Connected

00:00:00 ◼   ► Hey guys, it's Stephen. Before the show started, I wanted to take a little time and remind

00:00:04 ◼   ► everybody that September is National Childhood Cancer Awareness Month. Here in 2014, cancer

00:00:10 ◼   ► is still the leading cause of death for children in the United States, despite amazing breakthroughs

00:00:15 ◼   ► in both medicine and science. At the forefront of this battle is St. Jude Children's Research

00:00:20 ◼   ► Hospital right here in Memphis, Tennessee, my own backyard. Each year, St. Jude treats

00:00:25 ◼   ► thousands of kids, including my own, without charging their families for a single appointment,

00:00:31 ◼   ► meal or night of housing.

00:00:33 ◼   ► All the research St. Jude does into the human genome, treatment options and more is freely

00:00:38 ◼   ► shared with the medical community at large.

00:00:41 ◼   ► St. Jude's operating costs are $2 million a day and the doors stay open at the generosity

00:00:46 ◼   ► of the public.

00:00:48 ◼   ► Let's make September about these kids, about my kid and these families.

00:00:53 ◼   ► You can learn more and donate at 512pixels.net/September.

00:00:58 ◼   ► Thanks.

00:00:59 ◼   ► [MUSIC PLAYING]

00:01:06 ◼   ► Hello and welcome to episode number three

00:01:09 ◼   ► of Connected on Relay FM.

00:01:11 ◼   ► Today is September 3, 2014.

00:01:14 ◼   ► This episode of Connected is brought to you by Igloo,

00:01:17 ◼   ► ICONIC, and Squarespace.

00:01:19 ◼   ► And we're going to tell you about those guys and gals

00:01:21 ◼   ► a little bit later on in the show.

00:01:23 ◼   ► My name is Myke Hurley.

00:01:24 ◼   ► Today I am joined by Mr. Steven Hackett.

00:01:27 ◼   ► Hello, sir.

00:01:28 ◼   ► - Hello, sir.

00:01:29 ◼   ► - And that is it.

00:01:30 ◼   ► - Federico's off celebrating.

00:01:34 ◼   ► - Federico's a party, listeners of The Prompt

00:01:39 ◼   ► may remember La Machina, which we spoke about before.

00:01:42 ◼   ► It's that time of year again.

00:01:44 ◼   ► So that's where Federico is.

00:01:46 ◼   ► He is at La Machina.

00:01:48 ◼   ► - Was that episode three last time?

00:01:51 ◼   ► No no episode 12 according to Google yeah so yes Federico will be back next

00:01:58 ◼   ► week we are joined by Jason Snell in a little while but first we have some

00:02:02 ◼   ► follow-up follow-up sorry yeah we don't do the sound anymore can't help it so

00:02:08 ◼   ► underscore David Smith did the best thing ever the best thing ever so good

00:02:14 ◼   ► so there is now a official Safari extension that switches episode numbers

00:02:19 ◼   ► on relay.fm to Roman numerals. Now it is all episode numbers so my

00:02:26 ◼   ► standpoint was this should just be connected but you should definitely

00:02:29 ◼   ► download this and change the way that our site works in your browser. You

00:02:33 ◼   ► shouldn't have a bias for one show anymore. But yeah. Technically they're

00:02:39 ◼   ► all your shows. I mean they're more my shows but they're... Wow. I'm on the

00:02:44 ◼   ► more what do you want from me I'm very tired I'm drawing my redrawing my

00:02:51 ◼   ► contract real quick you're gonna be my co-host on every show now yes okay cool

00:02:57 ◼   ► just checking so this is awesome and you should run it in Safari and if you don't

00:03:03 ◼   ► run Safari you should switch to Safari so you can do it I'm are you running it

00:03:06 ◼   ► Myke I'm running it I use Chrome so look at me I need Google Docs like what do

00:03:12 ◼   ► you want from me. It works in Yosemite Safari. Oh really? I'm in it

00:03:17 ◼   ► right now yeah it's great. What Google Docs? Yes because it does not work in

00:03:22 ◼   ► Safari and Mavericks at all. This is great news because it doesn't seem like

00:03:26 ◼   ► Chrome are gonna do a lot to support the new extensions in iOS so I probably will

00:03:31 ◼   ► want to switch back to Safari. Yes. But I like you know tab syncing and I like

00:03:36 ◼   ► shared history and that sort of stuff so yes so I'll be happy. The next

00:03:41 ◼   ► follow-up item is in our document called "Steven is a liar" and so Paul Lu on on

00:03:52 ◼   ► Twitter says "ismh you never said why you don't like my fitness pal" which is

00:03:57 ◼   ► true I think I said that I would say why I didn't like it but then I didn't say

00:04:01 ◼   ► why I didn't like it and now I will say why I don't like it. I don't know I

00:04:04 ◼   ► assumed Federico put that in there and said you were a liar I don't think it was me and that

00:04:09 ◼   ► That definitely seems like something you would say.

00:04:12 ◼   ► It's pretty funny.

00:04:14 ◼   ► So MyFitnessPal is, it's a fine app, I don't want to disparage any developer, but it does

00:04:22 ◼   ► some things that I don't really care for, especially on the marketing side.

00:04:27 ◼   ► Like they send a lot of emails and they're really big into the social end of it and I

00:04:32 ◼   ► don't particularly care if Myke knows how much I weigh.

00:04:35 ◼   ► Like I don't care for the social aspect of it and so LoseIt is a little more sort of

00:04:39 ◼   ► Solitary and lose it does do I think some social stuff on their website, but it's sort of a different thing

00:04:44 ◼   ► My fitness pal is great. It's extremely popular. It's just I like the way that lose it sort of works and looks

00:04:52 ◼   ► For me so not really anything like groundbreaking there, but it's kind of how it is just don't like how it looks I understand

00:05:01 ◼   ► What's next in the follow-up Stephen Hackett, oh yes next in the

00:05:09 ◼   ► follow up item is the iPod halo effect and so we spoke what two weeks ago about

00:05:16 ◼   ► the iPod and we kind of passed over it about the the iPod halo effect and so we

00:05:25 ◼   ► got some we got a link from Becky Hansmeyer who has this this great blog

00:05:31 ◼   ► post about her iPod collection and kind of how that how that sort of unfolded

00:05:38 ◼   ► over history, over history. And the the closing of this blog post really grabbed my attention.

00:05:43 ◼   ► And it was the iPod was more than a music player. It was my first real introduction

00:05:49 ◼   ► into all things Apple. It was prompted my first white iBook by a black MacBook and then

00:05:54 ◼   ► a MacBook Pro. And I think Becky story is really common that that people bought an iPod

00:06:02 ◼   ► and then ended up with a Mac. And we spoke a little bit about that even on the show with

00:06:07 ◼   ► Federico and and the kind of his his gateway into Apple and I I went the

00:06:13 ◼   ► iPod route you know I apologize I had and and then to the rest I am I was Mac

00:06:20 ◼   ► first but of course you were it but uh yeah so I took up this article for Mac

00:06:25 ◼   ► world from 2006 written by Jim Darrow pull about how the iPod changed Apple's

00:06:31 ◼   ► fortune. So in this article Jim talks about the Mac business at the time that

00:06:37 ◼   ► the iPod was introduced and then in the fourth quarter of 2006 you know 746

00:06:44 ◼   ► thousand Macs versus 1.6 million Macs and it's you know I think it's very

00:06:50 ◼   ► clear you look at those numbers and you look at stories like yours and Federico's

00:06:53 ◼   ► and Becky's and lots of other people the iPod really was a gateway drug to the

00:06:59 ◼   ► sort of Apple ecosystem and that's kind of what we mean by halo effect that you

00:07:03 ◼   ► know you you pick this one device and it radiates outward and I think that that's

00:07:08 ◼   ► definitely true of the iPod I think it's true to maybe a lesser degree for the

00:07:14 ◼   ► for the iPhone and iPad and I don't know about you Myke but I think the stuff

00:07:19 ◼   ► with iOS 8 and handoff and continuity and all that stuff like that's even a

00:07:22 ◼   ► bigger like a bigger push into making iOS you know kind of recapture some of

00:07:28 ◼   ► that. Definitely. I mean it was my story you know that that that's how I got into

00:07:34 ◼   ► all this stuff. Like the iPod wasn't just my kind of halo into Apple it was my

00:07:38 ◼   ► halo into technology really you know in general. It was a big thing for me.

00:07:44 ◼   ► Yeah and you know Apple's obviously a different company than they were in 2001

00:07:49 ◼   ► right. The Mac was if the Mac is the underdog now it definitely was in 2001.

00:07:54 ◼   ► I mean just the iMac was just two years old at that point and so it is a

00:07:59 ◼   ► different different world now but I still think that that Apple can benefit

00:08:03 ◼   ► from that you know Apple does best when the consumer is using kind of Apple

00:08:08 ◼   ► end-to-end right iCloud is that glue that holds these devices together and so

00:08:13 ◼   ► to look at the iPod or iPhone and say you know what like this is a great

00:08:16 ◼   ► device and they work well together but if you have a Mac like it really work

00:08:20 ◼   ► well together I could say it's a whole nother level of productivity and

00:08:24 ◼   ► integration, that's not a bad thing for Apple at all.

00:08:27 ◼   ► So we're about to take a break for our first sponsor of this

00:08:32 ◼   ► week's episode. And when we come back, we're going to be joined

00:08:35 ◼   ► by Mr. Jason Snell. So you can look forward to that. But first,

00:08:39 ◼   ► let me tell you about our friends over at Igloo. We do

00:08:44 ◼   ► love Igloo. Igloo have been with us since the start of the launch

00:08:47 ◼   ► of this fine podcast network of which Connected is a part of. So

00:08:52 ◼   ► Igloo is the internet that you will actually like because it's built with you in mind.

00:08:57 ◼   ► They have super easy to use apps like shared calendars, twitter-like micro blogs, file sharing

00:09:03 ◼   ► and oh so much more. And these all integrate into Igloo's fantastic internet platform and are really

00:09:08 ◼   ► simple to set up and configure to exactly how you need and want them to be. Everything that you're

00:09:13 ◼   ► going to need with Igloo is built right in and everything is social. This means that when you

00:09:17 ◼   ► upload a file to your igloo? Maybe you write a blog post or you upload a music track you've

00:09:24 ◼   ► been working on over the weekend to share with some co-workers. Your team can share it around

00:09:27 ◼   ► with each other, they can comment on it, rate it, like it. This is just like the social apps that

00:09:31 ◼   ► you're used to using every single day. It's like bringing those conventions, the stuff that you're

00:09:36 ◼   ► used to talking with your friends into your conversations with your co-workers too. It just

00:09:42 ◼   ► helps bridge that gap a little bit. With igloo's latest release you can also manage all of the

00:09:46 ◼   ► tasks that are associated with your content. Like, for example, updating the

00:09:51 ◼   ► show notes for this week's episode. I can give Stephen the task of doing all the

00:09:56 ◼   ► follow-up. I can give Federico the task of taking the week off if he likes. And I

00:10:02 ◼   ► can delegate actions after this week's show, you know, maybe to do some editing

00:10:06 ◼   ► or something like that to me if necessary. This is the type of stuff that

00:10:09 ◼   ► you can do in Igloo. You can give people little tasks to do and all of this is

00:10:13 ◼   ► integrated right into their intranet platform. And this was just released, this functionality,

00:10:17 ◼   ► out to all igloo customers with their most recent unicorn release. Igloo's task management is

00:10:22 ◼   ► designed for people. You can manage your projects, your personal to-dos and everything in between,

00:10:27 ◼   ► in one unified view, all inside your intranet. Igloo have really built something that's going

00:10:32 ◼   ► to help you keep on top of your work, as well as interact with your co-workers. If your company has

00:10:38 ◼   ► a legacy intranet built on SharePoint or old portal technology, you should be giving Igloo a try.

00:10:43 ◼   ► or if you just want to be more connected, more social, more productive in your workplace,

00:10:46 ◼   ► igloo is for you. And it is free to use with up to 10 people and you can sign up today

00:10:52 ◼   ► at igloosoftware.com/connected. Thank you so much for igloo for supporting us at this show

00:11:02 ◼   ► and all of Relay FM. We love you igloo, even if I can't say it sometimes. I just get so choked

00:11:08 ◼   ► up when I think about you. Show your support to them and us by going to igloosoftware.com/connected.

00:11:16 ◼   ► And we have a special guest today to talk about the September 9th event which is just

00:11:21 ◼   ► around the corner, the one and only Mr. Jason Snell. Hi Jason.

00:11:25 ◼   ► Hey guys, it's good to be here. You're back on relay after like, not even

00:11:29 ◼   ► a week. It's been a week. Another week, another relay

00:11:32 ◼   ► I just appear on I can't help it. I just I just love talking to you. So yeah

00:11:38 ◼   ► So I love I love the show and it's very weird to be on the other side of a show that I listen to

00:11:43 ◼   ► Regularly, so yeah, it's a sweat ear on this side, isn't it? It's kind of weird. I don't know. It's pretty pleasant over here

00:11:50 ◼   ► It's all air-conditioned and nice. It's plush. This is the plush new relay dot FM. Look at me. I live in California

00:11:56 ◼   ► No, I mean the pot your podcast network is plugging it forget it

00:12:02 ◼   ► - Well, this was a good show.

00:12:03 ◼   ► We should just...

00:12:04 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:12:05 ◼   ► - Bye, everybody.

00:12:06 ◼   ► - Yeah, so, Tuesday, little less than a week from now,

00:12:11 ◼   ► Apple's gonna have a little shindig

00:12:13 ◼   ► at the Flint Center, right?

00:12:17 ◼   ► Which is interesting.

00:12:17 ◼   ► - Flint Center, yeah.

00:12:18 ◼   ► They haven't been there since the iMac, the original iMac.

00:12:21 ◼   ► - Yeah, oh yeah, I guess you were there.

00:12:23 ◼   ► Did you fist bump?

00:12:24 ◼   ► - I wasn't there.

00:12:26 ◼   ► - No?

00:12:26 ◼   ► - No, actually, it's funny.

00:12:28 ◼   ► The event that Apple called before that,

00:12:30 ◼   ► And this was back before Apple events were a thing.

00:12:34 ◼   ► It was the dark times.

00:12:35 ◼   ► And they did something where they got all the press

00:12:37 ◼   ► to come to Cupertino for some briefing.

00:12:39 ◼   ► And it turned out there was no new hardware,

00:12:41 ◼   ► and it was some software initiative.

00:12:43 ◼   ► And I don't even remember what it was.

00:12:44 ◼   ► But I remember we all felt so ripped off

00:12:47 ◼   ► that when they did this next event, and they said, oh, no,

00:12:50 ◼   ► you need to come to this event.

00:12:52 ◼   ► It's going to be really good.

00:12:53 ◼   ► And we're like, sure, guys.

00:12:54 ◼   ► Sure, it's going to be good.

00:12:56 ◼   ► And we sent a token.

00:12:59 ◼   ► One person went to that event, and it turned out

00:13:02 ◼   ► to be the iMac, and we never missed another event.

00:13:05 ◼   ► I never missed another event after that.

00:13:06 ◼   ► I guess-- I'm trying to think what would be before that,

00:13:09 ◼   ► like Mac OS 8.6 or--

00:13:11 ◼   ► it's before OS 9.

00:13:13 ◼   ► But I'm telling you, it wasn't even that.

00:13:15 ◼   ► Like I said, it was some weird--

00:13:16 ◼   ► It was like an Apple Works update.

00:13:18 ◼   ► --internet initiative or something.

00:13:20 ◼   ► I think it wasn't even a product.

00:13:21 ◼   ► I think it was like-- we all felt ripped off.

00:13:23 ◼   ► It was somebody's PR baby, and they

00:13:25 ◼   ► decided like, "Hey, we'll call the press." But we won't tell them what it is until we

00:13:30 ◼   ► get there, and then you feel totally ripped off. So when they did it again for the iMac,

00:13:35 ◼   ► we're like, "I guess somebody needs to go." So we sent somebody, because you can't not

00:13:39 ◼   ► have Macworld at an Apple event, and yet suddenly it turned out to be this big thing. Literally,

00:13:46 ◼   ► the editor-in-chief called the staff afterward and said, "I'm driving back now, assemble

00:13:51 ◼   ► in 40 minutes in my office and this is huge and it was huge.

00:13:56 ◼   ► So I'm assuming this is the Flint Center for the Performing Arts, right?

00:13:59 ◼   ► That's the one. Guys, have you seen their website?

00:14:03 ◼   ► Yeah, it's really good. Flintcenter.com, it's

00:14:07 ◼   ► going to be in the show notes. It's a special, special website.

00:14:11 ◼   ► I think it might have an image map, maybe some blink tags.

00:14:14 ◼   ► Wow, look at this. It's

00:14:18 ◼   ► pretty epic. And for all of the wrong reasons. So Jason we wanted to talk to you today. I mean

00:14:24 ◼   ► I would like to think that everybody loves to sort of guess what's going to come up. I think this is

00:14:31 ◼   ► the sort of the usual thing that we'll do before an event like this. We'd like to try and put in

00:14:38 ◼   ► our best estimates as to what we think we're going to see depending on like the rumors that have come

00:14:42 ◼   ► out or just like from our best guesswork and we figured you know who better than you to to talk

00:14:47 ◼   ► about this stuff. So let's start with the phone. I may be a terrible guesser though,

00:14:51 ◼   ► that's the problem. Well, we're gonna rely on your experience on this one.

00:14:54 ◼   ► All right. So let's start with the phone. All right, I guess that there will be a phone.

00:14:59 ◼   ► We're going to assume that. Now, what are we thinking about lineup here? So,

00:15:04 ◼   ► the standard rumor is we're going to see two new phones, like two new screen sizes, like a,

00:15:11 ◼   ► What are we looking at? 4.5, 4.7, and like 5.5 is kind of the general sort of rumors given out at this point.

00:15:20 ◼   ► Do you think that we're going to see this if we do see two new phones?

00:15:23 ◼   ► What happens to like the C line? Is that going to stick around or will that be gone already?

00:15:28 ◼   ► Oh wow, like I said I'm bad at predicting. The rumors seem too strong for there not to be two phones, right?

00:15:36 ◼   ► Although I kind of have expected them to do a big phone last year and it didn't happen.

00:15:40 ◼   ► there were some minor buzzing about that.

00:15:43 ◼   ► So I think two phones is a good rumor.

00:15:47 ◼   ► The big question is, yeah, what happens?

00:15:49 ◼   ► I presume they wouldn't just kill the existing product

00:15:55 ◼   ► line and product size and that there probably will still

00:15:57 ◼   ► be a phone that's a 5, let's say, of some kind--

00:16:01 ◼   ► 5S, 5C, 5 something else--

00:16:05 ◼   ► that they keep around at the lower end of the line.

00:16:08 ◼   ► I would think so.

00:16:09 ◼   ► I think there's just too much.

00:16:11 ◼   ► This is part of their product strategy, having these one and two year old models still available

00:16:15 ◼   ► at lower prices.

00:16:16 ◼   ► Because the naming is going to get potentially really clunky, right?

00:16:19 ◼   ► We could end up with a 5C, a 5CS, a 6 Pro.

00:16:28 ◼   ► The naming is just this thing that whenever we come into these announcements, it's always

00:16:33 ◼   ► such an interesting thing to think about.

00:16:37 ◼   ► There are some sort of things that Apple do which you can kind of guess at with naming,

00:16:41 ◼   ► but then every now and then they throw a spanner into the works, like when they call the fifth

00:16:46 ◼   ► iPad just the iPad.

00:16:48 ◼   ► Yeah, the new iPad.

00:16:51 ◼   ► And I feel like the iPhone, if we're going to get two new iPhones and then potentially

00:16:56 ◼   ► bump two older models down the chain again so they've got the lower end as well, I think

00:17:02 ◼   ► we're going to end up in some really interesting naming territory again.

00:17:06 ◼   ► is not consistent with the names either because I could see them sticking a letter on one

00:17:11 ◼   ► of these models. I could also see them saying that they're both the iPhone 6 and you can

00:17:16 ◼   ► choose your size. Yeah, that's not a bad thought actually. Right, they could do that. They

00:17:22 ◼   ► could just say, "Look, this is the new iPhone 6 and it comes in this size and then it'll

00:17:25 ◼   ► also come in this size, oh, and everybody is amazed by that." Or they could say, "It's

00:17:30 ◼   ► the 6 and it's the 6L," or something like that because it's large. And I don't know,

00:17:35 ◼   ► really inconsistent because you've got the iPad where they tried to take the generation

00:17:40 ◼   ► out of it and say it's just the new iPad, but it still is, you can count the generations.

00:17:45 ◼   ► They have the iPad mini, but then with the iPhone they've kept the numbering scheme,

00:17:49 ◼   ► and then if you look at the Mac side, you've got the MacBook Air, and then there's an 11-inch

00:17:52 ◼   ► MacBook Air and a 13-inch MacBook Air, and likewise with the iMac and the MacBook Pro.

00:17:59 ◼   ► They're not consistent across these devices, and in the iPhone line they seem to be perfectly

00:18:05 ◼   ► happy to add capital letters on at the ends of numbers.

00:18:09 ◼   ► So your guess is as good as mine here.

00:18:14 ◼   ► Every time they complicate a product line like this,

00:18:16 ◼   ► there's that question of how is Apple

00:18:18 ◼   ► going to attempt to communicate the complexity of this product

00:18:20 ◼   ► line?

00:18:22 ◼   ► It's interesting, too.

00:18:25 ◼   ► If you look at the iPad line, having two devices now

00:18:31 ◼   ► that are identical except screen size--

00:18:33 ◼   ► and they do have different names--

00:18:35 ◼   ► on the computer end of things, you know,

00:18:37 ◼   ► a MacBook Air, like they don't, in marketing at least,

00:18:41 ◼   ► say, you know, MacBook Air parenthetical 11.6 inch.

00:18:45 ◼   ► Now that's in the technical documentation

00:18:47 ◼   ► for those of us who are K-based lovers.

00:18:50 ◼   ► - Sure. - But it's, yeah,

00:18:51 ◼   ► love the K-based. - Mid-2011.

00:18:53 ◼   ► - Yeah, you should upgrade, that's getting old.

00:18:57 ◼   ► Yeah, it is interesting. - Oh, I've upgraded.

00:19:00 ◼   ► - Oh, oh. - I've upgraded.

00:19:02 ◼   ► Now I'm mid-2013, I've moved to the middle of last year

00:19:04 ◼   ► from the middle of many years ago.

00:19:08 ◼   ► - So, you know, if you were on a Mac Mini,

00:19:09 ◼   ► it doesn't really matter at all.

00:19:12 ◼   ► So, you know, it is interesting--

00:19:14 ◼   ► - Last year's model is 2011 model.

00:19:16 ◼   ► And the 2009 model.

00:19:18 ◼   ► - All of the Mac Mini fans are just weeping silently.

00:19:21 ◼   ► - I'm waiting to buy, I wanna buy a new Mac Mini

00:19:23 ◼   ► and I just can't bear to buy the one that they've got now

00:19:25 ◼   ► 'cause it is not new, it is very old.

00:19:26 ◼   ► - Yeah, well we live stream on a Mac Mini

00:19:29 ◼   ► and I bought a used one off somebody

00:19:31 ◼   ► 'cause it's like, what's the point?

00:19:32 ◼   ► Like, it doesn't matter.

00:19:35 ◼   ► So the naming is interesting,

00:19:38 ◼   ► but I think ultimately,

00:19:41 ◼   ► I think Apple's marketing department can figure that out.

00:19:44 ◼   ► I always, I really like what they do now with like,

00:19:47 ◼   ► I just rewatched the Yosemite part of the keynote

00:19:50 ◼   ► from WWDC and they're like, Craig Federighi's like,

00:19:53 ◼   ► "Oh, like OS X Weed,"

00:19:55 ◼   ► and like OS X all these crazy California names.

00:19:57 ◼   ► So I think they've got the names under control.

00:20:02 ◼   ► But what's interesting to me at least is looking at,

00:20:05 ◼   ► okay, you're gonna have two phones that are the same size,

00:20:07 ◼   ► potentially, I mean, new ones.

00:20:10 ◼   ► Are those phones specced the same,

00:20:12 ◼   ► or is there something different about the bigger one

00:20:15 ◼   ► besides screen size?

00:20:16 ◼   ► - You'd think that this would be an opportunity

00:20:21 ◼   ► for them to throw something in there at the super high end,

00:20:24 ◼   ► although I don't know, I feel like,

00:20:27 ◼   ► I think the best thing to do would be to say,

00:20:30 ◼   ► if it's the iPhone 6 line,

00:20:31 ◼   ► iPhone 6 line is all, you know, it all has those features. But, you know, I haven't

00:20:36 ◼   ► seen any rumors about the idea that there's some sort of withheld feature. I

00:20:39 ◼   ► don't think I've seen like the rumors about doing, you know, payment system and

00:20:44 ◼   ► near-field communication chip and things like that. They don't seem to be

00:20:47 ◼   ► rumors that there's going to be, well, that's only going to be in one model. I

00:20:52 ◼   ► think that they expect that it'll be in in both the models. I don't know, this big

00:20:57 ◼   ► phone thing is a big mystery too, because what if they said you can run, I don't know,

00:21:04 ◼   ► two apps side by side? Probably not. That seems like a terrible idea in general. I don't

00:21:08 ◼   ► know, I kind of feel like the beauty of the big phone is just that it's a bigger iPhone,

00:21:12 ◼   ► but it's still an iPhone, so I hope they keep it simple.

00:21:15 ◼   ► We can pray for battery life.

00:21:17 ◼   ► Well, I think that comes with the territory, right? Presumably, the larger an area, the

00:21:23 ◼   ► a volume of a phone, the more battery, although I worry that this is like an algebra problem

00:21:30 ◼   ► and that Apple solves for battery life and the battery life they're solving for is what

00:21:35 ◼   ► we've currently got and they think that's enough.

00:21:37 ◼   ► And I don't think it is.

00:21:39 ◼   ► And I think that this is a great opportunity to set that number higher and say, "Look,

00:21:43 ◼   ► now we've got 20 hours of battery life instead of 10."

00:21:49 ◼   ► One of my big things is I want the iPhone to have a larger screen for a few different

00:21:55 ◼   ► reasons.

00:21:57 ◼   ► I feel like it could be wider.

00:21:59 ◼   ► I would like to be able to have more apps on one screen at one time, like on the home

00:22:04 ◼   ► screens.

00:22:06 ◼   ► The content area that you get from a larger phone, like whenever I've used Android devices,

00:22:10 ◼   ► I always like that.

00:22:12 ◼   ► But battery life is a big thing for me.

00:22:15 ◼   ► I constantly wear, sorry, have a,

00:22:19 ◼   ► well I also wear it, a battery.

00:22:22 ◼   ► - A belt pack.

00:22:23 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:22:24 ◼   ► A battery belt pack.

00:22:25 ◼   ► - I wear a battery around my waist.

00:22:26 ◼   ► No, I have my phone in a mofo.

00:22:28 ◼   ► - It's not even charged, it's just the style.

00:22:31 ◼   ► - It's just the style, it's just the style at the time.

00:22:34 ◼   ► Because my iPhone doesn't get me through a day.

00:22:37 ◼   ► It doesn't get me through, sometimes just by the time

00:22:40 ◼   ► I get to the office in the morning,

00:22:42 ◼   ► I'm like at 35% or something like that.

00:22:45 ◼   ► And it just doesn't work for me.

00:22:48 ◼   ► I've never understood how people say

00:22:50 ◼   ► they get a whole day out of the phone.

00:22:52 ◼   ► It doesn't make sense to me.

00:22:53 ◼   ► I just don't get it.

00:22:54 ◼   ► So I would love to see a much improved battery life

00:22:59 ◼   ► from a phone with a larger screen

00:23:03 ◼   ► and a larger phone overall.

00:23:06 ◼   ► - I mean, more volume means more battery room, I think.

00:23:11 ◼   ► I hope.

00:23:12 ◼   ► Because the guts of this thing

00:23:13 ◼   ► are not going to be that dramatically different, I think, other than the screen.

00:23:16 ◼   ► But behind the screen, not that dramatically different from what we've seen in existing

00:23:20 ◼   ► iPhones, which means there's more room for battery, and on an even bigger one, there's

00:23:24 ◼   ► even more room for battery.

00:23:26 ◼   ► I hope that that's actually one of the big selling points of that larger screen phone,

00:23:31 ◼   ► if it exists.

00:23:32 ◼   ► Not only does it have a nice big screen, but man, you should look at the battery life,

00:23:35 ◼   ► because for some people, that really, really matters.

00:23:38 ◼   ► And that's a place where Android has had an advantage over the iPhone.

00:23:42 ◼   ► There are some phones out there that are big and chunky and have a big battery with long

00:23:46 ◼   ► life and some people need it.

00:23:48 ◼   ► Yeah, and that's a really good point, Jason.

00:23:52 ◼   ► This is one of those situations where Apple is not the first to do this.

00:23:56 ◼   ► Say that Apple has a 4.7 inch phone.

00:24:00 ◼   ► There's a lot of phones at that size.

00:24:01 ◼   ► I've got the Moto G which is 4.5 inch and the size is actually pretty nice.

00:24:08 ◼   ► But I can remember not that long ago where Apple community people, air quotes, sort of

00:24:15 ◼   ► mocked those bigger phones and now we're here sitting talking about all the advantages.

00:24:20 ◼   ► I find that shift kind of interesting and I've done it.

00:24:24 ◼   ► I still think a 5.5 inch phone is pretty ridiculous but I think that history over the last 18

00:24:31 ◼   ► months, two years, has shown that people like that.

00:24:34 ◼   ► today Samsung had an event and they announced two new Galaxy Notes that are

00:24:38 ◼   ► you know I think at least as big as this big iPhone would be and one has like a

00:24:43 ◼   ► crazy like curved screen on the edge which doesn't make any sense but um

00:24:46 ◼   ► those will be in the show notes but it you know like it's it's a weird shift

00:24:51 ◼   ► for us to be talking about these in kind of different ways now I think. Yeah it's

00:24:54 ◼   ► um you know sometimes some of it is tribal some of it is like well we don't

00:24:59 ◼   ► do that and they do do that so we're gonna say that what we do is good and

00:25:01 ◼   ► what they do is bad. And I get that. And some people have smaller hands and I hear from

00:25:09 ◼   ► women especially who have smaller hands who don't really like this trend toward larger

00:25:13 ◼   ► phones. Personally, I've tried a bunch of different Android phones, put them in my pocket

00:25:18 ◼   ► and my reaction is always, "That fits, it's fine." I mean, there's plenty of room in my

00:25:24 ◼   ► pocket for a bigger iPhone because the Android phones fit in there just fine. Now the super

00:25:29 ◼   ► jumbo iPhone, I think that's a question. Is that going to be like that Samsung, the Galaxy

00:25:35 ◼   ► Note where they had like Shaq holding it or Yao Ming holding it, and it's literally like,

00:25:39 ◼   ► it looks like, when a giant person holds it, it looks like a normal sized phone, or what?

00:25:44 ◼   ► I think that's an open question, but certainly these larger Android phones don't, I mean

00:25:51 ◼   ► they fit in my pocket just fine, and sometimes they're thinner around the edges, and I don't

00:25:56 ◼   ► walk around with one of those phones in my pocket and think this is ridiculous.

00:25:59 ◼   ► In fact, for a while when I was trying out the Galaxy S3, I think, I had a Galaxy S3

00:26:04 ◼   ► and an iPhone 5 in my pocket simultaneously, and it was fine.

00:26:09 ◼   ► It was a little bit tight, but I mean, there's room in there, and you get the bigger screen,

00:26:14 ◼   ► which is really nice.

00:26:18 ◼   ► I may be proving the point of now saying big screens are nice, but I never really understood.

00:26:22 ◼   ► I like that the iPhone is compact and I can reach everywhere on the screen with my thumb

00:26:27 ◼   ► and all that, but at the same time when I tried the Android phones they seemed fine

00:26:30 ◼   ► too.

00:26:31 ◼   ► Sometimes it's hard to know until you can experience these things.

00:26:35 ◼   ► I wasn't sure I ever wanted larger than the 3.5 inch screen until I played around with

00:26:43 ◼   ► some Android devices and realized that 4 point something was great.

00:26:47 ◼   ► I say that about 4.5 to 4.7 feels like a sweet spot for me. The larger screen,

00:26:54 ◼   ► like the even larger screen, I'm interested. I don't know if I want it but

00:26:59 ◼   ► I'm interested to see what Apple try and bring to that if they go that route. Like

00:27:05 ◼   ► if they go Galaxy Note route, where do they go? Because the Galaxy Note makes

00:27:11 ◼   ► sense because it has the stylus, right? So you can kind of... I feel like

00:27:17 ◼   ► in a way you can see it is the size of like a notepad so why not give it a

00:27:21 ◼   ► little pen and people can take notes on it. So I wonder what Apple will say is

00:27:26 ◼   ► their reason, like what is the reason for going that large if they do? Because

00:27:31 ◼   ► I think it's difficult to try and understand it especially if they don't

00:27:35 ◼   ► start doing extra software features in iOS which I highly doubt, you know, like

00:27:40 ◼   ► having being able to have more things on screen at a time however that might be

00:27:45 ◼   ► more than just what developers do, like what will Apple do themselves to try and

00:27:50 ◼   ► justify why a five, like over five inch device makes sense when they then have

00:27:56 ◼   ► like iPads which it's bumping up towards at that point. Although I like the idea

00:28:00 ◼   ► of, I don't think it's a mainstream product, I think it is an edge case

00:28:05 ◼   ► product, I think that's why Apple hasn't introduced one yet, even if they do now

00:28:09 ◼   ► it will be very late in the game. You know, I look at the note, I talk to

00:28:12 ◼   ► people who have things like the Note,

00:28:13 ◼   ► and usually what they say is they like the fact

00:28:16 ◼   ► that they have one device instead of having a tablet

00:28:18 ◼   ► and a smartphone, they just have this thing

00:28:20 ◼   ► that's like a small tablet, and yes,

00:28:25 ◼   ► it's also got a phone feature in it,

00:28:26 ◼   ► but that's kinda not the point,

00:28:28 ◼   ► and the point is that they've got cellular data,

00:28:30 ◼   ► and that they can take this one device around with them,

00:28:33 ◼   ► and I suspect those devices actually appeal more to women

00:28:36 ◼   ► in the sense that they're much more baggable

00:28:38 ◼   ► than they are pocketable, and I don't know,

00:28:41 ◼   ► I find it kind of intriguing. I have an iPad mini and I love it and I think about this

00:28:46 ◼   ► large iPhone and think, "If it wasn't too much of a burden to fit in my pocket and it

00:28:53 ◼   ► meant that I sort of just had the one device everywhere instead of the two, maybe that

00:28:57 ◼   ► would be a better thing?" I think for some people it would and for a lot of other people

00:29:01 ◼   ► it wouldn't. Up to now, Apple's like, "Look, we just do one iPhone. This is the best one.

00:29:05 ◼   ► We do this. This is the best fit for us." And now, we may be seeing them saying, "Well,

00:29:10 ◼   ► for different folks and the big phone is never gonna be everything.

00:29:16 ◼   ► This is why I'm still a little skeptical about the big phone because it seems not quite Apple-like

00:29:20 ◼   ► to say this is gonna be a little more of an oddity.

00:29:23 ◼   ► But maybe the product line is diverse enough now because it's been around with the iPods,

00:29:29 ◼   ► right?

00:29:30 ◼   ► It needs to diversify and at some point some of these things like the iPod shuffle was

00:29:33 ◼   ► an oddity too, but it filled a particular need.

00:29:38 ◼   ► The interesting thing that you mention about the one device, that is a real consumer reason

00:29:47 ◼   ► for a device like that, but it's not a marketable one.

00:29:51 ◼   ► Because Apple want people to have both still.

00:29:54 ◼   ► That's what I find really interesting.

00:29:56 ◼   ► I just try and wrap my head around, if they don't give some sort of additional features

00:30:01 ◼   ► in that device, which I think the general consensus is they probably wouldn't do that,

00:30:07 ◼   ► it's likely that they won't be unveiling like the iPhone 5c and the 5s. These are

00:30:12 ◼   ► gonna be two top tier phones, right? That they're just gonna have like potentially

00:30:17 ◼   ► the standard and then the pro or something like that they may go with now.

00:30:21 ◼   ► I just try and I try and put myself in their shoes and wonder what is the the

00:30:27 ◼   ► Apple justification of it and like the only thing that I can think of that you

00:30:32 ◼   ► can easily get away with is battery life but then they didn't do that

00:30:37 ◼   ► with the Air and the iPad, sorry, the Air and the Mini, the

00:30:42 ◼   ► iPads. They have the same battery life as well as like the rest of the same

00:30:45 ◼   ► internals. It's just an interesting thing to me and I want to talk about

00:30:50 ◼   ► Avanto but before that, if we're going to look at different screen dimensions, what

00:30:56 ◼   ► do you guys think are going to happen to existing third-party apps? Are we going to

00:31:00 ◼   ► be in one of those like scaling up scenarios like if developers haven't prepared for like

00:31:07 ◼   ► the new like resolution independence or something like that what are we going to do in that

00:31:14 ◼   ► regard?

00:31:17 ◼   ► There was an interesting conversation on I guess now last week's talk show with Gruber

00:31:21 ◼   ► and Craig Hockenberry of the Icon Factory and kind of thinking about especially on the

00:31:29 ◼   ► 5.5 what happens and I think where they settled and I don't disagree is that iOS

00:31:34 ◼   ► is just gonna scale those apps up so it won't be as bad as like 1x and 2x when

00:31:39 ◼   ► they went retina but it will be maybe a little bit fuzzy until until developers

00:31:45 ◼   ► deal with it I don't think they're gonna letterbox they did that when they went

00:31:49 ◼   ► to the 5 because it just went taller but letterboxing an app in the center of the

00:31:53 ◼   ► screen with like black all the way around it leads to a lot of issues right

00:31:57 ◼   ► like where is the keyboard end up? Is the keyboard full width of the app not?

00:32:00 ◼   ► Like I don't, I think Apple is going to deal with with it by scaling up because

00:32:04 ◼   ► it's the simplest solution and yeah it doesn't look great but it's better than

00:32:09 ◼   ► having apps like kind of floating in space in the middle of this phone.

00:32:12 ◼   ► Well it's going to be multiple, multiple steps right where there's a you know can

00:32:16 ◼   ► it, can't, does it have these these liquid layouts?

00:32:20 ◼   ► No it doesn't. Okay well then we'll either scale it up or we'll letterbox it

00:32:25 ◼   ► and it depends on what the aspect ratios of the phone if it's more or less with

00:32:29 ◼   ► the 5S is then maybe it would just scale it up. But you know developers all the

00:32:35 ◼   ► all the cool apps will get updated very rapidly to support it just like they did

00:32:40 ◼   ► with the 5S and and just like they did with retina. I am a little curious about

00:32:45 ◼   ► what's going to happen in terms of what target resolution developers are working

00:32:49 ◼   ► on and I my theory and I know I mentioned this on another podcast the

00:32:53 ◼   ► the other day is I keep wondering if they're gonna do

00:32:56 ◼   ► with the iPhone what they did with the Retina MacBook Pro,

00:33:00 ◼   ► which is end up targeting like a false resolution,

00:33:04 ◼   ► a resolution that's actually higher

00:33:09 ◼   ► than the resolution of the display, and then scale it.

00:33:12 ◼   ► Because I know that there are a lot of people

00:33:15 ◼   ► who are worried about like,

00:33:17 ◼   ► perfect, you know, pixel perfect designs

00:33:19 ◼   ► and things like that.

00:33:19 ◼   ► And I think one of the weirdest things that Apple did

00:33:22 ◼   ► with the Retina MacBook Pro was break away from the idea of a perfect pixel display resolution

00:33:27 ◼   ► on a flat panel.

00:33:29 ◼   ► They render it at an enormous resolution.

00:33:32 ◼   ► If you take a screenshot on the Retina MacBook Pro, it's much larger than the actual screen

00:33:36 ◼   ► resolution.

00:33:37 ◼   ► And that's because it's rendering at this incredibly high level, and then they're

00:33:42 ◼   ► resizing it on the fly for your screen.

00:33:44 ◼   ► And that sounds like it would look terrible.

00:33:46 ◼   ► It doesn't look terrible.

00:33:47 ◼   ► And the reason it doesn't look terrible is, at some point the resolution of your screen

00:33:50 ◼   ► is so high that you can't see the terrible, fuzzy part of the pixels because they're too

00:33:56 ◼   ► tiny to see.

00:33:58 ◼   ► And I wonder if maybe that's going to be the solution to some of this stuff with the bigger

00:34:02 ◼   ► screen is some screen math where they're rendering it at 4x or something and then scaling it

00:34:06 ◼   ► to 3x or whatever on the fly.

00:34:10 ◼   ► So that's going to be a wrinkle too, where we don't know what they're going to render

00:34:13 ◼   ► at and we don't know what's going to happen to apps that are moving independently like

00:34:18 ◼   ► little interface elements are sliding here and there and then what happens

00:34:22 ◼   ► when does the OS throw its hands up and say I don't know what to do with this

00:34:24 ◼   ► app here just

00:34:25 ◼   ► use it like the iPad does now with iPhone apps

00:34:29 ◼   ► yeah just like whatever here it is it's a 2x scaled up and

00:34:32 ◼   ► just take it.

00:34:36 ◼   ► So let me talk about our next sponsor for this episode

00:34:39 ◼   ► of Connected and we have a new sponsor today

00:34:43 ◼   ► and that is a lovely book

00:34:46 ◼   ► called ICONIC. It's a photographic tribute to Apple and design. ICONIC is a coffee table

00:34:54 ◼   ► book that tells the story of Apple's most beautiful desktops, portables, peripherals,

00:34:59 ◼   ► prototypes, iPods, iOS devices and packaging. It's got the whole lot, all with the use of

00:35:04 ◼   ► stunning and unique photography. The project began in 2009 when author Jonathan Zuffi decided

00:35:10 ◼   ► he wanted to start to photograph and catalogue his incredible and huge collection of Apple

00:35:15 ◼   ► products. Over four years, the team working on Iconic took over 150,000 photos, choosing

00:35:21 ◼   ► the very best examples to put into this fantastic 350 page book. To go along with the images,

00:35:27 ◼   ► there are a collection of essays from contributors such as Ken Siegel, Lauren Brickter and Daniel

00:35:31 ◼   ► Kottke, as well as forewords from Jim Darenport and Steve Wozniak.

00:35:36 ◼   ► Now we want to take a quick moment to talk about a product that we found in Iconic that

00:35:39 ◼   ► really means something to us and when I was flicking through the book, something that

00:35:44 ◼   ► What I loved very much to see was one of the main images of the iPod mini in the book is

00:35:50 ◼   ► a pink one, which made me very happy.

00:35:55 ◼   ► It was basically the image, it's kind of across a two page spread and it has a quote from

00:36:00 ◼   ► MG Siegler about all of the little things that Apple does and it's got the iPod mini,

00:36:06 ◼   ► a beautiful pink iPod mini, being opened in the box as it sits in the box that you would

00:36:10 ◼   ► take it out of.

00:36:11 ◼   ► I remember the unboxing experience of that iPod Mini. It was the first Apple product

00:36:16 ◼   ► that I had the pleasure of opening in that way. Apple were the pioneers of that sort

00:36:22 ◼   ► of unboxing. Opening a product like that was fantastic. Seeing it in the book like that

00:36:27 ◼   ► was so awesome. One of the other images that I love, I love all of the iPod images in here

00:36:32 ◼   ► because of the colors of them. It shows all of their nanochromatic, the colored nanos.

00:36:38 ◼   ► They've got them all side by side and I like the they have all of the square iPod

00:36:43 ◼   ► Nanos as well of all of the different watch faces on like a tile pattern

00:36:46 ◼   ► like the imagery in this book is just so beautiful. Steven I'm sure that you love

00:36:53 ◼   ► looking at all of the old Macs as well there. Yeah I love the there's a page

00:36:58 ◼   ► that has all of the old Apple disk drives so Apple had a bunch of different

00:37:02 ◼   ► you know five and a half and then three and a half and double stacked and single

00:37:07 ◼   ► stacked and one with release doors and whatnot they changed it a bunch and

00:37:10 ◼   ► there's a page with all those in a grid and for me at least is like an old Apple

00:37:15 ◼   ► hardware or really a hoarder like I have a ton of this stuff at home it it really

00:37:20 ◼   ► was like awesome to see all that all in one place. There is just so much stuff to

00:37:26 ◼   ► look at in here as an Apple nerd and just marvel at you know if you're a guy

00:37:30 ◼   ► like Steven you like looking at dish drives this book is for you. Iconic has

00:37:34 ◼   ► been fully self-published and is printed on beautiful and really thick and great

00:37:38 ◼   ► paper stock. When the book actually arrived I didn't think it could be the

00:37:43 ◼   ► book because it was so heavy. They've spared no expense and it

00:37:48 ◼   ► makes the perfect gift not only for you but for any of the geeky loved ones in

00:37:53 ◼   ► your life and we have a great deal for you. You can get 20% off either the

00:37:57 ◼   ► classic or classic plus edition which is made of even better materials by going

00:38:01 ◼   ► to iconicbook.com/relayfm. Thank you so much to ICONic for their support of

00:38:07 ◼   ► Connected and all of Relay FM. So go to iconicbook.com/relayfm and you'll

00:38:13 ◼   ► also see some examples of some of the fantastic imagery that they've got on

00:38:16 ◼   ► the site there too. Thank you. Awesome. So wearables, do you want to talk about that?

00:38:26 ◼   ► Sure. Seems like a thing. Right? How do they work? So what are we thinking? Are we

00:38:38 ◼   ► gonna see another product, a wearable product tomorrow? I mean the general

00:38:43 ◼   ► consensus being, right, iOS 8 and health and you would assume that a product like

00:38:49 ◼   ► this would interface with the iPhone in a key way. Maybe it has health, you know,

00:38:54 ◼   ► There's also rumors about payments, and that would most likely go with it too.

00:38:58 ◼   ► There's all this stuff of handoff and identity and how that's all changing between devices.

00:39:05 ◼   ► If Apple were going to do something wearable, would they be looking to unveil it at the

00:39:11 ◼   ► same time as they unveil the iPhone?

00:39:15 ◼   ► Well, here's a funny thing.

00:39:18 ◼   ► A lot of us in the people who are watching and writing and talking about technology world

00:39:24 ◼   ► get really excited about wearables and think,

00:39:25 ◼   ► oh, this is gonna be a whole new category of products

00:39:27 ◼   ► and isn't it exciting?

00:39:29 ◼   ► And you lose sight of the fact that

00:39:31 ◼   ► most of these wearable devices at their core

00:39:34 ◼   ► are accessories, right?

00:39:37 ◼   ► They're accessories for your device

00:39:40 ◼   ► that you've always got with you, which is your smartphone.

00:39:42 ◼   ► In almost all cases, that's the case.

00:39:44 ◼   ► They're accessories.

00:39:45 ◼   ► And if that's really true,

00:39:47 ◼   ► that a wearable device from Apple

00:39:48 ◼   ► really is best when used with an iPhone

00:39:51 ◼   ► and it's part of the iPhone ecosystem

00:39:53 ◼   ► and it makes the iPhone better,

00:39:55 ◼   ► and iPhone users are the ones who are gonna wanna buy it,

00:39:59 ◼   ► which I think is, obviously, any wearable that Apple makes

00:40:02 ◼   ► is going to work with just Apple stuff,

00:40:04 ◼   ► I think that's pretty clear, and that's fine.

00:40:07 ◼   ► What better place to introduce that product

00:40:10 ◼   ► than alongside the iPhone for two reasons.

00:40:12 ◼   ► One is it's in the ecosystem, it fits with the iPhone,

00:40:16 ◼   ► and presumably with iOS 8,

00:40:18 ◼   ► and so that's the best time you could introduce it

00:40:21 ◼   ► because they're attached, they're joined at the hip.

00:40:24 ◼   ► And then the other thing is that this is the big one

00:40:27 ◼   ► for Apple.

00:40:28 ◼   ► The iPhone launch gets more attention than any other launch

00:40:31 ◼   ► they do all year long, and I can tell you that

00:40:32 ◼   ► just from personal experience looking at traffic on the web

00:40:36 ◼   ► or the stories that we've done about it

00:40:37 ◼   ► and the live blogs that we do about it,

00:40:39 ◼   ► the iPhone event is it.

00:40:41 ◼   ► So if you're gonna launch a new product category,

00:40:43 ◼   ► what better time to do it than when the intention

00:40:45 ◼   ► of the entire world is on you?

00:40:46 ◼   ► So for those reasons, I think it's the perfect place.

00:40:50 ◼   ► - Yeah, but I take a little bit of problem with that.

00:40:55 ◼   ► Every time Apple does an event--

00:40:57 ◼   ► - That was the most polite way to disagree I've ever heard.

00:41:00 ◼   ► - Yeah. - Little problem with that.

00:41:01 ◼   ► - A little problem with that. - Let me have it, let me have it.

00:41:04 ◼   ► - Mr. Snell, Mr. Snell. (laughs)

00:41:07 ◼   ► Apple has the world's attention

00:41:09 ◼   ► at any time they step on stage.

00:41:11 ◼   ► So why share the stage with the iPhone?

00:41:15 ◼   ► - They have some attention, right?

00:41:17 ◼   ► but I feel like this is the big one though.

00:41:21 ◼   ► They get the most attention.

00:41:22 ◼   ► I mean, by a surprising factor,

00:41:25 ◼   ► I can just tell you from our traffic perspective,

00:41:29 ◼   ► the interest in this, this is also the event

00:41:30 ◼   ► where everybody's like, what's gonna go on the new iPhone,

00:41:32 ◼   ► what's the deal with the new iPhone?

00:41:33 ◼   ► And so, no, they don't have to do it now.

00:41:36 ◼   ► They could do it in January.

00:41:37 ◼   ► If it's not gonna ship until next year,

00:41:39 ◼   ► they could probably do that.

00:41:40 ◼   ► But then I will refer you to my previous statement,

00:41:44 ◼   ► which also fits in the ecosystem.

00:41:46 ◼   ► I feel like this is not a story on its own, it's a story with the iPhone.

00:41:50 ◼   ► And assuming they want to put it in production and then know the hardware is going to leak,

00:41:54 ◼   ► because the reason we haven't seen leaks about this is because it's not in the supply chain

00:41:57 ◼   ► yet.

00:41:58 ◼   ► Because Apple and most hardware companies leak from their supply chain, there's just

00:42:03 ◼   ► too many people involved in making too many parts.

00:42:05 ◼   ► But right now it's inside Cupertino where there are very few leaks.

00:42:10 ◼   ► So this is, you know, they would need to announce it like this month or next month at one of

00:42:14 ◼   ► presumably there'll be a second event like there usually is in October for an

00:42:17 ◼   ► iPad launch. They got to do it now or it is gonna leak and it's really part of

00:42:23 ◼   ► the iPhone ecosystem so it seems to me like it's the best it's the best choice

00:42:27 ◼   ► for now would be to just tie it in because then they tell the story with

00:42:31 ◼   ► iOS 8 right it's gonna be about the health kit and the health app and iOS 8

00:42:34 ◼   ► and perhaps some other features on these new iPhones and then also this wearable

00:42:38 ◼   ► device is part of the story. Yeah that's that's the thing if it is together there

00:42:43 ◼   ► has to be that narrative.

00:42:44 ◼   ► Apple likes telling, stringing these things together

00:42:48 ◼   ► as a narrative.

00:42:50 ◼   ► We've done a lot of Apple keynote kind of recaps

00:42:55 ◼   ► on the show, and that's always something that's true.

00:42:57 ◼   ► With the iPod, we really love music.

00:42:59 ◼   ► And because we love music, we made something

00:43:01 ◼   ► that was portable and had good battery life

00:43:04 ◼   ► and was easy to use.

00:43:05 ◼   ► The iPhone, very famously, the three things,

00:43:10 ◼   ► the internet communicator, the phone, and the iPod.

00:43:12 ◼   ► and that thread was carried throughout.

00:43:15 ◼   ► So if it is health, I think it does make sense.

00:43:18 ◼   ► If it's not, if it's a hey, we have these two iPhones,

00:43:23 ◼   ► which they haven't done before, really.

00:43:26 ◼   ► I mean the 5C kinda counts,

00:43:27 ◼   ► but no one cares about the 5C.

00:43:29 ◼   ► And then this, it's just gonna be a busy Tuesday.

00:43:36 ◼   ► - It could be, yeah, it does feel overstuffed.

00:43:38 ◼   ► I don't know, I maybe think that they

00:43:42 ◼   ► want to do it this way too because this is a product we expect to be blown away and have

00:43:46 ◼   ► this be the end of the world, the greatest product ever, right?

00:43:49 ◼   ► And instead, I think it's perhaps best judged in the context of being an iPhone accessory,

00:43:56 ◼   ► and I think it actually takes some of the anticipation and the high expectations out

00:44:03 ◼   ► of the product a little bit if you say, "Hey, this works with the iPhone and here it is,"

00:44:08 ◼   ► instead of saying we are going to create this brand new amazing event for this brand new

00:44:12 ◼   ► amazing product.

00:44:13 ◼   ► Does that make sense?

00:44:14 ◼   ► I mean, I think a lot of times Apple's products suffer from, and their events suffer from

00:44:17 ◼   ► these ridiculous expectations that can never be met.

00:44:20 ◼   ► And this might be a way to slide this product out there without it having to face quite

00:44:25 ◼   ► as much scrutiny as it would on its own, especially since it really does need to presumably to

00:44:30 ◼   ► work with the iPhone.

00:44:32 ◼   ► How much money could you charge for an iPhone accessory irrespective of what it could and

00:44:37 ◼   ► couldn't do. Let's assume it does everything we expect. So we'll talk about payments in

00:44:42 ◼   ► a minute, but let's say it does something like that. Let's say it does health tracking.

00:44:45 ◼   ► Let's say it gives you notifications, and let's say it does one other thing that nobody

00:44:49 ◼   ► can see, right? Because that's what people say, "Oh, we can't imagine what Apple would

00:44:54 ◼   ► do." So let's say it does all of those things.

00:44:57 ◼   ► By people, you mean Federico.

00:44:59 ◼   ► Yeah, Federico. Let's say it does this magical thing that Google could never do, right? How

00:45:05 ◼   ► How much money could you charge for this?

00:45:07 ◼   ► Could you charge $300?

00:45:08 ◼   ► Could you charge $400?

00:45:10 ◼   ► Bearing in mind the phone costs $600?

00:45:13 ◼   ► Yeah, but your cell phone provider presumably isn't going to rebate your wearable purchase.

00:45:23 ◼   ► I feel like this $400 or $450 rumor is like the $1000 iPad rumor.

00:45:31 ◼   ► I feel like it's a fake that's actually put out by Apple to lower, to raise unreasonable

00:45:36 ◼   ► expectations so that they can undercut it.

00:45:38 ◼   ► And they do that.

00:45:39 ◼   ► I mean, Apple has been known to leak information in order to try to control the enthusiasm

00:45:47 ◼   ► because they know that things can kind of run away with enthusiasm.

00:45:51 ◼   ► And it wouldn't surprise me if they also did something like this, that literally this way

00:45:56 ◼   ► people will be surprised when they find the price out.

00:45:59 ◼   ► I think this is the kind of thing that you have to do for like $2, $2.50, so I expect

00:46:04 ◼   ► Apple to do it for $300.

00:46:07 ◼   ► And I'm not trying to be silly, but that tends to be, you know, it's always like everybody

00:46:11 ◼   ► else does it at this amount, so they do it a little bit more.

00:46:16 ◼   ► Like when we were looking at the iPods a couple of weeks ago, right?

00:46:19 ◼   ► It was like, "Well, it does like 90% more and we only charge you $50 more."

00:46:25 ◼   ► You know, I feel like it will be one of those scenarios.

00:46:29 ◼   ► You know, and it was the same with the 5C, right?

00:46:33 ◼   ► Everyone expected it to be super cheap and it was just a bit cheaper.

00:46:37 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean, yeah, the whole 5C thing is a whole interesting case study and like sort

00:46:44 ◼   ► of the rumor mill kind of spiraling in on itself.

00:46:49 ◼   ► But I do think it's got to be something that can live on its own to a degree.

00:46:56 ◼   ► It can't be completely crippled unless the iPhone is present if it's going to be several

00:47:01 ◼   ► hundred dollars.

00:47:02 ◼   ► And talking about expectations, that's Apple's whole thing leading up to these is managing

00:47:08 ◼   ► that if it's controlled leaks.

00:47:13 ◼   ► I agree with you, Jason, that that thousand dollar rumor and then it being halfway, I

00:47:17 ◼   ► could see that being at play again. Now what's not helping is that they built a

00:47:22 ◼   ► giant like white building attached to the Flint Center. So like I don't know

00:47:26 ◼   ► what's going on in there I hope it's not that silly WWDC thing from last year of

00:47:30 ◼   ► the guys with the robot race cars like I hope they haven't built bigger ones and

00:47:34 ◼   ► that's what's in there. Real cars. Yeah yeah real car yeah real cars. So you know

00:47:39 ◼   ► if it's something health related maybe there are some activities going on out

00:47:42 ◼   ► there you know you can you can see Phil Schiller swim laps. Jason you'll get to

00:47:47 ◼   ► - You'd be on a treadmill.

00:47:48 ◼   ► - Yay!

00:47:49 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:47:51 ◼   ► - They'll do it.

00:47:52 ◼   ► They'll do a relay race with the journalists.

00:47:54 ◼   ► - It's probably like a demo room or briefing rooms

00:47:56 ◼   ► because they have the, you know,

00:47:58 ◼   ► if you're one of the elite group that has the early phone

00:48:03 ◼   ► where you get it and you get a week to write about it,

00:48:06 ◼   ► which I've been in that group

00:48:07 ◼   ► and I've not been in that group.

00:48:09 ◼   ► I've had it both ways.

00:48:10 ◼   ► If you're in that group,

00:48:11 ◼   ► they need a place to take you secretly

00:48:13 ◼   ► and give you a phone and let you talk to executives

00:48:16 ◼   ► and that might be it.

00:48:17 ◼   ► I don't know enough about the Flint Center to know if they need to add on a hands-on

00:48:21 ◼   ► area somewhere or if there's some place in the Flint Center that's going to be good enough

00:48:25 ◼   ► because they usually have an area afterward with 20 of every product that they announced

00:48:30 ◼   ► all on a table being watched over.

00:48:34 ◼   ► Each one is being watched by at least one and sometimes two Apple employees and then

00:48:39 ◼   ► the press comes and paws all over them.

00:48:42 ◼   ► That could be it too.

00:48:44 ◼   ► This is a weird thing logistically.

00:48:45 ◼   ► haven't seen them do this. Most of their events are either in Town Hall on the

00:48:50 ◼   ► Apple campus or Yerba Buena or Moscone West in their keynote configuration or

00:48:56 ◼   ► there have been a couple at the California Theatre in San Jose. This is

00:48:59 ◼   ► none of those so I don't know. It's been ages so I suspect it's one of

00:49:05 ◼   ► those though that either it's a hands-on area or they wanted their private secret

00:49:09 ◼   ► you know double secret briefing area for Walt Mossberg it's just for Walt

00:49:16 ◼   ► Mossberg and John Gruber the only ones allowed in it yeah those like red chairs

00:49:21 ◼   ► yeah a lot of space oh yeah yeah that's good they could be doing their own

00:49:24 ◼   ► little all things D up there with just Walt and Kara and Tim Cook so the to

00:49:32 ◼   ► kind of back up a second you know the rumors of mobile payment like this is

00:49:37 ◼   ► rumor that never dies right like I think it started with like that maybe the

00:49:40 ◼   ► iPhone like 4 or 4s that you know NFC was gonna be in it NFC is bigger overseas

00:49:46 ◼   ► than it is here in the States like Myke every time you're here you're like

00:49:49 ◼   ► mesmerized that we have to like physically swipe our debit cards from

00:49:52 ◼   ► the to work. And you still use checks like it's true I order checks for our

00:49:57 ◼   ► business this week because we're in America and we do things silly ways.

00:50:03 ◼   ► get I don't know if the world is ready for this and a sort of big scale and the

00:50:12 ◼   ► world I really mean America yeah because the rest of the world is doing it yeah

00:50:17 ◼   ► a little by the world I mean America yeah I've whoo we got to do against one

00:50:24 ◼   ► Myke it's two against one that's right do I have to go on that monologue again

00:50:29 ◼   ► why I say why this is relevant. Consider that Italy gets no representation this week and

00:50:35 ◼   ► yeah yeah just be lucky that you're even here and allowed to be on our podcast with us. Yeah

00:50:40 ◼   ► in the free world right? That's right number one. Yeah good grief. I'm in California we're

00:50:50 ◼   ► going to secede anyway so anyway go ahead. Yeah so do you think this is the year that this finally

00:50:55 ◼   ► comes true?

00:50:56 ◼   ► What was the question?

00:50:57 ◼   ► Sorry, I was too busy with my...

00:51:02 ◼   ► I'm folding up my American flag now.

00:51:05 ◼   ► Is this the year the NFC finally comes to Apple products?

00:51:08 ◼   ► Oh yeah, payment, boy, yeah, the US is so messed up in terms of payments.

00:51:11 ◼   ► I do...

00:51:12 ◼   ► Well, Chip and Pin is coming too, so I actually do think that we are...

00:51:16 ◼   ► When you look at things like the Target data breach and the fact that that got Visa and

00:51:20 ◼   ► MasterCard to finally agree to do chip and pin.

00:51:24 ◼   ► Just like everybody finally caved.

00:51:27 ◼   ► All of the credit card companies realized they were refunding way too much money in

00:51:30 ◼   ► fraud transactions and it wasn't worth it anymore.

00:51:33 ◼   ► And so I actually think this is a really fluid time for payment systems in the United States.

00:51:37 ◼   ► So I think it's a great time.

00:51:39 ◼   ► I actually think this is one of those cases like Apple does so often where everybody wants

00:51:45 ◼   ► Apple to jump into something really fast and Apple just kind of sits back and watches things

00:51:50 ◼   ► play out for a while. They did this with, like, Bluetooth was an example from back in

00:51:55 ◼   ► the day where everybody wanted Bluetooth on Macs right away and they're like, "Yeah, we'll

00:51:59 ◼   ► see." And like two years passed and then they finally kind of came in after it had settled

00:52:02 ◼   ► down. And I feel like with Google and Android devices with NFC hanging around and now with

00:52:09 ◼   ► this move toward chip and pin in the US, like, it seems to me like maybe Apple has just waited

00:52:15 ◼   ► long enough that they can come in now and add their clout. It's already moving in that

00:52:19 ◼   ► direction and that maybe that will be, that people will be ready now.

00:52:24 ◼   ► Because there was a shift.

00:52:25 ◼   ► The fact that the US was ever going to go to chip and pin, I thought that's like going

00:52:29 ◼   ► to the metric system.

00:52:30 ◼   ► I thought it would just literally never happen in the US.

00:52:33 ◼   ► And finally things got so bad and consumers were being ripped off so much and the credit

00:52:39 ◼   ► card companies were eating so much in refunds that this has finally changed.

00:52:44 ◼   ► So I think it might not work but I think it's as good a time as any for anybody to try to

00:52:49 ◼   ► try, because it seems like things are finally changing.

00:52:52 ◼   ► My concern is that Apple are going to do the Apple thing and not want to do NFC, but do

00:52:58 ◼   ► their own system. Because even with Apple, it's unlikely that that will get adopted.

00:53:05 ◼   ► They kind of have to move to NFC for this, because that's what currently exists in Europe.

00:53:15 ◼   ► And it's what will move for you guys as well.

00:53:18 ◼   ► Currently now we have a system, a relatively new system in the UK called Contactless, where

00:53:25 ◼   ► debit cards have an NFC chip in them.

00:53:27 ◼   ► So for any amount under £20, I just tap my debit card on a reader which is attached to

00:53:34 ◼   ► the chip and pin machine.

00:53:35 ◼   ► They're like one and the same.

00:53:38 ◼   ► And I don't even need to put my pin number in, it just debits my account and that's it.

00:53:42 ◼   ► So like for small transactions, no, I don't need cash, and I just go beep and that's it.

00:53:47 ◼   ► And I've paid for something.

00:53:48 ◼   ► So that's what needs to be integrated into phones and I mean I know for a fact that there

00:53:55 ◼   ► are movements from the card processing companies here that in some instances if like a supplementary

00:54:03 ◼   ► app is used, like a banking application for example, you could pay for amounts up to hundreds

00:54:10 ◼   ► of pounds because you can press it. The phone recognizes the banking app is there. The banking

00:54:15 ◼   ► app pops up, asks you to put in a four-digit PIN number, and it will debit. So there is

00:54:20 ◼   ► a potential future where we could pay for everything with these devices, and it could

00:54:26 ◼   ► be even more so if it was attached to your wrist because you don't need to get your phone

00:54:30 ◼   ► out of your pocket. You just put your wrist, wave your wrist over the cash register, and

00:54:36 ◼   ► you've just paid for your bagel.

00:54:38 ◼   ► I'm imagining too using like touch ID to authorize a payment.

00:54:43 ◼   ► That would be pretty cool.

00:54:44 ◼   ► There is, where that makes a lot of sense, there is still financial institutions still

00:54:51 ◼   ► get wary of this because it's not their system that is doing the authorization.

00:55:00 ◼   ► So even though in theory a fingerprint is more secure than a four or six digit PIN number,

00:55:07 ◼   ► some financial, more entrenched financial institutions are less likely to want to

00:55:12 ◼   ► support Touch ID because it's Apple's thing, not their thing, and they have no

00:55:18 ◼   ► way of like doing the verification themselves. They just have to trust that

00:55:22 ◼   ► Apple say it's that person. Which, you know, that's not necessarily when it's

00:55:28 ◼   ► coming down to they could end up losing their money in this to financial

00:55:32 ◼   ► institutions. They're less likely to want to support that.

00:55:35 ◼   ► Can you imagine where this information is coming from?

00:55:38 ◼   ► Right, and Dr. Drayton makes a good point in the chat of, you know, Apple doesn't have

00:55:43 ◼   ► the smartphone momentum in the market that they did, say in 2008 or 2009, where Android

00:55:49 ◼   ► is the market leader in a lot of metrics.

00:55:53 ◼   ► And so even if Apple said, "Hey, you know what, we're going to do this thing," they

00:55:58 ◼   ► don't hold the market share, they don't hold the majority of that in such a way that they

00:56:03 ◼   ► they can force the hand and kind of force the issue.

00:56:06 ◼   ► And so like if Apple does their own thing

00:56:10 ◼   ► and even if some banks are like, you know what,

00:56:12 ◼   ► sit like, you know, my small credit union,

00:56:14 ◼   ► like a local bank would never do this.

00:56:16 ◼   ► Like they barely have online banking and it's terrible.

00:56:19 ◼   ► They would never do this.

00:56:20 ◼   ► I would need to go to a bigger institution

00:56:24 ◼   ► even if they did support it.

00:56:25 ◼   ► So I don't know.

00:56:28 ◼   ► It's one of those things where I think,

00:56:30 ◼   ► I think Myke, I think you're absolutely right.

00:56:31 ◼   ► I think Apple's got to kind of play into the already established system.

00:56:36 ◼   ► And I don't think that's the end of the world.

00:56:37 ◼   ► I don't think that means that this is dead on arrival.

00:56:41 ◼   ► No, it's the right thing to do.

00:56:43 ◼   ► And Apple will still get their amount of money.

00:56:45 ◼   ► They'll still get their processing fee from their little slice of that from the card companies.

00:56:51 ◼   ► As I recall, there were reports that Apple did try to build their own payment system,

00:56:57 ◼   ► and they ran into a lot of trouble.

00:56:59 ◼   ► And I think this is something that we, I think Dr. Drang is right in saying that if Apple

00:57:04 ◼   ► could have done this, you know, a few years ago was when they could have tried it.

00:57:08 ◼   ► I'm not sure it would have worked because the financial services market is really huge

00:57:12 ◼   ► and slow to move.

00:57:13 ◼   ► And that's why I mentioned how like the move to chip and pin and the target data breach

00:57:17 ◼   ► and a bunch of things like that.

00:57:19 ◼   ► This is a good time because things are moving now.

00:57:21 ◼   ► Things are fluid.

00:57:22 ◼   ► And I, you know, I don't think the financial services sector was going to do an Apple,

00:57:27 ◼   ► know, an Apple-only thing ever. And I think that's sort of what Apple wanted to do.

00:57:31 ◼   ► And this is going to be more like Apple lending its weight to this might be the

00:57:37 ◼   ► thing that sort of greases the skids for it to just happen. And, you know,

00:57:43 ◼   ► I'm optimistic about that. I think, like I said, if you told me

00:57:47 ◼   ► that we were changing to the metric system, I would laugh and laugh and laugh.

00:57:50 ◼   ► And I would have said that about Chip and Pin, but funny how life works that

00:57:55 ◼   ► enough horrible data breaches happen and somebody says, "Oh, this is costing us money," and then

00:58:00 ◼   ► magically we get chip and pin after all. So I think it's a good time for all of this stuff.

00:58:05 ◼   ► Yeah. So the other sort of issue on the table today is iOS 8 and Yosemite ship dates. So if

00:58:14 ◼   ► history holds up and, you know, iOS 8 would ship with the new phones, you know, the new phones would

00:58:19 ◼   ► be running iOS 8, not really anything to discuss there, the question becomes what about Yosemite?

00:58:25 ◼   ► where iOS 8 and the new version of OS 10 obviously do a lot of stuff there's a

00:58:30 ◼   ► lot of the handoff and continuity stuff which I've been playing with and the

00:58:34 ◼   ► parts that work right now are really pretty handy and there's been some some

00:58:40 ◼   ► thoughts of do they need to ship these things at the same time and I for one

00:58:47 ◼   ► don't think that they do I think that iOS 8 can stand on its own and then when

00:58:53 ◼   ► OS X is ready probably in October then they you know maybe they release OS X

00:58:59 ◼   ► and the new iPads together which I think is what they did last year pretty pretty

00:59:03 ◼   ► close and and then you know with the iPads you can talk about handoff and all

00:59:09 ◼   ► this great stuff and then your iPhone kind of automatically just does it with

00:59:12 ◼   ► the Mac after your somebody's out like they don't I've I for one don't think

00:59:16 ◼   ► that they have to ship together I think saying that they do is a little

00:59:19 ◼   ► short-sighted. A lot of things in fact, in the "really pragmatic" "stalling for time"

00:59:24 ◼   ► category, I think if you know Yosemite is not going to ship until October, which I

00:59:30 ◼   ► mean that's when maverick shipped I believe, so it makes sense.

00:59:33 ◼   ► Also it allows you to, it gives you a lot of clarity as an iOS developer about

00:59:37 ◼   ► what bugs to focus on. Like you can just not worry about handoff and ship iOS 8

00:59:43 ◼   ► knowing that there'll be an 801 or 802 that will drop right around the same

00:59:48 ◼   ► Yosemite drops that's got all of the handoff stuff all buttoned up tight. I mean, it's

00:59:53 ◼   ► actually one of the beautiful things is you can say it's in iOS 8, but not have it be

00:59:57 ◼   ► there right away because Yosemite's not there. So they can just like whistle a little bit

01:00:02 ◼   ► past the graveyard and be like, "We'll be back later!" and be gone. Because, right?

01:00:08 ◼   ► And if you look in the public beta, it's very clear that that handoff doesn't really, you

01:00:12 ◼   ► know it's not really working very well right now or at all in some cases and I

01:00:18 ◼   ► think that's I think that's because they know they've got more time for that than

01:00:21 ◼   ► they do for other iOS features. But then iCloud Drive is the elephant in the room

01:00:26 ◼   ► like because if you upgrade to iCloud Drive it destroys all documents and

01:00:32 ◼   ► data-sinking. Well that's and that's not that's not really true I mean the way it

01:00:36 ◼   ► works if you go to iOS 8 or Yosemite and you don't enable iCloud Drive all your

01:00:41 ◼   ► other iCloud stuff is still there it's sort of in a different place and again

01:00:45 ◼   ► like handoff Apple could ship iOS 8 without iCloud Drive they could use the

01:00:50 ◼   ► old iCloud structure or they could just leave it janky for a month like I don't

01:00:56 ◼   ► know if that's enough to say Yosemite's gonna be out you know with with the new

01:01:02 ◼   ► iPhones now that said I'm planning to have my review ready by then just in

01:01:06 ◼   ► case and I think a lot of people who pay attention to this are you know maybe

01:01:10 ◼   ► preparing that they don't follow the pattern but I think if if next Tuesday

01:01:15 ◼   ► comes and goes and we are you know still running Mavericks like like like animals

01:01:20 ◼   ► I don't think that's the end of the world. The iCloud Drive thing though like you

01:01:24 ◼   ► can't well it's a choice to upgrade right doesn't iOS I mean

01:01:30 ◼   ► that we're talking about the beta now but doesn't it give you the option so

01:01:33 ◼   ► what would stop them from just not giving anybody the option and just not

01:01:36 ◼   ► having it be there for the first month. That would be the best thing to do. And

01:01:40 ◼   ► then turn it on in October, say iCloud Drive is coming in October. Woo! Yeah, I

01:01:44 ◼   ► mean that's the way to do it. Back away. If they're happy with the fact that they've

01:01:48 ◼   ► promoted it, right? So as long as they're happy to then just throw a little sticker

01:01:52 ◼   ► up, say like, "It's coming to October now!" Because you could do it between the iPhone and the

01:01:56 ◼   ► iPad, then you'll be fine and it will be lovely. Because at the moment if you

01:02:02 ◼   ► you enable it things like like for example clear will not sync for me

01:02:07 ◼   ► anymore because I dared to sign in on an iPod touch and wasn't paying attention

01:02:12 ◼   ► because that's the problem I wasn't paying attention nobody else really pays

01:02:17 ◼   ► attention and you just during that setup process just go yes yes yes yes yes and

01:02:22 ◼   ► then you know and when I say nobody else of course I don't mean you two because

01:02:26 ◼   ► you're smarter. I mean everybody else like regular people like me who don't

01:02:32 ◼   ► pay attention to what they're signing up to and then just go through and just say

01:02:38 ◼   ► yes to everything and then well their iCloud apps don't sync anymore.

01:02:43 ◼   ► Anyway on that great note, Mr. Jason Snell, are you gonna be at the

01:02:50 ◼   ► event? I will be there. I got invited. It was very very kind of Apple.

01:02:54 ◼   ► actually I think there are four people from Macworld who are going to be there, which

01:02:58 ◼   ► is a record for us in recent years. So yeah, I'll be there.

01:03:02 ◼   ► I look forward to seeing pictures of you on treadmills and exercise bikes and stuff like

01:03:06 ◼   ► that, trying out the health devices. And then around the, you know, they'll probably have

01:03:10 ◼   ► like a fake supermarket in there as well so you can try out the payment stuff. So enjoy

01:03:14 ◼   ► all of that. Those will be really, really beautiful photos

01:03:17 ◼   ► too. It'll be like when they unveiled the iPod

01:03:20 ◼   ► Hi-Fi, which is also in the iconic book by the way, Trami smile and they had like they set up the house

01:03:25 ◼   ► It's gonna be like that. Yeah

01:03:28 ◼   ► They also released if memory serves me correctly leather like iPod

01:03:33 ◼   ► Cases at that event that sold for like $100 and had like the embossed Apple logo on the back

01:03:39 ◼   ► Yeah, I don't know if was $100 but they were laughable expensive. I think they were $50 cases

01:03:43 ◼   ► Maybe that was it $60 cases and that was that was not

01:03:48 ◼   ► Not good. That event was like, I don't know, I felt like that was like Steve Jobs

01:03:54 ◼   ► had a really bad attitude that week and just decreed that this is what they were gonna do.

01:03:59 ◼   ► And actually, you know, Apple's product discipline is so great.

01:04:03 ◼   ► And even though Steve Jobs always had the attitude that everybody who was a third party

01:04:09 ◼   ► was stealing money from his good work and Apple's good work and that Apple needed to find ways to take the money off the table.

01:04:15 ◼   ► and that was absolutely his attitude.

01:04:17 ◼   ► You rarely saw it as brazenly as with the iPod Hi-Fi,

01:04:22 ◼   ► which was literally like,

01:04:23 ◼   ► wow, Bose is selling a lot of sound docs,

01:04:26 ◼   ► let's take that action from them.

01:04:28 ◼   ► And it failed, which is the beauty of it.

01:04:30 ◼   ► I actually use an iPod Hi-Fi as my external Mac speakers

01:04:34 ◼   ► at home to this day, 'cause it's got an aux port,

01:04:37 ◼   ► so it's still actually functional.

01:04:39 ◼   ► But man, that was the whole reason that product existed,

01:04:42 ◼   ► is just because they were really bent out of shape,

01:04:44 ◼   ► I really believe it was Steve Jobs was mad that Bose was making so much money

01:04:47 ◼   ► off of the greatness of the iPhone and so they made their own thing. That thing was so big.

01:04:53 ◼   ► Well I mean yeah it's like a it's like the size of a like classic 80s like dual

01:04:58 ◼   ► cassette deck portable tape player kind of thing. And Bose are doing those tiny

01:05:02 ◼   ► little things. Yeah. But you know it was fine because Steve replaced his high-end

01:05:07 ◼   ► audio equipment anyway so. It sounded good. It sounds good I listen to it almost

01:05:13 ◼   ► every day still and it sounds perfectly fine it was just overpriced and kind of

01:05:18 ◼   ► pointless and then sadly also it all the iPod charging in it even though it had

01:05:22 ◼   ► little swappable like place where you could put in different dock connectors

01:05:25 ◼   ► and things like that it was using the original firewire charging which meant

01:05:30 ◼   ► like a year later when they changed to USB charging where the pins were

01:05:34 ◼   ► different and all these different chargers car chargers broke so did the

01:05:39 ◼   ► iPod Hi-Fi and that was the end. Yeah I can't use my beloved iPod Classic

01:05:44 ◼   ► with one. Nope. I will say though I do keep my iPod Classic in a green

01:05:49 ◼   ► iPod sock so... Hey good for you! I know right? I have an iPod

01:05:54 ◼   ► Classic I'm in the club for the iPod Classic too I have one in my car. Does the

01:05:58 ◼   ► iPod Classic have the 30 pin? Yes. Yeah so I have both style

01:06:04 ◼   ► cables in my car. Mr. Jason Snell, thank you so much for joining us. Where can

01:06:13 ◼   ► people find you on the internet, sir? You can find me on Twitter @jsnell. You can

01:06:18 ◼   ► find much of my writing on Macworld, and you can find many of my fine, artisanal,

01:06:23 ◼   ► handcrafted podcasts at TheIncomparable.com. Thank you. You can find me

01:06:28 ◼   ► listening to this show every week on my iPhone in my in my car so

01:06:34 ◼   ► power sliding while listening to your show yes thank you Jason thank you

01:06:40 ◼   ► Arrivederci

01:06:43 ◼   ► this episode of connected is also brought to you by our friends at

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01:07:18 ◼   ► So basically, you can take as much of their beautiful templates as you like, but you can

01:07:22 ◼   ► also get under the hood and tinker around, and that's exactly what Steven does for

01:07:25 ◼   ► the photo of pixels.

01:07:27 ◼   ► Squarespace also feature Typekit and Google Fonts right out of the box, allowing you to

01:07:31 ◼   ► select a truly beautiful typeface for your website or blog and give it that bit of personality.

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01:07:47 ◼   ► They have progressive image loading built right in, which ensures that images at the

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01:08:11 ◼   ► with your images as well, so they don't serve images that are too big. They also make third-party

01:08:19 ◼   ► services like Typekit, Google Analytics and Disqus really easy. All you have to do is

01:08:24 ◼   ► provide your user ID and Squarespace takes care of the rest. If you want to dig into

01:08:29 ◼   ► the code you can do that, you can easily inject custom code into your site's header or footer

01:08:33 ◼   ► on a per page basis and get under the hood. 301 and 302 redirects are also built right

01:08:38 ◼   ► in and easily supported. I like to get into the real technical stuff when I talk about

01:08:42 ◼   ► Squarespace on this show. Squarespace really do think of everything, and all of this is

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01:09:27 ◼   ► So we should probably go for AppPix now, right?

01:09:29 ◼   ► Let's do it.

01:09:30 ◼   ► Do you want to take the lead?

01:09:32 ◼   ► Yep.

01:09:33 ◼   ► So I would like to talk about, it's a very quick one for me today, I think, Product Hunt,

01:09:38 ◼   ► which is a website that I came across recently.

01:09:42 ◼   ► I think I started getting into it when people let us know that we were on Product Hunt recently.

01:09:47 ◼   ► relay FM when we launched. It's basically a Y Combinator backed project and it's effectively

01:09:55 ◼   ► just a list of new things that have launched. People submit things to Product Hunt like

01:10:01 ◼   ► Digg or something like that and people upvote them. It's that sort of Digg style that you're

01:10:05 ◼   ► used to. But all it is is for things, new services, new apps, new projects, new products

01:10:11 ◼   ► that have launched. And it's a really cool way to go on and find new little web services

01:10:16 ◼   ► our apps and I found a few apps. So like today we've got like the Logitech K480

01:10:22 ◼   ► is the top of product hunt today and it's a keyboard, a new Logitech

01:10:29 ◼   ► keyboard that you can use with basically any device. It's like made to be like

01:10:33 ◼   ► Android, iOS, that sort of stuff. So the app is very simple. You're

01:10:37 ◼   ► authenticated via Twitter for the application. You can go in, you can view

01:10:42 ◼   ► all of the comments that are attached to each product that's listed. You can

01:10:46 ◼   ► add comments if you like. And you can also view the associated websites and if

01:10:50 ◼   ► you like it you can upvote it. It's just a cool way to... I kind of want to do like a

01:10:54 ◼   ► double thing like it's it's a cool service to find new stuff and their app

01:10:58 ◼   ► is very simple very clean it's a nicely designed application as well so check it

01:11:03 ◼   ► out. It's called Product Hunt and it's in the app store.

01:11:07 ◼   ► Cool. Mine, mine, my pick is an app by Jared Sinclair of Unread and Whisper and

01:11:18 ◼   ► Riposte, a new app called Time Zones. It's an iPhone app and it does basically what

01:11:24 ◼   ► you think it would. It is a time zone and world clock application and it does a

01:11:30 ◼   ► couple things really well. You might say, "Steven, the iOS system does this. You can

01:11:36 ◼   ► just open the clock app and I do have my timezones in there and and that's that's

01:11:41 ◼   ► fine but one thing that that timezones does is it has a little little feature

01:11:49 ◼   ► called is it called a quick check check quick check and so you can go in here

01:11:54 ◼   ► and I'm gonna have a screenshot in the in the show notes because it's not the

01:11:58 ◼   ► one that I'm deleting now from the document one so I can go in here and I

01:12:04 ◼   ► I can say, okay, I have an event Monday, September 8th

01:12:08 ◼   ► at 11 p.m.

01:12:09 ◼   ► and I can say that event is in,

01:12:17 ◼   ► pick a city, Myke, just pick a city.

01:12:19 ◼   ► - London.

01:12:19 ◼   ► - So I can say London.

01:12:22 ◼   ► So I'm gonna pick East London, South Africa.

01:12:26 ◼   ► - Okay, great, yeah, that's what you wanna do.

01:12:28 ◼   ► - And I can do quick check and it will tell me

01:12:30 ◼   ► when that event is based on my local time.

01:12:34 ◼   ► So I give her the time that I was given from the event host

01:12:37 ◼   ► in their time zone and it tells me what it is my time.

01:12:42 ◼   ► And that sounds confusing, but it's really not.

01:12:44 ◼   ► It's really quick and it's great.

01:12:47 ◼   ► But you know, if listening to a live podcast

01:12:49 ◼   ► or you know, wanna catch something on TV

01:12:51 ◼   ► or if someone says, "Hey, we're gonna have a phone call,"

01:12:54 ◼   ► to go in there and just very quickly know

01:12:56 ◼   ► when it is in your time zone

01:12:57 ◼   ► instead of doing what I used to do,

01:12:58 ◼   ► which would be like, you know, for Myke,

01:13:00 ◼   ► you and I are six hours apart,

01:13:02 ◼   ► Federico and I are seven hours apart,

01:13:04 ◼   ► Jason and I are two hours apart,

01:13:05 ◼   ► and trying to figure all that out mentally

01:13:08 ◼   ► is just a good way to go crazy.

01:13:09 ◼   ► So Time Dental takes care of all that.

01:13:11 ◼   ► It's free with the in-app purchase to get rid of ads.

01:13:14 ◼   ► It looks great on iOS 7 and 8,

01:13:16 ◼   ► and it's definitely, if you deal with this sort of thing,

01:13:19 ◼   ► definitely the tool you should be using.

01:13:21 ◼   ► - I want to add a couple of things to this.

01:13:23 ◼   ► So when you're doing the quick check,

01:13:25 ◼   ► so you can kind of go in and say,

01:13:28 ◼   ► I want to know what 8 p.m. is in all of,

01:13:30 ◼   ► And it gives you a list and shows you all of the time zones

01:13:33 ◼   ► that you've entered, 'cause you can enter

01:13:34 ◼   ► multiple time zones.

01:13:35 ◼   ► It shows you what that time is in all of them,

01:13:37 ◼   ► so that's really useful for, like for me,

01:13:40 ◼   ► when I'm trying to work out what time this show streams,

01:13:43 ◼   ► I can go in and be like, I know it's 10 p.m. London time,

01:13:46 ◼   ► right, so that's X time, like, so it's like,

01:13:49 ◼   ► that's a three, so I'm not using it right now,

01:13:52 ◼   ► otherwise I'd know.

01:13:53 ◼   ► Two p.m. San Francisco time, five p.m. Eastern time,

01:13:57 ◼   ► et cetera, and you get that list.

01:13:59 ◼   ► But then you can jump backwards and forwards

01:14:02 ◼   ► by 30 minute increments.

01:14:03 ◼   ► So if you're trying to schedule a time,

01:14:05 ◼   ► be like, oh no, that doesn't work for Steven.

01:14:08 ◼   ► Maybe an hour's time would be good for him,

01:14:10 ◼   ► so you just hit the button a couple of times

01:14:11 ◼   ► and it lets you do that.

01:14:13 ◼   ► You can also rename time zones.

01:14:15 ◼   ► So I have time zones by city, but also by people as well.

01:14:18 ◼   ► So I can't necessarily remember what time zone

01:14:22 ◼   ► such and such person's in.

01:14:23 ◼   ► I don't remember that they live in this city,

01:14:25 ◼   ► but I can just put their name in.

01:14:26 ◼   ► And also, one of the reasons I love this app

01:14:29 ◼   ► is I helped Jared with some of the thinking behind it.

01:14:34 ◼   ► So the actual, the idea for this application

01:14:38 ◼   ► came in a conversation that me and him had

01:14:41 ◼   ► after he was on command space.

01:14:43 ◼   ► I was talking to him, we were just talking,

01:14:45 ◼   ► I was talking to him about the fact

01:14:46 ◼   ► that there are no good timezone apps,

01:14:48 ◼   ► and then I told him all the things that I needed,

01:14:51 ◼   ► and then he made it.

01:14:52 ◼   ► For some reason, he doesn't credit me with this,

01:14:54 ◼   ► and it upsets me so greatly.

01:14:56 ◼   ► - Wow.

01:14:57 ◼   ► - Even the quick check thing, right?

01:14:58 ◼   ► So the jumping between like the 30 minutes,

01:15:00 ◼   ► like going in ahead, I said, "You add that."

01:15:02 ◼   ► And he had, you know, just saying, Jared, you know,

01:15:05 ◼   ► you don't have to give me any money,

01:15:06 ◼   ► but you could just say Myke helped.

01:15:08 ◼   ► That's what's all I asked for.

01:15:10 ◼   ► I don't know why he refuses to acknowledge

01:15:13 ◼   ► my existence, Steven.

01:15:15 ◼   ► - Wow. - It upsets me.

01:15:16 ◼   ► - Not that you're upset.

01:15:18 ◼   ► - Or bitter in any way.

01:15:19 ◼   ► - Yeah, so you can find Product Hunt online,

01:15:21 ◼   ► you can find time zones in the iOS app store.

01:15:25 ◼   ► All of those are available at our show notes,

01:15:29 ◼   ► which are on the internet somewhere.

01:15:31 ◼   ► - I'm not really that bitter, by the way.

01:15:33 ◼   ► I just wanna make that clear.

01:15:35 ◼   ► - Relay.fm/connected/three.

01:15:39 ◼   ► - Something like that.

01:15:40 ◼   ► - Something like that.

01:15:42 ◼   ► - So we come to the end of this week's episode.

01:15:45 ◼   ► Thank you so much for listening.

01:15:46 ◼   ► Thank you to Jason again for joining us.

01:15:49 ◼   ► We've got a very special episode next week

01:15:51 ◼   ► 'cause it's the first Apple event

01:15:54 ◼   ► that we'll be covering on Connected.

01:15:56 ◼   ► So you will wanna tune in for that.

01:15:59 ◼   ► We broadcast this show live on the internet.

01:16:04 ◼   ► We broadcast at 10 p.m. London time,

01:16:08 ◼   ► 2 p.m. San Francisco time, so Pacific time,

01:16:11 ◼   ► and 5 p.m. Eastern time.

01:16:15 ◼   ► So you wanna definitely tune in.

01:16:16 ◼   ► It's gonna be a fun show next week for sure.

01:16:18 ◼   ► If you wanna catch the show notes that Stephen mentioned,

01:16:21 ◼   ► relay.fm/connected/3.

01:16:25 ◼   ► We are _ConnectedFM on Twitter.

01:16:28 ◼   ► I am @imike, I am YKE, and Steven is @ismh.

01:16:33 ◼   ► Steven also writes over at 512pixels.net.

01:16:36 ◼   ► We'll be back next week.

01:16:37 ◼   ► Until then, bye bye.