The Talk Show

00:00:02 ◼   ► beautiful blues with java i'm going to

00:00:23 ◼   ► wish you a Happy android first day

00:00:25 ◼   ► yes very happy android first day i'm

00:00:28 ◼   ► glad glad the timing of this this

00:00:32 ◼   ► episode surround the betta almost

00:00:34 ◼   ► perfectly it was a movement six months

00:00:37 ◼   ► ago six months ago Eric Schmidt very

00:00:40 ◼   ► smartly made a couple of predictions

00:00:44 ◼   ► yeah LOL so there were actually i think

00:00:47 ◼   ► there were three right he made he

00:00:49 ◼   ► obviously made the one saying that by

00:00:51 ◼   ► this state you know he thought that uh

00:00:53 ◼   ► android-developers a would kind of be

00:00:58 ◼   ► sorry developers in general be focusing

00:01:00 ◼   ► on Android first instead of iOS he he

00:01:05 ◼   ► made the prediction that Google

00:01:07 ◼   ► television or there would be the vast

00:01:09 ◼   ► majority of TV's on the market would be

00:01:12 ◼   ► running some form of google TV and what

00:01:15 ◼   ► was the third thing all the there would

00:01:19 ◼   ► be some sort of killer tablet this was

00:01:20 ◼   ► sort of a weird one because like I think

00:01:22 ◼   ► was translated from some some foreign

00:01:26 ◼   ► press thing but uh something about a

00:01:28 ◼   ► killer tablet coming out around this

00:01:29 ◼   ► time that might be the one that he's

00:01:31 ◼   ► only somewhat often i think i think they

00:01:34 ◼   ► will have something along those lines

00:01:36 ◼   ► that their upcoming io conference but

00:01:39 ◼   ► still still not quite six months a

00:01:41 ◼   ► little bit more than sex once I am I

00:01:43 ◼   ► think that the the TV one in particular

00:01:46 ◼   ► was that not that there would be half

00:01:49 ◼   ► the tvs and use would have google TV but

00:01:51 ◼   ► half the tvs and stores in the US with

00:01:54 ◼   ► right have something I haven't been the

00:01:57 ◼   ► best buy this week i have not been the

00:01:59 ◼   ► best buy but i'm guessing if i did and i

00:02:02 ◼   ► kept a tally and I'm guessing it's a

00:02:04 ◼   ► little under fifty percent yeah they may

00:02:07 ◼   ► have gotten a big shipment in yesterday

00:02:09 ◼   ► I was worried about two weeks ago I i

00:02:11 ◼   ► don't recall seeing any butter

00:02:14 ◼   ► I'm sure I'm sure he had some reason to

00:02:17 ◼   ► suggest that that this was actually

00:02:20 ◼   ► going to happen and i'm sure we'll hear

00:02:21 ◼   ► more about it at Google i/o again

00:02:23 ◼   ► the kids have been complaining about

00:02:25 ◼   ► this show the talk shows usually that it

00:02:27 ◼   ► is rambling and unfocused those are the

00:02:29 ◼   ► adjectives that come up a lot from

00:02:31 ◼   ► people who don't seem to like it i have

00:02:32 ◼   ► i have a bad feeling that this

00:02:34 ◼   ► particular episode maybe the word smug

00:02:36 ◼   ► is gonna come quick

00:02:38 ◼   ► yeah that's a tough as they come up

00:02:41 ◼   ► sometimes I my special guest this week

00:02:43 ◼   ► i'm speaking to mg Siegler of Paris

00:02:47 ◼   ► lemon fame and techcrunch in and various

00:02:50 ◼   ► other endeavors and and I think you and

00:02:55 ◼   ► I have a sort of shared reputation for

00:02:57 ◼   ► 4i i'm not sure how to describe it being

00:03:01 ◼   ► poor poor sports right being you know

00:03:06 ◼   ► not acknowledging androids winning ways

00:03:09 ◼   ► many capacity I guess right all right

00:03:13 ◼   ► and you know and I i think that you and

00:03:16 ◼   ► I again this is so far this one of the

00:03:20 ◼   ► talk show it's a lot of people who who

00:03:21 ◼   ► I'm on the same page with but I think

00:03:23 ◼   ► you you approach this the same way I do

00:03:25 ◼   ► and you've done a lot of work with mike

00:03:29 ◼   ► arrington who I have a funny

00:03:30 ◼   ► relationship with but i do think though

00:03:32 ◼   ► that one thing that the three of us

00:03:35 ◼   ► agree on you mean you mike arrington is

00:03:37 ◼   ► that you'd if you're writing about this

00:03:40 ◼   ► stuff just call a spade a spade

00:03:42 ◼   ► alright just lay it out there and I'm

00:03:46 ◼   ► not gonna die i say to people I'm not

00:03:48 ◼   ► going to sit here and bend over

00:03:49 ◼   ► backwards to make somebody who's in

00:03:52 ◼   ► second place seem like they're closer to

00:03:53 ◼   ► first base first place than they really

00:03:55 ◼   ► are just just because somebody thinks

00:03:57 ◼   ► that's the way it should be

00:03:59 ◼   ► yeah totally yeah i totally agree with

00:04:04 ◼   ► that obviously and i think you know when

00:04:07 ◼   ► we do get lumped into this this group

00:04:09 ◼   ► that's some people feel is being unfair

00:04:12 ◼   ► to guess the android camp it's you know

00:04:14 ◼   ► it is just because that's the way we see

00:04:17 ◼   ► it and I think for good reason and i

00:04:18 ◼   ► think you know over time a lot of people

00:04:20 ◼   ► have a have come over to this site as

00:04:22 ◼   ► well but it's just got to be very

00:04:24 ◼   ► frustrating for the

00:04:27 ◼   ► those who see it a different way I guess

00:04:28 ◼   ► and yeah i mean along those lines I

00:04:32 ◼   ► remember what was the thing a few i

00:04:34 ◼   ► guess it was a couple weeks ago where I

00:04:37 ◼   ► think it was david poe grow some kind of

00:04:38 ◼   ► review about some gadget I forget what

00:04:41 ◼   ► it was i he might have been an android

00:04:43 ◼   ► gadget maybe a windows phone thing I

00:04:44 ◼   ► don't really remember what it was but

00:04:46 ◼   ► someone I think it was a BuzzFeed i

00:04:48 ◼   ► think it was Matt you can adjust yeah

00:04:49 ◼   ► I'm apart 44 kinda you know make going

00:04:52 ◼   ► out of his way to make it sound like you

00:04:54 ◼   ► know this is a decent thing that that

00:04:56 ◼   ► someone would like it's not clear that

00:04:57 ◼   ► someone was that someone even exists in

00:05:00 ◼   ► the real world but I those things are

00:05:03 ◼   ► always pretty funny to me right as i

00:05:04 ◼   ► call it grading on a curve

00:05:06 ◼   ► yeah right it's this bending over

00:05:08 ◼   ► backwards to make it seem as though it's

00:05:10 ◼   ► it's more competitive than it really is

00:05:12 ◼   ► because i had the bottom line was it was

00:05:15 ◼   ► the the samsung galaxy player 4.2 I I'd

00:05:21 ◼   ► i think i can do is write it was the

00:05:23 ◼   ► ipod touch competitor right from Samsung

00:05:26 ◼   ► and it does seem like finally five years

00:05:29 ◼   ► later they've got a pretty good version

00:05:32 ◼   ► of the ipod touch meaning in it like it

00:05:34 ◼   ► like a high-end android phone without

00:05:36 ◼   ► the phone but it was really really funny

00:05:40 ◼   ► to read post take on well why would you

00:05:43 ◼   ► buy this instead of the ipod touch and

00:05:45 ◼   ► its really really hard you know that's a

00:05:48 ◼   ► hard thing to come up with ya and I

00:05:50 ◼   ► totally acknowledge that if you work at

00:05:52 ◼   ► samsung or HTC any of these companies

00:05:54 ◼   ► you're in the hole on this but it's it's

00:05:59 ◼   ► like anything where if if you're behind

00:06:01 ◼   ► it's not enough to catch up to who's in

00:06:03 ◼   ► the lead you've got it put something out

00:06:05 ◼   ► there that's that's in some ways ten

00:06:07 ◼   ► times better

00:06:08 ◼   ► yep totally agree thats that's like

00:06:10 ◼   ► that's windows phone right now in a

00:06:11 ◼   ► nutshell to you know it's great it's a

00:06:13 ◼   ► good product but is it ten times better

00:06:15 ◼   ► than than the iphone and you know

00:06:19 ◼   ► certainly not with apps there's a what

00:06:22 ◼   ► did they hit I think they did they hit a

00:06:24 ◼   ► hundred thousand apps or something the

00:06:25 ◼   ► other day but it's like you know that

00:06:29 ◼   ► metric doesn't really matter that much

00:06:30 ◼   ► anymore and I don't even know if they

00:06:32 ◼   ► have a good percentage of the top apps

00:06:34 ◼   ► on there it's just you know who who

00:06:38 ◼   ► knows what those a hundred thousand apps

00:06:40 ◼   ► are

00:06:40 ◼   ► or in it and if they matter to anyone

00:06:41 ◼   ► but you know we'll see what uh what all

00:06:45 ◼   ► this windows 8 stuff if that changes

00:06:47 ◼   ► things at all from from an app

00:06:49 ◼   ► developers perspective

00:06:51 ◼   ► yeah I'm pretty bearish right now on on

00:06:54 ◼   ► windows 8 in general i don't know i

00:06:56 ◼   ► don't know how much you've talked about

00:06:57 ◼   ► it and I've said some things here and

00:06:59 ◼   ► there I think you and I are on the same

00:07:01 ◼   ► page where I just don't understand it

00:07:04 ◼   ► you know i like the metro stuff and i

00:07:06 ◼   ► kinda just wish they were doing that I

00:07:08 ◼   ► know why they're not I mean they have

00:07:09 ◼   ► the legacy and they have all those users

00:07:11 ◼   ► they can't just abandon straight up but

00:07:13 ◼   ► i think it's going to kind of be a

00:07:15 ◼   ► nightmare I've only used prototype stuff

00:07:17 ◼   ► but i think it's going to be a nightmare

00:07:18 ◼   ► trying to reconcile those two completely

00:07:22 ◼   ► different things into some kind of

00:07:23 ◼   ► seamless operating system

00:07:25 ◼   ► yeah I i think the bottom line and I'm

00:07:27 ◼   ► fascinated to see how it turns out

00:07:29 ◼   ► and if anybody can make it work it is

00:07:31 ◼   ► Microsoft because there's one of their

00:07:33 ◼   ► things that they've done right

00:07:34 ◼   ► institutionally for 30 years is they've

00:07:37 ◼   ► done a great job at moving legacy

00:07:40 ◼   ► platforms forward and and moving people

00:07:44 ◼   ► with them so like their transition from

00:07:47 ◼   ► that command line das PC era to the

00:07:51 ◼   ► graphical computing era was it was ugly

00:07:56 ◼   ► and it right involved a bunch of lurches

00:07:58 ◼   ► but they did move the existing

00:08:01 ◼   ► market-leading daus user base to windows

00:08:05 ◼   ► yet slowly but surely over a couple of

00:08:08 ◼   ► releases yep but I think in and doesn't

00:08:11 ◼   ► matter big or small big meaning like

00:08:13 ◼   ► Microsoft Windows you know the biggest

00:08:15 ◼   ► platform in the history of computing or

00:08:18 ◼   ► small something like well I've been

00:08:22 ◼   ► thinking about this a lot is with

00:08:23 ◼   ► panik's new version of coded for the mac

00:08:27 ◼   ► is that where you start with something

00:08:30 ◼   ► in a design forever effects it going

00:08:34 ◼   ► forward and what I mean by that with

00:08:36 ◼   ► koda is koda is designed its for anybody

00:08:39 ◼   ► is no it's like a one window web

00:08:42 ◼   ► development app you can edit HTML you

00:08:45 ◼   ► can edit PHP and other scripting

00:08:48 ◼   ► languages

00:08:49 ◼   ► it as a whole bunch of stuff to make CSS

00:08:51 ◼   ► editing easier it has documentation for

00:08:55 ◼   ► all sorts of web development

00:08:57 ◼   ► technologies like HTML CSS preview

00:09:00 ◼   ► windows and remote connection stuff

00:09:03 ◼   ► which panic specializes in because they

00:09:05 ◼   ► make transmit this great ftps FTP File

00:09:10 ◼   ► Transfer things interact but the main

00:09:11 ◼   ► thing is that it's the main conceit of

00:09:14 ◼   ► coda ever since it came out five years

00:09:16 ◼   ► ago is that it all in one window vs more

00:09:21 ◼   ► traditional apps like say bbedit or even

00:09:24 ◼   ► textmate where it's sort of each text

00:09:28 ◼   ► file is in a window and even in text me

00:09:31 ◼   ► where that it's more little bit more tab

00:09:33 ◼   ► oriented than bbedit it still is a

00:09:35 ◼   ► different paradigm and I think it's

00:09:38 ◼   ► harder for an app like BBM edit to to

00:09:40 ◼   ► move towards something like a one window

00:09:42 ◼   ► development and it would be hard for

00:09:45 ◼   ► Panik to take kota and say well hey some

00:09:49 ◼   ► people want stuff in a whole bunch of

00:09:51 ◼   ► windows

00:09:52 ◼   ► how can we add how can we make an update

00:09:54 ◼   ► Dakota or you can have everything in a

00:09:56 ◼   ► different window like you start with

00:09:57 ◼   ► this design and you're kind of stuck

00:09:59 ◼   ► with and what Apple is done and i think

00:10:03 ◼   ► i think it to me it just clicks and it

00:10:05 ◼   ► makes sense is that they said look

00:10:07 ◼   ► there's a new way to do all this stuff

00:10:08 ◼   ► so we're going to start with a new

00:10:10 ◼   ► platform we're going to sell this thing

00:10:12 ◼   ► this ipad that is like a computer it's

00:10:14 ◼   ► like a laptop more or less but we're not

00:10:17 ◼   ► going to run Mac os10 on it at all

00:10:20 ◼   ► we're not going to use the name

00:10:21 ◼   ► something look like it's going to be all

00:10:24 ◼   ► started over from scratch and it's going

00:10:26 ◼   ► to have all these restrictions and all

00:10:27 ◼   ► these limitations that you're not used

00:10:29 ◼   ► to but because we're starting over it

00:10:32 ◼   ► doesn't feel like we're breaking

00:10:33 ◼   ► anything it's all new ground yeah

00:10:36 ◼   ► whereas with windows 8 I really feel

00:10:38 ◼   ► like as they get closer and closer

00:10:40 ◼   ► people are really running into this but

00:10:42 ◼   ► wait a minute you're going to break all

00:10:43 ◼   ► of this stuff that I'm used to

00:10:45 ◼   ► yeah and that and what's funny the most

00:10:48 ◼   ► funny thing about that is that the way

00:10:49 ◼   ► that they set it up you know what's this

00:10:51 ◼   ► Steven Sinofsky the guys that you know

00:10:53 ◼   ► in charge windows he keeps hurting these

00:10:55 ◼   ► epically long post on the windows blogs

00:10:58 ◼   ► but you know he set up whenever it was

00:11:00 ◼   ► several months ago now that Windows 8 is

00:11:03 ◼   ► all

00:11:03 ◼   ► but no compromises but i think it's like

00:11:06 ◼   ► you can view it both ways either they're

00:11:08 ◼   ► not compromising in that they're there

00:11:10 ◼   ► including everything that everyone could

00:11:13 ◼   ► ever want and is that in it in and of

00:11:15 ◼   ► itself a compromise because they're not

00:11:17 ◼   ► actually giving the best user experience

00:11:18 ◼   ► they're just throwing kinda everything

00:11:20 ◼   ► in there and hoping it all works

00:11:22 ◼   ► together and you know so far the early

00:11:25 ◼   ► reviews of the it was at the release

00:11:28 ◼   ► candidate or whatever just that just

00:11:30 ◼   ► came out have been you know they say

00:11:31 ◼   ► good things in general but switching

00:11:34 ◼   ► between those two different interfaces

00:11:36 ◼   ► is very jarring and and it's going to

00:11:38 ◼   ► confuse the hell out of people right and

00:11:41 ◼   ► the out that I see is with winrt which

00:11:44 ◼   ► is the goofily name right the armed

00:11:46 ◼   ► version

00:11:47 ◼   ► yeah which isn't going to isn't going to

00:11:49 ◼   ► start and we know what r T stands for is

00:11:51 ◼   ► a real time with runtime what is it

00:11:54 ◼   ► we know you know I don't know I think

00:11:57 ◼   ► maybe run time but it's an awful name

00:11:59 ◼   ► that really is yeah yeah but that's the

00:12:02 ◼   ► one we're not going to have the legacy

00:12:04 ◼   ► support they've got right maps in there

00:12:06 ◼   ► like the built-in office apps which

00:12:08 ◼   ► don't really look like metro they look a

00:12:10 ◼   ► little bit more like traditional Windows

00:12:12 ◼   ► but they really are supposedly touch

00:12:14 ◼   ► oriented right and you can't install

00:12:17 ◼   ► traditional windows looking apps on the

00:12:20 ◼   ► getting so there won't be all this weird

00:12:22 ◼   ► context switching yeah and that's that's

00:12:26 ◼   ► great and I you know I know again I know

00:12:29 ◼   ► why they couldn't do that overall just

00:12:33 ◼   ► the sheer numbers that they be leaving

00:12:34 ◼   ► behind and and and risk alienating

00:12:36 ◼   ► completely but you know maybe maybe that

00:12:39 ◼   ► version does better because it's uh it's

00:12:42 ◼   ► kind of fresh and from the ground up but

00:12:44 ◼   ► I don't know but then then it's like

00:12:47 ◼   ► when you go to a store and you want to

00:12:48 ◼   ► buy some kind of Windows machine do you

00:12:50 ◼   ► buy the windows RT one with the armed

00:12:53 ◼   ► ship to you by a similar-looking tablet

00:12:56 ◼   ► device but has an intel chip and so it

00:12:58 ◼   ► runs you know whatever the other flavor

00:13:00 ◼   ► of Windows 8 is that's called it runs on

00:13:02 ◼   ► the the old architecture

00:13:04 ◼   ► it's like I don't know that seems like

00:13:06 ◼   ► just a branding nightmare and a a

00:13:08 ◼   ► consumer nightmare waiting to happen

00:13:11 ◼   ► it really does to me because it seemed

00:13:13 ◼   ► as if it it really doesn't seem

00:13:14 ◼   ► confusing to me if it

00:13:16 ◼   ► typical person just regular non nerve

00:13:18 ◼   ► walks into an apple store that the

00:13:20 ◼   ► difference between a mac and the ipad is

00:13:22 ◼   ► very very different different names

00:13:24 ◼   ► right different interface it it's all

00:13:28 ◼   ► touch

00:13:29 ◼   ► it's just a piece of glass this is super

00:13:30 ◼   ► simple this is the thing I've heard

00:13:32 ◼   ► about and here's the mac which is I

00:13:36 ◼   ► understand even if you never use the mac

00:13:38 ◼   ► surely you've used windows this is

00:13:40 ◼   ► apple's thing that's like a regular pc

00:13:42 ◼   ► with keyboard and windows and the mouse

00:13:44 ◼   ► that you dragged around there's no

00:13:47 ◼   ► confusion nobody's walking out with the

00:13:49 ◼   ► wrong thing whereas I really really

00:13:51 ◼   ► don't understand exactly what you said

00:13:53 ◼   ► is if you go into a store and they have

00:13:56 ◼   ► intel-based windows 8 tablets running

00:13:59 ◼   ► the full version of Windows 8 and arm

00:14:02 ◼   ► tablets that are running when Artie I

00:14:04 ◼   ► really really don't understand how

00:14:05 ◼   ► anybody except true nerds is going to

00:14:10 ◼   ► understand what what the heck the

00:14:11 ◼   ► differences in which one you might want

00:14:13 ◼   ► to buy right and so then Microsoft has

00:14:15 ◼   ► to hope you know that they can open

00:14:17 ◼   ► about a 10,000 more uh windows stores

00:14:20 ◼   ► and they can have their own people

00:14:22 ◼   ► explaining this or the reality of the

00:14:24 ◼   ► situation is that everyone's going to

00:14:25 ◼   ► walk into bestbuy or go on Amazon uh you

00:14:29 ◼   ► know best buy will be people who hit you

00:14:31 ◼   ► know does the the employees working on

00:14:33 ◼   ► Commission who have absolutely no idea

00:14:34 ◼   ► what the difference will be and you know

00:14:37 ◼   ► they just try and sell the most

00:14:38 ◼   ► expensive one and then amazon you know

00:14:41 ◼   ► you're left to fend for yourself and

00:14:43 ◼   ► it's their guy I'm sure they're going to

00:14:44 ◼   ► have you know the typical microsoft

00:14:47 ◼   ► charts to show you know which is which

00:14:50 ◼   ► feature doesn't have which version

00:14:52 ◼   ► doesn't have this feature in which one

00:14:53 ◼   ► doesn't this feature and it's just going

00:14:56 ◼   ► to be heat such such a nightmare i do I

00:14:59 ◼   ► you know it's just like God they should

00:15:00 ◼   ► have just done windows RT the awful name

00:15:04 ◼   ► and everything and just done the tablets

00:15:06 ◼   ► that way and then had a more traditional

00:15:08 ◼   ► version of windows and just kept it

00:15:10 ◼   ► going and and you know hope and and see

00:15:12 ◼   ► what happens that if people move more in

00:15:14 ◼   ► the tablet space which is you know what

00:15:16 ◼   ► of course is happening with Apple where

00:15:18 ◼   ► they can have the two separate tracks

00:15:19 ◼   ► and and there by natural selection kind

00:15:22 ◼   ► of people are are choosing to go with

00:15:24 ◼   ► the ipad more than they have with the

00:15:26 ◼   ► with the mac and so they're just letting

00:15:28 ◼   ► it play out in a natural

00:15:29 ◼   ► way rather than trying to cram things

00:15:30 ◼   ► together right so that you know Apple

00:15:33 ◼   ► calls it back to the mac where they take

00:15:34 ◼   ► these iOS ideas and right put them on

00:15:38 ◼   ► the Mac you know and another example of

00:15:41 ◼   ► what i said before about how where you

00:15:43 ◼   ► start really affects what you can do in

00:15:45 ◼   ► the future going forward I i still think

00:15:47 ◼   ► that full screen mode on Mac os10 is

00:15:50 ◼   ► weird and i just i use it sometimes but

00:15:53 ◼   ► I don't use it nearly as much as I

00:15:54 ◼   ► thought I would when they announced it

00:15:56 ◼   ► and it's because yummy the whole system

00:15:58 ◼   ► is designed on this idea that you're

00:16:02 ◼   ► using these windows on one screen not

00:16:04 ◼   ► full screen apps that

00:16:06 ◼   ► yeah and i totally normal no way to

00:16:09 ◼   ► square that circle smoothly i think it's

00:16:12 ◼   ► you know I use it it seems to be good

00:16:14 ◼   ► for certain things where you need a lot

00:16:16 ◼   ► of screen real estate like I photos a

00:16:18 ◼   ► good example of something that I like

00:16:19 ◼   ► like to use it for and they do some

00:16:22 ◼   ► interesting things that they don't play

00:16:23 ◼   ► up enough because you know who the dual

00:16:25 ◼   ► monitor situation isn't really i guess

00:16:28 ◼   ► probably been a mainstream thing that

00:16:30 ◼   ► you know they they actually do it

00:16:31 ◼   ► smartly where you can do other things

00:16:32 ◼   ► and even though it's a great out area or

00:16:34 ◼   ► whatever you don't make it obvious that

00:16:36 ◼   ► you can do it but you can kinda drag

00:16:38 ◼   ► things over there and and work in that

00:16:40 ◼   ► space as well when you have things full

00:16:42 ◼   ► screen but other other apps don't do

00:16:44 ◼   ► that at all and so it's just kind of

00:16:45 ◼   ► like a wasted space into a monitor thing

00:16:47 ◼   ► I think on the the bigger monitor in

00:16:48 ◼   ► general like that you know the the full

00:16:51 ◼   ► screen apps is often just overkill on a

00:16:53 ◼   ► 911 meant an 11-inch macbook air it

00:16:57 ◼   ► could be nice just because that screen

00:16:58 ◼   ► is small but yeah it's really hard that

00:17:01 ◼   ► design problem as opposed to on the ipad

00:17:05 ◼   ► where it just feels utterly natural it

00:17:07 ◼   ► feels like it's just write that

00:17:09 ◼   ► everything is full screen and I think

00:17:10 ◼   ► you know on the other hand it would be

00:17:12 ◼   ► really hard to add multi-application

00:17:14 ◼   ► windows to the iPad because it has

00:17:17 ◼   ► doesn't the whole thing it just wouldn't

00:17:19 ◼   ► would feel weird and that's that's sort

00:17:21 ◼   ► of interesting because it's actually i

00:17:23 ◼   ► don't know if you've had a chance to

00:17:24 ◼   ► play at all i assume not because they

00:17:26 ◼   ► just started coming out with them but

00:17:28 ◼   ► the new version of Chrome OS so they

00:17:30 ◼   ► sent me one of the one of the new

00:17:31 ◼   ► Chromebooks you know to try out right

00:17:33 ◼   ► and the new version of Chrome OS is is

00:17:36 ◼   ► pretty different from the previous

00:17:37 ◼   ► iterations of it I assume you played

00:17:39 ◼   ► with like some iteration yeah we better

00:17:41 ◼   ► see anything

00:17:42 ◼   ► and so the new version is much more

00:17:45 ◼   ► windows or answered then you know the

00:17:47 ◼   ► old version was basically just pretty

00:17:49 ◼   ► much a full screen browser at all times

00:17:51 ◼   ► and it was you know if you could switch

00:17:54 ◼   ► between windows but it would almost be

00:17:55 ◼   ► like like now when i was ten when you

00:17:58 ◼   ► switch when you're doing a full screen

00:17:59 ◼   ► apps and it was kind of weird and now

00:18:02 ◼   ► they're moving back to the window idea

00:18:04 ◼   ► you can have a different there so

00:18:06 ◼   ► browser windows but you can have

00:18:07 ◼   ► different sizes open at the same time

00:18:10 ◼   ► and kind of switch between them and it's

00:18:12 ◼   ► it's fascinating that they are moving

00:18:14 ◼   ► back to that thing and i get i know why

00:18:17 ◼   ► they're doing it because they're trying

00:18:18 ◼   ► to go after the the windows market

00:18:20 ◼   ► itself and no one had any idea how to do

00:18:22 ◼   ► this but uh I don't know if that will

00:18:23 ◼   ► end up working for them or not I think

00:18:25 ◼   ► it's a good idea to try it because no

00:18:26 ◼   ► one was buying chrome OS as it stood so

00:18:29 ◼   ► maybe this is a good idea for them to do

00:18:31 ◼   ► it but they're going in the opposite way

00:18:33 ◼   ► right you know in the bottom line for

00:18:36 ◼   ► the mac users i think with this back to

00:18:38 ◼   ► the mac thing is that it none of it's

00:18:41 ◼   ► really broken their old habits where I

00:18:44 ◼   ► got windows 8 really seems like it's

00:18:46 ◼   ► going to break some habits 01 just

00:18:47 ◼   ► notable example big big glaring

00:18:49 ◼   ► fundamental difference between the mac

00:18:51 ◼   ► and iOS is you just turn your machine on

00:18:55 ◼   ► you've got nothing open you haven't used

00:18:57 ◼   ► any apps

00:18:58 ◼   ► what do you see on the Mac you see a

00:19:00 ◼   ► desktop where you can save files and put

00:19:03 ◼   ► folders and just puts right there and

00:19:05 ◼   ► that's where you know Mac users famously

00:19:07 ◼   ► and I have messy desktops full of files

00:19:09 ◼   ► and folders and shortcuts and you know

00:19:12 ◼   ► whatever they're working on at the

00:19:13 ◼   ► moment and on iOS it's this home screen

00:19:16 ◼   ► you still have a background you have the

00:19:17 ◼   ► desktop picture but it's that's where

00:19:19 ◼   ► your apps are right and Apple added this

00:19:21 ◼   ► back to the mac thing called launch pad

00:19:24 ◼   ► in 10 7 which is sort of like the iOS

00:19:28 ◼   ► launch screen for the mac you all you

00:19:30 ◼   ► see your apps that should be in theory

00:19:36 ◼   ► if they start over from scratch with the

00:19:38 ◼   ► mac today that would be your desktop

00:19:40 ◼   ► launchpad would be your desktop wouldn't

00:19:42 ◼   ► be an app that you launch or mode you

00:19:44 ◼   ► jump to it would just be that would be

00:19:46 ◼   ► your desktop and I think it would be a

00:19:49 ◼   ► lot easier for most users especially

00:19:51 ◼   ► people just come into the mac for the

00:19:52 ◼   ► first time but I don't you think they

00:19:54 ◼   ► can do it because too many people say

00:19:56 ◼   ► files to the desktop and if they

00:19:57 ◼   ► couldn't save file to the desktop they

00:19:58 ◼   ► would go insane

00:19:59 ◼   ► yeah it totally great do you do you end

00:20:02 ◼   ► up using launchpad a lot I you know I

00:20:04 ◼   ► found it first that i didn't use it and

00:20:05 ◼   ► now now I just use it because that's the

00:20:07 ◼   ► way that mac app store apps kinda you

00:20:09 ◼   ► know the easiest way to find them it's

00:20:11 ◼   ► like they're the you know the latest

00:20:13 ◼   ► happens is the one that's that's right

00:20:14 ◼   ► there in that view

00:20:15 ◼   ► do you use it I use it a little bit on

00:20:18 ◼   ► my air which is my secondary machine and

00:20:21 ◼   ► I don't have all the apps that i have

00:20:22 ◼   ► installed yet and so it's a lot cleaner

00:20:25 ◼   ► i only have like two screens of apps on

00:20:26 ◼   ► the air right right on my main desktop

00:20:29 ◼   ► Mac know because it's like I've got like

00:20:32 ◼   ► 40 pages of apps and it's there's no way

00:20:35 ◼   ► to find anything and I really love and I

00:20:37 ◼   ► use launch bar and it's I by the time I

00:20:40 ◼   ► even think about opening launchpad

00:20:42 ◼   ► I've already done the command space and

00:20:43 ◼   ► type a few characters of the name of the

00:20:45 ◼   ► app and the captain

00:20:47 ◼   ► yep it's interesting to that chrome OS

00:20:50 ◼   ► that you know going back to that for a

00:20:51 ◼   ► second they also copy that that as well

00:20:53 ◼   ► they have like a launchpad like

00:20:55 ◼   ► functionality now that's kind of one of

00:20:58 ◼   ► the main features to launch their web

00:21:00 ◼   ► apps instead of you know native apps but

00:21:02 ◼   ► ah it's something they copied a little

00:21:04 ◼   ► bit from windows and copied a little bit

00:21:05 ◼   ► from OS 10

00:21:07 ◼   ► ah so it's it's certain music and the

00:21:12 ◼   ► other thing I i'm sort of jumping around

00:21:15 ◼   ► topics here but I want to go back to the

00:21:16 ◼   ► I want to go back to this six-month

00:21:21 ◼   ► prediction about app development on

00:21:23 ◼   ► Android and that Eric Schmidt's

00:21:25 ◼   ► prediction that which I think he meant

00:21:27 ◼   ► that's the thing is that i think he

00:21:28 ◼   ► believed it

00:21:29 ◼   ► yeah totally and your piece on

00:21:32 ◼   ► techcrunch today celebrating android

00:21:34 ◼   ► first day the six-month anniversary you

00:21:37 ◼   ► you specifically mentioned his that the

00:21:41 ◼   ► explanation for why he thought things

00:21:43 ◼   ► were going to change in the next six

00:21:45 ◼   ► months was ice cream sandwich right

00:21:47 ◼   ► which i completely agree is by far and

00:21:49 ◼   ► away the best version of Android ever

00:21:51 ◼   ► it's it's a huge difference and I've

00:21:53 ◼   ► said this before but it to me it's proof

00:21:55 ◼   ► that Matias Duarte I think I'm saying

00:21:58 ◼   ► his name right right is is very talented

00:22:02 ◼   ► I i think that's the one where his his

00:22:05 ◼   ► design sense is sort of been imposed on

00:22:07 ◼   ► Android as a whole and if you use a

00:22:09 ◼   ► nexus

00:22:09 ◼   ► phone it's it's coherent system wide

00:22:12 ◼   ► it's it's very nice you had a good

00:22:13 ◼   ► review of the the new Nexus that runs it

00:22:16 ◼   ► right on and it i think it's a better

00:22:19 ◼   ► system for developers have gotten rid of

00:22:20 ◼   ► these soft buttons if you get a new

00:22:22 ◼   ► phone so that you can have the whole

00:22:24 ◼   ► screen on and so his body his argument

00:22:28 ◼   ► was look ice cream sandwiches great

00:22:30 ◼   ► we're gonna you know that's really

00:22:31 ◼   ► what's going to drive people to to write

00:22:34 ◼   ► for air android first and yet here's the

00:22:37 ◼   ► thing

00:22:38 ◼   ► it's seven months after ice cream

00:22:39 ◼   ► sandwich came out and what's the

00:22:40 ◼   ► percentage of android phones that are

00:22:42 ◼   ► running scripts sandwich set 7.1 percent

00:22:46 ◼   ► according to google themselves you know

00:22:47 ◼   ► there they publish those numbers it's

00:22:49 ◼   ► it's hilarious that you know it's just

00:22:51 ◼   ► pathetic there's no other way to say it

00:22:53 ◼   ► it's a it's so ridiculously seven whip

00:22:56 ◼   ► 7.1 percent of android users are using

00:23:01 ◼   ► what you know everyone from eric schmidt

00:23:03 ◼   ► on down considers to be the best version

00:23:05 ◼   ► of Android and there's nothing anyone

00:23:07 ◼   ► can do about it right and he said

00:23:10 ◼   ► specifically at this event we made this

00:23:11 ◼   ► prediction we're making fun of his quote

00:23:13 ◼   ► was with the ice cream sandwich release

00:23:15 ◼   ► our core objective as a company is to

00:23:18 ◼   ► get all of the hardware vendors onto

00:23:20 ◼   ► that platform and I honestly I and i

00:23:23 ◼   ► don't mean this and i really don't mean

00:23:25 ◼   ► it to be making fun of them

00:23:27 ◼   ► I I I think it just shows how Android as

00:23:31 ◼   ► a whole has sort of spun out of their

00:23:33 ◼   ► control

00:23:34 ◼   ► yes as it as a concept it's it's become

00:23:37 ◼   ► something that is obviously they're

00:23:39 ◼   ► still driving that the development of

00:23:41 ◼   ► the new releases but what how it's

00:23:43 ◼   ► actually being used in the real world is

00:23:45 ◼   ► has completely they've lost control of

00:23:48 ◼   ► it right and you talked to people at

00:23:50 ◼   ► Google I've had this discussion so many

00:23:53 ◼   ► times in the past two to three years now

00:23:56 ◼   ► where it's like they always and they you

00:23:59 ◼   ► know they seem to legitimately believed

00:24:02 ◼   ► that that's about to change and I don't

00:24:04 ◼   ► know why they think that I mean that was

00:24:05 ◼   ► part of the reason why you know I before

00:24:08 ◼   ► the post you know making fun of the

00:24:10 ◼   ► six-month claim you know I Provost six

00:24:13 ◼   ► months ago pointing out june six you

00:24:15 ◼   ► know as the day and just saying like you

00:24:18 ◼   ► know we'll revisit it at that time and

00:24:20 ◼   ► you know I just flat-out said like

00:24:22 ◼   ► there's no way this is going to have

00:24:23 ◼   ► and I laid out i think like five or six

00:24:24 ◼   ► reasons why there was no way that that

00:24:27 ◼   ► android development would actually

00:24:28 ◼   ► surpassed iOS development and you know

00:24:32 ◼   ► one of the reasons of of course and the

00:24:34 ◼   ► thing that were you know talking about

00:24:36 ◼   ► right now is that Google cannot get the

00:24:38 ◼   ► OEMs and ore carriers to actually get in

00:24:42 ◼   ► line with doing these the way that doing

00:24:44 ◼   ► these updates the way that that Apple

00:24:46 ◼   ► can with with their partners

00:24:49 ◼   ► yeah i think and i think that there's a

00:24:51 ◼   ► a it's like an institutional confidence

00:24:54 ◼   ► and maybe it serves them well overall

00:24:56 ◼   ► but that there's a sense of where Google

00:24:59 ◼   ► we're doing cool stuff and so of course

00:25:02 ◼   ► people are gonna get on board with what

00:25:04 ◼   ► we want them to get on board with

00:25:05 ◼   ► because of google yeah and then it's I i

00:25:09 ◼   ► actually i think i wrote a post about a

00:25:11 ◼   ► year ago or something that kind of like

00:25:13 ◼   ► they were living in a dream world and of

00:25:14 ◼   ► course that that put everyone on google

00:25:16 ◼   ► side of things in a tizzy because you

00:25:18 ◼   ► know pointing out not only that Android

00:25:20 ◼   ► a with the carrier and OEM relationships

00:25:22 ◼   ► isn't going as a as swimmingly as they

00:25:25 ◼   ► had hope but also the google TV thing

00:25:27 ◼   ► it's like they really thought that they

00:25:28 ◼   ► were going to revolutionize the TV

00:25:30 ◼   ► experience made you know they had all

00:25:32 ◼   ► the executives that they needed to have

00:25:33 ◼   ► I think was was atlanta two years ago at

00:25:36 ◼   ► Google i/o I think they had like Howard

00:25:37 ◼   ► Stringer up there and they had everyone

00:25:40 ◼   ► and it was and it was you know sounding

00:25:42 ◼   ► like it was going to be great and then

00:25:43 ◼   ► everything just fell apart within like

00:25:45 ◼   ► two months of that happening and is the

00:25:47 ◼   ► same exact thing with the with google

00:25:49 ◼   ► music which is probably the best well i

00:25:52 ◼   ► would say Google Wallet might be the the

00:25:54 ◼   ► biggest chaos situations they've ever

00:25:56 ◼   ► had but google music is certainly one of

00:25:58 ◼   ► them because it was two years ago almost

00:26:00 ◼   ► exactly at i/o that they first announced

00:26:02 ◼   ► you know what would look to be a full on

00:26:04 ◼   ► itunes competitor of course they

00:26:06 ◼   ► pre-announced it and no one knew for

00:26:08 ◼   ► sure when it was going to come out and

00:26:09 ◼   ► then hit took them several months of

00:26:12 ◼   ► negotiating and it didn't actually

00:26:14 ◼   ► launch until just about a year later and

00:26:16 ◼   ► even today two years after they

00:26:18 ◼   ► announced that they still don't have

00:26:20 ◼   ► warner brothers on board

00:26:21 ◼   ► I mean they still do not have one of the

00:26:24 ◼   ► major labels on their big music service

00:26:27 ◼   ► that was going to revolutionize you know

00:26:28 ◼   ► music purchasing and how on earth do

00:26:31 ◼   ► they not have at least twenty-five

00:26:34 ◼   ► percent if not more

00:26:35 ◼   ► Warners you know arguably the

00:26:36 ◼   ► it's important to have on board they

00:26:38 ◼   ► don't have them on board and they know

00:26:40 ◼   ► you just you know they just thought that

00:26:41 ◼   ► they could get it you know would be

00:26:42 ◼   ► super easy and two years later

00:26:44 ◼   ► nothing and it's not going to happen

00:26:45 ◼   ► right i think that the group and add

00:26:47 ◼   ► some steps when it comes to dealing with

00:26:49 ◼   ► the rest of the industry that they

00:26:51 ◼   ► implement instead of thinking like a

00:26:53 ◼   ► chess player and having this look if we

00:26:55 ◼   ► do this then this then this this is

00:26:58 ◼   ► where we'll be

00:26:59 ◼   ► you know and have this strategy that it

00:27:01 ◼   ► with no gaps from here to there they

00:27:03 ◼   ► have this we have the that famous South

00:27:06 ◼   ► Park analogy where there's this step 2

00:27:08 ◼   ► dot figure 3c is it alright let me let

00:27:14 ◼   ► me hit the money button here and and do

00:27:16 ◼   ► the first sponsor sure I want to thank

00:27:18 ◼   ► brand new company it's a new app from a

00:27:22 ◼   ► new company company is nice mohawk and

00:27:26 ◼   ► they have a brand new app called Ida ITA

00:27:29 ◼   ► think of it like it i think it's a Latin

00:27:31 ◼   ► were plural for items a brand-new

00:27:34 ◼   ► list-making app for the iphone and ipad

00:27:39 ◼   ► and it's designed to make it fast and

00:27:40 ◼   ► simple to collect and organize

00:27:42 ◼   ► information i love the look at this app

00:27:44 ◼   ► this app think of it as sort of almost

00:27:47 ◼   ► like a field notes aesthetic like a

00:27:49 ◼   ► brown paper with one of my favorite font

00:27:52 ◼   ► future all over the place sort of the

00:27:54 ◼   ► classic timeless fifties sixties look

00:27:58 ◼   ► typographically looks like stationary

00:28:00 ◼   ► beautiful ab and you just make lists

00:28:06 ◼   ► it's not like a to-do system it's just

00:28:10 ◼   ► less you make lists across items off

00:28:12 ◼   ► couldn't be simpler and it syncs across

00:28:15 ◼   ► iCloud so you can use it on more than

00:28:17 ◼   ► one device and seamless sinking through

00:28:20 ◼   ► iCloud universal app one app for both

00:28:24 ◼   ► the iphone ipad and it's fully

00:28:27 ◼   ► accessible using voiceover it is on sale

00:28:30 ◼   ► right now for ninety-nine cents through

00:28:33 ◼   ► june fifteenth one buck for the first

00:28:37 ◼   ► list app that's actually better than a

00:28:38 ◼   ► piece of paper

00:28:39 ◼   ► Ida ITA from nice mohawk great app you

00:28:46 ◼   ► doing

00:28:47 ◼   ► do when you find out that there's a cool

00:28:48 ◼   ► app from 99 cents i just buy it

00:28:50 ◼   ► yeah there's no question i mean who

00:28:52 ◼   ► cares 99 dance where years into this

00:28:55 ◼   ► whole app store thing where there's this

00:28:57 ◼   ► whole discussion where indie developers

00:28:59 ◼   ► had gone from selling at least on the

00:29:01 ◼   ► mac it was very standard just you know

00:29:03 ◼   ► indie developers the low-end was always

00:29:05 ◼   ► around 15 bucks

00:29:07 ◼   ► I mean it seemed like nobody could

00:29:08 ◼   ► really make a living selling software

00:29:09 ◼   ► for less than 15 and most apps were

00:29:12 ◼   ► usually started like 20 bucks you know

00:29:14 ◼   ► 1999 yeah and the whole 99-cent thing

00:29:17 ◼   ► really had people thinking is anybody

00:29:18 ◼   ► going to be able to make a living

00:29:19 ◼   ► selling these apps and it's you know it

00:29:22 ◼   ► seems like definitely some are I mean

00:29:23 ◼   ► whether 99 senses the right price for

00:29:25 ◼   ► 199 and 299 but i'll tell you what for

00:29:27 ◼   ► ninety-nine cents i just do it

00:29:29 ◼   ► I just buy it um yeah i mean it's it's a

00:29:33 ◼   ► no-brainer the only thing I actually

00:29:34 ◼   ► think about now is that god I have so

00:29:35 ◼   ► many apps and it's just going to get

00:29:37 ◼   ► lost in the shuffle and you know will i

00:29:39 ◼   ► buy it one night and then forget about

00:29:41 ◼   ► it the next day and so a you know that's

00:29:43 ◼   ► the only thing I think about it's not

00:29:44 ◼   ► the the price thing it's almost just

00:29:46 ◼   ► just you know a non equation because it

00:29:49 ◼   ► is so cheap and so easy to download now

00:29:52 ◼   ► I'm kind of interested to see how with

00:29:54 ◼   ► you know some mountain lion presumably I

00:29:58 ◼   ► i guess that they'll have the gold

00:29:59 ◼   ► master version at WWDC next week

00:30:03 ◼   ► you know we've both been trying it out

00:30:05 ◼   ► for a bit the developer preview of it

00:30:06 ◼   ► seems pretty solid to me i don't know if

00:30:08 ◼   ► you've had any problems with it

00:30:10 ◼   ► I the only thing I really noticed that

00:30:12 ◼   ► kind of annoys me is the slow shutdown

00:30:15 ◼   ► speed and that's like I don't really

00:30:17 ◼   ► know what that's about I don't know if

00:30:18 ◼   ► you've noticed that at all but uh

00:30:19 ◼   ► there's and shut down

00:30:21 ◼   ► ok so I you know I try and shut down i

00:30:23 ◼   ► don't know why but I should tell them

00:30:25 ◼   ► about what it once a night pretty much

00:30:27 ◼   ► and then start anew in the in the

00:30:29 ◼   ► morning but that's only thing I've

00:30:31 ◼   ► noticed about it seems our salad but I'm

00:30:33 ◼   ► sort of interested to see how the mac

00:30:35 ◼   ► app store plays along with with mountain

00:30:38 ◼   ► line now given the stuff that they're

00:30:40 ◼   ► doing with with what's what's it called

00:30:43 ◼   ► out of the Volt thing i'll file on and

00:30:48 ◼   ► I'm sorry gatekeeper I know yeah you

00:30:53 ◼   ► know how is that are people actually

00:30:55 ◼   ► going to do the default setting for it

00:30:58 ◼   ► right is going to be that people have to

00:31:00 ◼   ► be

00:31:00 ◼   ► yeah certified by this app certification

00:31:03 ◼   ► thing and are people actually going to

00:31:06 ◼   ► get around to doing that our developers

00:31:07 ◼   ► going to do that and if they do that is

00:31:09 ◼   ► there more incentive now to sell their

00:31:11 ◼   ► stuff as as a registered developer over

00:31:15 ◼   ► the web versus the mac app store i don't

00:31:17 ◼   ► know if it's the if it's apple playing

00:31:18 ◼   ► against itself is you know trying to

00:31:20 ◼   ► trying to push the mac app store a

00:31:22 ◼   ► little bit less than making it easier

00:31:23 ◼   ► for people to do the web or if it's a

00:31:26 ◼   ► kind of vice versatile just exploded

00:31:28 ◼   ► interest in in mac apps in general i

00:31:32 ◼   ► wonder i do think and I believe this and

00:31:35 ◼   ► you know this could be one of those

00:31:36 ◼   ► things where I'm 23 years from now I'm

00:31:38 ◼   ► shown to be wrong but I do believe that

00:31:41 ◼   ► Apple sees that as long as there's a mac

00:31:44 ◼   ► that you'll be able to install software

00:31:47 ◼   ► from anywhere it will not be app store

00:31:49 ◼   ► only

00:31:50 ◼   ► yep right which is a big fear for a lot

00:31:52 ◼   ► of mac users is that there's gonna you

00:31:53 ◼   ► know obviously not going to 10 8 but

00:31:55 ◼   ► maybe ten nine or whatever

00:31:57 ◼   ► sometimes a year from now two years now

00:31:59 ◼   ► they're going to say hey there's a great

00:32:00 ◼   ► new feature for security

00:32:02 ◼   ► you can only install software from the

00:32:03 ◼   ► mac app store I'm i don't think they're

00:32:06 ◼   ► going to do that i really don't and I

00:32:08 ◼   ► really think that gatekeeper is not a

00:32:10 ◼   ► step towards that I think gatekeeper is

00:32:13 ◼   ► a way of bringing some of the peace of

00:32:16 ◼   ► mind of right the App Store to download

00:32:22 ◼   ► it from anywhere apps right he's not

00:32:24 ◼   ► going to start

00:32:25 ◼   ► yeah yeah go ahead well how how

00:32:29 ◼   ► restrictive are they going to be as they

00:32:31 ◼   ► really only going to because the thing

00:32:33 ◼   ► is is that you get this developer

00:32:34 ◼   ► certificate that signs your apps and

00:32:38 ◼   ► apple can revoke so if you've used it

00:32:41 ◼   ► for something that seemed to be malware

00:32:43 ◼   ► people have got it apple can revoke that

00:32:45 ◼   ► certificate remotely and then

00:32:47 ◼   ► yep that all those apps just stopped

00:32:49 ◼   ► working where they only going to what

00:32:55 ◼   ► are they going to use that for they

00:32:56 ◼   ► really are going to use it for things

00:32:57 ◼   ► that everybody agrees our malware or

00:33:00 ◼   ► like what about like this situation with

00:33:02 ◼   ► the rogue amoeba airfoil touch

00:33:04 ◼   ► yes it's interesting right right right

00:33:06 ◼   ► so let me see if I can summarize this

00:33:08 ◼   ► quickly but Rogan me by

00:33:10 ◼   ► as this app for the iphone called

00:33:15 ◼   ► airfoil speakers touch and you can use

00:33:17 ◼   ► it to it's like a airplay remember

00:33:23 ◼   ► fireplace without it and they added a

00:33:26 ◼   ► new feature as I can night so you can

00:33:28 ◼   ► play for you know music from airfoil on

00:33:30 ◼   ► your Mac or PC to your to your iOS

00:33:32 ◼   ► devices and it's great works works

00:33:34 ◼   ► amazingly well they added a new feature

00:33:36 ◼   ► in the latest version like six weeks ago

00:33:38 ◼   ► that lets you set your iOS device as a

00:33:43 ◼   ► destination for airplay from itunes so

00:33:46 ◼   ► you can play music from itunes and have

00:33:48 ◼   ► it sent there just looks just like when

00:33:50 ◼   ► your apple TV shows up as a airplay

00:33:52 ◼   ► destination right and the way there is

00:33:54 ◼   ► no supported way to do that the way they

00:33:56 ◼   ► did that is with this technique with you

00:33:58 ◼   ► know I I think I don't even know how it

00:34:00 ◼   ► works but any but there is no supported

00:34:02 ◼   ► way to do it i think they have like a

00:34:03 ◼   ► key that that came out of a an airport

00:34:08 ◼   ► express or something like that the

00:34:11 ◼   ► public key or something like that but

00:34:13 ◼   ► it's not supported and once Apple

00:34:16 ◼   ► figured out that the app got into the

00:34:17 ◼   ► app store but then because that's the

00:34:20 ◼   ► sort of obscure edge case that the

00:34:22 ◼   ► reviewers aren't going to catch and

00:34:23 ◼   ► they're not violating any of the actual

00:34:25 ◼   ► rules of the app store in terms of

00:34:27 ◼   ► private api all they're doing is using a

00:34:30 ◼   ► non-public decryption key to be a air

00:34:34 ◼   ► plate receiver and so apple took it out

00:34:37 ◼   ► of the store until they took that

00:34:38 ◼   ► feature out of the app and resubmitted

00:34:41 ◼   ► it to the store so would they

00:34:43 ◼   ► there's here so here's where i'm going

00:34:44 ◼   ► with that what about if rogue amoeba

00:34:47 ◼   ► ships a mac version that has the same

00:34:50 ◼   ► feature right size not alter the store

00:34:53 ◼   ► it's just sold through the through the

00:34:54 ◼   ► web though right right so directly not

00:34:58 ◼   ► through the mac app store right from the

00:34:59 ◼   ► rogue amoeba website if it's signed by

00:35:01 ◼   ► gatekeeper is that ok because it's not

00:35:03 ◼   ► now where it's doing exactly what it was

00:35:05 ◼   ► billed to do

00:35:06 ◼   ► yeah I may not be happy i would hope

00:35:09 ◼   ► that that what they would do in that

00:35:10 ◼   ► situation is just reach out to the

00:35:13 ◼   ► developer and you know try and talk to

00:35:14 ◼   ► them back channel because it seems like

00:35:16 ◼   ► it's a bit of you know it's going to be

00:35:19 ◼   ► an edge case type situation where they

00:35:21 ◼   ► can probably you know handle that they

00:35:23 ◼   ► have the the man

00:35:24 ◼   ► or to be able to handle that rather than

00:35:25 ◼   ► just kill the app because that will

00:35:27 ◼   ► cause an absolute shit storm if they do

00:35:28 ◼   ► that you have a remotely kill a nap that

00:35:32 ◼   ► was downloaded from the web

00:35:33 ◼   ► you know that's kind of a a barrier i

00:35:36 ◼   ► don't think they want to cross right i

00:35:37 ◼   ► would think that they don't want to

00:35:39 ◼   ► cross that because i really do think

00:35:40 ◼   ► they want developers to get on board

00:35:42 ◼   ► with this they want all the major Mac

00:35:44 ◼   ► developers you know if you're going to

00:35:46 ◼   ► keep selling stuff that's not my app app

00:35:49 ◼   ► store only at least do this and I think

00:35:52 ◼   ► that anything that they could do that

00:35:54 ◼   ► would make developers wary of doing it i

00:35:56 ◼   ► think those shy away from yeah yeah i

00:36:00 ◼   ► think that the only use it for malware

00:36:03 ◼   ► stuff and you know it's it's it's really

00:36:05 ◼   ► genius because it kind of cuts mail

00:36:08 ◼   ► where problems off you know right at the

00:36:10 ◼   ► root of it rather than having to worry

00:36:12 ◼   ► about it after the fact and so it's

00:36:13 ◼   ► smart in that way I i still wonder and I

00:36:17 ◼   ► and I think this is going to play out

00:36:18 ◼   ► pretty interestingly in Mount line

00:36:20 ◼   ► itself because you know they'll have for

00:36:23 ◼   ► the first time all will be mac apps that

00:36:25 ◼   ► can play nicely with iOS apps right so

00:36:28 ◼   ► they'll have a lot of games that they're

00:36:30 ◼   ► kinda that there will be coming out that

00:36:31 ◼   ► will be able to do that that might my

00:36:33 ◼   ► thought is and i'm pretty sure this is

00:36:35 ◼   ► true maybe you know the answer sure that

00:36:37 ◼   ► they have to be sold through the mac app

00:36:39 ◼   ► store to be able to do that to be able

00:36:42 ◼   ► to interplay with with iOS apps you know

00:36:45 ◼   ► if that's if that's actually the case

00:36:46 ◼   ► run the question by me again i'm not

00:36:51 ◼   ► quite sure so they'll have you know like

00:36:53 ◼   ► a game for example they had you know

00:36:55 ◼   ► some sort of game that will right now of

00:36:58 ◼   ► course you can play across iOS devices

00:36:59 ◼   ► you can play with an iphone vs an ipad

00:37:02 ◼   ► and some reason say and you know the end

00:37:04 ◼   ► so they'll have it now where you can do

00:37:05 ◼   ► it via the mac to you can play a game

00:37:09 ◼   ► that's that syncs across the entire

00:37:12 ◼   ► ecosystem but i think that those are

00:37:14 ◼   ► only going to work if it's sold the mac

00:37:17 ◼   ► app store i think there's things like

00:37:18 ◼   ► Game Center that they're going to

00:37:20 ◼   ► require you to use the mac app store for

00:37:22 ◼   ► yeah I and I it there's nothing that

00:37:25 ◼   ► would keep a developer from implementing

00:37:27 ◼   ► their own peer to peer over the Wi-Fi

00:37:29 ◼   ► thing that would let an ipad

00:37:31 ◼   ► up communicate with a mac app you can do

00:37:33 ◼   ► that today alright though that if you

00:37:35 ◼   ► want to do it through apple's sister

00:37:37 ◼   ► apples back and try to go through the I

00:37:39 ◼   ► mean it's the same thing with iCloud for

00:37:41 ◼   ► storage is yep

00:37:42 ◼   ► the only way you get to write to iCloud

00:37:45 ◼   ► is if you go through the app store right

00:37:48 ◼   ► and i think it's all about you know it's

00:37:50 ◼   ► they're not going to they're never gonna

00:37:51 ◼   ► see that control the start so that if

00:37:53 ◼   ► anybody's writing it is abusing iCloud

00:37:57 ◼   ► by writing way too much data exceeding

00:37:59 ◼   ► any kind of you know limits are using it

00:38:01 ◼   ► for file sharing or something ridiculous

00:38:03 ◼   ► like that Apple can just yank the plug

00:38:06 ◼   ► yet and this out let me ask you this

00:38:09 ◼   ► this is this is something that developed

00:38:11 ◼   ► that more than one developer is brought

00:38:13 ◼   ► up you know in the past few months with

00:38:14 ◼   ► me that when talking specifically about

00:38:16 ◼   ► gatekeeper and i think you said

00:38:18 ◼   ► something about this before but I'm

00:38:20 ◼   ► interested in your take it some the idea

00:38:22 ◼   ► that gatekeeper is sort of a test to see

00:38:26 ◼   ► if they would if they can ever do non

00:38:29 ◼   ► appstore apps on iOS devices so they

00:38:32 ◼   ► would do the same thing where they they

00:38:34 ◼   ► sign the developer and they have no

00:38:35 ◼   ► unsigned developers since they're

00:38:37 ◼   ► starting from scratch they would be with

00:38:39 ◼   ► iOS but they would have a way that you

00:38:41 ◼   ► could download via the web as long as

00:38:44 ◼   ► they were a assigned developer and you

00:38:46 ◼   ► would just lose excess of course to

00:38:48 ◼   ► things like iCloud access and can game

00:38:50 ◼   ► center and those type of Apple things

00:38:52 ◼   ► but you would be allowed to download

00:38:54 ◼   ► from the web do you think that's ever

00:38:55 ◼   ► going to happen i don't and in fact John

00:38:59 ◼   ► Walton I talked about it on last week's

00:39:00 ◼   ► episode and i think it's it's possible

00:39:03 ◼   ► and if they were going to do it would

00:39:05 ◼   ► definitely be through gatekeeper like I

00:39:06 ◼   ► think that in if they ever did it i

00:39:09 ◼   ► don't think they would ever allow true

00:39:10 ◼   ► unsigned side-loaded apps if they ever

00:39:13 ◼   ► allowed sideload apps in iOS it would be

00:39:16 ◼   ► through something exactly like

00:39:17 ◼   ► gatekeeper where it's signed and they

00:39:19 ◼   ► could still revoke it remotely actually

00:39:23 ◼   ► have were sitting right here it's open a

00:39:24 ◼   ► tab i haven't linked to it yet i have a

00:39:26 ◼   ► blog post from a guy named zach weekend

00:39:29 ◼   ► and he after listening to the show last

00:39:32 ◼   ► week he said let me see if i can find it

00:39:36 ◼   ► a good pull quote here that it's not

00:39:39 ◼   ► about the money yes Apple makes a little

00:39:41 ◼   ► bit of money from their thirty percent

00:39:42 ◼   ► cut but they are also providing a

00:39:43 ◼   ► service for that tree they host your

00:39:45 ◼   ► yup I agree with that that is not just

00:39:48 ◼   ► about the money i don't know i think

00:39:49 ◼   ► they're on the Apple gets me abstracts

00:39:51 ◼   ► it's nice and neutral to them it's icing

00:39:53 ◼   ► on the cake right but the reason he

00:39:56 ◼   ► finds it hard to believe that apple will

00:39:58 ◼   ► ever open up the floodgates to third

00:40:00 ◼   ► party at our third party non appstore

00:40:01 ◼   ► apps is one word

00:40:03 ◼   ► amazon if Apple were to allow apps to be

00:40:06 ◼   ► loaded from other sources nothing would

00:40:07 ◼   ► prevent amazon from creating a rival

00:40:09 ◼   ► store one that provides many of the same

00:40:11 ◼   ► benefits and is even more

00:40:12 ◼   ► developer-friendly uh yeah that's

00:40:16 ◼   ► interesting that's really interesting

00:40:17 ◼   ► actually because you look at the history

00:40:18 ◼   ► of amazon while they are sort of trying

00:40:21 ◼   ► to do this now with the with the android

00:40:24 ◼   ► that's kind of their model in general

00:40:26 ◼   ► where they just you know they figure out

00:40:28 ◼   ► kind of the some weak point and just

00:40:32 ◼   ► kind of go over the top and figure out a

00:40:33 ◼   ► way to bully their their way into the

00:40:35 ◼   ► system and kind of disrupted from the

00:40:38 ◼   ► ground up and yeah that could

00:40:40 ◼   ► potentially open some sort of box that

00:40:44 ◼   ► that apple doesn't want to open if they

00:40:46 ◼   ► were to do that I think that amazon have

00:40:48 ◼   ► a harder time doing it from pure light

00:40:49 ◼   ► quality perspective and maybe even you

00:40:52 ◼   ► know kind of confusion on how to install

00:40:54 ◼   ► things but yeah that's pretty

00:40:56 ◼   ► interesting

00:40:57 ◼   ► I like that idea right I so I i would

00:41:00 ◼   ► think my honest feeling is that they

00:41:02 ◼   ► wouldn't do it unless they were forced

00:41:04 ◼   ► to buy antitrust legislation

00:41:07 ◼   ► yeah or however you want to put it

00:41:10 ◼   ► government regulation right I then if

00:41:13 ◼   ► they did that that's the route they

00:41:14 ◼   ► would take yeah that's so not

00:41:18 ◼   ► yeah interesting i wanted i forgot to

00:41:21 ◼   ► mention one time wanted to give a

00:41:22 ◼   ► shout-out to Ida about is that with this

00:41:25 ◼   ► skeuomorphic sort of paper list thing

00:41:28 ◼   ► they've done something i don't know if

00:41:30 ◼   ► they had me in mind I don't know what

00:41:32 ◼   ► they've done something that makes me

00:41:34 ◼   ► just adore the app which is that like

00:41:37 ◼   ► the whole user interface like i said is

00:41:38 ◼   ► in future which I door but when you

00:41:40 ◼   ► enter stuff it's not in and marker felt

00:41:43 ◼   ► or chalkboard or any of those goofy

00:41:45 ◼   ► silly childish handwriting fonts it's

00:41:48 ◼   ► your input is helvetica it it's the I

00:41:51 ◼   ► just wanted I can't believe i forgot to

00:41:53 ◼   ► mention entering a sponsor read that

00:41:55 ◼   ► it's the skeuomorphic paper type thing

00:41:58 ◼   ► but without

00:41:59 ◼   ► goofy silly handwriting fun which is why

00:42:02 ◼   ► does Apple use those anyway like

00:42:03 ◼   ► everyone just makes fun of them

00:42:05 ◼   ► I you know what these are no I just

00:42:08 ◼   ► remember the day I got my original

00:42:09 ◼   ► iphone in 2007 I loved every single

00:42:12 ◼   ► thing about it except that stupid font

00:42:14 ◼   ► and notes app yes couldn't stop looking

00:42:16 ◼   ► at it as I and I know they switched from

00:42:20 ◼   ► marker fell to the one that has talking

00:42:22 ◼   ► the name and i love the name the chalk

00:42:23 ◼   ► name and I just can't help but think

00:42:25 ◼   ► that it's somebody else that Apple who

00:42:26 ◼   ► thinks of it like I do like nails on a

00:42:28 ◼   ► chalkboard every time there's a pic also

00:42:34 ◼   ► i also have a little another piece of

00:42:35 ◼   ► correction from last week I have to get

00:42:38 ◼   ► to is that last week's sponsor i

00:42:40 ◼   ► pronouncing your name wrong

00:42:42 ◼   ► pixelmator not pixel mentor and I I

00:42:45 ◼   ► curse myself for this because i called

00:42:47 ◼   ► it Pixelmator for years and then

00:42:49 ◼   ► somebody somewhere told me that because

00:42:51 ◼   ► the guys who make the aperture German

00:42:52 ◼   ► that it's not called Pixelmator it's

00:42:54 ◼   ► pixel mentor and I thought well you know

00:42:57 ◼   ► I want to be worldly I'm debonair and it

00:42:59 ◼   ► pronounce words in other languages so I

00:43:01 ◼   ► didn't really think about it before we

00:43:02 ◼   ► did the show and I did the sponsoring

00:43:04 ◼   ► then i got like a hundred emails from

00:43:06 ◼   ► people saying holy crap i've been saying

00:43:08 ◼   ► Pixelmator like our automator for years

00:43:10 ◼   ► I can't believe I'm wrong so I checked

00:43:12 ◼   ► with the Pixelmator guys in there they

00:43:13 ◼   ► said its Pixelmator like automator and I

00:43:16 ◼   ► and I and I did the wrong thing i

00:43:19 ◼   ► overthought it so that that's another

00:43:22 ◼   ► piece of cleanup us we have a winner

00:43:26 ◼   ► when you come guys soon you're coming

00:43:27 ◼   ► out here for WI will be there I will be

00:43:30 ◼   ► there next week

00:43:31 ◼   ► have you uh would what do you know what

00:43:36 ◼   ► your general thoughts what's coming

00:43:38 ◼   ► that's what I go we can spend the rest

00:43:39 ◼   ► of the show and you know what I'll take

00:43:41 ◼   ► an opportunity right now I have another

00:43:42 ◼   ► announcement to make

00:43:43 ◼   ► I'll just make it right now maybe

00:43:45 ◼   ► there's going to be a live episode of

00:43:48 ◼   ► this show the talk show next week

00:43:49 ◼   ► broadcast from WWDC gonna be on tuesday

00:43:53 ◼   ► at five thirty and it's going to be free

00:43:58 ◼   ► it's about a hundred and fifty tickets

00:44:00 ◼   ► to give out so if you want to go if

00:44:02 ◼   ► you're going to be in san francisco

00:44:03 ◼   ► gonna be at WWDC it's going to be held a

00:44:05 ◼   ► few blocks away from Moscow knee tuesday

00:44:07 ◼   ► afternoon you can get tickets at

00:44:12 ◼   ► talk-show dot eventbrite.com that's

00:44:17 ◼   ► eventbrite is spelled bri te dot-com

00:44:21 ◼   ► there's about a hundred fifty tickets I

00:44:23 ◼   ► don't know how fast they're going to go

00:44:24 ◼   ► i'm not going to announce on daring

00:44:26 ◼   ► fireball the only way I'm gonna announce

00:44:27 ◼   ► it is right here during this broadcast I

00:44:30 ◼   ► special guest is going to be cable

00:44:33 ◼   ► sasser of panic i don't know maybe

00:44:36 ◼   ► there'll be other surprise guess I'm not

00:44:38 ◼   ► sure probably about an hour show so nice

00:44:42 ◼   ► the talk show at eventbrite.com hope you

00:44:45 ◼   ► can make it

00:44:46 ◼   ► yeah i'll be a i'll be there on Tuesday

00:44:49 ◼   ► Tuesday 530 so I figure we'll have lots

00:44:51 ◼   ► of WBC news to talk about and talked

00:44:55 ◼   ► about Panik software with with cable

00:44:59 ◼   ► after so what to expect i don't know i

00:45:02 ◼   ► guess they-- it seems like everybody

00:45:04 ◼   ► realized it seems pretty obvious is

00:45:05 ◼   ► going to new mac hardware right I'm not

00:45:08 ◼   ► sure though how much time you know i

00:45:10 ◼   ► like to think about where they put the

00:45:12 ◼   ► emphasis in their key nuts because it's

00:45:14 ◼   ► their very very carefully thought-out

00:45:16 ◼   ► yep i wonder how much time they're going

00:45:19 ◼   ► to spend talking about Mac hardware or

00:45:22 ◼   ► will it just be I i can honestly see it

00:45:24 ◼   ► it's not even really being mentioned i

00:45:27 ◼   ► don't know i guess if they go retina

00:45:28 ◼   ► display they're going to have to mention

00:45:29 ◼   ► it because that's developer news and

00:45:31 ◼   ► that's a real bragging point that they

00:45:33 ◼   ► can jump on over the industry and they

00:45:35 ◼   ► can say look first we brought the retina

00:45:36 ◼   ► to the phone then we brought the retina

00:45:38 ◼   ► to the ipad everybody loves it text is

00:45:41 ◼   ► beautiful pictures look better now we're

00:45:44 ◼   ► bringing it to the mac yep

00:45:46 ◼   ► yeah I i think you know obviously

00:45:48 ◼   ► everyone knows the trend over the years

00:45:50 ◼   ► where because iOS is so huge compared to

00:45:53 ◼   ► Mac development that this is the focus

00:45:55 ◼   ► of WWDC now and it just so happens that

00:45:58 ◼   ► the timing of all this this new mac

00:46:00 ◼   ► hardware seems to be corresponding

00:46:02 ◼   ► perfectly with wwc so you think that

00:46:04 ◼   ► they got to say something about it there

00:46:05 ◼   ► and the fact that they have you know the

00:46:07 ◼   ► new OS 10 presumably close to being done

00:46:10 ◼   ► they've always said is gonna come out

00:46:12 ◼   ► this summer you know and and they like

00:46:14 ◼   ► to of course launch those things with

00:46:16 ◼   ► some new hardware so it still seems like

00:46:19 ◼   ► though yeah i mean you all the banners

00:46:20 ◼   ► you see that are up right now at at

00:46:22 ◼   ► moscone are

00:46:23 ◼   ► are pretty much a populated so it will

00:46:27 ◼   ► be interesting to see how much time they

00:46:28 ◼   ► devote to to the mac itself but I cannot

00:46:31 ◼   ► wait to see what of retina display on a

00:46:35 ◼   ► macbook and you know macbook pro or

00:46:37 ◼   ► whatever it's going to be looks like I

00:46:39 ◼   ► can't even really think about what it

00:46:41 ◼   ► would look like because you know you you

00:46:43 ◼   ► look at your screen right now I'm

00:46:44 ◼   ► looking at a 27-inch imac screen and

00:46:46 ◼   ► it's a beautiful screen and it's always

00:46:47 ◼   ► been a beautiful screen and it's like

00:46:49 ◼   ► how you know how much better is it going

00:46:52 ◼   ► to be now with it with a Retina display

00:46:54 ◼   ► and will it be the same situation that

00:46:56 ◼   ► we had with the iphone and that with the

00:46:58 ◼   ► ipad where you can look at one of the

00:46:59 ◼   ► retina displays and then you look at the

00:47:01 ◼   ► old one and while when you first look at

00:47:03 ◼   ► one and look at the other you know too I

00:47:05 ◼   ► think I still think to kind of the the

00:47:08 ◼   ► common user they're like okay yeah it

00:47:10 ◼   ► looks nicer but you don't really you

00:47:11 ◼   ► don't really get into you look at one

00:47:13 ◼   ► and then look at the other right away or

00:47:15 ◼   ► try and switch back after a long time

00:47:17 ◼   ► using it and it just looks awful and is

00:47:18 ◼   ► that the way all macs are going to look

00:47:20 ◼   ► now

00:47:20 ◼   ► yeah i think it's the same that whenever

00:47:22 ◼   ► you buy a new computer and it's faster

00:47:23 ◼   ► than your old one you notice the speed

00:47:25 ◼   ► for a couple of seconds and it feels fun

00:47:27 ◼   ► you know it kind of fades away and then

00:47:29 ◼   ► if you go back to the old machine after

00:47:30 ◼   ► a couple of days are like I can't

00:47:32 ◼   ► believe i use this and that is the

00:47:33 ◼   ► retina displays exact same way where and

00:47:36 ◼   ► I remember it the naysayers about the

00:47:37 ◼   ► ipad who are saying there's no way

00:47:39 ◼   ► they're gonna you know they could do

00:47:40 ◼   ► with the phone because it was only 960 x

00:47:42 ◼   ► 6 whatever 640 on but there's no way

00:47:46 ◼   ► they're going to put the 2048 pixel

00:47:48 ◼   ► display and this tiny little iPad it's

00:47:51 ◼   ► that that's insane you're not going to

00:47:53 ◼   ► do it nobody's gonna road is nobody's

00:47:54 ◼   ► winning money it's a price nobody is out

00:47:56 ◼   ► there did you know they argument was

00:47:58 ◼   ► nobody's out there with the first ipad

00:47:59 ◼   ► or the second one saying my god the

00:48:01 ◼   ► pixels are too noticeable on this but

00:48:03 ◼   ► the truth is once you've used the eye

00:48:04 ◼   ► the retina display one they are they're

00:48:06 ◼   ► off yes

00:48:07 ◼   ► yeah it's pretty bad to go back and and

00:48:10 ◼   ► look at it now you can pack a i mean

00:48:12 ◼   ► it's it's me it's even worse than it is

00:48:14 ◼   ► on the on the iphone switch which is

00:48:16 ◼   ► still pretty bad but just because the

00:48:18 ◼   ► bigger screen and so it'll be even a

00:48:19 ◼   ► bigger screen now you know presumably a

00:48:21 ◼   ► 15 inch or something like that with the

00:48:24 ◼   ► with a mac book and it's like it got

00:48:26 ◼   ► that's going to be really jarring to

00:48:28 ◼   ► today and I know into mac people have

00:48:31 ◼   ► said to me over the years because I i do

00:48:33 ◼   ► i I obsess over typography

00:48:35 ◼   ► it is absolutely one of my great

00:48:37 ◼   ► passions and I've had this discussion

00:48:40 ◼   ► with people about pixels is that you

00:48:42 ◼   ► know that it's inevitable and and and

00:48:45 ◼   ► they say well know most people don't

00:48:46 ◼   ► care about this stuff like you do so why

00:48:48 ◼   ► would they bother but it's the path that

00:48:52 ◼   ► print talk right like if you look at

00:48:54 ◼   ► really old books if you look at books

00:48:56 ◼   ► that were printed you know like vintage

00:48:58 ◼   ► books from about a hundred years ago or

00:48:59 ◼   ► so that the printing quality was great i

00:49:02 ◼   ► mean it you know typography had you know

00:49:04 ◼   ► some of the great text faces of all time

00:49:06 ◼   ► were well established already a hundred

00:49:08 ◼   ► years ago and the typography is gorgeous

00:49:10 ◼   ► but if you look at the quality of the

00:49:12 ◼   ► printing it's it there's a lot of you

00:49:14 ◼   ► know the ink spread a lot and the fonts

00:49:18 ◼   ► were designed to accommodate that the

00:49:20 ◼   ► great text faces of hundred years ago

00:49:24 ◼   ► were designed with the idea that look

00:49:26 ◼   ► it's gonna you know it's not going to be

00:49:28 ◼   ► super crisp it's not the letters are

00:49:30 ◼   ► going to be perfect you go to a

00:49:32 ◼   ► bookstore now buy a print book that the

00:49:34 ◼   ► the quality of the type in the book is

00:49:37 ◼   ► astounding

00:49:38 ◼   ► it is like each letter is absolutely

00:49:40 ◼   ► perfectly by a newsweek or time I mean

00:49:44 ◼   ► they still print Newsweek right i think

00:49:47 ◼   ► so

00:49:47 ◼   ► dan lyons you know he's he's big in

00:49:49 ◼   ► there somebody's going to have

00:49:50 ◼   ► somebody's wearing his legs right I the

00:49:53 ◼   ► print quality is astounding

00:49:55 ◼   ► it is absolutely astounding and its

00:49:57 ◼   ► beginning maybe you don't notice that

00:49:58 ◼   ► the you did people don't buy news we can

00:50:00 ◼   ► think my god this thing is is very

00:50:02 ◼   ► finely printed ah you may not know that

00:50:06 ◼   ► you may not think it but you notice it

00:50:07 ◼   ► and that's just like the way apple stuff

00:50:09 ◼   ► is all the way you know where people

00:50:10 ◼   ► don't buy normal people don't buy it

00:50:13 ◼   ► the iphone and think about how nice this

00:50:15 ◼   ► seems our between the steel antenna and

00:50:19 ◼   ► the glass front and you may not think

00:50:22 ◼   ► about it but you appreciate it right do

00:50:25 ◼   ► you think do you think that they just to

00:50:27 ◼   ► kind of one product with at first with

00:50:30 ◼   ► the retina display for in terms of the

00:50:32 ◼   ► Mack you know they do a macbook pro

00:50:33 ◼   ► rather than the macbook air and and

00:50:36 ◼   ► maybe or do they do you know do the

00:50:38 ◼   ► release of cinema display one that can

00:50:40 ◼   ► use that obviously they've met new mac

00:50:42 ◼   ► pro's you'll need new cinema displays or

00:50:44 ◼   ► or you can use the old ones but do they

00:50:45 ◼   ► do just one uh

00:50:48 ◼   ► retina at first try I really don't know

00:50:51 ◼   ► I I thought originally that they would

00:50:53 ◼   ► do it one just to introducing and it

00:50:55 ◼   ► seems like that's a little bit more of a

00:50:56 ◼   ► napoli way to do it is just interactive

00:50:59 ◼   ► but it seems like there but there's so

00:51:01 ◼   ► many spots in the mac product matrix

00:51:06 ◼   ► that are overdue for an update that it

00:51:09 ◼   ► just feels to me like they're going to

00:51:11 ◼   ► just do the whole line at once and say

00:51:14 ◼   ► that they all they all get written that

00:51:15 ◼   ► you get a Retina Display you get to it's

00:51:18 ◼   ► going to be Oprah Winfrey up they're

00:51:20 ◼   ► great cars God you think they'll do a

00:51:22 ◼   ► 27-inch imac and like cinema display on

00:51:26 ◼   ► that would be pretty insane

00:51:28 ◼   ► I don't know it seems it seems almost

00:51:29 ◼   ► impossible but that's what I thought

00:51:31 ◼   ► about the phone to when I first heard

00:51:33 ◼   ► the rumors you know three years ago that

00:51:35 ◼   ► they were going to double the pixel

00:51:36 ◼   ► resolution on the iphone it just seemed

00:51:38 ◼   ► impossible

00:51:39 ◼   ► yep I I mean it like there's more pixels

00:51:43 ◼   ► i still have a 20 inch cinema display

00:51:45 ◼   ► but even if you had like the old 23 into

00:51:46 ◼   ► whatever you the ipad today's ipad has

00:51:49 ◼   ► more pixels than oh that's crazy on

00:51:51 ◼   ► yeah so I don't know I I you know I

00:51:54 ◼   ► almost wonder in at it I don't even know

00:51:56 ◼   ► if it's like a yield problem but maybe

00:51:58 ◼   ► at this point you know with the pixels

00:51:59 ◼   ► that small a couple of dead pixels you

00:52:01 ◼   ► don't even notice i honestly don't know

00:52:03 ◼   ► right

00:52:04 ◼   ► sure would be awesome if they did and I

00:52:08 ◼   ► wonder you know obviously they'll try

00:52:10 ◼   ► and they'll do something within os10

00:52:12 ◼   ► mountain lion sooo kind of make older

00:52:16 ◼   ► apps look fine on the new thing without

00:52:20 ◼   ► being custom tailored for it but I I do

00:52:22 ◼   ► sort of wonder

00:52:23 ◼   ► excuse me what they'll end up looking

00:52:25 ◼   ► like I think it's going to be like the

00:52:27 ◼   ► iphone where they know they're going to

00:52:29 ◼   ► stick out the ones that haven't been

00:52:31 ◼   ► updated are going to stick out because

00:52:32 ◼   ► that is the weird thing the weird thing

00:52:34 ◼   ► about and I didn't think of it didn't

00:52:37 ◼   ► make sense to me until I saw it but when

00:52:39 ◼   ► you run non-retina apps on the iphone

00:52:42 ◼   ► based shouldn't theory

00:52:44 ◼   ► look the same as they did on an old 3gs

00:52:47 ◼   ► with a non retina display but they don't

00:52:50 ◼   ► it looks worse right because the pixels

00:52:53 ◼   ► yeah there's a little for pixel square

00:52:55 ◼   ► one pixel used to be but there's so much

00:52:57 ◼   ► sharper that you see that whereas it was

00:53:00 ◼   ► sort of fun

00:53:01 ◼   ► on the old non retina displays there was

00:53:04 ◼   ► a fuzziness that sort of glossed over

00:53:07 ◼   ► the the pixelation that you can notice

00:53:09 ◼   ► whereas yep when you run them on the

00:53:12 ◼   ► actual retina displays it it turns into

00:53:14 ◼   ► sharp jagged pneus that stair-step you

00:53:17 ◼   ► know like you're filling in graph paper

00:53:19 ◼   ► right look and I you know I think that I

00:53:23 ◼   ► think that's the motivation i think

00:53:25 ◼   ► that's the one thing about apples

00:53:26 ◼   ► success with this sort of athletics are

00:53:30 ◼   ► a core value that across-the-board it

00:53:34 ◼   ► just gets developers on board like your

00:53:36 ◼   ► app looks like ass is is like a kick in

00:53:39 ◼   ► the pants to developers to hurry up

00:53:41 ◼   ► hurry up and fix it like no one wants to

00:53:43 ◼   ► be that guy who people are saying i love

00:53:45 ◼   ► your app but boy it looks like ass on my

00:53:47 ◼   ► new macbook air

00:53:48 ◼   ► yeah I wonder I you know I think about

00:53:52 ◼   ► like what are.what are 1080p movies

00:53:53 ◼   ► gonna be like when you know most youtube

00:53:55 ◼   ► things or 1080p now we have the option

00:53:57 ◼   ► for at Vimeo videos and then of course

00:53:58 ◼   ► the itunes content you know they can go

00:54:02 ◼   ► with it so far beyond that but

00:54:05 ◼   ► Hollywood's obviously not ready to do

00:54:06 ◼   ► that they are they're filming like the

00:54:08 ◼   ► filming the new Hobbit movie right with

00:54:09 ◼   ► those red cams and that's going to be a

00:54:11 ◼   ► uniform can I resolution right for can

00:54:14 ◼   ► and so there are you know there are

00:54:15 ◼   ► there will be options do that in the

00:54:16 ◼   ► future but you know it's going to be an

00:54:19 ◼   ► interesting transition is AI think video

00:54:22 ◼   ► I think video gets by with it though

00:54:24 ◼   ► because of the motion

00:54:26 ◼   ► yeah is it right immersion kinda

00:54:28 ◼   ► inherently blurs the stuff just like

00:54:31 ◼   ► with you know when you watch an actual

00:54:33 ◼   ► film projected that the you know the the

00:54:38 ◼   ► frame to frame you don't see the frames

00:54:39 ◼   ► and so right i think that covers it up i

00:54:42 ◼   ► think a bigger question is what

00:54:43 ◼   ► photography photographs are going to

00:54:45 ◼   ► look like

00:54:46 ◼   ► yep and you kind of see that on the ipad

00:54:50 ◼   ► i think especially when you're on the

00:54:51 ◼   ► web because most websites don't have

00:54:53 ◼   ► retina photographs their photographs on

00:54:57 ◼   ► the web and you really I'd I think you

00:55:00 ◼   ► can really see like jpeg compression now

00:55:02 ◼   ► that you couldn't see before with the

00:55:03 ◼   ► exact same photograph on on a on another

00:55:06 ◼   ► kind of non retina display

00:55:08 ◼   ► yeah yeah it was you know I had my

00:55:11 ◼   ► little logo thing

00:55:13 ◼   ► of course wasn't wasn't retina ready

00:55:14 ◼   ► when it came out and I just look at that

00:55:16 ◼   ► and cringe every single day and soho now

00:55:18 ◼   ► it's a matter of just uploading a much

00:55:20 ◼   ► larger image file but it looks finally

00:55:23 ◼   ► looks fine red yeah let me I'm gonna

00:55:27 ◼   ► just let me do the second sponsor and

00:55:29 ◼   ► will run through I think for the rest of

00:55:30 ◼   ► the show will speak talk more about WWDC

00:55:33 ◼   ► rumors but they're the second sponsor is

00:55:37 ◼   ► excellent creations that spelled ex-ceo

00:55:40 ◼   ► llen t excellent without the E in the

00:55:43 ◼   ► front

00:55:44 ◼   ► excellent creations is a mobile app

00:55:47 ◼   ► development company they've been

00:55:48 ◼   ► building mobile apps since 2007 and they

00:55:51 ◼   ► have expertise in iOS Android and mobile

00:55:54 ◼   ► websites they can turn your idea into

00:55:57 ◼   ► reality on whatever platform it requires

00:56:00 ◼   ► they don't use cross-platform frameworks

00:56:02 ◼   ► they write native code for whatever

00:56:03 ◼   ► platform you're targeting are you

00:56:05 ◼   ► attending WWDC excellent creations will

00:56:08 ◼   ► be there handing out commemorate of

00:56:10 ◼   ► level up

00:56:11 ◼   ► that's a tag hash tag pound level up

00:56:14 ◼   ► WWDC 2012 t-shirts so if you see anybody

00:56:18 ◼   ► from excellent creations at WWDC in

00:56:20 ◼   ► Moscow knee hit him up they'll give you

00:56:22 ◼   ► a t-shirt and if you're in the market

00:56:26 ◼   ► for a new job if you're not I iOS

00:56:28 ◼   ► android mobile web developer excellent

00:56:31 ◼   ► creations is hiring in denver colorado

00:56:34 ◼   ► so if you need a nap talk to excellent

00:56:37 ◼   ► creations they can make it for you if

00:56:39 ◼   ► you're in the market for a new job as an

00:56:41 ◼   ► app developer talk to excellent

00:56:43 ◼   ► creations

00:56:44 ◼   ► they're great place to work thank you to

00:56:46 ◼   ► them and look for Matt wdc so what else

00:56:54 ◼   ► maps maps it seems like a done deal i

00:56:56 ◼   ► mean that's the one that's that's leaked

00:56:58 ◼   ► everywhere

00:56:59 ◼   ► what what would you make of the of the

00:57:01 ◼   ► google event yes it was me yesterday

00:57:04 ◼   ► that happened kind of funny funny little

00:57:07 ◼   ► event you know that uh that I don't know

00:57:11 ◼   ► what they were really thinking you know

00:57:13 ◼   ► if they were even trying to be a smart

00:57:17 ◼   ► about the way that they kind of time the

00:57:18 ◼   ► entire thing every tweet that is all

00:57:21 ◼   ► about it you know I was gearing up to

00:57:23 ◼   ► just sit down and watch it and then it's

00:57:24 ◼   ► just like treat us like this is

00:57:25 ◼   ► ridiculous

00:57:26 ◼   ► announcing anything all they're saying

00:57:28 ◼   ► is you know kind of the history of

00:57:29 ◼   ► google maps and and going into you know

00:57:32 ◼   ► how great the product is and it's very

00:57:34 ◼   ► clear that they threw this conference

00:57:35 ◼   ► together at the last second just to

00:57:37 ◼   ► preempt whatever Apple is going to

00:57:38 ◼   ► announce at wwc one of the articles I

00:57:41 ◼   ► read covering and i forget which side it

00:57:44 ◼   ► was on but the first comment was perfect

00:57:47 ◼   ► it was the first comment with somebody

00:57:48 ◼   ► who's comment was google to apple all

00:57:52 ◼   ► caps first

00:57:54 ◼   ► yeah you know which is it was so perfect

00:57:58 ◼   ► because it's you know that's famously

00:57:59 ◼   ► what try to people jerks try to stick in

00:58:01 ◼   ► is the first comment on any article

00:58:03 ◼   ► right it really was and and somebody

00:58:05 ◼   ► else had the analogy is on Twitter and I

00:58:07 ◼   ► wish I'd thought of it was that it

00:58:08 ◼   ► really wreaked of that it was exactly

00:58:12 ◼   ► like that 2010 CES keynote from steve

00:58:16 ◼   ► ballmer whenever your slates and right

00:58:19 ◼   ► right holding up their one year it was

00:58:22 ◼   ► you know six weeks before the original

00:58:24 ◼   ► iPad introduction and it was at a point

00:58:27 ◼   ► where there is this fever pitch of hey

00:58:29 ◼   ► apples really doing a tablet and there

00:58:31 ◼   ► is coming soon

00:58:32 ◼   ► everybody knew it nobody knew what it

00:58:34 ◼   ► was going to be but there's this idea

00:58:35 ◼   ► that Apple has a tablet and it's coming

00:58:37 ◼   ► soon in and Microsoft CES keynote was

00:58:40 ◼   ► about slates and they tried to grasp the

00:58:42 ◼   ► word in there and and Google got a

00:58:46 ◼   ► chance to throw out the 3d word I you

00:58:49 ◼   ► know even though you know they've had 3d

00:58:51 ◼   ► elements of course for for a while but

00:58:52 ◼   ► now they have some concern new you know

00:58:54 ◼   ► I amazing 3d element coming soon my new

00:58:57 ◼   ► nothing was actually released at this

00:58:59 ◼   ► event because it wasn't ready right but

00:59:01 ◼   ► coming soon they will have some sort of

00:59:03 ◼   ► 3d thing I thought I think was like

00:59:06 ◼   ► quentin hardy for I think he wrote about

00:59:08 ◼   ► in new york times maybe even like the

00:59:10 ◼   ► bits blog there something like that but

00:59:11 ◼   ► I'm you know because I was of course

00:59:13 ◼   ► extremely skeptical and just wrote a

00:59:15 ◼   ► post pretty much trashing that that

00:59:17 ◼   ► whole conference is a giant waste of

00:59:18 ◼   ► time and kinda showing a google has

00:59:22 ◼   ► while they are you know undoubtedly the

00:59:25 ◼   ► leader in maps they do have a

00:59:26 ◼   ► vulnerability here that I think is is

00:59:28 ◼   ► going to be fun sort of watch how it

00:59:31 ◼   ► plays out but I thought we'd already had

00:59:33 ◼   ► an interesting other view of it which is

00:59:36 ◼   ► that they had to do this conference to

00:59:39 ◼   ► try and

00:59:40 ◼   ► preempt what the rest of the press will

00:59:43 ◼   ► talk about at wwc which is that

00:59:46 ◼   ► Wow Apple you know has an opportunity

00:59:48 ◼   ► here to really hurt a google wear

00:59:51 ◼   ► something that matters because you know

00:59:53 ◼   ► mobile mobile Sookie maps are so key to

00:59:56 ◼   ► mobile and there's all this data and you

00:59:59 ◼   ► know Google could

00:59:59 ◼   ► know Google could

01:00:00 ◼   ► lose half the market all of a sudden and

01:00:02 ◼   ► so Quinton hardees point was that you

01:00:05 ◼   ► know this at least put some seed in the

01:00:08 ◼   ► presses mind that well you know this

01:00:11 ◼   ► what apple announced you know could be

01:00:13 ◼   ► disruptive certainly but it's not nearly

01:00:15 ◼   ► as good as what Google is done in and

01:00:17 ◼   ► you know they've had seven years to work

01:00:19 ◼   ► on this and they've been doing it all

01:00:20 ◼   ► this time and they have all the experts

01:00:22 ◼   ► in the space you know working on this

01:00:23 ◼   ► problem so there's no way they can

01:00:25 ◼   ► actually do it

01:00:25 ◼   ► it was basically just a plant a seed of

01:00:27 ◼   ► doubt in five days before WC about it i

01:00:30 ◼   ► guess i just think it makes them look

01:00:32 ◼   ► defensive though

01:00:34 ◼   ► yes right there my tickets they're

01:00:35 ◼   ► fighting down rather than fighting

01:00:37 ◼   ► because they are a position of power

01:00:39 ◼   ► I you know I i if it were me I would

01:00:43 ◼   ► just stay silent

01:00:45 ◼   ► you know yeah and you know i might have

01:00:47 ◼   ► you know fought as hard as i could have

01:00:49 ◼   ► been negotiating table to convince Apple

01:00:51 ◼   ► to stick with google maps in iOS if if I

01:00:54 ◼   ► really thought that was in Google's

01:00:56 ◼   ► interests but if they were clearly going

01:00:58 ◼   ► to go their own way and not not renew

01:01:00 ◼   ► the contract then just shut down

01:01:04 ◼   ► silence and you know good luck and let's

01:01:06 ◼   ► see what they do and let them do it

01:01:08 ◼   ► because you know Jay arrow had a piece

01:01:10 ◼   ► on business insider today and in typical

01:01:12 ◼   ► business insider fashion it's sort of

01:01:14 ◼   ► sensationalizing it why Apple is taking

01:01:16 ◼   ► a tremendous risk with this time but

01:01:20 ◼   ► he's a good guy

01:01:21 ◼   ► the arrow and he has a good point the

01:01:22 ◼   ► fundamental point though is that it is a

01:01:24 ◼   ► risk because it has to be as good as

01:01:27 ◼   ► google maps yet overall you know

01:01:30 ◼   ► directions have to be as good and they

01:01:31 ◼   ► can't in on and I I'm guessing that's

01:01:34 ◼   ► why it's taking them so long with their

01:01:36 ◼   ► a been working on this for a while

01:01:37 ◼   ► they've been making these accusations

01:01:38 ◼   ► accusations four years is that there's

01:01:41 ◼   ► no other way to roll that out other than

01:01:43 ◼   ► to do it all at once and have beautiful

01:01:46 ◼   ► cartography that covers the world and

01:01:50 ◼   ► accurate directions and driving and

01:01:54 ◼   ► transit public right hands it you know

01:01:57 ◼   ► and I know that the google walking

01:01:58 ◼   ► directions of star still beta but you

01:02:01 ◼   ► know that they pretty good i mean at

01:02:03 ◼   ► least in the cities i've used them in I

01:02:05 ◼   ► mean it always works

01:02:06 ◼   ► I mean I think they're just covering

01:02:07 ◼   ► their ass if you know you can hit by a

01:02:10 ◼   ► car or something like that

01:02:11 ◼   ► right on but it just has to be as good

01:02:14 ◼   ► and it's an area where Apple is it's not

01:02:16 ◼   ► a historical struggling unproven yeah

01:02:18 ◼   ► yeah and it's like it goes back to what

01:02:20 ◼   ► we were talking about kind of the

01:02:21 ◼   ► beginning where you know if if you're

01:02:23 ◼   ► gonna come into a market that's kind of

01:02:25 ◼   ► dominated by someone you have to do

01:02:27 ◼   ► something that's that's really kind of

01:02:28 ◼   ► you know not just not just as good but

01:02:30 ◼   ► 10 times better

01:02:31 ◼   ► Apple resident necessarily have to do

01:02:33 ◼   ► that here because they have control of

01:02:35 ◼   ► this platform and so you know people

01:02:37 ◼   ► will have no choice but rather to use it

01:02:39 ◼   ► and as long as it's just as good

01:02:41 ◼   ► that will be fine for people you know

01:02:43 ◼   ► most people won't even you know most

01:02:45 ◼   ► average consumers I think wouldn't even

01:02:46 ◼   ► they'll notice a difference obviously if

01:02:48 ◼   ► they look a little different but they

01:02:49 ◼   ► wouldn't really care if it's a google

01:02:51 ◼   ► map or if it's an apple maps as long as

01:02:53 ◼   ► it functions just as well as it did so

01:02:55 ◼   ► it doesn't have to be better here but it

01:02:56 ◼   ► has to be as good and that's you know

01:02:59 ◼   ► that's asking a lot and and no one knows

01:03:02 ◼   ► if Apple's going to be able to pull it

01:03:03 ◼   ► off or not they certainly think that the

01:03:05 ◼   ► candidate seems like but who knows my

01:03:07 ◼   ► big question and i have i forget if I

01:03:10 ◼   ► ask this to john molitor adam lee circle

01:03:13 ◼   ► around the show a week or two ago and I

01:03:15 ◼   ► had it was multiple that would we

01:03:16 ◼   ► couldn't figure it out is do you think

01:03:18 ◼   ► they're gonna do a web version of the

01:03:20 ◼   ► map yeah I actually i said this

01:03:22 ◼   ► yesterday too kind of thinking out loud

01:03:24 ◼   ► about it that's that's a really

01:03:28 ◼   ► interesting question because it's on one

01:03:30 ◼   ► hand it seems like if they're going to

01:03:33 ◼   ► ask every developer to do this along

01:03:36 ◼   ► with you know the standard maps app so

01:03:38 ◼   ► in all the apps i'll have the you know

01:03:40 ◼   ► they someone brought up the point you

01:03:42 ◼   ► know that it's not like there is a

01:03:43 ◼   ► Google Maps SDK part of the the iOS SDK

01:03:46 ◼   ► is just the you know they've mapkit I

01:03:49 ◼   ► think and and right now that uses google

01:03:51 ◼   ► data and presumably they'll switch that

01:03:53 ◼   ► out to use the Apple data so so all you

01:03:56 ◼   ► know almost all developers you know

01:03:57 ◼   ► probably will fall in line with that and

01:04:00 ◼   ► if they do that then you know it's sort

01:04:02 ◼   ► of like there's so many apps that have a

01:04:04 ◼   ► web components to it like are they then

01:04:06 ◼   ► going to have to switch over to using

01:04:07 ◼   ► google maps on the web because they have

01:04:09 ◼   ► no other choice or does Apple offer a

01:04:12 ◼   ► web version of it i guess i would guess

01:04:14 ◼   ► that apple doesn't have a web version of

01:04:16 ◼   ► it though it doesn't seem like an

01:04:17 ◼   ► apple-like thing to do but the other

01:04:19 ◼   ► thing I was thinking about is what

01:04:20 ◼   ► happens when you email somebody

01:04:21 ◼   ► directions from you

01:04:22 ◼   ► phone Yeah Yeah right like when you do

01:04:25 ◼   ► it now it you can use the google map on

01:04:27 ◼   ► the phone and say look here's where I'm

01:04:29 ◼   ► coming

01:04:29 ◼   ► yeah the directions in and there's like

01:04:31 ◼   ► a little in action button email this and

01:04:33 ◼   ► send them to the Google Maps website so

01:04:36 ◼   ► i guess they just hope that you're using

01:04:38 ◼   ► a mobile device or an iOS device and you

01:04:41 ◼   ► either open it through your iPad or the

01:04:42 ◼   ► iphone or maybe they have a picture or

01:04:44 ◼   ► something including out it's a real

01:04:47 ◼   ► mystery I don't expect them to a website

01:04:49 ◼   ► but i wonder how they how you email

01:04:51 ◼   ► directions to somebody if they don't

01:04:52 ◼   ► it's also said it's interesting idea as

01:04:56 ◼   ► well because you know on the web itself

01:04:59 ◼   ► google is also in a bit of a vulnerable

01:05:01 ◼   ► position there because for some reason

01:05:04 ◼   ► which most people still don't really

01:05:05 ◼   ► understand google raise their rates a

01:05:08 ◼   ► few months ago for your google maps for

01:05:10 ◼   ► like high-level customers so for example

01:05:12 ◼   ► foursquare switched away from using

01:05:14 ◼   ► google maps on their website they still

01:05:16 ◼   ► use it in there in the mobile app

01:05:18 ◼   ► because it's part of iOS SDK and it's

01:05:20 ◼   ► free right but on the web they started

01:05:23 ◼   ► jacking up the rates for like big

01:05:24 ◼   ► customers and so all those guys moving

01:05:26 ◼   ► over to things like open street maps and

01:05:28 ◼   ► where they can kind of customize their

01:05:30 ◼   ► own maps and so Google is actually

01:05:32 ◼   ► vulnerable here and no one really again

01:05:34 ◼   ► no one understands why they checked the

01:05:36 ◼   ► traits that a lot of money for google

01:05:37 ◼   ► and it just seems like a risk that

01:05:40 ◼   ► they're taking for no apparent reason

01:05:41 ◼   ► but so if Apple words to do web maps of

01:05:46 ◼   ► some sort they could get a lot of the

01:05:48 ◼   ► bigger developers potentially using them

01:05:49 ◼   ► again I don't think it's gonna happen

01:05:51 ◼   ► but it's something interesting to think

01:05:53 ◼   ► about

01:05:53 ◼   ► it's always seemed in Google's priority

01:05:56 ◼   ► was collecting data right right so I

01:05:59 ◼   ► don't know why they're merging yeah

01:06:01 ◼   ► right like why why motivate people that

01:06:04 ◼   ► maybe look elsewhere and fit in

01:06:06 ◼   ► foursquare is obviously a super high

01:06:08 ◼   ► profile example why why give foursquare

01:06:11 ◼   ► any reason to change it does seem

01:06:14 ◼   ► curious to me and I mean unless it's far

01:06:17 ◼   ► more expensive then then I think it is i

01:06:21 ◼   ► mean it's it's definitely expensive but

01:06:23 ◼   ► it'sit's such you know in the amount of

01:06:24 ◼   ► money that they make that they would

01:06:26 ◼   ► make from its is gonna be completely

01:06:28 ◼   ► negligible to Google's bottom line and

01:06:31 ◼   ► so right who cares just do it as a loss

01:06:34 ◼   ► leader I mean it's such a valuable

01:06:35 ◼   ► service

01:06:35 ◼   ► listen they're the leader in this and

01:06:37 ◼   ► there you know i i've talked to

01:06:38 ◼   ► foursquare but they don't know they

01:06:40 ◼   ► don't really know why they decided to

01:06:41 ◼   ► change it and and start jacking up these

01:06:44 ◼   ► rights no one no one really knows and it

01:06:46 ◼   ► just seems on googly it's not you know

01:06:49 ◼   ► all the complaints that we you and I

01:06:50 ◼   ► have about various aspects of google one

01:06:52 ◼   ► is it one thing it i can't imagine ever

01:06:55 ◼   ► saying before is that they seemed like

01:06:57 ◼   ► they were too hungry for collecting

01:07:00 ◼   ► money from people right dad never did it

01:07:02 ◼   ► I can't think of any other example of

01:07:04 ◼   ► that where they've done something where

01:07:06 ◼   ► they seem to favor revenue per user /

01:07:08 ◼   ► just getting as many people using their

01:07:10 ◼   ► things as possible

01:07:11 ◼   ► yeah so I don't know what do you think

01:07:15 ◼   ► about you know so it sounds like we know

01:07:19 ◼   ► maps are coming

01:07:21 ◼   ► seems like facebook as well it's going

01:07:23 ◼   ► to be a part of this i know you're not a

01:07:25 ◼   ► facebook user at all but now this is a

01:07:28 ◼   ► you know this is this is the state.the

01:07:30 ◼   ► of the ecosystem right now so many apps

01:07:33 ◼   ► use facebook connect to be able to do it

01:07:36 ◼   ► and it seems yet I i think if they could

01:07:39 ◼   ► get facebook to agreed to terms that

01:07:42 ◼   ► Apple considers appropriate privacy wise

01:07:47 ◼   ► yep that it's done deal I'd i think so

01:07:51 ◼   ► and I think I you know at one thing you

01:07:56 ◼   ► have to remember too is that Apple

01:07:58 ◼   ► really operates on a yearly schedule

01:08:00 ◼   ► they really do things annually they

01:08:02 ◼   ► don't roll out a lot of stuff other than

01:08:04 ◼   ► bug fixes in you know in between and so

01:08:08 ◼   ► a year ago is when they baked in the

01:08:10 ◼   ► Twitter star if in the US and it was

01:08:13 ◼   ► sort of you know I think it was half

01:08:14 ◼   ► because they thought twitter is good and

01:08:16 ◼   ► that would be useful for iOS and I think

01:08:18 ◼   ► it was half a message to facebook of

01:08:21 ◼   ► well we'll show you stop saying to them

01:08:24 ◼   ► you know you don't agree to our Terms

01:08:26 ◼   ► well these guys are you know they're

01:08:28 ◼   ► nipping at your heels so you know one

01:08:31 ◼   ► year later I wouldn't be surprised at

01:08:33 ◼   ► all if you know I think as a negotiating

01:08:35 ◼   ► tactic a one year head start of built-in

01:08:38 ◼   ► social integration on iOS you know is

01:08:40 ◼   ► enough to maybe get facebook to budge on

01:08:42 ◼   ► the terms that they were offering which

01:08:44 ◼   ► by all accounts

01:08:45 ◼   ► and that you know you i think you and i

01:08:46 ◼   ► both have you know pretty high level and

01:08:48 ◼   ► info on that it was you know more or

01:08:50 ◼   ► less came down to their facebooks bottom

01:08:52 ◼   ► line on the terms they wanted from Apple

01:08:54 ◼   ► was Apple would not agree to not about

01:08:56 ◼   ► money it was about privacy and private

01:08:59 ◼   ► chef right so I i wouldn't be surprised

01:09:01 ◼   ► at all I I think that's definitely

01:09:02 ◼   ► happen i think it's i think it sticks

01:09:05 ◼   ► out more now on iOS 5 that there's one

01:09:09 ◼   ► and only one third party social

01:09:11 ◼   ► integration you know that was like this

01:09:13 ◼   ► this section in the settings apps that

01:09:15 ◼   ► seems like it would naturally be suited

01:09:17 ◼   ► through a couple of them and it's just

01:09:20 ◼   ► one I Twitter and you know

01:09:25 ◼   ► coincidentally tonight Facebook's like

01:09:26 ◼   ► having this last-minute event looks like

01:09:28 ◼   ► to launch what they're calling their app

01:09:31 ◼   ► center which is which is fascinating

01:09:33 ◼   ► because it's uh it's actually leaked out

01:09:35 ◼   ► a little bit and it's gone live in their

01:09:37 ◼   ► facebook app on their off facebook iOS

01:09:39 ◼   ► app even it's basically on the side

01:09:42 ◼   ► panel they knew how they have this new

01:09:44 ◼   ► area that's called App Center where they

01:09:46 ◼   ► basically have their own app store but

01:09:48 ◼   ► it's not their app store it's really

01:09:50 ◼   ► pointing to mobile apps at least on you

01:09:52 ◼   ► know it's kind of I think the idea is to

01:09:54 ◼   ► be platform-agnostic so it's on android

01:09:56 ◼   ► 2.2 android apps if it's on iOS points

01:09:58 ◼   ► iOS apps that the web it can point to a

01:10:00 ◼   ► web app but you know this this might

01:10:03 ◼   ► come into play with kind of these

01:10:04 ◼   ► negotiations as well because you know as

01:10:07 ◼   ► we're seeing now Facebook is a pretty

01:10:09 ◼   ► important driver for growth for a lot of

01:10:12 ◼   ► these apps you know like we had all the

01:10:14 ◼   ► video camera apps that were kind of

01:10:15 ◼   ► exploding for awhile mainly because of

01:10:17 ◼   ► the way that they were using facebook

01:10:19 ◼   ► open graph and now you know one of the

01:10:21 ◼   ► big complaints

01:10:22 ◼   ► that's only going to get louder is about

01:10:24 ◼   ► app discovery and apple but chomping you

01:10:27 ◼   ► know there are supposedly trying to work

01:10:29 ◼   ► on things with that but Facebook can do

01:10:31 ◼   ► a pretty good job of it i think just

01:10:33 ◼   ► given the social data that they have

01:10:35 ◼   ► about what apps your friends are using

01:10:37 ◼   ► and so maybe Apple maybe they do

01:10:40 ◼   ► something a little bit more with that to

01:10:42 ◼   ► to kind of make it as a new discovery

01:10:44 ◼   ► layer for apps themselves because all it

01:10:45 ◼   ► does is kick you into the app store it's

01:10:47 ◼   ► just a new layer on top of it

01:10:50 ◼   ► yeah I'd I definitely not an act that

01:10:53 ◼   ► harkens all the way back to the original

01:10:55 ◼   ► rumors that pain was designed with

01:10:57 ◼   ► writing is playing over

01:10:58 ◼   ► his right mind and I don't get these

01:11:00 ◼   ► recommendations and and find out new

01:11:02 ◼   ► music that people you know we're using

01:11:04 ◼   ► based on your facebook friendships and

01:11:07 ◼   ► connections

01:11:08 ◼   ► yeah and so and that may have sunk that

01:11:11 ◼   ► ship before it even started

01:11:13 ◼   ► you know there are those lines one thing

01:11:16 ◼   ► I've noticed i have noticed is recently

01:11:17 ◼   ► and it's partly because I don't know if

01:11:20 ◼   ► I notice it more because I don't even

01:11:22 ◼   ► have a facebook account or if it's just

01:11:24 ◼   ► my branding sensitivity but I've noticed

01:11:26 ◼   ► more and more as i walk around the city

01:11:29 ◼   ► when I see like billboards and

01:11:32 ◼   ► advertisements like on the sides of

01:11:35 ◼   ► buildings or wherever you can put ads

01:11:36 ◼   ► like walking around I see an awful lot

01:11:38 ◼   ► of brands that instead of putting their

01:11:41 ◼   ► URL you know that it was put facebook

01:11:44 ◼   ► yep dot slash their name yep I including

01:11:48 ◼   ► one I forget who you didn't even print

01:11:50 ◼   ► facebook they just printed the f just

01:11:52 ◼   ► that Facebook f / their name

01:11:55 ◼   ► yeah and I thought that was that blew me

01:11:58 ◼   ► away and they didn't it wasn't next to

01:12:00 ◼   ► their URL it was the this is where to go

01:12:02 ◼   ► for more information

01:12:04 ◼   ► is facebook / brand name yeah i thought

01:12:07 ◼   ► the same thing that's a I don't really

01:12:09 ◼   ► know what that's all about facebook just

01:12:11 ◼   ► as a killer kind of partnership team to

01:12:14 ◼   ► be able to to get these guys to do it or

01:12:15 ◼   ► if there's some sort of data that

01:12:17 ◼   ► they're saying we're just kind of silly

01:12:19 ◼   ► now to have your own website when what

01:12:21 ◼   ► you really want is kind of data social

01:12:24 ◼   ► data that facebook is able to offer up

01:12:25 ◼   ► and help you kind of spread the word

01:12:27 ◼   ► about messages and stuff right now that

01:12:30 ◼   ► you can get them to follow you or like

01:12:31 ◼   ► you and then have a ongoing relationship

01:12:34 ◼   ► with them rather than one time they

01:12:36 ◼   ► visit your site look right one page and

01:12:39 ◼   ► whatever they remember they remember but

01:12:42 ◼   ► i still think it's very very powerful is

01:12:46 ◼   ► a powerful statement of Facebook's

01:12:48 ◼   ► influence

01:12:48 ◼   ► yeah you know while I have you here

01:12:50 ◼   ► because now your new gig your job is

01:12:53 ◼   ► really working as a you an angel

01:12:56 ◼   ► investor or vc vc vc yeah just doing

01:13:01 ◼   ► seed level investments of smaller kind

01:13:03 ◼   ► of angel sighs investments in a way but

01:13:05 ◼   ► yeah so I want you to explain to me the

01:13:08 ◼   ► facebook IPO picture

01:13:10 ◼   ► here's what I'd I don't understand why

01:13:12 ◼   ► it's being called a disaster

01:13:14 ◼   ► I don't understand it seems to me like

01:13:16 ◼   ► it must it's gone down so that's not

01:13:19 ◼   ► good but it seems to me like it was

01:13:20 ◼   ► mostly at least on day one it was priced

01:13:22 ◼   ► kind of right because this is my very

01:13:25 ◼   ► very lame and I I this is so out outside

01:13:27 ◼   ► my wheelhouse that maybe I'm just

01:13:29 ◼   ► totally off base is that it was like

01:13:32 ◼   ► what was it 30 $38 or 32 years that's

01:13:35 ◼   ► the way over 38 somebody but it seemed

01:13:37 ◼   ► to me like it if you were on the inside

01:13:39 ◼   ► you got it you know if you there is one

01:13:42 ◼   ► of the banks that was doing the IPO you

01:13:43 ◼   ► you got it 38 bucks and if you jumped on

01:13:46 ◼   ► it right when the bell rang if you can

01:13:47 ◼   ► get your trade-in then you are getting

01:13:49 ◼   ► it at the same price that seems fair to

01:13:52 ◼   ► me

01:13:52 ◼   ► yep yeah its own people want people

01:13:55 ◼   ► wanted to double that seems to me like

01:13:57 ◼   ► you're saying that it's cooked in favor

01:13:59 ◼   ► of the banks who got it at the price

01:14:01 ◼   ► before it doubled yes that's it that's

01:14:03 ◼   ► exactly right i mean my my take on it is

01:14:05 ◼   ► is exactly pretty much what you said

01:14:07 ◼   ► that this you know that the perception

01:14:09 ◼   ► of it is not the reality the reality is

01:14:11 ◼   ► that Facebook made as much money as

01:14:13 ◼   ► possible as they could have off of an

01:14:15 ◼   ► IPO and say you know say they had priced

01:14:18 ◼   ► it at 15 or something and then you know

01:14:22 ◼   ► it opened at 35 that would have been it

01:14:24 ◼   ► wow you know everyone's like wow there's

01:14:26 ◼   ► so much demand for that this these

01:14:28 ◼   ► facebook shares whatever but Facebook

01:14:29 ◼   ► would have made actually half the money

01:14:31 ◼   ► because they would have only sold you

01:14:34 ◼   ► know half and half as much half uh for

01:14:37 ◼   ► what they could have uh basically and so

01:14:39 ◼   ► Facebook came out very well from this

01:14:42 ◼   ► and and you know I think that they're

01:14:43 ◼   ► all looking at this right now and they

01:14:45 ◼   ► just don't care i mean they had to go

01:14:46 ◼   ► public it was kind of an annoying thing

01:14:48 ◼   ► for them to do for a while you know they

01:14:50 ◼   ► kind of rallied around rallied around at

01:14:52 ◼   ► the end and they did raise you know it

01:14:53 ◼   ► something like 16 billion dollars as a

01:14:56 ◼   ► result of it but they did as well as

01:14:58 ◼   ► they possibly could

01:14:59 ◼   ► it's a it's a loss really for you know

01:15:01 ◼   ► the people who are looking to get a what

01:15:04 ◼   ► typically happens at least with tech