Under the Radar 31: Today’s App Store Announcements
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welcome to under the radar our show
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about independent iOS app development
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I'm Marco Arment and I'm David Smith
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under the radar is never longer than 30
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minutes so let's get started so today we
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wanted to talk about these interesting
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changes that were announced about the
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App Store today as of as a time of
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record they were announced about an hour
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Apple has officially recognized the
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speed of apps of a preview times being
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being improved some updates to the auto
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renewing subscription plans and some
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expansions of capabilities to
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subscriptions there and then number
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three is they've announced that search
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ads will be coming to the App Store what
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do you say we talk about the
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subscription changes sure so as best we
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can tell and there's a great page we'll
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have a link to it in the show notes of
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like the what's new in subscriptions
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that Apple's laid out see there's some
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good color you kind of get from Phil's
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interview but the real meat of it is on
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developer.apple.com and it seems like
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there's two or three big deals one is
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that you can now essentially offer Auto
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renewing subscriptions in any app type
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this used to be really some of somewhat
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of a vaguely defined rule but you had to
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be a magazine or a cloud services
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company or a dating site I think we're
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the three things that you could do yeah
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it was always this rule has always been
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very vague it used to only be like
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periodic content first they used to be
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able to be newsstand like in the very
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very first implementation of it back in
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2011 and then it kind of expanded to be
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like well you could be newsstand or it
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could be a handful of things that we
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that had like you know recurring costs
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like cloud services companies like I
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know Evernote started using it very
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early on for their premium service and
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it was the kind of thing where you could
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apply to do it and you could submit an
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app that did it and it seemed fairly
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inconsistent as to what got through app
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review for that and what didn't and what
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counted as like an ongoing service or
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ongoing content and what didn't count
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and so it was oh it was always very kind
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of risky to attempt to do that if you
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were just like an app that wanted
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subscription revenue for for some other
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reason outside of those narrowly defined
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boxes yeah and so now that seems like
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those kind of criterias are going away
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and any app category or type is
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available I think I mean that honestly
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that's that's still left a little bit
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vague and in the language on on the page
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it still left a little bit vague it's it
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still kind of sounds like okay now any
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app category can do this but you still
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should be offering some kind of like
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ongoing service backing it or some kind
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of ongoing content delivery so it's
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still a little like so if you just made
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like a really good calculator that
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didn't have a service behind it i it's
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not entirely clear that you would be
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allowed to subscription price it yeah
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and I think that is probably the most
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significant thing to note is that it
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does seem like the like on in on the
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developer page they're talking about the
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types of an order of renewable
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subscriptions are for content or for
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services and so it doesn't sound like in
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the sense of if you wanted to just say
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like here's my app and you will pay me
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whatever a few dollars a month a year to
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use this going forward that you would be
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able to you'd there'd have to be
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something that you were giving the user
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on an ongoing basis and I'm sure there's
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many ways around that like you can just
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kind of structure something in your app
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that will make that you know check that
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box but it doesn't sound like in in if
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you were just trying to do like a
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general purpose if you want to use my
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app you have to pay that doesn't sound
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like that's quite there um but it's
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expanding it certainly more and I
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imagine as we this gets rolled out and
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people start sort of pushing the edges
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of it will have a better understanding
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of exactly what that means but at the
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very least more people are going to be
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able to do subscriptions than could do
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subscriptions before yeah and it seems
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like the implementation of them is
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certainly improving but it seems like
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it's based on the auto renewing
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subscription type that we've had since
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2011 it you know it's it's still it
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isn't like some kind of separate app
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store payment structure like you know
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free versus paid upfront like it's not
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going to be like a automatic it seems
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like it's going to be a lot more like
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had before which is here's an in-app
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purchase type you have to as a developer
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you have to code the support for this a
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net purchase type in your app you
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probably have to write the backing
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service to validate them I'm not sure
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there's gonna be like I'm sure there's
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companies that will do that for you for
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a fee but you know you are still kind of
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manually implementing this in your app
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so it's not it's not as easy as you know
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if you have a paid app a paid upfront
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app you literally just like set a box
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and iTunes Connect saying this app costs
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X dollars and you don't have to deal
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with anything else ever again you know
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in relation to collecting money from
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people it's not going to be that easy
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it's it's still an in-app purchase that
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you have to code for you have to account
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for in your app ultimately though I
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think this is the better way to do it
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because this gives you flexibility in
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the app to do things like what if you
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know what if you want to have some
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amount of your apps functionality or
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content be available with it without
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subscribing and then have some other
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section of it be available with the
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subscription then you know this allows
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you to set that balance yourself so that
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I think is is the right way to do this
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ultimately though this is you know
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assuming that that they will allow all
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apps to use this which again it's the
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wording is kind of vague that I think it
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boils down to this one sentence on on
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the page on their site which says
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although all categories of apps will be
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eligible this Benzema this business
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model is not appropriate for every app
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so I guess it depends on their
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definition of eligible and appropriate
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it does that mean does appropriate mean
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they don't recommend we do it or does
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appropriate mean they won't let us do it
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so that's that's again still unknown but
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I think subscription pricing is a really
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really interesting compromise to what
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developers have been asking for in the
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App Store for a long time which is like
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you know upgrades trials some some kind
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of way to make money from people ongoing
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because software as we've just before
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you know software people expect ongoing
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functionality they expect updates they
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expect bug fixes they expect you to be
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putting in effort to improve and fix
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your software over time for them and so
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when they pay for it they expect not
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only am i paying for the software to use
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now I'm paying for upgrades forever like
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that's basically you know as much as
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developers like to like to fight against
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that with things like different versions
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and paid upgrades the way people
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is I pay for this thing and therefore I
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expect updates forever and so to try to
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try to track the balance between like
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what users want which is paying either a
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zero or one time and then getting this
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forever and versus what we need which is
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ongoing revenue to fund the development
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of these ongoing things and to fix
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things over time and to improve things
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over time subscriptions I think are a
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really good compromise there because
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look we're never gonna get paid upgrades
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in the App Store we're never gonna get
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like automated free trials this is the
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they're giving us the system now they
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gave us in-app purchase at first to to
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kind of first semi simulate free trials
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and types of upgrades sort of and now
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they're giving us subscriptions to to
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basically replace ongoing upgrade
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revenue and there's some ups there's
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some downs but I think it's pretty clear
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this is Apple's message this is this is
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them saying like we're not giving you
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those other things this is what we're
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giving you figure out a way to make this
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work for you or to make the other stuff
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that we already offer through in-app
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purchase work for you and there's the
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user side of this of course is is a big
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question mark but the the developer side
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as I think is very very clear now is if
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you want ongoing revenue you know for
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for people who just use your app if you
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want on long everything you need to
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either find a way to to convince them to
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pay for this for a subscription price
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like this or you have to do something
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like advertising where you just kind of
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automatically get paid with with usage
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of your app over time I don't know what
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do you think it's definitely a mixed
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feeling that I have when I spent I saw
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this news because on the one hand I'm
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very glad that something is happening
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like oK we've talked about for many
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episodes like there's a lot of things
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that feel not great in the App Store and
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for years it's felt like nothing was
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ever gonna change like what we had is
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just what it was and that's where it was
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going to be in eternity and I'm very
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excited that things are changing that
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whether this is a result of Phil
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Schiller taking over the App Store more
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fully or if it was just time for this to
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happen or whatever the reason something
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has caused this like changes to start
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happening the things are starting to
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sort of bubble up in the App Store and
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are changing which overall I'm pretty
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excited about because I think things
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weren't in a great place and I mean you
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never know it could be worse overall in
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the end but I'd rather have I'd rather
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to sort of find my way in a store that
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was evolving and changing because in a
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lot of ways like being a small developer
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there's a lot of benefits when things
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are more in flux because I can try
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things out with much less overhead and
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kind of dive in and there's less risk
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than if I was a bigger company I can be
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a bit more flexible and agile in that
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way so overall I like that I'm not sure
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if an annex and expansion of auto
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renewable subscriptions is like
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fundamentally going to improve the
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situation in terms of making a viable
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business in the app store it's I think
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the types of applications where it will
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make sense exist but they are more and
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more limited and the thing that I worry
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about as a user is if this is where
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software goes but like if all of my
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software requires an ongoing
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subscription to have there's a very I
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think you'll hit a fatigue point with
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that where customers won't want to
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download software or new software if in
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their mind it's going to come you know
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come with it a monthly charge of a
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dollar a month or whatever it is into
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their you know on their iTunes account
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every single month in order to use any
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of the apps and if they stop paying all
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of a sudden all their apps stop working
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and so I would imagine a lot of
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customers would you know fight against
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would push against that and in many ways
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that could push even stronger pressure
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towards the just sort of like software
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being free model where the expectation
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is that it'll be free and the reality is
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in the App Store right now I mean this
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is my own experience from trying every
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business model known to man is that the
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most success I've ever had is in the
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just sort of give it all away for free
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and put ads in it model which I don't
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I have a hard time believing that the
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percentage of my customers who would be
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willing to pay a non insignificant
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amount I mean one thing that I'm very
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curious about yes there's a bunch of
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stuff in here about different like 200
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different price points and you can
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specify different price points in
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different territories and there's a lot
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more flexibility there and I'm really
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intrigued to see if we're going to get
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something where the payments that you we
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are charging can be lower or like in a
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way that charging somebody a couple of
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dollars a year maybe much maybe a bit
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more palatable than charging them a
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minimum of 99 cents per month which I
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believe is the in the current form of
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Auto renewing in-app purchases that's
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the lowest tier you could do is a dollar
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a month and maybe it's maybe I'm being a
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little hard hard on my own software but
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I I don't think a lot of people would
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view a lot of what I make is worth more
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than that where they're paying twelve
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twelve dollars a year for it and but
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maybe they would be willing to pay a few
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dollars a year for it and so if there's
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those types of things that's interesting
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to me and I'm also quite interested in
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the way that like in-app purchase or
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auto renewing has a lot of flexibility
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in it like the actual fundamental API as
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it exists today and I imagine going
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forward or it has built-in support for
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things like free trials and bonus
00:12:36
◼
►
periods and things where you can have a
00:12:39
◼
►
bit more flexibility about the way the
00:12:42
◼
►
first you know someone is I'm being
00:12:43
◼
►
unboard into paying for your sock for
00:12:46
◼
►
your you know for your software for your
00:12:47
◼
►
service so that's certainly nice in
00:12:50
◼
►
terms of a lot of people have been
00:12:52
◼
►
asking for years for free trials on the
00:12:53
◼
►
App Store and with in-app purchase you
00:12:56
◼
►
can sort of get there you know they're
00:12:58
◼
►
exactly how that goes like is gonna be
00:13:00
◼
►
an interesting thing to navigate an app
00:13:02
◼
►
review of app review typically doesn't
00:13:04
◼
►
allow your app to be have a time limited
00:13:08
◼
►
free trial but you can sort of get
00:13:10
◼
►
around that if a your app is tied to an
00:13:12
◼
►
online service and so will we be able to
00:13:16
◼
►
work something out there but
00:13:18
◼
►
I said overall it's kind of this weird
00:13:20
◼
►
mixed feeling of I feel like I'm glad
00:13:22
◼
►
that this is changing I really hope this
00:13:25
◼
►
isn't the only change that we're gonna
00:13:27
◼
►
see in the near future but I think it's
00:13:30
◼
►
a good thing overall that it's happening
00:13:32
◼
►
and the reality is even if maybe only a
00:13:35
◼
►
few a very particular genre of
00:13:40
◼
►
application will now be made more viable
00:13:42
◼
►
maybe that's that's enough I don't know
00:13:45
◼
►
it doesn't have to benefit me or you
00:13:46
◼
►
necessarily but if all of a sudden
00:13:49
◼
►
there's you know a few hundred
00:13:50
◼
►
developers who can now make a viable run
00:13:53
◼
►
at the App Store like that sounds great
00:13:55
◼
►
overall yeah I mean and you know as you
00:13:59
◼
►
said like that I don't think this is
00:14:00
◼
►
going to address you know that there are
00:14:02
◼
►
basically two challenges that that are
00:14:04
◼
►
that developers face for monetization in
00:14:06
◼
►
the App Store two big ones
00:14:07
◼
►
one of which one of those challenges is
00:14:09
◼
►
when people do want to give you money
00:14:12
◼
►
our options for how to collect that
00:14:14
◼
►
money have been limited and this
00:14:16
◼
►
addresses that head-on this gives a lot
00:14:19
◼
►
more developers a way to collect money
00:14:21
◼
►
in a different way that might be a
00:14:22
◼
►
better way that might earn them more
00:14:23
◼
►
over time and the second challenge that
00:14:26
◼
►
developers face is from conversation is
00:14:28
◼
►
that there's just so many other apps out
00:14:30
◼
►
there that it's hard to give in people
00:14:32
◼
►
to pay anything for your app if there's
00:14:34
◼
►
a million other free ones that do
00:14:35
◼
►
something close enough and this don't
00:14:38
◼
►
this is not going to address that at all
00:14:40
◼
►
I do I do kind of argue though in
00:14:43
◼
►
general that that's not really Apple's
00:14:45
◼
►
problem that's that's our problem as
00:14:47
◼
►
developers like that's just the market
00:14:48
◼
►
that the market is full of competition
00:14:50
◼
►
and full of alternatives and if somebody
00:14:53
◼
►
else can do can offer the same thing for
00:14:54
◼
►
us that that we can for cheaper then you
00:14:57
◼
►
know good on that like that's that's
00:14:59
◼
►
their prerogative and so I don't I think
00:15:02
◼
►
this is Apple doing what they can to
00:15:04
◼
►
help apps that are worth paying for earn
00:15:08
◼
►
more money or collect money more easily
00:15:10
◼
►
and and to solve oh you know ongoing
00:15:12
◼
►
revenue in a new way which before we go
00:15:15
◼
►
we only had basically we had crappy ways
00:15:18
◼
►
to do it before and now we have a less
00:15:20
◼
►
crappy way to do it potentially I have
00:15:22
◼
►
in the past written about how much I
00:15:23
◼
►
didn't like the implementation of Auto
00:15:25
◼
►
renewing subscriptions I am reserving
00:15:28
◼
►
judgment of this new one until I see it
00:15:30
◼
►
and possibly
00:15:31
◼
►
even use it for my subscriptions we'll
00:15:33
◼
►
see but I I they say they're changing it
00:15:36
◼
►
this is like you know subscriptions 2.0
00:15:38
◼
►
they're saying so I'm willing to give it
00:15:40
◼
►
it will see if it's improved in in in
00:15:43
◼
►
meaningful ways it sounds it sounds from
00:15:45
◼
►
the language and the pigs that that it
00:15:46
◼
►
has so I will wait and see on that the
00:15:48
◼
►
other before we quickly leave this topic
00:15:50
◼
►
the other thing to talk about on the
00:15:52
◼
►
subscription front is that they they're
00:15:54
◼
►
changing the revenue split that they are
00:15:57
◼
►
so normally the revenue split is 70/30
00:15:59
◼
►
Apple gets we get seventy applicants
00:16:01
◼
►
31st for Auto renewing subscriptions of
00:16:04
◼
►
this new type are all actually for auto
00:16:07
◼
►
doing subscriptions there's changing the
00:16:09
◼
►
split from 70/30 to 85 15 after the
00:16:13
◼
►
first year so any subscriber you've had
00:16:16
◼
►
for more than a year you will start to
00:16:18
◼
►
earn more from them you'll start to earn
00:16:20
◼
►
85% set of 70% so this is basically
00:16:24
◼
►
incentivizing you to create you know
00:16:27
◼
►
it's if you have a way to make money
00:16:28
◼
►
from people over time this is
00:16:30
◼
►
incentivizing you to both use this
00:16:32
◼
►
system for for doing that and to to make
00:16:36
◼
►
something that is worth people
00:16:38
◼
►
subscribing to for more than a year and
00:16:39
◼
►
that's kind of cool and it's it's kind
00:16:42
◼
►
of cool to see you know this is this is
00:16:44
◼
►
the the first exception to the 70/30
00:16:47
◼
►
rule at least that's been publicized in
00:16:50
◼
►
the history of the App Store there I was
00:16:51
◼
►
able to find an article on I think was
00:16:54
◼
►
recode that I'll link to in the show
00:16:56
◼
►
notes from back in April that said that
00:16:59
◼
►
some of the video services on the Apple
00:17:01
◼
►
TV we're getting this 85/15 deal right
00:17:04
◼
►
up front as part of the negotiation with
00:17:06
◼
►
Apple but other than that I have never
00:17:08
◼
►
heard of any exceptions to the to the
00:17:10
◼
►
70/30 split so I think that was
00:17:12
◼
►
interesting and it's originally
00:17:13
◼
►
considered to like where Apple might go
00:17:15
◼
►
with a 7 with the 85 15 option in the
00:17:18
◼
►
future they can use this as a way to
00:17:20
◼
►
incentivize development to in a certain
00:17:23
◼
►
way or on certain platforms that need
00:17:25
◼
►
help so for instance they could you know
00:17:27
◼
►
if if Apple TV isn't getting enough
00:17:29
◼
►
developer attention they could say all
00:17:30
◼
►
right now everything on Apple TV is
00:17:31
◼
►
85/15 if if they wanted to incentivize
00:17:34
◼
►
people to go to the Mac App Store they
00:17:35
◼
►
could say all right now all Mac App
00:17:36
◼
►
Store apps are 85/15 so something
00:17:39
◼
►
interesting interesting to consider is
00:17:40
◼
►
like using using this this new lower
00:17:43
◼
►
lower Commission basically
00:17:45
◼
►
so we make more money as a way to
00:17:47
◼
►
incentivize different development or
00:17:49
◼
►
apps on different platforms that that
00:17:51
◼
►
need incentives to spur development
00:17:53
◼
►
exactly and I think the the actual in be
00:17:57
◼
►
like impact of this in this narrow case
00:17:59
◼
►
is it's nice I mean I guess if I had a
00:18:02
◼
►
subscription that had more than a
00:18:03
◼
►
years-long like subscriber base I love
00:18:07
◼
►
it like one day my revenue just goes up
00:18:10
◼
►
a little but like by far the more
00:18:11
◼
►
fundamental thing that this is really in
00:18:13
◼
►
treating with is it's the first sort of
00:18:16
◼
►
chink in the in my in the like well it
00:18:19
◼
►
will always be 70/30 for everything
00:18:21
◼
►
forever and if that's no longer true and
00:18:24
◼
►
it's like demonstrably not true that in
00:18:27
◼
►
this particular case they're changing
00:18:28
◼
►
the split what else could they change
00:18:30
◼
►
the split on like you said and driving
00:18:32
◼
►
they can incentivize whatever they want
00:18:34
◼
►
and that's intriguing you know are what
00:18:37
◼
►
you could imagine things where it's a
00:18:39
◼
►
different revenue split for the first
00:18:42
◼
►
revenue you make in a year to try and
00:18:44
◼
►
help smaller developers you could
00:18:47
◼
►
imagine you know trying to encourage
00:18:48
◼
►
people to different platforms to try
00:18:50
◼
►
different incentivize different business
00:18:52
◼
►
models there's all kinds of things that
00:18:54
◼
►
not having it be strictly 70/30
00:18:57
◼
►
everywhere you know can certainly make
00:19:00
◼
►
the imagination run wild with and so you
00:19:03
◼
►
know it's certainly a good thing I don't
00:19:05
◼
►
think it's immediate I can if your
00:19:07
◼
►
business wasn't viable at 70/30 having
00:19:10
◼
►
to wait a year for it to switch to 85 15
00:19:13
◼
►
to become viable seems a little bit of a
00:19:15
◼
►
stretch but it's certainly you know I'll
00:19:18
◼
►
take it it's better than nothing for
00:19:20
◼
►
sure our sponsor this week is Braintree
00:19:23
◼
►
now we talked about ease of payments
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►
right this is this is a perfect sponsor
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00:20:04
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/ radar that's it once again
00:20:07
◼
►
Braintree payments comm / radar thanks
00:20:09
◼
►
to Braintree for sponsoring our show
00:20:11
◼
►
once again all right so let's talk about
00:20:13
◼
►
app store search ads this was rumored a
00:20:16
◼
►
few a few weeks or months ago and it now
00:20:20
◼
►
it apparently is real they are really
00:20:21
◼
►
doing app store search ads and so what
00:20:25
◼
►
do you think I'm not delighted that's
00:20:30
◼
►
the things that I think so probably good
00:20:33
◼
►
at paint paint a word picture as they
00:20:35
◼
►
say for what's happening is in the App
00:20:38
◼
►
Store when you go to the Search tab and
00:20:40
◼
►
you type in what you're looking at what
00:20:42
◼
►
you're looking for they will now be
00:20:44
◼
►
potentially a ad at the top of that
00:20:47
◼
►
screen you can get an example of this if
00:20:50
◼
►
you go to the search ads page in our
00:20:52
◼
►
show notes and the placement there is
00:20:55
◼
►
going to be based on an auction and a
00:20:58
◼
►
combination of who's willing to pay the
00:21:00
◼
►
most for that spot as well as some vague
00:21:03
◼
►
relevance metric but essentially people
00:21:06
◼
►
are going to be able to pay money to
00:21:07
◼
►
appear in the App Store Search tab at
00:21:11
◼
►
the top of the results which is pretty a
00:21:14
◼
►
pretty big deal like Apple even says on
00:21:16
◼
►
their page that about 65 percent of
00:21:18
◼
►
downloads come from searching in the App
00:21:21
◼
►
Store so you know a substantial majority
00:21:24
◼
►
is going to be coming from there and the
00:21:27
◼
►
things that come to mind first and I see
00:21:29
◼
►
this is this really is unfortunate for
00:21:32
◼
►
apps that are currently the second
00:21:34
◼
►
search result for a particular term
00:21:36
◼
►
things are gonna fall off the screen
00:21:37
◼
►
because previously like back in the old
00:21:40
◼
►
days when you would did a search you
00:21:41
◼
►
would be able to see maybe like five or
00:21:42
◼
►
six results at once then they switch to
00:21:44
◼
►
the cards view we have now where your
00:21:47
◼
►
first two screenshots are a screenshot
00:21:49
◼
►
and your app preview are shown on that
00:21:51
◼
►
first screen and so they take up a lot
00:21:53
◼
►
more vertical space and so you can see
00:21:54
◼
►
the top result and the teeny little bit
00:21:59
◼
►
of the second result and now if there's
00:22:02
◼
►
an ad you're only ever going to see that
00:22:03
◼
►
top result and the paid ad so that's a
00:22:06
◼
►
little unfortunate because I've
00:22:08
◼
►
definitely seen in my own apps where if
00:22:10
◼
►
you fall off that first page
00:22:13
◼
►
yes if the user has to scroll it's a
00:22:15
◼
►
substantial reduction in user interest
00:22:18
◼
►
views on your page etc so that's a
00:22:21
◼
►
pretty big deal if now only two apps are
00:22:24
◼
►
gonna be shown in that in the initial
00:22:27
◼
►
search screen one of them is paid to get
00:22:29
◼
►
there and the other one is just the top
00:22:30
◼
►
result so if you're the top results like
00:22:32
◼
►
hooray things are looking good for you
00:22:34
◼
►
if you're the second result or below
00:22:36
◼
►
it's getting worse and then there's just
00:22:40
◼
►
like the fundamental thing about it when
00:22:42
◼
►
I look at it that feels it feels weird
00:22:45
◼
►
to have to pay to show up in search
00:22:49
◼
►
rather than search just being really
00:22:52
◼
►
relevant and helpful and I can see the
00:22:56
◼
►
areas where this unlike this is helpful
00:22:57
◼
►
where if you're launching a new app and
00:22:59
◼
►
you you know you're never gonna be the
00:23:02
◼
►
first search result on your first day
00:23:04
◼
►
and so you want to try and find your way
00:23:07
◼
►
into that like you can do a big spend on
00:23:09
◼
►
that first day and hope you know I hope
00:23:11
◼
►
that really helps at your launch and
00:23:13
◼
►
that sort of makes sense
00:23:15
◼
►
and it makes a lot of sense I suppose
00:23:16
◼
►
for someone generic terms but what I
00:23:20
◼
►
worry about a lot is how is the HAR
00:23:23
◼
►
they're going to police and manage you
00:23:26
◼
►
know and someone searches for a specific
00:23:27
◼
►
app you know so someone goes into the
00:23:29
◼
►
App Store and searches for a pedometer
00:23:31
◼
►
plus plus and my competitor like right
00:23:35
◼
►
now if you go into the App Store and
00:23:36
◼
►
search pedometer plus plus I'm the
00:23:38
◼
►
number one result which intuitively
00:23:40
◼
►
makes sense but if I in the future you
00:23:43
◼
►
do that search the top result is going
00:23:45
◼
►
to be a competitor of mine who wants to
00:23:49
◼
►
be placed on the top of there that feels
00:23:52
◼
►
really weird
00:23:53
◼
►
and am I gonna have to pay for that like
00:23:55
◼
►
am I gonna have to start paying like
00:23:58
◼
►
protection money to keep people
00:24:00
◼
►
searching for my apps name relevant to
00:24:03
◼
►
me you know so that I would be the both
00:24:05
◼
►
I guess the paid results and the natural
00:24:08
◼
►
result like that starts to feel really
00:24:11
◼
►
weird and awkward and not great but I
00:24:16
◼
►
mean I don't know if this seems like
00:24:18
◼
►
this is the new reality then I'm just
00:24:20
◼
►
gonna deal with that and try as best I
00:24:24
◼
►
can to work it
00:24:25
◼
►
work up to my favor but I definitely
00:24:27
◼
►
have a lot more apprehension about this
00:24:29
◼
►
than I do about the subscriptions change
00:24:31
◼
►
honestly I am excited about search ads
00:24:34
◼
►
because like if you look through their
00:24:35
◼
►
page it seems like it's it's more
00:24:38
◼
►
complicated and both both more simple
00:24:40
◼
►
more complicated than than what I would
00:24:41
◼
►
have guessed it is auction-based which i
00:24:43
◼
►
think is good and if you look they have
00:24:46
◼
►
a little screenshot of the interface to
00:24:48
◼
►
buy one of these ads and they say also
00:24:51
◼
►
like it says ads will only be shown as
00:24:54
◼
►
relevant to the search query if an ad is
00:24:55
◼
►
not relevant to what the users looking
00:24:57
◼
►
for it will not be shown regardless of
00:24:59
◼
►
how much you're willing to pay so that
00:25:01
◼
►
means it it sounds like they're gonna
00:25:03
◼
►
try to make it impossible for you to
00:25:05
◼
►
like keyword spam in a way that would be
00:25:07
◼
►
kind of odd or uncomfortable or
00:25:10
◼
►
inappropriate I'm curious to see how
00:25:12
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that works out in practice that sounds
00:25:13
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really great if it works and also it
00:25:15
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looks like you can kind of let them kind
00:25:19
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of like place you automatically if you
00:25:21
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want to or you can add in certain
00:25:22
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keywords that you want to be that you
00:25:24
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want to like bid on also but it seems
00:25:26
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like it's a fairly high level buying
00:25:28
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process rather than like a low level all
00:25:30
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right whenever you search for this exact
00:25:32
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string I will pay up to up to five
00:25:35
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dollars two beads to be on that first
00:25:36
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spot like it isn't quite that rigid or
00:25:39
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that or that specific it looks like so
00:25:41
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I'm really curious to see how they do
00:25:43
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this as a developer like I right now
00:25:45
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it's like okay well right now over cash
00:25:47
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is growing at a rate that's okay but I'd
00:25:49
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like it to grow faster I'm willing to
00:25:51
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pay a little bit for that how do I do
00:25:52
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that I mean the App Store is the perfect
00:25:55
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like app store search is the perfect
00:25:56
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place for me to do that
00:25:58
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as far as I know from before I mean if
00:26:00
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you've ever done it it seems like it
00:26:02
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would be the perfect place to do that
00:26:03
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I'm willing to pay money if somebody
00:26:05
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searches for like podcasts to pet to be
00:26:07
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in that top slot I'm like I'm willing to
00:26:10
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try that and so to have this new option
00:26:13
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to grow my app if it's done tastefully
00:26:15
◼
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which it looks like it might be this
00:26:17
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honestly looks very promising the way
00:26:19
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that on this page they've set up here I
00:26:21
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would love to have that option and it
00:26:24
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looks like it's probably not going to
00:26:26
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make it impossible for other apps to get
00:26:28
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discovered because it's so limited to
00:26:30
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like what people can buy and and you
00:26:32
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know what portion of the screen is
00:26:34
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devoted to this ad I think it looks like
00:26:36
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it's gonna be good but we'll see I mean
00:26:39
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thinking's gonna take a lot of
00:26:40
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experimentation I've actually you know
00:26:41
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trying the system out spending of you
00:26:43
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know maybe a few hundred dollars buying
00:26:44
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some ads first and see like we know what
00:26:46
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works what doesn't
00:26:47
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there's a lot of ways to advertise for
00:26:49
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apps and most of them don't work very
00:26:50
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well this one might work so I'm excited
00:26:53
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you know I think this will be I think
00:26:55
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this could be really good and there's
00:26:57
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definitely like we've said with all this
00:26:58
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like I love that they're trying
00:27:00
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something that they're not yeah like
00:27:02
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that part of it is good and sort of
00:27:05
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unequivocally I'm very I would rather
00:27:07
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things like this exist and make me a
00:27:09
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little nervous
00:27:09
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then things not exist at all and make me
00:27:12
◼
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be even more nervous that this platform
00:27:14
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that I make my living on is just
00:27:16
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stagnant so I'm definitely excited that
00:27:18
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it exists and it's interesting to to
00:27:21
◼
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think about how having to think about my
00:27:25
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like all my customers from the
00:27:27
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perspective of what are they worth to me
00:27:29
◼
►
is like the immediately thought maybe
00:27:31
◼
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this is just like me and my numbers
00:27:33
◼
►
brain where I think about these things
00:27:34
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but essentially what it comes down to is
00:27:35
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I now have to in a very concrete way say
00:27:38
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what is a customer worth to me because I
00:27:41
◼
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can now in many ways pay that amount of
00:27:44
◼
►
money to acquire that customer or at
00:27:48
◼
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least have a promising venue with which
00:27:51
◼
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to acquire them and so if I can say you
00:27:53
◼
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know a new user is worth 50 cents to me
00:27:56
◼
►
and I can come into the search ads page
00:27:59
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and pay you know 49 cents for that user
00:28:03
◼
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I'm coming out ahead I as soon as I can
00:28:06
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understand and wrap my arms around what
00:28:08
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like these are all like the terms like
00:28:10
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the average value per of each customer
00:28:12
◼
►
and those kinds of things once I can do
00:28:14
◼
►
that I can sit down and say okay I'm
00:28:17
◼
►
just going to pay as long as I break
00:28:19
◼
►
even or slightly come out ahead I can
00:28:23
◼
►
keep putting you into this weird cycle
00:28:26
◼
►
where I can just keep taking money out
00:28:27
◼
►
of the app and putting it in to a point
00:28:29
◼
►
mm-hmm and maybe the value of my
00:28:31
◼
►
customers will go down at a certain
00:28:33
◼
►
point as you do that like new there's a
00:28:34
◼
►
dilution effect but overall it certainly
00:28:37
◼
►
is a very intriguing way and maybe it's
00:28:39
◼
►
a good thing for you know for us as app
00:28:43
◼
►
developers to be forced to think of our
00:28:45
◼
►
apps in a more tangible business sense
00:28:48
◼
►
in that way that it isn't this kind of
00:28:49
◼
►
vague crafty thing that I'm sort of like
00:28:52
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►
I don't really know
00:28:53
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►
the value of it's kind of like I just
00:28:55
◼
►
make this stuff and I put it out in the
00:28:56
◼
►
world it's like no each I can sit down
00:28:58
◼
►
and say I get this much revenue from
00:29:00
◼
►
this many users that means each user is
00:29:03
◼
►
worth this much to me so I can pay up to
00:29:05
◼
►
this amount to acquire new ones and
00:29:06
◼
►
that's that's maybe a good thing for us
00:29:09
◼
►
to have to think about and I think it
00:29:11
◼
►
it can help newcomers like everyone's a
00:29:13
◼
►
little bit worried like what's this
00:29:14
◼
►
gonna do to the toy like the little guys
00:29:15
◼
►
I thinks will actually help newcomers
00:29:17
◼
►
give them an option that if they
00:29:19
◼
►
wouldn't otherwise be visible for a
00:29:21
◼
►
search query give them away to get in
00:29:24
◼
►
there you know like that I think this
00:29:26
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►
actually could be really good if done
00:29:27
◼
►
right and it looks pretty promising so
00:29:29
◼
►
far so we'll have to see all right and
00:29:31
◼
►
finally we want to very briefly talk
00:29:33
◼
►
about the the app review times being
00:29:36
◼
►
formally acknowledged you know we said
00:29:38
◼
►
that this would be great if this sticks
00:29:40
◼
►
around and one of the ways to make sure
00:29:42
◼
►
it'll stick around is if Apple formally
00:29:45
◼
►
acknowledges it in public and they did
00:29:46
◼
►
so fast a preview is probably sticking
00:29:49
◼
►
around and that's great thank you for
00:29:51
◼
►
listening everybody thanks to Braintree
00:29:53
◼
►
for sponsoring and we'll talk to you all
00:29:54
◼
►
next week bye