44: A Little Bit More Sad


00:00:00   [Music] [TS]

00:00:02   you're listening to hypercritical a [TS]

00:00:04   weekly talkshow ruminating on exactly [TS]

00:00:06   what is wrong in the world of Apple and [TS]

00:00:08   related technologies and businesses [TS]

00:00:10   nothing is so perfect that it can't be [TS]

00:00:12   complained about by my co-host John [TS]

00:00:14   siracusa I'm Dan benjamin today is [TS]

00:00:17   november 25th 2011 this is episode [TS]

00:00:20   number 44 we want to say thanks to [TS]

00:00:22   united pixel workers calm mailchimp.com [TS]

00:00:26   and reinvigorate reinvigorate by the way [TS]

00:00:29   is providing our bandwidth for this [TS]

00:00:31   episode simple affordable heat maps and [TS]

00:00:34   web stats check them out at reinvigorate [TS]

00:00:36   net use coupon code 5x5 and you had 10% [TS]

00:00:39   off life of your order how you been [TS]

00:00:43   just dandy dandy huh how was your [TS]

00:00:46   Thanksgiving this is the day after [TS]

00:00:48   Thanksgiving 2011 it's November 25th [TS]

00:00:51   mm-hmm [TS]

00:00:52   special days going for a run four people [TS]

00:00:54   here in the united states america they [TS]

00:00:57   abreast are you are you resting yeah i'm [TS]

00:01:01   not going to work well that's good yeah [TS]

00:01:05   I mean that's something mm-hmm is [TS]

00:01:08   usually what I don't know people know [TS]

00:01:09   this or not but you are you're [TS]

00:01:12   frequently taking you know your lunch [TS]

00:01:15   break here you're away from work and [TS]

00:01:18   you're here to record and that's usually [TS]

00:01:21   that's your mo that's right run the [TS]

00:01:25   middle of a workday crazy would you do [TS]

00:01:31   for Thanksgiving anything exciting [TS]

00:01:33   anything special no just the usual what [TS]

00:01:36   is the usual stuffing mashed potatoes oh [TS]

00:01:41   sweet potatoes pies you know whole nine [TS]

00:01:44   yards [TS]

00:01:44   I didn't host it myself this year Oh [TS]

00:01:48   where'd you go kind of just went to a [TS]

00:01:50   friend's house it's kind of a relief not [TS]

00:01:52   that at all that cooking but the [TS]

00:01:53   downside is that you don't have all the [TS]

00:01:56   leftovers also you're you you've got [TS]

00:01:59   nothing to eat today nothing special [TS]

00:02:00   other than I guess I got some month or [TS]

00:02:02   is like you know that the shared here's [TS]

00:02:04   some leftovers here to take home kind of [TS]

00:02:06   leftovers but it's not the same as when [TS]

00:02:07   you make it yourself and you have all [TS]

00:02:08   the leftovers are the majority of the [TS]

00:02:10   leftovers [TS]

00:02:13   what did you guys do uh we we had out of [TS]

00:02:17   here [TS]

00:02:18   we had one guest my brother-in-law was a [TS]

00:02:20   guest and of course we've got the the [TS]

00:02:22   two kids one of whom is not you know [TS]

00:02:25   eating solid food because she's a little [TS]

00:02:27   tiny baby but they was still quite you [TS]

00:02:30   know quite equating quite an ordeal [TS]

00:02:31   trying to you know because you've got [TS]

00:02:33   you've got a kid you get a guest you've [TS]

00:02:36   got lots of different items to prepare [TS]

00:02:39   it was a production it's enough you know [TS]

00:02:44   once a year or doing that but then you [TS]

00:02:48   kind of got to do it again at Christmas [TS]

00:02:52   right yeah not as bad as the turkey [TS]

00:02:56   though the turkeys always a big thing [TS]

00:02:58   because you have more options for [TS]

00:02:59   Christmas dinner like you could do a ham [TS]

00:03:02   I guess yeah much easier no to cook the [TS]

00:03:04   turkey what do you do with a hand how [TS]

00:03:06   does that work usually you buy the ones [TS]

00:03:08   that already cooked in you just [TS]

00:03:08   basically heating it up nothing you can [TS]

00:03:11   do that with a turkey no come on now you [TS]

00:03:14   go to Whole Foods you get there they're [TS]

00:03:16   you know free-range pasture turkey and [TS]

00:03:19   that's all or anything it's already [TS]

00:03:21   cooked well it's it's what they call [TS]

00:03:23   pre-roasted so it's not like it's it's [TS]

00:03:24   like you're getting it in a you know [TS]

00:03:26   like a heated thing like a take at it [TS]

00:03:29   you know a drive-thru or something you [TS]

00:03:30   still have to heat it up and that's not [TS]

00:03:32   good oh it's very good big thumbs down [TS]

00:03:34   on that take my word for a big huge [TS]

00:03:36   thumbs up in fact the thumb that is [TS]

00:03:38   doing the thumbs up is so supreme that [TS]

00:03:42   it just destroyed your entire thumb [TS]

00:03:44   that's how that's how much of a thumbs [TS]

00:03:46   up that I'm giving this you go to Whole [TS]

00:03:49   Foods and you get one of their [TS]

00:03:50   pre-roasted turkeys it will be the best [TS]

00:03:52   turkey you've ever had how do you feel [TS]

00:03:54   about tofurkey I don't even get me [TS]

00:03:57   started [TS]

00:03:58   all right and keep in mind keep in mind [TS]

00:04:01   that was Leo I was of no it's not that [TS]

00:04:03   because it's made from tofu which is [TS]

00:04:06   made from soy which is not paleo that's [TS]

00:04:07   not paleo no soy is the antithesis of [TS]

00:04:10   paleo maybe second to gluten and sugar [TS]

00:04:12   um but no and keep in mind I was a [TS]

00:04:15   vegetarian for many years and I would I [TS]

00:04:17   still never ate a Tofurky alright me [TS]

00:04:20   neither but alright just trying to put [TS]

00:04:23   some boundaries on your mm-hmm food [TS]

00:04:26   tastes good free [TS]

00:04:27   so you're ready to start I thought we [TS]

00:04:29   had well you know start start yeah so [TS]

00:04:33   well I'm definitely ready then all right [TS]

00:04:35   considering I thought that we had [TS]

00:04:36   started and in fact we had not started [TS]

00:04:38   then I would definitely say Murray this [TS]

00:04:40   this ain't no back to work [TS]

00:04:41   it's not like we start and then we [TS]

00:04:42   started and we really start the show [TS]

00:04:44   gets better as that show goes on and we [TS]

00:04:46   need the problem is you get a warm [TS]

00:04:47   Merlin up he ki he starts cold and he [TS]

00:04:49   thinks he's doing you know he thinks [TS]

00:04:51   he's doing all right and then you [TS]

00:04:53   compare that to 20 minutes later he's on [TS]

00:04:55   fire you start out and you're pretty [TS]

00:04:58   much level-headed the whole way through [TS]

00:04:59   or whatever the equivalent of that is [TS]

00:05:01   for you all right [TS]

00:05:03   then we have two small items that follow [TS]

00:05:06   up the best and worst kind of follow up [TS]

00:05:09   what is the best numbers kind of follow [TS]

00:05:10   it was the best of follow ups it was the [TS]

00:05:12   worst of follow ups yeah [TS]

00:05:14   it's pronunciation follow up oh it is [TS]

00:05:17   the worst probably it's always the worst [TS]

00:05:19   if you don't care about these things but [TS]

00:05:20   it's also the best okay all right so I [TS]

00:05:24   don't even know why this is in my notes [TS]

00:05:25   here but it is so I assume I said the [TS]

00:05:27   name of a burner VI ng e the science [TS]

00:05:32   fiction author that I say that on the [TS]

00:05:33   show at any point hmm it seems like the [TS]

00:05:39   only reason I can imagine it would be in [TS]

00:05:41   my notes is that I settled on this show [TS]

00:05:43   well anyway it's in my notes so I'm [TS]

00:05:45   going to go to so that science fiction [TS]

00:05:47   author girl in a fan of his last name [TS]

00:05:49   spelled VI ng E is apparently pronounced [TS]

00:05:52   vinji and not Vinge Blanche said in my [TS]

00:05:58   head through my entire life and many [TS]

00:06:00   times out loud VI ng is VIN G I've got [TS]

00:06:04   that like secondhand from people who [TS]

00:06:07   have talked to the man himself and [TS]

00:06:09   millions all the people who are also [TS]

00:06:11   convinced that's the way you say his [TS]

00:06:12   name because they probably heard him [TS]

00:06:13   talk or seen a pronunciation guide or [TS]

00:06:15   read it on Wikipedia but ever vinji that [TS]

00:06:17   kind of blew my mind because it was a [TS]

00:06:19   one name I didn't think I was [TS]

00:06:20   mispronouncing but apparently I was and [TS]

00:06:23   the next one that I know I did mention [TS]

00:06:25   on this show a couple of times and [TS]

00:06:27   someone I felt compelled to write in [TS]

00:06:30   after hearing it on multiple shows marry [TS]

00:06:31   me mangle it is the video game [TS]

00:06:33   originally a PlayStation 2 video game [TS]

00:06:35   and now remastered for the PlayStation 3 [TS]

00:06:37   the name of the game is spelled ICO [TS]

00:06:40   and I've always been pronouncing that as [TS]

00:06:43   ICO I don't know why I've chosen to [TS]

00:06:46   pronounce it that way but that's just [TS]

00:06:47   the way keep No [TS]

00:06:50   I've been saying it apparently that's [TS]

00:06:51   wrong well this is from Alex montine I'm [TS]

00:06:56   sorry Alex if I'm mispronouncing your [TS]

00:06:57   name mu n tean and he didn't really [TS]

00:07:01   clarify if he lives in Japan speaks [TS]

00:07:04   Japanese or just learned it or whatever [TS]

00:07:06   but apparently the name in on the [TS]

00:07:10   Japanese game is two characters and [TS]

00:07:11   first character is pronounced like a [TS]

00:07:14   like the letter e like E and the second [TS]

00:07:16   character is pronounced ko so it should [TS]

00:07:18   be eco not Aiko and what he says about [TS]

00:07:22   it is uh in Japanese it's a made-up word [TS]

00:07:24   as far as he knows it says it doesn't [TS]

00:07:26   have any meaning that's why it's written [TS]

00:07:27   in katakana which is the sole very used [TS]

00:07:30   for most foreign names or loan words and [TS]

00:07:33   Japanese this I think is a couple of [TS]

00:07:34   phonetic alphabets but katakana is one [TS]

00:07:36   of them and there's one pronunciation [TS]

00:07:37   for each symbol no matter what the [TS]

00:07:39   context so it's not like English where [TS]

00:07:41   the same letters can be pronounced [TS]

00:07:42   twenty different ways depending on where [TS]

00:07:44   they are completely silent or whatever [TS]

00:07:45   it's so it's very clear in Japanese [TS]

00:07:47   these doing ours it's eco instead of [TS]

00:07:48   Eiko now I still am unsure what the game [TS]

00:07:54   manufacturer Sony or whatever intends [TS]

00:07:56   for the American pronunciation of this [TS]

00:07:58   game today clearly this is what the game [TS]

00:07:59   should be called in Japanese but there [TS]

00:08:00   are many cases where words in English [TS]

00:08:04   eventually have different pronunciations [TS]

00:08:06   in the words and other languages and [TS]

00:08:07   even for products they they will say [TS]

00:08:09   well you know even though this is how [TS]

00:08:11   you pronounce it if you're pronouncing [TS]

00:08:12   your name correctly in French or in [TS]

00:08:14   Japanese or whatever in English the [TS]

00:08:15   pronunciation is different [TS]

00:08:16   ah but it's really difficult to find an [TS]

00:08:19   authoritative source it like who'd you [TS]

00:08:20   ask would you ask the game developers [TS]

00:08:22   well they're all Japanese they don't [TS]

00:08:24   really care how the game is pronounced [TS]

00:08:25   in their country would you ask Sony [TS]

00:08:27   itself maybe they have an official [TS]

00:08:29   pronunciation I don't know uh so anyway [TS]

00:08:32   I I will assume that Eco is the correct [TS]

00:08:35   pronunciation I'm not sure I will be [TS]

00:08:37   able to stop myself from saying Aiko ah [TS]

00:08:39   I'll have to help to sleep on that for a [TS]

00:08:41   while and decide we're going to go [TS]

00:08:44   that's it for my follow-up to [TS]

00:08:47   pronunciation topics yeah I really [TS]

00:08:52   looked through them like this is really [TS]

00:08:53   all to follow up I have I [TS]

00:08:54   really have I think these thieves AUB's [TS]

00:08:56   bio life discussion expunged a lot of [TS]

00:09:00   fault I think maybe I have a few other [TS]

00:09:03   items that are related that aren't [TS]

00:09:04   really follow up but they're just like [TS]

00:09:05   reader mail or reader questions that I [TS]

00:09:07   could use to spawn other topics but [TS]

00:09:10   that's not gonna be today today do [TS]

00:09:12   remember what our topic is going to be [TS]

00:09:13   today can you have any guesses hmm nope [TS]

00:09:19   from a long time ago Microsoft again [TS]

00:09:24   yeah I'll talk about what else Microsoft [TS]

00:09:26   those how did we get off of that I think [TS]

00:09:29   the bio came a bio cannon I was there [TS]

00:09:31   was two episodes honey before that we [TS]

00:09:34   were off track on something anyway we're [TS]

00:09:38   finally wrapping around to it my notes [TS]

00:09:39   from a month ago are still here uh and [TS]

00:09:43   interestingly when I was gathering stuff [TS]

00:09:46   up for it I was reading an article [TS]

00:09:47   yesterday there was a article that was [TS]

00:09:50   published on the 19th that is a good way [TS]

00:09:53   to sort of enter in on this topic an [TS]

00:09:56   article didn't exist when I originally [TS]

00:09:57   made my notes but I just add to them so [TS]

00:09:59   this is an article in Forbes magazine by [TS]

00:10:01   Steve Denning and it's an article about [TS]

00:10:05   why companies die and it yeah it's a [TS]

00:10:09   quote it's quoting from Peggy Noonan who [TS]

00:10:12   I don't know but uh and then she's [TS]

00:10:15   quoting from the jobs bio and then Steve [TS]

00:10:17   Denning the author of this article is [TS]

00:10:19   talking about both of those things and I [TS]

00:10:21   assume also promoting his book which is [TS]

00:10:24   called radical management which I'm [TS]

00:10:26   missioning ties into all this so the [TS]

00:10:29   quote from jobs this is from the bio I [TS]

00:10:32   know I know I said I'm a Microsoft we'll [TS]

00:10:33   get into the jobs bio but trust me as [TS]

00:10:35   well as we'll go somewhere this is a [TS]

00:10:38   quote from jobs from the bio it says how [TS]

00:10:40   companies die or how they decline or [TS]

00:10:42   whatever the company does a great job [TS]

00:10:44   innovates and becomes a monopoly or [TS]

00:10:45   close to it in some field and then the [TS]

00:10:47   quality of the product becomes less [TS]

00:10:48   important the company starts valuing [TS]

00:10:50   great salesmen because they're the ones [TS]

00:10:52   who can move the needle on revenues and [TS]

00:10:53   move the needle is CEO speak for you [TS]

00:10:58   know you say you've got a monopoly in [TS]

00:11:00   your field and what companies and wall [TS]

00:11:03   street want to see is you need to be [TS]

00:11:05   constantly growing so once you're [TS]

00:11:06   selling like 90 [TS]

00:11:07   five percent of the customers it's much [TS]

00:11:09   more difficult to have the next quarter [TS]

00:11:11   be like double this quarter or ten [TS]

00:11:13   percent of audience moving the needle is [TS]

00:11:14   like how can you how can you show an [TS]

00:11:17   improvement in our financial results how [TS]

00:11:19   can you show that our company is doing [TS]

00:11:20   better than it did last quarter once [TS]

00:11:22   you've saturated the market the way you [TS]

00:11:24   can get those last percent is you know [TS]

00:11:26   is the the company starts hinging on [TS]

00:11:29   sales people because then you need like [TS]

00:11:30   salesmen to sell those last percentages [TS]

00:11:32   you really just make sure you keep [TS]

00:11:33   reselling and re upping those contracts [TS]

00:11:35   for whatever it is that your company has [TS]

00:11:37   a monopoly for and Steve Denning [TS]

00:11:41   commenting on this he says in the [TS]

00:11:42   article it's not just the salesmen it's [TS]

00:11:44   also the accountants in the money men [TS]

00:11:45   who who searched the firm high and low [TS]

00:11:47   to find new and ingenious ways to cut [TS]

00:11:48   costs or even eliminate paying taxes the [TS]

00:11:51   activities of these people further [TS]

00:11:52   dispute the creators the product [TS]

00:11:54   engineers and designers and also crimps [TS]

00:11:55   the firm's ability to add value to its [TS]

00:11:57   customers but because the accountants [TS]

00:11:59   appear to be adding to the firm's short [TS]

00:12:00   term profitability as a class they're [TS]

00:12:02   also celebrated and well rewarded even [TS]

00:12:04   as their activities systematically kill [TS]

00:12:06   the firm's future so this is same the [TS]

00:12:07   money men like how can how can we show [TS]

00:12:09   better results well we're already [TS]

00:12:11   selling everybody we can possibly sell [TS]

00:12:12   to let CEO in cut costs let's say we can [TS]

00:12:14   cut corners on our manufacturing let's [TS]

00:12:16   see how we can find a way you know two [TS]

00:12:17   tax shelters for our income and the [TS]

00:12:19   people who do this end up being rewarded [TS]

00:12:22   if it's like oh you know the salesman [TS]

00:12:23   the guys who are you know increasing our [TS]

00:12:26   revenues each quarter and these money [TS]

00:12:29   guys and the accountants are finding [TS]

00:12:30   ways to increase our profits by lowering [TS]

00:12:31   our cost right so becomes like this [TS]

00:12:34   weird numbers game uh and Denning calls [TS]

00:12:36   this playing defense instead of playing [TS]

00:12:39   offense um and because he's saying any [TS]

00:12:42   article it's easier to milk the cash cow [TS]

00:12:43   than to add new value so you're saying [TS]

00:12:45   well why don't you know so say you get a [TS]

00:12:47   monopoly in one market why is the [TS]

00:12:48   strategy then to do all this stuff to [TS]

00:12:52   you know uh find get the sales people [TS]

00:12:55   really cranking to make sure you don't [TS]

00:12:56   lose any of the ground you have and [TS]

00:12:57   renew those contracts and try to get a [TS]

00:12:59   little bit more money out of each person [TS]

00:13:00   each contract and have the accountants [TS]

00:13:02   figure out how to lower your cost [TS]

00:13:03   because that'll increase your profit [TS]

00:13:04   margins just little by little and then [TS]

00:13:05   reward those people for doing it but [TS]

00:13:06   that's defense it saying you know oh we [TS]

00:13:08   got this we've got this thing we've got [TS]

00:13:09   a good thing going here we've got it a [TS]

00:13:10   near-monopoly in this market we just got [TS]

00:13:12   to hold on to it that's playing defense [TS]

00:13:14   instead of playing offense which is [TS]

00:13:15   alright that's great we did this thing [TS]

00:13:17   we're dominant and whatever what are we [TS]

00:13:18   gonna do next and that's much harder and [TS]

00:13:21   or scary I've talked about this before [TS]

00:13:22   as the most important lesson of Steve [TS]

00:13:24   Jobs that you know he showed the large [TS]

00:13:26   companies don't have to be you know [TS]

00:13:29   don't have to play defense don't have to [TS]

00:13:31   be beholding to shareholders in Wall [TS]

00:13:33   Street and just do the the defensive [TS]

00:13:35   things and at the very end of this thing [TS]

00:13:40   they were talking about why it's easier [TS]

00:13:42   to it's more difficult to add value than [TS]

00:13:44   to have cost another reason he lists is [TS]

00:13:47   that these executives have found ways to [TS]

00:13:49   reward themselves lavishly as Upton [TS]

00:13:52   Sinclair noted it's difficult to get a [TS]

00:13:53   man to understand something when his [TS]

00:13:54   salary depends on his not understanding [TS]

00:13:56   it so this is just the worst of the [TS]

00:13:58   worst where the company starts playing [TS]

00:14:00   defense the people who get rewarded our [TS]

00:14:02   salespeople and accountants and all the [TS]

00:14:05   rewards they reap instead of being [TS]

00:14:07   folded back into the company because I [TS]

00:14:08   wouldn't you know what if the company [TS]

00:14:09   need money for we already know we're [TS]

00:14:10   doing we have a monopoly in this market [TS]

00:14:11   or whatever we don't need any money on [TS]

00:14:13   R&D or to make new products or whatever [TS]

00:14:15   let's just reward ourselves big bonuses [TS]

00:14:17   pay off the salespeople you know it [TS]

00:14:19   becomes a little Club where this company [TS]

00:14:22   with a monopoly in a field becomes a way [TS]

00:14:23   to make a small number of people very [TS]

00:14:25   rich for simply maintaining that [TS]

00:14:27   monopoly but that's really the worst of [TS]

00:14:28   the worst [TS]

00:14:29   that's the ultimate sickness of a [TS]

00:14:31   corporation right so we're going to talk [TS]

00:14:34   about what what ails Microsoft obviously [TS]

00:14:39   I'm leading into this because I think [TS]

00:14:41   the what ails Microsoft is they well [TS]

00:14:44   it's not as simple as saying they start [TS]

00:14:45   playing defense but the similarities to [TS]

00:14:47   this article this article which by the [TS]

00:14:49   way I don't think even mentions [TS]

00:14:50   Microsoft it mentioned like Xerox and [TS]

00:14:52   IBM and other companies that as the [TS]

00:14:53   example set of companies this so [TS]

00:14:56   Microsoft did get a near monopoly on a [TS]

00:14:59   market or a government certified [TS]

00:15:00   monopoly if you want to put it that way [TS]

00:15:02   in the United States on the desktop [TS]

00:15:04   computing market but did they start [TS]

00:15:08   playing defense I it can be argued that [TS]

00:15:11   Microsoft has Microsoft could have [TS]

00:15:14   written this article and say yes we're [TS]

00:15:15   aware of all these things we know that [TS]

00:15:17   we can't just defend we have to play [TS]

00:15:19   offense we have to try to enter new [TS]

00:15:20   markets we have to do all these things [TS]

00:15:21   right so the internet tidal wave memo [TS]

00:15:25   where Gates it was it came to realize [TS]

00:15:30   through the input of his subordinates [TS]

00:15:32   and stuff and just looking around that [TS]

00:15:33   the internet was a big deal [TS]

00:15:34   we just really need to turn this whole [TS]

00:15:35   company around and and get on this [TS]

00:15:37   internet thing everything has to be [TS]

00:15:38   about the internet and just you know [TS]

00:15:40   let's take this big company and turn it [TS]

00:15:41   and he was the big CEO and he made it [TS]

00:15:43   happen and he crushed Netscape which I'm [TS]

00:15:45   assuming he considered a victory not [TS]

00:15:46   perhaps not understanding a crushing [TS]

00:15:48   Netscape is not the same as defeating [TS]

00:15:51   the internet or becoming savvy on the [TS]

00:15:53   internet they created msn which the [TS]

00:15:55   money-loser for years because i thought [TS]

00:15:56   they were fighting AOL AOL wasn't a real [TS]

00:15:58   enemy to fight like Microsoft has been [TS]

00:15:59   trying to it hasn't said oh we're not [TS]

00:16:02   going to endure the Internet we're not [TS]

00:16:04   going to try to have an online service [TS]

00:16:05   and we're not going to be into web [TS]

00:16:06   browsers they've been trying to not be [TS]

00:16:08   defensive so you can't pin the the [TS]

00:16:12   sickness describe nazar I'll go exactly [TS]

00:16:14   on them in that regard and the Xbox and [TS]

00:16:17   stuff like that someone inside the [TS]

00:16:18   company says hey I think we should make [TS]

00:16:19   game consoles because that might be the [TS]

00:16:20   future of computing because it's all [TS]

00:16:22   about owning the living room and we have [TS]

00:16:24   the technology to get into that business [TS]

00:16:26   and we have PC games let's see if we can [TS]

00:16:27   adapt that to the Xbox and they lost [TS]

00:16:29   billions of billions of dollars over [TS]

00:16:31   many years but certainly you can't say [TS]

00:16:32   the Xbox is the case of them playing [TS]

00:16:34   defense right they are playing offense [TS]

00:16:36   this is just not doing a good job of it [TS]

00:16:39   all right the in many cases they chose [TS]

00:16:42   the wrong enemy or they spent a lot of [TS]

00:16:44   money and were never successful in the [TS]

00:16:45   case of msn like that's combination they [TS]

00:16:48   all they chose the wrong enemy and they [TS]

00:16:49   never really defeated enemy the enemy [TS]

00:16:50   died of its own natural causes all the [TS]

00:16:53   while they just lost money trying to [TS]

00:16:55   attack it so how do I think this relates [TS]

00:16:59   to what what I think Microsoft problem [TS]

00:17:02   is the problem is not so much that they [TS]

00:17:06   were going to be on defense all the time [TS]

00:17:09   but guys just defend everything we have [TS]

00:17:11   the problem is that all their offensive [TS]

00:17:16   strategies in terms of like how we're [TS]

00:17:19   going to break into a new market how we [TS]

00:17:20   have to react to a threat so on and so [TS]

00:17:21   forth that was all well and good but [TS]

00:17:24   they were a big enough company they said [TS]

00:17:26   while we do these offensive things oh [TS]

00:17:28   and by the way we certainly can't do [TS]

00:17:30   anything to lose what we've built right [TS]

00:17:32   so they did all this offensive stuff but [TS]

00:17:35   it was just a given that we must also [TS]

00:17:37   protect windows in office which are [TS]

00:17:38   their two big moneymakers obviously we [TS]

00:17:41   will continue to protect them and we [TS]

00:17:42   will you know go off on these new [TS]

00:17:43   initiatives and try to do you know all [TS]

00:17:45   these different things and try to work [TS]

00:17:46   on a tablet computer and [TS]

00:17:47   you know get into the gaming market in [TS]

00:17:49   the online market and make a web browser [TS]

00:17:50   you know but of course you know windows [TS]

00:17:52   and office movie protected at all cost [TS]

00:17:55   and so that's that's different than the [TS]

00:18:00   Apple strategy which is go off and do [TS]

00:18:02   the new thing and if the new thing [TS]

00:18:04   totally destroys the old thing so be it [TS]

00:18:06   so the example that would be the iPhone [TS]

00:18:09   where the iPhone and iOS initiatives [TS]

00:18:13   were launched at a time when the iPod [TS]

00:18:16   was a huge percentage of Apple's [TS]

00:18:17   revenues and they were dominant in the [TS]

00:18:19   music player market and they didn't say [TS]

00:18:21   well we're going to make this new iOS [TS]

00:18:22   thing but of course we have to do [TS]

00:18:24   everything we can to defend our 70% or [TS]

00:18:26   whatever it was market share in the [TS]

00:18:28   music player market of course we need to [TS]

00:18:30   defend that they said look the our iPod [TS]

00:18:33   market share revenues profit everything [TS]

00:18:35   about it is going to start going down [TS]

00:18:36   and that's okay as long as we're the one [TS]

00:18:39   cannibalizing ourselves so they didn't [TS]

00:18:41   do all sorts of bending over backwards [TS]

00:18:43   and shenanigans to make sure their iPod [TS]

00:18:45   you know revenues and sales and market [TS]

00:18:47   share to stay exactly as it was and [TS]

00:18:49   tried to grow and just defend it to [TS]

00:18:50   death they said like if it dies dies of [TS]

00:18:52   natural causes so be it the world has [TS]

00:18:53   moved on it used to be the music players [TS]

00:18:56   where where it was at now that a lot of [TS]

00:18:57   that stuff is being subsumed into cell [TS]

00:18:59   phones and that's what we're going to be [TS]

00:19:00   next [TS]

00:19:01   Microsoft has never done that Microsoft [TS]

00:19:03   has never said we are going to do this [TS]

00:19:05   game console initiative and we think [TS]

00:19:09   that the game console is going to be the [TS]

00:19:11   platform of the future and the PC is not [TS]

00:19:13   so we expect game console revenue and [TS]

00:19:16   profits and sales and everything to go [TS]

00:19:18   up and we expect PC sales to go down so [TS]

00:19:21   we're going to start we're going to [TS]

00:19:22   start cannibalizing our own PC business [TS]

00:19:23   by like selling people Microsoft Word [TS]

00:19:25   and Xbox it's now this is a silly [TS]

00:19:26   example obviously but I'm just saying [TS]

00:19:27   like giving an example of a product that [TS]

00:19:29   that Microsoft did produce they would [TS]

00:19:33   never allow it to do things that hurt [TS]

00:19:36   its other businesses so that's what [TS]

00:19:39   that's the thing I have my notes here is [TS]

00:19:41   that Microsoft has been defined by the [TS]

00:19:42   fear of losing what it's built all right [TS]

00:19:45   they they are afraid of losing that big [TS]

00:19:49   thing they built which is dominant to [TS]

00:19:51   the desktop operating system ah [TS]

00:19:54   either that or they've never they've [TS]

00:19:56   never produced anything they thought [TS]

00:19:58   potentially could cannibalize their [TS]

00:20:00   existing [TS]

00:20:01   business-like you say well the Xbox's is [TS]

00:20:03   an example what do they make that could [TS]

00:20:05   possibly cannibalize their existing [TS]

00:20:07   business maybe they've only introduced [TS]

00:20:08   products which were not natural [TS]

00:20:09   replacements for this top pcs of course [TS]

00:20:11   the desktop PC has been defended because [TS]

00:20:13   they're defending against other [TS]

00:20:14   competitors not against themselves some [TS]

00:20:16   of the chatroom said that the Xbox [TS]

00:20:19   cannibalize the gaming PC Microsoft [TS]

00:20:23   never makes money on the gaming PC ATI [TS]

00:20:26   and NVIDIA perhaps made their money on [TS]

00:20:27   the gaming PC by selling high-end video [TS]

00:20:29   cards at large profit involvement [TS]

00:20:30   margins but that wasn't making Microsoft [TS]

00:20:32   any money if you played games on your PC [TS]

00:20:35   which you can continue to do so [TS]

00:20:36   Microsoft makes money on its windows [TS]

00:20:37   licenses and the next part I'm going to [TS]

00:20:39   get to is what Microsoft mostly makes [TS]

00:20:40   aware though I read no coming from it's [TS]

00:20:42   not coming from individual PC gamers [TS]

00:20:44   buying Windows computers for their house [TS]

00:20:47   Microsoft's cash cows very quickly got [TS]

00:20:49   tied up into what I call Enterprise [TS]

00:20:51   entanglements where you sign large [TS]

00:20:52   numbers of computers to corporations you [TS]

00:20:55   want to sell them licenses for exchange [TS]

00:20:57   server for sequel server you want to [TS]

00:20:58   sell them the dev tools over the making [TS]

00:20:59   stuff and you want to sell them a [TS]

00:21:00   license for Windows for every single [TS]

00:21:02   desktop in this huge thousand two [TS]

00:21:04   thousand three thousand person huge [TS]

00:21:06   company they thought they sold Windows [TS]

00:21:08   in office to corporations and yes home [TS]

00:21:11   users buy Windows in office too but [TS]

00:21:12   that's not really a regular recurring [TS]

00:21:15   revenue where you get subscriptions and [TS]

00:21:16   really like that server software with [TS]

00:21:18   the exchange licensing it used to be [TS]

00:21:19   Pursey licensing for like you know the [TS]

00:21:21   Windows NT server and the desktops and [TS]

00:21:23   all that stuff that's where the big [TS]

00:21:24   money is because then you get you know [TS]

00:21:26   that you you can't get that kind of [TS]

00:21:28   money out of interval consumers yes they [TS]

00:21:29   have that the scale for consumers and [TS]

00:21:32   they get this you know whatever they get [TS]

00:21:33   10 20 30 bucks for each Windows license [TS]

00:21:36   attached to a PC that's sold but they [TS]

00:21:38   really want that that enterprise income [TS]

00:21:40   in that tight relationship between [TS]

00:21:42   Microsoft and the enterprise created the [TS]

00:21:45   situation where Microsoft was willing to [TS]

00:21:49   listen to what the enterprise wanted [TS]

00:21:50   that's why enterprise love them [TS]

00:21:51   enterprise love the fact that they could [TS]

00:21:52   buy soft hardware from different vendors [TS]

00:21:54   and pit them against each other and and [TS]

00:21:55   they would talk to microphone and say we [TS]

00:21:57   really want to know we really want this [TS]

00:21:59   feature and that feature and we want to [TS]

00:22:01   be able to do remote deployments is the [TS]

00:22:02   IT department talking to Microsoft not [TS]

00:22:04   the individual people using computers [TS]

00:22:06   and corporations obviously ID Department [TS]

00:22:08   we want centralized control of you know [TS]

00:22:11   software installation we want to be able [TS]

00:22:12   to control [TS]

00:22:14   the internet explorer installations and [TS]

00:22:16   say but this set the security policies [TS]

00:22:18   for them then we want to be able to [TS]

00:22:20   remote update them to new versions and [TS]

00:22:23   just everything the enterprise wanted [TS]

00:22:25   for them we want an exchange server with [TS]

00:22:26   centralized control over the the all the [TS]

00:22:28   phones we put out so that if someone [TS]

00:22:31   connects to an exchange server with [TS]

00:22:32   their mobile phone we want to force them [TS]

00:22:33   to have a keypad entry coded on their [TS]

00:22:36   phone so their phone is locked and all [TS]

00:22:37   that business that relationship between [TS]

00:22:40   Microsoft and the enterprise made it so [TS]

00:22:44   that the thing driving the development [TS]

00:22:47   of Windows wasn't individual consumers [TS]

00:22:50   at home and it wasn't even people [TS]

00:22:53   working in their desks and businesses [TS]

00:22:54   it was the IT department at the large [TS]

00:23:00   corporations right and so this is a [TS]

00:23:05   situation that Microsoft got itself into [TS]

00:23:06   its its most important cash cow is a [TS]

00:23:09   product being driven by someone other [TS]

00:23:13   than the end users and that that is [TS]

00:23:15   always death for your product quality if [TS]

00:23:18   your product is it you know what is [TS]

00:23:21   motivating your product development is [TS]

00:23:22   not the end users like what would the [TS]

00:23:24   end user like then right away you've got [TS]

00:23:26   a conflict of interest because you're [TS]

00:23:27   making things that people aren't going [TS]

00:23:28   to like but they're forced being forced [TS]

00:23:30   to use by the our IT department and now [TS]

00:23:34   Microsoft probably knew it was in this [TS]

00:23:37   situation what what the thing I want to [TS]

00:23:40   get into this the heart of what I'm [TS]

00:23:41   trying to get into in this podcast is [TS]

00:23:42   not so much where do they go wrong what [TS]

00:23:44   lessons do we can take for but like sort [TS]

00:23:47   of an alternate history [TS]

00:23:49   what could Microsoft's had done [TS]

00:23:50   differently what if you could go back in [TS]

00:23:53   time and explain to Microsoft how the [TS]

00:23:55   future is going to play out and they [TS]

00:23:58   believed you is all right well so what [TS]

00:24:00   do we do what do we do what could we do [TS]

00:24:02   that will prevent the present state of [TS]

00:24:05   Microsoft Word they've been knocked off [TS]

00:24:07   their perch is the biggest technology [TS]

00:24:08   company they say they're seemingly [TS]

00:24:10   irrelevant in so many businesses they're [TS]

00:24:12   the struggling to get into nubes you [TS]

00:24:14   know what can we do to prevent that from [TS]

00:24:16   happening and the thing I think about is [TS]

00:24:19   like well well how did Apple sort of [TS]

00:24:22   turn things around and it's not it's [TS]

00:24:25   nothing it's not a good scenario to [TS]

00:24:26   present to the market [TS]

00:24:27   I go back in time talk to the Microsoft [TS]

00:24:28   people and say well so here's what Apple [TS]

00:24:31   did Apple almost went out of business [TS]

00:24:34   laid off thousands of people lost tons [TS]

00:24:37   of money went through multiple CP o CEOs [TS]

00:24:40   uh em was supposedly 90 days from [TS]

00:24:43   bankruptcy all right and then they [TS]

00:24:46   brought back their old CEO or they [TS]

00:24:48   brought in this great guy Steve Jobs and [TS]

00:24:51   he fired more people and cut more [TS]

00:24:54   projects and and basically tore the [TS]

00:24:59   company down it's sort of like the [TS]

00:25:00   equivalent of an alcoholic hitting [TS]

00:25:01   bottom right and then he made it picked [TS]

00:25:05   like one or two you know simplified [TS]

00:25:07   everything removed tons of products [TS]

00:25:09   abandoned customers killed entire [TS]

00:25:11   platforms and then just picked one or [TS]

00:25:14   two special products he was going to pay [TS]

00:25:15   attention to like when sched with the [TS]

00:25:16   iMac and then I mentioned the iPod and [TS]

00:25:18   put all his is you know weight behind [TS]

00:25:20   those ah that doesn't sound like [TS]

00:25:23   something you could sell to Microsoft in [TS]

00:25:25   1995 you know so but I think that was a [TS]

00:25:30   key to Apple success like Apple had the [TS]

00:25:32   luxury of slimming down to near death [TS]

00:25:35   sizes before Jobs came back and saved it [TS]

00:25:37   and he saved it by cutting even further [TS]

00:25:39   you can't tell Microsoft in 1995 what [TS]

00:25:44   you know what you have to do is destroy [TS]

00:25:46   your business and make it and make [TS]

00:25:49   yourself almost go bankrupt and destroy [TS]

00:25:51   all shareholder value and become like [TS]

00:25:53   falling off of the fortune 500 maybe [TS]

00:25:55   falling off the Fortune 1000 and then [TS]

00:25:57   finally you can you can get yourself in [TS]

00:25:59   position to be a success in a future [TS]

00:26:00   that's sort of a non-starter right ah [TS]

00:26:03   and I think I really do think that if [TS]

00:26:06   Jobs had come back to an Apple in like [TS]

00:26:11   1990 or something where they were still [TS]

00:26:14   making lots of profits selling really [TS]

00:26:15   expensive Macintoshes it would have been [TS]

00:26:18   harder for him to have the success that [TS]

00:26:20   he had because you would have to then [TS]

00:26:21   convince everybody that we should stop [TS]

00:26:23   making all this money it's not hard to [TS]

00:26:24   convince everybody that we should stop [TS]

00:26:25   doing what we're doing because we're [TS]

00:26:26   having massive lawsuits if you come in [TS]

00:26:28   when the company's going down the tubes [TS]

00:26:29   and you're losing money left and right [TS]

00:26:31   if you have a strong idea what you [TS]

00:26:33   should do they'll be willing to do it [TS]

00:26:34   but if you're coming into a company [TS]

00:26:35   that's successful like a an apple in the [TS]

00:26:38   90s or like a Microsoft in the mid-90s [TS]

00:26:41   still making tons of money you have to [TS]

00:26:43   be really convincing to come to to make [TS]

00:26:45   the company say I don't want to make [TS]

00:26:47   money that way I want to make money a [TS]

00:26:48   different way uh so here's here's the [TS]

00:26:54   key lack of will that I think Microsoft [TS]

00:26:57   the the key McKee mistaken reasoning [TS]

00:26:59   that Microsoft had no before before you [TS]

00:27:01   reveal that we get it I know I don't [TS]

00:27:03   like to interrupt you when you're on you [TS]

00:27:05   know you're on fire all right and if [TS]

00:27:06   we've got a do we get a pay some bills [TS]

00:27:08   are gonna do a sponsor but there's a [TS]

00:27:09   good one United pixel workers calm you [TS]

00:27:12   heard about this I have but I'm you need [TS]

00:27:15   to explain it to me because I don't know [TS]

00:27:16   what it is yet big name everywhere then [TS]

00:27:18   the name is everywhere and what these [TS]

00:27:20   guys do is periodically they come out [TS]

00:27:21   with some really cool t-shirts will get [TS]

00:27:23   you one I believe that they consider [TS]

00:27:26   Massachusetts to be a full-blown State [TS]

00:27:28   these days so they will they will make [TS]

00:27:31   one for this what it is is they have a [TS]

00:27:32   50 states sale very very cool t-shirts [TS]

00:27:35   there they've done a special run all 50 [TS]

00:27:38   states and Washington DC and these are [TS]

00:27:41   really cool t-shirts that have the state [TS]

00:27:44   printed on them there are American [TS]

00:27:46   Apparel very high quality and they were [TS]

00:27:49   originally going to only do it through [TS]

00:27:51   this week and I said let's let's do a [TS]

00:27:53   special thing we'll do a discount for [TS]

00:27:56   5x5 listeners and we'll extend the sale [TS]

00:28:00   for one more week they said well if we [TS]

00:28:01   do that we'll it'll be really stressful [TS]

00:28:03   for us to get it out for the holidays I [TS]

00:28:06   said well do you want to sell some [TS]

00:28:08   shirts or not and they said okay let's [TS]

00:28:09   do it so they're giving 10% off your [TS]

00:28:11   entire order use coupon code five by [TS]

00:28:13   five United pixel workers calm they also [TS]

00:28:16   have a hoodie but all these are printed [TS]

00:28:18   on the super soft American Apparel [TS]

00:28:20   things whatever your state is you go [TS]

00:28:22   there you pick Massachusetts and you [TS]

00:28:25   will get a Massachusetts shirt so that's [TS]

00:28:29   what it is United pixel workers calm 10% [TS]

00:28:31   off your order code five by five [TS]

00:28:33   don't be also have something where [TS]

00:28:36   internet celebrities like Mike Montero [TS]

00:28:39   do design their own shirts and yes yes [TS]

00:28:41   absolutely Mike Montero has done one I [TS]

00:28:44   think Zelda Minh has done one so people [TS]

00:28:45   like that [TS]

00:28:47   can can be recognized by their for their [TS]

00:28:50   talents and they will do special shirt [TS]

00:28:54   but right now they're on this bed but [TS]

00:28:55   here's the thing I should mention this [TS]

00:28:56   after this run the 50 states out there [TS]

00:28:59   gone that's what I was gonna say like if [TS]

00:29:00   you wanted to get the mic when Tara one [TS]

00:29:02   tough like that's gone right yeah that's [TS]

00:29:04   too bad so if you want if you want a 58 [TS]

00:29:07   shirt move now [TS]

00:29:08   it's not like they just have a stock of [TS]

00:29:10   these things and keep them around [TS]

00:29:11   forever right it is going to end [TS]

00:29:12   November 29 2011 that's a mere four days [TS]

00:29:15   from now at 11:00 a.m. is when it ends I [TS]

00:29:18   don't know why it it's 11:00 a.m. [TS]

00:29:19   Eastern Time but that's when it's over [TS]

00:29:21   so go get you go pick out your state and [TS]

00:29:23   if you want you can get all 50 states [TS]

00:29:26   and Washington DC and you'll still get [TS]

00:29:28   10% a lot of t-shirts do you wear [TS]

00:29:32   t-shirts up there [TS]

00:29:33   I do we gotta get them to send you a [TS]

00:29:37   Massachusetts now here's the real [TS]

00:29:38   question I've asked everybody this this [TS]

00:29:39   this week but I want to ask you where [TS]

00:29:41   you were born and raised in is it Rhode [TS]

00:29:44   Island try again [TS]

00:29:46   not Massachusetts no it's not New York [TS]

00:29:50   State somewhere yes okay so would you [TS]

00:29:52   get New York State or would you get [TS]

00:29:54   Massachusetts or both if they had a Long [TS]

00:29:58   Island sure to get that just Long Island [TS]

00:30:00   you know the important part of New York [TS]

00:30:01   State but assuming they don't I mean I [TS]

00:30:03   had to get Massachusetts like that's [TS]

00:30:05   where I'm spending my adult life right [TS]

00:30:07   so even though I grew up in Long Island [TS]

00:30:09   in New York I would go with [TS]

00:30:11   Massachusetts shirt I think although [TS]

00:30:13   again having both wouldn't be bad either [TS]

00:30:14   well there is tempers enough but I'm [TS]

00:30:17   looking at the Massachusetts one it's [TS]

00:30:18   not bad [TS]

00:30:20   everybody loves pixels all right because [TS]

00:30:24   Marco was talking about something in his [TS]

00:30:25   show saying what upstate was and right [TS]

00:30:28   and he was saying that anything is north [TS]

00:30:31   of where you are in New York that's kind [TS]

00:30:33   of a a humorous way to describe it but I [TS]

00:30:37   think there's an actual definition of [TS]

00:30:38   what upstate is it does get fuzzy around [TS]

00:30:41   where he lives but basically it's easy [TS]

00:30:43   to find what upstate is not upstate is [TS]

00:30:45   not Long Island or the New York metro [TS]

00:30:47   area and where you draw the line at New [TS]

00:30:49   York metro area like how far north along [TS]

00:30:51   the Hudson do you go before you say okay [TS]

00:30:53   you're out of the New York metro area [TS]

00:30:54   there is some fuzz around there but it's [TS]

00:30:57   not that it's not that big of a fuzz [TS]

00:30:58   strip like [TS]

00:31:00   somewhere above Westchester around there [TS]

00:31:02   certain point that there's a lot the [TS]

00:31:04   line is somewhere in that fuzzy region [TS]

00:31:06   right but there's the whole rest of New [TS]

00:31:07   York and that's all upstate except for [TS]

00:31:10   Long Island and New York metro area so [TS]

00:31:13   here in Albany who says they're not [TS]

00:31:14   upstate that bed nation they're upstate [TS]

00:31:17   why is it bad to be upstate why's there [TS]

00:31:20   it's not bad it's just like you know [TS]

00:31:21   there is where is upstate upstate New [TS]

00:31:24   York or just saying upstate that's [TS]

00:31:26   that's where it is it seems like where [TS]

00:31:27   do you live I live in upstate New York [TS]

00:31:29   well we most people should know where [TS]

00:31:31   that is with some sort of fuzz around [TS]

00:31:33   you know where does the New York metro [TS]

00:31:35   area end as you go north Mountain Hudson [TS]

00:31:37   but certainly no one's going to think [TS]

00:31:39   you live in you know Staten Island Bronx [TS]

00:31:42   or Long Island if you live in upstate [TS]

00:31:44   New York but Albany is no ambiguity none [TS]

00:31:47   you know Buffalo anything like that's [TS]

00:31:49   upstate all right so where was I oh I [TS]

00:31:58   actually totally lost my train of [TS]

00:32:00   thought [TS]

00:32:00   I can even know where I wasn't a note [TS]

00:32:01   suppose what was I gonna say before the [TS]

00:32:03   break I was got so interested in these [TS]

00:32:05   t-shirts I did that's right nothing [TS]

00:32:07   they're distracted they're very [TS]

00:32:08   distracting uh well you were taught you [TS]

00:32:11   were about to reveal it was a big reveal [TS]

00:32:13   I remember that much there's a big [TS]

00:32:15   reveal you were gonna give it all away [TS]

00:32:16   this is the what you've been leading up [TS]

00:32:18   to for 25 minutes no pressure no [TS]

00:32:22   pressure all right so I think what what [TS]

00:32:26   I was getting at with it but the [TS]

00:32:29   slimming down to near-death sizes right [TS]

00:32:31   because you had just talked about Steve [TS]

00:32:32   Jobs coming in and completely beating [TS]

00:32:34   the beating your company into a [TS]

00:32:37   different shape than it was in before [TS]

00:32:38   but it was like almost dead at that [TS]

00:32:40   point right so the whole thing that room [TS]

00:32:43   is saying what what could Microsoft do [TS]

00:32:45   if you went back in Jesse yes that's on [TS]

00:32:46   another the overall thing with like the [TS]

00:32:47   individual part miles here so no one [TS]

00:32:51   wants to go into a company that's making [TS]

00:32:52   money like gangbusters and change the [TS]

00:32:54   way they do things but also here does [TS]

00:32:56   that for remember this the key decision [TS]

00:33:01   decision in Microsoft's mind like the [TS]

00:33:03   one thing that you need to change in [TS]

00:33:05   Microsoft's mind is the idea that then [TS]

00:33:11   not serving the enterprise IT market or [TS]

00:33:14   like home PC users or hardware [TS]

00:33:17   manufacturers everything like that being [TS]

00:33:19   being so afraid to do things differently [TS]

00:33:23   than the thing that brought them that [TS]

00:33:25   big monopoly and the thing that they [TS]

00:33:27   were afraid of and probably still are [TS]

00:33:30   afraid of was that if they didn't do [TS]

00:33:32   that if they didn't if they didn't talk [TS]

00:33:34   to those IT managers say what do you [TS]

00:33:35   guys want we'll work with you for the [TS]

00:33:36   next revision of Windows and you know [TS]

00:33:38   work with the PC manufacturers and the [TS]

00:33:40   hardware vendors and everybody you know [TS]

00:33:42   and Intel and AMD and just like beat [TS]

00:33:44   serve be the software component of the [TS]

00:33:48   PC platform and like work with those [TS]

00:33:49   guys the fear is if that they didn't do [TS]

00:33:52   that someone else would come and take [TS]

00:33:54   that and take that business away from [TS]

00:33:55   them remember when they were super [TS]

00:33:57   afraid of Linux like oh my god you know [TS]

00:33:59   we were making these money off Windows [TS]

00:34:00   license is what Linux is free [TS]

00:34:02   what if Dell or HP or something suddenly [TS]

00:34:05   start selling Linux machines and then [TS]

00:34:06   donate P would do these little dance [TS]

00:34:08   moves over to the Linux side of things [TS]

00:34:10   and be all oh yeah we're thinking of [TS]

00:34:13   making Linux pcs and Microsoft forget [TS]

00:34:14   all scared okay okay we'll give you a [TS]

00:34:16   break on one you know that's all this [TS]

00:34:17   break up the windows licenses this whole [TS]

00:34:19   dance around like they're always afraid [TS]

00:34:22   that someone else was going to take that [TS]

00:34:24   business from and that that fear that [TS]

00:34:27   fear that if we look if we need to keep [TS]

00:34:29   doing this Windows an office thing we [TS]

00:34:31   know what it takes we know what we had [TS]

00:34:32   to do to win this market we know what it [TS]

00:34:34   takes to keep this market we need to [TS]

00:34:36   continue to do what all the all the [TS]

00:34:37   people all our stakeholders in this [TS]

00:34:39   market want of us because if we let this [TS]

00:34:41   go someone else is going to get it and [TS]

00:34:43   someone else gets it them they're going [TS]

00:34:44   to be the new Microsoft and they're [TS]

00:34:45   going to have billions of dollars [TS]

00:34:47   they're going to have the windows and [TS]

00:34:48   office cash cows and we'll be nothing [TS]

00:34:51   right and that's that that fear that [TS]

00:34:56   that someone else was going to come and [TS]

00:34:57   eat their their lunch who is the thing [TS]

00:35:00   that most handicapped the company and [TS]

00:35:03   probably still continues to have [TS]

00:35:04   accounts company enough I was back at [TS]

00:35:06   Microsoft in those days I would have [TS]

00:35:07   tried to play this out a little bit and [TS]

00:35:09   say ah so if you don't do this you don't [TS]

00:35:12   do what this idea vendors want if you [TS]

00:35:14   don't make these hardware manufacturers [TS]

00:35:15   happy if you don't if you don't mold [TS]

00:35:17   your your company and your strategy and [TS]

00:35:19   all your products around these [TS]

00:35:21   stakeholders you're not your end [TS]

00:35:22   consumers [TS]

00:35:24   if you break we're backward [TS]

00:35:25   compatibility but the app vendors like [TS]

00:35:27   all the people who are how to stake in [TS]

00:35:29   Windows who you currently serve with [TS]

00:35:30   your things what are you afraid is going [TS]

00:35:32   to happen who is going to come and take [TS]

00:35:33   that market from you Linux if they said [TS]

00:35:37   well what about Linux is this new thing [TS]

00:35:38   maybe they didn't know or whatever I [TS]

00:35:39   guess I look I've seen the future Linux [TS]

00:35:40   is not a threat to you [TS]

00:35:41   Linux is not going to come in and steal [TS]

00:35:43   that marker from you because they are [TS]

00:35:44   just it Linux is not a company it is an [TS]

00:35:47   amorphous open-source thing yeah they're [TS]

00:35:49   going to eat your lunch in the server [TS]

00:35:50   space you're right to be afraid of that [TS]

00:35:52   but like the desktop where you one you [TS]

00:35:54   know we we own the desktop and corporate [TS]

00:35:56   IT and the mail servers know stuff like [TS]

00:35:58   that I'm actually amazed at how well [TS]

00:36:00   exchange is held up against the Linux [TS]

00:36:02   Mail service and for the same reason is [TS]

00:36:04   that you know it's that's not another [TS]

00:36:06   company with the strategies is an [TS]

00:36:08   amorphous group of people working on an [TS]

00:36:09   open-source product it has its place and [TS]

00:36:11   it's going to hurt you in business but [TS]

00:36:12   they're not going to come and take the [TS]

00:36:13   PC desktop from you they're just not [TS]

00:36:15   Linux on the desktop is the reason it [TS]

00:36:17   hasn't happened they are even less [TS]

00:36:19   capable than you are of doing what [TS]

00:36:22   customers want and they're also not as [TS]

00:36:24   capable of doing what the IT people want [TS]

00:36:25   so the IT bill like who the IT people [TS]

00:36:27   going to go to Red Hat like an [TS]

00:36:28   individual Linux company you know Linux [TS]

00:36:31   is bigger than Red Hat you can't just go [TS]

00:36:32   to Red Hat and say we're done with [TS]

00:36:35   Microsoft Microsoft has betrayed us [TS]

00:36:36   Linux you are our Savior and then just [TS]

00:36:38   talk to Red Hat and ran a bit like well [TS]

00:36:40   it's great and all but we don't write [TS]

00:36:41   Linux you know there's a lot of people [TS]

00:36:43   who contribute to Linux so like we like [TS]

00:36:45   to sell you something but you're not [TS]

00:36:46   talking to Linux now you're talking to [TS]

00:36:48   red hat and you know it's it so Linux is [TS]

00:36:51   not going to looks just cannot take that [TS]

00:36:55   market from you just constitutionally is [TS]

00:36:56   unable to take the the PC desktop and ID [TS]

00:36:59   market as you know it away from you [TS]

00:37:01   Apple Apple doesn't even want those [TS]

00:37:04   markets this I think is the killer one [TS]

00:37:06   they're like be OS or Apple or whatever [TS]

00:37:07   like oh they're going to take Apple [TS]

00:37:09   spent after Steve Jasper they don't even [TS]

00:37:11   want that market you keeping that market [TS]

00:37:13   is helping Apple because I would be [TS]

00:37:15   afraid if I was at Apple that Microsoft [TS]

00:37:17   would do moves that took it away from [TS]

00:37:20   the interests of that market and that [TS]

00:37:21   market would come to Apple and say where [TS]

00:37:23   Microsoft is doing things we don't like [TS]

00:37:25   they're not listening to us anymore [TS]

00:37:26   they're breaking compatibility they're [TS]

00:37:28   making our lives more difficult we're [TS]

00:37:30   looking around for alternatives can you [TS]

00:37:32   help us and I would be terribly afraid [TS]

00:37:34   that if Microsoft had been a polite bad [TS]

00:37:36   leadership the leadership would go [TS]

00:37:38   I don't know we haven't really been in [TS]

00:37:39   that market but cheese that's a whole [TS]

00:37:40   lot of money over there you know how [TS]

00:37:41   many units uh [TS]

00:37:42   you know Microsoft sells for software [TS]

00:37:44   licenses for that you know much they [TS]

00:37:45   make them at exchanged up you know how [TS]

00:37:47   many seats they have Windows PCs game I [TS]

00:37:49   know we're not really into that I know [TS]

00:37:51   we're doing this consumer digital hub [TS]

00:37:53   thing with the iMac but but geez we [TS]

00:37:55   can't we can't leave that money over [TS]

00:37:56   there we gotta go look at that now that [TS]

00:37:58   would happen if Steve Jobs was there [TS]

00:37:59   Steve Jobs oh that he would just tell [TS]

00:38:01   them look if you want to use your [TS]

00:38:02   computers fine here they are we'll do [TS]

00:38:04   some stuff to help you if you want but [TS]

00:38:05   we're not going to change the way we [TS]

00:38:06   make our products for your stupid needs [TS]

00:38:08   we're trying to make the best products [TS]

00:38:09   possible you know so they'll add all [TS]

00:38:11   that exchange stuff to iOS so you could [TS]

00:38:14   use your corporate email with it and [TS]

00:38:15   they'll do you know they'll do the [TS]

00:38:17   enterprise deployment for the App Store [TS]

00:38:19   and stuff but they're not gonna slap on [TS]

00:38:21   a hardware keyboard because you think [TS]

00:38:22   that's what all your you know your [TS]

00:38:24   corporate customers want they're not [TS]

00:38:26   going to make $200 desktop PCs that are [TS]

00:38:28   pieces of crap because that's what the [TS]

00:38:30   enterprise wants cuz they want like the [TS]

00:38:31   volume just count Dell black pizza box [TS]

00:38:33   thing to put all their people's desk [TS]

00:38:35   sitting up there is not going to do that [TS]

00:38:36   apples it was under Steve Jobs that said [TS]

00:38:38   this is what we make will meet you know [TS]

00:38:40   will help you a little bit but we're not [TS]

00:38:42   going to be like Microsoft so who who [TS]

00:38:46   was it that was going to take this [TS]

00:38:47   market from Microsoft nobody was going [TS]

00:38:50   to take it and the reason nobody was [TS]

00:38:51   going to take it is because either [TS]

00:38:52   they're incapable of it or in Apple's [TS]

00:38:54   case they don't they realize that like [TS]

00:38:56   who wants to be the king that's like [TS]

00:38:58   fighting the old war Microsoft won that [TS]

00:38:59   war he they are that King getting that [TS]

00:39:02   going back there and say huh we're king [TS]

00:39:03   of the desktop now that would hurt Apple [TS]

00:39:06   because suddenly Apple would be beholden [TS]

00:39:08   to all those different markets and that [TS]

00:39:11   that's the thing like a race Microsoft [TS]

00:39:13   from history right now like a the [TS]

00:39:15   company blips out of existence including [TS]

00:39:16   all their products and everyone is [TS]

00:39:17   scrambling oh my god I have a computer [TS]

00:39:19   at Microsoft flipped out of existence so [TS]

00:39:20   I need another computer are they all [TS]

00:39:22   gonna go out and buy Macs financially [TS]

00:39:24   they can't most of the time because like [TS]

00:39:25   I have to my I'm allowed $300 per seat [TS]

00:39:28   in my ten thousand person company for [TS]

00:39:30   PCs and I can't even get iPads of that [TS]

00:39:33   price and Apple just doesn't do that [TS]

00:39:35   kind of volume business they're just [TS]

00:39:36   there did not they're not a capable of [TS]

00:39:38   doing that it would bankrupt me to do [TS]

00:39:40   that and if you did buy all those things [TS]

00:39:42   that's just Apple doesn't have products [TS]

00:39:44   or services that serve that market and [TS]

00:39:46   they simply don't want it which is part [TS]

00:39:47   of the big reason why Apple's products [TS]

00:39:49   are so much better than Microsoft's is [TS]

00:39:50   because they are there [TS]

00:39:51   for consumers to satisfy the needs of [TS]

00:39:53   individual people first and corporate IT [TS]

00:39:56   departments xx if at all right so this [TS]

00:40:01   big fear that Microsoft had that they do [TS]

00:40:03   something to anger their constituents [TS]

00:40:06   someone else will eat their lunch uh was [TS]

00:40:09   unfounded there was no one no one who [TS]

00:40:12   could or wanted to take that market from [TS]

00:40:14   them so that's why I said if I was going [TS]

00:40:16   to tell Microsoft that some of the [TS]

00:40:19   chatter Briggs opposed to warp that's [TS]

00:40:21   that's another example of like you're a [TS]

00:40:23   pig war Peter no so IBM was going to [TS]

00:40:26   take that marker from you like this that [TS]

00:40:28   Microsoft didn't quite understand how [TS]

00:40:32   strong their position was which is [TS]

00:40:33   strange to think like always to warp was [TS]

00:40:36   gonna come and take their market IBM was [TS]

00:40:39   was even older King than Microsoft no [TS]

00:40:41   one was going to say well Microsoft is [TS]

00:40:42   gone let's go back to IBM they'll serve [TS]

00:40:44   our needs IBM wants to sell you its own [TS]

00:40:47   Hardware wanted to back then and that's [TS]

00:40:49   corporate he doesn't like that they'd [TS]

00:40:50   rather buy from Dell or Gateway Rover [TS]

00:40:52   that crap boxes they're buying right uh [TS]

00:40:55   and they wanted windows compatibility [TS]

00:40:57   with all your software and always to had [TS]

00:40:59   did have windows compatibility but it [TS]

00:41:00   was still you know tied to Microsoft on [TS]

00:41:02   that and Microsoft could slowly change [TS]

00:41:03   things to make you know os/2 is you know [TS]

00:41:06   that the whole has two windows thing [TS]

00:41:07   like that that battle was done and [TS]

00:41:08   settled so this what I'm talking about [TS]

00:41:10   is the point after that where Microsoft [TS]

00:41:12   which is clearly dominant os/2 was [TS]

00:41:13   basically dead and it was not coming [TS]

00:41:15   back and people had settled into the [TS]

00:41:18   routine of Microsoft gives us the [TS]

00:41:19   software licenses and we could buy [TS]

00:41:20   Hardware from whoever we want right so [TS]

00:41:24   what I would tell Microsoft to do during [TS]

00:41:27   this phase is look at your products and [TS]

00:41:30   decide what about them people don't like [TS]

00:41:32   they're too complicated they've got lots [TS]

00:41:35   of all legacy crap that's in there from [TS]

00:41:37   before that you were afraid you couldn't [TS]

00:41:38   take out these we take this out of a [TS]

00:41:40   break a bunch of stuff all the things [TS]

00:41:41   that Apple did like abandon legacy ports [TS]

00:41:43   break backwards compatibility radically [TS]

00:41:46   simplify your operating system sort of [TS]

00:41:49   kind of like what they're doing with [TS]

00:41:50   Metro where you know just throw [TS]

00:41:52   everything out and anytime anyone [TS]

00:41:55   proposed that a Microsoft during like [TS]

00:41:57   the mid 90s and late 90s when they were [TS]

00:41:59   so down people's hell we can't do that [TS]

00:42:00   will you know we will lose it if we tell [TS]

00:42:03   the corporate IT [TS]

00:42:04   but yeah the next version will break a [TS]

00:42:07   bunch of your applications but and [TS]

00:42:09   change where everything is and radically [TS]

00:42:11   simplify the operating system but just [TS]

00:42:12   gonna have to deal with it because we [TS]

00:42:13   think this is better in a long term for [TS]

00:42:14   everybody involved [TS]

00:42:16   then there's oh no they'll they'll go to [TS]

00:42:18   someone else they'll all deploy Linux [TS]

00:42:20   they'll they'll just play max instead [TS]

00:42:22   they wouldn't or couldn't you Microsoft [TS]

00:42:24   didn't understand the power in the [TS]

00:42:26   position that it had there was no [TS]

00:42:28   alternative to them they had enough [TS]

00:42:29   power to that they had to be confident [TS]

00:42:32   enough in their position to say at the [TS]

00:42:35   peak of our power now is the time when [TS]

00:42:37   we can make radical changes to our [TS]

00:42:38   operating system that make it more [TS]

00:42:41   attractive to the people who have to use [TS]

00:42:43   it to prevent you know Mac OS 10 or iOS [TS]

00:42:47   from coming and looking like such a [TS]

00:42:48   breath of fresh air compared to the [TS]

00:42:49   ridiculously complicated windows [TS]

00:42:51   everything microsoft did with windows so [TS]

00:42:54   it's like well we'll try to make a [TS]

00:42:55   simple I diversion but if you want the [TS]

00:42:56   classic view you can get that back and [TS]

00:42:57   if you want see the classic control [TS]

00:42:58   panel you can see that again you know [TS]

00:43:00   all those kind of hedging your bets and [TS]

00:43:03   all that stuff even Metro you can say [TS]

00:43:05   like well Windows 8 it's totally nude [TS]

00:43:07   unrelated but if you want to go back to [TS]

00:43:09   the old desktop it's back there to [TS]

00:43:10   switch to the other you know they never [TS]

00:43:12   did the any transition there was [TS]

00:43:15   equivalent to Mac OS 10 as compared to [TS]

00:43:18   classic Mac OS they did it with the core [TS]

00:43:19   OS the Windows NT core that eventually [TS]

00:43:21   became quote-unquote mainstream in [TS]

00:43:24   Windows 2000 ish that was a big internal [TS]

00:43:26   reshuffle albeit with maintaining as [TS]

00:43:29   much backward compatibility as they [TS]

00:43:30   could possibly keep but I think they [TS]

00:43:31   abandon like old 16-bit apps and some [TS]

00:43:35   old da stuff that had to run in a VM or [TS]

00:43:37   whatever but they never made that hard [TS]

00:43:40   split that Mac OS end and they certainly [TS]

00:43:42   never made the hard jump that that iOS [TS]

00:43:44   is there's no no Mac apps whatever no [TS]

00:43:46   backward compatibility completely new [TS]

00:43:47   platform because they were afraid and [TS]

00:43:49   they didn't think they could do it and [TS]

00:43:50   what the time that they could have done [TS]

00:43:52   that was one that they were at the peak [TS]

00:43:53   of their power because nobody was [TS]

00:43:54   willing or able to take that market from [TS]

00:43:56   so even though everyone would have [TS]

00:43:57   screamed and complained and people to [TS]

00:43:59   say their stock value would have been [TS]

00:44:02   punished and their profits wouldn't gone [TS]

00:44:04   down or whatever it's not like that [TS]

00:44:06   business would have gone elsewhere and [TS]

00:44:07   eventually they could have fielded a [TS]

00:44:09   product it was so much better than the [TS]

00:44:11   ones that they had you know killed and [TS]

00:44:13   those corporate IT people had probably [TS]

00:44:16   maybe had some bad experiences trying to [TS]

00:44:17   deploy Linux and [TS]

00:44:18   and fault with a bond realized Apple is [TS]

00:44:20   just not interested in them and want to [TS]

00:44:22   come back to Microsoft and but they [TS]

00:44:23   would have eventually come out of winter [TS]

00:44:24   so this I think it is the main thing [TS]

00:44:29   that that Microsoft did wrong in the [TS]

00:44:32   past few decades the idea that it had to [TS]

00:44:36   maintain this market because if it [TS]

00:44:38   didn't someone else would take it they [TS]

00:44:39   under played their hand their hand was [TS]

00:44:41   much stronger than they thought it would [TS]

00:44:43   may be an obviously it's easy with [TS]

00:44:44   hindsight to say well how do they know [TS]

00:44:46   Linux wouldn't take it how do they know [TS]

00:44:47   Apple wasn't doing that if if your [TS]

00:44:50   Microsoft you think everybody thinks [TS]

00:44:51   like Microsoft you said if we if we [TS]

00:44:53   abandon this market by betraying those [TS]

00:44:55   people and doing something that we think [TS]

00:44:56   is better for the long-term health of [TS]

00:44:57   our product but worse for for our [TS]

00:44:59   constituents who want our products to be [TS]

00:45:00   a certain way apples going to eat our [TS]

00:45:03   lunch because if I was at Apple that's [TS]

00:45:05   what I would do that's the Microsoft [TS]

00:45:06   philosophy all of our competitors [TS]

00:45:07   stumble we swoop right in and say [TS]

00:45:09   whatever that competitor is no longer [TS]

00:45:11   willing to do for you we will do that [TS]

00:45:12   for you we're ready to to be your [TS]

00:45:14   servant in this need to be your partner [TS]

00:45:16   and figuring out what kind of products [TS]

00:45:18   you need maybe maybe they thought that [TS]

00:45:21   Apple would think like them you know and [TS]

00:45:24   again it hindsight is easy to is easy to [TS]

00:45:26   see oh sure you know they didn't know [TS]

00:45:28   everything that we know now that Steve [TS]

00:45:30   Jobs in his attitude and they they [TS]

00:45:32   couldn't have predicted you know was too [TS]

00:45:33   dangerous to move this is I admit [TS]

00:45:35   hindsight you know I'm just saying like [TS]

00:45:37   if you could go back in time with full [TS]

00:45:38   knowledge what would be the correct move [TS]

00:45:40   and I think that's it that it turns out [TS]

00:45:43   they had a lot stronger hand they [TS]

00:45:44   thought they did and they didn't play [TS]

00:45:45   now they're kind of playing it out with [TS]

00:45:48   Metro as I alluded to we would did old [TS]

00:45:50   several episodes in Metro where it [TS]

00:45:52   really is a clean break except for the [TS]

00:45:54   fact that you can still see the windows [TS]

00:45:55   that's not but on the tablets and [TS]

00:45:56   everything like the apps don't look like [TS]

00:45:58   they do this entirely new UI paradigm [TS]

00:46:00   you know new API is the whole nine yards [TS]

00:46:03   with the hedge of the desktop hiding [TS]

00:46:05   underneath but I actually think that [TS]

00:46:08   from Microsoft really to turn itself [TS]

00:46:11   around maybe the best thing that could [TS]

00:46:13   happen to them is for Metro to fail [TS]

00:46:14   miserably and you know like at this [TS]

00:46:16   point the only option maybe the 90 days [TS]

00:46:19   from bankruptcy option or you just [TS]

00:46:21   everything goes to crap the desktop [TS]

00:46:24   starts falling apart not because the [TS]

00:46:26   competitors taking your place but [TS]

00:46:27   because everyone starts using iPads or [TS]

00:46:28   god knows what like some other some [TS]

00:46:31   other horrible thing starts happening [TS]

00:46:32   too [TS]

00:46:33   business and you're just the company [TS]

00:46:34   declined sales declined your cash cow [TS]

00:46:35   stops being a cash cow your new next [TS]

00:46:38   generation product Metro just fails [TS]

00:46:40   miserably in the market Windows 7 [TS]

00:46:41   doesn't take off when the company [TS]

00:46:42   shrinks to some tiny sad little [TS]

00:46:45   shriveled ball of what it used to be [TS]

00:46:47   like Apple in 1996-97 right and then [TS]

00:46:50   someone comes in with a clearer vision [TS]

00:46:52   in terms of turns the thing around you [TS]

00:46:55   know that that maybe uh that's probably [TS]

00:46:58   not the scenario than anybody who's a [TS]

00:47:00   Microsoft fan or shareholder an employee [TS]

00:47:02   wants to happen [TS]

00:47:03   but that may be the most likely dramatic [TS]

00:47:06   turnaround scenario at this point so [TS]

00:47:07   because they didn't back when they had [TS]

00:47:09   the strongest hand they didn't use that [TS]

00:47:12   hand to force you know to force their [TS]

00:47:15   customers and constituents to accept a [TS]

00:47:17   more radical change in their ready [TS]

00:47:18   forwards that's been Apple's MO from day [TS]

00:47:22   one of jobs has returned forcing Apple [TS]

00:47:25   customers Apple developers everybody who [TS]

00:47:28   has a stake in an Apple hardware [TS]

00:47:29   software to to choke down more than they [TS]

00:47:33   were willing to choke down it's always [TS]

00:47:35   been their mo well you're taking all our [TS]

00:47:37   ports away it's just us beyond this iMac [TS]

00:47:39   peripheral manufacturers like grumble [TS]

00:47:40   grumble grumble Kay fine we'll make [TS]

00:47:41   bunch of USB stuff with teal plastic all [TS]

00:47:43   over and for your iMac you know that it [TS]

00:47:46   you're making an entirely new operating [TS]

00:47:48   system it's objective-c with a new [TS]

00:47:49   language and a new API and you're [TS]

00:47:51   telling me this this backward [TS]

00:47:52   compatibility layer I still have to [TS]

00:47:54   modify my apps and by the way you're [TS]

00:47:56   taking that away too it's always been [TS]

00:47:57   whatever you think you can handle my [TS]

00:47:59   crapples is taking away a little bit [TS]

00:48:01   more uh ask for a little bit more right [TS]

00:48:03   the App Store we have full approval in [TS]

00:48:06   your applications the customers aren't [TS]

00:48:08   even ours that's just too much but just [TS]

00:48:10   always Apple is always asking for more [TS]

00:48:12   whereas Microsoft has just been so shy [TS]

00:48:14   about that not wanting to anger the [TS]

00:48:16   people who it serves not don't anger [TS]

00:48:19   them too much right and I think that's [TS]

00:48:21   just the wrong strategy for having a [TS]

00:48:23   long term success I think that's the end [TS]

00:48:28   of my Microsoft notes hmm it's a topic [TS]

00:48:32   that I don't see discussed a lot is [TS]

00:48:33   everyone's talking about like what [TS]

00:48:34   Microsoft should do now but whenever [TS]

00:48:36   anyone talks about Microsoft did in the [TS]

00:48:38   past it's always about how great they [TS]

00:48:41   did look at how Microsoft won the [TS]

00:48:42   desktop market look at all these great [TS]

00:48:43   moves that I make [TS]

00:48:44   I mean there's a lot of things that [TS]

00:48:46   Microsoft did though that helped Apple [TS]

00:48:49   yeah unintentionally unintentionally not [TS]

00:48:52   on purpose or because they didn't think [TS]

00:48:54   Apple was a threat but it was you know [TS]

00:48:56   that the thing I think it's most [TS]

00:48:58   important of our history is back when [TS]

00:49:00   everyone thought it was doing so great [TS]

00:49:01   back were all the stories about [TS]

00:49:02   Microsoft were about how savvy it was in [TS]

00:49:05   business and how it crushed Apple that [TS]

00:49:07   was the point where it made its worst [TS]

00:49:09   mistake not playing its hand not not [TS]

00:49:11   using you know think of think of the [TS]

00:49:13   hands that Apple has played I know it's [TS]

00:49:14   bluffing or what but it would be like [TS]

00:49:16   taking all the ports away from the iMac [TS]

00:49:17   they were an imposition of strengths [TS]

00:49:19   when I did that they were gone down the [TS]

00:49:20   tubes and that was the time that they [TS]

00:49:23   they rightly Jobs rightly I don't know [TS]

00:49:25   if you call it a bluff or whatever but [TS]

00:49:26   he was like you trust me on this like we [TS]

00:49:28   make this computer awesome-looking I [TS]

00:49:29   know people scream and complain that [TS]

00:49:31   just has USB ports but it'll work will [TS]

00:49:33   take away the floppy drive to look trust [TS]

00:49:34   me I know it seem crazy but I have the [TS]

00:49:37   people who like Apple I think they'll go [TS]

00:49:38   with us in this our hand is stronger [TS]

00:49:40   than we think it as whereas if you're an [TS]

00:49:41   outside observer you're saying you [TS]

00:49:42   kidding you're practically bankrupt you [TS]

00:49:44   can't sign any computers that you have [TS]

00:49:45   and you're going to do a bunch of stuff [TS]

00:49:46   that you know is going to piss off your [TS]

00:49:48   customers your loyal customers who love [TS]

00:49:50   you the only people who are buying your [TS]

00:49:51   stuff anymore but he did it so imagine [TS]

00:49:54   how strong Microsoft's hand was if they [TS]

00:49:56   had done Apple like moves back when they [TS]

00:49:59   were so dominant they just think that [TS]

00:50:00   their customers had nowhere to go [TS]

00:50:02   oh god I've got some more things I want [TS]

00:50:09   to ask you about this all right before I [TS]

00:50:11   do let's do our second and and last [TS]

00:50:13   sponsor it's a mail chimp they have a [TS]

00:50:16   brand new mobile app so you're on the go [TS]

00:50:19   you want to see some reports you want to [TS]

00:50:22   see people signing up people are reading [TS]

00:50:23   the list you do that the app is pretty [TS]

00:50:26   pretty amazing as a brand new version [TS]

00:50:28   out there for iOS and Android all you [TS]

00:50:31   need is OS 4.3 or new or an Android 2.2 [TS]

00:50:35   or newer and a MailChimp account which [TS]

00:50:36   is free and it's a shortcut to your [TS]

00:50:39   stats just a few taps you can see our [TS]

00:50:41   campaigns are doing you can see what [TS]

00:50:43   your subscribers are doing with your [TS]

00:50:45   campaigns if they're sharing them and [TS]

00:50:46   how and what if you're out somewhere and [TS]

00:50:49   you you have somebody and you're talking [TS]

00:50:51   about this this cool newsletter you do [TS]

00:50:53   and they're like oh I sign me up for [TS]

00:50:54   that what how do I have to sign [TS]

00:50:55   oh you got to go to my website and here [TS]

00:50:58   let me write down the oral and then you [TS]

00:50:59   go to slash newsletter and you fill out [TS]

00:51:01   the form no you can subscribe them right [TS]

00:51:04   there on the spot with the app it's [TS]

00:51:06   amazing again it's all free go to [TS]

00:51:09   MailChimp com there's a link to it there [TS]

00:51:12   or you can go to the iTunes App Store [TS]

00:51:13   and search for MailChimp you'll find it [TS]

00:51:16   it's pretty great stuff [TS]

00:51:17   MailChimp com is a longtime sponsor of [TS]

00:51:21   ours we love them [TS]

00:51:22   love what they're doing newsletters are [TS]

00:51:25   a big deal [TS]

00:51:25   Ida sign up for siracusa newsletter [TS]

00:51:28   there was one should be one instead of a [TS]

00:51:32   blog a lot of work to write then you [TS]

00:51:35   would have to write it yeah so looking [TS]

00:51:39   at this this situation what do you feel [TS]

00:51:43   looking forward five years from now not [TS]

00:51:46   at Apple which is what we're all fond of [TS]

00:51:48   doing but at Microsoft what what kind of [TS]

00:51:52   company is Microsoft five years from now [TS]

00:51:54   in 2000 a 2015 that's not quite five [TS]

00:51:58   years from now what what is what in 2015 [TS]

00:52:01   what is Microsoft is it the same thing [TS]

00:52:03   are they still struggling have they come [TS]

00:52:05   out with something amazing are they [TS]

00:52:07   I mean what's what's the story the [TS]

00:52:11   problem I have with predicting any kind [TS]

00:52:12   of non boring future for Microsoft is [TS]

00:52:15   the boring future is like well they kind [TS]

00:52:17   of like they are now but like their [TS]

00:52:18   desktop business is making less money [TS]

00:52:20   than you used to and they're kind of [TS]

00:52:22   trying to be more successful Windows [TS]

00:52:24   Phone 7 Metro is kind of out there like [TS]

00:52:26   but that's boring though that's not like [TS]

00:52:28   a they're going to be dead because they [TS]

00:52:30   won't and it's not like they're going to [TS]

00:52:32   be 20 times the size they are now or [TS]

00:52:33   massively successful because I don't [TS]

00:52:35   think they will and the reason for that [TS]

00:52:37   is that when I look at all Microsoft's [TS]

00:52:39   efforts even in cases where I think [TS]

00:52:41   they're kind of doing the right thing [TS]

00:52:42   albeit too late everything they're doing [TS]

00:52:44   is a reaction to something somebody else [TS]

00:52:46   did that's what it seems like to me and [TS]

00:52:48   the things they're not doing that are [TS]

00:52:50   reactions I just never get out the door [TS]

00:52:51   so just look at all their product lines [TS]

00:52:54   Windows Phone 7 it's a reaction to iOS [TS]

00:52:56   the like MIT like pretty much every [TS]

00:52:57   mobile thing in the entire market since [TS]

00:53:01   2007 has been a reaction to the iPhone [TS]

00:53:02   right because they Microsoft had a [TS]

00:53:05   window uh windows you know what was it [TS]

00:53:07   called Windows Mobile and then was [TS]

00:53:09   called [TS]

00:53:09   see before that's great that they name [TS]

00:53:10   the product whose if you pronounce this [TS]

00:53:12   acronym is wince yeah does that was [TS]

00:53:14   pretty much for people dip in Houston [TS]

00:53:15   and they had a mobile operating system [TS]

00:53:18   for a long time right so it's like oh [TS]

00:53:20   they weren't we weren't reacting to [TS]

00:53:21   iPhone we've been doing this mobile [TS]

00:53:21   thing forever clearly iPhone came out [TS]

00:53:23   and they said all that mobile stuff [TS]

00:53:24   we've been doing is crap when you start [TS]

00:53:26   over Windows Phone 7 and I actually got [TS]

00:53:28   a chance to use Windows Phone 7 for the [TS]

00:53:29   first time for like you know three and a [TS]

00:53:32   half minutes I was very impressed by it [TS]

00:53:33   much more impressed than I've ever been [TS]

00:53:35   with my three minutes spent with a [TS]

00:53:36   variety of Android or palm phones were [TS]

00:53:38   you able to try out the Siri like [TS]

00:53:40   functionality that Windows has had on [TS]

00:53:43   the phone for decades or whatever the no [TS]

00:53:45   no I did not I did not try that out I [TS]

00:53:49   was just flipping around looking at you [TS]

00:53:51   know the applications a scrolling [TS]

00:53:53   responsiveness how they've got stuff [TS]

00:53:54   organized is definitely different than [TS]

00:53:56   the iPhone which I think is good and [TS]

00:53:57   actually maybe that's a counter example [TS]

00:53:58   to what I'm saying how everything to do [TS]

00:54:00   is a reaction Windows Phone 7 interface [TS]

00:54:01   and Metro interface it's very least is [TS]

00:54:03   not directly derivative of things other [TS]

00:54:08   people doing but I think the the effort [TS]

00:54:10   itself that effort we need to make next [TS]

00:54:12   generation mobile platform because all [TS]

00:54:13   the ones we've had so far are not good [TS]

00:54:15   enough because of the iPhone that's a [TS]

00:54:16   reaction and the Xbox is a reaction [TS]

00:54:19   basically to the game console market [TS]

00:54:22   starting to grip up its PC power like [TS]

00:54:23   the PlayStation 2 being so massively [TS]

00:54:25   dominant and starting to be a powerful [TS]

00:54:26   enough thing that you know it's got a [TS]

00:54:27   net it's got networking on it uh and [TS]

00:54:29   it's got a powerful CPU and lots of [TS]

00:54:31   memory it's like boy you know to be that [TS]

00:54:35   starting to look like pcs we need to be [TS]

00:54:36   in that market so the Xbox Xbox is a [TS]

00:54:37   reaction to the console market that [TS]

00:54:39   existed before them and and they they [TS]

00:54:42   did sort of the same things that the [TS]

00:54:44   rest of the console market did same [TS]

00:54:46   thing on the phone that you know it's [TS]

00:54:47   got to be all screen it's got to be all [TS]

00:54:48   touchscreen yeah we'll do it from UI [TS]

00:54:49   buts react into the iPhone whatever set [TS]

00:54:52   MSN is your action data well windows [TS]

00:54:55   your reaction to the Mac one other [TS]

00:54:58   efforts might forgetting something the [TS]

00:54:59   Microsoft's doing now that one of their [TS]

00:55:01   important things Kinect is a great [TS]

00:55:03   example Kinect is a reaction to we you [TS]

00:55:06   know the the we was the innovator [TS]

00:55:07   they're saying we're going to change the [TS]

00:55:09   input for consoles from this little [TS]

00:55:11   thing you hold your hand through thumbs [TS]

00:55:12   to something different [TS]

00:55:13   Kinect is more innovative than [TS]

00:55:15   PlayStation Move because it's like oh no [TS]

00:55:17   control at all like but it's still a [TS]

00:55:18   reaction to what's something that [TS]

00:55:19   competitor did but I don't see from [TS]

00:55:20   Microsoft is them [TS]

00:55:22   doing something where they're the first [TS]

00:55:25   one to do this thing and everyone's [TS]

00:55:26   going to be reacting to them I'll Bing [TS]

00:55:28   is another example Bing does reaction to [TS]

00:55:29   Google right they weren't the ones [TS]

00:55:32   spearheading that effort so if [TS]

00:55:34   everything they do is your reaction to [TS]

00:55:36   somebody else no matter how good they [TS]

00:55:38   are even have to execute like ten times [TS]

00:55:40   better than the other guy they'll never [TS]

00:55:42   be the one who defined that market the [TS]

00:55:44   Zune the reaction of the iPod there [TS]

00:55:46   they'll always be playing catch-up [TS]

00:55:49   they'll always be behind they'll [TS]

00:55:50   especially behind for people like Apple [TS]

00:55:52   who are super secretive who's we have no [TS]

00:55:53   idea what the hell a polygamist Evy [TS]

00:55:55   product so if they do something that [TS]

00:55:56   turns out to be successful Microsoft [TS]

00:55:59   gets a start like unannounced and a [TS]

00:56:00   scrambling to make their competitor [TS]

00:56:02   product they don't get you know they [TS]

00:56:04   don't get the two years of R&D that are [TS]

00:56:05   already gone into the Apple thing or do [TS]

00:56:07   you think that's a big part of the Apple [TS]

00:56:08   secrecy targeted specifically at the big [TS]

00:56:11   companies like Microsoft that if they [TS]

00:56:13   really had and I mean a lot a lot of [TS]

00:56:16   people are speculating that the secrecy [TS]

00:56:18   behind Apple ism is as much for you know [TS]

00:56:22   it's more about like people they want to [TS]

00:56:24   surprise people and they don't want [TS]

00:56:26   people to not buy the things that [TS]

00:56:28   they're offering out of their inventory [TS]

00:56:30   but maybe it sounds like you're saying [TS]

00:56:32   that it sure it's those things but maybe [TS]

00:56:35   it's more directed at their big big [TS]

00:56:37   competitors like Microsoft I think the [TS]

00:56:40   most important for the reason a police [TS]

00:56:43   OC croteau I think mostly ties in with [TS]

00:56:45   Steve Jobs is personality but ignoring [TS]

00:56:46   like the origins of a wire secret if I [TS]

00:56:48   had to rank the benefits of being [TS]

00:56:50   secretive ignoring why what it motivated [TS]

00:56:53   in the first place what what is the [TS]

00:56:54   actual result of this what are the [TS]

00:56:55   benefits the number one benefit I would [TS]

00:56:57   say is how how the market reacts to [TS]

00:57:02   stuff and how do consumers react it sort [TS]

00:57:04   of under-promise over-deliver thing [TS]

00:57:05   where they don't do the thing where they [TS]

00:57:07   show you what they're going to give you [TS]

00:57:08   in a year because that is just poison [TS]

00:57:10   because no matter what you show them [TS]

00:57:12   either like they want it right now and [TS]

00:57:14   they start thinking your existing [TS]

00:57:15   products are crappy or they bill look [TS]

00:57:16   fantasies in their head about what it's [TS]

00:57:18   going to be about or you don't exactly [TS]

00:57:19   meet what you showed in the demo like [TS]

00:57:21   that the whole knowledge navigator thing [TS]

00:57:22   where they made like a fantasy video [TS]

00:57:24   like this is what Apple computers are [TS]

00:57:25   going to be like in the future and then [TS]

00:57:26   I'm gonna not ever own a set don't don't [TS]

00:57:29   show anything if you've got something to [TS]

00:57:31   show that is the number one benefit of [TS]

00:57:33   that what that does to the market is not [TS]

00:57:35   benefit from Apple secrecy that it frees [TS]

00:57:38   them from all sorts of BS in terms of [TS]

00:57:40   public relations consumers everything is [TS]

00:57:42   like there is nothing but rumors until [TS]

00:57:44   we show you the thing and rumors is like [TS]

00:57:46   you know lucky those crazy rumors about [TS]

00:57:48   everything like that's not affecting [TS]

00:57:49   their market there's there's nothing [TS]

00:57:51   this this holiday season are people you [TS]

00:57:53   know I don't want to buy an iPad because [TS]

00:57:55   the iPad 3 is coming out and it's got a [TS]

00:57:56   double resolution display maybe as Apple [TS]

00:57:59   said that no you know you can't if Apple [TS]

00:58:02   has shown like the last WotC and we're [TS]

00:58:05   cons great new iPad and look it's got a [TS]

00:58:07   double resolution spray is going to be [TS]

00:58:08   awesome people that dampens the [TS]

00:58:10   enthusiasm of people buying an iPad for [TS]

00:58:11   their you know families this Christmas [TS]

00:58:13   right nothing they say nothing until [TS]

00:58:15   they're ready with the thing and the [TS]

00:58:17   environment that creates our own Apple [TS]

00:58:19   products from a consumers perspective [TS]

00:58:21   and for retail and very that is the most [TS]

00:58:24   important result of secrecy and also by [TS]

00:58:26   the way yet another reason why they are [TS]

00:58:28   totally incompatible with corporate IT [TS]

00:58:30   because that's not what corporate IT [TS]

00:58:31   wants they want a roadmap and Apple [TS]

00:58:34   doesn't want that so that the second [TS]

00:58:36   biggest reason probably is not honestly [TS]

00:58:42   like not tipping your hand to [TS]

00:58:44   competitors that's what you were getting [TS]

00:58:45   at like you don't let people know that [TS]

00:58:46   you're you know you see all these these [TS]

00:58:48   this footage of you know that the brand [TS]

00:58:51   new version of whatever new car is [TS]

00:58:54   coming out and how they'll have it all [TS]

00:58:55   disguised when they're doing the the [TS]

00:58:57   test runs in you know wonder if you're [TS]

00:59:00   up if you're fan of any kind of sports [TS]

00:59:02   whenever they're doing their practice [TS]

00:59:03   they're very very careful about who can [TS]

00:59:06   go and see them running their drills and [TS]

00:59:08   and you know that that's a known thing [TS]

00:59:11   so there's part of that is there for the [TS]

00:59:13   competitors but I guess I'm just curious [TS]

00:59:15   what where them the main concern is as a [TS]

00:59:18   competitors or is it I bet secondary [TS]

00:59:20   concern is competitors because the thing [TS]

00:59:21   about competitors is you can't do what [TS]

00:59:23   you do to consumers to them consumers [TS]

00:59:25   like literally do not know if an iPad 3 [TS]

00:59:28   exists with the double resolution [TS]

00:59:29   display or when it's coming out or like [TS]

00:59:30   all we have just vague rumors like we [TS]

00:59:33   get nothing solid [TS]

00:59:34   but competitors usually have pretty [TS]

00:59:37   solid leads like for example if Apple is [TS]

00:59:39   talking to every single television [TS]

00:59:42   network there's just no way you can hide [TS]

00:59:45   that from competitors who's also talking [TS]

00:59:46   to the same guys I know apples going to [TS]

00:59:47   say as part of this legal [TS]

00:59:49   you can't say you ever met with us bla [TS]

00:59:50   bla bla but when it's when it's like [TS]

00:59:52   when you're in the room with the guy [TS]

00:59:54   running CBS and Apple guys we're just [TS]

00:59:55   there that week you can tell whether [TS]

00:59:58   Apple's been there or not [TS]

00:59:59   even if they [TS]

00:59:59   even if they [TS]

01:00:00   never said like it's just especially [TS]

01:00:01   when you're doing deals with people for [TS]

01:00:03   content which is increasing what the [TS]

01:00:04   stuff is about other people can get wind [TS]

01:00:07   of the big moves that Apple's make me [TS]

01:00:09   more like manufacturers oh I'm sorry we [TS]

01:00:10   don't have manufacturing capacity for [TS]

01:00:12   those LCDs why well we just don't like [TS]

01:00:14   another you know we can't tell you who [TS]

01:00:16   is taking that manufacturing capacity or [TS]

01:00:18   yeah you can figure it out because you [TS]

01:00:20   are talking directly to the same people [TS]

01:00:22   that Apple talked their consumers were [TS]

01:00:23   just talking to people who talked to [TS]

01:00:24   people or the rumored from this guy you [TS]

01:00:26   know it's really hard to hide your [TS]

01:00:28   strategic moves as in Apple's making a [TS]

01:00:31   TV from your competitors because they're [TS]

01:00:33   talking to all the same people you are [TS]

01:00:35   all the people you need to do your [TS]

01:00:36   manufacturing to your business deal city [TS]

01:00:38   you're shipping to do everything but [TS]

01:00:41   what you can hide from them is what [TS]

01:00:43   exactly are you doing like they can try [TS]

01:00:45   to piece together they have much more [TS]

01:00:46   solid information than consumers do [TS]

01:00:48   about what you're doing but they don't [TS]

01:00:50   know exactly what the new Apple TV think [TS]

01:00:52   is going to be like they just can't so [TS]

01:00:54   they'll be alerted they'll be on alert [TS]

01:00:57   like geez Apple students until we gotta [TS]

01:00:58   do some TV thing but they can't make [TS]

01:01:01   their reaction product until they see [TS]

01:01:03   what the heck you you've made an Apple [TS]

01:01:04   is good enough with secrecy to prevent [TS]

01:01:06   them from know exactly we're going to [TS]

01:01:07   make sure they scramble go oh my god we [TS]

01:01:08   got to make a Microsoft TV and then make [TS]

01:01:10   a whole big TV set with a Microsoft logo [TS]

01:01:11   on it with like an Xbox strapped to the [TS]

01:01:13   back or something and turns out Apple [TS]

01:01:14   ships another little black box and not a [TS]

01:01:16   television set they goofed they didn't [TS]

01:01:19   react to the right thing they knew there [TS]

01:01:21   was something going on TV they could [TS]

01:01:23   kind of say sometime next year there's [TS]

01:01:25   got to be something going on the TV we [TS]

01:01:26   should do something to you they don't [TS]

01:01:27   know what to do exactly so that's I [TS]

01:01:30   think that's a secondary benefit to [TS]

01:01:32   their secrecy it'll be gone to the [TS]

01:01:37   secrecy topic again it's a good topic [TS]

01:01:39   we're talking about what you are [TS]

01:01:41   refusing to predict what Microsoft will [TS]

01:01:43   call you anyway ourself would be [TS]

01:01:45   infighting so so I was saying that the [TS]

01:01:47   thing that's keeping them back is that [TS]

01:01:48   everything you're doing is a reaction to [TS]

01:01:50   somebody else [TS]

01:01:51   ah and that's they have to stop that [TS]

01:01:55   they have to do something that is their [TS]

01:01:58   own there they are [TS]

01:02:01   if you want to be a big player in this [TS]

01:02:03   market you have to be the first one to [TS]

01:02:05   do this thing or the first one that you [TS]

01:02:06   know the first one to do but the first [TS]

01:02:07   one to do it well like for example in [TS]

01:02:09   Gmail Gmail was a pretty big [TS]

01:02:11   game-changer for Google obviously Google [TS]

01:02:13   search [TS]

01:02:13   like they did search better than [TS]

01:02:15   everybody else they're not the first one [TS]

01:02:16   to make search but the first one to just [TS]

01:02:17   make search much much better and just [TS]

01:02:19   you know really defined search right so [TS]

01:02:21   that was Google's big thing but Gmail [TS]

01:02:23   was another example they're not the [TS]

01:02:25   first ones do webmail hotmail was out [TS]

01:02:26   and all those other things were out [TS]

01:02:27   there whatever but Gmail changed the [TS]

01:02:30   game just same way the iPhone changed [TS]

01:02:32   the game where there was plenty of smart [TS]

01:02:33   phones before the iPhone but the iPhone [TS]

01:02:35   had a new way to do it that was so much [TS]

01:02:38   more compelling the other ways that it [TS]

01:02:39   came to define the smartphone so Gmail [TS]

01:02:41   just stomped on its competitors because [TS]

01:02:43   of what I figure what it was like two [TS]

01:02:45   gigabytes of space and it's free and [TS]

01:02:46   it's fast and it's reliable and this [TS]

01:02:49   little text ads on the side instead of [TS]

01:02:50   giant viagra banners in line denied you [TS]

01:02:52   know it was just it you know that [TS]

01:02:55   defined webmail for that point I was [TS]

01:02:57   like you want to do web mail well you [TS]

01:02:58   you get you gotta compete with Gmail now [TS]

01:03:00   like that's you know you want to make a [TS]

01:03:01   smart phone look at the iPhone because [TS]

01:03:03   that's what you got to deal with all [TS]

01:03:04   right so they they Google did something [TS]

01:03:06   granted and you know I don't know how [TS]

01:03:08   much money they still just token all [TS]

01:03:09   their money from advertising but it was [TS]

01:03:10   sort of a defining product that wasn't [TS]

01:03:12   following what everybody else did in [TS]

01:03:14   that space this gets back to what Gruber [TS]

01:03:16   was talking before every time I said is [TS]

01:03:17   people are gonna say what do you mean [TS]

01:03:19   you know not following everything's [TS]

01:03:20   apples done has been a following of [TS]

01:03:22   somebody else they weren't the first [TS]

01:03:23   ones to make the GUI about the whole [TS]

01:03:24   idea that innovation means you had the [TS]

01:03:26   very first one to ever do this that's [TS]

01:03:27   not what it means that think about the [TS]

01:03:29   iPhone it sort of saying there's so many [TS]

01:03:31   mobile phones for the iPhone so many [TS]

01:03:32   smart phones so many applications on [TS]

01:03:34   phones before the iPhone yet clearly the [TS]

01:03:36   iPhone is this discontinuity and then [TS]

01:03:38   everything after the iPhone was changed [TS]

01:03:40   that type of move is with Microsoft that [TS]

01:03:42   does it has to do maybe metros I don't [TS]

01:03:46   know a metro I still see metro and [TS]

01:03:48   Windows 8 as reaction to iOS is hard not [TS]

01:03:50   to see it that way [TS]

01:03:51   even though the software is so different [TS]

01:03:53   but if margosa wants to be someplace [TS]

01:03:55   other than someplace boring in 10 or 15 [TS]

01:03:59   years they need to do some I don't know [TS]

01:04:00   what that is that's up to them to decide [TS]

01:04:02   what a disk whatever whatever they [TS]

01:04:03   decide that is you know Microsoft could [TS]

01:04:06   leverage its entire company to try to [TS]

01:04:09   become the future of TV you know ditch [TS]

01:04:12   everything else like allow it to be [TS]

01:04:13   cannibalized say we are going to be the [TS]

01:04:15   future television whatever they have to [TS]

01:04:16   do like buy up all the content with the [TS]

01:04:18   huge cash reserves to buy their own [TS]

01:04:20   network for delivery loader they could [TS]

01:04:22   be the future television and that could [TS]

01:04:24   be their future in 15 years if they [TS]

01:04:26   decided the [TS]

01:04:27   point of Microsoft has become to become [TS]

01:04:28   the future of television and all those [TS]

01:04:30   people who have been using our existing [TS]

01:04:31   products tough luck they'll have to [TS]

01:04:33   figure something out if they all go to [TS]

01:04:35   Apple that we think will actually weigh [TS]

01:04:37   Apple down like a like a boat anchor and [TS]

01:04:39   will help us zoom ahead to become the [TS]

01:04:41   future of television not I'm saying this [TS]

01:04:42   is what Microsoft should do in [TS]

01:04:43   television is probably not the future of [TS]

01:04:44   anything anyway but I'm just saying like [TS]

01:04:46   that type of that type of move that that [TS]

01:04:49   Apple did in each little endeavor with [TS]

01:04:51   the iMac with the iPhone with the iPad [TS]

01:04:53   each one of those things Apple was [TS]

01:04:55   willing to say if Apple in 20 years is [TS]

01:04:58   just the company that makes the iPad and [TS]

01:04:59   although the products are dead we're [TS]

01:05:00   fine with that [TS]

01:05:01   because we'll just keep making new [TS]

01:05:02   products and new products you know like [TS]

01:05:03   their each new product it they're ok [TS]

01:05:07   with that being the the cornerstone of [TS]

01:05:09   their business in fact they hope it does [TS]

01:05:10   eat all their other business like when [TS]

01:05:12   the iPhone comes out as it came to [TS]

01:05:13   dominate the Mac you know even the iPod [TS]

01:05:15   the iPod came and suddenly Apple makes [TS]

01:05:17   more money for my pods and Macs Apple [TS]

01:05:18   isn't freaking about that so no we're [TS]

01:05:20   the Mac company we can't have a product [TS]

01:05:22   makes more money than Mac and the iPhone [TS]

01:05:23   came out and made more on the iPad [TS]

01:05:25   they're ok with that and our iPhone made [TS]

01:05:27   more money than the iMac or the iPod [TS]

01:05:29   they were ok with that too and the [TS]

01:05:31   iPhone if you look at the chart Horace's [TS]

01:05:33   great charts you can see the iPad [TS]

01:05:34   starting to grow in the percentage of [TS]

01:05:36   revenues and profits and everything [TS]

01:05:38   Apple's ok with that too Margaret has no [TS]

01:05:40   charts like that no charts where Zune [TS]

01:05:43   comes out and starts slowly getting to [TS]

01:05:45   be as big as Windows in office and then [TS]

01:05:46   you know the metro comes out and tablets [TS]

01:05:49   start to become as big as the Zune they [TS]

01:05:51   they just don't have that model so where [TS]

01:05:53   does that microphone going to be in 15 [TS]

01:05:54   years without a product is not a [TS]

01:05:56   follower product following someone [TS]

01:05:58   else's innovation they're gonna be like [TS]

01:05:59   they are now but even a little bit more [TS]

01:06:01   set like they are now but more sad a [TS]

01:06:06   little bit more sad okay and I mean a [TS]

01:06:09   thing that's I'm not predicting and I'm [TS]

01:06:11   saying if they don't do that [TS]

01:06:12   there's no they have so much money and [TS]

01:06:14   so much talent in so many brains it's [TS]

01:06:15   just a matter of like will and [TS]

01:06:17   priorities and I guess making the right [TS]

01:06:20   bet on what it is that you want to do I [TS]

01:06:21   think television probably be the wrong [TS]

01:06:23   bet kind of like game consoles were the [TS]

01:06:24   wrong bet in hindsight like they made a [TS]

01:06:26   great game console that's not where the [TS]

01:06:28   future of the industry was and so now [TS]

01:06:32   they're kind of like second place game [TS]

01:06:33   console but even like the first league [TS]

01:06:35   game consoles terrified of iOS like [TS]

01:06:37   Nintendo's out there you know getting [TS]

01:06:38   its lunch eaten by iOS so obviously the [TS]

01:06:40   future was in [TS]

01:06:41   they accept my croissant bet on mobile [TS]

01:06:44   they just been whoo good job right yeah [TS]

01:06:46   we haven't talked about games and gaming [TS]

01:06:48   consoles on this show like like that [TS]

01:06:50   industry have we not enough that'd be a [TS]

01:06:54   good topic for future show I would like [TS]

01:06:56   that to be a topic for you to show I'm [TS]

01:06:57   not sure how to focus it it's you know [TS]

01:07:01   it's kind of an amorphous concept I [TS]

01:07:05   don't know what I don't know thing I [TS]

01:07:07   think I've actually have this in my [TS]

01:07:08   notes for this show is talking about [TS]

01:07:10   Nintendo does Nintendo I think is a very [TS]

01:07:14   interesting analog to Apple and it's [TS]

01:07:16   also a company at the crossroads so [TS]

01:07:17   maybe I'll just do a whole show on on [TS]

01:07:19   Nintendo or on the aspects of Nintendo [TS]

01:07:22   that remind me of Apple and they relate [TS]

01:07:25   to Apple so I'll tuck that away for for [TS]

01:07:29   the future probably in the show then [TS]

01:07:34   yeah we also never talked about patents [TS]

01:07:37   somehow we managed remember that whole [TS]

01:07:38   pile yeah everybody everybody was [TS]

01:07:40   talking about patents and I never I'm [TS]

01:07:43   not that I have a particular unique [TS]

01:07:44   injures or interesting take on patents [TS]

01:07:45   but it will be worth throwing into some [TS]

01:07:48   show he kept quiet no everyone else was [TS]

01:07:51   doing you know people had more of a [TS]

01:07:52   connection like Marco had a more direct [TS]

01:07:53   connection with the with the whole lot [TS]

01:07:55   sis things and stuff like that so it's [TS]

01:07:57   better to leave that to them and I [TS]

01:07:59   forget what I was talking about at the [TS]

01:08:00   time probably something completely [TS]

01:08:02   unrelated so it didn't quite fit in but [TS]

01:08:04   maybe I'll circle back to it eventually [TS]

01:08:05   because it you know it doesn't leave the [TS]

01:08:07   news stays in there we should end it [TS]

01:08:13   then I think so too bad you don't have [TS]

01:08:15   any turkey sitting there waiting for you [TS]

01:08:18   to go eat for late late lunch [TS]

01:08:20   no I what I did bring to Thanksgiving [TS]

01:08:22   was the dessert so I got a lot I got a [TS]

01:08:25   lot of desserts in the house that's kind [TS]

01:08:28   of bad though big it's like yeah say [TS]

01:08:29   that don't you say that like it's a good [TS]

01:08:30   thing [TS]

01:08:31   yeah just well I know you yeah but [TS]

01:08:34   generally you don't want to load up on [TS]

01:08:35   that stuff no matter even if even if you [TS]

01:08:37   loved it even if you love desserts you [TS]

01:08:39   can have too much of your favorite [TS]

01:08:41   dessert and then you just don't want to [TS]

01:08:42   have it anymore [TS]

01:08:43   mmm that never happened to me instead it [TS]

01:08:46   happens to me it's not true of like your [TS]

01:08:48   favorite savory food I think mostly not [TS]

01:08:50   true like it's like not like your your [TS]

01:08:55   on steaks you know like I just can't I [TS]

01:08:57   can't have another steak I had steak [TS]

01:08:58   three times this week [TS]

01:08:59   you still like steak you have have you [TS]

01:09:00   had apple pie three times last week and [TS]

01:09:02   came time for dessert you wouldn't be up [TS]

01:09:04   for the Apple no not me maybe for [TS]

01:09:06   dessert anyway reset for the after dark [TS]

01:09:07   but I'll save it for the after dark [TS]

01:09:09   alright so listen up people who were [TS]

01:09:12   enjoying this episode we don't have a [TS]

01:09:13   lot of show notes but I've actually been [TS]

01:09:17   making some tweaks to the show notes a [TS]

01:09:19   little bit of feedback somebody emailed [TS]

01:09:21   to say Dan you refer to the show notes [TS]

01:09:25   and then when I actually go to the show [TS]

01:09:28   notes page it says episode links what [TS]

01:09:31   are you trying to do to me so I've [TS]

01:09:33   actually fixed that and a number of [TS]

01:09:35   other things and I did something just [TS]

01:09:37   for you John I haven't deployed this yet [TS]

01:09:40   but in my early morning coding efforts [TS]

01:09:43   over the last week or so I've been doing [TS]

01:09:46   making little enhancements and one of [TS]

01:09:48   them is something I think you might or [TS]

01:09:49   might not care about you your friends at [TS]

01:09:52   the incomparable podcast on 5x5 probably [TS]

01:09:55   would or will care about this but I've [TS]

01:09:57   made a place for there to be extended [TS]

01:10:00   notes which can include embedded links [TS]

01:10:02   and things like that so if you want to [TS]

01:10:03   do like a mini blog post along with an [TS]

01:10:06   episode you can now do there's a place [TS]

01:10:09   for you to do that and people may be [TS]

01:10:12   listening to this wondering what it is [TS]

01:10:13   we have show notes the show notes by the [TS]

01:10:15   way are sponsored by help spot comm [TS]

01:10:18   which is great check them out but you [TS]

01:10:20   can go to 5x5 that TV slash [TS]

01:10:22   hypercritical slash 44 and all of the [TS]

01:10:25   links and things that the John and [TS]

01:10:26   sometimes me have found they will be [TS]

01:10:29   there right there and you can follow [TS]

01:10:32   John on Twitter head siracusa I'm Dan [TS]

01:10:35   benjamin on twitter and rate the show in [TS]

01:10:38   itunes there was somebody emailed to say [TS]

01:10:40   that there were 666 reviews of this show [TS]

01:10:46   or ratings of the show was a different [TS]

01:10:48   show was are you sure that was this one [TS]

01:10:49   we've got reviews or ratings ratings now [TS]

01:10:52   this there were way over that number of [TS]

01:10:54   ratings okay although we should be [TS]

01:10:55   higher everybody just go and click [TS]

01:10:57   little stars we're stuck we're stuck [TS]

01:10:59   around a thousand [TS]

01:11:01   I just noted power through that yeah but [TS]

01:11:05   that's it so glad you had a good [TS]

01:11:07   Thanksgiving and everybody thanks for [TS]

01:11:09   tuning in we'll be back next week same [TS]

01:11:12   time same station thanks John yep [TS]

01:11:28   you [TS]