The Incomparable

00:00:00 ◼   ► the incontrovertible number 267 October [TS]

00:00:10 ◼   ► welcome back everybody to the [TS]

00:00:12 ◼   ► incomparable i'm your host Jason L we [TS]

00:00:13 ◼   ► are reconvening our book club this [TS]

00:00:16 ◼   ► episode we're going to be talking about [TS]

00:00:18 ◼   ► two books one by paolo bacigalupi it's [TS]

00:00:23 ◼   ► called the water knife and another final [TS]

00:00:26 ◼   ► Stephenson which is called seven Eve's [TS]

00:00:28 ◼   ► these are authors we've talked about [TS]

00:00:30 ◼   ► before in previous episodes you can look [TS]

00:00:32 ◼   ► at poor in the show notes perhaps if i'm [TS]

00:00:34 ◼   ► not too lazy to talk about these two [TS]

00:00:36 ◼   ► novels of the of a science-fiction [TS]

00:00:38 ◼   ► nature i have four human beings who are [TS]

00:00:43 ◼   ► not robots that we know Lisa Schmeisser [TS]

00:00:46 ◼   ► not a robot hi Lisa [TS]

00:00:48 ◼   ► hi how are you I'm doing fine and I'm [TS]

00:00:50 ◼   ► doing fine [TS]

00:00:51 ◼   ► David jail or probably not a mandroid [TS]

00:00:54 ◼   ► possibly possibly that's awesome [TS]

00:00:57 ◼   ► serenity Caldwell good dad good to hear [TS]

00:01:00 ◼   ► your voice your human voice yes I am NOT [TS]

00:01:03 ◼   ► a robot more than I don't believe you [TS]

00:01:06 ◼   ► and the the most of all of the creatures [TS]

00:01:09 ◼   ► I've met in my travels his is the most [TS]

00:01:11 ◼   ► human it is Scott McNulty hello hello [TS]

00:01:16 ◼   ► thanks i got your Star Trek reference in [TS]

00:01:21 ◼   ► there i hope you can appreciate that [TS]

00:01:23 ◼   ► yes I was gonna do the robot voice but [TS]

00:01:25 ◼   ► then rendered it and I was like well I [TS]

00:01:26 ◼   ► don't need to do it now it's always [TS]

00:01:29 ◼   ► being left both of these books are about [TS]

00:01:30 ◼   ► robots nope they're not at all not even [TS]

00:01:32 ◼   ► a little [TS]

00:01:33 ◼   ► they're not even there are a lot of [TS]

00:01:36 ◼   ► robot 30 well there are main room bar or [TS]

00:01:38 ◼   ► not they're not like sent you not think [TS]

00:01:41 ◼   ► yeah then I me Ryan Lee Johnston [TS]

00:01:44 ◼   ► syracuse would probably say that they're [TS]

00:01:46 ◼   ► not robots that is a different podcast [TS]

00:01:49 ◼   ► all right we should start with the water [TS]

00:01:51 ◼   ► knife i think i would like to start [TS]

00:01:53 ◼   ► there and then and then we will whatever [TS]

00:01:55 ◼   ► time we have left will be devoted to the [TS]

00:01:56 ◼   ► eighty thousand pages of the latest you [TS]

00:01:58 ◼   ► know steve is a novel is certain is that [TS]

00:02:01 ◼   ► first third so the water knife is a is a [TS]

00:02:06 ◼   ► shorter book than 70 use i'm told that [TS]

00:02:09 ◼   ► the hard lately is about 370 pages long [TS]

00:02:11 ◼   ► I right yeah Kendall Paul bacigalupi [TS]

00:02:14 ◼   ► we've talked about him before he wrote [TS]

00:02:15 ◼   ► the windup girl which I thought was [TS]

00:02:17 ◼   ► really excellent he wrote a couple of [TS]

00:02:19 ◼   ► really good albeit depressing why a [TS]

00:02:21 ◼   ► novel that we talked about Scott and I [TS]

00:02:23 ◼   ► think maybe we talked about those we did [TS]

00:02:26 ◼   ► the agency together on an episode and [TS]

00:02:29 ◼   ► now I had I had to miss an episode that [TS]

00:02:30 ◼   ► was traveling I was so bummed [TS]

00:02:32 ◼   ► yeah so should bring her in the ground [TS]

00:02:33 ◼   ► cities both III really highly recommend [TS]

00:02:35 ◼   ► ship breaker and and John cities is just [TS]

00:02:38 ◼   ► more depressing but also good just [TS]

00:02:40 ◼   ► depressing very good so yeah so I'm as [TS]

00:02:42 ◼   ► somebody who is a resident of california [TS]

00:02:44 ◼   ► i can tell you especially the water [TS]

00:02:46 ◼   ► knife for portrays a future in which the [TS]

00:02:50 ◼   ► desert southwest of the United States is [TS]

00:02:52 ◼   ► a horribly short on water water has [TS]

00:02:56 ◼   ► become incredibly valuable and [TS]

00:02:58 ◼   ► essentially the US government has [TS]

00:03:00 ◼   ► abdicated a lot of their [TS]

00:03:01 ◼   ► responsibilities over the border [TS]

00:03:03 ◼   ► disputes between the various powers in [TS]

00:03:06 ◼   ► the region that there is a there there [TS]

00:03:08 ◼   ► you know there still is a US government [TS]

00:03:10 ◼   ► and all of that but they're kind of not [TS]

00:03:12 ◼   ► going to get involved in nevada and [TS]

00:03:14 ◼   ► california and arizona and and other [TS]

00:03:17 ◼   ► parts of the Southwest squabbling over [TS]

00:03:20 ◼   ► who gets the water rights and who has [TS]

00:03:23 ◼   ► water and who is going with and what [TS]

00:03:24 ◼   ► cities are going to essentially shut [TS]

00:03:26 ◼   ► down and crumble into dust because they [TS]

00:03:28 ◼   ► don't have enough water and that is the [TS]

00:03:30 ◼   ► that is the the backdrop for the water [TS]

00:03:33 ◼   ► knife power but you're loopy is notable [TS]

00:03:34 ◼   ► for writing about about econ ecology and [TS]

00:03:38 ◼   ► Atmospheric stuff and and climate change [TS]

00:03:41 ◼   ► and stuff like that it's a UH the the [TS]

00:03:44 ◼   ► what-is-it the windup girl takes place [TS]

00:03:47 ◼   ► in a in a mostly drowned Southeast Asia [TS]

00:03:51 ◼   ► with some dykes and stuff and it's a [TS]

00:03:54 ◼   ► similar kind of situation in the in [TS]

00:03:57 ◼   ► those two why a book set in a in a kind [TS]

00:04:00 ◼   ► of post sealevel rise dystopia this is a [TS]

00:04:03 ◼   ► different world [TS]

00:04:04 ◼   ► it's not about sea level rise here but [TS]

00:04:07 ◼   ► it is still about climate change i've [TS]

00:04:08 ◼   ► heard people refer to this as Clive I [TS]

00:04:10 ◼   ► which I do not like do not [TS]

00:04:13 ◼   ► let's let's never say that again i just [TS]

00:04:15 ◼   ► i'm putting it out there and then we're [TS]

00:04:17 ◼   ► going to be to death and it will never [TS]

00:04:19 ◼   ► escape so and I assume this backdrop is [TS]

00:04:22 ◼   ► a story about a guy who is working for [TS]

00:04:25 ◼   ► the head of the water agency in Las [TS]

00:04:27 ◼   ► Vegas he is the titular water knife [TS]

00:04:30 ◼   ► he's basically a thug an assassin in the [TS]

00:04:33 ◼   ► employ of the water agency and then [TS]

00:04:36 ◼   ► there's also a plucky reporter named [TS]

00:04:38 ◼   ► Lucy Monroe who who has sort of [TS]

00:04:42 ◼   ► accidentally found herself in phoenix as [TS]

00:04:44 ◼   ► its in its death throes and and then [TS]

00:04:47 ◼   ► they they may meet along with uh refugee [TS]

00:04:50 ◼   ► from Texas because Texas is basically [TS]

00:04:52 ◼   ► following entirely apart [TS]

00:04:54 ◼   ► Maria and and they fight crime know that [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► doesn't happen but this is the this is [TS]

00:05:00 ◼   ► this is your story it is the water knife [TS]

00:05:02 ◼   ► it's all about the terrible things that [TS]

00:05:05 ◼   ► happen in phoenix arizona AZ it's [TS]

00:05:07 ◼   ► basically falling apart because it has [TS]

00:05:09 ◼   ► no water that's my summary of the water [TS]

00:05:12 ◼   ► knife what people think of this one [TS]

00:05:15 ◼   ► Lisa you're a resident of California [TS]

00:05:17 ◼   ► yeah I don't know if this happened for [TS]

00:05:19 ◼   ► anybody else but the first time you got [TS]

00:05:21 ◼   ► up to wash your hands get a drink of [TS]

00:05:22 ◼   ► water while reading after reading this [TS]

00:05:24 ◼   ► book did you think to yourself my god [TS]

00:05:26 ◼   ► what a miracle that we can just turn on [TS]

00:05:27 ◼   ► the tap and the water comes out I should [TS]

00:05:28 ◼   ► have a bowl under the under my want [TS]

00:05:31 ◼   ► Molly wash my hands and then use that to [TS]

00:05:32 ◼   ► water this plant which is what we do [TS]

00:05:35 ◼   ► actually being a cat a fellow [TS]

00:05:36 ◼   ► Californian we all the again as jason [TS]

00:05:41 ◼   ► has said we're both in California it's [TS]

00:05:43 ◼   ► suffering a huge you know once and 500 [TS]

00:05:45 ◼   ► every years type of drought and so in my [TS]

00:05:49 ◼   ► house we already do the thing where we [TS]

00:05:51 ◼   ► use every bit of water we have and and [TS]

00:05:53 ◼   ► I've got a great water system now for [TS]

00:05:54 ◼   ► watering the plants blah blah blah but [TS]

00:05:57 ◼   ► what I when I read this I kept thinking [TS]

00:05:59 ◼   ► well we should send copies of this to [TS]

00:06:02 ◼   ► you know people and people are utilities [TS]

00:06:04 ◼   ► and policymakers because one of the [TS]

00:06:06 ◼   ► things i thought one thing that was [TS]

00:06:08 ◼   ► phenomenal because i read this [TS]

00:06:09 ◼   ► back-to-back with seven Eve's and [TS]

00:06:11 ◼   ► there's a part in seven teams where the [TS]

00:06:13 ◼   ► neil degrasse tyson character who will [TS]

00:06:14 ◼   ► get to later [TS]

00:06:15 ◼   ► is all well you know one thing is a [TS]

00:06:18 ◼   ► tragedy but when entire planet goes [TS]

00:06:20 ◼   ► kablooey you just you can't you can't [TS]

00:06:23 ◼   ► get a your you can't wrap your brain on [TS]

00:06:24 ◼   ► the scope and [TS]

00:06:25 ◼   ► in this case like them the genius of the [TS]

00:06:27 ◼   ► water knife is the closer look because [TS]

00:06:30 ◼   ► you do have Maria who's this teenager [TS]

00:06:32 ◼   ► refugee from California eventually from [TS]

00:06:35 ◼   ► Texas who over the course the entire [TS]

00:06:36 ◼   ► novel she typifies what happens to [TS]

00:06:40 ◼   ► people who become refugees and are in [TS]

00:06:42 ◼   ► and are driven to rely on themselves far [TS]

00:06:44 ◼   ► before they have to and what I really [TS]

00:06:48 ◼   ► loved about the book was the way it [TS]

00:06:50 ◼   ► shows how Lucy gets too close to the [TS]

00:06:53 ◼   ► story and in doing so becomes utterly [TS]

00:06:56 ◼   ► unable to understand and see what would [TS]

00:06:58 ◼   ► drive somebody like Maria because they [TS]

00:07:00 ◼   ► have a climactic confrontation the very [TS]

00:07:02 ◼   ► end I loved on Hell's quasi Redemption [TS]

00:07:06 ◼   ► arc and the reason is a quasi Redemption [TS]

00:07:09 ◼   ► arc is because he's going to hop in a [TS]

00:07:10 ◼   ► helicopter and go back to Catherine case [TS]

00:07:12 ◼   ► who's the the headwater agency in Las [TS]

00:07:15 ◼   ► Vegas yeah i mean of the queen of las [TS]

00:07:17 ◼   ► vegas NV yeah I mean she was briefly [TS]

00:07:19 ◼   ► trying to kill him when she thought he [TS]

00:07:20 ◼   ► was betraying her but like now that [TS]

00:07:21 ◼   ► they've worked out that understanding [TS]

00:07:23 ◼   ► he's gonna talk he's going to toss Maria [TS]

00:07:24 ◼   ► and this helicopter and the last thing [TS]

00:07:26 ◼   ► he says to her in the book is Catherine [TS]

00:07:28 ◼   ► cases going to love you and I felt like [TS]

00:07:30 ◼   ► that book was saying right there okay [TS]

00:07:31 ◼   ► she's gonna be a water knife interesting [TS]

00:07:33 ◼   ► to be great at it because she's looking [TS]

00:07:34 ◼   ► at the world in a way that almost nobody [TS]

00:07:37 ◼   ► else can she doesn't remember a priest [TS]

00:07:38 ◼   ► shortage time and that kinda reminds me [TS]

00:07:41 ◼   ► of the Emily st. John mandals station [TS]

00:07:43 ◼   ► eleven when they're talking about the [TS]

00:07:46 ◼   ► before and the after and one of the [TS]

00:07:47 ◼   ► observations that one of the characters [TS]

00:07:49 ◼   ► makes is if you were a child you really [TS]

00:07:51 ◼   ► don't remember what if you were a child [TS]

00:07:52 ◼   ► in the world you know depopulated you [TS]

00:07:54 ◼   ► really don't remember electricity or [TS]

00:07:56 ◼   ► medicine or anything like that so you [TS]

00:07:57 ◼   ► don't miss it too much and Maria's case [TS]

00:08:00 ◼   ► she's very young she really doesn't [TS]

00:08:01 ◼   ► remember life before like she has these [TS]

00:08:03 ◼   ► big impressions of all the stuff that [TS]

00:08:05 ◼   ► she no longer has but she's like no this [TS]

00:08:08 ◼   ► is the world and she talks a lot about [TS]

00:08:10 ◼   ► old eyes looking at the world and old [TS]

00:08:11 ◼   ► eyes where this is the way the world [TS]

00:08:12 ◼   ► used to be we can get back to versus [TS]

00:08:14 ◼   ► looking at the world as it is now and [TS]

00:08:16 ◼   ► what i thought was the same thing i [TS]

00:08:19 ◼   ► thought at the end of the drowned cities [TS]

00:08:21 ◼   ► which was you know the drowsies explain [TS]

00:08:23 ◼   ► how people become child soldiers in [TS]

00:08:25 ◼   ► effect these are the circumstances that [TS]

00:08:26 ◼   ► lead to this is what happens this is the [TS]

00:08:28 ◼   ► human cost of the way the world is today [TS]

00:08:30 ◼   ► and you know this book is the same thing [TS]

00:08:32 ◼   ► whether water and it was saying this is [TS]

00:08:33 ◼   ► the this is the human cost of the kind [TS]

00:08:35 ◼   ► of consumption patterns we have going on [TS]

00:08:37 ◼   ► this is what are you guys going to pay [TS]

00:08:39 ◼   ► this so i thought it was an intensely [TS]

00:08:40 ◼   ► moral intensely gripping read i [TS]

00:08:43 ◼   ► highlighted a buttload of passages [TS]

00:08:44 ◼   ► because he's got a vivid and economical [TS]

00:08:46 ◼   ► way of describing the complete collapse [TS]

00:08:48 ◼   ► of civilization [TS]

00:08:50 ◼   ► no one of my favorite one of my favorite [TS]

00:08:53 ◼   ► phrases was the odd mix of broken Souls [TS]

00:08:56 ◼   ► bleeding hearts and predators who [TS]

00:08:57 ◼   ► occupied the shattered places of the [TS]

00:08:59 ◼   ► world and that that one sentence is just [TS]

00:09:04 ◼   ► so elegant and so economical and says so [TS]

00:09:07 ◼   ► much and it's just the pros in this book [TS]

00:09:10 ◼   ► is excellent in addition to the story [TS]

00:09:11 ◼   ► and i really love and appreciate when [TS]

00:09:13 ◼   ► you can find something where the story [TS]

00:09:16 ◼   ► and the method of delivery are both [TS]

00:09:17 ◼   ► beautiful i'm going to go next to our [TS]

00:09:20 ◼   ► native a native Californian I believe a [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► serenity what do you think of this one [TS]

00:09:26 ◼   ► gosh at this book made me think a lot I [TS]

00:09:30 ◼   ► in well it's funny because this book [TS]

00:09:33 ◼   ► came at a time where I i was talking [TS]

00:09:37 ◼   ► with my boyfriend at the time were like [TS]

00:09:39 ◼   ► well do we want to live in the northeast [TS]

00:09:41 ◼   ► forever and maybe I want to move club [TS]

00:09:44 ◼   ► back closer to my parents and we were [TS]

00:09:46 ◼   ► talking like maybe austin and then [TS]

00:09:49 ◼   ► really nice i'm like yes work of fiction [TS]

00:09:55 ◼   ► but there's definitely there's a lot in [TS]

00:09:57 ◼   ► this book to make you think because it's [TS]

00:10:00 ◼   ► not it's not necessarily yes this is [TS]

00:10:02 ◼   ► happening tomorrow but it's definitely [TS]

00:10:04 ◼   ► this is a version of a future that could [TS]

00:10:06 ◼   ► potentially happen and yes water rates [TS]

00:10:09 ◼   ► are thing which is something that I [TS]

00:10:10 ◼   ► didn't actually realize until after the [TS]

00:10:12 ◼   ► book i went kind of diggin being like is [TS]

00:10:14 ◼   ► this actually yeah he says just the book [TS]

00:10:19 ◼   ► for me again I i love all of how do you [TS]

00:10:24 ◼   ► see that his lesson about you loopy [TS]

00:10:26 ◼   ► bacigalupi i love all of Paolo [TS]

00:10:28 ◼   ► Bacigalupi stuff I think so you must not [TS]

00:10:30 ◼   ► have read the doubt factor even haha no [TS]

00:10:33 ◼   ► sorry [TS]

00:10:34 ◼   ► I the jacket factory the data factory [TS]

00:10:37 ◼   ► was clearly turned out quickly and it's [TS]

00:10:39 ◼   ► not bad book but I I feel like somebody [TS]

00:10:42 ◼   ► whispered in his ear this sort of book [TS]

00:10:43 ◼   ► could sell well yeah we talked about [TS]

00:10:46 ◼   ► that I want to come out and I like [TS]

00:10:47 ◼   ► everything else he's done [TS]

00:10:49 ◼   ► yes I alright so I'm yeah i love i love [TS]

00:10:52 ◼   ► his climate change-related science [TS]

00:10:54 ◼   ► fiction and i'm going to use the long [TS]

00:10:55 ◼   ► version of that because the short [TS]

00:10:57 ◼   ► acronym is terrible [TS]

00:10:59 ◼   ► I really Lisa in that I his prose is [TS]

00:11:03 ◼   ► chilling but i know in a way that it [TS]

00:11:05 ◼   ► doesn't make you feel completely [TS]

00:11:07 ◼   ► discouraged about the the fate of the [TS]

00:11:09 ◼   ► world or the potential fate of the world [TS]

00:11:11 ◼   ► but it definitely it gets in your brain [TS]

00:11:13 ◼   ► and you think about these things long [TS]

00:11:15 ◼   ► after you've closed the book i mean i [TS]

00:11:17 ◼   ► read that but I read it it's a [TS]

00:11:18 ◼   ► page-turner you know I I probably run it [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► straight through and 48 hours maybe less [TS]

00:11:22 ◼   ► but it yet but the certain phrases and [TS]

00:11:28 ◼   ► imagery stuck with me a long time after [TS]

00:11:30 ◼   ► the the hyenas the oh yeah oh my gosh [TS]

00:11:35 ◼   ► yes oh the all of the all of the games [TS]

00:11:38 ◼   ► just it's such a well it's such a [TS]

00:11:41 ◼   ► well-built version of apocalypse because [TS]

00:11:45 ◼   ► it doesn't because it's so close to our [TS]

00:11:47 ◼   ► reality that it doesn't feel so removed [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► that we can't identify with it and so [TS]

00:11:52 ◼   ► you can it's it's it's just it's like [TS]

00:11:56 ◼   ► turning the knob just one setting over [TS]

00:11:58 ◼   ► so you look at everything and you're [TS]

00:12:00 ◼   ► like yeah I recognize I recognize this [TS]

00:12:02 ◼   ► but without necessarily being too close [TS]

00:12:06 ◼   ► to home or too far away from home that [TS]

00:12:09 ◼   ► you become desensitized I there's a no [TS]

00:12:12 ◼   ► no it's it's a very special balance that [TS]

00:12:15 ◼   ► he's that he's kind of struck and I i [TS]

00:12:17 ◼   ► really enjoy you know the the plus side [TS]

00:12:22 ◼   ► I and i love the world-building i love [TS]

00:12:24 ◼   ► the stuff we get about the ecology is in [TS]

00:12:25 ◼   ► the essentially the living buildings and [TS]

00:12:29 ◼   ► how those sort of come into play in the [TS]

00:12:31 ◼   ► story [TS]

00:12:32 ◼   ► anybody who's played simcity will [TS]

00:12:34 ◼   ► recognize arcologies from if you baby [TS]

00:12:37 ◼   ► simcity 2000 if you built if you last [TS]

00:12:39 ◼   ► long enough they launched into space [TS]

00:12:41 ◼   ► oh yeah [TS]

00:12:42 ◼   ► you know that that was something that [TS]

00:12:44 ◼   ► was that start percolating through [TS]

00:12:46 ◼   ► architecture movements back in the [TS]

00:12:47 ◼   ► sixties and seven days self-contained [TS]

00:12:49 ◼   ► yes there's actually a structure in the [TS]

00:12:52 ◼   ► southwest call dark asante which was [TS]

00:12:54 ◼   ► meant to be a self-contained ecosystem [TS]

00:12:58 ◼   ► the idea was that good architecture [TS]

00:12:59 ◼   ► combined with ecology could create these [TS]

00:13:01 ◼   ► oasis in the desert and Marcus aunties [TS]

00:13:03 ◼   ► an experiment that's been going on the [TS]

00:13:04 ◼   ► southwestern sometime [TS]

00:13:06 ◼   ► David you live near a river but I'm [TS]

00:13:09 ◼   ► gonna have to well you're not about the [TS]

00:13:10 ◼   ► water knife [TS]

00:13:11 ◼   ► well i was gonna say all of the you know [TS]

00:13:13 ◼   ► thinking about the water being a miracle [TS]

00:13:16 ◼   ► as it comes out of these little faucets [TS]

00:13:18 ◼   ► all over my house I I thought of that [TS]

00:13:20 ◼   ► the last time i went to california and [TS]

00:13:21 ◼   ► when [TS]

00:13:22 ◼   ► oh this is what it's like out here and [TS]

00:13:28 ◼   ► I've been much more conscious let's and [TS]

00:13:29 ◼   ► taking home even though quote-unquote I [TS]

00:13:32 ◼   ► don't have to be and so reading this was [TS]

00:13:36 ◼   ► yeah i mean i'll go along and say that i [TS]

00:13:41 ◼   ► have also liked everything he's written [TS]

00:13:43 ◼   ► i like the doubt factory for what it is [TS]

00:13:45 ◼   ► it's not high heart this is high art [TS]

00:13:49 ◼   ► this is I'm not usually a big fan of [TS]

00:13:51 ◼   ► message fiction and and you know you [TS]

00:13:54 ◼   ► know let's let's [TS]

00:13:55 ◼   ► except for Star Trek i guess but one [TS]

00:13:59 ◼   ► thing i love about his work is that it [TS]

00:14:02 ◼   ► does stick with me and it's just a [TS]

00:14:05 ◼   ► really really well written and [TS]

00:14:07 ◼   ► well-plotted story every time out [TS]

00:14:10 ◼   ► it's a mystery said I mean I think the [TS]

00:14:12 ◼   ► one of the things that even in Star Trek [TS]

00:14:14 ◼   ► you could say is that you need to have a [TS]

00:14:16 ◼   ► good story a good plot that goes along [TS]

00:14:17 ◼   ► with your message and a day that could [TS]

00:14:20 ◼   ► you could say that was the sugar coating [TS]

00:14:21 ◼   ► sometimes what what bacigalupi is doing [TS]

00:14:23 ◼   ► here is you know he's telling he's [TS]

00:14:25 ◼   ► telling a an action adventure story in [TS]

00:14:28 ◼   ► this world where he which allows him to [TS]

00:14:32 ◼   ► tell us about it let's imagine a [TS]

00:14:35 ◼   ► Southwest with these crippling water [TS]

00:14:38 ◼   ► deficiencies and what the politics would [TS]

00:14:41 ◼   ► be in what the social ramifications [TS]

00:14:43 ◼   ► would be that's but you know then I'm [TS]

00:14:46 ◼   ► going to tell a story about this guy and [TS]

00:14:49 ◼   ► and these two women and what happens [TS]

00:14:51 ◼   ► with them and [TS]

00:14:52 ◼   ► and there's you know and there's action [TS]

00:14:54 ◼   ► there is and there's adventure and [TS]

00:14:56 ◼   ► there's excitement and there's some [TS]

00:14:57 ◼   ► crazy sci-fi kind of things in there but [TS]

00:15:00 ◼   ► you know but that's it's you know it is [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► i think well done in the sense that that [TS]

00:15:05 ◼   ► the the I the message isn't it is the [TS]

00:15:08 ◼   ► plot but it isn't the plot it's more [TS]

00:15:09 ◼   ► than that if it was just a message was [TS]

00:15:11 ◼   ► just discreet about the environment I [TS]

00:15:13 ◼   ► think it wouldn't be that it wouldn't be [TS]

00:15:15 ◼   ► as successful as it is not to tip my [TS]

00:15:17 ◼   ► hand for later but i really i really [TS]

00:15:20 ◼   ► like the the clothes look I don't I [TS]

00:15:23 ◼   ► don't necessarily like the let's see the [TS]

00:15:26 ◼   ► entire you know everything that's going [TS]

00:15:28 ◼   ► on everywhere all over the world hard [TS]

00:15:29 ◼   ► hard to get a lot of perspective when [TS]

00:15:31 ◼   ► you're looking at it from that viewpoint [TS]

00:15:32 ◼   ► and and you don't need it and this this [TS]

00:15:34 ◼   ► is proof that you don't need all of that [TS]

00:15:36 ◼   ► to have an effective story and to end to [TS]

00:15:38 ◼   ► get your points across to get the [TS]

00:15:41 ◼   ► message that you're trying to sell you [TS]

00:15:44 ◼   ► can you can just do it really nicely [TS]

00:15:46 ◼   ► covered entities in Philadelphia he's [TS]

00:15:49 ◼   ► just pouring buckets of water onto the [TS]

00:15:50 ◼   ► street for fun doing that right now like [TS]

00:15:53 ◼   ► about other is set up and i just turned [TS]

00:15:56 ◼   ► on the faucet and throw it out the [TS]

00:15:57 ◼   ► window [TS]

00:15:57 ◼   ► yeah this book has reaffirmed that i [TS]

00:16:00 ◼   ► should stay on the east coast because [TS]

00:16:01 ◼   ► you have plentiful water is usually rain [TS]

00:16:04 ◼   ► in oregon right that there's only in [TS]

00:16:06 ◼   ► fact the scene where they call vancouver [TS]

00:16:08 ◼   ► and they're like its winning [TS]

00:16:10 ◼   ► what is that yes that being said its own [TS]

00:16:13 ◼   ► problems an earthquake land you have [TS]

00:16:15 ◼   ► some ministers maybe we also don't have [TS]

00:16:17 ◼   ► earthquakes over here at the East Coast [TS]

00:16:19 ◼   ► generally of course we'll have one and [TS]

00:16:21 ◼   ► then everyone will die but yeah but to [TS]

00:16:24 ◼   ► philly sports fans i'm really not sure [TS]

00:16:25 ◼   ► that's a true that hurricane hurricane [TS]

00:16:27 ◼   ► only missed you by a little bit so we do [TS]

00:16:29 ◼   ► have her needs we sometimes have too [TS]

00:16:31 ◼   ► much water that is very game learn to [TS]

00:16:32 ◼   ► not mess with us also Eagles fans I feel [TS]

00:16:35 ◼   ► like we can't again about that danger [TS]

00:16:36 ◼   ► index Friedman so so Scott what do you [TS]

00:16:40 ◼   ► think of the water i liked it i read it [TS]

00:16:44 ◼   ► very quickly so that's always a good [TS]

00:16:46 ◼   ► sign [TS]

00:16:46 ◼   ► yeah I enjoyed the fact that it was [TS]

00:16:48 ◼   ► shorter than 70 you soon [TS]

00:16:50 ◼   ► american press that you although it's [TS]

00:16:53 ◼   ► not surprising considering both authors [TS]

00:16:54 ◼   ► I liked all talking about comparing and [TS]

00:16:57 ◼   ► contrasting i like how real the water [TS]

00:17:00 ◼   ► knife felt and plausible and how there [TS]

00:17:03 ◼   ► was so many striking scenes of [TS]

00:17:06 ◼   ► completely different people experiencing [TS]

00:17:10 ◼   ► the same kind of a horrific ecological [TS]

00:17:14 ◼   ► breakdown in so many like the people who [TS]

00:17:15 ◼   ► live in these arcologies it doesn't [TS]

00:17:17 ◼   ► matter because they have a fountain and [TS]

00:17:18 ◼   ► a river and everything's lovely inside [TS]

00:17:21 ◼   ► their little self-contained world but [TS]

00:17:23 ◼   ► then you go outside and there are people [TS]

00:17:24 ◼   ► lining up at a public spigot that they [TS]

00:17:27 ◼   ► have to pay you no money to get their [TS]

00:17:30 ◼   ► water and the prices fluctuate based on [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► the market [TS]

00:17:33 ◼   ► yeah there's a scene where now [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► malfunctions in advance oh it over Vince [TS]

00:17:37 ◼   ► water and like one of the characters [TS]

00:17:38 ◼   ► feels like she struck it rich because [TS]

00:17:40 ◼   ► she's going to be able to resell this [TS]

00:17:42 ◼   ► water for right Marshall fingers out [TS]

00:17:45 ◼   ► that because it's based on the market so [TS]

00:17:46 ◼   ► there's at 1.22 yeah i was down there is [TS]

00:17:49 ◼   ► nothing [TS]

00:17:50 ◼   ► and so you can quickly she fills up a [TS]

00:17:52 ◼   ► lots of jugs and of course in in this [TS]

00:17:55 ◼   ► book that is a great boon for her but [TS]

00:17:58 ◼   ► immediately it turns into a horrible [TS]

00:17:59 ◼   ► thing because nobody could be happy [TS]

00:18:02 ◼   ► well have you ever seen the wire it's [TS]

00:18:04 ◼   ► pretty much like watching the kids and [TS]

00:18:05 ◼   ► season four of the white attempt [TS]

00:18:07 ◼   ► together terrible situation I mean yeah [TS]

00:18:09 ◼   ► it'sit's uh yeah it was Ursa know that [TS]

00:18:13 ◼   ► that what I enjoyed is I really liked [TS]

00:18:15 ◼   ► what he did to Lucy over the course of [TS]

00:18:17 ◼   ► the book that's our our reporter yeah [TS]

00:18:20 ◼   ► loosies reporter character and there's a [TS]

00:18:23 ◼   ► character who appears very briefly and [TS]

00:18:24 ◼   ► kick starts things off where he tells [TS]

00:18:26 ◼   ► Lucy that her problem is she thinks too [TS]

00:18:27 ◼   ► small and at the end of the book when [TS]

00:18:31 ◼   ► she gets what is essentially the maltese [TS]

00:18:33 ◼   ► falcon of the book the thing everybody [TS]

00:18:35 ◼   ► has been looking for i think everybody [TS]

00:18:36 ◼   ► has been pulling to kill him to die for [TS]

00:18:38 ◼   ► and she gets it she's like with this [TS]

00:18:40 ◼   ► Phoenix can you know control its own [TS]

00:18:42 ◼   ► destiny and like she's all I'm going to [TS]

00:18:45 ◼   ► make sure that Felix isn't hired by this [TS]

00:18:46 ◼   ► and she says this in front of somebody [TS]

00:18:49 ◼   ► who has lost parts of her body her [TS]

00:18:51 ◼   ► parent and her best friend to the way [TS]

00:18:53 ◼   ► Phoenix is now and I thought oh my god [TS]

00:18:56 ◼   ► Lucy you really do like anything it's [TS]

00:18:58 ◼   ► not Lucy thinking small in that case she [TS]

00:19:00 ◼   ► was thinking too big that she missed the [TS]

00:19:01 ◼   ► key details which is that [TS]

00:19:03 ◼   ► there are probably people in Phoenix who [TS]

00:19:04 ◼   ► don't want it to succeed who wants [TS]

00:19:07 ◼   ► desperately to get out of there and will [TS]

00:19:08 ◼   ► do anything to get up there in Lucy lost [TS]

00:19:11 ◼   ► sight of that she was she was chasing [TS]

00:19:12 ◼   ► after the power structures and she kind [TS]

00:19:14 ◼   ► of it was ok to document the desperation [TS]

00:19:16 ◼   ► but I don't think she really realized [TS]

00:19:18 ◼   ► the lengths people would go to to avoid [TS]

00:19:22 ◼   ► prolonging the pain you mentioned the [TS]

00:19:24 ◼   ► MacGuffin here and I it may seem [TS]

00:19:26 ◼   ► ridiculous to people that essentially [TS]

00:19:29 ◼   ► what they're talking about and this [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► thing that everybody's fighting and [TS]

00:19:32 ◼   ► dying over is a document about water [TS]

00:19:35 ◼   ► rights from 100 a long time ago and like [TS]

00:19:39 ◼   ► who had the first water rights to [TS]

00:19:40 ◼   ► various watersheds and rivers and that [TS]

00:19:43 ◼   ► may seem ridiculous like will really [TS]

00:19:45 ◼   ► when you've got all these states and [TS]

00:19:46 ◼   ► their national guards and they're [TS]

00:19:47 ◼   ► fighting each other and they're blowing [TS]

00:19:48 ◼   ► up pumping stations and things like that [TS]

00:19:50 ◼   ► what is some quaint old document going [TS]

00:19:52 ◼   ► to mean except if you look at the [TS]

00:19:55 ◼   ► headlines of the mandatory water cuts in [TS]

00:19:57 ◼   ► California right now they're actually [TS]

00:20:00 ◼   ► the age of the water claims is the [TS]

00:20:04 ◼   ► determining factor in whether your farms [TS]

00:20:06 ◼   ► get water or not so this is absolutely [TS]

00:20:08 ◼   ► real as ridiculous as it sounds I think [TS]

00:20:11 ◼   ► it is that ridiculous and yet it is also [TS]

00:20:13 ◼   ► accurate so I thought that was a nice [TS]

00:20:15 ◼   ► touch there that as fact there have been [TS]

00:20:18 ◼   ► reporters who have been documenting the [TS]

00:20:20 ◼   ► Colorado for like the last 15 to 20 [TS]

00:20:21 ◼   ► years and taking a look at who has [TS]

00:20:24 ◼   ► claims where because this is a very real [TS]

00:20:27 ◼   ► thing if you were to cut off the kelp [TS]

00:20:29 ◼   ► that Colorado's water supply [TS]

00:20:31 ◼   ► well above Arizona Utah and Nevada they [TS]

00:20:35 ◼   ► be host and so right now who can draw [TS]

00:20:37 ◼   ► water from calif from the Colorado is a [TS]

00:20:39 ◼   ► really from political process and when [TS]

00:20:41 ◼   ► Arizona starting large-scale spinach [TS]

00:20:43 ◼   ► farming they actually tapped into the [TS]

00:20:45 ◼   ► Colorado to do that and that's about the [TS]

00:20:46 ◼   ► whole political flurry it's a Mike Davis [TS]

00:20:50 ◼   ► wrote a book called city of course which [TS]

00:20:51 ◼   ► is about Los Angeles and how you know it [TS]

00:20:55 ◼   ► the reason it grew is because they stole [TS]

00:20:57 ◼   ► of water rights which you know you can [TS]

00:20:58 ◼   ► learn more about actually much chinatown [TS]

00:21:00 ◼   ► and they talk about how water is life or [TS]

00:21:06 ◼   ► death to the American Southwest and [TS]

00:21:08 ◼   ► there are a lot of people who have a lot [TS]

00:21:10 ◼   ► at stake in making sure that it flows in [TS]

00:21:12 ◼   ► ways that are deeply unnatural for the [TS]

00:21:13 ◼   ► region [TS]

00:21:15 ◼   ► and I I I loved in this book how he had [TS]

00:21:18 ◼   ► clearly done his homework on how the [TS]

00:21:21 ◼   ► battles are fought you know [TS]

00:21:22 ◼   ► bit by bit with ranchers and farmers and [TS]

00:21:25 ◼   ► and where the money flows and how it get [TS]

00:21:27 ◼   ► started it's just such a whole research [TS]

00:21:30 ◼   ► book also we talking about um about this [TS]

00:21:33 ◼   ► being an apocalyptic it is in a way but [TS]

00:21:35 ◼   ► if this is a small apocalypse in the [TS]

00:21:37 ◼   ► sense that it's an apocalypse of a [TS]

00:21:38 ◼   ► region and in fact one of the things [TS]

00:21:40 ◼   ► that he goes to some pains to show is [TS]

00:21:43 ◼   ► that this is a world of haves and [TS]

00:21:45 ◼   ► have-nots and people in the United [TS]

00:21:47 ◼   ► States miss something I think power [TS]

00:21:48 ◼   ► budget hope he does a lot and does very [TS]

00:21:49 ◼   ► well is is a make you understand how [TS]

00:21:53 ◼   ► people in other parts of the world and [TS]

00:21:54 ◼   ► other situations feel by turning the [TS]

00:21:57 ◼   ► tables on on Americans and display and [TS]

00:22:00 ◼   ► showing them in that position because [TS]

00:22:01 ◼   ► you have that this is what you know this [TS]

00:22:03 ◼   ► is what they go [TS]

00:22:04 ◼   ► imagine what it would be like if you did [TS]

00:22:06 ◼   ► this exactly so in this case what we see [TS]

00:22:08 ◼   ► is not only do we see the rain in [TS]

00:22:09 ◼   ► Vancouver and we hear about you know [TS]

00:22:11 ◼   ► things within back east and all that but [TS]

00:22:13 ◼   ► lurking the whole time and we very [TS]

00:22:16 ◼   ► rarely see any instance of it other than [TS]

00:22:18 ◼   ► like people referencing it is the [TS]

00:22:20 ◼   ► monster in the room which is California [TS]

00:22:24 ◼   ► and the implication a California will [TS]

00:22:26 ◼   ► always get what it wants its got the [TS]

00:22:28 ◼   ► people it's got the power it will suck [TS]

00:22:31 ◼   ► you dry if it wants to and everybody in [TS]

00:22:33 ◼   ► this story is scrambling around the [TS]

00:22:36 ◼   ► edges trying not to anger California and [TS]

00:22:38 ◼   ► trying to get enough to survive without [TS]

00:22:40 ◼   ► drawing you know California's I and i [TS]

00:22:42 ◼   ► found that fascinating to that this [TS]

00:22:44 ◼   ► isn't this isn't a you know a story [TS]

00:22:47 ◼   ► about the The you know how California [TS]

00:22:49 ◼   ► steals everybody's water when there's a [TS]

00:22:51 ◼   ► drought this is a story of all the [TS]

00:22:52 ◼   ► people whose water got stolen but and [TS]

00:22:54 ◼   ► how they survive which i think is a [TS]

00:22:56 ◼   ► really nice touch the California is like [TS]

00:22:57 ◼   ► this super scary like the Soviet Union [TS]

00:23:00 ◼   ► and in a spy story in said in the cold [TS]

00:23:03 ◼   ► war where it's like it's just it's out [TS]

00:23:05 ◼   ► there [TS]

00:23:05 ◼   ► Hallie's are ya they are you you know [TS]

00:23:07 ◼   ► the calories are gonna come and then [TS]

00:23:09 ◼   ► it's all the jig is up man it's over [TS]

00:23:10 ◼   ► then I think that's a fascinating little [TS]

00:23:14 ◼   ► touch too and it's funny brought up [TS]

00:23:16 ◼   ► China tent is the first thing I wanted [TS]

00:23:17 ◼   ► to do as soon as they finish was gonna [TS]

00:23:19 ◼   ► watch chinatown [TS]

00:23:20 ◼   ► because it's been you know 15 years [TS]

00:23:21 ◼   ► since i saw it 20 years since i thought [TS]

00:23:23 ◼   ► i was thinking because you talk about [TS]

00:23:25 ◼   ► you Jason you alluded to the gap between [TS]

00:23:26 ◼   ► the rich and the poor and one of the [TS]

00:23:28 ◼   ► things i like about the way mr. B i'm [TS]

00:23:33 ◼   ► just going to one of the things i like [TS]

00:23:36 ◼   ► when mr. B rights is he makes it [TS]

00:23:39 ◼   ► abundantly clear that the technology and [TS]

00:23:41 ◼   ► the g was advances like the arcologies [TS]

00:23:43 ◼   ► have all been developed and designed in [TS]

00:23:46 ◼   ► the service of the from of the elite [TS]

00:23:49 ◼   ► economy and it reminds me a lot of the [TS]

00:23:51 ◼   ► stuff that you seen william gibson novel [TS]

00:23:53 ◼   ► except here there's more of an angry [TS]

00:23:55 ◼   ► activists heart whereas and william [TS]

00:23:57 ◼   ► gibson novels like he can go off for a [TS]

00:23:59 ◼   ► paragraph about somebody's [TS]

00:24:00 ◼   ► super-fantastic flannel shirt and the [TS]

00:24:02 ◼   ► fountain pen they're using and then it's [TS]

00:24:04 ◼   ► like a woman doing jujitsu but here [TS]

00:24:06 ◼   ► instead it's a little eyes fetishized [TS]

00:24:09 ◼   ► and it's definitely more comment on the [TS]

00:24:11 ◼   ► wealth is a lot less fetishize and you [TS]

00:24:13 ◼   ► are aware of the human cost you know [TS]

00:24:15 ◼   ► especially when you've got these these [TS]

00:24:17 ◼   ► these dudes who are supposed to be [TS]

00:24:19 ◼   ► looking for aquifers not finding LOL [TS]

00:24:21 ◼   ► hookers on the company tab and and and [TS]

00:24:23 ◼   ► working that way so it's I like his [TS]

00:24:27 ◼   ► books because i like the angry beating [TS]

00:24:28 ◼   ► heart of them will they feel real [TS]

00:24:30 ◼   ► yeah they don't they don't feel like [TS]

00:24:32 ◼   ► again they don't feel like some fantasy [TS]

00:24:34 ◼   ► world where we're so far removed it's [TS]

00:24:36 ◼   ► like oh that's nice post boxes like Mad [TS]

00:24:38 ◼   ► Max feels like a fantasy world [TS]

00:24:40 ◼   ► yeah it's just like it's so far removed [TS]

00:24:42 ◼   ► from reality that you're like all right [TS]

00:24:44 ◼   ► this is most part how would how would we [TS]

00:24:46 ◼   ► get to that point where it's very clear [TS]

00:24:47 ◼   ► how we get to this point so it did [TS]

00:24:50 ◼   ► everybody had everybody read the [TS]

00:24:52 ◼   ► tamarisk unter which is one of his short [TS]

00:24:54 ◼   ► stories and pump 6i have yeah I cannot [TS]

00:24:57 ◼   ► oh yeah that's a good coat on that's a [TS]

00:24:59 ◼   ► good choice for collection pump six is [TS]

00:25:00 ◼   ► an excellent pump six and other stories [TS]

00:25:02 ◼   ► is an excellent collection all all [TS]

00:25:05 ◼   ► ecosystem and climate change-related I [TS]

00:25:08 ◼   ► believe but that the tamarisk countries [TS]

00:25:11 ◼   ► i believe the short story that kind of [TS]

00:25:12 ◼   ► spurred this this book into action which [TS]

00:25:16 ◼   ► follows basically a a so-called tamarisk [TS]

00:25:19 ◼   ► hunter who basically goes down the [TS]

00:25:21 ◼   ► Colorado striking down tamarisk weeds [TS]

00:25:24 ◼   ► that are sucking the water dried and and [TS]

00:25:28 ◼   ► his interactions [TS]

00:25:29 ◼   ► and his his view or how he sees people [TS]

00:25:33 ◼   ► basically being policed on the wall on [TS]

00:25:35 ◼   ► the Colorado and that that in itself was [TS]

00:25:38 ◼   ► such an interesting snapshot of what [TS]

00:25:42 ◼   ► potential life and then I forget a year [TS]

00:25:45 ◼   ► or two later in the LA Times there was [TS]

00:25:48 ◼   ► something very very similarly mentioning [TS]

00:25:51 ◼   ► you know tamarisks sucking down Colorado [TS]

00:25:54 ◼   ► etc and it was just I don't know I feel [TS]

00:25:56 ◼   ► like he has such a good he has such a [TS]

00:25:59 ◼   ► good eye tap on the sort of the beating [TS]

00:26:03 ◼   ► heart of like what what is vital in [TS]

00:26:05 ◼   ► certain areas and the like the ability [TS]

00:26:09 ◼   ► to just draw out what might be most [TS]

00:26:10 ◼   ► negatively interesting without not [TS]

00:26:12 ◼   ► necessarily saying like this is the [TS]

00:26:14 ◼   ► future [TS]

00:26:15 ◼   ► everything is doomed but if this is the [TS]

00:26:17 ◼   ► worst way that this future could go [TS]

00:26:19 ◼   ► let's dive in deep and look at these [TS]

00:26:22 ◼   ► three people and explode their lives [TS]

00:26:25 ◼   ► basically let's make all of the bad [TS]

00:26:26 ◼   ► things happen and see how humanity [TS]

00:26:28 ◼   ► reacts which is fascinating so i will [TS]

00:26:31 ◼   ► say I another way that this book reminds [TS]

00:26:33 ◼   ► me of william gibson is that after i [TS]

00:26:37 ◼   ► read it i thought i really love the [TS]

00:26:39 ◼   ► world and i really loved the writing and [TS]

00:26:42 ◼   ► as for the plot it is not anything [TS]

00:26:46 ◼   ► special like to me I felt like like [TS]

00:26:49 ◼   ► Gibson and I love Gibson but Gibson's [TS]

00:26:51 ◼   ► plots are pulp crying plots mostly and [TS]

00:26:55 ◼   ► this you know [TS]

00:26:57 ◼   ► yes such they stopped a little better [TS]

00:26:58 ◼   ► something that's exactly and and I want [TS]

00:27:00 ◼   ► and what about with budget loopy I've [TS]

00:27:03 ◼   ► never really felt that way before but [TS]

00:27:05 ◼   ► with this book I felt that way I felt [TS]

00:27:07 ◼   ► like the setting was so rich but like in [TS]

00:27:10 ◼   ► the windup girl the setting is is rich [TS]

00:27:12 ◼   ► but it's also bizarre and in and drowned [TS]

00:27:14 ◼   ► cities i think is setting is as rich and [TS]

00:27:16 ◼   ► it's also super weird [TS]

00:27:18 ◼   ► in some ways water knife I felt like the [TS]

00:27:20 ◼   ► setting was good and then the plot is [TS]

00:27:23 ◼   ► kind of it is a MacGuffin plot it is a [TS]

00:27:26 ◼   ► thug you know and some mysterious like [TS]

00:27:29 ◼   ► people get assassinated and there's a [TS]

00:27:31 ◼   ► the reporter who's on the trail and [TS]

00:27:33 ◼   ► there's the the the poor refugee who's [TS]

00:27:36 ◼   ► put in these terrible situations and [TS]

00:27:37 ◼   ► it's not bad [TS]

00:27:39 ◼   ► but they did I just wanted to say it [TS]

00:27:41 ◼   ► that struck me and I think that's the [TS]

00:27:42 ◼   ► reason that I didn't like it as much as [TS]

00:27:43 ◼   ► some of his other work is not because of [TS]

00:27:45 ◼   ► all the things we've been talking about [TS]

00:27:46 ◼   ► that because I felt like the story [TS]

00:27:49 ◼   ► itself when I got done with it was like [TS]

00:27:51 ◼   ► that part of it yeah you know it's not [TS]

00:27:53 ◼   ► like I've seen that story that's like a [TS]

00:27:55 ◼   ► you know it came off of the plot machine [TS]

00:27:58 ◼   ► I almost like it that what I like I [TS]

00:28:01 ◼   ► almost enjoy the fact that it is [TS]

00:28:03 ◼   ► basically an archetypal story [TS]

00:28:05 ◼   ► I'm shoved into these extraordinary [TS]

00:28:07 ◼   ► circumstances because it a little for me [TS]

00:28:10 ◼   ► at least what I really enjoyed about the [TS]

00:28:12 ◼   ► water knife worthy the small moments in [TS]

00:28:15 ◼   ► there and the the very real humanization [TS]

00:28:18 ◼   ► of these characters whereas the their [TS]

00:28:20 ◼   ► overall arcs may have been fairly [TS]

00:28:21 ◼   ► predictable but the brief it like the [TS]

00:28:24 ◼   ► individual scenes in the way that these [TS]

00:28:26 ◼   ► characters interacted were very very [TS]

00:28:29 ◼   ► interesting on I don't yeah I it is the [TS]

00:28:33 ◼   ► less about the little moments for me in [TS]

00:28:35 ◼   ► this book which I i'm gonna bet you're [TS]

00:28:36 ◼   ► you're you're totally valid and that yes [TS]

00:28:38 ◼   ► it's much more of an archetypal story [TS]

00:28:40 ◼   ► than his other works [TS]

00:28:41 ◼   ► yeah I mean to me it's sort of like that [TS]

00:28:44 ◼   ► lets you focus on the message and the [TS]

00:28:46 ◼   ► character moments and it's the same [TS]

00:28:47 ◼   ► thing with Chinatown where he wanted to [TS]

00:28:50 ◼   ► tell the story about the water rights [TS]

00:28:52 ◼   ► and he came up with this home the war [TS]

00:28:54 ◼   ► storyline to fit into and so that was [TS]

00:28:57 ◼   ► sort of the spoonful of sugar for [TS]

00:28:58 ◼   ► everyone to get the story of the water [TS]

00:29:00 ◼   ► right thing and I think that I think [TS]

00:29:02 ◼   ► that was I almost want to say it's a [TS]

00:29:04 ◼   ► very intentional thing here I'd I think [TS]

00:29:07 ◼   ► that might have been in his brain going [TS]

00:29:09 ◼   ► hey you know I could take that and put [TS]

00:29:11 ◼   ► it into a science-fiction setting with [TS]

00:29:12 ◼   ► these thriller element but he actually [TS]

00:29:15 ◼   ► calls it out [TS]

00:29:16 ◼   ► he calls it out because they talk about [TS]

00:29:17 ◼   ► all the stuff that Lucy reported on and [TS]

00:29:20 ◼   ► got pills for and they point out that [TS]

00:29:22 ◼   ► her most her most dogged and tenacious [TS]

00:29:24 ◼   ► reporting that puts all this together [TS]

00:29:25 ◼   ► was released trafficked work but that's [TS]

00:29:28 ◼   ► not like they make that comment like he [TS]

00:29:30 ◼   ► makes that commentary on the state [TS]

00:29:31 ◼   ► journalism with what gets eyeballs [TS]

00:29:33 ◼   ► versus what gets what should get [TS]

00:29:34 ◼   ► attention when when they talk about the [TS]

00:29:36 ◼   ► most respectable and the best work that [TS]

00:29:38 ◼   ► Lucy did was was unraveling who was [TS]

00:29:40 ◼   ► responsible for drawing out phoenix and [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► nobody saw those stories so it's like [TS]

00:29:44 ◼   ► the subtext is text at least one chapter [TS]

00:29:46 ◼   ► there's one other thing i want to [TS]

00:29:47 ◼   ► mention here which is just a funny thing [TS]

00:29:49 ◼   ► that happened a week or two ago Elon [TS]

00:29:52 ◼   ► Musk [TS]

00:29:52 ◼   ► made the the comment about how if [TS]

00:29:56 ◼   ► there's an apocalypse of some sort [TS]

00:29:58 ◼   ► there's no place you want to be other [TS]

00:29:59 ◼   ► than a test love because in the test lab [TS]

00:30:01 ◼   ► there's like super air filters and stuff [TS]

00:30:03 ◼   ► like that and that made me laugh because [TS]

00:30:05 ◼   ► because there is a there are several [TS]

00:30:06 ◼   ► chapters here where we're on how the [TS]

00:30:08 ◼   ► last guys is a is driving around in a [TS]

00:30:11 ◼   ► Tesla and he's got the he goes through a [TS]

00:30:14 ◼   ► dust storm and he's got the filters on [TS]

00:30:16 ◼   ► and all of that and you know that I [TS]

00:30:19 ◼   ► think it's a nice touch because it it [TS]

00:30:21 ◼   ► says it says futuristic while also [TS]

00:30:23 ◼   ► saying not that far in the future [TS]

00:30:25 ◼   ► because it's a test lights recognizable [TS]

00:30:27 ◼   ► and that's kind of funny but then Elon [TS]

00:30:29 ◼   ► Musk comes out and says basically yup [TS]

00:30:31 ◼   ► you wanna you know if there's something [TS]

00:30:33 ◼   ► bad in the air just getting your test [TS]

00:30:34 ◼   ► lights really good for that we just like [TS]

00:30:36 ◼   ► again great i don't have one of those [TS]

00:30:39 ◼   ► are your audience Ilan consider your own [TS]

00:30:42 ◼   ► yeah yeah [TS]

00:30:43 ◼   ► Scott you have anything more to say you [TS]

00:30:45 ◼   ► can you been characteristically quiet [TS]

00:30:48 ◼   ► well I don't want to disappoint my fans [TS]

00:30:50 ◼   ► by actually talking as though made as [TS]

00:30:54 ◼   ► quiet as possible [TS]

00:30:56 ◼   ► well I thought the the book was fairly [TS]

00:30:58 ◼   ► straightforward i enjoyed it i didn't [TS]

00:31:00 ◼   ► think it was high arch as David said but [TS]

00:31:02 ◼   ► I thought it was a fine novel I wouldn't [TS]

00:31:05 ◼   ► read it again because I don't read [TS]

00:31:06 ◼   ► things but uh huh i certainly would read [TS]

00:31:10 ◼   ► another book by paolo bacigalupi but [TS]

00:31:12 ◼   ► apparently not the depth factor don't do [TS]

00:31:13 ◼   ► that one [TS]

00:31:14 ◼   ► no I i would say it's kind of in between [TS]

00:31:16 ◼   ► being the it's not a polemic and it it's [TS]

00:31:21 ◼   ► not like super high art either it's [TS]

00:31:23 ◼   ► summer it's it it's in between it is it [TS]

00:31:25 ◼   ► is it's got a message and it's got a fun [TS]

00:31:27 ◼   ► story and weld them together fairly well [TS]

00:31:29 ◼   ► I didn't react to it like I did when I [TS]

00:31:31 ◼   ► read the windup girl which was wow this [TS]

00:31:33 ◼   ► is amazing i'm going to vote for this [TS]

00:31:34 ◼   ► for the hugo award for best novel which [TS]

00:31:36 ◼   ► I did and it tied for that so it won [TS]

00:31:39 ◼   ► thanks to me I pointed this out [TS]

00:31:41 ◼   ► Paolo Bacigalupi give me a call my votes [TS]

00:31:46 ◼   ► that made the difference anyway if you [TS]

00:31:48 ◼   ► had to reread only one Paolo Bacigalupi [TS]

00:31:50 ◼   ► book i think the window grill is the [TS]

00:31:51 ◼   ► clear choice unless you're a teenager in [TS]

00:31:53 ◼   ► which case it is a ship breaker [TS]

00:31:56 ◼   ► yeah yeah yeahs less depressing in the [TS]

00:31:59 ◼   ► drowned cities [TS]

00:32:00 ◼   ► yeah yeah but you know it comes first [TS]

00:32:02 ◼   ► chronologically in that [TS]

00:32:03 ◼   ► your thoughts here are anything more [TS]

00:32:05 ◼   ► about the water knife before we move on [TS]

00:32:06 ◼   ► to seven Eve's everybody should get all [TS]

00:32:09 ◼   ► right it [TS]

00:32:10 ◼   ► yeah it's fun it's hard it's hard not to [TS]

00:32:12 ◼   ► think about Syrian refugees and he said [TS]

00:32:13 ◼   ► way but yeah it is well set your again [TS]

00:32:15 ◼   ► this is the business the thing in [TS]

00:32:17 ◼   ► drowned cities that he does that he does [TS]

00:32:19 ◼   ► again here is there is nothing that [TS]

00:32:21 ◼   ► makes a stronger point for the plight of [TS]

00:32:23 ◼   ► other people in the world who are in [TS]

00:32:25 ◼   ► terrible situations then reading a story [TS]

00:32:28 ◼   ► where you are the people who are in that [TS]

00:32:30 ◼   ► situation he does that very well and [TS]

00:32:32 ◼   ► it's very last thing the crisis yeah [TS]

00:32:34 ◼   ► alright so we'll move on to seven Eve's [TS]

00:32:40 ◼   ► final Stephenson similar symbols of 800 [TS]

00:32:43 ◼   ► minutes long and internet to the length [TS]

00:32:45 ◼   ► of this seven Eve's is longer in then [TS]

00:32:49 ◼   ► the water knife in that it's 880 pages [TS]

00:32:52 ◼   ► long which for Neal Stephenson is a [TS]

00:32:54 ◼   ► moderately long book it's in novella [TS]

00:32:58 ◼   ► yeah that's as with many long neal [TS]

00:33:01 ◼   ► stephenson books there's a really great [TS]

00:33:03 ◼   ► 400-page novel in here that is correct [TS]

00:33:07 ◼   ► so hard Dave day 3 one's Dave once joked [TS]

00:33:12 ◼   ► about tom clancy that that it was [TS]

00:33:13 ◼   ► basically like you know 400 pages of [TS]

00:33:15 ◼   ► submarine porn and you know 50 pages of [TS]

00:33:18 ◼   ► actual of actual story and i have to [TS]

00:33:21 ◼   ► admit that a lot of this book felt that [TS]

00:33:24 ◼   ► way to be too when I thought well if [TS]

00:33:25 ◼   ► I've ever trapped aboard a space station [TS]

00:33:27 ◼   ► and I need to learn how to dhaka module [TS]

00:33:29 ◼   ► in such a way so as I don't below set of [TS]

00:33:31 ◼   ► orbit [TS]

00:33:32 ◼   ► i am now fully equipped to do so it's [TS]

00:33:35 ◼   ► really be like that space station that [TS]

00:33:37 ◼   ► way so i agree with you and we'll come [TS]

00:33:38 ◼   ► back to that but first i will at least [TS]

00:33:40 ◼   ► say what the seventies is seven Eve's is [TS]

00:33:42 ◼   ► a novel in which a mysterious agent that [TS]

00:33:45 ◼   ► is never really describe blows up the [TS]

00:33:47 ◼   ► moon and the moon slowly is coming apart [TS]

00:33:49 ◼   ► and they and scientists realized that [TS]

00:33:51 ◼   ► this isn't just like it's a bummer i [TS]

00:33:53 ◼   ► like the moon it was it was pretty in [TS]

00:33:54 ◼   ► the sky that the man at the moment [TS]

00:33:57 ◼   ► debris is going to fall at similar to [TS]

00:34:00 ◼   ► other apocalypse books that we've read [TS]

00:34:02 ◼   ► perhaps the last policeman is down there [TS]

00:34:04 ◼   ► while this is all going on in a year to [TS]

00:34:08 ◼   ► basically it's going to be what's called [TS]

00:34:10 ◼   ► the white sky which is when all the [TS]

00:34:11 ◼   ► debris is going to basically re-enter or [TS]

00:34:14 ◼   ► interests orbit and [TS]

00:34:16 ◼   ► and the earth is gonna catch on fire and [TS]

00:34:19 ◼   ► it's going to be uninhabitable for [TS]

00:34:20 ◼   ► hundreds of years and I it's the story [TS]

00:34:24 ◼   ► of the people on the International Space [TS]

00:34:27 ◼   ► Station and its successor modules and [TS]

00:34:31 ◼   ► how they try to figure out how to [TS]

00:34:33 ◼   ► survive and keep the human race alive [TS]

00:34:34 ◼   ► even when the earth is going to be [TS]

00:34:36 ◼   ► boiled and that is the premise of 70 [TS]

00:34:40 ◼   ► years it spends most of its time in in [TS]

00:34:43 ◼   ► outer space [TS]

00:34:44 ◼   ► however and we'll get to this there is [TS]

00:34:46 ◼   ► that there is a a a point at which the [TS]

00:34:49 ◼   ► book shifts and then I I've described [TS]

00:34:53 ◼   ► this to several people as being a [TS]

00:34:54 ◼   ► trilogy in one book because it's kind of [TS]

00:34:58 ◼   ► like that there's kind of the what [TS]

00:35:00 ◼   ► happens before humanity is boiled [TS]

00:35:03 ◼   ► there's the we're working in space after [TS]

00:35:05 ◼   ► the earth has boiled in order to try to [TS]

00:35:07 ◼   ► keep everything together and then [TS]

00:35:09 ◼   ► there's the third part which again will [TS]

00:35:10 ◼   ► get to so that 70 was it is widescreen [TS]

00:35:13 ◼   ► there's a lot going on and to lisa's [TS]

00:35:15 ◼   ► point2 just come to that [TS]

00:35:17 ◼   ► yes Neal Stephenson is a very good [TS]

00:35:19 ◼   ► writer and he's very good at making his [TS]

00:35:21 ◼   ► digressions interesting which every time [TS]

00:35:23 ◼   ► he would get me and I'd be like five [TS]

00:35:25 ◼   ► pages and be like damn it Neal [TS]

00:35:26 ◼   ► Stephenson you made this interesting how [TS]

00:35:28 ◼   ► did you do that because this has nothing [TS]

00:35:30 ◼   ► to do with anything [TS]

00:35:31 ◼   ► and why am I reading this you're just [TS]

00:35:32 ◼   ► showing your work but well here's the [TS]

00:35:35 ◼   ► thing but then in this book and I i I'd [TS]

00:35:38 ◼   ► say more than in other books of his [TS]

00:35:40 ◼   ► there were times where I felt like he [TS]

00:35:42 ◼   ► was literally just putting things in [TS]

00:35:44 ◼   ► because he had done the work and those [TS]

00:35:46 ◼   ► were painful [TS]

00:35:47 ◼   ► where was like you know I mean you know [TS]

00:35:49 ◼   ► either he did himself or he hired [TS]

00:35:51 ◼   ► somebody to do the or orbital mechanics [TS]

00:35:52 ◼   ► or to come up with the how the rocket [TS]

00:35:55 ◼   ► needs to fire in order to go in this [TS]

00:35:57 ◼   ► orbit out of the Lagrange point we've [TS]

00:35:59 ◼   ► got a lot about Lagrange points and get [TS]

00:36:01 ◼   ► to the comment that we're going to bring [TS]

00:36:03 ◼   ► back and all of that and that was you [TS]

00:36:05 ◼   ► know those are the bad kind of [TS]

00:36:06 ◼   ► digressions I can support you know [TS]

00:36:08 ◼   ► what's really funny to me is that I [TS]

00:36:10 ◼   ► actually found the digressions in this [TS]

00:36:11 ◼   ► book far less annoying than readii his [TS]

00:36:14 ◼   ► previous novel of although i think what [TS]

00:36:17 ◼   ► I honest [TS]

00:36:17 ◼   ► well do you fuck do you find orbital [TS]

00:36:19 ◼   ► orbital mechanics more interesting than [TS]

00:36:21 ◼   ► the mechanics of guns [TS]

00:36:22 ◼   ► yeah with like I'm going to say that my [TS]

00:36:25 ◼   ► image garden space probably biases b2b [TS]

00:36:29 ◼   ► like i don't i know nothing about [TS]

00:36:30 ◼   ► orbital mechanics and i do not have the [TS]

00:36:32 ◼   ► math to make have orbital mechanics [TS]

00:36:34 ◼   ► makes sense but the digressions although [TS]

00:36:37 ◼   ► again towards third part got a little [TS]

00:36:39 ◼   ► crazy in the first two parts i actually [TS]

00:36:42 ◼   ► didn't mind it because it was very much [TS]

00:36:44 ◼   ► like yeah I want to know how we're gonna [TS]

00:36:46 ◼   ► solve this problem this impossible [TS]

00:36:48 ◼   ► problem that is impossible to solve [TS]

00:36:50 ◼   ► yeah I want to know about the crazy [TS]

00:36:51 ◼   ► lottery process for sending people up [TS]

00:36:53 ◼   ► from every country and going to visit [TS]

00:36:56 ◼   ► some obscure i forget what I think Asian [TS]

00:37:00 ◼   ► country that they go and visit is it [TS]

00:37:03 ◼   ► bhutan yeah baton sorry I'm when you [TS]

00:37:07 ◼   ► know they're picking the visual [TS]

00:37:08 ◼   ► distributes for the Hunger Games I mean [TS]

00:37:10 ◼   ► yeah but rain [TS]

00:37:12 ◼   ► yeah volunteer yeah but no I'm engine [TS]

00:37:17 ◼   ► you this is two very good halves and [TS]

00:37:21 ◼   ► then a third part i wait [TS]

00:37:24 ◼   ► oh very good have so that I liked her [TS]

00:37:27 ◼   ► better [TS]

00:37:27 ◼   ► look man again well she had an accident [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► so book axis 4.0 the trillions what [TS]

00:37:34 ◼   ► you're saying there's two weeks the [TS]

00:37:35 ◼   ► trilogy seriously I don't see it as a [TS]

00:37:38 ◼   ► trilogy I see it as one really long book [TS]

00:37:41 ◼   ► and then a weird epilogue that just goes [TS]

00:37:43 ◼   ► on a weird a novel way [TS]

00:37:45 ◼   ► epilogue not even novelist enough fella [TS]

00:37:48 ◼   ► it's just weird and I think that's why [TS]

00:37:50 ◼   ► I'm gonna run come back and tell dave [TS]

00:37:53 ◼   ► and reminders kinda like everyday get to [TS]

00:37:55 ◼   ► know [TS]

00:37:55 ◼   ► and ya know if it so so what we're [TS]

00:37:58 ◼   ► talking about it again if if you don't [TS]

00:38:00 ◼   ► want to be well don't listen to podcast [TS]

00:38:02 ◼   ► with my god what are you doing I'm i [TS]

00:38:04 ◼   ► haven't read all 880 pages yet what is [TS]

00:38:06 ◼   ► good as I'm as i'm reading seven Eve's [TS]

00:38:09 ◼   ► I'm thinking to myself there is no way [TS]

00:38:13 ◼   ► that Neal Stephenson is not going to be [TS]

00:38:15 ◼   ► able to write 5,000 years later there's [TS]

00:38:19 ◼   ► no way you've set up this thing where [TS]

00:38:21 ◼   ► they're going to wait five thousand [TS]

00:38:22 ◼   ► years in order to find out if there's [TS]

00:38:24 ◼   ► anybody left alive on earth no writer [TS]

00:38:26 ◼   ► gets going to set that up and not be [TS]

00:38:27 ◼   ► able to pull the trigger and paying off [TS]

00:38:29 ◼   ► so I was well prepared for that moment [TS]

00:38:31 ◼   ► and then there was and i'm like 'i up [TS]

00:38:34 ◼   ► and then we enter the the final phase of [TS]

00:38:38 ◼   ► the book which is a wholly different set [TS]

00:38:40 ◼   ► of characters but descended from the [TS]

00:38:42 ◼   ► characters we know and they have crazy [TS]

00:38:44 ◼   ► adventures on a repop gradually [TS]

00:38:47 ◼   ► repopulating the earth with its own [TS]

00:38:49 ◼   ► showing the research of like how do we [TS]

00:38:51 ◼   ► get the ring to be there in the city is [TS]

00:38:52 ◼   ► in moving explain how that works [TS]

00:38:54 ◼   ► any thoughts about that part of the bow [TS]

00:38:56 ◼   ► madness the part of the last third that [TS]

00:38:59 ◼   ► I like all the crazy giant machines what [TS]

00:39:02 ◼   ► annoyed me and this is a spoiler is that [TS]

00:39:04 ◼   ► people actually survived on the earth [TS]

00:39:07 ◼   ► and it crazily it's the people that were [TS]

00:39:10 ◼   ► on the earth before that we're talking [TS]

00:39:11 ◼   ► to the people on the face that survived [TS]

00:39:13 ◼   ► what oh my gosh you're not completely [TS]

00:39:15 ◼   ► Telegraph for the whole book I mean it [TS]

00:39:17 ◼   ► was like telling IMA submarine we are [TS]

00:39:20 ◼   ► going deeper [TS]

00:39:21 ◼   ► I can't tell you anymore it's a secret [TS]

00:39:23 ◼   ► Shh but we are going deeper and then [TS]

00:39:25 ◼   ► well it's my selfie we are going in [TS]

00:39:27 ◼   ► caves we will close the door in the [TS]

00:39:29 ◼   ► caves look for us later and then do they [TS]

00:39:32 ◼   ► meet the the descendants of the cave [TS]

00:39:35 ◼   ► people and the submarine people [TS]

00:39:36 ◼   ► yeah yes ok so you know what it's it's [TS]

00:39:41 ◼   ► crazy escape of science fiction and I [TS]

00:39:43 ◼   ► don't you know whatever my the the [TS]

00:39:46 ◼   ► biggest tragedy for me and get mega [TS]

00:39:48 ◼   ► spoiler is that our cave friends are [TS]

00:39:51 ◼   ► theoretically descended from Dinah [TS]

00:39:54 ◼   ► character in the story her father who [TS]

00:39:58 ◼   ► have been basically introduced to and in [TS]

00:40:00 ◼   ► fact one of the motion most emotional [TS]

00:40:02 ◼   ► parts at least for me of a book [TS]

00:40:05 ◼   ► and yeah the the more sources whether [TS]

00:40:07 ◼   ► when they're just saying when they're [TS]

00:40:09 ◼   ► saying yeah cute security of my god i [TS]

00:40:11 ◼   ► was i was doing on that but she sent me [TS]

00:40:14 ◼   ► a little more code messages to her [TS]

00:40:15 ◼   ► father from the space station and the [TS]

00:40:18 ◼   ► earth is slowly accepting fire [TS]

00:40:20 ◼   ► yeah exactly and that was such a [TS]

00:40:22 ◼   ► wonderful moment and they build up Rufus [TS]

00:40:24 ◼   ► to be this wonderful human-like very [TS]

00:40:28 ◼   ► human essence of like old world humanity [TS]

00:40:31 ◼   ► and then 5,000 years later [TS]

00:40:34 ◼   ► yeah his descendants are all the worst [TS]

00:40:36 ◼   ► of old-world humanity and assholes and [TS]

00:40:38 ◼   ► probably rape their children and you [TS]

00:40:41 ◼   ► know do horrible things to their young [TS]

00:40:42 ◼   ► women and men people after the [TS]

00:40:44 ◼   ► encyclopedia [TS]

00:40:44 ◼   ► it was just it it felt so like such a [TS]

00:40:48 ◼   ► betrayal of that of that character and [TS]

00:40:51 ◼   ► that family relationship and what I had [TS]

00:40:53 ◼   ► pictured of that family relationship for [TS]

00:40:55 ◼   ► the first thousand pages of the book [TS]

00:40:58 ◼   ► that I that I almost stopped reading at [TS]

00:41:00 ◼   ► that point because i was just like no [TS]

00:41:02 ◼   ► this is you know what I don't care that [TS]

00:41:04 ◼   ► you're going to bring the bring [TS]

00:41:05 ◼   ► descendants back fine whatever it's the [TS]

00:41:07 ◼   ► it's fantasy but to to ruin that carrot [TS]

00:41:11 ◼   ► I don't know it felt like it felt like [TS]

00:41:12 ◼   ► ruining that that arc it felt like no [TS]

00:41:16 ◼   ► sorry if you go into a cave the bad [TS]

00:41:18 ◼   ► people when the end although he did try [TS]

00:41:21 ◼   ► to explain or mansplain depending on [TS]

00:41:24 ◼   ► your Christmas did try to explain away [TS]

00:41:26 ◼   ► by saying listen when you're in a cave [TS]

00:41:27 ◼   ► with limited resources you have to [TS]

00:41:29 ◼   ► become fanatical about reproduction and [TS]

00:41:31 ◼   ► the only way to do that is to establish [TS]

00:41:32 ◼   ► a totalitarian regime and treat people's [TS]

00:41:35 ◼   ► fertility like a community like the [TS]

00:41:36 ◼   ► communal resource and I thought to [TS]

00:41:39 ◼   ► myself that is one way of doing it yes [TS]

00:41:42 ◼   ► but you don't like serenity I thought [TS]

00:41:45 ◼   ► it's disappointing that humanity on the [TS]

00:41:48 ◼   ► grounds on the ground find you seem to [TS]

00:41:51 ◼   ► devolve to to this the stark patriarchal [TS]

00:41:54 ◼   ► tribalism where was his first ask [TS]

00:41:56 ◼   ► questions later I found myself wishing [TS]

00:41:58 ◼   ► that perhaps instead of like touching [TS]

00:42:01 ◼   ► down in Alaska [TS]

00:42:02 ◼   ► Oh quelle coincidence deines descendants [TS]

00:42:06 ◼   ► like it would have been interesting to [TS]

00:42:08 ◼   ► see if some other miners in other parts [TS]

00:42:10 ◼   ► of the world that are famous for their [TS]

00:42:11 ◼   ► mining industries would have had the [TS]

00:42:12 ◼   ► same idea and then you would have been [TS]

00:42:14 ◼   ► dealing with people who didn't have that [TS]

00:42:16 ◼   ► cultural and genetic connect [TS]

00:42:17 ◼   ► action because a lot what I thought so I [TS]

00:42:21 ◼   ► really just like a lot of part 34 a lot [TS]

00:42:23 ◼   ► of reasons but one of the things I [TS]

00:42:24 ◼   ► thought was fascinating was how they had [TS]

00:42:25 ◼   ► basically made a religion of the seven [TS]

00:42:27 ◼   ► Eve's by ceaselessly looping the footage [TS]

00:42:30 ◼   ► in public places [TS]

00:42:31 ◼   ► Andrea indoctrinating people constantly [TS]

00:42:33 ◼   ► by having them see Stephenson seems to [TS]

00:42:36 ◼   ► labor under the sweet delusion that if [TS]

00:42:38 ◼   ► people only have all the facts they'll [TS]

00:42:40 ◼   ► act reasonably and come to some quarter [TS]

00:42:42 ◼   ► cups or cultural accord and this [TS]

00:42:44 ◼   ► delusion is like on full on display in [TS]

00:42:45 ◼   ► part 3 without sin we can just watch the [TS]

00:42:48 ◼   ► footage we can removal ambiguity and [TS]

00:42:51 ◼   ► everybody comes to some sort of common [TS]

00:42:52 ◼   ► cultural candidates to have these people [TS]

00:42:54 ◼   ► behaved with each other and I I thought [TS]

00:42:57 ◼   ► it was really interesting how facts have [TS]

00:43:00 ◼   ► out how the worship of factual narrative [TS]

00:43:02 ◼   ► has become a religious a religious [TS]

00:43:05 ◼   ► belief system for these people 5,000 [TS]

00:43:07 ◼   ► years hence you know what i find really [TS]

00:43:09 ◼   ► interesting there actually is that I [TS]

00:43:11 ◼   ► think Stephenson is even playing on that [TS]

00:43:14 ◼   ► a little bit because we get a whole we [TS]

00:43:16 ◼   ► get a whole bunch between Dinah and IV [TS]

00:43:18 ◼   ► very early on in the book basically what [TS]

00:43:21 ◼   ► two of the people on the space station [TS]

00:43:22 ◼   ► who become two of the seven Eve's we get [TS]

00:43:27 ◼   ► a whole thing back and forth between [TS]

00:43:28 ◼   ► them about basically being on and have [TS]

00:43:31 ◼   ► it you know there's a there's a [TS]

00:43:32 ◼   ► difference between being on and being [TS]

00:43:34 ◼   ► ourselves and there's a difference then [TS]

00:43:36 ◼   ► when the cameras are on and when the [TS]

00:43:38 ◼   ► station cameras are rolling and when we [TS]

00:43:40 ◼   ► can just talk real talk [TS]

00:43:42 ◼   ► and i love the idea of like I maybe [TS]

00:43:45 ◼   ► maybe it was completely out of his head [TS]

00:43:46 ◼   ► by the time that this was written but to [TS]

00:43:48 ◼   ► me it feels very much like someone [TS]

00:43:50 ◼   ► picking up you know the bachelor a lost [TS]

00:43:55 ◼   ► paradise or something and being like [TS]

00:43:56 ◼   ► this is our religion [TS]

00:43:57 ◼   ► these are our descendants we must listen [TS]

00:43:59 ◼   ► to every single word they say and find [TS]

00:44:02 ◼   ► some meaning i would absolutely read the [TS]

00:44:04 ◼   ► science fiction novel based on that [TS]

00:44:05 ◼   ► premise I would have it would be [TS]

00:44:08 ◼   ► hilarious i would i would read that book [TS]

00:44:11 ◼   ► all I would look at my job doing that [TS]

00:44:13 ◼   ► but wow that sounds phenomenal i want to [TS]

00:44:15 ◼   ► read it now and there are a lot of slide [TS]

00:44:20 ◼   ► touches in there there's a lot of the [TS]

00:44:22 ◼   ► book there are a lot of little things [TS]

00:44:23 ◼   ► that I liked and kinda want to take the [TS]

00:44:24 ◼   ► social but about like I thought it was [TS]

00:44:27 ◼   ► both savage and hilarious when he went [TS]

00:44:30 ◼   ► when the journalist who gets up there [TS]

00:44:33 ◼   ► introduces the idea of quote-unquote [TS]

00:44:34 ◼   ► soft cannibalism because to me that [TS]

00:44:37 ◼   ► seems like exactly the kind of idea that [TS]

00:44:38 ◼   ► gets paddled in vc meetings and startups [TS]

00:44:40 ◼   ► and I thought wow that's a really [TS]

00:44:42 ◼   ► vicious commentary on the whole chatter [TS]

00:44:45 ◼   ► on TV chattering classes thing and and [TS]

00:44:47 ◼   ► the way that poor blockers life ended [TS]

00:44:49 ◼   ► was so that's that is somebody something [TS]

00:44:52 ◼   ► some scores and I mean riveting to read [TS]

00:44:55 ◼   ► don't get me wrong but I'm like I said I [TS]

00:44:58 ◼   ► the big problem I had with part 3 was of [TS]

00:45:02 ◼   ► PTFE is existence of the the deep diving [TS]

00:45:05 ◼   ► species of the pingers that's right and [TS]

00:45:08 ◼   ► that part of its like women are you see [TS]

00:45:10 ◼   ► how how would a bunch of people in a [TS]

00:45:12 ◼   ► submarine have radically altered the [TS]

00:45:13 ◼   ► human genome to the point they would [TS]

00:45:15 ◼   ► have had to over 5,000 years to produce [TS]

00:45:17 ◼   ► what is essentially a race of man seals [TS]

00:45:20 ◼   ► you know God at that guy like that side [TS]

00:45:24 ◼   ► weird [TS]

00:45:25 ◼   ► yeah like the science like I realize [TS]

00:45:27 ◼   ► mind you that you know where this is [TS]

00:45:30 ◼   ► America is a weird thing to snark about [TS]

00:45:32 ◼   ► in in this and especially since genetic [TS]

00:45:35 ◼   ► engineering does play a huge part with [TS]

00:45:38 ◼   ► the the races that have descended from [TS]

00:45:40 ◼   ► the seven Eve's but I was like you know [TS]

00:45:42 ◼   ► I don't feel like this is [TS]

00:45:44 ◼   ► well-researched Aurora's carefully [TS]

00:45:46 ◼   ► thought-out as again all the stuff that [TS]

00:45:48 ◼   ► has to do with the space nerdery like [TS]

00:45:50 ◼   ► the space nerdery that is that is stuff [TS]

00:45:53 ◼   ► for you could probably get a boatload of [TS]

00:45:54 ◼   ► NASA people really like no story checks [TS]

00:45:56 ◼   ► out [TS]

00:45:57 ◼   ► um but when it came to the genetic [TS]

00:45:59 ◼   ► engineering on there's almost no [TS]

00:46:02 ◼   ► explanation for for any of it and that [TS]

00:46:05 ◼   ► kind of bug because i thought you're [TS]

00:46:06 ◼   ► talking about fundamentally altering a [TS]

00:46:08 ◼   ► human genome and you're talking about a [TS]

00:46:10 ◼   ► very small group of of raw material to [TS]

00:46:13 ◼   ► begin with and it's like I can't make it [TS]

00:46:16 ◼   ► work in my head I can't suspend [TS]

00:46:18 ◼   ► disbelief for it i think one of the [TS]

00:46:20 ◼   ► problems with this book is that it's i'm [TS]

00:46:23 ◼   ► not convinced that any of its science is [TS]

00:46:25 ◼   ► anything but ridiculous which makes it a [TS]

00:46:27 ◼   ► lot harder to sit through the downloads [TS]

00:46:29 ◼   ► the fact the idea that we're going to [TS]

00:46:31 ◼   ► take kind of a retrofitted International [TS]

00:46:33 ◼   ► Space Station and just put a bunch of [TS]

00:46:35 ◼   ► stuff up there and people are totally [TS]

00:46:37 ◼   ► going to figure out how to survive in [TS]

00:46:39 ◼   ► space without any contact with earth for [TS]

00:46:41 ◼   ► 5,000 years [TS]

00:46:43 ◼   ► no that's not gonna work it's not gonna [TS]

00:46:46 ◼   ► work and and he didn't prove to me [TS]

00:46:48 ◼   ► anything that would suggest that it does [TS]

00:46:49 ◼   ► it would work [TS]

00:46:51 ◼   ► it's sort of like lots of waving of the [TS]

00:46:53 ◼   ► hands like no no we're resourceful we'll [TS]

00:46:55 ◼   ► figure it out like now I don't think [TS]

00:46:57 ◼   ► anything you provided here would really [TS]

00:46:59 ◼   ► legitimately work and then the fact that [TS]

00:47:02 ◼   ► that by the time you get to the midpoint [TS]

00:47:04 ◼   ► of the book almost everybody has died [TS]

00:47:07 ◼   ► already kind of love that actually like [TS]

00:47:10 ◼   ► that's the part that feels very [TS]

00:47:12 ◼   ► realistic sure horrible but then [TS]

00:47:13 ◼   ► everybody does this bien price and yes [TS]

00:47:16 ◼   ► and no you don't get to space to get a [TS]

00:47:18 ◼   ► nice burgundy comes back having died for [TS]

00:47:20 ◼   ► rectal bleeding [TS]

00:47:21 ◼   ► oh yeah that's a little i thought that [TS]

00:47:23 ◼   ► was kind of cool when the Elon Musk [TS]

00:47:24 ◼   ► analog goes to a comet and brings it [TS]

00:47:28 ◼   ► back but I got a lot comment yeah for [TS]

00:47:30 ◼   ► the other grass Tyson gets the space [TS]

00:47:32 ◼   ► cancer [TS]

00:47:33 ◼   ► yeah everybody gets the space cancer [TS]

00:47:35 ◼   ► except for except for the Carly Fiorina [TS]

00:47:37 ◼   ► stand injustice a bolt through the [TS]

00:47:40 ◼   ► tongue so there is any old deGrasse [TS]

00:47:44 ◼   ► Tyson analog yeah in here the daughter [TS]

00:47:47 ◼   ► here's a good kid alright so this is the [TS]

00:47:49 ◼   ► thing that has been bugging me about [TS]

00:47:49 ◼   ► this book ever since I right and can I [TS]

00:47:51 ◼   ► talk about with you like they have they [TS]

00:47:53 ◼   ► have a son i have the summit of the [TS]

00:47:55 ◼   ► seven Eve's the the seven women who are [TS]

00:47:57 ◼   ► literally that the last of the human [TS]

00:47:59 ◼   ► race out in space [TS]

00:48:00 ◼   ► one of them is patently insane [TS]

00:48:03 ◼   ► yes and and one of them is just an evil [TS]

00:48:06 ◼   ► woman who is whoo-hoo-hoo let's face it [TS]

00:48:09 ◼   ► basically precipitated the crisis that [TS]

00:48:12 ◼   ► they find themselves and now thanks to [TS]

00:48:13 ◼   ► her like breaking the crater lake accord [TS]

00:48:15 ◼   ► and causing a cosmic incident and then [TS]

00:48:18 ◼   ► causing the insurrection that causes [TS]

00:48:19 ◼   ► them to lose all their germplasm blah [TS]

00:48:21 ◼   ► why on earth would you let these to [TS]

00:48:23 ◼   ► reproduce like why didn't anyone like [TS]

00:48:25 ◼   ► just without the space gun at that point [TS]

00:48:28 ◼   ► and go right you're out boom boom [TS]

00:48:29 ◼   ► okay we got five of us here let's run [TS]

00:48:31 ◼   ► the numbers like I just do not get the [TS]

00:48:34 ◼   ► point [TS]

00:48:34 ◼   ► why do not kill Peeta and Julia when you [TS]

00:48:37 ◼   ► get the chance what is the point to keep [TS]

00:48:39 ◼   ► him around again wouldn't have a [TS]

00:48:41 ◼   ► palindrome you [TS]

00:48:42 ◼   ► well that's true but also there were [TS]

00:48:44 ◼   ► what their eight there's one person who [TS]

00:48:45 ◼   ► was too old to me yeah i mean he's right [TS]

00:48:48 ◼   ► so that means they think they're the [TS]

00:48:49 ◼   ► last eight humans in the universe and [TS]

00:48:53 ◼   ► even if two of them are not so great a [TS]

00:48:56 ◼   ► that's that's a quarter of the human [TS]

00:48:58 ◼   ► race right that you're just gonna kill [TS]

00:48:59 ◼   ► tonight improving the species [TS]

00:49:02 ◼   ► well yeah I mean that the holistic way [TS]

00:49:05 ◼   ► of looking at it and I do think I do [TS]

00:49:07 ◼   ► think there's a very valid point there [TS]

00:49:08 ◼   ► especially when we do flash 5,000 years [TS]

00:49:11 ◼   ► later it's like oh yeah these guys [TS]

00:49:12 ◼   ► stealing my and everybody more [TS]

00:49:15 ◼   ► interesting with yeah that's right of [TS]

00:49:17 ◼   ► course it's an it's a rice it's a race [TS]

00:49:19 ◼   ► bread of the aggressors and cannibals [TS]

00:49:21 ◼   ► when you expect like I am all for nature [TS]

00:49:24 ◼   ► over nurture over nature and all of that [TS]

00:49:26 ◼   ► but yeah I the only way i can [TS]

00:49:30 ◼   ► rationalize it is Scott's thing where [TS]

00:49:32 ◼   ► it's like these like these women as [TS]

00:49:34 ◼   ► crazy as they are have been through so [TS]

00:49:37 ◼   ► much together that there's just there's [TS]

00:49:39 ◼   ► a at this point and line in the sand I [TS]

00:49:41 ◼   ► mean Dinah's pretty much ready to blow [TS]

00:49:43 ◼   ► everybody up at the end anyway I just be [TS]

00:49:45 ◼   ► like I we don't we don't deserve it [TS]

00:49:48 ◼   ► yeah and that would have been an [TS]

00:49:50 ◼   ► interesting thing if but then what that [TS]

00:49:52 ◼   ► does is 5,000 years later like the [TS]

00:49:54 ◼   ► people come out of there came an Alaskan [TS]

00:49:56 ◼   ► like crap nobody has bothered prepping [TS]

00:49:58 ◼   ► the atmosphere that last two tests and [TS]

00:49:59 ◼   ► here's real steel hose to go back inside [TS]

00:50:03 ◼   ► and your eyes the encyclopedia is my [TS]

00:50:05 ◼   ► love sonar tax law so our tracks Liza [TS]

00:50:08 ◼   ► door so that I anyways he's probably [TS]

00:50:11 ◼   ► been raped by the creepy Bollman yeah [TS]

00:50:13 ◼   ► but she's found true love with ms yeah [TS]

00:50:15 ◼   ► and as and has a companion deep [TS]

00:50:18 ◼   ► knowledge of many subjects between smt [TS]

00:50:21 ◼   ► yeah between sonar in tax on her hand up [TS]

00:50:25 ◼   ► it was interesting how they balanced out [TS]

00:50:27 ◼   ► the devolution from a written culture to [TS]

00:50:29 ◼   ► an oral culture to I thought I thought [TS]

00:50:30 ◼   ► that part was pretty I was like okay [TS]

00:50:32 ◼   ► maybe maybe the acceptance dr. [TS]

00:50:34 ◼   ► communication scholar because they're [TS]

00:50:35 ◼   ► there are significant cognitive [TS]

00:50:37 ◼   ► differences in language differences [TS]

00:50:39 ◼   ► between oral cultures and written [TS]

00:50:41 ◼   ► cultures and how you transmit pass [TS]

00:50:43 ◼   ► information down he got that right part [TS]

00:50:46 ◼   ► of my beef and I i just put this on [TS]

00:50:47 ◼   ► Twitter chatter is Sharia stepper wrote [TS]

00:50:50 ◼   ► this fantastic book back in 1996 called [TS]

00:50:52 ◼   ► Gibbons decline and fall which science [TS]

00:50:56 ◼   ► fiction as with a lot of her books [TS]

00:50:57 ◼   ► reproductive freedom is one of the [TS]

00:50:59 ◼   ► predominant platico through it and at [TS]

00:51:02 ◼   ► the end the protagonist is handed six [TS]

00:51:05 ◼   ► different color vials [TS]

00:51:07 ◼   ► and said ok you can figure out how to [TS]

00:51:09 ◼   ► guarantee the reproduction of the [TS]

00:51:10 ◼   ► species one it's business as usual usual [TS]

00:51:12 ◼   ► to its parthenogenesis three and and the [TS]

00:51:16 ◼   ► ideas that she has to pick the future of [TS]

00:51:18 ◼   ► the species and I I couldn't stop [TS]

00:51:20 ◼   ► thinking about that scene in that book [TS]

00:51:22 ◼   ► during that the summit of the seven [TS]

00:51:24 ◼   ► Eve's plus Louisa because i thought wow [TS]

00:51:26 ◼   ► this was done a lot better by Carrie [TS]

00:51:29 ◼   ► temper 20 years or so and that was [TS]

00:51:33 ◼   ► enough actually points to another [TS]

00:51:35 ◼   ► problem i have with the whole oh and [TS]

00:51:37 ◼   ► here's how we manage to five thousand [TS]

00:51:39 ◼   ► years of culture in our little space [TS]

00:51:40 ◼   ► structures and we now have what amounts [TS]

00:51:43 ◼   ► to the US and Soviet relations and so on [TS]

00:51:45 ◼   ► and so forth is um John Varley who we [TS]

00:51:47 ◼   ► have discussed in earlier apocalypse [TS]

00:51:50 ◼   ► type book clubs back in the seventies [TS]

00:51:53 ◼   ► John Varley what a novel called the OPG [TS]

00:51:55 ◼   ► hotline and the premise was that a bunch [TS]

00:51:59 ◼   ► of aliens watched how humans were [TS]

00:52:01 ◼   ► treating other species and said okay [TS]

00:52:03 ◼   ► right we're on the dolphins and the [TS]

00:52:04 ◼   ► Whale side here and then managed to a [TS]

00:52:07 ◼   ► neutralize all human technology to [TS]

00:52:09 ◼   ► attempt to cleanse the earth of humans [TS]

00:52:11 ◼   ► and the only people who could the only [TS]

00:52:15 ◼   ► the only people who survived four people [TS]

00:52:16 ◼   ► on a space station and they colonize the [TS]

00:52:19 ◼   ► column is the moon and then Charlie has [TS]

00:52:23 ◼   ► a whole host of short stories and a [TS]

00:52:24 ◼   ► couple more novels about Lunar Society [TS]

00:52:27 ◼   ► lunar culture and they are fantastically [TS]

00:52:31 ◼   ► thought out from a sociological [TS]

00:52:32 ◼   ► perspective and it culminates in the [TS]

00:52:34 ◼   ► novel steel Beach which talks about the [TS]

00:52:36 ◼   ► depression that people have when you are [TS]

00:52:39 ◼   ► raised in an environment that you simply [TS]

00:52:41 ◼   ► haven't evolved to and I thought well [TS]

00:52:44 ◼   ► you know if they've already got the [TS]

00:52:45 ◼   ► genetic engineering going on with the [TS]

00:52:46 ◼   ► races at the seven Eve's why don't they [TS]

00:52:49 ◼   ► talk a little bit more explicitly about [TS]

00:52:51 ◼   ► what it would take to evolve us to the [TS]

00:52:54 ◼   ► two of all human beings to the point [TS]

00:52:55 ◼   ► where they're totally okay living in a [TS]

00:52:57 ◼   ► world that that literally does not [TS]

00:52:59 ◼   ► paying any of the Paleolithic cuff [TS]

00:53:00 ◼   ► buttons we had installed like there were [TS]

00:53:02 ◼   ► a few illusions here and there with a [TS]

00:53:04 ◼   ► calf to and how she was suffering from [TS]

00:53:06 ◼   ► sensory overload when she was gliding [TS]

00:53:07 ◼   ► around stuff like that but again it felt [TS]

00:53:10 ◼   ► like this question either didn't [TS]

00:53:11 ◼   ► interest him enough to answer or like he [TS]

00:53:14 ◼   ► didn't even think about it and I just [TS]

00:53:15 ◼   ► kept thinking how Farley did this better [TS]

00:53:16 ◼   ► and early too [TS]

00:53:17 ◼   ► earlier and that's not a good sign when [TS]

00:53:19 ◼   ► you're reading an absorbing 900-page [TS]

00:53:21 ◼   ► epic and you like up [TS]

00:53:22 ◼   ► read it read it read it seen them since [TS]

00:53:24 ◼   ► done it's been done better here you know [TS]

00:53:26 ◼   ► about you suggested that you you liked [TS]

00:53:30 ◼   ► the end part so I'm a big fan of space [TS]

00:53:33 ◼   ► opera and so this is you know when [TS]

00:53:35 ◼   ► they're he's talking about these giant [TS]

00:53:37 ◼   ► space rings and I like reading about the [TS]

00:53:40 ◼   ► the hardware which is why i like [TS]

00:53:43 ◼   ► military science fiction because a lot [TS]

00:53:45 ◼   ► of time is spent lavished on hardware [TS]

00:53:46 ◼   ► right there's a lot of that they're so [TS]

00:53:49 ◼   ► there's a lot of that and the third part [TS]

00:53:51 ◼   ► there's a lot of the first and second [TS]

00:53:52 ◼   ► part but that's more you know like [TS]

00:53:53 ◼   ► current technology plus a lot of chain [TS]

00:53:57 ◼   ► physics which I didn't find all having [TS]

00:53:58 ◼   ► fascinating but I think Neal Stephenson [TS]

00:54:01 ◼   ► really find it interesting [TS]

00:54:02 ◼   ► clearly he does so but i thought i liked [TS]

00:54:06 ◼   ► the the first part the most i think when [TS]

00:54:09 ◼   ► they're you know neil degrasse tyson was [TS]

00:54:11 ◼   ► trying to figure out what what it means [TS]

00:54:13 ◼   ► that the moon has exploded and he [TS]

00:54:15 ◼   ► figures that he's horrified that's your [TS]

00:54:17 ◼   ► disaster story right that's your classic [TS]

00:54:19 ◼   ► disaster story parts portion of this [TS]

00:54:21 ◼   ► book [TS]

00:54:22 ◼   ► yes I thought that was the best part if [TS]

00:54:23 ◼   ► I would have but now i'm going to rank [TS]

00:54:25 ◼   ► the parts i agree with the first part [TS]

00:54:26 ◼   ► was the best part the second part was [TS]

00:54:28 ◼   ► the second best part and the third part [TS]

00:54:30 ◼   ► i was the third best part III the third [TS]

00:54:34 ◼   ► hurts me to 5th or 6th best part really [TS]

00:54:36 ◼   ► come yeah I you know I like to I like [TS]

00:54:39 ◼   ► the third part but i think really that [TS]

00:54:42 ◼   ► renders comments about it are right on [TS]

00:54:45 ◼   ► which is I think it's actually more [TS]

00:54:47 ◼   ► problematic when you're thinking about [TS]

00:54:48 ◼   ► the direction it's pointed from the [TS]

00:54:50 ◼   ► first two parts and thinking about the [TS]

00:54:52 ◼   ► the families of these various people i [TS]

00:54:54 ◼   ► thought it was interesting I thought it [TS]

00:54:55 ◼   ► went on too long and had way too much [TS]

00:54:58 ◼   ► detail on how the various objects that [TS]

00:55:01 ◼   ► have been built around the earth work [TS]

00:55:03 ◼   ► but that's again i feel like i like [TS]

00:55:05 ◼   ► everything you did your email Stephenson [TS]

00:55:06 ◼   ► he's just gonna show his work he is [TS]

00:55:10 ◼   ► going to show his work in a lot of ways [TS]

00:55:11 ◼   ► that you don't yeah he doesn't do a [TS]

00:55:13 ◼   ► grocery store list that going to like a [TS]

00:55:14 ◼   ► two-page digression on the mechanics of [TS]

00:55:16 ◼   ► refrigeration and how grocery stores [TS]

00:55:18 ◼   ► came to be because it's an interesting [TS]

00:55:19 ◼   ► story and i like that in general and I [TS]

00:55:25 ◼   ► also i like he so the chain thing I [TS]

00:55:27 ◼   ► thought was annoying but he did thread [TS]

00:55:29 ◼   ► it through the hole [TS]

00:55:30 ◼   ► every part had a part with the chain you [TS]

00:55:33 ◼   ► know they had weapons that were were [TS]

00:55:34 ◼   ► based on that chain thing and part of [TS]

00:55:36 ◼   ► the whole giant megastructures part [TS]

00:55:38 ◼   ► changed so he put it through which I [TS]

00:55:40 ◼   ► appreciated i did still think it was [TS]

00:55:42 ◼   ► annoying but I appreciate the work you [TS]

00:55:44 ◼   ► did you put in there that that's why I [TS]

00:55:46 ◼   ► usually avoid deal Stevenson was at his [TS]

00:55:49 ◼   ► best [TS]

00:55:50 ◼   ► I find him to be a slog so I didn't [TS]

00:55:53 ◼   ► think this was some of his best now and [TS]

00:55:55 ◼   ► I mean justjust contrasting the two [TS]

00:55:57 ◼   ► books the water knife i read in about [TS]

00:56:00 ◼   ► seventy-two hours and this took me about [TS]

00:56:02 ◼   ► two and a half weeks you know about Izzy [TS]

00:56:04 ◼   ► times longer than the white is 80 so but [TS]

00:56:07 ◼   ► actually sitting down saying i have to [TS]

00:56:11 ◼   ► keep reading this because i'm going to [TS]

00:56:13 ◼   ► talk about it and where is put the other [TS]

00:56:15 ◼   ► one was like I want to find out what [TS]

00:56:17 ◼   ► happens and you know again it was you [TS]

00:56:19 ◼   ► know been there done that read that seem [TS]

00:56:22 ◼   ► that you know and and I kept coming back [TS]

00:56:25 ◼   ► to a julienne may if you want to see [TS]

00:56:27 ◼   ► someone handle while families across [TS]

00:56:31 ◼   ► that was memorizing zip years are you to [TS]

00:56:34 ◼   ► get our dynasty yeah oh my god yeah [TS]

00:56:37 ◼   ► those books yeah yeah that's that's good [TS]

00:56:40 ◼   ► stuff [TS]

00:56:40 ◼   ► so this was sort of like oh you came up [TS]

00:56:43 ◼   ► with a palindrome good job I wife and I [TS]

00:56:47 ◼   ► think you're right there is a really [TS]

00:56:48 ◼   ► good novel hidden inside here it is the [TS]

00:56:50 ◼   ► last policeman ok i enjoyed this book [TS]

00:56:55 ◼   ► and I read a couple of interviews with [TS]

00:56:57 ◼   ► Stephenson and he his goal and I think [TS]

00:57:00 ◼   ► that he has a group of science fiction [TS]

00:57:01 ◼   ► authors that he's buddy-buddy with who [TS]

00:57:03 ◼   ► all think that people have lost sight of [TS]

00:57:06 ◼   ► trying to do big challenges and do big [TS]

00:57:09 ◼   ► science so this was kind of his clarion [TS]

00:57:11 ◼   ► call to have big ideas so he wrote this [TS]

00:57:14 ◼   ► big epic swimming thing which I think [TS]

00:57:16 ◼   ► talk speaks a little bit to the fact [TS]

00:57:18 ◼   ► that he kind of the people don't really [TS]

00:57:20 ◼   ► matter because they are banding together [TS]

00:57:21 ◼   ► to solve this giant problem and it's not [TS]

00:57:24 ◼   ► about individuals and I understand you [TS]

00:57:26 ◼   ► know i agree with you Lisa in that the [TS]

00:57:28 ◼   ► stories are of course the most [TS]

00:57:30 ◼   ► interesting when you have a character [TS]

00:57:32 ◼   ► that you kind of feel invested in and [TS]

00:57:34 ◼   ► can humanize but i don't think i think [TS]

00:57:36 ◼   ► it was a conscious decision on his point [TS]

00:57:38 ◼   ► part not to do that at [TS]

00:57:41 ◼   ► or not that makes it good or bad I won't [TS]

00:57:42 ◼   ► yeah I read some interviews right he [TS]

00:57:44 ◼   ► said the same thing he's all yeah I [TS]

00:57:45 ◼   ► wanted to bring back this commitment to [TS]

00:57:47 ◼   ► ideas that science fiction can inspire [TS]

00:57:49 ◼   ► people to do big ideas and I thought to [TS]

00:57:52 ◼   ► myself yeah characters are important and [TS]

00:57:54 ◼   ► he you know people can unite around an [TS]

00:57:55 ◼   ► idea i thought yeah but you know what [TS]

00:57:56 ◼   ► that was called that one's called the [TS]

00:57:57 ◼   ► Martian when you know where everyone [TS]

00:57:59 ◼   ► United around the idea of bringing home [TS]

00:58:00 ◼   ► those dudes stranded on Mars so maybe [TS]

00:58:03 ◼   ► maybe it is possible to advocate for big [TS]

00:58:06 ◼   ► ideas while remembering that ideas are [TS]

00:58:08 ◼   ► only successful when you can figure out [TS]

00:58:10 ◼   ► how to how to have put humanity into the [TS]

00:58:12 ◼   ► picture because they're the ones execute [TS]

00:58:14 ◼   ► the ideas if you know anyone character [TS]

00:58:16 ◼   ► in the Martian you can you cannot [TS]

00:58:18 ◼   ► potatoes you can you go right now in [TS]

00:58:20 ◼   ► other words that's that are full of [TS]

00:58:21 ◼   ► ideas but you have to have a story that [TS]

00:58:23 ◼   ► makes people want to rally around those [TS]

00:58:25 ◼   ► ideas and I think that's one of the [TS]

00:58:27 ◼   ► places where Stevens and often struggles [TS]

00:58:29 ◼   ► is that that that's when he is i'm going [TS]

00:58:30 ◼   ► to show you how I did all this work and [TS]

00:58:32 ◼   ► again I think he's so talented that he [TS]

00:58:34 ◼   ► can often pull it pull it off but I i [TS]

00:58:37 ◼   ► think that i think it's a challenge in [TS]

00:58:39 ◼   ► and in this case I you know I read it I [TS]

00:58:42 ◼   ► read it all [TS]

00:58:43 ◼   ► I read it relatively quickly these are [TS]

00:58:46 ◼   ► all things go in the back panties are [TS]

00:58:48 ◼   ► coming i read it all home i mean i [TS]

00:58:51 ◼   ► didn't i didn't know how to run it and [TS]

00:58:52 ◼   ► in fact I read it fairly quickly so we [TS]

00:58:54 ◼   ► passed to the test but that all said I i [TS]

00:58:57 ◼   ► found myself kind of squinting and being [TS]

00:59:00 ◼   ► like really deal Stephenson way more [TS]

00:59:03 ◼   ► than I usually do in his book and so [TS]

00:59:05 ◼   ► that for me I have to say I was kind of [TS]

00:59:06 ◼   ► disappointed even though there's a lot [TS]

00:59:07 ◼   ► of great [TS]

00:59:08 ◼   ► there's a lot of great stuff in this [TS]

00:59:09 ◼   ► book it's just a really big book and [TS]

00:59:11 ◼   ► there's a lot of not great stuff in it [TS]

00:59:13 ◼   ► to me did a very good editor which it [TS]

00:59:15 ◼   ► did [TS]

00:59:16 ◼   ► now there's a guy named do i just-i [TS]

00:59:19 ◼   ► can't-- the past do business i wonder if [TS]

00:59:22 ◼   ► Neil deGrasse Tyson's like a total [TS]

00:59:23 ◼   ► stoner as a college they have this side [TS]

00:59:26 ◼   ► joke I can't because I was like whether [TS]

00:59:28 ◼   ► it's a neil degrasse tyson person and [TS]

00:59:30 ◼   ► and then that's a lot mosque and then [TS]

00:59:32 ◼   ► when you get to Julia I was I was going [TS]

00:59:35 ◼   ► through like okay it's not Sarah Palin [TS]

00:59:37 ◼   ► but it's no it's yeah I don't know it [TS]

00:59:41 ◼   ► he's a visa frustrating and and [TS]