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Under the Radar

193: Unproductivity

 

00:00:00 ◼   ► Welcome to Under the Radar, a show about independent iOS app development.

00:00:04 ◼   ► I'm Marco Arment.

00:00:05 ◼   ► And I'm David Smith.

00:00:06 ◼   ► Under the Radar is never longer than 30 minutes, so let's get started.

00:00:10 ◼   ► So as we're recording this, it's sort of the middle of June in 2020.

00:00:16 ◼   ► So if you're looking back at this and you hear that the year is 2020, you may have some

00:00:21 ◼   ► sense of the unprecedented year we've been having.

00:00:30 ◼   ► That seems to be the term that's been thrown around a lot.

00:00:33 ◼   ► And it's like, I don't even know where to begin for all the things that are happening

00:00:37 ◼   ► that are not normal, are atypical, are significant, are emotional, are frustrating.

00:00:44 ◼   ► And so as the year starts out and we start to have the coronavirus outbreak and it totally

00:00:50 ◼   ► upends everything and causes widespread sickness and tragedy, and as right as we get to the

00:01:02 ◼   ► point where we start to perhaps slightly see the end of this and things open up, there's

00:01:08 ◼   ► all of the awfulness going on.

00:01:20 ◼   ► The issues around racism in the US and police brutality and the way those things are reacted

00:01:25 ◼   ► to and the protests around that, and all of these things come together.

00:01:29 ◼   ► And it's worth saying, I think, Marco and I, we are firmly against racism and all of

00:01:36 ◼   ► its guises as structural and personal and all of the awful things that are happening

00:01:41 ◼   ► there.

00:01:42 ◼   ► But as a result of all of those things, at least I can speak for myself, there is just

00:01:48 ◼   ► this general sense of difficulty and challenge.

00:01:53 ◼   ► As it relates to my work, it's been very difficult in this last six months to be productive,

00:01:58 ◼   ► to get the normal amount of work done that I would hope to do or expect myself to do

00:02:04 ◼   ► or want to do.

00:02:07 ◼   ► It's really hard to want to focus or be able to focus on the things that relate to my job

00:02:13 ◼   ► when it feels like everything around you is falling apart and going crazy and everything's

00:02:19 ◼   ► awful.

00:02:20 ◼   ► And it seemed like a topic, though, that is probably worth just discussing and talking

00:02:25 ◼   ► through some observations around what the impacts of having these external factors in

00:02:31 ◼   ► the world that are big and significant and weighty can have on you emotionally and how

00:02:36 ◼   ► they can relate to your productivity and your work.

00:02:39 ◼   ► And then also, on the more positive side, is hopefully to talk about some of the strategies

00:02:43 ◼   ► and things that you can do, that I've done, that Marco's done, that have helped.

00:02:49 ◼   ► Many of these things, when something is happening outside in the world more generally, there's

00:02:55 ◼   ► only so much that we can do to affect change to that and to eliminate it.

00:03:01 ◼   ► It isn't like I'm sitting in a chair that's uncomfortable and if I go and get a new chair,

00:03:06 ◼   ► suddenly my work environment can be more productive or more comfortable.

00:03:11 ◼   ► These are situations that are broad and wide in the world.

00:03:15 ◼   ► There aren't these simple and easy quick fixes, but there are certainly strategies and things

00:03:18 ◼   ► that we can do to mitigate the effect on us and to help us both emotionally and for our

00:03:24 ◼   ► mental health as well as our productivity and our ability to continue doing our jobs

00:03:29 ◼   ► in the midst of things that make that really difficult.

00:03:33 ◼   ► Yeah, because ultimately, as Dave said, this has been a really messed up year so far.

00:03:40 ◼   ► And the major factors, basically being COVID-19 and the Black Lives Matter protests against

00:03:46 ◼   ► police brutality, that's not likely to go away quickly.

00:03:52 ◼   ► These problems aren't just going to be solved tomorrow and everything will go back to "normal."

00:03:56 ◼   ► That's not going to happen.

00:03:57 ◼   ► Any return to something closer to normal is going to just take time.

00:04:01 ◼   ► It's going to be a gradual process and it's already been months.

00:04:06 ◼   ► I mean, we talked about doing this episode months ago and we kept having other things

00:04:10 ◼   ► to talk about, but it's already been months that we've been quarantined and going through

00:04:15 ◼   ► the COVID-19 pandemic and all those things.

00:04:20 ◼   ► This is such a not normal time that I personally, I know many people out there have had to do

00:04:27 ◼   ► that trouble.

00:04:28 ◼   ► I personally have had a lot of trouble getting any work done whatsoever.

00:04:33 ◼   ► And I think that's okay.

00:04:36 ◼   ► When we first started out with the quarantine, certainly one of the fastest issues we had

00:04:43 ◼   ► to face was what do we do about school?

00:04:45 ◼   ► We both have children.

00:04:47 ◼   ► You had a different situation than I do.

00:04:50 ◼   ► My situation was my kid went to a public school.

00:04:53 ◼   ► He goes to a regular school and his school was closed.

00:04:58 ◼   ► So everyone started doing basically web remote teaching and web remote learning.

00:05:03 ◼   ► So he has to do video chats and fill out worksheets and everything.

00:05:08 ◼   ► That's been difficult for everyone, for the teachers, for the students, for the parents,

00:05:13 ◼   ► because nobody was prepared for that.

00:05:14 ◼   ► It's a hugely different shift in how things have to work.

00:05:18 ◼   ► Everybody has to do things they haven't done before in ways they haven't done before.

00:05:23 ◼   ► It was extremely disruptive.

00:05:26 ◼   ► The question certainly arose of how much work should your children be doing during this

00:05:33 ◼   ► time?

00:05:34 ◼   ► How much should you try to stick with school?

00:05:36 ◼   ► For some people, school is what makes their kids feel normal.

00:05:42 ◼   ► So they try to do as structured of a day as possible for their kids.

00:05:47 ◼   ► For other people, their kids don't thrive in a school environment and school is stressful.

00:05:55 ◼   ► Moving it to home and trying to reproduce as much of the school day as possible at home

00:05:59 ◼   ► was a source of stress for a lot of people, not a source of normalcy and structure.

00:06:05 ◼   ► So you had to make a judgment call based on who you knew your kid to be of like, "Do

00:06:10 ◼   ► we make them work a lot or do we make them work just what they need to do bare minimum

00:06:16 ◼   ► and let them chill for the rest of the time?"

00:06:19 ◼   ► And I think back, nobody looks back on periods of disasters or tragedies or wars or things

00:06:28 ◼   ► like that.

00:06:29 ◼   ► No one looks back on that time later and says, "I wish I was more productive during that

00:06:34 ◼   ► time."

00:06:36 ◼   ► These are serious times where serious stuff is going on, much of which is negative.

00:06:41 ◼   ► And it's okay during that time to not overwork yourself or your kids or whatever, your employees.

00:06:49 ◼   ► It's totally okay to not overwork people.

00:06:52 ◼   ► In fact, you should be doing the opposite.

00:06:53 ◼   ► You should be underworking yourself during this time because there's a lot to process

00:06:57 ◼   ► and deal with in the world right now.

00:06:59 ◼   ► There are major shifts happening all around us.

00:07:02 ◼   ► There are major, you know, heavy dark times happening and many things have become more

00:07:09 ◼   ► difficult or more time consuming for us to handle at home or at work.

00:07:14 ◼   ► And so we need to leave space to breathe and to relax and to process this and to have some

00:07:22 ◼   ► time off.

00:07:23 ◼   ► And the good thing is that what most of us do, I think one of the unintentional positive

00:07:31 ◼   ► side effects of the quarantine period has been that a lot of the stuff that we used

00:07:36 ◼   ► to do day to day that we told ourselves we had to do, we actually don't have to do.

00:07:42 ◼   ► Or we can get away with doing a lot less of it.

00:07:45 ◼   ► And so I think we can apply a lot of that to our indie lives as well.

00:07:51 ◼   ► Indie life has been largely, for me, about trying to do as little work as possible, trying

00:07:58 ◼   ► to commit to as little time requirement as possible.

00:08:02 ◼   ► I don't want to create a job for myself where I have to wake up and do six hours of work

00:08:06 ◼   ► every single day, otherwise the job falls apart.

00:08:09 ◼   ► It's more bursty where if I want to go a day without doing any work whatsoever, that's

00:08:15 ◼   ► okay.

00:08:16 ◼   ► The work will wait or the app will run itself to some degree.

00:08:20 ◼   ► If I want to have a week where I do nothing, if I want to go on vacation, which is always

00:08:26 ◼   ► a healthy thing, we've talked about that, I want to have a business where it can take

00:08:30 ◼   ► a week of me not putting much or any time into it.

00:08:34 ◼   ► With the quarantine, I think what we've seen is we need even more slack in the system than

00:08:42 ◼   ► we initially thought for certain large scale disasters like this.

00:08:47 ◼   ► And I've been fortunate that my, like, for the whole first month, I didn't really do

00:08:53 ◼   ► anything.

00:08:54 ◼   ► I got almost no work done for like a month.

00:08:57 ◼   ► And nothing bad happened to my business.

00:09:00 ◼   ► It was fine.

00:09:01 ◼   ► My business, like, my app is in a stable-ish state.

00:09:04 ◼   ► Everything was fine.

00:09:05 ◼   ► Usage went down, money went down a little bit, but it wasn't like fatally so.

00:09:10 ◼   ► And so everything was just running kind of in like, you know, stable mode waiting for

00:09:16 ◼   ► whenever I want to work on it next.

00:09:18 ◼   ► And it's really great to put yourself in a position where you can have that kind of slack

00:09:22 ◼   ► in your business, where you can have that kind of like built in buffer on everything

00:09:26 ◼   ► and be like, "All right, it's okay if I don't work for a little while."

00:09:30 ◼   ► And you know, the business won't die.

00:09:33 ◼   ► My app won't stop working.

00:09:35 ◼   ► You know, everything will be fine.

00:09:37 ◼   ► And all those like feature updates that you want to do or redesigns or whatever, you know

00:09:41 ◼   ► what, maybe those can wait.

00:09:43 ◼   ► Does it really matter if you redesign the app this year or next year?

00:09:46 ◼   ► You know, does it really matter if you add this feature that 10% of your people are asking

00:09:50 ◼   ► for now or in a year from now?

00:09:54 ◼   ► Probably not.

00:09:55 ◼   ► All right.

00:09:56 ◼   ► So ultimately, I think it's very valuable to let yourself recognize that these are not

00:10:02 ◼   ► normal times and give yourself the room to breathe and give yourself time off and not

00:10:09 ◼   ► to beat yourself up over it.

00:10:11 ◼   ► Because again, like I think in five years from now, no one's gonna be looking back at

00:10:16 ◼   ► this time and saying, "Wow, I really wish I added two more features during the quarantine."

00:10:20 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:10:21 ◼   ► And I feel like so much of these, like it makes me think of one of the best analogies

00:10:26 ◼   ► I ever have, or the analogy that I find useful for myself in terms of understanding my capacity

00:10:35 ◼   ► for doing things is to think of like my life is like this, I have a box, and I can choose

00:10:42 ◼   ► which things I put into that.

00:10:44 ◼   ► And it's like, I can put in sleep, and I can put in exercise, and I can put in eating,

00:10:47 ◼   ► I can put in relationships, I can put in work, I can put in all of the various like homework,

00:10:52 ◼   ► whatever those things are that I need to do.

00:10:55 ◼   ► But the size of the box is sort of outside of my control.

00:11:01 ◼   ► And in many ways, you have situations like this where suddenly I feel like the box got

00:11:05 ◼   ► smaller, and it got smaller because of the emotional strain and the uncertainty and the

00:11:11 ◼   ► difficulty that sort of surrounds what we're doing.

00:11:14 ◼   ► And it's like at a certain point, you have to decide, "Well, what are you going to take

00:11:17 ◼   ► out?

00:11:18 ◼   ► What are you going to not, what are you going to take out of the box because the box is

00:11:22 ◼   ► too small?

00:11:23 ◼   ► It can't hold as much as it used to."

00:11:25 ◼   ► And that calculus is really complicated, but it's one of those things.

00:11:30 ◼   ► There is no way to change that.

00:11:33 ◼   ► Like you can't just like say, sort of like the old thing of, "Oh, I wish I had 25 hours

00:11:37 ◼   ► in a day."

00:11:38 ◼   ► It's like, you can't.

00:11:40 ◼   ► Like they're sort of trying to sort of fake it by working extra hours.

00:11:46 ◼   ► It's like all you're doing is you're taking away from sleep, probably, or you're taking

00:11:50 ◼   ► away from relationships, or you're taking away from something else.

00:11:53 ◼   ► Like ultimately, everything has to balance out.

00:11:56 ◼   ► And I think what's, it certainly is, everyone's situation is different.

00:12:00 ◼   ► And I think it is certainly one of the great things that I'm very appreciative of, of the

00:12:04 ◼   ► kind of the typical sort of software development lifecycle is such that it is one that has

00:12:11 ◼   ► a lot of slack in it.

00:12:12 ◼   ► That it is a situation where if I need to take out several units of software development

00:12:17 ◼   ► so that I can make sure that I don't have to take out any of my, you know, sort of sleep

00:12:22 ◼   ► or wellbeing or relationships or connection, I can leave all those in the box and I can

00:12:26 ◼   ► take out some work right now.

00:12:28 ◼   ► Like that is a tremendously fortunate place to be.

00:12:30 ◼   ► And obviously that's dependent on the kind of work you do.

00:12:32 ◼   ► And even if you are an independent developer, if you're doing a lot of consulting work or

00:12:35 ◼   ► something like that, where even if it's, you know, even sort of in the most specific cases,

00:12:39 ◼   ► if it's like hourly consulting, that there's like a very fixed number of hours that you

00:12:42 ◼   ► need to be sitting down working on a project.

00:12:45 ◼   ► Like maybe you don't have that flexibility to be able to do that.

00:12:48 ◼   ► But there's a certainly is important to understand that ever all of these things are going to

00:12:53 ◼   ► be this necessary trade off that like, whatever, you know, you have to decide what are the

00:12:58 ◼   ► things that you're going to allow you, what you're going to choose to put into the box

00:13:01 ◼   ► and understand that when things are all turned upside down, like that calculus and that choice

00:13:08 ◼   ► is going to be harder.

00:13:10 ◼   ► And unfortunately, most of the things that you can do to kind of try if you want to try

00:13:15 ◼   ► and keep your productivity normal in an unnormal time, are going to ultimately probably make

00:13:21 ◼   ► it worse in the long term.

00:13:23 ◼   ► That if you take like, it's very, very normal right now to feel emotional in big ways.

00:13:30 ◼   ► And that can be all kinds of different emotions.

00:13:32 ◼   ► But like, it's going to be just general latent emotional state right now, at least for myself

00:13:36 ◼   ► is very much higher than, you know, it was perhaps a year ago.

00:13:42 ◼   ► And so, like, understand that, but like, if I don't, if I decided to, like, instead of

00:13:47 ◼   ► taking out work, if I took out sleep, or exercise or diet or those types of things, and it's

00:13:54 ◼   ► like left, left all my work in there, my emotional state is all is necessarily going to suffer.

00:14:00 ◼   ► And ultimately, like, that's, it's going to be counterproductive that I'm going to eventually

00:14:04 ◼   ► not be able to do that, especially in a situation like this, where it isn't a short term fixed

00:14:09 ◼   ► duration, like sprint, it's this very open ended, who knows how long situation.

00:14:16 ◼   ► And so it's like, you have to be have to be planning and making choices that allow us

00:14:19 ◼   ► to be as best like the best situation that we can do for as long as we can.

00:14:24 ◼   ► And like, it's also really something that's also probably worth saying is, it's also really

00:14:29 ◼   ► a common thing, at least for myself to not know what I should be doing.

00:14:32 ◼   ► That it's easy, you know, like, for me to, like, have a nice picture of like, I have

00:14:37 ◼   ► this box, and I have these different boxes that I want to put inside of it.

00:14:39 ◼   ► And I can kind of sit there and I can play the play the Jenga game of what I want to

00:14:43 ◼   ► put in and what I want to take out.

00:14:45 ◼   ► The reality is, is very often I often just feel like I don't know what I'm doing, and

00:14:48 ◼   ► I don't know what to do.

00:14:49 ◼   ► And I think in those situations, it's certainly like there are things that I find that the

00:14:56 ◼   ► easiest things to start with are the things that you know, will sort of build you up into

00:15:00 ◼   ► things that will encourage you and improve your physical and mental health.

00:15:05 ◼   ► And putting those things in first, and then seeing what you have left to make decisions

00:15:11 ◼   ► with is a great place to, I think, start kind of just filtering through these big feelings

00:15:15 ◼   ► and dealing with like, what do you do when everything's going crazy?

00:15:19 ◼   ► It's like, start with the things that you know kind of make it better for you.

00:15:23 ◼   ► And if ultimately, like, other things fall out and things don't get put back in the

00:15:28 ◼   ► box, like, that's totally fine.

00:15:30 ◼   ► And that's totally normal.

00:15:31 ◼   ► Yeah, totally.

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00:17:16 ◼   ► One thing I've been helped by a lot during this time is that, as developers, we know

00:17:22 ◼   ► that there's some work that's just not very fun to do that we have to do.

00:17:28 ◼   ► Fixing some kind of obscure, deep crash in something that affects 1% of your people,

00:17:33 ◼   ► that's not fun.

00:17:35 ◼   ► Or adopting some new Apple technology that you kind of have to, but you haven't been

00:17:39 ◼   ► looking forward to.

00:17:40 ◼   ► Like, "Oh, great, they deprecated this entire old API, and I have to replace it with this

00:17:44 ◼   ► new thing."

00:17:45 ◼   ► There's certain kind of just grunt work involved here.

00:17:47 ◼   ► There's also fun stuff.

00:17:48 ◼   ► Everyone loves starting a new project.

00:17:50 ◼   ► New stuff is always fun.

00:17:52 ◼   ► People love starting new projects.

00:17:53 ◼   ► I can absolutely confirm this.

00:17:55 ◼   ► Yes.

00:17:56 ◼   ► Well, new projects, new features, new apps, new little fun stuff, that's like the ice

00:18:03 ◼   ► cream of development.

00:18:04 ◼   ► It's like, everyone loves that part.

00:18:06 ◼   ► Starting the new stuff is great.

00:18:08 ◼   ► Grinding away at maintenance or old stuff is less fun.

00:18:12 ◼   ► You mentioned before, trying to figure out what you want to do during this time.

00:18:16 ◼   ► One thing that helped me a lot is I wrote the entire ATP CMS in this time.

00:18:22 ◼   ► It's been a large project.

00:18:23 ◼   ► It's still ongoing because I'm building the membership stuff now.

00:18:26 ◼   ► It's still ongoing.

00:18:28 ◼   ► Starting a new project, even though I've also been doing overcast work at the same time,

00:18:32 ◼   ► but just a lot less of it.

00:18:34 ◼   ► I've been focusing much more on the ATP stuff for now because I needed something to get

00:18:40 ◼   ► me out of the unproductivity funk that I was in for a month or more at the beginning of

00:18:45 ◼   ► the project.

00:18:47 ◼   ► I knew that working on a bug fix version of overcast is not going to do that.

00:18:54 ◼   ► Working on a brand new, totally different kind of project that was a lot of fun and

00:18:58 ◼   ► it's smaller scope, easier in a lot of ways, that really got me going again.

00:19:05 ◼   ► I wouldn't say I'm in a great state of mind in the middle of all this, but my state

00:19:11 ◼   ► of mind was dramatically improved once I got going on that project.

00:19:16 ◼   ► I broke the funk.

00:19:18 ◼   ► I broke the inactive depression period.

00:19:22 ◼   ► I shoved myself into this project that made me very happy.

00:19:26 ◼   ► You mentioned exercise a minute ago and I'm sure we're going to talk more about it

00:19:30 ◼   ► in a second, but one of the reasons why you want to exercise is that you feel good after

00:19:34 ◼   ► you do it.

00:19:35 ◼   ► For me, I also feel that same kind of satisfaction when I've exercised my brain.

00:19:42 ◼   ► For a month, I didn't do that.

00:19:46 ◼   ► Once I started exercising my brain again by having these solid coding productivity days,

00:19:52 ◼   ► I felt significantly improved on those days.

00:19:55 ◼   ► I've tried to keep that going as much as I could because, again, at times like this,

00:19:59 ◼   ► take whatever you can get.

00:20:00 ◼   ► I think favored projects are doing the work that you enjoy.

00:20:06 ◼   ► There's just work that we enjoy as developers.

00:20:09 ◼   ► There's reasons why we got into this business in the first place.

00:20:12 ◼   ► There's certain kinds of problems, certain kinds of tasks that are interesting and fun.

00:20:17 ◼   ► I definitely agree that this is a tremendously good opportunity to try as best you can to

00:20:24 ◼   ► work on that.

00:20:26 ◼   ► If you have the ability and the flexibility to do that, pick up a feature or a project

00:20:31 ◼   ► or an idea that you are excited about.

00:20:34 ◼   ► Honestly, if you have any excitement about anything when it feels like the world's falling

00:20:39 ◼   ► apart, go with that.

00:20:44 ◼   ► Don't let that spark go out.

00:20:46 ◼   ► Fan that flame as much as you can and take advantage of it.

00:20:52 ◼   ► I find it's very hard to force your mind to do something it doesn't want to do or it doesn't

00:20:59 ◼   ► feel like you're excited or interested in doing.

00:21:01 ◼   ► Eventually that grunt work, that deep bug fix that you're trying to find that affects

00:21:07 ◼   ► a few numbers of people, eventually you're probably going to have to do it.

00:21:12 ◼   ► Maybe not, who knows?

00:21:13 ◼   ► Maybe it's actually not as big of a deal as you thought.

00:21:15 ◼   ► But the reality is, if you have something that's exciting to you, go for it.

00:21:19 ◼   ► That was the entire reason I just finished building this whole map, built an entire mapping

00:21:22 ◼   ► system for the Apple Watch from scratch because it just wedged in my brain.

00:21:29 ◼   ► I was like, "I'm excited about this.

00:21:31 ◼   ► I'm going to work on it."

00:21:32 ◼   ► I did and I felt productive.

00:21:34 ◼   ► Just like you said, there is something good and wholesome about building something and

00:21:41 ◼   ► being productive and having that sense that you accomplish something that is a positive

00:21:45 ◼   ► for your mental health and a positive for your ability to get back into the groove and

00:21:51 ◼   ► maybe be able to tackle less favorite projects.

00:21:53 ◼   ► But I think it's a great opportunity to think of that and to find things that you

00:22:00 ◼   ► have that kind of interest for.

00:22:02 ◼   ► This is the perfect opportunity to do that.

00:22:03 ◼   ► Whatever that might be, that can be small, that could be big, it can be learning something

00:22:07 ◼   ► that you've been wanting to learn for a while but have been putting off.

00:22:10 ◼   ► Maybe now is an interesting time to do that.

00:22:13 ◼   ► It's just going to be very different for everyone but that's definitely something that I've

00:22:16 ◼   ► been doing.

00:22:17 ◼   ► It's certainly something that I'm continuing to do.

00:22:21 ◼   ► I have my list of features that are my grown-up, "One day I'll need to deal with this bug

00:22:27 ◼   ► feature."

00:22:28 ◼   ► But the reality is I'm having much more fun and much more actual productivity building

00:22:34 ◼   ► new stuff that I think is interesting.

00:22:36 ◼   ► Every time I pick up one of those features or these bugs that I need to track down, I

00:22:40 ◼   ► end up spending four hours doing nothing.

00:22:42 ◼   ► I'm just running around hitting dead ends and my productivity and my ability to do that

00:22:47 ◼   ► kind of work right now is just limited.

00:22:49 ◼   ► I feel like that's the work you have to do when you're in a prime state where everything

00:22:53 ◼   ► is going right and everything is good.

00:22:56 ◼   ► If you're not in a prime state because everything around you is not so good, that's not the

00:23:01 ◼   ► time to worry about those features.

00:23:02 ◼   ► As best you can, just put them off.

00:23:05 ◼   ► So many other things that I think we can do outside of the work itself too.

00:23:11 ◼   ► Exercise is great just in terms of being active is just good for our well-being.

00:23:17 ◼   ► I think especially now, it is something that is so hard to be outside that whatever fitness

00:23:25 ◼   ► looks like for you, you can do some amount of exercise in any amount of space.

00:23:29 ◼   ► You don't need a huge amount of space or equipment or a situation to just be up and active and

00:23:33 ◼   ► get your blood flowing.

00:23:35 ◼   ► That has just tremendous positive effects on you.

00:23:39 ◼   ► I think another related thing is just the importance of taking breaks.

00:23:44 ◼   ► Fitness and exercise is a great break to take.

00:23:46 ◼   ► That's a nice short thing to say, "In the middle of the day, I'm going to stop and

00:23:50 ◼   ► I'm going to do 100 jumping jacks," or whatever it might be.

00:23:54 ◼   ► Do 10 push-ups.

00:23:55 ◼   ► It doesn't actually matter what you're doing, but taking breaks from your work and

00:24:00 ◼   ► exercise is a great place to do that.

00:24:02 ◼   ► That can be a short thing or a long thing, but just giving yourself permission that you

00:24:07 ◼   ► don't need to be nose to the grindstone the whole time.

00:24:11 ◼   ► Even better is perhaps if you can take those breaks and combine exercise and nature, like

00:24:16 ◼   ► going for a walk outside, going for a run, going for a bike ride, whatever is appropriate

00:24:20 ◼   ► for your situation.

00:24:22 ◼   ► I find that just being outside and being around nature is just very soothing in general.

00:24:29 ◼   ► Something that I think is a very apt and effective thing, if that's something that's possible

00:24:34 ◼   ► for you to do right now, it's a great way to take a break and reset and just lower the

00:24:41 ◼   ► – I feel like it lowers my anxiety when I'm just out in nature.

00:24:46 ◼   ► It's certainly a strategy that I've been using a lot recently to try and help.

00:24:51 ◼   ► Yeah, I've been doing all that as well because there are real reasons for this.

00:24:57 ◼   ► There's actual body chemistry and body health improvements that happen when you get any

00:25:03 ◼   ► exercise or when you get sunlight and fresh air.

00:25:07 ◼   ► This is not just mumbo jumbo, hippie stuff.

00:25:10 ◼   ► This is actually real science.

00:25:13 ◼   ► Your body actually is healthier and happier when you have exercise and fresh air and sunlight.

00:25:20 ◼   ► Do what you can.

00:25:21 ◼   ► Again, it's like because we're in a hard time, we keep saying just do what you can

00:25:25 ◼   ► to improve things for yourself and to get through it.

00:25:28 ◼   ► This is part of that.

00:25:29 ◼   ► Give yourself the best chance to feel good, as good as you can, by indulging yourself

00:25:36 ◼   ► in the things that you like, the work that you like, the activities that you like, and

00:25:41 ◼   ► by giving your body the chemistry it needs to be happy through things like exercise and

00:25:45 ◼   ► sunlight.

00:25:46 ◼   ► Yeah, and I think also, I think it's a very, very useful thing to keep in mind, as you

00:25:53 ◼   ► were saying earlier, if you just didn't work on your app for a year, how bad would

00:25:58 ◼   ► that actually be?

00:25:59 ◼   ► Would you go out of business?

00:26:00 ◼   ► Would everyone immediately stop buying it?

00:26:03 ◼   ► Possibly if you're in a rough state, but probably not.

00:26:06 ◼   ► Most apps could take a long time without major updates and be fine business-wise.

00:26:11 ◼   ► You do the updates usually because you want to or because you want to remain competitive

00:26:15 ◼   ► or whatever, but you don't actually have to do that as much as you might think.

00:26:21 ◼   ► That's something to keep in mind as well.

00:26:22 ◼   ► Finally, I think the timing of this, assuming that the rest of the year might be closer

00:26:27 ◼   ► to normal, which granted is not a safe assumption, but assuming that the worst is probably behind

00:26:33 ◼   ► us, this is actually a really good time for this in the year because we've talked about

00:26:38 ◼   ► before the seasonality of being an app developer and how right before WWDC, for the few months

00:26:44 ◼   ► before it, is a great time to not be doing a whole bunch of major changes to your app

00:26:50 ◼   ► because the whole world that we rest on is about to shift when WWDC happens and then

00:26:56 ◼   ► we have the summer of betas and the fall of releases and new hardware.

00:27:01 ◼   ► This has always been a good time of year for us to do more exploratory work or try new

00:27:06 ◼   ► projects or back off and do something fun while we wait for WWDC.

00:27:11 ◼   ► The timing of this is actually really good.

00:27:14 ◼   ► As we lead into WWDC in a couple of weeks now, I think it'll be interesting to see,

00:27:19 ◼   ► first of all, how big of a year does this end up being for Apple because they've had

00:27:22 ◼   ► challenges too because they've also been quarantined and slowed down and delayed probably in a

00:27:27 ◼   ► lot of ways.

00:27:28 ◼   ► We don't know how big of a year it's going to be for the APIs and for the platforms and

00:27:32 ◼   ► later on for the hardware, but it's interesting to think we've had all this time that we could

00:27:37 ◼   ► have been doing all this exploratory stuff and for the next few weeks we still can with

00:27:41 ◼   ► basically no burden from Apple on you better hurry up and adopt this thing because right

00:27:46 ◼   ► now we don't know what that is yet.

00:27:48 ◼   ► Honestly, I'm just excited about seeing what gets announced.

00:27:54 ◼   ► One of my favorite things is coming up with finding a favorite project or finding something

00:28:00 ◼   ► interesting.

00:28:01 ◼   ► WWDC is ground zero for that.

00:28:04 ◼   ► Here is Apple coming up and saying, "Here's all this new interesting stuff that we think

00:28:08 ◼   ► you should try and explore."

00:28:09 ◼   ► It's like, "Hooray!"

00:28:12 ◼   ► I'm really just looking forward to doing that.

00:28:16 ◼   ► It wouldn't surprise me at all if this is a year where it works well to be a bit more

00:28:22 ◼   ► exploratory and enjoy that.

00:28:26 ◼   ► Especially if there's some new thing that you think is really cool and interesting,

00:28:29 ◼   ► go for it.

00:28:30 ◼   ► If you're excited about it, it's a great time to dive into that.

00:28:35 ◼   ► I do hope that there is also something I will say that is slightly comforting to me about

00:28:41 ◼   ► the thought of a WWDC keynote that has been such a fixture in my life for so long that

00:28:47 ◼   ► there is something normative about it that it makes me hopeful that it will be an experience.

00:28:54 ◼   ► I know what to expect and I know what comes next.

00:28:56 ◼   ► Hopefully, we're getting into a more stable place and that will be a great opportunity

00:29:01 ◼   ► to hopefully have this mid-year reset and kind of re-decide what I want to work on the

00:29:06 ◼   ► rest of the year and just see where it goes.

00:29:08 ◼   ► I'm very much looking forward to it as well for all the same reasons.

00:29:12 ◼   ► As you said, the fun part of development so often is that new stuff, new projects.

00:29:19 ◼   ► Go to Xcode, file a new project, and try something totally new.

00:29:24 ◼   ► Beta season is an especially fun time to do that.

00:29:27 ◼   ► I'm looking forward to the escape that will provide and to the little opportunities for

00:29:33 ◼   ► satisfaction that we've got afterwards.

00:29:36 ◼   ► Hopefully it's a good year.

00:29:37 ◼   ► The show will be after the keynote so we will know a lot more about it and we'll do it

00:29:40 ◼   ► about that.

00:29:41 ◼   ► We will talk to you then and have a wonderful two weeks, everyone.

00:29:44 ◼   ► Thanks for listening.

00:29:45 ◼   ► Thank you.

00:29:46 ◼   ► Bye.

00:29:46 ◼   ► [BLANK_AUDIO]