Connected

00:00:00 ◼   ► From Relay, this is Connected, episode 612. Today's show is brought to you by Squarespace and Connected Pro. I'm your keynote chairman, Federico Vittici, and it's my pleasure to be joined once again by the annual chairman, Stephen Hackett. Hello, Stephen.

00:00:21 ◼   ► We are the chairman buddies up here at the top of the show.

00:00:26 ◼   ► We are.

00:00:27 ◼   ► Feels good.

00:00:27 ◼   ► Yeah, it does.

00:00:29 ◼   ► But we are men of the people, so we have a the people with us.

00:00:33 ◼   ► A member of the people.

00:00:34 ◼   ► A member of the people, Mike Hurley.

00:00:35 ◼   ► The son of a blacksmith.

00:00:37 ◼   ► The son of a Hurley.

00:00:39 ◼   ► Son of a blacksmith.

00:00:40 ◼   ► If you want to understand what that reference means, go getconnectedpro.co.

00:00:45 ◼   ► Stephen has an offer for you later on in the episode.

00:00:47 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:00:48 ◼   ► Yeah, go get it.

00:00:49 ◼   ► Hello, boys.

00:00:51 ◼   ► Hello.

00:00:51 ◼   ► Hello.

00:00:52 ◼   ► We are together for one week, and then...

00:00:57 ◼   ► And then we're not.

00:00:58 ◼   ► Then we're not again.

00:00:59 ◼   ► And then we're not again.

00:01:00 ◼   ► It's the summer, baby.

00:01:01 ◼   ► Summer.

00:01:02 ◼   ► Summer.

00:01:02 ◼   ► Yes.

00:01:03 ◼   ► Some shows are like, oh, we'll just record on a Sunday and release on a next Thursday or

00:01:08 ◼   ► whatever.

00:01:09 ◼   ► But no, we're just like, we're taking it off, baby.

00:01:12 ◼   ► That's right.

00:01:12 ◼   ► Catch up with us later.

00:01:13 ◼   ► The summer of fun schedules.

00:01:16 ◼   ► Indeed.

00:01:17 ◼   ► Indeed.

00:01:18 ◼   ► We have some follow-up.

00:01:19 ◼   ► That's how we start the show.

00:01:21 ◼   ► Huge news.

00:01:22 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:01:23 ◼   ► The Mario Crocs that we raided several weeks ago are now available for purchase.

00:01:28 ◼   ► So, Federico, you wanted to buy them, didn't you?

00:01:31 ◼   ► Let's see.

00:01:32 ◼   ► So hopefully you can go get them.

00:01:34 ◼   ► Crocs Italy.

00:01:34 ◼   ► I can, in fact.

00:01:36 ◼   ► All right.

00:01:37 ◼   ► Well, there you go.

00:01:37 ◼   ► There you go.

00:01:38 ◼   ► Make it happen.

00:01:38 ◼   ► Make a purchase.

00:01:39 ◼   ► Which one?

00:01:41 ◼   ► The Mario hat.

00:01:41 ◼   ► That's what we decided y'all liked the best and I liked, I think, the least.

00:01:46 ◼   ► But, yeah.

00:01:47 ◼   ► Go for it.

00:01:48 ◼   ► Okay.

00:01:48 ◼   ► Purchase is 75 euros.

00:01:50 ◼   ► Easy.

00:01:51 ◼   ► Oh, congrats.

00:01:52 ◼   ► Free shipping.

00:01:52 ◼   ► Thank you.

00:01:53 ◼   ► Thank you, Crocs.

00:01:54 ◼   ► Don't mind if I do, you know?

00:01:56 ◼   ► Oh, I can purchase additional gibbets.

00:01:58 ◼   ► No, I just want the Mario one.

00:01:59 ◼   ► Get some gibbets.

00:02:00 ◼   ► Come on.

00:02:01 ◼   ► No, they're not Mario related.

00:02:02 ◼   ► They're totally unrelated.

00:02:03 ◼   ► They have Mario gibbets, though.

00:02:05 ◼   ► No, but they're not suggested in the...

00:02:08 ◼   ► Oh, you'll only buy what's suggested to you.

00:02:11 ◼   ► Yeah, he's algorithm-pilled.

00:02:13 ◼   ► I have full trust in the algorithm, maybe.

00:02:15 ◼   ► If they don't serve it to me, I don't want it.

00:02:18 ◼   ► Do you have an account?

00:02:20 ◼   ► I just want to log in with Google.

00:02:21 ◼   ► More algorithm.

00:02:22 ◼   ► Crocs ID.

00:02:22 ◼   ► Get a Crocs ID, man.

00:02:23 ◼   ► Crocs ID.

00:02:24 ◼   ► I don't know that it's called that, but they should call it that.

00:02:26 ◼   ► You put your toe on the button on your keyboard.

00:02:29 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:02:30 ◼   ► Y'all remember when Touch ID came out and people were seeing what kind of body parts it would

00:02:35 ◼   ► read?

00:02:35 ◼   ► No.

00:02:36 ◼   ► No, I don't remember that, Stephen.

00:02:38 ◼   ► Stephen?

00:02:38 ◼   ► Did you do that?

00:02:40 ◼   ► No.

00:02:40 ◼   ► No.

00:02:41 ◼   ► Are you going to do it again with the iPhone Fold?

00:02:45 ◼   ► I am.

00:02:45 ◼   ► How's ID?

00:02:46 ◼   ► Did I tell you I had to buy a new keyboard?

00:02:48 ◼   ► I did.

00:02:49 ◼   ► No?

00:02:50 ◼   ► What'd you buy?

00:02:51 ◼   ► Just the same thing that I had, the Magic Keyboard with Touch ID.

00:02:54 ◼   ► Did you guys ever get that keyboard that I made you buy?

00:02:57 ◼   ► No.

00:02:57 ◼   ► No, we were scammed.

00:02:58 ◼   ► No, we never got it.

00:02:59 ◼   ► Scammed.

00:03:00 ◼   ► Didn't they go bankrupt or something?

00:03:02 ◼   ► They did.

00:03:02 ◼   ► It's hard to tell, man.

00:03:03 ◼   ► Yeah, they're gone.

00:03:04 ◼   ► It's hard to know.

00:03:05 ◼   ► Yeah, that money is just gone.

00:03:06 ◼   ► No, I bought a Touch ID Magic Keyboard when they became available, I guess, with the first

00:03:11 ◼   ► Apple Silicon machines.

00:03:12 ◼   ► And it died.

00:03:14 ◼   ► I just came up to work one day and it wasn't responding.

00:03:18 ◼   ► I was like, oh, maybe it died overnight because the battery life has gotten pretty bad on it.

00:03:22 ◼   ► And so I plugged it in as like nothing, just nothing at all and totally dead.

00:03:27 ◼   ► And so anyways, I got a new one.

00:03:28 ◼   ► And it's weird.

00:03:29 ◼   ► I can read all the keys on this one.

00:03:31 ◼   ► The other one, a bunch of the keys have worn off.

00:03:34 ◼   ► I'm such a writer.

00:03:35 ◼   ► Do you not consider like trying to get one of the color ones from eBay or something?

00:03:40 ◼   ► I did, but I needed a keyboard.

00:03:42 ◼   ► Ah, okay.

00:03:44 ◼   ► Actually, I have a set.

00:03:45 ◼   ► I have a blue keyboard and trackpad that a listener offered me a while back.

00:03:50 ◼   ► And it is the keyboard and trackpad paired.

00:03:54 ◼   ► Well, it was paired to the Mac Mini under the TV, but that Mac Mini isn't under the TV anymore.

00:03:59 ◼   ► I should find that keyboard and trackpad and use it.

00:04:01 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:04:02 ◼   ► Okay.

00:04:03 ◼   ► But then I'm on my to-do list.

00:04:04 ◼   ► What keyboard do you use?

00:04:06 ◼   ► Me?

00:04:07 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:04:08 ◼   ► Is it the little one or the big one?

00:04:09 ◼   ► The little one.

00:04:10 ◼   ► Little one?

00:04:10 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:04:11 ◼   ► Get the orange one.

00:04:11 ◼   ► I could use a numpad sometimes, you know, in my life as a spreadsheet jockey.

00:04:20 ◼   ► But it puts the mouse too far right to be comfortable for me and my fragile hands and wrists.

00:04:28 ◼   ► And so it's magic trackpad on the left, magic keyboard Touch ID in the center, and then the Logitech, the MX Master 4 on the right.

00:04:40 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:04:41 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:04:42 ◼   ► Which is a very good mouse.

00:04:43 ◼   ► Very good mouse.

00:04:43 ◼   ► I finalized the purchase, by the way.

00:04:45 ◼   ► Oh, congrats.

00:04:46 ◼   ► Good.

00:04:46 ◼   ► I can't wait to see the pictures of your feet.

00:04:48 ◼   ► Yes.

00:04:50 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:04:50 ◼   ► You will have to pay a price like everybody else, obviously.

00:04:53 ◼   ► Club Mac stories.

00:04:55 ◼   ► That's special.

00:05:00 ◼   ► We also recently spoke about the vapor chamber in the iPhone 17 Pro and how we felt like that's been a good move.

00:05:07 ◼   ► And according to reports, Apple is ramping that up for the foldable phone, which I just found interesting because the iPhone Air does not have the vapor chamber for a couple of reasons.

00:05:22 ◼   ► One, obviously, it's super thin, but most of the guts of their phone are up in the iconic plateau.

00:05:27 ◼   ► That one's not iconic.

00:05:29 ◼   ► That one's just new.

00:05:31 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:05:31 ◼   ► It's just, you know, it's the new plateau.

00:05:33 ◼   ► The new plateau.

00:05:34 ◼   ► Just this weekend, just on Sunday, I sat down and I don't like things in my pocket, so I put my phone on the table and someone was like, oh, is that a Pixel?

00:05:41 ◼   ► Oh, interesting.

00:05:44 ◼   ► I was like, no, it's the iPhone Air.

00:05:46 ◼   ► They're like, what's that?

00:05:47 ◼   ► Yeah, it's like no one's ever heard of it.

00:05:49 ◼   ► No one's ever heard of it.

00:05:50 ◼   ► Man, that's rough for Apple for someone to think it's a Pixel.

00:05:53 ◼   ► I know.

00:05:53 ◼   ► It's like a phone that also doesn't sell very well.

00:05:55 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:05:56 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:05:56 ◼   ► But, you know, I guess there's going to be room in the foldable for a vapor chamber, which I kind of assumed it would just be kind of built like the iPhone Air, but maybe internally it's going to be different.

00:06:10 ◼   ► I am very much looking forward to iFixit taking apart a foldable iPhone.

00:06:15 ◼   ► Like, I will.

00:06:16 ◼   ► I cannot wait.

00:06:17 ◼   ► Should we take a prediction on the iFixit repairability rating for the iPhone fold?

00:06:22 ◼   ► One.

00:06:23 ◼   ► Yeah, it's going to be low.

00:06:24 ◼   ► Oh, okay.

00:06:25 ◼   ► I would say, I mean, what is like the iPhone Air?

00:06:29 ◼   ► I think that there, I think you can't do it anymore to that level.

00:06:33 ◼   ► Seven.

00:06:34 ◼   ► Wow.

00:06:35 ◼   ► It's the provisional repairability rating of the iPhone Air.

00:06:39 ◼   ► Huh.

00:06:40 ◼   ► I'm going to say, I'm going to say it hits the seven.

00:06:42 ◼   ► I think, I don't think it would do worse than this.

00:06:44 ◼   ► I think it's just too difficult now, like legally to.

00:06:47 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:06:48 ◼   ► But I like, I like the passion of one Federico.

00:06:50 ◼   ► Something could go horrifically wrong with this product.

00:06:54 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

00:06:55 ◼   ► You know?

00:06:55 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:06:55 ◼   ► Maybe just no one can foresee yet.

00:06:58 ◼   ► I mean, do you remember when people were literally peeling the screen off, the first Samsung one?

00:07:02 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:07:03 ◼   ► I wonder what, I wonder if they're going to have a built-in screen protector.

00:07:06 ◼   ► I hope not.

00:07:07 ◼   ► All the Samsung phones still do.

00:07:10 ◼   ► All the foldable Samsung phones still do.

00:07:11 ◼   ► Because they're plastic, right?

00:07:12 ◼   ► Basically.

00:07:14 ◼   ► It's hard to say anymore, honestly.

00:07:15 ◼   ► Because like a lot of them say it's glass, but it's like, how could it be?

00:07:19 ◼   ► Anyway.

00:07:19 ◼   ► But they have screen protectors and they don't, you can always see the edges of them.

00:07:26 ◼   ► And I hate that.

00:07:27 ◼   ► I hate that so much.

00:07:28 ◼   ► That's why I don't use this.

00:07:30 ◼   ► I haven't used a screen protector in years.

00:07:31 ◼   ► Back in the day, I used to use matte ones.

00:07:34 ◼   ► And then like in the Retina era, like this was like the first couple of iPhones.

00:07:39 ◼   ► And then when Retina screens came out, it's like, oh, you can really tell that this sort

00:07:44 ◼   ► of degrades the quality a little bit.

00:07:47 ◼   ► And I haven't used one since, but I've got friends, like I know people who use the glass

00:07:51 ◼   ► ones.

00:07:52 ◼   ► In fact, a friend of mine has an iPhone Air, the only other person I know who uses one.

00:07:56 ◼   ► And they have a glass screen protector on theirs.

00:08:00 ◼   ► Like I don't.

00:08:01 ◼   ► I think they're really good.

00:08:02 ◼   ► And also like if you buy them at the Apple store, they have this like equipment that

00:08:07 ◼   ► will put it on for you.

00:08:08 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:08:09 ◼   ► I was like, uh, previously, um, not good brand D brand.

00:08:15 ◼   ► They, they ship theirs with like a mini one of those.

00:08:17 ◼   ► Like it seems like the application of screen protectors is much better now.

00:08:21 ◼   ► Um, I don't feel like I would ever need it, but I get it.

00:08:25 ◼   ► Right.

00:08:25 ◼   ► Like, and I think it makes a lot of sense now that they're those glass ones, cause you're

00:08:29 ◼   ► not really going to lose anything from the experience.

00:08:31 ◼   ► I feel like.

00:08:31 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:08:32 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:08:33 ◼   ► Definitely better than like the, the, the plasticky ones that you put on yourself and then

00:08:37 ◼   ► like there's a hair under it, you know, it's like, ah, yeah.

00:08:39 ◼   ► Um, yeah, I, uh, well, when I bought, I bought some kid to phone, I've bought a lot of phones

00:08:47 ◼   ► this year for, for a lot of kids.

00:08:49 ◼   ► And like, they offer it in the store.

00:08:50 ◼   ► Like when you buy a phone, like, Oh, Hey, do you want, you want us to do a, throw a screen

00:08:53 ◼   ► protector on there for you?

00:08:54 ◼   ► It's just part of their, their sales pitch.

00:08:56 ◼   ► Which is a funny thing, isn't it?

00:08:58 ◼   ► Right.

00:08:58 ◼   ► It's a third party product.

00:09:00 ◼   ► No, but also it's like, here's this phone we made for you.

00:09:03 ◼   ► Would you like to protect the screen?

00:09:06 ◼   ► It's like, well, aren't you inherently saying that the screen isn't protected?

00:09:09 ◼   ► Like, shouldn't you do something about that?

00:09:11 ◼   ► You know, rather than just, here's the screen protector, you know, it's also, it's funny.

00:09:16 ◼   ► It's like screen protector on a case.

00:09:18 ◼   ► That's what they want you to leave with.

00:09:19 ◼   ► And it's like, what, what do I have now?

00:09:21 ◼   ► Do I still have the phone that you gave me?

00:09:23 ◼   ► It's like the phone of Theseus or something over here.

00:09:25 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:09:26 ◼   ► Mike, you've made a purchase.

00:09:29 ◼   ► Well, I made a purchase.

00:09:31 ◼   ► It doesn't go on your feet.

00:09:32 ◼   ► No, but my new MacBook Air arrived.

00:09:35 ◼   ► The MacBook Air.

00:09:37 ◼   ► Nope, I would never do that.

00:09:38 ◼   ► It's just MacBook Air M5.

00:09:41 ◼   ► That's its product name.

00:09:42 ◼   ► You don't name your, you don't name your computers.

00:09:44 ◼   ► No, I don't.

00:09:44 ◼   ► Well, my previous one was MacBook Air 2.

00:09:46 ◼   ► Oh, no.

00:09:48 ◼   ► I hate that.

00:09:49 ◼   ► I just couldn't have been able to fix it.

00:09:51 ◼   ► And so this time, yeah, I tried doing the naming for a while.

00:09:55 ◼   ► And I just like, it just became too much to keep up with every time.

00:09:58 ◼   ► Like, and so it's just MacBook Air M5.

00:10:02 ◼   ► Because also it's like, I'm sending things around to all my devices.

00:10:05 ◼   ► If I don't have like a very clear, I don't know where this is going.

00:10:09 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:10:09 ◼   ► You know?

00:10:09 ◼   ► Like, I have two laptops in active use.

00:10:13 ◼   ► One is the one that's doing all of my Dropbox downloading and backup.

00:10:18 ◼   ► Then I have my Mac Mini.

00:10:19 ◼   ► I have an iPhone Air and an iPhone Pro.

00:10:22 ◼   ► So I just need these things to be called what they are.

00:10:24 ◼   ► So I could just get things around using Blip, which is like, oh, that's a good app.

00:10:30 ◼   ► Very good.

00:10:30 ◼   ► Oh, my God.

00:10:31 ◼   ► It's so good.

00:10:32 ◼   ► Like, if you're not, if you ever do, if you do AirDrop with any kind of frequency, you should

00:10:41 ◼   ► download and use Blip instead.

00:10:43 ◼   ► Yep.

00:10:43 ◼   ► It is so much better than AirDrop.

00:10:45 ◼   ► It's fantastic.

00:10:46 ◼   ► Federico, have you ever used this?

00:10:48 ◼   ► Blip?

00:10:49 ◼   ► No.

00:10:50 ◼   ► No.

00:10:50 ◼   ► Oh, you got to check it out, man.

00:10:52 ◼   ► Especially where you have your Macs connected all the time, right?

00:10:57 ◼   ► Like, you can send files to them.

00:10:59 ◼   ► You don't even need to be in the same place.

00:11:01 ◼   ► Blip.

00:11:02 ◼   ► Blip.

00:11:03 ◼   ► It's so good.

00:11:05 ◼   ► Is it better than just doing Tail Drop with Tail Scale?

00:11:09 ◼   ► Can't answer that question because I haven't tried doing that.

00:11:12 ◼   ► It's probably similar.

00:11:13 ◼   ► It's probably similar would be my expectation.

00:11:15 ◼   ► But if you're enjoying that, then keep using that.

00:11:19 ◼   ► But this is also a very good option.

00:11:21 ◼   ► So anyway, so my MacBook Air is here.

00:11:22 ◼   ► It was supposed to arrive in August, but it's arrived sooner, which I was very happy about

00:11:27 ◼   ► because I wanted it sooner rather than later.

00:11:29 ◼   ► It's very fast.

00:11:31 ◼   ► It's, I love that I have loads of storage space now.

00:11:35 ◼   ► And my Studio Display XDR can now do one of the main features, which is high refresh rate.

00:11:44 ◼   ► So I now have an adaptive refresh rate up to 120 hertz.

00:11:48 ◼   ► It's incredible because I've been using this thing with an M2 MacBook Air.

00:11:52 ◼   ► It's like 60 and you'll like it.

00:11:54 ◼   ► If that, sometimes.

00:11:55 ◼   ► But it's amazing.

00:11:57 ◼   ► I'm like scrolling the web and everything's super smooth.

00:11:59 ◼   ► I'm having a great time.

00:12:01 ◼   ► It's very happy.

00:12:02 ◼   ► And also I got, I've already applied stickers with the kind of using a wrap method.

00:12:08 ◼   ► I used the, I spoke about it before, but I bought a, Federico had this.

00:12:12 ◼   ► It's a retro apple skin from Slick Wraps.

00:12:15 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:12:16 ◼   ► And I got that one in like the beige color for my MacBook Air.

00:12:20 ◼   ► And I, then I just started covering up with stickers and I'm having a great time.

00:12:25 ◼   ► Very happy with this computer.

00:12:26 ◼   ► I got it in silver.

00:12:27 ◼   ► I think the silver and the beige is actually quite a decent combo.

00:12:31 ◼   ► So yeah, very happy.

00:12:32 ◼   ► Good.

00:12:33 ◼   ► And you just transferred stuff.

00:12:35 ◼   ► You didn't set up fresh.

00:12:37 ◼   ► Oh yeah.

00:12:38 ◼   ► No migration assistant.

00:12:39 ◼   ► I just, I just did the whole migration and I did it with a Thunderbolt cable and it took

00:12:42 ◼   ► like an hour, which is just like incredible.

00:12:45 ◼   ► Pretty, pretty sweet.

00:12:46 ◼   ► It was very easy.

00:12:48 ◼   ► And yeah, this is the thing with a migration.

00:12:53 ◼   ► Everything's fine right now.

00:12:55 ◼   ► Like I have one lingering thing at the moment, which is this Mac is just not showing up in

00:13:02 ◼   ► Find My.

00:13:02 ◼   ► So I'm working on that.

00:13:06 ◼   ► That's strange.

00:13:08 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:13:09 ◼   ► It's very weird.

00:13:10 ◼   ► My old one's there and I didn't erase that one.

00:13:12 ◼   ► I don't know if that's causing any issues of it, but it shouldn't.

00:13:15 ◼   ► Um, so, because it shows up in my iCloud device list.

00:13:18 ◼   ► So like, it's the thing that, you know, iCloud knows that this product exists, but it's just

00:13:22 ◼   ► not showing up in Find My, but everything is turned on, you know, like all of the settings

00:13:26 ◼   ► that you would need to Find My, they're all on.

00:13:29 ◼   ► Uh, it just can't find it in the Find My app, which is, uh, interesting.

00:13:33 ◼   ► The whole point, really, of the whole point, really, of that app.

00:13:35 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:13:36 ◼   ► Drive it over to Craig's house.

00:13:38 ◼   ► Yeah, okay.

00:13:39 ◼   ► You think he'd fix it?

00:13:40 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:13:41 ◼   ► I could take it to my friend John's house.

00:13:43 ◼   ► Thomas.

00:13:44 ◼   ► Say, hey, John.

00:13:45 ◼   ► Oh, hey, John.

00:13:46 ◼   ► He knows your name.

00:13:47 ◼   ► Exactly.

00:13:48 ◼   ► That's what I mean.

00:13:49 ◼   ► He's my friend.

00:13:49 ◼   ► He knows.

00:13:49 ◼   ► I don't know that Craig knows my name, but I know John Thomas knows my name.

00:13:54 ◼   ► Did y'all see this Lego iMac thing?

00:13:55 ◼   ► Yeah, it's not happening.

00:13:57 ◼   ► No, not at all.

00:13:59 ◼   ► So this was part of the Lego Ideas system.

00:14:03 ◼   ► Do you want to explain what that is if people aren't familiar with it?

00:14:05 ◼   ► Yeah, so this was something that, I don't think it was originally called Ideas when it started,

00:14:10 ◼   ► but they ended up making more of a thing where essentially an individual can create a Lego build,

00:14:18 ◼   ► whether they build it or they model it or whatever in some, you know, like Lego software

00:14:23 ◼   ► of some description or whatever.

00:14:24 ◼   ► But they can create the entire build and upload it to this system where Lego fans will vote

00:14:31 ◼   ► on an item.

00:14:32 ◼   ► And when something gets to, I think it's 10,000 votes, Lego will review the design.

00:14:39 ◼   ► And Lego have produced lots of products, very successful sets from the Lego Ideas line.

00:14:47 ◼   ► In fact, most of the Lego sets that I bought maybe in the last 10 years have come from Ideas.

00:14:53 ◼   ► Yes.

00:14:54 ◼   ► So like I have the Seinfeld set that came from Lego Ideas.

00:14:57 ◼   ► The WALL-E set, I believe, was a Lego Ideas project.

00:15:00 ◼   ► So they've done some great stuff, some licensed stuff and some not.

00:15:10 ◼   ► What happens is they have like a season, like a time frame that you can submit ideas.

00:15:19 ◼   ► And then when that time frame is over, anything that got over 10,000 votes will either be put into production,

00:15:27 ◼   ► essentially reviewed or rejected for whatever reason.

00:15:33 ◼   ► Now, somebody produced a model of the Bondi Blue iMac G3.

00:15:41 ◼   ► And it got to the votes and Lego have now put it in their what they call parking lot.

00:15:47 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

00:15:48 ◼   ► I know.

00:15:49 ◼   ► Which is essentially, we are reviewing this.

00:15:53 ◼   ► Now, typically, anything licensed would go in the parking lot because Lego can't just make it.

00:16:00 ◼   ► Yeah, they have to go talk to the IP owner, right?

00:16:03 ◼   ► So, Federico, one of the ones that's also in the parking lot is a Hollow Knight set that came out from this kind of round.

00:16:12 ◼   ► And so, you know, technically, Lego is now reviewing it.

00:16:18 ◼   ► But I don't think this will happen.

00:16:19 ◼   ► I don't think Apple would allow it.

00:16:20 ◼   ► No, they should.

00:16:22 ◼   ► I think it would be really cool if they did.

00:16:25 ◼   ► I agree.

00:16:25 ◼   ► Yeah, it would be amazing.

00:16:27 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:16:27 ◼   ► It would be, they should do something like this.

00:16:30 ◼   ► Especially like, let's see if we can get it approved before the 50th year is up.

00:16:34 ◼   ► But they should do this.

00:16:36 ◼   ► They won't do this.

00:16:37 ◼   ► Do you remember the Lego iMac?

00:16:40 ◼   ► The Lego Mac?

00:16:41 ◼   ► Yeah, I've got, back in the day.

00:16:43 ◼   ► Yeah, it was, that was a, like a fan creation.

00:16:47 ◼   ► Yes.

00:16:48 ◼   ► A thing that also happens in the Lego world is someone will just design a set and then they will sell all the parts you need for it.

00:16:54 ◼   ► And Lego has been, like, both cool and not cool about that over the years.

00:16:58 ◼   ► I've got one.

00:16:59 ◼   ► I can see it.

00:17:00 ◼   ► It's, like, literally on top of a shelf on the other side of my office.

00:17:02 ◼   ► It's super cool.

00:17:05 ◼   ► I think if you're ever going to do this, 50 is a good time to do it.

00:17:10 ◼   ► I'm like, it doesn't really matter.

00:17:11 ◼   ► It'll make the hardcore people happy.

00:17:14 ◼   ► I think this is super cool.

00:17:17 ◼   ► Steve Trout Smith says something that I actually kind of agree with.

00:17:21 ◼   ► Like, if they do this, they should make the design better.

00:17:24 ◼   ► Like, the thing that was put together as the Lego ideas, I guess, nomination or entry was a little rough.

00:17:35 ◼   ► And Lego will do that.

00:17:37 ◼   ► You know, they will take the design and refine it.

00:17:39 ◼   ► Like, they very rarely put the idea as it was submitted into production.

00:17:44 ◼   ► Like, they actually end up, like, goes to, like, they have names, like, the Lego designers, essentially.

00:17:51 ◼   ► And they will create the actual final product.

00:17:54 ◼   ► But it won't happen.

00:17:56 ◼   ► It's not going to happen.

00:17:57 ◼   ► I wished it would, but I don't think it is.

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00:20:00 ◼   ► So last week, Apple filed a lawsuit against OpenAI for stealing trade secrets.

00:20:08 ◼   ► Jason and I spoke about it at length on Upgrade.

00:20:12 ◼   ► But I wanted to see if either of you had any thoughts that you wanted to share on this.

00:20:17 ◼   ► Because it is actually quite a big story.

00:20:19 ◼   ► I found this to be quite perfect in terms of timing with the movie that we're watching for Connected Pro members.

00:20:30 ◼   ► More coming on that soon.

00:20:32 ◼   ► Very simple thought, I think, that I have.

00:20:38 ◼   ► Obviously, like, if crimes were committed, like, obviously, you got to handle the crime, so to speak.

00:20:48 ◼   ► Like, if there is a criminal case here, then by all means, this needs to go to court and all evidence needs to be reviewed.

00:20:58 ◼   ► And, you know, it goes beyond our jurisdiction, so to speak, right?

00:21:03 ◼   ► We're just podcasters.

00:21:04 ◼   ► It's like, if actual criminal activity was conducted by people employed at OpenAI to steal trade secrets from Apple, then by all means, a judge will decide.

00:21:14 ◼   ► I just feel like, on the other hand, what a handy way to stop your potential competition before it even begins.

00:21:27 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:21:28 ◼   ► Two things can be true.

00:21:30 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:21:31 ◼   ► You know?

00:21:31 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:21:32 ◼   ► It's like, this can be a thing that they have done, and also, how helpful.

00:21:37 ◼   ► And, you know me, if you will allow me, a bit of a conspiracy theory.

00:21:43 ◼   ► What if this was a honeypot?

00:21:45 ◼   ► What are the chances?

00:21:47 ◼   ► Well, I think that they did do that.

00:21:49 ◼   ► I don't know if it was when it started, but I think eventually Apple did do this.

00:21:53 ◼   ► What are the chances that you leave everything open in your security system, in your local network for Apple employees to just freely download PDFs and drawings and sketches and reports and meeting summaries,

00:22:13 ◼   ► and you don't notice for months, and you let somebody else who's now working at your potential biggest competitor in the future, and you just let this person download and download and download gigabytes of data and poach people.

00:22:31 ◼   ► And you just don't do anything, but since February, you start building a criminal case against them.

00:22:37 ◼   ► I mean, the alternative to that's pretty bad, right?

00:22:41 ◼   ► The alternative to that is that the Apple security system is so bad.

00:22:45 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:22:45 ◼   ► No one noticed.

00:22:46 ◼   ► I have a friend who doesn't work for Apple, but works with Apple.

00:22:52 ◼   ► And I was talking to them about this, and they gave me a couple of interesting things to consider about this part of it.

00:22:59 ◼   ► And one, I think they mentioned this on Dithering.

00:23:02 ◼   ► Apple uses Box a lot for their internal device, like document sharing, right?

00:23:10 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:23:10 ◼   ► So the issue could actually be with Box or the way they have it implemented, right?

00:23:14 ◼   ► It doesn't matter, but it's just a thought.

00:23:16 ◼   ► The other thing this person said to me, you know, because like the idea that like Apple employees, they're allowed to kind of use devices essentially freely, right?

00:23:25 ◼   ► That they're not very locked down at all.

00:23:28 ◼   ► And this person has observed that in Apple, like they're very kind of like flippant with the way that they manage devices.

00:23:37 ◼   ► And this is like a symptom of if you create a culture of secrecy and make it clear that if you break that secrecy, you're done.

00:23:49 ◼   ► You don't then do a lot of actual device, like secrecy stuff, because you assume that everyone will follow the rules.

00:24:00 ◼   ► Where like in other companies, if you don't really make a big deal out of it, you have to create a really good system of logging the movement of confidential documents, because it's not part of your company culture to enforce it so strongly.

00:24:14 ◼   ► And so it's like this thing of like, hey, we all know you can't even talk to colleagues about projects you're working on.

00:24:22 ◼   ► Like, you know, they have the internal tool where you can, there's like an app where you can work out if somebody is disclosed in the same thing that you are.

00:24:29 ◼   ► Like if you go to those kinds of levels, just in like general interaction, then you're kind of, you know, you can imagine a scenario where they're like, ah, just do whatever you want.

00:24:38 ◼   ► But you know the rules.

00:24:40 ◼   ► And then if you do things like that, you end up in a scenario where maybe doors aren't closed that should be closed.

00:24:45 ◼   ► And I thought that was a very interesting perspective.

00:24:49 ◼   ► It's such a wild story that you would have somebody leave and then there's like this, the thing that's, I mean, file security aside, which is just a totally bonkers part of this, the idea that someone would be coaching people to take information, what they should know for their interviews, handpicking people who are willing to go along with this.

00:25:13 ◼   ► Like, that's pretty dark stuff and it's not, I mean, these, you know, these things happen all the time, right?

00:25:21 ◼   ► It's, it's, you don't hear about it.

00:25:23 ◼   ► Like if it happens between like two rival plumbing companies, like, you know, it doesn't make the news.

00:25:28 ◼   ► This makes the news because it's two of the most valuable companies in the world.

00:25:32 ◼   ► But the thing that I keep thinking about is like, it's so, uh, it feels so premeditated and brazen to like the, the, the, the coaching people, the bringing people in, if any of that is true.

00:25:45 ◼   ► And it's all alleged, like, who knows, this will be sorted out.

00:25:49 ◼   ► Um, pretty, pretty, pretty wild stuff that you think that you can just do this in the 21st century.

00:25:56 ◼   ► Um, I think that the discovery process in particular will be, uh, potentially very interesting to see, you know, some of the most fascinating stuff we've learned about the early days of the iPhone came out in Apple V Samsung, you know, now like 10 years ago or, you know, we talked about it back then.

00:26:17 ◼   ► Right.

00:26:17 ◼   ► Uh, because it was the, the, what was it?

00:26:20 ◼   ► Uh, look and dress.

00:26:22 ◼   ► What is it?

00:26:23 ◼   ► I forget what it's called, but trade dress, trade dress, you know, some of the design stuff that Apple was saying Samsung had ripped off.

00:26:30 ◼   ► And we see all these internal documents of how these companies work.

00:26:33 ◼   ► Uh, my suspicion is that open AI is going to come out looking, even if none of this is true, right?

00:26:41 ◼   ► Say all this gets, gets just, you know, uh, disregarded by a jury at some point or by a judge.

00:26:48 ◼   ► The discovery process, I think is going to really reveal that open AI is as disorganized as they seem to be.

00:26:55 ◼   ► And, you know, one of the people in the suit is like a executive level.

00:27:01 ◼   ► And if they were doing this and you didn't know, that's bad.

00:27:04 ◼   ► If they were doing it and you didn't know, that's also bad.

00:27:07 ◼   ► Like, I just don't see any upside.

00:27:09 ◼   ► I don't see any way open AI comes out of this without some damage.

00:27:14 ◼   ► And I think that process will be very interesting to follow along.

00:27:18 ◼   ► And this is going to take a long time.

00:27:20 ◼   ► Like, this is going to be in the news for years.

00:27:23 ◼   ► I mean, Apple versus Epic is still happening.

00:27:26 ◼   ► The Supreme Court is hearing part of that case.

00:27:28 ◼   ► Google and Epic just, they just kind of ended that this week.

00:27:32 ◼   ► Did y'all see that?

00:27:32 ◼   ► Like, there's going to be third-party app stores on Android.

00:27:34 ◼   ► Google's like, fine, we'll do it.

00:27:36 ◼   ► Yeah, because they were trying to make this settlement, right?

00:27:39 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:27:39 ◼   ► They ended up knowing that no court would accept it.

00:27:42 ◼   ► So they just went with what they thought the court would accept.

00:27:45 ◼   ► But these things will take time.

00:27:47 ◼   ► This will be years of discovery and hearings and, I mean, who knows?

00:27:55 ◼   ► But totally bonkers, man.

00:27:58 ◼   ► I mean, the story came out and I was like reading it.

00:28:01 ◼   ► I was like, oh, this just keeps getting sort of more and more like a movie in many ways.

00:28:06 ◼   ► I have a few more thoughts on this, if nobody else does.

00:28:10 ◼   ► I just wanted to mention that it'll be so curious to understand Johnny Ive's involvement in all of this.

00:28:21 ◼   ► They went to great lengths not to name Johnny Ive in the lawsuit.

00:28:26 ◼   ► I believe the phrasing is that they mentioned the managers or superiors of the person involved.

00:28:36 ◼   ► I feel like it's awkward, right?

00:28:40 ◼   ► They had this very public divorce, so to speak.

00:28:45 ◼   ► But obviously, you know, it goes without saying that I think Apple still carries a lot of respect for Johnny Ive and vice versa.

00:28:51 ◼   ► And right now we have no idea whether Johnny Ive was involved in all of this or not.

00:28:57 ◼   ► Or if Johnny Ive is now very upset at this person for doing this to his previous employer.

00:29:03 ◼   ► I would hope so.

00:29:04 ◼   ► Right?

00:29:04 ◼   ► But what if he knew, actually?

00:29:07 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:29:09 ◼   ► An angle that I thought of, again, this, like, who knows, right?

00:29:14 ◼   ► But I had this thought the other day.

00:29:16 ◼   ► I was like, I wonder if people involved here are, like, trying to impress Johnny Ive or, like, prove their mettle.

00:29:27 ◼   ► Like, oh, I know all this stuff.

00:29:28 ◼   ► And the way they knew it is taking documents that weren't theirs.

00:29:33 ◼   ► But I agree with you.

00:29:34 ◼   ► That's, like, a huge unanswered question here.

00:29:38 ◼   ► And you're right.

00:29:38 ◼   ► Like, I didn't read the whole complaint, but I read a lot of it.

00:29:42 ◼   ► And it's like, boy, there are some places where they really tiptoe around Johnny Ive.

00:29:48 ◼   ► Right?

00:29:49 ◼   ► It's like this unnamed figure looming over all of this, as is Sam Altman in many ways, right?

00:29:57 ◼   ► They have a, like, their culture is on trial in many ways.

00:30:02 ◼   ► Like, if this is the sort of thing that, I don't know.

00:30:05 ◼   ► It's very, very strange.

00:30:07 ◼   ► I think that another scenario here is that this court case actually indicates how little Johnny Ive works on these products.

00:30:19 ◼   ► And that that will be a thing that OpenAI doesn't necessarily want people to know.

00:30:23 ◼   ► Like, I can imagine that being a scenario, right?

00:30:26 ◼   ► Like, there is the scenario that he knew about it.

00:30:28 ◼   ► There's the scenario that he didn't know about it, but is involved.

00:30:32 ◼   ► And there's the scenario that he didn't know about it because he's never there.

00:30:35 ◼   ► Right?

00:30:36 ◼   ► That, like, Tang Tan is doing it.

00:30:38 ◼   ► Like, Johnny Ive was there for the brainstorm meetings and then just went away.

00:30:43 ◼   ► Right?

00:30:44 ◼   ► And he's making Ferraris.

00:30:45 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:30:46 ◼   ► And nice cameras or whatever.

00:30:47 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:30:48 ◼   ► But OpenAI benefits from the idea that people have.

00:30:51 ◼   ► Like, Johnny Ive is there.

00:30:53 ◼   ► Exactly.

00:30:53 ◼   ► And so they want that to be the story that people think about.

00:30:57 ◼   ► But the reality might be that he's not engaged in the business.

00:31:02 ◼   ► And that would be damaging for them if it came out that way during the discovery process.

00:31:08 ◼   ► Like, the most he's worked was making that video where he swung his arms around a lot.

00:31:11 ◼   ► I mean, but maybe, right?

00:31:13 ◼   ► Because like that, you remember how excited we were?

00:31:15 ◼   ► Like, there is, it's marketing.

00:31:18 ◼   ► Johnny Ive, attaching Ive's name to your product now is marketing.

00:31:22 ◼   ► That's why Ferrari did it.

00:31:24 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

00:31:24 ◼   ► They didn't need Johnny Ive to do that.

00:31:26 ◼   ► I mean, maybe to do some of the stuff they ended up, yeah, they kind of did, whether you

00:31:31 ◼   ► like it or not, you know?

00:31:32 ◼   ► But like, they didn't have to bring Johnny Ive in to make the electric Ferrari.

00:31:36 ◼   ► They could have done it without him.

00:31:37 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:31:39 ◼   ► I figured this case has to go to court, right?

00:31:42 ◼   ► Because OpenAI cannot settle this.

00:31:45 ◼   ► Because if they settle it, their work can't be completed, right?

00:31:49 ◼   ► Because if they settle this case, you'd assume that they would have to be like, we will do

00:31:54 ◼   ► what you say and destroy all of the stuff.

00:31:56 ◼   ► So I figure they kind of have to go to court in the hope that they'll win, right?

00:32:01 ◼   ► Because otherwise, they can't produce their hardware products.

00:32:04 ◼   ► Hmm.

00:32:06 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:32:06 ◼   ► Because what else are you going to do?

00:32:08 ◼   ► I wonder, like, I've had this thought knocking around in my head for a while, and I think

00:32:13 ◼   ► this might be the first major case where we see the result of AI meeting notes as a problem

00:32:20 ◼   ► in Discovery.

00:32:22 ◼   ► Everyone's taking notes on meetings with tools.

00:32:27 ◼   ► Can they be entered into Discovery?

00:32:31 ◼   ► I figure probably, which means every meeting is recorded.

00:32:37 ◼   ► And I figure this is something happening on OpenAI, but not Apple.

00:32:40 ◼   ► Like, we spoke about it before, right?

00:32:42 ◼   ► So this is why they removed the feature from the new chat GPT for an AI.

00:32:45 ◼   ► Yeah, maybe.

00:32:45 ◼   ► But this is, I've had this thought for a while of, like, discovery processes are going to

00:32:51 ◼   ► change significantly because everyone records every word said in meetings now.

00:32:57 ◼   ► Multiple people are doing it in meetings.

00:32:59 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:32:59 ◼   ► And I figured, you know, like, if anyone is remote, the meeting is recorded.

00:33:04 ◼   ► And, like, we've all been on meetings, right?

00:33:07 ◼   ► You're on, like, a call, and there's, like, three participants and six note-takers on the call.

00:33:12 ◼   ► And those are the ones you just see, right?

00:33:14 ◼   ► There are tools that people use that I use where it's, like, I'm just recording it locally on my Mac.

00:33:18 ◼   ► Like, everyone's doing this.

00:33:21 ◼   ► It's like, can this all get entered into discovery?

00:33:23 ◼   ► And what will that result in?

00:33:24 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:33:25 ◼   ► And how much will OpenAI say, ah, it's an AI note.

00:33:28 ◼   ► You can't, you know, but not verbatim.

00:33:30 ◼   ► You can't trust them.

00:33:31 ◼   ► But they can't do that, right?

00:33:33 ◼   ► They can't be like, I can't trust AI.

00:33:34 ◼   ► It's like, hang on a minute.

00:33:35 ◼   ► What are we talking about here?

00:33:37 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:33:37 ◼   ► My last thought is they're going to, I figure, right, Tang Tan, and I forgot the person's first name, Chiang, they're going to hang them out to dry, right?

00:33:45 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:33:46 ◼   ► Probably.

00:33:47 ◼   ► Right?

00:33:48 ◼   ► Like, you've got to, in a scenario like this.

00:33:52 ◼   ► I mean, I'm surprised.

00:33:54 ◼   ► I mean, I know that OpenAI issued a second statement.

00:33:57 ◼   ► I guess they can't really do it yet, but, you know, they can't now be like, ah, we're going to fire these people because they're trying to also say nothing happened.

00:34:04 ◼   ► But, like, I think at a certain point, it's like, you're going to fall on this one if they did do it.

00:34:09 ◼   ► No one wins here at OpenAI, I don't think, no matter what happens.

00:34:14 ◼   ► We'll win because the story is interesting, but I don't think really there are any, yeah, I don't think OpenAI is going to come out of this one feeling great no matter what happens.

00:34:24 ◼   ► Mark Gurman has some details on new iPads.

00:34:29 ◼   ► Speaking of information coming out of Apple, I guess.

00:34:33 ◼   ► See what I did there?

00:34:34 ◼   ► I linked the two stories with a joke.

00:34:37 ◼   ► You're going to go, you're a professional.

00:34:39 ◼   ► I am a professional.

00:34:39 ◼   ► So, just a rough outline of what Gurman is reporting this morning.

00:34:45 ◼   ► I'm going to start with the most boring and work my way to the most interesting.

00:34:49 ◼   ► Updated iPad Airs and iPad Pros next year.

00:34:54 ◼   ► They're currently on the M4 and M5, respectively.

00:34:57 ◼   ► So, I guess this would be M6 and M5.

00:35:00 ◼   ► And I always forget the iPad Air comes in two sizes.

00:35:05 ◼   ► I just, that big iPad Air doesn't exist in my mind at all.

00:35:09 ◼   ► Same as the MacBook Air.

00:35:10 ◼   ► Same as the 15-inch MacBook Air.

00:35:12 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:35:13 ◼   ► No, the 15-inch Air is great.

00:35:16 ◼   ► I like that machine.

00:35:17 ◼   ► I'm not saying that they're good or bad.

00:35:18 ◼   ► It's just, I never remember that either of them come in the bigger sizes.

00:35:21 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:35:22 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:35:22 ◼   ► Entry-level iPad early next year.

00:35:27 ◼   ► I looked it up.

00:35:28 ◼   ► That was last updated in spring of 25.

00:35:31 ◼   ► And it currently runs the Apple A16 Bionic.

00:35:35 ◼   ► So, it is not compatible with Apple Intelligence at all.

00:35:39 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:35:39 ◼   ► Old or new.

00:35:40 ◼   ► Maybe they'll get it up to the A17 Pro, which is the baseline for Apple Intelligence features.

00:35:46 ◼   ► But that's also the cheap one, right?

00:35:49 ◼   ► And in the world of risen costs.

00:35:51 ◼   ► Cheap, quote-unquote cheap, right?

00:35:55 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:35:55 ◼   ► Quote-unquote cheap.

00:35:56 ◼   ► So, we'll see.

00:35:59 ◼   ► And that's the one they sell to schools.

00:36:00 ◼   ► Like, maybe it's not important if Apple Intelligence runs on it.

00:36:05 ◼   ► I would have said before the price increase stuff, like, yes, absolutely, this thing will get Apple Intelligence.

00:36:10 ◼   ► Now, I think it's, like, basically 50-50 if it gets the A17 or the A17 Pro.

00:36:15 ◼   ► Who knows?

00:36:16 ◼   ► But most interesting is the long-rumored OLED iPad Mini.

00:36:24 ◼   ► The iPad Mini runs the A17 Pro.

00:36:28 ◼   ► Remember, it got bumped to support Apple Intelligence in October of 2024.

00:36:32 ◼   ► It's been a minute.

00:36:35 ◼   ► And there have been other reports about the iPad Mini that it would include increased water resistance,

00:36:42 ◼   ► a vibration-based speaker system.

00:36:45 ◼   ► It could be interesting, I guess.

00:36:49 ◼   ► And then it would be either the A19 Pro or the upcoming A20 chip.

00:36:54 ◼   ► So, that could be, according to Gurman, this fall.

00:36:58 ◼   ► It may be an October event.

00:37:00 ◼   ► Maybe they do iPads and some Macs, you know, after the iPhone.

00:37:04 ◼   ► But out of all these, I think that's the most interesting.

00:37:07 ◼   ► You know, the Mini continues to be a strange product.

00:37:11 ◼   ► I've got one in my household, and parts of iPadOS really feel like no one tested them on an iPad Mini.

00:37:19 ◼   ► Like, there's parts of the UI that just got cut off in weird ways if you're in landscape.

00:37:23 ◼   ► Or just, it feels very cramped.

00:37:26 ◼   ► This does not include a size increase, I don't think.

00:37:30 ◼   ► But, it's still out there.

00:37:32 ◼   ► The iPad Mini's still kicking.

00:37:33 ◼   ► And, you know, I think about one every so often.

00:37:35 ◼   ► Even though I've gone down that road many times.

00:37:38 ◼   ► And no, ultimately, it's not for me.

00:37:39 ◼   ► I think an OLED one would be really nice.

00:37:43 ◼   ► It would be really nice.

00:37:44 ◼   ► I just wonder.

00:37:47 ◼   ► I mean, I'm going to get an iPhone Fold, right?

00:37:50 ◼   ► So, for me specifically, what's the point of an iPad Mini?

00:37:54 ◼   ► That's my main thought right now.

00:37:57 ◼   ► And obviously, there's going to be people who are not going to buy an iPhone Fold.

00:38:00 ◼   ► And they're going to be really happy with an iPad Mini.

00:38:02 ◼   ► I just, I'm thinking about me specifically here.

00:38:07 ◼   ► At that point, I'm just going to be all in on the iPhone Ultra or Fold, whatever it's going to be called.

00:38:14 ◼   ► Full-size apps, man.

00:38:17 ◼   ► I mean, this product would have been nice, would have been great for me two years ago.

00:38:24 ◼   ► Not now.

00:38:25 ◼   ► Not with a foldable iPhone on the horizon.

00:38:28 ◼   ► Like a month before, actually.

00:38:30 ◼   ► So, yeah.

00:38:32 ◼   ► It is.

00:38:34 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean, that's been an argument for a long time, right?

00:38:36 ◼   ► Like with the Pro Max.

00:38:37 ◼   ► It's like getting pretty big, pretty close.

00:38:40 ◼   ► And, yeah, the overlap between those two devices is going to be even more strong.

00:38:46 ◼   ► But we'll see.

00:38:49 ◼   ► We'll see how it goes.

00:38:50 ◼   ► Yeah, I think, you know, I think in terms of the Air and the iPad Pro, it just feels like they're just on a cycle with those.

00:38:57 ◼   ► And no one's upgrading year over year.

00:38:59 ◼   ► It's, you know, if you are replacing a three-, four-, five-year-old iPad Pro, then that's just the new one at the time.

00:39:06 ◼   ► I don't think those devices are wanting for updates.

00:39:09 ◼   ► I think if they skip them next year and it's a longer gap, I don't think it's any big deal.

00:39:15 ◼   ► But it's also about getting older chips kind of out of production, I think, at the same time.

00:39:22 ◼   ► I want to tell you about Connected Pro, the longer and ad-free version of the show that we do each and every week.

00:39:29 ◼   ► You know, for a long time, podcasts have been advertising back.

00:39:34 ◼   ► And that's going to continue, but membership is more important than ever.

00:39:38 ◼   ► Several years ago, we launched Connected Pro.

00:39:41 ◼   ► And we do extra content at the beginning of the show.

00:39:44 ◼   ► And you get the show without any ads.

00:39:46 ◼   ► And you get some extra content at the end.

00:39:49 ◼   ► You also get a bunch of great stuff from Relay.

00:39:52 ◼   ► So, access to our members-only Discord, which is my favorite place on the internet now.

00:39:57 ◼   ► And a newsletter and some members-only podcasts.

00:40:00 ◼   ► During the summer, we do annual specials.

00:40:02 ◼   ► And just today, actually, we are recording ours.

00:40:05 ◼   ► The three of us watched the BlackBerry movie from 2023.

00:40:09 ◼   ► And an incredible movie.

00:40:11 ◼   ► And we talked about it.

00:40:12 ◼   ► And that'll be out for members later today.

00:40:15 ◼   ► So, there's a link in the show notes where you can get 15% off an annual Connected Pro subscription.

00:40:21 ◼   ► Whether you're new to it or if you're reactivating an expired one.

00:40:26 ◼   ► You'll get 15% off with the coupon code TINYHEADS15.

00:40:31 ◼   ► That's TINYHEADS15 for 15% off an annual Connected Pro subscription.

00:40:36 ◼   ► Now, that's only running through July 31st.

00:40:40 ◼   ► So, be sure to go check it out.

00:40:42 ◼   ► And thank you for your ongoing support of the show.

00:40:45 ◼   ► It's public beta time.

00:40:49 ◼   ► Yes.

00:40:50 ◼   ► Everybody excited?

00:40:51 ◼   ► Yes.

00:40:52 ◼   ► Me too.

00:40:53 ◼   ► Me too.

00:40:54 ◼   ► Before Federico gets into his excellent article, just a quick update.

00:41:02 ◼   ► What are we running now?

00:41:05 ◼   ► What did that change in the public beta?

00:41:07 ◼   ► Everything except tvOS and visionOS, but the latter is going to change this weekend.

00:41:11 ◼   ► I'm going to get my vision pro again and update it to visionOS 27.

00:41:16 ◼   ► There's no...

00:41:17 ◼   ► I don't think there's a public beta of visionOS 27.

00:41:20 ◼   ► No.

00:41:21 ◼   ► So, I'm going to put the developer beta on it.

00:41:23 ◼   ► But that will just leave tvOS for me.

00:41:28 ◼   ► Okay.

00:41:28 ◼   ► Can I ask why?

00:41:30 ◼   ► I cannot be bothered with it.

00:41:33 ◼   ► I just want it to be stable with the HomeKit stuff.

00:41:36 ◼   ► No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

00:41:38 ◼   ► VisionOS.

00:41:38 ◼   ► Oh, visionOS.

00:41:39 ◼   ► Why do you want to bring out your visionOS for 27?

00:41:43 ◼   ► Intrigued to try the multi-tab Safari thing.

00:41:46 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:47 ◼   ► I thought that was really impressive.

00:41:49 ◼   ► Intrigued to try, again, Mac virtual display.

00:41:55 ◼   ► I realized I've been running a Mac studio server unlocked all the time on my home network for

00:42:02 ◼   ► like the past six months, and I never thought of managing it with a vision pro.

00:42:08 ◼   ► I just realized, I'm like, oh, I mean, obviously, I should have done this months ago, and I want

00:42:16 ◼   ► to try the panorama stuff with the environments.

00:42:18 ◼   ► Right.

00:42:19 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah.

00:42:19 ◼   ► I haven't done that yet, actually.

00:42:21 ◼   ► I wanted to do that and forgot, so I might do the same for the panoramas.

00:42:25 ◼   ► I just want to see what that looks like.

00:42:27 ◼   ► Steven Robles, I was in a briefing with him, and he airdropped me a panorama that he had

00:42:32 ◼   ► taken before at Apple Park, like looking out the windows onto the rainbow, and he had tried

00:42:38 ◼   ► it because he took his vision pro with him to WWDC, and he was like, this looks really

00:42:42 ◼   ► good.

00:42:42 ◼   ► So, I want to give it a go.

00:42:44 ◼   ► And also, generally speaking, I kind of dig the whole underdog vibe of the vision pro right

00:42:53 ◼   ► now, I am attracted to these cases in life in general, like these forgotten things that

00:43:01 ◼   ► actually have a really loyal following.

00:43:03 ◼   ► That kind of works for me, you know?

00:43:06 ◼   ► And so, that's why I kind of want to try it again.

00:43:08 ◼   ► Okay.

00:43:09 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:43:11 ◼   ► I still, iPhone, and I put the beta on my watch because I was no longer getting notifications

00:43:21 ◼   ► from my iPhone.

00:43:21 ◼   ► It just stopped.

00:43:23 ◼   ► And so, it seemed like a problem, and then when I put the beta on my watch, everything

00:43:28 ◼   ► went back to normal.

00:43:29 ◼   ► So, maybe something just got kind of like stuck.

00:43:32 ◼   ► This is the first time I've ever run an Apple Watch developer beta.

00:43:38 ◼   ► But this is maybe the first year where I felt like Apple has got the stability under

00:43:43 ◼   ► control, so I felt confident to try something like the watch beta.

00:43:49 ◼   ► I've got it.

00:43:52 ◼   ► I mean, I've had it on my iPhone and my MacBook Neo.

00:43:59 ◼   ► The public beta, I'm still running the dev betas, but with the public beta, I decided it

00:44:04 ◼   ► was time.

00:44:05 ◼   ► I added my iPad and my Apple Watch.

00:44:08 ◼   ► But I've run an Apple Watch beta for a couple years now for work, and so it's not new to

00:44:15 ◼   ► me.

00:44:15 ◼   ► But yeah, you're totally right about the stability.

00:44:18 ◼   ► Like, I was telling a friend of mine last night who was asking me about the public beta.

00:44:23 ◼   ► They were following the stuff, and I was like, honestly, it's kind of easy to forget you're

00:44:29 ◼   ► running a beta, except that you run a software update every week.

00:44:32 ◼   ► Like, it's pretty good.

00:44:35 ◼   ► And I have run into very few issues.

00:44:38 ◼   ► I think the biggest one is the menu bar stuff and Golden Gate.

00:44:42 ◼   ► Like, menu bar management apps are just broken, but they'll get that under control.

00:44:46 ◼   ► So yeah, it's solid.

00:44:49 ◼   ► So yeah, the public beta is out.

00:44:51 ◼   ► Federico, you used the opportunity to write about Siri AI and where Apple is with that.

00:44:59 ◼   ► So tell us what's going on.

00:45:00 ◼   ► Yeah, so I've been struggling with this since June, right?

00:45:08 ◼   ► Set aside the issues that I had with the Siri indexing.

00:45:13 ◼   ► Those have been fixed in developer beta 3.

00:45:15 ◼   ► But I've been struggling to wrap my head around working with an AI product that if you only

00:45:24 ◼   ► go by benchmarks or comparisons with other frontier models, you're going to be disappointed, right?

00:45:32 ◼   ► If you're a power user.

00:45:34 ◼   ► And that was my perspective going into this.

00:45:39 ◼   ► If you're a power user of these tools, whether you have a ChatGPT plan or a Cloud plan, and

00:45:45 ◼   ► you say, all right, I'm just going to try Siri AI and directly compare it to all the things

00:45:52 ◼   ► that I can do with ChatGPT or Codex or Cloud, and you're going to be disappointed, right?

00:45:57 ◼   ► And that was my issue.

00:45:59 ◼   ► If you just go a direct comparison, Apple, Siri AI versus Frontier models from Anthropic, OpenAI,

00:46:10 ◼   ► or really any of the Chinese companies at this point.

00:46:14 ◼   ► Just a few minutes ago, Moonshot, one of the Chinese companies, they put out Kimi 3.

00:46:21 ◼   ► And it's an open source model from China that is second only to Cloud Fable.

00:46:27 ◼   ► It's insane progress that they've made in China with these models.

00:46:33 ◼   ► But if you compare Siri AI to these models, you're not going to have a good time.

00:46:39 ◼   ► And that I struggled with for a while.

00:46:42 ◼   ► And it was...

00:46:44 ◼   ► Me and you were debating a lot in iMessages about this.

00:46:47 ◼   ► Yes, it was debating with Mike on iMessage and debating with Devin and Jonathan in our Slack

00:46:53 ◼   ► for Mac stories that I understood that my perspective coming into this was wrong, because the point

00:47:00 ◼   ► was not to compare the power user perspective of Siri AI versus these models.

00:47:06 ◼   ► The point was to take a normal, average AI user mindset and, you know, put myself in the

00:47:15 ◼   ► shoes of the kind of person who uses maybe ChatGPT quite a bit, but maybe they don't pay for it.

00:47:21 ◼   ► Like, of those billion people they have using ChatGPT, I would put money on the table, say,

00:47:27 ◼   ► all right, 900 million people are using it for free with ChatGPT instant, right?

00:47:33 ◼   ► I don't think they have 100 million subscribers, but I'm being generous.

00:47:37 ◼   ► And so there's, let's face it, the vast majority of people on Earth who are using AI tools are

00:47:46 ◼   ► not paying for it, are not paying for them, whether it's Cloud or OpenAI or...

00:47:52 ◼   ► And also, like, no regular person is using Cloud, right?

00:47:56 ◼   ► Most regular people exposed to AI, either for personal use or work use, they're either using

00:48:03 ◼   ► ChatGPT or Google Gemini or Microsoft Copilot.

00:48:07 ◼   ► That's what those people are using.

00:48:08 ◼   ► And they're not paying for it, and maybe their employer is paying for them at the workplace.

00:48:14 ◼   ► But employers now are, like, trying to backtrack some of that, like, the token maxing movement

00:48:20 ◼   ► is over as soon as it began.

00:48:22 ◼   ► Yes, yeah.

00:48:23 ◼   ► And so, but obviously, setting aside the workplace, because Apple is not building the product for

00:48:29 ◼   ► the workplace, now we're left with a comparison between Siri AI and ChatGPT for free.

00:48:35 ◼   ► And I think at that point, that's where the picture became more clear to me, as well as building

00:48:46 ◼   ► an appreciation for what Siri AI can do differently than ChatGPT.

00:48:52 ◼   ► I think that's the core element for me in this story.

00:48:57 ◼   ► There are things that Siri AI can do that other models cannot, not because they're not capable

00:49:06 ◼   ► of them, because they don't have access to the kinds of things that Siri AI has access to.

00:49:11 ◼   ► And so, the foundation model, the foundation model is not as good as even ChatGPT Instant

00:49:18 ◼   ► that those almost one billion people are using.

00:49:22 ◼   ► It's not as good, but it's good enough, right?

00:49:27 ◼   ► And that, I think, is the lens to sort of evaluate the product that Apple is building here.

00:49:36 ◼   ► And that's sort of the thesis of the article.

00:49:38 ◼   ► And I had, I think, a pretty simple sort of organization of thoughts, the good stuff and

00:49:47 ◼   ► the bad stuff.

00:49:48 ◼   ► But I think after all these conversations with Mike, I came away more optimistic about Siri AI

00:49:59 ◼   ► than I was until a month ago.

00:50:02 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean, you used a phrase that I kept thinking and didn't really say to you so explicitly,

00:50:08 ◼   ► which was in your article, you said, I believe my issue is that I'm too agent-pilled.

00:50:13 ◼   ► Yes.

00:50:14 ◼   ► And that was a thing that I was trying to get across in a way that didn't seem like I was

00:50:21 ◼   ► being derogatory.

00:50:23 ◼   ► But it's like, your whole thing was like, yeah, but it can't do all of this.

00:50:26 ◼   ► And it's like, well, yeah, I mean, it's not going to do any of that.

00:50:29 ◼   ► Yeah, it's like, imagine having been able, having been fortunate enough to drive in a

00:50:35 ◼   ► Ferrari for the past few months.

00:50:37 ◼   ► And you go buy your groceries in a Ferrari.

00:50:39 ◼   ► And you go to the dog park and you drive in a Ferrari.

00:50:42 ◼   ► And you go to the beach, you have a Ferrari.

00:50:44 ◼   ► And then you're like, all right, but now you also got to try this family, regular style,

00:50:51 ◼   ► you know, medium-sized SUV.

00:50:53 ◼   ► And you're like, oh boy, this sucks.

00:50:56 ◼   ► Like, I'm used to do all kinds of things in a really fancy Ferrari.

00:51:00 ◼   ► Now you want me to drive a regular family car?

00:51:03 ◼   ► But the thing is, most people don't drive a Ferrari.

00:51:06 ◼   ► And also, Ferraris are not always appropriate.

00:51:09 ◼   ► Exactly.

00:51:10 ◼   ► And also, the regular car can, in this case, I mean, the comparison only goes so far.

00:51:15 ◼   ► On the one hand, the issue is that I am too used to this cutting edge features, you know,

00:51:25 ◼   ► frontier models doing crazy things.

00:51:27 ◼   ► Whereas, most people are not going to do that.

00:51:33 ◼   ► They're not going to run coding agents.

00:51:35 ◼   ► They have no idea what MCP is.

00:51:37 ◼   ► However, and this is also something that I said at the end,

00:51:40 ◼   ► what will be interesting for me will be actually seeing what people think of Siri AI for world knowledge

00:51:51 ◼   ► and just regular usage.

00:51:53 ◼   ► Because those many, many people using ChatGPT for free, they really do use it.

00:51:59 ◼   ► They have long conversations.

00:52:01 ◼   ► They have folders of chats.

00:52:03 ◼   ► They actually use it a lot.

00:52:06 ◼   ► And they do complex searches.

00:52:08 ◼   ► And this is what I said in the story.

00:52:09 ◼   ► They're not stupid.

00:52:10 ◼   ► Being a normal, being a non-power user does not equal being just this silly person going around me like,

00:52:20 ◼   ► ah, I don't know how to use a phone.

00:52:22 ◼   ► No.

00:52:22 ◼   ► Like, regular people, they know what they're doing, right?

00:52:25 ◼   ► And so, when they have a long conversation with GPT Instant or regular ChatGPT,

00:52:30 ◼   ► and then they do the same thing with Siri AI, will they say, oh, man, I gotta tell you, Siri AI, really smart, gave me a lot of options.

00:52:37 ◼   ► Or are they gonna say, yeah, it's better.

00:52:40 ◼   ► Like, it definitely doesn't suck anymore, but I still prefer having conversations with ChatGPT.

00:52:45 ◼   ► Like, is that gonna happen?

00:52:47 ◼   ► I think it's a lot like Apple's productivity apps, right?

00:52:51 ◼   ► Like, there are people who rely on a need, to-do-ist, omni-focus things, but there are billions of people who run their whole lives out of reminders, right?

00:53:01 ◼   ► Some people want Notion or Obsidian or the ghost of Evernote.

00:53:06 ◼   ► Billions of people use Apple Notes, and it's perfectly fine for all of them.

00:53:11 ◼   ► And I kind of think that's where Siri AI has sort of landed in a similar place.

00:53:16 ◼   ► Like, what a lot of people want and need out of an assistant like this, it can do.

00:53:22 ◼   ► But if you're gonna use it for, if you want to use an AI tool for software development or coding or something like that, Apple's leaving, that's other tools you can go use, right?

00:53:34 ◼   ► And I don't see anything wrong with that at all.

00:53:36 ◼   ► In fact, I think it really fits in with Apple's sort of ethos on how software, how their software in particular should work.

00:53:42 ◼   ► Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense.

00:53:45 ◼   ► You know, I think that Siri AI accomplishes the base level of expectation from Siri, which Siri has not done until now.

00:53:59 ◼   ► It answers some promises they made, like, 15 years ago, in some ways.

00:54:04 ◼   ► And it does this in two ways.

00:54:06 ◼   ► If you ask it a question, it will give you an answer.

00:54:09 ◼   ► That's part one.

00:54:10 ◼   ► And most of the time, you ask it a question, and it will give you the correct answer.

00:54:15 ◼   ► Old Siri would fail often on both of those.

00:54:20 ◼   ► Sometimes it just would not give you an answer, right?

00:54:24 ◼   ► Like, it would be like, go look on the web.

00:54:26 ◼   ► It's like, that's not what I want to do.

00:54:28 ◼   ► I could have done that.

00:54:29 ◼   ► I could have opened Google and searched, you know?

00:54:32 ◼   ► So I think it succeeds in that area.

00:54:36 ◼   ► And for me, it's like, I feel like I've kind of developed over the last month and a bit or whatever, a kind of two-tier system where it's like anything basic, any simple question, I'm just asking Siri.

00:54:51 ◼   ► Plus, all of the benefits that Siri has, like Federico mentioned, like, using the camera and all that kind of stuff.

00:54:57 ◼   ► Asking it questions that I believe the answers will be in my email.

00:55:02 ◼   ► And as time goes on, assumedly, that will only broaden as more third-party apps that I use integrate with it.

00:55:09 ◼   ► So it will kind of, like, stretch out the kinds of questions I would ask.

00:55:13 ◼   ► Anything complex, I go to Claude.

00:55:17 ◼   ► Anything work-related, I go to Claude.

00:55:20 ◼   ► Anything, like, if I need some serious research for something done, I go to Claude.

00:55:24 ◼   ► But what that has meant is I do not use ChatGPT anymore.

00:55:29 ◼   ► That's what ChatGPT was doing for me.

00:55:31 ◼   ► So I just don't use it anymore because I use Siri AI for all of my kind of general searching because it performs the job adequately.

00:55:39 ◼   ► Is it the best?

00:55:41 ◼   ► No.

00:55:41 ◼   ► But I get what I need.

00:55:43 ◼   ► And then there's just, like, a lot of niceties, like, the simple things that it will do.

00:55:47 ◼   ► Like, I can access it from anywhere on my phone no matter what I'm doing.

00:55:51 ◼   ► I can say, what am I looking at?

00:55:52 ◼   ► And it will answer it, you know, like, just by looking at the screen.

00:55:55 ◼   ► And it will allow follow-up questions and all of this kind of stuff.

00:56:00 ◼   ► And so, like, I think it will be a successful product because it performs the very basic level of things and is obviously so well integrated into the system.

00:56:11 ◼   ► Like, I have found, and I encourage people to do this at any point that they get iOS 27.

00:56:19 ◼   ► Forget everything that you know about Siri.

00:56:23 ◼   ► Ignore every interaction you've ever had before that didn't go the way that you wanted.

00:56:28 ◼   ► Like, just forget about it.

00:56:30 ◼   ► And start over.

00:56:31 ◼   ► And I believe you'll be impressed.

00:56:32 ◼   ► Because that's how I have gone into this beta so far.

00:56:35 ◼   ► Of, like, I'm just going to ask my phone questions all the time.

00:56:38 ◼   ► And there are very few situations where I am disappointed in the answer that I get.

00:56:44 ◼   ► And often I'm like, oh, that worked.

00:56:47 ◼   ► So I think that they have built a much better system.

00:56:50 ◼   ► It does not compete with the quality of a lot of these larger models do, as Federica's pointing out.

00:56:57 ◼   ► But, like, at least from my perspective, I never expected that at all.

00:57:02 ◼   ► And I think that the quality of Siri AI has exceeded my expectation.

00:57:09 ◼   ► Like, I think it is closer to matching what I believed was going to happen when I saw the keynote.

00:57:15 ◼   ► And that is so rare, right?

00:57:17 ◼   ► That, like, you see something in the keynote and you're like, wow, this looks amazing.

00:57:21 ◼   ► And then you use it and you're like, ah, there's loads of caveats.

00:57:24 ◼   ► And I don't really feel like I'm hitting those.

00:57:26 ◼   ► And there's questions.

00:57:28 ◼   ► But we just don't, there's no way to know the answers to these.

00:57:32 ◼   ► Like, I'll read it from Federico's article.

00:57:35 ◼   ► Like, this is the big question.

00:57:38 ◼   ► Is Apple's on-device index a solid technological foundation or not?

00:57:42 ◼   ► Is this system going to work at scale for users of dozens of apps installed,

00:57:46 ◼   ► each donating their data to the index, perhaps spanning multiple years of content?

00:57:50 ◼   ► And can the cloud models, which are not using MCP,

00:57:53 ◼   ► but appear to be based on a plain JSON schema for structured data, make sense of it all?

00:57:58 ◼   ► We just don't know.

00:57:59 ◼   ► But maybe.

00:58:01 ◼   ► Maybe.

00:58:02 ◼   ► Maybe.

00:58:04 ◼   ► The thing is, they have this, it also, something that I should have added to the article.

00:58:12 ◼   ► It's not just about the cloud models working.

00:58:17 ◼   ► It's also about them working.

00:58:19 ◼   ► But it's also about the on-device model making an evaluation, making a decision

00:58:26 ◼   ► about the data that needs to be passed to the cloud one.

00:58:32 ◼   ► The on-device model will say, ah, the user is asking about email about Spain from 2024.

00:58:41 ◼   ► The user has such and such email absence.

00:58:43 ◼   ► Like, it's about the cloud models making sense of all of that.

00:58:47 ◼   ► But it's also about the on-device model making a decision up front, right?

00:58:52 ◼   ► This is what they're doing here.

00:58:55 ◼   ► They have these multiple layers of models making decisions.

00:58:59 ◼   ► And if the first link in the chain doesn't work right, then it's going to have a cascade

00:59:05 ◼   ► effect on the answers that you get later, right?

00:59:08 ◼   ► And so that's also what makes it interesting to see what Apple is going to do with these

00:59:13 ◼   ► on-device models.

00:59:14 ◼   ► Are they going to...

00:59:15 ◼   ► These things, they move so fast, right?

00:59:18 ◼   ► Are we going to get stuck with like a couple of updates per year?

00:59:22 ◼   ► Are they going to update to these models more frequently?

00:59:24 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:59:26 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:59:27 ◼   ► It seems to be doing a good enough job.

00:59:30 ◼   ► Like, if you ask me right now, one out of ten, what's Siri AI?

00:59:35 ◼   ► I would give you a solid seven from my perspective.

00:59:37 ◼   ► I mean, again...

00:59:39 ◼   ► Coming from zero.

00:59:40 ◼   ► Let's go two months back, right?

00:59:43 ◼   ► And you'd say, you would give Siri a seven out of ten?

00:59:47 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:59:48 ◼   ► Like, whoa!

00:59:49 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:59:49 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:59:50 ◼   ► You've hit your head.

00:59:50 ◼   ► Right?

00:59:51 ◼   ► You know, what has happened here?

00:59:52 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:59:53 ◼   ► The problem is that, especially in the press, the narrative is often controlled by people

00:59:58 ◼   ► who are used to tens, not sevens.

01:00:02 ◼   ► Sure.

01:00:03 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:00:04 ◼   ► You're my ten, Federico.

01:00:05 ◼   ► I know.

01:00:06 ◼   ► We spoke about this leading into WVDC.

01:00:10 ◼   ► Like, should they change the name?

01:00:13 ◼   ► Like, is the Siri brand so tarnished?

01:00:17 ◼   ► And, you know, we didn't really revisit that, but what they did is, like, they changed it

01:00:22 ◼   ► just enough.

01:00:23 ◼   ► Like, it's Siri AI, so it's familiar.

01:00:26 ◼   ► It works the same way as Siri always has, but it's been proved by this new technology sort

01:00:33 ◼   ► of fused into it.

01:00:34 ◼   ► And I think, in hindsight, they made the right call there.

01:00:38 ◼   ► I mean, there were good points on both sides of that debate.

01:00:41 ◼   ► Like, the brand is extremely well-known, and do you want to throw all that away versus, yeah,

01:00:48 ◼   ► but it's mocked, right?

01:00:49 ◼   ► It's a punchline on SNL sometimes.

01:00:51 ◼   ► Like, what do you do about that?

01:00:53 ◼   ► And I agree with you.

01:00:56 ◼   ► It has fulfilled the promise that they made all those years ago, and I have, I mean, I

01:01:02 ◼   ► think, Mike, I think you said this, but, like, you've had to really get into the practice

01:01:09 ◼   ► of using it, because I just wasn't using it.

01:01:11 ◼   ► Like, I was setting timers with it, and that was it, you know?

01:01:15 ◼   ► But kind of reminding myself that it's there and using it.

01:01:21 ◼   ► And honestly, one reason I installed the watchOS beta was to try to incorporate that more.

01:01:28 ◼   ► And I think a seven, I think it's a good, I think it's a good score.

01:01:32 ◼   ► So, it's saying about watchOS, I knew this was the case, but still, like, the Siri AI app

01:01:38 ◼   ► that you can just go and read the conversations you've had, that's great.

01:01:43 ◼   ► Like, that's a great UI.

01:01:44 ◼   ► Like, I knew it was the case, but I wasn't expecting it.

01:01:48 ◼   ► But I think that that is a very nice little thing that you can have, as well as, like,

01:01:53 ◼   ► asking it questions.

01:01:54 ◼   ► You can just go and read the answers to questions you previously asked, carry on those conversations.

01:01:58 ◼   ► Like, that's quite impressive that they've managed to do that.

01:02:03 ◼   ► Okay, so, something needs to be scored.

01:02:07 ◼   ► So, a year ago, on episode 561 of this show, Federico and I, and OTJ, who I found out was

01:02:19 ◼   ► a junior today, didn't know that.

01:02:21 ◼   ► OTJJR?

01:02:23 ◼   ► Yeah, OTJ.

01:02:27 ◼   ► So, yeah, John Voorhees Jr., I found this out by listening to NPC.

01:02:30 ◼   ► So, there you go.

01:02:31 ◼   ► What in the world?

01:02:32 ◼   ► So, OTJ Jr., we played the first ever Stephenlympics.

01:02:37 ◼   ► Ah, that was a year ago?

01:02:39 ◼   ► Wow.

01:02:39 ◼   ► Yes.

01:02:39 ◼   ► So, this was based on the Teachylympics that had been played either earlier that year or

01:02:45 ◼   ► the year before.

01:02:46 ◼   ► Stephen was away for an episode, so we made a selection of predictions that Stephen doesn't

01:02:51 ◼   ► know that we made.

01:02:53 ◼   ► And I would now like to score those predictions.

01:02:55 ◼   ► Stephen, I still do not want you to look at this document.

01:02:58 ◼   ► Yeah, I won't.

01:02:58 ◼   ► We will go through these together.

01:02:59 ◼   ► I hid an ocean, so I'm flying blind.

01:03:03 ◼   ► So, some of these I have already scored.

01:03:06 ◼   ► Some of them, because I know the answers to these things, some of them I need your help

01:03:11 ◼   ► on them.

01:03:12 ◼   ► But you can tell me yes or no anyway.

01:03:15 ◼   ► But I have been scoring them over the course of the year, so there might even be some things

01:03:19 ◼   ► you forget about yourself, which will be fun for us all to find out.

01:03:21 ◼   ► So, OTJ had the first pick, and he said, Stephen goes back to a two or more Mac setup.

01:03:28 ◼   ► Yes, I got the downstairs computer, the MacBook Neo.

01:03:33 ◼   ► The downstairs computer, indeed.

01:03:35 ◼   ► So, that is one point to OTJ.

01:03:38 ◼   ► My first round pick was, Stephen goes back to a desktop Mac.

01:03:43 ◼   ► Nope.

01:03:45 ◼   ► My main machine is still my M4 Mac MacBook Pro I bought a couple years ago.

01:03:51 ◼   ► So, Stephen, this is Federico's first round pick, Stephen will end up buying both an iPhone

01:03:58 ◼   ► 17 Air and iPhone 17 Pro within the span of 12 months.

01:04:02 ◼   ► I bought them the same day.

01:04:04 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:04:04 ◼   ► And you've gone backwards and forwards on them, which is fun.

01:04:08 ◼   ► Okay, my second round pick.

01:04:11 ◼   ► When reading this pick, Stephen will confess to another piece of technology that he has broken

01:04:18 ◼   ► in the last year and not told us about.

01:04:21 ◼   ► Did this happen?

01:04:23 ◼   ► I don't know, but this is what we need.

01:04:25 ◼   ► Yeah, Stephen, in the last year, have you broken any technology?

01:04:28 ◼   ► I have not.

01:04:29 ◼   ► No, I was just thinking through it.

01:04:30 ◼   ► Are you sure about this?

01:04:31 ◼   ► Yeah, my wife broke her iPhone 17, but that doesn't count.

01:04:35 ◼   ► You didn't have anything to do with that?

01:04:37 ◼   ► I did not.

01:04:37 ◼   ► In fact, I picked it up.

01:04:38 ◼   ► I was like, when did you do this?

01:04:39 ◼   ► And she was like, three days ago.

01:04:40 ◼   ► I was like, okay.

01:04:43 ◼   ► No, I have not.

01:04:44 ◼   ► I have not broken anything.

01:04:45 ◼   ► Okay.

01:04:46 ◼   ► Federico said, Stephen will go to WWDC 2026.

01:04:51 ◼   ► Nope.

01:04:52 ◼   ► I tried.

01:04:53 ◼   ► He tried.

01:04:53 ◼   ► And the airline denied me two days in a row, so I gave up.

01:04:57 ◼   ► He tried.

01:04:58 ◼   ► And John's was, Stephen will start a home improvement project with a technology goal.

01:05:04 ◼   ► This is correct.

01:05:05 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

01:05:06 ◼   ► The whole networking thing.

01:05:08 ◼   ► Yeah, I networked my whole new house.

01:05:10 ◼   ► Now, what was unfair about John making this pick is we knew you were moving.

01:05:17 ◼   ► Oh.

01:05:18 ◼   ► Right?

01:05:19 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:05:20 ◼   ► But the world did not know you were moving.

01:05:23 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:05:23 ◼   ► So John was dastardly here, I would say.

01:05:26 ◼   ► I mean, just like a junior would be, really.

01:05:29 ◼   ► Yes.

01:05:29 ◼   ► That is a junior move.

01:05:31 ◼   ► It is.

01:05:31 ◼   ► It is.

01:05:32 ◼   ► All you juniors out there know what I mean.

01:05:34 ◼   ► Mike, I think John is sweeping this, actually.

01:05:37 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:05:38 ◼   ► It is not looking good for us.

01:05:39 ◼   ► So far, John has two picks, two correct answers.

01:05:43 ◼   ► I have zero, and Federico has one, and we are going into the final round of main picks.

01:05:48 ◼   ► We then have some passion picks that are just for fun.

01:05:51 ◼   ► Federico says, Stephen will assemble a gallery of liquid glass design evolution throughout the beta process.

01:05:58 ◼   ► I am so disappointed, Stephen, that you haven't done this.

01:06:01 ◼   ► Yeah, I just, I haven't done much with it.

01:06:05 ◼   ► I felt like it was done really well by, like, basic Apple guy and other people, like all the icons and stuff.

01:06:12 ◼   ► And so I kind of just let it go by.

01:06:14 ◼   ► You had too much work on your hands with the Finder.

01:06:18 ◼   ► You know, look, I want to go out on top, right?

01:06:21 ◼   ► I got the Tahoe Finder icon fixed, and, you know, sometimes you just got to step away at the top of your game.

01:06:28 ◼   ► John's last round pick was, Stephen will switch email clients on the iPhone.

01:06:35 ◼   ► I am using a beta of a mail app that was not a beta last year, so yes.

01:06:41 ◼   ► There you go.

01:06:41 ◼   ► You can just say you're using Mimestream.

01:06:43 ◼   ► I'm using Mimestream on the phone.

01:06:44 ◼   ► Everyone knows that it's a thing that exists.

01:06:45 ◼   ► It's really good.

01:06:45 ◼   ► There's like an open application process to be on the test flight.

01:06:48 ◼   ► Is it?

01:06:49 ◼   ► Okay, I haven't paid attention.

01:06:49 ◼   ► Yeah, Mimestream is very good on the iPhone.

01:06:51 ◼   ► Goodbye, Apple Mail.

01:06:53 ◼   ► God, he jungle all of them.

01:06:54 ◼   ► Jeez.

01:06:56 ◼   ► Ridiculous.

01:06:56 ◼   ► All of them.

01:06:57 ◼   ► John.

01:06:57 ◼   ► My final pick was, when reading this, Stephen has a mustache and a shaved head.

01:07:03 ◼   ► I do have a mustache, but no, not a shaved head.

01:07:07 ◼   ► I'm really happy about the mustache, though.

01:07:09 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:07:09 ◼   ► You haven't seen me.

01:07:10 ◼   ► So I got nothing.

01:07:11 ◼   ► I got zero.

01:07:12 ◼   ► Wow.

01:07:13 ◼   ► Wow.

01:07:13 ◼   ► You're supposedly, you know.

01:07:15 ◼   ► Yeah, I don't know you at all.

01:07:15 ◼   ► I was your best man at your wedding.

01:07:16 ◼   ► You don't even know me.

01:07:17 ◼   ► No, I don't know.

01:07:19 ◼   ► You see how things have changed?

01:07:20 ◼   ► I mean, let's be honest about this.

01:07:22 ◼   ► The three things that I picked, they're very Stephen things.

01:07:26 ◼   ► You just didn't happen to do them this year.

01:07:28 ◼   ► All of the picks are good.

01:07:29 ◼   ► Like, what I've learned is I'm extremely predictable.

01:07:31 ◼   ► Yes.

01:07:32 ◼   ► Like, all right.

01:07:32 ◼   ► Well, we're not done.

01:07:33 ◼   ► Okay.

01:07:34 ◼   ► So John wins.

01:07:35 ◼   ► Okay.

01:07:36 ◼   ► At three points.

01:07:37 ◼   ► Federico, you got one and I got zero.

01:07:39 ◼   ► Congratulations, Junior.

01:07:41 ◼   ► Real Junior move.

01:07:41 ◼   ► Congratulations, John Junior.

01:07:43 ◼   ► So this was the O2J's passion picks.

01:07:46 ◼   ► Stephen will upgrade his NAS setup, which you definitely did.

01:07:50 ◼   ► I'm sure you did that.

01:07:51 ◼   ► It's the same NAS as I had.

01:07:52 ◼   ► You haven't stopped adding.

01:07:53 ◼   ► No, the NAS itself is the same as it was.

01:07:56 ◼   ► I've had it like a year and a half.

01:07:56 ◼   ► You haven't changed the setup?

01:07:57 ◼   ► I mean, the network has been upgraded around it, but the NAS is the same.

01:08:01 ◼   ► Okay.

01:08:02 ◼   ► I don't think that was what John meant, so he's wrong.

01:08:05 ◼   ► Stephen will install something in his truck, which is true.

01:08:09 ◼   ► You have done this.

01:08:10 ◼   ► I marked it when you did it.

01:08:11 ◼   ► I don't remember what it was, but you did it.

01:08:13 ◼   ► I did exhaust.

01:08:13 ◼   ► Yeah, he sent us photos at some point.

01:08:16 ◼   ► You're always adding something to the truck.

01:08:18 ◼   ► It's like a constant thing.

01:08:19 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:08:20 ◼   ► It's true.

01:08:21 ◼   ► Stephen installs a weather station.

01:08:23 ◼   ► No, but I desperately want to.

01:08:25 ◼   ► I'm surprised John didn't buy you a weather station.

01:08:30 ◼   ► I know.

01:08:30 ◼   ► Yeah, John.

01:08:31 ◼   ► That's one way to ensure the point.

01:08:34 ◼   ► It's like, hey, I got you this.

01:08:35 ◼   ► No reason.

01:08:36 ◼   ► That is technically against the rules, though.

01:08:38 ◼   ► We're not allowed to influence you.

01:08:40 ◼   ► You're not supposed to.

01:08:40 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:08:40 ◼   ► Although I did accidentally influence you.

01:08:44 ◼   ► I really encouraged you to buy the MacBook Neo.

01:08:47 ◼   ► You did.

01:08:47 ◼   ► But you were going to do that.

01:08:49 ◼   ► I was going to do it anyways.

01:08:50 ◼   ► Yeah, that's insider trading, really, I think.

01:08:52 ◼   ► Fourth pick.

01:08:54 ◼   ► Stephen takes apart a major household appliance.

01:08:57 ◼   ► Major household, like a washing machine?

01:09:03 ◼   ► Washing machine, fridge.

01:09:04 ◼   ► All these things Stephen has done.

01:09:07 ◼   ► I have done them, but not in the last year.

01:09:09 ◼   ► Wow.

01:09:10 ◼   ► And finally, Stephen assembles shelving.

01:09:14 ◼   ► Yes, just this weekend for one of my kids.

01:09:17 ◼   ► You'd already done it.

01:09:19 ◼   ► I already marked it.

01:09:20 ◼   ► Again, again, y'all knew I was moving.

01:09:23 ◼   ► So that feels like a...

01:09:24 ◼   ► And John really took advantage of that.

01:09:26 ◼   ► He really did.

01:09:26 ◼   ► Just like a lawyer, you know.

01:09:28 ◼   ► So that's two out of five on the passion picks.

01:09:30 ◼   ► Okay.

01:09:31 ◼   ► Here are mine.

01:09:32 ◼   ► Stephen's next computer has more than eight terabytes of SSD storage.

01:09:36 ◼   ► Unfortunately, it was a MacBook Neo.

01:09:39 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:09:40 ◼   ► If you could have, I know you would have.

01:09:42 ◼   ► The opposite.

01:09:42 ◼   ► But you didn't.

01:09:43 ◼   ► The opposite.

01:09:44 ◼   ► Actually, I could go...

01:09:46 ◼   ► I mean, I'm not buying a computer anytime soon.

01:09:47 ◼   ► But when I do, I could go back down to four terabytes.

01:09:50 ◼   ► Thanks to the NAS.

01:09:50 ◼   ► But you won't.

01:09:51 ◼   ► You could, but you won't.

01:09:52 ◼   ► It's going to be $4,000 to storage.

01:09:54 ◼   ► Yeah, you'll find a way.

01:09:55 ◼   ► Stephen launches another Kickstarter campaign.

01:09:58 ◼   ► He did not do that.

01:09:59 ◼   ► No, but close.

01:10:00 ◼   ► I mean, the Apple history calendar is back for sale.

01:10:02 ◼   ► Yep.

01:10:03 ◼   ► You launched a Kickstarter campaign.

01:10:05 ◼   ► I know.

01:10:06 ◼   ► I know.

01:10:06 ◼   ► But that wasn't on the cards.

01:10:09 ◼   ► Number three.

01:10:10 ◼   ► Stephen buys and returns at least one iPhone from the 2025 lineup.

01:10:15 ◼   ► Nope.

01:10:16 ◼   ► You didn't return anything?

01:10:17 ◼   ► Nope.

01:10:17 ◼   ► God, this is terrible.

01:10:19 ◼   ► Okay.

01:10:19 ◼   ► Stephen digs another trench.

01:10:24 ◼   ► I need to, but I have not done it yet.

01:10:26 ◼   ► Oh, come on.

01:10:27 ◼   ► Because you, basically in the span of 12 months, you had dug two trenches.

01:10:32 ◼   ► I did.

01:10:33 ◼   ► For both fiber and sewage.

01:10:34 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:10:35 ◼   ► I was in a real trench mode.

01:10:38 ◼   ► Mike, you really don't know Stephen.

01:10:40 ◼   ► Turns out.

01:10:40 ◼   ► Well, no, see, I know these are all Stephen things.

01:10:43 ◼   ► No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

01:10:44 ◼   ► No, what I'm trying to say is you used to know Stephen.

01:10:47 ◼   ► I used to know.

01:10:48 ◼   ► There was somebody that I used to know.

01:10:49 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:10:50 ◼   ► Oh, man.

01:10:51 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:10:51 ◼   ► Is that the best song from that era?

01:10:53 ◼   ► It could be.

01:10:54 ◼   ► It could be.

01:10:54 ◼   ► I don't know what the era was.

01:10:55 ◼   ► Might as well, yeah.

01:10:56 ◼   ► The 2010s.

01:10:57 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:10:58 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:10:58 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:10:58 ◼   ► And finally, and this was influenced by me, Stephen will not win the Relay Co-Founders

01:11:04 ◼   ► Championship at the Podcast-a-thon.

01:11:06 ◼   ► But I got way too excited and gave it away in the last minute.

01:11:09 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:10 ◼   ► Then I won the whole thing.

01:11:11 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:12 ◼   ► Which brings me to my first passion pick.

01:11:15 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:16 ◼   ► Stephen will win the Relay Co-Founders Championship this year.

01:11:20 ◼   ► That's right.

01:11:20 ◼   ► I did.

01:11:21 ◼   ► If you haven't seen the last 45 seconds of the Podcast-a-thon, go watch it.

01:11:25 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:26 ◼   ► You're basically the Messi of the Relay Co-Founders Championship.

01:11:30 ◼   ► Of using a sledgehammer to win Jenga.

01:11:33 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:36 ◼   ► Mike, I'm so sorry for England's loss.

01:11:38 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:39 ◼   ► Oh, I wasn't even watching it.

01:11:41 ◼   ► I'm fine with it.

01:11:42 ◼   ► It was rough.

01:11:42 ◼   ► It is what it is.

01:11:43 ◼   ► It is what it is.

01:11:44 ◼   ► Then I said, Stephen, so this is an interesting one.

01:11:49 ◼   ► Stephen will finish at least one game on the analog N64 console.

01:11:56 ◼   ► No, I mean, I've been playing Mario Kart and I've been playing-

01:11:59 ◼   ► Yeah, but not finished.

01:12:00 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:12:01 ◼   ► I'm a multiplayer guy on the 64 more than anything else.

01:12:04 ◼   ► It's impossible to finish the multiplayer.

01:12:05 ◼   ► It is.

01:12:06 ◼   ► Friendships never end.

01:12:08 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:12:09 ◼   ► Stephen sees either Yellow Card or Death Cab for Cutie again.

01:12:16 ◼   ► In the last year?

01:12:17 ◼   ► In the last year.

01:12:18 ◼   ► Was it within the last year?

01:12:19 ◼   ► No, I saw Death Cab two years ago.

01:12:21 ◼   ► I saw Linkin Park in the last year.

01:12:22 ◼   ► I should have said Linkin Park.

01:12:24 ◼   ► Which was just mind-blowing.

01:12:26 ◼   ► I should have said Linkin Park.

01:12:29 ◼   ► Stephen hurts himself trying to do some physical work.

01:12:34 ◼   ► You did.

01:12:35 ◼   ► So, in February of 2025, and this may have been September, that's the day, I made a note

01:12:43 ◼   ► that said, Stephen cut his foot trying to disable a sprinkler.

01:12:46 ◼   ► Yes.

01:12:47 ◼   ► Yep.

01:12:48 ◼   ► I did do that.

01:12:49 ◼   ► Man.

01:12:50 ◼   ► There you go.

01:12:50 ◼   ► There he was right.

01:12:51 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:12:52 ◼   ► And finally, I said, one of Stephen's old pieces of Apple gear gets misplaced.

01:12:59 ◼   ► So, once again, you were moving, right?

01:13:02 ◼   ► And that was my thought.

01:13:03 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:13:04 ◼   ► I mean, that's probably true.

01:13:05 ◼   ► I'm trying to think of something specific that I've looked for.

01:13:08 ◼   ► How would you know?

01:13:09 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:13:10 ◼   ► I think I'd give it to you.

01:13:12 ◼   ► It's probably true, but I'm not sure I could tell you exactly what it is.

01:13:15 ◼   ► But yeah, there's some disorganization going on right now.

01:13:18 ◼   ► Federico won the Passion Picks with three to two, and I got nothing correct.

01:13:23 ◼   ► Wow.

01:13:24 ◼   ► Wow.

01:13:25 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:13:26 ◼   ► How does that?

01:13:27 ◼   ► Man, that kind of hurts.

01:13:28 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:13:29 ◼   ► Well, let's see how you do in what I'm assuming is called the Mikelympics that you played at

01:13:34 ◼   ► some point where I was told I was when I was in May.

01:13:38 ◼   ► Oh, did we?

01:13:39 ◼   ► Did we?

01:13:39 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:13:39 ◼   ► We did.

01:13:40 ◼   ► Hold on.

01:13:41 ◼   ► Hold on.

01:13:41 ◼   ► Let me...

01:13:42 ◼   ► What episode number, Stephen?

01:13:43 ◼   ► 603.

01:13:43 ◼   ► I have an interdoist.

01:13:46 ◼   ► Don't look.

01:13:46 ◼   ► Because it makes me really want to look.

01:13:49 ◼   ► Oh, no, no, no, no.

01:13:50 ◼   ► Hold on, hold on.

01:13:52 ◼   ► Just a quick vibe check.

01:13:53 ◼   ► Let's see.

01:13:54 ◼   ► Some of these picks have happened, I think.

01:13:59 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

01:14:00 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

01:14:02 ◼   ► Wow.

01:14:02 ◼   ► Already?

01:14:02 ◼   ► Something in two months?

01:14:05 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:14:05 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:14:06 ◼   ► I'm looking good, I think.

01:14:07 ◼   ► You guys don't have a lot of future.

01:14:09 ◼   ► There are some things in here that the price hikes may have hurt, but we'll see.

01:14:13 ◼   ► I think I am looking good so far for you.

01:14:17 ◼   ► I don't know.

01:14:17 ◼   ► Never underestimate my ability to spend money.

01:14:19 ◼   ► Yeah, we know.

01:14:22 ◼   ► I have a steam machine now.

01:14:24 ◼   ► Yeah?

01:14:25 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:14:25 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:14:28 ◼   ► Also, in May, we have to judge Jobs for John, where we gave John Ternus assignments.

01:14:37 ◼   ► Jobs for John.

01:14:39 ◼   ► Jobs for John.

01:14:40 ◼   ► John's jobs.

01:14:42 ◼   ► John's jobs.

01:14:43 ◼   ► John's job jobs.

01:14:45 ◼   ► That is so soon, by the way.

01:14:47 ◼   ► May?

01:14:48 ◼   ► I was planning something.

01:14:50 ◼   ► No, no, no.

01:14:50 ◼   ► Ternus taking over.

01:14:52 ◼   ► It's so soon.

01:14:53 ◼   ► It's like six weeks away or something.

01:14:56 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

01:14:58 ◼   ► I'm looking forward to September.

01:14:59 ◼   ► Wow.

01:14:59 ◼   ► September's going to be exciting.

01:15:01 ◼   ► It is.

01:15:02 ◼   ► I think that's it.

01:15:04 ◼   ► I think we're good.

01:15:05 ◼   ► All right.

01:15:05 ◼   ► All right.

01:15:06 ◼   ► Thank you so much for listening to episode 612 of Connected.

01:15:11 ◼   ► If you want to find links to stuff we spoke about, they're in your podcast player.

01:15:14 ◼   ► A couple special links in there.

01:15:16 ◼   ► You can leave us feedback or follow up.

01:15:19 ◼   ► There's a form on the Relay website.

01:15:21 ◼   ► You can get to it at connectedfeedback.com.

01:15:23 ◼   ► Drop us a note.

01:15:25 ◼   ► And, of course, you can get Connected Pro, the longer and ad-free version of the show

01:15:29 ◼   ► that we do each and every week.

01:15:31 ◼   ► There's a deal going on right now on annual memberships.

01:15:33 ◼   ► That information is also in the show notes.

01:15:35 ◼   ► If you want to find more of Federico, he is the editor-in-chief of MacStories.net.

01:15:43 ◼   ► If you haven't checked out their public beta coverage, really good.

01:15:47 ◼   ► I learned, actually, a lot of stuff about Vision OS and Watch OS in particular

01:15:51 ◼   ► that I had not kind of flown by me during WVC.

01:15:54 ◼   ► So, great job on those, as always.

01:15:56 ◼   ► You can find Mike across a bunch of shows here at Relay

01:16:00 ◼   ► and his work at Cortex Brand and his writing at theenthusiast.net.

01:16:05 ◼   ► You ought to bring back the Good News Friday feels post, Mike.

01:16:10 ◼   ► Yeah, I should.

01:16:12 ◼   ► I've just had too much going on.

01:16:14 ◼   ► I miss him.

01:16:14 ◼   ► I will.

01:16:15 ◼   ► I have a task every Friday.

01:16:16 ◼   ► And then some Fridays, I'm like, sorry, everyone.

01:16:19 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:16:19 ◼   ► And then I just mark it complete.

01:16:20 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:16:21 ◼   ► You could maybe write about the MacBook Air.

01:16:23 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

01:16:25 ◼   ► I don't know what to say.

01:16:27 ◼   ► I think I've said everything I want to say about that computer, to be honest.

01:16:29 ◼   ► And I will never call it that, so please stop trying to do that.

01:16:34 ◼   ► You can find my writing at 512pixels.net.

01:16:37 ◼   ► I'd like to thank our sponsor this week, Squarespace, for making the show possible.

01:16:41 ◼   ► I'd like to thank you for listening.

01:16:43 ◼   ► And until next week, guys, say goodbye.

01:16:45 ◼   ► Adios.

01:16:47 ◼   ► Cheerio.