Hello Internet

◼   ► let's descend into prayer for this

◼   ► podcast dear podcast gods please forgive

◼   ► the sins we've committed over the last

◼   ► half-hour and let this episode actually

◼   ► make it to air amen amen

◼   ► it seems Brady that Trafalgar Square is

◼   ► doubling down on their policy of no fun

◼   ► big time I was there the other day

◼   ► mm-hmm and you know how you're not

◼   ► allowed on the lines and you said there

◼   ► was like some guard right well now the

◼   ► whole lion area at the bottom of

◼   ► Nelson's column had like this like black

◼   ► and yellow crime scene esque tape around

◼   ► it so you couldn't even get to within

◼   ► touching distance of the Lions yet alone

◼   ► climb on them it was like all

◼   ► quarantined there was no water in the

◼   ► fountains so there was no fun to be had

◼   ► in the fountains seriously it was crazy

◼   ► it was the least fun place in all of the

◼   ► UK except when you talked about

◼   ► Trafalgar Square and you were dissing it

◼   ► and you were quite right to be dissing

◼   ► it you did leave out Nelson's column

◼   ► itself which i think is one of the great

◼   ► sites of London and that is still a

◼   ► reason to go to Trafalgar Square and I

◼   ► do still love that I guess but it

◼   ► doesn't help that Nelson's column is now

◼   ► in the center of this no fun zone

◼   ► yeah and on one side you have Trafalgar

◼   ► Square which used to be fun and on the

◼   ► other side you just have a massive

◼   ► traffic intersection yeah it needs a

◼   ► reason to be a fun place to go but you

◼   ► sent me this photograph of the square

◼   ► crime scene off yeah it is hard to

◼   ► express how enraged that made me because

◼   ► the thing I was aware of when I was

◼   ► there the first time and saw those signs

◼   ► about don't climb on the Lions the thing

◼   ► that a bunch of people were doing which

◼   ► the guard seemed totally okay on is

◼   ► there's two positions to photograph

◼   ► yourself with the Lions at Trafalgar

◼   ► Square

◼   ► there is the risky one for the

◼   ► adventurous types which is to climb up

◼   ► on to the actual back of the lion and

◼   ► get a photograph there yeah but lots of

◼   ► families take a kind of classic

◼   ► Trafalgar Square photo which is a dad

◼   ► will raise up their kids onto the paws

◼   ► of the lion so like there's this

◼   ► relatively low area between

◼   ► the two pause of each of the Lions and

◼   ► every family loves to pack their kids in

◼   ► between the paws and take photographs of

◼   ► that it's a super cute photo right it's

◼   ► great and it seemed like that was okay

◼   ► with the guards they weren't stopping

◼   ► anybody from doing that it was just

◼   ► going on the backs of the Lions but now

◼   ► like you said they've put this tape

◼   ► around the whole thing so that you can't

◼   ► touch the Lions you certainly can't put

◼   ► people between the paws of the Lions

◼   ► it's unbelievable again it makes me so

◼   ► angry I could just I don't know it well

◼   ► before you go off on one there are two

◼   ► possible explanations for this that have

◼   ► come to mind mm-hmm the first and the

◼   ► one that I hope is true but is by far

◼   ► the least likely is that in a hallow

◼   ► internet wikipedia style lockdown moment

◼   ► the sheer act of us talking about a

◼   ► topic has caused such nuisance making by

◼   ► tims that the authorities have had no

◼   ► choice but to essentially lock down the

◼   ► Lions which would amuse me no end but

◼   ► clearly is not the case the second and

◼   ► more likely scenario is that some kind

◼   ► of work is going on some kind of

◼   ► preparation maybe they were having to do

◼   ► something to to concrete up above and

◼   ► they didn't want things falling down

◼   ► onto people from Lord Nelson or they

◼   ► were prepping something I mean the fact

◼   ► the fountains are empty as well tells me

◼   ► that maybe they're doing though you know

◼   ► once or twice a year

◼   ► spring clean so I think the most likely

◼   ► scenario is that this was a temporary

◼   ► measure but nevertheless it would be fun

◼   ► if it was it was like a Wikipedia style

◼   ► page lock there and that would cause

◼   ► again we would never promote Wikipedia

◼   ► vandalism that's the wrong thing to do

◼   ► and of course we never promote social

◼   ► disobedience on this podcast that would

◼   ► be wrong to do to promote people to go

◼   ► and sit on the backs of the Lions to

◼   ► retweet people doing that kind of thing

◼   ► that would be wrong on many levels but

◼   ► neither of us would ever do such a thing

◼   ► and as we've said that the perfect storm

◼   ► of the two is to go into the Wikipedia

◼   ► page for Trafalgar Square and fill it

◼   ► with photos of a city on the line yeah

◼   ► we would never encourage that but I'm

◼   ► always suspicious about this because my

◼   ► personal experience with

◼   ► bureaucracies and this kind of structure

◼   ► is there's like a crank shift that only

◼   ► turns in one direction and the direction

◼   ► that it turns is more regulations more

◼   ► rules and less fun and that it's

◼   ► essentially impossible to turn that back

◼   ► in the other direction and so yeah even

◼   ► if this is for building works let's say

◼   ► let's say is the best case scenario that

◼   ► go we just want to polish up the liens

◼   ► right and I can still imagine them

◼   ► thinking after a little bit like hey you

◼   ► know what this square is way easier to

◼   ► manage

◼   ► once we wall off the whole central

◼   ► column like now we don't have to worry

◼   ► about anything and then some lawyer

◼   ► would say hey you know what now you

◼   ► don't have to worry about people

◼   ► climbing up on Nelson's column not even

◼   ► on the liens there's just like a

◼   ► stair-step thing that you can climb up

◼   ► on why don't we just leave it up it's

◼   ► already been up for a couple of weeks

◼   ► and everything's been fine so that

◼   ► that's my fear it's like I can just feel

◼   ► the machinery of desaturating the world

◼   ► turning another tick yeah

◼   ► that's my worry my favorite example of

◼   ► fun being taken away because of safety

◼   ► won't mean a tremendous amount to you

◼   ► because you have no idea how the game of

◼   ► Australian rules football works but you

◼   ► know it's like an oblong like egg-shaped

◼   ► bowl that people kick and catch and do

◼   ► things like that with and it was a great

◼   ► tradition at Australian rules football

◼   ► games that at the end of the game when

◼   ► the final siren went and after the

◼   ► players had left the field they would

◼   ► sound the siren again about five or ten

◼   ► minutes later and everyone could run out

◼   ► onto the field with the balls they'd

◼   ► brought along themselves and like just

◼   ► to run around on the field and kick the

◼   ► ball and you could like try and kick for

◼   ► the goals and pretend to be a hero and

◼   ► kick the ball through the goals that

◼   ► your heroes had just been doing wow that

◼   ► sounds great it was great fun and you'd

◼   ► have two or three thousand people all

◼   ► over the field each having their own

◼   ► little games kicking it back and forward

◼   ► the probability of walking off that

◼   ► field without getting hit in the face by

◼   ► a football it was virtually zero of

◼   ► course no guarantee that at least once

◼   ► you would get hit by a ball you didn't

◼   ► see coming because it was just like a

◼   ► frenzy of balls in the air

◼   ► but it was so much fun you know you'd

◼   ► line up the girls and try and kick a

◼   ► goal from an angle you just saw your

◼   ► heroes doing it and then eventually so

◼   ► many people were complaining about

◼   ► getting hurt by getting hit by balls in

◼   ► the head or like you know twisting their

◼   ► ankle that eventually they banned it and

◼   ► like it went away and it was one of the

◼   ► great quaint traditions of Australian

◼   ► sport that all the kids were allowed to

◼   ► do this after a big professional game of

◼   ► sport but gone now gone tour the

◼   ► professionalism and health and safety

◼   ► gone mad I tell you

◼   ► it's not even health and safety gone mad

◼   ► it's there's a certain kind of I think

◼   ► undue weight that boredom and

◼   ► seriousness and safety always have in

◼   ► conversations because it ends up being

◼   ► really hard to argue for the intangible

◼   ► values like fun over the tangible thing

◼   ► like someone could hurt themselves no

◼   ► matter how small the probability of

◼   ► someone could hurt themselves or a thing

◼   ► could be dangerous is it's like I feel

◼   ► like any possibility of that in all

◼   ► conversations in organizations around

◼   ► anything like it it's always biased

◼   ► toward this direction that's why I find

◼   ► it really frustrating you know now it's

◼   ► a long time ago but I was always hugely

◼   ► frustrated when I was a teacher to

◼   ► discover how many of the things that I

◼   ► thought were awesome cool fun things

◼   ► that my teachers had done when I was a

◼   ► kid in the science lab were totally off

◼   ► limits Oh like we can't do any of that

◼   ► like are you crazy you can't have a kid

◼   ► touch a Van de Graaff generator what if

◼   ► they have a heart condition we don't

◼   ► know about it's like has this ever

◼   ► happened in the history of ever that a

◼   ► kids died from a heart attack from

◼   ► touching a Van de Graaff generator and

◼   ► they're like it could happen it's the

◼   ► case of course it could happen but like

◼   ► how we have to weigh these things

◼   ► they're like mmm no it could happen

◼   ► we're not gonna do that like only things

◼   ► that are totally safe oh my god it

◼   ► really bothers me I think that's why the

◼   ► Trafalgar Square thing gets right at the

◼   ► heart of me just to top it off I think

◼   ► this is the funniest thing I have seen

◼   ► which is related to Trafalgar Square

◼   ► being the no fun zone just mere hours

◼   ► ago on the hello internet subreddit

◼   ► someone posted a video of themselves in

◼   ► Trafalgar Square a couple of years ago

◼   ► doing some juggling and the guards at

◼   ► Trafalgar Square come over and tell him

◼   ► the juggling

◼   ► not allowed in Trafalgar Square it looks

◼   ► like this guy was putting together one

◼   ► of those videos where he's doing

◼   ► juggling in various spots all over the

◼   ► world he says in the description that

◼   ► like he'd traveled to all of these

◼   ► various places and there was only one

◼   ► spot in the whole world where they told

◼   ► him

◼   ► oh sorry you're not allowed to juggle

◼   ► and that was Trafalgar Square yeah I

◼   ► mean to be fair that is also probably

◼   ► one of the prime spot where like you

◼   ► know professional jugglers try and bust

◼   ► for twenty minutes and make a bit of

◼   ► money if there was one place where I

◼   ► thought you would get cracked down on

◼   ► for juggling it actually would be

◼   ► Trafalgar Square

◼   ► that's like busker central isn't it and

◼   ► they're like very fine-tuned to people

◼   ► doing unauthorized busking they're

◼   ► busking I can totally understand

◼   ► well juggling is a busker classic as

◼   ► well it's not busking if you don't have

◼   ► a like a sad poppers hat in front of you

◼   ► with some coins that you placed inside

◼   ► of it to get the thing going they

◼   ► clearly thought that's what he was

◼   ► starting to do I need to watch the video

◼   ► I don't get me wrong I like a good

◼   ► juggle do you like a good juggle I'm a

◼   ► very good juggler oh yeah

◼   ► yeah how many balls can you juggle the

◼   ► ones Brady well I'm not very good at

◼   ► four but I'm very good at three and I

◼   ► can do like behind my back and tricks

◼   ► and under my legs and stuff well I look

◼   ► forward to the brady juggling roadshow

◼   ► i can't believe you haven't been

◼   ► subjected to it yet to be honest you

◼   ► know what I'm surprised I haven't been

◼   ► subjected to it yet either but I have a

◼   ► feeling like the next time we see each

◼   ► other in person there's gonna be some

◼   ► juggling if there's like middle kids

◼   ► that are bored sometimes my wife will

◼   ► say just do a bit of juggling for them

◼   ► just to cheer them up and I'd like it's

◼   ► them all excited to say that feels very

◼   ► uncle Brady do you pull coins from

◼   ► behind their ears as well do you do that

◼   ► do you take their noses now I'm a bit

◼   ► more like edgy than that I tell you what

◼   ► a couple more things though coming back

◼   ► to the Lions hmm because I was reading

◼   ► about why they banned people going on

◼   ► the Lions and I read quite a bit about

◼   ► this and how they were like structural

◼   ► problems they did like surveys of the

◼   ► Lions and found that people were

◼   ► starting to wear them away and stuff of

◼   ► course yeah yeah but like fix them then

◼   ► because this is part of the experience

◼   ► it's like saying we're gonna ban people

◼   ► from throwing coins into the Trevi

◼   ► Fountain because occasionally coins hit

◼   ► the stonework and cause little chips

◼   ► right well yeah and the Trevi Fountain

◼   ► is old and famous and important and

◼   ► shouldn't be chipped but it's way more

◼   ► important that you're there to throw

◼   ► coins into it so this kind of damage and

◼   ► wear and tear

◼   ► is part of the story of the lines so if

◼   ► they get worn away and you've got to

◼   ► give one of them you know a bit of back

◼   ► surgery or reinforce one or do some work

◼   ► on them okay do the work but you've got

◼   ► to take the hit you know I'm with you

◼   ► 100% and I think this is another example

◼   ► of where there's an easy argument to

◼   ► make which like with the pigeons as well

◼   ► it's like you can put a number on how

◼   ► much damage does pigeon poo cause in

◼   ► Trafalgar Square every year in terms of

◼   ► dollars right you can say like it costs

◼   ► us X amount to clean this thing every

◼   ► year you can also say oh the Lions if we

◼   ► need to strengthen up the backs every

◼   ► decade it's gonna cost us X amount and

◼   ► like that is a real clear bureaucratic

◼   ► argument but what it just feel like is

◼   ► the intangible thing on the other side

◼   ► is but you know this is why people come

◼   ► here if you have to have touristy

◼   ► interesting things for people to do and

◼   ► if you continually crank this dial of

◼   ► having more and more of them more and

◼   ► more off limits like what is the point

◼   ► of all of this it's like yes I'm sure it

◼   ► costs a lot of money to clean up all the

◼   ► pigeon poo in Trafalgar Square but

◼   ► people come from the world over to see

◼   ► the pigeons and to go on the backs of

◼   ► the Lions and surely hundreds of

◼   ► thousands of tourists a year pay through

◼   ► tax revenue and buying stuff and

◼   ► supporting the local economy like they

◼   ► pay for that upkeep like there's no way

◼   ► that it doesn't but I feel like somehow

◼   ► the preservationist side and the cost

◼   ► side of the argument is just the de

◼   ► facto winner and it's it's like

◼   ► impossible to try to be on the side of

◼   ► these intangible things and I feel like

◼   ► I got again I'm totally with you on this

◼   ► it's like hey look guess what these

◼   ► lions being outside wears them away

◼   ► everything erodes over time you're going

◼   ► to have to update them anyway

◼   ► why not update them more frequently and

◼   ► also let people enjoy them and we could

◼   ► just put the whole thing inside a

◼   ► gigantic plastic box right and there's I

◼   ► go well there's also sun damage getting

◼   ► through that box so we can put it in a

◼   ► gigantic opaque box right all around

◼   ► your vulgar square and nobody is allowed

◼   ► in is like is that what you want now

◼   ► it'll last a really long time right but

◼   ► nobody gets to appreciate it like that

◼   ► feels like the logical conclusion of

◼   ► where

◼   ► sends up well that wouldn't be good with

◼   ► a big black box around Trafalgar Square

◼   ► everybody wants that nobody wants that

◼   ► except someone going like well you know

◼   ► it would save us a lot of money every

◼   ► year on meeting its cost like yeah I'm

◼   ► sure it would I'm sure it goddamn would

◼   ► it's fine but like the last thing I just

◼   ► want to mention about this is the

◼   ► juggling guy reminded me of something

◼   ► that I haven't thought about in years

◼   ► but as soon as I saw his video I was

◼   ► like oh yeah I forgot about this event

◼   ► so this is something like maybe 7 years

◼   ► ago now my wife and I thought that we

◼   ► might be leaving London permanently we

◼   ► weren't sure this is the time of my life

◼   ► where I sort of ended up living in

◼   ► Hawaii for a little bit but we were

◼   ► thinking there's a good possibility that

◼   ► we're leaving London and we won't come

◼   ► back obviously that didn't happen but we

◼   ► thought that at the time and now the

◼   ► place where my wife and I met each other

◼   ► in person for the first time was

◼   ► Trafalgar Square if you are standing at

◼   ► the National Gallery and you are looking

◼   ► toward Nelson's column we actually met

◼   ► right beneath the paws of one of those

◼   ► lions and it'd be the lion on the left

◼   ► hand side that is where we met for the

◼   ► first time and so when we were leaving

◼   ► London we thought you know what might be

◼   ► nice is let's take some really nice

◼   ► photographs of ourselves in Trafalgar

◼   ► Square as just like a little memory and

◼   ► momento of here's a city that we really

◼   ► like and here's the place that we met so

◼   ► my wife and I we got dressed up all nice

◼   ► and fancy my wife had a bunch of very

◼   ► high-end photography gear and we got up

◼   ► super early in the morning and we went

◼   ► out to Trafalgar Square and we thought

◼   ► okay we're gonna take some photographs

◼   ► of ourselves at sunrise right like we

◼   ► get there there is nobody in Trafalgar

◼   ► Square the place is totally empty it's

◼   ► just my wife and I and she sets up her

◼   ► camera on the tripod so that we can take

◼   ► some pictures of us in various locations

◼   ► and we're there for mere minutes before

◼   ► out of nowhere a guard comes along and

◼   ► tells us that we're not allowed to be

◼   ► taking these pictures in Trafalgar

◼   ► Square it's like are you serious man

◼   ► like is this is this something that's

◼   ► really happening right now he goes yeah

◼   ► well you're not allowed to do commercial

◼   ► photography like okay but we're taking

◼   ► pictures of ourselves

◼   ► for us lives like this isn't commercial

◼   ► photography look what are you talking

◼   ► about there goes uh well you have a

◼   ► tripod with that camera so it must be

◼   ► commercial photography there's no

◼   ► tripods allowed in Trafalgar Square for

◼   ► taking photographs it's one of these

◼   ► things where it's just so crazy making

◼   ► you feel like you're in this bizarro

◼   ► moment of weight like presumably you

◼   ► don't want tripods in Trafalgar Square

◼   ► because they take up a lot of space and

◼   ► there's a lot of people here but there's

◼   ► only three humans in the world in

◼   ► Trafalgar Square right now it's like my

◼   ► wife myself and this guy telling us that

◼   ► we're not allowed to take these pictures

◼   ► it was just like this incredibly

◼   ► frustrating back-and-forth where we're

◼   ► trying to convince this guy like we're

◼   ► not taking commercial photographs and

◼   ► he's like well why are you dressed up

◼   ► all nice and like he just wouldn't let

◼   ► it go and he's like now you can't do

◼   ► this you got to go you got to get out of

◼   ► here and not take these nice uh memento

◼   ► photographs of yourself bothering no one

◼   ► at 6:00 a.m. or whatever in Trafalgar

◼   ► Square how did that end did you walk

◼   ► away with the tie between your legs or

◼   ► did you stand up for your rights and

◼   ► sock him once I didn't punch him if

◼   ► that's what you're saying all right well

◼   ► here's an interesting thing which is

◼   ► that we knew in advance that Trafalgar

◼   ► Square and there's one other place in

◼   ► the UK which have really strange rules

◼   ► around photography inside of them

◼   ► they're super harsh on commercial

◼   ► photography and getting filming rights

◼   ► and all the rest of this yeah because

◼   ► it's a revenue stream yeah and it's like

◼   ► again also for doing like filming stuff

◼   ► there it makes total sense because you

◼   ► see movies and TV shows being filmed in

◼   ► Trafalgar Square and they have to close

◼   ► the whole place down it's like yeah of

◼   ► course that makes sense because it's a

◼   ► big hassle like it takes up the square

◼   ► bla bla bla but I think it's a very big

◼   ► difference between that kind of thing

◼   ► and to people who are just like no we're

◼   ► taking photographs for ourselves like we

◼   ► don't have a crew here there's just two

◼   ► people and we've come at a time that's

◼   ► bothering no one the problem is you two

◼   ► is so damn good-looking he probably

◼   ► thought you were both models yes I'm

◼   ► sure that is precisely what it was he's

◼   ► like oh look at these amazingly

◼   ► good-looking people they must be models

◼   ► but so all we did was like the dude was

◼   ► super frustrating and we went up the

◼   ► staircase and sort of by the National

◼   ► Gallery and just waited for a little bit

◼   ► he wandered around and then seemed to

◼   ► disappear from somewhere so he just went

◼   ► back out and took a bunch of photos and

◼   ► then left it's just it's just like what

◼   ► the lion is like okay sure mr. guard

◼   ► like I know you're gonna stand here

◼   ► you're gonna take the camera if

◼   ► leave it on the tripod and try to take

◼   ► some pictures of ourselves so I'm just

◼   ► gonna wait until you're further away and

◼   ► out of eyesight and then just do it

◼   ► again and then leave but it's like yeah

◼   ► Jeff allgor square no fun zone for a

◼   ► long time and the ratchet is only

◼   ► getting turned up the whole professional

◼   ► photography thing also it must be

◼   ► getting just impossible to police

◼   ► because any amateur these days you know

◼   ► has a tripod and a posh camera and a

◼   ► nice lens but also you could be there

◼   ► just clowning around on your iPhone and

◼   ► you could be some youtuber making your

◼   ► video that's gonna get watched by 30

◼   ► million people how they're policing that

◼   ► I've got no idea it doesn't make any

◼   ► sense I think especially with YouTube

◼   ► the whole notion of commercial is very

◼   ► strange because I took some videos of

◼   ► the signs in Trafalgar Square and I put

◼   ► that up on my second channel and the

◼   ► second channel does have ads that run on

◼   ► that video so like was I commercially

◼   ► filming in Trafalgar Square on my iPhone

◼   ► it's like I guess by have a letter of

◼   ► the law I was but by no reasonable

◼   ► person's definition would you say oh

◼   ► that was a commercial filming operation

◼   ► lock him up lock him up it is very funny

◼   ► because that you also see when I was

◼   ► there on that day I did see a bunch of

◼   ► people with what I think of as like the

◼   ► the KC nice tat filming set up where

◼   ► they have a very impressive looking

◼   ► canon camera with a little road

◼   ► microphone attachment on the top and the

◼   ► gorilla pod stand to hold it in their

◼   ► hands and it is it's this funny thing of

◼   ► like is that just some kid filming stuff

◼   ► for himself right or is that a vlogger

◼   ► with millions and millions of

◼   ► subscribers like you don't know and then

◼   ► is that a commercial operation or not it

◼   ► really is crazy and it's unbelievable

◼   ► and it's frustrating

◼   ► I was actually alerted to this situation

◼   ► by a couple of Tim's who I think had go

◼   ► onto the square they're from San

◼   ► Francisco but they were holidaying in

◼   ► London I was a married couple and they'd

◼   ► gone to the square I think for a little

◼   ► bit of gray inspired civil disobedience

◼   ► and they obviously saw this roped-off

◼   ► area and realized they couldn't get up

◼   ► on the lines so they took like a photo

◼   ► and posted it on Twitter sort of saying

◼   ► look how unfun the no-fun zone is now

◼   ► and I saw this and I just happened to be

◼   ► on the train on

◼   ► my way into London where I had meetings

◼   ► that day right near Trafalgar Square and

◼   ► I felt so bad I felt like I had to do my

◼   ► bit for London and for the UK I didn't

◼   ► want them leaving thinking so terribly

◼   ► of Trafalgar Square so I did message

◼   ► them on Twitter and I said I'll tell you

◼   ► what if you're in that same place at six

◼   ► o'clock tonight I'll come and say hello

◼   ► and let's take a better photo

◼   ► so sure enough we went later on and they

◼   ► turned up and like we get our own little

◼   ► photoshoot and funnily enough I think

◼   ► that photoshoot may have been with your

◼   ► love lion because as I think about it

◼   ► now it was that lion on the left nearest

◼   ► the gallery as you look down mm-hmm from

◼   ► the gallery so I think we were doing our

◼   ► little photo at the grail of life we

◼   ► didn't get stopped by the way kudos to

◼   ► the first person that goes on to

◼   ► Wikipedia and refers to that line as the

◼   ► love line right now brady you're just

◼   ► encouraging Wikipedia vandalism that we

◼   ► don't promote that on the show don't do

◼   ► that you wouldn't want to cause but

◼   ► could be view problems I don't want to

◼   ► tell you that I don't want to tell you

◼   ► that you're so good to the tim's brady

◼   ► you really are taking photographs in

◼   ► Trafalgar Square manufacturing shoes

◼   ► getting vinyl records printed you're

◼   ► very good to the audience you always put

◼   ► me to shame with that no I was writing

◼   ► hereby and like they had previously

◼   ► posted another picture as well where

◼   ► they had been at the San Francisco

◼   ► baseball stadium sitting like near where

◼   ► I sat when I went as well so they'd been

◼   ► goodtimz our like rewarding good Tim

◼   ► äj-- this episode of Hello Internet is

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◼   ► gray in the last podcast I talked about

◼   ► how traffic responds to ambulances and

◼   ► you know people getting out the way of

◼   ► ambulances and that caused lots of

◼   ► interesting discussion and there was

◼   ► lots of legal debate and things like

◼   ► that and there's no need to go over all

◼   ► that again I think it's been well and

◼   ► truly thrashed out on the reddit but one

◼   ► thing I said that caused some

◼   ► controversy was I referred to the

◼   ► drivers of ambulances as ambulance

◼   ► drivers mm-hmm and I don't know if you

◼   ► have seen some of the reaction this

◼   ► course I said at the time that a lot of

◼   ► people who work in ambulances listen to

◼   ► the podcast and that was proven to be

◼   ► true because they all got in touch I

◼   ► have seen very much of this as well yes

◼   ► and basically that to summarize their

◼   ► argument I supposedly have done them a

◼   ► disservice by referring to them as

◼   ► ambulance drivers as mere ambulance

◼   ► drivers because they are trained

◼   ► paramedics and they don't take well to

◼   ► being called ambulance drivers and I was

◼   ► wondering how you felt about this how

◼   ► you felt to this admonishment that I

◼   ► received it's a funny thing because I

◼   ► feel like there is a presumption from

◼   ► the people who are paramedics about a

◼   ► thing that we're saying which were not

◼   ► because when I say something like

◼   ► ambulance driver which is the phrase

◼   ► that I also used I feel like in my mind

◼   ► you can translate that into like a hero

◼   ► among men right like like that person is

◼   ► doing like awesome cool danger is

◼   ► driving down the roads like they're

◼   ► going to literally save lives yeah

◼   ► they're going in all of these dangerous

◼   ► situations there was no suggestion they

◼   ► were not trained to do it as well

◼   ► not-here is like ambulance driver it

◼   ► does not equate to like uber driver like

◼   ► dude with a car right who's just doing a

◼   ► thing that is not the comparison in my

◼   ► mind like I can totally understand from

◼   ► the perspective of a paramedic like you

◼   ► go through a whole bunch of training and

◼   ► then you you have a title that you are a

◼   ► paramedic that means a particular thing

◼   ► in your mind

◼   ► whereas when we're talking about it at

◼   ► least in my head it's all kind of mushed

◼   ► together where it's like oh yes of

◼   ► course

◼   ► ambulance drivers and paramedics like

◼   ► these are just people who are saving

◼   ► people's lives I and they are incredibly

◼   ► valuable members of society and they do

◼   ► great things we got a lot of feedback

◼   ► because I can understand why from the

◼   ► perspective of a paramedic they might

◼   ► feel like being referred to as an

◼   ► ambulance driver is less than what they

◼   ► are but that is by no means the feeling

◼   ► in at least my head and I presume your

◼   ► head when you are discussing what these

◼   ► people do well yes

◼   ► can I second what gray just said but can

◼   ► I also add with all the love in the

◼   ► world to those paramedics get off your

◼   ► high horse

◼   ► whoa because I accept that you have this

◼   ► incredible training and knowledge that I

◼   ► don't have and I'm so thankful for what

◼   ► you do and I think you're heroes and you

◼   ► know one day one of you might be leaning

◼   ► over me to save my life and I hope

◼   ► you're not still angry at me at that

◼   ► point and the words he will say is he's

◼   ► putting the mask over your face are your

◼   ► Brady Haran yeah has this on your high

◼   ► horse but no the thing is like yes you

◼   ► have all this medical training but at

◼   ► that moment in time when you are driving

◼   ► the ambulance to me you are an ambulance

◼   ► driver and that also is important and

◼   ► amazing and well trained and brilliant

◼   ► mm-hmm but a person driving an ambulance

◼   ► is an ambulance driver kind of like by

◼   ► definition even if they've stolen it

◼   ► they're an ambulance driver at that

◼   ► point in time and if like say someone

◼   ► drove into the front wall of my house

◼   ► tomorrow and knocked over the wall and I

◼   ► was upset at them and I was like here on

◼   ► the podcast complaining about it and I

◼   ► said oh great gonna believe it like some

◼   ► car driver drove into my wall and

◼   ► knocked it over yesterday they're not

◼   ► gonna call me up and say well actually I

◼   ► happen to be a brain surgeon and I'd

◼   ► prefer if you'd said a brain surgeon

◼   ► drove into

◼   ► my world yesterday like yes maybe you

◼   ► are a brain surgeon but at the time you

◼   ► were driving the car and knocking over

◼   ► the wall all you were to me was the

◼   ► driver of a car

◼   ► likewise when someone is driving an

◼   ► ambulance past me at high speed just go

◼   ► and save a life at that point in time

◼   ► you're an ambulance driver and I think

◼   ► it's a fair description of what you are

◼   ► and trust me you know if I am out in the

◼   ► field making one of my videos and a

◼   ► little kid says mommy mommy look at that

◼   ► cameraman over there I'm not gonna turn

◼   ► around and say excuse me

◼   ► I'm a trained journalist and I have

◼   ► interview skills and I also do the

◼   ► editing and I've also put things

◼   ► together and I'm gonna create a lovely

◼   ► narrative out of the story I just think

◼   ► okay I'm a cameraman at the moment

◼   ► oh my god okay a few things I feel like

◼   ► I cannot go down this line of reasoning

◼   ► with you the thing is I would bet so

◼   ► much money in real life that you would

◼   ► turn to that kid and be like excuse me I

◼   ► am a trained journalist like everything

◼   ► I know about you everything about our

◼   ► private conversations to me like are all

◼   ► arrows pointing in the direction of yes

◼   ► Brady would tell that child that he is a

◼   ► trained journalist and not really a

◼   ► cameraman in that moment that you've got

◼   ► that wrong you've got that wrong but

◼   ► putting that aside the ambulance driver

◼   ► thing okay so if you were in that field

◼   ► filming a video about ambulances and

◼   ► they let you drive the ambulance would

◼   ► you say that you were an ambulance

◼   ► driver in that moment no okay you caught

◼   ► me out there okay perhaps using the

◼   ► notion of someone having stolen the

◼   ► ambulance was maybe me taking a little

◼   ► bit of dramatic license the amusement of

◼   ► our listeners but I do think it is fair

◼   ► to call someone who is earning money

◼   ► while driving the ambulance an ambulance

◼   ► driver and yes they also have an even

◼   ► more important role to play but in the

◼   ► context of my story mhm

◼   ► all that mattered was that their own

◼   ► ambulance driver so here's the thing

◼   ► that I'm a little bit foggy on so the

◼   ► preferred term is paramedic

◼   ► I feel like I don't understand very

◼   ► clearly the boundaries of this word

◼   ► because do paramedics only exist in some

◼   ► form of transit like I'm thinking about

◼   ► right a paramedic is coming in and

◼   ► ambulance where a paramedic is coming in

◼   ► a helicopter do paramedics operate

◼   ► inside of the hospital or do they

◼   ► operate exclusively outside of the

◼   ► hospital in transit back to it like I

◼   ► don't understand actually very clearly

◼   ► where the boundaries of this are you're

◼   ► asking me I'm already in trouble for not

◼   ► knowing this so you don't ask me okay

◼   ► I'm looking at now while I look this up

◼   ► I have another question I want to throw

◼   ► out there to the paramedics if you're a

◼   ► paramedic and you lose your driver's

◼   ► license let's say for drink-driving I'm

◼   ► assuming you can't now drive the

◼   ► ambulance are you still a paramedic if

◼   ► you can't drive an ambulance who drives

◼   ► the ambulance

◼   ► are there any just bespoke ambulance

◼   ► drivers you know I Drive the ambulance

◼   ► but like I've got nothing about the

◼   ► human body like I just get the

◼   ► paramedics there to those people even

◼   ► exist that's a very interesting question

◼   ► I feel like economies tend towards

◼   ► specialization I feel like somewhere in

◼   ► some country this has to be a clear

◼   ► division of labor that there does exist

◼   ► someone who is an ambulance driver only

◼   ► who's trained on racetracks and like

◼   ► pretend villages to be able to drive

◼   ► around corners because that seems like a

◼   ► very different skill sets from being

◼   ► able to stop someone from bleeding to

◼   ► death in their kitchen I don't think

◼   ► there's necessarily overlap so there

◼   ► must be someplace that has this division

◼   ► of labor I'm sure we'll find out from

◼   ► all of the paramedics well we're not

◼   ► gonna find out from the paramedic

◼   ► Wikipedia page because that's a little

◼   ► bit nebulous I was looking over that too

◼   ► and I'm like I'm getting no help from

◼   ► your Wikipedia page this is now what I'm

◼   ► looking for plays plays plays nuisance

◼   ► Tim make the term ambulance driver

◼   ► redirect to paramedic Brady you you are

◼   ► such a troublemaker it's a thing I have

◼   ► to disapprove of greatly in your

◼   ► personality so these are the questions

◼   ► are there people who are ambulance

◼   ► drivers only and do paramedics only

◼   ► exist in transit from location our

◼   ► paramedics do they not exist inside of a

◼   ► hospital I feel like this is this is

◼   ► what we need to know please go to the

◼   ► reddit's and have a big angry discussion

◼   ► about it I'm feeling a bit bad about

◼   ► this Wikipedia thing I'll tell you what

◼   ► if you are a Wikipedia mischief-maker

◼   ► not only are you very naughty and we

◼   ► don't

◼   ► proof of that but I hope at least once a

◼   ► year you make a donation to the wiki

◼   ► foundation to support them because like

◼   ► Wikipedia is pretty important it's one

◼   ► of the few things that like when I get

◼   ► pestered about donations on the Internet

◼   ► I will sometimes say you know what I

◼   ► like Wikipedia I'm gonna check him a few

◼   ► bucks that is the same in our household

◼   ► because yes it is Wikipedia it's super

◼   ► fun to mess with and it is also maybe

◼   ► one of the most important things for

◼   ► civilization that has emerged in the

◼   ► past 20 years it's on both sides of

◼   ► those scales support your local

◼   ► Wikipedia people was that an NPR joke I

◼   ► don't know what that was I feel like

◼   ► I've heard that phrase but I wasn't

◼   ► intentionally making an NPR joke because

◼   ► like this is something that's been on my

◼   ► mind lately and you've just brought it

◼   ► up by accident but I don't listen to NPR

◼   ► radio because I live in England right

◼   ► but I do listen to lots of NPR podcasts

◼   ► an NPR podcasts are obviously supported

◼   ► through like the NPR pot of money and I

◼   ► think they've gotten themselves into

◼   ► this weird antiquated situation now

◼   ► where there's obviously some turf war

◼   ► going on and there's a lot of politics

◼   ► involved because whenever you're

◼   ► listening to the podcasts they always

◼   ► say if you want to support the podcast

◼   ► and give money so we can keep making

◼   ► this excellent podcast right go to your

◼   ► local radio station and give them money

◼   ► because some of that money will find its

◼   ► way here and that's what keeps the

◼   ► podcast guy and I understand the

◼   ► situation that has come about and why

◼   ► this has happened but I think at some

◼   ► stage in PR are gonna have to say do you

◼   ► know are like our podcasts are really

◼   ► popular now and people want to give them

◼   ► money but they don't want to do this

◼   ► like indirect weird thing where they

◼   ► have to go to their radio station and

◼   ► prop up the radio station yeah let's

◼   ► keep getting their podcast yeah so I

◼   ► think NPR needs to soon revisit this

◼   ► situation where their podcasts are

◼   ► saying hey go to your local radio

◼   ► station and give them money I understand

◼   ► the politics I can see what's happened

◼   ► as old media versus new media thing

◼   ► going on within the one organization but

◼   ► it's very strange to me and it's

◼   ► starting to sound strange that makes no

◼   ► sense to me so you're listening to an

◼   ► NPR podcast yeah so I'm listening to it

◼   ► and they say if you like this and you

◼   ► want to give us money here's what you do

◼   ► go to your local NPR radio station and

◼   ► give them money okay so I am Joe Johnson

◼   ► listening in Boise Idaho and I like a

◼   ► podcast from Washington about about

◼   ► Washington politics or something Yeah

◼   ► right it's not about Boise it's some NPR

◼   ► podcast broadcast to everybody and yeah

◼   ► in theory the thing that I'm supposed to

◼   ► do is find Boise radio be qrx 103.2 and

◼   ► hand them an envelope full of cash like

◼   ► that seems so crazy I don't even

◼   ► understand how that mechanism is

◼   ► supposed to work that is so weird it's a

◼   ► bit like us saying if you like hello

◼   ► internet and want to support Brady and

◼   ► gray give money to my best friends

◼   ► cousins sisters brother cuz I owe him

◼   ► money for something I borrowed from him

◼   ► six months ago

◼   ► and that will really help me out people

◼   ► will know I don't do that yeah I would

◼   ► never do that they need to set up crowd

◼   ► funding for the podcast that seems like

◼   ► what they should do and clearly I mean I

◼   ► can see what's happened obviously this

◼   ► is the huge radio infrastructure which

◼   ► is probably crumbling in some way

◼   ► because of everyone's listening to

◼   ► podcasts instead of radio and the radio

◼   ► people are like worried that they're

◼   ► gonna cease to exist totally be worried

◼   ► they are on the way out and you don't

◼   ► need to explain to me that that the

◼   ► journalism of the radio stations feeds

◼   ► into the podcast I understand all that

◼   ► there's a New York Times podcast I

◼   ► listen to sometimes and they always say

◼   ► hey people always ask how to give money

◼   ► the best thing you can do is get a

◼   ► subscription to The New York Times

◼   ► because that's the journalistic engine

◼   ► that keeps this podcast going and again

◼   ► that's true but it's that extra layer of

◼   ► abstraction that I think makes you

◼   ► resistant the New York Times one is at

◼   ► least to me a much straighter arrow yes

◼   ► this is the parent organization the New

◼   ► York Times give us some money to support

◼   ► the podcast it's very interesting from a

◼   ► big organization perspective of like if

◼   ► you want people to give you money how to

◼   ► do it I feel like in that situation

◼   ► let's say there was a podcast from the

◼   ► New York Times I was listening to and

◼   ► that I liked and I want to support it

◼   ► like I would feel a little bit of a

◼   ► weirdness giving to the New York Times

◼   ► as a whole because I feel like but I

◼   ► want to give it to this exact podcast

◼   ► yeah but you can see that the New York

◼   ► Times organization wants the money to go

◼   ► to the parent organization not to the

◼   ► podcast in particular and of course like

◼   ► money

◼   ► is fungible for an organization like

◼   ► that it doesn't really matter

◼   ► yeah but I'm thinking like if NPR was

◼   ► doing crowdfunding

◼   ► I think the institution's instinct would

◼   ► be to do the thing that would probably

◼   ► get them less money overall which is to

◼   ► have one gigantic contribute to NPR fund

◼   ► as opposed to setting up a whole bunch

◼   ► of contribute to this particular podcast

◼   ► funds even if they had some little

◼   ► disclaimer like oh you're contributing

◼   ► to podcast X and 50% of the revenue that

◼   ► goes to podcast X goes to the parent

◼   ► organization as well hmm

◼   ► like I'd be willing to bet they would

◼   ► make more revenue overall by asking for

◼   ► donations to particular podcast than to

◼   ► the parent organization but also bet

◼   ► they would never actually set it up that

◼   ► way no probably not

◼   ► speaking of big organizations let me

◼   ► tell you a funny thing that happened to

◼   ► me yesterday I went to my local gym I

◼   ► just want to sit in the jacuzzi actually

◼   ► so I went along and I sat in the jacuzzi

◼   ► because I that's what I wanted all right

◼   ► this is what I wanted and where my sort

◼   ► of gym is is sort of connected to this

◼   ► posh hotel and guests of the posh hotel

◼   ► used the same facility and this hotel

◼   ► always hosts like away days and weddings

◼   ► and stuff like that right so I was

◼   ► sitting in the jacuzzi for probably half

◼   ► an hour and there was obviously this big

◼   ► away day happening at the hotel they

◼   ► were all men all these men who were at

◼   ► this away day for this business came and

◼   ► sat in the jacuzzi around me so there

◼   ► was like probably eight of us and the

◼   ► seven of them worked for this business

◼   ► and they were talking about their work

◼   ► and then a few of them got out and then

◼   ► a couple more came and then a few of

◼   ► others got out and a couple more came

◼   ► and over the course of half an hour

◼   ► probably 16 or 17 people that worked for

◼   ► this business set in the jacuzzi with me

◼   ► and they spent the whole time talking

◼   ► about their work non-stop the politics

◼   ► of how bills lazy and isn't pulling his

◼   ► weight and this email and their email

◼   ► and this report I had to fill out and

◼   ► this thing I had to do they never

◼   ► stopped talking about their work the

◼   ► whole time the whole half hour I was in

◼   ► the jacuzzi and it was only at the very

◼   ► very end it suddenly occurred to me

◼   ► after listening to these people talk

◼   ► non-stop about their work for half an

◼   ► hour I had no idea what they did or what

◼   ► business not one single thing gave away

◼   ► what their business was and it made me

◼   ► realize how universal people complaining

◼   ► about their work is like I even said to

◼   ► them at the end guys I've been listening

◼   ► to you guys for the last half an hour I

◼   ► have no idea what you do like what's

◼   ► your business like and they all laughed

◼   ► and like they realized like at certain

◼   ► points I was like I thought I'd figured

◼   ► it out and I was transposing different

◼   ► businesses on to what they did they

◼   ► could they could have been a bunch of

◼   ► journalists seriously they could have

◼   ► been they could have been accountants at

◼   ► one point I thought they were like

◼   ► estate agents and things like that I

◼   ► couldn't figure out what they were doing

◼   ► listening to them talk for half an hour

◼   ► part of it made me miss working because

◼   ► they had such comradery and you know but

◼   ► another part of me made me realize well

◼   ► working in their organizations pretty

◼   ► crappy yeah you're always getting sucked

◼   ► up into politics

◼   ► as soon as you get past maybe five

◼   ► people working together it's it's like

◼   ► politics starts to happen it's just a

◼   ► natural side-effect of the way humans

◼   ► are so what was the business I have to

◼   ► know now even when they told me I still

◼   ► don't know what they did cuz apparently

◼   ► they worked in operations for a retail

◼   ► organization okay okay yeah so I don't

◼   ► know exactly what that means does that

◼   ► mean is there like head office for a

◼   ► shop I don't know this scenario when I'm

◼   ► talking to somebody and I get an answer

◼   ► about their job that's what you should

◼   ► say your job is when you don't want

◼   ► people to ask questions because as soon

◼   ► as they said operations for a retail

◼   ► organization I just shut up yeah you

◼   ► know what that's that's not a bad idea

◼   ► I work in digital operations I mean the

◼   ► thing I wanted to say when they said

◼   ► that was what retail organization then I

◼   ► was a stranger and I just basically had

◼   ► told these people I've been listening to

◼   ► you gossip I would have looked like some

◼   ► kind of industrial spy or like

◼   ► investigative journalist if I said what

◼   ► organization yeah give me names you

◼   ► bring out a little waterproof notepad to

◼   ► write things down any oh yeah

◼   ► interesting I think what's happening

◼   ► here is there is like a larger and

◼   ► larger portion of the economy which is

◼   ► not directly involved in doing the thing

◼   ► but is instead involved in managing

◼   ► doing the thing yeah and I feel like

◼   ► this is why is an incredibly common

◼   ► experience to run into people and it's

◼   ► like

◼   ► everybody seems to be like so what do

◼   ► you do exactly

◼   ► like I don't understand on making a

◼   ► thing you're overseeing people who make

◼   ► a thing or you're overseeing departments

◼   ► of people who make a thing it just feels

◼   ► like the economy leans more towards

◼   ► layers of management and I'm not even

◼   ► saying that those layers are unnecessary

◼   ► like I think as the economy gets more

◼   ► complicated it shouldn't be surprised

◼   ► that more and more people are involved

◼   ► in which you could broadly call like

◼   ► management or logistics like that

◼   ► becomes more and more vital as a thing

◼   ► to do yeah but I do have this let's call

◼   ► it like not really great pro-social

◼   ► tendency that in these moments when

◼   ► somebody gives me an answer like that I

◼   ► have a very hard time not like drilling

◼   ► down with the person precisely what it

◼   ► is that they do it almost always ends up

◼   ► in this thing where is like oh if I'm

◼   ► meeting with someone on a Friday the

◼   ► conversation will bend towards be like

◼   ► okay look I still don't understand this

◼   ► morning when you went when you went into

◼   ► work is like 9:00 a.m. what was the

◼   ► thing that you did it's like this line

◼   ► of questioning makes people really

◼   ► uncomfortable yeah it would have made

◼   ► them more uncomfortable because our bare

◼   ► legs were touching underwater I could

◼   ► see how that definitely encourages a

◼   ► little bit of social walk for this I

◼   ► love the fact that you're chatting with

◼   ► a bunch of other guys in the jacuzzi

◼   ► after spying on them for a while that's

◼   ► it's like oh I wanted to go out with him

◼   ► they were planning their night out

◼   ► sounds like they were gonna have a big

◼   ► night out though talking about what pub

◼   ► they were gonna go to and go out

◼   ► drinking and I was like oh yeah that's

◼   ► fantastic and then these guys are

◼   ► wondering who the hell is this hanger I

◼   ► know from the way they were talking

◼   ► they'd probably just think I was one of

◼   ► them like I didn't think anyone knew who

◼   ► anyone was like who is that guy Arden hi

◼   ► you must be in I thought you knew who he

◼   ► was

◼   ► I don't know he seems to fit in you

◼   ► could have totally blended right in this

◼   ► is like an American Psycho situation

◼   ► where none of these guys really know who

◼   ► the other guys are anyway so what's it

◼   ► matter

◼   ► this episode of Hello Internet is

◼   ► brought to you in part by audible

◼   ► audible is a leading provider of premium

◼   ► digital spoken audio information and

◼   ► entertainment on the Internet you can

◼   ► get a free audiobook with a 30-day trial

◼   ► at audible.com slash hello internet

◼   ► that's where you should go right now

◼   ► audible.com slash hello internet to get

◼   ► a free audiobook with your 30 day trial

◼   ► now audible as always likes for us to

◼   ► recommend a book so I recently read a

◼   ► book that I can highly recommend and

◼   ► it's tribe by Sebastian Junger he's the

◼   ► same guy who wrote a perfect storm if

◼   ► you ever read that it's a little bit of

◼   ► a difficult book to describe but I can

◼   ► briefly say that it is a little bit

◼   ► about people in war particularly men in

◼   ► war and how that affects them it talks

◼   ► about some of the difficult things like

◼   ► why is it that some soldiers really find

◼   ► solace in being in a group in war and

◼   ► why they can have difficulty

◼   ► reintegrating into society afterwards

◼   ► that makes the book sound like it's a

◼   ► huge downer but I actually found it a

◼   ► fascinating non downer read and it's

◼   ► also very short which is the thing that

◼   ► I really appreciate in books sometimes

◼   ► so if you're looking for a book to try

◼   ► maybe something that's a little bit

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◼   ► hello Internet that's a you DIBL EECOM

◼   ► slash hello Internet I remember when

◼   ► Theresa May the prime minister of the UK

◼   ► which is prime minister as I'm speaking

◼   ► now I don't know what the situation

◼   ► would be with this podcast goes out the

◼   ► prime minister who called the snap

◼   ► election to consolidate her power as we

◼   ► discussed and I couldn't resist

◼   ► on election night when it all went wrong

◼   ► for her and she lost her majority and it

◼   ► must have been one of the less enjoyable

◼   ► evenings of her professional career I

◼   ► couldn't resist going back to your tweet

◼   ► and when the election was first called

◼   ► where you just had the Jurassic Park

◼   ► meme of clever girl and I remember you

◼   ► talking about it on the podcast her you

◼   ► talked about what a genius move it was

◼   ► people had to vote for her she cornered

◼   ► them in such a clever way that they had

◼   ► no choice but to vote for her and

◼   ► increase her power for those who don't

◼   ► know that's not how it played out then

◼   ► she went from having a small majority in

◼   ► the House of Commons to having no

◼   ► majority in the House of Commons how are

◼   ► you feeling now are you feeling sheepish

◼   ► so I didn't follow the election at all

◼   ► between that tweet and then when

◼   ► somebody sent me a message about like oh

◼   ► there's a coalition government in the UK

◼   ► now like as far as on my radar

◼   ► like the whole election disappeared and

◼   ► then just reappeared several weeks later

◼   ► yeah it's interesting and from my

◼   ► perspective I have no idea what happened

◼   ► in the intermediate time what's happen

◼   ► is she's obviously in the minority she

◼   ► hasn't got enough votes to get anything

◼   ► through okay but what she's doing is

◼   ► rather than forming a coalition which is

◼   ► what happened a couple of elections ago

◼   ► between the Conservatives and the

◼   ► Liberal Democrats right what she's

◼   ► trying to do as we're speaking now it

◼   ► hasn't actually been signed and it's

◼   ► causing controversy for some other

◼   ► reasons that I won't bore you with but

◼   ► what she's trying to do is broker a deal

◼   ► with a political party the DUP from

◼   ► Northern Ireland mm-hmm who have some

◼   ► handful of seats in the Commons but

◼   ► they've got just enough seats to give

◼   ► her a majority so what she's doing is

◼   ► she's trying to broker a deal with them

◼   ► where they're not in coalition and they

◼   ► don't have to support her laws and all

◼   ► her votes and everything she does but

◼   ► they do agree to support her on two

◼   ► important things confidence and supply

◼   ► so if there's a no confidence vote they

◼   ► agree to support the government so the

◼   ► government can stay in government and if

◼   ► there's something that's going to block

◼   ► up the money in the budget supply they

◼   ► also will support the government on that

◼   ► so it's not a coalition they don't have

◼   ► like you know oh interests they're not

◼   ► part of the government it's just an

◼   ► agreement to support them on those two

◼   ► crucial things and everything else is

◼   ► gonna be just chaos and what they're

◼   ► gonna get for that deal is yet to be

◼   ► finalized like you know lb suddenly

◼   ► gonna get lots of shiny new gorgeous

◼   ► infrastructure in certain parts of

◼   ► Northern Ireland as a result of this I

◼   ► imagine that might happen yes but of

◼   ► course the problem is Northern Ireland

◼   ► is deeply deeply divided between its own

◼   ► parties like the DUP lynchin phone well

◼   ► we're not going to go into that but

◼   ► obviously like shin vain and these other

◼   ► parties in Northern Ireland like hang on

◼   ► a second you're the UK government you're

◼   ► supposed to in some ways kind of

◼   ► keep out of the Northern Ireland mess

◼   ► you know there's agreements here that

◼   ► have been made and now you're like

◼   ► budding up with just one of the parties

◼   ► to get their votes so more messes to

◼   ► come as we speak now this agreement

◼   ► hasn't been signed

◼   ► that's very interesting I thought she

◼   ► had formed an official coalition this is

◼   ► a much more interesting situation the UK

◼   ► government sort of kind of taking aside

◼   ► in the Northern Irish politics like boy

◼   ► that sounds like a whole bunch and not

◼   ► fun I like this idea that there's a

◼   ► coalition that is a it's like an

◼   ► unofficial official coalition is what's

◼   ► happening here which is amazing because

◼   ► it sounds like maximum instability now

◼   ► it's like coalition's people always

◼   ► worry about them being unstable and now

◼   ► to not even have a coalition is unstable

◼   ► err that's fantastic I don't know what

◼   ► the betting markets are saying at the

◼   ► moment but a lot of people are saying

◼   ► that they'll probably be another

◼   ► election this year

◼   ► oh really interesting I think not but

◼   ► why do you think not because I mean one

◼   ► of the reasons this election went so

◼   ► pear-shaped I think for Teresa may was

◼   ► like election fatigue and I think people

◼   ► are sick of having elections all the

◼   ► time and they thought she was having

◼   ► another one to be a bit greedy people

◼   ► wanted to give her bit of a bloody nose

◼   ► for that well they did for whatever

◼   ► reason so I think if there's another

◼   ► election this year it will be one that's

◼   ► kind of forced upon them certainly I

◼   ► don't think the Conservative Party would

◼   ► risk holding it but I don't know what do

◼   ► I know

◼   ► I don't know much your bet is that if

◼   ► there is another election it would just

◼   ► be simply because the government just

◼   ► falls apart it is in essentially

◼   ► dissolves yeah and we have another

◼   ► election interesting folks two paces

◼   ► yeah it's interesting because again I I

◼   ► didn't follow any of the things going on

◼   ► but the reason I thought it was such a

◼   ► clever move is because I did have this

◼   ► feeling like boy really boxed in to

◼   ► having to support Theresa May because

◼   ► like my feeling is the result we have

◼   ► now is kind like the worst of everything

◼   ► because if brexit is going to happen

◼   ► even though i am not in favor of brexit

◼   ► i would still want the UK government to

◼   ► be in the strongest negotiating position

◼   ► for brexit to occur otherwise it feels

◼   ► like cutting your nose to spite your

◼   ► face hmm and so that's why I thought

◼   ► like oh man this elections lockdown be

◼   ► because everyone else is gonna make this

◼   ► kind of like same game theory

◼   ► calculation like well we don't want

◼   ► brexit to happen but if it's gonna

◼   ► happen like we might as well make our

◼   ► position super strong now it feels like

◼   ► oh god here we go like well the UK is

◼   ► wandering into brexit with a real bloody

◼   ► nose before the negotiations have even

◼   ► really begun I feel like this is not a

◼   ► good situation I tell you one thing

◼   ► that's interesting that I mean I know

◼   ► you and I are not you know we don't talk

◼   ► a lot of politics and stuff and you know

◼   ► especially you aren't particularly

◼   ► interested but this does mean that if

◼   ► BRICS it goes ahead which it seems like

◼   ► it still will you being so wrong about

◼   ► the general election does mean you're

◼   ► probably more likely to be right now

◼   ► about your bricks at prediction and that

◼   ► is everyone seems to agree now that soft

◼   ► brexit is much more likely than hard

◼   ► brick so we seem to be drifting towards

◼   ► a hard brick set before this election

◼   ► and now soft bricks that seems like the

◼   ► more likely scenario yeah I don't know

◼   ► it's like I still feel like with all of

◼   ► this stuff there's some weird part of me

◼   ► which still thinks like this will just

◼   ► never be resolved right but this will

◼   ► just go on forever and ever even though

◼   ► I know that it can't like article 50 has

◼   ► been triggered yeah there's some part of

◼   ► me which just can't let go of the idea

◼   ► of like man people can stall forever

◼   ► sometimes and are we just are we just

◼   ► going to be left in a limbo that just

◼   ► never ends that's a remain of fantasy

◼   ► then that remain a fantasy suddenly

◼   ► became a little bit more possible I

◼   ► think it's still a fantasy but I

◼   ► obviously was hoping we would stay in

◼   ► the EU as well so the idea of it falling

◼   ► apart delights me but I don't know if

◼   ► it'll happen or not but yeah I think it

◼   ► won't I don't think it will fall apart

◼   ► something happens or endless negotiation

◼   ► happens but those are different from it

◼   ► falling apart I don't know it's been a

◼   ► real interesting time with elections

◼   ► that's for sure and I feel like this one

◼   ► was to me particularly unexpected I feel

◼   ► like I don't really understand what

◼   ► happened between when she called the

◼   ► election and when the election happened

◼   ► but yeah it's surprising it is

◼   ► interesting and I don't like the

◼   ► position that the UK is in now because I

◼   ► feel like it's a it's a worse

◼   ► negotiating position but maybe if it

◼   ► ends up being a softer brexit in the

◼   ► long run that's better

◼   ► I don't know who knows only in the

◼   ► future will we know current US recording

◼   ► this now has no idea so there was

◼   ► another page

◼   ► of news I wanted to bring up with you

◼   ► this is one of the times where the fact

◼   ► that our podcasts are so far apart comes

◼   ► in handy or works against us I don't

◼   ► know which it's summertime Brady you

◼   ► can't have a lot of podcast in the

◼   ► summer everybody knows that no you

◼   ► certainly can't there was big news that

◼   ► I couldn't wait to tell you it's not be

◼   ► related we haven't actually had the buzz

◼   ► this week is there gonna be a buzz this

◼   ► week there's no buzz this week Brady

◼   ► okay there has been a lot of B news in

◼   ► fact did you not see the story about the

◼   ► Vice President of the United States has

◼   ► put a beehive at his house this sounds

◼   ► vaguely familiar it was like

◼   ► presidential buzz news in the summertime

◼   ► Twitter is also very hard to do so I

◼   ► haven't been keeping up with the Twitter

◼   ► as much because it's warm outside the

◼   ► second lady has installed a beehive at

◼   ► the vice presidential residence it's to

◼   ► raise awareness of the dwindling

◼   ► honeybee population well now that we've

◼   ► gotten some honeybees in the vice

◼   ► presidency there's only one place to go

◼   ► presidential honeybees in the future

◼   ► imagine that like a big white house of

◼   ► bees yeah that'll be awesome White House

◼   ► or bust for bees okay so after that

◼   ► accidental piece of buzz let me tell you

◼   ► more importantly what I thought was

◼   ► going to be Mount Everest news that I

◼   ► couldn't wait to discuss with you but I

◼   ► think it's been snatched away from me

◼   ► because there was this story during the

◼   ► rounds a few weeks ago that this really

◼   ► famous feature on Mount Everest called

◼   ► the Hillary step which is a sort of

◼   ► rocky outcropping it's the last bit of

◼   ► technical climbing you have to do before

◼   ► you get to like the summit of Everest

◼   ► mm-hmm had like collapsed had fallen

◼   ► apart apparently it was shaken apart by

◼   ► the earthquake that happened a couple of

◼   ► years ago and because no one had gone

◼   ► and navigated it since because of

◼   ► problems on Everest all the climbers

◼   ► were going back for the first time and

◼   ► they were like it's not there anymore

◼   ► there's just all this snow and the rocks

◼   ► falling apart and my impression was it

◼   ► had become actually easier now to get up

◼   ► past her and go on up to the summit and

◼   ► they were like these before and after

◼   ► pictures doing the rounds and it looked

◼   ► to me like it wasn't there anymore and I

◼   ► was really excited and so just before

◼   ► the show I was like getting everything

◼   ► ready to tell you about it mm-hmm and

◼   ► now there seems to be this second story

◼   ► where climbers are saying no no no no we

◼   ► think it's still there there's just been

◼   ► a lot of snow and you can't see

◼   ► properly and it's covering snow at the

◼   ► moment but the Hillary step is still

◼   ► there so the jury is out as to whether

◼   ► or not this famous feature this beloved

◼   ► feature on Mount Everest may not even be

◼   ► there anymore it's not often you get

◼   ► geological news is it that works in a

◼   ► pretty slow time scale so the idea that

◼   ► we have like a new piece of geology to

◼   ► tell everyone about that was quite

◼   ► exciting to me but now I don't know yes

◼   ► I have to wait a bit longer issues of

◼   ► the buzz might come out on a monthly

◼   ► basis but I feel like the geology Now

◼   ► magazine maybe comes out once a year

◼   ► geological news happens on a geological

◼   ► time scale yeah but like of all the

◼   ► things that could change like all the

◼   ► geological features in the world that

◼   ► could change like there's only one

◼   ► geological feature like higher than the

◼   ► Hillary step and that is like the summit

◼   ► of Mount Everest so sure of the summit

◼   ► of Mount Everest disappearing which I

◼   ► don't think is technically possible the

◼   ► Hillary step disappearing is like big

◼   ► news it's the second highest named thing

◼   ► in the world I think so anyway there you

◼   ► go there's Mount Everest non news or

◼   ► maybe news let's wait till the snow

◼   ► thaws but I have been hearing you Tim's

◼   ► for those 400,000 Tim's that alerted me

◼   ► to this news I didn't receive your

◼   ► emails and tweets thank you so you went

◼   ► to WWDC mm-hmm and I know you've

◼   ► discussed this on detail in the other

◼   ► place but I do want to find out what it

◼   ► was like that was it good by the way the

◼   ► other place is like a politics joke like

◼   ► if people don't know how that

◼   ► Parliament's work you don't name the

◼   ► other chamber and stuff oh yeah my

◼   ► learned friend in another place is what

◼   ► you sometimes stay instead of like the

◼   ► House of Lords really is it like a

◼   ► question time thing I don't think I've

◼   ► ever heard that yeah it's like it's like

◼   ► a parliament thing so anyway was it good

◼   ► did you have a good time I always feel

◼   ► kind of funny going to a conference like

◼   ► WWDC because I don't really have any

◼   ► reason to be there like I'm not a

◼   ► developer I don't have like a software

◼   ► business that has any reason to be in

◼   ► WWDC this is for me just totally an

◼   ► extension of really like my professional

◼   ► interest in Apple as a user of their

◼   ► products and particularly interesting to

◼   ► go after what feels like has been a long

◼   ► time where there haven't been any

◼   ► updates in in their products

◼   ► I went I really enjoyed it I feel like

◼   ► they had a whole bunch of exciting

◼   ► announcements which it's it's kind of

◼   ► nice to be there in person for that and

◼   ► to be around people when that's

◼   ► happening why well it's nice to be in

◼   ► person because when you're watching the

◼   ► announcements you can see other people's

◼   ► reactions to things and you know how you

◼   ► know what other people care about and

◼   ► what you care about and this was this

◼   ► was a really good show because everybody

◼   ► got something that they liked and then

◼   ► yeah the other reason I do like to be

◼   ► there in person is when Apple announces

◼   ► that they have new products like this

◼   ► year they have new iPads they give out

◼   ► review units to some of the people who

◼   ► are there and mmm there are

◼   ► circumstances under which maybe a person

◼   ► like me can get their hands on the brand

◼   ► new thing to get a first look at it for

◼   ► brief periods of time and that's the

◼   ► kind of thing that you can only do if

◼   ► you are physically at where the

◼   ► conference is happening that's just

◼   ► plain exciting like it's it's super fun

◼   ► and super interesting to see the brand

◼   ► new thing that was announced the day

◼   ► before which hasn't gone on sale yet so

◼   ► I really quite like that who would have

◼   ► thought that you of all people would

◼   ► like get a thrill from that luck because

◼   ► you know you're gonna get it in a few

◼   ► weeks and you buy everything new anyway

◼   ► so you are gonna have one who would have

◼   ► thought that like that kind of cheap

◼   ► thrill would penetrate your rational

◼   ► exterior don't get me wrong like it

◼   ► would work on me because I like cheap

◼   ► thrills but who would have thought that

◼   ► you would be so susceptible to the cheap

◼   ► thrill of oh I'm getting to touch this a

◼   ► few weeks before everyone else is that a

◼   ► cheap thrill though I mean the joke is

◼   ► always like Apple has this reality

◼   ► distortion bubble that they announce

◼   ► things and and it seems like it's

◼   ► amazing in their presentations but

◼   ► there's a really big difference between

◼   ► seeing and handling something in person

◼   ► hmm versus just seeing it presented on a

◼   ► stage oh yeah don't get me wrong oh yeah

◼   ► no I understand the difference between

◼   ► saying a picture of it and actually

◼   ► getting to use it and I just could have

◼   ► imagined a scenario in which you said

◼   ► well it's going to be in the shop in six

◼   ► weeks anyway and I'm going to buy it so

◼   ► the fact that I've touched it for 15

◼   ► minutes six weeks before is really

◼   ► irrelevant I'm gonna come to grips with

◼   ► it soon anyway and I

◼   ► no in six weeks whether it's good or

◼   ► it's bad and it's basically just that

◼   ► kind of not that you would boast about

◼   ► it but that kind of boast enos of I got

◼   ► to touch it before everyone else I would

◼   ► have thought would have little impact on

◼   ► you I feel like you don't understand it

◼   ► all the joy that I'm getting out of this

◼   ► right it's not that I get to change it

◼   ► before other people do it's I want to

◼   ► pass it through my own evaluation filter

◼   ► as soon as possible so impatient you're

◼   ► impatient to see it ya know you use you

◼   ► don't me see you such funny words it's

◼   ► like I want to know if the thing is as

◼   ► good as they're saying it is but you are

◼   ► gonna find that out like you're gonna

◼   ► find that out whether you're at WWDC or

◼   ► not like you're gonna find out when it's

◼   ► in the shop if it's as good as they say

◼   ► it is yeah I just like to find out

◼   ► sooner it's fun to find out sooner

◼   ► hence my word impatient which I think

◼   ► was the ideal word for that to describe

◼   ► that I want to find out sooner I think

◼   ► yes but it somehow really when you use

◼   ► the words I feel like I have the shape

◼   ► of some like Brady thought in my mind

◼   ► which you seem to be expressing which

◼   ► doesn't match up with my own internal

◼   ► experience here because if I was in

◼   ► London still I don't think I'd be

◼   ► feeling like oh man I can't wait to see

◼   ► the thing like I got to get my hands on

◼   ► it I would just be waiting until it was

◼   ► available but if I can go to WWE word to

◼   ► use but maybe you're right maybe it is

◼   ► the best word in in this circumstance

◼   ► I mean WWDC like isn't that like fueled

◼   ► by impatience like people's enthusiasm

◼   ► to see the stuff as soon as humanly

◼   ► possible like that's why everyone's

◼   ► there I know there are the reasons like

◼   ► collaboration and you know the primary

◼   ► thing with WWDC is apples announcing all

◼   ► of their new software changes so that

◼   ► all of the developers who are there can

◼   ► get their apps ready for when the

◼   ► software is officially released like

◼   ► there has to be a big period of time

◼   ► between which Apple reveals here's all

◼   ► the new things we've been working on

◼   ► here all the changes that we've made you

◼   ► need to adapt all of your programs to

◼   ► work with this new paradigm like there

◼   ► has to be at least a several month gap

◼   ► before the time yeah before then apple

◼   ► says here we're now putting all of these

◼   ► changes on

◼   ► everybody's iPhone impatience isn't the

◼   ► correct word to describe that it's just

◼   ► like we need

◼   ► like we need

◼   ► buffer period where people can adapt

◼   ► their stuff to the new way things are

◼   ► going to work and that is why

◼   ► essentially everybody is at WWDC they

◼   ► want to find out what's happening and

◼   ► more importantly software developers can

◼   ► actually get in touch with people at

◼   ► Apple and ask them questions about how

◼   ► to change their software that's why I

◼   ► feel I always feel like really out of

◼   ► place you're the one guy there that

◼   ► wants to just touch an iPad before

◼   ► everyone oh yeah exactly

◼   ► everybody else is there for like serious

◼   ► business work and I'm they're going to

◼   ► let me look at the thing it's so that's

◼   ► why I don't it feels a bit funny to go

◼   ► but it it just so happens to have worked

◼   ► out in the past two years that WWDC

◼   ► combined with other things and family

◼   ► stuff it's worked out that I can roll it

◼   ► up into one gigantic ball of traveling

◼   ► for the summer it happens to have worked

◼   ► out this way but it's not the kind of

◼   ► thing like I wouldn't fly over only for

◼   ► WWDC most likely I need to like wrap it

◼   ► up in a whole bunch of other stuff to do

◼   ► because again I have no real reason to

◼   ► be there except in patients are they

◼   ► releasing anything that I should be

◼   ► excited about I would say the thing that

◼   ► you should be excited about is new iMac

◼   ► pros yeah I did hear there is one and it

◼   ► excites me I went to the Apple store

◼   ► today but obviously it wasn't there

◼   ► because I wanted to find out what it was

◼   ► all about but it's not coming out until

◼   ► much later in the year it's coming out

◼   ► in December supposedly but yes this is

◼   ► for you and I for the work that we do

◼   ► probably the machines that we should get

◼   ► and it's also very nice because they're

◼   ► making it in black which is nice instead

◼   ► of the silver co as a way to distinguish

◼   ► like this is their professional thing

◼   ► but yet it's coming out in a few months

◼   ► and I don't know about you but my iMac

◼   ► certainly could use a bit of horsepower

◼   ► update yeah when it comes to exporting

◼   ► videos and editing podcasts and all the

◼   ► rest of that differently please tell me

◼   ► it's gonna have like some ports in it

◼   ► please they're not gonna like just have

◼   ► like one hole in it for Apple stuff only

◼   ► like is it gonna have like am I gonna be

◼   ► able to plug stuff into it it's funny

◼   ► you mention that because I'm recording

◼   ► right now on my macbook pro which I

◼   ► brought with me for this trip and

◼   ► the lack of ports is just killing me

◼   ► setting it up today it's like I have

◼   ► four USB seaports but of course the

◼   ► microphone that I'm using isn't USB see

◼   ► it's USB a so I need to have an adapter

◼   ► and it's like all of the hard drives I

◼   ► have also need adapters and I'm sitting

◼   ► here over the past few weeks realizing

◼   ► like I don't have enough adapters to

◼   ► work with this thing and even when I

◼   ► went out and bought like a big bag full

◼   ► of adapters there's still only four

◼   ► ports and it's like I need to plug in

◼   ► more than four things when I'm doing

◼   ► professional work on the road and the

◼   ► lack of SD card slot is just killing me

◼   ► on this trip I just had this today I

◼   ► went to the mech store today and I was

◼   ► looking at the MacBook Pro and I was

◼   ► just like I was looking for an SD slot

◼   ► in it just then the lady from the shop

◼   ► came up to me and said can I help you

◼   ► and I basically this turned her and said

◼   ► you guys are having a laugh and walked

◼   ► off I was disenchanted I gotta say of

◼   ► all of the things that they've done okay

◼   ► switching to USB C ports I can get on

◼   ► board a train that's driving to the

◼   ► future fine right reducing the number of

◼   ► ports I guess I can live with it but

◼   ► cutting out the SD card slot so that you

◼   ► can pull footage off your camera fast

◼   ► like isn't that the definition of Pro

◼   ► like how is this not in the laptop it

◼   ► has killed me so many times on this trip

◼   ► it is such a pain in the butt to not

◼   ► have that I do know that the new Mac Pro

◼   ► does have USB C slots and has USB a

◼   ► slots and has thunderbolt slots I don't

◼   ► know if it has an SD card slot or not

◼   ► but it seems like they've reversed a

◼   ► little bit on their decision of we will

◼   ► just go with two beautiful USB C ports

◼   ► because how could you possibly ever need

◼   ► more so it does look like they're black

◼   ► I Mac Pro will actually have a bunch of

◼   ► slots but it kills me on this laptop

◼   ► like I swear to God if Apple released

◼   ► the exact same laptop and they only

◼   ► changed one thing they added an SD card

◼   ► like I would buy it because it's so

◼   ► important you reminded me with this s

◼   ► taste stuff because obviously you're

◼   ► taking photos on your trip what

◼   ► percentage of the photos that you take

◼   ► have you in them have you taken any

◼   ► photos with you in them okay I am going

◼   ► to estimate five

◼   ► sent of the photos I take have me in

◼   ► them oh that's more than I would have

◼   ► guessed there might be a real over

◼   ► estimate but here's the thing Brady the

◼   ► only reason that I take photographs with

◼   ► me in them is because I know that my

◼   ► parents and my wife vastly prefer

◼   ► photographs that have me in them versus

◼   ► just photographs of things which I can

◼   ► totally understand but if for some

◼   ► reason my family did not want

◼   ► photographs of what I'm up to I think I

◼   ► would have essentially 0 photographs

◼   ► with with myself in them I go a little

◼   ► bit back and forward on this because

◼   ► don't get me wrong like I love taking

◼   ► like a nice photo for the sake of just a

◼   ► photo but part of me does think like if

◼   ► you're not taking any pictures with you

◼   ► in them what's the point of taking a

◼   ► photo at all I guess like why not just

◼   ► like buy a postcard buy a photographer

◼   ► who would have taken a much better

◼   ► further from the same spot I don't agree

◼   ► with that I think there's something

◼   ► about taking a photograph of a spot that

◼   ► you have taken like obviously of course

◼   ► any any notable landmark of any kind if

◼   ► you go to there will exist better

◼   ► photographs of that thing but I think

◼   ► there's something kind of nice about

◼   ► taking a photograph yourself of a place

◼   ► even if it's not a as good of a

◼   ► photograph as it could possibly be I

◼   ► also think that if you go somewhere

◼   ► significant you should like take a photo

◼   ► of yourself there like it's kind of like

◼   ► your flag on the moon it's just like

◼   ► yeah I I was here you know I was there

◼   ► when you look back at it I've liked if

◼   ► you go somewhere really amazing and

◼   ► don't and have no photograph of yourself

◼   ► there I think you could regret it later

◼   ► I'm mentally running over my last 10

◼   ► years of taking photographs and I feel

◼   ► like I don't really regret not having

◼   ► photographs of me and any particular

◼   ► places I feel like I'm totally fine with

◼   ► a photograph of the thing but it is

◼   ► mostly that other people are much less

◼   ► fine with solely photographs of things

◼   ► they want photographs of people which is

◼   ► completely understandable in further fun

◼   ► election news we have another election

◼   ► that took place recently and this was

◼   ► the Puerto Rican referendum on whether

◼   ► or not

◼   ► Puerto Rico should become a state of the

◼   ► United States

◼   ► raaah Puerto Rico has existed for a very

◼   ► long time in this in-between land

◼   ► as a territory and the US has this very

◼   ► strange system of territories which was

◼   ► obviously designed for the 1800s when

◼   ► America was adding a whole bunch of

◼   ► states and was not intended to be a

◼   ► thing that would just go on forever but

◼   ► Puerto Rico has ended up being a

◼   ► territory for a very very long time

◼   ► and there has been a debate for ages

◼   ► about whether or not Puerto Rico should

◼   ► become a state of the United States if

◼   ► it should become an independent country

◼   ► of its own or if it should enter into

◼   ► what is called free association with the

◼   ► United States which is I guess you could

◼   ► describe it as independence light where

◼   ► it is functionally an independent

◼   ► country but a bit under the aegis of the

◼   ► United States these are the options that

◼   ► have been open to Puerto Rico and they

◼   ► just recently had a referendum on it and

◼   ► Puerto Rico has voted for full statehood

◼   ► as the option that they wish to pursue

◼   ► all right there are a few things coming

◼   ► to mind and a few things to talk about

◼   ► that you're going to want to talk about

◼   ► but just to start me off here you're

◼   ► talking as if this is entirely their

◼   ► decision which I find hard to believe

◼   ► like there's a there's a whole other

◼   ► party here isn't there which is the

◼   ► other 50 states it's not just their

◼   ► decision is it's not like you and I

◼   ► could decide we want to form a state of

◼   ► the United States and vote on it and

◼   ► then tell them right all right we're in

◼   ► this is the beginning of even under the

◼   ► best of circumstances what would be a

◼   ► very long dance between Puerto Rico and

◼   ► and the United States

◼   ► I don't know offhand what the exact

◼   ► procedure is but yeah it is not the case

◼   ► that if Puerto Rico decides that it

◼   ► wants to be a state that it is just

◼   ► immediately accepted into the Union

◼   ► given its status as a territory right so

◼   ► given that is a known thing I assume

◼   ► polling been done but I don't know

◼   ► whether it's that this is a common

◼   ► knowledge or not is it a well known

◼   ► thing how the greater body of the United

◼   ► States feels about this like do most

◼   ► people think yeah let him in order most

◼   ► people think no way we don't want to

◼   ► like what's the general temperature of

◼   ► the United States in in relation to this

◼   ► I have never seen any polling data on it

◼   ► I

◼   ► would be curious but I would bet that if

◼   ► you asked Americans about Puerto Rico

◼   ► you would only get one of two answers

◼   ► and it would be people who think it is a

◼   ► separate country and people who think it

◼   ► is already a state in the United States

◼   ► no I would wager an enormous amount of

◼   ► money on that that most people would not

◼   ► be able to answer that Puerto Rico is a

◼   ► territory of the United States right

◼   ► most continental citizens yeah I agree

◼   ► with part one of what you said I just

◼   ► cannot believe part two I cannot believe

◼   ► you could find people who think Puerto

◼   ► Rico is one of the 50 states you always

◼   ► have such a high opinion of people Brady

◼   ► I find it really charming it's like I

◼   ► know too many things about how people in

◼   ► New Mexico have a hard time getting

◼   ► deliveries to New Mexico in the United

◼   ► States like I've run across too much of

◼   ► this stuff where people just don't

◼   ► understand what the states are I'm not

◼   ► even confident that more than 75% of

◼   ► adult Americans would know that there

◼   ► are 50 states exactly I've run into

◼   ► people who are like oh it's 52 states

◼   ► isn't it for some reason like this seems

◼   ► to be a number that lodges in people's

◼   ► heads I can see where that confusion

◼   ► comes from but yeah okay so that's why I

◼   ► would be very willing to bet that most

◼   ► Americans think it is already a state or

◼   ► think it is a separate country and just

◼   ► don't really have any opinion on this

◼   ► matter at all but what I think is a

◼   ► really really interesting snag in this

◼   ► because because as we said like this is

◼   ► going to start a dance between Puerto

◼   ► Rico and the United States but just I

◼   ► think there's interesting parallels with

◼   ► this to brexit because just like the

◼   ► brexit turnout was lower than expected

◼   ► the voter turnout in the Puerto Rican

◼   ► referendum was hilariously low 23% of

◼   ► the population turned out to vote in

◼   ► this referendum that seems to me just

◼   ► like a real snag perhaps in this because

◼   ► again it's like a non-binding referendum

◼   ► but I feel like it is really hard to

◼   ► call that a clear victory that Puerto

◼   ► Ricans want to become an official state

◼   ► in the United States when only 23% of

◼   ► people turned out to vote in the actual

◼   ► referendum

◼   ► I mean I'm no expert on this I've only

◼   ► read one article about the story at all

◼   ► but in that article I did read two

◼   ► important pieces of information that

◼   ► feed into that though one is they have

◼   ► voted on this before yes yeah it's not

◼   ► the first time yeah and the second thing

◼   ► is this particular election was unique

◼   ► because there was this like call for a

◼   ► boycott like there was a political

◼   ► reason for that low turnout it wasn't

◼   ► that people don't care and things that

◼   ► was like the low turnout it was in

◼   ► itself part of the the politics of it

◼   ► that's exactly right that I didn't

◼   ► follow the exact details of it but the

◼   ► two other major parties and options

◼   ► boycotted the referendum which when you

◼   ► look at the voter turnout makes it even

◼   ► more hilarious because 23 percent of the

◼   ► people showed up to vote but of those 23

◼   ► percent who showed up to vote 97 percent

◼   ► of them voted for state it is like okay

◼   ► this is not any kind of normal election