The Incomparable

00:00:00 ◼   ► the incomparable part test number 93 too [TS]

00:00:09 ◼   ► well [TS]

00:00:11 ◼   ► welcome back everybody to the [TS]

00:00:13 ◼   ► incomparable podcast I'm your host Jason [TS]

00:00:15 ◼   ► smell this is another edition of our [TS]

00:00:17 ◼   ► book club and I have two participants to [TS]

00:00:20 ◼   ► brave brave participants who are going [TS]

00:00:23 ◼   ► to join me to discuss two novels by [TS]

00:00:27 ◼   ► science fiction writer Paolo Bacigalupi [TS]

00:00:28 ◼   ► I said it [TS]

00:00:31 ◼   ► listen to me look I said his name now I [TS]

00:00:33 ◼   ► learned how to pronounce palla bicycle [TS]

00:00:35 ◼   ► loop his name because he wrote a book [TS]

00:00:37 ◼   ► called the windup girl which was [TS]

00:00:38 ◼   ► actually one shared the hugo award a [TS]

00:00:41 ◼   ► couple of years back for best novel and [TS]

00:00:44 ◼   ► I loved it and I voted for it and it was [TS]

00:00:47 ◼   ► excellent and he also wrote around the [TS]

00:00:50 ◼   ► same time a young adult novel called [TS]

00:00:52 ◼   ► ship breaker which one a whole lot of [TS]

00:00:54 ◼   ► awards most it was a finalist for the [TS]

00:00:57 ◼   ► National Book Award it won the Prince [TS]

00:00:59 ◼   ► award and the locus award which is a [TS]

00:01:01 ◼   ► sci-fi award for best young adult book [TS]

00:01:03 ◼   ► is a very very good book and has spawned [TS]

00:01:06 ◼   ► follow-up called the drowned cities [TS]

00:01:08 ◼   ► which was released i believe last month [TS]

00:01:11 ◼   ► very recently so it's a new release so [TS]

00:01:13 ◼   ► these are these are books in the same [TS]

00:01:15 ◼   ► universe they are not directly connected [TS]

00:01:19 ◼   ► except for one character which will get [TS]

00:01:22 ◼   ► to but I I think ship breaker is a [TS]

00:01:25 ◼   ► fantastic and we have talked about it [TS]

00:01:27 ◼   ► briefly on a couple of podcast before [TS]

00:01:29 ◼   ► Scott McNulty who joins me here [TS]

00:01:34 ◼   ► it was the first person to mention this [TS]

00:01:35 ◼   ► book to me and he got me to read it and [TS]

00:01:37 ◼   ► he said great things about it [TS]

00:01:39 ◼   ► Scott thanks for being here to talk [TS]

00:01:41 ◼   ► about it a little bit more uh oh I say [TS]

00:01:44 ◼   ► that uh his last name as a bacigalupi [TS]

00:01:46 ◼   ► right be sure i don't know if it's right [TS]

00:01:49 ◼   ► secondly bacigalupi bocce ball except in [TS]

00:01:52 ◼   ► my head whenever I read that's how good [TS]

00:01:54 ◼   ► it sounds a bicycle loopy but I can kind [TS]

00:01:56 ◼   ► of soup paci GL UPI is he's uh his [TS]

00:02:02 ◼   ► extraction I believe maybe italian but [TS]

00:02:05 ◼   ► he is is he lives in Colorado he's an [TS]

00:02:07 ◼   ► American who listen color and that other [TS]

00:02:09 ◼   ► Voice you heard was serenity caldwell [TS]

00:02:11 ◼   ► who volunteered to read ship breaker and [TS]

00:02:15 ◼   ► also to read the drowned cities which is [TS]

00:02:18 ◼   ► in the midst of doing so we will say [TS]

00:02:19 ◼   ► goodbye to her before we talk about it [TS]

00:02:21 ◼   ► so that she does not [TS]

00:02:22 ◼   ► that spoiled she can go read it when [TS]

00:02:25 ◼   ► horns for me and where does your sign to [TS]

00:02:27 ◼   ► dive i will i will dive underneath the [TS]

00:02:31 ◼   ► deep seas of my bed covers and read the [TS]

00:02:34 ◼   ► rest of the book like a a good reader so [TS]

00:02:37 ◼   ► the author which now I'm Scott give me a [TS]

00:02:40 ◼   ► complex i'm going to call bicycle loopy [TS]

00:02:41 ◼   ► but whatever you can call him what you [TS]

00:02:42 ◼   ► like Colin bacigalupi go ahead a but [TS]

00:02:46 ◼   ► paulo I'll take a loop [TS]

00:02:48 ◼   ► he is he is basically not just a sci-fi [TS]

00:02:50 ◼   ► writer he's like an eco sci-fi writer so [TS]

00:02:54 ◼   ► he writes these books that are about [TS]

00:02:57 ◼   ► their set in a world or or different [TS]

00:03:01 ◼   ► worlds but that they have something in [TS]

00:03:02 ◼   ► common which is this the idea that we [TS]

00:03:05 ◼   ► are living in an accelerated age and the [TS]

00:03:07 ◼   ► point of peak oil is coming and at that [TS]

00:03:10 ◼   ► point there's going to be an energy [TS]

00:03:12 ◼   ► collapse and and bad things are going to [TS]

00:03:15 ◼   ► happen to what we think of as modern [TS]

00:03:17 ◼   ► industrialized society and in the windup [TS]

00:03:19 ◼   ► girl we see one version of that and here [TS]

00:03:21 ◼   ► we see we see another where the United [TS]

00:03:23 ◼   ► States has basically been broken to bits [TS]

00:03:27 ◼   ► by the loss of oil and in ship breaker [TS]

00:03:31 ◼   ► we meet nailer and and what they'll [TS]

00:03:36 ◼   ► nailer and and his team of people who [TS]

00:03:39 ◼   ► are basically running salvage like crew [TS]

00:03:42 ◼   ► tearing apart ships and stay for for [TS]

00:03:47 ◼   ► their parts and their and their metal [TS]

00:03:49 ◼   ► which is not that far off from some [TS]

00:03:52 ◼   ► things that happen in the real world [TS]

00:03:53 ◼   ► when there are there's a place in i want [TS]

00:03:55 ◼   ► to say Bangladesh where they where they [TS]

00:03:58 ◼   ► tear apart ships for their mettle and [TS]

00:04:00 ◼   ► it's not that far off but it's happening [TS]

00:04:02 ◼   ► in the United States in a post you know [TS]

00:04:04 ◼   ► almost apocalyptic eco apocalyptic [TS]

00:04:06 ◼   ► United States not at for a young adult [TS]

00:04:11 ◼   ► book this is not like a young boys [TS]

00:04:12 ◼   ► adventures with his dog and his paper [TS]

00:04:14 ◼   ► out this his this is this is dark stuff [TS]

00:04:18 ◼   ► this is a the diana wynne jones for out [TS]

00:04:21 ◼   ► of young adult which I actually really [TS]

00:04:23 ◼   ► appreciate where it just it treats kids [TS]

00:04:26 ◼   ► you know teenagers as we know you're not [TS]

00:04:28 ◼   ► stupid we know that you enjoy a [TS]

00:04:31 ◼   ► well-crafted story just as much as an [TS]

00:04:33 ◼   ► adult does we're just going to take out [TS]

00:04:35 ◼   ► some of the [TS]

00:04:35 ◼   ► more violent aspects but even this even [TS]

00:04:37 ◼   ► this book has has its fair share of [TS]

00:04:39 ◼   ► violence [TS]

00:04:41 ◼   ► yeah yeah it's it's um you know it's [TS]

00:04:43 ◼   ► it's a tough world and there's violence [TS]

00:04:45 ◼   ► and there's a a really bad father figure [TS]

00:04:48 ◼   ► nailers father is a very gives Darth [TS]

00:04:52 ◼   ► Vader run for his money [TS]

00:04:53 ◼   ► very bad guy and they're in there on the [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► Gulf Coast basically except that the the [TS]

00:04:59 ◼   ► global warming because again a co-writer [TS]

00:05:02 ◼   ► the global warming has caused the Seas [TS]

00:05:04 ◼   ► to rise and so that there's an Orleans [TS]

00:05:08 ◼   ► to because the New Orleans is completely [TS]

00:05:11 ◼   ► gone and three Orleans yes there are [TS]

00:05:15 ◼   ► many say don't call the thorough Orleans [TS]

00:05:17 ◼   ► or lanes are many cities that are [TS]

00:05:19 ◼   ► drowned [TS]

00:05:20 ◼   ► mmm her house we'll get back to that but [TS]

00:05:23 ◼   ► um so I mean the starts though it it's [TS]

00:05:27 ◼   ► funny one of the things that I want to [TS]

00:05:28 ◼   ► talk about about the two books is which [TS]

00:05:30 ◼   ► one is which one is darker and I [TS]

00:05:34 ◼   ► actually keep going back and forth on it [TS]

00:05:35 ◼   ► in this one [TS]

00:05:37 ◼   ► you've got these uh these kids are into [TS]

00:05:40 ◼   ► these terrible conditions as scavengers [TS]

00:05:42 ◼   ► and and we meet when we mean Taylor he [TS]

00:05:46 ◼   ► almost dies right because he's he's deep [TS]

00:05:48 ◼   ► down in these narrow passages in the [TS]

00:05:50 ◼   ► ship and he falls into a into a tank [TS]

00:05:54 ◼   ► into a gas tank and thinks he's gonna [TS]

00:05:57 ◼   ► die but he ends up being a smart being [TS]

00:06:00 ◼   ► smart enough to save himself and you [TS]

00:06:02 ◼   ► know and and when he gets back to shore [TS]

00:06:04 ◼   ► it's not any better this is just kind of [TS]

00:06:06 ◼   ► a a chaotic environment where they're [TS]

00:06:08 ◼   ► working for for almost nothing and [TS]

00:06:11 ◼   ► there's a you know there's a fast [TS]

00:06:13 ◼   ► company above them that is that is sort [TS]

00:06:17 ◼   ► of far away and and it you know really [TS]

00:06:19 ◼   ► it's like a forced labor camp almost [TS]

00:06:21 ◼   ► it's just incredibly poor squalid [TS]

00:06:23 ◼   ► conditions so you know it's that I think [TS]

00:06:26 ◼   ► that's it's pretty rough stuff for [TS]

00:06:28 ◼   ► something that's that's a young adult [TS]

00:06:31 ◼   ► definitely I mean I i read a lot of [TS]

00:06:34 ◼   ► really really dark young adult books [TS]

00:06:36 ◼   ► growing up and I tend to prefer those [TS]

00:06:38 ◼   ► and I'd I mean I feel like most avid [TS]

00:06:42 ◼   ► readers tend to prefer something that's [TS]

00:06:44 ◼   ► a little more complex and a little less [TS]

00:06:46 ◼   ► black and white and heat I mean he does [TS]

00:06:49 ◼   ► a really good job [TS]

00:06:51 ◼   ► I didn't really realize until the end of [TS]

00:06:54 ◼   ► ship breaker that this was actually [TS]

00:06:56 ◼   ► meant to be a young adult book I because [TS]

00:06:59 ◼   ► the way that it was portrayed in the [TS]

00:07:01 ◼   ► language that was used i just kind of [TS]

00:07:03 ◼   ► assumed oh it's you know it's just a [TS]

00:07:04 ◼   ► book with younger characters and then [TS]

00:07:08 ◼   ► when i was looking stuff up in advance [TS]

00:07:10 ◼   ► this podcast was like oh this was [TS]

00:07:12 ◼   ► written specifically to be a young adult [TS]

00:07:14 ◼   ► book okay why I get that I think the [TS]

00:07:17 ◼   ► best young adult books though are [TS]

00:07:19 ◼   ► written like normal books they just [TS]

00:07:21 ◼   ► happened to star maybe slightly younger [TS]

00:07:24 ◼   ► cast wonder whether some you know [TS]

00:07:26 ◼   ► there's some language limitations and [TS]

00:07:28 ◼   ► ended the rally and I which is just [TS]

00:07:30 ◼   ► wrong and there isn't and there isn't [TS]

00:07:32 ◼   ► there isn't sex and that you know that [TS]

00:07:37 ◼   ► those are the like sort of defining it's [TS]

00:07:38 ◼   ► got to be kind of a PG but you can be [TS]

00:07:41 ◼   ► really you know really dark around those [TS]

00:07:44 ◼   ► two limitations Scott you have issues [TS]

00:07:46 ◼   ► with when you read something young adult [TS]

00:07:48 ◼   ► is it you know is it isn't that big a [TS]

00:07:51 ◼   ► deal or or does it doesn't matter [TS]

00:07:54 ◼   ► well I I generally do not like young [TS]

00:07:57 ◼   ► adult books mostly because i enjoy [TS]

00:08:00 ◼   ► reading I sort of said you up there [TS]

00:08:03 ◼   ► because i know i don't get w you know I [TS]

00:08:05 ◼   ► but generally despised young adult books [TS]

00:08:07 ◼   ► frankly mostly because i think that you [TS]

00:08:11 ◼   ► as Wren said they they tend to simplify [TS]

00:08:13 ◼   ► things and uh i enjoy reading books that [TS]

00:08:18 ◼   ► have complicated language and kind of [TS]

00:08:22 ◼   ► multifaceted plots generally that's not [TS]

00:08:24 ◼   ► to say i don't like a book with a quick [TS]

00:08:26 ◼   ► plot that you know is straightforward [TS]

00:08:28 ◼   ► because i also read a lot of mysteries [TS]

00:08:30 ◼   ► that generally are you know to figure [TS]

00:08:32 ◼   ► out who killed somebody and that's it [TS]

00:08:34 ◼   ► but it's not like 14 different things [TS]

00:08:36 ◼   ► are happening at once and then at the [TS]

00:08:37 ◼   ► end it all comes together [TS]

00:08:39 ◼   ► that being said I think that ship [TS]

00:08:42 ◼   ► breaker rises above the general cross [TS]

00:08:45 ◼   ► of crappy young adult books in that his [TS]

00:08:47 ◼   ► well written [TS]

00:08:49 ◼   ► yes it does is a plus yes and so that [TS]

00:08:52 ◼   ► keeps me engaged even though the plot [TS]

00:08:54 ◼   ► itself is fairly straightforward and I [TS]

00:08:55 ◼   ► have no problem with that [TS]

00:08:57 ◼   ► he manages to keep it interesting enough [TS]

00:09:01 ◼   ► and keep the pace very quick which I [TS]

00:09:04 ◼   ► appreciate [TS]

00:09:04 ◼   ► and there isn't kind of like you know [TS]

00:09:07 ◼   ► the young adult the kind of the trip to [TS]

00:09:09 ◼   ► the young adults the kid finds out he [TS]

00:09:11 ◼   ► has special powers that you know nobody [TS]

00:09:13 ◼   ► appreciates it but then he suddenly a [TS]

00:09:15 ◼   ► wizard and everybody is great and he's [TS]

00:09:18 ◼   ► going to save the world need a dealer is [TS]

00:09:20 ◼   ► not a wizard but no Clara fide he's [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► apparently quick he's a kid [TS]

00:09:25 ◼   ► yes he's talented smart kid but he's [TS]

00:09:28 ◼   ► just a kid I feel like I father issues i [TS]

00:09:30 ◼   ► add my shelf of good young adult books [TS]

00:09:33 ◼   ► Scott because I may have missed so when [TS]

00:09:36 ◼   ► I was a kid I was trying to think of in [TS]

00:09:39 ◼   ► preparation of this what young adult [TS]

00:09:40 ◼   ► books i read because both ship breaker [TS]

00:09:42 ◼   ► and drowned cities are you know marketed [TS]

00:09:45 ◼   ► as young adults and I was thinking to [TS]

00:09:46 ◼   ► myself why I don't know what age group [TS]

00:09:49 ◼   ► of young adult is but reading both of [TS]

00:09:51 ◼   ► them I wouldn't think that young kids [TS]

00:09:53 ◼   ► should really read them I don't know but [TS]

00:09:55 ◼   ► a young adult is usually at least the [TS]

00:09:58 ◼   ► way that I've seen it marketed is aged [TS]

00:10:00 ◼   ► like 10-11 to age 17 it's a pretty wide [TS]

00:10:04 ◼   ► range it's not for I'd say it's it's for [TS]

00:10:07 ◼   ► kids in like the higher grades and then [TS]

00:10:09 ◼   ► starting in middle school middle school [TS]

00:10:11 ◼   ► is usually the starting because I mean [TS]

00:10:14 ◼   ► most of the young adult books you know [TS]

00:10:16 ◼   ► you're talking about the tropes you do [TS]

00:10:18 ◼   ► get a little bit of the budding romance [TS]

00:10:20 ◼   ► but not necessarily full-fledged [TS]

00:10:22 ◼   ► Stephenie Meyer Twilight craziness like [TS]

00:10:25 ◼   ► I so II you've got to be a certain i [TS]

00:10:30 ◼   ► think i have a certain age to appreciate [TS]

00:10:32 ◼   ► that but well you know why a is this new [TS]

00:10:36 ◼   ► new ish category there's a i remember [TS]

00:10:39 ◼   ► when i first heard the concept was like [TS]

00:10:40 ◼   ► oh ok i guess that makes sense but you [TS]

00:10:42 ◼   ► know some writers don't write books that [TS]

00:10:45 ◼   ► are you know that have a lot of language [TS]

00:10:48 ◼   ► and have a lot of graphic sex and and so [TS]

00:10:53 ◼   ► it's interesting that now there's this [TS]

00:10:55 ◼   ► category that's sort of in the middle [TS]

00:10:57 ◼   ► there [TS]

00:10:57 ◼   ► and yet a lot of yaa stuff is also read [TS]

00:11:00 ◼   ► by adults and good young adult fiction [TS]

00:11:03 ◼   ► is perfectly good for adults right it's [TS]

00:11:06 ◼   ► not you're not reading and this is the [TS]

00:11:09 ◼   ► argument when you read Harry Potter and [TS]

00:11:11 ◼   ► i know that's a sore spot with Scott who [TS]

00:11:12 ◼   ► didn't like Harry Potter but those are [TS]

00:11:14 ◼   ► books that have become successful not [TS]

00:11:16 ◼   ► just because kids read them but because [TS]

00:11:17 ◼   ► adults read them and and you know good [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► good fiction in that slot is good [TS]

00:11:23 ◼   ► fiction and the problem is that i think [TS]

00:11:25 ◼   ► there's some writers who then say i'm [TS]

00:11:27 ◼   ► gonna i'm going to target this and I'm [TS]

00:11:29 ◼   ► going to dumb it down and that's when it [TS]

00:11:31 ◼   ► I I think maybe it breaks down and a [TS]

00:11:34 ◼   ► previous podcast Scott mentioned that [TS]

00:11:36 ◼   ► Ian McDonald who wrote a book that Scott [TS]

00:11:38 ◼   ► and I thought was fantastic last year [TS]

00:11:40 ◼   ► actually I think we both voted or voted [TS]

00:11:43 ◼   ► for it [TS]

00:11:43 ◼   ► my vote counted because i paid the money [TS]

00:11:45 ◼   ► and scott's boat didn't count but it [TS]

00:11:46 ◼   ► didn't for best for best novel for the [TS]

00:11:48 ◼   ► hugo awards in mcdonalds the Dervish [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► house you know he that's a fantastic [TS]

00:11:53 ◼   ► book and he wrote a young adult book [TS]

00:11:56 ◼   ► that Scott red and said was really bad [TS]

00:11:58 ◼   ► because I and I worry that he just sort [TS]

00:12:00 ◼   ► of said well its young adult I'm gonna [TS]

00:12:01 ◼   ► take my plot my intricate plots and make [TS]

00:12:04 ◼   ► them not intricate and simplify [TS]

00:12:05 ◼   ► everything and then it will be dumb [TS]

00:12:07 ◼   ► which is you know I don't know what you [TS]

00:12:09 ◼   ► want to know in a good book whether it's [TS]

00:12:11 ◼   ► young adults or not it shouldn't be dumb [TS]

00:12:13 ◼   ► i read through more or less the entire [TS]

00:12:17 ◼   ► young adult section at both my local [TS]

00:12:19 ◼   ► library and my local borders over a [TS]

00:12:22 ◼   ► course of like five or six years and [TS]

00:12:25 ◼   ► that while there are some books that [TS]

00:12:27 ◼   ► really stand out my memory and some will [TS]

00:12:28 ◼   ► probably bring up later on the podcast [TS]

00:12:30 ◼   ► as they relate to ship breaker [TS]

00:12:32 ◼   ► they were definitely like their arse [TS]

00:12:34 ◼   ► logs in in that in that category where [TS]

00:12:37 ◼   ► you just run into very very like you run [TS]

00:12:41 ◼   ► into somebody who wants to be Judy Blume [TS]

00:12:43 ◼   ► except with magic or with you know [TS]

00:12:46 ◼   ► post-apocalyptic sci-fi I and it just [TS]

00:12:50 ◼   ► doesn't it doesn't work so well but [TS]

00:12:52 ◼   ► there were plenty i mean even even [TS]

00:12:54 ◼   ► something that was fairly widespread [TS]

00:12:55 ◼   ► like animorphs which was clearly I mean [TS]

00:12:58 ◼   ► that was a a big giant series that had [TS]

00:13:02 ◼   ► its share and was written i can remember [TS]

00:13:04 ◼   ► that was written by a series of of [TS]

00:13:06 ◼   ► people are just one person but it was [TS]

00:13:09 ◼   ► you know it would have both [TS]

00:13:11 ◼   ► x where they would very clearly be oh [TS]

00:13:13 ◼   ► well we're actually this is just about [TS]

00:13:15 ◼   ► young people and young in situations and [TS]

00:13:18 ◼   ► not really dumb down language and then [TS]

00:13:20 ◼   ► there were other books in that series [TS]

00:13:21 ◼   ► which was just unbearable to read [TS]

00:13:23 ◼   ► because you're looking at this year like [TS]

00:13:25 ◼   ► I feel like this was a writing [TS]

00:13:27 ◼   ► assignment that i got in high score in [TS]

00:13:29 ◼   ► in like fifth grade [TS]

00:13:31 ◼   ► it's like bobbin Jeremy are going on an [TS]

00:13:34 ◼   ► adventure bad writing batteries [TS]

00:13:37 ◼   ► batteries bad well you know young adult [TS]

00:13:39 ◼   ► right I suppose young adults have young [TS]

00:13:41 ◼   ► adult protagonist that's part of the [TS]

00:13:42 ◼   ► deal although there are lots of [TS]

00:13:44 ◼   ► perfectly good fine you know [TS]

00:13:46 ◼   ► high-quality novels that that have young [TS]

00:13:48 ◼   ► adults as protagonists and-and-and it [TS]

00:13:51 ◼   ► you know we wouldn't look down upon them [TS]

00:13:53 ◼   ► for doing that it i do think that [TS]

00:13:56 ◼   ► there's a right like people are smelling [TS]

00:13:59 ◼   ► money from yeah especially because harry [TS]

00:14:00 ◼   ► potter rightness ago geez I gotta get [TS]

00:14:02 ◼   ► some of that and so you've got some [TS]

00:14:03 ◼   ► people who are reading good books and [TS]

00:14:04 ◼   ► some people who are trying to find a [TS]

00:14:07 ◼   ► market for you know that by writing [TS]

00:14:09 ◼   ► something targeted at the market that [TS]

00:14:11 ◼   ► they think might make them a lot of [TS]

00:14:12 ◼   ► money and i feel like when i was a young [TS]

00:14:14 ◼   ► adult there was not a young adult genre [TS]

00:14:19 ◼   ► well they worthy I mean there are things [TS]

00:14:21 ◼   ► that were kinda adult book i'm reading [TS]

00:14:24 ◼   ► juvenile science fiction right which was [TS]

00:14:27 ◼   ► like pulp stuff from the fifties I think [TS]

00:14:30 ◼   ► more than I mean they're like boys [TS]

00:14:33 ◼   ► magazines it but it wasn't like a [TS]

00:14:34 ◼   ► juggernaut that it is now and the people [TS]

00:14:37 ◼   ► are no it's very clearly labeled now in [TS]

00:14:39 ◼   ► a way that it i don't think it was it is [TS]

00:14:41 ◼   ► only really just started to go that way [TS]

00:14:44 ◼   ► when I was growing up like there wasn't [TS]

00:14:46 ◼   ► really even a young adult section in the [TS]

00:14:48 ◼   ► book store until I was 16 or 17 i want [TS]

00:14:52 ◼   ► to say i usually just kind of jump [TS]

00:14:54 ◼   ► lumped in with fiction and it was like [TS]

00:14:56 ◼   ► maybe a subcategory with infections like [TS]

00:14:59 ◼   ► people with young protect your books [TS]

00:15:01 ◼   ► with young protagonists rather than [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► young adults right right right i mean i [TS]

00:15:06 ◼   ► would just end up in the sci-fi section [TS]

00:15:08 ◼   ► and pick out a book and you know and and [TS]

00:15:11 ◼   ► it's it's a the split infinity by piers [TS]

00:15:15 ◼   ► anthony and i read that it's like oh god [TS]

00:15:17 ◼   ► they're people having sex in this book i [TS]

00:15:18 ◼   ► will read the next book now right so it [TS]

00:15:20 ◼   ► was you know that I I think that's part [TS]

00:15:22 ◼   ► of it too is this weird thing I keep [TS]

00:15:24 ◼   ► liking it too [TS]

00:15:24 ◼   ► PG rating it's I I that is some strange [TS]

00:15:27 ◼   ► part of this young adult thing is it's [TS]

00:15:29 ◼   ► it's a category where there's sort of an [TS]

00:15:32 ◼   ► implied cleanness of content which you [TS]

00:15:37 ◼   ► know III as a parent I appreciate that [TS]

00:15:40 ◼   ► but it's it's strange and so you end up [TS]

00:15:44 ◼   ► with books that are legitimately good [TS]

00:15:45 ◼   ► books and then you end up with books [TS]

00:15:47 ◼   ► that are that are not and ship breaker [TS]

00:15:49 ◼   ► which is again what we're talking about [TS]

00:15:51 ◼   ► is a good book it's I mean it's not it [TS]

00:15:54 ◼   ► didn't feel to me like it was a [TS]

00:15:56 ◼   ► watered-down a windup girl or something [TS]

00:16:00 ◼   ► like that it feels like legitimately [TS]

00:16:01 ◼   ► good books I story [TS]

00:16:04 ◼   ► ya know it just happens to have young [TS]

00:16:06 ◼   ► protagonists as the lead characters but [TS]

00:16:09 ◼   ► it is a story is a story where adults [TS]

00:16:11 ◼   ► exist and where some adults are very [TS]

00:16:13 ◼   ► good and some adults are very scary and [TS]

00:16:16 ◼   ► there are shades of grey whereas they [TS]

00:16:18 ◼   ► might not otherwise be yeah I'm chip [TS]

00:16:21 ◼   ► bigger actually reminds me of two books [TS]

00:16:23 ◼   ► I read when I was growing up there was a [TS]

00:16:26 ◼   ► book called the the ear the eye and the [TS]

00:16:28 ◼   ► arm which I think when a alda cot or a [TS]

00:16:32 ◼   ► newbery or something like that which was [TS]

00:16:35 ◼   ► sort of post-apocalyptic or i guess not [TS]

00:16:38 ◼   ► post-apocalyptic future world where you [TS]

00:16:41 ◼   ► get three people who are were a not even [TS]

00:16:45 ◼   ► guns for hire but like detectives for [TS]

00:16:47 ◼   ► hire and they have to go find am missing [TS]

00:16:49 ◼   ► a missing privileged girl and then also [TS]

00:16:53 ◼   ► a book by I think Karthik's called [TS]

00:16:55 ◼   ► shades children which deals with kind of [TS]

00:16:58 ◼   ► again the weird sci-fi post-apocalyptic [TS]

00:17:00 ◼   ► but also running from big bads and I got [TS]

00:17:04 ◼   ► a very similar vibe from ship breaker to [TS]

00:17:06 ◼   ► both of those two books where it's it's [TS]

00:17:10 ◼   ► a very dark world and you're talking [TS]

00:17:12 ◼   ► you're putting basically relatively [TS]

00:17:14 ◼   ► young children and even in shipwreck her [TS]

00:17:16 ◼   ► there's a there's a mention about just [TS]

00:17:18 ◼   ► how young you know [TS]

00:17:20 ◼   ► Naylor is and how he doesn't really even [TS]

00:17:23 ◼   ► recognize that fact just because he's [TS]

00:17:26 ◼   ► like well you know you're either light [TS]

00:17:28 ◼   ► crew or your or your heavy crew you can [TS]

00:17:31 ◼   ► either create a small enough to fit or [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► you're not and he's aged just getting [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► big enough that he's not going to be [TS]

00:17:37 ◼   ► able to be like [TS]

00:17:38 ◼   ► crew anymore exactly we don't even find [TS]

00:17:41 ◼   ► out these characters ages until over [TS]

00:17:43 ◼   ► halfway through that first book when [TS]

00:17:44 ◼   ► he's quite literally coming-of-age he's [TS]

00:17:46 ◼   ► getting to the point where he is he is [TS]

00:17:48 ◼   ► getting bigger and of course there's a [TS]

00:17:50 ◼   ► girl right there is a pretty girl [TS]

00:17:52 ◼   ► inner-city got in a wreck ship and [TS]

00:17:55 ◼   ► there's a 12 mm and you've had that [TS]

00:17:57 ◼   ► moment which is like who i kinda like [TS]

00:17:59 ◼   ► her something about her is different [TS]

00:18:03 ◼   ► than what you love then turn that on its [TS]

00:18:05 ◼   ► head though because I mean they find her [TS]

00:18:07 ◼   ► when presumably she's dead she's dead [TS]

00:18:10 ◼   ► and they try to cut off her fingers to [TS]

00:18:13 ◼   ► get her gold regular jewelry that's yeah [TS]

00:18:16 ◼   ► that's how they discover she's alive [TS]

00:18:18 ◼   ► it's a very it's turning on its head of [TS]

00:18:20 ◼   ► it the typical it's not really your [TS]

00:18:22 ◼   ► usual meet-cute yeah no not so much [TS]

00:18:24 ◼   ► hi you know we fell in love how do we [TS]

00:18:27 ◼   ► fall in love all I was sawing off your [TS]

00:18:29 ◼   ► fingers that's how I met my wife very [TS]

00:18:31 ◼   ► bloody story [TS]

00:18:32 ◼   ► thank goodness she woke up I don't think [TS]

00:18:35 ◼   ► she could keep her jewelry and you can't [TS]

00:18:37 ◼   ► exactly and i think that it was [TS]

00:18:39 ◼   ► interesting so one of the things i like [TS]

00:18:41 ◼   ► about this setting is he concentrates [TS]

00:18:44 ◼   ► obviously want to make a point about you [TS]

00:18:46 ◼   ► know eco-friendliness and how the world [TS]

00:18:49 ◼   ► is going to go to pot because yeah our [TS]

00:18:51 ◼   ► short-term thing friends us yes exactly [TS]

00:18:53 ◼   ► but then he shows there's a clear like [TS]

00:18:56 ◼   ► as you're reading it you think okay [TS]

00:18:57 ◼   ► everybody is just living in squalor and [TS]

00:19:00 ◼   ► then you realize know there's this whole [TS]

00:19:02 ◼   ► other world of people that have the [TS]

00:19:05 ◼   ► ships that have like Paris tales that [TS]

00:19:08 ◼   ► can go fast and go over the place and [TS]

00:19:10 ◼   ► have advanced technology that the other [TS]

00:19:12 ◼   ► clipper ships that span the oceans and [TS]

00:19:14 ◼   ► lakes high tech I really want a [TS]

00:19:16 ◼   ► clippership when end and the neda is is [TS]

00:19:20 ◼   ► a the child of these people who own [TS]

00:19:26 ◼   ► these big companies that have this money [TS]

00:19:28 ◼   ► she's she's the one that they meet and [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► when they're trying to cut off the [TS]

00:19:31 ◼   ► fingers and and she's like an heiress [TS]

00:19:34 ◼   ► basically 2a and God has gotten caught [TS]

00:19:37 ◼   ► up in a in a plot among the rich people [TS]

00:19:39 ◼   ► and so there and and was attacked but [TS]

00:19:42 ◼   ► you know she's never known you know she [TS]

00:19:45 ◼   ► in some ways which is funny she's kind [TS]

00:19:47 ◼   ► of our proxy in the sense that she is [TS]

00:19:50 ◼   ► from a world [TS]

00:19:52 ◼   ► where there isn't the kind of squalor [TS]

00:19:54 ◼   ► that is on the beach with the with the [TS]

00:19:56 ◼   ► ship breakers where you know where [TS]

00:19:58 ◼   ► things are really miserable and awful [TS]

00:20:00 ◼   ► and she has kind of no idea and and and [TS]

00:20:04 ◼   ► so she becomes our proxy except for [TS]

00:20:06 ◼   ► viewing it through the eyes of nailer [TS]

00:20:07 ◼   ► and we're looking at her thinking you [TS]

00:20:08 ◼   ► know who is this person and then [TS]

00:20:10 ◼   ► oh it's us actually that's who she has [TS]

00:20:13 ◼   ► just boiled and has anything she wants [TS]

00:20:15 ◼   ► and whereas he's incredibly poor and [TS]

00:20:18 ◼   ► fighting for survival [TS]

00:20:19 ◼   ► I actually really like how I'm not gonna [TS]

00:20:23 ◼   ► try and pronounce the author's name [TS]

00:20:24 ◼   ► Apollo the greats [TS]

00:20:27 ◼   ► but you're gonna be yeah you may have [TS]

00:20:30 ◼   ► mr. B mr. B yes but the eco integration [TS]

00:20:35 ◼   ► into the story [TS]

00:20:36 ◼   ► it kind of snuck up on me where i'm [TS]

00:20:38 ◼   ► reading this and I'm like man drowned [TS]

00:20:40 ◼   ► cities and city killer and you slowly [TS]

00:20:42 ◼   ► start to realize oh this is you know [TS]

00:20:44 ◼   ► this is the United States and you [TS]

00:20:46 ◼   ► realize oh it's because of crude oil [TS]

00:20:48 ◼   ► drilling but it's never it's never gone [TS]

00:20:51 ◼   ► out and explicitly said yes humans you [TS]

00:20:54 ◼   ► are bad you are destroying things [TS]

00:20:57 ◼   ► beware for there will come a day when [TS]

00:21:00 ◼   ► all of this comes you know there's there [TS]

00:21:02 ◼   ► are certain books it's better for that [TS]

00:21:04 ◼   ► yeah and it's just kind of like know [TS]

00:21:06 ◼   ► this is you know this is how it is [TS]

00:21:08 ◼   ► dropping and jam it down your throat and [TS]

00:21:10 ◼   ► actually there's a lot of here it's a [TS]

00:21:13 ◼   ► lot of stuff within this book in that [TS]

00:21:15 ◼   ► sort of manner which I really appreciate [TS]

00:21:17 ◼   ► it so nice to as a reader be able to [TS]

00:21:21 ◼   ► actually discover things for yourself [TS]

00:21:23 ◼   ► and not feel like the author is saying [TS]

00:21:25 ◼   ► yes focus on this for it will be [TS]

00:21:28 ◼   ► important in 50 pages from now feed ya [TS]

00:21:33 ◼   ► another one thing I hate more than young [TS]

00:21:35 ◼   ► adult books are preaching books that are [TS]

00:21:38 ◼   ► trying to tell teach me a lesson [TS]

00:21:41 ◼   ► overtly and and so this book is [TS]

00:21:44 ◼   ► obviously it has a theme and he he is [TS]

00:21:47 ◼   ► clearly a a an environmentalist but he's [TS]

00:21:50 ◼   ► not saying you know the characters don't [TS]

00:21:53 ◼   ► stop and say gee wouldn't have been [TS]

00:21:56 ◼   ► great if we had thought about this [TS]

00:21:58 ◼   ► before this all happened message to the [TS]

00:22:01 ◼   ► past [TS]

00:22:02 ◼   ► exactly you you're destroying us your [TS]

00:22:04 ◼   ► you cause this you cause to know that [TS]

00:22:07 ◼   ► simply its implicit and and but he did [TS]

00:22:09 ◼   ► it right there isn't a moment where they [TS]

00:22:10 ◼   ► turned the camera basically and say if [TS]

00:22:13 ◼   ► only you would you had saved your oil [TS]

00:22:16 ◼   ► and not know it I mean it really his his [TS]

00:22:20 ◼   ► whole deal here is to say I'm i built [TS]

00:22:23 ◼   ► into the world once you accept this [TS]

00:22:24 ◼   ► world exists you accept that we've [TS]

00:22:27 ◼   ► completely squandered you know [TS]

00:22:29 ◼   ► everything and this is the remnant sort [TS]

00:22:31 ◼   ► of the the you know hollowed-out remnant [TS]

00:22:34 ◼   ► of our society after we run out of fuel [TS]

00:22:36 ◼   ► and I just hope that I'm on the [TS]

00:22:39 ◼   ► high-tech part and I'm not yelling on [TS]

00:22:41 ◼   ► the clippership exactly you want to go [TS]

00:22:44 ◼   ► live in the midwest that's right don't [TS]

00:22:46 ◼   ► want another character in this in this [TS]

00:22:49 ◼   ► story is is a very sci-fi character [TS]

00:22:53 ◼   ► we've got these regular human beings who [TS]

00:22:55 ◼   ► are struggling to get along but that's [TS]

00:22:57 ◼   ► not all we are in a sci-fi novel and we [TS]

00:23:00 ◼   ► have two lamented who is an argument he [TS]

00:23:03 ◼   ► is a half man as they call him but he is [TS]

00:23:06 ◼   ► a creation from human dog hyena tiger [TS]

00:23:12 ◼   ► many other kinds of animal and he is a [TS]

00:23:15 ◼   ► he walks like a man [TS]

00:23:17 ◼   ► hamster yes right Mockingbird trout [TS]

00:23:21 ◼   ► yes a most mosquito leaner yeah exactly [TS]

00:23:26 ◼   ► he's every animal really um he is he is [TS]

00:23:29 ◼   ► a a walks like a man but he is a killing [TS]

00:23:32 ◼   ► machine he's he's smarter than people [TS]

00:23:34 ◼   ► and much more dangerous than people and [TS]

00:23:38 ◼   ► they meet him the art nailer and Annie [TS]

00:23:42 ◼   ► to meet him and he becomes a he becomes [TS]

00:23:45 ◼   ► their sort of traveling companion and [TS]

00:23:47 ◼   ► and helper and what's funny about it is [TS]

00:23:50 ◼   ► when he's introduced he's sort of you [TS]

00:23:52 ◼   ► know he's a monster [TS]

00:23:53 ◼   ► it's very much like the the [TS]

00:23:54 ◼   ► sort of you you meet the monster and [TS]

00:23:57 ◼   ► then you realize the monster may not be [TS]

00:23:59 ◼   ► as bad as the people and and dry [TS]

00:24:03 ◼   ► yeah yeah yeah because because they [TS]

00:24:05 ◼   ► always father Richard Lopez is really [TS]

00:24:07 ◼   ► really bad raising aside [TS]

00:24:10 ◼   ► yeah as a side note i find it very [TS]

00:24:12 ◼   ► interesting that all of the characters [TS]

00:24:14 ◼   ► have real names up into a certain age [TS]

00:24:18 ◼   ► where it's like all of nailers parents [TS]

00:24:22 ◼   ► generation has real names but nailer and [TS]

00:24:25 ◼   ► all of his crew folk to a certain like [TS]

00:24:29 ◼   ► of rage [TS]

00:24:30 ◼   ► yeah they all have things like naylor or [TS]

00:24:33 ◼   ► I mean even need it gets a lucky girl [TS]

00:24:36 ◼   ► you know right and you don't get the [TS]

00:24:38 ◼   ► sense that these are nicknames you get [TS]

00:24:39 ◼   ► the sense that these are actually these [TS]

00:24:41 ◼   ► are the names that they grew up with [TS]

00:24:42 ◼   ► everybody's open up [TS]

00:24:43 ◼   ► yeah but this it's like surnames are not [TS]

00:24:47 ◼   ► important anymore actual inventive [TS]

00:24:49 ◼   ► things are not important if they've run [TS]

00:24:51 ◼   ► out of names they are not a [TS]

00:24:54 ◼   ► non-renewable resources host yes its [TS]

00:24:56 ◼   ► post name apocalypse and uh huh [TS]

00:24:58 ◼   ► there's no more than anybody region [TS]

00:25:00 ◼   ► America reach peak naming and since then [TS]

00:25:03 ◼   ► it's all been downhill great Taylor [TS]

00:25:04 ◼   ► shortage of 2012 and mouse so tool is a [TS]

00:25:09 ◼   ► really interesting character because [TS]

00:25:10 ◼   ► what you know he is he does seem to be [TS]

00:25:12 ◼   ► this monster and maybe he is a monster [TS]

00:25:15 ◼   ► right and yet he is he helps them [TS]

00:25:19 ◼   ► he's an honorable you get the sense i [TS]

00:25:21 ◼   ► mean you're told that he is not like [TS]

00:25:23 ◼   ► other half men in fact when they go to [TS]

00:25:25 ◼   ► Orleans and they're they're like hiding [TS]

00:25:28 ◼   ► in the water trying not to be spotted [TS]

00:25:30 ◼   ► and there's like a squat that they're in [TS]

00:25:32 ◼   ► at one point and then there are there [TS]

00:25:36 ◼   ► are half men on the ship and and and you [TS]

00:25:39 ◼   ► know you get to see what the other [TS]

00:25:40 ◼   ► monsters are like and they are [TS]

00:25:41 ◼   ► completely subservient to their masters [TS]

00:25:45 ◼   ► and then there's tool who is he's like [TS]

00:25:47 ◼   ► the rebel he's like the one who went [TS]

00:25:48 ◼   ► wrong and he's a monster who is [TS]

00:25:50 ◼   ► rebelling and that's good because that [TS]

00:25:52 ◼   ► means he's not a monster [TS]

00:25:54 ◼   ► he's more than a monster and it's just [TS]

00:25:56 ◼   ► such a really interesting character that [TS]

00:26:01 ◼   ► that just kind of drops in and then he [TS]

00:26:03 ◼   ► you know he helps them out and they [TS]

00:26:04 ◼   ► cling to the back of railroad cars [TS]

00:26:06 ◼   ► as they travel along the countryside and [TS]

00:26:08 ◼   ► he he sort of whip them into shape which [TS]

00:26:10 ◼   ► is it's it's just a very interesting [TS]

00:26:12 ◼   ► character [TS]

00:26:14 ◼   ► I mean he's a he's a pseudo parental [TS]

00:26:17 ◼   ► figure wow what a parent yeah do I know [TS]

00:26:21 ◼   ► but actually the the whole idea of the [TS]

00:26:24 ◼   ► arguments and not having read more than [TS]

00:26:27 ◼   ► a hundred pages of the second book i'm [TS]

00:26:28 ◼   ► really curious to see where that goes [TS]

00:26:30 ◼   ► because tool does crossover is the only [TS]

00:26:32 ◼   ► community use the crossover character is [TS]

00:26:35 ◼   ► mia much more problem wasn't cool to [TS]

00:26:38 ◼   ► leave out of the second book clearly [TS]

00:26:40 ◼   ► forbids we can leave them by the wayside [TS]

00:26:42 ◼   ► but he's like the the whole concept of [TS]

00:26:47 ◼   ► the augments in the idea of yes we're [TS]

00:26:49 ◼   ► going to genetically alter these people [TS]

00:26:51 ◼   ► like combined humans with all of these [TS]

00:26:53 ◼   ► various animal DNA is to create the [TS]

00:26:56 ◼   ► ultimate bodyguard and then we're going [TS]

00:26:59 ◼   ► to train them almost you know impress [TS]

00:27:01 ◼   ► upon their minds that they may only have [TS]

00:27:03 ◼   ► one master i'm really curious not [TS]

00:27:06 ◼   ► knowing the end of drowned or the end of [TS]

00:27:09 ◼   ► drowned cities yes that's the second one [TS]

00:27:11 ◼   ► yes um if we find out just why tool is [TS]

00:27:16 ◼   ► very different from the other the other [TS]

00:27:19 ◼   ► arguments like why how he was able to [TS]

00:27:21 ◼   ► break his conditioning because I mean [TS]

00:27:24 ◼   ► they say very clearly in the first book [TS]

00:27:26 ◼   ► when they meet other other half men you [TS]

00:27:30 ◼   ► know it's impossible it's theoretically [TS]

00:27:32 ◼   ► impossible for an augment to ever betray [TS]

00:27:35 ◼   ► or walk away from their master because [TS]

00:27:38 ◼   ► they're programmed to basically died of [TS]

00:27:40 ◼   ► longing if the their master dies or you [TS]

00:27:43 ◼   ► know goes away someone I don't think [TS]

00:27:46 ◼   ► it's explained other than he's not you [TS]

00:27:47 ◼   ► know he's he's an error [TS]

00:27:49 ◼   ► he's not hooked up right he is supposed [TS]

00:27:51 ◼   ► to behave like that he doesn't have [TS]

00:27:54 ◼   ► anything that's further along this with [TS]

00:27:57 ◼   ► this theme of you know that humankind [TS]

00:27:59 ◼   ► fiddle around with things that shouldn't [TS]

00:28:02 ◼   ► and it expects the things to work like [TS]

00:28:04 ◼   ► they think it doesn't that he doesn't [TS]

00:28:06 ◼   ► and so he's you know everyone who to [TS]

00:28:09 ◼   ► read like the world exactly screwed up [TS]

00:28:12 ◼   ► the Augmented creatures which is i mean [TS]

00:28:15 ◼   ► that that is this book could be just [TS]

00:28:17 ◼   ► saying well you know you can't you guys [TS]

00:28:19 ◼   ► kind of screwed up [TS]

00:28:20 ◼   ► the whole energy thing and and now we're [TS]

00:28:22 ◼   ► reaping the rewards that global warming [TS]

00:28:24 ◼   ► and all these things and yet he does [TS]

00:28:26 ◼   ► have this whole other thing that gets [TS]

00:28:28 ◼   ► thrown in which is genetic engineering [TS]

00:28:31 ◼   ► and after you you smell side plot yet [TS]

00:28:34 ◼   ► you spend some time thinking this is [TS]

00:28:36 ◼   ► really about these kids who are tearing [TS]

00:28:37 ◼   ► apart the ships and their terrible life [TS]

00:28:39 ◼   ► on shore and then they find the ship [TS]

00:28:40 ◼   ► that's crashed and there's a girl they [TS]

00:28:42 ◼   ► try to cut off her finger but she's [TS]

00:28:44 ◼   ► actually alive so they can't cut off her [TS]

00:28:46 ◼   ► finger and yet on the side there's this [TS]

00:28:49 ◼   ► oh did we mention that there are also [TS]

00:28:50 ◼   ► bioengineered monsters who are smarter [TS]

00:28:52 ◼   ► than people who are used to soldiers [TS]

00:28:54 ◼   ► that's also bad [TS]

00:28:57 ◼   ► no just throw that in there that also is [TS]

00:28:59 ◼   ► that it's counter to nature [TS]

00:29:01 ◼   ► kind of except he ends up being cut more [TS]

00:29:03 ◼   ► of a hero than its although there are [TS]

00:29:06 ◼   ► plenty of scary half men in this book [TS]

00:29:08 ◼   ► yeah there are really and I also like [TS]

00:29:10 ◼   ► the we see much more than the drowned [TS]

00:29:13 ◼   ► cities actually we see the swells we see [TS]

00:29:14 ◼   ► the the with rich people here where [TS]

00:29:17 ◼   ► there's there's this corporate [TS]

00:29:19 ◼   ► imagination going on between the the [TS]

00:29:22 ◼   ► people who are struggling for the [TS]

00:29:24 ◼   ► control of a of Nita's come to shipping [TS]

00:29:28 ◼   ► family's company right and and and now [TS]

00:29:31 ◼   ► that's going on and that's fascinating [TS]

00:29:33 ◼   ► because from the perspective of the poor [TS]

00:29:37 ◼   ► kids on the beach it's like who cares [TS]

00:29:40 ◼   ► right it's just like beyond completely [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► beyond them because holidays you guys [TS]

00:29:45 ◼   ► are fighting over who gets more of this [TS]

00:29:47 ◼   ► huge amount of money and we are [TS]

00:29:48 ◼   ► completely penniless and on the beach [TS]

00:29:50 ◼   ► and I feel like in in all of of bicycle [TS]

00:29:55 ◼   ► Lupe's work that CI said there are there [TS]

00:29:58 ◼   ► i scented we get this one of his tricks [TS]

00:30:01 ◼   ► which i think is really effective is he [TS]

00:30:05 ◼   ► takes situations that are you know this [TS]

00:30:07 ◼   ► is about the future and it's about [TS]

00:30:09 ◼   ► ecology and and about the environment [TS]

00:30:11 ◼   ► it's also about the present and and his [TS]

00:30:16 ◼   ► trick is that he's taking situations [TS]

00:30:17 ◼   ► that happen now and turns them around to [TS]

00:30:21 ◼   ► make them about as if they were [TS]

00:30:22 ◼   ► happening to us and so he makes a point [TS]

00:30:26 ◼   ► when he's talking about these poor kids [TS]

00:30:27 ◼   ► that are getting beaten and threatened [TS]

00:30:30 ◼   ► by gunfire and in both of these books [TS]

00:30:33 ◼   ► and pointing out that it's black kids [TS]

00:30:36 ◼   ► and Asian kids white kids they're blonde [TS]

00:30:38 ◼   ► girl blonde kids that are there working [TS]

00:30:40 ◼   ► as slaves and and and he's really saying [TS]

00:30:43 ◼   ► you know you guys are used to the poor [TS]

00:30:45 ◼   ► people you know being in far-off places [TS]

00:30:49 ◼   ► and not looking like you and in my [TS]

00:30:52 ◼   ► stories they look like you they are you [TS]

00:30:55 ◼   ► and and that's part of what he does so [TS]

00:30:57 ◼   ► it you know he's saying you know today [TS]

00:30:59 ◼   ► we've got very poor parts of the world [TS]

00:31:00 ◼   ► and then we've got very rich parts of [TS]

00:31:02 ◼   ► the world that that are arguing about [TS]

00:31:04 ◼   ► their first world problems right and [TS]

00:31:06 ◼   ► that's exactly what happens in ship [TS]

00:31:08 ◼   ► breaker is that is that Nina and her [TS]

00:31:10 ◼   ► family have a lot of first world [TS]

00:31:12 ◼   ► problems and the kids on the beach like [TS]

00:31:13 ◼   ► you know [TS]

00:31:14 ◼   ► hello I'm hoping to get food tonight [TS]

00:31:17 ◼   ► well yeah I doubt that there are people [TS]

00:31:19 ◼   ► you know they age dockworkers and South [TS]

00:31:22 ◼   ► Korea really care about the facebook IPO [TS]

00:31:24 ◼   ► right where it's you know it's like no [TS]

00:31:26 ◼   ► I'm gonna you know work for my daily [TS]

00:31:28 ◼   ► bread and get enough money to feed my [TS]

00:31:31 ◼   ► family and the kids in bangladesh that [TS]

00:31:33 ◼   ► are disassembling ships are are not do [TS]

00:31:35 ◼   ► not care about what's happening with the [TS]

00:31:37 ◼   ► latest in computer technology right now [TS]

00:31:39 ◼   ► they don't care they're they're far away [TS]

00:31:42 ◼   ► from that sort of thing [TS]

00:31:43 ◼   ► yeah so I think that's one of that's one [TS]

00:31:45 ◼   ► of a of his very effective sometimes [TS]

00:31:49 ◼   ► tricks of of saying no this is not [TS]

00:31:51 ◼   ► happening in a far-off land this is [TS]

00:31:54 ◼   ► happening here are our own world has [TS]

00:31:57 ◼   ► disintegrated and this is what it's like [TS]

00:31:58 ◼   ► to live in a poor miserable place the [TS]

00:32:04 ◼   ► vestiges bringing more close to home [TS]

00:32:06 ◼   ► residents that said this is not a this [TS]

00:32:08 ◼   ► is not a depressing kind of book the [TS]

00:32:10 ◼   ► setting is depressing but it is a fun [TS]

00:32:12 ◼   ► entertaining book about these smart kids [TS]

00:32:16 ◼   ► doing what they can to survive and [TS]

00:32:19 ◼   ► making some smart decisions in the end [TS]

00:32:22 ◼   ► out to to beat beat the bad guys with [TS]

00:32:25 ◼   ► the help of their you know monster [TS]

00:32:28 ◼   ► I don't know what his mentor he's a [TS]

00:32:31 ◼   ► monster and a mentor might see someone [TS]

00:32:33 ◼   ► store [TS]

00:32:34 ◼   ► exactly i wish i had a monster I will [TS]

00:32:39 ◼   ► meet him one [TS]

00:32:39 ◼   ► today it's got what I I mean I realize [TS]

00:32:42 ◼   ► you and I both read this book a long [TS]

00:32:44 ◼   ► time ago i was in Scott book years it [TS]

00:32:47 ◼   ► was like two centuries ago [TS]

00:32:48 ◼   ► yeah yeah you have anything else that [TS]

00:32:50 ◼   ► sticks out for you about about ship [TS]

00:32:53 ◼   ► breaker that we have uh huh i love the [TS]

00:32:56 ◼   ► end where they're smart enough that they [TS]

00:32:58 ◼   ► know the terrain of the bay that they're [TS]

00:33:00 ◼   ► legally lowering the ship into and so [TS]

00:33:03 ◼   ► you know there's that moment wait for it [TS]

00:33:05 ◼   ► wait for it [TS]

00:33:06 ◼   ► there we because the kids know like [TS]

00:33:08 ◼   ► where the rocks [TS]

00:33:09 ◼   ► all right but not even rocks dead [TS]

00:33:12 ◼   ► underwater building scale yeah right [TS]

00:33:14 ◼   ► that's right right right which is kinda [TS]

00:33:17 ◼   ► ruined crazy [TS]

00:33:18 ◼   ► although i will say the one thing that [TS]

00:33:20 ◼   ► flag me about that ending was I nailers [TS]

00:33:24 ◼   ► father is technically on the big bad [TS]

00:33:27 ◼   ► enemy ship wouldn't he know about the [TS]

00:33:30 ◼   ► big giant skyscraper teeth that nailers [TS]

00:33:33 ◼   ► leading in into or maybe he's just not [TS]

00:33:35 ◼   ► know either with the captain I think [TS]

00:33:37 ◼   ► Richard Lopez like nah day he's kind of [TS]

00:33:41 ◼   ► not legitimate figure he he doesn't [TS]

00:33:43 ◼   ► really know all the stuff like he was [TS]

00:33:45 ◼   ► always like a fixer and he was on the [TS]

00:33:46 ◼   ► beach and I think he's not he was heavy [TS]

00:33:49 ◼   ► crew for a while I mean I know he was [TS]

00:33:51 ◼   ► also like you know later but I i want to [TS]

00:33:54 ◼   ► say like he probably knew the area [TS]

00:33:56 ◼   ► goodbye at the same time they do mention [TS]

00:33:59 ◼   ► that that ship is a much bigger ship [TS]

00:34:01 ◼   ► than the tiny ship and it was one of [TS]

00:34:05 ◼   ► those things where I was like this is [TS]

00:34:08 ◼   ► the only thing that distracts from being [TS]

00:34:10 ◼   ► absolutely perfect [TS]

00:34:11 ◼   ► alright but so absolutely perfect you [TS]

00:34:14 ◼   ► say so [TS]

00:34:15 ◼   ► so I i can I take this test then that [TS]

00:34:18 ◼   ► you enjoyed your your reading of ship [TS]

00:34:21 ◼   ► breaker i did not expect to but I really [TS]

00:34:23 ◼   ► did well I want you ready ready because [TS]

00:34:27 ◼   ► it was going to be in the book club and [TS]

00:34:28 ◼   ► you're like alright i'll read it [TS]

00:34:29 ◼   ► these jerks want me to read it Scott [TS]

00:34:31 ◼   ► said he liked it but shinno scott i mean [TS]

00:34:34 ◼   ► i i've had sort of 5050 luck the book [TS]

00:34:37 ◼   ► club was like I've started like dervish [TS]

00:34:39 ◼   ► house i remember reading I don't know [TS]

00:34:42 ◼   ► 200 pages of and being like I'm sure [TS]

00:34:44 ◼   ► this book will eventually get really [TS]

00:34:46 ◼   ► interesting but it's just catching me [TS]

00:34:48 ◼   ► i know i know i'll finish it sometime [TS]

00:34:50 ◼   ► right for you [TS]

00:34:52 ◼   ► yeah and that's absolutely it is a slow [TS]

00:34:54 ◼   ► build oh yeah when I just said that [TS]

00:34:57 ◼   ► point I didn't have time to really like [TS]

00:34:59 ◼   ► sit back and enjoy a thousand-page book [TS]

00:35:01 ◼   ► with a 300-page slow build-up but with [TS]

00:35:04 ◼   ► this one you know the first couple [TS]

00:35:05 ◼   ► chapters are slow and I thought I [TS]

00:35:08 ◼   ► expected myself to get kind of impatient [TS]

00:35:11 ◼   ► with it but they build it so nicely like [TS]

00:35:14 ◼   ► there are a lot of things that happened [TS]

00:35:15 ◼   ► in this relatively short book but none [TS]

00:35:17 ◼   ► of them to feel rushed [TS]

00:35:19 ◼   ► none of them feel overlong either it's a [TS]

00:35:23 ◼   ► it's just a really nice balance with a [TS]

00:35:26 ◼   ► gigantic really well formed world [TS]

00:35:29 ◼   ► considering again the limited book space [TS]

00:35:32 ◼   ► in which they had to explain it like all [TS]

00:35:35 ◼   ► of the conflicts feel real the [TS]

00:35:37 ◼   ► background of the beach you know the [TS]

00:35:39 ◼   ► beach folk feel real all the most of the [TS]

00:35:42 ◼   ► characters developed even even the [TS]

00:35:45 ◼   ► captain's like towards the end feel some [TS]

00:35:47 ◼   ► somewhat developed he just has a a a [TS]

00:35:50 ◼   ► really fantastic knack for being able to [TS]

00:35:54 ◼   ► shape and explain a world without you [TS]

00:35:57 ◼   ► feeling like you're you know either too [TS]

00:35:59 ◼   ► overwhelmed or underwhelmed by it and [TS]

00:36:02 ◼   ► poking holes through it so yeah i'm [TS]

00:36:04 ◼   ► looking forward to reading drowned [TS]

00:36:06 ◼   ► cities is it i started it i just [TS]

00:36:09 ◼   ► finished ship breaker like 30 minutes [TS]

00:36:10 ◼   ► before the podcast i started finished so [TS]

00:36:14 ◼   ► it's very recent that's true damn or and [TS]

00:36:16 ◼   ► almost more necessary action [TS]

00:36:18 ◼   ► definity i only started reading ship [TS]

00:36:21 ◼   ► breaker yesterday so you know I got [TS]

00:36:23 ◼   ► through it quick but I'm you know I i [TS]

00:36:27 ◼   ► read the first hundred pages of drowned [TS]

00:36:29 ◼   ► cities in the half hour between [TS]

00:36:30 ◼   ► finishing ship breaker and waiting for [TS]

00:36:33 ◼   ► this podcast artisan like this world is [TS]

00:36:34 ◼   ► actually really interesting and I really [TS]

00:36:36 ◼   ► want to like go back to it as soon as [TS]

00:36:39 ◼   ► possible haha told you so I don't know [TS]

00:36:44 ◼   ► I'm yeah I'm glad I'm glad that I'm glad [TS]

00:36:47 ◼   ► that you liked it when I first heard [TS]

00:36:49 ◼   ► about it from scott who said it was very [TS]

00:36:51 ◼   ► good because we were talking about the [TS]

00:36:52 ◼   ► wind up girly snow [TS]

00:36:53 ◼   ► shipbreakers better than the window girl [TS]

00:36:55 ◼   ► he liked the wind up girl but it's [TS]

00:36:57 ◼   ► really haven't read the windup girl yet [TS]

00:36:59 ◼   ► so [TS]

00:36:59 ◼   ► I make some people hate another and some [TS]

00:37:01 ◼   ► people that love it and I I much to my [TS]

00:37:04 ◼   ► surprise when i was reading it i [TS]

00:37:05 ◼   ► discovered that i loved it so I voted [TS]

00:37:07 ◼   ► for it over the city in the city by me [TS]

00:37:09 ◼   ► evil and they tied so it didn't I guess [TS]

00:37:12 ◼   ► I'm the reason since I my vote actually [TS]

00:37:14 ◼   ► in town i'm the reason they tied because [TS]

00:37:17 ◼   ► I I thought it was I don't like the city [TS]

00:37:19 ◼   ► in the city too but it seems that he was [TS]

00:37:21 ◼   ► very good but the windup girl just you [TS]

00:37:23 ◼   ► know [TS]

00:37:23 ◼   ► yeah I thought it was really i thought [TS]

00:37:25 ◼   ► was really good and that this is a [TS]

00:37:26 ◼   ► similarly similarly good i think it [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► maybe is better [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► Scott I mean that is a really good it's [TS]

00:37:33 ◼   ► working my wife is a children's [TS]

00:37:35 ◼   ► librarian and she's recommended it and [TS]

00:37:38 ◼   ► she read it before I did in fact and [TS]

00:37:39 ◼   ► she's recommended it to many many people [TS]

00:37:42 ◼   ► now which i think is really cool to find [TS]

00:37:43 ◼   ► somebody who doesn't read a lot of [TS]

00:37:45 ◼   ► sci-fi some but not a lot but has you [TS]

00:37:48 ◼   ► know a conduit to young minds who want [TS]

00:37:51 ◼   ► to read books and is saying ship breaker [TS]

00:37:54 ◼   ► is you know is a highly recommended book [TS]

00:37:57 ◼   ► so that's good too [TS]

00:37:58 ◼   ► I will take full credit for all of that [TS]

00:38:00 ◼   ► you should you are molding young minds [TS]

00:38:02 ◼   ► in California from far away in [TS]

00:38:04 ◼   ► Philadelphia you are the monster tour I [TS]

00:38:09 ◼   ► know [TS]

00:38:09 ◼   ► yes but it's got i'm going to send you a [TS]

00:38:12 ◼   ► list of really good young adult novels [TS]

00:38:15 ◼   ► that I hope you will not hate [TS]

00:38:17 ◼   ► so you can expand your reach of really [TS]

00:38:20 ◼   ► cool ones should see see me i'm at that [TS]

00:38:22 ◼   ► way i would love to see the list of I [TS]

00:38:24 ◼   ► don't pass that onto to Lauren who can [TS]

00:38:27 ◼   ► use more things to recommend in the [TS]

00:38:29 ◼   ► children's library so yeah I mean [TS]

00:38:31 ◼   ► they're all they're all like five and [TS]

00:38:33 ◼   ► 10-year olds a recommendation about [TS]

00:38:35 ◼   ► salon might yeah they're still on my [TS]

00:38:38 ◼   ► shelf will still cool books to go bad [TS]

00:38:40 ◼   ► books are all short I'm Leslie when [TS]

00:38:42 ◼   ► they're about apocalyptic futures that's [TS]

00:38:45 ◼   ► true well sometimes to go bed [TS]

00:38:47 ◼   ► we're not talking about this [TS]

00:38:50 ◼   ► that's not discussing this podcast so [TS]

00:38:53 ◼   ► now because miss Caldwell has not yet [TS]

00:38:56 ◼   ► read the rest of the drowned cities [TS]

00:38:58 ◼   ► oh and we are going to have to shake [TS]

00:39:00 ◼   ► goodbye to her [TS]

00:39:01 ◼   ► we're going to put her in the soundproof [TS]

00:39:02 ◼   ► booth or actually just you know maybe [TS]

00:39:03 ◼   ► hang up and go crawl into bed and read [TS]

00:39:06 ◼   ► through and read the rest of them and so [TS]

00:39:09 ◼   ► you two can talk so yes we thank you for [TS]

00:39:12 ◼   ► your service and [TS]

00:39:13 ◼   ► thanks for being on this on this podcast [TS]

00:39:15 ◼   ► and and we will say could we will part [TS]

00:39:18 ◼   ► ways and it's just gonna be me and Scott [TS]

00:39:19 ◼   ► the rest of the way who is podcast is [TS]

00:39:22 ◼   ► over for you know it's just be a night [TS]

00:39:25 ◼   ► goodnight goodbye point yeah she's going [TS]

00:39:30 ◼   ► i'm scott you're the last one left again [TS]

00:39:32 ◼   ► I i just am a winner [TS]

00:39:36 ◼   ► I'm a survivor that's why i am you are [TS]

00:39:39 ◼   ► and a mod store constantly they don't [TS]

00:39:41 ◼   ► wait up a new word and you are it [TS]

00:39:44 ◼   ► yes so the dream cities the drowned [TS]

00:39:48 ◼   ► cities [TS]

00:39:51 ◼   ► what did you think jason has compared to [TS]

00:39:54 ◼   ► the ship breakers which one you like [TS]

00:39:57 ◼   ► more [TS]

00:39:58 ◼   ► I like ship breaker better i did as well [TS]

00:40:02 ◼   ► which is not to say that the grounds [TS]

00:40:05 ◼   ► that i liked around cities and now one [TS]

00:40:07 ◼   ► of the questions I had for you was it is [TS]

00:40:10 ◼   ► is the drowned cities darker than ship [TS]

00:40:12 ◼   ► breaker and and Mike the reason that i [TS]

00:40:15 ◼   ► keep going back and forth on this is [TS]

00:40:17 ◼   ► that in the drowned cities the kids we [TS]

00:40:19 ◼   ► meet at the beginning have a semi stable [TS]

00:40:23 ◼   ► life I mean they lost their old life but [TS]

00:40:25 ◼   ► they like you're working for this doctor [TS]

00:40:26 ◼   ► in a village and you know they kind of [TS]

00:40:29 ◼   ► got a system whereas the kids and ship [TS]

00:40:32 ◼   ► breaker just you know slaves and it's [TS]

00:40:34 ◼   ► miserable [TS]

00:40:36 ◼   ► the difference is that they have a nice [TS]

00:40:38 ◼   ► kind of adventure that leads to meeting [TS]

00:40:40 ◼   ► a rich girl who it might save them [TS]

00:40:42 ◼   ► whereas just terrible things happened to [TS]

00:40:45 ◼   ► kids in the surrounding cities terrible [TS]

00:40:48 ◼   ► things I i think that without a doubt [TS]

00:40:50 ◼   ► the drowned city is much darker than [TS]

00:40:52 ◼   ► ship breaker if only because of the the [TS]

00:40:56 ◼   ► number of times people say maggot maggot [TS]

00:40:58 ◼   ► it's it's a it's a we can't swear in the [TS]

00:41:01 ◼   ► young adult fiction so instead we get [TS]

00:41:03 ◼   ► maggot every and you you wrote you but [TS]

00:41:06 ◼   ► you didn't ruin I would have noticed [TS]

00:41:07 ◼   ► anyway but when you pointed out they say [TS]

00:41:09 ◼   ► Megan a lot as i was reading it I Bryce [TS]

00:41:11 ◼   ► started to notice that they say make it [TS]

00:41:13 ◼   ► a lot [TS]

00:41:14 ◼   ► everybody's a maggot there were maggots [TS]

00:41:15 ◼   ► their magnetism maggot that training [TS]

00:41:19 ◼   ► maggots [TS]

00:41:20 ◼   ► yeah hallelujah it's raining minutes and [TS]

00:41:23 ◼   ► so is why is to the drowned cities uh [TS]

00:41:26 ◼   ► they're like child the a lot of the [TS]

00:41:28 ◼   ► characters are child soldiers basically [TS]

00:41:30 ◼   ► right so yeah they're young i mean i [TS]

00:41:32 ◼   ► think and it really did forget how young [TS]

00:41:34 ◼   ► they are and then they they eventually [TS]

00:41:36 ◼   ► end up someplace where there are people [TS]

00:41:38 ◼   ► like we're in their teens or twenties [TS]

00:41:40 ◼   ► and you realize oh geez these kids are [TS]

00:41:42 ◼   ► like 10 12 years old right and so that [TS]

00:41:45 ◼   ► the teenagers are like the officers the [TS]

00:41:47 ◼   ► experienced people he actually get [TS]

00:41:49 ◼   ► uniforms instead of just a an automatic [TS]

00:41:52 ◼   ► machine [TS]

00:41:53 ◼   ► no it don't even think about machete and [TS]

00:41:56 ◼   ► it all that's true you have been a [TS]

00:41:57 ◼   ► bottle of acid you start with a machete [TS]

00:42:00 ◼   ► and a bottle of acid see there you go if [TS]

00:42:03 ◼   ► you know any book that had [TS]

00:42:04 ◼   ► as ten-year-olds waging war fair with a [TS]

00:42:08 ◼   ► machete and a bottle of acid is pretty [TS]

00:42:10 ◼   ► dark pretty dark pretty dark [TS]

00:42:13 ◼   ► yeah yeah so we we meet Malia and mouse [TS]

00:42:17 ◼   ► and they are kids who are working for [TS]

00:42:19 ◼   ► this doctor in this village and an army [TS]

00:42:24 ◼   ► and militia that's one of these groups [TS]

00:42:27 ◼   ► that we we realize we're we're actually [TS]

00:42:29 ◼   ► in the Potomac basin and this is around [TS]

00:42:31 ◼   ► Washington DC and and these various [TS]

00:42:35 ◼   ► militia groups are are are fighting this [TS]

00:42:37 ◼   ► endless war with each other and they [TS]

00:42:39 ◼   ► they come to their village because [TS]

00:42:41 ◼   ► they've been chasing a monster through [TS]

00:42:43 ◼   ► the jungle that monster of course is [TS]

00:42:47 ◼   ► tool [TS]

00:42:48 ◼   ► Oh half-man from fully booked [TS]

00:42:52 ◼   ► yes Tyler all right yes yes the spoiler [TS]

00:42:56 ◼   ► horn by the way that sounded for the [TS]

00:42:59 ◼   ► drowned cities hopefully if you have not [TS]

00:43:01 ◼   ► read it and do not want to be spoiled so [TS]

00:43:04 ◼   ► so tool tools presence causes all the [TS]

00:43:08 ◼   ► stuff to happen basically and Malia and [TS]

00:43:10 ◼   ► mouse watch their village get torched [TS]

00:43:12 ◼   ► yeah the doctor is killed horribly you [TS]

00:43:16 ◼   ► know just awful things happen and and [TS]

00:43:18 ◼   ► the mouse is taken in by a hand [TS]

00:43:21 ◼   ► recruited by this uh this militia and so [TS]

00:43:25 ◼   ► they're they're turning him into another [TS]

00:43:26 ◼   ► faceless killing machine soldier boy [TS]

00:43:29 ◼   ► throughout throughout this book while [TS]

00:43:31 ◼   ► Malia is talking to and arguing with [TS]

00:43:35 ◼   ► tool tools like well let's just leave it [TS]

00:43:38 ◼   ► leave that lets run we are outnumbered [TS]

00:43:41 ◼   ► and our only chance of getting out of [TS]

00:43:44 ◼   ► this is if we leave him and there's no [TS]

00:43:46 ◼   ► logic to stay you notice you're not [TS]

00:43:49 ◼   ► going to be able to save him and she [TS]

00:43:50 ◼   ► insists she doesn't i think is very [TS]

00:43:52 ◼   ► clever that she figures out tools kind [TS]

00:43:55 ◼   ► of pack mentality because it's kinda [TS]

00:43:57 ◼   ► been programmed into him because he's [TS]

00:43:59 ◼   ► part dog and she's like well he's a pack [TS]

00:44:02 ◼   ► member we need to save him and tools [TS]

00:44:04 ◼   ► like well alright yeah yeah I can't [TS]

00:44:07 ◼   ► decide whether that's Malia manipulating [TS]

00:44:11 ◼   ► tool or whether tool is like almost like [TS]

00:44:14 ◼   ► reading her feelings for him and [TS]

00:44:18 ◼   ► saying oh and extrapolating I great i go [TS]

00:44:22 ◼   ► he's like part of your pack I oh that I [TS]

00:44:25 ◼   ► understand i'm not sure what what which [TS]

00:44:28 ◼   ► one it is but it's it's effective right [TS]

00:44:30 ◼   ► that then suddenly he is ready to leave [TS]

00:44:34 ◼   ► and decides not to and and she tries to [TS]

00:44:37 ◼   ► save his life so that he'll owe her and [TS]

00:44:39 ◼   ► he laughed it off it says I don't owe [TS]

00:44:41 ◼   ► you anything and yet he he ends up going [TS]

00:44:43 ◼   ► with her anyway for his own reasons and [TS]

00:44:45 ◼   ► I you know such an interesting character [TS]

00:44:48 ◼   ► because he's not he's not human and he [TS]

00:44:52 ◼   ► does not behave like a human but he has [TS]

00:44:53 ◼   ► his own honor and his own kind of code [TS]

00:44:57 ◼   ► and he's happy to rip people into into [TS]

00:45:00 ◼   ► shreds but at the same time he's he's [TS]

00:45:02 ◼   ► he's like a weapon that his that is [TS]

00:45:05 ◼   ► turned back on its creators and he's now [TS]

00:45:07 ◼   ► it's like an a a tool of vengeance [TS]

00:45:12 ◼   ► against those who created him [TS]

00:45:14 ◼   ► that's true yeah and I think it's a he [TS]

00:45:17 ◼   ► is probably the most fleshed out of the [TS]

00:45:20 ◼   ► characters not the other characters are [TS]

00:45:22 ◼   ► like caricatures i think a Paolo [TS]

00:45:25 ◼   ► Bacigalupi it does a great job getting a [TS]

00:45:29 ◼   ► lot of characterization into all of his [TS]

00:45:32 ◼   ► characters and I think tool and mouse [TS]

00:45:35 ◼   ► are probably my two favorite characters [TS]

00:45:37 ◼   ► in this book [TS]

00:45:38 ◼   ► um and which makes mouse's story even [TS]

00:45:42 ◼   ► more depressing 40 as it was heroin [TS]

00:45:45 ◼   ► right that he is you actually are seeing [TS]

00:45:48 ◼   ► the steps that he goes through to sort [TS]

00:45:49 ◼   ► of dehumanize him and and there's a [TS]

00:45:52 ◼   ► moment where heat more mouse has this [TS]

00:45:53 ◼   ► great success where he because he's not [TS]

00:45:55 ◼   ► very valuable they basically thrown in [TS]

00:45:57 ◼   ► the water and have them swim over to [TS]

00:45:59 ◼   ► where there are snipers figuring you [TS]

00:46:01 ◼   ► know you get shot whatever he does it [TS]

00:46:03 ◼   ► doesn't matter and he succeeds and like [TS]

00:46:06 ◼   ► all the people who are with him die and [TS]

00:46:09 ◼   ► he kills and then he kills a bunch of [TS]

00:46:11 ◼   ► people and his coup de Gras is that he [TS]

00:46:14 ◼   ► calls in the radio is very smart righty [TS]

00:46:17 ◼   ► call him on the radio that people who [TS]

00:46:19 ◼   ► are firing artillery and tells him to [TS]

00:46:21 ◼   ► move it back a few hundred yards which [TS]

00:46:22 ◼   ► blows up their fellow soldiers instead [TS]

00:46:24 ◼   ► of his soldiers from so children right [TS]

00:46:28 ◼   ► and so it's you're like yay [TS]

00:46:30 ◼   ► uh actually not a second yeah he's [TS]

00:46:34 ◼   ► killed people and all of that but that [TS]

00:46:36 ◼   ► so you're rooting for him and then you [TS]

00:46:37 ◼   ► realize what you're doing which is he is [TS]

00:46:39 ◼   ► becoming increasingly one of these like [TS]

00:46:41 ◼   ► Jojo who is one of the other characters [TS]

00:46:43 ◼   ► who is sort of like Mouse further along [TS]

00:46:46 ◼   ► he's been further dehumanizing Malia [TS]

00:46:49 ◼   ► gets a sense that ocho I you know there [TS]

00:46:53 ◼   ► are moments when he's like a human being [TS]

00:46:54 ◼   ► and moments where he's like a completely [TS]

00:46:56 ◼   ► inhuman killing machine [TS]

00:46:58 ◼   ► she doesn't really understand it better [TS]

00:47:00 ◼   ► but now with with mouse's progression [TS]

00:47:02 ◼   ► you see this is what happens is these [TS]

00:47:04 ◼   ► kids are great card sort of ground-up [TS]

00:47:07 ◼   ► and the ones who survived end up being [TS]

00:47:10 ◼   ► they've seen all of these people died [TS]

00:47:12 ◼   ► and they've come become completely [TS]

00:47:14 ◼   ► dehumanized yeah it's fun [TS]

00:47:17 ◼   ► it is it is an uplifting story it's a [TS]

00:47:20 ◼   ► it's a rough so so it's all set it [TS]

00:47:23 ◼   ► what's interesting is I read an [TS]

00:47:24 ◼   ► interview with with Paolo Bacigalupi [TS]

00:47:26 ◼   ► where he was talking about the subject [TS]

00:47:30 ◼   ► matter and how he is not a non-political [TS]

00:47:32 ◼   ► writer at all because he does have these [TS]

00:47:34 ◼   ► other environmental themes in his work [TS]

00:47:37 ◼   ► but that hehe said that as he was [TS]

00:47:39 ◼   ► writing it he found that he was much [TS]

00:47:42 ◼   ► more overtly political than usual and [TS]

00:47:46 ◼   ► you see it in setting it in washington [TS]

00:47:47 ◼   ► DC I and having these different kind of [TS]

00:47:50 ◼   ► militia groups that are like the Army of [TS]

00:47:52 ◼   ► God and the Patriots and all these sorts [TS]

00:47:54 ◼   ► of things and they're there are several [TS]

00:47:56 ◼   ► passages where he talks about how all [TS]

00:48:00 ◼   ► this started with people who disagreed [TS]

00:48:03 ◼   ► with the beliefs of other people saying [TS]

00:48:05 ◼   ► they were traders or not patriotic and [TS]

00:48:09 ◼   ► it's clearly his his take on our current [TS]

00:48:13 ◼   ► events you know fractured political [TS]

00:48:16 ◼   ► system where if you don't believe what I [TS]

00:48:18 ◼   ► believe you are not you know you're not [TS]

00:48:20 ◼   ► an American or you're against America or [TS]

00:48:23 ◼   ► you're not a patriot and and you know [TS]

00:48:26 ◼   ► which wich so did you find that stuff to [TS]

00:48:28 ◼   ► be having praised him for not being too [TS]

00:48:31 ◼   ► preachy and ship breaker did you find [TS]

00:48:32 ◼   ► that stuff i mean i was a little more [TS]

00:48:34 ◼   ► overtly like I'm sending you a message [TS]

00:48:36 ◼   ► now [TS]

00:48:37 ◼   ► yeah it was it was kind i think that was [TS]

00:48:39 ◼   ► part of the reason why i didn't like [TS]

00:48:40 ◼   ► this book as much [TS]

00:48:41 ◼   ► ship breaker because it was kind of more [TS]

00:48:45 ◼   ► so than ship breaker wearing its lesson [TS]

00:48:48 ◼   ► on its sleeve as it were especially [TS]

00:48:50 ◼   ► given like you said setting in [TS]

00:48:52 ◼   ► Washington making these tee two groups [TS]

00:48:54 ◼   ► so kind of obviously mirroring what's [TS]

00:48:59 ◼   ► happening uh now uh without trying to [TS]

00:49:03 ◼   ► shade it at all really [TS]

00:49:05 ◼   ► um right it's because it's the Patriots [TS]

00:49:07 ◼   ► against the Army of God writes these two [TS]

00:49:10 ◼   ► groups that are saying we're for [TS]

00:49:11 ◼   ► goodness rackets as they as they shell [TS]

00:49:14 ◼   ► the hell out of each other kill each [TS]

00:49:16 ◼   ► other and they don't know nobody really [TS]

00:49:18 ◼   ► knows why they're trying to kill each [TS]

00:49:20 ◼   ► other and the any other interesting [TS]

00:49:22 ◼   ► thing and the climax is at the Capitol [TS]

00:49:25 ◼   ► right right and so that that's not a [TS]

00:49:26 ◼   ► message at all is it there in the [TS]

00:49:28 ◼   ► Capitol building in the Capitol building [TS]

00:49:29 ◼   ► basically is blown up in the climax [TS]

00:49:32 ◼   ► which so it's all this time it hasn't [TS]

00:49:34 ◼   ► really gotten hurt but now [TS]

00:49:36 ◼   ► yeah yeah yeahs a six-time acts of this [TS]

00:49:38 ◼   ► book it's the Capitol dome is gonna gets [TS]

00:49:41 ◼   ► mad it's a giant building that is [TS]

00:49:43 ◼   ► clearly a target but it's react and so [TS]

00:49:47 ◼   ► the other thing that was kind of a [TS]

00:49:48 ◼   ► little heavy-handed is so the Chinese [TS]

00:49:51 ◼   ► have a apparently survived the eco [TS]

00:49:54 ◼   ► apocalypse a fairly well and so they [TS]

00:49:57 ◼   ► come into America to be like the [TS]

00:49:59 ◼   ► Peacekeeper to be peacekeeper sins to [TS]

00:50:02 ◼   ► teach people how to you know have a [TS]

00:50:04 ◼   ► democracy and live civilized and you [TS]

00:50:07 ◼   ► know how they can instead of a fighting [TS]

00:50:11 ◼   ► each other they can farm and turn their [TS]

00:50:14 ◼   ► you know they have all these [TS]

00:50:15 ◼   ► motivational sayings and this literature [TS]

00:50:17 ◼   ► and they paint propaganda to help people [TS]

00:50:19 ◼   ► to wrap and only a million father was a [TS]

00:50:22 ◼   ► Chinese peacekeeper who met her mother [TS]

00:50:25 ◼   ► who is an American and and had her and [TS]

00:50:29 ◼   ► then the Chinese pull out and she's left [TS]

00:50:31 ◼   ► behind rises the Sun and they they run [TS]

00:50:34 ◼   ► to the docks right when they're leaving [TS]

00:50:35 ◼   ► because clearly hey we're his family [TS]

00:50:37 ◼   ► there's growing room on the boats and [TS]

00:50:39 ◼   ► which is so so clearly like a Vietnam [TS]

00:50:41 ◼   ► kind of a parallel except that we're [TS]

00:50:42 ◼   ► Vietnam and this is exactly [TS]

00:50:45 ◼   ► and this is like what you're saying [TS]

00:50:46 ◼   ► before he kind of twists a what's the he [TS]

00:50:49 ◼   ► makes the and I imagine he's writing for [TS]

00:50:52 ◼   ► largely American audience but that could [TS]

00:50:54 ◼   ► be wrong so he kind of Western audience [TS]

00:50:56 ◼   ► westerns that's true and so he he shifts [TS]

00:50:58 ◼   ► your normal expectations of well that [TS]

00:51:01 ◼   ► doesn't happen to people in Western [TS]

00:51:03 ◼   ► civilization's yeah i mean not to not to [TS]

00:51:05 ◼   ► be too blunt about it but I I feel like [TS]

00:51:07 ◼   ► one of the the tricks he doesn't it can [TS]

00:51:10 ◼   ► be very effective is he saying and he [TS]

00:51:12 ◼   ► uses this he says is this person red [TS]

00:51:15 ◼   ► hair and this person was blonde with [TS]

00:51:17 ◼   ► pale skin and what he's saying is he's [TS]

00:51:19 ◼   ► telling a story essentially about about [TS]

00:51:24 ◼   ► what has happened recently in fact in [TS]

00:51:27 ◼   ► Africa especially where there are [TS]

00:51:30 ◼   ► militias with children do and they do [TS]

00:51:33 ◼   ► and and horrible things happen in these [TS]

00:51:35 ◼   ► children are kind of dehumanized as they [TS]

00:51:38 ◼   ► live through these horrible violent [TS]

00:51:40 ◼   ► spurts in in especially in Africa and so [TS]

00:51:46 ◼   ► he tells that same story except he he [TS]

00:51:48 ◼   ► makes a point of saying you know these [TS]

00:51:50 ◼   ► are white kids and and and blackheads [TS]

00:51:52 ◼   ► and Asian kids and they look like [TS]

00:51:54 ◼   ► Americans and and you know what he's [TS]

00:51:56 ◼   ► saying is imagine imagine how horrible [TS]

00:51:59 ◼   ► this would be if it happened to you [TS]

00:52:01 ◼   ► now imagine the fact that it is [TS]

00:52:02 ◼   ► happening yeah today [TS]

00:52:04 ◼   ► oh by the way it's in Washington DC yeah [TS]

00:52:07 ◼   ► yeah so it hits home but he's also so [TS]

00:52:09 ◼   ► he's making its that statement about you [TS]

00:52:11 ◼   ► know your your environment your culture [TS]

00:52:14 ◼   ► could be destroyed by your actions but I [TS]

00:52:17 ◼   ► i'm interested in the fact that he's [TS]

00:52:18 ◼   ► also making a side statement which is [TS]

00:52:20 ◼   ► you know you can ignore the violence or [TS]

00:52:23 ◼   ► have it be remote in some places like [TS]

00:52:26 ◼   ► Africa but you can't I it's harder to do [TS]

00:52:31 ◼   ► that when i when i make you think of it [TS]

00:52:33 ◼   ► in the context of a bunch of little [TS]

00:52:35 ◼   ► American kids who are who have a machete [TS]

00:52:37 ◼   ► and a Nevada of acid and are and you [TS]

00:52:41 ◼   ► know are chopping off limbs and [TS]

00:52:43 ◼   ► indiscriminately killing people [TS]

00:52:45 ◼   ► so yeah it's kinda dark but but i think [TS]

00:52:48 ◼   ► really effective in that way of of [TS]

00:52:50 ◼   ► saying you know these are horrible [TS]

00:52:52 ◼   ► things and they're not the horrible [TS]

00:52:54 ◼   ► things that happened this book or not [TS]

00:52:55 ◼   ► things that haven't happened [TS]

00:52:57 ◼   ► world they just haven't happened in the [TS]

00:52:58 ◼   ► future in America so you know it makes [TS]

00:53:01 ◼   ► it that all the more horrible i guess to [TS]

00:53:04 ◼   ► see you know to look at these characters [TS]

00:53:06 ◼   ► and say these are our these are us and [TS]

00:53:08 ◼   ► and we don't have you know it's funny I [TS]

00:53:11 ◼   ► mean logically of course this is not [TS]

00:53:14 ◼   ► true but you know one of the nice things [TS]

00:53:16 ◼   ► about science fiction is is he can use [TS]

00:53:18 ◼   ► that device to say look you're you as an [TS]

00:53:21 ◼   ► American are used to seeing the poor [TS]

00:53:24 ◼   ► people in these terrible places with his [TS]

00:53:26 ◼   ► terrible violence as having different [TS]

00:53:29 ◼   ► color skin and different looking faces [TS]

00:53:31 ◼   ► and being able to sort of like just say [TS]

00:53:36 ◼   ► well that sort of thing doesn't happen [TS]

00:53:38 ◼   ► to people like us right now with plastic [TS]

00:53:40 ◼   ► a loop he says in both these books is [TS]

00:53:42 ◼   ► yeah you're you wanna bet [TS]

00:53:44 ◼   ► how do you how do you how would feel if [TS]

00:53:47 ◼   ► it did happen to people who looked like [TS]

00:53:48 ◼   ► you who were you how then how horrible [TS]

00:53:51 ◼   ► would this be and that's that is one of [TS]

00:53:53 ◼   ► these things that he doesn't answer is [TS]

00:53:55 ◼   ► it's it's really really horrible [TS]

00:53:58 ◼   ► spoiler alert not cool it is it is [TS]

00:54:01 ◼   ► terrible [TS]

00:54:02 ◼   ► that's O'Toole meanwhile takes Malia and [TS]

00:54:05 ◼   ► I'm like on his back and breathe air [TS]

00:54:09 ◼   ► into her mouth and maybe go into the [TS]

00:54:11 ◼   ► heart of the drowned cities and the end [TS]

00:54:13 ◼   ► the climax there in the basement of [TS]

00:54:15 ◼   ► capital basically and he gets he gets [TS]

00:54:19 ◼   ► free because he was captured by the way [TS]

00:54:22 ◼   ► protip do not take the captured half-man [TS]

00:54:27 ◼   ► to your lair and hope he doesn't get out [TS]

00:54:33 ◼   ► yeah and talked a little while and then [TS]

00:54:35 ◼   ► justice and have a guy with the keys get [TS]

00:54:37 ◼   ► a little too close to exactly it's a lot [TS]

00:54:39 ◼   ► of ground a bad idea because what [TS]

00:54:42 ◼   ► happens is he gets out and he like [TS]

00:54:43 ◼   ► literally kills just by tearing shooting [TS]

00:54:46 ◼   ► or tearing them limb from limb every [TS]

00:54:49 ◼   ► major senior figure in this one militia [TS]

00:54:53 ◼   ► is just they're all dead [TS]

00:54:55 ◼   ► me and it's it's it's Malia and Jojo and [TS]

00:54:59 ◼   ► tool i think so [TS]

00:55:01 ◼   ► in the basement with dead people all [TS]

00:55:04 ◼   ► around them [TS]

00:55:05 ◼   ► wow it's [TS]

00:55:07 ◼   ► a pretty dark oh and i didn't even [TS]

00:55:09 ◼   ► mention the fact that I'm Malia's mother [TS]

00:55:12 ◼   ► has apparently squirrels away or stolen [TS]

00:55:15 ◼   ► like all of the key artifacts of like [TS]

00:55:18 ◼   ► the Constitution you from the National [TS]

00:55:21 ◼   ► Archives she's basically taken all [TS]

00:55:23 ◼   ► valuable artifacts and hidden like a [TS]

00:55:25 ◼   ► secret room in her apartment building [TS]

00:55:28 ◼   ► and once again playing with that whole [TS]

00:55:30 ◼   ► idea of there's kind of two [TS]

00:55:32 ◼   ► civilizations here one people living in [TS]

00:55:36 ◼   ► the dragon city with to uh you know [TS]

00:55:38 ◼   ► children soldiers kill each other and [TS]

00:55:40 ◼   ► crazy militias fighting over inch by [TS]

00:55:43 ◼   ► inch over a city that's basically ruined [TS]

00:55:46 ◼   ► and worthless [TS]

00:55:47 ◼   ► yeah and then you have like [TS]

00:55:48 ◼   ► businesspeople from China coming by to [TS]

00:55:52 ◼   ► purchase a the artifacts artifacts [TS]

00:55:55 ◼   ► executor laying around because they want [TS]

00:55:57 ◼   ► to save them from this this war-torn [TS]

00:56:00 ◼   ► place and this is right this actually [TS]

00:56:02 ◼   ► happens in the real world right yeah [TS]

00:56:05 ◼   ► right right that people from the the [TS]

00:56:07 ◼   ► rich countries come to the poor [TS]

00:56:09 ◼   ► countries and exploit them and accept [TS]

00:56:10 ◼   ► and occasionally the UN since [TS]

00:56:12 ◼   ► peacekeeping forces right or NATO and [TS]

00:56:15 ◼   ► that's what the a and you know as [TS]

00:56:17 ◼   ► Americans were always the ones who are [TS]

00:56:19 ◼   ► sent to those places and so again just [TS]

00:56:21 ◼   ► like with the Vietnam parallel that [TS]

00:56:23 ◼   ► parallel of being the place where the [TS]

00:56:25 ◼   ► peacekeepers are sent and they are [TS]

00:56:27 ◼   ► condescending and they're like you [TS]

00:56:28 ◼   ► people are savages why don't you why do [TS]

00:56:30 ◼   ► you do this why do you fight when you [TS]

00:56:32 ◼   ► could be cultured and have a democracy [TS]

00:56:34 ◼   ► all of these things and and he just [TS]

00:56:36 ◼   ► turns it he just turned it all around [TS]

00:56:41 ◼   ► yeah so did you get did you get what the [TS]

00:56:43 ◼   ► drowned city stands for did I get with [TS]

00:56:46 ◼   ► the ground city stands for its DC oh I [TS]

00:56:50 ◼   ► did not make that connection haha very [TS]

00:56:53 ◼   ► proud of myself when I realized that [TS]

00:56:54 ◼   ► drowned cities means DC it's washington [TS]

00:56:58 ◼   ► DC the drowned cities [TS]

00:57:00 ◼   ► well I did not pick up another haha off [TS]

00:57:02 ◼   ► two points for you Jay yes oh yes [TS]

00:57:06 ◼   ► finally [TS]

00:57:07 ◼   ► I'm off to my drought I 10 points for a [TS]

00:57:11 ◼   ► very long time it's true but so and tool [TS]

00:57:15 ◼   ► in this book is is is more to do it does [TS]

00:57:18 ◼   ► is a lot more to do and and he was an [TS]

00:57:21 ◼   ► interesting character in ship breaker [TS]

00:57:23 ◼   ► but in drowned cities he is fascinating [TS]

00:57:26 ◼   ► because you get you get more to Rennes [TS]

00:57:27 ◼   ► question about what we learned about him [TS]

00:57:29 ◼   ► I don't think we learned his origin [TS]

00:57:31 ◼   ► story that's still kind of a mystery [TS]

00:57:33 ◼   ► other than the fact that he's just sort [TS]

00:57:34 ◼   ► of um didn't behave plank [TS]

00:57:38 ◼   ► other like here is just not like the [TS]

00:57:40 ◼   ► other moms yeah it is his pack died and [TS]

00:57:43 ◼   ► he should have just died with them and [TS]

00:57:45 ◼   ► he decided he didn't care and he would [TS]

00:57:47 ◼   ► just be his own guy but such a [TS]

00:57:50 ◼   ► fascinating character because he is even [TS]

00:57:52 ◼   ► though he has a monster he is he is a [TS]

00:57:54 ◼   ► above us in many ways i love that he is [TS]

00:57:57 ◼   ► more not just stronger but more [TS]

00:57:59 ◼   ► intelligent and he's built for war right [TS]

00:58:02 ◼   ► and he is priorities are very different [TS]

00:58:04 ◼   ► his morality is very different but he [TS]

00:58:06 ◼   ► does have a morality and he is [TS]

00:58:08 ◼   ► incredibly intelligent and it's just [TS]

00:58:10 ◼   ► such a great character to see you know [TS]

00:58:12 ◼   ► it is almost like an alien being in a [TS]

00:58:14 ◼   ► way where he's he's except that he's not [TS]

00:58:16 ◼   ► above us like so many aliens are [TS]

00:58:18 ◼   ► portrayed as being kind of like these [TS]

00:58:20 ◼   ► ethereal beings that are above us he is [TS]

00:58:22 ◼   ► a is a killing machine but yet also is [TS]

00:58:26 ◼   ► has all these other traits that are so [TS]

00:58:28 ◼   ► much better than the people we see it's [TS]

00:58:30 ◼   ► just it's a it's a really interesting [TS]

00:58:32 ◼   ► character true and I think he says at [TS]

00:58:34 ◼   ► one point the Betty what he does is he [TS]

00:58:37 ◼   ► survives like he goes and he's been in [TS]

00:58:40 ◼   ► all these different battlefield he's [TS]

00:58:41 ◼   ► killed people on every confidence and [TS]

00:58:44 ◼   ► write the main thing that he has learned [TS]

00:58:46 ◼   ► is that he survives no matter what [TS]

00:58:48 ◼   ► battle he goes into he is going to [TS]

00:58:50 ◼   ► survive and that's kind of how frames [TS]

00:58:52 ◼   ► his [TS]

00:58:53 ◼   ► his whole view outlook on life he does [TS]

00:58:55 ◼   ► what he needs to do to survive and that [TS]

00:58:58 ◼   ► I think is kind of how he kinda [TS]

00:59:01 ◼   ► overrides his genetic programming [TS]

00:59:04 ◼   ► somehow because he want he needs to [TS]

00:59:05 ◼   ► survive he's not just going to lay down [TS]

00:59:07 ◼   ► and die like the rest of them like they [TS]

00:59:09 ◼   ► think he should write when we need him [TS]

00:59:11 ◼   ► right he's been bitten by a gigantic [TS]

00:59:13 ◼   ► crocodile and his arms almost falling [TS]

00:59:16 ◼   ► off and he only has the 1i and but he he [TS]

00:59:21 ◼   ► makes it he survives it's hard it's hard [TS]

00:59:23 ◼   ► to kill it is hard to kill as an [TS]

00:59:26 ◼   ► enormous half man half tiger hyena dog [TS]

00:59:31 ◼   ► monster guy any word you what you might [TS]

00:59:36 ◼   ► expect that he be difficult to kill is [TS]

00:59:38 ◼   ► very hard to kill [TS]

00:59:39 ◼   ► this is true anyway he would I was [TS]

00:59:41 ◼   ► really that was really good character to [TS]

00:59:43 ◼   ► write was nice to see more of him and [TS]

00:59:45 ◼   ► get a little more since I would like to [TS]

00:59:46 ◼   ► see him again [TS]

00:59:47 ◼   ► in fact maybe the next book will just be [TS]

00:59:50 ◼   ► all about tool the Avengers a tool [TS]

00:59:52 ◼   ► that's right yeah it could be open up [TS]

00:59:55 ◼   ► but maybe who knows it could be so so in [TS]

00:59:58 ◼   ► general the thumbs up for a drink [TS]

00:59:58 ◼   ► general the thumbs up for a drink [TS]

01:00:00 ◼   ► cities yeah i would think if you liked a [TS]

01:00:02 ◼   ► ship breaker you like the drowned cities [TS]

01:00:06 ◼   ► i don't know if you necessarily have to [TS]

01:00:08 ◼   ► breathe [TS]

01:00:09 ◼   ► I mean you don't they don't continue the [TS]

01:00:11 ◼   ► same story [TS]

01:00:12 ◼   ► no no crosses over so they stand alone [TS]

01:00:14 ◼   ► you don't have to read one or the other [TS]

01:00:15 ◼   ► if we're going to implementation I think [TS]

01:00:17 ◼   ► the implication is that is that drowned [TS]

01:00:20 ◼   ► cities comes after ship breaker but even [TS]

01:00:22 ◼   ► that it's not it's not a hundred percent [TS]

01:00:24 ◼   ► me a tool never mentions yeah any of [TS]

01:00:28 ◼   ► what he's done in the previous book so [TS]

01:00:30 ◼   ► right if you had to choose if you only [TS]

01:00:33 ◼   ► have time for one of them i would think [TS]

01:00:35 ◼   ► you should show the ship breaker [TS]

01:00:37 ◼   ► yeah but it really quick reads and there [TS]

01:00:40 ◼   ► are both well done so i would say thumbs [TS]

01:00:43 ◼   ► up [TS]

01:00:43 ◼   ► yeah they don't feel dumb down I mean to [TS]

01:00:45 ◼   ► get back to the point about yaa books [TS]

01:00:47 ◼   ► and general david this is not a it's not [TS]

01:00:49 ◼   ► dumb down book it just because I mean [TS]

01:00:52 ◼   ► there isn't there isn't bad language [TS]

01:00:55 ◼   ► just maggots stream agate and if you're [TS]

01:00:58 ◼   ► offended by the word maggot don't read [TS]

01:01:00 ◼   ► that around cities there's lots of [TS]

01:01:01 ◼   ► maggots are there is a lot of maggots [TS]

01:01:03 ◼   ► all over the place but it's so funny to [TS]

01:01:04 ◼   ► me that so young adult fiction you know [TS]

01:01:07 ◼   ► don't swear [TS]

01:01:09 ◼   ► and don't have sex but it's okay to have [TS]

01:01:11 ◼   ► kids [TS]

01:01:12 ◼   ► cutting down kids and have really [TS]

01:01:13 ◼   ► horrible violent things yeah really [TS]

01:01:16 ◼   ► twisted like psychological things going [TS]

01:01:19 ◼   ► on [TS]

01:01:19 ◼   ► that's ok but hey don't swear yeah we [TS]

01:01:23 ◼   ► want the kids to get the wrong idea yeah [TS]

01:01:24 ◼   ► i know i know it is very strange [TS]

01:01:27 ◼   ► it's a very strange set of parties [TS]

01:01:28 ◼   ► because it is it is so I mean what [TS]

01:01:30 ◼   ► they're these are kids in with my ship [TS]

01:01:32 ◼   ► machetes hacking off the arms of other [TS]

01:01:35 ◼   ► kids and throwing acid in each other's [TS]

01:01:37 ◼   ► faces you know this is not just horrible [TS]

01:01:39 ◼   ► yeah it's not that they don't swear they [TS]

01:01:41 ◼   ► just a maggot exactly so it's ok so it's [TS]

01:01:43 ◼   ► all right i don't have sex except for [TS]

01:01:45 ◼   ► the except well actually is a sex scene [TS]

01:01:47 ◼   ► in and around cities i guess we should [TS]

01:01:48 ◼   ► say because they wouldn't they they get [TS]

01:01:50 ◼   ► naylor high / drunk on stuff is [TS]

01:01:53 ◼   ► initiation or not naylor mouse [TS]

01:01:56 ◼   ► yes his initiation into being the [TS]

01:01:57 ◼   ► faceless member of a militia and that [TS]

01:02:00 ◼   ► was that reminds me the kind of the the [TS]

01:02:02 ◼   ► really chilly point for me is when mouse [TS]

01:02:04 ◼   ► starts at some point so the the kids uh [TS]

01:02:08 ◼   ► in the militia they they kind of [TS]

01:02:11 ◼   ► basically shanghai mouse and he becomes [TS]

01:02:13 ◼   ► a soldier right and they give my name [TS]

01:02:15 ◼   ► and donate right coast is his new name [TS]

01:02:17 ◼   ► and at some point during the narrative a [TS]

01:02:20 ◼   ► Palo stops calling and mouse himself [TS]

01:02:24 ◼   ► stops thinking of himself as mouse and [TS]

01:02:26 ◼   ► thinks of himself as ghosts [TS]

01:02:27 ◼   ► yeah at that point you're like oh boy [TS]

01:02:29 ◼   ► that's after they get them to get them [TS]

01:02:31 ◼   ► high and they thrown into the whorehouse [TS]

01:02:33 ◼   ► basically the nail shed with Neil shed [TS]

01:02:35 ◼   ► girls and when he wakes up the next day [TS]

01:02:38 ◼   ► it's like ghosts woke up it doesn't [TS]

01:02:40 ◼   ► agree that was very effective [TS]

01:02:42 ◼   ► yeah yeah it's terrible that you know [TS]

01:02:45 ◼   ► it's a it's his it his adventure is not [TS]

01:02:48 ◼   ► a happy one [TS]

01:02:50 ◼   ► he has a little PS a nice moment at the [TS]

01:02:52 ◼   ► end but it's not that nice shirt and I [TS]

01:02:55 ◼   ► mean I'm not a approved and I don't [TS]

01:02:58 ◼   ► think that kids need to be sheltered but [TS]

01:03:00 ◼   ► I i was reading this I thought to myself [TS]

01:03:02 ◼   ► this is really a young adult book I mean [TS]

01:03:04 ◼   ► it seems very extreme for a lot of the [TS]

01:03:08 ◼   ► the violence seems a little like my head [TS]

01:03:10 ◼   ► I'd say the high school level and yeah I [TS]

01:03:13 ◼   ► guess that's true isn't it [TS]

01:03:14 ◼   ► my daughter I wouldn't have my daughter [TS]

01:03:16 ◼   ► read at ten there's no way but for high [TS]

01:03:20 ◼   ► school kind of audience i think you know [TS]

01:03:22 ◼   ► when i was reading stuff that was again [TS]

01:03:24 ◼   ► probably inappropriate for or at least [TS]

01:03:27 ◼   ► would be considered an appropriate for [TS]

01:03:29 ◼   ► my age but it was fine [TS]

01:03:30 ◼   ► I you know was fine read that piercing [TS]

01:03:33 ◼   ► to me and go well [TS]

01:03:34 ◼   ► ok so their sex in this book alright I [TS]

01:03:37 ◼   ► don't know anything about that i'm only [TS]

01:03:38 ◼   ► 15 but i am going to read it and you [TS]

01:03:43 ◼   ► know it which might be working in its [TS]

01:03:45 ◼   ► own way if piers anthony is teaching you [TS]

01:03:47 ◼   ► about [TS]

01:03:47 ◼   ► well that is gonna be dark got a good [TS]

01:03:53 ◼   ► thing but but I bi it this is yeah this [TS]

01:03:56 ◼   ► is a like a high school level kinda and [TS]

01:03:58 ◼   ► I mean I don't think it was it there was [TS]

01:04:00 ◼   ► nothing that offended me your nose like [TS]

01:04:02 ◼   ► a file it was of it's a good book i was [TS]

01:04:05 ◼   ► just reading it is the thing about young [TS]

01:04:07 ◼   ► adult fiction that throws me is that [TS]

01:04:08 ◼   ► work young so I never know how young [TS]

01:04:09 ◼   ► people are who are supposed to be [TS]

01:04:12 ◼   ► reading this I think red said it's sorta [TS]

01:04:14 ◼   ► like it's sorta like 12 to 17 or 10 to [TS]

01:04:17 ◼   ► 17 and it's a broad broad spectrum and i [TS]

01:04:20 ◼   ► feel like my daughter is is creeping [TS]

01:04:22 ◼   ► toward being able to read some of [TS]

01:04:24 ◼   ► but it would be on the lower you know [TS]

01:04:26 ◼   ► that the the younger and if admitted [TS]

01:04:29 ◼   ► that is a broad range and at the high [TS]

01:04:30 ◼   ► end you've got things that are you know [TS]

01:04:32 ◼   ► in some ways just you know adult [TS]

01:04:34 ◼   ► essentially adult but it without you [TS]

01:04:38 ◼   ► know hardcore kind of sex and and [TS]