Upgrade

00:00:00 ◼   ► [Music]

00:00:08 ◼   ► From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 297.

00:00:12 ◼   ► Today's show is brought to you by PDFPEM from Smile, Pingdom, and DoorDash.

00:00:17 ◼   ► My name is Myke Curley. I am joined by the intrepid Jason Snow.

00:00:20 ◼   ► Hello, Jason Snow.

00:00:21 ◼   ► [Singing]

00:00:23 ◼   ► Intrepidly yours, Myke. Hi, how are you?

00:00:25 ◼   ► I am very well, my friend. Very well indeed. Big show.

00:00:28 ◼   ► Action packed, as they say today.

00:00:30 ◼   ► We start, as we always do, with a #snowtalk question.

00:00:34 ◼   ► This one comes in from Chris.

00:00:36 ◼   ► Chris wants to know, "Jason, while you're working in your office,

00:00:38 ◼   ► do you ever open the garage door for an open-air, Hawaiian, Linai-style vibe?"

00:00:44 ◼   ► Hmm.

00:00:45 ◼   ► This is very descriptive. I enjoyed this one, you know?

00:00:48 ◼   ► Yes. The answer is no. If I want to work outside, I go outside.

00:00:52 ◼   ► Right. Ah, yes. Don't bring the outside to you, Jason. Go to the outside.

00:00:56 ◼   ► Right, because I still have, like, a curtain and a giant set of metal shelving

00:01:01 ◼   ► between me and the outside, so it's not...

00:01:03 ◼   ► Even if I move the curtains and stuff, it's like, it's not super pleasant.

00:01:08 ◼   ► I have opened the garage door and worked before,

00:01:11 ◼   ► but it's mostly because it's intolerably hot.

00:01:14 ◼   ► If it gets intolerably hot in here and it is cooler outside, I will sometimes do that.

00:01:17 ◼   ► The problem is, when I do that, then there's bugs in my office

00:01:21 ◼   ► for some unknown amount of time.

00:01:24 ◼   ► And in the house, because then I'll open the door to the house,

00:01:27 ◼   ► and when I'm done, even after I've closed the garage door,

00:01:29 ◼   ► but the bugs will come in here and then they go in there,

00:01:31 ◼   ► and then there's, like, flies and stuff around.

00:01:33 ◼   ► As we know, bugs in your office can lead to repairs required.

00:01:38 ◼   ► Do you remember the spider?

00:01:39 ◼   ► The spiders are always with me.

00:01:41 ◼   ► The spiders. Oh, please don't.

00:01:43 ◼   ► But anyway, people don't remember, Jason wrote a great article once,

00:01:46 ◼   ► I'm sure we spoke about it on the show too,

00:01:48 ◼   ► when you had a spider stuck in your screen.

00:01:52 ◼   ► Yes. Tiny one, tiny one.

00:01:53 ◼   ► Yeah, I had to do an IMAX screen replacement.

00:01:56 ◼   ► No, the spiders, I mean, there are gonna always be spiders in my office,

00:01:59 ◼   ► but, like, flying bugs and stuff come in when the garage door is open.

00:02:04 ◼   ► It's no good.

00:02:05 ◼   ► So, no, I don't generally do that.

00:02:08 ◼   ► That's a good question, 'cause I do have, unlike many, most people,

00:02:12 ◼   ► my office place has a giant roll-up door to the outside world.

00:02:16 ◼   ► It's true.

00:02:17 ◼   ► But it's not that.

00:02:18 ◼   ► It's not as great as it sounds.

00:02:20 ◼   ► It's not as spectacularly fantastic as it sounds

00:02:25 ◼   ► to have a garage door in your office.

00:02:27 ◼   ► So I just go outside, sit in a chair.

00:02:29 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:02:30 ◼   ► We'll talk about those chairs a little bit later on in the episode.

00:02:33 ◼   ► Fun times.

00:02:34 ◼   ► If you would like to send in a question to start off the show,

00:02:37 ◼   ► just send out a tweet with the hashtag #snowtalk,

00:02:39 ◼   ► and it may be considered for a future episode.

00:02:42 ◼   ► I wanted to provide a little bit of follow-out,

00:02:44 ◼   ► more about Relay FM membership.

00:02:46 ◼   ► We've got a lot going on right now.

00:02:47 ◼   ► We published -- I don't like the phrase, like, "open letter,"

00:02:51 ◼   ► but I can't think of another phrase.

00:02:53 ◼   ► Like, basically, we wrote something that we want you to read about --

00:02:57 ◼   ► we're calling it Moving Forward here at Relay FM.

00:03:01 ◼   ► Basically, we spent a lot of time over the last month or so

00:03:04 ◼   ► thinking about our membership program,

00:03:06 ◼   ► because we are in a time where businesses need to adapt

00:03:10 ◼   ► their business models, and so we want to be able to do that.

00:03:13 ◼   ► And so one of the things that we're doing is doubling down

00:03:16 ◼   ► on our most important thing, which is our listeners.

00:03:18 ◼   ► Like, we are here, and Jason pointed this out

00:03:21 ◼   ► when we were talking about this with him while working on this letter, right?

00:03:24 ◼   ► Like, Relay FM is here because of you, the listener,

00:03:28 ◼   ► and the strong connection that we have with you.

00:03:31 ◼   ► So we want to continue to put more focus on providing

00:03:34 ◼   ► an even better experience for those of you who decide to support us directly.

00:03:38 ◼   ► Basically, if you not only decide to support us with your time,

00:03:41 ◼   ► but also your hard-earned money,

00:03:43 ◼   ► we want to be able to give you more for that.

00:03:47 ◼   ► And we're working on lots of really great ideas.

00:03:49 ◼   ► Like, I am actually very excited about this.

00:03:52 ◼   ► We started late today because me and Steven --

00:03:54 ◼   ► we have a call on Mondays, which I always have before recording Upgrade,

00:03:58 ◼   ► and we were late today because we were work --

00:04:00 ◼   ► I was late for Upgrade today because we were working on some great stuff.

00:04:03 ◼   ► And Steven, my co-founder, made the point

00:04:06 ◼   ► that we haven't worked as hard or as, like, frenzied right now

00:04:11 ◼   ► as we have since the beginning.

00:04:13 ◼   ► But it's great.

00:04:14 ◼   ► Like, I feel a renewed sense of excitement

00:04:17 ◼   ► for what Relay FM can be because of this.

00:04:20 ◼   ► Like, this doesn't have to be a bad thing because the world's changing around us.

00:04:24 ◼   ► Like, we're going to use this as a time to make everything better.

00:04:28 ◼   ► Like, that's the plan.

00:04:29 ◼   ► So the first step of our renewed membership focus

00:04:35 ◼   ► is we have created a Discord server for Relay FM members.

00:04:38 ◼   ► This is a private community where like-minded people can come together

00:04:41 ◼   ► in a safe, moderated environment to talk about the things that they love

00:04:45 ◼   ► and to make connections with other people like them.

00:04:47 ◼   ► So right now, we are streaming this show live, as we always do,

00:04:52 ◼   ► at 9 a.m. Pacific, noon Eastern, every Monday.

00:04:57 ◼   ► And we have a live chat.

00:04:59 ◼   ► And now the live chat is also occurring in the Discord.

00:05:02 ◼   ► And that's where I'm looking at it.

00:05:03 ◼   ► But there are lots of wonderful topics to talk about and hundreds --

00:05:07 ◼   ► we have nearly 1,000 people in there already.

00:05:10 ◼   ► So if you are a Relay FM member, you should have gotten an email about this.

00:05:15 ◼   ► So all existing Relay FM members, look out for an email,

00:05:19 ◼   ► or you can contact us if you need to.

00:05:21 ◼   ► But basically, everyone who is a member can get access to the Discord server.

00:05:26 ◼   ► If you become a member, you'll get an email about it when you sign up

00:05:29 ◼   ► so you can join.

00:05:31 ◼   ► Basically, we want to create something which is fun and moderated.

00:05:34 ◼   ► That's why we use Discord over Slack.

00:05:36 ◼   ► Slack has no moderation tools at all.

00:05:39 ◼   ► Right, because it's a workplace tool.

00:05:40 ◼   ► You're not supposed to mute or ban people in your office.

00:05:45 ◼   ► I've spoken for years.

00:05:46 ◼   ► People have asked us for years about having a community.

00:05:50 ◼   ► And when we were first launching the membership,

00:05:54 ◼   ► I wasn't comfortable with the tools out there.

00:05:55 ◼   ► Discord then didn't have as great tools as it has now.

00:06:00 ◼   ► And basically, that's the reason, because Discord realized,

00:06:02 ◼   ► I assume, we can't compete with Slack.

00:06:04 ◼   ► Let's make a product which is similar but focuses in different areas.

00:06:08 ◼   ► And they've really focused on having communities.

00:06:11 ◼   ► So we have a team of wonderful moderators there.

00:06:13 ◼   ► And we're building something I'm super excited about.

00:06:17 ◼   ► It has been a wonderful weekend.

00:06:18 ◼   ► We launched this on Friday.

00:06:19 ◼   ► And it's been amazing to watch this thing grow.

00:06:21 ◼   ► So it would mean a lot to us if you signed up to become a Relay FM member.

00:06:26 ◼   ► Especially, I will speak for me and Jason,

00:06:28 ◼   ► if you choose to support upgrade with that membership.

00:06:30 ◼   ► There is a link in the show notes to do so.

00:06:32 ◼   ► You can just click that.

00:06:33 ◼   ► You support upgrade.

00:06:34 ◼   ► You give us some money every month.

00:06:36 ◼   ► You get a bunch of great benefits.

00:06:38 ◼   ► And now, access to the Relay FM Discord server.

00:06:41 ◼   ► Or you can go to relay.fm/membership to learn more.

00:06:45 ◼   ► Thank you for this time, I will say.

00:06:47 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:06:48 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:06:48 ◼   ► And we do some extra stuff during the year and our planning,

00:06:53 ◼   ► what we're going to be doing next.

00:06:55 ◼   ► So you get some podcasty kind of bonuses to listen to,

00:06:58 ◼   ► as well as the community.

00:06:59 ◼   ► And I've had little communities for Six Colors members

00:07:03 ◼   ► and incomparable members for the last couple of years.

00:07:06 ◼   ► And those have actually turned out to be pretty great spaces.

00:07:09 ◼   ► And the Relay Discord is looking like it's going to be that, too.

00:07:12 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:07:13 ◼   ► Very, very, very happy with it so far.

00:07:17 ◼   ► Should we do some more follow-up, follow-out, Jason?

00:07:20 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:07:20 ◼   ► I mean, this is the time for it.

00:07:22 ◼   ► If we don't do it now, they're not going to let us--

00:07:24 ◼   ► The podcast police aren't going to let us do it later.

00:07:27 ◼   ► I know that you wanted--

00:07:28 ◼   ► that you put in here that there was a great interview on App

00:07:31 ◼   ► Stories with Craig Federighi joining Federico.

00:07:35 ◼   ► Federighi, Federico part two.

00:07:38 ◼   ► They spoke last year at WWDC, but now they

00:07:40 ◼   ► spoke prior to WWDC.

00:07:42 ◼   ► And the focus of the interview was about the cursor support

00:07:46 ◼   ► in iPad OS.

00:07:49 ◼   ► Yeah, it's the--

00:07:51 ◼   ► I like this interview.

00:07:52 ◼   ► And what I was thinking while I was listening to it is,

00:07:56 ◼   ► you know, there is a group of us who write or talk

00:07:58 ◼   ► about these issues.

00:08:00 ◼   ► And we spend all our time thinking about issues

00:08:02 ◼   ► involving Apple and products and their product philosophy

00:08:05 ◼   ► and stuff like that.

00:08:06 ◼   ► Federico and I talk about iPad keyboards and mice

00:08:11 ◼   ► and things like that and back and forth.

00:08:13 ◼   ► And there's a group of us.

00:08:14 ◼   ► But the thing is, there is this other group

00:08:17 ◼   ► of people who spend all their time thinking about this.

00:08:20 ◼   ► And they never talk about it except amongst themselves.

00:08:23 ◼   ► And we never get to talk to them.

00:08:24 ◼   ► And that's the people who make this stuff at Apple.

00:08:27 ◼   ► And they do carefully consider-- a lot of the same things

00:08:30 ◼   ► we're talking about, they talk about and consider.

00:08:32 ◼   ► And so this is a great breaking of that wall

00:08:35 ◼   ► where Federico and Craig got to talk to each other.

00:08:39 ◼   ► And it's very clear from that conversation

00:08:41 ◼   ► just how much they considered all these issues before making

00:08:47 ◼   ► their decisions.

00:08:48 ◼   ► And I think that not only is it fun to see that interaction,

00:08:51 ◼   ► but it's also a reminder that it's

00:08:55 ◼   ► really easy to see Apple do something and say,

00:08:57 ◼   ► I can't believe they didn't think of,

00:08:58 ◼   ► or this is so lazy, or whatever.

00:09:01 ◼   ► And that is almost never the case.

00:09:04 ◼   ► It's more that they made a decision you disagreed with,

00:09:07 ◼   ► and they have their reasons, or because

00:09:09 ◼   ► some other circumstances going on.

00:09:11 ◼   ► But it's hard to listen to Craig Federighi

00:09:13 ◼   ► and not get the sense that there are

00:09:14 ◼   ► a lot of people at Apple who are very carefully considering

00:09:18 ◼   ► all of the issues involved in doing something like adding

00:09:21 ◼   ► a pointer to iPad OS.

00:09:25 ◼   ► Yeah, and I really like what you said there about there

00:09:28 ◼   ► are people that are thinking about this so much

00:09:30 ◼   ► because they're making it.

00:09:31 ◼   ► And it can be very helpful to just hear these people talk

00:09:37 ◼   ► about their thought processes that lead them to this.

00:09:41 ◼   ► Or also, things like-- I really liked the conversation

00:09:45 ◼   ► they were having about how the trackpad could change Pro Apps.

00:09:51 ◼   ► And Federighi was talking about the fact that, yes, maybe,

00:09:54 ◼   ► but they want all apps to be considered to be usable

00:09:58 ◼   ► in every mode.

00:10:00 ◼   ► They don't want Photoshop to have such tiny icons that only

00:10:05 ◼   ► the cursor can use them.

00:10:07 ◼   ► And so it was useful to hear that because there

00:10:11 ◼   ► may have been some people that were starting to potentially go

00:10:13 ◼   ► off on a road like, oh, I'm going

00:10:15 ◼   ► to make an app that's just for cursor support.

00:10:17 ◼   ► It's like, don't do that.

00:10:19 ◼   ► You should make an application that's useful in all modes.

00:10:23 ◼   ► Maybe it works better in one or the other,

00:10:25 ◼   ► but should be usable everywhere.

00:10:28 ◼   ► Yeah, no, it's a great conversation

00:10:32 ◼   ► that what I really liked about it

00:10:34 ◼   ► is it reflected a lot of the stuff

00:10:36 ◼   ► that we've kind of reverse engineered out here

00:10:38 ◼   ► on the outside about the iPad as a flexible thing.

00:10:41 ◼   ► And it's touch first, but you have to have these other modes.

00:10:43 ◼   ► And that's one of the values of it is you

00:10:44 ◼   ► can mode shift and all that.

00:10:46 ◼   ► And so to hear Craig Federighi talk about it, it's like, yes,

00:10:48 ◼   ► OK.

00:10:49 ◼   ► It's like, they thought about it.

00:10:50 ◼   ► We thought about it.

00:10:51 ◼   ► We're thinking the same things.

00:10:54 ◼   ► It's reassuring in some way that these things

00:10:56 ◼   ► are happening in parallel because it means that our read

00:10:58 ◼   ► on it about how this product is being used

00:11:01 ◼   ► and how we're using it-- because all we can base it on

00:11:04 ◼   ► is what the product is and how we use it

00:11:05 ◼   ► and our desires for it.

00:11:07 ◼   ► And they, on the inside, have the ability to steer it,

00:11:11 ◼   ► but they have to have those discussions about where

00:11:13 ◼   ► they want to steer it and what is their guiding philosophy.

00:11:15 ◼   ► And I was encouraged by the fact that it seems

00:11:17 ◼   ► that Apple views the iPad, at least based

00:11:21 ◼   ► on Federighi's comments, in a very similar way to the way

00:11:25 ◼   ► that people like me and Federico view it, which is good.

00:11:30 ◼   ► Take your minds back to October 2018.

00:11:38 ◼   ► Oh, no.

00:11:40 ◼   ► Good time.

00:11:40 ◼   ► We were outside.

00:11:42 ◼   ► What I liked about the--

00:11:43 ◼   ► I just opened the link here to add it to the show notes.

00:11:46 ◼   ► And the beginning of the description

00:11:47 ◼   ► for the episode of Upgrade that we're about to refer to,

00:11:49 ◼   ► 213, was this week Jason and Myke discussed where the iPad

00:11:53 ◼   ► Pro might go next, including whether it's

00:11:55 ◼   ► a primarily horizontal or vertical device

00:11:58 ◼   ► and if adding a USB-C port makes sense.

00:12:00 ◼   ► The answer is yes to all of that.

00:12:02 ◼   ► I'm just going to assume that we were

00:12:03 ◼   ► very prophetic in that episode.

00:12:05 ◼   ► I'm sure.

00:12:06 ◼   ► But the most important thing that happened in that episode

00:12:08 ◼   ► is that I told the story about not getting

00:12:11 ◼   ► a bunch of stuff from Ikea for my outdoor furniture.

00:12:14 ◼   ► Which is similar in its idea to the Drobo discussion

00:12:19 ◼   ► last week.

00:12:20 ◼   ► Yeah, it was.

00:12:21 ◼   ► In that I got to start talking and you

00:12:23 ◼   ► got to go pour yourself a cup of tea.

00:12:25 ◼   ► I'm always here, Jason.

00:12:27 ◼   ► I never leave.

00:12:28 ◼   ► Sweep the floors and just do whatever else you need to do.

00:12:31 ◼   ► And I'm listening and I'm pondering.

00:12:33 ◼   ► Never leave.

00:12:34 ◼   ► This makes it sound like I do leave.

00:12:35 ◼   ► I literally never leave.

00:12:37 ◼   ► All right.

00:12:37 ◼   ► OK.

00:12:39 ◼   ► You can kick back.

00:12:40 ◼   ► Yeah, I knock my chair down.

00:12:42 ◼   ► You've got the height adjustment, the angle adjustment,

00:12:44 ◼   ► and lock that down a couple of points so I can lean back

00:12:47 ◼   ► and just go for it.

00:12:48 ◼   ► Yeah, it's like the chair equivalent of loosening a tie.

00:12:50 ◼   ► Yes, exactly.

00:12:51 ◼   ► You're like, I'm going to settle in here for this story.

00:12:54 ◼   ► So go listen to episode 213.

00:12:56 ◼   ► If you haven't, you can hear us talk about the iPad Pro.

00:12:59 ◼   ► Maybe we were right, maybe we were wrong.

00:13:01 ◼   ► And you can also hear about my adventure with Ikea

00:13:03 ◼   ► where I didn't get all the cushions for this.

00:13:05 ◼   ► And the people told me I could go online, people at the store,

00:13:10 ◼   ► and fill the rest of my order, which turned out

00:13:13 ◼   ► to be a horrible lie.

00:13:14 ◼   ► And so I had furniture that didn't have cushions on it

00:13:18 ◼   ► or was missing cushions.

00:13:19 ◼   ► And in the end, it all worked out in the sense

00:13:22 ◼   ► that a listener in Norway found the cushion covers--

00:13:27 ◼   ► because I had the cushions but not the covers for them.

00:13:30 ◼   ► And I sent him money, and he sent me

00:13:32 ◼   ► Norwegian Ikea cushion covers.

00:13:35 ◼   ► The best ones.

00:13:36 ◼   ► In all of this, I got a $10 credit from Ikea

00:13:39 ◼   ► for them apologizing for the fact that they took my order

00:13:41 ◼   ► and claimed that it was about to ship,

00:13:43 ◼   ► and it spent an entire summer not shipping because they

00:13:45 ◼   ► didn't actually have it.

00:13:49 ◼   ► And it turns out I was still short one pillow and one cover

00:13:52 ◼   ► from 2018.

00:13:54 ◼   ► I didn't buy enough of the pillows, of the cushions.

00:13:57 ◼   ► So last year I went by, and I just

00:13:59 ◼   ► forgot and never bothered to check.

00:14:01 ◼   ► But this year, I thought, oh, let's see if a Frozon--

00:14:06 ◼   ► because this was FrozonQuest 2018--

00:14:09 ◼   ► if a Frozon cover and a Dovholman cushion

00:14:15 ◼   ► are available on Ikea.com.

00:14:17 ◼   ► Because we're locked down, I'm not going to go to my local Ikea.

00:14:19 ◼   ► And they were.

00:14:20 ◼   ► And I ordered them.

00:14:21 ◼   ► And I found in my email the gift card code from Ikea

00:14:25 ◼   ► from FrozonQuest 2018.

00:14:28 ◼   ► And I placed an order.

00:14:29 ◼   ► And that was April.

00:14:33 ◼   ► It showed up yesterday.

00:14:35 ◼   ► Two boxes with the Frozon and the Dovholman.

00:14:40 ◼   ► And so now I have a slightly darker final piece

00:14:45 ◼   ► of the puzzle cushion.

00:14:46 ◼   ► Slightly darker because the other ones

00:14:48 ◼   ► have faded in the sunlight in the ensuing year.

00:14:50 ◼   ► But I'm at full power with my backyard furniture.

00:14:55 ◼   ► And I thought everybody should know.

00:14:57 ◼   ► So there you go, FrozonQuest 2020.

00:14:59 ◼   ► Not as exciting.

00:15:00 ◼   ► I placed an order.

00:15:01 ◼   ► And it showed up.

00:15:03 ◼   ► Yeah, it's not really so much of a quest, really.

00:15:05 ◼   ► It's just Frozon expected 2020.

00:15:08 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean, to be fair, Ikea has nothing else to do right now

00:15:11 ◼   ► than fulfill online orders.

00:15:12 ◼   ► But they did.

00:15:14 ◼   ► You said that, though, but they're still not very good at it.

00:15:16 ◼   ► I've received similar credit.

00:15:18 ◼   ► I've received similar credit in the past.

00:15:19 ◼   ► Not recently.

00:15:21 ◼   ► Not recently.

00:15:22 ◼   ► No, they're terrible at it.

00:15:24 ◼   ► And I'm not going to go into the details other than to say that--

00:15:27 ◼   ► I mean, I did wait a month with minimal--

00:15:31 ◼   ► we're so used to-- this was the point of FrozonQuest 2018.

00:15:33 ◼   ► We're so used to Amazon telling you every step of the process.

00:15:36 ◼   ► And I think that's up the game for a lot of e-commerce vendors.

00:15:39 ◼   ► Ikea still got it.

00:15:41 ◼   ► And then there's just silence.

00:15:42 ◼   ► And then a month passes, and you get an email that says,

00:15:45 ◼   ► shipped it.

00:15:46 ◼   ► And that's it.

00:15:47 ◼   ► That's all they do.

00:15:49 ◼   ► So that month of silence passed.

00:15:51 ◼   ► But to their credit, they actually

00:15:53 ◼   ► had the thing they claimed they had,

00:15:54 ◼   ► and they shipped it to me.

00:15:55 ◼   ► And now I have it.

00:15:56 ◼   ► So no Norwegian imports required this time.

00:16:00 ◼   ► Wonderful.

00:16:02 ◼   ► We can entertain in our backyard now.

00:16:04 ◼   ► Oh.

00:16:04 ◼   ► Oh, no.

00:16:05 ◼   ► I have one other tale, a miniature tale of woe

00:16:10 ◼   ► to share with you.

00:16:12 ◼   ► So I bought the iPhone X, as we all did in the fall of 2017.

00:16:17 ◼   ► Remember, it came out after the iPhone 8, but it came out.

00:16:19 ◼   ► And we placed our orders.

00:16:20 ◼   ► And I believe I actually placed my order on the East Coast.

00:16:25 ◼   ► So I had to get up at 5 AM or whatever.

00:16:28 ◼   ► Or at 8 AM, no, it was the luxury.

00:16:30 ◼   ► Or no, it was stay up till 3 AM.

00:16:31 ◼   ► That's what it was back then.

00:16:32 ◼   ► I was punished for being on the East Coast.

00:16:34 ◼   ► And all the East Coasters laughed at me and said,

00:16:36 ◼   ► see what it's like?

00:16:37 ◼   ► And then they changed it so it's 5 AM Pacific,

00:16:39 ◼   ► so I get to see how it's like every time.

00:16:40 ◼   ► Anyway, this weekend-- so I rolled that down.

00:16:45 ◼   ► I have-- I bought an 11 Pro.

00:16:48 ◼   ► So my wife has the 10 that I bought.

00:16:52 ◼   ► And so she and my daughter left the area for the first time

00:16:59 ◼   ► in nine weeks to go pick up my daughter's stuff, which is

00:17:04 ◼   ► still sitting in her dorm room.

00:17:06 ◼   ► We had a deadline of you need out.

00:17:08 ◼   ► And it's about an eight-hour drive up there.

00:17:12 ◼   ► So they drove up there eight hours, went to the dorm,

00:17:15 ◼   ► packed up the stuff, slept, moved the stuff to the car,

00:17:18 ◼   ► and came home.

00:17:19 ◼   ► It was a whole operation.

00:17:21 ◼   ► On the drive up, literally the first time

00:17:24 ◼   ► she's been away from home at any length for all this time,

00:17:31 ◼   ► she notices that the screen has basically

00:17:34 ◼   ► popped out of the iPhone.

00:17:36 ◼   ► And apparently, the battery in the iPhone 10 swelled.

00:17:39 ◼   ► It did one of those things like a star that's

00:17:42 ◼   ► going to go supernova, where it's just like,

00:17:44 ◼   ► I'm going to just start getting big.

00:17:46 ◼   ► I'm going to puff up big.

00:17:47 ◼   ► It's Liftoff Podcast.

00:17:49 ◼   ► Read all-- here, listen all about Supernovas

00:17:51 ◼   ► on the Liftoff Podcast.

00:17:54 ◼   ► It's bad.

00:17:55 ◼   ► It's bad, right?

00:17:56 ◼   ► And what the timing of it--

00:17:57 ◼   ► literally any other day in the last eight weeks,

00:17:59 ◼   ► it would be fine.

00:18:00 ◼   ► But she's driving away from home.

00:18:03 ◼   ► So my daughter's got her phone because she's 18.

00:18:06 ◼   ► So she's got a phone.

00:18:07 ◼   ► It's fine.

00:18:07 ◼   ► So what do I do?

00:18:11 ◼   ► Well, I've got--

00:18:14 ◼   ► I can't help her, right?

00:18:15 ◼   ► She's like, what do we do?

00:18:16 ◼   ► I'm like, nothing.

00:18:17 ◼   ► I can't-- there's no buttons to push

00:18:20 ◼   ► to make the battery deflate.

00:18:21 ◼   ► It just is broken now.

00:18:23 ◼   ► So I did get ahead on the replacement.

00:18:26 ◼   ► So I went to Apple.

00:18:28 ◼   ► I actually did their text support.

00:18:30 ◼   ► Oh, right, the business shop.

00:18:33 ◼   ► No, this was like their web interface.

00:18:34 ◼   ► Oh, OK.

00:18:35 ◼   ► The worst one.

00:18:36 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah.

00:18:37 ◼   ► The worst one, yeah, the worst one.

00:18:40 ◼   ► And they wanted the serial number and the IMEI number,

00:18:42 ◼   ► which I was able to look up on appleid.apple.com,

00:18:45 ◼   ► which lists all of the phones that are logged in

00:18:47 ◼   ► with a particular ID.

00:18:48 ◼   ► They needed me to erase the phone

00:18:52 ◼   ► and delete it from my account in order to do--

00:18:56 ◼   ► basically turn off Find My because they want that off.

00:18:59 ◼   ► And of course, the phone wasn't with me,

00:19:01 ◼   ► but I was able to do that remotely.

00:19:04 ◼   ► And then they asked me if I wanted to bring it into a store.

00:19:07 ◼   ► And I said, those stores aren't open.

00:19:11 ◼   ► They're like, ah, yes.

00:19:13 ◼   ► We have no way to tell when stores will be open.

00:19:16 ◼   ► So you can just mail it.

00:19:17 ◼   ► We'll send you a box and you can mail it in.

00:19:18 ◼   ► I'm like, all right.

00:19:19 ◼   ► So they're apparently sending me a box.

00:19:21 ◼   ► And they said, we'll send you an email

00:19:22 ◼   ► with details about payment,

00:19:24 ◼   ► which I thought was interesting, a way of phrasing it.

00:19:26 ◼   ► Like, they're not going to make me pay on the text chat.

00:19:29 ◼   ► They won't tell me what I need to pay.

00:19:31 ◼   ► And I'm sitting there thinking, why am I paying?

00:19:33 ◼   ► This seems like a really bad battery problem

00:19:36 ◼   ► that I know it's out of warranty.

00:19:38 ◼   ► It's a two-plus-year-old phone, two-and-a-half-year-old phone,

00:19:40 ◼   ► but your battery should probably not explode like this.

00:19:43 ◼   ► Well, it's dangerous.

00:19:44 ◼   ► Yeah, it is dangerous.

00:19:45 ◼   ► It's created like an explosive device

00:19:47 ◼   ► that is just being driven around California.

00:19:49 ◼   ► Exactly.

00:19:49 ◼   ► Not too explosive because they're willing

00:19:51 ◼   ► to have me put it in a box and put it through the mail.

00:19:53 ◼   ► But still, it makes me uneasy.

00:19:55 ◼   ► Anyway, it doesn't matter because I got the email

00:19:57 ◼   ► like an hour later and it said, basically,

00:20:00 ◼   ► you don't have to pay for this.

00:20:02 ◼   ► Just put it in the box and we'll...

00:20:04 ◼   ► So, you know, anyway, it's funny

00:20:05 ◼   ► 'cause that two-and-a-half years since I bought that iPhone

00:20:09 ◼   ► and one day it just decided to,

00:20:12 ◼   ► its battery just decided to swell and expand.

00:20:14 ◼   ► I'm intrigued to see what that box looks like

00:20:16 ◼   ► that they send you.

00:20:18 ◼   ► Yeah, I'm looking forward to it.

00:20:21 ◼   ► I'm sure people who've done mail repairs

00:20:25 ◼   ► have seen this before, but it's, yeah,

00:20:27 ◼   ► it's gonna be an empty box with padding probably

00:20:30 ◼   ► and a label that you stick on the, and it's resealable,

00:20:33 ◼   ► and a label you stick on the outside

00:20:34 ◼   ► and then give it to your UPS guy when he comes by

00:20:38 ◼   ► and he takes it away.

00:20:39 ◼   ► We'll see, I'll keep you updated.

00:20:41 ◼   ► But it was just the timing of it

00:20:42 ◼   ► and the fact that a relatively young iPhone had this battery.

00:20:47 ◼   ► I've had this in laptops before,

00:20:48 ◼   ► but I've never seen it in an iOS device before.

00:20:51 ◼   ► Yeah, it's not good, not good.

00:20:55 ◼   ► Don't like that, don't like battery swelling.

00:20:57 ◼   ► That's not my favorite.

00:20:58 ◼   ► No, it's really disturbing.

00:21:00 ◼   ► And of course, they're in the middle of a long drive

00:21:01 ◼   ► and I'm like, well, I hope it doesn't,

00:21:03 ◼   ► if it explodes, roll down the window.

00:21:05 ◼   ► It catches fire, roll down the window

00:21:06 ◼   ► and throw it out of the car, I guess.

00:21:08 ◼   ► But like, yeah.

00:21:12 ◼   ► - And they'll be easier to return then.

00:21:14 ◼   ► Be a burnt out star at that point.

00:21:16 ◼   ► - They did start asking me as a part of this,

00:21:18 ◼   ► like, is there any water damage?

00:21:20 ◼   ► Actually, the first question was, is it damaged in any way?

00:21:22 ◼   ► And I said, well, the screen got pushed out

00:21:24 ◼   ► by the swelling battery.

00:21:25 ◼   ► And they're like, other than that, I'm like, no.

00:21:27 ◼   ► And then they specifically asked, is there water damage?

00:21:29 ◼   ► I said, no.

00:21:31 ◼   ► Like, all right.

00:21:31 ◼   ► So I sent you a picture of the swollen battery.

00:21:35 ◼   ► Like, all right, okay, it's gonna be okay.

00:21:37 ◼   ► What the time, any, literally any other day

00:21:41 ◼   ► out of the last nine weeks.

00:21:43 ◼   ► - Maybe that's what it was, you know,

00:21:44 ◼   ► it's just like oxygen or something.

00:21:46 ◼   ► - I was thinking, you know, what is it like,

00:21:48 ◼   ► it left home and it had to use the battery.

00:21:52 ◼   ► You know, although they're in the car

00:21:53 ◼   ► with a charger and all that, I don't know.

00:21:54 ◼   ► I don't know what did it, it's just bad luck.

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00:23:33 ◼   ► Should we do some upstream headlines?

00:23:35 ◼   ► I've got a few for you.

00:23:37 ◼   ► Okay, Apple's been doing more content deals.

00:23:40 ◼   ► So they have three.

00:23:41 ◼   ► They have a two year content deal with Annie Weissman,

00:23:45 ◼   ► a Weissman, I'm not sure which one it is,

00:23:46 ◼   ► but Weissman worked on Desperate Housewives

00:23:49 ◼   ► and is also the creator of the upcoming TV+ show Physical.

00:23:53 ◼   ► So Weissman has been working with Apple already

00:23:57 ◼   ► and there's actually a couple of these

00:23:59 ◼   ► and it's like, oh, now we'll just sign you up

00:24:00 ◼   ► for a few years.

00:24:02 ◼   ► Another one of these is Kerry Aaron,

00:24:04 ◼   ► who is the showrunner for The Morning Show.

00:24:07 ◼   ► Aaron has also signed a multi-year overall content deal

00:24:10 ◼   ► with Apple, so that's like locking up some more people

00:24:14 ◼   ► that they've worked with, they think they're great,

00:24:15 ◼   ► so it's like, all right, you're gonna stick around.

00:24:18 ◼   ► Apple have also hired Alison Kirkham,

00:24:20 ◼   ► who is the quote unquote factual controller at the BBC,

00:24:25 ◼   ► which is a very strange way to say that Kirkham

00:24:28 ◼   ► was in charge of commissioning documentaries.

00:24:31 ◼   ► - So did she battle the forces of confusion and delay?

00:24:35 ◼   ► Was that what she was doing on the railroad?

00:24:37 ◼   ► - Possibly, I mean, but factual controller,

00:24:41 ◼   ► this is the thing about--

00:24:41 ◼   ► - It's the fact controller, the fact controller,

00:24:44 ◼   ► Sir Topham Hatt.

00:24:44 ◼   ► - No, no, it's Sir Topham Hatt.

00:24:46 ◼   ► - Topham Hatt, you are causing confusion and delay.

00:24:50 ◼   ► - Factual controller, like this is one of those phrases

00:24:53 ◼   ► that shows how old the BBC is, right?

00:24:55 ◼   ► And they just never changed the name.

00:24:58 ◼   ► It's such a strange way of saying like documentary commissioner

00:25:01 ◼   ► but factual controller, this factual controller

00:25:06 ◼   ► has now moved to Apple instead,

00:25:09 ◼   ► which I guess is just key to say that Apple wants to do

00:25:12 ◼   ► more documentaries and like nonfiction, I guess.

00:25:17 ◼   ► - Do we have a title for her?

00:25:20 ◼   ► Is she gonna be the factual controller at Apple?

00:25:23 ◼   ► - From everything that I've read, there isn't like--

00:25:26 ◼   ► - There doesn't have a title.

00:25:28 ◼   ► But like we'll be working on that type of content, right?

00:25:33 ◼   ► Like she's gonna be joining the global team at Apple TV Plus

00:25:38 ◼   ► and we'll be reporting into the European director.

00:25:42 ◼   ► But basically it's going to be

00:25:44 ◼   ► unscripted original series of films.

00:25:46 ◼   ► - All right, okay.

00:25:47 ◼   ► And people can tune into that B-side episode

00:25:50 ◼   ► that we'll put a link to in the show notes

00:25:52 ◼   ► where we discussed in detail the history and naming

00:25:55 ◼   ► and family of Sir Topham Hatt from Tom Hanks.

00:25:57 ◼   ► - That's four minutes of fun.

00:25:59 ◼   ► - From 2015, can you believe that?

00:26:01 ◼   ► - We're really just reaching into the archives today.

00:26:05 ◼   ► - We are, this is a retrospective episode

00:26:07 ◼   ► as we move toward episode 300.

00:26:10 ◼   ► - The Oscars is being forced to adapt

00:26:12 ◼   ► as much as it can possibly resist at the same time.

00:26:15 ◼   ► So because movie theaters are closed,

00:26:17 ◼   ► Oscars consideration this year will consider movies

00:26:21 ◼   ► that haven't played in theaters,

00:26:23 ◼   ► but that movie must prove that it had a planned

00:26:28 ◼   ► theatrical release.

00:26:30 ◼   ► So there you go.

00:26:31 ◼   ► It's just like drag, like just being dragged,

00:26:34 ◼   ► kicking and screaming the film industry into the future.

00:26:38 ◼   ► But that's how they're gonna deal

00:26:39 ◼   ► with the Oscars this year.

00:26:40 ◼   ► I'm expecting there will be no Oscars as well, right?

00:26:44 ◼   ► I don't know how they're gonna deal with that part yet.

00:26:46 ◼   ► Like there's not gonna be a event.

00:26:49 ◼   ► - Like, yeah, I don't know, there might be,

00:26:51 ◼   ► but it may be a limited,

00:26:54 ◼   ► we'll see who knows what the world's gonna look like

00:26:56 ◼   ► next March, right?

00:26:57 ◼   ► We have no idea, but it's possible

00:26:58 ◼   ► that they will have a socially distant Oscars

00:27:03 ◼   ► to honor the eight movies that came out last year, right?

00:27:06 ◼   ► - The three movies that made it into cinemas.

00:27:10 ◼   ► - That's right.

00:27:11 ◼   ► - The Oscars in 2021 are gonna be the fun part, right?

00:27:15 ◼   ► It's gonna be like people's home movies.

00:27:17 ◼   ► There's gonna be no movies, there's no movies.

00:27:20 ◼   ► - It's TikToks, mostly it's TikToks.

00:27:22 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:27:24 ◼   ► - All right, let's talk about Apple and COVID-19.

00:27:27 ◼   ► They have awarded $10 million

00:27:29 ◼   ► to a company called Copan Diagnostics.

00:27:32 ◼   ► This money has come from their Advanced Manufacturing Fund,

00:27:36 ◼   ► which if that rings a bell,

00:27:37 ◼   ► it is the same fund that they gave a bunch of money

00:27:40 ◼   ► to Corning, the glass, the Gorilla Glass people.

00:27:43 ◼   ► So basically Apple set up a fund

00:27:46 ◼   ► that they were gonna be giving to companies

00:27:48 ◼   ► to help them with their manufacturing.

00:27:51 ◼   ► And also, like I mean, in the case of Corning,

00:27:54 ◼   ► Apple would also significantly benefit from that arrangement

00:27:58 ◼   ► like Corning make the glass

00:27:59 ◼   ► that goes on the front of their iPhones.

00:28:01 ◼   ► Now this one is obviously,

00:28:03 ◼   ► I think a little bit more altruistic

00:28:05 ◼   ► because Copan Diagnostics, their whole thing

00:28:08 ◼   ► is to work on sample collection kits in the US.

00:28:11 ◼   ► So basically for testing, right?

00:28:14 ◼   ► They create testing materials, like medical testing.

00:28:19 ◼   ► So obviously this is gonna be used for,

00:28:21 ◼   ► and Copan stuff is already being used

00:28:23 ◼   ► for coronavirus testing,

00:28:26 ◼   ► but Apple is going to be able to help them ramp up

00:28:28 ◼   ► from producing thousands of kits a week

00:28:30 ◼   ► to over a million a week by July,

00:28:33 ◼   ► which is a very, very steep curve.

00:28:36 ◼   ► I wanna give a quote from the press release.

00:28:38 ◼   ► Apple is sourcing equipment and materials

00:28:40 ◼   ► for Copan Diagnostics from companies across the US

00:28:43 ◼   ► and then including equipment

00:28:45 ◼   ► that Apple is helping design as well.

00:28:48 ◼   ► I read an article from John Grubin

00:28:50 ◼   ► linked to this during Fireball

00:28:52 ◼   ► and basically pointed out that

00:28:53 ◼   ► possibly the operational assistance from Apple

00:28:56 ◼   ► is worth more than the $10 million really, right?

00:29:00 ◼   ► - Interesting.

00:29:01 ◼   ► - So this is, if we remember,

00:29:03 ◼   ► Cast Our Minds back a few weeks ago

00:29:05 ◼   ► to when Tim Cook said that Apple would do the things

00:29:08 ◼   ► that it's best at,

00:29:09 ◼   ► this is probably one of those things, right?

00:29:11 ◼   ► Like they can help here,

00:29:13 ◼   ► by helping a company that is needed for testing

00:29:16 ◼   ► ramp up their production

00:29:18 ◼   ► because Apple knows how to produce stuff.

00:29:21 ◼   ► - Yeah, it's an interesting one

00:29:25 ◼   ► and I do keep coming back to,

00:29:26 ◼   ► there is some altruism in it,

00:29:29 ◼   ► there is some positive PR in it.

00:29:31 ◼   ► I do wonder if there is also some angle,

00:29:36 ◼   ► I mean, 'cause Apple wants to do good,

00:29:39 ◼   ► but Apple is also a huge profit-driven corporation.

00:29:42 ◼   ► My gut feeling is that this,

00:29:45 ◼   ► Apple wants to be a major player in health, right?

00:29:50 ◼   ► The Apple Watch has led them to be very interested

00:29:53 ◼   ► in being a major player in health

00:29:55 ◼   ► and pushing technology and their technology

00:29:59 ◼   ► into the health industry

00:30:00 ◼   ► in order, they will say to improve people's health, right?

00:30:03 ◼   ► And the Apple Watch has been very successful at that.

00:30:06 ◼   ► And I wonder if that's also part of this

00:30:08 ◼   ► is being a good member of the health industry

00:30:12 ◼   ► means doing things like this.

00:30:14 ◼   ► - And I'll be honest,

00:30:14 ◼   ► I haven't looked into Copan enough

00:30:17 ◼   ► to know if they have other arms at their business

00:30:19 ◼   ► that would be more helpful to Apple.

00:30:22 ◼   ► But the main thing that they seem to be known for

00:30:24 ◼   ► is their physical testing abilities.

00:30:27 ◼   ► But you're right, it might be that either A,

00:30:29 ◼   ► there's something about that company

00:30:30 ◼   ► that can be useful for the future

00:30:32 ◼   ► or B, that they want to be seen

00:30:34 ◼   ► in the global health community

00:30:36 ◼   ► as a company that can be trusted,

00:30:39 ◼   ► a company that is serious.

00:30:40 ◼   ► - And as a leader.

00:30:41 ◼   ► - Yeah, and as a leader, very good point.

00:30:44 ◼   ► There is still a lot of uncertainty

00:30:45 ◼   ► around the exposure notification API adoption.

00:30:48 ◼   ► So this is contact tracing.

00:30:50 ◼   ► I don't want to get into all of this,

00:30:53 ◼   ► but basically to say there are many countries

00:30:56 ◼   ► that agree it's an approach that they may consider,

00:30:57 ◼   ► Apple and Google's joint effort.

00:30:59 ◼   ► There are countries pushing ahead with their own options,

00:31:02 ◼   ► just completely ignoring it.

00:31:04 ◼   ► Some of these countries like my own say,

00:31:07 ◼   ► or there are reports that they're looking

00:31:10 ◼   ► to switching to Apple system anyway,

00:31:11 ◼   ► even though they're developing their own system,

00:31:13 ◼   ► they're like feasibility studies being done.

00:31:16 ◼   ► And there are some countries like Germany

00:31:18 ◼   ► that have already adopted Apple's approach

00:31:20 ◼   ► and have an app in development,

00:31:22 ◼   ► and they're gonna be pushing it out

00:31:23 ◼   ► as soon as it's available.

00:31:25 ◼   ► One of the things that I have learned,

00:31:27 ◼   ► looking into just this stuff today, really,

00:31:30 ◼   ► I mean, I've been paying attention to it,

00:31:31 ◼   ► but just reading the links I'm putting in the show notes

00:31:34 ◼   ► is that there's a lot of politics wrapped up in this.

00:31:38 ◼   ► - Oh yeah.

00:31:38 ◼   ► - And I think we're gonna have to see how this fares

00:31:42 ◼   ► over the next few months.

00:31:43 ◼   ► My read on this is a lot of the countries,

00:31:46 ◼   ► including my own right now that are saying

00:31:47 ◼   ► they're gonna do their own thing, will change course.

00:31:51 ◼   ► And I expect it's going to be at the second stage of the API

00:31:54 ◼   ► when it's built into the operating system.

00:31:56 ◼   ► Right, if you remember, there's the first stage,

00:31:59 ◼   ► which is you have to have an app,

00:32:00 ◼   ► and then the API will be able to talk with the app,

00:32:03 ◼   ► and then the apps can exchange their identifiers.

00:32:06 ◼   ► And then there is the second stage

00:32:07 ◼   ► where the identifiers are being drawn anyway,

00:32:10 ◼   ► and then you can download an app later

00:32:12 ◼   ► and put in your symptoms and say that you've been tested

00:32:15 ◼   ► or whatever, and then it can retroactively alert people.

00:32:18 ◼   ► Right, there's this two-stage approach.

00:32:21 ◼   ► So I expect that by that second stage,

00:32:24 ◼   ► I would really expect most countries

00:32:28 ◼   ► to have moved to the Apple Google system

00:32:31 ◼   ► because there are going to be significant issues

00:32:35 ◼   ► with any application that is trying to do this

00:32:40 ◼   ► Bluetooth exchange stuff

00:32:42 ◼   ► without Apple and Google's blessing.

00:32:44 ◼   ► And the UK government is saying a lot of interesting things

00:32:48 ◼   ► about the way that their app's going to work

00:32:50 ◼   ► in ways that seem to be counter to how I believe iOS works.

00:32:55 ◼   ► So we're gonna have to wait and see about all of that.

00:32:59 ◼   ► But yeah, I think that this is still a really moving thing.

00:33:04 ◼   ► It is in a lot of flux.

00:33:05 ◼   ► I mean, and honestly, if you think, as of right now,

00:33:09 ◼   ► the first stage of this

00:33:10 ◼   ► is not even publicly available anyway.

00:33:12 ◼   ► So- - Right.

00:33:13 ◼   ► They're beta testing it.

00:33:15 ◼   ► It'll be out soon, the first stage.

00:33:17 ◼   ► But yeah, there'll be another update

00:33:19 ◼   ► that has to happen after that for it to be at the OS level.

00:33:23 ◼   ► And yeah, I saw a note this week

00:33:28 ◼   ► that made me scratch my head a little bit

00:33:29 ◼   ► where somebody said, "Apple and Google's effort here

00:33:33 ◼   ► is an attempt to impose American values

00:33:35 ◼   ► on the rest of the world."

00:33:37 ◼   ► Those values being privacy and security.

00:33:42 ◼   ► And their argument was,

00:33:44 ◼   ► "Look, if the government wants to know everything about you

00:33:46 ◼   ► and where you go and what you do

00:33:48 ◼   ► in the middle of a public health crisis,

00:33:50 ◼   ► you should just give it to them."

00:33:51 ◼   ► And as an American, I think, "Hmm, no."

00:33:54 ◼   ► But yes, you're right.

00:33:55 ◼   ► In a way, they are imposing American values

00:33:57 ◼   ► over other cultures and countries that might have values

00:34:01 ◼   ► that don't include the privacy of their people.

00:34:04 ◼   ► But the truth is that they are also imposing

00:34:08 ◼   ► their corporate values.

00:34:11 ◼   ► And I guess I would say this is one of those cases

00:34:15 ◼   ► where I'm glad that the companies

00:34:17 ◼   ► that run the dominant smartphone platforms on the world

00:34:21 ◼   ► care about this stuff.

00:34:23 ◼   ► They care enough that they wanna build a system

00:34:26 ◼   ► that does both contact tracing data,

00:34:29 ◼   ► background data for contract tracers,

00:34:32 ◼   ► and keep it private and not make it a surveillance tool.

00:34:37 ◼   ► But I can see the other side, which is,

00:34:41 ◼   ► "But it's a crisis, make it a surveillance tool."

00:34:45 ◼   ► And my point here is that,

00:34:48 ◼   ► although I found that statement bizarre,

00:34:50 ◼   ► although accurate in a way, right?

00:34:54 ◼   ► That it is sort of one of our values, I think,

00:34:57 ◼   ► of a lot of countries, not just America, to say,

00:35:00 ◼   ► "Oh, people have rights and should have a right to privacy,

00:35:04 ◼   ► but even in a health crisis,

00:35:06 ◼   ► but we also need to solve the health crisis."

00:35:08 ◼   ► But it shows you just how much politics,

00:35:13 ◼   ► and it's individual politics,

00:35:14 ◼   ► like the reason the UK is doing what it's doing

00:35:16 ◼   ► has a lot to do with the dynamics in the UK and UK politics.

00:35:20 ◼   ► The reason the US is doing what it's doing,

00:35:21 ◼   ► or not doing as the case may be,

00:35:24 ◼   ► has a lot to do with internal politics.

00:35:26 ◼   ► So that's the other challenge with a global threat like this,

00:35:29 ◼   ► is that everybody's reacting differently to it,

00:35:31 ◼   ► and that includes their reactions to Google and Apple.

00:35:34 ◼   ► - And I understand, it is difficult,

00:35:37 ◼   ► and I'm sure it's very difficult as world leaders

00:35:40 ◼   ► to accept Tim Cook and Sundar Pichai

00:35:42 ◼   ► to tell them what to do, right?

00:35:44 ◼   ► It's counter to everything that they have believed in

00:35:47 ◼   ► leading up to the point that they became the politicians

00:35:49 ◼   ► that they are, right?

00:35:50 ◼   ► That no corporation's going to tell a country what to do.

00:35:55 ◼   ► But I mean, I think we both agree

00:35:58 ◼   ► that it's probably the better way to do it.

00:36:01 ◼   ► At least it's the way I feel more comfortable with.

00:36:03 ◼   ► I don't feel completely comfortable

00:36:05 ◼   ► with the government running this system.

00:36:09 ◼   ► - Well, first off, yes, I actually trust the tech companies

00:36:13 ◼   ► to build a system fast over a giant government bureaucracy.

00:36:18 ◼   ► But also, it's not an either/or proposition,

00:36:21 ◼   ► and that's part of what bugs me

00:36:22 ◼   ► about some of these debates about this,

00:36:24 ◼   ► is Apple and Google want to do something

00:36:25 ◼   ► that gives everybody useful data and is private.

00:36:28 ◼   ► It's not, and you get the sense,

00:36:31 ◼   ► okay, maybe I'm projecting here,

00:36:32 ◼   ► but I get the sense that some of the people

00:36:33 ◼   ► who are arguing for expediency don't really mean it

00:36:37 ◼   ► because they're making this kind of false case,

00:36:40 ◼   ► this false choice, which is, well, you can have privacy

00:36:44 ◼   ► or you could have public health, and you have to choose.

00:36:46 ◼   ► And what I appreciate about the approach

00:36:48 ◼   ► Apple and Google has taken is that they're trying to say,

00:36:50 ◼   ► and it may not be the right approach,

00:36:53 ◼   ► and there may be technical details that are problematic,

00:36:55 ◼   ► and we'll see how they roll it out,

00:36:56 ◼   ► but what they're trying to do is say, you can do both.

00:37:00 ◼   ► We can keep it private

00:37:02 ◼   ► and help it contribute to public health,

00:37:04 ◼   ► and you don't need to turn into a surveillance state

00:37:07 ◼   ► where every single phone is tracking everybody's location

00:37:10 ◼   ► and everybody they interact with

00:37:12 ◼   ► in order to protect the public health.

00:37:14 ◼   ► And I appreciate that because I don't like the idea

00:37:17 ◼   ► of having to choose between privacy and public health

00:37:20 ◼   ► because that's a very hard decision, right?

00:37:22 ◼   ► And we've seen it in the past.

00:37:24 ◼   ► You give away some of your rights

00:37:25 ◼   ► in order to protect the public good.

00:37:28 ◼   ► I would also argue that if this kind of stuff

00:37:31 ◼   ► is seen as a mass surveillance tool,

00:37:33 ◼   ► you're going to lose a percentage of the population

00:37:35 ◼   ► who will refuse to do it,

00:37:37 ◼   ► at which point it's no longer a public health tool anyway,

00:37:41 ◼   ► because you need a certain percentage.

00:37:42 ◼   ► There were some stories that I read that suggested

00:37:46 ◼   ► that you really need this on the operating system

00:37:48 ◼   ► turned on by default because you need to reach

00:37:51 ◼   ► a very high percentage of people who are using it

00:37:53 ◼   ► for it to have any effect at all that is substantial.

00:37:57 ◼   ► So I appreciate that Apple and Google

00:37:58 ◼   ► are trying to make this both so that somebody who says,

00:38:02 ◼   ► oh, well, you have to choose one or another,

00:38:04 ◼   ► they can't make that argument

00:38:06 ◼   ► because Apple and Google have chosen both.

00:38:08 ◼   ► - Apple have announced WWDC is going to begin June 22nd

00:38:13 ◼   ► and through the week.

00:38:14 ◼   ► - It's a tragedy for upgrade

00:38:16 ◼   ► because that week was going to be episode 300.

00:38:20 ◼   ► We hadn't planned it.

00:38:21 ◼   ► It was just luck.

00:38:21 ◼   ► It's a bounty for connected

00:38:24 ◼   ► because you guys skipped some episodes

00:38:26 ◼   ► and episode 300 will be that week for you guys.

00:38:29 ◼   ► - Yep, I got two chances to win.

00:38:32 ◼   ► - Yeah, you got two tickets.

00:38:34 ◼   ► - I got two tickets.

00:38:35 ◼   ► And so, yeah, I think we're going to be at like episode 303

00:38:39 ◼   ► or something is going to be WWDC week.

00:38:44 ◼   ► We'll obviously be drafting our predictions on June 15th,

00:38:49 ◼   ► which I'm of course extremely excited for.

00:38:51 ◼   ► We don't have any details.

00:38:53 ◼   ► The press release basically just said June 22nd

00:38:56 ◼   ► and they announced the student challenge.

00:38:58 ◼   ► So it was like a student challenge every year

00:39:01 ◼   ► where students would get a free ride to WWDC

00:39:05 ◼   ► if they would complete something.

00:39:07 ◼   ► And I'm pleased to see that they're still doing

00:39:10 ◼   ► something here and it was the thing

00:39:12 ◼   ► that needed to be announced first

00:39:13 ◼   ► because that's the only thing this year

00:39:16 ◼   ► that has to happen in advance.

00:39:18 ◼   ► Nothing else needs to happen.

00:39:19 ◼   ► - I parsed there, I did my little Apple chromatography thing

00:39:23 ◼   ► and I looked at their release

00:39:24 ◼   ► and the two things that struck me were one,

00:39:27 ◼   ► it's a week long event.

00:39:30 ◼   ► It seems like they are going to stick to the concept

00:39:32 ◼   ► of a week long event.

00:39:33 ◼   ► I imagine they're going to have follow ons

00:39:35 ◼   ► throughout the summer,

00:39:36 ◼   ► but that the primary stuff is going to drop that week

00:39:39 ◼   ► and it's going to be this week long event.

00:39:40 ◼   ► And then of course the promise for more information

00:39:44 ◼   ► as we get closer basically,

00:39:46 ◼   ► but that is a little placeholder for Phil Schiller

00:39:48 ◼   ► basically to say, we're going to make more announcements.

00:39:51 ◼   ► We just haven't made them yet.

00:39:52 ◼   ► - Which is great, right?

00:39:54 ◼   ► 'Cause we were talking about this,

00:39:56 ◼   ► I think maybe last week or a couple of weeks ago

00:39:58 ◼   ► that they have to announce a date

00:40:01 ◼   ► so people could prepare their lives

00:40:03 ◼   ► because people aren't traveling,

00:40:05 ◼   ► but they do need to free up time to consume and learn

00:40:10 ◼   ► and also to start setting development schedules in place.

00:40:16 ◼   ► Because from now, we have to still assume

00:40:19 ◼   ► that this is coming in September, iOS 14.

00:40:22 ◼   ► But we have to make that assumption.

00:40:23 ◼   ► We can't make any other assumption

00:40:24 ◼   ► until Apple tell us otherwise.

00:40:26 ◼   ► So people need to work out

00:40:30 ◼   ► what their development cycle is going to be.

00:40:32 ◼   ► So they needed to start announcing a date

00:40:33 ◼   ► so people could, I believe,

00:40:34 ◼   ► so people could start working on that.

00:40:36 ◼   ► So I think that's great.

00:40:37 ◼   ► June 22nd, I think this is obviously later in the month

00:40:41 ◼   ► than it would have been.

00:40:43 ◼   ► I feel like it probably would have been

00:40:45 ◼   ► much earlier in the month,

00:40:46 ◼   ► but they could have given themselves some leeway.

00:40:48 ◼   ► Is it the last full week of June?

00:40:51 ◼   ► Yeah, it is.

00:40:52 ◼   ► It's the last full week of June.

00:40:53 ◼   ► So otherwise, it would have moved into July.

00:40:55 ◼   ► And the only other thing I guess we can assume,

00:40:57 ◼   ► even though I haven't been told,

00:40:59 ◼   ► just because logistically,

00:41:00 ◼   ► I don't know how else it would work,

00:41:01 ◼   ► that the keynote will be on the morning of the 22nd.

00:41:04 ◼   ► You can't do anything else.

00:41:06 ◼   ► - That's literally, you have to,

00:41:08 ◼   ► that's what a keynote is.

00:41:09 ◼   ► You got to kick it off.

00:41:10 ◼   ► I imagine that would be exactly what we expect

00:41:12 ◼   ► where there will be a keynote

00:41:13 ◼   ► and there'll probably even be a deep dive OS session

00:41:17 ◼   ► that happens thereafter.

00:41:18 ◼   ► Now, the question is,

00:41:19 ◼   ► when you're not tethered by reality

00:41:21 ◼   ► of people having to get lunches in boxes

00:41:24 ◼   ► and reset the room and all of that,

00:41:26 ◼   ► will they, how much time do they leave between streams?

00:41:30 ◼   ► Are they gonna leave us enough time to record upgrade?

00:41:33 ◼   ► I mean, there's a lot.

00:41:35 ◼   ► - It doesn't matter as much.

00:41:38 ◼   ► Our typical issue with when we record upgrade

00:41:42 ◼   ► was there were physical movements that needed to occur.

00:41:45 ◼   ► They aren't happening this time,

00:41:47 ◼   ► so we'll just record it whenever, right?

00:41:49 ◼   ► Or we have a live show to go to.

00:41:51 ◼   ► We were not doing any of that this year,

00:41:53 ◼   ► so we'll just record it as soon as we can after the keynote.

00:41:56 ◼   ► But the typical constraints that we have

00:42:00 ◼   ► aren't gonna be the same.

00:42:02 ◼   ► - Yeah, we'll see.

00:42:04 ◼   ► I'm excited though.

00:42:05 ◼   ► This is Apple's opportunity to rethink WWDC

00:42:10 ◼   ► and as somebody who's been going for a long time,

00:42:13 ◼   ► it's a fun event, but you're always gonna,

00:42:18 ◼   ► I mean, like being forced to reevaluate it and rethink it

00:42:22 ◼   ► is gonna lead to some cool stuff

00:42:25 ◼   ► that would never have happened

00:42:27 ◼   ► if the circumstances hadn't occurred.

00:42:29 ◼   ► Doesn't mean that the circumstances are good,

00:42:31 ◼   ► but it is challenging Apple in a way

00:42:34 ◼   ► that I think they're gonna do some interesting stuff.

00:42:36 ◼   ► And I do think that it will have a lasting impact

00:42:38 ◼   ► on what we think of as WWDC,

00:42:40 ◼   ► even if there is a real event in the future

00:42:42 ◼   ► and this doesn't go virtual only,

00:42:45 ◼   ► I think that they're gonna rethink it.

00:42:48 ◼   ► And I think we're never gonna go back to an era

00:42:52 ◼   ► where this event is primarily for participants in person

00:42:57 ◼   ► and only sort of secondarily for everyone else.

00:43:00 ◼   ► I think, I feel like from now on,

00:43:03 ◼   ► they really are going to say,

00:43:05 ◼   ► this is a global event that we beam out

00:43:09 ◼   ► and then maybe there's also a physical event,

00:43:12 ◼   ► but we'll see what they do.

00:43:13 ◼   ► I'm excited to see all the,

00:43:14 ◼   ► we have to throw the old playbook out the window.

00:43:16 ◼   ► We used to know sort of exactly what Apple was gonna do

00:43:18 ◼   ► and really we don't know.

00:43:20 ◼   ► So I'm looking forward to it.

00:43:22 ◼   ► - The one thing that I expect to be different

00:43:24 ◼   ► from whatever is the morning announcement, the keynote,

00:43:27 ◼   ► is I expect that the production values will be much higher

00:43:31 ◼   ► because I just expect things to be produced differently.

00:43:35 ◼   ► Like the little video that they did for the Magic Keyboard

00:43:39 ◼   ► was a very high production value video that Craig did.

00:43:42 ◼   ► I expect stuff like that.

00:43:44 ◼   ► When I say higher production values,

00:43:45 ◼   ► it's like more than a person standing on a stage

00:43:48 ◼   ► with slides behind them.

00:43:49 ◼   ► I think it will be more visual than it typically is.

00:43:55 ◼   ► - Yeah, it wouldn't surprise me

00:43:56 ◼   ► if the whole thing is a prerecorded video extravaganza.

00:44:01 ◼   ► - It is not gonna be live.

00:44:03 ◼   ► Why would you have it live?

00:44:04 ◼   ► You have the advantage of prerecording.

00:44:07 ◼   ► - Yeah, I guess what I'm saying is

00:44:09 ◼   ► you could do it plausibly live.

00:44:12 ◼   ► - Live to tape.

00:44:13 ◼   ► - But I don't think they will.

00:44:14 ◼   ► - No, I don't either.

00:44:15 ◼   ► - I think it will be more like the rollout video

00:44:17 ◼   ► that they did for the iPad Pro and the MacBook Air, right?

00:44:22 ◼   ► Where they were at Apple and having a whole like,

00:44:26 ◼   ► look at this, like here's Craig working on the iPad Pro

00:44:31 ◼   ► with Magic Keyboard somewhere in Apple Park, right?

00:44:34 ◼   ► Like I think it will be more like that.

00:44:37 ◼   ► But you know, there's an argument

00:44:40 ◼   ► about like emulating the Apple keynote style

00:44:43 ◼   ► and I'm sure they've had that discussion,

00:44:46 ◼   ► but is it worth it to make it feel comforting

00:44:50 ◼   ► like an Apple keynote or is it better for them

00:44:53 ◼   ► to just blow the doors off of it

00:44:55 ◼   ► and make it something different?

00:44:56 ◼   ► I don't know.

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00:46:15 ◼   ► So we very briefly spoke about

00:46:18 ◼   ► the 13-inch MacBook Pro last week.

00:46:21 ◼   ► - Right. - And obviously,

00:46:24 ◼   ► the main thing that we spoke about, hooray, keyboard, right?

00:46:26 ◼   ► And we all know that.

00:46:27 ◼   ► You've reviewed them now.

00:46:28 ◼   ► There's no surprises, right?

00:46:30 ◼   ► The keyboard is what we wanted it to be.

00:46:31 ◼   ► It's the one we want, so excellent.

00:46:33 ◼   ► - Yeah, that's the thing about it

00:46:35 ◼   ► that is a killer from a writing perspective,

00:46:39 ◼   ► a reviewing perspective,

00:46:40 ◼   ► is the most important feature by far

00:46:42 ◼   ► is a thing we've already talked about twice, right?

00:46:45 ◼   ► Like it's the 16-inch MacBook Pro keyboard.

00:46:47 ◼   ► We talked about it a lot then.

00:46:49 ◼   ► Talked about it again when the MacBook Air got revised

00:46:51 ◼   ► and now here it is on the 13s.

00:46:53 ◼   ► - I mean, we even spoke about it with the iPad Pro, right?

00:46:55 ◼   ► Like we got the magic keyboard there too, right?

00:46:57 ◼   ► It's the keyboard you know and love, right?

00:46:59 ◼   ► - We know what this keyboard is and now it's everywhere,

00:47:02 ◼   ► but then, okay, fine, but it's a new computer.

00:47:04 ◼   ► What about the rest of it?

00:47:06 ◼   ► And the thing that I emphasized,

00:47:07 ◼   ► and it was really funny to hear other people

00:47:10 ◼   ► talking about the same thing last week,

00:47:12 ◼   ► that it's two of them.

00:47:13 ◼   ► And that's my real question

00:47:15 ◼   ► is there's two 13-inch MacBook Pros.

00:47:17 ◼   ► And we treat them like one and we shouldn't

00:47:20 ◼   ► because for a few years now,

00:47:22 ◼   ► there's really been two models with the same name

00:47:24 ◼   ► and it's the two-port version and the four-port version.

00:47:26 ◼   ► The two-port version used to be the Escape

00:47:28 ◼   ► back when it didn't have a touch bar,

00:47:29 ◼   ► but then it got a touch bar.

00:47:31 ◼   ► So really Apple's always differentiated them

00:47:33 ◼   ► as two versus four Thunderbolt ports.

00:47:37 ◼   ► But the truth is like they did update

00:47:40 ◼   ► the two-port one last year a little bit

00:47:42 ◼   ► to give it sort of the new materials keyboard.

00:47:44 ◼   ► And I think they did a little processor update,

00:47:46 ◼   ► but basically it didn't get touched

00:47:48 ◼   ► other than the keyboard this year.

00:47:50 ◼   ► The four-port one got new processors.

00:47:52 ◼   ► It's still just kind of a speed bump,

00:47:54 ◼   ► but they did get some other spec things.

00:47:58 ◼   ► - Well, the graphics, you know,

00:47:59 ◼   ► like the beta graphics are only in the new one, right?

00:48:03 ◼   ► - It's their Intel embedded graphics.

00:48:05 ◼   ► So it's a function of it being a 10th generation Intel.

00:48:08 ◼   ► It's an isolated processor.

00:48:09 ◼   ► So that's why the graphics are better.

00:48:12 ◼   ► And in fact, the focus of that generation

00:48:15 ◼   ► is improved embedded graphics.

00:48:18 ◼   ► So the graphics support gets a lot faster.

00:48:21 ◼   ► The truth is if you're coming from an old MacBook Pro

00:48:24 ◼   ► with the old keyboard

00:48:25 ◼   ► and you've been holding out all this time,

00:48:27 ◼   ► it's gonna be a huge performance jump regardless

00:48:29 ◼   ► because you're getting a modern computer.

00:48:31 ◼   ► But I have some ongoing questions

00:48:34 ◼   ► about the weirdness of that two-port 13-inch,

00:48:39 ◼   ► which is, it just, it feels a little bit strange to me.

00:48:43 ◼   ► And then there's also the issue

00:48:45 ◼   ► that they didn't do a rethink of the whole product

00:48:47 ◼   ► like they did for the 16-inch MacBook Pro.

00:48:51 ◼   ► And that's, other than the fact

00:48:54 ◼   ► that there were some rumors that they were gonna do that

00:48:56 ◼   ► and it didn't happen,

00:48:57 ◼   ► this is a pretty standard speed bump and that's fine,

00:49:00 ◼   ► but it does make you wonder like the 16-inch

00:49:04 ◼   ► got a whole rethink with smaller bezels and a bigger screen

00:49:07 ◼   ► and the better sound system, input and output.

00:49:11 ◼   ► And the 13-inch didn't, not even the four-port model.

00:49:14 ◼   ► And that's, so those are the two beyond the keyboard,

00:49:18 ◼   ► the two kind of overriding things

00:49:19 ◼   ► that I walked away from my review.

00:49:21 ◼   ► I got the four-port one to review.

00:49:23 ◼   ► So the two-port one, which is fine

00:49:25 ◼   ► 'cause there's nothing but the keyboard

00:49:26 ◼   ► in the two-port one that was different.

00:49:29 ◼   ► But I think it's the last part of this transition.

00:49:34 ◼   ► The fact that they've gotten the butterfly keyboard

00:49:36 ◼   ► out of all their laptops is the big story here.

00:49:40 ◼   ► But I do still think that this is a weird laptop line

00:49:45 ◼   ► for Apple because they've got this low-end 13.

00:49:51 ◼   ► And I was asking the question last week

00:49:55 ◼   ► and I asked it in my review, why does this product exist?

00:49:58 ◼   ► And I know why it exists.

00:49:59 ◼   ► It exists to hit some price points

00:50:00 ◼   ► that Apple doesn't have for other products.

00:50:02 ◼   ► It is more powerful than the Air, not a lot,

00:50:07 ◼   ► but it is more powerful than the Air

00:50:09 ◼   ► and it has a better cooling system.

00:50:10 ◼   ► And there are reasons you would get it.

00:50:11 ◼   ► Although I kept coming back to the thought

00:50:13 ◼   ► that if you really need a Pro, you should probably,

00:50:17 ◼   ► if you can at all afford it, buy the four-port model.

00:50:20 ◼   ► And if you are price averse,

00:50:23 ◼   ► you probably should just buy an Air.

00:50:25 ◼   ► I'm not sure that two-port model is a great buy

00:50:29 ◼   ► because it's last year's processor update

00:50:32 ◼   ► and appreciably less than the four-port model

00:50:37 ◼   ► in so many ways.

00:50:38 ◼   ► And the Air is so good that it's a really narrow window

00:50:42 ◼   ► for that two-port model.

00:50:44 ◼   ► I get why it's there, but it still also feels

00:50:46 ◼   ► like a function of the original sin of the MacBook escape

00:50:49 ◼   ► of like thinking it was the Air replacement

00:50:52 ◼   ► and it really wasn't and then they brought the Air back.

00:50:55 ◼   ► And it feels to me, I don't know about you, Myke,

00:50:57 ◼   ► but it feels to me a little bit like Apple is doing

00:51:00 ◼   ► kind of like the keeping everything going,

00:51:03 ◼   ► but maybe a change is in the offing, right?

00:51:07 ◼   ► Like if the ARM processor rumors are true,

00:51:09 ◼   ► like why revamp your product line now

00:51:13 ◼   ► when you're gonna revamp your product line in a year?

00:51:16 ◼   ► - And I guess, all right, so let me put a pin in that

00:51:19 ◼   ► in a second so I can come back around to it

00:51:20 ◼   ► from what I was gonna say,

00:51:21 ◼   ► which is that the MacBook Pro branding is a mess right now.

00:51:26 ◼   ► It's a mess because there were three laptops

00:51:30 ◼   ► that are very different,

00:51:32 ◼   ► but they're all named MacBook Pro, right?

00:51:34 ◼   ► The 16-inch MacBook Pro may as well be a different computer.

00:51:37 ◼   ► Like it is as different to the other MacBook Pros,

00:51:40 ◼   ► the MacBook Air is to that, right?

00:51:41 ◼   ► Like they are shared things,

00:51:44 ◼   ► but it's got a completely different internal architecture.

00:51:47 ◼   ► It has a bigger screen for its body, right?

00:51:50 ◼   ► Like that is a modern,

00:51:52 ◼   ► that's the most modern laptop that Apple makes,

00:51:54 ◼   ► but then there's another MacBook Pro

00:51:56 ◼   ► and another MacBook Pro,

00:51:58 ◼   ► and they're all different from each other,

00:52:00 ◼   ► and one of them is closer to the MacBook Air.

00:52:02 ◼   ► And so like the MacBook Pro branding is messed up right now.

00:52:05 ◼   ► So, but that comes back to what you were just saying, right?

00:52:08 ◼   ► Like, well, what if there isn't,

00:52:09 ◼   ► well, we know that the ARM transition is coming.

00:52:11 ◼   ► We don't know where it's gonna start sitting, right?

00:52:13 ◼   ► Like what products are going to be affected?

00:52:17 ◼   ► So you start looking at what's available, right?

00:52:19 ◼   ► And you think to yourself, well,

00:52:21 ◼   ► we all come into round to the idea that,

00:52:23 ◼   ► oh, they'll keep the iMac Pro

00:52:24 ◼   ► because the iMac will become ARM, right?

00:52:27 ◼   ► Like that seems like a possibility.

00:52:29 ◼   ► And then there'll be a laptop.

00:52:30 ◼   ► We expect it to be like a MacBook Air, right?

00:52:34 ◼   ► Like a cheaper laptop.

00:52:36 ◼   ► But what if there's a MacBook Pro that's ARM powered

00:52:39 ◼   ► and it's gonna be different to the 16 inch.

00:52:40 ◼   ► And the reason they updated the 16 inch

00:52:43 ◼   ► is because Apple want to have for their pro customers,

00:52:46 ◼   ► their most powerful machines

00:52:48 ◼   ► and architecture they already know.

00:52:49 ◼   ► So the iMac Pro stays Intel, the Mac Pro stays Intel

00:52:53 ◼   ► and the 16 inch MacBook Pro,

00:52:55 ◼   ► which is always gonna be the most powerful one,

00:52:57 ◼   ► stays Intel.

00:52:58 ◼   ► And that's going to be a longer period of time.

00:53:00 ◼   ► But everything else moves to ARM in 2021.

00:53:04 ◼   ► So if that's the case,

00:53:05 ◼   ► don't blow your new designed MacBook Pro 14 inch

00:53:10 ◼   ► on the Intel chip.

00:53:11 ◼   ► Wait and do it on the ARM chip.

00:53:14 ◼   ► Maybe. - Could be.

00:53:15 ◼   ► Could be, but it does feel like

00:53:18 ◼   ► there are too many products that aren't well differentiated.

00:53:22 ◼   ► - There are too many MacBook Pros

00:53:23 ◼   ► and they're all too different and it's a mess, right?

00:53:26 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:53:27 ◼   ► Yeah, I think that's right.

00:53:28 ◼   ► I think that's right.

00:53:29 ◼   ► I do wonder about the MacBook Air

00:53:31 ◼   ► only because it's a very popular computer.

00:53:33 ◼   ► And so you would think that an ARM MacBook Air

00:53:35 ◼   ► would make a lot of sense.

00:53:36 ◼   ► I also watched as Apple tried to kill it and failed

00:53:41 ◼   ► and it came back.

00:53:43 ◼   ► You would think that they could make

00:53:44 ◼   ► a thin light MacBook style, 12 inch MacBook style laptop

00:53:48 ◼   ► on ARM and it would be great.

00:53:50 ◼   ► But that laptop didn't sell so well

00:53:54 ◼   ► and they brought the Air back.

00:53:55 ◼   ► And so I'm not sure they're going to do anything

00:53:59 ◼   ► other than keep the Air around,

00:54:00 ◼   ► whether it's ARM or not. - If I'm,

00:54:02 ◼   ► whoever's in charge of this,

00:54:04 ◼   ► my ARM laptop would be MacBook Air.

00:54:06 ◼   ► Because when Apple make the move to ARM,

00:54:10 ◼   ► this isn't like a test.

00:54:12 ◼   ► This is the future, right?

00:54:14 ◼   ► Like they will go into this and they will go into it hard

00:54:18 ◼   ► because they want to move everyone.

00:54:20 ◼   ► So you put, if you're going to really like put all your chips

00:54:24 ◼   ► on the table, you do it to the MacBook Air

00:54:26 ◼   ► 'cause it's the machine that sells the most,

00:54:28 ◼   ► assumably, right?

00:54:30 ◼   ► I think, I don't know if we noticed,

00:54:31 ◼   ► but we assume, right, that the MacBook Air

00:54:33 ◼   ► is Apple's best selling Mac probably, right?

00:54:36 ◼   ► It's either that or the MacBook,

00:54:37 ◼   ► or like 13 inch MacBook Pro.

00:54:39 ◼   ► But let's just assume amongst their non-pro customers,

00:54:42 ◼   ► people will buy MacBook Airs, lots of them.

00:54:44 ◼   ► Otherwise, why else is that branding sort of existing?

00:54:46 ◼   ► So if you really want to go heavy,

00:54:50 ◼   ► you put the ARM chip in the MacBook Air

00:54:52 ◼   ► because that's the one everyone's going to keep buying.

00:54:54 ◼   ► So then you can convince your Mac developers to say,

00:54:57 ◼   ► well, you know, you really should support our ARM computers

00:55:00 ◼   ► now because the MacBook Air has it.

00:55:03 ◼   ► And you know how many of your customers use that.

00:55:05 ◼   ► So that might be the idea, right?

00:55:07 ◼   ► Like I think it would be not good to have another laptop

00:55:12 ◼   ► that is the ARM laptop.

00:55:13 ◼   ► I think that's just going to make things super confusing

00:55:17 ◼   ► in a way that was proven with the MacBook's existence,

00:55:20 ◼   ► didn't help anything to have like,

00:55:23 ◼   ► here is our fifth laptop option for you.

00:55:26 ◼   ► And this one has a different chip inside

00:55:28 ◼   ► and you shouldn't have to worry about that.

00:55:30 ◼   ► Like, I don't know if that's a good idea.

00:55:33 ◼   ► I could imagine the MacBook,

00:55:34 ◼   ► like look at this new MacBook Air.

00:55:35 ◼   ► It has 20 hours battery life and it's thinner

00:55:39 ◼   ► and it's lighter and it has a nicer screen.

00:55:42 ◼   ► And you know what I mean?

00:55:43 ◼   ► Like I can imagine that kind of thing for it,

00:55:46 ◼   ► but I don't know.

00:55:47 ◼   ► The thing that seems interesting to me,

00:55:50 ◼   ► 'cause again, like I was talking about this last week,

00:55:52 ◼   ► I am trying to work out what laptops will be right

00:55:56 ◼   ► for our family, right?

00:55:57 ◼   ► Like I need a new laptop, I need a new laptop.

00:56:00 ◼   ► We've been waiting until Apple turned over the whole line

00:56:02 ◼   ► before we made our decisions.

00:56:04 ◼   ► So I started pricing things up

00:56:06 ◼   ► and it starts getting really weird

00:56:08 ◼   ► when you start comparing some of these machines spec to spec.

00:56:12 ◼   ► - Yes, I heard you do this on connected a little bit

00:56:14 ◼   ► where you can make a very expensive MacBook Air

00:56:17 ◼   ► at which point it seems weird.

00:56:19 ◼   ► But that's kind of my point though,

00:56:20 ◼   ► is you can make a MacBook Air that's so expensive

00:56:23 ◼   ► that you might as well get the four port base model

00:56:25 ◼   ► of the 13 inch MacBook Pro.

00:56:29 ◼   ► But that's kind of my point is,

00:56:31 ◼   ► but there's also another laptop in between those two.

00:56:34 ◼   ► That's weird.

00:56:35 ◼   ► But yeah, you're right.

00:56:36 ◼   ► It's kind of all over the place

00:56:39 ◼   ► and you've got to make some decisions.

00:56:40 ◼   ► And somebody might choose the two port model of the 13 inch

00:56:45 ◼   ► for good reasons, but I look at it and I think

00:56:48 ◼   ► that's a pretty narrow window

00:56:50 ◼   ► and you probably need to either firmly commit

00:56:53 ◼   ► to the high end or you need to just say,

00:56:56 ◼   ► the MacBook Air.

00:56:57 ◼   ► 'Cause I had a couple of people on Twitter last week say,

00:56:59 ◼   ► well, yeah, but you use the MacBook Air for video editing

00:57:01 ◼   ► or audio editing and or developing

00:57:05 ◼   ► and it's low powered and the fans have to run

00:57:08 ◼   ► and can't take it.

00:57:09 ◼   ► And like I've edited video,

00:57:12 ◼   ► I've edited a 4K video on a MacBook Air.

00:57:15 ◼   ► I've edited podcasts on MacBook Air.

00:57:16 ◼   ► - I have edited 1080p video on a MacBook, 12 inch MacBook.

00:57:20 ◼   ► You know, it can be done.

00:57:21 ◼   ► - So I think there are probably cases

00:57:24 ◼   ► where the MacBook Air is inappropriate.

00:57:27 ◼   ► That's why they make Pro laptops.

00:57:29 ◼   ► But the MacBook Air, the current 2020 MacBook Air

00:57:33 ◼   ► is very capable.

00:57:34 ◼   ► It's a very capable machine.

00:57:35 ◼   ► So I think you downgraded at your peril

00:57:38 ◼   ► to say that people who are even doing things like editing,

00:57:42 ◼   ► video and audio can't use it.

00:57:44 ◼   ► So I think it's a very capable computer

00:57:47 ◼   ► at which point if you need more than that,

00:57:49 ◼   ► you probably should shell out for the 4Port 13.

00:57:53 ◼   ► I like your theory by the way.

00:57:55 ◼   ► I keep thinking about the MacBook, the 12 inch MacBook

00:57:58 ◼   ► and wonder if there isn't room in the arm laptop line

00:58:02 ◼   ► for a tiny fanless laptop.

00:58:04 ◼   ► Although at this point, given what happened before,

00:58:06 ◼   ► I don't know, maybe you call that the 12 inch MacBook Air

00:58:10 ◼   ► or something like that and like pair it

00:58:13 ◼   ► and have two MacBook Airs and two MacBook Pros

00:58:15 ◼   ► or something like that.

00:58:16 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:58:16 ◼   ► I mean, this is why the people at Apple,

00:58:20 ◼   ► this is why they get paid pretty well

00:58:22 ◼   ► is these are hard decisions to navigate

00:58:25 ◼   ► what the products are and at what price points.

00:58:27 ◼   ► And you can see what happens

00:58:28 ◼   ► when you get something a little bit wrong

00:58:30 ◼   ► because I think that's why that 2Port MacBook Pro exists

00:58:32 ◼   ► is that they kind of made a mistake

00:58:34 ◼   ► and are still paying for it.

00:58:37 ◼   ► - Yeah, and it's like they doubled down on it in weird ways

00:58:39 ◼   ► like giving it the touch bar.

00:58:41 ◼   ► Which is super strange.

00:58:43 ◼   ► Like you made the computer more expensive

00:58:46 ◼   ► and made it harder to differentiate from the others

00:58:50 ◼   ► and gave it a feature that Apple

00:58:54 ◼   ► does not seem to believe in enough.

00:58:56 ◼   ► - So this is another thing that I ranted about on this show.

00:59:00 ◼   ► I remember it so you can go back and listen to,

00:59:02 ◼   ► I don't know, was that one maybe when the 16

00:59:04 ◼   ► or maybe it was last summer

00:59:05 ◼   ► but I've done a touch bar rant before

00:59:08 ◼   ► but every time I get one of these,

00:59:09 ◼   ► so I don't own a computer with a touch bar.

00:59:11 ◼   ► We got a lot of MacBook Airs in this house.

00:59:13 ◼   ► I don't own a computer with a touch bar.

00:59:15 ◼   ► So every time I get a review unit from Apple,

00:59:18 ◼   ► I do one of those let's check in on the touch bar.

00:59:20 ◼   ► And it's never any different

00:59:23 ◼   ► because over the course of all this time

00:59:26 ◼   ► since they introduced the touch bar,

00:59:28 ◼   ► which was years ago now, multiple revisions of macOS,

00:59:33 ◼   ► they've done nothing to improve it.

00:59:35 ◼   ► There are a couple of minor changes

00:59:37 ◼   ► that you would not even notice

00:59:39 ◼   ► if you came forward in time from when they introduced it.

00:59:42 ◼   ► It's basically they've done nothing.

00:59:44 ◼   ► And to your point, it is a little bit baffling

00:59:46 ◼   ► about doubling down like,

00:59:47 ◼   ► no, we added the touch bar to this model too

00:59:50 ◼   ► when Apple is acting like it's confident about the touch bar

00:59:54 ◼   ► and yet has apparently given no real software backing to it.

00:59:58 ◼   ► And I know that there are things like that are touch tool.

01:00:01 ◼   ► There are tools that you can kind of use to hack

01:00:04 ◼   ► the touch bar to make it more useful.

01:00:05 ◼   ► But every time I get a touch bar laptop,

01:00:07 ◼   ► I am shocked at how poorly Apple software supports it.

01:00:12 ◼   ► Like there's no third-party access to the control strip.

01:00:15 ◼   ► You can't do sort of global stuff.

01:00:17 ◼   ► The limit, there are obviously developer limitations.

01:00:20 ◼   ► There are some great examples of the touch bar fully formed,

01:00:24 ◼   ► but a lot of apps just don't have

01:00:27 ◼   ► any proper touch bar support.

01:00:29 ◼   ► BB Edit is the one that I was playing with,

01:00:31 ◼   ► my favorite Mac app basically.

01:00:33 ◼   ► And it's got three touch bar buttons in its editor

01:00:36 ◼   ► and they're to show the sidebar,

01:00:38 ◼   ► which I hate and I keep closed

01:00:40 ◼   ► and to move between items in the sidebar.

01:00:41 ◼   ► It's like, there's no way for me to add my scripts on there,

01:00:46 ◼   ► my filters for me to do it.

01:00:47 ◼   ► Like I can't do anything with it.

01:00:49 ◼   ► And yes, that is to a certain degree on bare bones software

01:00:52 ◼   ► for not doing it.

01:00:53 ◼   ► But also like if you were them,

01:00:56 ◼   ► would you prioritize the touch bar?

01:00:58 ◼   ► I mean, there's a chicken and egg thing happening there too.

01:01:01 ◼   ► But if I could have keyboard maestro

01:01:05 ◼   ► with direct access to the touch bar

01:01:06 ◼   ► and program it to do stuff in a certain way,

01:01:09 ◼   ► that would be different, but it doesn't work.

01:01:11 ◼   ► And the third-party stuff like Better Touch Tool

01:01:14 ◼   ► is hacky enough that it works,

01:01:17 ◼   ► but like they're working hard

01:01:19 ◼   ► to work around Apple's limitations

01:01:21 ◼   ► because Apple's done nothing.

01:01:22 ◼   ► There's my mini touch bar rant.

01:01:24 ◼   ► Every time I get one of these touch bars in my house,

01:01:26 ◼   ► I use it thinking I'm gonna find something different

01:01:30 ◼   ► and I never ever find anything different,

01:01:32 ◼   ► which I think makes me ask the question,

01:01:36 ◼   ► is it really a dead product?

01:01:40 ◼   ► Is it really a dead product?

01:01:42 ◼   ► And they couldn't walk away from it.

01:01:43 ◼   ► - No, I don't see how you could.

01:01:46 ◼   ► - I know you're a believer in this.

01:01:47 ◼   ► Well, they could-

01:01:48 ◼   ► - No, it's not even about my own opinions on it.

01:01:50 ◼   ► Like I think it would be really difficult

01:01:52 ◼   ► to add a little screen to a keyboard

01:01:55 ◼   ► and then in the next revision, replace it with keys again.

01:02:00 ◼   ► - What if it was a whole new product

01:02:01 ◼   ► 'cause you were doing a processor transition

01:02:04 ◼   ► and you kept it on the high-end laptop

01:02:06 ◼   ► that's gonna stay on Intel and stay around for a while?

01:02:08 ◼   ► - Maybe.

01:02:09 ◼   ► I mean, I just don't know how-

01:02:13 ◼   ► - I'm not advocating for killing the touch bar by the way,

01:02:17 ◼   ► but I am advocating for Apple, if it's going to have it,

01:02:21 ◼   ► it needs to like put effort into it.

01:02:24 ◼   ► - I agree with that.

01:02:24 ◼   ► Right, there should be more there.

01:02:26 ◼   ► It feels like for me, the touch bar is really loved

01:02:30 ◼   ► by the hardware team because it was something

01:02:33 ◼   ► that maybe it was really hard to do.

01:02:35 ◼   ► And so they put it on all the hardware

01:02:37 ◼   ► they can conceivably put it on,

01:02:39 ◼   ► but the operating system team doesn't care about it.

01:02:42 ◼   ► - Yeah, they did the obligatory amount to get it launched

01:02:44 ◼   ► and then they've let it sit there by the side of the road.

01:02:46 ◼   ► And it's like, again, I rarely see this level of dysfunction

01:02:53 ◼   ► from Apple where like from the outside, you can say,

01:02:56 ◼   ► "It seems clear that you don't have alignment

01:02:59 ◼   ► in your teams about this product."

01:03:02 ◼   ► Like you literally, one group is really hot on this feature

01:03:06 ◼   ► and the other group doesn't wanna have anything to do

01:03:07 ◼   ► with it and everybody can tell because they've done nothing.

01:03:11 ◼   ► They've made no effort.

01:03:12 ◼   ► It's either that or they've decided internally

01:03:16 ◼   ► that it's a failure and they're gonna kill it

01:03:18 ◼   ► as soon as they can, as soon as the pride permits them

01:03:21 ◼   ► to kill it and in the meantime,

01:03:23 ◼   ► they're not gonna put any effort into it.

01:03:24 ◼   ► It's one of those two things.

01:03:26 ◼   ► Either it's a badly managed product

01:03:28 ◼   ► where some part of Apple just doesn't wanna do the work.

01:03:31 ◼   ► There are more important things to do.

01:03:34 ◼   ► Or I guess, or they're deluded and they think

01:03:36 ◼   ► that there's literally nothing they could ever add to it

01:03:38 ◼   ► to make it any better, which is totally wrong.

01:03:40 ◼   ► Or they've decided it's a loser

01:03:42 ◼   ► and they're not gonna waste their time on it

01:03:44 ◼   ► and they're gonna get rid of it as soon as they can.

01:03:45 ◼   ► But it's so frustrating every time I see it

01:03:47 ◼   ► 'cause it's a cool idea and I'm not opposed to it in general

01:03:51 ◼   ► and yet in specific, when I try to use it,

01:03:54 ◼   ► it doesn't do anything I want it to do

01:03:57 ◼   ► and I can't edit it to make it do something I wanna do

01:04:00 ◼   ► because that's not possible.

01:04:03 ◼   ► - I was listening to Dithering,

01:04:06 ◼   ► which is Ben Thompson and John Gruber's new show,

01:04:08 ◼   ► which I really enjoy and they were talking about this

01:04:10 ◼   ► and they were actually praising your review.

01:04:12 ◼   ► And one of the things that John was saying

01:04:16 ◼   ► was comparing the touch bar to the introduction

01:04:20 ◼   ► of the iPhone in the sense of there's no buttons

01:04:23 ◼   ► on the iPhone because if you have a,

01:04:26 ◼   ► you can't ship a new button.

01:04:27 ◼   ► That was Steve Jobs' idea, right?

01:04:29 ◼   ► Once you put the buttons on the phone

01:04:31 ◼   ► and the phone is in people's hands,

01:04:32 ◼   ► you wanna change something in the software,

01:04:34 ◼   ► you can't send them a new button to do something new.

01:04:37 ◼   ► So they decided to have a complete touchscreen

01:04:40 ◼   ► so the buttons are all software,

01:04:41 ◼   ► you can do whatever they want with them.

01:04:43 ◼   ► That idea should make the touch bar a great thing, right?

01:04:49 ◼   ► Like you can't ship new buttons to a laptop.

01:04:53 ◼   ► The buttons are already there, but you got a screen,

01:04:55 ◼   ► you can put any button you want.

01:04:57 ◼   ► It could be any interaction message you want.

01:04:59 ◼   ► That's the promise of the touch bar,

01:05:02 ◼   ► but it feels like it hasn't been realized yet.

01:05:06 ◼   ► And what I have used, I enjoy it from a basic level,

01:05:11 ◼   ► but also I want more because I like it, right?

01:05:15 ◼   ► Like I want there to be more in it

01:05:17 ◼   ► because if we've made it work with iOS, right?

01:05:21 ◼   ► With like buttons, then you can make it work

01:05:24 ◼   ► with the touch bar.

01:05:25 ◼   ► There can be more there, it just has yet to be seen.

01:05:30 ◼   ► But I liked the comparison of the original iPhone there,

01:05:33 ◼   ► right, like you make more with having a screen.

01:05:37 ◼   ► The buttons can be anything, they can change.

01:05:39 ◼   ► They can change in the next software update.

01:05:42 ◼   ► You can do whatever you want.

01:05:43 ◼   ► You have more functionality to your software

01:05:46 ◼   ► that wasn't there when the computer shipped.

01:05:48 ◼   ► Well, now that doesn't matter

01:05:50 ◼   ► because you can do whatever you want with it, right?

01:05:52 ◼   ► Like it's available to you, so.

01:05:54 ◼   ► - And things that are key proxies

01:05:57 ◼   ► and things that are not at all key proxies

01:05:58 ◼   ► that are whole little UIs on there,

01:06:00 ◼   ► like they've done in Logic and Final Cut and all that.

01:06:02 ◼   ► Now that's fine, and we can debate the finer points

01:06:06 ◼   ► of like do those interfaces work

01:06:08 ◼   ► and is that the right place for it

01:06:09 ◼   ► and it shouldn't even be there.

01:06:10 ◼   ► But if we accept the idea that the touch bar

01:06:14 ◼   ► is an interesting interface element

01:06:16 ◼   ► replacing a bunch of keys that aren't that interesting,

01:06:20 ◼   ► why has it not evolved?

01:06:24 ◼   ► I mean, Mac OS, every time they do an update,

01:06:26 ◼   ► there's a hundred new features, a thousand new features

01:06:29 ◼   ► about this and that thing,

01:06:30 ◼   ► and they tweak this and they tweak that.

01:06:31 ◼   ► They have this brand new interface element.

01:06:34 ◼   ► Anyway, you know, I've said it before.

01:06:36 ◼   ► It really disappoints me, it baffles me.

01:06:39 ◼   ► I want to like the touch bar more than I do,

01:06:42 ◼   ► and it's not because I've decided I hate the touch bar.

01:06:45 ◼   ► It's that every time I bring one of these in,

01:06:48 ◼   ► it's an opportunity to see it anew

01:06:51 ◼   ► because I don't live with a touch bar on a Mac in my house.

01:06:55 ◼   ► And then I'm immediately reminded that it hasn't changed

01:06:59 ◼   ► and is just disappointing,

01:07:00 ◼   ► and there's nothing I can do to make it better

01:07:01 ◼   ► because it's not customizable in any real way.

01:07:05 ◼   ► And yeah, anyway, it's a mystery.

01:07:09 ◼   ► And among mysteries, the big point is

01:07:13 ◼   ► that all the butterfly keyboards are gone, right?

01:07:15 ◼   ► Like that is, we can talk about all these other issues

01:07:18 ◼   ► because the truth is we've said all we can say

01:07:21 ◼   ► about the keyboard.

01:07:22 ◼   ► They fixed the keyboard.

01:07:22 ◼   ► This is a much better keyboard on this laptop.

01:07:24 ◼   ► If you've been waiting five years for a 13-inch laptop,

01:07:27 ◼   ► a 13-inch MacBook Pro, go buy it.

01:07:29 ◼   ► It's here for you now.

01:07:31 ◼   ► It's just all the details that make me wonder.

01:07:33 ◼   ► - This is the MacBook Pro you wanted

01:07:34 ◼   ► but couldn't get for a few years, right?

01:07:36 ◼   ► - Yeah, I would wager there are lots of people out there

01:07:39 ◼   ► with like 2015 MacBook Pros who have been waiting

01:07:41 ◼   ► and waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting

01:07:45 ◼   ► for the butterfly keyboard to go away

01:07:47 ◼   ► so they could buy another one.

01:07:48 ◼   ► And they probably already purchased these, right?

01:07:50 ◼   ► They probably already have.

01:07:51 ◼   ► But that is the number one thing that is going on here.

01:07:56 ◼   ► And it's a good thing.

01:07:57 ◼   ► - I have an Ask Upgrade question,

01:08:00 ◼   ► which is just building on this a little bit.

01:08:04 ◼   ► So we'll kind of finalize our thoughts

01:08:06 ◼   ► on whether or not you should buy this

01:08:09 ◼   ► and from what avenue coming from after this break

01:08:12 ◼   ► where we thank our final sponsor,

01:08:14 ◼   ► which is our friends over at Smile.

01:08:15 ◼   ► And I wanna tell you about PDF Pen.

01:08:17 ◼   ► PDF Pen 12 is the ultimate tool

01:08:20 ◼   ► for editing PDFs on the Mac.

01:08:21 ◼   ► It is a new version that adds tons of wonderful new features

01:08:25 ◼   ► like allowing you to optimize your PDFs

01:08:27 ◼   ► to get smaller file sizes

01:08:28 ◼   ► of customizable image compression settings,

01:08:31 ◼   ► plus built-in DocuSign support for digitally signing PDFs,

01:08:36 ◼   ► which is amazing.

01:08:38 ◼   ► And the magnifier window lets you magnify

01:08:41 ◼   ► any part of a document independently

01:08:43 ◼   ► at the document's zoom level

01:08:44 ◼   ► as well as another great new feature.

01:08:46 ◼   ► PDF Pen supports Apple Script

01:08:48 ◼   ► so you can automate actions on the Mac.

01:08:50 ◼   ► And it's fully supported with macOS Catalina.

01:08:53 ◼   ► And PDF Pen for iPad and iPhone

01:08:55 ◼   ► supports iOS 13 and the Apple Pencil.

01:08:58 ◼   ► I personally love doing that.

01:08:59 ◼   ► I also find PDF Pen really useful on my iPhone.

01:09:03 ◼   ► I sign contracts on my iPhone.

01:09:04 ◼   ► Like I'm busy, I've just got my phone with me,

01:09:08 ◼   ► someone needs me to sign something,

01:09:09 ◼   ► I could just open it up with PDF Pen.

01:09:11 ◼   ► One of the things I actually really like,

01:09:13 ◼   ► I was talking to my friend Federico Fattucci

01:09:15 ◼   ► about this today 'cause he was mentioning an app

01:09:17 ◼   ► that he wish supported a feature that PDF Pen does,

01:09:19 ◼   ► which is in iOS, it's called Open in Place.

01:09:23 ◼   ► So this is the idea of being able to edit a document

01:09:26 ◼   ► without creating a new version of it.

01:09:28 ◼   ► And this is something that a lot of apps

01:09:30 ◼   ► do not support very well on iOS, but PDF Pen does.

01:09:34 ◼   ► So I can open, I can use PDF Pen,

01:09:36 ◼   ► I can open a PDF that is in Dropbox on my iOS devices

01:09:41 ◼   ► and sign it and it just gets saved to the file.

01:09:45 ◼   ► It doesn't create a duplicate file that I have to override.

01:09:47 ◼   ► So I really like that about PDF Pen.

01:09:49 ◼   ► It's just like a little thing, which they added,

01:09:52 ◼   ► but to people that use this stuff a lot,

01:09:54 ◼   ► makes a big difference.

01:09:55 ◼   ► But anyway, the big new release is PDF Pen 12 for the Mac.

01:09:58 ◼   ► Go to smallsoftware.com/podcast right now.

01:10:01 ◼   ► If you do any work with PDFs, you should check out PDF Pen.

01:10:04 ◼   ► Our thanks to PDF Pen from Smile for their support

01:10:07 ◼   ► of this show and Relay FM.

01:10:08 ◼   ► So Jason, beginning our #askupgradequestions today

01:10:13 ◼   ► is a question from David.

01:10:15 ◼   ► David says, "I have a 2013 13-inch MacBook Pro.

01:10:18 ◼   ► It's old, but I was determined

01:10:20 ◼   ► that I would skip the butterfly keyboard."

01:10:22 ◼   ► Congratulations, David, you did that.

01:10:24 ◼   ► Now finally, I can replace it,

01:10:26 ◼   ► except maybe I wanna wait a little bit longer

01:10:28 ◼   ► for a possible 14-inch update.

01:10:30 ◼   ► Maybe we have an ARM processor.

01:10:32 ◼   ► Should I wait or pull the trigger?

01:10:35 ◼   ► - Part of me wants to say you've waited this long.

01:10:37 ◼   ► You can wait forever.

01:10:39 ◼   ► The other part of me says, no, you've done your work.

01:10:41 ◼   ► You've done more than your work.

01:10:43 ◼   ► I would not wait.

01:10:48 ◼   ► I would not have waited this long, quite frankly,

01:10:51 ◼   ► but I would not wait any longer.

01:10:52 ◼   ► - Yeah, I think it's time.

01:10:53 ◼   ► - You can wait forever.

01:10:54 ◼   ► - Yes. - You can wait forever.

01:10:55 ◼   ► The big gating issue, which was the keyboard,

01:10:57 ◼   ► is gone for you now, so I would just do it.

01:10:59 ◼   ► There will always be new stuff in the future

01:11:01 ◼   ► that will be better than what you're currently buying,

01:11:03 ◼   ► and you could wait forever.

01:11:04 ◼   ► So I'd say you've reached your reward now.

01:11:08 ◼   ► Your seven years in the wilderness is over.

01:11:11 ◼   ► - 'Cause it's like, yeah,

01:11:12 ◼   ► they will be ARM laptops at some point,

01:11:14 ◼   ► but you don't know about the potential downsides

01:11:17 ◼   ► of them right now.

01:11:18 ◼   ► So don't wait for something that is really unknown.

01:11:21 ◼   ► So that would be my thinking,

01:11:24 ◼   ► because if it takes another year,

01:11:26 ◼   ► well, now you're using a 2013 laptop in 2021, right?

01:11:31 ◼   ► - Yeah, no. - It's just like,

01:11:32 ◼   ► you know, that's just gonna keep getting worse

01:11:33 ◼   ► and worse for you.

01:11:34 ◼   ► And as Jason mentioned,

01:11:37 ◼   ► if you have something like a 2013 MacBook Pro,

01:11:40 ◼   ► and you move to a 2020 MacBook Pro,

01:11:43 ◼   ► either of those are gonna feel amazing, right?

01:11:46 ◼   ► Like, especially if you go for the correct one, right,

01:11:49 ◼   ► which is the four port,

01:11:50 ◼   ► you're gonna have a whale of a time.

01:11:52 ◼   ► Like, you're gonna be great over there.

01:11:54 ◼   ► It's gonna be amazing.

01:11:55 ◼   ► So I think now's the time.

01:11:57 ◼   ► You're probably good to move.

01:12:00 ◼   ► Piano Junkie asks, probably a fan of pianos

01:12:03 ◼   ► would be my expectation.

01:12:05 ◼   ► Have either of you guys had problems with your AirPods Pro?

01:12:08 ◼   ► Both the right and left of my AirPods

01:12:10 ◼   ► have been replaced by Apple about six weeks apart

01:12:13 ◼   ► due to a rattling sound when any movement is present.

01:12:16 ◼   ► Curious if anybody else has had this problem.

01:12:18 ◼   ► I wanna talk about this, Jason,

01:12:19 ◼   ► 'cause I'm sure like me,

01:12:20 ◼   ► you've had many people contact you and say,

01:12:22 ◼   ► "Why aren't you talking about this?"

01:12:23 ◼   ► - Of course, they usually send a tweet

01:12:25 ◼   ► and they include me and Gruber and Rene Ritchie

01:12:28 ◼   ► and often Marco Arment all in a big group,

01:12:30 ◼   ► like CC, everyone, why aren't you talking about my problem?

01:12:33 ◼   ► That happens a lot. - I'm on those tweets too.

01:12:34 ◼   ► - That's what I'm saying.

01:12:36 ◼   ► Oh good, enjoy.

01:12:38 ◼   ► - I wanted to talk about this

01:12:39 ◼   ► 'cause it does seem to be a widespread problem,

01:12:42 ◼   ► but I don't even know what a rattling sound

01:12:45 ◼   ► in my AirPods Pro would be.

01:12:47 ◼   ► - It may be that there's like a little thing in there

01:12:53 ◼   ► that can come detach and all that.

01:12:55 ◼   ► It sounds like this is a problem with a,

01:12:58 ◼   ► widespread is, what does that mean?

01:13:00 ◼   ► It sounds like this is a problem with some AirPods Pro

01:13:03 ◼   ► and you report it and Apple gives you a new one.

01:13:06 ◼   ► - Yeah, when I say widespread,

01:13:09 ◼   ► it is a problem enough

01:13:11 ◼   ► that Apple have made a support document for it.

01:13:13 ◼   ► So it isn't just like a very small thing,

01:13:15 ◼   ► like it's happening enough

01:13:16 ◼   ► that they have created some steps that you should take.

01:13:20 ◼   ► And it seems to be that the problem

01:13:22 ◼   ► is mostly with noise cancellation.

01:13:25 ◼   ► Now I use noise cancellation on my AirPods Pro all the time,

01:13:28 ◼   ► so I've not had this issue. - Yeah, me too.

01:13:30 ◼   ► - One thing I have had recently

01:13:32 ◼   ► is Bluetooth connection problems with my iPad Pro.

01:13:35 ◼   ► So when I'm using them connected to my iPad Pro,

01:13:37 ◼   ► I can hear that like, I can't explain it,

01:13:41 ◼   ► it's not rattling, but it's like pops, right?

01:13:43 ◼   ► And I know that's a connection problem.

01:13:45 ◼   ► This is only happening when I'm using my Logitech mouse,

01:13:47 ◼   ► which makes sense because there is a warning

01:13:49 ◼   ► in the Bluetooth settings that say quote,

01:13:51 ◼   ► "Using the Air Max Ergo,"

01:13:52 ◼   ► which is a Logitech mouse that I use,

01:13:53 ◼   ► "may affect WiFi and Bluetooth connectivity."

01:13:55 ◼   ► So that is happening, right?

01:13:57 ◼   ► But I'm not gonna write to Apple support on that

01:14:01 ◼   ► because they've already told me it's a problem.

01:14:03 ◼   ► And if I can then connect my AirPods to my iPhone instead,

01:14:06 ◼   ► I don't have this problem.

01:14:07 ◼   ► So like there is an issue about mouse there,

01:14:09 ◼   ► like whatever, I like using the mouse.

01:14:11 ◼   ► If the problem also persists,

01:14:12 ◼   ► I could just turn off the mouse and use the trackpad.

01:14:14 ◼   ► - But I mean, the bottom line is

01:14:16 ◼   ► if you have a physical problem with your AirPods,

01:14:18 ◼   ► you should contact Apple and talk to them about it.

01:14:20 ◼   ► And I guess we could write stories saying some,

01:14:25 ◼   ► it's the usual thing.

01:14:29 ◼   ► I've talked about it here before.

01:14:30 ◼   ► It's very hard to get a sense of whether,

01:14:32 ◼   ► if you make millions of something,

01:14:34 ◼   ► some of them are gonna be bad.

01:14:35 ◼   ► And the question is, is it 0.1%, 0.01%, 1%, 10%, 50%?

01:14:40 ◼   ► We don't know.

01:14:45 ◼   ► But the thing is if it's a flaw,

01:14:47 ◼   ► and I'd say contact Apple support

01:14:50 ◼   ► because like some products are gonna be flawed

01:14:52 ◼   ► and presumably if it's a physical flaw,

01:14:54 ◼   ► they will send you new ones.

01:14:56 ◼   ► And if it's a software problem,

01:14:57 ◼   ► maybe they're working on it.

01:14:59 ◼   ► I haven't seen any reports that Apple says

01:15:02 ◼   ► it's not a problem and is ignoring it,

01:15:04 ◼   ► which would put my attention more to it.

01:15:08 ◼   ► Like all these people are having problems with AirPods

01:15:10 ◼   ► and Apple denies that it's a problem,

01:15:12 ◼   ► but that doesn't seem to be what's happening.

01:15:13 ◼   ► I haven't seen anything like this.

01:15:15 ◼   ► I did have my AirPods completely cease to function.

01:15:20 ◼   ► This week.

01:15:21 ◼   ► And it looked like they were out of battery

01:15:24 ◼   ► and they wouldn't charge.

01:15:26 ◼   ► So I ended up plugging them in to,

01:15:29 ◼   ► they wouldn't charge wirelessly.

01:15:32 ◼   ► So I ended up plugging them in directly,

01:15:33 ◼   ► holding down the button, doing the restart,

01:15:37 ◼   ► the complete reset thing.

01:15:39 ◼   ► I did that twice.

01:15:40 ◼   ► And then when they came back,

01:15:41 ◼   ► it came back with the battery at 0% on the case

01:15:48 ◼   ► and on one of the AirPods, but not the other one.

01:15:51 ◼   ► And then they repaired and they charged

01:15:54 ◼   ► and then they were fine.

01:15:56 ◼   ► But that was a weird thing that I experienced

01:15:58 ◼   ► where it just got really confused

01:16:01 ◼   ► and the battery wasn't dead or shouldn't have been dead.

01:16:04 ◼   ► I think something very strange happened

01:16:05 ◼   ► and it went out of control and it discharged and it was bad.

01:16:07 ◼   ► But I haven't heard the rattling problem,

01:16:09 ◼   ► but it sounds like some people have

01:16:12 ◼   ► and Apple support is the place to do this

01:16:15 ◼   ► because if this is a physical problem,

01:16:16 ◼   ► I'm very confident that they will replace your earbuds.

01:16:20 ◼   ► - With the stuff, I think it's very clear

01:16:23 ◼   ► that we tend to talk from our personal experience.

01:16:26 ◼   ► And it's very hard to talk about a thing that has happened

01:16:29 ◼   ► or is happening if it hasn't happened to me.

01:16:31 ◼   ► I don't know what a rattling sound is.

01:16:34 ◼   ► - And again, if 40, 'cause when these things happen,

01:16:38 ◼   ► I'm not saying this in particular,

01:16:40 ◼   ► but when stuff like this happens,

01:16:42 ◼   ► they will always point you at a bunch of Apple support

01:16:45 ◼   ► forum posts and say, "See, this is a huge problem."

01:16:48 ◼   ► And they'll link to like four threads

01:16:50 ◼   ► where eight people said that they have the problem.

01:16:53 ◼   ► It's like, I can't tell if it's these eight people

01:16:57 ◼   ► or 80 people or 8,000 people or 80,000 people.

01:17:00 ◼   ► There's no way to tell.

01:17:02 ◼   ► The internet doesn't let us do that.

01:17:03 ◼   ► So it's very hard because you could write a story,

01:17:06 ◼   ► I'm sure some site does write a story

01:17:08 ◼   ► about every single one of these,

01:17:09 ◼   ► but it's hard to tell.

01:17:12 ◼   ► And in this case, it's a potential hardware problem

01:17:16 ◼   ► on a product that's so new that if you have a problem

01:17:20 ◼   ► with it, the manufacturer, which is Apple, is gonna fix it

01:17:23 ◼   ► because this is a new product and it has a physical problem

01:17:26 ◼   ► in some small percentage, presumably, of these.

01:17:30 ◼   ► So yeah, there it is.

01:17:32 ◼   ► - All right, our next question comes from Holmes.

01:17:36 ◼   ► While sleep tracking for Apple Watch

01:17:38 ◼   ► has been heavily rumored, do you think that if it will

01:17:41 ◼   ► materialize as an announced feature for watchOS 7

01:17:44 ◼   ► for all watches or an exclusive feature

01:17:47 ◼   ► for the Series 6 watch?

01:17:49 ◼   ► - Depends on the hardware, right?

01:17:52 ◼   ► - I think it's gonna be a watch Series 6 thing.

01:17:54 ◼   ► - Well, I mean, this is like the always on

01:18:00 ◼   ► where the question is, is it special hardware

01:18:03 ◼   ► that enables it or is it really just the battery life

01:18:06 ◼   ► pushing it across the finish line?

01:18:08 ◼   ► 'Cause I feel like Series 5 could probably do this

01:18:13 ◼   ► in terms of battery life, but it may be that they've got

01:18:15 ◼   ► some special features in the Series 6 hardware

01:18:17 ◼   ► that enable it to get through the night.

01:18:21 ◼   ► And for me, I think it comes down to that.

01:18:25 ◼   ► I don't think Apple, Apple might withhold this feature,

01:18:28 ◼   ► but more likely what happens is this feature

01:18:30 ◼   ► has been crafted for the hardware, right?

01:18:31 ◼   ► Like it is more likely that Apple has built the feature

01:18:35 ◼   ► with the hardware in mind and the hardware

01:18:37 ◼   ► with the feature in mind than it is that it's just

01:18:39 ◼   ► a software thing that they didn't get to

01:18:41 ◼   ► that now they've gotten to.

01:18:43 ◼   ► Because you could do either one,

01:18:45 ◼   ► and that's why I'm not putting out the possibility

01:18:48 ◼   ► that they'll say, yeah, Series 5 can really do this too.

01:18:50 ◼   ► So we put it in both of them.

01:18:52 ◼   ► But it may be that the reason Series 5 doesn't do this

01:18:55 ◼   ► is not that they hadn't gotten around to it.

01:18:58 ◼   ► It's that they weren't satisfied with the performance

01:19:01 ◼   ► of sleep tracking on the Series 5,

01:19:02 ◼   ► and they made changes in Series 6

01:19:04 ◼   ► so that they could launch that feature.

01:19:06 ◼   ► And if that's true, then it will be limited to Series 6.

01:19:10 ◼   ► - Yeah, I agree with you, but I also do feel that

01:19:13 ◼   ► at a certain point you need to come up with new features

01:19:16 ◼   ► to sell watches, and so sometimes you might wanna

01:19:18 ◼   ► just restrict the software feature to it,

01:19:20 ◼   ► even if technically another watch could do it.

01:19:22 ◼   ► - Yeah, it's funny.

01:19:25 ◼   ► Really, it's features like this and it's sensors, right?

01:19:28 ◼   ► 'Cause like the Series 5 really only had the difference

01:19:33 ◼   ► of the always on, but that was such a huge feature

01:19:36 ◼   ► that that was a big differentiator.

01:19:38 ◼   ► How do you sell a Series 6 watch?

01:19:39 ◼   ► And I think you're right.

01:19:41 ◼   ► You have to say now with sleep tracking

01:19:43 ◼   ► or now with this new sensor.

01:19:46 ◼   ► - Like there has to be a thing,

01:19:48 ◼   ► and maybe like this is the thing.

01:19:51 ◼   ► I would actually like to file a complaint at this point

01:19:53 ◼   ► about the always on watch face.

01:19:56 ◼   ► - Yes.

01:19:57 ◼   ► - Defaults to that like digital, basic digital face

01:20:01 ◼   ► when you have an app open far too quickly.

01:20:04 ◼   ► So like I've been using a workout app,

01:20:06 ◼   ► like a third party app, but it's got like a remote

01:20:09 ◼   ► for moving through the exercises,

01:20:12 ◼   ► and I so often have to tap it and then tap it again.

01:20:16 ◼   ► - Well, that's annoying.

01:20:17 ◼   ► - So I feel like it's not,

01:20:18 ◼   ► you know, I'm not getting the promise

01:20:21 ◼   ► of the always on face.

01:20:22 ◼   ► Like I think they need to do something

01:20:24 ◼   ► for third party developers to be able to kind of have--

01:20:27 ◼   ► - For sure.

01:20:28 ◼   ► - Not an always on face, but like an always on app

01:20:31 ◼   ► that like it's always ready.

01:20:32 ◼   ► - Right, because the workout app doesn't do that,

01:20:34 ◼   ► but that's their app.

01:20:35 ◼   ► - Exactly.

01:20:36 ◼   ► And I want there to be something.

01:20:39 ◼   ► I don't know what, but I feel like it goes to that,

01:20:43 ◼   ► I mean, all apps that you use, right?

01:20:45 ◼   ► Like it defaults to that ugly,

01:20:47 ◼   ► just blank screen with a digital like time readout

01:20:52 ◼   ► in the top right hand corner

01:20:53 ◼   ► and the screen is kind of semi-translucent.

01:20:55 ◼   ► It goes to that very quickly,

01:20:57 ◼   ► and I would prefer if they could find some way

01:20:59 ◼   ► to just show me the app UI instead

01:21:02 ◼   ► of when I have an application open, then that clock.

01:21:06 ◼   ► Or like if you're gonna force me

01:21:09 ◼   ► to have to look at something,

01:21:11 ◼   ► show me my actual watch face that I chose

01:21:14 ◼   ► rather than this weird one that you're showing me instead.

01:21:17 ◼   ► So it's just an issue I have with the watch face.

01:21:21 ◼   ► 'Cause really like, if you remember the pitch was like,

01:21:23 ◼   ► "Oh, people are working out

01:21:24 ◼   ► and they have to tap it with their nose, ha ha ha ha ha."

01:21:27 ◼   ► I'm still having to do that when I'm working out.

01:21:29 ◼   ► - Right, because you're using a third party workout app

01:21:31 ◼   ► and it's screensaver is not the information you wanna see.

01:21:34 ◼   ► - Exactly, and Apple's workout app

01:21:37 ◼   ► can't give me what I need in that moment, right?

01:21:40 ◼   ► So I would like to see some more there.

01:21:42 ◼   ► John asks, "Do you think there will be

01:21:45 ◼   ► a face mask emoji option in iOS 14?"

01:21:48 ◼   ► I feel like it should be added before, like embrace it.

01:21:52 ◼   ► This is the thing that people are doing now,

01:21:53 ◼   ► put face masks in them, right?

01:21:56 ◼   ► I feel like it's a thing, I feel like they should just do it.

01:21:58 ◼   ► - Yeah, sure, why not?

01:21:59 ◼   ► And it's also, it's an emoji,

01:22:01 ◼   ► there's an emoji face mask, so why not?

01:22:04 ◼   ► - I feel like really it should have been

01:22:05 ◼   ► an option before now, right?

01:22:07 ◼   ► Like this is one of those maybe US centric ideas, right?

01:22:10 ◼   ► That they didn't do it before now,

01:22:12 ◼   ► but they had other types of like accessories.

01:22:15 ◼   ► Last question comes from Andrew, Andrew asks,

01:22:18 ◼   ► "What is the worst Apple product that you have ever owned?"

01:22:22 ◼   ► - Great, you go first.

01:22:23 ◼   ► - The 2013 Trashcan Mac Pro.

01:22:26 ◼   ► I owned one of those.

01:22:28 ◼   ► - Oh, right, remember?

01:22:30 ◼   ► - Yeah, and you had actually like technical problems

01:22:32 ◼   ► with it where it behaved weirdly and restarted and stuff.

01:22:34 ◼   ► - It would lock up when I was recording sometimes.

01:22:38 ◼   ► It was like, this was one of the GPU overheating issues

01:22:42 ◼   ► is what it ended up working out to be.

01:22:43 ◼   ► I was like a GPU issue.

01:22:45 ◼   ► And so I would be recording say with Jason,

01:22:48 ◼   ► it happened a lot when recording with Jason,

01:22:50 ◼   ► and the machine would just lock up

01:22:53 ◼   ► and all I could do was turn off the machine

01:22:56 ◼   ► and sometimes I would lose audio.