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The Incomparable

19: This Podcast Never Existed

 

00:00:00   the incomparable podcast number 19 for [TS]

00:00:09   january to ntlm if the new year and time [TS]

00:00:15   for a new edition of the incomparable [TS]

00:00:16   podcast welcome everybody I'm Jason [TS]

00:00:19   smell your host with me today i have two [TS]

00:00:21   guests for our exciting incomparable [TS]

00:00:24   book club yes we've managed to kill just [TS]

00:00:26   about everyone else but to remain alive [TS]

00:00:29   and they enter our Thunderdome here [TS]

00:00:32   today from the Pacific Northwest Glenn [TS]

00:00:35   fleischmann thank you for reading the [TS]

00:00:37   book you are very welcome [TS]

00:00:40   somebody had to do it and from the east [TS]

00:00:42   coast from Philadelphia lonely no longer [TS]

00:00:45   Scott McNulty thank you for being [TS]

00:00:47   literate Scotty you know I think this is [TS]

00:00:50   what happens to all book clubs isn't it [TS]

00:00:52   slowly people just stopped coming [TS]

00:00:54   it's oh you mean the next one will be [TS]

00:00:55   Jason talking to himself [TS]

00:00:57   yes I either that or it'll be me talking [TS]

00:00:59   to my digitized version of dan more'n [TS]

00:01:02   likely back and debate things with it at [TS]

00:01:06   my leisure so are our topic today [TS]

00:01:08   primary topic first topic is a the the [TS]

00:01:13   book selection which is how to live [TS]

00:01:15   safely in a science fictional universe [TS]

00:01:18   which is by Charles you believe Charles [TS]

00:01:21   you that that is correct [TS]

00:01:23   alright uh and this is a very peculiar [TS]

00:01:26   book blend you want to kind of step us [TS]

00:01:30   through kind of the overview of what [TS]

00:01:31   this what this book is [TS]

00:01:35   I'm going to give it a try it some I [TS]

00:01:37   think it's you know I think it's very [TS]

00:01:39   interesting book because it's it has a [TS]

00:01:42   feel [TS]

00:01:43   I'll give me like the big picture as a [TS]

00:01:44   feel of some of that new science fiction [TS]

00:01:47   stuff from like the nineteen sixties and [TS]

00:01:48   seventies when everyone was tired of the [TS]

00:01:50   Golden Age and then the Silver Age it [TS]

00:01:52   also have exploded into Harlan Ellison [TS]

00:01:55   and things that were almost unreadable [TS]

00:01:56   but they were different right so there's [TS]

00:01:58   a little bit of a picture of this this [TS]

00:02:00   is not unreadable but it's it's very [TS]

00:02:03   difficult reading so it's I come to the [TS]

00:02:05   plot it's like all right well I think [TS]

00:02:06   this is what happened you know it's not [TS]

00:02:08   that I got a ray gun and charged across [TS]

00:02:11   the universe and killed this blog's and [TS]

00:02:13   one girl you know which i have been [TS]

00:02:16   reading books like that recently i'm in [TS]

00:02:18   this book [TS]

00:02:18   let's say they think almost anything i [TS]

00:02:20   say my trigger the spoiler horn but i'll [TS]

00:02:22   start slow so it appears to be there is [TS]

00:02:24   a gentleman who is a time machine repair [TS]

00:02:29   prepare right i mean i think we can [TS]

00:02:31   agree on that we can and his name [TS]

00:02:34   happens to be Charles you who is the [TS]

00:02:36   author of the book right and he seems to [TS]

00:02:39   live in a universe that is a is enter [TS]

00:02:41   twinkled and entwined with our own in [TS]

00:02:44   the science fictional universe is a [TS]

00:02:46   construct within the book and it is [TS]

00:02:49   something to which he possesses some [TS]

00:02:52   power of movement like ever while you [TS]

00:02:54   think this is thoroughly abstract it [TS]

00:02:56   sounds like he's been in a kind of [TS]

00:02:58   stasis for 10 or more years in which he [TS]

00:03:01   visits different locations in different [TS]

00:03:03   adjacent universes and repairs people's [TS]

00:03:05   problems where they people go back to [TS]

00:03:08   visit events in the past and they make [TS]

00:03:09   changes that they are outside [TS]

00:03:11   operational parameters it's very very [TS]

00:03:13   maytag salesperson [TS]

00:03:14   oh you know you shouldn't put the you [TS]

00:03:16   know the ACI card and you only put the [TS]

00:03:18   ati card in that always causes a blowout [TS]

00:03:20   we really need that you should have [TS]

00:03:21   gotten the upgrade and I can fix it but [TS]

00:03:24   it's going to cost $15 so we kind of its [TS]

00:03:26   quitting at times you know it's this [TS]

00:03:28   very much like he's like any repairman [TS]

00:03:30   and then it's then it keeps blasting and [TS]

00:03:33   metaphysical aspects and then there's a [TS]

00:03:35   regular citations from a book that isn't [TS]

00:03:37   that called how to live safely in a [TS]

00:03:39   science fictional universe inside the [TS]

00:03:41   book and over time we come to realize [TS]

00:03:43   that his father fictional Charles use [TS]

00:03:47   father has invented [TS]

00:03:49   time machines sort of and that Charles [TS]

00:03:52   you you has people he visits including [TS]

00:03:54   his mother who is stuck in a time loop [TS]

00:03:57   he created for her but she repeats a [TS]

00:03:59   pleasant event over and over again i [TS]

00:04:01   don't know if i would say stuck she's [TS]

00:04:02   evil Heimlich she's sort of been placed [TS]

00:04:04   in a time loop so that it would be [TS]

00:04:07   easier on her or something exactly she [TS]

00:04:10   has some awareness of it and he has a [TS]

00:04:11   dog who doesn't exist the dog was sort [TS]

00:04:14   of a fictional construct that was being [TS]

00:04:16   thrown out and he felt bad for us is the [TS]

00:04:19   notion of a dog that is not quite a dog [TS]

00:04:22   and he has a onboard artificial [TS]

00:04:24   intelligence system that is self-aware [TS]

00:04:26   but kind of sad [TS]

00:04:27   Tammy she sleeps a lot and his boss is a [TS]

00:04:30   computer program it doesn't realize at [TS]

00:04:32   least for a while these computer program [TS]

00:04:33   yes so it you know some of these are [TS]

00:04:35   very nominal science-fiction elements [TS]

00:04:36   these are things that every know a lot [TS]

00:04:38   of science fiction all these concepts [TS]

00:04:39   come to eat together but keeps breaking [TS]

00:04:41   down is it as you read the book you keep [TS]

00:04:44   sort of peeling down through allegory [TS]

00:04:46   you're like oh it's the story of a guy [TS]

00:04:47   who's 30-something his life has been a [TS]

00:04:50   mess and he's writing about in this [TS]

00:04:53   heavily allegorical way and is troubled [TS]

00:04:55   relations between his parents his [TS]

00:04:56   parents getting divorced and his [TS]

00:04:58   childhood in which his father was never [TS]

00:05:00   please and can never achieve what you [TS]

00:05:01   want to or is this like Pierre you know [TS]

00:05:03   like we talked about with the city in [TS]

00:05:05   the city your perspective keeps changing [TS]

00:05:07   sometimes with every page as to whether [TS]

00:05:09   this is you know a novel of personal [TS]

00:05:10   self exploration thinly-veiled with [TS]

00:05:13   science-fiction elements or a science [TS]

00:05:15   fiction novel with oddly [TS]

00:05:16   autobiographical potentially [TS]

00:05:18   autobiographical elements inserted [TS]

00:05:20   inside of it so what do you think that I [TS]

00:05:22   do okay jobs [TS]

00:05:24   yeah i think i think so and I think in [TS]

00:05:27   fact it's not even an either/or i think [TS]

00:05:29   that in some ways that's exactly what [TS]

00:05:31   the book is it's an autobiography with [TS]

00:05:34   sort of a filter run on that to turn it [TS]

00:05:36   into a science fiction novel and then [TS]

00:05:39   you know and then everybody has point [TS]

00:05:40   where introduces specific elements that [TS]

00:05:43   are associated with science fiction [TS]

00:05:44   books and also i mean the title [TS]

00:05:48   science-fictional as opposed to science [TS]

00:05:49   fiction it's you know that is a queue [TS]

00:05:52   there but their element where inserts [TS]

00:05:54   things like you know he goes back [TS]

00:05:56   apparently goes back in time and shoots [TS]

00:05:57   himself or there are paradoxes that are [TS]

00:06:00   classic science fiction [TS]

00:06:02   time travel paradoxes that introduces [TS]

00:06:04   but then dispenses with or incorporate [TS]

00:06:06   sin completely in insane ways that are [TS]

00:06:09   again like sometimes i feel like i'm [TS]

00:06:11   reading philosophy when I'm reading it [TS]

00:06:12   sometimes it's like a you know had a [TS]

00:06:15   dense novel that's designed to be [TS]

00:06:19   interpreted by literary critics and [TS]

00:06:22   sometimes it's like a rousing good [TS]

00:06:23   sci-fi story it is sort of got two parts [TS]

00:06:26   right it's got this introductory part [TS]

00:06:27   where you meet this you meet this guy [TS]

00:06:29   and he he's a time machine repairman he [TS]

00:06:31   lives out of time he sort of like [TS]

00:06:32   doesn't want to access his actual life [TS]

00:06:34   so he he just doesn't return home and he [TS]

00:06:39   and he's fixing the time machines and [TS]

00:06:41   then there's that scene coursing in the [TS]

00:06:43   middle of the book where he is walking [TS]

00:06:46   to his time machine and the door opens [TS]

00:06:48   and he gets out of it and he sees [TS]

00:06:51   himself and shoots himself and then gets [TS]

00:06:54   in the time machine and leaves and [TS]

00:06:56   realizes he's just sort of loop himself [TS]

00:06:58   and that's where the book gets seriously [TS]

00:07:00   weird and it turns out that he's been [TS]

00:07:02   writing he needs to read a book called [TS]

00:07:05   how to live safely of a science [TS]

00:07:06   fictional universe which he himself [TS]

00:07:08   wrote in the time loop so he writes it [TS]

00:07:11   as he reads it and then we can get all [TS]

00:07:15   kind of goes crazy and then he ends up [TS]

00:07:18   trying to find his father whose live [TS]

00:07:19   living in a a an imaginary kind of [TS]

00:07:24   parallel universe that he's trying to [TS]

00:07:26   track him down and as a science fiction [TS]

00:07:30   story that's the point where i really [TS]

00:07:31   started to think what the heck am I [TS]

00:07:33   reading here where it got seriously [TS]

00:07:36   weird [TS]

00:07:37   although I you know I understand it kind [TS]

00:07:39   of on that allegorical level but that's [TS]

00:07:41   where that really weird after he shoots [TS]

00:07:42   himself and and then he's playing all [TS]

00:07:45   the cards right he's like you you're in [TS]

00:07:47   a time loop you you know you're not just [TS]

00:07:48   kill your grandfather you're killing [TS]

00:07:49   yourself you've got a book that's been [TS]

00:07:51   handed to you that you yourself rat [TS]

00:07:53   wrote so how do you write it which is [TS]

00:07:55   your right as you read it it's just [TS]

00:07:57   and that's where it goes it's crazy [TS]

00:07:59   right yeah he's an observer his own past [TS]

00:08:02   with an alternate realities where he [TS]

00:08:04   sees like his mother in a place that she [TS]

00:08:06   doesn't know the woman was the whole the [TS]

00:08:08   woman he never married who is almost [TS]

00:08:10   instantiated [TS]

00:08:12   we'll never fell in love with it's like [TS]

00:08:13   a real person sort of as a construct it [TS]

00:08:16   anything that's a construct in his book [TS]

00:08:18   being can become a real thing that you [TS]

00:08:20   can interact with on everything that's [TS]

00:08:22   could have been possible is it does [TS]

00:08:25   theoretically does exist everywhere and [TS]

00:08:27   I think that's part of it too is that if [TS]

00:08:29   you're writing a biography even you know [TS]

00:08:32   you wonder what might have been and the [TS]

00:08:33   science fictional universe everything [TS]

00:08:34   that might have been it did happen [TS]

00:08:37   somewhere in a in another universe and I [TS]

00:08:40   think that's sort of what he's getting [TS]

00:08:42   at [TS]

00:08:42   Scott what did you think of this one [TS]

00:08:45   ah I thought it was interesting i'm not [TS]

00:08:51   quite sure at I know everyone i read a [TS]

00:08:54   book and I think to myself well often i [TS]

00:08:57   think what i'm reading which is good but [TS]

00:08:59   this is the book which i think is the [TS]

00:09:02   main character insane so does anything [TS]

00:09:05   it is looking actually happened or is [TS]

00:09:08   this all just an insane dream that this [TS]

00:09:11   character is having and I don't know the [TS]

00:09:14   answer to that after reading the book [TS]

00:09:15   whether or not any of these things you [TS]

00:09:17   know within the fictional universe that [TS]

00:09:19   the book inhabits if these events [TS]

00:09:22   actually happened or if this person is [TS]

00:09:24   just insane because you know he has a [TS]

00:09:26   dog that doesn't exist [TS]

00:09:27   he his father apparently invent a time [TS]

00:09:30   machine in their garage but there's no [TS]

00:09:33   real proof that it worked and then we're [TS]

00:09:35   going to show it to someone like a third [TS]

00:09:37   party it didn't work and then all of a [TS]

00:09:39   sudden it did work in the the bad some [TS]

00:09:43   other corporations stole his idea so I [TS]

00:09:46   don't know maybe I'm crazy [TS]

00:09:48   oh it's it's a strange it's a very [TS]

00:09:52   strange book and I wouldn't i wouldn't [TS]

00:09:55   say that i liked it actually I thought [TS]

00:09:58   it was I thought it was interesting and [TS]

00:09:59   it was very interesting to see him the [TS]

00:10:02   author make these I just crazy decisions [TS]

00:10:07   to just do i'm going to put it all out [TS]

00:10:08   there i'm going to lay out every single [TS]

00:10:10   science-fictional element you could [TS]

00:10:11   think of and I appreciated as as [TS]

00:10:14   essentially a an exploration of his own [TS]

00:10:17   life of the author's life and his [TS]

00:10:19   relationship with his parents and you [TS]

00:10:22   know I thought it was interesting on [TS]

00:10:23   that level but i honestly cannot say [TS]

00:10:25   that i enjoyed reading and I I thought [TS]

00:10:27   it was yeah weird and you know a little [TS]

00:10:30   bit off-putting and i'm not quite sure [TS]

00:10:32   we ever really get a good grip on who [TS]

00:10:35   the who the narrator is I feel in some [TS]

00:10:38   ways that i had a UH you know it was [TS]

00:10:40   hard [TS]

00:10:41   a lot of the characters there it's [TS]

00:10:42   almost like they're sort of shadow [TS]

00:10:44   figures where you know their present but [TS]

00:10:46   I'm not really quite sure who they are [TS]

00:10:47   and that goes for the narrator but also [TS]

00:10:49   goes for the mother and the father too [TS]

00:10:51   yeah I wouldn't say exactly sort of it [TS]

00:10:54   you know that there's a joke and laurie [TS]

00:10:55   anderson album about like welcome to [TS]

00:10:57   distant difficult listening our pleas [TS]

00:11:00   button your top button on your shirt [TS]

00:11:02   sit back and you know bolt upright [TS]

00:11:04   uncomfortable chair and prepared to [TS]

00:11:06   listen to some difficult music and I'm [TS]

00:11:09   always like that's that's what it's [TS]

00:11:10   about it like this is a hard book to [TS]

00:11:12   read [TS]

00:11:13   is it worth it I'm still not sure after [TS]

00:11:15   you finish that was disappointed by how [TS]

00:11:18   conventionally the book was brought to a [TS]

00:11:20   conclusion i get close inclusion I mean [TS]

00:11:22   not exactly something is not [TS]

00:11:24   conventional I just thought it wasn't [TS]

00:11:25   didn't fulfill its promise of how [TS]

00:11:27   strange it was by how it ended but it [TS]

00:11:31   was it was an attempt to write something [TS]

00:11:33   that was not easy to read and I wasn't [TS]

00:11:36   really in before structurally in [TS]

00:11:37   Subway's it is i mean it he like i said [TS]

00:11:41   before he pulled out all the stops all [TS]

00:11:43   the tricks right so he's got the the [TS]

00:11:45   this book is quoting itself it you know [TS]

00:11:48   but this book is also quoting from a [TS]

00:11:50   book in the universe and then that book [TS]

00:11:52   is being written in the story and then [TS]

00:11:54   it's being read and written [TS]

00:11:55   simultaneously in the story so it's like [TS]

00:11:57   inside a circle within a circle within a [TS]

00:11:59   circle with a circle which you know [TS]

00:12:01   hi it's a high-wire act i I'm not sure [TS]

00:12:04   it really works [TS]

00:12:05   I was thinking actually if I wasn't a [TS]

00:12:08   college literature class [TS]

00:12:12   yeah we got we gotta told go out and buy [TS]

00:12:15   any you know book published in the last [TS]

00:12:17   five years and write a story to write [TS]

00:12:19   out write an essay analyzing it from a [TS]

00:12:21   literature class analysis kind of [TS]

00:12:23   perspective let's take it apart and [TS]

00:12:25   consider what the author is doing I [TS]

00:12:26   would pick a book like this because it [TS]

00:12:29   does like we've been talking about it [TS]

00:12:30   does have all these like layers of what [TS]

00:12:32   does it mean and what's the technique [TS]

00:12:33   and and and on that level it's [TS]

00:12:36   interesting is it but that's not [TS]

00:12:39   a level of you know entertainment value [TS]

00:12:41   i guess i would say so it's so much as [TS]

00:12:44   it is you know it interesting to defect [TS]

00:12:47   to do as an autopsy really you know what [TS]

00:12:51   this reminds me most closely of its some [TS]

00:12:52   level as Nicholson Baker's mezzanine if [TS]

00:12:55   either of you have read that book i have [TS]

00:12:57   not I have not either [TS]

00:12:58   it is an interesting piece of writing [TS]

00:13:00   with more out of every web Scott no [TS]

00:13:01   bearing on comparables on the Capitals I [TS]

00:13:04   don't think wasn't comfortable on the [TS]

00:13:06   mezzanine is Nicholson Baker think it's [TS]

00:13:08   one of his first books it's um is a [TS]

00:13:10   nonfiction one could argue with some [TS]

00:13:13   level it is the entire set of thoughts [TS]

00:13:16   that goes through his head ostensibly [TS]

00:13:18   from the top of an escalator to the [TS]

00:13:20   bottom and occupies a 250 pages and it [TS]

00:13:23   is you read it and it is absolutely [TS]

00:13:24   understandable as a stream of [TS]

00:13:26   consciousness of all the things that are [TS]

00:13:28   sort of minut switches and how we you [TS]

00:13:32   know cogitate while we are ostensibly [TS]

00:13:33   doing one activity or just even [TS]

00:13:35   daydreaming [TS]

00:13:36   it's a beautiful thing and it's one of [TS]

00:13:38   the greatest things written i actually [TS]

00:13:40   already i would argue because it's so [TS]

00:13:42   it's unique and it is is so beautiful [TS]

00:13:45   its way so there's there are some things [TS]

00:13:46   in common i think between that where [TS]

00:13:48   this is incredibly intense self-analysis [TS]

00:13:51   that's presented in many many different [TS]

00:13:53   allegorical and biographical ways that [TS]

00:13:58   sounds awful [TS]

00:13:59   yeah it's not fun for science but if [TS]

00:14:02   we're doing you see no this isn't i'll [TS]

00:14:04   bring a metal argument since we're doing [TS]

00:14:06   everything is collapsing and expanding [TS]

00:14:07   above us in this book you know she the [TS]

00:14:09   in the this podcast I mean geeky things [TS]

00:14:12   Dukey things can they not be hard to [TS]

00:14:15   read I'm gonna need to be good but [TS]

00:14:16   cannot be hard [TS]

00:14:17   well they can but i think it can be hard [TS]

00:14:19   i actually liked this book i think i [TS]

00:14:21   would recommend it but I also you know I [TS]

00:14:24   went to I was an English major so I [TS]

00:14:26   spent a lot of time thinking about this [TS]

00:14:28   stuff and my area of interest when I was [TS]

00:14:31   you know have breeding for criticizing [TS]

00:14:34   things was postmodern fiction and this [TS]

00:14:37   is all the the quintessential kind of [TS]

00:14:39   postmodern thing whenever you know [TS]

00:14:40   whenever an author is a main character [TS]

00:14:43   of their own book i'm interested i [TS]

00:14:45   don't--that's haha [TS]

00:14:47   that is an understanding and a book is [TS]

00:14:50   written in the book and read and written [TS]

00:14:52   inside is how many have never met levels [TS]

00:14:54   of Medicaid you get here it's craziness [TS]

00:14:56   and it reminds me of another author uh [TS]

00:14:59   Don Pardo may I don't know if anyone has [TS]

00:15:02   told ya Donnell Barthelemy yes yeah I [TS]

00:15:04   love him short stories a lot of we're [TS]

00:15:06   here as well I think he's dead now but [TS]

00:15:08   may be alive if he's not dead is between [TS]

00:15:11   these two living brothers also extremely [TS]

00:15:12   good writers yes I actually don't like [TS]

00:15:14   his the one brothers are gamblers and [TS]

00:15:16   he's that's about gambling yet [TS]

00:15:18   understand i don't really like he's [TS]

00:15:19   right by the way his his short stories [TS]

00:15:21   are very odd and very entertaining [TS]

00:15:26   he had one short story about a woman who [TS]

00:15:27   gave birth to a giant Ruby and another [TS]

00:15:31   one about a church built a town that was [TS]

00:15:33   only churches so that kind of thing and [TS]

00:15:36   so it really reminded me of that [TS]

00:15:38   that's good that is that weirdness that [TS]

00:15:40   the writer sits down and writes [TS]

00:15:42   something that is challenging an insane [TS]

00:15:45   and they just go with it they don't back [TS]

00:15:47   off you didn't write this [TS]

00:15:48   Charles you didn't write this up i don't [TS]

00:15:50   know this little out there maybe I [TS]

00:15:51   should dumb it down and make it feel [TS]

00:15:53   more like conventional stuff because [TS]

00:15:55   I'll some more copies he put something [TS]

00:15:57   really hard and strange and personal [TS]

00:16:00   yeah I don't know if it was successful [TS]

00:16:02   but I enjoyed it i don't know I a great [TS]

00:16:04   place and I don't think it was a [TS]

00:16:05   satisfying hunger but I did like it i'm [TS]

00:16:09   gonna read it [TS]

00:16:10   yeah i mean i-i i bring this up on the [TS]

00:16:12   podcast a lot but I sort of think there [TS]

00:16:14   are a couple different ways you can [TS]

00:16:15   appreciate something and sometimes [TS]

00:16:17   you'll get one of the other sometimes [TS]

00:16:18   you get both sometimes you'll get [TS]

00:16:19   neither and i got on one level for me I [TS]

00:16:22   appreciate the the the craftsmanship of [TS]

00:16:26   the work and how its put together and on [TS]

00:16:28   that level i really appreciate this [TS]

00:16:29   because i thought was very interesting [TS]

00:16:30   what he chose to do with it [TS]

00:16:32   the other level is sort of maybe you'd [TS]

00:16:34   say it's a little more emotional or it's [TS]

00:16:35   just you know I am i enjoying it as a as [TS]

00:16:38   a tale as a an entertainment experience [TS]

00:16:42   and that level i don't i don't think i [TS]

00:16:43   would say work for me but I'm not on the [TS]

00:16:46   first level it did and and to your point [TS]

00:16:48   Glenn I do think that science fiction or [TS]

00:16:52   any other genre it doesn't have to be [TS]

00:16:53   hard but it it could be hard and if the [TS]

00:16:56   if a work is difficult to [TS]

00:16:58   to parse that can be a it can be [TS]

00:17:02   engaging it could be interesting [TS]

00:17:04   it can be frustrating and sometimes I [TS]

00:17:06   think those things work and sometimes [TS]

00:17:07   they don't [TS]

00:17:08   I'm not quite sure what I feel about [TS]

00:17:09   this i mean this this was on one level I [TS]

00:17:13   wouldn't say this book is challenging i [TS]

00:17:15   didn't find it hard to read it right i [TS]

00:17:17   mean it is because it's using these kind [TS]

00:17:19   of sci-fi tropes i√≠ve i found it [TS]

00:17:22   readable [TS]

00:17:24   i I just I just I guess found a little [TS]

00:17:26   bit off-putting and all i could see what [TS]

00:17:28   he was doing in his craftsmanship [TS]

00:17:30   I wasn't sure at the end of it that I [TS]

00:17:32   you know I really felt connected enough [TS]

00:17:35   to it to say I I you know enjoyed the [TS]

00:17:38   ride I more appreciated the work that [TS]

00:17:40   went into it then I enjoyed the ride I [TS]

00:17:42   guess but it's not it's not very subtle [TS]

00:17:43   book he isn't trying to hide his ground [TS]

00:17:46   it is all right there is like look at me [TS]

00:17:48   I'm a writer [TS]

00:17:49   well anyways that's that I mean that's [TS]

00:17:52   the whole book is look at me right i [TS]

00:17:54   mean it's me i'm a writer this is about [TS]

00:17:55   me or is it i want to i want to be a [TS]

00:18:00   very short passage that is that stuck [TS]

00:18:02   struck me as a writer and you guys will [TS]

00:18:03   appreciate this as well and it's clearly [TS]

00:18:05   as a writer this is the fantasy of every [TS]

00:18:07   writer is this is a section is it [TS]

00:18:09   location 1282 in the kindle edition [TS]

00:18:12   which is not IM 1282 after the card hole [TS]

00:18:16   12 babies are very good talking about [TS]

00:18:18   the tow the textual object analysis [TS]

00:18:20   device that is interacts with him as he [TS]

00:18:23   is writing the book that he is reading [TS]

00:18:24   and the TM 31 is his time machine model [TS]

00:18:27   31 that his father apparently prototypes [TS]

00:18:29   he says he's talking about reading the [TS]

00:18:31   book he says in essence my reading is a [TS]

00:18:33   creative act the product of which is [TS]

00:18:35   being captured by the toad i'm typing [TS]

00:18:37   even though strictly speaking I'm using [TS]

00:18:39   the TM 30 ones cognitive visual motor [TS]

00:18:41   sound active is activated recording [TS]

00:18:44   module which operates as you might guess [TS]

00:18:45   by simultaneously tracking output from [TS]

00:18:48   the users neural activity voice finger [TS]

00:18:50   movements retinol movements and facial [TS]

00:18:51   muscle contractions part keyboard part [TS]

00:18:53   microphone part optical scan and part [TS]

00:18:55   brain scan when I want to type i raise [TS]

00:18:57   my hands up in front of the palms down [TS]

00:18:59   in a position approximate IP typing in a [TS]

00:19:02   virtual qwerty layout materializes in [TS]

00:19:03   front of me and it goes on in that vein [TS]

00:19:05   that you can see the writer who is [TS]

00:19:07   probably having horrible problems [TS]

00:19:09   writing thinking of all the ways in [TS]

00:19:11   which devices could [TS]

00:19:12   he invented that would make the process [TS]

00:19:14   of writing easier by allowing all these [TS]

00:19:16   modalities that you know tap into your [TS]

00:19:19   brain your intentions and even your you [TS]

00:19:21   know subconscious basically i think it [TS]

00:19:24   and it comes out over here although i'm [TS]

00:19:26   not sure exactly what I'm thinking so I [TS]

00:19:28   don't know what's going to come out of [TS]

00:19:29   that reminds me a little of philip k [TS]

00:19:30   dick the man in the high castle which he [TS]

00:19:33   wrote i believe that this is to the [TS]

00:19:35   thing is verified is true by cast [TS]

00:19:37   casting eaching all the decisions he [TS]

00:19:40   made worth reaching the novel is kind of [TS]

00:19:42   crazy and viewers all over the place and [TS]

00:19:44   in the novel in the novel it's [TS]

00:19:47   understood that the universe doesn't [TS]

00:19:49   exist in which the characters live they [TS]

00:19:50   discovered this that it's a fake [TS]

00:19:52   parallel universe in which decisions are [TS]

00:19:54   being made de qing i'm looking at my [TS]

00:19:58   highlights on my candle actually for [TS]

00:20:00   this book and and here's here's the one [TS]

00:20:03   that I i highlighted that I think is [TS]

00:20:05   interesting this is from 26 27 and other [TS]

00:20:08   excellent location i love 260 uh my [TS]

00:20:11   inner monologue that running story I've [TS]

00:20:13   been telling myself ever since the [TS]

00:20:14   moment I learned to talk since before [TS]

00:20:16   that even since I learned to think the [TS]

00:20:17   story i began to tell while still in [TS]

00:20:19   diapers in the crib the babbling [TS]

00:20:20   commentary sometimes audible sometimes [TS]

00:20:22   not that accelerated into childhood and [TS]

00:20:24   then beyond became a tortured and [TS]

00:20:25   anguish story in puberty this decade [TS]

00:20:28   spanning confabulation that has [TS]

00:20:29   continued up until today up until this [TS]

00:20:31   very moment this monologue of my life [TS]

00:20:33   that will keep running and running and [TS]

00:20:34   running until it gets cut off abruptly [TS]

00:20:35   at the moment of my death and i thought [TS]

00:20:38   you know that was really interesting and [TS]

00:20:40   also again wheels within wheels you know [TS]

00:20:42   it's a story about telling the story [TS]

00:20:44   that it's about which isn't over yet [TS]

00:20:47   until it until it ends except that he he [TS]

00:20:49   ends it and then continues because he [TS]

00:20:51   shoots himself and didn't notice that [TS]

00:20:56   the end the book ends with a picture of [TS]

00:20:57   the book's cover an additional [TS]

00:20:59   information that appears to be the start [TS]

00:21:01   of the book just to make that all you [TS]

00:21:03   know sure we get there were some i will [TS]

00:21:07   say it's aight aight this is we're [TS]

00:21:09   talking about this and it makes it sound [TS]

00:21:10   like this is a really you know kind of a [TS]

00:21:12   downer of a book and it's not there's [TS]

00:21:14   actually a lot of funny stuff in it he [TS]

00:21:16   talks about playing games as a kid and [TS]

00:21:19   how they would play star wars and and [TS]

00:21:23   there's a hilarious part where he says [TS]

00:21:25   first first dibs get on [TS]

00:21:26   solo everyone knows that you don't have [TS]

00:21:28   to say it if you are first [TS]

00:21:29   you are Han Solo period which is great [TS]

00:21:33   awesome so there's a lot of funny stuff [TS]

00:21:35   in here to about this guy some [TS]

00:21:37   hitchhikers guide stuff too i mean not [TS]

00:21:39   some of it i think is no modulation some [TS]

00:21:41   of its just you know intentional but [TS]

00:21:43   like you know instead of having a [TS]

00:21:44   paranoid android he has a depressed hey [TS]

00:21:47   I who is pretty funny and and who [TS]

00:21:49   evolves over time and develops more of a [TS]

00:21:51   personality as a distinct entity you [TS]

00:21:54   know not just sort of a plot device by [TS]

00:21:56   the end of the book kind of a love story [TS]

00:21:57   really [TS]

00:21:58   yeah he's in love with his AI know it's [TS]

00:21:59   typical store typically sci-fi story [TS]

00:22:02   love with an artificial construct that's [TS]

00:22:03   right yeah we meet say I if it's your [TS]

00:22:06   typical the other yeah [TS]

00:22:08   the other item I i highlighted I i quote [TS]

00:22:11   from location 839 of course like it's [TS]

00:22:14   like a a sermon right like John book 3 [TS]

00:22:18   chapter 12 snow its location 839 is but [TS]

00:22:22   I love this because just as use of [TS]

00:22:24   language he says I stand there for a [TS]

00:22:25   while [TS]

00:22:26   shivering stuck trapped free and at that [TS]

00:22:31   moment where he he he's because he's [TS]

00:22:34   been trapped in this time machine and [TS]

00:22:37   then all of a sudden he's living in real [TS]

00:22:39   time and he has to walk around and he's [TS]

00:22:41   got like a whole night and he's staying [TS]

00:22:42   at his apartment where the guy at the [TS]

00:22:45   front desk keep seeing him come in every [TS]

00:22:47   day at but that over the last week he's [TS]

00:22:49   aged 10 years because we only spend the [TS]

00:22:52   night there occasionally and any street [TS]

00:22:54   and he's he's trapped now because he's [TS]

00:22:57   in time and so even though he's free his [TS]

00:23:00   freedom is a prison to him which is I [TS]

00:23:03   mean to go back to the point of busy [TS]

00:23:05   crazy he having there is that aspect of [TS]

00:23:08   it which is you know wow this is a guy [TS]

00:23:10   who does not want to live his life and [TS]

00:23:12   does not want time it in the world to to [TS]

00:23:16   move he just doesn't even want to be in [TS]

00:23:17   the world and it's unclear whether he [TS]

00:23:20   succeeds our door but it's awful it's an [TS]

00:23:24   uplifting story really [TS]

00:23:26   sorry man transcending himself [TS]

00:23:28   transcending himself facing suicide if [TS]

00:23:31   you shoot yourself in a time loop that [TS]

00:23:34   is a good question or is it murder [TS]

00:23:37   there's a there's a sci-fi story i [TS]

00:23:39   cannot recall the name of which is my [TS]

00:23:40   theme for today I can't call the name of [TS]

00:23:42   a sci-fi story in which kids are allowed [TS]

00:23:46   to visit the future like they take high [TS]

00:23:48   school kids on a trip into their own [TS]

00:23:50   future bodies in a way that they may not [TS]

00:23:53   remember entirely but they can see where [TS]

00:23:55   they go and it's a cut it's totally [TS]

00:23:57   ridiculous but there's a bit where this [TS]

00:24:00   very nerdy kid and the high school [TS]

00:24:02   beauty wind up like they're married and [TS]

00:24:04   she can't believe this in the future [TS]

00:24:05   they would be possibly be married you [TS]

00:24:07   know in their fifties or sixties and she [TS]

00:24:09   accepts it and they spend their life [TS]

00:24:11   together and understand what's going you [TS]

00:24:12   know they have this whatever week [TS]

00:24:13   together in the future and on the way [TS]

00:24:15   back like she somehow managed to get a [TS]

00:24:17   hold of a gun and she shoots him as they [TS]

00:24:19   are pulled back into the past and kills [TS]

00:24:21   him and destroys our own future like [TS]

00:24:25   murder-suicide time travel pretty great [TS]

00:24:27   little plot story not so good that plot [TS]

00:24:30   element excellent murder she will write [TS]

00:24:33   with the you know it [TS]

00:24:36   that reminds me of something my wife [TS]

00:24:38   always says about christmas christmas [TS]

00:24:40   movies and and and TV shows where [TS]

00:24:43   they're always trying to save Christmas [TS]

00:24:44   because it turns out the christmas is [TS]

00:24:46   just this close to being a radically [TS]

00:24:49   forever if one thing doesn't happen to [TS]

00:24:52   save it and that Dad strikes me as very [TS]

00:24:54   similar which is you know the future [TS]

00:24:55   future one little thing and the whole [TS]

00:24:58   future is ruined [TS]

00:25:00   oh I'm sorry I just stepped on a [TS]

00:25:01   butterfly should be in this part of this [TS]

00:25:04   podcast never existed [TS]

00:25:05   you can't because I can be over it never [TS]

00:25:08   began i'll say that's one of the most [TS]

00:25:10   disturbing thing about the crisis series [TS]

00:25:12   of DC Comics many many DC Comics a lot [TS]

00:25:15   of crisis let me tell you quickly [TS]

00:25:16   Infinite Crisis placing multiple [TS]

00:25:19   multiverse Christ standing Rice's [TS]

00:25:21   problem is in crisis if they have many [TS]

00:25:23   many crises but one of his a disturbing [TS]

00:25:25   most like metaphysically about those [TS]

00:25:27   books was the sort of retro acting like [TS]

00:25:29   none of these worlds ever existed [TS]

00:25:31   despite the complex you might have that [TS]

00:25:32   take place in them it like the you know [TS]

00:25:34   not only are you dead but you never [TS]

00:25:37   existed and such [TS]

00:25:38   horrible concept that I think science [TS]

00:25:40   fiction can express an existential like [TS]

00:25:43   a double existential dread that is [TS]

00:25:46   impossible to to present in on [TS]

00:25:48   speculative fiction because then we [TS]

00:25:51   cannot speculate that we never existed [TS]

00:25:52   in you know a traditional narrative and [TS]

00:25:55   what does that say about the people who [TS]

00:25:57   read science fiction [TS]

00:25:58   that's what I want to know where all [TS]

00:25:59   depressed again I'm not every science [TS]

00:26:03   because it makes me happy smiley it is a [TS]

00:26:07   happy happy thing I I yeah it's a it's i [TS]

00:26:12   don't know i don't even know what I'm [TS]

00:26:13   saying now i will stand more over here [TS]

00:26:15   he would agree with you he'd make it [TS]

00:26:18   alright good [TS]

00:26:21   he would know it's it's you know the [TS]

00:26:24   whole idea of the you've never even [TS]

00:26:27   existed in and all that man that's what [TS]

00:26:29   I love about science fiction is that you [TS]

00:26:31   can add to talk about Charles use book I [TS]

00:26:34   mean he's using the science fictional [TS]

00:26:36   concepts to talk about his own life and [TS]

00:26:38   that's one of the things I love about [TS]

00:26:40   science fiction is that you can tell a [TS]

00:26:41   story and make it interesting and and [TS]

00:26:45   and make an argument even in a way that [TS]

00:26:48   you wouldn't necessarily do in something [TS]

00:26:51   that was mainstream by by changing the [TS]

00:26:53   parameters you are able to explore the [TS]

00:26:57   concept more than you would if you were [TS]

00:26:58   burdened by today's reality and that [TS]

00:27:00   goes back to you know Star Trek telling [TS]

00:27:02   you know that parables were Frank [TS]

00:27:04   Gorshin is you know half black and half [TS]

00:27:06   white and can't we all just get along [TS]

00:27:08   and whom that might have some bearing [TS]

00:27:10   and modern sixties culture but i think [TS]

00:27:14   it's true that one of the things I love [TS]

00:27:15   about size that you can explore these [TS]

00:27:18   concepts that might be much more [TS]

00:27:19   difficult to explore if you are grounded [TS]

00:27:22   in reality by taking it out of reality [TS]

00:27:24   and making it completely ridiculous but [TS]

00:27:26   and sci-fi is the best sci-fi i think is [TS]

00:27:29   often not about the future but about the [TS]

00:27:30   president's right so frightened think [TS]

00:27:33   about that right why you could argue [TS]

00:27:35   that yeah that that any good size is [TS]

00:27:37   really about when it was written and the [TS]

00:27:40   perceptions of the future and where [TS]

00:27:41   things are going at the time it was [TS]

00:27:43   written i'm going to write a kind of [TS]

00:27:45   science fiction looks backwards so that [TS]

00:27:46   it's it's the year 2010 and mainframe [TS]

00:27:49   computers [TS]

00:27:50   with giant vacuum tubes are still in use [TS]

00:27:52   and that's always been your guests are [TS]

00:27:54   all things that ya know steampunk that's [TS]

00:27:56   steampunk positive we're still living in [TS]

00:27:58   1800 we have the technology is there is [TS]

00:28:00   there [TS]

00:28:01   retro retro steampunk in which it's the [TS]

00:28:03   21st century but we're using steampunk [TS]

00:28:05   technology i have wow I've outstripped [TS]

00:28:08   you I've stripped from here you blow my [TS]

00:28:10   mind [TS]

00:28:11   you blew my vacuum too so so let's in [TS]

00:28:15   the in the in the future podcast will be [TS]

00:28:17   radio program thousand that would be [TS]

00:28:21   awesome [TS]

00:28:22   let's talk about time travel a little [TS]

00:28:23   bit that wewe with Charles you obviously [TS]

00:28:26   we have a story that's all about time [TS]

00:28:28   travel [TS]

00:28:29   I'm wondering though this is such a [TS]

00:28:32   common concept in sci-fi writing and [TS]

00:28:36   there's so many things to choose from [TS]

00:28:38   i'm wondering if you guys have any [TS]

00:28:40   particular instances of of time-travel [TS]

00:28:42   novels that you've particularly liked or [TS]

00:28:45   disliked Scott yes I think I uh-huh [TS]

00:28:51   that is as though I knew this question [TS]

00:28:53   was going to be asked because I have an [TS]

00:28:54   answer I i would point to probably the [TS]

00:28:58   first and this may in fact be the first [TS]

00:29:00   science-fiction novel I ever read so and [TS]

00:29:04   i haven't read it since I was you know [TS]

00:29:06   in elementary school I imagine a time [TS]

00:29:11   and again by Jack Finney which is all [TS]

00:29:14   about time travel and jack but he also [TS]

00:29:18   wrote invasion of the Body Snatchers if [TS]

00:29:20   anyone cares about that and so the great [TS]

00:29:24   thing about this book is it set in New [TS]

00:29:27   York which I always liked reading books [TS]

00:29:29   that are set in New York City and the [TS]

00:29:30   main character travels back in time to [TS]

00:29:33   eighteen hundreds New York which is also [TS]

00:29:35   something that I had shohei in fact this [TS]

00:29:38   may have this book may have started [TS]

00:29:40   mother at all starting your obsession [TS]

00:29:42   with eighteen hundreds of new york [TS]

00:29:44   Oh [TS]

00:29:45   and so the idea is that the government [TS]

00:29:49   its 1970 and the government starts this [TS]

00:29:51   program to figure out if they can time [TS]

00:29:53   travel and the way they think that you [TS]

00:29:55   can time travel is if you live so it's [TS]

00:29:58   in 1970 so they after this warehouse [TS]

00:30:00   with a you know period rooms and they [TS]

00:30:04   have people live as though they were in [TS]

00:30:06   you know 1880 and using only the power [TS]

00:30:09   of your mind you are transported to that [TS]

00:30:12   time period so that the main character [TS]

00:30:15   does in fact transport himself to that [TS]

00:30:18   time period and a variety of hijinks [TS]

00:30:22   ensue and including where he's the [TS]

00:30:25   government wants him to change the past [TS]

00:30:27   so that you know certain things don't [TS]

00:30:29   happen and people don't meet that need [TS]

00:30:31   to meet and he you know so it's a very [TS]

00:30:35   interesting book and kind of a [TS]

00:30:36   prototypical to me at least a [TS]

00:30:37   time-travel science fiction novel and it [TS]

00:30:41   has illustrations [TS]

00:30:42   oh nice when what about you [TS]

00:30:46   I'm gonna reach into the past to I guess [TS]

00:30:48   appropriate for talking about time for [TS]

00:30:49   coupling say grace upon a time was [TS]

00:30:52   probably one of my are James P Hogan [TS]

00:30:55   yeah now he did he pass away he recently [TS]

00:30:57   passed away and he actually lived for [TS]

00:30:59   several years in my hometown and I met [TS]

00:31:01   him when I was kid and Delta and yes a [TS]

00:31:04   very nice fellow and it's definitely [TS]

00:31:05   passed away recently and in 2010 [TS]

00:31:08   I think I dedicate this podcast today we [TS]

00:31:10   do to James P hogan who wrote great by [TS]

00:31:13   the way great novel love inherit the [TS]

00:31:15   stars which was written on a band glow [TS]

00:31:17   familiar i don't recall that the it was [TS]

00:31:22   written on a bad we're all that he was [TS]

00:31:24   working at digital equipment in Ireland [TS]

00:31:26   i think at the time and and he said he [TS]

00:31:28   had this idea of astronauts go to the [TS]

00:31:31   moon and they find a dead body of an of [TS]

00:31:34   a guy in a spacesuit that is completely [TS]

00:31:36   unrecognizable that's been there for [TS]

00:31:40   thousands of years and it's something [TS]

00:31:41   supplement up and and one of his [TS]

00:31:43   co-workers said I i bet you can't write [TS]

00:31:46   that story and he did and he got it [TS]

00:31:49   published and that was his first novel [TS]

00:31:50   you know it has like has a fantastic [TS]

00:31:52   cover because i just googled it [TS]

00:31:54   it doesn't it lets the two it's the two [TS]

00:31:56   astronauts and you can get I think we [TS]

00:31:57   mentioned on a podcast before [TS]

00:31:58   actually available for free download on [TS]

00:32:00   pub download I believe still from band [TS]

00:32:04   like it's got that great cover with the [TS]

00:32:06   two astronauts who are looking over a [TS]

00:32:07   rock and there's the guy the dead the [TS]

00:32:09   skeleton any orange space yeah it kind [TS]

00:32:12   of looks like a rebel fighter from Star [TS]

00:32:15   Wars yeah and it's and that's actually [TS]

00:32:16   the start of a series there are sequels [TS]

00:32:18   although it doesn't read like to also [TS]

00:32:20   mention things that we mentioned in [TS]

00:32:22   previous podcast it doesn't it's not [TS]

00:32:23   like there were he wrote one book and [TS]

00:32:24   chopped into three to make you buy three [TS]

00:32:26   books and it stands alone but then some [TS]

00:32:29   of the concepts that come out in the [TS]

00:32:31   kind of you know fascinating and semi [TS]

00:32:33   scientifically inaccurate but still [TS]

00:32:35   fascinating resolution to this plot of [TS]

00:32:37   how this guy could be their leadoff to [TS]

00:32:39   the sequel books which are actually also [TS]

00:32:40   pretty good anyway the three upon a time [TS]

00:32:42   is more hard sci-fi about how would you [TS]

00:32:45   send a message back in time right yeah [TS]

00:32:47   that's that's right and I i wanted to [TS]

00:32:49   point out that some of the best fiction [TS]

00:32:50   ever written was written because of bar [TS]

00:32:52   bets and then that's so what does a best [TS]

00:32:56   buy CS lewis wrote his perelandra series [TS]

00:32:58   because he and I and J are talking were [TS]

00:33:01   great buddies sort of challenge each [TS]

00:33:03   other to wright sci fi books and oddly [TS]

00:33:05   talking never wrote his I would have [TS]

00:33:07   been curious to see ants in the space it [TS]

00:33:11   would have been boring [TS]

00:33:13   yeah we've been terribly boy but wait [TS]

00:33:15   until tom bombadil appears at the space [TS]

00:33:18   books to sing his space song in a [TS]

00:33:21   strange language for saving our april [TS]

00:33:24   edition comfortable being developed as [TS]

00:33:26   we speak we working on the script for [TS]

00:33:28   that race upon a time for a spot of time [TS]

00:33:30   one so this is guest book about nineteen [TS]

00:33:32   eighty and i think i read it right [TS]

00:33:33   around that time so I was one-year-old [TS]

00:33:35   know i was about was a 12 at the time [TS]

00:33:38   perfect time to i was already exposed to [TS]

00:33:40   sci-fi but I read this book and I i [TS]

00:33:42   remember i read it again several years [TS]

00:33:44   ago and I remember it so distinctly [TS]

00:33:46   because it's a very sweet book it's got [TS]

00:33:48   great [TS]

00:33:49   hard-science elements in it it's got a [TS]

00:33:51   very innocent love story in the middle [TS]

00:33:53   it's got tales of loyalty it's got [TS]

00:33:55   kittens or a kitten i should say a sort [TS]

00:33:58   of quantum kitten in its the most [TS]

00:34:01   dangerous kind any instead of a [TS]

00:34:04   butterfly [TS]

00:34:05   there's a ball of paper bomb bomb bomb [TS]

00:34:08   bomb that plays a key role in it but [TS]

00:34:11   but i think the book part of it is it's [TS]

00:34:12   his just such a sweet book that the [TS]

00:34:15   basic plot is that this fellow is uncle [TS]

00:34:18   like an oversized uncle or a distant [TS]

00:34:20   relative goes to work with his uncle in [TS]

00:34:21   somewhere in the UK and Scotland write a [TS]

00:34:24   lot about the plot i should i should [TS]

00:34:26   come prepared with a lot but this fellow [TS]

00:34:28   has developed a machine this older [TS]

00:34:30   fellows developed a device that allows [TS]

00:34:33   you to send a message back in time but [TS]

00:34:36   only two previous versions of the same [TS]

00:34:39   machine right which is a brilliant [TS]

00:34:40   concept in on a different basis in [TS]

00:34:43   reality yeah there's some stereo exactly [TS]

00:34:45   you could build conceivably have some [TS]

00:34:47   theories check out and you might have to [TS]

00:34:48   you know who knows what the machines [TS]

00:34:50   nature be or the size of it or the power [TS]

00:34:52   requirements but it is conceivable you [TS]

00:34:53   could build a machine that if the theory [TS]

00:34:55   were consistent future iterations of the [TS]

00:34:58   machine or other devices could [TS]

00:34:59   correspond so kind of he was a way ahead [TS]

00:35:01   of his time it right the movie primer is [TS]

00:35:03   very similar which I love by the way and [TS]

00:35:05   i highly recommend and in that movie you [TS]

00:35:07   have to build the time machine flip it [TS]

00:35:09   on and then wait and then in the future [TS]

00:35:13   you can get in it and come back to the [TS]

00:35:15   point where you flipped it on right and [TS]

00:35:17   I sorta like sort of like that ties in [TS]

00:35:18   with Hawkins theories and so forth so [TS]

00:35:20   will you know what we want to the math [TS]

00:35:22   here of course will be working on their [TS]

00:35:23   own [TS]

00:35:24   that's right home but your whiteboard [TS]

00:35:26   but yeah yeah it's all I'm so you know [TS]

00:35:28   where I found the detail it is Murdock [TS]

00:35:30   Ross and his friend visit marks [TS]

00:35:32   grandfather in Scotland I didn't over [TS]

00:35:34   some details [TS]

00:35:35   he's figured this out in what happens is [TS]

00:35:37   this is a seminal year in which is [TS]

00:35:39   supposed to be oh it's supposed to be [TS]

00:35:41   december 2009 even I didn't realize this [TS]

00:35:43   was set more in the future that is on [TS]

00:35:45   our far the future and want to the earth [TS]

00:35:48   be like the photograph for the drawing [TS]

00:35:50   on the covers marvelous is using a pet [TS]

00:35:52   computer clearly a pet with three minor [TS]

00:35:54   modifications awesome but anyway that so [TS]

00:35:57   the novel is just a bunch of events [TS]

00:35:58   happen that you're including again from [TS]

00:36:01   the future Large Hadron Collider style [TS]

00:36:04   micro black holes being created after [TS]

00:36:07   the device is switched on not because of [TS]

00:36:09   the device so they're able through the [TS]

00:36:11   device to continuously change history [TS]

00:36:13   and very small ways but only within the [TS]

00:36:15   confines of the narrative structure [TS]

00:36:17   which is one thing is beautiful and the [TS]

00:36:18   fellow falls in love doesn't fall in [TS]

00:36:20   love falls and his friend is dying is [TS]

00:36:22   not dying [TS]

00:36:23   he kidding basketball one-way wallpaper1 [TS]

00:36:26   the other and the book ends with the [TS]

00:36:27   sort of cliffhanger everything I don't [TS]

00:36:29   believe that a sequel was ever written [TS]

00:36:30   but it was sort of you know sort of a [TS]

00:36:32   throwaway as the developers machine [TS]

00:36:36   wakes up one morning it starts the first [TS]

00:36:38   time you turn it on it spews out [TS]

00:36:40   hundreds or thousands of pages [TS]

00:36:42   information including a note from the [TS]

00:36:43   Queen explaining how the entire planet [TS]

00:36:48   will be destroyed that his mom it's [TS]

00:36:52   funny the the well james hogan road [TS]

00:36:56   another time travel book called the [TS]

00:36:59   Proteas operation which is it is [TS]

00:37:01   interesting it but it's mostly [TS]

00:37:03   historical stories about world war two [TS]

00:37:04   and the premises that it's the seventies [TS]

00:37:08   and I the United States is the last [TS]

00:37:12   country to have not fallen to Nazi [TS]

00:37:17   domination and they build a time machine [TS]

00:37:21   and send a small team of people back to [TS]

00:37:23   the beginning of world war two to see if [TS]

00:37:25   they can change the course of history [TS]

00:37:27   and what's delightful about it is [TS]

00:37:29   everything that does they do in back in [TS]

00:37:31   time of course is setting this alternate [TS]

00:37:34   timeline right into our history so [TS]

00:37:37   they're making our history from this [TS]

00:37:40   alternate timeline which is i love i [TS]

00:37:42   love the time travel story in Reverse [TS]

00:37:44   where you're not trying to not change [TS]

00:37:45   the future they're actively trying to [TS]

00:37:47   change the future and what they changed [TS]

00:37:49   it to is our present our our history [TS]

00:37:52   that's good i think it's a good one and [TS]

00:37:54   it's similar in some ways to the book I [TS]

00:37:58   was going to mention one of the books I [TS]

00:37:59   was going to mention which is Timescape [TS]

00:38:00   by Gregory Benford [TS]

00:38:01   oh yes which from 1981 are nineteen [TS]

00:38:04   eighty somewhere in there which I love [TS]

00:38:06   partially because it's at UCSD where I [TS]

00:38:08   went to college it's it's kind of a [TS]

00:38:11   downer i have to say because it said in [TS]

00:38:13   a future time that uh there's been I [TS]

00:38:16   think ecological disasters and [TS]

00:38:18   catastrophes and essentially the [TS]

00:38:21   messages to be you can send messages [TS]

00:38:23   back in time but sadly it doesn't [TS]

00:38:26   actually save the people who are sending [TS]

00:38:28   them because you create your branch off [TS]

00:38:31   what happens at one point in the story [TS]

00:38:32   is that they they make so many changes [TS]

00:38:34   the information they're sending back and [TS]

00:38:36   I'm again trying to base this on [TS]

00:38:37   scientific reality the information [TS]

00:38:39   they're sending back in time is so great [TS]

00:38:41   at one point that it can't reconcile [TS]

00:38:44   itself with the with the future and so [TS]

00:38:48   it sheared off into a parallel universe [TS]

00:38:50   soho so the these guys don't succeed in [TS]

00:38:53   saving themselves they succeed in [TS]

00:38:55   creating a parallel universe that can [TS]

00:38:57   hopefully avoid the mistakes that led to [TS]

00:38:59   this point so it's really kind of dark [TS]

00:39:01   but it's also a very cool very cool [TS]

00:39:05   story so I I'm out that was a hugo [TS]

00:39:07   winner 24 or nebula winner it's what we [TS]

00:39:12   want a couple of those big awards and [TS]

00:39:13   it's good and that Benford who wrote [TS]

00:39:16   that Gregory Benford and Greg bear and [TS]

00:39:18   david brin I think all were at UCSD [TS]

00:39:21   around the killer period yeah i think [TS]

00:39:23   they're all at UCSD which I didn't [TS]

00:39:24   realize when I went there you know ten [TS]

00:39:26   years later to the model seattle-based [TS]

00:39:28   interesting well that's where you go you [TS]

00:39:30   go from one end of the i-5 to the other [TS]

00:39:32   end to bring in there are local killer [TS]

00:39:35   bees and what else i want to mention i [TS]

00:39:38   want to mention connie willis who's [TS]

00:39:39   written a bunch of great time around [TS]

00:39:41   looks the best my favorite of which i [TS]

00:39:43   would say i'm not going to go for [TS]

00:39:45   doomsday book which is also it down or [TS]

00:39:47   I'm gonna go for to say nothing of the [TS]

00:39:48   dog which we mentioned i know in this [TS]

00:39:50   podcast hilarious sort of book of [TS]

00:39:52   Victorian manners [TS]

00:39:54   except it's about time travel just very [TS]

00:39:58   funny funny book for for somebody who's [TS]

00:40:00   written these sort of serious books are [TS]

00:40:02   current pair of books about the Blitz [TS]

00:40:05   and that book about doomsday book which [TS]

00:40:07   is about the plague are really dark and [TS]

00:40:10   yet to say nothing of a dog is it is one [TS]

00:40:13   of the funniest things I've ever read [TS]

00:40:14   it's a very funny book [TS]

00:40:17   speaking of funny books that have been [TS]

00:40:18   mentioned on the podcast before Jasper [TS]

00:40:21   Ford's thursday next series includes a [TS]

00:40:23   character Thursday Next father Colonel [TS]

00:40:26   next was a member of the spec up 12 [TS]

00:40:31   which is an organization that a does [TS]

00:40:34   time travel and in the in that universe [TS]

00:40:38   they're able to time travel because at [TS]

00:40:40   some point in the future time travel [TS]

00:40:42   will be invented so that they can time [TS]

00:40:44   travel and he's gone rogue [TS]

00:40:47   so the the spec op 12 [TS]

00:40:49   sent agents to interrupt his conception [TS]

00:40:51   so he was never existed he never exists [TS]

00:40:54   but he does through some kind of [TS]

00:40:55   manipulation through time he's able to [TS]

00:40:58   exist and he pops up and helps Thursday [TS]

00:41:00   Next through her adventures every once [TS]

00:41:02   in a while I would also mention outside [TS]

00:41:05   no go ahead i would also mention the [TS]

00:41:07   evolutionary void which I wanted to [TS]

00:41:09   mention in passing i will mention again [TS]

00:41:11   we talked about what we are reading but [TS]

00:41:12   it has is very it's a trilogy has a very [TS]

00:41:14   odd conception of time travel in it [TS]

00:41:16   which is that rather than travel through [TS]

00:41:19   time you store the a pocket universe [TS]

00:41:22   inside our universe powered by [TS]

00:41:24   destroying stars outside this pocket [TS]

00:41:27   universe stores a backup copy of [TS]

00:41:30   everything that's happened it's time [TS]

00:41:32   machine for a time machine at the apple [TS]

00:41:35   product for science fiction so if [TS]

00:41:38   something goes wrong you can consciously [TS]

00:41:39   cause the entire universe you're into [TS]

00:41:42   rewind at great great expense to the [TS]

00:41:44   star fields outside and then just do it [TS]

00:41:47   over and the story of the the source of [TS]

00:41:50   trilogy and the story centers on a bunch [TS]

00:41:53   of Brazilian characters and it's like [TS]

00:41:55   2,000 pages long but it's a unique [TS]

00:41:57   anything unique conception of time [TS]

00:41:59   travel as a capability of resetting [TS]

00:42:02   reality as opposed to traveling through [TS]

00:42:04   the outside reality continues to flow at [TS]

00:42:06   normal time while this pocket universe [TS]

00:42:07   is entirely different reality in which [TS]

00:42:10   the changed events can be seen as well [TS]

00:42:12   as other the old events can be seen as [TS]

00:42:14   part of a narrative in which the change [TS]

00:42:16   occurs within it isn't that the [TS]

00:42:18   resolution of the latest season of [TS]

00:42:20   doctor who basically that they have a [TS]

00:42:22   backup for the end of her it's only have [TS]

00:42:24   a reboot it's on a backup it's more like [TS]

00:42:26   open Amy Amy remembers things and that's [TS]

00:42:29   she's the backup [TS]

00:42:30   it's like an install disk alright okay [TS]

00:42:33   the TARDIS is the back by air installer [TS]

00:42:37   no no it's now ask but the great thing [TS]

00:42:40   about time travel is that you can get it [TS]

00:42:42   to do anything anything you want because [TS]

00:42:45   it's just kind of crazy and ridiculous [TS]

00:42:47   as long as you put the word tacky and [TS]

00:42:49   front of enough thing sure [TS]

00:42:51   Bergeron you can do anything you want so [TS]

00:42:53   the other book i want to mention and we [TS]

00:42:55   exchanged email about this so i know [TS]

00:42:57   what's coming that I that I love love [TS]

00:42:59   love love [TS]

00:43:00   uh-huh uh-huh is the Time Traveler's [TS]

00:43:03   Wife yea big land may have transformed [TS]

00:43:07   into an angry gorilla holic smash i love [TS]

00:43:12   the time traveler's wife and i and maybe [TS]

00:43:14   that makes me a girl [TS]

00:43:15   well my husband say my wife loves the [TS]

00:43:17   time traveler's wife so all so they're [TS]

00:43:21   they're gonna know she has great taste [TS]

00:43:23   there are no she married me oh yeah we [TS]

00:43:28   all make sound effects on the show I can [TS]

00:43:30   provide some of them i well i will i'll [TS]

00:43:32   admit i did not read the entire time [TS]

00:43:34   travelers wife i stopped at a point [TS]

00:43:36   which irritated me so great that I [TS]

00:43:39   thought I might explode and so I had to [TS]

00:43:41   put it down now save the planet wasn't [TS]

00:43:43   your wasn't your argument that you [TS]

00:43:45   didn't like the time travelers wife [TS]

00:43:46   because it was so obvious what was going [TS]

00:43:47   to happen and so what's the point of the [TS]

00:43:49   whole thing [TS]

00:43:50   well it was no was the heavy-handedness [TS]

00:43:52   of the foreshadowing which i think is I [TS]

00:43:55   which may be exactly what you just said [TS]

00:43:57   stated more pretentious indie but i [TS]

00:43:58   don't know i think my feet I don't know [TS]

00:44:01   is im Michael any human reactionary as [TS]

00:44:05   somebody who had a glint off and Wilson [TS]

00:44:06   will make a point which is I usually [TS]

00:44:08   quite right that somebody post something [TS]

00:44:12   online and Glynis a little let me guess [TS]

00:44:14   you're an engineer right because it's [TS]

00:44:16   this application of a very specific way [TS]

00:44:18   of thinking and I have to admit I add [TS]

00:44:20   that response when Glenn told me that he [TS]

00:44:22   hated the time traveler's wife because [TS]

00:44:24   he's like but it's it's so obvious and [TS]

00:44:26   it's heavy-handed and this is what's [TS]

00:44:27   going to happen in my response was of [TS]

00:44:29   course it's going to happen that's the [TS]

00:44:30   that's the whole point the the time [TS]

00:44:32   traveler's wife is is just a story about [TS]

00:44:34   a married couple who meet and fall in [TS]

00:44:37   love and have a kid and live their life [TS]

00:44:39   and then they die and one of them dies [TS]

00:44:42   and the other one is left without the [TS]

00:44:43   other one and it that's the story of [TS]

00:44:45   every marriage with the exception being [TS]

00:44:47   that they put one of them in a blender [TS]

00:44:50   and his time stream get split up like [TS]

00:44:53   you know Billy Pilgrim style which is [TS]

00:44:55   what gives it its it's spin but what I [TS]

00:44:57   liked about it is in the end you know [TS]

00:44:59   yes it's this question of what happened [TS]

00:45:01   to him and it's very clear i think early [TS]

00:45:04   on what's going to happen to him Glen to [TS]

00:45:06   your point yes haha they they never [TS]

00:45:08   really wanted to talk about where her [TS]

00:45:09   father showed up with his shotgun and [TS]

00:45:12   seemed to stir [TS]

00:45:13   but for some reason there was blood I [TS]

00:45:15   wonder if that will be important later I [TS]

00:45:17   may not course it will be important [TS]

00:45:19   later but I i still love it because you [TS]

00:45:21   know in the end it is to me that book is [TS]

00:45:25   about the inevitability of of a married [TS]

00:45:29   couple couple loves each other as much [TS]

00:45:31   as you could possibly love one another [TS]

00:45:32   being separated by death and that you [TS]

00:45:36   know the perspective is different [TS]

00:45:37   because after he dies they still see him [TS]

00:45:40   because he's in this kaleidoscope of of [TS]

00:45:43   time travel and you know I I thought it [TS]

00:45:45   was really cool to take a ride through a [TS]

00:45:48   couple's relationship from that outside [TS]

00:45:50   you know I outside twisted perspective [TS]

00:45:53   of a viewing it out of order which you [TS]

00:45:56   know Steven Moffat is actually done [TS]

00:45:57   basically lift lifted that premise and [TS]

00:46:01   is using it for the river song plot in [TS]

00:46:03   Doctor Who where they're also having [TS]

00:46:05   their relationship happen out of order [TS]

00:46:07   that's right we've already seen in yeah [TS]

00:46:08   well let me tell you two things one is I [TS]

00:46:11   will confess this is a live on the air [TS]

00:46:13   convection actually thought the book was [TS]

00:46:15   quite beautiful and what hit me was as I [TS]

00:46:18   got to the point at which i suddenly [TS]

00:46:20   realized that it was going to be a total [TS]

00:46:22   heart tearing tearjerker [TS]

00:46:24   I found I couldn't take it I hit I mean [TS]

00:46:26   like somewhere I don't know was made the [TS]

00:46:28   third of the way windows meet her in the [TS]

00:46:30   library the first time she has met him [TS]

00:46:33   as when she's an adult and he's never [TS]

00:46:34   met her before or yeah that's about yeah [TS]

00:46:37   yeah there's the scene where he hasn't [TS]

00:46:40   she meets him as a child right he in a [TS]

00:46:44   library [TS]

00:46:45   he needs her for the first time and of [TS]

00:46:47   course she knows him very well and he [TS]

00:46:49   has no idea who she is [TS]

00:46:51   he's perfectly pleased because they go [TS]

00:46:52   back and you know well she's hot and jen [TS]

00:46:55   and she loves him and he's definitely [TS]

00:46:56   know who the hell she is so he's like [TS]

00:46:58   alright have desirable intercourse [TS]

00:47:01   yeah so the I think I hit that point of [TS]

00:47:04   the book and there were a few elements [TS]

00:47:06   that were revealed clearly and i was and [TS]

00:47:08   i just i found it didn't have the [TS]

00:47:09   stomach to at that point to read further [TS]

00:47:13   and I could play the personal card i [TS]

00:47:14   think it may have been after my mother [TS]

00:47:16   died [TS]

00:47:17   see now i'm getting all weepy he'll make [TS]

00:47:18   it all very personal know it but i think [TS]

00:47:20   that was the thing is like I hit a point [TS]

00:47:21   where I just I so i will actually [TS]

00:47:25   recanting my position is [TS]

00:47:27   it's not that I didn't like it i thought [TS]

00:47:28   that i thought the foreshadowing was too [TS]

00:47:30   heavy-handed but I also because the book [TS]

00:47:33   was so well-constructed I could see the [TS]

00:47:34   Machine returning was gonna make me [TS]

00:47:36   miserable and I thought I don't this is [TS]

00:47:38   like the UH the Doctor Who statements [TS]

00:47:40   like you know sometimes nobody dies [TS]

00:47:42   right this is episode of doctor who [TS]

00:47:44   wears a few of them like the doctor [TS]

00:47:46   dances and it the silence and libraries [TS]

00:47:49   as part 2 which is technically people do [TS]

00:47:52   die but whatever am a back to get a [TS]

00:47:55   backup so it's ok it's it's that notion [TS]

00:47:57   that in this universe which everything [TS]

00:47:58   is this in the doctors university [TS]

00:48:00   there's always massive amounts of death [TS]

00:48:02   and destruction whatever sometimes [TS]

00:48:03   nobody dies so I have that reaction was [TS]

00:48:04   like you know I am NOT ready to watch [TS]

00:48:06   this sink is an evil guy castro my fate [TS]

00:48:09   be killed and what is clearly going to [TS]

00:48:11   be a horrible method and all the loss [TS]

00:48:14   that goes with it so I I my back off on [TS]

00:48:16   my previous statement it is a sad it is [TS]

00:48:18   a sad book but at the same time I i do [TS]

00:48:21   think it's a very sweet and beautiful [TS]

00:48:23   and you don't hurt Saturday was the [TS]

00:48:25   movie bahaha yeah i heard really was not [TS]

00:48:28   good [TS]

00:48:29   it's true no but the book the book is [TS]

00:48:31   beautiful and i love how the book ends I [TS]

00:48:32   mean the book ends with hit with because [TS]

00:48:34   he you know he dies from their [TS]

00:48:36   perspective but he's still traveling [TS]

00:48:39   throughout his life and it ends with the [TS]

00:48:42   last time the oldest he sees her right [TS]

00:48:47   so from his respective it's the oldest [TS]

00:48:48   she sees her from her perspective it's [TS]

00:48:50   the last time she sees him before she [TS]

00:48:52   dies and she's extremely old and it and [TS]

00:48:55   it's so sad but it is beautiful at the [TS]

00:48:57   same time that that it's this tragic [TS]

00:49:00   story and yet at the same time you know [TS]

00:49:03   it's it's beautiful that he hit you know [TS]

00:49:06   his his gift is also allowed them to [TS]

00:49:09   keep seeing him after he's died so that [TS]

00:49:11   is a river song thing river song has the [TS]

00:49:13   book of all those times she's seen the [TS]

00:49:15   doctor and keeps flipping backwards in [TS]

00:49:17   silence the library she finally finds [TS]

00:49:19   wait a minute we haven't she finally [TS]

00:49:21   realized they haven't met yet this be [TS]

00:49:22   right where the start of her jewellery [TS]

00:49:24   and she has the character in time [TS]

00:49:27   travelers like she has a list that he [TS]

00:49:29   gave her which I was talking about here [TS]

00:49:31   now isn't that is until they didn't [TS]

00:49:33   figure out they figure out how to sync [TS]

00:49:35   it up its yeah it's interesting so Scott [TS]

00:49:39   your wife liked it did you [TS]

00:49:40   yet I did not read it because it sounded [TS]

00:49:43   a little too girly for my taste you but [TS]

00:49:47   I i I'm narrow-minded so that that is [TS]

00:49:50   the it's great i really i really like [TS]

00:49:53   reenacted so i love the fact that he's [TS]

00:49:55   the camry the character the main [TS]

00:49:57   character [TS]

00:49:58   I'm sorry I spoiled it all for you now [TS]

00:49:59   Scott but now I don't need to read it [TS]

00:50:01   because the depressive apparently but [TS]

00:50:02   it's no it's great because you know it [TS]

00:50:05   says a lot of things about relationships [TS]

00:50:06   so again i apologize for being a girl [TS]

00:50:08   but it's a lot of things about the upper [TS]

00:50:11   relationships that are so true [TS]

00:50:13   especially as you get older that I'm you [TS]

00:50:15   know we we meet him you know it's just [TS]

00:50:19   funny because you meet him as an adult [TS]

00:50:20   as a full-fledged adult who knows what's [TS]

00:50:22   going on and then the first time you [TS]

00:50:24   really meet him he's you know in his [TS]

00:50:26   twenties and is is still going out to [TS]

00:50:29   punk rock concerts and has is Paris kind [TS]

00:50:31   of funny and his closer kind of funny [TS]

00:50:33   and it and it's hilarious because it's [TS]

00:50:35   like oh this guy doesn't have it [TS]

00:50:37   together at all he he gets it together [TS]

00:50:39   later and you got it you got a lot of [TS]

00:50:41   studying in which he as a teenager [TS]

00:50:43   appears naked in the room his own room [TS]

00:50:46   with himself and the father walks in ya [TS]

00:50:49   ya little hilarious it'sit's there's [TS]

00:50:52   some good stuff in it anyway so I bring [TS]

00:50:54   up the time traveler's wife as well so [TS]

00:50:55   those of you out there who are not [TS]

00:50:56   afraid of your of your standing in terms [TS]

00:50:59   of all you men out there who are not [TS]

00:51:00   afraid of your masculinity and all of [TS]

00:51:02   you women out there who bless you for [TS]

00:51:03   listening to this podcast which is all [TS]

00:51:07   men today you know it's a great i love [TS]

00:51:11   it [TS]

00:51:11   we have shaved during this podcast love [TS]

00:51:13   that book [TS]

00:51:14   uh speaking of women who listen to the [TS]

00:51:16   podcast my my my wife does not listen to [TS]

00:51:19   the podcast because we were at powell's [TS]

00:51:21   when we visited portland and she said oh [TS]

00:51:24   the windup girl I want to read that book [TS]

00:51:26   and I said didn't you listen to the game [TS]

00:51:29   the the podcast where we talked about it [TS]

00:51:31   just like you're on a podcast that [TS]

00:51:33   yeah well she can listen to it after she [TS]

00:51:35   reads the one my wife has a negative [TS]

00:51:37   interest in science fiction or interest [TS]

00:51:38   in science fiction is so low it makes [TS]

00:51:41   other people not read it wow that's [TS]

00:51:44   impressive [TS]

00:51:44   it's like a two-hour it shine wrote [TS]

00:51:46   science fiction my wife like science [TS]

00:51:48   fiction but I she basically waits for me [TS]

00:51:51   to recommend something to her and it's [TS]

00:51:53   like if it's good enough [TS]

00:51:54   for me to be like oh you got to read [TS]

00:51:55   this then she'll read it but she's not [TS]

00:51:57   going to pick it up by the way she [TS]

00:51:58   figures i can be her screener which is [TS]

00:52:00   fair enough my life like science fiction [TS]

00:52:02   she just doesn't like listening to me so [TS]

00:52:04   oh well I i can understand that I in [TS]

00:52:09   July however I enjoy listening to you [TS]

00:52:12   but she gets to listen to you all the [TS]

00:52:13   time it's true [TS]

00:52:14   non-stop I don't know if she has to [TS]

00:52:17   listen to canned can scott when she's [TS]

00:52:19   away from you so i could listen to Scott [TS]

00:52:21   talking some more you did for me to [TS]

00:52:23   travel more and then the podcast will [TS]

00:52:25   grow fonder uh-huh that's true i should [TS]

00:52:28   leave my wife and then jobs this podcast [TS]

00:52:30   a so what makes the mp3 grow fonder [TS]

00:52:33   before we before we wrap up this podcast [TS]

00:52:35   i want to go around the room which it [TS]

00:52:38   will be not take very much time since [TS]

00:52:40   we're the only ones who read that book [TS]

00:52:41   if you attack ask your it yes in the [TS]

00:52:45   triangle of the book club [TS]

00:52:46   the musical question what are you [TS]

00:52:49   reading [TS]

00:52:50   Scott what are you reading I am really [TS]

00:52:53   something that is not science fiction [TS]

00:52:56   ok I i will admit is the third book in a [TS]

00:53:00   series of books called mr. slaughter [TS]

00:53:04   it's by Robert mccammon and it is about [TS]

00:53:08   a character by the name of Matthew [TS]

00:53:11   Corbett who is well starts off as a law [TS]

00:53:14   clerk in 1699 so it's cool it's set in [TS]

00:53:20   the colonial America and he is in New [TS]

00:53:23   York it he actually does live in New [TS]

00:53:25   your heart so it is colonial New York [TS]

00:53:29   I'm going even further back and more [TS]

00:53:30   specific with my mysteries that i read [TS]

00:53:33   and so in this book he is looking for a [TS]

00:53:37   bad guy named mr. slaughter not to be [TS]

00:53:40   confused with sergeant slaughter [TS]

00:53:43   wow it's very good all right Glenn what [TS]

00:53:46   about you i just recently finished [TS]

00:53:49   reading a couple big things one is [TS]

00:53:51   mentioned earlier is the evolutionary [TS]

00:53:53   void part of a insanely long series of [TS]

00:53:57   three books by Peter F Hamilton whose [TS]

00:54:00   work I really quite like Hamilton's [TS]

00:54:01   writing but he mostly over rights but [TS]

00:54:05   man he's got a lot of detail he really [TS]

00:54:06   feels the need to express it in 700-page [TS]

00:54:09   books so i think the void trilogy is [TS]

00:54:12   like I want to say it's like 2,000 pages [TS]

00:54:14   long i'm not sure i'm exaggerating again [TS]

00:54:16   I don't think you are [TS]

00:54:17   he only wrote he also wrote his earlier [TS]

00:54:19   books he wrote a detective side my [TS]

00:54:22   detective thing and those are much [TS]

00:54:23   shorter [TS]

00:54:24   oh I didn't I well I think over time [TS]

00:54:26   people get less constrained if they sell [TS]

00:54:29   stuff it necessarily it's the neal [TS]

00:54:31   stephenson syndrome [TS]

00:54:33   yeah but there's also on pandora star [TS]

00:54:34   and Judas Unchained or earlier books [TS]

00:54:36   like white I think our little more zippy [TS]

00:54:37   and stories and those that I detail but [TS]

00:54:39   so the void books i mean the the [TS]

00:54:41   evolutionary void just came out and read [TS]

00:54:43   it on the kindle because the book weigh [TS]

00:54:45   700 pounds and i use the kindle app to [TS]

00:54:48   avoid hurting my arms while reading this [TS]

00:54:49   behemoth it's definitely entertaining I [TS]

00:54:52   again I think too many words across [TS]

00:54:54   three books but the story is basically [TS]

00:54:56   there's a religious movement that spread [TS]

00:54:58   across the you know a alliance of many [TS]

00:55:00   planets occupied by human beings that [TS]

00:55:03   this primary character the dreamer first [TS]

00:55:08   dreamer can see dreams of this pocket [TS]

00:55:10   universe that show a different kind of [TS]

00:55:12   life and people eventually want to [TS]

00:55:13   migrate into this pocket universe but [TS]

00:55:15   another race of beings has fought it [TS]

00:55:17   back for thousands of years many [TS]

00:55:19   millions or something and the end if [TS]

00:55:22   everyone were to go into that universe [TS]

00:55:23   they would create such an energy suck on [TS]

00:55:26   the you-know-what real universe that the [TS]

00:55:28   universe would cease to exist in there [TS]

00:55:30   be this kind of weird resettable pocket [TS]

00:55:32   universe so it's I think it's always a [TS]

00:55:34   rousing the tail but it is very [TS]

00:55:35   interesting some good metaphysics a lot [TS]

00:55:37   of them great explosions and fights [TS]

00:55:39   really well depicted huge amounts of [TS]

00:55:41   destruction and sadistic evil people and [TS]

00:55:45   it's it's kind of fun [TS]

00:55:46   I don't have finished all right now [TS]

00:55:49   because now it's good to read it because [TS]

00:55:50   it's all done so because the bond I have [TS]

00:55:52   with his books is whenever he you know [TS]

00:55:54   he has to write them so [TS]

00:55:55   you read one and you have to wait a year [TS]

00:55:57   or year and a half to read the other one [TS]

00:55:59   and then i have read no idea what [TS]

00:56:00   happened so you have read the first [TS]

00:56:02   thats not realizing was a trilogy [TS]

00:56:03   planned trilogy make five years ago [TS]

00:56:06   the other thing I just finished reading [TS]

00:56:07   as I got the collected versions of DC [TS]

00:56:09   Comics blackest day brightest [TS]

00:56:11   black-and-white rather like write a nice [TS]

00:56:15   day blackest night series where it was [TS]

00:56:17   across you know 400 different comic book [TS]

00:56:18   series in there whatever I got the [TS]

00:56:20   collective versions of the library to [TS]

00:56:22   read as I found is a great way to catch [TS]

00:56:23   up on a lot of comics because they put [TS]

00:56:25   everything together in one place and you [TS]

00:56:26   don't have piles of strewn confusing [TS]

00:56:28   things and I found the story's really [TS]

00:56:30   sort of in comprehensible and messianic [TS]

00:56:32   and bizarre but not too bad not too bad [TS]

00:56:34   is no it's again library collections of [TS]

00:56:36   comics a great way to actually catch up [TS]

00:56:38   on some of the interesting stuff that's [TS]

00:56:40   going on in comics without getting a [TS]

00:56:41   message to the inn you know buying 500 [TS]

00:56:43   copies than trying to collate the order [TS]

00:56:44   in which things happen [TS]

00:56:45   that's a Green Lantern thing is nothing [TS]

00:56:48   yeah it's I mean it's interesting it's [TS]

00:56:49   all of a sudden it turns out it turns [TS]

00:56:51   out the Guardians of the Universe [TS]

00:56:52   they're hiding something [TS]

00:56:54   providing is there are other colors in [TS]

00:56:57   the spectrum [TS]

00:56:58   well sort of the plot I'm shocked go to [TS]

00:57:01   that also sounds lame [TS]

00:57:03   so I read a lot of books on my my [TS]

00:57:06   Christmas vacation i read a couple of [TS]

00:57:08   nonfiction so now again Scott yes these [TS]

00:57:10   are not science fiction either but i [TS]

00:57:12   think people might like them because [TS]

00:57:13   there's a science book the only place in [TS]

00:57:15   19th century or if if you like if you [TS]

00:57:17   like science i read a very entertaining [TS]

00:57:20   book about astronomy and about the [TS]

00:57:24   process of discovering things in the [TS]

00:57:27   professional astronomers go to go [TS]

00:57:29   through called love the titles by Mike [TS]

00:57:32   Brown who discovered the the plant the [TS]

00:57:35   not planet- Minor Planet eros it's [TS]

00:57:38   discovered a lot of these these distant [TS]

00:57:41   solar system objects including one that [TS]

00:57:42   is bigger than Pluto which led to the [TS]

00:57:45   whole existential crisis about is Pluto [TS]

00:57:48   a planet or not and it has the [TS]

00:57:49   delightful title how I killed Pluto and [TS]

00:57:52   why it had it coming [TS]

00:57:54   yeah he was guest blogging on-going [TS]

00:57:56   going for a while and stuff your very [TS]

00:57:58   eyes he's a funny guy [TS]

00:58:00   it's a good book and it really does talk [TS]

00:58:02   about it talk about his personal life in [TS]

00:58:05   an interesting way and his life as a [TS]

00:58:07   professional astronomer and [TS]

00:58:09   what they went through and there's [TS]

00:58:10   actually a little bit of scandal limit [TS]

00:58:11   too because there's a disputed discovery [TS]

00:58:14   where it looks like this team of [TS]

00:58:16   astronomers discovered that they could [TS]

00:58:18   use a google search to search the data [TS]

00:58:21   of the telescope that they were using to [TS]

00:58:24   discover these objects and and the name [TS]

00:58:26   of one of the objects that they were [TS]

00:58:27   working on it been published in a in a [TS]

00:58:29   basically like a toc for an advanced [TS]

00:58:31   version of this of a kind of conference [TS]

00:58:34   or something and so they did a search [TS]

00:58:35   for it turned out that they have the [TS]

00:58:37   telescope blogs and you know allegedly [TS]

00:58:39   they then use that data to pre discover [TS]

00:58:43   it before the team that was actually had [TS]

00:58:45   already discovered just it's it's a good [TS]

00:58:47   story and and it's funny and if you love [TS]

00:58:49   Pluto and are very angry that it's not a [TS]

00:58:51   planet anymore don't read it but [TS]

00:58:52   otherwise a lot of fun i also read a not [TS]

00:58:55   as good but a good book if you've ever [TS]

00:58:57   wondered why the large hadron collider [TS]

00:58:59   exists and what they're really trying to [TS]

00:59:02   find there's a good book by Gandhi and [TS]

00:59:04   sample who works at I think the Guardian [TS]

00:59:06   in London called massive the missing [TS]

00:59:10   particle that sparked the greatest hunt [TS]

00:59:11   in science which explains a lot about [TS]

00:59:13   the arms race that led to the large [TS]

00:59:16   hadron collider and the failure of the [TS]

00:59:19   u.s. to create the superconducting [TS]

00:59:20   supercollider and sort of the politics [TS]

00:59:22   of that along with the science and that [TS]

00:59:25   was a pretty good read to and also [TS]

00:59:26   pretty fast read and then I novel wise [TS]

00:59:30   I've been engrossed and I cursed and [TS]

00:59:33   mourn for doing this to me but I've been [TS]

00:59:34   engrossed in Lois McMaster Bujold 'he's [TS]

00:59:37   for cosec and saga [TS]

00:59:39   oh really i've read eight of them in the [TS]

00:59:42   last month that is my kindle is loaded [TS]

00:59:46   with seven of them so yes and what I'll [TS]

00:59:48   say to people out there is that what one [TS]

00:59:50   what the publisher did that's very [TS]

00:59:52   interesting is the latest novel in the [TS]

00:59:53   series cryo burn comes with a CD and the [TS]

00:59:57   license on the CDC says that you can you [TS]

00:59:57   license on the CDC says that you can you [TS]

01:00:00   can redistribute it on the internet if [TS]

01:00:02   you like as long as you don't sell it so [TS]

01:00:04   essentially what they're doing is [TS]

01:00:05   they're giving away most of the books in [TS]

01:00:08   the series in e-reader format if you [TS]

01:00:12   search for i'm sure you could find them [TS]

01:00:14   with child why my kindle has seven of [TS]

01:00:16   the market yes and that's why I've read [TS]

01:00:18   all these but it's brilliant because if [TS]

01:00:20   she writes another one that I have to [TS]

01:00:21   buy in fact one of the missing on there [TS]

01:00:22   there's a book called memory that is [TS]

01:00:24   omitted because it's not in one of the [TS]

01:00:25   omnibus edition and and I i got to that [TS]

01:00:28   book and I said what I don't have that [TS]

01:00:30   book six dollars you say and that was it [TS]

01:00:33   I i bought it so it did its job that you [TS]

01:00:35   know I've got to say they're really good [TS]

01:00:37   i'm enjoying them greatly [TS]

01:00:38   so we'll just we'll do a whole miles for [TS]

01:00:41   coach again podcast at some point but I [TS]

01:00:43   you know I've been seeing those on Hugo [TS]

01:00:45   and nebula nominee list over the years [TS]

01:00:47   and thinking that's a series I you know [TS]

01:00:49   I can't read it it's such an investment [TS]

01:00:50   and I made the investment and have had a [TS]

01:00:53   great time reading those books and [TS]

01:00:54   ignore the awful cover art [TS]

01:00:57   yes the cover is atrocious don't mean [TS]

01:00:59   that's the nice thing about having an [TS]

01:01:00   e-reader is you can just ignore the [TS]

01:01:02   cover art on the kindle especially [TS]

01:01:04   there's no coverage imagine no covered [TS]

01:01:07   haha so before we go we're going to try [TS]

01:01:11   something new on the incomparable book [TS]

01:01:12   club which is we are going to declare [TS]

01:01:15   this is required us to actually do some [TS]

01:01:17   work in advance [TS]

01:01:18   we're going to declare the book that we [TS]

01:01:19   are going to cover in our next [TS]

01:01:21   installment which will hopefully this [TS]

01:01:23   madness people and if not it'll just be [TS]

01:01:25   me and Scott yes then we'll have dropped [TS]

01:01:29   out by that game Auryn will have have [TS]

01:01:32   resigned from the podcast altogether [TS]

01:01:33   this sort of test is over this podcast [TS]

01:01:36   is over it'll be the last thing we post [TS]

01:01:38   anyway so so this is the book that we're [TS]

01:01:40   going to read so if you would like to [TS]

01:01:41   not be deterred by the spoiler horn go [TS]

01:01:44   out and read this book the book we're [TS]

01:01:46   going to read we mentioned it actually I [TS]

01:01:47   think maybe even on our first podcast i [TS]

01:01:49   think i think it was because it has a [TS]

01:01:52   Zeppelin on to hover on the cover and it [TS]

01:01:56   figures in prominently into this book [TS]

01:01:57   gotten some great reviews on a lot of [TS]

01:02:00   list of the best sci-fi you know and [TS]

01:02:03   Chandra in general novels of 2011 for [TS]

01:02:05   2010 so we're going to read it it is the [TS]

01:02:09   dream of perpetual motion by dexter [TS]

01:02:12   Palmer [TS]

01:02:13   and it's available in paperback it's [TS]

01:02:15   available for kindle so check it out and [TS]

01:02:19   then we will discuss that back here in a [TS]

01:02:22   few weeks but we're giving you the [TS]

01:02:24   warning out there so that you can get [TS]

01:02:25   caught up with us rather than loading up [TS]

01:02:28   your book club podcast and going dammit [TS]

01:02:30   i haven't read that book and then [TS]

01:02:33   pausing it as being like Scott's wife [TS]

01:02:34   and saying I can't listen to this [TS]

01:02:36   podcast and I can't and I would like to [TS]

01:02:38   point out that i read this book before [TS]

01:02:40   it was on all of those best of lists [TS]

01:02:43   know you you get a lot of credibility we [TS]

01:02:45   look to you Scott to find out what is [TS]

01:02:47   up-and-coming i am a trendsetter you are [TS]

01:02:50   i should note this book is available as [TS]

01:02:52   an e-book from google books among other [TS]

01:02:54   places [TS]

01:02:55   it's available in many I get tense every [TS]

01:02:58   time i say that now but many reputable [TS]

01:02:59   that's Robbie booksellers and in [TS]

01:03:02   paperback so it's affordable even if you [TS]

01:03:04   choose to read it on dead trees was [TS]

01:03:07   probably in a library near use it is [TS]

01:03:10   certainly in life there are 16 people [TS]

01:03:12   headed me at my library i have to kill [TS]

01:03:14   them all to get the book in time so I'm [TS]

01:03:15   a bachelor copy that would be at that [TS]

01:03:17   would be a a novel it with murdering [TS]

01:03:20   people to get to the book that isn't a [TS]

01:03:23   waiting list we call the movie called [TS]

01:03:24   add to hold and then you find out you're [TS]

01:03:28   reading the book and you realize that [TS]

01:03:29   you in fact wrote the book [TS]

01:03:31   well gentlemen thank you for reading the [TS]

01:03:34   book which puts you ahead of everyone [TS]

01:03:36   else [TS]

01:03:37   yes haha and i liked it so it's two out [TS]

01:03:40   of three one out of three people like [TS]

01:03:42   two nite i guess it's not worth i would [TS]

01:03:44   recommend reading it but I wouldn't say [TS]

01:03:45   that I like this is not funny i like [TS]

01:03:48   parts of it didn't hold together as a [TS]

01:03:49   whole but i would recommend reading it [TS]

01:03:51   was very interesting challenging [TS]

01:03:52   thought-provoking and Scott you would [TS]

01:03:55   recommend reading it i would recommend [TS]

01:03:57   radiant and i would not but that's me i [TS]

01:04:00   would recommend writing it I that yes [TS]

01:04:04   before you read it [TS]

01:04:05   find yourself with a copy of it in the [TS]

01:04:08   future and shoot him take it and read [TS]

01:04:12   the book it will have a much deeper [TS]

01:04:14   meaning if you do yes that's much better [TS]

01:04:16   alright well until next time i would [TS]

01:04:19   like to thank my guests Glenn freshman [TS]

01:04:20   at Scott McNulty thanks guys [TS]

01:04:22   thank you just [TS]

01:04:23   thank you and that's it for this edition [TS]

01:04:25   of the book club [TS]

01:04:27   thanks for listening to be uncomfortable [TS]

01:04:29   we'll catch you next time [TS]

01:04:32   this has been the incomparable podcast [TS]

01:04:36   visit us at the incomparable dot-com [TS]

01:04:54   the more not on the podcast but i had to [TS]

01:04:57   mention it because he's almost on [TS]

01:04:59   difference like every function isn't [TS]

01:05:00   that is contractually obligated to [TS]

01:05:03   mention damn yes well he's he is ill [TS]

01:05:05   today [TS]

01:05:06   well I use that as the excuse also [TS]

01:05:08   hasn't read the book but is it happens [TS]

01:05:10   to be could be reading it right now and [TS]

01:05:12   the dog is homework [TS]