Hello Internet

00:00:00 ◼   ► saying as you and I are both wearing

00:00:01 ◼   ► hello internet merchandise at the moment

00:00:03 ◼   ► you wearing a reunion swamp in t-shirt

00:00:06 ◼   ► and me that mighty nailing gear who it

00:00:09 ◼   ► does remind me of a question I've been

00:00:10 ◼   ► meaning to ask you for a while yeah I

00:00:12 ◼   ► don't want to put you on the spot here

00:00:14 ◼   ► but I am I had made for you and had sent

00:00:17 ◼   ► to you Oh a pair of hello Internet

00:00:20 ◼   ► limited edition sneakers Oh

00:00:22 ◼   ► oh yes I didn't really expect you to

00:00:26 ◼   ► wear them cuz you know you're you but

00:00:28 ◼   ► I'm curious as to what's happened to

00:00:30 ◼   ► them well I mean Brady I I think you

00:00:31 ◼   ► know I'm a real sneaker head I'm a big

00:00:35 ◼   ► fan of collecting sneakers yeah one of

00:00:37 ◼   ► the things when you're in the sneaker

00:00:39 ◼   ► head world or the sneaker verse as we

00:00:42 ◼   ► call it right is you you want to keep

00:00:45 ◼   ► your really special sneakers in mint

00:00:48 ◼   ► condition

00:00:49 ◼   ► yeah absolute pristine mint condition

00:00:52 ◼   ► suniverse is a good name as well who

00:00:54 ◼   ► universe I'll pass that on to the other

00:00:56 ◼   ► sneaker heads and see okay see how that

00:00:58 ◼   ► gets accepted on the ICQ where we chat

00:01:01 ◼   ► don't get me wrong I mean I have a pair

00:01:03 ◼   ► I wear and a second pair in mint

00:01:05 ◼   ► condition so I have my mint condition

00:01:06 ◼   ► pair I'm just wondering where your mint

00:01:09 ◼   ► condition pair is oh you want to know

00:01:13 ◼   ► where it is yeah I don't think you're

00:01:15 ◼   ► wearing them okay it's pride of place in

00:01:18 ◼   ► the house Brady they're in a box which

00:01:22 ◼   ► is behind my laundry hamper so that it

00:01:26 ◼   ► is as safe and as protected an item can

00:01:30 ◼   ► be in the house

00:01:31 ◼   ► if robbers were ever to show up they

00:01:33 ◼   ► won't find the hello internet sneakers

00:01:35 ◼   ► I'm impressed they're in the house I'm

00:01:37 ◼   ► happy with that I'll take that do you

00:01:38 ◼   ► feel like that's a victory yeah

00:01:40 ◼   ► did you honestly think Brady that I

00:01:42 ◼   ► might tell you that I had thrown away

00:01:43 ◼   ► the hello internet sneakers that you

00:01:45 ◼   ► have lovingly handmade well I didn't

00:01:48 ◼   ► think you'd tell me you had but I still

00:01:49 ◼   ► think there is a chance you have I think

00:01:51 ◼   ► it's more likely you've read them like

00:01:54 ◼   ► you sent them to a relative or someone

00:01:56 ◼   ► who listens to the show mm-hmm with my

00:01:58 ◼   ► same shoe size is that who I would send

00:02:00 ◼   ► it to well yeah I imagine you must have

00:02:03 ◼   ► some relative with the same same shoe

00:02:05 ◼   ► size as you probably yeah family trees

00:02:08 ◼   ► are quite extensive but now you haven't

00:02:10 ◼   ► reqif didn't know they're in my house

00:02:12 ◼   ► they

00:02:13 ◼   ► Henry gifted they are in mint condition

00:02:15 ◼   ► and shall remain so for ever I think

00:02:20 ◼   ► maybe I have been ever mint condition

00:02:25 ◼   ► conundrum at the moment hmm because for

00:02:29 ◼   ► my birthday which was back in June

00:02:31 ◼   ► mm-hmm I really wanted the Saturn 5 Lego

00:02:36 ◼   ► rocket that was released around that

00:02:39 ◼   ► time with 1969 pieces it was one of the

00:02:42 ◼   ► most impressive Lego things I'd ever

00:02:44 ◼   ► seen so I said to my wife because she

00:02:46 ◼   ► never knows what to get me for my

00:02:47 ◼   ► birthday I said that's what I want

00:02:49 ◼   ► mm-hmm so she got it for me I was over

00:02:52 ◼   ► the moon I was very pleased with it but

00:02:57 ◼   ► I haven't made it partly because I

00:03:00 ◼   ► haven't had time but also like I like

00:03:02 ◼   ► that it's in its box and in mint

00:03:04 ◼   ► condition and like I kind of like the

00:03:06 ◼   ► box and like knowing that all the pieces

00:03:08 ◼   ► of it and they're all beautifully

00:03:09 ◼   ► arranged and and I kind of don't want to

00:03:12 ◼   ► make it I'm seriously wondering if it's

00:03:14 ◼   ► still on sale whether I should buy a

00:03:16 ◼   ► second one so I can make one and keep

00:03:18 ◼   ► one in mint condition in a box as like a

00:03:20 ◼   ► display think I have some follow-up

00:03:24 ◼   ► questions here Brady hmm I feel like I

00:03:27 ◼   ► have ended up with a mint condition item

00:03:30 ◼   ► in my house through a series of

00:03:32 ◼   ► extraordinary circumstances but yeah

00:03:35 ◼   ► I've started a podcast with a friend

00:03:37 ◼   ► that podcast ended up creating

00:03:39 ◼   ► merchandise straight from the brain of

00:03:42 ◼   ► my friend who shipped some right to my

00:03:43 ◼   ► house it's not ordinary circumstances

00:03:45 ◼   ► that such a thing would exist

00:03:47 ◼   ► yeah you however are looking to

00:03:51 ◼   ► intentionally have a mint condition Lego

00:03:54 ◼   ► box and I'm imagining this is quite a

00:03:56 ◼   ► big Lego box like what's the size of

00:03:57 ◼   ► this thing I would say it's about the

00:04:00 ◼   ► size of two cake boxes two or three cake

00:04:03 ◼   ► boxes how the cake box as compared to

00:04:07 ◼   ► bread baskets I don't know this measure

00:04:08 ◼   ► you know the hello internet sneaker box

00:04:10 ◼   ► yes it's about the size of three of them

00:04:12 ◼   ► okay I have a sense of that but for the

00:04:14 ◼   ► listeners those who did not acquire

00:04:17 ◼   ► hello internet sneakers how many

00:04:18 ◼   ► Audrey's is the box

00:04:20 ◼   ► how many Audrey's could you fit inside

00:04:22 ◼   ► the box that's the standard measure we

00:04:23 ◼   ► use here

00:04:24 ◼   ► you could probably fit three to four

00:04:27 ◼   ► Audrey's in the box all right the audrey

00:04:29 ◼   ► has been packing on the pounds lately

00:04:31 ◼   ► that's good

00:04:32 ◼   ► my mental estimate here is you could fit

00:04:33 ◼   ► ten arteries in but you must be really

00:04:35 ◼   ► it depends on how tightly you pack them

00:04:37 ◼   ► and and how much she's been putting on

00:04:39 ◼   ► the weight oh so I'm aware that these

00:04:41 ◼   ► Lego things if they're unboxed have a

00:04:43 ◼   ► greater resale value like years later

00:04:46 ◼   ► but I never sell these things anyway so

00:04:48 ◼   ► I don't really think that's my reason I

00:04:51 ◼   ► don't think it's a financial

00:04:52 ◼   ► consideration I think it's just for

00:04:54 ◼   ► liking the neatness and the beauty of an

00:04:56 ◼   ► unboxed awesome thing right you're not

00:04:58 ◼   ► investing in Legos here no no and I just

00:05:02 ◼   ► feel like the boxed rocket and made just

00:05:07 ◼   ► feels like a nicer thing to me than if I

00:05:10 ◼   ► made it like if I made it I'm just gonna

00:05:12 ◼   ► have this big rocker that obviously is

00:05:15 ◼   ► made of Lego mm-hmm and like I don't

00:05:17 ◼   ► know where I'd put that or how I'd feel

00:05:18 ◼   ► about that whereas I really like the box

00:05:20 ◼   ► I just like how the Box looks and I like

00:05:23 ◼   ► knowing what's in it and I can't explain

00:05:25 ◼   ► it I know it's a bit weird I'm trying

00:05:27 ◼   ► very hard to understand and maybe I have

00:05:31 ◼   ► used this analogy before when I when I

00:05:33 ◼   ► try to think of these kinds of things

00:05:34 ◼   ► but the closest I can come is the

00:05:38 ◼   ► promise of unused stationery like an

00:05:42 ◼   ► unwritten in notebook that is true it is

00:05:45 ◼   ► the promise of what you could write in

00:05:48 ◼   ► there as opposed to what you actually do

00:05:51 ◼   ► which which just doesn't live up to the

00:05:53 ◼   ► ideal that analogy is good beyond what

00:05:56 ◼   ► you know because when I was a school

00:05:59 ◼   ► mm-hmm in year 3 mm-hmm so I must have

00:06:04 ◼   ► been what like around 8 years old or

00:06:06 ◼   ► something

00:06:06 ◼   ► mm-hmm yes but right my year 3 teacher

00:06:08 ◼   ► who I still remember was mrs. delbridge

00:06:10 ◼   ► and she had this diary which was a

00:06:14 ◼   ► five-year diary you could keep five

00:06:17 ◼   ► years in it because of the way the pages

00:06:19 ◼   ► were configured like oh five years

00:06:20 ◼   ► schedule do you mean like a calendar for

00:06:22 ◼   ► five years yeah it was basically yeah

00:06:24 ◼   ► okay especially what I was I had a

00:06:25 ◼   ► little lock on and I was completely

00:06:27 ◼   ► besotted by it mm-hmm and it was the

00:06:29 ◼   ► prize for the student who did the best

00:06:32 ◼   ► work in their journal that year we had

00:06:33 ◼   ► like a daily journal we had to write

00:06:35 ◼   ► stuff in it

00:06:36 ◼   ► I was just obsessed with winning it and

00:06:38 ◼   ► it was going to be given at the end of

00:06:40 ◼   ► the year and while most of the kids

00:06:43 ◼   ► didn't care about the journal and would

00:06:45 ◼   ► write stuff about like what they did

00:06:47 ◼   ► last night or what they watched on TV or

00:06:49 ◼   ► you know what they did in the holidays I

00:06:52 ◼   ► decided to turn my journal into like a

00:06:55 ◼   ► spy novel which I just wrote each day

00:06:57 ◼   ► and it was this fictional story about

00:06:59 ◼   ► this spy having all these adventures he

00:07:01 ◼   ► was called I am I don't know why I

00:07:03 ◼   ► called him okay it was this epic tale

00:07:06 ◼   ► spanning to exercise books and there was

00:07:09 ◼   ► one other girl in the class who kept a

00:07:11 ◼   ► really good journal and she had much

00:07:13 ◼   ► better handwriting than me of course she

00:07:15 ◼   ► also really wanted to win it and I was

00:07:17 ◼   ► convinced that she was gonna win it and

00:07:18 ◼   ► I still remember at the end of the year

00:07:20 ◼   ► mrs. Dilber sang and the winner of the

00:07:22 ◼   ► Diary is and she opened up the page and

00:07:24 ◼   ► my name had been written in the front

00:07:26 ◼   ► where it said this belongs to

00:07:27 ◼   ► then I'd won the five-year diary which

00:07:29 ◼   ► I'd wanted all year so I took it home

00:07:33 ◼   ► and I thought this is amazing this is I

00:07:35 ◼   ► finally got it it's mine I've coveted

00:07:38 ◼   ► this for so long and I never ever wrote

00:07:41 ◼   ► in it or did anything with it because I

00:07:43 ◼   ► was too scared to ruin the beautiful

00:07:45 ◼   ► empty diary I didn't want to sully it so

00:07:47 ◼   ► for the next three or four years I just

00:07:48 ◼   ► kept this five-year diary thinking next

00:07:50 ◼   ► year maybe I'll start it when I when my

00:07:52 ◼   ► handwriting's better and I know I won't

00:07:54 ◼   ► ruin it as I said your handwriting will

00:07:56 ◼   ► never be good enough to live up to the

00:07:57 ◼   ► idea of the diary yeah especially the

00:07:59 ◼   ► longer you have it as it has gone on for

00:08:02 ◼   ► two years it becomes like oh well now I

00:08:04 ◼   ► really need to have something great to

00:08:06 ◼   ► write in this thing yeah it's like if

00:08:07 ◼   ► you're keeping a bottle of champagne for

00:08:09 ◼   ► a special occasion the longer you go

00:08:11 ◼   ► without drinking the special allure the

00:08:13 ◼   ► occasion needs to be in order to drink

00:08:15 ◼   ► that champagne like well we haven't

00:08:16 ◼   ► drank this for two years now it has to

00:08:18 ◼   ► be an amazing event you sort of say

00:08:20 ◼   ► critize an object by not using it that's

00:08:22 ◼   ► it that's what's happening to the rocket

00:08:23 ◼   ► mm-hmm say critizing anta yeah I think

00:08:26 ◼   ► that is what what's happening my

00:08:27 ◼   ► strategy for this at least with paper

00:08:30 ◼   ► stationery because I used to use paper

00:08:32 ◼   ► notebooks all the time

00:08:33 ◼   ► I can used always have a paper notebook

00:08:34 ◼   ► with me I used to write in paper

00:08:35 ◼   ► notebooks for all kinds of projects and

00:08:37 ◼   ► the stationery used to be a much bigger

00:08:39 ◼   ► part of my life than it currently is but

00:08:41 ◼   ► I was always aware of feeling that

00:08:45 ◼   ► feeling about oh my dumb ideas are not

00:08:47 ◼   ► worthy of this pristine book and so my

00:08:49 ◼   ► strategy was to just every time I got a

00:08:52 ◼   ► notebook intentionally just scribble all

00:08:55 ◼   ► over the first page like okay now it's

00:08:58 ◼   ► fine because there's no this first page

00:09:01 ◼   ► needs to be the opening lines of war in

00:09:03 ◼   ► peace

00:09:04 ◼   ► I am Dees a critizing but maybe it's

00:09:08 ◼   ► like degrading the notebook down to my

00:09:10 ◼   ► normal human level I was like okay well

00:09:12 ◼   ► now I can write sullying it when I got

00:09:16 ◼   ► my new iPhone the other day the first

00:09:19 ◼   ► day I had I happened to go to the gym

00:09:20 ◼   ► and when I go to the gym I give my phone

00:09:22 ◼   ► and my car keys and my wallet to my

00:09:23 ◼   ► trainer and he goes into like a back

00:09:25 ◼   ► locked room and puts them in his gym bag

00:09:27 ◼   ► mm-hmm so I said I've got a new phone

00:09:30 ◼   ► and I hand it over to him and I said can

00:09:31 ◼   ► you just be careful when you put it in

00:09:33 ◼   ► that the keys like scratch up against

00:09:35 ◼   ► the phone Lou and I never say things

00:09:37 ◼   ► like that

00:09:37 ◼   ► he looked at me funny and I said I just

00:09:39 ◼   ► got the phone today and you know I don't

00:09:40 ◼   ► want to scratch it and he was like I had

00:09:42 ◼   ► no problems I understand I'll be really

00:09:43 ◼   ► careful when I put it in my bag mm-hmm I

00:09:45 ◼   ► went back to the gym two days later and

00:09:47 ◼   ► handed over my stuff to him and he said

00:09:49 ◼   ► I'll be careful and I said don't care

00:09:51 ◼   ► any more seriously as the half-life of

00:09:54 ◼   ► it was to the iPhone is sacred for a day

00:09:56 ◼   ► and after that I don't care but the

00:09:59 ◼   ► first day you have it you know you're

00:10:00 ◼   ► polishing it on your t-shirt all the

00:10:01 ◼   ► time to make sure there's no

00:10:02 ◼   ► fingerprints on it and making sure it's

00:10:04 ◼   ► so beautiful and then two days later it

00:10:06 ◼   ► was like yeah

00:10:07 ◼   ► chuck it in it's just my phone now so

00:10:10 ◼   ► after there's big conversation about how

00:10:11 ◼   ► sacred

00:10:12 ◼   ► your unopened box of Lego is what do you

00:10:14 ◼   ► think you're going to do here braiding

00:10:15 ◼   ► it's still open I don't know what you

00:10:18 ◼   ► might have to do is buy the second box

00:10:20 ◼   ► hmm

00:10:20 ◼   ► build the Lego Saturn rocket and then

00:10:24 ◼   ► display the Lego Saturn rocket on top of

00:10:26 ◼   ► the box

00:10:26 ◼   ► with the other one what will I do with

00:10:29 ◼   ► the empty box will you'll throw that one

00:10:30 ◼   ► away have you seen how gorgeous the box

00:10:34 ◼   ► is this is the point in these

00:10:35 ◼   ► conversations Brady where I feel like

00:10:36 ◼   ► I've tried to work with you but now it's

00:10:38 ◼   ► too far you're gonna keep two identical

00:10:41 ◼   ► boxes of a lego Construction Set in your

00:10:44 ◼   ► head that's what you're gonna do that's

00:10:45 ◼   ► the ultimate idea when you were going to

00:10:46 ◼   ► buy the second one is that you're going

00:10:48 ◼   ► to keep the two boxes because they're

00:10:49 ◼   ► beautiful okay but you know that's crazy

00:10:51 ◼   ► right it would be a difficult box to

00:10:53 ◼   ► throw away that's all I'm saying I don't

00:10:55 ◼   ► know man I feel like we're getting close

00:10:57 ◼   ► to an episode of Hoarders when you're

00:10:58 ◼   ► telling me that you're gonna keep both

00:10:59 ◼   ► of the boxes of the Saturn 5 rocket when

00:11:01 ◼   ► you both

00:11:02 ◼   ► yeah tell me I have a second one don't

00:11:05 ◼   ► tie me up that your plan is when you get

00:11:08 ◼   ► the second vote you're going to keep it

00:11:09 ◼   ► I don't know man

00:11:11 ◼   ► I could go along with the constructed

00:11:13 ◼   ► rocket in front of or on top of the box

00:11:15 ◼   ► of the unopened one but that's a keep

00:11:17 ◼   ► the two boxes like I don't know I don't

00:11:20 ◼   ► know what to say to you yeah I don't

00:11:21 ◼   ► know him what why it's gonna go because

00:11:23 ◼   ► while they are nice it is a nice box it

00:11:25 ◼   ► is a little bit childish so it's not

00:11:27 ◼   ► really in keeping with the look of my

00:11:29 ◼   ► office you know with the nice green

00:11:31 ◼   ► walls and lovely framed pictures so but

00:11:34 ◼   ► it's your office your office is what you

00:11:36 ◼   ► want to make it you can have Lego

00:11:38 ◼   ► Rockets in your office if you want to

00:11:39 ◼   ► yeah but I want it to have a certain

00:11:40 ◼   ► grown-up look as well right of course

00:11:42 ◼   ► go on and look do you know quite often

00:11:47 ◼   ► when I go through feedback like in the

00:11:49 ◼   ► emails and on the reddit and stuff like

00:11:51 ◼   ► that I do enjoy it and I am grateful for

00:11:54 ◼   ► it but it always feels quite like

00:11:57 ◼   ► sometimes it feels a bit antagonistic

00:11:59 ◼   ► there is a certain heat to it that

00:12:02 ◼   ► sometimes can rile you up or you don't

00:12:04 ◼   ► enjoy especially when people are

00:12:06 ◼   ► disagreeing on things or disagreeing

00:12:08 ◼   ► with us it's like manner because you

00:12:09 ◼   ► know they feel frustrated because they

00:12:11 ◼   ► can't get their say to us we're gonna

00:12:13 ◼   ► feel a bit frustrated because we can't

00:12:14 ◼   ► answer all their comments I've been

00:12:17 ◼   ► going through a lot of the feedback on

00:12:18 ◼   ► which is better the moon landing or the

00:12:21 ◼   ► Mars landing

00:12:22 ◼   ► oh the which is more impressive and

00:12:23 ◼   ► there's been lots of discussion about it

00:12:25 ◼   ► yeah their hands their hands and both

00:12:26 ◼   ► views are be important you know what

00:12:27 ◼   ► I've completely enjoyed it mm-hmm I've

00:12:30 ◼   ► enjoyed the tone of it

00:12:32 ◼   ► I've enjoyed both sides of the argument

00:12:34 ◼   ► I still think I'm right of course and

00:12:36 ◼   ► the moon landing is more impressive than

00:12:38 ◼   ► the Mars landing but I've enjoyed what

00:12:39 ◼   ► the Mars landing people have had to say

00:12:41 ◼   ► I've enjoyed engaging with a little bit

00:12:43 ◼   ► of it it's been one of the more

00:12:44 ◼   ► enjoyable bits of civilized feedback and

00:12:48 ◼   ► discussions we've had as a result of the

00:12:50 ◼   ► show that's nice to hear baby hmm there

00:12:54 ◼   ► is also always the problem when you're

00:12:56 ◼   ► going through feedback if you've made

00:12:58 ◼   ► anything online and then people are

00:13:00 ◼   ► leaving comments and I feel like this is

00:13:01 ◼   ► also one of the fundamental problems of

00:13:03 ◼   ► the Internet is that there is no

00:13:04 ◼   ► indication of tone of how the person is

00:13:08 ◼   ► saying the other thing I think it's very

00:13:10 ◼   ► easy when you're reading feedback that

00:13:11 ◼   ► is critical of you that the the narrator

00:13:14 ◼   ► in your head

00:13:15 ◼   ► for the comment that you're reading has

00:13:17 ◼   ► angry tone which might not at all be

00:13:19 ◼   ► what the person is intending which of

00:13:22 ◼   ► course is why we have a proliferation of

00:13:24 ◼   ► emoticons and smiley faces everywhere

00:13:26 ◼   ► but at least on on Reddit and YouTube

00:13:28 ◼   ► like the emoji encroachment has not

00:13:30 ◼   ► reached their to a full extent so I

00:13:32 ◼   ► think it can be hard to understand how

00:13:34 ◼   ► did the person mean the comment but I'm

00:13:37 ◼   ► very happy that you've been enjoying the

00:13:38 ◼   ► Moon vs Mars feedback I also enjoy all

00:13:40 ◼   ► those comment threads I still think that

00:13:44 ◼   ► Mars is more impressive to me but I felt

00:13:47 ◼   ► myself a bit swayed by the idea that for

00:13:50 ◼   ► humans on the long scale the moon is

00:13:53 ◼   ► objectively more impressive I felt

00:13:56 ◼   ► myself pulled in that direction by the

00:13:57 ◼   ► feedback yeah I think maybe the reason

00:13:59 ◼   ► I've found it so easy reading the

00:14:01 ◼   ► feedback is my assuredness that I'm

00:14:03 ◼   ► right hahaha

00:14:05 ◼   ► maybe it's that you're so confident in

00:14:08 ◼   ► your opinion that it's just like oh yeah

00:14:10 ◼   ► there's no there's no arguing with a

00:14:12 ◼   ► Brady on this oh so there was another

00:14:15 ◼   ► big space event since we last recorded

00:14:18 ◼   ► and this was the Cassini space probe

00:14:21 ◼   ► which had been doing the business around

00:14:23 ◼   ► Saturn for years now and send you back

00:14:25 ◼   ► all these great photos mm-hmm that

00:14:27 ◼   ► mission finally came to its end and it

00:14:30 ◼   ► was sent plunging into the atmosphere of

00:14:32 ◼   ► Saturn for a big dramatic finale because

00:14:34 ◼   ► they didn't want to leave it just you

00:14:36 ◼   ► know cruising around the orbit of Saturn

00:14:38 ◼   ► as space junk yeah basically and I have

00:14:41 ◼   ► in the past been critical of height and

00:14:45 ◼   ► space sheer pressure and things like

00:14:47 ◼   ► that movie and admittedly when this was

00:14:49 ◼   ► happening I did go on Twitter and I was

00:14:51 ◼   ► a little bit naughty and made a few

00:14:52 ◼   ► provocative tweets just for fun but I

00:14:55 ◼   ► will say overall I thought the level of

00:14:59 ◼   ► Cassini hype in my timeline at least in

00:15:02 ◼   ► the social media I was saying was

00:15:04 ◼   ► pitched just perfect it was right this

00:15:06 ◼   ► time I was very pleased

00:15:08 ◼   ► I thought the mainstream media may be

00:15:10 ◼   ► slightly under played it but of course a

00:15:12 ◼   ► space note is always going to think that

00:15:13 ◼   ► but the space cheerleaders around the

00:15:16 ◼   ► place I thought it was about right you

00:15:19 ◼   ► know they were passionate and emotional

00:15:21 ◼   ► and I teased them about it a little bit

00:15:23 ◼   ► on the Twitter particularly when I said

00:15:26 ◼   ► that taking nice pictures of Saturn is

00:15:27 ◼   ► low-hanging fruit

00:15:29 ◼   ► but overall I thought it was about right

00:15:31 ◼   ► and I wish they're all science events

00:15:34 ◼   ► were treated about that tone

00:15:36 ◼   ► there was a proportional response you

00:15:40 ◼   ► think taking pictures of Saturdays

00:15:42 ◼   ► low-hanging fruit yeah it's a bit oh

00:15:44 ◼   ► we're isn't amazing we got these

00:15:46 ◼   ► beautiful pictures of a satin I mean

00:15:47 ◼   ► anyone with the 2005 Nokia pointing

00:15:50 ◼   ► vaguely in the direction of sad could

00:15:52 ◼   ► take an amazing photo set but don't get

00:15:55 ◼   ► me wrong I did like the scene II

00:15:56 ◼   ► preferred the Voyager missions myself

00:15:59 ◼   ► well you will have a Voyager man I said

00:16:01 ◼   ► that on Twitter as well

00:16:02 ◼   ► I said I'm more of avoid you man I was

00:16:05 ◼   ► impressed by Cassini and it was a really

00:16:07 ◼   ► cool mission its Voyager 2 still going

00:16:10 ◼   ► I'm just realizing I don't know is is

00:16:11 ◼   ► that yeah I think they're still getting

00:16:12 ◼   ► signals from both of them there's a new

00:16:15 ◼   ► story every few weeks that they've

00:16:16 ◼   ► finally left the solar system as the

00:16:18 ◼   ► definition of the solar system keeps

00:16:20 ◼   ► changing for PR reasons really you're so

00:16:22 ◼   ► cynical there hasn't been a void you

00:16:24 ◼   ► left the solar system story for a few

00:16:26 ◼   ► weeks and actually so I'm sure we can

00:16:27 ◼   ► redefine the edge of the sun's magneto

00:16:30 ◼   ► sphere once again has the true edge of

00:16:32 ◼   ► the solar system so we can get that

00:16:34 ◼   ► story and just quickly can I praised

00:16:36 ◼   ► SpaceX for a minute and you're trying to

00:16:38 ◼   ► win over our commenters Brady I think

00:16:41 ◼   ► they did something I like credit where

00:16:43 ◼   ► credit's due

00:16:44 ◼   ► they posted a YouTube video montage of

00:16:47 ◼   ► their greatest failures and crashes it

00:16:50 ◼   ► was this brilliant montage of rockets

00:16:52 ◼   ► exploding and everything that went wrong

00:16:53 ◼   ► and I really enjoyed it I thought it was

00:16:57 ◼   ► really cool and I liked that they were

00:16:58 ◼   ► able to take the mickey out of himself

00:17:01 ◼   ► in that way it hacked back to a famous

00:17:03 ◼   ► scene in the film the right stuff where

00:17:05 ◼   ► they show a whole bunch of rocket

00:17:06 ◼   ► failures so maybe - and the stage would

00:17:08 ◼   ► kick in again but it was a really cool

00:17:11 ◼   ► video this was on the official channel

00:17:12 ◼   ► they published a compilation of their

00:17:14 ◼   ► failures yes

00:17:15 ◼   ► is this it how not to land an orbital

00:17:17 ◼   ► rocket booster it probably is yeah you

00:17:21 ◼   ► know what I've got to give a company

00:17:23 ◼   ► credit for doing that kind of thing yeah

00:17:24 ◼   ► I mean to be fair if you've got that

00:17:26 ◼   ► incredible sexy footage why not use it

00:17:28 ◼   ► because there's not many things more

00:17:29 ◼   ► amazing to look at then a rocket going

00:17:31 ◼   ► wrong but still some companies would not

00:17:34 ◼   ► couch it in this way so good on them I'm

00:17:37 ◼   ► watching the video now it's pretty good

00:17:39 ◼   ► and it certainly helps if these are all

00:17:41 ◼   ► unmanned

00:17:42 ◼   ► rockets yeah it did occur to me that the

00:17:44 ◼   ► first time something goes wrong with a

00:17:45 ◼   ► rocket with a person on it that this

00:17:47 ◼   ► video is gonna maybe come back to bite

00:17:50 ◼   ► them on the backside which is why the

00:17:51 ◼   ► companies would do it that's exactly it

00:17:53 ◼   ► you're putting something out there in

00:17:55 ◼   ► the world for people to hold against you

00:17:56 ◼   ► but I'll give a company credit for doing

00:17:57 ◼   ► that kind of thing this is definitely

00:17:59 ◼   ► some impressive explosions yeah they're

00:18:02 ◼   ► nice nice footage I'll put it in the

00:18:04 ◼   ► show notes for people to watch so

00:18:05 ◼   ► speaking of your approval of the Cassini

00:18:08 ◼   ► news coverage there's something I want

00:18:11 ◼   ► to touch on from two shows ago there was

00:18:14 ◼   ► a topic that came up briefly and it was

00:18:17 ◼   ► when you were discussing the overhyped

00:18:19 ◼   ► eclipse in America yeah the eclipse of

00:18:22 ◼   ► the millennium I believe was what it was

00:18:24 ◼   ► being called I know when you're poking

00:18:26 ◼   ► me on purpose I'm not even gonna bother

00:18:28 ◼   ► correct was that because they're not

00:18:29 ◼   ► right I might be mistaken I don't know

00:18:31 ◼   ► by the way I do realize when you'd like

00:18:32 ◼   ► to deliberately say things wrong like a

00:18:34 ◼   ► dad you know who does it just to whine

00:18:36 ◼   ► the kids up okay you keep not

00:18:37 ◼   ► understanding what akka means I do know

00:18:39 ◼   ► you do that on purpose by the way

00:18:41 ◼   ► oh I understand what akka mean it's

00:18:43 ◼   ► great I think I understand I got better

00:18:44 ◼   ► than you I think you're too close to it

00:18:47 ◼   ► and you can't understand what akka

00:18:49 ◼   ► really is all right but yes I was

00:18:51 ◼   ► critical of the eclipse of the century

00:18:53 ◼   ► hype coming from our friends across the

00:18:56 ◼   ► Atlantic yeah so you made some comments

00:18:58 ◼   ► about the American centric nests of

00:18:59 ◼   ► American news and speaking of feedback

00:19:02 ◼   ► in the comments there were about a

00:19:04 ◼   ► bazillion comments in the reddit where

00:19:06 ◼   ► people were jumping on this bandwagon

00:19:09 ◼   ► about how American centric the news is

00:19:11 ◼   ► and I am NOT one to defend the news

00:19:15 ◼   ► people might be aware of that but this

00:19:17 ◼   ► is one case we didn't touch upon it at

00:19:19 ◼   ► the time but I have to say reading the

00:19:21 ◼   ► comments where people were complaining

00:19:22 ◼   ► about how American centric the news in

00:19:24 ◼   ► America is I'm fine with that

00:19:26 ◼   ► of all of the myriad of things I could

00:19:28 ◼   ► complain about American news the fact

00:19:31 ◼   ► that it focuses on America is like the

00:19:34 ◼   ► most minor of complaints that could

00:19:35 ◼   ► possibly be I think it's actually

00:19:38 ◼   ► totally justified for example there was

00:19:41 ◼   ► a comment that I'm I'm sort of picking

00:19:42 ◼   ► at random but I think works well as an

00:19:45 ◼   ► example where there was someone from

00:19:48 ◼   ► Brazil who was complaining about having

00:19:49 ◼   ► moved to America that nobody in America

00:19:52 ◼   ► knows anything about

00:19:54 ◼   ► right that it never comes up on the

00:19:55 ◼   ► American news they were you know sort of

00:19:58 ◼   ► making fun of Americans for saying

00:19:59 ◼   ► Americans would ask him if he speaks

00:20:01 ◼   ► Brazilian as a question about like

00:20:02 ◼   ► what's what's Brazil like or not knowing

00:20:05 ◼   ► where in the world Brazil is that's like

00:20:07 ◼   ► I kind of get that it's funny to make

00:20:10 ◼   ► fun of Americans for not knowing these

00:20:12 ◼   ► things but what I was thinking about was

00:20:14 ◼   ► I was trying to think okay what is to

00:20:17 ◼   ► Brazil as Brazil is to America

00:20:20 ◼   ► how do we measure the different sizes of

00:20:22 ◼   ► countries and this may not be a perfect

00:20:25 ◼   ► comparison but I thought I think you

00:20:28 ◼   ► could use the GDP of a country as a

00:20:32 ◼   ► rough first order approximation for how

00:20:36 ◼   ► important is it in the world I'm not

00:20:38 ◼   ► saying that's a perfect measure but I

00:20:40 ◼   ► think we can ballpark that yeah and it

00:20:44 ◼   ► works out just about perfectly that the

00:20:46 ◼   ► Brazilian GDP is one-tenth the size of

00:20:49 ◼   ► the American GDP and of course the

00:20:52 ◼   ► United States GDP is the largest in the

00:20:54 ◼   ► world by a pretty decent margin so the

00:20:57 ◼   ► country that is to Brazil as Brazil is

00:20:59 ◼   ► to the United States is a country like

00:21:02 ◼   ► the Czech Republic or Romania and I just

00:21:07 ◼   ► kind of would love to know how often the

00:21:11 ◼   ► goings-on of Romania or the Czech

00:21:14 ◼   ► Republic are in Brazilian news and if

00:21:18 ◼   ► someone from Romania could be like oh

00:21:19 ◼   ► the Brazilian news doesn't cover Romania

00:21:22 ◼   ► as often as they think it should but it

00:21:24 ◼   ► would feel like well of course it

00:21:26 ◼   ► doesn't how does the Czech Republic or

00:21:28 ◼   ► Romania impact Brazil like not really a

00:21:30 ◼   ► lot and so I really feel like American

00:21:33 ◼   ► news is American centric Ness it's

00:21:36 ◼   ► totally fine and it's a thing that I am

00:21:38 ◼   ► very happy to defend as far as American

00:21:41 ◼   ► news goes well maybe I didn't put my

00:21:44 ◼   ► case properly mm-hmm I think it is ok

00:21:46 ◼   ► for news to be parochial mm-hmm I worked

00:21:49 ◼   ► on the newspaper in Adelaide and

00:21:50 ◼   ► everything was about what's the Adelaide

00:21:52 ◼   ► angle if a huge disaster happens on the

00:21:55 ◼   ► other side of the world the first thing

00:21:56 ◼   ► we wonder is I wonder if anyone from

00:21:58 ◼   ► Adelaide was there Pirozhki onus is fair

00:22:01 ◼   ► enough I think the American news does go

00:22:04 ◼   ► too far like I think they're too

00:22:06 ◼   ► cool I think they could just turn that

00:22:09 ◼   ► dial down just a little bit but I'm

00:22:12 ◼   ► alright with Pirozhki or news coverage

00:22:13 ◼   ► because you got a play to your audience

00:22:16 ◼   ► mm-hmm but my problem is they're kind of

00:22:18 ◼   ► it's almost kind of like a well I hope

00:22:21 ◼   ► it's a willful ignorance for example if

00:22:23 ◼   ► a new building got built in America that

00:22:25 ◼   ► was taller than every other building in

00:22:27 ◼   ► America but it was shorter than the Burj

00:22:30 ◼   ► Khalifa which is the tallest building in

00:22:31 ◼   ► the world and say it was built in

00:22:34 ◼   ► Chicago and then the American news in

00:22:37 ◼   ► the Chicago News ran a story about this

00:22:40 ◼   ► new building and called it the biggest

00:22:42 ◼   ► building ever I'd be like no it's not

00:22:46 ◼   ► the biggest building ever it's the

00:22:47 ◼   ► biggest building in America mm-hmm

00:22:50 ◼   ► that's like how the finals of the

00:22:51 ◼   ► baseball in America is called the World

00:22:53 ◼   ► Series that's the classic example isn't

00:22:55 ◼   ► it this is not the World Series to

00:22:57 ◼   ► decide the world champions they crowned

00:22:59 ◼   ► the world champions of baseball every

00:23:00 ◼   ► year based on who won a domestic us

00:23:03 ◼   ► competition well it does include Canada

00:23:06 ◼   ► greatly this is more where my problem is

00:23:08 ◼   ► it's kind of this this ignorant of the

00:23:10 ◼   ► bigger picture mm-hmm and I think that's

00:23:12 ◼   ► the problem I think you need to know how

00:23:15 ◼   ► you fit into the world

00:23:17 ◼   ► I don't mind skewing the coverage and

00:23:19 ◼   ► you know not covering every minor

00:23:22 ◼   ► incident that happens in Romania mm-hmm

00:23:24 ◼   ► but I think it's degrees and I think

00:23:27 ◼   ► America goes a little bit too far there

00:23:29 ◼   ► are some TV channels in the UK when

00:23:32 ◼   ► they're covering the news and they try

00:23:33 ◼   ► to be all high and mighty and be really

00:23:35 ◼   ► international and I get really bored I

00:23:37 ◼   ► think yeah enough of all this boring

00:23:39 ◼   ► stuff about the stuff that's happening

00:23:41 ◼   ► in other countries this is so worthy

00:23:43 ◼   ► tell me why there was a big traffic jam

00:23:45 ◼   ► on my motorway today you know I want my

00:23:47 ◼   ► local news so you can't go too far the

00:23:49 ◼   ► other way and be to unsend Trek but I

00:23:53 ◼   ► think America goes the other way it's to

00:23:55 ◼   ► America centric I want my porridge is

00:23:57 ◼   ► just right is that too much to ask

00:24:00 ◼   ► I mean look as a man who wants to bend

00:24:03 ◼   ► the entire world to his will I

00:24:05 ◼   ► understand you want your porridge just

00:24:07 ◼   ► right I can sympathize there I think of

00:24:09 ◼   ► a lot of this stuff in life like it I

00:24:11 ◼   ► don't know how to articulate this very

00:24:13 ◼   ► well but it's a bit like everything in

00:24:15 ◼   ► life is a series of dials and it's like

00:24:17 ◼   ► yes of course we would want the dial to

00:24:19 ◼   ► be tuned just

00:24:20 ◼   ► right but you can never know when it's

00:24:22 ◼   ► tuned just right so you have to think

00:24:25 ◼   ► about it in terms of like well what

00:24:26 ◼   ► happens if this dial is tuned too much

00:24:28 ◼   ► and what happens if it's tuned too

00:24:31 ◼   ► little and think about like what are the

00:24:33 ◼   ► consequences in in these directions

00:24:36 ◼   ► because you just don't know where the

00:24:38 ◼   ► exact correct setting is and I look at

00:24:40 ◼   ► the American centric nests of American

00:24:42 ◼   ► news and and feel mostly like well of

00:24:44 ◼   ► course this dial is going to be turned

00:24:46 ◼   ► way to one side and it's because the

00:24:50 ◼   ► United States is it's like such an

00:24:52 ◼   ► incredibly large and important

00:24:55 ◼   ► economically in political country in the

00:24:57 ◼   ► world and very few other countries can

00:25:01 ◼   ► impact the United States in any

00:25:03 ◼   ► meaningful way

00:25:04 ◼   ► and essentially the only foreign news

00:25:06 ◼   ► that Americans get is about the

00:25:08 ◼   ► countries that may be able to impact the

00:25:10 ◼   ► United States and in some way and that

00:25:12 ◼   ► is a tiny handful of countries and to

00:25:16 ◼   ► expect that it's much broader beyond

00:25:19 ◼   ► that I think is kind of unreasonable

00:25:21 ◼   ► like the stuff like the world series is

00:25:22 ◼   ► just funny and that's why the eclipse of

00:25:24 ◼   ► the century was a perfect example

00:25:26 ◼   ► because as you said last time I was like

00:25:27 ◼   ► how is this being measured like there's

00:25:29 ◼   ► no there's no objective way it's the

00:25:31 ◼   ► eclipse of the century except that it's

00:25:32 ◼   ► happening right now in America like that

00:25:35 ◼   ► stuff is funny my personal peeve is a

00:25:37 ◼   ► kind of beating on Americans for not

00:25:40 ◼   ► knowing about the world outside and I

00:25:43 ◼   ► think it's because it's such an

00:25:44 ◼   ► asymmetric relationship like people in

00:25:46 ◼   ► other countries know all sorts of stuff

00:25:49 ◼   ► about America because what America does

00:25:51 ◼   ► affects those countries but Americans

00:25:53 ◼   ► don't know about the countries that

00:25:55 ◼   ► their policies affect because one

00:25:57 ◼   ► there's vastly more of them and and two

00:26:00 ◼   ► like well frankly those countries their

00:26:02 ◼   ► actions don't really affect the United

00:26:04 ◼   ► States nearly as much so like II just I

00:26:06 ◼   ► just think it's not surprising that this

00:26:08 ◼   ► is the situation that we're in that's a

00:26:10 ◼   ► bit of a shame mm-hmm I can spare for

00:26:12 ◼   ► shame that's something so powerful and

00:26:13 ◼   ► that can affect so many other people is

00:26:16 ◼   ► so unaware of those people but I hear

00:26:20 ◼   ► argument I guess it bothers me mostly

00:26:22 ◼   ► because I remember coming to the UK a

00:26:23 ◼   ► long time ago and getting into

00:26:25 ◼   ► conversations with people about how like

00:26:26 ◼   ► oh it's amazing how you don't know

00:26:27 ◼   ► anything about all of our countries and

00:26:29 ◼   ► I was originally on the side of like oh

00:26:31 ◼   ► I should I should feel totally ashamed

00:26:33 ◼   ► by

00:26:33 ◼   ► but then eventually I kind of changed my

00:26:35 ◼   ► mind I'm like wait a minute what like

00:26:37 ◼   ► why would I know the details of like how

00:26:39 ◼   ► the politics in France works like why

00:26:42 ◼   ► would this ever be a thing that would

00:26:44 ◼   ► come across my attention before having

00:26:46 ◼   ► having moved to Europe like it never

00:26:48 ◼   ► would in any meaningful way so I

00:26:50 ◼   ► shouldn't feel bad about not having

00:26:52 ◼   ► known it when I showed up so I think

00:26:54 ◼   ► that's why it's like a little personal

00:26:55 ◼   ► thing for me I'm okay with you defending

00:26:57 ◼   ► your countrymen but I do think one

00:27:00 ◼   ► should strive for more information and

00:27:04 ◼   ► more knowledge in life in all ways and

00:27:06 ◼   ► that includes knowledge of the world and

00:27:09 ◼   ► you know we should know how the

00:27:10 ◼   ► electoral system in France works I don't

00:27:12 ◼   ► but I shouldn't be proud that I don't I

00:27:15 ◼   ► should say I wish I did I wish I knew

00:27:17 ◼   ► everything but I do feel like a

00:27:20 ◼   ► statement like oh we should all strive

00:27:21 ◼   ► to know more about the world like it's

00:27:22 ◼   ► very easy to say but it's very hard to

00:27:25 ◼   ► agree with the specifics of what exactly

00:27:27 ◼   ► does that mean because there's an

00:27:29 ◼   ► infinite amount of things to know about

00:27:31 ◼   ► absolutely everything and so if we

00:27:34 ◼   ► accept that as a premise we immediately

00:27:37 ◼   ► have to start filtering out almost

00:27:39 ◼   ► everything about everything it's not

00:27:42 ◼   ► possible to know about all of the things

00:27:44 ◼   ► so there there has to be some sort of

00:27:46 ◼   ► filter again that's why I'm not

00:27:48 ◼   ► surprised that Americans they know about

00:27:50 ◼   ► America and maybe not very much beyond

00:27:53 ◼   ► her borders hello Internet are you

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00:29:31 ◼   ► so grace since we last spoke I know

00:29:35 ◼   ► there's been another announcement from

00:29:37 ◼   ► the temple the temple Apple has

00:29:39 ◼   ► announced new iPhones for all the fans

00:29:43 ◼   ► and I'll tell you what if you went to a

00:29:45 ◼   ► dictionary and looked up unimpressed you

00:29:49 ◼   ► could put a photo of me watching the

00:29:51 ◼   ► iPhone announcement there yeah as far as

00:29:56 ◼   ► I can tell and you set me straight if

00:29:57 ◼   ► I'm wrong but this new iPhone don't can

00:30:01 ◼   ► I call it iPhone X I know I'm supposed

00:30:03 ◼   ► to call it 10 okay no let's let's get

00:30:05 ◼   ► this on the record here I am boycotting

00:30:07 ◼   ► the 10 they're not going along with

00:30:10 ◼   ► their it's iPhone 10 it's like I'm sorry

00:30:12 ◼   ► if you're gonna put the big letter X

00:30:13 ◼   ► there I'm calling it X it's it's not

00:30:16 ◼   ► gonna happen I Apple but I feel like

00:30:18 ◼   ► like pulling out the X in any branding

00:30:21 ◼   ► time it's like your big gun isn't it and

00:30:23 ◼   ► that's like okay it's time it's time for

00:30:26 ◼   ► the X version of whatever we've got

00:30:28 ◼   ► mm-hmm so I expect it to be pretty

00:30:30 ◼   ► awesome like game-changer and as far as

00:30:34 ◼   ► I can tell this is not a game changer

00:30:36 ◼   ► this is just more faffing around the

00:30:39 ◼   ► edges and I think they've wasted their X

00:30:43 ◼   ► I think they've gone early on the X

00:30:45 ◼   ► whether it's out of desperation or they

00:30:48 ◼   ► were just running out of time because

00:30:50 ◼   ► they were approaching them pretend and

00:30:51 ◼   ► they thought that was when they could

00:30:52 ◼   ► you they had to use their X you know

00:30:55 ◼   ► well I would argue that they had if they

00:30:57 ◼   ► didn't want to use the 10 they could

00:30:59 ◼   ► have had several more years

00:31:00 ◼   ► of not using the ten right because yeah

00:31:02 ◼   ► because they they have their little s

00:31:04 ◼   ► their little in between years so we had

00:31:06 ◼   ► seven they could have done seven s 8 8 s

00:31:09 ◼   ► 9 9 s and then count to 10 so they could

00:31:13 ◼   ► have had what was at six years I heard

00:31:15 ◼   ► there was some technical reason they

00:31:16 ◼   ► couldn't use 9 I find that hard to

00:31:18 ◼   ► believe but okay

00:31:19 ◼   ► what do I know about this stuff but

00:31:21 ◼   ► anyway I am disappointed from what I've

00:31:24 ◼   ► seen so far

00:31:25 ◼   ► I'm not yearning to get one from a

00:31:27 ◼   ► thousand pounds

00:31:29 ◼   ► am I wrong should I want one what would

00:31:31 ◼   ► you want the X to have what would make

00:31:33 ◼   ► you feel like wow that's the kind of X

00:31:36 ◼   ► you want to see in the world emojis that

00:31:38 ◼   ► move when I fuck move my face no well

00:31:40 ◼   ► good news for you feels like it should

00:31:44 ◼   ► be like a new birth it should be the

00:31:46 ◼   ► monolith descending from the sky if I

00:31:48 ◼   ► knew the answer to that I would either

00:31:49 ◼   ► work at Apple or I would have a really

00:31:52 ◼   ► trendy cool designed monochrome blog

00:31:55 ◼   ► where I wrote about it every day I'm not

00:31:56 ◼   ► thinking of one in particular by the way

00:31:58 ◼   ► because I don't know any of them that is

00:31:59 ◼   ► what they all sort of seem like to me

00:32:00 ◼   ► all these like really minimalist design

00:32:03 ◼   ► blogs I'll tell you another thing about

00:32:06 ◼   ► podcasters that annoys me is when they

00:32:09 ◼   ► refer to the fact that they wrote about

00:32:10 ◼   ► something like that's a big deal but you

00:32:13 ◼   ► know yeah I can talk on a podcast all

00:32:14 ◼   ► day but actually I wrote an article

00:32:16 ◼   ► about that like suddenly that oh hang on

00:32:18 ◼   ► you wrote an article about that well

00:32:21 ◼   ► that's different political podcasts are

00:32:23 ◼   ► really bad for this like political

00:32:24 ◼   ► journalists who like just waffle about

00:32:26 ◼   ► politics and they'll say actually I

00:32:28 ◼   ► wrote an article about that this week

00:32:29 ◼   ► they're probably worse than the Apple

00:32:31 ◼   ► people for that like it's somehow now

00:32:33 ◼   ► it's scripture cuz it's written down and

00:32:34 ◼   ► it's more important than just waffling

00:32:36 ◼   ► don't you think it is though Brady I

00:32:38 ◼   ► mean this is one of the things I like

00:32:39 ◼   ► about podcasts is I mean you and I we've

00:32:43 ◼   ► just shown up we're having a little chat

00:32:44 ◼   ► here even though we were just talking

00:32:47 ◼   ► about the American centric mists of

00:32:48 ◼   ► American news and I feel like that's a

00:32:50 ◼   ► very different conversation than if I

00:32:52 ◼   ► sat down and I was going to write an

00:32:54 ◼   ► article defending that same topic right

00:32:56 ◼   ► if you write something I think it is a

00:32:58 ◼   ► bigger deal than - doing a podcast cuz

00:33:00 ◼   ► in the podcast you're just talking right

00:33:02 ◼   ► yeah okay I see what you're saying but I

00:33:04 ◼   ► think it puts an importance on what's

00:33:06 ◼   ► written basically just on a blog on the

00:33:08 ◼   ► Internet into some kind of important

00:33:11 ◼   ► fear they'd like that's not like it's

00:33:13 ◼   ► gone through peer review

00:33:14 ◼   ► and it's more right you're still just

00:33:17 ◼   ► some Joker who wrote an article on a

00:33:18 ◼   ► blog actually I wrote now - cool about

00:33:21 ◼   ► that so now now what I'm saying like has

00:33:24 ◼   ► more credence or something like no it

00:33:26 ◼   ► doesn't you just also wrote down what

00:33:28 ◼   ► you think I guess I know what you're

00:33:32 ◼   ► saying but I still feel like they're

00:33:33 ◼   ► very different things what is your you

00:33:35 ◼   ► don't like your one that when they're

00:33:37 ◼   ► simply referencing that's like oh I have

00:33:38 ◼   ► an important piece of work and you're

00:33:40 ◼   ► listening to a podcast and you're

00:33:41 ◼   ► thinking like hey you're a guy listen to

00:33:43 ◼   ► talk about politics all the time what's

00:33:45 ◼   ► the difference if you've written it down

00:33:46 ◼   ► versus you're talking about it it just

00:33:48 ◼   ► sort of seems irrelevant it's like okay

00:33:49 ◼   ► good for you i'm listening to the

00:33:50 ◼   ► podcast like it's okay if they say like

00:33:53 ◼   ► there's a lot of things about that that

00:33:55 ◼   ► you know I'm not gonna say now so you

00:33:57 ◼   ► should be the article but they just they

00:33:58 ◼   ► just sort of say it as an aside

00:33:59 ◼   ► oh yeah wrote an article about that and

00:34:01 ◼   ► then they go on to regurgitate sort of

00:34:02 ◼   ► the odd I don't know there's something

00:34:04 ◼   ► about it that just rubs me up the wrong

00:34:06 ◼   ► way it's like a paper cut mm-hmm

00:34:08 ◼   ► the thing that's funny to me about this

00:34:10 ◼   ► is I just always feel like we said

00:34:12 ◼   ► before everything we're talking about on

00:34:13 ◼   ► this podcast is sort of off the record

00:34:15 ◼   ► because we're just talking like on my

00:34:17 ◼   ► Wikipedia page I sometimes see quotes

00:34:19 ◼   ► from things that I've said on the

00:34:20 ◼   ► podcasts like on my own Wikipedia page

00:34:23 ◼   ► explaining a thing and I always feel

00:34:25 ◼   ► like weirdly annoyed by that like but it

00:34:27 ◼   ► was just I was just talking like but now

00:34:29 ◼   ► this quote of a thing that I just said

00:34:31 ◼   ► offhandedly is like the representative

00:34:33 ◼   ► thing on this topic whereas I would feel

00:34:36 ◼   ► very differently about that if I had

00:34:37 ◼   ► written an article and then the

00:34:38 ◼   ► Wikipedia article was like quoting the

00:34:40 ◼   ► article that I had written it just it

00:34:42 ◼   ► does feel like they're very different

00:34:43 ◼   ► things to me Brady yeah I know I know

00:34:45 ◼   ► you feel that way that's fair enough

00:34:46 ◼   ► and also like it is also just

00:34:47 ◼   ► cross-promotion and I mean we often talk

00:34:50 ◼   ► about things and I'll say I made a video

00:34:51 ◼   ► about that it's completely extraneous to

00:34:55 ◼   ► what we're talking about so I'm guilty

00:34:56 ◼   ► of it too so Mia Copa you should make a

00:35:00 ◼   ► video about it Brady I should I haven't

00:35:02 ◼   ► made a video about the new iPhone or

00:35:04 ◼   ► read an article about it or seen one you

00:35:07 ◼   ► guys you have to do an unboxing really

00:35:09 ◼   ► do you unboxing channel yet there could

00:35:11 ◼   ► be more popular than all your other

00:35:12 ◼   ► actually I make calculator unboxings

00:35:14 ◼   ► we'll put a link in the show notes I

00:35:16 ◼   ► think you should really spin that off

00:35:17 ◼   ► into something else it could be a

00:35:19 ◼   ► full-time dad wore f-- numberphile

00:35:21 ◼   ► immediately is the iphone x a big deal

00:35:24 ◼   ► this is the one time like you're really

00:35:26 ◼   ► asking the wrong person Brady because

00:35:28 ◼   ► I didn't actually watch the keynote this

00:35:31 ◼   ► year I was in an extremely low Internet

00:35:35 ◼   ► area so I haven't actually seen the

00:35:37 ◼   ► presentation or anything I just read a

00:35:39 ◼   ► couple of those articles afterwards

00:35:40 ◼   ► people wrote down their thoughts to get

00:35:42 ◼   ► a summary of what's going on I'm not

00:35:45 ◼   ► saying people shouldn't write articles

00:35:46 ◼   ► or write down their thoughts by the way

00:35:47 ◼   ► like technology articles and blogs are

00:35:50 ◼   ► not only like good I like them and I

00:35:52 ◼   ► read them

00:35:53 ◼   ► I'm not against writing you heard here

00:35:54 ◼   ► first people Brady : against writing and

00:35:57 ◼   ► there's some good ones there are a few

00:35:59 ◼   ► people who we know who I think write

00:36:00 ◼   ► really cool tech blogs it's when

00:36:03 ◼   ► someone's on a podcast saying I wrote an

00:36:06 ◼   ► article about this Azlan okay that's

00:36:09 ◼   ► good but obviously to your podcast at

00:36:11 ◼   ► the moment so let's talk let's have a

00:36:12 ◼   ► little chat I feel like I've

00:36:14 ◼   ► misrepresented myself but anyway let's

00:36:16 ◼   ► move on to the new iPhone yeah but you

00:36:17 ◼   ► know what thank god this is a podcast

00:36:19 ◼   ► and people can hear that in the

00:36:20 ◼   ► conversation as opposed to every was

00:36:22 ◼   ► just transcribed and written in an

00:36:23 ◼   ► article then it seems like it's

00:36:24 ◼   ► something set in stone are confused

00:36:26 ◼   ► thoughts about about these matters I

00:36:28 ◼   ► don't know man like I'm not the person

00:36:29 ◼   ► here who's gonna try to sell you on an

00:36:31 ◼   ► iPhone X have you ordered one they're

00:36:33 ◼   ► not able to be ordered yet but I mean

00:36:34 ◼   ► yes I will order one as soon as I can

00:36:37 ◼   ► but I think that is also for anyone who

00:36:40 ◼   ► has listened to this podcast and has

00:36:42 ◼   ► heard both of us do our various iPhone

00:36:44 ◼   ► switches over the years in the past what

00:36:47 ◼   ► is it now four years of this design I

00:36:51 ◼   ► have been unhappy with and and

00:36:54 ◼   ► frustrated with the phones at at both

00:36:55 ◼   ► sizes so I am excited far less because

00:37:00 ◼   ► of the technology that is in the phone

00:37:02 ◼   ► and far more simply because oh thank god

00:37:05 ◼   ► it's a different size after four years

00:37:07 ◼   ► and maybe I'll like this size better

00:37:10 ◼   ► than the phones that I've been living

00:37:12 ◼   ► with in the past what size is this one

00:37:14 ◼   ► what's it massage off it's in between

00:37:16 ◼   ► the two sizes it's like a little bit

00:37:19 ◼   ► bigger than the regular iPhone and it's

00:37:22 ◼   ► as if that iPhone was all scream except

00:37:25 ◼   ► obviously for that notch at the top so

00:37:27 ◼   ► I'm hoping the fact that the screen size

00:37:30 ◼   ► is larger if not the body size is much

00:37:33 ◼   ► larger we'll get rid of some of my

00:37:35 ◼   ► typing frustrations that I've had with

00:37:36 ◼   ► the phone that is the reason that I'm

00:37:38 ◼   ► ordering it is I feel like please let me

00:37:40 ◼   ► like this

00:37:42 ◼   ► if you're looking for someone to

00:37:44 ◼   ► evangelize how technically impressive

00:37:47 ◼   ► the iPhone X is you are with the wrong

00:37:49 ◼   ► podcasting partner for this one I'm

00:37:51 ◼   ► sorry baby I cannot tell you on this

00:37:53 ◼   ► device I'm worried about the lack of the

00:37:55 ◼   ► home button because whenever I have to

00:37:57 ◼   ► swipe things from the bottom of my

00:37:59 ◼   ► iPhone as it is now I'm so hopeless at

00:38:01 ◼   ► that I'm like oh oh it takes me about

00:38:03 ◼   ► eight goes to bring up that swipey thing

00:38:05 ◼   ► at the bottom so if the home button is

00:38:07 ◼   ► anything like that functionality it's

00:38:09 ◼   ► bad news for me remember look Brady we

00:38:12 ◼   ► all know that the future is no buttons

00:38:13 ◼   ► all right all of the buttons go away I'm

00:38:16 ◼   ► sure someday we won't have volume

00:38:18 ◼   ► buttons on the side it'll be nothing but

00:38:20 ◼   ► swipe gestures all over the place that's

00:38:22 ◼   ► what's going to happen there you're

00:38:24 ◼   ► passing on the iPhone X yeah 10 would

00:38:28 ◼   ► you like it more if it was called iPhone

00:38:29 ◼   ► Pro Brady I would suddenly be tempted if

00:38:32 ◼   ► they cracked out the prairie I think

00:38:33 ◼   ► this exact same phone if they said it's

00:38:35 ◼   ► iPhone Pro you might feel the call of

00:38:37 ◼   ► Apple tugging on your wallet yeah I'd be

00:38:40 ◼   ► thinking oh well I'm not supposed to be

00:38:42 ◼   ► a professional person maybe I well

00:38:44 ◼   ► haven't I got a pro do you not Brady

00:38:46 ◼   ► literally watch videos professionally on

00:38:48 ◼   ► your phone is that not one of the

00:38:50 ◼   ► primary use cases I probably will have

00:38:52 ◼   ► to get the prayer mmm

00:38:54 ◼   ► yeah when they do that that's when

00:38:56 ◼   ► Apple's gonna get your money yeah did

00:38:59 ◼   ► you hear that Apple that's how you get a

00:39:00 ◼   ► Brady on the hook there's a few bucks to

00:39:02 ◼   ► be made over here in the UK one customer

00:39:06 ◼   ► waiting for the pro well we'll say I'll

00:39:08 ◼   ► have a look at yours when you get it and

00:39:10 ◼   ► decide from there I'll talk to you on

00:39:11 ◼   ► the podcast about it but I won't

00:39:12 ◼   ► actually believe what you say until

00:39:14 ◼   ► you've written article on your blog no

00:39:17 ◼   ► Brady the one topic that relates to

00:39:20 ◼   ► YouTube that never stops is copyright

00:39:26 ◼   ► copyright on YouTube is the topic that

00:39:29 ◼   ► never ever ends and we're talking by the

00:39:32 ◼   ► two shows ago we were talking about it

00:39:34 ◼   ► last show with regards to h3 h3 and

00:39:38 ◼   ► their copyright lawsuit that has gone on

00:39:40 ◼   ► and I thought oh we've gone through the

00:39:43 ◼   ► copyright topic we probably won't talk

00:39:44 ◼   ► about it again but just recently another

00:39:46 ◼   ► thing has occurred in YouTube land with

00:39:48 ◼   ► regards to complications over copyright

00:39:50 ◼   ► that I I thought was a tricky case

00:39:55 ◼   ► I just kind of wanted to bring up yeah

00:39:58 ◼   ► are you aware at all of what's been

00:40:00 ◼   ► going on in the world of PewDiePie and

00:40:03 ◼   ► video game copyright is this a story

00:40:05 ◼   ► that's crossed your radar what's your

00:40:07 ◼   ► guess I'm gonna guess no correct no idea

00:40:11 ◼   ► what you're talking about

00:40:12 ◼   ► yeah this is one of these funny little

00:40:15 ◼   ► moments where I feel that we do live in

00:40:18 ◼   ► these non-overlapping bubbles of what's

00:40:21 ◼   ► going on in the world do you know what

00:40:23 ◼   ► happened with bricks and negotiations in

00:40:24 ◼   ► the last couple of days I literally

00:40:26 ◼   ► didn't know exit negotiations I love it

00:40:29 ◼   ► I love it but you know all about what's

00:40:31 ◼   ► happening at a video game channel on

00:40:33 ◼   ► YouTube this is the moment where again I

00:40:35 ◼   ► can be very sympathetic to your position

00:40:37 ◼   ► because I am sitting here thinking I

00:40:40 ◼   ► kind of can't believe that as someone

00:40:42 ◼   ► who makes their living on YouTube like

00:40:44 ◼   ► you haven't come across this thing

00:40:45 ◼   ► that's going on and into some way shape

00:40:47 ◼   ► or form but obviously you haven't but

00:40:49 ◼   ► you are you would be quite right to say

00:40:51 ◼   ► you can't believe that is someone who

00:40:53 ◼   ► lives in the UK and has professionally

00:40:55 ◼   ► made videos about the politics of the UK

00:40:57 ◼   ► I have not heard anything about brexit

00:40:59 ◼   ► we're as bad as each other we are about

00:41:01 ◼   ► it is there anything I need to know

00:41:02 ◼   ► about brexit is there anything I should

00:41:03 ◼   ► worry about Brady just before Justin

00:41:06 ◼   ► yeah it's still a big bows up okay great

00:41:09 ◼   ► so I haven't met anything yet than that

00:41:10 ◼   ► all right well let me tell you about

00:41:12 ◼   ► something that really matters it's okay

00:41:14 ◼   ► tell me what's happening on YouTube and

00:41:16 ◼   ► with PewDiePie I'm gonna do a very

00:41:19 ◼   ► high-level overview of what's going on

00:41:22 ◼   ► here because in some ways I don't think

00:41:24 ◼   ► that the details really matter but I

00:41:25 ◼   ► think the broad point is more

00:41:27 ◼   ► interesting okay so PewDiePie the

00:41:30 ◼   ► largest subscribed YouTube channel at

00:41:33 ◼   ► the time of recordings got 50 million

00:41:35 ◼   ► something subscribers crazy number that

00:41:37 ◼   ► makes no sense

00:41:38 ◼   ► he's also recently gotten in to live

00:41:41 ◼   ► streaming so playing his games live on

00:41:44 ◼   ► the internet and he got himself into a

00:41:46 ◼   ► whole world of trouble by saying a very

00:41:49 ◼   ► bad word that he shouldn't have said

00:41:51 ◼   ► what was the word it was the N word

00:41:54 ◼   ► Brady oh okay right yeah that doesn't go

00:41:57 ◼   ► down well

00:41:57 ◼   ► no it doesn't go down well he said

00:41:59 ◼   ► nobody read but not the word nobody it

00:42:01 ◼   ► was even naughtier met he said it

00:42:03 ◼   ► naughty word but it wasn't that N word

00:42:05 ◼   ► that's not the word that misaeng yeah so

00:42:07 ◼   ► he got himself into a whole load

00:42:08 ◼   ► yeah so now PewDiePie has made videos of

00:42:13 ◼   ► a video game called

00:42:16 ◼   ► fire watch right in his past he's

00:42:18 ◼   ► recorded them they're up on his YouTube

00:42:20 ◼   ► channel he didn't say any naughty words

00:42:22 ◼   ► in those it was just very typical he's

00:42:24 ◼   ► recording himself playing a video game

00:42:26 ◼   ► and putting it up for his fans

00:42:28 ◼   ► yeah so then what happened was the

00:42:31 ◼   ► company that makes that video game

00:42:35 ◼   ► because of the thing that he said on his

00:42:38 ◼   ► livestream yeah decided to file DMCA

00:42:42 ◼   ► takedowns against all of his videos

00:42:45 ◼   ► featuring their content rah and he got a

00:42:49 ◼   ► copyright strike against his channel now

00:42:53 ◼   ► in the YouTube world getting a copyright

00:42:57 ◼   ► strike getting an official real strike

00:42:58 ◼   ► against your channel is a pretty big

00:43:00 ◼   ► deal because if you get three strikes

00:43:03 ◼   ► your channel is just totally removed

00:43:06 ◼   ► from YouTube all of your videos are

00:43:08 ◼   ► deleted the channels just gone I think

00:43:11 ◼   ► they elapse after a certain amount of

00:43:13 ◼   ► time I'm not 100% sure about that but

00:43:15 ◼   ► getting three copyright strikes is a

00:43:19 ◼   ► super big deal yeah I feel like this is

00:43:23 ◼   ► right in the heart of this complicated

00:43:27 ◼   ► topic about copyrights and also like

00:43:30 ◼   ► YouTube getting into the like the

00:43:33 ◼   ► business of controlling content on their

00:43:36 ◼   ► channel and it's like while PewDiePie is

00:43:40 ◼   ► very difficult to defend in this

00:43:42 ◼   ► situation I think there's something

00:43:44 ◼   ► really really dangerous and really

00:43:48 ◼   ► chilling about a company being able to

00:43:52 ◼   ► like selectively enforce the copyright

00:43:57 ◼   ► on their content based on whether or not

00:44:00 ◼   ► they like the creator or not

00:44:02 ◼   ► when PewDiePie first uploaded these

00:44:04 ◼   ► Firewatch videos the ones that are not

00:44:07 ◼   ► naughty did he have their permission or

00:44:11 ◼   ► had they just turned a blind eye to the

00:44:13 ◼   ► copyright because it was great publicity

00:44:15 ◼   ► from a really famous youtuber like did

00:44:18 ◼   ► he have permission and they're removing

00:44:20 ◼   ► it

00:44:21 ◼   ► retrospectively like what was the status

00:44:23 ◼   ► at the time before this n-word thing

00:44:26 ◼   ► happened the short answer is the company

00:44:28 ◼   ► that makes fire watch on their official

00:44:32 ◼   ► web page have an FAQ where they say you

00:44:36 ◼   ► can make videos about our game you can

00:44:39 ◼   ► stream this game and you are allowed to

00:44:41 ◼   ► monetize this game like go ahead go nuts

00:44:44 ◼   ► okay so the the developers of the game

00:44:47 ◼   ► did give sort of a blanket permission to

00:44:51 ◼   ► the world of go ahead you can record

00:44:54 ◼   ► this this video game and you can stream

00:44:57 ◼   ► it and that was just sort of given out

00:45:00 ◼   ► to everybody and that's part of what I

00:45:02 ◼   ► think is this kind of dangerous thing

00:45:05 ◼   ► that I really don't like YouTube going

00:45:08 ◼   ► along with this of him allowing the

00:45:11 ◼   ► company to retroactively Lee remove

00:45:14 ◼   ► someone's content simply because they

00:45:17 ◼   ► don't like that creator anymore there's

00:45:19 ◼   ► something about that that feels really

00:45:21 ◼   ► dangerous as a precedent that sets on

00:45:24 ◼   ► YouTube and it makes me as a sometimes

00:45:27 ◼   ► very rare game streamer a bit

00:45:29 ◼   ► uncomfortable with how that has worked

00:45:31 ◼   ► out I mean there's a certain

00:45:32 ◼   ► arbitrariness to how you can enforce

00:45:36 ◼   ► your own copyright like if the Daily

00:45:38 ◼   ► Mail pinch one of my videos I may go to

00:45:40 ◼   ► town and try to get money out of them

00:45:42 ◼   ► and kick up a fuss mm-hmm but if another

00:45:43 ◼   ► organization free boots me I might have

00:45:46 ◼   ► been a good mood one day and do nothing

00:45:48 ◼   ► I can see how you can be arbitrary on

00:45:50 ◼   ► who you prosecute for lack of a better

00:45:53 ◼   ► word for taking your material and

00:45:55 ◼   ► Firewatch could potentially be within

00:45:58 ◼   ► their rights if they hadn't said in the

00:46:01 ◼   ► past this is okay so I don't think you

00:46:05 ◼   ► can move the goalposts after you've done

00:46:06 ◼   ► that like if PewDiePie was taking a risk

00:46:09 ◼   ► and Firewatch had always said this is

00:46:12 ◼   ► our game you shouldn't be streaming it

00:46:13 ◼   ► and it turned a blind eye to PewDiePie

00:46:15 ◼   ► for years and then one day he turned

00:46:18 ◼   ► into a bad character and they said all

00:46:20 ◼   ► right now we're gonna enforce like that

00:46:23 ◼   ► would be a bit douchey but like it would

00:46:25 ◼   ► sort of seem within the rules but if

00:46:27 ◼   ► they have already said as you say on

00:46:29 ◼   ► their FAQ you can stream the game

00:46:32 ◼   ► and it was done in good faith I think

00:46:35 ◼   ► that is very unfair it seems unfair I

00:46:37 ◼   ► really don't like that YouTube has gone

00:46:38 ◼   ► along with that and has issued a

00:46:41 ◼   ► copyright strike against PewDiePie it

00:46:43 ◼   ► seems like two entities deciding that

00:46:45 ◼   ► that for content reasons not for the

00:46:48 ◼   ► like official rules reasons that they're

00:46:50 ◼   ► going to enforce the thing and that

00:46:52 ◼   ► always just kind of makes me a little

00:46:53 ◼   ► bit uncomfortable but it's an

00:46:55 ◼   ► interesting situation because Let's

00:46:58 ◼   ► Plays and people who record themselves

00:47:00 ◼   ► playing video games on the Internet

00:47:02 ◼   ► this is like the greatest of grey areas

00:47:06 ◼   ► when it comes to a question of what is

00:47:08 ◼   ► fair use and when we were talking about

00:47:11 ◼   ► with the h3h3 lawsuit and I kept saying

00:47:13 ◼   ► oh I think this is the bare minimum of

00:47:15 ◼   ► what I might consider fair use under the

00:47:17 ◼   ► rules as they were written the live

00:47:20 ◼   ► streaming stuff and the video game

00:47:21 ◼   ► streaming stuff is like oh my god we're

00:47:23 ◼   ► in this fog and there's no ability to

00:47:25 ◼   ► see in any direction where we're

00:47:27 ◼   ► actually standing and there is like this

00:47:30 ◼   ► I almost want to call it like a like a

00:47:33 ◼   ► date hunt between most video game

00:47:36 ◼   ► companies and video game streamers where

00:47:38 ◼   ► nobody seems to want to bring up any

00:47:41 ◼   ► kind of court case that would actually

00:47:43 ◼   ► resolve this like it's it is astounding

00:47:45 ◼   ► to me that this far into YouTube and

00:47:48 ◼   ► this far into game streaming as a hugely

00:47:52 ◼   ► popular thing there have been no court

00:47:54 ◼   ► cases that have set any meaningful

00:47:56 ◼   ► precedents on the concept of is

00:47:59 ◼   ► recording yourself playing a video game

00:48:01 ◼   ► fair use or not no companies want to

00:48:05 ◼   ► make this move and many many companies

00:48:08 ◼   ► take the the policy sort of like what

00:48:10 ◼   ► you were saying before of simply not

00:48:13 ◼   ► saying anything publicly about it it's

00:48:17 ◼   ► very interesting I kind of wonder if

00:48:20 ◼   ► this thing between PewDiePie and the

00:48:23 ◼   ► company that makes Firewatch might

00:48:25 ◼   ► actually end up becoming one of the

00:48:27 ◼   ► first precedent-setting court cases

00:48:30 ◼   ► depending on how far Firewatch wants to

00:48:31 ◼   ► take it but the very concept of should

00:48:35 ◼   ► someone recording themselves playing a

00:48:36 ◼   ► video game count as fair use is a thing

00:48:39 ◼   ► that I feel like I have no ability to

00:48:42 ◼   ► come to a decision on that even as

00:48:44 ◼   ► someone who has streamed him

00:48:46 ◼   ► of playing video games I will happily

00:48:48 ◼   ► acknowledge that that feels like it's in

00:48:49 ◼   ► a really big gray area about how much of

00:48:53 ◼   ► this content is like transformative

00:48:54 ◼   ► versus how much of it is just showing

00:48:58 ◼   ► what the game developers themselves have

00:48:59 ◼   ► created so gray as you know I haven't

00:49:02 ◼   ► been following this debate but I do know

00:49:04 ◼   ► that PewDiePie is not famous for being

00:49:06 ◼   ► silent on such matters

00:49:07 ◼   ► has he been kicking up a ruckus and

00:49:10 ◼   ► saying this is an outrage and going to

00:49:12 ◼   ► the mattresses he's made a few videos

00:49:13 ◼   ► about it but of course that's his stock

00:49:15 ◼   ► in trade

00:49:16 ◼   ► he's a controversial character and then

00:49:18 ◼   ► he gets to make videos about his own

00:49:20 ◼   ► controversies which become popular as

00:49:21 ◼   ► well said the guys that are still doing

00:49:23 ◼   ► feedback an error to the episode look

00:49:25 ◼   ► you know everything feeds on itself in

00:49:28 ◼   ► some way or another brady but yeah of

00:49:32 ◼   ► course he's taken the position as well

00:49:34 ◼   ► that it's that the copyright strike is

00:49:37 ◼   ► ridiculous and that he had permission

00:49:38 ◼   ► from from Firewatch but that's exactly

00:49:41 ◼   ► the position that you would expect him

00:49:42 ◼   ► to take I mean my initial thought like a

00:49:44 ◼   ► minute ago I was thinking maybe this is

00:49:46 ◼   ► just like for show you know like a PR

00:49:49 ◼   ► thing and it's just like you know that

00:49:50 ◼   ► when you get officially sanctioned and

00:49:52 ◼   ► no one's really angry anyone but you

00:49:54 ◼   ► said the videos have been taken down too

00:49:56 ◼   ► so his Firewatch videos were taken down

00:49:59 ◼   ► he got the DMCA copyright strike and the

00:50:01 ◼   ► thing that I find a little bit a little

00:50:03 ◼   ► bit in this like threatening kind of way

00:50:04 ◼   ► is that the developer of fire watch was

00:50:07 ◼   ► on Twitter and was calling for other

00:50:09 ◼   ► developers to issue copyright strikes

00:50:12 ◼   ► retro actively against PewDiePie and

00:50:14 ◼   ► it's like man you only need two other

00:50:18 ◼   ► people to do that and if he gets three

00:50:21 ◼   ► copyright strikes at once like his whole

00:50:22 ◼   ► channel goes yeah they're not gonna do

00:50:24 ◼   ► that to him you cheap won't let that

00:50:25 ◼   ► happen to their biggest channel well

00:50:27 ◼   ► this is a topic for another time but

00:50:29 ◼   ► let's just say I would personally

00:50:30 ◼   ► suspect that YouTube might not shed a

00:50:33 ◼   ► tear if PewDiePie of all people were no

00:50:36 ◼   ► longer the number one youtuber on their

00:50:38 ◼   ► platform I don't think YouTube would be

00:50:40 ◼   ► crying themselves to sleep at night

00:50:41 ◼   ► thinking oh cutie pie he was the one

00:50:44 ◼   ► that we wanted to hold up our brand to

00:50:45 ◼   ► the world fair enough and I think

00:50:47 ◼   ► YouTube would be way more happy if

00:50:49 ◼   ► someone like Casey Neistat became the

00:50:51 ◼   ► number one person and then was the

00:50:53 ◼   ► representative of YouTube to the world

00:50:54 ◼   ► well objectivity or objectivity of

00:50:58 ◼   ► course there's the finalist list

00:51:00 ◼   ► those things it's which one do they

00:51:01 ◼   ► think they should have represent YouTube

00:51:04 ◼   ► itself cave

00:51:05 ◼   ► Kate's famous cave yeah so great what

00:51:12 ◼   ► are you gonna do what does this mean for

00:51:13 ◼   ► CGP player whatever you've killed your

00:51:16 ◼   ► mom Chell my incredible gaming Chapel

00:51:18 ◼   ► what happens now is this gonna scare you

00:51:20 ◼   ► off you're gonna like a little

00:51:22 ◼   ► frightened rabbit are you gonna run back

00:51:24 ◼   ► into your hole and not make any more of

00:51:26 ◼   ► those truck things driving channels

00:51:29 ◼   ► things well luckily my CTV plays live

00:51:33 ◼   ► streaming channel is a trivial portion

00:51:35 ◼   ► of the massive empire that is gray

00:51:38 ◼   ► industries yeah so from a like a

00:51:39 ◼   ► personal perspective I don't have to

00:51:40 ◼   ► worry about that because it's a it's a

00:51:43 ◼   ► separate thing it's not connected to my

00:51:45 ◼   ► main industry right you've got it you've

00:51:47 ◼   ► got it registered like on the Isle of

00:51:49 ◼   ► Wight or something I guess I think

00:51:50 ◼   ► that's exactly right oh the bank

00:51:52 ◼   ► accounts are offshore yeah yeah it's in

00:51:54 ◼   ► a trust the Isle of Wight that's

00:51:56 ◼   ► actually owning a company in the Bahamas

00:51:58 ◼   ► right yeah we have three trustees yeah

00:52:01 ◼   ► it's a very secure situation so the

00:52:03 ◼   ► people who make Euro Truck Simulator

00:52:05 ◼   ► aren't gonna be able to get their hands

00:52:07 ◼   ► on the main channel Dulles no that's

00:52:09 ◼   ► they're all quarantined yes it's very

00:52:10 ◼   ► good but it really is like when I

00:52:13 ◼   ► started doing that just for fun the

00:52:15 ◼   ► whole copyright issue around this I

00:52:16 ◼   ► really do find sort of fascinating

00:52:20 ◼   ► because a lot of the argument for why

00:52:23 ◼   ► let's play video should should be fair

00:52:25 ◼   ► use is that the streamers will argue

00:52:27 ◼   ► it's a kind of performance it's like

00:52:29 ◼   ► well yes yeah the thing that you're

00:52:31 ◼   ► looking at on the screen is content

00:52:33 ◼   ► that's created by somebody else but

00:52:34 ◼   ► there is a performance that is occurring

00:52:36 ◼   ► on top of it look if I went out and

00:52:38 ◼   ► bought at a desk juggling balls and made

00:52:40 ◼   ► a video of me juggling added s couldn't

00:52:42 ◼   ► say hey those are our juggling balls

00:52:44 ◼   ► right you know I was just using their

00:52:46 ◼   ► thing from our performance right he's

00:52:48 ◼   ► like oh they have a copyrighted sequence

00:52:50 ◼   ► of colours on them or the pattern right

00:52:51 ◼   ► so it's like the Eiffel Tower at night

00:52:53 ◼   ► you know he can't you can't photograph

00:52:54 ◼   ► it yeah this is the argument that the

00:52:56 ◼   ► performance makes it transformative but

00:52:59 ◼   ► then of course like with all of these

00:53:00 ◼   ► things there is this slider that goes

00:53:02 ◼   ► from red letter media being totally

00:53:05 ◼   ► transformative down to the h3 h3 video

00:53:07 ◼   ► which is like minimally transformative

00:53:09 ◼   ► and you have stuff that's in between

00:53:10 ◼   ► there and Euro Truck Simulator or like

00:53:13 ◼   ► driving American Truck Simulator when

00:53:15 ◼   ► I'm doing that there are reasonably

00:53:17 ◼   ► large portions where I'm simply not

00:53:18 ◼   ► saying anything then all of a sudden we

00:53:20 ◼   ► get to this very strange situation where

00:53:22 ◼   ► it's like okay what is occurring on the

00:53:23 ◼   ► screen here it's like well a man is

00:53:26 ◼   ► driving a pretend truck on a pretend

00:53:27 ◼   ► Road and he's saying nothing is this

00:53:30 ◼   ► transformative I would say it's not

00:53:32 ◼   ► transformative at all but it's also just

00:53:34 ◼   ► a virtual representation of a real Road

00:53:37 ◼   ► like does anybody own the copyright to

00:53:39 ◼   ► this road that we're driving along all

00:53:41 ◼   ► not not really it's so hard to

00:53:43 ◼   ► understand is this fair use and I think

00:53:45 ◼   ► is another another example of the

00:53:48 ◼   ► internet really changing and distorting

00:53:51 ◼   ► what these laws were originally written

00:53:52 ◼   ► for and you end up in all sorts of

00:53:53 ◼   ► situations where it's hard to understand

00:53:55 ◼   ► how this stuff should apply and and I

00:53:58 ◼   ► can't come down with any clear decision

00:54:01 ◼   ► in my mind about should stuff like Let's

00:54:04 ◼   ► Plays be considered fair use or not I

00:54:07 ◼   ► think a lot of the companies that are

00:54:10 ◼   ► making games don't want to push that

00:54:12 ◼   ► issue either I think they're very happy

00:54:14 ◼   ► with this date hunt of not saying

00:54:18 ◼   ► anything but I think that this Firewatch

00:54:20 ◼   ► thing is the first little breakdown in

00:54:23 ◼   ► maybe this day tante can't last forever

00:54:25 ◼   ► and at at some point someone is going to

00:54:29 ◼   ► have to force the issue and the courts

00:54:31 ◼   ► will have to decide whether gameplay is

00:54:33 ◼   ► fair use or not can I just ask a quick

00:54:35 ◼   ► thing about the truck simulator game

00:54:37 ◼   ► yeah I haven't watched a lot of your

00:54:38 ◼   ► playing videos but I've occasionally

00:54:40 ◼   ► dipped in once or twice when I've seen

00:54:41 ◼   ► people saying you know your pause

00:54:43 ◼   ► playing now on Twitter mhm

00:54:44 ◼   ► every time I look at you playing that

00:54:46 ◼   ► game you seem to be crashing the truck

00:54:49 ◼   ► into stuff yeah but are you good at it

00:54:51 ◼   ► am I just happening to watch at times

00:54:53 ◼   ► when you're making mistakes or because

00:54:54 ◼   ► every time I've watched you play it

00:54:55 ◼   ► you're dreadful at it now I want to get

00:54:57 ◼   ► this on the record I'm very good at that

00:54:59 ◼   ► game know that the problem is that

00:55:01 ◼   ► you're drunk no Brady although I will

00:55:04 ◼   ► say if you ever want to see an actual

00:55:07 ◼   ► demonstration of how much alcohol

00:55:08 ◼   ► effects you play a truck simulator game

00:55:10 ◼   ► because sometimes I play the game on the

00:55:12 ◼   ► couch like when my wife and I are just

00:55:14 ◼   ► sort of watching TV and I like to have

00:55:16 ◼   ► it as a mindless thing to do with my

00:55:17 ◼   ► hands and it is very noticeable like

00:55:20 ◼   ► hilariously noticeable that what I would

00:55:23 ◼   ► consider to be a minimal amount of

00:55:25 ◼   ► alcohol like oh I have had a glass

00:55:27 ◼   ► of wine surely I don't feel like I'm

00:55:29 ◼   ► affected this doesn't affect me at all

00:55:30 ◼   ► is like truck simulator says different

00:55:32 ◼   ► like it's it is fascinating to say as I

00:55:34 ◼   ► Wow

00:55:35 ◼   ► I would not have guessed that my

00:55:36 ◼   ► reflexes were different but they sure

00:55:38 ◼   ► are different but now when I'm

00:55:40 ◼   ► live-streaming it's it's a different

00:55:41 ◼   ► thing simply because there's a whole

00:55:42 ◼   ► bunch of stuff going on and they're

00:55:44 ◼   ► people chatting like they're people who

00:55:45 ◼   ► are interacting with me and so when I

00:55:47 ◼   ► crash it's because people have

00:55:49 ◼   ► distracted me in the chat you're like

00:55:50 ◼   ► texting and driving that is exactly

00:55:52 ◼   ► what's happening when you see me

00:55:54 ◼   ► crashing on the Euro Truck Simulator I'm

00:55:55 ◼   ► not drinking it is an advertisement for

00:55:58 ◼   ► how bad texting and driving is because

00:56:00 ◼   ► that's essentially what's occurring

00:56:01 ◼   ► there don't text and drive kids you'll

00:56:04 ◼   ► crash seriously don't this it's such a

00:56:06 ◼   ► bad thing yeah it's it's horrific

00:56:08 ◼   ► I'm serious grey it's bad man I'm deadly

00:56:11 ◼   ► serious as well yeah I've seen a bunch

00:56:12 ◼   ► of studies saying that it is as bad or

00:56:14 ◼   ► worse than drinking a frequent topic on

00:56:17 ◼   ► the podcast uber I think that that is

00:56:18 ◼   ► one thing I will I will give drivers

00:56:20 ◼   ► really harsh ratings for us if they're

00:56:21 ◼   ► texting while driving yeah and I did it

00:56:24 ◼   ► recently I gave a dude one-star and

00:56:25 ◼   ► contacted uber about that this dude was

00:56:27 ◼   ► driving dangerously because he was he

00:56:29 ◼   ► was texting through an intersection I

00:56:31 ◼   ► was like okay forget it

00:56:33 ◼   ► I wouldn't put up with it if you were

00:56:34 ◼   ► drinking through this intersection so

00:56:35 ◼   ► I'm certainly gonna write it up if you

00:56:37 ◼   ► were texting through an intersection I'm

00:56:39 ◼   ► off a bit now gray oh really

00:56:41 ◼   ► what are you doing there's not lift in

00:56:43 ◼   ► the UK he's there now I'm walking uh

00:56:45 ◼   ► what are you doing I don't know yeah I

00:56:47 ◼   ► just got him black cabs the other day I

00:56:48 ◼   ► was going to install lifts I didn't know

00:56:50 ◼   ► I couldn't do it in the UK but I hadn't

00:56:51 ◼   ► actually got around to replacing ever

00:56:53 ◼   ► okay so you're back on uber that's what

00:56:55 ◼   ► you're saying well no I'm not back on it

00:56:58 ◼   ► yeah and I'm not gonna use it in America

00:56:59 ◼   ► why are you off it they didn't show me

00:57:01 ◼   ► the respect I deserve

00:57:02 ◼   ► no do I even want to know Brady what

00:57:05 ◼   ► happened oh it's a boring corporate

00:57:06 ◼   ► compensation corner okay alright yeah

00:57:08 ◼   ► we'll leave it believe it at that with

00:57:10 ◼   ► there is let's leave it for another day

00:57:11 ◼   ► leave it for another day I'll let you

00:57:13 ◼   ► know once it's resolved if it's

00:57:15 ◼   ► interesting I'll let you know okay for

00:57:16 ◼   ► now uber or on my blacklist

00:57:19 ◼   ► okay the breeding blacklist hmm beware

00:57:22 ◼   ► beware companies yeah I wanna be on that

00:57:25 ◼   ► hi everyone welcome to my bathroom I'm

00:57:28 ◼   ► just gonna be running you through a

00:57:31 ◼   ► Harry shave while I talk about them it's

00:57:34 ◼   ► some water going here

00:57:39 ◼   ► I've got my Harry's or weaponry ready

00:57:42 ◼   ► here I'm holding in my hand the handle

00:57:45 ◼   ► I've gone for this weighty silver one

00:57:48 ◼   ► you can't see it but you can hear it

00:57:49 ◼   ► tapping against the sink here very nice

00:57:53 ◼   ► looking and look is very expensive

00:57:55 ◼   ► although it's not and now just let me

00:57:56 ◼   ► put my blade onto the handle always very

00:58:00 ◼   ► satisfying as a new one clicks into

00:58:02 ◼   ► place

00:58:03 ◼   ► lovely Harry's is a company that's so

00:58:06 ◼   ► confident that you're gonna love their

00:58:07 ◼   ► shaving products that they'll send you a

00:58:09 ◼   ► free trial shave set when you go to

00:58:12 ◼   ► harrys.com slash H eye all you have to

00:58:16 ◼   ► pay for is shipping now they're all

00:58:18 ◼   ► about a great shave but they're also

00:58:19 ◼   ► about a fair price and that's why over

00:58:21 ◼   ► three million guys have started using

00:58:23 ◼   ► them the blades are made in Germany so

00:58:26 ◼   ► you know they're going to be made to the

00:58:28 ◼   ► highest quality they're going to be

00:58:29 ◼   ► super precise and they're also going to

00:58:32 ◼   ► be pretty good at taking penalty kicks

00:58:33 ◼   ► in soccer tournaments if my experience

00:58:35 ◼   ► of Germans has anything to go by let's

00:58:39 ◼   ► get things moving here be a cream not

00:58:44 ◼   ► much of an audio experience this is a

00:58:47 ◼   ► rubbing on my face getting things ready

00:58:51 ◼   ► to row here now Harry's products are all

00:58:53 ◼   ► backed by a 100% quality guarantee you

00:58:57 ◼   ► can buy replacement blades over the web

00:58:59 ◼   ► and they are it'll way better price than

00:59:03 ◼   ► comparable rivals and I better

00:59:04 ◼   ► concentrate here let me move the

00:59:06 ◼   ► microphone so you can get some shaving

00:59:08 ◼   ► noise listen to this quality Harry's

00:59:11 ◼   ► shave that's done the job nicely so

00:59:16 ◼   ► let's be clear on the offer here Harry's

00:59:18 ◼   ► comm /h I short for hello internet for a

00:59:23 ◼   ► free trial offer that's $13 a value for

00:59:26 ◼   ► free

00:59:27 ◼   ► when you sign up you just got to cover

00:59:29 ◼   ► the shipping and that sets going to

00:59:31 ◼   ► include a weighted economic razor handle

00:59:34 ◼   ► I'm holding such a handle in my

00:59:38 ◼   ► and at the moment just connect I'm not

00:59:45 ◼   ► lying

00:59:45 ◼   ► it's a good shape I'm literally shaving

00:59:47 ◼   ► right now in the set you're also gonna

00:59:50 ◼   ► have five precision-engineered blades

00:59:52 ◼   ► with lubricating strips trimmer blade

00:59:55 ◼   ► you get a rich lathering gel I actually

00:59:57 ◼   ► use the shave cream I like the hair

00:59:57 ◼   ► use the shave cream I like the hair

01:00:00 ◼   ► shave cream but the gel apparently is

01:00:02 ◼   ► really good too that comes in the kit

01:00:03 ◼   ► and you get a travel blade cover that's

01:00:06 ◼   ► harrys.com /h I go and have a look at

01:00:09 ◼   ► their website because they've got some

01:00:10 ◼   ► other nicer products as well including

01:00:12 ◼   ► sort of lotions and potions for your

01:00:14 ◼   ► face and I know a lot of people like

01:00:17 ◼   ► years ago were always complaining that

01:00:19 ◼   ► could only really get their hairy stuff

01:00:20 ◼   ► in North America but I know for a fact

01:00:23 ◼   ► they're shipping in the UK now so go and

01:00:25 ◼   ► have a look at their website and see

01:00:27 ◼   ► what's available there great for you

01:00:28 ◼   ► they also make really great gifts I'm

01:00:31 ◼   ► gonna finish the show even let you get

01:00:33 ◼   ► back on with hello Internet his Trip

01:00:36 ◼   ► Advisor on their blacklist no

01:00:38 ◼   ► TripAdvisor is not on my blacklist bit

01:00:40 ◼   ► as you have seen in the notes that is

01:00:42 ◼   ► what I would like to ask you about next

01:00:43 ◼   ► I was trying to do a segue their

01:00:47 ◼   ► breeding they took a leaf out of my book

01:00:48 ◼   ► back I'm proud of you learning from your

01:00:51 ◼   ► vice host don't say that baby it's awful

01:00:56 ◼   ► it's already a thing that genies out of

01:00:58 ◼   ► the bottle you degrade yourself when you

01:01:00 ◼   ► say vice host don't do it I already get

01:01:01 ◼   ► emails from people calling me vice ace

01:01:03 ◼   ► now all right what do you want to know

01:01:07 ◼   ► about Trip Advisor buddy so you use Trip

01:01:09 ◼   ► Advisor presumably like you know when

01:01:11 ◼   ► you're going places and and so do i it's

01:01:14 ◼   ► a useful resource my question is a

01:01:17 ◼   ► simple one

01:01:18 ◼   ► do you ever contribute to Trip Advisor

01:01:21 ◼   ► or are you like me a parasite I am NOT

01:01:27 ◼   ► like you a parasite yeah but it's just

01:01:31 ◼   ► by a technicality let me tell you a

01:01:33 ◼   ► little story reading please two summers

01:01:36 ◼   ► ago my wife and I were driving across

01:01:39 ◼   ► America we're going to a family reunion

01:01:41 ◼   ► and we wanted to get some breakfasts and

01:01:45 ◼   ► at that point in my life breakfast was a

01:01:47 ◼   ► very important meal to me at that point

01:01:49 ◼   ► you're like yeah I don't do breakfast

01:01:50 ◼   ► anymore it turns out breakfast is

01:01:52 ◼   ► bullshit you don't need it that's a lie

01:01:54 ◼   ► but two years ago gray was real grumpy

01:01:57 ◼   ► if he didn't get his breakfast okay so

01:02:01 ◼   ► my wife and I we look up on TripAdvisor

01:02:02 ◼   ► we're trying to find a place and we

01:02:05 ◼   ► eventually pick a place that looks like

01:02:07 ◼   ► it's nearby

01:02:08 ◼   ► and has a reasonable TripAdvisor

01:02:11 ◼   ► so we go into the restaurant hmm and you

01:02:16 ◼   ► know when you're with another person

01:02:19 ◼   ► sometimes it's it's a little bit hard to

01:02:21 ◼   ► judge what's going on in the other

01:02:24 ◼   ► person's mind and you know how when

01:02:26 ◼   ► you're traveling you want you have a

01:02:27 ◼   ► certain amount of like you want to go

01:02:28 ◼   ► along with things yeah but I walk

01:02:30 ◼   ► through the door of this restaurant and

01:02:31 ◼   ► I just immediately thought I don't know

01:02:34 ◼   ► about this I can't put my finger on what

01:02:36 ◼   ► it is something is amiss here and where

01:02:39 ◼   ► I on my own I would have turned around

01:02:41 ◼   ► right then but you're with someone and

01:02:43 ◼   ► there's like an inertia that you the two

01:02:46 ◼   ► of you have rolled through the door

01:02:47 ◼   ► together and so you just don't say

01:02:49 ◼   ► anything did you think it was like

01:02:51 ◼   ► unsafe or unhygenic or like what was the

01:02:55 ◼   ► feel it's hard to say what it was just a

01:02:59 ◼   ► little bit of something's not right okay

01:03:01 ◼   ► the decor in the restaurant was I would

01:03:03 ◼   ► say quirky but something just seemed off

01:03:06 ◼   ► and I couldn't place it

01:03:07 ◼   ► I hope this is gonna end up but from

01:03:09 ◼   ► dusk to dawn and it was like a vampire

01:03:11 ◼   ► hangout or something I'm afraid it was

01:03:12 ◼   ► not a vampire hangout but there was

01:03:14 ◼   ► nobody else in the restaurant which is

01:03:16 ◼   ► objective thing one yeah that's a

01:03:18 ◼   ► problem it's not that's not a good sign

01:03:20 ◼   ► hmm there's a little bit of confusion

01:03:21 ◼   ► the waitress eventually shows up with

01:03:24 ◼   ► what I presume is like the owner who's

01:03:26 ◼   ► sort of standing nearby by the counter

01:03:29 ◼   ► like I can't quite figure out what the

01:03:30 ◼   ► situation is we're looking at the menu

01:03:32 ◼   ► we order what we're gonna order and they

01:03:36 ◼   ► go they disappear off back into the

01:03:38 ◼   ► kitchen the two of them hmm and I'm

01:03:40 ◼   ► realizing it's super warm in this

01:03:43 ◼   ► restaurant like uncomfortably warm as

01:03:45 ◼   ► we're sitting there and then suddenly a

01:03:49 ◼   ► fly lands on my wife and then I noticed

01:03:53 ◼   ► there's some flies on the window and all

01:03:55 ◼   ► of a sudden your senses just tune into

01:03:57 ◼   ► it immediately like there's flies

01:03:59 ◼   ► everywhere there's a fly in her hair

01:04:02 ◼   ► there's flies in my hair I was like this

01:04:05 ◼   ► is disgusting

01:04:06 ◼   ► what's going on in this restaurant and

01:04:08 ◼   ► then as I'm like looking at my wife

01:04:11 ◼   ► she's looking at me and she's

01:04:13 ◼   ► recognizing all the Flies all of a

01:04:15 ◼   ► sudden and we're getting to that moment

01:04:16 ◼   ► of like uh-oh what have we done yeah and

01:04:19 ◼   ► then we hear from the kitchen the two

01:04:21 ◼   ► people are arguing

01:04:24 ◼   ► they're arguing about how the things

01:04:26 ◼   ► that we just ordered were supposed to be

01:04:29 ◼   ► made there's some kind of like great

01:04:30 ◼   ► disagreement occurring in the kitchen

01:04:32 ◼   ► yeah and so my wife and I we got up I

01:04:36 ◼   ► took her hand and I said we're getting

01:04:39 ◼   ► out of here and we essentially just ran

01:04:43 ◼   ► to the car and drove away there's so

01:04:45 ◼   ► many flies this place is so disgusting

01:04:47 ◼   ► there's an argument occurring in the

01:04:48 ◼   ► kitchen we're just getting out of here

01:04:50 ◼   ► they've no explanation required we're

01:04:52 ◼   ► just leaving that was the last time we

01:04:54 ◼   ► ever went to big Joe's sloppy buns

01:04:56 ◼   ► yeah that restaurant is the only time I

01:05:01 ◼   ► have left a review on TripAdvisor I gave

01:05:04 ◼   ► them one star and I wrote a review

01:05:07 ◼   ► warning everybody else away that I go so

01:05:12 ◼   ► that is my one and only contribution to

01:05:14 ◼   ► TripAdvisor

01:05:15 ◼   ► which is now bigs desperately sort by

01:05:19 ◼   ► tims across the internet aside from that

01:05:21 ◼   ► one incident I'm essentially a parasite

01:05:24 ◼   ► I have I have not reviewed anything I

01:05:26 ◼   ► think you're pretty much parasite and

01:05:28 ◼   ► the funny thing is I can't think of a

01:05:31 ◼   ► nice holiday that I've been on where my

01:05:34 ◼   ► wife and I haven't sat over like a

01:05:35 ◼   ► lovely meal or a cocktail saying Oh what

01:05:38 ◼   ► would we write on TripAdvisor about this

01:05:40 ◼   ► place and we go through all the

01:05:41 ◼   ► different things we do and like the

01:05:43 ◼   ► lovely review we write and we always say

01:05:45 ◼   ► well we must do that when we get back

01:05:46 ◼   ► that would be really useful so many

01:05:48 ◼   ► people have helped us with the reviews

01:05:49 ◼   ► that's right a really useful review of

01:05:51 ◼   ► this place you get home never do it just

01:05:54 ◼   ► forget about it you discuss the

01:05:56 ◼   ► theoretical TripAdvisor review that you

01:05:57 ◼   ► would learn like we don't like you know

01:05:59 ◼   ► craft the wording yeah you're not

01:06:01 ◼   ► writing an article about it now are you

01:06:03 ◼   ► you're just having a conversation yes

01:06:07 ◼   ► they're two totally different things I

01:06:09 ◼   ► completely understand writing an article

01:06:11 ◼   ► about it would be would be a much more

01:06:13 ◼   ► important thing to do wouldn't it I

01:06:14 ◼   ► don't know I feel like people have been

01:06:16 ◼   ► doing us a service and we can return the

01:06:18 ◼   ► favor cuz it's not always just like

01:06:19 ◼   ► praise you know oh this would be a

01:06:21 ◼   ► useful thing to know and that we don't

01:06:23 ◼   ► do it I don't think you should feel any

01:06:25 ◼   ► kind of guilt about this that Brady

01:06:26 ◼   ► because one of the ways all of these

01:06:30 ◼   ► kinds of things were like obviously they

01:06:31 ◼   ► are a useful reference

01:06:34 ◼   ► but there is a part of it which is that

01:06:38 ◼   ► if you are writing a review for

01:06:41 ◼   ► TripAdvisor or Yelp or any of these kind

01:06:43 ◼   ► of services hmm in that moment you're

01:06:46 ◼   ► essentially doing advertising work for

01:06:50 ◼   ► the place that you were visiting well I

01:06:53 ◼   ► don't think you were advertising big joe

01:06:55 ◼   ► sloppy buns when you wrote that really

01:06:57 ◼   ► negative review or you're anti

01:06:58 ◼   ► advertising you're kicking sand in their

01:07:00 ◼   ► faiths our read reviews where I've said

01:07:02 ◼   ► things like you know try to get water

01:07:05 ◼   ► Villa number seven because it's got the

01:07:06 ◼   ► best view of the sunset and stuff like

01:07:08 ◼   ► that like you can get useful information

01:07:10 ◼   ► in these things yeah but see that's a

01:07:11 ◼   ► different thing because I feel like if I

01:07:13 ◼   ► go to a place and there's this is the

01:07:15 ◼   ► thing this is the good thing to do I

01:07:17 ◼   ► feel like that's a--that's like a trade

01:07:18 ◼   ► secret that I want to keep for myself I

01:07:19 ◼   ► don't want to let people in on what the

01:07:21 ◼   ► secret is when they when they visit the

01:07:23 ◼   ► place I'm gonna keep the information to

01:07:24 ◼   ► myself yeah I mean that's yeah but

01:07:26 ◼   ► you've benefited from it when you read

01:07:28 ◼   ► the review in the first place yeah

01:07:30 ◼   ► that's a bit selfish isn't it fine

01:07:33 ◼   ► that's okay but that's that's where the

01:07:34 ◼   ► guilt comes from I don't feel any guilt

01:07:36 ◼   ► about that kind of thing I'm not sitting

01:07:37 ◼   ► here wracked with guilt and I don't like

01:07:39 ◼   ► you know I'm not I'm not thinking like

01:07:41 ◼   ► I'm the world's worst person and it's

01:07:42 ◼   ► fine I think TripAdvisor would be more

01:07:44 ◼   ► useful if more people like me wrote

01:07:48 ◼   ► reviews mm-hmm it's like when you're

01:07:50 ◼   ► really angry at uber and by the time you

01:07:52 ◼   ► record the podcast you've like you know

01:07:54 ◼   ► you've just lost the fire in your belly

01:07:56 ◼   ► it's the same with a holiday once you're

01:07:57 ◼   ► back home you've you've lost your

01:07:59 ◼   ► creative flame for writing a bit of

01:08:02 ◼   ► purple prose about how lovely the place

01:08:04 ◼   ► works yeah I don't feel any guilt here

01:08:06 ◼   ► because there's there's like what's

01:08:08 ◼   ► occurring here is the interaction

01:08:10 ◼   ► between two corporations and a while

01:08:15 ◼   ► TripAdvisor and and services like it

01:08:16 ◼   ► they're obviously useful to everybody it

01:08:19 ◼   ► is also totally the fact that it's

01:08:20 ◼   ► because of all of the user contributions

01:08:23 ◼   ► that TripAdvisor has any value at all

01:08:26 ◼   ► and so even if you don't feel like

01:08:28 ◼   ► you're doing advertising work for the

01:08:30 ◼   ► restaurant that you have just visited

01:08:32 ◼   ► because you're you're writing about how

01:08:34 ◼   ► there's flies everywhere and they argue

01:08:35 ◼   ► in the kitchen yeah whatever you write

01:08:38 ◼   ► you are still then doing a kind of

01:08:41 ◼   ► unpaid work to build up the value of the

01:08:44 ◼   ► company of TripAdvisor yeah okay but the

01:08:47 ◼   ► thing is

01:08:47 ◼   ► you're willing to extract that free

01:08:49 ◼   ► value you're just not willing to put any

01:08:51 ◼   ► back in right it's fine it's selfish but

01:08:54 ◼   ► it's fine and it's okay and they get

01:08:56 ◼   ► their value in other ways I mean they

01:08:57 ◼   ► are running ads and you know I'm not

01:08:59 ◼   ► feeling sorry for TripAdvisor here again

01:09:01 ◼   ► this this is a kind of company that can

01:09:05 ◼   ► exist very differently in the Internet

01:09:07 ◼   ► than traditional companies could yeah

01:09:09 ◼   ► and it runs a ground of some of these

01:09:11 ◼   ► things and don't give her a I totally

01:09:14 ◼   ► get what you're saying and I will be the

01:09:16 ◼   ► first to admit that I am like a parasite

01:09:18 ◼   ► on the review systems of the world like

01:09:21 ◼   ► I just I rarely contribute and I

01:09:23 ◼   ► constantly extract value hmm but I don't

01:09:27 ◼   ► feel bad about it because I do think

01:09:29 ◼   ► these companies part of the way they're

01:09:32 ◼   ► able to do it is that like they

01:09:33 ◼   ► themselves are treading on a kind of

01:09:37 ◼   ► social expectation among the users to

01:09:40 ◼   ► contribute I just can't feel that way

01:09:43 ◼   ► about the company where it's it's like

01:09:44 ◼   ► well you you company are making this

01:09:46 ◼   ► available to me for free and I am happy

01:09:49 ◼   ► to enjoy your free resource see I think

01:09:52 ◼   ► the difference between you and I in this

01:09:53 ◼   ► conversation though is that I'm not even

01:09:55 ◼   ► thinking about TripAdvisor as a company

01:09:57 ◼   ► like to me that's an abstraction I'm

01:09:59 ◼   ► thinking about the other holiday makers

01:10:01 ◼   ► and me as a holiday maker and the

01:10:03 ◼   ► relationship between us right I feel a

01:10:06 ◼   ► bit like you know if I stumbled and fell

01:10:08 ◼   ► down a pothole in the street hmm and

01:10:10 ◼   ► then just walked away quietly and didn't

01:10:12 ◼   ► tell anyone else that was there and the

01:10:14 ◼   ► next person fell on the pothole I feel

01:10:16 ◼   ► like oh maybe I should have told some

01:10:18 ◼   ► people about it I'm not thinking of

01:10:20 ◼   ► TripAdvisor I'm not thinking of the

01:10:21 ◼   ► businesses that run holidays and the

01:10:23 ◼   ► restaurants and the hotel's I'm thinking

01:10:24 ◼   ► about my fellow your fellow Internet

01:10:27 ◼   ► citizens yeah I totally get it and

01:10:29 ◼   ► actually the pothole comparison is great

01:10:30 ◼   ► because I think it runs parallel to what

01:10:32 ◼   ► I was gonna say it would be a different

01:10:34 ◼   ► situation

01:10:34 ◼   ► so the different thing with the pothole

01:10:36 ◼   ► is we are all members of an involuntary

01:10:41 ◼   ► corporation which is the municipal

01:10:43 ◼   ► government like we're all paying taxes

01:10:45 ◼   ► into it we're all here as part of

01:10:47 ◼   ► society like this is a coordination

01:10:49 ◼   ► that's occurring between the large

01:10:50 ◼   ► number of people and so the like

01:10:52 ◼   ► reporting a pothole kind of thing like

01:10:53 ◼   ► yeah I would totally do that I know that

01:10:55 ◼   ► I have done that kind of

01:10:56 ◼   ► something like TripAdvisor it just feels

01:10:58 ◼   ► different because it's a for-profit

01:11:00 ◼   ► entity if TripAdvisor was something kind

01:11:02 ◼   ► of different if it was like a

01:11:04 ◼   ► not-for-profit open-source collaborative

01:11:07 ◼   ► thing kind of like the Wikipedia is sort

01:11:10 ◼   ► of like I would feel more guilt about it

01:11:13 ◼   ► which is why like my wife and I do

01:11:16 ◼   ► contribute to Wikipedia because it feels

01:11:18 ◼   ► like it's so much more on the on the end

01:11:20 ◼   ► of like a social good and people have

01:11:24 ◼   ► tried to get distributed review systems

01:11:27 ◼   ► off the ground or things like

01:11:29 ◼   ► distributed social networks off the

01:11:31 ◼   ► ground they've never really taken off

01:11:33 ◼   ► because I think this is a space that

01:11:35 ◼   ► just ends up being one where commercial

01:11:37 ◼   ► interests will naturally dominate but

01:11:39 ◼   ► for me that there is a part of it that I

01:11:41 ◼   ► cannot ignore that it this isn't just a

01:11:45 ◼   ► direct interaction between me and fellow

01:11:48 ◼   ► citizens that there is an entity that is

01:11:51 ◼   ► profiting from the interaction between

01:11:53 ◼   ► me and fellow citizens and if it was

01:11:55 ◼   ► more peer-to-peer in the way that I

01:11:57 ◼   ► think a government interaction would be

01:11:59 ◼   ► or the way a different sort of system

01:12:01 ◼   ► would be then I would genuinely feel

01:12:03 ◼   ► more guilt for being a like a parasite

01:12:05 ◼   ► upon the system again they you just

01:12:07 ◼   ► can't get your brain away from the

01:12:09 ◼   ► company and the money I will totally

01:12:11 ◼   ► agree like that is a thing that is

01:12:14 ◼   ► unlike the owl watches over us all right

01:12:17 ◼   ► as we're we're contributing those

01:12:18 ◼   ► reviews I don't agree with you right

01:12:20 ◼   ► like I feel like I'm the same as you I'm

01:12:22 ◼   ► a parasite but I feel like that defense

01:12:24 ◼   ► doesn't work for me and I feel like to

01:12:27 ◼   ► me that's not an acceptable position

01:12:29 ◼   ► that you're taking like I don't care if

01:12:31 ◼   ► you write reviews or not but to me that

01:12:33 ◼   ► argument doesn't hold water as you make

01:12:35 ◼   ► it there but if you then said to me I

01:12:38 ◼   ► once wrote a review on TripAdvisor for

01:12:41 ◼   ► my fellow man and it was removed by

01:12:44 ◼   ► TripAdvisor or they edited it then I

01:12:47 ◼   ► would completely agree with you and

01:12:48 ◼   ► think I'll hang on a second this is just

01:12:50 ◼   ► a company this isn't between me and the

01:12:53 ◼   ► other holidaymakers they're editing

01:12:54 ◼   ► things because their customers are

01:12:56 ◼   ► unhappy and they're and then I would

01:12:58 ◼   ► totally agree with you and actually I

01:13:00 ◼   ► think that does happen on TripAdvisor so

01:13:02 ◼   ► so I kind of probably am on your side in

01:13:04 ◼   ► a way but the single argument that the

01:13:07 ◼   ► whole system was set up by a company

01:13:09 ◼   ► that makes money like doesn't stop you

01:13:11 ◼   ► taking the value from it there is also a

01:13:13 ◼   ► similar thing which I totally changed my

01:13:15 ◼   ► mind on which is when self checkout

01:13:17 ◼   ► machines were first introduced my

01:13:19 ◼   ► initial reaction long ago was this is

01:13:22 ◼   ► ridiculous they're having me work as an

01:13:24 ◼   ► unpaid employee bagging my own groceries

01:13:26 ◼   ► here I guess is outrageous that the

01:13:28 ◼   ► grocery store

01:13:29 ◼   ► wants me to do free work for them I will

01:13:31 ◼   ► do no such that and now of course as

01:13:33 ◼   ► Luthor's no it's like I couldn't be

01:13:35 ◼   ► happier to be packing my own groceries

01:13:37 ◼   ► yeah so I'm not perfectly consistent on

01:13:40 ◼   ► this issue but yeah that was a place

01:13:42 ◼   ► where I felt the same way I was like I

01:13:43 ◼   ► can't ignore the commercial interaction

01:13:45 ◼   ► that's that's taking place here like

01:13:46 ◼   ► look at you grocery store so cynically

01:13:48 ◼   ► saving money on wages by deferring labor

01:13:50 ◼   ► to the actual customers and now I'm now