Upgrade

00:00:00 ◼   ► [Music]

00:00:12 ◼   ► From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 415. Today's show is brought to you by

00:00:18 ◼   ► Squarespace, Source Graph and Capital One. My name is Myke Hurley, it is the Summer of Fun!

00:00:24 ◼   ► Summer of Fun!

00:00:26 ◼   ► And I'm joined by Jason Snow. Hi, Jason Snow.

00:00:28 ◼   ► - Or fun. Hello, Myke Hurley. Happy summer of fun and happy upgrade to you.

00:00:32 ◼   ► - And to you, my friend, and to you. I have a #snowtalk question.

00:00:36 ◼   ► To start off this week's episode, in case you're new around here,

00:00:39 ◼   ► Snow Talk is to get us started in the show and avoid small talk.

00:00:44 ◼   ► And this week's question was submitted by listener Mac, who says,

00:00:48 ◼   ► "If the summer is the summer of fun, what are the other seasons?"

00:00:52 ◼   ► - The other, like, upgrade seasons?

00:00:57 ◼   ► - Sure.

00:00:59 ◼   ► - Okay, we can start with winter 'cause that's easy,

00:01:02 ◼   ► 'cause we've already defined it.

00:01:05 ◼   ► It's the winter of no content.

00:01:07 ◼   ► - Yeah. (laughs)

00:01:09 ◼   ► The winter of no content,

00:01:11 ◼   ► 'cause there's no content in the winter.

00:01:12 ◼   ► So like, you know, we think the summer's bad, right?

00:01:15 ◼   ► We came up with the summer of fun,

00:01:17 ◼   ► because we like to do fun things in the summer,

00:01:19 ◼   ► because usually it's quiet for stories and news

00:01:22 ◼   ► in the summer for us to talk about.

00:01:23 ◼   ► So we have to be a little bit more creative.

00:01:26 ◼   ► But truly the problem is winter.

00:01:28 ◼   ► (laughs)

00:01:28 ◼   ► It's like over time it's kind of shifted,

00:01:31 ◼   ► but now here we are in the summer.

00:01:32 ◼   ► But it's like those winter months,

00:01:33 ◼   ► so like those first three months of the year,

00:01:35 ◼   ► whoa, that's where the--

00:01:36 ◼   ► - Well, the summer of fun doesn't exist

00:01:39 ◼   ► because there's nothing going on.

00:01:40 ◼   ► It exists because there's not a lot going on

00:01:43 ◼   ► 'cause it's that cruise until the fall,

00:01:44 ◼   ► the beta's been announced and then we're kind of cruising.

00:01:47 ◼   ► But also it exists because you and I,

00:01:49 ◼   ► and many people travel in the summer.

00:01:51 ◼   ► And so we ended up having those scenarios

00:01:53 ◼   ► where we had to have weird episodes that were out of time,

00:01:56 ◼   ► you know, we're banking it a week in advance or that.

00:01:58 ◼   ► And that led us down this path to sort of making a theme

00:02:02 ◼   ► out of it because the summer got really weird some years

00:02:06 ◼   ► where, you know, there was one where like you were gone

00:02:09 ◼   ► and then I was gone.

00:02:10 ◼   ► So like I did the,

00:02:11 ◼   ► I did that thing that was like live

00:02:13 ◼   ► from that automation event.

00:02:15 ◼   ► And then the next time, and that was a delayed one.

00:02:18 ◼   ► And then I came back and I think you were gone.

00:02:21 ◼   ► There was a whole, like, that's why we do Summer of Fun.

00:02:23 ◼   ► So winter, yes, it's true.

00:02:24 ◼   ► Winter is, uh, is rougher.

00:02:27 ◼   ► And so the winter of discontent is the winter of no content.

00:02:30 ◼   ► I came up with two, two potential ideas.

00:02:33 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:02:33 ◼   ► No, I'm not saying we do this because we don't need a brand for every season.

00:02:38 ◼   ► No, we don't.

00:02:38 ◼   ► I was thinking fall of plenty because the fall was the best time of the year, right?

00:02:44 ◼   ► This is just stuff happening left, right.

00:02:46 ◼   ► And center.

00:02:47 ◼   ► and then springing towards the summer,

00:02:50 ◼   ► because in spring, all we're doing is waiting for WWDC

00:02:54 ◼   ► at that point.

00:02:55 ◼   ► - Yeah, that's fair.

00:02:57 ◼   ► Sure, sure.

00:02:57 ◼   ► But I agree with you that we don't actually need

00:03:00 ◼   ► to brand the other seasons, but just for Mac purposes,

00:03:02 ◼   ► we'll go with that.

00:03:03 ◼   ► - It's like, you know, in the sense of like,

00:03:05 ◼   ► we have always had in our mind this joke of like,

00:03:07 ◼   ► the winter of no content.

00:03:09 ◼   ► - Yes, that one we got.

00:03:11 ◼   ► The other ones haven't happened yet.

00:03:13 ◼   ► Fall of iPhone, but fall of really everything.

00:03:16 ◼   ► It's everything now. This is the thing, it's not just the iPhone anymore, right?

00:03:19 ◼   ► It's just literally everything.

00:03:21 ◼   ► If you would like to help us open an episode of Upgrade and be involved in the show,

00:03:26 ◼   ► just send out a tweet with the hashtag #SNELtalk with your question,

00:03:29 ◼   ► or use question mark #SNELtalk in the Relay FM members Discord.

00:03:33 ◼   ► I have some follow out, Jason Snell.

00:03:36 ◼   ► If you are listening to this, kind of at the start of the week, Monday or Tuesday,

00:03:40 ◼   ► you have a very short time left to get your own Upgrade Summer of Fun t-shirt.

00:03:48 ◼   ► This is going to be cutting off, I think on the 13th for most people, but you've got to find out

00:03:55 ◼   ► on the page. It has a localized When the End of the Sail is. But if you're on the page,

00:04:00 ◼   ► buy the shirt. Go to upgradeyourwardrobe.com. Don't wait any longer because if you wait much

00:04:06 ◼   ► longer you won't get one. Wednesday July 13th 2022 at 5 p.m. Pacific time

00:04:14 ◼   ► it's over. It's over which is also just to make things more complicated I will

00:04:22 ◼   ► give you what it's like for me Thursday the 14th of July 2022 at 1 a.m. British

00:04:31 ◼   ► summertime. So Myke can you when you edit the show can you like put in like

00:04:35 ◼   ► called JavaScript or something in the podcast

00:04:37 ◼   ► that localizes that.

00:04:38 ◼   ► So whatever we say, it'll just come out in the time that...

00:04:42 ◼   ► Okay, good.

00:04:43 ◼   ► - That's easy to do.

00:04:44 ◼   ► - Right?

00:04:44 ◼   ► That's like the little JavaScript, little PHP.

00:04:46 ◼   ► - Dynamic time insertion.

00:04:48 ◼   ► - It's dangerous when I was listening

00:04:50 ◼   ► to a Reconcilable Differences episode over the weekend.

00:04:52 ◼   ► And it's dangerous when I do that,

00:04:54 ◼   ► because then I try to turn this show

00:04:56 ◼   ► into the nonsense of Reconcilable Difference.

00:04:59 ◼   ► Anyway, yeah.

00:05:00 ◼   ► - Oh, you've been...

00:05:01 ◼   ► - I feel like that, yeah,

00:05:03 ◼   ► I was driving us off the rails there.

00:05:04 ◼   ► Yeah, stick some JavaScript in there and localize that time to UTC, to Unix epoch time.

00:05:13 ◼   ► And then your podcast player of choice will then emulate our voices saying the proper

00:05:20 ◼   ► time.

00:05:21 ◼   ► I would just like to state for the record that you said that listening to Reconcileable

00:05:24 ◼   ► Differences has made you silly.

00:05:26 ◼   ► We spent 45 minutes doing Buzzfeed quizzes last week.

00:05:29 ◼   ► You were fine before listening to Reconcileable Differences.

00:05:33 ◼   ► - No, I think what you're saying is I was already kind of

00:05:37 ◼   ► messed up.

00:05:39 ◼   ► - You had this, you've got this on your own.

00:05:41 ◼   ► You don't need any inspiration from anyone else.

00:05:45 ◼   ► - Anyway, if you are a Unix computer,

00:05:47 ◼   ► buy a t-shirt for your computer frame.

00:05:50 ◼   ► Buy 16577-56800 in Unix epoch.

00:05:55 ◼   ► - Perfect, thank you so much.

00:06:00 ◼   ► - Helpful.

00:06:01 ◼   ► - If you enjoy this show and want more of it,

00:06:03 ◼   ► you should subscribe to Upgrade Plus because you will get bonus content every week and no ads

00:06:07 ◼   ► and special for relay FM members. We finally did it.

00:06:12 ◼   ► This year's RPG adventure crossover with the Cortex podcast is now available

00:06:18 ◼   ► for relay FM members in the crossover feed.

00:06:20 ◼   ► This is available for Upgrade Plus, but this is also available if you are a member of any show

00:06:25 ◼   ► here in relay FM, you get access to the crossover feed, which features

00:06:28 ◼   ► tons of bonus content from relay FM hosts.

00:06:31 ◼   ► We did it again. We continued on our story from last year.

00:06:34 ◼   ► You also get access to the whole history of that feed, so you can go back and listen to our previous RPG adventures if you want to.

00:06:40 ◼   ► And we had Tony come in, Tony Sindelar from the Total Party Kill podcast on the incomparable.

00:06:45 ◼   ► And Tony was our DM again as myself and Jason and Gray.

00:06:50 ◼   ► We went on a supply chain adventure.

00:06:53 ◼   ► We did, yeah. These are our characters from last time where we're in space.

00:06:59 ◼   ► I was gonna say futuristic, but I think the idea is that it's literally we are plucked from earth

00:07:03 ◼   ► and deposited in a wild space scenario. And in this case, a very simple need for the bar

00:07:11 ◼   ► that we were deposited in to replenish its supplies of like chicken fingers and fries and stuff

00:07:18 ◼   ► from the food, but the delivery hasn't arrived. So we just got to go get the stuff. And it goes

00:07:24 ◼   ► from there, I guess I would say. It goes from there. - I really love this one. So like,

00:07:28 ◼   ► I've always enjoyed these. Last year we kind of switched it up. So we were doing the text

00:07:31 ◼   ► adventures where Jason was at the end, but we wanted Jason to play with us. So we brought

00:07:37 ◼   ► in Tony, who's an experienced Dungeon Master, to craft an RPG. And Tony adapted a previous

00:07:41 ◼   ► story. But my understanding is this one, he basically created this story himself. And

00:07:47 ◼   ► I think it's fantastic. I think he did such a good job. We had so much fun. This was the

00:07:52 ◼   ► most fun I've had editing one of these in years. He did such a good job and it was really

00:07:59 ◼   ► great. It took a little longer, my Covid recovery slowed down the edit, but we got there and

00:08:05 ◼   ► I'm really happy with how it came out and I'm happy that we took the extra time on it

00:08:08 ◼   ► because it's really great. So you can get this for yourself by going to getupgradeplus.com

00:08:13 ◼   ► and you can sign up and you'll get access to Upgrade Plus and the crossover feed where

00:08:17 ◼   ► you'll find this RPG adventure.

00:08:20 ◼   ► But wait there's more. Jason Snell has joined MacBreakWeekly on Twitter.

00:08:24 ◼   ► It's true. It's true. I'm expanding what I said on Twitter is my goal is to eventually

00:08:28 ◼   ► you know have a podcast every day of the week and twice on Sundays or at least sometimes

00:08:33 ◼   ► it seems like that. Yeah so our friend-

00:08:36 ◼   ► So we say goodbye to Jason today.

00:08:37 ◼   ► Bye.

00:08:38 ◼   ► Bye Jason.

00:08:39 ◼   ► No. No. No. Our good friend Renee Ritchie who was at iMore and has been doing his own

00:08:49 ◼   ► and YouTube channel for a while.

00:08:51 ◼   ► He has apparently a new job that hasn't been announced yet.

00:08:55 ◼   ► People are thinking that it'll be with Apple.

00:08:57 ◼   ► I kind of think not, especially since he,

00:09:01 ◼   ► I think has said that he'll come back from time to time.

00:09:04 ◼   ► People who go to Apple don't come back from time to time.

00:09:06 ◼   ► They just go and they're gone.

00:09:07 ◼   ► - Well, they do, but under an official auspice.

00:09:10 ◼   ► - Yeah, I doubt that will happen.

00:09:12 ◼   ► Anyway, so we'll see.

00:09:13 ◼   ► I don't know, it's Renee's announcement to make

00:09:15 ◼   ► and I honestly, he hasn't said and I don't know.

00:09:17 ◼   ► but it required him to leave MacBreak Weekly

00:09:20 ◼   ► on the Twit network.

00:09:20 ◼   ► And I have been a guest on their shows,

00:09:23 ◼   ► especially the main Twit show, on and off for quite a while.

00:09:26 ◼   ► And I know those people and our friend,

00:09:29 ◼   ► Micah works up there.

00:09:31 ◼   ► And of course, Leo Laporte runs the whole thing

00:09:33 ◼   ► with his wife, Lisa.

00:09:34 ◼   ► And they're also local, they're in the North Bay.

00:09:37 ◼   ► They're not that far away from me.

00:09:39 ◼   ► And so they offered me Renee's slot essentially,

00:09:42 ◼   ► and I'm just kind of honored to be offered it.

00:09:45 ◼   ► And so, yes, you can see me leaning back,

00:09:48 ◼   ► not being the co-host or producer or anything,

00:09:52 ◼   ► but just being one of the panel,

00:09:54 ◼   ► just kind of fun, weekly on Tuesdays at Twit.

00:09:59 ◼   ► So I'm looking forward to giving that a start tomorrow.

00:10:04 ◼   ► - One of my very first podcasts that I would listen to

00:10:06 ◼   ► is My Break Weekly.

00:10:07 ◼   ► - Yeah, it's, people are asking,

00:10:12 ◼   ► first off, I don't think there's actually a lot of overlap.

00:10:14 ◼   ► They have a, every time I go on Twitter,

00:10:15 ◼   ► I'm surprised at how different their audience is

00:10:18 ◼   ► from our audience.

00:10:19 ◼   ► So that's interesting.

00:10:21 ◼   ► And like I said, I, the difference, somebody asked,

00:10:25 ◼   ► what's the difference between Upgrade and MacBreak Weekly?

00:10:27 ◼   ► Well, I mean, MacBreak Weekly,

00:10:30 ◼   ► the producers make the list of topics.

00:10:33 ◼   ► Leo runs the show and I will be one of three, you know,

00:10:37 ◼   ► panelists talking to Leo.

00:10:40 ◼   ► Upgrade is a collaborative process

00:10:41 ◼   ► where Myke and I make the show.

00:10:43 ◼   ► we talk about what we want.

00:10:45 ◼   ► This is like, this is my show and Myke's show

00:10:49 ◼   ► and Mac Break Weekly's Leo show that I will be on.

00:10:51 ◼   ► So it's a totally different thing.

00:10:54 ◼   ► The vibe is different.

00:10:55 ◼   ► It's all different.

00:10:55 ◼   ► So if you want to give it a try or if you listen to it,

00:10:58 ◼   ► you know, I'll be over there,

00:10:59 ◼   ► but it's not going to be the same as here.

00:11:02 ◼   ► And that's good.

00:11:03 ◼   ► I'll be providing my, you know,

00:11:05 ◼   ► whatever it is unique Jason perspective to whatever

00:11:08 ◼   ► they're talking about.

00:11:10 ◼   ► Sure.

00:11:11 ◼   ► Are we going to talk about, like, inserting JavaScript for a time code on a podcast over

00:11:15 ◼   ► on a Twit?

00:11:16 ◼   ► Probably not.

00:11:17 ◼   ► Probably not.

00:11:18 ◼   ► Who knows?

00:11:19 ◼   ► It's my guess.

00:11:20 ◼   ► Yeah, who knows?

00:11:21 ◼   ► It's a podcast.

00:11:22 ◼   ► Anything can happen.

00:11:23 ◼   ► By the way, though, if you do love tech panel shows, we have a great one here at Relay FM.

00:11:28 ◼   ► It's called Clockwise.

00:11:29 ◼   ► Jason was one of the original hosts of Clockwise.

00:11:32 ◼   ► It's now hosted by Dan Warren and Michael Sargent.

00:11:36 ◼   ► Michael is also on a bunch of Twit shows, too.

00:11:38 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:11:39 ◼   ► now which I think is nice. The most recent episode of Clockwise featured Flo who's on

00:11:45 ◼   ► material and Matthew Bischoff they were the guests they were talking about stuff like

00:11:49 ◼   ► online privacy, target advertising that kind of thing. Clockwise is never longer than 30

00:11:54 ◼   ► minutes so it's an easy one to add to your queue so go check it out.

00:11:57 ◼   ► Yeah check it out and I'm gonna be doing if you want even more of me again.

00:12:00 ◼   ► Oh my god.

00:12:01 ◼   ► I'm gonna I'm gonna be doing some fill-

00:12:03 ◼   ► Summer of Jason!

00:12:04 ◼   ► - Yeah, I'm gonna be doing some fill in hosting

00:12:07 ◼   ► as a favorite to Dan and Micah, I think starting next week.

00:12:10 ◼   ► So I'll be on a clockwise a lot this summer,

00:12:14 ◼   ► which is great because I demanded it

00:12:16 ◼   ► when I knew they needed to fill in

00:12:17 ◼   ► because it is near and dear to my heart.

00:12:20 ◼   ► Dan and I did create that show

00:12:21 ◼   ► and worked really hard on that format.

00:12:23 ◼   ► And I'm really proud that it continues to be a great show

00:12:26 ◼   ► because that, you know, it's just such a fun, unique format

00:12:30 ◼   ► and less than 30 minutes and you know it's all it's worth it it's worth it if you want

00:12:36 ◼   ► to kind of a sampler of different voices and different topics and not have another two

00:12:42 ◼   ► hour podcast dropping in your in your podcast app definitely check it out.

00:12:47 ◼   ► -Clockwise is the beneficiary of a unique feature in the Relay FM CMS which is the ability

00:12:53 ◼   ► to adjust who the hosts are on specific episodes as opposed to the entire show so if you go

00:13:00 ◼   ► back and look at the older episodes, Jason's there instead of Micah.

00:13:04 ◼   ► Yeah, that's true.

00:13:06 ◼   ► I have some follow up on the iPad and Universal Control.

00:13:09 ◼   ► So I've got a few little things on this.

00:13:12 ◼   ► So I think I mentioned this in the episode but I also had some people suggest to me like

00:13:16 ◼   ► using shortcuts to turn on low power mode as a way to lock the iPad.

00:13:20 ◼   ► But it's also for your status board.

00:13:23 ◼   ► For my status board.

00:13:24 ◼   ► For your iPad status board.

00:13:25 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:13:26 ◼   ► it does low power mode doesn't lock an iPad if universal control is enabled. So maybe

00:13:35 ◼   ► this would work after I leave the studio but it's not as reliable as I would want it to

00:13:40 ◼   ► be. I'm going to test it out more but I what I was hoping was somebody was going to write

00:13:45 ◼   ► in and say oh this is really easy way and shortcuts to turn like to turn an iPad on

00:13:50 ◼   ► and off the screen but there isn't. It's always going to be a hack. But to be honest I actually

00:13:55 ◼   ► think it's mostly okay. At the end of every day I unplug my MacBook Pro from the monitor

00:14:02 ◼   ► to put in my bag and so as part of my kind of like shutting down the studio procedure

00:14:06 ◼   ► now I just lock my iPad. It's not actually that much more complicated. But the thing

00:14:12 ◼   ► that I still might want to do though is try and set up a smart switch for the power situation

00:14:19 ◼   ► because I'm plugging and unplugging that iPad a lot and it's annoying me but I also don't

00:14:23 ◼   ► want to leave it continuously plugged in, like drawing power always. So I think I might

00:14:30 ◼   ► get a smart switch and just like kind of wire it up and just have it turn off in the evenings

00:14:35 ◼   ► and turn back on in the mornings. I think I might have that. I think I might set that

00:14:38 ◼   ► up anyway.

00:14:39 ◼   ► I don't know if it's if it's asleep. I don't think it's going to matter because it's only

00:14:42 ◼   ► going to draw power when it needs to and it will let its battery kind of drop down and

00:14:45 ◼   ► and yeah, I know I'm weird with this kind of stuff. All right, I'm weird with this stuff.

00:14:51 ◼   ► I leave my iPad plugged in overnight all the time.

00:14:53 ◼   ► - No, I do that.

00:14:54 ◼   ► Like I charge my phone or whatever,

00:14:56 ◼   ► but this would be like,

00:14:57 ◼   ► it would be plugged in 24/7, 365 days a year.

00:15:02 ◼   ► - Well, that's, yeah.

00:15:03 ◼   ► - And I don't need it to do that.

00:15:05 ◼   ► Like if I was away for a week,

00:15:08 ◼   ► I don't need that iPad to remain consistently charged.

00:15:11 ◼   ► So that just feels like a waste of electricity.

00:15:15 ◼   ► So I'm thinking I might just get,

00:15:17 ◼   ► I might get another one of those smarts,

00:15:19 ◼   ► like power strips that you can, I've spoke about these before.

00:15:22 ◼   ► I don't remember the name, but I'll put them in the show notes. Uh,

00:15:25 ◼   ► James Thompson, uh,

00:15:26 ◼   ► turned me onto this company where like they have a smart switch that you can

00:15:31 ◼   ► individually automate each of the switches in the smart

00:15:36 ◼   ► switch, like a, like a power strip so that you can have,

00:15:40 ◼   ► you can like break it up and it can be like four individually addressable

00:15:43 ◼   ► automatable, uh, sockets.

00:15:45 ◼   ► And so I might just get one of those and plug it into that. Uh,

00:15:48 ◼   ► I think I'm going to do that actually once I knew.

00:15:51 ◼   ► I knew, see here's the thing,

00:15:52 ◼   ► I knew if I stalled for long enough there,

00:15:55 ◼   ► James would tell me in the Discord

00:15:56 ◼   ► the name of the company.

00:15:57 ◼   ► - Real time.

00:15:58 ◼   ► - It's called Meross, M-E-R-O-S-S, Meross.

00:16:02 ◼   ► They make these products

00:16:03 ◼   ► and we've been using them at home for a long time

00:16:05 ◼   ► and I really liked them.

00:16:06 ◼   ► So I think we're going to get another one of these

00:16:08 ◼   ► 'cause it does like native home kit.

00:16:10 ◼   ► Like you don't need to use an app and I like that, right?

00:16:14 ◼   ► Like I don't need to use the Meross app or Meross bridge.

00:16:16 ◼   ► it just works with HomeKit.

00:16:18 ◼   ► So I'm going to get myself one of these and set it up.

00:16:21 ◼   ► Uh, I will say over the past week, I have had better reliability of universal

00:16:26 ◼   ► control. It's been reconnecting more frequently, but not all the time.

00:16:29 ◼   ► And sometimes just disconnects whenever it wants to.

00:16:32 ◼   ► Uh, so, but many upgradians wrote in to tell me that they have a flawless

00:16:37 ◼   ► experience, which leads me to believe that it is the beta, like me running

00:16:40 ◼   ► the iPadOS beta is making it odd, which I did expect, right?

00:16:43 ◼   ► But, uh, I was happy to get that feedback.

00:16:46 ◼   ► I also had a bunch of upgrade-ins write in to tell me about the Logitech Logitech Options

00:16:52 ◼   ► Plus app from Logitech.

00:16:54 ◼   ► It's a beta that they've got running right now specifically to address issues with Universal

00:17:00 ◼   ► Control and it's odd.

00:17:02 ◼   ► You have to have Logitech's Logitech Options app already installed and then you install

00:17:07 ◼   ► this which I think is kind of like a plug-in for that app but it makes the scrolling work

00:17:13 ◼   ► with my Logitech mouse in Universal Control.

00:17:16 ◼   ► So it's doing something to just get all of that together.

00:17:19 ◼   ► I don't know how it's doing it, but I'm happy to have it because I now can scroll whenever

00:17:24 ◼   ► I want to.

00:17:27 ◼   ► And finally the MacBook Air is available for sale.

00:17:31 ◼   ► It went on sale at the end of the week.

00:17:34 ◼   ► As expected availability got very thin very quickly.

00:17:39 ◼   ► Basically what it seems like almost immediately and now is that if you want anything other

00:17:43 ◼   ► than one of the base configurations, you want to, if you change anything, you're into August

00:17:48 ◼   ► before one of these things will come to you. You ordered one, right?

00:17:51 ◼   ► I did. It's the same thing. Yeah, I, uh, let's see, for the record, midnight, 16 gigs of

00:17:58 ◼   ► RAM, 512 SSD, and first week of August. Yeah. That's what it kind of seems like. I think

00:18:06 ◼   ► they made a lot of standard configurations, right? Which they probably know that they

00:18:10 ◼   ► They sell a lot of base model configurations.

00:18:12 ◼   ► So they made a lot of those, so there's more availability of those.

00:18:16 ◼   ► And then everything else, I'm not even sure this is a traditional sort of like, "Oh, whoop,

00:18:20 ◼   ► just like that.

00:18:21 ◼   ► They're sold out."

00:18:22 ◼   ► I feel like it was more they had a...

00:18:26 ◼   ► I don't think things necessarily slipped much to get to August or late July.

00:18:29 ◼   ► I think it was more like you could either get a stock one this week, or you could wait

00:18:35 ◼   ► for one of those configured order models because those were going to take a little bit longer.

00:18:39 ◼   ► longer. Yeah. But yeah, so definitely if you want to get your hands on one like Friday,

00:18:47 ◼   ► stock configurations at an Apple store maybe. Yeah, I mean that might be the thing, right?

00:18:52 ◼   ► As you said, they could sometimes even Apple have in store some basic upgrades like you

00:18:59 ◼   ► might be able to get one with a little bit more RAM from a store but that's on the usual

00:19:04 ◼   ► times and right now it doesn't seem like stock is a usual thing, right? It's all it's all

00:19:09 ◼   ► weird right now.

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00:21:02 ◼   ► to get 10% off your first purchase and show you support for the show. Our thanks to Squarespace

00:21:06 ◼   ► for their support of Upgrade and Relay FM. So we're up to Beta 3 now and I think that

00:21:14 ◼   ► we've both had some changes on our devices in the sense of what we're running the betas

00:21:20 ◼   ► on. So I think it might be time for a bit of a check-in. Where have you got betas going

00:21:25 ◼   ► right now?

00:21:26 ◼   ► >> A little beta update.

00:21:27 ◼   ► >> Beta update.

00:21:28 ◼   ► - I took the plunge and installed the Beta 3 of iPadOS

00:21:33 ◼   ► on my personal iPad Pro,

00:21:38 ◼   ► which, you know, it's a little scary.

00:21:44 ◼   ► There's an annoying bug.

00:21:49 ◼   ► I use my iPad so much and there's a bug.

00:21:54 ◼   ► I mean, it's a Beta, there are bugs,

00:21:57 ◼   ► but the one that really annoys me

00:21:58 ◼   ► is there's a software keyboard bug where a lot,

00:22:01 ◼   ► frequently apps basically lose track

00:22:04 ◼   ► of where the top of the software keyboard is.

00:22:06 ◼   ► And so the text entry field is below the top

00:22:09 ◼   ► of the software keyboard, so you can't see it.

00:22:11 ◼   ► - Yeah. - And the only solution

00:22:12 ◼   ► is to quit the app and relaunch it,

00:22:15 ◼   ► and then you can see it, and then it gets bad again

00:22:18 ◼   ► and you have to do it again.

00:22:19 ◼   ► And that's just a thing that's in there and it's annoying,

00:22:22 ◼   ► but I can live with it.

00:22:23 ◼   ► I did this all right before I went away for a long weekend.

00:22:27 ◼   ► And so I haven't spent time with it in a smart keyboard

00:22:31 ◼   ► or a magic keyboard or in monitor external display mode.

00:22:36 ◼   ► So I can't talk about the stage manager

00:22:42 ◼   ► from that perspective, right?

00:22:44 ◼   ► I'm not convinced stage manager is the right approach

00:22:48 ◼   ► when you're just holding an iPad in your hand, right?

00:22:51 ◼   ► Like I'm not sure in most cases,

00:22:53 ◼   ► at least the way I use my iPad,

00:22:55 ◼   ► that I need Stage Manager when I'm just holding my iPad

00:22:58 ◼   ► in my hands, using my fingers to touch it.

00:23:01 ◼   ► Like, eh, I don't know, not entirely convinced.

00:23:04 ◼   ► Maybe there are scenarios, but a lot less so

00:23:07 ◼   ► than if I'm in a keyboard-based scenario,

00:23:10 ◼   ► keyboard and pointer-based scenario.

00:23:11 ◼   ► So I've got to, I mostly used it even over the weekend

00:23:14 ◼   ► with Stage Manager turned off, but I am looking forward to,

00:23:17 ◼   ► now that it's on my, you know, my, my iPad Pro,

00:23:21 ◼   ► spending some time with it in the Magic Keyboard

00:23:23 ◼   ► or attached to the studio display.

00:23:26 ◼   ► - So in developer beta three,

00:23:28 ◼   ► there was some new stuff that came to stage manager.

00:23:31 ◼   ► And I was playing with some of that

00:23:34 ◼   ► 'cause I have it on my iPad air, right?

00:23:36 ◼   ► The one that I'm using for my status board.

00:23:38 ◼   ► So the multitasking menu, that little pill thing,

00:23:42 ◼   ► it got some new, it's kind of presented differently now.

00:23:46 ◼   ► It used to just be like three little icons.

00:23:48 ◼   ► Now they have text labels, which I think is a good move.

00:23:50 ◼   ► And there's also a close button,

00:23:52 ◼   ► the fourth close button now. So you can minimize and you can close. Realistically I feel like

00:23:58 ◼   ► on iPad OS there isn't a difference. Like I can't really work out what the difference

00:24:03 ◼   ► is, but I guess maybe it returns to the little tray on the left if you minimize. But happily,

00:24:09 ◼   ► as I know you wanted, Command+W now closes Windows. Which is fantastic. They have a better

00:24:17 ◼   ► presentation for multiple windows, in fact there's one that works, if you had like a

00:24:22 ◼   ► one to select between multiple windows you'd go into that like I don't know like kind of

00:24:26 ◼   ► like an expose kind of mode. It didn't work on previous betas, they fixed that. Full screen

00:24:33 ◼   ► apps and iPhone apps now work better in stage manager. So previously if you had an app that

00:24:38 ◼   ► kind of couldn't be resized, you couldn't put any other windows in that kind of space

00:24:43 ◼   ► with it in that stage with it you can do that now it kind of just they overlap

00:24:48 ◼   ► and you can run iPhone apps in there you know you can't resize them but you can

00:24:53 ◼   ► have a bunch of iPhone apps on screen so you finally iPhone apps are useful on

00:24:58 ◼   ► the iPad because you could have say an iPhone app and a iPad app in the same

00:25:04 ◼   ► stage where up until now if you wanted to use an iPhone app it was just this

00:25:08 ◼   ► this huge disgusting thing on the screen.

00:25:11 ◼   ► So that's really cool I think.

00:25:13 ◼   ► - Yeah, I used this with some iPhone apps over the weekend.

00:25:17 ◼   ► And what I found is that I couldn't consistently see

00:25:22 ◼   ► the window control thing, which is kind of necessary.

00:25:27 ◼   ► So, you know, being able to grab it and minimize it

00:25:32 ◼   ► or close it or whatever, I had some iPhone apps

00:25:34 ◼   ► where it was sort of like just a floating thing, right?

00:25:38 ◼   ► With no controls on it at all.

00:25:40 ◼   ► But this is the idea.

00:25:42 ◼   ► I wonder if this is like literally part

00:25:44 ◼   ► of the Mark Gurman report from whatever two years ago

00:25:47 ◼   ► that eventually, you know, you'd be able to roll.

00:25:50 ◼   ► I guess I was on the Mac, right?

00:25:51 ◼   ► You'd be able to run iPhone apps on the Mac.

00:25:53 ◼   ► This seems a little like that though, where it's like,

00:25:56 ◼   ► yeah, we have a context now where anything can be

00:25:59 ◼   ► on your iPad.

00:26:00 ◼   ► Why would we not let those iPhone apps run

00:26:02 ◼   ► in the little iPhone shaped window

00:26:06 ◼   ► with other stuff going on.

00:26:07 ◼   ► In fact, last year I did a mock-up,

00:26:09 ◼   ► I think it was last year, maybe it was the year before,

00:26:11 ◼   ► of what an iMac on an, sorry,

00:26:13 ◼   ► an iPad on an external display would look like,

00:26:17 ◼   ► 5K external display.

00:26:18 ◼   ► And that was one of the things I did was like,

00:26:20 ◼   ► let's take an iPhone app and have it be like

00:26:22 ◼   ► just a little window on the screen and look great.

00:26:25 ◼   ► And it looked exactly like this, which is, yeah.

00:26:28 ◼   ► I mean, ideally you'd like to be able to resize them

00:26:31 ◼   ► and that requires it to be more iPad-y,

00:26:33 ◼   ► but it's nice to not have to open an iPad.

00:26:36 ◼   ► It's the worst to open an iPhone app on the iPad.

00:26:39 ◼   ► Some of them don't even do rotation.

00:26:41 ◼   ► So if you're holding it horizontal,

00:26:43 ◼   ► you launch the iPhone app and it's vertical

00:26:45 ◼   ► and you're like, oh, I guess I'm gonna turn my iPad now.

00:26:48 ◼   ► And even if you just wanna get out of it,

00:26:50 ◼   ► you can't flip up from the bottom

00:26:53 ◼   ► once it's in that orientation.

00:26:55 ◼   ► 'Cause once it's in vertical,

00:26:56 ◼   ► you have to turn it and flip up from the bottom

00:26:59 ◼   ► or flip up from the side.

00:27:01 ◼   ► it's weird. Anyway, so this is this is progress.

00:27:05 ◼   ► I still wish that tapping the blank space behind the applications would take

00:27:11 ◼   ► me to the home screen. I know that you can do this on the Mac, right? If you

00:27:15 ◼   ► click it shows you the desktop. I wished it would do this. They just added in Beta

00:27:20 ◼   ► 3 on Mac OS with Stage Manager the ability to just show the desktop. Like

00:27:25 ◼   ► your actual desktop. All the time. It just stays back there. It doesn't hide the

00:27:29 ◼   ► desktop and I didn't realize how disconcerting it was for my desktop to

00:27:32 ◼   ► be gone. I flipped that feature on I was like oh and then you can just like drag

00:27:37 ◼   ► things open for the desktop and it's not it doesn't get weird about it so I think

00:27:40 ◼   ► they're they're making some progress on the Mac front too but I agree with you

00:27:44 ◼   ► it's a little weird that you can't just use that as a shortcut. Especially when

00:27:48 ◼   ► they insist on there being that kind of space there right they insist on showing

00:27:54 ◼   ► me this blurred image. So if it's always there, make it useful. I think they will do this

00:28:01 ◼   ► because the Mac does it, but I think it's just like a case of priorities. I will say,

00:28:06 ◼   ► I think personally, we're up to Beta 3 now, developer Beta 3. It's not on any non-M1 iPad.

00:28:14 ◼   ► I think that ship has sailed.

00:28:15 ◼   ► Yeah, I think they, you know, the people who are upset about it are upset about it, but...

00:28:22 ◼   ► It's kind of blown over mostly now and you know I'm sure people were annoyed

00:28:26 ◼   ► about it but like the news cycles moved on right they have not released a

00:28:30 ◼   ► statement nor if they changed it so I think this is it and I mean I'm

00:28:36 ◼   ► personally I don't have a problem with it I just want because stage managers

00:28:40 ◼   ► continuing to get better right and so I don't want stage manager as a feature to

00:28:46 ◼   ► have a bad launch because they have to like kind of put it in handcuffs so it

00:28:51 ◼   ► can run on different hardware. That's where I come from anyway. I have the iOS beta on

00:28:56 ◼   ► my iPhone and I've been playing around with that a bunch. I put beta 2 on but now I'm

00:29:02 ◼   ► running beta 3 as well. I've been really happy with the lock screen stuff. I think I've been

00:29:09 ◼   ► able to get my lock screen looking really good and really stylish I think. You know

00:29:14 ◼   ► it changing the font. I'm using what do they call it? It's not SF, the New York font. Is

00:29:22 ◼   ► that what it's called? They have that like they have a serif font. Apple has a serif

00:29:28 ◼   ► font. So it's not San Francisco. I think it's called New York. Am I? Have I lost my mind?

00:29:36 ◼   ► They have a new font. Yeah, New York, right? It's called New York. Yeah. So I'm using the,

00:29:40 ◼   ► I think it's the New York font, which is like it's a little bit more like, I don't know,

00:29:45 ◼   ► cool in a way.

00:29:46 ◼   ► Like so I've been using that as the time.

00:29:48 ◼   ► I think that's the time option is what it looks like anyway.

00:29:50 ◼   ► And you know, I have a new image, which I think looks nicer, like with the whole layout

00:29:55 ◼   ► that I've got.

00:29:56 ◼   ► And I'm running a few widgets.

00:29:57 ◼   ► I've got like a calendar widget, an activity widget, and a widget of a beta app that I'm

00:30:02 ◼   ► testing.

00:30:04 ◼   ► I really like it.

00:30:05 ◼   ► I also think just in general, the way that they present options is so good. I think you

00:30:12 ◼   ► can tell that they learn from watchOS and they kind of push that forward. When you go

00:30:18 ◼   ► into that screen and you want to add a new lock screen, because of design, they have

00:30:23 ◼   ► so many options. They have all these fun ones that they've made. They take images of yours

00:30:28 ◼   ► and show you how good it could look. I think they've done a really good job with that whole

00:30:32 ◼   ► kind of like setup screen. And just the widgets in general, the lock screen widgets, I'm really

00:30:39 ◼   ► excited for more and more of these to come into it when it's released because I think

00:30:44 ◼   ► it's going to be pretty great. Like at the moment, oh, I also have the calendar and I

00:30:51 ◼   ► have weather. The calendar is the one that's on the top. Like, you know, you got that one

00:30:54 ◼   ► above the time. It's just text, which is like perfect for a calendar, right? Like what's

00:30:58 ◼   ► my next meeting.

00:30:59 ◼   ► There were a couple of other features that I've enjoyed.

00:31:06 ◼   ► I have actually come to really like the way the notifications are laid out now, kind of

00:31:10 ◼   ► coming down from the bottom.

00:31:11 ◼   ► I feel like it takes up way less screen real estate at most of the time, which I actually

00:31:16 ◼   ► think is better, like show me fewer notifications until I want to see more of them.

00:31:22 ◼   ► I've been trying out that dictation feature within Messages mostly, you know how now their

00:31:27 ◼   ► whole thing is you can just dictate and type at the same time. You can say something and

00:31:32 ◼   ► it works really well. I would say my experience of punctuation, the automatic punctuation

00:31:38 ◼   ► hasn't been that great. There's been times where I've expected it to put punctuation

00:31:43 ◼   ► in and it hasn't been, but now it's so much easier to manually edit without needing to

00:31:49 ◼   ► leave the dictation mode. So you can just leave the dictation going, go in and fix something,

00:31:55 ◼   ► go back and then just start speaking again.

00:31:56 ◼   ► So I think the fact that it's no longer like a modal thing,

00:32:00 ◼   ► you're either dictating or not, I

00:32:03 ◼   ► could see myself using it more because I

00:32:05 ◼   ► think that they've done a really good job of it.

00:32:08 ◼   ► Messages editing is awesome.

00:32:11 ◼   ► And the new way to set up focus modes--

00:32:13 ◼   ► I created a new focus mode because it's so easy

00:32:16 ◼   ► to do it now.

00:32:17 ◼   ► They've really refined that process

00:32:19 ◼   ► and have made it much better.

00:32:21 ◼   ► And I think I've made focus mode more useful now

00:32:24 ◼   ► that you can, instead of saying,

00:32:26 ◼   ► only let these things bug me,

00:32:28 ◼   ► just like everything can bug me except these things.

00:32:31 ◼   ► I think that makes way more sense for like a work focus mode

00:32:34 ◼   ► and like a personal focus mode.

00:32:36 ◼   ► 'Cause in personal focus modes, most people are just like,

00:32:39 ◼   ► I just don't wanna hear from Slack over the weekend.

00:32:41 ◼   ► And so just having that as an option of like,

00:32:45 ◼   ► everything can remind me except Slack

00:32:47 ◼   ► and say like Outlook and my calendar

00:32:49 ◼   ► 'cause I'm in weekend mode.

00:32:50 ◼   ► So I think that's nice.

00:32:53 ◼   ► - That's great.

00:32:54 ◼   ► I'm looking forward to playing with it more.

00:32:56 ◼   ► And like you said, widgets,

00:33:00 ◼   ► like third-party widgets to add more

00:33:02 ◼   ► 'cause the Apple ones are nice, but they're pretty generic.

00:33:05 ◼   ► I'm looking forward to doing that.

00:33:06 ◼   ► - It was the same with iOS 14, right?

00:33:07 ◼   ► It was like, we could get an idea

00:33:09 ◼   ► for what it might look like using Apples,

00:33:11 ◼   ► but really you want the widgets for the apps you're using.

00:33:15 ◼   ► - Right.

00:33:16 ◼   ► And I think that your point is really good

00:33:20 ◼   ► that the Apple Watch was a good kind of test bed

00:33:24 ◼   ► for this kind of stuff and that they learned

00:33:26 ◼   ► and having much more screen space on the iPhone

00:33:30 ◼   ► to give people all of those different options

00:33:32 ◼   ► and sort of, what a nice way to walk people through features

00:33:37 ◼   ► by providing them with variations that use the features,

00:33:42 ◼   ► right, 'cause then you can just do it yourself

00:33:45 ◼   ► if you want to, but Apple's gonna provide you

00:33:47 ◼   ► with this big palette of options.

00:33:49 ◼   ► They choose featured photos that you might want to use.

00:33:53 ◼   ► Like they're doing a lot to try and not just steer you,

00:33:56 ◼   ► but also teach you sort of like,

00:34:00 ◼   ► rather than saying,

00:34:01 ◼   ► "Here are a bunch of settings, good luck."

00:34:02 ◼   ► They're like,

00:34:03 ◼   ► "Here's all these different ways these settings can be used

00:34:06 ◼   ► or customize it yourself for good luck."

00:34:07 ◼   ► Which is, I think it's a better approach.

00:34:09 ◼   ► - And if you want to see like an example of, you know,

00:34:15 ◼   ► like we talk about like Apple whimsy design and stuff,

00:34:18 ◼   ► They have a selection of weather and astronomy lock screens and you can kind of choose them

00:34:27 ◼   ► and you can scroll through them.

00:34:30 ◼   ► You can set up one of the earth, one of the earth detail where it zooms in.

00:34:35 ◼   ► When you swipe through them they do a completely unnecessary but really beautiful animation

00:34:43 ◼   ► of zooming in and out.

00:34:45 ◼   ► That is stunning and is really I think only important for if you're in that mode of choosing

00:34:51 ◼   ► between which one you want and it's super great.

00:34:56 ◼   ► This is a fun screen to play around in because they change it up.

00:34:59 ◼   ► I just got recommended to me.

00:35:02 ◼   ► This is like I saw this going around on Twitter a lot.

00:35:04 ◼   ► The clown fish wallpaper that they created for the original iPhone.

00:35:10 ◼   ► Sometimes it pops up as like, "Hey, do you want this one?"

00:35:13 ◼   ► So I just added it as one of my options because you can have multiple lock screens and you

00:35:17 ◼   ► can choose between them and choose like, do you want a different like home screen to go

00:35:22 ◼   ► with that lock screen.

00:35:23 ◼   ► It's really cool.

00:35:24 ◼   ► I love this feature.

00:35:25 ◼   ► I think this is going to be really nice.

00:35:26 ◼   ► Well, I did put Ventura on, I actually used the review unit 13 inch M2 MacBook Pro that

00:35:34 ◼   ► Apple sent me because I wrote that review.

00:35:37 ◼   ► So it had to be sacrificed for the cause.

00:35:41 ◼   ► So I put Ventura beta on there.

00:35:42 ◼   ► I spent some time with continuity camera

00:35:44 ◼   ► 'cause really stage manager and continuity camera

00:35:47 ◼   ► are kind of the two big Mac features I would argue

00:35:49 ◼   ► that are kind of uniquely Mac.

00:35:53 ◼   ► I know that there's stage manager and iPad,

00:35:55 ◼   ► but stage manager and iPad and Mac are, they're different.

00:35:59 ◼   ► The way that they work is different.

00:36:01 ◼   ► And continuity camera is technically kind of an iOS feature

00:36:06 ◼   ► because most of the intelligence is happening on your iPhone,

00:36:10 ◼   ► but it's a Mac feature, right?

00:36:11 ◼   ► It's for the Mac, that's the point.

00:36:13 ◼   ► I'm really impressed with Continuity Camera.

00:36:15 ◼   ► It is working really well.

00:36:17 ◼   ► That standard iPhone camera,

00:36:20 ◼   ► which is remember what Apple calls the wide camera,

00:36:23 ◼   ► but it's the standard camera that you use.

00:36:26 ◼   ► It looks really good even in bad light.

00:36:28 ◼   ► I was sitting in my bedroom with the light off

00:36:32 ◼   ► in the late afternoon and the light from outside

00:36:35 ◼   ► is coming in a little bit.

00:36:36 ◼   ► And it looked so much better on that standard iPhone camera

00:36:41 ◼   ► than it did on either the webcam that was on the 720p webcam

00:36:46 ◼   ► on the 13 inch M2 MacBook Pro, don't get me started,

00:36:49 ◼   ► or actually the view in center stage,

00:36:52 ◼   ► because remember center stage is a feature

00:36:55 ◼   ► of continuity camera, but it uses the ultra wide,

00:36:58 ◼   ► the 12 megapixel ultra wide on the iPhone,

00:37:00 ◼   ► not the standard because it wants to be able to have room

00:37:03 ◼   ► to move, pan and zoom and basically move around.

00:37:06 ◼   ► And you will not be surprised to know

00:37:08 ◼   ► when you take a 12 megapixel ultra wide image and then crop it in order to do panning and zooming

00:37:14 ◼   ► in bad light situations, it gets kind of grainy and doesn't look that great. I would say it still

00:37:20 ◼   ► looks better than the 720p webcam. Not a high bar, but it still looks better than that, but not a lot

00:37:26 ◼   ► better. So this is an interesting, just a note about center stage in general, right? Which is,

00:37:33 ◼   ► if you want the best image quality and you want especially performance in low light situations,

00:37:40 ◼   ► not using center stage is a good idea because center stage is just going to be it's kind of

00:37:46 ◼   ► an inferior camera and then it's a crop of and a distortion and crop of an inferior camera and it's

00:37:53 ◼   ► always going to look inferior compared to in this case the standard iPhone camera which is beautiful.

00:37:59 ◼   ► It really is.

00:38:00 ◼   ► It looks great.

00:38:01 ◼   ► In continuity camera mode, you can choose which camera you want?

00:38:06 ◼   ► Is that right?

00:38:07 ◼   ► So the way continuity camera works is if you are not using centre stage, it uses the wide

00:38:13 ◼   ► camera.

00:38:14 ◼   ► The good camera.

00:38:15 ◼   ► Which of course is something that like the Studio Display can't do.

00:38:19 ◼   ► It won't crop but it's still got a not great camera, right?

00:38:22 ◼   ► Well yeah, it's still got that same camera although at least it's, I mean, and it's not

00:38:27 ◼   ► not cropped, it's just cropped wider and it doesn't move, right?

00:38:32 ◼   ► Because the ultra wide is super wide and an uncropped view of the camera in the studio

00:38:36 ◼   ► display would be super weird because just like if you take your iPhone and go into the

00:38:41 ◼   ► ultra wide and then zoom out, it gets all strangely distorted because it's a wide angle

00:38:46 ◼   ► lens, right?

00:38:47 ◼   ► It's an ultra wide lens.

00:38:48 ◼   ► So on continuity camera, they are making the decision that unless you want center stage,

00:38:54 ◼   ► they're gonna use the regular camera

00:38:57 ◼   ► 'cause it's way better.

00:38:58 ◼   ► And so they'll do that.

00:39:00 ◼   ► And then, yeah, you can add that studio lighting effect

00:39:04 ◼   ► if you want, which, you know, it helps.

00:39:06 ◼   ► It finds your face in the foreground and lightens it up

00:39:09 ◼   ► and darkens the background.

00:39:11 ◼   ► And you can use the blurring stuff.

00:39:13 ◼   ► And again, it's portrait mode, basically.

00:39:15 ◼   ► It's using all this tech that had already had built,

00:39:17 ◼   ► Apple had already built for other products.

00:39:20 ◼   ► And that all looks fine.

00:39:22 ◼   ► So you can do that.

00:39:23 ◼   ► the new document, your desk view thing that they do

00:39:28 ◼   ► has to use the ultra wide,

00:39:31 ◼   ► because it's trying to see the edges,

00:39:34 ◼   ► the peripheral edges of what it can see.

00:39:37 ◼   ► And the ultra wide can see kind of everything.

00:39:39 ◼   ► And so, the image quality isn't great,

00:39:43 ◼   ► but that's sort of not the point of the desk view thing.

00:39:45 ◼   ► It's more just to get a quick and dirty view

00:39:49 ◼   ► down onto your desktop in front of your laptop

00:39:52 ◼   ► or beneath your display.

00:39:53 ◼   ► and it does do that.

00:39:54 ◼   ► But the actual standard iPhone camera

00:40:00 ◼   ► looks exactly as you might expect.

00:40:03 ◼   ► And if you've ever used something like Camo,

00:40:05 ◼   ► you've seen this, like the iPhone camera is really good.

00:40:07 ◼   ► Using it as a webcam is really good.

00:40:09 ◼   ► The difference here is that you don't have to launch an app

00:40:14 ◼   ► and launch an app on the Mac and an app on your iPhone

00:40:18 ◼   ► in order to do it.

00:40:19 ◼   ► It just does it, it just happens.

00:40:21 ◼   ► And in fact, if you place the iPhone,

00:40:24 ◼   ► like mount it on your screen or behind your screen

00:40:27 ◼   ► and it's horizontal to the desk and it's still,

00:40:32 ◼   ► macOS Ventura will just auto switch to it.

00:40:36 ◼   ► 'Cause it knows it's using the iPhone sensors

00:40:39 ◼   ► to know that the iPhone is now in a state

00:40:42 ◼   ► where it's probably mounted as a webcam

00:40:44 ◼   ► and then it'll just flip over.

00:40:46 ◼   ► You can use it without mounting it as a webcam.

00:40:48 ◼   ► - I still don't know what I think about that.

00:40:50 ◼   ► I still can't get my head around that,

00:40:53 ◼   ► like the default swapping to the, I don't know.

00:40:58 ◼   ► I'm still, I feel like I need to see that myself.

00:41:01 ◼   ► - There's an API and you don't have to use it, right?

00:41:04 ◼   ► You can select your camera.

00:41:05 ◼   ► It's like having a default audio output or input.

00:41:09 ◼   ► It's kind of like that, but yeah,

00:41:10 ◼   ► we'll have to see how that goes.

00:41:12 ◼   ► Because I mean, obviously if you lay it,

00:41:14 ◼   ► if you put it upright on a desk,

00:41:17 ◼   ► it will also switch over and it's not pointing at you.

00:41:19 ◼   ► if you try to emulate those same conditions.

00:41:21 ◼   ► But I think their thought is,

00:41:23 ◼   ► when are you gonna have your iPhone horizontal

00:41:25 ◼   ► and not moving around?

00:41:27 ◼   ► And if you hold it in your hand, it's not the same.

00:41:29 ◼   ► It knows that it's being held by a human.

00:41:32 ◼   ► It's actually using those sensors

00:41:34 ◼   ► to really detect that it's been mounted.

00:41:37 ◼   ► So more to come on this, obviously,

00:41:39 ◼   ► and I think that the story changes

00:41:41 ◼   ► when you put an iPhone in a mount,

00:41:43 ◼   ► like that Belkin mount that was sort of pre-announced

00:41:46 ◼   ► on a laptop and then, you know,

00:41:49 ◼   ► what about a mount for a bigger display?

00:41:53 ◼   ► There's more to come here, but it does,

00:41:57 ◼   ► unsurprisingly, it looks really good on that standard camera.

00:42:00 ◼   ► And also, I would say unsurprisingly,

00:42:02 ◼   ► when you go into center stage mode,

00:42:04 ◼   ► it looks like center stage.

00:42:05 ◼   ► And that means it's gonna be a worse performance

00:42:10 ◼   ► in low light, especially,

00:42:12 ◼   ► but you get the cool panning and scanning thing,

00:42:14 ◼   ► which is great if that matters to you.

00:42:17 ◼   ► - Did you say if you did this wired or wireless?

00:42:20 ◼   ► - I did this wireless, but it does work either way.

00:42:25 ◼   ► - But it looks good wireless?

00:42:27 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:42:28 ◼   ► - Cool, 'cause that's what I would wanna do.

00:42:29 ◼   ► If I was gonna use this feature,

00:42:31 ◼   ► I would want it to be wireless,

00:42:32 ◼   ► otherwise I'd just get a webcam.

00:42:34 ◼   ► - I think the real issue is if you use it

00:42:37 ◼   ► for a long amount of time,

00:42:38 ◼   ► you probably want it wired mostly just to power the iPhone

00:42:41 ◼   ► so that it doesn't drain the battery on it.

00:42:43 ◼   ► an hour of video is gonna kill the battery, you know?

00:42:46 ◼   ► - Well, I don't know,

00:42:48 ◼   ► because the screen's not gonna be on, right?

00:42:50 ◼   ► So maybe not. - Good point, good point.

00:42:52 ◼   ► - Camo, the screen is on.

00:42:54 ◼   ► On this, I don't think the screen is on.

00:42:56 ◼   ► So I don't know, we'll have to test it out and see.

00:43:00 ◼   ► But yeah, you can do either.

00:43:01 ◼   ► And I think that's great, because I think the idea here is,

00:43:04 ◼   ► oh, I'm gonna be on a meeting, I'm gonna pop this thing on,

00:43:07 ◼   ► and now I've got this great webcam,

00:43:09 ◼   ► and then when the meeting's over,

00:43:10 ◼   ► I'll just take it right back off.

00:43:11 ◼   ► I don't want to be like, like, dripping a cable down like, you know what I mean?

00:43:16 ◼   ► Like every time, if I was going to do that, I would just put a webcam on the

00:43:21 ◼   ► top here and just do it once.

00:43:22 ◼   ► Um, basically I'm intrigued about this feature because the studio displays

00:43:29 ◼   ► camera fails me so poorly.

00:43:31 ◼   ► Like it's, as I said before, I mentioned it many times, it's not the quality for

00:43:35 ◼   ► me, it's the fact that it cannot handle overhead lighting, uh, at the refresh

00:43:41 ◼   ► rate of the overhead lighting that I have here, even though all of my Macs can.

00:43:45 ◼   ► All my Macs can adjust to it, but the Studio Display can't.

00:43:48 ◼   ► And so I frequently, I'm sitting at my desk and then I need to go on a video call so I

00:43:53 ◼   ► have to come and start up everything in the podcast gear set that I have here.

00:43:58 ◼   ► Because the iMacs will handle it, but the Studio Display won't.

00:44:02 ◼   ► So I love the idea of being able to just get a little thing, pop my iPhone in, and then

00:44:07 ◼   ► and use it, you know, rather than needing to then go

00:44:10 ◼   ► and like change all my gear around and stuff.

00:44:12 ◼   ► - I wanted to mention the settings app just because,

00:44:16 ◼   ► I mean, it's beta, I hope it changes, I hope it changes.

00:44:19 ◼   ► It's not good.

00:44:20 ◼   ► Like they said, oh, let's make a settings app like iOS,

00:44:23 ◼   ► but it's not as a Mac settings app,

00:44:25 ◼   ► as a replacement for system preferences,

00:44:26 ◼   ► which is old and needed to be replaced, right?

00:44:29 ◼   ► But it's just, it's very bad.

00:44:32 ◼   ► I hope they fix it, I hope they make it better.

00:44:34 ◼   ► There's a lot of like clicking to get through

00:44:37 ◼   ► to another layer and having to go hierarchically down,

00:44:40 ◼   ► which is not even ideal on iOS, honestly,

00:44:43 ◼   ► but on the Mac, when you've got,

00:44:44 ◼   ► especially when I'm on a big Mac display,

00:44:49 ◼   ► but even on a laptop, these are widescreen laptops,

00:44:52 ◼   ► and the app is sort of square still or tall,

00:44:57 ◼   ► instead of taking advantage of the width

00:44:59 ◼   ► to lay things out that way.

00:45:01 ◼   ► I don't know what they're thinking.

00:45:03 ◼   ► there are so many frustrations

00:45:06 ◼   ► with the current system preferences thing

00:45:08 ◼   ► in terms of like approving apps

00:45:10 ◼   ► for like this app would like full disk access.

00:45:14 ◼   ► And the settings app, like those settings are like

00:45:18 ◼   ► a hierarchical two levels down and in

00:45:21 ◼   ► and then approve and then out.

00:45:23 ◼   ► Like it's not, it seems, it's just a, it's a mess.

00:45:28 ◼   ► So I hope there's no way this is made in like

00:45:31 ◼   ► catalyst or Swift UI, right?

00:45:33 ◼   ► - Like is the settings out, they surely have not done that.

00:45:35 ◼   ► - I don't know, maybe they have.

00:45:37 ◼   ► Maybe it is a Swift UI or something.

00:45:39 ◼   ► I think, like I get the idea that we want it

00:45:42 ◼   ► to be reminiscent of iOS, but the Mac has more

00:45:45 ◼   ► fiddly settings even than iOS does.

00:45:47 ◼   ► And if you're going to, like, look,

00:45:50 ◼   ► I know different people use different settings

00:45:52 ◼   ► in different ways. - Wow, Zach in the Discord

00:45:54 ◼   ► is saying it is Swift UI.

00:45:55 ◼   ► - Swift UI, I mean, it feels like it's Swift UI.

00:45:58 ◼   ► - But that's bold of everything to do next, you know?

00:46:02 ◼   ► - Yeah. - Wow, okay.

00:46:04 ◼   ► - So it feels, well, it's the, it's the, it's, you know,

00:46:06 ◼   ► if you're building a new app, like system settings,

00:46:08 ◼   ► then you should build it in Swift UI, right?

00:46:10 ◼   ► So it's a mess and, and it should,

00:46:14 ◼   ► I feel like it's not taking advantage of things

00:46:15 ◼   ► about the Mac and I get you want it to be of a kind with iOS,

00:46:19 ◼   ► but the Mac is different.

00:46:20 ◼   ► And what I was saying is different people use it differently

00:46:23 ◼   ► and I get that, but like, especially in beta time,

00:46:27 ◼   ► I'm restarting into a different startup disk all the time.

00:46:32 ◼   ► Like startup disk isn't at the top anymore.

00:46:35 ◼   ► You can search for it, or you have to go into,

00:46:37 ◼   ► I think general and then click startup disk

00:46:40 ◼   ► and then select your startup disk and restart.

00:46:43 ◼   ► It's like, why is it like that?

00:46:45 ◼   ► Why have you buried a lot of, for some people, common,

00:46:50 ◼   ► and it's not like you can favorite them

00:46:52 ◼   ► or bring them out to the top or star them in some way.

00:46:55 ◼   ► Right, like you can't, it's, so anyway, we got the summer,

00:47:01 ◼   ► maybe they will do more.

00:47:03 ◼   ► But my initial feedback on the settings app on the Mac

00:47:07 ◼   ► is that they have managed to do something

00:47:09 ◼   ► I didn't think they could do,

00:47:11 ◼   ► which is replace the old outdated,

00:47:16 ◼   ► desperately needed to be replaced system preferences app

00:47:20 ◼   ► and made it worse.

00:47:22 ◼   ► I don't know how that's even possible,

00:47:24 ◼   ► but as of beta three, that's where we are,

00:47:28 ◼   ► is that it's a complete...

00:47:30 ◼   ► I'm not one of those people who says,

00:47:33 ◼   ► go back to the old way and old system preferences is bad.

00:47:36 ◼   ► It's bad, but like it's better than this.

00:47:39 ◼   ► It's better than this.

00:47:41 ◼   ► This is terrible.

00:47:42 ◼   ► So good luck.

00:47:45 ◼   ► I mean, I'm crossing my fingers for every Mac user

00:47:49 ◼   ► that the people inside Apple

00:47:50 ◼   ► who are working on the settings app understand

00:47:53 ◼   ► that they had to ship it because it was beta time.

00:47:55 ◼   ► And they know that there are lots of things wrong with it.

00:47:57 ◼   ► And they are going to try to fix them all

00:47:59 ◼   ► by the end of the summer.

00:48:00 ◼   ► I hope that's the case,

00:48:02 ◼   ► because if this thing ships anything resembling

00:48:04 ◼   ► what it is now, it's an embarrassment.

00:48:06 ◼   ► So there it is.

00:48:08 ◼   ► There's my, again, beta, beta.

00:48:10 ◼   ► I get that it's beta,

00:48:12 ◼   ► but this is also the time where people,

00:48:13 ◼   ► like with Safari last year,

00:48:15 ◼   ► this is the time where people have to raise their hand

00:48:16 ◼   ► and say, "You didn't do it right."

00:48:19 ◼   ► And they didn't do this right.

00:48:20 ◼   ► It's a mess.

00:48:21 ◼   ► And it's not because it's different.

00:48:23 ◼   ► It's because it's bad,

00:48:25 ◼   ► because it doesn't do what a settings app

00:48:29 ◼   ► is supposed to do, which is make it easy for users

00:48:33 ◼   ► to change their settings instead of, I mean, yeah,

00:48:37 ◼   ► at least you can search for startup disk.

00:48:39 ◼   ► At least you can search for it if you need to.

00:48:41 ◼   ► - That doesn't sound good.

00:48:44 ◼   ► At least the Mac sometimes usually takes

00:48:47 ◼   ► a little bit longer, right?

00:48:48 ◼   ► They give it a little bit more time.

00:48:50 ◼   ► So there might be more time to work on it.

00:48:52 ◼   ► - And this is a Mac only feature essentially.

00:48:54 ◼   ► So there's probably a group that's focused on it

00:48:57 ◼   ► because they're not trying to build something

00:48:59 ◼   ► that goes across all the OSs.

00:49:01 ◼   ► They're building this thing for the Mac.

00:49:03 ◼   ► And when I criticize stuff, I always hear like,

00:49:07 ◼   ► oh, but then, you know, I know there are people

00:49:09 ◼   ► who are working on this who are working very hard.

00:49:11 ◼   ► And in fact, I would bet you that there are people

00:49:14 ◼   ► who are working on this app who know it isn't very good,

00:49:16 ◼   ► but they've been told to do it and it's their job.

00:49:19 ◼   ► But whoever makes the decisions

00:49:21 ◼   ► about the settings app on the Mac needs to,

00:49:25 ◼   ► if they don't know already, they need to be told

00:49:29 ◼   ► it's not getting it done.

00:49:31 ◼   ► - Yeah, what I've kind of felt like with SwiftUI personally

00:49:36 ◼   ► and also from talking to smart developers that I know,

00:49:40 ◼   ► is like SwiftUI is really good for building new things.

00:49:44 ◼   ► It gets complicated when you wanna replace

00:49:47 ◼   ► an existing thing with SwiftUI currently, right?

00:49:50 ◼   ► Because it's just different.

00:49:52 ◼   ► And I'm just surprised that they decided to tackle one of the fiddliest bits of Mac OS

00:50:02 ◼   ► now in SwiftUI.

00:50:05 ◼   ► That is just a surprise to me.

00:50:07 ◼   ► I could see that it looked like the iPhone, but they've done that for years, right?

00:50:13 ◼   ► Like things that look like their iOS, but they're built with AppKit and UIKit and traditional

00:50:19 ◼   ► Mac OS stuff.

00:50:21 ◼   ► It's just a surprise to me that something as fiddly and particular as System Preferences

00:50:27 ◼   ► was rebuilt using a more new modern technology that ConsenSys says still needs a little bit

00:50:35 ◼   ► more work.

00:50:36 ◼   ► Yeah, I'm not convinced that something like the Settings app...

00:50:41 ◼   ► I mean, if you can't build the Settings app with SwiftUI, then we're really in trouble

00:50:45 ◼   ► here.

00:50:46 ◼   ► I feel like the Settings app is pretty straightforward.

00:50:48 ◼   ► Maybe not.

00:50:49 ◼   ► the settings app is one of our more complicated apps,

00:50:51 ◼   ► it doesn't feel like it.

00:50:52 ◼   ► It feels like it's pretty simple.

00:50:54 ◼   ► So I'm not convinced that laying,

00:50:56 ◼   ► how should I phrase this?

00:50:59 ◼   ► I don't think we should lay the blame for this on SwiftUI.

00:51:03 ◼   ► I think the settings app on the Mac is bad

00:51:06 ◼   ► because it was conceived as using the metaphors from iOS

00:51:10 ◼   ► and that's a very hierarchical metaphor

00:51:13 ◼   ► and they're not using the screen orientation

00:51:16 ◼   ► of the Mac properly and they decided to make it

00:51:18 ◼   ► a single pane that scrolls instead of something

00:51:20 ◼   ► a little more complex.

00:51:21 ◼   ► Maybe that's a Swift UI thing.

00:51:22 ◼   ► Maybe there's some Swift UI issues going on there.

00:51:25 ◼   ► It feels to me, and I don't know the truth,

00:51:29 ◼   ► but all I can say is what it feels like to me.

00:51:31 ◼   ► It feels to me that rather than somebody sitting down

00:51:33 ◼   ► and saying, "What do we want a modern settings app

00:51:36 ◼   ► on the Mac to be?"

00:51:37 ◼   ► Somebody said, "Here, this is what settings is like

00:51:41 ◼   ► on iOS and iPadOS.

00:51:44 ◼   ► Do the Mac version of this."

00:51:46 ◼   ► And that's the wrong choice.

00:51:47 ◼   ► It's the wrong choice.

00:51:48 ◼   ► Having them feel like they're part of the family

00:51:50 ◼   ► because people are using all these devices

00:51:53 ◼   ► and having them feel similar, I get it.

00:51:55 ◼   ► But what's on the Mac now doesn't feel like

00:51:58 ◼   ► it makes sense for the Mac at all.

00:51:59 ◼   ► It feels like it's being forced into an iOS frame

00:52:04 ◼   ► that doesn't fit and there's no point in it being like that.

00:52:07 ◼   ► This is the Mac settings app.

00:52:09 ◼   ► I don't understand at all.

00:52:10 ◼   ► - This episode is brought to you by Sourcegraph.

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00:54:00 ◼   ► That's about.sourcegraph.com to find out why some of the biggest tech companies in

00:54:04 ◼   ► the world use Sourcegraph and to see what it can do for your company. Or you can just

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00:54:12 ◼   ► this show. Thanks to Sourcegraph for their support of Upgrade and Relay FM.

00:54:18 ◼   ► Breaking news, Myke, breaking news. As was anticipated when we started recording this

00:54:23 ◼   ► episode, as we are recording now, the public betas for all of Apple's OS's are rolling

00:54:28 ◼   ► out and consider our previous segment, our public beta segment that we didn't want to

00:54:35 ◼   ► say because we weren't sure.

00:54:36 ◼   ► What a surprise.

00:54:37 ◼   ► We weren't sure whether, well, Apple rolls, sometimes Apple says, "We're going to roll."

00:54:42 ◼   ► "Pst, pst, we're gonna roll out the public betas on Monday."

00:54:45 ◼   ► And then you get to Monday and they're like,

00:54:48 ◼   ► "No, no, no, no, not yet, no."

00:54:52 ◼   ► - "Please don't talk about it."

00:54:53 ◼   ► - "Maybe tomorrow, we'll let you know, we don't know yet."

00:54:55 ◼   ► That has happened, right?

00:54:56 ◼   ► We are ready to push the button and they're like,

00:54:58 ◼   ► it's not like the hardware stuff where they're like,

00:55:01 ◼   ► "Okay, okay, you're gonna, at 6 a.m. post the story."

00:55:05 ◼   ► With the betas it's like, "We'll let you know."

00:55:07 ◼   ► 'Cause they have to be like on the CDN

00:55:08 ◼   ► and then they say that they're out at 10 a.m.

00:55:10 ◼   ► but some people don't see them.

00:55:11 ◼   ► I don't see them yet, you may have to wait.

00:55:14 ◼   ► But I've been told, I have, on good authority,

00:55:17 ◼   ► that the public betas are rolling out as we record this,

00:55:19 ◼   ► and therefore please, again, consider our coverage

00:55:22 ◼   ► of the developer betas in the previous segment.

00:55:25 ◼   ► That was really our public beta conversation.

00:55:28 ◼   ► And you can go read my story about the macOS public beta

00:55:30 ◼   ► and Dan Morin's story about the iOS public beta

00:55:33 ◼   ► at Six Colors, we were working on those over the weekend.

00:55:36 ◼   ► It's the start of a long process that will lead

00:55:37 ◼   ► to full reviews in the fall, but it's a start.

00:55:41 ◼   ► - So yeah, you can go read more there,

00:55:42 ◼   ► but all of this was, all of that conversation

00:55:45 ◼   ► was based in mind of, we knew developer beta three

00:55:48 ◼   ► would be the public beta, 'cause it always is,

00:55:50 ◼   ► and we had the idea that it was coming today.

00:55:52 ◼   ► So we thought, hey, why not talk about them?

00:55:54 ◼   ► So there you go.

00:55:55 ◼   ► - That was it, that was it, now you know.

00:55:56 ◼   ► And by the time you're listening to this,

00:55:58 ◼   ► probably dear listener, you've already seen

00:56:00 ◼   ► that there's a public beta, and already treated

00:56:02 ◼   ► that comment as public beta related,

00:56:04 ◼   ► 'cause the beta three is basically the public beta.

00:56:06 ◼   ► That's generally how that works,

00:56:07 ◼   ► the developer Beta 3 then gets rolled out to the public. I think they wait a few days to see if

00:56:12 ◼   ► anything explodes and then they roll it out to the public.

00:56:14 ◼   ► - Remember Roundup, Jason Snell. - Okay, yeah. I'm ready.

00:56:17 ◼   ► - This time it's all focused on the extreme sports version of the Apple Watch. Now,

00:56:23 ◼   ► I just want to know, Upgradients will know, Mark Gurman has been calling this the rugged Apple Watch,

00:56:29 ◼   ► the sports Apple Watch, and we coined the term extreme sports. This is now caught on.

00:56:34 ◼   ► So I'm going to say that that came from us.

00:56:36 ◼   ► I know that this was a joke that we made some weeks ago.

00:56:40 ◼   ► I'm not saying this is serious, but it is funny to me now that--

00:56:42 ◼   ► Apple Watch Extreme.

00:56:43 ◼   ► Now Mark Gorman is calling it the extreme sports version

00:56:46 ◼   ► of the Apple Watch 2.

00:56:48 ◼   ► There's more details here, and details I was not expecting.

00:56:52 ◼   ► So this comes from a couple of articles.

00:56:55 ◼   ► One was a typical Bloomberg article that Mark wrote,

00:56:59 ◼   ► and then another was in the Power On newsletter.

00:57:01 ◼   ► So we've got this Apple Watch will have a larger screen

00:57:06 ◼   ► than any current Apple Watch.

00:57:08 ◼   ► It will be almost two inches diagonally,

00:57:11 ◼   ► which is, it'll be 7% more screen real estate

00:57:14 ◼   ► than the largest watch screen right now.

00:57:17 ◼   ► So it's not a huge difference, but it is different.

00:57:20 ◼   ► And I was not expecting that,

00:57:22 ◼   ► because my expectation is this will probably cause work

00:57:25 ◼   ► for Apple Watch app developers just to fully support this.

00:57:30 ◼   ► I mean, it depends.

00:57:32 ◼   ► It depends to me on whether they are,

00:57:34 ◼   ► and I was unclear reading Marc's report,

00:57:38 ◼   ► if the screen's bigger, is it more screen space

00:57:40 ◼   ► or is it just that everything's bigger?

00:57:42 ◼   ► Right?

00:57:45 ◼   ► - So he did give-- - If it's the same number of--

00:57:47 ◼   ► If it's the same number of pixels,

00:57:49 ◼   ► then it doesn't matter, right?

00:57:52 ◼   ► If it's bigger.

00:57:53 ◼   ► - Yeah, I don't know if he knows.

00:57:55 ◼   ► 'Cause he was saying some stuff--

00:57:57 ◼   ► - I know, right? - Like he was saying about,

00:57:59 ◼   ► oh, and they're putting more stuff on the screens now,

00:58:01 ◼   ► which will make this even better.

00:58:03 ◼   ► But yeah, I don't know, right?

00:58:05 ◼   ► Like I don't know how to do this.

00:58:06 ◼   ► - Yeah, I read that with some skepticism

00:58:08 ◼   ► because I was trying to say,

00:58:09 ◼   ► is he really saying that there's gonna be

00:58:11 ◼   ► a new screen layout on that thing?

00:58:13 ◼   ► Or is he saying it's gonna be a little bit bigger,

00:58:17 ◼   ► but that's just gonna make everything more readable.

00:58:19 ◼   ► And I'm not clear on that at all.

00:58:23 ◼   ► And I think you could take it to mean that,

00:58:25 ◼   ► but I'm not sure that I believe that.

00:58:28 ◼   ► And again, his wording here is all, you know,

00:58:31 ◼   ► there's stuff he seems to know

00:58:33 ◼   ► and stuff he's not sure about.

00:58:35 ◼   ► And so there's a lot going on here.

00:58:38 ◼   ► - Well, okay, so I'm trying to work this out

00:58:43 ◼   ► by looking at, this doesn't make any sense,

00:58:46 ◼   ► 430 by 352 pixels.

00:58:50 ◼   ► And he says 410 by 502 pixels.

00:58:53 ◼   ► So that's different.

00:58:57 ◼   ► - Yeah, if it really is a different screen size,

00:59:00 ◼   ► I mean, I'm sure there'll be like a compatibility

00:59:02 ◼   ► or something where it just runs in the center,

00:59:04 ◼   ► but maybe apps can take advantage of it.

00:59:06 ◼   ► Or alternately, maybe there's a system thing

00:59:08 ◼   ► that is putting a frame around it that, you know,

00:59:10 ◼   ► or only Apple is taking advantage of.

00:59:12 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:59:13 ◼   ► It's an interesting thought that there might be

00:59:15 ◼   ► yet another screen size for Apple Watch developers

00:59:17 ◼   ► to deal with.

00:59:17 ◼   ► - Yeah, so to say that slightly differently,

00:59:19 ◼   ► this is coming from screen sizes, size screens.com,

00:59:24 ◼   ► it's just what came up when I Googled it.

00:59:26 ◼   ► The big one is 484 by 396.

00:59:35 ◼   ► And Mark is saying that this would be 502 by 410.

00:59:40 ◼   ► Well, that's bigger.

00:59:40 ◼   ► So that's different.

00:59:42 ◼   ► So I'm not sure he knows completely,

00:59:46 ◼   ► and we don't know completely.

00:59:47 ◼   ► But it will be bigger.

00:59:49 ◼   ► So I wasn't expecting that.

00:59:53 ◼   ► Increased shatter resistance on the display,

00:59:55 ◼   ► that would make perfect sense, right?

00:59:58 ◼   ► - Sure.

00:59:59 ◼   ► - Rugged metal casing.

01:00:01 ◼   ► Quote, "Strong metal instead of aluminum."

01:00:05 ◼   ► Quote, "Probably titanium."

01:00:07 ◼   ► Mark didn't say this in the report,

01:00:09 ◼   ► but said it in the newsletter, right?

01:00:11 ◼   ► Probably, you never see probablys

01:00:14 ◼   ► in a typical Mark Gorman-Blumberg report.

01:00:17 ◼   ► I was not expecting metal for this watch.

01:00:21 ◼   ► - Yeah, yeah, I wasn't either.

01:00:23 ◼   ► I mean, Mark's report is interesting in general

01:00:26 ◼   ► because he makes it sound,

01:00:28 ◼   ► and we should say he thinks it's gonna be expensive too.

01:00:32 ◼   ► He thinks it's gonna be like,

01:00:34 ◼   ► I mean, he kind of advocates to call it an Apple Watch Pro,

01:00:37 ◼   ► which I think is a bad idea, but you know, who knows?

01:00:42 ◼   ► Apple calls something a Pro Max, so why not?

01:00:45 ◼   ► - In the article, that's just one of the many names

01:00:47 ◼   ► he throws out there of like it's,

01:00:49 ◼   ► 'cause in the newsletter,

01:00:51 ◼   ► he's comparing it to the Galaxy Watch Pro.

01:00:54 ◼   ► So this just refers to it as Pro.

01:00:56 ◼   ► But you know, he's thrown around

01:00:58 ◼   ► about five different names for this thing,

01:01:00 ◼   ► but not names that he has heard,

01:01:03 ◼   ► but names that he thinks it could be.

01:01:05 ◼   ► - Yeah, but the idea of Pro,

01:01:07 ◼   ► but regardless it's a high-end model

01:01:09 ◼   ► and it's sort of like replacing the edition with this.

01:01:12 ◼   ► And that's not necessarily what I thought.

01:01:13 ◼   ► I mean, Apple's always gonna try to make its money

01:01:15 ◼   ► wherever it can.

01:01:16 ◼   ► So having this be like a special Apple Watch

01:01:18 ◼   ► that's got super awesome features for people

01:01:21 ◼   ► who are sports enthusiasts at a high end level,

01:01:25 ◼   ► and they're gonna spend more money to get this thing

01:01:26 ◼   ► that's super strong and has more battery

01:01:30 ◼   ► and maybe has some special modes.

01:01:31 ◼   ► He says, at the end, he says something about how like,

01:01:35 ◼   ► "Oh, there may be some features that are just to this

01:01:38 ◼   ► that are announced," which I would expect.

01:01:40 ◼   ► I would expect that it's got some special features.

01:01:43 ◼   ► I was thinking about our friend, David Smith

01:01:44 ◼   ► and his hiking thing,

01:01:49 ◼   ► where he tried to take an Apple Watch

01:01:51 ◼   ► out into the wilderness.

01:01:52 ◼   ► And the challenge with that is that

01:01:54 ◼   ► the Apple Watch really was designed to be charged every day,

01:01:56 ◼   ► but you can put it in a low power mode and all that.

01:01:59 ◼   ► I wonder if when Mark Gurman here reports

01:02:01 ◼   ► the larger battery as well,

01:02:03 ◼   ► I started to think, I wonder if there's a story there

01:02:05 ◼   ► where there's basically like a long life mode

01:02:08 ◼   ► for the Apple Watch

01:02:09 ◼   ► that has some very specific characteristics,

01:02:11 ◼   ► and maybe it's easier to take it in and out of that

01:02:14 ◼   ► as you use it, but that it will have a larger battery

01:02:17 ◼   ► and a longer life mode so that you can use it for longer

01:02:20 ◼   ► and maybe it samples your heart rate and other activity

01:02:24 ◼   ► at a slower pace if you're gonna be out there for days.

01:02:28 ◼   ► I feel like that could be part of the story too,

01:02:30 ◼   ► but I am a little surprised like you are about the idea

01:02:32 ◼   ► that this is really also a high-end

01:02:35 ◼   ► with high-end materials kind of product

01:02:37 ◼   ► that they might be saying, well, this new Apple Watch Sport

01:02:40 ◼   ► or Extreme or Pro or whatever is gonna be made

01:02:43 ◼   ► with this titanium that's light and strong

01:02:46 ◼   ► and isn't gonna get bashed by, you know,

01:02:51 ◼   ► when you hit it against a boulder or whatever.

01:02:53 ◼   ► Interesting, I mean, like the sales pitch on this,

01:02:56 ◼   ► you gotta admit, it's gonna be really interesting

01:02:58 ◼   ► 'cause like, who are they trying to hit with this?

01:03:00 ◼   ► And is it gonna be this sort of like

01:03:02 ◼   ► premium high-end sports enthusiast kind of product

01:03:06 ◼   ► as opposed to what I was kind of envisioning,

01:03:09 ◼   ► which maybe is just my lack of vision on this.

01:03:11 ◼   ► I was kind of envisioning something

01:03:13 ◼   ► that would cost more or less like what an Apple Watch costs,

01:03:16 ◼   ► but be a variation on it.

01:03:18 ◼   ► And that's not what Mark is proposing at all here.

01:03:20 ◼   ► He's proposing a souped up, just for sports enthusiasts

01:03:25 ◼   ► kind of mega Apple Watch.

01:03:28 ◼   ► - My kind of reading on this now is, I was like you, right?

01:03:31 ◼   ► Like this is gonna be a third watch in the lineup

01:03:34 ◼   ► and it's focused on a particular market.

01:03:37 ◼   ► But I think probably what they'll go with now is like,

01:03:42 ◼   ► you can have a watch which can do anything,

01:03:46 ◼   ► like it can cope with anything,

01:03:48 ◼   ► but you don't need to compromise on the look.

01:03:51 ◼   ► Right? - Yeah, and it feels like,

01:03:53 ◼   ► I mean, essentially also it's just

01:03:55 ◼   ► the high-end Apple Watch, right?

01:03:56 ◼   ► - Exactly. - 'Cause it's not gonna look

01:03:57 ◼   ► like a G-SHOCKS or something like that.

01:03:59 ◼   ► It's going to be made a premium material,

01:04:01 ◼   ► it's gonna have a bigger battery,

01:04:02 ◼   ► it's gonna have a bigger screen.

01:04:04 ◼   ► You know, obviously it's gonna be bigger and heavier,

01:04:06 ◼   ► but it allows them to basically say,

01:04:11 ◼   ► And that would lead to calling it something like Pro,

01:04:14 ◼   ► because although we've been thinking of it

01:04:16 ◼   ► as a extreme fitness version, what if it's not, right?

01:04:20 ◼   ► What if it's just a big old Apple Watch,

01:04:23 ◼   ► a big old fancy expensive Apple Watch,

01:04:25 ◼   ► and it's got a bunch of features maybe for the storytelling

01:04:28 ◼   ► that are about extreme levels of, you know,

01:04:33 ◼   ► activity and adventure and stuff like that.

01:04:36 ◼   ► It doesn't maybe change from it being kind of like

01:04:40 ◼   ► a mega high-end Apple Watch and not a kind of derivative for a particular market, which

01:04:47 ◼   ► is how I think we've been talking about it all along.

01:04:50 ◼   ► Yeah, it's more like, honestly feels to me more like an Apple Watch Max, right? Like,

01:04:56 ◼   ► you can do anything, right? Like you can do anything and it's great.

01:04:58 ◼   ► Maybe that's it. I like that as a bit, I like that better than Apple Watch Pro, to be honest,

01:05:02 ◼   ► is Apple Watch Max.

01:05:03 ◼   ► Me too. Pro doesn't make, I mean, honestly, I reckon they'll probably, if they're going

01:05:06 ◼   ► to do something, they'll do Pro because they can't stop using Pro everywhere.

01:05:09 ◼   ► But like it doesn't make sense to me as like I'm a professional watch wearer?

01:05:15 ◼   ► Like I don't, that doesn't line up in my mind.

01:05:19 ◼   ► Like I'm not content creating on my Apple Watch.

01:05:22 ◼   ► So it's Apple Watch Studio then is what we're saying.

01:05:25 ◼   ► You use my Apple Watch to, my body is my studio, my whatever it is, my exercises are my canvas

01:05:33 ◼   ► and so therefore Apple Watch Studio is for me.

01:05:37 ◼   ► As you mentioned, Mark is expecting this to be more expensive than any Apple Watch you

01:05:41 ◼   ► can currently buy in the 900 to 999 category, which makes sense to me if they're going to

01:05:47 ◼   ► make it bigger and they're going to put a bigger battery in it. By the way, I reckon

01:05:50 ◼   ► the screen's only getting bigger because they want to put a bigger battery in it. I think

01:05:54 ◼   ► it started with battery and then they ended up with bigger screen because they needed

01:05:57 ◼   ► a bigger physical case. That would be my expectation.

01:06:00 ◼   ► Right. And maybe they had a conversation about ruggedizing it and people were like, "You

01:06:04 ◼   ► what we should do is make it of a fine rugged metal because then right because then people

01:06:11 ◼   ► will buy it aspirationally and wear it as a regular Apple watch whereas if it if it's

01:06:16 ◼   ► if it looks like a big plasticy if it is a watch you're not gonna wear it to dinner right

01:06:24 ◼   ► yeah it is made of the fluoro elastomer stuff that they make the sport bands out of which

01:06:29 ◼   ► I was kind of hoping it would because it'd be fun. It's gonna look like either a sports

01:06:36 ◼   ► watch or be a kids watch right and I think they probably don't want to do that right

01:06:40 ◼   ► that would be my expectation in reading these reports. This pricing thing has led to a lot

01:06:45 ◼   ► of people thinking that Apple's going to get rid of the edition. I don't think they are.

01:06:49 ◼   ► I think the Series 8 will still have an edition model.

01:06:52 ◼   ► I have a hard time believing they won't offer I mean whether they call it edition or not

01:06:56 ◼   ► like offering stainless steel and titanium as materials doesn't like what

01:06:59 ◼   ► it's a chance to sell literally the same product for a lot more yes and for

01:07:04 ◼   ► people who want to buy the the nicer material and who might not want to buy

01:07:08 ◼   ► this particularly high-end watch so with the series 7 they stopped breaking it

01:07:15 ◼   ► out into its own product it used like Apple watch edition used to be kind of

01:07:19 ◼   ► like its own thing like we're in the ceramic and titanium but now we just go

01:07:24 ◼   ► to the buy page it's just a material option basically, it's titanium and it's called

01:07:30 ◼   ► addition. It's not broken out in the same way, it's kind of like Hermes, they're

01:07:36 ◼   ► not going to stop making the Hermes either. So I kind of just feel like all of those fit

01:07:41 ◼   ► under series 7 or series 8 it will be, because it's just different materials for that watch

01:07:46 ◼   ► type and then the Apple Watch Max will be its own thing. And honestly, could also have

01:07:54 ◼   ► a set of different materials, right? Like, who knows? All Mark has officially said is

01:08:01 ◼   ► strong metal, which is a fun thing for me, but then referenced titanium as a probably.

01:08:08 ◼   ► Because it would be interesting to me if they made this out of titanium and then also continued

01:08:12 ◼   ► to make a series 8 in titanium. I feel like if they're going to make this out of titanium,

01:08:18 ◼   ► they need to make an addition out of something else. Hopefully they go back to ceramic, because

01:08:23 ◼   ► 'cause I miss the ceramic.

01:08:25 ◼   ► - I wanted to mention also,

01:08:27 ◼   ► just 'cause I don't know this category very well at all,

01:08:29 ◼   ► I'm looking at the G-Shock website, Casio.

01:08:32 ◼   ► And you know, I always think of them as like plastic

01:08:34 ◼   ► or rubberized kind of things.

01:08:36 ◼   ► And you can buy plasticy G-Shocks for 140 bucks,

01:08:39 ◼   ► but like you can also buy a G-Shock for 800, 1100, 1200

01:08:44 ◼   ► that are kind of special, carbon fiber reinforced, et cetera.

01:08:50 ◼   ► And like you think Apple doesn't look at this spread of products and go, well, I know where

01:08:55 ◼   ► we're going. We're going up there, right? Then we're not going to the $110 plastic one.

01:08:59 ◼   ► We're going to the $1,000 fancy one and doing it there. So yeah, this fascinating little tidbit.

01:09:06 ◼   ► Like it doesn't seem like Mark Gurman knows everything about this product, but it is coming

01:09:11 ◼   ► more into focus as a high-end, not like you said, not coated in like fluoro elastomer. And it's like,

01:09:19 ◼   ► if you drop it, it bounces back up into your hand

01:09:22 ◼   ► kind of thing, right?

01:09:23 ◼   ► Like it's a Super Bowl with an Apple Watch inside,

01:09:27 ◼   ► but more that it's a high-end Apple Watch

01:09:29 ◼   ► that has some features that are going to fit

01:09:32 ◼   ► the storytelling of the sports focus of the Apple Watch,

01:09:36 ◼   ► which kind of makes sense.

01:09:37 ◼   ► But you could also just buy one

01:09:38 ◼   ► if you want a bigger Apple Watch with a bigger battery

01:09:41 ◼   ► and all of that, you can just buy it and wear it

01:09:43 ◼   ► and it'll look nice.

01:09:44 ◼   ► And that sounds right to me,

01:09:46 ◼   ► that sounds much more plausible.

01:09:48 ◼   ► to celebrate the summer of fun.

01:09:49 ◼   ► We're gonna do a quick draft.

01:09:51 ◼   ► - Quick draft.

01:09:52 ◼   ► - Jason had an idea that we're gonna draft app icons.

01:09:55 ◼   ► - We are.

01:09:56 ◼   ► - This is, we've been very,

01:09:58 ◼   ► we haven't really shared a lot of like what are the rules.

01:09:59 ◼   ► We don't have rules.

01:10:00 ◼   ► It's just, we're just gonna pick our favorite app icons.

01:10:03 ◼   ► - Yeah, that's it.

01:10:05 ◼   ► - I would like to go first.

01:10:08 ◼   ► - Yeah, you get to go first.

01:10:08 ◼   ► I suggested this draft, so I'm gonna let you go first.

01:10:12 ◼   ► - And I took a look at my iPhone home screen,

01:10:15 ◼   ► took a look at my iPad home screen,

01:10:17 ◼   ► And then also consulted a book that I own,

01:10:20 ◼   ► which I backed from a Kickstarter campaign

01:10:21 ◼   ► called the iOS App Icon Book.

01:10:23 ◼   ► So I spent some time today going through that

01:10:26 ◼   ► and looking at some of the best app icons

01:10:30 ◼   ► in all of iOS history for this today.

01:10:33 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:10:34 ◼   ► - And so I feel like I wanna start with something

01:10:38 ◼   ► really classic and also maybe to steal one from you.

01:10:42 ◼   ► And I'm gonna go with Twitterrific.

01:10:44 ◼   ► - Oh, for people who don't know,

01:10:48 ◼   ► the Twitterific Bluebird predates Twitter

01:10:52 ◼   ► using a blue bird as its icon.

01:10:55 ◼   ► They got the idea,

01:10:58 ◼   ► Twitterific not only did that,

01:10:59 ◼   ► they defined, Craig Hockenberry defined the term tweets.

01:11:04 ◼   ► Like there's a reason there's only one third party app

01:11:09 ◼   ► that gets to use the word Twitter in its name still.

01:11:11 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:11:12 ◼   ► - 'Cause they,

01:11:13 ◼   ► - The Twitter kind of owes them,

01:11:15 ◼   ► they helped build the service. - We'll just agree here,

01:11:16 ◼   ► shall we? - Yeah, exactly.

01:11:18 ◼   ► And it was on my list, it was second on my list

01:11:21 ◼   ► because it's a great icon, it comes in lots of variations,

01:11:24 ◼   ► but that Bluebird, it's great.

01:11:27 ◼   ► - That was for me. - It's a great icon.

01:11:30 ◼   ► - You know, some of my favorite app icons

01:11:32 ◼   ► are variations of the, you know,

01:11:33 ◼   ► like that are available inside of apps,

01:11:35 ◼   ► but like, I just think any version of this,

01:11:38 ◼   ► 'cause it's like also every Twitter app

01:11:40 ◼   ► also has some other kind of Bluebird,

01:11:41 ◼   ► Like everyone, but like it all started here

01:11:44 ◼   ► and also is made by like one of,

01:11:49 ◼   ► if not the definitive icon design companies as well, right?

01:11:53 ◼   ► Like this just felt to me as like so many things converging

01:11:57 ◼   ► to be like, this is one of the best.

01:11:59 ◼   ► - I agree. It was very high up on my list.

01:12:03 ◼   ► Now you were looking at the app icon book

01:12:05 ◼   ► and looking at iOS icons.

01:12:06 ◼   ► I'm just gonna say my next pick is a Mac icon.

01:12:11 ◼   ► - How about that? - There's a lot of Mac icons

01:12:12 ◼   ► in that book too.

01:12:13 ◼   ► - Okay, that's good.

01:12:15 ◼   ► That's good.

01:12:16 ◼   ► Well, I'm gonna go for a classic introduced in the,

01:12:19 ◼   ► oh, when was it?

01:12:22 ◼   ► In the OS 8, I wanna say days?

01:12:27 ◼   ► There was a point when the clones came in

01:12:29 ◼   ► where Apple needed to do some branding around Mac OS

01:12:31 ◼   ► because Mac OS was no longer just running on Macs.

01:12:34 ◼   ► It was running on clones, but they were running Mac OS

01:12:37 ◼   ► so there needed to be branding

01:12:39 ◼   ► and Apple has kept macOS branding all along.

01:12:41 ◼   ► And one of the things they introduced at the time

01:12:44 ◼   ► was an interesting icon that was a face,

01:12:48 ◼   ► but also a face looking the other direction.

01:12:51 ◼   ► And it's now the Finder icon.

01:12:52 ◼   ► So I'm going to choose the Finder,

01:12:54 ◼   ► which is also the classic macOS icon.

01:12:57 ◼   ► - Oh man.

01:12:57 ◼   ► - As my choice.

01:13:00 ◼   ► - That's a good one.

01:13:00 ◼   ► - For my first choice, the Finder.

01:13:02 ◼   ► - That's a good one. - The smiley faces.

01:13:04 ◼   ► It's like a person looking to their right

01:13:07 ◼   ► and maybe kissing somebody on the side of their face,

01:13:10 ◼   ► or it's a face facing forward.

01:13:12 ◼   ► It's both things at once.

01:13:13 ◼   ► (laughing)

01:13:14 ◼   ► - It's like, "Hey buddy."

01:13:16 ◼   ► You know, comes in. - Hey, hey, love you.

01:13:18 ◼   ► - I'm gonna pick one that I think this icon

01:13:23 ◼   ► does a very good job of showing off

01:13:26 ◼   ► one of my favorite app designs of all time as well, Clear.

01:13:31 ◼   ► - Oh, interesting.

01:13:34 ◼   ► - Yeah, I think Clear is one of the most beautiful apps

01:13:37 ◼   ► ever made. It was a to-do app. It was just wonderful design in and out and the app

01:13:43 ◼   ► icon itself just does a great job of showing that like the heat map kind of

01:13:48 ◼   ► look that the app originated. So yeah what does the clear app icon look like?

01:13:53 ◼   ► It's a checkbox? Checkbox with like oranges to red like not like a gradient

01:13:59 ◼   ► or something like little like... Well like with the like with the six colors rainbow

01:14:03 ◼   ► it's that kind of thing. It's striped of a—it's a gradient, but it's in like six stripes.

01:14:08 ◼   ► -Yeah. -Or five stripes.

01:14:10 ◼   ► -Yeah, and I think it does a great job of showing off the design that's inside,

01:14:15 ◼   ► because I think it's just—it's one of my favorite app designs ever, and the icon just is so simple,

01:14:23 ◼   ► but so well made. Yeah, big fan. -In looking at all these apps for this draft,

01:14:30 ◼   ► I did have, I'm sure you did too, this question of like, well, what do I like in an app icon?

01:14:34 ◼   ► Sure. Because there are lots of apps I use all the time and they have icons that are recognizable.

01:14:38 ◼   ► And like from a purely functional perspective, having an app that your brain can assign to

01:14:44 ◼   ► pattern matching so you can see it and know that that's the app and maybe have some feelings about

01:14:48 ◼   ► it. But like it has being an app with an icon, like the icon has a job to do. But what I found

01:14:54 ◼   ► when I was looking for this draft, I kept thinking like, just like a thing with a letter on it,

01:15:00 ◼   ► or a couple of letters on it, like, doesn't really excite me. I kind of want it to be,

01:15:08 ◼   ► have a symbol and have it be clever in some way. That was sort of what I realized that was working

01:15:16 ◼   ► working for me. I don't know, what did you think? Did you come up with, as you were looking,

01:15:24 ◼   ► a kind of working definition of what is a good app in your terms?

01:15:28 ◼   ► I think it honestly is like something that felt iconic in a way. So I think for me it

01:15:36 ◼   ► was...

01:15:37 ◼   ► Your best icons are iconic, you're saying.

01:15:39 ◼   ► Yes, I think so. I mean, so I wasn't looking for like company logo or letters or, you know.

01:15:45 ◼   ► So for me it was something...

01:15:46 ◼   ► - And they either really strongly evoked the app

01:15:50 ◼   ► and or did what you were just mentioning about like

01:15:54 ◼   ► unequivocally says what this app is.

01:15:57 ◼   ► So like the next one that I'm gonna pick

01:15:58 ◼   ► is an example of that if you don't pick it before me,

01:16:00 ◼   ► but like, yeah.

01:16:02 ◼   ► - All right, with my next pick,

01:16:04 ◼   ► I'm picking maps, Apple Maps.

01:16:06 ◼   ► - Wow, okay.

01:16:08 ◼   ► - I really liked the Apple Maps icon

01:16:10 ◼   ► and have liked it through history

01:16:12 ◼   ► because it says what it is, but in a visual way,

01:16:15 ◼   ► It's got the little blue dot, it's got a little arrow.

01:16:19 ◼   ► And also I like it for the detail here,

01:16:21 ◼   ► which is if people don't know the Apple Maps icon

01:16:24 ◼   ► used to be the vicinity of infinite loop,

01:16:29 ◼   ► the actual like Interstate 280 and the exit

01:16:33 ◼   ► and infinite loop.

01:16:35 ◼   ► And now it's the vicinity of Apple Park

01:16:38 ◼   ► and it's the Wolf Road exit now

01:16:40 ◼   ► on the far side of Apple Park

01:16:44 ◼   ► and the little curve of Apple Park is up in the corner.

01:16:47 ◼   ► And I like that it looks like map elements,

01:16:49 ◼   ► but it's also something that I can see at a glance

01:16:51 ◼   ► and know that it's the Maps app.

01:16:52 ◼   ► And I really love the detail of the fact

01:16:55 ◼   ► that it's the actual map area of the Apple Campus.

01:16:59 ◼   ► - That's a good one.

01:17:01 ◼   ► In that similar vein of like an app icon

01:17:04 ◼   ► telling you what it is, I'm gonna go with Fantastic Hal.

01:17:07 ◼   ► - Sure. - I think it's just like

01:17:09 ◼   ► a very nice design, like with the colors

01:17:12 ◼   ► that exist inside of the kind of calendar squares,

01:17:16 ◼   ► but it just looks like a calendar.

01:17:18 ◼   ► Like, I like it, but it doesn't look like a calendar

01:17:20 ◼   ► in such a way that like, it looks like it's pretending

01:17:23 ◼   ► to be a real calendar, you know?

01:17:24 ◼   ► Like it's not got that skeuomorphism, which, you know,

01:17:28 ◼   ► I think had its time and its place,

01:17:31 ◼   ► and I like the kind of where we are now,

01:17:33 ◼   ► a lot with design, where there's a little bit

01:17:35 ◼   ► of texture back, but we're not trying to pretend

01:17:36 ◼   ► to be something we're not.

01:17:38 ◼   ► One of the things I'm always struck at

01:17:40 ◼   ► when I see screenshots from iPhones,

01:17:44 ◼   ► like iPhone 6 and early, all of the screens looked dark

01:17:48 ◼   ► because everyone was putting shadows on everything.

01:17:51 ◼   ► So, like, everything just looks, like, muddy to me.

01:17:54 ◼   ► There's, like, a clarity that's lost.

01:17:57 ◼   ► But anyway, I think Fantastic

01:18:07 ◼   ► It's funny on the Mac I have it displaying

01:18:10 ◼   ► with the current date,

01:18:11 ◼   ► which honestly I don't need

01:18:15 ◼   ► 'cause I have the current date up in the top.

01:18:18 ◼   ► So that's what I should do is I should like turn it off.

01:18:20 ◼   ► I should just have it be,

01:18:22 ◼   ► it's like a high date on app icon.

01:18:24 ◼   ► Oh, look at that in the settings.

01:18:25 ◼   ► I can make it, yeah, that's a lot better.

01:18:27 ◼   ► That's a good one.

01:18:28 ◼   ► I like it.

01:18:29 ◼   ► I, huh, there are so many,

01:18:35 ◼   ► and we're only doing five here.

01:18:37 ◼   ► I'm gonna go with another Mac app.

01:18:46 ◼   ► Am I? Am I though?

01:18:51 ◼   ► You know, I'm gonna go with Overcast.

01:18:56 ◼   ► - Classic, okay.

01:18:57 ◼   ► - Like I use Overcast as my podcast player,

01:19:01 ◼   ► so I see that icon a lot, but I like it.

01:19:05 ◼   ► I like that it's orange.

01:19:06 ◼   ► I use the orange one.

01:19:07 ◼   ► I don't use the dark one.

01:19:08 ◼   ► I like the orange background.

01:19:09 ◼   ► - I was very happy when I got to be able

01:19:11 ◼   ► to set the orange icon when using the dark theme.

01:19:16 ◼   ► - Yes, right, instead of changing the one.

01:19:17 ◼   ► - 'Cause I missed out on the orange icon for a long time.

01:19:20 ◼   ► - It's very simple.

01:19:21 ◼   ► It's a little broadcast transmitter

01:19:23 ◼   ► with the little orange radio waves waving out.

01:19:27 ◼   ► If you know that, if not, I think it's still,

01:19:30 ◼   ► you know, you could think of that as a speaker

01:19:32 ◼   ► playing music if you aren't thinking of it

01:19:34 ◼   ► as from the broadcast metaphor.

01:19:36 ◼   ► In the white circle with the orange background behind it,

01:19:41 ◼   ► very easy to pick out.

01:19:43 ◼   ► And also again, an icon,

01:19:46 ◼   ► I guess technically it's got a letter in it.

01:19:48 ◼   ► If you consider that circle an O, I don't.

01:19:51 ◼   ► So there.

01:19:52 ◼   ► - Oh no, I wouldn't have,

01:19:55 ◼   ► I don't think it's meant to be.

01:19:57 ◼   ► - No, it's not.

01:19:58 ◼   ► But I'm just saying that the most,

01:19:59 ◼   ► that's the most generic form of icon

01:20:01 ◼   ► is that it's a colored round-wrecked with a letter in it.

01:20:06 ◼   ► Like the App Store icon,

01:20:08 ◼   ► which I would put in the Hall of Fame

01:20:09 ◼   ► for worst icons of all time.

01:20:11 ◼   ► - Guys, one of the things I like

01:20:13 ◼   ► about the Overcast logo icon, I should say,

01:20:17 ◼   ► is that it is also evocative of the other apps

01:20:22 ◼   ► in the category that came before.

01:20:24 ◼   ► The idea of like a transmission tower.

01:20:29 ◼   ► Yeah, it's that metaphor, the podcast metaphor.

01:20:32 ◼   ► Which was featured in Apple podcasts and Instacast

01:20:36 ◼   ► and all of those kinds of apps as well.

01:20:39 ◼   ► I'm going to go with Carrot Weather next.

01:20:47 ◼   ► Interesting.

01:20:50 ◼   ► What I like about Carrot Weather a lot

01:20:52 ◼   ► is there are loads of app icon choices,

01:20:55 ◼   ► and they're all pretty fun.

01:20:57 ◼   ► I use one called Neon Dream, but I just really like the design.

01:21:02 ◼   ► I think that it does a good job of choice because the app itself does a good job of

01:21:09 ◼   ► choice so you can choose to have something that's kind of robotic looking if you like

01:21:15 ◼   ► the app to be robotic, right, and having its kind of personality.

01:21:23 ◼   ► But there's also a bunch of alternate options which can be more iconic, more customizable.

01:21:31 ◼   ► I like it.

01:21:32 ◼   ► I just think it's a nice simple icon, does a good job, and has a bunch of really good

01:21:36 ◼   ► options and neon dream is my favorite.

01:21:39 ◼   ► I love it.

01:21:40 ◼   ► I prefer the simpler logo that's just the cloud with the lightning bolt coming out of

01:21:46 ◼   ► it as opposed to the robot.

01:21:48 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:21:49 ◼   ► The neon, the one I use is a variation of just the cloud and lightning bolt.

01:21:53 ◼   ► It doesn't have any of the robot features.

01:21:56 ◼   ► - I think that's a better way to go.

01:21:58 ◼   ► I agree.

01:22:00 ◼   ► I'm gonna have to change my icon now in Carrotweather.

01:22:03 ◼   ► - There you go, see.

01:22:04 ◼   ► - To something that I prefer.

01:22:05 ◼   ► 'Cause you know, that's me.

01:22:08 ◼   ► I think I'm gonna go with something orange too.

01:22:11 ◼   ► 'Cause you know, again, it looks nice.

01:22:16 ◼   ► It's nice to have an orange one.

01:22:17 ◼   ► Pumpkin guts it is.

01:22:19 ◼   ► - Excellent.

01:22:23 ◼   ► Okay, my next icon is gonna be, this is an esoteric app,

01:22:28 ◼   ► although our friends use it, but I love it as an icon.

01:22:32 ◼   ► - Oh, I know what it's gonna be.

01:22:34 ◼   ► - Working Copy.

01:22:36 ◼   ► - That's not what I thought it was gonna be.

01:22:37 ◼   ► - No, I didn't think so.

01:22:39 ◼   ► - Okay.

01:22:41 ◼   ► - Working Copy is a, it's like a GitHub app,

01:22:44 ◼   ► a GitHub client.

01:22:47 ◼   ► It's basically, or is it more broadly,

01:22:51 ◼   ► it may just be version control on the iPad.

01:22:56 ◼   ► But I love its icon 'cause its icon is a fingerprint.

01:23:01 ◼   ► - It looks like Touch ID. - With dots.

01:23:03 ◼   ► It does look kind of like Touch ID.

01:23:05 ◼   ► And I like, I can always spot work and copy.

01:23:08 ◼   ► I know exactly what it looks like.

01:23:10 ◼   ► But I also like that it's an image, it's not W.

01:23:15 ◼   ► (laughs)

01:23:17 ◼   ► - WC.

01:23:18 ◼   ► WC is not, I like, yeah, just put a toilet on there

01:23:22 ◼   ► and it's good, it's fine.

01:23:23 ◼   ► I just, I like it.

01:23:26 ◼   ► I like that it's a dark background

01:23:28 ◼   ► with a little bit of a frame,

01:23:29 ◼   ► but the real core is that it's got the fingerprint

01:23:33 ◼   ► with the points going from end to end,

01:23:35 ◼   ► which is, I'm sure a very nice metaphor.

01:23:39 ◼   ► So there you go.

01:23:41 ◼   ► Love it.

01:23:42 ◼   ► - All right, my final pick.

01:23:45 ◼   ► I'm gonna award a few things here for my final pick.

01:23:48 ◼   ► Like it's one choice, but there's a few things.

01:23:50 ◼   ► One designed by a friend of mine, so Nepotism.

01:23:53 ◼   ► - Okay.

01:23:55 ◼   ► - App made by a friend of mine.

01:23:56 ◼   ► - Dear sir, I was outraged to discover your Nepotism.

01:24:01 ◼   ► - Well, you know, what can I say?

01:24:03 ◼   ► And I really like apps that allow for options, Peacock.

01:24:07 ◼   ► - Oh, well, congratulations to James Thompson

01:24:14 ◼   ► for having his calculator chosen as a winner

01:24:17 ◼   ► - Whatever this is.

01:24:18 ◼   ► - The six colors one a lot.

01:24:20 ◼   ► I think it's nice.

01:24:21 ◼   ► I like that James has a bunch of just like fun ones.

01:24:24 ◼   ► There's icons for like various representation.

01:24:29 ◼   ► Like there's lots of like flags in there.

01:24:32 ◼   ► You've got wild ones, you've got furry ones,

01:24:36 ◼   ► all kinds of stuff's going on in here.

01:24:38 ◼   ► I like it.

01:24:39 ◼   ► And I think that the app icon itself is just really nice.

01:24:43 ◼   ► Like the 42.

01:24:44 ◼   ► I like that it isn't a little calculator actually,

01:24:47 ◼   ► 'cause for some reason I'm breaking my own rule.

01:24:51 ◼   ► Yeah, I'm a fan.

01:24:52 ◼   ► Plus I was partly responsible

01:24:55 ◼   ► for there being so many icons in Peacock

01:24:58 ◼   ► because I convinced James that he should do it

01:25:00 ◼   ► and charge people for it.

01:25:01 ◼   ► So there you go, Peacock.

01:25:03 ◼   ► - I did not consider Peacock

01:25:06 ◼   ► because it breaks my rule of just being an icon

01:25:09 ◼   ► with in this case numbers in it, which it is a calculator.

01:25:14 ◼   ► It's fair and it is 42, which is also not fair.

01:25:19 ◼   ► - I think my new rule is I have no rules.

01:25:22 ◼   ► - Okay, that works.

01:25:23 ◼   ► That works.

01:25:25 ◼   ► I am going to choose Bartender.

01:25:30 ◼   ► - Oh. - That's my lack of it.

01:25:32 ◼   ► Bartender is a utility on the Mac

01:25:34 ◼   ► that lets you tend to your menu bar

01:25:36 ◼   ► and hide menu bar items you don't wanna see

01:25:38 ◼   ► or expand them when you do wanna see them.

01:25:40 ◼   ► And it's icon, I love it, it's hilarious.

01:25:42 ◼   ► It is the rounded rect is the black of the suit jacket.

01:25:47 ◼   ► There's a V and then there's a dress shirt underneath.

01:25:50 ◼   ► And then at the very top is the black bow tie.

01:25:54 ◼   ► It is what the bartender wears at a formal event.

01:26:00 ◼   ► And I think it's adorable.

01:26:01 ◼   ► And I love, I just love the attention to detail.

01:26:04 ◼   ► I think it is a elegant kind of icon.

01:26:07 ◼   ► It is a, some levels it's kind of a joke, right?

01:26:11 ◼   ► It's like, get it, bartender?

01:26:12 ◼   ► And yet it's so well executed.

01:26:14 ◼   ► - And it also, you know, the little collar of the shirt

01:26:17 ◼   ► pokes out of the round rack, right?

01:26:19 ◼   ► Like it's not completely flat on the top.

01:26:22 ◼   ► Which is one of the great things about Mac apps

01:26:25 ◼   ► is that they can be arbitrary shapes.

01:26:27 ◼   ► - Yeah, so good.

01:26:28 ◼   ► Did a good job with that one.

01:26:30 ◼   ► - Yeah, I liked that one a lot.

01:26:32 ◼   ► - I like the bartender app a lot.

01:26:33 ◼   ► Did you have any extras that you want to mention

01:26:35 ◼   ► that we didn't pick?

01:26:36 ◼   ► - Yeah, deliveries, I really like.

01:26:39 ◼   ► Tweetbot, the New Year's variant I like.

01:26:42 ◼   ► I didn't like when Tweetbot made the bird look angry,

01:26:45 ◼   ► but the New Year's one is nice.

01:26:49 ◼   ► And Kraft, specifically a variation that they have,

01:26:53 ◼   ► which is a kind of pink and blue gradient background.

01:26:56 ◼   ► That would be the ones that I had on my little list here.

01:27:00 ◼   ► - I had Net News Wire,

01:27:02 ◼   ► which has gone through many, many different icons,

01:27:04 ◼   ► but it has kept the idea of a satellite

01:27:08 ◼   ► that's beaming things to you.

01:27:10 ◼   ► I think that's a nice metaphor

01:27:12 ◼   ► and also instantly recognizable.

01:27:14 ◼   ► - I like that they didn't just go with

01:27:16 ◼   ► the version of the RSS logo.

01:27:18 ◼   ► - Sure. - Like many.

01:27:19 ◼   ► - No, it's a totally different concept.

01:27:21 ◼   ► Transmit from panic, which is, you know, it's that truck.

01:27:24 ◼   ► - The truck. - It's that truck.

01:27:26 ◼   ► The yellow and blue truck. - The truck.

01:27:28 ◼   ► - It's iconic and great.

01:27:31 ◼   ► Automator, it's got a robot holding a metal thing.

01:27:36 ◼   ► It's adorable.

01:27:37 ◼   ► Apple would never let anybody get away with this now.

01:27:40 ◼   ► And all they did when they updated to the new style

01:27:42 ◼   ► where there's the round recs is they just

01:27:44 ◼   ► put the round rec behind the robot.

01:27:46 ◼   ► Whatever.

01:27:47 ◼   ► - The Automator logo for me,

01:27:49 ◼   ► I don't like it 'cause it's threatening.

01:27:51 ◼   ► It's like he's got a pipe and he's gonna bash me with a pipe.

01:27:55 ◼   ► - Yeah, maybe.

01:27:57 ◼   ► Maybe that's why I like it so much.

01:27:58 ◼   ► - How dare you make me do all this work?

01:28:00 ◼   ► I'm coming for you, kid.

01:28:01 ◼   ► That's what I think when I look at this little icon here.

01:28:05 ◼   ► - An app I use all the time,

01:28:06 ◼   ► but rarely see the icon of is actually a launch bar.

01:28:09 ◼   ► But what I like about it is that it's like almost like a,

01:28:13 ◼   ► it's kind of cryptic,

01:28:13 ◼   ► but like it's an L and a B for like launch bar.

01:28:16 ◼   ► It is sort of the L and the B,

01:28:18 ◼   ► but it's also a circle that goes into an arrow.

01:28:22 ◼   ► And it's also got that kind of step gradient

01:28:23 ◼   ► from orange to a yellow of the arrow.

01:28:27 ◼   ► It's very pretty.

01:28:28 ◼   ► And I like that it's the logo is the name of the app,

01:28:32 ◼   ► but you also don't need to see that to get what it is,

01:28:37 ◼   ► which I think is very clever.

01:28:38 ◼   ► And my last one, I just wanted to do a shout out

01:28:41 ◼   ► to an icon that makes me laugh every time I launch it.

01:28:46 ◼   ► And that's the icon for VLC, which is a road cone.

01:28:50 ◼   ► - What does that mean?

01:28:53 ◼   ► - I don't know why it's a cone.

01:28:56 ◼   ► I'm sure there's a story.

01:28:57 ◼   ► It's like, is it because it's constantly under development

01:29:00 ◼   ► and it's because it's dangerous?

01:29:02 ◼   ► because you shouldn't, I don't know, I just love that it's a cone because it makes me laugh. Again,

01:29:07 ◼   ► is it a good icon? I don't know. Does it properly represent the app? No, not at all,

01:29:13 ◼   ► which is probably why it's not a good icon. And yet it does make me laugh. So that's got to be

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01:30:51 ◼   ► Let's finish up today's episode with some #AskUpgradeQuestions.

01:30:55 ◼   ► The first comes from Brian.

01:30:58 ◼   ► Brian says, "My Apple Watch will sometimes throw up handwashing or workout suggestions or alerts while I'm doing things that are not handwashing or working out.

01:31:07 ◼   ► Do you have any situations where your watch will detect something that's different from the reality of the situation?"

01:31:12 ◼   ► I turn the handwashing thing off.

01:31:15 ◼   ► Okay.

01:31:16 ◼   ► Workout suggestions?

01:31:18 ◼   ► Yes.

01:31:19 ◼   ► Oh really?

01:31:20 ◼   ► - Sometimes I will get that.

01:31:23 ◼   ► I've been getting workout suggestions lately that are,

01:31:25 ◼   ► I mean, it's helpful when it recognizes it.

01:31:27 ◼   ► My bigger frustration is that I will sometimes be out

01:31:31 ◼   ► on a walk and it doesn't notice.

01:31:33 ◼   ► And it's like, you surely have noticed that I left my house

01:31:36 ◼   ► and have been walking and my heart rate is updated.

01:31:39 ◼   ► And sometimes it doesn't catch on for quite a while.

01:31:43 ◼   ► And when it logs me, it's not logging the beginning

01:31:45 ◼   ► of the walk, so it obviously missed some of it.

01:31:47 ◼   ► I'm a little bit baffled by that.

01:31:49 ◼   ► So that happens.

01:31:50 ◼   ► I also get frustrated by the,

01:31:52 ◼   ► are you done working out?

01:31:54 ◼   ► That sometimes happens.

01:31:55 ◼   ► And it's like, no, I'm not done working out.

01:31:56 ◼   ► - Oh, that's rough.

01:31:57 ◼   ► I haven't had that one before.

01:31:58 ◼   ► So like you're still working out and it's like.

01:32:01 ◼   ► - You seem to be going slower or being,

01:32:03 ◼   ► and it's like, are you done working out?

01:32:04 ◼   ► I'm not done working, shut up.

01:32:06 ◼   ► - It's like, hey Jason,

01:32:06 ◼   ► it feels like you've given up at this point.

01:32:08 ◼   ► - You've given up now, right?

01:32:09 ◼   ► Would you like to give up officially?

01:32:11 ◼   ► No, I don't want to give up officially.

01:32:13 ◼   ► Well, let me tell you the,

01:32:15 ◼   ► there was a workout type for curling.

01:32:17 ◼   ► And you know, you're sweeping.

01:32:19 ◼   ► you can get your heart rate pretty elevated,

01:32:21 ◼   ► but you know, curling is like it goes in cycles

01:32:23 ◼   ► and you're shooting and then you're sweeping.

01:32:26 ◼   ► And it is not set to, it keeps asking me like between ends,

01:32:31 ◼   ► like, are you done curling now?

01:32:32 ◼   ► I was like, no, I'm not done.

01:32:34 ◼   ► It's just, I'm not, it's not like running.

01:32:36 ◼   ► It's not like I'm sprinting all the time,

01:32:38 ◼   ► but I'm still doing it.

01:32:39 ◼   ► And they should tweak that a little bit

01:32:40 ◼   ► for all the people who use the curling workout,

01:32:42 ◼   ► which I get a kick out of,

01:32:44 ◼   ► 'cause it's hilarious to use the curling workout

01:32:46 ◼   ► on the Apple Watch.

01:32:47 ◼   ► But anyway, I don't have--

01:32:50 ◼   ► that's about it.

01:32:52 ◼   ► I very rarely get something other than the false negatives

01:32:57 ◼   ► of "are you done?"

01:32:58 ◼   ► And I wish it was better at doing the, you know,

01:33:01 ◼   ► "I figured out that you were taking a walk,

01:33:03 ◼   ► so I logged it for you" thing.

01:33:04 ◼   ► But it often misses it until it's, like, way too late.

01:33:09 ◼   ► -I had one that Adina had one the other day,

01:33:10 ◼   ► which was intriguing.

01:33:12 ◼   ► It was a big problem, which was funny.

01:33:14 ◼   ► We were outside.

01:33:15 ◼   ► we were walking somewhere and it said it looks like you're walking indoors would you like

01:33:19 ◼   ► to record an indoor workout and I'm not sure how it got that one messed up you know like

01:33:25 ◼   ► what what was so different about an indoor and outdoor walk and why did it get those

01:33:29 ◼   ► wrong that was just weird for me washing dishes I get the hand washing thing a lot obviously

01:33:36 ◼   ► right that one kind of makes sense one that really annoyed me for a while you know it

01:33:42 ◼   ► has the noise detection one, you know like, oh, you're in a loud environment. I had this

01:33:47 ◼   ► on for a while, so that would be good, you know, I would like to know if I'm in places

01:33:52 ◼   ► which are bad for my ears, right? Maybe I could do something about them. But it would

01:33:57 ◼   ► trigger every time I used a hand dryer. And I found that to be particularly frustrating

01:34:03 ◼   ► considering you knew I just washed my hands because I used the hand washing thing. So

01:34:08 ◼   ► So I feel like a natural thing to do is if someone has washed their hands don't worry

01:34:15 ◼   ► about the noise detection for the next minute because they're going to be using a hand dryer.

01:34:21 ◼   ► So it's the air blowing into the microphone, right?

01:34:24 ◼   ► Makes them think it's super loud or just because they are loud and I just found that to be

01:34:30 ◼   ► really annoying every time.

01:34:31 ◼   ► It's like "Oh you're in a loud environment!"

01:34:33 ◼   ► No I'm not, I'm not, I'm not.

01:34:35 ◼   ► I just dry my hands, that's all.

01:34:38 ◼   ► Veej asks, "I had an operation yesterday. I hope you're okay, Yig."

01:34:43 ◼   ► Veej, I really hope you're okay.

01:34:45 ◼   ► "I woke up this morning and my Apple Watch was bugging me about completing my rings since I hadn't yesterday.

01:34:52 ◼   ► I am of course going to be taking a rest day today and probably tomorrow.

01:34:57 ◼   ► Shouldn't that be an option Apple gives you?"

01:35:00 ◼   ► Yes.

01:35:01 ◼   ► Yeah, I have several friends who use the, are committed to closing their rings, who have complained about this.

01:35:07 ◼   ► - Please let me invite you to the idea of coronavirus,

01:35:12 ◼   ► which is a thing that many of us are having.

01:35:15 ◼   ► - Also, I think the idea streaks in general.

01:35:19 ◼   ► I think streak forgiveness is a thing that should happen,

01:35:22 ◼   ► that sometimes there's like, oh,

01:35:24 ◼   ► you've gone 22 straight days and like, you know what?

01:35:28 ◼   ► Not every day is gonna be for this.

01:35:30 ◼   ► I get the idea of wanting to motivate you,

01:35:32 ◼   ► but having the ability as a human being to be like,

01:35:34 ◼   ► no, today is my break day because you don't know.

01:35:37 ◼   ► I had an operation or I'm sick or whatever it is.

01:35:41 ◼   ► And I'm not saying you should be able to skip three weeks

01:35:46 ◼   ► and have it keep your streak, right?

01:35:47 ◼   ► That doesn't make sense.

01:35:48 ◼   ► But the idea of a rest day

01:35:50 ◼   ► and programming a rest day in potentially,

01:35:52 ◼   ► or saying, no, this is my rest day,

01:35:53 ◼   ► I'm not gonna go for a run today, that would be helpful.

01:35:57 ◼   ► Yeah, I had that related.

01:36:00 ◼   ► I had that where I, okay, long story short,

01:36:03 ◼   ► everything's fine.

01:36:04 ◼   ► This was like a month ago.

01:36:05 ◼   ► I was running and I fell and I bruised my ribs.

01:36:08 ◼   ► It sucks, they still hurt.

01:36:11 ◼   ► But the next day as I'm icing and heating and icing

01:36:16 ◼   ► and taking as many pain, you know, as much Tylenol

01:36:20 ◼   ► and Advil as I'm allowed to take

01:36:22 ◼   ► and I'm sitting there not doing anything,

01:36:24 ◼   ► my Apple Watch is like,

01:36:26 ◼   ► you seem to be getting a slow start on the day.

01:36:28 ◼   ► You can still do it.

01:36:30 ◼   ► And I'm like, shut up Apple Watch.

01:36:32 ◼   ► Like, and there's no way, and I get it, I get it,

01:36:34 ◼   ► It's software.

01:36:35 ◼   ► All it can do is what it can do

01:36:37 ◼   ► 'cause it's dumb and it's software.

01:36:39 ◼   ► But there are cases where you kind of want the human touch.

01:36:41 ◼   ► You kind of want to say like,

01:36:43 ◼   ► I'm not going to be active today and let it be like,

01:36:46 ◼   ► okay, I'll check in with you tomorrow.

01:36:48 ◼   ► And I know from especially active people I know

01:36:51 ◼   ► that the drive to do it every day,

01:36:54 ◼   ► like it can be good as a motivator.

01:36:57 ◼   ► It can also run into these moments where it's like,

01:36:59 ◼   ► you know what?

01:37:01 ◼   ► It's not appropriate today.

01:37:02 ◼   ► Let's take this as a skip day.

01:37:03 ◼   ► and it's okay and we'll give you a skip day.

01:37:06 ◼   ► We're gonna keep your streaks alive.

01:37:07 ◼   ► It's okay because you're only human

01:37:12 ◼   ► and you might not wanna do it every day.

01:37:14 ◼   ► - This isn't like some official global competition

01:37:17 ◼   ► we're doing.

01:37:17 ◼   ► This is just for me.

01:37:19 ◼   ► Like if I give myself a day

01:37:22 ◼   ► and it tells me I still kept my streak going,

01:37:25 ◼   ► nothing's affected.

01:37:26 ◼   ► Like it's just for me.

01:37:28 ◼   ► So why can't I do that?

01:37:30 ◼   ► Like I lost my longest move streak

01:37:33 ◼   ► because I was on a transatlantic flight.

01:37:35 ◼   ► - Right.

01:37:37 ◼   ► - I flew, I took like a, you know,

01:37:40 ◼   ► like I flew from California, I think.

01:37:42 ◼   ► Yeah, I flew from California.

01:37:44 ◼   ► And by the time that I landed, it reset to the next day

01:37:48 ◼   ► and I didn't have enough time in the day

01:37:50 ◼   ► to accumulate the rest of my streak points,

01:37:53 ◼   ► even though I tried.

01:37:54 ◼   ► So, you know, like now, you know,

01:37:56 ◼   ► they do that calculation and they recalculate it all.

01:38:00 ◼   ► Ah, that annoys me too,

01:38:01 ◼   ► the way that they do the calculation of date math when you like they recalculate all the

01:38:06 ◼   ► points and assign them to the other days rather than split.

01:38:09 ◼   ► Yeah it's annoying, I find it really annoying.

01:38:10 ◼   ► But anyway they should have a rest day option and honestly I can't believe they haven't

01:38:13 ◼   ► done it by now.

01:38:14 ◼   ► It's just not healthy like in my opinion.

01:38:17 ◼   ► Push people all the time.

01:38:19 ◼   ► Anyway Wes asks, "Is there any news on how the new shared photo library will treat our

01:38:25 ◼   ► cloud family storage?

01:38:27 ◼   ► each library have its own copy of a photo taking doubled space or is there going to

01:38:32 ◼   ► be like linked against the same photo? Do you know any of this stuff right now? Does anybody?

01:38:35 ◼   ► Uh yeah the person who creates the iCloud family shared library it goes toward their space.

01:38:41 ◼   ► It doesn't double up if you're on a family plan or whatever or even sharing with somebody who's not

01:38:46 ◼   ► in a family. Their space doesn't get charged, you get charged for all the photos that are placed in

01:38:51 ◼   ► in the shared library.

01:38:52 ◼   ► It doesn't, will each library have its own copy of a photo?

01:38:58 ◼   ► No, there are two libraries.

01:39:00 ◼   ► There's the shared and the not shared.

01:39:02 ◼   ► And so you can view them all individually

01:39:05 ◼   ► or you can view them merged, but they're not doubling.

01:39:09 ◼   ► They're in one or they're in the other.

01:39:11 ◼   ► - So can you help me understand this a bit more?

01:39:13 ◼   ► So let's imagine we're a family

01:39:15 ◼   ► and you've created the shared library.

01:39:20 ◼   ► - If I wanna contribute things that are shared library,

01:39:24 ◼   ► do I have to like push them to the library?

01:39:27 ◼   ► But then it counts on your storage

01:39:29 ◼   ► for everybody else in the family.

01:39:32 ◼   ► - Yeah, it counts on my storage.

01:39:33 ◼   ► - Okay.

01:39:34 ◼   ► - I mean, it's family, it's all shared,

01:39:35 ◼   ► so it doesn't matter.

01:39:36 ◼   ► But if we're not in a family together,

01:39:37 ◼   ► which you and I aren't,

01:39:38 ◼   ► and yet we decide we're the ones

01:39:40 ◼   ► who are gonna share the library,

01:39:41 ◼   ► I believe even when you move those photos

01:39:43 ◼   ► into the shared library,

01:39:45 ◼   ► they go off of your ledger and onto mine.

01:39:47 ◼   ► - Oh, okay.

01:39:49 ◼   ► - That's how that works.

01:39:50 ◼   ► - Okay.

01:39:51 ◼   ► - I think that's how it works.

01:39:51 ◼   ► - I have another question about iCloud shared photo

01:39:54 ◼   ► libraries from Florian.

01:39:55 ◼   ► Do you know if it's gonna support full image quality?

01:39:59 ◼   ► - Yes.

01:40:01 ◼   ► This is a full straight up iCloud photo library.

01:40:04 ◼   ► So it's full image quality.

01:40:05 ◼   ► It's not like the old shared libraries

01:40:07 ◼   ► that were kind of like partial.

01:40:08 ◼   ► - Or photo stream.

01:40:10 ◼   ► That was like a thing.

01:40:11 ◼   ► You remember that?

01:40:12 ◼   ► - There was photo stream and camera roll,

01:40:14 ◼   ► camera roll, photo stream.

01:40:16 ◼   ► And then the current sharing, which is,

01:40:19 ◼   ► If you, it's complicated.

01:40:22 ◼   ► There are some sharings where it is reduced

01:40:24 ◼   ► and there are some sharings where it's not,