H.I #81: Adpocalypse
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all right I'm gonna minimize the brady
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for maximum bandwidth yeah breathing is
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gonna make the don't minimize me joke no
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I checked for ages now you haven't you
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have an almost method I never don't
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think remember a while back I told you
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about my little experiment where I
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changed my gray icon on all my system
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from being your flask and gear symbol
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Harter like a smiling gray face because
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I thought it would make me feel more
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fondly towards you when you send your
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robotic text messages and emails to me
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that you still fear yes yes you found my
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messages too brief and too cold and you
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thought a happier picture might improve
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the situation as I remember yeah how's
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that going I think it's worked you know
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oh yeah I think has worked so after
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running the experiment for a while my
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advice is if there's someone who pisses
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you off a little bit with their
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messaging change the picture to like the
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friendliest possible picture and it
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changes the way you view the person hmm
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like a text messaging psychological
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start over that's what's happening yeah
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you just look happier more of the time
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to me and I don't imagine you being all
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sort of grumpy and robotic with your
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brief replies I'm picturing you smiling
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as you think about me Freddie
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every time I send you a text message I
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send it with a smile yeah you're a real
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smile a minute you are I'm amazed I even
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have a picture of you smiling that
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wasn't great get so gray you know I
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spend a lot of time thinking about the
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Marty Blackstone yeah I dunno you spend
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a lot of time thinking about that might
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be bland stuff there is now a Wikipedia
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article just dedicated to the tallest
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buildings in Adelaide and whoever made
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that by the way you are my personal hero
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I was a little bit humbled though when I
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saw that the tallest building in
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Adelaide is actually the 115th tallest
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building in Australia I was gonna like
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Wikipedia they have the lists of
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everything but I was wondering a list of
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the tallest buildings in Adelaide how
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tall can these buildings actually be and
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that sounds like that's the answer
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this article though makes for
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fascinating reading on numerous levels
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it does partly because there's a whole
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bunch of buildings that have been
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proved or under construction and it's
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going to turn the world upside down I
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mean a whole bunch of the approved ones
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will be taller than the black stamp one
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will even beat older than the current
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tallest so it's all happening in
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Adelaide yeah I imagine so I'm looking
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at this list and the mighty black stump
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also known as the grenfell Center on
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this list which I think probably should
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be amended if someone's really diligent
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out there
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yeah it's number three on this list this
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is what I want to talk about uh-huh
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this needs to be settled because you may
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remember when I spoke to the sort of the
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building manager of the mighty black
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stamp when I visited and he told me that
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it was the second tallest building and
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he was upset that there were articles
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going around that were claiming it was
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third and this third place position for
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the black stamp is becoming more and
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more entrenched on the internet and fair
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enough if that's the fact of the matter
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I'll accept it but I've got a suspicion
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that it's not over do you
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you think this the hell straw house
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which is claiming to be one meter taller
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you think there's some shenanigans going
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on there yeah and I don't know whether
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or not this 103 meters versus 104 meters
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mm-hmm I think maybe that refers to like
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the top of the building and not maybe
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masts and things on top which probably
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should be included I don't know but I
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want to get to the bottom of it but I
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have no resources available to me other
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than the Internet and the Internet has
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this kind of self-perpetuating aspect to
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it where everyone just copies everything
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else off the previous articles and I get
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the feeling that everywhere I look I'm
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just reading the same stuff from the
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same source yeah so I need someone with
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like contacts and influence and maybe
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access to sort of blueprints and
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surveying equipment or something I want
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to settle once and for all what is
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taller between Telstra house at 30 Perry
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Street and the Grenville Center at 25
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grand fall straight to be second place
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as Adelaide's told us building behind
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Westpac house which is a runaway winner
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obviously runaway winner of course
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obviously I've loaded up Adelaide here
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on the 3d Apple maps on the computer
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yeah this is trying to see which one
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looks taller as though I can see a
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metres difference in this 3d
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representation close to each other these
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it looks like they are across the street
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from each other not quite actually no
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are they even on the same block or am I
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looking at a different building I think
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maybe Telstra houses maybe not quite the
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same block I'm not sure that's it here's
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the thing Brady I know this is once
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again evidence of how the mighty black
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stump is mighty in your mind but is not
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necessarily super obvious on the actual
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skyline of Adelaide I think it is
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because it's like so black it's like
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it's been painted with that vente black
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that is like the blackest substance
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known to man when you look at the
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Adelaide skyline it's not noticeable
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because of its height it's noticeable
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because of its blackness no no of course
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I understand no they are right next to
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each other it looks like there's a tiny
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little church in between these two rival
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buildings for second place in the city
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they're right next to each other yeah
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actually yeah they are very close to
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each other now that I look at the map
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yeah but this needs to be sorted gray by
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experts and it needs to be sorted in my
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favor preferably again do you want to
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count it looks like there's a little
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antenna on top of the mighty black stump
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should antennas count do you think that
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it should count if it works in your
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favor it shouldn't count if it doesn't
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work in your favor I think that sums up
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my attitude yes okay that's the way that
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works yeah
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can we get some people to do that kind
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of surveying you do when you're looking
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at mountains with these two buildings in
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Adelaide yeah that's what I'm hoping for
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triangulates from known heights the
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heights of these two buildings I would
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like to see that and you know I don't
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want to make promises mm-hmm but H I
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medals of Honor could be at stake here
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depending on the result yeah depending
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on the result and be aware dear
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listeners I will find it nothing but
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hilarious
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if the Grenville centre mighty black
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stump is firmly solidified in third
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place that would be hilarious for me not
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so hilarious for Brady well
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interestingly I'm looking at that
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picture that you sent and I mean toaster
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building does look a little bit taller
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from that angle but you can't really
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tell yeah also by the way you don't know
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this but I'll tell you so that you're
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fully in the picture the tallest
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building is also in that picture just
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the bottom part of it hmm in the top
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right corner of that picture you sent
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you see like a sort of a oh right Riano
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page building that's the tallest
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building but so what you're telling me
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no matter what the current situation is
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which of these buildings is a metre
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taller than the other yeah there's going
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to be a lot of new construction
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in the ever dynamic urban core that is
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Adelaide that's going to dwarf all of
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these buildings if that's what's
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happening here yeah well not Toto be cuz
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one of the nice things about Adelaide is
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it's not too tall like then they do that
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on purpose cousins you know pleasant
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place we don't want all your big nasty
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skyscrapers nothing worse than a
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skyscraper the pinnacle of human
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achievement you don't want that Natalie
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now don't get me wrong don't get me
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wrong you know I do love a good skies
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mate but the funny thing is I'm here
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saying come on someone help me out my
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job when I was the Civic reporter at the
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Adelaide Advertiser
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was actually going to the Adelaide City
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Council archives and looking at all the
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planning applications and getting them
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all out because I would report on you
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know new buildings that were going to be
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built so I am the man to do this
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but unfortunately I'm just too far away
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from Adelaide now so you don't want to
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do it for the love of journalism brady
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go fly down and do a little
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investigative reporting yourself to find
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this out no you don't want to do oh
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maybe maybe we considered a Kickstarter
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this is a sort of a mission to go down
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to Adelaide measure some buildings I
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feel like there's got to be a video in
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this somewhere for you Brady right on
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your building file channel or whatever
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like somewhere there's a YouTube video
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of you going down to Adelaide to measure
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these two buildings that are next to
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each other there's got to be a place
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that you have to put that off or the
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book I'm writing will hook up publishing
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down out the comprehensive history of
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the muddy black stuff from when it was
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just a twinkle in someone's eye right
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through to when it was finally surpassed
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as the tallest building in Adelaide
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somehow this feels like an inevitability
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I'll just wait for the publication I
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don't know I guess a lot of Tim's would
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buy it but other than that I don't think
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there's going to be an obviously like
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building manager of the building might
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but the one who thinks I'm crazy after I
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gave him a t-shirt really I don't think
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this is a project that you're doing for
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the money I think this is a project
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you're doing for the love and I can just
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interject that all right this is a
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passion project of yours mighty black
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stamp watch this space come on let's
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pull together here wisdom of the crowds
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and all that let's figure this one out
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speaking of architectural marvels that
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have been written into hello internet
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law I am going to Dulles this weekend oh
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are you I am I'm flying to Washington no
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not even this weekend I'm in two days
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time from when we're speaking Brady you
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exhaust me with your seemingly from my
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perspective constant flying
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know that I have a like a selection bias
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here that I hear about all the time that
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your fly so it feels more frequent than
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it probably really is but it seems to me
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like you are constantly John ting to
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different areas of the world to film
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things to go on vacation for exciting
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travels to meet Russian poets you're
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just doing amazing things around the
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world constantly and I feel like I can
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never keep up well at this point I would
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interject and correct you and add some
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clarification but you just made me sound
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so awesome that I'm just going to let
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00:09:20
◼
►
that fly ya know just let it slide man
[TS]
00:09:22
◼
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it's totally fine and this is how you
[TS]
00:09:24
◼
►
are in my mind you're like some kind of
[TS]
00:09:25
◼
►
modern adventurer except with airplanes
[TS]
00:09:28
◼
►
with the amount of traveling that you're
[TS]
00:09:29
◼
►
the Russian poet thing was a nice touch
[TS]
00:09:31
◼
►
as well it made me feel that Lord Byron
[TS]
00:09:33
◼
►
or something I'm just describing your
[TS]
00:09:37
◼
►
life to you man that's all I'm doing
[TS]
00:09:39
◼
►
that's not how my life feels but it's so
[TS]
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◼
►
cool I'm just gonna keep going I am
[TS]
00:09:43
◼
►
going to Washington for the National
[TS]
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◼
►
math festival Oh as part of my
[TS]
00:09:48
◼
►
numberphile and MSRI responsibilities
[TS]
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◼
►
I'm looking forward to doing a couple of
[TS]
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◼
►
live shows with Matt Parker and the very
[TS]
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◼
►
exciting one with cliff style the crazy
[TS]
00:09:58
◼
►
Klein bottle guy he's also good value so
[TS]
00:10:00
◼
►
I would spend more time promoting it but
[TS]
00:10:02
◼
►
by the time this podcast has gone out it
[TS]
00:10:04
◼
►
will have been in God and then I'm going
[TS]
00:10:07
◼
►
to Miami where I've never been before
[TS]
00:10:09
◼
►
for a brief holiday and then I'm coming
[TS]
00:10:11
◼
►
home but the thing I want to know from
[TS]
00:10:13
◼
►
you is how to prepare myself for my
[TS]
00:10:16
◼
►
Dulles experience because I'm pretty
[TS]
00:10:17
◼
►
sure this is going to be my first time
[TS]
00:10:19
◼
►
there what do I look for what do I do
[TS]
00:10:21
◼
►
like talk me through it well it all
[TS]
00:10:23
◼
►
depends on where you're getting in I
[TS]
00:10:24
◼
►
presume that you're going to be landing
[TS]
00:10:26
◼
►
in the international terminal because I
[TS]
00:10:30
◼
►
get tweets from people who are like oh
[TS]
00:10:31
◼
►
I'm in Dulles it's not so bad right and
[TS]
00:10:33
◼
►
that's the voice that they're using in
[TS]
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◼
►
my head when they tweet those things
[TS]
00:10:35
◼
►
yeah and that is because they are in the
[TS]
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◼
►
domestic a B terminals terrible
[TS]
00:10:40
◼
►
terminals the old terminals with
[TS]
00:10:42
◼
►
inconsistent heating and low ceilings
[TS]
00:10:45
◼
►
and smelly carpets is the CD terminals
[TS]
00:10:49
◼
►
which are generally used for
[TS]
00:10:49
◼
►
international flights so I'm gonna guess
[TS]
00:10:51
◼
►
that you're probably in there yeah
[TS]
00:10:53
◼
►
now can we remember off the top of our
[TS]
00:10:56
◼
►
head one of those gates was a cursed
[TS]
00:10:58
◼
►
gate where an accident took place on a
[TS]
00:10:59
◼
►
previous episode hello Internet well
[TS]
00:11:01
◼
►
loop that up yeah we got to find that
[TS]
00:11:03
◼
►
out Brady so that's obviously one of the
[TS]
00:11:05
◼
►
tourist spots that you need to go and
[TS]
00:11:06
◼
►
point at that's
[TS]
00:11:07
◼
►
to be on your list Thank You Fido of it
[TS]
00:11:09
◼
►
yep yeah now it's funny that you
[TS]
00:11:12
◼
►
mentioned this because I have not
[TS]
00:11:14
◼
►
verified this I'm going to be relying on
[TS]
00:11:16
◼
►
your journalistic skills to verify this
[TS]
00:11:18
◼
►
I have just heard today breaking Dulles
[TS]
00:11:22
◼
►
news that the at transports are no
[TS]
00:11:25
◼
►
longer in operation at that Airport oh
[TS]
00:11:27
◼
►
yeah I don't know if it's true I can't
[TS]
00:11:30
◼
►
verify this firsthand I'm going to rely
[TS]
00:11:32
◼
►
on you to let me know what the situation
[TS]
00:11:34
◼
►
is down there with what happened did
[TS]
00:11:36
◼
►
Luke Skywalker cut a hole in the bottom
[TS]
00:11:37
◼
►
I want to throw a charge into it yeah
[TS]
00:11:39
◼
►
okay Disney was like you need to pay as
[TS]
00:11:41
◼
►
licensing rights for you things one of
[TS]
00:11:43
◼
►
the two I know that there has been a lot
[TS]
00:11:46
◼
►
bunch of redevelopment work at Dulles to
[TS]
00:11:47
◼
►
try to take it from worst Airport in the
[TS]
00:11:49
◼
►
world to just marginally acceptable
[TS]
00:11:51
◼
►
Airport in the world and as part of that
[TS]
00:11:54
◼
►
I saw a construction on some kind of
[TS]
00:11:56
◼
►
train transport between the terminals
[TS]
00:11:59
◼
►
last time I was there and so I've just
[TS]
00:12:01
◼
►
heard that that is now done and those at
[TS]
00:12:03
◼
►
transports might be over which quite
[TS]
00:12:06
◼
►
frankly I'll be a little sad about if
[TS]
00:12:08
◼
►
that is true because it was by far and
[TS]
00:12:10
◼
►
away the most remarkable and most
[TS]
00:12:11
◼
►
interesting thing at Dulles Airport and
[TS]
00:12:13
◼
►
now even that will be gone which makes
[TS]
00:12:15
◼
►
it even less interesting I'm gutted I
[TS]
00:12:18
◼
►
was so looking for that was the one
[TS]
00:12:19
◼
►
thing I was looking forward to I know
[TS]
00:12:21
◼
►
it's the only thing a person can look
[TS]
00:12:23
◼
►
forward to at that Airport I hope I'm
[TS]
00:12:24
◼
►
wrong I'll hear about that from you in
[TS]
00:12:27
◼
►
the future otherwise no the best thing I
[TS]
00:12:29
◼
►
can tell you to do is if you're landing
[TS]
00:12:30
◼
►
there just get out as fast as you can
[TS]
00:12:33
◼
►
after visiting the cursed gate at Dulles
[TS]
00:12:36
◼
►
Airport Hara I'll let you know how a guy
[TS]
00:12:38
◼
►
I'll report back with the pictures and
[TS]
00:12:41
◼
►
all that sort of stuff
[TS]
00:12:42
◼
►
pointing pointing pictures speaking also
[TS]
00:12:44
◼
►
of sort of breaking news of things we
[TS]
00:12:47
◼
►
like to follow and again I'm a little
[TS]
00:12:49
◼
►
bit in the dark here but this is
[TS]
00:12:50
◼
►
potentially huge
[TS]
00:12:51
◼
►
hmm CGP grey the penguin the lady
[TS]
00:12:55
◼
►
penguin right if you have a look at the
[TS]
00:12:57
◼
►
link that I've put there in the notes
[TS]
00:12:59
◼
►
apparently Bristol Zoo where CGP grey
[TS]
00:13:02
◼
►
the penguin lives hmm has sent 19 of its
[TS]
00:13:05
◼
►
young South African penguins to Tbilisi
[TS]
00:13:09
◼
►
is that how you pronounce it capital of
[TS]
00:13:11
◼
►
Georgia oh yeah two Blissett I'm very
[TS]
00:13:13
◼
►
familiar with Tbilisi that is exactly
[TS]
00:13:15
◼
►
how you pronounce a 19 penguins have
[TS]
00:13:16
◼
►
been sent there to the penguin pool at
[TS]
00:13:20
◼
►
Tbilisi Zoo
[TS]
00:13:21
◼
►
mm-hmm they had some problems there
[TS]
00:13:23
◼
►
recently with flooding and the zoo
[TS]
00:13:24
◼
►
suffered a lot of damage and animal
[TS]
00:13:27
◼
►
losses along with human losses and sort
[TS]
00:13:30
◼
►
of because Bristol is sort of the sister
[TS]
00:13:33
◼
►
city of Tbilisi the zoos are sort of
[TS]
00:13:35
◼
►
friendly so these penguins have been
[TS]
00:13:37
◼
►
sent and if it's a young South African
[TS]
00:13:39
◼
►
penguin and 19 of them have gone you
[TS]
00:13:42
◼
►
know I'm thinking are you telling me
[TS]
00:13:44
◼
►
that CGP grey the penguin might have
[TS]
00:13:45
◼
►
died in a flood and I Georgia is that
[TS]
00:13:49
◼
►
what you're telling me this article that
[TS]
00:13:51
◼
►
you've sent me says two hundred and
[TS]
00:13:53
◼
►
eighty-one of the zoo's thousand plus
[TS]
00:13:55
◼
►
animals died in this disaster now grey
[TS]
00:13:58
◼
►
the penguins have been sent after the
[TS]
00:14:00
◼
►
flood to help restock the zoo okay
[TS]
00:14:04
◼
►
that's less alarming yes sorry other
[TS]
00:14:07
◼
►
animals I are not named after me I care
[TS]
00:14:09
◼
►
much less about your well-being so what
[TS]
00:14:13
◼
►
I'm saying is I don't know but it's
[TS]
00:14:15
◼
►
possible that grey has left the country
[TS]
00:14:17
◼
►
this is going to make it much more
[TS]
00:14:19
◼
►
difficult for you to keep up your
[TS]
00:14:20
◼
►
regular and ongoing correspondence with
[TS]
00:14:23
◼
►
CGP creator penguin that you have so
[TS]
00:14:25
◼
►
diligently maintained low these past
[TS]
00:14:27
◼
►
years and months keeping the audience
[TS]
00:14:29
◼
►
updated on what she's up to
[TS]
00:14:31
◼
►
you've been so diligent about it this is
[TS]
00:14:33
◼
►
going to make that a bit more difficult
[TS]
00:14:34
◼
►
but I'm sure you'll keep doing just as
[TS]
00:14:36
◼
►
good of a job as you have been doing in
[TS]
00:14:38
◼
►
the future if she actually has left I
[TS]
00:14:40
◼
►
was fondly sucking myself up to go and
[TS]
00:14:42
◼
►
do this visit now maybe she's not even
[TS]
00:14:44
◼
►
there I love that you're telling
[TS]
00:14:46
◼
►
yourself like oh you were psyching
[TS]
00:14:47
◼
►
yourself up for this visit like I was
[TS]
00:14:49
◼
►
just about to visit I feel like when I
[TS]
00:14:51
◼
►
was a kid and my parents would yell at
[TS]
00:14:53
◼
►
me to clean my room I always had this
[TS]
00:14:55
◼
►
feeling like ah I was just about to
[TS]
00:14:57
◼
►
write but there's no way I was really
[TS]
00:14:59
◼
►
just about to like now that I'm being
[TS]
00:15:02
◼
►
told to do a thing like you have this
[TS]
00:15:03
◼
►
reverse memory of like I was just about
[TS]
00:15:05
◼
►
to why'd you have to bother me so you
[TS]
00:15:07
◼
►
kind of think you were just about to
[TS]
00:15:08
◼
►
visit this penguin you only feel that
[TS]
00:15:11
◼
►
way because now there's a possibility
[TS]
00:15:12
◼
►
that you can't okay that's true but
[TS]
00:15:15
◼
►
isn't it really frustrating at those
[TS]
00:15:16
◼
►
times when you were just about to do
[TS]
00:15:18
◼
►
something and then you get told to do it
[TS]
00:15:19
◼
►
and you know no I really was just about
[TS]
00:15:21
◼
►
to do it but how do you distinguish that
[TS]
00:15:23
◼
►
feeling from just the constant feeling
[TS]
00:15:25
◼
►
and what it does happen right I think
[TS]
00:15:26
◼
►
this is like a false memory you know
[TS]
00:15:28
◼
►
when you were really going to do it so
[TS]
00:15:29
◼
►
anyway ctp gray the lady penguin wing
[TS]
00:15:32
◼
►
tag number a 205 83 mm-hmm I don't know
[TS]
00:15:37
◼
►
where she is
[TS]
00:15:37
◼
►
it's been a holiday here in the UK since
[TS]
00:15:40
◼
►
I found out the news frustratingly it's
[TS]
00:15:42
◼
►
been a four-day holiday over Easter as I
[TS]
00:15:44
◼
►
can't contact anyone at the zoo but uh
[TS]
00:15:47
◼
►
we need to get on this I think the more
[TS]
00:15:48
◼
►
exciting thing is for some Tbilisi Tim's
[TS]
00:15:51
◼
►
with a zoom lens to go out to the zoo
[TS]
00:15:54
◼
►
and try to find the lady penguin CGP
[TS]
00:15:57
◼
►
grey out there if they can I think
[TS]
00:15:58
◼
►
that's what should happen
[TS]
00:15:59
◼
►
Tbilisi Tim's you were called upon in
[TS]
00:16:02
◼
►
this moment you weren't expecting this
[TS]
00:16:04
◼
►
yeah but we're relying on you so put on
[TS]
00:16:08
◼
►
hold that trip to Adelaide you were
[TS]
00:16:09
◼
►
doing to survey the muddy black stump
[TS]
00:16:10
◼
►
and first of all head to your local Zoo
[TS]
00:16:13
◼
►
and check out the Penguins
[TS]
00:16:15
◼
►
I mean I'd feel a bit sad if they went
[TS]
00:16:16
◼
►
there and it turns out grey hasn't been
[TS]
00:16:18
◼
►
moved but that's part of it that's part
[TS]
00:16:20
◼
►
of it just go carefully catalog all of
[TS]
00:16:22
◼
►
the serial numbers of all of the
[TS]
00:16:24
◼
►
Penguins and let us know let us know
[TS]
00:16:26
◼
►
what the situation is I wonder if it
[TS]
00:16:28
◼
►
kept its wing tag and number or it has
[TS]
00:16:30
◼
►
to get like a tbilisi wing tag with a
[TS]
00:16:31
◼
►
new number and the other ones been cut
[TS]
00:16:34
◼
►
off I don't know hmm feels like there
[TS]
00:16:37
◼
►
should be some sort of international
[TS]
00:16:39
◼
►
identification number system for zoos
[TS]
00:16:41
◼
►
transferring animals back and forth
[TS]
00:16:43
◼
►
otherwise like if you're loaning a zoo
[TS]
00:16:45
◼
►
an animal how do you know if you got the
[TS]
00:16:46
◼
►
same one back if you're allowed to cut
[TS]
00:16:48
◼
►
off the tags I feel like those tags have
[TS]
00:16:50
◼
►
to be the same everywhere good point
[TS]
00:16:51
◼
►
they don't let they come on and off very
[TS]
00:16:53
◼
►
easily either but they must come off
[TS]
00:16:55
◼
►
there because presumably the wing grows
[TS]
00:16:56
◼
►
and they need to put bigger tags on I
[TS]
00:16:58
◼
►
don't know there's a lot of unanswered
[TS]
00:17:00
◼
►
questions here I really we're rapidly
[TS]
00:17:02
◼
►
wandering into like meat security
[TS]
00:17:04
◼
►
questions here's like somebody out there
[TS]
00:17:06
◼
►
it's their job to deal with the
[TS]
00:17:08
◼
►
technology behind the tags on a penguin
[TS]
00:17:10
◼
►
fake and they're like screaming at the
[TS]
00:17:11
◼
►
podcast right now I thought the answer
[TS]
00:17:14
◼
►
to this question I do this all day this
[TS]
00:17:17
◼
►
is the third podcast this week I've
[TS]
00:17:18
◼
►
heard get that wrong speaking of animals
[TS]
00:17:21
◼
►
orgies snoring a bit so I'm just gonna
[TS]
00:17:23
◼
►
give her a little nudge with my foot
[TS]
00:17:24
◼
►
stop snoring stop it oh I'll send you
[TS]
00:17:28
◼
►
the tibula see
[TS]
00:17:30
◼
►
oh poor Audrey I would never do that she
[TS]
00:17:33
◼
►
knows a little delicate background
[TS]
00:17:35
◼
►
snores they can be part of the podcast
[TS]
00:17:37
◼
►
it's not only fine
[TS]
00:17:38
◼
►
this episodes been brought to you by
[TS]
00:17:41
◼
►
Squarespace whatever you're looking to
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00:17:43
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Squarespace is going to have you covered
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to find out more go to squarespace.com
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slash hello and there's 10% off your
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first purchase using the code hello when
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you're asked for it I view Squarespace
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00:18:12
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for several of my own websites my blog
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00:18:15
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and I continue to use them pretty much
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00:18:17
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every day I really would recommend them
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00:18:19
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to anyone from buying the domain first
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setting up your site using their range
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of really good templates tweaking that
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they've also got great 24/7 customer
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if you get yourself into a pickle I
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00:18:40
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doubt you're going to need that much
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I've had nothing but good experiences
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Squarespace including making sure your
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◼
►
tablets and mobile phones which is as a
[TS]
00:18:52
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given it's so important these days
[TS]
00:18:54
◼
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check them out again the address is
[TS]
00:18:56
◼
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squarespace.com slash hello so they know
[TS]
00:19:00
◼
►
you came from here on the podcast and to
[TS]
00:19:02
◼
►
lock in that ten percent discount on
[TS]
00:19:04
◼
►
your first order and I guess as our own
[TS]
00:19:06
◼
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podcast web site is hosted by
[TS]
00:19:08
◼
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Squarespace I really can thank them for
[TS]
00:19:11
◼
►
making this episode possible you may
[TS]
00:19:13
◼
►
remember Brady on the podcast long ago
[TS]
00:19:17
◼
►
I may have complained a little bit about
[TS]
00:19:20
◼
►
the way Kindles
[TS]
00:19:22
◼
►
format the text on screen I don't know
[TS]
00:19:25
◼
►
if this sounds familiar to you or not it
[TS]
00:19:27
◼
►
was a minor annoyance of yours I seem to
[TS]
00:19:29
◼
►
recall there was a minor annoyance that
[TS]
00:19:31
◼
►
was like a dagger in my soul every time
[TS]
00:19:34
◼
►
I tried to use a Kindle yeah so much so
[TS]
00:19:37
◼
►
that I eventually abandoned my beloved
[TS]
00:19:40
◼
►
Kindle and went over to iBooks because
[TS]
00:19:43
◼
►
knows how you're supposed to format text
[TS]
00:19:44
◼
►
on a screen and Kindle did not well I
[TS]
00:19:49
◼
►
would be remiss if I did not mention
[TS]
00:19:51
◼
►
that remarkably as of yesterday a mere
[TS]
00:19:56
◼
►
several decades after Kindles have come
[TS]
00:19:58
◼
►
out they have finally released an update
[TS]
00:20:01
◼
►
that allows a reader to have a ragged
[TS]
00:20:05
◼
►
right on their text to left align all of
[TS]
00:20:09
◼
►
the words on the page it's an amazing
[TS]
00:20:12
◼
►
moment for all of us
[TS]
00:20:14
◼
►
I must have received ten twenty thousand
[TS]
00:20:17
◼
►
tweets letting me know that there was a
[TS]
00:20:19
◼
►
software update for Kindles that finally
[TS]
00:20:22
◼
►
allowed the thing that I asked about for
[TS]
00:20:24
◼
►
so long for so passionately that I
[TS]
00:20:26
◼
►
wanted it is now here and it's available
[TS]
00:20:29
◼
►
if you have a Kindle people go update
[TS]
00:20:31
◼
►
the software on your Kindle you too can
[TS]
00:20:34
◼
►
experience an amazing reading experience
[TS]
00:20:36
◼
►
huge man it's like the JFK assassination
[TS]
00:20:39
◼
►
where were you when can define and went
[TS]
00:20:40
◼
►
right ragged I remember where I was I
[TS]
00:20:44
◼
►
was at home I had a Kindle and I was
[TS]
00:20:47
◼
►
pressing the update my Kindle button
[TS]
00:20:48
◼
►
right like I want to see this software
[TS]
00:20:50
◼
►
update like update update update my
[TS]
00:20:51
◼
►
Kindle was going like I don't know what
[TS]
00:20:53
◼
►
you're talking about there's no software
[TS]
00:20:54
◼
►
update available I was shaking my fist
[TS]
00:20:56
◼
►
and like curse you CDN like this update
[TS]
00:20:58
◼
►
hasn't been distributed yet to the UK or
[TS]
00:21:00
◼
►
wherever it is in your Amazon network so
[TS]
00:21:02
◼
►
actually like I like I want to see this
[TS]
00:21:04
◼
►
right now so I went onto the kindle
[TS]
00:21:06
◼
►
support page and like hard downloaded
[TS]
00:21:08
◼
►
the software update manually transferred
[TS]
00:21:11
◼
►
via USB over to the Kindle did like a
[TS]
00:21:13
◼
►
force reboot update of the device with
[TS]
00:21:15
◼
►
like I need to see what this looks like
[TS]
00:21:17
◼
►
first hand I can't trust people's
[TS]
00:21:20
◼
►
reports of how it looks I need to see
[TS]
00:21:22
◼
►
this for myself and the answer is it
[TS]
00:21:24
◼
►
looks like books are supposed to look so
[TS]
00:21:27
◼
►
it's fantastic that sounds like quite a
[TS]
00:21:29
◼
►
day you know sometimes I think I
[TS]
00:21:31
◼
►
couldn't make up stories to make you fit
[TS]
00:21:33
◼
►
your stereotype any better than the
[TS]
00:21:34
◼
►
actual stories that you tell what do you
[TS]
00:21:37
◼
►
mean baby I could have made that up if
[TS]
00:21:40
◼
►
someone said make up a story that makes
[TS]
00:21:41
◼
►
gray sound like really pedantic and
[TS]
00:21:43
◼
►
nerdy and into technology I wouldn't
[TS]
00:21:45
◼
►
have come up with a better story than
[TS]
00:21:46
◼
►
the one you just told what about doing
[TS]
00:21:49
◼
►
the manual update like who actually sits
[TS]
00:21:51
◼
►
looking to screen saying curse you CDM
[TS]
00:21:55
◼
►
but that's what it is like they just
[TS]
00:21:57
◼
►
haven't distributed the update to all of
[TS]
00:21:58
◼
►
the networks yet I know I understand
[TS]
00:22:00
◼
►
what happened I didn't want to wait it
[TS]
00:22:02
◼
►
seems very straightforward to me okay
[TS]
00:22:03
◼
►
let's all thing and is this going to
[TS]
00:22:05
◼
►
result in you going back to Kindle here
[TS]
00:22:07
◼
►
is the interesting thing the interesting
[TS]
00:22:09
◼
►
thing is why did I have a Kindle to
[TS]
00:22:12
◼
►
update in the first place because I had
[TS]
00:22:14
◼
►
abandoned Kindle a long time ago and I
[TS]
00:22:15
◼
►
hated their old paperwhite Kindle hmm so
[TS]
00:22:18
◼
►
Amazon has been very slowly trying to
[TS]
00:22:22
◼
►
make their typography better and over
[TS]
00:22:25
◼
►
the summer they introduced a precursor
[TS]
00:22:28
◼
►
to this which was actually hyphenating
[TS]
00:22:30
◼
►
words correctly so they used to never
[TS]
00:22:32
◼
►
even break words at the syllable level
[TS]
00:22:35
◼
►
on the edge of a page they used to just
[TS]
00:22:37
◼
►
have these horrific ugly gaps and what I
[TS]
00:22:39
◼
►
wanted to see this past summer because I
[TS]
00:22:41
◼
►
have been making a real concerted effort
[TS]
00:22:43
◼
►
to try to read more books over the past
[TS]
00:22:47
◼
►
year or so essentially to take time away
[TS]
00:22:50
◼
►
from reddit and hacker news and to
[TS]
00:22:52
◼
►
divert that time war into books and that
[TS]
00:22:55
◼
►
was one of the things that when I was
[TS]
00:22:57
◼
►
using Kindle years ago that I really
[TS]
00:22:59
◼
►
liked is that I always found that having
[TS]
00:23:01
◼
►
it as a separate device was helpful to
[TS]
00:23:04
◼
►
reading more as opposed to reading on my
[TS]
00:23:07
◼
►
iPad but I gave it up because I couldn't
[TS]
00:23:09
◼
►
deal with the formatting so when they
[TS]
00:23:11
◼
►
introduced some slightly better
[TS]
00:23:12
◼
►
typography plus when they introduced the
[TS]
00:23:15
◼
►
latest version of the Kindle which is
[TS]
00:23:17
◼
►
the Kindle Oasis which actually is
[TS]
00:23:19
◼
►
designed with revolutionary buttons for
[TS]
00:23:22
◼
►
turning the page and it's designed
[TS]
00:23:23
◼
►
actually to be a good ebook reader I
[TS]
00:23:27
◼
►
thought I'm gonna give this a try like
[TS]
00:23:29
◼
►
I'm gonna give you a second go here
[TS]
00:23:31
◼
►
Kindle and see how it works and I was
[TS]
00:23:34
◼
►
using it for the summer I was using it
[TS]
00:23:35
◼
►
for a little while I found that the
[TS]
00:23:37
◼
►
hyphenation alone did not make enough of
[TS]
00:23:39
◼
►
a difference like it's still very
[TS]
00:23:40
◼
►
annoying for the little narrator in my
[TS]
00:23:41
◼
►
head to be speeding up and slowing down
[TS]
00:23:43
◼
►
ever so slightly even if it was way
[TS]
00:23:45
◼
►
better so I put it away reluctantly like
[TS]
00:23:48
◼
►
I was hoping that that Kindle experiment
[TS]
00:23:50
◼
►
would work but it didn't quite take yeah
[TS]
00:23:52
◼
►
but that's why I had it in a drawer and
[TS]
00:23:54
◼
►
so when I heard this news is like I'm
[TS]
00:23:56
◼
►
updating this right away so it just
[TS]
00:23:58
◼
►
happened yesterday
[TS]
00:23:59
◼
►
I've been reading a couple of books on
[TS]
00:24:01
◼
►
the Kindle annoyingly Kindle for some
[TS]
00:24:03
◼
►
reason they don't do it with all books
[TS]
00:24:05
◼
►
they only have this available for some
[TS]
00:24:07
◼
►
so you have to check in advance but I'm
[TS]
00:24:09
◼
►
going to give this a real go and try to
[TS]
00:24:12
◼
►
use the Kindle again as a dedicated
[TS]
00:24:15
◼
►
separate breeding device because I
[TS]
00:24:17
◼
►
really do think that is a big advantage
[TS]
00:24:19
◼
►
plus it doesn't help that Apple has not
[TS]
00:24:22
◼
►
updated their software for iBooks in
[TS]
00:24:24
◼
►
like three years they've added no new
[TS]
00:24:26
◼
►
features and Kindle has very slowly been
[TS]
00:24:28
◼
►
adding useful features over this time
[TS]
00:24:31
◼
►
none of them are deal-breakers on their
[TS]
00:24:33
◼
►
own but each one is like a nice little
[TS]
00:24:34
◼
►
addition so the Kindle is again an
[TS]
00:24:37
◼
►
attractive option that I'm going to give
[TS]
00:24:39
◼
►
a real try this time so I'm very happy
[TS]
00:24:41
◼
►
about this well now that the Kindle
[TS]
00:24:43
◼
►
influencer CGP grey has been fully wooed
[TS]
00:24:46
◼
►
I think it's your move iBooks what could
[TS]
00:24:51
◼
►
i books do to get you back to iBooks
[TS]
00:24:53
◼
►
here's the problem right
[TS]
00:24:54
◼
►
iBooks always has one major disadvantage
[TS]
00:24:58
◼
►
which is that it's always going to be on
[TS]
00:25:00
◼
►
an iPad yeah and I do really like having
[TS]
00:25:03
◼
►
a separate thing I find it's nice to
[TS]
00:25:05
◼
►
have a separate thing that's like a
[TS]
00:25:07
◼
►
physical reminder of oh you should be
[TS]
00:25:09
◼
►
reading a book as dumb as that sounds I
[TS]
00:25:11
◼
►
really do like that even when you're
[TS]
00:25:14
◼
►
traveling grind when you're thinking
[TS]
00:25:15
◼
►
argh on the pliant gotta pack my iPad
[TS]
00:25:17
◼
►
and my Kindle wouldn't it be better to
[TS]
00:25:19
◼
►
have one device it would be better in
[TS]
00:25:21
◼
►
terms of packing to have one device but
[TS]
00:25:23
◼
►
it is that extra reminder that I find is
[TS]
00:25:25
◼
►
visually there so it's more top of mind
[TS]
00:25:28
◼
►
that this is an additional thing I
[TS]
00:25:30
◼
►
really do like that and iBooks is always
[TS]
00:25:34
◼
►
going to lose that battle in that I'm
[TS]
00:25:35
◼
►
always going to be able to do something
[TS]
00:25:37
◼
►
else and I'm aware that when I'm reading
[TS]
00:25:38
◼
►
on an iPad even on my like super
[TS]
00:25:41
◼
►
lockdown I can only do very few things
[TS]
00:25:43
◼
►
on this except read iPad I'm still
[TS]
00:25:46
◼
►
always tempted to like flip away and oh
[TS]
00:25:48
◼
►
let me just quickly add something to a
[TS]
00:25:50
◼
►
little note that I have somewhere else
[TS]
00:25:51
◼
►
I'm still more likely to flip out of it
[TS]
00:25:54
◼
►
whereas with a dedicated device I'm less
[TS]
00:25:56
◼
►
likely to flip out of it so it's always
[TS]
00:25:58
◼
►
a big advantage to Kindle I don't know
[TS]
00:26:00
◼
►
how books could do but it's funny
[TS]
00:26:02
◼
►
because I went back and I read that that
[TS]
00:26:03
◼
►
old article that I wrote when I was
[TS]
00:26:05
◼
►
talking about originally switching from
[TS]
00:26:08
◼
►
Kindle to iBooks and I made a note about
[TS]
00:26:10
◼
►
how like Oh Kindles software development
[TS]
00:26:13
◼
►
is glacially slow and so like I booked
[TS]
00:26:16
◼
►
some obviously will be developed more
[TS]
00:26:19
◼
►
quickly than that as like iBooks
[TS]
00:26:21
◼
►
hasn't changed at all in that whole time
[TS]
00:26:23
◼
►
that like turns out glacially slow
[TS]
00:26:25
◼
►
development is faster than nothing at
[TS]
00:26:28
◼
►
so iBooks is the tortoise like winning
[TS]
00:26:30
◼
►
this race against a hare that is totally
[TS]
00:26:33
◼
►
napping great as always there's been
[TS]
00:26:37
◼
►
lots of listener emails
[TS]
00:26:39
◼
►
never really know which ones to put on
[TS]
00:26:41
◼
►
the show but I've got a couple here that
[TS]
00:26:43
◼
►
caught my eye that I tell you about
[TS]
00:26:44
◼
►
that's the right thing there Brady you
[TS]
00:26:46
◼
►
don't mention how many because then I
[TS]
00:26:48
◼
►
can just cut them yeah sometimes you're
[TS]
00:26:49
◼
►
like oh I have exactly three listening
[TS]
00:26:51
◼
►
emails and I have to cut that sentence
[TS]
00:26:53
◼
►
and then just have a number of listener
[TS]
00:26:55
◼
►
emails so this one came in from a Tim
[TS]
00:26:59
◼
►
you two unveiled the world of podcast to
[TS]
00:27:01
◼
►
me and I'm a long time listener to your
[TS]
00:27:03
◼
►
show now nothing compares to a long and
[TS]
00:27:06
◼
►
naughty episode of hallo internet I just
[TS]
00:27:09
◼
►
had my wisdom tooth extracted and you
[TS]
00:27:12
◼
►
guys made me bear this horrid procedure
[TS]
00:27:14
◼
►
ever since I was a child I never liked
[TS]
00:27:16
◼
►
any form of surgical intrusion and like
[TS]
00:27:18
◼
►
those children who do it I can't say who
[TS]
00:27:21
◼
►
are those people I'm sure there's at
[TS]
00:27:22
◼
►
least one one weirdo but for the most of
[TS]
00:27:24
◼
►
us now No thank you and I absolutely
[TS]
00:27:25
◼
►
despise disappointment at my dentist so
[TS]
00:27:29
◼
►
what this Tim did was he listened to an
[TS]
00:27:31
◼
►
episode of hello Internet while having
[TS]
00:27:33
◼
►
the procedure done thank you guys for
[TS]
00:27:35
◼
►
making my tooth surgery more tolerable
[TS]
00:27:36
◼
►
and please keep producing the world's
[TS]
00:27:38
◼
►
most interesting podcast on the internet
[TS]
00:27:41
◼
►
and on vinyl this is some serious
[TS]
00:27:43
◼
►
sucking up going on here yeah I know
[TS]
00:27:46
◼
►
gray wants proof and as my wisdom tooth
[TS]
00:27:48
◼
►
had to be sawn into tiny pieces in order
[TS]
00:27:50
◼
►
to even get it out of the guns god I'm
[TS]
00:27:53
◼
►
sending you a picture of my medication
[TS]
00:27:55
◼
►
instead of a shattered tooth and there's
[TS]
00:27:57
◼
►
basically a picture of a whole bunch of
[TS]
00:27:58
◼
►
medical things plus a phone listening to
[TS]
00:28:01
◼
►
hello Internet as proof the thing I
[TS]
00:28:03
◼
►
found interesting though was this Tim
[TS]
00:28:05
◼
►
also pointed out to the episode that he
[TS]
00:28:08
◼
►
listened to during the procedure I'm
[TS]
00:28:10
◼
►
guessing you might be able to guess what
[TS]
00:28:11
◼
►
it is no but it was episode 35 which is
[TS]
00:28:15
◼
►
entitled are my teeth real so very nice
[TS]
00:28:19
◼
►
choice so great I had a question I was
[TS]
00:28:21
◼
►
going to ask you as a result of this
[TS]
00:28:22
◼
►
lesson but I don't need to ask you
[TS]
00:28:25
◼
►
because coincidentally we have another
[TS]
00:28:27
◼
►
email from another Tim this is an
[TS]
00:28:30
◼
►
Australian Tim called Sandra mm-hmm and
[TS]
00:28:33
◼
►
Sandra says user
[TS]
00:28:34
◼
►
all my titles here so showing total
[TS]
00:28:36
◼
►
respect dear dr. Brady hard as nails
[TS]
00:28:39
◼
►
soft as cushions Herron this is a
[TS]
00:28:42
◼
►
partial good yes I'll forgive that one
[TS]
00:28:43
◼
►
yes that was in the right place yeah
[TS]
00:28:46
◼
►
and the dr. counts for a lot I know yeah
[TS]
00:28:48
◼
►
it's a bit like getting like an MBA or
[TS]
00:28:50
◼
►
wrong you know softest cushions Pasha's
[TS]
00:28:52
◼
►
cushions as long as cushions are in
[TS]
00:28:54
◼
►
there were okay so anyway this one from
[TS]
00:28:58
◼
►
Sandra says I've just had my upper right
[TS]
00:29:00
◼
►
wisdom teeth extracted tweet us if you
[TS]
00:29:02
◼
►
have a go wisdom tooth from oh no I'm
[TS]
00:29:04
◼
►
only tweet brady bleh pretty we got a
[TS]
00:29:06
◼
►
lot of people listening to this right
[TS]
00:29:07
◼
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the number people who are getting a
[TS]
00:29:08
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wisdom tooth extracted right now is a
[TS]
00:29:10
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non-trivial number uh only tweet me if
[TS]
00:29:13
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you're having a wisdom tooth removed you
[TS]
00:29:15
◼
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are in the chair and you are listening
[TS]
00:29:17
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to hello Internet yeah and only tweet
[TS]
00:29:19
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brady no come on surely you would allow
[TS]
00:29:22
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tweet for that that's not how this works
[TS]
00:29:23
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again didn't you learn haven't you learn
[TS]
00:29:25
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from the tweet of me if you're not on a
[TS]
00:29:27
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plane debacle that will haunt us until
[TS]
00:29:29
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the end of time yeah but then I open the
[TS]
00:29:31
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door for everyone surely my more
[TS]
00:29:33
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detailed description there is gonna keep
[TS]
00:29:35
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it specific not as the podcast keeps
[TS]
00:29:37
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growing man like we're getting into big
[TS]
00:29:39
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►
numbers here so now I want to make it
[TS]
00:29:40
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real clear do I really admire your
[TS]
00:29:42
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ambition that you're worried about the
[TS]
00:29:44
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number of people who are right now
[TS]
00:29:45
◼
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sitting in a dentist's chair listening
[TS]
00:29:47
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to hello Internet anyway as I say and I
[TS]
00:29:50
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had wisdom teeth removed now the dentist
[TS]
00:29:53
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made the offer to keep the extracted
[TS]
00:29:55
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tooth mm-hmm
[TS]
00:29:57
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Sandra declined instead I've donated my
[TS]
00:29:59
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tooth to the student hospital for
[TS]
00:30:01
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education purposes which I didn't even
[TS]
00:30:02
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know was a thing like I would have
[TS]
00:30:04
◼
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thought wisdom teeth were a dime a dozen
[TS]
00:30:05
◼
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anyway my question to you is whether you
[TS]
00:30:08
◼
►
and gravy wants to answer have had your
[TS]
00:30:11
◼
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wisdom teeth extracted and if so did you
[TS]
00:30:14
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keep your extracted tooth you strike me
[TS]
00:30:17
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I think as me Brady you strike me as
[TS]
00:30:19
◼
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someone who would hoard his teeth kind
[TS]
00:30:22
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regards Sandra have you had your wisdom
[TS]
00:30:25
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teeth extracted gray if you wish to
[TS]
00:30:28
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answer I know you know your medical
[TS]
00:30:29
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records sir you're going business but I
[TS]
00:30:31
◼
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think we can safely go into the wisdom
[TS]
00:30:34
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►
teeth territory yes I had one of my
[TS]
00:30:37
◼
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wisdom teeth removed hmm because it was
[TS]
00:30:40
◼
►
causing a problem in the back of my gums
[TS]
00:30:42
◼
►
I had one of them removed in retrospect
[TS]
00:30:46
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►
very sketch
[TS]
00:30:48
◼
►
gee dentist office that was just up a
[TS]
00:30:50
◼
►
staircase on this high street and I'll
[TS]
00:30:54
◼
►
never forget that it was done so quickly
[TS]
00:30:57
◼
►
and sort of without ceremony the whole
[TS]
00:30:59
◼
►
it just made me have this done this
[TS]
00:31:01
◼
►
sounds Wow dodgy some back lined it was
[TS]
00:31:04
◼
►
in London I mean this is like 12 years
[TS]
00:31:06
◼
►
ago now I still do past that staircase
[TS]
00:31:08
◼
►
every once in a while and I'm like oh
[TS]
00:31:10
◼
►
yeah I know there's a little man up
[TS]
00:31:11
◼
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there who pulls out teeth yeah I thought
[TS]
00:31:13
◼
►
that spot is it like that dodgy guy that
[TS]
00:31:15
◼
►
does your iPhone screen for ya and quit
[TS]
00:31:17
◼
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or something I think that's essentially
[TS]
00:31:18
◼
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what it was right yeah I would have been
[TS]
00:31:20
◼
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like a very poor student at the time so
[TS]
00:31:22
◼
►
it's like a discount dentist but yeah I
[TS]
00:31:25
◼
►
remember it because the guy reaches in
[TS]
00:31:28
◼
►
there and he's like wiggling around he
[TS]
00:31:30
◼
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seems to not be able to get the tooth
[TS]
00:31:31
◼
►
out and he looks at me he goes I'm gonna
[TS]
00:31:34
◼
►
really lean into this one and before I
[TS]
00:31:36
◼
►
could do anything he kinda like got up
[TS]
00:31:39
◼
►
on top of me and just leaned like right
[TS]
00:31:42
◼
►
into this tool that was holding onto the
[TS]
00:31:44
◼
►
tooth and it was the loudest most
[TS]
00:31:46
◼
►
terrifying crack in my head that I'd
[TS]
00:31:49
◼
►
ever heard all right and you think
[TS]
00:31:51
◼
►
playing crash chord is inappropriate
[TS]
00:31:53
◼
►
you're asking this question that's what
[TS]
00:31:55
◼
►
happens he got the whole thing out but
[TS]
00:31:57
◼
►
it was like he did it so quickly because
[TS]
00:31:59
◼
►
I think he knew I would object much more
[TS]
00:32:01
◼
►
sternly if I had a moment to realize
[TS]
00:32:03
◼
►
what was happening and he's like I'm
[TS]
00:32:04
◼
►
just gonna throw my body weight into
[TS]
00:32:06
◼
►
this one buddy like that's how we're
[TS]
00:32:08
◼
►
gonna get this tooth out so yes I've had
[TS]
00:32:10
◼
►
one wisdom tooth removed and now since
[TS]
00:32:13
◼
►
then what about you brain I bet you're a
[TS]
00:32:15
◼
►
guy that doesn't like going to the
[TS]
00:32:16
◼
►
dentist oh yeah of course not of course
[TS]
00:32:18
◼
►
not know who does Monda I don't Monda we
[TS]
00:32:20
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►
mean you don't mind it I don't know I
[TS]
00:32:21
◼
►
always have quite pleasant experiences
[TS]
00:32:23
◼
►
when I go to the dentist this is again
[TS]
00:32:24
◼
►
you live in this whole like Brady
[TS]
00:32:25
◼
►
alternate universe where everybody's
[TS]
00:32:27
◼
►
friendly and things are always pleasant
[TS]
00:32:29
◼
►
I don't understand and we you are given
[TS]
00:32:32
◼
►
the option to keep this tooth already
[TS]
00:32:33
◼
►
already sold it to sell in some black
[TS]
00:32:35
◼
►
market down the back lane or something I
[TS]
00:32:37
◼
►
don't even remember if I was given the
[TS]
00:32:39
◼
►
option to keep obviously I don't have it
[TS]
00:32:40
◼
►
why would anyone keep a wisdom tooth I
[TS]
00:32:42
◼
►
don't remember yeah if I was even given
[TS]
00:32:45
◼
►
the option or if it was immediately sold
[TS]
00:32:47
◼
►
and as in somebody else's head in China
[TS]
00:32:49
◼
►
now like I have no idea
[TS]
00:32:52
◼
►
I have not had my wisdom teeth removed
[TS]
00:32:55
◼
►
I've never really had a bad dental
[TS]
00:32:57
◼
►
procedure mm-hmm whether I'd keep it on
[TS]
00:33:00
◼
►
I probably would I don't know what I'd
[TS]
00:33:01
◼
►
do with it but what would you do with it
[TS]
00:33:03
◼
►
why would you keep I don't know but I
[TS]
00:33:04
◼
►
know about a year ago Audrey had to have
[TS]
00:33:06
◼
►
some teeth removed because she had some
[TS]
00:33:08
◼
►
teeth problems and I have got those
[TS]
00:33:09
◼
►
teeth somewhere in my room in a little
[TS]
00:33:11
◼
►
tiny little testing because they're so
[TS]
00:33:13
◼
►
cute they like this look tiny cute
[TS]
00:33:15
◼
►
little dog teeth and she's got such tiny
[TS]
00:33:17
◼
►
teeth or Dury they're like you know
[TS]
00:33:18
◼
►
little pinpricks do you take him out
[TS]
00:33:19
◼
►
every once in a while do you show them
[TS]
00:33:21
◼
►
to Audrey no I showed my wife and I
[TS]
00:33:23
◼
►
don't think she was particularly
[TS]
00:33:24
◼
►
impressed I wonder is there anybody you
[TS]
00:33:26
◼
►
could show these teeth to who would be
[TS]
00:33:27
◼
►
particularly impressed I don't know
[TS]
00:33:29
◼
►
you're right I probably shouldn't have
[TS]
00:33:30
◼
►
kept him I think you can safely get rid
[TS]
00:33:33
◼
►
of those Brady let's start the dehorning
[TS]
00:33:35
◼
►
process with something small tiny
[TS]
00:33:37
◼
►
Chihuahua gee that's a bad as small as
[TS]
00:33:39
◼
►
you can start with exactly so there you
[TS]
00:33:41
◼
►
go Sandra Grey has had it done quite
[TS]
00:33:45
◼
►
horrific we by the sounds of it and did
[TS]
00:33:47
◼
►
not keep the tooth and I have not had it
[TS]
00:33:49
◼
►
done and as you will keep the tooth do
[TS]
00:33:52
◼
►
you know what I think maybe I wouldn't
[TS]
00:33:53
◼
►
oh wow I feel like we're making progress
[TS]
00:33:57
◼
►
I don't like teeth I don't like how
[TS]
00:33:58
◼
►
teeth look when they're not in a mouth
[TS]
00:34:00
◼
►
and in gums like teeth when they're out
[TS]
00:34:03
◼
►
and you see like all the roots and the
[TS]
00:34:04
◼
►
whole full horror of a tooth it's not
[TS]
00:34:07
◼
►
quite as nice as when you just see the
[TS]
00:34:08
◼
►
part that sticks out above the gum
[TS]
00:34:09
◼
►
they're not good looking things teeth I
[TS]
00:34:12
◼
►
don't like how they've got those two
[TS]
00:34:14
◼
►
little prong bits on the bottom that
[TS]
00:34:16
◼
►
yeah now now I wouldn't keep the roots
[TS]
00:34:18
◼
►
that dig into your gums Brady that's you
[TS]
00:34:20
◼
►
don't like to think about that don't
[TS]
00:34:21
◼
►
like it your whole mouth is just just
[TS]
00:34:23
◼
►
full of pieces of calcium that have
[TS]
00:34:25
◼
►
roots that dig into your soft gums you
[TS]
00:34:27
◼
►
don't like thinking about that although
[TS]
00:34:29
◼
►
you just said who would like Audrey's
[TS]
00:34:31
◼
►
teeth Sandra actually signed off her
[TS]
00:34:33
◼
►
email as from Sandra fellow Aussie
[TS]
00:34:36
◼
►
devoted hello internet listener and
[TS]
00:34:38
◼
►
number for Audrey fan bracket after you
[TS]
00:34:41
◼
►
your wife and gray maybe that would be
[TS]
00:34:43
◼
►
an appropriate gift to Sandra and I'll
[TS]
00:34:46
◼
►
get rid of the teeth Sandra if you would
[TS]
00:34:47
◼
►
like Audrey's teeth let me know and I'll
[TS]
00:34:51
◼
►
get them shipped over to us for you I
[TS]
00:34:53
◼
►
had the crazy things I know that you
[TS]
00:34:56
◼
►
will actually do this if it happens I
[TS]
00:34:57
◼
►
just know what I'll take it right
[TS]
00:35:01
◼
►
however you're going to get rid of those
[TS]
00:35:02
◼
►
teeth whatever you need to do I think
[TS]
00:35:04
◼
►
that'll work
[TS]
00:35:05
◼
►
I'll be happy if that's how they go I'd
[TS]
00:35:07
◼
►
put them straight in the garbage but if
[TS]
00:35:09
◼
►
you feel they need to send them to
[TS]
00:35:10
◼
►
Australia that works too
[TS]
00:35:12
◼
►
one last listener email this is
[TS]
00:35:15
◼
►
brilliant
[TS]
00:35:16
◼
►
okay you're gonna like this now you're
[TS]
00:35:18
◼
►
big in it up Brady I'm confident you're
[TS]
00:35:20
◼
►
confident okay alright you know it's
[TS]
00:35:22
◼
►
really got to work if you big it up like
[TS]
00:35:23
◼
►
that well one of the few things that I
[TS]
00:35:27
◼
►
know you do like that shows you're more
[TS]
00:35:28
◼
►
human side mm-hmm
[TS]
00:35:30
◼
►
at cute animals oh yeah I think you're a
[TS]
00:35:32
◼
►
bit of a sucker for cute animals I think
[TS]
00:35:34
◼
►
you're wrong
[TS]
00:35:34
◼
►
cute animals now did do not move my
[TS]
00:35:37
◼
►
metallic art what you does Audrey is a
[TS]
00:35:41
◼
►
very nice doggy this is from Rosie it
[TS]
00:35:44
◼
►
starts off dear Brady
[TS]
00:35:46
◼
►
here's another things people do while
[TS]
00:35:48
◼
►
listening to a chai story for you last
[TS]
00:35:50
◼
►
I conducted wildlife surveys in the
[TS]
00:35:53
◼
►
Carrizo Plain National Monument in
[TS]
00:35:55
◼
►
California we spent one month trapping
[TS]
00:35:58
◼
►
San Joaquin antelope squirrels a
[TS]
00:36:01
◼
►
threatened species okay I'm going to
[TS]
00:36:04
◼
►
send you a picture of what one of these
[TS]
00:36:06
◼
►
sand will Queen antelope squirrels looks
[TS]
00:36:08
◼
►
like there has been sent advice quite a
[TS]
00:36:09
◼
►
name that's quite an infernal it is
[TS]
00:36:11
◼
►
here's a picture of one via Rosie so
[TS]
00:36:14
◼
►
this was taken by Rosie in Scituate
[TS]
00:36:29
◼
►
we marked their bums with Sharpie okay
[TS]
00:36:34
◼
►
we will get there I was running out of
[TS]
00:36:36
◼
►
ideas for symbols to do but since I had
[TS]
00:36:39
◼
►
been marathoning AJ while doing some of
[TS]
00:36:42
◼
►
our more tedious surveys I realized I
[TS]
00:36:44
◼
►
could give a few of them a chai themed
[TS]
00:36:46
◼
►
names so attached are some pictures of
[TS]
00:36:49
◼
►
squirrels named hello Internet Brady
[TS]
00:36:54
◼
►
CGP and nailing gear and just so you can
[TS]
00:36:58
◼
►
see what we're talking about here are
[TS]
00:36:59
◼
►
you about to send me pictures of
[TS]
00:37:01
◼
►
squirrel butts with names written on
[TS]
00:37:03
◼
►
them yep here's the squirrel back with
[TS]
00:37:05
◼
►
b8 written on it for Brady Haran and
[TS]
00:37:07
◼
►
then here comes the squirrel but with
[TS]
00:37:10
◼
►
written on it so basically these tiny
[TS]
00:37:13
◼
►
squirrels quite largely have had these
[TS]
00:37:16
◼
►
things done on them but best of all is
[TS]
00:37:18
◼
►
the nailing gear
[TS]
00:37:19
◼
►
here is a endangered squirrel in
[TS]
00:37:21
◼
►
California with an ailing gear drawn on
[TS]
00:37:25
◼
►
its bum in sharpie I would describe this
[TS]
00:37:27
◼
►
as the rump of the squirrel is where
[TS]
00:37:30
◼
►
this is drunk this is not what I was
[TS]
00:37:32
◼
►
imagining around the actual real butt of
[TS]
00:37:35
◼
►
the squirrel right that's what I was
[TS]
00:37:37
◼
►
expecting you sending me for pictures of
[TS]
00:37:39
◼
►
right this is yeah squirrel rump right
[TS]
00:37:42
◼
►
not yet world but just a cipher work
[TS]
00:37:44
◼
►
yeah exactly right yeah if you're
[TS]
00:37:46
◼
►
listening to hello internet at work you
[TS]
00:37:48
◼
►
can safely click on this link and not
[TS]
00:37:50
◼
►
have to worry that your boss is gonna
[TS]
00:37:52
◼
►
come over in an opportune time and ask
[TS]
00:37:54
◼
►
why on earth are you looking at
[TS]
00:37:56
◼
►
photographs of scroll bot yeah you can
[TS]
00:37:58
◼
►
say it's like a boss it's just the rump
[TS]
00:37:59
◼
►
yeah it's just the rump totally safe for
[TS]
00:38:03
◼
►
work that nail in gear on little
[TS]
00:38:07
◼
►
squirrel though that's very cute is very
[TS]
00:38:08
◼
►
cute it is cool and also you know I've
[TS]
00:38:12
◼
►
sent you bits of paper where they were
[TS]
00:38:13
◼
►
doing all the work anyway you get the
[TS]
00:38:15
◼
►
impression how long do they need to
[TS]
00:38:17
◼
►
track these squirrels for though because
[TS]
00:38:18
◼
►
that has to come off eventually is this
[TS]
00:38:20
◼
►
just a temporary tracking process that's
[TS]
00:38:21
◼
►
going on here I imagine I imagine so
[TS]
00:38:23
◼
►
anyway she finishes her mo with
[TS]
00:38:26
◼
►
ironically CGP the squirrel ended up
[TS]
00:38:28
◼
►
being a female just like the penguin
[TS]
00:38:30
◼
►
that seems like this is the this is how
[TS]
00:38:32
◼
►
it works when cgb is a different animal
[TS]
00:38:34
◼
►
I'm sure you can guess what my
[TS]
00:38:36
◼
►
one-sentence reply to Rosie was I cannot
[TS]
00:38:38
◼
►
well I wanted to know what the gender of
[TS]
00:38:40
◼
►
Brady H I and Nalin gear were all right
[TS]
00:38:42
◼
►
okay so here's a little chart here's a
[TS]
00:38:44
◼
►
little chart oh you can look it up
[TS]
00:38:45
◼
►
yourself on the chat Brady's a boy I
[TS]
00:38:47
◼
►
prefer man but ok boy ha sorry yeah no
[TS]
00:38:51
◼
►
I don't think a male squirrel can be a
[TS]
00:38:53
◼
►
man I think that's what can be a boy
[TS]
00:38:55
◼
►
either look right because dogs dogs can
[TS]
00:38:57
◼
►
be a good boy right but you would never
[TS]
00:38:59
◼
►
say to a grown up dog that he's a good
[TS]
00:39:02
◼
►
right right I do say to my dogs good
[TS]
00:39:04
◼
►
girl I've never called them good woman
[TS]
00:39:05
◼
►
yeah all right that'd be super weird so
[TS]
00:39:07
◼
►
I just call them ladies though I do call
[TS]
00:39:09
◼
►
my dogs ladies that's also fine right
[TS]
00:39:11
◼
►
you can see like oh hello ladies right
[TS]
00:39:13
◼
►
when the two of them walk in the room I
[TS]
00:39:15
◼
►
think I sometimes sing all the single
[TS]
00:39:16
◼
►
ladies when they walk in the room okay
[TS]
00:39:18
◼
►
it's a little too much personal
[TS]
00:39:19
◼
►
information but that still works right
[TS]
00:39:20
◼
►
that's what I'm saying if I'd sung it
[TS]
00:39:22
◼
►
that would have been weird okay or I
[TS]
00:39:23
◼
►
think you can address a pack of dogs as
[TS]
00:39:26
◼
►
guys right all of this works but I don't
[TS]
00:39:28
◼
►
think it works if we're going to a man
[TS]
00:39:31
◼
►
or a woman so I'm gonna stick with
[TS]
00:39:33
◼
►
The Brady Haran squirrel is a boy
[TS]
00:39:35
◼
►
squirrel what could we go mail or we
[TS]
00:39:37
◼
►
could say he's a mail squirrel that is
[TS]
00:39:38
◼
►
also true because that's what Rosie said
[TS]
00:39:40
◼
►
Rosie said Brady was a mail so was a
[TS]
00:39:42
◼
►
chai and Nalin gear so the only lady was
[TS]
00:39:45
◼
►
CGP that's fine I'm happy with that
[TS]
00:39:47
◼
►
that were right with that I know CGP
[TS]
00:39:50
◼
►
grey the squirrel she's the one actually
[TS]
00:39:52
◼
►
making sure that there are more of these
[TS]
00:39:53
◼
►
endangered squirrels in the future she's
[TS]
00:39:55
◼
►
doing the hard work yeah I'm not gonna
[TS]
00:39:57
◼
►
argue with that thank you very much
[TS]
00:40:00
◼
►
definitely have a look at these pictures
[TS]
00:40:01
◼
►
of squirrel rumps in the show notes if
[TS]
00:40:04
◼
►
you are so inclined yeah if you want to
[TS]
00:40:06
◼
►
see squirrel rumps we've got some you've
[TS]
00:40:07
◼
►
come to the right point one hello
[TS]
00:40:12
◼
►
Internet I've never heard that podcast
[TS]
00:40:13
◼
►
arts that one will they always talk
[TS]
00:40:15
◼
►
about squirrel rumps oh yeah I like that
[TS]
00:40:18
◼
►
stuff I love those squirt room guys
[TS]
00:40:19
◼
►
they're awesome
[TS]
00:40:20
◼
►
yeah who could have thought they'd get
[TS]
00:40:22
◼
►
so many episodes out of it but anyway
[TS]
00:40:24
◼
►
yeah I can't wait for all of this follow
[TS]
00:40:26
◼
►
up in the future right nailing gear
[TS]
00:40:29
◼
►
squirrels spotted in the wild right
[TS]
00:40:30
◼
►
someone's just walking around in
[TS]
00:40:31
◼
►
California they happen to be a Tim and
[TS]
00:40:33
◼
►
right by them runs a squirrel with an
[TS]
00:40:35
◼
►
and character on the rump like what the
[TS]
00:40:38
◼
►
I'm never gonna believe this speaking of
[TS]
00:40:43
◼
►
things you would not believe mm-hmm
[TS]
00:40:45
◼
►
we have just passed another April Fool's
[TS]
00:40:47
◼
►
Day why wouldn't you believe that it
[TS]
00:40:49
◼
►
comes every year I thought that was a
[TS]
00:40:51
◼
►
nice segue you've just completely ruined
[TS]
00:40:52
◼
►
it was that a joke was there now's to be
[TS]
00:40:54
◼
►
a job but uh how was that anyway because
[TS]
00:40:57
◼
►
like things you wouldn't believe in
[TS]
00:40:59
◼
►
April Fool's days telling people you
[TS]
00:41:01
◼
►
know making people believe things that
[TS]
00:41:02
◼
►
aren't real doesn't matter it's very
[TS]
00:41:04
◼
►
I'm sorry Brady it's very clever that
[TS]
00:41:06
◼
►
was a fantastic segue there thank you
[TS]
00:41:08
◼
►
thank you it's it's gonna give a better
[TS]
00:41:09
◼
►
man ten out of ten would say way again
[TS]
00:41:11
◼
►
so April Fool's Day we've got to retire
[TS]
00:41:15
◼
►
this thing thank God
[TS]
00:41:16
◼
►
I know what a waste of time it also
[TS]
00:41:19
◼
►
feels like you've ruined it everybody
[TS]
00:41:20
◼
►
yeah right you have ruined it you're all
[TS]
00:41:23
◼
►
too into this that now it's not fun
[TS]
00:41:25
◼
►
anymore do you know what's ruined up
[TS]
00:41:26
◼
►
gray what social media and
[TS]
00:41:29
◼
►
corporatization yeah social media that's
[TS]
00:41:31
◼
►
a good one but I was going to say it's
[TS]
00:41:33
◼
►
companies getting on board yet now is
[TS]
00:41:35
◼
►
the worst I imagine there are businesses
[TS]
00:41:37
◼
►
now that have whole departments
[TS]
00:41:39
◼
►
dedicated to like next year's April
[TS]
00:41:40
◼
►
Fool's Day joke mm-hmm and like April
[TS]
00:41:43
◼
►
Fool's Day is not about that what is the
[TS]
00:41:45
◼
►
true meaning of April Fool's
[TS]
00:41:47
◼
►
I actually don't know what its history
[TS]
00:41:52
◼
►
is and I don't need to know because now
[TS]
00:41:54
◼
►
the bloody subreddits gonna be full of
[TS]
00:41:56
◼
►
so I'm going to spend the next two weeks
[TS]
00:41:58
◼
►
basically immersed in the minutiae of
[TS]
00:42:01
◼
►
how April Fool's Day came to be I don't
[TS]
00:42:03
◼
►
care how it came to be I'm sure it's a
[TS]
00:42:04
◼
►
good story
[TS]
00:42:05
◼
►
I liked April Fool's Day back in the day
[TS]
00:42:07
◼
►
when it was like a thing that maybe one
[TS]
00:42:10
◼
►
newspaper would maybe do or like your
[TS]
00:42:13
◼
►
local TV station London something every
[TS]
00:42:15
◼
►
few years and you know there are some
[TS]
00:42:16
◼
►
classics but now it's just tiresome like
[TS]
00:42:20
◼
►
what they need to do is that all the
[TS]
00:42:22
◼
►
businesses and PR departments and
[TS]
00:42:24
◼
►
companies and people in the world and
[TS]
00:42:26
◼
►
news organizations that need to get
[TS]
00:42:27
◼
►
together and say alright this year you
[TS]
00:42:30
◼
►
can do one mm-hmm and no one else can do
[TS]
00:42:32
◼
►
it because when every man and their dog
[TS]
00:42:35
◼
►
is doing it all giggling to themself
[TS]
00:42:36
◼
►
like a dad who's just told a dad joke
[TS]
00:42:38
◼
►
yeah we just did like oh yeah look what
[TS]
00:42:42
◼
►
you just did and every single other
[TS]
00:42:44
◼
►
person in my timeline just did go away
[TS]
00:42:46
◼
►
yeah you know what that's what it is
[TS]
00:42:48
◼
►
it's like dad joke day
[TS]
00:42:49
◼
►
yeah that's precisely what it is it's
[TS]
00:42:51
◼
►
like Oh Google has a video about their
[TS]
00:42:53
◼
►
Google Nome instead of Google home it's
[TS]
00:42:56
◼
►
like oh my god I can't deal with this
[TS]
00:42:58
◼
►
this is terrible
[TS]
00:42:59
◼
►
yeah yes it's like dad jokes from
[TS]
00:43:01
◼
►
corporations because real humor always
[TS]
00:43:03
◼
►
has a little bit of like an edge to it
[TS]
00:43:05
◼
►
that's what makes it funny but a company
[TS]
00:43:07
◼
►
they don't want to have any edge to
[TS]
00:43:09
◼
►
anything so which is going to be some
[TS]
00:43:10
◼
►
stupid pun right that's what they're
[TS]
00:43:12
◼
►
gonna do and you also know they're like
[TS]
00:43:13
◼
►
measuring their engagement with the joke
[TS]
00:43:15
◼
►
right last year's April Fool's Day
[TS]
00:43:17
◼
►
performance we had double the retweets
[TS]
00:43:20
◼
►
of this year's April Fool's Day
[TS]
00:43:21
◼
►
tweet that we did last year and it's
[TS]
00:43:23
◼
►
like if anyone is going to be suckered
[TS]
00:43:25
◼
►
in by some traditional day and a bit of
[TS]
00:43:27
◼
►
tomfoolery it's me and I bloody hate it
[TS]
00:43:29
◼
►
yeah I'm actually kind of surprised that
[TS]
00:43:31
◼
►
you're on this side of it I assumed you
[TS]
00:43:33
◼
►
were going to be on the other side of
[TS]
00:43:34
◼
►
this I've like a let's return to the
[TS]
00:43:36
◼
►
true meaning of April Fool's but I'm
[TS]
00:43:39
◼
►
actually somewhat surprised yeah that
[TS]
00:43:40
◼
►
you don't you don't want to go along
[TS]
00:43:41
◼
►
with this non tastic tradition can't
[TS]
00:43:44
◼
►
stand get rid of it for the past several
[TS]
00:43:46
◼
►
years I have taken April Fool's as my
[TS]
00:43:49
◼
►
annual don't go on the Internet at all
[TS]
00:43:51
◼
►
day and here's the thing in the past I
[TS]
00:43:54
◼
►
occasionally would tweet about this like
[TS]
00:43:56
◼
►
I put up a little image like I'm just
[TS]
00:43:57
◼
►
not going to be online today everybody
[TS]
00:43:58
◼
►
like goodbye I recommend you do this
[TS]
00:44:00
◼
►
same thing like just unplugged for a day
[TS]
00:44:01
◼
►
you won't miss anything but I was aware
[TS]
00:44:04
◼
►
this year that April fools again because
[TS]
00:44:07
◼
►
of social media it like it's it bleeds
[TS]
00:44:09
◼
►
into it's actually a lot closer to two
[TS]
00:44:11
◼
►
days like two and a half days yeah
[TS]
00:44:14
◼
►
because you have people all over the
[TS]
00:44:15
◼
►
world and the day after people are still
[TS]
00:44:18
◼
►
retweeting stuff from April Fool's so I
[TS]
00:44:20
◼
►
think in the future I might have to
[TS]
00:44:22
◼
►
start quarantine in this day with like a
[TS]
00:44:24
◼
►
whole week around it of like I'm just
[TS]
00:44:25
◼
►
not going on the internet at this time
[TS]
00:44:26
◼
►
because everything is super dumb it's
[TS]
00:44:29
◼
►
super dumb and it's super frustrating
[TS]
00:44:31
◼
►
and the Internet's full of untrue crap
[TS]
00:44:33
◼
►
anyway in an era of fake news let's not
[TS]
00:44:36
◼
►
even start a fake news this is talk
[TS]
00:44:38
◼
►
about stuff that's wrong or stuff that's
[TS]
00:44:40
◼
►
supposed to be a joke and this stuff
[TS]
00:44:41
◼
►
lasts forever - it's not like a
[TS]
00:44:43
◼
►
newspaper story or an old TV telecast on
[TS]
00:44:46
◼
►
the BBC 40 years ago that went out and
[TS]
00:44:48
◼
►
was forgotten yeah or the fish and chips
[TS]
00:44:50
◼
►
was Repton this stuff hangs around
[TS]
00:44:51
◼
►
forever as well yeah so it just becomes
[TS]
00:44:53
◼
►
this like legacy of that's not the point
[TS]
00:44:56
◼
►
yes it's not the old BBC broadcast about
[TS]
00:44:58
◼
►
the spaghetti harvest yeah so guess what
[TS]
00:45:00
◼
►
everybody
[TS]
00:45:01
◼
►
everyday is April Fool's on the Internet
[TS]
00:45:04
◼
►
in some way right where it's just like
[TS]
00:45:05
◼
►
filled with stuff that can't possibly be
[TS]
00:45:07
◼
►
real and trying to sort it out from the
[TS]
00:45:09
◼
►
stuff that isn't so yeah it's a
[TS]
00:45:10
◼
►
frustrating holiday if it's not
[TS]
00:45:12
◼
►
corporations being dumb I also feel like
[TS]
00:45:15
◼
►
it's a weird day where it's like people
[TS]
00:45:16
◼
►
have a permission to be like a jackass
[TS]
00:45:19
◼
►
like this is a holiday that has almost
[TS]
00:45:20
◼
►
no redeeming characteristics at all I'm
[TS]
00:45:23
◼
►
not sure I'd call a holiday but I know
[TS]
00:45:25
◼
►
you know yeah we put it we put it in the
[TS]
00:45:26
◼
►
pantheon of holidays right a st.
[TS]
00:45:28
◼
►
Patrick's Day
[TS]
00:45:29
◼
►
Cupid's Day I don't think there are
[TS]
00:45:31
◼
►
people that have like a day off April
[TS]
00:45:33
◼
►
Fool's Day they like but anyway the
[TS]
00:45:35
◼
►
problem is every day has this done to it
[TS]
00:45:38
◼
►
because now like there's like so much
[TS]
00:45:41
◼
►
stuff there's so much Twitter and
[TS]
00:45:42
◼
►
Facebook and there's so much PR and spin
[TS]
00:45:45
◼
►
and stuff everything gets ruined and I
[TS]
00:45:47
◼
►
accept you know Christmas has to be
[TS]
00:45:49
◼
►
ruined that's what Christmas is mm-hmm
[TS]
00:45:51
◼
►
and all these major holidays everyone
[TS]
00:45:53
◼
►
jumps on but it seems like anything that
[TS]
00:45:55
◼
►
comes up now gets destroyed like this
[TS]
00:45:57
◼
►
and another prime example that you're
[TS]
00:45:59
◼
►
probably not as exposed to because you
[TS]
00:46:00
◼
►
don't have a mathematics YouTube channel
[TS]
00:46:02
◼
►
but I do mmm and that's pi day this you
[TS]
00:46:05
◼
►
know 14th of March through 14 like when
[TS]
00:46:09
◼
►
that sort of got a little bit of
[TS]
00:46:10
◼
►
traction a few years ago and like I put
[TS]
00:46:12
◼
►
up a couple of Pi Day videos and you
[TS]
00:46:14
◼
►
was a little fun thing but now just like
[TS]
00:46:16
◼
►
every man woman and their dog jumps all
[TS]
00:46:20
◼
►
over pi day as an excuse for publicity
[TS]
00:46:23
◼
►
and attention and it's like ah I almost
[TS]
00:46:26
◼
►
want to pull off the internet now for
[TS]
00:46:27
◼
►
three days before in three days after pi
[TS]
00:46:29
◼
►
day because i obviously follow a lot of
[TS]
00:46:31
◼
►
math you people and stuff and like my
[TS]
00:46:33
◼
►
timeline facebook and that just becomes
[TS]
00:46:35
◼
►
a kind of issue around that time as well
[TS]
00:46:37
◼
►
this makes me laugh because i feel like
[TS]
00:46:39
◼
►
you are at the center of a particular
[TS]
00:46:41
◼
►
kind of storm here
[TS]
00:46:43
◼
►
i have a hard time imagining anybody who
[TS]
00:46:45
◼
►
might be on the receiving end of more pi
[TS]
00:46:47
◼
►
day stuff than you is like if we're
[TS]
00:46:53
◼
►
complaining about Oh hot stopper news
[TS]
00:46:55
◼
►
like there's just too much of it all the
[TS]
00:46:56
◼
►
time it's like well actually we're like
[TS]
00:46:58
◼
►
the Nexus of all hot stuff is it's not
[TS]
00:47:01
◼
►
like a society-wide problem and that
[TS]
00:47:03
◼
►
might be a little bit of pi day for you
[TS]
00:47:05
◼
►
yeah it's like you're gonna be right at
[TS]
00:47:07
◼
►
the center of this anyway I proposed I
[TS]
00:47:11
◼
►
had enough but gah why I do have to
[TS]
00:47:14
◼
►
mention one thing here though that I
[TS]
00:47:17
◼
►
would be remiss if I did not mention
[TS]
00:47:18
◼
►
which is that one corporation that I
[TS]
00:47:23
◼
►
think at least does something
[TS]
00:47:24
◼
►
interesting sometimes on April Fool's is
[TS]
00:47:28
◼
►
reddit they don't do jokes right they're
[TS]
00:47:32
◼
►
not doing some joke they don't release
[TS]
00:47:33
◼
►
like a dumb feature that they pretend is
[TS]
00:47:36
◼
►
real but they have done little like
[TS]
00:47:39
◼
►
experiments on their user base sometimes
[TS]
00:47:42
◼
►
over April Fool's and the one that they
[TS]
00:47:44
◼
►
did this year was actually quite amazing
[TS]
00:47:47
◼
►
and did cross my attention which was our
[TS]
00:47:50
◼
►
place this big pixel art I don't know if
[TS]
00:47:54
◼
►
you saw this at all break yes I did I
[TS]
00:47:55
◼
►
did I found it very interesting
[TS]
00:47:57
◼
►
so for listeners who are unaware reddit
[TS]
00:48:00
◼
►
what they started on April 1st and they
[TS]
00:48:03
◼
►
let it run for I think 72 hours in the
[TS]
00:48:06
◼
►
end or something like that was they
[TS]
00:48:08
◼
►
created a blank grid there was a
[TS]
00:48:10
◼
►
thousand pixels by a thousand pixels and
[TS]
00:48:13
◼
►
all of reddits users every 5 minutes
[TS]
00:48:16
◼
►
could color in one of the pixels any
[TS]
00:48:20
◼
►
color they wanted over the 72 hours I
[TS]
00:48:24
◼
►
have to say it was just
[TS]
00:48:26
◼
►
very interesting thing to see different
[TS]
00:48:30
◼
►
groups of people coming together to try
[TS]
00:48:32
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to represent their group on this piece
[TS]
00:48:36
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of artwork that was being created this
[TS]
00:48:38
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was a just a very interesting look into
[TS]
00:48:42
◼
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groups interacting with each other on
[TS]
00:48:44
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the internet because it required
[TS]
00:48:45
◼
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teamwork didn't you would have to say
[TS]
00:48:47
◼
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okay everyone let's let tag at this
[TS]
00:48:49
◼
►
portion of the grid and use of all our
[TS]
00:48:51
◼
►
app credits or our time or our colors to
[TS]
00:48:53
◼
►
try and create this image and other
[TS]
00:48:55
◼
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people might try and come in and
[TS]
00:48:56
◼
►
encroach upon it that's exactly like as
[TS]
00:48:58
◼
►
an individual user all you could do was
[TS]
00:49:00
◼
►
just put down a pixel and there were
[TS]
00:49:02
◼
►
plenty of people who were just
[TS]
00:49:03
◼
►
essentially defacing the image by just
[TS]
00:49:06
◼
►
putting down random color pixels all
[TS]
00:49:08
◼
►
over the place but then there were much
[TS]
00:49:10
◼
►
bigger groups that we're trying to say
[TS]
00:49:11
◼
►
like we will defend the American flag in
[TS]
00:49:13
◼
►
the center of this image right but in
[TS]
00:49:15
◼
►
order to do that we need to convince a
[TS]
00:49:17
◼
►
couple thousand people to keep this tab
[TS]
00:49:20
◼
►
open in the background on their
[TS]
00:49:21
◼
►
computers and monitor the American flag
[TS]
00:49:24
◼
►
and change all the colors to make it
[TS]
00:49:25
◼
►
match there was a group that was calling
[TS]
00:49:27
◼
►
themselves just the Void who was trying
[TS]
00:49:29
◼
►
to black out the whole canvas and it's
[TS]
00:49:31
◼
►
really interesting like people have put
[TS]
00:49:33
◼
►
together time lapses of what happens
[TS]
00:49:35
◼
►
with this image over time and you can
[TS]
00:49:38
◼
►
see like these factions coming and going
[TS]
00:49:41
◼
►
and like the void is growing and
[TS]
00:49:42
◼
►
expanding and then people are working to
[TS]
00:49:44
◼
►
push back the void and is I found it a
[TS]
00:49:47
◼
►
very very interesting thing and of
[TS]
00:49:49
◼
►
course the most interesting thing is
[TS]
00:49:51
◼
►
that the listeners of hello Internet the
[TS]
00:49:55
◼
►
huge number of Tim's that there are were
[TS]
00:49:57
◼
►
able to secure a corner of the place for
[TS]
00:50:00
◼
►
hello Internet and so there's our logo
[TS]
00:50:04
◼
►
and not insignificant gray they did a
[TS]
00:50:06
◼
►
really good job type they did a really
[TS]
00:50:08
◼
►
good job it is not just a tiny little
[TS]
00:50:10
◼
►
thing like it's a decent little chunk of
[TS]
00:50:12
◼
►
this thing it's multiple images like we
[TS]
00:50:15
◼
►
have our faces we have Flags rebel flags
[TS]
00:50:18
◼
►
maybe but they're our rebels so it's
[TS]
00:50:20
◼
►
okay yeah it was really interesting to
[TS]
00:50:22
◼
►
see and especially because this didn't
[TS]
00:50:24
◼
►
really cross my radar until just I think
[TS]
00:50:26
◼
►
maybe only two hours before the whole
[TS]
00:50:27
◼
►
thing was going to shut down so I have
[TS]
00:50:29
◼
►
to give total credit to our audience
[TS]
00:50:31
◼
►
that this was 100% arranged and
[TS]
00:50:35
◼
►
accomplished just by them but for
[TS]
00:50:38
◼
►
anybody listening I got put some links
[TS]
00:50:39
◼
►
in the show notes
[TS]
00:50:40
◼
►
of some of the time lapses what the
[TS]
00:50:42
◼
►
final image looks like some close-ups of
[TS]
00:50:44
◼
►
the hello Internet section yeah I I
[TS]
00:50:46
◼
►
think this was a very interesting thing
[TS]
00:50:49
◼
►
that occurred on the internet that was
[TS]
00:50:52
◼
►
connected to April Fool's and is
[TS]
00:50:54
◼
►
probably the best April Fool's related
[TS]
00:50:56
◼
►
thing I have ever seen because it was
[TS]
00:50:58
◼
►
actually interesting it's got nothing to
[TS]
00:51:00
◼
►
do with April Fool's gray though other
[TS]
00:51:02
◼
►
than they did it on April 4 yeah so I
[TS]
00:51:03
◼
►
think I wouldn't count that as April
[TS]
00:51:05
◼
►
Fool's but I thought it was cool I guess
[TS]
00:51:07
◼
►
we have to talk about this one red pixel
[TS]
00:51:09
◼
►
they approached on our little territory
[TS]
00:51:12
◼
►
and someone put a little red pixel on
[TS]
00:51:13
◼
►
the little H eye section of the image
[TS]
00:51:15
◼
►
that unfortunately was there when it all
[TS]
00:51:16
◼
►
shut down so it's there for eternity how
[TS]
00:51:18
◼
►
do you feel about that oh but I'm
[TS]
00:51:20
◼
►
totally fine with that right because
[TS]
00:51:21
◼
►
that's what this thing is like I think
[TS]
00:51:23
◼
►
that red pixel is an indicator of what
[TS]
00:51:25
◼
►
this project was right where there are
[TS]
00:51:27
◼
►
there are some people who are working
[TS]
00:51:29
◼
►
against the coherence of the overall
[TS]
00:51:32
◼
►
thing but I love this stuff because like
[TS]
00:51:35
◼
►
as much trouble as we give Wikipedia I
[TS]
00:51:37
◼
►
think Wikipedia is a testament to the
[TS]
00:51:40
◼
►
fact that although people don't always
[TS]
00:51:42
◼
►
think it most people are good and
[TS]
00:51:47
◼
►
helpful right the a thing like Wikipedia
[TS]
00:51:49
◼
►
could never exist if most people were
[TS]
00:51:53
◼
►
what sometimes it seems like most people
[TS]
00:51:55
◼
►
think anonymous people are which is just
[TS]
00:51:58
◼
►
a bunch of jackasses out to ruin
[TS]
00:52:00
◼
►
everything right and it's like if people
[TS]
00:52:02
◼
►
weren't willing and able to coordinate
[TS]
00:52:04
◼
►
and work towards the better good
[TS]
00:52:06
◼
►
something like our place could never
[TS]
00:52:08
◼
►
have happened at all it would just be a
[TS]
00:52:09
◼
►
big massive noise but the fact that some
[TS]
00:52:13
◼
►
people just want to see the world burn
[TS]
00:52:15
◼
►
that's part of the experience of the
[TS]
00:52:17
◼
►
Internet but overall people wanting to
[TS]
00:52:21
◼
►
work together and be good is a bigger
[TS]
00:52:23
◼
►
part of it so I feel like I'm totally
[TS]
00:52:25
◼
►
fine with that red dot that red dot is
[TS]
00:52:27
◼
►
almost symbolic of the fact that
[TS]
00:52:29
◼
►
coordination triumphs over chaos so I
[TS]
00:52:32
◼
►
have no problem with it
[TS]
00:52:33
◼
►
there's also tradition I think it's a
[TS]
00:52:35
◼
►
Far Eastern tradition amongst the sort
[TS]
00:52:37
◼
►
of famous old rug makers who would
[TS]
00:52:39
◼
►
stitch these incredible huge rugs that
[TS]
00:52:41
◼
►
they put one stitch in the rug that is a
[TS]
00:52:43
◼
►
mistake deliberately and that's like a
[TS]
00:52:46
◼
►
reminder that only God is perfect you
[TS]
00:52:48
◼
►
can't make a perfect rug cool so maybe
[TS]
00:52:50
◼
►
that's a imperfect stitch as well I like
[TS]
00:52:52
◼
►
it I have to say it was
[TS]
00:52:53
◼
►
interesting to see the final image I
[TS]
00:52:55
◼
►
think people should really take a look
[TS]
00:52:57
◼
►
at it watch the time lapses they're very
[TS]
00:52:59
◼
►
interesting and I have to say if I'm so
[TS]
00:53:02
◼
►
pleased and surprised that our audience
[TS]
00:53:04
◼
►
was able to coordinate and accomplish
[TS]
00:53:07
◼
►
this thing all on their own it's very
[TS]
00:53:08
◼
►
impressive it's very impressive speaking
[TS]
00:53:11
◼
►
of our audience in Tim's I would like to
[TS]
00:53:12
◼
►
say a quick hello to the surprisingly
[TS]
00:53:15
◼
►
high number of Tim's that I bumped into
[TS]
00:53:17
◼
►
at VidCon in Amsterdam European VidCon
[TS]
00:53:20
◼
►
oh did you go which I mentioned I was
[TS]
00:53:22
◼
►
going to I didn't know you were going oh
[TS]
00:53:23
◼
►
and although gray is playing coy Gray
[TS]
00:53:27
◼
►
was there as well or was I you wouldn't
[TS]
00:53:30
◼
►
know there you were there I had a really
[TS]
00:53:34
◼
►
good time mainly because I liked hanging
[TS]
00:53:35
◼
►
out with you and some of our friends I
[TS]
00:53:37
◼
►
had a really good time doing that I also
[TS]
00:53:39
◼
►
did the things I had to do I did a talk
[TS]
00:53:41
◼
►
on the first morning and I also went
[TS]
00:53:42
◼
►
along and did a little workshop with
[TS]
00:53:44
◼
►
some Tim's who had the surprise of gray
[TS]
00:53:46
◼
►
coming along as a special guest you
[TS]
00:53:48
◼
►
actually agreed to come along and talk
[TS]
00:53:50
◼
►
with me which was very kind of you
[TS]
00:53:52
◼
►
I was strong-armed into coming along by
[TS]
00:53:55
◼
►
an unprepared Brady is how I would
[TS]
00:53:57
◼
►
describe the situation you absolutely
[TS]
00:53:59
◼
►
would not strong-armed I said it would
[TS]
00:54:01
◼
►
be lovely for you to come along be a
[TS]
00:54:03
◼
►
nice surprise for the people who came
[TS]
00:54:05
◼
►
but you under no pressure and it's
[TS]
00:54:06
◼
►
completely up to you I said I would like
[TS]
00:54:09
◼
►
you to do it but if you don't like
[TS]
00:54:12
◼
►
absolutely no problem I can see the
[TS]
00:54:14
◼
►
ostia I think you were curious I will in
[TS]
00:54:18
◼
►
public allow you to indulge that
[TS]
00:54:20
◼
►
delusion how things went on it's not my
[TS]
00:54:23
◼
►
personal experience of how it went down
[TS]
00:54:24
◼
►
but no you did strong-arm me into going
[TS]
00:54:27
◼
►
into a thing and yes I was there at
[TS]
00:54:29
◼
►
VidCon in the end much to my surprise
[TS]
00:54:31
◼
►
what did you think of it I mean I
[TS]
00:54:33
◼
►
haven't been to the big American VidCon
[TS]
00:54:35
◼
►
for years so I always forget that oh
[TS]
00:54:36
◼
►
yeah what was your overall impression of
[TS]
00:54:38
◼
►
VidCon Europe any sort of just quick
[TS]
00:54:41
◼
►
executive summary I feel like I'm just
[TS]
00:54:42
◼
►
the worst person in the world to try to
[TS]
00:54:44
◼
►
give an executive summary of these
[TS]
00:54:45
◼
►
things because I am I am going in such a
[TS]
00:54:47
◼
►
strange way I feel like I am going as a
[TS]
00:54:50
◼
►
tourist who is interested in this thing
[TS]
00:54:53
◼
►
in a very abstract way because I'm not
[TS]
00:54:57
◼
►
there as a creator learning how to work
[TS]
00:55:01
◼
►
in the industry I'm also not there
[TS]
00:55:04
◼
►
is one of the creators who like you is
[TS]
00:55:07
◼
►
actually doing presentations and has an
[TS]
00:55:10
◼
►
onstage presence so I always feel like
[TS]
00:55:12
◼
►
very much like an odd man out at VidCon
[TS]
00:55:16
◼
►
I feel I feel very much like I'm not
[TS]
00:55:17
◼
►
really supposed to be here I'm here and
[TS]
00:55:20
◼
►
just observing this like an
[TS]
00:55:22
◼
►
anthropologist I just find it an
[TS]
00:55:24
◼
►
interesting experience I don't know how
[TS]
00:55:27
◼
►
other people experience VidCon like I
[TS]
00:55:31
◼
►
think it's a very different thing if
[TS]
00:55:32
◼
►
you're going on a stage I'm not asking
[TS]
00:55:34
◼
►
how other people experience I'm asking
[TS]
00:55:35
◼
►
how you experience it but that's what
[TS]
00:55:37
◼
►
I'm saying like I experienced it as a
[TS]
00:55:38
◼
►
tourist like I think it's very
[TS]
00:55:40
◼
►
interesting to see I'm always very
[TS]
00:55:42
◼
►
interested in how big things get pulled
[TS]
00:55:46
◼
►
off like I find it fascinating of like
[TS]
00:55:49
◼
►
how does this thing go from an idea in
[TS]
00:55:52
◼
►
someone's head - oh there's thousands of
[TS]
00:55:56
◼
►
people here
[TS]
00:55:57
◼
►
and there are also sandwiches on that
[TS]
00:55:59
◼
►
table over there and all of this has to
[TS]
00:56:00
◼
►
be arranged somehow and it all seems
[TS]
00:56:03
◼
►
like it's just so far beyond the mind of
[TS]
00:56:05
◼
►
a single individual person and I don't
[TS]
00:56:07
◼
►
understand how its coordinated like I
[TS]
00:56:09
◼
►
always just find my mind being drawn
[TS]
00:56:10
◼
►
towards that kind of stuff yeah and one
[TS]
00:56:13
◼
►
of these days I will get someone who's
[TS]
00:56:15
◼
►
in charge of VidCon like I will bully
[TS]
00:56:16
◼
►
them into a corner and give them a pen
[TS]
00:56:18
◼
►
and be like draw for me the org chart on
[TS]
00:56:20
◼
►
this napkin like I don't understand how
[TS]
00:56:23
◼
►
all of this happens and I would like to
[TS]
00:56:25
◼
►
see on a piece of paper the logistics
[TS]
00:56:27
◼
►
behind all of this
[TS]
00:56:28
◼
►
I find that stuff very very interesting
[TS]
00:56:31
◼
►
I have got a quick sports book owner
[TS]
00:56:34
◼
►
gray ok well I've picked one that I
[TS]
00:56:36
◼
►
think is relevant to you you always do
[TS]
00:56:38
◼
►
okay alright go ahead
[TS]
00:56:39
◼
►
do you have some story about a person is
[TS]
00:56:41
◼
►
that what you think is is relevant to me
[TS]
00:56:43
◼
►
yeah okay here we go great yeah nailed
[TS]
00:56:45
◼
►
it perfect 10 out of 10 10 attends
[TS]
00:56:48
◼
►
fourth-wall corner
[TS]
00:56:48
◼
►
the topic is golf okay but it's not the
[TS]
00:56:52
◼
►
Masters golf which everyone is gonna be
[TS]
00:56:53
◼
►
hoping I'm talking about which is the
[TS]
00:56:55
◼
►
big tournament that just happened oh is
[TS]
00:56:56
◼
►
that what everyone's gonna be hoping
[TS]
00:56:57
◼
►
you're talking about yeah because I
[TS]
00:56:59
◼
►
watched the Masters and I was like
[TS]
00:57:00
◼
►
tweeting while I was watching everyone
[TS]
00:57:02
◼
►
saying oh you got to talk to gray about
[TS]
00:57:03
◼
►
this but there's nothing to talk to grab
[TS]
00:57:05
◼
►
air about the Masters it was just a good
[TS]
00:57:06
◼
►
golf tournament mm-hmm
[TS]
00:57:07
◼
►
but what I want to talk about is the
[TS]
00:57:10
◼
►
tournament the week before I called the
[TS]
00:57:12
◼
►
aana inspiration which obviously is a
[TS]
00:57:15
◼
►
sponsors name but this is one of the
[TS]
00:57:17
◼
►
four May
[TS]
00:57:18
◼
►
tournaments for women golfers and I want
[TS]
00:57:22
◼
►
to tell you what happened on the final
[TS]
00:57:24
◼
►
day because I want to know what you
[TS]
00:57:25
◼
►
think about this whether you think this
[TS]
00:57:27
◼
►
is a good thing
[TS]
00:57:28
◼
►
and makes you happy and makes you happy
[TS]
00:57:31
◼
►
with the world or you think it's like a
[TS]
00:57:32
◼
►
bit of a travesty
[TS]
00:57:34
◼
►
this woman as you know it well as you
[TS]
00:57:37
◼
►
probably don't know typically a golf
[TS]
00:57:38
◼
►
tournament is played over four days you
[TS]
00:57:40
◼
►
play the 18 holes over four consecutive
[TS]
00:57:42
◼
►
days and whoever has the lowest
[TS]
00:57:44
◼
►
accumulated score is the winner right
[TS]
00:57:46
◼
►
and this woman called Lexi Thompson was
[TS]
00:57:50
◼
►
leading after three days and she was
[TS]
00:57:52
◼
►
playing on the fourth day and she was
[TS]
00:57:54
◼
►
still leading the tournament she was
[TS]
00:57:55
◼
►
streaking away and was going to win the
[TS]
00:57:58
◼
►
tournament it was clear she had this
[TS]
00:57:59
◼
►
comfortable lead and then what happened
[TS]
00:58:01
◼
►
was a TV viewer contacted the network
[TS]
00:58:05
◼
►
and the organisers of the tournament and
[TS]
00:58:08
◼
►
said I was watching some footage from
[TS]
00:58:10
◼
►
the third day and when this woman picked
[TS]
00:58:13
◼
►
up her golf ball from the green and like
[TS]
00:58:15
◼
►
cleaned the grass off it and then put it
[TS]
00:58:17
◼
►
back down where she'd put her marker she
[TS]
00:58:20
◼
►
didn't put it in exactly the right place
[TS]
00:58:22
◼
►
it was like a few millimeters wrong
[TS]
00:58:24
◼
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there are very strict rules about how
[TS]
00:58:25
◼
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this works with golf so the people
[TS]
00:58:29
◼
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organizing the tournament went back and
[TS]
00:58:30
◼
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watched the previous day's footage and
[TS]
00:58:32
◼
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yes she had reached this rule which I
[TS]
00:58:35
◼
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think was so trivial it hardly matters
[TS]
00:58:38
◼
►
but anyway it didn't make a big
[TS]
00:58:40
◼
►
difference but she did technically
[TS]
00:58:41
◼
►
breach this rule the penalty for doing
[TS]
00:58:43
◼
►
that is a two-shot penalty mm-hmm so
[TS]
00:58:46
◼
►
they gave her a two-shot penalty there's
[TS]
00:58:48
◼
►
another penalty in golf that if you sign
[TS]
00:58:50
◼
►
your scorecard at the end of the day and
[TS]
00:58:52
◼
►
the score is incorrect you get a
[TS]
00:58:53
◼
►
two-shot penalty and cuz she designed a
[TS]
00:58:55
◼
►
scorecard that was now incorrect
[TS]
00:58:57
◼
►
although how could she have known
[TS]
00:58:58
◼
►
otherwise she got another two-shot
[TS]
00:59:00
◼
►
penalty so she got this four shot
[TS]
00:59:02
◼
►
penalty they walk out to her on the golf
[TS]
00:59:04
◼
►
course and say because of what you did
[TS]
00:59:05
◼
►
yesterday which some viewers saw which
[TS]
00:59:08
◼
►
we've now gone and found we're docking
[TS]
00:59:10
◼
►
you for shots and she went on to lose
[TS]
00:59:14
◼
►
the tournament in a playoff because of
[TS]
00:59:16
◼
►
this now I know that you're a big fan of
[TS]
00:59:19
◼
►
TV replays and you think it's crazy that
[TS]
00:59:21
◼
►
TV replays aren't used in sport hmm so I
[TS]
00:59:24
◼
►
want to know what you think about this
[TS]
00:59:26
◼
►
happening by the way one of the problems
[TS]
00:59:28
◼
►
is when you're leading the tournament
[TS]
00:59:29
◼
►
you're getting filmed a whole lot more
[TS]
00:59:31
◼
►
so you're much more likely to get caught
[TS]
00:59:32
◼
►
doing this trivial little mistake mm-hmm
[TS]
00:59:35
◼
►
so that's one thing but a thing I want
[TS]
00:59:36
◼
►
to know is no referee saw it no one saw
[TS]
00:59:39
◼
►
it on the day no one associated with the
[TS]
00:59:41
◼
►
tournament Sora
[TS]
00:59:42
◼
►
she was basically you know was a tail
[TS]
00:59:44
◼
►
tattle viewer sitting in their sofa at
[TS]
00:59:47
◼
►
home hold on her you're showing your
[TS]
00:59:50
◼
►
hand there I think we can all
[TS]
00:59:53
◼
►
objectively call this person a
[TS]
00:59:54
◼
►
tattletale yes so I wanna know where
[TS]
00:59:58
◼
►
great a big butt
[TS]
00:59:58
◼
►
great a big butt
[TS]
01:00:00
◼
►
flavor and using of technology and
[TS]
01:00:01
◼
►
replays and things in sport and getting
[TS]
01:00:03
◼
►
a fair outcome feels about the story as
[TS]
01:00:05
◼
►
I just told I will have an asterisk to
[TS]
01:00:07
◼
►
this the statement yeah but in general I
[TS]
01:00:11
◼
►
would say what are sports but a
[TS]
01:00:14
◼
►
collection of rules yep if we're just
[TS]
01:00:16
◼
►
going to say that we're not going to
[TS]
01:00:18
◼
►
follow those rules all the time then
[TS]
01:00:21
◼
►
what are we even doing here right why
[TS]
01:00:23
◼
►
are we all together what is this thing
[TS]
01:00:25
◼
►
that's occurring yep
[TS]
01:00:26
◼
►
so if a viewer spotted a thing that none
[TS]
01:00:29
◼
►
of the referee spotted and it was
[TS]
01:00:32
◼
►
technically something she should not do
[TS]
01:00:35
◼
►
it doesn't matter by how little she did
[TS]
01:00:38
◼
►
the thing that she should not do she did
[TS]
01:00:40
◼
►
a thing that she was not supposed to do
[TS]
01:00:41
◼
►
that was against the rules that
[TS]
01:00:43
◼
►
encourages penalty and then she received
[TS]
01:00:45
◼
►
that penalty I don't see what the
[TS]
01:00:46
◼
►
problem is I think that viewer I think
[TS]
01:00:49
◼
►
we could fairly describe them as a rules
[TS]
01:00:50
◼
►
hero that's what that person is right
[TS]
01:00:53
◼
►
they're calling in doing their civic
[TS]
01:00:55
◼
►
duty right doing a thing that actually
[TS]
01:00:57
◼
►
has an effect in the world enforcing the
[TS]
01:01:00
◼
►
rules and taking someone who would have
[TS]
01:01:03
◼
►
I think again we can objectively say
[TS]
01:01:04
◼
►
stolen a place in the playoff from
[TS]
01:01:10
◼
►
somebody else
[TS]
01:01:11
◼
►
and giving it to the person who actually
[TS]
01:01:13
◼
►
won so I see no problem with this I
[TS]
01:01:15
◼
►
think this is great okay all right I
[TS]
01:01:18
◼
►
mean I also think part of roles need to
[TS]
01:01:21
◼
►
be who has the power to enforce the
[TS]
01:01:23
◼
►
rules and I think you have to draw lines
[TS]
01:01:25
◼
►
like the infringement has to be seen by
[TS]
01:01:28
◼
►
the right person but is that is that
[TS]
01:01:30
◼
►
part of the rules it doesn't sound like
[TS]
01:01:32
◼
►
that was part of the rules I also think
[TS]
01:01:33
◼
►
they need to be Lions drawed like are we
[TS]
01:01:35
◼
►
gonna start going through like footage
[TS]
01:01:37
◼
►
from the 1950s and finding times where
[TS]
01:01:40
◼
►
people broke rules and start like
[TS]
01:01:42
◼
►
reallocating scores and trophies like
[TS]
01:01:44
◼
►
back through the ages I would do that I
[TS]
01:01:46
◼
►
would happily do that I would take a
[TS]
01:01:48
◼
►
gold medal out of a retired Olympians
[TS]
01:01:51
◼
►
hand and give it to the deserved winner
[TS]
01:01:53
◼
►
and I would feel good doing all right
[TS]
01:01:55
◼
►
right I would feel like I was writing an
[TS]
01:01:57
◼
►
injustice in the universe yeah they're
[TS]
01:01:59
◼
►
holding on to it with like their
[TS]
01:02:00
◼
►
decrepit old claw like no this is the
[TS]
01:02:02
◼
►
most meaningful thing I've ever done and
[TS]
01:02:03
◼
►
it's like no you didn't do it somebody
[TS]
01:02:06
◼
►
else did it
[TS]
01:02:06
◼
►
give me that trophy and hand it to the
[TS]
01:02:08
◼
►
actual winner and think about the joy in
[TS]
01:02:10
◼
►
the real winners eyes so I feel like
[TS]
01:02:13
◼
►
that person was a hero at home my little
[TS]
01:02:15
◼
►
asterisk is there's something that
[TS]
01:02:16
◼
►
sounds like the second to stroke penalty
[TS]
01:02:18
◼
►
sounds a bit like I don't understand the
[TS]
01:02:20
◼
►
interpretation of the rules here I
[TS]
01:02:22
◼
►
tiredly that one pisses me off more than
[TS]
01:02:24
◼
►
anything that one I feel like we need to
[TS]
01:02:26
◼
►
go to the rule book on that one I think
[TS]
01:02:27
◼
►
I could be persuaded that that is like
[TS]
01:02:29
◼
►
an overly harsh interpretation of how
[TS]
01:02:31
◼
►
this is supposed to happen
[TS]
01:02:32
◼
►
yeah because presumably that is like
[TS]
01:02:34
◼
►
knowingly signing a wrong card there is
[TS]
01:02:38
◼
►
something about that one that doesn't
[TS]
01:02:39
◼
►
quite sit right with me but if she
[TS]
01:02:40
◼
►
didn't put the ball back down where it
[TS]
01:02:42
◼
►
was supposed to go it's like hey this is
[TS]
01:02:43
◼
►
your job you're supposed to put the ball
[TS]
01:02:45
◼
►
back down in that spot and I don't even
[TS]
01:02:47
◼
►
have a problem with the fact that
[TS]
01:02:48
◼
►
they're being filmed more like I
[TS]
01:02:50
◼
►
obviously everyone should be filmed all
[TS]
01:02:51
◼
►
the time but if the leader is being
[TS]
01:02:53
◼
►
filmed more than someone in the behind
[TS]
01:02:56
◼
►
areas it's like well this is just like
[TS]
01:02:58
◼
►
the robber in Settlers of Catan right
[TS]
01:03:01
◼
►
it's like a Hubble the leader effect and
[TS]
01:03:02
◼
►
this is just what happens in this sport
[TS]
01:03:04
◼
►
okay I'm okay with all of this all right
[TS]
01:03:07
◼
►
I'm glad I brought it up I'm glad you've
[TS]
01:03:09
◼
►
cast a different light on the argument I
[TS]
01:03:11
◼
►
mean do you disagree though do you think
[TS]
01:03:14
◼
►
the tattle tale at home shouldn't have
[TS]
01:03:15
◼
►
called in they should have just kept it
[TS]
01:03:17
◼
►
- well I'm not saying they shouldn't
[TS]
01:03:18
◼
►
have called it you can't stop people
[TS]
01:03:20
◼
►
call again if they feel guilty for the
[TS]
01:03:22
◼
►
rest of their lives for not writing this
[TS]
01:03:23
◼
►
injustice but I do think is a wrong
[TS]
01:03:26
◼
►
decision I don't think like the
[TS]
01:03:29
◼
►
arbitrariness of people at home who
[TS]
01:03:32
◼
►
calls in and who doesn't the decisions
[TS]
01:03:34
◼
►
have to be made by the decision makers
[TS]
01:03:35
◼
►
and I don't think people at home should
[TS]
01:03:37
◼
►
be acting as chair referees I don't
[TS]
01:03:41
◼
►
think it's right I'm also fine with
[TS]
01:03:43
◼
►
having a rule that says at the end of
[TS]
01:03:47
◼
►
the day whatever happened becomes the
[TS]
01:03:50
◼
►
unchangeable score like you can make
[TS]
01:03:52
◼
►
that part of the sport and just have
[TS]
01:03:53
◼
►
that be set down like hey listen we're
[TS]
01:03:55
◼
►
not going to adjudicate this overtime so
[TS]
01:03:57
◼
►
that in 50 years CGP grey can come along
[TS]
01:04:00
◼
►
and steal gold medals away from our
[TS]
01:04:01
◼
►
winners and give them to other people
[TS]
01:04:02
◼
►
right you can make that part of the
[TS]
01:04:04
◼
►
process but it sounds like this wasn't
[TS]
01:04:06
◼
►
part of the process for the Masters I
[TS]
01:04:08
◼
►
mean I agree with like you know drug
[TS]
01:04:09
◼
►
cheats and things like that
[TS]
01:04:10
◼
►
losing medals ripped respectively but I
[TS]
01:04:13
◼
►
do think this was wrong and that extra
[TS]
01:04:16
◼
►
two shots for signing the incorrect
[TS]
01:04:17
◼
►
scorecard which even you seem to grasp
[TS]
01:04:19
◼
►
as being a bit weird did cost her the
[TS]
01:04:21
◼
►
tournament she would have won if it
[TS]
01:04:23
◼
►
wasn't for that even though anyway see I
[TS]
01:04:26
◼
►
thought I
[TS]
01:04:27
◼
►
one that was half interesting to you
[TS]
01:04:29
◼
►
this episode of hello Internet is
[TS]
01:04:31
◼
►
brought to you in part by audible
[TS]
01:04:33
◼
►
audible is a leading provider of premium
[TS]
01:04:36
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digital spoken audio information and
[TS]
01:04:38
◼
►
entertainment on the Internet
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01:04:40
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aka it's the place you should get your
[TS]
01:04:43
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►
audiobooks from you can get a free audio
[TS]
01:04:46
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book with a 30-day trial at audible.com
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01:04:49
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hello internet that's where you should
[TS]
01:04:51
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►
go right now audible.com slash hello
[TS]
01:04:54
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Internet to get a free audio book with
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01:04:57
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your 30-day trial now audible as always
[TS]
01:04:59
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likes for us to recommend a book and
[TS]
01:05:01
◼
►
I've been making a really concerted
[TS]
01:05:03
◼
►
effort to try to read more and not just
[TS]
01:05:06
◼
►
read more but also read differently so I
[TS]
01:05:09
◼
►
recently read a book that was a little
[TS]
01:05:11
◼
►
bit out of the normal kind of thing that
[TS]
01:05:13
◼
►
I would pick up but that I can highly
[TS]
01:05:15
◼
►
recommend and it's tribe by Sebastian
[TS]
01:05:18
◼
►
Junger he's the same guy who wrote a
[TS]
01:05:20
◼
►
perfect storm if you ever read that it's
[TS]
01:05:23
◼
►
a little bit of a difficult book to
[TS]
01:05:24
◼
►
describe but I can briefly say that it
[TS]
01:05:26
◼
►
is a little bit about people in war
[TS]
01:05:29
◼
►
particularly men in war and how that
[TS]
01:05:32
◼
►
affects them it talks about some of the
[TS]
01:05:34
◼
►
difficult things like why is it that
[TS]
01:05:36
◼
►
some soldiers really find solace in
[TS]
01:05:39
◼
►
being in a group in war and why they can
[TS]
01:05:41
◼
►
have difficulty reintegrating into
[TS]
01:05:43
◼
►
society afterwards that makes the book
[TS]
01:05:46
◼
►
sound like it's a huge downer but I
[TS]
01:05:47
◼
►
actually found it a fascinating non
[TS]
01:05:50
◼
►
downer read and it's also very short
[TS]
01:05:53
◼
►
which is the thing that I really
[TS]
01:05:54
◼
►
appreciate in books sometimes so if
[TS]
01:05:56
◼
►
you're looking for a book to try maybe
[TS]
01:05:58
◼
►
something that's a little bit different
[TS]
01:05:59
◼
►
than what you would normally do give
[TS]
01:06:01
◼
►
tribe a try on audible.com so if you
[TS]
01:06:05
◼
►
want to listen to it audible has it with
[TS]
01:06:07
◼
►
an unmatched selection of audio books
[TS]
01:06:09
◼
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original audio shows which is something
[TS]
01:06:11
◼
►
that they have started now News comedy
[TS]
01:06:14
◼
►
and more you'll always find what you're
[TS]
01:06:16
◼
►
looking for once again get your free
[TS]
01:06:19
◼
►
audio book with a 30-day trial today by
[TS]
01:06:21
◼
►
signing up at audible.com slash hello
[TS]
01:06:25
◼
►
Internet that's a UD IB le com slash
[TS]
01:06:29
◼
►
hello Internet
[TS]
01:06:30
◼
►
alright so the next thing we're going to
[TS]
01:06:33
◼
►
try to talk about is the news coverage
[TS]
01:06:36
◼
►
that has surrounded YouTube advertising
[TS]
01:06:38
◼
►
and a subsequent boycott and all this
[TS]
01:06:40
◼
►
lot of stuff now gray and I have tried
[TS]
01:06:44
◼
►
to discuss this a couple of times before
[TS]
01:06:45
◼
►
one of them made it to the show but
[TS]
01:06:47
◼
►
we've also tried other times and we've
[TS]
01:06:49
◼
►
gotten a bit hot and bothered talking
[TS]
01:06:51
◼
►
about it because it always tends to veer
[TS]
01:06:53
◼
►
into a discussion about our conflicting
[TS]
01:06:55
◼
►
views on journalism and news coverage
[TS]
01:06:57
◼
►
and we've just thought that didn't go to
[TS]
01:07:00
◼
►
and we've cut it from the show but we're
[TS]
01:07:02
◼
►
going to try again and we've also just
[TS]
01:07:03
◼
►
had a few conversations in person which
[TS]
01:07:05
◼
►
we were any good recording but like we
[TS]
01:07:06
◼
►
get caught in the vortex yeah of this
[TS]
01:07:09
◼
►
topic so if this conversation seems a
[TS]
01:07:11
◼
►
little strange listeners if it's made it
[TS]
01:07:13
◼
►
into the show just keep that in mind
[TS]
01:07:14
◼
►
this is like the fifth time
[TS]
01:07:16
◼
►
Brady and I are actually going to talk
[TS]
01:07:18
◼
►
about Fitz so go so I've tried something
[TS]
01:07:22
◼
►
a bit different because I can never make
[TS]
01:07:25
◼
►
my points and I sort of I get confused
[TS]
01:07:28
◼
►
and heated and then we start putting
[TS]
01:07:30
◼
►
each other off and going down rabbit
[TS]
01:07:32
◼
►
holes so I've done is I've written like
[TS]
01:07:34
◼
►
a statement or like an open letter I
[TS]
01:07:37
◼
►
think that's it I cannot believe that
[TS]
01:07:39
◼
►
you have done this I find this hilarious
[TS]
01:07:41
◼
►
but I also feel like if I had known that
[TS]
01:07:43
◼
►
you were really gonna write like an
[TS]
01:07:45
◼
►
opening statement I should have written
[TS]
01:07:47
◼
►
opening statement too right and now
[TS]
01:07:49
◼
►
suddenly we're in court and I feel like
[TS]
01:07:51
◼
►
I'm at a terrible disadvantage because
[TS]
01:07:53
◼
►
you were coming to the table with a
[TS]
01:07:54
◼
►
prepared statement and I feel like I'm
[TS]
01:07:56
◼
►
walking up to the bench like no your
[TS]
01:07:58
◼
►
honor I'm just defending myself
[TS]
01:07:59
◼
►
I have no preparations I've got no
[TS]
01:08:01
◼
►
papers with me and you're over there
[TS]
01:08:03
◼
►
with a team of lawyers right and you're
[TS]
01:08:05
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already you're like no we're gonna fight
[TS]
01:08:07
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this so yeah well if it's any
[TS]
01:08:09
◼
►
consolation great it's not like a
[TS]
01:08:10
◼
►
crafted document I did just
[TS]
01:08:12
◼
►
hunt-and-peck this an hour before the
[TS]
01:08:13
◼
►
show okay so it's a little bit rough
[TS]
01:08:16
◼
►
around the edges you would like to enter
[TS]
01:08:18
◼
►
a statement into the record yeah and the
[TS]
01:08:21
◼
►
reason is not because I want to have
[TS]
01:08:23
◼
►
another like argument about the media
[TS]
01:08:26
◼
►
but when we start talking about what
[TS]
01:08:28
◼
►
we're going to talk about which is you
[TS]
01:08:31
◼
►
know YouTube advertising and media
[TS]
01:08:32
◼
►
coverage around ER I have criticisms to
[TS]
01:08:34
◼
►
make of them of the media like yeah okay
[TS]
01:08:36
◼
►
but I don't want to have to keep like
[TS]
01:08:38
◼
►
adding little addendums or little
[TS]
01:08:40
◼
►
qualifications and professing I want
[TS]
01:08:42
◼
►
people to know where I stand about
[TS]
01:08:44
◼
►
journalism and how it's different to you
[TS]
01:08:46
◼
►
because I think most people know where
[TS]
01:08:47
◼
►
you stand I mean most Rauh know where I
[TS]
01:08:48
◼
►
stand - but you're setting up that
[TS]
01:08:51
◼
►
framing because also you don't want me
[TS]
01:08:53
◼
►
to respond to your
[TS]
01:08:54
◼
►
opening statement right you just want to
[TS]
01:08:55
◼
►
read it and then you wanna move right
[TS]
01:08:57
◼
►
along I just keep my mouth shut I'm
[TS]
01:08:59
◼
►
worried if you're too clever in your
[TS]
01:09:01
◼
►
response we're just gonna have the same
[TS]
01:09:02
◼
►
old arguments but anyway I'll read this
[TS]
01:09:04
◼
►
and then you say whatever you are and
[TS]
01:09:05
◼
►
then we'll talk about what we're going
[TS]
01:09:07
◼
►
to talk about it's a little bit long
[TS]
01:09:09
◼
►
go right ahead sir enter your statement
[TS]
01:09:11
◼
►
into the record here we go Laura's yours
[TS]
01:09:13
◼
►
dear CGP grey haha no I didn't write
[TS]
01:09:17
◼
►
that okay alright I was like you can't
[TS]
01:09:19
◼
►
expect me not to say something if you're
[TS]
01:09:20
◼
►
opening it with great addressing it to
[TS]
01:09:22
◼
►
me okay I didn't say that they just kind
[TS]
01:09:23
◼
►
of addressed to you but it's sort of
[TS]
01:09:24
◼
►
neutral okay I want to say a few things
[TS]
01:09:27
◼
►
about news and journalism before we get
[TS]
01:09:30
◼
►
lost in the weeds this is because as you
[TS]
01:09:33
◼
►
know I get a little frustrated by some
[TS]
01:09:35
◼
►
attitudes to news reporting I'll preface
[TS]
01:09:38
◼
►
all this by saying I'm aware we probably
[TS]
01:09:41
◼
►
agree on more things than we disagree on
[TS]
01:09:43
◼
►
and not everything I'm about to say
[TS]
01:09:45
◼
►
necessarily reflects your views it's
[TS]
01:09:48
◼
►
more general than that so please don't
[TS]
01:09:50
◼
►
think I'm putting words in your mouth
[TS]
01:09:51
◼
►
I'll also try not to use the word media
[TS]
01:09:55
◼
►
too often because that's so nebulous
[TS]
01:09:58
◼
►
that it seems to confuse matters I'll
[TS]
01:09:59
◼
►
opt instead for journalism and reporting
[TS]
01:10:03
◼
►
but let me start by making mention of my
[TS]
01:10:06
◼
►
nephew he's 19 years old he's a good lad
[TS]
01:10:08
◼
►
but he has never read a book not one he
[TS]
01:10:12
◼
►
claims he thinks they're boring and
[TS]
01:10:14
◼
►
reckons he can get everything he needs
[TS]
01:10:16
◼
►
from other sources mainly YouTube and
[TS]
01:10:19
◼
►
snapchat it seems I can understand this
[TS]
01:10:22
◼
►
why would anyone do anything they find
[TS]
01:10:24
◼
►
boring I guess I could argue that
[TS]
01:10:26
◼
►
exercise is boring eating healthy
[TS]
01:10:29
◼
►
vegetables is boring that we do some
[TS]
01:10:31
◼
►
things for our own well-being that
[TS]
01:10:33
◼
►
reading a book could be the intellectual
[TS]
01:10:35
◼
►
equivalent of a session at the gym but
[TS]
01:10:38
◼
►
as I'm someone who doesn't eat very
[TS]
01:10:39
◼
►
healthily or exercise enough that might
[TS]
01:10:41
◼
►
be a bit rich and it does sound kind of
[TS]
01:10:43
◼
►
lame anyway so why do I even mention my
[TS]
01:10:46
◼
►
nephews refusal to read books because
[TS]
01:10:48
◼
►
the emotion it incites in me is so
[TS]
01:10:51
◼
►
similar to the emotion I feel about
[TS]
01:10:53
◼
►
people who willfully ignore the news
[TS]
01:10:55
◼
►
while their reasons and motives are
[TS]
01:10:58
◼
►
different I think this kind of willful
[TS]
01:11:00
◼
►
ignorance and an accompanying
[TS]
01:11:02
◼
►
broad-brush generalization that so often
[TS]
01:11:05
◼
►
goes with it really frustrates me
[TS]
01:11:07
◼
►
so let's deal with the reasons I think
[TS]
01:11:09
◼
►
we should pay at least some attention to
[TS]
01:11:12
◼
►
news to journalism to reporting on
[TS]
01:11:14
◼
►
events that are happening in our
[TS]
01:11:16
◼
►
communities and the wider world
[TS]
01:11:17
◼
►
the first reason I think is just being a
[TS]
01:11:21
◼
►
good caring empathetic citizen most of
[TS]
01:11:25
◼
►
us live on a road or community with a
[TS]
01:11:27
◼
►
few dozen people a city or a town with
[TS]
01:11:30
◼
►
hundreds of thousands of other people a
[TS]
01:11:31
◼
►
planet with seven billion other people
[TS]
01:11:34
◼
►
now you may not be directly affected by
[TS]
01:11:37
◼
►
their hardships their struggles the
[TS]
01:11:39
◼
►
events in their lives but I think it is
[TS]
01:11:41
◼
►
part of the human experience to know
[TS]
01:11:43
◼
►
about and share some of this yes it can
[TS]
01:11:46
◼
►
be overwhelming and we can't possibly
[TS]
01:11:48
◼
►
take it all in but slamming the door on
[TS]
01:11:50
◼
►
their plots because we don't care or it
[TS]
01:11:53
◼
►
makes us feel bad while we're eating our
[TS]
01:11:54
◼
►
evening dinner is a sad state of affairs
[TS]
01:11:57
◼
►
I really think this is the most
[TS]
01:12:00
◼
►
important reason of all to have some
[TS]
01:12:02
◼
►
awareness of news because there are
[TS]
01:12:03
◼
►
fellow men and women and we should care
[TS]
01:12:05
◼
►
about them we should care about what
[TS]
01:12:07
◼
►
they care about
[TS]
01:12:08
◼
►
I think it's selfish and it's not the
[TS]
01:12:10
◼
►
kind of person I want to be to only care
[TS]
01:12:13
◼
►
about things that directly affect me by
[TS]
01:12:16
◼
►
the way and I guess this applies to
[TS]
01:12:17
◼
►
people who are a bit more social but I
[TS]
01:12:19
◼
►
also think it's just good practice to
[TS]
01:12:21
◼
►
know about the two or three biggest
[TS]
01:12:22
◼
►
things that are going on at a given time
[TS]
01:12:24
◼
►
just for like social reasons just to
[TS]
01:12:27
◼
►
show you're a person who's aware of the
[TS]
01:12:28
◼
►
bigger picture in your town or your
[TS]
01:12:30
◼
►
country or on the planet just so you're
[TS]
01:12:32
◼
►
not the guy or the girl the watercooler
[TS]
01:12:34
◼
►
who doesn't know that London Bridge is
[TS]
01:12:36
◼
►
falling down but another more important
[TS]
01:12:38
◼
►
reason I think we need to pay attention
[TS]
01:12:40
◼
►
to journalism is because a well informed
[TS]
01:12:42
◼
►
citizenry is pretty important to the way
[TS]
01:12:44
◼
►
people in power can exploit us knowing
[TS]
01:12:47
◼
►
what governments are doing what
[TS]
01:12:49
◼
►
political leaders are doing what courts
[TS]
01:12:51
◼
►
are doing what the police are doing what
[TS]
01:12:53
◼
►
big business is doing the Fourth Estate
[TS]
01:12:55
◼
►
our reporters play a key role in this
[TS]
01:12:58
◼
►
accountability public opinion is very
[TS]
01:13:01
◼
►
important to people in power whether
[TS]
01:13:02
◼
►
it's polls elections or consumer habits
[TS]
01:13:05
◼
►
and I think it's important that public
[TS]
01:13:07
◼
►
opinion is based on factual information
[TS]
01:13:08
◼
►
not misinformation or no information
[TS]
01:13:12
◼
►
where that factual information will come
[TS]
01:13:14
◼
►
from if not from journalists is
[TS]
01:13:16
◼
►
something I don't know it certainly
[TS]
01:13:18
◼
►
won't come from the governments and
[TS]
01:13:19
◼
►
businesses themselves
[TS]
01:13:21
◼
►
and I can't see anything in the world of
[TS]
01:13:23
◼
►
social media taking the place of
[TS]
01:13:25
◼
►
old-fashioned journalism if anything
[TS]
01:13:27
◼
►
much of what I see happening on social
[TS]
01:13:29
◼
►
media seems to be a step in the wrong
[TS]
01:13:30
◼
►
direction now clearly this is where
[TS]
01:13:33
◼
►
someone listening might be thinking well
[TS]
01:13:35
◼
►
journalists hardly do a good job
[TS]
01:13:37
◼
►
providing useful or factual information
[TS]
01:13:38
◼
►
and yes I was once a traditional
[TS]
01:13:42
◼
►
newspaper and TV journalists and have
[TS]
01:13:43
◼
►
some skin in this game but I think this
[TS]
01:13:46
◼
►
blanket dismissal of journalists and
[TS]
01:13:48
◼
►
large media organizations is silly just
[TS]
01:13:51
◼
►
as silly as my nephew arguing that all
[TS]
01:13:53
◼
►
books are boring or saying that all
[TS]
01:13:54
◼
►
YouTube videos are frivolous or all
[TS]
01:13:57
◼
►
politicians are corrupt etc etc yes
[TS]
01:14:00
◼
►
there are bad journalists and bad media
[TS]
01:14:02
◼
►
organizations citing the examples of
[TS]
01:14:04
◼
►
certain rolling news channels or some of
[TS]
01:14:07
◼
►
Britain's scummiest tabloid newspapers
[TS]
01:14:09
◼
►
are easy pickings but there are also a
[TS]
01:14:11
◼
►
lot of good journalists a lot of good
[TS]
01:14:13
◼
►
newspapers good news websites good TV
[TS]
01:14:16
◼
►
news programs yes even the good ones
[TS]
01:14:19
◼
►
have their faults and they should be
[TS]
01:14:21
◼
►
held to account for their misdeeds but
[TS]
01:14:23
◼
►
this dismissal of journalism because of
[TS]
01:14:25
◼
►
those easy targets is well lazy now I'm
[TS]
01:14:29
◼
►
not saying that we all have the same
[TS]
01:14:31
◼
►
appetite for news that we should all sit
[TS]
01:14:33
◼
►
around and consume news for hours each
[TS]
01:14:34
◼
►
day I'd even argue that my own news
[TS]
01:14:37
◼
►
appetite is quite low much of the time I
[TS]
01:14:39
◼
►
really only skim a newspaper for 5 to 10
[TS]
01:14:42
◼
►
minutes over my breakfast and maybe dip
[TS]
01:14:44
◼
►
into a website in a quiet moment just to
[TS]
01:14:46
◼
►
see what the few top stories are I'm
[TS]
01:14:49
◼
►
also not recommending what sources of
[TS]
01:14:50
◼
►
news and individuals should use everyone
[TS]
01:14:52
◼
►
has their own preferences trusted
[TS]
01:14:54
◼
►
sources and stylistic preferences but I
[TS]
01:14:57
◼
►
think a willful decision to avoid news
[TS]
01:14:59
◼
►
is unhealthy
[TS]
01:15:00
◼
►
it's a fast-tracked uninformed citizens
[TS]
01:15:03
◼
►
who care about no one but themselves and
[TS]
01:15:05
◼
►
see the world only through the prism of
[TS]
01:15:07
◼
►
the Select people they've decided to
[TS]
01:15:09
◼
►
follow on Twitter and Facebook or which
[TS]
01:15:11
◼
►
subreddit silos they've decided suit
[TS]
01:15:13
◼
►
them best it results in public opinions
[TS]
01:15:16
◼
►
and beliefs maybe even elections being
[TS]
01:15:19
◼
►
decided by people who are ignorant
[TS]
01:15:21
◼
►
now journalists are easy punching bags
[TS]
01:15:23
◼
►
like politicians I guess and they do not
[TS]
01:15:25
◼
►
deserve a free pass there are some very
[TS]
01:15:27
◼
►
good ones some very bad ones and lots of
[TS]
01:15:30
◼
►
just average ones they're also employed
[TS]
01:15:33
◼
►
by organizations with conflicted in
[TS]
01:15:35
◼
►
interests barrows to push this can color
[TS]
01:15:37
◼
►
their coverage from time to time and we
[TS]
01:15:39
◼
►
need to see this I've certainly picked
[TS]
01:15:41
◼
►
on journalists plenty of times here in
[TS]
01:15:43
◼
►
hello Internet there are frequent source
[TS]
01:15:44
◼
►
of my paper cuts but I think the role of
[TS]
01:15:47
◼
►
the Fourth Estate is important ignoring
[TS]
01:15:50
◼
►
them to the point of extinction is a sad
[TS]
01:15:52
◼
►
situation and I don't know what the
[TS]
01:15:54
◼
►
world will look like without a free
[TS]
01:15:55
◼
►
media my last point is this and I can
[TS]
01:15:59
◼
►
never expect someone like you gray to
[TS]
01:16:01
◼
►
change your mind and suddenly become
[TS]
01:16:03
◼
►
someone who consumes news anymore than I
[TS]
01:16:05
◼
►
can expect my nephew to suddenly start
[TS]
01:16:07
◼
►
reading books or me to start eating
[TS]
01:16:09
◼
►
salads but influential people dismissing
[TS]
01:16:12
◼
►
the merits of the press even indirectly
[TS]
01:16:14
◼
►
by being a little too proud of an
[TS]
01:16:16
◼
►
information light diet worries me we now
[TS]
01:16:19
◼
►
live in a world where numerous people in
[TS]
01:16:21
◼
►
positions of power have made it their
[TS]
01:16:23
◼
►
modus operandi to discredit and
[TS]
01:16:25
◼
►
undermine trust in the media because
[TS]
01:16:27
◼
►
this suits their own agendas it's
[TS]
01:16:29
◼
►
reached almost farcical proportions the
[TS]
01:16:32
◼
►
way some people assume every utterance
[TS]
01:16:34
◼
►
on TV or every word in the newspaper is
[TS]
01:16:36
◼
►
a lie journalism is certainly at a
[TS]
01:16:39
◼
►
crossroads and it's a messy problem
[TS]
01:16:41
◼
►
involving changing technology shifts and
[TS]
01:16:43
◼
►
advertising and a strange political
[TS]
01:16:45
◼
►
climate at the moment I don't think it's
[TS]
01:16:48
◼
►
necessarily our job to advocate
[TS]
01:16:50
◼
►
subsidized or save journalism it has
[TS]
01:16:53
◼
►
evolved as a business and maybe that's
[TS]
01:16:54
◼
►
how it would die but I do feel like
[TS]
01:16:57
◼
►
there's a little more to the role of
[TS]
01:16:58
◼
►
journalists than just filling the gaps
[TS]
01:17:00
◼
►
between advertising and as my buddy here
[TS]
01:17:02
◼
►
on the podcast is known for being a
[TS]
01:17:04
◼
►
little disparaging towards the media I
[TS]
01:17:06
◼
►
wanted to have my say too to say that I
[TS]
01:17:09
◼
►
think it's a good thing anyway now I've
[TS]
01:17:11
◼
►
said all this I would like to get on
[TS]
01:17:13
◼
►
with the show and give a kicking to The
[TS]
01:17:15
◼
►
Times of London your opening statement
[TS]
01:17:18
◼
►
has been entered into the record reading
[TS]
01:17:19
◼
►
obviously there are many points that I
[TS]
01:17:23
◼
►
would choose to disagree with of course
[TS]
01:17:25
◼
►
but I was intentionally keeping my hands
[TS]
01:17:27
◼
►
out the keyboard and not making a
[TS]
01:17:29
◼
►
point-by-point analysis or noting the
[TS]
01:17:32
◼
►
points where I feel like you're
[TS]
01:17:33
◼
►
conflating two different issues I will
[TS]
01:17:35
◼
►
ask you one question which you might not
[TS]
01:17:37
◼
►
want to answer okay but I'm sort of
[TS]
01:17:39
◼
►
curious about with regards to that
[TS]
01:17:41
◼
►
statement let's say a listener to the
[TS]
01:17:43
◼
►
podcast had at some point followed my
[TS]
01:17:49
◼
►
and had stopped following the news and
[TS]
01:17:52
◼
►
was moved by your opening statements to
[TS]
01:17:56
◼
►
come back into the world of news hmm
[TS]
01:17:59
◼
►
where do you think they should start
[TS]
01:18:04
◼
►
with that because I do find it
[TS]
01:18:07
◼
►
interesting that you don't want to
[TS]
01:18:09
◼
►
mention any particular source and I can
[TS]
01:18:11
◼
►
understand very many reasons why you
[TS]
01:18:14
◼
►
might not want to do that yeah but I
[TS]
01:18:17
◼
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feel like that comes to a particular
[TS]
01:18:19
◼
►
feeling that I have sometimes of where
[TS]
01:18:23
◼
►
do you think they should go if they are
[TS]
01:18:27
◼
►
moved by your statement yeah I mean the
[TS]
01:18:29
◼
►
reason that I would answer that is
[TS]
01:18:31
◼
►
because I don't want to get into that
[TS]
01:18:32
◼
►
kind of mix in a way I think it's
[TS]
01:18:34
◼
►
different for everyone I would say there
[TS]
01:18:37
◼
►
are certain newspapers I guess that some
[TS]
01:18:39
◼
►
people refer to as papers of record
[TS]
01:18:41
◼
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which of newspapers which supposedly are
[TS]
01:18:43
◼
►
a little bit less politically biased
[TS]
01:18:45
◼
►
which are hard to find in the UK but you
[TS]
01:18:48
◼
►
know that they're around so I would say
[TS]
01:18:49
◼
►
maybe you know newspapers are websites
[TS]
01:18:52
◼
►
that have less of a political agenda I
[TS]
01:18:55
◼
►
guess is one thing I could maybe suggest
[TS]
01:18:58
◼
►
but I think there are lots of options I
[TS]
01:19:01
◼
►
don't want to start recommending it
[TS]
01:19:02
◼
►
because I think this is what we do we'll
[TS]
01:19:03
◼
►
get lost in the weeds and we can find
[TS]
01:19:06
◼
►
examples of where people have much
[TS]
01:19:07
◼
►
things up and I think people need to
[TS]
01:19:09
◼
►
find their own way and their own sources
[TS]
01:19:11
◼
►
I'm genuinely I am not trying to trick
[TS]
01:19:14
◼
►
you here I know you know I'm not trying
[TS]
01:19:15
◼
►
to get you to name a name and then up
[TS]
01:19:17
◼
►
and then I'll point to a story that I
[TS]
01:19:18
◼
►
thought was terrible that they did yeah
[TS]
01:19:20
◼
►
what I'm trying to get at here is that I
[TS]
01:19:22
◼
►
think this is a vastly more difficult
[TS]
01:19:26
◼
►
task than it sounds when you say
[TS]
01:19:29
◼
►
something like oh people should read a
[TS]
01:19:31
◼
►
newspaper of record because for someone
[TS]
01:19:34
◼
►
like me like that doesn't necessarily
[TS]
01:19:35
◼
►
mean anything like I don't know which
[TS]
01:19:37
◼
►
papers you you mean by that
[TS]
01:19:39
◼
►
and again I understand why you don't
[TS]
01:19:42
◼
►
want to recommend something in
[TS]
01:19:43
◼
►
particular I'm imagining someone who may
[TS]
01:19:47
◼
►
have taken my advice in the past to
[TS]
01:19:48
◼
►
disengage from the news cycle who was
[TS]
01:19:50
◼
►
looking for a reentry point and I just
[TS]
01:19:52
◼
►
wanted to know if you had a particular
[TS]
01:19:53
◼
►
place that you would recommend that they
[TS]
01:19:55
◼
►
start I have an answer for than if you
[TS]
01:19:57
◼
►
don't want to give one I'm just curious
[TS]
01:19:59
◼
►
as to your feelings on that
[TS]
01:20:01
◼
►
I feel like I don't want to have that
[TS]
01:20:02
◼
►
discussion today on it which is a nice
[TS]
01:20:04
◼
►
bit of a cop-out I feel like you know
[TS]
01:20:05
◼
►
you gave me a lot latitude you let me
[TS]
01:20:07
◼
►
have my say and you didn't slap down
[TS]
01:20:09
◼
►
things you disagree with and for me to
[TS]
01:20:11
◼
►
now like go further and start going into
[TS]
01:20:13
◼
►
the weeds that I was trying to avoid
[TS]
01:20:14
◼
►
would be a bad idea but I do think you
[TS]
01:20:17
◼
►
should tell people what your advice is
[TS]
01:20:18
◼
►
no people are gonna know right I'm gonna
[TS]
01:20:20
◼
►
recommend they read The Economist right
[TS]
01:20:22
◼
►
because when we had a now long ago
[TS]
01:20:25
◼
►
deleted conversation the news yeah I
[TS]
01:20:29
◼
►
don't really follow the news but we do
[TS]
01:20:31
◼
►
have a subscription to The Economist in
[TS]
01:20:32
◼
►
my house and as I've mentioned before my
[TS]
01:20:34
◼
►
wife reads The Economist and she often
[TS]
01:20:35
◼
►
recommends articles to me out of it yeah
[TS]
01:20:37
◼
►
and I did on a couple of Sundays just
[TS]
01:20:39
◼
►
make an effort to say like oh I'm gonna
[TS]
01:20:40
◼
►
just read The Economist again just a
[TS]
01:20:43
◼
►
little bit more than I normally would
[TS]
01:20:44
◼
►
just picking it up and going through and
[TS]
01:20:46
◼
►
and it can just reconfirm to me that
[TS]
01:20:47
◼
►
like as a person who does not have
[TS]
01:20:50
◼
►
interest in following the news who would
[TS]
01:20:54
◼
►
argue that on an individual basis it
[TS]
01:20:55
◼
►
might not be the best thing for a person
[TS]
01:20:57
◼
►
to do I do think that the Economist is a
[TS]
01:20:59
◼
►
pretty great job of reporting on stuff
[TS]
01:21:02
◼
►
in a way that is accessible for someone
[TS]
01:21:06
◼
►
who doesn't necessarily have background
[TS]
01:21:08
◼
►
information I think I've mentioned
[TS]
01:21:10
◼
►
previous on the podcast but one thing I
[TS]
01:21:11
◼
►
do love is their style guide is to
[TS]
01:21:14
◼
►
always write articles assuming that a
[TS]
01:21:16
◼
►
person has essentially no background so
[TS]
01:21:18
◼
►
they always explain what everything is
[TS]
01:21:19
◼
►
you never feel like you're lost and I
[TS]
01:21:21
◼
►
feel like they do a pretty good job of
[TS]
01:21:22
◼
►
hitting things down the middle and in my
[TS]
01:21:25
◼
►
own research anyway I have yet to come
[TS]
01:21:26
◼
►
across any major howlers in the
[TS]
01:21:29
◼
►
Economist in the way they report things
[TS]
01:21:31
◼
►
unlike just about every other place I've
[TS]
01:21:33
◼
►
ever gone where it's like oh this really
[TS]
01:21:35
◼
►
interesting story when you dig into it
[TS]
01:21:36
◼
►
turns out to be entirely misrepresented
[TS]
01:21:39
◼
►
so if people are looking for a place to
[TS]
01:21:41
◼
►
enter the news I would recommend the
[TS]
01:21:43
◼
►
economists use offer code gray for no
[TS]
01:21:46
◼
►
discount at all because this isn't an ad
[TS]
01:21:48
◼
►
but you know telling gray sent you so
[TS]
01:21:52
◼
►
let's talk about the actual issue at
[TS]
01:21:54
◼
►
hand yeah so what we want to talk about
[TS]
01:21:56
◼
►
is this ongoing brouhaha that is related
[TS]
01:22:00
◼
►
to the news and is related to youtube
[TS]
01:22:02
◼
►
and advertising which was I think
[TS]
01:22:05
◼
►
started by the very article that you
[TS]
01:22:08
◼
►
first brought up on the podcast a couple
[TS]
01:22:10
◼
►
episodes ago which I foreshadowed is
[TS]
01:22:12
◼
►
becoming a big deal yeah
[TS]
01:22:14
◼
►
which is in the times was it yeah the
[TS]
01:22:16
◼
►
Times of London Times of London yeah no
[TS]
01:22:18
◼
►
I do just want to enter it on the record
[TS]
01:22:20
◼
►
that I had not read that article when we
[TS]
01:22:22
◼
►
were discussing it on the podcast it was
[TS]
01:22:24
◼
►
a bit of a surprise to me so I hadn't
[TS]
01:22:26
◼
►
gone through it and I think that
[TS]
01:22:28
◼
►
slightly coloured the conversation that
[TS]
01:22:30
◼
►
we had because I would have been vastly
[TS]
01:22:33
◼
►
more angry had I actually read it
[TS]
01:22:35
◼
►
because I think that article is a
[TS]
01:22:36
◼
►
perfect example of how news stories I
[TS]
01:22:39
◼
►
think sometimes intentionally
[TS]
01:22:42
◼
►
misrepresent situations but anyway
[TS]
01:22:45
◼
►
putting that aside so we don't get
[TS]
01:22:46
◼
►
sucked into the weeds hmm
[TS]
01:22:48
◼
►
The Times did an article describing how
[TS]
01:22:51
◼
►
on YouTube there are advertisements that
[TS]
01:22:55
◼
►
are shown against extremist content and
[TS]
01:22:58
◼
►
this has since snowballed into what I
[TS]
01:23:03
◼
►
think we can fairly described as a very
[TS]
01:23:05
◼
►
big problem
[TS]
01:23:06
◼
►
for YouTube there have been advertisers
[TS]
01:23:10
◼
►
big brand advertisers that have pulled
[TS]
01:23:12
◼
►
out from advertising on YouTube lots of
[TS]
01:23:15
◼
►
people can see it in the data event ad
[TS]
01:23:17
◼
►
rates on YouTube have gone down this is
[TS]
01:23:19
◼
►
actually something that I can see
[TS]
01:23:21
◼
►
directly in my own channel and on my own
[TS]
01:23:23
◼
►
video the most recent one that I put up
[TS]
01:23:25
◼
►
is at about 20 percent of the rate that
[TS]
01:23:28
◼
►
I would expect it to be under normal
[TS]
01:23:29
◼
►
circumstances some entire channels have
[TS]
01:23:32
◼
►
been demonetised or very close to being
[TS]
01:23:36
◼
►
demonetised for having advertiser
[TS]
01:23:37
◼
►
unfriendly content this has turned into
[TS]
01:23:40
◼
►
a very big brouhaha that YouTube seems
[TS]
01:23:45
◼
►
to be having a hard time getting out
[TS]
01:23:47
◼
►
from under and the newspapers seem to
[TS]
01:23:51
◼
►
keep liking to report on that sort of
[TS]
01:23:54
◼
►
this the state of the situation right
[TS]
01:23:56
◼
►
now would you say yes I think that's a
[TS]
01:23:58
◼
►
pretty fair summary okay I guess my more
[TS]
01:24:03
◼
►
emotional reaction to this and my
[TS]
01:24:06
◼
►
feeling about it is I am infuriated with
[TS]
01:24:09
◼
►
this whole topic because I view this as
[TS]
01:24:11
◼
►
a self-serving storm that the
[TS]
01:24:15
◼
►
traditional news industry is cooking up
[TS]
01:24:18
◼
►
that works tremendously in their favor
[TS]
01:24:21
◼
►
and that is essentially a total non
[TS]
01:24:24
◼
►
problem on YouTube
[TS]
01:24:26
◼
►
but that they can use to constantly hit
[TS]
01:24:30
◼
►
and berate YouTube over like the
[TS]
01:24:33
◼
►
question of the massive amount of
[TS]
01:24:35
◼
►
content that is uploaded to YouTube
[TS]
01:24:37
◼
►
there is always going to be something
[TS]
01:24:39
◼
►
that someone is able to point to as
[TS]
01:24:42
◼
►
objectionable that YouTube will not be
[TS]
01:24:45
◼
►
able to remove immediately I view this
[TS]
01:24:47
◼
►
as a kind of problem that is just
[TS]
01:24:50
◼
►
intrinsic to the medium and is never
[TS]
01:24:53
◼
►
going to go away but the scale of the
[TS]
01:24:58
◼
►
problem is never reported in these
[TS]
01:24:59
◼
►
stories so all of the examples I ever
[TS]
01:25:02
◼
►
see are examples on videos with very low
[TS]
01:25:06
◼
►
view numbers on channels that are
[TS]
01:25:08
◼
►
essentially not watched and these are
[TS]
01:25:10
◼
►
brought up as examples of oh look how
[TS]
01:25:13
◼
►
big companies like Pepsi are funding
[TS]
01:25:15
◼
►
terrorism through YouTube and there's
[TS]
01:25:17
◼
►
never any context of scale given to this
[TS]
01:25:20
◼
►
that's my frustration is when I when I
[TS]
01:25:22
◼
►
see these things it seems very much like
[TS]
01:25:24
◼
►
these stories are not intended to be
[TS]
01:25:27
◼
►
vehicles to well inform the public of
[TS]
01:25:30
◼
►
how the YouTube advertising system works
[TS]
01:25:33
◼
►
and how this process is happening and
[TS]
01:25:36
◼
►
how an advertisement might end up in
[TS]
01:25:38
◼
►
front of a video that it doesn't want to
[TS]
01:25:40
◼
►
be in front of there's no elucidation of
[TS]
01:25:42
◼
►
this it's just entirely presented as
[TS]
01:25:45
◼
►
like YouTube is facilitating the funding
[TS]
01:25:47
◼
►
of terrorism with big brand money and I
[TS]
01:25:51
◼
►
find that incredibly frustrating it is
[TS]
01:25:53
◼
►
frankly causing needless economic harm
[TS]
01:25:58
◼
►
irresponsibly I do you want me to start
[TS]
01:26:00
◼
►
with the parts where I disagree with you
[TS]
01:26:02
◼
►
or the parts where I agree with you
[TS]
01:26:04
◼
►
you start wherever you want man well
[TS]
01:26:07
◼
►
let's get the disagreements out of the
[TS]
01:26:09
◼
►
way I guess mmm first of all let's admit
[TS]
01:26:12
◼
►
we have a big conflict of interest here
[TS]
01:26:14
◼
►
you just said yourself you know we're
[TS]
01:26:16
◼
►
very affected by this so we need to bear
[TS]
01:26:19
◼
►
that in mind you know this is hitting us
[TS]
01:26:21
◼
►
in the hip pocket and obviously the
[TS]
01:26:24
◼
►
conflict of interest for the newspapers
[TS]
01:26:26
◼
►
starting with The Times which is owned
[TS]
01:26:28
◼
►
by Rupert Murdoch and you know it's been
[TS]
01:26:31
◼
►
picked up by lots of other papers now
[TS]
01:26:32
◼
►
who I think have seen the opportunity
[TS]
01:26:33
◼
►
this conflict is massive mm-hmm and I'm
[TS]
01:26:37
◼
►
finding it rather tiresome they flogged
[TS]
01:26:39
◼
►
the dead whore
[TS]
01:26:40
◼
►
way too hard to the point where I'm
[TS]
01:26:42
◼
►
thinking come on enough enough and also
[TS]
01:26:45
◼
►
I don't know you probably don't realize
[TS]
01:26:46
◼
►
this but in recent days it's now
[TS]
01:26:48
◼
►
switched to Facebook they've said gosh
[TS]
01:26:50
◼
►
that worked better than we thought and
[TS]
01:26:51
◼
►
now they're targeting Facebook and
[TS]
01:26:53
◼
►
they're looking for examples of you know
[TS]
01:26:54
◼
►
pedophiles on Facebook and all this
[TS]
01:26:56
◼
►
other stuff so that's really funny I
[TS]
01:26:57
◼
►
feel like shock surprise there because
[TS]
01:26:59
◼
►
it's like Google and Facebook or
[TS]
01:27:01
◼
►
something like 80 percent of all the
[TS]
01:27:03
◼
►
advertising money spent on the Internet
[TS]
01:27:05
◼
►
are spent on those two websites yeah I
[TS]
01:27:07
◼
►
was like oh you turned your attention to
[TS]
01:27:08
◼
►
Facebook yeah color me shocked nice oh
[TS]
01:27:11
◼
►
I'm a little jaded and cynical about it
[TS]
01:27:15
◼
►
and I'm also rather jaded and cynical by
[TS]
01:27:18
◼
►
how they keep referring to these
[TS]
01:27:20
◼
►
investigations they're doing I don't I
[TS]
01:27:23
◼
►
don't think they have done like an
[TS]
01:27:24
◼
►
undercover investigation
[TS]
01:27:25
◼
►
they probably used Google ironically but
[TS]
01:27:27
◼
►
they've just basically searched for
[TS]
01:27:29
◼
►
extremist content I mean anyone can do
[TS]
01:27:31
◼
►
this like this is not an investigation
[TS]
01:27:32
◼
►
they've just like done something that
[TS]
01:27:34
◼
►
any five-year-old could do in ten
[TS]
01:27:37
◼
►
minutes yes so like digging themselves
[TS]
01:27:39
◼
►
up as these like people who have
[TS]
01:27:41
◼
►
uncovered some mystery frustrates me
[TS]
01:27:44
◼
►
somewhat and the reporting of it because
[TS]
01:27:47
◼
►
it's an area I know quite well and you
[TS]
01:27:49
◼
►
know quite well some of the reporting of
[TS]
01:27:51
◼
►
it has been not as thorough accurate as
[TS]
01:27:54
◼
►
it could have been so I'm quite upset by
[TS]
01:27:56
◼
►
the generous description but I think
[TS]
01:27:59
◼
►
some of the things you're arguing about
[TS]
01:28:01
◼
►
and some of the things that are
[TS]
01:28:02
◼
►
upsetting you not the point and I think
[TS]
01:28:07
◼
►
you're kind of getting lost in the
[TS]
01:28:11
◼
►
minutiae of the details and ignoring the
[TS]
01:28:14
◼
►
problem that does exist if I can go off
[TS]
01:28:16
◼
►
on a tangent for a second this is what
[TS]
01:28:18
◼
►
you remind me of at the moment there's
[TS]
01:28:20
◼
►
an episode of the TV show The Office the
[TS]
01:28:22
◼
►
British office in which there's a pub
[TS]
01:28:24
◼
►
quiz that goes to a tiebreaker mm-hmm
[TS]
01:28:26
◼
►
the two guys have to stand on stage
[TS]
01:28:27
◼
►
opposite each other and they have to say
[TS]
01:28:29
◼
►
the answer first whichever one of you
[TS]
01:28:31
◼
►
says the answer first wins yeah and it
[TS]
01:28:33
◼
►
says a quote from Shakespeare and one
[TS]
01:28:35
◼
►
guy says that and gets it wrong but then
[TS]
01:28:37
◼
►
he just keeps naming play after play
[TS]
01:28:38
◼
►
after play trying to get it right and he
[TS]
01:28:40
◼
►
he keeps getting it wrong and eventually
[TS]
01:28:42
◼
►
the other guy says the right answer and
[TS]
01:28:43
◼
►
he wins and then for the next couple of
[TS]
01:28:47
◼
►
minutes the guy who was saying answer
[TS]
01:28:50
◼
►
after answer and got told off for saying
[TS]
01:28:52
◼
►
too many plays gets into this big
[TS]
01:28:54
◼
►
argument with the quizmaster about you
[TS]
01:28:56
◼
►
never said I could only say one so
[TS]
01:28:58
◼
►
that's why I was saying lots and lots so
[TS]
01:28:59
◼
►
I didn't break the rules no rules were
[TS]
01:29:01
◼
►
broken you know you never said that and
[TS]
01:29:03
◼
►
he's ignoring the fact he never even
[TS]
01:29:04
◼
►
said the right answer mm-hmm and it's oh
[TS]
01:29:07
◼
►
it doesn't matter anyway and he's so
[TS]
01:29:08
◼
►
busy arguing over the minutiae of the
[TS]
01:29:10
◼
►
rules Rose ignoring the fact he didn't
[TS]
01:29:12
◼
►
know the answer then he lost the quiz
[TS]
01:29:14
◼
►
anyway hmm and I feel a bit like you're
[TS]
01:29:16
◼
►
that guy you're so busy worrying about
[TS]
01:29:19
◼
►
the fact that they gave the wrong number
[TS]
01:29:22
◼
►
for the amount of money or they didn't
[TS]
01:29:25
◼
►
explain very clearly how the advertising
[TS]
01:29:28
◼
►
algorithm works and that you're kind of
[TS]
01:29:30
◼
►
ignoring the fact that money that once
[TS]
01:29:33
◼
►
belongs to a company is ending up in the
[TS]
01:29:36
◼
►
pocket of people who've uploaded
[TS]
01:29:38
◼
►
inappropriate content to YouTube that's
[TS]
01:29:40
◼
►
the problem and how it happened and
[TS]
01:29:42
◼
►
whether it flowed through an auction
[TS]
01:29:44
◼
►
system or whether Joe Bloggs knew that
[TS]
01:29:47
◼
►
the money was going to end up here or
[TS]
01:29:48
◼
►
not and whose fault was it and whether
[TS]
01:29:50
◼
►
it was a bot or a human mm-hmm that
[TS]
01:29:52
◼
►
isn't really the argument here the
[TS]
01:29:53
◼
►
argument is there was money that once
[TS]
01:29:55
◼
►
belongs to Pepsi to use your example and
[TS]
01:29:57
◼
►
now that's in the pocket of someone who
[TS]
01:29:59
◼
►
puts something deeply wrong on the
[TS]
01:30:02
◼
►
internet and they've been rewarded for
[TS]
01:30:04
◼
►
it with money that once belonged to
[TS]
01:30:06
◼
►
Pepsi and that's what's upsetting Pepsi
[TS]
01:30:08
◼
►
yeah oh yeah so I saw you uploaded your
[TS]
01:30:10
◼
►
video about how YouTube auctions works I
[TS]
01:30:13
◼
►
mean it could be a coincidence but I
[TS]
01:30:15
◼
►
feel like you must have been motivated
[TS]
01:30:17
◼
►
or sped up by this recent controversy
[TS]
01:30:19
◼
►
you felt like this was something that
[TS]
01:30:20
◼
►
needed to be explained more clearly oh
[TS]
01:30:22
◼
►
yeah that was a video uploaded in anger
[TS]
01:30:24
◼
►
yeah and you did a good job of
[TS]
01:30:25
◼
►
explaining how the system works you know
[TS]
01:30:27
◼
►
well done it was a really nice video but
[TS]
01:30:29
◼
►
I think it's completely irrelevant to
[TS]
01:30:31
◼
►
this 2-bay and it changes nothing
[TS]
01:30:33
◼
►
well yeah I didn't really want to talk
[TS]
01:30:35
◼
►
about this debate I wanted to talk about
[TS]
01:30:37
◼
►
a thing that I think is important which
[TS]
01:30:38
◼
►
is the understanding that humans are not
[TS]
01:30:40
◼
►
assigning these ads and I also just want
[TS]
01:30:43
◼
►
to just agree emphasized there's an
[TS]
01:30:45
◼
►
enormous amount of content but no I made
[TS]
01:30:47
◼
►
that video because I've as with all my
[TS]
01:30:49
◼
►
videos I feel like I want this to last
[TS]
01:30:50
◼
►
beyond this particular debate right
[TS]
01:30:53
◼
►
which will go away eventually of course
[TS]
01:30:55
◼
►
but I think it's completely irrelevant
[TS]
01:30:57
◼
►
that like humans don't do it YouTube are
[TS]
01:31:01
◼
►
the enablers googler the enablers well
[TS]
01:31:02
◼
►
they've done it with an algorithm or 400
[TS]
01:31:05
◼
►
people in a call center in chow
[TS]
01:31:07
◼
►
however they've done it they've created
[TS]
01:31:09
◼
►
the system that advertisers put money
[TS]
01:31:13
◼
►
into the big black box no but doesn't
[TS]
01:31:15
◼
►
matter what happens in the black box and
[TS]
01:31:16
◼
►
then the money ends up in people's
[TS]
01:31:18
◼
►
pockets whether it's your pocket my
[TS]
01:31:20
◼
►
pocket or some crazy person who's
[TS]
01:31:22
◼
►
uploading hate speech and how to make
[TS]
01:31:24
◼
►
bombs and stuff right this is the
[TS]
01:31:26
◼
►
problem and like if the extent of the
[TS]
01:31:29
◼
►
problems being exaggerated that is an
[TS]
01:31:31
◼
►
issue don't get me wrong but I do think
[TS]
01:31:33
◼
►
a problem exists I've always thought
[TS]
01:31:35
◼
►
it's a problem just like I think it's a
[TS]
01:31:37
◼
►
problem that freebooters get money you
[TS]
01:31:39
◼
►
know do you remember
[TS]
01:31:40
◼
►
I've said this a couple of times I've
[TS]
01:31:42
◼
►
even said it on the podcast that I think
[TS]
01:31:44
◼
►
the best way to get freebooting dealt
[TS]
01:31:46
◼
►
with would be to get in the advertisers
[TS]
01:31:48
◼
►
ears and say to them did you know that
[TS]
01:31:50
◼
►
your advertising on stolen content
[TS]
01:31:51
◼
►
mm-hmm this is exactly what's happened
[TS]
01:31:54
◼
►
the times have gotten in the ears via
[TS]
01:31:57
◼
►
the power of their newspaper and their
[TS]
01:31:58
◼
►
influence have gotten in the ears of the
[TS]
01:32:00
◼
►
advertisers and said do you know that
[TS]
01:32:02
◼
►
your money says some of your money's
[TS]
01:32:03
◼
►
ending up here now they've done it with
[TS]
01:32:05
◼
►
what I think somewhat disingenuous
[TS]
01:32:07
◼
►
motive mm-hmm but that's exactly what's
[TS]
01:32:10
◼
►
happened and YouTube have been caught
[TS]
01:32:14
◼
►
doing the wrong thing yes like then yeah
[TS]
01:32:17
◼
►
but had to act
[TS]
01:32:18
◼
►
they've been penalized for I know it's
[TS]
01:32:20
◼
►
been skewed you can go ahead and explain
[TS]
01:32:22
◼
►
how it's been skewed but I think they
[TS]
01:32:23
◼
►
have done the wrong thing they have to
[TS]
01:32:26
◼
►
act and they are acting yeah but yeah
[TS]
01:32:28
◼
►
like I have to fundamentally disagree
[TS]
01:32:29
◼
►
with your description thereof YouTube
[TS]
01:32:31
◼
►
has done the wrong thing right I don't
[TS]
01:32:35
◼
►
think that is a fair description of what
[TS]
01:32:38
◼
►
is occurring because what you're asking
[TS]
01:32:41
◼
►
for is a perfect system that has to deal
[TS]
01:32:44
◼
►
with essentially an infinite amount of
[TS]
01:32:46
◼
►
content yeah but you're giving them a
[TS]
01:32:48
◼
►
leave pass for that reason you're saying
[TS]
01:32:49
◼
►
because it's hard and because it's big
[TS]
01:32:51
◼
►
we've done enough I don't think they
[TS]
01:32:53
◼
►
have done enough this is our fundamental
[TS]
01:32:55
◼
►
disagreement because I do think and the
[TS]
01:32:57
◼
►
reason why the way all of the new
[TS]
01:33:00
◼
►
stories have reported on YouTube
[TS]
01:33:01
◼
►
frustrates me is because I think that
[TS]
01:33:05
◼
►
you have to report on the Internet as a
[TS]
01:33:09
◼
►
different thing like this is not a TV
[TS]
01:33:12
◼
►
schedule this is not advertising against
[TS]
01:33:15
◼
►
known content this is algorithmically
[TS]
01:33:18
◼
►
matching your advertisement
[TS]
01:33:21
◼
►
- what algorithms think the content is
[TS]
01:33:24
◼
►
yeah that's what advertising on the
[TS]
01:33:26
◼
►
Internet is and I think if you ignore
[TS]
01:33:30
◼
►
that if you want to ignore the
[TS]
01:33:32
◼
►
fundamental way that the internet works
[TS]
01:33:34
◼
►
and then hold the company Google
[TS]
01:33:37
◼
►
responsible as though they're putting
[TS]
01:33:39
◼
►
ads on an episode of Seinfeld where you
[TS]
01:33:41
◼
►
know what it is hold them to the same
[TS]
01:33:43
◼
►
standard of like oh we didn't air
[TS]
01:33:46
◼
►
Seinfeld that evening we actually aired
[TS]
01:33:48
◼
►
a terrorist recruiting video and we just
[TS]
01:33:50
◼
►
left all the ads in and hold them to
[TS]
01:33:51
◼
►
that kind of standard like I don't think
[TS]
01:33:53
◼
►
that that's a fair assessment that's why
[TS]
01:33:56
◼
►
I think it is an important part of this
[TS]
01:33:59
◼
►
story how does the internet work but all
[TS]
01:34:03
◼
►
of the newspapers are reporting upon
[TS]
01:34:05
◼
►
Google and a presumably now Facebook yet
[TS]
01:34:08
◼
►
I'm no friend of Facebook but you can't
[TS]
01:34:10
◼
►
report on them like they're just a
[TS]
01:34:12
◼
►
bigger newspaper it's a fundamentally
[TS]
01:34:16
◼
►
different kind of thing and I think what
[TS]
01:34:19
◼
►
makes the internet different is what
[TS]
01:34:22
◼
►
really matters in this story and to
[TS]
01:34:24
◼
►
ignore that is irresponsible this is
[TS]
01:34:27
◼
►
where we fundamentally disagree but this
[TS]
01:34:29
◼
►
is kind of where I think you're the guy
[TS]
01:34:32
◼
►
debating after the pub quiz all that
[TS]
01:34:34
◼
►
matters is that Pepsi saw their
[TS]
01:34:37
◼
►
advertisement that they paid for next to
[TS]
01:34:40
◼
►
Bob the bombers video and like that's
[TS]
01:34:43
◼
►
happened yep and YouTube took the money
[TS]
01:34:45
◼
►
they took the money and when they took
[TS]
01:34:47
◼
►
the money they knew they weren't
[TS]
01:34:48
◼
►
supposed to put it next to Bob the
[TS]
01:34:50
◼
►
bomber they knew that even the way
[TS]
01:34:52
◼
►
you're describing it though like is
[TS]
01:34:53
◼
►
implying a kind of intent like oh well
[TS]
01:34:56
◼
►
hahaha we're taking Pepsi's money and
[TS]
01:34:58
◼
►
we're gonna put it against this
[TS]
01:34:59
◼
►
terrorist video okay let's not call it
[TS]
01:35:00
◼
►
intent let's call it negligence
[TS]
01:35:02
◼
►
negligence is also not a word that I can
[TS]
01:35:04
◼
►
agree with and right I was just winding
[TS]
01:35:06
◼
►
you up but you're doing what I think
[TS]
01:35:08
◼
►
exactly the newspapers are doing right
[TS]
01:35:10
◼
►
they'll write a word like negligent all
[TS]
01:35:12
◼
►
right and then you're implying a certain
[TS]
01:35:14
◼
►
kind of thing I get super interesting
[TS]
01:35:17
◼
►
because I wanted to check that right
[TS]
01:35:18
◼
►
after this had happened I actually
[TS]
01:35:19
◼
►
bought a bunch of ads from my own
[TS]
01:35:21
◼
►
YouTube channel on YouTube because I
[TS]
01:35:24
◼
►
just wanted to quickly see how the
[TS]
01:35:25
◼
►
system was like after we had that first
[TS]
01:35:26
◼
►
conversation yeah
[TS]
01:35:28
◼
►
just as I had remembered when I tried
[TS]
01:35:29
◼
►
this years and years ago as with other
[TS]
01:35:31
◼
►
stuff like
[TS]
01:35:32
◼
►
the amount of options and preferences
[TS]
01:35:34
◼
►
they give you to try to target your ad
[TS]
01:35:36
◼
►
to exactly who you want and the number
[TS]
01:35:38
◼
►
of check boxes that you can tick for all
[TS]
01:35:40
◼
►
the kinds of things that you want to try
[TS]
01:35:42
◼
►
to have your ad not be shown against
[TS]
01:35:43
◼
►
it's enormous
[TS]
01:35:44
◼
►
like I've always like they have an
[TS]
01:35:46
◼
►
incentive kind of stuff is that oh they
[TS]
01:35:48
◼
►
have all of this like inappropriate
[TS]
01:35:50
◼
►
content but they also have things like
[TS]
01:35:51
◼
►
gambling like they have a bunch of
[TS]
01:35:53
◼
►
related kinds of things that you might
[TS]
01:35:55
◼
►
not want your ads to run against this
[TS]
01:35:58
◼
►
writer they have like mild violence they
[TS]
01:36:00
◼
►
have a whole bunch of categories that
[TS]
01:36:01
◼
►
you can specify you don't want your ads
[TS]
01:36:04
◼
►
to run against and there's no reason
[TS]
01:36:06
◼
►
that they'd be like negligent where it's
[TS]
01:36:08
◼
►
like ah ha ha we'll just have them take
[TS]
01:36:10
◼
►
a bunch of these boxes and we won't do
[TS]
01:36:11
◼
►
anything on the other end like it is in
[TS]
01:36:13
◼
►
YouTube's direct financial interest to
[TS]
01:36:18
◼
►
put the ads where the advertiser wants
[TS]
01:36:21
◼
►
them to go it's not a kind of negligence
[TS]
01:36:24
◼
►
to an extent
[TS]
01:36:25
◼
►
that's not completely true it's in their
[TS]
01:36:28
◼
►
interest to do it as long as it doesn't
[TS]
01:36:30
◼
►
cost them too much to do that it's in
[TS]
01:36:32
◼
►
their interest to do it because YouTube
[TS]
01:36:34
◼
►
charges when a user clicks on an ad
[TS]
01:36:36
◼
►
right so they are in the business of
[TS]
01:36:38
◼
►
matching ads to interested viewers yeah
[TS]
01:36:42
◼
►
they're not selling billboards on the
[TS]
01:36:43
◼
►
highway here at a price that at a price
[TS]
01:36:45
◼
►
to them they're in the business of doing
[TS]
01:36:47
◼
►
that at a price to them that isn't too
[TS]
01:36:49
◼
►
great that I can't employ 400 million
[TS]
01:36:51
◼
►
people to do it right they employ no one
[TS]
01:36:53
◼
►
to do it they avoid a computer to do it
[TS]
01:36:54
◼
►
there's not a huge cost on the other end
[TS]
01:36:56
◼
►
it's not a big army of people where
[TS]
01:36:57
◼
►
they're like oh if we get these people
[TS]
01:36:58
◼
►
to slack off a bit right this is
[TS]
01:37:00
◼
►
Google's whole thing is this kind of AI
[TS]
01:37:03
◼
►
and categorization right this is their
[TS]
01:37:05
◼
►
whole deepmind project like this is
[TS]
01:37:07
◼
►
everything they do is making this stuff
[TS]
01:37:09
◼
►
good yeah and so that's why I think if
[TS]
01:37:12
◼
►
you ignore this that is a kind of
[TS]
01:37:15
◼
►
negligence if you just ignore how this
[TS]
01:37:18
◼
►
system is different how YouTube is in
[TS]
01:37:21
◼
►
the business of categorizing decade's
[TS]
01:37:24
◼
►
worth of content every day and you find
[TS]
01:37:28
◼
►
the couple of videos that no one has
[TS]
01:37:31
◼
►
watched and you keep refreshing and
[TS]
01:37:33
◼
►
refreshing them until you find an ad
[TS]
01:37:34
◼
►
from a big company that you know you can
[TS]
01:37:37
◼
►
bully because I think the other side of
[TS]
01:37:39
◼
►
this is I don't disagree with any of
[TS]
01:37:41
◼
►
these big companies from pulling out
[TS]
01:37:43
◼
►
because I think
[TS]
01:37:45
◼
►
newspapers and the news are able to
[TS]
01:37:48
◼
►
bully these big companies into negative
[TS]
01:37:51
◼
►
PR campaigns to move their money
[TS]
01:37:53
◼
►
elsewhere that's definitely true I
[TS]
01:37:55
◼
►
definitely agree with that but the news
[TS]
01:37:56
◼
►
is causing the very problem that they're
[TS]
01:38:00
◼
►
threatening will happen right like boy
[TS]
01:38:03
◼
►
won't it be terrible news for you if we
[TS]
01:38:05
◼
►
keep writing stories that associate your
[TS]
01:38:08
◼
►
brand name with horrible thing in the
[TS]
01:38:10
◼
►
title which is exactly what we want to
[TS]
01:38:12
◼
►
do so to me this is like a mafia
[TS]
01:38:14
◼
►
shakedown that they're doing here it's
[TS]
01:38:16
◼
►
like we'll always be able to find of the
[TS]
01:38:19
◼
►
decades worth of stuff every day we'll
[TS]
01:38:21
◼
►
be able to find something that has been
[TS]
01:38:24
◼
►
miscategorized and we'll always be able
[TS]
01:38:27
◼
►
to hold that over your head so it'd be a
[TS]
01:38:29
◼
►
real shame if we keep having to tarnish
[TS]
01:38:31
◼
►
your brand all the time it'd be a real
[TS]
01:38:34
◼
►
shame if we caused a constant problem
[TS]
01:38:36
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for our main competitor for advertising
[TS]
01:38:38
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dollars so this is why I find it
[TS]
01:38:41
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frustrating is I think this is
[TS]
01:38:43
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intentionally misrepresented what this
[TS]
01:38:45
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thing is the Internet is just not a
[TS]
01:38:47
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newspaper it's not a television schedule
[TS]
01:38:50
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it's a different kind of advertising and
[TS]
01:38:52
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I feel like pretty much everybody knows
[TS]
01:38:56
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this but nonetheless traditional media
[TS]
01:39:00
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can bully companies into pulling their
[TS]
01:39:03
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dollars off of it like I would even
[TS]
01:39:05
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believe that people on the board of
[TS]
01:39:06
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Pepsi or whatever know what this whole
[TS]
01:39:08
◼
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situation is but they're just pulling
[TS]
01:39:11
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their dollars because they feel like we
[TS]
01:39:12
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can't don't please don't put us at the
[TS]
01:39:14
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center of the story like we're just
[TS]
01:39:16
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taking our money out leave us alone for
[TS]
01:39:18
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a while I would believe that that's
[TS]
01:39:19
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happening that even the people in charge
[TS]
01:39:21
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of the advertising of the big companies
[TS]
01:39:22
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understand the situation fully but just
[TS]
01:39:24
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feel like okay we can't be involved in
[TS]
01:39:26
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this like we're forced to make a move
[TS]
01:39:28
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here because of this story that has been
[TS]
01:39:31
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generated I agree with what you just
[TS]
01:39:33
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said I am Not sure that the problems
[TS]
01:39:36
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quite as tiny as you say like you're
[TS]
01:39:39
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making it sound like these are like five
[TS]
01:39:41
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videos with eight views and they've made
[TS]
01:39:43
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like point zero one of a penny mm-hmm I
[TS]
01:39:45
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don't know in some of the examples I've
[TS]
01:39:47
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read about have been you know hundreds
[TS]
01:39:49
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and hundreds of thousands of views it
[TS]
01:39:51
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would be interesting to know the money
[TS]
01:39:53
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involved and whether or not YouTube are
[TS]
01:39:56
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willing to disclose that I mean
[TS]
01:39:57
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obviously they're not willing to
[TS]
01:39:58
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disclose that
[TS]
01:39:59
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because the numbers would probably would
[TS]
01:40:01
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be quite big even though you would call
[TS]
01:40:03
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them small yeah like they could easily
[TS]
01:40:05
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say uh yet we've looked at it and we've
[TS]
01:40:07
◼
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done an order and we've paid out you
[TS]
01:40:08
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know $33 hmm over the last year two
[TS]
01:40:12
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extreme content but obviously the number
[TS]
01:40:14
◼
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isn't $33 it's obviously numbers that
[TS]
01:40:16
◼
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are big enough that people are going to
[TS]
01:40:18
◼
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get spooked I don't know if they're
[TS]
01:40:20
◼
►
numbers that are big enough that people
[TS]
01:40:21
◼
►
are going to get spooked because the
[TS]
01:40:22
◼
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other thing that I've seen in the
[TS]
01:40:24
◼
►
articles like I've seen people passing
[TS]
01:40:25
◼
►
around that I find really frustrating is
[TS]
01:40:29
◼
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again this is a kind of thing that I see
[TS]
01:40:32
◼
►
often in the news but this is an example
[TS]
01:40:35
◼
►
of it where it's like you start talking
[TS]
01:40:37
◼
►
about a really terrible thing but you
[TS]
01:40:39
◼
►
transition into something else and so
[TS]
01:40:42
◼
►
I've seen articles where they start out
[TS]
01:40:44
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►
by talking about like oh here's a
[TS]
01:40:46
◼
►
horrible beheading video that's Walmart
[TS]
01:40:50
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ran an ad against or whatever yeah and
[TS]
01:40:52
◼
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then they transition to videos that have
[TS]
01:40:56
◼
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let's say unpopular political speech
[TS]
01:41:00
◼
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that have hundreds of thousands of views
[TS]
01:41:03
◼
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in them and then they suddenly they
[TS]
01:41:04
◼
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start talking about popular channels
[TS]
01:41:07
◼
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that might say unpopular things and it's
[TS]
01:41:10
◼
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like whoa whoa you've done like a
[TS]
01:41:12
◼
►
switcheroo here because you're kind of
[TS]
01:41:15
◼
►
implying that this horrible thing is
[TS]
01:41:18
◼
►
getting the numbers of this other thing
[TS]
01:41:20
◼
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that you're talking about yeah and if I
[TS]
01:41:22
◼
►
didn't follow this world as closely as I
[TS]
01:41:24
◼
►
I would not be aware of what has just
[TS]
01:41:28
◼
►
occurred like if I'm just reading an
[TS]
01:41:29
◼
►
article suddenly I think there are
[TS]
01:41:31
◼
►
channels on YouTube that show terrorist
[TS]
01:41:33
◼
►
recruiting videos that have millions of
[TS]
01:41:35
◼
►
subscribers and hundreds of thousands of
[TS]
01:41:37
◼
►
views and it's like those things don't
[TS]
01:41:38
◼
►
exist yeah those are not on YouTube and
[TS]
01:41:40
◼
►
so that is just another thing that I
[TS]
01:41:42
◼
►
find really frustrating where it's like
[TS]
01:41:43
◼
►
you news article or news story are like
[TS]
01:41:47
◼
►
you're no fool you're deliberately doing
[TS]
01:41:50
◼
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this thing of like talk about the
[TS]
01:41:52
◼
►
horrible thing and then switch to the
[TS]
01:41:54
◼
►
maybe controversial thing but act as
[TS]
01:41:57
◼
►
though they're the same like it's a kind
[TS]
01:41:59
◼
►
of false equivalence I think some of
[TS]
01:42:00
◼
►
them are folks by the way they I think
[TS]
01:42:02
◼
►
in some cases they don't even quite get
[TS]
01:42:04
◼
►
it themselves
[TS]
01:42:05
◼
►
then I think it was as clever as you
[TS]
01:42:07
◼
►
think well there we go score one for the
[TS]
01:42:09
◼
►
journalists then are they malevolent or
[TS]
01:42:12
◼
►
just fools I think that's exactly what
[TS]
01:42:16
◼
►
you said braiding hair and I'm gonna put
[TS]
01:42:17
◼
►
that on up no no I think you're right I
[TS]
01:42:19
◼
►
said in my statement in my now famous
[TS]
01:42:20
◼
►
statement I didn't say that you know
[TS]
01:42:22
◼
►
they're a bad journalist out there and
[TS]
01:42:24
◼
►
they need to be called out and I think
[TS]
01:42:25
◼
►
some of this reporting you know it's
[TS]
01:42:27
◼
►
perfectly fair to call that and you know
[TS]
01:42:30
◼
►
you make you make some good points about
[TS]
01:42:31
◼
►
it but I do think big organizations and
[TS]
01:42:35
◼
►
companies don't act to improve things
[TS]
01:42:39
◼
►
until they're called out sometimes and
[TS]
01:42:42
◼
►
you know YouTube have now announced some
[TS]
01:42:44
◼
►
you know new system and stuff and I saw
[TS]
01:42:46
◼
►
a few people tweeting saying okay that
[TS]
01:42:49
◼
►
looks like an interesting thing they're
[TS]
01:42:50
◼
►
going to do to get around the problem
[TS]
01:42:51
◼
►
well let's talk about this
[TS]
01:42:53
◼
►
how have YouTube responded well the main
[TS]
01:42:56
◼
►
thing that I've seen which I thought I
[TS]
01:42:58
◼
►
believe I said on Twitter it's a
[TS]
01:42:59
◼
►
brilliant response yeah is YouTube has
[TS]
01:43:02
◼
►
decided that unless your YouTube channel
[TS]
01:43:04
◼
►
has 10,000 lifetime views across all the
[TS]
01:43:08
◼
►
videos yeah you will not be able to
[TS]
01:43:10
◼
►
monetize the channel Yeah right now
[TS]
01:43:12
◼
►
10,000 views is no money it's like a
[TS]
01:43:15
◼
►
dollar especially after the ad boy yeah
[TS]
01:43:18
◼
►
it's essentially nothing yeah so this
[TS]
01:43:21
◼
►
no creators right nobody with less than
[TS]
01:43:23
◼
►
10,000 views is making a living on
[TS]
01:43:25
◼
►
YouTube and I thought this was a
[TS]
01:43:27
◼
►
fantastic response because I viewed it
[TS]
01:43:30
◼
►
essentially as YouTube had to be seen
[TS]
01:43:33
◼
►
doing something and here's them able to
[TS]
01:43:37
◼
►
say like okay look we're gonna do this
[TS]
01:43:39
◼
►
because we know that the videos people
[TS]
01:43:42
◼
►
are pointing to have essentially no
[TS]
01:43:44
◼
►
views right that they're getting flagged
[TS]
01:43:46
◼
►
and they're getting pulled out of the
[TS]
01:43:47
◼
►
system really fast and so since the view
[TS]
01:43:51
◼
►
numbers on those things are so small
[TS]
01:43:52
◼
►
anyway we can set a comically low
[TS]
01:43:55
◼
►
threshold before videos can be monetized
[TS]
01:43:58
◼
►
I think YouTube's response shows exactly
[TS]
01:44:01
◼
►
what the level of the problem really is
[TS]
01:44:03
◼
►
it's like okay fine we have to be seen
[TS]
01:44:07
◼
►
to be doing something so we're going to
[TS]
01:44:09
◼
►
implement a quote solution to fix this
[TS]
01:44:13
◼
►
trivial problem I think it was a good PR
[TS]
01:44:16
◼
►
move on YouTube's side like I think that
[TS]
01:44:19
◼
►
was a good decision to do but what I
[TS]
01:44:21
◼
►
don't think is happening is behind the
[TS]
01:44:23
◼
►
scenes is YouTube is going how jeez guys
[TS]
01:44:26
◼
►
never trying to find bad content before
[TS]
01:44:28
◼
►
we were just taking all the Pepsi's
[TS]
01:44:29
◼
►
money and running it on these these
[TS]
01:44:31
◼
►
horrible ads like shucks we better stop
[TS]
01:44:33
◼
►
doing that I think again with YouTube in
[TS]
01:44:36
◼
►
particular they already had a hell of an
[TS]
01:44:39
◼
►
incentive to do this so I really don't
[TS]
01:44:41
◼
►
think that there's something going on at
[TS]
01:44:43
◼
►
YouTube where they're trying to like
[TS]
01:44:45
◼
►
improve their categorization algorithm
[TS]
01:44:47
◼
►
more than they already were doing but if
[TS]
01:44:49
◼
►
they had already had this system in
[TS]
01:44:51
◼
►
place this 10,000 view system mm-hmm
[TS]
01:44:54
◼
►
wouldn't it have been the case that
[TS]
01:44:55
◼
►
there would have been no beheading
[TS]
01:44:57
◼
►
videos with Walmart ads next to them in
[TS]
01:44:59
◼
►
the first place and they wouldn't have
[TS]
01:45:01
◼
►
had this ammunition okay yeah right yes
[TS]
01:45:03
◼
►
I would agree with that but what I'm
[TS]
01:45:06
◼
►
saying is I think the amount of money
[TS]
01:45:09
◼
►
here is so trivial that it is nothing
[TS]
01:45:12
◼
►
right so what you're asking is is the
[TS]
01:45:16
◼
►
difference between a literal 0 problem
[TS]
01:45:19
◼
►
and a essentially near zero problem I
[TS]
01:45:23
◼
►
don't think that that difference is a
[TS]
01:45:25
◼
►
significant difference well it must feel
[TS]
01:45:28
◼
►
significant when lot your stock price
[TS]
01:45:29
◼
►
goes down by a billion dollars but this
[TS]
01:45:32
◼
►
is my whole point
[TS]
01:45:33
◼
►
it feels significant because the news
[TS]
01:45:36
◼
►
has made a thing out of nothing to their
[TS]
01:45:40
◼
►
own advantage should YouTube have seen
[TS]
01:45:42
◼
►
it coming I don't know if YouTube should
[TS]
01:45:44
◼
►
have seen it coming because I feel like
[TS]
01:45:46
◼
►
you can't possibly see how your enemies
[TS]
01:45:50
◼
►
are always going to attack you in the
[TS]
01:45:51
◼
►
future but this seems like a really
[TS]
01:45:53
◼
►
obvious attack to me I even suggested it
[TS]
01:45:55
◼
►
in the context of freebooting shame
[TS]
01:45:57
◼
►
advertisers by showing them what their
[TS]
01:46:00
◼
►
content is being shown against like it
[TS]
01:46:02
◼
►
seems like an obvious tactic if you'd
[TS]
01:46:04
◼
►
sat me down and said Brady we need to
[TS]
01:46:06
◼
►
stop ad people advertising on YouTube
[TS]
01:46:08
◼
►
give us some ideas I think I would have
[TS]
01:46:10
◼
►
come up with that in the first hour or
[TS]
01:46:11
◼
►
two okay right yeah you're coming up
[TS]
01:46:14
◼
►
with ways to attack YouTube yeah you're
[TS]
01:46:17
◼
►
not selling me on like what an amazing
[TS]
01:46:19
◼
►
piece of investigative journalism
[TS]
01:46:21
◼
►
they're doing here right no no but what
[TS]
01:46:23
◼
►
I'm saying in the context of should
[TS]
01:46:24
◼
►
YouTube have been prepared for it and
[TS]
01:46:26
◼
►
said we need to make sure that like
[TS]
01:46:28
◼
►
we're not open to this attack because
[TS]
01:46:30
◼
►
it's such an easy attack you know I'm
[TS]
01:46:32
◼
►
not saying it's not trivial I'm saying
[TS]
01:46:33
◼
►
it's easy to do I guess I sort of see
[TS]
01:46:35
◼
►
what you're saying here but I feel like
[TS]
01:46:37
◼
►
you're giving in to my whole premise
[TS]
01:46:38
◼
►
then that this
[TS]
01:46:39
◼
►
whole story is like a made-up nonsense
[TS]
01:46:41
◼
►
story right like it isn't that surely
[TS]
01:46:44
◼
►
the infuriating part and it's like a
[TS]
01:46:46
◼
►
gigantic company is never going to be
[TS]
01:46:48
◼
►
able to protect itself from generated
[TS]
01:46:52
◼
►
fury you can never possibly foresee all
[TS]
01:46:55
◼
►
of the ways that your enemies are going
[TS]
01:46:57
◼
►
to attack you especially if they're able
[TS]
01:46:59
◼
►
to spin up non problems into gigantic
[TS]
01:47:02
◼
►
problems yeah okay so I'm saying is this
[TS]
01:47:04
◼
►
does seem like an obvious one to me and
[TS]
01:47:06
◼
►
if you think the ten thousand solution
[TS]
01:47:09
◼
►
has an impact I'm surprised they didn't
[TS]
01:47:12
◼
►
do it before yeah but again I don't see
[TS]
01:47:14
◼
►
you're asking youtube to be able to
[TS]
01:47:16
◼
►
anticipate all of the problems yeah I am
[TS]
01:47:19
◼
►
actually I think a big smart business
[TS]
01:47:21
◼
►
does sit around and anticipate all their
[TS]
01:47:23
◼
►
problems and how they're going to get
[TS]
01:47:24
◼
►
attacked and how to protect themselves
[TS]
01:47:26
◼
►
against it don't they but presumably you
[TS]
01:47:28
◼
►
would be concerned about your actual big
[TS]
01:47:31
◼
►
problems first and you wouldn't
[TS]
01:47:33
◼
►
necessarily be sitting around and
[TS]
01:47:34
◼
►
thinking what are all of our tiniest
[TS]
01:47:37
◼
►
problems I don't think this is a tiny
[TS]
01:47:39
◼
►
problem for them
[TS]
01:47:40
◼
►
I think it's been shown to not be a tiny
[TS]
01:47:41
◼
►
problem for them again this is where
[TS]
01:47:43
◼
►
language is a thing though yes this is
[TS]
01:47:46
◼
►
now a real problem for YouTube that has
[TS]
01:47:49
◼
►
been spun out of bullshit that's my
[TS]
01:47:51
◼
►
feeling on this is like you can't
[TS]
01:47:52
◼
►
foresee all of the both problems that
[TS]
01:47:55
◼
►
someone is going to attack you with yeah
[TS]
01:47:57
◼
►
but I think this one could have been for
[TS]
01:47:58
◼
►
saying is what I'm saying I would have
[TS]
01:48:00
◼
►
foreseen it well that's because you
[TS]
01:48:02
◼
►
think like a yellow journalist okay
[TS]
01:48:04
◼
►
because you know how the minds of
[TS]
01:48:06
◼
►
journalists work and how they're going
[TS]
01:48:08
◼
►
to attack their enemies
[TS]
01:48:09
◼
►
so I guess YouTube should hire you as a
[TS]
01:48:11
◼
►
consultant very good just sitting around
[TS]
01:48:14
◼
►
thinking of all the ways you could
[TS]
01:48:15
◼
►
attack them yeah I don't know great I
[TS]
01:48:18
◼
►
don't know what to say because I don't
[TS]
01:48:20
◼
►
know some of the stuff you're saying I
[TS]
01:48:22
◼
►
don't know if you're right you're saying
[TS]
01:48:25
◼
►
to me that the people making
[TS]
01:48:27
◼
►
inappropriate content and making very
[TS]
01:48:30
◼
►
very little money
[TS]
01:48:31
◼
►
like nothing money you're saying that to
[TS]
01:48:34
◼
►
me I don't know if that's true or not so
[TS]
01:48:35
◼
►
I don't know whether to disagree with
[TS]
01:48:38
◼
►
you yeah if that's true there's nothing
[TS]
01:48:40
◼
►
really you're saying that's particularly
[TS]
01:48:42
◼
►
wrong yeah just to be clear one of the
[TS]
01:48:44
◼
►
bigger problems that is happening is
[TS]
01:48:48
◼
►
this question of like what is advertiser
[TS]
01:48:51
◼
►
appropriate on YouTube
[TS]
01:48:53
◼
►
this gets very quickly into a realm
[TS]
01:48:54
◼
►
where it's very hard to know what is
[TS]
01:48:57
◼
►
happening but like I do sort of know
[TS]
01:49:00
◼
►
through unofficial channels that YouTube
[TS]
01:49:02
◼
►
does have behind the scenes like bins
[TS]
01:49:05
◼
►
that they put different channels into of
[TS]
01:49:06
◼
►
saying like oh this is perfectly okay
[TS]
01:49:08
◼
►
content like this is unknown content
[TS]
01:49:10
◼
►
yeah and there's a very different
[TS]
01:49:13
◼
►
question about categorizing channels and
[TS]
01:49:16
◼
►
what happens to channels that are
[TS]
01:49:18
◼
►
considered more or less advertiser
[TS]
01:49:20
◼
►
friendly again I think that that is like
[TS]
01:49:23
◼
►
a related problem but a much more
[TS]
01:49:24
◼
►
difficult to talk about problem because
[TS]
01:49:26
◼
►
you just don't know but one of the
[TS]
01:49:29
◼
►
things that I do start getting very
[TS]
01:49:32
◼
►
uncomfortable about is what you're
[TS]
01:49:34
◼
►
touching on here is like the boundaries
[TS]
01:49:38
◼
►
of what do we consider okay and not okay
[TS]
01:49:41
◼
►
content right and there's there's always
[TS]
01:49:43
◼
►
like a huge gray area there on one end
[TS]
01:49:46
◼
►
we have like the absolute stuff that
[TS]
01:49:47
◼
►
everybody agrees is totally horrible but
[TS]
01:49:50
◼
►
then as you start getting towards the
[TS]
01:49:51
◼
►
end of the spectrum which is where I
[TS]
01:49:53
◼
►
think the conflation starts beginning is
[TS]
01:49:56
◼
►
like politically unpopular speech which
[TS]
01:50:00
◼
►
starts becoming like a grey zone and you
[TS]
01:50:02
◼
►
like well is this okay is this not okay
[TS]
01:50:06
◼
►
like then that becomes much harder and
[TS]
01:50:09
◼
►
to be clear I am 100% on the side like
[TS]
01:50:12
◼
►
if advertisers don't want to advertise
[TS]
01:50:14
◼
►
on politically unpopular videos like
[TS]
01:50:19
◼
►
that's totally their prerogative it's
[TS]
01:50:20
◼
►
their money to spend
[TS]
01:50:21
◼
►
it's 100% their choice advertisers
[TS]
01:50:25
◼
►
should be able to say like don't put our
[TS]
01:50:27
◼
►
videos on anything that seems remotely
[TS]
01:50:29
◼
►
political but then that starts getting
[TS]
01:50:31
◼
►
into much more complicated questions
[TS]
01:50:34
◼
►
about like what kind of content is
[TS]
01:50:36
◼
►
YouTube implicitly through the way their
[TS]
01:50:39
◼
►
system works promoting or not promoting
[TS]
01:50:42
◼
►
the creation of this starts becoming a
[TS]
01:50:44
◼
►
real mess like there are definitely
[TS]
01:50:48
◼
►
channels on YouTube that get lots of
[TS]
01:50:50
◼
►
views that you can point to easily that
[TS]
01:50:52
◼
►
say like oh people don't like this
[TS]
01:50:53
◼
►
channel and they're making a bunch of
[TS]
01:50:55
◼
►
money but I think that gets very easily
[TS]
01:50:58
◼
►
conflated with the absolute stuff that
[TS]
01:51:01
◼
►
we all agree is horrible and so my
[TS]
01:51:03
◼
►
stance is like the worst of the worst
[TS]
01:51:05
◼
►
stuff is not making
[TS]
01:51:06
◼
►
any money on YouTube but that doesn't
[TS]
01:51:08
◼
►
mean that like channels where we start
[TS]
01:51:10
◼
►
having some disagreement over are they
[TS]
01:51:13
◼
►
making money like those channels do
[TS]
01:51:15
◼
►
exist and I do think if advertisers
[TS]
01:51:17
◼
►
don't want to advertise on them that is
[TS]
01:51:19
◼
►
the advertisers prerogative but that's a
[TS]
01:51:22
◼
►
much subtler question I think than what
[TS]
01:51:25
◼
►
most of these new stories are talking
[TS]
01:51:27
◼
►
about and I mean Google's solo it up the
[TS]
01:51:29
◼
►
kazoo they must have contracts in place
[TS]
01:51:30
◼
►
that are saying you know we don't know
[TS]
01:51:32
◼
►
what people are putting in their videos
[TS]
01:51:33
◼
►
sometimes and if suddenly CGP grey
[TS]
01:51:36
◼
►
uploads a video that's different to all
[TS]
01:51:37
◼
►
the ones that have come before it's hard
[TS]
01:51:39
◼
►
for them to realize that your tone has
[TS]
01:51:41
◼
►
changed immediately that is exactly
[TS]
01:51:43
◼
►
right as I mentioned on the show before
[TS]
01:51:45
◼
►
I was told by someone YouTube like oh
[TS]
01:51:46
◼
►
you are listed as one of the school safe
[TS]
01:51:48
◼
►
channels so YouTube has a mode which is
[TS]
01:51:52
◼
►
where schools can have a super lockdown
[TS]
01:51:53
◼
►
version of YouTube yeah and it's like
[TS]
01:51:55
◼
►
okay that's great I know my channels on
[TS]
01:51:57
◼
►
there but I could upload a video that's
[TS]
01:51:59
◼
►
a different thing like how long does it
[TS]
01:52:00
◼
►
take before the system would pull that
[TS]
01:52:02
◼
►
yeah right this is what I mean by like
[TS]
01:52:04
◼
►
you can never possibly have a perfect
[TS]
01:52:07
◼
►
system here there's always going to be a
[TS]
01:52:09
◼
►
thing that you can point to yeah at the
[TS]
01:52:11
◼
►
higher levels it becomes a much more
[TS]
01:52:13
◼
►
complicated issue to talk about hmm what
[TS]
01:52:18
◼
►
do you think in there Brady well my
[TS]
01:52:21
◼
►
overall feeling is that the old-school
[TS]
01:52:23
◼
►
media particularly the times has really
[TS]
01:52:27
◼
►
overcooked this and I'm finding it a
[TS]
01:52:30
◼
►
little bit offensive how conflicted they
[TS]
01:52:34
◼
►
are and how hard they're going and
[TS]
01:52:35
◼
►
they've movie on the bounds of raising
[TS]
01:52:38
◼
►
an issue and stirring up a bit of
[TS]
01:52:40
◼
►
controversy and asking a few questions
[TS]
01:52:41
◼
►
about accountability they've totally
[TS]
01:52:43
◼
►
moved over into feathering their own
[TS]
01:52:46
◼
►
nest mm-hmm
[TS]
01:52:47
◼
►
however I do think it was legitimate to
[TS]
01:52:50
◼
►
point out that there's this
[TS]
01:52:52
◼
►
inappropriate content around sometimes
[TS]
01:52:54
◼
►
it's got ads on it is this something
[TS]
01:52:56
◼
►
that should questions should be asked
[TS]
01:52:57
◼
►
about I think there was legitimate I
[TS]
01:52:59
◼
►
still think it's legitimate I don't know
[TS]
01:53:01
◼
►
I think you're coming across as very
[TS]
01:53:03
◼
►
much like so Pro YouTube that it's
[TS]
01:53:06
◼
►
almost like surprising it's an
[TS]
01:53:08
◼
►
uncomfortable position to be in
[TS]
01:53:09
◼
►
yeah and I do think that YouTube like
[TS]
01:53:14
◼
►
any big company will sometimes only act
[TS]
01:53:16
◼
►
to improve systems whether it's their
[TS]
01:53:18
◼
►
algorithm and how things are
[TS]
01:53:19
◼
►
when they have the blowtorch put on them
[TS]
01:53:22
◼
►
so I do think sometimes it's good for a
[TS]
01:53:24
◼
►
blowtorch such as media attention to be
[TS]
01:53:27
◼
►
applied to companies to make them act
[TS]
01:53:29
◼
►
and look at their systems and think
[TS]
01:53:30
◼
►
should we have a 10,000 rule is there
[TS]
01:53:33
◼
►
more we can do so I think it was fine to
[TS]
01:53:35
◼
►
put a blowtorch on them but I think the
[TS]
01:53:37
◼
►
blowtorch has gone way too far to some
[TS]
01:53:40
◼
►
kind of SuperDuper mother of all flame
[TS]
01:53:41
◼
►
throwers mm-hmm and it's gone beyond the
[TS]
01:53:45
◼
►
realms of what was fair reporting and
[TS]
01:53:48
◼
►
I'm finding it quite frustrating what do
[TS]
01:53:50
◼
►
you think the net result is if you think
[TS]
01:53:53
◼
►
the blowtorch has been held too long and
[TS]
01:53:54
◼
►
turned up too high and we also have to
[TS]
01:53:58
◼
►
look at creators on the margin right for
[TS]
01:54:00
◼
►
whom this does have an impact right and
[TS]
01:54:02
◼
►
a decrease in like we're looking at all
[TS]
01:54:04
◼
►
of the various things and the
[TS]
01:54:06
◼
►
possibility of what YouTube can change
[TS]
01:54:08
◼
►
yeah in your view do you think this
[TS]
01:54:10
◼
►
comes out as a net win or a net loss I
[TS]
01:54:13
◼
►
think it when all the dust settles that
[TS]
01:54:15
◼
►
for a few months or a year or two the
[TS]
01:54:19
◼
►
needle has swung ever so slightly
[TS]
01:54:22
◼
►
maybe the newspapers have stalled this
[TS]
01:54:24
◼
►
move in advertising maybe slightly
[TS]
01:54:27
◼
►
I think it's overall the trend will
[TS]
01:54:29
◼
►
continue
[TS]
01:54:30
◼
►
I think the creators who are the big
[TS]
01:54:31
◼
►
losers are kind of collateral damage hmm
[TS]
01:54:34
◼
►
I mean there's been a lot written about
[TS]
01:54:36
◼
►
this and I think the interesting thing
[TS]
01:54:37
◼
►
is what a lot of the experts I'm reading
[TS]
01:54:39
◼
►
as saying is that all these big
[TS]
01:54:41
◼
►
advertising budgets that are being
[TS]
01:54:42
◼
►
pulled out of YouTube are just going to
[TS]
01:54:43
◼
►
go into sort of Google ads and search
[TS]
01:54:45
◼
►
anyway because they set aside you know
[TS]
01:54:47
◼
►
100 million dollars a year for online
[TS]
01:54:49
◼
►
advertising mm-hmm and they're just
[TS]
01:54:51
◼
►
going to reallocate it around the
[TS]
01:54:52
◼
►
internet anyway and goo who's gonna
[TS]
01:54:53
◼
►
Hoover up most of it anyway well it was
[TS]
01:54:55
◼
►
gonna go to Facebook but somebody else
[TS]
01:54:57
◼
►
is next on the list yeah and also when
[TS]
01:55:00
◼
►
you look at sort of the wording of all
[TS]
01:55:02
◼
►
the media statements from the companies
[TS]
01:55:05
◼
►
they're never saying we're pulling all
[TS]
01:55:06
◼
►
their advertising from the internet or
[TS]
01:55:08
◼
►
Google they're quite canny with their
[TS]
01:55:10
◼
►
wording usually so you can tell they're
[TS]
01:55:12
◼
►
still advertising online so I don't
[TS]
01:55:14
◼
►
think it's quite the victory for
[TS]
01:55:16
◼
►
newspapers that they probably think
[TS]
01:55:17
◼
►
they've landed the only real losers are
[TS]
01:55:21
◼
►
probably you and me well this is why
[TS]
01:55:24
◼
►
I've arranged my whole business so that
[TS]
01:55:26
◼
►
this isn't a problem yeah this is why I
[TS]
01:55:28
◼
►
have my fantastic patrons yeah it is
[TS]
01:55:30
◼
►
really interesting because I'm I've been
[TS]
01:55:32
◼
►
digging around
[TS]
01:55:33
◼
►
data for my own analytics behind the
[TS]
01:55:35
◼
►
scenes trying to see what I can see yeah
[TS]
01:55:37
◼
►
and I am fairly certain that the video I
[TS]
01:55:40
◼
►
uploaded about the YouTube system has
[TS]
01:55:43
◼
►
been put into some kind of political
[TS]
01:55:46
◼
►
category because I could see what the
[TS]
01:55:49
◼
►
CPM s were at the start mmm and like for
[TS]
01:55:53
◼
►
the first two days it was lower than
[TS]
01:55:56
◼
►
normal and then all of a sudden it
[TS]
01:55:59
◼
►
crashed to almost nothing and it's like
[TS]
01:56:02
◼
►
ha this is really interesting like
[TS]
01:56:03
◼
►
somewhere switched was clearly flipped
[TS]
01:56:05
◼
►
where the algorithm thinks oh this is a
[TS]
01:56:08
◼
►
video maybe about politics or whatever
[TS]
01:56:10
◼
►
like who knows what it is but it's
[TS]
01:56:11
◼
►
interesting because I've never had a
[TS]
01:56:12
◼
►
video do that before like comparing it
[TS]
01:56:15
◼
►
with everything else where it's like
[TS]
01:56:16
◼
►
okay now this is earning essentially
[TS]
01:56:18
◼
►
nothing it's interesting to see but I
[TS]
01:56:21
◼
►
still say like its creators on the
[TS]
01:56:22
◼
►
margin who are most affected by this but
[TS]
01:56:25
◼
►
yeah I didn't hear a clear answer from
[TS]
01:56:27
◼
►
you there of overall summing everything
[TS]
01:56:31
◼
►
up is this whole debacle that happens on
[TS]
01:56:35
◼
►
the long scale is it a net positive for
[TS]
01:56:38
◼
►
the world or is it a net negative for
[TS]
01:56:40
◼
►
the world
[TS]
01:56:40
◼
►
what does Brady think oh no I think it
[TS]
01:56:43
◼
►
just balances out like so might as well
[TS]
01:56:45
◼
►
have not happened it's a net neutral
[TS]
01:56:49
◼
►
that's what you're saying like
[TS]
01:56:50
◼
►
everything in the world there are lot
[TS]
01:56:52
◼
►
winners and losers who are the winners I
[TS]
01:56:54
◼
►
feel like this is very important who do
[TS]
01:56:55
◼
►
you think is the winner in this
[TS]
01:56:58
◼
►
situation who comes out better after
[TS]
01:57:00
◼
►
these news stories whoa I'm sure if you
[TS]
01:57:02
◼
►
ask Google and YouTube if they could
[TS]
01:57:04
◼
►
turn back the clock and have the stories
[TS]
01:57:05
◼
►
not appear they would say yes let's have
[TS]
01:57:08
◼
►
them not appear and if you ask the times
[TS]
01:57:10
◼
►
do you regret running them do you want
[TS]
01:57:12
◼
►
to not do them they would say no no
[TS]
01:57:13
◼
►
we're glad we did it so based on that
[TS]
01:57:16
◼
►
clearly the winners in that battle is
[TS]
01:57:19
◼
►
the newspaper I think it will result in
[TS]
01:57:22
◼
►
it being a little bit harder for people
[TS]
01:57:24
◼
►
creating an appropriate content to make
[TS]
01:57:27
◼
►
money so that's like a small positive
[TS]
01:57:29
◼
►
that's come out of it I don't know how
[TS]
01:57:31
◼
►
big a positive because again I don't
[TS]
01:57:32
◼
►
know how much money these make you tell
[TS]
01:57:35
◼
►
me it's nothing you're more likely to
[TS]
01:57:37
◼
►
know than me so I'm assuming a right but
[TS]
01:57:38
◼
►
I don't know that you're right
[TS]
01:57:39
◼
►
regardless I think it will be even
[TS]
01:57:41
◼
►
harder to make money with inappropriate
[TS]
01:57:43
◼
►
content now I think that's a good result
[TS]
01:57:45
◼
►
I think people who
[TS]
01:57:47
◼
►
make their living via revenue on YouTube
[TS]
01:57:50
◼
►
have taken a hit I don't know how long
[TS]
01:57:53
◼
►
that hit will last for their losers if
[TS]
01:57:56
◼
►
they are making appropriate content
[TS]
01:57:58
◼
►
which most of them are so I don't really
[TS]
01:58:00
◼
►
think of it like that I don't really
[TS]
01:58:02
◼
►
think of it as winners and losers that I
[TS]
01:58:03
◼
►
just think it's like I've really got to
[TS]
01:58:05
◼
►
do the society calculus right we add up
[TS]
01:58:07
◼
►
all the benefits and all the harms alike
[TS]
01:58:08
◼
►
and there's a net positive for the world
[TS]
01:58:10
◼
►
or a net negative for the world I need a
[TS]
01:58:11
◼
►
bit longer I haven't got all the data I
[TS]
01:58:14
◼
►
mean I haven't got enough data to know
[TS]
01:58:16
◼
►
how big the problem was yeah that's that
[TS]
01:58:18
◼
►
that is the big unknown you think it's
[TS]
01:58:20
◼
►
completely trivial I think it's much
[TS]
01:58:23
◼
►
much less than the times made it sound
[TS]
01:58:25
◼
►
but I don't know if it's as trivial as
[TS]
01:58:27
◼
►
you're making it sound mmm
[TS]
01:58:29
◼
►
I don't know if it was a problem I think
[TS]
01:58:31
◼
►
it kind of was a problem but if these
[TS]
01:58:33
◼
►
videos have made like half of one cent
[TS]
01:58:37
◼
►
and they just screen captured the one
[TS]
01:58:38
◼
►
moment in history when an ad was served
[TS]
01:58:41
◼
►
against it then okay it was not a
[TS]
01:58:44
◼
►
problem I tend to think it must be a
[TS]
01:58:46
◼
►
little bit worse than that all I can go
[TS]
01:58:48
◼
►
on is the fact that when people free
[TS]
01:58:51
◼
►
boot my videos there's certainly a
[TS]
01:58:53
◼
►
boatload of ads running against them so
[TS]
01:58:55
◼
►
whatever mechanisms are in place to stop
[TS]
01:58:57
◼
►
freebooting aren't working and people
[TS]
01:58:59
◼
►
are making money from that a little
[TS]
01:59:00
◼
►
different I don't think those things get
[TS]
01:59:02
◼
►
flagged as fast as a terrorist
[TS]
01:59:04
◼
►
recruitment video I realize that but
[TS]
01:59:06
◼
►
what I'm saying is that's all I've got
[TS]
01:59:07
◼
►
to go on right and if that's all I've
[TS]
01:59:09
◼
►
got to go on then the history has shown
[TS]
01:59:12
◼
►
me that these hosts of media aren't
[TS]
01:59:16
◼
►
particularly super red-hot on doing this
[TS]
01:59:20
◼
►
they do it they get around to it and if
[TS]
01:59:21
◼
►
this has made them improve their systems
[TS]
01:59:24
◼
►
a bit if the new 10,000 rule is a big
[TS]
01:59:26
◼
►
positive then something's come of it I
[TS]
01:59:29
◼
►
guess but don't get me wrong I think it
[TS]
01:59:31
◼
►
was a bit scummy the times are overdone
[TS]
01:59:33
◼
►
er they're continuing to overdo it it's
[TS]
01:59:35
◼
►
driving me crazy it's making me a little
[TS]
01:59:37
◼
►
bit mad now when I read age mourning
[TS]
01:59:38
◼
►
it's like just because of the brazenness
[TS]
01:59:41
◼
►
of it I think more than anything like
[TS]
01:59:43
◼
►
the obvious of it I just find it a
[TS]
01:59:45
◼
►
little bit
[TS]
01:59:47
◼
►
yeah bit yucky you know like I don't
[TS]
01:59:50
◼
►
care about Facebook but I don't like
[TS]
01:59:52
◼
►
Facebook no I don't like me look I
[TS]
01:59:55
◼
►
reckon I still don't want to see that
[TS]
01:59:57
◼
►
their business slandered essential
[TS]
01:59:57
◼
►
their business slandered essential
[TS]
02:00:00
◼
►
blew by supposedly reputable news
[TS]
02:00:02
◼
►
sources I don't I agree I've done a
[TS]
02:00:05
◼
►
really terrible job of answering a
[TS]
02:00:06
◼
►
question because I don't really think of
[TS]
02:00:08
◼
►
it in terms of winners and losers it's
[TS]
02:00:09
◼
►
been bit of a mucky episode but you know
[TS]
02:00:12
◼
►
a Walmart aired running against one
[TS]
02:00:14
◼
►
beheading video is also unfortunate I
[TS]
02:00:16
◼
►
understand why it happens and the system
[TS]
02:00:17
◼
►
we work in but I think you're a lot more
[TS]
02:00:21
◼
►
of an apologist for these automated
[TS]
02:00:22
◼
►
systems than i apologist the apologist
[TS]
02:00:27
◼
►
realist brady really was a realist I
[TS]
02:00:30
◼
►
think you can always make it better and
[TS]
02:00:32
◼
►
I think they don't have best in making
[TS]
02:00:34
◼
►
these things better until they felt the
[TS]
02:00:37
◼
►
heat I don't think they should have felt
[TS]
02:00:39
◼
►
as much heat as they have when this much
[TS]
02:00:41
◼
►
money moves around and investment is
[TS]
02:00:43
◼
►
pulled real lives are affected and we
[TS]
02:00:46
◼
►
shouldn't forget that as well but I also
[TS]
02:00:49
◼
►
think like in general terms one of the
[TS]
02:00:52
◼
►
roles the media can play is holding
[TS]
02:00:54
◼
►
businesses to account that aren't doing
[TS]
02:00:56
◼
►
enough to do their job properly I don't
[TS]
02:00:59
◼
►
know if that's what happened here you
[TS]
02:01:01
◼
►
say absolutely not I say maybe they
[TS]
02:01:03
◼
►
could have done more maybe I'd like to
[TS]
02:01:05
◼
►
see some data I do think that's a
[TS]
02:01:07
◼
►
legitimate role for journalists to play
[TS]
02:01:09
◼
►
I don't think the times should be
[TS]
02:01:11
◼
►
beating their chests about
[TS]
02:01:12
◼
►
investigations I think this is trivial
[TS]
02:01:14
◼
►
what they've done they've just spun it
[TS]
02:01:16
◼
►
into a clever story that there we go
[TS]
02:01:19
◼
►
it's happened that's a we can say for
[TS]
02:01:21
◼
►
sure it's a thing that happened that we
[TS]
02:01:25
◼
►
and I'll be introducing how it ends
[TS]
02:01:27
◼
►
it'll never end they'll do this forever
[TS]
02:01:29
◼
►
I'll find another read on some obscure
[TS]
02:01:30
◼
►
video and then add a little kick off
[TS]
02:01:33
◼
►
again it'll never end Brady that I can
[TS]
02:01:36
◼
►
pretty much guarantee you it'll end when
[TS]
02:01:38
◼
►
the times goes out of business this
[TS]
02:01:40
◼
►
episode of hello Internet is brought to
[TS]
02:01:42
◼
►
you in part by Harry's Harry's was
[TS]
02:01:44
◼
►
started by two guys Jeff and Andy who
[TS]
02:01:46
◼
►
were fed up with being overcharged for
[TS]
02:01:48
◼
►
razors so they decided to start their
[TS]
02:01:50
◼
►
own razor company to give guys
[TS]
02:01:52
◼
►
everywhere what they deserve a great
[TS]
02:01:55
◼
►
shave at a fair price
[TS]
02:01:57
◼
►
they bought a factory with a hundred
[TS]
02:01:59
◼
►
years of blade making experience so they
[TS]
02:02:01
◼
►
could make their own high-quality razors
[TS]
02:02:02
◼
►
sell them online and ship them directly
[TS]
02:02:05
◼
►
to you for half the price of the leading
[TS]
02:02:08
◼
►
Harry's razors include everything you
[TS]
02:02:10
◼
►
need for a close comfortable shave
[TS]
02:02:13
◼
►
I have a german-engineered blades
[TS]
02:02:14
◼
►
lubricating strip flex hinge for a
[TS]
02:02:17
◼
►
comfortable glide trimmer blade for
[TS]
02:02:19
◼
►
hard-to-reach places and a weighted
[TS]
02:02:21
◼
►
organ Amma candle all this for two bucks
[TS]
02:02:24
◼
►
a blade compared to the four or more
[TS]
02:02:26
◼
►
that you'll pay at the drugstore I
[TS]
02:02:28
◼
►
always like to mention is not in the
[TS]
02:02:30
◼
►
copy here but the hairy stuff just feels
[TS]
02:02:32
◼
►
really nice in the hand they're not
[TS]
02:02:34
◼
►
kidding about that weighted handle it
[TS]
02:02:35
◼
►
just it's way better than those cheapo
[TS]
02:02:39
◼
►
blue razors you might have a full bag of
[TS]
02:02:42
◼
►
somewhere in your house if you have one
[TS]
02:02:43
◼
►
of those bags with a bunch of blue
[TS]
02:02:45
◼
►
cheapo razors seriously get rid of them
[TS]
02:02:47
◼
►
get Harries instead you will be much
[TS]
02:02:51
◼
►
happier it's much nicer stuff to use and
[TS]
02:02:53
◼
►
you're going to get a better shave and
[TS]
02:02:56
◼
►
it looks nice there in your bathroom as
[TS]
02:02:58
◼
►
well they really take care with the way
[TS]
02:03:01
◼
►
they design their products
[TS]
02:03:03
◼
►
Perris is so confident in the quality of
[TS]
02:03:06
◼
►
their blades they want you to try their
[TS]
02:03:08
◼
►
most popular trial set for free it comes
[TS]
02:03:11
◼
►
with a razor handle of your choice five
[TS]
02:03:13
◼
►
blade cartridge and shaving gel free
[TS]
02:03:16
◼
►
when you sign up just pay a small fee
[TS]
02:03:19
◼
►
for shipping to redeem your free trial
[TS]
02:03:22
◼
►
offer go to harrys.com and use the offer
[TS]
02:03:25
◼
►
code h eye
[TS]
02:03:27
◼
►
once again that's Harry's com offer code
[TS]
02:03:31
◼
►
thanks to Harry's for supporting the
[TS]
02:03:34
◼
►
show and thanks to Harry's for giving
[TS]
02:03:35
◼
►
men everywhere a better shave okay gray
[TS]
02:03:39
◼
►
let's do it I have finally finished
[TS]
02:03:41
◼
►
Westworld
[TS]
02:03:42
◼
►
I started watching this and stopped then
[TS]
02:03:45
◼
►
you told me you'd watched it and
[TS]
02:03:46
◼
►
finished it so I I went back to it and
[TS]
02:03:49
◼
►
finished it so that we have both speak
[TS]
02:03:51
◼
►
from position of knowledge yes although
[TS]
02:03:56
◼
►
at this point it has been quite a while
[TS]
02:03:58
◼
►
since I watched Westworld yeah so I
[TS]
02:03:59
◼
►
think our conversation might be somewhat
[TS]
02:04:01
◼
►
brief but I'm happy to discuss Westworld
[TS]
02:04:04
◼
►
a little bit because everybody seemed to
[TS]
02:04:06
◼
►
want us to at least touch upon it
[TS]
02:04:08
◼
►
yeah and as I briefly mentioned when we
[TS]
02:04:11
◼
►
first brought it up but you you wanted
[TS]
02:04:13
◼
►
to cut me off this is an example of
[TS]
02:04:15
◼
►
people recommending a thing recommending
[TS]
02:04:18
◼
►
it in the right way simply just saying
[TS]
02:04:21
◼
►
watch Westworld
[TS]
02:04:22
◼
►
not mentioning anything about it
[TS]
02:04:25
◼
►
and I watched a thing and I definitely
[TS]
02:04:29
◼
►
enjoyed it so this was a good
[TS]
02:04:31
◼
►
recommendation
[TS]
02:04:32
◼
►
from the audience from my perspective
[TS]
02:04:35
◼
►
now since the Brady rule is that you
[TS]
02:04:38
◼
►
have to lay your cards down on the table
[TS]
02:04:40
◼
►
yep we can't play poker not across a
[TS]
02:04:43
◼
►
smoky table yeah with guns on our side
[TS]
02:04:45
◼
►
we have to just put it down on the table
[TS]
02:04:47
◼
►
yep what did you think Brady well what
[TS]
02:04:49
◼
►
is your opinion of the west-world
[TS]
02:04:51
◼
►
well we've both kind of tipped our hands
[TS]
02:04:53
◼
►
a little bit yeah but you didn't finish
[TS]
02:04:55
◼
►
it so it doesn't no but I did stop
[TS]
02:04:57
◼
►
because I wasn't enjoying it mm-hmm and
[TS]
02:04:59
◼
►
a lot of people did say to me now stick
[TS]
02:05:01
◼
►
with it it gets better which I don't
[TS]
02:05:02
◼
►
agree with I kind of do agree with it I
[TS]
02:05:05
◼
►
do agree with that I enjoyed the second
[TS]
02:05:07
◼
►
half more than the first half of the
[TS]
02:05:08
◼
►
series mm-hmm so should I go first and
[TS]
02:05:13
◼
►
say a few things a few of my thoughts
[TS]
02:05:14
◼
►
yeah but so is that a you liked it this
[TS]
02:05:17
◼
►
is worth watching this was a good look
[TS]
02:05:19
◼
►
at my time okay it's a high quality show
[TS]
02:05:21
◼
►
it's well-made it's thought-provoking
[TS]
02:05:24
◼
►
it's interesting it has a lot to
[TS]
02:05:27
◼
►
recommend itself and I would say watch
[TS]
02:05:29
◼
►
if someone said to me Brady I'm thinking
[TS]
02:05:31
◼
►
of watching Westworld should I do it I
[TS]
02:05:34
◼
►
would say yes definitely do it okay
[TS]
02:05:36
◼
►
great that's what I wanted to know
[TS]
02:05:37
◼
►
that's what I was interested in and yet
[TS]
02:05:39
◼
►
frankly I feel a little bit relieved
[TS]
02:05:41
◼
►
that that is your opinion
[TS]
02:05:43
◼
►
yeah because my feeling is like if
[TS]
02:05:45
◼
►
someone watches two episodes of
[TS]
02:05:46
◼
►
Westworld and they don't like it I don't
[TS]
02:05:48
◼
►
think I could confidently say you should
[TS]
02:05:50
◼
►
go on and continue to watch it because I
[TS]
02:05:52
◼
►
feel like it is what it is right from
[TS]
02:05:54
◼
►
the start and right through the end so
[TS]
02:05:56
◼
►
it's interesting that you had a bit of a
[TS]
02:05:58
◼
►
different experience that you liked it
[TS]
02:05:59
◼
►
more as it went on okay I can maybe
[TS]
02:06:01
◼
►
explain why that's the case I'll say the
[TS]
02:06:04
◼
►
things I didn't like about it okay
[TS]
02:06:06
◼
►
because that's always the most
[TS]
02:06:08
◼
►
interesting yeah it's an it's the
[TS]
02:06:10
◼
►
easiest and the most fun is to complain
[TS]
02:06:12
◼
►
about yeah now Westworld
[TS]
02:06:15
◼
►
started at a slight disadvantage because
[TS]
02:06:17
◼
►
I think I don't have a natural affinity
[TS]
02:06:20
◼
►
for the Wild West genre ah yeah and half
[TS]
02:06:24
◼
►
the show is kind of wild Westy obviously
[TS]
02:06:28
◼
►
half the shows in all the cool super
[TS]
02:06:29
◼
►
high-tech labs but half of the show is
[TS]
02:06:31
◼
►
out in the theme park ones all wild
[TS]
02:06:34
◼
►
Westy and I just don't have a natural
[TS]
02:06:37
◼
►
enjoyment of the
[TS]
02:06:38
◼
►
Wester Chandra don't Australians have
[TS]
02:06:40
◼
►
like a Wild West there must have been
[TS]
02:06:42
◼
►
like cowboy genres out in Australia
[TS]
02:06:44
◼
►
right yeah we we had our frontiers and
[TS]
02:06:46
◼
►
that doesn't mean that I like the genre
[TS]
02:06:48
◼
►
in films just because I'm from a country
[TS]
02:06:50
◼
►
where we had a frontier no I disagree
[TS]
02:06:53
◼
►
100 percent of Americans love the West
[TS]
02:06:55
◼
►
that's how that works
[TS]
02:06:56
◼
►
okay so that was a slight disadvantage
[TS]
02:06:58
◼
►
for me and I certainly enjoyed the
[TS]
02:07:02
◼
►
moments in the labs and things much more
[TS]
02:07:06
◼
►
than the scenes out in the park mmm that
[TS]
02:07:09
◼
►
appealed to me more and another thing I
[TS]
02:07:12
◼
►
would say about the series was I felt
[TS]
02:07:14
◼
►
like like it was a bit of a slow burn on
[TS]
02:07:16
◼
►
some of the storylines and I don't mind
[TS]
02:07:19
◼
►
a slow burn but I felt like maybe this
[TS]
02:07:22
◼
►
was too slow a burn and some of the
[TS]
02:07:24
◼
►
payoffs came a little bit too late I
[TS]
02:07:27
◼
►
think some of these storylines that you
[TS]
02:07:29
◼
►
invested in that later on how to pay off
[TS]
02:07:31
◼
►
maybe they should have sprinkled in some
[TS]
02:07:32
◼
►
of that a bit earlier because some of
[TS]
02:07:34
◼
►
the stuff some of the little twists and
[TS]
02:07:36
◼
►
things that came later on I thought oh
[TS]
02:07:39
◼
►
that's nice like I feel glad I watched
[TS]
02:07:41
◼
►
now I felt like if they sprinkled them
[TS]
02:07:43
◼
►
in earlier it would have pulled me
[TS]
02:07:45
◼
►
through the series a bit better rather
[TS]
02:07:46
◼
►
than kind of back loading all of the
[TS]
02:07:49
◼
►
twists and interesting stuff and maybe
[TS]
02:07:53
◼
►
that's why I enjoyed the second half
[TS]
02:07:55
◼
►
more because I felt like at last I was
[TS]
02:07:57
◼
►
getting some payment for my investment
[TS]
02:07:58
◼
►
in these stories so I was like okay I
[TS]
02:08:00
◼
►
see what you did there thank you took me
[TS]
02:08:03
◼
►
long enough but all right yeah I'll
[TS]
02:08:05
◼
►
agree that they probably could have cut
[TS]
02:08:07
◼
►
one episodes worth of contents and not
[TS]
02:08:10
◼
►
really suffered anything I think the
[TS]
02:08:13
◼
►
biggest problem though for me was there
[TS]
02:08:16
◼
►
were too many storylines and characters
[TS]
02:08:18
◼
►
that I didn't engage with and like hmm
[TS]
02:08:22
◼
►
so you know how when you're watching a
[TS]
02:08:24
◼
►
really good series that you really like
[TS]
02:08:25
◼
►
every time they cut to a new storyline
[TS]
02:08:27
◼
►
or a new person and what they're up to
[TS]
02:08:29
◼
►
you're like I forgot about this I loved
[TS]
02:08:31
◼
►
this one - mm-hmm like and there are
[TS]
02:08:33
◼
►
very few where it's like oh this is the
[TS]
02:08:34
◼
►
boring one this is when I have a cup of
[TS]
02:08:36
◼
►
coffee or not pad like a good series has
[TS]
02:08:39
◼
►
none of them a bad series has lots of
[TS]
02:08:41
◼
►
them Westworld had a couple like there
[TS]
02:08:43
◼
►
were a couple of times when it was like
[TS]
02:08:45
◼
►
no I don't like this one I wish they'd
[TS]
02:08:47
◼
►
go back to the other one if you remember
[TS]
02:08:48
◼
►
which which were some of the storylines
[TS]
02:08:50
◼
►
you found lesson
[TS]
02:08:52
◼
►
I can't specifically remember now in
[TS]
02:08:53
◼
►
hindsight but a lot of it was groups of
[TS]
02:08:55
◼
►
people riding around on horses going
[TS]
02:08:57
◼
►
places I didn't really know where they
[TS]
02:08:59
◼
►
were going okay
[TS]
02:09:02
◼
►
it's a pretty big swath of things I like
[TS]
02:09:05
◼
►
the people on the horses
[TS]
02:09:06
◼
►
yeah just to mention very briefly not to
[TS]
02:09:09
◼
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interject but a thing that I found
[TS]
02:09:10
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really interesting so one of the ways I
[TS]
02:09:13
◼
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like watching a series like this is I
[TS]
02:09:15
◼
►
sort of binge it all and then when it's
[TS]
02:09:19
◼
►
done the exciting part for me is like
[TS]
02:09:21
◼
►
now I'm gonna go on Reddit and see what
[TS]
02:09:24
◼
►
the discussions are when the whole thing
[TS]
02:09:25
◼
►
is done and over with yeah like I find
[TS]
02:09:27
◼
►
that a very very enjoyable part of some
[TS]
02:09:30
◼
►
bin jabal TV shows it's like I don't
[TS]
02:09:32
◼
►
want to follow this as we're going along
[TS]
02:09:33
◼
►
but I'm very interested afterward and
[TS]
02:09:36
◼
►
like a perfect example this is like mr.
[TS]
02:09:38
◼
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robot or stranger things where people
[TS]
02:09:41
◼
►
can point out stuff that you didn't
[TS]
02:09:42
◼
►
notice and so it was the same thing with
[TS]
02:09:44
◼
►
Westworld it was like okay great now I
[TS]
02:09:45
◼
►
want to go find all the details that
[TS]
02:09:47
◼
►
people have found in all this this
[TS]
02:09:48
◼
►
fabulous stuff but one of the other
[TS]
02:09:50
◼
►
reasons that I think is very interesting
[TS]
02:09:51
◼
►
is it seemed like there was a big
[TS]
02:09:54
◼
►
consensus that people did not like the
[TS]
02:09:57
◼
►
one storyline in particular which was
[TS]
02:10:00
◼
►
about the madam trying to escape from
[TS]
02:10:03
◼
►
West world that had like a whole bunch
[TS]
02:10:05
◼
►
of thumbs down of her constantly waking
[TS]
02:10:08
◼
►
up in technology land and trying to
[TS]
02:10:09
◼
►
escape from West world as I it's really
[TS]
02:10:11
◼
►
interesting to see how there can be a
[TS]
02:10:13
◼
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strong consensus about a thing that I
[TS]
02:10:16
◼
►
think if I had seen people talking about
[TS]
02:10:19
◼
►
that going along it might have infected
[TS]
02:10:21
◼
►
my mind but I thought like oh no I like
[TS]
02:10:23
◼
►
that part I had no issue with it
[TS]
02:10:25
◼
►
whatsoever so that's why I was just kind
[TS]
02:10:27
◼
►
of curious to see like did you hit upon
[TS]
02:10:28
◼
►
the thing well that at least commenters
[TS]
02:10:31
◼
►
on the Internet seemed to dislike the
[TS]
02:10:33
◼
►
I liked that storyline I liked that as a
[TS]
02:10:35
◼
►
character like I was interested in like
[TS]
02:10:37
◼
►
it kind of lost a bit of puff towards
[TS]
02:10:39
◼
►
the last episode or two yeah but overall
[TS]
02:10:41
◼
►
I liked her storyline the sandy Newton's
[TS]
02:10:44
◼
►
character but the weak link for me for
[TS]
02:10:47
◼
►
the show in terms of this kind of thing
[TS]
02:10:49
◼
►
mm-hmm was in a show filled with like
[TS]
02:10:52
◼
►
really good actors and actresses
[TS]
02:10:55
◼
►
was Dolores hmm
[TS]
02:10:58
◼
►
who was such an important character to
[TS]
02:11:00
◼
►
the show mm-hmm and she just got more
[TS]
02:11:03
◼
►
and more important as it went along to
[TS]
02:11:05
◼
►
the end where she was super important I
[TS]
02:11:06
◼
►
just never really liked her hmm and I
[TS]
02:11:09
◼
►
don't know if it was the way she was
[TS]
02:11:10
◼
►
written or if it was the way she was
[TS]
02:11:12
◼
►
acted but I just never cared about her
[TS]
02:11:15
◼
►
at all like I mean I know she's a robot
[TS]
02:11:17
◼
►
and stuff but like I didn't care about
[TS]
02:11:19
◼
►
robots I know I just never she was a big
[TS]
02:11:23
◼
►
weak link to me from always from the
[TS]
02:11:24
◼
►
first five minutes of the series right
[TS]
02:11:27
◼
►
to the end
[TS]
02:11:28
◼
►
I never warmed to her I never cared
[TS]
02:11:31
◼
►
about her I never wanted bad things to
[TS]
02:11:33
◼
►
happen to her or good things to happen
[TS]
02:11:34
◼
►
to her she just left me completely cold
[TS]
02:11:38
◼
►
in every way and because she was so
[TS]
02:11:41
◼
►
pivotal to what they were doing I don't
[TS]
02:11:44
◼
►
know who the actress is actually or if
[TS]
02:11:45
◼
►
she's like some mega superstar but I
[TS]
02:11:47
◼
►
felt like they could have done with like
[TS]
02:11:49
◼
►
a real heavy hitter in the acting
[TS]
02:11:51
◼
►
Department hmm in that role because you
[TS]
02:11:53
◼
►
know you got Ed Harris and Anthony
[TS]
02:11:54
◼
►
Hopkins and you got some got some good
[TS]
02:11:57
◼
►
actors in that show and really like
[TS]
02:11:59
◼
►
people who just really captivate you hmm
[TS]
02:12:01
◼
►
and she just was the opposite maybe it
[TS]
02:12:03
◼
►
was supposed to be that way and like it
[TS]
02:12:05
◼
►
was some act of genius but she was a
[TS]
02:12:07
◼
►
real weak link in the show for me hmm
[TS]
02:12:10
◼
►
and one last criticism I'll make before
[TS]
02:12:12
◼
►
I hand the floor to her friend is a
[TS]
02:12:16
◼
►
criticism you often make which i think
[TS]
02:12:19
◼
►
is one of my favorite ways you criticize
[TS]
02:12:21
◼
►
things but it is always a criticism is
[TS]
02:12:23
◼
►
your whoa dude criticism like that's a
[TS]
02:12:25
◼
►
way of saying something's trying to be
[TS]
02:12:27
◼
►
smart but it's not your kind of frat boy
[TS]
02:12:29
◼
►
puffing on a bong going well dude this
[TS]
02:12:32
◼
►
is like philosophy I think as I liked
[TS]
02:12:35
◼
►
Westfield but West Weald was whoa dude
[TS]
02:12:39
◼
►
for the pseudo-intellectual people who
[TS]
02:12:43
◼
►
like trendy glass concrete architecture
[TS]
02:12:46
◼
►
and cool iPads and people who say AI and
[TS]
02:12:49
◼
►
cognitive a lot hmm like it was whoa
[TS]
02:12:52
◼
►
dude dressed in sheep's clothing and
[TS]
02:12:55
◼
►
like most of the time it was you know
[TS]
02:12:57
◼
►
whoa what if the robots are alive well
[TS]
02:12:59
◼
►
what if this is that like it was whoa
[TS]
02:13:01
◼
►
dude all the time but for redditors who
[TS]
02:13:05
◼
►
think they're too smart to say whoa dude
[TS]
02:13:08
◼
►
there was a lot of that I like how you
[TS]
02:13:11
◼
►
portray that is a general criticism
[TS]
02:13:12
◼
►
whereas it was a criticism of one
[TS]
02:13:14
◼
►
particular book was the world dude but I
[TS]
02:13:17
◼
►
totally get what you're saying and this
[TS]
02:13:19
◼
►
is always whenever watching anything
[TS]
02:13:20
◼
►
that you have feeling of if it strikes
[TS]
02:13:23
◼
►
you you're always willing to go along
[TS]
02:13:25
◼
►
with stuff and if it doesn't strike you
[TS]
02:13:26
◼
►
you're not willing to go along with
[TS]
02:13:27
◼
►
stuff like that's how all movies and
[TS]
02:13:29
◼
►
media work and I can totally see how
[TS]
02:13:32
◼
►
especially in the earlier episodes if
[TS]
02:13:33
◼
►
you're not going along with it like the
[TS]
02:13:36
◼
►
ridiculous
[TS]
02:13:37
◼
►
set where it's like we all work in 100%
[TS]
02:13:39
◼
►
glass offices can feel like it's a
[TS]
02:13:42
◼
►
little much I can definitely see that
[TS]
02:13:44
◼
►
and they do have a little bit of their
[TS]
02:13:46
◼
►
techno jargon when they're talking about
[TS]
02:13:49
◼
►
oh these robots they have reveries and
[TS]
02:13:52
◼
►
they're able to remember their past
[TS]
02:13:53
◼
►
selves it is a bit like I would you're
[TS]
02:13:55
◼
►
going a bit far here like this stuff
[TS]
02:13:57
◼
►
doesn't really matter these details and
[TS]
02:13:59
◼
►
it feels like you're doing something to
[TS]
02:14:00
◼
►
do something so I can see how you could
[TS]
02:14:02
◼
►
feel that at certain parts in the show
[TS]
02:14:03
◼
►
but I like to I am genuinely glad that
[TS]
02:14:06
◼
►
you liked it I'm glad that you didn't
[TS]
02:14:07
◼
►
feel like it was a waste of your time no
[TS]
02:14:09
◼
►
definitely not tell me your thoughts
[TS]
02:14:11
◼
►
about it tell me what captured you and
[TS]
02:14:12
◼
►
what you liked and didn't like here's a
[TS]
02:14:14
◼
►
problem for me Brady is I feel like this
[TS]
02:14:17
◼
►
show was the center of a bull's eye for
[TS]
02:14:20
◼
►
a few things that then allowed me to go
[TS]
02:14:23
◼
►
along with a whole bunch of other stuff
[TS]
02:14:25
◼
►
and so center of the bullseye number one
[TS]
02:14:29
◼
►
is I love this environment of it's the
[TS]
02:14:34
◼
►
Wild West but it's also the future I
[TS]
02:14:37
◼
►
love this in West world I love this in
[TS]
02:14:41
◼
►
Firefly one of the video games I play
[TS]
02:14:44
◼
►
the most called rim world is also set in
[TS]
02:14:46
◼
►
this kind of like it's the Wild West but
[TS]
02:14:49
◼
►
it's also the future I don't know why
[TS]
02:14:51
◼
►
but I feel like this setting really
[TS]
02:14:54
◼
►
nails it for me I feel like there's
[TS]
02:14:57
◼
►
something about the fact that the
[TS]
02:14:58
◼
►
American idea of the Wild West is such
[TS]
02:15:00
◼
►
like a made-up thing anyway like what
[TS]
02:15:02
◼
►
Americans think the Wild West was is
[TS]
02:15:05
◼
►
like nothing at all like what the actual
[TS]
02:15:06
◼
►
Wild West was something about that to me
[TS]
02:15:09
◼
►
kind of lends itself in a strange way to
[TS]
02:15:11
◼
►
the science fiction genre like it's such
[TS]
02:15:14
◼
►
an artificial setting that I think using
[TS]
02:15:17
◼
►
it as the setting for this park
[TS]
02:15:21
◼
►
just works perfectly it's like this
[TS]
02:15:23
◼
►
wild-west it wasn't real in the first
[TS]
02:15:25
◼
►
place and now we're creating like a
[TS]
02:15:27
◼
►
little fantasy place for people to ride
[TS]
02:15:30
◼
►
around on horses that is totally the
[TS]
02:15:32
◼
►
center of the bullseye for me the other
[TS]
02:15:35
◼
►
thing which is going to be a little bit
[TS]
02:15:36
◼
►
hard to explain is this show was very
[TS]
02:15:41
◼
►
enjoyable to me on another level which
[TS]
02:15:44
◼
►
is I have played in the past massively
[TS]
02:15:48
◼
►
multiplayer online role-playing games so
[TS]
02:15:50
◼
►
things like World of Warcraft and I
[TS]
02:15:53
◼
►
would just love to know but like I think
[TS]
02:15:55
◼
►
the writers of this show had to be
[TS]
02:15:57
◼
►
fairly heavily influenced by the way
[TS]
02:16:00
◼
►
those games work because so much of this
[TS]
02:16:04
◼
►
show felt like oh we're going to do
[TS]
02:16:07
◼
►
world of warcraft but we're going to put
[TS]
02:16:10
◼
►
it in a real-world setting so there's
[TS]
02:16:12
◼
►
lots of elements in the show that I felt
[TS]
02:16:14
◼
►
like I'm enjoying this on two levels
[TS]
02:16:16
◼
►
because it's like oh the show is
[TS]
02:16:18
◼
►
happening but it's like they're kind of
[TS]
02:16:20
◼
►
calling out oh yes some of these
[TS]
02:16:22
◼
►
characters these are where quests begin
[TS]
02:16:24
◼
►
right this is the exact way it works in
[TS]
02:16:26
◼
►
World of Warcraft these event Nara tapes
[TS]
02:16:27
◼
►
I call them yeah the narratives right
[TS]
02:16:29
◼
►
but it's like in World of Warcraft
[TS]
02:16:31
◼
►
those characters have like golden
[TS]
02:16:33
◼
►
exclamation marks above their head so
[TS]
02:16:34
◼
►
you know like this is where a story can
[TS]
02:16:36
◼
►
begin yeah or the idea that like it gets
[TS]
02:16:38
◼
►
more dangerous the further out from the
[TS]
02:16:40
◼
►
center of town you go it's like oh of
[TS]
02:16:43
◼
►
there's like the protective starting
[TS]
02:16:45
◼
►
newbie area just like in all of these
[TS]
02:16:47
◼
►
games in the further you get from that
[TS]
02:16:48
◼
►
the more dangerous it gets so I feel
[TS]
02:16:50
◼
►
like there were so many things that felt
[TS]
02:16:52
◼
►
like they were intentional calls or
[TS]
02:16:55
◼
►
references to a particular kind of way
[TS]
02:16:58
◼
►
that certain video games work and then
[TS]
02:17:01
◼
►
that works for me on an additional level
[TS]
02:17:03
◼
►
because in those games I never really
[TS]
02:17:05
◼
►
care about the game at all
[TS]
02:17:06
◼
►
I only care about just exploring like
[TS]
02:17:08
◼
►
and riding around on a horse and then so
[TS]
02:17:11
◼
►
it's it's this double thing with like oh
[TS]
02:17:12
◼
►
of course in West world what do they do
[TS]
02:17:13
◼
►
they're riding around on horses like
[TS]
02:17:15
◼
►
they're exploring this whole world yeah
[TS]
02:17:17
◼
►
so I felt like again it just hit me in
[TS]
02:17:20
◼
►
the right spot in a couple of ways that
[TS]
02:17:23
◼
►
a bunch of stuff that in another show I
[TS]
02:17:26
◼
►
might have been annoyed with or find
[TS]
02:17:28
◼
►
tiresome I felt very happy to just go
[TS]
02:17:31
◼
►
along with it
[TS]
02:17:33
◼
►
I felt like I was really on board with
[TS]
02:17:35
◼
►
his show yeah okay and just in a way the
[TS]
02:17:37
◼
►
TV shows are made like what you were
[TS]
02:17:39
◼
►
saying before I felt like this is a
[TS]
02:17:42
◼
►
well-crafted show I like it when it
[TS]
02:17:44
◼
►
feels like effort has been put into
[TS]
02:17:46
◼
►
making an interesting watching
[TS]
02:17:49
◼
►
experience I thought it's a show that
[TS]
02:17:51
◼
►
did a great job of naturally exploring
[TS]
02:17:55
◼
►
its own premise yeah so a lot of the
[TS]
02:17:57
◼
►
things that they did of like oh of
[TS]
02:17:58
◼
►
course we're in an amusement park where
[TS]
02:18:01
◼
►
some people are robots and so since
[TS]
02:18:03
◼
►
those people who are robots they don't
[TS]
02:18:04
◼
►
age we can show you things out of order
[TS]
02:18:07
◼
►
and you won't realize it until later
[TS]
02:18:09
◼
►
yeah because the robots are always
[TS]
02:18:12
◼
►
looking the same but the people who
[TS]
02:18:14
◼
►
aren't robots look different I didn't
[TS]
02:18:15
◼
►
see that coming to be honest that was
[TS]
02:18:17
◼
►
quite well done yeah I have to say like
[TS]
02:18:18
◼
►
sometimes when you're watching shows you
[TS]
02:18:20
◼
►
feel like oh I know where this is going
[TS]
02:18:22
◼
►
and even in a show like this you're like
[TS]
02:18:23
◼
►
someone's gonna be a robot who is in a
[TS]
02:18:25
◼
►
robot like obviously right we know this
[TS]
02:18:27
◼
►
is how these stories work but I still
[TS]
02:18:30
◼
►
felt like they did it in an interesting
[TS]
02:18:32
◼
►
way adding in this fact that you're
[TS]
02:18:34
◼
►
constantly seeing stuff out of order and
[TS]
02:18:37
◼
►
not realizing it added to the
[TS]
02:18:40
◼
►
interestingness of it and I went back
[TS]
02:18:42
◼
►
and watched a few of the earlier
[TS]
02:18:43
◼
►
episodes again knowing that I was like
[TS]
02:18:45
◼
►
oh yes this is doubly clever like I'm
[TS]
02:18:47
◼
►
getting an enjoying viewing experience
[TS]
02:18:49
◼
►
the second time through in a different
[TS]
02:18:51
◼
►
way hmm which by the way is one of the
[TS]
02:18:54
◼
►
reasons why I love the reddit because
[TS]
02:18:55
◼
►
people were pointing out that if you
[TS]
02:18:57
◼
►
know that there are these two different
[TS]
02:18:59
◼
►
timelines there's all sorts of little
[TS]
02:19:01
◼
►
clues in all of the scenes that let you
[TS]
02:19:03
◼
►
know right where you are in time like
[TS]
02:19:06
◼
►
stuff in the background is different
[TS]
02:19:07
◼
►
that you just don't notice on the first
[TS]
02:19:08
◼
►
one or so
[TS]
02:19:10
◼
►
so I'd say like I just felt like really
[TS]
02:19:12
◼
►
great show explored its premise I liked
[TS]
02:19:15
◼
►
it a whole lot I'm frankly a little
[TS]
02:19:18
◼
►
concerned that there's going to be a
[TS]
02:19:19
◼
►
season two because I feel like it's a
[TS]
02:19:21
◼
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nice little self-contained thing I don't
[TS]
02:19:23
◼
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really feel like there's a need for
[TS]
02:19:24
◼
►
another season here at the end I did cuz
[TS]
02:19:26
◼
►
I didn't know if I'm making season 2 or
[TS]
02:19:28
◼
►
not but I did think well obviously
[TS]
02:19:29
◼
►
they're setting up season 2 or you could
[TS]
02:19:31
◼
►
end it there really class early but
[TS]
02:19:33
◼
►
they're going season 2 are they you can
[TS]
02:19:35
◼
►
never enter classily right it's like
[TS]
02:19:37
◼
►
I've seen a couple of shows where I feel
[TS]
02:19:38
◼
►
like oh what a nice complete first
[TS]
02:19:40
◼
►
season we could end it there oh there's
[TS]
02:19:43
◼
►
going to be another one like well are we
[TS]
02:19:45
◼
►
going to go to Samurai
[TS]
02:19:46
◼
►
and for season two that they hinted at I
[TS]
02:19:48
◼
►
feel I feel ready to be disappointed by
[TS]
02:19:50
◼
►
a second season because the first season
[TS]
02:19:52
◼
►
was just such a nice self-contained
[TS]
02:19:54
◼
►
thing so I really liked it was there
[TS]
02:19:57
◼
►
anything you didn't like what did you
[TS]
02:19:59
◼
►
think about all the storylines and the
[TS]
02:20:00
◼
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characters and the acting and the what
[TS]
02:20:02
◼
►
do you think of the character
[TS]
02:20:03
◼
►
development you haven't talked about
[TS]
02:20:04
◼
►
that side of things at all really well I
[TS]
02:20:06
◼
►
guess because again I was mostly on
[TS]
02:20:07
◼
►
board with it I agree with some of the
[TS]
02:20:09
◼
►
things you say like there were a couple
[TS]
02:20:10
◼
►
places where I felt like it was dragging
[TS]
02:20:12
◼
►
a little bit towards the end but again
[TS]
02:20:16
◼
►
I'm also marathoning these things over
[TS]
02:20:18
◼
►
two days yeah and I feel like that leads
[TS]
02:20:20
◼
►
to a very different viewing experience
[TS]
02:20:23
◼
►
than if you're watching it yeah
[TS]
02:20:24
◼
►
segmented Lee so I really don't have any
[TS]
02:20:28
◼
►
major complaints I just think it was
[TS]
02:20:31
◼
►
interesting and well done and I liked it
[TS]
02:20:33
◼
►
two thumbs up and it's probably one of
[TS]
02:20:35
◼
►
the I'm going to say one of the top TV
[TS]
02:20:38
◼
►
viewing experiences I've had in a very
[TS]
02:20:40
◼
►
long time
[TS]
02:20:40
◼
►
so I don't actually have a long list of
[TS]
02:20:43
◼
►
complaints but I do recognize that there
[TS]
02:20:47
◼
►
are things that I would complain about
[TS]
02:20:48
◼
►
in a less well-done show but I was fine
[TS]
02:20:51
◼
►
with them in this show I'm very happy
[TS]
02:20:53
◼
►
with it
[TS]
02:20:53
◼
►
I guess like a thing that I think is a
[TS]
02:20:55
◼
►
kind of interesting question which is
[TS]
02:20:57
◼
►
not really about the show by like I've
[TS]
02:20:58
◼
►
been wondering and I don't have a good
[TS]
02:21:00
◼
►
answer to this I would like to know if
[TS]
02:21:03
◼
►
you would go to Westworld like if this
[TS]
02:21:05
◼
►
was a real thing would you go brady i
[TS]
02:21:07
◼
►
feel like i have no idea how you would
[TS]
02:21:10
◼
►
answer this I reckon I would yeah you
[TS]
02:21:12
◼
►
would okay why would you go oh I like a
[TS]
02:21:15
◼
►
good adventure mm-hmm and you know I
[TS]
02:21:18
◼
►
like that it's kind of exclusive and
[TS]
02:21:20
◼
►
posh as well because that is that part
[TS]
02:21:24
◼
►
of what you like about it
[TS]
02:21:25
◼
►
interesting yeah it looks like they take
[TS]
02:21:26
◼
►
care of their customers uh-huh
[TS]
02:21:29
◼
►
you know you think you get the respect
[TS]
02:21:31
◼
►
you deserve see exactly what yeah and
[TS]
02:21:32
◼
►
I'd like the adventure of like getting
[TS]
02:21:34
◼
►
to you know have adventures with guns
[TS]
02:21:37
◼
►
and stuff without being scared of dying
[TS]
02:21:40
◼
►
so you know because I quite like you
[TS]
02:21:41
◼
►
know I like playing paintball and things
[TS]
02:21:43
◼
►
like that I always find that quite
[TS]
02:21:44
◼
►
adventurous you know running around the
[TS]
02:21:46
◼
►
forest and shooting and stuff here's the
[TS]
02:21:48
◼
►
thing that I've wondered that so that
[TS]
02:21:49
◼
►
the fakeness of it wouldn't bother you
[TS]
02:21:53
◼
►
like the fact that it's all set up and
[TS]
02:21:55
◼
►
that you know that you're protected that
[TS]
02:21:56
◼
►
wouldn't undermine it for you no I think
[TS]
02:21:58
◼
►
I would appreciate
[TS]
02:21:59
◼
►
a the safety of it hmm in the context of
[TS]
02:22:02
◼
►
it's a place where you go to escape and
[TS]
02:22:04
◼
►
have adventures and you know mm-hmm you
[TS]
02:22:06
◼
►
know I wouldn't go there trying to like
[TS]
02:22:07
◼
►
yeah make new friends better what about
[TS]
02:22:11
◼
►
you would you go to West world oh my god
[TS]
02:22:13
◼
►
yeah of course in the heartbeat I would
[TS]
02:22:14
◼
►
go why because that to me seems like the
[TS]
02:22:17
◼
►
perfect kind of adventure to have where
[TS]
02:22:19
◼
►
I don't want to ride around on a horse
[TS]
02:22:21
◼
►
in the real American West yeah
[TS]
02:22:24
◼
►
because I can die of thirst or get stung
[TS]
02:22:28
◼
►
by a scorpion all right like there's all
[TS]
02:22:29
◼
►
kinds of bad things that can happen yeah
[TS]
02:22:31
◼
►
and so I would ride around in in West
[TS]
02:22:34
◼
►
world for the same reason that I rode
[TS]
02:22:36
◼
►
around in World of Warcraft because
[TS]
02:22:38
◼
►
there is some kind of pleasure to
[TS]
02:22:41
◼
►
exploring new things and that could be
[TS]
02:22:45
◼
►
achieved in this kind of environment and
[TS]
02:22:46
◼
►
the fact that it's a safe environment
[TS]
02:22:49
◼
►
allows you to have a certain kind of
[TS]
02:22:52
◼
►
more adventurous fun than you normally
[TS]
02:22:53
◼
►
would so oh yeah I would be on board
[TS]
02:22:55
◼
►
immediately and also I would go to West
[TS]
02:22:58
◼
►
you can keep your samurai world that
[TS]
02:23:01
◼
►
sounds really boring and uninteresting I
[TS]
02:23:03
◼
►
have no desire to go there to take it a
[TS]
02:23:04
◼
►
step further and to take it where the
[TS]
02:23:06
◼
►
show took it would you have ethical
[TS]
02:23:08
◼
►
concerns about what was being done to
[TS]
02:23:10
◼
►
the hosts is it cruel what they're doing
[TS]
02:23:12
◼
►
to those robots so that's the
[TS]
02:23:14
◼
►
interesting question right I think if a
[TS]
02:23:17
◼
►
real-life West world had this kind of
[TS]
02:23:20
◼
►
technology and the robots were actually
[TS]
02:23:24
◼
►
conscious then to me it's like it's
[TS]
02:23:26
◼
►
unambiguous this is morally
[TS]
02:23:28
◼
►
reprehensible right this is essentially
[TS]
02:23:30
◼
►
slavery I don't think there's any way
[TS]
02:23:32
◼
►
you can argue around that if they're
[TS]
02:23:34
◼
►
conscious but what I what I have found
[TS]
02:23:36
◼
►
really interesting is it seems like
[TS]
02:23:38
◼
►
people disagree on the morality of it if
[TS]
02:23:43
◼
►
West's world works in a sense the way
[TS]
02:23:45
◼
►
it's supposed to that the robots are
[TS]
02:23:48
◼
►
just complicated toasters right that
[TS]
02:23:50
◼
►
there's nothing inside that they don't
[TS]
02:23:52
◼
►
have any actual feelings that they're
[TS]
02:23:54
◼
►
just simulating experience and emotion
[TS]
02:23:57
◼
►
and then I feel like well I have no
[TS]
02:24:00
◼
►
problem with this in the same way that I
[TS]
02:24:02
◼
►
don't have a problem with Disney's Hall
[TS]
02:24:05
◼
►
of Presidents right like there's no
[TS]
02:24:06
◼
►
moral problem there you've just made a
[TS]
02:24:09
◼
►
thing that's much more convincing but
[TS]
02:24:12
◼
►
it's interesting that like
[TS]
02:24:13
◼
►
from people I've spoken to about the
[TS]
02:24:16
◼
►
show it seems like in some people's
[TS]
02:24:18
◼
►
minds there's a line that gets crossed
[TS]
02:24:20
◼
►
if a thing becomes too convincingly
[TS]
02:24:23
◼
►
human then it's a moral even if the
[TS]
02:24:27
◼
►
thing isn't conscious where do you sit
[TS]
02:24:30
◼
►
on that line what's the question it is
[TS]
02:24:32
◼
►
the question that if it seems to human
[TS]
02:24:34
◼
►
will I start thinking it's conscious
[TS]
02:24:36
◼
►
there's two questions what I think is
[TS]
02:24:37
◼
►
the easy question is Westworld wrong
[TS]
02:24:41
◼
►
morally wrong if the robots inside of it
[TS]
02:24:44
◼
►
are conscious creatures yeah if they're
[TS]
02:24:46
◼
►
conscious in the way that I'm conscious
[TS]
02:24:48
◼
►
yeah in the way that you're conscious
[TS]
02:24:49
◼
►
right so like when when people are
[TS]
02:24:51
◼
►
stabbing them they're feeling pain
[TS]
02:24:53
◼
►
yeah stabbing them and raping them and
[TS]
02:24:56
◼
►
shooting them in the head and if they're
[TS]
02:24:58
◼
►
conscious then yes yes yeah that's the
[TS]
02:25:01
◼
►
easy question yeah the harder question
[TS]
02:25:04
◼
►
is it morally wrong if they're not
[TS]
02:25:08
◼
►
conscious if they are like a mechanical
[TS]
02:25:11
◼
►
object that experiences nothing then in
[TS]
02:25:14
◼
►
most cases no because it's no different
[TS]
02:25:17
◼
►
to shooting a bottle of a shelf at a
[TS]
02:25:20
◼
►
shooting gallery if it's just a
[TS]
02:25:22
◼
►
inanimate object okay so what do you
[TS]
02:25:24
◼
►
mean by most cases though well it does
[TS]
02:25:27
◼
►
start raising questions where you're
[TS]
02:25:30
◼
►
tapping into the dark side of the humans
[TS]
02:25:34
◼
►
so you know if a human's going to this
[TS]
02:25:37
◼
►
place to start performing depraved acts
[TS]
02:25:40
◼
►
and feeding and fueling sides of their
[TS]
02:25:44
◼
►
personality that a morally ambiguous you
[TS]
02:25:47
◼
►
could probably have conversations around
[TS]
02:25:49
◼
►
that is it right for you know a married
[TS]
02:25:53
◼
►
man or woman to go to this place and
[TS]
02:25:55
◼
►
start performing acts and doing things
[TS]
02:25:57
◼
►
that they wouldn't do in the real world
[TS]
02:25:59
◼
►
because they can get away with it
[TS]
02:26:00
◼
►
they're then then you could start having
[TS]
02:26:01
◼
►
a conversation around that mm-hmm I
[TS]
02:26:04
◼
►
don't know where that conversation would
[TS]
02:26:05
◼
►
take you but that obviously is
[TS]
02:26:09
◼
►
questionable isn't it like you know you
[TS]
02:26:11
◼
►
displaying your murderer you know or
[TS]
02:26:12
◼
►
going there to act out your murderous
[TS]
02:26:15
◼
►
intent is that a good thing to do is it
[TS]
02:26:18
◼
►
good for there to be a place where
[TS]
02:26:19
◼
►
people can act on impulses they wouldn't
[TS]
02:26:22
◼
►
act on in the real world sometimes I
[TS]
02:26:24
◼
►
think that's okay other time it's maybe
[TS]
02:26:26
◼
►
not I don't know yeah I think there's a
[TS]
02:26:27
◼
►
two questions here in this which is
[TS]
02:26:30
◼
►
someone's actions in Westworld even if
[TS]
02:26:34
◼
►
there's nothing morally wrong because
[TS]
02:26:37
◼
►
the robots are not feeling anything and
[TS]
02:26:39
◼
►
it feels like it could raise some
[TS]
02:26:41
◼
►
questions about the person though yeah
[TS]
02:26:43
◼
►
like if you know your buddy goes to West
[TS]
02:26:45
◼
►
world and he spends his day torturing
[TS]
02:26:47
◼
►
the robots yeah slowly and in detailed
[TS]
02:26:50
◼
►
ways I'd feel a little uncomfortable
[TS]
02:26:52
◼
►
letting him take care of my dog for the
[TS]
02:26:54
◼
►
weekend yeah right because I feel like
[TS]
02:26:56
◼
►
you're getting some information about
[TS]
02:26:57
◼
►
the person yeah
[TS]
02:26:59
◼
►
and that's that's like an uncomfortable
[TS]
02:27:01
◼
►
thing because you're finding out
[TS]
02:27:02
◼
►
something about a person but it's more
[TS]
02:27:04
◼
►
than just finding out about it is it
[TS]
02:27:06
◼
►
also cultivating it isn't starting to
[TS]
02:27:08
◼
►
you know breed those impulses and make
[TS]
02:27:10
◼
►
them more likely to be act upon that's
[TS]
02:27:12
◼
►
where it becomes an interesting question
[TS]
02:27:13
◼
►
that is an interesting question but what
[TS]
02:27:14
◼
►
I also find interesting though is that I
[TS]
02:27:16
◼
►
have found disagreement with people
[TS]
02:27:18
◼
►
about whether or not that would be wrong
[TS]
02:27:22
◼
►
for someone to do right even if the
[TS]
02:27:25
◼
►
thing isn't experience anything it's
[TS]
02:27:28
◼
►
interesting that there seemed
[TS]
02:27:29
◼
►
disagreement over here and I like when I
[TS]
02:27:30
◼
►
was watching the show I kept being aware
[TS]
02:27:32
◼
►
of like if I was in West world I would
[TS]
02:27:34
◼
►
be playing it the same way that I played
[TS]
02:27:36
◼
►
World of Warcraft which is essentially
[TS]
02:27:37
◼
►
like I don't care about your quests
[TS]
02:27:39
◼
►
right I just want to ride my horse
[TS]
02:27:40
◼
►
around and explore these different areas
[TS]
02:27:42
◼
►
and if I did do any of those quests or
[TS]
02:27:47
◼
►
those adventures I was trying to think
[TS]
02:27:49
◼
►
like where is the line how far would I
[TS]
02:27:51
◼
►
want to push this line and it's like oh
[TS]
02:27:54
◼
►
I could see a fun adventure where I'm
[TS]
02:27:56
◼
►
shooting bandits at a distance and an
[TS]
02:28:01
◼
►
adventure like there's some guys on a
[TS]
02:28:02
◼
►
mountaintop that I'm shooting yeah but
[TS]
02:28:04
◼
►
boy is it gets closer and closer it
[TS]
02:28:06
◼
►
becomes more and more uncomfortable
[TS]
02:28:07
◼
►
sticking and nothing they got and right
[TS]
02:28:09
◼
►
yeah and it's like that's what I was
[TS]
02:28:11
◼
►
trying to think it's like okay
[TS]
02:28:11
◼
►
hand-to-hand combat with knives even if
[TS]
02:28:15
◼
►
I think the robot is unconscious that
[TS]
02:28:18
◼
►
feels uncomfortable like that would not
[TS]
02:28:20
◼
►
be an enjoyable experience yeah
[TS]
02:28:22
◼
►
I think like it's just interesting to
[TS]
02:28:24
◼
►
kind of think it through it's like oh I
[TS]
02:28:25
◼
►
could imagine enjoying an adventure
[TS]
02:28:29
◼
►
where you're shooting someone at a
[TS]
02:28:31
◼
►
distance but like the hand-to-hand stuff
[TS]
02:28:33
◼
►
it's like even if this is not a real
[TS]
02:28:36
◼
►
thing like this this robot is not
[TS]
02:28:37
◼
►
conscious it's not experience anything
[TS]
02:28:39
◼
►
it's like I don't want to do this right
[TS]
02:28:41
◼
►
like I don't want to slit
[TS]
02:28:42
◼
►
guys neck right up close even if none of
[TS]
02:28:45
◼
►
its real and I'm ultimately safe and no
[TS]
02:28:48
◼
►
one is being harmed like it just it
[TS]
02:28:50
◼
►
would feel like it's personally crossing
[TS]
02:28:51
◼
►
some kind of line like this is not an
[TS]
02:28:53
◼
►
enjoyable experience and I would find it
[TS]
02:28:55
◼
►
concerning if we're in West world and
[TS]
02:28:58
◼
►
like somebody else's is doing that all
[TS]
02:29:01
◼
►
the time
[TS]
02:29:01
◼
►
it's why I think I think the show is an
[TS]
02:29:03
◼
►
interesting point of conversation around
[TS]
02:29:07
◼
►
some of that stuff yeah it's sort of
[TS]
02:29:10
◼
►
like the holodeck question like you
[TS]
02:29:11
◼
►
mentioned before they have you on Star
[TS]
02:29:13
◼
►
Trek when they use the holodeck like can
[TS]
02:29:15
◼
►
you cheat on your spouse in the holodeck
[TS]
02:29:17
◼
►
there's some disagreement about whether
[TS]
02:29:19
◼
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or not that's cheating yeah it's a
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question without a good answer in date
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in date anyway two thumbs up from West
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world for me well I haven't watched it
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and you've listened somehow go watch it
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I guess
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did you see how Netflix now has switched
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to you give a thumbs up or a thumbs down
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to a show at the end and no more star
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02:29:36
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ratings Oh have they yeah oh I can't
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believe you haven't seen that everyone's
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been pointing that out to us oh I miss I
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02:29:42
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missed that somehow you must take that
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as a big victory did I promote that in
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the past at one point did I say did I
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promote everyone's talking to me like
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it's a victory for me but I keep
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thinking why are you saying that's a
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victory for me that sounds like a
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victory for grey you know me i'm i was
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using minutes on a clock to rate the
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film so if i ever promoted that i don't
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remember
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but you're more like thumbs up or thumbs
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down to whether things are good or not
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you're not one for like you know three
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and a half stars or seven out of ten
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you're like thumbs up or thumbs down i
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yeah i like thumbs up for movies yeah
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cuz i think maybe what people are
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remembering is i know we had a
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02:30:22
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conversation a long time ago about with
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02:30:24
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five star ratings on youtube before
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02:30:26
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youtube switched everybody was either
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02:30:28
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giving things five stars or one star
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like that that's what tends to happen
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with readings that are 5 so like i bet
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02:30:34
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that happens with uber right that the
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ratings are like yeah five stars or one
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star yeah i remember being born out of
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02:30:39
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you giving a thumbs down to her which i
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02:30:41
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couldn't believe like i oh yeah
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thumbs down a strong thumbs dan yeah
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yeah yes sir i'm some sticking by that
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reading but yeah yeah okay yeah just to
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be clear yeah I recommend nobody watch
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her boring
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and you did whole you did bite your
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tongue enough so good yeah I'm glad you
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02:31:57
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you thought I bit my tongue enough yeah
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I let that statement slide and that's a
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02:32:01
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compliment to you by the way that wasn't
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02:32:03
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like that was that was like saying you
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02:32:04
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were very gracious I was I was sticking
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a fork in my leg the whole time like
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don't say anything don't use very
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gracious you were very gracious
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