00:00:01 ◼ ► We've only been going an arrant ten minutes on follow up on looking we have things that we theoretically sort of wanted [TS]
00:00:06 ◼ ► to talk about. I don't fancy our chances I don't know for ever going to get to anything. [TS]
00:00:11 ◼ ► I feel this is just one hundred percent follow up it feels like a very long time since we did this it has been a very [TS]
00:00:21 ◼ ► long time I think for us it's been almost three weeks since the last time we recorded because we recorded the last two [TS]
00:00:28 ◼ ► back to back so that's why I feel like it's been such a long time you know that you see like your wife every day [TS]
00:00:33 ◼ ► and every single little thing that happens in life can become a conversation but then [TS]
00:00:44 ◼ ► and there's like so many things you almost don't know what to talk about like what qualifies as being big enough [TS]
00:00:57 ◼ ► when you haven't seen another person you can't talk about the little things because they're not involved enough to care [TS]
00:01:05 ◼ ► So you just have to talk about the big things that three weeks is difficult because three weeks is that nothing really [TS]
00:01:13 ◼ ► but the little things all of a sudden same two little three weeks is probably the worst possible gap between talking to [TS]
00:01:22 ◼ ► and listen to our old podcasts like I made fun of you doing on the last show because I just I felt like I could not [TS]
00:01:30 ◼ ► remember at all what we talked about and then oh yes what a delightful conversation about like that was how go great. [TS]
00:01:37 ◼ ► I do enjoy listening to I am not going to lie I did enjoy listening to you talk about flags [TS]
00:01:47 ◼ ► but I thought wow that was really enjoyable I'd listen to that guy again you know in one of the last one cast I think [TS]
00:01:54 ◼ ► it was the last one. I jokingly said I'd be sitting by the pool in Morocco listening to a podcast. [TS]
00:02:03 ◼ ► and I was listening to a pod like there was kind of a reason for it because people pay people may not care [TS]
00:02:17 ◼ ► and once you put it together so I can have a quick listen and give you some ideas for titles and editing [TS]
00:02:23 ◼ ► and so I was listening to those before you had put it up so I felt like I had to listen to it I was hoping I was doing [TS]
00:02:29 ◼ ► Yeah and there's another sort of thing which I'm often maligned by my wife was kind of chuckling at my own jokes. [TS]
00:02:39 ◼ ► But just in general if I'm with people I say joke I have that I'll laugh after I say that I was sitting by the pole [TS]
00:02:46 ◼ ► and then I heard myself make the joke that I will be sitting by the pool the maraca this thing to the pod cast [TS]
00:02:57 ◼ ► and then I laughed at my snow joke because of the funniness of the fact that I was doing it. [TS]
00:03:05 ◼ ► and said the funniest thing just happened I was listening to the park and as I said the PA the poem [TS]
00:03:14 ◼ ► and then I laughed laughed at the joke of the joke of the joke so it was a bit like Inception I was laughing at this [TS]
00:03:21 ◼ ► joke about eight levels down and I just thought this is the most amazing thing ever and then she got on the phone [TS]
00:03:32 ◼ ► So I'm back live a good time in Morocco it was amazing. Yeah very hot it was very relaxing. [TS]
00:03:39 ◼ ► We were staying at this kind of quiet nice place which was quite quite grown up type place not many kids there [TS]
00:03:47 ◼ ► and then a few kids arrived one day with a family are the worst. Yeah I know these things happen. [TS]
00:03:52 ◼ ► So anyway two nights we were there they have got this open air cinema where they just set up some rugs [TS]
00:04:00 ◼ ► They play a movie was that I was going to play Casablanca and of course if you're in Morocco [TS]
00:04:09 ◼ ► and we're waiting for to it is going to be really lovely watching Casablanca under the stars in Morocco. [TS]
00:04:15 ◼ ► So we went and we laid we laid out on the head like these they have got these wireless headphones so it was nice. [TS]
00:04:21 ◼ ► It's a really nice thing and that would say the movie earlier in the week so we knew how lovely it was going to play [TS]
00:04:28 ◼ ► and they didn't tell anyone this but there was a delay starting and then we had to watch all these trailers [TS]
00:04:32 ◼ ► and all these things and then eventually that the film started and it wasn't Casablanca. [TS]
00:04:45 ◼ ► O'Day we've been looking forward to Casablanca I hadn't told anyone they were going to play Casablanca [TS]
00:04:50 ◼ ► and we are so lucky I took my headphones off and I sort of said to the people what was going on [TS]
00:04:56 ◼ ► and I said the kids went to the manager today and one of the kids went to the manager today [TS]
00:05:03 ◼ ► My managers that are OK and they didn't tell anyone that changed and they just played it and everyone had turned up [TS]
00:05:09 ◼ ► and light was sitting there a man took me with their glasses of wine waiting for the film [TS]
00:05:13 ◼ ► and then the different film started tell you there was some there are some quietly unhappy people there. [TS]
00:05:21 ◼ ► Oh man I went with another winning everything but. So we went back to the room and I I asked for the D.V.D. [TS]
00:05:35 ◼ ► We watch the first twenty minutes and got tired and fell asleep and said I will watch it tomorrow [TS]
00:05:43 ◼ ► Yeah that was a pretty exciting evening I was asked I can center the next morning the people come to the room [TS]
00:06:00 ◼ ► Because we're going to watch it tonight and I said oh we really need a back and I said you know I'm going to pack [TS]
00:06:05 ◼ ► and I we need it because we're going to play tonight on the big screen again and it wasn't a movie not that not [TS]
00:06:10 ◼ ► and it turns out so many people who had gotten their knickers in a twist about this. [TS]
00:06:14 ◼ ► There's been this huge mutiny and the manager had like realized the error of his ways [TS]
00:06:20 ◼ ► and they had to have another big move in the next night and they did show Casablanca [TS]
00:06:26 ◼ ► Very nice evening to have this thing about kids right because we're here because we don't have kids [TS]
00:06:47 ◼ ► and we were talking about having kids versus dogs and I thought the view was that had kids would get into if it is [TS]
00:06:53 ◼ ► and then say we were going to clip about kids not a single comment I was I was going to bring up the same thing I was [TS]
00:07:00 ◼ ► amazed. Not a single person complained about our comment that dogs are more responsibility than children. [TS]
00:07:07 ◼ ► Well you know I'm going to take is evidence that people who have dogs and children know that we are right about this [TS]
00:07:17 ◼ ► and it was like an international incident and then you may say but there's nothing about kids nothing. [TS]
00:07:25 ◼ ► but no I think it says something about how difficult children are relative to how difficult dogs are that's that's all [TS]
00:07:31 ◼ ► and that's why I think it's By that rationale because of all the outcry of your take your stuff that means you must [TS]
00:07:35 ◼ ► acknowledge that you take your stuff was wrong. Language stuff. Now I know it is a work both ways. [TS]
00:07:50 ◼ ► and sort of a challenge was thrown down to guess what Grey's daily checklist is because you won't reveal what's on your [TS]
00:08:00 ◼ ► Or you threw down a challenge to the listeners to try to guess what was on my checklist. [TS]
00:08:05 ◼ ► There were some guesses I did say some on the side. Did you have a look through them. [TS]
00:08:16 ◼ ► and his look his list is it continues on the metal beam because some of the items that he wrote for what he guessed was [TS]
00:08:27 ◼ ► Check previous day's list and carry over new business today to arrange today's list according to current needs. [TS]
00:08:33 ◼ ► Proofread today's list left justified today's LIST. Nice touch there to life stuff. Update list based on life stuff. [TS]
00:08:55 ◼ ► It's not too far off because I do use many lists to manage my other lists so it is general [TS]
00:09:02 ◼ ► but it is it is kind of right well done to delusion. The most accurate IF least specific list you could possibly make. [TS]
00:09:10 ◼ ► So all of the other people who are making a lot more serious guesses they were quite aware of the makeover there anyway [TS]
00:09:17 ◼ ► you know there are people people some people are on the Mark one of the things that I thought was funny was somebody [TS]
00:09:28 ◼ ► and somebody somebody replied to them that nobody would need to put breakfast on the list and then I chimed in [TS]
00:09:34 ◼ ► and said Actually I do have breakfast on my workflow that is one of the items. So this person was correct. [TS]
00:09:42 ◼ ► Even though other people were jumping in and telling him no that's too ridiculous nobody would put that on there [TS]
00:09:46 ◼ ► but I do I do have that on my list so I made up stories about my genius scientists who employ people to come [TS]
00:09:53 ◼ ► and remind them to age because they get so lost in their thoughts they forget to eight. You do that to you. [TS]
00:10:00 ◼ ► Now I'm not I'm not doing it because I'm not doing it because I'm a genius scientist that I was [TS]
00:10:12 ◼ ► nor diligent enough for the genius scientist route that is very hard I mean I mainly actually have that on my list [TS]
00:10:24 ◼ ► but I am very aware that my whole day is productivity is very sensitive to slight changes in the morning. [TS]
00:10:33 ◼ ► So I like things have to go very smooth when I first wake up to kind of getting into the office and starting work [TS]
00:10:46 ◼ ► and just do these things in this order every time to try to ease me into getting a good start on the day. [TS]
00:10:52 ◼ ► So that's why I do have breakfast on there but I don't have other meals that doesn't say don't forget about dinner. [TS]
00:10:58 ◼ ► It's like this is the order that I want to do things in all the time so that's not still haven't convinced me why you [TS]
00:11:06 ◼ ► I cannot going to get a little it's nothing it's nothing to do with the forgetting. [TS]
00:11:20 ◼ ► So this is this is just a way to encourage a little ritual in the morning which I find is beneficial to the whole day's [TS]
00:11:29 ◼ ► or get dressed on the list presumably you know where this is this is the thing with with us I mean we can find them [TS]
00:11:36 ◼ ► but what is breakfast what what is it about breakfast that gets it on the list that I put on my underpants. [TS]
00:11:42 ◼ ► Doesn't have that means it doesn't go on the list this is this is the art of checklists creation that's going to be a [TS]
00:11:51 ◼ ► book as well as creation there is if there is a book if I can remember a time I had the. [TS]
00:12:02 ◼ ► Probably mentioned inaudible at some point but it is the Checklist Manifesto by a tool guy one day who's a doctor. [TS]
00:12:09 ◼ ► Very interesting book and it talks about how do you make checklists in different environments [TS]
00:12:15 ◼ ► and one of the things that he talked about is for example prepping surgery patients. [TS]
00:12:21 ◼ ► So what you need to have a checklist of what is going to happen to prep someone for say open heart surgery [TS]
00:12:27 ◼ ► and there's a real art in making a checklist that is effective and that you can't put everything on there [TS]
00:12:38 ◼ ► and that there are actual studies showing how often do things get forgotten or how often do things get messed up. [TS]
00:12:43 ◼ ► And if a checklist is too long people tend to go through it very automatically without really thinking about it [TS]
00:12:49 ◼ ► but of course if it's too short you end up with errors because you're leaving off things that you're assuming people [TS]
00:12:57 ◼ ► And but you want very obvious things on a checklist and he also talked about pre-flight checklist for airplanes. [TS]
00:13:08 ◼ ► or really boring until their preflight checklist is all of a sudden Brady perk up. That's all OK no go for launch. [TS]
00:13:19 ◼ ► That's Co Yeah that's when Check this become the checklists are never more cool than [TS]
00:13:28 ◼ ► but so it's an interesting book to read to talk about what what should be and should not be on this kind of list. [TS]
00:13:46 ◼ ► That's what I don't get like I I respect that you can't put too much on and you can't have too little. [TS]
00:13:51 ◼ ► I'm just surprised that you know any conflicts is is one that would make the list for for me it sounds. [TS]
00:14:00 ◼ ► But for me I am aware that breakfast is a bit of a trouble point because very often I will wake up [TS]
00:14:10 ◼ ► and I have learned from experience that this is dangerous because I feel like I don't need to eat right now. [TS]
00:14:17 ◼ ► Let me just start piddling around with some sort of work but it's not really work. [TS]
00:14:21 ◼ ► This is this is one area where I'm aware that things can go a little bit wrong so it is helpful to have a bit of a [TS]
00:14:26 ◼ ► nudge that says even if you don't feel like it just eat your standard breakfast now [TS]
00:14:35 ◼ ► So I do have on that checklist that while I am making breakfast I do create an additional checklist which is relevant [TS]
00:14:41 ◼ ► to the events that are going to happen in the day like that where that is that is a nice like let's get going on the [TS]
00:14:48 ◼ ► and breakfast is a sticking point whereas you never forget to brush your teeth because you just feel so disgusting as a [TS]
00:14:55 ◼ ► human being until you have done it so that there's no way you're not you're not going to do that [TS]
00:15:00 ◼ ► but you have to use an electric toothbrush electric toothbrushes are a recent addition to the great household [TS]
00:15:21 ◼ ► or something has like been most life changing for a little and I was amazed by the number of people he said. [TS]
00:15:27 ◼ ► Electric toothbrush. And I've been thinking about one for a long time so I took the plunge and got one. [TS]
00:15:51 ◼ ► I read all the reviews and the sonic it did look good for various reasons I went for this other one. [TS]
00:16:00 ◼ ► My wife decided that we were going to convert to electric toothbrushes and so this just happened [TS]
00:16:08 ◼ ► and here's how I know that this is a thing that has become part of my life without me really noticing because at first [TS]
00:16:13 ◼ ► I was all unreasonably grumpy about this change for no apparent reason I don't know about this I have to charge my [TS]
00:16:20 ◼ ► toothbrush I have enough things in my life I need to charge I don't I don't need to charge something like a tooth brush [TS]
00:16:33 ◼ ► It sort of tickles it takes a little while to get used to it and then the feeling goes away [TS]
00:16:50 ◼ ► when I used it it felt like I was brushing my teeth with a twig with some leaves on it I think. [TS]
00:16:58 ◼ ► How did I ever use this barbaric tool before like you don't even feel remotely clean. [TS]
00:17:07 ◼ ► I think I'm just moved a whole bunch of junk around and possibly made my mouth dirtier than it was before. [TS]
00:17:14 ◼ ► So I cannot go back to what it was you go to an electric toothbrush there is no turning back. [TS]
00:17:21 ◼ ► You can never you can never reverse as bad at least that that's my feeling I have used a normal tooth brush are you [TS]
00:17:29 ◼ ► but man it makes brushing your tastes like fun I really look forward to it like I am now brushing my teeth once a week [TS]
00:17:44 ◼ ► It does it makes it fun like I want I want to do it for longer like it's like just give me another minute [TS]
00:17:50 ◼ ► or two brushing my taste this is it's like how the shredder has made a paper away from the electric toothbrush has made. [TS]
00:18:03 ◼ ► I'm surprised that you would have taken converting you know you know this you know this who the tech guy that most [TS]
00:18:26 ◼ ► and I honestly I always about electric toothbrushes were a gimmick I thought this is just the company needs to sell [TS]
00:18:40 ◼ ► and that this is just some some little gimmick thing so I never considered them as being genuinely better but in the. [TS]
00:18:47 ◼ ► But they really do feel much much better so yes I did need convincing because I was valuing simplicity [TS]
00:18:53 ◼ ► and I like that I didn't want another yet another thing that I have to charge which I do find irritating. [TS]
00:18:58 ◼ ► Yeah that is one part of this at least if not I think this is something with the this is a small irritation in the [TS]
00:19:12 ◼ ► and they have you can't have a regular wall socket in the bathroom you know in the U.K. [TS]
00:19:19 ◼ ► You have these wimpy wimpy little shaving sockets and maybe one if you're lucky but. [TS]
00:19:27 ◼ ► and so I still don't like the fact that I have to have a little charging station for my tooth brush in my office [TS]
00:19:33 ◼ ► because there's no other place to put it so I don't like that thumbs down on that I would like there to be wireless [TS]
00:19:45 ◼ ► I know I think we're I think we're OK it would only cause a few hundred extra deaths a year [TS]
00:19:49 ◼ ► and I think for the convenience of eating I would have to trace back in the time it's worth it. [TS]
00:19:54 ◼ ► It would cause no extra death was in the electrical code if they like what they buy. [TS]
00:20:00 ◼ ► At the lower that you can have these four power sockets in the bathroom because they're overly cautious we have full [TS]
00:20:04 ◼ ► power sockets in America you don't hear about rashes of people dying is this is what we have circuit breakers you don't [TS]
00:20:10 ◼ ► hear about it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. OK Let me let me let me google something Hold on a moment. [TS]
00:20:17 ◼ ► How many people die from electrocution in the United States every year. In the bathroom. [TS]
00:20:35 ◼ ► You don't have to go through every individual story I'm hoping for sort of an overarching statistic. [TS]
00:20:40 ◼ ► Yeah and I understand that but I'm just trying to one of the top link is nothing to do with the number of deaths. [TS]
00:20:51 ◼ ► OK let's try something else here I can't even find anything it's just time on the road it would let us know they will. [TS]
00:21:02 ◼ ► I'm going to assume that basically got right with you sometimes as terrifying pictures of things as I was growing [TS]
00:21:28 ◼ ► This this interlude of great giggling something on Helen Today is brought to you by Dr Pepper. [TS]
00:21:40 ◼ ► Yeah I'm going to basically this is so infrequent as to not be mentioned like I'm saying all this is it's about injury [TS]
00:21:48 ◼ ► from electric shock just in the household in general I'm seeing almost nothing about death from electric shock I read [TS]
00:21:53 ◼ ► are you not of the electricians. I refuse to believe that Americans are killing themselves in their bathrooms there. [TS]
00:22:02 ◼ ► and there are a lot of them there are a lot of them yes now I'll be curious We'll see if we can find some actual [TS]
00:22:08 ◼ ► or some some intrepid listener can find some actual statistics about deaths in the bathroom accidental from electricity. [TS]
00:22:19 ◼ ► That's my guess I'm betting is large but we will see. So I'm looking at a list here of things and follow up. [TS]
00:22:31 ◼ ► Today's sponsor is audible dot com a leading provider of spoken audio information and entertainment. [TS]
00:22:41 ◼ ► and indeed at the Checklist Manifesto How to get things right by to look one day is available on audible because they [TS]
00:22:48 ◼ ► have over a hundred thousand books to listen to so this is definitely my recommendation for this week. [TS]
00:22:54 ◼ ► If you are interested in the art of checklist creation or just a book that talks about the problems that can arise [TS]
00:23:01 ◼ ► when you have humans working in organizations how do you make sure that everyone in a hospital does what they need to [TS]
00:23:06 ◼ ► do. Or how do you make sure that everybody in an airline does what they need to do. This is the book to listen to. [TS]
00:23:15 ◼ ► and of course if you sign up to audible with us you get a free audio book to listen to. So if you want to listen to it. [TS]
00:23:24 ◼ ► and virtually every genre you'll find what you're looking for to get your free audio book [TS]
00:23:28 ◼ ► and thirty day trial today just sign up at Audible dot com slash hello internet. All one word. [TS]
00:23:34 ◼ ► That's all Bill dot com slash hello internet. Humble bragging. Oh OK I have to just talk about this for a little bit. [TS]
00:23:43 ◼ ► Since that came out I think you you kind of brought up the term I hadn't heard the term you know how you said on on [TS]
00:23:50 ◼ ► Twitter you are getting notifications of every single plane crash that ever occurs. [TS]
00:23:55 ◼ ► Yeah I also see that people treat you with just about every you ever use of the word freebooting. [TS]
00:24:01 ◼ ► So I experienced the same phenomenon where it seemed like everybody was tweeting me various humble brags I'm getting it [TS]
00:24:08 ◼ ► I'm maybe not as much as if I'm getting a lot of that back every time someone says. [TS]
00:24:13 ◼ ► Every time someone humble brags to Twitter a lot. Yeah and it's like people don't know what this word is. [TS]
00:24:21 ◼ ► I've seen several news stories of people showing me some humble brag and that's not a humble brag. [TS]
00:24:28 ◼ ► I think the fundamental thing about the humble brag is you are complaining about something in a way that makes you look [TS]
00:24:37 ◼ ► awesome. That is that is the key thing is this opposition. YORK your sensible complaint I don't. [TS]
00:24:45 ◼ ► I think you have to be complaining but I think you have to be saying something either negative [TS]
00:24:50 ◼ ► or something like it a whole new or it has to appear that the premise is something a little bit self-deprecating [TS]
00:25:01 ◼ ► But complaining is too specific but yes you are are describing yourself in a sensibly negative terms [TS]
00:25:08 ◼ ► but you're actually pumping yourself up as sort of which they are and there is a Twitter account [TS]
00:25:14 ◼ ► and it is just a humble brag. And what I like is it is an account that just read tweets people making humble brags. [TS]
00:25:28 ◼ ► There's no it doesn't suite itself it just retrieves other people that's class that's you know [TS]
00:25:33 ◼ ► and some of them are some of them are just they're just celebrities other people that that you might you might know [TS]
00:25:42 ◼ ► some who say if I was playing the fear in the me see if I can just find a couple examples of ones that I think are good [TS]
00:25:52 ◼ ► Stephen Fry and he says Oh dear I don't know what to do at the airport there's a huge crowd [TS]
00:26:03 ◼ ► Yeah I think this is an example of a humble brag that is a classic example because it's like oh there is this problem [TS]
00:26:13 ◼ ► but I'm talking about the enormous collection of people who are here because I am here that that is a humble brag. [TS]
00:26:20 ◼ ► There's another one here which I like I don't know who this perfect person is but it is a guy called David Garland [TS]
00:26:29 ◼ ► He says Oh That awkward moment when you go to bodybuilding dot com and the graphic on the left side is you [TS]
00:26:37 ◼ ► and a picture of bodybuilding dot com with it looks like his advertisement featuring his own shirtless picture on the [TS]
00:26:47 ◼ ► But he's presenting this as though it's so awkward that I'm on bodybuilding dot com I can't show my face in public like [TS]
00:26:55 ◼ ► that is what a humble brag as you know. Yes So I just I just want to mention that. [TS]
00:27:03 ◼ ► And so people I don't know to stop sending these things which I don't even know how to describe to describe them [TS]
00:27:15 ◼ ► but a brag may be done in a slightly roundabout way I don't I don't even know how to describe the thing that people are [TS]
00:27:21 ◼ ► sending me but I just found it infuriating that none of you think they're humble brags. [TS]
00:27:30 ◼ ► and isn't that great is a humble brag to say I have this legion of father was he keep tweeting me humble brags [TS]
00:27:39 ◼ ► and I'm going to banks you have over I would I would say I would say no because I feel like I'm not trying to build [TS]
00:27:51 ◼ ► myself up in that world like that like the bodybuilding dot com one is different you're trying to promote you're trying [TS]
00:27:57 ◼ ► to promote yourself. That sounds like it was a humble ad. If I thought it was a good example. [TS]
00:28:03 ◼ ► The thing I get sent a little bit I don't want to say I guess until the time I was sound like I'm bragging [TS]
00:28:09 ◼ ► and a little bit on Twitter is misuse of humble which is obviously where this whole conversation started with my little [TS]
00:28:23 ◼ ► and the thing that I find interesting is what they're doing is they're they're finding someone who tweeted it [TS]
00:28:34 ◼ ► but they just put me in as well they put Brady Haran and as well so they all say it [TS]
00:28:58 ◼ ► With that comment with that person's going why why are these people talking about me I think because I don't like I [TS]
00:29:04 ◼ ► don't reply or anything so I must just be a little weird moment in their life. Twitter is strange sometimes. [TS]
00:29:13 ◼ ► and I'm still going to have a few from from a long time ago which were from the Emmys. [TS]
00:29:25 ◼ ► There's another one here complaining why can't I look cool when I meet Tom Hanks and he hands me an Emmy. [TS]
00:29:32 ◼ ► and then there's a picture of them getting handed an Emmy by Tom Hanks these are all humble brag. [TS]
00:29:37 ◼ ► Get your act together people great doesn't want to hear your humble brags and that's that proper humble brags. [TS]
00:29:45 ◼ ► Well I was going to say way it was more you spoke for quite some time about the design of U.S. State flags. [TS]
00:30:03 ◼ ► and a mouse are probably were saved more a mouse not because I'm more popular because people realize they should email [TS]
00:30:11 ◼ ► Yeah I've now ignore those emails paypal so you can you can lay off and I was once he does [TS]
00:30:21 ◼ ► That's good because I become like this like filter like if someone if a mouse not wanting to offer you like a large sum [TS]
00:30:37 ◼ ► Maybe other that could be possible for both of us if it works out right I don't know tell me about what's been coming [TS]
00:30:47 ◼ ► Yeah yeah I was it was incredibly great discussion and I enjoyed listening to me talk about again [TS]
00:30:58 ◼ ► When I wanted to point out is people sense me two things in particular where people had redesigned the U.S. [TS]
00:31:07 ◼ ► State flags and I saw a whole bunch of these and I thought there were two that were interesting and worth mentioning [TS]
00:31:18 ◼ ► Yes you have to scroll down about one hundred times on this page I can looking at that a complex out there. [TS]
00:31:25 ◼ ► Yes scroll down scroll down there is just below. There's actually a slightly interesting thing here which is the U.S. [TS]
00:31:35 ◼ ► Yeah OK so this this first one is a look at the design project where they decided to do what is sort of the Australia [TS]
00:31:51 ◼ ► So can we do all of the flags and give them a similar look like I was like having a style guide. [TS]
00:32:00 ◼ ► They settled on a couple points the main one which is the most visually striking right away is that all of the flags [TS]
00:32:07 ◼ ► are going to be done in only three colors red blue and white. So the American colors and they picked. [TS]
00:32:16 ◼ ► There's a strange thing which is I always run into this whenever I use an American flag in my videos is the actual [TS]
00:32:40 ◼ ► and it almost looks strange because people aren't used to seeing it so dark I think most flags that people buy like on [TS]
00:32:45 ◼ ► a stick that you wave in a parade. Those I think those are just done brighter than they really are. [TS]
00:32:53 ◼ ► It's often some street they've just been lined up for various reasons so I actually often tweek the colors of the [TS]
00:33:02 ◼ ► and for my little America country girl I know I lightened up the colors on her skirt because it looked weird otherwise [TS]
00:33:12 ◼ ► I'm disappointed I think that because I am American I'm allowed to do it I wouldn't do it with some other country's [TS]
00:33:18 ◼ ► flag was like I'm American I'm going to you know America others up her own flag is not American enough sign of affray [TS]
00:33:30 ◼ ► but I went this route this redesign what they've done is they too have decided that the traditional colors are too dark [TS]
00:33:37 ◼ ► and they've gone with very bright blue very light bright blue and bright red color [TS]
00:33:43 ◼ ► and they have picked a few elements Stars and Stripes and tried to do all of the fifty flags with a unified look [TS]
00:34:04 ◼ ► Analogies that we're talking about things we're looking at other computers going to be a theme for those of you who [TS]
00:34:15 ◼ ► and is looking at the same thing on looking at my thoughts a kind of bland boring sameness I have to say [TS]
00:34:31 ◼ ► I imagine each on their own would be cool but when you see them all together it looks a bit too samey [TS]
00:34:37 ◼ ► and none of them catch my eye like I don't look look I want to thank Tex So look at one [TS]
00:34:42 ◼ ► and say California I just look at it and think there's a whole bunch of flags are all kind of similar. [TS]
00:34:51 ◼ ► Now first we have to we have to agree as all right thinking people do that almost anything is better than the current [TS]
00:35:02 ◼ ► But it's interesting because I would have expected that I would like this a lot more than I actually do [TS]
00:35:08 ◼ ► and I would almost have described something just like this if you had asked me what would you do with the flag if you [TS]
00:35:14 ◼ ► and I would think I would probably make all the exact same design decisions that this group has done as well. [TS]
00:35:19 ◼ ► Let's let's standardize the colors let's standardized design elements. I like a lot of these individual designs. [TS]
00:35:27 ◼ ► I mean of course obviously Maryland is made vastly inferior because Maryland has the best flag [TS]
00:35:32 ◼ ► and so you know they had to change all the colors of Maryland is like oh what a shame to lose that beautiful flag. [TS]
00:35:38 ◼ ► Is that the one they had the yellow and black cherry yellow and black checks with the red [TS]
00:35:49 ◼ ► So yes I was very interested by this design because I guess that I expected to like it a lot more than I actually do I [TS]
00:35:55 ◼ ► still think it is a great bit of design work and some of the if you go through all fifty. [TS]
00:36:00 ◼ ► If you are a flack not they've made some interesting choices about what the representation suit should be for various [TS]
00:36:05 ◼ ► states if you if you're familiar with the state at all I think it's interesting to see. [TS]
00:36:10 ◼ ► But I agree I think it's almost too bland and I wonder if fifty is just too many to try [TS]
00:36:16 ◼ ► and standardize Except now I'm going to send you the second link so here is the other thing I want to take a look at [TS]
00:36:22 ◼ ► and I mean this is winter is coming so I have done this using a motif of the pan as in Game of Thrones that sets the [TS]
00:36:36 ◼ ► They's a good so now I don't know if I've never seen Game of Thrones you have seen Game of Thrones I'm a big fan yes. [TS]
00:36:42 ◼ ► I'm assuming that this I will rely on you to to say that this is some there's some of the houses in the mirrors also [TS]
00:36:49 ◼ ► there for a fiver a bit more houses and each one has a very distinctive banner you know to take into battle [TS]
00:36:56 ◼ ► and they look just like these things and it becomes a big part of the House of stock have have these walls as [TS]
00:37:04 ◼ ► and things like that I think the House of Lannister is aligned on the plan of the house I think so yeah I think these [TS]
00:37:09 ◼ ► houses have a very distinctive my TAFE and these are these are the important part of the show done. [TS]
00:37:17 ◼ ► Along that does not like that they look you have a slip like that come out of the show this is to say someone's done a [TS]
00:37:25 ◼ ► or so it looks like it should be on a on a staff then carried by soldiers into battle and they are very very good. [TS]
00:37:33 ◼ ► I really impressed by the ace So this is my thought as well is that this game of thrones state flag redesign I love [TS]
00:37:52 ◼ ► and so I thought these two were an interesting comparison because I look at the first one I think I'll maybe fifty [TS]
00:37:57 ◼ ► flags is just too many to try to have them have it. Team but then there's this Game of Thrones one thing. [TS]
00:38:02 ◼ ► Boy is this awesome and they still look coherent but they're distinct enough from each other and I really like it. [TS]
00:38:11 ◼ ► I think some of them are just the state should just immediately adopt these designs. [TS]
00:38:15 ◼ ► I mean the thing is I mean part of the thing that makes stays consistent is is quite is almost more. [TS]
00:38:29 ◼ ► but it's also like they've got like a distressed miss to them like they look like they didn't have things you couldn't [TS]
00:38:36 ◼ ► That's part of what makes them cohesive Is that kind of pain that had like a filter almost for lack of a better sense [TS]
00:38:54 ◼ ► but I would still say what I think is interesting scrolling through them is to see that they clearly are using a [TS]
00:38:59 ◼ ► limited but wider color palette. Yes the yellows keep repeating the Greens the blues they are all in the same feel. [TS]
00:39:12 ◼ ► and I think almost every state would be improved immediately either by adopting the first one which is not my favorite [TS]
00:39:19 ◼ ► or immediately adopting any of King throw things style flags for their state like an echo them signals tonight again [TS]
00:39:31 ◼ ► when they were discussing the state facts last time I think we kind of I think we kind of I think I said [TS]
00:39:42 ◼ ► when they created they created by presumably governments and committees and things like that [TS]
00:39:47 ◼ ► and there are people pulling in different directions and each state would have had different pressures [TS]
00:39:53 ◼ ► and not only is each flag compromised that each flag has been compromised in subtly different ways and you end up. [TS]
00:40:04 ◼ ► when you look at all the flags of the nations of the world like on a big map why don't I have that problem [TS]
00:40:15 ◼ ► but they were very few duds very few fall into the traps that you would say the state flags to fall into [TS]
00:40:22 ◼ ► and there's no it's not like there are rules on international flags as far as I know. [TS]
00:40:38 ◼ ► You don't look at that and think we need to start again like you do with the state facts. [TS]
00:40:43 ◼ ► What has happened on this international level that didn't happen when the states come up with their flags. [TS]
00:40:55 ◼ ► but although the world flags look better as a bunch I don't know maybe there is less design by committee for the [TS]
00:41:06 ◼ ► I don't know if that's true I would say that there are definitely some duds on the world stage. They're not criminal. [TS]
00:41:11 ◼ ► Not many when you consider like you know international tastes and things like that. There are there are many bad ones. [TS]
00:41:21 ◼ ► and take a thorough look at what we can have a whole episode just on the world flags we can about their design that [TS]
00:41:32 ◼ ► I'd be up for that we'll do that sometimes with what I was actually you just remind me one more thing which is a lot. [TS]
00:41:41 ◼ ► So I nice looking north american to see what happens I don't care what one of us one of us needs repair. [TS]
00:41:54 ◼ ► OK underscoring a trick by the way I'm not like wetting myself in case you can hear that I cannot hear that. [TS]
00:42:02 ◼ ► You might imagine that there are there are no rules for flags about one hundred people after that episode must've sent [TS]
00:42:09 ◼ ► me this link to the North American Mexico logical Association which has a guideline called the five basic principles of [TS]
00:42:28 ◼ ► The checklist is that it's sort of it well if it is a it is guidelines guidelines is what I always find the world of [TS]
00:42:34 ◼ ► design really interesting and I think I need a break first before designing your flag. [TS]
00:42:48 ◼ ► and the suggestion is that it should be simple enough that a child could reproduce it from memory. [TS]
00:42:54 ◼ ► The second one is to use meaningful symbolism. The third is to use no more than three basic colors. [TS]
00:43:11 ◼ ► and then number five which relates to our discussion of the state flags is be distinctive or be related. [TS]
00:43:19 ◼ ► So either stand on your own or be connected to things that are similar to your own [TS]
00:43:23 ◼ ► and they go through they have a whole bunch of examples of good good design and bad design both with the colors [TS]
00:43:29 ◼ ► or with the simplicity you have or being able to being able to reproduce it from memory [TS]
00:43:35 ◼ ► and what I like is that they perfectly acknowledge that these are guidelines that you can still have good flags that [TS]
00:43:42 ◼ ► break these rules and what I absolutely love is the number one example of a flag that is hideous but still works. [TS]
00:43:50 ◼ ► Yes it is America and it is in Maryland. I laughed so hard when I saw that I thought well I'm not. [TS]
00:44:04 ◼ ► and then say By the way Number Six is you don't have to follow the previous five. You can't respect that. [TS]
00:44:19 ◼ ► and half those rules were not the most obvious thing in the world anyway like make sure your symbols have meaning. [TS]
00:44:25 ◼ ► Yeah thanks thanks for the advice I was about to put you know the planet Jupiter on my flag I don't know how until you [TS]
00:44:33 ◼ ► gave me that brilliant advice. You think this simple but most of the state flags ignore a bunch of those rules of war. [TS]
00:44:44 ◼ ► No child could ever possibly dry I would say half the flag for sale on points one through three immediately [TS]
00:44:51 ◼ ► and then be distinctive or be related nobody can agree there on what's happening with the flags. [TS]
00:44:56 ◼ ► So I mean they're just following rule number six which said you don't have to follow the rules you may be better. [TS]
00:45:03 ◼ ► I disagree you would think that I would be the one who would say you have to follow these rules [TS]
00:45:07 ◼ ► but this really is where I am endlessly fascinated by how design works and I don't understand it at all [TS]
00:45:12 ◼ ► and I you know I've read books on design and I find all the stuff really interesting [TS]
00:45:22 ◼ ► and I don't understand why things look good sometimes and why things don't look good. [TS]
00:45:28 ◼ ► I find this a fascinating topic and it just it seems obvious to me that there may be considerations [TS]
00:45:36 ◼ ► but somehow people can break these rules and stuff still works but how do you know when to break those rules. [TS]
00:45:42 ◼ ► I need a I need a checklist for rule breaking this utopia you know but that by that by definition can exist so anyway. [TS]
00:45:51 ◼ ► Well I want to just throw that in there because everybody sent it to me and I thought it was interesting. [TS]
00:46:00 ◼ ► It's an artistic bent and that is we have had a little bit more movement in the I mean we jokingly call a fan [TS]
00:46:07 ◼ ► but it's probably that's probably not the right word for creations from people who appreciate the show [TS]
00:46:14 ◼ ► and we think we've posted them on the sub Reddit previously and it's been a bit of chat on social media about it. [TS]
00:46:27 ◼ ► and associated animation music clip that went with it created by a couple of guys who we've kind of crossed paths with [TS]
00:46:37 ◼ ► alums who I who makes a lot of music for my videos. Wrote a jingle for the Bradys papercut segment and sent it to us. [TS]
00:46:52 ◼ ► And then he collaborated with I'm going to try and say this forgive me Newt I think is how you pronounce his name. [TS]
00:47:05 ◼ ► He animated them some and they put it together on You Tube So there's a pat Brady's pipe song and film and you star [TS]
00:47:16 ◼ ► and of course the robot gray and caveman Brady and a lot of people but I see a lot of people not including us. [TS]
00:47:32 ◼ ► and canoed who I think of in my head as getting into Phish since that's his deviant ART name. [TS]
00:47:38 ◼ ► Yes it does really cute little diagrams to go along with them so it was really great people to check it out [TS]
00:47:48 ◼ ► What do you think I mean it's funny that this connects to trial which started with those drawings [TS]
00:48:00 ◼ ► As the way of animating a service is become your official physical form in the animation which is this kind of glasses [TS]
00:48:15 ◼ ► What do you what do you think of this betrayal the glasses wearing robot that sounds about right. [TS]
00:48:20 ◼ ► The one wheel thing is a little weird I'm not sure how or how quite how I feel about that [TS]
00:48:23 ◼ ► but I can understand from a nation perspective why you would think that it makes it look more interesting [TS]
00:48:32 ◼ ► Basically it's very expressive robot and I like it does become very expressive in its movements and reaction [TS]
00:48:49 ◼ ► People end up embodying a character version of you and I don't know if this is exactly comparable [TS]
00:48:57 ◼ ► but do you have you ever seen or listened to the Ricky Gervais's show yes yes I did and I liked a lot back in the day. [TS]
00:49:04 ◼ ► So the number I'm thinking of is if I didn't follow this very closely but he he had a pod cast [TS]
00:49:19 ◼ ► Yes And so I feel that it's a similar interesting thing because I know with those three guys Ricky Gervais Steve [TS]
00:49:27 ◼ ► Merchant and Company thank you very much as blanking on his name and what they look like in real life [TS]
00:49:33 ◼ ► and then they have cartoon versions of themselves and it's a similar kind of thing it's sort of them [TS]
00:49:46 ◼ ► So I am fully in favor of the this kind of robot robot depiction of myself I guess [TS]
00:49:53 ◼ ► but I still feel like robots can look different whereas cave men. Everybody knows what a cave man looks like. [TS]
00:50:04 ◼ ► but the funny thing is like this caveman that version of me that canoe does is kind of this oafish you know is he over [TS]
00:50:16 ◼ ► but the funny thing is that he kind of is this oafish weird not you know I'm not appealing he's not like you dream man [TS]
00:50:24 ◼ ► and yet he is more attractive looking than I am so I'm actually quite happy with it because I think you may be a better [TS]
00:50:33 ◼ ► The that's the thing I find this because it's also been the second video that was made by another animator. [TS]
00:50:40 ◼ ► Yes And is it a hey I shouldn't say hey for some reason I think because I saw the name. [TS]
00:50:46 ◼ ► He O'Shea took a couple of little clips from the pod cast and animated them as well [TS]
00:50:52 ◼ ► and I found that really interesting to look at as well to see us talking you know with no intent no video intent [TS]
00:50:59 ◼ ► or anything seeing it turned into a video was quite something as you know was not that dusky is the name he took a [TS]
00:51:07 ◼ ► bunch of stuff and made a minute long animation out of it and I think it is adorable and surprisingly funny. [TS]
00:51:17 ◼ ► Yeah when you take the best bits of the show and just condense them down into one minute [TS]
00:51:21 ◼ ► and add some final animations along with it is probably only about one minute of funniness in the average. [TS]
00:51:28 ◼ ► Sounds about right on the right but I think it is condensed to one minute and save us a whole lot of trouble. [TS]
00:51:34 ◼ ► Yes maybe I have found I sound like I mean we've both been making these You Tube videos for long enough that we've [TS]
00:51:44 ◼ ► probably gotten used to people who enjoy them contacting us and doing nice things like drawing pictures [TS]
00:51:51 ◼ ► and things like that to a point where maybe it's no longer a huge novelty but it still looks nice [TS]
00:52:02 ◼ ► Mike I hope you know who take it like it's like it's like starting again from the very start because they're doing it [TS]
00:52:08 ◼ ► in different ways and they're drinking it in different ways and I have actually found that not really good fun. [TS]
00:52:16 ◼ ► The I think it's also partly just that the podcast is of much smaller scale and it feels much more intimate. [TS]
00:52:26 ◼ ► Yeah well both in the on the listener's end I mean I can understand that feeling that we've discussed before that [TS]
00:52:34 ◼ ► when you listen to someone on a podcast you feel like you get to know them really well even though you don't [TS]
00:52:40 ◼ ► and then we both are actively participating in the conversation that happens on Reddit after each one of these shows [TS]
00:52:46 ◼ ► and I feel like that is a big part of the show as well as the interaction afterward I mean a number of comments are [TS]
00:52:54 ◼ ► But it's very fun to interact and it's and it's fun to see to see this kind of feedback and [TS]
00:53:04 ◼ ► and engaged with the podcast feedback than I am with some of the video feed back to the video feed back just feels so [TS]
00:53:18 ◼ ► and there are places where I have consciously turned that off like I've discussed I don't really look at the You Tube [TS]
00:53:25 ◼ ► So it's just a different it's a different experience because it is been very fun seeing seeing the creation that people [TS]
00:53:32 ◼ ► or the things I have been surprised that are that are the little running jokes that happened on Twitter where people [TS]
00:53:42 ◼ ► but it's that same feeling of oh there's an ongoing little joke in this little corner of the Internet [TS]
00:53:49 ◼ ► and I really like and I have a lot the one thing I do want to clarify or correct from the paper cuts jingo. [TS]
00:54:00 ◼ ► But I I do not like it when people know that I have and followed them on Twitter. Oh yeah I am neutral on that. [TS]
00:54:12 ◼ ► and ask me why I haven't followed them like a stranger just for the just for the record because you know I could stick [TS]
00:54:18 ◼ ► with sticklers for that kind of thing here we are. You've written here. Brady Atlas. Oh yes I absolutely love this. [TS]
00:54:29 ◼ ► You saw this thing you know what I'm talking about I'm not sure I do. It's not OK it's not ringing a bell. [TS]
00:54:37 ◼ ► Did you see this image. All right hang on the color. Actually I had seen that. OK so I. [TS]
00:54:46 ◼ ► This this is one of my favorite Mima fied little things that I've seen so far which is it is a scene from Beauty [TS]
00:54:56 ◼ ► I think I think that's going to stand in the center image where someone it is guessed on the villain [TS]
00:55:02 ◼ ► but he is in his his wood house and there are antlers all across the walls from all of his his successful hunting's [TS]
00:55:09 ◼ ► and someone has just pasted your face over Stan's face who is sitting in his chair being very happy [TS]
00:55:14 ◼ ► and it just says I use antlers in all of my decorating and I think a picture is just great. [TS]
00:55:20 ◼ ► Briefly if I got this got quite a big laugh out of me. So yes who have ever made that thumbs up. [TS]
00:55:27 ◼ ► I reckon we can prove I thought it was great I got quite a laugh I showed it to my wife she really laughed [TS]
00:55:38 ◼ ► and your wife if you always misunderstand now because I know what a day you'll be giving each other knowing looks [TS]
00:55:45 ◼ ► and snickering behind my back I can I can never make you understand my position on this [TS]
00:55:50 ◼ ► or I think you just intentionally riling me how it is that I don't want to live in my house [TS]
00:55:56 ◼ ► Actually we were just discussing the other day that from the photos that we have seen you have. [TS]
00:56:10 ◼ ► and I said great what you think of my new trousers and you said well they could see you but I wouldn't wear them. [TS]
00:56:22 ◼ ► I mean it's so genuinely what you are refusing to understand what you think of my new video. [TS]
00:56:45 ◼ ► but people seem to call it Fan Art I don't know if it's fair or not but it's fun it's not quite like that. [TS]
00:56:51 ◼ ► I think I think people understand a concern. I know I do. I sometimes try to think of a better word to use than sand. [TS]
00:57:03 ◼ ► but then that's also weird I don't I don't like that word I mean Jesus had followers. He didn't have fans. [TS]
00:57:08 ◼ ► Yeah maybe it was fans that he wears and I would love to hear suggestions from people [TS]
00:57:14 ◼ ► but I don't know maybe this is maybe this is just the uncomfortable ness of being in this position because it doesn't [TS]
00:57:19 ◼ ► seem like other people have a problem with being fans I will use the word fan to describe myself for things that I [TS]
00:57:28 ◼ ► This episode of hello internet is brought to you by Squarespace the other one platform that makes it fast [TS]
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00:58:18 ◼ ► website that I wanted to change the look of and I wasn't quite sure how to do it on my own. [TS]
00:58:23 ◼ ► I ended up recording a little bit of my screen so I could show the support person what it was that I wanted [TS]
00:58:29 ◼ ► and a link to the dropbox file where they could see the little video that I had made that actual support human got back [TS]
00:58:39 ◼ ► and this was early in the morning London time which is middle of the night America time. [TS]
00:58:43 ◼ ► Their support team is so fast that a human will get back to you before your Dropbox file can even upload that you want [TS]
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00:59:25 ◼ ► I feel that we do need to follow up on your scathing unfair review of the movie was it unfair I don't think it was a [TS]
00:59:37 ◼ ► very well to do or I tell you what if it was unfair. I'll tell you what was unfair it was unfair of you. [TS]
00:59:49 ◼ ► and you would recommend not watching it to people that you assigned it I don't know what all of them although as you [TS]
01:00:05 ◼ ► but the whole reason I wanted to talk about is I thought it was an interesting it was an interesting movie to discuss [TS]
01:00:11 ◼ ► and there are definitely things that you can watch that you don't necessarily like [TS]
01:00:19 ◼ ► Well what value is a thumbs down if you still think people should watch the film. Well quit. [TS]
01:00:27 ◼ ► Well first of all the real value of that film wasn't listening to us discuss it later talking about what is the movie [TS]
01:00:35 ◼ ► to fully enjoy the section where we talk about the movie to fully appreciate our wit and banter. [TS]
01:00:45 ◼ ► You need to really watch the film in order to run that so I didn't I didn't tell people oh go watch this movie it's an [TS]
01:00:57 ◼ ► and that's what this was this was homework assigned to you to watch the movie and I wouldn't do this for a movie that. [TS]
01:01:09 ◼ ► and has no redeeming value because I say we because we want everyone to watch Transformers three. [TS]
01:01:22 ◼ ► but if I have no problem signing up for homework I feel like I feel no no conflict in this. [TS]
01:01:32 ◼ ► but I I think the number scales for movies can get weirdly arbitrary fast it's hard to it's hard to know what you know [TS]
01:01:41 ◼ ► as fast as your sky or where you are either in the category of the Raiders of the Lost Ark and Citizen Kane [TS]
01:01:52 ◼ ► You take in the great quest of the cation system is on the exact same level as the Transformers movies it's in. [TS]
01:02:04 ◼ ► Oh now explain that I don't have got a grading system that you're not telling me about what's going on here. [TS]
01:02:13 ◼ ► All right at the top the thumbs up thumbs down thing is a question of of expectations about a movie it is the whole [TS]
01:02:21 ◼ ► point of it is to not rank all of the movies from Citizen Kane to Transformers that is a fundamentally meaningless [TS]
01:02:28 ◼ ► endeavor to give you an example of OK here's a movie you know the movie Armageddon with Bruce Willis from the late [TS]
01:02:37 ◼ ► ninety's. I've been thinking about that family because I just made a video about the probe that's gone to the comma. [TS]
01:02:52 ◼ ► but because I think it is better than no you know if you know what I'm trying I don't. [TS]
01:03:03 ◼ ► My feeling of the thumbs up thumbs down thing is you are looking at a movie. It is called Armageddon. [TS]
01:03:30 ◼ ► Honest to God I get emotionally moved at the president's speech at the end of the movie every time I think it is a [TS]
01:03:37 ◼ ► great I want to cheer their presence on the yeah you're right you know every impossible reach for the stars that [TS]
01:03:42 ◼ ► brought a story like this is great her like i'm glad i think i don't know it's totally down. [TS]
01:03:49 ◼ ► but the movie just movies are so funny in this way that that they can sometimes sweep you away despite despite yourself [TS]
01:04:03 ◼ ► Boy nothing is even remotely scientifically accurate in this movie or these things would never happen this way. [TS]
01:04:11 ◼ ► The ridiculous training montage in Armageddon you know what I love it every time it's stupid what are they even doing [TS]
01:04:23 ◼ ► and other movies don't if I give that movie a thumbs up. It is successful at being what it is. [TS]
01:04:28 ◼ ► So you're saying it's a bit like if Tiger Woods shoots around the Gulf in seventy six. [TS]
01:04:35 ◼ ► and if I got around a ninety five I've had a miracle day so I deserve more credit than Tiger Woods for exceeding [TS]
01:04:42 ◼ ► expectations. I have I don't know what any to make them to start of the Senate and anything. [TS]
01:04:53 ◼ ► Because you're saying like it's like if a little kid makes a finger painting you say well done [TS]
01:05:02 ◼ ► You're like well that's just not as good as your usual stuff because I say thumbs down here where the kid gets a thumbs [TS]
01:05:08 ◼ ► up. Now kids are different kids are different I've never seen a kid do something impressive. [TS]
01:05:16 ◼ ► I've seen better paintings in that kid though a look at this is great no it isn't it's not good. [TS]
01:05:21 ◼ ► I feel it's so clear in my mind the only other thing that I would want to add to the thumbs up thumbs down thing is a [TS]
01:05:26 ◼ ► Like the bunch of movies you just don't care I don't like your problem with her is that it was nearly a it was nearly [TS]
01:05:36 ◼ ► and because it didn't quite get your like SAG Well I don't want anything to do with you old [TS]
01:05:41 ◼ ► and because you because you were nearly great whereas because Armageddon wasn't nearly great you're like OK well you [TS]
01:05:47 ◼ ► didn't you didn't you didn't tase me. That's not that's that's not too inaccurate. [TS]
01:05:52 ◼ ► I find that stuff more frustrating the almost perfect stuff is way more frustrating than just total garbage that you [TS]
01:06:00 ◼ ► Or things that are indifferent and so yes I think for me a movie like that it is aiming very high [TS]
01:06:11 ◼ ► and so Thumbs Down movie some down of course handing by it of course the reason you watch this film in the first place [TS]
01:06:24 ◼ ► when I think of what I saw I saw people in the road ask about that because we didn't bring that we did mention that [TS]
01:06:34 ◼ ► I'll tell you something else about halfway back in a minute but let's see what Mrs Gray thought. [TS]
01:06:44 ◼ ► and her as did as did a number of her opinion was she just thought I was being too kind. [TS]
01:07:00 ◼ ► And I said on the right that which I think is true is that her son's down makes my thumbs down look like an [TS]
01:07:23 ◼ ► and want to have all of you had almost just an inarticulate ball of rage at this movie as well as a as a ho as a woman [TS]
01:07:31 ◼ ► who is not only in a relationship is married to I'm ashamed I have to respect her opinion. [TS]
01:07:37 ◼ ► Do you know what my wife pointed out something that neither of us noticed about the film which I think makes it even [TS]
01:07:43 ◼ ► clever she thinks the fact that Scarlett Johannson ended up being like she was that kind of Hi How you doing girlfriend. [TS]
01:07:54 ◼ ► touching rather than object or a mouse or a tree and read you going to be at the shops at three thirty P.M. [TS]
01:08:01 ◼ ► and the fact that that's what Scarlett Johanson became is actually the beauty of the operating system the operating [TS]
01:08:09 ◼ ► systems become adapted to the people they were serving and became the people they're saving Nate and [TS]
01:08:19 ◼ ► and has just coming out of a break up exactly what sia donated at that time was just like a girlfriend. [TS]
01:08:31 ◼ ► Because when you see the relationship between Amy Adams and her operating system that she uses in her time of need. [TS]
01:08:40 ◼ ► Harris is like a body like a mate and my wife is saying and that's exactly what women are like [TS]
01:08:48 ◼ ► They kind of just want like a mate to they can joke around with and talk about how rubbish men [TS]
01:08:53 ◼ ► and that's exactly what an operating system becomes famous Adams Theodore like man you know kind of a bit more. [TS]
01:09:00 ◼ ► I kind of I think you know you seek a new relationship and want to feel loved and attractive [TS]
01:09:05 ◼ ► and that's exactly what his operating system became And there's another hint to that earlier in the film [TS]
01:09:18 ◼ ► Dating dating process and he's going through all the voices and he's skipping all the certain genres of women [TS]
01:09:25 ◼ ► and then there's a certain one comes on that takes his fancy and eat and he talks to that one [TS]
01:09:30 ◼ ► and that one is very much like what Scarlett Johannson becomes so it's almost like earlier in the film they're setting [TS]
01:09:37 ◼ ► up the idea that the operating system is already going to know what he wants and what appeals to him [TS]
01:09:42 ◼ ► and mold itself to that earlier history and I thought that was an interesting observation. [TS]
01:09:47 ◼ ► Whether it's Russian I don't know but it was something we didn't discuss you know we didn't discuss it [TS]
01:09:51 ◼ ► but I thought that was I mean that was the whole point of the the set up process like Johanson is based on those [TS]
01:10:00 ◼ ► Yes I know we talked about the fact that it taps to him but in such a specific way. [TS]
01:10:05 ◼ ► But the stuff with Amy Adams passed me by the fact that her relationship to the operating system was completely [TS]
01:10:10 ◼ ► different and much more. Anyway development another there are operating systems that totally hate their users. [TS]
01:10:19 ◼ ► Yeah as background I'm not for everybody but there are a few people recommended things to watch that we should watch. [TS]
01:10:27 ◼ ► Afterwards one of them was a series of television programs that had a while ago in the U.K. [TS]
01:10:34 ◼ ► and That they're produced by a guy called Charlie Brooker who I'm a really big fan of his his writing [TS]
01:10:41 ◼ ► and he was behind the series called Black Mirror which was a series of sort of forty five minute programs each [TS]
01:10:50 ◼ ► self-contained and each a kind of little pace sort of other reflecting society on looking forward on society [TS]
01:10:58 ◼ ► and looking at some of the darker aspects of society hence the Black Mirror and obviously I had seen them before. [TS]
01:11:10 ◼ ► Yeah I hadn't seen them and this was well done in the Reddit where people recommended them [TS]
01:11:17 ◼ ► but this is exactly what you should do if you want we actually want something they recommended something [TS]
01:11:22 ◼ ► but basically didn't describe it at all because that that is not what I really want in a recommendation [TS]
01:11:32 ◼ ► and so in the discussion I noticed that a whole bunch of people mentioned Black Mirror [TS]
01:11:42 ◼ ► and I happen to have one night to myself for I thought all the people mentioned this the other day I'm tired of doing [TS]
01:11:50 ◼ ► the work. Let me let me try this out and I don't know the try the broker was involved I knew nothing about this. [TS]
01:11:56 ◼ ► I just put it on and I thought these were. Rates they were they were really really captivating. [TS]
01:12:07 ◼ ► Yes I I watched all of them over the course of two days I just basically binged it especially because these are these [TS]
01:12:14 ◼ ► are episodes it's really like almost like a modern Twilight Zone this is the closest thing that I can say [TS]
01:12:20 ◼ ► and if you know that you also know that knowing anything about any of the episodes would just totally ruin it [TS]
01:12:31 ◼ ► and so I thought well I have to watch all of them right now because I'm just going to be worried that I'm going to [TS]
01:12:38 ◼ ► But I've started watching should we not talk about it too much now and maybe set a voluntary homework [TS]
01:12:45 ◼ ► and talk about another time or do you want to talk about them now because I haven't. [TS]
01:12:50 ◼ ► Having said what you just said that people shouldn't be told about them before watching it. [TS]
01:13:03 ◼ ► and watch like we'll talk about it so part of the plot laughed at me or the people of this piece back in six hours. [TS]
01:13:14 ◼ ► People said they were listening and we got to the hair part I posed and went and watched [TS]
01:13:18 ◼ ► and then came back in this into the second half of the podcast I can see that people have the self-restraint to do that [TS]
01:13:23 ◼ ► and I'm quite surprised so I know I guess this does not mean we can talk about some of the episode a little bit later [TS]
01:13:31 ◼ ► but the the one that I just I think it is worth following up. Is it an episode called Be back soon and I think it is. [TS]
01:13:40 ◼ ► Episode one of season two. Probably haven't watched that one that I haven't watched series to I'll come on. [TS]
01:13:47 ◼ ► Yeah sorry man I watched season one and I even write what I sent you the titles of the ones to watch. [TS]
01:13:53 ◼ ► What did you think was going on. Now forget now we have to stop. OK now it is homework. Thank you. [TS]
01:14:06 ◼ ► but I saw that this is not that mirror anymore by the way I've run this is the movie I have saying that may be quite [TS]
01:14:13 ◼ ► long ago now that I saw that when it was quite nice. My memory of it is hazy but that's OK. [TS]
01:14:19 ◼ ► Others I mentioned briefly that I think it is interesting follow up this is the other thing there were two things that [TS]
01:14:29 ◼ ► when trying to recommend it I think people just don't aren't sensitive to how little information can be spoilers. [TS]
01:14:39 ◼ ► and I am cursed with this terrible memory in general but I can remember every So every single scene in a trailer [TS]
01:14:48 ◼ ► and then when I watched the movie My brain is just counting down the scenes that I haven't seen yet [TS]
01:14:53 ◼ ► and I have just had that ruined so many movies for me where I just seen a single freaking clip [TS]
01:14:58 ◼ ► and then it just rushes everything like Attack The Block with an alien movie takes place in the U.K. [TS]
01:15:08 ◼ ► and then the whole movie I'm waiting for that frame which of course is that the editors anyway. [TS]
01:15:13 ◼ ► It's amazing what can ruin a film tell you because sometimes people just saying I love the film it's got like such a [TS]
01:15:23 ◼ ► when you're watching it you could have a really bad ending happening so I want that to still be on the table [TS]
01:15:32 ◼ ► but the frustrating thing of people saying oh this is a great movie and it has a twist. [TS]
01:15:36 ◼ ► That's a spoiler but telling someone there's a twist is ruining the twist it doesn't matter. [TS]
01:15:41 ◼ ► Heaven forbid if they were the people who recommended moon a little too much information in those recommendations [TS]
01:16:03 ◼ ► At the end of the last of her where you have the voices in movies that are computers are generally the villains [TS]
01:16:11 ◼ ► or computers are usually the villains in movies and moon did a very interesting take on that [TS]
01:16:19 ◼ ► and the brief set up is that there is a guy and he is working on this moon base all by himself [TS]
01:16:24 ◼ ► and there is a robot that is working along side of him and the robot is Kevin Spacey [TS]
01:16:29 ◼ ► and basically this movie I thought did a really good job of using your expectation that the robot is going to be the [TS]
01:16:42 ◼ ► You are waiting for this robot voiced by Kevin Spacey which is voiced in this very monotone way to turn evil. [TS]
01:17:04 ◼ ► or computer movies is the other comical the absurd moment where the the computer outgrows programming [TS]
01:17:11 ◼ ► or you know like suddenly develops feelings or something dumb like that and I think well I guess it's not a robot [TS]
01:17:22 ◼ ► What I really liked in Moon was that they kept things consistent that from the robot's perspective it was programmed to [TS]
01:17:32 ◼ ► And it turns out that it is assisting the main character in in a way that seems to be operating against what is there [TS]
01:17:38 ◼ ► to do but I thought it was handled perfectly the robot never does anything inconsistent. [TS]
01:17:43 ◼ ► Yeah things like Oh my my job is is to help the main character and that's what I'm going to do [TS]
01:17:51 ◼ ► and it's it was a really kind of touching little emotional response to this robot especially because that movie. [TS]
01:18:00 ◼ ► Again highlighted in some ways the robot isn't different but he is also just there to help [TS]
01:18:08 ◼ ► I liked it I thought it was good very very good film. Do you know what that's there and a follow up. [TS]
01:18:17 ◼ ► Actually I actually I don't if you want to talk about this I have a question for you. [TS]
01:18:21 ◼ ► Wow And you're a great journalist journalist you don't have to answer that you don't want to but I am curious. [TS]
01:18:29 ◼ ► I'm you know people. Suddenly everything is turned right around it's like the robots have grown. I'm curious. [TS]
01:18:49 ◼ ► but there are there are there are certain words I say that people would consider a swear word [TS]
01:18:58 ◼ ► and have never said not even once so I am I am curious as to why this is or what is what is your reasoning behind this. [TS]
01:19:07 ◼ ► They each know that Congress is no reasoning like the reason I don't do it now I suspect liken taken straight into the [TS]
01:19:20 ◼ ► My wife sometimes I go on just say you know what I am aware as you say the word I am going to say just once for me [TS]
01:19:32 ◼ ► and I'm just like no I don't do it because once I do like I can't I've lost that little I've lost the streak of having [TS]
01:19:43 ◼ ► Yeah I guess I mean you know I was probably I was probably a good boy and tell him not to swear when I was young [TS]
01:19:49 ◼ ► He just listened and you know my my mum was a formidable person so I would probably would not at least. [TS]
01:20:01 ◼ ► and you know of all the of all the things that most things I was told not to do was a little boy I did eventually [TS]
01:20:11 ◼ ► So that's where you know there are some words like I said there are some words that would be classified as a swear word [TS]
01:20:24 ◼ ► when making podcasts Apple has a requirement that you label a podcast explicit if certain words are spoken [TS]
01:20:31 ◼ ► but there is no official list anywhere. Leave it up to you because I know what the words are. [TS]
01:20:41 ◼ ► We should probably talk about this to say that you know that I have recently had issues with comments on the videos [TS]
01:20:48 ◼ ► were outside of that I've had enough of people being abusive to my contributors and doing inappropriate things. [TS]
01:20:57 ◼ ► but there is a mechanism on You Tube where you can create a blacklist of words that come to eventing [TS]
01:21:06 ◼ ► So I've been doing a bit of testing of that to see whether or not that will help some of these problems in the bud. [TS]
01:21:13 ◼ ► but if words on this list appear now come to May first just to to take to make sure they're not being used in a way [TS]
01:21:27 ◼ ► So as as a result of doing that I'm having to keep a list of words which I'm constantly adding to [TS]
01:21:33 ◼ ► and as I look at comments and look at the way that people can be abusive in the things they say [TS]
01:21:42 ◼ ► and add them to this list so I can come up with this list of you know what words of flight were unacceptable words [TS]
01:21:51 ◼ ► Some of them can be unacceptable in strange ways and could be very specific to the people in the video. [TS]
01:22:00 ◼ ► So I have got this list of just called up now and I can't rate it because the words other words I wouldn't say [TS]
01:22:11 ◼ ► and I've got them on a sticky note at the moment one of those happens I think if anyone ever comes it might stick in X. [TS]
01:22:16 ◼ ► I've got this one sticking off to the side which is just this stream of stream of every rude word you could think of I [TS]
01:22:33 ◼ ► There are a few other words so it's an interesting person who does not swear has a constant visual reminder of all of [TS]
01:22:41 ◼ ► that and is like copying and pasting this list everywhere and rating over time and saying [TS]
01:22:46 ◼ ► and I guess I still I still feel a bit unsatisfied with your answer though is it is it entirely just the streak you [TS]
01:22:59 ◼ ► Do you know what I'm really struggling to answer not for lack of not not out of any kind of cautiousness [TS]
01:23:08 ◼ ► or privacy it's just I mean I think I think for a lot of people swear words are just words they say [TS]
01:23:18 ◼ ► when they can't think of something better to say that that's not that doesn't mean I think I'm like you know too clever [TS]
01:23:35 ◼ ► when I was making a joke because it could it could add a certain amount of impact to funniness But so there is a part [TS]
01:23:41 ◼ ► of me that thinks the swearing is like unnecessary because I can usually think of what I want to say without swearing [TS]
01:23:48 ◼ ► but what kind of an answer tonight. I think I'm fairly kind of moral and you know you think it is immoral. [TS]
01:24:00 ◼ ► Well no no I don't think it's immoral to swear. All of my friends swear and I think well you swear words are funny. [TS]
01:24:07 ◼ ► I'm never offended by other people swearing at all as this is what I am sometimes suddenly self-conscious around you. [TS]
01:24:15 ◼ ► If we meet up. You hardly ever swear you are of your very last where really I feel like I am. [TS]
01:24:29 ◼ ► when you swear I even notice that you swore that's how you do notice so I should feel that I don't notice that I don't [TS]
01:24:34 ◼ ► when a lot of my other friends swear because I swear all the time that you do a certain frequency that's like our greatest [TS]
01:24:40 ◼ ► wear hats or does not like it I think it really is just Strake. I think it is just like it's like a novelty. [TS]
01:24:53 ◼ ► and if you drop a hammer on your toe that's not those was never occurred to me to say. [TS]
01:24:58 ◼ ► Like people always say that I can believe in you hell you so if you don't swear. Well it's like that never. [TS]
01:25:06 ◼ ► or Galileo just because they are the words that come then who is that automatically come to me I don't think the swear [TS]
01:25:15 ◼ ► So I don't think it's like the natural thing to do I think it's a learned I think swear words are a learned thing [TS]
01:25:20 ◼ ► and and because I haven't learned I don't I don't know but I don't. Have a problem with. [TS]
01:25:42 ◼ ► and if i swear i'm suddenly aware of a rise you to guidance where you know it might be in your head you have a little [TS]
01:25:48 ◼ ► moral checklist you go marital Absolutely and I know and trust me I have many many vices that are worse and swearing [TS]
01:26:11 ◼ ► I don't encourage I don't encourage it and I don't think it would encourage like you know a child to start swearing [TS]
01:26:21 ◼ ► I'm not like you know somebody's goody two shoes person who thinks Swearing is a bad thing. [TS]
01:26:26 ◼ ► I just happen to not do it just like I think a lawn bowls is a perfectly legitimate sport [TS]
01:26:32 ◼ ► but I just I play so well that I would watch on T.V. I don't know much about lawn bowls. [TS]
01:26:47 ◼ ► Well and that was that was her thinking that if you told me you must tell me your advice [TS]
01:26:55 ◼ ► Well I mean you know there are some questions that people just said but you know you brought it back [TS]
01:26:59 ◼ ► when you weren't happy with the answer the first time I went What was the worst vice that you'd be willing to admit on [TS]
01:27:11 ◼ ► I would I would happily stop swearing if it meant I was able to have the self-control to not eat rubbish that is a [TS]
01:27:17 ◼ ► boring face. Thumbs down. I want a different vice a little gluttony as not interesting. [TS]
01:27:34 ◼ ► when we're off the air I want to hear about the worst life that you will what's the worst advice you did me too [TS]
01:27:44 ◼ ► I don't know I think I think maybe it's a problem with the word vice I don't know I mean I've got a huge cocaine [TS]
01:27:51 ◼ ► problem if I want to get fat is exactly what I'm interested in. All right now let's talk about the life. [TS]
01:28:00 ◼ ► All I did and I didn't really think about the past but if you want to hear about that that's my that's my mind. [TS]
01:28:12 ◼ ► What's your worst boss I don't know I'm not sure I I think I am suddenly realizing that this is a problem with the word [TS]
01:28:24 ◼ ► and those those are the things I would often say I dislike about myself the most is is [TS]
01:28:37 ◼ ► or you know maybe I can end up sometimes playing video games longer than I should. That's that's kind of a got me vice. [TS]
01:28:47 ◼ ► You know I don't do cooking them so I don't want to clear that up just in case people are thinking that we have just in [TS]
01:28:55 ◼ ► case this is tentative evidence I do not take drugs. You know I've never even smoked a cigarette. [TS]
01:29:05 ◼ ► I am shockingly boring in this way I have I have never done any illegal drugs and I have never smoked cigarettes [TS]
01:29:19 ◼ ► and that was never profitable so I will say also I was never cool enough in high school to be in a whole picture. [TS]
01:29:41 ◼ ► and yeah not a lot of underage drinking and smoking cigarettes and doing blow at the library the rest of a lot of my [TS]
01:29:50 ◼ ► and your parent your parents are not really worried about you I'm really worried about him you know he's just all he's [TS]
01:29:54 ◼ ► doing is reading today he's not doing drugs he's not I'm going to with the cool kids that actually that actually. [TS]
01:30:04 ◼ ► and what are you going to do some drugs that can feel a lot better if you were more popular. [TS]
01:30:18 ◼ ► and honest we are going to see that that is the bottom line I think I think the fact we've been talking for an hour [TS]
01:30:24 ◼ ► and forty five minutes we haven't even talked of anything it is an indication of how we have to talk about something if [TS]
01:30:31 ◼ ► Let's talk about monkey couple OK let's pick something that's not the follow up we could at least have one thing to [TS]
01:30:39 ◼ ► talk about I want to talk about monkey copy I did enjoy a little after school special. [TS]
01:30:43 ◼ ► SAY NO TO DRUGS section and don't swear. Although I'm sure that was the conclusion to draw but it was boring people. [TS]
01:30:52 ◼ ► It was it was more kind of US regressing not doing drugs more than I only I was cooler. [TS]
01:31:00 ◼ ► Tell me about monkey copier you know that you know the guy at the center of this story you're about to know that she [TS]
01:31:07 ◼ ► lives in my little patch of England here so me I guess I'm showing a bit of parochial an affair because I guess lots of [TS]
01:31:13 ◼ ► people live in London and every time some big knock when there's a story about the prime minister on T.V. [TS]
01:31:18 ◼ ► You know he lives in the same city as me. This is my local this is my local news sort of background shining through. [TS]
01:31:32 ◼ ► If you ever look up a place on Wikipedia you always know that the place is not a place [TS]
01:31:37 ◼ ► when the Wikipedia article about it has a section that isn't titled notable people from. [TS]
01:31:44 ◼ ► I'm always really aware of that because basically any place is a place that doesn't have a notable people from San [TS]
01:31:53 ◼ ► Francisco. If they don't include that because there's a billion people from San Francisco that they give you. [TS]
01:32:00 ◼ ► Often if you have to enumerate the people from your place is not a notable big snob. [TS]
01:32:11 ◼ ► If a place is a real huge place you can't possibly list of notable people from it just because there are millions of [TS]
01:32:19 ◼ ► people what a ridiculous thing to say. What do you mean an absolutely ridiculous thing to say I think it's a truism. [TS]
01:32:25 ◼ ► Are you saying that the town of Grantham in Lincolnshire is not a place. Is that what you're saying. [TS]
01:32:39 ◼ ► Rent them but it's not a place according to you it doesn't exist. I'm looking it up. Notable people there. [TS]
01:32:47 ◼ ► I'm not you know I'm not saying it doesn't exist. Yes I saw you said it's not a place. [TS]
01:32:51 ◼ ► Let me let me try to refine my thinking about it. Sound of a no no I guess what I mean is the only hope for the better. [TS]
01:33:00 ◼ ► Man I'm going to look up at will I heard notable people I like at the very top of the list they have a serial killer [TS]
01:33:09 ◼ ► Beverley applet serial killer from Grant I'm not going to have a head of a English serial killer who convicted [TS]
01:33:18 ◼ ► and attempting to murder three others causing grievous bodily harm to a further six children. [TS]
01:33:23 ◼ ► Margaret Thatcher may get on a developing Adelaide where I'm from that's OK doesn't have a notable people. [TS]
01:33:31 ◼ ► OK OK OK I says Isaac Newton is from Grantham yesterday. OK OK OK this is mostly by you know by the serial killer. [TS]
01:33:43 ◼ ► OK OK This is my feeling about the notable people section which Pedia its purpose seems to build up the place that it [TS]
01:33:52 ◼ ► is describing. But for me it has the exact opposite effect it diminishes the place by feeling the. [TS]
01:34:02 ◼ ► I think that is that is the more articulate version of the feeling that it gives me that that is fair enough [TS]
01:34:08 ◼ ► and a little bit less than a little bit less. I live in London and nobody else matters but I'm not from London. [TS]
01:34:18 ◼ ► I don't mean it in a snob in a snobbish way I just think that that that section always seems to do the opposite of what [TS]
01:34:27 ◼ ► it is intending to do that by the very fact of saying look at all the notable people from this place in my mind it [TS]
01:34:33 ◼ ► makes me feel like that place is less notable not more notable and I care. I understand the logic of what you say. [TS]
01:34:46 ◼ ► Like where could say despite despite not having the advantage of a huge swarming population we still have produced [TS]
01:35:01 ◼ ► but we still pack a punch which you couldn't argue with that something only a small party would say [TS]
01:35:09 ◼ ► and always with these notable people's actions what I'm really curious about is how many of these notable people lived [TS]
01:35:13 ◼ ► in that place as opposed to how many of them were born there and then left after high school [TS]
01:35:22 ◼ ► But that's what I would really like is there any notable people who also spent their entire life in this place. [TS]
01:35:27 ◼ ► Section I think it's a little weird that a place gets to lay claim to somebody because they you know they happen to pop [TS]
01:35:45 ◼ ► So this guy I told you that the guy at the center of monkey monkey copyright was from like know even from the town I'm [TS]
01:36:00 ◼ ► Now if I had pulled up I tried to be prepared and I pulled up some links before and I seem to have lost all of them [TS]
01:36:09 ◼ ► or my other well OK OK So I want I knew which I tried to parrot a little. Prepare a little bit and so here we go. [TS]
01:36:18 ◼ ► So for those unaware the basic story is this guy David Slater who is a nature photographer in two thousand [TS]
01:36:28 ◼ ► and eleven went to Indonesia and he was there to do wildlife photography and the interesting thing that happened is [TS]
01:36:45 ◼ ► and ended up taking pictures of themselves with his camera and he Sophie's basically yeah it's a monkey selfie [TS]
01:36:53 ◼ ► and take great pictures that are amazing that I have to say the one picture that this is really primarily about I'll [TS]
01:37:03 ◼ ► and look it is an amazing photograph that this monkey took of himself he had he has a smile he has these striking red [TS]
01:37:13 ◼ ► It is just a really striking photographs and the guy has a few more on his Web site [TS]
01:37:25 ◼ ► But the question the question about this is does the photographer David Slater own the copyright to this image or not. [TS]
01:37:42 ◼ ► when the story first broke in a bunch of newspapers are posting it primarily to say looking this amazing photograph [TS]
01:37:50 ◼ ► But what has happened is it has escalated which is that is actually going to court because he is contending the [TS]
01:38:00 ◼ ► The copyright belongs to him because we Kapadia it's become like a lookup eighty A picture has an affair. [TS]
01:38:05 ◼ ► So if it's on Wikimedia Commons which is a resource that I use all the time to try and find public domain [TS]
01:38:10 ◼ ► and certain kinds of creative commons images and they listed on Wikipedia as being able to be used. [TS]
01:38:19 ◼ ► Now the funny version of this story which I'm going to say almost certainly a whole bunch of times throughout this [TS]
01:38:25 ◼ ► The headline in newspapers who don't care to fact check things is that the argument is that the monkey owns the [TS]
01:38:33 ◼ ► and you will see this headline in careless newspapers who are uninterested in the truth [TS]
01:38:38 ◼ ► and are more interested in selling newspapers the actual the actual argument is that the photograph is public domain [TS]
01:38:44 ◼ ► because there is no author of the photograph that was really what you were guilty of this headline we started to talk [TS]
01:38:50 ◼ ► about it and you said let's talk about monkey copyright. Yes that's exactly right. So I am not a newspaper now. [TS]
01:39:00 ◼ ► but I'm still going to talk about monkey copyright because I am tickled by the notion of a monkey owning the copyright [TS]
01:39:04 ◼ ► to an image I think this is a fascinating fascinating question about whether what is the copyright of this image does [TS]
01:39:18 ◼ ► You seems like you familiar with the story do you have any initial thoughts about this. [TS]
01:39:22 ◼ ► You think the monkey gets a copyright nobody is the copyright he is the copyright What do you think I think he should [TS]
01:39:42 ◼ ► He didn't intend for the monkey to pick up the camera to take that monkey just did it or did [TS]
01:39:47 ◼ ► or was he trying to trick the monkey into doing it because he thought it would be a cool picture. [TS]
01:39:50 ◼ ► I'm not one hundred percent clear but from what I've read it reads like he's left unattended in the monkey just played. [TS]
01:40:00 ◼ ► I mean if he tried to trick the monkey into doing it and so this would be classic and you know [TS]
01:40:28 ◼ ► but my underlying like just gut feeling is that it should belong to him because I feel like it should belong to someone [TS]
01:40:39 ◼ ► and if it's going to belong to anyone I have to come to him and it should belong to him. [TS]
01:40:44 ◼ ► But why that's the case I cannot say. Maybe it's not the case. I don't and what do you what what's your feeling on it. [TS]
01:40:58 ◼ ► I have what is currently his web page now but you can also go to the Wayback Machine [TS]
01:41:12 ◼ ► but then there are newspaper reports of him talking about leaving the camera equipment around [TS]
01:41:18 ◼ ► and then the monkey takes the picture. Yep and then the current description is A is A. [TS]
01:41:24 ◼ ► I don't think he's doing this as an on purpose but it's a bit ambiguous as as to what happens [TS]
01:41:29 ◼ ► but it sounds much more like he was intentionally leaving the equipment around for the monkey to take the picture. [TS]
01:41:41 ◼ ► but it's funny because the impression that I get is that this this story gained ground in the first place with the monkey [TS]
01:41:52 ◼ ► selfie version of it. Yeah and then it becomes a legal problem and now there is this description which is of. [TS]
01:42:01 ◼ ► and I think both of those things can be true it can be true to describe it as a monkey selfie [TS]
01:42:12 ◼ ► or it's just either way tales are relevant do you think the circumstance changes the copyright situation. [TS]
01:42:22 ◼ ► So it's funny because my I think this makes me think of is my wife and I used to be very avid photographers [TS]
01:42:30 ◼ ► We did a couple road trips across America and we would often compete to get the better photograph. [TS]
01:42:36 ◼ ► and I think I was very natural in couples I think to think that they had a they had a master photographer in the other [TS]
01:42:44 ◼ ► and I was always hugely frustrated because I would take ten thousand photographs and try to get one good photograph [TS]
01:42:50 ◼ ► and then she would just casually like oh this looks good. Click one perfect beautiful means no retouching. [TS]
01:43:04 ◼ ► Belongs to the person camera so she uses my camera at the copyright for that image is mine [TS]
01:43:12 ◼ ► and if I use her camera the copyright is hers because honestly we just grab stuff was that I said was that to avoid [TS]
01:43:19 ◼ ► That's exactly this is the only reasonable rule even if it doesn't strictly make sense we just have to leave this down [TS]
01:43:26 ◼ ► as a couple How could you have photos that you're having like as is just a bidding war every time you go take a photo [TS]
01:43:33 ◼ ► but you have to lay down the rules we need to make it clear about what happened with photographs that all couples lay [TS]
01:43:40 ◼ ► So anyway so this is a question that we went with the yeah the copyright resides with the equipment for different [TS]
01:43:46 ◼ ► reasons but for different reasons but but but I think this is this is just so interesting [TS]
01:43:52 ◼ ► and it is my my my gut reaction. Just a fun reaction is I want the monkey to have the coffee. [TS]
01:44:03 ◼ ► Why are we being so human centric with this notion that only humans can have copyrights to their works cannot the [TS]
01:44:10 ◼ ► monkey own the copyright to his selfie do not the whales own the copyright to their music. [TS]
01:44:16 ◼ ► It seems like we should be so human centric in these things but if I was if I was a judge and I was sitting down [TS]
01:44:25 ◼ ► Yeah what is the situation I would say that the same thing that taking this guy's description at his word. [TS]
01:44:36 ◼ ► And so he should own the copyright to the image even if he was not the one pressing the shutter. [TS]
01:44:42 ◼ ► What if it's not not even this case just what if someone had their pick their camera picked up [TS]
01:44:47 ◼ ► and just taken by the monkey like a tourist had their i Phone snatched and took a picture. [TS]
01:45:15 ◼ ► I thought some tourist took out their phone to take a picture of these little adorable monkeys [TS]
01:45:20 ◼ ► and he just swung down from the tree and grabbed it and ran off with delight at his new toy [TS]
01:45:24 ◼ ► and I don't know if people forget animals a fast art Mantell an animal does something you don't expect us to do it you [TS]
01:45:39 ◼ ► But you're also never going to see it coming you think I'll have a monkey makes a move for my camera. [TS]
01:45:44 ◼ ► I'll just put it away and it won't now. But they're so quick your reaction times are so slow. [TS]
01:45:48 ◼ ► Yeah it's like the monkeys in Gibraltar if you go on You Tube you can find a million hilarious clips of the monkeys [TS]
01:45:55 ◼ ► and apparently the only reason they do it is because it is funny that this is how the monkeys past a time. [TS]
01:46:00 ◼ ► If they know that it's a big reaction out of people and they just love it so monkeys are nothing but trouble [TS]
01:46:10 ◼ ► Here think if you go with a situation where the copyright resides with the equipment there's an interesting problem [TS]
01:46:19 ◼ ► when people use photo booths that the photo booth owns the copyrights to the image that the company that set up a photo [TS]
01:46:32 ◼ ► I think there's some weird situations about having copyright reside with equipment that is that is used. [TS]
01:46:41 ◼ ► And here is a scenario that I think of as the most interesting version I imagine this was not a monkey. [TS]
01:46:48 ◼ ► Imagine that this guy was reaching some and contacted peoples. So in Brazil there are and contacted human tribes. [TS]
01:47:00 ◼ ► But he was just with a tribe that had no experience with technology and so had no expectation of what a camera does [TS]
01:47:07 ◼ ► and does basically what these monkeys did which was looking at their reflection in the lens and pressing the buttons. [TS]
01:47:13 ◼ ► I think if it's if it's an uncontracted person that human should get the copyright to the image even if the [TS]
01:47:19 ◼ ► photographer is setting up the whole situation so that it would happen even if the person doesn't have any idea like a [TS]
01:47:28 ◼ ► They should have the copyright to that so I find copyright residing with equipment problematic you know reminds me of a [TS]
01:47:39 ◼ ► but I now look at it in a whole new light because of what we've just been talking about [TS]
01:47:46 ◼ ► and still is one of the world's best cricket photographers you know photographing games of cricket. [TS]
01:47:51 ◼ ► He's excellent He's like you know he's the best in the world in my opinion. And hey you stay at cricket matches. [TS]
01:48:00 ◼ ► I would say in all the different places around the ground where he thought he would get the best angles [TS]
01:48:03 ◼ ► and the best sports shots but he would also set up a second camera at the top of a grandstand looking down [TS]
01:48:13 ◼ ► and set it at the part of the the ground where the batsman was where the action was most likely to happen. [TS]
01:48:20 ◼ ► Kind of home plate in baseball you know he would have a just a good shot of home plate like the cricket equivalent [TS]
01:48:26 ◼ ► and he would get like a trainee photographer to sit there with it so it didn't get stolen or you know [TS]
01:48:33 ◼ ► and get knocked over or anything like that but he had like a remote control to take the pictures [TS]
01:48:39 ◼ ► and the trainee was in there to touch it because I always think I want to get the training to do it good practice [TS]
01:48:45 ◼ ► But whenever he was around the ground doing his own pictures and e-zine things more his fire angles [TS]
01:48:50 ◼ ► when something happened like a like a big wicket or a big interesting thing happen. [TS]
01:48:54 ◼ ► He would just press this remote button and it would fire off ten shots really quickly. [TS]
01:48:59 ◼ ► I always thought that was because he distrusted his knowledge of the game and his his knowing his feel for [TS]
01:49:08 ◼ ► and he didn't trust the trainer he got the tranny would miss Mr magic moment because he didn't read the game as well [TS]
01:49:19 ◼ ► but the you work for a contractor work for work for hire situations where people are producing artwork [TS]
01:49:31 ◼ ► But there are also plenty of really weird situations with that we're trying to lock down something as a work for hire. [TS]
01:49:38 ◼ ► You can run into all sorts of weird problems so I would be surprised at the trainee actually did have some kind of work [TS]
01:49:44 ◼ ► for hire contract. But even still he just was a double to make sure that he is like an iron clad. [TS]
01:49:52 ◼ ► Yeah I can't help it as as looking at this this monkey paid to have these few monkey picture staring at me. [TS]
01:50:00 ◼ ► That's what the situation is with the monkeys and then below he says it is a totally humbling [TS]
01:50:06 ◼ ► and almost beyond my ability to write here experience so we have humbling use on this monkey copyright page I just just [TS]
01:50:17 ◼ ► and a monkey does a better job than you do. That's what we have proper use of humbling. [TS]
01:50:23 ◼ ► It might be although he has plenty of other dramatic monkey photos this guy is clearly no slouch with the wildlife [TS]
01:50:30 ◼ ► Oh there he is complaining that he's he's really crying poor on this like I read an interview with him [TS]
01:50:35 ◼ ► and he said you know I haven't got a lot of money and I need the money from this picture so you know [TS]
01:50:41 ◼ ► but anyway it's an interesting argument and I I do sympathize with him if I if I through luck or circumstance. [TS]
01:50:50 ◼ ► The thing is you know these guys these photographers spend all their life waiting for a lucky moment because that's [TS]
01:50:56 ◼ ► when that's that that makes or breaks a career in figure of a lot of the time it's just that one lucky moment [TS]
01:51:15 ◼ ► Yeah the wildlife photography in particular is basically a kind of lottery that a lottery that you pay with in time [TS]
01:51:23 ◼ ► and you hope to get one winning image out of there. But but yes I I just I think it is an interesting story. [TS]
01:51:35 ◼ ► and this is also where you know I happen to be working on something which even though I don't really want to get it it [TS]
01:51:44 ◼ ► and the frustrating thing with copyright law you know why it is an endless topic of conversation is that there are no [TS]
01:51:51 ◼ ► Ultimately all this stuff has to be decided by a court somewhere on each individual case [TS]
01:52:00 ◼ ► Where where the legal disagreement is taking place but a judge somewhere it somewhere is going to have to rule on. [TS]
01:52:07 ◼ ► Is this a public domain image or is this a is this his image and I will be very curious to see which way that goes. [TS]
01:52:15 ◼ ► So Monday copyrights I hope the monkey just about right. Not really I hope he gets it. [TS]
01:52:33 ◼ ► When you make another video going coming this is this is that there's a thing I alluded to earlier which is the [TS]
01:52:45 ◼ ► Actually I'm OK I'm OK talking about this a little bit because given my timeline hopefully by the time this episode [TS]
01:52:51 ◼ ► goes out hopefully the thing that I'm working on now will either just have come out or will just be out. [TS]
01:52:58 ◼ ► Yeah this is a thing I mentioned last time that I've been bring cracking for too long [TS]
01:53:01 ◼ ► and I'm just trying to get finished and is just a huge nightmare and enormous time sink and a copyright nightmare [TS]
01:53:14 ◼ ► Even though it is a topic that is close to my heart there's nothing more in the world that I want to stand for this [TS]
01:53:20 ◼ ► and so that that is what I have been working on that is also partly why I have delayed this podcast recording one week [TS]
01:53:28 ◼ ► but it is a very frustrating long boring process that hopefully will be over soon. [TS]
01:53:32 ◼ ► I never I never want to work with video clips ever again. Every video I learned a lesson on what not to do. [TS]
01:53:41 ◼ ► Video online. Don't ever do law again. Video on medicine no that's a terrible topic as well. [TS]
01:53:46 ◼ ► And now a video that is primarily composed of video clips. That's also a terrible idea. [TS]
01:53:52 ◼ ► It is so time consuming and if the thing comes out. As of right now it looks like it'll be. About twelve minutes long. [TS]
01:54:05 ◼ ► but I have been finding that it takes about a day per minutes to make a minute of things on screen because finding [TS]
01:54:23 ◼ ► but I'm trying to reduce the number of drawings that are going to be in this I don't want to be such a drawing you [TS]
01:54:28 ◼ ► video but I know that that is also impossible to to accomplish so it is all just a nightmare I'll be happy [TS]
01:54:34 ◼ ► when it's over but I look forward to a photo hopefully we'll talk about it in the next podcast. I don't know maybe not. [TS]
01:54:42 ◼ ► I mean I guess we will talk about the topic when it comes out but I have I have no expectations for this video. [TS]
01:54:53 ◼ ► I would never have done this video without the crowdfunding because it would just not make any sense for me to spend as [TS]
01:55:00 ◼ ► Then you know if I was still one hundred percent reliant on advertising this is exactly the kind of thing that I just [TS]