Upgrade

00:00:00 ◼   ► [Intro music]

00:00:09 ◼   ► From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 314. Today's show is brought to you by Squarespace,

00:00:16 ◼   ► Pingdom, and KiwiCo. My name is Myke Hurley and I am joined by Jason Snell. Hi, Jason Snell!

00:00:21 ◼   ► Hello, Myke Hurley, how are you?

00:00:23 ◼   ► I'm very well, I'm expecting you to make some kind of pie reference now.

00:00:27 ◼   ► 3.14, and this is episode 314, so I guess multiply pie by 100 and then round it.

00:00:37 ◼   ► Because you spent those episodes, like it was a stint of episodes a while ago where

00:00:41 ◼   ► you were just picking the numbers and like they weren't very relevant facts, I think,

00:00:45 ◼   ► but I was expecting you to jump right in with relevant pie content today.

00:00:51 ◼   ► Who doesn't like pie? Pie is tasty.

00:00:55 ◼   ► #SnellTalkQuestion this week comes from Steven and Steven wants to know, "Jason, do you add

00:01:00 ◼   ► individual songs to your Apple Music library as well as albums or do individual tracks

00:01:06 ◼   ► get saved to playlists? So like if there's a song that you like, do you just add it to

00:01:11 ◼   ► the library or does that song get put somewhere?"

00:01:15 ◼   ► I very, this is kind of a weird question, but the way I handle it generally is if there's

00:01:24 ◼   ► a song that I'm finding that I really like, I have a playlist of recent, of like for this

00:01:29 ◼   ► year, songs that I've found that I like, and I add it to that playlist, which adds it to

00:01:34 ◼   ► my library. I rarely will add an individual song to my library because if it's not in

00:01:42 ◼   ► a playlist, it's just kind of a stray and it's in the library, but I'm never going to

00:01:46 ◼   ► find it and I'm never going to play it. So usually they get added to my library as a

00:01:50 ◼   ► part of adding it to a playlist because I literally have a playlist that is my collection

00:01:55 ◼   ► of songs that I like from a given year. And as I'm listening to the Apple Music curated

00:02:01 ◼   ► playlists and stuff like that, and I find something that I really like, that's a big

00:02:05 ◼   ► moment. Sometimes I will listen to it for a while and I'll either go on a kick where

00:02:11 ◼   ► I'll say, "Oh, I haven't promoted any of these songs into from the alternative playlist into

00:02:18 ◼   ► my playlist," and I'll drag a few of them in. Other times it's literally, I hear a song

00:02:22 ◼   ► and I'm like, "I really like this song," and it'll be like in a small private ceremony,

00:02:28 ◼   ► that song is inducted into my playlist of songs that I like from the year. But that's

00:02:32 ◼   ► how it happens. Whereas adding the explicit like add to library thing, I do that as Stephen

00:02:37 ◼   ► suggests for albums. That's something if there's an album that comes out that I'm interested

00:02:42 ◼   ► in, I just add it and it shows up in the recently added and that's very useful.

00:02:45 ◼   ► Stephen Eckert Yeah, see I don't like adding just like songs

00:02:48 ◼   ► to my library that way for that reason because I use the recently added and then you end

00:02:53 ◼   ► up with just too much stuff in there that's not albums and I like to use that to find

00:02:57 ◼   ► albums. So most of the time if I have a song that I like, I just want to add it to my library

00:03:02 ◼   ► typically. And I don't listen to like the curated playlists like you do. I'm very much

00:03:07 ◼   ► like, "Hey, I like the music that I like," and every time, every now and then an album

00:03:11 ◼   ► is added to that. But and then I'll just pick from my albums for the stuff that I want to

00:03:16 ◼   ► listen to. So I don't really like adding the singles. I will wait until the album comes

00:03:21 ◼   ► out and then add the whole album.

00:03:23 ◼   ► Josh Birkoff Yeah, I mean these days they do a lot of putting

00:03:26 ◼   ► the albums in in advance so you can add like when the 1975 album was like last fall that

00:03:32 ◼   ► new 1975 album was posted on Apple Music and it was like one song and then

00:03:37 ◼   ► Stephen Eckert Great Out.

00:03:38 ◼   ► Josh Birkoff Unnamed Great Out tracks, right? But I added

00:03:41 ◼   ► the album and the way that works is that when more tracks drop, they automatically drop in

00:03:44 ◼   ► there and then when the full album drops, the whole thing drops in there and that's

00:03:47 ◼   ► what happens. So that was that was great. So but I do use the curated playlists. That's

00:03:55 ◼   ► that's how I discover new music is through the curated playlists, which is great because

00:04:00 ◼   ► I like to discover new music. That's one of my favorite things about being on a music

00:04:03 ◼   ► service and then but I want to I want to subcurate that right like because what happens

00:04:07 ◼   ► is those those Apple Music playlists are like I don't know 50 songs something like that

00:04:11 ◼   ► 100 songs. I think it's 50 songs and they they rotate out right like eventually those

00:04:16 ◼   ► songs drop out and new ones come in because it's a it's like the the latest music. And

00:04:22 ◼   ► so what I want to do is capture the ones that I really like and store them away somewhere

00:04:28 ◼   ► to listen to later even after they've scrolled off and then I will sometimes listen to you

00:04:33 ◼   ► know, my favorite of the year or favorite of last year or I also have like a mega playlist.

00:04:37 ◼   ► That's all the favorites that I've collected.

00:04:41 ◼   ► Thank you so much for Stephen for that. I think really great snow talk question. You

00:04:45 ◼   ► can send in a tweet with the hashtag snow talk or use question marks no talk in the

00:04:48 ◼   ► relay FM members discord to submit a question for a future episode this September join relay

00:04:54 ◼   ► FM in support of St. Jude Children's Research Hospital during September in honor of childhood

00:05:00 ◼   ► cancer Awareness Month every single year between 180,000 and 240,000 children are diagnosed

00:05:08 ◼   ► of cancer worldwide and St. Jude's mission is to not stop until no child dies from cancer

00:05:14 ◼   ► childhood cancer remains the leading cause of death by disease for children under the

00:05:19 ◼   ► age of 15 and children undergoing treatment for cancer and other life threatening diseases

00:05:24 ◼   ► offered new transfusions physical and cognitive therapy and so much more. But the great thing

00:05:29 ◼   ► about St. Jude is no family will pay for that treatment if they are treated as St. Jude

00:05:34 ◼   ► which is unbelievable. Your gift can help St. Jude provide the best care and treatment

00:05:39 ◼   ► for patients go to stjude.org/relay today and help save St. Jude kids that is

00:05:45 ◼   ► stjude.org/relay to donate right now. Thank you again to everybody who was donated.

00:05:51 ◼   ► Please continue to go to the page because there's always fun stuff updating there and

00:05:56 ◼   ► anytime you have any more money you can kick in please do it. We've raised $141,000

00:06:02 ◼   ► as of the recording so far. I'm absolutely blown away by the generosity of the relay FM

00:06:08 ◼   ► community and like our little world here. You've really like me and Stephen completely blown away

00:06:14 ◼   ► by the support that we've seen so far, but we still have a long way to get to our goal of $315,000.

00:06:21 ◼   ► So if you're listening to the show and you have that money to give please please give what you can.

00:06:26 ◼   ► This is an incredible charity that does incredible work. The hospital takes care of

00:06:31 ◼   ► children but it's also a research institution and St. Jude's cancer research is shared

00:06:36 ◼   ► throughout the world and they really does incredible things. It's a magical place that I've

00:06:41 ◼   ► had the honor of visiting a few times and really some amazing stuff happens there. So please

00:06:46 ◼   ► continue to go to stjude.org/relay to donate now. Yes and the podcastathon is coming up

00:06:52 ◼   ► and that's going to be great. Me and Stephen had a call today we were talking about it and we were both

00:06:56 ◼   ► in absolute horror that it's next Friday. Yeah I'm horrified too. I have to kick off the

00:07:03 ◼   ► first the first phase of the two-phase game show is kicking off today. So I got to do some

00:07:14 ◼   ► work today and then I got to do some work next Monday and then I got to put it all together

00:07:19 ◼   ► for Friday. So yeah it's it's all coming together now. So we spoke a little bit about keyboards

00:07:25 ◼   ► and key caps on last week's episode and I recommended that you buy a set that I like

00:07:31 ◼   ► called the dummy key SA Dolch orange key caps which I'll put in the show notes and I wanted

00:07:37 ◼   ► to follow up because you sent me a picture of them. Yeah was that was that an upgrade plus thing

00:07:42 ◼   ► that we talked about those? No I think it was in regular Ask Upgrade. All right well

00:07:47 ◼   ► either way surprise if you didn't hear it last week then you know what you're missing now.

00:07:52 ◼   ► Yeah I bought them they looked good you said these look good and I said yes they do look good

00:07:56 ◼   ► and I bought them and they came and yeah so they're pretty and they're orange and

00:08:02 ◼   ► gray and black and they're nice. I put them on my Keychron K6 which is a 65% I think

00:08:10 ◼   ► keyboard it's little no function keys but and I use that with my iPad and I did actually

00:08:16 ◼   ► use that the other day but I might move them to another keyboard I don't know. You know

00:08:20 ◼   ► the truth is I am I should get rid of some of my keyboards because I have a bunch of keyboards

00:08:24 ◼   ► I don't use because I've decided those aren't keyboards I like but the primary things I have

00:08:29 ◼   ► is I have my Mac keyboard and I have an iPad keyboard when it's in a stand and I haven't

00:08:34 ◼   ► really settled on which one of the Keychron keyboards I prefer for that when I do that

00:08:40 ◼   ► I'll probably get rid of the other one but I'm still kind of shopping around it's you

00:08:43 ◼   ► know you never I don't think I'm ever going to settle on exactly what keyboard I love

00:08:49 ◼   ► but I think that I need to come to like a standard set of like I these right now this

00:08:57 ◼   ► is where it is and then I can get rid of some of the keyboards that I don't want. Yeah you

00:09:00 ◼   ► can settle on like the home but things change it's like any of these kinds of hobbies right

00:09:06 ◼   ► like new products it's a product driven hobby they appear and different things become interesting

00:09:11 ◼   ► to you. The case some people are asking in the Discord and I'll mention it here anyways

00:09:18 ◼   ► that the key caps are in a profile called SA and there's a couple of things about the

00:09:23 ◼   ► SA profile that I'm aware of so far they're taller. Yes they are. And they have the large

00:09:28 ◼   ► capital letters in the middle like you like. Right. Because I think they are more kind

00:09:33 ◼   ► of evocative of like old terminal style keyboards. Yes that's the kind of profile. Yeah they've

00:09:40 ◼   ► got sometimes they've got key labels like super which is one of my favorites. You can

00:09:45 ◼   ► get that on I have super on other different key that's just basically so they don't have

00:09:51 ◼   ► to print windows keys and command keys just yeah put super. Well it's from an old terminal

00:09:57 ◼   ► terminal I assume where that was a thing but that's that's the retro retro keyboard thing

00:10:02 ◼   ► is something that I enjoy I like I like feeling like it's you know everything ancient is new

00:10:07 ◼   ► again and that's the kind of vibe I want and and yeah I mean you were talking about how

00:10:11 ◼   ► keyboards was more about kind of a hobby for you for me I feel like and this says a lot

00:10:15 ◼   ► about me as a shopper I would say which is my preferred mode mode of shopping for anything

00:10:22 ◼   ► is have a plan get in get what you want and get out and there is a degree of that in my

00:10:31 ◼   ► keyboard desire which is I decided I wanted mechanical keyboards I but it was very much

00:10:37 ◼   ► a find what I want find the features I want get what I want get settled and get out and

00:10:42 ◼   ► although I will be tempted by a pretty set of key caps like this one again I'm not super

00:10:48 ◼   ► super interested in going beyond that because I basically I learned enough to find the tools

00:10:52 ◼   ► that I like and that I like to use and now I other than the key caps which is the terrible

00:10:58 ◼   ► thing that keeps pulling me back because some of them are very pretty I've sort of moved

00:11:04 ◼   ► on from that because it was a great learning experience to find a product that I'm comfortable

00:11:10 ◼   ► using as my you know as my writing tools so that's what I do well see that's the difference

00:11:15 ◼   ► between me and you is like I like these things for the yes the joy and the challenge of finding

00:11:22 ◼   ► new yeah oh no I got that last time too yeah I mean you're definitely in a different place

00:11:27 ◼   ► with them in terms of sort of fandom than I I have and and that's that says I think that

00:11:32 ◼   ► says a lot about both of us as people that you're super into like the experience of it

00:11:37 ◼   ► and for me it's a I'm a little more just sort of in it for the practical aspect of it but

00:11:44 ◼   ► I do have a little bit of the aesthetic part with the key caps too because I like that

00:11:48 ◼   ► idea of having like a key cap for the season and my winter key caps in my summer key caps

00:11:52 ◼   ► that's kind of a fun idea that I have tried I've investigated to various degrees of success

00:11:59 ◼   ► well as I find new things that I think you might like I will send them your way so I

00:12:03 ◼   ► can I can be that first filter for you thank you for costing me money so speaking of keyboards

00:12:09 ◼   ► actually so one of the things that we've been doing which is different for us St. Jude campaign

00:12:13 ◼   ► this year is as we have been hitting different milestones we've been promising streams and

00:12:19 ◼   ► content that we will release and one of the milestones that we hit last week was for me

00:12:24 ◼   ► to do a keyboard focused live stream so at 10 a.m. Eastern at twitch.tv/relayfm on Thursday

00:12:31 ◼   ► so it is coming Thursday which is the 10th I'm going to be doing a stream where I show

00:12:37 ◼   ► off the keyboards that I own and the key caps that I own and I'm hoping that I will have

00:12:42 ◼   ► something arrive in time so we can change some key switches out on the keyboard together

00:12:47 ◼   ► which might be fun I have got like a camera which I've suspended over my head and everything

00:12:53 ◼   ► so you'll be able to I'm setting some fun stuff up so you can come and hang out at 10

00:12:58 ◼   ► a.m. Eastern on Thursday at twitch.tv/relayfm and we'll hang out we'll get a show and tell

00:13:05 ◼   ► and we'll spend some time together on twitch some more follow up because I feel like I've

00:13:11 ◼   ► just got to touch on it anyway Epic has requested that a court will grant an injunction on Apple

00:13:17 ◼   ► to allow them to put Fortnite back in the store so this is something that the original

00:13:22 ◼   ► temporary restraining order didn't work out for them but they're going to another court

00:13:26 ◼   ► now Epic is saying that they will suffer irreparable harm from the fact that Fortnite is not in

00:13:31 ◼   ► the App Store a quote this was a clear warning to any developer that would dare challenge

00:13:37 ◼   ► Apple's monopolies follow our rules we will cut you off from a billion iOS consumers challenge

00:13:43 ◼   ► us and we will destroy your business is the thing that Epic said in their court case there

00:13:50 ◼   ► yes it's a clear warning to anyone who would challenge the laws against bank robbery follow

00:13:54 ◼   ► the law or we'll put you in jail I mean they're literally like this is a clear warning that

00:14:00 ◼   ► you need to follow the rules yeah it is and and it's very clear I mean so here's the thing

00:14:05 ◼   ► anything can happen in court but I feel like and the lawyers have to do what they got to

00:14:08 ◼   ► do it's their jobs but yeah they're pushing it with this one I feel like the judge in

00:14:12 ◼   ► the temporary restraining order her reaction was pretty much my guess is the reaction they're

00:14:17 ◼   ► going to get for this argument which is you did this to yourself you could undo it at

00:14:23 ◼   ► any moment if it's if it's the removal from the App Store that is threatening your business

00:14:29 ◼   ► you can solve this by removing your payment system if the larger issue is that that it's

00:14:35 ◼   ► actually they can't run the business without building their own in-app purchase system

00:14:39 ◼   ► which is bogus that's not a thing then then that's a different argument they can make

00:14:44 ◼   ► anyway I wish them luck I don't think they're gonna get back in the App Store unless they

00:14:49 ◼   ► take their own thing out but you never know any every judge is different they could change

00:14:54 ◼   ► their mind but it feels to me like whether you agree with them or not I I think this

00:14:58 ◼   ► is a ridiculous request right to say basically we want to stay in the App Store and not follow

00:15:03 ◼   ► the rules because we don't like the rules but that's that's their take on it so good

00:15:09 ◼   ► luck to them yeah there's part of the statement that statement which is a little it's very

00:15:14 ◼   ► dramatic over dramatic that but there is a there is some truth to that statement where

00:15:19 ◼   ► it's not like about following the rules but it is that like if Apple's rule if Apple do

00:15:23 ◼   ► not feel like you're following the rules the way that they want and that is the type of

00:15:27 ◼   ► stuff that we've seen over the last couple of months right that like Apple has decided

00:15:32 ◼   ► that now they want a cut for this and you know but in epic situation it's not this is

00:15:38 ◼   ► you know this is this is of their own doing that's the lip service of their larger argument

00:15:43 ◼   ► which is fine again lawyers get paid to write things like this but the truth is they've

00:15:48 ◼   ► got the lawsuit they're fighting for what they believe is a bad behavior on Apple's

00:15:52 ◼   ► part however is it entirely unreasonable that since they very specifically broke Apple's

00:15:59 ◼   ► rules knew they were going to get kicked out and then basically said what are we to do

00:16:05 ◼   ► you know well you could go on with your lawsuit while putting it back in the store using Apple

00:16:10 ◼   ► system and you know you could even ask for the all the money in the in-app purchase system

00:16:15 ◼   ► to be put in escrow or something so that if you win your case you get it all and if you

00:16:19 ◼   ► lose your case you give Apple 30% of it but you know that's that's they're they're playing

00:16:24 ◼   ► the game here if you're gonna argue for a restraining order this is what you should

00:16:27 ◼   ► say I just roll my eyes at it because I don't think they're gonna get anywhere there's

00:16:31 ◼   ► very repairable harm right like you can situation if you want to you literally this is not a

00:16:39 ◼   ► case where Apple has rolled into your thing that you worked really hard on and decided

00:16:43 ◼   ► capriciously to destroy it it's like you did this to yourself in order to make the point

00:16:48 ◼   ► you don't want to deal with the consequences of it there's a simple solution without dropping

00:16:54 ◼   ► your lawsuits but you don't want to do it because I mean because the truth is you want

00:16:59 ◼   ► to be a martyr that's the truth is you want to be a martyr you want to make a stink you

00:17:02 ◼   ► want to make all your customers angry at Apple that is the that is the goal here so they're

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00:19:10 ◼   ► C O.com/upgrade our thanks to KiwiCo for their support of this show and Relay FM

00:19:16 ◼   ► some upstream news for you Jason okay Apple signs a deal for five days at Memorial this

00:19:24 ◼   ► is a new limited series from Academy Award winner John Ridley known for 12 years a slave

00:19:29 ◼   ► an American crime and Emmy Award winner Carlton Cruz who's known for Jack Ryan and lost

00:19:34 ◼   ► the Cuse yeah does it cover his he's not a cruise Carlton Cuse I don't know why my brain

00:19:41 ◼   ► read Cruz sorry Carlton Cuse you have a great one never never nevertheless you know it's

00:19:46 ◼   ► a Mission Impossible thing maybe I don't know maybe he is maybe it is this is based on a

00:19:50 ◼   ► novel that chronicles the first five days of life in New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina

00:19:56 ◼   ► hit this is one of the rare projects that Apple announced themselves of a press release

00:20:02 ◼   ► interesting usually this stuff gets out in other places but this one they announced that

00:20:07 ◼   ► one straight up yeah and John Ridley is is well known for winning the Academy Award for

00:20:11 ◼   ► 12 years a slave but American crime was a very good sort of anthology series on ABC

00:20:20 ◼   ► I believe that was yeah it was really good so he's done he's done some really good TV

00:20:24 ◼   ► work too so he understands this kind of format I think it's a good fit for him I think they

00:20:30 ◼   ► I think that Cuse and Ridley worked did they work together on Jack Ryan or no I don't think

00:20:35 ◼   ► so actually I don't think so no I love Jack Ryan though do you want did you watch Jack

00:20:41 ◼   ► Ryan I did it's it's okay I watch both seasons it's they've got things to commend about it

00:20:46 ◼   ► but I it's not as good as it should be I think is my feeling about it it's okay I like it

00:20:52 ◼   ► as like I found like an easy bingeable show yep oh yeah it is that it's just and the second

00:20:58 ◼   ► season I just thought was kind of a letdown after the first season and I first season

00:21:02 ◼   ► was better yeah I yeah but Carlton Cuse he did lost with David little off thing they

00:21:07 ◼   ► did lost which is one of my all-time favorites don't email me Apple is celebrating their

00:21:12 ◼   ► 18 Emmy nominations of a homepage takeover of apple.com right now right now you can go

00:21:18 ◼   ► to right now as of right now and you go to apple.com and you'll see all the nominations

00:21:22 ◼   ► quote and we're just getting started it says on the page I think it's quite a big statement

00:21:26 ◼   ► to take over the Apple homepage they usually reserve this for quite important things and

00:21:30 ◼   ► so clearly Apple think this is quite important yeah well we said here listeners to upstream

00:21:35 ◼   ► already know that one of the big things that any tech ish company that enters the entertainment

00:21:40 ◼   ► industry wants our awards because the awards are validation and Apple's got their Emmy

00:21:45 ◼   ► nominations which is very exciting and and so of course they are proud of it and they

00:21:50 ◼   ► want to make a big deal out of it I'm sure also there's a level of serving the TV group

00:21:55 ◼   ► where they're like we don't get enough love on the Apple homepage why don't we get a little

00:21:59 ◼   ► love and so this is their way Apple's way of giving them a little love now you may be

00:22:02 ◼   ► asking yourself well the Emmy Awards aren't until September 20th so why why are they choosing

00:22:08 ◼   ► this moment to pat themselves on the back for all their Emmy nominations and I'll just

00:22:12 ◼   ► say it's possible that there will be other things that will be featured on the Apple

00:22:16 ◼   ► homepage between now and then maybe we'll get to that later on so maybe it needs to

00:22:23 ◼   ► be today that's all I'm saying the morning show leads with eight nominations Beastie

00:22:30 ◼   ► Boys story the documentary has five defending Jacob has two and then Central Park home and

00:22:35 ◼   ► the elephant queen have also picked up a nomination each yep yep so good luck to Apple on

00:22:41 ◼   ► September 20th I guess for your consideration yep the UK cell carrier EE has launched an

00:22:48 ◼   ► Apple services bundle in partnership with Apple so they have a new plan it's called

00:22:53 ◼   ► the full works plan and it gives you access to Apple music Apple TV plus and Apple arcade

00:22:59 ◼   ► at no extra cost as part of the plan but listen to this plan as they describe it the full

00:23:04 ◼   ► works package offers an iPhone 11 pro with unlimited data calls and texts Apple music

00:23:10 ◼   ► Apple TV plus and Apple arcade for 77 pounds a month the same plan about the bundled services

00:23:16 ◼   ► cost 68 pounds so you end up saving about 11 pounds a month when using this compared

00:23:22 ◼   ► to buying directly from Apple I got that from 9 to 5 Mac what I found interesting about

00:23:26 ◼   ► this is this is kind of what people want Apple to produce themselves right like when we were

00:23:32 ◼   ► talking about the Montgomery report a couple of weeks ago it's like okay do all the services

00:23:38 ◼   ► but I would love to get some hardware along with it this is that right you get an iPhone

00:23:44 ◼   ► you get unlimited calls and texts and I will say for 77 pounds a month and it's probably

00:23:48 ◼   ► over like three years two or three years that's actually for the UK a pretty decent price

00:23:52 ◼   ► for that entire package because it includes a phone right so you're basically paying like

00:23:58 ◼   ► what you're paying nine pounds for those services instead of 20 pounds for those services yeah

00:24:03 ◼   ► there are thereabouts yeah I think it's actually it's interesting I thought EE have done stuff

00:24:10 ◼   ► with Apple in the past like you would get a free year of Apple music and stuff like

00:24:15 ◼   ► that and I just found it really interesting that they've they've gone ahead and done like

00:24:19 ◼   ► a full-on bundle with EE before they did one themselves maybe they were supposed to have

00:24:25 ◼   ► one by now Jason there are some of these things that have happened in America I haven't seen

00:24:29 ◼   ► them all the services bundle with an iPhone I mean that's a really interesting idea T-Mobile

00:24:34 ◼   ► in the US has done a lot of that where it's it's done in fact I was talking to somebody

00:24:39 ◼   ► who said that they got their they got their Netflix from one from their from their cell

00:24:45 ◼   ► phone carrier and they got some other streaming service through their cable company bundling

00:24:51 ◼   ► it in and like they had they had assembled streaming services without actually joining

00:24:55 ◼   ► the services because they got them as part of other deals I know T-Mobile is offered a

00:24:59 ◼   ► bunch of of those kind of bundles or even freebies where it's like if you sign up for

00:25:04 ◼   ► this plan you get this service for free so I think this is an interesting thing for us

00:25:10 ◼   ► to watch because we keep talking about Apple's direct-to-consumer bundle but there are other

00:25:14 ◼   ► ways for Apple services to generate revenue for Apple that involve them piggybacking on

00:25:19 ◼   ► another existing relationship I'm sure that Apple would prefer to keep all the money and

00:25:23 ◼   ► have it all get channeled through them but this is a great example where you know Apple

00:25:28 ◼   ► is getting all of these subscribers who sign up for this plan and these are the most Apple

00:25:34 ◼   ► focused people via a wireless plan the wireless subscribers think that they're getting a deal

00:25:39 ◼   ► and Apple is giving subscribers and presumably this improves EE's marketing so it potentially

00:25:45 ◼   ► works for everyone so something to keep an eye on is how Apple tries to bundle its services

00:25:50 ◼   ► into other plans yeah it's like you know I could easily imagine them changing the way

00:25:55 ◼   ► this is marketed to be like oh you get the Apple subscription service not all of them

00:26:00 ◼   ► right like at the moment they're just saying like oh we give you these three things but

00:26:04 ◼   ► if Apple have a bundle maybe it just swaps out become hey as the full works package you

00:26:08 ◼   ► get Apple's Apple one bundle along with your phone right I can imagine yeah I'm going to

00:26:15 ◼   ► move on to the next question. Mulan is now available on Disney Plus it currently costs

00:26:19 ◼   ► as we've mentioned before $29.99 for Premier Access we have learned a couple of things

00:26:24 ◼   ► now it will be made available to all Disney Plus subscribers in December so if you don't

00:26:30 ◼   ► want to see it now you don't want to pay for it now you can wait until December if you're

00:26:34 ◼   ► a Disney Plus subscriber and you'll get the movie as part of your regular plan and to

00:26:38 ◼   ► answer a previously asked question that I had on this show Disney are using the iOS

00:26:44 ◼   ► Internet purchase mechanism if you want to buy the movie inside of the app so that's

00:26:50 ◼   ► kind of where we are right now it's not available anywhere else that was another thing was wondering

00:26:54 ◼   ► like could you get it on iTunes no it's just in Disney Plus in a quite short window a three

00:27:00 ◼   ► month window I think is really great. Yeah this it seems to me like they're they're hyper

00:27:05 ◼   ► compressing the windows here so it's Disney Plus Premier Access I would bet you that sometime

00:27:10 ◼   ► between now and December it will show up on you know iTunes and in Amazon Prime and all

00:27:16 ◼   ► of those places for this same kind of like high price right but they're but they've created

00:27:21 ◼   ► this kind of Premier Access window where it's exclusively available essentially exclusively

00:27:26 ◼   ► available to pay for on Disney Plus and then eventually it will become available everywhere

00:27:32 ◼   ► to pay for for $29.99 and then it will go on Disney Plus and that's a new again a lot

00:27:39 ◼   ► of experiments going on here but I'm interested to see if Disney does this again because it's

00:27:44 ◼   ► possible that a Disney Plus membership may end up being a first access plan for the opportunity

00:27:53 ◼   ► to see Disney stuff before anyone else gets access to it at home even if theaters reopen

00:28:00 ◼   ► and we go back to a more theater centric approach I would I'm interested to see if Disney uses

00:28:05 ◼   ► this as their rollout so basically like Disney Plus people always get access to buy these

00:28:10 ◼   ► Disney movies before they end up on the other for purchase services by a couple of weeks

00:28:18 ◼   ► even just to make Disney Plus feel important to them.

00:28:23 ◼   ► I mean it's a good strategy right like yeah I mean we'll see it depends on how interested

00:28:31 ◼   ► people are in paying on top of paying for Disney Plus but I think the idea here is that

00:28:36 ◼   ► these are the most committed Disney fans it's unlikely that people who are super into Disney

00:28:41 ◼   ► movies are not Disney Plus members and so giving them you know they're in the club and

00:28:48 ◼   ► so they get to see it sooner it's not a bad idea really it's interesting because as a

00:28:54 ◼   ► Disney Plus subscriber I look at it and I think do I really want to play pay $30 now

00:28:58 ◼   ► for something that I could see for free in December I'm not sure I want to see this movie

00:29:01 ◼   ► anyway but I did have I am gonna get it right so there is that part of it which is like

00:29:06 ◼   ► you know I'm just gonna get in three months you're you're paying to see it sooner paying

00:29:10 ◼   ► $30 to see it sooner but I think for a would I do that for a Marvel movie let's say right

00:29:15 ◼   ► if that was a Black Widow maybe which is coming out if they said okay well you can watch Black

00:29:20 ◼   ► Widow at home for $30 and it'll be on the plan you know on the on the program in three

00:29:24 ◼   ► months but you can just buy it and watch it tonight and it's a premiere would I do that

00:29:28 ◼   ► and the answer is yeah probably my whole family would sit down and watch that movie so I'm

00:29:33 ◼   ► intrigued by this it'll be interesting to see if this is a one-off or if Disney is gonna

00:29:38 ◼   ► build this up as a system and an inducement to be a Disney Plus member.

00:29:42 ◼   ► David I would totally I mean I was thinking about doing it for Mulan and then when I saw

00:29:47 ◼   ► it was December I was like I'll probably just wait like if I really feel like I want to

00:29:50 ◼   ► see it between now and then I'll do it but I'll probably wait but if it's if it is something

00:29:54 ◼   ► like Black Widow which I'm way more interested in because I'm more involved and more in like

00:29:58 ◼   ► invested in that universe then I probably would do it if anything because I would want

00:30:05 ◼   ► to not go to the cinema because like cinemas are open here in some limited capacity but

00:30:14 ◼   ► I wouldn't want to go to one like I was because this is like something I know it's like I'm

00:30:17 ◼   ► seeing everyone talk about the Bill and Ted movie being really good and I was like I'll

00:30:21 ◼   ► watch that but I can't I can't get it here like you can in America.

00:30:25 ◼   ► David Oh because it's in in the theaters right now.

00:30:28 ◼   ► David Yes in the theaters I mean they're bringing

00:30:29 ◼   ► it to digital services sooner than they would normally for that reason but there's still

00:30:34 ◼   ► a theatrical window and so it's kind of like no I don't want to do that so we're gonna

00:30:42 ◼   ► say I mean look frankly I mean we talk about this the whole the whole time but frankly

00:30:47 ◼   ► if this works for the studios this is this is the model now.

00:30:51 ◼   ► David I think so we something you may mentioned that

00:30:55 ◼   ► I've also felt is the real question here which is how long is it gonna take and is it ever

00:31:01 ◼   ► gonna happen that theaters really bounce back because right now theaters are reopening in

00:31:07 ◼   ► some places but I would imagine there are lots of people like you and me who are like

00:31:11 ◼   ► well I'm not going just because it's open are you kidding no no not gonna happen so

00:31:19 ◼   ► but yeah I agree with you let's also say we've talked about this briefly the idea that they

00:31:25 ◼   ► the consent decree got dropped in America the idea of a movie theater that's owned by

00:31:29 ◼   ► a movie studio was not allowed and now is allowed because I keep thinking if I'm the

00:31:35 ◼   ► movie theater or the if I'm the movie studio do I really even want to share any of my revenue

00:31:41 ◼   ► with theater owners and they take a lot of it but they still share the revenue with the

00:31:46 ◼   ► theater owners and I mean they maybe they don't want to own a lot of theaters but I

00:31:51 ◼   ► had that moment too which is like direct to consumers awfully powerful I think the truth

00:31:55 ◼   ► is going to be again something that you just said which is I suspect the final result is

00:32:00 ◼   ► that we're still gonna have movie theaters but they're gonna be maybe fewer of them but

00:32:06 ◼   ► the window to between movie theaters and home is gonna get compressed even more that the

00:32:11 ◼   ► studios are gonna have the upper hand and they're gonna say look I'll put my movie in

00:32:15 ◼   ► your theater for three weeks but then I'm putting it on home access for 30 bucks and

00:32:21 ◼   ► if you don't like it too bad right like we're not that's the business model now I think

00:32:27 ◼   ► that's gonna happen I don't and if you're a theater owner I know the theater owners

00:32:30 ◼   ► the chains always complain and they say oh we're not gonna do this but I just I think

00:32:34 ◼   ► it's inevitable I think it's inevitable that and I don't think it's gonna kill movie theaters

00:32:38 ◼   ► so what movie theater like you know like there's this weird thinking and by the movie theaters

00:32:43 ◼   ► like they're the ones with any power in this situation they don't you don't have it right

00:32:48 ◼   ► like you don't have the power like if you say to Disney because they're doing this thing

00:32:53 ◼   ► on Disney plus we don't want Disney movies anymore well say goodbye to your business

00:32:56 ◼   ► movie theaters because you're in the Disney business yeah exactly so I think that movie

00:33:04 ◼   ► theaters will survive because I think there's a great business to be run on having a great

00:33:08 ◼   ► theater experience hopefully at some point when people want to go to them again for new

00:33:12 ◼   ► release movies with loud sound and big screen and choosing not to watch it at home I'm not

00:33:18 ◼   ► entirely convinced that the ability to watch a movie at home even day and date with it

00:33:23 ◼   ► being in a theater is going to prevent people from going to the movie theater I think some

00:33:27 ◼   ► people as somebody who had you know my kids are older now but when my kids were little

00:33:32 ◼   ► like we just couldn't go to the movie theater right it wasn't that we didn't want to it's

00:33:37 ◼   ► that we literally couldn't so there's first off there's an audience you're gonna get who

00:33:40 ◼   ► it's not convenient or it's not playing near them or for whatever reason they can't go

00:33:44 ◼   ► to the movie theater but if you make a good theater experience especially if you've got

00:33:48 ◼   ► this artificial sort of month or three week long boundary where you can't watch it at

00:33:52 ◼   ► home people will go if the experience is good I think the truth is a lot of movie theater

00:33:58 ◼   ► experiences especially in the US are bad yeah yeah like I would see more new movies in a

00:34:04 ◼   ► year if this was the norm like there would still be movies the movies that I really care

00:34:09 ◼   ► about I would still want to go to a cinema and see them right like like the James Bond

00:34:14 ◼   ► movies the Marvel movies you know like these big blockbusters I want to have a better audio

00:34:20 ◼   ► visual experience than I have at home but there are a lot of movies that come out where

00:34:25 ◼   ► like I want to see that but I don't like my work schedule is so strange right times that

00:34:30 ◼   ► like I don't really get good windows that I feel like I can definitely go and spend

00:34:35 ◼   ► that time let me pile on there that the marketing is so focused on the release and when it comes

00:34:42 ◼   ► out on home video there is some marketing about it but like all the marketing is basically

00:34:48 ◼   ► pushed on the release which means if you can't for whatever reason go out to see it in the

00:34:52 ◼   ► movie theater right away you that marketing is wasted on you even if it's made you want

00:34:58 ◼   ► to see the movie by the time it comes out on home video do you remember do you know

00:35:01 ◼   ► that it's out so there is I I would argue to really good value in trying to convert

00:35:07 ◼   ► all of those people who aren't going to see the movie into watching it at home and and

00:35:13 ◼   ► get them now get when the and and as a viewer I want to I want to see the movie when people

00:35:19 ◼   ► are talking about the movie I want to have an opinion about that movie I don't want to

00:35:23 ◼   ► wait to video but I can't go see it and so I'm kind of stuck so I think yeah it's I feel

00:35:28 ◼   ► for movie theater owners and a little bit although a lot of the movie theater chains

00:35:33 ◼   ► are crappy and I don't feel for them too much but like I do think that movie good movie

00:35:38 ◼   ► theaters are not going to die and that there is a market for that but it's got to change

00:35:44 ◼   ► and I think this is the thing that's going to change it and that's great because I'm

00:35:46 ◼   ► like you there are certainly movies that I would pay movie what I would pay to go see

00:35:52 ◼   ► them in the movie theater but I can't go to the movie theater for whatever reason schedules

00:35:58 ◼   ► and and the like but we can watch it at home and I would I would love that because there

00:36:03 ◼   ► is a movie experience which is nice which is like you know like in America it's like

00:36:07 ◼   ► the Alamo draft house Alamo draft house we went yeah we saw Avengers infinity war yeah

00:36:14 ◼   ► in Austin and it was a great experience so nice and we have I think it's I can't remember

00:36:19 ◼   ► the name of the there's like a chain in in the UK that's doing some stuff like this too

00:36:23 ◼   ► which I've been to and like that is a really great experience which I value much more than

00:36:30 ◼   ► the typical movie experience right where I'm going and I feel like I'm being treating myself

00:36:36 ◼   ► to something for much more money than it costs to go to a regular theater like that's the

00:36:42 ◼   ► type of stuff that I want to exist and the stuff that I think will exist because it's

00:36:46 ◼   ► like you are making it more of an event rather than I'm gonna go sit in a different chair

00:36:50 ◼   ► with a bigger screen right like yeah we're gonna sit in like a sofa and there's gonna

00:36:55 ◼   ► be food and drinks and like it's exactly thing you know and so that's the kind of stuff that

00:37:00 ◼   ► I hope will and should continue to exist post-pandemic but I think that there needs to be changed

00:37:06 ◼   ► in the typical model now we did there was a blog on the San Francisco Chronicles website

00:37:11 ◼   ► for a long time that was for parents and they would do screenings at a movie theater that

00:37:18 ◼   ► in the East Bay where they serve food and beer and I went to a couple of those with

00:37:25 ◼   ► we brought the kids we got pizza and you're sitting in like big couches with and there's

00:37:30 ◼   ► a table and we're eating pizza and we're watching like Kiki's Delivery Service and it was so

00:37:36 ◼   ► great so great and not not what we think of as a traditional theater experience but it

00:37:41 ◼   ► was so much fun like there's so many different ways to do it but the fact is yes if you're

00:37:45 ◼   ► a faceless corporate theater chain who has a bunch of shoeboxes tied together that people

00:37:51 ◼   ► you know are ushered into by surly teens and then they sit in an uncomfortable chair and

00:37:56 ◼   ► look at a not really that great screen with not really that great sound system like you

00:38:03 ◼   ► your business is in jeopardy but I don't think good movie theater experiences I think people

00:38:10 ◼   ► will still pay for a good movie theater experience in the long run I do really believe that even

00:38:13 ◼   ► after after all this is said and done I think they will but it's got to be way more Alamo

00:38:18 ◼   ► Drafthouse and a lot less light than a boring faceless chain.

00:38:22 ◼   ► The chain I'm being reminded by Emma in the Discord is Everyman it's a chain here called

00:38:28 ◼   ► Everyman theaters and it's a similar thing you sit on much nicer chairs and they bring

00:38:31 ◼   ► you food and drinks.

00:38:32 ◼   ► Love it.

00:38:33 ◼   ► It's nice really good.

00:38:35 ◼   ► Before we started recording today you referenced your Mac Mini which I know means that you

00:38:42 ◼   ► are you're currently running Big Sur daily.

00:38:46 ◼   ► Big Sur has come to my life yeah I installed Big Sur on my iMac.

00:38:50 ◼   ► So because the audio stuff isn't really working very well reliably on Big Sur you are recording

00:38:56 ◼   ► from the Mac Mini right?

00:38:57 ◼   ► It's actually not a reflection on Big Sur's reliability Big Sur changed some stuff and

00:39:02 ◼   ► Rogue Amoeba's software which I rely on for all my podcasting doesn't work on Big Sur.

00:39:08 ◼   ► They are working on it but it doesn't work and yet I need to experience Big Sur and there's

00:39:14 ◼   ► only so much I've talked about this before there's only so much as a reviewer you can

00:39:18 ◼   ► do by having a separate system off to the side or thing I think you reboot into where

00:39:22 ◼   ► you can say I am using the beta now because you're not using the beta right you're exploring

00:39:26 ◼   ► the beta.

00:39:27 ◼   ► I'm going to have a little bit of fun I'm going to poke around and then I'm going to

00:39:30 ◼   ► leave when it annoys me.

00:39:31 ◼   ► It's beta tourism basically.

00:39:36 ◼   ► And I've moved into the beta now I live in the beta.

00:39:39 ◼   ► You're not a tourist.

00:39:40 ◼   ► My passport has been stamped I live here now.

00:39:43 ◼   ► You got a visa.

00:39:44 ◼   ► So how do I do a podcast if I don't if I can't use my podcast stuff in Big Sur and the answer

00:39:51 ◼   ► is about five feet away from me in the corner of my room is a Mac Mini attached to a big

00:39:57 ◼   ► hard drive RAID array that I use as a server and I was thinking like how I thought about

00:40:03 ◼   ► like putting a laptop on my desk I thought about using a recorder separate from my computer

00:40:09 ◼   ► I thought about all these things and then I realized what I need to do is use the Mac

00:40:13 ◼   ► Mini that I'm already using and the beauty of it is I bought on I think on a price I

00:40:20 ◼   ► bought a 15 foot long USB cable powered USB cable or like this will work it will tow and

00:40:29 ◼   ► I ran it behind my furniture and over to my desk and unplugged my audio interface from

00:40:35 ◼   ► my Mac and plugged it in to that long cable I have all the rogue Amoeba stop software

00:40:40 ◼   ► on the Mac Mini the Mac Mini is running Mojave by the way not even Catalina which I had some

00:40:44 ◼   ► weird audio quirks that I haven't had since I moved to the Mac Mini which means it totally

00:40:50 ◼   ► was Catalina.

00:40:51 ◼   ► In my personal opinion Mojave was the last good version.

00:40:54 ◼   ► Yeah well so now when I want to do a podcast I open my little I click I have a and I've

00:41:01 ◼   ► always had this a an icon in my dock that is a screen sharing link to my server so I

00:41:08 ◼   ► just click that and the screen sharing window opens and then I do the stuff in there so

00:41:12 ◼   ► yeah I'm sitting in the same place talking to the same microphone everything is exactly

00:41:16 ◼   ► the same except the iMac in front of me isn't actually doing any of the work here it is

00:41:22 ◼   ► the Mac Mini that's doing it and I generally just keep that window in the background that's

00:41:27 ◼   ► got Skype and audio hijack running and I'm using Google Docs and I've got discord running

00:41:31 ◼   ► in the foreground here but so it's a funny solution but I like it and the other thing

00:41:36 ◼   ► that I've had happen not with podcasting but that I've been doing a lot is with the magic

00:41:41 ◼   ► keyboard in my iPad the last couple of weeks because we had a heat wave and it gets very

00:41:47 ◼   ► hot in my garage is that I've been using my iPad with the magic keyboard as a as a laptop

00:41:52 ◼   ► a little bit more using screen sharing with the Mac Mini okay where I can just do things

00:41:57 ◼   ► on the Mac Mini and it sort of I know Federico has written about this a little bit but like

00:42:00 ◼   ► it sort of turns your your Mac into an app that your iPad can run it's not perfect but

00:42:06 ◼   ► it's pretty good so I've been doing that a little bit too so a lot of screen sharing

00:42:10 ◼   ► with the Mac Mini and that's the that's a great thing about having that extra extra

00:42:14 ◼   ► Mac in my life is that now that I'm in Big Sur I can I don't know what's the right metaphor

00:42:18 ◼   ► here I can write home I can I can phone home to Mojave it's your Mojave escape hatch yeah

00:42:26 ◼   ► something like that so how long have you been running Big Sur on your iMac week and a half

00:42:31 ◼   ► this is on your iMac Pro right couple weeks iMac Pro at my desk yeah and had you used

00:42:37 ◼   ► it on a big screen like that before are we testing it on a laptop on the 13 inch PowerBook

00:42:42 ◼   ► or PowerBook god I'm living in the 90s right now the 13 inch MacBook Pro the latest one

00:42:48 ◼   ► I got a review unit of that and right and then without Apple's permission I installed

00:42:53 ◼   ► Big Sur on it so I sent that back a couple weeks ago and I'm there surprise Big Sur on

00:42:59 ◼   ► it good luck and what is do you have any refreshed experiences like renewed opinions I should

00:43:06 ◼   ► say on Big Sur using it on a bigger screen does it change any of your feeling about the

00:43:12 ◼   ► overall look no I'm getting used to it I'm more noticing all the things that have cosmetic

00:43:18 ◼   ► problems because they haven't been updated for Big Sur yet because there are enough this

00:43:23 ◼   ► is the thing if you haven't lived through applications that are alt right yes see this

00:43:28 ◼   ► is the thing that if you if you have not lived it's been a while since Apple has made such

00:43:31 ◼   ► a radical change in the Mac OS interface and if you live through any of those past iterations

00:43:37 ◼   ► when they make a big change what ends up happening is all of the assumptions that were made by

00:43:43 ◼   ► the apps that existed on your Mac before that worked the assumptions just worked because

00:43:51 ◼   ► everything looked okay and like well it looks okay I guess it's fine and then you see Apple

00:43:56 ◼   ► adjusting the size of the menu bar and Windows and things like that and it exposes those

00:44:02 ◼   ► apps because they were doing it in some way not their fault but like they were doing it

00:44:07 ◼   ► in some way that worked fine that doesn't work fine anymore and you go through a period

00:44:12 ◼   ► over the summer and probably into the fall where you open an app and you look at it you're

00:44:16 ◼   ► like what is happening here and the answer is well that app has not been updated for

00:44:22 ◼   ► Big Sur yet so so there's a little bit of that that I'm noticing is the kind of cosmetic

00:44:28 ◼   ► stuff but otherwise I'd say it's actually working okay it's buggy there's apps that

00:44:33 ◼   ► quit and sometimes it feels a little bit slow but it's a beta that's that's not surprising

00:44:39 ◼   ► the big thing with any beta is just the compatibility stuff like there are apps that I use that

00:44:42 ◼   ► don't like the audio apps that don't work I use bartender to clean up my menu bar and

00:44:48 ◼   ► it they're working on a beta but last time I checked they hadn't released a beta for

00:44:53 ◼   ► it so my menu bar has got a lot of junk in it and of course every little piece of junk

00:44:57 ◼   ► is more spread out now because that's so it fills up even more of my menu bar with with

00:45:02 ◼   ► junk but but it's like you know I mean I think we think spending a lot of time thinking about

00:45:08 ◼   ► Big Sur is a big visual change right but there's clearly a lot of under the hood stuff because

00:45:14 ◼   ► you know the rogue amoeba apps are not not working or bonten is not not working because

00:45:18 ◼   ► it looks different they've clearly made significant changes to the underpinnings of the operating

00:45:23 ◼   ► system that is meaning that a lot of people have a lot of work to do yeah yeah so they're

00:45:29 ◼   ► doing it I'm sure and it's not their fault that their their apps don't work with the

00:45:33 ◼   ► beta because it's a beta right like it's fine I know what I was getting myself into when

00:45:38 ◼   ► I signed up for this but it is we're in that point now where it's just it's a what ends

00:45:42 ◼   ► up happening is that I'm doing my job doing my normal things and then I'll click on something

00:45:46 ◼   ► or I'll try to do something and I'll go oh right and it's like something doesn't work

00:45:53 ◼   ► or doesn't work right and I'm reminded right Big Sur right and the good news is if it's

00:45:58 ◼   ► something I desperately need to do I have that Mojave Mac mini that will run 32-bit

00:46:04 ◼   ► apps you know which Catalina didn't it you know it has a lot going for it but I do hit

00:46:11 ◼   ► those every now and then but it's generally been okay I'll tell you the one thing that

00:46:15 ◼   ► I have had to change in from the default because I try to use the default because I want to

00:46:19 ◼   ► write about the default experience of of the OS when I when I review it but I had to check

00:46:28 ◼   ► reduce transparency so that I could read the menu bar yeah transparency in Mac OS is a

00:46:35 ◼   ► bad idea it's been a bad idea since they first introduced it I hate it and I always turn

00:46:39 ◼   ► it off I really don't like it I don't I don't get it yeah and the menu bar is just it's

00:46:43 ◼   ► bad like I I have lots of text that I put in my menu bar yeah and I just I can't read

00:46:52 ◼   ► it I can't it's not it's not good I don't like it plus I have I have a satellite image

00:47:00 ◼   ► in the background I actually use an app called downlink that puts satellite images live satellite

00:47:05 ◼   ► you know every hour satellite images as as your desktop changes it frequently yeah every

00:47:11 ◼   ► hour with a new picture of what's going on right now and but as a result the you know

00:47:18 ◼   ► the corner of my screen is outer space essentially and and therefore big Sur reads that as well

00:47:26 ◼   ► that's a black background so I'm gonna put all of the text of the menu bar on the left

00:47:30 ◼   ► side of my screen as as white text on a black background or a you know a mostly black background

00:47:37 ◼   ► I don't want my menu bar to be white I I'm not using dark mode right like I'm not in

00:47:42 ◼   ► dark mode I don't want my menu bar to be white text on a black background so reduce transparency

00:47:49 ◼   ► turns all that stuff off and it makes it a much better experience but I don't know what

00:47:54 ◼   ► Apple is thinking about legibility of menu bar items with that it just seems like a mistake

00:47:59 ◼   ► to me I hate it this is an interesting year to have so much change to the just the operating

00:48:06 ◼   ► system because like so developers like we're picking on in a mean way but we're singling

00:48:12 ◼   ► out wrong amoeba here today because it's a developer that we use all of their software

00:48:17 ◼   ► for and is really important to us like not only do they have to get their software ready

00:48:22 ◼   ► and everybody does but their software ready for Big Sur they also have Apple Silicon in

00:48:28 ◼   ► the back of their minds because right these Apple Silicon Macs are gonna sell in big numbers

00:48:34 ◼   ► to the Mac faithful right a lot of people are gonna buy the first Apple Silicon Mac

00:48:41 ◼   ► which will probably be a laptop she spoke about just because of what it is and it's

00:48:47 ◼   ► gonna be quite peculiar to to have maybe some apps not working for that machine you know

00:48:55 ◼   ► because as well like there might be a lot of people that buy an Apple Silicon Mac that

00:49:00 ◼   ► haven't updated their main Mac to Big Sur at that point right because there's some some

00:49:06 ◼   ► wonkiness to it so yeah I just I just an interesting thing that you have to consider all of it

00:49:12 ◼   ► well like I know like James Thompson's in our discord chat right now and is saying like

00:49:17 ◼   ► and I know this from talking to James that Apple Silicon has been no problem for him

00:49:21 ◼   ► but if you're dealing with that and your app already doesn't work in Big Sur it feels like

00:49:27 ◼   ► quite a big a big plate you've got to deal with right of stuff yeah there's a lot going

00:49:33 ◼   ► on like going on I would argue that it seems to be that being compatible with Big Sur is

00:49:38 ◼   ► more important than being compatible with Apple Silicon at this point because not only

00:49:42 ◼   ► if if everybody's apps are like James's apps it's James is gonna hate this James Thompson

00:49:47 ◼   ► said it's not a problem why why is it a problem for you are you not as good a developer as

00:49:51 ◼   ► James Thompson but so you know it'll run an emulation right it'll it'll use Rosetta so

00:49:58 ◼   ► like it's not a must it's not like your app won't work yeah of course of course yes yes

00:50:02 ◼   ► right about that I hadn't thought about that yeah it really is about Big Sur but if you

00:50:06 ◼   ► look like I mentioned bartender which is one of my favorite little utilities because it

00:50:10 ◼   ► lets me hide a bunch of menu bar items it's funny because it's sort of doing what the

00:50:13 ◼   ► control center icon is also doing in Big Sur which is I suspect why the developer has had

00:50:19 ◼   ► to say I have to rewrite I had to rewrite my whole app and it's in beta now but not

00:50:25 ◼   ► publicly yet because you know it's brand new and there are a lot of bugs but like they're

00:50:29 ◼   ► working on it but they completely overhauled the menu bar and so bartender doesn't work

00:50:34 ◼   ► so that there's gonna be stuff like that if it touches if the software update touches

00:50:38 ◼   ► on a place where you play as a an app developer that's the part that's gonna get you whether

00:50:44 ◼   ► it's a security change or a visual change or whatever and the menu bar is a great example

00:50:48 ◼   ► of that where you know bartender what I really think is the bartender needs to be like control

00:50:53 ◼   ► center I wish control center in Big Sur is really interesting right because it's a it's

00:50:57 ◼   ► a drop down containing a whole bunch of different stuff from different places and you can actually

00:51:01 ◼   ► even add and remove things to it but it's all Apple stuff I feel like a long range approach

00:51:08 ◼   ► for Apple is going to be to let third parties put their items in control center and get

00:51:16 ◼   ► them out of the menu bar I think that might be a place that they go eventually but a a

00:51:20 ◼   ► short term solution for bartender might be to be like control center and be a little

00:51:26 ◼   ► drop down that sequesters little things in it but probably he'll just implement it like

00:51:30 ◼   ► he like the current version where basically you click on the bartender icon and your existing

00:51:36 ◼   ► menu bar items kind of go away briefly and instead these the ones you've chosen to hide

00:51:40 ◼   ► appear and then you can click on them but anyway also bartenders a utility that's less

00:51:46 ◼   ► important on Big Sur in some ways because Apple itself is allowing you to collapse a

00:51:51 ◼   ► bunch of its menu bar items and just put them in control center so anyway life in Big Sur

00:51:59 ◼   ► it's okay but I had to turn off transparency because transparency is bad

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00:53:23 ◼   ► So Jason there is a rumor which may only last for 24 hours or so from us talking about this

00:53:32 ◼   ► yes hello listeners from the future you might have to skip this part but we're gonna talk

00:53:40 ◼   ► about it anyway so John Prosser who is a relatively recent or a newcomer to the rumor mill reporting

00:53:50 ◼   ► leaking as I don't really understand what the difference is in the media between people

00:53:56 ◼   ► that report rumors and people that report leaks they seem pretty much the same to me

00:54:01 ◼   ► nevertheless John Prosser is referred to in the Apple media typically as a leaker which

00:54:08 ◼   ► I just don't like that I just don't like calling someone that it's just seems mean anyway John

00:54:12 ◼   ► Prosser claims that there will be some form of news from Apple on September 8th at 9 a.m.

00:54:20 ◼   ► Eastern Time which is tomorrow as we record this Prosser had previously claimed that this

00:54:26 ◼   ► that there would be some news related to the debut of the Apple watch and a new iPad of

00:54:32 ◼   ► some kind so we can assume that that is what Prosser will be saying is going to be happening

00:54:37 ◼   ► Mark Gurman countered this by saying there will be no hardware releases this week but

00:54:42 ◼   ► if there is any news it will be the announcement of an Apple event date so the date when they

00:54:48 ◼   ► will be showing off the iPhones so there's a couple of questions here and some of this

00:54:53 ◼   ► stuff is definitely relevant whether the news occurs tomorrow or not but it just gave us

00:54:57 ◼   ► a way to talk about it so the first part is do we think it is likely that Apple would

00:55:02 ◼   ► release hardware before an event specifically something like the Apple watch like my thinking

00:55:09 ◼   ► is would they not have to release iOS 14 and watch OS 7 if they want a new Apple watch

00:55:16 ◼   ► well not not necessarily right like you could there's a couple scenarios here first off

00:55:22 ◼   ► is they could release the new Apple watch and have support for it in the existing in

00:55:30 ◼   ► like one of these recent iOS updates support for that OS version right they could do something

00:55:36 ◼   ► like that it's probably more work than is necessary but I think they could if they wanted

00:55:39 ◼   ► to they put their mind to it the other thing is they might announce an Apple watch and

00:55:44 ◼   ► release iOS 14 right when by the time it shipped release iOS 14 I find it a little peculiar

00:55:51 ◼   ► like why not give the Apple watch what would what is the benefit of announcing an Apple

00:55:57 ◼   ► watch in advance of an iPhone event when you could announce it it gets a little bit of

00:56:03 ◼   ► sunshine on its own but then you're going to just talk about it and say oh by the way

00:56:07 ◼   ► yeah we released the Apple watch already like at the event so to me could they do it absolutely

00:56:17 ◼   ► and maybe it would be an interesting experiment to say what if we did it this way but I think

00:56:23 ◼   ► there is the opening question that you know is what about the OS release how does this

00:56:28 ◼   ► dovetail with the OS release do you have to have because you can use an Apple watch with

00:56:34 ◼   ► a phone that's not running iOS 14 right can you do that do if you buy an Apple watch do

00:56:39 ◼   ► you have to have the latest version of iOS to run on it well I think if it's running

00:56:45 ◼   ► the latest version of watch OS I'm gonna assume the answer is yes well if I if I wander in

00:56:50 ◼   ► a into an Apple store which you know mostly not open where I am but if I go and go to

00:56:55 ◼   ► an Apple store and I say I would like to buy an Apple watch I have a phone that runs iOS

00:56:59 ◼   ► 12 would they say well you'll need to update it probably they would so it's a complication

00:57:05 ◼   ► I I don't know I I think they get around it if they really really wanted to but my question

00:57:09 ◼   ► is why would they really want to unless they just thought that they were experimenting

00:57:14 ◼   ► Zach and the discord is confirming that to run watch OS 7 you have to be running watch

00:57:18 ◼   ► iOS 14 so that's it so unless they did some engineering work to make it a built the ability

00:57:25 ◼   ► to go run the new watch OS on the old version which why would they do that well the reason

00:57:32 ◼   ► they might do that Jason is last year do you remember last year we talked about it right

00:57:37 ◼   ► you know it would be wouldn't it be nice if you built new hardware with the ability to

00:57:41 ◼   ► run an old version of the hardware just in case you had the old version of the software

00:57:46 ◼   ► just in case you had a software problem right like the idea there is what if we what if

00:57:51 ◼   ► iOS 14 this isn't happening but what if I was 14 is such a disaster that you can't ship

00:57:55 ◼   ► the iPhone like that's that's catastrophic for Apple so do you make it so that it could

00:58:01 ◼   ► run on a late build of iOS 13 and the same could be true of the watch the watch could

00:58:06 ◼   ► ship with watch OS 6 it could but yes but they also could say you know like this week

00:58:14 ◼   ► or next week oh hey we have these new products and also this is your one week warning for

00:58:18 ◼   ► iOS yes as well by far the more likely scenario would be that I would be very very surprised

00:58:24 ◼   ► if Apple did have new hardware that released any of that hardware would run the old version

00:58:29 ◼   ► of the operating system when I think it could be argued I would be willing to make the argument

00:58:36 ◼   ► that iOS 14 is is is basically ready to go like you could you could the current version

00:58:41 ◼   ► of iOS 14 I think you could release it like it's way better than last year's 13 was when

00:58:47 ◼   ► they released that I'm talking 13 one right and as far as we know it's entirely possible

00:58:54 ◼   ► that the one that were the code that we're running right now is the one that's going

00:58:57 ◼   ► to be loaded on iPhones yeah or that the one that we get this week is going to be loaded

00:59:02 ◼   ► on iPhones like we're at that point now where if they're going to ship iPhones at the end

00:59:07 ◼   ► of the month we're either using or about to receive in the next week or so what's effectively

00:59:12 ◼   ► the final master yeah right which doesn't mean they stop working right they immediately

00:59:17 ◼   ► switch over to the the emergency bug fix update version of it but at some point they do have

00:59:23 ◼   ► to put the software on the phones so you've got to draw a line in the sand and and that

00:59:28 ◼   ► you know you can always like you know you can have like updates on day one basically

00:59:34 ◼   ► right that will come when the but yes you're right like the phones you would assume are

00:59:38 ◼   ► in production at some point the software has to go on thumb like you you kind of have to

00:59:44 ◼   ► do that so I mean I guess that the biggest the the other question is this particular

00:59:50 ◼   ► set of hardware an Apple watch and an iPad could you imagine them announcing them before

00:59:57 ◼   ► the iPhone event and if that is the case what what does that say about this hardware and

01:00:01 ◼   ► the other hardware Apple does have to show well I find it a little bit weird that it's

01:00:07 ◼   ► the you know we don't want to have the event be too long argument because you could do

01:00:13 ◼   ► that right you could do that I'm not sure taking a brand new Apple watch and a brand

01:00:18 ◼   ► new iPad that has you know if the iPad air rumor is to be believed you know has some

01:00:23 ◼   ► interesting changes to it and tossing them out with a press release or maybe a short

01:00:30 ◼   ► video that when you've got the iPhone event like what is the trade-off there the trade-off

01:00:35 ◼   ► is that your iPhone event if you're doing it as a video is more focused it's not as

01:00:40 ◼   ► long well I mean the argument might be Jason for new iPhones at least one Mac which has

01:00:47 ◼   ► a brand new direction for the Mac over-the-ear headphones potentially some over some other

01:00:54 ◼   ► AirPods thing and hold it with the Mac hold it with the Mac thing because I think the

01:00:58 ◼   ► Mac is a much bigger outlier than the than the existing products we're talking about

01:01:03 ◼   ► the watch and the iPad like a Mac don't do you won't do the Mac at the iPhone event like

01:01:09 ◼   ► that would be I mean they could but but that would be to me the first thing to go because

01:01:14 ◼   ► just first off you know Big Sur probably uses needs more time to cook and and second just

01:01:21 ◼   ► do another event late October like do another event for Apple Silicon why why rush it why

01:01:27 ◼   ► do that now these are a little bit more in tune with the iPhone and we've seen them before

01:01:32 ◼   ► but yeah I will take your larger point which is there's a lot if there are four iPhones

01:01:38 ◼   ► especially there's a lot to cover and that's when I talk about like experimenting that's

01:01:43 ◼   ► what I'm really saying is why do a two-hour long video about the iPhone and an iPad and

01:01:50 ◼   ► an Apple watch tradition but the tradition is based on in part getting a bunch of people

01:01:58 ◼   ► in a room and doing an event that way and we're not doing that anymore so it's worth

01:02:02 ◼   ► asking the question would it be better to give the Apple watch its own launch video

01:02:07 ◼   ► or launch press or whatever would that be better or not I could see arguments on both

01:02:13 ◼   ► of those and then you stretch it out you get that because there can't be if Apple want

01:02:17 ◼   ► there to be the hands-on videos which I think they definitely do otherwise the hands-on

01:02:22 ◼   ► area wouldn't exist like they can't it's gonna be it would be very difficult and there would

01:02:28 ◼   ► be a prioritization thing from especially people in you in the YouTube space like if

01:02:34 ◼   ► you're gonna sell it send them the new iPhones and a new Apple watch that watch might not

01:02:38 ◼   ► get videos right and so my counter-argument is that they also have to do like press review

01:02:47 ◼   ► programs for all these products and it's more work if you have multiple waves of product

01:02:56 ◼   ► releases sure then it is to have one wave where you do one set of briefings and one

01:03:01 ◼   ► set of mailing out review units and all of that right it's more work not that they couldn't

01:03:05 ◼   ► do it but they're making more work for themselves and and that's what it comes down to to me

01:03:08 ◼   ► is it's more work it's more complicated is it worth it is it worth it to do it that way

01:03:15 ◼   ► instead of having it just be a segment at the beginning of the iPhone video that is

01:03:20 ◼   ► before we get to you know our main interaction let's talk about the Apple watch and doing

01:03:24 ◼   ► it in a more traditional way anyway I think I think the biggest argument actually against

01:03:30 ◼   ► it is Apple watch is a hit product it does really well the wearables category is going

01:03:36 ◼   ► great if you release it via press release or minor thing what does that say about that

01:03:47 ◼   ► product that it that it got yanked off of the iPhone stage where it's been all along

01:03:53 ◼   ► so I think that's an argument to to keep it in the iPhone event but Apple in the end I

01:03:59 ◼   ► think it's going to come down to does Apple want to go with tradition or does Apple want

01:04:02 ◼   ► to experiment with some things and just see how they work but I wouldn't put money on

01:04:08 ◼   ► it well you did mention hip hip product and services wearables going great but maybe they

01:04:14 ◼   ► also might want to get some of those sales in this quarter maybe it's not a big reason

01:04:21 ◼   ► but it's another reason yeah I mean it's not going to be a lot of Apple watch sales also

01:04:27 ◼   ► happen in store and in store is problematic right now so I don't know so that's the hardware

01:04:35 ◼   ► argument but if we go with Mark Gorman's argument that if we're like you to hear anything this

01:04:40 ◼   ► week it will be a date for an event we could say I mean you'd probably assume they're only

01:04:45 ◼   ► going to announce it if it's soon so then would maybe be looking at like the 15th or

01:04:52 ◼   ► the 22nd right as our Apple events with a phone shipping on with the first wave of phones

01:04:58 ◼   ► shipping on the 25th or October 2nd which a few weeks later than usual is what they

01:05:05 ◼   ► said in the analyst call and you know take your pick it would not be unreasonable to

01:05:12 ◼   ► have them do a September 22nd event and have the first phones ship October 2nd but instead

01:05:18 ◼   ► of in September but they could also do it shipping October or September 25th I do think

01:05:24 ◼   ► it's going to be a traditional span of time only because you don't want to make people

01:05:28 ◼   ► wait too long you want to get people excited and then you want to open the pre-orders and

01:05:31 ◼   ► then you want to be able to ship the products and have them all arrive on the following

01:05:35 ◼   ► week so I think that they'll keep that and so the date that they select is going to be

01:05:40 ◼   ► the date that is backdated from when they are going to be able to ship the product if

01:05:45 ◼   ► I was just randomly pulling numbers out of the air I would say event on the 22nd with

01:05:52 ◼   ► the second as the first round of iPhones second of October is the first round of iPhones.

01:05:56 ◼   ► I would err on the side of of pushing it back you know Luca said the CFO who made this statement

01:06:05 ◼   ► he said a few weeks didn't he so I think more than one week later than traditional although

01:06:12 ◼   ► you could argue that yeah if this was a normal year which it is most definitely not the Apple

01:06:17 ◼   ► event would probably be Wednesday this week because it's the you know that not the day

01:06:24 ◼   ► after Labor Day but the day after the day after Labor Day is I think they've done that

01:06:28 ◼   ► before so pushing it back to the 22nd or something like that is not unreasonable at all given

01:06:36 ◼   ► the circumstances but who knows again the beauty of it is we don't know we've seen WWDC

01:06:41 ◼   ► so we have some idea of what something like this is like but they could you know do something

01:06:48 ◼   ► completely different they could release a product every week but I don't think they

01:06:54 ◼   ► will.

01:06:55 ◼   ► You know I know a lot of developers and a lot of our friends writing reviews and stuff

01:06:59 ◼   ► are concerned about this because of the timing but I mean really the big concern is when's

01:07:03 ◼   ► the draft gonna happen.

01:07:04 ◼   ► Oh boy.

01:07:05 ◼   ► You know I know that's what everyone should care about.

01:07:07 ◼   ► And when does the summer of fun end right?

01:07:10 ◼   ► Yeah I mean that's the last summer of fun ending who knows when that's gonna be because

01:07:14 ◼   ► it's like when are the phones gonna start arriving right?

01:07:18 ◼   ► You know because really the summer of fun I mean we always say it ends with like the

01:07:21 ◼   ► iPhone thing because the iPhone event because then the phones start coming out we start

01:07:26 ◼   ► doing our first impressions and reviews of the phones but like that might stretch on

01:07:30 ◼   ► so the summer of fun might actually end up going past the draft.

01:07:34 ◼   ► Who knows this year right?

01:07:35 ◼   ► Nobody knows what could happen next.

01:07:38 ◼   ► So yeah we're you know I hope that we'll get at least notice I think we will get at least

01:07:44 ◼   ► a week's notice I would expect to the event.

01:07:47 ◼   ► I think they will still do that even though they don't need to.

01:07:50 ◼   ► I think they will still give a hey in a week's time because they did that for WWDC too.

01:07:57 ◼   ► They still sent out an e-invite basically like a week or so before for the WWDC keynote

01:08:05 ◼   ► even though we all knew exactly when that one was gonna be right?

01:08:08 ◼   ► So I still expect there will be because I mean look Apple want it to be covered by the

01:08:13 ◼   ► press like they need to get it on people's calendars so they can do that right?

01:08:18 ◼   ► Like it's kind of important to get that in so you know and also I'm sure everyone Apple

01:08:25 ◼   ► cares about the draft and they know they don't want to have us have no draft but we said

01:08:30 ◼   ► we'd come back to the first Apple Silicon Max because I think they will announce it

01:08:36 ◼   ► at the iPhone event but I'm getting a sense from you that you do not think so.

01:08:41 ◼   ► I if I had to bet I would say that it will be a separate announcement whether it's an

01:08:46 ◼   ► event or not we can debate that because they're not really events anymore as much as they

01:08:51 ◼   ► are sort of just announcement streams.

01:08:55 ◼   ► I would say late October early November along with Big Sur just push it all back they don't

01:09:00 ◼   ► need to ship all that stuff simultaneous with iOS and they haven't in the past.

01:09:06 ◼   ► My argument isn't that they will ship this stuff together.

01:09:10 ◼   ► But you'll think they'll announce it together I don't think they will.

01:09:13 ◼   ► It's possible but I think that there's enough going on in the Mac that the Mac is not going

01:09:18 ◼   ► to be joined to the iPhone in that way.

01:09:22 ◼   ► I think it is a better fit in a separate event and they've shown that again and again that

01:09:28 ◼   ► they treat the Mac stuff sort of separately from the iPhone stuff.

01:09:31 ◼   ► So I would definitely bet later if I had to bet.

01:09:36 ◼   ► Yeah I mean I understand that right like the idea of giving it its focus right like I totally

01:09:42 ◼   ► get that argument but like my thinking on it is right like the reason that I think that

01:09:48 ◼   ► they would maybe do them together is so you get the majority like the most eyeballs on

01:09:54 ◼   ► it as possible.

01:09:56 ◼   ► That's been the argument but they haven't done it right like they haven't done it instead

01:09:59 ◼   ► they have a late fall event they have a late October you know Halloween.

01:10:04 ◼   ► I think that like it's not been necessary for the Mac in in previous years to do that

01:10:10 ◼   ► right so like.

01:10:11 ◼   ► But they have they have done it with less exciting like they did it with the Mac Mini

01:10:15 ◼   ► and the MacBook Air return right.

01:10:17 ◼   ► That was that and the iPad Pro was one event.

01:10:20 ◼   ► I mean they have done these Mac events that are you know the other products we do that

01:10:24 ◼   ► are more about productivity and less you know and aren't iPhones and they've done them later

01:10:29 ◼   ► and launching Apple Silicon and boasting about how great Apple Silicon is and what all the

01:10:34 ◼   ► amazing things they've done with Apple Silicon it seems to me that there's more material

01:10:40 ◼   ► for that kind of an event as a standalone event than there's ever been for a Mac event before.

01:10:45 ◼   ► So I think it's even more likely that they would spread that around and let that be separate.

01:10:51 ◼   ► The only other part of it I think that would give me continued pause on it is when does

01:10:56 ◼   ► the iPhone event actually happen because there is only so much time left right like if we

01:11:01 ◼   ► start pushing towards October.

01:11:04 ◼   ► Even if the iPhone event is on the 22nd of September like we've had we've had those late

01:11:09 ◼   ► October early November kind of Apple events before I think that's just fine I think it's

01:11:13 ◼   ► just fine.

01:11:14 ◼   ► Yeah okay I'm not married to it it's just like if I was gonna put money on it I would

01:11:19 ◼   ► say they do it all together but I see lots of I see and agree with lots of the things

01:11:26 ◼   ► that you're saying here as to why they would want to have them separated.

01:11:30 ◼   ► I feel like we really need to have a draft to settle this.

01:11:33 ◼   ► Oh yeah no I'm not draft picking it I don't think I don't think I'm so confident that

01:11:38 ◼   ► I'm willing to lose a draft pick.

01:11:40 ◼   ► All right.

01:11:41 ◼   ► On it.

01:11:42 ◼   ► We'll see.

01:11:43 ◼   ► That says a lot.

01:11:44 ◼   ► The thing is about the draft it's like I would be burning really good picks to pick the max

01:11:49 ◼   ► will be shown off like I've got all the iPhone stuff to lose at that point right like all

01:11:57 ◼   ► of the various iPhone picks.

01:11:58 ◼   ► I'm just saying you talked you talked a big game there but now you're not gonna pick it

01:12:01 ◼   ► so.

01:12:02 ◼   ► I talk a big game when there's no stakes yeah but like what I'm saying is right if we're

01:12:07 ◼   ► drafting like say next week right I will have it on my list but it will be before all of

01:12:14 ◼   ► the things that I'm way more confident in right like I know it's going to be an iPhone

01:12:18 ◼   ► I know it is going to be four of them.

01:12:21 ◼   ► I know I'm confident about all of the features that I think those iPhones are going to get

01:12:26 ◼   ► and I would want to pick all of those before I get to the Mac right.

01:12:33 ◼   ► You know what then on me.

01:12:35 ◼   ► Hey Mr. draft maybe you pick that there won't be max and you pick that early and I'll pick

01:12:41 ◼   ► there will be max and we'll maybe those number one pick.

01:12:45 ◼   ► Maybe that'll be our tiebreaker.

01:12:47 ◼   ► Maybe interesting interesting.

01:12:51 ◼   ► So yes there's so maybe by the time you've heard this you'll know that Apple isn't doing

01:12:55 ◼   ► anything on September 8th but what we won't know maybe who knows is when the event will

01:13:00 ◼   ► be so but nevertheless we're ramping up towards it now at a breakneck speed.

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01:15:14 ◼   ► Now Myke before we get to our last segment I want to say one last thing about events.

01:15:20 ◼   ► Okay.

01:15:21 ◼   ► And this is in collaboration with some good people in the Discord.

01:15:24 ◼   ► I'm going to throw in one reason why you might be right after all.

01:15:28 ◼   ► Okay.

01:15:29 ◼   ► Well, it's election day in the US on November 5th.

01:15:34 ◼   ► Maybe if you're Apple you don't want to try to launch a product during the last couple

01:15:43 ◼   ► of weeks of the election campaign in the US which are sure to be super weird and unpleasant.

01:15:50 ◼   ► So I will throw that in there that that is I could see how Apple might have a strategy

01:15:57 ◼   ► which is let's do our event late in September get it out before the election hysteria to

01:16:02 ◼   ► a fever pitch.

01:16:03 ◼   ► Sorry November 5th is Emma's birthday in the chat room.

01:16:10 ◼   ► It's a natural holiday here.

01:16:19 ◼   ► So if I'm Apple and I look at that and I think well okay we're going to be late with our

01:16:22 ◼   ► iPhone event and the elections coming up and do we really want to collide with all the

01:16:27 ◼   ► talk about the election people are going to be distracted.

01:16:30 ◼   ► I could see that argument as to just blowing it out with one big thing in instead of doing

01:16:39 ◼   ► that little later event in late October.

01:16:41 ◼   ► So that's just a thought.

01:16:43 ◼   ► Should we do some hashtag #askupgradequestions?

01:16:48 ◼   ► This is possibly the longest askupgradequestion that we've ever done but I think that the

01:16:52 ◼   ► the preamble to it is important to understand the question.

01:16:56 ◼   ► So this comes from Bridge and Bridge asks I have used a Mac since System 7 came out

01:17:02 ◼   ► on my Power Mac 8600/300.

01:17:06 ◼   ► What is the 8600/300?

01:17:07 ◼   ► The 300 was the megahertz of the processor inside the Power Mac 8600.

01:17:12 ◼   ► Okay.

01:17:13 ◼   ► We're back in the 90s now.

01:17:14 ◼   ► Wonderful.

01:17:15 ◼   ► While I'm working with an app I regularly press command S to save.

01:17:20 ◼   ► I've done it for so long it's a muscle memory action that I don't realise I'm doing

01:17:24 ◼   ► anymore.

01:17:25 ◼   ► My kids who generally use iPads in school ask me why do I keep pressing these two keys.

01:17:29 ◼   ► When I try to explain that it's because you could lose your data if the machine turns

01:17:33 ◼   ► off unexpectedly they just respond that it's always saved.

01:17:36 ◼   ► You just restart the iPad or Google docs and it always keeps the work.

01:17:39 ◼   ► Jason, since you're an old time Mac user like me do you use command S for save a lot

01:17:44 ◼   ► even though most programs auto save now and we have a more robust operating system that

01:17:49 ◼   ► doesn't crash as much.

01:17:51 ◼   ► Myke, as a relative newcomer to Mac OS X, I don't know why people think this, do you

01:17:56 ◼   ► use command S while you work or just let the program auto save until you are done with

01:18:02 ◼   ► the work and then save it then?

01:18:03 ◼   ► I just want to clear up this point.

01:18:04 ◼   ► So I have been using the Mac for over 15 years.

01:18:07 ◼   ► Before that I used PCs which also need saving.

01:18:09 ◼   ► I mean I've been using computers like 20 years at this point.

01:18:13 ◼   ► Like I'm not a relative newcomer by any stretch of the imagination but now we've

01:18:17 ◼   ► made that point.

01:18:18 ◼   ► Let's answer the question.

01:18:19 ◼   ► I'm using KC Liss.

01:18:20 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean I have been using the Mac longer than KC and Marco.

01:18:29 ◼   ► They're relative newcomers.

01:18:30 ◼   ► They're just confused as what ATP is.

01:18:32 ◼   ► Yeah, like think about that everyone.

01:18:34 ◼   ► I have been using the Mac daily for longer than them too.

01:18:38 ◼   ► Come on.

01:18:39 ◼   ► That's right.

01:18:40 ◼   ► So do I reflectively command S?

01:18:43 ◼   ► Yes absolutely I do.

01:18:44 ◼   ► I absolutely do.

01:18:45 ◼   ► Not as much as I used to.

01:18:47 ◼   ► It used to I would sit in whatever program I was using and I would just sit there and

01:18:51 ◼   ► go S. Hold down the command key with my thumb and just do S S S S S all the time.

01:18:59 ◼   ► Yeah I do that thing where like when I do that I don't just press it once.

01:19:03 ◼   ► I'll do it like two or three times.

01:19:05 ◼   ► I don't know why.

01:19:06 ◼   ► I just do that right.

01:19:07 ◼   ► If I'm going to save I'll do it more than one time.

01:19:10 ◼   ► Yeah for sure.

01:19:11 ◼   ► So I do that.

01:19:12 ◼   ► That is a nervous habit.

01:19:13 ◼   ► I still do it.

01:19:14 ◼   ► I am annoyed by when I'm in an app that you do command S and it doesn't it like throws

01:19:19 ◼   ► up a dialogue and says this is being saved automatically.

01:19:23 ◼   ► Why did you type that key?

01:19:24 ◼   ► It's like shut up.

01:19:25 ◼   ► Just shut up.

01:19:26 ◼   ► I don't I don't do it.

01:19:29 ◼   ► I'm pretty good at not doing it in places it's not to be done.

01:19:32 ◼   ► Like I don't do it in Google Docs.

01:19:33 ◼   ► You know I don't really do it on I don't think I do it on any iPad app.

01:19:37 ◼   ► It just happens accidentally sometimes that I just get into that kind of mode.

01:19:43 ◼   ► But so yeah I do that.

01:19:46 ◼   ► Also not all apps auto save and I do have those moments where I where something crashes.

01:19:51 ◼   ► I actually just had this happen with an iOS app that I was working on an iPad app and

01:19:57 ◼   ► it hard crashed it locked up that thing where you know you just basically have to wait for

01:20:00 ◼   ► it to auto quit.

01:20:02 ◼   ► And I thought oh boy and it doesn't have a save command like because instead of having

01:20:08 ◼   ► a save command you play the game.

01:20:09 ◼   ► When was the last time it auto saved.

01:20:12 ◼   ► Unfortunately I didn't lose anything because the truth is most stuff does a good job of

01:20:17 ◼   ► auto saving because at some point in the last 20 years people realized that it was really

01:20:22 ◼   ► lousy that you had to save all the time.

01:20:25 ◼   ► And there was a period where computers it took there was a period where using Microsoft

01:20:30 ◼   ► Word if you did command s you had to wait like 10 seconds for your file to save right.

01:20:38 ◼   ► And then they invented fast save as a way to make it a little bit faster but like there's

01:20:42 ◼   ► a reason why auto save didn't exist because it used to be very intense to save but now

01:20:47 ◼   ► it's not.

01:20:48 ◼   ► So generally things are pretty good about auto saving.

01:20:52 ◼   ► MOMO asks will either of you consider more of an investment into the Android ecosystem

01:20:59 ◼   ► to try out Microsoft Project xCloud.

01:21:01 ◼   ► I'm assuming that you will not you do not care about this.

01:21:06 ◼   ► I do not care.

01:21:07 ◼   ► I have more consoles at my house than I know what to do with and I don't play them for

01:21:11 ◼   ► the you know in large part anyway.

01:21:14 ◼   ► So no.

01:21:15 ◼   ► You see this is the frustration for me with the possibility that is one becoming the iOS

01:21:22 ◼   ► is I do want to try xCloud.

01:21:24 ◼   ► So this is the it's I think it's called game pass ultimate now so it's part of the Microsoft

01:21:29 ◼   ► game pass service and it's basically what allows you to play Xbox games on other devices.

01:21:37 ◼   ► And they're streaming over the web.

01:21:40 ◼   ► Now I would like to try this but I really find this to be more of a tablet experience

01:21:44 ◼   ► than a phone experience like I have Android phones but I'm not interested in Android tablets

01:21:49 ◼   ► because typically they're not that good.

01:21:51 ◼   ► The Samsung stuff the Samsung tab is considered to be the best and they have some good features

01:21:58 ◼   ► on a show I do called the test drivers recently with Austin Evans.

01:22:01 ◼   ► Austin switched to using one instead of his iPad for a week and we spoke about that if

01:22:06 ◼   ► you're interested in listening it's episode 9 I'll put a link in the show notes.

01:22:09 ◼   ► But I'm not I don't really want an Android tablet really because like the Android tablet

01:22:16 ◼   ► experience is not that great.

01:22:18 ◼   ► So you know this is like the frustration is I want to try this service out but I don't

01:22:22 ◼   ► want to play console games on a phone because I know it's not going to work that great because

01:22:27 ◼   ► the UI is going to be too small.

01:22:30 ◼   ► So it's part of why I would really love to be able to take my Xbox controller pair it

01:22:35 ◼   ► to my 12.9 inch iPad and play like Forza wherever I want.

01:22:41 ◼   ► So I really mean I continue to hope that that is a situation that can get worked out but

01:22:44 ◼   ► I don't have a lot of hope at this point because Apple must review every application single

01:22:49 ◼   ► on its own.

01:22:51 ◼   ► No because Apple is afraid of game streaming.

01:22:53 ◼   ► Yeah that's it.

01:22:54 ◼   ► That's the real reason.

01:22:55 ◼   ► We know that.

01:22:56 ◼   ► That's the real reason.

01:22:57 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:22:58 ◼   ► Sims asks how much storage do you actually use on your phones and how difficult would

01:23:02 ◼   ► it be for you to switch to a 64 gigabyte phone.

01:23:07 ◼   ► So I will answer the second question first by saying I mean I could do it anyone can

01:23:11 ◼   ► do it but I would have to give up a lot of the way that I like to use my phone.

01:23:16 ◼   ► So I will tell you I have a 256 gigabyte phone.

01:23:20 ◼   ► I'm currently using 252.7 gigabytes of that phone.

01:23:28 ◼   ► On what?

01:23:29 ◼   ► Now the reason is 106 gigabytes is my photo library because I keep all of my photos on

01:23:35 ◼   ► my device.

01:23:36 ◼   ► The reason I do this is because I had grown frustrated with wanting to look at images

01:23:43 ◼   ► and then they do that loading thing that iCloud photo library does.

01:23:47 ◼   ► So I find it frustrating.

01:23:49 ◼   ► So this does mean I will be going up a storage tier for my next phone.

01:23:54 ◼   ► But yeah so that's the main reason is like half of that used storage is my photo library.

01:23:59 ◼   ► I don't use most of the storage on my phone.

01:24:03 ◼   ► It would be okay if I switch to a 64 gig phone.

01:24:08 ◼   ► What I would lose probably is I will occasionally there's not a problem right now but if I'm

01:24:12 ◼   ► taking a trip I will preload like movies to watch on the plane.

01:24:16 ◼   ► I will preload music so that I can listen to the music on the plane.

01:24:25 ◼   ► Mostly that or if I'm going someplace that doesn't have reliable internet.

01:24:28 ◼   ► I will you know some of those playlists I mentioned earlier I'll download those to my

01:24:32 ◼   ► device but that's about it.

01:24:35 ◼   ► It wouldn't be that difficult.

01:24:37 ◼   ► I'm not exactly sure why the Dropbox app is taking up 12 gigabytes of space for me on

01:24:42 ◼   ► my phone but it is.

01:24:45 ◼   ► And I have 55 gigabytes of messages because I see that auto delete old conversations thing

01:24:50 ◼   ► right and I could enable that and the phone's telling me I'll save 29 gigabytes if I do

01:24:55 ◼   ► it.

01:24:56 ◼   ► But the messages in the cloud if you have that on you should need to have it locally.

01:25:00 ◼   ► But like I'm concerned because it says automatically removes all your messages and attachments

01:25:05 ◼   ► that was sent or received over a year ago and I just come like I don't know if I if

01:25:12 ◼   ► I trust it but like if I so if I enable that is it going to save the messages and attachments

01:25:18 ◼   ► in the cloud like how easily can I get to them.

01:25:20 ◼   ► That's I get a little nervous about that.

01:25:23 ◼   ► Most of my messages not important some of them very important to me and I wouldn't want

01:25:28 ◼   ► to lose them.

01:25:29 ◼   ► Yeah I don't want to delete I don't want to delete messages on my phone I just want them

01:25:32 ◼   ► to be synced to the cloud and then removed as necessary.

01:25:36 ◼   ► Yeah I have that on right like I have messages in the cloud but I haven't done the automatic

01:25:42 ◼   ► deletion thing of like a removal thing because I don't know that's it that just that that

01:25:47 ◼   ► warning concerns me Jason I don't like the way it's written so it scares me from tapping

01:25:53 ◼   ► the button.

01:25:55 ◼   ► So it will be very difficult for me to go down to a 16 my messages wouldn't even fit.

01:26:00 ◼   ► Okay so that there's the answer is bad for Myke not bad for me.

01:26:06 ◼   ► Bastian asks I heard Myke say that he ordered some bento keycaps which have kind of characters

01:26:11 ◼   ► on them is this solely for aesthetics or is there an intent to learn Japanese.

01:26:15 ◼   ► So I'll include a link in the show notes to a different keycap set that I ordered Jason

01:26:20 ◼   ► called GMK bento which is very nice looking and I will get it currently in March even

01:26:25 ◼   ► though I ordered it a couple of weeks ago because that's what you're getting into if

01:26:30 ◼   ► you want to get in on keyboard group buys.

01:26:32 ◼   ► That's how it works.

01:26:33 ◼   ► That's how it works aloha.

01:26:36 ◼   ► This is purely for aesthetics I have no intention of learning Japanese right now or especially

01:26:41 ◼   ► learning how to type in Japanese like to type with Japanese characters I just think it looks

01:26:46 ◼   ► really nice and I already have a set of keycaps on a different keyboard that have kind of

01:26:53 ◼   ► characters on them.

01:26:54 ◼   ► I just think aesthetically I really like the look of it and this this keycap set in particular

01:27:00 ◼   ► the bento keycap set which I'm excited about but yeah so I as with many keyboard related

01:27:06 ◼   ► things which you will find out if you tune into the live stream at 10 a.m. Eastern on

01:27:09 ◼   ► Thursday for me is aesthetics stuff.

01:27:14 ◼   ► Another question today Alexander asks do you think that the Apple Silicon Max will see

01:27:18 ◼   ► any cost savings for the user?

01:27:21 ◼   ► If I had to guess I'd say no it could be because Apple's gonna save money on them my guess

01:27:26 ◼   ► is that Apple likes its price points where it is I think it gives Apple movement if it

01:27:30 ◼   ► wants to move down so like a small laptop might get if they could go down to $8.99 or

01:27:36 ◼   ► something and still make a good profit I think they would be happy with that but I think

01:27:39 ◼   ► higher up in the line they're more likely to soup up the features and keep the price

01:27:45 ◼   ► points because those price points have been tested and and stressed and checked but it's

01:27:51 ◼   ► possible they have the leeway to do it but if I had to bet I'd say they mostly won't

01:27:55 ◼   ► just because they like money.

01:27:59 ◼   ► I am in agreement with you except for one asterisk which I think you will agree with

01:28:04 ◼   ► me on is that I don't think that the MacBook if it came back would cost the same as the

01:28:09 ◼   ► MacBook did before.

01:28:10 ◼   ► And that's and yeah and that's sort of what I'm getting at with having a low a lower price

01:28:15 ◼   ► it gives you the ability to price something like that the MacBook was overpriced so having

01:28:19 ◼   ► the MacBook come in at $9.99 or $8.99 would be perfectly reasonable or even $10.99 we'll

01:28:24 ◼   ► see what they do but they have the ability to do that I think.

01:28:27 ◼   ► If you would like to send in a question for a future episode of upgrade just send out

01:28:30 ◼   ► a tweet with the hashtag #askupgrade or just use question mark ask upgrade in the RelayFM

01:28:34 ◼   ► members discord if you want to get into the discord you should sign up for upgrade plus

01:28:38 ◼   ► that's a great way to do it to become a RelayFM member and you will get additional features

01:28:44 ◼   ► from the upgrade program so if you go sign up at getupgradeplus.com you get more upgrade

01:28:50 ◼   ► and no ads and also you get early release of 20 for 20 Mac episodes as well that's an

01:28:56 ◼   ► extra perk for upgrade plus subscribers and thank you so much to everybody that has done

01:29:00 ◼   ► that and if you do thank you so much and also do not forget please please please donate

01:29:06 ◼   ► to St Jude by going to stjude.org/relay and you can sign up there Jason more money has

01:29:13 ◼   ► been raised as we are recorded today and we're now $142,000 raised for St Jude so please

01:29:20 ◼   ► keep that donation going we've had an incredible week especially thank you so much to everybody

01:29:25 ◼   ► that shared the campaign and has donated to the campaign it means an awful awful lot to

01:29:30 ◼   ► all of us if you'd like to find links and information about this episode you can find

01:29:34 ◼   ► them in your podcast app of choice or at relay.fm/upgrade/314 if you'd like to find Jason's work online

01:29:41 ◼   ► including the 20 for 20 Macs articles and essays go to sixcolors.com where you can find

01:29:47 ◼   ► those Jason is @jsnell I am @imike thank you to KiwiCo, Pingdom and Squarespace for their

01:29:55 ◼   ► support of this episode and we'll be back next time until then say goodbye Justin Snell

01:29:59 ◼   ► Goodbye Myke Hurley

01:30:00 ◼   ► [Music]

01:30:14 ◼   ► [Music]