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The Incomparable

230: World-Class Weirdo

 

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00:00:25   the incomparable number 230 January 2015 [TS]

00:00:33   welcome back everybody the incomparable [TS]

00:00:37   podcast host Jason still we I'm [TS]

00:00:39   convening a very large edition of our [TS]

00:00:42   comic book club to talk about a [TS]

00:00:44   comic-book chosen by the first person [TS]

00:00:47   i'm going to introduce to Lisa [TS]

00:00:49   Schmeisser Italy charter member of the [TS]

00:00:51   comic book club hello hi it's nice to be [TS]

00:00:53   here and and you chose promethea my and [TS]

00:00:57   alan moore available where comics are [TS]

00:01:01   sold on the internet and elsewhere and [TS]

00:01:03   and we are going to be talking about the [TS]

00:01:05   first couple of trades so if you have [TS]

00:01:07   not read any of it and you don't want to [TS]

00:01:09   be spoiled you should go read the first [TS]

00:01:10   couple trades and then come back and and [TS]

00:01:13   a welcome back thanks reading those [TS]

00:01:15   trade see what i did there anyway the [TS]

00:01:16   other members of our comic book club [TS]

00:01:18   tonight Tony sindelar hi Tony [TS]

00:01:20   hello nerds I don't have anything [TS]

00:01:23   quickly to say about committee except [TS]

00:01:24   that i read it i'm here to talk about it [TS]

00:01:26   well good i do the homework [TS]

00:01:28   hello nerds I did the homework mont [TS]

00:01:31   actually also here hi Monty hello that [TS]

00:01:34   this is our world now reading comic [TS]

00:01:37   books his homework [TS]

00:01:38   yes the Nerds one and that they have an [TS]

00:01:40   assignment for you sleep with the [TS]

00:01:42   weeping gorilla says and in episode [TS]

00:01:44   we've been girl I gotta read comic books [TS]

00:01:47   homework [TS]

00:01:49   yes your streams down the weakened [TS]

00:01:51   condition there's one and this is our [TS]

00:01:52   world now Erica and sign is also out [TS]

00:01:55   there hello hello yes i have learned [TS]

00:01:58   that reading comic books can be like [TS]

00:02:00   homework [TS]

00:02:00   ah very nice yeah and since that's [TS]

00:02:03   foreshadowing and chips others is also [TS]

00:02:06   out there hello [TS]

00:02:07   it's an honor to be here to talk about [TS]

00:02:08   one of the most important comic creators [TS]

00:02:11   ever [TS]

00:02:11   and I'm talking of course about letter [TS]

00:02:13   Todd klein yes he said that's amazing [TS]

00:02:17   no i'm serious i love his work yeah i [TS]

00:02:19   was making notes about how good his [TS]

00:02:21   lettering was in the Attic book [TS]

00:02:23   oh my God he's already promised look [TS]

00:02:24   Monty don't do that it was digital i was [TS]

00:02:27   writing on my screen [TS]

00:02:28   okay well don't write on your screen [TS]

00:02:31   monitor that's terrible [TS]

00:02:32   alright Lisa why did you pick promethea [TS]

00:02:34   and have us read it and I'm not judging [TS]

00:02:37   here well maybe a little bit of you [TS]

00:02:39   don't use yeah I had a few reasons for [TS]

00:02:42   picking it up one [TS]

00:02:43   it's relatively old so it's easy to get [TS]

00:02:45   used copies for cheap [TS]

00:02:47   oh yeah maybe 9 and 15 exactly one of my [TS]

00:02:49   goals for having one of the things I'm [TS]

00:02:52   trying to do with or I'd like us to do [TS]

00:02:54   with kaka club this year is introduced [TS]

00:02:58   comics to people who really don't have [TS]

00:03:00   time everyone stay to pop into a shop [TS]

00:03:02   and read and so I thought well if it's [TS]

00:03:04   an older home me and if its older comic [TS]

00:03:06   you can get used which means that it's [TS]

00:03:08   not a big financial strain either and [TS]

00:03:09   that was another reason I'm the second [TS]

00:03:12   reason I chose promethea is the book is [TS]

00:03:14   completely done so we could if we wanted [TS]

00:03:17   to assess it as a whole body of work we [TS]

00:03:21   can talk about this comic knowing full [TS]

00:03:24   well that Alan Moore is not going to add [TS]

00:03:25   on like another five issues and [TS]

00:03:26   completely torpedo everything we think [TS]

00:03:28   about it right so it's a finite [TS]

00:03:30   closed-loop it's not like when you talk [TS]

00:03:31   about a TV series and the Creator hit [TS]

00:03:33   the reset button I mean this is done [TS]

00:03:34   it's close it's a finite thing [TS]

00:03:35   the third reason I chose it is because [TS]

00:03:38   it's a deconstruction of the superhero [TS]

00:03:42   genre and it's also equals in a really [TS]

00:03:45   weird religious direction and i was just [TS]

00:03:47   fascinated by i was fascinated by it by [TS]

00:03:50   the fact that he said you know I'm going [TS]

00:03:52   to do I'm going to take the Wonder Woman [TS]

00:03:53   myth and i'm going to mix it up with a [TS]

00:03:55   whole bunch of mystical stuff and see [TS]

00:03:57   what comes out the other side [TS]

00:03:58   the fourth reason I chose it was because [TS]

00:04:01   it is the most optimistic [TS]

00:04:02   post-apocalyptic work I've ever run [TS]

00:04:04   across and given the amount of a [TS]

00:04:06   post-apocalyptic dystopian fiction we've [TS]

00:04:08   talked about here I thought to be kind [TS]

00:04:10   of refreshing to to approach something [TS]

00:04:11   that's all trial on the end of the world [TS]

00:04:13   her ray and finally the fifth reason is [TS]

00:04:16   to me it's the most Alan more thing he's [TS]

00:04:19   ever written it is it is if if you had [TS]

00:04:22   to take a look at his body of work and [TS]

00:04:24   then [TS]

00:04:24   a pic something that distills the [TS]

00:04:26   essence of our more down to one book [TS]

00:04:28   this would be the book to do it there's [TS]

00:04:29   just enters layer upon layer upon layer [TS]

00:04:31   and so and finally as I was rereading it [TS]

00:04:34   the the reason that bubble for my [TS]

00:04:36   subconscious is this book is now old [TS]

00:04:39   number we can use it as kind of a [TS]

00:04:40   historical artifact of the nineties [TS]

00:04:43   because i'm pretty sure that's when he [TS]

00:04:44   started thinking about it and writing it [TS]

00:04:46   and it's fun to see this as an artifact [TS]

00:04:48   of where comics were going in the [TS]

00:04:50   nineties and works where societal [TS]

00:04:52   attitudes were two and then to compare [TS]

00:04:54   them to what we're doing today [TS]

00:04:55   so those are all my reasons alright fair [TS]

00:04:58   enough i I am so i started the one of [TS]

00:05:02   the reasons I I said let's absolutely do [TS]

00:05:05   this i mean one is I've read a lot of [TS]

00:05:07   alan moore and not just the you know [TS]

00:05:08   watchman and be for vendetta and from [TS]

00:05:12   hell and swamp thing but also his [TS]

00:05:15   latter-day comic stuff like Tom strong [TS]

00:05:20   and top 10 on and on on one level I [TS]

00:05:23   think you're right that it is very alan [TS]

00:05:26   moore E&I in all ways including you know [TS]

00:05:29   the all the great ways and also all the [TS]

00:05:31   terrible ways yes um I think I think [TS]

00:05:33   it's all in there any other reason i was [TS]

00:05:35   fascinated by this is because i was i [TS]

00:05:38   was thinking about wonder woman and you [TS]

00:05:41   know with a lot of talk about whether [TS]

00:05:43   there would be a Wonder Woman movie [TS]

00:05:45   after various failed TV series which [TS]

00:05:47   they've announced they are going to do a [TS]

00:05:49   Wonder Woman movie now and um also I [TS]

00:05:52   went and saw a play called lasso of [TS]

00:05:55   truth which is actually about the guy [TS]

00:05:58   who invented wonder woman which is a [TS]

00:06:00   fascinating story in unto itself [TS]

00:06:03   I have you read the Jill Lepore article [TS]

00:06:05   which is exempted from her longer booked [TS]

00:06:06   on the origins of wonder woman I i [TS]

00:06:08   haven't although I feel like I since I [TS]

00:06:10   saw an entire play that it's probably [TS]

00:06:13   none of its new but like that the [TS]

00:06:14   polygamous relationship and that's the [TS]

00:06:16   name undertones and his pretty strong [TS]

00:06:18   feminist feelings and all of that yes [TS]

00:06:19   and in fact he is the creator of the [TS]

00:06:21   love the love the light detectors to the [TS]

00:06:23   man who invented Wonder Woman's lasso of [TS]

00:06:25   truth also invented the actual last [TS]

00:06:28   three the white detector [TS]

00:06:30   I'm in the middle of that book and it is [TS]

00:06:32   great I thought I knew everything about [TS]

00:06:33   him but he's a real [TS]

00:06:35   we're do there's lots more yeah so I I'm [TS]

00:06:39   that fascinates me that promethea is [TS]

00:06:41   this you know Alan Moore post modern [TS]

00:06:43   take on Wonder Woman as well which is [TS]

00:06:46   this is a mythological figure that is [TS]

00:06:48   sort of like superimposed on top of a [TS]

00:06:50   regular girl and creates this creates [TS]

00:06:55   this kind of superhero Malcolm and so [TS]

00:06:57   that was it looks like a pretty rich [TS]

00:06:59   stew to jump into and and and you're not [TS]

00:07:02   supposed to jump into a stew but that's [TS]

00:07:04   what i did i jumped into it was like a [TS]

00:07:05   hot tub full of stew emperor has jumped [TS]

00:07:07   right in any way and I found it [TS]

00:07:10   fascinating i don't know where we go [TS]

00:07:11   from here what with elisa would you like [TS]

00:07:13   to throw something out because like I [TS]

00:07:15   said I feel like I feel like this is [TS]

00:07:16   your baby [TS]

00:07:17   so the first question I wanted to bring [TS]

00:07:19   up to the crowd at large was exactly how [TS]

00:07:23   much do you think more knew about Wonder [TS]

00:07:25   Woman's history and the Creator because [TS]

00:07:27   one of the themes that I notice pops up [TS]

00:07:30   through the course of the first two [TS]

00:07:31   trades and what I'm going to say I feel [TS]

00:07:34   like we should respect we should try to [TS]

00:07:36   focus the discussion on the first two [TS]

00:07:37   trades because that's what almost always [TS]

00:07:39   have read and can contribute to but [TS]

00:07:42   what's the problem what seems to pop up [TS]

00:07:44   over and over again is the idea of the [TS]

00:07:47   crater as somebody who has an innate [TS]

00:07:50   streak of of iconoclasm and that and he [TS]

00:07:54   comes back that over and over again [TS]

00:07:55   where the very nature of being a [TS]

00:07:57   creative person sets you apart from the [TS]

00:07:59   mainstream and it's also something that [TS]

00:08:01   while it allows you to contribute to the [TS]

00:08:03   world and ultimately damages you because [TS]

00:08:05   as they point out in the comic books [TS]

00:08:07   promethium for those are you catching a [TS]

00:08:10   Promethean is is basically the [TS]

00:08:12   ratification imagination she's the [TS]

00:08:14   living avatar of imagination she was [TS]

00:08:16   original little girl to God's pulled her [TS]

00:08:19   into the material which is the room [TS]

00:08:21   imagination is so basically she's a [TS]

00:08:23   living avatar when people imagine her [TS]

00:08:24   she can possess them or they can become [TS]

00:08:26   her living avatar and earth and over the [TS]

00:08:28   course the first two books you get [TS]

00:08:29   introduced to a series of artists or [TS]

00:08:32   artist muses who had imagined and and [TS]

00:08:35   and loved and become invested promethea [TS]

00:08:36   and so they came for me for themselves [TS]

00:08:38   and as one of the points out every [TS]

00:08:40   single one of them died as a result of [TS]

00:08:41   engaging in the Smith creating this myth [TS]

00:08:44   and becoming this myth [TS]

00:08:46   so what I wonder about is is do you [TS]

00:08:48   think alan moore new a whole lot about [TS]

00:08:50   Wonder Woman or is this just a general [TS]

00:08:52   larger statement on creativity [TS]

00:08:54   um yes he'll check on that Chicago is it [TS]

00:09:01   had to be both I mean I'll alan moore is [TS]

00:09:04   is a genius about the comics field and [TS]

00:09:06   is is it [TS]

00:09:08   he's an artistic formalist who really [TS]

00:09:11   digs in deep into comics and tries to [TS]

00:09:14   make this dries to make them do things [TS]

00:09:18   that they've never done before but it's [TS]

00:09:19   all about the art form itself so he had [TS]

00:09:23   to know how about the history and all [TS]

00:09:25   and all that but at the same time at the [TS]

00:09:29   same time it it turns into such as [TS]

00:09:31   meditation on imagination itself that [TS]

00:09:34   I'm reading this thing and all i can [TS]

00:09:36   hear in the background as a magician [TS]

00:09:37   Doug Henning in the background talking [TS]

00:09:38   about in the mountain a mission [TS]

00:09:41   oh that's worth of imagination everybody [TS]

00:09:44   here maybe you are worlds avatar [TS]

00:09:46   Prometheus win the war [TS]

00:09:47   ok actually let me go around one table [TS]

00:09:50   um who is your favorite permuting out of [TS]

00:09:52   out of the ones that we get introduced [TS]

00:09:53   to everyone [TS]

00:09:55   did everybody find one they identified [TS]

00:09:56   with her is there one that you liked or [TS]

00:09:58   disliked or really related to like what [TS]

00:10:01   are your emotional responses to the [TS]

00:10:02   different Prometheus and I mean I like I [TS]

00:10:04   want to start by saying I like the fact [TS]

00:10:06   that there is in the in the you get [TS]

00:10:09   introduced to promethea through the [TS]

00:10:12   current holder of of promethea mhm who [TS]

00:10:17   is aging and a band and Barbara yeah and [TS]

00:10:22   she's not really up to it anymore [TS]

00:10:23   yeah it and that's interesting and very [TS]

00:10:25   traditional comical care right like the [TS]

00:10:28   Gold Eagle the but yet Golden Age hero [TS]

00:10:30   is about to retire but the Silver Age [TS]

00:10:32   hero is going to step in and become the [TS]

00:10:34   new promethea right but what I love is [TS]

00:10:37   that then when / media visits the the [TS]

00:10:40   land of imagination she finds everybody [TS]

00:10:43   who's ever been promethea basically [TS]

00:10:45   hanging out by a pool and talking to [TS]

00:10:48   each other and there's like essentially [TS]

00:10:50   Greek chorus of Prometheus and I i love [TS]

00:10:53   that as a concept to the fact that like [TS]

00:10:55   the whole Prometheus squad is there as [TS]

00:10:58   promethea [TS]

00:10:59   to comment on what's going on and to [TS]

00:11:02   help her out i think that that takes it [TS]

00:11:05   to a whole other level from the you know [TS]

00:11:07   you just meet your you know the mentor [TS]

00:11:09   the originator know you mean everybody [TS]

00:11:11   was at the job [TS]

00:11:12   yeah the greatest thing yeah yeah so I [TS]

00:11:14   thought that was I thought that was [TS]

00:11:15   really cool [TS]

00:11:16   I'm my favorite promethea is Margie a [TS]

00:11:20   little help hardly be there between to [TS]

00:11:21   work and I get defensive over and also [TS]

00:11:23   just because i love Little Nemo in [TS]

00:11:25   Slumberland so i'm totally in for any [TS]

00:11:28   references or in this case out right [TS]

00:11:30   back off some of the concept I honestly [TS]

00:11:32   had trouble remembering who is who I [TS]

00:11:34   trouble keeping them keeping them [TS]

00:11:37   separate in my mind I was constantly [TS]

00:11:39   having to go back and be like okay which [TS]

00:11:40   one is this and what's their deal so I [TS]

00:11:43   wouldn't say I had a favorite because I [TS]

00:11:44   struggled so much to remember who was [TS]

00:11:46   who [TS]

00:11:46   yeah i'll be boring and say that sophie [TS]

00:11:49   was my favorite but one of the things [TS]

00:11:51   that I noticed was that their voices [TS]

00:11:54   they they occasionally become very [TS]

00:11:59   specific and distinct and otherwise and [TS]

00:12:02   at other times they talk like each other [TS]

00:12:04   and I don't know how I don't know how [TS]

00:12:08   purposeful that was but it also made it [TS]

00:12:11   difficult for me to tell them apart [TS]

00:12:12   sometimes you have to really pay [TS]

00:12:15   attention to the costuming and [TS]

00:12:17   everything else and I think you know [TS]

00:12:19   they're supposed to be different aspects [TS]

00:12:21   of the same character but luckily for me [TS]

00:12:24   Margie not only doesn't talk like [TS]

00:12:25   everyone else she had better anything to [TS]

00:12:27   talk fine being a genius [TS]

00:12:29   yes she's not even really a Prometheus [TS]

00:12:30   she just sort of she's just heard this [TS]

00:12:32   annoying tag along the cartoon character [TS]

00:12:34   or in a comic book that makes some sense [TS]

00:12:39   yeah i guess if I had if I had to pick a [TS]

00:12:41   favorite it would be Sophie bangs mostly [TS]

00:12:43   simply because i felt like i was kind of [TS]

00:12:46   on the journey with her she had no idea [TS]

00:12:48   what was going on at the beginning in [TS]

00:12:49   and I had no idea what was going on [TS]

00:12:51   either so therefore she was my my [TS]

00:12:53   identification character [TS]

00:12:55   well I mean yeah I mean that that's good [TS]

00:12:57   night and like I really like i like [TS]

00:12:58   Barbara and the fact that she's dealing [TS]

00:13:00   with the fact that she's passing this is [TS]

00:13:02   the end of her life essential and she's [TS]

00:13:03   passing this torch to Sophie and then [TS]

00:13:06   you know inevitably she's gonna pass [TS]

00:13:08   into the the realm of imagination i will [TS]

00:13:11   throw a shout out to Bill [TS]

00:13:12   because I i think the idea that a [TS]

00:13:15   closeted gay male artist who drew [TS]

00:13:20   promethea and sort of uh I idolized her [TS]

00:13:24   and then that plotline me that he takes [TS]

00:13:28   where he becomes promethea and falls in [TS]

00:13:30   love with a man who doesn't realize that [TS]

00:13:31   this is a man who's turned into a woman [TS]

00:13:34   and ends up getting killed as a result I [TS]

00:13:37   I thought that was poignant and also [TS]

00:13:40   quite an interesting like if you're [TS]

00:13:42   gonna have this wall of Prometheus to [TS]

00:13:43   have that be be one of the twist i [TS]

00:13:45   thought was was really brilliant and I [TS]

00:13:48   could also identify which promethea was [TS]

00:13:51   Bill so how do i do that that one is [TS]

00:13:53   delicate the planet is gonna love that [TS]

00:13:55   little rings around the legs yeah or [TS]

00:13:58   know what I think of what i thought was [TS]

00:14:00   interesting when I went back through and [TS]

00:14:03   looked at him is one of the reasons i [TS]

00:14:04   love Barbara is because I feel like over [TS]

00:14:06   the course the book you're also getting [TS]

00:14:08   a look at the it isn't in sort of a [TS]

00:14:11   subtle meditation on the impact that [TS]

00:14:13   created a creative life has on a [TS]

00:14:15   relationship and the feedback loop [TS]

00:14:17   between the creator of their partner and [TS]

00:14:19   and how much it might be a joint [TS]

00:14:21   endeavor and how much of it isn't [TS]

00:14:22   because remember Barbara says well he [TS]

00:14:24   used he used me as his model for his [TS]

00:14:26   imagination for promethea I don't have [TS]

00:14:28   his imagination which is why I basically [TS]

00:14:30   look like myself and help in the costume [TS]

00:14:32   right but she's even soup and that's [TS]

00:14:34   fascinating she becomes Promethean not [TS]

00:14:35   not the writer but but the music his [TS]

00:14:39   wife [TS]

00:14:39   yeah yeah she's the model and um I [TS]

00:14:42   realize we're restricting this to the [TS]

00:14:44   first two books but in the third there's [TS]

00:14:46   actually a really lovely sequence where [TS]

00:14:48   you do get to see more about their [TS]

00:14:50   relationship and it is very end it [TS]

00:14:54   really it it makes me wonder if alan [TS]

00:14:57   moore was was saying something about you [TS]

00:14:59   know this is this is the reality of what [TS]

00:15:02   it's like to be the person who's in love [TS]

00:15:03   with the creative force this is the [TS]

00:15:04   reality of what it's like to be a [TS]

00:15:05   creative person who has the need to love [TS]

00:15:08   and connect with somebody and pull them [TS]

00:15:09   into their endeavor even if they don't [TS]

00:15:10   fully understand it so so i really like [TS]

00:15:13   Barbara for that reason I really like [TS]

00:15:15   Barbara and Bill i do want to interject [TS]

00:15:17   though that one of the things that make [TS]

00:15:19   me a little uncomfortable reading this [TS]

00:15:20   book is that they're all these feminist [TS]

00:15:23   statements [TS]

00:15:25   we're in a time right now with gamer [TS]

00:15:28   date and everything else going on [TS]

00:15:29   I kept in the back of my head I don't [TS]

00:15:32   know Alan Moore very well as far as is [TS]

00:15:35   and personal life and life is outside of [TS]

00:15:38   comics and things like that but i felt a [TS]

00:15:41   little bit like I was being mansplain 2m [TS]

00:15:43   that the guy telling the story has [TS]

00:15:47   Barbara looking older and overweight and [TS]

00:15:50   unattractive bill has it still has his [TS]

00:15:55   gender issues becomes a her and I almost [TS]

00:15:59   would have felt more comfortable if it [TS]

00:16:01   hadn't been alan moore writing this but [TS]

00:16:03   if this had been woman writing it that's [TS]

00:16:05   it was funny as I actually felt almost [TS]

00:16:07   the opposite because when you get to the [TS]

00:16:09   whole tantric sex scene no the cup and [TS]

00:16:11   the wand and the cup in the wand and I'm [TS]

00:16:12   like I got really really know who's back [TS]

00:16:17   to that I could hear and that's why I [TS]

00:16:19   roll my eyes I say hello to taro and [TS]

00:16:21   it's all and you look at the city on the [TS]

00:16:23   cards and you notice the harlot at one [TS]

00:16:25   point and i went back and took a look [TS]

00:16:28   and I thought well on the one hand he's [TS]

00:16:29   got this whole Prometheus a woman and [TS]

00:16:32   she's imagination but on the other hand [TS]

00:16:33   he's got some pretty gender determinist [TS]

00:16:35   ideas going on and so I was a little [TS]

00:16:38   uncomfortable with the book on that [TS]

00:16:39   level because I feel like he starts off [TS]

00:16:41   strong by pointing out that imagination [TS]

00:16:44   should in theory make general fluid in a [TS]

00:16:46   construct but then it turns into but [TS]

00:16:48   know the laws of the universe are that [TS]

00:16:50   man and woman in and ask really thus [TS]

00:16:53   were going with it i'll just i'll just [TS]

00:16:55   briefly point out that the year after [TS]

00:16:57   promethea ended is the year lost girls [TS]

00:17:00   finally came out so well anybody else [TS]

00:17:06   here comes to reading loss girls i read [TS]

00:17:08   it i own it you on it yeah for sudo [TS]

00:17:12   artistic ok where he he only reads it [TS]

00:17:18   for the article know it is [TS]

00:17:19   yeah well it's actually one of the most [TS]

00:17:21   angry and emotionally disturbing of his [TS]

00:17:24   work and i'm not i'm not being arch [TS]

00:17:26   about that it was some it'sit's general [TS]

00:17:29   generally speaking there's a lot of [TS]

00:17:31   anger on that and there's a sequence in [TS]

00:17:33   the first two books again where there's [TS]

00:17:34   like those two demons for hire to go [TS]

00:17:36   after Sophie early on [TS]

00:17:37   and they they call the cab driver what [TS]

00:17:41   he's doing to his granddaughter and a [TS]

00:17:42   handgun and I was like okay I've this is [TS]

00:17:45   clearly a theme that he's working on [TS]

00:17:47   because it comes up again and again the [TS]

00:17:49   damage that people can do two children [TS]

00:17:50   that that's like a huge thread that runs [TS]

00:17:51   your loss girls and I thought it was [TS]

00:17:53   interesting that he puts it out there [TS]

00:17:55   and then he gives the reader this this [TS]

00:17:57   some almost unearned sense of catharsis [TS]

00:18:00   with oh don't worry bad people will go [TS]

00:18:03   get their comeuppance because there are [TS]

00:18:04   forces in the University give it to them [TS]

00:18:05   so that was something that stuck with me [TS]

00:18:08   it it didn't the first time I read the [TS]

00:18:10   series but you know the first of the [TS]

00:18:11   series I had lost girls huh [TS]

00:18:13   so there you go oh well i tried to just [TS]

00:18:16   come back i tried to do some background [TS]

00:18:18   because I'm like Shirley other comic [TS]

00:18:19   sites have tackled this let's see if [TS]

00:18:20   anybody's done this and I kept burning [TS]

00:18:23   cross these essays forever like I I [TS]

00:18:24   don't know what to say and this made me [TS]

00:18:27   think of the biggest question I want to [TS]

00:18:28   ask you guys which is do you think that [TS]

00:18:31   this book might be perhaps a little too [TS]

00:18:33   complex with too many layers sisters and [TS]

00:18:36   systems in meeting [TS]

00:18:37   yeah or or or you know are we struggling [TS]

00:18:41   because we may be used to reading really [TS]

00:18:42   complex pros novels but when you get so [TS]

00:18:46   many different levels of narrative like [TS]

00:18:47   you having a graphic novel where is all [TS]

00:18:49   of this visual imagery on top of the [TS]

00:18:50   text and you have to negotiate the [TS]

00:18:52   relationship between them to do you [TS]

00:18:54   think maybe we're getting like what [TS]

00:18:55   basically amounts to four times the [TS]

00:18:56   complex novel is this the part where I [TS]

00:18:58   say yes again yes this time this time i [TS]

00:19:02   was reading it on my computer so i was [TS]

00:19:04   using guided view from panel to panel [TS]

00:19:07   I've lifted the guided view which I [TS]

00:19:09   never used to say let's see what the [TS]

00:19:11   person who did guided view things i [TS]

00:19:13   should look at the end to this is a [TS]

00:19:14   comic that breaks comiXology it is [TS]

00:19:17   because so many so much of the design is [TS]

00:19:19   here's the whole page isn't that amazing [TS]

00:19:21   and guess what are these panels go there [TS]

00:19:23   is overdoing it was like here's some [TS]

00:19:25   panels now let's zoom out now we're [TS]

00:19:27   gonna go back in now come back out [TS]

00:19:29   no man as I was I was looking at the [TS]

00:19:32   sequence where Sophie is is busy [TS]

00:19:35   BIP BIP bopping through it's the it's [TS]

00:19:39   the last issue in trade paperback number [TS]

00:19:42   two [TS]

00:19:42   yes chapter 6i have Magnus's about this [TS]

00:19:45   issue the stupid scrabble tiles at the [TS]

00:19:47   bottom [TS]

00:19:48   pentagram and oh there's a stupid [TS]

00:19:50   running joke at the bottom and the joke [TS]

00:19:51   is done by man in different stages of [TS]

00:19:53   development oh look there's a history of [TS]

00:19:54   Western civilization of the top [TS]

00:19:56   yeah then on top of that you have macro [TS]

00:19:59   and micro who are busy giving you really [TS]

00:20:01   bad hackneyed Rhymes and there's the [TS]

00:20:03   it's the Socratic dialogues and I [TS]

00:20:05   thought to myself only you can only do [TS]

00:20:08   some comics and then another party was [TS]

00:20:10   like I was born I always wanted to [TS]

00:20:15   remove the two snakes in the caduceus [TS]

00:20:17   were and what their personalities were [TS]

00:20:19   like no I never wanted to know that what [TS]

00:20:21   I found out I need to take a sponsor [TS]

00:20:24   break i want to tell you about loot [TS]

00:20:25   crate to Crate is a monthly subscription [TS]

00:20:27   box service for epic geek and gamer [TS]

00:20:30   items and pop-culture gear for less than [TS]

00:20:32   twenty dollars a month you get six to [TS]

00:20:34   eight items in a box in a crate the loot [TS]

00:20:37   crate includes licensed gear apparel [TS]

00:20:39   collectibles unique one-of-a-kind items [TS]

00:20:41   a whole lot more [TS]

00:20:43   I just got my first loot crate over the [TS]

00:20:46   holidays [TS]

00:20:46   it was really cool my kids liked it I [TS]

00:20:49   liked it we have distributed equitably [TS]

00:20:51   the items in the box and even the box [TS]

00:20:54   was cool looks like a little bat cave [TS]

00:20:56   inside the box it was really awesome [TS]

00:20:58   little magazine that goes with it that [TS]

00:21:00   tells you about the stuff that's and [TS]

00:21:01   it's a really cool thing you should try [TS]

00:21:03   it out [TS]

00:21:03   so in 2015 they wanted the first created [TS]

00:21:06   the year to celebrate geeky gaming items [TS]

00:21:08   of the past so they're rewinding and [TS]

00:21:11   giving Star Wars and Voltron stuff [TS]

00:21:13   putting those in the box along with some [TS]

00:21:15   epic geek apparel on a lot more if you [TS]

00:21:17   are hearing this before January [TS]

00:21:20   nineteenth at nine p.m. pacific time you [TS]

00:21:22   can subscribe and get the January box by [TS]

00:21:25   going to loot crate calm / Snell and [TS]

00:21:28   enter code smell to save ten percent off [TS]

00:21:30   any new subscription to loot crate if [TS]

00:21:32   you're hearing this after january [TS]

00:21:33   nineteen then the star wars the Voltron [TS]

00:21:35   the epic geek apparel you're not going [TS]

00:21:38   to get that but you know what you can do [TS]

00:21:40   you can still go to loot crate calm / [TS]

00:21:41   smell and sign up with february's create [TS]

00:21:44   what's going to be in February's great i [TS]

00:21:45   don't know yet although that's one of [TS]

00:21:47   the beauties of loot crate is you never [TS]

00:21:49   really know what you're gonna get even [TS]

00:21:50   if they give you hints the the opening [TS]

00:21:52   the box is a joy there like a pal who [TS]

00:21:55   knows the stuff that you love and like [TS]

00:21:57   to surprise you with awesome stuff every [TS]

00:22:00   month they shipped to nine different [TS]

00:22:01   countries there's more [TS]

00:22:02   nation on the loot crate site and it's [TS]

00:22:04   not just a subscription services a whole [TS]

00:22:06   community of fans that are sharing the [TS]

00:22:08   stuff that's in their crates with each [TS]

00:22:10   other and showing off what they're doing [TS]

00:22:11   with it it's a lot of fun so if this [TS]

00:22:14   sounds cool if having cool geeky stuff [TS]

00:22:16   appeals to you like it appeals to me go [TS]

00:22:18   to loot crate calm / smell and a code [TS]

00:22:21   smells to save ten percent off any new [TS]

00:22:22   subscription [TS]

00:22:23   Thank You lootcrate for the cool box [TS]

00:22:25   again every month and for sponsoring me [TS]

00:22:27   uncomfortable if you read the script for [TS]

00:22:30   from hell [TS]

00:22:31   only every panel has a thousand words [TS]

00:22:35   describing everything that's in it and [TS]

00:22:37   explaining all the research he did which [TS]

00:22:38   is why I think you know everything about [TS]

00:22:40   William Moulton Marston yeah but it's [TS]

00:22:42   like this was alan moore deciding i'm [TS]

00:22:46   just going to put in everything I think [TS]

00:22:47   of ya [TS]

00:22:49   yes my entire worldview yeah which is [TS]

00:22:51   why I think this is like the most [TS]

00:22:52   quintessentially mauryan thing ever [TS]

00:22:54   because it's him doing all sorts of [TS]

00:22:56   fancy intellectual backflips because one [TS]

00:22:59   of things i do love about legal shorter [TS]

00:23:01   gentleman for example is how he [TS]

00:23:03   basically it's basically highfalutin [TS]

00:23:04   fanfic oh sure it's gotten less [TS]

00:23:07   highfalutin nothing yet has i got like [TS]

00:23:09   the one volume or like oh so so so that [TS]

00:23:12   we have been harvested subject these [TS]

00:23:13   days that's about where i was like a [TS]

00:23:15   I'll find some other things treat it was [TS]

00:23:18   obvious like for a while he really love [TS]

00:23:20   these characters and love these stories [TS]

00:23:21   and he loved the idea of trying to fit [TS]

00:23:22   them together in a hole macro narrative [TS]

00:23:24   right and so here he's kind of doing the [TS]

00:23:27   same thing where author and Hermes and [TS]

00:23:29   all thrown floss and i'll throw in the [TS]

00:23:30   history of the Western world and i'll [TS]

00:23:32   throw in the Kabbalah and then i'll do a [TS]

00:23:34   whole lot of commentary on how awful [TS]

00:23:36   Generation X is and i'll send up the [TS]

00:23:38   super and after a while you're like dude [TS]

00:23:40   we get it dialed back man I kind of look [TS]

00:23:43   at it as sort of have to step back and [TS]

00:23:46   look at it it's just a work of art and [TS]

00:23:48   usually anytime i described something as [TS]

00:23:50   a work of art it means it's not [TS]

00:23:52   something that I really appreciate it on [TS]

00:23:54   an emotional level it's something that [TS]

00:23:56   look at it and say that this [TS]

00:23:58   intellectually appreciate it took an [TS]

00:24:00   awful lot of work and I appreciate that [TS]

00:24:02   that there are this many intellectual [TS]

00:24:04   backflips that went into it i was i was [TS]

00:24:07   actually really excited after eating the [TS]

00:24:08   first trade because I i thought at first [TS]

00:24:11   that maybe it was going to be a little [TS]

00:24:12   bit more of a straightforward narrative [TS]

00:24:13   that you had and i love the idea of the [TS]

00:24:16   land of imagination reminded me of like [TS]

00:24:18   fantasia from the neverending story but [TS]

00:24:21   the more we got into the you know the [TS]

00:24:23   Kabbalah on the Tarot and the mysticism [TS]

00:24:25   I mean I've read an awful lot of stuff [TS]

00:24:27   about that sort of thing but i prefer to [TS]

00:24:29   read about that in a more [TS]

00:24:31   straightforward you know kind of like [TS]

00:24:33   this just made me want to go back and [TS]

00:24:34   reread breaking open the head by Daniel [TS]

00:24:36   Pinchbeck which is a a real-world story [TS]

00:24:39   of self-discovery as opposed to this [TS]

00:24:41   very artsy fartsy version thereof so I [TS]

00:24:44   just felt like I was it was preaching to [TS]

00:24:45   the choir and I don't like being [TS]

00:24:47   preached to [TS]

00:24:48   and I really don't like being preached [TS]

00:24:49   you when I have to read like six [TS]

00:24:51   different types of things are going on [TS]

00:24:53   the same page [TS]

00:24:54   some of it in poem haha yeah although I [TS]

00:24:57   i liked it more than the Invisibles [TS]

00:25:00   which is grant morrison kind of doing [TS]

00:25:01   the same thing as yeah okay you know [TS]

00:25:04   what i'm talking about really sighs you [TS]

00:25:08   know they're kind of in a similar place [TS]

00:25:09   in my head where you know very smart [TS]

00:25:13   people who I respected strongly [TS]

00:25:14   encouraged me to read them and I got a [TS]

00:25:16   lot further in prometheus than i did in [TS]

00:25:18   the Invisibles but like yeah i got i [TS]

00:25:20   have tried one of the collection of the [TS]

00:25:22   Invisibles that I have never finished it [TS]

00:25:24   and I'm not I don't [TS]

00:25:26   you never will I think you can launch [TS]

00:25:28   the podcast called Lisa grumbles about [TS]

00:25:30   the Invisibles for 45 minutes and I [TS]

00:25:32   could probably fill it up for like six [TS]

00:25:33   weeks some people who have recommended [TS]

00:25:35   some other very good comics to be really [TS]

00:25:37   like the Invisibles but like yeah I [TS]

00:25:39   could not get into it this book reminded [TS]

00:25:41   me of another grant morrison book an [TS]

00:25:44   earlier one tho animal man oh man just [TS]

00:25:47   oh that's oh wow well tied into the loss [TS]

00:25:52   what was that the Lost Children which [TS]

00:25:53   was that big old vertical multi [TS]

00:25:54   crossover that had part of Sandman and [TS]

00:25:58   it had animal man and had Doom Patrol [TS]

00:26:01   and know and like 10 feet from the and [TS]

00:26:05   swamp thing to think it's tied into it [TS]

00:26:07   somehow and and whatsherface the little [TS]

00:26:09   girl from Animal Man and then I went [TS]

00:26:11   back and read grant grant morrison's [TS]

00:26:12   animal ran around and was like I I don't [TS]

00:26:15   take enough drugs to read this on a [TS]

00:26:16   regular basis haha but a lot of the same [TS]

00:26:19   stuff is going on here that that was a [TS]

00:26:22   series that starts out as a commentary [TS]

00:26:26   on superheroes and ends as a commentary [TS]

00:26:30   on comic books and plays a lot of the [TS]

00:26:32   same tricks I thought better than [TS]

00:26:35   promethea did because Prometheus a [TS]

00:26:37   polemic and this gets into the third [TS]

00:26:40   fourth and fifth trade paperbacks mommy [TS]

00:26:43   there's a big difference between books [TS]

00:26:45   to one and two and what comes after that [TS]

00:26:47   it's it's huge it's like it it's like a [TS]

00:26:51   lot more to sit it's time to preach yeah [TS]

00:26:53   by like by the time you to book five you [TS]

00:26:55   gotta be in there right and actually i [TS]

00:26:57   have to say without without being [TS]

00:26:58   spoilery the very last issue is is the [TS]

00:27:02   voice sort of changes in its it's much [TS]

00:27:04   more straightforward and it's a lot less [TS]

00:27:05   you know I don't know if it's a lot less [TS]

00:27:08   silly i guess i thought so honestly I [TS]

00:27:10   think my favorite one was the very very [TS]

00:27:12   last one where it's more just a case of [TS]

00:27:14   of el amor [TS]

00:27:15   he just kind of strips away some of the [TS]

00:27:17   artifice in between himself and their [TS]

00:27:19   the reader it is basically more just [TS]

00:27:21   talking straight at you rather than [TS]

00:27:23   putting it in layer after layer of gauzy [TS]

00:27:26   weirdness I feel like he kind of insist [TS]

00:27:28   on doing that at some point it always [TS]

00:27:30   works that's usually where i get [TS]

00:27:31   exasperated see i'd rather have that [TS]

00:27:34   than all the rest of it [TS]

00:27:36   I want to ask you something and didn't [TS]

00:27:37   occur to me until I didn't reread a [TS]

00:27:39   Promethean and then went back and looked [TS]

00:27:40   at some of his earlier works the [TS]

00:27:43   friendship between stacia and Sophie I [TS]

00:27:46   wanted to see what you guys thought [TS]

00:27:48   about that friendship how it reads to [TS]

00:27:50   you what you think they see in each [TS]

00:27:52   other and why so much attention is paid [TS]

00:27:54   to it i hope i never have a friendship [TS]

00:27:56   like that I just I felt that way that i [TS]

00:27:58   read it was that they were both such a [TS]

00:28:00   damaged people who did not really know [TS]

00:28:02   how to get along and society that they [TS]

00:28:03   couldn't do any better than each other [TS]

00:28:05   and I kept hoping that maybe they would [TS]

00:28:07   just go ahead on separate ways and find [TS]

00:28:08   some real friends and yeah you guys have [TS]

00:28:10   read more than me but i have to say that [TS]

00:28:12   was kind of the stuff that I struggled [TS]

00:28:14   with the most I mean everything else is [TS]

00:28:15   so kind of is all this kind of weird [TS]

00:28:17   fantastic stuff and the stuff between [TS]

00:28:20   them like just didn't know i didn't find [TS]

00:28:23   that writing is good and it didn't feel [TS]

00:28:24   particularly believable [TS]

00:28:26   I guess yeah because the only the the [TS]

00:28:28   most charitable explanation I can come [TS]

00:28:30   up with is maybe station is supposed to [TS]

00:28:32   be more steak on the vacuity or [TS]

00:28:34   shallowness of Generation X because [TS]

00:28:36   there's a lot of stuff in here that [TS]

00:28:37   makes me think that he tends that he [TS]

00:28:39   really hated the nineties like no [TS]

00:28:43   because a lot of the aesthetic I i was [TS]

00:28:45   looking at the trends that station rocks [TS]

00:28:47   and a lot of it is is very 1990s club [TS]

00:28:50   kid looking you know what the the [TS]

00:28:52   beehives and the hair colors and things [TS]

00:28:53   like that [TS]

00:28:54   weeping gorilla is basically that if we [TS]

00:28:58   can google is like the most 1990s thing [TS]

00:29:00   i can think of you know and especially [TS]

00:29:02   when he's got that one trackers like i [TS]

00:29:03   could if i could only listen to just one [TS]

00:29:05   more Radiohead track and I was like oh [TS]

00:29:07   there we go [TS]

00:29:07   but but i was wondering if stations [TS]

00:29:11   supposed to be his his indictment of oh [TS]

00:29:13   this is the chat shallow techno obsessed [TS]

00:29:15   non-critical consumerist generation and [TS]

00:29:18   their big into pop culture nostalgia and [TS]

00:29:21   so they're incapable genuine creativity [TS]

00:29:23   because he has such act of hostility for [TS]

00:29:25   that character i think that especially [TS]

00:29:27   the club she's at with the terrible rock [TS]

00:29:30   lyrics [TS]

00:29:31   oh yes laughing all over the place [TS]

00:29:32   that's now are lyrics are like Alan [TS]

00:29:35   knock it off [TS]

00:29:37   yeah yeah I'm i wanted to i want to back [TS]

00:29:40   up to talk about the edit that issue [TS]

00:29:42   number 12 again only because this is [TS]

00:29:44   this is we touched on it briefly but now [TS]

00:29:47   I kinda want to lower the boom on it be [TS]

00:29:49   is this I I I like Erica I appreciated [TS]

00:29:54   the effort [TS]

00:29:56   good job good effort that went into it [TS]

00:29:58   and get it the same time I kind of hated [TS]

00:30:00   it [TS]

00:30:01   yeah and so it reminded me of like an [TS]

00:30:07   art installation where they might have [TS]

00:30:09   liked some paintings on the walls and [TS]

00:30:12   some sculpture and you think oh it's art [TS]

00:30:14   but there's also like a boom box playing [TS]

00:30:16   beat poetry on one side and another boom [TS]

00:30:20   box playing different beat poetry on the [TS]

00:30:22   other side so it's a cacophony and you [TS]

00:30:24   don't understand it because there's just [TS]

00:30:26   too much going on you're completely [TS]

00:30:27   overwhelmed and then somebody is like [TS]

00:30:30   yelling footnotes at you [TS]

00:30:32   that is what that is and it's the entire [TS]

00:30:34   issues like that and it is alan moore [TS]

00:30:37   telling us how much research is done and [TS]

00:30:40   or what his personal metaphysical [TS]

00:30:43   beliefs about the universe and or tarot [TS]

00:30:46   cards are and it is it is so far off the [TS]

00:30:52   rails that it's it's kind of [TS]

00:30:54   breathtaking to watch somebody with that [TS]

00:30:56   level of talent when he brings up a [TS]

00:30:57   Harpo Marx tarot cards are all really [TS]

00:30:59   wait what [TS]

00:31:00   dude if you were on some like amanita [TS]

00:31:03   muscaria mushrooms you would be in linux [TS]

00:31:05   understanding everything to a degree of [TS]

00:31:07   clearly an issue 12 and it blew my mind [TS]

00:31:10   man [TS]

00:31:11   what I feel like this I actually feel [TS]

00:31:15   like this book is a huge artifact of the [TS]

00:31:16   nineteen nineties like intellectually [TS]

00:31:18   and psychically and pop-culture speaking [TS]

00:31:20   one of the reasons i actually dropped [TS]

00:31:22   out after my Master's is I was in grad [TS]

00:31:25   school at the time when [TS]

00:31:26   deconstructionism was huge and everyone [TS]

00:31:30   was time we break down the signifiers of [TS]

00:31:32   meaning and I should we should we should [TS]

00:31:34   put know by the way deconstructionism [TS]

00:31:35   met back then did not mean taking all [TS]

00:31:38   the different ingredients of a sandwich [TS]

00:31:39   and putting separately on a plate that [TS]

00:31:41   has never because you know it was [TS]

00:31:43   shocked terrible and it was a lot of [TS]

00:31:46   holiness zoo and you need to challenge [TS]

00:31:48   the the borders that have been ratified [TS]

00:31:50   by the Academy blogger and I was like I [TS]

00:31:53   can't really spend another four years [TS]

00:31:55   pretending that I respect this so i left [TS]

00:31:57   and [TS]

00:31:58   but there's 12 promethea for you that an [TS]

00:32:01   issue 12 a Promethean was like honestly [TS]

00:32:03   it was like the performance art I had a [TS]

00:32:05   class in the class that actually it got [TS]

00:32:07   me thinking I need to get the heck out [TS]

00:32:08   of school was one where are our [TS]

00:32:11   professor had challenged us to do a [TS]

00:32:12   creative interpretation of the history [TS]

00:32:14   of communications technology i am Morse [TS]

00:32:18   code that's right Joey I am a radio way [TS]

00:32:21   like there's this one guy who came in in [TS]

00:32:24   Latin like put himself in a foil box and [TS]

00:32:26   began reciting beat poetry years there [TS]

00:32:29   were people who liked it [TS]

00:32:30   interpretive dances to hypertext and [TS]

00:32:32   jenny holz her stuff and I was like and [TS]

00:32:35   I was like I can't even I just wrote a [TS]

00:32:37   regular paper deconstructing the [TS]

00:32:38   creation myths and wired magazine for [TS]

00:32:40   two years and an issue 12 was basically [TS]

00:32:44   like sitting through that class all over [TS]

00:32:46   again and you know what I looked at the [TS]

00:32:48   scrabble tiles and was like oh my God [TS]

00:32:50   he's done nothing but a mammogram is [TS]

00:32:51   this is this is I sort of like an [TS]

00:32:53   immigrant anagrams are what you do in [TS]

00:32:55   fifth grade you're like whoa if you [TS]

00:32:56   rearrange letters they need different [TS]

00:32:58   things are the same set now my mind [TS]

00:33:01   yeah it's kind of it's kind of a parlor [TS]

00:33:03   trick I think it's I think it's a shame [TS]

00:33:05   because I again there's a lot of really [TS]

00:33:08   great deep interesting material here but [TS]

00:33:12   it's like I mean at we say this so often [TS]

00:33:14   on this show in fact it's like it's like [TS]

00:33:16   there's nobody there because he's a lot [TS]

00:33:18   more right there's nobody there to say [TS]

00:33:19   Alan too far [TS]

00:33:21   dial it back on and there are plenty of [TS]

00:33:23   people out there who are saying you go [TS]

00:33:25   Alan maurya genius one of working on [TS]

00:33:28   Virginia's they feel smarter and having [TS]

00:33:29   read in this is a work of genius in the [TS]

00:33:31   sense that he's kind of a genius and he [TS]

00:33:33   did this work that is totally bizarre [TS]

00:33:35   and out there so there's that [TS]

00:33:37   likelike again I'm going back to Erica [TS]

00:33:39   there's that analytical level of like [TS]

00:33:40   what did alan moore mean when he did [TS]

00:33:43   this [TS]

00:33:43   that's fine but in terms of like being [TS]

00:33:46   an an editor or somebody saying what was [TS]

00:33:49   this what what do we think this was [TS]

00:33:51   going to be I get to issue 12 unlike [TS]

00:33:53   nope this is not what we thought this [TS]

00:33:55   was going to be this is kind of totally [TS]

00:33:56   nuts and you know I I liked where you [TS]

00:34:00   were going with the idea of sort of [TS]

00:34:02   taking me wonder woman kind of tropes [TS]

00:34:05   and investigating those and and [TS]

00:34:07   commenting on them [TS]

00:34:08   we haven't even talked about the fact [TS]

00:34:09   that you know promethea Sophie [TS]

00:34:12   is a as as as they see a point out [TS]

00:34:16   because she's a really good friend that [TS]

00:34:18   Sophie Sophie is kinda flat chested and [TS]

00:34:21   promethea is a cartoon character she's a [TS]

00:34:24   giant she's like an Amazon with big [TS]

00:34:26   boobs and I you look at that and you [TS]

00:34:29   think this is a great commentary on the [TS]

00:34:33   you know on individuality and and who's [TS]

00:34:37   the real person here and how we depict [TS]

00:34:38   women and and idealization of women and [TS]

00:34:42   all of that you know this nice rich [TS]

00:34:44   thing to draw from an issue 12 comes in [TS]

00:34:46   like oh ok the Big Bang there's a woman [TS]

00:34:49   with a snake in the sky real seriously [TS]

00:34:50   the Big Bang is a male ejaculation and [TS]

00:34:52   then cosmic inflation is a female [TS]

00:34:54   something that's the second card [TS]

00:34:57   oh did you see that money 5,000 yeah [TS]

00:35:01   that what I'm also wondering is we're [TS]

00:35:03   reading this in 2015 and graphic novels [TS]

00:35:06   are are pretty much they've come out of [TS]

00:35:09   the no really they're our basement where [TS]

00:35:11   they were hunting and because because [TS]

00:35:13   you have to get over the last decade [TS]

00:35:14   we've had you know wonderful works of [TS]

00:35:16   nonfiction reportage and we've had [TS]

00:35:18   really great contain graphic novels and [TS]

00:35:20   it's kind of hard to remember sometimes [TS]

00:35:22   that promethea was spawned as it were [TS]

00:35:25   when this this this repositioning of [TS]

00:35:29   comics and graphic novels when that was [TS]

00:35:30   still pretty ongoing and my senses is [TS]

00:35:33   that more is smart but he also whether [TS]

00:35:35   or not he admits that he wants to be [TS]

00:35:36   recognized as one as a literary genius [TS]

00:35:39   and favor [TS]

00:35:40   there's a little bit of trihard to it [TS]

00:35:42   where you like to just you know maybe [TS]

00:35:44   four systems of meeting per page not six [TS]

00:35:46   you know how I think it's important to [TS]

00:35:48   look at promethea in context when it [TS]

00:35:50   came out because he was also doing top [TS]

00:35:53   10 and Tom strong like that at exactly [TS]

00:35:57   the same time they all three of those [TS]

00:35:58   launched within two months of each other [TS]

00:36:00   and top 10 is good it's not you know [TS]

00:36:04   annoyingly deep lake from media is and [TS]

00:36:07   Tom strong is just fun [TS]

00:36:09   yes so I think at the time he was giving [TS]

00:36:11   people a range of the Alan Moore's and [TS]

00:36:13   they could pick which one they liked do [TS]

00:36:15   you like the one with the talking [TS]

00:36:16   gorilla and so much so that it was [TS]

00:36:18   during when you get Tom strong appearing [TS]

00:36:21   in prometheus later on and it's just [TS]

00:36:24   like I'm not I'm not [TS]

00:36:25   i thought i was reading this kind of [TS]

00:36:27   comic and now we're back to that kind of [TS]

00:36:28   comic again [TS]

00:36:29   yeah and I like well I like top 10 and [TS]

00:36:31   Tom strong and i would say both I like [TS]

00:36:33   them both enjoyed them both better than [TS]

00:36:35   promethea but i also will accept in that [TS]

00:36:38   duality that prometheus is obviously an [TS]

00:36:40   artist trying to do something big big [TS]

00:36:45   and about the universe where is Tom Tom [TS]

00:36:47   strong top 10 or kind of about comic [TS]

00:36:49   books and i gotta-i gotta make sales [TS]

00:36:51   I could make some but they're also i [TS]

00:36:53   mean while I comment on the John run [TS]

00:36:55   yeah and and then do a twist narrative [TS]

00:36:57   and and all of that and so I can [TS]

00:36:59   appreciate Prometheus's ambition level [TS]

00:37:03   versus top 10 tom strong which I like I [TS]

00:37:05   also i I don't know sometimes I wonder I [TS]

00:37:08   try to think about alan moore and [TS]

00:37:10   forgive me for taking this even further [TS]

00:37:11   off topic but sometimes I wonder about [TS]

00:37:13   him in the context of somebody who has [TS]

00:37:16   sort of done everything there is to do [TS]

00:37:18   and has been acclaimed as one of the [TS]

00:37:20   greats in his chosen medium and why do [TS]

00:37:25   you do after that and and then he's got [TS]

00:37:27   his extra anger about like DC Comics [TS]

00:37:29   taking advantage of him and all that and [TS]

00:37:31   so you end up with this like you know [TS]

00:37:32   what it what's your next acting for him [TS]

00:37:35   it was america's best comics i'm going [TS]

00:37:37   to do these different titles [TS]

00:37:39   I'm gonna you know i'm going to do [TS]

00:37:40   something super hero we over here and [TS]

00:37:42   I'm going to do this something [TS]

00:37:43   mythological over there and I mean it is [TS]

00:37:45   kind of on one level I mean I have no [TS]

00:37:48   idea how he turned out all the money [TS]

00:37:50   from the movie so obviously he's got [TS]

00:37:51   enough money to live on and doesn't care [TS]

00:37:53   and can just turn the money down or give [TS]

00:37:56   it to dave gibbons out of spite for [TS]

00:37:57   judgment [TS]

00:37:58   well most of the movies are not making a [TS]

00:38:00   lot of money that legal ordinary [TS]

00:38:02   gentlemen movie [TS]

00:38:02   well that's true but I mean just for [TS]

00:38:04   that just for the rights my [TS]

00:38:05   understanding is they keep trying to [TS]

00:38:06   shovel money and alan moore and he keeps [TS]

00:38:08   saying give it to the colorist give it [TS]

00:38:09   to the letter or give it to the artist I [TS]

00:38:11   don't want it i don't want your filthy [TS]

00:38:13   money that's fine but so then let's just [TS]

00:38:16   assume we can do whatever he wants [TS]

00:38:18   that's kind of fascinating like you you [TS]

00:38:21   have reached the pinnacle you can do [TS]

00:38:23   whatever you want and you know and then [TS]

00:38:26   that puts you in this position we're [TS]

00:38:28   like all right well I'm gonna do this [TS]

00:38:29   crazy like kabbala infested uh your [TS]

00:38:35   woman gets religion [TS]

00:38:37   let's do that and what I've done with [TS]

00:38:39   that I'm gonna do pornographic fanfic [TS]

00:38:41   well retired my giant mansion and [TS]

00:38:43   worship by snake god my pal Neil rights [TS]

00:38:46   doubles he's living his best life I [TS]

00:38:49   think we should talk about that [TS]

00:38:50   let me take a sponsor break here i want [TS]

00:38:52   to tell you about mail route imagine a [TS]

00:38:54   world without spam viruses or bounced [TS]

00:38:56   email imagine opening your mail and [TS]

00:38:58   seeing only the legitimate stuff that [TS]

00:39:00   you want and need to receive you can do [TS]

00:39:03   this with mail route get spam out of [TS]

00:39:06   your box get out of your mail server [TS]

00:39:08   i've been using mail route for quite a [TS]

00:39:09   while now and it has cleared out my [TS]

00:39:11   inbox can do the same for you [TS]

00:39:14   there's no hardware software by mail [TS]

00:39:16   route as a service that lives in the [TS]

00:39:18   cloud it takes in your mail it uses some [TS]

00:39:20   serious intelligence to filter out the [TS]

00:39:22   spam and viruses and other just junk [TS]

00:39:25   stuff and it doesn't deliver that to you [TS]

00:39:28   instead it holds onto that stuff and it [TS]

00:39:30   passes through to your mail server only [TS]

00:39:32   the good stuff so if your desktop user [TS]

00:39:35   you can find that the user interface is [TS]

00:39:36   simple and reliable but for you email [TS]

00:39:39   administrators and IT pros out there you [TS]

00:39:41   want to check it out they built all the [TS]

00:39:42   tools with you in mind they've got an [TS]

00:39:43   API for account management they support [TS]

00:39:45   pretty much anything you'd want from the [TS]

00:39:48   people handling your mail ldap Active [TS]

00:39:49   Directory TLS male bagging outbound [TS]

00:39:52   relay all of that stuff no hardware [TS]

00:39:54   software to buy remove spam from your [TS]

00:39:57   life for good [TS]

00:39:58   I did go to mail route dotnet / and [TS]

00:40:01   comfortable for a free trial and ten [TS]

00:40:03   percent off for the lifetime of your [TS]

00:40:05   account i've been using it it's working [TS]

00:40:07   great my inbox is clearer than it's ever [TS]

00:40:09   been before [TS]

00:40:10   check it out and thank you so much to [TS]

00:40:11   mail route for sponsoring and [TS]

00:40:12   comfortable that the word I keep coming [TS]

00:40:14   back to when i think about this is it I [TS]

00:40:16   feel like he thinks of this as maybe his [TS]

00:40:20   masterwork because it ties together a [TS]

00:40:22   bunch of other things it looks like he's [TS]

00:40:24   really putting himself on the page [TS]

00:40:26   perhaps more than even in some of his [TS]

00:40:28   other work in this this really is a [TS]

00:40:30   worldview in you know in color and yeah [TS]

00:40:34   good for him [TS]

00:40:35   I'll see your I'll see your masterwork [TS]

00:40:38   and I'll raise it to manifest oh yeah [TS]

00:40:41   okay that works that works is one of the [TS]

00:40:43   things that I find astounding is how [TS]

00:40:45   much he seems to hate Western [TS]

00:40:47   civilization because that comes know it [TS]

00:40:49   does [TS]

00:40:49   because the way that he depicts 1999 [TS]

00:40:52   that's the world that Sophia station [TS]

00:40:54   it's pretty clear to me that station is [TS]

00:40:55   a product of that world like purely and [TS]

00:40:57   holy of that world [TS]

00:40:58   well he hates modern Western [TS]

00:41:00   civilization League of Extraordinary [TS]

00:41:01   Gentlemen later things suggest he really [TS]

00:41:04   likes like old stuff we've been girl [TS]

00:41:06   weeping gorilla is is basically that the [TS]

00:41:09   the stand-in for I hate the way [TS]

00:41:11   sentiment has been commercialized and [TS]

00:41:12   the bands are basically a stand-in for I [TS]

00:41:15   hate the way music today as nihilistic [TS]

00:41:17   and doesn't talk about meaningful things [TS]

00:41:18   like it did in the 60s and the science [TS]

00:41:21   heroes are an indictment of of the [TS]

00:41:23   corporatization of the state and also he [TS]

00:41:27   really hates the fantastic 40 Giants [TS]

00:41:32   heroes what are you talking about the [TS]

00:41:33   five small guys [TS]

00:41:34   yeah I'm totally different number [TS]

00:41:37   there's like this alien vs thing in a [TS]

00:41:39   book number two where I made a note but [TS]

00:41:42   i'm trying to find it now where it's the [TS]

00:41:45   most ridiculous sterilization that has a [TS]

00:41:47   solid banging your head against the wall [TS]

00:41:48   where basically he's talking about how [TS]

00:41:50   the age of aquarius was so awesome [TS]

00:41:51   because you have this generation that [TS]

00:41:52   was totally into spirituality there's a [TS]

00:41:54   critical mass of people blur blur blur [TS]

00:41:56   and I'm like are you kidding me with the [TS]

00:41:58   baby boomers and so this this whole this [TS]

00:42:02   whole series is pretty much his his [TS]

00:42:05   contempt for and weirdly enough not his [TS]

00:42:08   contempt for the baby boomers but rather [TS]

00:42:09   his contempt for the people who are [TS]

00:42:11   reacting to baby boomer culture so [TS]

00:42:13   basically on the one hand it may be as [TS]

00:42:15   master working on the other hand it's [TS]

00:42:17   just a little giant standing on the wall [TS]

00:42:19   no hits he has a giant it's a giant fist [TS]

00:42:21   raised at the kids saying get off my [TS]

00:42:23   lawn [TS]

00:42:24   it kind of feels like that when you when [TS]

00:42:25   you read through another time you're [TS]

00:42:27   like wow he really has a lot of contempt [TS]

00:42:29   for youth culture in this and for modern [TS]

00:42:31   culture and you know when he's like well [TS]

00:42:33   the end of the world wouldn't be so bad [TS]

00:42:34   because we went off track [TS]

00:42:36   I one of the things I noticed about it [TS]

00:42:38   and and you know that here's my theory [TS]

00:42:40   which is the watch watchmen is very much [TS]

00:42:42   like modern society is doomed and this [TS]

00:42:46   is like modern society is doomed but [TS]

00:42:48   it's later and so now he hates a later [TS]

00:42:51   version of modern society but it's [TS]

00:42:52   really just whatever is happening he [TS]

00:42:55   hates it [TS]

00:42:55   yeah it's a grand old counterculture [TS]

00:42:57   days that he's [TS]

00:42:59   but he's pining for ya everything else [TS]

00:43:01   sucks [TS]

00:43:02   he's a fascinating character back when [TS]

00:43:04   you can make an honest living as a drug [TS]

00:43:06   dealer or something that's what yeah [TS]

00:43:07   that's the thing it and this goes back [TS]

00:43:10   to my my n800 of academic [TS]

00:43:11   deconstructionism to think we should [TS]

00:43:14   hate on podcast child actors [TS]

00:43:16   deconstructionism um but the thing is [TS]

00:43:18   you can't have a counterculture unless [TS]

00:43:20   you have account unless you have a [TS]

00:43:21   culture to specifically define it and [TS]

00:43:23   like I don't think he realizes that in [TS]

00:43:25   many ways the counterculture both won [TS]

00:43:28   and lost because they got commodified so [TS]

00:43:30   you really can't be counterculture at [TS]

00:43:31   this point because we've become such a [TS]

00:43:32   polyglot culture and it's like he [TS]

00:43:34   doesn't recognize that and his works [TS]

00:43:37   don't recognize that there's this [TS]

00:43:38   there's this incredible conformance mass [TS]

00:43:40   and then there's like two or three [TS]

00:43:41   people who see the real world and you're [TS]

00:43:43   like really thats see no it's not how [TS]

00:43:45   that's not how that's not how it's [TS]

00:43:47   worked and perhaps because again we're [TS]

00:43:49   looking at this from the filter of 15 [TS]

00:43:52   years on where a lot has changed the [TS]

00:43:54   global landscape and you know the [TS]

00:43:56   Internet has has has had the internet is [TS]

00:43:58   now a fact of life for people there [TS]

00:44:01   there's a lot of points of view in this [TS]

00:44:03   book that I i think are really specific [TS]

00:44:04   to their time like as i was reading I [TS]

00:44:07   thought you said make a fascinating [TS]

00:44:08   college class the same way that reading [TS]

00:44:10   virginia woolf makes a fascinating [TS]

00:44:11   college class because you don't just [TS]

00:44:13   read the book what you have to do is [TS]

00:44:14   understand the context in the history [TS]

00:44:15   and why it mattered at the time it was [TS]

00:44:18   created and that's I think is part of it [TS]

00:44:19   for going back and revisiting promethea [TS]

00:44:21   I was like wow it is it is starting to [TS]

00:44:25   read this now it in conduit you know [TS]

00:44:27   especially 15 years after basically [TS]

00:44:29   started and realize like how much has [TS]

00:44:30   changed in how reactionary and and left [TS]

00:44:33   behind this book filled in some ways I [TS]

00:44:35   mean it's still a beautiful book i think [TS]

00:44:37   it will see ya there isn't a single page [TS]

00:44:39   for the coloring isn't the colors is [TS]

00:44:41   phenomenal and you know we can rant [TS]

00:44:43   about how wonderful todd Klein is and [TS]

00:44:46   they are you know I I really feel like [TS]

00:44:48   JH williams three means needs a special [TS]

00:44:50   shout-out yes it's it's a gorgeous book [TS]

00:44:52   battle use a lot of the ideas behind it [TS]

00:44:55   and there's there's kind of no heart of [TS]

00:44:56   this at the middle at the center of it [TS]

00:44:57   and if you're going to write a polemic [TS]

00:44:59   or if you're going to be like this is my [TS]

00:45:01   life this is the culmination of my [TS]

00:45:02   philosophy like put some put some heart [TS]

00:45:04   into it i agree with you but I it in the [TS]

00:45:07   books defense in every single issue [TS]

00:45:10   there is something in there [TS]

00:45:12   clever there is something there is some [TS]

00:45:14   beautiful art in every one of these [TS]

00:45:16   issues the entire issue as a whole may [TS]

00:45:19   not hang together at all but there but [TS]

00:45:23   there is cleverness in here I'm and I [TS]

00:45:26   take Erica's point about it's a it is a [TS]

00:45:29   work of art and I take her point about [TS]

00:45:33   how about that not being a terribly [TS]

00:45:35   enjoyable statement thing but every once [TS]

00:45:38   in a while I do like looking at art for [TS]

00:45:40   art's sake and it may be difficult for [TS]

00:45:43   me to get emotionally involved in it or [TS]

00:45:45   for me to appreciate it as a story but [TS]

00:45:49   it is challenging and there are neat [TS]

00:45:51   things that happen in every book ok [TS]

00:45:55   maybe not 36 but we're not anything [TS]

00:45:58   yeah I think we're being to a little too [TS]

00:46:00   hard on it that and i think it's it's [TS]

00:46:03   certainly gorgeous to look at i think [TS]

00:46:05   it's interesting reading and I think [TS]

00:46:07   it's fascinating to have a world class [TS]

00:46:10   weirdo like alan moore it is until it [TS]

00:46:13   down to his alan murray estate would say [TS]

00:46:15   this is what I think alan moore of all [TS]

00:46:19   the Alan Moore's in the world where the [TS]

00:46:21   alan moore easiest yeah like how [TS]

00:46:24   ambitious this book is yeah yeah you [TS]

00:46:26   know that's why I had no I i enjoyed [TS]

00:46:29   reading it and we'll probably read all [TS]

00:46:30   of the issues because again i would like [TS]

00:46:33   to read everything Elmore okay well [TS]

00:46:35   almost everything maybe not lost girls I [TS]

00:46:37   has also present he is fat he is a [TS]

00:46:40   fascinating even when I don't like or [TS]

00:46:43   agree with what he's doing [TS]

00:46:45   I'm fascinated to see the a great artist [TS]

00:46:47   at work and why i like it and don't like [TS]

00:46:50   it i have to admit there are moments [TS]

00:46:51   where I feel like he's trolling me as [TS]

00:46:53   your career because having enjoyed top [TS]

00:46:56   10 for example there is a subplot early [TS]

00:46:59   on involving the five swell guys and the [TS]

00:47:03   painted doll Everett at the hospital [TS]

00:47:05   that is very twisty plot a superhero e [TS]

00:47:08   in the same way the top 10 is actually [TS]

00:47:11   accept its kind of beside the point [TS]

00:47:15   and its really like you were you're [TS]

00:47:17   interested in that well that's not what [TS]

00:47:18   we're telling a story about today and I [TS]

00:47:21   I even kind of appreciate that but it [TS]

00:47:24   also reminds me of [TS]

00:47:25   alan moore when he's focused on telling [TS]

00:47:28   those kinds of stories and how I mean [TS]

00:47:30   this is always in the back of my head is [TS]

00:47:32   alan moore is such a brilliant writer of [TS]

00:47:36   this this is genre of superhero we kind [TS]

00:47:40   of stories so good at it and I can tell [TS]

00:47:44   that he doesn't want to do it [TS]

00:47:47   yeah and you know he's done it and he's [TS]

00:47:49   maybe done it better than anybody and he [TS]

00:47:51   kind of doesn't want to do it again and [TS]

00:47:52   now he's just playing with me a little [TS]

00:47:54   bit like see I could do that but i'm not [TS]

00:47:56   going to and it's his you know it's up [TS]

00:47:58   to him he doesn't have to write those [TS]

00:47:59   kinds of stories anymore but he's even [TS]

00:48:01   when he kind of taunts me a little bit [TS]

00:48:03   it's like he's so good at it even when [TS]

00:48:05   he doesn't want to be and you know top [TS]

00:48:07   10 reminded me how good he was at it I [TS]

00:48:10   would love to read a book about those [TS]

00:48:12   five guys to be honest with you the [TS]

00:48:13   interval goes swell first swell the [TS]

00:48:17   interpersonal dynamics for great um i [TS]

00:48:20   love them i love the mayor with the [TS]

00:48:23   pulse width of and personalities yeah [TS]

00:48:26   yeah and honestly if you know i would [TS]

00:48:29   have loved a a side book about the [TS]

00:48:31   people who are responsible for weeping [TS]

00:48:32   gorilla because I iphone just in there [TS]

00:48:35   ya know I i find yeah it's just it there [TS]

00:48:38   they're all these details that you know [TS]

00:48:39   in that you could actually spin out into [TS]

00:48:41   really rich entertaining books on their [TS]

00:48:43   own and they're just casually tossed out [TS]

00:48:46   because this is a guy who's idea whose [TS]

00:48:47   idea factory never shuts down i'm [TS]

00:48:50   clearly well you know i feel i was for [TS]

00:48:52   rewarded when i get through his books [TS]

00:48:54   and then go back and i picked this [TS]

00:48:56   because you know it really is engaged [TS]

00:48:59   reading on on a huge level and one of [TS]

00:49:03   the comic book series i've been reading [TS]

00:49:04   kind of as a palate cleanser between us [TS]

00:49:06   I've been going back and revisiting the [TS]

00:49:08   mike grell run on green arrow which was [TS]

00:49:11   written but you know so it's books that [TS]

00:49:12   are like the ladies and it's you know [TS]

00:49:15   total total shift its in lab it's [TS]

00:49:17   literally like a palate cleanser it's a [TS]

00:49:19   sorbet to the the gourmet work about [TS]

00:49:21   more and it makes me appreciate them [TS]

00:49:23   both a whole lot more important without [TS]

00:49:25   more like I'm effectively reading 10 [TS]

00:49:27   books at once and and that got me to [TS]

00:49:29   thinking what I have this reaction if it [TS]

00:49:32   were in a different medium if your prose [TS]

00:49:34   or if it were a TV show and and it did [TS]

00:49:36   this or or is [TS]

00:49:38   this type of story that you can only [TS]

00:49:39   tell in comics I don't know [TS]

00:49:41   Lynda Carter would have made me [TS]

00:49:42   interesting promethea but I think [TS]

00:49:45   there's a lot of women who have made [TS]

00:49:47   sure he was just a lawless would be [TS]

00:49:49   great to actually you're right Lucy [TS]

00:49:51   Lawless basically Barbie she be a [TS]

00:49:53   fantastic Barbara oh my god i don't know [TS]

00:49:56   Alan Moore man my eye I have my own like [TS]

00:50:00   10 different versions of watchmen I mean [TS]

00:50:02   and I think I've got it i mean i think [TS]

00:50:04   i've got a couple a couple v for [TS]

00:50:07   vendetta and I from hell I mean I i am [TS]

00:50:09   fascinated by Alan Moore that oh yeah [TS]

00:50:11   and all and all he does and this is this [TS]

00:50:13   is this is good it's just there are [TS]

00:50:15   those moments where I feel like a lot [TS]

00:50:17   more pulls us aside and ok sit here now [TS]

00:50:19   and let me tell you a little bit of [TS]

00:50:21   value it would you like to subscribe to [TS]

00:50:23   my newsletter that is called dodjem [TS]

00:50:25   logic there's one piece of dialogue i [TS]

00:50:28   wanted to make fun of just just really [TS]

00:50:30   briefly just one pic yes there's a [TS]

00:50:35   moment when I think it's Barbara [TS]

00:50:37   Prometheus says I'm freaking promethea [TS]

00:50:40   you idiot [TS]

00:50:41   yeah and reading that now really [TS]

00:50:43   reminded me of Frank Miller's dialogue [TS]

00:50:45   for all-star batman and robin oh-ah I'm [TS]

00:50:51   going to steal Erica's role here and i'm [TS]

00:50:53   going to make the obligatory doctor who [TS]

00:50:55   reference alright I when I light [TS]

00:50:58   Ghostlight seventh seventh doctor [TS]

00:51:01   episode where they crammed in so many [TS]

00:51:05   ideas into three episodes and the and [TS]

00:51:09   fandom is hugely divided over whether it [TS]

00:51:13   is genius or whether it is overall [TS]

00:51:16   incomprehensible nonsense [TS]

00:51:17   yeah principle not that I think Eric and [TS]

00:51:20   I are both on the incomprehensible [TS]

00:51:21   nonsense team here and and I get this [TS]

00:51:24   feeling over like I do get this feeling [TS]

00:51:27   over promethea where I where I am [TS]

00:51:30   struggling i'm struggling through the [TS]

00:51:32   cool stuff and the cool art and trying [TS]

00:51:35   to figure out if this is a really a good [TS]

00:51:38   use of the medium you know I think for [TS]

00:51:40   me it was a sound very negative about [TS]

00:51:43   this and I think that the reason for [TS]

00:51:45   that is simply because they didn't know [TS]

00:51:47   what I was getting into my expectations [TS]

00:51:49   worst kind of like I said set up to be [TS]

00:51:51   one thing if I had known what it was [TS]

00:51:53   going to be going into it and had was [TS]

00:51:56   able to sort of shift my mind to be [TS]

00:51:57   ready for that i think i would have [TS]

00:51:59   would have liked it more but since i was [TS]

00:52:00   expecting something a little bit more [TS]

00:52:02   straightforward it was disapointing to [TS]

00:52:04   have that that shift but but i do really [TS]

00:52:08   think that it was beautiful on both [TS]

00:52:10   surface levels and incredibly deep [TS]

00:52:12   levels i mean if there's a lot of good [TS]

00:52:14   in here it [TS]

00:52:16   this may not be for me but I am honestly [TS]

00:52:19   glad that it exists and I I wouldn't [TS]

00:52:22   change a thing [TS]

00:52:22   I think i'm totally with you Erykah i [TS]

00:52:24   mean i feel like i watch and read and [TS]

00:52:26   listen to a lot of stuff that's kind of [TS]

00:52:27   junk food media and this though I don't [TS]

00:52:32   think I care for it was really [TS]

00:52:34   interesting in a way that a lot of stuff [TS]

00:52:36   i consume is not so like I don't regret [TS]

00:52:40   reading it which is you know not [TS]

00:52:42   something i can say about everything i [TS]

00:52:43   read i don't know and i went back and [TS]

00:52:45   read it again because I wanted to feel [TS]

00:52:47   prepared and and I got more out of it [TS]

00:52:49   the second time and that's not something [TS]

00:52:50   that's always true but i don't know if i [TS]

00:52:53   need to own it which I currently do i [TS]

00:52:55   don't know i'm going to go back and read [TS]

00:52:57   this again right you know i feel like i [TS]

00:52:59   got plenty of other comics on the Shelf [TS]

00:53:00   that I'm much more likely to read many [TS]

00:53:03   many more times before i decided to pull [TS]

00:53:05   this one down again and you know I guess [TS]

00:53:09   that's kind of how i feel about [TS]

00:53:10   something that I've I've I've read [TS]

00:53:11   watchmen countless times I don't feel [TS]

00:53:14   the need to reread his middle stuff of [TS]

00:53:17   League of Extraordinary Gentlemen [TS]

00:53:19   anymore i'm okay with that right so yeah [TS]

00:53:22   yeah there's a moment and book 3 when [TS]

00:53:25   their characters walking on a m√∂bius [TS]

00:53:28   loop and if you're reading this on an [TS]

00:53:30   iPad you're in hell yeah because because [TS]

00:53:34   auto-rotate is your worst enemy [TS]

00:53:36   oh yeah but what it's designed for it to [TS]

00:53:38   be in a comic book when I got to that [TS]

00:53:41   point I did actually have to put the [TS]

00:53:44   ipad down and direct an expletive and [TS]

00:53:48   Ally take a little long [TS]

00:53:49   korean shake your fist Adele and more [TS]

00:53:51   wherever here take a left take a walk [TS]

00:53:53   around the ipad so you can actually see [TS]

00:53:55   everything i want to mention that the [TS]

00:53:57   science hero thing which is in this end [TS]

00:53:59   and in tom strong is a i believe i was [TS]

00:54:03   just talking on [TS]

00:54:04   I walk today with with with my family [TS]

00:54:07   about we were talking about superheroes [TS]

00:54:09   and things like that [TS]

00:54:10   I didn't start it but I finished it [TS]

00:54:12   uh-huh about the idea of it superhero [TS]

00:54:14   itself is a trademark co-owned by DC [TS]

00:54:17   Comics Marvel Comics and and and I [TS]

00:54:20   realized later that this is why Alan [TS]

00:54:22   Moore has played up the concept of [TS]

00:54:24   science hero in these comics because [TS]

00:54:26   that's actually his commentary on the [TS]

00:54:29   fact that superhero is owned as a [TS]

00:54:32   concept and I thought that was hilarious [TS]

00:54:34   actually [TS]

00:54:36   Wow because he's a bitter bitter man so [TS]

00:54:38   so bitter who I had what better is [TS]

00:54:40   awesome and you know I obviously enjoy [TS]

00:54:42   better men but I don't know what you're [TS]

00:54:50   talking about that the the take i took [TS]

00:54:54   from that as well is since the a lot of [TS]

00:54:57   this talks about instinct and primordial [TS]

00:54:59   flow and cosmic rhythms and so on and so [TS]

00:55:02   forth is i also had a kind of suddenly [TS]

00:55:05   slip it goes back to his I hate [TS]

00:55:06   technological progress I think he's not [TS]

00:55:08   a really big fan of scientific culture [TS]

00:55:12   as it emerged in popular culture over [TS]

00:55:15   the last 60 to 70 years like I think the [TS]

00:55:18   space race is kind of the worst thing [TS]

00:55:19   that's ever happened to him personally [TS]

00:55:20   because what because it legitimized [TS]

00:55:24   science as a way to to learn about [TS]

00:55:26   creation and introduce ideas of quantify [TS]

00:55:29   ability and verifying and you have to [TS]

00:55:32   reproduce results and this is how we [TS]

00:55:34   know things is because they are [TS]

00:55:35   immutable and that that is almost [TS]

00:55:38   counter to this whole you walk pads and [TS]

00:55:40   see women having things to do it snakes [TS]

00:55:41   in the sky and that's how you know [TS]

00:55:42   you're on the the path to truth and [TS]

00:55:44   freedom is so for me [TS]

00:55:46   science heroes is also his way of saying [TS]

00:55:47   well I hate the deplorable superhero [TS]

00:55:50   culture of mainstream comics right [TS]

00:55:52   science is not done anything great for [TS]

00:55:53   culture too horrible taste that tastes [TS]

00:55:55   horrible together often get is his a [TS]

00:55:58   wikipedia biography made me laugh out [TS]

00:56:00   loud because it describes him as an [TS]

00:56:02   occultist ceremonial magician and [TS]

00:56:06   anarchist it's like yep that's that's [TS]

00:56:09   you can tell you that from the beard [TS]

00:56:11   really yeah well I got a cultist [TS]

00:56:14   ceremonial magician i was saying that [TS]

00:56:16   this should turn into a showtime [TS]

00:56:18   TV series and and I realize it will not [TS]

00:56:20   happen because i would but it might [TS]

00:56:21   break everybody's TVs know what I was [TS]

00:56:24   thinking is personal a lot more like I [TS]

00:56:25   don't need the money and I thought what [TS]

00:56:27   they do is they would probably strip the [TS]

00:56:28   cult it would be this woman gets really [TS]

00:56:30   possessed by hot women entities and she [TS]

00:56:33   goes often has adventures and at the end [TS]

00:56:35   she meets an FBI guy and settles down [TS]

00:56:36   like they would totally date and the [TS]

00:56:39   meantime it's an example is an excuse [TS]

00:56:41   for women to get into like scanty chain [TS]

00:56:43   mail and run around and I thought oh man [TS]

00:56:46   I i need to stop reading for that tap [TS]

00:56:47   and it is why I want more is better [TS]

00:56:50   yeah exactly because you know you [TS]

00:56:52   there's and and I thought well maybe the [TS]

00:56:53   religious things kind of off-putting [TS]

00:56:54   thing because in u.s. culture were [TS]

00:56:57   really generally very uncomfortable with [TS]

00:57:00   with any sort of with the idea that [TS]

00:57:01   people who believe things that are in [TS]

00:57:03   judeo-christian have have valid rights [TS]

00:57:05   and their beliefs might actually be [TS]

00:57:07   worth considering [TS]

00:57:08   that's not really an idea that we're [TS]

00:57:09   comfortable with so having an entire [TS]

00:57:11   series or attractive will explain the [TS]

00:57:13   Kabbalah g it might be off-putting and I [TS]

00:57:17   thought know they would probably just [TS]

00:57:18   eliminate that altogether and go [TS]

00:57:19   straight to and then she and this is she [TS]

00:57:22   and the 54 guys take on you know don't [TS]

00:57:24   you [TS]

00:57:25   the y2k y2k technology because we see [TS]

00:57:27   them and then they permeate takes on the [TS]

00:57:30   crazy mayor and then promethea goes on a [TS]

00:57:32   walkabout to help a lady find her dead [TS]

00:57:34   husband and it would just be like that [TS]

00:57:36   and there might be a hint of [TS]

00:57:38   spirituality to keep people you know to [TS]

00:57:40   keep the fan people no no really it's [TS]

00:57:41   gonna happen in minute now but it would [TS]

00:57:43   it would basically be we have attractive [TS]

00:57:45   women running around and losing their [TS]

00:57:47   clothes every opportunity which would [TS]

00:57:50   actually be the type of series that [TS]

00:57:51   promethea would send up in flames as [TS]

00:57:53   proof of a decadent spiritually dead [TS]

00:57:55   Western culture that needs to be brought [TS]

00:57:57   meant let me take a break to tell you [TS]

00:58:00   about one of our sponsors at Squarespace [TS]

00:58:02   you heard them at the top of the show [TS]

00:58:02   you know back in the day building [TS]

00:58:05   website was a really really hard the [TS]

00:58:08   number of things you need to know you [TS]

00:58:09   need to know the technical stuff about [TS]

00:58:10   things like the web server you need to [TS]

00:58:12   set up that the code you need if you [TS]

00:58:15   want to add e-commerce there's a whole [TS]

00:58:16   other series of things that you need to [TS]

00:58:18   all integrate together so much effort to [TS]

00:58:21   do that even as recently as a few years [TS]

00:58:23   ago just a really hard thing to do I [TS]

00:58:25   definitely felt this pain with a bunch [TS]

00:58:28   of the sites that i was starting back in [TS]

00:58:30   the late nineties and in the [TS]

00:58:31   to thousands but the good news is you [TS]

00:58:34   don't have to worry about anymore [TS]

00:58:35   there's Squarespace Squarespace makes [TS]

00:58:37   building beautiful websites easy you can [TS]

00:58:40   do it without breaking a sweat [TS]

00:58:42   so if you're new to squarespace check it [TS]

00:58:43   out and if you've been hearing about [TS]

00:58:44   Squarespace on podcast like this one for [TS]

00:58:47   a long time [TS]

00:58:47   there's much more to talk about now that [TS]

00:58:50   Squarespace seven is here [TS]

00:58:52   Squarespace 7 has a brand new redesigned [TS]

00:58:55   user interface it's got integration with [TS]

00:58:57   google apps so it can connect to your [TS]

00:58:59   email and your spreadsheets and things [TS]

00:59:01   like that it's got this amazing [TS]

00:59:02   partnership with getty images where you [TS]

00:59:04   can spend ten dollars per image from the [TS]

00:59:08   library of getty images 40 million high [TS]

00:59:10   quality photos the photo licensing [TS]

00:59:12   happens right within Squarespace such a [TS]

00:59:15   great feature and i want to mention 15 [TS]

00:59:17   new design templates there are these [TS]

00:59:19   beautiful responsive design templates so [TS]

00:59:21   they look great on computers they look [TS]

00:59:23   great on phones and tablets as well so [TS]

00:59:26   if you're not a designer you don't want [TS]

00:59:27   to hire a designer you can afford to [TS]

00:59:29   hire a designer you can use these [TS]

00:59:31   beautiful templates and then you can [TS]

00:59:32   customize them so you can make them look [TS]

00:59:34   exactly like you want to look so [TS]

00:59:36   Squarespace beautiful design simple yet [TS]

00:59:39   powerful twenty four seven support by a [TS]

00:59:42   chat and email and the price is eight [TS]

00:59:45   dollars a month if you buy a year up [TS]

00:59:48   front you get a free domain thrown in [TS]

00:59:50   and so you can get your own domain name [TS]

00:59:52   for free as part of by Squarespace for a [TS]

00:59:54   year [TS]

00:59:55   what a great deal so here's what you [TS]

00:59:57   need to do you can start a trial to [TS]

00:59:57   need to do you can start a trial to [TS]

01:00:00   a no credit card required just go signup [TS]

01:00:02   Squarespace and when you do sign up use [TS]

01:00:05   offer code smell and you'll get ten [TS]

01:00:07   percent off your first purchase at [TS]

01:00:09   Squarespace and show your support for [TS]

01:00:11   the uncomfortable that's promo code [TS]

01:00:13   smell at squarespace.com Squarespace [TS]

01:00:16   start here go anywhere you know you know [TS]

01:00:19   it's interesting that you bring up the [TS]

01:00:21   whole attractive women explain the [TS]

01:00:22   Kabbalah to you because I I feel a [TS]

01:00:24   little bit like that's what this was [TS]

01:00:26   ya know we've got this we've got this [TS]

01:00:28   worldview that that Alan Moore may or [TS]

01:00:31   may not actually hold but it certainly [TS]

01:00:33   seems like he does and i think he it [TS]

01:00:35   seems to me like it's almost [TS]

01:00:36   proselytizing he's trying to sort of [TS]

01:00:38   sneak it in via comic book for people [TS]

01:00:41   who might not otherwise be be here would [TS]

01:00:44   be associated with these kinds i don't [TS]

01:00:46   think he's sneaking yeah exactly it's [TS]

01:00:48   not something people's minds and this is [TS]

01:00:51   this is why I didn't like it because I [TS]

01:00:53   prefer the straightforward approach and [TS]

01:00:55   like i said i've already have already [TS]

01:00:57   been through this this this crash course [TS]

01:00:59   here like I know this is what will give [TS]

01:01:01   you it will give you a free ride from [TS]

01:01:03   the airport but along the way you're [TS]

01:01:06   going to have to hear about our [TS]

01:01:07   timeshare and episode or issue 12 is [TS]

01:01:10   sort of like the the lecture you have to [TS]

01:01:11   sit through to get the free thing for [TS]

01:01:13   the timeshare it's like okay I i know [TS]

01:01:15   you bought into this really interesting [TS]

01:01:17   story [TS]

01:01:17   ok let me tell you about my worldview [TS]

01:01:18   universe is created it looks like that [TS]

01:01:21   one issue in from Hell where he just [TS]

01:01:22   tore London and say here's all the [TS]

01:01:24   Masonic architecture you know what [TS]

01:01:27   Legion there's actually done every [TS]

01:01:28   camper meeting now that you mention it [TS]

01:01:30   that bugs me because it pops up a lot [TS]

01:01:32   and trades 2 and 3 which is Randy old [TS]

01:01:35   men will take young women in hand and [TS]

01:01:36   explain to them how the world works and [TS]

01:01:38   it's it's a little problem that fit her [TS]

01:01:41   where you're like okay she's supposed to [TS]

01:01:43   be in a living avatar imagination then [TS]

01:01:46   why does she need so much help from old [TS]

01:01:49   men who will lead her while they explain [TS]

01:01:51   how how the Tarot works like what was [TS]

01:01:53   going on with that what what what are [TS]

01:01:55   you working out buddy [TS]

01:01:57   it's you know it's aight i think it [TS]

01:02:01   feels kind of icky to me so and and that [TS]

01:02:03   just might be me being being [TS]

01:02:05   hypersensitive but I am I found it I [TS]

01:02:08   found it pretty striking that you have [TS]

01:02:09   like a few issues where it's like Hello [TS]

01:02:10   promethea here is Margaret explaining [TS]

01:02:12   things to you here's [TS]

01:02:13   I'll explain things to you here's you [TS]

01:02:15   know what Oh what's your name the the [TS]

01:02:17   one who goes crazy and book three clear [TS]

01:02:20   she's great here's grace being typically [TS]

01:02:22   Gracie and um and you have that years [TS]

01:02:26   ago this is great because they have this [TS]

01:02:27   community pool of knowledge and they [TS]

01:02:28   each have different specialties and then [TS]

01:02:30   it turns into and now it's time for you [TS]

01:02:32   to have sex with an odious old man [TS]

01:02:33   position oh yeah that was so creepy and [TS]

01:02:35   oh and oh yeah well my final statement [TS]

01:02:41   on this comic is yes it's creepy [TS]

01:02:44   yes it doesn't always work yes it's but [TS]

01:02:47   there are worse things to read than a [TS]

01:02:49   gorgeous comic book that's an ambitious [TS]

01:02:51   failure written by a genius [TS]

01:02:54   even if he is a complete lunatic that's [TS]

01:02:55   pretty fair i agree completely with that [TS]

01:02:57   Monty I i agree i am glad to have read [TS]

01:03:00   it i will read it to the end and it is [TS]

01:03:04   bizarre and its kind of brilliantly [TS]

01:03:07   bazaar in that way like I would never [TS]

01:03:09   put this it as a favorite comic of mine [TS]

01:03:11   ever but um I i have fascinated by it [TS]

01:03:15   yeah exactly I'm actually okay with the [TS]

01:03:18   the sex with the creepy old man part I [TS]

01:03:20   appreciated that simply because i really [TS]

01:03:23   liked the idea that at least in this [TS]

01:03:25   case that sex is going beyond the [TS]

01:03:28   physical representation of a person now [TS]

01:03:31   maybe it would have been nicer if it was [TS]

01:03:33   a young hot guy in and then old wrinkly [TS]

01:03:36   lady or something like that but to me [TS]

01:03:38   the part that stood out and was [TS]

01:03:39   important was the fact that that we are [TS]

01:03:42   not what we look like there's there's [TS]

01:03:43   more to us on the inside so I like that [TS]

01:03:45   okay it just I don't know I mean some of [TS]

01:03:48   the imagery is soaked just like super [TS]

01:03:49   creepy because I because I appreciate [TS]

01:03:52   that i do I didn't I was so glad he [TS]

01:03:54   didn't put on a glamour i like that they [TS]

01:03:56   they put that off in our face because [TS]

01:03:58   it's really all that's just nonsense [TS]

01:03:59   anyway it's just everything's in the end [TS]

01:04:03   it's still a transaction but anyway yeah [TS]

01:04:04   probably [TS]

01:04:05   although you know that wasn't a wrinkly [TS]

01:04:07   old lady in a really hot young man sex [TS]

01:04:09   right exact that's another comic that is [TS]

01:04:11   not has not adopted [TS]

01:04:13   well I don't know why almost ready those [TS]

01:04:15   comics i just want to emphasize how [TS]

01:04:20   awesome the art is by JH williams there [TS]

01:04:23   it in beautiful are the great color [TS]

01:04:25   great letter layout you have the layout [TS]

01:04:29   so much attention is given to the page [TS]

01:04:30   layout [TS]

01:04:31   oh my god and the varying styles that [TS]

01:04:34   mean this guy this guy has no house [TS]

01:04:37   style.the the digital photography and [TS]

01:04:40   some spot oh yeah there's others i [TS]

01:04:42   didn't even mention there's a few many [TS]

01:04:44   issue basic land and it just works and [TS]

01:04:46   it works for you know I and i love how [TS]

01:04:49   the different formations have very [TS]

01:04:51   distinct body types as opposed to it's [TS]

01:04:53   just five women who are you know typical [TS]

01:04:55   comic babysits and we're not getting [TS]

01:04:57   Todd client is a great letter and he [TS]

01:04:59   does great work in this just fantastic [TS]

01:05:01   lettering top clients unspoken hero [TS]

01:05:03   because it's such a text heavy comic [TS]

01:05:05   that if you didn't have all of the [TS]

01:05:08   subtle differences it would be very [TS]

01:05:09   difficult figure out who's who on his [TS]

01:05:11   lettering was one of the reasons i was [TS]

01:05:13   able to get as far into the book and so [TS]

01:05:15   I would yeah that's good yeah he's the [TS]

01:05:17   guy who lettered Sandman and then the [TS]

01:05:20   fact that I recognized his lettering [TS]

01:05:22   stone and looks so familiar helped me [TS]

01:05:25   get past the okay this isn't just a [TS]

01:05:27   superhero comic there's some weird stuff [TS]

01:05:29   going on here [TS]

01:05:30   don't think don't think Fantastic Four [TS]

01:05:33   think sandman you'll get through this [TS]

01:05:35   you'll be okay Todd clients blog had [TS]

01:05:38   recently like an 808 chapter incredibly [TS]

01:05:43   detailed essay on the evolution of [TS]

01:05:45   computerized lettering and comic books [TS]

01:05:47   and how the good letterers now have [TS]

01:05:50   their own fonts with 12 different [TS]

01:05:52   exclamation points because they have to [TS]

01:05:54   adjust the spacing manually all the time [TS]

01:05:57   uh-huh fascinating to me I want to thank [TS]

01:06:00   everybody for sticking out and slogging [TS]

01:06:01   through this book and engaging with it [TS]

01:06:03   is rigorously as you did as opposed to [TS]

01:06:05   making this podcast an hour of know Lisa [TS]

01:06:09   Hayes know who about fascinating [TS]

01:06:13   fascinating to read some of this and and [TS]

01:06:16   yeah and so I I in some ways i would say [TS]

01:06:19   this is the kind of thing that many of [TS]

01:06:21   us wouldn't have read if it weren't [TS]

01:06:22   assigned to us whether it's in a [TS]

01:06:24   classroom for a podcast so thank you for [TS]

01:06:26   the assignment because i think it was i [TS]

01:06:28   was fascinated 22 to dig into it i never [TS]

01:06:31   would have otherwise I think thanks mrs. [TS]

01:06:34   memorized [TS]

01:06:35   oh yeah and our essays are due next [TS]

01:06:39   tuesday eight pages double-spaced have [TS]

01:06:42   him in Lisa's box by 5pm and but you get [TS]

01:06:47   an F unless you write it in multiple [TS]

01:06:49   colors and upside down to expect to be [TS]

01:06:52   able to read it right to left and left [TS]

01:06:55   to right [TS]

01:06:56   oh no my essays in the form of a mobius [TS]

01:06:59   strip is that going to be an awesome big [TS]

01:07:01   help [TS]

01:07:01   no it's create different boxes start [TS]

01:07:04   reciting but i'm writing to sa is one on [TS]

01:07:07   the top half of each page 1 of the [TS]

01:07:08   bottom half of each page and the [TS]

01:07:09   counterpoint each other so enjoy that I [TS]

01:07:12   turned my essay into an anagram it's [TS]

01:07:14   your job to unscramble yeah before so [TS]

01:07:20   before we go I wanted to I want to go [TS]

01:07:22   around just in case somebody has been [TS]

01:07:24   has been reading some other kind of [TS]

01:07:26   comic book related thing that they would [TS]

01:07:28   like to mention i like it's sort of like [TS]

01:07:30   our book clubs what are we reading i [TS]

01:07:31   don't know if you guys have prepared [TS]

01:07:33   anything [TS]

01:07:33   Oh or but but you know if you if you [TS]

01:07:36   aren't don't feel bad if you are then [TS]

01:07:39   then share with us Lisa something that [TS]

01:07:42   you've been reading that you would like [TS]

01:07:43   to share with the group [TS]

01:07:44   I'm eye-to-eye like i said i have been [TS]

01:07:46   going back through and rereading the [TS]

01:07:47   mike grell run on green arrow but he did [TS]

01:07:50   back in the late eighties uh if you like [TS]

01:07:54   if you liked this show arrow I think you [TS]

01:07:55   should read this because the whole point [TS]

01:07:57   of the grip my grill run was they drop [TS]

01:07:59   the key and black Canary drop the code [TS]

01:08:01   names they have no superpowers [TS]

01:08:02   whatsoever [TS]

01:08:03   they're basically vigilantes living and [TS]

01:08:05   working out of seattle and the artist so [TS]

01:08:08   ladies and it's so much fun and I have [TS]

01:08:11   been working my way through pox romana [TS]

01:08:13   which is what would happen if the [TS]

01:08:16   Catholic Church one time traveling to [TS]

01:08:17   try two inch ensure a permanent [TS]

01:08:19   religious One World Order and it's a [TS]

01:08:22   great idea and there's a lot of great [TS]

01:08:23   things in the execution the typeface is [TS]

01:08:26   driving me crazy so that's its but [TS]

01:08:28   that's been slow going and for fun i [TS]

01:08:31   also read Kelly sue deconnick some first [TS]

01:08:33   trade for Captain Marvel which i loved [TS]

01:08:36   it was so much fun [TS]

01:08:38   it's so funny i can't wait for that [TS]

01:08:40   movie to come out and we talked about on [TS]

01:08:43   our walk today yeah we had to explain [TS]

01:08:45   the difference between ms marvel and [TS]

01:08:47   after Marvel no ya didn't explain that [TS]

01:08:50   to people and they forget immediately [TS]

01:08:52   and then Rogan monkey bridge you don't [TS]

01:08:54   even be just anyway [TS]

01:08:55   ya know the captain marvel but to be [TS]

01:08:57   honest the captain marvel book reads [TS]

01:08:58   like the guardians of the galaxy felt [TS]

01:09:00   when I was watching the movie this [TS]

01:09:01   summer it's it's it's that funny and has [TS]

01:09:03   that that vein of soul running through [TS]

01:09:05   it and i highly recommend it to anybody [TS]

01:09:07   who was just looking for a romp and for [TS]

01:09:10   anybody who's watching the series arrow [TS]

01:09:11   and wants to nerd out a little bit more [TS]

01:09:13   read the ground stuff or or if anybody [TS]

01:09:15   was like my that shot looks like an [TS]

01:09:16   eagle painting come to life like read [TS]

01:09:18   the girl stuff that's a lot of fun [TS]

01:09:20   tony i have been reading a bunch of [TS]

01:09:23   stuff scalped and help laser and things [TS]

01:09:27   like that but the new series that i [TS]

01:09:28   recently discovered that i'm really [TS]

01:09:30   enjoying and I feel like pretty rarely [TS]

01:09:33   pick up new series and just you know [TS]

01:09:34   slaving away on one's i've been reading [TS]

01:09:35   forever but the wicked and the define [TS]

01:09:38   have you guys heard about that or anyone [TS]

01:09:39   else reading that i have it on my [TS]

01:09:40   wishlist on amazon so what I was really [TS]

01:09:43   impressive the weekend the divine the [TS]

01:09:45   premise is that there are there's a [TS]

01:09:48   pantheon of gods who show up every 90 [TS]

01:09:51   years or so and i have godlike powers [TS]

01:09:54   but are fated to die within limits two [TS]

01:09:56   years and so basically kind of live as [TS]

01:09:58   rock stars for those two years and [TS]

01:09:59   complicated things happen to them and it [TS]

01:10:03   was highly recommended to me by somebody [TS]

01:10:05   who only ever recommends good things and [TS]

01:10:07   I read the premise was like having i [TS]

01:10:08   read that vertigo comics like four times [TS]

01:10:10   already but and then I got it and I was [TS]

01:10:12   I was kind of blown away so i strongly [TS]

01:10:15   recommend it is already too and then [TS]

01:10:17   we'll find out which of us is right [TS]

01:10:19   also i love scalp so yes a plus+ for [TS]

01:10:22   reading that this was my favorite series [TS]

01:10:24   the last 10 years [TS]

01:10:25   all right Monty anything you're reading [TS]

01:10:27   you want to plug here i think the last [TS]

01:10:29   live comic book I read was death of [TS]

01:10:31   wolverine number three and you can tell [TS]

01:10:34   already that I was by the fact i haven't [TS]

01:10:35   gotten to the number four we actually [TS]

01:10:37   dies he dies he is he okay now [TS]

01:10:39   no he's still day is good yeah he's got [TS]

01:10:43   a good year or so of death coming [TS]

01:10:45   people still buy comic books after will [TS]

01:10:46   realize i just i dunno we don't know yet [TS]

01:10:49   Marvel farm after worry doc yes who's [TS]

01:10:51   who's in all the comic books that [TS]

01:10:53   spider-man and deadpool mostly know [TS]

01:10:55   there's a new Marvel comic that's like [TS]

01:10:57   death of wolverine after [TS]

01:10:59   so they just keep playing it out now [TS]

01:11:01   that's so that's just people undergoing [TS]

01:11:02   we're going to know that Wolverines not [TS]

01:11:04   yeah i remember Wolverine have over it [TS]

01:11:06   was great [TS]

01:11:07   flashbacks when he was alive Wolverine [TS]

01:11:09   yeah I have really enjoyed the adventure [TS]

01:11:12   time comic book written by Ryan North [TS]

01:11:15   who does the daily dinosaur comics on [TS]

01:11:17   the web [TS]

01:11:18   although he's not going to be writing it [TS]

01:11:20   anymore so i'm not sure where that's [TS]

01:11:21   going and I've been trying to get into [TS]

01:11:24   Doom Patrol nonsense but I you know your [TS]

01:11:28   butt first trade paperback have not said [TS]

01:11:30   so I'm hitting the second one already in [TS]

01:11:33   the grant morrison to control [TS]

01:11:34   yeah yeah oh yeah oh yeah chip anything [TS]

01:11:39   any other than for media any comics [TS]

01:11:42   you've been reading lately and liking um [TS]

01:11:44   I have been taking advantage of some of [TS]

01:11:46   the holiday sales that comiXology was [TS]

01:11:48   doing and I i have discovered mark [TS]

01:11:52   waid's daredevil oh yeah that's good [TS]

01:11:55   that's really that's really good that's [TS]

01:11:58   really good and I i am not terribly [TS]

01:12:01   interested in wolverine the character so [TS]

01:12:03   i have not been reading the death of [TS]

01:12:06   Wolverine but the stuff that paul [TS]

01:12:07   cornell wrote leading up to that right [TS]

01:12:10   the two years of did like any for issues [TS]

01:12:13   I think of wolverine volume [TS]

01:12:14   yes five and six or whatever it is [TS]

01:12:16   fantastic and me made me care about the [TS]

01:12:20   character only only and only in that [TS]

01:12:23   writers hands not enough to follow it [TS]

01:12:25   with a to a different writer but I i [TS]

01:12:29   highly recommend it and it stands on its [TS]

01:12:32   own without any of the event stuff that [TS]

01:12:34   follows nice Erica you read many comics [TS]

01:12:38   I don't actually know this about you or [TS]

01:12:40   was promethea big one for you lately but [TS]

01:12:43   it was lately i had my comics phase that [TS]

01:12:45   will actually haven't read a whole lot [TS]

01:12:47   of anything in the past few years but i [TS]

01:12:49   have done a little bit of rereading [TS]

01:12:50   every read a few my old help lasers [TS]

01:12:52   recently but actually I we just [TS]

01:12:55   rearranged our podcast studio / lego [TS]

01:12:58   room where some of my comic books also [TS]

01:13:00   resided and i ran across a few that [TS]

01:13:03   haven't started reading yet but it'sit's [TS]

01:13:05   next up on my list to do [TS]

01:13:07   it's a very very short truncated series [TS]

01:13:09   called rapid as EDD which [TS]

01:13:12   sadly crushingly was only three issues [TS]

01:13:14   long because it was published by [TS]

01:13:16   cross-gen and then they went out of [TS]

01:13:17   business and it was it was kind of aimed [TS]

01:13:20   aimed at children and it was a story of [TS]

01:13:22   a magical land that a young sort of [TS]

01:13:25   grumpy teenage girl had had read these [TS]

01:13:27   books very wizard of oz like but then of [TS]

01:13:30   course she discovers that it's actually [TS]

01:13:32   a real place and she has to go there and [TS]

01:13:34   rescuing her little brother and it is it [TS]

01:13:36   a fantastically realized false the world [TS]

01:13:40   and it really cute characters and it was [TS]

01:13:44   just a I'm a sucker for anything that's [TS]

01:13:46   remotely like The Wizard of Oz so you [TS]

01:13:49   know labyrinth is made one of my [TS]

01:13:50   favorite movies this this is right up my [TS]

01:13:52   alley and was really well done and I was [TS]

01:13:54   just so heartbroken when it gotta oh we [TS]

01:13:57   got cut short so I that I just brought [TS]

01:14:00   up the wikipedia page and apparently [TS]

01:14:01   they made some disney bought the rights [TS]

01:14:03   and they made some children's books out [TS]

01:14:04   of it so i may have to pick those up [TS]

01:14:06   just to see where the story goes but [TS]

01:14:07   yeah so i will be reading a peasant and [TS]

01:14:10   I recommend it for anybody who is into [TS]

01:14:12   that sort of thing but be ready to have [TS]

01:14:14   your heart broken because it doesn't [TS]

01:14:15   keep going right and I guess that leaves [TS]

01:14:18   me i wanted to mention a couple of [TS]

01:14:20   things I've been reading old x-men [TS]

01:14:23   issues in Marvel unlimited which is [TS]

01:14:26   fascinating because my memory of x-men [TS]

01:14:28   series actually have been reading the [TS]

01:14:29   x-men after from when I stopped reading [TS]

01:14:32   the x-men in the mid-eighties and now [TS]

01:14:35   you remember why you stopped i am [TS]

01:14:37   reminded of that but I I'm also [TS]

01:14:39   fascinated by the fact that now i have [TS]

01:14:41   200 issues or whatever just sitting [TS]

01:14:43   there that I could just flip through [TS]

01:14:44   with no charge i am reminded that my [TS]

01:14:47   childhood crush on Kitty Pryde would not [TS]

01:14:49   have survived and I kept reading for [TS]

01:14:51   another two years because they do [TS]

01:14:54   something horribly eighties things to [TS]

01:14:56   her [TS]

01:14:56   any idea where you would not be nearly [TS]

01:14:58   as 1/2 go on a little longer but instead [TS]

01:15:02   she was frozen in 1983 or whatever when [TS]

01:15:04   they they didn't put her in the fishnets [TS]

01:15:07   so that was ok she was adorable 19 yeah [TS]

01:15:10   she really was so anyway I'm fascinated [TS]

01:15:11   by that i'm also reminded that one of [TS]

01:15:13   the problems and maybe I'm hoping we [TS]

01:15:15   actually will do this in an episode 1 [TS]

01:15:17   the problems I have with the x-men one [TS]

01:15:18   of the things that I think makes it hard [TS]

01:15:20   to talk about them is that it is in the [TS]

01:15:22   chris claremont era they really what it [TS]

01:15:24   was like a soap opera and so it's [TS]

01:15:25   actually very hard [TS]

01:15:26   to hold onto the storylines there are [TS]

01:15:28   these storylines you can point to but [TS]

01:15:29   when you actually go back to the issues [TS]

01:15:31   you realize they're all mixed up and [TS]

01:15:33   thread it in with all this other stuff [TS]

01:15:34   and it's actually very hard to get ahold [TS]

01:15:36   on something and say this is an x-men [TS]

01:15:38   story because it all ends up played [TS]

01:15:41   across you know the x-men and the new [TS]

01:15:43   mutants and this miniseries in that mini [TS]

01:15:46   series and they're all kind of [TS]

01:15:47   interleaved with other storylines that [TS]

01:15:49   are also happening and becomes very hard [TS]

01:15:51   and falls apart when you love that it's [TS]

01:15:54   just marvel comics in general at the [TS]

01:15:56   time yeah like this is a really good [TS]

01:15:58   story [TS]

01:15:58   Thor turns into a frog ok the beyonders [TS]

01:16:02   also in this issue yeah like I just went [TS]

01:16:04   through secret war sincere words too and [TS]

01:16:05   the x-men like man this is rough stuff [TS]

01:16:08   this is like like literally there's like [TS]

01:16:09   oh and now we're at Central Park and [TS]

01:16:11   we're gonna go through this gateway and [TS]

01:16:13   then the next issue well we're back from [TS]

01:16:14   The Secret Wars like a man i remember [TS]

01:16:16   that that was not good and yet that's [TS]

01:16:18   where like spider-man is cool black out [TS]

01:16:21   costumes from so [TS]

01:16:23   oh yeah but it's just fascinating like I [TS]

01:16:25   want to talk about like the brood war at [TS]

01:16:27   issues of x-men and they're great but [TS]

01:16:29   when you try to pick out exactly what [TS]

01:16:30   they are you kinda can't because they're [TS]

01:16:33   all intertwined with all this other [TS]

01:16:34   stuff anyway it's been fascinating [TS]

01:16:36   I'm feature requests from Marvel [TS]

01:16:39   unlimited i really love them to have [TS]

01:16:40   some sort of chronological reading list [TS]

01:16:42   for some of this stuff because I would [TS]

01:16:43   really like to be able to read an x-men [TS]

01:16:46   issue and then just go to the New [TS]

01:16:47   Mutants issue and then go back to the [TS]

01:16:48   x-men issue because instead I have to [TS]

01:16:50   kind of do that myself but anyway that's [TS]

01:16:52   been fascinating [TS]

01:16:53   it's it's like I've returned the bag [TS]

01:16:57   went back in time to where I abandoned [TS]

01:16:59   all those comics and now picking them up [TS]

01:17:01   that's fascinating I wanted to also [TS]

01:17:04   mention that i'm reading the spider [TS]

01:17:06   verse story an amazing spider-man I I [TS]

01:17:08   mention this because it's an as a an [TS]

01:17:10   event it's okay cuz it's pretty [TS]

01:17:12   self-contained their spin-off issues but [TS]

01:17:14   the main story is in amazing spider-man [TS]

01:17:16   the thing that I really like is that [TS]

01:17:17   it's integrated l you know not only some [TS]

01:17:19   new alternate universe spider-man [TS]

01:17:22   characters but also every spider-man [TS]

01:17:25   character from every medium ever and [TS]

01:17:28   there is a particular scene in I [TS]

01:17:30   think'll one of the issues from last [TS]

01:17:32   month where the actual cartoon [TS]

01:17:35   characters from spider-man and his [TS]

01:17:37   amazing friends [TS]

01:17:38   spider-man [TS]

01:17:39   Firestar and Iceman in there cool new [TS]

01:17:42   york apartment pad / superhero team [TS]

01:17:44   headquarters are brutally murdered and I [TS]

01:17:49   i can hardly lion I can't believe they [TS]

01:17:51   did it but they did it and it is kind of [TS]

01:17:54   hilarious also there's there's a scene [TS]

01:17:56   where they wear it where they go to the [TS]

01:17:58   they go to the date Daily Bugle of jonah [TS]

01:18:01   Jameson from the 1967 animated [TS]

01:18:03   spider-man series which is pretty [TS]

01:18:05   amazing so it blew my mind as a longtime [TS]

01:18:07   spider-man fan to see all that stuff in [TS]

01:18:09   spite of verse i believe that they [TS]

01:18:11   recently dropped in the nineteen [TS]

01:18:13   seventies Japanese spider-man with the [TS]

01:18:16   giant robot the giant robot yeah he [TS]

01:18:17   factors into its it's kind of amazing [TS]

01:18:19   and it is a love letter to all the [TS]

01:18:21   variants of spider-man over the years [TS]

01:18:22   and I want to throw out there's a new [TS]

01:18:24   Star Wars comic that's coming that's [TS]

01:18:25   apparently going to be like the biggest [TS]

01:18:27   selling comic in the last 20 years [TS]

01:18:29   I'm excited about that because i want to [TS]

01:18:31   see if they will also reveal how Darth [TS]

01:18:33   Vader drinks coffee using the Force to [TS]

01:18:35   be original [TS]

01:18:36   I'm excited about that because [TS]

01:18:37   humblebundle just sold a whole bunch of [TS]

01:18:39   old Star Wars comments so i can really [TS]

01:18:42   get into that when i get around to [TS]

01:18:43   classic old Star Wars comics anyway [TS]

01:18:46   all right I think we've reached the end [TS]

01:18:48   yeah comics [TS]

01:18:49   whoa Eleanor eae thank you thank you for [TS]

01:18:53   your service alan moore you make us feel [TS]

01:18:55   smart and adore stupid sometimes [TS]

01:19:00   simultaneously em the bottom part I felt [TS]

01:19:03   really smart and the top part I felt [TS]

01:19:05   really dumb [TS]

01:19:06   it's all happening at once on a page [TS]

01:19:08   with letters and color all creepy in the [TS]

01:19:10   middle [TS]

01:19:11   oh yeah that's the album or sandwich [TS]

01:19:13   right there right at you people don't [TS]

01:19:17   use well yeah Muno alright i'd like to [TS]

01:19:20   thank my gas for being here this was [TS]

01:19:22   amusing fun good conversations always [TS]

01:19:25   and yeah you should you should check out [TS]

01:19:27   if you haven't check out promethea and [TS]

01:19:28   you your mind will be blown [TS]

01:19:30   we are not responsible for that if your [TS]

01:19:33   mind is blown [TS]

01:19:34   you're going to take care of that [TS]

01:19:35   yourself Tony similar thank you for [TS]

01:19:37   being here [TS]

01:19:38   comics they're not just for kids don't [TS]

01:19:40   let your kids read this letter [TS]

01:19:41   yeah don't know my kids don't read these [TS]

01:19:44   comics Erica inside thank you thank you [TS]

01:19:48   this this may have sort of rekindled my [TS]

01:19:50   my comics reading [TS]

01:19:52   yeah this might be a comics Renaissance [TS]

01:19:54   for me to read other areas done better [TS]

01:19:56   comics Monty actually thank you i [TS]

01:19:59   actually remembered Prometheus being [TS]

01:20:01   crazier than this 10 knots to me at the [TS]

01:20:05   time now it's just you know mostly 15 [TS]

01:20:07   years later it's just kind of crazy not [TS]

01:20:10   totally nuts [TS]

01:20:11   yeah yeah chips under thank you again [TS]

01:20:13   for being on an episode that had nothing [TS]

01:20:15   to do with Doctor Who Babylon 5 so good [TS]

01:20:17   job thank you good to have you you're [TS]

01:20:20   spreading out you're branching out [TS]

01:20:21   I'm growing yeah i'm growing like a oh [TS]

01:20:24   no no no no capital of redmond oh no and [TS]

01:20:28   Lisa Schmeisser you did this I did this [TS]

01:20:34   to you although hatch will hatch a plot [TS]

01:20:36   for the next comic book club and what [TS]

01:20:38   we're going to read for that I don't [TS]

01:20:40   look forward to [TS]

01:20:41   ya know that the woman comic lot now [TS]

01:20:43   that we're at the very end point comma [TS]

01:20:44   club is we would like to find things [TS]

01:20:46   that are relatively readily available [TS]

01:20:49   don't require a lot of reading around [TS]

01:20:50   the edges you should be able to read a [TS]

01:20:52   trade or two and get something out of it [TS]

01:20:55   which I really believe comics that's [TS]

01:20:56   sort of what i was getting at when i was [TS]

01:20:57   talking about the x-men is you know you [TS]

01:21:00   should really have to read like a [TS]

01:21:01   hundred comics order to appreciate the [TS]

01:21:03   these four issues either should be you [TS]

01:21:06   know some stuff that's more accessible [TS]

01:21:08   that people can pick up a couple of [TS]

01:21:10   it's getting late we can talk about [TS]

01:21:12   something that's the plan 2015 to do [TS]

01:21:15   some more that the competition well [TS]

01:21:18   thanks to everybody out there for [TS]

01:21:19   sticking with us [TS]

01:21:20   I from the comic little time and we will [TS]

01:21:23   see with another episode be comfortable [TS]

01:21:35   did anyone read that text page that's [TS]

01:21:42   right at the beginning of promethea yes [TS]

01:21:44   Wow congratulations you win at the [TS]

01:21:48   bottom it tells you you don't have to [TS]

01:21:50   read any of the issues and you can just [TS]

01:21:52   go on the podcast so if you read to that [TS]

01:21:54   point [TS]

01:21:55   PS she's a sex goddess okay goodnight [TS]

01:21:57   everybody loved Alan door [TS]