00:00:09 ◼ ► From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 466. Today's show is brought to you by Squarespace and Ooni Pizza Ovens.
00:00:22 ◼ ► Hello, Mike Hurley. I hope you're enjoying the Summer of Fun! Summer of Fun! I have a Snell Talk question for you.
00:00:32 ◼ ► Okay, alright. This one comes from Brayden, who asks, "Jason, what is your preferred summer drink while you're at the D'Angle Town Surf Club?"
00:00:40 ◼ ► Ah, oh yeah, out there on Thunderbolt dock. Mm-hmm. Preferred summer drink. I'd be interested in hearing what your summer drink is, so get ready for that.
00:00:51 ◼ ► Preferred summer drink. I mean, there's many different choices here. I make iced tea in the summer, and I enjoy that.
00:00:59 ◼ ► For an alcoholic beverage, I am not a mixed drink person, so I would say for an alcoholic beverage, these days I drink a lot of hazy IPAs,
00:01:09 ◼ ► which are very sort of like summery and citrusy, so I like those. And then my classic, I would say that for the last few years, my classic summer drink is my own,
00:01:17 ◼ ► I feel like I've said this before on this podcast, but I'll say it again, my friend Simon Jerry, when I was in England, told me about the Lager Top,
00:01:25 ◼ ► which is literally just a lager with lemonade on top. Right, which in England, lemonade is lemon lime soda. In America, lemonade is lemon water with sugar in it.
00:01:38 ◼ ► I actually have a funny story for you. One of the first times I went to America, what, the first time I went to America under legal drinking age, I think it was,
00:01:46 ◼ ► and this is when I went to, I went to the first Portland XOXO festival that I went to, and I was in a bar with some friends, and I asked for a vodka lemonade,
00:01:58 ◼ ► and the bar person was incredibly confused, which set me to be incredibly confused, because I felt like I went with the most basic drink that somebody could ask for.
00:02:10 ◼ ► Like I purposefully did that because I was uncomfortable with what to order. Vodka and 7-Up is what you should have ordered. Or Sprite, right?
00:02:18 ◼ ► But what they ended up giving me was like, I don't even know what it was, but it was like vodka and something and simple syrup, it was very confusing.
00:02:25 ◼ ► Lemon juice and simple syrup. Yes, I think that was what they did, and it was absolutely terrible. An American lemonade.
00:02:33 ◼ ► I love American lemonade, but it's not what the friends mean by lemonade. But it's not what I want in a vodka lemonade.
00:02:39 ◼ ► Let me tell you, Mike, if you take a nice beer on a hot summer day and you put some lemonade in it, it's really good.
00:02:46 ◼ ► It's really good. So that is one of my preferred summer drinks at the Doggle Town Surf Club. Lager Top, American style.
00:02:52 ◼ ► Lager Top. I, this summer, have just enjoyed cold beers. I am not, I don't drink alcohol very much, for no specific reason, I just don't.
00:03:06 ◼ ► I maybe have like a beer or two a week, pretty much. But there are these two beers that I've found to be very refreshing this summer.
00:03:16 ◼ ► I kind of found them in my local supermarket. They're two brands. One is called Jubal, and they basically make beers with fruit in them.
00:03:24 ◼ ► They brew them with fruit, which is very refreshing. And another one called Shandy Shack, which is essentially what we're talking about here.
00:03:32 ◼ ► Shandy is the American word for the beer lemonade combo. Oh no, we have Shandy's too. Shandy is like one thing, and Lager Top's like another thing.
00:03:42 ◼ ► Interesting. Well, it's because of your lemonade. Anyway, I'm essentially making a Shandy too. It's a good summer beer, for sure.
00:03:47 ◼ ► And they make, this company just makes like a bunch of Shandy's, including an IPA Shandy, which I'd never had before. And I really like them.
00:03:55 ◼ ► Lauren's Preferred is from a local brewery called Pitchers, and it's basically a grapefruit Shandy. And it's really good.
00:04:06 ◼ ► It's really good. I know all the beer purists are like gasping. It's like, you know what, beer is good in lots of ways, including with other flavors in it.
00:04:17 ◼ ► Yeah, I like an IPA, I like a Lager as much as the next guy. Well, maybe not as much as the next guy, but I also like fruity and weird beers too.
00:04:36 ◼ ► Oh, well then it's Pimms time. It's Pimms o'clock, as they used to say. That was the old ad campaign. Pimms o'clock.
00:04:49 ◼ ► It could be. My friend, friend of the show, he's been on, Scott McNulty, he's a Pimms cup guy, which has always surprised me as a Philadelphian, but he's very English in that way, I guess.
00:04:58 ◼ ► Rebelling against his Irish background. And I would say, our English friends had us over for a summer party once and there were Pimms cups and I had one.
00:05:12 ◼ ► Oh, I like it. Do you want to know another funny thing? Like, kind of wrapping this whole conversation around? We don't call it Pimms cup, we call it Pimms and lemonade.
00:05:22 ◼ ► Pimms cup is not what it's called here. It's just called Pimms and lemonade, but it's the same thing. All the fruit and all that kind of stuff. Yeah, that's how it goes.
00:05:31 ◼ ► If you would like to send us in a Snell Talk question, of course this is the summer, so summery questions are not advised, but recommended.
00:05:40 ◼ ► Then you can send those in by going to upgradefeedback.com and thank you to Braden for that great question.
00:05:47 ◼ ► We have some, just a whole cavalcade of weird follow up I think today, spanning the gamut of the last couple of weeks of shows. I think a lot of it actually is from last week.
00:06:01 ◼ ► Indeed. We had many people, I think mostly Canadians, send us in a video called the House Hippo commercial. The North American House Hippo.
00:06:13 ◼ ► Obviously in relation to Jason's desire for a tiny hippo. Can I, I'll tell you, I don't know if I told you this privately, but I'll tell you it now.
00:06:23 ◼ ► We posted the clip, as we always do, you can find our video clips on our various social media channels. I'll tell you about those at the end of the show.
00:06:31 ◼ ► I had two people from my life, like just my sister in law and one of my close friends who do not listen to my podcasts, contact me to tell me what small animals they wanted.
00:06:48 ◼ ► It's pretty good. I had a guy I play curling with say, "Hey, I was in an airport scrolling through TikTok and I saw you."
00:06:58 ◼ ► This Canadian House Hippo ad, it's adorable. It's just a whole ad that reads like it's a nature documentary about the small Canadian house hippo.
00:07:07 ◼ ► At the end, and this is very late 90s, it's very 90s public service announcement, it says, "Of course this isn't real, but children believe things they see on TV.
00:07:16 ◼ ► And they shouldn't. Don't believe things you see on TV. Ask questions and be critical kids." That's what that ad is for.
00:07:23 ◼ ► It was commissioned by the Concerned Children's Advertisers, which is now called the Companies Committed to Kids.
00:07:30 ◼ ► And from the actual House Hippo Wikipedia page, it says, "The stated intent of this piece is to educate children about critical thinking with regard to what they see in television advertising."
00:07:42 ◼ ► And I was struck by, this was in 1999, this commercial. It's the same problems we're dealing with now about fake news and now we're moving into the AI deep fake generation.
00:08:09 ◼ ► I'm back with a report. The short answer, so I think my theory was correct, which is Australians say beta, New Zealanders say beta.
00:08:18 ◼ ► And we got many videos saying that the Kiwis say beta. A few people said they say beta, but almost everybody said they say beta, so I believe them.
00:08:27 ◼ ► But here's the thing about beta and beta is New Zealanders change, this is what I thought would be the case, New Zealanders change vowels.
00:08:34 ◼ ► So I think New Zealanders are actually trying to say beta, but because they flip their vowels compared to other English speakers, they say beta.
00:08:44 ◼ ► But I think they mean beta, but they say beta. So a win for the beta pronunciation there.
00:08:50 ◼ ► And I want to thank specifically the listener, listener Sam I believe, who sent in an audio clip that contrasts the word beta with an igbeater, which is an eggbeater, but in New Zealand.
00:09:10 ◼ ► Yes, I really love the way that you said that, which is very funny to me. What I would just like to addendum, what I hear and what I think is one of the key differences is they say beta.
00:09:29 ◼ ► Yes. Or really, the way I hear it is Americans say T's like D's, right, where I would say water, but now I've conditioned myself to say water instead.
00:09:40 ◼ ► Because I found myself, Jason, many times, again, earlier on in my travels, where I would say, could I have a glass of water? And they were like, what? And people couldn't understand me in a way that I just don't understand.
00:09:56 ◼ ► I will tell you, when people say that Americans take their T's and turn them into D's, I get to do the John Saricusa thing where I can say, no, we don't.
00:10:04 ◼ ► But what I mean by that is I can understand why it is not, you can't differentiate it, but I can differentiate it. There is a slight difference there, but it's very close. It's true.
00:10:19 ◼ ► Yeah, you see, that's a D to me. I understand what you're saying. I can't hear it any other way.
00:10:23 ◼ ► My tongue is actually up in my teeth and making a T sound there, but it's very subtle. Because otherwise it's water. Oh, water.
00:10:56 ◼ ► No, no. I think I spent two weeks in New Zealand. I think I've sussed it out. I think I got it.
00:11:05 ◼ ► You haven't spent two weeks there? You're like that person that goes on holiday and comes back with a new accent.
00:11:18 ◼ ► We spoke about the Vision Pro and the fact that there was a potential for it to not be shipping with health features,
00:11:29 ◼ ► We had two upgrade-ins write in with some thoughts on this that I wanted to share. Ben wrote in to say,
00:11:34 ◼ ► "I think that it could be possible that health-related features could be held for a 'Apple Vision Sport' model,
00:12:08 ◼ ► I could imagine lots of forms of exercise that I could do wearing the Apple Vision Pro.
00:12:13 ◼ ► Anything on a stationary machine, stationary bikes for sure, yoga I could imagine being possible.
00:12:32 ◼ ► The same as I feel like I could work out in AirPods Max as well. I think it's possible.
00:12:49 ◼ ► I think this is one of those things that it's very easy to say no in order to try to justify Apple's reported design decision here,
00:13:12 ◼ ► Steve says, "It seems like a pragmatic choice given the weight of the headset, the lack of controllers and the external battery pack to not have these features.
00:13:19 ◼ ► Until it's released, it's hard to say if there are other issues limiting its use as a fitness device.
00:13:24 ◼ ► Mehta has worked hard to support users who are more active, but Apple's first headset may be better suited for sedentary use.
00:13:31 ◼ ► Once Apple can field a lighter, cheaper, self-contained device, I'm sure it will support some fitness activities."
00:13:47 ◼ ► But I feel like any of these fitness apps that I've tried, you could use the Apple Vision Pro just as easily, I feel like.
00:13:54 ◼ ► Yeah, again, I feel like this is a tendency that a lot of people have to sort of try to justify the report about what Apple's decided by saying,
00:14:03 ◼ ► "Well, yeah, I can list a bunch of reasons why Apple just can't do this and they'll have to wait till the next time."
00:14:11 ◼ ► And what I said last week stands, which is if Apple doesn't want to do anything fitness related in here, guess what?
00:14:20 ◼ ► And it might not be the same as the Mehta headset and it might not be everything you want and it might not be as good as if Apple was more committed to it,
00:14:41 ◼ ► People have worked out for a long time with cabled headphones. It's the same deal, right?
00:14:46 ◼ ► Like we all found a way to work out with our iPods. We all found a way to work out with our Apple headphones plugged into our phone.
00:14:54 ◼ ► I understand if you listen to the way we've been talking to assume that the weight of the thing would preclude it. I don't think it would.
00:15:02 ◼ ► I think maybe there will be things that each person might not want to do, but I could imagine multiple types of exercise that I do now that I could quite easily do wearing the Vision Pro.
00:15:24 ◼ ► So a while ago, I switched them all to the scheduled summary feature and it's been an unmitigated success for me.
00:15:31 ◼ ► I get a summary of all of the rubbish news that I get a couple of times a day and none of it goes to the watch.
00:15:42 ◼ ► So I thought this was a really smart thing to do and a use case of a thing that I've never understood why it existed, which was the scheduled summary notifications.
00:15:56 ◼ ► If you have forgotten about this, you go to settings, notifications, scheduled summary.
00:16:00 ◼ ► You choose the apps that you want to be in the summary and the times of day you want it to pop up.
00:16:15 ◼ ► See, it's funny because when you mentioned this last week, I remain silent, but I actually find the news notifications valuable one time of day, which is when I wake up in the morning.
00:16:25 ◼ ► I kind of want to see if anything big happened, but I don't want them the rest of the day.
00:16:33 ◼ ► This is the right way for me to do it is to schedule a summary for the morning and then never have to deal with them the rest of the day.
00:16:39 ◼ ► The reason no one thought about this feature except Amari is because it isn't really good for anything else.
00:16:45 ◼ ► It's not super well implemented, at least in I/O 16. I don't know if it's been changed at all in 17, but probably not.
00:16:59 ◼ ► The feature from this release that really was great is you can swipe on any notification and choose options and basically say, "Don't ever show this to me again."
00:17:07 ◼ ► I love that feature. This was also a feature from that era of we want to give you more control over notifications,
00:17:13 ◼ ► which is to say roll up all these notifications into a summary that you'll deliver at this time.
00:17:18 ◼ ► For news headlines, I just had never thought of that. It's actually great to be like, "I don't want to be bugged with news headlines except maybe once or twice a day."
00:17:27 ◼ ► I'm going to put a link in the show notes to Federico's IOS 15 review that explains notification summaries if you want a bit more information about it.
00:17:36 ◼ ► But yes, it's the first time I've ever heard of anybody using it for something I would like to.
00:17:40 ◼ ► Also, I ranted a couple of weeks ago on, I think, Upgrade Plus, but I ranted about discoverability and in my Mac world column.
00:17:47 ◼ ► I got a lot of feedback from people who, again, as expected, the features that we discussed in that segment and that I discussed in that article,
00:17:55 ◼ ► they didn't know existed, like the shuffling between faces in the lock screen, not to mention the holding an app that's shaking with one hand while you swipe
00:18:09 ◼ ► I'll just point out that Lister Mike in the member Discord right now just said, "T-I-L, did not know this was a thing," to what we just talked about.
00:18:22 ◼ ► I might as well while we're doing this, I'm going to throw two features that I think people might not know about.
00:18:27 ◼ ► You can delete apps from searches. So if you search for an app and long press on it, you get the options to delete it.
00:18:33 ◼ ► So if you want to get rid of an app, that's a quick way to do it. And if you have folders on your home screen and you have the notification badge in the folders,
00:18:41 ◼ ► if you long press on the folder, it will pop up and show you what apps the notifications are for.
00:18:57 ◼ ► And we were wondering where they were coming from and we were sent an email that told us where they're coming from.
00:19:04 ◼ ► And it was pointing to an Apple Newsroom piece that came out during WWDC, which I remember seeing, but I did not read,
00:19:17 ◼ ► "We'll include a daily crossword, a mini crossword in partnership with the Puzzle Society."
00:19:29 ◼ ► "The Puzzle Society is becoming a major yet shadowy player in the world's puzzling spheres, simultaneously in plain sight and invisible,
00:20:04 ◼ ► They are a "inclusive partner and home to a first-class roster of distinctive and powerful cartoonists, artists, writers, illustrators, game makers, and storytellers."
00:20:13 ◼ ► They are like a conglomerate company, and one of the companies they own is the Puzzle Society.
00:20:36 ◼ ► Adam says they're in partnership with Puzzle Society, which is an existing online crossword service.
00:20:41 ◼ ► But Apple is also hiring in-house crossword editors, including prolific puzzle maker Ross Trudeau and seemingly Eric Agard,
00:20:51 ◼ ► who just resigned as the USA Today crossword editor and is widely hailed for championing diversity in crosswords.
00:21:32 ◼ ► mere minutes after admitting that there was a whole Apple press release that we saw and did not read,
00:21:38 ◼ ► we are now claiming the mantle of being your go-to experts regarding Apple and puzzles.
00:21:55 ◼ ► What I'm going to say is if anybody does think, like, oh, you should read, just go look at this press release.
00:22:52 ◼ ► The new Riddler's identity has not been revealed because they're hiding behind the Puzzle Society right now.
00:23:12 ◼ ► You are obviously Batman and I'm Robin, and there's kind of nothing I can do about that.
00:23:28 ◼ ► You will find this in the crossover feed that we have available to all relay FM members.
00:23:39 ◼ ► I will put a link in the show notes that you can just click on and you sign in and it will take you to your member exclusive podcasts.
00:23:46 ◼ ► This is the third installment of our RPG crossover, where the two of us are joined by CGP Grey
00:24:02 ◼ ► I think Tony did a really, really amazing job creating a very fun game mechanic that I'm very excited.
00:24:18 ◼ ► This one's really good. In fact, I've started to think about these three Tales from the Floating Vagabond adventures
00:24:25 ◼ ► that we've done the last three years as three movie series or three episodes of a TV show,
00:24:40 ◼ ► The second one we go to the food company where there's a mascot and there's been a disaster.
00:24:53 ◼ ► No, because it doesn't really feel like it's necessary to take seriously, but it fits right within your wheelhouse.
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00:27:13 ◼ ► And yeah, you get the little, it melts the cheese on top and you get the little kind of like burny bits on the crust.
00:27:23 ◼ ► That's my tip for you is, especially if you're like me and you struggle a little bit to get the dough thin enough,
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00:27:57 ◼ ► Whereas at home or inside on the, in the oven, I have to do like, you know, it sits in there for 10 or 15 minutes.
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00:29:13 ◼ ► He's rounding the criminals up and he's putting them in newsletter jail and he's, and he's now sending that out.
00:29:23 ◼ ► including developing a feature to test hearing by playing a series of tones and sounds.
00:29:48 ◼ ► So they currently have a selection of features that they've been introducing over the last few years
00:29:59 ◼ ► But Apple does not have health regulatory approvals to claim that they are actually hearing aids with these features.
00:30:06 ◼ ► Right. And, and in the U.S. that just changed where you can sell things that make hearing aid claims over the counter.
00:30:12 ◼ ► So this is, and this is one of the ideas here that Apple seems to be staffing up and leaning into that
00:30:19 ◼ ► now that they have a little more latitude to consider AirPods basically as hearing aids, at least in some modes. Yeah.
00:30:27 ◼ ► A quote from Mark, "There's also engineering work being done on adding sensors to AirPods
00:30:36 ◼ ► This type of data is considered more accurate than wrist temperature, which is collected on the Apple Watch Series 8
00:30:49 ◼ ► But if you're wearing them, they can, they could track your temperature and it's going to be much more accurate, right?
00:30:59 ◼ ► It's a pretty accurate reading. So that, that, it just makes sense because you've got a product that's already in there.
00:31:04 ◼ ► And that would be super good because that feels like would be a feature where it could tell you if it's found something wrong
00:31:27 ◼ ► As always with these things, these features could take time to materialize in shipping products.
00:31:32 ◼ ► You know, it could be like they don't, he doesn't know when it's coming because it's complicated,
00:31:36 ◼ ► especially when if they're going to go for regulatory approval on either of these things.
00:31:40 ◼ ► Yeah. But in the meantime, Apple is preparing to switch the AirPods product line over to USB-C,
00:31:47 ◼ ► starting with the, like along with the iPhone this year, beginning with the AirPods Pro.
00:31:52 ◼ ► The way he phrases this is really weird to me because all it means is that you do a new case.
00:32:16 ◼ ► Yeah. Which I will be super excited about because like, you know, we're still in the throes of house decoration.
00:32:26 ◼ ► which by the way, if anybody has product recommendations for like good ways to get like USB-C cables
00:32:41 ◼ ► I am upgradefeedback.com. I am surprised that there aren't more products that are designed to like
00:32:55 ◼ ► like nearby. Cause yeah, I ended up having, I have a USB adapter that is basically under the couch
00:33:12 ◼ ► That's not, I want like a little, you know, I'm not buying furniture with USB installed, right?
00:33:18 ◼ ► Like I'm not going to do that, but I would like the USB to be somewhere really accessible without getting in my way.
00:33:24 ◼ ► And I know that's tricky, but like I am surprised that everything I find is a big block that you plug in the wall
00:33:33 ◼ ► And wireless charging is not the solution here because I'm not just charging products that, like for example,
00:33:41 ◼ ► The beauty of having USB-C and what your point that you're making here about AirPods is,
00:33:45 ◼ ► if you end up with a USB-C cable or two at your couch, you could charge anything there, right?
00:33:51 ◼ ► Charge your iPad, charge your laptop, charge your AirPods, charge your phone, anything.
00:33:55 ◼ ► So last night me and Edina were talking about this and I was like, I am going to find a solution to this
00:33:59 ◼ ► because right now we just have like cables just like under the sofa and it's just ugly and it's not really great to grab them and stuff.
00:34:08 ◼ ► And I was saying, oh, you know, when the iPhone goes to USB-C, then we won't even need the lightning cable anymore,
00:34:16 ◼ ► And I was like, aha, here we go, we're going to get AirPods Pro the new cases and we'll be nice and happy.
00:34:32 ◼ ► Right, I would love to know if there's a thing that you can like hang over the back of the couch that is also an adapter.
00:34:38 ◼ ► Like I've got a desk power strip that literally under desk power strip that I got with my desk
00:34:50 ◼ ► And I thought, you know, I am surprised given all of the iPhone accessories out there that somebody hasn't come over like a super clever solution for this that is not,
00:34:59 ◼ ► well, hide this brick on the floor and then get a long cable and stuff it behind the cushion.
00:35:09 ◼ ► Mark is also reporting that Apple have "explored the idea of a finger-worn device that would work as a controller for the Apple Vision Pro, but rejected it."
00:35:25 ◼ ► nor are they planning to support third-party controllers specifically for VR-focused experiences.
00:35:34 ◼ ► I mean, it doesn't necessarily mean, what he's not saying is that they built like something you could stick on your finger and it like aided in the precision.
00:35:51 ◼ ► It's also possible that they looked at the hand tracking software they already had and said, "This is good enough."
00:36:00 ◼ ► But it's interesting that this report suggests that Apple was exploring this idea and was like, "Nah, we don't want it or need it to pop something on your finger."
00:36:15 ◼ ► I'm making sure to stay hopeful about just there being new and interesting gaming experiences.
00:36:21 ◼ ► I have found the current crop of VR gaming to be very focused around a very specific type of game, which realistically is just shooting games.
00:36:30 ◼ ► Where you do not really move or you move in weird ways because you don't want to get sick.
00:36:38 ◼ ► So what I'm hoping is that if Apple is saying, "No controllers," that it may encourage people to think a little bit more weirdly and out of the box and create some interesting experiences.
00:36:54 ◼ ► I can imagine a lot of puzzle games that could come out of just hand tracking, moving things around.
00:37:02 ◼ ► Or maybe with really good eye tracking, what kind of gaming experiences does that create?
00:37:14 ◼ ► That they will be able to, when pressed under certain constraints, come up with some new type of experiences.
00:37:36 ◼ ► The interesting one here is one of these could include an integrated processor and software stack that could make a display double as a monitor for a Mac and as a standalone display, like a TV kind of thing, and a smart home display with a low power mode.
00:37:57 ◼ ► His story is basically like a larger external display that you can, I could sort of see it because it's the, it actually is the answer to the question, why do we have a studio display that has iOS inside it, but it's not visible in any way?
00:38:21 ◼ ► And this is sort of the answer to that, is what if they made one that was a little bit bigger that you could use as your standalone display, but it could also be, take other inputs and also have a smart home, low power mode.
00:38:33 ◼ ► Yeah, but where's this display going in someone's house that it can actually serve as all of these things at once?
00:38:41 ◼ ► It made me start to think about like iMacs where they say that sometimes you put a, you're in a limited screen environment.
00:38:48 ◼ ► I don't think this is for like a living room TV, but like, could it be for other environments where there's really limited space and you can have it pull double duty?
00:38:57 ◼ ► I don't know. It is an interesting idea of like where this actually fits and is it a product that actually has a mainstream use case?
00:39:05 ◼ ► But they keep telling me that they sell a lot of iMacs that are just meant to be, you know, that people just plop them down in the middle of their home and everybody uses them.
00:39:17 ◼ ► Yeah, I feel like these use cases and the product doesn't match up, right? Because this is obviously going to be more expensive than the current studio display because it sounds like it's going to be quite advanced.
00:39:29 ◼ ► So let's imagine this is a $2,000 display, right? Let's just, I'm just throwing that money out there.
00:39:36 ◼ ► I just feel like an expensive display doesn't necessarily match with this idea of like, I have just one room, right?
00:39:45 ◼ ► Like those things, this sounds to me like it's an expensive display, so it's probably going to be bought by somebody who has at least a room where they keep their work computer, like they have an office, right?
00:39:55 ◼ ► Where they have the computer. And then if it's in the office, it's not so helpful to be a smart display, smart home display because it's in the office.
00:40:01 ◼ ► Yeah, some people do live in very small spaces and they could use this and I'm sure there are people out there who watch movies and TV shows on the same screen that they use, you know, to do their computer stuff.
00:40:14 ◼ ► But I would imagine most people don't. They use a device to do that. They use an iPad or an iPhone or whatever.
00:40:22 ◼ ► And so, yeah, I wonder about that. I am going to dispute you on this is going to be powerful and therefore expensive.
00:40:28 ◼ ► I think that the studio display could do this right now. I think it could. I think they made a decision to have it run iOS invisibly in the background in order to run the camera and run center stage.
00:40:43 ◼ ► But like, I don't know, it's an A series processor running an OS. I think it's not a real leap to say that if it was a slightly more modern A series processor and they built it to run TV OS standalone from scratch, which they didn't do with the studio display.
00:41:06 ◼ ► I'm not sure that that's a particularly more expensive product. Maybe the display is better and that makes it more expensive, but I don't think this is a lot of extra power.
00:41:13 ◼ ► I think this is just designing it with that stuff visible versus invisible like on the studio display.
00:41:20 ◼ ► I mean, I still think a $1600 display meets the same argument that I was making earlier.
00:41:26 ◼ ► My point is, is there a market where you're sitting right in front of the screen doing computing work and it's also your TV?
00:41:32 ◼ ► Right. And if there are markets for that, then great. But is that a market or is this an incredibly large display for a computer monitor that Apple thinks is sort of like it will work as a small TV or it'll work as a computer monitor?
00:41:48 ◼ ► You decide. But you're right. There are lots of scenarios where you might be better off just buying a TV, right? Because TVs are cheaper than that.
00:41:54 ◼ ► I don't know. It's an interesting idea. And they have the market research, but it does seem like a one-size-fits-all TV that is also a computer monitor.
00:42:07 ◼ ► I feel like I know of a better display, which already includes an integrated processor and software that could double as a standalone display and small home display of a low power mode.
00:42:19 ◼ ► It's called the iPad. Like, if this feels like it's better for an iPad, if they're going to put it in a product that's not like HomePod with screen.
00:42:30 ◼ ► Look, this is such a nebulous rumor. We're really just like talking around a thing that we have no idea. But it's interesting to talk about.
00:42:39 ◼ ► It could legitimately just be a Mac display that they've decided, why are we hiding the fact that we're running our operating system on it? Let people use it for a PlayStation.
00:42:49 ◼ ► Let people use it as an Apple TV if they want when the Mac is not connected. And maybe they look at the use cases and think, you know, we got people connecting via laptops.
00:42:59 ◼ ► They disconnect their laptop. The screen's just sitting there doing nothing. Somebody else in the home can use it for something else.
00:43:05 ◼ ► Maybe this is a minor feature where it's sort of like, well, if we're going to make a smart display for that works with Macs, why not also make it be visibly smart?
00:43:15 ◼ ► It's an extra feature. Because like I'm saying, the studio display as it currently exists basically is this, except they decided to hide it all.
00:43:23 ◼ ► So maybe they just decided, let's not hide it. Let's put an HDMI port back there and make it an Apple TV and not hide it anymore. I don't know.
00:43:33 ◼ ► So moving on, the Wall Street Journal is reporting that Goldman Sachs is trying to break out of their deal with Apple on the Apple card.
00:43:41 ◼ ► Apparently, this is so weird to me, Goldman Sachs is in talks with American Express to try and convince them to take on the business.
00:43:49 ◼ ► "Apple would have to agree to a transfer. The tech company is aware of the talks, which have been ongoing for months."
00:43:56 ◼ ► It was reported in January that Goldman Sachs has apparently lost over a billion dollars on the Apple card.
00:44:09 ◼ ► My very cursory knowledge of this market suggests that Goldman Sachs probably doesn't want to be in the consumer credit card market anymore.
00:44:26 ◼ ► They really tried to expand into this consumer banking area and they've lost a lot of money. They were really aggressive in it.
00:44:29 ◼ ► There's nothing more esoteric than what investors in banks think. It's like double financial. It's investors in banks.
00:44:41 ◼ ► That's the point where I generally pass out. They may have tried to expand and they're like, "Oh no, let's go back to our core business and let's unload all this stuff."
00:44:54 ◼ ► I am fascinated about the fact that they're losing money on the Apple card. I guess that that is because they took on Apple's aggressive terms and so they're not able to make the money on it than they wanted to.
00:45:11 ◼ ► Some of the stuff that I read today, because I was doing a little bit of research and trying to understand this loss that was reported, it was very nebulous because it was a loss reported in part of a bigger loss that they had and some people were trying to pull it apart and work out that this is what it was.
00:45:26 ◼ ► There was some talk about the billion. It was hard for me to try and work out exactly how it was confirmed.
00:45:32 ◼ ► I read an article on 9to5Mac by Michael Potok and they were talking about some of the potential ways in which Goldman may have lost money here. It could have been the cash back.
00:45:45 ◼ ► It could have been the fact that they weren't charging lots of fees, which usually credit card companies would charge, which is something Apple didn't want.
00:45:55 ◼ ► Also, they were much more aggressive in accepting people and therefore there would be more bad debt there.
00:46:06 ◼ ► They were really excited about working with Apple because there's Apple Halo. I think there's this question about maybe Apple is really only good at making money for Apple.
00:46:17 ◼ ► I do think this is very interesting in the context of why isn't the Apple card somewhere else? Maybe it's because nobody wants this business. Nobody wants to play by Apple's rules.
00:46:28 ◼ ► Again, it makes me wonder about Apple setting up its own financial company. I don't know when Apple becomes a bank or not. As long as they've got partners, maybe they don't need to become a bank.
00:46:41 ◼ ► Apparently, they're hiring for it. This is something we spoke about a number of months ago. They are hiring and looking more at becoming a financial service and taking on more of this stuff themselves.
00:46:52 ◼ ► In some form or other, lots of regulation to deal with there. I don't know. The Apple card is a pretty good product. I think the question is, did Apple…
00:47:02 ◼ ► Apple obviously was like, "We want to set the terms. We want this to be very different." They got somebody to say yes and that's great, but maybe in the end, it was a bad idea.
00:47:14 ◼ ► As well as the Apple card, the relationship with Goldman Sachs is also powering Apple Card Savings and Apple Pay Later. They're really intertwined now.
00:47:24 ◼ ► The Amex thing is interesting to me. It's obviously a very different business, American Express. They have the American Express card and that's going to be complicated.
00:47:34 ◼ ► Well, I cannot envision Apple just declaring that the Apple card is an Amex card. If this deal is going on, I assume that the deal would maybe involve that as an option.
00:47:45 ◼ ► But I just can't envision the Apple card going to Amex and being turned into an American Express card.
00:47:51 ◼ ► But similarly, I can't imagine Amex taking it and not making it an Amex. Why would they not do that? They don't have to take this from Goldman Sachs. American Express are going to have their own needs and desires here.
00:48:06 ◼ ► That might be one of the reasons this doesn't work. Maybe Amex say yeah, but it's going to be an Amex and Apple say no and it's like, "Well, back to Goldman."
00:48:15 ◼ ► Yeah, I think the scenario I would say there, again, knowing nothing about this, so I'm just spitballing, would be Amex taking on that business, viewing it as an opportunity to get some of these Apple card holders to be Amex customers, Amex card customers over time, even if they're supporting the existing MasterCard customers.
00:48:52 ◼ ► And so maybe Amex would do that, that it would be Amex by default, but you have this fallback maybe if it didn't work and maybe they would work with Apple to find some kind of interesting way to make that work via Apple Pay. I don't know.
00:49:05 ◼ ► But it would be really strange to me if I get Amex, "Yeah, we'll take this, but we're going to use MasterCard and pay MasterCard to do this."
00:49:14 ◼ ► Yeah, well, hmm. Yeah, but remember the context here, Mike. The context here is companies who want to do business with Apple and are willing to do things that they would not normally do because they want to be in business with Apple. I'm not saying that it's smart. I'm saying that seems to happen.
00:49:29 ◼ ► But it's weird though, right? If Goldman's like, "We're losing so much money on this. Will you take this from us?" I can't even imagine what the pitch is to Amex. Like, "Do you want this? We're losing a billion dollars. Who lost a billion dollars in 2020? Did you like this?"
00:49:45 ◼ ► It's very strange to me. I would love to know more about what is going on there. Very strange. And I'm now fascinated to see what the next few years are for the Apple card because it seems like maybe it's not the business people want it to be.
00:50:00 ◼ ► Goldman Sachs is learning one of those important lessons. Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb.
00:50:10 ◼ ► And the Financial Times is reporting that Apple has had to reduce their production forecasts for the Apple Vision Pro due to manufacturing complexities. These issues are stemming from the micro OLED displays that are found inside the two displays found inside of each Vision Pro.
00:50:26 ◼ ► The Times is claiming that Apple is unhappy with the output and quality from their manufacturing partners and have now subsequently cut estimates to 400,000 units produced in 2024.
00:50:39 ◼ ► It was previously reported that Apple was forecasting a million units in the first year. However, I have heard some conjecture that maybe it was misunderstood as a million displays, which would be half a million units.
00:50:59 ◼ ► The Financial Times is also claiming that Apple has further pushed back their plans for a more affordable Apple Vision headset. They were exploring mini LED displays instead of micro OLED displays for a cheaper device, but they were unhappy with the results of the mini LED displays when used that close to the eyes.
00:51:18 ◼ ► It's cutting edge stuff. It's hard. They're going to sell every one that they can make, but they're not going to be able to make very many.
00:51:23 ◼ ► It seems that way. It's going to be hard to get them. I'm not looking forward to that. It's going to be hard to get them.
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00:54:09 ◼ ► But I kind of am always looking for a reason. And today when I open my RSS reader, I had like six stories, five or six stories, all related to Apple TV+.
00:54:31 ◼ ► Woo! We're a Pac-12 family. I went to Cal, Cal lifelong. My dad was a Cal season ticket holder. He went to Cal.
00:54:42 ◼ ► My kids go to Oregon or went to Oregon, I guess I got to say now. My daughter is an alum now.
00:54:50 ◼ ► And they are the only college football conference that does not currently have a long-term contract.
00:55:00 ◼ ► So about a year left on it. But they've been negotiating for a year and there's this real question of like, are they going to be able to match some of the other conferences in terms of the money?
00:55:08 ◼ ► And the presidents keep saying that they're very confident that they're going to be able to beat the Big 12 in terms of the money that they're going to be able to pay.
00:55:15 ◼ ► And then there's some question about that. And this is all going on. They got a new commissioner. He was brought in to negotiate the media rights. That's why he's here.
00:55:26 ◼ ► The reason this is relevant to the upgrade audience, and I'm not just bringing in your, you know, let me talk about how the Cal Bears are going to do this year.
00:55:33 ◼ ► Disappointing as always. Is the answer or how the Oregon Ducks are going to do. Way more successful and my kids are spoiled.
00:55:45 ◼ ► It literally is the only. The NFL has signed all its deals several years out with all of its partners.
00:55:58 ◼ ► So while it is the Pac-12, it is a smaller of the major conferences. It's not one of the two big ones. It's one of the three smaller ones.
00:56:07 ◼ ► They are still a good source of viewers and a good source of content during college football season.
00:56:16 ◼ ► And again, I'll just remind our non-American viewers, American football is by far the most successful sport in America.
00:56:24 ◼ ► It is by far, by far, far like the highest rated television series for the last 15 years have been NFL games.
00:56:40 ◼ ► People would argue that football is now the national pastime, I guess, but whatever. It is certainly the biggest entertainment property and sports entertainment property in America.
00:56:49 ◼ ► And so the fact that the Pac-12 is still sitting out there is interesting because if you were a streamer who was trying to dip your toe in the water of more live sports events and you wanted to try it with American football,
00:57:04 ◼ ► now Amazon's got an NFL deal, but that's about it. There's a little like NBC as part of their deal with the NFL has a Peacock thing where they're going to show some games on Peacock.
00:57:16 ◼ ► But according to a guy who covers this for a living, John Willner from the San Jose Mercury News, as well as information from John Canzano who has a substack that I subscribe to is very good.
00:57:28 ◼ ► Apple, Willner says, is the favorite for the bulk of the Pac-12 college football inventory beginning in the fall of next year.
00:57:40 ◼ ► Willner's projection is that ESPN will probably take sort of like scoop up the cream of the crop, especially for Saturday nights and maybe other weeknights, like a Thursday night game.
00:57:51 ◼ ► Those will be like marquee matchups on ESPN, but that's only about 22 regular season games, he estimates.
00:57:58 ◼ ► There are 50 something other conference games that currently air on Fox or on the Pac-12 network, which is the conference's own TV network.
00:58:13 ◼ ► And they may even pick up the Pac-12 network which produces these games and use it as part of its sports production facility that would be owned by Apple.
00:58:28 ◼ ► No, the 50 something games currently, some of them are on Fox, a handful, and then the rest of them are on the Pac-12 network.
00:58:39 ◼ ► So in the way that Major League Baseball is producing Friday Night Baseball for Apple, but that I believe Apple and MLS are producing or MLS is producing for Apple, I'm not sure exactly how that works, the MLS games.
00:58:55 ◼ ► Anyway, Willner thinks that Apple is going to take those other games that ESPN doesn't take.
00:59:01 ◼ ► And that it's possible that there will be another small package and he says maybe Fox will buy some games. The advantage the Pac-12 has is it's on the West Coast, which means that it can put games later on on Saturday night where the East Coast can't play anymore.
00:59:14 ◼ ► And so it just extends the day and there's limited inventory of West Coast football games.
00:59:32 ◼ ► So it's just as an Apple story, this is the idea that this may be Apple's best chance in the next few years to experiment with American football, which is our most popular sport.
00:59:49 ◼ ► It's all along the West Coast and the Western US, which culturally is actually not a bad fit for Apple.
00:59:55 ◼ ► The idea that you've got universities, one of them just down the road in Palo Alto, also in Berkeley and then Seattle, and Salt Lake City and Eugene and Tucson.
01:00:28 ◼ ► If Willner is right, and Willner and Canzano has suggested that there's a Pac-12 media day happening in a few weeks where they get all the coaches and players and stuff, and they do their big promotion for the year.
01:00:38 ◼ ► And they said the last thing they want is for the TV rights to be undecided by the time they get there.
01:00:44 ◼ ► And I think I may have mentioned this here earlier, but the reason this has taken way longer than most of these conference TV negotiations have taken is apparently because they're talking to non-traditional partners, namely Apple and Amazon.
01:01:08 ◼ ► And even now, even though they've got some sports rights, the impression is when you're talking to Fox and ESPN, they've been doing this for ages. They know how it is.
01:01:17 ◼ ► You talk to Apple, and they're not even quite talking the same language, which we heard about the NFL Sunday ticket negotiations, right?
01:01:24 ◼ ► That there was this real head scratcher of a conversation going on there. And then I guess Google figured it out or just wrote a big check.
01:01:30 ◼ ► So we'll see, but this would be another thing in the pile of all the different live sports that Apple is trying if Apple ends up picking up 40 or 50 college football games.
01:01:41 ◼ ► So the thing that I could imagine of that same language thing is just cultural norms of Apple, "Well, we're going to take this and show it all over the world."
01:01:52 ◼ ► So what I'm wondering from this is they may be the favorite, but can they actually get the deal?
01:02:00 ◼ ► No, but can they get the deal they want? There isn't a large MLS market either, but they still do that.
01:02:06 ◼ ► The advantage that they have here is that this is small enough, and it doesn't really have much of an international deal that they can basically, yeah, I think they would just take it and do it, even though outside of the US there isn't much of a market for this.
01:02:24 ◼ ► So I don't know how to read this because, like I said, I am a lifelong fan of a team in this conference.
01:02:29 ◼ ► But I'm just saying from a larger issue, it's very interesting that Apple is at least reportedly the favorite to close this deal because it would throw some college football on the pile along with MLS and MLB.
01:02:42 ◼ ► Apple have posted the first episode of their new, I'm going to say hit show, Silo on Twitter.
01:02:50 ◼ ► I would call it a hit just because I've been seeing people talk about this show who are not in my tech circles.
01:02:58 ◼ ► I've yet to see it, but I've got it on my queue. I want to watch it because people are saying it's really good.
01:03:04 ◼ ► And so they just took the first episode and just posted it on Twitter so people can just watch it for free.
01:03:11 ◼ ► Jungkook were out of good art core parts to put in the show notes, but it's interesting because you can do this already in the TV app. You can just go to the TV app and you can watch the first episode of all of their shows for free.
01:03:23 ◼ ► But this is just interesting because they've done it on Twitter at what is, I think, a pretty contentious time to do anything new with Twitter, right?
01:03:32 ◼ ► And it's only over the last week just gotten even weirder with the rate limiting and stuff like that now.
01:03:39 ◼ ► As somebody who doesn't use Twitter now, I can't read any tweets because I'm not logged in anywhere.
01:03:44 ◼ ► Someone sends me a link to a tweet and I'm like, I can't do anything with this because I can't bother to log in again.
01:03:50 ◼ ► And it's interesting because I think there are two pretty decent arguments on this of one, it's weird to extend any kind of new relationship with Twitter right now from a political standpoint in all of the ways that you could take the word political.
01:04:10 ◼ ► We might not be, a lot of our audience may have moved on to new places, but most people who were on Twitter in the first place are still there.
01:04:31 ◼ ► I don't know what the right decision is to make on this one if you're Apple, to be honest.
01:04:35 ◼ ► It's marketing and there are a lot of people still using it and they've got an existing marketing relationship, so they're doing it.
01:04:42 ◼ ► So like CBS, Viacom put up, or I guess Paramount Plus technically, put up on the entire first season of Star Trek Strange New Worlds before, ahead of the season two premiere.
01:04:54 ◼ ► For a limited time, but they basically like posted the whole thing and said, you can just watch, you can binge this and then sign up for Paramount Plus for season two.
01:05:02 ◼ ► I'm a little surprised that this was a Twitter decision here, but again, they do have an existing Twitter relationship.
01:05:11 ◼ ► The truth is marketing decisions are not made through any lens, but does this get us to our marketing goals?
01:05:16 ◼ ► I think the idea here is they're trying to get people to see silo and be into it and then want to pick up Apple TV Plus and this is a place that they can do that.
01:05:25 ◼ ► I think that in the end, a lot of the arguments about, do you want to be supporting this product and this company, ends up being, well, there's a lot of people there.
01:05:37 ◼ ► Maybe they're not paying attention. Maybe they're awful people. Chances are they're not awful people.
01:05:46 ◼ ► I will admit that I rolled my eyes at a lot of the so-called controversy about this because most of the posts I saw about this were, how dare Apple, you know, with Twitter.
01:06:08 ◼ ► A lot of people have not quit Twitter in a huff like so many people in our community have.
01:06:14 ◼ ► The moment that it's not worth it for Apple to promote things on Twitter, they'll stop.
01:06:27 ◼ ► Like you mentioned, in the last week, we've gotten this thing where Twitter is, are they paying their bills to Google Cloud?
01:06:35 ◼ ► But suddenly they closed off the whole site unless you can log in and they rate limited everybody.
01:06:41 ◼ ► It is rapidly decaying to the point where I almost wonder if Apple would make that same decision today that they made last week.
01:07:03 ◼ ► Also, it's possible that they had a deal with Twitter where they got the ability to do this and it was part of their deal.
01:07:15 ◼ ► It may not be, "We can spend money to put a show somewhere. Will we put it on Twitter or YouTube?"
01:07:21 ◼ ► Maybe they don't cost the same or maybe literally you have a coupon for a free thing as part of your relationship with Twitter.
01:08:01 ◼ ► Marketing is all about, "Let's give it a shot and see what happens and get the results back."
01:08:13 ◼ ► Unless it totally blew up in their faces, like, "How dare you," which I don't think it actually will.
01:08:19 ◼ ► What will happen is that if people have abandoned Twitter because it sucks or they've been rate limited or whatever the reasons are,
01:09:05 ◼ ► I just want to say, I feel like I saw so many articles bemoaning the final season of the show.
01:09:11 ◼ ► I feel like people were taking pleasure in sharing them around, it almost felt like at one point.
01:09:21 ◼ ► I loved the show overall. I loved the path it took, and I was very satisfied with the ending.
01:09:27 ◼ ► My read on people not enjoying the final season, a lot of it was people wanted the show to be different than what the show was,
01:09:50 ◼ ► that would not have been effective if it was just three seasons of season one, in my opinion.
01:10:11 ◼ ► which is, I think, one of the reasons people hated Battlestar Galactica's ending so much,
01:10:14 ◼ ► is because they had decided what the show was, and ignored the stuff that they didn't want to pay attention to that was in the show.
01:10:29 ◼ ► because they didn't want to engage with that kind of the content, was the point of the ending,
01:10:39 ◼ ► Whereas, I had thought about that content all along as being super important to the show,
01:13:35 ◼ ► Jon Hamm is in this one, which was the perfect payoff to his whole commercial thing of Apple,
01:13:41 ◼ ► They put him in the Morning Show, which is, I think, whether the world agrees, Apple considers
01:13:53 ◼ ► Star studded, and yeah, it's got the prestige feel, whether people feel like it's got the
01:14:08 ◼ ► Before this season even begins, it has been renewed for season four, which is a surprise
01:14:13 ◼ ► I just thought this would be the last one, but it's going to keep going for another season
01:14:45 ◼ ► I can't believe that someone has made this show that now, and it works, and it's great.
01:15:04 ◼ ► Yeah, the reason I say is it Peacock because it just feels like the NBC 30-minute comedy.
01:15:08 ◼ ► It is a surprise to me that something like that could exist again, but it's fantastically done.
01:15:14 ◼ ► We are slowly going through that having finished Superstore, which was our last traditional sitcom, which is also great.
01:15:36 ◼ ► So if you're looking to get something to fit into your life, because sometimes with an hour-long show, it's like, "Do I have an hour right now?"
01:15:45 ◼ ► No, see, Abbott's fitting in perfectly for a show while we're eating dinner or whatever.
01:15:58 ◼ ► Yeah, I feel like any show where there's food as part of the show where it's not a cooking competition, I'm never going to watch it while I'm eating.
01:16:15 ◼ ► And in the middle of season two right now, it is legitimately one of the best shows on TV right now.
01:16:20 ◼ ► And I know it to be the case just because of the way people talk about it, so I'm going to get to it at some point.
01:16:47 ◼ ► And that's Ben Stiller, who is also doing Severance, was the executive producer of that.
01:16:53 ◼ ► Unlike all the other streamers, when Apple cancels something, they don't just yank it off the air.
01:16:57 ◼ ► It'll live in the Apple catalog because Apple's catalog is really small and they want more stuff in it.
01:17:07 ◼ ► We've talked about it on our podcast downstream, Julian Alexander and I host, which the pilot episode of that was a summer of fun episode last year.
01:17:21 ◼ ► And then also the idea is if it's not making money for you here, maybe you can sell it to someone.
01:17:26 ◼ ► The short version of this is there was a period there where everybody was trying to gear up to fight Netflix.
01:17:32 ◼ ► And everybody decided, all the studios decided, we're going to own our own streaming service and put all of our content on it.
01:17:52 ◼ ► And what ended up happening is people were like, say, you know that show that's not doing, like, Insecure is an HBO show.
01:18:04 ◼ ► Netflix will give us money to put it on Netflix where it will find a bigger audience and make more money for us and for Netflix.
01:18:16 ◼ ► And that's what's going on with some of these things getting pulled off streaming services is they're going to get sold somewhere else for more, for incremental money.
01:18:25 ◼ ► Basically the idea of like, well, we, everybody who'd watched it on our service has watched it now.
01:18:35 ◼ ► Like we'll put it somewhere where it can generate more money for us than on our own service.
01:18:41 ◼ ► I understand why people feel whiplashed by it because like just literally a year and a half ago, we were in the land of like, everything's going to its own service and Disney's going to have a service and Paramount's got a service and Warner media's got a service.
01:18:59 ◼ ► It just feels like as a customer, like the rugs been pulled out from under me, like I was sold on the idea that I would sign up to all of these services so I could have all of the television and movies.
01:19:25 ◼ ► They literally pulled one of the animated Star Trek show off, completely off Paramount Plus and are going to sell it with 20 unaired episodes somewhere else.
01:19:39 ◼ ► It's akin a little bit to a Marvel show suddenly going on Netflix where it's like they did that back in the past, right?
01:19:49 ◼ ► Imagine if they're like, you know, on second thought, maybe we should just put Daredevil back on Netflix.
01:19:59 ◼ ► I feel like Disney would maybe be the company most least likely to do this sell out thing, right?
01:20:25 ◼ ► They've got some because everybody's got some, but like there's probably a better fit somewhere else.
01:20:35 ◼ ► We'll see, but it's just so weird, this idea that you would take some of your crown jewels,
01:21:14 ◼ ► If you would like to get more Upgrade, if you want more Upgrade, why wouldn't you want more Upgrade?
01:21:44 ◼ ► Because this thing that I'm doing right now, where I'm talking about Upgrade Plus for like a minute,
01:23:36 ◼ ► Like I said, I want Apple to put all of this stuff in a thing that doesn't have a screen on it,
01:28:00 ◼ ► Also, I think they have the ability to do not only dynamic sounds and stuff in the environment,
01:28:45 ◼ ► I was thinking Mount Hood itself could be basically photographic all the way in the background,
01:28:57 ◼ ► If it was a desktop picture, or even one of those dynamic desktop pictures that updates every 10 minutes or something,
01:29:54 ◼ ► but users can only be using windows of your application inside of that immersive space.
01:31:35 ◼ ► Beyond that, I mean, I wrote a one thing that I distributed to a bunch of people I know
01:32:41 ◼ ► I'm more concerned about what happens with developers in terms of how it will impact the user,
01:39:35 ◼ ► There are those moments, I think, at those events where you can see the people who are viewing it.
01:40:23 ◼ ► It's like I don't know if it was always this way, but I really appreciated Apple's designation as media rather than press.
01:40:35 ◼ ► I don't know if it's always been that way and people are just used to calling it press.
01:40:41 ◼ ► Because I don't consider myself as part of the press because there's no newspaper around here.
01:40:51 ◼ ► If you would like to send us your feedback, follow-up, and questions for our various segments, go to UpgradeFeedback.com.
01:41:11 ◼ ► That includes the podcast we've mentioned multiple times because you should listen to it.