The Accidental Tech Podcast

268: A Tarnished Brass Age


  they're not selling the a leaven chip to

  other cell phone makers this is not a

  thing they do and we just assume if they

  were going to make chips for the Mac's

  they also wouldn't say oh this is our

  new business now by the way we're

  selling chips to everybody in the

  industry and what that would mean is

  that max would have CPUs that are not

  the same as the CPUs that are running in

  other things in the industry and what so

  what is that who cares well it was it

  matter or don't we just care if we have

  a nice CPU and iMac well right now we

  are in a a I know what you'd call it a

  Golden Age used to be a golden age now

  it's not quite golden now it's more of

  like a tarnished brass age anyway we're

  where max use the same CPUs that are

  also used in the servers further we run

  server-side software in which means that

  if you're writing server-side software

  and using the Mac as your dev

  environment you can run VMs and you can

  run docker and you can do all sorts of

  things and run the same software that's

  running on your server locally on your

  Mac because they're both x86 64 CPUs

  right and to a lesser extent you can

  also run Windows stuff because render

  ones the next 86 thinker on Windows in

  virtualization and high-speed so it's

  over line and those are real advantages

  for certain constituencies of pro Mac

  users who use the the Mac as like a

  development platform for writing

  server-side software and maybe just

  because I'm in that world that I see it

  a lot but I have been shocked over the

  course of my career how prevalent Mac's

  have become for people who essentially

  you know not know who pejoratively used

  them as glorified terminals right I

  don't think that's really true because

  lots of people do local development like

  they will you know they will run docker

  on their Mac they will run you know a

  VirtualBox on their Mac or whatever and

  they will use software and binaries that

  run on the server they will run them on

  their Mac alright and so they're not

  just using this glorified terminal but

  actually doing local development that is

  one class of software developer these

  server-side software developers so if

  Apple makes a CPU transition the Mac as

  a server-side software dev platform

  becomes far less attractive because

  apples not going to sell those CPUs to

  run on the server and now it could be if

  they just use the same instruction set

  and somehow armed on the server becomes

  a thing lots of companies have been

  trying to make armor and the server

  birthing for a long time hasn't quite

  happened but if Apple's not gonna make

  it happen and no one else makes it

  happen and Intel continues to endure

  even AMD continue to dominate the server

  space with x86 64

  it makes the Mac Mac less attractive to

  in one particular area and same thing

  for Windows I'm just picking this

  example but if you rely on the ability

  to run Windows virtualized Windows at

  full speed as part of some important

  business that you do let's use a Mac

  when previously you couldn't because you

  can also run a Windows on it I know when

  those is ported to arm as well right but

  it really just depends on do people

  portal or Windows software arm do they

  recompile it for arm do most pcs sold

  become arm

  ideally whatever transition Apple makes

  the whole rest of the industry would

  also make pcs servers everything whether

  or not Apple helps them naked I think

  Apple will not help them make it so the

  only way we can get maintain the golden

  age where everything runs on the same

  platform is if the rest of the industry

  also transitions more or less at the

  same time without any of Apple's help

  which seems unlikely to me so that would

  make me slightly more sad and I think it

  would make the app the Mac slightly less

  desirable or even viable for certain Pro

  applications everything else that the

  Mac normally does no one cares you can

  develop Mac software on it you could run

  all your applications you can browse the

  web so it's probably not that big of a

  deal but it is the one angle that I have

  found myself pondering you know if I'm

  able to bring myself to believe that

  they're really gonna do this actually be

  like how would it change my experience

  of Mac's you know what would it and I'd

  even get into you know playing Windows

  games with our guess who cares that's

  really small but I look around my big

  company full of hundreds of developers

  and how many Mac's I see and everything

  they're doing with them and think what

  if that Mac was armed but all of our

  servers were still x86 how would that

  change how viable the Mac is for you and

  I think it would be would be worse so

  that's one more thing for me to not look

  forward to on the flip side of that is

  what Mark was talking about how awesome

  would be

  Thompson I frankly I think how awesome

  it would be on the Mac Pro I would love

  to see a massive multi-core apple design

  ARM processor that outperforms a Xeon

  with less power I would love that and I

  think it's 100% possible maybe on

  Apple's second or third try and help

  maybe on their first try those people

  are really smart but there are some

  things I would miss one other thing to

  think about is like you know we're

  assuming that you know if Apple does

  this transition that the processor is

  being in their hands would be a good

  thing and that they would outperform or

  they would match or I perform what Intel

  is doing and the assumption in that is

  that they will always or at least for a

  long time

  outperform what the rest of the PC

  industry is doing but that might not

  hold like it might be what if they can

  put this transition and then they find

  themselves actually not doing as well as

  the PC industry or not caring as much

  about the processors of developing for

  the Mac and therefore like you know

  today we have the issue of you know it

  doesn't see them I take care as much

  about the Mac but as they do about iOS

  so you know they have like these product

  lines that just sit around forever when

  at when Intel does make a new generation

  of processor it's not that much work to

  create to update these new product lines

  to use that new component it's way less

  engineering resources to take Intel's

  newest chip and stick it in the Mac you

  already have designed than it is to

  design the next version of the you know

  a10 you know quadruple x whatever

  whatever it is that would be like you

  know the high-performance version of

  this this year's a series processor it's

  very possible that could backfire on us

  like it could be that Apple takes it

  over then down the road decides the Mac

  is not that you know important to them

  which wouldn't be unheard of because

  that's already how it's been and then

  they just never update those chips for

  those compute for the Mac and because as

  John's like because they're not selling

  these chips outside of Apple which I can

  never see them doing there would be no

  other pressure for them to keep those

  chips updated so they actually might

  make them like it would basically raise

  the car

  of updating the Mack line to keep pace

  with the latest and greatest hardware

  and I think the last thing Apple he

  heats us for that cost to be raised

  because right now they already seem to

  have a lot of trouble justifying

  investment in the Mac so if it's more

  expensive to update the Mac to you know

  update Mac hardware to the latest

  generation of whatever that actually

  could really backfire quite badly on us

  and we that could result in even less

  attention even fewer updates even less

  competitive performance to what the rest

  of industry is doing it's like the the

  trashcan Mac Pro we were like oh why

  isn't Apple updated to use the latest

  Zeon's we'll imagine there were no

  latest eons and I would say we're using

  the highest performance yes a whatever

  processes are available it's like yeah

  but well you got me there I mean they

  are you just haven't made another one so

  technically it is still using the

  fastest one Yeah right like you get the

  good and the bad with like bringing this

  stuff in-house to Apple you get probably

  pretty good performance and power

  efficiency gains but at the cost of now

  you're at the wins of Apple and Apple is

  you know fickle and in in many areas

  unreliable and you know this you would

  be at the whims of whatever they felt

  worth doing even more than you are now

  because the cost of keeping the things

  updated would be higher to them that's

  worth mentioning the other angle that a

  lot of people are talking about mostly

  because this Bloomberg article is so

  careful not to say anything definitive

  about anything they're like well you

  know that Bloomberg girl doesn't

  actually say arm anywhere they're just

  Apple would make its own chips what if

  they make their own x86 chips and they

  can do that you know money solves a lot

  of problems

  patents licensing instruction set

  whatever you know dealing with Intel

  like assuming you threw enough money of

  the people you need to throw money at to

  be allowed to do that

  Alpo could probably make a pretty good

  x86 chip I have a hard time believing

  Apple could make it substantially better

  x86 check than Intel because apples

  expertise thus far has been in making

  arm CPUs and x86 even just plain old


  664 is a much more let's say warty

  instruction set than arm it's got a lot

  of history behind it it's weird in lots

  of interesting ways and intel has a lot

  of experience and you know instruction

  decode hardware and all sorts of you

  know chip within a chip ways to crack

  apart those big variable with

  instructions and feed it into a machine

  that works more like a modern processor

  on the inside I mean it's not as big a

  difference as people think because

  modern you know arm risk style

  processors also have to do lots of weird

  stuff internally as well but there's a

  lot of institutional expertise both AMD

  and Intel have that Apple does not have

  when it comes to figuring out how to

  make the x86 instruction set faster even

  just the x86 64 one which is much nicer

  than a 32-bit or let alone the 16-bit or

  whatever variants so I it that seems

  much less likely to me like it really

  hammers on what Marko was getting at

  which is like okay Apple now you're on

  now you have something to keep up with

  you're making your own x86 chips and so

  we can still ask the question hey Apple

  you have an update that whatever chip in

  your whatever Mac for a long time

  meanwhile Intel has released three new

  chips that are faster what's the deal

  you could just use those Intel chips why

  did you go on your own or it's at least

  if they do arm we can't tell them you

  know unless someone else decides to make

  like 17 core ARM chips they're

  stubbornly refusing to use in their new

  arm Mac Pro whatever so that I think

  this this realization and everything

  we're talking about is leading people to

  talk more around this blimp rogues story

  about I think for the first time I'm

  hearing people speculates more seriously

  about the idea of them having x86 at the

  high end and arm at the low end like for

  some sustained period of time rather

  than having a transition where you just

  say all the x86 Mac's are gone and all

  the Mac's are a whatever ARM chips but

  rather instead saying we're never going

  to make the investment to compete with

  Zeon's those are always gonna be Zeon's

  in the Mac Pro and the iMac Pro and we

  will keep up with Intel's line as much

  as we always have and we're just not

  going to do stuff there but for all for

  all of them

  max that can essentially take drop-in

  chips from our iPad and phone line maybe

  with some minor tweaks in terms of

  adding more cash or maybe some more

  cores and you know beef your GPU and

  stuff like that those will get armed and

  as Marco said those are the majority of

  Mac's sold and like the the x86 max will

  just be as technical curiosity that

  nerds and developers use but then the

  max that most people buy to do basic

  computing stuff and word processing and

  run office and web browsing and run

  spreadsheets and watch Netflix and

  whatever else people want to do those

  will all be armed and that is an

  unprecedented move because Apple has

  never had a sustained dual CPU strategy

  on the Mac it has always been a

  transition old chip goes out and your

  chip comes in new chip has lots of

  advantages everyone loves the new chip

  look how fast it is look how fast

  graphing calculator runs on the PowerPC

  look how fast everything runs on x86

  versus these ancient power pcs that IBM

  doesn't update anymore I am NOT

  enthusiastic about that future even

  though it makes sense from a technical

  perspective in terms of like what you

  want to spend money on and what you

  don't because tomorrow is earlier point

  dealing with an OS that runs on two

  different platforms is a who is it I

  think a TP tipster said it on Twitter is

  a bug multiplier like potentially there

  are new bugs that might only exist on

  one platform or another throwing another

  very it's not double the bugs right

  because not every bug is architecture

  specific but throwing another variable

  into the mix especially as variable as

  significant as the instruction set is

  not the best way to drive down bugs and

  cost and it could be that the software

  maintaining the software and dealing

  with the bugs and the changes there is

  actually more expensive than dealing

  with the hardware I don't know how that

  shakes out in the grand scheme of things

  exactly how many millions of dollars it

  would cost to build a Zeon competitor

  yourself versus how many millions of

  dollars it would cost to maintain in

  perpetuity or at least for a decade or

  so two architectures that you make and

  OS the same OS for with the same apps

  compiled the stat minor II

  to toolchains and all the other stuff so

  that also strikes me it's not ideal

  likely the simplest solutions are that

  Apple nope doesn't do this transition or

  that they transition everything to the

  same architecture on all their devices

  and any sort of hybrid thing though it

  might make sense from a nickel-and-dime

  perspective I bet if you had to pitch it

  to the Board of Directors it would seem

  to too much like a half-measure and they

  would say why don't we just all go if

  you had to pitch them and say we're

  gonna go all armed and it's unified and

  we have a unified framework and a

  unified architecture and we own all the

  stuff that is way easier to sell to a

  board of directors than any of the more

  technical solutions where you leave the

  pro Max's x86 and you support both of

  them and have two tool trains two

  compilers in fact binaries and you don't

  transition I you know I don't think

  that's a that's a winner it's funny

  because I'm of two minds about this

  whole thing the KC from a couple of

  years ago that lived in VMware fusion in

  Windows but on a Mac would most likely

  really hate this and this is exactly

  what you were talking about earlier John

  that you know one of the advantages of

  being able to virtualize a OS or a

  platform that's based on the same

  platform you're running is that it

  happens really really fast right this is

  in contrast to in this hypothetical

  future when you're trying to emulate x86

  on top of arm and who knows maybe this

  phantom apple processor would be so damn

  fast that you could get away with it but

  the likelihood of that is not good and

  so you know past KC who is doing Windows

  development on his Mac does not want

  this at all and I think the last time we

  really spoke about this seriously I was

  still that KC that that does not want

  this at all but the current me that only

  works on Xcode and you know other things

  that are native to the Mac and I haven't

  run Windows in at least a year if not

  more I don't feel like I have a problem

  with this and the thought of my beloved

  12-inch MacBook being faster with a

  battery that lasts even longer which to

  be fair I don't have any particular

  complaints about the battery on this

  thing but that being said you can always

  have more more is always better so

  having a 12-inch MacBook that is

  considerably faster and yet has much

  better battery life that sounds friggin

  awesome like I totally want that

  but what I'm not really doing is

  considering what am I losing out on

  because maybe there's some there's some

  app that's vital to my workflow that I

  won't be able to use anymore like you

  know ffmpeg I believe is open-source so

  presumably I could compile from source

  if I needed to but just let's suppose

  for the sake of discussion that ffmpeg

  was never built forearm could not be

  built forearm like that would stink I

  use ffmpeg all the time for stupid stuff

  that doesn't matter but it but you know

  whether or not it matters it's important

  to me it matters to me

  weight to be clear you use it on the

  12-inch every great once well not

  usually but perhaps not my best choice

  of analogies or a examples but but you

  get my point right is that there maybe

  it's something else

  maybe it's the app rocket which lets you

  you know easily insert emoji pretty much

  anywhere in the system you know it's a

  rocket is a modern app I would assume if

  this X eighties excuse me if this arm

  thing happened that rocket would get

  updated but what if for the sake of

  discussion rocket isn't updated I use

  rocket constantly probably hundreds of

  times a day and if it didn't get updated

  that would really bum me out and so

  there there are probably trade-offs that

  I'm not considering but on the surface

  and going on the assumption that it you

  know a this phantom new Apple processor

  that goes in the 12-inch MacBook is you

  know five times faster and that uses

  half as much power or whatever the case

  may be I think that sounds freaking

  great an Apple being in control of its

  own pipeline sounds freaking great but

  who knows I mean like you guys were

  saying maybe it would be that Apple

  makes crummy desktop level CPUs maybe it

  would be that they're even slower than

  Intel like we don't know how it would

  turn out but on the server is it faster

  and then they don't make a new one for

  three years yeah like you never know how

  it's gonna turn out but the optimist in

  me thinks hell yeah like even if even if

  it's painful at first because some of

  the things I really love don't get you

  know don't get moved to like fat binary

  or whatever they end up doing in

  principle this sounds great I'm all I'm

  all in on it I think I'd really like to

  see how this plays out but it sounds

  like we're waiting until at least

  20 20 if not after that so we'll say uh

  or steak you want to put in dates no

  think your windows VM thing like I think

  that's a definitely a pretty rare case

  because you really really wanted to use

  a Mac but we're kind of doing Windows

  developing and you can get away with it

  because of VMware but I'm honestly I'm

  surprised you were able to tolerate that

  because that's no way to live an imac

  constantly be using VMware to do Windows

  stuff what's my alternative use a Dell

  I'm not a monster yeah I know at some

  point maybe that's better but like the

  reason I brought into the point is that

  yeah the reason I brought up server side

  of stuff it's not just because it's what

  I do for a living but because they're

  there you know think of the big the big

  tech companies you know you've got Apple

  what is it Apple Google Amazon maybe

  Microsoft Facebook right Facebook Amazon

  increasingly Microsoft and Google write

  a lot of or mostly server-side software

  and when you picture the stereotypical

  developer who works at any of those

  companies and you picture them using a

  Mac and being a cool tech nerd hipster

  person they're writing server-side

  software on the Mac and I have to think

  that there is some aspect of having the

  same CPU architecture as all of their

  servers makes that a more desirable

  development platform and there are a lot

  of those people right I don't know how

  many people are using a Mac to do

  Windows development because they hate

  Windows so much but there are a lot of

  people writing server-side software and

  my impression is that Mac's are very

  prevalent at those companies and that's

  why I think it's a use case that

  actually may raise to the level of being

  a factor in Apple's decision they will

  at least consider it right because you

  know like just think of the apple says

  well we considered it but it's not

  important enough use case it's too small

  like we care about consumers right so

  fine ten years from now if you went into

  Facebook or Google or Microsoft or

  Amazon and looked at all the developers

  who are doing server-side development

  what would it look like would it still

  be filled with Mac's or would they be

  mostly gone now

  and people switch to what to to Windows

  to Linux I don't know something that's

  still on x86 or it could be that by

  initiating this thing that Apple finally

  kick-starts all other companies to start

  pushing arm on the server more and

  Amazon rolls that arm on the server for

  all your ec2 instances and everything

  and you know Microsoft arm on Windows

  really starts to take off and Intel just

  really has a bad decade it really just

  fades from prominence and we're all

  happy because we're all using arm

  everywhere like that's a possibility I

  suppose but you know I just the big tech

  companies these days aren't the big tech

  companies because they make native

  applications and hardware most of the

  big temp tech companies are big because

  they run server-side software on cloud

  infrastructure on x86 CPUs and their

  developers all used Macs and run docker

  and stuff yeah just to clarify what I

  was saying earlier about ffmpeg that was

  really a crummy example because ffmpeg

  is open source so presumably like I

  think I said it earlier but that could

  be rebuilt from source but there's got

  to be some closed source thing maybe

  it's an Adobe product which doesn't

  typically get updated very well maybe

  it's some other thing maybe it's make

  MKV maybe it's any number of other apps

  that maybe you wouldn't be able to

  recompile yourself from source and maybe

  won't ever get upgraded or updated I

  should say for this new platform and

  then you would never be able to run that

  app again and that would really stink or

  you would have to be used some sort of

  what was the virtual virtualization but

  the thing that thank you were they you

  would have some sort of Rosetta style

  situation where yes you can still run it

  but it's at you know a compromised

  performance and blah blah blah so that's

  the thing that worries me is that

  sitting here now I'm all enthusiastic

  and it sounds great

  yeah give me my arm MacBook adorable

  give it to me tomorrow but maybe I'd get

  that arm MacBook adorable and realize oh

  this this grass isn't quite as green as

  I thought mark or any other thoughts on

  this I think the the software argument

  is is a good one like I think in any

  transition like this one of the big

  risks and problems is that you do lose

  some apps you lose software like you

  know when we went from PowerPC to Intel

  not everything made it along the


  now the Mack is in a very different

  place than where it was in 2006 when

  that transition really happened you know

  now a whole lot more Mack software's

  really in maintenance mode or being

  totally unmaintained and the software

  the people still use you know like a lot

  of developer attention moved to mobile

  and a lot of Mac developers no longer

  work on their apps or rather than the

  apps the developers have a lot of Mac

  apps are no longer working on them so

  the magazine is in a kind of a bad spot

  to go through an architecture transition

  with no other modifications I think this

  is possibly one of the reasons why I'm

  so excited about this idea of project

  marzipan of having iOS and Mac kind of

  cross having cross compatibility between

  the apps is that I think that could

  really revive a lot of the Macs off our

  market in theirs they were that would

  dramatically I think increase the

  developer interest in the Mac and and

  developer support of the Mac because it

  would lower that barrier allowed more

  skills to be shared a lot more code to

  be shared cetera so you know we talked

  about that before so anything to to

  revive software interest in the Mac of

  among developers would be very well

  timed to go before or during a partial

  or full architectural transition because

  that's when you need the developers to

  be active on the Mac is right now if you

  look around like like you know we're

  about to lose a 32-bit probably this


  almost everyone probably has something

  that will break you and we show this on

  iOS too like when when I always drop

  32-bit almost everyone lost something

  and if you might have been using any

  more but you know you know not

  everything made it and that's how this

  is gonna be - like if max transition

  away from Intel not everything is going

  to make it we're already losing some a

  lot of things with 32-bit and so to do

  that without significant destruction and

  problems for your users you need a

  healthy and well maintained software

  ecosystem the Mac had that in 2006 and

  that's why PowerPC to Intel went so well

  it's hard to say the Mac

  has that now so this kind of transition

  I think would be a very bad idea unless

  and until the Mac has more active

  development from third parties on it and

  right now I don't see that happening

  without some kind of major intervention

  and project marzipan could be that I and

  I so that's one of the reasons again I

  really hope that happens yeah I think

  the good news is that if either one of

  these things happen I don't think anyone

  can imagine a sequence in which the

  marzipan anything doesn't come either

  before simultaneous with the CPU

  transition just because it takes so long

  to make CPUs and Apple has already

  dabbled in what it takes to reuse stuff

  that you wrote in iOS on the Mac and so

  like it see that just seems so much

  closer to being a reality to me than a

  CPU transition so I think we will get

  something to address the GUI API parity

  between iOS and the Mac before any CPU

  transition or at exactly the same time

  as a CPU transition for for the reasons

  you just set because it's Apple I think

  recognized is the same thing that going

  through a transition with the Mac market

  the way it is it's just gonna make more

  people say well that's the last straw

  screw it I'm just gonna be an iOS

  developer or do something else well see

  it's exciting times ahead maybe possibly

  you never know alright let's do some

  ASCII tipi

  oh please writes hey we'll lift be

  generally available during WDC as in not

  swamped with users or should I rent a

  car if I want to see the things around

  San Jose like the Computer History

  Museum in my experience from only one

  year of WDC in San Jose it was fine like

  I can't remember ever waiting on a lift

  for any particular reason or for any

  particular amounts of time I didn't have

  any trouble so I don't know about you


  compared to San Francisco San Jose is

  like a neutron bomb went off like

  there's nobody there there is there's a

  weird side effect though like it's a

  you're right first of all San Jose is

  empty the relatively speaking

  the problem with San Jose so it's kind

  of like the inverse plot of The Truman

  Show where it seems like you walking

  around are the only human being there

  and everyone who works

  every establishment in San Jose seems

  like they're an actor and for the very

  first time ever you are asking them to

  do their job that is a bit much but you

  are closer to the truth that I really

  want to admit well welcome to California

  like its it really does seem like you

  are like the first customer

  everyone's ever had everyone it's their

  first day on the job like it's we we

  found this to be the case last year

  almost everywhere we went almost every

  day it like and in various different

  contexts like it just seems like the

  city it seems like this is the first

  time people had ever come here and I

  know it's I know that's not the case

  like I know you know this is a big city

  like obviously people are here all the

  time but it's not that big that's the

  thing it's not a big city so anyway

  hiring like lifts and stuff you know for

  your time there you might have to tell

  the person how to drive you are the

  first person to ever ask them to do

  their job you know obviously at least

  that's how it will seem so I don't know

  what happened in San Jose to make

  everybody behave this way but that's how

  it felt the entire time

  San Jose from the perspective of an

  adopted New Yorker you ain't wrong all

  right Bart hoofs rights hey should I use

  the new CloudFlare DNS thing or should I

  stay with Google's DNS thing

  so to recap google has a free and not

  open but a free DNS it's the DNS servers

  actually the IP address and what

  you can do is you can use Google's DNS

  which is supposed to provide perks

  although honestly I'm not even sure what

  they are anymore the last time I used it

  the only thing it really provided for me

  was making things like YouTube slower

  because I I was hitting servers that

  were very far away from where I was

  sitting I guess one of the advantages is

  it prevents your ISP from knowing as

  easily what web addresses you're going

  to and things of that nature instead

  you're giving it to Google because

  that's a better choice but nevertheless

  but yeah so that that was a thing it is

  useful if your ISPs DNS perhaps the bed

  which I know

  is a comcastic thing to happen but I

  don't know I've never really had that

  trouble on on files or of your ISP does

  stupid redirects where they they take

  over the DNS when you do they mean you

  typo something and throw you to some

  stupid page to reuse ISP DNS because

  they do that well also like you know I

  really don't trust ISPs to be ethical at

  all because they have shown in the u.s.

  that they're not like they're just not

  they they will do anything and

  everything to be as sleazy as possible

  because what are you gonna do about it

  there's no competition and now there's

  no FCC to regulate them so they can do

  whatever they want and they know it and

  they do like I would actually trust

  Google more than I would trust Verizon

  which is my ISP or

  any major ISP in this country because at

  least Google like there's a lot riding

  on that if they mess up if they do

  something creepy like so I think they're

  less likely to try creepy stuff and if

  they do creepy stuff they're less likely

  to to get hacked and have my information

  leaked all over the place so there's

  there's a few reasons why I think I

  would trust Google over any ISP that

  being said I think I trust CloudFlare

  more than any of them because a they're

  not an advertising company and B they've

  spelled out in their post announcing

  this like why they're doing this for

  free what's in it for them like what is

  their business plan here and their

  business plan is in part because they

  seem to honestly care about making the

  internet a better place and in part

  because they offer Enterprise DNS

  services that would be better and are

  faster if more people who access the

  enterprise's sites are using their DNS

  on the client-side so there is a clear

  business reason why this benefits

  CloudFlare to do that does not depend on

  creepy stuff that I don't want them to

  be doing yeah systems good I'm not using

  it personally but I I will say that I

  would be far more likely to use this

  than Google's thing I do use my eyes p's

  dns because I don't often fat-finger

  URLs so I don't see that god-awful

  Verizon search page that I hate that it

  hijacks when you enter a bogus URL they

  used to have a way for you to turn that

  off by

  like you go to Verizon's preferences and

  find it somewhere and say please don't

  do that

  but there still is it's it's poorly

  documented but like if you change like

  the last digit of your DNS servers in a

  certain way like you get you get

  alternate ones yeah yeah that used to be

  that used to be the way but there's a

  lot of like outdated documentation on

  that and sometimes what used to works

  stops working and it's it's annoying

  sorry I dig up on your on your concern

  KC about eight eight eight and eight

  eight eight eight four four the other

  one like that's my concern and my

  experience with them as well as like a

  lot of the the ISP DNS likes a sort of

  local DNS use the fact that that that

  DNS is local to get to give you

  different names for common services so

  you hit the closer incarnation of it and

  if you use the Google one so the theory

  went that it didn't know where you were

  to as much you know like and it would

  just send you to a server far away or

  that has a worse route to you I'm pretty

  sure Google with is a date thing

  does a bunch of stuff to try to make

  that less severe in other words is

  you're not going to some central DNS

  server in the middle of the country that

  gives everyone the same number for all

  the different services and that's why

  you know like it tries to be local like

  all Google thing it's massively

  distributed it's not just one thing in

  one place but my experience has been

  that whatever that local thing is it's

  not local enough and still occasionally

  I will get poor performance on the flip

  side sometimes you'll get better

  performance because if you try using

  your ISPs DNS I found is PDS to be

  unreliable as in no-name resolves or

  crappy as and it gives me like the same

  IP for that name as everyone else was on

  my the same ISP as me and it's crowded

  and if I switch to a today they get

  better traffic but either way I just I

  think CloudFlare is probably doing the

  same thing as Google in that regard I

  didn't I didn't read their full blog

  post but that that concern is real and

  does sometimes ever on vacations and

  that's why I hesitate to suggest to

  non-technical friends and family oh you

  shouldn't use the ISP DNS just always

  use a today there or one on one

  whatever because if they do find

  themselves in a situation where they're

  being sent to a server far away and they

  get terrible forms they're gonna have no

  idea how to debug that and I feel like

  it's better for them to just use the ISP

  DNS so then at least when it breaks they

  know the number to call and complain to

  people and the complaint will be

  legitimate and they won't find

  themselves in a situation where they the

  ISP support person eventually discovers

  that they have some weird dns and say oh

  there's your problem just they're at the

  mercy or their ISP in more ways than one

  but even for me I think maybe half of

  the devices in my house use the Google

  DNS but the other half use the native

  ones and I choose based on how important

  it is for that device to get good video

  streaming from like Netflix or whatever

  not an ideal situation

  ideal situation would be if the kind of

  technical expertise general morality and

  aligned business success incentives

  demonstrated by CloudFlare actually

  existed in is peace but we do not live

  in that country no not even close which

  is too bad

  all right so Josh Rappaport asks hey

  John with the release of Mac OS 10 point

  three point four have you considered

  getting an external GPU enclosure and a

  fancy graphics card can you do more in

  gaming on your Mac you can your Mac even

  support this isn't it way too old for

  this it doesn't even have thunderbolt

  yeah I don't I can't I'm running out

  Capitan I can't even run Sierra John's

  Mac doesn't even have USB 3 nope to the

  question about external GPUs

  I think those are a good solution for

  people who need to use GPU incentive

  intensive things on a computer that

  can't fit an internal GPU so laptops

  right and my main concern in the laptop

  realm is based on my experience using my

  2017 15 inch macbook pro at work

  constantly connecting and disconnecting

  it to my monitor and a hub thing that

  gives me USB a connections and you know

  what else comes off of that

  well maybe DisplayPort for my old

  monitor or whatever anyway I plug it

  into a thing that periodically makes it


  turn on the discrete GPU and connect up

  to a an external monitor and the

  reliability of that is terrible there I

  have to do all sorts of weird dances and

  do things to make sure the machine

  doesn't feel too rushed or too hassled

  by me plugging and unplugging things

  very often I plug it in and it just

  ignores me

  no no unplug it and plug it in again oh

  maybe in a little potentially sometimes

  no matter how many times I plug it in

  and unplug it I have to pull the power

  cord out of my hub thing that it's

  connected to and basically reboot the

  hub thingy sometimes it freezes with a

  black screen and so like all this is

  making me think do I really want to be

  plugging and unplugging a GPU and

  thinking this operating system is gonna

  handle that gracefully because it can't

  even handle plugging into an external

  monitor in a consistent manner so I am

  NOT optimistic about how good an

  experience it will be to use an external

  GPU but especially to connect an

  external GPU to a system that didn't

  previously have it and disconnect it

  without doing all sorts of dances and

  jumping through hoops and bending over

  backwards to make sure the machine isn't

  too rushed or isn't too upset

  I mean plugging in the second GPU so my

  faith and the reliability of the Mac

  operating system to handle this is

  shaken despite the fact that I realize

  this is a revolutionary feature for the

  part of people who are on the go

  previously had no way to to increase the

  GPU power of their portable machine like

  you do only so much you could fit in

  that case and they were just the fans

  would be spinning you get the hottest

  one you could and it would still be

  terrible and now all of a sudden you're

  telling me I can get this little

  external enclosure and have massively

  more powerful GPU maybe they'll just

  deal with the bugs and they'll just be

  worth it for them to be able to do like

  live video previews of 4k video or

  whatever they're doing with their GPU

  rendering stuff like that but for me

  personally like I would not my choice of

  a gaming rig would not be a Mac laptop

  with an external GPU

  there's a reason I'm waiting for the Mac

  Pro so I don't know I'm not personal

  interested in this thanks to our

  sponsors this week

  Kaspar Squarespace and Rover and we'll

  see you next week

  now the show is over

  they didn't even mean to begin cuz it

  was accidental oh it was accidental John

  didn't do any research Marko and Casey

  wouldn't let him

  because it was accidentally was

  accidental and you can find the show

  notes at a TPM and if you can follow

  them CAS II WA L is s so that's Casey

  less and a are Co AR m and T Marco

  Arment SI r AC Syracuse


  so Casey I think I have a solution to

  your BMW problem if I'm trying to solve

  my BMW problem with Morgan with more BMW

  spend a shitload of money then yes you

  have definitely found a solution for me

  BMW is come up with a subscription

  service you heard that right that is not

  a joke

  it is now offering a subscription

  service only in Nashville or I'm sorry

  it will be offering a subscription

  service only in Nashville for $2,000 a

  month and thousand dollars a month you

  can choose between x5s for syriza's five

  syriza's plug-in hybrids etc and they

  will deliver with like white-glove

  service they will deliver the car you

  want to your door they will take away

  the car you already have and you can be

  assured that the car you are given is

  freshly detailed etc etc for $3,700 a

  month you can alternatively get access

  to m4 m5 m6 convertibles as well as x5m


  etc none of these apparently offer the 7

  Series but you know whatever but what's

  interesting about this is it includes

  not only access to the car but insurance

  maintenance roadside assistance etcetera

  etcetera etcetera so if you are willing

  to trade an asinine amount of money for

  a fair bit of convenience you can get a

  suite or a fleet I should say of BMWs at

  your disposal and I think in general

  this is a pretty cool idea as long as

  you don't have kids where you have to

  plug in a car seat as long as you're not

  the kind of person that likes to have a

  whole bunch of things sitting around in

  your car be that a rag or a charger

  perhaps a obscenely overpriced car

  charger to go with your obscenely

  overpriced BMW subscription do you have

  a rag in your car yes I have a rag in my

  car why wouldn't you have a rag in here

  alright what kind of rag do you have

  where is it

  I believe generally speaking it is a

  blue surgical rag that was never used

  for surgery but my my uncle was a eye

  surgeon for the longest time and he

  would either purchase or snag a series

  of these blue rags that are probably

  about a foot square and they are the

  best rags for general purpose use and

  they're intended to be used in like

  surgeries and things but he would just

  grab them and then give a batch to my

  dad or me and it is sitting in the

  little container compartment whatever in

  in the driver side door so if I ever

  have to say wipe off the inside of the

  inside of the of the windshield because

  maybe I've had my windows open and some

  like you know that kind of like film

  that gets on the inside after a while

  you can wipe it off with that if you

  ever have to kill a spider because

  somehow spider has found its way into

  your car yeah but then you're then

  you're smearing spiders all over the

  windshield after the next time you clean

  yeah yeah so the reason I asked about it

  is because it brought back memories of

  my grandfather who also had a rag in his

  car but it was a filthy rag and it was

  in the trunk and it was used to clean

  off the dipstick when you're checking

  the oil yeah that's the I'm more curious

  what it what are these rags used for in

  the surgery I think to mop up blood and

  things like that third eye surgeon

  that's it's not terribly useful right or

  one would hope not anyway but for

  general purpose surgeries I'm assuming

  that's what they're for speaking of

  surgery and surgical cleanliness the

  reason I was moaning about you about

  your use of this rag that you keep in

  that the door pocket to clean the inside

  of your windshield is because mm-hmm be

  first of all the inside every wind chill

  is a hard spot to clean it's

  inconvenient it's hard to reach right

  you know like just arm angle wise and

  stuff does all sorts of film of your

  human gross miss like collects on there

  and everything but the other problem

  especially I imagined in Casey's car

  well that you can correct me if I'm

  wrong is that potentially you may use

  something to clean the dashboard that is

  right below the windshield some kind of

  product to to keep that clean there

  maintained it or protected from UV or

  whatever you're thinking like armor-all

  or equivalent or anything like that

  right something something other than

  just a completely dry rag to clean that

  part of your dashboard and make it look


  if you touch the rag that you're using

  to clean the inside of your dashboard

  any part of it

  to the the inside of your windshield if

  you touch that to the dashboard and then

  bring that to your windshield you're in

  for a world of hurt because the last

  thing you wanted to do is have even a

  corner of that thing touch your armor

  all covered dashboard and then smear

  that all over your window because you

  will spend the rest of your life with

  your arm at a weird angle of trying to

  get that stuff off the inside of your

  windshield and it is not easy so to try

  it there's some good YouTube videos

  about this for the like the correct and

  only sane way to clean the inside of

  your windshield involves basically

  surgical cleanliness it's like you're

  like you're in you know this looking

  chip fab a cleanroom you must use a rag

  perfectly clean freshly cleaned has not

  touched anything else you use it to wipe

  off the gross film then maybe you can

  use the other side of that rag and then

  it's done then you have to get your next

  rag and you can't touch it to any part

  of the trim or anything else that might

  have arm roll on it like this is a

  disaster alright I have an alternate

  policy no armor-all

  ever goes in my car I hate armor oh I

  hate the idea that I touch any surface

  and it's greasy that is awful there was

  one time where like a detailer used it

  without asking and it drove me nuts I

  was like taking like a beach towel like

  wiping it like trying to wipe it all off

  it was horrible

  probably smearing it all over the inside

  of your windshield yeah why we're all is

  the worst but there are lots of things

  that you can use to clean the inside of

  your car all of them have in various

  ways are you do not want them touching

  your windshield no they don't all vacuum

  cleaner and cloth that's all you need to

  clean a car you don't need like two like

  coat your your dashboard with the grease

  unfortunately even water even like

  dampness the problem is the grease comes

  from you from your body

  what's collecting on the inside of your

  windshield is human scum right it's

  coming from inside the car that also

  settles on your dashboard so even just

  rubbing it with a dry cloth you were

  picking up some some grease and if you

  if you would like to rub the top of your

  dashboard with a dry cloth and then take

  that same dry cloth and rub your

  windshield you are adding to the mess on

  your windshield clean the inside of your

  windshield is really hard to do I and

  I'm terrible at it by the way like don't

  think just because I reference those

  YouTube videos I show you how to do it

  right I am terrible I which is why I


  difficult actually is to do I mean maybe

  maybe I'm just not as as greasy greasy

  is you guys I'm Italian I I don't

  I hardly ever have to clean somebody

  said I just don't touch it and by not

  touching it I almost never have to do

  but that is one that is a reasonable

  policy because a lot of people make the

  mistake of getting something on their

  windshield and then they try to like rub

  it with their hand or something an

  accident has grease on it started the

  cycle of grease Christmas but Casey's

  rag that thing I would never touch that

  to the inside of my windshield because I

  think you're just making it worse like

  you okay so you need to come on you're

  you are fancy enough of a car person you

  need to come on board they like time to

  crack out the completely sealed

  completely sterile never seen the light

  of day rag which I will carefully handle

  with my perfectly clean hands and wipe

  down the inside of my windshield maybe

  not even the whole windshield but just

  half of it and then throw that thing

  away and then your rag just keeping the

  keeping the trunk for dipstick checking

  or you can just have lower standards can

  we get back to the point so BMW has a

  subscription starter so do you think the

  BMW concierge a car seat what if you

  have a rag I mean cuz they they say they

  would they will personally deliver the

  vehicle they arrived fully fueled and

  freshly detailed with personal

  preferences already preset say can I get

  a filthy rag in the door pocket yeah

  well what do you mean by personal

  preference is it just like where the

  seat is or can it be like can you also

  install this particular brand of car

  seat in this spot load the pocket below

  it with these three toys my kid likes

  and wants to play with in the car today

  put my brand of sunglasses in the

  sunglass holder that is probably not

  there because BMW doesn't percent less

  holders anywhere how far will this go

  could you get them to even pick your

  scent in the 7 Series I think yeah like

  could you get them to include one of

  these surgical rags that mops up KC's

  uncle's eye blood in the door pocket so

  you can reach it and can can they pre

  clean the windshield for you so that you

  don't get anyone elses ambient grease

  and on your windshield well they say it

  is detailed so you shouldn't have to do

  anything the windshield should be

  sparkling clean when you get it yeah but

  I just think this is an interesting

  thing the first I'd heard of this was

  actually with Volvo with the new XC 40

  where you kid

  you get euro and XZ 40 and you can the

  interesting thing about this actually I

  could swear I had read that you can do

  this all via an app on your phone which

  how does that make sense when there's

  payment involved it's not it's like

  Netflix for cars you just you just

  constantly get a bill for $3,700 every

  month and that covers all the cost of

  you picking whatever vehicle you want

  like it more than covers the cost they

  just charge you too much yeah but but in

  the case of Volvo you know they're

  saying what makes care by Volvo unique

  which is what they're calling their

  subscription Verve the service no down

  payment no price negotiation one flat

  monthly fee with no surprises includes

  premium insurance no matter where you

  live maintenance and excess wear

  coverage upgrade to new Volvo is in as

  little as 12 months subscribe easily

  online or via the app and a 15,000 mile

  allowance per year like if I was

  interested in an XC 40 which that's not

  the kind of car that I particularly want

  this is a really really cool idea I

  don't know how much the Volvo setup

  costs and oh there you go starting $600

  a month for the base model $700 a month

  for their equivalent of the M Sport

  which they call our drive or excuse me

  our design but the BMW version is you

  know many times that and yes I think

  it's a cool idea and I kind of like

  where this is going the thought of just

  paying one monthly fee to have

  everything taken care of is really cool

  yeah but but there but believe me

  they're charging you for like this is

  not none of these things are good deals

  financially speaking peace of mind wise

  you may be appealing to you to say oh

  and I just don't have to worry about it

  but you are paying not to worry and

  you're paying I loves like like for the

  the $3,700 a month one for the high one

  to get like the M cards like you can

  lease an m5 for like $1,000 a month

  and insurance on it is gonna be less

  than that more it's not gonna be another

  thousand a month at least three M fives

  and you could just rotate them each day

  yeah and another thing is like you see

  you just said like oh it wouldn't it be

  great if you could just pay a monthly

  fee and have written taken care of you

  can do that already it's called leasing

  that's it already takes care of almost

  all well but it doesn't do insurance

  like not to say that paying an insurance

  bill it does include maintenance and

  roadside assistance and you get a

  concierge to your house oh I never tell

  you about that

  it's the same car all the time I mean

  this is totally for rich people who are

  like Oh today I want to try this car

  today I want to obey Him w came out with

  a new car is that included in my head

  fix for cars sure it is Oh trade this

  you know like you really I feel like you

  really have to have a lot of time and

  also at Casey's point not a lot of junk

  in your car to do this kind of rotation

  although like I was trying to think of

  things in my life that have been like

  this that actually have been

  ridiculously good deals and I thought of

  one which I'm sure this doesn't exist

  anymore but someone can write and tell

  me when I was kid I went skiing almost

  every year and when I was teen I was

  wanted to buy fancy new skis for myself

  for a huge amount of money and the only

  way to know which keys you wanna buy is

  to try a bunch of skis kind of like


  and at the mountain they have they have

  demos you could go to the ski shop and

  say I want a demo skis and you'd give

  them some paltry amount of money I don't

  remember it was maybe it was $15 $10 $20

  and how much gonna cost yeah exactly but

  it was a really seeming small to me then

  right and in exchange for that all day

  you can go to the ski shop and point to

  the $700 in 1990 money ski behind the

  counter that you wanted to try and so I

  want to try that one and you've given

  your ski boot and they would dress the

  bindings and say here you go I need to

  go up and take a run you come back down

  you say alright let me try that one and

  you point to the $800 nineteen nineties

  money ski over there and they would take

  your boot and adjust the bindings and

  give it to you you go up and come back

  down you can do that all day they change

  skis as many times you want no

  additional fee each time every time they

  would adjust the bindings for your ski

  boots on your weight and you would get

  to try hundreds and hundreds and

  hundreds of dollars of skis in one day

  for one flat fee of like ten or fifteen

  dollars now granted the lift tickets

  were 100 bucks in 1990 money but my

  parents were paying for those so I'd

  have to worry about it but I just I

  remember being amazed that like what a

  good deal it was like there was no

  equivalent of that it's as if you could

  for a fee of like $80 try as many bbws

  as you wanted for a week and just every

  time you wanted to go back to the dealer

  along I'd try that one now and you'd

  have to buy anything at the end of it

  and I didn't buy anything at the end of

  it I tried all these skis on real ski

  mountains which is why I found how I

  found my beloved Rossignol 7s to be the

  ideal ski

  me just alone to this day well and like

  that actually is you know one possible

  reason why somebody could reasonably

  want a plan like this is like I mean I

  don't know what if they have like

  minimum terms but if you could just sign

  up for it for one month and like if you

  if you wanted to buy one of these cars

  but you couldn't decide which one and

  you didn't want to make like an

  expensive mistake you you know kiss

  $2,000 goodbye or whatever and just try

  basically having a one-month test-drive

  of all these different models and you

  could make you decision that way or say

  if you were trying to get a car review

  channel off the ground on YouTube and

  you needed access to a bunch of cars to

  review and you can schedule it so you

  had all them you could do them all in

  one month like imagine being able to

  review like seven different cars in one

  month because you'd have access to them

  I have to pay Casey for that so we can

  have as little demurrer ad in the front

  and say I got this car courtesy you know

  whatever Toyota the like you do a little

  ad for them like they pay you this is

  why I'm not a youtube car journalist

  yeah well neither am i these days

  apparently Porsche also has one called

  Porsche passport which is so related so

  you could try all two of their cars they

  have so many SUVs and Plus up some other

  cars in any case I just think it's a

  very cool idea I don't I don't know that

  it's gonna work for most people not the

  least of which because it's obscene

  amount of money but like you guys were

  saying this is trading money in favor of

  convenience and you know to your point

  Marko if you're gonna go this route like

  there's an argument that leasing would

  be just as good or almost as good you

  don't get a guaranteed one-year upgrade

  in a lease or most leases anyway like

  you would within in the case of the

  Volvo one and you don't get access to

  many cars in a lease like you can and

  this BMW or Porsche ones but I do think

  it's a cool idea and if you have more

  money than sense I mean the good thing

  is like this makes leasing look pretty

  reasonable by comparison like I'm like

  leasing like yeah like you don't get a

  you don't get every years new model but

  most cars like every year is a really

  minor update like in most cars they only

  change in substantial ways every you

  know three to five years so

  you know you don't need to get every

  single year and you know while I would

  miss the year while you would miss the

  concierge with your blood cloth I think

  there's a pretty good argument to be

  made that like the parts of this that

  are appealing to you right now in theory

  are really directly saying like you're

  ready for a lease that's what this means

  like you are so ready for release

  because you're like oh I can just pay a

  flat monthly fee and then like

  maintenance is included yes terribly

  used to do that and you don't have to

  worry about upgrades down the road yes

  yes exactly you can do it now like I can

  offer you a wonderful deal where I will

  offer you most of this service for a

  quarter of the price and you don't even

  have to be in Nashville oh that's great

  man reason I think of leasing is not for

  caseous because it will force him to

  make a new car buying decision every

  three months and I don't think the show

  can handle that yeah even every three

  years that's true if people just made

  cars I wanted to buy it would be so much


  like just make make the model three have

  an actual dashboard make the model s not

  a bazillion dollars make BMWs that don't

  break any of these would be reasonable

  options make a Golf R with a sunroof but

  here's the thing if you lease if you

  start a three-year lease today what

  you're doing is just kicking that can

  down the road for three years yes so

  that's great you can say no but you can

  say like you know what I would rather

  not think about this for the next three

  years I'll get back to it then it's like

  snoozing your car angst like he just

  snooze it for three years and you know

  remind me in three years to revisit the

  my car craziness in the meantime I will

  happily drive this thing that's being

  taken care of by the lease plan and I

  don't have to worry about his

  maintenance costs and the thing could be

  like an m3 or something Casey's just

  waiting for BMW to have a roundtable


  manual transmission reliable cars but I

  don't think that's in your future no I

  don't think so

  don't think so

  also my throat's burning from all the

  ginger I put in my lemon ginger honey

  things too much normally I just minced

  the ginger but this time I decided to to

  put a ginger and hot water solution in

  my blender and really puree the crap out

  of those really in there and Wow is it

  stronger that way using chemical weapons

  on yourself next Marco pepper sprays his

  throat yeah and then of course all the

  ginger like particles sank to the bottom

  of the cup so the whole time I was

  drinking it wasn't too bad but now I

  mean now at the bottom and now it's

  every sip is like fire mmm you just need

  to get crystallized ginger so you slowly

  the crystals did you know that ginger

  tea is almost always BS like if you try

  to get like just like bad ginger tea so

  it's all dried every single one time

  I've ever seen includes is one of the

  ingredients black pepper

  that's why is that BS because you don't

  like black pepper because they're trying

  to make it feel like fresh ginger with

  the burn in the back of your throat by

  making you drink black pepper basically

  ginger fresh ginger gives you a burn in

  the back of your I guess I don't need

  enough fresh ginger to know i mean i

  gender is spicy it's like there's like a

  spice to it but when you dry it out and

  and you know make dry teabags with it

  you lose that and so to make you think

  you're tasting more fresh ginger than

  you are they add black pepper to ginger

  tea bags to remind you of the burn that

  you get with fresh ginger but it's you

  know it's it's like engine noises it's

  like it's totally fake when do you eat

  fresh ginger other than this thing that

  you're doing to yourself because you're

  sick I'm not sick I use enjoy this okay

  yes it's fresh but then you chop it up

  and then you cook it you make it hot in

  some kind of pain about the ginger that

  comes with sushi

  that's pickled ah okay and I don't eat


  have you tried it mMmmm neither do I I

  finally so my problem is I don't like

  fish and I'm allergic to avocado try to

  find anything at a sushi restaurant that

  contains neither of those things

  but anyway I'm eating fresh ginger right

  now in this drink it's really good but a

  little Bernie but a little Bernie yeah

  cuz I'm making my own ginger tea because

  actual user tea is bullshit

  just because it contains pepper like I'm

  not convinced people just are like that

  - pepper you think it's it's you think

  it's ginger fakery but maybe it's just

  it's positive peppering if they if

  that's the reason they added it they

  would put pepper on the label they was

  advertised as ginger pepper tea is zero

  of them do this little put salt on the

  labels they're solvent

  no actually I don't think so let's do

  follow-up Peter Kendall writes that he

  loves that Marco you purchased an

  walkie-talkies for your road trip since

  he is an amateur or ham radio operator

  and he is glad that they worked well

  Peter continues well walkie-talkies

  don't have the best range once one

  passes an amateur radio exam that you

  can get access to much more powerful

  radios for example one can get these

  mobile radios that pump out 50 watts and

  are powered by the 12-volt battery in

  your car and to have a detachable head

  unit to put on your dash there are other

  shapes and sizes as well including

  smaller ones that are basically

  glorified walkie talkies but more

  powerful holy monkey 50 watts is yeah I

  don't know anything and I know that's

  significant yeah I mean for reference

  the walkie talkies maxed out at two

  watts and you only get the two watts if

  you go on your only legally supposed to

  use the the two want versions if you go

  to the FCC's website and register for a

  GM RS license which I actually did and I

  didn't want to get in trouble for using

  the tool on channels and I did it

  because it was really easy and

  inexpensive to do it going all the way

  for a full ham radio license is

  considerably more involved and I didn't

  think it was necessary to communicate

  between two vehicles that were usually

  at most a few hundred feet apart so it

  wasn't necessary for this use case but

  ham radio is one of those things like

  that there's a lot of overlap between

  ham radio and nerd culture and I respect

  a lot of it but I don't know that much

  about it but ultimately I've never had

  much of a reason to get into it because

  the the broadcast nature of that hobby

  for me I've solved with odd casting and

  the like short range communication

  nature I've never really had a need

  until now and walkie talkies served my

  needs perfectly well I put this in here

  because I feel like it fits well with

  Marcos vinyl revival and

  I stopped not that he's gonna be into it

  now but maybe this is like the ghost of

  Marco future when he wants another tech

  thing to get into her maybe find himself

  traveling to upstate a lot maybe retires

  to upstate and needs to have

  walkie-talkies seeing Marco take an

  amateur radio exam to get a license for

  a more powerful radio is a thing that

  seems plausible to me so just put a

  marker here come back in 20 years there

  is no way I would ever be allowed to put

  a giant antenna in my yard once you have

  your giant compound upstate you have

  plenty of land for that there's some

  sort of ham joke here that I just can't

  put my finger on I'm more of a brisket

  person now that's not that that's not

  the ham I was going for but I'll allow

  it as long as some one of us got one in

  I'm good all right Eduardo ponts writes

  if anyone's wondering whether the new

  onboarding screens on iOS 11.3 we're all

  about gdpr

  wonder no more and they include a link

  to the photograph of their Apple TV

  where there are clearly some string what

  would you call these I don't like

  placeholders their localization

  identifiers basically like like when so

  when you're when you're writing an app

  that's supposed to be localized to

  different languages you usually wrap the

  string calls in some kind of

  localization layer like NS localized

  string or something like that and so the

  idea is you you don't just hard code the

  language strings are going to be shown

  to the user in like the source code you

  have some kind of resource file that is

  a strings file and then you can localize

  the strings file that's just like a list

  of all the strings that would be

  displayed to a user you can have that

  localized by translators and then you

  could have a whole bundle of those

  things in your app and you can have

  different ones show for different

  language and locale settings and your

  app simply instead of saying like ask

  the user are you sure the app says give

  me the string for the are you short

  dialogue on this page so it might have

  some kind of identifier for that some

  kind of like you know are you sure dot

  identifiers are dot set up dot one or

  something like that and so what we see

  here is there was some kind of problem

  or some kind of bug or something where

  the string didn't load and instead it

  just showed the identifier and it has

  GDP are in the identifiers in the name

  of the identifiers for the for the text

  of this dialog for these boxes so

  clearly Apple

  considers these GDP our dialogues right

  so like a couple samples a TV for Apple

  TV videos GDP our welcome to movies or a

  TV videos GDP our continue button label

  so yeah it was funny to me because I was

  pretty darn confident that this was this

  boiled down to GDP our and man there

  were not a lot of people who disagreed

  but who boy to the people who disagree

  they were very confident that we were

  wrong and guess what told you so

  moving on oh man I did not think to

  figure out how to pronounce this say

  Liam kellian mr. or mrs. Babcock who

  writes in of Dell with technology at the

  high school and elementary levels when

  it comes to cost and collaboration

  features Google wins since that device

  is configured and lockdown iOS doesn't

  count much as for video editing it

  sounds cool but it's a huge time sink I

  didn't add this who did what are you

  what are we trying to say here I just

  put a little bit of etu feedback we got

  a lot of people replying so I just want

  to have a few samples to sort of cover

  the range that's what the next few items

  are about fair enough Andrew link writes

  creativity is the peak of learning but

  40% of the time I'm dealing with quote

  unquote classroom management and 50% is

  trying to even get students to reach the

  baseline there's a broad or there

  they're abroad family and cultural

  issues to address before tech really


  Andrews school or whatever is

  implementing Google suite over the next

  two years it's a mixed bag the

  software's okay that our kid is slowing

  everything to a crawl also tween

  memories and Google level secure

  passwords are painful mix in other words

  everyone's always forgetting their

  passwords did one of your kids have that

  happen to them not me no not me my kid

  has good password hygiene I don't even

  know if you're serious or not scared to

  bits here is that we are people who are

  actually in education writing to us and

  maybe not all of them

  but no matter what it was these people

  were using everyone had complaints right

  so it's not complaints about the thing

  they're not using complaints about the

  thing they are using complaints about

  the difficulty of the job about the

  difficulty of dealing with technology

  and no matter what it was they were

  using if they were all Apple if they

  were all googles they were mix that

  everything had problem we know this

  Varitek podcast we complain about

  technology and we know the frustration

  is that most people who aren't tech

  enthusiasts feel about technology like

  this is frustrated when it doesn't work

  especially if it's you're supposed to be

  using as part of your job so not not a

  lot of feedback was like here's what we

  use and we love it and it's awesome

  awesome some people like one thing

  better than the other one said I'm so

  glad I have X it's better than Y but

  they all had complaints about whatever

  it was they were using so no silver

  bullet for our tech in schools and I

  particularly like the idea of like that

  creativity is the peak of learning sort

  of like a pyramid of like you know what

  was that uh

  said Maslow's hierarchy of needs if

  somebody has a hierarchy of need not

  sloth yeah it's like you know safety and

  bubble and very at the top of like

  self-actualization or whatever and so

  it's like in the classroom get the kids

  to show up get them to be safe get you

  know get them to pay attention get them

  to absorb something like and creativity

  is like when you get all that other

  stuff taken care of and then finally

  they're allowed to to blossom and that

  that's the aspirational nature of what

  Apple is pitching that by buying our

  products they will enhance the the peak

  of learning but you have to get to that

  peak first yeah you know you have to

  have the students in the seats paying

  attention absorbing the material and

  then sprout you know spreading their

  wings and being creative with the things

  that you've successfully taught them it

  was interesting to me that um I felt

  like a lot of the feedback we got about

  education was very contradictory

  you know somebody would say oh of course

  you would want an iPad the total cost of

  ownership is so much better oh you could

  never get an iPad the total cost is so

  much worse it was very it was very in

  and yang and it made me laugh oh yeah

  one more thing I didn't put anybody's

  feedback and I should have but the idea

  of Apple devices or whatever device is

  being expensive and then only being

  available in the quote-unquote rich

  schools lots of people were all right

  there seems to be like a disconnect

  between the students that attend the

  schools and attack space that

  potentially feeds into them because a

  lot of people are like you know we have

  iPads in our school and our it's we're

  not in a wealthy area right and so it's

  like it doesn't mean necessarily the

  students who go to the school are

  well-to-do but it seems in some areas

  more than others money somehow is

  getting to these schools that is not

  directly attributable to the incomes of

  the individual students who are

  attending and I think that's just the

  nature of tax spaces it depends on where

  you live it depends on how your taxes

  are distributed it depends on if there's

  some other program that's feeding money

  into the school to buy the fancy iPads

  for the school that otherwise is not

  awash in cash I mean that I can tell you

  the opposite here where where I live

  it's filled with rich people and yet a

  lot of the technology in the schools too

  my kids attend especially elementary

  school is entirely funded directly by

  the parents as in there is no money in

  the school budget for technology

  whatsoever and the only reason there's

  any technology is because all the kids

  parents are rich and give directly money

  to buy like if you want to see any

  computers in your kids school you're

  gonna have to collect money and give

  them to us right and is it because the

  tax base is a big enough here no I can't

  possibly be it it's just a question of

  budgeting and how much money goes

  towards elementary and how much priority

  they put on putting technology in school

  versus you know tearing down one a local

  elementary school and rebuilding it to

  be this Taj Mahal multi-million dollar

  amazing piece of construction right that

  costs a lot more money than iPads and

  that was not funded by people's parents

  with direct contributions but with good

  old-fashioned taxes and bonds would one

  of you like to tell me about what

  happens when you open a new document in

  pages I think there is a video of it

  this is related to our topic for like

  how do you how do you how do people find

  help in iOS apps when the screen is so

  small how do you communicate the

  features of your application so people

  know when it launches what you can do

  with it begin because the screen is so

  small and there's no I'm the president

  menu bar with a help menu and we were we

  talked about the bad ways you can do

  this by circling a bunch of stuff on the

  screen and throwing a bunch of words at

  people's faces putting it pointing a

  finger and said this

  this thing to do this tap that thing to

  do that tap that thing I'm expecting

  them to memorize at the one time they

  see it

  so there's Benjamin Mayo tweeted a

  little video of what happens and I'm

  assuming this is a new version of pages

  on iOS so they have you know what you do

  have visible in many iOS applications is

  a toolbar with some glyphs on it some

  kind I conjure glyphs either whether

  it's the top or at the bottom and in

  pages this looks like on a phone you

  launch it and the new collaboration

  glyph pulses like if it gets a little

  bigger and smaller I don't know if it

  ever stops pulsing cuz in the video we

  tap sit right away right but if you tap

  it it takes you to this little video

  that shows you like oh the collaborate

  feature and it sort of does this

  wordless animation showing you how

  collaboration might work it's pretty

  good animation that communicates without

  too much text kind of what collaboration

  does it has a brief explanation but then

  shows you a bunch of thing I don't know

  it I think you kind of already have to

  know how collaboration works to

  understand what a video frankly but

  that's I mean I don't know if I like

  that better than the overlay but I guess

  it's certainly trying to be more subtle

  I just can imagine people launching the

  app and going why's that button pulsing

  especially if it doesn't stop or if it

  does stop you might think you're you

  know going a little bit mad that like I

  could swear last time I launched his

  application part of the toolbar was

  pulsing sure I wasn't under cold

  medicine or anything anyways I just

  thought it was interesting

  here's Apple trying alternate solutions

  to scribbling over screen with a bunch

  of arrows so keep trying Apple we are

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  Apple giveth and Apple taketh away good

  news 200 gigs of free our cloud storage

  for bad news every managed Apple ID

  account that's involved in education


  Freeman up because we talk about oh they

  need to give more iCloud storage to

  everybody and you know they haven't for

  a really long time someone put it how

  long it was like seven years there's

  nothing since the five gig free yeah I

  think it's since I flab was introduced

  like it was never less than five gigs

  that's what it's during it yeah and so

  for education this this is something a

  lot of people cited and feedback

  including one that just came in just

  before the show like how much it cost to

  buy all the third-party things you have

  by to fill in the gaps in functionality

  that Apple doesn't offer including

  having cloud storage which according to

  an email we just got I believe a person

  said that there is no way to pay for

  more iCloud storage for students like

  even if you wanted to give them more

  money for more you couldn't I'm not you

  know that seems that seems very strange

  to me but anyway Apple said hey we're

  increasing to two hundred and got lots

  of applause but why wouldn't you you

  know two hundred gigabytes free up from

  five that is a big increase but for

  people who are not students still five

  gigabytes and you know we've heard from

  lots of other you know podcasters and

  fans and Apple users we I keep hearing

  that everyone expects that oh well

  they're just waiting until WTC in June

  and that's when they're going to raise

  the limits for everybody for free I

  honestly would not consider that a safe

  bet at all

  in fact I might even bet against that

  you know we did the five gigs is indeed

  comically stingy and even was seven

  years ago when I'm pretty sure Steve

  Jobs introduced it but you know it was

  it was bad then and it's bad now but

  services are apple's biggest area of

  potential growth I think I don't think

  they're gonna want to give up services

  revenue that easily and this is probably

  not a small portion of it like you know

  the people who upgrade to and iCloud a

  pate iCloud storage plan for you know

  basic functionality of their iOS devices

  really that's probably not a small

  amount of their services revenue so I

  can't imagine them all of a sudden

  raising it to a level that would cover

  way more people for free it'd be nice if

  this happens Apple has in the past

  occasionally intentionally taken a hit

  on margin to do something really

  compelling for consumers and they'll

  usually even warn analysts of that in

  like one of the earnings calls

  beforehand but honestly I don't I just

  don't see that I mean that happened a

  lot more in the past than it does now

  and I don't see them giving up a big

  chunk of services revenue when that is

  clearly an area where they're focusing a

  lot on and depending on for growth I

  think the balance that they have to keep

  looking at is

  how many how many people buy it how

  people are willing to pay money for

  extra storage versus how many people are

  at their storage limits but still I'm

  willing to pay because when you're at

  your storage limit and they're still

  unwilling to pay that becomes apple's

  problem if it starts to affect their

  satisfaction like that they don't like

  apple because it's like they they want

  to charge me money I don't want to give

  them any money and my phone is

  constantly full because a constantly

  full phone is a bad user experience it

  yells you about having too much storage

  you can't take pictures you have to

  choose precious things that you want to

  delete it's a bad experience right and

  so it is in Apple's interest to get

  people somehow to have more storage

  ideally by paying Apple money right

  that's they prefer but if it turns out

  that nothing they do can dislodge this

  very large percentage of people who

  refuse to pay money and constantly have

  full phones that's not a good situation

  now maybe it's still just a fraction of

  people maybe like people do in the end

  they complain but they pay and that an

  apple may be willing to do that and then

  you know people feel better but whenever

  I see somebody with a full iOS device

  who refuses to pay for additional

  storage I I feel apples pain by proxy

  this person is dissatisfied or

  unsatisfied whichever those is the

  correct word with their product and

  there's an obvious solution that doesn't

  cost that much money but there's no way

  you will convince them to pay for you

  know pay for nothing to pay for air to

  pay for whatever storage should be free

  bla bla bla software should be free like

  it's it's a tough sell but it really

  does affect their opinion of their

  device maybe not enough to get them on

  to another device maybe eventually be at

  them on the device but they are mad

  about it so I think that's that's a

  problem Apple needs to address in some

  way maybe they can address it just by

  reducing the prices or changing the

  tears or cleverly arranging the tears

  such that people get on board like with

  the thin end of the wedge like get on

  board a cheapo tear and then slowly like

  ratchet up as they need storage to like

  to make it feel better for people to pay

  for storage because I think that's the

  big barrier the big barrier is not how

  much it costs it's getting people over

  the hump from not paying anything to

  paying something oh yeah because like

  you know so much of this is


  it's it's more about feeling than about

  whether you can afford or not afford the

  you know whatever whatever's the

  cheapest planning like three bucks a

  month or something and a lot of it is

  more like you know people are just kind

  of annoyed on principle that they have

  to pay for this or they're annoyed on

  principle that their phone is bugging

  them about this thing that they haven't

  even actually really rather looked into

  they just know that their phones bugging

  them or they're annoyed on principle

  that they only get five gigs for free

  and and that bugs them or they look at

  the prices of additional storage on

  other services like Dropbox and how it

  compares and they're like oh this is a

  bad deal and and so like it's it's so

  much more about like I don't want to pay

  then I can't afford the X dollars a

  month in a lot of cases or they're

  putting their money like you said

  towards a different thing like well if

  I'm gonna pay for storage I'm gonna get

  the most bang for my buck and that takes

  people off Apple services if you're

  using Dropbox for all your file surge

  you know it's actually even more viable

  now that Apple has the you know the

  share shoot integration for Dropbox and

  stuff but you know like I think Apple

  would be upset if people decided to use

  Google photos instead of Apple's photo

  solution like I think Apple wants you to

  use their photo solution for a variety

  of reasons well they should be trying a

  little harder on a variety of fronts

  then sure yeah and I think Apple would

  tell you that their photo solution is

  like you know better on privacy and all

  those other reasons how you might use it

  but if you are conta you know that's the

  feature that Google has hammer tap on if

  you're constantly running out of storage

  because you're filling up your phone

  with videos and photos and Apple wants

  you to pay more money and Google says

  don't pay us anything we'll keep an

  unlimited amount of your photos where's

  quality asterisk forever and ever people

  say oh well then why would I pay for the

  Apple thing I'm just gonna use Google

  photos and I'm gonna use you know the

  Google Photos app instead of the Apple

  Photos app and I'm gonna use the Google

  Website and like Apple doesn't want you

  to go all in on the Google ecosystem

  right so the Apple should do something I

  don't know if that means increase the

  five gig tier to 200 for everybody for

  free but something would be nice you

  know what it is that bothers me so much

  about this is that I feel like five gigs

  is it egregiously obnoxiously paltry

  amounts if it was maybe as much is the

  smallest modern iPhone so let's say it's

  thirty or whatever gigs you know 32 gigs

  are there abouts

  that at least feels like okay they're

  giving you something reasonable if you

  have one single iPhone attached to your

  Apple ID it stands to reason that you

  should be able to back that up to iCloud

  for free that to me would be still more

  paltry than I would want like something

  along the lines of 200 gigs sounds

  really great you know but let's say for

  the sake of argument you know 32 gigs is

  is what they're going to bring tomorrow

  that's tomorrow you can have 32 gig

  storage then I wouldn't be as offended

  by it I would be slightly annoyed but I

  wouldn't be frigging offended but five

  gigs is like man screw you you don't

  have any storage you know but here fine

  fine okay we'll give you a little bit be

  happy about that

  it's just it's I just find it obnoxious

  it's so little and that's the thing that

  bothers me yeah under how much of this

  is just like inertia like like if they

  were launching the service today I doubt

  that the number they would pick would be

  five gigs but you know it's probably

  hard for them to you know first of all

  in typical Apple fashion they probably

  don't look at this very often you know

  like they set it up it's going and it's

  probably you know a lot like a lot of

  their hardware releases very like it

  just gets ignored for years until

  somebody realizes they should look at it

  eventually and so I'm guessing this

  hasn't actually been reconsidered that

  often and then because there's the

  inertia of having it there for so long

  the idea of increasing it by by a large

  amount probably does scare them on two

  fronts number one you know Marg and as

  mentioned earlier they're probably

  afraid of that services revenue going

  down or or having the growth slowdown

  and number two every iOS device is a lot

  of iOS devices and so the scale of the

  scale at which they would have to scale

  this up they they probably can't offer

  something like a terabyte for free to

  everybody because there probably aren't

  enough hard drive in the world or

  something like that like there is

  probably some kind of major limit on

  scale in place here I don't know where

  that limit is it's gotta be way higher

  than five gigs but they probably

  couldn't say offer 200 gigs to everybody

  like that that might be too high or it

  might be just impractical or it might be

  like me

  they can do it in a couple years maybe

  not yet so there you know there's

  definitely I guarantee you to some kind

  of scale concerns there whether they are

  impassable or not I don't know but you

  know if you start doing the math of how

  many active iOS devices there are out

  there and and how many you know how many

  hard drives and data centers and stuff

  they would need it is pretty large

  numbers so there is definitely a factor

  there but it might not you know its way

  it's gotta be higher than five cakes oh

  there's a new single region only variant

  of s3 for twenty-two percent less than

  the regular price how could get right on

  that I'm trying to think back to when

  the five gig limit was introduced and

  I'm pretty sure that five gigs was

  always positioned as this is not enough

  for you - this is not cover you even

  there wasn't the Apple never sold the

  five gig device with a five K good thing

  it was always so clearly the starter

  price you get a little bit for free but

  if you use and fill whatever device you

  purchased fine you're gonna run out of

  five gigs so it was always with the

  expectation that if you fill the device

  you need to buy more five gigs today

  still is something that if you get it

  and you feel that it ice you got to buy

  more it's so it fulfills the same role

  like it is it is equally able to cause

  people to hit the limit right and

  arguably with with the he can he's you

  know h.265 stuff you could hit your

  limits more slowly now than you did last

  year because your images are half the

  size and stuff and now you can fit ten

  minutes of 4k video yeah but in general

  things every every photo and every video

  is so much bigger than it was back when

  the five gig limit was introduced that

  it you know it feels more punitive now

  than it did before it's just it's a

  bummer classrooms for Mac so there's

  already classrooms app for iPad maybe

  iPhone I don't remember doesn't really

  matter for iOS and they said classrooms

  for Mac is coming in June as a beta what

  why not now as a beta why June well

  there's one clear well I shouldn't say

  clear answer there's one clear theory

  about that

  there's one hopeful theory

  and probably a few other explanations

  that are less interesting right and one

  of the less interesting ones is probably

  the accurate you know real answer but

  the fun theory that we can pontificate

  about is marzipan which is that supposed

  cross-platform framework that is maybe

  but maybe not coming at WWDC and perhaps

  that's why we can't talk about it

  because there's more things to come in

  June at WDC and then they will all be

  made clear that's why you can't download

  it like because if you download it then

  everyone just you know run class dump or

  whatever and look at the frameworks but

  speaking of frameworks the the much more

  boring explanation it's it's UX kit the

  same thing that photos and stuff is made

  out of like when when Apple has been in

  situations in the past where there's an

  iOS device and they want something more

  or less like that iOS device on the Mac

  they have ways of doing that that don't

  involve the rumored cross platform

  framework thing yeah and also it might

  not be ready yet it actually is they're

  just not done writing it and that's and

  that I think is by far the most likely I

  love the idea of this project marzipan

  thing I really hope it's real and I do

  think this summer would not be an

  unreasonable time to launch it into beta

  that would be a really fun explanation

  for this it's much more likely that it

  just isn't ready yet because it is not

  like the fact that Apple said here's an

  event that we're going to announce

  something but you can't actually see it

  or buy it or use it yet for a few months

  that's so common now like that that's

  constantly used for all sorts of reasons

  for all sorts of products it the most

  rare thing now is when they have an

  event and then on something that's ready

  right then you can buy like today or

  tomorrow that's the less common case now

  so the fact this isn't ready yet I

  really I I think it's unlikely that it

  has any other meaning other than it's

  not ready yet but it probably is using

  UX kit because I don't see why they

  would pour something from iOS and not

  use the framework they have that they

  have you successfully deport a bunch of

  stuff from iOS right that's not the

  cross flight that's not marzipan but it

  is a way that Apple has done this in the

  past and I'm sure you know it saves some

  time especially if marzipan requires

  support the OS level on the Mac side

  which it probably would I they probably

  wouldn't have that support in

  hi Sierra it would probably be pushed to

  the next version of Mac OS or maybe even

  the one after that if it's gonna launch

  in beta and that's not gonna be ready in

  time for this coming school year it's

  gonna be launched probably in like

  October or something and no IT

  administrators should be installing it

  in October it's so so you know it's

  probably just not ready yet

  then setting aside new bikes kit like

  the way like I knew Apple applications

  to be iOS like whether or not they use

  your xcode under the covers when they

  just feel like an iOS app photos

  certainly does I think maps maps maybe

  contacts or notes depending on how you

  squint at them reminders calendar yeah

  it could be argued that this is actually

  not iOS like but merely the modern Mac

  way like apples trying to say this is

  what modern man can look like but if you

  use iOS a lot a lot of things look

  mighty familiar and again I didn't I'm

  not looking at the you know I'm not

  class dumping every single one of these

  apps to see do they actually use the

  same framework as photos or is it you

  know but from a user's perspective they

  vary they feel very iOS see in this case

  we know it's an application that already

  existed in iOS and so it makes sense

  that they would use some technique to

  reuse some of the work that they've

  already done in iOS rather than

  reloading it from scratch in app kit but

  I'm sure when this application comes out

  some of them will tell us definitively

  probably Steve John Smith I have one

  quickie I just wanted to share I have

  finally joined the world of inductive

  charging and by and large my phone for

  the last couple of weeks now has not had

  anything plugged into it and inductive

  charging is pretty cool turns out who

  knew oh that's right I told you this a

  long time ago well but the difference

  between you and me is I didn't crap all

  over inductive charging I just said oh

  that sounds neat sir anyway the point

  I'm trying to say is the most that that

  I think you and most of the rest of

  world recommended is really great and I

  got what appears to be like what is

  aesthetically a terrible mount for my

  car but in in functionality is a really

  great mount for my car and so what I can

  do is I can get in my car I can just

  kind of drop

  my phone in this little mount and it

  starts charging and when I want to leave

  my car I just pick it up out of the

  mount and it's super convenient I'm only

  ever in my car for like two minutes at a

  time so I'm doing this just because I

  think it's cool not because it's ever

  particularly useful but inductive

  charging super cool and it is super

  weird after having had an iPhone since

  the 3GS to have gone for like two weeks

  without having plugged anything to my

  phone so odd but I love it yeah it's

  like I know a lot of people try and it's

  not for them that's cool

  I I find it very much for me as well

  like I really like now plugging in my

  phone like when I travel it just feels

  barbaric it's like wait man like I have

  to plug this am like this is so weird

  yeah the one thing I will I do still

  plug it in in the car I did so in our

  episode about my $7 piece of garbage

  that I was using to mount my phone on my

  car before a bunch of people wrote in to

  recommend better phone mounts and by far

  the most commonly recommended one is the

  pro clip line of products and you

  basically you go on pro cliff site and

  you buy like a certain like base that's

  made to fit exactly your model of car

  and then you buy like the second part of

  it which is like the phone part that you

  you buy exactly the one for exactly the

  phone you have and they enter the

  interface in some kind of standard way

  and so you like when you get a new phone

  you can just replace the phone part and

  you get a new car you just place the car

  part and it's not cheap the combination

  of both the both sides of this was $90

  holy hell mess up your dashboard - right

  well no so it does a like a pressure fit

  inside one of the air vents so it just

  it's like it's like pushing against the

  top and bottom of the air vent to kind

  of wedge yourself in there with like a

  little rubber pad under it to keep it in

  place and I gotta say it is really

  really solid like my is the only thing

  I've seen that has that actually keeps

  the phone like totally still you know

  you can run over a bump or anything the

  phone does not move like it is it is

  attached very firmly to the car it was

  very easy to get and install the cable

  routings my got the kind I got the let's

  see the adjustable phone adjustable

  iPhone holder for

  lightning to USB cable so what you do is

  it has like a little clamp in the bottom

  you actually stick an apple cable into

  it and this is this is where I used my

  one black Apple lightning cable from my

  iMac Pro I use it here it look better in

  black and it is basically a dock and so

  I just stick my phone into it and it is

  getting a wired charge and it just stays

  right there and it's awesome the only

  major downside to this is that it's not

  it's combo it was it was 34 the car part

  and 60 for the iPhone adjustable thing

  with the cable so again why not cheap

  way more than my seven dollar piece of

  garbage however also way nicer than my

  seven dollar piece of garbage and I can

  see myself keeping this up as long as I

  continue to use ways on a semi-regular

  basis in my car I think as I get new

  phones and new cars down the road I

  think I will probably stay in the pro

  clip yukos system for now cuz it is

  surprisingly nice like you can like take

  the phone out with one hand and the

  mount doesn't move and stuff like that

  like it just it's just nice like it's

  it's solid and heavy-duty and just

  really nice the reason I stick with

  wired charging which is why I thought of

  this here is that Qi charging is not

  fast enough to charge the phone and run

  ways it can keep the phone at about the

  same charge level it's already at or

  maybe very slowly trickle charge it well

  but like the the charge rate really

  requires a 10 watt plug like like what

  you get from the iPad bricks or from the

  high powered USB chargers so it really

  requires that too both runways

  constantly and also charge the phone and

  a meaningful rate and you right now I

  don't think any Qi charger even the 7.5

  watt movie one I don't think any of them

  can actually do it fast enough so for Qi

  charging in cars I've still honestly

  can't recommend that unless you are very

  light with your phone's usage in the car

  but for Wired stuff I can recommend Pro

  clip if you were willing to spend $90 on

  a clip for your phone to your car this

  is the difference between you and me in

  summary you bought one car charger for

  ninety dollars you could buy three and a


  of the inductive chargers that I just

  bought which admittedly are not nearly

  as nice I'm quite sure but three and a

  half if the Chargers still can't charge

  my phone for ways know what I'm saying

  this is this is you and me in a nutshell

  I don't need three and a half chargers I

  need one charge

  I'm just saying also before we get a

  bazillion pieces of email do we really

  care about the report that came out

  recently I don't remember where I saw it

  about how wireless charging destroys

  your battery because it's when it's

  trying to keep your battery topped up

  it's like discharging recharging

  discharging recharging discharging

  recharging I don't think I really care

  that much and maybe I will if I see that

  my battery is not doing well which maybe

  I could do in this new battery window or

  a screen in settings but I don't know

  man like especially someone who keeps

  iPhones only for a year I just don't

  care like Apple wouldn't have made this

  a thing if they thought it was going to

  nuke their batteries so hashtag yellow I

  thought that pitch was that it was heat

  yeah part of the idea was that because

  Qi charging generates some heat like a

  little more heat than regular charging

  that it that you know charging your

  battery in a hot environment is worse

  for it you know just operating your

  battery in a hot environment is worse

  for it so there's you know there might

  be something to that I can't imagine you

  know because it's Apple is doing like

  the management of the charging on the

  phone end in their firmware I can't

  imagine they would allow it to abuse the

  battery like that I think they would

  control that a little bit better well

  that's not abuse that everything does

  that laptops and phones they they don't

  they allow it to discharge a little bit

  and then trickle it up and then

  discharge a little bit do that

  everything every device has done that

  forever that's good I I don't think duck

  dude does that anymore than plugged in

  because like marques that Apple's

  controlling it but if all charging

  things produce more heat for equivalent

  power transfer to the battery which

  makes sense to me for a you know

  inductive type thing then maybe you have

  a little bit extra heat yeah but

  regardless I think the you know just

  using your phone on a regular basis is

  probably doing way more you know where

  on the battery then the minor

  differences in how you charge it

  generally charging it more slowly is

  usually better for its long-term health

  but again a twitch and an image case she

  charges should actually be really good

  for a good theory but you know I it's a

  kind of thing like you know we talked

  about before if you just use your phone

  normally you're gonna burn through

  batteries you know over a year or two

  and now that Apple's offering less

  expensive battery replacements I think

  if you care about this kind of thing

  it's much more reasonable to just going

  after two years again a new battery for

  30 bucks then to have to micromanage

  your entire life around not using

  convenient things or trying to like

  tiptoe around the battery because you

  know no matter what you do it's gonna

  wear out and a reasonable amount of time

  like it's gonna it's gonna wear out

  probably around the same amount of time

  as it would have no matter what you did

  so you might as well use your phone to

  its fullest potential use whatever is

  convenient about it use it how you want

  to use it and if your battery wears out

  in a year and a half or two years just

  get a new battery for 30 bucks and just

  plan for that ahead of time and try to

  live a healthy life so you can live long

  enough for some battery technology to

  come out that has way longer charge

  cycle failure rates like I don't think

  we can expect the infinite like I can

  charge and recharge and uncharged just a

  million times and it never degrades

  right but if you can just change it from

  whatever these bad all your batteries

  are rated I like the rate of like a

  thousand cycles or something before that

  could put if that was you know 100,000

  it would seem like that you could use a

  phone basically forever and the battery

  was as good the day you bought it as the

  day it went away we are not living in

  the current time with that technology

  available but there are lots of research

  things that are all the the cliched five

  to ten years away so stay alive long

  enough and you might see one of those

  happen I will also say if you are

  interested in getting a better

  replacement maybe wait on that a little

  bit because you have no choice isn't I'm

  to like four months now yeah yeah we

  keep hearing from people that the wait

  times span from weeks to months for

  getting new batteries you know there's

  so many people going in now after a

  battery gate scandal and now with 11.3

  actually telling them you know whether

  the battery is degraded or not there's a

  lot of people going in and apparently

  the wait for the battery is at the

  Genius Bar is literally like weeks or

  months in a lot of places and so

  by the time you know if you buy a new

  phone now and you cheat charged it all

  the time but that's how the battery

  wears out you should probably be able to

  get one might not be $30 anymore but

  that's probably true oh and one more

  thing on this pro clip thing I remember

  when you mentioned your clip and people

  sent in stuff I went to this site

  because I was looking for similar clips

  I think I just bought one for my wife

  and I was wondering if they were better

  ones and on the pro clip website

  the image they have in the background at

  the top of the page shows a mount that

  goes into like the gap in the dashboard

  between like the the top stuff and the

  thing that has the vents it doesn't go

  inside the vents like you were just

  describing and like you know I have one

  right now that goes inside the vents

  that's usually difficult way to do it

  you see that on the website it's like

  good I do see what you mean mine is not

  mine does not do that mine is mine

  presses against the top and bottom inner

  edge of the vent right and so when I saw

  this I was like well forget that I'm not

  jamming anything into the cracks in my

  dashboard if it had just gotten into the

  air vent I probably would have liked oh

  well that's how they all work so it

  would be fine

  so that scared me away so I guess it

  depends on your exact model of car but I

  really don't want anything because once

  you do that you know if you ever take

  that out now you have giant gaps where

  that thing had been wedged in for the

  past six months or whatever we are

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  Squarespace bloomberg reports that Apple

  is planning to use its own chips and

  Mac's starting in just a couple of years

  and giving Intel the boot I feel like we

  on this show have flirted with this

  topic on and off pretty much since this

  year the show started in 2013 so on the

  one side I find this fascinating and I

  feel like we should talk about it on the

  other side I feel like we've we've been

  around this this topic so many times I'm

  not sure what else there is to say but

  yeah Intel has not had the dramatic

  improvements that they used to have

  there what does a tick-tock cycle has

  been slowing down and now they've

  basically said yeah we're not going to

  do that anymore so Apple may be taking

  matters into their own hands when it

  comes to CPUs and they may just start

  putting those in computers rather than

  just iPhones and fake computers I mean

  iPads so what are our thoughts because

  what we assume we don't know but we

  assume these would be ARM processors

  which is different than the Intel

  processor in a Mac it's a different

  instruction set which means things would

  have to be you know all your apps and

  the operating system would have to be

  compiled again like there are many many

  many things that fall out of this it

  would basically be the PowerPC to Intel

  transition all over again

  how do we feel are we excited are we

  bummed I mean let's start with Marco

  what do you think I don't really know

  what to think yet at a high level it

  seems inevitable that if Apple wants to

  keep maintaining the Mac you know

  competitively and if they want to push

  it forward and if basically if they're

  gonna care about the Mac again this does

  seem like an obvious direction to take

  it and we have seen rumblings that they

  are caring about the Mac again I mean

  the iMac Pro I think is one of the

  biggest ones like there's a lot of

  things about the iMac Pro that they

  didn't have to do but but they did it

  anyway and and they made a really great

  product and and so I'm I'm heartened to

  see like they are actually investing you

  know non-trivial into Mac hardware and

  will I hope to see more of that as the

  year goes on I hope to see fixed laptops

  I hope to see the Mac Pro we'll see how

  that all turns out but clearly they they

  have they have had some kind of change

  of heart or at least change of direction

  with Mac hardware if they're gonna keep

  doing stuff like that

  this does seem like an obvious place to

  go because Intel really is holding them

  back in a few areas and I wouldn't say

  all areas you know as some people have

  pointed out we haven't seen what Apple's

  chip design department can do for for

  computing with like the Xeon in the iMac

  Pro you know they could probably do a

  pretty good job if I had to guess but we

  don't know that yet

  what we do know is that Apple can

  definitely compete with Intel with their

  chip designs at lower ends of the power

  spectrum so that would be most important

  in frankly the most commonly sold Mac's

  small laptops like that's where this

  makes a huge difference like if you can

  actually have say something like the

  size of a macbook 12-inch or if you can

  have something like a real computer size

  like a 13-inch you can get serious gains

  and battery life and maybe even

  performance at the same time by

  switching to a modern Apple arm design

  and these things probably so it does

  seem like that's a really clear place to

  go in addition Intel has been a pretty

  crappy supplier to Apple I think in

  recent years and not even yet

  like over a long time now you know intel

  has really had a lot of problems itself

  a lot of problems too you know shipping

  its ships on time getting its fabs going

  and whatever it's needing to do a lot of

  problems with performance per watt

  compared to arm chips you know in a lot

  of ways Intel is really not delivering

  very well on supplying apple with what

  it actually needs and and this isn't

  that different from when IBM was not

  delivering very well on PowerPC and

  Apple made a switch you know in that

  case to Intel because they were doing

  great then but it wouldn't surprise me

  at all if Apple decides to take this

  kind of move as long as they care enough

  about the Mac to to push this kind of

  thing through it's a big job it's a

  really big job it requires tons of major

  and long-running changes it's going to

  be a heck of a transition if it happens

  it's gonna really you know need a lot of

  work a lot of time it's gonna be a

  little messy however I do think where

  they would end up it could be really

  nice even if it doesn't even go to the

  whole line even even if it doesn't do

  like the high end like the desktops in

  the Zeon's even if it just stays in like

  the smallest laptop line maybe even like

  the 15-inch doesn't even have it but

  maybe the 12 inch and 13 inch do okay it

  probably Sartain 12 meter honestly that

  would be really really competitive for

  those products you get really good

  battery life you get pretty competitive

  performance and many of the apps that

  people use you know first of all maybe

  the apps people use are built in OS apps

  that come with the system and so those

  would all be ready you know on day one

  probably and then you know a lot of apps

  people use would be simple recompiles or

  not that much work to to get them

  updated for it or recompile for it so

  like I think that could be a really

  great direction for the products to take

  the downside to this might where I'm

  concerned and I did a little quick tweet

  about this earlier the main reason I'm

  concerned about this is that if this is

  true which that's a big if I worry will

  Apple in the near future or ever place

  enough priority on mac OS to really make

  this happen well on the software side

  because ever since iOS came out Mac OS

  has been really a distant second

  priority they you know they have made no

  efforts to hide that and I think it's

  obvious to everybody and you could argue

  that that should be how it is because

  iOS devices sell so much more than Macs

  and really are the bulk of the company's

  income and everything so like Mac OS is

  really not a priority for them and

  hasn't been for a long time and what we

  see every time they do try to update Mac

  OS they seem to be getting Messier and

  sloppier and introducing more and and

  worse and more embarrassing bugs a lot

  you know every time they rewrite a

  subsystem it comes out buggier than the

  one before it and maybe it might

  eventually catch up but it usually takes

  a few release this is at least there's a

  lot of problems with Mac OS and it seems

  like they're incapable of touching it

  recently without breaking stuff and a

  lot of times the stuff they break never

  gets fixed so I'm concerned if they're

  going to approach this kind of move to

  arm like a whole architecture transition

  if they're going to approach that with

  the same level of frankly I don't know

  if it's carelessness but at least they

  are not giving it the resources that

  they need to make quality so far if

  they're gonna you know attack this

  problem like that then they might just

  break everything and make everything way

  worse and maybe never fix it or fix it

  very slowly or never fix certain parts

  of it that's where I'm concerned is like

  I really want the Mac platform to be

  brought forward in big ways it needs it

  however if it's going to do that with

  the same amount of starved resources and

  seeming disregard for quality and

  exchange for ship dates that I don't

  think is is beneficial to the platform

  so that's my concern came back though

  when do you kick this off with Casey the

  fact that we've discussed this many

  times in the past this is this is a bit

  of inside baseball medic concern but I'm

  always worried about like how much to

  repeat something that we've said on a

  past show because you

  you can't assume that everyone listening

  now is listening to all the dozens of

  hours we have talked about the same

  topic but on the other hand if you have

  listened to them do you really want us

  to hear this here I say the same things

  again so on this topic I'm I'm looking

  for two things I think Marco was at

  least looking for one of these but one

  is something new to say on the topic

  which think Marco is found with is

  concerned about that via the care and

  attention that they've shown to Mac OS

  being applied to a hardware transition

  right which we haven't really talked

  about that much in the past because I

  think if you pass three times we talked

  for this

  we weren't collectively as disgruntled

  about the quality of Mac OS right and

  the second one is specifically this

  story when stuff like this comes out I'm

  looking for is there any new information

  and the story like is that is there any

  information period other than hey guess

  what Apple could could transition Mac's

  to a different processor that it makes

  itself and in this story there isn't

  really much new information except

  perhaps some dates a whole lot of

  hedging this this line from the article

  is great I would call this comprehensive

  but covering Apple could still

  theoretically abandon or delay the

  switch theoretically is the icing on the

  cake there but it could still abandon or

  delay it's like you're reading this

  whole article let me tell you Apple's

  gonna do this thing half way through the

  Oracle says and by the way they might

  not do this it's like all right we get

  it you're covering yourself okay you can

  say well we didn't say there were gonna

  we just said they they're gonna but they

  might not and then theoretically

  abandoned or delay theoretically they

  can abandon or delay it

  there's no theory you don't need anyway

  not a big fan of the article but as in

  all these things set aside the article

  and just take it as a data point as

  another little pebble to the pile you

  know maybe this pebble you know we'll

  see like where there's smoke this fire

  kind of as you see more and more stories

  about a topic maybe you start to take it

  start taking it more seriously than just

  like when we've talked about in the past

  it has just been sort of idle musing

  like because it's an obvious thing like

  Apple is really good at making and

  getting better making ARM processors

  and Apple likes to control this stuff

  and apples trying to make him more and

  more of the stuff themselves or design

  more more than stuff themselves and have

  it fab and Intel's befall on behind

  likes lots of reasons to talk about this

  so I don't want to rehash all the things

  we've discussed about in the past but I

  mean I kinda actually I kind of do but I


  I want everyone who's listening now to

  know all the hours of discussion we had

  about this because I want us all to get

  credit for having the foresight and

  wisdom to have discussed this issues

  well in the past but I don't want to

  have to repeat them for everybody now

  the only one I will repeat explicitly is

  one of the things that is in tension

  about this topic is the idea of Apple

  spending the money that would be

  required to make an ARM chip that is

  essentially useless for iOS devices

  right to make an ARM chip for the Mac

  Pro for instance right 150 watt Mac Pro

  caliber chip to make something like that

  to design it is a lot of work and you

  can reuse a lot of the work you did for

  you the lesser chips that are in phones

  and iPads like to use the cores and

  assemble them or whatever but a lot of

  the stuff you do will only be for that

  Mac Pro like you won't be able to use

  that chip anywhere else because nothing

  else has that that power envelope and in

  the past when we've talked about this

  the question was always alright well so

  Apple can reuse a lot of the chips

  directly like in the mac books and stuff

  but when it comes to the Mac Pro if

  they're going to transition the whole

  line they have to make that chip

  themselves from scratch there is no you

  know and and that's a lot of money to

  invest does Apple really want to invest

  that amount of money solely in the Mac

  as Margaret Cho said and you know in our

  in our modern iMac Pro having error we

  could say hey they actually spent a lot

  of money money they didn't necessarily

  have to spend reusing and adapting

  technology from iOS things in an

  application that basically is only

  useful in the iMac Pro like that t2 chip

  is probably not going into an iPad

  anytime soon it's probably not even

  going into a laptop right is that you

  know is that e1 in there we'll see but

  they spent a lot of time and money

  building a Mac Pro

  made a good product out of it and like

  the touch bar before it as much as we

  may or may not like it it shows a

  willingness to invest in Mac hardware

  that is probably out of proportion

  financially to how much money the Mac

  brings in because as we've pointed out

  in Apple now seems to agree the Mac's

  importance is also out of proportion to

  the amount of money it brings in its

  importance to the overall Apple platform

  and not just because you develop iOS

  apps for but that's part of it but Apple

  seems to be on the same page with with

  all of us now about you know Pro Mac

  users are an important constituency they

  had that roundtable a year or so ago or

  whatever and Apple said they agreed and

  it's made us all happy for a long time

  when we're patiently waiting for the

  fruits of that labor the iMac Pro is one

  of the fruits of that labor and it's

  good right it came out good right so

  we're all enthusiastic about that but

  that makes it more and more likely that

  they would be willing to spend the money

  they would need to spend to make a bunch

  of arm CPUs reusing cores and other

  technology and stuff from elsewhere but

  in it but in a big giant high-power blob

  that is not useful anywhere except for

  Mac's so this story is another pebble on

  the pile the iMac Pro and that round

  table some more pebbles so it's starting

  to look more and more likely things

  against it new tried to come up with

  some a new angle on us and the new angle

  that I have not against this theory but

  because doesn't mean they're not going

  to do it but something that if they did

  do it would be a disadvantage to Mac

  users it would be a step down from where

  they are today

  is that none of the stories I've seen

  rumors or whatever have suggested that

  what Apple would actually be doing is

  making a new line of CPUs that they

  would use in Macs and that they would

  also sell to the whole rest of the

  industry I haven't even seen that

  suggested like no one no one even dare

  speculate about that let alone say that

  they think it's a thing that I was going

  to do so we always just assume yeah

  Apple would make its own CPUs because

  they like to make their own whatever's

  and they make their own a series system

  out of chips and then they make their

  own Wi-Fi you know why would

  the W one ship and they make they make

  all sorts of stuff right not make but

  you know design and have someone fit for

  them and they don't sell them to the

  rest the industry yeah they license the

  W one for the purposes of referrals and

  stuff like that but