Top Four

Top Four 3: Reality TV Shows


  I should probably have written something

  down you're the worst

  yeah all right so Marco was supposed to

  pick the topic tonight but he read me

  one of his topics from his topic list I

  asked him to actually give me the top

  four topics that he had had but he

  refused to give me the top four so he

  gave me one and it really bad it was

  terrible it was so bad I can't even

  remember what it is right now honestly I

  have no idea what you even told me but I

  know that when you told me I was

  horrified and it was terrible

  and that was so i-i've been keeping this

  list and notes on my phone never look up

  note - my phone - ooh well like your

  gift list is there - you don't - see

  that no so I like to be spoiled I've

  been keeping this list on my phone every

  time I think of a good idea for what we

  can do for top 4 and he's been hyping it

  up like it's the greatest list ever and

  he has secrets on there that he wasn't

  gonna tell me and so I could be

  surprised when he reveals it when we

  record and all his topics are so great

  turns out they're terrible all the words

  so I pick what I thought was the best

  one what you want me to do tell the

  audience now I forgot so yeah sure tell

  me - it's that good

  so I think what I thought was the best

  one which was roadtrip food options oh

  yeah I mean come on

  and even as I was saying I was like you

  know there won't like argue how yeah

  over like how there's only probably four

  choices that we'd even list so like it's

  not even a top fours are the only four I

  would eat Arby's period period there is

  no - three or four I will not eat

  anything else on the road

  everything else is vile and disgusting

  Arby's or a bag of gummy bears

  that's nope nope warm do that no yeah

  bad yeah well you'll everyone always

  wants one or two gummy worms but when

  you get the bag you have to eat 40 gummy

  worms and then nobody wants to feel that

  way afterwards and now you get like

  stomach aches and nightmares and it's


  you get nightmares from Commerce oh yeah

  they'll get you oh my god all right so

  our topic tonight is what so our topic


  mmm I don't think I'm ready to talk

  about the topic that we talked about in

  the kitchen ah I don't think I can do it

  yeah I have to do a little bit more

  research I don't know I don't want to

  hurt feelings I don't want to I don't

  think I want to go there yet okay

  all right we can wait so what's your

  topic for the night so I was trying to

  vary it up because Marco was supposed to

  pick the topic since I picked the last

  two topics but it looks like I am going

  to be the topic picker of the family

  since Marcos topics are awful as you

  heard oh yeah I mean you know you're

  typically I'm in charge of wires mm-hmm

  anything that includes wires and we

  sound really good because of your

  choices yeah yeah so so I got wires

  covered and things that things that have

  wires you have generally soft things and

  things that are supposed to look good in

  the house and also you manage the

  calendar yep I'm good calendar manager

  yeah and I and I do the grocery shopping

  and the school drop-offs and you do the

  putting to beds the laundries and lots

  of other stuff yep I do those things

  making the bed

  changing the sheets yeah well that could

  that soft things yeah that's true

  yeah so we're gonna add to your faith

  hops Ubaid hops hops is soft and he

  huffed but I walk hops which involves a

  leaf which is kind of like a wire that's

  true Wow all of this is really coming

  together yeah this is a very well

  thought out very well planned I don't

  like everything I always say very

  well-thought-out yeah Marco it didn't

  even oh my goodness no less nothing

  prepared oh I have a list it's just

  terrible okay all right let me get my

  paper here I have a notebook I write

  things down and stuff I don't know did

  you hear that

  microphones pretty good all right so

  since we're not doing the topic that we

  talked about in the kitchen that we kept

  telling each other stop stop stop

  talking stop talking say before the show

  we're not doing that so you're going to

  do top four reality TV shows okay I mean

  I wanted to vary it up a little bit and

  like you know maybe come back to this

  one later but because your topic was so

  awful you have forced my hand

  to the reality TV show topic now reality

  TV shows include a lot of things it

  includes competition shows it

  I don't know competitions well it

  includes category of like survivor and

  Big Brother like those kind of like what

  some of those like kind of competitions

  but wearing the country shows various

  finding things shows working in a store

  shows working I don't know wait so what

  is Hanks would that include things like

  diners drive-ins and dives

  absolutely yeah does it's based in

  reality they're going places and they're

  doing stuff even there's one host which

  is fine but they're like talking to

  people in real life see to me this I

  think there's a lot of overlap here with

  the Netflix garbage shows category now

  do if we still want to do a Netflix

  garbage show category no this is Netflix

  car my shows I mean like but it doesn't

  have to be on Netflix but we just happen

  to consume all of our television through

  Netflix so if it wasn't on Netflix in

  the last like six years so we probably

  haven't seen it right I don't have it

  the television actually yes we don't

  have we have a television set but we

  don't have cable yeah there's a word for


  we're cord cutters that sounds like a

  berthing thing well I mean I guess

  everybody would be no I guess no you

  could just wait for it to fall off right

  you know you have to cut it eventually

  I'd please don't god stop okay it's

  reality shows apparently we are called

  cord cutters yes you never heard that

  before I mean I guess I have but I just

  never thought of myself as one well we

  did it before was cool we did it in like

  2006 I did it before that because all my

  jobs I never bothered having TV cuz I

  was wandering the country that's true

  yeah anyway so we are cord cutters I'm

  sorry to tell you but we do have you

  know Netflix iTunes and occasional other


  trust me there are plenty of chords in

  this house yes I make sure of that so

  with that being said so see to me that I

  think the goal here you know we

  discussed having a Netflix garbage shows

  category and to me it's different

  because like something like top reality

  shows I would put Top Chef really high

  on my list

  might be number one we'll see but Top

  Chef to me is really really high on that

  list but Top Chef is not a Netflix

  garbage show and when you go to the TV

  you're going to it with a certain role

  in mind if you just had a really tough

  day a really tiring day you're exhausted

  you want to go and sit on the couch and

  watch TV and maybe browse Twitter while

  you're watching TV you're not going to

  put on something like Top Chef it's

  actually good that you want to pay

  attention to you're gonna put on a

  garbage show so to me this might be a

  separate category hmm Joey split this up

  I think so I think this is chuh shows

  everything is ruined my shirt is just

  obliterated but I don't I can't think of

  anything else that's like a good reality

  show besides the two that I have is my

  top two Top Chef Project Runway yeah yep

  yeah so I don't I guess we could go

  further down but because like it just

  degrades from there it really does I

  don't so we both just said Top Chef

  would be our favorite show because I

  find that to be a fantastic reality show

  the camaraderie is usually really good

  between the contestants it is kind of

  classy you know they don't really fight

  that much it's not about the fighting if

  they do fight it's more about the

  cooking and the menus and the meals and

  who's good at their craft it's not so

  much about the the drama

  I guess that a lot of other reality

  shows kind of fall victim to and that's

  also kind of why I like Project Runway I

  mean yes there's plenty of drama and

  Project Runway but it's mostly about

  people being really really good at their

  craft and you watching them compete to

  be the best especially when contestants

  start helping each other which often

  happens on both of those shows and then

  you always have that one guy that's like

  I'm here to not make friends and I'm

  here to win I'm here to win I'm not here

  to make friends and I'm not gonna help

  anybody and it's like guys you're told

  those guys always win do you think it's

  a thing like you know how there's

  there's the Wilhelm scream have you ever

  heard of this no it's this very famous

  movie sound effect and it's kind of a

  thing to put it in every movie somewhere

  you know about movies no but I know


  it's like it's like an insider joke

  among filmmakers and film buffs that

  there's this one sound effect called the

  Wilhelm scream I think that that is just

  in like tons and tons of movies from you

  know decades ago and forward and it's

  it's like this joke to kind of put in

  everything do you think reality show

  producers have that kind of joke where

  they they just always have to have in

  every season of every series they always

  have to have somebody saying I'm not

  here to make friends I'm here to win I

  think so because I'm pretty sure I've

  heard it on every single reality show

  season of like a competition show that

  can possibly remember yeah I I'm I'm

  almost positive I have and it's it's

  funny cuz it's like it's the exact same

  phrase almost every time like if there's

  not a lot of variety in that phrase and

  it's in everything even the shows like

  Top Chef which you're pretty low drama

  and even even a lot of the shows like

  like chopped or you know some like the

  shorter shows but they don't even have

  that much time to throw in stuff like


  don't worry no they're still there not

  to make friends someone always make sure

  that they say that even if it takes like

  two or three episodes with a show like

  chop the contestants change every single

  episode there's still that guy that's

  gonna come on and say he's not there to

  make friends it's like you're here for

  like 30 minutes guy like you still there

  were these hairs like no no one cares to

  be here right like no one's jumping down

  your throat to be your friend like you

  can calm down see I I really hope that

  at some point they have somebody on

  there that says you know what I'm here

  to make friends I don't really care if I

  win yeah I'd like to hear that too

  it'd be cool to have to have some shows

  start throwing and throwing that and

  every time it's dead yeah but then they

  wouldn't get put on because then they're

  not like a personality well that's a

  personality just maybe a different one

  maybe maybe a less exciting one mm-hmm

  that's true you know there was a on

  project one way I think a lady named

  sweet pea she was very nice she was that

  kind of person how'd she do she do okay

  didn't get that far

  right cuz she was there to make friends

  I mean but she did make friends did she

  I don't know I kind of hope she did

  don't know think about have you ever had

  friends on a reality show see your

  essence because you know the inside you

  know and you know that the answer for

  you is yes so let me reflect your

  question back super famous so to other


  have you ever had friends on every aisle

  why funny you ask I really did really

  which show would that be Top Chef and

  Project Runway I forgot what the top

  chef won yeah well I mean okay they

  weren't like we're not like BFFs that we

  talk all day so my Top Chef connection

  when I was a senior when I was a

  freshman he was a senior and we went to

  prom together in the same limo because I

  went to prom as a freshman I was invited

  by a senior and so yeah we went to prom

  together in the same limo and hung out

  together afterwards and the next day and

  I knew him from school and theater stuff

  and singing and everything and yeah so

  he ended up being a chef on Top Chef and

  his name is Richard Sweeney I think

  never said that it was such a good

  friend didn't say that that's true well

  you should at least know the name of the

  contestant on and on it was one of those

  things that you look you watching a show

  and you're like that guy really looks

  familiar and then all of a sudden you're

  like oh my gosh that's someone I knew

  but when you knew someone from high

  school and he was 18 years old and come

  on now we're in our 30s and he's four

  years old three years older than me

  anyway this American boy okay that's me

  and his life is totally different now

  so you see I feel like you you probably

  can't claim him as a friend I'm not

  claiming you can traverse day I'm saying

  I've known people on reality shows from

  real life okay because I love to

  name-drop no I really don't look so so

  you said they were two and the second

  one was on Project Runway yes the second

  problem Project Runway a co-worker of


  Alexander Pope was on Project Runway was

  it last season I believe it was last

  season anyway he did really great and he

  didn't get to the end but I think he

  should have gotten further than he did

  and I worked with him for a number of

  years at making costumes so he is very

  very talented and really a hilarious

  person who loves roller coasters what

  was the topic again

  reality shows oh my gosh the reality

  shows that you're either good or bad

  that you watch either for the goodness

  or their badness but I thought you

  wanted to separate them I do because I

  think they should be different but you

  are saying they shouldn't I mean why

  don't it sounds like we only have one or

  two good ones so why don't we just talk

  about the bad ones okay it's cool right

  up me do you have any other good ones no

  I mean I do you want to hear my short

  long list you you you could seem to be

  the one that is more prepared than me on

  this show but in reality I think you are

  just as unprepared you just have a

  written down version of your

  unpreparedness and mine is just like a

  slacker I didn't do anything version

  I'll tear you alright what do you got

  alright cuz you're gonna forget about

  half of these shows absolutely okay so

  we got Project Runway Top Chef

  Mythbusters on Starz LA Ink storage wars

  Cake Boss a GT so you thinking can dance

  Pickers Hell's Kitchen Ramsay's Kitchen

  Nightmares Dog Whisperer hoarders

  hoarders what not to wear beauty and the

  geek did you forget about that one I

  didn't you know today Preppers man

  versus food and how the state's got

  their shapes which we've been recently

  watching always like four episodes of it

  so you had on there you ask me about

  beauty in the geek

  beauty and the geek to me it was I don't

  think it has drone for quite some time I

  think it's the only brand new four or

  five seasons maybe Last Comic Standing

  was good I never saw that we should

  watch it a beauty and the geek I thought

  like I liked it in the sense that I am a

  geek and that a lot of the people on

  there I could relate to in in a lot of

  ways but I didn't think it was that

  great of a show like I we watched it we

  enjoyed it at the time but I really

  don't think it would hold up if you

  actually tried to watch it again not

  that reality shows ever do but like I

  think I think if the same show aired

  today we wouldn't even try watching it

  because I think we would just assume no

  I mean terrible reality shows aren't

  really rewatchable know what I'm saying

  like you know if they if the show was

  still running if it if it if it had

  started today

  we wouldn't even a chance mmm probably

  not no no I watched a lot of garbage

  probably if it was on Netflix we would

  probably try it right

  what about Undercover Boss it so just so

  painful we can talk about it though

  because it's hilarious he has a bad

  reality garbage Netflix show I think

  it's great because you don't put a lot

  of thought into it

  it's incredibly repetitive and doesn't

  tie in between episodes so you can jump

  in and watch any of the episodes and it

  doesn't really matter whether you watch

  them all in what order you watch them

  they're self-contained so you don't like

  watch a whole season to know what's

  going on so as a garbage show it is very

  very good and it is so very very bad

  well because that's the best thing it's

  so commonly bad like I love when they

  put on their disguises oh yeah like

  who's gonna recognize the CEO of some

  random company like Oh 1-800 limos who's

  the CEO of that nobody knows but they

  need to put on disguise because someone

  might recognize you and then the big

  time like the couple times that like

  almost happened they hype it up so much

  like oh my god his covers gonna be blown

  and then that's it and the whole things

  of math it's all gonna be over uh and

  then it's not really and they're like

  you just need to keep it quiet if you

  know I am yeah and that's it and like

  and they go to like five different

  locations in each episode anyway so it

  doesn't even matter like if one of the

  managers recognize you but yeah you're

  right like like I mean I I used to work

  at Staples and I was in college I have

  no idea who the CEO of Staples was while

  I was working there no clue I would not

  I wouldn't even know their name let

  alone how to recognize them I can't even

  tell you what age or gender they were I

  have no idea who'd like it could have

  been anybody walking in the door I would

  have no clue and before that I worked at

  bruger's bagels same deal would have no

  idea who the CEO of bruger's bagels yes

  can we just automatically cross this one

  off the list because I it's just bad no

  but it'sit's bad in a way that you want

  and you're watching garbage and so is

  this on your top for for what purpose

  well now we've moved on because what you

  only had one on your other list yeah I

  only have top chef on my on my good list

  they have lots of my bad list so you

  have no you have number one is Top Chef

  and number two three and four

  nothing so you rather watch nothing well

  one of the reality shows do i watch that

  are actually good very few really all

  the other ones that I enjoy are actually

  pretty bad okay so we're onto the bad

  right so and let me just one more thing

  on Undercover Boss the best the best

  thing about that show is how incredibly

  terrible the prizes at the end are what

  about that one guy when they're like

  he's so down on his luck he like needed

  I don't know it's kid needed to go to

  college there was like crazy stuff that

  you know the people who are on the show

  would benefit from like cash a bonus a

  trip anything and someone's like I'm

  donating money in your name to this

  charity and they're like yeah this

  worker who could really use the money

  themselves and their boss is like I'm

  gonna give like a tree in your name yeah

  that was so painful I felt so bad for

  those people that got like the shaft

  prizes it was or like the one not that

  charity is a shaft but I'm just saying

  that you know the only people we're

  working really hard and being really

  awesome at their job and kind of

  deserved a bonus cuz like one person

  they'd be like you're getting a thousand

  dollar bonus and the other person is

  like I planted a tree for you and it's

  yeah it's that's that's weak it is yeah

  it's just is unbalanced yeah and and the

  worst ones that the ones that are like

  we're gonna put you in leadership

  training at our company so it's like

  they're putting the person in one of

  their own corporate programs that it's

  like it's even its work so we're we're

  giving you a different kind of work to

  do for two weeks

  oh my god no that's that that show is

  the best because of how terrible it is

  it is not my number one worst show but

  it is really it is really quite

  unchanged I think I got to say my number

  one worship worst show will have to be

  hoarders I thought you'd say that it's

  so awful I can't even watch it it like I

  that's so bad it's so disturbing to me I

  can't I can't no disturbing i watch it

  because i can't fathom how people could

  live like that and it fascinates me that

  people can live like that and not see it

  yeah and so that's why it's like I don't

  know that's what it's like the creepy

  fascinating other that I feel like when

  I watch that show I'm like what is what

  is going through your mind you know like

  yeah sometimes I walk past a piece of

  paper on the floor and decide not to

  pick it up but I eventually pick it up

  maybe like well days later oh my god now

  it's time for you to go in the trash but

  that's as far as I go but yeah some of

  these some of these ones who it's it's

  hard to watch a couple of them I cannot

  watch animal hoarders because I feel

  very bad for the animals yep but you

  know a good show hoarders doesn't

  doesn't end without a couple dead cats

  so I cannot lie I don't know how you can

  endure that show I cannot watch that

  show it's now that I'm talking about it

  I'm pretty embarrassed

  yeah I'm pretty embarrassed that I watch

  that see to me I think I'm trying to

  think of like my number-one garbage show

  and why not - where's I watch we watch

  totally different garbage shows yeah I'm

  thinking it might be Pawn Stars Pawn

  Stars is really it's really like when

  they had like the old musketoons and

  stuff on that show the old guns because

  I don't hear about guns at all no a gun

  person at all not even not even a little

  bit but no I just I like all like the

  weird stuff they find I'm sure a lot of

  it is like set up and stage and

  everything you know I don't care won't

  care that any of that stage do you know

  a lot of people are like oh how do you

  like that this is staged like I watched

  storage wars that's so bad

  Oh Sarge why that's so good ah yeah it's

  great I love all the crazy stuff they

  find but I mean we did a little

  periscope for like two seconds and

  someone said you know was working for

  them and I hope they're listening hi so

  but I mean even if they plant stuff in

  there which yeah changes things a little

  bit I still really like the show yeah to

  me yeah so so Pawn Stars I think is very

  very good it is very entertaining I also

  really really like cut through a kitchen

  and cut through a kitchen is my kitchen

  how I don't know it's not on the list

  putting it on right now

  so it cut their kitchen to me I mean

  there's lots of bad cooking reality

  shows and cutthroat kitchen I think is

  actually pretty good like when it first

  started I thought all this this has all

  the makings of a bad one like shock is

  the worst chopped

  I can't watch because it's so

  frustratingly bad the judges are bad

  that's why it's because the judges on

  chopped are so fickle when it comes to

  what they're choosing and why they're

  choosing it and they're just like you

  would think they'd say this horrible

  things about one person another person

  completely leaves off half the

  ingredients from their dish and then a

  third person like makes something that

  just needed a little bit of salt and

  you're like oh man it has to be the guy

  that like left everything off his dish

  and then this part of it that he did

  make didn't really taste very good and

  then when they go to reveal the person

  that got chopped it's the dude who left

  off a little bit of salt like right and

  they'll say well you're we had to chop

  you please because your dish was green

  it's like it'll be like some random

  reason and you're like that's the

  problem at that show is like I think to

  enjoy these kind of these judging shows

  he's judging competition shows I think

  the audience has to feel like they can

  predict what's going to happen right

  before it happens so the audience has to

  be able to say oh based on what they

  just said I bet they're gonna eliminate

  that guy you know like the audience have

  to believe that it it makes sense to

  them and the version they're seeing

  makes sense and then with chopped the

  judges like they're there they make the

  craziest comments and they they cut

  somebody random and it just feels like

  it feels like why am I even watching

  this if there's like kind of rolling the

  dice and for all we know it could be a

  good judging panel that's just edited

  very badly when it's shown on TV but it

  doesn't seem that way it seems like you

  know either they have really a bad

  editors or they have really a bad judges

  and I think it's most likely they really

  about judges they just they just judges

  the willy-nilly they don't even think

  about it there's a one woman that she's

  just always angry or at least she always

  looks angry and just everyone was angry

  I just don't even look like they want to

  be there and they're like yeah I'll just

  judge your food and then they're like

  yeah you're chopped and it just I don't

  feel like that the people that win

  necessarily deserve it and I think that

  that's frustrating but with cutthroat


  they have hilarious hilarious what do

  they call them the judges no sabotages

  yeah it was we really liked Alton Brown

  so we find him fantastic we really like

  to show good eat good eats and and we

  saw him do a show live which was really

  fun so we really liked him as a host and

  then the judges they have on or often

  people that were on Top Chef which is

  excellent and also they seem their

  judging is much more competent and yeah

  the sabotages are so funny I love the

  tiny kitchen yeah they're just a

  constantly something really funny that

  is gonna mess people up and then yet

  people overcome and it's very very good

  yeah it's like like usually the people

  who got the most sabotages like it

  doesn't seem to affect who loses or not

  like it doesn't seem to have a very

  strong correlation of like if you get

  sabotage the most you will lose like

  there's not it doesn't seem like that is

  the case yeah my I definitely I love the

  ones where they have where they get like

  funny-looking tools like either like you

  know factional you're too late' of tin

  foil or whatever like so there's so many

  good sabotages there well when they tape

  things to their hands that they can't do

  it like tape is an oven mitt to your

  hand or whatever it's like your only

  source of heat is this like tea light

  it's so bad or like they just give you

  this garbage ingredient to replace this

  beautiful fresh ingredient with I

  remember what we watching that that 100

  year old egg that was on that was truck

  hopped but what they should do on

  cutthroat kitchen if they haven't done

  it is replace all if they're making like

  egg salad replace all your eggs with 100

  year old eggs but if anyone doesn't know

  what that is look that up we'll put it

  in our show notes which we do now we've

  shot the way we have shown oh I think

  you just signed us up for show notes so

  you'll be in charge of that we do a show

  notes because the first show you

  mentioned like one article so that's our


  they are not extensive they're just you

  know what they are yeah I would say

  among the cooking garbage reality shows

  I would say cut through kitchen is

  almost good enough to be on the good

  list I think it is

  was good enough to be on the good list I

  was and I think about putting it there

  under my project runway I don't that

  good it is very good you you with your

  top three you can't just like pick spots

  this is this is about the top four is

  this is about how many like in order if

  you don't have anything else to put

  between it it's automatically your

  thirds like that's just how it happens

  last show you didn't have a second like

  you just didn't you didn't know there

  was no number two for you know you had


  you had three and you had like six on

  four the only thing I don't like about

  cut their kitchen is the prizes again

  are usually end up being kammath ly

  small like you know they have their own

  fault the most they can they can win is

  $25,000 but I've never seen anybody even

  go above like what about 12 or so I

  can't I can't say for sure and usually

  usually like what we end up seeing is

  somebody will win the show and they'll

  win like maybe 3,000 bucks

  and it's like a half-hour isn't so bad

  for a competition I don't

  that seems unreasonably cheap for what

  you're comparing it to competitions that

  last month's I I guess it still seems

  like a little bit too too small I don't

  know anyway so what what else do you

  have on your list for either good or bad

  reality shows slash competition shows

  slash Buster's well we have to talk

  about a little I like I like tattoo

  shows yeah much Markos chagrin I do not

  have any tattoos marco also does not

  have any tattoos I know of I'm pretty

  sure I know now okay so so so yeah I

  really like tattoo shows and we've been

  recently watching one that was that's

  called um bad tattoos I think yeah and

  it's about a guy who walks around Vegas

  fixing people's tattoos and he's very

  good at it

  I mean Marco sat down and watched a

  couple with me and I think he kind of

  liked a little bit because it's very

  interesting how good they can cover up

  tattoos with other tattoos yeah I don't

  I don't like tattoos at all

  I it's not I don't like hate people with

  tattoos I just

  just don't do anything for me I just

  don't like they don't appeal to me at

  all and so I don't I can't look at the

  show and say oh that's a really awesome

  tattoo but what I can do is I can look

  at this show and I can say wow that was

  a really creative job and a really

  effective job at covering up that bad

  tattoo you know like that's what like

  any other tattoo show I wouldn't really

  enjoy you like tattoo makeover shows

  sure it's just like it's interesting

  it's like it's a design problem it's

  like how the heck do you cover that up

  and the guy is really good yeah you

  can't see like even when there's like

  crazy thick Fontan words they over them

  up I mean they have to come up with like

  tremendous tattoos but they do it and I

  also I love LA Ink that was one of my

  favorite reality shows which is Kat Von

  D's tattoo shop in LA and I love her

  show I think she's excellent and she's a

  fantastic artist if he's ever seen the

  show she can tattoo portraits on people

  that look real it's it's incredible she

  can also draw them so she is you know

  very very talented in many many ways and

  she just happens to be an incredible

  tattoo artist there's that I have

  nothing to say I've walked through and

  seen like five minutes of it and I can't

  get through it because that that seemed

  like a shift from the pit from the parts

  I've seen correct me if I'm wrong is

  that a show that's more about like the

  interpersonal relationships and drama

  and stuff it gets there but I watch it

  for the tattoos it's like I used to

  watch I to watch it for the tattoos

  because I like the art version I like

  read it I read the articles right I do I

  do read the articles like I watch it

  because I want to see it's like I want

  to see you know the finished product I

  want to see how it comes out because

  these people are really fantastic

  artists that just happen to be doing

  tattoos on people and I find it

  interesting what people decide to put on

  their body permanently and what their

  choices are yeah yeah so also I want to

  talk about to totally switch gears here

  Dog Whisperer that's interesting okay I

  guess that's a reality show yeah that

  makes sense it's wholly reality show and

  you know we watch Dog Whisperer a lot

  and we learned a lot

  Cesar who is the dog whisperer I want to

  say Cesar Chavez but that's not it Cesar

  Millan I know it's these are balloons

  yeah but you don't know what Cesar

  Chavez look like no nevermind anyway

  that Simpsons

  you're the worst okay right before we

  got hops we watched tons and tons of Dog

  Whisperer and when he was a puppy and we

  did almost everything that they said and

  he is an amazing dog now yeah and we've

  also we have we have done tricks like

  that or like training methods like that

  in small ways whenever we are around

  like you know our parents dogs or

  whatever and they work like instantly

  yeah it's it really is incredible how

  much Cesar is right about how dogs work

  and I know that there's there's a lot of

  controversy around his methods from some

  people and I don't have look too deeply

  into those into the controversy because

  all we know is that the parts that we do

  work really well well he's dealing with

  a lot of the times dogs that are

  problems or already like pretty bad and

  he needs to you know rehabilitate the

  dog so it's better and then train people

  that's there's a little logo line and to

  teach them how to communicate with dogs

  properly so that the dog understands

  what the human wants the dog to do and

  if you start off fresh with the puppy or

  a dog that's only slightly misbehaving

  and not like aggressively biting people

  you can take his methods and it really

  works like just simply taking your dog

  for a walk appropriately like not

  letting the dog pull you on a walk but

  farce forcing the dog to walk with you

  it just changes everything it doesn't

  matter what kind of leash you have on

  the way that it really doesn't like it

  just it matters how you are deciding to

  walk with your dog this is that's very

  hard for me to not say long island walk

  with your dog into the Long Island

  corner there yeah anyway so little

  things like that small training bits

  like making the dog wait before going

  through doorways sit and make eye

  contact before giving them food things

  like that just really very quickly make


  very well-behaved dog yeah it's really

  we have had such great luck with those

  methods and part of it you know

  obviously some dogs are easier to train

  than others because of their

  personalities and our dog is also just

  really easy because he's naturally very

  like a rabid and submissive and it's a

  natural rug so what's next on your list

  of good or bad reality we're still going

  are we done I don't know well do you

  have you now you're trying to get all up

  on my list you didn't want anything to

  do with my list

  well we watched so much garbage I have a

  GT on here but we didn't we haven't at

  which stands where America's Got Talent

  which we started watching because Howard

  Stern's on it where Howard fans yeah I

  really don't see us watching it after he

  leaves which is presumably after this

  season no I wouldn't either I have Cake

  Boss on here okay seemed like it was

  pretty good actually like as these shows

  go there's much more about like the

  family brush painting with each other

  and that gets really old fast I mean I

  used to love watching America's Next Top

  Model until it became the Tara banks

  look at me show and it also became about

  all of the models complaining to each

  other in the house pretty much the whole

  time because I was watching that show

  again for the photographs like I wanted

  to see the photos that they got out of

  people and you know how they look before

  before they're all like done up and then

  they're you know the artistic process

  that's what I found the show interesting

  for and then it just became total

  garbage fight fest so I quit watching

  that let's talk about man vs. food

  that's a pretty good one yeah I mean you

  you're more into it than I am because

  you just love crazy stuff I mean how do

  you rank that between your other because

  you had you seem like you have a lot of

  shows that are about the same rank yeah

  I'm pulling to you here I have like a

  whole bunch my number six shows and I

  have nothing three or four but I really

  like my own versus food because I like

  well I don't necessarily want like

  watching competitive eating but I do

  like when he goes around to the

  different restaurants all over the

  country and talked about like what their

  best thing is

  it just looks so delicious yeah like

  like the that show usually has a two

  segments that the first one is like I'm

  just going to go eat something that's

  really famous and the second half is

  like now I'm gonna go eat like the big

  challenge food and I usually I like the

  first half better most of the time

  because usually the first half is the

  part that's more like food tourism and

  the second half is more like let's see

  if you can finish this ridiculously

  seemingly impossible task of eating this

  pile of garbage well see if you just

  want food tourism you could always do

  guy Furies diners drive-ins and dives

  but I find I think his name is Adam

  actually yeah the guy's name is Adam who

  does members food man vs. food I find

  him more personable and I just I had the

  places he goes they're pretty neat I'm

  pretty sure there's been plenty of

  overlap between the two but I like that

  the show switches it up and then they

  have like this weird usually like

  strange competitive eating aspect to it

  at the end it's pretty gross when he

  vomits especially after having

  milkshakes he can't keep down those

  milkshakes I don't blame him

  trying to drink like 15 milkshakes and

  you know a half hours really unhealthy

  but yeah I like it needs very spicy

  foods very large foods seems to me like

  the the like stuff like the milkshake

  thing like that that is not interesting

  to me like I even as a viewer like that

  that doesn't seem like it's that

  interesting of a challenge to me like

  the best man vs. food challenges are the

  ones that are not just like here's a

  normal thing eat ten of them but instead

  it's like here's like a tremendous

  version of a normal thing or here's a

  really weird combination of things or

  here's like a really extreme version

  like some crazy hot pepper or something

  like you know that I think is more

  interesting than yours 15 milkshakes

  it's not like that that's true so it

  seems like we have found a topic that

  neither of us have strong opinions on

  because you know so it seems like with

  garbey shows like there is no ranking

  for garbage you know I think that

  there's just one big pool of garbage but

  yeah I mean it's just it's hard to rank

  things because the longer they last the

  worse they get in terms of seasons

  usually because they start you know

  stretching you know and reaching for

  straws is that the phrase I don't know

  grasping at straws sure she's reaching

  for the stars they start reaching for

  the stars yeah okay

  and then it's just it all falls apart

  and it's not very good and even when

  they switch the people if they try and

  do that then it's jarring it's just not

  good and then a lot of it's very

  repetitive or it's sad or it's you know

  like you know the addiction shows like I

  can't watch any of those they're just

  too depressing yeah yeah I liked what

  not to wear a lot but then that gets a

  repetitive - because they always put

  everyone in the same outfit they're like

  well we're gonna try and style this for

  you but it totally looks like the same

  dress that they put the other girl in

  that was a completely different person

  they've changed the color Holmes

  Inspection home done Holmes will see

  novel see Holmes on a home they don't

  actually enjoy that much

  we tried watching a few of them they

  aren't that good that's your home's

  inspection the same guy different

  different kind of show it makes you

  spanic about your house it may if you

  own a home it's like oh my god what are

  all the things there fuck with my house

  right this instant

  that is leaking creating mold and my

  walls are gonna fall down yeah you got

  to watch Homes inspection it's on

  Netflix at least at the time we were

  recording it I'm pretty sure it's still

  there and it there's only been a handful

  of season that that company unless yeah

  yeah homes inspection and it is oh my

  god it is so scary cuz like the guy Mike

  Holmes Mike on yeah he's great like he's

  an actor yeah Canadian of course

  although all the nicest people are

  Canadian so so he's great and he he

  basically goes and homes on homes I

  think was was less compelling because it

  was like we're gonna go help these

  people who were rich enough to renovate

  their house and they just got a crappy

  job done we're gonna finish it whereas

  like homes inspection is a lot more kind

  of morally justifiable or or more

  there's more empathy there where home

  inspection is like here are some people

  who got screwed on the house they bought

  and and they usually oftentimes as

  people who really couldn't afford to fix

  it yes or to fix it right at least you

  know and like that that I think is a

  more interesting emotionally it's more

  interesting show

  I don't think you could say that these

  people who were the regular homes on

  homes that I mean come on you save up

  money to do a home renovation because

  you want to do it you specifically like

  pick something out you're trying to get

  something fixed in your house it you can

  not have a you know you could have a lot

  of money or you could have very little

  money regardless of it was someone saved

  up to do this to their home and then it

  got done wrong and it was and they don't

  have enough money to do it again that's

  the problem with the ones that the

  contractors failed okay that's true I'll

  give you that that's fair I mean come on

  that's really crappy if like you know

  your contractor comes you take time you

  hire them they do the work and then they

  end up not doing it right and you have

  no repercussion to like find them if

  they ditch you if they leave a job

  half-done a lot of them were like jobs

  that were just never finished they just

  left you know like and then the people

  are like hung up for the money that they

  already gave them and they can't afford

  to have someone else in because they

  already spent half their money getting

  the first job done that didn't work out

  okay that's fair I'll give you that yeah

  but I still think that homes inspections

  inspection is a better show it's more

  relatable it's more like because you

  know everyone who buys a house or even

  lives in a rental house everyone who

  lives anywhere everyone who buys a house

  can relate to the problems that homes

  inspection uncovers whereas the problems

  at homes on homes addresses it's a it's

  a much smaller narrower audience if

  people who can relate to that because if

  that's the only people who have had

  renovation done whereas homes inspection

  is all homeowners that who could look at

  this show and not only enjoy it and feel

  empathy for the people but also like it

  freaks them out and it interests them to

  see all the different ways that these

  houses are terrible and then of course

  that prompts you to look at your own

  house and to see all the ways that your

  own house is terrible in all the ways

  they're discussing on the show oh yes

  it's really great yeah yeah it's awesome

  yeah yeah roof ventilation very

  important very important the mold will

  come alright so this episode of top four

  our top four lists are Top Chef

  from me project one runway number two

  from mark oh nothing

  number three nothing for either of us

  right number four

  giant pool of garbage of cars with I

  think cut through a kitchen bobbing at

  the top of that

  yeah cutthroat kitchen maybe that's our

  number three well that's what I said if

  it's if you don't have something in a

  slot and there's one that's over the

  other ones it's your number three like

  you you gotta put it in there I think we

  can leave gaps so here's a question

  think you are think that's that's why so

  to close this out

  let's talk critically about our topics

  about Top Chef and Project Runway now do

  you is there anything I don't watch

  Project Runway really so so I will

  address this only to you then instead of

  you know officer myself or anyone else

  here so I'll dress is only to you is

  there something about Project Runway

  that you think is declining because it

  has been running a while you said

  earlier shows that run a while have

  things that are declining is there

  something in Project Runway that you

  think is getting worse over time well

  they have new judges which is fine I

  think that they're good judges so it's

  pretty it's fine they are getting a

  little bit more into the drama of things

  and I guess that you know having it be

  on so long it might be getting a little

  long in the tooth is that the right

  thing to say I don't know I think so

  that sounds good

  so but in general I think it's standing

  up because everyone kind of wants to see

  it's fun to watch people make the things

  that they make on Project Runway you

  know because they the challenges that

  they have are usually very creative

  especially when they use an

  unconventional materials challenge or

  they do this kind of challenge or you

  know they have to get fabric from this

  place or they have to work within this

  restriction that they put on them for a

  challenge and that's very interesting to

  see how different people kind of adapt

  to that they had a moment in their

  reality in their show one of the years

  they did this teams thing they tried

  that out and that didn't work out so

  they reverted back the neck

  year and I think they even had a couple

  people on who were on the teams thing

  back because it was such a crappy year

  to be on

  I think the sponsorship stuff is getting

  a little bad on Project Runway you know

  they're really kind of hounding the

  Lexus sponsorship and cramming it down

  your throat and being like this is the

  Lexus challenge or this is the yoke play

  challenge it's like how what does that

  have to do with Project Runway is

  running around some boardwalk trying to

  sell yogurt to people and get them to

  say the words that make them think of

  the yogurt and so then you have to use

  those words as your inspiration for your

  garment like the steps to that in order

  to get back to fashion did that take to

  connect yogurt to fashion it was

  horrible I don't know why they're doing

  that kind of stuff I think that that we

  know why you're doing it oh yeah well we

  know why but I'm saying it's such a good

  show they don't really need to I feel

  like they don't need to do that because

  they are a very good reality show

  they're not just like one of these

  one-off garbage pile shows but I mean in

  general I'll keep watching because I

  really like seeing again it's the it's

  the artistic creative results that I

  like to watch I love the very final part

  of this episode is when they're showing

  what came down the runway versus what

  they had to work with and I I find the

  creative creativity and the people the

  best part that's why I like Top Chef

  it's their creativity and their food

  that's why I like Project Runway and I

  like quarters no no well I like to see a

  clean house ish even though we know it's

  probably not going to stay that way but

  that's why I tried to like top model but

  that fell through for me and that's why

  I like Cake Boss because you get to see

  all the cakes that they make creatively

  after you know what someone ordered

  versus how they come up with it and how

  they build it and it's that part's I

  love the result the creative result you

  know in a in a reality show so now I'm

  gonna turn the question that I just

  asked you about Project Runway on to

  both of us for Top Chef Top Chef we both

  agree our number one pick right yeah

  definitely so what do you

  think about Top Chef if anything what do

  you think is is getting worse over time

  see to me I can point to definitely some

  of the corporate tie-ins while it

  doesn't sound like it's as bad as the

  Project Runway ones some of them are

  pretty painful and forced yeah yeah when

  they're like let's use the Reynolds Wrap

  challenge right right and you have to

  it's like and let's say we have to pile

  every one into this new Toyota and we're

  gonna talk about how spacious it is wow

  I can't believe no I hate them drive

  themselves to go shopping like well but

  what I mind is is when they make the

  contestants talk about how nice the car

  is yes it's so obviously forced and and

  you know they're feeding them line so

  obviously Showtime with watching them do

  like the automatic parking or something

  yeah like or like oh let's watch this

  trunk open wow that opens so smooth like

  they're wasting time it's like I want to

  the show I want you to spend time on

  showing me why you're like doing the

  thing you're doing and how you're

  creating it and what your thoughts are

  you know all the good parts of the show

  right it's like we're buying the show on

  iTunes so it's commercial free we don't

  want to see a Toyota commercial in the

  middle maybe that's why they're doing

  because they know so many people now are

  buying these kind of shows like

  commercial free and it's that's possible

  honestly I doubt that many people buy

  them on iTunes but that's that's just a

  guess but so I do think that that Top

  Chef has that problem of a lot of those

  corporate sponsorships are really forced

  and and and not only do they take up

  time but I think some of them actually

  make this show worse like like when they

  mess with the challenges and then

  another another big thing is when they

  have gimmick judges at the challenges so

  one example from from a recent season

  was when they had pee-wee Herman on and

  and and I like like I was a huge pee-wee

  Herman fan as a kid I loved pee-wee

  Herman why he's real you know well but

  they didn't have Paul Reubens on they

  had pee-wee Herman the character yeah

  you rode a bike in and everything Paul

  Reubens is like 60 so it was kind of

  weird but that's right he don't have

  that creepy makeup on and everything -

  yeah and and so like as much as I love


  Herman as a kid that just was weird it

  didn't fit it felt like both it felt

  like both Paul Reubens / pee-wee Herman

  and Top Chef were selling out to each

  other like they were both sellouts it

  made me think less of both of them that

  that happened and they'll and they'll

  have you know different like you know

  musicians and actors on sometimes two

  and we're like well I they like green

  things I really like eggs and Billy with

  peewee Herman it was like what do you

  make for a fictional character and then

  how does a fictional character judge

  things it was just weird yeah they'll

  have stuff like that where it's like you

  know some some of the gimmick challenges

  are a little weird and and sometimes

  they'll have them and this this is

  arguable whether this is a problem

  sometimes they'll have elimination

  decisions based on really kind of wacky

  challenges that you kind of think like

  that was kind of unfair to eliminate

  someone for that you know but that's

  less of a problem that the the tie-ins

  with the celebrities and the product

  endorsements are are I think the biggest

  challenge but for the most part you know

  I think Top Chef really holds up that

  the core of the show the judging seems

  like it's solid it seems like you know

  we've never had a serious problem with

  the top chef judging as viewers like we

  and we've watched every season so the

  the judging is solid it seems like the

  the the competition the core of it most

  of it is solid and the editing and

  everything still seems good it doesn't

  seem like it's getting too trashy or to

  into the drama or anything like that it

  seems like overall it's still very solid

  there's these few little cracks in the

  foundation that get me a little worried

  about it yeah I agree and Project Runway

  is very similar that yeah

  all right I think that's it hey make it

  work wait I want to add a segment to our

  show called I have made a huge mistake

  my huge mistake is in relation to our

  video game episode and thinking about it

  a little bit more because we recorded

  that episode kind of we were

  chit-chatting on the couch as couples do

  and talking about stuff and things that

  we like and you know and so we decided

  to jump

  Mike as you know regular couples do and

  record a podcast and everyone does that

  for the most part I'm pretty solid with

  what I've chose but I think my number

  four was not well thought out I really

  like you know Dead Rising I think it's a

  good game but but I don't really think

  it deserves my four spot and my huge

  mistake I think I need to put in there I

  think I need to put journey I think I

  need to put journey on Syracuse or this

  is not Syracuse of pressure I made this

  decision after no before before I made

  this decision before he was bugging me

  on slack okay

  but the reason I decided to put journey

  on is because I played it again would be

  it was my third time now playing journey

  and normally I don't really care for

  games that have kind of a Japanese

  animation tone to it I just that art

  style isn't appealing to me and so I

  can't usually get very into games like

  that this game does have a little bit of

  that especially you know with the carpet

  dogs dragony creatures that are in this

  game but it is way more stylized than

  that and playing through it again and

  the magic of it I think I really do need

  to have it as my top four my number 4

  slot because it's so different I was

  writing it off because I was thinking it

  wasn't as joyful replaying it as I

  thought but since we recorded I had to

  replate it again and it really deserves

  a spot because it is unlike any other

  game and its really very it's a very

  special game and it deserves at least

  number four so I put that out there and

  I'm not ever there has been so much talk

  about journey if you want to know more

  about journey the incomparable has

  talked about journey we John siracusa

  and I talked about journey on ATP one of

  the episodes we'll put that in the show

  notes along with the incomparable

  episode and Mike on Mike and Federico

  talked about Israel on virtual yes so

  there's been lots of journey talk and

  you know a little bit of hearing your

  friends talk about journey kind of makes

  you love it a little bit more because as

  you hear people getting excited about

  playing it for the first time you get

  really it it because you want to know

  about someone else's first time and then

  that's exciting and I think that that

  aspect of it the camaraderie the joy the

  the delight the the magic that that

  journey has really elevates it up beyond

  what I would I originally you know one

  off thinking about I was thinking too

  much about the fun and the instant

  thrill and the excitement and the

  adrenaline of a lot of the other games

  that I've that I've chose and I wasn't

  thinking about the small independent

  games that I have played and so I think

  journey journey absolutely deserves a

  spot so I'm sorry journey I made a huge

  mistake but I hope I'm making it up for

  you now can I stop now yeah so you want

  to go watch something stupid