Upgrade

00:00:00 ◼   ► [Music]

00:00:22 ◼   ► From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 396.

00:00:26 ◼   ► Today's show is brought to you by TextExpander, Unipizza Ovens, ZocDoc, and Memberful.

00:00:32 ◼   ► My name is Myke Hurley and I am joined by the one and only Jason Snell.

00:00:35 ◼   ► Hi Jason Snell.

00:00:36 ◼   ► Hi Myke Hurley, was that draft music I heard?

00:00:40 ◼   ► That was indeed.

00:00:41 ◼   ► That can't be.

00:00:42 ◼   ► Draft music.

00:00:43 ◼   ► That can't be.

00:00:44 ◼   ► Jason it can be.

00:00:45 ◼   ► Here's the deal, alright?

00:00:48 ◼   ► We're going rogue today.

00:00:50 ◼   ► We are.

00:00:51 ◼   ► We are assuming there will be an Apple event next week.

00:00:56 ◼   ► So the assumption has been for a while there will be one in March.

00:00:59 ◼   ► The Sheriff of Rua Town, Mark Gorman, has been suggesting for multiple weeks that it

00:01:06 ◼   ► is going to be March 8th.

00:01:08 ◼   ► Here's the thing.

00:01:10 ◼   ► I am traveling later this week going to Memphis.

00:01:15 ◼   ► The concern we have right now, or the concern I had, that if there is an event announced

00:01:22 ◼   ► sometime in the next 24 hours, which is what we would expect if it's going to be on March 8th.

00:01:26 ◼   ► Right. We would struggle to find a time to record a draft episode. So, we're gonna draft today.

00:01:35 ◼   ► I've been pushing this for a little while with these weak warning events and us doing the double

00:01:41 ◼   ► episodes with the draft as an emergency episode to say if we feel pretty good that an event is

00:01:48 ◼   ► gonna happen, even if it's not exactly when we think. I'm not sure I see the harm in doing

00:01:56 ◼   ► the draft, and if the draft has to remain in kind of a hovering above us for an extra

00:02:02 ◼   ► week or two, that's okay. In fact, it might be good because it might mean that more stuff

00:02:08 ◼   ► will leak out, and it will be too bad for us because we will have already picked. And

00:02:13 ◼   ► I think the draft is better when there's more uncertainty.

00:02:18 ◼   ► If we draft when we know everything, then it's what is it that we're even doing here.

00:02:23 ◼   ► So I've been thinking maybe we should try this and then events have led us to this point

00:02:30 ◼   ► now.

00:02:31 ◼   ► So, kind of here's where we are.

00:02:33 ◼   ► We're going to make our draft today and if there's an event next week, great.

00:02:38 ◼   ► If there isn't an event, as Jason said, if there's an event in two weeks, also fine.

00:02:43 ◼   ► If the event ends up being in April, we're gonna kind of play it as it goes. Like one

00:02:49 ◼   ► thing that I had potentially thought that we could do is maybe like the week before

00:02:53 ◼   ► we get to change one pick, you know, we'll see.

00:02:56 ◼   ► That would be a maybe a fun game we could do if it comes to that. But we, I think, although

00:03:01 ◼   ► Mark Gurman, who is definitely leading a cattle out onto the Ponderosa in Rumour Roundup,

00:03:11 ◼   ► I think he keeps saying probably, but he doesn't know.

00:03:15 ◼   ► Like probably March 8th, but he doesn't know.

00:03:18 ◼   ► So maybe not.

00:03:19 ◼   ► And maybe he can't know.

00:03:21 ◼   ► We're definitely seeing the limits

00:03:22 ◼   ► of Mark Gurman's information.

00:03:24 ◼   ► So we're gonna go under the assumption

00:03:27 ◼   ► that there's gonna be an Apple announcement

00:03:28 ◼   ► coming pretty soon.

00:03:30 ◼   ► And this is our draft for that.

00:03:32 ◼   ► - Now, of course, one of the things that could stop

00:03:34 ◼   ► maybe an event that was planned going ahead

00:03:37 ◼   ► is the current war going on in Ukraine,

00:03:39 ◼   ► which of course, you know, we'll just take a quick pause

00:03:42 ◼   ► to say that everybody here at Upgrade

00:03:45 ◼   ► throws their wholehearted support

00:03:47 ◼   ► behind the people of Ukraine

00:03:49 ◼   ► for the situation that they're going through right now.

00:03:51 ◼   ► And it's an atrocious situation

00:03:53 ◼   ► that they have found themselves in

00:03:55 ◼   ► and we continue to support them.

00:03:58 ◼   ► - A lot of Mac developers, actually.

00:03:59 ◼   ► - Yes, a lot of wonderful Mac developers.

00:04:00 ◼   ► - Mac and iOS developers we know,

00:04:02 ◼   ► including Redl and MacPaw, among others,

00:04:05 ◼   ► that are actually from Ukraine.

00:04:08 ◼   ► So we send all of our positive thoughts

00:04:11 ◼   ► to the people of Ukraine, especially the people we know.

00:04:14 ◼   ► - I have a #snowtalk question for you.

00:04:17 ◼   ► Comes from WotC, who wants to know?

00:04:19 ◼   ► So this is me just, I'm just like straight up assuming

00:04:23 ◼   ► that this is the normal episode.

00:04:25 ◼   ► Jason, do you make any changes to your regular morning

00:04:29 ◼   ► routine in preparation for remote Apple event days,

00:04:33 ◼   ► or do you treat it the same as any other day?

00:04:36 ◼   ► I treated, this is what a terrible answer this is.

00:04:39 ◼   ► I treated the same as any other day, really.

00:04:41 ◼   ► It's not the case for in-person Apple events,

00:04:44 ◼   ► but for remote Apple events,

00:04:45 ◼   ► I can just treat it like any other day

00:04:47 ◼   ► 'cause the events are at 10 a.m. Pacific.

00:04:49 ◼   ► - Which is great for you, isn't it?

00:04:51 ◼   ► - Like I'm up at 9 a.m. Pacific doing upgrade, right?

00:04:54 ◼   ► Like, so it's just kinda luxurious

00:04:58 ◼   ► 'cause I have to get up early and drive far

00:05:01 ◼   ► to go to an Apple event in Cupertino.

00:05:03 ◼   ► but when it's happening in my living room on my TV,

00:05:07 ◼   ► it's, I don't have to vary my morning routine at all,

00:05:11 ◼   ► which is delightful.

00:05:12 ◼   ► That said, I kind of miss the in-person events,

00:05:16 ◼   ► but it is, after having done them for so long,

00:05:19 ◼   ► it's a luxury to just continue doing my own thing

00:05:23 ◼   ► in my house.

00:05:24 ◼   ► - I also really want there to be an Apple event next week

00:05:27 ◼   ► because then me and Steven will be able

00:05:29 ◼   ► to watch it together.

00:05:30 ◼   ► - Which will be fun.

00:05:31 ◼   ► - And it will be in the morning,

00:05:33 ◼   ► which is just never a thing I experience.

00:05:35 ◼   ► - And I'm kind of assuming that I could just

00:05:38 ◼   ► break this news right here, breaking news,

00:05:40 ◼   ► upgrade 397 to have special guest co-host

00:05:43 ◼   ► Stephen Hackett appearing.

00:05:45 ◼   ► - Yeah, 'cause I probably will record it in his studio.

00:05:50 ◼   ► - It would be really mean of us to like,

00:05:51 ◼   ► to get out, Hackett out, out.

00:05:55 ◼   ► - Get out. - No upgrade for you.

00:05:56 ◼   ► - Or you can sit in the corner and just listen to me.

00:05:59 ◼   ► You have to imagine the other half of the conversation.

00:06:02 ◼   ► - Silence.

00:06:03 ◼   ► - So yeah, no matter what the episode is next week,

00:06:06 ◼   ► Steven will be joining.

00:06:07 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:06:08 ◼   ► - And of course, if there is an event,

00:06:10 ◼   ► we will be recording after the event.

00:06:12 ◼   ► - Right, of course.

00:06:14 ◼   ► Of course, so if an event is announced this week,

00:06:18 ◼   ► then you can listen to Upgrade on Tuesday,

00:06:20 ◼   ► we'll record it right after the event.

00:06:23 ◼   ► - If you would like to send in a question of your own

00:06:24 ◼   ► to help us open a show,

00:06:25 ◼   ► just send out a tweet with the hashtag Snow Talk,

00:06:27 ◼   ► use question mark Snow Talk in the Relay FM members Discord.

00:06:30 ◼   ► Now I have the rules of the draft.

00:06:33 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:06:34 ◼   ► - Little bit bigger this time than usual.

00:06:37 ◼   ► - We had some stuff.

00:06:39 ◼   ► I don't know, I think our rules are fairly simple

00:06:40 ◼   ► compared to other rules that could be invented.

00:06:43 ◼   ► - Simple rules, but they have grown a little bit this time

00:06:45 ◼   ► for good reason.

00:06:46 ◼   ► 10 rounds, 20 overall picks, with an additional bonus round.

00:06:51 ◼   ► The draft will be split into four categories.

00:06:55 ◼   ► There will be four iPhone and iPad picks, four Mac picks,

00:07:00 ◼   ► two other picks, and the return of the draft of the color czar. This will be a bonus round,

00:07:06 ◼   ► and we will explain the overly complicated rules of the draft of the color czar a little later on

00:07:12 ◼   ► in today's episode. -In short, it's worth a point. The winner gets a point, yeah. -But it's not as

00:07:18 ◼   ► simple as it seems. The winner of the previous draft gets the first pick, and that is Jason

00:07:22 ◼   ► Snell. Items are chosen from a predetermined list of choices, which we have agreed are verifiable

00:07:29 ◼   ► on screen, which we have agreed must be verifiable on screen.

00:07:33 ◼   ► There we go. I got it.

00:07:34 ◼   ► Third time's a charm and not ridiculously obvious.

00:07:37 ◼   ► For an item to count, it must be either clearly announced on stage

00:07:41 ◼   ► or on a slide during the presentation verifiable from the keynote itself.

00:07:46 ◼   ► Stephen Hackett will adjudicate in case of a scoring stalemate

00:07:50 ◼   ► between Jason and Myke.

00:07:52 ◼   ► There are no partial points awarded.

00:07:54 ◼   ► The points awarded on the episode are final and are finalized

00:07:57 ◼   ► during the scoring segment.

00:08:00 ◼   ► This will make me smile every time I read that forever.

00:08:02 ◼   ► In the case of a tie, there is a tiebreaker question.

00:08:05 ◼   ► The loser gets the pick of the tiebreaker kind of over/under.

00:08:10 ◼   ► The winner of the previous draft gets to choose the time duration

00:08:14 ◼   ► because we will be tiebreaking on event runtime.

00:08:17 ◼   ► And a new addition is the winner becomes draft champion

00:08:21 ◼   ► and displays the champion pennant in the champion configuration.

00:08:25 ◼   ► Loser becomes draft challenger and displays the upgrade draft challenger

00:08:29 ◼   ► dependent in the challenger position. It's very important. We now have physical,

00:08:34 ◼   ► we're going to move some atoms, people. We're actually going to move a physical object based

00:08:39 ◼   ► on who wins or who loses. The draft results of last year was Jason was the 2021 champion,

00:08:44 ◼   ► and I have some historic statistics for you now. Oh, I love it. There have been too much events in

00:08:50 ◼   ► in draft history. Jason has won both of these in 2018 and 2019. There has only ever been

00:08:57 ◼   ► one other pre-WWDC event and that was in April 2021, which Myke won. Isn't that what, it

00:09:05 ◼   ► was a wild statistic to me that in the five, six years that we've been doing this, I think

00:09:10 ◼   ► it's six years actually, there have only been three pre-WWDC events.

00:09:14 ◼   ► - Yeah, we were taking a walk with our dog yesterday

00:09:17 ◼   ► and Lauren said, "Is this one of those things

00:09:19 ◼   ► where they do it every year?"

00:09:21 ◼   ► And I said, "No, this is not.

00:09:24 ◼   ► It's not something you can map out like that."

00:09:27 ◼   ► Sometimes they do a spring event and sometimes they don't.

00:09:29 ◼   ► So if there is indeed an event,

00:09:34 ◼   ► it will be one of a handful in the last few years.

00:09:39 ◼   ► - It is possible there may not be an event at all.

00:09:42 ◼   ► I don't know what we do if that's the case.

00:09:44 ◼   ► Like if they just release a bunch of things

00:09:45 ◼   ► by press release, I don't know what we do.

00:09:47 ◼   ► I guess there's just no draft.

00:09:48 ◼   ► - This draft is entirely invalidated.

00:09:50 ◼   ► That's definitely not gonna happen.

00:09:51 ◼   ► This is totally worth your time

00:09:52 ◼   ► to listen to this draft everybody.

00:09:53 ◼   ► - I mean, this is worth it no matter what.

00:09:55 ◼   ► 'Cause this is it, look, you know, this is our predictions

00:09:58 ◼   ► episode, wherever they have been a lot,

00:09:59 ◼   ► there are still things to predict.

00:10:01 ◼   ► Tiebreaker will be based on the event runtime.

00:10:04 ◼   ► Jason, what is the amount of minutes

00:10:06 ◼   ► that I get to pick the over under on?

00:10:08 ◼   ► - That's a tough one.

00:10:11 ◼   ► So we got some rumors, got some strong,

00:10:14 ◼   ► it's all a little murky, some strong iPhone rumors,

00:10:17 ◼   ► some strong iPad rumors, some shaky Mac rumors,

00:10:21 ◼   ► some strong Mac rumors.

00:10:24 ◼   ► - A good thing from Zach in the Discord here.

00:10:27 ◼   ► Zach, by the way, who is the creator of upgrade.cards,

00:10:30 ◼   ► which is where you can go to get your interactive scorecard

00:10:33 ◼   ► so you can score along during any event

00:10:35 ◼   ► that we have here on the upgrade program.

00:10:39 ◼   ► Zach said that the April event of last year

00:10:42 ◼   ► was 61 minutes long.

00:10:44 ◼   ► - Interesting.

00:10:44 ◼   ► That's an interesting data point.

00:10:46 ◼   ► And I was going to point at that and say,

00:10:48 ◼   ► I think they have shorter events and that this will be one.

00:10:51 ◼   ► And that is why I am going to just follow

00:10:57 ◼   ► the last year's event and say,

00:10:59 ◼   ► Myke, is it longer or shorter than last year's 61 minutes?

00:11:02 ◼   ► - Under 61 minutes.

00:11:04 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:11:05 ◼   ► - Honestly, Jason, my feeling is,

00:11:07 ◼   ► I was going to say under basically whatever you chose.

00:11:10 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:11:10 ◼   ► - Because I just can't imagine this being a long event.

00:11:14 ◼   ► - Well, I don't know.

00:11:15 ◼   ► I almost picked 48.

00:11:16 ◼   ► - And then I wouldn't,

00:11:18 ◼   ► I maybe wouldn't have answered so quickly.

00:11:21 ◼   ► - Yeah, maybe, maybe not, but we'll see.

00:11:23 ◼   ► I mean, they can, Apple has surprised me sometimes.

00:11:25 ◼   ► I would love them to be efficient and be,

00:11:28 ◼   ► and be under an hour, but we'll see.

00:11:34 ◼   ► If, maybe my picks will bear out my feelings on this,

00:11:37 ◼   ► we'll find out.

00:11:38 ◼   ► If they have announced what I think they're going to announce

00:11:41 ◼   ► I do not think that this will run over an hour.

00:11:43 ◼   ► - Well, that's the trick, isn't it?

00:11:45 ◼   ► I'll just have to beat you straight up.

00:11:47 ◼   ► - We'll see. - That's what I have to do.

00:11:48 ◼   ► - That's all you have to do.

00:11:49 ◼   ► - Can't count on the tie to save me like I did last time.

00:11:52 ◼   ► - This episode of Upgrade is brought to you

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00:12:25 ◼   ► I heard Stephen mention this recently when he was reading the ad Unconnected,

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00:13:35 ◼   ► We're gonna move into the first set of picks now,

00:13:38 ◼   ► rounds one to four, which are the iPhone and iPad picks.

00:13:42 ◼   ► Jason, you're up first.

00:13:44 ◼   ► - All right, with the first pick in the draft,

00:13:48 ◼   ► I am going to take it easy

00:13:51 ◼   ► and pick that Apple announces a new iPhone SE.

00:13:55 ◼   ► Just gonna lay it there.

00:13:56 ◼   ► - Easy pick one.

00:13:57 ◼   ► This was my pick one.

00:13:58 ◼   ► This is just like.

00:13:59 ◼   ► - It's just laying there.

00:14:01 ◼   ► - It's honestly the only thing for me

00:14:03 ◼   ► that I feel is a certain of this event.

00:14:06 ◼   ► - This is in fact, if you follow all the reports,

00:14:09 ◼   ► the reason for this season.

00:14:10 ◼   ► This is the thing that everyone's like,

00:14:13 ◼   ► "Well, Apple's going to announce a new iPhone SE

00:14:15 ◼   ► and they may find other products to announce with it."

00:14:18 ◼   ► So yeah, I'm just gonna lay that down.

00:14:21 ◼   ► Let's get it started with the most obvious thing

00:14:23 ◼   ► that's on our list, the iPhone SE.

00:14:25 ◼   ► Yeah, there's gonna be a new one everybody, woo!

00:14:28 ◼   ► - I know that this is an important phone

00:14:31 ◼   ► to Apple and many users.

00:14:35 ◼   ► I'm sorry, I just need to say it now.

00:14:37 ◼   ► I really struggled to get excited about the iPhone SE.

00:14:40 ◼   ► - What do you mean?

00:14:41 ◼   ► I said woo, Myke, come on, woo!

00:14:42 ◼   ► - I can't get excited about it.

00:14:44 ◼   ► Unless, I mean--

00:14:45 ◼   ► - Developers, developers, developers, developers!

00:14:48 ◼   ► - Unless they do something that's like really unexpected,

00:14:52 ◼   ► which I don't expect, I'm sorry,

00:14:54 ◼   ► like I just can't get excited about a phone,

00:14:57 ◼   ► a new iPhone that has a touch ID home button on it,

00:15:01 ◼   ► you know, which is what I expect it will probably be.

00:15:04 ◼   ► Which is why my first pick is gonna be that the iPhone SE

00:15:08 ◼   ► keeps the current iPhone SE design.

00:15:11 ◼   ► - Oh, interesting.

00:15:13 ◼   ► - Now, this is one of those ones that again,

00:15:15 ◼   ► it might be like, we're gonna have to call it as we see it.

00:15:17 ◼   ► There might be some tweaks, but I think, you know,

00:15:20 ◼   ► if this thing has bezels and a home button

00:15:24 ◼   ► and all that kind of stuff,

00:15:25 ◼   ► like that's the iPhone SE design.

00:15:27 ◼   ► We'll see, right?

00:15:29 ◼   ► Like, I don't know what you think about this,

00:15:31 ◼   ► but you know, there's stuff that they might do

00:15:34 ◼   ► to the design of this phone,

00:15:35 ◼   ► but it's still by and large, looks like the iPhone SE.

00:15:38 ◼   ► - I think that would be really boring.

00:15:40 ◼   ► And you look at it and it's got like all the big bezels

00:15:42 ◼   ► at the top and the bottom and home button

00:15:47 ◼   ► with touch ID.

00:15:48 ◼   ► - But I think honestly,

00:15:52 ◼   ► one of the reasons that they keep this phone

00:15:54 ◼   ► is for this design,

00:15:56 ◼   ► because there are some people that they know as well

00:15:58 ◼   ► that do not want face ID.

00:16:01 ◼   ► And I cannot imagine Apple designing,

00:16:04 ◼   ► if they keep the touch ID home button,

00:16:05 ◼   ► which I do think they will keep,

00:16:07 ◼   ► I do not imagine them making a phone

00:16:10 ◼   ► with a new design for that.

00:16:12 ◼   ► - I'm gonna leave that out there

00:16:14 ◼   ► as a potential future pick for me.

00:16:17 ◼   ► But I'll tell you something the new iPhone SE

00:16:18 ◼   ► is gonna have Myke, 5G.

00:16:21 ◼   ► - 5G, 5G, 5G, 5G.

00:16:24 ◼   ► - Because as Tim Cook has told us,

00:16:26 ◼   ► we're just at the very beginnings of the global 5G rollout

00:16:29 ◼   ► and a lot of people are motivated to upgrade their phone

00:16:32 ◼   ► or motivated by their carrier to upgrade their phone

00:16:35 ◼   ► to get 5G support.

00:16:37 ◼   ► So let's throw it in there.

00:16:39 ◼   ► Everything gets 5G, you get 5G and you get 5G and you.

00:16:42 ◼   ► iPhone SE, wake up, wake up.

00:16:45 ◼   ► Come on, snap to it, you get 5G.

00:16:47 ◼   ► - Do you know what else is gonna get 5G?

00:16:49 ◼   ► - Oh yes, this is, I mean, we're going straight

00:16:53 ◼   ► to the lowest of the low hanging fruit now, aren't we?

00:16:56 ◼   ► - This was not gonna be my second pick,

00:16:58 ◼   ► but you mentioning it has made it there for me,

00:17:00 ◼   ► the iPad Air.

00:17:01 ◼   ► - Yeah, sure. - iPad Air.

00:17:03 ◼   ► - iPad Air, you too, get up here.

00:17:05 ◼   ► There's gonna be a new iPad Air apparently,

00:17:07 ◼   ► according to Myke's pick here, and it'll have 5G.

00:17:09 ◼   ► - Mm-hmm.

00:17:10 ◼   ► - You gotta have 5G.

00:17:11 ◼   ► - This is probably the next most likely product in general

00:17:16 ◼   ► is an iPad Air refresh, the iPad Air Jufuru refresh.

00:17:20 ◼   ► It's now behind the other iPads, even the regular iPad

00:17:24 ◼   ► and a bunch of features that we'll probably get here.

00:17:27 ◼   ► And you've got to expect that the iPad Air

00:17:29 ◼   ► is a pretty good seller for Apple, looks like an iPad Pro,

00:17:32 ◼   ► but isn't priced like an iPad Pro.

00:17:34 ◼   ► And I think it's gonna get 5G.

00:17:37 ◼   ► - That's good.

00:17:38 ◼   ► I'm gonna make, sorry to make a boring pick,

00:17:40 ◼   ► but it's on our list and I just want to stake out

00:17:42 ◼   ► the ground here.

00:17:43 ◼   ► iPad Air, like you say for the iPhone SE,

00:17:47 ◼   ► iPad Air keeps the same design.

00:17:49 ◼   ► They just changed it, it's got the flat sides,

00:17:51 ◼   ► it's the modern design, it was the first one to go,

00:17:53 ◼   ► why would they change it?

00:17:54 ◼   ► Same design.

00:17:55 ◼   ► - Now here's the thing, Jason,

00:17:57 ◼   ► there is a pic that we did not have on our list

00:17:59 ◼   ► because we pre-approved these pics together.

00:18:01 ◼   ► One of these things was, Apple announces an iPad Air.

00:18:05 ◼   ► - Yes.

00:18:06 ◼   ► - If we agree that I can pick that,

00:18:08 ◼   ► then the first three rounds,

00:18:10 ◼   ► they are exact mirror of each other.

00:18:12 ◼   ► - Well, you can't pick it,

00:18:14 ◼   ► but you already, and your pick already implies it

00:18:16 ◼   ► because you said it gets 5G support.

00:18:18 ◼   ► - Yeah, I know, but we also have Apple announces

00:18:21 ◼   ► a new iPhone SE as a pick, right?

00:18:24 ◼   ► - Yeah, but why didn't we do that for the iPad Air?

00:18:26 ◼   ► - I don't know, we just didn't put it in there.

00:18:28 ◼   ► But all right, if you're not gonna let me add it,

00:18:30 ◼   ► that's totally fine by me,

00:18:32 ◼   ► because my next pick will be-

00:18:34 ◼   ► - You could add it, it would be really boring

00:18:36 ◼   ► if you added it, but if you wanna add it in, that's fine.

00:18:38 ◼   ► - No, I'm gonna go in another direction

00:18:40 ◼   ► and I'm gonna say that--

00:18:41 ◼   ► - All right, well then I'll pick it next round.

00:18:43 ◼   ► (laughs)

00:18:44 ◼   ► So I'll pick it next round.

00:18:45 ◼   ► - You play dirty.

00:18:47 ◼   ► The iPad Air gets center stage.

00:18:51 ◼   ► - Yeah, there we go.

00:18:53 ◼   ► Why didn't it already have it?

00:18:54 ◼   ► Well, that feature hadn't been introduced yet.

00:18:57 ◼   ► - And this one feels to me like,

00:19:00 ◼   ► honestly even more certain than 5G

00:19:03 ◼   ► because every iPad has it now, I think.

00:19:08 ◼   ► if I'm remembering correctly.

00:19:09 ◼   ► Yeah, even the iPad mini has center stage.

00:19:11 ◼   ► So this is definitely a product

00:19:14 ◼   ► that Apple won in the iPad line.

00:19:18 ◼   ► We have had many conversations

00:19:19 ◼   ► about wanting it in other products,

00:19:21 ◼   ► but right now it just exists in the iPad.

00:19:24 ◼   ► I feel like if they touch the iPad Air,

00:19:27 ◼   ► they put center stage in it.

00:19:28 ◼   ► - Yep, I agree, 100%.

00:19:29 ◼   ► I think that it's even more likely than 5G,

00:19:32 ◼   ► and I think 5G is very, very, very likely.

00:19:35 ◼   ► But center stage, it has to be.

00:19:37 ◼   ► It's in every other iPad, why would it not be?

00:19:40 ◼   ► All right, Myke, well, remember when you said

00:19:41 ◼   ► that the iPhone SE was gonna keep the current design?

00:19:43 ◼   ► I think it's not.

00:19:44 ◼   ► - Tell me about this. - That's my next pick.

00:19:46 ◼   ► - What do you think?

00:19:47 ◼   ► - I think it's not.

00:19:49 ◼   ► I think we have reached the point now

00:19:52 ◼   ► where Apple is gonna say goodbye to that design

00:19:54 ◼   ► and come up with something that has,

00:19:59 ◼   ► maybe has face ID, but I think maybe has

00:20:05 ◼   ► button touch ID like on the iPad?

00:20:09 ◼   ► Whatever is cheaper.

00:20:12 ◼   ► - Can I just jump in right now and just say

00:20:15 ◼   ► that my final pick is that the iPhone SE has touch ID?

00:20:19 ◼   ► - Okay, all right.

00:20:20 ◼   ► Let's do it.

00:20:21 ◼   ► - Then we can talk more about that.

00:20:22 ◼   ► - Let's double this up.

00:20:23 ◼   ► - This is where if for me, I imagine if they do

00:20:26 ◼   ► change the design, they keep touch ID

00:20:29 ◼   ► but put it in the side button.

00:20:31 ◼   ► - In the button.

00:20:32 ◼   ► I think that's possible.

00:20:33 ◼   ► I, so look, your pick that the iPhone,

00:20:38 ◼   ► the current iPhone SE design remains

00:20:43 ◼   ► is banking on Tim Cook grinding more margin

00:20:48 ◼   ► out of a very old iPhone design.

00:20:53 ◼   ► And you know, it's hard to bet against that,

00:20:56 ◼   ► but I look at the current iPhone SE

00:20:59 ◼   ► and think it's so old now

00:21:04 ◼   ► and so out of line with the existing iPhone line

00:21:07 ◼   ► that I think there's a chance

00:21:11 ◼   ► that Apple is going to make an iPhone SE

00:21:16 ◼   ► that looks a little like the rest of the iPhone line

00:21:19 ◼   ► that they can call it edge to edge and put a notch in it,

00:21:26 ◼   ► but maybe it doesn't have the face ID system,

00:21:29 ◼   ► just simplify their product line a little bit.

00:21:33 ◼   ► And I realize I'm just kind of grasping here

00:21:35 ◼   ► because the easy thing is it's just, again,

00:21:38 ◼   ► it's just the same one with a little bit of an upgrade.

00:21:41 ◼   ► But I don't know,

00:21:42 ◼   ► I feel like there's enough water under the bridge now

00:21:44 ◼   ► that maybe they're gonna revise it

00:21:46 ◼   ► and use some of the stuff they've used in other phones

00:21:48 ◼   ► while keeping it cheap

00:21:49 ◼   ► and allow them to have something

00:21:51 ◼   ► that feels a little more like a modern iPhone.

00:21:53 ◼   ► And the big one is get that home button

00:21:56 ◼   ► off the front of the iPhone.

00:21:58 ◼   ► And since we've seen the touch ID

00:22:01 ◼   ► in the sleep wake button on the iPad,

00:22:05 ◼   ► I feel like maybe that's the direction they wanna go

00:22:07 ◼   ► if they wanna keep face ID as a premium feature.

00:22:10 ◼   ► So that's my just kind of out of the blue,

00:22:13 ◼   ► picking a little bit from what they did with the iPad Air

00:22:16 ◼   ► and thinking that the big black stripe at the top,

00:22:19 ◼   ► big black stripe with a home button at the bottom

00:22:21 ◼   ► feels really old that maybe they want to finally kind of put that one in the ground.

00:22:26 ◼   ► So I have a bunch of thoughts on this, right?

00:22:29 ◼   ► One is, hey, maybe the iPhone mini becomes the iPhone SE, but I don't think that would

00:22:35 ◼   ► be now, but I could imagine that, right?

00:22:37 ◼   ► Like in the future, maybe in a year or two.

00:22:40 ◼   ► Because when I think about that, it's like, okay, I don't believe they're going to put

00:22:44 ◼   ► face ID on the iPhone SE for a while because it is apparently very expensive to do so.

00:22:52 ◼   ► And so if they were not going to do that, or even if they were going to change the iPhone

00:22:55 ◼   ► SE's design at all, and let's imagine that they go edge to edge, right?

00:23:00 ◼   ► Or they go towards the bezels.

00:23:04 ◼   ► My thinking on this is it might have to give away potential designs of next iPhones more

00:23:11 ◼   ► based on like how they do like a camera

00:23:14 ◼   ► in the display kind of thing, like a hole punch.

00:23:17 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:23:17 ◼   ► - And so like all of this stuff says to me,

00:23:18 ◼   ► I think that they will change this design,

00:23:21 ◼   ► but I could imagine it's one more round at the current one.

00:23:25 ◼   ► And then after that, they can start doing some new stuff.

00:23:28 ◼   ► - I think clearly, I mean,

00:23:29 ◼   ► we'll see how the rest of this draft goes,

00:23:31 ◼   ► but the draft may be won or lost simply on whether Apple

00:23:35 ◼   ► lets it ride for another round with the SE

00:23:37 ◼   ► or does something a little bit different.

00:23:38 ◼   ► And I just, I think you're probably right about Touch ID,

00:23:43 ◼   ► but there is part of me that says,

00:23:45 ◼   ► Apple has been doing Face ID for so long now.

00:23:48 ◼   ► And I wonder if the economy of scale of that,

00:23:54 ◼   ► that Face ID sensor block in fact has come down

00:23:58 ◼   ► to the point where instead of continuing to make these parts

00:24:03 ◼   ► that are like only in the SE at this point,

00:24:05 ◼   ► they're actually able to make a cheaper device

00:24:09 ◼   ► by using parts that they're using in other iPhones.

00:24:13 ◼   ► But then there's the touch ID button tech too.

00:24:15 ◼   ► - Even in that, they would put the touch ID button, I think.

00:24:18 ◼   ► Like I genuinely believe that part of the iPhone SE's

00:24:22 ◼   ► current existence is to have an iPhone that is not face ID.

00:24:26 ◼   ► - Yeah, in fact, the strongest argument for the iPhone SE

00:24:31 ◼   ► to not have face ID, I think is the iPad Air.

00:24:34 ◼   ► because that's a mid-level iPad.

00:24:37 ◼   ► And Apple is like, you don't get face ID.

00:24:41 ◼   ► Sorry, that's a pro kind of feature.

00:24:43 ◼   ► And it's a different market because the,

00:24:46 ◼   ► both of the iPhone lines, the regular and the pro

00:24:49 ◼   ► do have face ID,

00:24:50 ◼   ► but the SE is the thing that's down there below it.

00:24:53 ◼   ► So pulling it out and saying, no, no,

00:24:55 ◼   ► we're not gonna do that, I think is really reasonable.

00:24:58 ◼   ► To me, again, what motivates me most of all

00:25:02 ◼   ► is that home button.

00:25:03 ◼   ► It's like the home button, oh, it's so dated now, right?

00:25:08 ◼   ► And people like it and it's fine,

00:25:10 ◼   ► but I'm just trying to get into Apple's mind

00:25:12 ◼   ► and thinking about all the products

00:25:13 ◼   ► that they got in their product line.

00:25:14 ◼   ► And like, it's so dated.

00:25:16 ◼   ► And we know that it's been a problem,

00:25:19 ◼   ► like in terms of breaking it and things like that.

00:25:23 ◼   ► Like, I wonder if getting it out of there

00:25:26 ◼   ► and getting something that looks a little more modern,

00:25:28 ◼   ► but still has Touch ID like in the button,

00:25:30 ◼   ► if that might be their answer.

00:25:32 ◼   ► But I think your thought is also reasonable

00:25:36 ◼   ► because it's hard to bet against Tim Cook

00:25:38 ◼   ► continuing to grind with old parts

00:25:41 ◼   ► at a low price, high margin iPhone SE.

00:25:45 ◼   ► So that's, is this the year?

00:25:48 ◼   ► I say, maybe you say, no, we'll see.

00:25:50 ◼   ► - I mean, when did that last iPad come out?

00:25:53 ◼   ► Like I know it was last year, right?

00:25:54 ◼   ► I don't remember exactly when,

00:25:55 ◼   ► but that has a home button on it.

00:25:58 ◼   ► - Yeah, it's true.

00:25:59 ◼   ► - You know, so they haven't gotten rid of it

00:26:01 ◼   ► from everywhere yet.

00:26:02 ◼   ► - It's true.

00:26:03 ◼   ► - Not yet, not yet.

00:26:04 ◼   ► - Not yet.

00:26:05 ◼   ► And they love it on the Macs, right?

00:26:09 ◼   ► This is what it looks like on the Mac.

00:26:11 ◼   ► It's just that little circle.

00:26:13 ◼   ► Speaking of the Mac, this is where, look,

00:26:16 ◼   ► this is where it starts to get interesting.

00:26:18 ◼   ► I'm sorry, iPhone and iPad, you're not for us right now.

00:26:23 ◼   ► That might be the fastest draft round of all time

00:26:28 ◼   ► for four picks.

00:26:29 ◼   ► - We're gonna move into our Mac picks now.

00:26:31 ◼   ► There are enough of four.

00:26:32 ◼   ► I would just note, I make my own personal list, right?

00:26:36 ◼   ► I had like six or seven things on my iPhone and iPad list.

00:26:41 ◼   ► I have 15 that I have made for my Mac picks here,

00:26:45 ◼   ► even though we're only going for four each.

00:26:47 ◼   ► What is your first?

00:26:49 ◼   ► - I only have seven, so you're more confident than I am.

00:26:51 ◼   ► I'm gonna start with a product, the Mac,

00:26:53 ◼   ► that I do think is going to be announced for sure

00:26:56 ◼   ► at this event, which is a new 13-inch MacBook Pro

00:26:59 ◼   ► of some sort.

00:27:00 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:27:01 ◼   ► - That's my first MacBook, new 13-inch MacBook Pro.

00:27:05 ◼   ► - We don't wanna get into that too much

00:27:06 ◼   ► because there are many more picks on the table

00:27:08 ◼   ► for this MacBook Pro in particular.

00:27:10 ◼   ► Mine is gonna be that a new Mac Mini is announced.

00:27:14 ◼   ► - All right.

00:27:15 ◼   ► - For my money, I think we're more likely

00:27:17 ◼   ► to see a Mac Mini than a new MacBook Pro.

00:27:19 ◼   ► - I went back and forth on this

00:27:22 ◼   ► and new Mac Mini is announced was also on my list.

00:27:24 ◼   ► it was next up, so I went back and forth with them.

00:27:27 ◼   ► I think I could go either way, right?

00:27:30 ◼   ► I think the new Mac mini seems logical

00:27:33 ◼   ► because they held the Intel Mac mini around,

00:27:36 ◼   ► even though they did an M1 Mac mini last fall,

00:27:39 ◼   ► or I guess fall of '20.

00:27:43 ◼   ► So, oh God, it's not even last fall,

00:27:44 ◼   ► you know, a year and a half ago.

00:27:46 ◼   ► And yet I feel like this,

00:27:49 ◼   ► even though the rumors conflict,

00:27:52 ◼   ► there's so much heat around the idea

00:27:54 ◼   ► that they're gonna revise that 13-inch MacBook Pro

00:27:56 ◼   ► that I feel like that gave me a little bit more of an edge.

00:27:58 ◼   ► Whereas the Mac Mini, I'm like,

00:27:59 ◼   ► well, they could announce it.

00:28:01 ◼   ► I don't doubt it's coming.

00:28:03 ◼   ► They could not announce it,

00:28:05 ◼   ► and I wouldn't be shocked, I guess.

00:28:07 ◼   ► - What I'll say is that rumors of a new Mac Mini

00:28:09 ◼   ► have been around for a lot longer.

00:28:11 ◼   ► - Oh yeah, oh yeah.

00:28:12 ◼   ► No, my, I don't doubt it exists.

00:28:14 ◼   ► I think my question is, is it now?

00:28:18 ◼   ► And maybe it is now.

00:28:19 ◼   ► I think that, like I said, it was my second choice.

00:28:21 ◼   ► So that's reasonable.

00:28:24 ◼   ► - And I'll just state just like for the record,

00:28:26 ◼   ► both of these products like new,

00:28:29 ◼   ► if Apple has something to show off, it's new, right?

00:28:32 ◼   ► It doesn't matter if they've just changed a part

00:28:35 ◼   ► here or there, it's new.

00:28:37 ◼   ► - Yep.

00:28:38 ◼   ► Okay, gonna go out on a limb here.

00:28:41 ◼   ► I know there've been conflicting reports.

00:28:43 ◼   ► I'm just gonna lay it down.

00:28:45 ◼   ► Bye bye touch bar, gone.

00:28:46 ◼   ► Touch bar gone. - Okay.

00:28:49 ◼   ► gone, new MacBook Pro doesn't have a touch bar.

00:28:52 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:28:53 ◼   ► - Yeah, that's it.

00:28:56 ◼   ► Look, if they come out with,

00:28:59 ◼   ► if they update the MacBook Pro

00:29:01 ◼   ► in the smallest ways possible

00:29:03 ◼   ► and it still has the touch bar,

00:29:06 ◼   ► like what are you doing?

00:29:07 ◼   ► Like I get that last time

00:29:10 ◼   ► when you were doing the first round of M1s

00:29:13 ◼   ► that the goal was kind of stability

00:29:15 ◼   ► and you just put the new chip in the old computer.

00:29:19 ◼   ► But last year you revised everything.

00:29:24 ◼   ► And this thing is still laying out there.

00:29:26 ◼   ► It's like, come on, just it's over.

00:29:28 ◼   ► So there are a few things that were added

00:29:33 ◼   ► to the MacBook Pro line in 2021

00:29:37 ◼   ► that helped differentiate it from the MacBook Air.

00:29:40 ◼   ► And this 13-inch MacBook Pro

00:29:42 ◼   ► does not have any of those things.

00:29:44 ◼   ► So I'm gonna go out on a limb.

00:29:47 ◼   ► And I know there's some reports that say it stays

00:29:50 ◼   ► and some reports that say it goes.

00:29:52 ◼   ► I like the home button.

00:29:54 ◼   ► I'm gonna put some money down on the touch bar.

00:29:56 ◼   ► Just, it's gone, it's gone.

00:29:58 ◼   ► Just some buttons up there.

00:29:59 ◼   ► Just some regular old function keys.

00:30:02 ◼   ► Goodbye touch bar.

00:30:03 ◼   ► - Jason, I'm all about the drama today.

00:30:05 ◼   ► I'm like, big drama draft boy.

00:30:08 ◼   ► - Big drama energy from you, yeah.

00:30:09 ◼   ► - I had this pick way later in my list,

00:30:12 ◼   ► but I'm gonna put it up there now.

00:30:14 ◼   ► the new MacBook Pro keeps the touch bar.

00:30:16 ◼   ► - (laughs) Okay, all right.

00:30:19 ◼   ► - Now, here's the thing.

00:30:21 ◼   ► - I am the picks of optimism

00:30:24 ◼   ► and you are the picks of pessimism

00:30:26 ◼   ► and we'll see who wins.

00:30:27 ◼   ► - It's not about pessimism.

00:30:28 ◼   ► I think I'm going for realism.

00:30:31 ◼   ► Now, this MacBook Pro will only exist

00:30:36 ◼   ► to maintain a price point, right?

00:30:40 ◼   ► That is why this thing exists.

00:30:41 ◼   ► This MacBook Pro only continues to exist

00:30:44 ◼   ► because they cannot get the 14 inch cheaper.

00:30:47 ◼   ► - I agree with you there.

00:30:49 ◼   ► Now let me throw something at you.

00:30:51 ◼   ► What do you think is cheaper,

00:30:52 ◼   ► function keys or a touch bar with an OLED display

00:30:55 ◼   ► and a touch sensitive surface?

00:30:56 ◼   ► - Here's what I'll say.

00:30:57 ◼   ► Here's what I'll say on that.

00:30:59 ◼   ► They already did the Apple Silicon revision

00:31:02 ◼   ► for the MacBook Pro with a touch bar.

00:31:05 ◼   ► I would expect it is cheaper to drop new chips

00:31:10 ◼   ► in that MacBook Pro, then going back to the MacBook Pro that had the function keys and

00:31:17 ◼   ► bringing that to the point where it's now ready for Apple Silicon.

00:31:22 ◼   ► I expect that if they within an 18 month period thought that they were going to be both A)

00:31:30 ◼   ► removing the touch bar from future designs and B) knowing they were going to keep the

00:31:35 ◼   ► the MacBook Pro around, they never would have revised

00:31:39 ◼   ► the MacBook Pro with a touch bar

00:31:41 ◼   ► to keep for Apple Silicon in the first place.

00:31:44 ◼   ► - Couple of things.

00:31:45 ◼   ► First off, I don't think that it works

00:31:47 ◼   ► where they go back to the MacBook escape

00:31:48 ◼   ► and then bring it forward.

00:31:49 ◼   ► I don't think that's how they would do it.

00:31:51 ◼   ► But secondly, I view it a very different way,

00:31:54 ◼   ► which is that they did a first round

00:31:56 ◼   ► of Apple Silicon M1 Mac designs

00:32:01 ◼   ► basically to get the first ones out the door

00:32:04 ◼   ► so they could move on and actually do the redesigns

00:32:06 ◼   ► and that it was a placeholder and it wasn't,

00:32:09 ◼   ► well, if we're gonna keep this around,

00:32:11 ◼   ► let's redesign it now.

00:32:13 ◼   ► It was like, it's not important for us to redesign it

00:32:15 ◼   ► 'cause it's the least important MacBook Pro.

00:32:18 ◼   ► So let's wait and keep its redesign for later

00:32:22 ◼   ► and now it's later.

00:32:23 ◼   ► So that's the way that I approach it.

00:32:25 ◼   ► And I do think that it's cheaper

00:32:26 ◼   ► to not have an OLED touch surface

00:32:28 ◼   ► and that replacing that with function keys

00:32:30 ◼   ► is probably something that will make a cheaper product.

00:32:33 ◼   ► - So we'll see, we're head to head.

00:32:35 ◼   ► - They may have a big stock part

00:32:36 ◼   ► and a touch bars somewhere.

00:32:38 ◼   ► - For people who are not listening live,

00:32:42 ◼   ► I just wanna give you a little sense

00:32:44 ◼   ► of one of the great things about being a real AFM member

00:32:47 ◼   ► and listening live while being in our Discord

00:32:49 ◼   ► is that the Discord is kind of losing it.

00:32:52 ◼   ► I have seen Myke is doomed

00:32:54 ◼   ► and Jason is throwing it both in the chat.

00:32:58 ◼   ► So I like it, I like it.

00:33:00 ◼   ► Everybody's opposed, everybody has an opinion.

00:33:02 ◼   ► The drama, thank you, Myke, for cultivating the drama.

00:33:04 ◼   ► - Bring in the drama today.

00:33:05 ◼   ► This is draft drama, that's what I'm all about,

00:33:07 ◼   ► draft drama.

00:33:08 ◼   ► I just think that there's like, for me,

00:33:10 ◼   ► there's a bunch of reasons to keep the touch bar.

00:33:13 ◼   ► I think it's the speed thing.

00:33:14 ◼   ► I think that there is a continuation

00:33:16 ◼   ► of needing to separate the devices, right?

00:33:19 ◼   ► Like, at that point, if it's,

00:33:21 ◼   ► why is it different to a MacBook Air?

00:33:23 ◼   ► It's just bigger.

00:33:24 ◼   ► Like, I think that there's just like a bunch of reasons

00:33:27 ◼   ► they're gonna keep the touch bar,

00:33:28 ◼   ► even though I don't think they should.

00:33:29 ◼   ► - All right, with my next pick,

00:33:30 ◼   ► I'm going back to the Mac.

00:33:31 ◼   ► I'm going to the Mac Mini that you say is going to be announced.

00:33:34 ◼   ► And I'm going to say it will have options for both the M1 Pro and M1 Max chip.

00:33:39 ◼   ► Okay. This was my next pick. This was going to be what I went with.

00:33:44 ◼   ► I think that for me,

00:33:47 ◼   ► I feel like this Mac Mini is a replacement for both Mac Minis,

00:33:51 ◼   ► right?

00:33:52 ◼   ► And that they may have like the ability to have a Mac Mini that can be specced

00:33:57 ◼   ► across the M1.

00:33:59 ◼   ► - Well, that would be the ideal, right?

00:34:01 ◼   ► Is that you could get an M1 or M2 when it comes along

00:34:03 ◼   ► and then an M1 Pro and M1 Max,

00:34:06 ◼   ► and you're really just sort of picking it.

00:34:08 ◼   ► It depends on the marketing.

00:34:09 ◼   ► They may say, right, but it's all,

00:34:12 ◼   ► it's what we've said about the iMac.

00:34:15 ◼   ► Also is true of the Mac Mini is.

00:34:16 ◼   ► They could market the Mac Mini and a Mac Mini Pro

00:34:20 ◼   ► and have it be different names

00:34:24 ◼   ► and this one's Silver and this one's Space Gray,

00:34:26 ◼   ► but ultimately I think it's gonna be good, better, best

00:34:30 ◼   ► kind of thing, right?

00:34:31 ◼   ► Where it's like you can get an M1 or an M1 Pro

00:34:33 ◼   ► or an M1 Max, it's all Mac mini.

00:34:35 ◼   ► And I think that that's where they're headed.

00:34:37 ◼   ► - I feel like I'm bringing more drama right now, Jason.

00:34:41 ◼   ► - Bring it in.

00:34:42 ◼   ► - The new MacBook Pro gets an M2 chip.

00:34:44 ◼   ► - Whoa, interesting, interesting.

00:34:49 ◼   ► M2, so a lot of rumors that M2 is coming.

00:34:53 ◼   ► A lot of rumors about the M2 appearing first

00:34:56 ◼   ► in a MacBook Air that keeps getting delayed

00:34:58 ◼   ► till maybe even this summer.

00:35:00 ◼   ► But you're saying it's gonna debut

00:35:03 ◼   ► whenever this event happens.

00:35:06 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:35:07 ◼   ► Here's the thing, I don't think personally

00:35:11 ◼   ► that they would put an M1 Pro or M1 Max chip

00:35:14 ◼   ► in this MacBook Pro.

00:35:15 ◼   ► To me, that doesn't make sense.

00:35:19 ◼   ► It's like, what is this MacBook Pro

00:35:22 ◼   ► if it can have so much power at that point.

00:35:25 ◼   ► Things start to get confusing for me.

00:35:27 ◼   ► They have to start M2 at some point.

00:35:30 ◼   ► Like, some point it needs to begin.

00:35:33 ◼   ► To me, it would make sense that they would put it in

00:35:35 ◼   ► what is at this point, I think, the oldest,

00:35:39 ◼   ► or one of the oldest computers that has an M1 in it.

00:35:44 ◼   ► - Uh-huh.

00:35:45 ◼   ► - So it makes sense to me that they would start with M2

00:35:49 ◼   ► sooner rather than later,

00:35:51 ◼   ► 'cause otherwise it could potentially be,

00:35:52 ◼   ► and as the Mac Mini gets it,

00:35:54 ◼   ► it'll be going all the way to the end of the year

00:35:56 ◼   ► before M2 comes out,

00:35:57 ◼   ► if the MacBook Air isn't gonna come anytime soon.

00:36:00 ◼   ► So I think that the MacBook Pro will get an M2 chip.

00:36:03 ◼   ► - Very interesting.

00:36:05 ◼   ► Feel like it's premature, but who knows?

00:36:10 ◼   ► - Premature though, really?

00:36:12 ◼   ► I mean, didn't it start in like the end of 2020

00:36:17 ◼   ► with the M1?

00:36:18 ◼   ► - Yeah, oh yeah.

00:36:19 ◼   ► I just, I don't know, I've read enough reports

00:36:22 ◼   ► that suggest that the MacBook Air is sort of

00:36:25 ◼   ► when the M2 debuts, that I've kind of been thinking

00:36:29 ◼   ► that the M2 debut is gonna happen later.

00:36:31 ◼   ► But it could happen now.

00:36:32 ◼   ► It will be interesting if it does happen

00:36:35 ◼   ► to see how Apple spins comparing M2 to M1 Pro and M1 Max,

00:36:40 ◼   ► right, because like M2 sounds newer,

00:36:43 ◼   ► but it's not gonna be nearly as fast as an M2

00:36:46 ◼   ► or an M1 Pro or M1 Max.

00:36:48 ◼   ► - Yep.

00:36:49 ◼   ► - So they're gonna have to trick that one out.

00:36:53 ◼   ► Well, so here's a funny thing, Myke.

00:36:56 ◼   ► We're in our last round now.

00:36:58 ◼   ► And neither of us has picked anything

00:36:59 ◼   ► about rumored MacBook Air and larger iMac models.

00:37:04 ◼   ► - Well, I think there's a pretty good reason for that, but.

00:37:07 ◼   ► - I think the challenge is that while I want there

00:37:10 ◼   ► to be a larger iMac and Mark Gurman seems

00:37:12 ◼   ► to not have a view into it in his reports,

00:37:15 ◼   ► I have not seen any reports that really suggest

00:37:18 ◼   ► despite how much I want it to exist,

00:37:20 ◼   ► that it actually is going to exist.

00:37:22 ◼   ► - Which is funny to me because when I opened,

00:37:28 ◼   ► so I started off our list that we keep

00:37:31 ◼   ► with the text that we can choose from,

00:37:35 ◼   ► and I sent it to you.

00:37:36 ◼   ► When I reopened it again, you had added more items

00:37:40 ◼   ► to the new larger iMac category than anywhere else.

00:37:44 ◼   ► - There's so many great mysteries about a new larger iMac.

00:37:47 ◼   ► And I know you care about it the most.

00:37:49 ◼   ► - Yeah, and it's very hard for me to choose

00:37:52 ◼   ► about whether it will exist or not.

00:37:56 ◼   ► So my question is basically,

00:37:57 ◼   ► do I wanna throw a pick at something

00:37:58 ◼   ► in order to make it exist?

00:38:00 ◼   ► 'Cause I have that kind of magical power.

00:38:02 ◼   ► - So that's, what is that?

00:38:04 ◼   ► - Wish casting.

00:38:04 ◼   ► - Yeah, okay.

00:38:06 ◼   ► - Oh yeah, sure.

00:38:07 ◼   ► Or do I wanna just go with something that's safe and boring

00:38:13 ◼   ► and I really don't wanna flip the pen over.

00:38:15 ◼   ► So I'm gonna go with a Mac Mini keeps the same design.

00:38:19 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:38:20 ◼   ► Darn it.

00:38:22 ◼   ► - Is that on your list?

00:38:26 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:38:27 ◼   ► - I mean, I would love a new design for the Mac Mini

00:38:29 ◼   ► that's smaller and just all tiny and awesome and all,

00:38:34 ◼   ► but they've worn me down to the point now

00:38:37 ◼   ► that the M1 Mac Mini has so much open space in it

00:38:40 ◼   ► that I actually think it's an advantage

00:38:41 ◼   ► because if you wanna put a cooling system in there

00:38:44 ◼   ► for the M1 Pro and M1 Macs,

00:38:46 ◼   ► then you actually wanna have a mini that's that size.

00:38:49 ◼   ► And, you know, Apple releasing new versions

00:38:52 ◼   ► of the Mac Mini is great.

00:38:53 ◼   ► Expecting Apple to change the shape of the Mac Mini,

00:38:56 ◼   ► I feel like is unrealistic.

00:38:58 ◼   ► So I'm gonna give up and just say,

00:38:59 ◼   ► "Yeah, it's gonna look the same,

00:39:01 ◼   ► "but it's gonna be awesome on the inside."

00:39:03 ◼   ► - I'm trying to work out right now

00:39:05 ◼   ► if I go for drama,

00:39:08 ◼   ► - Uh-huh. - Go for something exciting,

00:39:10 ◼   ► or I just go for a boring final pick.

00:39:13 ◼   ► - I almost offered a deal with you,

00:39:18 ◼   ► which was that for our last picks in this round

00:39:22 ◼   ► to not be about the Mac mini and the MacBook Pro,

00:39:25 ◼   ► but then I decided I wouldn't.

00:39:27 ◼   ► - No, because more than anything, Jason,

00:39:29 ◼   ► I think the upgrade ends have learned,

00:39:31 ◼   ► do you love to win?

00:39:32 ◼   ► - I wanna win the draft, yeah, I do.

00:39:34 ◼   ► - Yeah, I know, I know you wanna win the draft.

00:39:42 ◼   ► - All right, I'm just gonna go boring.

00:39:45 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:39:46 ◼   ► - The Mac Mini gets more ports than the M1 Mac Mini.

00:39:50 ◼   ► - More ports than the M1 Mac Mini.

00:39:52 ◼   ► I like this one.

00:39:55 ◼   ► I enjoyed picking this

00:39:56 ◼   ► because I think it's kind of diabolical, right?

00:39:58 ◼   ► It's like more ports.

00:40:02 ◼   ► - Yup.

00:40:03 ◼   ► - They could be different,

00:40:04 ◼   ► but if it's the same number, it's not more ports.

00:40:08 ◼   ► I was actually, I had my next on my list

00:40:10 ◼   ► that I didn't go with was Mac Mini has

00:40:12 ◼   ► one or more USB-A ports on it, because I think that's a hilarious question too.

00:40:17 ◼   ► And I don't know the answer. I think probably it would because the current Mac Mini did,

00:40:22 ◼   ► but who knows what Apple's opinion of various ports are at any given time. You would think,

00:40:28 ◼   ► based on the MacBook Pro, that a powerful Mac Mini would have lots of ports on the back.

00:40:33 ◼   ► That has traditionally been the case, that the Mac Mini has had a lot of ports on the back.

00:40:37 ◼   ► It just wasn't true with the M1 because the M1 Mac Mini was an M1 and didn't have the ability to

00:40:44 ◼   ► really have very many ports. But this one's going to have more capable chips, so it should have more

00:40:51 ◼   ► ports on it. One way or another, I expect that if we get a Mac Mini, it has the capability for more.

00:40:56 ◼   ► I reckon M2 will do it or M1 Pro or Max will do it. And it'll probably be something simple like,

00:41:03 ◼   ► it'll still have the USB-A ports on it,

00:41:06 ◼   ► but it'll have an extra Thunderbolt on it,

00:41:09 ◼   ► something like that.

00:41:10 ◼   ► - Or like, they're all Thunderbolt,

00:41:11 ◼   ► but there's more than there was before,

00:41:13 ◼   ► or who knows, you know what I mean?

00:41:14 ◼   ► Something like that.

00:41:15 ◼   ► - Something like that.

00:41:17 ◼   ► - The pick that I wanted to go with then

00:41:19 ◼   ► is that I do actually think that Mac Mini

00:41:21 ◼   ► will get a new design.

00:41:23 ◼   ► - I think there's a chance,

00:41:25 ◼   ► and I'll be delightfully surprised

00:41:28 ◼   ► and happy to lose that point if it comes to that.

00:41:31 ◼   ► 'Cause I think that my hope also fear

00:41:34 ◼   ► is that they're gonna do a redesign.

00:41:36 ◼   ► And one of the things they're gonna do

00:41:38 ◼   ► is they're gonna put the power supply outbound

00:41:43 ◼   ► like they did on the, in outboard power supply

00:41:45 ◼   ► like they've done in the iMac.

00:41:46 ◼   ► - Yeah, that'd be nice.

00:41:48 ◼   ► - Well, it's bad.

00:41:50 ◼   ► In some ways it's bad because you have to manage that block

00:41:54 ◼   ► and people don't like that.

00:41:56 ◼   ► But at the same time it gets it off the desk

00:41:59 ◼   ► and it might even use the same connector as on the iMac,

00:42:03 ◼   ► and that that allows them to take the power supply

00:42:05 ◼   ► out of it, which means that it can be even smaller.

00:42:08 ◼   ► And they may yet do that, but I don't know.

00:42:12 ◼   ► Again, they've ground me down with the Mac Mini.

00:42:15 ◼   ► I wrote articles imagining a new design for the Mac Mini

00:42:17 ◼   ► like five years ago, and it still looks exactly the same.

00:42:20 ◼   ► So I give up.

00:42:21 ◼   ► - My feeling on this is I do genuinely believe

00:42:26 ◼   ► that there will be no Mac untouched design-wise

00:42:31 ◼   ► after the end of the Apple Silicon transition?

00:42:38 ◼   ► - I see where you're coming from,

00:42:40 ◼   ► and yet again, they ground me down with the Mac Mini so much

00:42:44 ◼   ► that, like, that M1 Mac Mini, oh my God, right?

00:42:47 ◼   ► It's literally like a couple of tiny things

00:42:50 ◼   ► rattling around inside a giant aluminum enclosure

00:42:52 ◼   ► 'cause they didn't wanna change it.

00:42:54 ◼   ► But maybe now's the time.

00:42:55 ◼   ► I mean, that's my, you're making my argument

00:42:57 ◼   ► for the 13 inch MacBook Pro, right?

00:43:00 ◼   ► Which is, it wasn't important enough to change

00:43:03 ◼   ► when they were getting the M1s out the door,

00:43:04 ◼   ► but now is the time to refresh.

00:43:08 ◼   ► And you could make the same argument for both of those.

00:43:11 ◼   ► And the Air, which we all expect is gonna be changed.

00:43:14 ◼   ► But yeah, it could be time for the Mac mini

00:43:17 ◼   ► and the 13 inch MacBook Pro to look different.

00:43:19 ◼   ► - Of course, there was a ton of stuff we did not pick.

00:43:23 ◼   ► We did not pick anything iMac related,

00:43:25 ◼   ► did not pick anything MacBook Air related.

00:43:27 ◼   ► We're gonna go over some of the things

00:43:29 ◼   ► we didn't pick in Upgrade Plus today.

00:43:31 ◼   ► So if you sign up, you go to getupgradeplus.com,

00:43:33 ◼   ► you can sign up $5 a month or $50 a year.

00:43:36 ◼   ► You get longer ad-free versions of Upgrade,

00:43:38 ◼   ► and this time we're gonna be talking about

00:43:40 ◼   ► some of the stuff that did not make it

00:43:42 ◼   ► into the draft list this time around.

00:43:45 ◼   ► Honestly, I don't really know how I'm feeling

00:43:47 ◼   ► about the draft for me so far.

00:43:49 ◼   ► I have not picked anything that was not on my list.

00:43:52 ◼   ► I just maybe moved some stuff around a little bit more.

00:43:55 ◼   ► But I feel like people may disagree with me.

00:44:00 ◼   ► I'm sure people do.

00:44:02 ◼   ► I'm seeing people that do,

00:44:03 ◼   ► but I do think that all of these things are going to happen.

00:44:07 ◼   ► For me, it's just a case of, does it happen this time

00:44:09 ◼   ► or does it happen next time?

00:44:11 ◼   ► - Oh yeah.

00:44:12 ◼   ► Yeah, I would agree with that.

00:44:13 ◼   ► - We'll see.

00:44:14 ◼   ► - But one of the challenges with the Raft

00:44:15 ◼   ► is that we're trying to gauge,

00:44:19 ◼   ► - The heart of it too is just trying to restrict

00:44:22 ◼   ► your enthusiasm.

00:44:23 ◼   ► And I've done some things here that are like letting

00:44:25 ◼   ► a little bit of my enthusiasm out,

00:44:27 ◼   ► but like I didn't pick an iMac,

00:44:29 ◼   ► even though I want it badly.

00:44:31 ◼   ► Because I think I'm over indexing how likely it is

00:44:36 ◼   ► that it'll happen based on my enthusiasm for it.

00:44:41 ◼   ► So I'm trying to kind of tamp that down.

00:44:43 ◼   ► I do think it'll happen.

00:44:44 ◼   ► But again, like with doing a new Mac mini enclosure,

00:44:47 ◼   ► where I'm like, yeah, I've been burned enough, let's not.

00:44:51 ◼   ► - I would question an Apple event where we get an iPhone,

00:44:57 ◼   ► an iPad, a Mac mini and a MacBook Pro

00:44:59 ◼   ► and they basically all remain the same visually.

00:45:02 ◼   ► Like, and I know that we've got some different picks

00:45:04 ◼   ► between the two of us across this spectrum,

00:45:07 ◼   ► but like that's why I think at least something's

00:45:10 ◼   ► gotta change somewhere, right?

00:45:12 ◼   ► Then I don't know what it is.

00:45:14 ◼   ► Can you, I mean how funny that would be though.

00:45:16 ◼   ► If the iPhone SE got updated with new internals, the iPad Air got updated with new internals,

00:45:21 ◼   ► the MacBook Pro got updated with new internals, so does the Mac Mini.

00:45:24 ◼   ► Goodbye everyone!

00:45:25 ◼   ► Bye everybody!

00:45:26 ◼   ► See you at WNBC!

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00:47:43 ◼   ► Ok we move into other picks. Now this is a range of products that we haven't mentioned

00:47:49 ◼   ► that don't fall into the previous categories. Stagecraft picks, software, hardware, all

00:47:55 ◼   ► of that fun stuff. We are picking two things each from this round. Jason, what's your first?

00:48:01 ◼   ► I am going to pick... I'm just going in on March 8th. Going in on March 8th. The event takes place

00:48:11 ◼   ► March 8th. Very nice. Interesting. Okay. I didn't end up picking this one. Felt like tempting fate

00:48:19 ◼   ► to me. Yeah, I didn't find a lot in our others list that I was really super excited about,

00:48:24 ◼   ► And I think that I when I when I look back at what I thought the probabilities were for all the items in our miscellaneous list

00:48:32 ◼   ► I decided that the event taking place on March 8th was actually stronger than I initially thought

00:48:37 ◼   ► so I'm just gonna lay it down and we'll see whether Mark Gurman's

00:48:41 ◼   ► vague pronouncements about March 8th are right or not. And if we do decide that

00:48:46 ◼   ► This goes on long enough that we each get to swap out a pick guess which one I'm swapping out

00:48:51 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:48:54 ◼   ► - My first pick is that Tim Cook presents

00:48:58 ◼   ► from outside Apple Park.

00:49:00 ◼   ► - What makes you think that?

00:49:03 ◼   ► - Because he does that every single time

00:49:06 ◼   ► except for the iPhone.

00:49:08 ◼   ► - I mean, sometimes he's in the cafe

00:49:12 ◼   ► and sometimes he's in the theater.

00:49:15 ◼   ► - But he's always walking around that Tim Cook, you know?

00:49:18 ◼   ► - He is walking around, yeah, that's true.

00:49:19 ◼   ► - And I do feel like spring event,

00:49:21 ◼   ► - Remember when he was standing amongst all the reads

00:49:23 ◼   ► last time?

00:49:24 ◼   ► - Yeah, okay.

00:49:27 ◼   ► - So I think that he will be presented

00:49:28 ◼   ► from outside Apple Park. - A little nature,

00:49:29 ◼   ► a little nature for Tim.

00:49:30 ◼   ► - Obviously this does not account for the entire

00:49:32 ◼   ► presentation, it's not one I'm picking.

00:49:35 ◼   ► This says it could be multiple reads on this.

00:49:38 ◼   ► Tim Cook presents from outside Apple Park, he will.

00:49:41 ◼   ► - Okay, and I'm gonna go with a classic,

00:49:44 ◼   ► We See the Rainbow Stage.

00:49:47 ◼   ► - Oh, I had this, I had this very--

00:49:50 ◼   ► - Taste the Rainbow, See the Rainbow,

00:49:51 ◼   ► They love that rainbow stage, they love it.

00:49:53 ◼   ► And all you have to do is see, remember there was that one event where it was dark and it

00:49:55 ◼   ► was like the saddest, darkest rainbow of all, but it was there.

00:49:59 ◼   ► Midnight rainbow.

00:50:00 ◼   ► They like, they like it.

00:50:02 ◼   ► That could be one of the colors in the color draft, just stay tuned for that.

00:50:05 ◼   ► John Turnas presents the segment.

00:50:08 ◼   ► Okay.

00:50:09 ◼   ► What uh, what made you pick him?

00:50:11 ◼   ► If there's a Mac, Turnas will present it.

00:50:14 ◼   ► Okay.

00:50:15 ◼   ► Because he has presented every Mac that they've announced in the last little while.

00:50:20 ◼   ► I do still assume that he is considered for great things at Apple.

00:50:26 ◼   ► We've mentioned this before.

00:50:28 ◼   ► And apparently John Turness is seen as a potential future CEO of the company.

00:50:33 ◼   ► So I think they're just going to continue to give him space.

00:50:38 ◼   ► He has a more important role at Apple now than he has in previous years.

00:50:44 ◼   ► I think that he will get his time.

00:50:45 ◼   ► Plus, he's just a really good presenter.

00:50:47 ◼   ► I really like parts where John Turner presents,

00:50:50 ◼   ► and I think they're gonna continue doing that,

00:50:52 ◼   ► especially if they have anything new chip based.

00:50:55 ◼   ► And I know that he doesn't do all of it,

00:50:57 ◼   ► but he very frequently starts that part

00:51:00 ◼   ► and then throws over to someone in the chip lab.

00:51:02 ◼   ► - Totally.

00:51:03 ◼   ► - So we now move into the draft of The Color Czar.

00:51:07 ◼   ► - Yes.

00:51:07 ◼   ► - So this is a Jason Snell creation.

00:51:10 ◼   ► And a Jason Snell adaptation.

00:51:12 ◼   ► Would you like to explain what this is?

00:51:15 ◼   ► I think it would be fun for us to draft colors.

00:51:18 ◼   ► Apple's doing a lot of stuff with color.

00:51:20 ◼   ► They're putting color, there's colors in the iPad Air,

00:51:23 ◼   ► there's colors in the iMac.

00:51:25 ◼   ► There may be colors coming to the big iMac.

00:51:29 ◼   ► There may be, there's colors in iPhones.

00:51:32 ◼   ► And so we did this last time and I wanna bring it back.

00:51:36 ◼   ► A silly little game that we tack on to the end of the draft

00:51:39 ◼   ► where we pick colors.

00:51:42 ◼   ► In this case, we are going to pick colors.

00:51:45 ◼   ► that are unveiled in a new product during the event.

00:51:49 ◼   ► For this one, I'm gonna say that if the color

00:51:54 ◼   ► isn't said out loud, but it shows up

00:51:56 ◼   ► in the product description afterward, it's good enough,

00:51:59 ◼   ► 'cause it's really, this is like a little adjunct

00:52:02 ◼   ► to the main draft.

00:52:03 ◼   ► But the idea here is we're trying to guess

00:52:05 ◼   ► what colors Apple puts on its products.

00:52:08 ◼   ► By the way, if a color is used on more than one product,

00:52:11 ◼   ► I would say it's worth a point for each product it's on.

00:52:14 ◼   ► and most total points gets a bonus draft point.

00:52:16 ◼   ► - Yes, so this is going to be a slight change

00:52:21 ◼   ► to the way that we usually do things,

00:52:24 ◼   ► because we are going to have to,

00:52:26 ◼   ► and we've agreed on this in advance,

00:52:28 ◼   ► we will do it for this.

00:52:29 ◼   ► We will be going into Apple's product pages

00:52:33 ◼   ► and confirming the color names and their frequencies.

00:52:37 ◼   ► It may be possible, honestly,

00:52:39 ◼   ► that we might be able to just get all of this information

00:52:41 ◼   ► from the keynote.

00:52:43 ◼   ► That's, you know, they show videos

00:52:45 ◼   ► and we could see all the colors there,

00:52:47 ◼   ► but we will be wanting to go in and triple check this one.

00:52:51 ◼   ► But of course we have to be able to confirm it

00:52:54 ◼   ► before the draft segment, the results segment ends.

00:52:58 ◼   ► That still stands.

00:53:00 ◼   ► - Now in the original Colors Are draft,

00:53:02 ◼   ► we got very competitive and we got caught up

00:53:06 ◼   ► in picking things that were boring and we tied.

00:53:09 ◼   ► And so there was no bonus point there.

00:53:11 ◼   ► So in this colors are draft,

00:53:13 ◼   ► we each have to make three picks.

00:53:16 ◼   ► We have to make a boring pick.

00:53:18 ◼   ► We have to make a color pick.

00:53:20 ◼   ► And then we have to make up a color name

00:53:22 ◼   ► that we think Apple will use

00:53:24 ◼   ► that has not yet been used on an Apple product.

00:53:26 ◼   ► Those are our three selections.

00:53:28 ◼   ► - All right.

00:53:28 ◼   ► So just to give a little bit more information on this,

00:53:31 ◼   ► boring colors are names of colors

00:53:34 ◼   ► that are preexisting in Apple products.

00:53:37 ◼   ► Colors are just colors, right?

00:53:41 ◼   ► Any color you could pick it, new or old I guess you could pick it.

00:53:44 ◼   ► But like the boring colors is like your space grays, your space blacks of the world, you know that kind of stuff.

00:53:51 ◼   ► Yeah, space gray silver, starlight, midnight.

00:53:53 ◼   ► By the way starlight, did you know there's now a Coke flavor called starlight?

00:53:56 ◼   ► What does that mean?

00:53:57 ◼   ► I wonder if it tastes like a MacBook.

00:54:01 ◼   ► Coke starlight?

00:54:02 ◼   ► I guess it would taste like an iPhone.

00:54:04 ◼   ► Yeah, starlight.

00:54:05 ◼   ► Thetakeout.com says Coca-Cola starlight tastes like one big marketing ploy.

00:54:10 ◼   ► - Yeah, well, sounds about right.

00:54:13 ◼   ► Anyway, so the boring colors are not very colorful,

00:54:15 ◼   ► is the point.

00:54:16 ◼   ► Silver, space gray, starlight, midnight, space black, rose.

00:54:18 ◼   ► I'm putting rose gold in there.

00:54:19 ◼   ► It's kind of boring.

00:54:20 ◼   ► It's been around a long time.

00:54:21 ◼   ► Colors are like green and orange and pink and purple

00:54:23 ◼   ► and yellow and blue.

00:54:24 ◼   ► Also the iPad Air currently comes in sky blue.

00:54:27 ◼   ► So you could say sky blue if you wanted to.

00:54:28 ◼   ► And that's a color, sky blue.

00:54:30 ◼   ► - Can I ask a question?

00:54:32 ◼   ► - Yes. - Is there a final question

00:54:32 ◼   ► on colors? - And if you wanted to do

00:54:34 ◼   ► midnight lemon or Pacific blue or whatever,

00:54:36 ◼   ► you could do that too.

00:54:37 ◼   ► And that's a color.

00:54:38 ◼   ► Starlight and Midnight, right?

00:54:40 ◼   ► We couldn't really understand what these colors were.

00:54:43 ◼   ► - Right.

00:54:45 ◼   ► - Now, when it comes to colors,

00:54:47 ◼   ► the colors category of the colors are draft,

00:54:50 ◼   ► do they have to be named this?

00:54:53 ◼   ► - I would say yes.

00:54:56 ◼   ► I would say if you pick blue

00:54:58 ◼   ► and the blue that they use is sky blue and not blue,

00:55:01 ◼   ► it's not. - Or if like,

00:55:01 ◼   ► it's called Azure, right?

00:55:04 ◼   ► - Yeah, but what I don't wanna do is get like, so pink.

00:55:07 ◼   ► Pink is a color and you can say,

00:55:09 ◼   ► well, but really the pink iMac, it's kind of red.

00:55:13 ◼   ► No, it's called pink.

00:55:15 ◼   ► - Cool, this is what I want you to check.

00:55:16 ◼   ► It's just the name, we are matching the name.

00:55:18 ◼   ► - It is the name, right?

00:55:20 ◼   ► Apple gets to name it,

00:55:21 ◼   ► we just have to guess what they're gonna name it.

00:55:23 ◼   ► - Yeah, this is what I wanted to check

00:55:24 ◼   ► 'cause I don't wanna be like color,

00:55:28 ◼   ► like, you know, I don't wanna start getting out color meters.

00:55:30 ◼   ► - We're gonna argue whether something,

00:55:32 ◼   ► whether the new Aqua iMac is green or blue, right?

00:55:35 ◼   ► We don't want to be in that situation.

00:55:38 ◼   ► That way lies more madness than we already have.

00:55:40 ◼   ► So no.

00:55:41 ◼   ► - And then the Invent a Color round

00:55:44 ◼   ► is we need to pick a marketing name for a color.

00:55:48 ◼   ► - Exactly.

00:55:49 ◼   ► You got it. - Which is amazing.

00:55:50 ◼   ► That's my favorite one.

00:55:52 ◼   ► All right. - Okay.

00:55:53 ◼   ► - What is your boring color?

00:55:56 ◼   ► - Silver.

00:55:57 ◼   ► The most boring color of all is silver.

00:55:59 ◼   ► I choose silver.

00:56:05 ◼   ► - Silver was my first choice.

00:56:07 ◼   ► - It is the most, like, is Apple not gonna offer it

00:56:11 ◼   ► in silver?

00:56:11 ◼   ► Of course it is.

00:56:12 ◼   ► - So I'm not asking for you here,

00:56:14 ◼   ► but I'm just gonna talk, speak this aloud, all right?

00:56:17 ◼   ► - All right.

00:56:18 ◼   ► - My next two are Starlight and Space Gray.

00:56:21 ◼   ► Starlight is a newer one, right?

00:56:25 ◼   ► - I'm worried about this, 'cause it sure looks like

00:56:28 ◼   ► Starlight and Midnight are the new Silver and Space Gray.

00:56:32 ◼   ► - Yes.

00:56:33 ◼   ► haven't brought them to a bunch of products

00:56:37 ◼   ► that are, you know, they're not yet,

00:56:41 ◼   ► it's not yet clear that they're gonna be everywhere.

00:56:44 ◼   ► - Oh, I've made my decision.

00:56:45 ◼   ► - Like, are they gonna make a Starlight MacBook Pro?

00:56:47 ◼   ► - You've helped me make my decision,

00:56:49 ◼   ► which is I'm going with Space Gray.

00:56:51 ◼   ► - Space Gray, okay.

00:56:52 ◼   ► - I am expecting some products that they announce

00:56:57 ◼   ► will not get new colors,

00:56:58 ◼   ► they will just be in the old colors.

00:57:00 ◼   ► - Uh-huh, yeah, that's part of the game.

00:57:01 ◼   ► - The nice gray is the old colors, right?

00:57:04 ◼   ► - Now we get complaints in the chat now

00:57:05 ◼   ► that you shouldn't be able to pick silver.

00:57:07 ◼   ► And the answer is this is the boring of color people.

00:57:09 ◼   ► This is what it's all about.

00:57:10 ◼   ► The good news is, boring color round is now over.

00:57:13 ◼   ► - Silver to be a color that Apple offers anymore.

00:57:16 ◼   ► But they do, so what do you want from us?

00:57:19 ◼   ► - Exactly, exactly.

00:57:21 ◼   ► Can you imagine all the people who are gonna be angry

00:57:23 ◼   ► if they replace silver with starlight and they're like,

00:57:25 ◼   ► no, it's slightly different.

00:57:27 ◼   ► I guess.

00:57:29 ◼   ► I had a Starlight review unit and I looked at it

00:57:31 ◼   ► and I was like, is this different?

00:57:34 ◼   ► And you had to literally had to hold it next to a silver one

00:57:37 ◼   ► and then you'd be like, sort of, a little bit, not a lot.

00:57:42 ◼   ► All right, it's color time.

00:57:44 ◼   ► I got to pick a color.

00:57:47 ◼   ► We've got Mac books and Mac minis and an iPad Air.

00:57:52 ◼   ► - And an iPhone SE.

00:57:55 ◼   ► - And an iPhone SE.

00:57:57 ◼   ► - And I will also just note for the record,

00:57:59 ◼   ► one of the picks that we did not pick,

00:58:01 ◼   ► but I would mention it here,

00:58:02 ◼   ► Apple announces a new color to the iPhone 13 line,

00:58:05 ◼   ► which they did do last time with the purple one.

00:58:08 ◼   ► - Right, so that might be part of it too.

00:58:10 ◼   ► - Easter iPhone.

00:58:11 ◼   ► - I'm gonna go with...

00:58:18 ◼   ► Oh, this is a tough one.

00:58:26 ◼   ► Well, it's just we're gonna go with green.

00:58:32 ◼   ► I'm gonna take green.

00:58:34 ◼   ► All right.

00:58:35 ◼   ► Thought about product red there for a minute, but I went with green.

00:58:39 ◼   ► You just put an idea in my brain.

00:58:42 ◼   ► But it's not on the list, though.

00:58:45 ◼   ► You can pick product red if you want.

00:58:47 ◼   ► I'm gonna.

00:58:48 ◼   ► I'm sorry.

00:58:49 ◼   ► I'm picking red.

00:58:50 ◼   ► Product red.

00:58:51 ◼   ► Okay.

00:58:52 ◼   ► My actual colors that I had that I was going to pick is purple, blue and orange.

00:58:58 ◼   ► They were the three.

00:59:00 ◼   ► Purple I was going to abandon even though it was my top one because then when thinking about it,

00:59:04 ◼   ► I don't think they're going to do a purple iPhone two times in a row.

00:59:08 ◼   ► Right?

00:59:10 ◼   ► And orange was high up there for me because orange is like a good color for Apple these days.

00:59:21 ◼   ► Apple product name color of our own.

00:59:51 ◼   ► Now here's the thing, this is what we're gonna go with here.

00:59:56 ◼   ► There's two options on the table.

00:59:58 ◼   ► Do you either A, put an adjective

01:00:01 ◼   ► in front of a standard color?

01:00:03 ◼   ► You'll say Pacific blue of the world.

01:00:06 ◼   ► Or do you go starlight and just pick a random word?

01:00:11 ◼   ► - Ah yes, that's right.

01:00:12 ◼   ► - Any color can be assigned to.

01:00:14 ◼   ► - Supernova.

01:00:16 ◼   ► - Rhinoceros or something.

01:00:18 ◼   ► (laughing)

01:00:20 ◼   ► - I choose deep blue sea.

01:00:25 ◼   ► - All right, interesting.

01:00:26 ◼   ► That's a completely new convention

01:00:28 ◼   ► where the color name is in the middle.

01:00:30 ◼   ► - Sure, I'm breaking new ground here.

01:00:33 ◼   ► Why not?

01:00:34 ◼   ► - Sea blue, Jason, why deep blue sea?

01:00:38 ◼   ► All right, so--

01:00:39 ◼   ► - Well, they got sky blue

01:00:40 ◼   ► and it's like the devil in the deep blue sea.

01:00:41 ◼   ► It's the deep blue sea.

01:00:42 ◼   ► Deep blue sea is, I've just decided,

01:00:45 ◼   ► sea blue is probably better, but it's too late.

01:00:47 ◼   ► I have three. I'm trying to pick which one. I tell you the one I think that I had that I don't think it will be.

01:00:55 ◼   ► Cosmic Black. That was one of them. But I'm going to go with Spring Yellow.

01:01:04 ◼   ► Oh, okay. Safari Green was my other one. But Safari Green. That feels very pro.

01:01:12 ◼   ► So my Safari green, Safari green is my iMac Pro color.

01:01:17 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:01:18 ◼   ► - Right?

01:01:19 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:01:20 ◼   ► - Spring yellow is what I'm gonna go with for,

01:01:22 ◼   ► and I'm betting spring yellow on a potential iPhone color.

01:01:26 ◼   ► That's where I'm going with that.

01:01:27 ◼   ► - Okay.

01:01:29 ◼   ► - Here's a question for you.

01:01:31 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:01:32 ◼   ► - Are we gonna count cases in this?

01:01:35 ◼   ► - No, no, this is just on the hardware.

01:01:39 ◼   ► - Computers, phones, that kind of stuff, right?

01:01:42 ◼   ► - Exactly.

01:01:42 ◼   ► - Cool.

01:01:43 ◼   ► So we'll have to double check

01:01:44 ◼   ► 'cause obviously that opens us up a lot, right?

01:01:46 ◼   ► And could take us quite a while

01:01:47 ◼   ► to check through all this stuff.

01:01:49 ◼   ► - Yes.

01:01:50 ◼   ► - We'll see.

01:01:51 ◼   ► Maybe that's a thing, maybe in future, right?

01:01:53 ◼   ► We could start including.

01:01:54 ◼   ► We'll see how the cut draft of the ColorZar goes.

01:01:56 ◼   ► - I fear that the end result here

01:01:58 ◼   ► is going to be either a boring tie or a win

01:02:01 ◼   ► because of more silver things or more gray things.

01:02:05 ◼   ► But we're still fine tuning the ColorZar draft.

01:02:08 ◼   ► - Who knows how it's gonna go.

01:02:09 ◼   ► - Yeah, it does.

01:02:11 ◼   ► So that's it. That draft is complete.

01:02:13 ◼   ► The episode is not over.

01:02:14 ◼   ► I had a few more things I want to get to today,

01:02:16 ◼   ► but the draft is now done.

01:02:19 ◼   ► I have no idea about this one.

01:02:21 ◼   ► I don't feel confident,

01:02:22 ◼   ► but I don't feel like you've taken it.

01:02:24 ◼   ► So, you know, I'm just like,

01:02:26 ◼   ► we're just going to see how this one plays out.

01:02:29 ◼   ► Maybe there won't even be an event.

01:02:32 ◼   ► - The one pick here of yours

01:02:39 ◼   ► that I raise my eyebrows at the most is the M2 chip.

01:02:44 ◼   ► But-- - Oh yeah, definitely.

01:02:45 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah. - We'll see.

01:02:48 ◼   ► - Yeah, we'll see.

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01:04:46 ◼   ► Howdy partner!

01:04:47 ◼   ► Hey there partner, it's time for the room roundup!

01:04:52 ◼   ► So I thought, I still wanted to go through some of this stuff, some things that may be

01:04:57 ◼   ► of an effect to the event itself, but I wanted to obviously talk about them after we've made

01:05:02 ◼   ► our picks so as not to sway our opinions. The Sheriff of Rumorville, Mark Gurman, expects

01:05:10 ◼   ► Apple to release seven new Macs in 2022. This includes a new Mac Mini with an M1 Pro chip,

01:05:19 ◼   ► a 13-inch MacBook Pro with an M2 chip. See if I would have read this and then a Mac Mini

01:05:24 ◼   ► with an M2 chip. Come on, Mark, you got my back. A 24-inch iMac with an M2 chip, a redesigned

01:05:30 ◼   ► MacBook Air with an M2 chip, a larger iMac Pro with M1 Pro and M1 Max chip options, and

01:05:37 ◼   ► a half-sized Mac Pro, the first of Apple Silicon, with the equivalent of either two or four

01:05:43 ◼   ► M1 Max chips.

01:05:45 ◼   ► Now we have heard about all of these things, I feel like over the last year or so, but

01:05:50 ◼   ► the idea, just laying it out there, seven new Macs in 2022, woo boy.

01:05:56 ◼   ► - Yeah, yeah, including the big iMac and the Mac Pro

01:06:00 ◼   ► and the first wave of M2 Macs as well.

01:06:05 ◼   ► That's pretty sweet, pretty sweet.

01:06:06 ◼   ► - It's gonna be a big, big important, yeah.

01:06:08 ◼   ► Now, Mark's guess for March, the March event,

01:06:12 ◼   ► is MacBook Pro and Mac Mini.

01:06:14 ◼   ► Mark feels pretty confident about that.

01:06:19 ◼   ► And he goes on to mention, more releases expected

01:06:23 ◼   ► in the May/June timeframe could be the Mac Pro,

01:06:27 ◼   ► unsure of the window of the iMac Pro,

01:06:30 ◼   ► but between now and June seeming the most likely.

01:06:33 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:06:34 ◼   ► - I still don't think we're gonna see a release

01:06:36 ◼   ► of a Mac Pro in June.

01:06:37 ◼   ► - I, yeah, I still think that the most likely scenario

01:06:43 ◼   ► is that the Mac Pro gets teased and then releases later,

01:06:46 ◼   ► but who knows?

01:06:47 ◼   ► I mean, they've got the M1 Pro and Macs chips out there now.

01:06:49 ◼   ► If they've got them, then they're obviously,

01:06:51 ◼   ► they've got all the parts

01:06:52 ◼   ► and they just need to put it together.

01:06:54 ◼   ► So who knows?

01:06:56 ◼   ► That's part of the excitement of having Apple

01:06:59 ◼   ► not be constrained by Intel product releases

01:07:01 ◼   ► is we don't really know what Apple's full array

01:07:04 ◼   ► of Apple Silicon Macs is gonna be.

01:07:06 ◼   ► And then we don't know what their update schedule

01:07:08 ◼   ► is gonna be.

01:07:09 ◼   ► And this is gonna be our first data point to really,

01:07:12 ◼   ► 'cause you gotta connect two events

01:07:15 ◼   ► to start making extrapolations.

01:07:17 ◼   ► And we haven't had two events of any Apple Silicon product.

01:07:21 ◼   ► We've only had introductions.

01:07:22 ◼   ► So we're gonna really get a sense.

01:07:24 ◼   ► And the M2, I think the M2 is really interesting.

01:07:26 ◼   ► Like is this next event the M2 rollout?

01:07:29 ◼   ► And you go into the chip lab, it could be.

01:07:31 ◼   ► And you talk about we're doing this next generation M2

01:07:34 ◼   ► and the first place it's going is the MacBook Pro.

01:07:36 ◼   ► And that's what differentiates it,

01:07:39 ◼   ► at least momentarily from the MacBook Air

01:07:42 ◼   ► is that it's got the better chip in it,

01:07:44 ◼   ► which then the MacBook Air will get later.

01:07:46 ◼   ► So I don't know, maybe, maybe could be.

01:07:49 ◼   ► That would be, I think it would not be unreasonable

01:07:51 ◼   ► for this event to be putting the M1 Pro and Max

01:07:56 ◼   ► in Pro-E hardware like the Mac mini

01:08:00 ◼   ► and the, and maybe even an iMac,

01:08:05 ◼   ► and then putting the M2 in a new lower end piece of hardware

01:08:10 ◼   ► like the 13-inch MacBook Pro.

01:08:13 ◼   ► Maybe, maybe, I could see that.

01:08:15 ◼   ► - Jon Prosser has shared a leaked schematic

01:08:19 ◼   ► of the iPhone 14 which shows both a hole punch camera and a pill shaped face ID sensor with

01:08:26 ◼   ► no more notch. This has been rumoured before but this schematic seems to show some of the

01:08:32 ◼   ► sizing, the sizing being much larger than people expected. It's expected that this

01:08:37 ◼   ► kind of like jewel hole punch cut out screen will find its way to all of the iPhone 14

01:08:45 ◼   ► later on this year.

01:08:46 ◼   ► I don't think we've spoken about this at all.

01:08:49 ◼   ► I kind of wanted to get your thoughts

01:08:51 ◼   ► on this overall design.

01:08:54 ◼   ► So losing the notch and having kind of some holes

01:08:57 ◼   ► be cut into the screen,

01:08:58 ◼   ► but having the screen flow around them.

01:09:01 ◼   ► What is your take on this?

01:09:03 ◼   ► - Well, you know, Apple can define areas that are not,

01:09:06 ◼   ► you know, that are not safe.

01:09:08 ◼   ► The notch is one version of it.

01:09:09 ◼   ► This might be a different one.

01:09:11 ◼   ► I think Apple has shown that they know how to hide this stuff

01:09:15 ◼   ► when necessary and keep the software in line.

01:09:19 ◼   ► So this would just be a way to reduce the visibility

01:09:24 ◼   ► of the notch a little bit.

01:09:26 ◼   ► It's fine.

01:09:27 ◼   ► I think we all expected that they were going to continue

01:09:29 ◼   ► to slim things down as much as possible

01:09:32 ◼   ► until they can get to the point where it's all invisible.

01:09:34 ◼   ► I don't know.

01:09:37 ◼   ► I think it'll be interesting to see

01:09:39 ◼   ► what it actually looks like in use

01:09:42 ◼   ► and how Apple handles the software.

01:09:44 ◼   ► I imagine that for most cases it will be up in the,

01:09:48 ◼   ► you know, up in the display bar area or just below it.

01:09:52 ◼   ► And we'll, you know, Apple will try to discourage

01:09:56 ◼   ► the use of the space around it for general purpose.

01:09:59 ◼   ► And I don't know, I mean, I'm fine with it.

01:10:02 ◼   ► I have come to not care about the notch at all.

01:10:06 ◼   ► Every now and then a tweet makes its way into my timeline

01:10:09 ◼   ► where somebody makes a notch joke and I think, really?

01:10:12 ◼   ► Like, oh, okay.

01:10:14 ◼   ► I'm over it.

01:10:16 ◼   ► And even on the MacBook Pro, I think the notch is fine

01:10:20 ◼   ► because they've done a good job

01:10:21 ◼   ► of basically making it irrelevant.

01:10:23 ◼   ► So it doesn't really bother me

01:10:26 ◼   ► and I doubt this would bother me either.

01:10:27 ◼   ► I think we'll all get used to it.

01:10:28 ◼   ► And I think Apple's goal is ultimately

01:10:31 ◼   ► to reduce that space as much as possible.

01:10:34 ◼   ► - Yeah, I don't think about the notches

01:10:35 ◼   ► on any of my devices.

01:10:37 ◼   ► Because it's not, it doesn't impede me in any way.

01:10:40 ◼   ► And for this, it's like it would only be better because, you know, I don't imagine people

01:10:46 ◼   ► going to start putting content behind there.

01:10:48 ◼   ► But like, you know, like most applications and websites or whatever now they just have

01:10:52 ◼   ► like a blank color up at the top.

01:10:54 ◼   ► And this way the color would just flow around more neatly.

01:10:57 ◼   ► You know, I think it would feel more integrated as part of the overall design.

01:11:01 ◼   ► I would be totally fine with this.

01:11:03 ◼   ► And it is with the idea that like, this is the next step or maybe in another three or

01:11:07 ◼   ► for

01:11:24 ◼   ► just from a quality perspective, but this is how this stuff begins. And I think that

01:11:31 ◼   ► this makes a lot of sense for them to go in this direction. Plus, it will make another

01:11:36 ◼   ► iPhone visibly different. And we all know what happens when iPhones are visibly different.

01:11:42 ◼   ► They sell a lot of them.

01:11:43 ◼   ► I mean, I think external hardware-shaped stuff is more powerful, but I agree. Any change

01:11:50 ◼   ► is good and that we all agree that the ultimate goal here is to have the sensors be invisible,

01:11:56 ◼   ► but they can't do that yet. So here we are.

01:11:59 ◼   ► - DigiTimes is reporting that Apple's headset hardware has passed some important hardware

01:12:05 ◼   ► tests indicating that it could actually be indeed ready for a late 2022 release.

01:12:11 ◼   ► - Well, congratulations headset on passing your exams.

01:12:15 ◼   ► - A star I heard.

01:12:17 ◼   ► - Nice, nice, it's an S tier now.

01:12:20 ◼   ► - Great.

01:12:21 ◼   ► - This has just been a timeline

01:12:25 ◼   ► that feels pretty elastic right now.

01:12:28 ◼   ► I feel like every couple of weeks,

01:12:29 ◼   ► there's something about like, is it this year?

01:12:31 ◼   ► Is it next year?

01:12:32 ◼   ► Is it this year?

01:12:33 ◼   ► Is it next year?

01:12:34 ◼   ► - The beauty of having an unannounced product

01:12:36 ◼   ► that doesn't replace any other product is,

01:12:39 ◼   ► it's ready when it's ready.

01:12:41 ◼   ► And they didn't promise anything.

01:12:44 ◼   ► They literally haven't announced it.

01:12:44 ◼   ► - Not yet they haven't.

01:12:46 ◼   ► So it's, this sounds to me like they're gearing up

01:12:49 ◼   ► to release a product, right?

01:12:50 ◼   ► And it's just a matter of when,

01:12:52 ◼   ► and that is to be determined.

01:12:54 ◼   ► But it sounds like they are,

01:12:56 ◼   ► they're going through all the steps,

01:12:57 ◼   ► so it's clear that there's gonna be a product.

01:12:59 ◼   ► The question is just what the details are,

01:13:01 ◼   ► and when does it happen,

01:13:02 ◼   ► and when does it announce, and when does it ship?

01:13:04 ◼   ► - And this, it puts the potential back on the table

01:13:09 ◼   ► for soft, like SDKs at WWDC.

01:13:13 ◼   ► You know, if all rumors indicate

01:13:15 ◼   ► that this is not a 2022 product,

01:13:18 ◼   ► then the likelihood of them talking about it at WWDC

01:13:21 ◼   ► slims down and it may then do what I think

01:13:23 ◼   ► they will do anyway, but have its own dedicated

01:13:25 ◼   ► software announcement event along with the hardware tease.

01:13:29 ◼   ► But if, you know, I think if there is still

01:13:34 ◼   ► the rumors are pointing to, oh no,

01:13:35 ◼   ► it actually is gonna come out at the end of this year,

01:13:38 ◼   ► then we could be in the situation where they could

01:13:40 ◼   ► actually talk about it at WWDC,

01:13:42 ◼   ► even though I still think they won't.

01:13:44 ◼   ► I think WWDC and the iPhone release

01:13:47 ◼   ► are the best times to talk about it.

01:13:48 ◼   ► And just remember the Apple watch was at an iPhone event

01:13:51 ◼   ► because it's the most watched event.

01:13:54 ◼   ► So in some ways it's the best place

01:13:55 ◼   ► to make a strategic announcement if you're Apple.

01:13:58 ◼   ► And they could do either of those

01:14:00 ◼   ► or have a standalone event.

01:14:01 ◼   ► I think if they're not shipping it soon,

01:14:04 ◼   ► a standalone event makes less sense.

01:14:07 ◼   ► But they've got room to play.

01:14:11 ◼   ► Like I think WWDC would be great, but who are we kidding?

01:14:14 ◼   ► if they announce a new platform in September and say it's going to ship by the end of the

01:14:19 ◼   ► year, the developers will still be paying attention.

01:14:23 ◼   ► - Especially when I think any developer that is somewhat serious thinks they might have

01:14:30 ◼   ► an application that could work for this and/or thinks they might have an idea. I mean, ARKit

01:14:36 ◼   ► exists. You can start doing base level work for what understanding what AR is, you know?

01:14:43 ◼   ► It's not like this is the Apple watch.

01:14:46 ◼   ► It's like, "Well, what can I do?

01:14:47 ◼   ► I can't do anything."

01:14:49 ◼   ► But with this, it's obviously not the same, exactly,

01:14:53 ◼   ► but you can start getting ahead on yourself

01:14:55 ◼   ► by understanding how an AR kit works.

01:14:59 ◼   ► - And they've been doing that for years now,

01:15:00 ◼   ► so a lot of them are already on top of it.

01:15:03 ◼   ► - And Sports Business Journal is reporting,

01:15:07 ◼   ► as many others have before,

01:15:08 ◼   ► but with a little bit more information potentially,

01:15:11 ◼   ► that Apple is still in talks with the NFL

01:15:14 ◼   ► to acquire the streaming rights to Sunday Ticket.

01:15:17 ◼   ► Amazon and Apple are apparently the front runners

01:15:20 ◼   ► for this deal, which would start in 2023.

01:15:23 ◼   ► - Yeah, Amazon has been aggressive on sports stuff.

01:15:26 ◼   ► They got the Thursday Night Football franchise from the NFL.

01:15:29 ◼   ► This is, Sunday Ticket is a premium service

01:15:33 ◼   ► that's been on DirecTV for a very long time,

01:15:36 ◼   ► where you can watch any game,

01:15:38 ◼   ► and not just the games that are airing in your local,

01:15:41 ◼   ► area because NFL games almost all run on Sundays in two-time slots. And if you're a fan of

01:15:48 ◼   ► a team from a far-off city, you can't watch it unless you pay for NFL Sunday Ticket, which

01:15:54 ◼   ► has been limited to people using satellite service, DirecTV. So Apple and Amazon are

01:16:00 ◼   ► both interested in it, which I think is interesting. We know Apple's interested in live sports,

01:16:06 ◼   ► they haven't done a lot.

01:16:07 ◼   ► This would be a very interesting question too about,

01:16:10 ◼   ► I imagine this would be a premium on top of,

01:16:13 ◼   ► or separate from Apple TV+,

01:16:15 ◼   ► which would be also fascinating, right?

01:16:17 ◼   ► A different subscription service potentially.

01:16:20 ◼   ► I used to be a Sunday Ticket subscriber.

01:16:22 ◼   ► It's a fun service that actually gets better

01:16:25 ◼   ► with more interactive features.

01:16:27 ◼   ► And like being able to put everything up in a box

01:16:30 ◼   ► and flip between games or have it auto flip between games.

01:16:34 ◼   ► And there's also the Red Zone Channel,

01:16:36 ◼   ► which is a channel you can tune in

01:16:38 ◼   ► that basically has an announcer who switches you

01:16:41 ◼   ► between games when interesting things are happening.

01:16:43 ◼   ► - That's fun.

01:16:45 ◼   ► - A lot of stuff that they could do there.

01:16:46 ◼   ► And then there are also some rumors

01:16:48 ◼   ► about Apple being involved

01:16:50 ◼   ► in a major league baseball conversation.

01:16:54 ◼   ► Some possibilities there include,

01:17:00 ◼   ► I saw a report that said that it could be

01:17:02 ◼   ► a kind of a whip around service like the NFL Red Zone,

01:17:06 ◼   ► which doesn't really exist right now,

01:17:08 ◼   ► where you basically have a channel that you can tune in

01:17:12 ◼   ► that is taking you between different baseball games

01:17:15 ◼   ► as they're going on.

01:17:16 ◼   ► And that might be a fun kind of product as well.

01:17:19 ◼   ► So Apple has not done any of this yet,

01:17:24 ◼   ► but is definitely in the running

01:17:25 ◼   ► for a bunch of live sports stuff.

01:17:27 ◼   ► - Do you think that there is any possibility

01:17:30 ◼   ► of them doing something like NFL Sunday Ticket

01:17:33 ◼   ► included in Apple TV+ as it currently is,

01:17:38 ◼   ► like as a way to bring more people in?

01:17:40 ◼   ► - It's gonna cost them a fortune to buy the thing,

01:17:43 ◼   ► but that's the question, right?

01:17:44 ◼   ► Is you could build a whole separate business on it

01:17:45 ◼   ► or you could roll it into Apple TV+

01:17:47 ◼   ► and use it as an inducement.

01:17:49 ◼   ► It would be, let me just say,

01:17:50 ◼   ► way cheaper than NFL Sunday Ticket currently goes for,

01:17:54 ◼   ► but they could do it.

01:17:55 ◼   ► - There was nothing from the article that

01:17:58 ◼   ► Disney is also in the running,

01:18:00 ◼   ► but is offering significantly less money than Amazon and Apple,

01:18:03 ◼   ► according to Sports Business Journal, for the Sunday ticket.

01:18:06 ◼   ► All right, saddle up.

01:18:11 ◼   ► That's the end of the round-up.

01:18:12 ◼   ► -All right, we're out of here.

01:18:14 ◼   ► We're going to ride off into the sunset.

01:18:15 ◼   ► -We're going to mosey away now. -Mm-hmm.

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01:20:05 ◼   ► We're going to finish out today, Jason, with some hashtag ask upgrade questions.

01:20:12 ◼   ► I wondered if there was going to be any kind of like, would the lasers turn into like gunfire

01:20:18 ◼   ► or something?

01:20:19 ◼   ► Like I wonder what it was going to be.

01:20:20 ◼   ► How did that horse get in here?

01:20:22 ◼   ► - The laser horse. - That's from the roundup.

01:20:23 ◼   ► - Laser horse.

01:20:24 ◼   ► Oh, did you just shoot at the horse?

01:20:26 ◼   ► Jason, oh my God.

01:20:28 ◼   ► Oh wait, I see the horse got away.

01:20:30 ◼   ► The horse got away. - They laser horses,

01:20:31 ◼   ► don't they? - Don't worry.

01:20:32 ◼   ► The horse got away.

01:20:33 ◼   ► Claude asks, "What do you use to uninstall

01:20:38 ◼   ► non App Store Mac apps?

01:20:41 ◼   ► And why doesn't Apple have a built-in uninstall utility

01:20:44 ◼   ► for applications?"

01:20:45 ◼   ► Do you remember AppSapper, Jason?

01:20:48 ◼   ► Do you remember AppSapper?

01:20:50 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:20:50 ◼   ► - I was thinking about this recently.

01:20:51 ◼   ► What a wonderful piece of software.

01:20:53 ◼   ► - So here's the idea.

01:20:54 ◼   ► The idea is that an app keeps everything in its app package.

01:20:58 ◼   ► So you just delete the app package and it's deleted.

01:21:02 ◼   ► So that's what I do is if I uninstall an app,

01:21:05 ◼   ► what I do is you delete it.

01:21:06 ◼   ► Now I get it that sometimes there are things

01:21:08 ◼   ► that are more complex.

01:21:09 ◼   ► Ideally an app with more complex,

01:21:12 ◼   ► like files running in various places,

01:21:16 ◼   ► you can, you know, you should provide like an uninstaller

01:21:19 ◼   ► or something like that.

01:21:20 ◼   ► But most apps are not that complicated,

01:21:22 ◼   ► even if they're not in the Mac App Store.

01:21:23 ◼   ► Most apps live in their little bundle.

01:21:25 ◼   ► And yeah, they may have like a cache file somewhere

01:21:27 ◼   ► or preferences file somewhere.

01:21:29 ◼   ► Honestly, I would say given the size of storage these days,

01:21:33 ◼   ► don't worry about it.

01:21:34 ◼   ► And also it means that if you delete that app

01:21:36 ◼   ► and want it back later, your preferences will still be there

01:21:39 ◼   ► and so it'll all still work when you re-download it.

01:21:41 ◼   ► So I don't, honestly, I don't sweat it,

01:21:43 ◼   ► but that's why Apple doesn't have

01:21:44 ◼   ► built-in uninstall utility is it does actually it's the it's the trash you

01:21:50 ◼   ► drag the app into the trash that's it I'm getting some suggestions from the

01:21:56 ◼   ► discord Justin Hamilton suggests hazel is an application that when you know

01:22:00 ◼   ► like is an application that when you delete something it'll say hey here's

01:22:03 ◼   ► some stuff that you could also delete which is cool and Emma uses an

01:22:06 ◼   ► application called app cleaner for these reasons yeah because they're sometimes

01:22:10 ◼   ► it just isn't that simple it just is I understand what you're saying Jason but

01:22:13 ◼   ► sometimes there are apps that you do wanna get rid of.

01:22:16 ◼   ► It's not, I don't feel like I need this.

01:22:19 ◼   ► I do what you do.

01:22:20 ◼   ► I just drag it out.

01:22:21 ◼   ► - Yeah, the challenge is,

01:22:23 ◼   ► are the cleaner apps really getting everything?

01:22:25 ◼   ► And mostly what this is an issue for

01:22:28 ◼   ► is something that's like,

01:22:30 ◼   ► it's asked you for your password to install something down

01:22:32 ◼   ► somewhere in the system where it's running a thing

01:22:36 ◼   ► in the background when you start up or something like that.

01:22:38 ◼   ► And ideally that would have an uninstaller.

01:22:42 ◼   ► If these apps can help with that, that's great.

01:22:45 ◼   ► You could also use a utility like Lingon,

01:22:50 ◼   ► which looks at your whole, like,

01:22:53 ◼   ► automatic task set on your Mac,

01:22:59 ◼   ► and you can remove all those startup things

01:23:02 ◼   ► or uncheck them. - What is this?

01:23:03 ◼   ► What is that? - Lingon, L-I-N-G-O-N,

01:23:05 ◼   ► like Lingonberries. - Okay.

01:23:07 ◼   ► - Lingon X, it's by Peter Borg.

01:23:11 ◼   ► And that's actually what I use,

01:23:13 ◼   ► 'cause you can also use it to schedule stuff.

01:23:15 ◼   ► It's like a Cron jobs and system jobs and all of that.

01:23:19 ◼   ► But it's the same thing.

01:23:21 ◼   ► So anyway, there are ways.

01:23:25 ◼   ► And I don't doubt that there are apps

01:23:28 ◼   ► where you wanna do a little more work.

01:23:30 ◼   ► But again, I will just say,

01:23:32 ◼   ► the size of our hard drives

01:23:33 ◼   ► and really the power of our computers,

01:23:36 ◼   ► I think you can get way too obsessed

01:23:39 ◼   ► with cleanup on your computer

01:23:41 ◼   ► when it's not really necessary.

01:23:44 ◼   ► And then in most cases, if you delete the app,

01:23:47 ◼   ► you've uninstalled it.

01:23:49 ◼   ► - Mork wants to know, don't do it again, Jason.

01:23:53 ◼   ► Do you think- - Shot his butt.

01:23:56 ◼   ► - Oh, he did it.

01:23:57 ◼   ► Do you think the touch bar would still be with us?

01:24:00 ◼   ► It kind of is, but you know,

01:24:02 ◼   ► if it was something closer to the stream deck,

01:24:05 ◼   ► a row of dynamic physical keys

01:24:08 ◼   ► that adapted to the context of what you were doing.

01:24:11 ◼   ► - Yeah, so yes, two things here.

01:24:13 ◼   ► One is, yes, the biggest condemnation of the Stream Deck

01:24:17 ◼   ► is not from the people on the outside

01:24:19 ◼   ► who said the Stream Deck is dumb.

01:24:20 ◼   ► It's from inside Apple,

01:24:22 ◼   ► 'cause Apple never made any attempt

01:24:24 ◼   ► to make the Touch Bar better.

01:24:25 ◼   ► They never did, they never did.

01:24:28 ◼   ► Stream Deck, the software's not that great, right?

01:24:32 ◼   ► But Stream Deck lets you assign tasks to the keys

01:24:38 ◼   ► And from that, you can run scripts and stuff like that,

01:24:41 ◼   ► and you can kind of get out into the wider world.

01:24:43 ◼   ► And although you could modify the Touch Bar to do that

01:24:46 ◼   ► with something like Better Touch Tool,

01:24:48 ◼   ► Apple never made, beyond like adding some

01:24:52 ◼   ► finder services shortcuts that you could put in the Touch Bar

01:24:55 ◼   ► like Apple never made any attempt to make the Touch Bar

01:25:00 ◼   ► a general purpose set of assignable macros.

01:25:06 ◼   ► They like, instead they said,

01:25:08 ◼   ► oh, every app is gonna do it,

01:25:09 ◼   ► but the user isn't gonna be involved.

01:25:12 ◼   ► I think it was a huge mistake.

01:25:13 ◼   ► They misconceived it and they never corrected it.

01:25:17 ◼   ► So yes, if you could have done something

01:25:20 ◼   ► like what we can do with the Stream Deck

01:25:22 ◼   ► to have a user completely program the touch bar

01:25:26 ◼   ► and had it be part of macOS

01:25:28 ◼   ► or had it be open to third parties

01:25:31 ◼   ► in an actual usable legal way,

01:25:35 ◼   ► which BetterTouchTool was kind of a hack

01:25:38 ◼   ► and it's amazing what it could do,

01:25:39 ◼   ► but it was super hacky and not as nice

01:25:42 ◼   ► as it should have been, not their fault.

01:25:44 ◼   ► It's the fault of Apple for forcing them to do it that way.

01:25:47 ◼   ► But yeah, Stream Deck shows that something like Touch Bar

01:25:51 ◼   ► could have been better.

01:25:52 ◼   ► And then what Mork also says here is a row of physical keys

01:25:56 ◼   ► that adapted to the context of what you're doing.

01:25:58 ◼   ► That's the other problem with Touch Bar

01:26:00 ◼   ► was you couldn't feel for it because it was a flat surface.

01:26:03 ◼   ► And Stream Deck, those are buttons.

01:26:06 ◼   ► You can feel them, you can use them,

01:26:08 ◼   ► you can navigate by feel,

01:26:09 ◼   ► you can find the bottom left corner

01:26:12 ◼   ► and then count over two buttons and press the button.

01:26:14 ◼   ► Like you can do all of that.

01:26:16 ◼   ► And you had to look at the touch bar.

01:26:19 ◼   ► So I think that would have made the touch bar more useful.

01:26:22 ◼   ► I'm not entirely,

01:26:24 ◼   ► other than the fact that Apple's been burned,

01:26:26 ◼   ► like I would love to see Apple experiment

01:26:28 ◼   ► with the idea of something

01:26:28 ◼   ► where it was more like a dynamic function key,

01:26:31 ◼   ► where it was a function key with a little screen beneath it

01:26:34 ◼   ► and it could change

01:26:37 ◼   ► and it would actually change the look of the key.

01:26:39 ◼   ► I don't think they're gonna do that

01:26:40 ◼   ► because I think that they've been burned

01:26:42 ◼   ► and they've stopped trying to innovate on the keyboard

01:26:44 ◼   ► and maybe we should all just be relieved that they have.

01:26:47 ◼   ► But yes, absolutely.

01:26:49 ◼   ► If something like the Stream Deck can get people excited

01:26:52 ◼   ► with the software that is really not that great,

01:26:55 ◼   ► but it enables a lot,

01:26:56 ◼   ► imagine what would have happened if Apple had allowed,

01:26:59 ◼   ► either built it themselves or allowed third parties

01:27:01 ◼   ► to really get in there and play with the touch bar.

01:27:04 ◼   ► But they didn't, and now it's gone, almost.

01:27:08 ◼   ► - I don't think forever though.

01:27:09 ◼   ► 'Cause I do think that idea, the idea was a good one.

01:27:14 ◼   ► And even if they do end up doing what you've suggested

01:27:16 ◼   ► or like this rumor that we might talk about

01:27:18 ◼   ► in a future episode of just like,

01:27:20 ◼   ► it's all screen baby, the whole thing, you know?

01:27:23 ◼   ► Like at some point I think the idea of this is a area

01:27:28 ◼   ► area of the keyboard which is dynamic and gives you what you need it was a

01:27:33 ◼   ► good idea just not very well executed for various reasons. Yeah I would be a

01:27:40 ◼   ► big fan of replacing the F keys with keys that could be programmable because

01:27:48 ◼   ► the great thing about the stream deck is you have keys and then the labels

01:27:55 ◼   ► will change based on your context. And I think if Apple did something like that, and what's funny

01:28:01 ◼   ► about it is that Apple already sort of has taken a step in this direction, right? Because Apple has

01:28:07 ◼   ► stolen the F keys and instead made them hardware control keys, and then you have to press the globe

01:28:12 ◼   ► or the function key in order to get back to the traditional F keys. And then they've started to

01:28:17 ◼   ► label them. And one of the nice things about a programmable set of F keys is that you could show,

01:28:23 ◼   ► this is volume up, this is volume down, and yet in a different context it could show something

01:28:28 ◼   ► different. That would be really interesting, but again it would require Apple to try and

01:28:33 ◼   ► reinvent the function row again, and I wonder if they're going to leave that for a while because

01:28:41 ◼   ► they had this whole touch bar thing and it was a flop, and so are they going to go back there and

01:28:48 ◼   ► and take another run at it or not, I don't know.

01:28:50 ◼   ► - Not H.G. asks, "In which tab in photos

01:28:55 ◼   ► "do you usually view your photos?"

01:28:57 ◼   ► Are you in the library?

01:28:59 ◼   ► Are you in the album?

01:29:00 ◼   ► Or is it For You is another one, right?

01:29:02 ◼   ► Is that?

01:29:03 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:29:04 ◼   ► - For me, I've stuck to like what I know,

01:29:07 ◼   ► what it used to be, like what it always was.

01:29:09 ◼   ► Albums, Recents.

01:29:11 ◼   ► That's where I like to view my images.

01:29:13 ◼   ► Because sometimes if I look in the other tabs,

01:29:16 ◼   ► it can sort things chronologically, which isn't always necessarily the way that I want

01:29:20 ◼   ► it, right? Like, as in, like, actual date chronologically. Like, imagine that I've saved

01:29:24 ◼   ► something from some—like, someone sent me, right? Then it might actually—if I go in

01:29:29 ◼   ► the other tab, it wouldn't be my most recent image. It could actually be three weeks ago

01:29:32 ◼   ► or whatever. So I like albums, recents. That's where I view all my images is what I'm used

01:29:38 ◼   ► to, is what I like.

01:29:39 ◼   ► It's perfectly reasonable. I just use the library. Your way is probably better, but

01:29:43 ◼   ► that's not what I do. I generally I just use library. It's not about better. It's

01:29:47 ◼   ► just what I'm used to. I don't think it's better necessarily, you know. No, I think

01:29:51 ◼   ► it might be. I think for what the reasons you said of not having something that

01:29:54 ◼   ► sorts further up and it's it's you you just want to get the thing you just

01:29:59 ◼   ► added and it's like why is it not right here and the answer is well it's a

01:30:02 ◼   ► little higher up. I don't know. I just use the library straight up. I will give

01:30:06 ◼   ► you a bit of long-term follow-up that all of the problems I had with the

01:30:10 ◼   ► images sharing thing remain. I still have images that go back months and

01:30:17 ◼   ► months and months that Adina sent me when she was at home and I was at the

01:30:20 ◼   ► studio. I have images here I'm looking at, like pictures that were sent

01:30:25 ◼   ► to me back from June 2020 that I haven't saved to my library and they've still

01:30:29 ◼   ► got that speech bubble on them. That feature just never really worked for me

01:30:34 ◼   ► and I've left it on but I still don't think it's what I want.

01:30:38 ◼   ► Lastly, Franken asks, on the Mac, what quick settings take up real estate in your menu

01:30:45 ◼   ► bar and which ones do you keep in control center?

01:30:47 ◼   ► So as a refresher in control center, you can drag things out of control center and put

01:30:52 ◼   ► them in the menu bar.

01:30:54 ◼   ► For me, focus and the sound, I dragged them out and left them out.

01:31:00 ◼   ► Everything else I've kept in there.

01:31:01 ◼   ► I experimented a while, I put Bluetooth up there or whatever, but ultimately control

01:31:06 ◼   ► Center was perfectly fine. What about you? Have there been any that have found their

01:31:11 ◼   ► way out of Control Center? On my iMac, nothing. Okay. On my MacBook Air, Wi-Fi, and battery

01:31:21 ◼   ► are both up there. Oh yeah, battery, battery, yeah I've moved that out on my laptop. I'm

01:31:29 ◼   ► looking on my iMac right now, so obviously I don't have battery on my iMac. I actually

01:31:36 ◼   ► - I do because I have a UPS.

01:31:37 ◼   ► - Oh, and it shows him the control center for battery?

01:31:41 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:31:42 ◼   ► - Oh, that's cool.

01:31:43 ◼   ► - There's a little USB thing that comes out of most UPSs

01:31:44 ◼   ► and you plug them in and it allows it to communicate

01:31:46 ◼   ► with the Mac and tell it,

01:31:48 ◼   ► it can tell it how much battery it's got

01:31:49 ◼   ► and the Mac can use that setting.

01:31:51 ◼   ► If you haven't done this,

01:31:53 ◼   ► if you have a UPS and a desktop Mac,

01:31:55 ◼   ► it will show up if you attach its little USB thing

01:31:59 ◼   ► and it allows the Mac to do things

01:32:01 ◼   ► like when the power is out,

01:32:03 ◼   ► when does the Mac shut down?

01:32:05 ◼   ► And so you can say like keep running until the UPS battery

01:32:10 ◼   ► is down at 10% or whatever, and then auto shut down.

01:32:13 ◼   ► So it'll actually work with the UPS,

01:32:14 ◼   ► be aware of how much power is still left in the UPS battery.

01:32:18 ◼   ► So if I click on control center right now on my iMac,

01:32:21 ◼   ► I have a little battery indicator that says 100%.

01:32:24 ◼   ► - Hmm.

01:32:25 ◼   ► - Yeah, it's kind of fun.

01:32:26 ◼   ► But anyway, I don't have any of those.

01:32:27 ◼   ► I've got a lot of menu bar items up there,

01:32:29 ◼   ► but they're the ones that I've chosen to be there

01:32:31 ◼   ► and they're not the standard Apple ones.

01:32:34 ◼   ► And then, but on my Mac, on my MacBook Air, it makes sense to like have quick

01:32:38 ◼   ► access to wifi and battery.

01:32:39 ◼   ► If you would like to send in a question of your own, you could just send out a

01:32:42 ◼   ► tweet with the hashtag #askupgrade.

01:32:44 ◼   ► There you go.

01:32:45 ◼   ► It's not Snell Talk, it's #askupgrade.

01:32:46 ◼   ► Uh, or you can use question mark ask upgrade in the relay FM members discord.

01:32:51 ◼   ► We'll be back next week.

01:32:54 ◼   ► Who knows what day, maybe by the time you're hearing this, you'll know.

01:32:58 ◼   ► I mean, honestly, if you're listening to this episode, like late Tuesday or

01:33:03 ◼   ► Wednesday and they have not announced an event, right, then it's, you know, we're back on

01:33:08 ◼   ► Monday.

01:33:09 ◼   ► Yes, a lot of listeners of Upgrade will have gotten to this point and they'll either not

01:33:14 ◼   ► think this is an unusual draft at all or they'll be very, they'll be laughing at us basically.

01:33:20 ◼   ► So be it.

01:33:21 ◼   ► So be it.

01:33:22 ◼   ► But the draft is locked in, as they say.

01:33:25 ◼   ► Nobody says that, but they could say that.

01:33:27 ◼   ► Oh, there was more.

01:33:29 ◼   ► Apparently lasers lock the draft as well.

01:33:31 ◼   ► Yes, sometimes.

01:33:33 ◼   ► And the draft is now solidified until it's cast, concrete has been poured on it.

01:33:39 ◼   ► The die is cast.

01:33:41 ◼   ► And the concrete has been poured on it until we smash it open.

01:33:44 ◼   ► And who knows, we could smash it open next week or it might be smashed open in three

01:33:48 ◼   ► weeks or just sent out to sea.

01:33:51 ◼   ► I don't know what this metaphor is that I'm building right now.

01:33:54 ◼   ► I don't know what things are cast and then put in concrete and then sent out to sea.

01:33:57 ◼   ► But I don't know.

01:33:58 ◼   ► You know, this is just stuff that I'm talking about.

01:34:01 ◼   ► If you would like to find us online, you can go to sixcolors.com for Jason.

01:34:05 ◼   ► You can go to @jsnell, J-S-N-E-L-L, that's also Jason.

01:34:09 ◼   ► I'm @imyke.

01:34:11 ◼   ► I would like to thank our sponsors of this week's episode, that is Memberful, Zocdoc,

01:34:16 ◼   ► Ooni and Smile.

01:34:17 ◼   ► I would like to thank you all for listening, and especially to our Upgrade Plus supporters

01:34:23 ◼   ► who get longer ad-free episodes.

01:34:26 ◼   ► Thank you for supporting the show.

01:34:27 ◼   ► We'll be back next time.

01:34:29 ◼   ► Until then, say goodbye to Jason Snow.

01:34:31 ◼   ► Goodbye Mark Hurley.