419: Modemtown
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From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, Episode 419.
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Today's show is brought to you by Sourcegraph, Hover, and CleanMyMac X.
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My name is Myke Hurley and I am joined by Jason Snell. Hi, Jason Snell.
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Hi, Myke Hurley.
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I have a #SnellTalk question for you.
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- All right.
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- Comes from instantiate this and they asks,
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if you were in a car chase with the police,
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what song do you put on to keep you going?
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- Interesting premise.
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Again, I will say I choose to interpret this
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as that I am chasing the police because they're bad police
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or I'm teaming up with the police to chase bad people.
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- Is this Sting or not Sting?
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Different police.
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- Oh, I love that.
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So we're in a car chase.
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The bank robbers are getting away,
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but I'm driving and Sting is in the passenger seat.
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And Stewart Copeland and Andy Summers are in the back seat.
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- They're gonna complain.
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Well, yeah, I should really put on, you know,
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every breath you take at that point or something
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'cause they're gonna be like,
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oh, actually, no, they don't wanna hear it.
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They've heard it too many times.
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My funny answer that I thought of as part of this,
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of course, is to lean on the Beverly Hills cop.
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I immediately thought, "Well, the heat is on by Glenn Frey is the perfect answer here,"
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because every 80s car chase was basically "the heat is on."
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And if instantiate this as actually something that wants to get me kind of pumped, it would
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be probably from the Bob Mould catalog, like the "Aqui-Act by Sugar," or maybe "Something
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I Learned Today" by Husker Du, something that's really loud and shouty and is going to get
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me pumped up to drive that car and do whatever with the police that will happen next. Probably
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an impromptu concert at a coffee house after we catch the bad guy. There'll be like a fruit
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cart will be overturned, a fire hydrant will be clipped, water will be spewing up, but
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the bad guy will be led away by the cops and the police and I will be hanging out in front
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of a coffee house next to the fire hydrant and playing a message in a bottle.
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What about "Born to be Wild"? It feels like a good one. Maybe overplayed.
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Not my style. I'm going to go with the punky "Hoosker Doo" sugar kind of stuff.
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If you would like to send in a question for us to open an episode of Up Green, as you
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can tell, we could answer just about anything. Send out a tweet with the hashtag #snowtalk,
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use question mark "snowtalk" in the Relay FM members discord, which is something that
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get access to if you subscribe to Upgrade Plus. Go to GetUpgradePlus.com and you will
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be able to sign up for $5 a month if you do those a year. You get tons of great benefits
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like access to RelayFam members Discord, I think primarily for Upgrade Plus. You get
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extra content. This time you will hear us, well you will hear Jason talk me through setting
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up a complex shortcut for podcast editing notes. That's what we do on Upgrade Plus today.
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If you wonder what on earth does that mean, go to getocoplast.com.
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Jason, it seems to me like there is an awful lot of stuff going on with HBO and Discovery
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right now, because I see people talking about it a lot.
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Yes, there's a lot of misinformation, a lot of accurate information, lots going on.
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And I want to know in advance of this, will you be talking about this on the next downstream?
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Well, only the downstream show document will know that for sure, and I am working on that
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later today because we record tomorrow. But yeah, it may be entirely what we talk about
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next time on there is what is going on with Warner Brothers Discovery and what's happening
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with HBO Max and what is David Zaslav doing over there. And I saw, what was it, John Oliver
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last night said, "I get the distinct impression that my network is being burned down for the
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insurance money."
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I feel like there were sometimes these things happen and I'm like, "Only Julia can explain
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this to me." You know? And so, all right, I'm looking forward to it because I've been
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I've seen a lot of spread, like some slides going around to it, and I don't really understand
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what's happening.
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Oh, the slides are a thing to behold.
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There is one slide in particular involving an arrow that goes into like a box and that
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explains that it's like streaming and it's like, okay?
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But yeah, there's some amazing...
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I'll just say, I feel like listening to the call about financials where they're trying
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to talk to the money people. It's a lot like Apple stuff, right? You gotta filter it through
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the fact that they're talking to the money people. They're talking to the investors,
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they're talking to Wall Street, they know that they've got a big debt, what are they
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gonna do, what's their strategy, what happens to the stock price, and of course the CEO
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wants the stock price to go up and not down, so he's gonna spin everything he's doing in
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that call for Wall Street and speak the language that they understand, which is incomprehensible
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PowerPoint slides. So that's not quite, so yes, the creative side and the consumer side
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will take the wrong message away from that and he's going to have to deal with the fallout
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of that. But they were speaking a different message to Wall Street than they're going
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to speak to the creators of the stuff that they're doing. But still there's a lot, I
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feel like it's simultaneously what they're doing is overstated in terms of how terrible
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it is, and yet on another level accurate. So we'll see what Julius says.
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Yep, so you can go to relay.fm/downstream and that's where you'll go to get that
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wonderful podcast and you'll hear more about it.
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Alright, some follow up. We did follow up. Now I have follow up. So we had spoken about
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Apple ditching their plans to create their own modems, right? We were talking about they
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they were having a bunch of problems with that?
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- I mean, they're delaying, right?
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- Delaying, sorry, yes.
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- The whole Intel business and all of that,
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and they've been working on it,
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but there was that report that said,
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I think Ming-Chi Kuo was saying,
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"It's not gonna be in next year's iPhones."
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They've had to push it back.
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They were hoping to get it in next year's iPhones,
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didn't happen, they're gonna have to use Qualcomm parts
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for that, and their Apple-built 5G stuff
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is gonna have to come later.
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- Well, it seems that they are still very committed
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to this idea in new and wonderful ways.
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They've just purchased 67 acres of land from HP,
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which is funny 'cause I think Apple Park
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was built on HP land as well, which is just kind of funny.
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- It was formerly HP, yeah.
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- So they bought 67 acres of land from HP
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to build new facilities north of San Diego.
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And the expectation is this is going to be for modems
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because apparently this is modem town, Qualcomm is around.
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- Yeah, well, Qualcomm is in San Diego.
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They're just north of San Diego.
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And this is a little further north of downtown San Diego,
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but it's in the vicinity.
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The idea here is this is where,
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it's a little like when they were doing their,
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starting to investigate car stuff,
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they set up offices in Waterloo, Ontario,
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right next to QNX and Blackberry,
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because when you're hiring away people
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from the competition to build something,
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it's awfully nice if you've got a facility right next to them
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so they don't have to uproot their family.
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And so Apple has continued with what I believe Intel did
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originally, which is if you're gonna be Qualcomm
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and you're gonna beat Qualcomm,
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you gotta set up shop in San Diego
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'cause that's where Qualcomm is.
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- Yep. - Good place.
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Who would wanna leave San Diego?
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I think that's the bigger point there is
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who would wanna actually leave San Diego for anywhere else?
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I mean, I did, but I graduated from college
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and had to get a job, but otherwise I would not have left
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because it's great. So more Apple. I love that they had a press release that's like,
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"Oh, Apple's been a part of San Diego for several decades." And when I was in college,
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there was a big building not too far away from our college campus that had a big rainbow
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Apple logo at the top of it. Apple has been a part of it. I don't know what was in it
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at that point. But yeah, Apple's been in San Diego for a very long time, on and off at
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least. And so, yeah, they're expanding. Keep in mind, they already have space. I don't
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I don't know if they're gonna leave that space or what,
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but they're in Mira Mesa where Qualcomm is,
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but they're doing this.
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So good job, San Diego people.
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We got some Apple there.
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- There are also some more hints of always on screens code
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being found in the latest Xcode beta,
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potentially for the next iPhones.
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Steve Moser uncovered some evidence of lock screen widgets
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changing their appearance.
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So they're dimmed or like color is removed from them.
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- Yeah, this is, and what's really interesting about this
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is, and then also like the clownfish
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has a different appearance.
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And I initially thought that this was the dimming.
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'Cause when you put, when a phone goes into sleep mode,
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it does dim everything.
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But what's interesting is the dimmed media files
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that people are finding are not what is displayed
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in sleep mode.
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They're different, which is weird.
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Like the clownfish image in sleep mode,
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it looks like is just, it's got an opacity,
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you know, in front of it, 20% or whatever,
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where it's dimmed.
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Whereas this dimmed clownfish,
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like doesn't have the colors removed from it,
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a very specific kind of color profile.
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So it looks very much like what we already suspected,
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which is Apple is working on all the assets
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to make it so that there is an additional mode
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that would presumably be the always on mode,
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where it dims itself and the color drops out
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and the brightness drops out,
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but you can still see it in a kind of high contrast way
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on the OLED display of the new iPhones.
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- Jason, I wanted to talk a little bit more
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about the MacBook Air,
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because I mean, I think I referenced this.
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I have one for a couple of weeks that Apple sent me.
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I now have my own,
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and I wanted to give a little bit more about,
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a little more of my thoughts about that whole experience
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and why I have decided to own a MacBook Air of my own.
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- That's nice.
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the record I got my purchased midnight MacBook Air last week as well. So we both got a midnight
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MacBook Air in our lives now. Well look at us. Mm-hmm. Fingerprint pals. Yeah the midnight.
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Midnight, look here's the thing I'll start with that right. I think it's the best color.
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Yeah oh yeah. So I wanted it. Yeah yeah and does it show you does it show fingerprints?
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Yeah, it absolutely does. I don't care that my old black MacBook showed fingerprints, too
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I don't care it is different from all the other Mac laptops. It looks different. It looks really nice
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I like it when it looks black and I just had this happen in my house where I showed it to Lauren and I said
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I said look it's actually blue, but it looks black and she's like it just is black like okay
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But I'm telling you and she's like no, it's just black
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I'm like, alright
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so I lay it down and then it's like the next day and the light is different coming into the room and all that and
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And she's sitting on the couch looking at the coffee table
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where it's sitting and she goes, "Oh, it is blue."
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- Yeah. - Like, yep.
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That's the color of this Mac. - I like that.
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- This MacBook Air is that it's black
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until you realize that it's actually blue,
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but only a little bit.
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It's yeah, it looks great. - Until it's black again.
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- And when it's open and it's just all the whole dark,
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the dark keys and the dark surface and the dark screen
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and the dark bezels, like, it looks really nice.
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I like it a lot.
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- So the one that Apple sent me
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was the 8GB of RAM model and I was thinking this was going to be potentially problematic
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because I had some issues with the original MacBook Pro and it had 16GB of RAM and it
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ran out of memory a lot. I think I was talking about that at the time. But my iMac never
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did it but I thought maybe this would and I didn't have any issues with that at all.
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I expect that the swap was doing its job pretty well.
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Because I was using a variety of apps, like open all the time.
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I have tons of apps open, I should leave them open, why not leave them open.
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It was doing a good enough job but it was maxing out I could see.
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And so for mine I got 24GB of RAM in my MacBook Air because I just want to not think about
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it for years.
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It's just going to have what it has and it's going to run its course.
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Now for me with this computer, I am doing the majority of my work on it.
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So we're talking just general work stuff, email, calendars, notes, research, I do stuff
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with Photoshop, Pixelmator, all of the stuff that's basically everything that I may possibly
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do that isn't recording or editing a podcast will be done on MacBook Air.
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It's previously been done on my Macbook Pro and then my iMac was my recording and editing computer.
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And I thought, "I'm just going to go head first into this Macbook Air and just see what it can
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handle." I couldn't tell any difference between it and my Macbook Pro. I just couldn't. If I wanted
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to do something audio editing wise, sure I'd see the difference. But I don't do anything there.
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Like if I want to start crunching on a file and converting an MP3 or whatever, I'm going to see it
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But I'm not doing any of that here.
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And so where I'm usually using this computer for the vast majority of its time
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is plugged into my studio display.
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So the computer's closed, studio display is on, and I'm doing my thing.
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When I use it as a laptop, there are a few things that I notice that are different.
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One, the biggest thing for me is the screen brightness.
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Really notice that compared to my MacBook Pro.
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I don't notice the ProMotion very much.
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I don't really know how well that is possible to see on a MacBook Pro anyway.
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I know at first it was a bit shaky as to where you'd actually see the higher refresh rate on a Mac.
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I'd see it on my iPhone still and I love it on my iPhone.
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I think I've found that the bigger a display gets, maybe the less visible that becomes.
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I don't know why, but that seems to have been a thing for me.
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But the brightness is where I definitely see a huge difference.
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the MacBook Air just can't get to what the MacBook Pro can.
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- No, it's half, I mean, it's half.
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Somebody was saying on,
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I don't even remember what podcast this was,
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that they like to work outside and the MacBook Pro,
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like you can work outside and see everything clearly
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because it goes so bright.
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And the MacBook Air, I have not had a problem with it,
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but again, this is the thing of like,
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if you always use a MacBook Air,
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you internalize what the brightness of the MacBook Air is
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and you just think,
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"Oh, well, this is how bright laptops get."
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And then you use the MacBook Pro and you realize,
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oh no, no, this is twice as bright as that one is.
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And in certain circumstances,
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you can just crank up the brightness
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and blast away any of the glare that's coming from the sun
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and bouncing off objects while you're outside.
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And it just, I was thinking about this the other day
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when it might've been when we were talking
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about the MacBook Air compared to the MacBook Pro.
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And I thought we could talk about the chips
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and we can talk about the slots and the ports.
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But I think the real, like, most important difference
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between them is the screen, right?
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Because of the brightness and the pro motion.
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Like, it is the biggest upgrade you get
00:15:50
◼
►
when you go from the Air to the Pro.
00:15:52
◼
►
The big pros, not the 13, 'cause don't get that one.
00:15:56
◼
►
- Yeah, before you start
00:15:57
◼
►
with all the configurations available.
00:15:59
◼
►
But like, it's the thing that every owner's gonna see, right?
00:16:04
◼
►
is the screen, no matter what configuration you go for.
00:16:07
◼
►
- And you know, chip differences are gonna be
00:16:09
◼
►
speed at certain tasks,
00:16:12
◼
►
and the port differences are convenience,
00:16:13
◼
►
and they're real.
00:16:14
◼
►
I'm not saying that those aren't differences,
00:16:16
◼
►
I'm just saying you're staring at the screen all the time,
00:16:19
◼
►
and on the Pro systems, you are getting it.
00:16:21
◼
►
I mean, we're talking about the Air here, not the Pro,
00:16:22
◼
►
but just saying, I don't miss the ProMotion
00:16:25
◼
►
and the brightness, but they are real,
00:16:28
◼
►
they do make a difference, and they're not on the Air,
00:16:31
◼
►
and that's one of the things you give up
00:16:32
◼
►
to get the smaller, lighter, cheaper laptop.
00:16:35
◼
►
- So one of the biggest things for me,
00:16:38
◼
►
I think it was actually the biggest thing
00:16:40
◼
►
as to why I decided I wanted to have one of these machines,
00:16:44
◼
►
is how good it is at being a laptop.
00:16:48
◼
►
It is the most laptop-y laptop I've ever used
00:16:51
◼
►
in its lightness, its thinness.
00:16:54
◼
►
Like I take my laptop home with me every day
00:16:58
◼
►
and bring it back to the studio every day.
00:17:00
◼
►
I do it so I always have a Mac
00:17:01
◼
►
where my computer, if I ever need it at home,
00:17:04
◼
►
sometimes I do, sometimes something might happen.
00:17:07
◼
►
I have that kind of job where it could be 10 p.m. at night
00:17:09
◼
►
and someone needs me for something,
00:17:10
◼
►
and the easiest thing for me to do is grab my laptop.
00:17:13
◼
►
So I like to just have it with me.
00:17:15
◼
►
And I could not get over,
00:17:17
◼
►
during the couple of weeks that I was using it,
00:17:20
◼
►
just how much easier it is to pick it up and move it around.
00:17:23
◼
►
And this sounds like such a simple kind of glib kind of thing
00:17:28
◼
►
and why is this important?
00:17:29
◼
►
Well, it's a laptop, it's meant to be moved.
00:17:33
◼
►
And the fact of just how much thinner and lighter it was
00:17:37
◼
►
than the MacBook Pro that I was using,
00:17:39
◼
►
it just made a noticeable,
00:17:43
◼
►
like positive difference every single day for me.
00:17:46
◼
►
Like it is way closer to an iPad
00:17:49
◼
►
in the way it feels in your hands,
00:17:52
◼
►
when closed especially than a Mac.
00:17:55
◼
►
Especially like if you have like an iPad
00:17:56
◼
►
and a Magic keyboard, like 12.9 inch iPad
00:17:59
◼
►
and the magic people.
00:18:00
◼
►
It's basically the same.
00:18:01
◼
►
And that was just an incredible thing for me.
00:18:04
◼
►
And it was just like, right, okay,
00:18:06
◼
►
I know I want this to be my daily computer
00:18:10
◼
►
because it's just doing what I want,
00:18:13
◼
►
everything I want it to do from a power perspective,
00:18:15
◼
►
from a capability perspective,
00:18:16
◼
►
but in a much better form factor for what I need.
00:18:20
◼
►
So I'm now living the two-laptop lifestyle
00:18:24
◼
►
here in the studio.
00:18:26
◼
►
So I now am using a MacBook Air,
00:18:29
◼
►
I've got one terabyte SSD, 24 gigabytes of RAM,
00:18:32
◼
►
that's my daily driver laptop.
00:18:34
◼
►
My MacBook Pro is taking the spot of my M1 iMac.
00:18:39
◼
►
I did this today, I switched it all over today.
00:18:43
◼
►
So I now have MacBook Pro plugged into two displays.
00:18:47
◼
►
I have a Dell display that I've used for ages on the side,
00:18:50
◼
►
which is where I put all my audio hijack stuff.
00:18:52
◼
►
So it's always visible when I'm recording.
00:18:54
◼
►
all the recording tools are over there,
00:18:56
◼
►
and I can just look at them and I can see the time,
00:18:58
◼
►
I can see everything's running, it's always there.
00:19:00
◼
►
And then I have the LG monitor that I used to use
00:19:04
◼
►
before my studio display.
00:19:06
◼
►
This LG monitor is way too big.
00:19:08
◼
►
It's like 32 inches, it's way too big,
00:19:11
◼
►
it's way too close to me here,
00:19:13
◼
►
but I wanna test all of this out
00:19:15
◼
►
before I even consider getting another studio display.
00:19:20
◼
►
- And considering the fact that we're coming up to September,
00:19:23
◼
►
which is always an expensive time.
00:19:25
◼
►
I don't want to be buying another studio to spare right now.
00:19:27
◼
►
So I'm just going to live with this for a while
00:19:28
◼
►
and see how I feel.
00:19:30
◼
►
Because also I've had really inconsistent experiences
00:19:34
◼
►
of laptops plugged in all the time, right?
00:19:36
◼
►
That like, do they connect?
00:19:37
◼
►
Do they not connect?
00:19:38
◼
►
So I've got it running.
00:19:39
◼
►
Also the desk is all not right.
00:19:41
◼
►
I need to completely reorganize my desk
00:19:44
◼
►
to deal with this different layout.
00:19:46
◼
►
And like, I just have to,
00:19:47
◼
►
the laptop is just sitting in front of me
00:19:49
◼
►
on a little stand that I used to put my iMac
00:19:53
◼
►
on top of, right?
00:19:54
◼
►
So it would be your eye height, but it's like super ugly.
00:19:56
◼
►
There's cables coming out of it.
00:19:57
◼
►
It's like, I don't like it.
00:19:58
◼
►
I have one of those 12 South book stand things,
00:20:02
◼
►
whatever they call it.
00:20:04
◼
►
- Book ark, yeah.
00:20:05
◼
►
But I just don't have anywhere to put that yet.
00:20:07
◼
►
It's like, I've got to redo this entire desk,
00:20:09
◼
►
but I'm not doing that until I'm sure of this.
00:20:12
◼
►
Now, the reason I've done this,
00:20:14
◼
►
and also I will say my desk does not feel as happy
00:20:17
◼
►
as a place to be.
00:20:18
◼
►
We've got that beautiful yellow computer looking at me.
00:20:20
◼
►
I will say that.
00:20:21
◼
►
I sat down to record today Jason and it was like oh this feels sad like this is ugly lg
00:20:27
◼
►
like it's not ugly it's fine it's like all black right the monitors like all the bezels are black
00:20:32
◼
►
and it just doesn't feel as colorful in here but now I will be able to benefit from having an M1
00:20:39
◼
►
max powered machine and I know it's going to be ripping through anything that I need to do
00:20:46
◼
►
processing wise. I will say there is this other part of it which is like well not
00:20:50
◼
►
actually editing as many podcasts as I used to but that's like a whole other
00:20:54
◼
►
thing to think about for a future time. So the plan is to think about I'm
00:21:00
◼
►
going to try this out for a couple of weeks I think of these two laptops where
00:21:02
◼
►
the MacBook Pro is essentially sitting here as an Mac studio right that's kind
00:21:09
◼
►
of how I'm treating it. But my kind of future that I imagine is
00:21:16
◼
►
If I need to travel for work and record I will just take the MacBook Pro
00:21:21
◼
►
because I know it is all ready and all set up with the most power possible to
00:21:26
◼
►
get my podcast recording done. Which you may think that sounds
00:21:30
◼
►
counterintuitive if you're taking a heavier laptop with you while you're
00:21:32
◼
►
traveling but when I'm traveling say across the Atlantic my backpacks already
00:21:37
◼
►
too heavy with all other kinds of stuff I've got in it anyway so I'll just take the
00:21:40
◼
►
MacBook Pro. But we'll see my M1 iMac it's gonna stay here for a little bit
00:21:45
◼
►
until I finally made this decision,
00:21:47
◼
►
and then it's gonna go home,
00:21:49
◼
►
and it's gonna be a beautiful family home computer.
00:21:52
◼
►
You're gonna get to do what Apple does
00:21:54
◼
►
in all of its promo shots,
00:21:55
◼
►
which is put a lovingly detailed home setup with an iMac,
00:22:00
◼
►
a nice yellow iMac in the center of it.
00:22:02
◼
►
- And it could be,
00:22:03
◼
►
I was originally thinking,
00:22:05
◼
►
"Oh, I don't wanna have a kitchen computer,"
00:22:08
◼
►
but I actually think
00:22:09
◼
►
it could be a really nice kitchen computer,
00:22:11
◼
►
'cause I was thinking,
00:22:12
◼
►
"Maybe we'd want a small television screen in the kitchen,
00:22:15
◼
►
and this could also be that, right?
00:22:16
◼
►
So maybe, we'll see how that goes in the future for me.
00:22:19
◼
►
But yeah, I'm just really struck by
00:22:24
◼
►
how excellent a computer the MacBook Air is.
00:22:27
◼
►
I just think it's fantastic.
00:22:30
◼
►
I think it's, for me, easily taking the crown again
00:22:34
◼
►
of the best laptop Apple makes,
00:22:36
◼
►
'cause it's just the right balance of everything, I think.
00:22:41
◼
►
I think it's fantastic.
00:22:43
◼
►
- I think you're right.
00:22:44
◼
►
I saw a note go by on Twitter this weekend
00:22:47
◼
►
from Walt Mossberg, retired, great tech reviewer
00:22:52
◼
►
for many years of "Wall Street Journal"
00:22:53
◼
►
and all things D and all of that.
00:22:56
◼
►
And he said, it drives him crazy
00:23:00
◼
►
that there are all of these reviews of the MacBook Air
00:23:05
◼
►
that talk about power or a lack of power
00:23:09
◼
►
or these incredibly complicated use cases for it
00:23:11
◼
►
when the truth is 99% of people don't use that much power.
00:23:16
◼
►
And I think the truth is, the real truth is
00:23:19
◼
►
that for the last decade,
00:23:21
◼
►
most computers had enough power
00:23:23
◼
►
to serve 90% of the needs of people.
00:23:26
◼
►
I think at this point, the bar has been raised to,
00:23:29
◼
►
and I look back 'cause I was like,
00:23:30
◼
►
"Oh, okay, well, does my review pass the test?"
00:23:32
◼
►
And my review says 99% of people,
00:23:36
◼
►
the bar has been raised so much now
00:23:39
◼
►
that most people can get along just fine
00:23:41
◼
►
with the MacBook Air.
00:23:43
◼
►
One of the things that struck me about this MacBook Air is,
00:23:46
◼
►
you can't, like there's very little you can't do with it.
00:23:51
◼
►
When you hit the wall, you don't really hit the wall,
00:23:55
◼
►
you just slow down and it takes you a while
00:23:58
◼
►
to reach the wall.
00:23:59
◼
►
And that's another thing that's really notable
00:24:01
◼
►
about how much power is in even the MacBook Air.
00:24:04
◼
►
And the M1 MacBook Air is this case too.
00:24:08
◼
►
But now with the M2, even more with like 8K video
00:24:12
◼
►
and different kinds of 4K video,
00:24:13
◼
►
like what you're really giving up is time.
00:24:16
◼
►
I'm sure there are things that require
00:24:18
◼
►
a certain number of like ports.
00:24:19
◼
►
And like, I'm sure you can find those edge cases,
00:24:21
◼
►
but we've reached the point now
00:24:23
◼
►
where you would have to work really hard
00:24:26
◼
►
to find reasons why you absolutely couldn't
00:24:29
◼
►
use a MacBook Air to do your job,
00:24:31
◼
►
whatever your job is, literally whatever your job is.
00:24:34
◼
►
And I'm not saying those edge cases aren't there.
00:24:36
◼
►
And I'm not saying that our listeners
00:24:37
◼
►
aren't the edge cases,
00:24:38
◼
►
'cause our listeners probably are the edge cases,
00:24:40
◼
►
but we've gone from it being like,
00:24:43
◼
►
when it started the computer for 50% of people,
00:24:46
◼
►
to now I think it's the computer for 99% of people.
00:24:49
◼
►
And that if you wanna go,
00:24:50
◼
►
this is why I was saying about the MacBook Pro,
00:24:52
◼
►
if you wanna go to the MacBook Pro,
00:24:54
◼
►
go for the size, go for the ports, go for the screen,
00:24:57
◼
►
or go for the fact that it's so fast,
00:25:00
◼
►
you'll be able to do that work faster
00:25:02
◼
►
and that matters to you.
00:25:03
◼
►
But like you traveling internationally with a MacBook Air,
00:25:07
◼
►
There's nothing that you're going to say, "Oh, I can't do this."
00:25:11
◼
►
You might say, "Oh, this is slow.
00:25:14
◼
►
I'm going to have to wait an extra 10 minutes for this thing to finish."
00:25:17
◼
►
But that's it. It's really remarkable.
00:25:19
◼
►
And it depends on the type.
00:25:22
◼
►
Basically, I'm giving myself the ability to take either of these laptops if I was traveling.
00:25:26
◼
►
So for WWDC, for example, I need speed.
00:25:31
◼
►
I've got to get things done as quickly as possible.
00:25:34
◼
►
but like a regular trip where I might record a show or two
00:25:37
◼
►
while I'm traveling, I'll just take my, okay.
00:25:40
◼
►
So, but I'm gonna be giving myself the flexibility
00:25:42
◼
►
to make the right choice.
00:25:44
◼
►
- Even what speed you need,
00:25:45
◼
►
like if you're not working in 4K video,
00:25:49
◼
►
it will have all the speed you need, it really will.
00:25:52
◼
►
It's that super high end stuff
00:25:55
◼
►
where you're really gonna have it.
00:25:56
◼
►
Or if you're doing like, I mean,
00:25:57
◼
►
my example is always isotope.
00:25:59
◼
►
And I think this goes back to Walt saying about
00:26:01
◼
►
why do all the reviewers talk about these things?
00:26:03
◼
►
To be fair, Apple is also to blame here
00:26:04
◼
►
because Apple brings out a low end MacBook Air,
00:26:08
◼
►
by definition the low end of their product,
00:26:10
◼
►
their laptop line, and says, "Let's talk about 8K video."
00:26:14
◼
►
- Yeah. - Like, really?
00:26:15
◼
►
- And puts that stuff in the chip, right?
00:26:17
◼
►
The video decoding and coding stuff.
00:26:18
◼
►
- Right, and one of the reasons we do that
00:26:21
◼
►
is because we're trying to find the places
00:26:22
◼
►
where this thing falls down.
00:26:23
◼
►
'Cause the fact is, we are all just out there
00:26:25
◼
►
on the edge of the 99% trying to find some use case
00:26:29
◼
►
that it doesn't work.
00:26:29
◼
►
So for me, it's iZotope, and their D Reverb and D Noise
00:26:33
◼
►
plugins and yeah, so the reason I have a Mac studio
00:26:36
◼
►
is because I've got stuff that takes,
00:26:39
◼
►
a job that takes 30 minutes on the MacBook Air
00:26:43
◼
►
and takes 15 minutes on the Mac studio.
00:26:45
◼
►
And for me, sitting there watching the progress bar
00:26:47
◼
►
or going off and doing something else
00:26:50
◼
►
and then coming back and doing the next file,
00:26:51
◼
►
which is another half hour, right?
00:26:53
◼
►
It's better to do that in 10 or 15 minutes,
00:26:55
◼
►
but I could still do it.
00:26:57
◼
►
And that's the most extreme for me that I really get
00:26:59
◼
►
is that kind of stuff.
00:27:01
◼
►
For most stuff, it's the difference between,
00:27:03
◼
►
as I did with my testing, right?
00:27:04
◼
►
It's the difference between,
00:27:05
◼
►
"Oh, that job took a minute 20 instead of a minute 10."
00:27:09
◼
►
Which is, I mean, yeah, it's slower, okay,
00:27:12
◼
►
but not so you'd notice really.
00:27:15
◼
►
And that's what I mean about,
00:27:16
◼
►
I think you could travel with confidence
00:27:18
◼
►
for all that you do with a MacBook Air.
00:27:21
◼
►
You might have to, again,
00:27:22
◼
►
you might have to get like a hub or something, right?
00:27:24
◼
►
There are these issues with the fact
00:27:25
◼
►
that it's only got the two ports,
00:27:27
◼
►
but, and a card reader, if you're doing stuff
00:27:30
◼
►
where you're pulling things off of an SD recorder
00:27:32
◼
►
and all that, there are reasons to get a MacBook Pro.
00:27:34
◼
►
I'm not saying there aren't.
00:27:35
◼
►
I'm just saying that if all you have is a MacBook Air,
00:27:38
◼
►
you could do everything.
00:27:40
◼
►
- I agree. - You really could.
00:27:42
◼
►
- We'll see.
00:27:43
◼
►
- And maybe you will.
00:27:44
◼
►
Also, by the way, I'm gonna give you a,
00:27:46
◼
►
I'm not, this is not a real assignment,
00:27:47
◼
►
but I'm gonna give you a fake assignment,
00:27:50
◼
►
which is to say, you could,
00:27:52
◼
►
now you can replace your streaming PC as well,
00:27:54
◼
►
because, I mean, you probably can't,
00:27:56
◼
►
but I will say OBS just went into beta
00:28:00
◼
►
with their Apple Silicon version
00:28:02
◼
►
that also integrates all of those code changes
00:28:05
◼
►
that the Apple engineers made
00:28:06
◼
►
so that they're using the right APIs
00:28:08
◼
►
for window capture and stuff like that.
00:28:12
◼
►
So I haven't seen any reports about how good this thing is,
00:28:16
◼
►
but I have at least hope
00:28:18
◼
►
that OBS may actually be decent on the Mac again.
00:28:22
◼
►
So something to watch,
00:28:23
◼
►
'cause I know that's a tool that you use for live streaming.
00:28:27
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean, OBS can still be fine,
00:28:29
◼
►
but this is like a bunch of input output stuff
00:28:31
◼
►
that I have way more control of.
00:28:34
◼
►
I mean, having a piece,
00:28:35
◼
►
also what's the difference between having set it up
00:28:36
◼
►
and having to set it up?
00:28:37
◼
►
Like it may be that we're reaching a point
00:28:39
◼
►
where somebody like you looks at and goes,
00:28:41
◼
►
"I don't really need to buy a PC, I can get by."
00:28:44
◼
►
But you already have it.
00:28:45
◼
►
So it's fine.
00:28:46
◼
►
I have managed to never go down that path
00:28:49
◼
►
and I never will because I've got other options
00:28:54
◼
►
but it's nice that OBS is kind of,
00:28:56
◼
►
it seems to have found the plot again on the Mac
00:28:59
◼
►
with Apple Silicon and the new stuff
00:29:02
◼
►
that for those who don't remember,
00:29:04
◼
►
there was a GitHub code contribution from Apple.
00:29:08
◼
►
I think listed as from Apple,
00:29:11
◼
►
but it is using the right APIs on macOS for window capture
00:29:16
◼
►
that it previously wasn't using.
00:29:19
◼
►
It's the screen capture kit API.
00:29:22
◼
►
And so that's encouraging
00:29:25
◼
►
that that app, which is vital for so many people
00:29:29
◼
►
who do video streams, is actually kind of up to speed,
00:29:33
◼
►
or at least theoretically up to speed on macOS,
00:29:35
◼
►
again, with Apple Silicon and Screen Capture Kit support.
00:29:38
◼
►
- This episode is brought to you by Sourcegraph.
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Or just click the link in the show notes to let them know that you heard about them from
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Thanks to Sourcegraph for their support of this show and Relay FM.
00:31:20
◼
►
Rumour round up!
00:31:22
◼
►
Mark Gurman is reporting that Apple is currently preparing and recording the September event,
00:31:28
◼
►
confirming that it will be a continuation of pre-recorded events.
00:31:32
◼
►
This event will feature the iPhone 14 and new Apple Watches with the plan for an October
00:31:37
◼
►
event for new iPads and Macs.
00:31:41
◼
►
there any doubt in your mind that there would be an in-person, like any doubt in your mind
00:31:46
◼
►
about what this event was going to be from in-person, not in-person?
00:31:49
◼
►
Well, at some point, yes. At some point, I thought that they might do this after they
00:31:53
◼
►
did WWDC with the in-person component. I thought that maybe they would feel like they could
00:31:57
◼
►
invite people, but as we've detailed here, the trajectory of the pandemic and the new
00:32:02
◼
►
strains that are more infectious and easily transmittable and like right now, I'm not
00:32:10
◼
►
that surprised that they might do this.
00:32:12
◼
►
I still am thinking it's possible they will do
00:32:15
◼
►
an in-person media event of some kind.
00:32:18
◼
►
- They could do what they did at WWDC,
00:32:20
◼
►
what you just mentioned. - They could.
00:32:21
◼
►
- They could just do the same thing.
00:32:22
◼
►
- They could invite the media and have a small media group
00:32:25
◼
►
and have us sit outside and then do maybe even
00:32:28
◼
►
in Cafe Max or some other kind of like open air location
00:32:31
◼
►
or masked inside something like the Steve Jobs Theater,
00:32:34
◼
►
have the hands-on area.
00:32:35
◼
►
'Cause that would be the one thing
00:32:36
◼
►
that I would still put out there,
00:32:38
◼
►
is this is gonna be a produced show, it absolutely is.
00:32:41
◼
►
Are they gonna have an in-person component?
00:32:43
◼
►
Maybe, but if so, it's gonna be
00:32:45
◼
►
'cause they really want members of the press
00:32:46
◼
►
to come and get their hands on the new hardware.
00:32:48
◼
►
And it's great when you can do that.
00:32:51
◼
►
It's also possible that they'll do something hybrid
00:32:54
◼
►
where they do this event, but they also schedule briefings
00:32:56
◼
►
and maybe some of us in the East and West Coast
00:32:59
◼
►
will get invited to be in New York or Cupertino
00:33:02
◼
►
and get our hands on that way.
00:33:03
◼
►
And you could do that without having a big crowd.
00:33:06
◼
►
So I think there are options there for them to do that.
00:33:09
◼
►
That's what I'm gonna keep watching,
00:33:11
◼
►
but it's not surprising to think
00:33:13
◼
►
that most of this stuff is gonna be,
00:33:14
◼
►
if not all, prerecorded.
00:33:16
◼
►
- So speaking of new iPads,
00:33:19
◼
►
Mac Otakara is reporting from supply chain sources
00:33:23
◼
►
that the new iPad Pro would feature a quote,
00:33:26
◼
►
four pin connector on the top and bottom edges.
00:33:33
◼
►
- I think Smart Connector.
00:33:36
◼
►
That's what I think.
00:33:37
◼
►
I think smart connector, although MagSafe
00:33:38
◼
►
and smart connector are, could be related.
00:33:41
◼
►
I mean, MagSafe is in, it's a little different,
00:33:45
◼
►
but like smart connector can do power transfer,
00:33:47
◼
►
at least at a low level, not a high level, but a low level.
00:33:50
◼
►
Four pin connector on top and bottom edges reads to me
00:33:54
◼
►
like they want to do, this might be a new Apple pencil
00:33:59
◼
►
or it might be the same Apple pencil in a new location.
00:34:02
◼
►
And this might also be for connecting to, you know,
00:34:05
◼
►
a new keyboard and other accessories that way, maybe.
00:34:09
◼
►
Top and bottom seems weird to me
00:34:11
◼
►
because the orientations are exactly the same.
00:34:13
◼
►
- Well, this is why I don't think smart keyboard,
00:34:16
◼
►
like, because, okay, so here's the problem.
00:34:19
◼
►
What's top and what's bottom?
00:34:21
◼
►
As described to the person who heard this,
00:34:26
◼
►
this is where it becomes complicated.
00:34:27
◼
►
- I've been thinking you could do it
00:34:29
◼
►
on two of the side edges
00:34:33
◼
►
so that you can have different orientations
00:34:36
◼
►
that use those things.
00:34:38
◼
►
We're gonna need more information here,
00:34:39
◼
►
but it feels like this is accessory-based
00:34:42
◼
►
and that this is probably smart connector-y in some way.
00:34:46
◼
►
But it's, yeah, I hesitate to go down this path too much
00:34:49
◼
►
because it's so vague and I'm not sure what I'm picturing
00:34:53
◼
►
is essentially the smart connector moved to the sides
00:34:57
◼
►
in place of where the Apple Pencil thing was
00:35:00
◼
►
instead of on the back where it is now.
00:35:02
◼
►
The disadvantage of it being on the back,
00:35:03
◼
►
the advantage of being on the back
00:35:04
◼
►
is that you can put a big thing back there
00:35:06
◼
►
that includes wired in the connections
00:35:09
◼
►
and that's what the smart keyboard does.
00:35:11
◼
►
The disadvantage of it is you have to have
00:35:13
◼
►
a thing back there.
00:35:14
◼
►
Whereas, you know, there are a lot of stands
00:35:17
◼
►
that don't necessarily have a full cover
00:35:19
◼
►
on the back of an iPad.
00:35:21
◼
►
You get access to it on the side.
00:35:23
◼
►
So I could see them moving it,
00:35:26
◼
►
but they would need to redesign everything
00:35:29
◼
►
if they did that.
00:35:30
◼
►
'Cause the back connector feels very much like,
00:35:33
◼
►
Apple put it there as a part of designing the accessory.
00:35:36
◼
►
Like it was made for the accessory.
00:35:39
◼
►
So I don't know.
00:35:40
◼
►
I mean, it's a weird thing,
00:35:42
◼
►
but this is right in line with,
00:35:44
◼
►
I think what we see from Apple with this stuff,
00:35:46
◼
►
which is they change these kind of proprietary things
00:35:50
◼
►
that are on iPads.
00:35:51
◼
►
They change kind of at their own whim
00:35:54
◼
►
if they have a good accessory story that goes around it.
00:35:57
◼
►
And I'm not quite sure what that accessory story is here.
00:36:00
◼
►
and whether it's a redesigned smart keyboard
00:36:02
◼
►
or it's something with the Apple Pencil
00:36:04
◼
►
or it's something completely different,
00:36:06
◼
►
but are they gonna do a kind of like a dock
00:36:09
◼
►
or a desktop-y thing?
00:36:11
◼
►
'Cause now there's external display support.
00:36:14
◼
►
Is it related to charging?
00:36:16
◼
►
I don't know.
00:36:17
◼
►
It's interesting, but so vague.
00:36:19
◼
►
- I don't know about the Magic Keyboard question.
00:36:23
◼
►
I think that design is pretty good
00:36:28
◼
►
and I would be surprised if they iterated on their design after two years.
00:36:35
◼
►
Just like the fundamental design of how the thing works.
00:36:39
◼
►
Because if now the connector is on the top or the bottom, or any of the sides say, that's
00:36:47
◼
►
a new design for the Magic Keyboard.
00:36:50
◼
►
Now it's completely different if it's no longer on the back.
00:36:53
◼
►
So this is why I'm kind of more inclined to think
00:36:57
◼
►
this is some kind of new accessory connector,
00:37:00
◼
►
which also does MagSafe charging.
00:37:03
◼
►
Like that's why I'm leaning on that.
00:37:05
◼
►
I think that there could,
00:37:07
◼
►
or some other accessory or whatever,
00:37:09
◼
►
but the way that the Apple Pencil charges
00:37:12
◼
►
and the way that the Magic Cube
00:37:14
◼
►
will just fundamentally works,
00:37:16
◼
►
I just think those two things
00:37:17
◼
►
feel pretty set to me for a while.
00:37:21
◼
►
- I sort of agree with you,
00:37:22
◼
►
but I'm gonna just make the counterpoint here,
00:37:23
◼
►
which is if Apple thinks that there's a better way
00:37:26
◼
►
to do the smart keyboard, I mean, the magic keyboard
00:37:29
◼
►
that they were not able to do before,
00:37:32
◼
►
they're like, oh yeah, well, you know,
00:37:33
◼
►
we had to cantilever it over and all of that.
00:37:36
◼
►
And the reason they do that is for weight
00:37:37
◼
►
more than anything else.
00:37:38
◼
►
But like, if they think there's a new way to do it,
00:37:40
◼
►
it's not beyond them at all to just say,
00:37:42
◼
►
oh, we've got a new design,
00:37:43
◼
►
so we want the pins to be here.
00:37:46
◼
►
To the designers and the designers are like,
00:37:49
◼
►
all right, okay, I guess we'll do that.
00:37:51
◼
►
So I wouldn't put it past them, but you're right.
00:37:53
◼
►
It is a big step to say,
00:37:54
◼
►
we're gonna change the pencil design,
00:37:55
◼
►
or we're gonna change the Magic Keyboard design.
00:37:58
◼
►
And there have been rumors there
00:37:59
◼
►
about some sort of charging thing.
00:38:01
◼
►
And as the iPad and Mac become more cousins
00:38:06
◼
►
than the iPad and the iPhone, right?
00:38:09
◼
►
Where the iPad is slowly drifting closer to the Mac
00:38:12
◼
►
and away from the iPhone, I feel like.
00:38:15
◼
►
Even though they're based on the same operating system,
00:38:16
◼
►
they're, you know, that's part of the iPad OS thing,
00:38:19
◼
►
as it allows it to drift toward the Mac.
00:38:22
◼
►
And given that MagSafe came back to the Mac,
00:38:25
◼
►
and it's on the iPhone too,
00:38:26
◼
►
but like if you think about MagSafe in Mac terms,
00:38:29
◼
►
it could be, right?
00:38:31
◼
►
It could literally be MagSafe like on the Mac
00:38:36
◼
►
at the bottom and top of the iPad
00:38:39
◼
►
so that you can just pop on a MagSafe connector
00:38:42
◼
►
and charge it, yeah.
00:38:44
◼
►
- Because what I've been thinking about on that one was like-
00:38:48
◼
►
And I just want me, let me be clear here.
00:38:50
◼
►
I think that's the change in orientation you need to have
00:38:54
◼
►
in order to think about MagSafe on the iPad
00:38:56
◼
►
is don't think about it like MagSafe on the iPhone.
00:38:59
◼
►
Think about it like MagSafe on the Mac.
00:39:01
◼
►
And then you look at it and you go,
00:39:03
◼
►
oh, like maybe even the same connector,
00:39:07
◼
►
but if not something like that
00:39:08
◼
►
where there's like a little blob and you go boop
00:39:10
◼
►
and attach it magnetically and it charges the iPad
00:39:13
◼
►
because if it's good enough for the Mac,
00:39:15
◼
►
why not for the iPad?
00:39:16
◼
►
Not, I'm gonna lay my iPad down flat on a big puck
00:39:21
◼
►
and it's gonna charge, different thing.
00:39:23
◼
►
- 'Cause that's why I think it could be MagSafe
00:39:25
◼
►
because it's on the two sides.
00:39:26
◼
►
So then it's even better, right?
00:39:28
◼
►
Where they'd be like, oh, if you want it to charge by USB,
00:39:30
◼
►
you've gotta make sure it's on the,
00:39:32
◼
►
but now with MagSafe, you could just be like, whatever.
00:39:35
◼
►
You just do it, you just do it.
00:39:36
◼
►
It's two different places, right?
00:39:37
◼
►
Like, I don't know, we'll find out.
00:39:40
◼
►
I'm intrigued by it.
00:39:40
◼
►
I'm happy to hear they're doing something though
00:39:43
◼
►
because it means there's maybe an interesting story to tell.
00:39:46
◼
►
- Yeah, yeah, always good to have a,
00:39:48
◼
►
never bet against Apple having an interesting
00:39:50
◼
►
accessory story to tell, especially with an iPad, right?
00:39:53
◼
►
The whole platform from the beginning has been
00:39:56
◼
►
not just about the iPad,
00:39:57
◼
►
but about what accessories they put with it,
00:39:59
◼
►
for logical reasons, right?
00:40:00
◼
►
Because the iPad is, it changes and modifies itself
00:40:03
◼
►
based on what accessories you attach to it.
00:40:05
◼
►
So it's part of the iPad story is the accessories.
00:40:09
◼
►
- Going back to Mark Gurman,
00:40:10
◼
►
Mark is reporting that Apple has two new HomePod products
00:40:14
◼
►
in the works.
00:40:15
◼
►
a new high-end HomePod and an updated HomePod mini. As previously reported, this new high-end
00:40:23
◼
►
HomePod will run the same S8 chip of the future Apple Watch Series 8 and will be closer in
00:40:29
◼
►
terms of size and audio performance to the original HomePod rather than the mini version.
00:40:35
◼
►
Fine. The more interesting part of the report is, there are currently "at least four new
00:40:41
◼
►
smart home devices in its labs but not all will see the light of day. Two of
00:40:47
◼
►
these are a kitchen focused, so there's two, one is a kitchen focused device that
00:40:52
◼
►
is a combo of a speaker and an iPad like screen. Another is a living room device
00:40:57
◼
►
that combines an Apple TV camera and a home pod. Basically my two dream devices.
00:41:03
◼
►
Mm-hmm yeah these and we've talked about them both on upgrade in detail but the
00:41:07
◼
►
idea is one is like an Amazon echo except it's from Apple it's a home pod
00:41:11
◼
►
and an iPad kind of style screen although whether it would run iPad OS or
00:41:15
◼
►
maybe tv OS and it would presumably have a camera and it would be a FaceTime
00:41:20
◼
►
device so a Siri and FaceTime kind of thing in the kitchen that sort of thing
00:41:27
◼
►
and then the other one is the the Apple TV HomePod combo soundbar whatever thing
00:41:33
◼
►
that also does FaceTime, which I'm really interested in that. Like, I agree with you,
00:41:41
◼
►
these are both pretty interesting and I might want both of these. I think, though, that
00:41:51
◼
►
what I really am curious about is how Apple is testing these and trying them out, because
00:41:56
◼
►
it's all in the details, right? I know it's always all in the details. But if you just
00:42:00
◼
►
tell me with no not a lot of details oh Apple's gonna do a thing that you put by
00:42:04
◼
►
your TV and it's got a camera and it's a sound bar and it's an Apple TV and you
00:42:08
◼
►
attach it and it does all those things and it's great it's like a home pod plus
00:42:11
◼
►
Apple TV plus FaceTime camera all together I would say great right but
00:42:16
◼
►
like it's all about the details what does it look like where does it fit
00:42:19
◼
►
what are its features what is it omitting that it's gonna disappoint me
00:42:21
◼
►
like could I could I actually use it I don't know and the kitchen one is the
00:42:25
◼
►
same way like how do you interact with it is it like there's an Apple TV in
00:42:28
◼
►
your kitchen? Or is it like there's an iPad in your kitchen? And you know, how
00:42:32
◼
►
much of it is navigated by voice and how much of it is navigated by touch? Because
00:42:36
◼
►
the Amazon thing I've got in my kitchen, I almost never touch. And when I do, it's
00:42:41
◼
►
because something's gone horribly wrong and I need to bring down the menu or
00:42:45
◼
►
cancel something or go to the settings or something like that. So that's, those
00:42:50
◼
►
are all the questions I've got as well. Okay, great. Mark's talked about these
00:42:54
◼
►
before, they're still floating out there. They're still intriguing. I would like
00:42:59
◼
►
Apple to do both of them because I feel like there's something there, but it may
00:43:04
◼
►
be that, you know, if they don't come to pass it may be because Apple goes
00:43:09
◼
►
through them and goes, "Oh, this just isn't good enough," or "It doesn't make
00:43:13
◼
►
enough sense," but I'm glad that they're investigating them because I think
00:43:17
◼
►
both of them have a lot of potential given all of the features Apple already
00:43:21
◼
►
has in its ecosystem, all the different component parts exist for these
00:43:24
◼
►
products. They just have to put it together in an interesting way that is in a product
00:43:28
◼
►
that is something they could actually sell for a reasonable price so that people actually
00:43:32
◼
►
Mark believes that at least one of these products would launch by the end of 2023 or early 2024.
00:43:39
◼
►
Yeah, don't get, you know, don't put away some money for this for Christmas. It's not
00:43:43
◼
►
gonna happen. 2023 maybe.
00:43:47
◼
►
And Ming-Chi Kuo's released an updated research note for Apple's upcoming headset. Kuo currently
00:43:52
◼
►
expects that Apple will hold an event in January of 2023 to announce the device. I assume this
00:43:58
◼
►
is based on like when manufacture is planned.
00:44:04
◼
►
I don't know, right? This is one of those things where like we wonder like, Kuo's...
00:44:09
◼
►
How does he know?
00:44:10
◼
►
Kuo knows like what's going on on the supply chain. I don't know if that could necessarily
00:44:14
◼
►
tell you when an event's gonna be, but there you go. Guess around that timeframe. And Kuo
00:44:21
◼
►
also expects it to cost now between 2000 to $2,500.
00:44:26
◼
►
That's cheaper than we've heard in the past.
00:44:30
◼
►
- Because of this, it would be a niche device
00:44:31
◼
►
and there is expectations for about one and a half million
00:44:36
◼
►
of them to be shipped in 2023.
00:44:40
◼
►
That's, you know, that's 3 billion in revenue.
00:44:44
◼
►
For wearables, home and accessories, I guess.
00:44:48
◼
►
Put it, slide it in there.
00:44:50
◼
►
niche device. I think we've all expected this for a little while now. And it'll be interesting
00:44:54
◼
►
when this gets announced that for the mainstream media to react and say, Oh my God, I can't
00:44:58
◼
►
believe it. But like, I think it's been clear that Apple's goal with this product is to
00:45:01
◼
►
make something that's up to their standards and they're a little less concerned about
00:45:05
◼
►
the price. And what's interesting is when you see what Meta is doing, you realize they're
00:45:08
◼
►
doing the same thing, right? Which is they raised the price on their low end headset,
00:45:12
◼
►
but they're also working on a high end headset. Cause I think Apple at this point is sort
00:45:17
◼
►
of like, we need to set the bar about where we think that this is a usable product. And
00:45:21
◼
►
then I would assume over time, as the product line goes along, it will come down in price,
00:45:28
◼
►
or at least versions of it will come down in price. Because I think, you know, I know
00:45:32
◼
►
we talk about Apple making a lot of money and not going too far down market, but a $2,000
00:45:36
◼
►
headset, $2,500 headset is probably too much to spur this along. But you start there. And
00:45:45
◼
►
I think you imagine that the supply chain and the parts and all that and your knowledge
00:45:50
◼
►
about it and what sensors you thought were necessary that weren't and all that kind of
00:45:54
◼
►
like leads you down a path where a year or two after that you've got a split product
00:45:58
◼
►
line with a couple different models, one of which is more affordable and you go from there.
00:46:03
◼
►
But yeah, nobody get their hopes up for a $500 Apple headset because that's not going
00:46:08
◼
►
David: This feels somewhat like a learning from the Apple Watch to me kind of like you
00:46:13
◼
►
You can't launch a product and expect it to be the iPhone.
00:46:16
◼
►
It's just not going to happen.
00:46:19
◼
►
Like where you launch this thing and it's just like everyone wants it and it blows the
00:46:23
◼
►
doors off immediately and everyone's losing their minds.
00:46:26
◼
►
What's more likely is you launch a product that is hard to get out there so it's more
00:46:31
◼
►
expensive and then you work out a little bit more of the story based upon how people use
00:46:37
◼
►
it, what developers are adopting it, what developers are doing with it.
00:46:41
◼
►
So then for revision 2, revision 3, you've got a much more concise understanding, right?
00:46:45
◼
►
Because Apple Watch initially, fashion device that can unlock doors for you physically in
00:46:50
◼
►
hotels and it's going to do everything and you're going to talk to your friends by sending
00:46:55
◼
►
them pictures of fish and like all that kind of stuff.
00:46:57
◼
►
And then a couple of versions later it's like, hey, this is a health and fitness device that
00:47:01
◼
►
can also read to you text messages.
00:47:03
◼
►
And you know what?
00:47:04
◼
►
When they work that out, then they started selling way more of them.
00:47:07
◼
►
So I expect this to be somewhat similar and Apple's preparing for that upfront maybe?
00:47:14
◼
►
Because you know, I know this 1.5 million sounds like a lot.
00:47:17
◼
►
It's not a lot for Apple.
00:47:18
◼
►
I think there's a lesson here that's almost maybe like a lesson from the Newton, which
00:47:22
◼
►
is better to, if it's not a good experience below a certain price, don't come out with
00:47:29
◼
►
a bad experience.
00:47:31
◼
►
Like we shipped a lot of it, we sold a lot of them, but everybody hated it, is not something
00:47:35
◼
►
that Apple wants to do strategically, right?
00:47:37
◼
►
was really excited and they spent five, we got the price down to $900 and we got a lot
00:47:41
◼
►
more people to buy it. But because we had to cut it in so many different ways, the experience
00:47:46
◼
►
was bad. I honestly think that Apple's strategy with this product has always been that there
00:47:51
◼
►
is a certain level below which they won't go because they don't think people will accept
00:47:55
◼
►
it as a good product. And so I think their goal is it's going to be too expensive but
00:48:00
◼
►
good. And then the next step after that has to be how do we get it to be less expensive
00:48:06
◼
►
or more necessary so that people wanna buy it.
00:48:09
◼
►
And I think that's gonna take some time.
00:48:12
◼
►
The risk, the counterargument is something like the HomePod,
00:48:15
◼
►
which was too expensive and even though it was good,
00:48:18
◼
►
people kind of rejected it.
00:48:19
◼
►
But the HomePod was not mission critical for Apple
00:48:23
◼
►
in a way that this is.
00:48:24
◼
►
I think that Apple's gonna be in this for the long haul.
00:48:26
◼
►
If it doesn't sell well upfront, they're not gonna say,
00:48:29
◼
►
"Well, that was it, we're out of the AR business."
00:48:31
◼
►
I think they're in this for years to come.
00:48:33
◼
►
And so the first one is gonna be like them
00:48:35
◼
►
putting down their chips for the first round,
00:48:39
◼
►
but they're in it for the long game.
00:48:40
◼
►
- I also think that this has a potential larger audience
00:48:44
◼
►
than the HomePod ever could as well,
00:48:46
◼
►
like of people that might want something like this
00:48:49
◼
►
because it's interesting to them in some way,
00:48:52
◼
►
where I feel like the HomePod is not so much
00:48:55
◼
►
because it's like, why would I want that
00:48:57
◼
►
when I could just get a Bluetooth speaker?
00:49:00
◼
►
- And there isn't a Bluetooth speaker version
00:49:02
◼
►
of this type of thing.
00:49:04
◼
►
- Exactly, also I'd say, well, I mean,
00:49:07
◼
►
maybe the Bluetooth, that's a bad analogy,
00:49:09
◼
►
but like a meta quest to, or a PSVR or something like that.
00:49:14
◼
►
- That's the Amazon Echo or the Google Home
00:49:19
◼
►
to the HomePod rather than, you know.
00:49:21
◼
►
- That's fair, that's fair.
00:49:22
◼
►
So I think that's gonna be a challenge on their point.
00:49:25
◼
►
You know, in the, David in our discord said
00:49:28
◼
►
they think they're gonna sell one and a half million
00:49:32
◼
►
at that price.
00:49:34
◼
►
- I think Apple, how shall I put this?
00:49:38
◼
►
A hot new Apple product in a new wizzy category
00:49:41
◼
►
that is pricey and so only some people
00:49:44
◼
►
are gonna be able to get it
00:49:45
◼
►
and you can get in on the ground floor
00:49:47
◼
►
for somebody who doesn't really care that it costs $2,000.
00:49:50
◼
►
Like Apple can sell, I really believe Apple could sell
00:49:54
◼
►
a large number of almost anything,
00:49:57
◼
►
especially something that is hot and new and pricey
00:50:01
◼
►
because a lot of Apple's customers don't care about price.
00:50:04
◼
►
They're not price sensitive at all.
00:50:06
◼
►
And so I don't think that's unreasonable
00:50:09
◼
►
to say a million and a half units in a year
00:50:12
◼
►
of the brand new Apple thing.
00:50:14
◼
►
Maybe they'll be off by a little bit,
00:50:16
◼
►
but I'm never gonna underestimate Apple's ability
00:50:19
◼
►
to sell a product like this to the hardest core
00:50:24
◼
►
of its audience who are the least price sensitive.
00:50:26
◼
►
There'll be a hot app and there'll be people
00:50:28
◼
►
talking about it and there'll be some new thing and there'll be videos about like,
00:50:32
◼
►
"Oh, here's this amazing thing that the Apple thing does."
00:50:35
◼
►
That'll drive some sales.
00:50:36
◼
►
And again, we're not talking about 20 million in sales.
00:50:38
◼
►
We're talking about a million and a half.
00:50:41
◼
►
This episode is brought to you by our friends over at Hover.
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so make that super simple. They break it all down, you can check different types, they
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like categorise the domain options like the dot whatever the TODs, the dot net, dot biz
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◼
►
We'll go back to Mark Gurman again, talk about something different this time.
00:52:30
◼
►
It's kind of a rumor but a little bit not and I wanted to give it a bit more air to
00:52:33
◼
►
breathe which is that iPadOS 16 is likely to be delayed according to Mark Gurman with
00:52:44
◼
►
the main reason for this to be stage manager needing more work before shipping out widely
00:52:49
◼
►
is what Mark is saying that Apple believes.
00:52:52
◼
►
And it is now expected that iPadOS 16 will ship about a month later than the iPhone.
00:52:57
◼
►
I wanted to get your reaction to this.
00:53:00
◼
►
I feel for people like our friend James Thompson, who was quoted by Marc in his newsletter,
00:53:06
◼
►
misspelled his name, saying the problem with this is if you're an iOS developer and you're
00:53:11
◼
►
building a universal app, so it runs on iPad and iPhone, now you're in this position where
00:53:14
◼
►
you're like, "What do I do?" because you're going to have the iPhone out there before
00:53:21
◼
►
the iPad. I feel like, though, what I said earlier about the Apple kind of like
00:53:27
◼
►
taking, wrenching iPadOS further away from the iPhone and pushing it toward
00:53:31
◼
►
the Mac and the iPad hardware as well, I feel like this is in line with that,
00:53:35
◼
►
right? Like Stage Manager is a feature on Mac and iPad, not iPhone. And so in
00:53:40
◼
►
addition to the fact that Stage Manager, I think obviously they want more time
00:53:44
◼
►
with it to do it right, and I think that's good because they could use it.
00:53:49
◼
►
giving that more time.
00:53:51
◼
►
And also like Mac OS already,
00:53:54
◼
►
like James's problem is only magnified by this,
00:53:58
◼
►
but it's not created by this
00:53:59
◼
►
because we have had for years now,
00:54:02
◼
►
all the brand new OS stuff for iOS and iPad OS ship
00:54:05
◼
►
in September and Mac OS not shipped till October.
00:54:08
◼
►
And so for a month,
00:54:09
◼
►
the Mac just can't do any of those things.
00:54:12
◼
►
So all that's different here is that it'll be the Mac
00:54:15
◼
►
and the iPad that can't do those things.
00:54:17
◼
►
And so it's a problem that will be magnified
00:54:20
◼
►
because it's a shared app platform
00:54:23
◼
►
between the iPhone and the iPad.
00:54:25
◼
►
But it honestly doesn't bother me.
00:54:27
◼
►
The new iPads are rumored to come out,
00:54:30
◼
►
a new iPad at least, in October,
00:54:32
◼
►
possibly at the same event.
00:54:33
◼
►
Having a single event with macOS and iPadOS launching
00:54:37
◼
►
and new Macs and new iPads kinda makes sense.
00:54:40
◼
►
- I think it makes sense.
00:54:41
◼
►
- So on a messaging standpoint,
00:54:43
◼
►
and I give Stage Manager more time standpoint,
00:54:46
◼
►
And honestly, giving the iPad a little more love
00:54:50
◼
►
after the crunch to get the iPhone shipped,
00:54:53
◼
►
'cause the iPhone, again, we love the iPad,
00:54:57
◼
►
we love the Mac.
00:54:59
◼
►
Never forget that half of Apple's business is the iPhone,
00:55:01
◼
►
and it will always take priority.
00:55:03
◼
►
So I've become a big fan in the last few years
00:55:06
◼
►
of allowing the iPhone,
00:55:08
◼
►
which is the elephant in the room,
00:55:12
◼
►
allowing the iPhone to do its thing
00:55:15
◼
►
when it needs to do its thing
00:55:17
◼
►
and getting the other products time,
00:55:20
◼
►
some other time to do their thing.
00:55:23
◼
►
Because if you're the iPad and you're like,
00:55:25
◼
►
"But, but, but I have to fix this iPad feature
00:55:26
◼
►
before we ship, I've got to fix it, I got to fix it."
00:55:29
◼
►
And they're like, "No, you must do the iPhone things
00:55:33
◼
►
'cause we got iPhones to sell."
00:55:35
◼
►
And it's the most important feature,
00:55:37
◼
►
your most important product in our company.
00:55:39
◼
►
The iPad will never win that argument, never.
00:55:43
◼
►
So if this opens up a window where sometime, possibly now,
00:55:47
◼
►
they set aside some of the iPad stuff,
00:55:50
◼
►
work on getting the final shipping version,
00:55:52
◼
►
'cause remember they're working way ahead of us,
00:55:54
◼
►
final shipping version of iOS that will go on those phones
00:55:58
◼
►
that are being manufactured now.
00:56:01
◼
►
And then also all the bug cleanup for the version
00:56:03
◼
►
that will be there the day that they ship
00:56:05
◼
►
that you're gonna need to update.
00:56:07
◼
►
And then when they lock that one down,
00:56:10
◼
►
they are then kind of wrapping up the iPad project
00:56:14
◼
►
and doing the work on that.
00:56:16
◼
►
Like kind of makes too much sense.
00:56:19
◼
►
And I think it's actually good for the iPad
00:56:21
◼
►
to get out from under the iPhone crunch.
00:56:24
◼
►
'Cause in the iPhone crunch,
00:56:25
◼
►
only the iPhone should matter and does matter.
00:56:28
◼
►
- So I took this debate straight to James Thompson
00:56:33
◼
►
a couple of days ago.
00:56:35
◼
►
- I don't agree when this is a funny thing to say,
00:56:40
◼
►
considering I'm telling him how he feels.
00:56:43
◼
►
I don't necessarily agree with--
00:56:47
◼
►
- You're feeling it wrong, James, you're feeling it wrong.
00:56:49
◼
►
- The idea that there would be some kind of issue
00:56:51
◼
►
for most developers about iPad coming out at a different time
00:56:54
◼
►
like if what you're doing for your iPad app
00:56:58
◼
►
is supporting stage manager,
00:57:01
◼
►
iPad being delayed is not like your app's not gonna work.
00:57:04
◼
►
Like, this is only an issue if you require iPad OS 16
00:57:07
◼
►
or some iPad OS 16 technology in your application,
00:57:10
◼
►
which most developers wouldn't do
00:57:11
◼
►
because that's a bad business move, right?
00:57:13
◼
►
To be like, this is only gonna run on iPad OS 16 now.
00:57:16
◼
►
Like, under typical circumstances,
00:57:19
◼
►
this app can still just run as normal on an iPad.
00:57:23
◼
►
Like, you have to, as a developer, right,
00:57:25
◼
►
and like, I know that James would do this,
00:57:27
◼
►
confirm that your app's gonna work on 15
00:57:29
◼
►
after you do an update.
00:57:31
◼
►
So, this is no different.
00:57:33
◼
►
- Yeah, I-- - Right?
00:57:35
◼
►
- And here to answer that question is James Notenese.
00:57:38
◼
►
- I mean, me and James have already had this conversation
00:57:41
◼
►
and we have decided we disagree.
00:57:43
◼
►
But that's kind of my view on it.
00:57:46
◼
►
I don't know why this would make any specific difference
00:57:49
◼
►
because unless you are a developer
00:57:51
◼
►
that is specifically targeting some iPad OS 16 feature
00:57:55
◼
►
and you're cutting off the rest of your user base
00:57:57
◼
►
on the day that iPad OS comes out,
00:57:58
◼
►
like this isn't gonna make a difference to you
00:58:00
◼
►
because you still have to make sure
00:58:02
◼
►
it's gonna work on iPadOS 15
00:58:04
◼
►
when the iPadOS 16 version comes out anyway.
00:58:08
◼
►
James is saying that I'm wrong,
00:58:09
◼
►
but I don't think I am.
00:58:10
◼
►
So until he can prove otherwise,
00:58:13
◼
►
I'm gonna assume I'm right.
00:58:14
◼
►
- Well, the approach I took is,
00:58:17
◼
►
I feel for developers like James
00:58:19
◼
►
that are put in this situation.
00:58:20
◼
►
From a user in Apple perspective,
00:58:23
◼
►
it kind of makes sense.
00:58:24
◼
►
But the challenge for developers like James
00:58:27
◼
►
is that they're gonna have to make decisions
00:58:29
◼
►
that may impact their users.
00:58:30
◼
►
And I feel bad about that.
00:58:32
◼
►
but I think we're all gonna need to get used to it
00:58:34
◼
►
because this feels kind of like the right thing to do
00:58:37
◼
►
from that larger perspective.
00:58:38
◼
►
And it's on Apple to,
00:58:41
◼
►
and this is I think an important point to make,
00:58:43
◼
►
it's on Apple,
00:58:44
◼
►
if this is an issue for developers like James,
00:58:47
◼
►
Apple should make this not an issue
00:58:48
◼
►
for developers like James.
00:58:50
◼
►
I don't know how, some other way of doing it
00:58:52
◼
►
where he can take his universal app,
00:58:55
◼
►
but it's actually a different version
00:58:56
◼
►
that goes to the iPad than the iPhone.
00:58:59
◼
►
And that it gets split off like a little bit more
00:59:02
◼
►
so that he can, even though it's one app in the App Store,
00:59:05
◼
►
or perhaps across all App Stores, which he doesn't do,
00:59:08
◼
►
'cause he doesn't want to do it that way, and that's fine,
00:59:10
◼
►
but have that ability to sort of like control it.
00:59:13
◼
►
Maybe there are better ideas than that.
00:59:14
◼
►
I just made that up.
00:59:15
◼
►
But the idea of, you know,
00:59:16
◼
►
if Apple's going to do this every time,
00:59:18
◼
►
and it's going to put developers like James in a spot,
00:59:21
◼
►
maybe Apple should find a way to give them tools
00:59:23
◼
►
so that they're not stuck.
00:59:24
◼
►
How about that?
00:59:26
◼
►
- Still not sure how they will be stuck.
00:59:28
◼
►
'Cause I just don't see it.
00:59:29
◼
►
I don't, I can't, I can't, I can't conceive of it.
00:59:31
◼
►
- Right, 'cause unless he's shipping an app
00:59:33
◼
►
that doesn't work on iPad OS 16,
00:59:36
◼
►
if he ships his app on iOS 16 and it goes to iPad OS 16,
00:59:40
◼
►
it'll still work just like the old version
00:59:44
◼
►
because he's maintained compatibility.
00:59:47
◼
►
- But James can't answer himself, so.
00:59:49
◼
►
- It's impossible, unfortunately it's impossible,
00:59:52
◼
►
so we're just gonna have to move on.
00:59:54
◼
►
Do you agree with the idea of delaying it
00:59:57
◼
►
for Sage Manager's sake?
01:00:00
◼
►
- Yeah, like I said, I agree with it
01:00:01
◼
►
because I think getting out from under the iPhone
01:00:04
◼
►
is good for the iPad.
01:00:05
◼
►
That any decision about iPad features
01:00:08
◼
►
when they're crunching to get it on to iPhones
01:00:11
◼
►
is going to, the iPad is gonna lose.
01:00:14
◼
►
So I support this.
01:00:18
◼
►
And the Mac's already there, right?
01:00:20
◼
►
I mean, that's the other part of this,
01:00:21
◼
►
is that the Mac's already on this cycle.
01:00:24
◼
►
And it's annoying in a way, but it's fine.
01:00:27
◼
►
I think it's okay.
01:00:28
◼
►
- But like, do you think that it needs it?
01:00:30
◼
►
Like, do you think that it needs this time
01:00:33
◼
►
for stage managers?
01:00:34
◼
►
Do you find stage manager to be a feature
01:00:36
◼
►
that could do with a lot more work?
01:00:38
◼
►
- I mean, it's a work in progress for sure.
01:00:40
◼
►
It's gonna need more work beyond the fall, right?
01:00:42
◼
►
It's gonna need more work.
01:00:43
◼
►
I hope they can just keep refining it
01:00:46
◼
►
and don't just leave it in its finished state for a year.
01:00:49
◼
►
It's funny because I saw Federico Vittucci
01:00:53
◼
►
tweet about how he felt like it had gotten more buggy lately.
01:00:59
◼
►
And I think he's right.
01:01:01
◼
►
But my feeling about it is that it's also gotten more
01:01:04
◼
►
refined and works better lately,
01:01:08
◼
►
or at least when it works, it works better.
01:01:11
◼
►
So I think they're making progress in doing so.
01:01:14
◼
►
I think they're breaking things that are causing the bugs
01:01:17
◼
►
that Federico sees.
01:01:19
◼
►
There are also some bugs that have been there
01:01:20
◼
►
since the beginning in terms of where windows go,
01:01:23
◼
►
when you do things, it's like,
01:01:25
◼
►
it's what I said a while ago about the Mac,
01:01:28
◼
►
which is the Mac is a system that's got windowing down,
01:01:31
◼
►
has been doing windowing for almost 40 years.
01:01:34
◼
►
And so when you put stage manager on it,
01:01:37
◼
►
the windowing all makes sense.
01:01:39
◼
►
And then on the iPad, it has no windowing to speak of.
01:01:43
◼
►
And there are all these places where you do something
01:01:48
◼
►
that's supposed to spawn a Safari window,
01:01:49
◼
►
and you've got another Safari window
01:01:51
◼
►
in your stage manager view, and it doesn't go there,
01:01:55
◼
►
but instead opens a new Safari window in a different view,
01:01:57
◼
►
and you're like, why would you do that?
01:01:59
◼
►
And the answer is, 'cause it's the iPad
01:02:01
◼
►
and it doesn't have that infrastructure around it.
01:02:03
◼
►
So, they got a lot of work to do.
01:02:06
◼
►
I feel like they're making some interface improvements,
01:02:08
◼
►
like adding features, but Federico's right,
01:02:11
◼
►
it's also really buggy.
01:02:12
◼
►
So, the more time it has for them to grind away on it,
01:02:17
◼
►
I find it funny, Mark Gurman hates Stage Manager.
01:02:20
◼
►
- Yeah, he really does.
01:02:22
◼
►
- He really hates it.
01:02:23
◼
►
In his newsletter, he complains about it all the time.
01:02:25
◼
►
And the piece of evidence that he gives
01:02:27
◼
►
that I find the most baffling is he says,
01:02:30
◼
►
"Even Apple knows Stage Manager sucks
01:02:32
◼
►
because they have a button in Control Center
01:02:35
◼
►
to turn it on and off."
01:02:37
◼
►
- No. - It's like Mark.
01:02:38
◼
►
No, no, it's a mode, it's great.
01:02:41
◼
►
The reason that it's like that is because most iPad users
01:02:45
◼
►
won't want to use Stage Manager.
01:02:47
◼
►
They are used to single window mode
01:02:49
◼
►
and they're very happy with it.
01:02:51
◼
►
And that's what the iPad is to them.
01:02:53
◼
►
And if you introduce this windowing mode to everybody,
01:02:56
◼
►
most of your iPad users will be like,
01:02:57
◼
►
"What the hell is going on?
01:02:58
◼
►
I don't want this."
01:02:59
◼
►
And then they're going to spend the next,
01:03:01
◼
►
you know, rest of their time using the iPad,
01:03:03
◼
►
tapping Zoom on every single one of their apps
01:03:06
◼
►
to get them back to full screen,
01:03:07
◼
►
if they can figure that out.
01:03:09
◼
►
So the control center thing is not there
01:03:12
◼
►
because they're not proud of center stage,
01:03:15
◼
►
or sorry, stage manager, I did it.
01:03:17
◼
►
It's not that at all.
01:03:19
◼
►
- What I find funny is that prior to this,
01:03:22
◼
►
Mark was talking about wanting to have a pro mode,
01:03:24
◼
►
like a button that you press
01:03:26
◼
►
that turn the iPad into pro mode.
01:03:28
◼
►
I think he, so it is doing that.
01:03:30
◼
►
I think he just doesn't like that it's do not,
01:03:32
◼
►
he doesn't like what it's doing.
01:03:35
◼
►
But that's just funny to me that that's a reason
01:03:37
◼
►
because that was something that he was suggesting
01:03:40
◼
►
they should do.
01:03:41
◼
►
- So he's so cranky about it, because he doesn't like it,
01:03:43
◼
►
that he says, aha, look, they hate it.
01:03:45
◼
►
They're hiding it behind a button in control center
01:03:47
◼
►
and it's dumb because that's not, that's no,
01:03:50
◼
►
that's not why.
01:03:51
◼
►
And I think that they're actually kind of proud of it,
01:03:54
◼
►
but they're also realize it would break the interface
01:03:57
◼
►
for every iPad user in a way
01:03:59
◼
►
that most iPad users don't want.
01:04:01
◼
►
It's also not on by default on the Mac.
01:04:03
◼
►
Are they ashamed of it on the Mac too?
01:04:05
◼
►
I don't think they are.
01:04:06
◼
►
I think that they think this is a mode
01:04:07
◼
►
like many other modes that you can turn on and off.
01:04:10
◼
►
And I actually think it's gonna be pretty decent,
01:04:13
◼
►
but it's got a lot of bugs
01:04:14
◼
►
and a lot of weird things about it,
01:04:15
◼
►
and it's gonna take time.
01:04:17
◼
►
So we'll see.
01:04:19
◼
►
Myke, I wanna take a moment here
01:04:21
◼
►
to channel James Thompson.
01:04:23
◼
►
Okay, just 'cause we have not given him his say
01:04:26
◼
►
and I'm gonna channel it here, which is,
01:04:27
◼
►
he has a very nuanced reason why this is an issue,
01:04:31
◼
►
which is if you ship an app in September for iOS,
01:04:34
◼
►
that's linked against the iOS and iPadOS 16 SDK,
01:04:39
◼
►
that code will run on iPadOS 16,
01:04:44
◼
►
even if it's not tested with the final build.
01:04:47
◼
►
So his issue here is he can release it for the iPhone
01:04:51
◼
►
But the iPad OS is still in beta,
01:04:53
◼
►
and when it goes final and gets pushed out to everybody,
01:04:56
◼
►
he, however it works on the iPad
01:05:00
◼
►
and however broken it might be,
01:05:02
◼
►
it'll just start working on those updated iPads.
01:05:05
◼
►
And he wants to test it and control that experience
01:05:10
◼
►
and not have it be broken,
01:05:12
◼
►
because then he's gonna get a bunch of bad app reviews
01:05:14
◼
►
for his iPad app.
01:05:15
◼
►
It was like, "Oh, I updated iOS 16
01:05:17
◼
►
"and now Peacock doesn't work."
01:05:19
◼
►
When the truth is it doesn't work
01:05:20
◼
►
because it doesn't have the GM.
01:05:21
◼
►
- I still don't understand how that's different.
01:05:24
◼
►
Like, what's the difference?
01:05:26
◼
►
- Well, I think the difference in part is that
01:05:28
◼
►
he's got days, or sometimes it's a day,
01:05:31
◼
►
or maybe it's a week, to run on the final build
01:05:33
◼
►
before it goes out and make any changes he needs to change
01:05:37
◼
►
so that it works properly
01:05:38
◼
►
when the regular users update to it.
01:05:41
◼
►
And that this is turning it to zero, literally zero,
01:05:45
◼
►
because it's already out there.
01:05:46
◼
►
He can't control it, he can't gate it and say,
01:05:48
◼
►
"I'm not gonna release this until I've cleared all the bugs
01:05:50
◼
►
"because it will already be released."
01:05:53
◼
►
I think that's his issue.
01:05:54
◼
►
Anyway, James, you can write.
01:05:57
◼
►
All right, well, it's out there.
01:05:58
◼
►
People can judge themselves.
01:06:00
◼
►
Anyway, I'm fine with it. - An unfortunate part
01:06:02
◼
►
of all of this is, and I feel for all developers
01:06:06
◼
►
of all kinds of things now, it doesn't matter.
01:06:08
◼
►
This is what they're gonna do.
01:06:09
◼
►
You just gotta get used to it, you know?
01:06:10
◼
►
- And what we've said all along is,
01:06:13
◼
►
and developers know this better than anyone,
01:06:14
◼
►
what is the pecking order in terms of Apple's priorities?
01:06:17
◼
►
It is one, Apple.
01:06:20
◼
►
- Two, customers of Apple.
01:06:22
◼
►
Three, developers.
01:06:24
◼
►
And this is a move that I think makes sense
01:06:26
◼
►
for one and two.
01:06:27
◼
►
Sorry, three.
01:06:29
◼
►
Like that's, but what else is new?
01:06:31
◼
►
This is how it is with that.
01:06:33
◼
►
So that's where we are.
01:06:34
◼
►
- This episode is brought to you by our friends
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over at CleanMyMacX.
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It is time for some #AskUpgrade questions to finish out today's episode.
01:08:27
◼
►
First one comes from Chris.
01:08:30
◼
►
Chris says "I, like Jason, love the iPhone mini."
01:08:35
◼
►
"Have you decided how long you think you might keep your iPhone 13 mini?
01:08:41
◼
►
What do you think it's gonna take for you to move
01:08:43
◼
►
to a larger phone size?
01:08:46
◼
►
- It's kind of an unfair question just because,
01:08:48
◼
►
or at least I'm gonna give an unfair answer.
01:08:50
◼
►
How about that?
01:08:51
◼
►
I buy a new iPhone for myself every other year.
01:08:54
◼
►
This year was my year to do it,
01:08:57
◼
►
or last fall was my year to do it.
01:08:58
◼
►
So I bought an iPhone 13 mini,
01:09:00
◼
►
knowing I would keep it for two years at least.
01:09:03
◼
►
Maybe I'll keep it longer, I don't know.
01:09:04
◼
►
However, I'm a cheater because I get the iPhones
01:09:08
◼
►
every fall from Apple.
01:09:09
◼
►
thank you for making me part of your review program.
01:09:12
◼
►
I don't have to buy many iPhones.
01:09:14
◼
►
They send me the iPhones and I review them.
01:09:16
◼
►
And that means I get to use all the iPhones for a while.
01:09:19
◼
►
And that's really nice.
01:09:21
◼
►
But my personal owned iPhone will be the 13 mini
01:09:24
◼
►
and I don't anticipate buying one of these new ones
01:09:27
◼
►
'cause I just don't,
01:09:28
◼
►
I've kept myself on the two year cycle
01:09:30
◼
►
just because I think that that's fair.
01:09:34
◼
►
I'm also buying a new iPhone for my son this fall
01:09:38
◼
►
as he goes off to college.
01:09:39
◼
►
So he's gonna have to,
01:09:40
◼
►
I'm spending the money there this time instead.
01:09:44
◼
►
What will it take for me to move to a larger size iPhone?
01:09:47
◼
►
My guess is that the agglomeration of new features
01:09:50
◼
►
over the next two years will be what gets me to do it,
01:09:52
◼
►
that I'll be sad to give up the mini.
01:09:54
◼
►
- Well, and that there won't be one.
01:09:57
◼
►
It's also like, you know, if you wanna get a new phone,
01:10:00
◼
►
you eventually have to move.
01:10:01
◼
►
- Yes, but I could also not get a new phone, right?
01:10:04
◼
►
That's the thing. - How long though?
01:10:05
◼
►
when the iPhone 15 comes out and it's two years,
01:10:09
◼
►
will I buy a new phone or will I keep it?
01:10:11
◼
►
I could keep the iPhone.
01:10:12
◼
►
My guess is that in two years,
01:10:14
◼
►
all the new features that have been rolled
01:10:15
◼
►
into the iPhone 14 and 15,
01:10:17
◼
►
and keep in mind the rumors are
01:10:18
◼
►
the 15 will be one of those big,
01:10:20
◼
►
kind of like new generations with new cameras
01:10:23
◼
►
and the periscope might be in there
01:10:25
◼
►
and all that kind of stuff.
01:10:26
◼
►
And I don't have ProMotion.
01:10:28
◼
►
And I don't have all these other features
01:10:30
◼
►
because I have an iPhone 13 mini.
01:10:32
◼
►
My guess is that in two years,
01:10:34
◼
►
when it's time for me traditionally to buy a new iPhone,
01:10:38
◼
►
I'm gonna look at some version of the iPhone 15
01:10:41
◼
►
and say, all right, I'll do it.
01:10:43
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And that's my guess.
01:10:46
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Is it possible that I will look at them and say,
01:10:49
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I can wait a year.
01:10:53
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►
Maybe, it's possible, anything's possible.
01:10:55
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►
Again, one of the fortunate things
01:10:57
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►
about doing this as my job is that
01:10:58
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►
if I need to refer to something
01:10:59
◼
►
on one of the brand new pieces of hardware,
01:11:01
◼
►
I have them, at least for a while, and I can do that.
01:11:04
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►
I don't need to actually buy the new pieces of hardware
01:11:06
◼
►
just for reference because that's my job.
01:11:09
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So I might be able to put it off longer,
01:11:12
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►
but if I know myself and analyze myself,
01:11:15
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that would be my guess is that in two years,
01:11:17
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►
when it's time for me to traditionally buy a new phone,
01:11:21
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►
I will buy a new phone and it will be probably an iPhone 15.
01:11:26
◼
►
That said, if there's a rumor
01:11:27
◼
►
that the iPhone 15 technology is gonna be rolled
01:11:30
◼
►
into something that looks like the iPhone mini
01:11:31
◼
►
maybe in the spring, I would probably wait.
01:11:34
◼
►
'cause I would really rather have an iPhone mini.
01:11:37
◼
►
But if there's no sign that the mini form factor,
01:11:40
◼
►
I can't believe I used that phrase, I hate it,
01:11:41
◼
►
but there it is.
01:11:42
◼
►
If the mini is not coming back in any shape or form,
01:11:45
◼
►
back to, I'll probably break down in two years.
01:11:48
◼
►
- Vegar asks, "With Major League Baseball,
01:11:51
◼
►
"Major League Soccer, and potentially the NFL,
01:11:54
◼
►
"when will Apple announce their first streaming deal
01:11:56
◼
►
"for any women's sport?"
01:11:59
◼
►
Now, I have to say, we can't answer the question, right?
01:12:02
◼
►
We don't know the answer to this, but I think it would be a good thing for them to pursue.
01:12:07
◼
►
It's more content, potentially of a smaller but also dedicated audience.
01:12:12
◼
►
They would get the ability to learn more about streaming in general.
01:12:16
◼
►
They just keep adding in, for I would presume, cheaper rights.
01:12:23
◼
►
If you got the women's Super League football, it would be cheaper than trying to get the
01:12:30
◼
►
premiership football.
01:12:32
◼
►
So here's the problem. There are not that many, especially in the United States, there
01:12:36
◼
►
are not that many women's sports leagues. The most prominent is the soccer league, the
01:12:41
◼
►
NWSL. There's the women's Super League in Europe. Paramount+ has bought the rights to
01:12:48
◼
►
both of those, so they're locked into a deal. And Sky and BBC in the UK have that. So I
01:12:56
◼
►
think the answer to Vega's question is largely all the streamers are aware that there's an
01:13:01
◼
►
audience that is growing for women's sports, and the challenge is that the number of those
01:13:09
◼
►
leagues that are out there is small, and therefore there is a competition to get those rights.
01:13:19
◼
►
And Paramount Plus, CBS basically in the US, has invested in women's soccer in the US and
01:13:27
◼
►
put that into their brand. And I have friends who are fans of the NWSL and specific teams
01:13:32
◼
►
like the Portland Thorns, and they got Paramount+ to watch the Portland Thorns, right? Like
01:13:38
◼
►
that was part of the deal. It's actually very similar to what's going to happen with Apple
01:13:41
◼
►
and MLS, where people are going to get their package because they are a fan of an MLS team.
01:13:47
◼
►
So my answer is women's sports leagues need to grow, but one of the ways that women's
01:13:52
◼
►
sports leagues are growing is by making deals with streamers. I'm sure Apple will
01:13:57
◼
►
be in the conversation, but you can't just turn around and, you know, the
01:14:01
◼
►
shopping—the aisles of the of the market, of the supermarket full of sports rights,
01:14:06
◼
►
the women's aisle is pretty bare because there just have not been that
01:14:13
◼
►
many women's sports leagues out there. And it's growing, but like in the US, like
01:14:21
◼
►
the the NWSL is kind of it in terms of the major sports. I will throw out there
01:14:29
◼
►
that Apple is rumored to be in conversations for some college
01:14:35
◼
►
conference deals and it probably is mostly gonna go to like ESPN+ or
01:14:42
◼
►
something like that but it's possible that some college conference in the US
01:14:46
◼
►
anyway might make a deal with Apple that looks like the MLS deal at which point
01:14:50
◼
►
what you'd see is all the college sports going on Apple's streaming. So they might
01:14:54
◼
►
get some college football games and some college basketball games, which is what
01:14:57
◼
►
they really want, but for example, if they make a deal with the, you know, PAC-12,
01:15:02
◼
►
which is having to make a new deal because they lost two members and their
01:15:06
◼
►
deal is up, so they have to make some new deals, and the commissioner there has
01:15:10
◼
►
said that one of the things that they will do is work with the streamer. One
01:15:13
◼
►
possibility might be that Apple or Amazon could assume their streaming
01:15:19
◼
►
package, in which case all of the college women's soccer and volleyball and softball,
01:15:25
◼
►
etc., etc., is going to go to whatever streamer they tie up with. So I'd say that pro leagues
01:15:30
◼
►
are going to be harder because they're going to have to compete with every other streamer
01:15:33
◼
►
for the limited number of women's pro leagues, especially in the US. But college might give
01:15:38
◼
►
them a little bit more of a venue. But this is the challenge is that there are all these
01:15:43
◼
►
established men's leagues and there just are not very many established women's leagues
01:15:47
◼
►
Next question comes from John Cressen who asks,
01:15:50
◼
►
do we think that the next iPad Pro will have an M2 chip
01:15:53
◼
►
or could there be a Pro chip of some kind in there?
01:15:56
◼
►
- M2, no, no Pro, it doesn't make sense for the iPad.
01:16:01
◼
►
- What about M1 Pro?
01:16:03
◼
►
- Battery, no, I just don't think it makes sense.
01:16:05
◼
►
I think you want, M1 and M2 are fundamentally
01:16:07
◼
►
the iPad chips that also go in Macs.
01:16:10
◼
►
So I don't think so.
01:16:11
◼
►
- Brant asks, do you think we'll get lighter iPhones
01:16:15
◼
►
this year or are we in for heavier and heavier phones
01:16:18
◼
►
and screen sizes as battery size,
01:16:20
◼
►
as screen sizes and battery sizes get bigger?
01:16:23
◼
►
I miss the days of the 4S to the 5,
01:16:25
◼
►
more screen lighter designs.
01:16:27
◼
►
I don't know about if we're gonna get heavier
01:16:30
◼
►
and heavier phones all the time
01:16:32
◼
►
because that soon becomes a problem, right?
01:16:36
◼
►
But I don't know about lightness.
01:16:40
◼
►
Like I don't know if they're gonna make them lighter
01:16:43
◼
►
because it's like materials plus the batteries, right?
01:16:47
◼
►
But, you know.
01:16:49
◼
►
- Yeah, I reject the premise of this question.
01:16:52
◼
►
Bigger phones, yes.
01:16:53
◼
►
Heavier and heavier and heavier.
01:16:55
◼
►
Oh, every year the phones get heavier and bigger
01:16:57
◼
►
and heavier and bigger.
01:16:58
◼
►
Like there are bigger phones, they sell well.
01:17:01
◼
►
There are also smaller phones.
01:17:02
◼
►
Is Apple going to, this is like,
01:17:04
◼
►
did Johnny I write this question?
01:17:06
◼
►
This is like everything should be thinner and lighter.
01:17:08
◼
►
Phones on average are gonna be bigger
01:17:10
◼
►
because people like them.
01:17:11
◼
►
hey, iPhone mini user here, I lost.
01:17:16
◼
►
- No phones are getting bigger this year.
01:17:20
◼
►
- Right, well, the iPhone line as a whole will get bigger
01:17:23
◼
►
because they're gonna replace the iPhone mini
01:17:24
◼
►
with an iPhone max, right?
01:17:25
◼
►
- But it's not like the iPhone mini is getting bigger, right?
01:17:28
◼
►
It's just gonna go away.
01:17:29
◼
►
- Yeah, but they're not gonna like switch to like,
01:17:32
◼
►
people really like stainless steel.
01:17:33
◼
►
So this year we're gonna do some, like iron,
01:17:37
◼
►
we're gonna do an iron base, we're gonna do a lead based,
01:17:41
◼
►
Don't touch it, don't lick it.
01:17:43
◼
►
It's lead-based phone, but it's heavy and people love heavy.
01:17:46
◼
►
Like, you know, there are always trade-offs gonna be made.
01:17:50
◼
►
But if you are somebody who says,
01:17:53
◼
►
"I miss the days of the 4S to the 5,
01:17:55
◼
►
more screen, lighter designs," like,
01:17:57
◼
►
they will make it lighter and thinner
01:18:01
◼
►
when they feel like they can,
01:18:02
◼
►
but just needing the battery to be good
01:18:06
◼
►
and the screen to be big means that
01:18:09
◼
►
they're always gonna be fighting against that.
01:18:10
◼
►
- Also the 4S to the 5 is,
01:18:13
◼
►
I understand where you're coming from,
01:18:14
◼
►
but it's a bad example because they changed materials,
01:18:17
◼
►
right, so they went from glass to aluminum.
01:18:20
◼
►
That can't happen now because of wireless charging.
01:18:23
◼
►
- Yeah, and also the aluminum models, right,
01:18:28
◼
►
are the cheaper models and they are lighter
01:18:32
◼
►
because of that,
01:18:33
◼
►
'cause they're not using the heavy stainless steel.
01:18:34
◼
►
I think that they'll keep doing that too.
01:18:37
◼
►
- The regular phones, not the pro phones, you're saying, yeah.
01:18:39
◼
►
- I wanna be sympathetic here
01:18:40
◼
►
because I also like smaller, lighter phones.
01:18:43
◼
►
But I don't think that the narrative
01:18:45
◼
►
that they're always getting bigger and heavier
01:18:47
◼
►
is accurate either.
01:18:48
◼
►
I think there's a push and a pull,
01:18:50
◼
►
an ebb and a flow to this sort of thing.
01:18:52
◼
►
But if you're dreaming of the days
01:18:54
◼
►
of having small, light phones in general, it's over.
01:18:59
◼
►
But Apple, we're not gonna,
01:19:02
◼
►
fast forward to the iPhone 20 and it weighs four pounds.
01:19:05
◼
►
That's not gonna happen.
01:19:06
◼
►
- And Ryan asks,
01:19:07
◼
►
Is there somewhere I can see my Apple Watch's battery health like I can for my iPhone?
01:19:13
◼
►
Why yes Ryan, if you go to settings on the watch itself,
01:19:16
◼
►
so you have to go to settings, there is a battery section.
01:19:21
◼
►
Inside of that there is a button which isn't very clear that says battery health.
01:19:27
◼
►
You have to scroll down, you find it, it's buried in between two paragraphs for some reason
01:19:31
◼
►
and you can find it. Mine is 92%.
01:19:35
◼
►
Oh look at you, congratulations.
01:19:37
◼
►
Yeah, yeah, big battery boy here.
01:19:40
◼
►
I guess you are.
01:19:43
◼
►
If you would like to send in a question of your own, so we can help give you an answer
01:19:48
◼
►
on a future episode of Upgrade, just send out a tweet with the hashtag #AskUpgrade or
01:19:52
◼
►
use question mark #AskUpgrade in the Relay FM members Discord.
01:19:56
◼
►
Thank you to KleememacX, Hover and Sourcegraph for the support of this show.
01:20:00
◼
►
Thank you for listening and thank you to our members who support the show directly.
01:20:04
◼
►
You can find out more and sign up today at GetUpgradePlus.com.
01:20:08
◼
►
If you want to find Jason online, you can go to SixColors.com, TheIncomparable.com.
01:20:13
◼
►
He is @JSNEL, J-S-N-E-L-L, both Jason and I. Host office shows here at Relay FM.
01:20:18
◼
►
You can go to Relay.fm/shows.
01:20:20
◼
►
Find a new show.
01:20:21
◼
►
There's going to be something in there for you to listen to.
01:20:23
◼
►
You're going to find something fun, I bet.
01:20:25
◼
►
I am @imike, I-M-Y-K-E, and we'll be back next week.
01:20:29
◼
►
Until then, say goodbye, Jason Snow.
01:20:31
◼
►
Goodbye, everybody.
01:20:32
◼
►
[MUSIC PLAYING]
01:20:38
◼
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[BLANK_AUDIO]