The Incomparable

00:00:01 ◼   ► the incomparable [TS]

00:00:05 ◼   ► number 330 a pastor larry 27 welcome [TS]

00:00:13 ◼   ► back everybody to the uncomfortable i'm [TS]

00:00:15 ◼   ► your host Jason Steele we're here to [TS]

00:00:16 ◼   ► talk about v for vendetta [TS]

00:00:19 ◼   ► this is a comic from the eighties by [TS]

00:00:23 ◼   ► Alan Moore and David Lloyd over many [TS]

00:00:26 ◼   ► years in the eighties it was actually [TS]

00:00:28 ◼   ► like a few of the album or earlier more [TS]

00:00:30 ◼   ► projects sort of stopped and then had to [TS]

00:00:32 ◼   ► be restarted a few years later and they [TS]

00:00:34 ◼   ► were unpublished issues but the beauty [TS]

00:00:37 ◼   ► of it is in the end they collected it is [TS]

00:00:39 ◼   ► it as a giant trade paperback that has [TS]

00:00:41 ◼   ► the whole thing in it and so if you have [TS]

00:00:42 ◼   ► been if you read it at any point after [TS]

00:00:44 ◼   ► the late eighties you've probably read [TS]

00:00:47 ◼   ► it in book form which is well I think [TS]

00:00:48 ◼   ► the best way to read and we are you know [TS]

00:00:51 ◼   ► we'll talk about that maybe a little bit [TS]

00:00:52 ◼   ► for those who on the panel who who read [TS]

00:00:54 ◼   ► it and we'll also talk about the film [TS]

00:00:56 ◼   ► which is a much more accessible in many [TS]

00:00:59 ◼   ► ways from 2005 directed by james [TS]

00:01:02 ◼   ► McTeague who is a longtime collaborator [TS]

00:01:05 ◼   ► of the Wachowskis they didn't direct it [TS]

00:01:09 ◼   ► because they had James matete do it but [TS]

00:01:11 ◼   ► they did write it and produce it so [TS]

00:01:13 ◼   ► there's a lot of which house key in be [TS]

00:01:15 ◼   ► for vendetta as well of course the movie [TS]

00:01:17 ◼   ► stars natalie portman and hugo weaving [TS]

00:01:19 ◼   ► in a very interesting performance in so [TS]

00:01:24 ◼   ► many ways like trivia question [TS]

00:01:25 ◼   ► interesting as well as I think good let [TS]

00:01:28 ◼   ► me introduce my panelists we're going to [TS]

00:01:29 ◼   ► talk about the data with me because [TS]

00:01:31 ◼   ► that's something i should probably do [TS]

00:01:33 ◼   ► laughing there why not have her go first [TS]

00:01:35 ◼   ► with Briana well hello hey what's up by [TS]

00:01:37 ◼   ► jason still you know not much not much [TS]

00:01:39 ◼   ► going on the current events kind of [TS]

00:01:41 ◼   ► quiet yeah yeah so I thought you just [TS]

00:01:43 ◼   ► dip into the past into the mid-2004 a [TS]

00:01:46 ◼   ► movie pic ships others also here hi chip [TS]

00:01:49 ◼   ► hi there this was the most unexpected [TS]

00:01:50 ◼   ► use of the benny hill music I ever haha [TS]

00:01:54 ◼   ► i have comments about that scene a [TS]

00:01:57 ◼   ► little bit but we'll get to brian [TS]

00:01:59 ◼   ► hamilton is also here hi Brian tell me [TS]

00:02:01 ◼   ► Jason do you like music uh yeah sure [TS]

00:02:03 ◼   ► music is fine [TS]

00:02:05 ◼   ► boom explosion guy English is here it's [TS]

00:02:08 ◼   ► been a little while high guy welcome [TS]

00:02:09 ◼   ► back [TS]

00:02:10 ◼   ► hey it's really nice to be here i miss [TS]

00:02:12 ◼   ► you [TS]

00:02:13 ◼   ► we missed you too yeah yeah [TS]

00:02:15 ◼   ► well you know what for three years I had [TS]

00:02:17 ◼   ► Moses and apologize to no one [TS]

00:02:20 ◼   ► alright and fill most lachrymose well I [TS]

00:02:24 ◼   ► didn't know guy was gonna be here but [TS]

00:02:26 ◼   ► I'll still stay anyway cases this is [TS]

00:02:27 ◼   ► strength through unity you got tricked [TS]

00:02:30 ◼   ► we totally got tricked into this [TS]

00:02:32 ◼   ► yeah I I didn't tell anybody guy would [TS]

00:02:34 ◼   ► be here because i wanted i wanted to the [TS]

00:02:36 ◼   ► whole panel to show up so surprised [TS]

00:02:39 ◼   ► so how so how many of you have read the [TS]

00:02:41 ◼   ► comic I'm curious [TS]

00:02:43 ◼   ► oh absolutely yeah i've read it when it [TS]

00:02:45 ◼   ► was first coming out [TS]

00:02:46 ◼   ► wow yeah me too i walked into ides [TS]

00:02:48 ◼   ► comics in pittsburgh and loved the [TS]

00:02:51 ◼   ► artwork and was fascinated by it and [TS]

00:02:54 ◼   ► never read it interesting and Brian's [TS]

00:02:58 ◼   ► can stay here and play listen while [TS]

00:02:59 ◼   ► everyone else talks about the comic [TS]

00:03:00 ◼   ► comic is it is a lot and it's very dense [TS]

00:03:06 ◼   ► it's you know it's really more because [TS]

00:03:08 ◼   ► it started in 80-82 it's fairly early [TS]

00:03:10 ◼   ► its it really reminded me of a lot of [TS]

00:03:13 ◼   ► comics published in England in that [TS]

00:03:18 ◼   ► period that I've read it had at the art [TS]

00:03:21 ◼   ► style really look like that it's it and [TS]

00:03:23 ◼   ► it's super dense and because it was [TS]

00:03:25 ◼   ► published in the eighties the the [TS]

00:03:26 ◼   ► publishing like the color and contrast [TS]

00:03:28 ◼   ► techniques I i was trying to read this [TS]

00:03:31 ◼   ► in a dimly lit room and was literally [TS]

00:03:33 ◼   ► unable to read it i had to get my ID to [TS]

00:03:35 ◼   ► turn on a bright light in order to see [TS]

00:03:37 ◼   ► it because the it is you know it that's [TS]

00:03:41 ◼   ► just the the nature of the publishing [TS]

00:03:43 ◼   ► medium in that in that time especially I [TS]

00:03:45 ◼   ► was originally black and white so on top [TS]

00:03:48 ◼   ► of that they're there colorizing black [TS]

00:03:51 ◼   ► and white art and that's it's a bit of a [TS]

00:03:53 ◼   ► rough go [TS]

00:03:54 ◼   ► yeah yeah it is step for people who have [TS]

00:03:56 ◼   ► seen the movie what you should know [TS]

00:03:57 ◼   ► about the comic i mean i-i think it's [TS]

00:03:59 ◼   ► good it is super dense it to the point [TS]

00:04:02 ◼   ► where i was reading a couple of articles [TS]

00:04:03 ◼   ► about how they felt like you know it's [TS]

00:04:07 ◼   ► what exactly what you'd expect which is [TS]

00:04:08 ◼   ► a look at allen more comic adaptation [TS]

00:04:10 ◼   ► first off he took his name off the movie [TS]

00:04:12 ◼   ► because he takes his name off every [TS]

00:04:13 ◼   ► every movie but a lot of people will be [TS]

00:04:14 ◼   ► like oh well you know it's it's the [TS]

00:04:16 ◼   ► movie is so simplified compared to the [TS]

00:04:18 ◼   ► comic and it's true the comic is so the [TS]

00:04:20 ◼   ► comic is so dense so much happens in the [TS]

00:04:22 ◼   ► comic that the streamlining they had to [TS]

00:04:25 ◼   ► do a tremendous amount of streamlining [TS]

00:04:26 ◼   ► for the movie but you know that there [TS]

00:04:28 ◼   ► are [TS]

00:04:29 ◼   ► the shape of it and specific memorable [TS]

00:04:31 ◼   ► scenes in it are reflected in in the [TS]

00:04:34 ◼   ► movie as well I came to the movie first [TS]

00:04:35 ◼   ► and went back and read the comics yeah I [TS]

00:04:37 ◼   ► i did the same thing in the comic yeah I [TS]

00:04:40 ◼   ► i see the brilliance there but it's like [TS]

00:04:42 ◼   ► an eel students and you know novel in [TS]

00:04:46 ◼   ► the sense it's so big and it's so dense [TS]

00:04:48 ◼   ► it so would like benefit from editing [TS]

00:04:51 ◼   ► it's just a hot mess right out [TS]

00:04:54 ◼   ► I think it's worth remembering that at [TS]

00:04:55 ◼   ► the time comics were directed and alan [TS]

00:05:00 ◼   ► moore almost single-handedly Alan what a [TS]

00:05:03 ◼   ► bunch of other British people from [TS]

00:05:04 ◼   ► Thatcher's England sort of recreate the [TS]

00:05:06 ◼   ► art form in a lot of ways everything we [TS]

00:05:08 ◼   ► know about that man now came out of that [TS]

00:05:10 ◼   ► basically when you can see the [TS]

00:05:12 ◼   ► techniques that are used to use for [TS]

00:05:13 ◼   ► years later and watch men at work at you [TS]

00:05:15 ◼   ► which is better like heat you know he [TS]

00:05:18 ◼   ► learned any girl and yeah it's dense yes [TS]

00:05:21 ◼   ► it's difficult [TS]

00:05:22 ◼   ► yes certainly going back to try to beat [TS]

00:05:24 ◼   ► it is is hard i personally love the [TS]

00:05:26 ◼   ► movie I didn't really like the watch [TS]

00:05:28 ◼   ► movie which is a comic book nerds are [TS]

00:05:30 ◼   ► gonna take my card guys touching the [TS]

00:05:33 ◼   ► third well no I i'm with you guys i'm [TS]

00:05:36 ◼   ► with you i like it and you know what [TS]

00:05:38 ◼   ► Alan Moore loves the medium of comic [TS]

00:05:40 ◼   ► books he loves it and he is an artist in [TS]

00:05:43 ◼   ► that medium and what he's good at is [TS]

00:05:46 ◼   ► leveraging that so when you take that [TS]

00:05:47 ◼   ► work and you put in a different medium [TS]

00:05:49 ◼   ► by necessity you must omit various [TS]

00:05:53 ◼   ► aspects of it and i think particularly [TS]

00:05:56 ◼   ► this movie but even watch me too but [TS]

00:05:58 ◼   ► particularly this movie is very strong [TS]

00:06:00 ◼   ► film based off of that the same ideas [TS]

00:06:03 ◼   ► and and the root the root of the story [TS]

00:06:07 ◼   ► that he was trying to tell them beefing [TS]

00:06:09 ◼   ► data and this was one of the craziest [TS]

00:06:10 ◼   ► for in the way of comic book movies that [TS]

00:06:14 ◼   ► was adapted for the for film that was [TS]

00:06:18 ◼   ► way different than anything anybody had [TS]

00:06:21 ◼   ► seen like I mean hugo weaving is i mean [TS]

00:06:24 ◼   ► we're talking obviously about this but [TS]

00:06:26 ◼   ► like the fact that he has a mask on for [TS]

00:06:29 ◼   ► the entire film is literally unheard of [TS]

00:06:33 ◼   ► i am hosting this entire show wearing a [TS]

00:06:35 ◼   ► mask and you can only hear my voice you [TS]

00:06:37 ◼   ► can see my face at all just throwing it [TS]

00:06:39 ◼   ► out there beautiful [TS]

00:06:40 ◼   ► it's an honor [TS]

00:06:41 ◼   ► yeah no it'sit's it's amazing will get [TS]

00:06:43 ◼   ► there i was going to say something about [TS]

00:06:44 ◼   ► the way the story is told that you know [TS]

00:06:47 ◼   ► it has this meandering history it was a [TS]

00:06:50 ◼   ► comic in a in a larger collection which [TS]

00:06:53 ◼   ► is something that happened in the UK [TS]

00:06:55 ◼   ► where they be a magazine that would have [TS]

00:06:56 ◼   ► different stories in it and warrior [TS]

00:06:59 ◼   ► magazine yes so you get the i want to [TS]

00:07:01 ◼   ► say it's almost de ken zijn in the sense [TS]

00:07:04 ◼   ► that these AR installments and I think [TS]

00:07:07 ◼   ► you know the way I think more had an [TS]

00:07:10 ◼   ► endgame in mind but one of the reasons [TS]

00:07:14 ◼   ► that you have to do some work when you [TS]

00:07:16 ◼   ► turn this into a movie is because the [TS]

00:07:19 ◼   ► comic is episodic it is stretched out it [TS]

00:07:22 ◼   ► can meander it can go in lots of [TS]

00:07:24 ◼   ► different twists and turns and take a [TS]

00:07:26 ◼   ► long time because not only is it like [TS]

00:07:28 ◼   ► any comic an issue by issue sort of [TS]

00:07:30 ◼   ► thing it wasn't done as a novel but in [TS]

00:07:33 ◼   ► addition to that it was done in small [TS]

00:07:35 ◼   ► installments inside another magazine and [TS]

00:07:37 ◼   ► then it got a delay and then it got you [TS]

00:07:39 ◼   ► know published years later some of those [TS]

00:07:41 ◼   ► things got so it ended up being a very [TS]

00:07:42 ◼   ► stretched out narrative I'm sure when [TS]

00:07:45 ◼   ► most says you know it you could be i [TS]

00:07:47 ◼   ► think was most maybe was guide when you [TS]

00:07:49 ◼   ► say almost like a rough draft and it [TS]

00:07:51 ◼   ► could be tightened I mean that's the [TS]

00:07:53 ◼   ► problem of writing in installments is [TS]

00:07:55 ◼   ► you don't get to go back and make [TS]

00:07:56 ◼   ► changes so it is sprawling and [TS]

00:07:58 ◼   ► meandering in a way that that that a [TS]

00:08:00 ◼   ► movie you would never choose if you [TS]

00:08:02 ◼   ► could do a rewrite of the whole thing [TS]

00:08:03 ◼   ► when you were done but comics at work [TS]

00:08:05 ◼   ► like that not only installments but it [TS]

00:08:07 ◼   ► also just it brackets it brackets [TS]

00:08:11 ◼   ► watchman the first two parts of the book [TS]

00:08:13 ◼   ► were written between in the early [TS]

00:08:16 ◼   ► eighties not booked and released like 80 [TS]

00:08:18 ◼   ► to 85 and then I believe warrior folded [TS]

00:08:22 ◼   ► so look the the comic is divided into 3 [TS]

00:08:26 ◼   ► into 3 books and the first two made it [TS]

00:08:29 ◼   ► into warrior then the story just stops [TS]

00:08:33 ◼   ► more makes a name for himself at DC with [TS]

00:08:38 ◼   ► Swamp Thing and other stuff watch men [TS]

00:08:40 ◼   ► becomes a thing and DC gives more the [TS]

00:08:44 ◼   ► opportunity to finish v for vendetta [TS]

00:08:46 ◼   ► with the third book which was written so [TS]

00:08:49 ◼   ► much later so it's not just episodic but [TS]

00:08:52 ◼   ► it's it's it's it's it's free [TS]

00:08:54 ◼   ► admitted at least in terms of the [TS]

00:08:56 ◼   ► morning he had to get back into his head [TS]

00:08:58 ◼   ► space to write the thing [TS]

00:08:59 ◼   ► yeah I came in for the third book i was [TS]

00:09:01 ◼   ► working at the comic store at the time [TS]

00:09:03 ◼   ► and when that came out and it was like [TS]

00:09:05 ◼   ► mind-blowing for everybody but it's like [TS]

00:09:07 ◼   ► in in some ways it's like tell me the [TS]

00:09:09 ◼   ► story spider-man and Jason know your big [TS]

00:09:11 ◼   ► fan so you can tell me the story [TS]

00:09:13 ◼   ► spider-man there's no story of [TS]

00:09:15 ◼   ► spider-man need like he's moscato ours [TS]

00:09:18 ◼   ► gets his powers any you know is uncle [TS]

00:09:20 ◼   ► dies and now he's you know great power [TS]

00:09:22 ◼   ► great responsibility [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► go like there's no there's no artoo it's [TS]

00:09:26 ◼   ► unlike watchman which is a fully plucked [TS]

00:09:29 ◼   ► out very carefully plotted out from [TS]

00:09:31 ◼   ► beginning to end [TS]

00:09:32 ◼   ► also the character of EV is just not [TS]

00:09:35 ◼   ► really the same you know like this this [TS]

00:09:37 ◼   ► comic book is very much a product of the [TS]

00:09:40 ◼   ► the eighties right and it's clearly up [TS]

00:09:42 ◼   ► that that low level 80 sexism image in [TS]

00:09:46 ◼   ► spite of every single tournament that [TS]

00:09:48 ◼   ► it's every single bad trope like it's [TS]

00:09:50 ◼   ► your rape being used to like good just [TS]

00:09:53 ◼   ► as to come titillate the the reader and [TS]

00:09:56 ◼   ► you know a shortcut for character [TS]

00:09:58 ◼   ► development is just she's not as good a [TS]

00:10:01 ◼   ► character at all and I think it really [TS]

00:10:03 ◼   ► speaks to you about the witch house case [TS]

00:10:06 ◼   ► ability to write a more interesting [TS]

00:10:07 ◼   ► character there and natalie portman's [TS]

00:10:10 ◼   ► ability to play it actually agreed the [TS]

00:10:12 ◼   ► killing joke suffers from the same thing [TS]

00:10:14 ◼   ► yeah but so much of that DNA from the [TS]

00:10:16 ◼   ► comic does make it into the movie [TS]

00:10:19 ◼   ► because it is following the bones of the [TS]

00:10:22 ◼   ► plot so some of the things that I found [TS]

00:10:25 ◼   ► really problematic in the comic about EV [TS]

00:10:28 ◼   ► are still there [TS]

00:10:30 ◼   ► despite Natalie perform important [TS]

00:10:32 ◼   ► performance and despite you know some [TS]

00:10:34 ◼   ► refinements along the way it's still can [TS]

00:10:38 ◼   ► i use the word squeaky i'm going to use [TS]

00:10:40 ◼   ► the words which is what we watching a [TS]

00:10:42 ◼   ► movie tonight he doesn't he could [TS]

00:10:45 ◼   ► frankly just be a figment of her [TS]

00:10:47 ◼   ► imagination for particularly because [TS]

00:10:49 ◼   ► those actions that he takes it to have [TS]

00:10:51 ◼   ► impact on the world but effectively he's [TS]

00:10:53 ◼   ► the inspiration for her changing my [TS]

00:10:55 ◼   ► nanny is the inspiration and the agent [TS]

00:10:57 ◼   ► of change for everybody that's whether [TS]

00:10:59 ◼   ► all standing outside the building in [TS]

00:11:01 ◼   ► Parliament [TS]

00:11:01 ◼   ► and it blows up sure he sent to train [TS]

00:11:04 ◼   ► but ultimately bit blows up because the [TS]

00:11:07 ◼   ► the people right accepted his message [TS]

00:11:10 ◼   ► and showed up on mass to to protest it [TS]

00:11:13 ◼   ► and we see that story too easy [TS]

00:11:15 ◼   ► transition from being sort of you know [TS]

00:11:18 ◼   ► almost a functionary of the machine to [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► completely rejecting it anyway I'd I [TS]

00:11:24 ◼   ► think that's why we don't see his face [TS]

00:11:25 ◼   ► basically he's an idea not not a man so [TS]

00:11:28 ◼   ► much [TS]

00:11:29 ◼   ► let's talk about v in the film Hugo [TS]

00:11:32 ◼   ► Weaving yeah plays this i believe they [TS]

00:11:34 ◼   ► shot for a week or two with a different [TS]

00:11:36 ◼   ► actor and then and then that they [TS]

00:11:38 ◼   ► replace that actor and Hugo Weaving came [TS]

00:11:40 ◼   ► in and so there may be a few shots in [TS]

00:11:42 ◼   ► this movie where where he is it's not [TS]

00:11:46 ◼   ► Hugo Weaving but i believe in large part [TS]

00:11:48 ◼   ► he's there and he's acting and then [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► presumably they looked his dialogue but [TS]

00:11:52 ◼   ► it's still it's him and it's quite a [TS]

00:11:54 ◼   ► performance [TS]

00:11:55 ◼   ► oh you know I think I think it's a great [TS]

00:11:57 ◼   ► vocal performance and a great physical [TS]

00:11:59 ◼   ► performance and such as a dangerous [TS]

00:12:02 ◼   ► decision to have I mean in the in the [TS]

00:12:05 ◼   ► comic every panel everybody's face is [TS]

00:12:08 ◼   ► frozen in a comic right i mean get away [TS]

00:12:10 ◼   ► with it but in a movie to do that and I [TS]

00:12:14 ◼   ► i think it's a bold decision and I think [TS]

00:12:16 ◼   ► it really works because of the [TS]

00:12:18 ◼   ► physicality and because of the voice [TS]

00:12:19 ◼   ► that it is but he you know the fact is [TS]

00:12:22 ◼   ► we doesn't have a name he's just V we we [TS]

00:12:25 ◼   ► learned that that although he likes [TS]

00:12:27 ◼   ► alliteration because you know he's got [TS]

00:12:29 ◼   ► that whole speech with all ever like [TS]

00:12:31 ◼   ► every word that starts with v is in that [TS]

00:12:32 ◼   ► speech he's room 5 from the testing [TS]

00:12:35 ◼   ► facility where he was kind of created [TS]

00:12:37 ◼   ► recreated and you know he doesn't have a [TS]

00:12:40 ◼   ► name and we never see his face and and [TS]

00:12:43 ◼   ► guys right he you you could view him as [TS]

00:12:45 ◼   ► being and he I think maybe infuse [TS]

00:12:47 ◼   ► himself as the embodiment of an idea [TS]

00:12:49 ◼   ► more than a person he's most akin to me [TS]

00:12:52 ◼   ► as the Joker in the Dark Knight i am [TS]

00:12:55 ◼   ► reading the comics so I don't know what [TS]

00:12:56 ◼   ► any of the Joker's established backstory [TS]

00:12:59 ◼   ► is but to me in the dark knight the [TS]

00:13:02 ◼   ► joker is just a symbol of chaos [TS]

00:13:04 ◼   ► wonderfully performed by Keith ledger in [TS]

00:13:06 ◼   ► the same way hugo weaving is simply an [TS]

00:13:09 ◼   ► idea man behind the mask is not as much [TS]

00:13:12 ◼   ► of him but he's the idea they hammer [TS]

00:13:14 ◼   ► that home [TS]

00:13:14 ◼   ► in the movie a lot and the fact that you [TS]

00:13:17 ◼   ► know going back to the fact that he's in [TS]

00:13:18 ◼   ► a mask the whole time in a comic you do [TS]

00:13:20 ◼   ► have the separate drawings and words and [TS]

00:13:23 ◼   ► in the movie you have both his vocal [TS]

00:13:25 ◼   ► performance and his physical performance [TS]

00:13:27 ◼   ► it's not a David Prowse james earl jones [TS]

00:13:30 ◼   ► situation it is hugo weaving through and [TS]

00:13:32 ◼   ► through and that shines through in his [TS]

00:13:34 ◼   ► performance to make it more coherent but [TS]

00:13:36 ◼   ► I'm glad you got a better because i was [TS]

00:13:37 ◼   ► gonna say that he's probably the other [TS]

00:13:39 ◼   ► example of a character that everybody [TS]

00:13:41 ◼   ► kind of ya reads and understands right [TS]

00:13:44 ◼   ► that it had does epistatic mask [TS]

00:13:46 ◼   ► it's interesting that we're talking [TS]

00:13:47 ◼   ► about the character as an idea in this [TS]

00:13:51 ◼   ► movie compared to the idea in the book [TS]

00:13:55 ◼   ► up the book really leans into like [TS]

00:13:58 ◼   ► anarchism yes LOL the whole point of the [TS]

00:14:01 ◼   ► whole point of the graphic novel is alan [TS]

00:14:04 ◼   ► moore pretty much defending anarchism as [TS]

00:14:06 ◼   ► a philosophy v is right up there you [TS]

00:14:10 ◼   ► know he wants to get everybody to the [TS]

00:14:11 ◼   ► land of do as you please and and but [TS]

00:14:15 ◼   ► before that there's going to be a period [TS]

00:14:17 ◼   ► of K chaos that he calls the land of [TS]

00:14:20 ◼   ► take what you want but he says that you [TS]

00:14:21 ◼   ► gotta get if you're going to deal with [TS]

00:14:24 ◼   ► authoritarianism and totalitarianism [TS]

00:14:25 ◼   ► you're going to have the chaos before [TS]

00:14:27 ◼   ► you get to this philosophy of everybody [TS]

00:14:30 ◼   ► taking personal responsibility and [TS]

00:14:32 ◼   ► everybody who making collective order [TS]

00:14:35 ◼   ► and something like that [TS]

00:14:36 ◼   ► not a whole lot of that comes through in [TS]

00:14:38 ◼   ► the movie he's more of a generic agent [TS]

00:14:41 ◼   ► of chaos slash freedom fighter then you [TS]

00:14:45 ◼   ► know there's not a whole lot of [TS]

00:14:46 ◼   ► anarchists philosophy into this movie [TS]

00:14:48 ◼   ► and what I think that's what Alan Moore [TS]

00:14:50 ◼   ► had a problem with because you know you [TS]

00:14:53 ◼   ► know not everybody accepts that real [TS]

00:14:54 ◼   ► well no one really accept this movie [TS]

00:14:56 ◼   ► when it came out if your recall it was [TS]

00:14:59 ◼   ► kind of and bye-bye reviews severely and [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► you know so but you you come out [TS]

00:15:04 ◼   ► straight up with an with anarchists [TS]

00:15:06 ◼   ► cookbook on film [TS]

00:15:08 ◼   ► no no no what no one's no one's gonna go [TS]

00:15:10 ◼   ► for that real well [TS]

00:15:11 ◼   ► well I mean so this is the early [TS]

00:15:13 ◼   ► eighties in Thatcher's UK this is the [TS]

00:15:15 ◼   ► beginning of the punk movement this is [TS]

00:15:18 ◼   ► akin and it is certainly part of the [TS]

00:15:20 ◼   ► family of that entire movement [TS]

00:15:23 ◼   ► I mean that's where we get the anarchy [TS]

00:15:24 ◼   ► symbol firm which is it's no mistake to [TS]

00:15:27 ◼   ► be simply yellow like the animals real [TS]

00:15:29 ◼   ► because they're down obvious [TS]

00:15:31 ◼   ► yeah exactly an obvious shadow is that [TS]

00:15:33 ◼   ► is relevant when the audience when they [TS]

00:15:36 ◼   ► made this movie [TS]

00:15:37 ◼   ► no I don't think so but I think they [TS]

00:15:40 ◼   ► took what was development for the time [TS]

00:15:42 ◼   ► and they the jigger the politics behind [TS]

00:15:45 ◼   ► a little bit in order to tell his story [TS]

00:15:47 ◼   ► that would land the same points but [TS]

00:15:50 ◼   ► would be more relevant for the time [TS]

00:15:51 ◼   ► CII have to give a little bit push back [TS]

00:15:54 ◼   ► on that I think I it's very clear that [TS]

00:15:57 ◼   ► Elmore's interpretation be was [TS]

00:15:59 ◼   ► definitely you know in his anarchist [TS]

00:16:02 ◼   ► libertarian view point i think the [TS]

00:16:05 ◼   ► beauty of the film in the the book like [TS]

00:16:08 ◼   ► the physical book that went along with [TS]

00:16:09 ◼   ► the film is it really you know this [TS]

00:16:13 ◼   ► isn't written by you know a white guy [TS]

00:16:16 ◼   ► it's a much much deeper perspective [TS]

00:16:18 ◼   ► about you know societies that oppressed [TS]

00:16:22 ◼   ► people and I think it's much deeper [TS]

00:16:23 ◼   ► because of that V the reading of him in [TS]

00:16:27 ◼   ► the movie is so much deeper he's not [TS]

00:16:30 ◼   ► like a a joker agent of chaos there's a [TS]

00:16:33 ◼   ► lot of duality there if he's a villain a [TS]

00:16:36 ◼   ► terrorist our hero and you can look at [TS]

00:16:39 ◼   ► this film and see it completely [TS]

00:16:41 ◼   ► legitimately both ways he tortures EV he [TS]

00:16:44 ◼   ► water board's her he you know he there's [TS]

00:16:47 ◼   ► a scene where he talks about he's a [TS]

00:16:49 ◼   ► monster and he's been broken by the [TS]

00:16:51 ◼   ► things have happened to him to do one [TS]

00:16:53 ◼   ► good thing he does in the movie is that [TS]

00:16:55 ◼   ► TV make the decision to do the train [TS]

00:16:57 ◼   ► down exactly it's why this movie really [TS]

00:17:00 ◼   ► appeals to me i mean i think most people [TS]

00:17:02 ◼   ► that know me in my real life no you know [TS]

00:17:05 ◼   ► i am someone else out there every day [TS]

00:17:07 ◼   ► working for change i think people to get [TS]

00:17:11 ◼   ► that invested in it there's an anger [TS]

00:17:14 ◼   ► sometimes it kind of drives you with [TS]

00:17:17 ◼   ► that about the things have been done to [TS]

00:17:19 ◼   ► you along the way to make you feel so [TS]

00:17:21 ◼   ► strongly about that [TS]

00:17:22 ◼   ► so when I see be wrestling with that [TS]

00:17:24 ◼   ► part of himself [TS]

00:17:26 ◼   ► it's it's real to me and yeah I also say [TS]

00:17:30 ◼   ► I realized there were some critics that [TS]

00:17:31 ◼   ► didn't like this movie when it came out [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► to me this came out at the height of the [TS]

00:17:36 ◼   ► bush [TS]

00:17:36 ◼   ► administration in the middle of the Iraq [TS]

00:17:38 ◼   ► war and I remember everybody and [TS]

00:17:41 ◼   ► outgoing seeing it like four times in [TS]

00:17:43 ◼   ► the theater and people loving so you [TS]

00:17:46 ◼   ► know that was mine I think you could [TS]

00:17:48 ◼   ► really make the argument that V in the [TS]

00:17:51 ◼   ► in the movie is very specifically [TS]

00:17:55 ◼   ► pushing back against an oppressive [TS]

00:17:57 ◼   ► government and V in the book is pushing [TS]

00:18:00 ◼   ► back against society the system [TS]

00:18:03 ◼   ► everything right he's a is an anarchist [TS]

00:18:05 ◼   ► he he wants to push back on anything and [TS]

00:18:08 ◼   ► the VA and the film is more targeted [TS]

00:18:10 ◼   ► because there is you know that there is [TS]

00:18:13 ◼   ► this the fascist regime in Britain that [TS]

00:18:16 ◼   ► he is he is specifically pushing back [TS]

00:18:18 ◼   ► against which I do think is also part of [TS]

00:18:20 ◼   ► yes being a mid-2000 film that night's [TS]

00:18:23 ◼   ► the politics that they were most that [TS]

00:18:25 ◼   ► was closest to them and therefore they [TS]

00:18:27 ◼   ► were most concerned by and also he's [TS]

00:18:29 ◼   ► pushing against the V is pushing against [TS]

00:18:33 ◼   ► two different kinds of fascism or or or [TS]

00:18:36 ◼   ► two different characterizations of [TS]

00:18:37 ◼   ► authoritarianism in the book of the film [TS]

00:18:39 ◼   ► in the book you don't have John Hurt [TS]

00:18:42 ◼   ► staring at you screaming from a [TS]

00:18:44 ◼   ► viewscreen but you just it's totally [TS]

00:18:47 ◼   ► personal in the film in a way that the [TS]

00:18:51 ◼   ► book is not it's more but it's more of a [TS]

00:18:52 ◼   ► clash of ideas kind of thing the the [TS]

00:18:55 ◼   ► leader Adam Susan in the book is much [TS]

00:18:59 ◼   ► more passive then the then Adam sutler [TS]

00:19:03 ◼   ► is in the movie and I think I happy that [TS]

00:19:06 ◼   ► I think that influences that influences [TS]

00:19:09 ◼   ► how he is played in the book and film [TS]

00:19:11 ◼   ► the reactionary elements to it like what [TS]

00:19:13 ◼   ► how they are characterizing the [TS]

00:19:14 ◼   ► quote-unquote enemy that the state [TS]

00:19:17 ◼   ► effectively it depends on the government [TS]

00:19:20 ◼   ► under which the book or the movie are [TS]

00:19:21 ◼   ► being written at the time and I think [TS]

00:19:24 ◼   ► that in the eighties it characterized so [TS]

00:19:28 ◼   ► reflected like Thatcherism and and [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► mechanism at and I think of his reaction [TS]

00:19:33 ◼   ► to that and in the two thousands we had [TS]

00:19:36 ◼   ► a bit of a different setup right little [TS]

00:19:38 ◼   ► it was a different circumstance and [TS]

00:19:42 ◼   ► certainly the plate pretty loud and [TS]

00:19:44 ◼   ► clear about like taking people away for [TS]

00:19:46 ◼   ► the ground [TS]

00:19:47 ◼   ► yeah right well but we also [TS]

00:19:49 ◼   ► understood what was to be galvanized by [TS]

00:19:52 ◼   ► certain events that happened and then we [TS]

00:19:54 ◼   ► were all right go go let's get them [TS]

00:19:57 ◼   ► let's get them kill kill kill [TS]

00:19:58 ◼   ► yeah right and so it right you know [TS]

00:20:00 ◼   ► there's this is the this is the pretext [TS]

00:20:02 ◼   ► the you know if you go back to the [TS]

00:20:04 ◼   ► Reichstag fire right it's the pretext [TS]

00:20:06 ◼   ► that allows the movement that allows the [TS]

00:20:09 ◼   ► government to become completely [TS]

00:20:10 ◼   ► authoritarian and in this case it's the [TS]

00:20:12 ◼   ► u.s. having a plague and a nuclear war [TS]

00:20:16 ◼   ► and being you know falling apart and [TS]

00:20:19 ◼   ► then we also discovered there have been [TS]

00:20:21 ◼   ► a couple attacks on British soil and [TS]

00:20:24 ◼   ► that all leads to this complete takeover [TS]

00:20:27 ◼   ► by the fascist government in in Britain [TS]

00:20:31 ◼   ► so we so we think that's the official [TS]

00:20:32 ◼   ► party line right but that's not actually [TS]

00:20:34 ◼   ► be find out we find out they cut it was [TS]

00:20:37 ◼   ► an inside job Bryce yeah right and the [TS]

00:20:41 ◼   ► one scene where you where you can see [TS]

00:20:42 ◼   ► bits of hugo weaving face it gives me it [TS]

00:20:45 ◼   ► gives me pause of those scenes because [TS]

00:20:47 ◼   ► we have we saw post 911 right that that [TS]

00:20:51 ◼   ► one of the great conspiracy theories was [TS]

00:20:52 ◼   ► it's an inside job it was all set up it [TS]

00:20:54 ◼   ► was all pretext and you know in v for [TS]

00:20:57 ◼   ► vendetta that's exactly what it is and [TS]

00:20:59 ◼   ► that that I makes me makes me pause [TS]

00:21:02 ◼   ► because that sign that kind of way of [TS]

00:21:04 ◼   ► thinking led to people down kind of [TS]

00:21:06 ◼   ► wacky fantasy rabbit hole and conducted [TS]

00:21:10 ◼   ► very introduction and here it's in the [TS]

00:21:12 ◼   ► in the plot i want to ask about John [TS]

00:21:13 ◼   ► Hurt I think the user john hurt here is [TS]

00:21:15 ◼   ► fascinating first column John Hurt [TS]

00:21:17 ◼   ► whoo-hoo as we record this just passed [TS]

00:21:19 ◼   ► away [TS]

00:21:20 ◼   ► great actor what's interesting here is [TS]

00:21:23 ◼   ► so he was Winston Smith in the movie [TS]

00:21:25 ◼   ► 1984 and it is i think no mistake about [TS]

00:21:29 ◼   ► how he's deployed here a little not only [TS]

00:21:32 ◼   ► using the character guy who was in [TS]

00:21:34 ◼   ► nineteen eighty-four but by having him [TS]

00:21:36 ◼   ► not be a person until the like last [TS]

00:21:38 ◼   ► scene but a face on a screen huge screen [TS]

00:21:43 ◼   ► I mean they really make him into big [TS]

00:21:45 ◼   ► brother that is that is absolutely the [TS]

00:21:48 ◼   ► intent is to make a sutler a big brother [TS]

00:21:51 ◼   ► figure and having a page on her who was [TS]

00:21:52 ◼   ► in nineteen eighty-four is icing on the [TS]

00:21:55 ◼   ► cake there it's hard to believe he was [TS]

00:21:57 ◼   ► Winston Smith [TS]

00:21:59 ◼   ► when his big brother I guess he learned [TS]

00:22:00 ◼   ► to love himself i I don't know something [TS]

00:22:03 ◼   ► like that hurt is is he's great he's [TS]

00:22:06 ◼   ► kind of frosting when he needs to and [TS]

00:22:07 ◼   ► shouting when he needs to but he's up [TS]

00:22:08 ◼   ► there on the screen i want to mention [TS]

00:22:10 ◼   ► that one of the most fascinating uses [TS]

00:22:12 ◼   ► have hurt in this entire thing is in the [TS]

00:22:14 ◼   ► comedy sketch on stephen Fry's suddenly [TS]

00:22:17 ◼   ► subversive comedy show that's the one [TS]

00:22:19 ◼   ► with the benny hill music with yakety [TS]

00:22:20 ◼   ► sax playing in the background they have [TS]

00:22:22 ◼   ► a they have a sutler impersonator that [TS]

00:22:25 ◼   ► they're doing this comedy sketch around [TS]

00:22:26 ◼   ► and the movie just uses John her to be [TS]

00:22:29 ◼   ► that guy which I think it's so amazing [TS]

00:22:31 ◼   ► it's like it's just john heard with like [TS]

00:22:33 ◼   ► darker facial hair and stuff but I like [TS]

00:22:35 ◼   ► pancake wife like ask somebody to look [TS]

00:22:38 ◼   ► like John heard in a comedy sketch when [TS]

00:22:41 ◼   ► you can just have John Hurt bv excellent [TS]

00:22:44 ◼   ► impersonation of Joan Harris one of the [TS]

00:22:48 ◼   ► reasons i love this movie is that and [TS]

00:22:51 ◼   ► and one of the reasons i was considering [TS]

00:22:52 ◼   ► be as a good imaginary figment we see a [TS]

00:22:57 ◼   ► scene where a young girl who's been [TS]

00:22:59 ◼   ► spray-painting like she's been following [TS]

00:23:01 ◼   ► the v story since the beginning like in [TS]

00:23:04 ◼   ► like the second scene but he's being [TS]

00:23:06 ◼   ► seen spray-painting the TV logo we see [TS]

00:23:09 ◼   ► her get shot and then we see her in the [TS]

00:23:12 ◼   ► final scene [TS]

00:23:13 ◼   ► yes as they all take off their masks and [TS]

00:23:15 ◼   ► there's people that we know to be dead [TS]

00:23:17 ◼   ► there [TS]

00:23:18 ◼   ► yes open love held non-literal the movie [TS]

00:23:21 ◼   ► is and that's why i love the idea that's [TS]

00:23:24 ◼   ► like this is this is conceptual there's [TS]

00:23:27 ◼   ► there's a lot of reality to the fellow [TS]

00:23:29 ◼   ► right like alive to the camera shots [TS]

00:23:31 ◼   ► that they deliberately have day they [TS]

00:23:33 ◼   ► make a real point to pull the camera [TS]

00:23:35 ◼   ► back and have these slow shots around [TS]

00:23:37 ◼   ► people's faces to just show the reacting [TS]

00:23:40 ◼   ► to it and the way the movie is i edited [TS]

00:23:43 ◼   ► in a nonlinear way we're just is [TS]

00:23:45 ◼   ► constantly bringing back these themes [TS]

00:23:48 ◼   ► from the past like running through the [TS]

00:23:50 ◼   ► series of events it is very much [TS]

00:23:52 ◼   ► constructed to be a very surreal i think [TS]

00:23:56 ◼   ► it's it's what makes this very different [TS]

00:23:58 ◼   ► than any other which house key project [TS]

00:24:01 ◼   ► right like it'sit's um it's like a dream [TS]

00:24:04 ◼   ► it really is i find it's I mean out of [TS]

00:24:06 ◼   ► all this stuff done this this is way up [TS]

00:24:09 ◼   ► there like why is Vee sitting up all [TS]

00:24:11 ◼   ► is dominos not amazing but it looks [TS]

00:24:14 ◼   ► awesome though so he does it had access [TS]

00:24:16 ◼   ► your time to make his low yeah and [TS]

00:24:18 ◼   ► Domino yeah yer yeah it doesn't matter [TS]

00:24:21 ◼   ► it looks awesome [TS]

00:24:22 ◼   ► you don't question it nice work and has [TS]

00:24:25 ◼   ► one left standing which oh yeah I've got [TS]

00:24:27 ◼   ► to go let Eevee like decided to let the [TS]

00:24:30 ◼   ► train go not its is this like one of the [TS]

00:24:35 ◼   ► best lines of movie is it artists use [TS]

00:24:37 ◼   ► lies to tell the truth [TS]

00:24:39 ◼   ► this movie is a slice don't do it and [TS]

00:24:43 ◼   ► and it's very aware of it i think the [TS]

00:24:45 ◼   ► comic book did the same thing and I i [TS]

00:24:48 ◼   ► really respect it's it's constructed [TS]

00:24:51 ◼   ► incredibly well way so a much lesser [TS]

00:24:54 ◼   ► movie would show those faces in the [TS]

00:24:59 ◼   ► crowd at the end and juxtapose them like [TS]

00:25:03 ◼   ► with a black-and-white shot of their [TS]

00:25:05 ◼   ► appearance previously you make you [TS]

00:25:07 ◼   ► wonder like what you can remember this [TS]

00:25:10 ◼   ► like this movie doesn't even want out [TS]

00:25:12 ◼   ► like i don't think it even cares if you [TS]

00:25:14 ◼   ► realize that those people are I think [TS]

00:25:15 ◼   ► it's just bonus points if you do if you [TS]

00:25:17 ◼   ► see you see the girl there you see a [TS]

00:25:21 ◼   ► gallery there right yeah yeah we see [TS]

00:25:23 ◼   ► Stephen Fry you see Stephen Fry there [TS]

00:25:25 ◼   ► exactly right that these people we know [TS]

00:25:27 ◼   ► to be dead but they're uh they're in the [TS]

00:25:31 ◼   ► crowd at the at the end and i like that [TS]

00:25:34 ◼   ► i really like how Valerie is treated [TS]

00:25:36 ◼   ► throughout the film because one of the [TS]

00:25:38 ◼   ► things that we see is the first time we [TS]

00:25:40 ◼   ► see her [TS]

00:25:41 ◼   ► it's in a flashback from the the test [TS]

00:25:44 ◼   ► grounds at Larkhill where be like [TS]

00:25:47 ◼   ► experimented on right and we see her [TS]

00:25:49 ◼   ► just as a random victim contestants [TS]

00:25:52 ◼   ► alignment [TS]

00:25:53 ◼   ► oh yeah we see her alive in a line and [TS]

00:25:56 ◼   ► then we see her dead in the pit and then [TS]

00:25:59 ◼   ► we get her flash back later and then we [TS]

00:26:02 ◼   ► also see her face at the end and it's [TS]

00:26:04 ◼   ► haunting because you know the movie is [TS]

00:26:06 ◼   ► not trying to tell us anything literally [TS]

00:26:07 ◼   ► at the end I feel like I feel like [TS]

00:26:09 ◼   ► that's just a reminder of these are the [TS]

00:26:12 ◼   ► you know these are also people and you [TS]

00:26:15 ◼   ► judge it they're not ghosts they're not [TS]

00:26:17 ◼   ► you know they're not anything they are [TS]

00:26:19 ◼   ► the people who are triumphing their part [TS]

00:26:23 ◼   ► of the group of people who are now [TS]

00:26:24 ◼   ► trying things [TS]

00:26:24 ◼   ► over this this terrible regime that's [TS]

00:26:27 ◼   ► all I i think it's it's a real call to [TS]

00:26:30 ◼   ► action at the end I think it's something [TS]

00:26:32 ◼   ► we should all do very well to remember [TS]

00:26:35 ◼   ► today like it goes for people that gave [TS]

00:26:38 ◼   ► their lives to get to that point it's [TS]

00:26:41 ◼   ► showing these are all people that stood [TS]

00:26:43 ◼   ► up that did what they could some played [TS]

00:26:46 ◼   ► small part some point very large parts [TS]

00:26:48 ◼   ► but it's all part of what led to this [TS]

00:26:50 ◼   ► and I think that is the the extremely [TS]

00:26:53 ◼   ► moving message at the end of it and [TS]

00:26:55 ◼   ► Jason I have to say it's like we [TS]

00:26:57 ◼   ► mentioned Valerie that whole subplot I [TS]

00:27:00 ◼   ► cannot watch it right now just breaking [TS]

00:27:02 ◼   ► down like I tried tonight I tried [TS]

00:27:05 ◼   ► watching you tonight and the quote they [TS]

00:27:07 ◼   ► say the beginning the shoulders from [TS]

00:27:08 ◼   ► that you know roses for three years and [TS]

00:27:11 ◼   ► Apollo is no one like you to fellate [TS]

00:27:13 ◼   ► what a beautiful scent and structurally [TS]

00:27:15 ◼   ► I mean not only is it amazingly [TS]

00:27:17 ◼   ► beautiful but structurally and it like [TS]

00:27:19 ◼   ► this in the comic to write but you could [TS]

00:27:21 ◼   ► do it in a comic I feel like butt in a [TS]

00:27:22 ◼   ► in a a motion picture with a lot of [TS]

00:27:24 ◼   ► action and a huge budget right the movie [TS]

00:27:26 ◼   ► stops to tell her story it's like a [TS]

00:27:29 ◼   ► little anthology short story inside this [TS]

00:27:33 ◼   ► other movie and you know it's [TS]

00:27:35 ◼   ► interleaved a little bit where he is is [TS]

00:27:37 ◼   ► being processed and tortured and and [TS]

00:27:39 ◼   ► then going back to her cell and reading [TS]

00:27:40 ◼   ► a little bit more so they try to but but [TS]

00:27:42 ◼   ► essentially that segment of the movie is [TS]

00:27:44 ◼   ► about Valerie's story that's what it's [TS]

00:27:46 ◼   ► about 90 right in the middle of the [TS]

00:27:48 ◼   ► movie [TS]

00:27:48 ◼   ► yeah right dead center if it weren't for [TS]

00:27:51 ◼   ► that segment of the movie i would [TS]

00:27:54 ◼   ► consider this movie irredeemable oh ok [TS]

00:27:58 ◼   ► irredeemable because i have some I have [TS]

00:28:02 ◼   ► real problems in both the comic and the [TS]

00:28:03 ◼   ► movie i have real problems with what V [TS]

00:28:06 ◼   ► does TV [TS]

00:28:08 ◼   ► oh god yeah oh yes mmm I grout queer [TS]

00:28:11 ◼   ► Mississippi right like it's that's [TS]

00:28:13 ◼   ► playing on hard but right it's stuck [TS]

00:28:15 ◼   ► you know the the whole scene with [TS]

00:28:17 ◼   ► Valerie where she is you know these are [TS]

00:28:20 ◼   ► the fears that every single queer person [TS]

00:28:23 ◼   ► you know all the real Jew house on a [TS]

00:28:26 ◼   ► very very deep level and it is so [TS]

00:28:29 ◼   ► movingly done and I just I cannot watch [TS]

00:28:32 ◼   ► this entire scene without just breaking [TS]

00:28:36 ◼   ► down dirty crying [TS]

00:28:38 ◼   ► like I was on a plane at last time I saw [TS]

00:28:40 ◼   ► this like I'm in first class and just [TS]

00:28:43 ◼   ► weeping everybody's there staring at me [TS]

00:28:45 ◼   ► because it's so emotionally done so i [TS]

00:28:49 ◼   ► just don't I know I I I feel like [TS]

00:28:53 ◼   ► there's so much wider meaning there in [TS]

00:28:57 ◼   ► her death and you know the fact that [TS]

00:28:59 ◼   ► dies given to natalie portman then push [TS]

00:29:02 ◼   ► her on to the next level I just think [TS]

00:29:04 ◼   ► it's brilliantly done and it's really [TS]

00:29:06 ◼   ► important that it is a real story it is [TS]

00:29:09 ◼   ► the real story that right v received in [TS]

00:29:13 ◼   ► his cell that he didn't just manufacture [TS]

00:29:16 ◼   ► it for v's benefit that's also vitally [TS]

00:29:19 ◼   ► important I don't know if that matters [TS]

00:29:21 ◼   ► and i think that's part of it in the [TS]

00:29:22 ◼   ► middle of story is that he does tell EV [TS]

00:29:28 ◼   ► first of all these names are pretty much [TS]

00:29:30 ◼   ► dead giveaway that like none of this is [TS]

00:29:33 ◼   ► personal [TS]

00:29:33 ◼   ► vite lzv the valerie no was was real and [TS]

00:29:39 ◼   ► destroy Israel and it wasn't fabricated [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► but doesn't matter that like all I'm [TS]

00:29:45 ◼   ► thinking is to tell it using using light [TS]

00:29:48 ◼   ► has to tell the truth is literally a [TS]

00:29:51 ◼   ► theme of this [TS]

00:29:52 ◼   ► yeah but if it wasn't true that really i [TS]

00:29:55 ◼   ► think that would have sunk us visually [TS]

00:29:58 ◼   ► and this day the testing open to the um [TS]

00:30:02 ◼   ► I am I am open to the idea that v is [TS]

00:30:05 ◼   ► Valley and that she didn't die in person [TS]

00:30:08 ◼   ► and it she went on to become v well [TS]

00:30:10 ◼   ► either either way that I mean the [TS]

00:30:11 ◼   ► argument of a lark hill is that I feel [TS]

00:30:13 ◼   ► like as much as V is a I mean he's many [TS]

00:30:17 ◼   ► things here if he is a revolutionary the [TS]

00:30:19 ◼   ► is a victim v is a superhero kind of [TS]

00:30:25 ◼   ► because he basically gets powers [TS]

00:30:27 ◼   ► I mean there is Alan Moore is absolutely [TS]

00:30:30 ◼   ► commenting on some of the and using some [TS]

00:30:32 ◼   ► of the tropes of superheroes in this not [TS]

00:30:35 ◼   ► superhero comic that way but one thing v [TS]

00:30:39 ◼   ► is also is V is the only survivor of a [TS]

00:30:43 ◼   ► program that killed everybody else and [TS]

00:30:45 ◼   ► he wears his guilt of being the only [TS]

00:30:48 ◼   ► survivor and his responsibility for [TS]

00:30:50 ◼   ► everyone who didn't survive as the [TS]

00:30:53 ◼   ► person who speaks for them whether he's [TS]

00:30:55 ◼   ► representing Valerie or not he you know [TS]

00:30:59 ◼   ► it mean he he he could be Valerie or you [TS]

00:31:01 ◼   ► cannot be Valerie guy based on your [TS]

00:31:03 ◼   ► theory but it doesn't matter because he [TS]

00:31:04 ◼   ► represents her I think he stopped being [TS]

00:31:06 ◼   ► a person and he started being V and yeah [TS]

00:31:09 ◼   ► he admit as much yeah yeah yeah he does [TS]

00:31:12 ◼   ► your right now [TS]

00:31:13 ◼   ► yeah the the valerie segment is is is [TS]

00:31:16 ◼   ► fantastic think about also when we see [TS]

00:31:17 ◼   ► Eevee reading the story and in the film [TS]

00:31:19 ◼   ► we think the chain goes Valerie to EV [TS]

00:31:23 ◼   ► that Valerie is inspiring EV perhaps to [TS]

00:31:25 ◼   ► do something you know it better and make [TS]

00:31:27 ◼   ► that decision what we learned later is [TS]

00:31:30 ◼   ► that the chain actually goes from [TS]

00:31:31 ◼   ► Valerie 2v2 EV because my galleries [TS]

00:31:34 ◼   ► letter inspired v he's the one who was [TS]

00:31:37 ◼   ► first inspired by it so that changes [TS]

00:31:39 ◼   ► longer she and he's replaying it for her [TS]

00:31:41 ◼   ► because he basically wants to make her [TS]

00:31:43 ◼   ► like him [TS]

00:31:43 ◼   ► yeah yeah in all the parallels of V + DV [TS]

00:31:46 ◼   ► name aside that is my favorite moment [TS]

00:31:49 ◼   ► because a valerie comes in at the most [TS]

00:31:52 ◼   ► bleak moment in the movie interleaf so [TS]

00:31:55 ◼   ► perfectly to give a little bit of levity [TS]

00:31:56 ◼   ► and beauty in the middle of this [TS]

00:31:59 ◼   ► extremely dark bleak terrible torture [TS]

00:32:01 ◼   ► scene and they they try that in watching [TS]

00:32:04 ◼   ► the details the black freighter it [TS]

00:32:05 ◼   ► failed miserably but it works really [TS]

00:32:07 ◼   ► well here and then I i have so many [TS]

00:32:10 ◼   ► problems with EV and v's relationship [TS]

00:32:13 ◼   ► but where the parallels between the two [TS]

00:32:16 ◼   ► of them and the moment when he goes [TS]

00:32:20 ◼   ► outside and finally evolved into a [TS]

00:32:22 ◼   ► Vaporeon in the rain that woman to come [TS]

00:32:24 ◼   ► back and forth with love the [TS]

00:32:29 ◼   ► uncomfortable that very very blatantly [TS]

00:32:34 ◼   ► obvious moment come back and forth with [TS]

00:32:36 ◼   ► the rising from the flames gives the EV [TS]

00:32:39 ◼   ► something that she didn't have before [TS]

00:32:42 ◼   ► but I don't think it comes to as full of [TS]

00:32:45 ◼   ► a point as these artists at the end of [TS]

00:32:47 ◼   ► movie they have been completely [TS]

00:32:48 ◼   ► different arcs and I've problem with the [TS]

00:32:50 ◼   ► love that she has for him but Evie at [TS]

00:32:52 ◼   ► least has some kind of different art [TS]

00:32:54 ◼   ► based on her rise to power in the rain [TS]

00:32:57 ◼   ► the movie tree TV better than the book [TS]

00:33:00 ◼   ► does oh yeah that's the plan [TS]

00:33:02 ◼   ► the book is it's just [TS]

00:33:04 ◼   ► the book just bothers me so much it is a [TS]

00:33:07 ◼   ► cult programming that the subjects [TS]

00:33:10 ◼   ► trapped and in fact you could argue that [TS]

00:33:12 ◼   ► the way she's introduced in a movie soft [TS]

00:33:14 ◼   ► petals this to it's very much like v [TS]

00:33:17 ◼   ► plucked a teen prostitute off the street [TS]

00:33:19 ◼   ► because she had her life was essentially [TS]

00:33:21 ◼   ► worthless and she wouldn't be missed in [TS]

00:33:23 ◼   ► order to program her to be what he [TS]

00:33:24 ◼   ► wanted her to be mean that is that is [TS]

00:33:26 ◼   ► some of that again is the structures in [TS]

00:33:28 ◼   ► the movie but in the book it's just [TS]

00:33:30 ◼   ► that's what it is right if you look at [TS]

00:33:32 ◼   ► the chow skis were generally speaking [TS]

00:33:34 ◼   ► like you can go into balance and there [TS]

00:33:36 ◼   ► are a few things their rates pretty [TS]

00:33:37 ◼   ► freaking high on the feminist meter oh [TS]

00:33:39 ◼   ► yeah you know they tweaked a few things [TS]

00:33:42 ◼   ► yeah they did turn her from me no [TS]

00:33:44 ◼   ► prostitute with someone that works at a [TS]

00:33:48 ◼   ► TV station absolutely important royal [TS]

00:33:51 ◼   ► you know she has agency all the way all [TS]

00:33:53 ◼   ► the way through so i just feel like this [TS]

00:33:56 ◼   ► is a good point to take a beat and say [TS]

00:33:58 ◼   ► in the goal of feminist critique of [TS]

00:34:01 ◼   ► media isn't saying you can't have things [TS]

00:34:04 ◼   ► happened women that are abysmal like is [TS]

00:34:06 ◼   ► its name saying you can't have rape [TS]

00:34:08 ◼   ► scenes you know it's saying you can't [TS]

00:34:10 ◼   ► think be more conscious about the [TS]

00:34:13 ◼   ► choices that you make and I have no [TS]

00:34:15 ◼   ► problem with anything that happens to [TS]

00:34:17 ◼   ► even in this film even though it is very [TS]

00:34:19 ◼   ► horrible because it's not trying to sell [TS]

00:34:22 ◼   ► v is like a Disney hero he's not this is [TS]

00:34:27 ◼   ► a wildly complicated movie and I i just [TS]

00:34:30 ◼   ► think that that really feeds into right [TS]

00:34:33 ◼   ► now and i'm gonna get a little bit [TS]

00:34:34 ◼   ► political i see people on the Left [TS]

00:34:36 ◼   ► people I respect really bearing system [TS]

00:34:39 ◼   ► some territory talk about violence [TS]

00:34:42 ◼   ► towards people with different political [TS]

00:34:45 ◼   ► views in a way that makes me wildly [TS]

00:34:47 ◼   ► uncomfortable so I think this this [TS]

00:34:50 ◼   ► message at the core of it of the really [TS]

00:34:52 ◼   ► being turned into a monster of e [TS]

00:34:55 ◼   ► becoming someone who goes too far [TS]

00:34:58 ◼   ► I think that's a message that people [TS]

00:35:00 ◼   ► would do very well to hear today [TS]

00:35:02 ◼   ► that's a really good point and also in [TS]

00:35:04 ◼   ► the movie compared to the book the [TS]

00:35:06 ◼   ► Wachowskis give EV so much more agency [TS]

00:35:08 ◼   ► on in the book VIII basically [TS]

00:35:11 ◼   ► brainwashing sir [TS]

00:35:12 ◼   ► yeah and she goes along and keeps doing [TS]

00:35:15 ◼   ► her thing in the movie [TS]

00:35:17 ◼   ► Evie actually leaves that she doesn't [TS]

00:35:20 ◼   ► come back into the end she she has been [TS]

00:35:22 ◼   ► she has been transformed by her [TS]

00:35:24 ◼   ► experience she can take some strength [TS]

00:35:27 ◼   ► from it but it's also something that she [TS]

00:35:30 ◼   ► can't abide at least for now and she [TS]

00:35:33 ◼   ► leaves and she chooses to come back [TS]

00:35:36 ◼   ► later she gets it [TS]

00:35:38 ◼   ► it's a much stronger character i think [TS]

00:35:40 ◼   ► given the fact that we still got the [TS]

00:35:42 ◼   ► bones of the torturing her [TS]

00:35:46 ◼   ► who's the hero of this movie so easy [TS]

00:35:48 ◼   ► even yeah definitely i agree with [TS]

00:35:50 ◼   ► everything you said guy but i still have [TS]

00:35:52 ◼   ► massive problems with the gas lighting [TS]

00:35:53 ◼   ► that V gives her in that know this was [TS]

00:35:56 ◼   ► your choice you're the one that wanted [TS]

00:35:57 ◼   ► to stay because you didn't give up any [TS]

00:35:59 ◼   ► information about me this was you [TS]

00:36:01 ◼   ► well Ivy to be perfectly frank I think [TS]

00:36:04 ◼   ► he's a bad guy didn't guy kills a lot of [TS]

00:36:07 ◼   ► people [TS]

00:36:07 ◼   ► the guy's a terrorist somebody knows [TS]

00:36:09 ◼   ► he's a monster he he doesn't and he [TS]

00:36:11 ◼   ► admits to being that the only good thing [TS]

00:36:13 ◼   ► you did like i said previously is that [TS]

00:36:14 ◼   ► he let Eevee decide whether or not to [TS]

00:36:17 ◼   ► send that train there is a really [TS]

00:36:19 ◼   ► interesting moment where and they it's [TS]

00:36:23 ◼   ► fascinating i I don't know if I noticed [TS]

00:36:25 ◼   ► it before but i really noticed that this [TS]

00:36:26 ◼   ► time v hopes that when he reveals that [TS]

00:36:30 ◼   ► it's him to EV that she will basically [TS]

00:36:33 ◼   ► love him for it and yet it because he [TS]

00:36:36 ◼   ► says he says as she's going through this [TS]

00:36:39 ◼   ► he's like I wonder if you might dance [TS]

00:36:40 ◼   ► with me like he says that he doesn't [TS]

00:36:42 ◼   ► just say it went later when she comes [TS]

00:36:44 ◼   ► back and they dance [TS]

00:36:45 ◼   ► he says that right when she gets out and [TS]

00:36:47 ◼   ► she's she doesn't even respond to it [TS]

00:36:49 ◼   ► she's just like I am getting out of here [TS]

00:36:50 ◼   ► and he's like yeah well that's yeah I [TS]

00:36:52 ◼   ► figured that you might but he but no he [TS]

00:36:54 ◼   ► actually holds out hope that he will [TS]

00:36:56 ◼   ► have like magically transform which i [TS]

00:36:58 ◼   ► think is interesting because it's the [TS]

00:36:59 ◼   ► characters weakness is that he you know [TS]

00:37:01 ◼   ► he believes things that are going to [TS]

00:37:04 ◼   ► come out of what he did that are [TS]

00:37:05 ◼   ► completely unrealistic i think it is the [TS]

00:37:07 ◼   ► thing that redeems this movie I because [TS]

00:37:10 ◼   ► of that because of her reaction the fact [TS]

00:37:12 ◼   ► that she's allowed to leave and go [TS]

00:37:13 ◼   ► somewhere else and take care of herself [TS]

00:37:15 ◼   ► and and just she just steps away and and [TS]

00:37:19 ◼   ► he doesn't help her or anything she [TS]

00:37:21 ◼   ► finds her own way but that said I it [TS]

00:37:24 ◼   ► gives me a little pause only because the [TS]

00:37:26 ◼   ► structure of it is that we're supposed [TS]

00:37:28 ◼   ► to think he's a hero and I know he's not [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► here [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► around here but like it still gives me [TS]

00:37:34 ◼   ► pause that this character that we've [TS]

00:37:35 ◼   ► kind of been rooting for does this [TS]

00:37:37 ◼   ► terrible thing also just replied [TS]

00:37:39 ◼   ► practical standpoint the way the movie [TS]

00:37:41 ◼   ► is shot all of the scenes where Eevee is [TS]

00:37:44 ◼   ► being captured and tortured and all that [TS]

00:37:47 ◼   ► you can't tell whether those people are [TS]

00:37:50 ◼   ► real or anything like that and and so [TS]

00:37:54 ◼   ► there's that reveal I do kind of have a [TS]

00:37:57 ◼   ► very hard time with those scenes because [TS]

00:37:59 ◼   ► you know those are the shots that we see [TS]

00:38:02 ◼   ► but she's living at the whole time she [TS]

00:38:04 ◼   ► has to be taken from room to room by [TS]

00:38:06 ◼   ► people and sat down and things like that [TS]

00:38:08 ◼   ► and I don't really believe that one guy [TS]

00:38:11 ◼   ► in a various with mannequins and some [TS]

00:38:13 ◼   ► masks could really pull that off is in [TS]

00:38:16 ◼   ► this makes sense because he's chinese [TS]

00:38:18 ◼   ► cutting off your hair and stuff and when [TS]

00:38:20 ◼   ► clearly you know this is this is why I [TS]

00:38:22 ◼   ► think he's more of an idea i think she's [TS]

00:38:24 ◼   ► tortured by the idea of freedom in my [TS]

00:38:27 ◼   ► head candidates he has some interns who [TS]

00:38:30 ◼   ► we never see but they are there to help [TS]

00:38:32 ◼   ► him with his in prison experiment maybe [TS]

00:38:34 ◼   ► maybe also purchased a hundred [TS]

00:38:36 ◼   ► thousand-plus guy fawkes suits for the [TS]

00:38:39 ◼   ► entire yeah that there's some economic [TS]

00:38:43 ◼   ► haha i accept the absurdity and D it's [TS]

00:38:46 ◼   ► not a literal movie it's a movie about [TS]

00:38:49 ◼   ► ideas and when v is torturing her [TS]

00:38:52 ◼   ► it's awful I it's also a movie and sure [TS]

00:38:58 ◼   ► is it is like he is telling the truth I [TS]

00:39:01 ◼   ► think she's being tortured by an idea [TS]

00:39:03 ◼   ► and you could argue argue in a situation [TS]

00:39:05 ◼   ► like that where being tortured that it's [TS]

00:39:06 ◼   ► all hallucinatory anyway right i mean [TS]

00:39:08 ◼   ► that that she doesn't have to make sense [TS]

00:39:10 ◼   ► because who knows what she saw or what [TS]

00:39:12 ◼   ► she understood she may have it may have [TS]

00:39:14 ◼   ► not been that great an artifice but she [TS]

00:39:16 ◼   ► was so confused and messed up that [TS]

00:39:17 ◼   ► there's that chic believed that it was [TS]

00:39:20 ◼   ► because that was the story she was being [TS]

00:39:21 ◼   ► told i can I kind of accept that and [TS]

00:39:23 ◼   ► that we're sort of seeing it through her [TS]

00:39:25 ◼   ► is because we pause though cuz i think [TS]

00:39:27 ◼   ► really i mean he's good but is he that [TS]

00:39:29 ◼   ► good a little late so I don't remember [TS]

00:39:31 ◼   ► the first time I saw this movie and at [TS]

00:39:33 ◼   ► the end [TS]

00:39:34 ◼   ► really at the end when people start [TS]

00:39:37 ◼   ► taking off the masks [TS]

00:39:38 ◼   ► I sort of understood like this movie [TS]

00:39:41 ◼   ► should not be taken literally literally [TS]

00:39:43 ◼   ► ran it should be taken as move almost [TS]

00:39:46 ◼   ► metaphorically [TS]

00:39:47 ◼   ► yeah i just can't go that far yeah I [TS]

00:39:50 ◼   ► know I know it's hard because I've [TS]

00:39:52 ◼   ► watched it again just tonight and I was [TS]

00:39:54 ◼   ► like this is he's a bad guy [TS]

00:39:57 ◼   ► it's hard yeah it's all the [TS]

00:39:58 ◼   ► quote-unquote hero is an awful person [TS]

00:40:01 ◼   ► the story's all the TV every time i [TS]

00:40:03 ◼   ► watch this I waffle back and forth [TS]

00:40:05 ◼   ► between whether or not the ending works [TS]

00:40:06 ◼   ► for me or doesn't work for me because [TS]

00:40:08 ◼   ► sometimes it just gets a little too [TS]

00:40:11 ◼   ► close to magical realism with all the [TS]

00:40:12 ◼   ► dead people coming back at the end but [TS]

00:40:14 ◼   ► tonight it worked for me i thought i was [TS]

00:40:16 ◼   ► a sweet moment even though like we're [TS]

00:40:17 ◼   ► celebrating a terrorist blowing up [TS]

00:40:19 ◼   ► Parliament it was a weird moment from [TS]

00:40:20 ◼   ► yeah obviously nobody blow up Parliament [TS]

00:40:23 ◼   ► but at the same time maybe maybe there's [TS]

00:40:26 ◼   ► a cause out there in the world you're [TS]

00:40:27 ◼   ► upset about having a giant rally is [TS]

00:40:30 ◼   ► probably something you should think [TS]

00:40:33 ◼   ► about well even like you know i would [TS]

00:40:34 ◼   ► say in America I have grown up with [TS]

00:40:37 ◼   ► always seeing these big crowds all by [TS]

00:40:40 ◼   ► most recently but it's always been [TS]

00:40:44 ◼   ► somewhere else it's always been outside [TS]

00:40:47 ◼   ► the US where you see crowds gathering in [TS]

00:40:49 ◼   ► streets [TS]

00:40:50 ◼   ► I mean I'm just I've never seen it like [TS]

00:40:52 ◼   ► where we've stood up on something and [TS]

00:40:55 ◼   ► actually taken to the streets it always [TS]

00:40:57 ◼   ► seems like it happened somewhere else [TS]

00:40:59 ◼   ► this movie brings up a lot of ethical [TS]

00:41:02 ◼   ► conflict right because i like a lot of [TS]

00:41:04 ◼   ► people and thinking what the frak can I [TS]

00:41:06 ◼   ► do I am somebody's choosing to work [TS]

00:41:08 ◼   ► within the system right as much as I can [TS]

00:41:11 ◼   ► and hope that that's how we can bring [TS]

00:41:13 ◼   ► about change but you know it takes all [TS]

00:41:17 ◼   ► kinds of young people know yeah I don't [TS]

00:41:19 ◼   ► advocate violence at all i think that's [TS]

00:41:22 ◼   ► the moment that we've really crossed a [TS]

00:41:24 ◼   ► line in America but I think like crowds [TS]

00:41:27 ◼   ► going outside and demonstrating I see [TS]

00:41:29 ◼   ► this film is being really a reboot of a [TS]

00:41:32 ◼   ► kind of anger fantasy from like a white [TS]

00:41:36 ◼   ► male libertarian dude and I see it [TS]

00:41:39 ◼   ► really turned into you from a fairly [TS]

00:41:42 ◼   ► clear cast our fair [TS]

00:41:44 ◼   ► a quitter set of riders and really [TS]

00:41:46 ◼   ► turned into a really modern story about [TS]

00:41:50 ◼   ► oppression systematic oppression so I i [TS]

00:41:53 ◼   ► just think that it's it's a very very [TS]

00:41:56 ◼   ► deep story about you what's going on [TS]

00:41:59 ◼   ► right now and i also have to say I think [TS]

00:42:01 ◼   ► part of that change is why there were [TS]

00:42:05 ◼   ► some of those reviewers that weren't [TS]

00:42:07 ◼   ► pleased with this interpretation other [TS]

00:42:09 ◼   ► because it's it's crossing this thing [TS]

00:42:13 ◼   ► this made for them and they're casting [TS]

00:42:15 ◼   ► it wider and that upsets people that's a [TS]

00:42:18 ◼   ► really good point i'm not surprised that [TS]

00:42:20 ◼   ► the v mask has been co-opted in the way [TS]

00:42:22 ◼   ► that has yeah yeah yeah totally i have a [TS]

00:42:25 ◼   ► question about the voltage these [TS]

00:42:26 ◼   ► specific terrorist violence here because [TS]

00:42:29 ◼   ► i think it goes to what we were saying [TS]

00:42:30 ◼   ► about v being a bad guy and we see him [TS]

00:42:32 ◼   ► torture EV and you know she's right to [TS]

00:42:35 ◼   ► basically take her life into her own [TS]

00:42:37 ◼   ► hands at that point but you know bottom [TS]

00:42:40 ◼   ► line is he blows up the old bailey and [TS]

00:42:42 ◼   ► he blows a parliament that beginning of [TS]

00:42:44 ◼   ► the end he has her hehe provides her [TS]

00:42:45 ◼   ► with the opportunity to blow up [TS]

00:42:47 ◼   ► Parliament and I i think you know i am [TS]

00:42:50 ◼   ► of two minds about that were sometimes I [TS]

00:42:51 ◼   ► think that because vs is a difficult [TS]

00:42:55 ◼   ► character and we're not supposed to root [TS]

00:42:57 ◼   ► for everything he does that him him [TS]

00:42:59 ◼   ► being violent like that is ok or that [TS]

00:43:02 ◼   ► this situation is perhaps so extreme [TS]

00:43:04 ◼   ► that is what is required and the other [TS]

00:43:06 ◼   ► part of me thinks I don't know if I want [TS]

00:43:08 ◼   ► to root for the people who were blowing [TS]

00:43:10 ◼   ► up buildings even if there is late at [TS]

00:43:12 ◼   ► night and they have defended enough [TS]

00:43:14 ◼   ► words late at night and it's probably [TS]

00:43:15 ◼   ► nobody there and there are pretty [TS]

00:43:16 ◼   ► fireworks and music to go yeah i mean [TS]

00:43:18 ◼   ► obviously blowing up a federal building [TS]

00:43:20 ◼   ► do not do that also do like that no i [TS]

00:43:23 ◼   ► will not only really hate you for that [TS]

00:43:25 ◼   ► yeah yeah I'm the old Billy food those [TS]

00:43:29 ◼   ► not familiar is sort of the main [TS]

00:43:31 ◼   ► courthouse in London it's it's [TS]

00:43:33 ◼   ► old-school old-school justice [TS]

00:43:35 ◼   ► yeah that's where the statue on the time [TS]

00:43:37 ◼   ► but usually what that stands for ya [TS]

00:43:39 ◼   ► so in taking that out first in the book [TS]

00:43:42 ◼   ► by the way target yeah he blows up he [TS]

00:43:44 ◼   ► blows up he blows up to the Parliament [TS]

00:43:46 ◼   ► at the beginning on on the 15 november [TS]

00:43:49 ◼   ► and then the last thing that gets blown [TS]

00:43:51 ◼   ► up is number ten Downing Street actually [TS]

00:43:53 ◼   ► at the very end so yeah [TS]

00:43:55 ◼   ► move that stuff around i think also [TS]

00:43:57 ◼   ► smartly attitude that gets the old [TS]

00:43:59 ◼   ► bailey in the middle somewhere right I [TS]

00:44:00 ◼   ► guess I'm willing to give it a break [TS]

00:44:02 ◼   ► because it is a movie I don't think it's [TS]

00:44:04 ◼   ► literally calling for violence [TS]

00:44:06 ◼   ► no he also tells him that he's gonna [TS]

00:44:08 ◼   ► blow stuff up and he blows up the Bailey [TS]

00:44:09 ◼   ► at midnight which is not right [TS]

00:44:12 ◼   ► I i like to think that he wasn't killing [TS]

00:44:13 ◼   ► people because we see him well she was [TS]

00:44:16 ◼   ► so anyway tax a TV station [TS]

00:44:19 ◼   ► he'll he murders a lot of cops oh yeah [TS]

00:44:22 ◼   ► but he doesn't murder all of those [TS]

00:44:24 ◼   ► civilians who just happened to know even [TS]

00:44:26 ◼   ► the guy with the ball is in his mouth [TS]

00:44:28 ◼   ► right yeah he leaves that guy there you [TS]

00:44:30 ◼   ► know he'll try to think that the cops [TS]

00:44:32 ◼   ► are gonna show the guy that shoot the [TS]

00:44:33 ◼   ► guys that are just as him but like he's [TS]

00:44:37 ◼   ► got he's got some kind of restraint [TS]

00:44:39 ◼   ► there are only really two major like [TS]

00:44:42 ◼   ► action scenes where you get the quote [TS]

00:44:44 ◼   ► superhero effect at the end at it is [TS]

00:44:48 ◼   ► near his demise and when he begins his [TS]

00:44:51 ◼   ► brigade at the TV station which I you [TS]

00:44:55 ◼   ► know in in watching it a couple times [TS]

00:44:57 ◼   ► watched last week and I watched today it [TS]

00:45:00 ◼   ► was really weird seeing the lack of [TS]

00:45:03 ◼   ► action after seeing so many Marvel and [TS]

00:45:07 ◼   ► DC movies since then like it was weird [TS]

00:45:11 ◼   ► to see a movie that was I i use this [TS]

00:45:14 ◼   ► very very tentatively but a cerebral [TS]

00:45:18 ◼   ► movie that quote is superheroes [TS]

00:45:21 ◼   ► there's a lot of action like the first [TS]

00:45:22 ◼   ► 30 minutes and then it really shifts [TS]

00:45:25 ◼   ► gears and there isn't a lot until later [TS]

00:45:28 ◼   ► yeah I think of it as more of a dramatic [TS]

00:45:30 ◼   ► movie than an action movie yeah [TS]

00:45:32 ◼   ► definitely I feel like the Cherokees [TS]

00:45:34 ◼   ► know that people buy tickets to go see [TS]

00:45:35 ◼   ► action so that you know you get some [TS]

00:45:39 ◼   ► action but this was not an action movie [TS]

00:45:41 ◼   ► it you know who's got the incredibly [TS]

00:45:44 ◼   ► personal violence of all the [TS]

00:45:46 ◼   ► high-profile deaths in the middle where [TS]

00:45:48 ◼   ► v comes in almost like a suspense horror [TS]

00:45:50 ◼   ► movie at times and it offers a few [TS]

00:45:53 ◼   ► people one by one in very tense ways and [TS]

00:45:55 ◼   ► it's not the kind of impersonal James [TS]

00:45:57 ◼   ► Bond adventures violence were used to [TS]

00:45:59 ◼   ► that comes at the beginning and the end [TS]

00:46:00 ◼   ► but there's still a lot there in the [TS]

00:46:02 ◼   ► middle know when he sits down with the [TS]

00:46:04 ◼   ► coroner [TS]

00:46:05 ◼   ► and daughters i love that Delilah [TS]

00:46:07 ◼   ► Delilah that scene is probably one of my [TS]

00:46:09 ◼   ► favorites falls far short of the [TS]

00:46:12 ◼   ► evaluations but man i love that that's [TS]

00:46:16 ◼   ► that's right i'll be home ready in 10 [TS]

00:46:18 ◼   ► minutes ago while you sleep like would [TS]

00:46:21 ◼   ► be wrong to apologize now as he said he [TS]

00:46:24 ◼   ► says no hehe provides her kind of [TS]

00:46:26 ◼   ► kindness and you know that she you know [TS]

00:46:28 ◼   ► she regrets as you want to hang yourself [TS]

00:46:31 ◼   ► yeah yeah yeah yeah I guess I i can [TS]

00:46:34 ◼   ► struggle without for the same reason [TS]

00:46:36 ◼   ► um and there's some people there's a one [TS]

00:46:38 ◼   ► of my favorite games his tomb raider [TS]

00:46:40 ◼   ► right I it has some really grisly death [TS]

00:46:43 ◼   ► scenes where Laura is killed and makes a [TS]

00:46:46 ◼   ► lot of our players unhappy and you at [TS]

00:46:48 ◼   ► the same time every single person who [TS]

00:46:50 ◼   ► killed in that game as a guy i am always [TS]

00:46:53 ◼   ► yes sorry it came out in 2013 [TS]

00:46:55 ◼   ► I'm always a little hesitant it movies [TS]

00:46:59 ◼   ► that kind of pull their punches when and [TS]

00:47:01 ◼   ► don't come to give women the same you [TS]

00:47:04 ◼   ► don't treat women the same ways as the [TS]

00:47:06 ◼   ► men are treated if you look at you know [TS]

00:47:08 ◼   ► throw in all of that you know they are [TS]

00:47:11 ◼   ► given a really violent bloody end and [TS]

00:47:15 ◼   ► you know she's treated a lot work with a [TS]

00:47:18 ◼   ► little bit more respect and maybe you [TS]

00:47:19 ◼   ► can read that like I think the generous [TS]

00:47:21 ◼   ► reading is you see it is an [TS]

00:47:23 ◼   ► interpretation of her characters having [TS]

00:47:25 ◼   ► some remorse [TS]

00:47:26 ◼   ► yeah about the things that she did like [TS]

00:47:28 ◼   ► as evidence by her diary but why did [TS]

00:47:31 ◼   ► they assign that wrote that motherly [TS]

00:47:33 ◼   ► gold yeah character yeah why would she [TS]

00:47:35 ◼   ► be the only one to show remorse [TS]

00:47:37 ◼   ► that's good that's a real good point [TS]

00:47:39 ◼   ► what bothers me it bothers me a free [TS]

00:47:41 ◼   ► when you talk about the Wachowskis kind [TS]

00:47:42 ◼   ► of read altering this movie triggering [TS]

00:47:44 ◼   ► this movie you close reading between the [TS]

00:47:46 ◼   ► comic in the movie you will probably see [TS]

00:47:49 ◼   ► in many locations like changes they made [TS]

00:47:51 ◼   ► for these specific reasons but with [TS]

00:47:54 ◼   ► leaving the structure behind and I it [TS]

00:47:57 ◼   ► that's basically how I read it in the [TS]

00:47:58 ◼   ► movie is that look that you know that [TS]

00:48:00 ◼   ► character was a woman and she you know [TS]

00:48:02 ◼   ► and then they had that scene together [TS]

00:48:03 ◼   ► and so they left it but i do think your [TS]

00:48:06 ◼   ► you see the bones thereof [TS]

00:48:08 ◼   ► Alan Moore's decisions in the eighties [TS]

00:48:11 ◼   ► behind it right if you read the book [TS]

00:48:13 ◼   ► it's very interesting because they go [TS]

00:48:14 ◼   ► way way [TS]

00:48:16 ◼   ► Warren depth with her character she was [TS]

00:48:18 ◼   ► having like a romance with the the lead [TS]

00:48:20 ◼   ► detective who you know kind of chooses [TS]

00:48:23 ◼   ► not to shoot TV at the end so she's a [TS]

00:48:26 ◼   ► much more complex character the [TS]

00:48:27 ◼   ► Wachowskis had in mind when they you [TS]

00:48:30 ◼   ► know adapted this film this book from [TS]

00:48:32 ◼   ► their script [TS]

00:48:34 ◼   ► I'm just saying that one little part [TS]

00:48:36 ◼   ► bothers with the casting of bishop as [TS]

00:48:39 ◼   ► basically molester [TS]

00:48:41 ◼   ► yeah we got it like it's a little longer [TS]

00:48:44 ◼   ► there is controlling your notes yeah [TS]

00:48:46 ◼   ► that's right on the nose it's just too [TS]

00:48:47 ◼   ► easy [TS]

00:48:48 ◼   ► well back in 80 back in 82 yeah that's [TS]

00:48:51 ◼   ► it not so now it's like yeah we know [TS]

00:48:55 ◼   ► like that's a serious problem but yeah [TS]

00:48:59 ◼   ► but a second 82 made sense and I think [TS]

00:49:02 ◼   ► again like judgments and it was like [TS]

00:49:04 ◼   ► well they just left it I think it's kind [TS]

00:49:06 ◼   ► of a funny weird creepy scene also since [TS]

00:49:09 ◼   ► she's sort of like is saying the truth [TS]

00:49:11 ◼   ► of like I've been held captive by the [TS]

00:49:13 ◼   ► terrorists and i love that she was [TS]

00:49:15 ◼   ► trying to escape [TS]

00:49:16 ◼   ► yeah but she wanted out in the comic you [TS]

00:49:18 ◼   ► know EV is young is very young I mean I [TS]

00:49:22 ◼   ► think she's 15 but she looks very young [TS]

00:49:24 ◼   ► and in that seems they have her dress [TS]

00:49:26 ◼   ► young and look young for the for the the [TS]

00:49:29 ◼   ► priest because he wants a girl little [TS]

00:49:32 ◼   ► girl and they and they still say the [TS]

00:49:34 ◼   ► same line she's older than you're used [TS]

00:49:35 ◼   ► to and all that they kept this with [TS]

00:49:38 ◼   ► natalie portman and I guess they can get [TS]

00:49:40 ◼   ► away with it because they have her like [TS]

00:49:42 ◼   ► with the with her hair up and the dress [TS]

00:49:44 ◼   ► and all of that but still it's calling [TS]

00:49:46 ◼   ► really you know they give their best but [TS]

00:49:49 ◼   ► it's like she I didn't believe it even [TS]

00:49:51 ◼   ► though it that was what the script and [TS]

00:49:53 ◼   ► had them behave [TS]

00:49:54 ◼   ► I just don't believe it that she's gonna [TS]

00:49:55 ◼   ► really come across as a as a little girl [TS]

00:49:58 ◼   ► there because it's Natalie port but you [TS]

00:50:00 ◼   ► know I guess you go with it [TS]

00:50:01 ◼   ► I think that scene goes too far in that [TS]

00:50:03 ◼   ► I'm sitting there cringing the entire [TS]

00:50:05 ◼   ► time and it seemed that I think goes on [TS]

00:50:06 ◼   ► way too long and he gets in the way of a [TS]

00:50:08 ◼   ► really important character moment for ev [TS]

00:50:10 ◼   ► where she tries to escape but cans and [TS]

00:50:13 ◼   ► then V is freaking out about the fact [TS]

00:50:16 ◼   ► that she tried to out him and I'm not [TS]

00:50:19 ◼   ► collected enough again until she's at [TS]

00:50:22 ◼   ► stephen Fry's house at that point I [TS]

00:50:23 ◼   ► completely forget what was happening [TS]

00:50:24 ◼   ► this tonight was the only time I've ever [TS]

00:50:27 ◼   ► seen the movie where i was able to [TS]

00:50:28 ◼   ► actually piece together the dots that [TS]

00:50:30 ◼   ► there when you see her escape you see [TS]

00:50:32 ◼   ► what was happening because I for one was [TS]

00:50:34 ◼   ► able to completely listen to the [TS]

00:50:36 ◼   ► dialogue and what was happening with EV [TS]

00:50:38 ◼   ► rather than freaking the hell out of [TS]

00:50:40 ◼   ► this Bishop trying to get well I mean [TS]

00:50:42 ◼   ► one thing is troubling is that and this [TS]

00:50:45 ◼   ► is kind of common whenever you try to [TS]

00:50:47 ◼   ► write and film a scene like this is that [TS]

00:50:50 ◼   ► you run the risk of titillating the east [TS]

00:50:52 ◼   ► on the thing that you're trying to damn [TS]

00:50:54 ◼   ► and like this was awkward it's like why [TS]

00:50:57 ◼   ► they put in that we put them in this [TS]

00:50:59 ◼   ► weird integrated housing issue with it [TS]

00:51:02 ◼   ► then you lose the effect and why is he [TS]

00:51:03 ◼   ► going on so long [TS]

00:51:05 ◼   ► exactly yeah like yeah I mean it was [TS]

00:51:07 ◼   ► revolting it's meant to be reporting it [TS]

00:51:09 ◼   ► worked on that level but that took me [TS]

00:51:12 ◼   ► out like dead [TS]

00:51:13 ◼   ► it had I mean I don't know how to handle [TS]

00:51:17 ◼   ► this better [TS]

00:51:18 ◼   ► well right because it's straight from [TS]

00:51:20 ◼   ► the comic book yeah like yeah the [TS]

00:51:22 ◼   ► existing from the comic but i think what [TS]

00:51:24 ◼   ► to me what made this uncomfortable I [TS]

00:51:26 ◼   ► don't do it the film scripts it Natalie [TS]

00:51:29 ◼   ► Portman has spoken out on so many [TS]

00:51:31 ◼   ► occasions how uncomfortable it is for [TS]

00:51:34 ◼   ► her as an actress that are you [TS]

00:51:36 ◼   ► apparently people that have that [TS]

00:51:39 ◼   ► particular thing are really into [TS]

00:51:42 ◼   ► pictures of her when she was a child you [TS]

00:51:45 ◼   ► know when she was younger actress so [TS]

00:51:47 ◼   ► she's talked on the record many times [TS]

00:51:50 ◼   ► about how uncomfortable it makes her and [TS]

00:51:51 ◼   ► I'm like really the Wachowskis like [TS]

00:51:54 ◼   ► they're going to put her in that [TS]

00:51:55 ◼   ► situation that's just I I wouldn't have [TS]

00:51:57 ◼   ► written that scene but I mean I think it [TS]

00:51:59 ◼   ► makes that you know her betrayal of e i [TS]

00:52:02 ◼   ► think is a I think it's a damning moment [TS]

00:52:05 ◼   ► for her character too so ridiculous [TS]

00:52:07 ◼   ► scene from her but I audience i thought [TS]

00:52:10 ◼   ► it was good really [TS]

00:52:12 ◼   ► yes yes it seemed before it and she says [TS]

00:52:14 ◼   ► look I need you to understand AB&C about [TS]

00:52:16 ◼   ► Maisie's kidnapped her and he's crazy [TS]

00:52:19 ◼   ► and you want to get out [TS]

00:52:20 ◼   ► well I i see it like icv asking her to [TS]

00:52:23 ◼   ► stay there for a year is kind of a [TS]

00:52:25 ◼   ► reasonable thing like she will get [TS]

00:52:27 ◼   ► hunted and killed on the outside was [TS]

00:52:29 ◼   ► just a fat right so i can only see that [TS]

00:52:33 ◼   ► yeah but he's being selfish right he's [TS]

00:52:34 ◼   ► being selfish because she knows where he [TS]

00:52:36 ◼   ► lives [TS]

00:52:37 ◼   ► I think that's part of it yeah but i [TS]

00:52:38 ◼   ► think it's it's just it's a plan overall [TS]

00:52:41 ◼   ► the I understand [TS]

00:52:42 ◼   ► right and then she's she's talking to [TS]

00:52:44 ◼   ► him she's like look I need you to [TS]

00:52:46 ◼   ► understand this about me and they killed [TS]

00:52:47 ◼   ► my parents you know they sent me to the [TS]

00:52:50 ◼   ► center to reprogram me I want to help in [TS]

00:52:52 ◼   ► any way I can't the way i read that [TS]

00:52:54 ◼   ► scene is it she chickens out in the last [TS]

00:52:57 ◼   ► moment like she was going to go through [TS]

00:52:59 ◼   ► and help him and down fails [TS]

00:53:01 ◼   ► yeah I kind of just assumed that that [TS]

00:53:03 ◼   ► was your plan because she said like look [TS]

00:53:04 ◼   ► I'm gonna help you [TS]

00:53:05 ◼   ► everyone knowing that it would that [TS]

00:53:09 ◼   ► would afford her an opportunity to get [TS]

00:53:11 ◼   ► out and get help [TS]

00:53:13 ◼   ► oh yeah i don't know and i think it's i [TS]

00:53:15 ◼   ► think you can read it either way [TS]

00:53:17 ◼   ► like when she decided to do that mission [TS]

00:53:19 ◼   ► is she really going into it all the way [TS]

00:53:21 ◼   ► or is she sort of me because she's kind [TS]

00:53:23 ◼   ► of stalling while he gets their sochi [TS]

00:53:24 ◼   ► half-heartedly giving him this [TS]

00:53:26 ◼   ► information [TS]

00:53:27 ◼   ► yeah this is all part of my not argument [TS]

00:53:30 ◼   ► but my thesis is a thesis I'm gonna get [TS]

00:53:33 ◼   ► a doctorate in this uh-huh it's here it [TS]

00:53:36 ◼   ► is guys wacky theory my headcanon and [TS]

00:53:41 ◼   ► izzy is an idea this is her struggling [TS]

00:53:44 ◼   ► with accepting the idea all right right [TS]

00:53:46 ◼   ► okay look forward to your your your [TS]

00:53:49 ◼   ► thesis on this yeah yeah you should get [TS]

00:53:52 ◼   ► an English PhD and i write this but also [TS]

00:53:54 ◼   ► you have any record in a bunch of yarn [TS]

00:53:56 ◼   ► to connect all pay a sum I think the [TS]

00:53:59 ◼   ► things that we see in the movie don't [TS]

00:54:01 ◼   ► make sense so we cannot take it [TS]

00:54:03 ◼   ► literally [TS]

00:54:03 ◼   ► so given we can take it literally why [TS]

00:54:07 ◼   ► don't we just run with the idea that [TS]

00:54:08 ◼   ► haha i keep pushing back against this [TS]

00:54:11 ◼   ► guy because because the it is more [TS]

00:54:15 ◼   ► literal in the book in the source videos [TS]

00:54:18 ◼   ► in Vietnam it so so and I and I come to [TS]

00:54:21 ◼   ► this from having read the book back when [TS]

00:54:23 ◼   ► DC published it in the u.s. so i can't i [TS]

00:54:27 ◼   ► can't not look at this as an adapter as [TS]

00:54:29 ◼   ► an adaptation so that makes it much [TS]

00:54:32 ◼   ► harder for me to look at it as a [TS]

00:54:34 ◼   ► metaphorical story when in in the in the [TS]

00:54:38 ◼   ► source material it was intended to be [TS]

00:54:40 ◼   ► more more one-to-one I think honestly I [TS]

00:54:44 ◼   ► think you're right [TS]

00:54:45 ◼   ► a gym at that thank you to leave it I'm [TS]

00:54:47 ◼   ► gonna be happy of thinking the other [TS]

00:54:48 ◼   ► thing so [TS]

00:54:51 ◼   ► for me as someone who's never read the [TS]

00:54:53 ◼   ► book the fact that this movie is so [TS]

00:54:56 ◼   ► metaphorical comes through in the very [TS]

00:54:59 ◼   ► end when how are we supposed to feel [TS]

00:55:00 ◼   ► we're happy that the apartments blown up [TS]

00:55:02 ◼   ► we feel emotions about Evie saying and [TS]

00:55:07 ◼   ► that's why i love this man and the fact [TS]

00:55:10 ◼   ► that they added that love story in and [TS]

00:55:13 ◼   ► Evie's arc is about that coming to love [TS]

00:55:15 ◼   ► this man instead of the idea because she [TS]

00:55:18 ◼   ► keeps saying I it's not the idea i miss [TS]

00:55:20 ◼   ► it's the man it's the man that is what [TS]

00:55:22 ◼   ► makes me feel like this movie is so much [TS]

00:55:24 ◼   ► more metaphorical than the book because [TS]

00:55:27 ◼   ► the ending beats really don't work for [TS]

00:55:29 ◼   ► me I i have to say if you read as a love [TS]

00:55:31 ◼   ► story i could not a groove to love me I [TS]

00:55:34 ◼   ► don't read as a love story but she says [TS]

00:55:37 ◼   ► that she loves the man in the same way [TS]

00:55:39 ◼   ► in the same way that ties back to the [TS]

00:55:42 ◼   ► same the cell with the gay woman like [TS]

00:55:44 ◼   ► she's talking about how like I even [TS]

00:55:45 ◼   ► though i may not know your whole tree or [TS]

00:55:47 ◼   ► kiss you I want you to know i love you [TS]

00:55:49 ◼   ► just as a person and I think it's just [TS]

00:55:51 ◼   ► mirroring the exact same idea out its [TS]

00:55:55 ◼   ► respect like this is v's arc she starts [TS]

00:55:58 ◼   ► to someone who's beaten down her parents [TS]

00:56:00 ◼   ► were taken from her like well she's [TS]

00:56:01 ◼   ► hiding under the bed she sent to a camp [TS]

00:56:03 ◼   ► the reprograms her then she goes and [TS]

00:56:06 ◼   ► becomes part of this medium machine that [TS]

00:56:08 ◼   ► helps misinform the entire public she [TS]

00:56:10 ◼   ► was instrumental v captures our tortures [TS]

00:56:13 ◼   ► her changes her she has entire arc is a [TS]

00:56:16 ◼   ► character she reaches inside her she [TS]

00:56:18 ◼   ► finds strength she didn't know she had [TS]

00:56:19 ◼   ► and then like she's the one that flips [TS]

00:56:22 ◼   ► the switch again and she loves be as a [TS]

00:56:26 ◼   ► person in that same it's not like she [TS]

00:56:29 ◼   ► still has she still very guarded in [TS]

00:56:32 ◼   ► those scenes you can see her keeping her [TS]

00:56:33 ◼   ► distance is just more respect I read [TS]

00:56:36 ◼   ► yeah I don't she'll of yours either last [TS]

00:56:38 ◼   ► line is very clear she says he was my [TS]

00:56:40 ◼   ► mother and father and brother and Raven [TS]

00:56:42 ◼   ► cheat meal is a lot of reading and thank [TS]

00:56:44 ◼   ► you mother is not one of them right did [TS]

00:56:47 ◼   ► not what his role is to I I could have [TS]

00:56:50 ◼   ► done without the kids on the mask i have [TS]

00:56:52 ◼   ► to say i could have done it because I'm [TS]

00:56:55 ◼   ► is everything was bad yeah I did write [TS]

00:56:57 ◼   ► down the line that we was just talking [TS]

00:57:00 ◼   ► about because I was crying so I went [TS]

00:57:05 ◼   ► down even though i do not know you and [TS]

00:57:07 ◼   ► even though I may never meet you [TS]

00:57:09 ◼   ► laughs with you cry with you or kiss you [TS]

00:57:11 ◼   ► I love you with all my heart and let him [TS]

00:57:13 ◼   ► that is to me [TS]

00:57:15 ◼   ► probably the court moment of the movie [TS]

00:57:18 ◼   ► yes absolutely and and it's and it's [TS]

00:57:20 ◼   ► lifted straight from alan moore script [TS]

00:57:22 ◼   ► yeah yeah I you we speaking of the end [TS]

00:57:26 ◼   ► of the movie if it and this is where i [TS]

00:57:29 ◼   ► could buy into a certain standard of the [TS]

00:57:31 ◼   ► guy English theory the the are the army [TS]

00:57:35 ◼   ► of marchers in their newly FedExed guy [TS]

00:57:40 ◼   ► fawkes masks and outfits and you know [TS]

00:57:43 ◼   ► ending with this sort of this triumphant [TS]

00:57:45 ◼   ► march of the pickup of the people and [TS]

00:57:48 ◼   ► even before that throughout this movie [TS]

00:57:50 ◼   ► every time you see civilians watching TV [TS]

00:57:53 ◼   ► are watching watching Stephen Fry's show [TS]

00:57:56 ◼   ► watching the watching political [TS]

00:58:00 ◼   ► statements in the propaganda on TV [TS]

00:58:01 ◼   ► the people are not buying it the people [TS]

00:58:04 ◼   ► are enjoying laughing at subtler I I get [TS]

00:58:08 ◼   ► the feeling that this movie expect it [TS]

00:58:12 ◼   ► has a very very optimistic sense of how [TS]

00:58:15 ◼   ► people living under fascism actually [TS]

00:58:17 ◼   ► react to it seems like everybody's a [TS]

00:58:19 ◼   ► good person who's just being who's being [TS]

00:58:22 ◼   ► held down by the man when you get in [TS]

00:58:26 ◼   ► there in the early going [TS]

00:58:27 ◼   ► you do get these speech about a accusing [TS]

00:58:32 ◼   ► the population of having let this happen [TS]

00:58:34 ◼   ► having this chosen but i think it gets [TS]

00:58:36 ◼   ► undermined by the whole rest of the [TS]

00:58:38 ◼   ► movie and I'm maybe I'm just really [TS]

00:58:43 ◼   ► really cynical and discouraged about [TS]

00:58:44 ◼   ► current politics but I that's it that's [TS]

00:58:50 ◼   ► an awful lot of people who are [TS]

00:58:52 ◼   ► apparently who apparently never really [TS]

00:58:56 ◼   ► voted for Norris fire and a parent will [TS]

00:58:58 ◼   ► be never really wanted what was going on [TS]

00:59:00 ◼   ► and I just don't buy it [TS]

00:59:02 ◼   ► wow thats dark chip no user and these [TS]

00:59:05 ◼   ► are canada's our time [TS]

00:59:06 ◼   ► well I do like the way the truth the [TS]

00:59:08 ◼   ► people are treated there is a scene very [TS]

00:59:09 ◼   ► early on where we see all the people [TS]

00:59:11 ◼   ► when he takes over the TV station we see [TS]

00:59:13 ◼   ► all the people who are watching in the [TS]

00:59:15 ◼   ► like in the pub and everywhere the [TS]

00:59:18 ◼   ► family at home they're watching and that [TS]

00:59:21 ◼   ► scene is replayed at the end when [TS]

00:59:24 ◼   ► they're trying to get everybody to not [TS]

00:59:28 ◼   ► worry about Vee and and nobody in all [TS]

00:59:32 ◼   ► those locations there's nobody there and [TS]

00:59:35 ◼   ► that's because everybody is marching and [TS]

00:59:37 ◼   ► I like i did my favorite moment like [TS]

00:59:39 ◼   ► those to cut and you know you know you [TS]

00:59:41 ◼   ► have to be paying attention is like why [TS]

00:59:43 ◼   ► are they showing that the TV and that [TS]

00:59:45 ◼   ► empty bar and it's because that's where [TS]

00:59:46 ◼   ► all the people used to be and they're [TS]

00:59:47 ◼   ► not there anymore because now they're [TS]

00:59:49 ◼   ► out marching I I like that part of it [TS]

00:59:51 ◼   ► but yeah I can see your point chip which [TS]

00:59:52 ◼   ► is you know it is it is it their fault [TS]

00:59:55 ◼   ► or not or is it beyond that which is [TS]

00:59:57 ◼   ► like look at some point you have to [TS]

00:59:58 ◼   ► stand up and they didn't stand [TS]

00:59:58 ◼   ► stand up and they didn't stand [TS]

01:00:00 ◼   ► d'Epinay allowed the the country to get [TS]

01:00:01 ◼   ► to this point but within their fear [TS]

01:00:03 ◼   ► about the attacks and all that but [TS]

01:00:05 ◼   ► they're not allowing it [TS]

01:00:06 ◼   ► they crystallise around this idea of v2 [TS]

01:00:09 ◼   ► not allow it to go on on any further I [TS]

01:00:11 ◼   ► mean it is kind of fantasy like Jason [TS]

01:00:13 ◼   ► but yeah it was yeah it's very much [TS]

01:00:16 ◼   ► fantasy [TS]

01:00:16 ◼   ► yeah that's why I think he's an idea if [TS]

01:00:18 ◼   ► you do see you to see flashes a bigger [TS]

01:00:20 ◼   ► population in here like remember the [TS]

01:00:22 ◼   ► scene in the BBC station with the guy [TS]

01:00:25 ◼   ► watching laser laughs like keys hell yea [TS]

01:00:27 ◼   ► dressings added just to watch the people [TS]

01:00:29 ◼   ► there to out that don't get it [TS]

01:00:32 ◼   ► yeah you see it in like the the nursing [TS]

01:00:34 ◼   ► home shots of them reacting to vtv we're [TS]

01:00:37 ◼   ► just kind of like what I don't gather [TS]

01:00:40 ◼   ► and yes finches role like Finch is that [TS]

01:00:43 ◼   ► guy [TS]

01:00:44 ◼   ► yeah that's apart an inner party member [TS]

01:00:47 ◼   ► and who is is seeing this all these [TS]

01:00:51 ◼   ► things lining up and like do I really [TS]

01:00:53 ◼   ► want to ask these questions if you know [TS]

01:00:56 ◼   ► if God's there to protect me if my [TS]

01:00:58 ◼   ► country's there to protect me then [TS]

01:00:59 ◼   ► should you know what i do i really want [TS]

01:01:02 ◼   ► to know if they they're the ones that [TS]

01:01:03 ◼   ► are actually hurting me [TS]

01:01:04 ◼   ► we haven't mentioned Steven Reyes pinch [TS]

01:01:06 ◼   ► but yea he's the he's got a fantastic [TS]

01:01:07 ◼   ► fantastic he's got to investigate this [TS]

01:01:09 ◼   ► is with his friend of Rupert graves who [TS]

01:01:11 ◼   ► is a of course from from Sherlock you [TS]

01:01:15 ◼   ► know he was always a cop asshole [TS]

01:01:17 ◼   ► they they seem array in the end you know [TS]

01:01:19 ◼   ► he keeps following his instincts as a [TS]

01:01:22 ◼   ► cop back to what happened at lark hell [TS]

01:01:26 ◼   ► and he's told several times not to he's [TS]

01:01:29 ◼   ► threatened he says I've been a member [TS]

01:01:30 ◼   ► this party for 20 years but he keeps [TS]

01:01:32 ◼   ► following this he says 22 Rupert graves [TS]

01:01:35 ◼   ► uh you know how far are we willing to go [TS]

01:01:38 ◼   ► here because you know he realizes just [TS]

01:01:41 ◼   ► what he's doing up here and again i [TS]

01:01:44 ◼   ► would say in a more conventional movie [TS]

01:01:45 ◼   ► structure this would this be [TS]

01:01:48 ◼   ► he's essentially like the crusading [TS]

01:01:49 ◼   ► reporter kind of character digging up [TS]

01:01:52 ◼   ► the real truth and it's it's you know [TS]

01:01:54 ◼   ► it's a less a part of the story then [TS]

01:01:56 ◼   ► maybe it might have been in a another [TS]

01:01:58 ◼   ► movie but he is the he does represent [TS]

01:02:00 ◼   ► like a good person who wants to do the [TS]

01:02:04 ◼   ► right thing here even though he's a [TS]

01:02:05 ◼   ► party member and he's in this government [TS]

01:02:07 ◼   ► he is following the truth and in the end [TS]

01:02:10 ◼   ► he let Stevie you know he doesn't he [TS]

01:02:13 ◼   ► doesn't [TS]

01:02:13 ◼   ► shoot her he doesn't stop her he lets [TS]

01:02:15 ◼   ► her go I did hate the montage know like [TS]

01:02:18 ◼   ► the date the explanation so yeah where I [TS]

01:02:22 ◼   ► see I'm i went over to lark hill and I [TS]

01:02:24 ◼   ► then I see the future blah blah [TS]

01:02:26 ◼   ► that felt like compression I was I was [TS]

01:02:29 ◼   ► good with it gives otherwise I don't [TS]

01:02:30 ◼   ► know how we would have strong little [TS]

01:02:32 ◼   ► things together you need some you know [TS]

01:02:35 ◼   ► either you need a character that you [TS]

01:02:37 ◼   ► need to explain it to or you needed to [TS]

01:02:39 ◼   ► get some kind of trip like that I i just [TS]

01:02:42 ◼   ► saw his pure or Chomsky like [TS]

01:02:44 ◼   ► metaphysical months that's like the [TS]

01:02:45 ◼   ► synthetic people enjoyed the make sure [TS]

01:02:47 ◼   ► people out the dead sensate and you know [TS]

01:02:51 ◼   ► like they are all in on that the this [TS]

01:02:53 ◼   ► people Cloud Atlas i get these are the [TS]

01:02:56 ◼   ► people that have this idea that we're [TS]