The Incomparable

00:00:00 ◼   ► the Intolerable podcast number 35 2011 [TS]

00:00:11 ◼   ► we are back on the incomparable podcast [TS]

00:00:14 ◼   ► I'm Jason smell your host our topic [TS]

00:00:16 ◼   ► today is the book series that has [TS]

00:00:20 ◼   ► generated the buzz worthy HBO series [TS]

00:00:23 ◼   ► Game of Thrones these are the books by [TS]

00:00:26 ◼   ► george RR martin called a song of ice [TS]

00:00:30 ◼   ► and fire which is such a ridiculous and [TS]

00:00:32 ◼   ► pretentious title that it Five known [TS]

00:00:35 ◼   ► that was the name of the series I might [TS]

00:00:36 ◼   ► not have read the books but instead I've [TS]

00:00:38 ◼   ► read four of them and there's a fifth [TS]

00:00:40 ◼   ► one coming out so we're going to talk [TS]

00:00:42 ◼   ► about the books we will fire off spoiler [TS]

00:00:45 ◼   ► horns inappropriate places but basically [TS]

00:00:47 ◼   ► if you don't want to know what happens [TS]

00:00:48 ◼   ► in these books you might not want to [TS]

00:00:49 ◼   ► listen to this podcast because we are [TS]

00:00:51 ◼   ► going to talk about how can you not [TS]

00:00:53 ◼   ► everybody dies there's your boiler horn [TS]

00:00:57 ◼   ► everybody dies and then he writes poetry [TS]

00:01:00 ◼   ► for a thousand pages that's what happens [TS]

00:01:02 ◼   ► it's the art it's the opposite of that [TS]

00:01:04 ◼   ► doctor who episode everybody lady never [TS]

00:01:06 ◼   ► die [TS]

00:01:07 ◼   ► sighs george RR martin series so anyway [TS]

00:01:10 ◼   ► joining me to talk about george RR [TS]

00:01:12 ◼   ► martin series of books those voices [TS]

00:01:14 ◼   ► you've heard before and you just heard [TS]

00:01:17 ◼   ► and they're like ghosts they that you [TS]

00:01:18 ◼   ► probably hear them when you're not even [TS]

00:01:19 ◼   ► listening to the podcast at this point I [TS]

00:01:21 ◼   ► know I know when I have nightmares [TS]

00:01:23 ◼   ► they're usually narrated by day and more [TS]

00:01:25 ◼   ► in hi dan welcome to your life chasing [TS]

00:01:28 ◼   ► there's no turning back [TS]

00:01:30 ◼   ► donkey citizen Z well I sleep you will [TS]

00:01:35 ◼   ► follow very sinister of serenity [TS]

00:01:38 ◼   ► Caldwell are you acting on your best [TS]

00:01:40 ◼   ► behavior [TS]

00:01:41 ◼   ► I I am don't turn your back on mother [TS]

00:01:44 ◼   ► nature [TS]

00:01:45 ◼   ► no why would I do that I don't know the [TS]

00:01:47 ◼   ► song and everybody wants to rule the [TS]

00:01:49 ◼   ► world except for Scott McNulty he's a [TS]

00:01:52 ◼   ► lover not a fighter [TS]

00:01:53 ◼   ► hi Scott I don't want the world I just [TS]

00:01:56 ◼   ► want your half [TS]

00:01:57 ◼   ► thank you nice right well well done that [TS]

00:02:00 ◼   ► also a band beginning with the letter T [TS]

00:02:02 ◼   ► you could assess it is good friday and [TS]

00:02:06 ◼   ► this lady estea in your record store [TS]

00:02:08 ◼   ► that went out of business five years ago [TS]

00:02:09 ◼   ► so george RR martin [TS]

00:02:12 ◼   ► I was I was that big beard is Diaz these [TS]

00:02:15 ◼   ► dirty and a half she's often wear your [TS]

00:02:17 ◼   ► hat he died i know somebody else wears a [TS]

00:02:21 ◼   ► hat regularly and it's it takes a [TS]

00:02:23 ◼   ► special kind of man to wear a hat i will [TS]

00:02:25 ◼   ► say this i have a picture of myself with [TS]

00:02:28 ◼   ► george RR martin with both of us wearing [TS]

00:02:30 ◼   ► hats [TS]

00:02:31 ◼   ► Oh see you can put that you can put them [TS]

00:02:33 ◼   ► in the show notes great that was that [TS]

00:02:35 ◼   ► one of the Hat clubs [TS]

00:02:37 ◼   ► yes it would say it was a hat convenient [TS]

00:02:39 ◼   ► believe its hat squads have squad [TS]

00:02:42 ◼   ► yes we both have beards too is much more [TS]

00:02:45 ◼   ► impressed yet dad come to think of it [TS]

00:02:46 ◼   ► you could be george RR martin you've [TS]

00:02:47 ◼   ► gotta hide a picture the young George RR [TS]

00:02:50 ◼   ► Martin's time-travel mystic it just [TS]

00:02:52 ◼   ► finished the books we bake trying i love [TS]

00:02:58 ◼   ► me working on it [TS]

00:02:59 ◼   ► so before we get started and before we [TS]

00:03:01 ◼   ► fire up the spoiler home because i want [TS]

00:03:02 ◼   ► at least a little bit of action here [TS]

00:03:04 ◼   ► before we fire off from everybody dies [TS]

00:03:06 ◼   ► yeah you know i'm not going to everybody [TS]

00:03:09 ◼   ► eighty percent of the characters diving [TS]

00:03:11 ◼   ► which eighty percent series the series [TS]

00:03:14 ◼   ► isn't over yet so it may be that [TS]

00:03:15 ◼   ► everything is entirely possible so i [TS]

00:03:18 ◼   ► started reading these books late last [TS]

00:03:19 ◼   ► year when i heard HBO was going to make [TS]

00:03:22 ◼   ► a series out of it [TS]

00:03:23 ◼   ► I don't know if that strange behavior to [TS]

00:03:24 ◼   ► say you know read the books now before [TS]

00:03:26 ◼   ► they become a TV series but they've been [TS]

00:03:28 ◼   ► out there for a long time the first book [TS]

00:03:30 ◼   ► was published in 1996 so I'm wondering [TS]

00:03:32 ◼   ► when did you guys start reading these [TS]

00:03:35 ◼   ► books i have a funny story about how I [TS]

00:03:38 ◼   ► first became aware of these books will [TS]

00:03:40 ◼   ► be the judges that but I have a story [TS]

00:03:42 ◼   ► about the first time is with being where [TS]

00:03:44 ◼   ► these books it was the first week of [TS]

00:03:47 ◼   ► college my freshman year of college and [TS]

00:03:51 ◼   ► one of my floormates now and i went to [TS]

00:03:54 ◼   ► do laundry the dorm across from us and [TS]

00:03:56 ◼   ► there was a girl there reading a game of [TS]

00:03:58 ◼   ► thrones i had never heard of this book [TS]

00:04:00 ◼   ► but my friend brian says oh that's a [TS]

00:04:03 ◼   ► really great book and strikes up a [TS]

00:04:04 ◼   ► conversation with this girl who i then [TS]

00:04:07 ◼   ► went out with for like three months so [TS]

00:04:09 ◼   ► that so george RR martin has had you [TS]

00:04:11 ◼   ► know got me a date basically because you [TS]

00:04:14 ◼   ► because your friend had rather because [TS]

00:04:16 ◼   ► my friend had read it I know I didn't [TS]

00:04:18 ◼   ► even have to do the hard work there and [TS]

00:04:20 ◼   ► to this day dan has not read the books [TS]

00:04:22 ◼   ► anyways that was but I did read them [TS]

00:04:23 ◼   ► like the summer after that [TS]

00:04:24 ◼   ► and I've read them I guess only two [TS]

00:04:28 ◼   ► maybe three red at that point that would [TS]

00:04:29 ◼   ► have been like 1999 I guess maybe only [TS]

00:04:33 ◼   ► to that point but I read the other set [TS]

00:04:36 ◼   ► that as they came out before the fourth [TS]

00:04:38 ◼   ► one came out i reread the first three so [TS]

00:04:41 ◼   ► I guess that was 2005-6 somewhere in [TS]

00:04:44 ◼   ► there so yeah I've read all I've read [TS]

00:04:47 ◼   ► the books twice except for the fourth [TS]

00:04:48 ◼   ► one and and it's still yet it's still [TS]

00:04:51 ◼   ► been like six years since i think i was [TS]

00:04:54 ◼   ► pondering that this very question [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► earlier today so i went to amazon and [TS]

00:04:59 ◼   ► search my order history to see if I [TS]

00:05:01 ◼   ► could figure out when i first read a [TS]

00:05:03 ◼   ► game of thrones and turns out I i will i [TS]

00:05:07 ◼   ► ordered the second and third book [TS]

00:05:09 ◼   ► februari third 2003 which leads me to [TS]

00:05:12 ◼   ► believe i read the first book some time [TS]

00:05:14 ◼   ► beforehand because i have no record of [TS]

00:05:17 ◼   ► that book so apparently either got it [TS]

00:05:19 ◼   ► from the library or stole it from [TS]

00:05:20 ◼   ► someone so that it and I have no idea [TS]

00:05:23 ◼   ► why i started reading them but I read [TS]

00:05:26 ◼   ► them in 2003 apparent i read them when i [TS]

00:05:29 ◼   ► read the first one for the first time [TS]

00:05:30 ◼   ► shortly after Dan in two thousand or so [TS]

00:05:33 ◼   ► because the writing group that I was [TS]

00:05:35 ◼   ► part of it at the time I one of our [TS]

00:05:39 ◼   ► members Robin was absolutely obsessed [TS]

00:05:41 ◼   ► with this series and wouldn't stop [TS]

00:05:44 ◼   ► talking about it and in fact I think had [TS]

00:05:46 ◼   ► written to full-length novels in this [TS]

00:05:48 ◼   ► universe and at the time she's like I [TS]

00:05:51 ◼   ► need people to read them and I'm like [TS]

00:05:52 ◼   ► well in order to read your novels I i [TS]

00:05:55 ◼   ► think i probably have to read the story [TS]

00:05:57 ◼   ► that it's based in first so i picked up [TS]

00:06:02 ◼   ► all three from the library at the time [TS]

00:06:04 ◼   ► there were three out it was a storm of [TS]

00:06:06 ◼   ► swords is that the third one [TS]

00:06:08 ◼   ► yes but I get on the the huge one yeah [TS]

00:06:11 ◼   ► well I mean that was that was alongside [TS]

00:06:12 ◼   ► that was the same year that I first [TS]

00:06:15 ◼   ► started reading Robert Jordan as well so [TS]

00:06:17 ◼   ► i was just reading all yeah I know [TS]

00:06:19 ◼   ► I know you can make those faces i was [TS]

00:06:21 ◼   ► reading a lot of terrible fantasy but [TS]

00:06:23 ◼   ► this this was not terrible fantasy this [TS]

00:06:25 ◼   ► was enjoyable fantasy but i have to say [TS]

00:06:27 ◼   ► until right before the HBO series came [TS]

00:06:30 ◼   ► out earlier this year I had not read [TS]

00:06:33 ◼   ► them since I read them straight through [TS]

00:06:36 ◼   ► in about a month in two thousand so I'm [TS]

00:06:39 ◼   ► slowly like going through and reading [TS]

00:06:41 ◼   ► them now and I'm in the middle of the [TS]

00:06:42 ◼   ► second book I'm like I remember none of [TS]

00:06:44 ◼   ► this kind of just vanished from my head [TS]

00:06:47 ◼   ► there's a lot there's a lot there and [TS]

00:06:49 ◼   ► then there's a lot of stuff didn't want [TS]

00:06:51 ◼   ► to people in places and culture and all [TS]

00:06:53 ◼   ► that well [TS]

00:06:54 ◼   ► very i met somewhere that there's a [TS]

00:06:56 ◼   ► thousand named characters in the series [TS]

00:06:58 ◼   ► in the run-up in the run-up to the HPS [TS]

00:07:02 ◼   ► here is going on in a george RR martin [TS]

00:07:04 ◼   ► has said to several interviewers that he [TS]

00:07:07 ◼   ► intended for this to be unfilmable irony [TS]

00:07:12 ◼   ► of ironies that he wanted to make it as [TS]

00:07:14 ◼   ► widescreen as possible and lots of [TS]

00:07:16 ◼   ► different stories of huge numbers of [TS]

00:07:17 ◼   ► characters and complicated and and and [TS]

00:07:20 ◼   ► then you know here they are making a TV [TS]

00:07:22 ◼   ► series happyish owed him [TS]

00:07:24 ◼   ► yeah take that George that was that was [TS]

00:07:26 ◼   ► the one question I i actually asked him [TS]

00:07:28 ◼   ► when when I got a chance to talk to him [TS]

00:07:30 ◼   ► was how he kept track of all of that [TS]

00:07:32 ◼   ► stuff and he didn't really give me a [TS]

00:07:34 ◼   ► good answer is just said he kind of [TS]

00:07:35 ◼   ► looked at me and said that's my job and [TS]

00:07:37 ◼   ► I was like okay but like to use like a [TS]

00:07:39 ◼   ► whiteboard you think computers activate [TS]

00:07:41 ◼   ► what give me something just like to [TS]

00:07:43 ◼   ► think in fact it's a little minion [TS]

00:07:45 ◼   ► sitting there that's just recording [TS]

00:07:47 ◼   ► everything beautifully i just came up [TS]

00:07:48 ◼   ► with a new character right now he does [TS]

00:07:50 ◼   ► have a minion actually don't that was [TS]

00:07:51 ◼   ► the story in The New Yorker wasn't it [TS]

00:07:53 ◼   ► that there's a guy who runs a wiki and [TS]

00:07:55 ◼   ► has a database and he's in like Sweden [TS]

00:07:58 ◼   ► or something [TS]

00:07:59 ◼   ► yes some Scandinavian country [TS]

00:08:02 ◼   ► yeah we're with her is always coming and [TS]

00:08:05 ◼   ► and he liked apparently now is actually [TS]

00:08:08 ◼   ► a paid sort of like how they have script [TS]

00:08:11 ◼   ► coordinators on TV series he's like the [TS]

00:08:13 ◼   ► a paid assistant to george RR martin for [TS]

00:08:16 ◼   ► these reasons you like send them [TS]

00:08:17 ◼   ► questions of like who's this cruise this [TS]

00:08:20 ◼   ► guy and a guy will immediately respond [TS]

00:08:22 ◼   ► with the answer because he knows he's [TS]

00:08:23 ◼   ► encyclopedia CLE catalog everything in [TS]

00:08:26 ◼   ► all the books so he's like the guy on [TS]

00:08:27 ◼   ► lost [TS]

00:08:28 ◼   ► he's exactly like Greg nations the guy [TS]

00:08:30 ◼   ► are lost who has the Bible of F [TS]

00:08:33 ◼   ► everybody and who what time they did [TS]

00:08:34 ◼   ► what I'm loss so they could do all the [TS]

00:08:36 ◼   ► time travel stuff [TS]

00:08:38 ◼   ► yeah he is the george RR martin has that [TS]

00:08:40 ◼   ► guy minion any one of those yeah it's [TS]

00:08:44 ◼   ► good to have a minion if you can afford [TS]

00:08:45 ◼   ► one [TS]

00:08:46 ◼   ► what would your minion do though Dan [TS]

00:08:48 ◼   ► really don't know I need like I totally [TS]

00:08:50 ◼   ► for a long time in one of my the series [TS]

00:08:53 ◼   ► i was writing i had like a voodoo ped [TS]

00:08:55 ◼   ► document so it's kind of like a mini [TS]

00:08:56 ◼   ► wiki to keep track of [TS]

00:08:58 ◼   ► because I would forget like a character [TS]

00:08:59 ◼   ► that i mentioned you know early in one [TS]

00:09:02 ◼   ► story would return and I couldn't [TS]

00:09:03 ◼   ► remember what color their hair my eyes [TS]

00:09:06 ◼   ► or something dumb like that now be like [TS]

00:09:08 ◼   ► aqua have to go back through the whole [TS]

00:09:09 ◼   ► like last book and try to like search [TS]

00:09:11 ◼   ► through and find out what I used [TS]

00:09:12 ◼   ► Scrivener for it's the same it's the [TS]

00:09:14 ◼   ► same thing i was i have to say the [TS]

00:09:15 ◼   ► people who do these george RR martin [TS]

00:09:17 ◼   ► wiki's are laying down on the job [TS]

00:09:18 ◼   ► because I am in the fourth book which i [TS]

00:09:21 ◼   ► just finished there's a character who's [TS]

00:09:25 ◼   ► in several previous books raff the [TS]

00:09:26 ◼   ► sweetling and I was like hey he's just [TS]

00:09:28 ◼   ► sort of like tangentially briefly [TS]

00:09:30 ◼   ► mentioned they send them off somewhere [TS]

00:09:31 ◼   ► and I went and looked up his with his [TS]

00:09:33 ◼   ► george RR martin wiki page and there's [TS]

00:09:37 ◼   ► no mention that he's mentioned in that [TS]

00:09:38 ◼   ► book anywhere it's like come on you [TS]

00:09:41 ◼   ► encyclopedia of fans you're laying down [TS]

00:09:43 ◼   ► on the job here that just means you [TS]

00:09:45 ◼   ► better sign up for an account righteous [TS]

00:09:47 ◼   ► yeah I really don't want to do that [TS]

00:09:49 ◼   ► although I couldn't balance on the [TS]

00:09:50 ◼   ► internet someone that you know it's got [TS]

00:09:53 ◼   ► to be that way lies met it is it is that [TS]

00:09:55 ◼   ► way like we're either that or one guy [TS]

00:09:57 ◼   ► gets to be paid by george RR martin but [TS]

00:10:00 ◼   ► everybody else is just mad so so we [TS]

00:10:04 ◼   ► should talk a little bit about the [TS]

00:10:07 ◼   ► setting for these these books I i think [TS]

00:10:09 ◼   ► one of the things that attracted me in [TS]

00:10:11 ◼   ► addition to the fact that HBO is going [TS]

00:10:12 ◼   ► to be making this into a series [TS]

00:10:14 ◼   ► attracted me to the series that I've [TS]

00:10:15 ◼   ► heard that it was like fantasy books but [TS]

00:10:17 ◼   ► not like your kind of stereotypical you [TS]

00:10:21 ◼   ► know wizards and witchcraft kind of kind [TS]

00:10:25 ◼   ► of & Dragons kind of fantasy bug and it [TS]

00:10:28 ◼   ► turns out that there are dragons and [TS]

00:10:30 ◼   ► there is magic but it's it's not a lot [TS]

00:10:33 ◼   ► but not a lot right i mean the first [TS]

00:10:35 ◼   ► look you get hints of dragons but even [TS]

00:10:38 ◼   ► then they're they're extinct [TS]

00:10:40 ◼   ► yeah exactly it's really more medieval [TS]

00:10:42 ◼   ► fiction that it [TS]

00:10:43 ◼   ► is right i mean you get the Dragons at [TS]

00:10:45 ◼   ► the end in sort of the the others at the [TS]

00:10:47 ◼   ► beginning and those sort of bookend it [TS]

00:10:49 ◼   ► but in between there really isn't much [TS]

00:10:51 ◼   ► so it's politics and violence and sex [TS]

00:10:53 ◼   ► and and back-slapping and things like [TS]

00:10:56 ◼   ► that which is is you know he'll be [TS]

00:10:57 ◼   ► anything but like little bit like the [TS]

00:10:59 ◼   ► wire [TS]

00:11:00 ◼   ► yes exactly medieval wire that's yes [TS]

00:11:04 ◼   ► well I have level you know the TV series [TS]

00:11:06 ◼   ► is a lot like the wire to and in that [TS]

00:11:08 ◼   ► it's complicated know lots of characters [TS]

00:11:10 ◼   ► but you know the wire screen [TS]

00:11:12 ◼   ► yeah well and again there they haven't [TS]

00:11:14 ◼   ► done much other than sort of you know [TS]

00:11:16 ◼   ► like yeah there's only that little bit [TS]

00:11:18 ◼   ► in the later books there become sort of [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► more of an influence of the magic coming [TS]

00:11:23 ◼   ► right but definitely that first book I [TS]

00:11:25 ◼   ► mean I i remember reading through and [TS]

00:11:26 ◼   ► thinking wow yeah there's there's really [TS]

00:11:28 ◼   ► not like beyond that sort of prologue if [TS]

00:11:30 ◼   ► you sort of forget about that it only [TS]

00:11:31 ◼   ► becomes a vacant after then people [TS]

00:11:35 ◼   ► talking about oh yeah there's some bad [TS]

00:11:37 ◼   ► you know crazy dudes up in the North or [TS]

00:11:39 ◼   ► whatever else not really worried about [TS]

00:11:41 ◼   ► that will even with the crazy dudes in [TS]

00:11:42 ◼   ► the North me with the others all you [TS]

00:11:44 ◼   ► really see me you get like the blue eyes [TS]

00:11:45 ◼   ► and the white hair and the crazy thing [TS]

00:11:47 ◼   ► but you don't really get the sense that [TS]

00:11:49 ◼   ► there anything other than savages you [TS]

00:11:51 ◼   ► know I mean there's a sort of mystique [TS]

00:11:53 ◼   ► to it but you could roll that off as [TS]

00:11:54 ◼   ► just ok these are just crazy warriors [TS]

00:11:57 ◼   ► who haven't lived among civilization [TS]

00:11:58 ◼   ► four years I mean like it seems pretty [TS]

00:12:00 ◼   ► clear that there's something to do with [TS]

00:12:02 ◼   ► like the Dead coming back so there's [TS]

00:12:03 ◼   ► there's definitely I think an element of [TS]

00:12:05 ◼   ► the other letter is it supposed to say [TS]

00:12:07 ◼   ► the Wildings yeah I guess towards the [TS]

00:12:09 ◼   ► end of the book barrel but the well we [TS]

00:12:10 ◼   ► have the wildlings are just feral right [TS]

00:12:13 ◼   ► so we should we fire up the spoiler [TS]

00:12:16 ◼   ► warning now [TS]

00:12:19 ◼   ► one of the things that's most striking I [TS]

00:12:21 ◼   ► think about these books and iíve been [TS]

00:12:24 ◼   ► reliving it as I've been watching the [TS]

00:12:26 ◼   ► the HBO series is poised RR martin is [TS]

00:12:30 ◼   ► not he admitted in one of these articles [TS]

00:12:33 ◼   ► that preceded the show coming on that [TS]

00:12:37 ◼   ► he's playing a shell game in the first [TS]

00:12:39 ◼   ► book that he he intends for you to [TS]

00:12:42 ◼   ► assume who the main characters are and [TS]

00:12:45 ◼   ► it's very clear you know Ned Stark is [TS]

00:12:47 ◼   ► the main character in the game of [TS]

00:12:48 ◼   ► thrones and so it's all the more [TS]

00:12:51 ◼   ► shocking when they chop his head off [TS]

00:12:53 ◼   ► I hope someone told Shawn being ahead of [TS]

00:12:55 ◼   ► time i'll see if i seasoned veteran some [TS]

00:12:57 ◼   ► unpleasant aspects i'm not in the second [TS]

00:13:00 ◼   ► season while back and he signed a [TS]

00:13:01 ◼   ► one-year contract [TS]

00:13:02 ◼   ► yeah unless they change huge tapestry of [TS]

00:13:06 ◼   ► characters and I mean that was the thing [TS]

00:13:07 ◼   ► that was described to me in terms of [TS]

00:13:09 ◼   ► like why this was its series that was so [TS]

00:13:12 ◼   ► different from any other series which [TS]

00:13:13 ◼   ► was my friend sort of telling this me [TS]

00:13:15 ◼   ► going well the thing about this series [TS]

00:13:16 ◼   ► is like they put people into impossible [TS]

00:13:19 ◼   ► situations you're like how are they ever [TS]

00:13:20 ◼   ► going to escape that and then they don't [TS]

00:13:22 ◼   ► right right so so you know the it turns [TS]

00:13:28 ◼   ► out that the main characters in the [TS]

00:13:30 ◼   ► series are are like like re s dark the [TS]

00:13:36 ◼   ► daughter of Ned Stark and jon snow it's [TS]

00:13:38 ◼   ► like the stark children are our main [TS]

00:13:41 ◼   ► character ones that survived once that [TS]

00:13:43 ◼   ► survived right [TS]

00:13:45 ◼   ► not all of them do and um and then you [TS]

00:13:49 ◼   ► know Tyrion Lannister and and and some [TS]

00:13:51 ◼   ► of the Lannisters who are the bad [TS]

00:13:52 ◼   ► characters although some of them end up [TS]

00:13:54 ◼   ► being good characters or at least [TS]

00:13:56 ◼   ► interesting not entirely evil characters [TS]

00:13:58 ◼   ► later ray they're complicated which is [TS]

00:14:01 ◼   ► one of the one of the good things about [TS]

00:14:02 ◼   ► these books is that you've got people [TS]

00:14:04 ◼   ► who you like who do bad things and [TS]

00:14:05 ◼   ► people who don't like who do good things [TS]

00:14:07 ◼   ► and it is a mess and not clear like [TS]

00:14:11 ◼   ► going into this I was thinking about how [TS]

00:14:12 ◼   ► you know I was sort of going through [TS]

00:14:14 ◼   ► what I remember from the books and and [TS]

00:14:15 ◼   ► remembering that one of my life i can [TS]

00:14:18 ◼   ► call on one of my favorite characters [TS]

00:14:19 ◼   ► but like one of the characters that [TS]

00:14:21 ◼   ► intrigues me the most is from at the [TS]

00:14:24 ◼   ► beginning of the series is like the most [TS]

00:14:26 ◼   ► despicable person in the book is Jaime [TS]

00:14:29 ◼   ► Lannister like throws a kid out the [TS]

00:14:31 ◼   ► window like you don't [TS]

00:14:33 ◼   ► much worse than that right but he did it [TS]

00:14:35 ◼   ► because he loved and sisters things he [TS]

00:14:37 ◼   ► does for a little 2morrow is the real [TS]

00:14:39 ◼   ► despicable character but like as the [TS]

00:14:41 ◼   ► series goes on i mean like he becomes a [TS]

00:14:44 ◼   ► little more human and a little less like [TS]

00:14:46 ◼   ► evil villainy right like you know he [TS]

00:14:48 ◼   ► loses his hand when the later books we [TS]

00:14:50 ◼   ► can't he's no longer able to be the sort [TS]

00:14:52 ◼   ► of great warrior [TS]

00:14:53 ◼   ► you also get into his head you know yes [TS]

00:14:55 ◼   ► yeah he becomes a protest a narrow [TS]

00:14:57 ◼   ► viewpoint characters well which which [TS]

00:14:59 ◼   ► does change your opinion of him and you [TS]

00:15:02 ◼   ► learn some stuff about his past about [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► things that he's done that's been sort [TS]

00:15:05 ◼   ► of assumed to be terrible terrible acts [TS]

00:15:07 ◼   ► that may have had different motivations [TS]

00:15:09 ◼   ► and he has this very interesting [TS]

00:15:10 ◼   ► relationship for a while with this woman [TS]

00:15:11 ◼   ► breanne yes I made of Tarth which brings [TS]

00:15:14 ◼   ► out a lot of humanity in him that is [TS]

00:15:17 ◼   ► previously lacking and I kind of a kind [TS]

00:15:19 ◼   ► of dug that and of course the other [TS]

00:15:20 ◼   ► character I like kinda from the get-go [TS]

00:15:21 ◼   ► even though here you're never quite sure [TS]

00:15:23 ◼   ► where you where he stands as Theriot man [TS]

00:15:25 ◼   ► who is also considered maybe a villain [TS]

00:15:27 ◼   ► but he's also kind of a good guy in some [TS]

00:15:29 ◼   ► ways like he's probably one of the more [TS]

00:15:30 ◼   ► sympathetic character he never strikes [TS]

00:15:32 ◼   ► me as a villain he always strikes me I [TS]

00:15:35 ◼   ► mean to think about Tyrion Lannister [TS]

00:15:36 ◼   ► which such great character when I heard [TS]

00:15:37 ◼   ► that peter dinklage was going to be [TS]

00:15:38 ◼   ► playing always be a little break so up [TS]

00:15:41 ◼   ► Tyrion Lannister such a great character [TS]

00:15:43 ◼   ► but he's always you know he's got this [TS]

00:15:47 ◼   ► interesting combination of being very [TS]

00:15:49 ◼   ► well aware of of of his place in the [TS]

00:15:53 ◼   ► world and everybody's placed in the [TS]

00:15:54 ◼   ► world and in a way that a lot of the [TS]

00:15:56 ◼   ► other characters aren't but at the same [TS]

00:15:58 ◼   ► time being loyal to his family in the [TS]

00:16:02 ◼   ► way he sort of defines but it's [TS]

00:16:04 ◼   ► fascinating because the his family's [TS]

00:16:06 ◼   ► basically bad they're bad people and we [TS]

00:16:09 ◼   ► don't like them and and so you like him [TS]

00:16:11 ◼   ► and you're like well i like this guy [TS]

00:16:13 ◼   ► he's a guy could root for but he's loyal [TS]

00:16:15 ◼   ► to his family which means he does some [TS]

00:16:17 ◼   ► stuff that you that you would really [TS]

00:16:18 ◼   ► rather not see him do but the reason he [TS]

00:16:20 ◼   ► does it is because he's still a [TS]

00:16:22 ◼   ► Lannister and he does feel like he's got [TS]

00:16:25 ◼   ► this obligation up to a point any way up [TS]

00:16:27 ◼   ► to the point where he shoots his father [TS]

00:16:29 ◼   ► down the toilet and kills him love he [TS]

00:16:32 ◼   ► has this feeling the thing i love about [TS]

00:16:34 ◼   ► Tyrion though is that he's Frank and [TS]

00:16:37 ◼   ► he's not you know you don't you don't [TS]

00:16:38 ◼   ► get that hidden from it you know from [TS]

00:16:40 ◼   ► the get-go that he's loyal to his family [TS]

00:16:41 ◼   ► and he pretty much says it straight out [TS]

00:16:43 ◼   ► I think it's like the second or third [TS]

00:16:44 ◼   ► chapter [TS]

00:16:45 ◼   ► where where he's at the stark residence [TS]

00:16:47 ◼   ► and and Jamie like something about you [TS]

00:16:50 ◼   ► know [TS]

00:16:51 ◼   ► oh I hope I hope you're not planning on [TS]

00:16:53 ◼   ► you know doing this is like well why [TS]

00:16:54 ◼   ► would I ever betray my family you I mean [TS]

00:16:57 ◼   ► you get these clues from him from the [TS]

00:16:58 ◼   ► get-go and he's and completely Frank [TS]

00:17:01 ◼   ► every way I mean he's loyal to his [TS]

00:17:03 ◼   ► family in a way that doesn't necessarily [TS]

00:17:04 ◼   ► mean that he's blind loyalty to the [TS]

00:17:06 ◼   ► members of his family like I think [TS]

00:17:08 ◼   ► there's a greater he's got something [TS]

00:17:10 ◼   ► bigger at stake there right yeah the [TS]

00:17:11 ◼   ► reputation the honor of that house and [TS]

00:17:13 ◼   ► hehe really protects that even when the [TS]

00:17:16 ◼   ► people he thinks our dishonouring it are [TS]

00:17:17 ◼   ► the people in his family like his sister [TS]

00:17:20 ◼   ► or his father but the interesting setup [TS]

00:17:22 ◼   ► is is that you've got the War of the [TS]

00:17:24 ◼   ► five kings and it looks as if the [TS]

00:17:27 ◼   ► Lannisters and and Joffrey whoever you [TS]

00:17:30 ◼   ► know at that point you hate him and he's [TS]

00:17:32 ◼   ► and he's done all these horrible things [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► and he's ordered that you know you [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► ordered the execution of of Ned after a [TS]

00:17:38 ◼   ► deal was brokered by his mother to just [TS]

00:17:41 ◼   ► send them to the wall all these terrible [TS]

00:17:43 ◼   ► things and you're thinking alright [TS]

00:17:44 ◼   ► though the Lannisters are going to get [TS]

00:17:46 ◼   ► it [TS]

00:17:47 ◼   ► auntie reham basically outsmarts [TS]

00:17:49 ◼   ► everybody else and saves the day and its [TS]

00:17:51 ◼   ► really you're in this weird position [TS]

00:17:52 ◼   ► where you're rooting for the guy because [TS]

00:17:54 ◼   ► he is such an interesting character [TS]

00:17:56 ◼   ► esmart you want him to do you know do is [TS]

00:17:59 ◼   ► kind of well as an underdog right now [TS]

00:18:01 ◼   ► right except for traditional what he's [TS]

00:18:02 ◼   ► doing is protecting these horrible [TS]

00:18:04 ◼   ► people and you kinda wanna be like come [TS]

00:18:07 ◼   ► on [TS]

00:18:08 ◼   ► but at the same time you know he has [TS]

00:18:10 ◼   ► this code which makes them interesting i [TS]

00:18:12 ◼   ► also love you know and even in the first [TS]

00:18:14 ◼   ► couple episodes of the TV show they [TS]

00:18:16 ◼   ► really bring out the sort of great he's [TS]

00:18:18 ◼   ► got a confidence that it seems like a [TS]

00:18:20 ◼   ► lot of people in the show [TS]

00:18:21 ◼   ► whack you know he talks about that my [TS]

00:18:23 ◼   ► love that line the Utopia all dwarves [TS]

00:18:25 ◼   ► are bastards in the eyes of their [TS]

00:18:27 ◼   ► fathers just such a such a great like he [TS]

00:18:31 ◼   ► knows exactly how other people see me [TS]

00:18:33 ◼   ► also tells john snow at some point like [TS]

00:18:35 ◼   ► hey you know embrace what you are [TS]

00:18:38 ◼   ► because it's not going to go away and [TS]

00:18:40 ◼   ► the sooner you're more comfortable with [TS]

00:18:41 ◼   ► it like a better off you'll be [TS]

00:18:44 ◼   ► I think it's just very he's got he's a [TS]

00:18:46 ◼   ► very smart guy and I clearly he's worked [TS]

00:18:48 ◼   ► hard to become that it's like it's like [TS]

00:18:51 ◼   ► a it's like a little bit like a miles [TS]

00:18:53 ◼   ► workers again is exactly that's the [TS]

00:18:55 ◼   ► first person I thought of when i was [TS]

00:18:56 ◼   ► reading this [TS]

00:18:57 ◼   ► that's why Scott hates t really did one [TS]

00:19:02 ◼   ► of the interesting things about the [TS]

00:19:04 ◼   ► first book is this split storyline we're [TS]

00:19:07 ◼   ► really in parallel with almost no [TS]

00:19:11 ◼   ► crossover slight crossover you've got a [TS]

00:19:14 ◼   ► daenerys targaryen and her adventures in [TS]

00:19:17 ◼   ► the desert where her brother basically [TS]

00:19:19 ◼   ► sells her to the warlord of the horse [TS]

00:19:24 ◼   ► people and and yet and if you haven't [TS]

00:19:28 ◼   ► read this series it's not quite as weird [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► as it sounds [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► no we're not actually a horse people [TS]

00:19:32 ◼   ► know they're not happen address there [TS]

00:19:34 ◼   ► like people here on horses so pretty [TS]

00:19:37 ◼   ► weird though it is kinda weird [TS]

00:19:39 ◼   ► yeah and she you know her brother has no [TS]

00:19:42 ◼   ► care and he basically sells her in order [TS]

00:19:45 ◼   ► to get the idea is to get this army of [TS]

00:19:47 ◼   ► people to take back their their crown [TS]

00:19:50 ◼   ► which has been usurped across the sea [TS]

00:19:53 ◼   ► and you know there's some great stuff in [TS]

00:19:56 ◼   ► there because she actually kind of comes [TS]

00:19:59 ◼   ► of age and in the end she sort of like [TS]

00:20:00 ◼   ► the last one standing interns in terms [TS]

00:20:02 ◼   ► of she you know she's the queen of the [TS]

00:20:05 ◼   ► well the horse people except there are [TS]

00:20:09 ◼   ► many of them left after a while you know [TS]

00:20:11 ◼   ► it but she's kind of empowered and she's [TS]

00:20:13 ◼   ► got these dragon eggs that she throws in [TS]

00:20:15 ◼   ► the fire and the hatch and then she's [TS]

00:20:16 ◼   ► got dragons so it's very clear that [TS]

00:20:18 ◼   ► she's in the long run [TS]

00:20:20 ◼   ► you know one of the major characters if [TS]

00:20:21 ◼   ► not the most important character in the [TS]

00:20:23 ◼   ► books but in the first in the first book [TS]

00:20:25 ◼   ► and really for a while she's just in a [TS]

00:20:28 ◼   ► parallel story with there's white one [TS]

00:20:29 ◼   ► character and then eventually I think [TS]

00:20:31 ◼   ► there are two characters across over [TS]

00:20:33 ◼   ► between her story and everybody else I [TS]

00:20:35 ◼   ► mean she's on the other side of the [TS]

00:20:37 ◼   ► Narrow Sea and the Narrow Sea can't be [TS]

00:20:38 ◼   ► crossed by anything except ships and [TS]

00:20:40 ◼   ► they don't have ships so why would such [TS]

00:20:42 ◼   ► narrow sea before now you won't go on [TS]

00:20:45 ◼   ► and I know whenever the others when you [TS]

00:20:48 ◼   ► when you wanna cross the sea you of [TS]

00:20:50 ◼   ► course need to get 10,000 mounted [TS]

00:20:52 ◼   ► warriors because that makes perfect [TS]

00:20:55 ◼   ► sense [TS]

00:20:55 ◼   ► all I could say is they can probably see [TS]

00:20:57 ◼   ► Westeros from their house probably the [TS]

00:21:00 ◼   ► thing i love about Denarius though is [TS]

00:21:03 ◼   ► that she starts off that first book as [TS]

00:21:05 ◼   ► so like almost completely innocent to a [TS]

00:21:08 ◼   ► certain extent [TS]

00:21:09 ◼   ► like you have you have her brother [TS]

00:21:11 ◼   ► basically bullying her and I the the [TS]

00:21:13 ◼   ► phrase don't wake that you don't want to [TS]

00:21:14 ◼   ► wait the dragon do you that that kind of [TS]

00:21:16 ◼   ► chills down my spine the first time I [TS]

00:21:18 ◼   ► read it to my gosh shoot this does not [TS]

00:21:20 ◼   ► bode well for for this character bad [TS]

00:21:23 ◼   ► things are happening and then she [TS]

00:21:24 ◼   ► basically gets l2 yeah the warlord [TS]

00:21:26 ◼   ► horselord who basically rapes her [TS]

00:21:29 ◼   ► yep yep and I mean she she she takes [TS]

00:21:33 ◼   ► such as marvelous transition between [TS]

00:21:34 ◼   ► scared girl who's just wants to go back [TS]

00:21:38 ◼   ► to the the house with the red door that [TS]

00:21:39 ◼   ► she lived in for a couple years where [TS]

00:21:41 ◼   ► she thought she was happy to this to a [TS]

00:21:44 ◼   ► queen in her own right and its really [TS]

00:21:45 ◼   ► really fascinating to read that [TS]

00:21:47 ◼   ► especially nice first through everything [TS]

00:21:48 ◼   ► else [TS]

00:21:49 ◼   ► despite that I could never quite figure [TS]

00:21:51 ◼   ► out if I like her not she definitely is [TS]

00:21:53 ◼   ► like you know I i agree that the her [TS]

00:21:55 ◼   ► transition is really interesting and [TS]

00:21:57 ◼   ► like she definitely becomes a very [TS]

00:21:58 ◼   ► empowered figure especially towards the [TS]

00:22:00 ◼   ► later books where she's really like [TS]

00:22:02 ◼   ► learning how to you know wield that [TS]

00:22:05 ◼   ► power authority but she's and she's very [TS]

00:22:09 ◼   ► ruthless to a certain point but at the [TS]

00:22:12 ◼   ► same time you know I can't quite get a [TS]

00:22:14 ◼   ► sense of whether or not i find her a [TS]

00:22:15 ◼   ► likeable character you know I think the [TS]

00:22:18 ◼   ► most likable I found her was the first [TS]

00:22:20 ◼   ► chapter of the first book and then as [TS]

00:22:23 ◼   ► chic as she grows colder as she grows [TS]

00:22:26 ◼   ► stronger and more the more she goes into [TS]

00:22:29 ◼   ► this sort of you know Queen queenly [TS]

00:22:31 ◼   ► attitude the farther away you get from [TS]

00:22:33 ◼   ► this person could ever be likable [TS]

00:22:35 ◼   ► because you never really seen her head [TS]

00:22:37 ◼   ► after that especially after the whole [TS]

00:22:39 ◼   ► incident with the fire on the Dragons I [TS]

00:22:41 ◼   ► think that's the last point where you [TS]

00:22:42 ◼   ► ever really see what's kind of going on [TS]

00:22:45 ◼   ► for her personally and not what's going [TS]

00:22:47 ◼   ► on for her as a larger scope it's got [TS]

00:22:50 ◼   ► that at that moment she was reborn into [TS]

00:22:53 ◼   ► her birthright right as a dragon [TS]

00:22:55 ◼   ► controlling monarch i guess and so she [TS]

00:22:58 ◼   ► transforms from that innocent child much [TS]

00:23:01 ◼   ► like the Petrified eggs were hatched [TS]

00:23:03 ◼   ► into dragons haha very nice aesthetic i [TS]

00:23:06 ◼   ► like that i like having this degree [TS]

00:23:08 ◼   ► Bravo sir they do you know obviously the [TS]

00:23:12 ◼   ► song of ice and fire which again you [TS]

00:23:14 ◼   ► know is i see why it's called that but [TS]

00:23:16 ◼   ► it's it's a little bit silly but clearly [TS]

00:23:19 ◼   ► that sacrifice and that it over with [TS]

00:23:21 ◼   ► clearly the overarching story here is [TS]

00:23:23 ◼   ► that the the battle the battle is [TS]

00:23:25 ◼   ► between the Dragonlords and fire and [TS]

00:23:30 ◼   ► they seem to be the Dragon seem to be [TS]

00:23:31 ◼   ► the only thing that can stop the others [TS]

00:23:33 ◼   ► the dragonglass and the fire from [TS]

00:23:35 ◼   ► dragons and so you've got this sort of a [TS]

00:23:38 ◼   ► conflict building and then on top of it [TS]

00:23:42 ◼   ► right there there's also the whole I [TS]

00:23:46 ◼   ► like this like the red fiery God yet [TS]

00:23:51 ◼   ► didn't whose name I can't pronounce real [TS]

00:23:52 ◼   ► or yeah the gods always have weird names [TS]

00:23:56 ◼   ► and fantasy series because they're their [TS]

00:23:58 ◼   ► gods yeah it Bob would not be a scary [TS]

00:24:01 ◼   ► yeah they don't want you to be able to [TS]

00:24:02 ◼   ► print out all the ones I Californians [TS]

00:24:04 ◼   ► and and double consonants and yeah it's [TS]

00:24:07 ◼   ► a glottal that's basically like a [TS]

00:24:09 ◼   ► Romulan broccoli god yeah that would be [TS]

00:24:13 ◼   ► that would be such a twist ending we [TS]

00:24:15 ◼   ► have been turning up the whole Klingon [TS]

00:24:17 ◼   ► so so that and that's actually for me [TS]

00:24:20 ◼   ► that's one of the weirder things is not [TS]

00:24:21 ◼   ► i mean the whole idea of the dragons and [TS]

00:24:23 ◼   ► the heat of the dragons in these ice [TS]

00:24:24 ◼   ► guy's monster creature things the others [TS]

00:24:27 ◼   ► that are coming from the north as winter [TS]

00:24:29 ◼   ► comes I I i see where he's going with [TS]

00:24:31 ◼   ► that and and it's interesting because [TS]

00:24:33 ◼   ► for a while you're rooting for the you [TS]

00:24:35 ◼   ► know you're like oh no not the Targaryen [TS]

00:24:37 ◼   ► there they're bad and they kicked out [TS]

00:24:38 ◼   ► the crazy king and and and but it's [TS]

00:24:41 ◼   ► clear where this is going which is that [TS]

00:24:43 ◼   ► that you know the nearest and her [TS]

00:24:45 ◼   ► dragons are are the thing that's gonna [TS]

00:24:47 ◼   ► save them it you know theoretically but [TS]

00:24:51 ◼   ► the red the red priests and the end and [TS]

00:24:54 ◼   ► the and Melisandre the red woman who and [TS]

00:24:58 ◼   ► the fact that they're like you know [TS]

00:24:59 ◼   ► kings who just died just dropped dead [TS]

00:25:03 ◼   ► because of the red godz magic it's that [TS]

00:25:08 ◼   ► stuff always struck me as being really [TS]

00:25:09 ◼   ► bizarre because I I always just sort of [TS]

00:25:11 ◼   ► wrote it off as i was reading it as [TS]

00:25:13 ◼   ► being like Oh silly silly magic that [TS]

00:25:15 ◼   ► won't do anything and then you know [TS]

00:25:16 ◼   ► various kings just drop dead [TS]

00:25:20 ◼   ► yeah that was the point at which it like [TS]

00:25:22 ◼   ► you know I felt like the series move [TS]

00:25:23 ◼   ► more into the traditional fantasy realm [TS]

00:25:26 ◼   ► and I and in some ways I was kind of [TS]

00:25:27 ◼   ► disappointed with that transition [TS]

00:25:28 ◼   ► because I'd really enjoyed the sort of [TS]

00:25:31 ◼   ► non magical atmosphere up to that point [TS]

00:25:32 ◼   ► and also because I [TS]

00:25:35 ◼   ► I think one of the other sort of [TS]

00:25:37 ◼   ► sympathetic characters introduced in [TS]

00:25:39 ◼   ► conflict with the red priestess which is [TS]

00:25:42 ◼   ► a devil's oh yeah i like his music yeah [TS]

00:25:46 ◼   ► he's a likable guy he's also wanted to [TS]

00:25:48 ◼   ► sort of more honorable characters out [TS]

00:25:51 ◼   ► there i mean because I mean I guess you [TS]

00:25:53 ◼   ► can you can argue that Stannis Baratheon [TS]

00:25:55 ◼   ► is kind of honorable but he's also kinda [TS]

00:25:56 ◼   ► got a stick up his ass [TS]

00:25:58 ◼   ► it gets kind of taken over to ya [TS]

00:26:01 ◼   ► and so I mean like having that in there [TS]

00:26:03 ◼   ► you know it [TS]

00:26:04 ◼   ► II it's not feel very conflicted about [TS]

00:26:06 ◼   ► that as a plot development but i guess [TS]

00:26:09 ◼   ► it remains to be seen whether they where [TS]

00:26:11 ◼   ► it's sort of where it's art will lead it [TS]

00:26:13 ◼   ► yeah I you know that thing when they [TS]

00:26:15 ◼   ► curse all the other Kings right and all [TS]

00:26:17 ◼   ► the other Kings die but what what what [TS]

00:26:22 ◼   ► is weird is that some of them died in a [TS]

00:26:24 ◼   ► mysterious way right and readily get [TS]

00:26:27 ◼   ► stabbed by a shadow right really is [TS]

00:26:28 ◼   ► killed by shadow and and Joffrey just [TS]

00:26:31 ◼   ► sort of like randomly chokes on nothing [TS]

00:26:34 ◼   ► well he gets poisoned it doesn't get [TS]

00:26:36 ◼   ► poisoned or do they just think he good [TS]

00:26:38 ◼   ► I feel like it's poisoned by the same [TS]

00:26:40 ◼   ► thing that I'm the what's-his-face Jon [TS]

00:26:43 ◼   ► Arryn I'm not well Jon Arryn yeah the [TS]

00:26:46 ◼   ► tears of the tears of lys or lies or [TS]

00:26:49 ◼   ► have to say it but doesn't mean I wasn't [TS]

00:26:51 ◼   ► sorry i just reread a lot of the sort of [TS]

00:26:54 ◼   ► overviews before this to sort of refresh [TS]

00:26:56 ◼   ► myself and they suggest that [TS]

00:26:57 ◼   ► Littlefinger had a hand in in killing [TS]

00:27:00 ◼   ► Joffrey when I read it I i thought you [TS]

00:27:02 ◼   ► know our is it that they think that [TS]

00:27:05 ◼   ► that's what happened or did that [TS]

00:27:06 ◼   ► actually happen right is it that they [TS]

00:27:08 ◼   ► don't get excited when they set up to [TS]

00:27:11 ◼   ► poison him except it didn't it he got [TS]

00:27:13 ◼   ► killed by the magic for my for some [TS]

00:27:15 ◼   ► great but my point is that that the even [TS]

00:27:16 ◼   ► that and then certainly what happens at [TS]

00:27:18 ◼   ► the red wedding with with Robb Stark [TS]

00:27:20 ◼   ► I'm a little out of control measure [TS]

00:27:22 ◼   ► those are yeah those are plausibly be [TS]

00:27:24 ◼   ► like well maybe it's bad luck or maybe [TS]

00:27:26 ◼   ► it was a curse but like murdered by [TS]

00:27:28 ◼   ► shadow it's just like wow [TS]

00:27:31 ◼   ► because I also the guy in the iron the [TS]

00:27:33 ◼   ► Ironborn you know that the King bail or [TS]

00:27:36 ◼   ► Greyjoy [TS]

00:27:37 ◼   ► yeah Greyjoy hehe like falls off a [TS]

00:27:39 ◼   ► bridge or something until you killed by [TS]

00:27:42 ◼   ► a shadow looks terrible on homicide [TS]

00:27:44 ◼   ► report by the way yeah def by shadow [TS]

00:27:46 ◼   ► detective general plan [TS]

00:27:48 ◼   ► shadow it makes kind of sense though [TS]

00:27:50 ◼   ► because I mean Renly is his younger [TS]

00:27:51 ◼   ► brother and it makes sense that of all [TS]

00:27:54 ◼   ► of them she would have a direct hand in [TS]

00:27:56 ◼   ► killing him and the others may be [TS]

00:27:58 ◼   ► coincidence but she can write it off as [TS]

00:28:00 ◼   ► oh yes well I did this I did this in the [TS]

00:28:02 ◼   ► red God answered my prayers [TS]

00:28:04 ◼   ► yes that's exactly what happens oh and I [TS]

00:28:06 ◼   ► also killed you younger brother did [TS]

00:28:08 ◼   ► anybody did anybody else when reading [TS]

00:28:10 ◼   ► the books get the subtext of the fact [TS]

00:28:12 ◼   ► that readily is gay and loves the knight [TS]

00:28:15 ◼   ► of flowers [TS]

00:28:16 ◼   ► well if you don't get in the books [TS]

00:28:18 ◼   ► you'll certainly get it need you know [TS]

00:28:19 ◼   ► you're in the TV series it is clear but [TS]

00:28:23 ◼   ► although afterwards I went back and I [TS]

00:28:25 ◼   ► was like oh yeah the rainbow guard huh [TS]

00:28:27 ◼   ► yeah and when the nighty knight of [TS]

00:28:32 ◼   ► flowers is kind of a pretty boy and yeah [TS]

00:28:35 ◼   ► yeah the HBO series makes it quite clear [TS]

00:28:38 ◼   ► that that that Renly and actually [TS]

00:28:40 ◼   ► reading piece a feast for crows there [TS]

00:28:44 ◼   ► are several scenes where I realize that [TS]

00:28:46 ◼   ► it's totally there all along and I just [TS]

00:28:48 ◼   ► totally just passed over it and didn't [TS]

00:28:50 ◼   ► notice all the subtext of how so lorises [TS]

00:28:53 ◼   ► not not interested in the ladies except [TS]

00:28:56 ◼   ► for San soon he was kind of I seems kind [TS]

00:28:59 ◼   ► of like an ascetic you know [TS]

00:29:01 ◼   ► no not well I don't it's been way too [TS]

00:29:04 ◼   ► long since i've read the books I i [TS]

00:29:06 ◼   ► create the HBO series will make it [TS]

00:29:08 ◼   ► abundantly clear that abundantly so I [TS]

00:29:13 ◼   ► don't understand what's going on its [TS]

00:29:14 ◼   ► various guys ignore it yes the night of [TS]

00:29:16 ◼   ► our flowers very pretty armor that's not [TS]

00:29:18 ◼   ► what I'm saying he's a good chance that [TS]

00:29:21 ◼   ► he was he was bluffing his armor for him [TS]

00:29:23 ◼   ► exactly and advising advising him on how [TS]

00:29:26 ◼   ► to be a good king [TS]

00:29:27 ◼   ► sadly he will be killed by shadow that [TS]

00:29:30 ◼   ► that is the trouble I have with watching [TS]

00:29:32 ◼   ► the TV show is knowing all the awful [TS]

00:29:34 ◼   ► things are going to happen oh man I know [TS]

00:29:36 ◼   ► x 0 2 you're watching like Kaitlyn [TS]

00:29:38 ◼   ► you're like all mad [TS]

00:29:40 ◼   ► oh yeah catlin sure like oh man this is [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► gonna go bad that was the most shocking [TS]

00:29:44 ◼   ► even more than Ned that was the most [TS]

00:29:45 ◼   ► shocking death in the entire series and [TS]

00:29:47 ◼   ► then even more shocking to put it in [TS]

00:29:49 ◼   ► quotes yeah well even more shocking than [TS]

00:29:51 ◼   ► killing her is that then they record [TS]

00:29:52 ◼   ► resurrector is like a half zombie [TS]

00:29:54 ◼   ► version of fresh oh yeah [TS]

00:29:57 ◼   ► exactly it's unclear well her throat is [TS]

00:30:00 ◼   ► still cut so I mean you have that if [TS]

00:30:03 ◼   ► nothing else and one another topic I [TS]

00:30:06 ◼   ► wanted to bring up is that the [TS]

00:30:08 ◼   ► direwolves which are introduced the very [TS]

00:30:10 ◼   ► beginning and there's one for each stark [TS]

00:30:12 ◼   ► child and it turns out that several of [TS]

00:30:15 ◼   ► the star children have this connection [TS]

00:30:17 ◼   ► with them which is most I think it's [TS]

00:30:19 ◼   ► most clear and brand who ends up even [TS]

00:30:21 ◼   ► though we can't walk he's got this you [TS]

00:30:23 ◼   ► know vision and and he's proceeding [TS]

00:30:25 ◼   ► north of the wall to speak to us to the [TS]

00:30:28 ◼   ► three-eyed crow or something like that [TS]

00:30:29 ◼   ► and John and and jon snow has this [TS]

00:30:33 ◼   ► ability to worry sort of bonded with [TS]

00:30:34 ◼   ► this dire wolf and area an area to write [TS]

00:30:37 ◼   ► even though even though hers disappears [TS]

00:30:39 ◼   ► fairly early on but it and yet its [TS]

00:30:42 ◼   ► present throughout because they keep on [TS]

00:30:44 ◼   ► wondering around through the Riverlands [TS]

00:30:45 ◼   ► in the lake man there's lots of wolves [TS]

00:30:47 ◼   ► around here in a big 12 and it's very [TS]

00:30:49 ◼   ► clear that that's her direwolf surprise [TS]

00:30:51 ◼   ► surprise that you never see it it's just [TS]

00:30:54 ◼   ► out pci author out that she's one of my [TS]

00:30:56 ◼   ► other favorite care i love re also [TS]

00:30:57 ◼   ► because she's actually that like one [TS]

00:31:00 ◼   ► legitimately like innocent like victim [TS]

00:31:02 ◼   ► basic licking all this and and she but [TS]

00:31:04 ◼   ► she also kicks a switch here right [TS]

00:31:06 ◼   ► what I appreciate is that she's capable [TS]

00:31:08 ◼   ► without being superhuman you know it's [TS]

00:31:10 ◼   ► like she still she still has bad things [TS]

00:31:12 ◼   ► happen to her and she still gets in bad [TS]

00:31:14 ◼   ► situations but she manages to pull [TS]

00:31:17 ◼   ► through and use what little training she [TS]

00:31:19 ◼   ► has without make me her you know [TS]

00:31:21 ◼   ► oh I've had you know six months worth of [TS]

00:31:23 ◼   ► dancing lessons therefore i'm a master [TS]

00:31:25 ◼   ► of the tiny sword [TS]

00:31:26 ◼   ► yeah i got sad when they said they put [TS]

00:31:29 ◼   ► her on the boat to she ended up on the [TS]

00:31:30 ◼   ► boat to what Bravo sir whatever nose [TS]

00:31:32 ◼   ► like now you're taking her further away [TS]

00:31:33 ◼   ► from everything that's or is she closer [TS]

00:31:37 ◼   ► who she's farther away she she would [TS]

00:31:40 ◼   ► meet Samwell Tarly at one point is that [TS]

00:31:43 ◼   ► it's in that fourth book who I like [TS]

00:31:45 ◼   ► Samwell Tarly he said well Charlie [TS]

00:31:47 ◼   ► that's a great carrying the fat coward [TS]

00:31:49 ◼   ► yeah but he's smart it's like it's like [TS]

00:31:52 ◼   ► I'm in the book because it's like Sam [TS]

00:31:55 ◼   ► Gamgee I is it wrong that I picture him [TS]

00:31:58 ◼   ► as sam from lord of the ring now I [TS]

00:32:00 ◼   ► totally Sean ass on a steel you [TS]

00:32:02 ◼   ► absolutely do that was the first thing [TS]

00:32:04 ◼   ► it's awful to say to compare it to [TS]

00:32:07 ◼   ► another character but it has to be [TS]

00:32:09 ◼   ► intentional well there are several other [TS]

00:32:11 ◼   ► references yeah in i think the only [TS]

00:32:13 ◼   ► other things that came across the [TS]

00:32:14 ◼   ► Wikipedia entries like there are several [TS]

00:32:16 ◼   ► references to the wheel of time like [TS]

00:32:19 ◼   ► there's even there's like a character [TS]

00:32:20 ◼   ► named like like something from an [TS]

00:32:23 ◼   ► anagram of like robert jordan or [TS]

00:32:24 ◼   ► something [TS]

00:32:25 ◼   ► I it's just one of their lives there so [TS]

00:32:27 ◼   ► Maj in there to other two other [TS]

00:32:29 ◼   ► fantasies that's that's why I can't [TS]

00:32:31 ◼   ► stand the whole red God stuff is that it [TS]

00:32:33 ◼   ► reminds me too much of wheel of time in [TS]

00:32:36 ◼   ► parts like the ace today and like stuff [TS]

00:32:38 ◼   ► like that with the with the red pieces [TS]

00:32:39 ◼   ► and I'm like I this I really hope it [TS]

00:32:42 ◼   ► doesn't go that direction not not having [TS]

00:32:45 ◼   ► read the fourth book and only skimmed [TS]

00:32:47 ◼   ► the wikipedia entry for this podcast [TS]

00:32:49 ◼   ► well and that's something actually want [TS]

00:32:52 ◼   ► to ask you as yet because I mean this is [TS]

00:32:54 ◼   ► always the danger especially with [TS]

00:32:55 ◼   ► lifelong fantasy series is we're in the [TS]

00:32:57 ◼   ► middle right like and and Martin is [TS]

00:33:00 ◼   ► delayed a number of the books including [TS]

00:33:02 ◼   ► the most recent 1i mean this is the [TS]

00:33:04 ◼   ► first book and again what 687 hear me [TS]

00:33:07 ◼   ► out and also right so I guess the [TS]

00:33:10 ◼   ► question is like are we in for a [TS]

00:33:12 ◼   ► disappointment or you are any of you [TS]

00:33:14 ◼   ► worried that this series is going to [TS]

00:33:15 ◼   ► sort of peter out like I mean I don't [TS]

00:33:17 ◼   ► know if he's got the whole thing I [TS]

00:33:19 ◼   ► assume that he's got you know a lot of [TS]

00:33:20 ◼   ► stuff planned out but I don't I mean I [TS]

00:33:22 ◼   ► also assume that it's not like the whole [TS]

00:33:23 ◼   ► thing is planned out otherwise you know [TS]

00:33:25 ◼   ► the books would be written but I don't [TS]

00:33:28 ◼   ► know do you I i bet i've read a lot of [TS]

00:33:30 ◼   ► fantasy series where it's like it starts [TS]

00:33:32 ◼   ► out good and you can kind of tell with [TS]

00:33:33 ◼   ► the author ran out of steam or ideas or [TS]

00:33:37 ◼   ► just got so convoluted that you sort of [TS]

00:33:40 ◼   ► lost the thread and and I start to worry [TS]

00:33:42 ◼   ► about that with us and there's there's [TS]

00:33:43 ◼   ► three books left in theory it looks I [TS]

00:33:49 ◼   ► mean I don't know what is that anyway is [TS]

00:33:51 ◼   ► worried about their just kind of living [TS]

00:33:52 ◼   ► in the moment [TS]

00:33:53 ◼   ► well i think that that's always a danger [TS]

00:33:55 ◼   ► right when you have some kind of and [TS]

00:33:56 ◼   ► especially when it's so successful and [TS]

00:33:58 ◼   ► people so many people are so excited [TS]

00:34:00 ◼   ► about it and I can't imagine the the [TS]

00:34:03 ◼   ► pressure that george RR martin fields as [TS]

00:34:05 ◼   ► he's sitting down to write these books [TS]

00:34:06 ◼   ► because so many people are excited about [TS]

00:34:09 ◼   ► it and I'm sure that's on one hand [TS]

00:34:11 ◼   ► very exciting but on the other hand [TS]

00:34:12 ◼   ► awful because you know there are [TS]

00:34:15 ◼   ► websites that are devoted to just like [TS]

00:34:18 ◼   ► finish the damn book George and all that [TS]

00:34:20 ◼   ► kind of stuff and people read his blog [TS]

00:34:22 ◼   ► and if he mentions he's doing anything [TS]

00:34:24 ◼   ► other than writing there like you [TS]

00:34:26 ◼   ► shouldn't be watching football you have [TS]

00:34:27 ◼   ► to finish your book and I who he you [TS]

00:34:31 ◼   ► know it may suck who knows but doesn't [TS]

00:34:34 ◼   ► yeah that's right and I don't know and [TS]

00:34:37 ◼   ► they're there seems to be a little bit [TS]

00:34:38 ◼   ► of people feel that George RI no reason [TS]

00:34:42 ◼   ► yeah exactly they feel that he owes them [TS]

00:34:44 ◼   ► something it doesn't really OS anything [TS]

00:34:47 ◼   ► it's he's writing his own story and you [TS]

00:34:49 ◼   ► finish it [TS]

00:34:50 ◼   ► exactly it's just like the last episode [TS]

00:34:51 ◼   ► of seinfeld right that of many people [TS]

00:34:54 ◼   ► think that was awful but that's the way [TS]

00:34:56 ◼   ► they wanted to end or the way they ended [TS]

00:34:59 ◼   ► lost which george RR martin himself did [TS]

00:35:01 ◼   ► not care for you know I think that I'm i [TS]

00:35:03 ◼   ► think that if if we aren't willing to [TS]

00:35:06 ◼   ► take a chance on somebody who's writing [TS]

00:35:08 ◼   ► an intricate you know 3,000 page story [TS]

00:35:13 ◼   ► four thousand page story however long it [TS]

00:35:15 ◼   ► ends up being and I you know then all [TS]

00:35:17 ◼   ► wherever we're never going to get it [TS]

00:35:18 ◼   ► right we're never going to get anything [TS]

00:35:20 ◼   ► but a 400-page book and I what I like [TS]

00:35:22 ◼   ► about these books is that they really [TS]

00:35:24 ◼   ► feel especially the first three that you [TS]

00:35:27 ◼   ► can just stack them up and just read [TS]

00:35:28 ◼   ► them in fact i bought the first two on [TS]

00:35:30 ◼   ► the kindle and it was an omnibus edition [TS]

00:35:31 ◼   ► and I just kind of blew through both of [TS]

00:35:34 ◼   ► them and it you know it's one story it's [TS]

00:35:38 ◼   ► not like there's a novel standalone [TS]

00:35:40 ◼   ► novel here [TS]

00:35:41 ◼   ► really it just keeps going and [TS]

00:35:43 ◼   ► presumably will go to the end i love the [TS]

00:35:45 ◼   ► ambition of that and I'm willing because [TS]

00:35:47 ◼   ► the quality is so good i'm willing to [TS]

00:35:48 ◼   ► take a chance because I like that idea [TS]

00:35:51 ◼   ► that he's trying to tell this huge story [TS]

00:35:54 ◼   ► and it's one story in all of these books [TS]

00:35:56 ◼   ► instead of it being a series of [TS]

00:35:58 ◼   ► adventures one by one that said I i [TS]

00:36:01 ◼   ► think this dance with dragons book is [TS]

00:36:02 ◼   ► going to tell the tale because it's you [TS]

00:36:04 ◼   ► know feast for crows is almost like a [TS]

00:36:06 ◼   ► stalling tactic was how this don't have [TS]

00:36:11 ◼   ► the same but yeah yeah well and it's not [TS]

00:36:13 ◼   ► even that anymore because he's actually [TS]

00:36:14 ◼   ► added apparently Dance with Dragons does [TS]

00:36:16 ◼   ► advance the plot from feast for crows so [TS]

00:36:19 ◼   ► and he said that if they get to that [TS]

00:36:21 ◼   ► point in the TV series they'll basically [TS]

00:36:23 ◼   ► have to stick them back [TS]

00:36:24 ◼   ► together but so so the people who were [TS]

00:36:27 ◼   ► had the stories told the feast for crows [TS]

00:36:29 ◼   ► their stories presumably will advance a [TS]

00:36:31 ◼   ► little bit which is good news i think [TS]

00:36:33 ◼   ► because it would be a shame to wait you [TS]

00:36:34 ◼   ► know in more years to get the those [TS]

00:36:36 ◼   ► those cliffhangers result but i think [TS]

00:36:39 ◼   ► that will tell the tale because feast [TS]

00:36:41 ◼   ► for crows for me was a disappointment [TS]

00:36:42 ◼   ► because it was half a story and and [TS]

00:36:44 ◼   ► because it introduced all these new [TS]

00:36:45 ◼   ► characters and you missed a lot of the [TS]

00:36:47 ◼   ► old characters if if but if Dance with [TS]

00:36:50 ◼   ► Dragons is like storm of swords which is [TS]

00:36:52 ◼   ► a thousand pages of good stuff i feel [TS]

00:36:55 ◼   ► gonna feel way more confident but right [TS]

00:36:57 ◼   ► now having just read feast for crows I'm [TS]

00:36:59 ◼   ► like oh wow that was a no not [TS]

00:37:01 ◼   ► necessarily a misstep but it was like [TS]

00:37:02 ◼   ► not much of a step and I think he was [TS]

00:37:05 ◼   ► feeling a lot of pressure he needed to [TS]

00:37:06 ◼   ► get something out right and so he just [TS]

00:37:08 ◼   ► cut it in half and said okay take this [TS]

00:37:11 ◼   ► heavy load right i mean if we hadn't [TS]

00:37:13 ◼   ► seen feast for crows they would have [TS]

00:37:15 ◼   ► been like what like 12 years between [TS]

00:37:16 ◼   ► exactly couldn't figure out how long [TS]

00:37:19 ◼   ► time i don't know i think on the whole I [TS]

00:37:21 ◼   ► mean I enjoyed reading the books in two [TS]

00:37:24 ◼   ► thousand and I'm enjoying reading them [TS]

00:37:27 ◼   ► rereading them now and I feel like as [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► long as I'm enjoying reading this story [TS]

00:37:32 ◼   ► even if the story goes to bad places i [TS]

00:37:35 ◼   ► will still have had all that enjoyment I [TS]

00:37:37 ◼   ► don't feel like I've wasted my time our [TS]

00:37:39 ◼   ► group which is that kind of my feeling [TS]

00:37:40 ◼   ► on loss to it's like I didn't care for [TS]

00:37:42 ◼   ► the end of lost but i enjoyed watching [TS]

00:37:44 ◼   ► most of it and then you know okay [TS]

00:37:47 ◼   ► the ending sucks but it doesn't mean [TS]

00:37:49 ◼   ► that I've wasted you know six years of [TS]

00:37:51 ◼   ► my life [TS]

00:37:53 ◼   ► ok maybe the worst thing was the worst [TS]

00:37:55 ◼   ► that could happen you just haven't done [TS]

00:37:56 ◼   ► like you know at the end of the whatever [TS]

00:37:58 ◼   ► the last book is the last chapter is bob [TS]

00:38:01 ◼   ► newhart wakes up but it was all the tree [TS]

00:38:05 ◼   ► yeah yeah I do heart song of ice and [TS]

00:38:08 ◼   ► fire [TS]

00:38:08 ◼   ► it's nice it's nice to get in a good [TS]

00:38:10 ◼   ► satisfying ending but you know no I mean [TS]

00:38:14 ◼   ► I i agree i'm not i'm not so you just [TS]

00:38:15 ◼   ► invited terms that i'm going to give up [TS]

00:38:17 ◼   ► like although i did do that without the [TS]

00:38:19 ◼   ► wheel of time I think there's a point [TS]

00:38:20 ◼   ► for me where it was like and I worry [TS]

00:38:22 ◼   ► about this book to you know dance [TS]

00:38:23 ◼   ► dragons comes out and again I spent so [TS]

00:38:25 ◼   ► much time like having to refresh my [TS]

00:38:27 ◼   ► memory because I couldn't remember what [TS]

00:38:29 ◼   ► happened in the first four books i want [TS]

00:38:30 ◼   ► to go reread them before the next one [TS]

00:38:32 ◼   ► comes out i don't know if i want to read [TS]

00:38:33 ◼   ► them up there that could never do it [TS]

00:38:35 ◼   ► again great mr. wikipedia [TS]

00:38:37 ◼   ► it's very unevenly it's certainly a lot [TS]

00:38:39 ◼   ► more helpful than and like what helped [TS]

00:38:40 ◼   ► very much in this case I'm they have [TS]

00:38:42 ◼   ► their own their own wiki to and as much [TS]

00:38:44 ◼   ► as I Josh about them not paying [TS]

00:38:46 ◼   ► attention to the presence of raff the [TS]

00:38:48 ◼   ► sweetling in the feast for crows hello [TS]

00:38:51 ◼   ► that was great actually the wiki of ice [TS]

00:38:53 ◼   ► and fire because I would read the name [TS]

00:38:55 ◼   ► and be like Oh what the hell is that [TS]

00:38:57 ◼   ► and I would look it up and make a right [TS]

00:38:59 ◼   ► that guy and it's great because i wasn't [TS]

00:39:02 ◼   ► going to go back and read and you know [TS]

00:39:03 ◼   ► 2,000 pages and I will also say thank [TS]

00:39:05 ◼   ► God that HBO is making a TV show because [TS]

00:39:08 ◼   ► that makes it much easier to refresh my [TS]

00:39:09 ◼   ► memory for any other things yes well and [TS]

00:39:12 ◼   ► and i think you know to a certain extent [TS]

00:39:14 ◼   ► despite whatever happens with the end of [TS]

00:39:17 ◼   ► the story as a whole [TS]

00:39:18 ◼   ► what's nice is that there are characters [TS]

00:39:20 ◼   ► that have arcs that essentially get [TS]

00:39:22 ◼   ► completed you know many of them with [TS]

00:39:24 ◼   ► their dance but you know that there is [TS]

00:39:26 ◼   ► nice there there is like basically [TS]

00:39:29 ◼   ► resolution in smaller doses as it goes [TS]

00:39:32 ◼   ► along so you don't feel like my god [TS]

00:39:34 ◼   ► there's all of these thread now granted [TS]

00:39:36 ◼   ► he also starts new threads but you know [TS]

00:39:38 ◼   ► I think that's kind of what's what's fun [TS]

00:39:39 ◼   ► about it is it's almost like somebody's [TS]

00:39:41 ◼   ► it's almost like spying on like out like [TS]

00:39:43 ◼   ► out like massively multiplayer RPG or so [TS]

00:39:45 ◼   ► what I was you see all the lives of all [TS]

00:39:48 ◼   ► these guys going in The New Yorker [TS]

00:39:50 ◼   ► article i think he says something that I [TS]

00:39:51 ◼   ► actually thought I actually told my wife [TS]

00:39:53 ◼   ► this while I was while I was reading a [TS]

00:39:55 ◼   ► storm of swords is he said he wanted he [TS]

00:40:00 ◼   ► wanted a story that was like great [TS]

00:40:02 ◼   ► historical fiction but that you didn't [TS]

00:40:04 ◼   ► know how it turned out and that's [TS]

00:40:06 ◼   ► exactly how these books feel to me it's [TS]

00:40:08 ◼   ► like you're reading this history of what [TS]

00:40:11 ◼   ► things were like in these amazing events [TS]

00:40:13 ◼   ► that occurred and the only difference is [TS]

00:40:15 ◼   ► you can't you know read a book about the [TS]

00:40:17 ◼   ► war of the roses and then go to [TS]

00:40:18 ◼   ► Wikipedia and look up what happened to [TS]

00:40:20 ◼   ► everybody because it's not there it's [TS]

00:40:22 ◼   ► only and you gotta read the books as he [TS]

00:40:25 ◼   ► writes them and i love that you can't [TS]

00:40:27 ◼   ► peek [TS]

00:40:27 ◼   ► you can't find out what happened it [TS]

00:40:28 ◼   ► feels like historical fiction but you [TS]

00:40:30 ◼   ► can't find out who lives and who dies [TS]

00:40:32 ◼   ► you have as long as god forbid george RR [TS]

00:40:35 ◼   ► martin does not die before him and [TS]

00:40:37 ◼   ► serious the thing that's nice about the [TS]

00:40:39 ◼   ► TV even about the format to is because [TS]

00:40:41 ◼   ► the the books are divided character by [TS]

00:40:44 ◼   ► chapter which is i have to say is really [TS]

00:40:47 ◼   ► nice having read other epic fantasy when [TS]

00:40:49 ◼   ► you just have other chapters [TS]

00:40:51 ◼   ► to begin with like 12 13 and you have no [TS]

00:40:53 ◼   ► idea who's point of view it is the first [TS]

00:40:55 ◼   ► these books that we state very clearly [TS]

00:40:57 ◼   ► this chapter is aria [TS]

00:41:00 ◼   ► this chapter is catlin you know exactly [TS]

00:41:03 ◼   ► where you are and you know exactly where [TS]

00:41:04 ◼   ► you can leave off if you can pick up and [TS]

00:41:06 ◼   ► if so choose you want to skip chapters [TS]

00:41:08 ◼   ► and just follow one person story you [TS]

00:41:10 ◼   ► could do that i mean you'd lose out on [TS]

00:41:12 ◼   ► some of the piecemeal stuff but you [TS]

00:41:14 ◼   ► still be able to do that they also cheat [TS]

00:41:16 ◼   ► a little bit in that some of the [TS]

00:41:18 ◼   ► characters that changed names [TS]

00:41:20 ◼   ► yeah I in the headings including the [TS]

00:41:22 ◼   ► headings of the job yes [TS]

00:41:23 ◼   ► so you're right this one or two but [TS]

00:41:26 ◼   ► that's only what he needs to be clever [TS]

00:41:28 ◼   ► and and keep you guessing about what's [TS]

00:41:30 ◼   ► going on [TS]

00:41:31 ◼   ► I so we're talking about favorite [TS]

00:41:32 ◼   ► characters and I I i tried to get in [TS]

00:41:34 ◼   ► with on this which is that I love I love [TS]

00:41:36 ◼   ► the interior and i think is my favorite [TS]

00:41:39 ◼   ► character but right behind him is Jon [TS]

00:41:41 ◼   ► Snow actually who I love is just a i [TS]

00:41:43 ◼   ► think is a great character who is going [TS]

00:41:45 ◼   ► to become I think ultimately other than [TS]

00:41:49 ◼   ► maybe Denarius i think the most [TS]

00:41:51 ◼   ► important character in the series i [TS]

00:41:54 ◼   ► agree i think john is jon is kind of the [TS]

00:41:57 ◼   ► closest you have to the like heroic [TS]

00:42:00 ◼   ► character right i mean for the most part [TS]

00:42:03 ◼   ► of unfairly you know making it was not [TS]

00:42:06 ◼   ► to sleep with people and then sleeping [TS]

00:42:07 ◼   ► with women and and ya again and then [TS]

00:42:10 ◼   ► only liberated them and having them die [TS]

00:42:13 ◼   ► and all right that often present still [TS]

00:42:16 ◼   ► as as as far as all of the characters go [TS]

00:42:19 ◼   ► yeah he does see he has this very strong [TS]

00:42:21 ◼   ► you know code you know moral code in [TS]

00:42:23 ◼   ► many ways and Lee has the hearings also [TS]

00:42:25 ◼   ► again he's the underdog guys right like [TS]

00:42:28 ◼   ► he's the bastard you know who's going to [TS]

00:42:30 ◼   ► make good his powers Lee has magical [TS]

00:42:33 ◼   ► powers magical powers uh and I don't [TS]

00:42:37 ◼   ► know if you are what one of the most [TS]

00:42:39 ◼   ► interesting things about Jon Snow is [TS]

00:42:41 ◼   ► that his his parentage is shrouded in [TS]

00:42:44 ◼   ► mystery [TS]

00:42:45 ◼   ► now that's right they had that was a [TS]

00:42:47 ◼   ► great scene in the TV show oh I'll tell [TS]

00:42:49 ◼   ► you about your mom next time I see you [TS]

00:42:51 ◼   ► yes we're why very happy I laughed and I [TS]

00:42:57 ◼   ► laughed out loud at that scene because i [TS]

00:42:58 ◼   ► was like wow that's at least a dozen [TS]

00:43:01 ◼   ► Robert [TS]

00:43:02 ◼   ► oh oh wait oh it's one of the little [TS]

00:43:07 ◼   ► pieces of the world that I really love [TS]

00:43:08 ◼   ► is the naming of the bastards [TS]

00:43:11 ◼   ► yeah yeah but they're all called after [TS]

00:43:13 ◼   ► the sort of dominant feature of the [TS]

00:43:16 ◼   ► registry problem disgrace to the snow [TS]

00:43:18 ◼   ► and stones are the rivers yeah I just I [TS]

00:43:22 ◼   ► really i think that's a great touch and [TS]

00:43:23 ◼   ► it's one of those little things that [TS]

00:43:24 ◼   ► makes me really enjoyed the world that [TS]

00:43:26 ◼   ► he's built and I think that's something [TS]

00:43:27 ◼   ► you know we've only touched upon a [TS]

00:43:28 ◼   ► little bit as with the world building in [TS]

00:43:31 ◼   ► Song of Ice and fires awesome like [TS]

00:43:33 ◼   ► probably the best thing about in my [TS]

00:43:36 ◼   ► opinion I just love the setting the [TS]

00:43:38 ◼   ► world i think is really interesting [TS]

00:43:39 ◼   ► I mean everything from going from the [TS]

00:43:41 ◼   ► wall which is such a crazy insane like [TS]

00:43:46 ◼   ► especially you know you see it in the [TS]

00:43:47 ◼   ► first time in the TV show and you're [TS]

00:43:48 ◼   ► like yeah yeah it's pretty big [TS]

00:43:51 ◼   ► a giant wall made out of ice mountains [TS]

00:43:54 ◼   ► and mountains that's nope [TS]

00:43:55 ◼   ► the best no port in the world the thing [TS]

00:43:57 ◼   ► I really like about the world is that [TS]

00:43:59 ◼   ► it's all done tactfully and kind of [TS]

00:44:01 ◼   ► behind the scenes where you don't really [TS]

00:44:03 ◼   ► notice that you realize that you know so [TS]

00:44:05 ◼   ► much about the world until your you know [TS]

00:44:07 ◼   ► two books and you're like oh wait i have [TS]

00:44:09 ◼   ► a really great picture in my mind of [TS]

00:44:12 ◼   ► what this all looks like and I never had [TS]

00:44:14 ◼   ► to sit through 10 pages of exposition [TS]

00:44:16 ◼   ► right you know vague third person [TS]

00:44:19 ◼   ► telling me how lovely the trees are when [TS]

00:44:21 ◼   ► they bloom at night you know what you're [TS]

00:44:23 ◼   ► talking about the world in a way that [TS]

00:44:24 ◼   ► doesn't feel like you're being lectured [TS]

00:44:25 ◼   ► to which is you know it's it's funny I [TS]

00:44:27 ◼   ► had that realization when I was watching [TS]

00:44:29 ◼   ► the TV show and trying to explain who [TS]

00:44:31 ◼   ► some of the characters were in my wife [TS]

00:44:32 ◼   ► and and and realized that you know I [TS]

00:44:35 ◼   ► would never have been able to memorize [TS]

00:44:37 ◼   ► the various families during the war of [TS]

00:44:40 ◼   ► the roses or you know any other kind of [TS]

00:44:41 ◼   ► medieval series of your battles between [TS]

00:44:44 ◼   ► noble families and I'm like oh yeah i [TS]

00:44:46 ◼   ► can tell you all about the Turk Arians [TS]

00:44:48 ◼   ► and the Starks and the and the beareth [TS]

00:44:50 ◼   ► eons and and the Lannisters and what [TS]

00:44:53 ◼   ► their symbols are and what their colors [TS]

00:44:55 ◼   ► are and how did I learn all this stuff [TS]

00:44:57 ◼   ► that's 2,000 pages of george RR martin [TS]

00:45:00 ◼   ► history teachers to take a leaf from [TS]

00:45:02 ◼   ► this book if only it were real teach [TS]

00:45:04 ◼   ► Westeros in schools will be a great bump [TS]

00:45:08 ◼   ► w great bumper sticker by the way teach [TS]

00:45:10 ◼   ► Westeros [TS]

00:45:12 ◼   ► what would Tyrion do probably you know [TS]

00:45:17 ◼   ► the higher and bring ya back i also love [TS]

00:45:20 ◼   ► the number of the number of shifty [TS]

00:45:21 ◼   ► characters [TS]

00:45:22 ◼   ► yes you get like tyrion you get RS yeah [TS]

00:45:25 ◼   ► a little finger like they're such great [TS]

00:45:28 ◼   ► characters who are who are clearly all [TS]

00:45:31 ◼   ► about intrigue in sumter fusion that's [TS]

00:45:33 ◼   ► kind of refreshing and not all of them [TS]

00:45:35 ◼   ► are you know stereotypical like like [TS]

00:45:38 ◼   ► insidious characters only I love that [TS]

00:45:40 ◼   ► little finger says to Ned's face early [TS]

00:45:43 ◼   ► on in the first book just like you [TS]

00:45:45 ◼   ► shouldn't trust me i'm the person you [TS]

00:45:46 ◼   ► should trust least and Ned still trust [TS]

00:45:49 ◼   ► him and then when he gets frustrated [TS]

00:45:51 ◼   ► like I told you not to trust you like I [TS]

00:45:54 ◼   ► I said it [TS]

00:45:55 ◼   ► what do you want for me also characters [TS]

00:45:57 ◼   ► who like to push other characters out of [TS]

00:45:59 ◼   ► windows [TS]

00:46:00 ◼   ► yes defenestration dip-dip yeah ask that [TS]

00:46:04 ◼   ► I would make me do it Emma straighten [TS]

00:46:06 ◼   ► that's right twice and lovely word [TS]

00:46:09 ◼   ► prices met that that's like the [TS]

00:46:11 ◼   ► climactic scene of a storm of swords [TS]

00:46:13 ◼   ► right is that is that after all of that [TS]

00:46:16 ◼   ► trouble to get to the Aerie fo ya shoves [TS]

00:46:20 ◼   ► Lisa Lisa license Aaron right out the [TS]

00:46:22 ◼   ► window [TS]

00:46:23 ◼   ► oh she's dead talk about it and talk [TS]

00:46:27 ◼   ► about super creepy characters [TS]

00:46:29 ◼   ► oh yeah definitely up there yes crazy [TS]

00:46:31 ◼   ► when she makes a grand entrance in the [TS]

00:46:32 ◼   ► HBO series let me tell ya she really [TS]

00:46:35 ◼   ► does [TS]

00:46:35 ◼   ► well I was wondering how they were going [TS]

00:46:36 ◼   ► to do her introductory scene when i was [TS]

00:46:39 ◼   ► reading the book i'm like they they [TS]

00:46:41 ◼   ► can't possibly put that on oh they're [TS]

00:46:43 ◼   ► going to put that on television you see [TS]

00:46:45 ◼   ► here sitting on the throne and her you [TS]

00:46:47 ◼   ► know kind of like 10 year old son is [TS]

00:46:49 ◼   ► sitting there nursing on her wall she [TS]

00:46:51 ◼   ► oh my god oh that makes me wonder i was [TS]

00:46:56 ◼   ► gonna say you know makes me there's a [TS]

00:46:57 ◼   ► pretty interesting scene at the end of [TS]

00:46:59 ◼   ► game of thrones with Daenerys that I was [TS]

00:47:01 ◼   ► like man I can't wait to see how they [TS]

00:47:03 ◼   ► handle the actual fire yeah i mean it is [TS]

00:47:06 ◼   ► hpl it's HBO I don't think everything [TS]

00:47:09 ◼   ► needs to be attacked they haven't they [TS]

00:47:12 ◼   ► haven't shown themselves like willing to [TS]

00:47:14 ◼   ► pull punches really which is kind of [TS]

00:47:15 ◼   ► refreshing in some ways but also you [TS]

00:47:17 ◼   ► know disturbing others the amount of Sun [TS]

00:47:21 ◼   ► will not even subtle pornography in the [TS]

00:47:22 ◼   ► books always throws me where it's just [TS]

00:47:25 ◼   ► like out [TS]

00:47:25 ◼   ► wow ok where we're going into a chapter [TS]

00:47:28 ◼   ► and then [TS]

00:47:28 ◼   ► oh yeah someone someone's getting raped [TS]

00:47:30 ◼   ► and they're getting raped in great [TS]

00:47:31 ◼   ► detail in this book and it's not even [TS]

00:47:33 ◼   ► suddenly or otherwise implied these are [TS]

00:47:36 ◼   ► these are underage children or these are [TS]

00:47:39 ◼   ► like people who are far you know it [TS]

00:47:41 ◼   ► it'sit's they don't pull any punches and [TS]

00:47:43 ◼   ► it's it's very it's a little disturbing [TS]

00:47:46 ◼   ► I have to say it's bothersome to read [TS]

00:47:47 ◼   ► not to go back to the the that New [TS]

00:47:49 ◼   ► Yorker article again but some another [TS]

00:47:51 ◼   ► you know it's a great article and and [TS]

00:47:53 ◼   ► i'll put in the show notes but it's um [TS]

00:47:55 ◼   ► he says you know it's a reaction to the [TS]

00:48:00 ◼   ► kind of glossy fantasies that people [TS]

00:48:02 ◼   ► have about the the medieval period he [TS]

00:48:05 ◼   ► said you know people were you know [TS]

00:48:08 ◼   ► people were married off young and and [TS]

00:48:11 ◼   ► that you know 12 and 13 year old girls [TS]

00:48:14 ◼   ► this stuff happened to them it was not [TS]

00:48:16 ◼   ► this kind of fairytale kind of existence [TS]

00:48:18 ◼   ► and and especially he said these fairy [TS]

00:48:20 ◼   ► tales where the the working girl tells [TS]

00:48:23 ◼   ► off the prints [TS]

00:48:25 ◼   ► he's like yeah that didn't happen if [TS]

00:48:27 ◼   ► that happened they would be dead or more [TS]

00:48:29 ◼   ► likely they would be raped and then dead [TS]

00:48:31 ◼   ► and so we wanted it to be that ugly that [TS]

00:48:34 ◼   ► people get put into arranged marriages [TS]

00:48:36 ◼   ► and they can't do anything about it and [TS]

00:48:38 ◼   ► they're stuck with it and it's miserable [TS]

00:48:39 ◼   ► and you know and and so he put that all [TS]

00:48:43 ◼   ► in there and it's lovely isn't it yeah [TS]

00:48:46 ◼   ► there are some brutal scenes very early [TS]

00:48:48 ◼   ► i mean like as again i refresh because I [TS]

00:48:50 ◼   ► just watch the second episode i think [TS]

00:48:52 ◼   ► the TV show that the scene where Arya's [TS]

00:48:54 ◼   ► fencing with the butcher's boy the [TS]

00:48:58 ◼   ► bushes well yeah and then Joffrey of [TS]

00:49:01 ◼   ► course shows up and ruins everything as [TS]

00:49:02 ◼   ► his is want but the picture basically [TS]

00:49:05 ◼   ► gets written down later and killed by [TS]

00:49:07 ◼   ► the San firmed clean the dog [TS]

00:49:11 ◼   ► yes and you know it was you know an [TS]

00:49:15 ◼   ► innocent basically I kid who did nothing [TS]

00:49:17 ◼   ► right and like you know he just got on [TS]

00:49:19 ◼   ► the wrong side of royalty and the end on [TS]

00:49:22 ◼   ► the killing of stanzas [TS]

00:49:24 ◼   ► a direwolf to always makes me really sad [TS]

00:49:26 ◼   ► where you don't even really get to know [TS]

00:49:29 ◼   ► that the the wolves that much at that [TS]

00:49:32 ◼   ► point in the story and you don't really [TS]

00:49:34 ◼   ► get to know sands of that much of that [TS]

00:49:35 ◼   ► you seem you think of her kind of as a [TS]

00:49:37 ◼   ► little bit of a pressed of audio Starks [TS]

00:49:39 ◼   ► but at the same time you can't help but [TS]

00:49:41 ◼   ► feel for just like all this that's [TS]

00:49:44 ◼   ► that's terrible toll free so had some [TS]

00:49:48 ◼   ► yeah [TS]

00:49:50 ◼   ► Sansa Stark annoys that crap she's [TS]

00:49:52 ◼   ► frustrating she gets better in the [TS]

00:49:54 ◼   ► second book in the first book yeah she's [TS]

00:49:56 ◼   ► still one of my least sympathetic [TS]

00:49:58 ◼   ► editors i think i think on the whole [TS]

00:50:00 ◼   ► area and brand actually I like jon snow [TS]

00:50:03 ◼   ► a lot but brand brand kind of have a [TS]

00:50:05 ◼   ► special place in my heart for her for [TS]

00:50:08 ◼   ► him a little bit i don't know if it's [TS]

00:50:10 ◼   ► the climbing or the or the the wolf [TS]

00:50:13 ◼   ► connection or what but he just he's very [TS]

00:50:15 ◼   ► interesting character the three-eyed [TS]

00:50:17 ◼   ► crow [TS]

00:50:18 ◼   ► yeah I always want more about Rickon I [TS]

00:50:21 ◼   ► don't know engage in time a day I don't [TS]

00:50:24 ◼   ► know you [TS]

00:50:24 ◼   ► he seems like bad bad things are in [TS]

00:50:27 ◼   ► store for baby reckon he's off with his [TS]

00:50:30 ◼   ► frog eating friends right there [TS]

00:50:33 ◼   ► going somewhere I don't know that that's [TS]

00:50:36 ◼   ► one of those cases where it's like well [TS]

00:50:38 ◼   ► I have too many characters i'm going to [TS]

00:50:40 ◼   ► send some of them off and we will never [TS]

00:50:42 ◼   ► see them just hide them somewhere my [TS]

00:50:45 ◼   ► date but they might end up being the the [TS]

00:50:47 ◼   ► king of Winterfell the only a live [TS]

00:50:50 ◼   ► person at the end of the book right but [TS]

00:50:53 ◼   ► read the last general would have died [TS]

00:50:55 ◼   ► love walks back in which is you know [TS]

00:50:58 ◼   ► hiding off-screen and he wins the game [TS]

00:51:01 ◼   ► with the hounds [TS]

00:51:02 ◼   ► that's right by default would be sad if [TS]

00:51:05 ◼   ► the game of thrones said that I wouldn't [TS]

00:51:07 ◼   ► it [TS]

00:51:07 ◼   ► there is only but you either win or you [TS]

00:51:10 ◼   ► die [TS]

00:51:11 ◼   ► isn't that place and there's only one [TS]

00:51:12 ◼   ► way to win the game of thrones and [TS]

00:51:14 ◼   ► that's not to play [TS]

00:51:15 ◼   ► ah that's a good lesson thanks i came up [TS]

00:51:19 ◼   ► with a nice thank you thank you very [TS]

00:51:21 ◼   ► much so [TS]

00:51:22 ◼   ► so we've talked about it all this time i [TS]

00:51:24 ◼   ► guess i should ask the question you know [TS]

00:51:27 ◼   ► obviously to read all these you must [TS]

00:51:29 ◼   ► have all enjoyed the books are they you [TS]

00:51:33 ◼   ► know where they where do they rank are [TS]

00:51:34 ◼   ► they you know are they find a ok or [TS]

00:51:37 ◼   ► are they some of the better stuff i mean [TS]

00:51:39 ◼   ► to keep talking about Martin as the [TS]

00:51:40 ◼   ► American Tolkien which is awfully high [TS]

00:51:42 ◼   ► praise and so I'm just wondering is it [TS]

00:51:44 ◼   ► is it deserved how deserve this and how [TS]

00:51:47 ◼   ► good are these books i think that it is [TS]

00:51:49 ◼   ► difficult since it is one large story it [TS]

00:51:53 ◼   ► is difficult to judge it until it is [TS]

00:51:55 ◼   ► done because i think that it [TS]

00:51:58 ◼   ► I mean clearly george RR martin knows [TS]

00:52:00 ◼   ► how to tell a story right so i think [TS]

00:52:01 ◼   ► it's enjoyable i like reading it I [TS]

00:52:03 ◼   ► wouldn't have read whatever 4,000 pages [TS]

00:52:05 ◼   ► of it if I didn't like it a lot of [TS]

00:52:08 ◼   ► Kendall dots [TS]

00:52:08 ◼   ► it's a lot of candles and I read it [TS]

00:52:10 ◼   ► before the candles were around so it's a [TS]

00:52:12 ◼   ► lot of heavy blocks [TS]

00:52:14 ◼   ► yeah I didn't realize how long story of [TS]

00:52:15 ◼   ► sorts was until i had read like a [TS]

00:52:17 ◼   ► million pages of it and saw that I was a [TS]

00:52:19 ◼   ► two percent exactly their long books in [TS]

00:52:22 ◼   ► it requires a you know I'm indication [TS]

00:52:26 ◼   ► yes and especially this isn't done it's [TS]

00:52:28 ◼   ► even uncertain right cuz you never know [TS]

00:52:30 ◼   ► so i think that I don't know if you see [TS]

00:52:34 ◼   ► market told him I don't really like [TS]

00:52:35 ◼   ► talking so that may come home d'Artagnan [TS]

00:52:40 ◼   ► so I hope he isn't exactly i think is [TS]

00:52:42 ◼   ► very good and I think that it is so [TS]

00:52:44 ◼   ► unlike almost other fantasy well [TS]

00:52:47 ◼   ► especially fantasy of that time when it [TS]

00:52:49 ◼   ► was written now there's a whole bunch of [TS]

00:52:51 ◼   ► more fantasy that is kind of like this [TS]

00:52:52 ◼   ► that it certainly is an important series [TS]

00:52:56 ◼   ► in the world of fantasy and enjoyable [TS]

00:53:00 ◼   ► but I don't know what his lasting legacy [TS]

00:53:03 ◼   ► will be I was kind of expensive exactly [TS]

00:53:06 ◼   ► Wisconsin and i think i think the proof [TS]

00:53:07 ◼   ► is going to be in the pudding once the [TS]

00:53:09 ◼   ► the rest of the volumes come out i agree [TS]

00:53:10 ◼   ► you know he's a good storyteller I've [TS]

00:53:13 ◼   ► been very engaged by all the books i [TS]

00:53:16 ◼   ► think in in that I i would put him up [TS]

00:53:20 ◼   ► there is one of the fantasy authors i [TS]

00:53:22 ◼   ► really like there may be a couple others [TS]

00:53:25 ◼   ► i like more and that might just be [TS]

00:53:26 ◼   ► having you know the scope of the other [TS]

00:53:28 ◼   ► books in terms of the way the end and [TS]

00:53:30 ◼   ► things like feel like they might have a [TS]

00:53:32 ◼   ► little better sense of humor and stuff [TS]

00:53:33 ◼   ► like that a lot of a lot of Song of Ice [TS]

00:53:35 ◼   ► and virus very grim which is not say [TS]

00:53:38 ◼   ► it's not enjoyable but like you know [TS]

00:53:40 ◼   ► it's nice to have a levee break every [TS]

00:53:42 ◼   ► once in awhile after like you've seen [TS]

00:53:43 ◼   ► countless people get raped and murdered [TS]

00:53:45 ◼   ► you know nice to maybe you know [TS]

00:53:46 ◼   ► something that'll put a something along [TS]

00:53:48 ◼   ► like a wedding [TS]

00:53:50 ◼   ► oh wait let's move [TS]

00:53:51 ◼   ► sure everybody at a wedding everybody [TS]

00:53:53 ◼   ► wants our wedding that's what a cello [TS]

00:53:55 ◼   ► mentioned the promotion for HP other you [TS]

00:53:57 ◼   ► like the wedding episode yay come and [TS]

00:53:59 ◼   ► watch the wedding [TS]

00:54:01 ◼   ► everybody dies these musicians musicians [TS]

00:54:06 ◼   ► are not very good i wonder why I suppose [TS]

00:54:10 ◼   ► anyway so you know i i've enjoyed it a [TS]

00:54:13 ◼   ► lot but i really i think you know in [TS]

00:54:16 ◼   ► order i think the ending needs to he [TS]

00:54:18 ◼   ► needs to stick the ending like i think [TS]

00:54:20 ◼   ► that's that's what it comes down to for [TS]

00:54:22 ◼   ► me if it really turns into like you know [TS]

00:54:24 ◼   ► you can go back and and look at the [TS]

00:54:26 ◼   ► whole the whole thing is a hole and say [TS]

00:54:28 ◼   ► wow yeah this was a great story will i [TS]

00:54:29 ◼   ► recommend this to my friends once it's [TS]

00:54:31 ◼   ► all out there and I've read it from [TS]

00:54:33 ◼   ► start to finish and say yes you know [TS]

00:54:35 ◼   ► what you can you come on your conscience [TS]

00:54:36 ◼   ► i can when it's all like yeah i can [TS]

00:54:39 ◼   ► recommend to you this excellent book [TS]

00:54:42 ◼   ► series [TS]

00:54:43 ◼   ► um I mean I like that's the question I [TS]

00:54:45 ◼   ► think Jason I think you and I might have [TS]

00:54:47 ◼   ► had a conversation with the passes like [TS]

00:54:48 ◼   ► whether or not and a bad ending [TS]

00:54:49 ◼   ► sabotages everything that comes before [TS]

00:54:52 ◼   ► they're there are numerous books and TV [TS]

00:54:54 ◼   ► shows and movies that I have recommended [TS]

00:54:56 ◼   ► even though I felt like maybe the ending [TS]

00:54:59 ◼   ► fell flat because I felt like that the [TS]

00:55:01 ◼   ► beginning the journey of getting to that [TS]

00:55:03 ◼   ► point was still worthwhile and andrea [TS]

00:55:05 ◼   ► was talking about lost earlier and while [TS]

00:55:07 ◼   ► I disagree in certain i really like in [TS]

00:55:10 ◼   ► many ways the lost ending or I liked a [TS]

00:55:12 ◼   ► lot more than a lot of people do I [TS]

00:55:14 ◼   ► didn't feel that it undermined the rest [TS]

00:55:16 ◼   ► of the series for me I felt like that [TS]

00:55:17 ◼   ► was still enjoyable in its own right but [TS]

00:55:20 ◼   ► it's hard to tell somebody to invest all [TS]

00:55:23 ◼   ► the time in watching a sixth season [TS]

00:55:25 ◼   ► series or a you know seven books read [TS]

00:55:28 ◼   ► the second book series if the ending is [TS]

00:55:31 ◼   ► kind of a letdown [TS]

00:55:32 ◼   ► so I around you know abstain from [TS]

00:55:35 ◼   ► judgment until that point I hear it get [TS]

00:55:37 ◼   ► compared to battlestar a lot actually [TS]

00:55:39 ◼   ► where people not like that yes see [TS]

00:55:42 ◼   ► that's the problem is that the ending on [TS]

00:55:44 ◼   ► that for me fell flat i can't recommend [TS]

00:55:45 ◼   ► it to people like there's some really [TS]

00:55:47 ◼   ► great stuff in there but I feel like as [TS]

00:55:50 ◼   ► a whole the end of that series really [TS]

00:55:52 ◼   ► crushes allow the beginning of it for me [TS]

00:55:54 ◼   ► but Ren generally to generally I mean [TS]

00:55:58 ◼   ► this thing about epic fantasy for me [TS]

00:56:01 ◼   ► while I once i get hooked into a [TS]

00:56:04 ◼   ► a story i will end up reading it epic [TS]

00:56:06 ◼   ► fantasy is not my preferred genre of [TS]

00:56:08 ◼   ► voice why neither [TS]

00:56:10 ◼   ► yeah but I mean but that being said i [TS]

00:56:13 ◼   ► really enjoy reading these books and I'm [TS]

00:56:15 ◼   ► enjoying reading them and i will [TS]

00:56:19 ◼   ► probably buy the book in july when it [TS]

00:56:21 ◼   ► comes out and read that as well [TS]

00:56:23 ◼   ► presumably that I'm finished rereading [TS]

00:56:24 ◼   ► the whole the books by then I and I mean [TS]

00:56:27 ◼   ► on the whole yet it's definitely a wait [TS]

00:56:29 ◼   ► and see game but in terms of I mean what [TS]

00:56:32 ◼   ► he's put out so far I like and in [TS]

00:56:35 ◼   ► comparison to other unnamed epic fantasy [TS]

00:56:38 ◼   ► writers of the last you know couple [TS]

00:56:40 ◼   ► decades is definitely higher up than [TS]

00:56:43 ◼   ► them so that's that's where he registers [TS]

00:56:46 ◼   ► for me [TS]

00:56:47 ◼   ► alright then you mentioned other fantasy [TS]

00:56:50 ◼   ► novels sub i'm wondering you rank uh the [TS]

00:56:54 ◼   ► name of the wind above or below this I [TS]

00:56:57 ◼   ► think they're they're very close for me [TS]

00:56:59 ◼   ► they're very different stories and [TS]

00:57:00 ◼   ► anyway I mean like they're both fantasy [TS]

00:57:01 ◼   ► very different camps you know I mean I [TS]

00:57:06 ◼   ► mean there's a lot more magic obviously [TS]

00:57:07 ◼   ► name of the wind it's a lot more focused [TS]

00:57:09 ◼   ► on that it's a it's in theory a smaller [TS]

00:57:11 ◼   ► scope series ii notes it's very long [TS]

00:57:14 ◼   ► hook in fact if you actually manage to [TS]

00:57:16 ◼   ► finish it in a third book it's also [TS]

00:57:19 ◼   ► focused very heavily on one character [TS]

00:57:21 ◼   ► which is of which is a major difference [TS]

00:57:24 ◼   ► but it is I'll I appreciate that i find [TS]

00:57:27 ◼   ► it a little more even tho bad stuff [TS]

00:57:29 ◼   ► happens and bad stuff [TS]

00:57:30 ◼   ► most assuredly does happen it's a little [TS]

00:57:33 ◼   ► more measured there's there's more [TS]

00:57:35 ◼   ► levity you know I think that that makes [TS]

00:57:38 ◼   ► it in some ways a more enjoyable the [TS]

00:57:42 ◼   ► right word but like it makes it some [TS]

00:57:43 ◼   ► ways more fun to read good but it may be [TS]

00:57:46 ◼   ► lacks some of the scope or the like [TS]

00:57:49 ◼   ► intense historical like Captain [TS]

00:57:51 ◼   ► grittiness that the song of ice and fire [TS]

00:57:53 ◼   ► has so I don't know it might be kind of [TS]

00:57:55 ◼   ► an apples and oranges thing but i like i [TS]

00:57:56 ◼   ► like both of those writers quite a bit [TS]

00:57:57 ◼   ► and they both have trouble getting out [TS]

00:57:58 ◼   ► walking book so I sympathize before we [TS]

00:58:01 ◼   ► go I wanted to ask you I'd sew a dance [TS]

00:58:04 ◼   ► with dragons right is coming out [TS]

00:58:08 ◼   ► july 12 was finished today right when he [TS]

00:58:11 ◼   ► 11 it was finished as we record this [TS]

00:58:13 ◼   ► podcast it is finished or so they claim [TS]

00:58:15 ◼   ► will believe it when I see it [TS]

00:58:18 ◼   ► does anyone else think a dance with [TS]

00:58:19 ◼   ► dragons would be really awkward like I'm [TS]

00:58:21 ◼   ► thinking like a highschool yes [TS]

00:58:23 ◼   ► yeah like all the dragons on one side [TS]

00:58:24 ◼   ► and almost there so you decide to cook [TS]

00:58:27 ◼   ► corpses on the other side there is very [TS]

00:58:30 ◼   ► awkward dance if you're a Dragonlord you [TS]

00:58:34 ◼   ► know if you're a Targaryen it would be [TS]

00:58:36 ◼   ► an awesome dance [TS]

00:58:37 ◼   ► yeah you'd be crowned like prom queen [TS]

00:58:40 ◼   ► yeah of course everybody else would the [TS]

00:58:42 ◼   ► prom king would be horribly slowly [TS]

00:58:46 ◼   ► murdered by a poison blade but hey [TS]

00:58:49 ◼   ► you're the ball [TS]

00:58:51 ◼   ► what does it matter if things happen [TS]

00:58:52 ◼   ► make an omelet without breaking space [TS]

00:58:53 ◼   ► dragon eggs haha after they've been [TS]

00:58:58 ◼   ► roasted and fire am i right right so I [TS]

00:59:04 ◼   ► oh what a dance with dragons [TS]

00:59:06 ◼   ► you're gonna you know place your [TS]

00:59:07 ◼   ► pre-orders and start reading about July [TS]