The Incomparable

00:00:00 ◼   ► the incomparable number 210 September [TS]

00:00:11 ◼   ► welcome back everybody being comfortable [TS]

00:00:14 ◼   ► i am your host Jason L and I'm convening [TS]

00:00:16 ◼   ► it's not like the retro book club here [TS]

00:00:19 ◼   ► we are going to be talking about Stephen [TS]

00:00:22 ◼   ► King's novel The Stand we have talked [TS]

00:00:24 ◼   ► about Stephen King before we did an [TS]

00:00:25 ◼   ► episode about his book about the time [TS]

00:00:28 ◼   ► traveler goes back to stop the Kennedy [TS]

00:00:30 ◼   ► assassination just what is it called 11 [TS]

00:00:33 ◼   ► 2011 22 6363 I can never remember when [TS]

00:00:37 ◼   ► doctor who premiered and when Kennedy [TS]

00:00:39 ◼   ► got assassinated because they're like [TS]

00:00:40 ◼   ► two days apartment i'm a very bad [TS]

00:00:42 ◼   ► student of history and a very good [TS]

00:00:45 ◼   ► student doctor who anyway but we're back [TS]

00:00:48 ◼   ► to talk about the stand one play it is [TS]

00:00:50 ◼   ► my favorite Stephen King novel it is [TS]

00:00:52 ◼   ► also i think my introduction Stephen [TS]

00:00:54 ◼   ► King I've got a great panel with me to [TS]

00:00:57 ◼   ► talk about this book which was first [TS]

00:00:59 ◼   ► published in like 79 and then republish [TS]

00:01:02 ◼   ► tin in vegas 78 and republished in 1990 [TS]

00:01:06 ◼   ► joining me to talk about it [TS]

00:01:09 ◼   ► are these schmeiser hello I'm happy to [TS]

00:01:13 ◼   ► be here when I think about talking about [TS]

00:01:14 ◼   ► Stephen King novels I think of two [TS]

00:01:16 ◼   ► people one of whom is laser miser so [TS]

00:01:18 ◼   ► it's good to have you here thank you [TS]

00:01:19 ◼   ► I also don't think about Monty Ashley [TS]

00:01:22 ◼   ► but he's here and i'm happy to hear you [TS]

00:01:25 ◼   ► had another way there didn't I my money [TS]

00:01:28 ◼   ► hi it's good to have you is it because [TS]

00:01:31 ◼   ► you're delightful surprise [TS]

00:01:33 ◼   ► okay haha i will accept that is not [TS]

00:01:36 ◼   ► quite an insult okay good that's what I [TS]

00:01:38 ◼   ► was sorta not quite going for I I the [TS]

00:01:41 ◼   ► print the other person i like to think [TS]

00:01:43 ◼   ► of when I think of Stephen King novels [TS]

00:01:44 ◼   ► is of course John siracusa who is here [TS]

00:01:47 ◼   ► hello you know after hearing you say to [TS]

00:01:49 ◼   ► all of us that we don't have to talk too [TS]

00:01:51 ◼   ► long about the stand that one thing to [TS]

00:01:53 ◼   ► say to you Jason [TS]

00:01:54 ◼   ► you ain't no nice guy oh my god i love [TS]

00:01:58 ◼   ► it the first reference we're saving it [TS]

00:02:00 ◼   ► for the complete and uncut episode yet [TS]

00:02:03 ◼   ► you have to wait like 15 years between [TS]

00:02:05 ◼   ► the spot for you guys and just talked [TS]

00:02:07 ◼   ► for five hours tonight and all our first [TS]

00:02:10 ◼   ► release a one-hour long version and then [TS]

00:02:12 ◼   ► like for it to about my time also here [TS]

00:02:15 ◼   ► to talk about the stand is Erica and [TS]

00:02:17 ◼   ► sign hello hello [TS]

00:02:19 ◼   ► I have actually had stand by our am [TS]

00:02:21 ◼   ► stuck in my head all day because that's [TS]

00:02:23 ◼   ► nice [TS]

00:02:24 ◼   ► which is why [TS]

00:02:24 ◼   ► hopefully not a great choice since it's [TS]

00:02:26 ◼   ► not at all related but very most boring [TS]

00:02:29 ◼   ► isn't it Erica isn't it the trip [TS]

00:02:32 ◼   ► what should be don't fear the reaper [TS]

00:02:34 ◼   ► hell off the world its butt and [TS]

00:02:37 ◼   ► everybody else out there who hasn't read [TS]

00:02:39 ◼   ► the stand you shouldn't listen to this [TS]

00:02:40 ◼   ► podcast m 00 and spells spoilers [TS]

00:02:43 ◼   ► all right all my god you know just a [TS]

00:02:47 ◼   ► feud [TS]

00:02:48 ◼   ► I think mid last week somebody tweeted [TS]

00:02:51 ◼   ► at Stephen saying MO and spells [TS]

00:02:53 ◼   ► something or other and I was just [TS]

00:02:54 ◼   ► shaking my head because in the middle of [TS]

00:02:56 ◼   ► reading the book and I guess the key is [TS]

00:02:58 ◼   ► not gonna get this but I get that tweet [TS]

00:03:00 ◼   ► I thought we would start by talking a [TS]

00:03:01 ◼   ► little bit about our personal history [TS]

00:03:03 ◼   ► with this book since it's been around [TS]

00:03:05 ◼   ► for awhile I i'll start by saying that I [TS]

00:03:08 ◼   ► heard that this was a great book but I [TS]

00:03:10 ◼   ► didn't read the original I didn't I I [TS]

00:03:12 ◼   ► knew was out there and I had friends who [TS]

00:03:14 ◼   ► are big fans of stephen king and end of [TS]

00:03:15 ◼   ► this book in particular and then there [TS]

00:03:17 ◼   ► was that big publicity campaign in 1990 [TS]

00:03:20 ◼   ► when the complete an uncut addition that [TS]

00:03:22 ◼   ► that is over like a thousand pages i'm [TS]

00:03:26 ◼   ► trying to see 1153 is what my copy says [TS]

00:03:28 ◼   ► came out and I i said ok that's the one [TS]

00:03:31 ◼   ► I'll buy and read and indeed i have the [TS]

00:03:34 ◼   ► first edition and in and inside I have a [TS]

00:03:37 ◼   ► bookmark of the first complete and cut [TS]

00:03:39 ◼   ► addition that actually explains what it [TS]

00:03:41 ◼   ► is from the publisher which is hilarious [TS]

00:03:44 ◼   ► it has a bulleted list of why it's [TS]

00:03:45 ◼   ► bigger from Doubleday that I still uses [TS]

00:03:48 ◼   ► the morning very very helpful anyway III [TS]

00:03:50 ◼   ► in the summer of nineteen ninety i was a [TS]

00:03:53 ◼   ► working a summer job between years of [TS]

00:03:56 ◼   ► college at this as a temp at this like [TS]

00:03:59 ◼   ► power plant out in the middle of nowhere [TS]

00:04:01 ◼   ► with like a hundred and five degrees and [TS]

00:04:03 ◼   ► I remember the lunch hour [TS]

00:04:04 ◼   ► I would sit outside in the shade eating [TS]

00:04:06 ◼   ► my little meager sandwich and drinking [TS]

00:04:08 ◼   ► my little can of soda and reading the [TS]

00:04:11 ◼   ► stand for an hour before going back to [TS]

00:04:12 ◼   ► the mind-numbing work of really honestly [TS]

00:04:16 ◼   ► the super flu could have come at that [TS]

00:04:17 ◼   ► moment and I wouldn't have even noticed [TS]

00:04:19 ◼   ► because i was out in the middle of [TS]

00:04:21 ◼   ► nowhere and if you leave behind payday [TS]

00:04:23 ◼   ► candy bar wrappers [TS]

00:04:24 ◼   ► that's good idea what Harold do so John [TS]

00:04:28 ◼   ► what's your with your history with the [TS]

00:04:30 ◼   ► stand [TS]

00:04:30 ◼   ► well I guess before the internet the [TS]

00:04:33 ◼   ► only way we had to get things was like [TS]

00:04:35 ◼   ► the store or me [TS]

00:04:37 ◼   ► Lauder and remember the Columbia House [TS]

00:04:39 ◼   ► like mail-order things for four cds [TS]

00:04:42 ◼   ► that's kind of how i got into music was [TS]

00:04:43 ◼   ► like that that record thing and there [TS]

00:04:45 ◼   ► was also one for books was it also [TS]

00:04:47 ◼   ► Columbia's I don't even remember anymore [TS]

00:04:48 ◼   ► but was one of those things where you [TS]

00:04:49 ◼   ► pay a dollar and get five free books or [TS]

00:04:51 ◼   ► something like that the quality [TS]

00:04:52 ◼   ► paperback club right yeah i did the [TS]

00:04:54 ◼   ► science-fiction book club [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► yep me too i don't i don't remember [TS]

00:04:57 ◼   ► which it was but whatever it was I was [TS]

00:04:59 ◼   ► doing at the same time that I was doing [TS]

00:05:00 ◼   ► is getting the free CDs and and for [TS]

00:05:03 ◼   ► whatever reason I I don't like you know [TS]

00:05:05 ◼   ► fantasy novel paperback before that but [TS]

00:05:07 ◼   ► I got a hardcover the same one you [TS]

00:05:08 ◼   ► probably have Jason the big first [TS]

00:05:10 ◼   ► edition Doubleday hardcover uncut stand [TS]

00:05:13 ◼   ► i don't know how i picked it I probably [TS]

00:05:14 ◼   ► picked it because it was like the big [TS]

00:05:16 ◼   ► thing on the cover of the little sheet [TS]

00:05:18 ◼   ► that you fill out with a little pin and [TS]

00:05:19 ◼   ► the check boxes which free pick your [TS]

00:05:21 ◼   ► five free books and so I don't remember [TS]

00:05:23 ◼   ► what that the books were that I got free [TS]

00:05:25 ◼   ► and i don't remember how I escaped that [TS]

00:05:27 ◼   ► plan probably because i was just a [TS]

00:05:28 ◼   ► teenager and should have been signing up [TS]

00:05:29 ◼   ► for it anyway but anyway I got work [TS]

00:05:32 ◼   ► longer a lot of us and I think it was [TS]

00:05:34 ◼   ► also i wasn't released in the summer [TS]

00:05:35 ◼   ► time I seem to recall reading in the [TS]

00:05:37 ◼   ► summertime as well and so I read through [TS]

00:05:39 ◼   ► that book and when i finished the book i [TS]

00:05:43 ◼   ► put it down and just went back to the [TS]

00:05:45 ◼   ► first page to start over again and [TS]

00:05:47 ◼   ► that's the first look I know I had ever [TS]

00:05:48 ◼   ► done that with and the stand like it was [TS]

00:05:51 ◼   ► was my top favorite book for the longest [TS]

00:05:54 ◼   ► time certainly during all of my teen [TS]

00:05:56 ◼   ► years in young adulthood so I i have [TS]

00:05:58 ◼   ► read the stand more times than I read [TS]

00:06:00 ◼   ► any books except for probably lord of [TS]

00:06:01 ◼   ► the rings Wow all right Erica what's [TS]

00:06:05 ◼   ► your story with the stand [TS]

00:06:06 ◼   ► well we were we were library family we [TS]

00:06:09 ◼   ► went to the library of a couple of weeks [TS]

00:06:11 ◼   ► and my mom would get like 30 books and [TS]

00:06:12 ◼   ► you know I aspired to get that many but [TS]

00:06:14 ◼   ► it wasn't that many and I want to say [TS]

00:06:17 ◼   ► was probably within a year or two of the [TS]

00:06:19 ◼   ► rerelease she I think she my mom had [TS]

00:06:22 ◼   ► originally read the early version and [TS]

00:06:24 ◼   ► then decided she wanted to read the [TS]

00:06:25 ◼   ► expanded version so i didn't know [TS]

00:06:27 ◼   ► anything about the earlier version i [TS]

00:06:29 ◼   ► just saw that she had this book that was [TS]

00:06:31 ◼   ► huge [TS]

00:06:32 ◼   ► I was like yeah I was like okay I need [TS]

00:06:34 ◼   ► to read that book it was just sort of a [TS]

00:06:35 ◼   ► challenge to myself it's that long that [TS]

00:06:38 ◼   ► is something that I i need to to read II [TS]

00:06:40 ◼   ► don't even care what it's about and I [TS]

00:06:42 ◼   ► was probably like a freshman in high [TS]

00:06:43 ◼   ► school at the time so I picked it up and [TS]

00:06:45 ◼   ► I zipped through it probably way faster [TS]

00:06:48 ◼   ► than I [TS]

00:06:48 ◼   ► then I should have because it meant i'm [TS]

00:06:50 ◼   ► skipping a lot of homework and I just [TS]

00:06:53 ◼   ► loved it so I i haven't read it as many [TS]

00:06:55 ◼   ► times as John has but i have read it [TS]

00:06:57 ◼   ► three or this was probably my fourth [TS]

00:07:00 ◼   ► time through but I've never read the [TS]

00:07:01 ◼   ► original version just the like the huge [TS]

00:07:03 ◼   ► one every time we leavin uncut so i have [TS]

00:07:06 ◼   ► read The Lord of the Rings more times [TS]

00:07:07 ◼   ► than this because i used to do that [TS]

00:07:08 ◼   ► annually [TS]

00:07:09 ◼   ► I've read them the same amount which is [TS]

00:07:11 ◼   ► to each so just twice each Monty what's [TS]

00:07:15 ◼   ► your story withstand mom's read it last [TS]

00:07:17 ◼   ► week for the first time never heard of [TS]

00:07:19 ◼   ► it i think i had read the cut version [TS]

00:07:23 ◼   ► once when the uncut version came out I [TS]

00:07:26 ◼   ► got the paperback so I'm a little behind [TS]

00:07:28 ◼   ► you guys looking inside this is the [TS]

00:07:31 ◼   ► first paperback printing from a 1991 how [TS]

00:07:34 ◼   ► much was the paperback [TS]

00:07:36 ◼   ► oh i think i did actually read the paper [TS]

00:07:39 ◼   ► back so would have been about 90 91 when [TS]

00:07:41 ◼   ► the library 690 now she's it's 2495 for [TS]

00:07:44 ◼   ► the hardcover I got I got screwed good [TS]

00:07:46 ◼   ► job way to be a good shopper Monty it [TS]

00:07:48 ◼   ► was free from the library you guys yeah [TS]

00:07:50 ◼   ► the other one of the shiny red ya [TS]

00:07:53 ◼   ► tomorrow colored yeah and as a bonus the [TS]

00:07:56 ◼   ► back announces that the first two dark [TS]

00:07:59 ◼   ► tower books are out but I read this book [TS]

00:08:04 ◼   ► i think four or five times in total but [TS]

00:08:07 ◼   ► whenever i have anything stronger than a [TS]

00:08:09 ◼   ► strong cold i tend to read the [TS]

00:08:11 ◼   ► free-throw I'm miserable and I want to [TS]

00:08:16 ◼   ► imagine that everybody else was soon and [TS]

00:08:18 ◼   ► also be miserable [TS]

00:08:19 ◼   ► this cold is going to kill us all which [TS]

00:08:22 ◼   ► my girlfriend has reminded me that means [TS]

00:08:24 ◼   ► this book that I'm holding is probably [TS]

00:08:26 ◼   ► riddled with disease because I'm always [TS]

00:08:29 ◼   ► reading it when I have the flu [TS]

00:08:31 ◼   ► it is Project Blue maybe it's keeping [TS]

00:08:34 ◼   ► you alive [TS]

00:08:35 ◼   ► whoo yeah I'm just it that's an [TS]

00:08:38 ◼   ► unscientific area a little bit made you [TS]

00:08:40 ◼   ► feel better [TS]

00:08:41 ◼   ► Lisa what's what is your stance story [TS]

00:08:44 ◼   ► summer of nineteen eighty-four i was [TS]

00:08:48 ◼   ► able to start babysitting and that was [TS]

00:08:52 ◼   ► also some my mom graciously agreed to [TS]

00:08:53 ◼   ► drive me to the nearest used bookstore [TS]

00:08:55 ◼   ► and every week i would take the five [TS]

00:08:58 ◼   ► dollars i had earned and I would go [TS]

00:08:59 ◼   ► browse the shelves [TS]

00:09:01 ◼   ► and i bought the stand 11 week with [TS]

00:09:04 ◼   ► along with like four or five other [TS]

00:09:06 ◼   ► stephen king books for my five dollars [TS]

00:09:08 ◼   ► some and I read my way through all the [TS]

00:09:13 ◼   ► short story collections first so i read [TS]

00:09:15 ◼   ► the short story that loosely Precision's [TS]

00:09:17 ◼   ► this book and then i read the stand and [TS]

00:09:21 ◼   ► when you're in seventh grade there's [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► always that when I survived the [TS]

00:09:25 ◼   ► apocalypse i'm going to go live in a [TS]

00:09:26 ◼   ► museum fantasy r or whatever but [TS]

00:09:28 ◼   ► delivered [TS]

00:09:30 ◼   ► oh my god i had a plan how it's going to [TS]

00:09:33 ◼   ► DC and live in the Smithsonian that [TS]

00:09:34 ◼   ► everything you and John should compare [TS]

00:09:37 ◼   ► notes John also has something about [TS]

00:09:39 ◼   ► surviving the apocalypse [TS]

00:09:40 ◼   ► yeah but I read the stand and it hit my [TS]

00:09:43 ◼   ► after the apocalypse buttons and then I [TS]

00:09:45 ◼   ► just got sucked in and kept going kept [TS]

00:09:46 ◼   ► going on so it actually turned into kind [TS]

00:09:50 ◼   ► of a comfort read through middle school [TS]

00:09:52 ◼   ► and high school and then the year I [TS]

00:09:54 ◼   ► graduated college in 1994 my first post [TS]

00:09:58 ◼   ► graduate splurge was a paperback of the [TS]

00:10:01 ◼   ► you know completely uncut version and I [TS]

00:10:04 ◼   ► read it [TS]

00:10:05 ◼   ► concurrent with the airing of the [TS]

00:10:07 ◼   ► miniseries and I was on a beach break [TS]

00:10:09 ◼   ► with a friend of mine and this poor [TS]

00:10:10 ◼   ► woman had to listen to me rant and rave [TS]

00:10:12 ◼   ► every night about how bad the gas haha [TS]

00:10:14 ◼   ► its and that's not in the block and and [TS]

00:10:17 ◼   ► well i'm not sure like to do that but i [TS]

00:10:19 ◼   ► think i really like the way that miguel [TS]

00:10:21 ◼   ► ferrer slate that's that's okay so [TS]

00:10:24 ◼   ► you're blown up by a bomb anyway yeah so [TS]

00:10:26 ◼   ► I've had I I've probably read the book [TS]

00:10:28 ◼   ► and I still read the stand once every [TS]

00:10:31 ◼   ► few years when I want an engrossing read [TS]

00:10:34 ◼   ► that I know will reliably entertain me [TS]

00:10:37 ◼   ► and I find something new every time and [TS]

00:10:39 ◼   ► I think it's in reading it in my [TS]

00:10:40 ◼   ► thirties and forties has been a lot [TS]

00:10:41 ◼   ► different than reading it as a [TS]

00:10:42 ◼   ► thirteen-year-old so [TS]

00:10:44 ◼   ► oh yeah I've probably read it about ten [TS]

00:10:46 ◼   ► eleven times maybe [TS]

00:10:48 ◼   ► oh wow so no you know it's again i've [TS]

00:10:50 ◼   ► been reading the same i've been reading [TS]

00:10:52 ◼   ► for 30 years so you know where people [TS]

00:10:55 ◼   ► fair enough yeah wow so I guess the [TS]

00:10:58 ◼   ► logical next thing to ask would be what [TS]

00:11:01 ◼   ► is it about the stand that makes it so [TS]

00:11:03 ◼   ► notable in stephen king's work [TS]

00:11:06 ◼   ► what is it about the stand that has all [TS]

00:11:09 ◼   ► of us have admitted to being [TS]

00:11:10 ◼   ► multiple-time readers of this book and [TS]

00:11:13 ◼   ► you know I I don't do [TS]

00:11:15 ◼   ► not a lot of books that i read there are [TS]

00:11:16 ◼   ► some my wife has a strict no reread [TS]

00:11:18 ◼   ► policy which I don't understand but [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► that's our policy admired this i do [TS]

00:11:23 ◼   ► there looked in the world there's always [TS]

00:11:24 ◼   ► other books to read but i don't i don't [TS]

00:11:26 ◼   ► read read a lot but I've reread this and [TS]

00:11:29 ◼   ► will read it again and treasure my copy [TS]

00:11:31 ◼   ► so i think i want to start there which [TS]

00:11:33 ◼   ► is what is it about this book what is it [TS]

00:11:35 ◼   ► that makes it something that stays with [TS]

00:11:37 ◼   ► you and that you want to revisit whether [TS]

00:11:40 ◼   ► you're just feeling sick but it's been [TS]

00:11:43 ◼   ► you or or was thinking about the [TS]

00:11:46 ◼   ► apocalypse that is to come or what I'm [TS]

00:11:48 ◼   ► gonna do is what you guys think [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► well I am a reader to start with I have [TS]

00:11:52 ◼   ► a terrible memory so i can't remember [TS]

00:11:54 ◼   ► books or movies until i have read or [TS]

00:11:56 ◼   ► seen them several times and I really [TS]

00:11:58 ◼   ► like this book the first time through [TS]

00:12:00 ◼   ► and afterwards i remembered that i liked [TS]

00:12:02 ◼   ► it i like maybe I remember that feeling [TS]

00:12:04 ◼   ► of a great enjoyment as I went through [TS]

00:12:05 ◼   ► it but I couldn't remember exactly what [TS]

00:12:07 ◼   ► happened [TS]

00:12:08 ◼   ► therefore I decided to read it again and [TS]

00:12:10 ◼   ► again and here we go again so I think [TS]

00:12:13 ◼   ► for me i'm a sucker for apocalypse [TS]

00:12:15 ◼   ► stories and I think I like stories about [TS]

00:12:18 ◼   ► the apocalypse and stories about way [TS]

00:12:21 ◼   ► after the apocalypse [TS]

00:12:22 ◼   ► so the first half of this book is right [TS]

00:12:24 ◼   ► up my alley I do like the second half [TS]

00:12:27 ◼   ► but it definitely tapers off as far as [TS]

00:12:29 ◼   ► enjoyment goes so i think quite often [TS]

00:12:31 ◼   ► when i start reading it I'm rereading [TS]

00:12:33 ◼   ► just to see the apocalypse happen again [TS]

00:12:35 ◼   ► and then because I've already gotten [TS]

00:12:37 ◼   ► that far i might as well stick around [TS]

00:12:38 ◼   ► for the next six hundred pages [TS]

00:12:40 ◼   ► yeah yeah I feel the same way actually [TS]

00:12:42 ◼   ► that that I I I definitely maybe we can [TS]

00:12:45 ◼   ► talk about this later I definitely enjoy [TS]

00:12:46 ◼   ► the first part more than the the rest of [TS]

00:12:49 ◼   ► it and maybe that is because i'm [TS]

00:12:50 ◼   ► enjoying the the the layout of the [TS]

00:12:54 ◼   ► actual apocalypse as it as it spreads & [TS]

00:12:57 ◼   ► M in the immediate aftermath as opposed [TS]

00:12:59 ◼   ► to sort of then the battle between good [TS]

00:13:02 ◼   ► and evil that comes afternoon what what [TS]

00:13:04 ◼   ► else one of my favorite parts of the [TS]

00:13:06 ◼   ► apocalypse scenario you guys are talking [TS]

00:13:08 ◼   ► about is one that I didn't get to read [TS]

00:13:09 ◼   ► until the complete version came out and [TS]

00:13:11 ◼   ► it's chapter 38 way to describe all the [TS]

00:13:13 ◼   ► ways that people died that are super flu [TS]

00:13:16 ◼   ► yeah that's a great one yeah like the [TS]

00:13:18 ◼   ► poor kids who died from neglect or the [TS]

00:13:20 ◼   ► girl who gets locked in the freezer with [TS]

00:13:22 ◼   ► her husband and her son or the woman who [TS]

00:13:25 ◼   ► blow yourself up with a gun the hair [TS]

00:13:26 ◼   ► an addict i love that chapter um I don't [TS]

00:13:29 ◼   ► know why I just drink it but but i think [TS]

00:13:33 ◼   ► i think because it points out that you [TS]

00:13:34 ◼   ► can have this you know again romantic [TS]

00:13:36 ◼   ► adolescent fantasy about Oh surely once [TS]

00:13:38 ◼   ► i survived its it's all you know she [TS]

00:13:40 ◼   ► cakes and victory and putting myself to [TS]

00:13:42 ◼   ► sleep by the Hope Diamond every night [TS]

00:13:44 ◼   ► and then someone points out that now as [TS]

00:13:47 ◼   ► a matter of fact the world becomes a lot [TS]

00:13:48 ◼   ► more dangerous and you are a lot more [TS]

00:13:50 ◼   ► loan it but I think why I keep rereading [TS]

00:13:53 ◼   ► is I always find someone new to latch [TS]

00:13:56 ◼   ► onto if that makes sense [TS]

00:13:58 ◼   ► um like the first reread I did where I [TS]

00:14:01 ◼   ► realized that when Stephen King was [TS]

00:14:02 ◼   ► writing Harold water he was essentially [TS]

00:14:04 ◼   ► putting a Navitar for a youthful write [TS]

00:14:07 ◼   ► his own youthful regularly ego in the [TS]

00:14:09 ◼   ► book was was kind of an eye-opener [TS]

00:14:11 ◼   ► without holy crap this is a guy who's [TS]

00:14:13 ◼   ► just look back on his working this is [TS]

00:14:15 ◼   ► the guy who's supplementing his own [TS]

00:14:17 ◼   ► self-loathing and his fears about his [TS]

00:14:20 ◼   ► writing in in to harold and it gave me a [TS]

00:14:24 ◼   ► lot more sympathy for that character for [TS]

00:14:25 ◼   ► example and again as i find as i get [TS]

00:14:28 ◼   ► older of different characters do or [TS]

00:14:30 ◼   ► don't resonate with me the way they [TS]

00:14:31 ◼   ► would have when i was a teenager [TS]

00:14:33 ◼   ► um that said Mike Russian jelyn my crush [TS]

00:14:35 ◼   ► on blood Bateman however has been going [TS]

00:14:37 ◼   ► strong for about 30 years [TS]

00:14:38 ◼   ► oh my god I can't explain it but there [TS]

00:14:40 ◼   ► it is oh I like that it's essentially [TS]

00:14:44 ◼   ► three or four different novels in a Rome [TS]

00:14:47 ◼   ► that you get people worrying about the [TS]

00:14:51 ◼   ► spread of the disease and then the [TS]

00:14:53 ◼   ► disease itself and I to love chapter 38 [TS]

00:14:56 ◼   ► because it shows that the author has put [TS]

00:14:58 ◼   ► actually putting thought into what are [TS]

00:15:01 ◼   ► the effects of all these things that I'm [TS]

00:15:04 ◼   ► doing to earth or at least America I [TS]

00:15:06 ◼   ► guess we don't really know what happens [TS]

00:15:07 ◼   ► to the rest of the planet probably not [TS]

00:15:10 ◼   ► great but there aren't that many books [TS]

00:15:12 ◼   ► that take huge tonal shifts where you [TS]

00:15:16 ◼   ► start off with an entire world and then [TS]

00:15:19 ◼   ► 500 pages later you're reading notes [TS]

00:15:22 ◼   ► from us of a note from a subcommittee on [TS]

00:15:25 ◼   ► whether or not to take a census exactly [TS]

00:15:28 ◼   ► why this could this could have been you [TS]

00:15:31 ◼   ► know two books or three books I suppose [TS]

00:15:33 ◼   ► that would have been another way to tell [TS]

00:15:35 ◼   ► it in a different point in the [TS]

00:15:36 ◼   ► publishing industry and in Stephen [TS]

00:15:37 ◼   ► King's career trajectory maybe it [TS]

00:15:39 ◼   ► would've been [TS]

00:15:40 ◼   ► and I don't know he he could have [TS]

00:15:41 ◼   ► started it 500 pages in and just said [TS]

00:15:43 ◼   ► there was an apocalypse and everybody [TS]

00:15:46 ◼   ► but the people i want to talk about died [TS]

00:15:48 ◼   ► but he really takes his time making that [TS]

00:15:50 ◼   ► happen [TS]

00:15:51 ◼   ► I find it fascinating that friend is [TS]

00:15:53 ◼   ► such a naturally gifted writer and he [TS]

00:15:55 ◼   ► just you know it's not he's got some [TS]

00:15:58 ◼   ► weird veins of subtlety through the book [TS]

00:16:00 ◼   ► but I i have found it interesting that [TS]

00:16:02 ◼   ► the fran passages he points out what a [TS]

00:16:04 ◼   ► natural voice she has a natural impulse [TS]

00:16:06 ◼   ► compared to harold who desperately wants [TS]

00:16:08 ◼   ► to be a writer and lets his own stupid [TS]

00:16:10 ◼   ► nature getting away so i think it was [TS]

00:16:12 ◼   ► actually working out some some some [TS]

00:16:14 ◼   ► artistic crisis issues along the way [TS]

00:16:16 ◼   ► with his book to just talk about some [TS]

00:16:18 ◼   ► past podcast I like Apocalypse stories [TS]

00:16:20 ◼   ► as well and this and we also talked [TS]

00:16:22 ◼   ► about in the past there's lots of [TS]

00:16:23 ◼   ► different kinds of apocalypse and the [TS]

00:16:24 ◼   ► most appealing kind to me and one I had [TS]

00:16:26 ◼   ► never read up until this point was i [TS]

00:16:28 ◼   ► guess i think you had called the clean [TS]

00:16:30 ◼   ► apocalypse where things aren't destroyed [TS]

00:16:32 ◼   ► or blown up a radioactive this dead [TS]

00:16:34 ◼   ► bodies everywhere but they eventually [TS]

00:16:35 ◼   ► you know liquefied and dry up the [TS]

00:16:37 ◼   ► animals either you know like take care [TS]

00:16:39 ◼   ► of itself eventually but everything else [TS]

00:16:41 ◼   ► is still there and so it fulfill its [TS]

00:16:44 ◼   ► like it's you know living substance [TS]

00:16:45 ◼   ► missoni wherever you want to live the [TS]

00:16:47 ◼   ► thing that you want to do and all those [TS]

00:16:48 ◼   ► people you know this is booked for [TS]

00:16:50 ◼   ► introverts people get rid of all of the [TS]

00:16:51 ◼   ► people believe all their stomach that [TS]

00:16:53 ◼   ► stuff is pretty cool and so that was [TS]

00:16:55 ◼   ► exciting and they left their stuff and [TS]

00:16:57 ◼   ► and there weren't enough of them left to [TS]

00:16:59 ◼   ► eat all the candy food or anything so [TS]

00:17:01 ◼   ► things yeah pretty good shape given that [TS]

00:17:03 ◼   ► almost everybody is dead right and if [TS]

00:17:05 ◼   ► you read this book read the book as a [TS]

00:17:07 ◼   ► teenager he sounds like a lot of us did [TS]

00:17:09 ◼   ► there are many many characters for you [TS]

00:17:11 ◼   ► to identify with as an introverted [TS]

00:17:13 ◼   ► teenager in in this story and it [TS]

00:17:15 ◼   ► definitely changes of course as you age [TS]

00:17:17 ◼   ► and read the book and start relating [TS]

00:17:18 ◼   ► more for the adults in the story and [TS]

00:17:19 ◼   ► everything like that but so many [TS]

00:17:21 ◼   ► characters that you know I don't have [TS]

00:17:23 ◼   ► necessarily Harold is is stephen king or [TS]

00:17:25 ◼   ► some part of himself in there but like [TS]

00:17:27 ◼   ► it's interesting takes on these type of [TS]

00:17:30 ◼   ► things and we'll talk about the [TS]

00:17:31 ◼   ► characters later but like it's not you [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► think you know where everything is going [TS]

00:17:34 ◼   ► to go especially if you read a stephen [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► king book before because usually sinking [TS]

00:17:37 ◼   ► wants to have like one or two [TS]

00:17:38 ◼   ► Stephen King ish protagonists and you [TS]

00:17:41 ◼   ► kind of know that underneath it all [TS]

00:17:43 ◼   ► they're really good people and they're [TS]

00:17:44 ◼   ► going to face challenges in the floor [TS]

00:17:45 ◼   ► over this so many people in this book he [TS]

00:17:47 ◼   ► can do like the joss whedon thing like [TS]

00:17:49 ◼   ► actually that guy you like is gonna die [TS]

00:17:51 ◼   ► how do you like that one hour [TS]

00:17:52 ◼   ► or this is good this is not going to [TS]

00:17:54 ◼   ► turn out well you know I mean if Harold [TS]

00:17:57 ◼   ► was the only character and like if there [TS]

00:17:59 ◼   ► was a protagonist and Harold and like a [TS]

00:18:00 ◼   ► big baddie bad guy in a regular stephen [TS]

00:18:02 ◼   ► king book how would not have ended up [TS]

00:18:04 ◼   ► the way you did but there are so many [TS]

00:18:05 ◼   ► freakin characters in this book that he [TS]

00:18:07 ◼   ► can he can do everything he can surprise [TS]

00:18:09 ◼   ► you and I was riveted through the whole [TS]

00:18:10 ◼   ► story like it just affected me i don't [TS]

00:18:12 ◼   ► think i've ever read a book with that [TS]

00:18:13 ◼   ► many characters again except maybe lord [TS]

00:18:15 ◼   ► of the rings but Lord of the Rings does [TS]

00:18:17 ◼   ► not spend a lot of time [TS]

00:18:19 ◼   ► flushing out like you're like a mirror [TS]

00:18:20 ◼   ► or something you know it's not did not a [TS]

00:18:22 ◼   ► lot of times whereas stephen king is [TS]

00:18:23 ◼   ► like I know how to do characters I he [TS]

00:18:26 ◼   ► had clearly has an affection for all [TS]

00:18:28 ◼   ► these characters good and bad it's gonna [TS]

00:18:30 ◼   ► give each 150 pages in the end up in the [TS]

00:18:32 ◼   ► same page book [TS]

00:18:33 ◼   ► well he's got a tremendously generous [TS]

00:18:34 ◼   ► heart in the book too because I I feel [TS]

00:18:38 ◼   ► so bad for reward every time I read this [TS]

00:18:40 ◼   ► book I feel bad for Lloyd airport on [TS]

00:18:43 ◼   ► Lloyd well I feel for like the word that [TS]

00:18:45 ◼   ► one of I've never stop feeling sorry for [TS]

00:18:46 ◼   ► those Naomi because she just had no [TS]

00:18:48 ◼   ► chance at all you know i mean there's [TS]

00:18:50 ◼   ► that one moment on a hillside where she [TS]

00:18:52 ◼   ► could have chose differently and I i [TS]

00:18:55 ◼   ► I've often thought about how monstrously [TS]

00:18:58 ◼   ► unfair the the god of this book is with [TS]

00:19:01 ◼   ► the way you know he he lays punishments [TS]

00:19:03 ◼   ► on people for free choice for life and [TS]

00:19:05 ◼   ► naomi is just as horrible horrible [TS]

00:19:07 ◼   ► warning that that but yeah easy [TS]

00:19:10 ◼   ► I John you're right there's a hundred [TS]

00:19:12 ◼   ► fifty pages [TS]

00:19:14 ◼   ► although money wasn't you when you and I [TS]

00:19:15 ◼   ► were talking on twitter and you said [TS]

00:19:16 ◼   ► that you really could have done without [TS]

00:19:17 ◼   ► the part about the kid [TS]

00:19:18 ◼   ► um yeah I've got some problems with the [TS]

00:19:22 ◼   ► kid [TS]

00:19:22 ◼   ► yeah and I can also do without the kid [TS]

00:19:25 ◼   ► once that once we start talking about [TS]

00:19:26 ◼   ► the time that this book is set i will [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► have much more to say about what i think [TS]

00:19:32 ◼   ► is going on with the kid I realized that [TS]

00:19:34 ◼   ► we have had several episodes of the show [TS]

00:19:37 ◼   ► involving books about the apocalypse and [TS]

00:19:40 ◼   ► that is I think doing [TS]

00:19:42 ◼   ► yeah to a lot of influence of of John [TS]

00:19:45 ◼   ► and Lisa it was suggesting and and you [TS]

00:19:49 ◼   ► know a bottle of the apocalypse and [TS]

00:19:50 ◼   ► bringing means only gonna make it worth [TS]

00:19:53 ◼   ► it i turned on its nice it turns out I [TS]

00:19:54 ◼   ► like him too but but it is fascinating [TS]

00:19:58 ◼   ► about i always ask what what draws us to [TS]

00:20:00 ◼   ► it and and there's this idea [TS]

00:20:03 ◼   ► first off there there's just this [TS]

00:20:04 ◼   ► feeling about the fragility of society [TS]

00:20:05 ◼   ► and [TS]

00:20:05 ◼   ► how does the world and here it is a [TS]

00:20:07 ◼   ► fairly we watch it play out but really [TS]

00:20:12 ◼   ► it's it's a premise in action which is [TS]

00:20:14 ◼   ► what if almost everybody died and then [TS]

00:20:16 ◼   ► he's got a reason why everybody dies and [TS]

00:20:18 ◼   ► it's not [TS]

00:20:19 ◼   ► yeah and it's it's basically accidental [TS]

00:20:21 ◼   ► release of a biological warfare agent [TS]

00:20:23 ◼   ► that that kills everybody and and and [TS]

00:20:26 ◼   ► then they're swept aside and then what's [TS]

00:20:27 ◼   ► fascinating to me is that then it's all [TS]

00:20:29 ◼   ► about the what happens when you find [TS]

00:20:31 ◼   ► yourself alone and society has vanished [TS]

00:20:33 ◼   ► and what do you do and what how do you [TS]

00:20:36 ◼   ► survive and and that leads into that [TS]

00:20:38 ◼   ► second phase of the book which is kind [TS]

00:20:40 ◼   ► of fascinating which is this weird like [TS]

00:20:43 ◼   ► you know we hear that there's some lady [TS]

00:20:46 ◼   ► out out west that we're gonna go find [TS]

00:20:49 ◼   ► and it's strange [TS]

00:20:50 ◼   ► and-and-and has almost like a mythical [TS]

00:20:53 ◼   ► quality to it but it's also you know [TS]

00:20:55 ◼   ► it's also it says something to me about [TS]

00:20:57 ◼   ► like people are trying to find somewhere [TS]

00:20:59 ◼   ► to go and something do because they it's [TS]

00:21:01 ◼   ► you know it's over the the story that [TS]

00:21:03 ◼   ► they thought they were living in is over [TS]

00:21:05 ◼   ► and it turns out there in a very [TS]

00:21:06 ◼   ► different kind of story and that that is [TS]

00:21:08 ◼   ► fascinating to i think yeah I think that [TS]

00:21:11 ◼   ► that those are the most interesting [TS]

00:21:12 ◼   ► parts of the book to me and RR when the [TS]

00:21:14 ◼   ► world is ending and then immediately [TS]

00:21:15 ◼   ► after where everybody is uprooted and [TS]

00:21:17 ◼   ► has no idea what they're going to do to [TS]

00:21:19 ◼   ► survive and they're kind of like [TS]

00:21:20 ◼   ► glomming onto people they find and those [TS]

00:21:23 ◼   ► people are sometimes good and sometimes [TS]

00:21:24 ◼   ► not well I think when it gets to the you [TS]

00:21:27 ◼   ► know the end part where it's really sort [TS]

00:21:29 ◼   ► of the good versus evil and they're also [TS]

00:21:30 ◼   ► having town meetings and stuff i sort of [TS]

00:21:33 ◼   ► bifurcation myself a bit and I enjoy it [TS]

00:21:35 ◼   ► on two completely different tracks i [TS]

00:21:38 ◼   ► really like the the the town meeting [TS]

00:21:41 ◼   ► style stuff like how does society try to [TS]

00:21:43 ◼   ► rebuild its tough both on that you know [TS]

00:21:45 ◼   ► that the good side and a bad side but I [TS]

00:21:47 ◼   ► don't like mixing that with the good [TS]

00:21:49 ◼   ► versus evil thing I prefer my good [TS]

00:21:50 ◼   ► versus evil stories to be a little bit [TS]

00:21:53 ◼   ► more in your face with you know dragons [TS]

00:21:54 ◼   ► and stuff like that so I'm also enjoying [TS]

00:21:57 ◼   ► you like it to be more in your face and [TS]

00:21:58 ◼   ► Randall Flagg is a little too subtle for [TS]

00:22:00 ◼   ► you haha i guess i mean a fantastical [TS]

00:22:04 ◼   ► are probably better better term for that [TS]

00:22:06 ◼   ► so I'm still enjoying the good versus [TS]

00:22:08 ◼   ► evil thing but so so dragons are [TS]

00:22:11 ◼   ► slightly more fantastical in a giant [TS]

00:22:13 ◼   ► hand made of lightning coming out of the [TS]

00:22:15 ◼   ► out of the middle of nowhere he saves [TS]

00:22:17 ◼   ► after the big [TS]

00:22:17 ◼   ► finish though he didn't get the animals [TS]

00:22:19 ◼   ► a lot but you know it's more about the [TS]

00:22:22 ◼   ► setting i prefer it not to be in a [TS]

00:22:24 ◼   ► real-world typesetting yeah [TS]

00:22:26 ◼   ► time for a brief break to tell you about [TS]

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00:22:31 ◼   ► me talk about lynda.com before ly in da [TS]

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00:22:49 ◼   ► out of a book these are the people who [TS]

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00:23:05 ◼   ► it's very clear it's well-put-together [TS]

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00:23:33 ◼   ► but you want your skills to be a little [TS]

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00:23:38 ◼   ► everyday anything in the adobe creative [TS]

00:23:40 ◼   ► cloud microsoft office the apple pro [TS]

00:23:43 ◼   ► apps like final cut and logic all of [TS]

00:23:45 ◼   ► that stuff there are lynda.com courses [TS]

00:23:47 ◼   ► to help you stay current to get what's [TS]

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00:23:52 ◼   ► it's all there there's an ipad for [TS]

00:23:54 ◼   ► business course to get maximum [TS]

00:23:56 ◼   ► productivity out of the ipad there's a [TS]

00:23:58 ◼   ► google docs and sheets on iOS first look [TS]

00:24:01 ◼   ► that's out now [TS]

00:24:02 ◼   ► keynote six training really if you can [TS]

00:24:04 ◼   ► think about it there's probably a great [TS]

00:24:06 ◼   ► lynda.com course on that subject and the [TS]

00:24:10 ◼   ► courses are all broken down into little [TS]

00:24:11 ◼   ► bite-sized pieces so even if you only [TS]

00:24:13 ◼   ► have 15 minutes you can learn something [TS]

00:24:15 ◼   ► because you can look at the course and [TS]

00:24:17 ◼   ► jump right to the part that you want to [TS]

00:24:19 ◼   ► learn about it really is great stuff if [TS]

00:24:21 ◼   ► you haven't checked it out i encourage [TS]

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00:24:24 ◼   ► part you can check it out for free for [TS]

00:24:27 ◼   ► seven days and it's not just a little [TS]

00:24:30 ◼   ► taste you have [TS]

00:24:31 ◼   ► access to the entire lynda.com library [TS]

00:24:33 ◼   ► for seven days you can learn so much [TS]

00:24:35 ◼   ► that you'll become a super genius and [TS]

00:24:37 ◼   ► take over the world after seven days or [TS]

00:24:40 ◼   ► you can keep on going as a lynda.com [TS]

00:24:42 ◼   ► member after that but here's where you [TS]

00:24:43 ◼   ► go to get seven days of mind expanding [TS]

00:24:46 ◼   ► video training for free [TS]

00:24:50 ◼   ► lynda.com / incomparable that's ly [TS]

00:24:53 ◼   ► nba.com slash incomparable to try [TS]

00:24:56 ◼   ► lynda.com free for seven days [TS]

00:24:59 ◼   ► ly nba.com slash and comfortable and [TS]

00:25:02 ◼   ► thanks so much to linda.com for [TS]

00:25:04 ◼   ► sponsoring being comfortable that I [TS]

00:25:06 ◼   ► haven't Vegas chapters problematic but [TS]

00:25:08 ◼   ► the reason I do is because there's I [TS]

00:25:10 ◼   ► don't think he ever fully flushes out [TS]

00:25:12 ◼   ► the parallel between the Las Vegas [TS]

00:25:15 ◼   ► society and the boulder society of the [TS]

00:25:17 ◼   ► no las vegas already has the lights on [TS]

00:25:20 ◼   ► and bolder they're all just kind of you [TS]

00:25:23 ◼   ► know that the implications that Boulder [TS]

00:25:24 ◼   ► the kind of disorganized because they're [TS]

00:25:26 ◼   ► all very nice whereas in Las Vegas [TS]

00:25:27 ◼   ► everybody kind of has this natural bent [TS]

00:25:29 ◼   ► towards toadying and so they're ok with [TS]

00:25:30 ◼   ► being bossed around and um he only goes [TS]

00:25:34 ◼   ► into this once or twice [TS]

00:25:36 ◼   ► oh gosh there's I have to find the [TS]

00:25:38 ◼   ► passage it's about um Danny who has the [TS]

00:25:41 ◼   ► rotating cast of mothers and there's [TS]

00:25:43 ◼   ► only a few passages here and talk about [TS]

00:25:45 ◼   ► how the people who end up in Vegas are [TS]

00:25:47 ◼   ► not necessarily all evil [TS]

00:25:49 ◼   ► they're just people who drifted one way [TS]

00:25:52 ◼   ► or another because of fear or because of [TS]

00:25:54 ◼   ► an inability to reflect on the contents [TS]

00:25:56 ◼   ► of their own characters and I really [TS]

00:25:58 ◼   ► wish that King would have done more of a [TS]

00:25:59 ◼   ► meditation on on how how how very little [TS]

00:26:02 ◼   ► difference there is between so-called [TS]

00:26:05 ◼   ► good and so-called evil but it just [TS]

00:26:06 ◼   ► comes down to a series of choices that [TS]

00:26:08 ◼   ► you do or don't consciously make all the [TS]

00:26:10 ◼   ► time but that stuff is that stuff isn't [TS]

00:26:12 ◼   ► as fun as following trashcan man around [TS]

00:26:14 ◼   ► the desert [TS]

00:26:15 ◼   ► oh he's another tragic figure yeah [TS]

00:26:17 ◼   ► already simple pension check [TS]

00:26:20 ◼   ► he was so much fair to the bad guys like [TS]

00:26:22 ◼   ► it it's not it is a little bit one-sided [TS]

00:26:24 ◼   ► because this way more good guys that are [TS]

00:26:25 ◼   ► fleshed out but we talk about Lloyd I [TS]

00:26:27 ◼   ► think and it's before the show and you [TS]

00:26:30 ◼   ► know this is not a lot of bad guy [TS]

00:26:31 ◼   ► characters but for the most part [TS]

00:26:32 ◼   ► everybody who's in Vegas who gets [TS]

00:26:35 ◼   ► flushed out a little bit has a reason [TS]

00:26:37 ◼   ► for being there has their own [TS]

00:26:38 ◼   ► motivations the only one who is [TS]

00:26:39 ◼   ► ridiculously velez flag and even he is [TS]

00:26:42 ◼   ► you know sort of evil but doesn't quite [TS]

00:26:45 ◼   ► understand why and is you know that [TS]

00:26:48 ◼   ► starts to fall apart towards the end he [TS]

00:26:50 ◼   ► starts off as elemental force but then [TS]

00:26:51 ◼   ► towards the end he is all let his more [TS]

00:26:54 ◼   ► shaky and it's clear that he's like well [TS]

00:26:55 ◼   ► he's kind of a man but he's also kind of [TS]

00:26:57 ◼   ► this force of nature but he's not behind [TS]

00:26:59 ◼   ► the force of nature and you know it all [TS]

00:27:01 ◼   ► comes to a head at the end I the good [TS]

00:27:04 ◼   ► versus evil thing I don't I think that [TS]

00:27:07 ◼   ► blends well with the apocalypse because [TS]

00:27:09 ◼   ► once you just have like a bunch of ppl [TS]

00:27:11 ◼   ► rattling around the united states like [TS]

00:27:13 ◼   ► it seems like you know that the world [TS]

00:27:14 ◼   ► shrinks so much like obviously if you do [TS]

00:27:16 ◼   ► the math is way more people than there [TS]

00:27:18 ◼   ► are in boulder or Las Vegas left in the [TS]

00:27:20 ◼   ► country but we just focus on the small [TS]

00:27:21 ◼   ► group and once you're just rattling [TS]

00:27:23 ◼   ► around in the country like that it's [TS]

00:27:24 ◼   ► very easy to slip back and sort of [TS]

00:27:26 ◼   ► primal is Aman tribalism and one of my [TS]

00:27:28 ◼   ► in my future and my later reads this [TS]

00:27:31 ◼   ► book one of the interpretations i [TS]

00:27:32 ◼   ► started to latch onto is that it is the [TS]

00:27:35 ◼   ► really real world and there's not really [TS]

00:27:37 ◼   ► any you know Stephen King style magical [TS]

00:27:40 ◼   ► supernatural stuff but as soon as you [TS]

00:27:42 ◼   ► strip everything away people immediately [TS]

00:27:44 ◼   ► fall back to their primitive you know [TS]

00:27:46 ◼   ► demon haunted world kind of you know [TS]

00:27:49 ◼   ► superstitions and this story of what [TS]

00:27:52 ◼   ► happened between this group in Las Vegas [TS]

00:27:53 ◼   ► and the Super Bowl tickets retold a few [TS]

00:27:55 ◼   ► times and eventually all the [TS]

00:27:56 ◼   ► superstitions become actual magic and [TS]

00:27:58 ◼   ► the stories about you know Randall Flagg [TS]

00:28:00 ◼   ► become real stories and like you can you [TS]

00:28:02 ◼   ► can look at this anymore talk about this [TS]

00:28:03 ◼   ► with toro we can connect this totals [TS]

00:28:05 ◼   ► about you can look at this and say this [TS]

00:28:08 ◼   ► this is an entirely you know this is how [TS]

00:28:10 ◼   ► the this story is viewed but [TS]

00:28:12 ◼   ► realistically what really happens like [TS]

00:28:14 ◼   ► crash came and just rolled up with it [TS]

00:28:15 ◼   ► together probably everybody out and it [TS]

00:28:17 ◼   ► wasn't hand of God said offers crazy guy [TS]

00:28:19 ◼   ► who thought he was going to be you know [TS]

00:28:20 ◼   ► like if they're all plausible logical [TS]

00:28:22 ◼   ► explanation for something that could [TS]

00:28:24 ◼   ► they could play out like this and you [TS]

00:28:25 ◼   ► can just become embellished in in the [TS]

00:28:27 ◼   ► retelling three or four times that's all [TS]

00:28:29 ◼   ► it takes right and why would that happen [TS]

00:28:31 ◼   ► why would this otherwise rational people [TS]

00:28:33 ◼   ► start believing in this magical story [TS]

00:28:35 ◼   ► two or three generations because that's [TS]

00:28:36 ◼   ► exactly how it happens all the time and [TS]

00:28:38 ◼   ► so not that I'm saying that's my [TS]

00:28:39 ◼   ► favorite interpretation of the book but [TS]

00:28:40 ◼   ► the more I read the more I say the more [TS]

00:28:42 ◼   ► i like looking at it as like everything [TS]

00:28:44 ◼   ► has an actual real explanation and the [TS]

00:28:46 ◼   ► good versus evil thing is it's kind of [TS]

00:28:47 ◼   ► like red conned into it like oh of [TS]

00:28:50 ◼   ► course there was a super evil guy we [TS]

00:28:51 ◼   ► were the super good people and you know [TS]

00:28:53 ◼   ► I mean [TS]

00:28:53 ◼   ► I think you have to dismiss arrange that [TS]

00:28:55 ◼   ► he said he explained that the last two [TS]

00:28:57 ◼   ► pages of the book which is that Randall [TS]

00:28:59 ◼   ► flagons have revived on the shore of [TS]

00:29:01 ◼   ► some African nation right well that's [TS]

00:29:03 ◼   ► the story of like what you can never [TS]

00:29:04 ◼   ► actually kill evil kids because you know [TS]

00:29:05 ◼   ► it always comes back right and I mean [TS]

00:29:07 ◼   ► I'm not saying like I i say that's what [TS]

00:29:09 ◼   ► obviously it's not the intent of the [TS]

00:29:10 ◼   ► author that's not the primary [TS]

00:29:12 ◼   ► interpretation of the book but sometimes [TS]

00:29:14 ◼   ► when I squint that especially the thing [TS]

00:29:16 ◼   ► with the bomb going off because that is [TS]

00:29:17 ◼   ► like the most overt I hey guys there's [TS]

00:29:19 ◼   ► magic and oh here's the hand of god and [TS]

00:29:21 ◼   ► it's like yeah maybe or maybe the thing [TS]

00:29:23 ◼   ► just went off accidentally because no [TS]

00:29:25 ◼   ► one is going to be alive to tell the [TS]

00:29:26 ◼   ► tale so who's you know to me and let me [TS]

00:29:28 ◼   ► get the you know the omniscient narrator [TS]

00:29:29 ◼   ► tells that this is what happened but if [TS]

00:29:32 ◼   ► you just see a big mushroom cloud in the [TS]

00:29:33 ◼   ► distance and you know Stu end up going [TS]

00:29:35 ◼   ► home and retails but you like the it [TS]

00:29:37 ◼   ► explains how legends come to be in that [TS]

00:29:39 ◼   ► almost everything had to happen this [TS]

00:29:40 ◼   ► book is real certainly the apocalypse is [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► because science-based or whatever and [TS]

00:29:44 ◼   ► then all the dreams they have a sort of [TS]

00:29:45 ◼   ► old testament god that's one of my [TS]

00:29:47 ◼   ► favorite things about this book like [TS]

00:29:48 ◼   ► mother Abigail's God is the Old [TS]

00:29:50 ◼   ► Testament God not that not the new [TS]

00:29:51 ◼   ► Desmond and so don't give me that old [TS]

00:29:54 ◼   ► time religion so this is a lot of that [TS]

00:29:56 ◼   ► sort of baked into the book like it's [TS]

00:29:57 ◼   ► not be kinder gentler got it anymore you [TS]

00:29:59 ◼   ► know it's the strange arbitrary weird [TS]

00:30:01 ◼   ► one and you can you can record it all [TS]

00:30:03 ◼   ► and they explained it away [TS]

00:30:05 ◼   ► well I mean talk to rephrase what you're [TS]

00:30:07 ◼   ► saying I think what you're saying is you [TS]

00:30:08 ◼   ► know that that's why this book has this [TS]

00:30:10 ◼   ► mythical kind of feel to it whether [TS]

00:30:12 ◼   ► whether even when it's not intended [TS]

00:30:13 ◼   ► that's how it that's how it feels that [TS]

00:30:15 ◼   ► yeah I guess that's literally what [TS]

00:30:17 ◼   ► happened this literally is like one of [TS]

00:30:18 ◼   ► those stories and if it wasn't what [TS]

00:30:20 ◼   ► happened this is how those you know this [TS]

00:30:21 ◼   ► is a struggle between good and evil as a [TS]

00:30:24 ◼   ► relatively skeptical person i would say [TS]

00:30:25 ◼   ► I one of the things that I like about [TS]

00:30:26 ◼   ► this book is the fact that it is not I [TS]

00:30:30 ◼   ► like that it's telling this this you [TS]

00:30:32 ◼   ► know almost mythological story about [TS]

00:30:33 ◼   ► good and evil and the forces lining up [TS]

00:30:36 ◼   ► against each other because quite [TS]

00:30:38 ◼   ► honestly one of the things that exhaust [TS]

00:30:39 ◼   ► me about so many apocalypse stories is [TS]

00:30:41 ◼   ► that it's just well what happens [TS]

00:30:44 ◼   ► afterward everybody kills each other and [TS]

00:30:45 ◼   ► each other until there's nobody left and [TS]

00:30:47 ◼   ► then we're all dead and that's the end [TS]

00:30:49 ◼   ► and here it's like no no there's another [TS]

00:30:51 ◼   ► story that happens which is this you [TS]

00:30:53 ◼   ► know ultimate battle between the forces [TS]

00:30:55 ◼   ► of good and evil and all the IT people [TS]

00:30:58 ◼   ► are going to go to Las Vegas where [TS]

00:30:59 ◼   ► they're going to get electricity running [TS]

00:31:01 ◼   ► and that's evil [TS]

00:31:02 ◼   ► I think what was what [TS]

00:31:04 ◼   ► that woman's got the speech where he [TS]

00:31:06 ◼   ► says because he lays it out nice as well [TS]

00:31:08 ◼   ► is going to get scientists engineers [TS]

00:31:10 ◼   ► military types of law enforcement [TS]

00:31:11 ◼   ► because they like structure there like [TS]

00:31:13 ◼   ► order and they're going to jump at the [TS]

00:31:14 ◼   ► opportunity to to follow somebody who [TS]

00:31:16 ◼   ► offers from a promise of that and [TS]

00:31:18 ◼   ► remember reading that again as a kid [TS]

00:31:20 ◼   ► going to that's harsh and a hard drive [TS]

00:31:22 ◼   ► for Tristan like yeah I can see that in [TS]

00:31:28 ◼   ► general like Stephen King for most of [TS]

00:31:30 ◼   ► his stories doesn't do the Marvel movie [TS]

00:31:34 ◼   ► thing where the world always has to be [TS]

00:31:35 ◼   ► in peril a lot of the stories especially [TS]

00:31:37 ◼   ► his early ones were small something [TS]

00:31:39 ◼   ► happening in a small town there's one [TS]

00:31:40 ◼   ► vampire in a small town there's a good [TS]

00:31:43 ◼   ► telekinetic and it's like the world's [TS]

00:31:44 ◼   ► always the same small town [TS]

00:31:46 ◼   ► well you know that they think they're [TS]

00:31:48 ◼   ► all very castle rock sometimes its dairy [TS]

00:31:50 ◼   ► but like it doesn't have the disease [TS]

00:31:52 ◼   ► where world you know fantasy novels have [TS]

00:31:54 ◼   ► this the worst the world is always in [TS]

00:31:55 ◼   ► peril bites the resurgence of some [TS]

00:31:57 ◼   ► ancient evil looks like it's always the [TS]

00:31:58 ◼   ► world it's never like just within some [TS]

00:32:00 ◼   ► villages one where often we do a whole [TS]

00:32:02 ◼   ► story about that and like who cares you [TS]

00:32:03 ◼   ► can wipe out the whole village no one [TS]

00:32:05 ◼   ► notices little town in Maine but I he [TS]

00:32:07 ◼   ► has to you know to sort of great works [TS]

00:32:10 ◼   ► of intertwined that our world in peril [TS]

00:32:12 ◼   ► things were you know that the dark tower [TS]

00:32:14 ◼   ► and the stand and those were his like [TS]

00:32:17 ◼   ► you can argue which one is like it you [TS]

00:32:19 ◼   ► know obviously the dark tower sort of [TS]

00:32:20 ◼   ► the cornerstone of his entire work and [TS]

00:32:22 ◼   ► wraps everything up but the stand is the [TS]

00:32:24 ◼   ► one big sort of pillar in you know i'm [TS]

00:32:27 ◼   ► going to i'm gonna kill everybody in the [TS]

00:32:29 ◼   ► world this is this is a world in peril [TS]

00:32:31 ◼   ► fight for the soul of humanity good [TS]

00:32:32 ◼   ► versus evil which he didn't indulge in [TS]

00:32:35 ◼   ► in his career up to that point i'm [TS]

00:32:37 ◼   ► trying to think of what did he did he go [TS]

00:32:39 ◼   ► back to that I think this is more or [TS]

00:32:41 ◼   ► less the only sort of realistic world in [TS]

00:32:44 ◼   ► peril thing and then there's the dark [TS]

00:32:46 ◼   ► tower which is world's plural in [TS]

00:32:47 ◼   ► parallel reality but it's either gonna [TS]

00:32:49 ◼   ► get expansion this idea right i mean [TS]

00:32:51 ◼   ► that the dark dad was kind of the [TS]

00:32:54 ◼   ► standard large and away [TS]

00:32:55 ◼   ► well but it's all it's all [TS]

00:32:56 ◼   ► interconnected I mean you've got like [TS]

00:32:58 ◼   ► one of my favorite things is like it if [TS]

00:33:00 ◼   ► you just if I was you recommend someone [TS]

00:33:01 ◼   ► read three things by Stephen King would [TS]

00:33:03 ◼   ► be like the entire dark salary series to [TS]

00:33:05 ◼   ► stand in the eyes of the dragon just to [TS]

00:33:06 ◼   ► see how you can take how you can take [TS]

00:33:09 ◼   ► three entirely different genres and and [TS]

00:33:12 ◼   ► styles of books and audiences and [TS]

00:33:14 ◼   ► connect them all into one big thing and [TS]

00:33:16 ◼   ► it's just it's just [TS]

00:33:17 ◼   ► fascinating fascinating trainwreck are [TS]

00:33:19 ◼   ► fascinating beautiful tapestry depending [TS]

00:33:21 ◼   ► on how you look at it actually the very [TS]

00:33:23 ◼   ► first time that i reread the stand was [TS]

00:33:26 ◼   ► after I'd started reading the dark tower [TS]

00:33:27 ◼   ► books and I was like oh yeah like you [TS]

00:33:29 ◼   ► meet somebody told me that he weaves [TS]

00:33:30 ◼   ► them in a little bit so it's like okay [TS]

00:33:32 ◼   ► I'm going to read all of his other stuff [TS]

00:33:33 ◼   ► that has little connections to shower [TS]

00:33:36 ◼   ► which all just about everything I said [TS]

00:33:38 ◼   ► so and so I did and and then actually [TS]

00:33:42 ◼   ► just before i read the stand this time i [TS]

00:33:44 ◼   ► had just finished reading wizard and [TS]

00:33:45 ◼   ► glass again which has the scene where [TS]

00:33:47 ◼   ► those characters are walking through [TS]

00:33:49 ◼   ► what seems to be Kansas during the time [TS]

00:33:52 ◼   ► of the post-apocalypse because you know [TS]

00:33:55 ◼   ► they see a newspaper that says captain [TS]

00:33:57 ◼   ► trips on it just like oh I just get that [TS]

00:33:59 ◼   ► little shiver every time I see that hard [TS]

00:34:01 ◼   ► again because of its it's that book but [TS]

00:34:03 ◼   ► then they also point out that the the [TS]

00:34:05 ◼   ► baseball team is what is it the Kansas [TS]

00:34:07 ◼   ► City Monarchs instead of the Kansas City [TS]

00:34:08 ◼   ► Royals so it's not actually our world we [TS]

00:34:10 ◼   ► could still be in for this always want [TS]

00:34:13 ◼   ► to be monarch swears that negro league [TS]

00:34:15 ◼   ► team [TS]

00:34:15 ◼   ► mhm true but in this in this in wizard [TS]

00:34:18 ◼   ► glasses the MLB major league baseball [TS]

00:34:21 ◼   ► and Lisa was mentioning Glenn Bateman [TS]

00:34:23 ◼   ► speeches before and I remember my first [TS]

00:34:25 ◼   ► couple of read-throughs of the books [TS]

00:34:26 ◼   ► that was my favorite part because it was [TS]

00:34:28 ◼   ► like a character in the blade like you [TS]

00:34:30 ◼   ► always wanted characters characters in [TS]

00:34:31 ◼   ► the book to discuss like the discuss [TS]

00:34:34 ◼   ► what's happening in the book this is not [TS]

00:34:35 ◼   ► sit down and talk about it a few times [TS]

00:34:37 ◼   ► they did that it's like yes glad it's [TS]

00:34:39 ◼   ► finally saying all the things that I'm [TS]

00:34:40 ◼   ► thinking what are the people going to [TS]

00:34:41 ◼   ► let's discuss it like instead of just [TS]

00:34:43 ◼   ► the characters being in dread and always [TS]

00:34:45 ◼   ► running from chases or whatever he would [TS]

00:34:46 ◼   ► sit down every once in a while inside [TS]

00:34:48 ◼   ► will help [TS]

00:34:48 ◼   ► let's think this is gonna turn out like [TS]

00:34:50 ◼   ► see that's exactly the only conversation [TS]

00:34:52 ◼   ► I would ever be having with people would [TS]

00:34:53 ◼   ► be like constant rehashing of Glenn's [TS]

00:34:55 ◼   ► conversations there there are some [TS]

00:34:59 ◼   ► characters i have more of a problem with [TS]

00:35:01 ◼   ► as i get older just because I think oh [TS]

00:35:02 ◼   ► you know you tried buddy but you didn't [TS]

00:35:04 ◼   ► quite nail it and I have rarely [TS]

00:35:07 ◼   ► connected to the women in this book the [TS]

00:35:09 ◼   ► same way i've connected to the male [TS]

00:35:11 ◼   ► characters and I have spent a lot of [TS]

00:35:13 ◼   ► useless time thinking about whether [TS]

00:35:15 ◼   ► that's because King bro this is a [TS]

00:35:17 ◼   ► comparatively young man and was still [TS]

00:35:19 ◼   ► developing the kind of imagination [TS]

00:35:21 ◼   ► empathy needed for whether it's because [TS]

00:35:23 ◼   ► the book was written during the nineteen [TS]

00:35:25 ◼   ► seventies and perhaps gender attitudes [TS]

00:35:28 ◼   ► for that dramatically different [TS]

00:35:29 ◼   ► or what the story is but there's an [TS]

00:35:32 ◼   ► awful lot of slapping of women's faces [TS]

00:35:34 ◼   ► that takes place in like the first [TS]

00:35:35 ◼   ► quarter of the book and I've always been [TS]

00:35:38 ◼   ► vaguely bought I've always been kind of [TS]

00:35:39 ◼   ► bothered by by two things by Miss [TS]

00:35:41 ◼   ► Abigail's you know elderlies mystical [TS]

00:35:44 ◼   ► black woman check because it feel it [TS]

00:35:46 ◼   ► does feel kind of sticky you know it's [TS]

00:35:48 ◼   ► it's the kind of thing that young white [TS]

00:35:49 ◼   ► men right when they're oh she's machine [TS]

00:35:51 ◼   ► applies she's with you she's so [TS]

00:35:53 ◼   ► profoundly other like oh she's a woman [TS]

00:35:55 ◼   ► and she's black and she's old she's [TS]

00:35:58 ◼   ► basically you know and she's a bad West [TS]

00:36:00 ◼   ► she's actually no yeah no she's [TS]

00:36:02 ◼   ► absolutely like she's every possible of [TS]

00:36:04 ◼   ► you can take off on the box and and [TS]

00:36:06 ◼   ► that's always bugged me that the way [TS]

00:36:08 ◼   ► that he's written her especially that [TS]

00:36:11 ◼   ► passage about how much you enjoy sex and [TS]

00:36:13 ◼   ► then I've always had a difficult time [TS]

00:36:15 ◼   ► connecting to [TS]

00:36:16 ◼   ► but like the the part of the book that I [TS]

00:36:18 ◼   ► feel the best toward friend is always [TS]

00:36:20 ◼   ► the part where she's burning her dad and [TS]

00:36:22 ◼   ► then after my life I've always kind of [TS]

00:36:25 ◼   ► had our friend with the hell are you [TS]

00:36:26 ◼   ► thinking is is going through my mind [TS]

00:36:27 ◼   ► through most of the rest of the book [TS]

00:36:29 ◼   ► most of the time and again I tried to [TS]

00:36:31 ◼   ► figure out if this is a cat's the result [TS]

00:36:33 ◼   ► of King writing this when he was very [TS]

00:36:34 ◼   ► young because he's got a roster of great [TS]

00:36:37 ◼   ► female characters for a lot of the rest [TS]

00:36:39 ◼   ► of his books or if this is an unwitting [TS]

00:36:41 ◼   ► reflection of the time period in which [TS]

00:36:43 ◼   ► King was writing this book or what but [TS]

00:36:44 ◼   ► there's there's something about you know [TS]

00:36:46 ◼   ► Lucy and Nadine and and and you know [TS]

00:36:50 ◼   ► yeah but the data Jergens the data [TS]

00:36:51 ◼   ► Jergens lesbian turn on and off thing is [TS]

00:36:53 ◼   ► a little problematic and and you know [TS]

00:36:55 ◼   ► this if you're writing this book now eat [TS]

00:36:59 ◼   ► I think he'd get dinged for it [TS]

00:37:00 ◼   ► yeah I I never actually noticed that [TS]

00:37:02 ◼   ► sort of stuff when I was younger [TS]

00:37:03 ◼   ► yeah I I kind of the first few times [TS]

00:37:05 ◼   ► throughout think I related to friend and [TS]

00:37:07 ◼   ► then now reading it I really don't in [TS]

00:37:10 ◼   ► part because I'm older than she is and [TS]

00:37:12 ◼   ► she acts a lot younger than she is i [TS]

00:37:14 ◼   ► think in many cases but I think also [TS]

00:37:16 ◼   ► just the fact that there aren't a lot of [TS]

00:37:18 ◼   ► women when when you are compared with [TS]

00:37:20 ◼   ► the number of well-developed male [TS]

00:37:21 ◼   ► characters and then the choices that [TS]

00:37:23 ◼   ► they're all kind of archetypal and you [TS]

00:37:26 ◼   ► do get a lot of that on male side but i [TS]

00:37:27 ◼   ► think there are enough guys that they're [TS]

00:37:29 ◼   ► not all that way so you've got mother [TS]

00:37:31 ◼   ► Abigail as the you know archetypal other [TS]

00:37:33 ◼   ► yo woman basically and then you know [TS]

00:37:36 ◼   ► you've got you've got Nadine sort of the [TS]

00:37:38 ◼   ► femme fatale and religion sacrifice [TS]

00:37:42 ◼   ► yeah that too and then you get the [TS]

00:37:44 ◼   ► girlfriend and the mother figure you [TS]

00:37:47 ◼   ► know friend turns into the mother figure [TS]

00:37:48 ◼   ► after being just like the wayward [TS]

00:37:50 ◼   ► wayward daughter figure and none of them [TS]

00:37:53 ◼   ► seem quite as real to me as any of the [TS]

00:37:56 ◼   ► the male characters throughout but I [TS]

00:37:58 ◼   ► thought that perhaps one of the reasons [TS]

00:38:00 ◼   ► for this is the archetypal thing this is [TS]

00:38:02 ◼   ► a story of good vs evil the characters [TS]

00:38:04 ◼   ► all sort of do have a little bit of that [TS]

00:38:07 ◼   ► in their DNA [TS]

00:38:08 ◼   ► I think that it fits so I I don't get [TS]

00:38:11 ◼   ► too worked up about it but I do tilt my [TS]

00:38:13 ◼   ► head a little bit i feel that kings [TS]

00:38:16 ◼   ► point of view can be shown by right at [TS]

00:38:18 ◼   ► the end of the book when even though [TS]

00:38:20 ◼   ► he's giving us dozens and dozens of [TS]

00:38:22 ◼   ► characters pretty much the four living [TS]

00:38:25 ◼   ► white middle-aged dudes go off to solve [TS]

00:38:27 ◼   ► the problem [TS]

00:38:28 ◼   ► yeah let's be fair most of them died [TS]

00:38:31 ◼   ► yeah 3 out of the 4 end up dead and the [TS]

00:38:34 ◼   ► photos I've seen by a mentally [TS]

00:38:35 ◼   ► challenged man they get to go be Christ [TS]

00:38:37 ◼   ► figures but there it's basically [TS]

00:38:40 ◼   ► everybody else stay at home [TS]

00:38:42 ◼   ► yeah i think it's clear that King [TS]

00:38:45 ◼   ► understands the male characters in the [TS]

00:38:48 ◼   ► book more than he understands the female [TS]

00:38:50 ◼   ► ones and it's easier this point his [TS]

00:38:51 ◼   ► writing career where that makes a [TS]

00:38:54 ◼   ► difference in his characterization will [TS]

00:38:55 ◼   ► give more time to the male characters [TS]

00:38:57 ◼   ► and their their internal monologues and [TS]

00:38:59 ◼   ► motivations and actions make more sense [TS]

00:39:02 ◼   ► from the various perspectives obviously [TS]

00:39:03 ◼   ► he clearly understands Herald and the [TS]

00:39:05 ◼   ► older man who sort of like what he wants [TS]

00:39:07 ◼   ► to be but the women they do fall into [TS]

00:39:09 ◼   ► all these roles and it got the roles [TS]

00:39:11 ◼   ► they fall into the role so I don't know [TS]

00:39:13 ◼   ► the rules of the Stephen King sees for [TS]

00:39:14 ◼   ► women or the women had the seventies but [TS]

00:39:16 ◼   ► so many of the women's opinions not just [TS]

00:39:18 ◼   ► in this book with a lot of his books had [TS]

00:39:20 ◼   ► to do with how they relate to the men in [TS]

00:39:22 ◼   ► the books which man are they going to [TS]

00:39:24 ◼   ► choose as their man which man will be [TS]

00:39:26 ◼   ► their protector which man fulfills that [TS]

00:39:28 ◼   ► like they're the women are looking [TS]

00:39:30 ◼   ► towards the men and the men are looking [TS]

00:39:32 ◼   ► towards the horizon and so they end up [TS]

00:39:35 ◼   ► either at the end up either thinly drawn [TS]

00:39:37 ◼   ► or just not given as much time to [TS]

00:39:41 ◼   ► develop you made like the the other [TS]

00:39:42 ◼   ► stereotypes that you know that the [TS]

00:39:44 ◼   ► toughbook lesbian one like he tries to [TS]

00:39:46 ◼   ► show them as at being complex and making [TS]

00:39:49 ◼   ► decisions that affect the rest of the [TS]

00:39:50 ◼   ► story and so on and so forth but it's [TS]

00:39:51 ◼   ► all kind of writ small like there's not [TS]

00:39:54 ◼   ► a lot of the women worrying about [TS]

00:39:56 ◼   ► how they're going to fix the problem of [TS]

00:39:57 ◼   ► the world like and the men you know some [TS]

00:40:00 ◼   ► of the major thing about some of them [TS]

00:40:01 ◼   ► are so that is just a weakness and i [TS]

00:40:03 ◼   ► think a young author and to be fair when [TS]

00:40:06 ◼   ► you have a book with this many [TS]

00:40:07 ◼   ► characters and it's hard to make all the [TS]

00:40:09 ◼   ► great and he just eventually you just at [TS]

00:40:12 ◼   ► it you know you just end up leaning on [TS]

00:40:13 ◼   ► the ones you can do better so he just [TS]

00:40:14 ◼   ► does the male characters better uh huh [TS]

00:40:16 ◼   ► you know he does as an author I think he [TS]

00:40:19 ◼   ► gets better with the women i think if [TS]

00:40:20 ◼   ► you reduce the character count he can [TS]

00:40:22 ◼   ► imbue the women with more interesting [TS]

00:40:24 ◼   ► things like always and like a book like [TS]

00:40:25 ◼   ► Gerald's game was like look I'm really [TS]

00:40:27 ◼   ► got to get this right it's just going to [TS]

00:40:28 ◼   ► be a woman she's going to be my thing [TS]

00:40:30 ◼   ► under the whole book my respected and [TS]

00:40:32 ◼   ► she becomes an entire person um he's an [TS]

00:40:35 ◼   ► older guy he does have his weird [TS]

00:40:36 ◼   ► prejudices but yeah that's in repeated [TS]

00:40:39 ◼   ► readings of this and i said this used to [TS]

00:40:41 ◼   ► be my favorite book i think lord of the [TS]

00:40:43 ◼   ► rings has passed it simply because now [TS]

00:40:44 ◼   ► as i read it and i get older i see sort [TS]

00:40:47 ◼   ► of all the things that you didn't see [TS]

00:40:48 ◼   ► when you're younger than the writing is [TS]

00:40:50 ◼   ► not as strong as kings later work in the [TS]

00:40:51 ◼   ► characterizations are not as Richard [TS]

00:40:53 ◼   ► sophisticated as they could be [TS]

00:40:54 ◼   ► I still love the story i I'm willing to [TS]

00:40:56 ◼   ► forgive a lot because of the puffiness [TS]

00:40:57 ◼   ► like it's kind of you know trashy pulpy [TS]

00:41:00 ◼   ► soap opera ish sci-fi apocalypse like [TS]

00:41:04 ◼   ► I'm willing to forgive a lot for that [TS]

00:41:06 ◼   ► fun but it you know it is it has [TS]

00:41:08 ◼   ► decreased in esteem and and in my mind [TS]

00:41:10 ◼   ► over the years [TS]

00:41:11 ◼   ► well the two the two people who kill [TS]

00:41:13 ◼   ► themselves over the course of the book [TS]

00:41:15 ◼   ► because they can't handle living without [TS]

00:41:17 ◼   ► a man or having a man take care of them [TS]

00:41:19 ◼   ► both are both women because you've got [TS]

00:41:20 ◼   ► Rita the socialite that killed herself [TS]

00:41:23 ◼   ► around Larry never wouldn't love to have [TS]

00:41:26 ◼   ► Larry honorary but you've also but [TS]

00:41:30 ◼   ► you've also got Perry who briefly [TS]

00:41:33 ◼   ► mentioned a few chapters who kills [TS]

00:41:36 ◼   ► herself after poor stew watches marks a [TS]

00:41:38 ◼   ► pen that you know appendectomy and by [TS]

00:41:41 ◼   ► the way that appendectomy seeing is [TS]

00:41:42 ◼   ► actually one of my favorites that got [TS]

00:41:43 ◼   ► added back into the expanded book [TS]

00:41:45 ◼   ► because it really points out how quickly [TS]

00:41:47 ◼   ► you can be laid low on eternal enemy the [TS]

00:41:49 ◼   ► podcast david brin actually has a nice [TS]

00:41:51 ◼   ► that's understood official then yes sir [TS]

00:41:55 ◼   ► have a nice [TS]

00:41:57 ◼   ► he has a base throwaway line actually [TS]

00:41:58 ◼   ► the postman of all things where a [TS]

00:42:00 ◼   ► character kind of loses his head when [TS]

00:42:02 ◼   ► somebody steals his tooth powder and his [TS]

00:42:04 ◼   ► loss because one of the things that's [TS]

00:42:06 ◼   ► been killing people and that [TS]

00:42:07 ◼   ► post-apocalyptic landscape is [TS]

00:42:09 ◼   ► that was a parent parent pairing [TS]

00:42:13 ◼   ► peritonitis yeah yeah and that's been [TS]

00:42:16 ◼   ► killing people and so this guy's [TS]

00:42:17 ◼   ► fanatical about his teeth regimen and I [TS]

00:42:20 ◼   ► had never really stopped to consider [TS]

00:42:21 ◼   ► that yeah you know if the bacteria get [TS]

00:42:23 ◼   ► into ulcerated gums it's done with and [TS]

00:42:26 ◼   ► so I love when stuff like okay once upon [TS]

00:42:28 ◼   ► a time I had this melody I could go into [TS]

00:42:30 ◼   ► the ER got it taken care of overnight [TS]

00:42:32 ◼   ► turns into oak rap i'm going to die in a [TS]

00:42:34 ◼   ► lot of abdomen abdominal pain to be fair [TS]

00:42:38 ◼   ► to Stephen King actually the his first [TS]

00:42:40 ◼   ► published novel was Carrie yeah but [TS]

00:42:44 ◼   ► don't make it sound like he never wrote [TS]

00:42:46 ◼   ► about with dentist so I'm just like he [TS]

00:42:48 ◼   ► has it he has a deeper intuitive [TS]

00:42:50 ◼   ► understanding of men [TS]

00:42:51 ◼   ► that's one of the books that passes the [TS]

00:42:52 ◼   ► Bechdel test and that it's not all women [TS]

00:42:54 ◼   ► talking to each other about about guys [TS]

00:42:56 ◼   ► because I yeah just pop up a lot sloped [TS]

00:43:00 ◼   ► we're talking to get to each other about [TS]

00:43:01 ◼   ► God [TS]

00:43:02 ◼   ► yeah so we're on were on characters now [TS]

00:43:04 ◼   ► I think this is this is our opportunity [TS]

00:43:05 ◼   ► before we get to that important talk [TS]

00:43:07 ◼   ► about the timeframe in the expanded [TS]

00:43:08 ◼   ► edition and all that [TS]

00:43:10 ◼   ► let's talk about the characters because [TS]

00:43:10 ◼   ► i think one of the things that we didn't [TS]

00:43:12 ◼   ► mention really except in passing when we [TS]

00:43:14 ◼   ► talk about the appeal of this book I [TS]

00:43:15 ◼   ► think it's got to be the characters this [TS]

00:43:17 ◼   ► is a huge cast and that there are some [TS]

00:43:20 ◼   ► really memorable people in this cast of [TS]

00:43:23 ◼   ► characters this is of this is a you know [TS]

00:43:25 ◼   ► that there isn't just about three or [TS]

00:43:28 ◼   ► four people who walk off to Las Vegas to [TS]

00:43:30 ◼   ► get killed it's it's this huge [TS]

00:43:33 ◼   ► widescreen set of characters so if you [TS]

00:43:35 ◼   ► guys have more characters you want to [TS]

00:43:37 ◼   ► talk about now is your chance we haven't [TS]

00:43:40 ◼   ► mentioned Nick's a mechanical great [TS]

00:43:44 ◼   ► yes I love him yeah yeah [TS]

00:43:47 ◼   ► ap I think he's that it's hard not to [TS]

00:43:49 ◼   ► Harold is kind of like the the [TS]

00:43:53 ◼   ► novelization version of the character [TS]

00:43:55 ◼   ► from one of my favorite jonathan coulton [TS]

00:43:57 ◼   ► songs the future soon where it's he's he [TS]

00:44:00 ◼   ► kinda more or less gets his wish and [TS]

00:44:03 ◼   ► that he survived the apocalypse everyone [TS]

00:44:04 ◼   ► else has gone all his tormenters he [TS]

00:44:07 ◼   ► finally has time to write you know in [TS]

00:44:09 ◼   ► his underpants whatever he's doing [TS]

00:44:10 ◼   ► swimming away their that the one girl he [TS]

00:44:11 ◼   ► liked in town is the is this left I he [TS]

00:44:14 ◼   ► is he may literally be the last man on [TS]

00:44:16 ◼   ► earth [TS]

00:44:17 ◼   ► and he has the chance to remake himself [TS]

00:44:19 ◼   ► and it doesn't start off well for him [TS]

00:44:24 ◼   ► but like it [TS]

00:44:25 ◼   ► he almost gets it's like okay well I can [TS]

00:44:27 ◼   ► be a new person the society i can be [TS]

00:44:28 ◼   ► different than I was [TS]

00:44:30 ◼   ► I'm useful i'm smart people look up to [TS]

00:44:32 ◼   ► me like the great you know turn turn [TS]

00:44:34 ◼   ► where Larry says that house becomes [TS]

00:44:36 ◼   ► legend larry's mind because they're [TS]

00:44:37 ◼   ► following all his signs and the [TS]

00:44:39 ◼   ► disconnect between like this kid that he [TS]

00:44:41 ◼   ► meets you so insecure and obnoxious and [TS]

00:44:43 ◼   ► everything and the guy who had the [TS]

00:44:44 ◼   ► smarts write those signs but he doesn't [TS]

00:44:46 ◼   ► turn it around in the end in the end he [TS]

00:44:48 ◼   ► is his own worst enemy in the end you [TS]

00:44:50 ◼   ► know the the Robot Wars cause his love [TS]

00:44:53 ◼   ► to you know have a bionic eyes and [TS]

00:44:55 ◼   ► realize that he is the person who caused [TS]

00:44:57 ◼   ► all this and it's it's kind of a tragedy [TS]

00:45:00 ◼   ► out but like I said it in a book with [TS]

00:45:03 ◼   ► fewer number of characters or in a more [TS]

00:45:05 ◼   ► conventional Stephen King novel he would [TS]

00:45:06 ◼   ► have turned it around but he doesn't [TS]

00:45:08 ◼   ► have to turn around this book he's [TS]

00:45:09 ◼   ► allowed to follow a course that seems [TS]

00:45:11 ◼   ► very realistic and likely in that he if [TS]

00:45:15 ◼   ► he ends up he ends up being his own [TS]

00:45:17 ◼   ► worse enemy and can't pull out of you [TS]

00:45:19 ◼   ► know I mean he makes it more than makes [TS]

00:45:20 ◼   ► a conscious choice we can't let go of [TS]

00:45:21 ◼   ► his hate and I like the type of story [TS]

00:45:24 ◼   ► because it's not the easy one where when [TS]

00:45:26 ◼   ► everybody's gone [TS]

00:45:28 ◼   ► you know you will be able to sleep in [TS]

00:45:30 ◼   ► the Smithsonian and you'll be great [TS]

00:45:32 ◼   ► person and you'll get the girl and [TS]

00:45:33 ◼   ► everything will be great it's like [TS]

00:45:34 ◼   ► wherever you go there you are you're not [TS]

00:45:36 ◼   ► going to be able to escape yourself [TS]

00:45:38 ◼   ► ah and despite your efforts to the [TS]

00:45:40 ◼   ► contrary and I that's why I really liked [TS]

00:45:42 ◼   ► his story lines its I mean it strikes me [TS]

00:45:45 ◼   ► is not being clichéd and I I feel for [TS]

00:45:48 ◼   ► him every time through like you hate him [TS]

00:45:50 ◼   ► and you want him to be punished so badly [TS]

00:45:52 ◼   ► but so many times like oh hell you were [TS]

00:45:54 ◼   ► so close you are so close [TS]

00:45:55 ◼   ► oh hi always feel so sorry for him I [TS]

00:45:57 ◼   ► think that's why he's one of the [TS]

00:45:59 ◼   ► characters that I definitely had to grow [TS]

00:46:00 ◼   ► into when i read it as a youngster I was [TS]

00:46:02 ◼   ► really sort of just seeing the [TS]

00:46:03 ◼   ► black-and-white two-dimensional part of [TS]

00:46:05 ◼   ► it and I was just angry at him all the [TS]

00:46:07 ◼   ► time and didn't care and now that i have [TS]

00:46:10 ◼   ► had grown up and actually had some life [TS]

00:46:12 ◼   ► experiences and and battled a little bit [TS]

00:46:14 ◼   ► with the good versus evil in myself I [TS]

00:46:16 ◼   ► can feel a lot more for his character [TS]

00:46:18 ◼   ► and I would like to think that I've [TS]

00:46:20 ◼   ► turned it around and done things okay [TS]

00:46:21 ◼   ► but i can understand his sort of inner [TS]

00:46:25 ◼   ► turmoil turn it to fight back and forth [TS]

00:46:27 ◼   ► so it's a much much deeper more [TS]

00:46:29 ◼   ► meaningful [TS]

00:46:30 ◼   ► character transformation linear [TS]

00:46:32 ◼   ► transformation for me now than it was [TS]

00:46:33 ◼   ► when i first read the book the first [TS]

00:46:35 ◼   ► couple times [TS]

00:46:36 ◼   ► well as a teenager was next to Harold [TS]

00:46:38 ◼   ► water in school and and so that was the [TS]

00:46:41 ◼   ► reason I didn't like it was because I [TS]

00:46:42 ◼   ► was already dealing with people like him [TS]

00:46:44 ◼   ► every day then but you know once you get [TS]

00:46:47 ◼   ► older and like Erica says you've had to [TS]

00:46:49 ◼   ► have a reckoning with the limits of your [TS]

00:46:50 ◼   ► own strengths and weaknesses and you [TS]

00:46:54 ◼   ► have to start and you start living with [TS]

00:46:56 ◼   ► the consequences of decisions you've [TS]

00:46:58 ◼   ► made [TS]

00:46:58 ◼   ► it's easier to go back and look at [TS]

00:47:00 ◼   ► harold and see the times when the deck [TS]

00:47:03 ◼   ► has been stacked against him and how [TS]

00:47:05 ◼   ► easy it was and for him to make some [TS]

00:47:08 ◼   ► decisions and how hard it was for him to [TS]

00:47:10 ◼   ► sit to stand by and not make others [TS]

00:47:12 ◼   ► there's that there's a the conversation [TS]

00:47:15 ◼   ► thats too has with the herald where they [TS]

00:47:18 ◼   ► did they try to settle things that were [TS]

00:47:19 ◼   ► friends for over Franny and instead of [TS]

00:47:21 ◼   ► course lies like a rug about his [TS]

00:47:22 ◼   ► interesting fran but there's that moment [TS]

00:47:24 ◼   ► where we're and King writes beautifully [TS]

00:47:27 ◼   ► words it's pretty obvious that Harold [TS]

00:47:29 ◼   ► just lets go of his his petulance [TS]

00:47:31 ◼   ► towards the old old world and recognizes [TS]

00:47:34 ◼   ► that he can be somebody you like and [TS]

00:47:35 ◼   ► stupid really you know carry each other [TS]

00:47:38 ◼   ► through this and and be good people [TS]

00:47:39 ◼   ► together and he doesn't do it and I read [TS]

00:47:41 ◼   ► that now i'm like 'oh Harold [TS]

00:47:43 ◼   ► Oh buddy the tragedy it really is and [TS]

00:47:47 ◼   ► and you think about the dumb things you [TS]

00:47:48 ◼   ► did as a teenager you're like oh I had I [TS]

00:47:50 ◼   ► i could have been I this person was [TS]

00:47:53 ◼   ► reaching out i was just too dominant [TS]

00:47:54 ◼   ► angry and youngest yet so and then two [TS]

00:47:57 ◼   ► kings credit he does not really well and [TS]

00:48:00 ◼   ► he's unsparing and that's actually the [TS]

00:48:01 ◼   ► reasons i think it is Harold its kind of [TS]

00:48:04 ◼   ► him [TS]

00:48:05 ◼   ► grappling with his own demons own [TS]

00:48:06 ◼   ► writerly alter ego [TS]

00:48:08 ◼   ► I think there's a lot of King and Harold [TS]

00:48:10 ◼   ► everybody i like i like that Harold is [TS]

00:48:12 ◼   ► is weak not really evil he's weak and [TS]

00:48:16 ◼   ► his weakness is exploited he fails to [TS]

00:48:19 ◼   ► make good decisions because he's weak [TS]

00:48:21 ◼   ► and and for reasons right but and then [TS]

00:48:25 ◼   ► he is exploited by flag essentially his [TS]

00:48:28 ◼   ► weakness and he he you know he doesn't [TS]

00:48:29 ◼   ► get a reward he ends up dead because he [TS]

00:48:33 ◼   ► flag doesn't really trust him either [TS]

00:48:35 ◼   ► right and and uh huh ok his because he's [TS]

00:48:38 ◼   ► too smart too much yeah he thinks too [TS]

00:48:40 ◼   ► much and he and and he's gonna be [TS]

00:48:41 ◼   ► trouble you've already good omens right [TS]

00:48:43 ◼   ► or [TS]

00:48:44 ◼   ► talking about how Crowley didn't really [TS]

00:48:45 ◼   ► fall from heaven so much as you just [TS]

00:48:46 ◼   ► kind of software down slowly [TS]

00:48:49 ◼   ► you know where it's not that were wasn't [TS]

00:48:52 ◼   ► a whole lot of intentionality was just a [TS]

00:48:53 ◼   ► series of small decisions that added up [TS]

00:48:55 ◼   ► and that's sort of like Jason weaknesses [TS]

00:48:57 ◼   ► Harold's Harold's condition as a result [TS]

00:48:59 ◼   ► of all these things cascading and i like [TS]

00:49:02 ◼   ► that his weaknesses sort of all [TS]

00:49:03 ◼   ► revolving around his ego he sees himself [TS]

00:49:05 ◼   ► is so much better than everybody around [TS]

00:49:07 ◼   ► him and that is something that I be as a [TS]

00:49:10 ◼   ► teenager now looking back I realize I [TS]

00:49:12 ◼   ► can relate to that I didn't recognize it [TS]

00:49:14 ◼   ► at the time but although it's such a [TS]

00:49:16 ◼   ► defense mechanism because his dad picked [TS]

00:49:18 ◼   ► on him and he felt awkward and out and [TS]

00:49:20 ◼   ► so we you know you see how because [TS]

00:49:23 ◼   ► there's that lovely chapter where he [TS]

00:49:24 ◼   ► kills himself and well that's a turn of [TS]

00:49:27 ◼   ► phrase [TS]

00:49:27 ◼   ► uh-huh there's that chapter 18 kills [TS]

00:49:29 ◼   ► himself and you basically get taken for [TS]

00:49:31 ◼   ► the autobiography of hair autobiography [TS]

00:49:33 ◼   ► of of the formation of harold and you [TS]

00:49:36 ◼   ► know from when he was a small boy who's [TS]

00:49:37 ◼   ► his dad is saying all these terrible [TS]

00:49:39 ◼   ► things about him and he's better-looking [TS]

00:49:41 ◼   ► in this pretty little sister shadow and [TS]

00:49:43 ◼   ► you can see where all of the hertz keep [TS]

00:49:44 ◼   ► piling on and he kind of has to create [TS]

00:49:46 ◼   ► these defenses to push people away [TS]

00:49:48 ◼   ► before they could hurt him again and [TS]

00:49:50 ◼   ► that's where he gets the superiority [TS]

00:49:51 ◼   ► complexes because it's safer and easier [TS]

00:49:53 ◼   ► to go on the offensive [TS]

00:49:55 ◼   ► that is why i love both his written [TS]

00:49:57 ◼   ► final declaration where he signs his [TS]

00:49:58 ◼   ► name hawk and the fact that it gets [TS]

00:50:01 ◼   ► dismissed later by RR for traveling [TS]

00:50:03 ◼   ► quite saviors who are like this [TS]

00:50:05 ◼   ► beautiful dying declaration and I just [TS]

00:50:06 ◼   ► completely like whatever Harold this is [TS]

00:50:08 ◼   ► ben and they keep ya like he doesn't [TS]

00:50:10 ◼   ► even have any written mine was like oh [TS]

00:50:12 ◼   ► he's conscripted the truth to print it's [TS]

00:50:15 ◼   ► all whatever is a little it's a little [TS]

00:50:17 ◼   ► bit late by that point just a little bit [TS]

00:50:19 ◼   ► if you want everybody up and fled town [TS]

00:50:21 ◼   ► and yeah that Lloyd has a similar [TS]

00:50:24 ◼   ► situation where he is a person Vic not a [TS]

00:50:27 ◼   ► victim of circumstance but like it is [TS]

00:50:29 ◼   ► weak and his weaknesses exploited like [TS]

00:50:32 ◼   ► because again there are things he's not [TS]

00:50:33 ◼   ► a good person right but yeah there are [TS]

00:50:36 ◼   ► things in him that are redeemable but [TS]

00:50:38 ◼   ► the flag basically waits for him to be [TS]

00:50:40 ◼   ► near death and like you know II and [TS]

00:50:42 ◼   ► ready to eat his cellmate [TS]

00:50:44 ◼   ► yeah he would have gone to Vegas anyway [TS]

00:50:45 ◼   ► but if you wait until he's almost dead [TS]

00:50:47 ◼   ► you can get him as a lot you know [TS]

00:50:49 ◼   ► completely loyal for life like that that [TS]

00:50:51 ◼   ► type of a mean witch Lloyd even [TS]

00:50:53 ◼   ► recognizes in the end I [TS]

00:50:54 ◼   ► actually recognizes he waited until I [TS]

00:50:56 ◼   ► was at my weakest and extracted undying [TS]

00:50:58 ◼   ► loyalty from me and I'm going to give [TS]

00:50:59 ◼   ► him that because I'm just you know like [TS]

00:51:01 ◼   ► miss it it's it's another sad situation [TS]

00:51:04 ◼   ► of a you know a similar person who was [TS]

00:51:08 ◼   ► and i'm using flags like well if there's [TS]

00:51:11 ◼   ► no Randall Flagg around you don't have [TS]

00:51:12 ◼   ► to worry because weak people won't be [TS]

00:51:13 ◼   ► exploited in this way I mean grandma [TS]

00:51:15 ◼   ► flags a stand-in for all the other [TS]

00:51:16 ◼   ► things that are going to exploit a [TS]

00:51:19 ◼   ► weakness or insecurity or internal [TS]

00:51:21 ◼   ► conflict in the world is just a [TS]

00:51:23 ◼   ► convenient narrative shorthand I'd like [TS]

00:51:26 ◼   ► to briefly mention one of my favorite [TS]

00:51:28 ◼   ► really short-lived characters which is [TS]

00:51:31 ◼   ► Starkey the general who kind of goes [TS]

00:51:34 ◼   ► crazy watching the videos everybody dead [TS]

00:51:37 ◼   ► he's really bucking space ooh that's so [TS]

00:51:41 ◼   ► much of what happens to the country is [TS]

00:51:43 ◼   ► his fault he's the one that says kill [TS]

00:51:46 ◼   ► anyone who says there's a super flu put [TS]

00:51:48 ◼   ► every city on lockdown but yeah I have [TS]

00:51:52 ◼   ► that poor journalist in west virginia [TS]

00:51:53 ◼   ► his last act is to try to put out a [TS]

00:51:55 ◼   ► broadsheet before he dies [TS]

00:51:56 ◼   ► yeah but I think Starkey is an [TS]

00:51:58 ◼   ► interesting Lee tragic character because [TS]

00:52:00 ◼   ► he's clearly gone crazy and in a book [TS]

00:52:03 ◼   ► the size King can take his time showing [TS]

00:52:05 ◼   ► him going crazy and then going down and [TS]

00:52:08 ◼   ► killing himself but fixing the face in [TS]

00:52:10 ◼   ► the soup first [TS]

00:52:11 ◼   ► yeah and then the next guy sits in his [TS]

00:52:13 ◼   ► chair why can't he have cleaned off the [TS]

00:52:15 ◼   ► face at least why don't know what he'll [TS]

00:52:17 ◼   ► be busy but it doesn't it sits down and [TS]

00:52:20 ◼   ► takes over right there [TS]

00:52:21 ◼   ► noted that i got dark humor of the book [TS]

00:52:24 ◼   ► is like you can you can't tell what it's [TS]

00:52:26 ◼   ► just always gonna be said that guy's [TS]

00:52:27 ◼   ► going to slowly go mad while watching [TS]

00:52:29 ◼   ► the same thing but it there's there's [TS]

00:52:31 ◼   ► humor and a lot of this the absurdity of [TS]

00:52:33 ◼   ► the apocalypse is I mean even chapter 38 [TS]

00:52:35 ◼   ► you can even think about some of those [TS]

00:52:36 ◼   ► passages are just like slapstick death [TS]

00:52:39 ◼   ► comedy of like what could possibly go [TS]

00:52:41 ◼   ► wrong with these people but you know it [TS]

00:52:44 ◼   ► thats that's throughout the entire book [TS]

00:52:46 ◼   ► like that he's not not afraid to the [TS]

00:52:48 ◼   ► characters aren't afraid and King isn't [TS]

00:52:50 ◼   ► afraid to dare you to laugh it the [TS]

00:52:52 ◼   ► terrible things that are happening but [TS]

00:52:54 ◼   ► I'm gonna mention the trashcan man i [TS]

00:52:57 ◼   ► love the fresh cat man [TS]

00:52:59 ◼   ► he is a pure character he knows what he [TS]

00:53:02 ◼   ► was happy because it doesn't to fire and [TS]

00:53:04 ◼   ► flat flag totally distracted him from [TS]

00:53:06 ◼   ► his mission such a poor baby he's [TS]

00:53:08 ◼   ► basically be this i mean no way to know [TS]

00:53:12 ◼   ► what love is somebody that I was a bully [TS]

00:53:14 ◼   ► the trashcan there and he's also flags [TS]

00:53:18 ◼   ► big weaknesses that he finds trashcan [TS]

00:53:20 ◼   ► man as endearing as I do but even even a [TS]

00:53:23 ◼   ► better [TS]

00:53:24 ◼   ► it's literally a bad idea to have this [TS]

00:53:26 ◼   ► guy running around inside your group he [TS]

00:53:29 ◼   ► doesn't seem to care that much about [TS]

00:53:31 ◼   ► shutting him down [TS]

00:53:32 ◼   ► well he is useful he does have skills [TS]

00:53:35 ◼   ► like he's the only flexpay problems he [TS]

00:53:37 ◼   ► mistakes crazy for stupid [TS]

00:53:39 ◼   ► well I mean like he wants to see what [TS]

00:53:40 ◼   ► the trashcan man's abilities trashcan [TS]

00:53:42 ◼   ► and supernatural ability to understand [TS]

00:53:43 ◼   ► machinery he needs that he needs them to [TS]

00:53:45 ◼   ► get like the fighter planes back up with [TS]

00:53:46 ◼   ► that base or whatever and he will enter [TS]

00:53:49 ◼   ► cells up the first tank [TS]

00:53:50 ◼   ► yeah i mean like what really like a site [TS]

00:53:54 ◼   ► he interrupted the trash can Trash man [TS]

00:53:56 ◼   ► could have finally had a comfortable [TS]

00:53:57 ◼   ► always going to do is going to burn [TS]

00:53:59 ◼   ► every city in the United States and he [TS]

00:54:00 ◼   ► would have done that for the rest of his [TS]

00:54:01 ◼   ► life like now I actually have to come to [TS]

00:54:03 ◼   ► Vegas and go to work and be like all [TS]

00:54:04 ◼   ► seriously do you realize how much stuff [TS]

00:54:05 ◼   ► I can burn in this country it's just you [TS]

00:54:08 ◼   ► know I got West is pretty dance I could [TS]

00:54:10 ◼   ► I could spend years here [TS]

00:54:12 ◼   ► yeah I mean eventually would blow [TS]

00:54:13 ◼   ► himself up that's the way he wanted to [TS]

00:54:15 ◼   ► cover like it [TS]

00:54:16 ◼   ► King even think as such it King even has [TS]

00:54:19 ◼   ► sympathy for like the craziest of his [TS]

00:54:22 ◼   ► character is so easy to make a crazy [TS]

00:54:23 ◼   ► pyromaniac but no he's got to give trash [TS]

00:54:25 ◼   ► game and a backstory why is he crazy [TS]

00:54:27 ◼   ► what happened to him and obviously as [TS]

00:54:29 ◼   ► mental illness but also people were [TS]

00:54:30 ◼   ► terrible to him too like everyone's [TS]

00:54:32 ◼   ► everyone's got their reasons everyone's [TS]

00:54:34 ◼   ► got their story even the people who are [TS]

00:54:35 ◼   ► just you know already and I even flag [TS]

00:54:38 ◼   ► has kind of you know that they tried not [TS]

00:54:40 ◼   ► to make him sympathetic but to explain [TS]

00:54:42 ◼   ► that he has feelings too he's not just [TS]

00:54:45 ◼   ► pure evil who knows exactly what he's [TS]

00:54:46 ◼   ► doing he has doubts he's not sure what's [TS]

00:54:48 ◼   ► going on [TS]

00:54:49 ◼   ► yes he is he's period knows what he's [TS]

00:54:51 ◼   ► doing and has doubts though I mean you [TS]

00:54:53 ◼   ► talk about his big memories and and [TS]

00:54:55 ◼   ► and how he incites the worst in what I [TS]

00:54:58 ◼   ► do like is housekeeping things like well [TS]

00:54:59 ◼   ► clearly from flag is responsible for the [TS]

00:55:01 ◼   ► fact the sixties turned into the [TS]

00:55:03 ◼   ► complete cluster flock of seventies [TS]

00:55:05 ◼   ► because it has to be even more human [TS]

00:55:07 ◼   ► nature but you know flight that the [TS]

00:55:09 ◼   ► point is flagged out there supposed to [TS]

00:55:11 ◼   ► be well he's wavering because the forces [TS]

00:55:12 ◼   ► of good and finally getting their act [TS]