Upgrade

00:00:00 ◼   ► [Intro music]

00:00:07 ◼   ► From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 115. Today's show is brought to you by Casper,

00:00:14 ◼   ► FreshBooks, and Encapsula. My name is Myke Hurley and I am joined by the one and only,

00:00:21 ◼   ► Mr. Jason Snell.

00:00:22 ◼   ► Hey Myke, how's it going?

00:00:24 ◼   ► Pretty good Jason Snell, how are you?

00:00:26 ◼   ► Good, good. Busy time. Busy time. You know, my mom always says to me, whenever we talk

00:00:33 ◼   ► about what we're doing and the kids are doing and all that, she's like, "Oh, you're just

00:00:36 ◼   ► so busy. You're so lucky to be so young. You're just so busy." And most of the time I just

00:00:40 ◼   ► kind of roll my eyes a little bit and think, "Yeah, you know, it's just life. It's what

00:00:44 ◼   ► we do." But the last couple of months, and I think this happens for all of us who write

00:00:48 ◼   ► or talk about Apple, yeah, it's been really busy.

00:00:51 ◼   ► It's just a busy season. September to November really is the busy season.

00:00:55 ◼   ► It is high season. I feel like I was walking the dog with my wife yesterday and we were

00:01:00 ◼   ► talking about all this stuff and I said, "The good news is we're kind of at the end of the

00:01:08 ◼   ► Apple product cycle for this year." I mean, there's stuff, right? Because now we're going

00:01:16 ◼   ► to kick into the holiday season and make lists and stuff like that, all the end of year stuff,

00:01:22 ◼   ► it's work and the work never stops. The upgrade-ies will be coming. All of that, we got a plan,

00:01:27 ◼   ► it's all going to happen, but it is also kind of nice to feel like as somebody who works

00:01:34 ◼   ► on this stuff that we're on the backside a little bit, can calm down a little bit. Because

00:01:38 ◼   ► it's been kind of nuts, especially if you throw in the, you know, that I was gone for

00:01:43 ◼   ► ten days on my continuous travel adventure with Apple products, you know, an Apple event

00:01:50 ◼   ► right before and a product that I took with me and then as soon as I got back I got the

00:01:54 ◼   ► Touch Bar MacBook Pro and had an embargo for that that dropped this morning. So I'm feeling

00:02:00 ◼   ► a little bit like I can actually take stock of my where I am in my life and where I am

00:02:05 ◼   ► in the world for the first time in a couple of weeks. So that's nice. It's nice to get

00:02:10 ◼   ► that review out in the world and be able to sort of look up from my desk for a moment

00:02:14 ◼   ► and ask what's next.

00:02:17 ◼   ► So we are going to touch on the touch bar later on today in the show, but I did want

00:02:22 ◼   ► to ask just as a--

00:02:23 ◼   ► You've got to touch on the touch bar, Myke.

00:02:25 ◼   ► That's how it works.

00:02:26 ◼   ► You have to.

00:02:27 ◼   ► I mean, otherwise, what's the point of having it?

00:02:29 ◼   ► But I do have this one kind of meta question about the reviews and saying it's busy.

00:02:33 ◼   ► I think something that's maybe made this uncharacteristically busy, I can't ever remember a time where you

00:02:38 ◼   ► or like the majority of Tech Press will review two models of the same computer separately.

00:02:44 ◼   ► Yeah, well, okay, so there was a serious availability kind of roll out issue for the MacBook Pro

00:02:53 ◼   ► models and it's interesting, I've never seen this either. Usually, you know, they release

00:02:59 ◼   ► a bunch and you get the best one, right? That's where you're like, "No, no, no, here's the

00:03:03 ◼   ► best one." You're like, "But what about the others? Ah, bop, bop, nope, nope, you get

00:03:07 ◼   ► the good one, review the good one." That tends to be what happens. But this time, because

00:03:14 ◼   ► availability issue. So after the event, a bunch of reviewers, and I was included in

00:03:19 ◼   ► this, were, you know, it's the thing where you're told, "Come back a little bit later."

00:03:23 ◼   ► And I went and had a sandwich with Dan Frakes, my former colleague at Macworld who works

00:03:28 ◼   ► at the Wirecutter now, because he lives nearby.

00:03:30 ◼   ► Greg "Stryke" Baumgartner The New York Times, right?

00:03:32 ◼   ► Tim "Stryke" Baumgartner By the New York Times, right? Exactly. So

00:03:36 ◼   ► he's employed by that company now. Anyway, we had lunch and all that. And then I came

00:03:40 ◼   ► back and basically you get ushered into their new briefing center and you get demos and

00:03:46 ◼   ► then you leave with a MacBook Pro in a bag. And so I got the escape essentially, right?

00:03:53 ◼   ► The physical button two port 13 inch MacBook Pro and that's what everybody got and everybody

00:03:58 ◼   ► was saying after the event like, you know, they don't have the touch bar ones yet. So

00:04:02 ◼   ► then the next week I'm in Ireland with the physical button 13 inch MacBook Pro and I

00:04:07 ◼   ► I get an email from my PR contact at Apple saying, "Can you come by tomorrow to pick

00:04:11 ◼   ► up the 13-inch with touch bar?" To which I replied, "No, I can't. I'm in Ireland. Can

00:04:17 ◼   ► you send it to me?" There's no response. And I still don't have that model because I think

00:04:24 ◼   ► they were a very limited supply and they gave mine to someone else instead. So that's sad.

00:04:29 ◼   ► But then I get home and they say, "Can you come down and pick up the 15-inch?" So basically

00:04:36 ◼   ► on successive weeks each of these three variations rolled out. And so you end up with these interesting

00:04:42 ◼   ► situations of like, the first one had no embargo, or had, yeah, I think it had like…

00:04:47 ◼   ► They had the new embargo, right, which is just like, talk about whatever you want, but

00:04:51 ◼   ► post your review at a certain point or whatever it is.

00:04:55 ◼   ► The first one was, it was I think just like, your embargo is tomorrow morning or something

00:05:01 ◼   ► like that, just to give everybody a little bit more time, but it was not a lot of time.

00:05:05 ◼   ► then the second one came out and they had an embargo. And it sounds like then the third

00:05:09 ◼   ► one, 15-inch, came out. I'm not privy to all of this. It sounds like the embargo kept getting

00:05:14 ◼   ► pushed back. The embargo I got was Monday morning and that's what I did. So that was

00:05:18 ◼   ► all going on. So there was a lot of moving parts this time, which is kind of unusual.

00:05:21 ◼   ► And so people had to choose. Like, some sites have multiple reviews of the different models.

00:05:27 ◼   ► Some sites conflated all the, you know, all the reviews are all in one. I ended up writing

00:05:34 ◼   ► a hands-on experience piece on day one, and then a travel piece after I posted it literally

00:05:44 ◼   ► over the Atlantic Ocean on my flight back home, and then about the 13. And then this

00:05:50 ◼   ► piece is about 15 because that's the only model I've got. So it's kind of all over the

00:05:55 ◼   ► place about how people chose to review these. And in reality, we can talk about this more

00:05:59 ◼   ► later. What it ended up being was mostly I'm reviewing Touch Bar and Touch ID because these

00:06:04 ◼   ► systems are not that different from the 13 inch model without the Touch Bar. They're

00:06:10 ◼   ► not that different other than the Touch Bar and the Touch ID. So I ended up writing a

00:06:14 ◼   ► review of the MacBook Pro that's very much a review of, it's like an essay about Touch

00:06:18 ◼   ► Bar and Touch ID essentially.

00:06:19 ◼   ► Yeah, I guess the reason that you can write these reviews genuinely about these two machines

00:06:24 ◼   ► is it's been very, I can't think of any time

00:06:27 ◼   ► Apple's released a new product, like a new Mac,

00:06:31 ◼   ► where they have two versions

00:06:32 ◼   ► and one of them has this different feature.

00:06:34 ◼   ► Like they've released in the past,

00:06:36 ◼   ► like oh here's the Retina one,

00:06:37 ◼   ► but there wasn't like another Mac

00:06:39 ◼   ► that was just like the Retina one,

00:06:40 ◼   ► just didn't have Retina, I don't think.

00:06:42 ◼   ► But like this like touch bar is completely different.

00:06:45 ◼   ► As well, like you wouldn't even,

00:06:46 ◼   ► what would you review a Retina screen?

00:06:47 ◼   ► Like screen looks good, moving on,

00:06:49 ◼   ► like you know, what do you do?

00:06:51 ◼   ► But this is like a really weird type of thing

00:06:54 ◼   ► where they're just like, "Oh, here's a computer. It's really powerful. It has all this new

00:06:57 ◼   ► stuff in it. You can get it in space grey. Review it. Here's another one. It has another

00:07:02 ◼   ► screen on it and a fingerprint sensor on it. Review it. It's strange."

00:07:05 ◼   ► BRIAN: Every time I write a review of these things now, I end up trying to think, "How

00:07:11 ◼   ► do I describe..." Basically, you have to wave at the retina screen as you blow past it.

00:07:16 ◼   ► You have to say, "Like all of these computers these days, it has a beautiful, bright, wide

00:07:22 ◼   ► color retina display. It's great to look at. It's like, what can I say about it?

00:07:26 ◼   ► Your mileage may vary, right? You know what Apple does with displays now, and this has

00:07:32 ◼   ► got that, and so there it is. And then I kind of move on, because I'm not quite sure what

00:07:38 ◼   ► else to say. It's got a big, bright, beautiful retina display. And next!

00:07:44 ◼   ► So you can now buy these machines as well, but they're like four to five weeks shipping,

00:07:49 ◼   ► it stands currently. I don't know if you could buy them before but like you can buy them

00:07:53 ◼   ► and they're shipping in like a month. It'll be interesting to see if and how the touch

00:08:02 ◼   ► bar versions slip. So I think were they were they buyable? Like could you already buy these

00:08:08 ◼   ► things? Oh yeah. I can't remember. They're just I think I think they were on sale the

00:08:12 ◼   ► day it was announced and then the ship date was you know basically if you calculated it

00:08:17 ◼   ► if you ordered them right away. The ship date was mid-November, so about now. And they may,

00:08:21 ◼   ► given that our embargo dropped today, they may start trickling out this week. I don't

00:08:28 ◼   ► know, but my understanding is if you go and try to order one today, you won't be able

00:08:32 ◼   ► to get it tomorrow because they're backordered.

00:08:36 ◼   ► I guess my problem is, to check this personally, I don't think I know of anybody who's bought

00:08:39 ◼   ► one. I can't think of anyone that I know. I can't think of any friends of mine that

00:08:44 ◼   ► have actually purchased this machine. Oh, actually, our designer Frank has bought one.

00:08:49 ◼   ► So I mean, he's based in a place in Europe, so…

00:08:54 ◼   ► [Laughter]

00:08:55 ◼   ► A place in Europe?

00:08:57 ◼   ► Place in Europe. He's very mysterious.

00:08:58 ◼   ► I thought he was in a spaceship hovering above Europe.

00:09:01 ◼   ► Above Europe, yeah. There's a space place in Europe.

00:09:03 ◼   ► No, you've revealed it now. He's actually in a place, in a location in Europe.

00:09:07 ◼   ► Mm. Imagine that.

00:09:09 ◼   ► Wow. Mind blown.

00:09:11 ◼   ► John was the first person to recognize the startup chime is gone from the upgrade music

00:09:17 ◼   ► last week. We'd like to make sure that we keep up with the times, so Apple removes the

00:09:22 ◼   ► startup chime, so do we.

00:09:25 ◼   ► Yeah, this was an idea we talked about at ULL and didn't do it then because we were

00:09:32 ◼   ► just trying to get that episode out because it's live and we're at a conference and all

00:09:36 ◼   ► but we did it last time and presumably this time, and we'll see what happens. I don't

00:09:42 ◼   ► know if it's going to come back, Myke. I don't know what our policy, I don't know if somebody

00:09:46 ◼   ► can...

00:09:47 ◼   ► Well, it all depends on whether somebody opened terminal or not, right?

00:09:49 ◼   ► Yeah, I know, right? So we'll see. We'll see what happens if we can get into the podcast

00:09:54 ◼   ► command line and do some tweaking or whether we've lost the startup time forever.

00:10:01 ◼   ► We've spoken a lot recently about your kind of mobile recording setup and your iPad recording

00:10:05 ◼   ► setup and whilst we were at all, listener EJ, Elias who was the creator of the incredible

00:10:14 ◼   ► Podcast Universe map, if you've ever seen that thing, it's amazing.

00:10:20 ◼   ► He mentioned a way, because he records all on iOS and I believe he's writing a blog post

00:10:25 ◼   ► so Elias if you're out there and when you've written this, send it to me so I can put it

00:10:30 ◼   ► in show notes in future episode.

00:10:32 ◼   ► And he had mentioned, because he uses the Zoom solid state recorder like you do, Jason,

00:10:38 ◼   ► and then edits using Ferrite on his iPad. Now, currently there is no way without a Mac,

00:10:46 ◼   ► I believe, to get those two things to talk to each other, right? You need to somehow

00:10:51 ◼   ► – or using some kind of thing, you have to use something. There has to be something

00:10:55 ◼   ► in the middle.

00:10:56 ◼   ► Well, there has to be a PC, basically. There has to be a computer as an intermediary. This

00:11:00 ◼   ► is one of those things. I've written about how one of my big wish list items for iOS,

00:11:05 ◼   ► if they do a productivity update in the spring, is the ability to see more stuff on attached

00:11:12 ◼   ► storage devices, especially if you're using the card reader that Apple provides. Right

00:11:15 ◼   ► now all it'll do is see videos and photos. And now that we've got essentially file pickers

00:11:22 ◼   ► in terms of iCloud Drive and Dropbox and all the rest, and you can see files, why can't

00:11:28 ◼   ► you see files on those cards because right now a portable recorder like the Zoom that

00:11:35 ◼   ► I've got and that Elias has, they are recording waves or MP3s onto that card and it's great.

00:11:44 ◼   ► It's a great way to do portable recording. And then you want to edit and you've got your

00:11:47 ◼   ► iPad for editing and you can't get it over. You have to attach it to a computer that can

00:11:52 ◼   ► read or some other device that can read an SD card because the iPad can't read those

00:11:56 ◼   ► files on the SD card and transfer them and then transfer them to the iPad and then you

00:12:00 ◼   ► can do it. It's maddening. But now there are Wi-Fi enabled SD cards and the one I think

00:12:07 ◼   ► that has kind of occupied the mind share in this is a product called iFi. Right. Photographers

00:12:13 ◼   ► use this a lot in their cameras and they're able to transfer images to a service or to

00:12:20 ◼   ► a device very easily. However, the iFi SD card, it has a companion app on iOS, but it

00:12:27 ◼   ► only allows you to transfer media, movies, and photos.

00:12:31 ◼   ► It's got the same approach that Apple took with their SD card reader and the software

00:12:36 ◼   ► on iOS to read it, which is, this is a media transfer thing.

00:12:39 ◼   ► However, Toshiba make their own called the Flash Air, and the Flash Air app, when you

00:12:46 ◼   ► press a couple of hidden little buttons, not like hidden hidden, but like just not completely

00:12:50 ◼   ► - It's in the settings. - It's in the settings.

00:12:51 ◼   ► You can turn on the ability to take documents from,

00:12:56 ◼   ► or basically anything stored on the Flash Air

00:12:58 ◼   ► and it will download them to the application

00:13:00 ◼   ► and you can use the opening command on iOS.

00:13:02 ◼   ► So it is possible to grab these audio files

00:13:07 ◼   ► from the Flash Air card that has been recorded

00:13:11 ◼   ► in the Zoom recorder from the microphones

00:13:13 ◼   ► and then you're able to open in

00:13:15 ◼   ► and then you're able to open them up into Ferrite

00:13:17 ◼   ► and I believe you've tried this out.

00:13:19 ◼   ► Yeah, I did and it works. I mean that's the bottom line is you can see

00:13:24 ◼   ► and the way it works is you set it up, it's its own wireless

00:13:27 ◼   ► network basically and you have to, your iPad has to connect to it

00:13:30 ◼   ► or iPhone and you can set in the settings

00:13:33 ◼   ► in the app how long, because it uses battery right, or it uses power, so you can say how long

00:13:39 ◼   ► is it trying to set up that network before it gives up so I, you know, I have it set to like

00:13:44 ◼   ► a minute so literally in order to connect to it I need to turn on

00:13:47 ◼   ► because I wanted to save battery. I turn on my recorder and then connect to it by my iPad in

00:13:52 ◼   ► that first minute and then we're good. And then I can see the contents of the card. I can copy any

00:13:59 ◼   ► of those files over to my iPad. And yes, if you toggle a setting in the Flash Air app, then it

00:14:06 ◼   ► uses the open in, I don't know why this isn't on by default, but it provides you with the open in

00:14:12 ◼   ► command, at which point you can move those files over directly into something like Fairite

00:14:17 ◼   ► for editing. The only drawback is the way that that app is written right now. You have

00:14:22 ◼   ► to do them one at a time, even though you can make multiple selections, if you select

00:14:26 ◼   ► multiple files, you can't choose open in. I don't know why. It's kind of dumb.

00:14:30 ◼   ► That's an iOS limitation. You can only pass one file through at a time.

00:14:34 ◼   ► You can only open in one thing? Yeah. I wish there was, you know, it's one of those things

00:14:39 ◼   ► too where, yeah, if there was something else, you could zip it inside of Flash Air or something

00:14:45 ◼   ► like that, but you can't. So anyway, you have to do that one at a time. But this solves

00:14:48 ◼   ► the problem of if I want to go somewhere and record something, I can use, with multiple

00:14:53 ◼   ► microphones, I can use the Zoom recorder and then I can get it to my iPad and edit it and

00:14:57 ◼   ► post it and this closes a gap that probably shouldn't be there, but it closes that gap.

00:15:04 ◼   ► and that's cool. So I bought one, Elias told me about it, I immediately opened my phone,

00:15:11 ◼   ► opened the Amazon app, ordered one, had it sent to my house, it was here when I got back

00:15:15 ◼   ► home and it totally works. So it's a nice work around for now, I hope Apple will update

00:15:20 ◼   ► iOS to just read files off of SD cards in the future.

00:15:26 ◼   ► Last week, Dylan wrote in to ask, has anybody bought the larger Apple TV, the larger storage

00:15:32 ◼   ► Apple TV in our Ask Upgrade segment. And Steve wrote in to say that he owns the larger storage

00:15:38 ◼   ► Apple TV as he heard it has a better buffer for streaming content, so it's able to stream

00:15:43 ◼   ► more content. I've never heard this.

00:15:45 ◼   ► I don't think that's true.

00:15:47 ◼   ► I think that that might be a rubber chicken scenario, Steve, I'm afraid. But he also bought

00:15:52 ◼   ► it for future proofing, which I can kind of get on board with.

00:15:55 ◼   ► What is a rubber?

00:15:56 ◼   ► There might be something that pops up in the future that might mean he needs the storage,

00:16:00 ◼   ► but I'm afraid, Steve, whilst these may be valid reasons for you, they still don't seem

00:16:05 ◼   ► like enough for why anybody should buy that one.

00:16:08 ◼   ► What is a rubber chicken scenario?

00:16:10 ◼   ► You never heard of that?

00:16:11 ◼   ► I know what a rubber chicken is, but I don't-- what is a rubber chicken scenario?

00:16:15 ◼   ► So like, if you're swinging a rubber chicken like above your head, right?

00:16:19 ◼   ► Have you ever heard this?

00:16:21 ◼   ► No, I just googled for rubber chicken scenario in quotes and there's literally two-- there's

00:16:26 ◼   ► two web pages.

00:16:28 ◼   ► So I picked this up maybe from MacBreakWeekly back in the day. They would talk about swinging

00:16:35 ◼   ► a rubber chicken as a method of trying something out in the hopes that it will fix your problem.

00:16:42 ◼   ► Oh I see. So it's like a superstition thing. Like, you know, nothing else is working so

00:16:47 ◼   ► why don't I try this and see if it helps.

00:16:49 ◼   ► So let's blame Merlin for this. I'm just gonna straight up blame Merlin for that. But

00:16:53 ◼   ► I think that if Merlin Man is out there, he will know what I'm talking about. Like this

00:16:57 ◼   ► is the thing that they used to reference. I can hear him saying it. So like the idea

00:17:02 ◼   ► is you swing a rubber chicken above your head. Oh here it is. In the Wikipedia page for rubber

00:17:05 ◼   ► chicken it says "the rubber chicken fix refers to holding a rubber chicken above a problem

00:17:11 ◼   ► often perplexing and having the problem fix itself." I see. Okay. Right, so the idea being

00:17:17 ◼   ► that like this isn't a real thing that exists but it's like a placebo, it makes you feel

00:17:21 ◼   ► better. Alright. Well I again, so to Steve I don't know for sure but I think when it

00:17:27 ◼   ► came out we asked about this and they said that it's the way Apple describes

00:17:32 ◼   ► it is it's to load information from apps so that you basically large you can have

00:17:36 ◼   ► more apps and that those apps have more room to put their data on there but it's

00:17:41 ◼   ► never been very clearly communicated and I think Apple TV you know it's

00:17:46 ◼   ► providing plenty of buffer space for media is my understanding that that is

00:17:51 ◼   ► reserved for media on either model so I could be wrong about that but that's my

00:17:57 ◼   ► recollection from when it came out and that's why we've all been kind of

00:18:00 ◼   ► scratching our heads about the the storage difference in the Apple TV

00:18:03 ◼   ► because while it exists and they charge for it the communication on it is very

00:18:08 ◼   ► limited basically more apps so if you essentially I think what they're saying

00:18:12 ◼   ► is if you are using it for lots of games you can keep all the games on there and

00:18:18 ◼   ► it won't need to remove levels or whatever it'll load them and keep them

00:18:22 ◼   ► there because it's got plenty of space. And our resident Apple TV expert Joe

00:18:27 ◼   ► Steel in the chat room, fake name, said that the apps don't have more room themselves.

00:18:32 ◼   ► Everything is capped, all of the actual data that they can store in them. But as you said,

00:18:37 ◼   ► you can hold more apps, but you can't hold more data within those apps than the smaller

00:18:41 ◼   ► model does.

00:18:42 ◼   ► Tim Cynova I think it's not that you can hold more data.

00:18:44 ◼   ► I think it might be that if you run, you've got your app with content in the app package,

00:18:51 ◼   ► it's got its content and then you're in a low storage situation that it

00:18:57 ◼   ► blows off stuff that it can re-download and maybe that wouldn't

00:19:02 ◼   ► happen but I think Joe's also right that probably in almost any circumstance you

00:19:06 ◼   ► wouldn't get to that point unless you had lots of apps so it comes back to

00:19:09 ◼   ► more apps. I don't think that there are that many good apps to be honest.

00:19:13 ◼   ► Yeah, although I did see, who was it? I saw somebody talking about how they, I

00:19:20 ◼   ► I think side loaded an emulator onto their Apple TV.

00:19:24 ◼   ► - Marco did that.

00:19:25 ◼   ► - Was that Marco?

00:19:25 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:19:26 ◼   ► An emulator onto their Apple TV

00:19:29 ◼   ► and they have the steel case controller

00:19:31 ◼   ► and they play like emulated video games on the Apple TV.

00:19:34 ◼   ► That's what Marco tweeted about.

00:19:35 ◼   ► - The emulator games that you can put

00:19:37 ◼   ► they're like Nintendo games,

00:19:39 ◼   ► they're not gonna take up a lot of space.

00:19:41 ◼   ► - No, no, I know.

00:19:42 ◼   ► It's just, I thought that was an interesting,

00:19:44 ◼   ► but that's an example where you can't do that legally.

00:19:47 ◼   ► It's not in the app store.

00:19:49 ◼   ► So it's too bad.

00:19:50 ◼   ► Oh, I've got one for you.

00:19:53 ◼   ► Just a quick note.

00:19:54 ◼   ► I'm not gonna, I'm gonna write an article

00:19:55 ◼   ► about this at some point.

00:19:56 ◼   ► In the midst of writing my review

00:19:58 ◼   ► and doing all this stuff and being really busy,

00:20:00 ◼   ► I got a text message from my sister

00:20:02 ◼   ► saying that she had a virus on her Mac and could I help her?

00:20:07 ◼   ► And I literally ended up texting with her for three hours,

00:20:10 ◼   ► trying to figure out what it was and how to do it.

00:20:14 ◼   ► And it was made more difficult.

00:20:18 ◼   ► So what she did was she obviously clicked on something somewhere that reset her home

00:20:25 ◼   ► page on Safari to load a page that loads a JavaScript that throws up a dialog box that

00:20:31 ◼   ► says you've been infected call this number and you can't get out of the dialog box in

00:20:37 ◼   ► order to go to the preferences and reset Safari.

00:20:39 ◼   ► This happened, something like this happened to someone in John Siracus' family right?

00:20:43 ◼   ► I think you talk about ATP recently.

00:20:45 ◼   ► And one of the amazing things about Safari that I think is actually a flaw in Safari

00:20:49 ◼   ► that they need to fix is there's no way to reset Safari from outside Safari.

00:20:56 ◼   ► That doesn't make any sense.

00:20:58 ◼   ► Right?

00:20:59 ◼   ► There's not a command line tool.

00:21:01 ◼   ► I deleted every file I'm aware of that feeds Safari on her system and it didn't reset her

00:21:07 ◼   ► homepage.

00:21:08 ◼   ► This is a good thing for Chrome, right?

00:21:09 ◼   ► You could just delete Chrome.

00:21:11 ◼   ► So this is the problem is she had no other browser on her system so I couldn't even send

00:21:15 ◼   ► to web pages because she didn't have a browser. I was, I was, we were in messages and she

00:21:19 ◼   ► started on her iPhone and eventually I said get on messages on your Mac and I was sending,

00:21:24 ◼   ► I was dragging like anti-malware apps into the chat for her to get them through a download

00:21:31 ◼   ► through an iMessage transfer. It was a mess and it turns out that for all of this, and

00:21:37 ◼   ► this is why I wanted to bring this up and why I'll write about it, there is a really

00:21:41 ◼   ► simple solution here, and so I wanted to share it because maybe our listeners will experience

00:21:46 ◼   ► this or experience this with family members. If you get this like blocker, first off make

00:21:52 ◼   ► sure they don't call the person, make sure they don't let them share their screen or

00:21:56 ◼   ► whatever, you know, and if they've done that then it's even more problematic, but how you

00:22:01 ◼   ► solve this Safari blocker problem is actually shockingly simple, which is you turn off Wi-Fi,

00:22:06 ◼   ► you make sure they're not plugged into any networks, because the way this works is not

00:22:10 ◼   ► a page on the hard drive that's getting loaded, it's a page on the internet that's getting

00:22:14 ◼   ► loaded that loads the JavaScript that does the blocker. So if you turn off Wi-Fi and

00:22:18 ◼   ► load Safari it goes, "Oh, I can't find that page," at which point you can go to preferences

00:22:22 ◼   ► and go to homepage and delete the weird homepage URL that's been inserted as your homepage.

00:22:29 ◼   ► And then you're fine.

00:22:30 ◼   ► Oh, I hate that it's that simple.

00:22:32 ◼   ► So three hours to get to, "Why don't you turn off Wi-Fi?" But there it is. So I'll write

00:22:38 ◼   ► about it.

00:22:39 ◼   ► up the "Can't connect to the internet" page and you're good to go, right?

00:22:43 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah, yeah, and unfortunately there are lots of other steps we tried. If you hold

00:22:48 ◼   ► down shift when you launch Safari, it's supposed to kind of like not do it, but it didn't work,

00:22:55 ◼   ► right? Like I thought it was a rogue extension, I thought there was something, no, it was

00:22:58 ◼   ► just this, it was the homepage thing which is not solved. So I don't know what Apple

00:23:03 ◼   ► can do here, but that seemed like, and it sounds like maybe in El Capitan and Sierra,

00:23:09 ◼   ► added more stuff and she was running Yosemite. So it sounds like maybe this is solved in

00:23:16 ◼   ► more modern versions but of course you know what? All of our relatives who ask us for

00:23:20 ◼   ► technical help, they're not running Sierra, right?

00:23:22 ◼   ► I'm not running Sierra.

00:23:24 ◼   ► They're running an old, they're not running El Capitan. They may not even be running Yosemite.

00:23:28 ◼   ► They're running old versions. Anyway, so if this comes up to anybody out there, try turning

00:23:36 ◼   ► off all the networking and see if you can do that to get around it because that don't

00:23:40 ◼   ► be like me and spend three hours troubleshooting this. And from Apple's perspective, yeah,

00:23:45 ◼   ► again, maybe they fixed this, but it would be awfully nice if I could go to maybe settings

00:23:49 ◼   ► and have something I could click somewhere that erased, you know, that reset Safari,

00:23:56 ◼   ► outside of Safari. I don't know. IOS, man. That's what you need. You'll be alright.

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00:25:17 ◼   ► So let's talk about the touch bar shall we?

00:25:21 ◼   ► Oh let's!

00:25:23 ◼   ► So I spent some time this morning reading over your review.

00:25:25 ◼   ► I really like and I'm very happy that you included a video

00:25:28 ◼   ► with this review to kind of give a real flavor

00:25:32 ◼   ► for what's happening because, you know,

00:25:34 ◼   ► this is one of the things like so far, we've seen videos,

00:25:36 ◼   ► but they've been like real quick videos

00:25:38 ◼   ► that people take in demo rooms,

00:25:39 ◼   ► but you were able to sit down

00:25:41 ◼   ► and try out a ton of applications,

00:25:43 ◼   ► including some third party ones,

00:25:44 ◼   ► and really give an idea for what is going on

00:25:49 ◼   ► in the touch bar when you're accessing applications.

00:25:52 ◼   ► and I believe that you were doing a screen capture

00:25:55 ◼   ► and then actually recording yourself

00:25:58 ◼   ► in I assume a very dark room touching on the touch bar.

00:26:02 ◼   ► - Yeah, it was, yeah, so it's about a five minute video.

00:26:06 ◼   ► I decided, I finished writing the story mostly on Friday

00:26:09 ◼   ► and I spent most of Sunday morning doing the video.

00:26:14 ◼   ► And it was, right, I mean I don't do a lot of videos

00:26:17 ◼   ► mostly because they take a lot of time, as you know,

00:26:21 ◼   ► and I want to pick the spots where I think I've got something that actually

00:26:24 ◼   ► benefits from video, but this seemed like

00:26:27 ◼   ► seemed obvious, right? Like I need to show people how this works

00:26:30 ◼   ► and the room wasn't that dark but what I had to do is I basically put an

00:26:35 ◼   ► iPhone

00:26:36 ◼   ► on a tripod and with the glyph

00:26:39 ◼   ► mounting it on the tripod and

00:26:43 ◼   ► and I stopped down the shutter so basically I

00:26:46 ◼   ► had to make it way darker in order for the

00:26:50 ◼   ► for the the screen to be visible on it. So it looks like a dark room. It actually

00:26:54 ◼   ► wasn't that dark, but I needed to make it dark

00:26:56 ◼   ► so that you could see the touch bar clearly. And then, yeah, and I ran a

00:26:59 ◼   ► screen capture. I discovered that QuickTime helpfully

00:27:03 ◼   ► puts a big red button on the control strip

00:27:08 ◼   ► that says "You're capturing the screen. Thanks!" That's not what I needed. But

00:27:14 ◼   ► anyway, I did a screen capture and also was videoing

00:27:17 ◼   ► from kind of above and behind me the touch bar and then I put those two,

00:27:21 ◼   ► composited those two things together so that people could see sort of like what

00:27:24 ◼   ► was I doing on screen and what was I doing on the touch bar and how they connect

00:27:27 ◼   ► because you can't really,

00:27:29 ◼   ► first off you can't capture video from the touch bar right now. You can capture

00:27:32 ◼   ► screenshots but you can't capture video

00:27:34 ◼   ► and the second thing is even if you could capture video from the touch bar

00:27:38 ◼   ► you can't see the fingers and what they're doing on the touch bar. Frankly

00:27:41 ◼   ► why would you need that? The use case of capturing it is so

00:27:46 ◼   ► So slim, Apple's not going to build that in for a long time, if ever, into QuickTime.

00:27:50 ◼   ► Well, plus it has to get it, it has to like get the video stream of itself through the,

00:27:56 ◼   ► you know, through the processor, through the T1.

00:27:59 ◼   ► It might not even be able to.

00:28:01 ◼   ► It may not, right?

00:28:02 ◼   ► And so, anyway, so it was pretty easy to do it once I got the setup, once I figured out

00:28:07 ◼   ► like the tripod, and it was funny, I have this tripod that I, that literally I got in

00:28:13 ◼   ► high school to shoot videos and I still have it. It weighs a ton but I still have it so

00:28:17 ◼   ► I got it out. It was funny though the tripod I got in the 80s with an iPhone 7 Plus on

00:28:24 ◼   ► it shooting 4K video. That tripod never could have imagined that camera could it? No definitely

00:28:31 ◼   ► not pretty amazing that's had VHS camcorders on it and it's had an iPhone 7 Plus shooting

00:28:36 ◼   ► 4K video. Anyway so I put it together and yeah I'm pretty happy with how the video turned

00:28:41 ◼   ► out because I think it's good to show people it's a new user interface system and I think

00:28:49 ◼   ► you know the real thing to do is to use it but failing that it's to see it in use and

00:28:54 ◼   ► that was what I was going for with the video as the I mean I also wrote 5,000 words but

00:29:00 ◼   ► I did make a five minute long video too so you know a little bit of both.

00:29:04 ◼   ► So there are I've seen this in your video in some of your photos and photos I've seen

00:29:09 ◼   ► elsewhere. If you get the keyboard under the right light, so like it's all evenly lit,

00:29:16 ◼   ► like you know, there's no light shining from it, or you don't see any finger grease or

00:29:21 ◼   ► anything like that on the keys, the realness of the display of the buttons of the touch

00:29:27 ◼   ► bar, like how much they look like buttons, to me it tricks my brain into thinking it's

00:29:32 ◼   ► all screen. Not all buttons.

00:29:35 ◼   ► Interesting.

00:29:36 ◼   ► So like it's weird.

00:29:37 ◼   ► - I like that the keyboard is screened too.

00:29:39 ◼   ► - Yeah, because I know that's a screen.

00:29:41 ◼   ► So there's like this weird,

00:29:43 ◼   ► and you mentioned Uncanny Valley in yours, in your article.

00:29:47 ◼   ► Where it's like, I look at this,

00:29:48 ◼   ► like I'm looking at your top image, right?

00:29:50 ◼   ► Your banner image with the ginger molasses cookies,

00:29:53 ◼   ► which I'm a big fan of that type of cookie, by the way.

00:29:54 ◼   ► Just FYI, Jason.

00:29:56 ◼   ► - They're really good.

00:29:57 ◼   ► That's, yeah, they're really good.

00:29:59 ◼   ► - If you look at like the left hand side, right?

00:30:02 ◼   ► Of that keyboard of the image,

00:30:04 ◼   ► where it's all like just dark.

00:30:06 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:30:07 ◼   ► like just looking at that whole thing I'm like I know my brain is like there's

00:30:10 ◼   ► some screen there maybe the whole thing screen it's really weird it's like

00:30:13 ◼   ► tricking my head in a strange strange way I think it's because those keys are

00:30:17 ◼   ► so flat and they're so dark and they're pretty well illuminated now it's a so

00:30:22 ◼   ► weird mix but this is a really really roundabout way of saying that the touch

00:30:26 ◼   ► bar screen does look really cool and Apple have done a great job of

00:30:31 ◼   ► integrating it it looks more like part of the keyboard than part of the screen

00:30:35 ◼   ► Yeah, that's the goal. And so you're seeing your uncanny valley, you know, you're coming

00:30:40 ◼   ► at it from the other angle here. But the idea here is that the touch bar matches the screen.

00:30:44 ◼   ► It's designed to be an input device. It is from certain angles, you can see that it's,

00:30:51 ◼   ► you know, it's glass and it's shiny, but not from where you're sitting if you're using

00:30:56 ◼   ► the keyboard. From there, it looks much more matte. And the idea, you can even see it on

00:31:01 ◼   ► that same image with the cookies. On the left side it looks very black just like

00:31:06 ◼   ► the key next to it. All the way on the right side where there's a little more

00:31:09 ◼   ► of a reflection picking up because there's more light over there, it looks

00:31:12 ◼   ► lighter but so do the keys right below it, right? And that's the idea here is

00:31:18 ◼   ► that it's trying to match it. The whole goal is to make it feel like an

00:31:22 ◼   ► extension of the keyboard and I think they succeeded. It's not a keyboard, right?

00:31:26 ◼   ► Because it doesn't have physical buttons but it's not it's not an iPad either

00:31:30 ◼   ► like it is and the way you use it is very much as part of the keyboard it's

00:31:35 ◼   ► part of the keyboard process it's not it's not a third touch area nor is it a

00:31:41 ◼   ► second trackpad it really feels like it's part of the keyboard I had a I had

00:31:45 ◼   ► a realization at some point so I our friend James Thompson who does pcalc he

00:31:52 ◼   ► kept sending me builds that he's working on of pcalc with touch bar support and

00:31:57 ◼   ► the first build he sent me, one of the buttons on the touch bar was to do a

00:32:02 ◼   ► conversion, like just like Fahrenheit to Celsius or whatever. So you just have

00:32:08 ◼   ► conversions. And what it did was it brought up his conversions dialog on the

00:32:11 ◼   ► screen, and then I would need to move my mouse out there and pick which one and

00:32:14 ◼   ► choose OK. And I had that moment of realization, like, oh, that's not good.

00:32:18 ◼   ► Like, the last thing I want to do when I'm in kind of keyboard mode is trigger

00:32:23 ◼   ► a thing that makes me take my hands back off the keyboard, move down to the track

00:32:26 ◼   ► mouse up and click on something. And I think that was my moment of realization

00:32:31 ◼   ► that although I kind of throw a keyboard and trackpad into one bucket, which is

00:32:35 ◼   ► like input into my Mac, they're not, right? They're not the same. And there are

00:32:40 ◼   ► keyboard-driven people, and there are our mouse and trackpad-driven people, and

00:32:45 ◼   ► other people are kind of in the middle. There's a spectrum there, right, where

00:32:47 ◼   ► people want to do all keyboard shortcuts and stuff. And sometimes for RSI

00:32:51 ◼   ► reasons and other things like that, they want to minimize the mousing that they

00:32:54 ◼   ► do. And other people are very into mousing. They're visual people. They like to click

00:32:58 ◼   ► on the icons. You tell them that they can hit Command+Shift+Z to do the same thing and

00:33:02 ◼   ► they're like, "Yeah, but the icon's right there. I'm just gonna click on that icon."

00:33:06 ◼   ► But what I found with the Touch Bar is it's part of the keyboard. Like, when I'm on the

00:33:10 ◼   ► keyboard, I want to be on the keyboard. And the last thing I want to do is like, "Do-do-do-do-do,

00:33:15 ◼   ► keyboard. Oh, now I need to move down to the mouse. Go up, click something. Do-do-do-do-do.

00:33:19 ◼   ► Now I'm back on the keyboard." Wouldn't it be better if I stayed on the keyboard? If

00:33:24 ◼   ► could-- because switching from one to the other, and it doesn't matter whether

00:33:27 ◼   ► you're on the trackpad or on the keyboard, from one to the other, you're

00:33:30 ◼   ► going to take a little bit of a hit. So I told this to James, and I don't

00:33:34 ◼   ► know if he was already working on it or not or whether I influenced him, but I

00:33:36 ◼   ► told this to James because he's just using the simulator, and he sent me a

00:33:40 ◼   ► build where instead of it triggering the function or the the conversion image on

00:33:46 ◼   ► screen, what it did is bring up a list of favorite or recent conversions you've

00:33:51 ◼   ► done in pcalc on the touch bar. So I touch conversion and it says Celsius to Fahrenheit

00:33:57 ◼   ► and I tap that and it does it and I was like that's it. Like that's the difference.

00:34:02 ◼   ► Is I'm staying on the keyboard and so that was it stuff like that where it's you know

00:34:06 ◼   ► it taught me that that Apple has taken a lot of care. I imagine that they spent a lot of

00:34:13 ◼   ► time debating and watching how people use different approaches to this and you still

00:34:18 ◼   ► see it in some of the ways different apps implement the touch bar, like it's kind of

00:34:22 ◼   ► all over the place. Like, I think some of them I use and I go, "Oh yeah, this is exactly

00:34:26 ◼   ► right." In others I'm like, "I don't really understand what's going on here." And over

00:34:31 ◼   ► time I think we'll all kind of figure out together what the best practices are for this.

00:34:35 ◼   ► But Apple's given it a lot of thought and it definitely struck me that this is what

00:34:40 ◼   ► they figured out, is it's part of the keyboard. Like, that is its purpose. And no, you can't

00:34:47 ◼   ► feel it like you can feel physical keys but I would make the argument that nobody really

00:34:51 ◼   ► touch types or very few people really touch type F keys like I don't touch type F keys

00:34:57 ◼   ► and so I was always looking down to press a function key anyway this isn't that different.

00:35:02 ◼   ► It's different if you got like a big slider and stuff like that that's a very different

00:35:05 ◼   ► kind of thing and we'll see how people adapt to that but when it's just sort of like extra

00:35:10 ◼   ► buttons that change based on what you need and you can quickly tap them and you know

00:35:14 ◼   ► it in the calculator. Like, it's really cool to be able to--I would use both Apple's calculator

00:35:18 ◼   ► and James' PCALC. Like, it used to be, if I wanted to take the square root of something--and

00:35:23 ◼   ► there's probably a keyboard shortcut, but I never used it--I would, like, type the number

00:35:28 ◼   ► on the keyboard, and then I'd move to the mouse and push my cursor to the square root

00:35:31 ◼   ► button and click it, and then I'd get the square root. Well, with the touch bar, I put

00:35:36 ◼   ► in the number, and then I'd tap square root on the touch bar, and there's my answer, and

00:35:40 ◼   ► and I've never left the keyboard.

00:35:41 ◼   ► And that's better, I mean that is better.

00:35:44 ◼   ► - So this kind of leads into something

00:35:48 ◼   ► that you said in the video and you kind of echoed it

00:35:51 ◼   ► in the, I first saw the video,

00:35:53 ◼   ► so you said it in the video,

00:35:54 ◼   ► you echo it in the review as well.

00:35:56 ◼   ► And I'm gonna paraphrase you a little bit.

00:35:58 ◼   ► But you basically said that the touch bar

00:35:59 ◼   ► kind of helps you keep your fingers in the keyboard position

00:36:03 ◼   ► without needing to reach for the track pad.

00:36:04 ◼   ► Now this is very counter to all of the upset

00:36:09 ◼   ► that people were feeling before this was announced, right?

00:36:12 ◼   ► The idea of like,

00:36:14 ◼   ► this is gonna ruin my touch typing experience,

00:36:17 ◼   ► this is gonna be a way I'm gonna have to keep reaching up

00:36:20 ◼   ► there and that kind of thing.

00:36:21 ◼   ► So this, it seems to me at least that like,

00:36:24 ◼   ► you're someone who's a touch typist,

00:36:26 ◼   ► that this is actually helping you improve

00:36:28 ◼   ► your keyboard experience because you're

00:36:31 ◼   ► staying on the keyboard as opposed to, as you say,

00:36:34 ◼   ► reaching for the trackpad.

00:36:36 ◼   ► This just seems counter to what I think we were expecting.

00:36:39 ◼   ► - Yeah, it surprised me a little bit too,

00:36:43 ◼   ► but it definitely was that feeling like,

00:36:45 ◼   ► it's not something I really anticipated,

00:36:47 ◼   ► but it's what I ended up experiencing,

00:36:49 ◼   ► that when I've got my hands, you know,

00:36:52 ◼   ► as I'm talking here, I've got my 10 fingers

00:36:55 ◼   ► sort of spread out in like keyboard positions.

00:36:57 ◼   ► Like I've got my hands out and in keyboard position, right?

00:37:01 ◼   ► And I'm doing things on my computer

00:37:02 ◼   ► that are like, you know, typey, typey, typey,

00:37:04 ◼   ► whether it's in a text window or it's something else,

00:37:07 ◼   ► I'm doing something very keyboard-y.

00:37:08 ◼   ► And then in other contexts,

00:37:10 ◼   ► I will be entirely like on my track pad

00:37:13 ◼   ► and maybe I've got one hand on a keyboard shortcut

00:37:17 ◼   ► or something, but that's a very different kind of mode.

00:37:19 ◼   ► And that's the part that I discovered

00:37:21 ◼   ► is that when you're in typing, typing, typing mode,

00:37:24 ◼   ► there are some times when you have to come off the keyboard

00:37:26 ◼   ► in order to do something to interact

00:37:28 ◼   ► with the app that you're using.

00:37:30 ◼   ► And that's often because there's no keyboard shortcut

00:37:34 ◼   ► or you don't know it.

00:37:35 ◼   ► There may be one, but you don't know it.

00:37:37 ◼   ► You just, for whatever reason, you haven't learned it.

00:37:39 ◼   ► - Because you can learn all the keyboard shortcuts seriously.

00:37:41 ◼   ► - Right, and so what you end up doing, right,

00:37:44 ◼   ► and discoverability is part of this too,

00:37:46 ◼   ► that like I used headings and notes

00:37:49 ◼   ► that I've never used before.

00:37:50 ◼   ► And there's a keyboard trick.

00:37:51 ◼   ► It's like Command + Shift + H to do a heading.

00:37:52 ◼   ► But on this, I was like,

00:37:54 ◼   ► "Oh, I could just tap the touch bar and go style header.

00:37:56 ◼   ► "Got it."

00:37:58 ◼   ► And that was different.

00:37:59 ◼   ► So anyway, when I'm in that mode of typing,

00:38:02 ◼   ► I think that's one of the big changes is,

00:38:06 ◼   ► suddenly I've got these other options

00:38:09 ◼   ► that allow me to do, rather than taking my hands out

00:38:12 ◼   ► into push the cursor on the screen mode

00:38:16 ◼   ► and go up to the top of the window and click the button

00:38:19 ◼   ► to do the thing I wanna do

00:38:20 ◼   ► and then maybe go back to the keyboard,

00:38:23 ◼   ► instead, if that interface button is on the touch bar,

00:38:27 ◼   ► my hands are staying in typing position

00:38:29 ◼   ► and I'm reaching up with a finger and going, boop,

00:38:31 ◼   ► and then continuing along my way.

00:38:34 ◼   ► And I know that's a little thing,

00:38:36 ◼   ► but I got to appreciate the fact that that was,

00:38:41 ◼   ► that was a useful thing.

00:38:45 ◼   ► And there is as small as it might seem,

00:38:48 ◼   ► maybe it's a micro distraction or something,

00:38:51 ◼   ► but it's a mode shift when you go from

00:38:54 ◼   ► my hands are in keyboard position

00:38:55 ◼   ► to my hands are in driving the mouse on the screen position.

00:38:58 ◼   ► and I think good touch bar apps let you reduce the number of times you need to switch.

00:39:06 ◼   ► Hmm, yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense.

00:39:11 ◼   ► And switching from trackpad to keyboard is also a mode switch, right?

00:39:16 ◼   ► I mean, that's the challenge. I would argue maybe that, yeah,

00:39:21 ◼   ► trackpad in one hand and hand on a keyboard doing copies and pastes and things like that

00:39:26 ◼   ► quite the same as the full-on typing feel it's a little bit different and I do that all the time

00:39:31 ◼   ► but yeah I don't know it's like that the modes are broken when you're using sliders on the touch bar

00:39:38 ◼   ► uh maybe okay because that's more of a track patty thing yeah yeah I think I think

00:39:46 ◼   ► everybody look uh Christina Warren's piece at uh Gizmodo about this she said how much she loved

00:39:55 ◼   ► the Final Cut Pro stuff. I really didn't like it. And some of that may be just having to get used

00:40:01 ◼   ► to it, but it was very complicated at points where there was like a slider and all of this stuff.

00:40:07 ◼   ► And I was thinking to myself, is this better, you know, than using my trackpad or using, well,

00:40:17 ◼   ► using my trackpad to make a gesture or using my trackpad to drive something on the screen?

00:40:22 ◼   ► And it's certainly different, right? And I think that's one of the things we all have to learn is

00:40:27 ◼   ► having that touch surface with the screen feedback where you're doing like swiping

00:40:33 ◼   ► and stuff like that. Is that--what kind of mode is that? Is that a totally new mode?

00:40:41 ◼   ► Is that an extension of the keyboard? It doesn't feel like an extension of the keyboard to me.

00:40:47 ◼   ► it feels like an alternative touch interface and that's that you know I

00:40:55 ◼   ► don't know I I don't know where this is going to go because we could speculate

00:40:58 ◼   ► about the trackpad turning into a screen to write and they haven't done that but

00:41:04 ◼   ► they could do that at some point I don't know I don't know it those interfaces

00:41:09 ◼   ► didn't work for me like the more kind of button exposing interesting features

00:41:15 ◼   ► stuff worked for me. I want you to try and explain to me Jason the control

00:41:22 ◼   ► strip. I have no idea if I'm missing something here but I am very confused

00:41:28 ◼   ► and continue to be very confused about what the control strip is, what it does

00:41:34 ◼   ► when it's there when it isn't and I think part of this is I think that Apple

00:41:40 ◼   ► are trying to be too cute in giving a part of this touch bar a name that kind of harkens

00:41:47 ◼   ► back to classic Mac in the attempt to try and make some Mac people happy. Because what

00:41:54 ◼   ► they've done is they've created a new thing which has its own brand and then they've created

00:41:58 ◼   ► a sub-brand within it. Because the control strip is being referred to as this thing when

00:42:04 ◼   ► really it should just be like the permanent buttons on the touch bar. That's what they

00:42:09 ◼   ► should be referred to in my mind but calling it Control Strip it only makes it more confusing

00:42:14 ◼   ► to me because quite frequently I mix Control Strip and Touch Bar up in my head as what

00:42:19 ◼   ► they actually are.

00:42:20 ◼   ► Haha, I mean my argument would be that it's a little bit like referring to the Max Menu

00:42:26 ◼   ► Bar like the Menu Bar is part of the display but it's a special part of it and that's

00:42:34 ◼   ► how the Control Strip, that's what the Control Strip is. It's not, it's almost always

00:42:38 ◼   ► there though, if it was always there 100% of the time, then fine. That's the control

00:42:44 ◼   ► strip corner, but that's not even how it works, right?

00:42:47 ◼   ► It's there most of the time. It's actually, it's there except when it's not.

00:42:53 ◼   ► Nothing like some consistency. Well no, it's there basically if you think

00:42:57 ◼   ► of it as a layer. Like the bottom layer of the touch bar is the control strip and the

00:43:03 ◼   ► application area. The control strip is three or four buttons on the right side

00:43:08 ◼   ► and then everything else is the application area. That's the bottom layer.

00:43:12 ◼   ► Now one of the things you can do with the touch bar is open an overlay where

00:43:19 ◼   ► you basically tap on something and something comes up that's a layer on top

00:43:23 ◼   ► of it and there's a little X at the far left that lets you close it again. When

00:43:29 ◼   ► you open an overlay it overlays the touch bar. So the touch bar is always

00:43:35 ◼   ► there except if you're in kind of a modal context where you opened a thing

00:43:44 ◼   ► like the emoji picker. The idea there is it wants to give, touch bar wants to

00:43:50 ◼   ► give the most space possible to essentially a new window, a new layer

00:43:55 ◼   ► that you've opened, that you opened yourself, that the app can't do it but

00:43:59 ◼   ► that you did it. You opened this thing using the touch bar. So if I tap the emoji picker,

00:44:05 ◼   ► the emoji picker takes the whole touch bar space. It doesn't just leave the control strip

00:44:11 ◼   ► on the side. But it's modal and it's got the X on the left to tell you that you can clear

00:44:17 ◼   ► out of it. And then you go back down to the first layer which is appstep on the left and

00:44:22 ◼   ► control strip on the right. So control strip is mostly there.

00:44:25 ◼   ► So the only things that can hide Control Strip are modal views within Touch Bar?

00:44:31 ◼   ► I think so?

00:44:36 ◼   ► Modal things and Touch ID things, which are kind of modal too, right?

00:44:39 ◼   ► Because the Touch ID label comes up right where the Touch Bar or the Control Strip is.

00:44:43 ◼   ► See, I did it.

00:44:44 ◼   ► And points the little arrow at the Touch ID and says, "Touch it, touch it."

00:44:49 ◼   ► But otherwise, yeah, as far as I could tell, and there's things that are inconsistent.

00:44:54 ◼   ► QuickTime recording thing, for example, it was there and then at one point it went away

00:44:59 ◼   ► and I couldn't figure out why it went away. Sometimes iTunes loses track of, or the system

00:45:04 ◼   ► loses track of what iTunes is playing. There are bugs. There are some bugs here. But for

00:45:08 ◼   ► the most part I think that's how it's supposed to work. That's what it's meant to be, is

00:45:12 ◼   ► that the control strip stays on that base level, but if you usher something else up

00:45:15 ◼   ► by tapping on something that pops up a new strip on top, or if you tap the left side

00:45:21 ◼   ► of the control strip to bring up like the full on... because I think that's the more

00:45:25 ◼   ► confusing thing about the control strip is when you tap the little arrow on the left

00:45:28 ◼   ► side of the control strip it brings up a whole big control strip that's not the same like

00:45:34 ◼   ► it doesn't just reveal more to the left the ones that are that are in your standard control

00:45:38 ◼   ► strip go away and are replaced with this like new layer of control strip and it's all customizable

00:45:44 ◼   ► although again differently customizable like you can't put the same buttons on the big

00:45:49 ◼   ► control strip that you put on the small control strip.

00:45:51 ◼   ► Oh I'm so confused Jason.

00:45:53 ◼   ► You have different options there.

00:45:55 ◼   ► I think, see?

00:45:56 ◼   ► Right?

00:45:57 ◼   ► That's more confusing to me.

00:45:58 ◼   ► Because I can get with the control strips on the bottom layer.

00:46:01 ◼   ► But then you can expand the control strip, but it doesn't really expand it, it kind of

00:46:05 ◼   ► brings up a new level of, like a full on control strip instead.

00:46:13 ◼   ► Control strip is such a bad name.

00:46:14 ◼   ► it doesn't, it absolutely does not explain what is there to me. Like, I just don't, I

00:46:20 ◼   ► just don't get it. It should have a different name in my mind.

00:46:24 ◼   ► CURTIS SMITH But the idea is, so the idea is it's like

00:46:26 ◼   ► the system, I mean, they, they, you know, I guess menu bar is already taken or toolbar

00:46:30 ◼   ► or something like that.

00:46:31 ◼   ► WILLIAM

00:46:31 ◼   ► - System shortcuts, or like, system keys.

00:46:33 ◼   ► - 'Cause that's what it is.

00:46:35 ◼   ► I mean, ideally one day, third parties will be able

00:46:37 ◼   ► to put stuff in there, that would be really nice.

00:46:39 ◼   ► That's the one thing that I think this is,

00:46:41 ◼   ► Apple opens so much up to third parties

00:46:43 ◼   ► that I'm not gonna complain too much about it,

00:46:44 ◼   ► because all third party apps can use Touch ID now,

00:46:47 ◼   ► and I use 1Password and it works great.

00:46:50 ◼   ► Third party apps have access to that Touch Bar now,

00:46:53 ◼   ► that's great too.

00:46:54 ◼   ► What they don't do is they can't drop things

00:46:56 ◼   ► in Control Strip, which would be kinda nice,

00:46:57 ◼   ► because if you had the ability to key off

00:46:59 ◼   ► some sort of system-wide macro or whatever,

00:47:02 ◼   ► that would be really cool to have there,

00:47:03 ◼   ► but you can't do that yet.

00:47:05 ◼   ► But that's what it's for.

00:47:06 ◼   ► It's for volume and brightness and Siri

00:47:10 ◼   ► and all of that sort of thing.

00:47:12 ◼   ► That's why it's there.

00:47:13 ◼   ► - Maybe it should have just been called Control Center

00:47:15 ◼   ► and then everybody would understand what that was.

00:47:17 ◼   ► - Well, maybe so.

00:47:18 ◼   ► - Because, yeah.

00:47:20 ◼   ► It's like Control Center made sense

00:47:22 ◼   ► because there was already notification center, but you know.

00:47:25 ◼   ► - Right.

00:47:26 ◼   ► I don't mind the name Control Strip

00:47:27 ◼   ► because I've got that history with it

00:47:29 ◼   ► and it is kind of like the old control strip, kinda, sorta,

00:47:33 ◼   ► but it's probably, I could see your point

00:47:35 ◼   ► that it's maybe a little too cute.

00:47:37 ◼   ► - Yeah, there is a, Will in the chat room mentioned,

00:47:40 ◼   ► there is, can you explain what Touche is?

00:47:42 ◼   ► He's given me a link,

00:47:45 ◼   ► there's something that Daniel Jalka has made.

00:47:46 ◼   ► - Oh yeah, so Daniel Jalka wrote an app called Touche

00:47:49 ◼   ► that basically lets you do an emulated touch bar

00:47:51 ◼   ► on your Mac if you've got the build of OS X

00:47:54 ◼   ► that is the one that ships on these systems,

00:47:57 ◼   ► you can download it and install it. It's a new, gotta love Apple sometimes, it's a later

00:48:04 ◼   ► build of 10.12.1, so it's 10.12.1, but it's a more recent 10.12.1 that ships on these

00:48:12 ◼   ► new systems. It's a later build, which I don't know why you wouldn't call that 10.12.2? How

00:48:17 ◼   ► do you get this later build of 10.12.1? Daniel Jowkut on the site, he's got a link to it.

00:48:24 ◼   ► can download from Apple as an installer and then just run it as an OS update and you're

00:48:28 ◼   ► updating 10.12.1 to 10.12.1. Anyway, if you do that, if you've got the later version or

00:48:34 ◼   ► a future version, 10.12.2 and on, anything that's got the touch bar stuff put in there.

00:48:38 ◼   ► That wasn't in there before because they didn't want to give it away and then they put that

00:48:41 ◼   ► image in that gave it away. If you have that, you can run Touche and it will show you like

00:48:47 ◼   ► what the touch bar would show and you can take screenshots and stuff like that. So that's

00:48:53 ◼   ► That's what it is.

00:48:54 ◼   ► To tie up November's episodes into a question for you, what does the Touch Bar say about

00:49:02 ◼   ► Apple's current attitude to the Mac?

00:49:05 ◼   ► Does it show if they care and how much, and does it indicate how, or to you at least,

00:49:12 ◼   ► how you think that the Mac platform should change?

00:49:17 ◼   ► I think it absolutely shows that they care because of the amount of work they put into

00:49:21 ◼   ► it.

00:49:22 ◼   ► I think the answer is going to be everybody gets their own opinion about if this is what

00:49:27 ◼   ► they should care about, but it shows that they care. This is, if you…

00:49:32 ◼   ► They might not care about your thing, but they care about it as a whole, the platform.

00:49:36 ◼   ► Yeah. If Apple didn't care about the Mac, why would they build entirely new tech based

00:49:44 ◼   ► on iOS stuff with custom processor and a custom, you know, this custom screen and that really

00:49:53 ◼   ► on, if you've got these models, changes the Mac UI, like it adds a whole other layer of

00:50:00 ◼   ► Mac UI that didn't exist before. If Apple really felt like, look, the Mac is good, it's

00:50:05 ◼   ► fine, it's a legacy system, let's just eke it out for as long as we can, they wouldn't

00:50:10 ◼   ► have made this product. They wouldn't.

00:50:11 ◼   ► Yeah, I expect the person hours of development on this is much higher than usual because

00:50:16 ◼   ► they had to get all of the separate application teams to update for this, all right, and to

00:50:22 ◼   ► add this, which they don't—they very rarely have something that does this outside of like

00:50:28 ◼   ► a full OS update, right? Like there's some new feature that all of the apps have to support.

00:50:32 ◼   ► Yeah, here are the apps that Apple had to update to support Touch Bar. So in addition

00:50:37 ◼   ► building the touch bar and all the hardware that went into that and Touch ID

00:50:40 ◼   ► and everything they had to do with that and and getting the secure enclave to

00:50:45 ◼   ► talk to the Mac system and and have that be secure. They had to update, well they

00:50:50 ◼   ► did update, they probably wanted to update others too and they didn't, but

00:50:53 ◼   ► they updated activity monitor, calculator, calendar, contacts, finder, Final Cut Pro,

00:50:58 ◼   ► GarageBand, iMovie, iTunes, Keynote, Mail, Maps, Messages, Numbers, Pages, Photos,

00:51:03 ◼   ► preview QuickTime player Safari system preferences and terminal plus a bunch of other apps like

00:51:09 ◼   ► text edit stickies notes and script editor that use the standard text interface pick

00:51:15 ◼   ► up a touch bar but I think maybe they did that for free or for cheap but they updated

00:51:21 ◼   ► a lot of apps so this is a huge effort on the software on the Mac software side. I love

00:51:25 ◼   ► the activity monitors in there. Oh yeah the person dealing with activity monitor you know

00:51:31 ◼   ► know, they're just having their moment in the sun, you know.

00:51:34 ◼   ► Yeah, and terminal and activity monitor, those are key utilities that they have, they did

00:51:39 ◼   ► it. I use activity monitor all the time.

00:51:41 ◼   ► Really?

00:51:42 ◼   ► I love it.

00:51:43 ◼   ► What for?

00:51:46 ◼   ► See if there, why is my system behaving strangely, what app is behaving weirdly, can I force

00:51:51 ◼   ► quit it, can I get it to go away, what's the, you know, am I right that my computer is slow,

00:51:59 ◼   ► is something taking a lot of CPU cycles?

00:52:00 ◼   ► I use it a little less now that I have iStat menus, but I still use it, yeah, all the time.

00:52:04 ◼   ► If I have any of those problems, I will open Activity Monitor, but I very rarely have any

00:52:11 ◼   ► problems that need me to open Activity Monitor.

00:52:14 ◼   ► Yeah, I'm in there.

00:52:16 ◼   ► I was just using it last night because I ran Geekbench on a bunch of these systems, and

00:52:21 ◼   ► Activity Monitor's great because you can see if the photo library sync or the photo detection,

00:52:30 ◼   ► the machine learning is running because that will kill. You can't just start up a system

00:52:36 ◼   ► brand new and run a benchmark on it because it's going to index all your files with Spotlight

00:52:41 ◼   ► and it's going to do all these photo things. So I just used that last night to make sure

00:52:46 ◼   ► that everything had calmed down and I didn't have processes running in the background that

00:52:51 ◼   ► I didn't want to run so that I could get kind of a fair test. But anyway, the larger point

00:52:58 ◼   ► here is, "Yeah, this is a huge investment in Apple on something new on the Mac," and

00:53:03 ◼   ► I think if they didn't care, why would they do that? I do wonder if this is one of the

00:53:09 ◼   ► reasons why the Mac has seemed so logy for so long, is that there's only so much investment

00:53:14 ◼   ► Apple wants to do in the Mac, and they kind of poured it all into this while everything

00:53:18 ◼   ► else kind of stayed put, at least for now, and again, maybe there's—since this was

00:53:23 ◼   ► supposedly rumored to be coming out this summer, perhaps they've already moved on and are

00:53:27 ◼   ► working on something else now that we'll see next spring. But that may be part of it, that

00:53:32 ◼   ► this was so ambitious that it took more out of the Mac prioritization queue than perhaps

00:53:41 ◼   ► they intended or it slowed something else down. But it totally shows they care. Now,

00:53:46 ◼   ► you could argue it's like, well, it's just the MacBook Pro, it's not on any other systems,

00:53:49 ◼   ► it's not even on all the MacBook Pros. That's true, two-thirds of the Mac's Apple cells

00:53:53 ◼   ► are laptops, though. So you could see, I was having this conversation on Twitter earlier

00:53:56 ◼   ► today. You can see like this will motive-- app developers will be motivated. Mac app

00:54:01 ◼   ► developers will be motivated to support the touch bar because if Apple sticks

00:54:04 ◼   ► with this touch bar thing it will eventually be on all their laptops and

00:54:07 ◼   ► maybe on external keyboards at some point too, but even if it's just on

00:54:12 ◼   ► laptops that's two-thirds of the Macs and that means that if it's not available

00:54:16 ◼   ► on a majority of Macs at some point it will be probably pretty close. That's a

00:54:20 ◼   ► few years out but I also throw in there that if you're a Mac developer you're

00:54:25 ◼   ► looking, you know, you're hungry, I would think, for original foundational features

00:54:32 ◼   ► of Mac OS because there aren't, you know, they don't do that many of them, right?

00:54:38 ◼   ► It tends not to be-- Mac is much more sleepy now, and this is a big one, so I think

00:54:42 ◼   ► developers are going to be excited, and I think it's going to be something

00:54:46 ◼   ► that is fairly widely used eventually just because the laptop is the,

00:54:54 ◼   ► you know, the definitive Mac, if there is one, is a laptop, because for a long time

00:54:59 ◼   ► they've sold way more laptops than they have desktops.

00:55:02 ◼   ► Last question for you. If somebody bought the MacBook escape, the MacBook with the function

00:55:09 ◼   ► row, the hard function row, the actual keys there, should they regret this decision? So

00:55:15 ◼   ► that's a tough question, because, you know, like it's, you know…

00:55:19 ◼   ► That's a personal regret. I would say, you know, a big part of it is that it's, um,

00:55:24 ◼   ► it is price, right? This is a, this is a much more expensive. These, the 13 and the 15,

00:55:30 ◼   ► they're much more expensive.

00:55:31 ◼   ► Well, maybe a better question is, is the extra price worth these two features? The touch,

00:55:35 ◼   ► touch strip, the control center. Oh my word. What is it called? Touch bar, touch bar. I'm

00:55:41 ◼   ► being serious. I wasn't, I wasn't like, I just remember the name.

00:55:44 ◼   ► See, this is where the names fit. Touch bar and touch ID.

00:55:47 ◼   ► Mm-hmm. Control ID, you mean, right?

00:55:49 ◼   ► Yes. ID strip.

00:55:51 ◼   ► Finger control.

00:55:53 ◼   ► Are they worth the extra money?

00:55:55 ◼   ► Like, the extra, what is it, like maybe a thousand dollars or something?

00:55:58 ◼   ► Well, it's, so,

00:56:00 ◼   ► it's more than, I mean, this is how they get you, right?

00:56:03 ◼   ► It's more than just the touch bar.

00:56:06 ◼   ► So, it's also, like, the 13

00:56:11 ◼   ► escape has a 2 GHz i5.

00:56:15 ◼   ► the 13 Touch Bar base model has a 2.9 GHz i5. So it's not just the Touch Bar and Touch

00:56:28 ◼   ► ID, it's also faster. And that's $300 different. Yes, I said $1000, I just threw that out there,

00:56:35 ◼   ► it's $300. Yeah, if you go up to the $15 from the $13, it's a big difference, but it's a $300

00:56:40 ◼   ► different. So, you know, I think what I'd say is Apple rarely charges less than

00:56:45 ◼   ► $200 for a small, even a small processor bump when you do a bill to order. And the

00:56:53 ◼   ► the bump between the escape version and the touch bar version, of $300 you get a

00:57:02 ◼   ► much faster processor and the touch bar. You get two more ports. So I would

00:57:10 ◼   ► say the reason you get the non-touch bar MacBook Pro is either that you really love physical

00:57:19 ◼   ► function keys or you absolutely can't justify an extra $300. The price is just, you have

00:57:27 ◼   ► a very limited budget and getting to $1499 was hard enough and you don't want to go further

00:57:34 ◼   ► up. So if you have the extra cash, if you have the ability to spend that extra money,

00:57:40 ◼   ► should. I gotta say, I mean, everybody can decide for themselves, but for $300 more,

00:57:45 ◼   ► you get the faster processor and the touch bar and touch ID. If you, I don't think, I

00:57:50 ◼   ► mean, like I said, Apple puts specs, build to order specs for a faster processor and

00:57:55 ◼   ► it's $200 to $250 when they do it, usually. It's a big change, and this is from a 2 GHz

00:58:01 ◼   ► to a 2.9 GHz i5. It's a big step up. So, in the end, these are expensive computers. If

00:58:10 ◼   ► want more than 256 SSD you're going to pay through the nose for that. If you want

00:58:13 ◼   ► more than 8 gigs of RAM you're going to pay through the nose. So it's neither of

00:58:16 ◼   ► these systems is going to be $1499 or $1799, right, if you want to spec them up.

00:58:21 ◼   ► And so that's part of your judgment too. But I think the $300

00:58:25 ◼   ► difference for the 2x reports, the TouchBar and TouchID, and the faster

00:58:31 ◼   ► processor, that's a pretty reasonable dollar difference for what you get.

00:58:37 ◼   ► I don't think that the base model Touch Bar 13 is unreasonably priced over the Escape.

00:58:48 ◼   ► I think that's a reasonable price. Now that may not be enough. Like I said, there are

00:58:52 ◼   ► plenty of reasons why it might not be enough. But I look at the difference between those

00:58:56 ◼   ► two systems and think, "Wow, only $300 for all of that extra stuff? That's not bad."

00:59:02 ◼   ► That could be if you would ask me to pick a number out for just the Touch Bar and Touch

00:59:06 ◼   ► ID with the specs all being the same I might say $300 that Apple would do but you also

00:59:11 ◼   ► get the processor boost.

00:59:13 ◼   ► There you go. This episode is brought to you by FreshBooks. So you're racing against the

00:59:19 ◼   ► clock to wrap up free projects, you're getting ready to prep for a client meeting later in

00:59:23 ◼   ► the afternoon, you're dreaming of your touch bar all whilst trying to tackle a mountain

00:59:28 ◼   ► of paperwork. This is life as a freelancer ladies and gentlemen. This life can be rewarding

00:59:34 ◼   ► But it can also be very challenging as well. And our friends at FreshBooks believe the

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00:59:55 ◼   ► and I was levying this to Casey a couple of days ago after the discussion on ATP where

01:00:01 ◼   ► they were talking about millennials and I was very frustrated about that. Because I

01:00:04 ◼   ► believe that the, you know, many of the things that people think about millennials that they

01:00:08 ◼   ► don't want regular jobs, I believe a lot of that comes from the fact that we are the internet

01:00:13 ◼   ► generation and there are now more opportunities than ever could have existed before. I consider

01:00:19 ◼   ► myself a millennial and I work on the internet for a living. And the reason I do that is

01:00:24 ◼   ► because I wanted to live that life. I wanted to live the life of having the job that I

01:00:29 ◼   ► wanted. Anywho, that's a real tangent to say that

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01:02:01 ◼   ► it's unrestricted use so you can go and try it out for yourself. Just go to freshbooks.com/upgrade,

01:02:07 ◼   ► enter the code upgrade in the how you heard about us section so type in upgrade where it says how

01:02:12 ◼   ► did you hear about us so they know that you came to them from this show. Thank you so much to

01:02:17 ◼   ► refresh books for their support of upgrade and relay FM. I was not expecting to take

01:02:22 ◼   ► that little rant in the middle of the spot there but I did and if you have skipped the

01:02:26 ◼   ► ad you should now go back and listen to it because I had some stuff to say. Plus you

01:02:31 ◼   ► should always listen to the ads anyway. Let's talk about mobile recording gear again. I

01:02:39 ◼   ► But like it's all we talk about this these days because if anybody keeping score I just

01:02:47 ◼   ► bought a house like I actually own it now. If you're keeping score with like kind of

01:02:52 ◼   ► like where I am across this process across the various shows we own the home we have

01:02:57 ◼   ► the keys it's ours and we have a lot of contractors visiting I'm actually going there tonight

01:03:03 ◼   ► because I have a plumber coming at 8 a.m. tomorrow morning.

01:03:06 ◼   ► Is that going to be your first night sleeping there?

01:03:10 ◼   ► If we sleep there, we may actually stay in a hotel which is across the street. The place

01:03:13 ◼   ► is not completely ready yet. Mainly with plumbing being one of the things that we need taking

01:03:20 ◼   ► care of.

01:03:21 ◼   ► Sure. That's the plumber.

01:03:23 ◼   ► Once the plumber's been tomorrow and hopefully got everything done as we need it, then yes,

01:03:28 ◼   ► we can start staying there. So because of this, because we have multiple contractors

01:03:36 ◼   ► coming multiple times for many different things, I am going to have to record some shows from

01:03:41 ◼   ► this empty apartment. So I need gear that can help me with that, and I have amassed

01:03:49 ◼   ► a list of items. So I just want to run through this list of items with you, Jason.

01:03:54 ◼   ► But before you do that, let me ask you some other things. So you live in East London.

01:04:02 ◼   ► I live just east of London. East of London.

01:04:04 ◼   ► So technically. I'm just outside of what is considered the London border in the O'Toole

01:04:10 ◼   ► East.

01:04:11 ◼   ► Is it, would it be Essex? Is that what we would call it?

01:04:13 ◼   ► Technically classed as Essex, yes.

01:04:15 ◼   ► Okay. But you're moving to South London.

01:04:17 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:04:18 ◼   ► But not south of London.

01:04:19 ◼   ► No, this is considered South London.

01:04:22 ◼   ► be properly in South London. How long, so you're shuttling back and forth a lot. How

01:04:26 ◼   ► long is that? Currently, it depends on my mode of transport, like from place to place.

01:04:32 ◼   ► It would take me about 90 minutes to get there via public transport and about 35 to 40 if

01:04:38 ◼   ► I was to take an Uber or something. Oh, okay. I'm kind of splitting that depending on what

01:04:42 ◼   ► I'm going there for and when. So like, because we will be leaving here very late this evening,

01:04:47 ◼   ► we'll take an Uber, if I'm just traveling in the daytime, it's like a train, if I've

01:04:50 ◼   ► got a bunch of boxes with me, then maybe I'll take you with that kind of thing.

01:04:53 ◼   ► So it's…

01:04:54 ◼   ► All right, yeah, because I'm just trying to imagine moving that distance and not having

01:04:59 ◼   ► a car is going to be a challenge.

01:05:03 ◼   ► Yep, yep, but hopefully it won't be very long.

01:05:07 ◼   ► A couple of weeks, maybe.

01:05:09 ◼   ► Yeah, okay.

01:05:10 ◼   ► Okay, so you're gonna take in an Uber or in your backpack or something, your packing

01:05:15 ◼   ► list of "Myke records podcasts in an empty house."

01:05:19 ◼   ► Yeah, some of this stuff is gonna stay there after I take it there today

01:05:23 ◼   ► But some stuff I'll be bringing backwards and forwards

01:05:26 ◼   ► So this list currently consists of the map of adorable which I have kept

01:05:31 ◼   ► I have now adorn right stickers. It is part of the car. That's that's it. It's in the it's in the

01:05:36 ◼   ► It's forever yours, yep, I'm in the collection it's in the collection

01:05:43 ◼   ► I've been actually editing a show on it today like a heavy edit of a show

01:05:48 ◼   ► and it's been absolutely fine.

01:05:52 ◼   ► Now I know the parts where it will cause struggles

01:05:55 ◼   ► is doing things like bouncing the show,

01:05:57 ◼   ► so like exporting it out.

01:05:58 ◼   ► But to be honest, I don't care about that

01:06:00 ◼   ► because I know it's gonna do that,

01:06:02 ◼   ► I know it's gonna take longer,

01:06:04 ◼   ► I'll just let it do its thing and I'll do something else.

01:06:06 ◼   ► But all I care about is can I perform the actual tasks

01:06:11 ◼   ► to my usual abilities?

01:06:14 ◼   ► And it so far seems like yes I can.

01:06:18 ◼   ► I have, it seems funny, and it's very easy to get jaded about like having a big 5K iMac

01:06:25 ◼   ► or something like that, but I have edited hundreds of podcasts on an 11-inch MacBook

01:06:31 ◼   ► Air.

01:06:32 ◼   ► Like I've got the mid-2013 MacBook Air right now.

01:06:36 ◼   ► I have edited so many podcasts on this thing, and it's not, it's an 11-inch MacBook Air,

01:06:41 ◼   ► right?

01:06:42 ◼   ► And it's fine.

01:06:43 ◼   ► So, and that MacBook is quite similar.

01:06:47 ◼   ► I think in all respects other than the beautiful screen to this particular MacBook Air that

01:06:53 ◼   ► I've got. So it's a totally suitable system for editing audio.

01:06:57 ◼   ► It's quite possibly the greatest form factor of any Mac that I've ever used. The lightness

01:07:02 ◼   ► and thinness of that thing is just incredible. It's incredible. It's incredible. I like am

01:07:11 ◼   ► in love with the form factor. It's perfect, I think. Like the 11 inch MacBook was great.

01:07:18 ◼   ► I mean I had one of those. I used one of those for many years and it was great for that reason.

01:07:22 ◼   ► This thing blows that away from a form factor perspective.

01:07:25 ◼   ► It's the spiritual successor. It fills that same slot but it's a beautiful system. Yeah,

01:07:33 ◼   ► it is. I don't love the keyboard.

01:07:35 ◼   ► However, that trackpad, that's why I have the problems with the trackpad. The Magic

01:07:39 ◼   ► trackpad or whatever it's called on any of the laptops again I think has a

01:07:43 ◼   ► different name on the laptops I hate I hate it I hate it so much I I love my

01:07:49 ◼   ► standalone one perfect you would never even know on any of the laptops I cannot

01:07:54 ◼   ► stand it it feels terrible it feels terrible especially on the the really

01:08:00 ◼   ► thin one right like the MacBook I just it just feels terrible to me it just

01:08:04 ◼   ► doesn't feel like it's clicking at all. I don't like it.

01:08:08 ◼   ► Do you get missed clicks?

01:08:11 ◼   ► Yeah, I do. I've always had that problem. Steven has the

01:08:15 ◼   ► had the first one, the first MacBook Pro that had the

01:08:19 ◼   ► trackpad in it, and it would miss my clicks constantly.

01:08:23 ◼   ► I've had that on the Touch Bar MacBook Pro too. I'd never experienced it

01:08:27 ◼   ► before, but it misses, like,

01:08:29 ◼   ► and it seems random, and I thought it was originally like my shirt was pressing

01:08:32 ◼   ► into it or something like that, but no,

01:08:34 ◼   ► It just sometimes every 10th or 15th click,

01:08:38 ◼   ► just one of the clicks doesn't click

01:08:39 ◼   ► and you gotta take your finger off and put it back down

01:08:41 ◼   ► and then it clicks again.

01:08:42 ◼   ► And I've never experienced that on my magic trackpad

01:08:46 ◼   ► on my desk.

01:08:47 ◼   ► Never. - No, I never had

01:08:47 ◼   ► that problem either, but I have it constantly,

01:08:50 ◼   ► I have just loads of problems, I just don't like it.

01:08:51 ◼   ► Anywho, let's go back to the list.

01:08:53 ◼   ► - Yeah, MacBook durable.

01:08:54 ◼   ► - The MacBook charger.

01:08:56 ◼   ► I have an Anker USB-C hub.

01:08:59 ◼   ► So it has power pass through from USB-C to USB-C

01:09:04 ◼   ► and four USB ports.

01:09:06 ◼   ► - Good, 'cause you know you need to have power

01:09:09 ◼   ► and have a microphone to record a podcast.

01:09:12 ◼   ► - I have, I'm gonna be taking the Apple USB-C to a dongle

01:09:16 ◼   ► just in case something doesn't work with the one that I have.

01:09:20 ◼   ► - Okay.

01:09:21 ◼   ► - A microphone, I'm gonna be taking a sure,

01:09:24 ◼   ► what is the one that I have,

01:09:25 ◼   ► this is the one you have, is the one you take with you.

01:09:29 ◼   ► The beta-- - Oh, the beta 58a?

01:09:31 ◼   ► - Yeah, so it's the nice one, not the really expensive one.

01:09:34 ◼   ► - Right. - Let's take one of those.

01:09:35 ◼   ► - It's the Jason one, not the Marco one.

01:09:37 ◼   ► - The Jason one.

01:09:38 ◼   ► An XLR cable, a microphone stand.

01:09:41 ◼   ► The apartment is completely empty,

01:09:43 ◼   ► so I have bought a foam microphone shield

01:09:47 ◼   ► in the hopes that it will somehow maybe possibly help

01:09:50 ◼   ► with some of the inevitable echo.

01:09:53 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:09:53 ◼   ► - So it's just like this little foam surround.

01:09:55 ◼   ► It might help, it might not, but it's all I can do.

01:09:59 ◼   ► I'm taking my EE mobile Wi-Fi LTE thing,

01:10:03 ◼   ► 'cause we don't have internet in the place yet.

01:10:05 ◼   ► - Which is fine, 'cause you essentially

01:10:06 ◼   ► don't have internet now, so that's no change.

01:10:09 ◼   ► - I have a new problem in that cell connection

01:10:12 ◼   ► is not very good in the new place.

01:10:13 ◼   ► - Oh no.

01:10:14 ◼   ► (laughing)

01:10:15 ◼   ► - I just can't escape it.

01:10:17 ◼   ► So this won't be a problem when we get broadband,

01:10:20 ◼   ► 'cause we're getting fiber, but right now we don't have it.

01:10:23 ◼   ► So we'll see what happens over the next couple of days,

01:10:25 ◼   ► who knows?

01:10:26 ◼   ► I'm taking a Tascam USB audio interface

01:10:29 ◼   ► to plug my microphone into and then to plug that into the Mac Pro.

01:10:33 ◼   ► And also an iPad Pro so I can actually get some real work done while I'm there.

01:10:37 ◼   ► Boom.

01:10:38 ◼   ► Zing.

01:10:39 ◼   ► Uh, yeah.

01:10:40 ◼   ► So I could do this with less stuff.

01:10:44 ◼   ► You could.

01:10:45 ◼   ► I could remove the Mac completely from this.

01:10:48 ◼   ► But I want to try and maintain as much audio quality as possible because it's not going

01:10:54 ◼   ► to sound as good as normal.

01:10:56 ◼   ► I know that because I don't think for me that microphone sounds as good even though it sounds

01:11:00 ◼   ► fine but you know for me it doesn't sound as good.

01:11:03 ◼   ► And there's going to be echo which I will be able to get rid of some of but not all

01:11:07 ◼   ► because that's just the nature of echo.

01:11:10 ◼   ► But I want to try and minimize the effect on the listener as much as possible.

01:11:14 ◼   ► They don't need to go through this with me, right?

01:11:17 ◼   ► So I want to try and minimize that as much as possible whilst I'm doing this over the

01:11:22 ◼   ► the next couple of weeks I think it's gonna be,

01:11:26 ◼   ► where I'm actually gonna be shuttling back and forth.

01:11:29 ◼   ► So we'll say I have no idea if and how

01:11:32 ◼   ► it's even gonna work, right?

01:11:33 ◼   ► Like I have no idea, right?

01:11:35 ◼   ► This wifi thing might just crap out on me completely

01:11:38 ◼   ► and then I can't do it and then I'll have to go to plan B,

01:11:41 ◼   ► which I don't have.

01:11:42 ◼   ► I have no idea how it's gonna sound.

01:11:45 ◼   ► I don't even know where I'm gonna sit, Jason.

01:11:47 ◼   ► I don't really have any furniture in that place.

01:11:51 ◼   ► - Yeah, there's probably a counter in the kitchen

01:11:53 ◼   ► or something you could use.

01:11:54 ◼   ► - I could do that, however, that will cause

01:11:56 ◼   ► the most echo possible because the kitchen,

01:11:59 ◼   ► so I will probably be recording in what will be mega office

01:12:03 ◼   ► because it's the smallest room.

01:12:06 ◼   ► - Right, you're gonna be laying down on the floor?

01:12:09 ◼   ► - Well, I have a table and chairs.

01:12:11 ◼   ► - Okay, good.

01:12:12 ◼   ► - But I don't think I can get the table out of the door

01:12:15 ◼   ► in the living room to get it into the office

01:12:18 ◼   ► 'cause it's too big.

01:12:20 ◼   ► Um, and I have an inflatable mattress.

01:12:23 ◼   ► We need MacGyver to come and solve your problems with, well, let's see, what are our assets?

01:12:30 ◼   ► We've got a table, we've got some chairs, we've got an inflatable mattress, oh well,

01:12:33 ◼   ► I can build a podcast studio for you.

01:12:34 ◼   ► What I, so I thought, what would probably end up happening is I will be bringing the

01:12:39 ◼   ► chair from the table and chairs into the office.

01:12:45 ◼   ► Uh huh, you'll put the, you'll put your microphone shield on that.

01:12:48 ◼   ► Yep.

01:12:49 ◼   ► - And then sit on the floor. - And then sit on the floor

01:12:50 ◼   ► as well.

01:12:51 ◼   ► And then so I will sit on the chair.

01:12:54 ◼   ► - Microphone stand, okay.

01:12:55 ◼   ► - I bought a microphone stand for this as well.

01:12:57 ◼   ► So I'll put, and then I have it all in front of me.

01:13:00 ◼   ► There is also the possibility of sitting in a closet,

01:13:03 ◼   ► but I don't know if I want to do that.

01:13:05 ◼   ► Actually, no, I can't do that

01:13:06 ◼   ► because the only closet I could fit in

01:13:08 ◼   ► doesn't have a light in it.

01:13:09 ◼   ► And I'm not gonna sit in the dark.

01:13:11 ◼   ► So this is my life, ladies and gentlemen,

01:13:15 ◼   ► for the next couple of weeks.

01:13:17 ◼   ► And I just wanna clue you all in on it

01:13:18 ◼   ► so you know what to expect.

01:13:20 ◼   ► - That's exciting.

01:13:21 ◼   ► - I actually don't think there will be an up,

01:13:23 ◼   ► I have no plans to record an upgrade from there,

01:13:25 ◼   ► but as it stands currently,

01:13:27 ◼   ► I will be recording "Connected", "The Panadict", "Quartex",

01:13:32 ◼   ► and maybe something I haven't mentioned to you yet,

01:13:36 ◼   ► a standalone mic at the movies episode,

01:13:38 ◼   ► which is not including you.

01:13:39 ◼   ► - Ooh.

01:13:40 ◼   ► - I may also be recording from there this week.

01:13:42 ◼   ► - So many movies for mic.

01:13:44 ◼   ► - Yep, lost all the great movies.

01:13:46 ◼   ► Maybe there'll be some next week and then upgrade will be included, but hopefully I

01:13:51 ◼   ► will only need to be there this week.

01:13:54 ◼   ► We should hopefully have the majority of this work done this week, which would be amazing.

01:14:03 ◼   ► But then I'll have Mega Office and then we'll be able to talk about all of the great things

01:14:07 ◼   ► that I'm putting in there because I have grand plans, Jason.

01:14:10 ◼   ► Grand plans.

01:14:11 ◼   ► That's good. It's all part of our process, but the transitional stuff is hard. I remember that. When we moved to...

01:14:19 ◼   ► The distance doesn't help either. That's the thing that's why I asked about that. When we moved to this county from the county we previously lived in, that was a challenge because that was a long way to go.

01:14:31 ◼   ► go so we couldn't just pop over you know moving in a town moving a couple miles

01:14:37 ◼   ► away you can just keep popping back and forth and you have a big move but you

01:14:41 ◼   ► can also have the little stuff here and there and when it was when it was

01:14:45 ◼   ► distant it was very difficult because we could only do that a few times and yep

01:14:50 ◼   ► yeah so yeah like I'm popping back and forth but my pops are very large it's a

01:14:55 ◼   ► big pop it's a bit of pop because I don't really want to stay there on my own

01:15:01 ◼   ► I just don't really want, there are no comforts

01:15:04 ◼   ► in this place at all right now.

01:15:07 ◼   ► So I'm planning on traveling backwards and forwards

01:15:11 ◼   ► every day with the exception of like tomorrow

01:15:15 ◼   ► because we're gonna be staying locally

01:15:17 ◼   ► because I really don't wanna wake up at half past five

01:15:19 ◼   ► in the morning to start this process.

01:15:22 ◼   ► So there you go, this is it.

01:15:25 ◼   ► So we should probably wrap up today with some Ask Upgrade.

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01:15:32 ◼   ► the company focused on sleep that put their brightest minds

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01:15:43 ◼   ► inflated prices that you may see from showrooms.

01:15:47 ◼   ► Casper keeps all of the savings

01:15:49 ◼   ► by eliminating the showroom process,

01:15:52 ◼   ► and gives that to you, so they keep their costs down.

01:15:55 ◼   ► And this mattress, it's award-winning.

01:15:57 ◼   ► It isn't just some fly-by-night mattress.

01:15:59 ◼   ► This was developed in house by Casper's team as a sleek design.

01:16:02 ◼   ► It's delivered an impossibly small box.

01:16:05 ◼   ► It combines springy latex foam supportive memory foam that creates the mattress

01:16:10 ◼   ► that creates gives you just the right sink and just the right bounce as you

01:16:15 ◼   ► know, and it has that breathable design to help you regulate your temperature

01:16:20 ◼   ► throughout the night.

01:16:21 ◼   ► It is obsessively engineered at a shockingly fair price.

01:16:27 ◼   ► For example, you can get a Casper mattress from $500 for a twin size,

01:16:32 ◼   ► six for a twin size, yes for a 600 for a twin XL,

01:16:36 ◼   ► 750 for a full size, 850 for queen and 950 for a king.

01:16:40 ◼   ► To put this in comparison, mattresses that you're used to buying

01:16:43 ◼   ► in showrooms could cost you well over $1500,

01:16:48 ◼   ► which is more expensive than any of Casper's offering and all of their

01:16:52 ◼   ► mattresses are made in America. So the Casper mattress team don't just make mattresses,

01:16:59 ◼   ► Casper also now makes an adaptive pillow and soft breathable sheets as well.

01:17:05 ◼   ► Buying a Casper mattress is completely risk free. They offer free delivery and free returns

01:17:10 ◼   ► to the US and Canada with a 100 night home trial. If you don't love it they will pick

01:17:15 ◼   ► it up and refund you everything. Casper understands the importance of truly sleeping on a mattress

01:17:20 ◼   ► before you commit especially considering you're going to spend a third of your life on it.

01:17:25 ◼   ► You can get $50 towards any mattress purchase by visiting casper.com/upgrade and using the

01:17:31 ◼   ► code upgrade. Terms and conditions apply. Thank you so much to Casper for their support

01:17:36 ◼   ► of this show and Relay FM.

01:17:39 ◼   ► Casper Mattresses thank you. Oh look at that. Classic upgrade. Can I use a MacBook Pro charger

01:17:49 ◼   ► with a USB-C to lightning cable to fast charge my iPad Pro, or would that be too much power?"

01:17:55 ◼   ► asks Lucas.

01:17:56 ◼   ► I think it's fine because I think your iPad Pro will just take the power that it requires.

01:18:04 ◼   ► Yeah, I, somebody was explaining this to me recently and I may be misremembering it, but

01:18:10 ◼   ► it's good to go down, bad to go up, is my understanding. So like if you have a brick

01:18:16 ◼   ► for a more powerful machine, you can use it on a less powerful machine, but you shouldn't

01:18:20 ◼   ► go the other way. That's my understanding.

01:18:23 ◼   ► Right, right, because it's going to take, I mean that's the example of it's going to

01:18:26 ◼   ► take forever to charge anything or you're going to lose, even though you're plugged

01:18:30 ◼   ► in, you're going to lose battery because it's not getting enough.

01:18:34 ◼   ► Because it's trying to push more power than it can.

01:18:37 ◼   ► I don't know how electricity works, but just to remind everybody too, it's only the large

01:18:43 ◼   ► iPad Pro that's got the fast USB 3 charging so that's the one where it will

01:18:50 ◼   ► benefit from one of the those macbook USB C cables or charging bricks if you

01:18:55 ◼   ► use the USB C to lightning cable. One of the nice things about all these systems

01:18:59 ◼   ► by the way that doesn't get talked about enough I think is that if you have a

01:19:04 ◼   ► USB C computer and you get that lightning to USB C cable you only have

01:19:10 ◼   ► to take one power brick with you and you can use it to charge either your computer or your

01:19:15 ◼   ► iPad which is or your iPhone frankly which is pretty cool because it used to be with

01:19:19 ◼   ► MagSafe that you know the Mac charger only ever charged the Mac and it couldn't be put

01:19:24 ◼   ► to other uses.

01:19:26 ◼   ► Yep, in that vein Rajeev asked do you think Apple will keep the lightning port on iOS

01:19:30 ◼   ► devices but add USB type C to the AC adapter end? I think next iPhone will come with a

01:19:37 ◼   ► USB C brick.

01:19:39 ◼   ► break. Yeah, I think you're probably right. They make the cable now, they make the bricks.

01:19:46 ◼   ► I think the next iPhone will come with that for sure. I think maybe the iPad even will,

01:19:52 ◼   ► but we'll see. Yeah. You know, like the iPad Pro, if you can ship that with the USB-C,

01:19:56 ◼   ► so it's going to be a better charger. It's a fast charger. For the large iPad Pro. I

01:20:01 ◼   ► think that we may see that now roll out for all of the future iOS products from this period

01:20:06 ◼   ► on. And the argument is always like, but wait a second, there's so many computers out there

01:20:10 ◼   ► that don't have USB-C. Apple doesn't think that most people need to connect their iOS

01:20:16 ◼   ► device to a computer at all, right? This is one of those Apple opinionated things where

01:20:20 ◼   ► Apple has decided just because some people do it doesn't mean that we need to make all

01:20:25 ◼   ► our decisions based on those people. And they've made a lot of effort to make it so you don't

01:20:31 ◼   ► need to connect via a wire your iOS device to a PC or a Mac.

01:20:36 ◼   ► That's like there's so many things that they've tried to make that not something

01:20:39 ◼   ► you need to do.

01:20:41 ◼   ► So as long as they've got a cable for you to charge and if you absolutely need it then

01:20:46 ◼   ► they you know then get an adapter but I do think that that's what they're going to

01:20:51 ◼   ► do.

01:20:52 ◼   ► I actually don't think there's any reason anymore that you need to do it.

01:20:55 ◼   ► I think because now I think it's for esoteric reasons.

01:20:59 ◼   ► for esoteric reasons like sideloading files or whatever but they're all techy reasons

01:21:03 ◼   ► that most people who are getting a brand new iPhone don't need to do and Apple would say

01:21:09 ◼   ► that they're edge cases and everybody who's an edge case is going to be like "oh no!"

01:21:13 ◼   ► but really this is what Apple's been pushing everybody toward with these products.

01:21:15 ◼   ► Even with the file sideloading, there's a ways to do that. You should drop off. Do you

01:21:19 ◼   ► mean that I don't think that there's any reason anymore because if memory serves that now

01:21:25 ◼   ► iCloud backups are encrypted so...

01:21:28 ◼   ► Other than the, you know, the old "my phone doesn't work, I need to plug it in and restore

01:21:33 ◼   ► it," but that's it.

01:21:34 ◼   ► Yeah, take it to the Apple Store.

01:21:36 ◼   ► Oh.

01:21:37 ◼   ► I mean, that's, again, there are reasons, there are arguments against it, but I think

01:21:42 ◼   ► that Apple, I think the difference between Apple and the perception of Apple oftentimes

01:21:47 ◼   ► is we all go, "but look over there, there are these people who need this thing, and

01:21:56 ◼   ► like four percent of your user base and

01:21:57 ◼   ► Apple looks at it and goes "yeah it's just four

01:21:59 ◼   ► percent of our user base we're not gonna

01:22:00 ◼   ► we're not going to cater to them and

01:22:02 ◼   ► make our product less good" and those

01:22:04 ◼   ► people will get adapters and they'll

01:22:05 ◼   ► deal with it and they won't say

01:22:07 ◼   ► it that way but that's kind of the

01:22:09 ◼   ► approach they take is at some point if

01:22:11 ◼   ► you if you're Microsoft with Windows

01:22:13 ◼   ► back in the day you let the edge cases

01:22:17 ◼   ► dictate your product because they were

01:22:20 ◼   ► all you know "oh we ought to be compatible

01:22:22 ◼   ► with everything" and Apple's never been

01:22:24 ◼   ► like that. Apple's always like "yeah you

01:22:26 ◼   ► know most people don't need it now and if you need it there's an adapter and so

01:22:29 ◼   ► we're gonna pull pull the lever and I think 2017 is the year where USB a type

01:22:38 ◼   ► connectors are ushered out of the Apple product line I agree all of it Johnny

01:22:46 ◼   ► just got a new 5k iMac and wants to know if he can connect to the 5k LG monitor

01:22:52 ◼   ► to it. Johnny, you cannot. The system requirements require Mac OS Sierra 10.12.1 or later and

01:23:03 ◼   ► a Thunderbolt 3 enabled Mac of which there is one?

01:23:10 ◼   ► Of the MacBook Pro.

01:23:13 ◼   ► So no, maybe person in the future will be able to but Johnny unless you buy another

01:23:20 ◼   ► iMac probably in spring as we believe it will come out then then yes probably you will be

01:23:24 ◼   ► able to but no you will not and not even with a dongle even if you take a long excursion

01:23:31 ◼   ► to dongle town you will not be able to pick up anything that will help you with this i'm

01:23:36 ◼   ► afraid that's where you're moving isn't it mike you're moving to dongle town wow looking

01:23:42 ◼   ► at my packing list yes i am uh gabriel would like to know uh would it help if apple put

01:23:49 ◼   ► a MagSafe-like connector on the other end of the USB-C cable, the adapter side. We were

01:23:54 ◼   ► talking about the fact that we were unhappy that MagSafe was going away. I mean, yes,

01:24:00 ◼   ► if they could do it, it would be great, but they haven't, and I assume there's a reason.

01:24:06 ◼   ► Yeah, and it's a USB-C standard cable, so you would need to create like a breakaway

01:24:12 ◼   ► in there somewhere, and that's going to increase the cost, and it's going to increase

01:24:17 ◼   ► the bulk and the complexity of manufacturing it. And I feel like, I mean, not to go back

01:24:23 ◼   ► to it, but I feel like this is one of those levels where, again, Apple just said, "USBC

01:24:28 ◼   ► is more, um, more of a benefit than MagSafe. So we're just going to do USBC." And the nice

01:24:35 ◼   ► thing about USBC is it's a standard. So if somebody wants to make a breakaway cable,

01:24:40 ◼   ► they can do it. Apple can't stop them. It's not like the days of MagSafe where like, if

01:24:44 ◼   ► weren't an officially licensed MagSafe accessory manufacturer, you couldn't tie

01:24:49 ◼   ► into charging a Mac on a plane from a battery. You couldn't do it because you

01:24:55 ◼   ► had to go all the way back to the plug. And now USB-C is a standard, so if

01:25:01 ◼   ► somebody wants to invent clever ways to bring kind of breakaway tech to USB-C

01:25:09 ◼   ► charging, they can do it. Apple doesn't have to do it anymore, and I don't think

01:25:13 ◼   ► Apple will but maybe somebody else will try. And finally today Brando asks is

01:25:18 ◼   ► there any more word on Xcode for the iPad in latest in light of the latest Mac

01:25:23 ◼   ► news the iPad seemed like a more and more appealing development option at

01:25:28 ◼   ► least for me any any conversations I'd seen or word about this was all leading

01:25:34 ◼   ► up to playgrounds, Swift playgrounds since then nothing. Yeah well Swift

01:25:41 ◼   ► playgrounds is step one. Yeah, I think it will happen and I think Swift Playgrounds is the

01:25:46 ◼   ► indication that it will happen, but I don't think we're going to see it at WWDC.

01:25:52 ◼   ► You know, it's possible, but yeah, I tend to agree with you that I feel like,

01:26:01 ◼   ► are they going to have Xcode, even if it's a very specific kind of Xcode for

01:26:09 ◼   ► for iOS in 2017, because presumably they would unveil it at WWDC, right? I don't know, I

01:26:17 ◼   ► wouldn't put money on it. I do think it's inevitable, but...

01:26:20 ◼   ► I think we might see more from Swift Playgrounds at WWDC 2017, like it will be able to do more,

01:26:27 ◼   ► but I don't think they're going to unveil Xcode for the iPad. I think we need to be

01:26:33 ◼   ► further down the Swift road before that happens, because it... I just assume it will be Swift

01:26:39 ◼   ► only. So yeah. There you go. Alright that wraps up this week's episode of upgrade if

01:26:48 ◼   ► you'd like to find our show notes you can head on over to relay.fm/upgrade/115 if you

01:26:54 ◼   ► want to find Jason online he is @jsnell on the twitter and he is at sixcolors.com I am

01:27:02 ◼   ► @imike thanks again to our lovely sponsors for this week's episode the fine folk over

01:27:09 ◼   ► at Casper, Freshbooks and Encapsula. As always thank you for listening we'll be

01:27:15 ◼   ► back next week until then say goodbye Jason Snow.

01:27:19 ◼   ► Beep!

01:27:21 ◼   ► Oh no Jason just booted.

01:27:22 ◼   ► [Mimics Jason's booty]

01:27:24 ◼   ► No you got it wrong. You got it wrong.

01:27:26 ◼   ► It's not you.

01:27:27 ◼   ► Oh, oh. Okay.

01:27:29 ◼   ► [MUSIC PLAYING]

01:27:33 ◼   ► [ Music ]

01:27:40 ◼   ► [BLANK_AUDIO]