The Talk Show

81: ‘Bring Back Jerry Yang’, With John Moltz


  a recording recording yes [TS]

  1233 just clap your hands already started doing to stop and do that now I [TS]

  thought you were you are you are you can I swear to god you're not going to do [TS]

  that you wouldn't like that I was gonna clap just for your CQ I don't think [TS]

  there's anything I don't think the listeners of the shows they shouldn't [TS]

  notice a damn thing it should just all day all day [TS]

  they won't even know that anything's changed while I should go I gotta dot [TS]

  the i's and cross the t's on the feed redirection and stuff like that but I [TS]

  that's not my problem or is that from now I think it seems as though any [TS]

  well-written podcast client if they get a 30 to http which is 301 says redirect [TS]

  go over there but don't not permanently 302 is permanent and then it should [TS]

  remember the new URL so if you were previously subscribed at me or radio [TS]

  dotnet talk show whatever the video Eliz your your podcast software will [TS]

  automatically update to during fireball dotnet feeds the talk show whatever I [TS]

  don't know haven't decided anywhere but nobody should notice it in Christ back [TS]

  out splendidly problems are endemic to no problems whatsoever to see the rumor [TS]

  today just broke hours before we we started recording that Twitter might buy [TS]

  SoundCloud yeah I don't mess with anybody know but it's funny down from [TS]

  her friend of the show [TS]

  occasional guest of the the talk-show pointed out the the sort of irony in [TS]

  that is that it's that SoundCloud is effectively odio to point out yeah and [TS]

  audio was like a podcast was a time in this must be like back and he doesn't [TS]

  remember that war 2005 but it was you have ever Williams and Biz Stone in all [TS]

  these guys you know that they'd left Google after bloggers you know like [TS]

  google bot blogger and then when their time was up there all got the hell out [TS]

  of Google and they made odio and it was going to be like like Blogger for [TS]

  podcasting [TS]

  just it just didn't seem to have seemed in a good idea I mean they're on to [TS]

  something in terms of like back in 2004 2005 thinking podcasting was gonna be [TS]

  big [TS]

  clearly they're at it you know the basic the fundamental idea that is pretty good [TS]

  and ahead of its time but they didn't ever get quite got it to work and then [TS]

  it was like one other guy is the guy named jack is over there and we also [TS]

  have any ideas and Jack Dorsey is like I got an idea and it turned into twitter [TS]

  twitter yeah the idea really was a separate company though right [TS]

  well did well start Twitter started as an audio product and it and I'm not [TS]

  quite sure what the legal side some point you know lawyers came in and and [TS]

  and it went from Twitter being [TS]

  and audio product to Twitter being a stand-alone you know corporation yeah it [TS]

  was spun off but but Twitter date started life as a product of the audio [TS]

  corporation I've gotten odio t-shirt thing happen to audio yeah I think they [TS]

  changed the name to the obvious corporation [TS]

  thinking it might yeah which i think is still the parent company of media [TS]

  you know that's the new thing that real ok ok they just when he started that he [TS]

  just started under that umbrella yeah I think I you know and again is there [TS]

  really a difference if they dissed designer know maybe they just dissolved [TS]

  odio and started a new company called obvious where I think they changed the [TS]

  name though you know just like save on paper one of them something I don't know [TS]

  like I might have been easier to just change the name of the video to the [TS]

  obvious corporation are you planning on using sentiment I guess so I mean it's a [TS]

  well it's funny because now that I have to worry about every single detail [TS]

  hosting the podcast in and there are you know I don't know how much of the [TS]

  details you're you're taking care of with the with the parenting show turning [TS]

  this car don't make me go back there was also in the running [TS]

  we have a long list of things that dads [TS]

  was probably there was probably in there someplace but there are there's all [TS]

  sorts of details they have to worry about and and a fundamental one is where [TS]

  do you store the audio files yeah it would cost according to my calculations [TS]

  couple of thousand dollars a month for me to host the audio on Amazon s3 could [TS]

  be off by a little but I'm probably not off by a lot which is you know we are [TS]

  talking about hundreds of dollars and I'm I just squander it [TS]

  thousands of dollars you've got my attention and SoundCloud is free this [TS]

  economy I don't get too inside baseball here but to me it's a sort of an [TS]

  interesting it's the perils of of venture-backed cloud services so [TS]

  SoundCloud is free for everything and and it's just started life I guess is [TS]

  sort of a music hosting service where musicians could have put songs up and [TS]

  have people playing but they don't you know they let you put anything up there [TS]

  including podcasts and you can put your podcast there and they don't insert [TS]

  their own ads to have a player that you can embed like if you go you know if [TS]

  anybody has ever looked at the talk-show pages on your radio they used the [TS]

  Soundcloud embeddable player and it did but that doesn't really have a date has [TS]

  SoundCloud branding but you don't have to use their audio player you know like [TS]

  Dave discuses unprofessional show Jamie Newberry now are those that forget who [TS]

  used to be the host what's his name [TS]

  that's it who is on my part my parenting practiced he is he never speaks up all [TS]

  over yours you and john Kasay treatment as in the case of treatment they should [TS]

  do it they should do a show and they do it because like those guys the other [TS]

  guys the other guys should pretend to be each other just a few things but an [TS]

  unprofessional he hosts their audio sound club he uses a different you know [TS]

  html5 audio player and it all seems too good to be true because behind the [TS]

  scenes SoundCloud host your audio on Amazon s3 and so you know it's it's the [TS]

  hundreds or if they're popular enough show thousands of dollars worth of s3 [TS]

  bandwidth that SoundCloud is just covering based on the bike sixty million [TS]

  dollars they've raised in venture capital yeah so it's a perfect fit for [TS]

  to honor the idea and so like with like my friends and as I've been talking and [TS]

  and and planning and plotting and detailing you know everything I have to [TS]

  do to move the the talk show to be part of during fireball and I see you I hear [TS]

  that and I think that's too good to be true and too good to be true it is to me [TS]

  it makes me very uncomfortable I would rather pay a reasonable amount of money [TS]

  for something that I feel is sustainable [TS]

  I say this is some people on and some people hear it and they you know of a [TS]

  good point that is a little worrisome and then other people like just take the [TS]

  free hosting dummy worry about what you do when it goes away when it goes away [TS]

  wait for the brown you have an established podcast so in your situation [TS]

  it's a little easier you know with established sponsors and so so it's a [TS]

  little easier to actually go out and sell something out but we started up [TS]

  with me [TS]

  advertisers to begin with and so right now it's been a lot harder right it's [TS]

  it's not that it done a lot of confidence that I was gonna go someplace [TS]

  and there's other options besides Amazon s3 there's all sorts of things like you [TS]

  know one could do to host a podcast but there you know because SoundCloud offers [TS]

  a good quality you know because it back by s3 [TS]

  they don't tell you that but it just if you poke around and see where your stuff [TS]

  coming from it seems like it is good quality it works around the world which [TS]

  is often a problem like if you were just to do like the obvious thing and just [TS]

  get like Linux server start just put your audio files there let people [TS]

  download it like people around the world might have trouble getting it whereas [TS]

  something that's meant to be a content delivery system like s3 works better and [TS]

  then you don't have to pay again like he said it seemed like a perfect fit for [TS]

  Twitter you guys have no idea and no idea how to make money for it we're [TS]

  going to spend $30 on you guys can work with us all sorts of acquisition of this [TS]

  is another one of our co uses something else which lips it lipson yeah yeah yeah [TS]

  I know about that one [TS]

  they're they're a little bit less [TS]

  nebulous in terms of the money like to have some kind of hearing and paid [TS]

  accounts and something I don't know they mean what's your name and Paul confesses [TS]

  have a show then I'm so bad with names [TS]

  yeah yeah that's why I like to have you on the show to start over what your name [TS]

  is exactly he's got the same name that I've got little body that Armstrong [TS]

  doesn't have any age yet he must be a Jonathan Wright whenever I see a jail [TS]

  when I just slept with that is assuming you're right we're not right i mean you [TS]

  know that it's John now I CJO and I think you're really a Jonathan and [TS]

  you're just pretending to be at John and then when other people will say to me if [TS]

  they say hey is your real name Jonathan Gruber is your full name Jonathan Gruber [TS]

  then I'm offended cuz I might now have an age where you renamed after somebody [TS]

  sort of long story short I was the first child and this is before any kind of [TS]

  ultrasound tape technology so when my mom was pregnant with me in 1972 all [TS]

  they knew was that she was pregnant and had not been invented nope sounded and [TS]

  color right but my mom was a hundred percent convinced that she was having a [TS]

  girl she had no children before but she just felt like she was having a girl and [TS]

  she even has he still has it like a little like back pocket-sized book of [TS]

  baby names like the sort of little almost like a pamphlet book with [TS]

  thousands of names but it's you know it's like the size of a field 25 names [TS]

  that you know you can buy books like that the supermarket yeah and she has it [TS]

  and and like the girl pages are all like [TS]

  warn there's dozens and dozens of names circled in different colors for like [TS]

  second and there's a two boys names it was like Jason and I are in like two [TS]

  boys names over Lake begley underlined and that was it that was the only [TS]

  thought she'd put into it and then I came out and they said it's a boy and [TS]

  she doesn't know it's not in my back and and and she was upset because she didn't [TS]

  know she was this result was a girl that no names picked out my dad was not in [TS]

  room because this was 1973 and was not a smoke-filled room with which cigars yeah [TS]

  yeah probably like a six pack or something and then they came in and they [TS]

  said yeah good news [TS]

  wife had a baby is healthy boy and my dad I guess he joined and she said all [TS]

  of your column and he discusses name is John and that was that there was like no [TS]

  discussion of my mom and dad's been like hours and hours over the preceding like [TS]

  eight months [TS]

  picking up girls names mi they'd never discussed it just goes his name is John [TS]

  now it ends up that both both of my grandparents her dad and my dad's dead [TS]

  were both named John and so you know everybody felt on it right where you you [TS]

  know anybody yeah my grandfather my mom's dad and he passed away like six [TS]

  months before I was born so I was named after him [TS]

  tragic yeah good names most kids don't smoke [TS]

  good name gets me through the day lots of other acquisitions in the news so in [TS]

  and near near acquisitions orchard continuing tortured acquisitions well [TS]

  that the beats one which I thought would have been old news by the time we were [TS]

  recording this is still not still at limbo still actually not news like that [TS]

  we're getting close to two weeks right since it'll be like the end of this week [TS]

  every two weeks [TS]

  Friday right and a lot of people have been writing to me you know it down [TS]

  fireball emailing saying like hey maybe this whole thing is just nonsense and [TS]

  you know Apple not denying it is just their usual you know we don't comment [TS]

  one way or the other because if they end there might be you know who knows I [TS]

  don't I actually don't know but you know that the idea would be why wouldn't [TS]

  happen just publicly denied if it weren't true [TS]

  the idea then would be that they'd be right because then they'd be giving it [TS]

  away if there is another subsequent one that was real but was still pending and [TS]

  then they didn't comment on that one then it would be a sign that if it's not [TS]

  true Apple deny it but if it is true is true that helped me why we're so [TS]

  therefore if they want to maintain you know people in here until they actually [TS]

  make the announcement themselves they have to not comment on everything [TS]

  whether it's true or false [TS]

  so there's some logic there but I do think though that if it weren't the case [TS]

  then I I don't think they moved to address it officially with an official [TS]

  statement but I think behind the scenes they get word out and we haven't even [TS]

  seen any sign of that there's not a single report from anybody saying you [TS]

  know unnamed sources familiar with the situation say that Apple is not buying [TS]

  beats everything as you indicated that they still intend to and Peter Kafka [TS]

  recode that's the new AllThingsD [TS]

  he said like mid week last week that it was taking longer than expected but that [TS]

  this is the week sometime this week announced I guess it seems like that [TS]

  probably didn't help I would guess that probably wasn't a great idea [TS]

  think so I just my guess is it's not the video that was the problem is the fact [TS]

  that the video to rate the major the major problem right it was probably [TS]

  jumping the gun [TS]

  yeah and I would guess that dr dre did not expected to be posted to Facebook [TS]

  you know he you know he's he's very very smart man and he's clearly been if it's [TS]

  true he's clearly been in he knows enough that Apple doesn't want anything [TS]

  that I think that you know it was the fact that it was his friend that but [TS]

  wasn't he posted it to Facebook it was his friend that posted about that was a [TS]

  good conversation it was only up for a few hours rain and it was taken down [TS]

  early in the morning and it also seemed like the sort of situation where maybe [TS]

  he would have been getting up early in the morning that would probably be my [TS]

  guess is well yeah there might have been sleeping internet for that but it was me [TS]

  know and I know judgment there nobody loves asleep in morn I do you sure can [TS]

  swing in a pair of Beats headphones around that somebody with an opinion [TS]

  about them yeah yeah I think the funny thing is I think that's it to me the [TS]

  interesting thing about it isn't the actual is no longer the actual [TS]

  acquisition of it comes to pass it's more that the way that we've had like [TS]

  this two week period where it was just one confirmed rumor with no explanation [TS]

  from Apple repeat as to why you would want to do this [TS]

  it's become like this sort of blank canvas where everybody can project [TS]

  whatever they think about Apple onto it good or bad yeah yeah I guess I think I [TS]

  think it I everything I mean everything that Apple does has that a house that [TS]

  element to it and I feel better I feel like this more so than anything else [TS]

  because we lose it did seem to come out of left field like nobody is really [TS]

  predicting it it did seem confusing at first to a lot of us to me at least and [TS]

  I think it's still I think it's so confusing a little bit anyway because it [TS]

  doesn't seem like the hardware that great it doesn't seem like you know like [TS]

  they have a streaming service already and from what everybody says it doesn't [TS]

  seem like the licenses for the music go along with the sale but then there's a [TS]

  vine where three billion seems like a lot for in a quagmire exactly right I [TS]

  don't you know maybe altogether though maybe a know it all together it seems [TS]

  like something a little bit here a little bit there is no it's not you know [TS]

  on the surface it's not completely clear exactly what the value is yeah I totally [TS]

  agree but I don't know though that it you know I'm willing to say as somebody [TS]

  who is you know I think widely known as a key now Paul observer I'm willing to [TS]

  say I just don't know and just wait just wait you know I don't have a different [TS]

  way that I could go off on any kind of strongly opinionated you know column or [TS]

  or rant here on the show one way or the other that this is stupid it's genius [TS]

  either way I i dont know I don't know enough yet I don't know why more people [TS]

  can't just say I don't know I think that's a sign of weakness I guess I [TS]

  don't know but I've seen people as you know the saying that this is the [TS]

  clearest sign this is incontrovertible proof that Tim Cook is a moron [TS]

  you know that he's running the country into the company into the ground [TS]

  and and other people say it's genius you know in this you know keeps out on top [TS]

  of the music industry for another two decades and it's really I don't see how [TS]

  either of those extremes is evident in least ya jung did you read today's young [TS]

  weaknesses and now I did not going to suggest he's gonna be a good piece of [TS]

  today is Monday notice about is about that in his opinion he puts it fairly [TS]

  well basically just saying that he doesn't he doesn't understand it at this [TS]

  point I think that's the to me that's the only thinking man's take is that it [TS]

  doesn't make it less intriguing if anything it makes it more intriguing [TS]

  because it's now we you know there's something interesting going on here I [TS]

  can't wait to find out more about it there's gotta be you just feel like [TS]

  there's gotta be something more you know like I don't think I really really [TS]

  really do not think that the answer is apple has just given up and decided to [TS]

  just be lazy and just throw billions around without really thinking about it [TS]

  that after going decades only making relatively small I mean I think it's the [TS]

  case that they haven't made a billion they've never made a billion dollar [TS]

  acquisition and that all of a sudden now after never having done so now they're [TS]

  just going to spend money willy nilly I mean it doesn't make sense to me but [TS]

  without a very very concrete idea of how it's going to help out I just don't see [TS]

  it it's interesting that when they acquired next to me next was only 400 [TS]

  million or something like that yeah four hundred and some yeah and there's some [TS]

  inflation adjustment they have to do right but there's also think this just [TS]

  apart from the value of the dollar there's there's an acquisition inflation [TS]

  yeah that's gone on since then these acquisitions that have happened just [TS]

  driven up like every time somebody wants to get acquired their life wells [TS]

  facebook buys Instagram for well look at it this way that the Apple into the [TS]

  Apple next acquisition was I forget one it was officially completed I think it [TS]

  was like at least a handshake around Christmas 1996 but but made official in [TS]

  january ninety seven so whether you want to call it 96 or 97 1997 as a little bit [TS]

  better because it you know you know Christmas weaker New Years week 96 is [TS]

  effectively 97 anyway but even so the dot-com bubble was still in the early [TS]

  days you know it it gotten started but it was still early days and so I think [TS]

  at that point [TS]

  acquisitions were still largely done on traditional metrics [TS]

  revenue and profit like the idea that you add value and acquisition on [TS]

  anything it's sad that a lot of cases but in others maybe not so you know like [TS]

  a good example maybe Facebook buying Instagram where Instagram hadn't tried [TS]

  to make a nickel right they'd never sold the app they did they've never done is [TS]

  clearly worth a lot right because they had growth and they had you know all of [TS]

  these images they had given a good technology like 12 me often goes under [TS]

  sunset about Instagram because it's when things work we just don't notice it we [TS]

  take it for granted but Twitter which was all just text you know had so many [TS]

  problems with scaling with the fail whale etcetera [TS]

  Instagram was doing something you know where I'm guessing the average Instagram [TS]

  post is at least I could be there can be at least a thousand times bigger than [TS]

  tweet though because its own image now just 140 characters rain I don't know I [TS]

  might be but I could be ten thousand times where I don't even know I don't [TS]

  even know how big an instrument to bed gotta be at least two thousand times [TS]

  more and never really had scheduling problems right and the previous darling [TS]

  of social photo sharing Flickr [TS]

  we have to go way back in the day for the early days of liquor before Yahoo [TS]

  bought them also had you know terrible scaling problems and it was far smaller [TS]

  than Instagram was they did a great job so there's some value there but billions [TS]

  or was it one doing that Facebook bought them for I think so [TS]

  for a company that never even tried to make a little crazy while not crazy but [TS]

  it's it's it was certainly be crazy [TS]

  users which is a pretty important branch for that kind of thing and the potential [TS]

  to make money is there [TS]

  yeah I think the biggest thing if you're going to compare something like Apple [TS]

  buying beats four three billion today to apple's next acquisition in ninety-seven [TS]

  isn't about the inflationary difference between 400 and some million in three [TS]

  billion now it's really more how much is the cost compared to how much the couple [TS]

  had on hand at the time whereas now Apple has one hundred and sixty billion [TS]

  in cash [TS]

  much of it off see overseas but even so even if you even if they decided to pay [TS]

  the entire price in cash using overseas cash and pay you know thirty or forty [TS]

  percent income tax on the thing it's it's a drop in the bucket rate they [TS]

  could spend five billion on beats and it's only 130 fifth of their entire cash [TS]

  on hand [TS]

  you know it you know whereas the 400 and some million acquisition of next in 1997 [TS]

  was people say this all the time that it's a bet the company move that that is [TS]

  one case where it's not the least bit of hyperbole where it was enough you know [TS]

  Apple was near bankruptcy they didn't have it couldn't afford to lose to [TS]

  tonight [TS]

  workout right if you're just basically was so Microsoft investment was a [TS]

  hundred and fifty million hundred and fifty million so it was three times [TS]

  bigger than a 30 at Microsoft physically fit for a third of them have said this [TS]

  before Microsoft's people off a look back at that and say that microsoft [TS]

  helped save apple by giving them a hundred and fifty million 250 million [TS]

  they gave out but didn't really make much of a difference compared you know [TS]

  in terms of keeping the company afloat like they needed office yet they still [TS]

  needed billions of revenue per quarter just to stay in the black so a hundred [TS]

  and fifty million investment from Microsoft and it was enough at the time [TS]

  that it certainly didn't hurt but it didn't make a big difference i mean they [TS]

  need to billions in revenue and keep costs down to stay in the black [TS]

  quarter-to-quarter it was like you said yet the commitment to keep doing office [TS]

  and the political value of the hundred and fifty million dollars [TS]

  the fact that is Apple's revenue last quarter was forty five point six billion [TS]

  so consider that they'd taken at about that and that's not a record quarter 3 [TS]

  million to three billion doesn't seem like very much right I think that the [TS]

  the the concern and I have this concern I do you know I want to see how it turns [TS]

  out I mean but as a as a company watcher I'm certainly concerned about it where [TS]

  it's not the money its to me the the the potential that it could signify a lack [TS]

  of focus focus has always been the key to Apple's success that they have all of [TS]

  this town in the company and so many good executives and the whole operation [TS]

  is working on such a relatively few number of products [TS]

  Tim Cook has said he's used the analogy several times but that like you know [TS]

  that that he could put all of the company's products on one table in an [TS]

  Apple store the entire lineup of hardware that Apple sells [TS]

  could be arranged neatly on one table and that that sort of focus is what led [TS]

  to the company do such good work on those products yeah I guess that that [TS]

  kind of colors how you think this deal as the value of this deal depending on [TS]

  what do you think they're gonna sort of subsume that brand into their own or [TS]

  keep it separate yeah totally I mean my dear and I talked about this last week I [TS]

  just don't know I did me that's the one of the single biggest questions about [TS]

  this potential acquisition is fascinating to me because on the one [TS]

  hand I can't see Apple having only sub sub brand and on the other hand I can't [TS]

  see spending three billion dollars for beats and not keeping the brand because [TS]

  to me it seems to me like most of the value and beats is in the brand yeah I [TS]

  would guess so I got again I have heard from some people i mean clearly among [TS]

  audio files in your Marco Arment people who really know what they have seemingly [TS]

  overall operational years and really can't tell the difference between [TS]

  different headphones Beats is is like a non-entity and almost treated with [TS]

  disdain but I've seen other people say well so audio files will keep minor [TS]

  audiophile headphones you know from Sennheiser and whoever else but normal [TS]

  people who love the way beats headphones sound and that it's not about like [TS]

  fidelity and reproducing music you know and some sort of way that you measure [TS]

  fidelity but effectively making it sound as though you have a nightclub in your [TS]

  head and they do a really good job that I don't know though that that means that [TS]

  it would be hard for a competitor to do the same thing though that they you know [TS]

  that they have technology that is it that they have technology that's hard to [TS]

  reproduce serve you know I don't think that seemed like that now doesn't seem [TS]

  particularly since their stuff was made by monster before [TS]

  write her own suffer a little while 66 months or something [TS]

  yeah I've also seen other people this is on Twitter and always has been the knock [TS]

  against Apple for as long as Apple is existed in probably from 1980 onwards [TS]

  people who are clearly not a fan of Apple products and general saying it's a [TS]

  perfect acquisition for Apple overpriced technology sold based on marketing alone [TS]

  so it's you know I don't think it's a problem for Apple that from among some [TS]

  people the idea that Apple buys beads reinforces that notion of the company [TS]

  because I feel like those people there's nothing could ever do in a million years [TS]

  to turn around right end if your goal is to get a hundred percent of all [TS]

  consumers to view your brand favorably you're doomed you're never you're gonna [TS]

  you know there's no brand in any market that works like that so what other other [TS]

  acquisitions so let's take a break and let me tell you about our first sponsor [TS]

  our good friends all three sponsors today [TS]

  longtime friends of the show glad to have him on board with the transition to [TS]

  the new daring fireball version of the talk show our first is a good friends it [TS]

  glue that's the internet you'll actually like it and they want me to tell you a [TS]

  little bit about their comparison to SharePoint a SharePoint sin internet [TS]

  product from a little company in my washington state of Washington about you [TS]

  Microsoft is correct just up the road you go to the URL which is igloo [TS]

  software dot com slash the talk show you will go to a special page they've set up [TS]

  just for listeners of the show where they show the results of a white paper [TS]

  that they commissioned from a company called Osterman research they said here [TS]

  you guys got there were paying you but got their due in August version when you [TS]

  compare our [TS]

  SharePoint and then we're going to share this information with people and they [TS]

  came out ahead in just about every way you can imagine SharePoint is too [TS]

  expensive you can save time and money by going with a blue SharePoint requires [TS]

  too many resources you have to host yourself it to pay for these Windows [TS]

  servers igloo is fully hosted you don't have to worry about it people actually [TS]

  this is the big one [TS]

  people actually use it but they found his companies that use SharePoint based [TS]

  internets what the employees actually do is spend all their time going around it [TS]

  and using Gmail and avoiding it whereas companies that use a glue people [TS]

  actually will use it and they like it and I'm laughing because I used to work [TS]

  supports the use SharePoint and and that is exactly what we found right you [TS]

  install it and then people find ways to get around to get away from it [TS]

  SharePoint doesn't play well with mobile that's a huge thing going forward you [TS]

  know everything they do it as responsible ads so it all works great [TS]

  from your phone whether you're on the Android where they're on iOS so they [TS]

  have a thing you can download just go to include software dot com slash the talk [TS]

  show they have an evaluation kit you can download they also have some new [TS]

  template they've set up pretty recently came out like last month but template [TS]

  you can use any group to set up a glue in different ways depending on what you [TS]

  need [TS]

  like if you need a customer community site or corporate intranet just for your [TS]

  team to show two very different use cases where the years you know setting [TS]

  up something for community of users people outside the company or something [TS]

  internal only [TS]

  they have an app based social network [TS]

  couple of new template all of them you can start using for free with up to 10 [TS]

  people just to try it out [TS]

  and that's just fantastic as in you you to set up free using a free get ten [TS]

  people on board [TS]

  you have to pay anything and make sure that it works just the way you want that [TS]

  it actually is all these things I've just been telling her crew only then do [TS]

  you need to sign up when you add more than 10 people and after that the prices [TS]

  really really competitive so my thanks to them and again just go to a glue [TS]

  software dot com slash the talk show what retirement acquisitions so what [TS]

  else positions there is good reason why I thought by having your show so it's [TS]

  again rumored not completed as re-record but youtube is possibly by twitch twitch [TS]

  4 $1,000,000,000 [TS]

  two interesting things about that one it which is is effectively I thought I just [TS]

  posted it in before I did we start recording that it may take the ESPN [TS]

  video games that they stream they treat video games where he is being treated [TS]

  sports and you go to Twitter news twitching you can watch you know top [TS]

  players play video games and you and I have talked about this race uncertain [TS]

  years old are really into watching videos of people playing video games and [TS]

  you know I didn't come up with this last time we talked about it but you know [TS]

  I've already watched this season probably Yankees have played in 42 games [TS]

  so far I've probably watched about 30 of them so I'm probably up close to $100 of [TS]

  baseball that I bought so far this year and yet I'm the one who was thinking [TS]

  just like a month ago [TS]

  see how crazy it is that my son watches people playing game video of people [TS]

  playing games rather than point whereas I haven't played baseball [TS]

  fifteen years and watch hundreds of hours over the year and it just hit me [TS]

  like a ton of bricks I does the same thing you know i mean the baseball so I [TS]

  love watching my favorite baseball team play he's into video games into it loves [TS]

  watching people play video games and I would rather watch people play video [TS]

  games because of a better chance than with my local sports team I have a [TS]

  better chance seeing somebody actually win so I think if you're if your YouTube [TS]

  Google YouTube that makes a lot of my also think it's interesting that it's [TS]

  being dealt with as a YouTube acquisition not a group was interesting [TS]

  too and I didn't even notice but like the head of YouTube her title as CEO [TS]

  like their YouTube I didn't know that I I just thought they were trying to get [TS]

  the same unified sign in everywhere I didn't realize that you to business you [TS]

  know as independent as it seems to be interesting but it only makes sense to [TS]

  be you know for it to you know it does make sense that it's YouTube in [TS]

  particular not Google in general that might be making this acquisition [TS]

  somebody and I apologize because they don't remember it was a retweet of [TS]

  someone who don't follow but said that a while ago Vimeo had noticed that event [TS]

  that people were posting a lot of certain let's play videos and responded [TS]

  by banning which I mean I guess that's what you want for your platform and ya [TS]

  want that kind of thing they're they're a little more hard CAS and they've you [TS]

  know they've they've always sort of differentiated themselves from youtuber [TS]

  YouTube is sort of been like anything that you can legally post as video you [TS]

  can post to YouTube where you know i mean you know copyright stuff in [TS]

  particular and I'm sure that there's some kind of content based stuff that [TS]

  would get rejected directed from YouTube but if it's legal you can post in care [TS]

  what it is right you mean you can just yeah I'm sure they actually are often a [TS]

  man in the basal usually easily [TS]

  wait for someone asked taken down whereas Vimeo as always exactly they [TS]

  sort of wanted sort of artistic style and they also have restrictions about [TS]

  commercials type stuff you know where you can so I did I didn't think about [TS]

  that the licensing aspect of it which me me me me me that is more of what it is [TS]

  rather than sort of the Arts aspect of it yeah I thought it was more like we're [TS]

  doing so we don't wants let's play videos on our site I did see somebody [TS]

  tweeted that one of the things people who are fans of Twitter concerned about [TS]

  with the YouTube acquisition is that a lot of these videos get posted with [TS]

  music playing in the background and YouTube has done very very good at [TS]

  flagging such things identifying copyright music but to me that sort of [TS]

  you know and and you know I'm not a big fan of Google I think it's fair to say [TS]

  but I have to say that if you're putting copyright music and your videos and [TS]

  uploading them to a commercial website gets his hands on you [TS]

  there's sort of you know the world's tiniest violin playing the sad you know [TS]

  I understand that it's it in if you know it's one of those things like comiXology [TS]

  going to Amazon where you know it is making it worse for you as a user but [TS]

  you know come on you know copyright stuff is still using music for free is [TS]

  still have to admit a gray area [TS]

  rain had you know you had to think eventually that bubble was gonna burst [TS]

  one way or the other [TS]

  yeah and I do I think we're on the cusp of this sort of video people people [TS]

  spent you know note observing observing noting and then monetizing the fact that [TS]

  millions of people are watching hundreds and hundreds of hours of people play [TS]

  videogames [TS]

  that's gonna be honest quickly it's gonna take long before it it's like me [TS]

  who think wow these crazy kids today you know no longer see it as as fodder [TS]

  annual yeah maybe you mentioned this before but I feel like that says this is [TS]

  kind of my first [TS]

  moment of having something like that come up in from kids so yummy kids from [TS]

  you know our kids are 10 and seeing what they do in the beginning going you know [TS]

  that's so low brow but then realizing well maybe not even need to give it [TS]

  another chance and I'm sure it's just like any i mean i I feel like I'm most [TS]

  proud of myself for being as under my chin Lee has to recognize that this is [TS]

  normal that there's there's not that I shouldn't be saying that I was wrong [TS]

  that I shouldn't be seen this is weird yeah I'm kind of proud of myself an end [TS]

  wasn't until she started watching this stupid even realize that this was such a [TS]

  huge industry [TS]

  yea well your article writing the guys doing minecraft stuff in making [TS]

  ridiculous amounts of money and good for them right [TS]

  yes it's great i mean cuz it all comes down to the bottom line is attention you [TS]

  know this is not a new observation it's obvious but you know that's the one [TS]

  thing that we have collectively in the aggregate that a limited resource every [TS]

  person on the 24 hours in the day and we need to spend a certain number of hours [TS]

  that sleeping and eating and working or going to school or something so you know [TS]

  if you're capturing in the aggregate millions of hours of attention there's [TS]

  tremendous value there is simply wrong about that article recently tweeted that [TS]

  he's [TS]

  picture Jack Black Jack Black and the two of them are gonna be working on [TS]

  something to her so yeah that's so great [TS]

  which is a really which is a good fit for starters but also just given the [TS]

  fact that the guy who was working in a pub two years ago and now like mobile [TS]

  love you too my craft and so awesome but that it's all just you know a piece that [TS]

  you're doing this you know you're doing this thing that people watch for this [TS]

  reason I do these things that people watch for another reason we should do [TS]

  something together [TS]

  what else acquisition use AT&T is buying direct tv for forty five billion dollars [TS]

  you can just feel the increasing competition came I was just target as of [TS]

  yesterday we got together with friends yesterday out of town friends and we [TS]

  were talking about that that's the thing that really great about Comcast Time [TS]

  Warner merger which is really Comcast buying time warner which is almost the [TS]

  same amount of money like 46 billion dollars it would be one day of Comcast's [TS]

  argument was ok don't worry this is still gonna be ok for consumers here's [TS]

  why that's in Anderson some kind of argument they could make their and maybe [TS]

  it makes some kind of sense but the fact that they're actually saying that it [TS]

  will increase competition it would increase competition for us to consume [TS]

  our largest competitor makes no sense [TS]

  rate like if the Yankees and Red Sox merged you could say well this should be [TS]

  good for baseball for this reason or the other but you can't say it would [TS]

  increase competition because the two archrivals with you know big budgets [TS]

  DirecTV and AT&T emerging cannot increase competition he adds that it's [TS]

  classic lobbyists talk I also saw the DirecTV in particular was part of a comp [TS]

  its I think it's driven you know it could be the sort of thing or maybe he [TS]

  wouldn't have done this if they didn't have the nagging feeling that this [TS]

  Comcast Time Warner thing is gonna go through and that they kinda need you [TS]

  know they need to get bigger in the same way but that Comcast part of Comcast's [TS]

  argument that it's not anti competitive bad for consumers in a competitive way [TS]

  is that the average us' citizen has like three options are 33 at least three [TS]

  options as an alternative to Comcast and Time Warner but that that's it's not [TS]

  about cable service here on any kind of wired [TS]

  DirecTV you know that they're counting as competition something of an entirely [TS]

  different sort of the whole thing had mentioned this before I'm just glad city [TS]

  provided broadband you know very few cities have done that [TS]

  forget who I just saw somebody was was it San Diego I forget their summer in [TS]

  Southern California where their municipal municipal wi-fi and that it [TS]

  works it's it's really good and you know if it's not San Diego it somewhere else [TS]

  in Southern California but that you know you're downtown and you can just walk [TS]

  around and get on the wifi and you have you know superior to you know like LTE [TS]

  wireless internet everywhere [TS]

  yeah but those pockets are very few and far between so what you guys have you [TS]

  guys have wired broadband and who do you pay hooray where we are it was one of [TS]

  those late nineties cities vying for the title of America's Most Wired city of [TS]

  the future [TS]

  do you do to the city runs the network and they contracted with a few small [TS]

  local private companies to provide the service and come out and do the [TS]

  installation stuff like that there's a good service centers is fine [TS]

  yeah I mean it's certainly no worse than Comcast [TS]

  should be a feel good that I'm not sending Comcast my money that's their [TS]

  slogan you certainly know you know it's you know I experienced ups and downs I [TS]

  don't have any idea of experience more ups and downs than your average Comcast [TS]

  user yeah but i dont it I don't get a lot of them and I i pay for like the [TS]

  cheapest so shocker yes you need to take a break here and thank our second [TS]

  sponsor a good friends at Backblaze back blaze is unlimited unbridled [TS]

  uncomplicated backup for your Mac available anywhere you pay $5 a month [TS]

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  sounds too good to be true but it's not makes a lot of sense does it take a long [TS]

  time for your initial back up loan of your entire four gigabytes or whatever [TS]

  you have four terabytes [TS]

  however big it is to upload yeah it does actually but you can just do it during [TS]

  your free trial period and then once you're home Mac is backed up over the [TS]

  cloud to back blazes servers everything else is just incremental after that and [TS]

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  no upgrades there's no for well there is a $5 $5 a month here but it's not really [TS]

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  to a bigger thing because you only get so much now it's nothing like that just [TS]

  $5 a month for everybody for Mac great service I always say makes you sleep [TS]

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  I've been using it and it just runs in the background on your Mac nothing to [TS]

  worry about just a great service I think it's probably a great thing not just for [TS]

  all of you out there listening to the show but it's also a great thing that [TS]

  you could set up your parents or anybody like less technical family and friends [TS]

  members who have max so they you know that everything I have is getting backed [TS]

  up [TS]

  off-site just in case something bad happens in the house or river their Mac [TS]

  is great great great service if you haven't tried it I just can't imagine [TS]

  what you're waiting for and I don't even know I can't imagine why anybody would [TS]

  try it and then not sign up for it because it's just so great where do you [TS]

  go to sign up and find out more easy go to the web site WWW dot Backblaze dot [TS]

  com slash daring fireball Backblaze dot com slash during fireball by thanks to [TS]

  them going there right now yes I currently don't have [TS]

  well then you're not sure you should started started right now while [TS]

  recording the show of escape because I'm sure that won't cause any work done by [TS]

  thanks to back plays for ruining this recording of the talking [TS]

  I take it does put perspective on where if you want you know Apple the company [TS]

  with a hundred and sixty billion in the bank is buying a company for three [TS]

  billion dollars and it was good news for you know we can have if it was suing it [TS]

  comes to fruition this week I'm sure it'll pop pop back up to the top of the [TS]

  tech news was at 1:15 the size of a TNT's purchase of DirecTV do you think [TS]

  that they would wait until WWDC I I thought of that I do you know they're [TS]

  close enough now because what we're as we record today were two weeks to the [TS]

  day we're recording on Monday the 19th over two weeks to the day so I don't [TS]

  know why not you know it you know especially if they have some sort of [TS]

  consumer base story to tell about why they're doing it and what they have a [TS]

  plan together why not [TS]

  yeah why not just get all the paperwork ready to go [TS]

  don't put the signatures down until Sunday June first and then you know [TS]

  monday june 2nd have something someone like you know it's close enough then you [TS]

  got instant news right now that anybody's probably not gonna write about [TS]

  it anyway but well and they get their own they get to get to spend it their [TS]

  way [TS]

  tell their story to tell their side of the story and explain themselves first [TS]

  in a in a forum that more a richer medium than just a press release writing [TS]

  press releases can write what you want to say whereas during WWDC keynote you [TS]

  can tell it and you can use voice and slides bring doctor grapes I don't know [TS]

  I don't know but it's you know it's you know the way that can under something [TS]

  about watching people talk that different and better than just reading [TS]

  about it right the iPhone announcement 2007 would not have been the iPhone [TS]

  announcement if it had just come out [TS]

  the press release with a picture the fact that it was on on stage with the [TS]

  crowd right stands sigmund had been there [TS]

  exactly what would we have laughed at what anybody else is fondly as we did [TS]

  was it was it was just so that keynote was so amazing and then we had to sit [TS]

  there for five minutes and listen to stand segment 0 at the end and interest [TS]

  and Sigmund was dancing is it sigmund or stickman sigmund and Sigmund was to the [TS]

  iPhone keynote what christian Laettner was to the dream team remember the dream [TS]

  team the original the first time a USB same professional basketball players to [TS]

  the Olympics and it was Michael Jordan Larry Bird Magic Johnson Charles part I [TS]

  mean it's just those three that three of the top are arguably the I think well [TS]

  you know the bronze probably up there now maybe I don't know but you know at [TS]

  the time they were all three were considered arguably the single greatest [TS]

  player of all time [TS]

  all on the same team you know almost all not just all-stars but Hall of Famers [TS]

  down the line and then they had they have room for one college player and it [TS]

  could have been either Shaq who wound up having a fantastic pro career of Fame [TS]

  career [TS]

  christian Laettner from Duke a pic christian Laettner was dancing [TS]

  greatest announcement the history of consumer electronics and then one point [TS]

  just like stall in the midst of outright near pandemonium and delirium in in the [TS]

  in the Hall of a sudden there is the narcolepsy people had two passes [TS]

  smelling salts out when Jerry Yang is that there is up there in he's not the [TS]

  least charismatic [TS]

  and send them to attention like a dummy forgot to mention something that I [TS]

  wanted to during the recording with John Holt and that is this for those of you [TS]

  who will be in San Francisco during the week of WWDC I'm going to have another [TS]

  live audience episode of the talk show done this last two years as with the [TS]

  third year it's been a lot of fun and the show should be even better than [TS]

  before going to be on Tuesday that's june 3rd 6 to 9 p.m. at mezzanine in San [TS]

  Francisco we've already got the menu I don't have any ticket information yet [TS]

  don't have the URL but I will so what I'm going to do is rather than announce [TS]

  it on daring fireball I will announce it here on the show in the next episode [TS]

  about this episode 92 right now [TS]

  next episode episode 82 I will have instructions URL or something like that [TS]

  where you go to buy your tickets for the show so the first crack at tickets we [TS]

  should have about 500 available the first crack will go to the first people [TS]

  to listen to the show so if you really want to get a ticket you wanna be sure [TS]

  to get one [TS]

  pay attention keep your eyes peeled for the next episode of the talk show up [TS]

  city to give it a listen and in that show you'll find out how to get a ticket [TS]

  thanks hope to see you there [TS]

  and now back to the talk show [TS]

  so so WWC two weeks two weeks maybe when I hold off on hold off on speculation [TS]

  for your next show maybe you know get asked me questions and i know i phone I [TS]

  don't think so [TS]

  split screen I pen yeah I believe it I mean I don't think it's ridiculous and [TS]

  you know I trust mark Gurman who reported enough that I don't think that [TS]

  he you know i think is source probably you know is reasonably either in Apple [TS]

  are reasonably could be expected to do know of such a thing but I don't know I [TS]

  the devil would be in the details in terms of how it actually how you [TS]

  actually get into and out of this such a mode yeah because I think that's been [TS]

  Microsoft which tells you can use to apps at the same time but you wouldn't [TS]

  really want to write my guess is if it's true it's something that you managed [TS]

  within them the multitasking switcher in other words would that thing you get [TS]

  when you double tap the home button and then you zoom out a little bit like a [TS]

  card type you now in Iowa 7 you do and it might even help explain why they [TS]

  switched to that card type of you where you actually see what looks like windows [TS]

  of your apps as you pan left and right and that maybe you could take two of [TS]

  them and put them together and then you know but I don't know though it all [TS]

  seems you know you start thinking about this if you actually try to think it [TS]

  through and you know get a detailed down enough that you can actually hand over [TS]

  to someone and say ok built this if you start seeing how complicated it is cuz [TS]

  it almost certainly would require apps to support it explicitly because of the [TS]

  size of the app on screen would be it would be a new size it would be a new [TS]

  windows [TS]

  right because it's you know it's something that would work with if they [TS]

  announce it WWC by definition it would be part of an announcement of Iowa State [TS]

  not part of new iPad hardware so it would have to work on existing iPads and [TS]

  then so you could just take the half the size of the i pad screen and that's the [TS]

  size that the app would be running in you know 1020 2048 to be like 1024 by [TS]

  whatever I can to write but it would still be new dimensions in a new size [TS]

  yeah and it would so you couldn't just pushed together any to action only be [TS]

  able to put together two apps that support it was and how do you show the [TS]

  user which ones you can put together I don't know [TS]

  yeah and he also he is dealing with he and sort of insinuated that it might [TS]

  have implications for well I guess he said this but for data sharing between [TS]

  different out on that point I think he was I think he was guessing guessing [TS]

  yeah cause I don't think it didn't seem like that was [TS]

  what came from a source it seemed like that was his reforms yeah I don't think [TS]

  it would require the XP CD is he said yea certainly possible but again I think [TS]

  it would have to be you know you have to figure out after he see the details of [TS]

  exactly how you get into and out of the mode and then it has to be the sort of [TS]

  thing where I think the most important thing would be that you can't get into [TS]

  it accidentally cause I think that then all of a sudden you're in it's starting [TS]

  to turn into something like the Mac where people are easily confused and [TS]

  that's so big a part of why as a pro at it would be going to be great as a pro [TS]

  features something that you turn on explosively right and you just can't [TS]

  underestimate you don't want somebody like my mother or father right now that [TS]

  everything's always I know I don't play that card lately you know that if they [TS]

  know that some people will get all incensed about the non techie tech-savvy [TS]

  grandparents card but it's true it's absolutely true I mean my my parents [TS]

  both have iPad now and in the years I've gotten like one call bell again iPad [TS]

  problem and it was really came down to a building with the cellular wireless [TS]

  which is you know sort of a complicated aspect of it but in terms of just using [TS]

  it it's never been a problem whereas I think you and I talked about you did you [TS]

  get a call once when somebody was in full screen mode yeah oh yeah absolutely [TS]

  couldn't get out right exactly know that was exactly true where my my parents had [TS]

  got a new iMac and upgraded jumped a couple versions of Mac OS and never had [TS]

  full screen mode before got into it and it was a confusing from caucuses in [TS]

  there how do you quit we want to quit male and i was just go up to the menu [TS]

  and then there is no menu [TS]

  there's always that way now in full screen although I guess if you run the [TS]

  mouse up there there is a minimal because they couldn't see it in the [TS]

  first place they never even thought to run the mouse up see if there was a [TS]

  drink and getting into full screen mode accidentally [TS]

  required a phone call and I feel like whatever the iPad does 42 apps on the [TS]

  screen at the same time cannot be something that is going to get me a [TS]

  phone call if I get a phone call about it then i somebody didn't do their job [TS]

  and to me that's more important than number two which would be making it [TS]

  convenient enough that power users who know what they're doing and who really [TS]

  want to do it can get into it easy enough that it's that they end up using [TS]

  I don't know if there's a lot of people out there who want to call my iPad [TS]

  doubters but you know people who have just generally down on the iPad as I go [TS]

  you want term replacement for the mag and productivity device who who want [TS]

  more power user type features in iOS especially on the iPad may be compared [TS]

  to the phone just cuz it's big enough that you could do stuff like nobody is [TS]

  saying they want to upset the same time on the iPhone or at least nobody say I [TS]

  just feel like those sort of people Glock just gloss over how confusing [TS]

  computers in general are two 2 most people it's just if you understand it [TS]

  and you never really find yourself confused or lost on Mac OS 10 you just [TS]

  can't it's just so hard is the same people who think that widgets on and [TS]

  writer the killer feature yeah yeah I just saw something this week on ZDNet [TS]

  about how much more I didn't link to it as it was in one of the things they [TS]

  don't want to draw attention to something I think I meant it on a CD Key [TS]

  said look at how do you know how huge the usability advantage of and Raiders [TS]

  vs iOS usability he called it and it was his his home screen on both devices and [TS]

  he carries both wake for work for some reason android galaxy in iPhone and his [TS]

  iPhone home screen of course is just a bunch of apps and is en route home [TS]

  screen is a couple of apps and a bunch of widgets including a bunch of light a [TS]

  home automation ones so that he can like you know but his garage door [TS]

  changes thermostat and do all the stuff without ever entering a nap but do it [TS]

  right from his Android home screen which is cool in a geeky way it's kinda you [TS]

  know obviously makes him happy and maybe you know he's too fiddly yeah he's a [TS]

  perfect example of the sort of person who truly is better served by Android [TS]

  then I was that guy he tries too hard but calling it that is a years long [TS]

  usability advantages I think stretching it I just feel like people are vastly [TS]

  underestimate how big of a usability advantage for different people iOS has [TS]

  in terms of never making people feel like they're lost what happens you're [TS]

  into screen mode and you hit the home button what happened to both apps go [TS]

  away and replaced with your home screen cuz that's what I would expect to happen [TS]

  because whenever I hit the home button taken back to the safety of them back to [TS]

  Ground Zero oil just a home screen full of apps was the perfect solution for [TS]

  that what you home runs and let me thank our third and final sponsor the day our [TS]

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  office just fantastic [TS]

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  what it is they want where do you go to find out more and do it in such a way [TS]

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  easy barcode this month the URL of these is square / rubber thing is [TS]

  that we are in contact with them at this switch they didn't want to go talk show [TS]

  her daring fireball just / grouper square / Gruber they also have [TS]

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  code gigi my thanks to Squarespace response during the show in their [TS]

  continued support [TS]

  2010 here's where I wanted to talk about talk about 100 so I don't have you [TS]

  noticed as I tweeted a couple of times about it but a couple of weeks ago I [TS]

  bought I bought a Firefox Firefox yeah ZTE open sea Firefox OS phone I saw it I [TS]

  don't forget what side I was reading but it said that they started to sell it in [TS]

  the us- on eBay eBay story does go there and $99 smartphone unlocked of course of [TS]

  course it's so you just go there and you spend 99 bucks couple days later you get [TS]

  you get your phone I guess I should write about entering fireball attempt to [TS]

  get these things never end up writing about it but long story short not a good [TS]

  darn be a widely know that is interesting is that they copied [TS]

  conceptually and I don't mean this in a pejorative way at all I just mean in [TS]

  terms of look there following years behind the footsteps of them you know [TS]

  the modern smartphone which is a touchscreen device that more or less [TS]

  runs something like a real computer operating system the post iPhone [TS]

  smartphone right and one thing that they got right is there's only one button on [TS]

  the front home but there's a button to turn it on it's got the exact same [TS]

  buttons as the iPhone except it doesn't have a mute switch so there's an on off [TS]

  switch at the top [TS]

  just like the iPhone volume up volume down on the signed in on the front face [TS]

  underneath the screen there's just a circle in that circle is the home button [TS]

  and the home button does exactly what the home button on our funders as it [TS]

  takes you to homescreen pulled out my cunt [TS]

  21 cents I was actually I found myself very [TS]

  for an iPhone user you you do is no way to get lost or confused it's it's very [TS]

  very iPhone like in terms of what's the basic gist of how you use that I would [TS]

  say and every other regarded as a pretty bad and I don't mean to just pop your [TS]

  sim out and put it in you know what I get another i cant because my sim is a [TS]

  Verizon SIM GSM phone so it doesn't work and I was I was going to go to tmobile [TS]

  and just get buy a SIM card from them because I've been curious I've been [TS]

  curious about t-mobile ever since it seems like they're the most inner after [TS]

  that I would say the best carrier a non-us but they're the most interesting [TS]

  character that they seem to have the best plans the most the best pricing and [TS]

  a pretty cool you know did seem better did better company than Verizon or AT&T [TS]

  albeit with a smaller network coverage but it's like 50 to star in the get one [TS]

  for its like 50 bucks a month its prepaid you don't have to get on a [TS]

  contractor but even 50 bucks felt like too much to waste on this we're at $1 [TS]

  follow you know and I don't regret $200 I feel like it I got $100 worth of [TS]

  curiosity answered and just using it at home on the WiFi network is more than [TS]

  enough to satisfy my questions about it I don't feel I don't feel like the [TS]

  ability to actually go out and use it outside the house right would answer [TS]

  anything other than you know so I haven't been able to send any text [TS]

  messages because i dont have a sim card in it and I haven't been able to place [TS]

  an actual phone call but i i i don't like talking on the phone anyone who [TS]

  does that [TS]

  who uses the phony the phone and when I say that it's not good when I say that [TS]

  it's not good I do not mean in comparison to its $700 iPhone private [TS]

  s which is truly not a fair comparison a $99 unlocked phone to an iPhone 5s that [TS]

  in line locked in a cell for seven or eight hundred dollars which is that [TS]

  sound fair comparison I would say and I don't have it here so I can you know I [TS]

  don't have one in the house but where nokia has been going on in our Nokia's [TS]

  handset division is part of Microsoft and Motorola has been going on Android [TS]

  in terms of lower-cost smartphones and I did see when I was out it built for the [TS]

  Microsoft conference a month ago I saw at low end Nokia Windows Phone handset [TS]

  that I think unlocked was I I could be wrong but it was $129.00 way better than [TS]

  this device like you now and again not you know definitely not iPhone 5 55 °c [TS]

  iPhone 5 anything caliber not even iphone4s caliber but pretty good like in [TS]

  terms of things like frame rate and you know below to web page and slide your [TS]

  thong around and had to keep up with your thumb and stuff like that pretty [TS]

  good and I know Motorola has a new staff with model numbers but they have one [TS]

  that's like $129 so they're not quite at the $99 price I paid for this but [TS]

  hundred and twenty-nine the 99 is pretty fair comparison and this this phone has [TS]

  got a lot of problems [TS]

  video so when you shoot video on this phone its like 380 by like 240 pixels [TS]

  which is really a pretty pretty low size and its fifteen frames per second so you [TS]

  know i mean it's it's almost like it that's all they were able to to put in [TS]

  here I almost forget it better than nothing but it's not much better than [TS]

  that can you remember to remember that the original iPhone Video yeah that's [TS]

  that I i I caught myself that can't be right and then they went back and looked [TS]

  as I get that was right [TS]

  but I do think I will bet that that was the sort of decision Apple made with the [TS]

  original iPhone where they probably could have done something like shot [TS]

  postage stamp sized fifteen frames per second video and they relate it be [TS]

  better not even shoot video then offer video like that eventually there was a [TS]

  nap network video come to the iPhone was it was it was a 3G 3G asked as the 3G [TS]

  and 3G only has an even better processor break the 3G only added 3G and a new a [TS]

  new case design but technically it wouldn't name didn't increase the CPUs [TS]

  you know did increase the Ramdin increase the storage the one and only [TS]

  technical difference other than the outside appearance between the original [TS]

  iPhone and a 3G was 3G maybe there was a jailbreak app that added video to the [TS]

  earlier ones cause I remember that there was one and I never i'd never installed [TS]

  but by that point the cameras just really bad the video it's not just that [TS]

  the viewers it really takes terrible terrible photographs and again I so with [TS]

  the Nokia won the Nokias low-end $129 smartphone the only photos I got to take [TS]

  I was in a room in Moscow knee where they had demo unit set up for media to [TS]

  play with i mean but I could buy the Nokia as you know if anything if [TS]

  anything I'll just a Buddhist higher there yeah yeah and from everything I've [TS]

  read about it at a pretty big higher that he wasn't just the name and he [TS]

  actually was largely you know play a big part in making their either one in 24 [TS]

  2011 I mean thats marlys suggests that the two best companies that mobile [TS]

  photography right now or apple and Nokia and it doesn't matter which one you [TS]

  think is one in which ones too [TS]

  you know they're just leading the way in terms of image quality and features and [TS]

  stuff and this from from GTE is just feels like it's at least 10 years old [TS]

  and it makes me wonder about Firefox in general I mean I was never really a [TS]

  full-time Firefox user on desktop but it's just it's like a dead why are they [TS]

  with it just feels to me like this is just a waste of time [TS]

  their part I don't know I don't feel like they're they feel locked out [TS]

  because these mobile platforms don't allow released iOS certainly doesn't [TS]

  allow them to include their own rendering engine you know even chrome [TS]

  doesn't get to Chrome for iOS doesn't use the Chrome rendering engine it's [TS]

  just a chrome wrapper around the system's WebKit virgin you know if [TS]

  you're a company like Mozilla that you know that the whole point of your [TS]

  existence is to have your rendering engine out there [TS]

  powering people surfing the web I could see why you would want a mobile [TS]

  operating system of your own see you could do it but if this is how far [TS]

  behind you are for its gonna be tough to get anybody to lie I just can't see why [TS]

  anybody would buy it if you have the $99 to spend on it I just can't see why you [TS]

  wouldn't save up to 30 and get a Motorola Android phone or get a Nokia [TS]

  Windows 8 Phone when you get so much more and much more likely to get the [TS]

  entrance well statistically more people would get the entrance yeah well they [TS]

  would right now at least statistically although you know because you're buying [TS]

  into a bear ecosystem right I just feel and I feel like the only other reason I [TS]

  can think of them someone will buy this phone would be the politics of it you [TS]

  know that you support the whole political angle of Mozilla open web and [TS]

  etcetera etcetera but I just don't see how there's enough people out there that [TS]

  it's statistically valid number of people looks like it erase my notebook [TS]

  I had to load but there were written using that the notebook out on actual [TS]

  phone and and it seems as though now they're gone it's a shame I can remember [TS]

  a lot of them one of the big problems with this operating system is it does [TS]

  not support selecting text to rate so there's no cut copy and so it's a lot [TS]

  like it is and you know and there's you know i twittered about some of these [TS]

  things and people you know who support you know you know we're fans of that I [TS]

  guess you know try to call me a hypocrite for it that you know how is it [TS]

  ok for Apple in 2007 when the iPhone was new and it's not ok now what it because [TS]

  it's not 2007 anymore right it's you know the world moved on and other people [TS]

  called me out the other way and when I said that it was unacceptable it was [TS]

  acceptable for Apple them but it's unacceptable now he said no it was [TS]

  unacceptable for Apple then to it used to drive me nuts but my point in them is [TS]

  that no that was annoying then it was like an obvious shortcomings but it was [TS]

  clearly acceptable because we were using in your even admitting that you still [TS]

  used right we were frustrated by but we see you when I say it's unacceptable now [TS]

  I mean I can't imagine why someone would buy this phone where they can't select [TS]

  cut copy and paste win for about the same amount of money they could buy a [TS]

  different one that does mean everything has to be taken in context right i mean [TS]

  the context of 2007 was the iPhone was an amazing phone for the time even with [TS]

  that people when we did put up with it with those shortcomings and I just can't [TS]

  see why someone would put up with these now completed arrangement note I think [TS]

  it's cause I'm and let the battery died I don't know [TS]

  than likely you're saying about it you can't even the web browser which you [TS]

  would think would be the one thing that might be good because it's you know [TS]

  Firefox's own thing it's not good you can't do things like jumped like when [TS]

  you scroll down you can't jump to the top [TS]

  it doesn't have the iPhone thing where you just tapped out this bar across the [TS]

  top but the only way to get to the interface to manage multiple tabs at the [TS]

  top so if you scroll down on a web paging gonna switch to another tab that [TS]

  open you have to sit there and click click click click click click click [TS]

  click click click click click click click click click click click click and [TS]

  and it doesn't really have a lot of inertia either so if it's a long enough [TS]

  pages you've been reading I'm not exaggerating how many fiction need to [TS]

  get to the top which is where the top management is and there's no bookmarks [TS]

  therefore there is no bookmark let's and I used you know there's no book there [TS]

  are no bookmarks now I can tell there's bookmarks I don't know how you how you [TS]

  can you make them just our bookmarks here I just found it well let's just say [TS]

  that the book my not intuitive no not intuitive the email client isn't too bad [TS]

  it's got a decent IMAP client to usable at least but they just you know and it's [TS]

  this whole [TS]

  funderburk is a branded Thunderbirds know they owned by talk about them [TS]

  anymore they call it it's just called email and in fact I think what's [TS]

  interesting is they they spell it [TS]

  E dash capital and to me it looks like and I you know god knows I love some [TS]

  curmudgeonly grammar and spelling and stuff like that but the dashing email [TS]

  feels kinda old timey bills will nineteen nineties [TS]

  and having called marketplace which is like their app store but really it's [TS]

  just sort of like a directory of mobile operated mobile-optimized websites and [TS]

  when you create an app download an app out of one of these things it's really [TS]

  just you know like when you on iOS like when you use the + button and save web [TS]

  page as a nap and just you just lose the browser so that's like what the Twitter [TS]

  app for this thing is the Twitter app is just a it seems a little bit different [TS]

  than when you go to Twitter on an iPhone but not much I haven't done that in so [TS]

  long and therefore though you can't do anything now you can't do anything like [TS]

  have two different accounts anymore than you can have two accounts on you know [TS]

  the Twitter website there's no account switching so it's just you know when you [TS]

  use Twitter on this it's just the mobile Twitter website [TS]

  remember that those days of using the mobile Major League Baseball site and [TS]

  all those the website and mobile [TS]

  well that's a lot like used in this mostly most of the right now because [TS]

  they were better since they let it fester and so on the one hand there's [TS]

  the web in what you call the web as a developer can mean different things to [TS]

  different people wondering could just be using HTML CSS and Javascript to do the [TS]

  actual layout and development of the app and webOS work that way right from palm [TS]

  and later HP wraps were really just sort of like bundles that inside were [TS]

  implemented using HTML CSS and Javascript and is something wrong with [TS]

  that although there's some performance problems you have to overcome if you [TS]

  want to be compared favorably to native code like Objective C running on iOS or [TS]

  even the Java type byte code that you run on Android [TS]

  but it could be overcome but what Firefox OS does really is just load [TS]

  things you know actual web sites over the internet and save them and so a lot [TS]

  of stuff stops working if you don't have an internet connection like there's [TS]

  games they called this is games you can get but then if you don't have an [TS]

  internet connection the games don't load because it can't connect to the server [TS]

  anymore and it's not entirely cash locally and I just don't feel like [TS]

  there's any you know I don't we haven't gotten to a place where it always having [TS]

  an internet connection is a thing I thought you know what was the thinking [TS]

  about you by the for similar reasons I want to find out what they have the [TS]

  other said that you bought the Fire tablet right now have the Nexus 7 Nexus [TS]

  7 ya heard someone got that great it was it was it was alright I mean it's you [TS]

  know for anything in that case that the price is it was only you know this was a [TS]

  couple years ago now and it was only 200 bucks gigabyte it was a better price [TS]

  point that there wasn't an iPad available at that price point and you [TS]

  know there's it's a system that has absent Android operating system so it [TS]

  was ok but not a year into using and i ended up having battery problems and [TS]

  then you know how to reset it recondition it to get it to the point [TS]

  where I would really hold a charge for a good amount of time and then I one of [TS]

  things I want to use it for was listening to music on my desk as I was [TS]

  working and it was just there was a lot of bleed through in the device of sound [TS]

  from other electronics the kind of promise of used to have been since like [TS]

  we used to have those problems like I used to have to turn off that they want [TS]

  to do a podcast for that kind of thing as too close to your laptop you'd get [TS]

  weird back yeah and it wasn't it wasn't headphones the same had once they use of [TS]

  my iPhone and everything else I don't get it with any other device so that the [TS]

  thing about this Firefox found it has a four-point 20 inch screen I think the [TS]

  aspect ratio is a little bit wider when you're holding a portrait than the [TS]

  iPhone but roughly its roughly an iPhone sized device and they do find that [TS]

  comfortable [TS]

  don't find myself wishing that the screen bigger I don't know I feel like I [TS]

  don't know going on and it's going to be a problem for me if the new iPhone is [TS]

  bigger yeah I know I'll wait till I see it but I don't feel like I'm on the [TS]

  other hand i guess im curious about it and it occurred to me when I was [TS]

  thinking about how the buttons at the same as the iPhone except for the lack [TS]

  of a mute switch but most phones don't have mute switches and eyeball who is [TS]

  notoriously sort of minimalist on including hardware buttons you know I [TS]

  love the mute switch on the iPhone [TS]

  love the mute switch on the iPhone [TS]

  I i dont like whenever I try out these other phones and you have to do it for [TS]

  this one way to get into mute as you hold down the power button and instead [TS]

  of as oda turn off the phone but you get a menu with four options turn off [TS]

  airplane mode or turn it on silent incoming calls [TS]

  restart power off and I think Android does the same thing where if you want to [TS]

  be an Android phone that I had a while ago did what you wanted to turn off the [TS]

  sound you hold down the power button wait for a menu to come up and then hit [TS]

  I love that like you know at the start of my sons concert a couple weeks ago i [TS]

  I didn't take my phone out of my pocket I just you know just toggle the hand and [TS]

  toggle switch and I know it's not gonna make a sound I do the opposite and they [TS]

  are almost always have it in me and only when I'm expecting a call that I want [TS]

  you right turn [TS]

  yeah I could do that too or just to double check it really is a lot of times [TS]

  when I want to turn on mute it already is on you I thought you were gonna say [TS]

  that you do the opposition when your son's school is going to a concert you [TS]

  turn your phone up real life haha I gotta take this sorry that it's a 45 [TS]

  minutes in the lobby during game please turn off a lot of I do the opposite yet [TS]

  I gotta tell me when this silence one of my own mind up and I've set my ringtone [TS]

  to an appropriate lyrics yet wrestled out of school program by some some [TS]

  bouncers [TS]

  now it seemed like a back in the fall it's in a few things people predicting [TS]

  that Firefox OS was really gonna take off and change the playing field if they [TS]

  had come out of this in 2009 [TS]

  you know two years after the iPhone I would say maybe you know you know [TS]

  because that's when do it was new to you like it was maybe a little bit ahead of [TS]

  that but it was the end of 2008 when the first Android phone came out they TTC [TS]

  TTC 1 forget what it was called that it was brown you know keyboard that came [TS]

  out of the side and had a lot of problems and a lot of problems just like [TS]

  this where you know it was like they were still growing how do you know [TS]

  they'd started with the idea of an operating system that required a [TS]

  keyboard and required and up down left rice device so if you wanted to select [TS]

  text on that Android phone you had to use the rollerball you couldn't use your [TS]

  finger on the touchscreen you had to go to the rollerball you know it just feels [TS]

  like something from that era just it's just a long long time ago though since I [TS]

  could have used a fan of any operating system you can even select text just [TS]

  feels like the end it just makes me think that Mozilla as a whole is just [TS]

  off in their own an echo chamber in terms of you know the politics of the [TS]

  whole thing is the only reason keeping it afloat and and whatever remaining [TS]

  traction or momentum I guess that they have of all the people who switched to [TS]

  Firefox on Windows a decade ago [TS]

  you know still giving them some revenue because they go up to the search bar in [TS]

  search through Google and that they have a revenue-sharing deal with Google but [TS]

  that's it all [TS]

  you know have anything that's going on that gives them any value is ten years [TS]

  old they're still nowhere in terms of actual mobile kinda sad but not [TS]

  surprising but open but totally open john wants thanks for joining me I said [TS]

  we call a show where she tell people to go to go to your very nice web very nice [TS]

  website dotnet and your your podcast is called don't make me go back there we [TS]

  should buy that you don't make me turn this turning this on me we turn this car [TS]

  automobile over with on the freeway with turning this car around with John [TS]

  Armstrong and Casey Casey less likely to about three days to get get kicked out [TS]

  of school in a car accident [TS]

  yeah I don't text and drive but I do turn my ringer up during the school play [TS]