193: The Escape Zone
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it is currently five past nine on
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thursday night the apple event was
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earlier today my beloved virginia tech
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hokies are presently losing to the
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University of Pittsburgh i am i am
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watching it out of the corner of my eye
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on my iPad on the watch ESPN app which
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is actually very nice and I am trying
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desperately to pay attention what you
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guys are saying rather than watch my
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beloved Hokies and so if i accidentally
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let out a cheer may be given that we're
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losing 2116 a not happy cheer that Marco
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may have to bleep my apologies but this
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is what I do for you listeners it would
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be so much kind of incredible to be to
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be like perfectly well time we're
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talking about like you know this new
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touch bar in cases like to think that
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come on that would be kind of amazing
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haha i wouldn't put it past me
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no promises alright so we do have a an
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infinitesimally small bit of follow-up
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get yes alright work within 10 yards
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next video so even if intestinal small
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amount of farts 04 joke reference this
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is this is a football team you're
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yes this is a football game watching I
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don't know which sport to make terrible
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jokes about fair enough
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oh and is it is in the world series
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tonight as well actually come to think
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of it and one of the games i mean
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probably it isn't it like every night I
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mean is like that's the thing like
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baseball cards baseball like a DDoS
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attack but just like every night there's
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baseball like taking away from
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baseballers constantly games everywhere
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everyday that is amazing
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well done sir so we do have a bit of
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follow-up and for the first time in like
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two or three weeks it's not me
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John what have you been up to lately i
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did actually make it to an apple store
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to check out the phones were there this
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mystery is dedicated trip the only
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reason I went timely close to you to
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check out the fonts we're gonna start
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talking about the ipod yeah well it'll
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be quick i'll be here's a picture you
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took with one here's another picture you
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uh-huh yeah i was gonna send it to them
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but i decided to and I was helping to
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clarify he had plenty to clarify which
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1i want to get it didn't really help me
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that much because really yeah because i
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know i have a dilemma i think i can
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decide what I'm going to do but you know
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yet so the black one is group
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there it would look better people didn't
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touch it but people touch it so it looks
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gross and has little scratches on it
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like but we already covered all this
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ground i think i'm going to think what's
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gonna end up happening is I'm going to
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experience the worst of all possible
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worlds because what I think i'm going to
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do is buy a jet black one and try using
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without a case and then eventually
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decided that I can't handle the outer
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case because it looks too i'm looking at
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scratch too much and then by case for it
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later after it's already damaged and
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scratched up and put the leather case on
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my scratched up jet black iphone 7 at
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least it wouldn't be a lie at least you
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you wouldn't have this pristine funder
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there that you think is totally
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unscratched but there's actually one
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scratch on the side i think i can get
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pretty well but like I I the thing is
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I've never got all my ipod touches I've
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had cases for and my one iphone had a
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case for us i'm just going to give it a
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try without a case because this one is
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gritty enough that I feel like all right
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you know but let's give it a try and can
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I handle the damage that is inevitably
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going to happen to this so i think i'm
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gonna give it a try almost but when i
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was there but then i remembered that I'm
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not supposed to buy one until i can
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renegotiate summarizing thing in like
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ten days or something and they only had
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256 gig models anyway so I didn't get
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but that's what i'm going to do get a
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jet black one try without a case see how
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long that lasts i predict that will not
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fair enough now are you planning to get
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applecare oh yes yes i was still I
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bought myself this matte black iphone 7
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which I stand by a few weeks later is
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the prettiest iphone i think i've ever
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ever owned I really genuinely believe
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it's great-looking it is slicker than
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anything you can imagine but it's really
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darn good-looking
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yes all right field goal that's a good
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sign only down by two so anyway so I got
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this job but this excuse me this map
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black iphone i did not get this is all
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starting to show you know that's fine
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the listeners will take this journey
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with me so tomorrow I got applecare hey
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I know I got this I got this applecare+
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for the very first time and everyone
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applecare and anything before to the
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best of my recollection and I feel okay
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meanwhile later that same launch day i
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a-a-and iphone 7 no applecare+ because
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she always uses a case we go to a
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football game this past weekend and her
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phone falls out of her pocket because
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why wouldn't it it's slick as a bar soap
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and she didn't have her case on it yet
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asked me what happened aaron's phone her
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three week old phone did you spill water
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no that would actually be kind of okay
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why do not have a case on it yet how
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long does it take for the case
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installation process after after his
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passion purchases like that bring to the
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dealer to put the case on you just get
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take out of the box you put in the case
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well the rust-proof coating on the
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undercarriage is very expensive and
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takes a long time now I'm what ended up
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happening was we had gotten an apple
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case but even the silicone cases are
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ridiculously expensive just wait just
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the silicone cases like 30-40 box and so
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we had one but we were thinking maybe we
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can find something that's effectively
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the same on amazon hadn't opened up the
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apple one in case we could return it
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so what ended up happening was in order
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to attempt to save the forty dollars i
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think it was for the the silicone case
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that we had already purchased we ended
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up now having a hundred thirty dollars
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with the damage that has yet to be fixed
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because it's like when your UPS was
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sitting next to your computer during the
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thunderstorm not plugged into it
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yes exactly the case sitting at home and
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in the box while you drop your phone
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mhm that's true that's absolutely
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accurate so so get applecare is really
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the most story here or put the darn
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phone in a case and don't be like me
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this episode is brought to you by
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Squarespace start building your website
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today at squarespace.com enter offer
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love about Squarespace i always i will
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use square space for our site i've used
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it for projects before where people want
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to ask me to make a website and i said
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look you don't need me have here
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Squarespace and show them how to use it
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and sometimes like you don't get him
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started for like half hour it looks
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incredible and they think I did all
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and it turns out to squarespace graphics
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just that good and then they can help
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themselves and if they don't need to
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support after that they can just ask
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where space they don't have to ask me
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it's incredible you get so much built-in
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with squarespace if you have a project
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you need to make a website for it
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it is usually not worth doing anything
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else it's usually just worth kona
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Squarespace have them do all the hard
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an obvious cell check it out start your
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thanks a lot of square space for
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sponsoring our show
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ah I'm all fired up ready to go to the
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mac day I'm so happy it but yet
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asterisks but other for the most part of
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happy to Mac day we just start by
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talking about TV then yeah you should
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visit you to give an accurate simulation
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of the experience of watching this this
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well you know that was John on the phone
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we we cannot skip any where we're going
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to have to go chronologically so let's
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start with the TV things have happened
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for the apple TV and in fact things have
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happened for more than just the apple TV
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they have happened for iOS as well the
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mac well I mean who cares about the max
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just a mac event so but yeah there's an
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apple TV app or a TV app i should say
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for iOS not for the back but for iOS and
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as well for the TV of course and it's
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it's all things to all people as long as
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you don't care about Netflix or Amazon
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you know this it's weird kind of way
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that they did TV stuff in this thing
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although we kind of knew that they were
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going to with you know justjust off our
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features no hardware features they
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haven't fixed the apple TV remote or
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anything like that they didn't talk
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about their new you know making
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experience actually watching TV on your
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Apple TV better which is hey a good
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maybe don't spend too long on it in
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front of an event supposed to be about
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Max but whatever but I think it's worth
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talking about because this presentation
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kind of show that Apple is still
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chipping away at apple TV making steady
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progress but on the other hand I think
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it also highlighted all the ways that
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they're behind and I had a couple of
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thoughts in my head while watching this
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one was that everything they were
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showing you like the unified interface
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TV can be in place to watch all your
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easier than going to find like what
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Apple's I watching that thing in or
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whatever you know having a unified TV
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thing keeps track of what you're
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watching him if you're using another apt
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to watch it trying to bring everything
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together like their goal of you know I
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forget what the words are all try to
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scrub to the video here for like a
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unified TV experience or whatever you
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can't always it unified TV experience
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there you go you can't actually deliver
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on that until you hit some critical mass
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of content and it's debatable what that
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critical mass of content is but
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obviously we would agree that you just
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had HBO and it's never gonna be unified
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interface or you didn't have some of the
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major sports it wouldn't be unified
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interface but like I'm not quite sure
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what that is but I think Apple Apple TV
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does not yet have a critical mass of
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content and you may sit as dude based
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solely on netflix not participating in
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this that is enough at this point to say
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no because people want their next week's
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they have exclusive content people like
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it if that's not part of the experience
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so much for unified it's already
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bifurcated as just gonna split or even
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more for things like local sports that
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you can get so the gold unified
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experience is fine but as discussed many
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many times in the past if you're not
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going to do the omniverse box thing you
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can never present a unified interface
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unless you literally contain all the
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contents are also watching TV and there
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I don't think they're close to that for
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most people because it's always going to
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be something that's not in apple TV or
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not in the TV app and apple TV for most
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few people who only watch things that
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are in their fine but like if that's
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their goal they need to work on the
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business side of this to figure out if
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we had these content providers we can
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get you know we will cover eighty
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percent of the of the viewing public
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needs or whatever and I'm sure the
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changes from country to country and
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region to region but there I don't think
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they're closed now so that's depressing
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but that's nothing new technology is due
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entirely business deals and the next
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thing is the TV button the the icon on
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the remote for the TV button like that
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it's kind of the home button with you
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know when you're pressing you go back to
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the screen with all the little
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rectangles where all your different apps
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are right but that icon it's printed on
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the remote is also the little glyph
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that's on the TV app
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and so in the demo they showed if you go
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to the TV app launch it and like as a
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bunch of things you're watching and you
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click on one of them like Game of
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Thrones and your truck off into the HBO
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a poor you're watching Game of Thrones
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and then you hit the TV icon it takes
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you back to the TV application not back
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to the screen with a bunch of little
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rectangles and it's kind of like em this
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button and this this thing go together
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and like it should have been there from
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the beginning but it could be read
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conned in but either way it kind of
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changes the fundamental experience I
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think for the better kind of the same
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way the apple watch experience with
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changes like look people don't want to
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go back to basically springboard on
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their apple TV all the time it's
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supposed to be a television watching
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devices if you're watching television
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the television watching should be the
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central thing when you hit the tivo
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button you go back to you well that's
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not a good example is always takes me
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back to the stupid main Tebow central
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►
Reese entering the center of gravity of
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the tale of apple TV on television I
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think it's a good idea but then now all
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of a sudden the appletv reframed in this
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way less as a like humongous ipad that
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you don't touch you know like it's just
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like a big ipod you know less like a
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springboard is the heart of everything
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►
spring bars not the heart of everything
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►
the TV app is the heart of apple TV
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because it's all about watching TV and
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►
sometimes you want to play games or
[TS]
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►
whatever really you want to be using TV
[TS]
◼
►
app and reframed like that then again
[TS]
◼
►
you see how far behind on their where
[TS]
◼
►
the user profiles how can i switch shoot
[TS]
◼
►
like my kids think we're all their apps
[TS]
◼
►
are going oh there's like up next or
[TS]
◼
►
whatever yeah fine if you live alone and
[TS]
◼
►
only one person ever watch TV shows at
[TS]
◼
►
the same time that's great how do i
[TS]
◼
►
switch to you know a different account
[TS]
◼
►
with a different apple idea with the
[TS]
◼
►
same Apple ID all those things that
[TS]
◼
►
netflix has long since figured out is
[TS]
◼
►
when you want to thats like that you can
[TS]
◼
►
pick who you want to be and you have
[TS]
◼
►
your own cue of stuff and you have your
[TS]
◼
►
own thing that you watched last and i'm
[TS]
◼
►
not going to go up to it and find out
[TS]
◼
►
the next things up next for me is like
[TS]
◼
►
you know some Disney Channel show that
[TS]
◼
►
my daughter was watching that I don't
[TS]
◼
►
want to watch right there so far behind
[TS]
◼
►
just the netflix app let alone other
[TS]
◼
►
full television experience you know
[TS]
◼
►
attempts to be unified thing so I'm glad
[TS]
◼
►
apple TV is making progress i think
[TS]
◼
►
they're moving in the right direction
[TS]
◼
►
but they're still behind and the remote
[TS]
◼
►
sucks well how do you really feel you
[TS]
◼
►
know I was really excited
[TS]
◼
►
did to see the live sports stuff and
[TS]
◼
►
granted as we've already discussed i am
[TS]
◼
►
not at all watching college football
[TS]
◼
►
right now but being able to just say to
[TS]
◼
►
siri you know put on the Virginia Tech
[TS]
◼
►
game or what or what have you that
[TS]
◼
►
that's really powerful and really
[TS]
◼
►
awesome but it works when it works which
[TS]
◼
►
I meanwhile I'm going on faith that it
[TS]
◼
►
generally does but that that's really
[TS]
◼
►
exciting and that's like you said its
[TS]
◼
►
movements in the right direction but I I
[TS]
◼
►
just have a hard time thinking that for
[TS]
◼
►
me this is going to be much of an
[TS]
◼
►
improvement because generally speaking
[TS]
◼
►
when im using the apple TV which I do
[TS]
◼
►
darn near daily i'm using flex or i'm
[TS]
◼
►
using netflix or occasionally i'm using
[TS]
◼
►
the standard music app it's very rare
[TS]
◼
►
i'm doing anything else
[TS]
◼
►
so having to go for I guess how this
[TS]
◼
►
would work is I would hit the TV what
[TS]
◼
►
was once the home button to go to the TV
[TS]
◼
►
app and then I guess hit again to go to
[TS]
◼
►
springboard I don't know it might take
[TS]
◼
►
you back to the springboard you think
[TS]
◼
►
you did you haven't first launched apple
[TS]
◼
►
TV i have no idea where we saw a demo
[TS]
◼
►
with two seconds worth of interaction
[TS]
◼
►
will find out when we get the OS update
[TS]
◼
►
i suppose but anyway if if going back to
[TS]
◼
►
springboard is via the appletv a prime
[TS]
◼
►
sorry the TV app always that's actually
[TS]
◼
►
going to be a disappointing change for
[TS]
◼
►
me but i hope i really really hope that
[TS]
◼
►
in the future the netflix and amazon
[TS]
◼
►
stuff gets squared away so that they can
[TS]
◼
►
be included because amazon is going to
[TS]
◼
►
be important too soon because of the
[TS]
◼
►
like I said netflix is where we watch
[TS]
◼
►
pretty much any TV that isn't on you
[TS]
◼
►
know terrestrial television so and in
[TS]
◼
►
Plexus for movies and other things so I
[TS]
◼
►
feel like this is a step in the right
[TS]
◼
►
direction but it's not there yet and man
[TS]
◼
►
i'm hopeful though I'm super hopefully
[TS]
◼
►
even though i don't expect anything to
[TS]
◼
►
Apple has a lot of work to do if it
[TS]
◼
►
wants to get these things and like get
[TS]
◼
►
netflix on board this is the unified TV
[TS]
◼
►
experience you need to have netflix in
[TS]
◼
►
there get amazon to have a thing like
[TS]
◼
►
integrate make sure the people who
[TS]
◼
►
should be integrating do make sure
[TS]
◼
►
plexes integrated like if you really
[TS]
◼
►
want to be unified you have to reach out
[TS]
◼
►
and it's really hard to get it looks on
[TS]
◼
►
board when Apple keeps making more
[TS]
◼
►
she's about all we're gonna be a make
[TS]
◼
►
her own content like they're doing that
[TS]
◼
►
reality show and cookies talking about
[TS]
◼
►
well you know we were looking into
[TS]
◼
►
funding content we like making your own
[TS]
◼
►
content is directly competing with
[TS]
◼
►
Netflix and Amazon who were also making
[TS]
◼
►
their own content and I i think it's
[TS]
◼
►
easier to work with something like HBO
[TS]
◼
►
which also makes it on content with HBO
[TS]
◼
►
has no pretensions to make a digital
[TS]
◼
►
platform for television watching like
[TS]
◼
►
they're not selling little Punk's like
[TS]
◼
►
you connect to your TV they don't sell
[TS]
◼
►
network services they're all about the
[TS]
◼
►
content so that is a little bit more of
[TS]
◼
►
a straightforward thing but anyway this
[TS]
◼
►
is the plan they got work to do so while
[TS]
◼
►
we're waiting for the new Apple TV with
[TS]
◼
►
a non crappy remote to come out
[TS]
◼
►
hopefully all the apples little business
[TS]
◼
►
people are scurrying around trying to
[TS]
◼
►
get these deals happen doing whatever it
[TS]
◼
►
takes or just don't be a TV platform
[TS]
◼
►
like you're going to play in the state
[TS]
◼
►
game and try to friday unified interface
[TS]
◼
►
then provide a unified integrates I
[TS]
◼
►
don't want to see you know 10 years from
[TS]
◼
►
now three or four islands of content
[TS]
◼
►
with their own apps in their own
[TS]
◼
►
ecosystems totally separate from each
[TS]
◼
►
other so annoying all right anything
[TS]
◼
►
else about the TV i know i know Marco
[TS]
◼
►
you are really excited to talk about it
[TS]
◼
►
some more but oh yes I care so much
[TS]
◼
►
about television you know you see that
[TS]
◼
►
and I know to some degree you're being
[TS]
◼
►
silly but don't you watch all of your TV
[TS]
◼
►
through the apple TV
[TS]
◼
►
yeah and I don't care about it
[TS]
◼
►
whatsoever like that to me and I the
[TS]
◼
►
apple TV is something that I its I
[TS]
◼
►
country the appletv the way a lot of
[TS]
◼
►
like our friends who love ipad so much
[TS]
◼
►
treat the mac it's like it's a thing
[TS]
◼
►
that i use i choose it as the best of a
[TS]
◼
►
whole bunch of tools i don't care about
[TS]
◼
►
and i use it and I don't really think
[TS]
◼
►
about it I I don't have a lot of passion
[TS]
◼
►
for TV or TV related things or
[TS]
◼
►
tv-related boxes the appletv the new
[TS]
◼
►
Apple TV box is largely fine
[TS]
◼
►
it could be better in a lot of ways i
[TS]
◼
►
think it will always just be fine
[TS]
◼
►
the old one was always just fine also
[TS]
◼
►
it's the apple TV has a product line has
[TS]
◼
►
been around for quite some time and has
[TS]
◼
►
always been fine so I expected to
[TS]
◼
►
continue to be fine if we continue to
[TS]
◼
►
use it on a regular basis but really
[TS]
◼
►
just never think about it at all except
[TS]
◼
►
i'm using it doesn't work I think you'll
[TS]
◼
►
appreciate the up next thing because if
[TS]
◼
►
you actually use that TV app it's easier
[TS]
◼
►
way to get back what was i doing
[TS]
◼
►
before on the appletv if it hasn't
[TS]
◼
►
retain state on the thing to be able to
[TS]
◼
►
just go to that except the things that i
[TS]
◼
►
that i watch most often our netflix and
[TS]
◼
►
flex which i'm pretty sure will probably
[TS]
◼
►
never be in it not being that it's okay
[TS]
◼
►
I hear you you know it's the kind of
[TS]
◼
►
thing like i don't i don't have cable so
[TS]
◼
►
I'm cable lock in so i can I i don't use
[TS]
◼
►
any apps that require cable login I i do
[TS]
◼
►
have HBO Go now whichever 1i have one of
[TS]
◼
►
the HBO now but I've actually been thank
[TS]
◼
►
you i'm actually been nothing about
[TS]
◼
►
canceling because we hardly ever
[TS]
◼
►
watching Miley watch up in bursts and
[TS]
◼
►
you can always turn it off and turn
[TS]
◼
►
touchdown oh nevermind damn but
[TS]
◼
►
regardless i don't think i'm i'm going
[TS]
◼
►
to possibly ever see this TV app or if i
[TS]
◼
►
do it will be something that gets in my
[TS]
◼
►
way that that you know I have to like
[TS]
◼
►
click the the fake home button one more
[TS]
◼
►
time out of to get to what i really want
[TS]
◼
►
to watch all right anything else in the
[TS]
◼
►
apple TV is your team losing it
[TS]
◼
►
they are losing I thought we had a
[TS]
◼
►
touchdown which would put us somewhat
[TS]
◼
►
comfortably in the lead but I was
[TS]
◼
►
really you know we forgot to mention
[TS]
◼
►
something they Apple opened the keynote
[TS]
◼
►
with a really lovely video on
[TS]
◼
►
accessibility I mean that genuinely I
[TS]
◼
►
completely forgot to mention that I
[TS]
◼
►
thought that was really cool and they
[TS]
◼
►
said that they're going to our I guess I
[TS]
◼
►
think it's already there i just haven't
[TS]
◼
►
looked at it yet they're they're going
[TS]
◼
►
to have like a top-level so-to-speak
[TS]
◼
►
accessibility page on their website
[TS]
◼
►
which we should check out and we'll find
[TS]
◼
►
it and put a link in the show notes but
[TS]
◼
►
I thought that was a really great video
[TS]
◼
►
and and in many ways I think that's
[TS]
◼
►
Apple at its best and and I just wanted
[TS]
◼
►
to applaud them for it because I thought
[TS]
◼
►
that was really good stuff
[TS]
◼
►
Apple has always been really good with
[TS]
◼
►
accessibility stuff like you know they
[TS]
◼
►
haven't been perfect
[TS]
◼
►
by all means anybody use the technology
[TS]
◼
►
will tell you the various times have
[TS]
◼
►
been perfect but compared to what almost
[TS]
◼
►
everyone else in the industry does
[TS]
◼
►
apples accessibility support is just
[TS]
◼
►
world-class it's so good and what you
[TS]
◼
►
get out of the box with apple products
[TS]
◼
►
for for things like screen readers and
[TS]
◼
►
and click control thingy all sorts of
[TS]
◼
►
various technologies a lot of times this
[TS]
◼
►
kind of is available on other platforms
[TS]
◼
►
only if you like buy additional software
[TS]
◼
►
or have additional hardware even
[TS]
◼
►
and it's just it's it it is so like what
[TS]
◼
►
you get with apple out of the box with
[TS]
◼
►
all their products accessibility wise is
[TS]
◼
►
just ridiculously good compared to
[TS]
◼
►
everything else in the market like the
[TS]
◼
►
most important feature of these videos
[TS]
◼
►
as aside from you know making people
[TS]
◼
►
think Apple that is a nice company and
[TS]
◼
►
you know doing all the like the pr
[TS]
◼
►
affected simply like oh you're this
[TS]
◼
►
video show you should use a nice company
[TS]
◼
►
while they are nice company and be that
[TS]
◼
►
the the other side effect of this is
[TS]
◼
►
that it exposes people who don't use
[TS]
◼
►
these features people like me don't use
[TS]
◼
►
these features for the most part to the
[TS]
◼
►
fact that they exist in how they work
[TS]
◼
►
I had no idea that the camera on the
[TS]
◼
►
iphone will speak to you about who's in
[TS]
◼
►
the frame and and whether it finds a
[TS]
◼
►
face and how big the faces so a person
[TS]
◼
►
who can't see can I take pictures with
[TS]
◼
►
the with the camera like when do regular
[TS]
◼
►
people experience these features i don't
[TS]
◼
►
think most people go into accessibility
[TS]
◼
►
and turn on accessibility features and
[TS]
◼
►
created for people who have a bad or no
[TS]
◼
►
vision or can't hear or someone just
[TS]
◼
►
experiment with it right
[TS]
◼
►
most people don't see these features at
[TS]
◼
►
all and so when you say accessibility
[TS]
◼
►
maybe people don't even know what you
[TS]
◼
►
mean like what what do you mean how can
[TS]
◼
►
a blind person who's an iphone you got
[TS]
◼
►
to see the screen right people just
[TS]
◼
►
don't know right and this these things I
[TS]
◼
►
think show you know what marketers said
[TS]
◼
►
how far these products go to be usable
[TS]
◼
►
in situations that regular people don't
[TS]
◼
►
consider because they don't they don't
[TS]
◼
►
have if you don't if you don't have
[TS]
◼
►
these limitations you don't know what
[TS]
◼
►
thing what affordances are there to help
[TS]
◼
►
you with him until you need them like
[TS]
◼
►
it's as we all get old for example i'm
[TS]
◼
►
sure most of us will be cranking up the
[TS]
◼
►
text size and all of a sudden will
[TS]
◼
►
appreciate that feature that we never
[TS]
◼
►
touched before like my parents used
[TS]
◼
►
their iphone like six eyes device in
[TS]
◼
►
like the big mode where I forget what
[TS]
◼
►
it's called but like you've everything
[TS]
◼
►
is bigger it's like zoom in it's a non
[TS]
◼
►
native res and that feature is
[TS]
◼
►
meaningless to me now but eventually as
[TS]
◼
►
my vision gets worse
[TS]
◼
►
suddenly will be like oh I'm glad that's
[TS]
◼
►
there this video's do a good job of
[TS]
◼
►
highlighting to both users and
[TS]
◼
►
developers that this stuff is actually
[TS]
◼
►
there so that when they do eventually
[TS]
◼
►
get older and start you know that their
[TS]
◼
►
sensory perception starts changing
[TS]
◼
►
they'll know to go and find those and
[TS]
◼
►
they'll feel good about you know using a
[TS]
◼
►
product line that that offers easier for
[TS]
◼
►
it's reminding them it's not just about
[TS]
◼
►
was on your things there's other you
[TS]
◼
►
know go the extra mile and see what we
[TS]
◼
►
did with the camera app if you have a
[TS]
◼
►
camera app you could do something like
[TS]
◼
►
this to your application will be more
[TS]
◼
►
alright what else was spoken about free
[TS]
◼
►
mac stuff there was nothing that person
[TS]
◼
►
right didn't they talk about iphones
[TS]
◼
►
briefly talk about how well the apple
[TS]
◼
►
watch is selling but not giving numbers
[TS]
◼
►
I don't think and now I mean who cares
[TS]
◼
►
just talk about max its max I like iOS a
[TS]
◼
►
penetration of a iOS 10 verses the
[TS]
◼
►
latest version of Android or whatever
[TS]
◼
►
that let's let's be honest they were
[TS]
◼
►
killing time and I don't know why
[TS]
◼
►
they're coming time they they didn't
[TS]
◼
►
have like it's not as if there's one
[TS]
◼
►
thing that filler the second thing you
[TS]
◼
►
to just make what should have been a
[TS]
◼
►
much shorter presentation way too long
[TS]
◼
►
but they did we forgot to mention
[TS]
◼
►
something about the appletv minecraft is
[TS]
◼
►
on the appletv is that time I'm not
[TS]
◼
►
trying to be snarky that's something we
[TS]
◼
►
care about like is that a big dealers or
[TS]
◼
►
do you think no one will use that I
[TS]
◼
►
don't know squat about Minecraft I don't
[TS]
◼
►
think that's that I mean it it's it's a
[TS]
◼
►
big deal in Minecraft super popular in
[TS]
◼
►
terms of people buy and play it but
[TS]
◼
►
minecraft is available on like every
[TS]
◼
►
platform in the universe
[TS]
◼
►
so the fact that it's on apple TV now
[TS]
◼
►
yeah you have parody good but you know
[TS]
◼
►
alright so i guess i've run out of
[TS]
◼
►
reasons to stall other than to say that
[TS]
◼
►
tech is up 22 21 / pit I let's talk
[TS]
◼
►
about the mac overall I feel like this
[TS]
◼
►
is okay i think this was good i
[TS]
◼
►
certainly have been left I've there's
[TS]
◼
►
certain things that I'm disappointed by
[TS]
◼
►
but in the grand scheme of things these
[TS]
◼
►
new macbook pros look really darn good
[TS]
◼
►
really really good
[TS]
◼
►
I'm amped about the one they call the
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar now I'm I i don't know if i'll
[TS]
◼
►
like it but tentatively that looks good
[TS]
◼
►
i'm excited i'm excited to try it
[TS]
◼
►
even though i don't plan on buying one
[TS]
◼
►
and i'm not going to get one from work
[TS]
◼
►
for two years but anyway i'm excited to
[TS]
◼
►
try it i am sad although completely
[TS]
◼
►
unsurprised that they don't have like a
[TS]
◼
►
magic keyboard update that included it i
[TS]
◼
►
understand that leaving that screen on
[TS]
◼
►
would surely take and not insignificant
[TS]
◼
►
amount of battery power
[TS]
◼
►
but the magic keyboard is rechargeable
[TS]
◼
►
now so who really cares if I have to
[TS]
◼
►
charge it once connected with a wire and
[TS]
◼
►
then you wouldn't have a problem
[TS]
◼
►
I mean that I wouldn't want to be an
[TS]
◼
►
animal but I but no I mean I i would
[TS]
◼
►
love to see Magic keyboard that had this
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar on it i don't expect it will
[TS]
◼
►
happen but it would be neat and I say
[TS]
◼
►
that in part because that all my use the
[TS]
◼
►
desktop is an imac and certainly today
[TS]
◼
►
there was no real talk about anything
[TS]
◼
►
for the desktop but I I can't say I'm
[TS]
◼
►
surprised by that either I mean what are
[TS]
◼
►
they really gonna do the imac there's
[TS]
◼
►
not really any new chips are there in
[TS]
◼
►
and outside of maybe a new fancy
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard wired or wireless or maybe I
[TS]
◼
►
guess you could put different ports on
[TS]
◼
►
you could put us PC ports on it but
[TS]
◼
►
that's not that remarkable to me so I'm
[TS]
◼
►
not surprised there's not a desktop
[TS]
◼
►
activity nobody really thought the mac
[TS]
◼
►
pro would be updated am i right i mean
[TS]
◼
►
we talked about this last week with
[TS]
◼
►
Marco said the same thing like it if
[TS]
◼
►
we're going to do the imac at all just
[TS]
◼
►
USB seaports and we mentioned a another
[TS]
◼
►
fancy keyboard but well that's not
[TS]
◼
►
entirely true the I believe the cable
[TS]
◼
►
lake CPUs are available roughly for the
[TS]
◼
►
imac i'm not sure like if they're in
[TS]
◼
►
volume really yet but technically new
[TS]
◼
►
CPUs are basically available for the
[TS]
◼
►
imac now I know but none of us expected
[TS]
◼
►
the imac to come or i didnt pro or the
[TS]
◼
►
mac mini expected the imac really the
[TS]
◼
►
imac has been located the last two Falls
[TS]
◼
►
like it made sense like it is right on
[TS]
◼
►
schedule for damage me updated i'm
[TS]
◼
►
guessing it's it probably is not far off
[TS]
◼
►
like i mean i wouldn't expect it like
[TS]
◼
►
next week i'm guessing it's not going to
[TS]
◼
►
be like another year until the next time
[TS]
◼
►
a cup it's probably gonna be a few
[TS]
◼
►
months maybe I don't know how that
[TS]
◼
►
you're more optimistic than I am I like
[TS]
◼
►
i said in the last show I think they
[TS]
◼
►
should keep updating imac but i have dim
[TS]
◼
►
hopes that they will like it because i
[TS]
◼
►
mean it i don't understand the reason
[TS]
◼
►
behind the cadence of like doing imac
[TS]
◼
►
update so faithfully and then just
[TS]
◼
►
dropping it but i totally expected not
[TS]
◼
►
to have any desktop max of this thing at
[TS]
◼
►
well the thing is like you know with it
[TS]
◼
►
it doing an update when it's when it's a
[TS]
◼
►
fairly minor processor and motherboard
[TS]
◼
►
chipset update it is not that hard
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't take that much engineering work
[TS]
◼
►
for Apple you know not not anymore
[TS]
◼
►
engineer with any other updates is like
[TS]
◼
►
and and it used to be not that long ago
[TS]
◼
►
so that every time there was a new
[TS]
◼
►
chipset out for either the macbook the
[TS]
◼
►
macbook pro the macbook air or the imac
[TS]
◼
►
got updated like within a month of the
[TS]
◼
►
neutral coming out so it's only been in
[TS]
◼
►
these recent years with all the work has
[TS]
◼
►
been like Apple skipping generations and
[TS]
◼
►
Intel having weird delays
[TS]
◼
►
it's only been in those years that we
[TS]
◼
►
started having these things are apples
[TS]
◼
►
kind of like deciding whether they want
[TS]
◼
►
to bother updating things I mean it used
[TS]
◼
►
to just be assumed of course they would
[TS]
◼
►
update their main computers with the new
[TS]
◼
►
ships that came out and so the imac line
[TS]
◼
►
of chips has not had those problems that
[TS]
◼
►
all the mobile ones have had with intel
[TS]
◼
►
so the imax have actually been updated
[TS]
◼
►
on a regular basis until right now and
[TS]
◼
►
it's a little questionable why wasn't
[TS]
◼
►
there now and I guess the answer will
[TS]
◼
►
will not be parents until whenever it is
[TS]
◼
►
that next time we'll figure out like you
[TS]
◼
►
know why why did not get updated now I
[TS]
◼
►
guess but well i think i think i have an
[TS]
◼
►
answer though because if you look at
[TS]
◼
►
wikipedia which is clearly the source of
[TS]
◼
►
all human knowledge never incorrect the
[TS]
◼
►
kb lake wikipedia entry says that it
[TS]
◼
►
began shipping manufacturers no msn
[TS]
◼
►
second quarter this year mobile chips
[TS]
◼
►
have started shipping with more kb lake
[TS]
◼
►
desktop ships to be released in the
[TS]
◼
►
coming months or early next year
[TS]
◼
►
so what makes you think that they're
[TS]
◼
►
available for the imac right now I don't
[TS]
◼
►
want people on Twitter told me i could
[TS]
◼
►
be wrong if you want random people in
[TS]
◼
►
the chat room are pointing out that if
[TS]
◼
►
they are available it's almost certainly
[TS]
◼
►
not the ones with the fancy iris
[TS]
◼
►
graphics that Apple always likes fair
[TS]
◼
►
enough alright so that could be the
[TS]
◼
►
reason so that it could be as simple as
[TS]
◼
►
also I think it's worth pointing out
[TS]
◼
►
like we heard from a lot of people
[TS]
◼
►
because like you Intel officially quote
[TS]
◼
►
launched cable a good month or two ago
[TS]
◼
►
whatever it was and we immediately hurt
[TS]
◼
►
anybody and Twitter saying how can Apple
[TS]
◼
►
release skylake laptops now and not
[TS]
◼
►
cabling and of course the reason why is
[TS]
◼
►
because when intel announced the launch
[TS]
◼
►
it means nothing
[TS]
◼
►
I hit that it's like Intel's basically
[TS]
◼
►
saying these chips will be available
[TS]
◼
►
sometime maybe in the future and get the
[TS]
◼
►
actual time that you can ship computers
[TS]
◼
►
with the with the right ones for the
[TS]
◼
►
computers might be you know two to 12
[TS]
◼
►
months away from that period anyway
[TS]
◼
►
maybe like I don't think it's a big deal
[TS]
◼
►
from everything that we've read about it
[TS]
◼
►
from we know about so far it seems like
[TS]
◼
►
it is not really something that you
[TS]
◼
►
should be like really waiting up for Sky
[TS]
◼
►
lake was a big deal keep you awake
[TS]
◼
►
really isn't i also have another
[TS]
◼
►
important update for you it's 29 1 21
[TS]
◼
►
tech the good guys winning this is a
[TS]
◼
►
basketball game you're watching a lot of
[TS]
◼
►
scoring going on here
[TS]
◼
►
well you know football hits sometimes
[TS]
◼
►
there's it's a more offensive and
[TS]
◼
►
defensive game if you're voting for the
[TS]
◼
►
the Hoodoo user what are you doing
[TS]
◼
►
hokey but it's okay is it was like that
[TS]
◼
►
that that uh the ringer of an auburn
[TS]
◼
►
game they had where Oliver was up like
[TS]
◼
►
50-something sex that's only do that
[TS]
◼
►
when you see I guess right
[TS]
◼
►
ok so that no desktop is no imac updates
[TS]
◼
►
it's unclear whether or not k be like is
[TS]
◼
►
available tipster saying yes I'm seeing
[TS]
◼
►
know everything the matter if it's
[TS]
◼
►
available is this lead times the getting
[TS]
◼
►
into computers and apple recently has
[TS]
◼
►
not been that spry about like as soon as
[TS]
◼
►
the chips are ready we're going to be
[TS]
◼
►
like that's kind of more of the old
[TS]
◼
►
apple and this new one is like don't
[TS]
◼
►
even wake me up until they're available
[TS]
◼
►
in volume and the next generation is
[TS]
◼
►
about to come out
[TS]
◼
►
yeah then maybe we'll incorporate them
[TS]
◼
►
into a computer of some kind when Apple
[TS]
◼
►
delays on things like and we know that
[TS]
◼
►
this is probably Intel delay here but
[TS]
◼
►
when Apple glaze on things
[TS]
◼
►
what I'm saying is we know we don't
[TS]
◼
►
really have to make excuses for Apple
[TS]
◼
►
anymore like that they're there they're
[TS]
◼
►
the biggest corporation the world's most
[TS]
◼
►
of the time they have tons of resources
[TS]
◼
►
that they can choose to devote to
[TS]
◼
►
updating the computers to new components
[TS]
◼
►
to come out for them it isn't that hard
[TS]
◼
►
it doesn't take a lot of time or money
[TS]
◼
►
relative to what they make from them and
[TS]
◼
►
what they have in the company so we
[TS]
◼
►
don't need to excuse them it is up to
[TS]
◼
►
them to update things and it is my
[TS]
◼
►
opinion they should not be slackers
[TS]
◼
►
about that or skip generations be simply
[TS]
◼
►
because they don't feel like it
[TS]
◼
►
fair enough so sadness about well maybe
[TS]
◼
►
not sadness about the imac I think we
[TS]
◼
►
can all agree that's reasonably expected
[TS]
◼
►
sadness but not surprised about the what
[TS]
◼
►
does that Little Mac called it doesn't
[TS]
◼
►
come with any devices attached to its
[TS]
◼
►
dot not going to display the metal roads
[TS]
◼
►
i got like a tiny man no no no circular
[TS]
◼
►
one not the circular one it's like more
[TS]
◼
►
of a rounded rect it's not magical back
[TS]
◼
►
row the apple TV here thinking back
[TS]
◼
►
shoot i can't remember the name of Max
[TS]
◼
►
small mac small maybe no it's much
[TS]
◼
►
smaller than that I'm
[TS]
◼
►
and I little color in the macair the
[TS]
◼
►
power power mac g4 cube
[TS]
◼
►
yes that's it oh is that it okay yeah so
[TS]
◼
►
no power mac g4 cube updates no trashcan
[TS]
◼
►
thank God because on my I wouldn't even
[TS]
◼
►
pay attention to this show anymore just
[TS]
◼
►
be watching a football game
[TS]
◼
►
actually they should update the mac pro
[TS]
◼
►
isn't that what you're doing
[TS]
◼
►
oh speaking of the mac pro I'm i was i
[TS]
◼
►
was surprised at how many random angry
[TS]
◼
►
people there were on Twitter about there
[TS]
◼
►
being no macro update which shows that
[TS]
◼
►
this is weird sort of Venn diagram
[TS]
◼
►
between people who understand the mac
[TS]
◼
►
pro hasn't been updated in forever but
[TS]
◼
►
don't follow the stuff enough to know
[TS]
◼
►
that there was no way in hell no micro
[TS]
◼
►
is coming up in this thing so it's kind
[TS]
◼
►
of weird that the anger has spread
[TS]
◼
►
beyond the people who were actually
[TS]
◼
►
going to buy 12 just the general public
[TS]
◼
►
being embarrassed for apple for having
[TS]
◼
►
this quote-unquote pro computer that
[TS]
◼
►
pretty soon the watch will be faster
[TS]
◼
►
that well because you know even if
[TS]
◼
►
you're not about to buy a mac pro the
[TS]
◼
►
fact that they have this high-end that
[TS]
◼
►
the highest computer lineup that has
[TS]
◼
►
been so neglected high and air super air
[TS]
◼
►
quotes yeah well its timing if you do
[TS]
◼
►
parallel stuff it's still the fastest
[TS]
◼
►
its facets on no other benchmarks but on
[TS]
◼
►
that barely barely or you get like five
[TS]
◼
►
iPads yes I said probably not even that
[TS]
◼
►
night but the reason this matters is
[TS]
◼
►
what you argue John in your your
[TS]
◼
►
supercar halo car thing that like it
[TS]
◼
►
matters whether Apple is treating its
[TS]
◼
►
high-end well if you are a Mac user at
[TS]
◼
►
all because of Apple is neglecting
[TS]
◼
►
significant portions of its user base
[TS]
◼
►
for the mac lineup and you are a Mac
[TS]
◼
►
user or you are heavily invested in the
[TS]
◼
►
mac as a platform that should be a
[TS]
◼
►
warning sign for you that like that's
[TS]
◼
►
just off warning bells to say like wait
[TS]
◼
►
a minute maybe the health of my platform
[TS]
◼
►
or the future my platform is not as as
[TS]
◼
►
healthier guaranteed as I as I would
[TS]
◼
►
like because if they're neglecting this
[TS]
◼
►
whole big area of it maybe there are
[TS]
◼
►
worse things to come for me or maybe
[TS]
◼
►
they they are in putting resources into
[TS]
◼
►
it so it is totally relevant whether you
[TS]
◼
►
buy a mac pro or not how apple treats
[TS]
◼
►
their pro customers
[TS]
◼
►
yeah i'm just like they crossed over the
[TS]
◼
►
point now where where it is is moved
[TS]
◼
►
beyond and now is affecting the broader
[TS]
◼
►
base of people and it's kind of like as
[TS]
◼
►
that they were still selling the
[TS]
◼
►
original dodge viper like the original
[TS]
◼
►
original dodge viper did not change in
[TS]
◼
►
any way and it would be like the great
[TS]
◼
►
hello car for dodge chrysler but
[TS]
◼
►
eventually it becomes an embarrassment
[TS]
◼
►
because the original Viper was a
[TS]
◼
►
terrible car so many ways and just can't
[TS]
◼
►
compete with today's super cars like the
[TS]
◼
►
it would be like 900 your your your halo
[TS]
◼
►
car for dodge can be beaten off the line
[TS]
◼
►
by like a volkswagen GTI now I mean it's
[TS]
◼
►
just be or even a lesser car i keep it
[TS]
◼
►
stops being a halo car when it loses in
[TS]
◼
►
single-threaded performance the two you
[TS]
◼
►
know run-of-the-mill computers so anyway
[TS]
◼
►
so no mac pro not surprising
[TS]
◼
►
no mac mini not surprising no imac
[TS]
◼
►
almost entirely not surprising that
[TS]
◼
►
leaves us with the portable max so the
[TS]
◼
►
macbook pro is I was talking about a few
[TS]
◼
►
minutes ago my proposal can really could
[TS]
◼
►
I aesthetically it's looking really good
[TS]
◼
►
i think what they've done is really cool
[TS]
◼
►
the touch bar looks great and let that
[TS]
◼
►
we can go through this line by line but
[TS]
◼
►
man if I it it's to the point that
[TS]
◼
►
between this external display which
[TS]
◼
►
actually we should talk about as well
[TS]
◼
►
that that I haven't worked the 4k
[TS]
◼
►
display at work and these new macbook
[TS]
◼
►
I'm starting to doubt my newfound love
[TS]
◼
►
for my desktop imac existence because i
[TS]
◼
►
love this 5k imac i love it to death but
[TS]
◼
►
I just can't help but think to myself on
[TS]
◼
►
you know I could get one of these 4k or
[TS]
◼
►
maybe the fancy 5k LG Display I could
[TS]
◼
►
get one of these new macbook pros life
[TS]
◼
►
could be pretty good that way so I don't
[TS]
◼
►
know one of you guys is probably upset
[TS]
◼
►
about this so talking to talk me out of
[TS]
◼
►
spending money i don't have that on a
[TS]
◼
►
computer i don't need probably i'm
[TS]
◼
►
probably the most upset but Mr go first
[TS]
◼
►
to say what you like so I i will go back
[TS]
◼
►
to your earlier point which I will you
[TS]
◼
►
know I'd probably i'm talking about this
[TS]
◼
►
point yet but basically the touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
looks really cool i'm sure it's going to
[TS]
◼
►
be a really big deal for people when
[TS]
◼
►
they are working on their laptops and no
[TS]
◼
►
doubt that is a lot of people a lot of
[TS]
◼
►
the time however it is not on every
[TS]
◼
►
laptop apple sells a lot
[TS]
◼
►
of the macbook air class computers and
[TS]
◼
►
so for everyone who bought the macbook
[TS]
◼
►
adorable / macbook one or for everyone
[TS]
◼
►
who buys the the old or kind of still
[TS]
◼
►
for sale but old macbook air or the new
[TS]
◼
►
whatever we're going to call the low and
[TS]
◼
►
configuration of the macbook that was
[TS]
◼
►
named in the chat where that I liked a
[TS]
◼
►
lot so far are macbook escape or the
[TS]
◼
►
fbook madam a quick escape is part of my
[TS]
◼
►
favorite but the air pro was was an
[TS]
◼
►
efenburu were also very good but a
[TS]
◼
►
netbook escape is really good anyway so
[TS]
◼
►
all those people that's a lot of mac
[TS]
◼
►
buyers not to mention all the desktop
[TS]
◼
►
buyers and granted i know Latin from
[TS]
◼
►
apartment and desktop so i know the
[TS]
◼
►
desktop buyers don't count for as much
[TS]
◼
►
but all those people and the entire mac
[TS]
◼
►
user base that has a computer already
[TS]
◼
►
before today does not have a touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
and even if you are one of the people
[TS]
◼
►
who has one of the new MacBook Pros with
[TS]
◼
►
the touch bar that is only actually
[TS]
◼
►
accessible to you when you are using it
[TS]
◼
►
in its regular mode so not in clamshell
[TS]
◼
►
mode on a desk not like as a second
[TS]
◼
►
screen like with a main screen an
[TS]
◼
►
external keyboard and mouse like only
[TS]
◼
►
one using those particular models of
[TS]
◼
►
computer and only when you're using them
[TS]
◼
►
like right on them in in like normal
[TS]
◼
►
quote laptop mode that is when the touch
[TS]
◼
►
bar can be used it is going to be a
[TS]
◼
►
really great convenience for the people
[TS]
◼
►
who use it in that way but I don't think
[TS]
◼
►
it's going to radically take over the
[TS]
◼
►
the mac experience yet and become like a
[TS]
◼
►
must-have accessory until it is
[TS]
◼
►
available across the entire lineup
[TS]
◼
►
laptops and desktops in some form that
[TS]
◼
►
might become more interesting than you
[TS]
◼
►
know when you can kind of assume that
[TS]
◼
►
all modern max habit but you can assume
[TS]
◼
►
that today as either a user or developer
[TS]
◼
►
so I think it's gonna take a while
[TS]
◼
►
before that becomes a must-have thing it
[TS]
◼
►
will be convenient from day one and
[TS]
◼
►
surely you know apples apps having a
[TS]
◼
►
built-in is nice you know and and that's
[TS]
◼
►
like that's a lot of apps that people
[TS]
◼
►
use on the mac is our apples built-in
[TS]
◼
►
app so that's good but it's gonna take
[TS]
◼
►
awhile i really like when the first
[TS]
◼
►
retina macbooks came out in 2012
[TS]
◼
►
it took a long time for most of what you
[TS]
◼
►
saw on screen to be retina it took a
[TS]
◼
►
couple years at least four apps and
[TS]
◼
►
websites and everything to update for
[TS]
◼
►
the tux bars and take a while before you
[TS]
◼
►
can really get into using it with many
[TS]
◼
►
of your apps and everything so i would
[TS]
◼
►
say for UK see you looking at these
[TS]
◼
►
today and feeling bad you don't have one
[TS]
◼
►
it's the kind of thing where if you're
[TS]
◼
►
buying a new laptop if you were if you
[TS]
◼
►
were buying one anyway then I think you
[TS]
◼
►
should consider the touch bar as an
[TS]
◼
►
important thing to have you know
[TS]
◼
►
probably and all this should be preface
[TS]
◼
►
by saying that none of the three of us
[TS]
◼
►
were at the event
[TS]
◼
►
none of the three of us have review
[TS]
◼
►
units so none of the three of us have
[TS]
◼
►
ever touched these or handle these or
[TS]
◼
►
seniors in real life so all this could
[TS]
◼
►
be out the window the first time that
[TS]
◼
►
the world can get more experience with
[TS]
◼
►
these and we know more about them and
[TS]
◼
►
how they work in reality but i would say
[TS]
◼
►
probably that if you're buying today or
[TS]
◼
►
if you recently bought something you
[TS]
◼
►
don't want to buy another thing you
[TS]
◼
►
don't really have to feel bad yet that
[TS]
◼
►
you don't have this touch bar because
[TS]
◼
►
it's gonna be awhile before apps can
[TS]
◼
►
assume that a lot of people have it and
[TS]
◼
►
it's gonna be awhile before i have to
[TS]
◼
►
take advantage of it and we still don't
[TS]
◼
►
know how much of a must-have thing it
[TS]
◼
►
will be in practice until the things
[TS]
◼
►
wrapped for a while and we can kind of
[TS]
◼
►
look more objectively after its kind
[TS]
◼
►
after the cool has kind of rubbed off
[TS]
◼
►
and weave and we will use them ourselves
[TS]
◼
►
we know people who use them
[TS]
◼
►
you've gotten like some long-term
[TS]
◼
►
opinions from ourselves or others about
[TS]
◼
►
like how useful is actually in practice
[TS]
◼
►
so for now you don't need to feel that
[TS]
◼
►
you should feel bad
[TS]
◼
►
not because you don't touch bar but
[TS]
◼
►
because you don't have a macbook pro
[TS]
◼
►
with like modern internals its way
[TS]
◼
►
faster than one you have now that bad
[TS]
◼
►
feeling that bad feeling remains so
[TS]
◼
►
question for both of you and I'll start
[TS]
◼
►
with Marco do you think that a keyboard
[TS]
◼
►
with a touch bar will ever exist for a
[TS]
◼
►
desktop mac or do you think it will
[TS]
◼
►
always always always be four laptops and
[TS]
◼
►
if yes if you think it will one day
[TS]
◼
►
exist for desktop Mac would apple just
[TS]
◼
►
completely yo go bananas and make it
[TS]
◼
►
wired only or do you think you would be
[TS]
◼
►
just basically a revision of the smart
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard as it is today
[TS]
◼
►
I honestly don't know I I'm leaning
[TS]
◼
►
and no one's gonna like the reason why
[TS]
◼
►
but i'm leaning towards no and y know it
[TS]
◼
►
I know the reason you probably do we all
[TS]
◼
►
know the reason I'm leaning towards no
[TS]
◼
►
because I you know a guy I think putting
[TS]
◼
►
the touch bar as it exists today into
[TS]
◼
►
something the size and price of the
[TS]
◼
►
magic keyboard i think will be very
[TS]
◼
►
challenging and if there's probably a
[TS]
◼
►
lot of constraints there many of which
[TS]
◼
►
are self-imposed by Apple but I
[TS]
◼
►
basically don't like I don't see them
[TS]
◼
►
want to make their keyboard bigger I
[TS]
◼
►
don't see the market having much
[TS]
◼
►
tolerance for them making their keyboard
[TS]
◼
►
more expensive is already pretty
[TS]
◼
►
expensive and i don't really see them
[TS]
◼
►
you know wanting to have multiple models
[TS]
◼
►
of keyboard that they sell I mean they
[TS]
◼
►
can barely self-referrals at all anymore
[TS]
◼
►
so you know I don't see that happening
[TS]
◼
►
but ultimately the biggest reason why I
[TS]
◼
►
don't honestly see this happening even
[TS]
◼
►
if they get over the technical stuff
[TS]
◼
►
here comes is that I just don't think
[TS]
◼
►
Apple gives a damn about desktops
[TS]
◼
►
anymore and that's not to say that
[TS]
◼
►
they're never gonna make one again but i
[TS]
◼
►
but I just think the focus
[TS]
◼
►
I mean look you can barely get Tim Cook
[TS]
◼
►
to pretend to care about the mac at all
[TS]
◼
►
allmax you know there's a reason why Tim
[TS]
◼
►
didn't say a lot today about the mac you
[TS]
◼
►
know that was delegated to fill in Craig
[TS]
◼
►
because they I'm pretty sure care deeply
[TS]
◼
►
about the mac like they seem like
[TS]
◼
►
they're really like mac champions inside
[TS]
◼
►
the company at a very high level but Tim
[TS]
◼
►
I don't think is I don't think Tim cares
[TS]
◼
►
I don't think he even hide that very
[TS]
◼
►
well I don't think he even honestly
[TS]
◼
►
tries I don't think Tim cares and so as
[TS]
◼
►
long as the company is led by Tim I
[TS]
◼
►
don't see the max making substantial
[TS]
◼
►
advances and what I see instead is what
[TS]
◼
►
we what we see today which is they're
[TS]
◼
►
going to keep doing what we know what
[TS]
◼
►
they what they can do to move things
[TS]
◼
►
occasionally to be thinner lighter
[TS]
◼
►
better faster right that's what they do
[TS]
◼
►
but i don't see a time under tim cook's
[TS]
◼
►
rule which is probably going to be long
[TS]
◼
►
i don't see a time of this happening
[TS]
◼
►
here where team is going to decide that
[TS]
◼
►
the mac really needs a lot of effort put
[TS]
◼
►
into it and it needs like
[TS]
◼
►
no major resources and major
[TS]
◼
►
prioritization I just don't see that
[TS]
◼
►
happening so I don't think they're going
[TS]
◼
►
to put in like the lots of work that it
[TS]
◼
►
would take and possible profit
[TS]
◼
►
cannibalization of other products to
[TS]
◼
►
meaningfully enable this on desktops I
[TS]
◼
►
just don't see it happening
[TS]
◼
►
I wish it would but I just don't let's
[TS]
◼
►
assume for just one moment that you're
[TS]
◼
►
right that Tim either doesn't care about
[TS]
◼
►
the mac or let's even go so far as to
[TS]
◼
►
say he freaking hates the mac i'm not
[TS]
◼
►
saying he hated what I'm what I'm saying
[TS]
◼
►
he's obviously not a mac person he died
[TS]
◼
►
i'm pretty sure he has said on the
[TS]
◼
►
record multiple times that he does his
[TS]
◼
►
work on ipads anyway so I i basically I
[TS]
◼
►
don't think he uses macs very often if
[TS]
◼
►
at all and and I think he he is very
[TS]
◼
►
much profit focused and and he looks at
[TS]
◼
►
where Apple can make the most profit and
[TS]
◼
►
divert resources there and things that
[TS]
◼
►
that make still good profit but just
[TS]
◼
►
less are you know kind of out of his his
[TS]
◼
►
field of vision i think most of the time
[TS]
◼
►
so basically I just don't think Tim
[TS]
◼
►
gives a lot of thought to the mac and i
[TS]
◼
►
don't think it's a priority for him
[TS]
◼
►
alright so let's assume that's true and
[TS]
◼
►
you know it in any degree of of
[TS]
◼
►
aggressiveness he hates the mac or maybe
[TS]
◼
►
just doesn't really care
[TS]
◼
►
maybe it's just another line item like
[TS]
◼
►
you said let's assume any one of those
[TS]
◼
►
is true he's a pretty smart man from
[TS]
◼
►
everything we can tell
[TS]
◼
►
don't you think he would trust in in his
[TS]
◼
►
lieutenants and those who do care for
[TS]
◼
►
the mac to carry it forward like I I
[TS]
◼
►
don't you tim is the things standing in
[TS]
◼
►
the way of the mac being this perfect
[TS]
◼
►
device that you're that you're that
[TS]
◼
►
you're excited to buy a new one every
[TS]
◼
►
six months or what have you
[TS]
◼
►
i I really don't think times the problem
[TS]
◼
►
here I think it's just that Apple is
[TS]
◼
►
doing what they think is best and like I
[TS]
◼
►
think you had said Mark I mean laptops
[TS]
◼
►
are where are the maximum everyone buys
[TS]
◼
►
we're weird buying desktops and super
[TS]
◼
►
weird for you to buying cheese graters
[TS]
◼
►
and trash cans so I don't think to him
[TS]
◼
►
is the problem i think it's just that
[TS]
◼
►
this is where the users are so why not
[TS]
◼
►
cater to the ninety percent well isn't
[TS]
◼
►
debatable others even a problem maybe
[TS]
◼
►
job at the CEO is to be forward-looking
[TS]
◼
►
like what is this a product line isn't
[TS]
◼
►
an ascension are in decline and clearly
[TS]
◼
►
desktop PCs laptop PCs and that whole
[TS]
◼
►
market are in decline compared to
[TS]
◼
►
smartphones and possibly even tablets
[TS]
◼
►
and so he's trying to be forward-looking
[TS]
◼
►
but not for Apple that's the thing
[TS]
◼
►
they're not in decline for Apple there
[TS]
◼
►
in decline for everyone else but until
[TS]
◼
►
Apple stopped dating for three years
[TS]
◼
►
they were in decline for apple like
[TS]
◼
►
Apple has this entire market that could
[TS]
◼
►
keep taking share from it's a big market
[TS]
◼
►
it was declined relative to the rest of
[TS]
◼
►
their business for the rest of the
[TS]
◼
►
business was growing much faster at this
[TS]
◼
►
point service revenue is more than mac
[TS]
◼
►
revenue right based service revenue was
[TS]
◼
►
growing guess what just passed Mac
[TS]
◼
►
revenue right so if you are looking
[TS]
◼
►
where the next big you know where is the
[TS]
◼
►
next big product that's going to go on a
[TS]
◼
►
big growth trajectory gonna come from
[TS]
◼
►
it's not the pc is not the mac that's
[TS]
◼
►
what Apple currently thinks and so again
[TS]
◼
►
it's debatable whether the long-term
[TS]
◼
►
this is a name correct choice i think
[TS]
◼
►
that were in the painful period now
[TS]
◼
►
where it's like well look at you gonna
[TS]
◼
►
do max you're not going to maximum
[TS]
◼
►
apples like oh no we're gonna do max but
[TS]
◼
►
they're doing them not with the gust 0
[TS]
◼
►
meaning not with the investment that
[TS]
◼
►
they used to do them and to get back to
[TS]
◼
►
casey's question now you know do I think
[TS]
◼
►
they're gonna do a keyboard with a with
[TS]
◼
►
a touch bar on it the Apple that was
[TS]
◼
►
still investing heavily in the mac where
[TS]
◼
►
the mac was like super important and
[TS]
◼
►
central even even as the iphone was
[TS]
◼
►
growing and the ipod and other
[TS]
◼
►
businesses were obviously where the big
[TS]
◼
►
growth was back oh you know not too many
[TS]
◼
►
years ago Apple was still heavily
[TS]
◼
►
investing in the mac because those
[TS]
◼
►
growing one start off small and the ipod
[TS]
◼
►
one did a hump and went back down right
[TS]
◼
►
and so was like well the mac you know we
[TS]
◼
►
got to keep investing the mac is the
[TS]
◼
►
ipod looks great and it's big business
[TS]
◼
►
for us but actually we can see it's on
[TS]
◼
►
the way back down all the iphones
[TS]
◼
►
looking great and it's on its way back
[TS]
◼
►
up but if you look at those line graphs
[TS]
◼
►
the mac was still in the mix certain
[TS]
◼
►
point the phone just took off and now
[TS]
◼
►
every single graph is like here's the
[TS]
◼
►
iphone company and then there's some
[TS]
◼
►
lines down there hit near the final axis
[TS]
◼
►
and those lines like service revenue
[TS]
◼
►
mcintosh like he just crap like that and
[TS]
◼
►
once that happens like it's hard to it's
[TS]
◼
►
hard to justify like is it the right
[TS]
◼
►
thing for the for the CEO to do to
[TS]
◼
►
continue to invest that much
[TS]
◼
►
proportionally in the mac is used to and
[TS]
◼
►
it's clear that they're not right and so
[TS]
◼
►
I'm saying like good old days but the
[TS]
◼
►
old apple with the old Apple mix of
[TS]
◼
►
products in revenue and profits right
[TS]
◼
►
that apple would have had touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
keyboards in this presentation today
[TS]
◼
►
like guaranteed because like Marco said
[TS]
◼
►
what the hell's the point of this thing
[TS]
◼
►
even people who have laptops when they
[TS]
◼
►
set them at their desk you know you're
[TS]
◼
►
not like laptops are bad organically to
[TS]
◼
►
sit in front of all day the keyboard not
[TS]
◼
►
be touching the display like it's like
[TS]
◼
►
that because it's a portable device and
[TS]
◼
►
you you know when using portable that's
[TS]
◼
►
what you got to go with but if you're
[TS]
◼
►
sitting in a desk your laptop is off the
[TS]
◼
►
side you have a second monitor your
[TS]
◼
►
laptop is up on a stand but then you
[TS]
◼
►
can't use that keyboard using a big
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard like the touch bar can't be
[TS]
◼
►
part of the quote-unquote Mac experience
[TS]
◼
►
at the only place that exists is on
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard attached to a laptop period so
[TS]
◼
►
the old Apple would have had it is the
[TS]
◼
►
old Apple was investing in the mac much
[TS]
◼
►
more for comprehensible reasons not like
[TS]
◼
►
out of spite or meanness or whatever now
[TS]
◼
►
if you would have this discussion with
[TS]
◼
►
tim cook and and try to convince him
[TS]
◼
►
that it is important to continue to
[TS]
◼
►
invest in the Mac you can't say it's
[TS]
◼
►
because the mac is going to be
[TS]
◼
►
proportionately larger percentage of
[TS]
◼
►
apples profit and revenue in the future
[TS]
◼
►
because probably isn't but you could
[TS]
◼
►
make the argument that even though look
[TS]
◼
►
small and the argument I think we may
[TS]
◼
►
even though it looks small and it's it's
[TS]
◼
►
not going to come out of nowhere and
[TS]
◼
►
become a big thing it is as many people
[TS]
◼
►
who pointed on Twitter and said it was
[TS]
◼
►
very smelly for whatever the foundation
[TS]
◼
►
of so many other things apple does
[TS]
◼
►
you've got the halo car factor for
[TS]
◼
►
having like the you know highest
[TS]
◼
►
performance computing device you've got
[TS]
◼
►
the fact that the development for all
[TS]
◼
►
you do for the platform that's important
[TS]
◼
►
most important your company's done on
[TS]
◼
►
max right you've got the historical a
[TS]
◼
►
loyalty and fan base you've got the
[TS]
◼
►
Alpha geeks creatives type angle which
[TS]
◼
►
we can talk about when we talk about the
[TS]
◼
►
microsoft studio there are lots of
[TS]
◼
►
reasons not having to do with how much
[TS]
◼
►
they sell how much their profit is that
[TS]
◼
►
the mac is really important and I could
[TS]
◼
►
make that argument pretty strongly tim
[TS]
◼
►
cook and I bet people are trying to make
[TS]
◼
►
that argument but that argument relies
[TS]
◼
►
on a lot of assumptions are you have to
[TS]
◼
►
be convinced that if this in this in
[TS]
◼
►
this therefore this you can't back it up
[TS]
◼
►
by saying look I don't even need to
[TS]
◼
►
convince you of like human psychology or
[TS]
◼
►
customer loyalty or other things like
[TS]
◼
►
that i can show you that the lines on
[TS]
◼
►
the graph with dollar sign attached to
[TS]
◼
►
them and you can because you have to go
[TS]
◼
►
to it more touchy-feely argument to
[TS]
◼
►
it's tim cook to invest more in the
[TS]
◼
►
maximum they are currently investing and
[TS]
◼
►
I'm hope i'm hoping the people who are
[TS]
◼
►
making that argument inside Apple are
[TS]
◼
►
winning and that what we're just seeing
[TS]
◼
►
here is you know what a course
[TS]
◼
►
correction that they haven't quite
[TS]
◼
►
corrected all the way and tumble the
[TS]
◼
►
Intel delays mess things up and they'll
[TS]
◼
►
be restarted in the next year when they
[TS]
◼
►
have inevitably reduce reduce this guy
[TS]
◼
►
like mac pros someday maybe possibly is
[TS]
◼
►
well I don't know I liked her cry
[TS]
◼
►
backtrack from inevitable saying the
[TS]
◼
►
potential potential mac pro that we
[TS]
◼
►
might you know if they could still turn
[TS]
◼
►
this around and sort of get back on an
[TS]
◼
►
even keel but the the lack of a touch
[TS]
◼
►
bar external keyboard is a perfect
[TS]
◼
►
example of how Apple is just not an
[TS]
◼
►
investing as much in the mac as they
[TS]
◼
►
used to and it's i think it is an
[TS]
◼
►
argument to be had whether that is smart
[TS]
◼
►
or not smart but as fans of Max as all
[TS]
◼
►
of us on this podcast our friends at max
[TS]
◼
►
it is painful to see the product that
[TS]
◼
►
used to be so important to the company
[TS]
◼
►
being so much less important now I I
[TS]
◼
►
don't know if I would go that far at all
[TS]
◼
►
just because they're not updating
[TS]
◼
►
desktop max with the speed or efficacy
[TS]
◼
►
that you to approve of doesn't mean they
[TS]
◼
►
don't care about the mac or any
[TS]
◼
►
Maccabees the laptops aren't updated
[TS]
◼
►
well yeah but i think a lot of that was
[TS]
◼
►
obviously none of us know but if I would
[TS]
◼
►
wager gas that was relying on Intel to
[TS]
◼
►
give them a decent reason to make an
[TS]
◼
►
update or perhaps let's assume that
[TS]
◼
►
wasn't the issue
[TS]
◼
►
maybe they were just trying to get this
[TS]
◼
►
pretty darn fancy touch bar tack and the
[TS]
◼
►
fancy touch ID tech which apparently is
[TS]
◼
►
basically a mini apple watch within the
[TS]
◼
►
device it within the macbook pro that
[TS]
◼
►
can't have been easy so I I don't think
[TS]
◼
►
it's fair to characterize Apple as
[TS]
◼
►
caring as not caring about the mac or
[TS]
◼
►
caring that much less about them is it's
[TS]
◼
►
not about carrying it its investment
[TS]
◼
►
it's not care like don't is not
[TS]
◼
►
personify the company's and it's like
[TS]
◼
►
how much money and resources you put
[TS]
◼
►
into this investment is not it's not
[TS]
◼
►
like we did that max feelings are hurt
[TS]
◼
►
or whatever it's a choice about resource
[TS]
◼
►
allocation right and that's the that's
[TS]
◼
►
the argument view your design and I and
[TS]
◼
►
I feel like the perfect examples like
[TS]
◼
►
even if we buy everything you're saying
[TS]
◼
►
about the touch bar and and being
[TS]
◼
►
difficult or whatever it's apparently
[TS]
◼
►
ready to announce now they could have
[TS]
◼
►
announced keyboards right alongside it
[TS]
◼
►
but you know if they felt that was
[TS]
◼
►
important part of the mac experience and
[TS]
◼
►
I have done speaking in such bar onto
[TS]
◼
►
the next topic on the move to is
[TS]
◼
►
specifically about touch part but we can
[TS]
◼
►
get done gnashing of teeth over the mac
[TS]
◼
►
well but that's the thing is I really
[TS]
◼
►
don't i mean i guess there's no way that
[TS]
◼
►
I'm going to convince you that you're
[TS]
◼
►
wrong and there's certainly no way
[TS]
◼
►
you're going to convince me that I'm
[TS]
◼
►
wrong but I just for the record there is
[TS]
◼
►
one of the three of us thinks that there
[TS]
◼
►
are investments happening to the max I
[TS]
◼
►
am I am as as it sits right now I feel
[TS]
◼
►
like I'm or desktop Mac guide then then
[TS]
◼
►
I'm than a portable mac guy but I am
[TS]
◼
►
really excited about the macbook pros
[TS]
◼
►
and that is what most mac users use
[TS]
◼
►
almost everyone uses Matt a macbook pros
[TS]
◼
►
or perhaps the airs which at this point
[TS]
◼
►
is near as makes no difference to the
[TS]
◼
►
President Pro is effectively an air
[TS]
◼
►
I don't think it's fair to characterize
[TS]
◼
►
this is a lack of investment i don't
[TS]
◼
►
think it's fair of the three of us to
[TS]
◼
►
say Oh putting a mini apple watch next
[TS]
◼
►
to a mini retina display honest on a box
[TS]
◼
►
that's physically smaller that has
[TS]
◼
►
better battery life that is quicker like
[TS]
◼
►
these are all worthwhile investment and
[TS]
◼
►
and I don't think it's fair that a bunch
[TS]
◼
►
of nerds are getting butthurt about the
[TS]
◼
►
fact that this isn't the thing that they
[TS]
◼
►
wanted Apple to investment no that's not
[TS]
◼
►
what this is about it all like even if
[TS]
◼
►
we ignore all like what we think apples
[TS]
◼
►
philosophy is and how they choose to
[TS]
◼
►
investigate we don't know where their
[TS]
◼
►
money goes because we don't have the
[TS]
◼
►
level of granularity ignore all that and
[TS]
◼
►
just treat apples a black box and look
[TS]
◼
►
at the products they release in when
[TS]
◼
►
they release them the release cadence of
[TS]
◼
►
they released them less often which
[TS]
◼
►
means that the existing ones that you
[TS]
◼
►
can buy our worst relative to other
[TS]
◼
►
things and they also keep selling old
[TS]
◼
►
ones for much longer
[TS]
◼
►
that is inarguably affect you could say
[TS]
◼
►
that's not because they're not investing
[TS]
◼
►
as much in fact they're investing even
[TS]
◼
►
more but that dictates that they have to
[TS]
◼
►
have bigger gaps being products that is
[TS]
◼
►
probably the only argument you can make
[TS]
◼
►
this like oh it actually costs so much
[TS]
◼
►
more money to do the touch bar than the
[TS]
◼
►
didn't max but don't worry about it like
[TS]
◼
►
that the macbook pros they were out
[TS]
◼
►
there on the market were behind the
[TS]
◼
►
15-inch macbook pro was an embarrassing
[TS]
◼
►
product to sell is like this used to be
[TS]
◼
►
the best like that in the presentation
[TS]
◼
►
like the best macbook pro and how we
[TS]
◼
►
made it even better be able to do that
[TS]
◼
►
pitch because when they replace them the
[TS]
◼
►
old one is still pretty good
[TS]
◼
►
you almost piece of crap what the hell
[TS]
◼
►
was it out ivy bridge or as well
[TS]
◼
►
whatever the how it had when it has like
[TS]
◼
►
well like it's ridiculous
[TS]
◼
►
like that's not and that's we can't we
[TS]
◼
►
can argue about what the cause of that
[TS]
◼
►
was but on the outside we can see that's
[TS]
◼
►
the case that 15-inch macbook pro was
[TS]
◼
►
not a pro product was not the worst the
[TS]
◼
►
price their body part wasn't mac pro
[TS]
◼
►
levels of bed but it was bad and this is
[TS]
◼
►
their flagship product and so of course
[TS]
◼
►
when they make a new one it's thinner
[TS]
◼
►
faster better like yeah that's great
[TS]
◼
►
it's better faster better we totally
[TS]
◼
►
agree with all that of course when they
[TS]
◼
►
compared to the old models just like
[TS]
◼
►
i'll come on you know how much faster is
[TS]
◼
►
in our macro you know why is your
[TS]
◼
►
macbook pro sucked
[TS]
◼
►
that's why he's so much better like a
[TS]
◼
►
port like we know like and again I'm i
[TS]
◼
►
know it sounds negative i'm gonna get
[TS]
◼
►
even more negative and a little bit
[TS]
◼
►
these are good these are good genes
[TS]
◼
►
right but I'm arguments cases on trying
[TS]
◼
►
to convince you that regardless of what
[TS]
◼
►
we think about these machines which I
[TS]
◼
►
think they're pretty darn good and we'll
[TS]
◼
►
talk about that eventually I promise
[TS]
◼
►
oh shit i don't think you can say that
[TS]
◼
►
Apple is putting the same amount of
[TS]
◼
►
resources into the mac as they used to
[TS]
◼
►
because the proof is in the products
[TS]
◼
►
that they release and when they release
[TS]
◼
►
them and we can argue about what the
[TS]
◼
►
causes are and stuff like that but i
[TS]
◼
►
don't think there's an argument to be
[TS]
◼
►
had that they're doing the same as they
[TS]
◼
►
it's not fair to say that they're
[TS]
◼
►
putting the same amount of investment as
[TS]
◼
►
they used to i concur but I what I'm
[TS]
◼
►
hearing which maybe is a
[TS]
◼
►
misinterpretation my part of what I'm
[TS]
◼
►
hearing is all they're ignoring the mac
[TS]
◼
►
there the the mac is on life-support
[TS]
◼
►
nobody cares about the mac timko Kate's
[TS]
◼
►
the mac like I don't say i don't see ya
[TS]
◼
►
you said all those things not true i
[TS]
◼
►
mean i-i just it i don't i feel like
[TS]
◼
►
you're crapping all over that you
[TS]
◼
►
collective you and not just you 2i mean
[TS]
◼
►
I saw a lot of just grumbling going on
[TS]
◼
►
today on Twitter like I feel like
[TS]
◼
►
everyone's just getting grumpy about
[TS]
◼
►
touchdown tech everyone's getting around
[TS]
◼
►
here and Iraq and then our behalf I'm
[TS]
◼
►
back I'm back we're going to going to
[TS]
◼
►
you like right correct about tootie's
[TS]
◼
►
that's it that's exactly right yeah
[TS]
◼
►
there is so everyone's getting so upset
[TS]
◼
►
about all they're not investing enough
[TS]
◼
►
in the mac and I just personally I don't
[TS]
◼
►
see it that way at all
[TS]
◼
►
I agree John that that certainly there
[TS]
◼
►
was a dark period I perhaps I shouldn't
[TS]
◼
►
be sweeping the dark period under the
[TS]
◼
►
rug as quickly as emphatically as is as
[TS]
◼
►
i am right now but this is a to me this
[TS]
◼
►
is a clear sign that the mac matters and
[TS]
◼
►
I mean this is got to have been like
[TS]
◼
►
this touch bar which I really need to
[TS]
◼
►
shut up so we can get this we can move
[TS]
◼
►
on to that the touch bars got to be an
[TS]
◼
►
unbelievably cool piece of technology
[TS]
◼
►
and then turned in touch ID as well it
[TS]
◼
►
that's got to have been hard to create
[TS]
◼
►
in and again touch ID apparently is
[TS]
◼
►
being controlled by a mini watch OS and
[TS]
◼
►
I can't imagine getting an ARM chip in
[TS]
◼
►
the way that's controlling the touch ID
[TS]
◼
►
to cooperate and behave nicely with the
[TS]
◼
►
intel chip that's controlling the rest
[TS]
◼
►
of the mac that can't have been terribly
[TS]
◼
►
easy that must have been difficult to do
[TS]
◼
►
can they not have a little bit of time
[TS]
◼
►
to do that they can have a just-released
[TS]
◼
►
other max in between yes and here's the
[TS]
◼
►
thing by the way Casey like it's worth
[TS]
◼
►
pointing out here that there's this kind
[TS]
◼
►
of distortion here that I see a lot in
[TS]
◼
►
corporate culture especially into in 10
[TS]
◼
►
cooks apple that it is indeed a lot of
[TS]
◼
►
work what they did the team worked
[TS]
◼
►
really hard on this they did and they
[TS]
◼
►
should be commended in some kind of
[TS]
◼
►
price ceremony for how hard they were
[TS]
◼
►
contacting a level that's very
[TS]
◼
►
however that doesn't either a absolved
[TS]
◼
►
them of the the rest of the neglect of
[TS]
◼
►
the mac line and the land they left of
[TS]
◼
►
this line the meantime like that was
[TS]
◼
►
clearly bad management of the lineup and
[TS]
◼
►
end of the whatever the supply chain
[TS]
◼
►
whatever led to these long span for
[TS]
◼
►
these things have been updated and
[TS]
◼
►
whatever into the mac pro a mac mini and
[TS]
◼
►
imac still not being updated so it
[TS]
◼
►
doesn't it doesn't solve that and also
[TS]
◼
►
you don't get automatic reward just for
[TS]
◼
►
trying something difficult just for
[TS]
◼
►
trying something complicated knew it
[TS]
◼
►
might well be that the touch bar might
[TS]
◼
►
end up being awesome it we might look
[TS]
◼
►
back on this time and save men it we
[TS]
◼
►
can't believe we ever live without this
[TS]
◼
►
this was such a revolution but first we
[TS]
◼
►
don't know that yet it might it might
[TS]
◼
►
and that doesn't absolve them of the
[TS]
◼
►
other problems like you know there are
[TS]
◼
►
some downsides to visit to these new
[TS]
◼
►
releases which we get to but one of the
[TS]
◼
►
biggest ones that people are upset about
[TS]
◼
►
is that these costs a lot more than they
[TS]
◼
►
used to and that's not insignificant and
[TS]
◼
►
you know and things were taken away so
[TS]
◼
►
you know it certainly like there's going
[TS]
◼
►
to be people who are upset because in
[TS]
◼
►
certain ways they got worse for them and
[TS]
◼
►
it doesn't matter like if you if you are
[TS]
◼
►
buying these things if you were buying
[TS]
◼
►
like macbook airs in bulk and you had to
[TS]
◼
►
have been hit a certain price point and
[TS]
◼
►
now you can't do that anymore
[TS]
◼
►
I then the back is still selling them
[TS]
◼
►
well but yeah basically like everyone
[TS]
◼
►
has it whenever Apple releases something
[TS]
◼
►
new that these days especially but yeah
[TS]
◼
►
this is not that new
[TS]
◼
►
there's always pluses and minuses fix it
[TS]
◼
►
there's like you know you you move
[TS]
◼
►
mostly steps forward but usually a
[TS]
◼
►
couple steps back or sideways and in
[TS]
◼
►
there is a lot of cool new stuff they
[TS]
◼
►
did get seemingly really impressively
[TS]
◼
►
thin-and-light they it seems I the
[TS]
◼
►
battery still ? but if that they
[TS]
◼
►
reported specs are still reasonable so i
[TS]
◼
►
assume the better life won't be terrible
[TS]
◼
►
actually pretty good
[TS]
◼
►
so if they're able to achieve this thin
[TS]
◼
►
lightness with those battery games then
[TS]
◼
►
that's great so that like that's great
[TS]
◼
►
improvement right
[TS]
◼
►
the touch bar is mostly great it is
[TS]
◼
►
probably going to be bad to lose escape
[TS]
◼
►
keys for a lot of people i think the the
[TS]
◼
►
idea that only nerds use the escape key
[TS]
◼
►
i think is wrong i have lots of people
[TS]
◼
►
it's not like we get there we'll get
[TS]
◼
►
there and I think also a lot of people
[TS]
◼
►
were simply asking Apple can you please
[TS]
◼
►
put modern guts inside your laptops and
[TS]
◼
►
make them no faster and everything and
[TS]
◼
►
apple delivered this thing that they
[TS]
◼
►
weren't asking for and then raise the
[TS]
◼
►
prices even if you are impressed by the
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar and I think for the most part
[TS]
◼
►
it probably will end up being a good
[TS]
◼
►
thing the reason why so many people are
[TS]
◼
►
mad like people have good reasons to be
[TS]
◼
►
upset with this update because not every
[TS]
◼
►
product that that needs an update got
[TS]
◼
►
one and the update to these products
[TS]
◼
►
that did get updated came with
[TS]
◼
►
additional costs and and a couple of the
[TS]
◼
►
like what if you actually use
[TS]
◼
►
the SD card slot for the hdmi port or
[TS]
◼
►
things like there are a lot of things
[TS]
◼
►
removed too so you have ports that
[TS]
◼
►
removed you have a higher price and you
[TS]
◼
►
you lost some keys that you might prefer
[TS]
◼
►
to be hardware so basically even though
[TS]
◼
►
it made advances that doesn't make it
[TS]
◼
►
invalid or unreasonable for people to
[TS]
◼
►
complain about the ways in which it got
[TS]
◼
►
no it doesn't but I feel like what I'm
[TS]
◼
►
hearing in its not just from you guys
[TS]
◼
►
but you're the only two on the
[TS]
◼
►
but you're the only two on the
[TS]
◼
►
phone and so that's why I'm you know
[TS]
◼
►
busting your butt so hard is what I
[TS]
◼
►
don't feel like I'm hearing is well what
[TS]
◼
►
we really wanted was a new processor
[TS]
◼
►
maybe more ram maybe more hard drive
[TS]
◼
►
space and then don't touch anything else
[TS]
◼
►
for the love no no I mean I don't think
[TS]
◼
►
anyone's like I think Marco but what
[TS]
◼
►
talk around before but basically i said
[TS]
◼
►
last week if you're going to if you can
[TS]
◼
►
have this line of products and I think
[TS]
◼
►
who is it about the web page listed all
[TS]
◼
►
of the scene Hackett the listed all of
[TS]
◼
►
the the laptop sort of in in order of
[TS]
◼
►
the lines but you're going to have all
[TS]
◼
►
these that laptops from like under a
[TS]
◼
►
thousand all the way up to like big
[TS]
◼
►
bucks for the big one right and they do
[TS]
◼
►
have a pretty good spread of prices
[TS]
◼
►
right if you decide you're going to do
[TS]
◼
►
that you're going to sell one of them
[TS]
◼
►
one on retina display with old guts and
[TS]
◼
►
old ports and you're going to sell some
[TS]
◼
►
of them with the fancy new ports a new
[TS]
◼
►
guts in the whole deal
[TS]
◼
►
the the way to do it is not to leave
[TS]
◼
►
ancient computers around and just be
[TS]
◼
►
like well this one is never gonna get us
[TS]
◼
►
species it's not worth updating we're
[TS]
◼
►
just going to keep selling the macbook
[TS]
◼
►
air forever and ever and ever update the
[TS]
◼
►
guts every once in awhile but it's never
[TS]
◼
►
going to be an overall the the way with
[TS]
◼
►
more investment which I'm not gonna say
[TS]
◼
►
again I don't like the old Apple the old
[TS]
◼
►
ways it makes like cited in the olden
[TS]
◼
►
days like it's just a question of how
[TS]
◼
►
much investment deal the old way with
[TS]
◼
►
more investment is fine you're gonna
[TS]
◼
►
sell this lot of computers from a
[TS]
◼
►
thousand bucks to 4,000 all of them get
[TS]
◼
►
some minimum set of new features rolled
[TS]
◼
►
out together like it's a rising tide
[TS]
◼
►
lifts all boats if you're gonna keep
[TS]
◼
►
selling same look that one mac book
[TS]
◼
►
which i think is gone now or still alive
[TS]
◼
►
but it is finally gone anyway like I
[TS]
◼
►
said last week if you're going to sell a
[TS]
◼
►
super cheap laptop with real expect with
[TS]
◼
►
an optical drive
[TS]
◼
►
you also have to occasionally update
[TS]
◼
►
that 1i get you can't just say we're
[TS]
◼
►
going to keep some of the old computer
[TS]
◼
►
on modified for a long long time you
[TS]
◼
►
should move the lineup together which
[TS]
◼
►
means you have a gradation of features
[TS]
◼
►
like the touch bars and going to be in
[TS]
◼
►
all of them understands expensive right
[TS]
◼
►
and same thing with all the other
[TS]
◼
►
features and all all the different
[TS]
◼
►
things you bring out they're not all
[TS]
◼
►
gonna have the p3 screen right but the
[TS]
◼
►
fact that retina still hasn't trickled
[TS]
◼
►
down to the lowest end model because
[TS]
◼
►
they want to keep selling the old model
[TS]
◼
►
like the really really old crappy one
[TS]
◼
►
mostly unmodified with only minor tweaks
[TS]
◼
►
that does not speak well too
[TS]
◼
►
investment in the product line it's
[TS]
◼
►
better to keep selling the cheaper
[TS]
◼
►
computer but continued update them all
[TS]
◼
►
together in some cases they get away
[TS]
◼
►
with it on the phones because they only
[TS]
◼
►
do like you know last year's phone and
[TS]
◼
►
then it kind of trails off at the end
[TS]
◼
►
but even there I think it's a problem
[TS]
◼
►
that's where the strategy came from but
[TS]
◼
►
with the max like how many years has
[TS]
◼
►
essentially that same quote unquote same
[TS]
◼
►
macbook air with different guts been
[TS]
◼
►
I'm even made the point now which I look
[TS]
◼
►
at the 13-inch macbook pro is now it's
[TS]
◼
►
now more of an error than air isn't that
[TS]
◼
►
and yet will still sell that air because
[TS]
◼
►
the new macros five dollars more
[TS]
◼
►
expensive it would be better to have a
[TS]
◼
►
cheaper better macbook air me even want
[TS]
◼
►
to keep a non-retina make this one
[TS]
◼
►
better than it is it's a trapeze and I
[TS]
◼
►
mean like i'm not trying to sell you
[TS]
◼
►
trying to give them now I'm not saying
[TS]
◼
►
like every product has to be awesome but
[TS]
◼
►
you have to bring the products up
[TS]
◼
►
together you can have this these two
[TS]
◼
►
classes of like hear the good computers
[TS]
◼
►
and here the ones we've been saying for
[TS]
◼
►
years that are pieces of crap and
[TS]
◼
►
there's these weird that's not the case
[TS]
◼
►
though with what they're saying is
[TS]
◼
►
here's the brand-new good computers that
[TS]
◼
►
quite frankly aren't cheap and into as
[TS]
◼
►
someone of you just said they're less
[TS]
◼
►
cheap now than they used to be and then
[TS]
◼
►
if you want something that's more
[TS]
◼
►
affordable guess what
[TS]
◼
►
it's probably going to be a little older
[TS]
◼
►
on the inside it's like the difference
[TS]
◼
►
between but it should be newer than it
[TS]
◼
►
is because it's like the pricing doesn't
[TS]
◼
►
make sense it's like the mac pro we
[TS]
◼
►
understand the macros an expensive
[TS]
◼
►
computer but if you don't have that the
[TS]
◼
►
internals for three years it becomes
[TS]
◼
►
embarrassing i'm at the macbook airs in
[TS]
◼
►
terms have been updated more than the
[TS]
◼
►
mac pros we have to give them that but
[TS]
◼
►
it's still basically the same form
[TS]
◼
►
factor and the internals are pretty old
[TS]
◼
►
and slow as compared to everything else
[TS]
◼
►
like really that this to me like this
[TS]
◼
►
this is my fundamental just friction
[TS]
◼
►
that I have with the tim cook made way
[TS]
◼
►
of running Apple you don't take real
[TS]
◼
►
courage to talk about courage in this
[TS]
◼
►
head-to-head super headphone jack
[TS]
◼
►
it would take real courage would be to
[TS]
◼
►
take a temporary margin hit to make all
[TS]
◼
►
of your products great at some of the
[TS]
◼
►
generals pointing out like it's hard to
[TS]
◼
►
i'm trying to get the macbook air more
[TS]
◼
►
credit than it probably deserves in
[TS]
◼
►
terms of the specs in the money because
[TS]
◼
►
again they have updated more than mac
[TS]
◼
►
pro which is a low bar but if you if you
[TS]
◼
►
look at the pc internal you can get
[TS]
◼
►
for the similar price and again kind of
[TS]
◼
►
macbook air is a better computer as
[TS]
◼
►
nicer you know industrial design so on
[TS]
◼
►
so forth just this is just not keeping
[TS]
◼
►
up with the rest of the line and the
[TS]
◼
►
line just feels like i haven't had nuts
[TS]
◼
►
it's like the you know the ipad air and
[TS]
◼
►
ipad pros like we this gap that exists
[TS]
◼
►
everywhere and it is it's a gap that
[TS]
◼
►
reflects a level of desired investment
[TS]
◼
►
because it's so much easier to keep
[TS]
◼
►
selling the old models or even just
[TS]
◼
►
bumping the internals of the old model
[TS]
◼
►
that fundamentally change like oh well
[TS]
◼
►
we can bump the internals little bit but
[TS]
◼
►
we changed us bc that's like a whole new
[TS]
◼
►
thing and it requires more investment
[TS]
◼
►
all the stuff it and i know i don't want
[TS]
◼
►
to put value judgments on it like moral
[TS]
◼
►
things like tim cook doesn't care is
[TS]
◼
►
being mean to us i think it's just
[TS]
◼
►
investment in the end again I think the
[TS]
◼
►
investment is is justified by all of the
[TS]
◼
►
tangible attributes of the mac line as
[TS]
◼
►
compared to everything else
[TS]
◼
►
mostly the reason you hear me upset
[TS]
◼
►
anyway is because i like the mac right
[TS]
◼
►
and I from I can argue for why you
[TS]
◼
►
should do this not just because I like
[TS]
◼
►
the Maccabees here's why it's actually
[TS]
◼
►
important for apples the company like I
[TS]
◼
►
can make that argument to but personally
[TS]
◼
►
speaking it's because I like this
[TS]
◼
►
product is now getting less investment
[TS]
◼
►
that's why i find it frustrating and
[TS]
◼
►
bingo didn't help that it didn't help
[TS]
◼
►
that they said that
[TS]
◼
►
hello again on the invitation but as I
[TS]
◼
►
said last week that was overhyped that
[TS]
◼
►
you're taking one admittedly quite long
[TS]
◼
►
data point which is not updating the
[TS]
◼
►
macbook pros effectively for like two or
[TS]
◼
►
full stop that was BS that was terrible
[TS]
◼
►
shouldn't happened but you're taking
[TS]
◼
►
that one data point as a line that says
[TS]
◼
►
though that line with a huge downward
[TS]
◼
►
slope that says that we don't care about
[TS]
◼
►
the mac well you got the mac pro to you
[TS]
◼
►
got the mac mini which is always been
[TS]
◼
►
like that and we just excuse because
[TS]
◼
►
it's always been like that
[TS]
◼
►
right okay like I even the imac has gone
[TS]
◼
►
through droughts it's just not a good
[TS]
◼
►
cycle now right even if you just want to
[TS]
◼
►
pick like things like peripherals it's
[TS]
◼
►
not making a new extended keyboard when
[TS]
◼
►
they made the new key switches stuff
[TS]
◼
►
like that like it's movie you know it's
[TS]
◼
►
it that's harder to make an argument for
[TS]
◼
►
than everything else but anyway I'm
[TS]
◼
►
gonna get off this because I think I
[TS]
◼
►
mostly just arguing the two of us
[TS]
◼
►
arguing with you and I think the larger
[TS]
◼
►
the larger like this doesn't matter to
[TS]
◼
►
most people there was the biggest up cry
[TS]
◼
►
you know how Christ on twitter with some
[TS]
◼
►
people who expect desktop max to come
[TS]
◼
►
which is you know like just because we
[TS]
◼
►
didn't expect them to come or definitely
[TS]
◼
►
didn't expect them all to be updated or
[TS]
◼
►
anything doesn't mean it's not kind of
[TS]
◼
►
like doesn't mean we're not tired of
[TS]
◼
►
waiting for them as well right and I all
[TS]
◼
►
what you saw where people who like to
[TS]
◼
►
stop max complaining there were people
[TS]
◼
►
don't like that max don't care who cares
[TS]
◼
►
nobody noticed that max exist as far as
[TS]
◼
►
they're concerned max our laptops and
[TS]
◼
►
they think the macbook airs are fine and
[TS]
◼
►
so on and so forth but where you know
[TS]
◼
►
computer enthusiasts and mac fans and
[TS]
◼
►
desktop Mac fans and so of course we're
[TS]
◼
►
upset about it its separate argument
[TS]
◼
►
whether just because were upset that the
[TS]
◼
►
products we like are getting updated
[TS]
◼
►
does that mean that Apple should update
[TS]
◼
►
them are often but that explains the
[TS]
◼
►
upsetness I think the upsetting this is
[TS]
◼
►
not for the most part people think Larry
[TS]
◼
►
the same as saying Apple should do what
[TS]
◼
►
I want right because that's what you're
[TS]
◼
►
gonna have before we would like it if
[TS]
◼
►
Apple do something different but you
[TS]
◼
►
know we just allow us to be upset that
[TS]
◼
►
Apple's not doing what we want and then
[TS]
◼
►
we can have a discussion about whether
[TS]
◼
►
Apple should do this thing that we want
[TS]
◼
►
whether it's good for Apple are good for
[TS]
◼
►
computing or whatever night that i think
[TS]
◼
►
i can turn that into a big segue into
[TS]
◼
►
what i wanted to get into which is the
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar is remarkable put an add
[TS]
◼
►
something we also sponsor tonight by Mac
[TS]
◼
►
paw and clean my mac three go to Mac
[TS]
◼
►
Paul that's Mac PA w.com / ATP to learn
[TS]
◼
►
more mac Paul the reputable software
[TS]
◼
►
developer makes cleanmymac this is this
[TS]
◼
►
great program that helps you clean out
[TS]
◼
►
disk space and caches and things that on
[TS]
◼
►
your mac and mac three they recently
[TS]
◼
►
added a great new feature exclusively
[TS]
◼
►
for developers who use xcode xcode is
[TS]
◼
►
all the all these crap files keeps
[TS]
◼
►
around attempt files build files derive
[TS]
◼
►
data old support files for old simulated
[TS]
◼
►
devices and all devices you don't use
[TS]
◼
►
CleanMyMac 3 by Mac paw safely and
[TS]
◼
►
quickly can clean the xcode cash for you
[TS]
◼
►
more easily than ever before as app
[TS]
◼
►
developers Mac pod knows that it's a big
[TS]
◼
►
heart of try to remember all these
[TS]
◼
►
things are to even find these files to
[TS]
◼
►
know clean to remember clean them to try
[TS]
◼
►
to do anything anything quickly or with
[TS]
◼
►
any kind of like single key command
[TS]
◼
►
anything it's really hard so they made
[TS]
◼
►
all this safe easy and fast with
[TS]
◼
►
three you can see for yourself you got
[TS]
◼
►
to check this out go to go to Mac pod
[TS]
◼
►
calm / ATP that's Mac p aww Mac ba.com /
[TS]
◼
►
ATP to check out CleanMyMac 3 especially
[TS]
◼
►
if you're a developer to see the new
[TS]
◼
►
feature to clear xcode cache files once
[TS]
◼
►
again thanks a lot to Mac paw and clean
[TS]
◼
►
my mac three for sponsoring our show so
[TS]
◼
►
many years ago one of my early maybe my
[TS]
◼
►
first but one of my earlier articles for
[TS]
◼
►
macro magazine the back page article was
[TS]
◼
►
about this fairly fanciful idea again i
[TS]
◼
►
have is a history to the back page of
[TS]
◼
►
macworld mac user magazine that made me
[TS]
◼
►
think of writing something that probably
[TS]
◼
►
won't even write a blog post today but i
[TS]
◼
►
did in a print article back then about
[TS]
◼
►
the idea of mac laptop that you could
[TS]
◼
►
use a mac but then you could somehow
[TS]
◼
►
folded over on itself kinda like the all
[TS]
◼
►
those convertible like a lot of
[TS]
◼
►
convertible pc laptops feel like this
[TS]
◼
►
remember when they're making a lot about
[TS]
◼
►
they're still making but the month you
[TS]
◼
►
can fold over it turns into a tablet
[TS]
◼
►
basically and when you turn into a
[TS]
◼
►
however you want to do a twisting the
[TS]
◼
►
screen and going down fulton all
[TS]
◼
►
we want it in tablet mode it's basically
[TS]
◼
►
an ipad and when it's in mac mode its a
[TS]
◼
►
Mac and I was like well you know you've
[TS]
◼
►
already got us running an intel on the
[TS]
◼
►
simulator and the you know that the
[TS]
◼
►
conversion would be kind of anything
[TS]
◼
►
we've seen lots of pc makers do it
[TS]
◼
►
Apple could do a good job on that the
[TS]
◼
►
hinge mechanism make it very you know
[TS]
◼
►
interesting and and sturdy and and good
[TS]
◼
►
to use all these different scenarios and
[TS]
◼
►
when that be an interesting kind of
[TS]
◼
►
computer because that would deal with
[TS]
◼
►
the the dichotomy that was then a hot
[TS]
◼
►
topic and still kind of a hot topic
[TS]
◼
►
between iOS and and the mac OS and all
[TS]
◼
►
this stuff and you know obviously
[TS]
◼
►
nothing came of that windows continue to
[TS]
◼
►
sell those those are convertibles
[TS]
◼
►
windows is converted its OS to be one
[TS]
◼
►
unified OS for both touch interface and
[TS]
◼
►
everything else and again we might talk
[TS]
◼
►
about that later on a different show but
[TS]
◼
►
setting that aside now that you know the
[TS]
◼
►
idea that you could run both iOS and
[TS]
◼
►
what was then OS 10 or Mac os10 at that
[TS]
◼
►
on the same computer because iOS also
[TS]
◼
►
runs on intel what we have today with
[TS]
◼
►
these things as you pointed out Casey is
[TS]
◼
►
a mac that runs mac OS on its intel
[TS]
◼
►
processor and then off to the side this
[TS]
◼
►
little T 1 processor that is presumably
[TS]
◼
►
arm and presumably run something like
[TS]
◼
►
iOS I mean again the core OS of both
[TS]
◼
►
Western and both mac OS and iOS Darwin
[TS]
◼
►
anywhere but anyway
[TS]
◼
►
presumably that little chip is running
[TS]
◼
►
in the West that's running a touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
doing all this stuff here we have a mac
[TS]
◼
►
is essentially running to os's on two
[TS]
◼
►
different screens
[TS]
◼
►
the only difference is the tablet mode
[TS]
◼
►
is just a little skinny strip that goes
[TS]
◼
►
along the top of the thing and then the
[TS]
◼
►
mac part gets the big thing of the top
[TS]
◼
►
and you look at this and I to I joked
[TS]
◼
►
was teasing Marco about this a couple
[TS]
◼
►
just you wait until the entire keyboard
[TS]
◼
►
is one big screen for the people who
[TS]
◼
►
don't mind behind glass like look at the
[TS]
◼
►
evolution of the keyboards on these macs
[TS]
◼
►
going from big honkin giant keys that
[TS]
◼
►
are like on the Apple extended to keep
[TS]
◼
►
order the mac portable like big giant
[TS]
◼
►
mechanical switch petrunka chunk by
[TS]
◼
►
chunk and they just got squished and
[TS]
◼
►
squished and the plungers became a
[TS]
◼
►
butterfly hinges became dome switches
[TS]
◼
►
where they've just the keys have just
[TS]
◼
►
been descending into the thing becoming
[TS]
◼
►
like comically thinner and smaller like
[TS]
◼
►
like they were rolling over by a
[TS]
◼
►
steamroller year after year and now a
[TS]
◼
►
sudden one of the cortical keys is a big
[TS]
◼
►
flat screen that looks like the keys
[TS]
◼
►
they did a really good job by the way of
[TS]
◼
►
like pattern matching them like so it's
[TS]
◼
►
the same kind of matte finish on both
[TS]
◼
►
the screen in the key so it looks like
[TS]
◼
►
it's a big key anyway and now all of a
[TS]
◼
►
sudden one of them turns into a screen
[TS]
◼
►
and it's run by this little process has
[TS]
◼
►
an OS and like someone didn't animated
[TS]
◼
►
gif that i retweeted it was like next
[TS]
◼
►
year the number keys are screen next
[TS]
◼
►
year the top row of the qwerty keyboard
[TS]
◼
►
is keep next year the next row keys next
[TS]
◼
►
year the next rose the keys and
[TS]
◼
►
eventually the whole lot of the things
[TS]
◼
►
that the keys and eventually the top
[TS]
◼
►
screen goes away and you just have an
[TS]
◼
►
ipad right like it slowly slowly making
[TS]
◼
►
the Nintendo ds2 dual-screen thing you
[TS]
◼
►
know by by converting the keyboard and
[TS]
◼
►
i'm not saying this is the inevitable
[TS]
◼
►
direction they're going to go but it's
[TS]
◼
►
hard to look at that touchpad are the
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar and if this touch bar has any
[TS]
◼
►
legs at all the thing that people might
[TS]
◼
►
want to do not to see this as like a
[TS]
◼
►
weird transitional fossil
[TS]
◼
►
and I don't again I don't totally get
[TS]
◼
►
into the Microsoft Surface studio thing
[TS]
◼
►
but like this weird transition possibly
[TS]
◼
►
weird transitional fossil held up
[TS]
◼
►
against this the surface studio where
[TS]
◼
►
the whole freaking thing is one giant
[TS]
◼
►
touches play on by the way there's a
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard when you need it one of those
[TS]
◼
►
looks like they skip to the end of this
[TS]
◼
►
evolution again this may be a dead end
[TS]
◼
►
and evolution may be the wrong about
[TS]
◼
►
this is the you know the future of
[TS]
◼
►
computing or whatever may be the wrong
[TS]
◼
►
about the OS maybe the wrong about so
[TS]
◼
►
many other things but for one of the
[TS]
◼
►
first times in recent memory apple looks
[TS]
◼
►
to be making a more cautious bet then
[TS]
◼
►
then Microsoft at least in this
[TS]
◼
►
particular scenario and that's not
[TS]
◼
►
necessarily bad because i think the
[TS]
◼
►
cautious bet like the odds i think the
[TS]
◼
►
odds of touch bar being interesting and
[TS]
◼
►
useful are higher than the odds of the
[TS]
◼
►
surface studio being a runaway smash hit
[TS]
◼
►
that saves microsoft right or whatever
[TS]
◼
►
because like that it's safer
[TS]
◼
►
I think it has a higher chance of
[TS]
◼
►
success but I i look at that touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
and it's hard not to start thinking
[TS]
◼
►
about putting screens for the key but
[TS]
◼
►
why is the touchpad the the trackpad not
[TS]
◼
►
entirely screen the keyboard is not a
[TS]
◼
►
screen but is it has market would say
[TS]
◼
►
getting progressively worse as a
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard but other people might say
[TS]
◼
►
getting progressively less keyboard e
[TS]
◼
►
because people don't care about
[TS]
◼
►
keyboards anymore and when I just make
[TS]
◼
►
the whole thing screen and then when you
[TS]
◼
►
do that why do you have two screens
[TS]
◼
►
wanted to make one screen and you just
[TS]
◼
►
reinvented the ipad again but with a
[TS]
◼
►
different OS but now you know so i think
[TS]
◼
►
this is all this seems like it's all
[TS]
◼
►
eventually going to come to a head and I
[TS]
◼
►
think we'll look back at this and be
[TS]
◼
►
able to see the progression but right
[TS]
◼
►
now the progression that we can see from
[TS]
◼
►
the past is the keys are getting flatter
[TS]
◼
►
the things are getting thinner and now
[TS]
◼
►
the limitations of keys have gone to the
[TS]
◼
►
point where they're bringing some
[TS]
◼
►
screens down into that area and i'm not
[TS]
◼
►
quite sure where this will end but apple
[TS]
◼
►
looks like the more the more iterative
[TS]
◼
►
let's analyze a cautious or careful
[TS]
◼
►
because this is an interesting move but
[TS]
◼
►
it's definitely more iterative then sort
[TS]
◼
►
of leapfrog e then
[TS]
◼
►
then we're used to I think I don't think
[TS]
◼
►
that's a bad thing I i think it's i
[TS]
◼
►
don't want to really turn this into a
[TS]
◼
►
surface studio discussion but it is a
[TS]
◼
►
fascinating part of case studies the
[TS]
◼
►
right way of looking at it but it's it's
[TS]
◼
►
fascinating to see Microsoft just
[TS]
◼
►
tripping down on this hybrid OS idea
[TS]
◼
►
which to me seems utterly preposterous
[TS]
◼
►
and i actually have installed Windows 10
[TS]
◼
►
on my work laptop because I've been
[TS]
◼
►
doing a little c-sharp API work and i
[TS]
◼
►
gotta tell you i was expecting Windows
[TS]
◼
►
10 to be really good because everyone i
[TS]
◼
►
know that has run it has said oh it's
[TS]
◼
►
great it's a lot better they fixed a lot
[TS]
◼
►
of the problems that it's really good
[TS]
◼
►
and i could go on for hours about how
[TS]
◼
►
awful i found windows tend to be and in
[TS]
◼
►
no small part because high DPI support
[TS]
◼
►
is a joke at best and non-existent at
[TS]
◼
►
worst but that being said all of a
[TS]
◼
►
sudden with the surface to do I sort of
[TS]
◼
►
understand what Microsoft is going for
[TS]
◼
►
with this hybrid world where touches is
[TS]
◼
►
touching non-touch os's are one in the
[TS]
◼
►
same i think that that is the surface to
[TS]
◼
►
do is kind of the ultimate realization
[TS]
◼
►
that they it's to some degree kind of a
[TS]
◼
►
naked robotic or of love Microsoft
[TS]
◼
►
strategy that lets make a machine with
[TS]
◼
►
this huge what is it's a 27 inch monitor
[TS]
◼
►
i believe something like that does
[TS]
◼
►
matter huge monitor 18 inch I think okay
[TS]
◼
►
and i believe it's taller right because
[TS]
◼
►
it's a different aspect ratio then we
[TS]
◼
►
asked there is 3 by 2
[TS]
◼
►
yeah I i would love honestly so let's
[TS]
◼
►
make this very large that you know kind
[TS]
◼
►
of contrary device where it's not
[TS]
◼
►
widescreen like everything else on the
[TS]
◼
►
market is and let's make it touch
[TS]
◼
►
sensitive everywhere and that is kind of
[TS]
◼
►
the ultimate realization of microsoft
[TS]
◼
►
microsoft strategy and although i would
[TS]
◼
►
i would give almost anything not to run
[TS]
◼
►
windows and I can understand why this
[TS]
◼
►
would be appealing
[TS]
◼
►
I don't think I would ever want to have
[TS]
◼
►
a computer that is a drafting table so
[TS]
◼
►
to speak but i can see how would be
[TS]
◼
►
really really cool
[TS]
◼
►
similarly I think this touch bar is kind
[TS]
◼
►
of the ultimate realization
[TS]
◼
►
of what Apple thinks is the best idea
[TS]
◼
►
for a quote unquote hybrid world which
[TS]
◼
►
is not as much that the screen is a
[TS]
◼
►
touchscreen but more
[TS]
◼
►
hey will give you a little sick separate
[TS]
◼
►
touchscreen that you can interact with
[TS]
◼
►
and you can do cool stuff with and by
[TS]
◼
►
the way it's more than just buttons like
[TS]
◼
►
when we had seen the preview or the
[TS]
◼
►
renderings for this i don't recall
[TS]
◼
►
anyway having seen that there was going
[TS]
◼
►
to be anything on here really but a
[TS]
◼
►
bunch of just programmable buttons if
[TS]
◼
►
you will and there's all sorts of cool
[TS]
◼
►
stuff that they show on this they show
[TS]
◼
►
timelines and like Final Cut Pro or
[TS]
◼
►
maybe a different app they showed kind
[TS]
◼
►
of a cover flow version of all the
[TS]
◼
►
pictures that are in a folder when
[TS]
◼
►
you're looking and find her like there's
[TS]
◼
►
some really trick cool stuff coverflow
[TS]
◼
►
will never die but forever that I we
[TS]
◼
►
always know is a well the rumors were
[TS]
◼
►
all an oled screen so we kind of knew
[TS]
◼
►
that there was going to be other stuff
[TS]
◼
►
up there but like I go back to what you
[TS]
◼
►
said earlier Casey I think the key
[TS]
◼
►
phrase that I don't think it's apt here
[TS]
◼
►
is ultimate realization because this is
[TS]
◼
►
not the ultimate realization of anything
[TS]
◼
►
this is an iterative improvement and I
[TS]
◼
►
think it's good and I think it's going
[TS]
◼
►
to really cool but it's almost as if the
[TS]
◼
►
more cool this is the more we will
[TS]
◼
►
realize that limiting it to just a
[TS]
◼
►
little strip is bad and that you know
[TS]
◼
►
like why is the whole trackpad not a
[TS]
◼
►
screen why is the whole bottom of the
[TS]
◼
►
laptop screen wise though keyboard not a
[TS]
◼
►
screen is the point will say well the
[TS]
◼
►
whole keyboard on screen just type in
[TS]
◼
►
glasses terrible many millions of money
[TS]
◼
►
will say now we love it it's great you
[TS]
◼
►
know that it's like and then once you do
[TS]
◼
►
that it's like well then why is there a
[TS]
◼
►
bottom screen and the top screen why's
[TS]
◼
►
it all one screen and then you just like
[TS]
◼
►
it really feels it's not the ultimate
[TS]
◼
►
realization writing the ultimate
[TS]
◼
►
realization if this idea turns out to be
[TS]
◼
►
good of this computer on this laptop
[TS]
◼
►
idea but this computing idea using like
[TS]
◼
►
the value system that is most in line
[TS]
◼
►
with probably mine and Marcos is the
[TS]
◼
►
server studio which is just make the
[TS]
◼
►
whole freaking thing a big giant
[TS]
◼
►
gorgeous touchscreen but also give me a
[TS]
◼
►
physical keyboard when I want to type
[TS]
◼
►
because I'm old and I like to have on
[TS]
◼
►
physical keyboards and when i'm not
[TS]
◼
►
typing I don't have to deal with that
[TS]
◼
►
and there's no like separate region of
[TS]
◼
►
the keyboard that's also a screen and I
[TS]
◼
►
can use 77 hand and foot ten fingers and
[TS]
◼
►
five elbows all the same time with a
[TS]
◼
►
little dial and like just you know that
[TS]
◼
►
is the ultimate realization of ideas it
[TS]
◼
►
idea does it work well as the OS good
[TS]
◼
►
other other and intangibles that are
[TS]
◼
►
stopping them again I think we do have
[TS]
◼
►
to talk about this service to do some
[TS]
◼
►
point but the touch bar is not the
[TS]
◼
►
ultimate realization of any idea it is
[TS]
◼
►
the next good iterative step along the
[TS]
◼
►
lines of the idea that apple's pursuing
[TS]
◼
►
and I think it looks really cool and
[TS]
◼
►
really awesome with some minor caveat
[TS]
◼
►
it's but it feels it feels like just one
[TS]
◼
►
more step in it kind of its transition
[TS]
◼
►
off that makes me feel not uncomfortable
[TS]
◼
►
but like anticipatory like I like I'm
[TS]
◼
►
I'm waiting to see what's next it's
[TS]
◼
►
tantalizing in the like where does this
[TS]
◼
►
all go where does this lead because
[TS]
◼
►
clearly this is not going to be the end
[TS]
◼
►
this is clearly on its way to something
[TS]
◼
►
and I you know it's like it's like a
[TS]
◼
►
glimpse of the future that is not yet
[TS]
◼
►
the keyboard is getting flatter we
[TS]
◼
►
showed a screen on it but it's still
[TS]
◼
►
kind of disappointed this thing is still
[TS]
◼
►
kind of shape of the old computer and
[TS]
◼
►
certainly the shape of mac OS is still
[TS]
◼
►
as separate from iOS is that ever was
[TS]
◼
►
and we don't know I don't know where
[TS]
◼
►
it's going but this is like I feel like
[TS]
◼
►
this is the first step off of the path
[TS]
◼
►
that the mac has been going on to an
[TS]
◼
►
acknowledgement that there can be that
[TS]
◼
►
not there you know emerging the os's or
[TS]
◼
►
whatever but just trying trying to
[TS]
◼
►
reconcile this world where we want to
[TS]
◼
►
touch stuff and have touchscreen things
[TS]
◼
►
with the world of the mac we're not
[TS]
◼
►
touching things right and how do we
[TS]
◼
►
bring them together and this is honestly
[TS]
◼
►
this is the first mac with a touchscreen
[TS]
◼
►
right no automatic has had a screen that
[TS]
◼
►
you talked to touch pads and a little
[TS]
◼
►
hey we want to touch screen Mac you got
[TS]
◼
►
10 by the way the screen is really thin
[TS]
◼
►
and that just makes me think like where
[TS]
◼
►
is this going where what is the future
[TS]
◼
►
of this like surely this is not a
[TS]
◼
►
holding pattern that we stand for
[TS]
◼
►
another 15 years with a little script
[TS]
◼
►
strip on the screen there
[TS]
◼
►
this has to lead to something and I'm
[TS]
◼
►
excited to see where that goes but this
[TS]
◼
►
this machine makes me like hunger to see
[TS]
◼
►
yeah quick aside about the surface
[TS]
◼
►
studio from everything I can tell it's
[TS]
◼
►
using the exact same processors as the
[TS]
◼
►
imac and it isn't out for another two
[TS]
◼
►
yeah no it's not a super like that that
[TS]
◼
►
machine but its separate topic intend to
[TS]
◼
►
switch also sorry if you're here to her
[TS]
◼
►
present tense which probably not this
[TS]
◼
►
intense which Microsoft service studio
[TS]
◼
►
there on the list we will talk about
[TS]
◼
►
alright so now you said nice things
[TS]
◼
►
about touchpad a few minor annoying
[TS]
◼
►
things about the touchpad well now what
[TS]
◼
►
one fun thing about it that the
[TS]
◼
►
customized thing pure APPL feature love
[TS]
◼
►
that he can drag the little thing off
[TS]
◼
►
the screen onto the onto the touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
that's awesome right
[TS]
◼
►
that's like another one of those magical
[TS]
◼
►
type of things and I did when you're
[TS]
◼
►
editing mode where you want to edit the
[TS]
◼
►
buttons to customize it is good that
[TS]
◼
►
that's a feature because customizing is
[TS]
◼
►
great and they go into shaky mode you
[TS]
◼
►
know like iOS where you when you you
[TS]
◼
►
know when you're editing your
[TS]
◼
►
springboard icons that's that's kind of
[TS]
◼
►
like a a UI idiom that Apple has coined
[TS]
◼
►
and now they use across the product line
[TS]
◼
►
to great effect when when these things
[TS]
◼
►
are in the mode where they're being
[TS]
◼
►
edited have them wiggle so it's clear
[TS]
◼
►
that you're in like editing mode and all
[TS]
◼
►
the rules are different that's very
[TS]
◼
►
clever very good bit of you either
[TS]
◼
►
they've been smart spread everywhere but
[TS]
◼
►
the tricky bit on the little strip the
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar screen is that they're using
[TS]
◼
►
edge-to-edge every single pixel that
[TS]
◼
►
thing to show the buttons because it's
[TS]
◼
►
such a skinny screen like they're going
[TS]
◼
►
all out from the top edge there's no
[TS]
◼
►
margins they're leaving on it so they
[TS]
◼
►
can't have the icons shake back and
[TS]
◼
►
forth as if they're rotating like the
[TS]
◼
►
springboard icons but it would be you
[TS]
◼
►
did now because they would be because
[TS]
◼
►
they would be clipped on the top and
[TS]
◼
►
bottom and you would be it would break
[TS]
◼
►
the illusion that their keys when you
[TS]
◼
►
saw them clipped by the screen edges so
[TS]
◼
►
instead they they they shake but only
[TS]
◼
►
left and right i was just okay yeah
[TS]
◼
►
they're in there and they're wiggling
[TS]
◼
►
and you don't know there's something a
[TS]
◼
►
little off but basically like jostling
[TS]
◼
►
up against each other like a bunch of
[TS]
◼
►
like you know peas in a pod or whatever
[TS]
◼
►
but they can't we go up and down because
[TS]
◼
►
the club which I thought was a really
[TS]
◼
►
clever way to solve that problem because
[TS]
◼
►
the problem is that we want to use every
[TS]
◼
►
pixel this thing but we make them shake
[TS]
◼
►
the other way they clip top and bottom
[TS]
◼
►
and it destroys the illusion so just
[TS]
◼
►
make them shake side-to-side I thought
[TS]
◼
►
that was super clever and adorable and
[TS]
◼
►
they look cute when i do that and that's
[TS]
◼
►
a great feature but it's the same trick
[TS]
◼
►
using the watch display to is like on
[TS]
◼
►
the watch and this is one of things you
[TS]
◼
►
could do with all that like one reason
[TS]
◼
►
looks so great is like black on oled
[TS]
◼
►
looks really black and so you can more
[TS]
◼
►
easily concealed the edges of the actual
[TS]
◼
►
screen like the actual pixels of the
[TS]
◼
►
screen with the black margin around it
[TS]
◼
►
so on the watch interface elements go
[TS]
◼
►
right up to the edge like they did he
[TS]
◼
►
specifically in the interface guidelines
[TS]
◼
►
like you should design your screens that
[TS]
◼
►
way don't leave any margin around you
[TS]
◼
►
let's go ride right to the edges and
[TS]
◼
►
then on the watches physical hardware
[TS]
◼
►
they just leave enough of a margin
[TS]
◼
►
around the screen to make that look
[TS]
◼
►
right into the doing the same thing on
[TS]
◼
►
the touch part here which is another one
[TS]
◼
►
of the many parallels that have to watch
[TS]
◼
►
because it appears to run a very to
[TS]
◼
►
watch us and it's running on on what
[TS]
◼
►
appears to be a variant of the watches
[TS]
◼
►
s1 chip as it's totally different as a
[TS]
◼
►
TV there instead of an s totally
[TS]
◼
►
different right right and the w12
[TS]
◼
►
different yes anyway so yeah it's the
[TS]
◼
►
same similar move areas it's a genius
[TS]
◼
►
move like to know just we don't need the
[TS]
◼
►
screen to be any bigger than this
[TS]
◼
►
because the buttons are gonna be that
[TS]
◼
►
so just make it look like the screen has
[TS]
◼
►
a healthy margin and don't waste any
[TS]
◼
►
pixels and power on anything that's not
[TS]
◼
►
you know necessary so margins get within
[TS]
◼
►
margins taketh away
[TS]
◼
►
let's now discuss the escape button
[TS]
◼
►
other way all the people like I didn't
[TS]
◼
►
want to respond to us on Twitter for the
[TS]
◼
►
past week because it seemed tiring but
[TS]
◼
►
now i'm going to do it in the podcast
[TS]
◼
►
the the point that we made either on the
[TS]
◼
►
show last week or on twitter about the
[TS]
◼
►
escape key was all about the fact that
[TS]
◼
►
being a physical key
[TS]
◼
►
none of us on the show we're saying that
[TS]
◼
►
there was not going to be a little gray
[TS]
◼
►
square with the letters esc ended in the
[TS]
◼
►
upper left corner that little screen
[TS]
◼
►
well almost the upper left corner
[TS]
◼
►
yes yes I'm getting to that point to it
[TS]
◼
►
was all knew it would be there it's just
[TS]
◼
►
we were we were asking for a key because
[TS]
◼
►
in our line of work it is a key that we
[TS]
◼
►
had more often than probably the average
[TS]
◼
►
person and it's nice to be able to reach
[TS]
◼
►
up and feel for it and so as far as so
[TS]
◼
►
that was it was not about Lisbeth people
[TS]
◼
►
think when they showed the key look
[TS]
◼
►
there's an escapee you got your escapees
[TS]
◼
►
like it's not a key it's just a picture
[TS]
◼
►
on the screen and we knew that was going
[TS]
◼
►
to be there anyway it's an escape zone
[TS]
◼
►
yes as for margins the escape zone
[TS]
◼
►
escapes on the touch bar does is not in
[TS]
◼
►
the corner so if we want to it's like
[TS]
◼
►
well okay so it's not a physical button
[TS]
◼
►
but it's still on the corner and you can
[TS]
◼
►
reach for and feel the corner of the
[TS]
◼
►
unfortunately if you touch just the
[TS]
◼
►
corner of the screen you won't hit the
[TS]
◼
►
escape button because that first
[TS]
◼
►
centimeter or so of the touch bar is as
[TS]
◼
►
far as I'm able to determine completely
[TS]
◼
►
inert I know it doesn't have a screen
[TS]
◼
►
I'm pretty sure it also doesn't have
[TS]
◼
►
touch sensors underneath that although I
[TS]
◼
►
see those things are necessarily
[TS]
◼
►
connected they could have put touch
[TS]
◼
►
sensors under there but no screen anyway
[TS]
◼
►
no screen is under there so they can't
[TS]
◼
►
physically draw the escape button
[TS]
◼
►
against the left edge of the touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
and i'm pretty sure you can't touch
[TS]
◼
►
their which makes it kind of a shame
[TS]
◼
►
because if you're feeling for something
[TS]
◼
►
to like reach out to the corner to find
[TS]
◼
►
a thing it's the one part you can feel
[TS]
◼
►
for on a completely smooth like touch
[TS]
◼
►
bar screen as you can feel for the top
[TS]
◼
►
edges in the sides so i would love to be
[TS]
◼
►
able to reach up to that corner and hit
[TS]
◼
►
the escape zone on the screen
[TS]
◼
►
yes but it looks like i will have to hit
[TS]
◼
►
the zone slightly over to the right from
[TS]
◼
►
the escape zone and i'm not particularly
[TS]
◼
►
happy about that because it's like
[TS]
◼
►
snatching defeat from the jaws of
[TS]
◼
►
victory because you guys like the one
[TS]
◼
►
button i care about this being replaced
[TS]
◼
►
by virtual button the one hit the most
[TS]
◼
►
often at least it's in the corner and
[TS]
◼
►
i'll be able to feel for but now i can
[TS]
◼
►
feel for by the way and i'm probably
[TS]
◼
►
getting one of these at work which is
[TS]
◼
►
why more invested in this at this point
[TS]
◼
►
and as I snuggly tweeted earlier
[TS]
◼
►
can we all guess why the screen doesn't
[TS]
◼
►
go all the way to the edge on the left
[TS]
◼
►
why doesn't the screen expand a little
[TS]
◼
►
bit it's so on the opposite side is the
[TS]
◼
►
touch ID sensor that's the same width as
[TS]
◼
►
the margin on the left side interesting
[TS]
◼
►
exactly the same whether it's just
[TS]
◼
►
clothes I i think it's exactly the same
[TS]
◼
►
i haven't haven't verified that yes i
[TS]
◼
►
think it is I think you're right it is
[TS]
◼
►
exactly the same with who I know who
[TS]
◼
►
likes margins to be exactly the same
[TS]
◼
►
with on the right and left sides of
[TS]
◼
►
things that they design i don't know i
[TS]
◼
►
mean maybe it might be the same person
[TS]
◼
►
who put the camera shutter / volume up
[TS]
◼
►
button directly opposite of me turn off
[TS]
◼
►
the screen and go to sleep button on the
[TS]
◼
►
iPhone offsetting those wouldn't help
[TS]
◼
►
that much but anyway like if you again
[TS]
◼
►
if you squint this laptop you see this
[TS]
◼
►
is still a 15-inch laptop which it with
[TS]
◼
►
a tiny keyboard crammed in there and I
[TS]
◼
►
know you won't have room for the
[TS]
◼
►
speakers and I know someone so all I'm
[TS]
◼
►
saying is that keeper could be big round
[TS]
◼
►
that each model but they want to be
[TS]
◼
►
same thing with the inverted to you get
[TS]
◼
►
a full-size arrow keys if you didn't
[TS]
◼
►
have a perfect rectangle Jony ive and
[TS]
◼
►
the Apple designers like symmetry I like
[TS]
◼
►
symmetry I like things to be uniform and
[TS]
◼
►
centered and everything but everyone has
[TS]
◼
►
their limits and this hit the touch ID
[TS]
◼
►
being on the gap on the right
[TS]
◼
►
I know it has to be there that's fine
[TS]
◼
►
what I would have chosen if i was
[TS]
◼
►
designing this is the screen would go
[TS]
◼
►
over to the edge on left side even
[TS]
◼
►
though it's not symmetrical
[TS]
◼
►
that's the choice I would have made
[TS]
◼
►
apple made a different choice all they
[TS]
◼
►
have open the door for is the ability to
[TS]
◼
►
lefties model of this button is on the
[TS]
◼
►
left you want the lefty/righty pitch
[TS]
◼
►
macbook pro I won't touch ID and left
[TS]
◼
►
anyway it's mostly silly i think it will
[TS]
◼
►
probably be fine but is another
[TS]
◼
►
maddening case of some people would say
[TS]
◼
►
it's its form over function i think
[TS]
◼
►
that's okay it's a little far I think
[TS]
◼
►
I'll probably still be able to find that
[TS]
◼
►
escape key how the arrow keys bothered
[TS]
◼
►
me more than this but boy I babe I'm i
[TS]
◼
►
am on a slightly different page than
[TS]
◼
►
apples designers when it comes to
[TS]
◼
►
symmetry and ergonomics well and also
[TS]
◼
►
like you will probably want to find it
[TS]
◼
►
but you will probably have to look more
[TS]
◼
►
often and and we don't know yet like in
[TS]
◼
►
practice how often will be a problem
[TS]
◼
►
with all the buttons on the touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
but i would say for the most part I
[TS]
◼
►
think most people who use mac and
[TS]
◼
►
windows windows on all sorts of like
[TS]
◼
►
frequent shortcuts to the f keys like it
[TS]
◼
►
does is the only way to close window
[TS]
◼
►
still alt f4 like it so if we win those
[TS]
◼
►
people might use more often
[TS]
◼
►
Mac people for the most part you're not
[TS]
◼
►
very heavily using almost anything that
[TS]
◼
►
except the Escape key where many people
[TS]
◼
►
and you know we as guess we we often
[TS]
◼
►
minimizer or diminish or underestimate
[TS]
◼
►
everyone else who's not a computer geek
[TS]
◼
►
and their ability to use our computers
[TS]
◼
►
that we think are even even that guy I
[TS]
◼
►
slipped into right anyway sorry about
[TS]
◼
►
that other people who are not geeks many
[TS]
◼
►
of them know that the Escape key often
[TS]
◼
►
performs a cancel shortcut to lots of
[TS]
◼
►
things in the OS fullscreen things
[TS]
◼
►
dialogues really there's so many things
[TS]
◼
►
in using a computer where the Escape key
[TS]
◼
►
is a useful shortcut for literally
[TS]
◼
►
escape cancel or escape what I'm doing
[TS]
◼
►
right and normal people in quotes many
[TS]
◼
►
of them know that this is not like a
[TS]
◼
►
thing that only people who use them use
[TS]
◼
►
like a lot of people know this so this
[TS]
◼
►
is this is not just like a thing that
[TS]
◼
►
annoys geeks like the loss of a of a
[TS]
◼
►
hardware Escape key that you can hit
[TS]
◼
►
without looking because we've all been
[TS]
◼
►
taught to type without looking at the
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard and the more you use keyboards
[TS]
◼
►
just get into the habit of not looking
[TS]
◼
►
at them the the lack of the hardware
[TS]
◼
►
Escape key is actually going to
[TS]
◼
►
inconvenience a lot of people it is not
[TS]
◼
►
now it might be worth it the whole rest
[TS]
◼
►
of the benefit of this thing might end
[TS]
◼
►
up being worth it in the end but I don't
[TS]
◼
►
like when people sit when people
[TS]
◼
►
minimize this is just an earth because
[TS]
◼
►
I think more nerds don't look at the
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard and regular people but I you
[TS]
◼
►
know I i know a lot of people if i gave
[TS]
◼
►
this computer to would be annoyed by the
[TS]
◼
►
fact that escape is not a button but the
[TS]
◼
►
even if they're looking at the key part
[TS]
◼
►
of all time but you know that's I i I'm
[TS]
◼
►
willing to say that the benefit totally
[TS]
◼
►
outweighs that because the features that
[TS]
◼
►
are available on this thing or just
[TS]
◼
►
fantastically better than our growth
[TS]
◼
►
keys and I'm all involved with onboard
[TS]
◼
►
with that it's just like I said like the
[TS]
◼
►
one but the one button that you can feel
[TS]
◼
►
for if such ideas on the right the left
[TS]
◼
►
corner is the easiest place and that
[TS]
◼
►
thing to find and if the touch region
[TS]
◼
►
extended all the way to left that would
[TS]
◼
►
be that would make it almost as easy to
[TS]
◼
►
hit because it's not like you're typing
[TS]
◼
►
the escapee every once in a while you're
[TS]
◼
►
hitting it if you're a normal person
[TS]
◼
►
you're not it's not like the Ikki where
[TS]
◼
►
you're kind of like typing it so the
[TS]
◼
►
fact that it's not a button wouldn't be
[TS]
◼
►
like oh it feels weird when it's not a
[TS]
◼
►
button would be fine if it was over to
[TS]
◼
►
left more by the way the second most
[TS]
◼
►
frequently used button in the top row
[TS]
◼
►
for me on my Apple extended keyboard at
[TS]
◼
►
work and guess what it is
[TS]
◼
►
play pause volume now it's the eject
[TS]
◼
►
button and I don't hit on purpose i hit
[TS]
◼
►
accidentally when i try to hit backspace
[TS]
◼
►
and my CD tray of a mac program sticking
[TS]
◼
►
out like a giant tongue and why do I
[TS]
◼
►
accidentally hit the eject button when
[TS]
◼
►
i'm hitting backspace well i'm not a
[TS]
◼
►
but why do I actually hit the button
[TS]
◼
►
because the top row of keys is jammed
[TS]
◼
►
right up against the number 0 in the
[TS]
◼
►
backspace key is you know why because
[TS]
◼
►
it's just not enough room on my giant
[TS]
◼
►
expansive desk to put an extra five
[TS]
◼
►
millimeters between those two roadies
[TS]
◼
►
even Microsoft has lost the technology
[TS]
◼
►
of separate sets of keys remember the
[TS]
◼
►
original microsoft word on keyboard it
[TS]
◼
►
had the two halves of the keys and then
[TS]
◼
►
have a space and then had the function
[TS]
◼
►
keys and I had a space and had the
[TS]
◼
►
inverted T then it had a space that had
[TS]
◼
►
the numbered look at the one that they
[TS]
◼
►
just introduced recently and your mouse
[TS]
◼
►
is in New Jersey
[TS]
◼
►
I know what I'm just saying like you can
[TS]
◼
►
solve that problem by getting a getting
[TS]
◼
►
rid of America better whatever i'm not
[TS]
◼
►
asking for seven inches of space between
[TS]
◼
►
these regions right but if you look at
[TS]
◼
►
the new microsoft economic keyboard they
[TS]
◼
►
copied Apple down to the half-size
[TS]
◼
►
function keys that are jammed up against
[TS]
◼
►
the numbers like with vertical and they
[TS]
◼
►
huge risks rest on this thing is like a
[TS]
◼
►
7 inch wrist rest and yet they couldn't
[TS]
◼
►
spare five millimeters to put a space
[TS]
◼
►
between the top row functions i couldn't
[TS]
◼
►
make the top of functions these
[TS]
◼
►
full-sized like what do you think we
[TS]
◼
►
have room on your desk or did not think
[TS]
◼
►
we have reminded us because this
[TS]
◼
►
keyboard is huge but all your keys or
[TS]
◼
►
jam together and the numeric keypads
[TS]
◼
►
jammed against it at home end and page
[TS]
◼
►
up page and jam together like I don't
[TS]
◼
►
know who's designing these things are
[TS]
◼
►
what they think is going to like spaces
[TS]
◼
►
between different sets of keys are
[TS]
◼
►
feature being able to feel for the top
[TS]
◼
►
edge of the backspace key is a feature I
[TS]
◼
►
hated that freakin eject button and
[TS]
◼
►
seeing my CD tray eject and I can hit
[TS]
◼
►
without even looking to push back in
[TS]
◼
►
once i get the mechanism start going
[TS]
◼
►
because it was a delight
[TS]
◼
►
like I did it again i have and hold on
[TS]
◼
►
we can use I don't understand what you
[TS]
◼
►
just said you said something about a
[TS]
◼
►
tray in it in it you know what I know I
[TS]
◼
►
know it's hard to understand it's a
[TS]
◼
►
couple of kc oh the cup holder
[TS]
◼
►
oh yeah I miss having one of those i
[TS]
◼
►
mean that that man that's a long time
[TS]
◼
►
ago I and i would say again on a laptop
[TS]
◼
►
could you fit a keyboard on the 15-inch
[TS]
◼
►
macbook pro that has a space between
[TS]
◼
►
number keys and the little strip think
[TS]
◼
►
maybe you would want to in his new
[TS]
◼
►
scenario because it's like a screen and
[TS]
◼
►
you want to be able to reach about
[TS]
◼
►
everything for traditional keyboards
[TS]
◼
►
i think the space is important i think
[TS]
◼
►
having half-size keys up there is dumb i
[TS]
◼
►
think it you know the little strip thing
[TS]
◼
►
is not the full height of the keys
[TS]
◼
►
why not make that little strip to be
[TS]
◼
►
taller than it is maybe it's just the
[TS]
◼
►
right height for the the proportions
[TS]
◼
►
they wanted for the features but a lot
[TS]
◼
►
of times they shall i can in Photoshop
[TS]
◼
►
demo they're showing the history of the
[TS]
◼
►
images but the images were either they
[TS]
◼
►
were either cropped are squished because
[TS]
◼
►
you if you throw them if you show them
[TS]
◼
►
proportionally they'll be really small
[TS]
◼
►
so you want to show more of it but you
[TS]
◼
►
only have with to expand in like why
[TS]
◼
►
isn't the touch bar the height of a
[TS]
◼
►
full-height key right that's enough is
[TS]
◼
►
it just because the keys that is
[TS]
◼
►
replacing or a fight like maybe it's a
[TS]
◼
►
cost concern maybe its power concern i'm
[TS]
◼
►
not entirely sure but lots of decisions
[TS]
◼
►
flow out of this that I don't quite
[TS]
◼
►
understand but as far as keys go
[TS]
◼
►
I liked it better when I had full-size
[TS]
◼
►
keys with different regions separated
[TS]
◼
►
from each other especially on a gigantic
[TS]
◼
►
expansive desktop keyboard responsive
[TS]
◼
►
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ATP thanks to audible for sponsoring our
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if I had to summarize the releases today
[TS]
◼
►
i am on on like the the good side like
[TS]
◼
►
overall this was good and said earlier
[TS]
◼
►
it does not come with it isn't all roses
[TS]
◼
►
like they're there are some like bitter
[TS]
◼
►
pill to swallow here but overall this
[TS]
◼
►
was good and I'm I'm really happy that
[TS]
◼
►
they are still doing things like the
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar even even though like I will
[TS]
◼
►
probably not use one for quite some time
[TS]
◼
►
primarily because I get on working on
[TS]
◼
►
the desktop like and as I mentioned
[TS]
◼
►
earlier I don't expect this to come to
[TS]
◼
►
desktops anytime soon if ever
[TS]
◼
►
and and so this this particular thing
[TS]
◼
►
will probably not impact me day-to-day
[TS]
◼
►
it for a while if ever but they did make
[TS]
◼
►
their laptops better faster newer
[TS]
◼
►
designs thinner lighter like overall
[TS]
◼
►
this was a really good day for mac
[TS]
◼
►
laptops it was just not a day for mac
[TS]
◼
►
desktops or for anybody who cares about
[TS]
◼
►
money which is a lot of people i had
[TS]
◼
►
some lighter things on the the touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
before I move on from that topic sure is
[TS]
◼
►
your credit to people on twitter so i
[TS]
◼
►
was talking about you know when i was
[TS]
◼
►
doing my cranky tweets about the
[TS]
◼
►
symmetrical space on the size of the
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar like asking you know can
[TS]
◼
►
anyone guess why that space is like I
[TS]
◼
►
posted a picture from the Apple human
[TS]
◼
►
interface guidelines that emphasizes the
[TS]
◼
►
fact that the margins are identical on
[TS]
◼
►
both sides of it as a into the people
[TS]
◼
►
who are listening to the show and dave
[TS]
◼
►
liebman had a good answer as to why the
[TS]
◼
►
Escape key is not up against left margin
[TS]
◼
►
that's the space taken up by the
[TS]
◼
►
oh it's not that but you couldn't put
[TS]
◼
►
them on Jack we had me now we have to
[TS]
◼
►
come we had to fit in and you know
[TS]
◼
►
that's the headphone jack is right under
[TS]
◼
►
and then I also tweeted that we should
[TS]
◼
►
start the countdown to touch bar games
[TS]
◼
►
because you know if because it's the mac
[TS]
◼
►
and we don't have to send into the mac
[TS]
◼
►
app store and this thing does have an
[TS]
◼
►
API you can make a touch bar game i'm
[TS]
◼
►
sure of some fashion how responsive it
[TS]
◼
►
can be i don't know because I don't it's
[TS]
◼
►
not like you're you know i think is it
[TS]
◼
►
is how to remove without a separate t1
[TS]
◼
►
chip over there but it would be fun to
[TS]
◼
►
try to have tried to do something cool
[TS]
◼
►
and here are the best entries for
[TS]
◼
►
potential touch bar games richard gale
[TS]
◼
►
so just punch the monkey which is a joke
[TS]
◼
►
that only be nice
[TS]
◼
►
and then in the nineties will get
[TS]
◼
►
because that was a banner ad with the
[TS]
◼
►
monkey and he moved mostly horizontal
[TS]
◼
►
because there wasn't much room to go to
[TS]
◼
►
punch the monkey is the right thing and
[TS]
◼
►
Benjamin looking wins the idea for touch
[TS]
◼
►
bar game which he calls really boring
[TS]
◼
►
snake snake by the way for all over
[TS]
◼
►
younger people is a game that was
[TS]
◼
►
popular on cell phones back when the
[TS]
◼
►
only games they could play was having a
[TS]
◼
►
Lenny I can't explain snake if you don't
[TS]
◼
►
get the joke trust me it's very funny it
[TS]
◼
►
was called nibble and qbasic back in the
[TS]
◼
►
mm remember really boring snake he
[TS]
◼
►
should copyright is capital R capital B
[TS]
◼
►
capital s TM the game that you can make
[TS]
◼
►
Margo I honestly the the gaming things
[TS]
◼
►
might be I saw James Thompson of peacock
[TS]
◼
►
Fame talking earlier about the US
[TS]
◼
►
Attorney sdk awesome news that their
[TS]
◼
►
parent there appears to be a simulator
[TS]
◼
►
for building apps for so you don't need
[TS]
◼
►
to have the hardware yet but it also
[TS]
◼
►
appears that you only have access to it
[TS]
◼
►
when your app is active
[TS]
◼
►
so if you were to make a a touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
game you might have to always have a
[TS]
◼
►
window on screen the user keeps active
[TS]
◼
►
for your gift to keep showing up in the
[TS]
◼
►
yeah i know it again at the macro see
[TS]
◼
►
what kind of hacks people can do it but
[TS]
◼
►
like and you mentioned before that the
[TS]
◼
►
addressable market for touching our
[TS]
◼
►
things going to be small and I think
[TS]
◼
►
that would be more of a problem if the
[TS]
◼
►
touch bar wasn't so damn cool
[TS]
◼
►
uh yeah and and it probably seems like
[TS]
◼
►
it and it's also seems like it's easy to
[TS]
◼
►
do something down there it's just so
[TS]
◼
►
cool and it's in the simulator and i
[TS]
◼
►
expect to see a lot of applications
[TS]
◼
►
doing possibly inadvisable things with
[TS]
◼
►
the touch bar but it's just to have
[TS]
◼
►
another place that I you know to have a
[TS]
◼
►
place next to the keyboard that's
[TS]
◼
►
configurable that you can do stuff in it
[TS]
◼
►
will be exciting for developers to just
[TS]
◼
►
try something especially if it's fairly
[TS]
◼
►
straightforward implement it seems like
[TS]
◼
►
the classes they have for this type of
[TS]
◼
►
stuff that a scrubber and all the stuff
[TS]
◼
►
in the whole API seems pretty well
[TS]
◼
►
thought out and well designed it won't
[TS]
◼
►
be that hard to get something up there
[TS]
◼
►
even if it's just a bunch of buttons and
[TS]
◼
►
stuff and the Apple apps are really
[TS]
◼
►
showing the way with like we're not just
[TS]
◼
►
putting a bunch of configurable buttons
[TS]
◼
►
like Casey with you know case you're
[TS]
◼
►
saying before they all just a bunch of
[TS]
◼
►
buttons to change based on the context
[TS]
◼
►
they've got you know I mean it's obvious
[TS]
◼
►
lots of horizontal stuff but timelines
[TS]
◼
►
thumbnails lots of interfaces it seemed
[TS]
◼
►
pretty responsive in that you could do
[TS]
◼
►
things on this little tiny iOS control
[TS]
◼
►
computer that would cause changes on the
[TS]
◼
►
big mac computer a couple inches away in
[TS]
◼
►
a fairly responsive fashion making it so
[TS]
◼
►
you can do things without taking your
[TS]
◼
►
hands off the keyboard or you know doing
[TS]
◼
►
things two hands at once with one on the
[TS]
◼
►
touch part 1 the trackpad i found that
[TS]
◼
►
demonstration pretty compelling and I
[TS]
◼
►
think even though such a small number of
[TS]
◼
►
people relative to the rest of the mac
[TS]
◼
►
users are going to have this developers
[TS]
◼
►
will add this feature because it's cool
[TS]
◼
►
I i love the idea of this like amazing
[TS]
◼
►
like high-end dual-core supercomputer
[TS]
◼
►
sitting there mostly idle as you play a
[TS]
◼
►
game on this little 30 pixels tall strip
[TS]
◼
►
the whole screens like they're lit up
[TS]
◼
►
the whole computers on doing nothing but
[TS]
◼
►
it's it they're playing the game on this
[TS]
◼
►
little watch processors little space it
[TS]
◼
►
could be an inversion of like the old
[TS]
◼
►
like the top part will be just like the
[TS]
◼
►
the status display that shows your
[TS]
◼
►
inventory and the whole game is better
[TS]
◼
►
up on the bottom lots of infinite runner
[TS]
◼
►
runners are potentially good i I don't
[TS]
◼
►
know how much control you have there but
[TS]
◼
►
because it is a little computer doing
[TS]
◼
►
that I wonder if you can somehow get
[TS]
◼
►
code onto it for it to run i'm not sure
[TS]
◼
►
what the whole deal is it
[TS]
◼
►
it seems to be communicating at removed
[TS]
◼
►
from the rest of the mac system but
[TS]
◼
►
there is code running there to run the
[TS]
◼
►
display and if you can get your code
[TS]
◼
►
onto the t1 or onto whatever the t1 does
[TS]
◼
►
and get it run to run from there that
[TS]
◼
►
will be where your your fun at the very
[TS]
◼
►
least you should probably go to do pong
[TS]
◼
►
or something right or or really boring
[TS]
◼
►
snake and i would like to the the other
[TS]
◼
►
things as far as there's already Apple
[TS]
◼
►
human interface guidelines for it i
[TS]
◼
►
briefly looked at them and I remember
[TS]
◼
►
reading in like all this all seems
[TS]
◼
►
sensible and good ideas but one of the
[TS]
◼
►
items maybe think that Apple has
[TS]
◼
►
actually done a demo that was countered
[TS]
◼
►
to its me to see if I can find out about
[TS]
◼
►
like well that's that's not it
[TS]
◼
►
oh yeah apple doesn't always follow the
[TS]
◼
►
egg and following the end of it is not a
[TS]
◼
►
bible that has to be followed to the
[TS]
◼
►
letter it so now they've got it didn't
[TS]
◼
►
the one that was confusing me there
[TS]
◼
►
there within the bounds of things to
[TS]
◼
►
avoid mirroring the touch bar
[TS]
◼
►
interactions on the main screen but they
[TS]
◼
►
mean that the example to give it the
[TS]
◼
►
user taps about in touch bar is
[TS]
◼
►
presented with listed options don't also
[TS]
◼
►
present the same options on the main
[TS]
◼
►
screen what they demoed was for example
[TS]
◼
►
in photos when you're messing with like
[TS]
◼
►
the exposure slider they it rather than
[TS]
◼
►
just you messing with the exposure
[TS]
◼
►
slider on the touch bar and seeing the
[TS]
◼
►
John the full screen image when you go
[TS]
◼
►
into edit mode the Photos app also goes
[TS]
◼
►
into edit mode and when you drag the
[TS]
◼
►
exposure slider the exposures lighter is
[TS]
◼
►
visible on the main screen as well and
[TS]
◼
►
it drags in it you know the same time as
[TS]
◼
►
you're dragging your thing now that's
[TS]
◼
►
arguably not the same as presenting
[TS]
◼
►
delicious options in both places but it
[TS]
◼
►
isn't kind of mirroring the controls
[TS]
◼
►
like a look at my my changing exposure
[TS]
◼
►
in the sidebar photos are my changing
[TS]
◼
►
exposure on the on the touch bar and
[TS]
◼
►
it's kind of weird to have it in both
[TS]
◼
►
places like the advantage should be as
[TS]
◼
►
they showed in a couple other demos if
[TS]
◼
►
I'm using touch bar that means those
[TS]
◼
►
controls don't have to be on the screen
[TS]
◼
►
like this the whole point of the touch
[TS]
◼
►
bar i have them down here some more of
[TS]
◼
►
the screen can be used to show me the
[TS]
◼
►
content but maybe just because photos
[TS]
◼
►
hasn't been updated to do that and the
[TS]
◼
►
only way to be in edit mode is to have
[TS]
◼
►
that view visible I don't know but
[TS]
◼
►
anyway well we'll put this link and you
[TS]
◼
►
get and you can check it out it's short
[TS]
◼
►
it's one page and it's an interesting
[TS]
◼
►
insight into how Apple expects the Dutch
[TS]
◼
►
part can be used by developers write
[TS]
◼
►
anything else worth talking about
[TS]
◼
►
next we haven't talked about the max ram
[TS]
◼
►
16 gigs Mac ram on a four thousand
[TS]
◼
►
dollars that's okay
[TS]
◼
►
yeah we're gonna do you got to say now
[TS]
◼
►
on that one like 16 gigs that you know
[TS]
◼
►
standard on the 15-inch fine i can
[TS]
◼
►
almost kind of forgive eight gigs on the
[TS]
◼
►
13 maybe maybe not but all 13 pro is
[TS]
◼
►
increasingly less pro haven't talked
[TS]
◼
►
about that but uh 16 gigs maximum on the
[TS]
◼
►
big one not not a good choice not a good
[TS]
◼
►
choice at all especially since it's such
[TS]
◼
►
a powerful machine compared to the
[TS]
◼
►
previous one like to have the same
[TS]
◼
►
maximum but if you are going to run any
[TS]
◼
►
vm those are going to end up your memory
[TS]
◼
►
and if you're going to be doing all
[TS]
◼
►
these fancy things that you can do on
[TS]
◼
►
this this new computer with hi-res
[TS]
◼
►
images and video 16 gigs of ram max is
[TS]
◼
►
well I mean look let's be honest here I
[TS]
◼
►
mean like I see people on Twitter and
[TS]
◼
►
stop complaining like how could a pro
[TS]
◼
►
machine not have this or have this
[TS]
◼
►
whatever else apples use of the word pro
[TS]
◼
►
is primarily about size and price target
[TS]
◼
►
it it does not have to do with whether
[TS]
◼
►
professionals whatever that means
[TS]
◼
►
however you define that are able to use
[TS]
◼
►
this computer for what they need or
[TS]
◼
►
whether it's designed for them or not
[TS]
◼
►
pro means it's the big expensive one
[TS]
◼
►
period so the fact that pros often need
[TS]
◼
►
more than 16 gigs of ram does not seem
[TS]
◼
►
to enter apples thoughts about you know
[TS]
◼
►
power whether to make that option with
[TS]
◼
►
option available or not here I think it
[TS]
◼
►
enters their thoughts that just one more
[TS]
◼
►
battery to do it probably and that's
[TS]
◼
►
where the sticking points i'm assuming I
[TS]
◼
►
mean ram does use battery power and and
[TS]
◼
►
not a small amount of it but compared to
[TS]
◼
►
everything else in there i mean the
[TS]
◼
►
15-inch has a 45 watt cpu next 235 lat
[TS]
◼
►
GPU and and by the way one of the things
[TS]
◼
►
that makes me sad about the new 15-inch
[TS]
◼
►
is that I was always a fan of buying the
[TS]
◼
►
low-end 15 a configuration that only had
[TS]
◼
►
the intel integrated GPU which wich that
[TS]
◼
►
option has been available now for quite
[TS]
◼
►
some time i think since around twenty
[TS]
◼
►
ten or so where it used to be
[TS]
◼
►
first it was just always discreet and
[TS]
◼
►
then eventually they they had these dual
[TS]
◼
►
GPU models around 2008-2009 or something
[TS]
◼
►
like that where they would have this one
[TS]
◼
►
they had the high-power discrete GPU and
[TS]
◼
►
they would also have the Intel
[TS]
◼
►
integrated GPU and then it would switch
[TS]
◼
►
between them based on and we know
[TS]
◼
►
whether anything was running the needed
[TS]
◼
►
more power of the big one and and the
[TS]
◼
►
switching not only not only just having
[TS]
◼
►
two GPUs and having a high-powered when
[TS]
◼
►
they're in the first place
[TS]
◼
►
not only does that raise the power
[TS]
◼
►
requirement when that GPU is active and
[TS]
◼
►
every the ceiling of how high the power
[TS]
◼
►
consumption can get if it's under load
[TS]
◼
►
but also there were often bugs switching
[TS]
◼
►
between those two gpus it that's not an
[TS]
◼
►
easy task and the mac switch between
[TS]
◼
►
would often have weird issues and
[TS]
◼
►
they're they're like why of visual
[TS]
◼
►
glitches both gpus staying active using
[TS]
◼
►
occasionally even blue screens also the
[TS]
◼
►
other problem is that having another big
[TS]
◼
►
hot chip on the logic board will
[TS]
◼
►
actually significantly raises the
[TS]
◼
►
failure rates and many people there i
[TS]
◼
►
think there have even been class actions
[TS]
◼
►
against an extended service programs and
[TS]
◼
►
everything we're often a 15-inch macbook
[TS]
◼
►
pro will have a big problem with the GPU
[TS]
◼
►
failing after my time is really just the
[TS]
◼
►
additional heat and stress in the board
[TS]
◼
►
and everything like they were big
[TS]
◼
►
problems video back in the day and and
[TS]
◼
►
these problems i don't know if there's
[TS]
◼
►
any recent ones but it is basically
[TS]
◼
►
there's enough of a downside to having a
[TS]
◼
►
to having the discrete GPU in the
[TS]
◼
►
15-inch both in in battery and heat in
[TS]
◼
►
possible bugs and possible failures down
[TS]
◼
►
that I've always favor the option
[TS]
◼
►
because I'm i am neither a gamer nor do
[TS]
◼
►
i use external monitors with my 15
[TS]
◼
►
inches like I just use it as itself when
[TS]
◼
►
I've always been a fan of of buying the
[TS]
◼
►
Intel only GPU version and for whatever
[TS]
◼
►
reason that version that option is gone
[TS]
◼
►
now you can only buy it with the AMD one
[TS]
◼
►
and somebody on Twitter told me earlier
[TS]
◼
►
i don't know if this is true and
[TS]
◼
►
somebody said that the the newest
[TS]
◼
►
version of the intel integrated GPU that
[TS]
◼
►
would be in this is actually slower than
[TS]
◼
►
the previous one so that might be the
[TS]
◼
►
reason Apple might have a legitimate
[TS]
◼
►
reason for getting rid of adoption but
[TS]
◼
►
what about what about the fact that it
[TS]
◼
►
can drive to 5k displays I don't suspect
[TS]
◼
►
was gonna mention that like there's
[TS]
◼
►
there there's some big advantages to
[TS]
◼
►
this and you lose the prostatic
[TS]
◼
►
Markowitz the wannabes like I don't need
[TS]
◼
►
to drive to find creative ways but i
[TS]
◼
►
think all these reasons the one that is
[TS]
◼
►
common to tell them in the both the
[TS]
◼
►
memory and the GPU is uniformity if you
[TS]
◼
►
just have one model it always comes with
[TS]
◼
►
16 gigs always come to the GPU that's
[TS]
◼
►
another cost savings that's another
[TS]
◼
►
resource and investment thing how many
[TS]
◼
►
different SKUs do you want to have how
[TS]
◼
►
many different varieties do you want to
[TS]
◼
►
have the rama soldered to the board if
[TS]
◼
►
we have one with more RAM it's more of a
[TS]
◼
►
pain like do you want to have on with
[TS]
◼
►
and without discrete GPU just do the one
[TS]
◼
►
discrete GPU because the one without you
[TS]
◼
►
know the integrated ones crapping you
[TS]
◼
►
can't drive the monitors and then how do
[TS]
◼
►
you have for Thunderbolt three ports and
[TS]
◼
►
everything you know so I there's a lot
[TS]
◼
►
of reasons I can think of for for both
[TS]
◼
►
of these choices but I have more faith
[TS]
◼
►
in marco then in the discrete GPU simply
[TS]
◼
►
because this one is 40 nanometers which
[TS]
◼
►
is got to help with the heat and
[TS]
◼
►
everything and I'm hoping that they have
[TS]
◼
►
mostly worked out the kinks of the GPU
[TS]
◼
►
switching if they can do it power wise
[TS]
◼
►
it might be easier just to always use
[TS]
◼
►
the discrete one that would probably be
[TS]
◼
►
slaughtered your battery but that would
[TS]
◼
►
be good from a bug perspective i know a
[TS]
◼
►
lot of people use what was that thing
[TS]
◼
►
called Marco the little menu bar that is
[TS]
◼
►
a graphics card status by Cody Krieger
[TS]
◼
►
yeah that's right yeah there was a
[TS]
◼
►
utility where you could say you could
[TS]
◼
►
make it use one GP with the other and
[TS]
◼
►
one possible solution to bugs like
[TS]
◼
►
lugging your laptop and just make it
[TS]
◼
►
only use discrete GPU and then going to
[TS]
◼
►
worry about it well but even even that
[TS]
◼
►
was controversial because like even that
[TS]
◼
►
one like it could force the discrete GPU
[TS]
◼
►
to be on but it couldn't force the
[TS]
◼
►
creepy to be all
[TS]
◼
►
because be like under certain models
[TS]
◼
►
like it would it would tell that that
[TS]
◼
►
that utility that it wasn't that was it
[TS]
◼
►
was integrated only but it's still
[TS]
◼
►
running it would still run the discrete
[TS]
◼
►
one anyway and it was it basically like
[TS]
◼
►
you can never count on it to only use
[TS]
◼
►
the integrated one you could as you said
[TS]
◼
►
you could count always discreet but then
[TS]
◼
►
you're losing a lot of battery life and
[TS]
◼
►
making more heat to get that because you
[TS]
◼
►
know the GPUs are very complicated GPU
[TS]
◼
►
and I pop these days like a good one is
[TS]
◼
►
almost or equally or even more
[TS]
◼
►
complicated and heat demanding and
[TS]
◼
►
battery demanding than a cpu so you know
[TS]
◼
►
like that said that's 35 what GPU in
[TS]
◼
►
there next to a 45 watt cpu that's a lot
[TS]
◼
►
of extra power there so if you don't
[TS]
◼
►
need it and you know again the document
[TS]
◼
►
does the definition of pro there are
[TS]
◼
►
lots of types of pro work that don't
[TS]
◼
►
need GPU power I have never really
[TS]
◼
►
needed my sheep our what I do I'm a pro
[TS]
◼
►
tip doesn't mean she's a pro like lots
[TS]
◼
►
of John but you don't need except for
[TS]
◼
►
games but on your computer but you don't
[TS]
◼
►
are you ready you don't need a graphics
[TS]
◼
►
card power Casey do you need a good
[TS]
◼
►
graphics card on your computer or your
[TS]
◼
►
home one for that matter
[TS]
◼
►
no but I think you're pretty giving a
[TS]
◼
►
pretty narrow different definition of
[TS]
◼
►
pro pro to you as someone who does the
[TS]
◼
►
sorts of things that you or your family
[TS]
◼
►
do and there's a lot of other flavors of
[TS]
◼
►
pro that might necessitate that GPU and
[TS]
◼
►
since I have the floor i will say that
[TS]
◼
►
the only time I ever had problems with
[TS]
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my 2011 to my 2 2011 macbook pros each
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with each of which had discreet cpu GPU
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is the only time I ever had any sort of
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glitches or issues was when i was
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running graphics card status when i was
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just using OS 10 or you know Mac OS now
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out-of-the-box I never had an issue
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except I could not agree with you more
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Marco that battery life just was
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slaughtered when the discrete GPUs on
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completely agree there but in terms of
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like glitches and stuff like that
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I never had any of those problems as
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soon as I stopped talking about graphics
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card status that since I stopped rolling
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graphics card status i would always by
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vitac choice and they had everything I
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would always buy the one with the
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discrete GPU anyway later game with all
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the bugs I even not just because of the
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game just because it's like look if
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you're buying the pro you just it's
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gonna be the biggest the hottest the you
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and like i said i think i have i have
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faith i like the fact that were not in
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the bad old days with the GPUs to be
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done on a word processing the cpu GPU is
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40 nanometers it is on actually it is
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actually the current architecture the
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AMD is a has out right now I think it's
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the current polaris instead of being
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like three or four generations behind
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like the embarrassing g it's not it's
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not the superfast some people are asking
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is this like a gaming laptop no it is
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not like this is not this is not the
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best cpu you can get in a laptop by a
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long stretch of the imagination but
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compared to what we had before like
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that's what they could put up the slide
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look it's a hundred percent faster it's
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like yeah because those ones were
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ancient and this one is contemporary
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middle-of-the-road you know probably not
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as clocked as high not the best of the
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you know me but I like gpus I would
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always buy the one with the bigger GPU
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my laptop is going to be plugged in at
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work all the time anyway but it's it's
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good for it would be nice you know again
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options how many skills you have how
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many options do you have
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market would like one that has a big
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screen but doesn't have discrete GPU
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they don't make that product i think
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mostly because of uniformity make one of
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these computers were like one of those
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who make one of those they did until
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today I know actually a pretty little
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yeah you might be what you might be able
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to stop by the old one because why would
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they stop selling it
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yeah but any basically so besides that I
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mean the 1500 ultimately the 15-second
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incredible update i I'm a little
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concerned about real-world battery use
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here I i I'm very very interested to see
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the reviews come out and to see people's
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experiences with these things as they
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come out because one of the problems
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that i've always had that I've had
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recently with a lot of the as i
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mentioned before a lot of the games
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we've made a battery life it recently in
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you know probably last five years at
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least has really been in reducing the
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the idle power levels of these chips and
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of computers basically reducing the
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amount of power that computers use when
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you're when you're using them very
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lightly for things like email and web
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browsing but as soon as you do anything
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that really strains them like many pro
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types of applications or running chrome
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then the battery life dropped
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tremendously like it like you might get
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10 hours if you're doing light web
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browsing but for hours if you're
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actually pushing it a little hard or two
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hours to be pushing it to the max and
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huge differences in in like a better
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life under under light loads and better
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life under moderate to heavy loads with
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this guy i fear that we're going more in
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that direction because you just look at
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the specs and you have these these big
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hot chips in there and the one that
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doesn't go in this direction that I'm
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very very interested in is the new
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macbook escape because that one I think
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we need to talk about so the macbook
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escape the new 13-inch low and one with
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the real FM keys is the one that I have
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pre-ordered or ordered I guess that it's
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gonna ride next week that the reason why
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is because as far as i can tell so
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here's here's the weird thing about this
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computer APPL quotes all three of these
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new macbook pros the macbook escape the
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new 13 with the touch bar and new
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15-minute x-bar they quote all three of
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them as having 10 hour battery life and
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if you look at what hardware is in them
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that doesn't quite make sense now the 15
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of course the victim is a bigger battery
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that makes sense though you know it has
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much more power hungry components in it
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but it has a bigger battery you can kind
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of see that the 13 right 13 with touch
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bar and the 15 touch bar having very
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different components very different
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battery sizes can be made him to have
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the same battery life but the macbook
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escape has effectively the macbook air
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guts in it it has the macbook air
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processor which uses half the power of
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13 inch it has no notice of us look
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basically compared to the other 13 inch
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with the touch bar it has a processor
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that uses half the power max load it
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doesn't have the touch bar and whatever
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power it takes to drive the touch bar
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and it has ten percent larger battery
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capacity and it's quoted the same
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battery life that makes no sense to me
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my best guess here is that the 13-inch
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macbook escape gets substantially better
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►
battery life than the 13-inch macbook
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►
with touch bar but Apple probably didn't
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want to trumpet that at the low end one
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gets the best battery life in the whole
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lineup of these new things because that
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might discourage people from buying the
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►
new touch bar and by the way on this on
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the 13-inch model I'm kind of surprised
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►
that Apple emphasize this they're saying
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it's the you know it's smaller than the
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air and has less volume in the air
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this is kind of the amazing futuristic
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►
computer either 12 or 13 inch one that
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the escape or the regular touch bar that
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I always wanted the air to be and they
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finally made it because I've always been
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cranky about the wedge shape like what
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do you what you know why you saying that
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space while you're scalping your
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batteries like the potatoes just making
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the same active and then it's not going
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to fit more battery in and they did it
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they finally did it
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this is a mac that is not thinner one of
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the other for aesthetic reasons which
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means they can fit more battery into it
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►
which means it probably gets really good
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battery life for the powerful internals
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it's got two ports instead of one there
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Thunderbolt three right that's wonderful
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►
three on that right and then not
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►
remembering that's right the Thunderbolt
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►
three like this is a hell of a laptop
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and it makes me you know it's it's bad
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►
for his best most people that is 500
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►
also more expensive but I feel like it
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justifies that price by actually having
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►
modern technology in it and being being
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the same things all the way across and
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having better battery life and like that
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i don't think i would have gotten the
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escape one because I think touch bars
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too compelling it's like you're going to
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buy one is like the iphone and you're
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gonna buy one you get black and i'll get
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jack black is the new thing
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yeah uh but mark was making a bet on the
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battery life the specs seem to bear out
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your theory that it will have better
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►
battery life but don't you wanna play
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what are you gonna do you do with this
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we'll see here's here's exactly the
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thing I if you are the kind of person
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listener if you use your laptop as your
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primary computer get the touch bar
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►
because you're right that is the new
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►
thing that might be the future pro apple
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►
will will wedge into the future with her
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►
but we're not so that will become the
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►
future it's gonna be great it's gonna be
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►
awesome and that'll be a new cool thing
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►
to use and play with it and to probably
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►
improve your productivity at least
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►
sometimes it's not all the time so if
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you're your laptop is your primary
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►
computer get the touch bar but that's
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►
it's not my primary computer my primary
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►
computer is my imac and hopefully next
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►
year another mac pro I get all my work
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►
done almost all the time
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►
a desktop so I'm not really going to get
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►
into the touch bar lifestyle and it's
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never going to be a thing that really
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►
no that really gets get yourself into my
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►
workflow until i can use it on a desktop
[TS]
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►
and a tension that might be never so
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►
right now what I do want out of a laptop
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►
is I would like one that is small and
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►
light and by the way just to put into
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►
perspective how small and light these
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►
new laptops are the new 13-inch macbook
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►
escape and the new 13-inch macbook are
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►
both as a as light as the 13-inch
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►
macbook air always has been the 15-inch
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►
is four pounds now that is substantially
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►
lighter than the 13 inch plastic
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►
macbooks were those were I think they're
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►
a five-point or five and a half i looked
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►
it up before the show and I forgot they
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►
might be in the four-and-a-half but
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►
regardless this is the the new 15-inch
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is lighter than the plastic macbook was
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►
and that was the small my computer of
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►
its day and that day was not that long
[TS]
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►
ago so that's impressive
[TS]
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►
so the reason to not get a 15-inch if
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you're if you're weighing the the pros
[TS]
◼
►
and cons here the reasons to get a 15
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►
inch or not should not have to do with
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►
the weight by itself footprint might
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►
cost of course is a thing all the cost
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►
difference once respect up is actually
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►
not that big kind of embarrassing so not
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►
that pic better causes is one thing
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►
footprint is one thing but it's only
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►
four pounds the 13-inch MacBook Airs
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►
three pounds and so that's really
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►
awesome like that's a really lightweight
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►
computer for what you're getting for
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that price but anyway i'm trying out the
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