The Talk Show

133: ‘The MacGuffin Tractor’, With Special Guest Serenity Caldwell


  alright don't know jack hammer is no law no instruments thank god it was the [TS]

  funniest coincident over there any way certainly Caldwell is here yesterday we [TS]

  tried to record this episode and I had a jackhammer outside my window and then [TS]

  when that stopped a long career shutout outside surrendered his window with a [TS]

  rock mark the the biggest one more I've ever seen for a portable on group it was [TS]

  quite something but not very conducive to podcasting what that Big John Deere [TS]

  that was fixin never did get pretty much that we know easier louder that's right [TS]

  you never did never to fix the tractor whatever the MacGuffin tractor right so [TS]

  I don't have a lot going on new iMacs no no no no no MacBooks no new MacBooks [TS]

  they are still on the on the watch list I don't know if we'll get new MacBooks [TS]

  before the end of the year I would have guessed I think if we would have it [TS]

  would have happened all at once [TS]

  yeah yeah I don't see there's no need to have a third nonexistent event this is [TS]

  where I being a podcaster I'm starting to get lazy I'm not super well informed [TS]

  on the new iMacs are you [TS]

  yeah I mean I guess I got you covered john Payne got the information a little [TS]

  bit early and was able to basically an FAQ of epic proportions to fill out so [TS]

  we've got new 21.5 inch iMacs is the biggest news and they are for cairo it's [TS]

  only like the original 27 inch iMac it's only the top end model that threaten us [TS]

  you can still get 21.5 inch iMac Center your normal for her than average [TS]

  resolution quality in comparison to the rest of the Mac and iOS line but those [TS]

  started I think $14.99 [TS]

  finance for K or slightly more than four ka think it's like fork 8.5 with in [TS]

  cruised color definition they're using the same I don't know the phrase off the [TS]

  top of my head because of a bad film student but they're basically using the [TS]

  same color profiles as you would with the digital projectors so it allows it [TS]

  to be more true to life when you're editing when your color correcting video [TS]

  and photo photography and the 27 inch iMacs get that you don't get a boost [TS]

  above their five k they're still five K and medical and fire to just get sucked [TS]

  into their beautiful screen but they also have improved definition and they [TS]

  get sky Lake Intel's next-generation processor has been a long time coming [TS]

  but no Thunderbolt three and the 21.5 inch iMacs are still stuck on rockwell's [TS]

  because the integrated Intel processor graphics processor doesn't play nice [TS]

  with yet because route maps yeah so now my year old 5 can act it is outdated a [TS]

  little bit outdated I was eight I was looking at some of the best I think [TS]

  Jason Snell's review had a national benchmarks from deep bench and it was [TS]

  saying oh yeah the new 21.5 inch iMac outpaces 445 K 27 inch iMacs I'm kind of [TS]

  glad I waited now though I'm still I'm gonna go in for the 21.5 inches so the [TS]

  27 inches still gonna cook bacon with fancy sky like [TS]

  jumbled I don't feel too bad about it all you got a whole year as the king of [TS]

  the hill and I still subscribe to the III like to buy a Mac accident and then [TS]

  use it until four years until it gets low as I still find it even with Dropbox [TS]

  iCloud and other things I still find it takes me forever to get a Mac setup just [TS]

  the way I want yes even though I mean it's been it's gotten a lot better than [TS]

  it used to be where I still remember the days of just having to clone my hard [TS]

  drive because the idea of reinstalling all of my applications and to you my [TS]

  preferences just made me want [TS]

  throw up but yeah I i feel the same way I still have a 2008 MacBook Pro unibody [TS]

  MacBook Pro that I put an SSD end three years ago and it's still almost as fast [TS]

  as my macbook air it's a pain in the butt has its fifteen inches and it's not [TS]

  really a super portable machine and it's not right but it's one of those things [TS]

  where like it still perfectly good and it still fast I feel we're just being [TS]

  like no sorry you're gonna go in a drawer anywhere you really can't do that [TS]

  for an iMac no I i really I do what I did last year about this is I just [TS]

  bought the best one that they would so I just maxed out the RAM I got the one [TS]

  terabyte SST so you know it's like 3003 $3,500 money but my thinking is just max [TS]

  it out and I use it for at least four years and then by the time I upgraded [TS]

  but anyway it's the color stuff hurts a little bit because I think they are [TS]

  correct me if I'm wrong you probably know more about this to me to me that [TS]

  the old consumer gold standard was the sRGB color space yes correct and the [TS]

  basic gist if you just want to get a handle on this is that the new color [TS]

  space that that all of these retina displays both the 21 inches and the 27 [TS]

  inch is significantly bigger than sRGB it's it's much more of a pro color space [TS]

  very much so I'm very very similar to the kind of output that you're going to [TS]

  get onto shore projectors and i'm looking up for days [TS]

  FAQ now so I can actually have specific terms they're using DCI P three which is [TS]

  the same color spaces by digital movie theaters and they're using a different [TS]

  led type display now it's a more advanced red green phosphor led which [TS]

  allows them to do better color balance and hit wider ranges of colors that [TS]

  combined with the new Ghostface really [TS]

  really makes for some crystal clear photos and video did not not that the [TS]

  five kids was hurting in that before but I do feel that professional professional [TS]

  editors are going to hear that and just be like why don't I own this machine why [TS]

  can't I just replace it away I can't I just have to spend a ton of money and I [TS]

  think it's funny it's funny the way that even with the max they're sort of as [TS]

  they marched towards this already [TS]

  lineup I mean it's it's year-by-year March for now it's by far the [TS]

  overwhelming majority of the project products are alright finally and it's [TS]

  funny the way it sort of follows like the president that they've set with the [TS]

  iPad's like to me that that 21 inch iMac is sorta like the iPad Mini compared to [TS]

  the iPad air which is the 27 inch iMac so it gets everything the year ahead [TS]

  because retina first now a year later you can only get the 27 engine red and [TS]

  the 21 inch does exactly what the 27 instead last year which is there's a [TS]

  high-end model with a Retina display but you can still get that done so my guess [TS]

  is by next year there will be no more naan bread IMAX [TS]

  their only be even higher resolution written IMAX yeah yeah i i really like [TS]

  this from a business standpoint it seems like a good way to rule things out at [TS]

  the lake over these displays are too expensive for your average user to want [TS]

  to wait till three thousand plus dollars so we're gonna put him in the high-end [TS]

  models for the people who are really going to appreciate them and be able to [TS]

  spend money on them and then the more money they spend on them the more orders [TS]

  that we can place with our suppliers the more orders we can place their suppliers [TS]

  we can bring the cost down and it just trickles down into the rest of the rest [TS]

  of the line the what he called the low end model I don't even know what it used [TS]

  to be but it's it is kind of its seems kinda wimpy [TS]

  1690 like [TS]

  none of us really talk about her anymore I mean it's gotten away from us but when [TS]

  it's half the speed guards as the one that only $400 more kind of sticks out [TS]

  definitely an upsell I mean I have to assume that these the low-end models are [TS]

  really designed for the education market or they're designed for the folks who oh [TS]

  well you just need an iMac in your place of business or you need a iMac this [TS]

  essentially a glorified displayed to play a movie on education anymore [TS]

  because I think that this immense of Education has gone to laptop form [TS]

  factors of you know a lot of Chromebooks let's for sure no question but you know [TS]

  it doesn't seem to me like school and end is a practical aspect of that too [TS]

  like if you're gonna go with IMAX you need to set them up in a permanent spot [TS]

  whereas the whole just moving special election but I'm familiar with that my [TS]

  son with the elementary school it's that they can take the Chromebooks and the [TS]

  MacBooks out when they need them and work we know on the regular desks that [TS]

  they used for everything else yeah you don't need to go into a separate [TS]

  computer and I think I'm more and more thinking administration was exactly [TS]

  you're looking at your nonprofit's for people who really don't have a big [TS]

  budget for their electronics which is sad little bit in 2015 or if you're just [TS]

  gonna use it as the machine at the front desk for people to sign in or something [TS]

  and you really don't need performance if you haven't switched already to an iPad [TS]

  but also people complaining about 900 people are complaining that the hard [TS]

  drive is 5400 rpm yeah I'm I'm I would rather complain that they're not a [TS]

  sixties in the [TS]

  by default but you know if I guess we want to complain about hard drives [TS]

  we can complain about hard drives me but I think it has something to do with the [TS]

  21.5 inches 2.5 inch hard drive as opposed to a 3.5 inch drives so little [TS]

  bit trickier there ya in a weird way even though it's 21 inches it's sort of [TS]

  like that in some ways I think the guts of a laptop will when you think about [TS]

  how thin the twenty fun point five inch iMac is and just how much space of that [TS]

  has to be filled with oh you know giant retina display and cooling said giant [TS]

  Retina Display you really don't have all that much more area to put in high-level [TS]

  chips without necessary unless unless they figure out a way to flatten silicon [TS]

  even more like oh yes we're going to line the edges of the iMac display with [TS]

  with silicon chips now I did notice to the 21 in the storage for flash only [TS]

  goes up to 512 [TS]

  a terabyte years but I guess that kind of makes sense I feel like there's a [TS]

  terabyte of fights towards is still very expensive relative to hard drive prices [TS]

  for sure and I guess once you're in that sort of budget range you're looking at [TS]

  the 27 inch anyway yeah when I was pricing out my 20 15 and for me i i [TS]

  prefer slightly the 20 15 space for my desk because I don't know the 27 inch [TS]

  thick is gorgeous but i feel myself getting lost in that space especially in [TS]

  retina it's just it's too much too much for me unless I'm editing video in which [TS]

  case I'll this is nice pixel for pixel for kate is great but when I was pricing [TS]

  out my 21.5 inch iMac [TS]

  I was looking at the braces like alright so I'm upgrade to a fusion drive and I'm [TS]

  upgrading the memory [TS]

  putting on a magic trackpad because and then i'm looking at the price I'm like [TS]

  this is basically the price of a mid-level high level 27 inch iMac and I [TS]

  yeah I think you're absolutely right where people look at that price like [TS]

  well but I could go bigger and bigger would make bigger is always better rate [TS]

  and the most part I i you know I get there are certain circumstances where I [TS]

  actually think a 21.5 is better than a twenty-seven but I think for the vast [TS]

  majority of users alike so I can get a bigger screen for the same amount of [TS]

  tweaking is you know I would pay for trying to upgrade the internals of a [TS]

  twenty 15 sign me up is all of the RAM you know this is the RAM soldered onto [TS]

  the motherboard is in the twenty 15 it is not in the twenty 1717 the 28th so [TS]

  it's just another way where there is sort of a consumer's last pro split [TS]

  between 21 and 27 it's very I think the 21 is still very much marketed towards [TS]

  the end even the entry level user but the user who either has their first Mac [TS]

  or is about to get their first Mac and needs a desktop or a laptop and iPad I [TS]

  kind of feel I i understand you know that there's a couple people on Twitter [TS]

  and email me about the soldering the RAM and it seems like that's a real sticking [TS]

  point for certain segment of the audience but I really feel like it's [TS]

  almost like we're lucky that you can do it I can hear the machines anymore just [TS]

  not the way of the future [TS]

  your computers from Apple come out of China completely set so my dad you know [TS]

  I i've you know take it you know so that the fact that you can still add you to [TS]

  do with the RAM on your own on the 27 inch take that as a win and I wouldn't [TS]

  lose much sleep over the 21.5 being you know you choose either 16 then live with [TS]

  it forever [TS]

  exactly I would I would much prefer to be able to [TS]

  to remove in and cuddle with Ram and there's a there's a model to do that but [TS]

  for the again the average user I just don't think there's now and I feel like [TS]

  it's another it's another way that the iOS devices again I i you know people [TS]

  keep asking Apple keeps saying no we're not going to have one operating system [TS]

  for everything and i really think that they're serious about it but they are [TS]

  you you can see where you know one platform is going by where the other [TS]

  platform is gone first and the iOS hardware model of there's nothing that [TS]

  you can alter or adjust there's no way to put a memory card in to expand the [TS]

  storage or anything like that is definitely the way the Mac is heading [TS]

  and I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing anymore I know there's a lot [TS]

  of people have been arms words repairable and what if I want to tinker [TS]

  with my computer Bild computer it's just not going to be from Apple I don't see [TS]

  that there's something wrong with Apple saying you know what we know what the [TS]

  best processors in the market are gonna be we know what the the best memories [TS]

  going to be and we're going to package it up in a in a package that actually [TS]

  makes sense for you as a user that would give you real world usage I mean we've [TS]

  never been able to tinker with an iPhone's internals I don't think [TS]

  anybody's complaining about that because most people wouldn't know how to even [TS]

  begin to solder microarchitecture it's only because the IMAX architecture is [TS]

  big enough that we at one point we're able to feasibly play around with it [TS]

  there were like yeah we can totally build a better computer that Apple no [TS]

  problem [TS]

  Apple's totally wrong you don't need a us-based you need more than 8 gigabytes [TS]

  of RAM and that I kinda agree with the general population but but still I I [TS]

  don't think it's necessarily a bad thing and then last you touch son has a few [TS]

  minutes ago but it's at this point and I don't think the macros down I think that [TS]

  there will be a new one [TS]

  some point but who knows when and you don't have to just look at the new Darth [TS]

  Vader Mac Pro you could just look back [TS]

  maybe even gone back close to 10 years now that the Mac Pro just does not see [TS]

  updates anywhere near on a yearly schedule no it doesn't make sense also [TS]

  to be perfectly honest because the Mac Pro as such different internals than the [TS]

  other the other two lines and because they're internals are very at least at [TS]

  this point very hog-tied to Intel's rollout schedule like it doesn't make [TS]

  sense for the for the Mac Pro to be updated until they can have a processor [TS]

  that has full Thunderbolt 3 functionality so they could you know say [TS]

  release the retina display with wonderful three so that people could [TS]

  have their therefore k display without an iMac but it doesn't like I don't know [TS]

  it seems it seems silly to me to push like incremental updates to the MacBook [TS]

  Pro or iMac the macro because the only the only people who are buying it are at [TS]

  this point are serious Bros because the my Mac has filled that kind of semi-pro [TS]

  hole so if you're buying a serious pro machine you're only gonna upgrade your [TS]

  serious Pro machine like we were talking about earlier when year old pro machine [TS]

  is about ready to die or if it does something so spectacularly different [TS]

  that is going to be better for you [TS]

  yeah but for some people I think it's clearly the the big iMac 27 inch iMac is [TS]

  the the proper Pro machine for them like I'm thinking like the top especially [TS]

  like photographers and video editors because of the extra color space because [TS]

  there is no retina display from Apple you know the only way to get it [TS]

  anything like a Retina Display is sort of a hack at this point with the Mac Pro [TS]

  it I think it's clearly the better machine but then I wonder if they buy [TS]

  them now they're gonna be mad if you know Mac Pros are announced the WBC or [TS]

  something like that yeah where they go and now we have a thunderbolt 3 Retina [TS]

  Display I mean when you're talking about that kind of a space it depends on what [TS]

  projects you working on right now right if they need retina support if they're [TS]

  working on for gay video and actively doing that for their job they're going [TS]

  to want a good forty monitor and the real question is well can I get that [TS]

  from a third party and is it still look great [TS]

  or do I want to go [TS]

  to you know machine that has DCI color space and use that instead and I think [TS]

  that might be the the side effect will they will they be than grumpy you if [TS]

  Apple's like yes now we have a probe that supports the retina display there [TS]

  but if they needed that functionality six months ago then that that [TS]

  announcement six months later isn't going to help them to help them finish [TS]

  this project today maybe you know maybe this is wishful thinking but maybe once [TS]

  I feel like in a lot of ways all of these machines that the move to read now [TS]

  has been difficult for every single thing because it's always a lot because [TS]

  you're effectively going to four times the pixels you know at least at some [TS]

  point you're gonna say here's a new here's a new machine that replaces one [TS]

  from last year and it has four times the pictures right i mean in shows like it [TS]

  was a huge deal when the iPhone 4 when 2010 and the iMac iPad took a lot of [TS]

  follow max took a long time the following was only on one model the 15 [TS]

  inch MacBook Pro at first and I feel like the Mac Pro is the last and it's [TS]

  the hardest because they can't just seal it all up like with a member that the [TS]

  crazy story about how they got 25 K iMac last year was with this weird internal [TS]

  how are they driving all those pixels when it seems like there isn't a [TS]

  graphics card to do it and they had to write their own you know there are you [TS]

  ok right now had to invent hardware to do it with a Mac Pro they really are [TS]

  stuck waiting on Thunderbolt three cuz it has to be cable yet they can't they [TS]

  can trade their own graphics controller machine that they're not you know if [TS]

  they just don't have the they don't have the flexibility right now without having [TS]

  a displayed they connect via 303 or something along those lines so maybe [TS]

  once they make this one going maybe once they make that leap and maybe you know i [TS]

  i i can't help but think it's a 2016 think that at some point in 2016 whether [TS]

  it's early in the year [TS]

  WTC or next october at the latest that they'll have a Mac Pro update and aid [TS]

  you know whatever they're going to call it [TS]

  Cinema Display Thunderbolt three [TS]

  display whatever but a stand-alone Retina Display comfortable or even [TS]

  better than the five cash Mac display for Mac Pros [TS]

  by then maybe once they make that leap maybe then the Mac Pro can see slightly [TS]

  more regular incremental updates because they've already made that jump and he [TS]

  can just sort of keep he maintained right keep dipping in with the latest [TS]

  and greatest incremental updates from Intel yes I mean until until they decide [TS]

  to make another logical leap which Intel is unable to [TS]

  if you like the more time that power pc's and we're suddenly in the early two [TS]

  thousands it's it's so weird to me that all of a sudden you know Intel which we [TS]

  used to hold up this kind of the gold standard of Lake regular text updates is [TS]

  now very much a little drunk where her what MacBook Pros were waiting on [TS]

  probable chips for a very long time [TS]

  the new I'm actually waiting on Sky lake and and she shipped half-and-half [TS]

  stuff is so crazy the macros are probably waiting on Sky leak and [TS]

  Thunderball 32 to build proper Cinema Display is why I wonder also how long [TS]

  AAPL is going to continue being like well we have to wait around for our [TS]

  manufacturing partners as they really they've cut most of that out on the on [TS]

  the iOS line you know they're they're not waiting around for a lot of people [TS]

  cause they're building their own chips now I well I don't know I don't think [TS]

  they can do that on the high end process ID with it with Intel yea certainly not [TS]

  right now and then they even in the foreseeable future if you know in this [TS]

  is rabbit hole we don't have to go down but the whole idea of arm-based max [TS]

  clearly in the same way that retina came in at you know step-by-step arm-based [TS]

  max if it ever happens are gonna come in not all at once but step by step and [TS]

  it's gonna start with the you know one port MacBook oh yeah it all started the [TS]

  very low and I don't even yeah I can't I can't imagine and are an arm-based Mac [TS]

  Pros [TS]

  definitely a ways away yeah that's possible but it's you know that's that's [TS]

  outside the event horizon and yes I guess the thing that leaves people with [TS]

  a bad taste amount though is that if you if you are a premium customer and you [TS]

  have money to burn [TS]

  it's easy to feel confident that you've got the best thing you can just go in [TS]

  and you know if your gonna buy an iPhone if you're willing to if you like the [TS]

  bigger size or just willing to put up with a bigger size if you get the 60 S [TS]

  Plus and you max the storage you know you're getting the best of everything [TS]

  your got the image stabilization on the camera and all the best performance and [TS]

  if you don't like the bigger size you know exactly what you're missing out you [TS]

  are you missing out on his image stabilization and you've got the best [TS]

  iPhone iPad it's really easy to get the best iPad everybody knows that the new [TS]

  iPad Pro is going to be the most powerful iPad and it's the only one that [TS]

  has the the new you know pen-based green pencil or pen yeah so you know and you [TS]

  know what the tradeoff is it's the physical size of the device and I think [TS]

  with these people with a bad taste in our mouths when they've dropped a lot of [TS]

  money on a Mac Pro rig is the head that they look around in there like I don't [TS]

  have the best of anything [TS]

  yeah I'm it I'm in this purgatory this probe this pro purgatory hell yeah I [TS]

  mean I've talked to a lot of I have a lot of friends in the film industry a [TS]

  lot of people have been slowly but surely switching away from Mac Pros and [TS]

  I guess Mac Pros make sense to a certain extent I guess if you want to rig up you [TS]

  know a massive yeah I shouldn't say that they don't have the best of everything [TS]

  they do have the best expansion and they do have liked for certain [TS]

  computationally intensive tasks that the having a course or however many course [TS]

  you can make something out of six right you can really you know you can do [TS]

  certain tasks that if you can split them up in parallel like that really you can [TS]

  see tremendous advantages so there are some but it's a mixed bag for your [TS]

  trading off like [TS]

  you don't have the display anywhere near as nice as 25 came back in a fight you [TS]

  know you know for $2000 you can buy an iMac with a better display than than you [TS]

  know a $20,000 Mac Pro set up twelve 12 core Mac Pros very impressive in such as [TS]

  you were saying in some respects but it's interesting to me as somebody who [TS]

  used to live almost obsessively off of off of two hours and then later the Mac [TS]

  Pro early original sort of pre pre cylindrical Pro machine how much I don't [TS]

  fit into that mindset and even you know I don't do nearly as much fun as editing [TS]

  as I used to but still like the iMac really has become I think the desktop [TS]

  machine for 80 85% of the population including the pros purchased it makes [TS]

  more sense you don't need we don't need the money you think about where the iMac [TS]

  debut trait and Apple had this great great then and now [TS]

  website that they put up alongside the new iMacs or the like lets remember back [TS]

  to 1997 and the original iMac and how much faster our new iMacs are forces [TS]

  that the iMac when it came out was very hamstrung in very much a [TS]

  consumer-friendly this is the introduced this is your introduction to the Mac [TS]

  line device and as it's grown throughout the year is it really has you know it's [TS]

  been able to beef up what it can do and how it can compete against the Mac Pro [TS]

  and I mean right now is only the latest in a series of dynamic and smart [TS]

  improvements that you're so you're not going to get the most course you're not [TS]

  gonna get the most RAM and you're not going to be able to slot things in and [TS]

  out because the screen is what an inch thick but it's it's the better computer [TS]

  for the majority of people I mean that's that's apples goal right they don't want [TS]

  you have to fiddle around with things I linked to that said the other day the [TS]

  the then and now [TS]

  comparison to the 98 I'm [TS]

  and it is it's a cool comparison did you know wow how quickly we've you know I [TS]

  say quickly but it bends seventeen years but its feels quick but it is [TS]

  interesting to compare it in this in the context of this discussion of what do [TS]

  you get if you're a pro and you want to drop as you know get the best you can in [TS]

  1998 anybody with a Mac Pro i SAT with a prospective chief word G three towers [TS]

  I'm actually three's a PowerMac 23 would look at the iMac and say well that's [TS]

  cute but there wasn't one single thing about it that was better than you know [TS]

  performance wiser decided this play why's that you could drive you know you [TS]

  have fun with your little hockey puck mouse an all-in-one computer no use to [TS]

  get the hockey puck with the PowerMac to yeah that's right that's right baby yeah [TS]

  whatever anybody I knew with it with a PowerMac upgraded to a Kensington [TS]

  oh yes my superior you know I i've brought this up many times before over [TS]

  the years but my wife Amy she loved the hockey puck mouse that it is not [TS]

  universally loathed there were people and my wife was one of them she used it [TS]

  for years afterwards like on subsequent you know she kept she kept her iMac [TS]

  mouse and moved it from computer to computer I I still have my foot I did [TS]

  like it I didn't like it for certain tasks but it's cute in his own way it's [TS]

  it's it's part of the joy of the iMac I don't know behaviors behaviors can go [TS]

  somewhere else will hold that thought I'm going to do a sponsor it but we'll [TS]

  go back and we'll talk about the new mouse it's a good segue but first let me [TS]

  tell everybody about our good friends at Harry's you guys know her as they offer [TS]

  high-quality razors and blades for a fraction of the price of the big name [TS]

  brands brands areas were started by two guys who just wanted a better product [TS]

  without paying an arm and a leg shaving stuff [TS]

  razor blades are it's super expensive there's no reason for it [TS]

  so ares is super serious about this they're not just like some kind of thing [TS]

  with a by white label razor blades and put their own logo on it ever they [TS]

  actually we're forcing them from an old really old razor factory in Germany and [TS]

  they like the products and I said they bought the factory so these are high [TS]

  quality high performing german-made razor blades that Harry's supervises [TS]

  themselves the reason they can sell stuff for so much less is that it's it's [TS]

  like the whole internet model it's just direct you go to Harry's website you [TS]

  sign up and they ship it to you so there's no middlemen there are no [TS]

  distributors there's no retail like every step of the way when you buy razor [TS]

  blades like at a Walgreens or even at like Amazon or something like that it's [TS]

  a little bit of markup each step of the way caused a distributor goes to the [TS]

  retailer and everybody takes a look at how he's just sells these things [TS]

  direct right from them right to you and the prices are amazing they have a [TS]

  starter set 15 bucks gets you a razor your choice of moisturizing shave cream [TS]

  or gel and three razor blades and when you need more blades they are two bucks [TS]

  each or less than eight pack for just 15 bucks but if you want to buy in bulk [TS]

  they get cheaper and cheaper 16 pack is 25 bucks if you go to Amazon Gillette [TS]

  Fusion 12 pack of blades is 41 bucks so you like half the price of a Gillette [TS]

  Fusion totally serious I use myself very very comfortable quality wise I've had [TS]

  mine I don't know longtime listeners of the show know that Harry has been [TS]

  sponsoring the show for at least two years maybe even longer and they sent me [TS]

  one way back when they started I still have that razor handle and i'd i'd i'd [TS]

  look at it now it looks brand new looks mint condition I could look like I could [TS]

  just package it up in and so it is meant really high quality stuff so go check [TS]

  them out at Harry's dot com and the the code the promo code is the talk show and [TS]

  if you are a first time customer you will save five bucks off your first [TS]

  purchase which means you can get that starter kit for just 10 bucks which is [TS]

  amazing so [TS]

  dot com in the code is the talk show so the other new stuff that Apple announced [TS]

  this week with these iMacs are all new wireless peripherals new keyboard [TS]

  accessories new keyboard a new Magic Trackpad a new Magic Mouse is called the [TS]

  measure growth which is basically crashes everytime I think of the little [TS]

  cartoon characters I i you know it's funny because I feel like we get used to [TS]

  Apple's names and I remember like MacBook was so hard just seems it just [TS]

  was really hard for me to get out and now you know it's it just just your [TS]

  brain gets bludgeoned into accepting it over time [TS]

  second nature you're like our and I've given up I I won't anymore sorry and I [TS]

  understand the logic of it because the power and power book was from power PC [TS]

  and it wasn't really branded by Apple whereas putting back in the name really [TS]

  does help it it actually makes some kind of sense that all of the max would have [TS]

  the word mac in right I understand that but MacBook was somehow a mouthful it [TS]

  just doesn't seem like two words that fit quite as well together [TS]

  powerbook did but to me them as mad as always embarrasses me everytime I type [TS]

  yeah it feels so yes these are different than normal accessories how you ask they [TS]

  have the magic trackpad trackpad I can kind of understand it because yes it [TS]

  does especially with the new improvements to this version of the [TS]

  track pad where it gets the the MacBooks tactic engine and faux clicking here no [TS]

  longer to pressing a button you just you're using your using the magic of [TS]

  course touch and the tactic engine to make it feel like you're looking like [TS]

  that I would actually genuinely use it feels like magic because you're not [TS]

  actually clicking on anything but the mouse is still just you and I guess that [TS]

  their claim for the magic is that you get both the mouse that moves and you [TS]

  get the you can do the gestures on the surface but to me it's like that it's [TS]

  just that's just the way you you Apple have chosen to implement the scroll [TS]

  wheels and you know might have done more than just move the cursor around for a [TS]

  very long time and it's just an implementation detail whether you're [TS]

  going to use a wheel or that they had little that little ball they had for a [TS]

  while so truth be told I have not used an apple manufactured mouse on a regular [TS]

  basis since the ADB era the last eight GB Apple mouse which was a one button [TS]

  mouse I loved it [TS]

  click a great click and had a great form factor it fit my hand the way that I'd [TS]

  like to hold him out I know ATP has gone wrong on this awhile ago that depending [TS]

  on it when you learn to use a mouse you grip it in a certain way whether you [TS]

  rest your hand on it or something and I need like a big I don't know much bigger [TS]

  house than the Magic Mouse to be need to fit your hands yeah you need to have a [TS]

  good art because it's the it's the exact opposite problem of our essay on [TS]

  keyboard where you don't necessarily want your wrist marked up with a mouse I [TS]

  feel like you need you need the comfortable arc to rest your hand on it [TS]

  if you're going to be resting your hand on him out for a while I'm going around [TS]

  and clicking each to feel good and it needs to not feel like your hand is [TS]

  dwarfing them out so that you can actually find the buns by touch so I [TS]

  will confess the mouse that I used to know if I can get a picture of this I [TS]

  guess I'll try to maybe food show the mouse that I use is at least it [TS]

  absolutely positively I bought it in the nineties its from Logitech and even in [TS]

  the nineties when I bought it I don't think I paid more than $14 for it and [TS]

  it's so old it I swear to God and laser it has ball man and it is super super [TS]

  precise I actually because of our size shoes I use a third-party mouse driver [TS]

  too had to switch at one point guard steer mouse as ter mo USC's from some [TS]

  kind of band that lets you set your mouse speed significantly faster than [TS]

  the system mounted in a very fastest speed of the system out so I could go [TS]

  even mi5 k iMac I can go corner to corner pretty much without even using my [TS]

  wrist just my fingers and the ball on this thing is it's so super precise like [TS]

  it's a guy so I giant 27 inch screen I have the speed ramped up so far [TS]

  like my son can even use it he he thinks its crazy cuz he just immediately Rams [TS]

  from corner to corner by moving because it's you know the differences so subtle [TS]

  and this mass just has never broken the buttons don't work i mean at some point [TS]

  I guess it's gonna break I mean everybody feels eventually but but I [TS]

  haven't used in a pond that since when is it connected via USB USB [TS]

  I was going to ask if you're connected via Skype see you know 20 like crazy but [TS]

  I do I do still have my keyboard yeah you know I was talking to my dad the [TS]

  other day [TS]

  right after the new accessories came out and he's like rolling his eyes he's like [TS]

  no nothing nothing can be better than my my Kensington track ball and you still [TS]

  you and this that thing is probably from 1999 to because I remember using it [TS]

  playing like Star Wars Episode one pod racer something crazy like that so it's [TS]

  definitely I feel like people have very specific preferences with their mice but [TS]

  I have to do is to get on eBay and start hunting around for ya but I have to get [TS]

  a half to get new in box case I mean there is nothing grosser than using [TS]

  somebody some mouse that somebody's actually years of fingerprints and [TS]

  greasy you Tito fingers and God I'm I am i think im pretty good personal hygiene [TS]

  I'm not I'm not a real germaphobe but like I do have some previously used [TS]

  Apple extended keyboard Tues but when I whenever I get a new one I really do I [TS]

  get all sorta like like CSI like crime scene like cleaning up a break out the [TS]

  alcohol and cotton swipes and and I mean I i go you know I Q tips and I get in [TS]

  there and I'll clean you know even if it looks like really like very lightly used [TS]

  which are the best ones very likely I am going to get in there and scrub it who [TS]

  the hell knows what people are doing these things I mean I don't I no longer [TS]

  eat food while working or any of that and like my my keyboardist should be [TS]

  pristine and i'm looking down at it as we're talking that's like some of the [TS]

  number pad is absolutely disgusting I do not even my desk I gave that many years [TS]

  ago and I still can't believe how disgustingly keyboard can get if I get [TS]

  real close to yeah it's a little bit frightening to me well I know what I'm [TS]

  doing after this podcasts and now it's just it does the heebie jeebies [TS]

  just like my own key even my own keyboard grosses me out so it's hard for [TS]

  me to really get excited about the new Magic Mouse cuz I know I'm not going to [TS]

  use it because I know it's the same form factor is the old one [TS]

  I know that the old form factor to me is extremely uncomfortable tease yeah I [TS]

  don't like it at all my boyfriend has one that he will use on occasion but I [TS]

  am I the only mouse that I have on my desk right now is a very poor man's [TS]

  attempt to gaming mouse from a Cali from like 2004 that somehow is still working [TS]

  with just a 2004 button mouse scroll wheel I used to use for World of [TS]

  Warcraft of all things cause you know you have to do something in college but [TS]

  I think I've been a trackpad user pretty much since since the original Magic [TS]

  Trackpad came out I mean I was on a laptop for most of college and up until [TS]

  I got hired at Macworld in 2010 and when they hired me they're like oh you get an [TS]

  iMac do you wanna mouse or trackpad trackpad [TS]

  that's alright that's all I've been using aside from the occasional gaming [TS]

  and that's that's what I like I like white gestures and even the mouse with a [TS]

  tiny little sweat just did not feel comfortable for me I feel like the [TS]

  original Magic Mouse didn't even have a or or mission control support what he [TS]

  could to finger swipe between Safari windows but it could do any of the [TS]

  really cool things better track but it always has felt kinda hamstrung to me in [TS]

  comparison to the trackpad like Apple was really only having it to throw a [TS]

  bone to the users who still wanted a mouse to come with their machines their [TS]

  desktop Mac but I'd especially with the new features of the generations Magic [TS]

  Trackpad it just feels like the trackpad blows them out of the water [TS]

  this this is what you should be using that iMac I agree with that i mean I'm [TS]

  sure there are other people who are just so used him out that they sure that's [TS]

  why Apple hasn't gone all trackpad and why the Magic Mouse still exists in his [TS]

  tank but I do I it that is the other thing I do have it my desk I have a [TS]

  magic trackpad [TS]

  allowing I have the old way I don't have the new one I have the old one that [TS]

  takes the double A batteries and I don't use it all the time but I have it there [TS]

  because for certain tasks in certain apps its [TS]

  I find it nicer to have that adding an image or something like [TS]

  that it's nice to have it and be able to zoom in and for me I used mission [TS]

  control so much because I got used to it on the on my tiny laptops that being [TS]

  able to four finger swipe and get to the desktop and move around and all of that [TS]

  is second nature to me and especially with El Capitan adding in things like [TS]

  swype to Mark as Read and mail it just makes it more of a compelling feature [TS]

  for me and now that forced touch is added I some soul rock and the jelly [TS]

  roll the jelly roll Magic Trackpad with the AAA batteries but the idea of forced [TS]

  touch being able to do different things in the apps right now it's very very [TS]

  limited [TS]

  third-party app developers really haven't taken advantage of it all [TS]

  the track pads only been in the in the MacBook which only a small subset of the [TS]

  population owns but now hit that traffic is now potentially on potentially [TS]

  compatible with every single back in the lineup that runs every single back in [TS]

  the lineup that has blue 24 and runs on 10 now has the power force touch and [TS]

  seeing what it can do just in a couple of different out you know even just [TS]

  QuickTime Player the debt the demo below of both in their retail stores and when [TS]

  they were demoing the MacBook trackpad is the press press a little bit too fast [TS]

  forward and then press really deeply and you can fast-forward up to three hundred [TS]

  times and then you can lift your finger a little bit like a gas pedal you know [TS]

  that's that's a cool proof of concept but I feel like especially pro level [TS]

  applications design applications drawing applications photography is gonna be a [TS]

  big deal [TS]

  yeah I agree I i'm tempted by that I have you seen that there are people [TS]

  complaining I know and Neil dash [TS]

  we did you see yeah yeah oh my god ok so yeah go ahead [TS]

  charging port charges bylaw all these new devices if you don't you're not [TS]

  familiar [TS]

  the one of the big changes in all three of these is no longer now to topple make [TS]

  anything you put batteries in it maybe the remote now claiming the new remote [TS]

  for Apple TV is like I think we have gotten away from AAA batteries which I [TS]

  am thrilled by because I have so many useless slowly dying rechargeable [TS]

  batteries I why did that a couple years ago I bought a whole bunch of [TS]

  rechargeable batteries and it was good when Jonas was a real little kid and was [TS]

  using all sorts of toys that took them it really really don't regret it but no [TS]

  but they they they lose their efficacy [TS]

  so it's so bad I have a serious I probably have 12 or 14 and it's gotten [TS]

  to the point where I don't know which ones are almost are really properly [TS]

  charged in which ones are still kind of knew right because once you've charged [TS]

  them they're all good [TS]

  exactly yeah there's a twist that they like like like turned around and color [TS]

  like returned like eggshell yellow weird like that you might my trackpad I'm [TS]

  lucky if my trackpad on my keyboard last day if I had been smart what I would [TS]

  have done is maybe gotten in the habit of marking them as we mark like with [TS]

  Sharpie every time I charge the battery do Italian market which once you've done [TS]

  now you don't need to do it but now I've gotten off I've gotten back to just [TS]

  using like ourselves you know and then I feel guilty about it though I really do [TS]

  because I know that you know that it's sort of iraq yeah well and I don't know [TS]

  it's Philly one of the places in Boston you can't throw them away [TS]

  you have to dispose of them in especial place so if you use a non rechargeable [TS]

  battery in my house it's very much like either it goes in a bucket were like [TS]

  yeah we'll take this to the special recycling department someday and then it [TS]

  just sits there in your house forever ever just gathering dust in Philly we [TS]

  take them to sporting events and throw them at the buzzer that sounds like you [TS]

  accept another little bit more more potential of explosion of you set them [TS]

  on fire so the thing with that said that here's the thing that there's a minor [TS]

  design controversy is that the new Magic Mouse has I think the exact same when [TS]

  it's sitting on a desk it looks identical to the old one has the exact [TS]

  same profile as different feet according to the design but I don't think they [TS]

  look different I know that there there's interest even leaving at back channel on [TS]

  medium had a great behind the scenes talk with the team that made these [TS]

  things and they talked about how they somehow with the weight being different [TS]

  from the new battery that they had to redesign the feet to make the click [TS]

  sound right but anyway the complaint is that the lightning port is on the bottom [TS]

  so if you want to charge this thing you have to turn it on its side or turn it [TS]

  upside down in stimulating and therefore while it's charging you cannot use it as [TS]

  a mouse and what everybody seems to or the complainer seem to think it's common [TS]

  sense is that the lightning port should be at the front of the mouse so that you [TS]

  can plug it in and use it like you would a wired mouse yeah except for the fact [TS]

  that I i've seen [TS]

  nails mock-up like you just have this little hole in the front of the mouse [TS]

  it'll be fine except I can just I can just see five different people at [TS]

  Applebees like that is the most tedious thing I've ever seen in my life and such [TS]

  it just on top of that we should also mention the fact that this mouse does [TS]

  not take extremely long time to charge two minutes supposedly gives you nine [TS]

  hours a day to the idea for you get charges if you came to work and your [TS]

  mouse was dead [TS]

  you could charge it and you would have to wait to start using it but you could [TS]

  just use that as like your minute to get your standing there watching [TS]

  and by the time you've got your standpoint your Apple mouse your math [TS]

  magic mouse to be charged for the day and it does give you the other thing too [TS]

  is it gives you just you know a few if any of you who haven't used these [TS]

  peripherals they do the system is in touch with them and when they get low [TS]

  you do get a warning on screen and it's not like an emergency warning it's like [TS]

  you know you're going to want to charge this thing yeah you know I'm actually [TS]

  I'm kind of mad that the ports are on the back for the Magic Trackpad on the [TS]

  measure is a magic keyboard is just a keyboard it's it's just called a [TS]

  keyboard magic magic keyboard magic all the way down I think that might be a new [TS]

  name though because it's the Magic Trackpad to in the Magic Mouse too but [TS]

  that's just the magic word matching because it has the new not butterfly [TS]

  mechanism but differences are mechanism previous keep cords yes I i I kind of [TS]

  feel like I'm in tune of the with the standing notification idea where I don't [TS]

  want all of the ports on the underside intend then adjust forces you to get up [TS]

  off of your desk while you're charging accessories sorry your accessories [TS]

  literally are going to stop working unless you get out of your seat it seems [TS]

  it seems subversive Lee funny to me but i dont I honestly don't know what the [TS]

  what the fuss is about [TS]

  I think that Apple first and foremost wants to obviously designed functional [TS]

  things but also designed accessories that are going to look nice and the [TS]

  worst the worst thing I think in the world would be to give you a wireless [TS]

  mouse and then be here we're going to make it so that you can absolutely use [TS]

  it as a wired mouse because how many I don't wanna see stupid idiot how many [TS]

  stupid idiots are just going to plug in their peripherals and then just keep [TS]

  them plugged in the entire time I don't want to charge them they are you know [TS]

  things always burn down I i think that if the existing profile of the Magic [TS]

  Mouse had a flat front then they might have just put the port there [TS]

  but it's the fact that they're clearly happy with the profile of the Magic [TS]

  Trackpad where the front and back [TS]

  you know it's it's exactly symmetric and it has there is no there's there is [TS]

  nowhere for to go so anybody who's asking for them to put the port so that [TS]

  you can use it while it's charging is asking for them to redesign the hamas [TS]

  yeah I'm not saying that's a bad thing but it's it doesn't it just does not [TS]

  seem like a problem and i also think on the other hand I think exactly what you [TS]

  said I think it might even be deliberate mean it may actually be that they want [TS]

  to discourage people from using it while charging yeah but I'm not quite sure [TS]

  then why they didn't do the same with keyboard which is which is my no I [TS]

  honestly think that you know if you're if you're talking about technology that [TS]

  went into these peripherals again the mouse feels like the odd man out here [TS]

  where the trackpad gets first touch and all of this new and the keyboard is [TS]

  completely redesigned and should I better and the mouse's has lightning now [TS]

  you know why I know that there was design work that went into the mouse [TS]

  because this article and also I know that even if something looks identical [TS]

  couple spent a lot of time on it regardless but I do think what you were [TS]

  saying it's absolutely correct we're in order for them to put a lightning port [TS]

  on the front and make it not look like a piece of crap they're gonna have to [TS]

  redesign it and if they're going to redesign the mouse than they might as [TS]

  well redesign it in such a way that they can also put forced touching it which I [TS]

  think right now is probably too challenging given the curvature of the [TS]

  mouse and the you know current initial limits of forced touch so I mean may [TS]

  eventually happen but i just i think they ran up against time in and hardware [TS]

  limitations to actually put that together and it's like well do you want [TS]

  a mouse that has a port on the front of it for slightly easier charging or do [TS]

  you want forced touch on your trackpad pick one you can only have one and and [TS]

  getting the majority of people are going to say yeah we prefer force touch on the [TS]

  truck [TS]

  and why do we care about a charging port location [TS]

  the other thing lasting about these three peripherals is the price is very [TS]

  classic Apple the keyboard is 99 bucks but the track 79 before I think so the [TS]

  trackpad is $129 and the mouse is much as the mouse [TS]

  7979 mouse keyboard are the same price now the keyboards $99.99 the keyword [TS]

  used to be 79 so the mouse moves up the keepers praised the keyboards hundred [TS]

  bucks and the trackpad is a very very quintessential Apple number twenty [TS]

  dollars so hot [TS]

  yeah I mean I i understand the technology in the mouth in the trackpad [TS]

  at least forced forced touch to me seems like the kind of thing where you might [TS]

  need to charge a premium for it based on all of the mechanics that are under the [TS]

  hood it's not just a mouse but it still $129 first level middle the AmazonBasics [TS]

  three button USB wired masses 69 [TS]

  AmazonBasics wireless mouse now it's expensive that $11 [TS]

  if you want a mouse I seem to remember that in previous versions you could [TS]

  choose between the mouse and the keyboard or the trackpad they wouldn't [TS]

  you and now they are charging 50 bucks if you want to go from the mouse or [TS]

  keyboard to try them out to the track [TS]

  keepers know how ya that used to be like that used to be [TS]

  choose your choose your poison and now they're actually discouraging people [TS]

  from going to the trackpad which seems like such a seems like such the wrong [TS]

  thing to do if you want to get more people using force touch and and more [TS]

  people comfortable with a trackpad or egg hunt for you could get both the [TS]

  Magic Mouse to end the Magic Trackpad to $429 she wanted multiple peripherals are [TS]

  you can get a wired mouse yeah I think you're right I think you're right to the [TS]

  fundamentally comes down to the fact that forced touch is the 3d touch [TS]

  whatever we're calling it is the new you know hotness and it's you know it [TS]

  probably is more expensive I'd I really doubt that it cost $129 yeah that much [TS]

  more you know but multiply by Apple's standard margin and maybe you know maybe [TS]

  it is the right price but it really does is one of those remaining things that [TS]

  stands out from the Mac and the commodity market as I sit here and look [TS]

  at this you know I just opened up an Tappan just type mouse like [TS]

  you get five years a Logitech 421 $22 yeah if you want an end and you know [TS]

  what the high-quality mice the funny thing is like Greek as a high-quality [TS]

  silence wireless gaming mouse [TS]

  on his on his desk that I'm pretty sure he paid me be $70 for yeah I'm sure you [TS]

  can but it's you know but even that that's less than the price of them [TS]

  Apple Magic Mouse to write a mean here's one it looks like something from Ironman [TS]

  ICC team 4000 dpi 10 button led optical USB wired professional gaming mouse what [TS]

  is a good email Steve dots per inch [TS]

  well it's it's it's the dutch Prince is the center the laser [TS]

  it actually is pretty important oh yeah I never I've never heard that term [TS]

  because I am a very casual but still make sense I'm not a game I'm playing a [TS]

  game on my Mac and over ten years maybe longer but I'm very sensitive to that [TS]

  because that's why use my old mouse with the ball because it has a really high D [TS]

  Jack the speed up with him outside III that one of the weird things I know [TS]

  about the gaming world but anyway all these mice $7 but Apple can do it that's [TS]

  the thing is that the MEB is the peripherals [TS]

  renee has been going to the store pretty much every day to try and get the mayor [TS]

  their limited supply every day and every day sold out so that the people are [TS]

  buying these horrendously expensive peripherals yeah well I don't even know [TS]

  if it's it is expensive yes no way around it I don't know that it's too [TS]

  expensive that I'm not complaining about it it's the price you pay it forward you [TS]

  know Apple's cutting edge stuff 4944 no batteries for lithium-ion batteries in [TS]

  the keyboard and trackpad I would pay you know $229 for that set yeah I'm if I [TS]

  was buying it to upgrade to make her Mac yet I would do that in a heartbeat [TS]

  because anything that requires me never to use batteries again is Bertha church [TS]

  and church I do hate that they're referring it to for such as for such an [TS]

  American 3 touch on the phone that is driving me crazy [TS]

  well I think I've asked about it and it's one of those questions that they [TS]

  have a prepared answer for that doesn't really answer it [TS]

  yeah but they're ready for it but I think translating it from their non [TS]

  answer to a real answer is [TS]

  is I think it's twofold I think one they were calling it forced touch everywhere [TS]

  and then they decided that I think they kind of body or at least recognized the [TS]

  arguments of people have that it it sounds like it could be a little creepy [TS]

  something that there's other you know there's other ways to interpret those [TS]

  words that absolutely positive connotation and I think secondarily [TS]

  they've talked themselves into the not just renaming it 3d touch everywhere [TS]

  because I think forced touch is sort of binary where it's either a regular touch [TS]

  or a force touch and that's it in 3d touch has I just read and yeah well and [TS]

  has it measures degree of touch yes so like just the one way that Apple exposes [TS]

  it currently and I was nine is with the peak and pop where there's two levels of [TS]

  touch and I just read an article I guess I should try to find it a show notes I [TS]

  read an article where somebody was playing with the API's and and [TS]

  effectively a developer could could probably get six levels of touch if you [TS]

  wanted to like and where you where you might want to use it maybe in a game you [TS]

  know some kind of game of six levels you know maybe for acceleration driving the [TS]

  racing game maybe in some kind of musical app where you're playing the [TS]

  force touches is trying to get out of it drums or something you can pretty much [TS]

  go like 126 and thats 3d touched like it had you know and forced touch though is [TS]

  neither just it is a force touch or two regular touch and that's it yeah but [TS]

  that's what it is on the watch and that's what interests me about the [TS]

  desktop is that the force touch trackpad on a MacBook is not impressive you're [TS]

  not like it does have it does have degrees of sensitivity in layers in it [TS]

  but they're still kind of playing with that idea yeah I don't know that the [TS]

  API's are there maybe I'm wrong I don't know I think they should just got caught [TS]

  3d touchable yeah I like 3d touch I think 32 touches appropriate the [TS]

  interesting thing it's funny that developers can only access six levels of [TS]

  of pressure in sort of apps [TS]

  Peter Skinner from 10 1 did it of course [TS]

  initial tests for the pressure sensitivity and drawing ups and he was [TS]

  able to detect over 400 400 potential levels of pressure sensitivity when it [TS]

  came to drawing alone so there's a lot there's actually a lot of functionality [TS]

  built into that little screen that maybe it isn't quite exposed to developers for [TS]

  regular apps because maybe it just doesn't make sense to have that kind of [TS]

  finite pressure I mean it that so many levels of pressure that the average [TS]

  human is not understand that they've shut through 50 to get from step one to [TS]

  step 2 but from a drawing perspective that's actually really exciting one of [TS]

  the things I kinda wanna play with once we get the the new house called the [TS]

  first touch trackpad once we get the new Magic Trackpad I'm really curious to see [TS]

  how you know if if precious instead of drawing is going to be able to get [TS]

  something that that the Magic Trackpad can do they're going to just limited to [TS]

  the iPhone for this this time around [TS]

  yea well what do you think you would do the drawing what i mean you could do [TS]

  with a fantasy the thing the interesting thing for me at least on a on a Mac you [TS]

  could use a stylus argued that that glass is now so big that it got it [TS]

  almost reminds me of like a Wacom Bamboo Bamboo tablet really early 512 levels of [TS]

  pressure sensitivity tablet but would be cool for me is using it in something [TS]

  like Pixelmator or Lightroom where you use it to shade or two like to do color [TS]

  correction in various levels were you don't need the specific pinpoint [TS]

  pinpoint accuracy you if you were just drawing very tiny lines but if you're [TS]

  you know color correcting or if you're removing splotches or anything like that [TS]

  being able to have levels of pressure at Lake this is how this is how much I want [TS]

  you know this is how much color I want to take away the desaturation [TS]

  the pressure is more important than that but then the pics of precision exactly [TS]

  exactly at least in these early days [TS]

  Eastern certain tasks like that exactly and even the pixel precision is not too [TS]

  bad when you have resumed at your disposal and I can very easily see you [TS]

  pinch and then you use one finger to sketch but I've been doing on the on the [TS]

  phone and it's working really well [TS]

  why let's take a break and I will thank our second sponsor and it's our good [TS]

  friends at automatic they just spell it the regular way auto matic and what is [TS]

  it [TS]

  it is really cool it is a connected car adapter I call it a dingus it plugs into [TS]

  your car's diagnostic port every car made I think since 1997 but somewhere [TS]

  around there has one of these two standard port goes across manufacturers [TS]

  your car has one you just find out where it where it is on your card somewhere in [TS]

  the dashboard you put this little thing gets into it and it's exactly the same [TS]

  port that like the mechanic uses when you take your car in the shop and I Q [TS]

  your car's dashboard says you need like service a one you could just use [TS]

  automatic and it tells you exactly what that means is I have an appt here's how [TS]

  you you you you plug thing in the card and you have to worry about it anymore [TS]

  and after that you just use the app and communicates with Bluetooth between you [TS]

  and your car and it tells you everything that goes through there so any kind of [TS]

  like engine light warning or something like that automatically explain in plain [TS]

  English what the heck is going on you know whether you just need an oil change [TS]

  whether you're due for some kind of bigger service whether something is [TS]

  failing gives you a log of your trips it keeps track of your parking location so [TS]

  if you if you have it you know if you don't have a good garage or something [TS]

  and I you know forget your car is automatic knows where your cars every [TS]

  single time you park it even can call emergency services in the case of an [TS]

  accident its course you on your driving if you wanted to show you can set goals [TS]

  for fuel efficiency and stuff like that and we'll give you hints and tell you [TS]

  when you're you know when you're going over your limits and stuff like that the [TS]

  new thing they have this year and it was already called just doing all that the [TS]

  new they may have this year's they have an app store for automatic and they have [TS]

  over 20 apps available and that lets you use your car's data in all kinds of ways [TS]

  so for example they've got integration with nest so you can let your thermostat [TS]

  know when you're getting close to home you can say when I'm five miles away [TS]

  from home [TS]

  do this with the temperature in your house or 10 miles whatever you want it [TS]

  to be you have to do it you set it up and then it just works like that it's [TS]

  amazing that really seems like the future and they've got immigration with [TS]

  I F TTT that if then then that if this then that really great web service would [TS]

  you should check out on your own anyway for hooking up all sorts of nerdy stuff [TS]

  but then you can make your own recipes and do all sorts of custom stuff based [TS]

  on this really really long story short if you have a card you really want this [TS]

  it's amazing [TS]

  this sort of thing should be built into every car but it's not but it's pretty [TS]

  awesome that works with everybody's car it's a hundred bucks normally which is a [TS]

  great deal and there's no service for you don't pay like 10 bucks a month or [TS]

  whatever you just give them two hundred bucks you get the dangerous and then you [TS]

  own it but even better than that you can save 20% off thats 20 bucks get it for [TS]

  $80 and it ships in 2 business days and they have a 45 day return policy that's [TS]

  how confident are they gonna like it so buy it for 80 bucks with this code [TS]

  automatic dot com slash the talk show and get yourself this automatic thing is [TS]

  if you haven't gotten one already really cool anything else on the the perforce [TS]

  no I think I was thinking it seems a little silly cuz it's only October and [TS]

  I'm not like a big year in review sort of person I usually don't do anything [TS]

  like that but I think we're at the point now where we kinda know everything done [TS]

  for 2015 I mean we're still waiting coming you know the iPad Pro is [TS]

  obviously a huge thing that's coming it probably the right it's the biggest [TS]

  literally biggest iOS devices stopping 27 inch iMac but it it's probably the [TS]

  biggest hardware announcement of the year and we know we don't have it in our [TS]

  hands it but we know it's coming I think you know I think the Apple has shown on [TS]

  their cards and it actually is to me you know it's as much as like for the year [TS]

  or two prior there were a lot of complaints that alcohol was sort of [TS]

  silence for debating wasn't innovating you know Phil Schiller is can innovate [TS]

  anymore my ass thing at WWC it's obviously frustrating to them I don't [TS]

  see it's one of those things where I feel like they you can complain about it [TS]

  when they're quiet for a long time but then when they have a busy year nobody [TS]

  really says while they've really done a lot this year but they've done a lot [TS]

  this year and ocular amount when you really think about all of i mean they [TS]

  launched an entirely new product the Apple watch right you know we got new [TS]

  iPhones we got new dev kits get a new to new versions of of iOS and OS 10 which [TS]

  people I think overlooked just how just how much work goes into creating solid [TS]

  software and they really did I feel like make solid software this time around it [TS]

  on both iOS and OS 10 it doesn't feel nearly as as bulky to me right off the [TS]

  line we got new iPhones Apple TV I forgot about me that's looming end of [TS]

  October Early November I also I want to emphasize that as we record this I do [TS]

  not have an Apple TV I worry that somebody's gonna go out you know rupert [TS]

  says you know he's only waiting on an iPad programs have an Apple TV now I do [TS]

  love it that's coming and the other two really big things to me are the photos [TS]

  the new photo integrated photos that launched a nightclub photos and Apple [TS]

  music right answers these two things [TS]

  that you know music and your photos and videos that in 2015 Apple has introduced [TS]

  entirely new and and you know not necessarily in both cases in either case [TS]

  seamlessly [TS]

  but it they've certainly laid the foundation for the future of how people [TS]

  in the Apple customers in the Apple ecosystem are going to manage your [TS]

  photos and music [TS]

  absolutely and you know i i did a lot of work on both of those topics right now [TS]

  as they were coming out and as as the year has progressed they you know Apple [TS]

  has been very very good about listening to customer feedback and implementing [TS]

  implementing changes or fixes or bug you know bug fixes to make the experience [TS]

  better you know I think about the initial I club for the library and the [TS]

  new Photos app I couldn't turn around on the internet virtually turn around [TS]

  without seeing someone being like how dare you this sucks I'm moving to [TS]

  Lightroom everything is terrible and now they're I feel it quite a few people are [TS]

  using photos are using Google's photo service for the using you know they've [TS]

  found their photo service or they're willing to give those a try and there's [TS]

  there's no big calamity Apple hasn't lost someone's entire photo library [TS]

  there's no there's been no insanity there was a little insanity over apple [TS]

  music photos first feel like it was the smooth launch and I'm really impressed [TS]

  by it I really AM I it works really really well for me there was one one [TS]

  time early on with a photo on my iPhone I had so many photos I've got in there [TS]

  just put a scale we can compare [TS]

  of God 16,900 56 photos and 237 videos you might have Ebdon videos but I'm [TS]

  pretty sure I have you been on photos I don't have a lot of videos because I [TS]

  used to store them separately I do have videos in here nevermind [TS]

  I'm guessing most of that was recently shot but twenty 6896 photos 855 videos [TS]

  and three items I don't actually know what items are I i had had had a [TS]

  situation early in this summer [TS]

  know maybe at like at the point where I upgraded to iOS 9 beta on my iPhone and [TS]

  it was a beta so don't complain about it publicly but I had a situation where [TS]

  their account wasn't the same across all my devices it was slightly off and I [TS]

  figured it out that it came down to a photo taken on my iPhone about two weeks [TS]

  prior and which I had edited and I forget if I only edited I did it on the [TS]

  phone and I forget if I used the Photos app on the phone to adjust the color [TS]

  something or if I used like after later one of those third party apps that lets [TS]

  you modify images on your photo role in place without making a copy but it was [TS]

  added and for whatever reason it was not able to sync that photo to my class so I [TS]

  emailed it to myself so I have a copy of the edited version then I deleted it and [TS]

  then everything got caught up in an aide to the email photo and put it back in [TS]

  the photos so one time and it was with a beta so I'm not complaining and ever [TS]

  since then it has been great [TS]

  yeah well I and i think you know comparing us a little bit about the beta [TS]

  process was really important for this being able to have the months where [TS]

  their lake yes this is beta we definitely want people to come play in [TS]

  the beta so please if you're interested but this is a beta service and please be [TS]

  advised this is a beta service and please back up your photos and once [TS]

  people I think realized [TS]

  forcible knew that going in and also were able to figure out oh this is the [TS]

  difference between storing all of your photos on your device and optimizing [TS]

  storage and this is what this app gets me that aperture Lightroom does not have [TS]

  more time to kind of figure all that out I I too had had one [TS]

  really bad photos experience and that was mostly I had at this at the time [TS]

  that photo was released initially sort of announced I was really excited about [TS]

  this cuz my photo library had been spreading across four different [TS]

  computers and I thought at one point I had it all localized on the 15 inch iMac [TS]

  but as time went on it kind of more and more [TS]

  got over too much or 15 inch MacBook Pro as time went on it became more on on my [TS]

  old 21.5 inch iMac and a little bit on my on my my macbook air and I i was just [TS]

  saving like giant folders of iPhone images every time I get full I just [TS]

  dumped everything the image capture into a folder and shove it into Dropbox it [TS]

  was like there was something canonical version of my photos somewhere and when [TS]

  I went to merge everything into photos 1 my MacBook Air library wouldn't sink and [TS]

  eventually I just had to creating knew I had to create a new library and pulled [TS]

  down all of the photos from the cloud and then upload everything it was try it [TS]

  just got into a terrible loop where it was trying to download and upload at the [TS]

  same time and they just you know essentially them [TS]

  virtual pipe was clogged so nothing could get anywhere and just uploading [TS]

  forever but again once I like that was a very simple troubleshoot I talked to [TS]

  Apple almost immediately got that fixed and once I got that fixed no problems [TS]

  everything is great yeah the other thing that really works well and it sounds [TS]

  simple and I know there's other services that do this I'm not saying Apple is [TS]

  invented anything I'm just saying that at scale for all of the people who use [TS]

  iCloud photos it seems to be working well is the way that like you can say [TS]

  whether or not you want all of your photos on this device or not or you just [TS]

  want the thumbnails and pulled them down over the cloud as needed to save space [TS]

  yeah and having gone through the [TS]

  again I'm not complaining it's great it's great that I get access to the [TS]

  iPhones and stuff before him but I set up an awful lot of iOS devices every [TS]

  year because I knew I found in a nearby my own iPhone [TS]

  having set up my own iPhones for personal use a lot and over the last [TS]

  month or two it worked really really great where it's obviously they're not [TS]

  you know sixteen or seventeen thousand photos even the thumbnails are not there [TS]

  you know a minute or two after you unlock you know unwrap the phone but you [TS]

  know within a very reasonable amount of time they are and it's it's to me really [TS]

  impressive and it's always a problem that we've had for a long time [TS]

  yeah well that's just the not having to worry about what device they take photos [TS]

  on is huge and not like it's just an everyday to obviously most people don't [TS]

  necessarily have a job where they're taking tons of product photos on maybe [TS]

  you and then uploading them to one machine and maybe me access to them on [TS]

  another machine at a later point in time but that kind of workflow I feel like is [TS]

  universal for different documents and Apple seems to have really done a great [TS]

  thing with photos where I can again now for screenshot or snap snap a photo of [TS]

  like an apple watchdog in three seconds later it shows up on my Mac where I need [TS]

  to upload it to our CMS for your website and that it just it makes it easier I [TS]

  don't have to worry about where my photos are as I know like okay they're [TS]

  all the cloud and I have a backup if physical backup on one of my computers [TS]

  and then I have a double back up on in Dropbox like tax it's just it feels [TS]

  really nice the one the one nickel that I have with optimized storage is that I [TS]

  do wish that your favorite album was automatically stored on device like I [TS]

  wish there was an album that you could just be like this album needs to be [TS]

  sourced locally because the annoying thing of like typing something that you [TS]

  want to share with somebody and then seeing the doubt the slow download icon [TS]

  and realizing currently i cud photos is limited to wifi to download a photo so [TS]

  if you want to get an old photo from 1986 or something that you have stored [TS]

  chances are if you haven't looked at it frequently it's not it's stored up in [TS]

  the library it's not stored on device if you have optimized on and if you're not [TS]

  on wifi [TS]

  can't download that and so all you can see is this really blurry picture even [TS]

  if you're just looking at you want to just browse photos while you're stuck on [TS]

  an airplane or something that that's a little frustrating but it's not you know [TS]

  it's not a deal breaker it's not necessarily something room Apple how [TS]

  could you but it would be nice to have to have a space of these photos were [TS]

  always down my device these pictures of my pets it's either the default it's the [TS]

  only way you get photos under Apple watch to at least the fault is that you [TS]

  favorite them and then the favorites are on the watch yeah I don't know if you [TS]

  can also is there a way that you can manually specify different album you can [TS]

  specify a different album on the watch but it is albums only and favorites is [TS]

  the first option so out of the boxes with us what happens [TS]

  yeah I'm looking at it right now yes in town favorites but anyway long story [TS]

  short I think it's really been a good year for photos and I am really [TS]

  intrigued to see where they go [TS]

  going forward because it's one of those things where I feel like it's the same [TS]

  thing as I trying to get everything across the board to go read where you [TS]

  need all of these things in place first and some of the stuff you just have to [TS]

  wait for it and I feel like being able to say doesn't matter you know if you [TS]

  have a stand-alone you know camera and you can hook it up to your Mac and you [TS]

  import them into photos a week or two later you forget what you took the [TS]

  photos of you just know you took a photo of you know your relatives birthday [TS]

  party and the fact that it's just there on your phone [TS]

  even if you didn't take the photos with your phone is great I'm really [TS]

  interested see though if if what they do like for next year with photos is start [TS]

  beefing up especially the Mac version to be more of a prosumer photo editing tool [TS]

  I'm hoping so I hope so too and my concern though is that because [TS]

  everything is everywhere and that their non-destructive that the Mac what the [TS]

  Mac version of photos can do isn't limited by what the Macan do but it's [TS]

  limited by what iOS can [TS]

  do well I mean there's always there's already some disparity there because the [TS]

  iPhone has of course non-destructive third-party audits and Mac did not get [TS]

  that option for up extensions until this fall and even then there are those are [TS]

  limited to device so if you if you added something on your iPhone say with like [TS]

  the Pixelmator expense extension for iPhone and then you imported are you [TS]

  open it up in the Mac you can't open it with the Pixelmator extension for Mac [TS]

  you either have to you can revert it so you can take off all of the edits or you [TS]

  can add a top of it but you can once you change those sliders if you opened up [TS]

  the Mac and start to apply new new more edits you you lose the previous ability [TS]

  but if you do but if you just look at it you do see the edits [TS]

  yes you do so I guess that's one way to do it where the Mac could gain a lot of [TS]

  built-in serious stuff and then when you open it up on the iPhone you see them [TS]

  but then if you try to edit it would warn you that you either need to make a [TS]

  copy of it or something [TS]

  yeah exactly I can live with that that sort of I think the best we can hope for [TS]

  yeah I mean I wouldn't necessarily rule out pro version of photos but I do think [TS]

  there's enough there are enough things to make improvements to in the initial [TS]

  appt I think the initial opposite very solid 10 release but they're still there [TS]

  definitely they're definitely tools that a that would be great for a prosumer out [TS]

  or a you know a consumer leading to like during the slow stepping stones they've [TS]

  already done a great job even with the editing menu of making potentially you [TS]

  know severe and [TS]

  an expansive color correction available to somebody who doesn't really know much [TS]

  were you just start with this lighter from light to dark and then you can drop [TS]

  it down and it becomes more expensive and more in depth and then you can add [TS]

  extensions if you really want to play around and OH I messed this up a reset [TS]

  button away huge your photos and my Apple music [TS]

  the next day this is the part hot apple music to me still it confuses me you [TS]

  know this is really the main reason I want to do under shows I want you to [TS]

  explain Apple ok what it was like to know about music how am I supposed to [TS]

  use it [TS]

  ok so do you do you want to use Apple's catalogue of like to access Apple's [TS]

  catalogue of artists I guess what I needed to hear that I think I need to do [TS]

  I think for safety's sake I have backups but I think I need to make a copy of [TS]

  music yes i think thats what is which is largely ripped but I have had the match [TS]

  service for all you know ever since it came out and make a copy and then I have [TS]

  all my rep stuff that I've had for fifteen years now and then just go [TS]

  without music yet so what I would suggest if you're starting from scratch [TS]

  and you want to go into Apple music you make a copy of your library for that new [TS]

  copy of your library if you want to start just absolutely clean what you can [TS]

  do is create that new library and then I think there's a checkbox that allows you [TS]

  to add songs but keep the linked locations absolute so which is to say [TS]

  like if you have all of your songs packaged in your original iTunes music [TS]

  library when you add them to the second library it doesn't create a second copy [TS]

  of those songs it's just it it has a provisional [TS]

  symbiotic from the original library two years later an alias basically similar [TS]

  to to the way again to compare two photos similar to the way that it when [TS]

  you [TS]

  imported your iPhoto library to the new photos it didn't make copies of [TS]

  everything [TS]

  symlinks to have what looks like two copies of it but both are pointing to [TS]

  the same stream a bite on desk exactly so you can you can vote do this and then [TS]

  once you have that second library you turn up the music on for that library [TS]

  and your Apple IDs tied to your Apple idea that I think one of the most [TS]

  important things that people can't overlook side to europe lady you turn on [TS]

  Apple music and the big difference between having just Apple music as your [TS]

  Apple music service of choice or having iTunes Match or having both of them [TS]

  together is that Apple music alone gives you access to Apple's App Catalog so you [TS]

  can stream any of their songs or artists it lets you play songs that you your [TS]

  cell phone as well as the Apple music catalog on any of your devices to 10 but [TS]

  when do you or if you cancel that service that streaming on extra devices [TS]

  thing goes away and all of those songs that you've streamed or downloaded to [TS]

  another device gets deleted whether or not you own them extra auxiliary devices [TS]

  and all of your Apple music catalog goes away so you're left with just the [TS]

  original songs you had on your original computer the difference between that and [TS]

  Apple me and iTunes Match is that of course in iTunes Match when you you're [TS]

  able to stream or download your songs that you own to any other computer that [TS]

  has your appointee but when you download those songs onto an axillary computer [TS]

  those songs stay there forever [TS]

  whether or not you cancel iTunes Match are not there they are forever on your [TS]

  computer unless you delete them their their their DRM free so if you just use [TS]

  Apple music and cancel iTunes Match then you are your collection the songs you [TS]

  own that you stream or download other computers will show up as Apple music [TS]

  tagged if they can match that catalog and if you can't slap on music those [TS]

  songs on those auxiliary computers will disappear [TS]

  so if you want them to retain whether or not you choose to keep our music then [TS]

  that's when you keep the two subscriptions running concurrently so [TS]

  you have Apple music and iTunes Match [TS]

  since you have both do you still have both I still have both in part because [TS]

  I'm testing a million things but no i i have pulled because I have a canonical [TS]

  music library on my iMac but I still I will download some things to other two [TS]

  other computers and I don't want my you know my local music library on an [TS]

  axillary to vanish if I decide to camp canceled music because then I would have [TS]

  to go and you know we import everything onto an auxiliary computer right have to [TS]

  reenable iTunes Match and that seems like a book work and then like $25 to [TS]

  never have to worry about that work again I can I can pay 25 bucks here yet [TS]

  twenty-plus years i'd underneath my eye I give a shit threshold that $14.99 a [TS]

  month for a family plan about the music is I want to make sure we're actually [TS]

  listening to see exactly it's like this is actually this is a bill this adds up [TS]

  to a significant amount of money per month I like despite all of the insanity [TS]

  with Apple music and I really do think that the difference between the hike the [TS]

  photos around the photos rollout and the music rollout is that music didn't have [TS]

  a beta period of people and if they had had a beta period with enough with a [TS]

  couple you know a couple hundred like even five ten thousand subscribers would [TS]

  be enough to hash out most of the terrible bugs they saw like the fact [TS]

  that Apple music or Apple music and iTunes Match users were seeing their [TS]

  songs matched a sample music that was a bug that was fixed within the first 48 [TS]

  hours but despite it being fixed in the first 48 hours people went crazy over [TS]

  for about a month and a half [TS]

  yeah that's it really keen observer [TS]

  really think it that that you know that I photo or photos had a beta and they [TS]

  worked out these kinks and music was like all of you go sign up for this free [TS]

  service now for three months and they worked out the kinks like on the fly and [TS]

  it really did leave a sour taste in people's mouths and honestly because it [TS]

  was free they really could have just said three free free or free at three [TS]

  month trial and this is our beta period this summer is our beta launch off [TS]

  period for Apple music that's what I mean looking at beach when I listen to [TS]

  beats 10 law in the early days in part because I was writing about it but it [TS]

  just cuz it was it was such a curiosity to me as someone who hasn't listened to [TS]

  terrestrial radio in about 12 years it was such a curiosity and such an [TS]

  interesting highbrow can you make this work but but it's one was very much in [TS]

  their initial two months and even though I mean that interview with them low that [TS]

  he gave recently at the BBC is basically like we're figuring this stuff out by [TS]

  the seat of our pants this is very much a better for us and we won't know [TS]

  exactly what beats one is or how it fits into the over organ theme of Apple music [TS]

  for about a year but we need this time to build it we we built the station in [TS]

  12 weeks we'd we need this beta period and so they like that side was very very [TS]

  honest and straightforward even on the air being like we're just trying this [TS]

  out let us know what you like let us know what you don't we can you know we [TS]

  want to work with you we want to be your station and the rest of Apple music was [TS]

  very like this is how it is this music enjoyable music how do you think it's [TS]

  going now that for everybody who signed up right away that three-month Beta Beta [TS]

  bit trial yes we need your mind the trial the three-month trial is over and [TS]

  people got the notices like hey you gonna get charged unless you cancel how [TS]

  do you think they're doing now it's very hard to say cuz they don't think they've [TS]

  announced anything now and I don't think they will for a little bit I do think [TS]

  that probably fifty-plus percent canceled but I don't actually think [TS]

  that's a bad thing I think that they do need to do a little bit of retooling and [TS]

  the pretty sure kind of realized that they need to do a bit of retooling in [TS]

  terms of what's really valuable [TS]

  their streaming catalog is fantastic you know as someone who is still an apple [TS]

  music member of the streaming catalog is fantastic [TS]

  before you suggestions are very very good especially if you continue to [TS]

  listen and like these things are like in tryin and tryin refine your tastes [TS]

  their creation engine is really pretty good and beats one is really funny [TS]

  despite not being addressed through radio person like I I will tune into [TS]

  that because it feels it almost feels like being in an office as a [TS]

  work-at-home person worth like older people occasionally talking and they're [TS]

  talking about interesting music related things is not like the Daily local news [TS]

  in your area and it's not something so depressing at npr to get you to get your [TS]

  stomach in knots it's just kind of like fun interesting content and good and the [TS]

  music you might not have otherwise heard so I think there are quite a few people [TS]

  who are still kinda hanging on and and have gotten addicted to certain aspects [TS]

  of the service but for TV wide audience Apple needs to put a little bit more [TS]

  work into it too freely to really make it one shot and one of the biggest [TS]

  things they can do is revamp iTunes on a Mac because right now it's still a mess [TS]

  is the polite word I can't say much much more horrible things but I will decline [TS]

  but you know the music app the new music app in iOS nine people are still [TS]

  complaining that messy but its lately it's less messy it slowly like they're a [TS]

  rating on this would be like ok this is what works this is what does don't it [TS]

  doesn't turns out we don't need in a more but that's gonna last [TS]

  1515 links worth of war but we can we can work around missus iTunes still [TS]

  feels [TS]

  feels [TS]

  J context and bloated and uncomfortable and it's just awkward and weird ways I [TS]

  think I told you the story over the weekend when you were here in Philly for [TS]

  the local yeah we hang a little bit but long story short my wife had a playlist [TS]

  a new playlist you made on a Mac and she just wanted to send it to a phone and go [TS]

  to the gym and the way the new iTunes works it's like you like this where dot [TS]

  dot dot button yeah the playlist and then you go to the dot dot and then it [TS]

  just says send to device and then there's her iPhone and she'd click it [TS]

  and it which seems like that's what should do in if you google you know [TS]

  search for how you're supposed to do this it says that's how it's supposed to [TS]

  do and it never just it just never showed up on a live on and long story [TS]

  short I think that solution was to turn off Apple music on oliver devices and [TS]

  just do it the old-fashioned way and connected to USB and then the dot dot [TS]

  dot center that's found work yet because you're actually sending it over to the [TS]

  rejection it's such a mess it's such a mess but if you have a music turned on [TS]

  at a given having a tethered connection doesn't make it work that's even worse [TS]

  sometimes like some of some of my playlist show up to my playlist it still [TS]

  at the state like Apple this is that that's the kind of stuff that could have [TS]

  been really valuable during a three-month beta test of like me up [TS]

  there some playlists problems let's actually find out I find it really [TS]

  interesting I don't know if you saw this week apple launched an apple music [TS]

  helped Twitter account [TS]

  office hours know you have to appt at Apple music help for a people's Apple [TS]

  music questions they have office hours from I think 826 either GMT re-used yet [TS]

  to actually work but but I saw that and I i quite literally laughed out loud [TS]

  because that's you know that's what I've been doing for the last three months on [TS]

  and off is being people's like Apple music guru on Twitter and now I can be [TS]

  like to talk to them they've actually built this thing like I either I will [TS]

  happily help you still like try and stumble through your problem with you [TS]

  maybe the people who have access to the engineer's can fix your more high-level [TS]

  problems like the fact [TS]

  that pressing the like button to find your tastes but also there's no way to [TS]

  save a song you like as a favorite without adding it to your library and [TS]

  then it goes into the massive like the bottomless pit of library it's really [TS]

  awesome the top in tweet in fact answers my question is create a playlist with [TS]

  your favorite songs in music there you go [TS]

  obviously I've hit frequently asked question anyway but isn't that that is [TS]

  sort of a fun you know again not to release potentially gets new years [TS]

  already but and get all sanguine about and talk about 2015 in the past tense [TS]

  but among other things that are happening here there's you know it has [TS]

  been a sort of quote-unquote new Apple you know things happen does that they [TS]

  would have done before I think having a Twitter account with office hours is [TS]

  file that under things Apple wouldn't have done before the new giving even [TS]

  steven levy access to the design team and actually having like people's not [TS]

  only people's names associated to what they were doing but people's faces and [TS]

  inside it was just one of those things where I'm like I would never seen this [TS]

  story five or six years ago and I'm really glad to see the story and hear [TS]

  more about the inner workings of Apple I'm really glad that Apple is reaching [TS]

  out for help and support beyond just the you know the distended disclaimer go go [TS]

  see Apple Care I'm glad the developers are getting more of a voice on Twitter [TS]

  without worrying that PR is good for rapid PR is gonna come and eat them [TS]

  alive and then they'll never be seen or heard from again it's a really [TS]

  interesting sea-change and thank you [TS]

  well I one of the things a lot like I would like to see it and I've been on [TS]

  this for you haven't talked about it frequently but years ago I know five or [TS]

  six years ago [TS]

  I did as a talk at Macworld back when Macworld San Francisco still think it [TS]

  was like my top 10 things to be you know things to look at you know for the [TS]

  future things to worry about Apple [TS]

  top 10 list and one of them was that I wanted apple to go back to having but [TS]

  letting letting the people who make the software but their credit in the about [TS]

  box yeah like the whole reason about boxes were there the detained in Mac [TS]

  apps is originally it was so that the people who made the things could could [TS]

  get credit for them and it went away when Steve Jobs came back in 1997 98 and [TS]

  now the eval boxes are almost useless and its standard across all of their [TS]

  software it just has the icon the name of the app the version number and a [TS]

  copyright and that it's almost like why do it you know why it's going to really [TS]

  get out of his version number and the idea that the jobs gave back in 98 was [TS]

  that Apple is in bad shape and their talent they did it do one thing the [TS]

  company had come he was in bad shape but had lots and lots of talent and he was [TS]

  really almost pleasantly surprised by the amount of talent the engineering and [TS]

  in the fact that johnnie I've and his team were already there [TS]

  stolen well yeah it was like an anti poaching but it's that is such the way [TS]

  the world works today nobody needs to nobody who's a recruiter trying to poach [TS]

  Apple employees needs the about box to figure out who wrote this app you know [TS]

  you know and and there is obviously a mean if you you know I don't use [TS]

  LinkedIn but I mean thousands and thousands and thousands of employees are [TS]

  on LinkedIn I mean there's all sorts of you know and and be sure that the best [TS]

  recruiters don't even need to do that [TS]

  know it right like the difference between the current world today in a [TS]

  world where Apple employees got to put their credits in the about boxes for the [TS]

  App Center in the system the difference in the amount of talent that get poached [TS]

  is I think effectively zero that's not a good reason to do it and I think that [TS]

  being able to sign your work to me it's it's just an important [TS]

  part of you know it's just like a point of pride in its also nice I mean you [TS]

  know Apple boys I know Apple employees and former Apple employees and when [TS]

  you're working on something that secret all you can really say is I work in this [TS]

  team and and you don't want them to say anything more because you don't want [TS]

  them to get in trouble after as a feature ships you know they can save it [TS]

  can I worked on that that was that thing in the keynote that was partially my you [TS]

  know something that I did and I i I like that I like [TS]

  again what you said I like the idea that our friends and and Apple you know [TS]

  people who work at Apple consign their work and people can be proud about their [TS]

  work because they spend so long and under such levels of secrecy to get it [TS]

  right and get it perfect and and just make a great product whether that's [TS]

  hardware software and when it comes out like I love with Tim Cook has been doing [TS]

  the last couple events were stand up if you worked on this like let's [TS]

  acknowledge these people and not have them hide in the shadows jobs did that [TS]

  too sometimes I don't know I just feel like letting letting you know making the [TS]

  about box is relevant again as just you know the credits credits for the [TS]

  software and I feel like that kind of fits with the way that Stephen levy's [TS]

  behind the scenes of the new peripherals got to go talk to people who actually [TS]

  designed them and work done them in and stuff like that [TS]

  yeah it's very cool let me take another break here and thank our next friendly [TS]

  sponsor and it is our good friends [TS]

  a longtime sponsors the show mail route 40 ute some people may pronounce that [TS]

  mail route I don't know I say mail route [TS]

  here's what they do they are email nerds who do nothing but email that's what [TS]

  they want to do is they want to handle your email [TS]

  they've created the first cloud-based email filtering solution years ago when [TS]

  they sold it to Microsoft then the same team went back and they created a really [TS]

  clear product just as one thing it is an innovative and effective spam and virus [TS]

  filtering mail filter here's how it works you have your own email server [TS]

  your domain name and you get your email you keep running your own email server [TS]

  but what you do is you take your DNS records and you point them once for [TS]

  email at Melrose and then mail route you point them at your regular mail service [TS]

  so mail route isn't actually hosting your email it just goes through mail [TS]

  route first then on to the email server you already have worked with any mail [TS]

  server doesn't matter all mail route does is filter out all of the crap spam [TS]

  the virus stuff and Mac users only after wave of the virus stuff that's pam is [TS]

  enormous problem and mail route spam filtering is I would argue second to [TS]

  none [TS]

  it is really really amazing if if spam filtering for example is the only reason [TS]

  that you use Gmail instead of posting your own email you should really take a [TS]

  look at me out because it is super effective I mean like almost nothing [TS]

  gets through and they have really cool stuff very configurable so that you can [TS]

  get for example you get like a daily report just emailed to you at the end of [TS]

  the day with here are the ones that mail route was like maybe about you know 99% [TS]

  spam they can just nuke and there are two percent certain that if there's [TS]

  anything that they are like I think this is spam [TS]

  but maybe not they you can get it report every day and then you see it and say [TS]

  wow that wasn't spam [TS]

  you know click it you go there and market as not spam and it goes to your [TS]

  email and then they'll remember that keeps going [TS]

  really really easy to set up the hardest part is probably just you know figure [TS]

  out you know going to wear your domain is registered in the DNS records pointed [TS]

  the right way but they have all sorts of stuff to help you get that going it's [TS]

  easy to set up its reliable and its trusted by really really there's large [TS]

  corporations large universities entire universities with tens of thousands of [TS]

  students and all the mail all the stuff goes through mail route first because [TS]

  they're so good at what they do really is an amazing way it's it's just [TS]

  returned email to like the old days when there was no such thing as spam [TS]

  they support all sorts of nerdy stuff too if if you're like assisted been in [TS]

  these things mean anything to you [TS]

  they've got LDAP they've got Active Directory they support TLS they support [TS]

  mailbag bagging outbound relay everything you would want from the [TS]

  people handling your email it's so great it's so simple really great price it's [TS]

  just it it just takes all the junk out of reach and then you don't have to [TS]

  worry about spam anymore where do you go to find out more [TS]

  very easy but a mail route dot net dot net because you know they're like a [TS]

  networking service mail route dotnet / TTS for the talk show in with that code [TS]

  you'll get a free trial and 10% off for the lifetime of your account so use that [TS]

  / CT asked URL and you save 10% for as long as you use them could be decades to [TS]

  come to my thanks to mail out the check them out if you lose your own email [TS]

  server [TS]

  what else you wanna talk about it that this paper haha that's a good one if [TS]

  you're talking about the same thing I'm thinking about what they're talking [TS]

  about yesterday [TS]

  federico pointed this out surprised this yes so so Facebook is a lot of an [TS]

  iPhone's battery and it's traditionally a lot of the iPhone's battery which is [TS]

  why I'm worried recommend turning off background processes but and I S nine we [TS]

  were able to see not only is eating a lot of your battery and you can see you [TS]

  in terms of the the battery screen and percentages you can now tell what [TS]

  specific processes Facebook is using it turns out even if you have background [TS]

  processing turned off facebook can still eat your battery with background audio [TS]

  and what Federico II she's theorized and based on some very clever thing on his [TS]

  part is that Facebook is likely playing silent audio to keep the app running an [TS]

  active in the background and I don't know what that is helpful for them on [TS]

  the outside too but it's insane to me what it it's feel so dirty it's it feels [TS]

  downright malicious yeah and honestly the thing that occurs to me is it [TS]

  doesn't really matter what they're doing if if it's like to check out this week [TS]

  and this is a tweet from sorry I actually checked checked with this guy [TS]

  don't know his real name is his Twitter account is just his first name Chad but [TS]

  he tweeted a screenshot he added me and Jim Dalrymple and and this is his his [TS]

  usage this is his usage from get an iPad right and iPad Mini his battery usage on [TS]

  iOS nine was 75% of his entire battery was consumed by Facebook and it was only [TS]

  two minutes on screen this is so that if you haven't looked at this with you go [TS]

  to the usage and I was not [TS]

  Apple's really gotten this to a very fine grained breakdown and that the [TS]

  number one thing to remember is in most apps that thing that kills the battery [TS]

  the most is making the display and so like knowing how much of your time zone [TS]

  now that they tell you how much of the time was on screen and how much was in [TS]

  the background it can really tell you like hey maybe it's actually ok that [TS]

  Tweetbot used 38 percent of my battery because while I was on it for three [TS]

  hours and you know and so for example if you sit there and read a book in my book [TS]

  for a long time it makes sense that is going to use a lot of battery even [TS]

  though that is obviously not a a CPU intensive application because it [TS]

  powering screen this guy sent me this screenshot Facebook two minutes on [TS]

  screen [TS]

  15.9 hours in the background used up 75% of his iPad battery and he has the [TS]

  Facebook can set not to be able to use background that is insane and it [TS]

  actually to me I honestly think it's it's shows who holds the who holds the [TS]

  power in the Facebook Apple really a cave if you think of Apple is this [TS]

  mighty corporation and and they think of the App Store is this powerful tool that [TS]

  they wield with their own discretion I actually think that this makes Apple [TS]

  look bad in week at a most likely because Facebook is so essential to what [TS]

  people use their iPhones for it you know by almost every account that single most [TS]

  use third-party app on iPhone that I almost wonder whether up on those that [TS]

  they're doing this and feels like they can't do it what are they gonna do the [TS]

  Facebook app to the App Store unfortunately it harms them I'm looking [TS]

  at my my battery for the last seven days on this crazy 58 minutes on screen for [TS]

  Facebook 3.2 hours of background there's no reason and you have background [TS]

  updating turned off my turn I haven't turned off her facebook so it's you know [TS]

  this is mind boggling to me and I don't know if I still have a Facebook account [TS]

  so I have nothing [TS]

  encountered the first and it does not inspire me to change after all these [TS]

  years to change my mind and maybe sign up for Facebook and I hit the survey has [TS]

  like I I was off facebook around 2010 I was done with it and I only went back [TS]

  because the people that I play roller derby with that is the roller derby [TS]

  community is on Facebook it's not a Twitter based place so I only use [TS]

  Facebook for for Derby and even so end up murdering my battery and I totally [TS]

  understand that I know how much of stuff like that I was just at I don't we can [TS]

  talk about it a bit but I was at a screening of the Steve Jobs movie last [TS]

  night over at University of Pennsylvania and it was like a press screening but it [TS]

  was really more like physics students can get it was mostly just college get [TS]

  and they have like it was put together by like their their film club or [TS]

  something like that and the pre-announcement like a welcome glad [TS]

  everybody could be here it was like how do you get involved if you're a student [TS]

  want to get involved at the club it was Facebook yes because you know I'm sure [TS]

  that there are ten ten thousand other examples of groups where if you want to [TS]

  get involved in stay in touch via Facebook so I understand that and not [TS]

  everybody can be an anti social hermit like this is criminal [TS]

  this is absolutely insane that they're they're working around you know people [TS]

  who are so specifically saying I do not want you to update in the background and [TS]

  they're doing it anyway by cheating I mean if it doesn't matter whether the [TS]

  only way they're doing it is federico theory that they're playing silent audio [TS]

  which lets them stay running in the background as a separate you know things [TS]

  from the background updating option which clearly is not in the user's [TS]

  interest right now nobody wants that they've said we want you to shut up in [TS]

  the background just stopped and the other thing that struck me about this is [TS]

  this because of the insane popularity of Facebook and how many people use it [TS]

  and clearly how detrimental it is your battery this has to be [TS]

  I don't even think it's a maybe this has to be a main reason for the the the the [TS]

  stress about the iPhone's battery life force quitting abstain owe that to ya I [TS]

  was surprised that this whole entrenched I would it would you call the way that [TS]

  so many people believe it's a it's a tenant of like using a smartphone where [TS]

  I have to force quit my apps because it'll make things run faster and the [TS]

  battery last longer [TS]

  right on ATP the other week Casey list he was at a football game and the guy in [TS]

  front of him every time you take his phone out he'd unlock it [TS]

  do whatever he was gonna do and then double click the home button and force [TS]

  quit whatever happy to see you and then turn the phone off and put it back in [TS]

  the pocket every single time he said it was i driving him nuts but can you and [TS]

  my thought was this review to an Apple needs to stop this because it's not [TS]

  helping anybody whereas it must be helping people because it that way you [TS]

  can actually nuke the Facebook app and it wouldn't be playing the silent audio [TS]

  anymore and you actually would see better battery yeah I mean I used so I [TS]

  used to use the force quit apps technique [TS]

  way back when when I would go over the border between USA and Canada so that I [TS]

  wouldn't accidental use data usage because that you know that like that is [TS]

  the way to ensure that someone's not leaching in the background so you'd cut [TS]

  everything on that but yeah I mean it seems like that's the only way to ensure [TS]

  that Facebook's not leaching leaching data and battery life Dida like you [TS]

  think about how much how much data I don't care if they are you selling your [TS]

  still streaming something you were still requiring a call and I'll be really [TS]

  interesting to compare this with also the numbers of those the cellular data [TS]

  but I I but I do think you're absolutely right and that it it emphasizes ended it [TS]

  validates the force quit theory where oh well of course this is how I have to use [TS]

  my iPhone and I also I think that it might actually be skewing iPhone battery [TS]

  numbers enough p.m. Facebook but I wouldn't be surprised if that's cutting [TS]

  half an hour an hour off of your battery every day and if you're going from you [TS]

  know you think you're getting a phone with a 14 hour battery and you end up [TS]

  getting [TS]

  you know closer to 11 or 12 that's i mean that that it's a bigger problem [TS]

  than I think we've made it out to be before this yeah I really was not aware [TS]

  of it but it's it really seems like I don't use that word lightly but it seems [TS]

  scandalous it really does and I think it's clearly dark matter to most people [TS]

  like they're not going to figure this out like just going to Settings General [TS]

  Settings settings Battery to find the usage now write write write write [TS]

  something about it but people you know how many people go there I I think it's [TS]

  a lot you stumble across it occasionally like oh that's fun [TS]

  the only the only app that has more on the only after has more than Facebook [TS]

  green on Facebook has four hundred and twenty something megabytes [TS]

  got got new music at four hundred and thirty and Tweetbot at 551 megabytes but [TS]

  I used those apps probably fifteen times as much as facebook on my phone that's [TS]

  crazy yeah it's crazy anyway I think that it's not that last we heard us I [TS]

  think that this story as lakes and politics but it's discreetly this guy [TS]

  with the two minutes home screen 15 hours at the background is crazy and the [TS]

  usage the fact that you know it's not it's not just 75 percent but only all [TS]

  he's only use it to ours he has the time since last fall charge there and that's [TS]

  the really like and if you get you have to tap if you're just looking at if you [TS]

  look at the end I if you tap it and you get this little there's a little blue [TS]

  clock thing that shows you the the how long on screen and how long in the [TS]

  background breakdown doesn't show that but for me it's Tweet button and Safari [TS]

  3 but the last 24 hours of the maps because I've been using my phone a lot [TS]

  but we bought Safari maps music and in male was the only one to me that has the [TS]

  big difference between on screen and back [TS]

  because i dont yeah but that makes sense because I have mail said to to download [TS]

  meal in the background [TS]

  exactly like mel has a good reason to download stuff in the background and I [TS]

  know how to turn it off and if I told it not to have I said you know what would I [TS]

  do it again which I do when I go to a foreign country and a man like a hundred [TS]

  megabytes SIM card and I'll have my email set don't don't load email until I [TS]

  hope I asked for it yeah and then it does it does that it's it this is again [TS]

  it's so easy for someone like me who who's never used Facebook has always [TS]

  been sort of skeptical of the company to sit here and complain about it but my [TS]

  point is really does seem scandalous I mean it seems it's almost outrages we I [TS]

  mean look at those look at the battery and I'm like maps you can have [TS]

  background activity that makes sense [TS]

  mail you can have background activity music you can have background activity [TS]

  podcast yes all these make sense [TS]

  Facebook having background I don't know what Facebook would do with background [TS]

  activity like actively be useful for me maybe load more of my time line so I can [TS]

  read when I don't have a data connection but I don't care it would be curious to [TS]

  see what they are doing and why they're doing it but yes I don't know it's [TS]

  really really interesting yeah I don't think we've heard the last of it but [TS]

  that you know get get get get seriously change on this Steve Jobs movie D one [TS]

  yet let me just 11 last sponsored a tank and then I will tell you about that but [TS]

  I thought the Steve Jobs movie we should also talk about Elon Musk which is a [TS]

  good segue yeah so our last sponsor good friends longtime sponsors that the show [TS]

  is harvest harvest is a beautiful business tool for tracking time spent on [TS]

  client projects with harvest you can start a timer from anywhere [TS]

  web browser desktop mobile device matter where you find yourself working the [TS]

  focus stays on the task at hand [TS]

  track hours [TS]

  the appeal they appear in a visual time report that is designed to keep your [TS]

  projects on time and within budget and you can use their reporting features [TS]

  after you've used it for a little bit you use their reporting features and [TS]

  they show you which clients and projects are making you the most money which ones [TS]

  are making less money or which ones might be costing you money because the [TS]

  time you're putting into it is just not commensurate with what you're getting [TS]

  paid for it really really interesting to read these reporting features it's not [TS]

  just like a stopwatch that you get and gives you the time you spend on a [TS]

  project [TS]

  the way they integrate these into reports and let you combine it with what [TS]

  you're getting paid and stuff like that can really help you figure out whether [TS]

  you're putting your time into the right clients and projects and stuff like that [TS]

  and the fact that they have clients for everything [TS]

  mobile apps the website doesn't matter where you are whether your desktop on a [TS]

  Big Mac or whether you're on your MacBook weather on your phone or [TS]

  whatever it all is just tied into the exact same harvest account and you don't [TS]

  really have to think about it just all just it's just there when you need it [TS]

  and it really is super convenient to have to do to be able to do it that way [TS]

  as opposed to something that is say only on your Mac and then you've got to keep [TS]

  track of your time spent doing things away from your Mac for the project some [TS]

  other way and then get back and login or get enough to do that with harvest they [TS]

  also handle invoices gives you the Billboard hours right there so you don't [TS]

  have to use a different tool when you want to get paid you don't have to use a [TS]

  different world to send the invoices out you can send them right out from harvest [TS]

  so where do you go to get started [TS]

  easy their website is get harvest dot com and you get a free 30 day trial long [TS]

  trial [TS]

  but when you're done when the 30 day free trial is up use this code the talk [TS]

  show at the checkout and get this here's what you say you save 50% off your first [TS]

  month with that code half off with the talk show as your Kota so if you do any [TS]

  kind of freelance work if you run any kind of Client Services thing go check [TS]

  them out [TS]

  harvest is almost certainly a better way to keep track your time though what you [TS]

  doing now so before a time when the Movie lets talk about you on mosque [TS]

  there is a thing last last week where he was interviewed with a German newspaper [TS]

  and they asked him about Apple hiring that rumors and reports that Apple is [TS]

  hiring Tesla engineers and here's what he said Elon Musk said they've hired [TS]

  people we've fired we always jokingly call Apple the Tesla graveyard if you [TS]

  don't make it a test let you go work at Apple I'm not kidding you under my skin [TS]

  is he speaks his mind that is what I will say I mean he's very very job CNN [TS]

  very much like other folks we know in this in this area I don't think he [TS]

  necessarily meant at the way that it came out I think he was probably making [TS]

  a comment about Apple's car efforts and not about Apple's engineering talent but [TS]

  it's still pretty pretty bad it is it is you know it's jobs even in my opinion [TS]

  jobs in thing to say which is whether it's true or not that anatomy is [TS]

  interesting that's the interesting thing because it could be that they've done [TS]

  internally they've looked at this and and they've decided that a lot of the [TS]

  people that you know engineering talent out was hired away from Tesla we're not [TS]

  the eight players that Apple is getting to be players in the eight players are [TS]

  sticking a test that could be true and he's willing to just come out and say it [TS]

  or it could not be true it could have no relevant know it could be that Apple [TS]

  hired great people from Tesla but he's just saying it anyway because he's [TS]

  because of their own right and it either way [TS]

  it works I like it I i think that it's funny and I think that it's very [TS]

  confident and the thing that people have compared it to and I jumped in my mind [TS]

  immediately right away too well the next thing he said was that it was the court [TS]

  building cars the next logical thing for them to do but then he said did you ever [TS]

  take a look at the Apple watch no seriously it's good that Apple is moving [TS]

  in investing in this direction but cars are very complex compared to phones or [TS]

  smartphones and I think he said I don't have it here in this article you see the [TS]

  weird thing is that the German original ones I behind a paywall and then he said [TS]

  something to the effect of that you can't just go you you can just go to [TS]

  China and tell Foxconn to build your watch but you can't just go to Foxconn [TS]

  is a build me a car and a comparison the death brings to mind is then palm CEO at [TS]

  Colligan back in December of 2006 which is like a month before Apple unveiled [TS]

  the iPhone nobody knew it was gonna look like but rumors are rampant that Apple [TS]

  is gonna do a phone and he said something to the effect of we've we've [TS]

  been working on this for a long time PC guys aren't going to just jump in and [TS]

  figure it out yeah and the PC guys at apple just jumped did just jump in and [TS]

  figure out the difference that I see between AD Colligan then and Elon Musk [TS]

  now is that parm in 2006 was totally stagnant they were not making things [TS]

  that were amazing you were not future focus at all right they were you know [TS]

  they seem like they were behind here's here's the here's the quote from him in [TS]

  2006 I looked it up we've learned in struggled for a few years here figuring [TS]

  out how to make a decent phone PC guys are not going to just figure this out [TS]

  they're not going to just walk in [TS]

  so that you are must quote does seem to has echoes of that but the palm products [TS]

  of 2006 they were terrible they were behind the times they just were not [TS]

  exciting whereas Tesla is doing great work they literally made the motor Trend [TS]

  Car of the Year [TS]

  phenomenal work and there you know I the Model X is not for me but even just [TS]

  listening to the stuff that they were talking about the Model X like that that [TS]

  is a phenomenal car is a really cool car right so I actually I love it I love [TS]

  that he's embracing this flat out he's brash and I think it is great for both [TS]

  companies like I wrote years years ago had a piece that Apple you know Apple [TS]

  needs an icon that Canon you know makes better cameras because they have an arch [TS]

  rival for decades in Nikon Coolpix cameras that are as good or better you [TS]

  know class that's as good or better in some ways you know that the competition [TS]

  keeps both companies better that comparison is maybe not that good [TS]

  anymore because both Canon and Nikon are sort of getting disrupted by these [TS]

  mirrorless cameras like the ones from Sony but don't don't take the analogy [TS]

  too far but anyway I just think it would be great it would be so great it's if [TS]

  Tesla keeps gravel yeah if Tesla keeps kicking ass in between now and even the [TS]

  optimistic you know twenty twenty 20 1920 19 is supposedly the goals that's [TS]

  let's if the watch shipped here lately guessed that the car will ship at least [TS]

  a year too late it's probably are probably looking at 2020 2021 yeah [TS]

  nothing could be better for Apple then for Tesla to keep kicking ass and be you [TS]

  know have a great five-year run from now until then just to keep the state of the [TS]

  art going forward [TS]

  yeah I I honestly hope they do I feeling you must be going to is one of these [TS]

  people that doesn't come around every every spring right this is he has a [TS]

  unique snowflake in a in a number of ways and to have him physically [TS]

  breathing down Apple's neck not even in a mean way just kinda even if he just [TS]

  continues to make jobs and jokes and his engineers continue to make fantastic [TS]

  stuff that I mean that's going to spur Apple to work that much harder you know [TS]

  innovation my ass is it is a great lake grumpy grumpy this you know we hate the [TS]

  fact that everybody's been complaining about us on innovating would clearly [TS]

  we're innovating but that kind of stuff I really think that does drive them a [TS]

  little bit I I was very proud of the work they do and the products that they [TS]

  make and to have somebody even even in jest saying yeah to figure out of the [TS]

  project Titan team is like a ho ya Elon Musk ok we'll show you know it's it's [TS]

  good competition is good and especially intelligent competition not like we're [TS]

  going to copy your features and then you're gonna copy ours and then vice [TS]

  versa [TS]

  that's right it's so different coming from the the the founder of companies [TS]

  now well but the most just talk the talk rocket ships but just talking cars it's [TS]

  awesome that to hear sort of straight up you know comp competitive talk from the [TS]

  leader of the most innovative I I don't see how anybody could deny you know [TS]

  they're still very expensive but in terms of how innovative the cars are I [TS]

  don't see how anybody could deny that test was the most innovative company [TS]

  even just the way that they sell the cars without having dealers selling [TS]

  direct innovative you know to have him take a poll on is just great the only [TS]

  thing I don't like is it the next day he kind of walked back a little bit but [TS]

  despite winners so his comments you know instantly they're all over the place out [TS]

  I'd probably everybody listening to this shows us something about but then the [TS]

  next day he tweeted [TS]

  I just got back here that the other quote he told this German newspaper was [TS]

  no seriously it's good that Apple is moving [TS]

  investing in this direction but cars her very complex compared the phones are [TS]

  smart watches and again that so steve jobs in in my area because he's not [TS]

  gonna make phones are smart watches and so it's such a neat rhetorical trick to [TS]

  just sort of say 2222 an Apple as a company that makes these things that are [TS]

  easy answers tomorrow at all it's not true [TS]

  it had not seen the cars are complex or just come more comp just complex in [TS]

  different ways it's a different industry the completely different industry we've [TS]

  got multi gigahertz Unix machines with touch screens with 60 frames per second [TS]

  animation that are all fit into that we carry out our pockets are right i mean [TS]

  they are amazing devices so don't don't tell me that you know cars and other [TS]

  another order of magnitude or something but it's funny anyway on Twitter he [TS]

  tweeted yo I don't head out to great company with a lot of talented people I [TS]

  love their products and I'm glad they're doing and EV electric vehicle regarding [TS]

  the watch Johnny and his team created beautiful design but the functionality [TS]

  isn't compelling yet by version 3 it will be somebody who started following [TS]

  you on my I think I started following him during the initial dragon tests [TS]

  whether they're trying to land a rocket operate and just because I some people [TS]

  were treated retweeting stuff you treat it like a CEO that's because frankly on [TS]

  Twitter and that's not John McGarry this'll be interesting to watch [TS]

  he tends to do this pretty like do the day after responsive tweets to pretty [TS]

  much every interview he's done he did it after the yeah let's drop nooks on the [TS]

  polls that happened during the Stephen Colbert where I think he just he says [TS]

  things and then he watches the media you like oh no no you're you're [TS]

  misinterpreting what I said completely ok just just for my own personal [TS]

  happiness meter I'm gonna say this and I don't necessarily think it's it's [TS]

  apologizing I think it's let me actually make sure you understand what I said UPI [TS]

  dialing it back a little you know like he's he's gonna make he he'll come out [TS]

  and that's why he's such an enjoyable personality and I can't help but think [TS]

  that having a personality like that is it really helps motivate teams you know [TS]

  and the company's it works for it in the same way that it did with jobs it bye [TS]

  bye erring on the side of having the dial turn too high it and then and then [TS]

  dialing back as necessary as opposed to being cautious and keeping the dial a [TS]

  little too low and then maybe trying to tweak it up a little bit you know you [TS]

  have to pick which side you're going to err on there yet [TS]

  by erring on the side of too much I think it's it's how you'd do the [TS]

  impossible [TS]

  yeah I absolutely i mean you can't you can't win big unless you attempt to fill [TS]

  pick and you can't i'm i'm happy with him being boisterous ridiculous it it [TS]

  did it I thought it was fun it did though it it made me and again just by [TS]

  coincidence the timing is truly coincidentally is just that the fact [TS]

  that the anniversary of Steve Jobs death was last week for years you know every [TS]

  October it comes up and it gets a little bit and it just made me think and in [TS]

  some ways it's just sad and it just you know nobody wanted to go to die so it's [TS]

  always sad to remember somebody you know beloved who died but with the Elon Musk [TS]

  comment it really made me miss him because it's Apple doesn't need somebody [TS]

  who can play that role but you know i mean it would have been back and forth [TS]

  back and forth between Steve Jobs in Elon Musk on a semi public forum would [TS]

  have been glorious and going forward making cars like as fun as it's going to [TS]

  be to have apple and Tesla competing in the space it would have been more fun if [TS]

  so I made it did make me miss ya Jaane last thing I did see the [TS]

  yeah everybody call Aaron Sorkin but it's Aaron Sorkin written and Danny [TS]

  Boyle directed [TS]

  I can see why the Aaron Sorkin I you know what all is Aaron Sorkin done is [TS]

  done few good men he's in the West Wing sports night which is still at one of my [TS]

  all-time favorite TV shows [TS]

  studio 60 which was not one of my all-time favorite TV shows like that I [TS]

  like I like it yeah exactly was flawed but had some really great moments and [TS]

  same thing with the newsroom and very flood but occasional high points in the [TS]

  occasional hyper low points but he has a style yeah dialogue and it is you either [TS]

  like it [TS]

  hated or or maybe sometimes you like it sometimes you don't but it's very [TS]

  distinctive and this movie is very very Aaron Sorkin he also wrote the the [TS]

  social network movie and the social network to me was a far more [TS]

  conventional movie it was you could tell this organisms in the way that [TS]

  characters talked but was very neutered 44 sirkin like that was the first thing [TS]

  I ever noticed with with social network is it feels very again there's little [TS]

  bits of shortening it but doesn't feel like an Aaron Sorkin production this [TS]

  this Steve Jobs is very it just screams and in ways that are good and bad in a [TS]

  way that's good the best thing I can say about it is that there's only a handful [TS]

  of major characters and they are all interesting and well with the exception [TS]

  of maybe of Christian whatever her last name was the mother of his who is sort [TS]

  of a weird in the movie just a little little mousey [TS]

  but she was she was she didn't have as much dialogue and made her little [TS]

  uncertain but the characters who were there were all vivid very very vivid it [TS]

  was not just Steve Jobs and a bunch of others it was you know a bunch of very [TS]

  interesting characters and the dialogue is good and the characters are coming [TS]

  from [TS]

  interesting perspectives and there's a lot of really really interesting [TS]

  conflict and it's entirely verbal it I enjoyed it I thought the last third drug [TS]

  a little bit its base and I think most people know the basic gist of it it [TS]

  reacts the first there and they're all these scenes that centered around Apple [TS]

  Steve Jobs product unveilings 1984 original Macintosh 1988 its next box in [TS]

  1998 original iMac which we just talked about an hour ago and then there's this [TS]

  these scenes of you know personal conflict around these events but it's [TS]

  not really about the event and it's not about the products for the most part I [TS]

  thought the third one the third act with the iMac the scene drug a little bit I [TS]

  thought I like the first two much better this movie is wonder is really good I [TS]

  have to say I know there's a lot of people have to listen to the talk show [TS]

  this movie is really really going to bother you if you're the sort of person [TS]

  who wanted to be factually actor I don't understand why you'd go see a fiction [TS]

  movie I know why people expected to hit all the buttons but it was already based [TS]

  on a book that wasn't entirely you know yeah but this takes liberties though it [TS]

  does just taking liberties this is like the best way I can say is it fuels a lot [TS]

  more like a play then a movie and in fact I think it could be adapted to be a [TS]

  stage play good really easily I think the hardest part would be how to stage [TS]

  it because so much of it takes place on stages like almost feel like I was [TS]

  thinking about it [TS]

  as I came home is maybe the way to play it would be to have the actors pretend [TS]

  that the theater they're performing a play in is empty [TS]

  in at the audience isn't there but that's the way it feels to me it didn't [TS]

  really feel like a movie and it's not certain autobiography in any sense of [TS]

  the word like thinking about like I somebody on Twitter who tweeted that he [TS]

  wished their dad Martin Scorsese would do a Steve Jobs biography sorta like the [TS]

  ABA here would be so bored I mean Steve Jobs a fascinating character but i just [TS]

  i don't feel like we needed I don't think we need a diabetic noting that he [TS]

  did was as senate cinematically interesting is flying airplanes I really [TS]

  like scorsese but yeah I was abdel Ibrahim Twitter account is he be D O [TS]

  photo tweeted that which I thought was a keen observation if that's what you're [TS]

  hoping for it is not like that at all and it is not a story like you know that [TS]

  like the social network was it's you know a melodrama about his personal life [TS]

  and with Lisa's daughter [TS]

  overall I don't know why I candid I i enjoyed it but I really had to let go of [TS]

  what I know to be factually true to enjoy it and I can really see I also can [TS]

  really see why his family is not happy about it at all because some of them [TS]

  like liberties they're not just liberties they're just total [TS]

  inaccuracies so just to name one and it really the movie really centers around [TS]

  his relationship with his first daughter Lisa in the way that when she was first [TS]

  born he denied his paternity that's all factually true we don't we know that and [TS]

  complaining about this is that knee jerk response I get when I bring this stuff [TS]

  up is that people think that if your people like me who is a fan of Steve [TS]

  Jobs want this stuff buried and we don't want to talk about it we don't want to [TS]

  be out there because it's uncomfortable and it's ugly it's unfortunate that's [TS]

  not the case at all and nobody who I know who really cares about it is is [TS]

  saying those things and in a way that he could be almost tyrannical to work for [TS]

  nobody is asking people not to remember that order sweep it under the carpet [TS]

  they're just asking for it to be put into context and the thing that I could [TS]

  see would be so painful it's it's is in the movie he in 1998 when iMac thing he [TS]

  still hasn't reconciled with his daughter Lisa [TS]

  he sort of does right before he goes on to datetime field iMac which is [TS]

  ridiculous if you think a wide world would he be doing at Lake as like the PR [TS]

  people are saying let you know your thirty seconds later minute lead you [TS]

  know you know did not have it doesn't seem like jobs at all besides if you [TS]

  were if you're talking about you know someone who is excessively focused over [TS]

  rehearsing and all of that you know right no one gets to come near me for 24 [TS]

  hours [TS]

  right and actually that's his ways and the character that Michael Fassbender [TS]

  plays is interesting and he's great he's what he is a great actor and it's a very [TS]

  interesting character but the character he plays bears no resemblance to Steve [TS]

  Jobs yeah it's so in short what I almost wish is almost wish that they had done [TS]

  like like something like citizen keep this wouldn't have sold because it's the [TS]

  name Steve Jobs that is selling tickets to think but like Citizen Kane was a [TS]

  thinly veiled biography of William Randolph Hearst and instead of naming [TS]

  the guy William Randolph Hearst they made a had enough legal problems dealing [TS]

  with hearst as is [TS]

  hearst almost cut though the negative burned by naming the guy what's his name [TS]

  child's foster Charles Foster Kane so funny I remember the faster but Charles [TS]

  George Foster Kane Charles Foster Kane they had enough problems as it but it in [TS]

  addition to the fact that it helped them legally it just let them take liberties [TS]

  that they couldn't take otherwise but in real life steve Jobs was married to you [TS]

  know larry powell jobs by this time in the early nineties and they had kids of [TS]

  their own and that family reconciled with Lisa at some point in the nineties [TS]

  and brighter in and she was living with them for a time and you know whatever [TS]

  damage was done early in his life had gotten a lot better and Steve Jobs it [TS]

  really turned around [TS]

  well before 1998 whereas this movie paints a portrait of somebody who is no [TS]

  rambo resemblance to reality at all and I just and right and then just a little [TS]

  factual things are going to drive nerds crazy is that like in 1998 Steve woz [TS]

  Wozniak was still bugging jobs to thank the Apple to engineering team at the [TS]

  appt at the iMac introduction [TS]

  and I swear to God and and jobs claims was for the Newton [TS]

  so if things like that would bother you like you would there's no way that you [TS]

  can get around them and just pretend that this is totally fictional fable [TS]

  loosely based on somebody named Steve Jobs at Apple do not see this movie if [TS]

  you if you don't want that shit Steve Jobs blame lies the act for the news [TS]

  then do not watch this you know so a couple of plays and 11 of them I saw [TS]

  pretty recently called the Farnsworth invention which is a story about the [TS]

  founding of television essentially it's it's a very very good show if you know [TS]

  nothing about the founding of television would just say it centers around a guy [TS]

  named Philo Farnsworth and then RCA basically Farnsworth RCA were [TS]

  simultaneously developing television and then it deals with basically their legal [TS]

  battles where Farnsworth alleges that RCA basically steals the founding of [TS]

  television all of that is true the hyper like the the pivotal point in the script [TS]

  which is how the legal battle results is wildly different from the actual results [TS]

  of of the world's like what actually happened in real life and a lot of [TS]

  people when they first saw the fifth the show or just kind of like what [TS]

  but Sorkin went that way because he wanted to make his point he wanted he [TS]

  was telling a story and whether or not the story actually lined up with real [TS]

  logistical history [TS]

  doesn't matter if they had her which is very much what I kind of feel like even [TS]

  from the earliest trailers of Steve Jobs again I really I wish it hadn't been [TS]

  called that I wish they had figured out a different title I wish that they had [TS]

  taken more liberties with it because I think it [TS]

  Charles Foster Kane US citizen kane version of Steve Jobs is life would be [TS]

  fascinating just like a steve King version of Elon Musk's life would be [TS]

  fascinating and it's not it again because it's just these three little [TS]

  scenes you know surrounding these products event it wouldn't have this [TS]

  movie wouldn't even with giving everybody fake names wouldn't have that [TS]

  the scope of a citizen kane no scope but that's sort of I don't know or just wait [TS]

  a few decades literally decades so that it's not not so fresh right I mean I met [TS]

  you know I remember the iMac launched I'm sure you do to really wasn't that [TS]

  long ago not even 20 years back the people are so if if two-thirds of the [TS]

  people in this film are still living in Moneyball was the same issue right I [TS]

  don't I actually don't know the logistic like I read the book but the book in the [TS]

  film or a little bit different in my ways but I don't even yeah I don't know [TS]

  if feels it feels weird I don't like watching biopics especially recent pics [TS]

  for that very reason yeah I think Moneyball again it's weird and I do [TS]

  realize too that I'm intimately familiar with apple and their products and you [TS]

  know at least Steve Jobs is public life and so obvious inaccuracies jump out to [TS]

  me and in a way that I'm not quite with Moneyball because I'm a baseball fan but [TS]

  I can't say that I followed the Oakland Athletics to the degree that I follow [TS]

  Apple [TS]

  but I think that the money I don't think people associated with it the real [TS]

  people in it really had money much to complain about [TS]

  yeah I don't think Billy being a complainer Brad Pitt is playing you know [TS]

  I'm great on every level you know I don't know it's it's why I have very [TS]

  mixed feelings about it it's not it was an enjoyable movie but it's absolutely [TS]

  positively wasn't don't have anything to do with jobs are almost very little I [TS]

  would have been surprised if it did honestly I wanted to tell a character [TS]

  study and he wanted to he wanted to shape the character in the he's been [TS]

  really obsessed the last couple I wanna see the last couple projects done with [TS]

  father-daughter relationships you know yes yeah I think that was more of his [TS]

  like oh yeah I can read the Steve Jobs movie but not actually gonna write about [TS]

  Steve Jobs in the right about what I want to write about and that is [TS]

  fundamentally that is what this movie's about Aaron Sorkin Steve Jobs is is a [TS]

  father-daughter relationship story which could have been great great movie if it [TS]

  was entitled to jobs and even in in my opinion even [TS]

  with that it was increased because I thought that third third act was really [TS]

  like that it just was just didn't ring true [TS]

  not not true to like what I know to be factually true but like just contrived [TS]

  is maybe the word yeah here's my notes melodramatic be contrived it's probably [TS]

  a better word and I thought even even bordering a little bit boring and it'll [TS]

  be interesting to see how it plays I'm curious to see how big of a hit as I [TS]

  will say this to end it really made me cringe as it was a theater full of [TS]

  college students good crowd I mean it was free I think free movies go over [TS]

  pretty well pretty well oncologists [TS]

  when their credit came up everybody's up there is a young woman right behind me [TS]

  she said her friend wow that was my dad I'd be using an Android I swear to god [TS]

  that was what she does not paint a good picture know and I just like that it was [TS]

  there that I don't really understand if you really wanted to tell [TS]

  father-daughter piece you could have done a really interesting things I mean [TS]

  I think the iMac from a product standpoint is it pretty pivotal moment [TS]

  in Apple's history but I you know if you really wanted to compare Steve Jobs the [TS]

  father you should have done the iPhone release because that actually gives him [TS]

  a family that's not Lisa you know that that gives him a chance to basically [TS]

  press the redo button on being a father and I don't know this is me rewriting [TS]

  rewriting Aaron Sorkin [TS]

  I know better than anyone during screenwriter but I i'm [TS]

  this is not a lot you know that's the thing there isn't really much of a plot [TS]

  to spoil I mean it's a biopic never even get because it ends in 1998 there's [TS]

  absolutely no know nothing about his illness or anything like that but it's [TS]

  like they can't help themselves and it's like oh come on in 1998 is darrow's to [TS]

  walk around with it [TS]

  I'm gonna fix that i'm gonna put 500 songs pocket now 5,000 songs not well [TS]

  between 500 and 5,000 but I'm gonna do it I'm gonna put it in your pocket cause [TS]

  I'm so sick of seeing you with that stupid a player and it's ok [TS]

  zactly exactly they turned to the camera you get a little musical staying at the [TS]

  shame you know i i really like stored in the he's he's very flawed as a writer [TS]

  but I I love I love musical dialogue and yes the idea yet the idea of creating [TS]

  jobs or at least very issues like jobs has great musical dialogue Sorkin has [TS]

  great musical dialogue this could possibly be amazing or Sorkin could fall [TS]

  down one of his rivals and it could be I do it there is good dialogue I'm again [TS]

  you have to be able to let go and I i enough of a a cinema fans that I can [TS]

  sort of at times if the movie is made by talented people I can I can disengage [TS]

  from whether or not the movie is driving me in and just sort of watch it in a [TS]

  different way and I could do that and they're definitely could like what's her [TS]

  name who plays Joanna Hoffman Kate Winslet Kate Winslet really really good [TS]

  I think if anybody gets any kind of award nominations are going to be her I [TS]

  think she's remarkable and it's a great character and I don't know anything [TS]

  about the real join often so I can compare it you know i i don't know but [TS]

  she has a super great role in this movie really well written really great dynamic [TS]

  over the you know the fifteen-year stretch that it covers and she just [TS]

  she's the reason to see the movie I think and it's it's a great performance [TS]

  in really really well written character that's actually really phenomenal here [TS]

  because I know Sorkin's had trouble writing women lately so I think that [TS]

  she's she's the exam is it a great great female character in my opinion [TS]

  number one reason to watch a movie and I can totally see why actors would want to [TS]

  play his characters because I really feel like [TS]

  yeah yeah I feel like I feel like I said all the main characters jobs and and [TS]

  Joanna Hoffman and Andy Herzfeld and why was and although the whys that Seth [TS]

  Rogen place again is why I would say he bears less resemblance to the real was [TS]

  then then Fassbender's jobs does he doesnt bear any resemblance to the real [TS]

  wise not even just physically just everything about him is very different [TS]

  but it's an interesting character in a movie if you don't pretend that he's was [TS]

  was and especially john sculley played by gosh what his name Jeff Jeff Jeff [TS]

  Daniels love and he and he does so well with Sorkin's rating I mean he's a [TS]

  highlight of the newsroom for me and he he really steals the show in this too [TS]

  and he does have a huge role but he's one of the major you know major [TS]

  characters and he's he's really good really really good [TS]

  yeah so anyway that's that's my talk show review of Steve Jobs good good good [TS]

  overview I think I will see it I you should see I would recommend these I [TS]

  mean I just came I'm gonna go into it as you said with with film critic eyes on [TS]

  and not with not with tech writer job eyes on its I'll bet you'll come out [TS]

  another way to put it is it's exactly what you think it is [TS]

  yeah and it's disappointing in some ways but we're seeing others if you can put [TS]

  aside their actual stuff you can protect if you can ignore the fact that most of [TS]

  the movie isn't actually true but it's fiction I i'm not accept I wasn't [TS]

  expecting to do a note for note by a pic when it was announced that he was [TS]

  writing it fly [TS]

  I think that about wraps it up let me thank our sponsors this week we have [TS]

  harvest time tracker mail route great service for filtering all the spam out [TS]

  of your email [TS]

  automatic the dingus you sticking your car and get all the information out of [TS]

  and last but not least harry's get the talk the URLs in the codes by going to [TS]

  the website and look at it [TS]

  serenity Caldwell people can read your work I'm or dot com and on Twitter you [TS]

  are what you eat your twitter names that are nasty tter and Twitter account and [TS]

  and I thank you for your time [TS]

  anything else you wanna anything else you wanna books that came out we did [TS]

  read in a book on Apple music if you're if you're having trouble with that the [TS]

  big thing is actually not tech related to my tech related and that Jason Snell [TS]

  of a former macro 106 colors fame and myself and David lawyer who is a [TS]

  playwright and also Twitter enthusiasts along with a whole host of other people [TS]

  have put together a old timey radio theatre podcast called the incomparable [TS]

  radio theatre and we're doing season one right now [TS]

  454 episodes in I think of a twelve episodes season it's been really fun [TS]

  lots of guest voices that you may recognize from the tech community and [TS]

  also you know get cameos just left and right it's it's been a blast at such a [TS]

  fun like late record late night put together [TS]

  Jason does magic of editing wizardry Chris Prine formerly of back roads of [TS]

  Apple does amazing music it's just it's it's works for a company he does work [TS]

  for food company [TS]

  it does sound like fun I will put a link to that new show nodes and [TS]

  it seems as though everybody it seems like everybody's desperate for podcast [TS]

  to listen to because last week mark and i were talking about hello internet and [TS]

  hello internet shut up from Mike number three on the overcast recommended list a [TS]

  number one passing even Marcos own podcast and I know that is entirely [TS]

  markers doing but anybody looking for a good podcast that does sound like fun [TS]

  and it also sound like it's a lot different than the average text show to [TS]

  people talking about this week's news [TS]

  texture so anyway I will put a link into that sounds great thank you serenity [TS]

  thank you John actually before we go i did want to mention it just happened [TS]

  today Gary Allen who ran i oh yeah yeah he just passed away from brain cancer [TS]

  which is in part why he shut down I and i know i as somebody as a former Apple [TS]

  retail employee and someone who religiously checked that site for many [TS]

  years it feels like we lost a good one today [TS]

  really does and it makes me sad I never really I don't think I ever met him [TS]

  either a lot over the years because he was the definitive I mean what a weird [TS]

  be paid to eke out but that's a crazy beat but then for years to come [TS]

  you know the source and if there was nothing to write it in right and if [TS]

  they're new stores who wrote about him but when he's stopped writing the site [TS]

  back in March I was just that well all right he's done but it turns out there [TS]

  was because he didn't want to go public within have people you know [TS]

  yeah so anyway my best to anybody who knew and friends or family [TS]

  he will be missed [TS]

  all right thank you serenity thank you john was a blast talk to you soon [TS]