The Incomparable

165: Grieving for My Left Thumb


  the incomparable number 165 october2013 [TS]

  welcome back to be uncomfortable i'm [TS]

  your host Jason still and in this [TS]

  episode we're going to be talking about [TS]

  video games i have assigned the member [TS]

  is my esteemed panel panelists two games [TS]

  to play [TS]

  it's a tough job that's podcasting [TS]

  business playing games were assigned to [TS]

  you and we're going to talk about the [TS]

  two games and who knows where it will [TS]

  lead I don't play video games i don't [TS]

  know what i'm talking about here but [TS]

  these guys do and first up that laughter [TS]

  you heard there that Steve let's see [TS]

  let's have been known to play a video [TS]

  game or two in his time hi Steve [TS]

  I do play from time to time yes Jason [TS]

  and good evening to you [TS]

  good evening Dan Morgan is also here [TS]

  known to play video games in his sleep [TS]

  even he loves them so much that's a lie [TS]

  i know it's probably true [TS]

  yeah hi hi hi jason and i forget i [TS]

  forgot my niceties I'm too busy playing [TS]

  a videogame to talk to you [TS]

  that's a lie is your new hello very nice [TS]

  video gamers not well known for their [TS]

  social skills section I will murder us [TS]

  Tony sindelar is also here he has [TS]

  excellent social skills and there's a [TS]

  very polite fellow Tony hi jason i play [TS]

  too many video games but i'm here to [TS]

  talk about them and sell the truth but [TS]

  we can always make this an intervention [TS]

  it maybe I and we're all here gathered [TS]

  to intervene in the life of our the man [TS]

  whose life has been crippled by his [TS]

  video game addiction John siracusa hi [TS]

  John [TS]

  actually I'm in the dam or enroll in [TS]

  that I just finished the last game last [TS]

  night who did not attend tomorrow like [TS]

  we doing it is doing and fishing right [TS]

  now I will confess i finished one of [TS]

  them today I think I saw one of them [TS]

  today too man i don't like thursday guys [TS]

  right with hell you been at [TS]

  I was on the west coast life is [TS]

  different there whatever you know [TS]

  well these we all finished it unlike [TS]

  some other pot episodes of the in [TS]

  cumberland which participants didn't [TS]

  routers finish the entire it's a review [TS]

  of the first eighty percent just wrong [TS]

  I mean that's actually how a lot of game [TS]

  reviewers doing the play-by-play 10 [TS]

  hours [TS]

  here's what my thoughts are mhm yes some [TS]

  kind of chat room that we're not [TS]

  streaming to said he played the first 20 [TS]

  minutes and that's what that's enough [TS]

  for him tons yeah I don't know this game [TS]

  to get that game took some radical turn [TS]

  to our game and you can finish it come [TS]

  up i don't want people that I only like [TS]

  the first date [TS]

  the star wars and those are the best [TS]

  minutes i'm not looking at a Star [TS]

  Destroyer what's the point yeah all [TS]

  downhill after that really alright so to [TS]

  talk about two games brothers a tale of [TS]

  two sons which these are both games that [TS]

  came out this year brothers a tale of [TS]

  two sons and gone home for these two [TS]

  games and I played what I played gone [TS]

  home a little while ago and then I [TS]

  finished brothers today and we should [TS]

  talk about the both i don't i'm not sure [TS]

  if there's a link between the mother [TS]

  than these are both sort of like [TS]

  critical darlings I think in some ways [TS]

  i've heard people talk about them on [TS]

  release and praise them highly and when [TS]

  I said that I had finished playing gone [TS]

  home everybody immediately said you [TS]

  should play brothers and I do what I'm [TS]

  told on the internet so I i played [TS]

  brothers too [TS]

  well they're both short games which is [TS]

  interesting like this is a yes kind of a [TS]

  new genre that I kind of dig which is [TS]

  like games that you can play in one or [TS]

  two sittings games are always do like [TS]

  GTA or something you know grant thought [TS]

  or something let's say huge and [TS]

  sprawling an epic that's like you know [TS]

  when they measure it like this game will [TS]

  take you 30 hours to complete and kind [TS]

  of kind of dig ya on the other hand i [TS]

  would argue that these are almost both [TS]

  not games in the there's not a whole lot [TS]

  of actual gameplay at him [TS]

  what are they then what are no neasden [TS]

  Steve I don't know there's a line [TS]

  somewhere the college's define games and [TS]

  say what is really boring i just like to [TS]

  thank them more and for going back and [TS]

  explain what GTA stood for things like [TS]

  hugs find they are i don't know who are [TS]

  excellent he just said that an epic game [TS]

  is 30 hours long so is already losing [TS]

  credit fast [TS]

  I'm i meant double digits but there's a [TS]

  lot of hate already here i'll agree with [TS]

  you Justice with journey which I one of [TS]

  the motivating factors that I had for [TS]

  playing of course was that john loves [TS]

  journey but one of the things he said [TS]

  about it he especially loves by the way [TS]

  their their seminal album brace on radio [TS]

  anyway the john loves journey but he [TS]

  said it only takes like three hours to [TS]

  play it's like watching a movie at two [TS]

  hours your life movie and that's how to [TS]

  classify the genre like now people [TS]

  either of these into [TS]

  you know just like two-and-a-half hours [TS]

  play journey but the point the point is [TS]

  that for somebody like me who had who [TS]

  has bought lots of video games over the [TS]

  years and has never finish to any of [TS]

  them [TS]

  I loved the idea that I could play [TS]

  through this whole story and and and get [TS]

  to the end and I wanted to keep playing [TS]

  and find all the little gems and get all [TS]

  the little trophies i could do that but [TS]

  i didn't have to and those these two [TS]

  games felt that way to obviously they're [TS]

  small and self-contained and I and I [TS]

  didn't get that feeling of frustration [TS]

  like you know I'm never gonna play [TS]

  through this whole story because i'm not [TS]

  going to invest 40 hours in the game [TS]

  because i just i'm just not it's not [TS]

  ever gonna happen in my life I did [TS]

  appreciate the fact that neither of [TS]

  these games had collectibles which is [TS]

  something that is increasingly driving [TS]

  me nuts with games got way too much of [TS]

  an OCD touch to avoid actually trying to [TS]

  get everything although I never succeed [TS]

  and that just makes me feel sad it's [TS]

  just a way for them to pad out the game [TS]

  so they can have those huge our accounts [TS]

  and right and and they only did that [TS]

  because they've they felt like it did [TS]

  they ever get slammed by consumers if [TS]

  they didn't like they felt pressure to [TS]

  gain people's like oh we're gonna put [TS]

  out a game and we have a story to tell [TS]

  that story takes about two hours to play [TS]

  but that's not long enough for it's not [TS]

  viable as a product for us LOL game like [TS]

  that so we have to add stuff like stupid [TS]

  collectibles and barriers and then [TS]

  finally in the past few years like you [TS]

  know what if we don't add that people [TS]

  actually like the game even better and [TS]

  so that's what this new market of you [TS]

  know two-hour-long games it's not just [TS]

  the saleable part of like you know at [TS]

  all it's the like we you know the true a [TS]

  title cost 60 bucks right or something [TS]

  like that you know 50 60 bucks i mean [TS]

  people will feel like hey why I can get [TS]

  a movie you know I can watch a movie for [TS]

  like ten dollars that takes up two hours [TS]

  i'm going to play a game that costs [TS]

  sixty dollars better take me longer than [TS]

  two hours right like you get this value [TS]

  equivalency I don't want to tell you how [TS]

  much I want to pay to play journey but [TS]

  like at a certain point differential own [TS]

  energy was really on the stoop [TS]

  especially with the average age of [TS]

  gamers now like up in the thirties or [TS]

  whatever it is a certain point it [TS]

  becomes more valuable to you to get [TS]

  something that you can complete in the [TS]

  amount of time that you would spend on a [TS]

  movie like that that you would pay more [TS]

  than you would if you know i still play [TS]

  games like the other were you know me [TS]

  and my son and putting like 85 hours [TS]

  into a zelda game but I know what I'm [TS]

  getting there and then [TS]

  I'm arguably getting more of my money [TS]

  and my sixty dollars worth out of that [TS]

  then i get $15 into this but i will [TS]

  gladly pay fifteen dollars for a great [TS]

  to our game any day [TS]

  yeah alright let's get started let's [TS]

  talk about gone home which is from the [TS]

  Fulbright company came out is this [TS]

  summer i want to say and it runs it's on [TS]

  it's available on steam it runs on [TS]

  windows mac and linux i played on my [TS]

  macbook air on a foggy cold of summer [TS]

  day at san francisco and this is a this [TS]

  is a first-person game that it really [TS]

  sets you up to be that it's going to be [TS]

  kind of a horror story because it starts [TS]

  off as a dark and stormy night and you [TS]

  are you are a young woman named caitlin [TS]

  who returns home although her family has [TS]

  since she's been in Europe studying [TS]

  abroad she's a they moved to a new house [TS]

  and it's a big house and it's a dark and [TS]

  stormy night and the implication is that [TS]

  there might be something scary going on [TS]

  in there because you're playing a video [TS]

  game and of course that would be what [TS]

  you'd expect but regardless of the of [TS]

  the story what what you find out when [TS]

  Kaitlyn arrives at the front door is [TS]

  that there is nobody in the house and [TS]

  the rest of gamma gone home is [TS]

  essentially Caitlin investigating this [TS]

  house that she's never been in which is [TS]

  good because we've never been in it [TS]

  either and trying to figure out what's [TS]

  going on and what everybody's been doing [TS]

  and why there's nobody there [TS]

  does that sound about right more or less [TS]

  it's charmingly set in the 1995 so [TS]

  there's there's lots of light and [TS]

  written notes and and and answering [TS]

  machine messages and things like that [TS]

  people don't have you know you're not [TS]

  looking at people's text messages or [TS]

  emails but right if you have a [TS]

  smartphone you would have just called [TS]

  like family right [TS]

  this game is this game doesn't work if [TS]

  you have a smartphone so how many people [TS]

  knew anything about this game going in [TS]

  jason said right you you said you [TS]

  thought it would be like a haunted house [TS]

  but did you really did you know anything [TS]

  about it I knew that it took place in a [TS]

  house [TS]

  yeah I avoided most stuff I knew [TS]

  somebody said that it was affecting and [TS]

  that it was not like most games but I [TS]

  knew no details other than that it was [TS]

  said in this house that was [TS]

  that was it yeah I really expected in [TS]

  some ways something that as we will get [TS]

  into was not in this key but the spoiler [TS]

  horn should go off here because you're [TS]

  right it is time let's let's yes let's [TS]

  fire off 44 gone home work firing off a [TS]

  spoiler horn and please come back if if [TS]

  you want to listen to to us talk about [TS]

  brothers but for this next interval here [TS]

  it comes I hear it coming [TS]

  no I kept waiting you know you're [TS]

  creeping around corners and I turned on [TS]

  you can turn on the lights as you go and [TS]

  normally in my life you know i turn the [TS]

  light on my turn the light off and I [TS]

  kind of moved from the house but it's [TS]

  not a game [TS]

  don't we all and your light off is what [TS]

  like me I mean that's one of the most [TS]

  successful things about it for my mind [TS]

  like I remember coming home to me like a [TS]

  house late at night when I was like a [TS]

  teenager and you know my parents are out [TS]

  of town or something and it's like yeah [TS]

  when turn on every light in this house [TS]

  yeah it's gonna be the best thing in the [TS]

  game the best joke in the whole game is [TS]

  where you come upon the cork board with [TS]

  the note to the other daughter and the [TS]

  dad is saying starting the lights on in [TS]

  the house that decision you are of [TS]

  course that sister [TS]

  yeah i'm spending the last 20 minutes of [TS]

  turning on all the lights in the house [TS]

  every single light switch in that house [TS]

  lies on the mat room all the red herring [TS]

  stuff like the X file tapes in the you [TS]

  know living room and all this that I'd [TS]

  like it starts leading you down these [TS]

  paths of thinking it's going to be oh [TS]

  it's gonna be this kind of story and [TS]

  yeah there are so many applicable tropes [TS]

  that they didn't do anything Jason [TS]

  mentioned haunted house but the other [TS]

  ones that i had my mind from playing [TS]

  other video games with a sampler like [TS]

  premises you know unreliable narrator [TS]

  this suicide factor psycho killer any [TS]

  number of the family members a psycho [TS]

  killer body snatchers aliens like there [TS]

  are so many possible during travel ago [TS]

  that you played games exactly like this [TS]

  that when those directions and the great [TS]

  thing about this game is one that [TS]

  doesn't go in those directions but to [TS]

  that it has the playfulness to make [TS]

  faints and almost all those directions [TS]

  at various points so until it settles in [TS]

  until you're totally convinced you could [TS]

  be like alright but they're trying to [TS]

  take me out you know and they do a [TS]

  couple of fake outs like I mean I guess [TS]

  yeah there's a creepy neighbor the [TS]

  psycho house I got to admit that none of [TS]

  that none of the sort of creepy stuff [TS]

  really work for me unfortunately because [TS]

  i would have loved if it had but i don't [TS]

  know maybe i just played far too many of [TS]

  those kinds of games but it never really [TS]

  felt like it was committing in that [TS]

  direction for me [TS]

  well I didn't it's not supposed to be [TS]

  the nothing nothing jumps out and scares [TS]

  you in this game like there's no zombie [TS]

  behind a door there's no you know scary [TS]

  moment a cat does not race across the [TS]

  floor like it that it doesn't do that [TS]

  the only thing that was the closest [TS]

  thing to scare factor is when you're [TS]

  when you're in the first secret passage [TS]

  in the light flickers out for a second [TS]

  and that's that's a good moment but [TS]

  other than that I it i never felt like [TS]

  it was going to take a turn anywhere [TS]

  other than where it did he is [TS]

  re completely because I my experience [TS]

  was very different i played the first [TS]

  half of this on a plane and let me tell [TS]

  you like if you want the full like [TS]

  force-feedback experience when you're [TS]

  like creeping out like a hallway and [TS]

  turning the lights on and you go into a [TS]

  dark room and then your entire plane [TS]

  like it was like a turbulence tip you [TS]

  like okay I gotta stop playing this game [TS]

  thank me out [TS]

  no I did I did play this game in total [TS]

  darkness the new is gonna be one of [TS]

  those types of games are turned off all [TS]

  the lights and everything but I'm like [TS]

  I'm I'm affected by creepiness in mood [TS]

  and everything but mostly what got me in [TS]

  this game with things where they would [TS]

  in a certain point that I had realized [TS]

  it's not going to go in all these [TS]

  different direction right it's gonna be [TS]

  straightforward but then they do things [TS]

  like the like the red hair dye in the [TS]

  bathtub you have got that was facing [TS]

  that direction or even things like you [TS]

  know the Attic with the red lights in [TS]

  the Attic even at that point i'd know [TS]

  it's not gonna be that kind of story but [TS]

  I'm still a little weird and the most [TS]

  for the flickering lights from the TV [TS]

  room when you first yeah and you know [TS]

  and the thing the thing that got me is [TS]

  when I came home the most was at a [TS]

  certain point you open up one of the [TS]

  secret passages and you get know you [TS]

  think you're down to the basement or [TS]

  something yeah basement is really dark [TS]

  and there were candles and began any [TS]

  game with candles like I you know I [TS]

  stopped I went back I got a candle i [TS]

  went to get a match to light the candle [TS]

  but there are no matches in the [TS]

  matchbook and I'm like what am i doing [TS]

  and you can't use anything on anything [TS]

  else anyway so it was a bit of a fluid [TS]

  is not making progress in the game [TS]

  basically because I didn't want to go [TS]

  down into the dark basement because yeah [TS]

  one department is like being a gamer [TS]

  it's like look they have candles this [TS]

  guy i don't know whether to be impressed [TS]

  with the game or just sad for you well [TS]

  know because like the part of the gamers [TS]

  things I'm I kept looking for you know [TS]

  use X on Y like text adventure type type [TS]

  stuff like that it was kind of a little [TS]

  bit ly none of it was important to the [TS]

  gameplay and I figured these candles are [TS]

  here like it was the curse of this game [TS]

  if you're a gamer so many things were [TS]

  interactive that didn't need to be that [TS]

  I think that is a pretty fair critique [TS]

  their there's all its really again it is [TS]

  it a game it's more of this kind of [TS]

  mildly interactive experience there's [TS]

  always things that look like maybe it [TS]

  should be a puzzle but they're not right [TS]

  and even other kind of the secrets that [TS]

  you find the secret passageways and the [TS]

  panels and things like that you can [TS]

  actually find those and open those [TS]

  before the game tells you to which a lot [TS]

  of other games you wouldn't write like [TS]

  the parent wouldn't be movable until you [TS]

  found the note that says it i mean [TS]

  theoretically i looked at it afterward [TS]

  you could beat this game in three [TS]

  minutes if you click on the right [TS]

  stuff you have no idea what's going on [TS]

  but but you could kind of jump around [TS]

  without being directed where stuff is [TS]

  I did a little bit of it out of order to [TS]

  actually realize toward the end that [TS]

  there was one portion that I had to go [TS]

  there was a little corner of the [TS]

  downstairs that I hadn't covered and so [TS]

  there was something that didn't make any [TS]

  sense and i realized i needed to go and [TS]

  I have to go back downstairs and over [TS]

  the laundry room and then there was a [TS]

  whole little threat over there that [TS]

  opened up a few things and then I could [TS]

  finally go and resolve the rest of the [TS]

  game because i just happened to do it [TS]

  out of order and that was fine [TS]

  sure well Steve must have done like the [TS]

  completionist about the collectibles and [TS]

  stuff like I'm total i've added the [TS]

  gamers or two I did like hundred percent [TS]

  completion exhaustive search of every [TS]

  rock and cranny and i feel like i did [TS]

  the game exactly the order that the [TS]

  Gamemakers intended you to do because [TS]

  it's the water that a gamer would do [TS]

  like go in you know it maybe I took a [TS]

  left instead of right first or whatever [TS]

  but I swept this game from beginning to [TS]

  end and i don't think i mislike a single [TS]

  thing and it makes for a very coherent [TS]

  story like a reasonably good short story [TS]

  but you can I if if this I didn't [TS]

  realize the panels would be openable I'm [TS]

  gonna get you could totally break the [TS]

  story which is racing up in the wrong [TS]

  place at the lot of material and I think [TS]

  you know you can even mix you can [TS]

  experience stuff and kind of strange [TS]

  order i mean the answering machine right [TS]

  in the front hall has the voicemail from [TS]

  Lonni on it and you don't know who you [TS]

  are is yeah that's I assumed I was [TS]

  intended i don't know i mean i think [TS]

  it's i think it's intended to work [TS]

  either way [TS]

  yeah that was one of the first things i [TS]

  hit was this the answering machine yeah [TS]

  they know what's going to write to that [TS]

  I think there is an argument about [TS]

  whether or not is there in order and [TS]

  there are differences that I i canna [TS]

  you're not endorsed on Rails I don't [TS]

  know there's a cool there's a clear [TS]

  order and additionally there are [TS]

  organized by date speak but you don't [TS]

  experience them necessarily are they [TS]

  specifically tied two locations or they [TS]

  do they cross the Marzano they are they [TS]

  are tied to locations i can say this [TS]

  definitely because i had an inventory [TS]

  items as well but you don't have to pick [TS]

  up all them i had to restart after about [TS]

  an hour and a half of play time because [TS]

  it ate my save game for some reason and [TS]

  actually initially i usually I [TS]

  appreciate the fact that you have more [TS]

  options open to you can try things in a [TS]

  different way and the first time i [TS]

  played actually went up the stairs first [TS]

  because their lights on up there and I [TS]

  thought well if I was walking in and I [TS]

  was looking for people who are home [TS]

  we're gonna go i'm gonna go where the [TS]

  lights are clearly on [TS]

  so I headed up the stairs and I kind of [TS]

  did things a little out of order and it [TS]

  was it was still pretty clear what the [TS]

  narrative was that was forming there but [TS]

  when i restarted it I I realize you know [TS]

  it's very clear that they want this to [TS]

  be done in a certain order for it to [TS]

  make the right kind of sense you know [TS]

  for you really appreciate the story [TS]

  properly and i actually found it kind of [TS]

  annoying that i was allowed to take the [TS]

  the alternate route because I wanted I [TS]

  this game is so clearly about telling a [TS]

  story and I wanted to be told the story [TS]

  the way it was supposed to be told as [TS]

  opposed to getting it piecemeal it's the [TS]

  locked doors and lack of information [TS]

  that's trying to put your along a linear [TS]

  path and so I don't for making the [TS]

  panel's movable unlock doors really like [TS]

  look regal or a little a little [TS]

  exploration here but we don't want [TS]

  people to totally break the game and if [TS]

  you don't know about the panel's the [TS]

  odds of you and going lighter [TS]

  environments like every single panel i [TS]

  mean i was picking those I was being [TS]

  completionist but I was doing it mostly [TS]

  with items that i thought would be [TS]

  interactive and I was getting frustrated [TS]

  because like every single soda can and [TS]

  potato chip bags interactive and [TS]

  single-handed box i looked in every side [TS]

  of like a certain point you realize this [TS]

  isn't resident evil I don't need to turn [TS]

  every item over to make sure there's not [TS]

  a lot I can be on the bottom that opens [TS]

  up there reveals a key you know it but [TS]

  once I broke myself those habits i still [TS]

  found myself picking on Adams that new [TS]

  probably wouldn't be worth it you know [TS]

  right it's just it's it's a hard habit [TS]

  to break but just throwing cans all of [TS]

  that kind of it's kind of like it's kind [TS]

  of like a journey where if you play the [TS]

  game over and over again which I have [TS]

  you see the parts where you can break [TS]

  out of it but my first run-through of [TS]

  journey I felt like I was exactly like [TS]

  me and the game designers were exactly [TS]

  you know in sync and everything was [TS]

  happening the right time and gone home [TS]

  did that a few times because i think i [TS]

  followed the linear path and also the [TS]

  journals which are either location or [TS]

  item-based triggered sometimes like [TS]

  they'd be fighting because I'd like a [TS]

  tape that I was playing and then like [TS]

  the journal would play with Jessica and [TS]

  they would fight with each other and [TS]

  that wasn't good but like others music [TS]

  yeah one or two times though the the [TS]

  journal start playing at just the right [TS]

  moment and made a very cinematic [TS]

  experience like I think was one of the [TS]

  last journal things was playing as I was [TS]

  racing up to the attic for like that [TS]

  yeah the final anything like that right [TS]

  that sometimes it really worked anybody [TS]

  really worked it was great and it's [TS]

  difficult to pull it off it's like you [TS]

  know it's like my favorite a recall [TS]

  Fincher movie the game where when [TS]

  everything comes together and i'll [TS]

  answer on the X in the air bag with the [TS]

  revelation happening [TS]

  like it's really difficult to do that in [TS]

  real life and so that's what this game [TS]

  makers are trying to do is trying to [TS]

  give you a game where they arranged it [TS]

  all for you to have some sort of [TS]

  experience revelation but also make you [TS]

  feel like you are free acting individual [TS]

  the entire time that I think that's the [TS]

  interesting thing about you have freedom [TS]

  you know you you unlock one of the [TS]

  journals and you start hearing your [TS]

  sister talk to you and it's you stand [TS]

  there and listen the whole time do you [TS]

  keep continue searching the room do you [TS]

  walk down the spooky whore corridor well [TS]

  well she continues to talk to you about [TS]

  something and you know it's not like [TS]

  you're on Rails this is what you're [TS]

  going to experience right [TS]

  I couldn't stand the thought that I was [TS]

  gonna miss it so i had to stand there [TS]

  listed all things and I'm gonna go back [TS]

  I mean I finish the story i went back [TS]

  and saw because there's kind of three [TS]

  locked areas you can get into one that [TS]

  you have to advance the story and I [TS]

  figured out how to get the other two [TS]

  which you don't have to and could I [TS]

  guess proceed push presumably you could [TS]

  open the safe in the basement or the [TS]

  locked file cabinet in the office [TS]

  without you can complete the story [TS]

  without doing that but you miss out on [TS]

  kind of bits of it but you know I [TS]

  checked I didn't find all the journals [TS]

  and i finished the story so you know [TS]

  I've got the first and I've got the end [TS]

  and there's a lot of stuff in the middle [TS]

  that you have to find progress but [TS]

  there's clearly other stuff that you [TS]

  don't have to find a progress [TS]

  alright a brief cutscene inserted in [TS]

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  you thirty percent off thirty percent [TS]

  off what everything thirty percent off [TS]

  everything when you do the code smells [TS]

  sent me 10 and thank you to [TS] for sponsoring the [TS]

  incomparable let's talk about the actual [TS]

  story though because like the story of [TS]

  this is kind of is not lost ask us just [TS]

  the thing i always think of when like [TS]

  every character in the story has a thing [TS]

  about right like what and obviously the [TS]

  central thing is the sisters deal and [TS]

  you're trying to share what is this is [TS]

  Lucille but every member of this family [TS]

  has a problem and I don't know like I [TS]

  guess that's is it realistic i don't [TS]

  know i felt like if they had [TS]

  concentrated more on under the sisters [TS]

  story and distracted me less with items [TS]

  throughout the house and let me learn [TS]

  what every other person's problem is [TS]

  never any other things I didn't learn [TS]

  what my problem is as the heat up that I [TS]

  apparently I'm happy off in your blanket [TS]

  around right now you are you're kind of [TS]

  a boring person actually can be compared [TS]

  to everyone else of the mothers is gone [TS]

  with the forestry guy and the fathers [TS]

  who is like you know i'm potentially [TS]

  ripping off Stephen King a decade [TS]

  earlier with this 1963 book and he's got [TS]

  that I was thinking picturing the file [TS]

  like cigarette smoking man sending a [TS]

  science-fiction stories in and trying to [TS]

  get them you know and doing stereo [TS]

  reviews and going crazy and the crazy [TS]

  uncle like everyone's got some backstory [TS]

  that itself would make a game [TS]

  yeah but your backstories youryour [TS]

  apparently the perfect daughter you know [TS]

  I imagine Caitlyn has all sorts of [TS]

  stories to tell about Europe but [TS]

  unfortunately she's got to deal with her [TS]

  messed-up family first [TS]

  or maybe her story is about running away [TS]

  from all that right yeah maybe so i [TS]

  don't know I kept finding was with [TS]

  trophies and first-place ribbons and I [TS]

  kept thinking man Lester she's the [TS]

  perfect daughter [TS]

  yeah I must really made it rough on the [TS]

  younger sister and [TS]

  someone has a 3 bring binder fetish i [TS]

  guess that's what I'm saying everyone's [TS]

  people are single-handedly keeping the [TS]

  Portland three-ring binder and portable [TS]

  tape player industries in business [TS]

  because there's binders everywhere [TS]

  everywhere and they have at least 70 [TS]

  players mi only one who kept trying to [TS]

  turn that tape over and play the other [TS]

  side yeah i know i was driving me nuts [TS]

  I'd like to turn things around spent i [TS]

  pry spent more time in the game flipping [TS]

  the cassette holder so i could see [TS]

  inside inside yeah then I did anywhere [TS]

  else in the game but i really enjoyed [TS]

  that I enjoyed that I mean that they're [TS]

  the one of the things that works about [TS]

  this game for me is it is yes in the [TS]

  story or the you're the daughter who's [TS]

  trying to figure out what's going on but [TS]

  in that on that second level your this [TS]

  boy are you are walking through these [TS]

  people's lives trying to or you're the [TS]

  detective if you want to look at it that [TS]

  way you're walking through these [TS]

  people's lives trying to figure out from [TS]

  all of these found items what the heck [TS]

  is going on and you discovered like John [TS]

  said you discovered that it's not just [TS]

  this main story about about the the [TS]

  younger daughter [TS]

  it's also the story about the mother and [TS]

  the father and and what's going on with [TS]

  them in his writing career and-and and [TS]

  their their marriage is approval from as [TS]

  a his father [TS]

  yeah oh yes yeah exactly i think it does [TS]

  a very nice job at kind of making that [TS]

  feeling unsettling experience right like [TS]

  it first you kind of feels like you're [TS]

  going through and you're like you're [TS]

  trying to solve this mystery of what [TS]

  happened to people and as you kind of [TS]

  find out for example that you know the [TS]

  the answer to where your mother and [TS]

  father is you know somewhat mundane you [TS]

  know they're not dead or you know or or [TS]

  lost [TS]

  no but they're in couples counseling [TS]

  different couples counseling but you now [TS]

  feel unsettled right i mean you kind of [TS]

  think that you know you're going through [TS]

  other their you know their laundry and [TS]

  whatnot because you're worried about [TS]

  them and you try to find out their [TS]

  location and you end up kind of finding [TS]

  more than perhaps you were entitled to [TS]

  find somebody that like that part works [TS]

  with you being part of the family but as [TS]

  that as the journals later say it's like [TS]

  all you always know about me right Kate [TS]

  little maybe the Caitlyn did but I you [TS]

  know we didn't as the game player so [TS]

  there's an assume familiarity like the [TS]

  actual Caitlyn would know more than we [TS]

  do which is bad in the beginning but [TS]

  towards the end if you start to identify [TS]

  with her then you're a little bit [TS]

  freaked out that this is court your [TS]

  family that had [TS]

  these problems and maybe you didn't know [TS]

  about them before so that I do like the [TS]

  fact that midway through your thinking [TS]

  while this whole family has gone [TS]

  completely to hell yeah and if you [TS]

  figure God may be that the little sister [TS]

  swinging in the attic and deb with the [TS]

  wife mom is out with the Ranger Rick you [TS]

  know I'm the forest some dad is not as a [TS]

  bunch of people you know what that is [TS]

  yet the bottom of a bottle somewhere it [TS]

  may be walking around in the basement [TS]

  and then and then in the end it turns [TS]

  out everything's kind of turned out okay [TS]

  with order which is cool [TS]

  it's just that it's just the horror of [TS]

  everyday life Steve yeah more or less [TS]

  I was dreading going up into that attic [TS]

  I mean when I first walked down that [TS]

  hallway and there were the red lights [TS]

  that I was like nope gonna get every [TS]

  other room before I there [TS]

  oh I think Steve's point about the the [TS]

  hair dye one that one yeah because i [TS]

  just got to that point where I felt like [TS]

  all right I kind of know what's going on [TS]

  me you fucking looking and there's the [TS]

  red stain all over the top and you're [TS]

  like oh my god what happened to you and [TS]

  then you see the box of hair dye and [TS]

  it's like uh okay and I you know I [TS]

  wasn't sure also in terms of the idea [TS]

  that there are the dates have their own [TS]

  little story going on with the different [TS]

  parts of the family [TS]

  um you know in some ways that was a [TS]

  little distracting I wondered if they [TS]

  were supposed to be a thing where they [TS]

  kind of fit together in some way I mean [TS]

  there's its kind of its they leave it it [TS]

  seems like somewhat unclear what the the [TS]

  father's big issues from his traumatic [TS]

  childhood experience but you know does [TS]

  that play into the complications and in [TS]

  his relationship with your sister then [TS]

  in terms of her his unwillingness to you [TS]

  know basically tolerate her behavior so [TS]

  i wasn't sure if there was an attempt to [TS]

  kind of attach these two things together [TS]

  in terms of how the stories 50 million [TS]

  but the parents are not approving of the [TS]

  sister-like show they're there and so I [TS]

  don't know how it's not a happy ending [TS]

  because the parents haven't come to [TS]

  terms that she has run away and I guess [TS]

  it's happy for her kind of but you as a [TS]

  sister like well now my family has [TS]

  exploded live in common right we should [TS]

  we should say I think we did mention [TS]

  that so what we did what we discover and [TS]

  the main through line of this story is [TS]

  is discovering that the little sister [TS]

  Sam has met a friend who's a kind of a [TS]

  rebel you know rebellious girl named [TS]

  Lanna Loni Loni Loni who I we get to [TS]

  know as as the story progresses and they [TS]

  get so they get to know each other and [TS]

  they fall in love and so the the so the [TS]

  parents are not understanding of the [TS]

  fact that their daughter is a lesbian [TS]

  says she's going through a phase [TS]

  Lonnie meanwhile you know it's not a [TS]

  perfect character and and you know it [TS]

  and then Lonnie's turns out is signing [TS]

  up to join the army and is going to [TS]

  leave which really upset Sam and this is [TS]

  the story that's being told so you know [TS]

  you that that's the I really the core [TS]

  there are all these other other stories [TS]

  and that's that [TS]

  that story unfolds not only as a as [TS]

  Caitlyn goes through through sam's room [TS]

  but it also unfolds Caitlyn goes through [TS]

  a series of secret passageway into like [TS]

  like the servants quarters i guess it [TS]

  turns out of this house which sam and [TS]

  Lonnie kind of like took over as their [TS]

  Clubhouse and as you discover those [TS]

  secret entries you also find the secrets [TS]

  of their of their relationship as as a [TS]

  teenager's falling in love and making [TS]

  mixtapes of bad punk bands and scenes [TS]

  and publishing the readings right he's [TS]

  right [TS]

  good idea awesome scene follicles should [TS]

  have been more computers in this because [TS]

  like we had computers in the nineties [TS]

  i'm pretty sure it's non-refundable they [TS]

  weren't no one night is usually what you [TS]

  pick with this yet just about an hour [TS]

  before caitlyn got to the house [TS]

  a robber came and stole over computers [TS]

  yeah well it's apparently they took all [TS]

  the VCRs you have the nintendo listen I [TS]

  should attach them to go with yeah just [TS]

  as soon as licensing restrictions [TS]

  because they had all that all the SNES [TS]

  cartridges in there but with the crazy [TS]

  labels on them and everything [TS]

  yeah so I want this let's talk about the [TS]

  house just because i wanted to say might [TS]

  one of my number one things when i went [TS]

  through this game was a boy I would love [TS]

  a house like this I've always dreamed [TS]

  about having a house with like secret [TS]

  stuff in it and this this has got all [TS]

  the secret passageways their secret [TS]

  passageways everywhere in this house [TS]

  it's like houses secret I i know it into [TS]

  the square footage for the tax assessor [TS]

  like well it seems to me it seems your [TS]

  house looks a lot bigger on the outside [TS]

  it's like the opposite of the trusting [TS]

  ducting there's just lots of big air [TS]

  ducts it's not there's not nothing back [TS]

  there [TS]

  it's the cigarette one and eat artist [TS]

  lane but it's it's the you know they say [TS]

  that it's the it's the servants quarters [TS]

  or whatever but it's just there's that [TS]

  moment where i think i found it i think [TS]

  i was in the closet in one of the bed in [TS]

  one of the bedrooms right and there's [TS]

  like things like the button up on the [TS]

  ceiling of the closet and I'm like huh [TS]

  what's that [TS]

  boom rubber room one like whoo secret [TS]

  passageway right and that was very [TS]

  exciting because I i love that i want [TS]

  you know I want that bookshelf that [TS]

  slides away and reveals a whole room [TS]

  behind it which sadly I'd I don't have [TS]

  so I i was thinking this house is really [TS]

  creepy and yet i'm really i'm really [TS]

  loving all the secret passageway stuff [TS]

  that was just on its own i love that and [TS]

  then [TS]

  oh we should mention too there's the [TS]

  whole day inherit this house from the [TS]

  what is an old uncle uncle Oscar and he [TS]

  has a tragic story of his own to that we [TS]

  learn it mostly in the in the basement [TS]

  in that secret area all the way down in [TS]

  the basement where there's the safe okay [TS]

  let me let me ask then [TS]

  is this his tragic story alone or is it [TS]

  off his and the father's yeah I think [TS]

  raising location IE that's what I was [TS]

  trying to figure because you know that [TS]

  we've got the the darkroom with the [TS]

  light doesn't work that's got the toy [TS]

  horse in it and right around the corner [TS]

  there and the servants quarters we've [TS]

  got what is the father's name terry yeah [TS]

  yeah we've got his markings on the wall [TS]

  of how tall he is growing each [TS]

  thanksgiving and then it stops suddenly [TS]

  in 1963 which coincidentally is the year [TS]

  the Kennedy assassination which suggests [TS]

  that maybe that's why Terry's got that [TS]

  in his mind so vividly and so I'm [TS]

  thinking is this a mala station story or [TS]

  what I think I think you got it yep [TS]

  where is the note that we're reading is [TS]

  his is his transgression that the family [TS]

  is so ticked off at him about something [TS]

  else but yeah that's that's the feeling [TS]

  I got there I was just curious whether [TS]

  everybody else thinks everyone that [TS]

  seems to be the heavy implication i saw [TS]

  other people suggest that maybe you know [TS]

  he came out to his family and night in [TS]

  nineteen sixties with that doesn't then [TS]

  connect is nicely into you know [TS]

  everything running with I like the fact [TS]

  that they didn't have to nail a nail it [TS]

  down because you can that any of these [TS]

  interpretations are perfectly fine like [TS]

  that's not the point of the story like [TS]

  we understand you know they're there are [TS]

  problems here and we do we need to know [TS]

  the exact details you don't really don't [TS]

  really know in fact I didn't open the [TS]

  lock things I mean I couldn't the couple [TS]

  of them because i had trouble finding I [TS]

  open sans locker I didn't open the safe [TS]

  in the basement I think now and the [TS]

  combination for tonight [TS]

  and spend a lot of I was like all right [TS]

  I can spend time working on this or I [TS]

  can I like keep going through the story [TS]

  so yeah used to me [TS]

  yep so in the safe and the in the [TS]

  basement dan there's in addition to he [TS]

  has a nice collection of narcotics there [TS]

  specifically morning and then a letter [TS]

  to i believe his sister in which dated [TS]

  years ago in which you basically you [TS]

  know which is quite classic apologize [TS]

  area yes yes right his transgression [TS]

  without getting into the specifics of of [TS]

  that [TS]

  yeah well I mean any I think you know [TS]

  there's a point to there are [TS]

  interpretations and there are things [TS]

  that are or are not important [TS]

  necessarily to comprehending the entire [TS]

  game [TS]

  yeah but yeah it is interesting it is a [TS]

  layered story which is that if you're [TS]

  gonna throw that aspect it I kind of [TS]

  wish it actually had some impact on the [TS]

  story and I don't really see that there [TS]

  was no I mean it doesn't that you can [TS]

  imagine like how it makes the follow the [TS]

  person that he is and how it out to his [TS]

  feet his tortured life and where it came [TS]

  from and how he sort of takes it out of [TS]

  his daughter are not being understanding [TS]

  about that you know like but it works in [TS]

  a family dynamic in that you don't [TS]

  always know the details of all the deep [TS]

  dark things in your very own family like [TS]

  that's the one place you're very likely [TS]

  not to know the details right but why is [TS]

  uncle bobby gone now or like what was [TS]

  the deal with these two and those [TS]

  secrets died with people and so I think [TS]

  it's reasonable for you in 1995 to be a [TS]

  look through this stuff and kind of get [TS]

  a good idea of what was going on but not [TS]

  to have anyone available certainly not [TS]

  immediately in the time this game to [TS]

  tell you what's the real deal like we [TS]

  just wanted to explain to us like tell [TS]

  me exactly what happened on the [TS]

  omniscient narrator know if it's your [TS]

  family maybe you don't know maybe you'll [TS]

  never know [TS]

  yep and we get I think there's there's a [TS]

  lot of little hints like that right i [TS]

  mean one of the other things you find in [TS]

  the basement is the father's father the [TS]

  father has a painting of his father the [TS]

  faces torn outfits like the letter the [TS]

  letter from his father which is you can [TS]

  do better [TS]

  you can do better it out you know he's [TS]

  got his father of you know signs it [TS]

  formally you know your father below PhD [TS]

  and it's you know I mean we we don't [TS]

  know what happens with a relationship [TS]

  maybe he really likes the second book [TS]

  problem yeah that's equally much better [TS]

  but I mean that there was a really [TS]

  really clear line between his his [TS]

  father's disapproval of him and all the [TS]

  stuff that he was going through and I [TS]

  didn't see that there was any kind of in [TS]

  vacation that that the potential mala [TS]

  station was weighing heavy on him and so [TS]

  I just thought that was kind of odd [TS]

  well I think it was the 1963 connection [TS]

  with like that was you know the whole [TS]

  thing where you stick your arm and a [TS]

  bucket of ice water and then memorize [TS]

  numbers better like something traumatic [TS]

  happens to you then like the thing that [TS]

  the other thing that happened that you [TS]

  list forever linked in your mind is [TS]

  always obsessed with writing about JFK [TS]

  for the rest of his life and you know [TS]

  and they keep it vague but I mean [TS]

  there's also i think the idea he then [TS]

  has to move back to this house where [TS]

  that may have happened and now he's [TS]

  falling apart right his yes that was a [TS]

  bad choice problem there's the alcohol [TS]

  hidden throughout and there's all this [TS]

  stuff where you know [TS]

  yeah I mean maybe maybe that is kind of [TS]

  the source of all this problems right [TS]

  maybe if they you know if that hadn't [TS]

  happened to them and they were in this [TS]

  house his relationship with his daughter [TS]

  may be different i can inherit the house [TS]

  then just sell it they don't realize [TS]

  that the movement yeah i know it's that [TS]

  kind of ruined it a little bit for many [TS]

  people but they have no their money [TS]

  right in it and that's like that was one [TS]

  of the first letters i found yeah it was [TS]

  a Carol Carol Carol friends like all you [TS]

  know I always wanted to mention and you [TS]

  wanted a house in the woods and you got [TS]

  both right [TS]

  yeah I you know you could have imagined [TS]

  that they felt they had to go there a [TS]

  secret secret passageways got your [TS]

  passage with Jason would be there in a [TS]

  second email with my hair got murdered [TS]

  I don't know Ian ghostly was yours have [TS]

  his way there's a lot of capacities hear [TS]

  ya talkin about the letters I I [TS]

  appreciate the fact that you know we've [TS]

  been god [TS]

  well you as the the elder daughter has [TS]

  been gone for a year so you've got [TS]

  you've got a year's worth of time to [TS]

  make up you gotta find out what happened [TS]

  in the interim the fact that in order to [TS]

  kind of fill in all the gaps we had [TS]

  letters that were written like by the [TS]

  phone phone messages that were there for [TS]

  a year ago that somehow never got picked [TS]

  up and thrown away I and and then it [TS]

  seems like neatly as you're exploring [TS]

  the house you're finding things from [TS]

  later and later in the year that that [TS]

  really kind of took me out of it i wish [TS]

  there been another way they could have [TS]

  done that [TS]

  it's tough not to do that you're not [TS]

  going to have it you're not gonna have [TS]

  an actual years whether written history [TS]

  in an actual house but the only thing I [TS]

  think the way you're supposed to kind of [TS]

  conceptualizing I don't think they did a [TS]

  great job in it which is where that's [TS]

  coming from all of the the journals that [TS]

  she's kind of reading to you I think the [TS]

  idea is that your kind of experiencing [TS]

  them even though you you don't actually [TS]

  get them all until you go up in the [TS]

  Apple you read the polity and all right [TS]

  that's that that's the flash-forward [TS]

  thing that doesn't bother me it's just [TS]

  that it's just the letters the letter [TS]

  from the publisher from 1978 that just [TS]

  happens to be sitting out in a box [TS]

  yeah and I guess maybe someone that's [TS]

  kind of a hand waving because like you [TS]

  know they've moved in right and that [TS]

  adds to the like right now is the house [TS]

  of disaster area because it was looted [TS]

  or because many years people unpack [TS]

  already you know when you may say [TS]

  momentous letters like a lot of letters [TS]

  you find that are meaningful and you can [TS]

  imagine all you want to save this the [TS]

  first letters that we got a letter where [TS]

  you going to do your job offer and [TS]

  things like that right you could imagine [TS]

  those could be they haven't been in the [TS]

  house for a year they moved recently to [TS]

  the house right now they've been there [TS]

  for almost an entire year based on that [TS]

  first packing slip from the movers I [TS]

  just make any sense of it because it's [TS]

  all still in boxes have you moved a lot [TS]

  it takes a while to get all the boxes [TS]

  out it doesn't take a year though to get [TS]

  revenge on the people it's the foyer for [TS]

  God's sake that's the first place where [TS]

  you move the boxes out of so if guests [TS]

  come to check out your new digs they [TS]

  don't trip over boxy we're going to your [TS]

  basement were inspecting it i'm just [TS]

  saying i moved after living in the same [TS]

  place for five years and there were [TS]

  boxes that were not unpacked and let me [TS]

  tell you nothing useful in those all I'm [TS]

  saying is this game lives or dies based [TS]

  on based on whether i can relate to the [TS]

  character and whether i can get into [TS]

  exploring the house and feeling like i'm [TS]

  kailyn and when there's so much stuff [TS]

  around that very clearly isn't realistic [TS]

  it it took me out of it but you have to [TS]

  be ready to be to give into the mood and [TS]

  atmosphere like you have to go anything [TS]

  I'm knowing that knowing it's going to [TS]

  be that type of game and being in the [TS]

  right mindset or on a plane in the dark [TS]

  and just and i'm going to i'm going to [TS]

  give myself to this experience and [TS]

  especially if you're played a lot of [TS]

  other games you have to look I can [TS]

  handle this type of game and I can [TS]

  accept it or it just bothers me I'll [TS]

  never be able to accept it and I'm i'm a [TS]

  total sucker for like slightly moody [TS]

  lighting some good music and like all [TS]

  right fine you got me I'm ready to go [TS]

  and very little will take me out of it [TS]

  except for things that break that mood [TS]

  and i think they held they held the mood [TS]

  they were consistent throughout the game [TS]

  they didn't there wasn't a spot where I [TS]

  felt like I now you have to do a you [TS]

  know a puzzle looks like pipe dream to [TS]

  pretend you're hacking or you know [TS]

  something crazy thing like that jumping [TS]

  a little it was tell you is no no [TS]

  platforming right it really means is you [TS]

  know it was very consistent and so like [TS]

  I said that the thing [TS]

  you can manipulate that you are [TS]

  pointless they were there throughout the [TS]

  whole game and I just had to come to [TS]

  accept them but the atmosphere i felt [TS]

  like held the whole time and built to a [TS]

  satisfying conclusion i thought the the [TS]

  ending of it walking up to the journal [TS]

  and realizing that you've been hearing [TS]

  during the entire game all the things [TS]

  that you read later work that work for [TS]

  me I like I liked it [TS]

  let's let's talk about the ultimately [TS]

  how everybody felt about about playing [TS]

  this game I I i liked it i enjoyed the [TS]

  you know couple hours I spent with it on [TS]

  a Sunday morning I thought I you know it [TS]

  was not one of those kind of super [TS]

  frustrating puzzle kind of game [TS]

  experiences it was much more like I was [TS]

  walking through and discovering things [TS]

  and in more or less the right order but [TS]

  I i appreciated this method of [TS]

  storytelling and then it was a little [TS]

  bit different and yet i was i was seeing [TS]

  these kind of interlocked stories and [TS]

  discovering in an interesting way and I [TS]

  i did like the fact that it submitted my [TS]

  expectations and that I was you know in [TS]

  the dark and stormy night I was really [TS]

  expecting something a little more [TS]

  adventurous than I actually got but i [TS]

  did i did enjoy it i'm wondering you [TS]

  know what you guys think in terms of [TS]

  your product on on on gone home [TS]

  I was a little surprised by how short it [TS]

  was um I mean I guess I got to the end I [TS]

  was left wanting more which is not a bad [TS]

  thing there's so many other games I play [TS]

  where they seemed to drag on but I was a [TS]

  little surprised by how short it was but [TS]

  i liked it i would recommend it [TS]

  I honestly found it kind of boring and I [TS]

  hate to say that because i love indie [TS]

  games and I really see what they were [TS]

  trying to get get out here but the the [TS]

  atmosphere just never really worked for [TS]

  me that the contrived stuff laying [TS]

  around just took me out of that [TS]

  atmosphere constantly and I thought that [TS]

  the the whole love story plot line was [TS]

  very sweet and very well done and that's [TS]

  mostly down to really good writing for [TS]

  the two girls like the the notes that [TS]

  they've written back and forth really [TS]

  ring true for me they felt like [TS]

  teenagers in a way that fictional [TS]

  characters are things you need [TS]

  successfully kind of took me back to [TS]

  that period where everything seemed like [TS]

  it was heartbreak you know and and so I [TS]

  thought that all work very well and I [TS]

  thought the [TS]

  whoever the voice actresses that did Sam [TS]

  was terrific [TS]

  yes because she had a real nice sound [TS]

  and she sounded very heartfelt and and [TS]

  really fit the part very well but to me [TS]

  I sit down for a game and I want to play [TS]

  a game you know and this this was more [TS]

  or less we can debate endlessly what [TS]

  constitutes a game but i think there is [TS]

  a line where you know you've stopped [TS]

  playing a game and you're you're [TS]

  basically experiencing a Judy Blume [TS]

  novel with a really convoluted page [TS]

  turning mechanism know and this I think [TS]

  was was over that line for me I I you [TS]

  know I understand that other people [TS]

  probably feel very differently about it [TS]

  but didn't really work for me and I i [TS]

  really enjoyed it i mean III playing ki [TS]

  played in two sessions and so I had that [TS]

  first instinct was session on the plane [TS]

  where I played for an hour or so and at [TS]

  that point was like really creeped out [TS]

  and kind of put away because I was like [TS]

  all right I need to put this you know [TS]

  come back to this when I'm not on a [TS]

  plane in the darkness over the over the [TS]

  middle of the country and I played it [TS]

  like an afternoon and so it was it at [TS]

  that point i think it was right around [TS]

  the time at which you start getting a [TS]

  better idea of what kind of game it was [TS]

  so the mood for me while still creepy at [TS]

  times and sort of having that eerie [TS]

  movie atmosphere that the job was [TS]

  talking about a it it's often a little [TS]

  bit both probably by being in daylight [TS]

  and because i was starting to get a [TS]

  clearer picture of what the story was [TS]

  about and I think you know Steve's right [TS]

  that this is there's a lot of this [TS]

  that's more story like in terms of you [TS]

  know being told a story but i don't know [TS]

  i mean i still thought as a game it was [TS]

  fun and interesting it was a yeah i [TS]

  don't--there's there's room for a lot of [TS]

  different types of games in this for me [TS]

  you know well not like many of the other [TS]

  games that I play I think it was still [TS]

  worthwhile experience and it was an [TS]

  interesting story and I enjoyed the way [TS]

  that it was presented and clearly as [TS]

  someone who didn't go through in like [TS]

  unlock everything cream you know maybe I [TS]

  didn't get the most out of it that I [TS]

  could have but I still thought it was [TS]

  pretty good as we're going to find that [TS]

  in a moment I thought gone home was much [TS]

  more successful than brothers I think [TS]

  and it instantly it's I think it's of [TS]

  interest to a narrow group of people [TS]

  than brothers is and I think gone home [TS]

  requires more empathy [TS]

  charity and life experience to [TS]

  appreciate like a 12 year olds not gonna [TS]

  play gone home and you know get into it [TS]

  or maybe they would I don't know but it [TS]

  seems like not it's not as broad and in [TS]

  terms of like what is a game what isn't [TS]

  I i was filled that what gaming brings [TS]

  to the experience is the idea that you [TS]

  are making things happen not that you [TS]

  like oh I can change the game in the end [TS]

  of the end of my game the house blew up [TS]

  or anything like that it's it's the [TS]

  illusion of of control and agent this [TS]

  year just the sheer fact that you're [TS]

  participating you said I was [TS]

  sophisticated way of paper showing a [TS]

  sufficiently sophisticated technique of [TS]

  page-turning brings me at least into the [TS]

  story more because i feel like i am i am [TS]

  participating I'm like you get the same [TS]

  thing when you read a book like you an [TS]

  empty empathize with the character lead [TS]

  character whatever but the act of [TS]

  walking around doing that stuff and [TS]

  looking through things yourself as [TS]

  little as it may matter to the outcome [TS]

  of the game or maybe your become totally [TS]

  longer else or whatever I if you don't [TS]

  feel that and I didn't feel that much [TS]

  during this game it makes the story more [TS]

  meaningful to me than if I had simply [TS]

  read those journal entries on let that's [TS]

  my yardstick you put the text of this [TS]

  game into a book and read it versus me [TS]

  playing this game i'll pick the game any [TS]

  day of the week with the exact same [TS]

  words and that I feel like it's what [TS]

  gaming brings to this above and beyond a [TS]

  story I very much agree with what you're [TS]

  saying there and when I thought exactly [TS]

  the opposite i thought this could be [TS]

  done better in a book with with the same [TS]

  thing with the same text now well I mean [TS]

  you have to have to structure in such a [TS]

  way that it wasn't ridiculous I mean you [TS]

  can just read the journal and and be [TS]

  satisfied with that but honestly my [TS]

  obviously we did in the book you flush [TS]

  it out way more and it would be you [TS]

  could make a good book out of this but [TS]

  just given just given the amount of [TS]

  texts in the stories here with maybe a [TS]

  little bit of connecting stuff I feel [TS]

  like walking through the house finding [TS]

  things yourself doing the stuff in that [TS]

  atmosphere heighten the experience my [TS]

  way above just attacks and now you two [TS]

  must fight to the death and I just felt [TS]

  like I wasn't doing anything is the [TS]

  problem is i was picking up milk cartons [TS]

  and turning them over and I was [TS]

  basically just killing time until I [TS]

  found the next blotted a piece of paper [TS]

  that was story relevant and so there [TS]

  wasn't enough to suck me in and and [TS]

  maybe it's just down to having spent too [TS]

  much time playing haunted house games or [TS]

  games where I'm exploring house and [TS]

  actually manipulating items in [TS]

  and really feeling like I'm part of the [TS]

  story as opposed to just watching [TS]

  through the eyes of the character who's [TS]

  doing all this stuff but it just it just [TS]

  never grabbed me but but your point your [TS]

  point is absolutely right i mean if it [TS]

  if if this game had pulled me in that [TS]

  way then i would say absolutely this is [TS]

  a far superior medium for this story [TS]

  than a book but for me it just didn't [TS]

  work [TS]

  pistols at dawn no actually you leech [TS]

  you just have to make a cassette [TS]

  its a mix tape mixtape tapes it on okay [TS]

  yeah it's gonna be alright girl stuff I [TS]

  hope you're cool with that job out there [TS]

  they're definitely weaknesses to the [TS]

  story in the way that like you don't [TS]

  want to see the strings and you do see [TS]

  them a little bit too much here and I [TS]

  feel for them because it is so [TS]

  incredibly that's what am i bringing [TS]

  journey and what makes journey so [TS]

  amazing at least in the first place for [TS]

  me is like you cannot see the strings [TS]

  and everything seemed to work out [TS]

  perfectly that's almost impossible to do [TS]

  and there's a little bit too much like [TS]

  if I had to change this game around i [TS]

  would say I fewer things that are [TS]

  pointless so you wouldn't be spending [TS]

  milk cartons for no reason and like it [TS]

  its I kind of know what they would have [TS]

  to change to make it better but the it [TS]

  when it comes down to the details like [TS]

  geez this is a really really hard [TS]

  problem and so it is extremely difficult [TS]

  to make this type of game so that works [TS]

  for everybody [TS]

  I think they did enough of it here where [TS]

  I'm going to give it a thumbs up in it [TS]

  and totally endorse the game in it and [TS]

  it worked for me but it doesn't reach [TS]

  you no guarantees level for me [TS]

  not even close but still recommended see [TS]

  and journey worked wonderfully for me [TS]

  and I think a lot of that was down to [TS]

  the fact that there were actually [TS]

  problems for you to solve in journey [TS]

  they were difficult problems and they [TS]

  were very unconventional and I think I [TS]

  complained a little bit in the journey [TS]

  episode about the fact that there wasn't [TS]

  enough difficulty for me really to to [TS]

  stretch the game out but it just the [TS]

  simple fact that i had to solve some [TS]

  sort of problem gave me such a an [TS]

  attachment to the character it really [TS]

  made me feel like I was guiding this guy [TS]

  or you know it going farther i actually [TS]

  am this guy is he's exploring this world [TS]

  and this there just wasn't anything in [TS]

  this game to do that for me but and I [TS]

  think you know I think different parts [TS]

  of games resonate with different people [TS]

  in different ways i mean i think some [TS]

  people really want that sense of kind of [TS]

  challenge and achievement and overcoming [TS]

  an obstacle [TS]

  you know a lot of games build off of [TS]

  that very heavily this game does not [TS]

  almost at all right i mean they're the [TS]

  puzzles in this gamer so trivial you [TS]

  might as well not called and puzzles but [TS]

  it's really strong in the story area [TS]

  which is you know other games are not or [TS]

  in other games would be more about the [TS]

  visuals and you know I think this game [TS]

  does pretty well but for visuals but [TS]

  it's clearly more about the story I mean [TS]

  these characters in gone home feel more [TS]

  real to me than any other video game i [TS]

  can remember that's one aspect of the [TS]

  game but we haven't talked about that is [TS]

  definitely true is that if you are for [TS]

  example like you know a kid who is gay [TS]

  who grew up closet didn't have to come [TS]

  out of your parents are like if you have [TS]

  actual personal residence with with this [TS]

  situation and also it's a it's a story [TS]

  that you don't often see in Games which [TS]

  I feel like this is like that's a lot of [TS]

  the extra attention this game is getting [TS]

  is because it's telling a story to [TS]

  people who normally don't have the [TS]

  stories told because in that space [TS]

  marines or detectives you know what i [TS]

  mean and that like that goes a long way [TS]

  towards you know giving this game a [TS]

  boost in that it's a story even if [TS]

  you're not even if you can't directly [TS]

  emphasize with the things that are [TS]

  happening because none of those things [TS]

  happened in your family or whatever it's [TS]

  maybe a story that you haven't played [TS]

  there before I've been the grizzled [TS]

  detective I've been the space marine I [TS]

  haven't been the daughter coming home [TS]

  from Europe you've been a little space [TS]

  detective [TS]

  yes I've been the gristle space that was [TS]

  only once and i've been i've been linked [TS]

  many many times i actually have been the [TS]

  confused lesbian though [TS]

  yes well it was College Steve yeah well [TS]

  we did like this but it sounds young [TS]

  I'm going to hit the pause button one [TS]

  more time to talk to you about our [TS]

  second sponsor its Zoe spelled x owi [TS]

  it's a Kickstarter campaign running [TS]

  until november 21st 2013 it's a wearable [TS]

  badge for quick voice interactions [TS]

  straight out of Star Trek The Next [TS]

  Generation if Siri and Google now had a [TS]

  robot baby imagine that it would be Zoe [TS]

  you clip this badge anywhere it can give [TS]

  easy spoken instructions like turn off [TS]

  the AC give me the weather reading my [TS]

  facebook messages turn on the porch [TS]

  lights i want to watch some football and [TS]

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  they're looking to raise $100,000 on [TS]

  Kickstarter you can reserve your very [TS]

  own Zoe for 149 with a device scheduled [TS]

  to ship in March 2014 it connects with [TS]

  your iphone Windows Phone Android phone [TS]

  or blackberry by bluetooth and charges [TS]

  by a microUSB so it looks great [TS]

  understands you and responds quickly [TS]

  the end succinctly go to Zoe dot me to [TS]

  learn more and reserve yours today [TS]

  that's X owi dot me to reserve your Zoe [TS]

  let's uh let's move on and talk about [TS]

  brothers brothers a tale of two sons [TS]

  available on xbox and playstation and is [TS]

  this on pc to yes it is that's where i [TS]

  played it all right i played this on [TS]

  xbox actually came here seen did you [TS]

  have got like every console for a [TS]

  non-gamer i do I first yes I got every [TS]

  every last generation console now [TS]

  yes I am state-of-the-art from 2008 [TS]

  Steve wow yeah i know it's pretty cool [TS]

  i'm gonna going to watch the x-files VHS [TS]

  is and make some mixtapes then but if [TS]

  you're talking you know you talk down [TS]

  your gamer credit but you got some men [TS]

  have no credit i have the boxes with all [TS]

  those games that I don't finish so that [TS]

  potential energy versus kinetic legs [TS]

  thank you thank you to the energy her [TS]

  yeah statements teasingly energy can [TS]

  never truly be destroyed by one relay [TS]

  the games I just never played violin [TS]

  playing games because the podcast that's [TS]

  my new that's my new traveling excuse so [TS]

  brothers uh from Star values about two [TS]

  brothers it's about brothers it's a tale [TS]

  of two sons they are the sons of their [TS]

  parents the same parents dust brothers [TS]

  you're not going to get me my opening [TS]

  statement refers to make anyone do you [TS]

  have an opening statement about this I [TS]

  yeah we need to find her off the full [TS]

  display board first John yeah no I don't [TS]

  think you need to fire it off but like I [TS]

  think this is a good way to frame this [TS]

  is all I will frame it then you guys [TS]

  will go nuts and i will pick up any [TS]

  scraps that you got at the end because [TS]

  as I said I thought gone home was more [TS]

  successful this and so the creators of [TS]

  this game are so very clearly fans of [TS]

  one of my favorite games of all time [TS]

  eco which I've been trying to get us [TS]

  successful and write both my third [TS]

  person adventure games with two main [TS]

  characters both of them don't require a [TS]

  lot of skill to play both we have an [TS]

  emphasis on cooperation and both of them [TS]

  emphasize the emotional impact / like [TS]

  fancy gameplayer puzzles like that and [TS]

  the danger of basing being heavily [TS]

  inspired by one of my hair games all [TS]

  times that i will constantly compare [TS]

  your game to one of my favorite games of [TS]

  all time [TS]

  and in the case of brothers i did that [TS]

  and found it lacking and I have a huge [TS]

  list of reasons that's the case but [TS]

  instead i will let you guys go and [TS]

  anything that you don't get i will pick [TS]

  up my first note just says eco plus lost [TS]

  vikings minus originality minus [TS]

  difficulty so I I've got a couple of [TS]

  things here first i should say that the [TS]

  premise here is that these brothers [TS]

  their father is ill mysteriously and [TS]

  they have to be set out to go across [TS]

  this world find a cure and the clever [TS]

  game mechanic that I think is the thing [TS]

  that makes this game [TS]

  the most notable and why people have [TS]

  talked about it is you control both [TS]

  brothers the left thumbstick controls [TS]

  the big brother and the right thumbstick [TS]

  controls the little brother and the left [TS]

  trigger is an action for the big brother [TS]

  in the left trigger right trigger is the [TS]

  action for the little brother I also say [TS]

  that my wife compared John compared this [TS]

  to eco while we were playing it [TS]

  it is very obvious because we got to the [TS]

  point where there's the word that where [TS]

  they meet the girl and they rescue her [TS]

  from from being sacrificed or executed [TS]

  or whatever it happens to be and and and [TS]

  then for several you know points in the [TS]

  story she comes along with the [TS]

  characters and at one point my wife [TS]

  exclaimed she's smart [TS]

  we it's not like that stupid girl in eco [TS]

  where you have to hold her hand and drag [TS]

  her around terrible just terrible [TS]

  I know so that there you go but uh so [TS]

  anyway yes so that so I I have thoughts [TS]

  about this too but I I'm gonna throw it [TS]

  out to the rest of the panel by the way [TS]

  we did you let your wife see the rest of [TS]

  the game and how that turns out with the [TS]

  girl [TS]

  oh yeah we like with journey we actually [TS]

  played this game kind of handing it off [TS]

  back and forth and the kids actually [TS]

  watched watched us as we played this [TS]

  game so all of it i'm curious because [TS]

  that is a little olive it takes it take [TS]

  to now the tone a little bit [TS]

  it does i play the beginning with my [TS]

  kids and then kept playing after they [TS]

  went to sleep and I said okay I'm not [TS]

  bringing the kids back into the skin on [TS]

  my kids are old enough now that it has [TS]

  today was my real your seven-year-old [TS]

  son enjoyed it [TS]

  yeah if they don't find out about [TS]

  spiders cities in your house and find [TS]

  out of metal ok ok but I I what's that [TS]

  sound I hear coming for the distance [TS]

  it's all know the spoiler horn again [TS]

  alright so we should we should spoil it [TS]

  all we like now [TS]

  alright so i haven't played ego alright [TS]

  so i'll just come out there today then [TS]

  everyone playstation alright you're off [TS]

  the podcast your help you're a terrorist [TS]

  podcast is over and I can lend you one [TS]

  I'm totally cool with that and so I [TS]

  really really like yeah I'm for my [TS]

  situation that I forgot earlier with the [TS]

  game i've not played it by I i know of [TS]

  it so I but i will say I I experienced [TS]

  this game in a in a vacuum not having [TS]

  compared it to that game in the game and [TS]

  John Cena killing again that is good is [TS]

  to remind me the most of his journey of [TS]

  attorney was absolutely is very yeah [TS]

  there it's not the same game it's very [TS]

  much not the same an attorney but there [TS]

  are many things in it that are [TS]

  reminiscent of journey [TS]

  although apparently now every game that [TS]

  aspires to art has to have that swelling [TS]

  string music that's what that's one of [TS]

  the reasons why I thought of a really [TS]

  want this to be journey to ferment it [TS]

  was the I mean again I play a lot of [TS]

  other games that are much more involved [TS]

  and so something where the control [TS]

  scheme is so simple as to be you know [TS]

  basically transparent right like once [TS]

  you know move do things right like [TS]

  everything else is contained within the [TS]

  world of the game which is basically the [TS]

  exact same thing for journey right like [TS]

  once you know how do we like you know [TS]

  seeing you know jumper wouldn't move [TS]

  around like that is all you need to know [TS]

  about what buttons to press [TS]

  everything else is really about what you [TS]

  do inside the game world to have an [TS]

  effect inside the game world and i [TS]

  thought the mechanic was really clever [TS]

  like I mean it took some time to get [TS]

  used to [TS]

  I was constantly like I had to make sure [TS]

  that I tried to keep the big brother [TS]

  growing on the laughing over the right [TS]

  otherwise like ok they're running your [TS]

  direction was going on and I got pretty [TS]

  like I got to into like the second [TS]

  section the game before dying which was [TS]

  which was good because i was like maybe [TS]

  you can't really die in this game and I [TS]

  was like well how do youhow did you died [TS]

  and they've got lots of stuff determine [TS]

  if you died there they are big on the [TS]

  invisible walls in this game and not [TS]

  like oh yeah but there are some plates [TS]

  and the mind off kind of elevate the [TS]

  mind crush by rocks and there's there's [TS]

  a battleground [TS]

  yeah i'll actually had complaints about [TS]

  the control scheme i thought i thought [TS]

  it was too unwieldy with the two sticks [TS]

  and you know the thing with journey is [TS]

  it it it felt completely natural [TS]

  almost immediately it [TS]

  more it's more complicated injure and [TS]

  and this game I constantly felt like I [TS]

  was fighting a control scheme i never [TS]

  forgot that I was holding a control [TS]

  that's the whole point of getting on the [TS]

  whole point of the game is you are you [TS]

  have to be cooperating with yourself and [TS]

  you have to coordinate the action and [TS]

  there's the holder in Mexico against [TS]

  you've gotta coordinate these two it [TS]

  just it for something that aspires to be [TS]

  the kind of experience that journey was [TS]

  that's that's a big obstacle in the way [TS]

  and yet the second one is the insistence [TS]

  on using the analog triggers as as [TS]

  digital controls that just I mean I'm [TS]

  not sure what else you would use [TS]

  accepted wonder why students have their [TS]

  own problems but yeah if I to use the [TS]

  playstation controller i wouldn't have [TS]

  this problem but with the xbox this [TS]

  triggers they'll kill you every time ya [TS]

  know our climbing with yeah you have to [TS]

  do a lot of like catch release catch [TS]

  release and I could be annoying if you [TS]

  have to do against Ryland about me there [TS]

  but then again I do a lot of games that [TS]

  you like hold us down for the [TS]

  seven-year-old son had to take a lot of [TS]

  breaks yeah but i like that i mean the [TS]

  whole that was what made this game [TS]

  interesting to me from a gameplay [TS]

  standpoint was the fact that it was you [TS]

  know that was the the puzzle the puzzle [TS]

  was to do these different actions with [TS]

  the different characters and they had [TS]

  different interaction and they and [TS]

  different capabilities and and it [TS]

  manifested in a bunch of different ways [TS]

  he's gotta hop up here and then he can [TS]

  put down the rope and then the other guy [TS]

  can climb up or they some of them have [TS]

  to work together some of them may have [TS]

  to work in opposition [TS]

  there's the one where there's the dog [TS]

  that's running around ya gotta you gotta [TS]

  one has to distract the dog while the [TS]

  other one runs and then the other has to [TS]

  do it may have to move back and forth [TS]

  and I really like that it wasn't it [TS]

  wasn't easy and I like that I could do [TS]

  it not I could figure it out but it [TS]

  wasn't like I was just on Rails I was [TS]

  just walking through to the next thing [TS]

  that I had to think about right what the [TS]

  right but but it never did did you ever [TS]

  have to like think about it think about [TS]

  it that's was gonna compare yeah you go [TS]

  is because like eco has puzzles that you [TS]

  have to think about where is this game I [TS]

  always knew immediately what they wanted [TS]

  me to do and it was fairly easy to do [TS]

  that's what I'm saying there was a low [TS]

  skill Barry there's more but more [TS]

  coordination is required definitely like [TS]

  oh you're not just moving one guy around [TS]

  so that's why would say for non-gamers [TS]

  is probably high barrier but in terms of [TS]

  like boy I'm stuck in this puzzle can't [TS]

  figure out what to do that [TS]

  is much more likely to happen in the [TS]

  game like ego then then this one I felt [TS]

  like this in every situation I knew what [TS]

  they wanted me to do and executed it [TS]

  more or less on the first round I said [TS]

  I'd never die didn't think you could die [TS]

  oh thats see but there were you know I [TS]

  think there were times for me when I was [TS]

  like well i tried something that I [TS]

  realized like okay that's not the [TS]

  approach they want me to take but i [TS]

  thought was just like so the very early [TS]

  on there's a part where you have the [TS]

  drawbridge in the treadmill and you have [TS]

  to light so you can you realize oh one [TS]

  of the brothers can get the treadmill [TS]

  and lower it and the other guy could go [TS]

  across and how to get both of them [TS]

  across so i tried for a while I start [TS]

  piling sheep hit escape before heavy [TS]

  enough to keep the comforts down which [TS]

  incidentally is hilarious because [TS]

  they're now yeah I did that to you [TS]

  because it's just because it's fun yeah [TS]

  I know I spent some time playing but i [TS]

  did that because I thought it was a [TS]

  valid solution and finally realize i'm [TS]

  going to put the ship and refine my son [TS]

  greatly enjoyed dropping them into the [TS]

  wall yesterday really from the wonderful [TS]

  i love that because then they come [TS]

  another one this like lively comes out [TS]

  of the little farmhouse is he like your [TS]

  shit that comes out of the shed [TS]

  yeah they should have they should have a [TS]

  a spin-off game just with the Sheep [TS]

  Michael yeah I like I do like all the [TS]

  animals in this game but I don't know it [TS]

  was for me there were things i'm not [TS]

  saying required like a super long time [TS]

  and they're definitely puzzles and games [TS]

  that have our way harder than this but [TS]

  it was that nice balance of being [TS]

  something that was not so hard you're [TS]

  like banging your head against the wall [TS]

  trying to figure out what was not so [TS]

  easy that you're just like I'm walking [TS]

  through it [TS]

  I thought I I thought I hit that sweet [TS]

  spot really nicely I mean I feel like [TS]

  their other games that a lot more [TS]

  challenging and even games I like where [TS]

  I hid the point of frustration that I [TS]

  stopped right and hopefully i go back [TS]

  the next day or you know later that week [TS]

  there's some games were frustrated [TS]

  enough it's like i'm done with that game [TS]

  for a long time if not forever [TS]

  yeah and this never had that problem [TS]

  i'll admit it's pretty you know the [TS]

  challenges are pretty simple pretty soft [TS]

  but I felt like that they were they were [TS]

  but I felt like that they were they were [TS]

  that really nice sweet spot where you [TS]

  kept moving forward right you felt like [TS]

  you could figure this out and keep going [TS]

  and I never felt like at this game i'm [TS]

  not playing anymore right you know this [TS]

  is stupid i can't figure out what I'm [TS]

  supposed to do just clever enough for [TS]

  like oh yes i got it to hold my interest [TS]

  in keeping I don't think there are any [TS]

  challenging puzzles in this game of the [TS]

  control scheme is a little bit [TS]

  challenging but they're challenging [TS]

  puzzles and this is not to say that I [TS]

  think challenge is essential for a good [TS]

  game because journey has like zero [TS]

  challenge it's like one of my favorite [TS]

  games of all time so you don't need [TS]

  challenge to make a google at least he [TS]

  has more challenge than this by a large [TS]

  though [TS]

  well I mean I don't anyway though the [TS]

  whole point is I don't think you need [TS]

  challenge make a good game but here's [TS]

  what you do need you need you need a lot [TS]

  so you need something else to overcome [TS]

  any kind of gameplay that is as brutally [TS]

  Leonard linear as brothers is like you [TS]

  need like journey level of awesomeness [TS]

  to make you forget that you're being led [TS]

  down a single long car door with [TS]

  invisible walls also yes as a music [TS]

  atmosphere you need like emotions you [TS]

  need some intellectual engagement need [TS]

  something right and eco is less linear [TS]

  then brothers our journey because you [TS]

  can kind of wander all over and do all [TS]

  this stuff but it really is kind of [TS]

  linear a bit but there's more Challenge [TS]

  mentally to the puzzles and the [TS]

  free-roaming nature like let's fix you [TS]

  out into making you think that you're [TS]

  not you're not being like that i mean [TS]

  i-i don't I mean I played eco I don't I [TS]

  mean to me they're different games I [TS]

  don't I mean the scope of them is [TS]

  completely different ego is a much [TS]

  larger cargo but the whole thing makes [TS]

  you feel like you're not into Carter [TS]

  brothers were just killing me with the [TS]

  linearity because it was at one point I [TS]

  climbed up a wall for the for the 10,000 [TS]

  time and once again that I know how to [TS]

  climb also to people's thank you don't [TS]

  need the same challenge million times [TS]

  and I realized it was like a baby [TS]

  penguin rescuing side mission that I had [TS]

  missed somehow I got gonna go back down [TS]

  the wall and do that and it wouldn't let [TS]

  me go back down the wall to do it you [TS]

  can still see the side mission that I [TS]

  had failed to do like not only with [TS]

  linear it was like slamming doors behind [TS]

  me as i went down this invisible wall [TS]

  Carter and if you're not going to have [TS]

  challenging puzzles and you're gonna [TS]

  have linear gameplay like you can't you [TS]

  need to pick something else there like a [TS]

  bit journey has zero challenge it's [TS]

  incredibly linear and at no point did I [TS]

  ever get that feeling of like I'm [TS]

  Brailled in I I think you're mistaken [TS]

  journey has challenged to it challenges [TS]

  not the big thing it but journey [TS]

  certainly challenging their stuff where [TS]

  you feel threatened in journey you have [TS]

  to overcome obstacles i think all games [TS]

  have an element [TS]

  Challenge otherwise you'd be completely [TS]

  bored yeah I guess you do feel you do [TS]

  feel a sense of threat but like [TS]

  inherently general use [TS]

  you literally can't die though I mean [TS]

  now you know he's not the only offset [TS]

  back yet not all but that's another [TS]

  thing about journey as you you never [TS]

  really thought that you couldn't die in [TS]

  that game i remembered that the flying a [TS]

  dragon creature whatever taking me out [TS]

  and thinking oh that finally has decided [TS]

  to kill me and that's in fact that's the [TS]

  ridiculous thing about games that death [TS]

  is overused as the single punishment [TS]

  there's lots of ways you can get [TS]

  punished you can get things taken away [TS]

  and get pushback video is your scholarly [TS]

  get you know yet our death is a cop-out [TS]

  right i mean that's like you know that [TS]

  will because it's the one thing that [TS]

  breaks the narrative it doesn't mean [TS]

  that you write on the pit but guess what [TS]

  i want that here right enter a couple [TS]

  games where they do funny things with [TS]

  time travel or no the prince of persia [TS]

  games are actually noteworthy because [TS]

  it's like being narrated you follow the [TS]

  pit and the narrator says that's not [TS]

  what happened and you jump back but yeah [TS]

  but no death is overused as the like [TS]

  this is how you fall back and that's I [TS]

  mean I think during is a classic example [TS]

  you can have challenged without death [TS]

  sure you can and that and that happens [TS]

  in other games i'm a big fan of you know [TS]

  graphic adventure games and things like [TS]

  that were there is challenging their [TS]

  obstacles but you don't die you're even [TS]

  you know something really great games [TS]

  for you can't get into an irrevocable [TS]

  situation right now that's what I was [TS]

  thinking was getting stuck like that you [TS]

  think you talking about for we like I [TS]

  don't know what to do next in this game [TS]

  and I'm frustrated you know like that's [TS]

  what I talked about like in terms of [TS]

  challenge like where you're where you [TS]

  have to put the controller down and say [TS]

  I forget it i'm going to come back this [TS]

  because you're frustrated because of a [TS]

  mechanic or because you have no idea [TS]

  what to do and that never happens in [TS]

  journey which is a great thing about it [TS]

  is you never you never will get stuck [TS]

  unless you really don't have the [TS]

  coordination just move the guy along and [TS]

  it doesn't happen in this game either [TS]

  but this game is lacking all the stuff [TS]

  that journey has to make it so that [TS]

  you're willing to walk down a big long [TS]

  corridor with invisible walls and not [TS]

  feel like you're so yeah I don't know [TS]

  that I agree with that either because i [TS]

  don't like the thing that the for me [TS]

  made this game was the relationship [TS]

  between the brothers [TS]

  I mean and again really touching and [TS]

  it's not it's not like on homework like [TS]

  all right we're going to tell you [TS]

  everything about this you know the all [TS]

  the details right vector the language [TS]

  that they speak is basically impossible [TS]

  to understand right you can kind of pick [TS]

  up stuff from context but you're never [TS]

  gonna understand the full import of what [TS]

  I also i mean the only thing I knew [TS]

  going into this game was [TS]

  have been compared to journey and at [TS]

  first I was kind of skeptical as like [TS]

  this is not the scale and scope of [TS]

  journey i really like journey but i [TS]

  think this game had a really great slow [TS]

  build i mean i really liked the way you [TS]

  saw the relationship between the between [TS]

  the brothers you know the stuff about [TS]

  their two different parents even as the [TS]

  way it expanded from you know your first [TS]

  kind of puzzles are like there's a jerk [TS]

  with a stick who won't let you get past [TS]

  a you know a bridge and you have to go [TS]

  around two later you know your kind of [TS]

  your running across this field and their [TS]

  dogs chasing you to then there are these [TS]

  things they're like actually kind of [TS]

  foreign and hostile and creepy and weird [TS]

  and otherworldly and it's like it does [TS]

  actually fire one of the brothers in a [TS]

  in a catapult that one yeah you know is [TS]

  this actually happening or you know is [TS]

  this real or is this the the imagination [TS]

  of the younger brother has become the [TS]

  way that is commanded to me was was [TS]

  amazing i mean when the first our first [TS]

  maybe half hours like man people [TS]

  comparing this journey there you know I [TS]

  don't know I'm not with them but then at [TS]

  the end of music swells and suddenly [TS]

  it's snowy and I'm like oh yeah okay and [TS]

  really are trying to be any now really [TS]

  talked about the end yet but you know [TS]

  you get to the end and one of the [TS]

  brothers dies and it's like well as the [TS]

  game to be over now how you know [TS]

  basically that last I don't 20-25 [TS]

  minutes where you're playing as little [TS]

  surviving brother i kept being how much [TS]

  longer can this game be because this [TS]

  feels weird and wrong and like that [TS]

  sounds like somebody's having another [TS]

  game that I played before but that's the [TS]

  one to one truly moving thing in the [TS]

  story for me for me that the the the [TS]

  brothers in their relationship was all [TS]

  just so generic they didn't do much for [TS]

  me [TS]

  the older brothers the serious one and a [TS]

  little one of those buckets of water on [TS]

  sleeping people okay I get that and then [TS]

  at the end when the younger brother is [TS]

  on his own and the thing that you have [TS]

  to do in order to push him forward and [TS]

  and and you know for its kind of forget [TS]

  his fear of of water and jump up the [TS]

  cliff that he doesn't think he's talking [TS]

  to get up to is to use the other [TS]

  brothers button [TS]

  yes that was little I can one very cool [TS]

  moving thing I thought is that really [TS]

  worked well in the story which only [TS]

  works after training you write three [TS]

  actually and and3 that was brilliant and [TS]

  today even thinking about now I get [TS]

  chills i may have played too many games [TS]

  to have telegraphed that but I give them [TS]

  props hiring i don't know i don't like a [TS]

  lot of games you know how you did I ice [TS]

  kinda saw that come every like maybe I [TS]

  sound like I'm [TS]

  already here and I'm not saying I didn't [TS]

  like this game because like that's I [TS]

  don't want people to know I didn't like [TS]

  that like you should totally buy this [TS]

  and play this game like it's a great [TS]

  game to my players just the only reason [TS]

  I have all these huge list of negatives [TS]

  that we really good for you it's because [TS]

  that because i'm comparing at the eco [TS]

  and you should also kinda yeah you [TS]

  should also play journey you should also [TS]

  play you know shadows of the Colossus [TS]

  these are all games you should play but [TS]

  brothers is a great game [TS]

  I mean you mentioned eco and getting to [TS]

  that moment where you where you get in [TS]

  some games we get frustrated and I gotta [TS]

  come back later i gotta put it down one [TS]

  of the things that I appreciate about [TS]

  this game and that is is that I never [TS]

  got to that point I had to sometimes sit [TS]

  there and think okay where do i want to [TS]

  go here but it didn't take too long and [TS]

  I'd I got to be honest I don't like it [TS]

  if a game makes me so frustrated that i [TS]

  have to turn it off and come back [TS]

  another day a bunch of times so now I [TS]

  nobody likes it nobody likes and it's a [TS]

  balance of like when does that happen to [TS]

  you you know I mean like it if some game [TS]

  some people are that frustrated by [TS]

  journey and that games are a game is no [TS]

  good for them so everything has to be [TS]

  targeted a certain level of [TS]

  understanding it from from my experience [TS]

  this game had no challenge that's not [TS]

  and I said it's not a bad thing journey [TS]

  had zero challenge for me as well in [TS]

  terms of like not understanding what to [TS]

  do I always understood what to do and I [TS]

  could execute it reasonably well and [TS]

  that's fine you can still have a great [TS]

  game like that but you need other things [TS]

  to offset it at least for me well [TS]

  there's different elements of challenge [TS]

  to right there's the the mental [TS]

  challenge of trying to figure out what's [TS]

  the how do I solve this puzzle or where [TS]

  I go next what do I do and there's games [TS]

  that have like I got frustrated with [TS]

  game earlier this week that was playing [TS]

  because it was too much of a like there [TS]

  was a reaction challenge where it's like [TS]

  all right I'm just not fast enough and [TS]

  we're aiming well enough to to defeat [TS]

  this boss it's like and that I just got [TS]

  so frustrated quicktime event [TS]

  yeah like oh my god but you had 26 times [TS]

  and it keeps resetting me back and I [TS]

  have to go through this part that I have [TS]

  gotten good at but I got stuck at the [TS]

  second part it's just like that to me is [TS]

  just so annoying that i'm going to put [TS]

  that game down but like there are a [TS]

  couple things with brothers work out [TS]

  like I mean that i did spend a long time [TS]

  on the one puzzle the first time that [TS]

  you you tied a rope to each other and [TS]

  you do the swinging puzzle like that [TS]

  took me a little bit of time like to [TS]

  just figure out like all right I got up [TS]

  here with the Rope okay how do I get out [TS]

  there and once I did figure out like [TS]

  okay all right you know i I've mastered [TS]

  that but like it is interesting how you [TS]

  know there are moments that are [TS]

  challenging without necessarily being [TS]

  like it's not sure really challenged in [TS]

  there [TS]

  even their kind of challenges you can [TS]

  kind of read her kind of there on the [TS]

  side that you can do if you want I mean [TS]

  for me I you know I was playing on the [TS]

  xbox and achievements the pop-up when [TS]

  you do things and brothers was [TS]

  interesting in that all the achievements [TS]

  were for things that were kind of off [TS]

  the beaten path and like I found the [TS]

  first one of those and then it's like [TS]

  you know a you know I like getting [TS]

  achievements because I got no challenge [TS]

  to me i want i got i got nine out of 12 [TS]

  the first time through and I went Wow [TS]

  I have achievements turned off when i'm [TS]

  in game because of all that concerned [TS]

  but I think I like that like I mean and [TS]

  mainly because i liked in this game you [TS]

  know you didn't need to get any of them [TS]

  but they were like letting you know that [TS]

  there were these little things off the [TS]

  path that you could find you can explore [TS]

  so as i was playing brothers it was like [TS]

  I was always looking for what's all the [TS]

  little side quest i want it i want to [TS]

  experience all the parts of the game [TS]

  that they designed right and i missed [TS]

  three out of 12 on the first playthrough [TS]

  and i went back and found this because [TS]

  it's like I want to see all the little [TS]

  side passages of this game because they [TS]

  were all extremely cute like the funny [TS]

  little interest or not no or not it is [TS]

  well yeah it turns out there's also like [TS]

  you know there's this how you feel about [TS]

  hands and said you'd so Dan mentioned [TS]

  gameplay mechanics and I you know I it [TS]

  wasn't hard to do [TS]

  there's a mechanic where the two [TS]

  brothers have to grasp this this thing [TS]

  and like they need to move it forward [TS]

  and and then and then move it left and [TS]

  there are a couple of able to drag a [TS]

  piece of wood right there are a bunch of [TS]

  things like that that i enjoyed just the [TS]

  fact that oh I've gotta you know i'm [TS]

  going to move them independently or I've [TS]

  got a pivot one forward and one back it [TS]

  was not particularly complicated but I [TS]

  there was it kind of a joy in 10 this is [TS]

  different i haven't done something like [TS]

  this and that was weirdly satisfying [TS]

  also that you had figured it out right [TS]

  like the beginning you first have to [TS]

  pick up the wheelbarrow with your dad in [TS]

  it's like all right go away i can push [TS]

  with both the guys alright i'm getting [TS]

  this you know and then the part where [TS]

  it's like there's you have to navigate [TS]

  like the pipe through like a little bit [TS]

  made to like jam one of the graves and I [TS]

  was like oh I can do this very smoothly [TS]

  now like you know have been practiced [TS]

  this for a while like there is a sense [TS]

  of achievement there and it is well [TS]

  there's no stupid tutorial mode right [TS]

  it's like going to start senior year you [TS]

  know your you have to figure out press [TS]

  this button press this button [TS]

  alright that's what you need to know [TS]

  John has has played games for probably [TS]

  several hundred [TS]

  red times longer than I have in total [TS]

  game time if not thousand but when i get [TS]

  at the end of the game when the young [TS]

  brother is at the water that experience [TS]

  was really good because and so my wife [TS]

  is watching this and and she's already [TS]

  pretty outraged at the fact that the big [TS]

  brother had died because she's like what [TS]

  the hell what the hell was that this is [TS]

  actually I what about the slow sequence [TS]

  where you had to bury him how God is not [TS]

  a man not a man yeah she's like what [TS]

  what is this game [TS]

  it seemed a little curl press x to dig [TS]

  it to dig a shallow grave that happens [TS]

  to me because I ice set the game aside [TS]

  for a while and i came back to it and [TS]

  and bren came in and I let me show you [TS]

  this game I've been playing and I came [TS]

  right back into the part with where she [TS]

  turns into a specter it was like all [TS]

  right I totally ruin this game for your [TS]

  sorry and then she's watching me as I'm [TS]

  like Derek my brother like you [TS]

  I'm so sorry I'm proud of you on the [TS]

  plus side they don't make you dig the [TS]

  hole they have continued my drag the [TS]

  body in and cover it up [TS]

  they just make you dump the dirt on your [TS]

  brother's lifeless course sobbing the [TS]

  whole wage used to get off joe pesci I'm [TS]

  fine i think the whole with this first [TS]

  hole I dug yeah so so but some say that [TS]

  the water i'm back that the Griffin foul [TS]

  creature has brought me back to home and [TS]

  i'm i'm at the water and I i I'm [TS]

  thinking okay how what's what's the [TS]

  solution here i run i trigger i run i go [TS]

  over here too i climb and nothing is [TS]

  working and so you know that's 30 [TS]

  seconds or not and then I i'm looking at [TS]

  it and then I think oh yeah right i need [TS]

  to i I need to use the brothers controls [TS]

  like I would have done before and you [TS]

  press the trigger and you hear the [TS]

  brother and the boy ventures often too [TS]

  even though he's afraid of the water and [TS]

  he can't swim to get across and that [TS]

  moment for me was really affecting even [TS]

  though I I to roll my eyes at the [TS]

  brother dying and being well this is [TS]

  very much manipulative but but that [TS]

  payoff I felt like was really powerful [TS]

  now my wife is sitting there watching [TS]

  and she just sees me start swimming and [TS]

  she gets to the end she's like well that [TS]

  was really lame and I said no no I do [TS]

  use the brothers consider another [TS]

  difference the difference between you [TS]

  having played the game [TS]

  and her watching the game is true thing [TS]

  about games because you were the one [TS]

  doing it not just after she had seen the [TS]

  earlier part of the games it's different [TS]

  when you are doing it and the thing you [TS]

  just have to earlier about like feeling [TS]

  good about having figured out of [TS]

  maneuver that's something that I i also [TS]

  mentioned in the journey podcast where [TS]

  you don't do much in journey just kind [TS]

  of like float around and fly and stuff [TS]

  but there's enough there's enough a [TS]

  variation in there that you feel like [TS]

  you by the end of the game you are [TS]

  pulling off moves with finesse and [TS]

  that's why talk about the final level [TS]

  and journey where you get to show [TS]

  Superman now I'm really good at this [TS]

  whole scar flying business and watch me [TS]

  show my stuff and that's your and that's [TS]

  why you you get the little park of like [TS]

  i have now learned how to navigate the [TS]

  wheelbarrow with two people and I can go [TS]

  up the cliff or whatever that the [TS]

  biggest fault i think for in brothers is [TS]

  that maybe they have you can do some of [TS]

  the same things too many times but maybe [TS]

  that's just because that's how many [TS]

  times more people need more repetition [TS]

  to master it whereas if you master the [TS]

  first time then the 17-time you're [TS]

  climbing up the walls like whatever but [TS]

  that you know that's that it that's what [TS]

  games are going for and I'm glad that [TS]

  you got an attitude even if I didn't in [TS]

  this particular game [TS]

  well i gotta to and I I'd I audibly was [TS]

  like you know when I figured it out i'm [TS]

  sitting there and I just you know [TS]

  oh my god like you know I had that [TS]

  moment of I know what are you doing here [TS]

  I know what I need to do and I was like [TS]

  you know that to me that payoff is worth [TS]

  it I know I i have that at the end of [TS]

  the game i was talking about like that [TS]

  the him saying he was satisfied like oh [TS]

  now I know how to swing on the ropes and [TS]

  like get along like that now the ending [TS]

  part it's definitely working i regard [TS]

  but I I do have my long litany of [TS]

  complaints and you guys you guys who [TS]

  chokes what if i get if i can quickly go [TS]

  through them and and uh yes please [TS]

  please move rapidly through the long [TS]

  with me I'll just be here nodding and [TS]

  and then at the end of what will try to [TS]

  say how good the game is to try to I'm [TS]

  gonna go get a drink go ahead job [TS]

  alright so world design I brothers and [TS]

  brothers this item [TS]

  yes brother yes brothers straight that's [TS]

  right herself medical and heads runs [TS]

  like straight-up medieval fantasy and [TS]

  the only possible to us is like a little [TS]

  bit of over saturated color and slightly [TS]

  cartoonish character proportions and eco [TS]

  like a and everything is compared with [TS]

  ego is like as the muted color palette [TS]

  thing which is totally also a trope that [TS]

  goes on there but i have to give the [TS]

  nautique in terms of being more [TS]

  distinctive like this look a little bit [TS]

  generic to me a lot of it has to do with [TS]

  the fact that uses unreal engine 3 which [TS]

  if you're a gamer you've seen a million [TS]

  times before like I you know I know what [TS]

  unreal engine games look like this looks [TS]

  like an unreal engine game which is fine [TS]

  and egos engine was novel an interesting [TS]

  night wasn't the unreal engine though it [TS]

  was the setting the setting was [TS]

  unbelievably generic yeah actually might [TS]

  be my seven-year-old son recognized all [TS]

  of the various tropes and and knew what [TS]

  to do with them without having to be [TS]

  told ya it didn't seem like it had like [TS]

  a big style message [TS]

  did he call the that the pretty girl [TS]

  that they saved from their horrible [TS]

  execution turned out to be a murderous [TS]

  spider lady now he didn't get to that [TS]

  part because his fingers fell off from [TS]

  the triggers that was actually for [TS]

  shadow which i thought was clever [TS]

  yeah it was it was very well fortunately [TS]

  the wall where the sacrificing their [TS]

  fighting off giant spiders and it's [TS]

  super creepy and the fact that she leaps [TS]

  like 800 yards the first time hearing [TS]

  like mean I wasn't marmol yeah that the [TS]

  language barrier thing again comparing [TS]

  with eco which also has characters that [TS]

  don't speak the language that you're [TS]

  speaking right and both have like a [TS]

  limited set of phrases that the players [TS]

  repeat you know the so similar in all [TS]

  these regards and in this particular [TS]

  thing I i found that you know in in [TS]

  brothers understanding the intent of the [TS]

  spoken words was more important to the [TS]

  gameplay and it was also more difficult [TS]

  for me to understand what they were [TS]

  saying like an eco you press the key to [TS]

  call someone and make some noise and the [TS]

  person comes you like that must be the [TS]

  calling noise but and brothers they have [TS]

  these long run subtitled dialogue [TS]

  sequences that it's like I'm I get the [TS]

  gist of what you're saying but if you're [TS]

  going to be talking that long with no [TS]

  sometimes I want to actually know what [TS]

  you're saying I felt like I was being [TS]

  left out of the experience of my own [TS]

  name [TS]

  well it's so meaningless was the [TS]

  conversation clearly that the music [TS]

  would swell at those points and drown [TS]

  out what the guy was saying at least on [TS]

  the pc version it was just like it was [TS]

  still too much talking 44 not really [TS]

  understanding what they're doing and a [TS]

  good example for me is like the very [TS]

  beginning of the game what is the goal [TS]

  of the game you know a journey like the [TS]

  throne mountain your face in eco is like [TS]

  old uh you know try to escape and [TS]

  brothers I kind of got the idea was like [TS]

  I do something to help save this guy who [TS]

  is your dad I assume right but it's like [TS]

  what am i what am I getting my looking [TS]

  for medicine i'm looking for magic am I [TS]

  going to find a person and bring your [TS]

  diagonal entry it's under control [TS]

  read the drive you all right now but it [TS]

  like it was it like what is that the [TS]

  world treating you [TS]

  your brother's the only ones in the [TS]

  world that don't know exactly where that [TS]

  tree is yeah there's a scroll which way [TS]

  to the other side of the world [TS]

  oh that's right over there there and I [TS]

  know like these are because they want [TS]

  you to part of his they want you to be [TS]

  to figure out from context which is kind [TS]

  of fun 4head is a language I don't know [TS]

  but I'm going to fear from context [TS]

  what's going on and that's fine it just [TS]

  felt like they did a little bit too much [TS]

  of leaving me out of the game that i was [TS]

  playing just a little bit too much just [TS]

  make it make it up use your imagination [TS]

  just maybe maybe that power was too [TS]

  challenging for me I think whatever we [TS]

  cover the gameplay thing with the baby [TS]

  penguin that does uh you know i mean it [TS]

  wasn't a challenge was essential the [TS]

  game but like a baby penguin linearity [TS]

  bothered me out of the two player [TS]

  experience obviously that's what this [TS]

  game is all about you know it's a [TS]

  different 2 player take on that you know [TS]

  then then journey or eco your journey [TS]

  the second player is another person [TS]

  which totally changes the equation makes [TS]

  it very and you don't need the second [TS]

  player but I think with the second place [TS]

  that's totally different and another [TS]

  human is way more interesting than AI [TS]

  and way more engaging you know that [TS]

  you're playing with an eco the other [TS]

  players AI which is the worst case [TS]

  that's like one long terrible escort [TS]

  mission and if you played lots of games [TS]

  you like I'll cut them i got it i'm [TS]

  gonna try to get this other thing is [TS]

  just about that as i recall [TS]

  yes but in the best case you become [TS]

  engaged that you are like protecting [TS]

  your little computer friend in the game [TS]

  and the computer friend in the game as a [TS]

  little bit more pliable than human print [TS]

  I think with with the two player [TS]

  experience the I mean I worked great for [TS]

  the gameplay but then the problem is [TS]

  like when you when you have a thing [TS]

  where you kill him and you feel like I'm [TS]

  being manipulated he gets killed off or [TS]

  whatever i do other things without 1i he [TS]

  dies and I'm like okay so is there [TS]

  something I could do to get the good [TS]

  ending where he doesn't die but that's [TS]

  my immediate thought right you don't [TS]

  have you after that happens I call and [TS]

  you shouldn't be really having that [TS]

  thought but like that that's what I'm [TS]

  thinking and the second one is I almost [TS]

  forgot the variable seen the pork barrel [TS]

  seen that redhead on the interactive [TS]

  burial seem like that is actually been [TS]

  done before as well which is fine i and [TS]

  i thought the the winter is a slight [TS]

  spoiler for the walking dead sorry but [TS]

  he you know that's the same type of [TS]

  interactive barriers in the walking that [TS]

  line everybody [TS]

  londa good and I think it's because that [TS]

  I mean maybe it's harder for your degree [TS]

  for a player that you were controlling [TS]

  or what am i doing my grieving for my [TS]

  left thumb like it's not quite the same [TS]

  as grieving for like grieving for [TS]

  another player character in the game or [TS]

  even another human player a mean it [TS]

  works because you're breathing for your [TS]

  brother but like at that point it's like [TS]

  okay well now the controls got a lot [TS]

  easier and like I mean is just a little [TS]

  thing to do but he had hard to control [TS]

  these my brother but my left hand has [TS]

  nothing to do now I could I could I have [TS]

  concluded for this podcast John does not [TS]

  have a brother nor has he ever met [TS]

  anyone with the Bible you how I do have [TS]

  a brother but like the best lighting is [TS]

  that guy is doomed [TS]

  I thought I thought I don't control them [TS]

  with my other thumb but I thought more [TS]

  than what i'm going to hope not [TS]

  how is your brother at pulling the legs [TS]

  off of giant spiders be good at that [TS]

  yeah I thought way more attached to the [TS]

  human beings and I play journey with and [TS]

  the AI player that I protected [TS]

  throughout eco than I did with his other [TS]

  player that I was controlling because I [TS]

  felt like I'm still alive like in just [TS]

  half of me is not innovating that worked [TS]

  in the later scenes where the character [TS]

  in the game was upset by that and like [TS]

  getting across the water and you know [TS]

  the dead mother and everything it kind [TS]

  of worked out but not i mean maybe it [TS]

  was just the way they paced the burial [TS]

  seen or whatever I just it it was [TS]

  missing something for me and I think [TS]

  what it was missing is because like the [TS]

  things that were good about it that you [TS]

  got to control players for the whole [TS]

  game worked against it when they killed [TS]

  one of them off because i felt like i [TS]

  was still like half alive you know I [TS]

  mean I mean I call that kind successful [TS]

  in some ways I mean like the you know I [TS]

  don't you mention think about the good [TS]

  ending and i that made me think of a [TS]

  mass effect just because that's another [TS]

  case where there are characters that can [TS]

  die permanently if you do the wrong [TS]

  thing and for me it was always i only [TS]

  played through those games once but I [TS]

  know like Jason tosses occasionally on [TS]

  the podcast is played through more times [TS]

  than I care to think about and he'll [TS]

  talk about like all the different [TS]

  endings I'm like but in my world [TS]

  this guy is dead like this character [TS]

  that would even occur to me to go back [TS]

  and like oh I should go back and replay [TS]

  it so that he remains alive no he's dead [TS]

  and that would be disrespecting his [TS]

  memory r.i.p left thumb [TS]

  yeah the ending at the ending of this [TS]

  one you know to completely spot you end [TS]

  up in a situation where the brothers [TS]

  dead [TS]

  the dad is alive and the mother died [TS]

  previously again [TS]

  and it's like is this a fair trade like [TS]

  if you had not given the father would [TS]

  have died but you're not your brother [TS]

  still alive right now because this is a [TS]

  factory condition [TS]

  it just seems like the funding also just [TS]

  to just to wrap things up nicely before [TS]

  the end credits the final scene is them [TS]

  now there are two gravestones out of the [TS]

  tree behind the house and the dad is [TS]

  sobbing uncontrollably later in the end [TS]

  always just like I wanted it hold it [TS]

  hold it in the distance you see the [TS]

  groupon thing flying by [TS]

  he's on his way back to get the older [TS]

  brother know and I hate that [TS]

  by the way I hate the fact that that's [TS]

  happened he's just going back to the [TS]

  tree to have some more cool leaves and [TS]

  spiderleg well he knows where there's an [TS]

  easy meal that's why he's headed back [TS]

  there i think i think the end of it for [TS]

  me i was turned around he was elected [TS]

  and for the rest of his life his father [TS]

  can never meet his eyes again and yeah [TS]

  like it kind of comes to that and I'm [TS]

  like wow this is way darker than I [TS]

  thought it was gonna be added by the end [TS]

  of this game when I was thinking to [TS]

  myself as well just another day in the [TS]

  grim blood so funny giant that offering [TS]

  yourself in a dreamworld the brothers [TS]

  I mean it's just like this place is that [TS]

  our man i do not want to live here [TS]

  you just need a music place that'll put [TS]

  you right out of it but just wait till [TS]

  the sequel brother at a loved one son [TS]

  and one very sad father now the fact the [TS]

  fact that the Griffin is flying back to [TS]

  get the older brother kinda ticked me [TS]

  off because I what I saw as as the [TS]

  obvious kind of a dark here is at the [TS]

  beginning the little brother is he's [TS]

  consumed with guilt for the death of his [TS]

  the drowning death of his mother and you [TS]

  know is spending his life grieving and [TS]

  what I was expecting to see at the end [TS]

  was as the father kind of falls apart [TS]

  the the younger brother having been [TS]

  strengthened by his experience with his [TS]

  older brother than you know kind of [TS]

  pulls his father out of it and they [TS]

  realize that you know there are things [TS]

  worth living for and they kind of move [TS]

  on with life and that that would have [TS]

  made some sense a little of the the [TS]

  older brother's death and i'd i would [TS]

  appreciate that ending a lot more than [TS]

  then the two possible endings we have [TS]

  here which is one everybody's dead and [TS]

  everybody sad half of them are dead and [TS]

  half of them yes I or something there's [TS]

  a happy ending that's about to happen [TS]

  with the groupon flying back and [TS]

  retrieving the brother who was buried in [TS]

  the dirt outside the tree of life and [TS]

  therefore is resurrected although [TS]

  probably slightly were made it comes [TS]

  back as a zombie in the next game you [TS]

  have to kill [TS]

  admit that cemetery brothers a tale of [TS]

  one son and one zombie but with three [TS]

  then get back together the mother [TS]

  suddenly rises from the sea and they [TS]

  have to fight her off [TS]

  yeah there was a moment when when you're [TS]

  in the ice the ice fields and the [TS]

  icebergs and all of that and again that [TS]

  was the way they have to row the boat is [TS]

  interesting is another interesting game [TS]

  mechanic where where there's mountains [TS]

  off in the distance and I can't wait to [TS]

  see if one of them had that beam of [TS]

  light coming out of it like journey it's [TS]

  just over there but I'll other like that [TS]

  i wanted to mention is i like how the [TS]

  like the trolls are used in this i found [TS]

  out that sort of tickled me that there's [TS]

  there's a patrol that you meet who is [TS]

  like totally terrifying except it turns [TS]

  out that he's really friendly and [TS]

  helpful and helps you get where you need [TS]

  to go [TS]

  I really like that then later there's a [TS]

  level where you have to release a troll [TS]

  from a cage by stealing a key from [TS]

  another troll at and at that point then [TS]

  you have to lock the the the troll [TS]

  captor in the cage and then you see that [TS]

  the troll that you've released is [TS]

  reunited with her you know beloved other [TS]

  troll and there's like this shrimp [TS]

  portion of the game yeah I didn't see [TS]

  that coming because when you first see [TS]

  the other girl here that zombies really [TS]

  bad what he said about yes I thought it [TS]

  would be good for kids like two people [TS]

  are hanging from trees and stuff maybe [TS]

  not so good for can maybe the end it [TS]

  gets a little later look about like it [TS]

  like the top totally it didn't [TS]

  it's a little bit too much easier pixie [TS]

  and it's more like a Grimm fairy tale [TS]

  yes actual script yet it's very totally [TS]

  at I think tied to the grimm fairy tales [TS]

  those were all nasty is how people are [TS]

  always dying left and right and that was [TS]

  considered a happy ending right i mean [TS]

  is the part for me when I got to the [TS]

  we're getting a giant's for me and at [TS]

  first I get anyone else having a giant [TS]

  ice [TS]

  wait a second i think it's when the [TS]

  first time isn't in the tower you go to [TS]

  the tower first well yeah in the towers [TS]

  the first time write like that my first [TS]

  thought was wait for it does it turn out [TS]

  that we're really small when everything [TS]

  related a blue twilight zone and then I [TS]

  had the Giants part where you're [TS]

  navigating through the battlefield and [TS]

  that was disturbing I mean there's the [TS]

  part where you have to like shoot the [TS]

  crossbow not the guy that came into the [TS]

  dead Giants night because Alice if thats [TS]

  that's something I haven't done in a [TS]

  game before i had not caused the giant [TS]

  axe to fall to chop off someone's leg so [TS]

  I can pass through the linear car door [TS]

  of a game it was pretty brutal [TS]

  I mean yeah that's surprise my kids [TS]

  about that was hilarious [TS]

  yes that's the thing is the hanging and [TS]

  the Giants getting chopped up that just [TS]

  goes right over their heads [TS]

  you're not leaving until you paddle they [TS]

  can a canoe through a waterfall of blood [TS]

  but that was hardly growth has been [TS]

  impersonating a monster the tone never [TS]

  really committed to like what when you [TS]

  when you cut yourself in blood and get [TS]

  on your brother shoulders like is that a [TS]

  slapstick comedy moment or is it [TS]

  horrifying because you're cutting you [TS]

  and your brother when God and scary you [TS]

  know a little bit like this one side [TS]

  like it starts off very light-hearted [TS]

  and you can go like harder than get dark [TS]

  or whatever but it's like light-hearted [TS]

  but then it gets like a dark but also [TS]

  kind of slapstick and never quite knew [TS]

  where it was going there just kind of [TS]

  teetering back and forth and then at the [TS]

  end he really wants to go for the gut [TS]

  punch and it's like wow it's like you [TS]

  have always liked was not know i mean it [TS]

  like that you're always one single tone [TS]

  I know but it's only a two-hour gate [TS]

  minute I i like the transition I thought [TS]

  it was cute the way it kind of like I [TS]

  mean stuff gets darker and scarier and [TS]

  and I thought my head was going out [TS]

  tonight that that was the point at which [TS]

  you know became interesting for me the [TS]

  whole troll and mind sequence was all I [TS]

  had been there done that and then that [TS]

  they're out there with the wolves and [TS]

  they're you know they run across the [TS]

  guys hanging himself and this is just [TS]

  got a little bit more going for that [TS]

  didn't have anyone not say it not say [TS]

  that here guy [TS]

  no I think he liked you not have to i [TS]

  know you don't have to you can just let [TS]

  it go years let him hang [TS]

  you never do that no I didn't do it [TS]

  right I say we blew right through there [TS]

  the people should play brothers I think [TS]

  it's worth playing maybe I think more [TS]

  than more than Steve I think it's you [TS]

  know you should play a game that's good [TS]

  no no I highly recommend people play it [TS]

  i think that the art was gorgeous [TS]

  although generic [TS]

  and in fact I thought it was nice that [TS]

  they placed benches at random areas just [TS]

  matches the benches the most emblematic [TS]

  thing about how this game is inspired by [TS]

  ego but fails to live up to that [TS]

  standard is they put the benches in so [TS]

  obviously as a direct homage to the [TS]

  benches and ego which you sit on with [TS]

  with your order to save you and they did [TS]

  it in such a way it like that [TS]

  okay we're gonna do this we love that in [TS]

  any code we're going to put them in our [TS]

  game but they made you hold down both [TS]

  triggers to stay on the bench the bench [TS]

  is supposed to be relaxing [TS]

  you can't make me tense both my fingers [TS]

  and hold my turn with them the whole [TS]

  time to stay on the benches they missed [TS]

  the entire point of the benches [TS]

  oh my god that drove him insane i was [TS]

  every time I saw every time I saw bench [TS]

  I got angry and Lee we don't know what's [TS]

  it what's it like being driven insane [TS]

  i'm not really sure but please play [TS]

  short drives I've never met John in [TS]

  person is there a thing that just [TS]

  constantly throbs on a4a yes I thought [TS]

  there is i'm all vain means all the way [TS]

  down sometimes it just blood squirts out [TS]

  of his eyes was talking I just couldn't [TS]

  i consider because i love it's like the [TS]

  typewriters and resident evil like it's [TS]

  supposed to be an interlude it's [TS]

  supposed to be the nice music plays and [TS]

  everybody's come and we take a break and [TS]

  are you just hold down both these [TS]

  triggers hard as you can the whole done [TS]

  otherwise you can't get the city can [TS]

  look at the nice scenery if you don't [TS]

  know the triggers for students you like [TS]

  all one of them the cameras pans back [TS]

  and you don't look at the scenery [TS]

  anymore [TS]

  I think you're holding your triggers too [TS]

  long yeah i think that that's out of the [TS]

  closet we're going to be a little [TS]

  lighter on the trigger finger [TS]

  Thank You retaining something else to [TS]

  let it out man [TS]

  are you there Steve it's me margaret I'm [TS]

  a little conflicted about the fact that [TS]

  I had to to make the one white bunny [TS]

  become a black body in order for the [TS]

  United that was a little distressing [TS]

  yeah [TS]

  nope you know that part didn't know what [TS]

  I had no 90 triangle slipped off the [TS]

  only thing I got no trophies it was [TS]

  blowing the giant horn I Carol sheep all [TS]

  the way to that thing to make the sheet [TS]

  black it's a little cheaper irresistible [TS]

  the sheep are the best part of the game [TS]

  but like no no the best part is when you [TS]

  fire your brother in a catapult that was [TS]

  good that is awesome i liked writing the [TS]

  glider because I did [TS]

  that section like seven that was that [TS]

  dialing not know you can hide I really [TS]

  and I didn't know maybe you can join [TS]

  that crafted many times many times I did [TS]

  not like the younger brother going whoa [TS]

  he was like bad flashbacks and yeah now [TS]

  you transmit is his whole voice could [TS]

  have gone completely out the window far [TS]

  as I'm concerned you talk a little bit [TS]

  about about things you play too many [TS]

  times that the glider i kinda liked and [TS]

  wish I could have done a little longer [TS]

  because i really enjoyed that mechanic [TS]

  of the the shimmying of the two guys on [TS]

  the glider to make it till let me tell [TS]

  you pick up far cry 3 or Assassin's [TS]

  Creed unity and railways come on a lot [TS]

  of time in a glider that I won't do it [TS]

  yeah I refuse I know those games are too [TS]

  long too long for just too long [TS]

  give me another so is this some gamers [TS]

  is this a new genre of game the [TS]

  three-hour video game a two-hour video [TS]

  game because if it is i really like it I [TS]

  the time two hours good video game is no [TS]

  yeah i think it is i mean i think that's [TS]

  basically the idea is not every game has [TS]

  to be 60 hours 60 bucks and some games [TS]

  are shorting some games are long as you [TS]

  know we can deliver games digitally and [TS]

  we can price the price them however we [TS]

  feel like it we have room for short [TS]

  stories and novels [TS]

  yes a game games have been getting [TS]

  shorter for years now because it's so [TS]

  much more expensive to create content [TS]

  for them unless your rockstar can spend [TS]

  200 million dollars on a game because [TS]

  you games used to be routinely 20 30 40 [TS]

  hours easily and now it's like case with [TS]

  our budget we can make a 10-hour game [TS]

  when it first started happening people [TS]

  are like what a ripoff this is a [TS]

  sixty-dollar game and i finished in 10 [TS]

  hours but you know but it costs so much [TS]

  money to do all this high res things [TS]

  with all the the 3d models with more you [TS]

  know polygons in them and everything and [TS]

  all the music that you have to do in the [TS]

  voice-acting it just became too [TS]

  expensive and i think this is the [TS]

  logical conclusion it's like all right [TS]

  well now that people accept that [TS]

  how about we condense down our best [TS]

  ideas into as long as long as they take [TS]

  and our may be our best ideas only feel [TS]

  two hours and that's great because now [TS]

  the budget for the assets that we have [TS]

  to make all the voice-acting everything [TS]

  isn't that big [TS]

  and so here you go and I think people of [TS]

  critics and players have proven they [TS]

  like this type of game so i hope you see [TS]

  more of in the future because it's [TS]

  preferable to you know is the only other [TS]

  option 200 million dollar GTA or a [TS]

  really really crappy 10 our game I would [TS]

  not [TS]

  brother had this yeah i agree i I and as [TS]

  somebody who like i said i have that [TS]

  whole thing about I'm gonna buy this [TS]

  game and I'm gonna play it for I'm gonna [TS]

  play it for five or ten hours anyway [TS]

  that's that's the most remember what do [TS]

  so I would be happy to pay fifteen or [TS]

  twenty dollars for a three-hour game [TS]

  experience and then if I really really [TS]

  like it then I'll go back into [TS]

  achievements or things like that i mean [TS]

  i play journey through three or four [TS]

  times [TS]

  my daughter was playing journey this [TS]

  morning my wife's play journey all the [TS]

  way through a couple of times i'm a [TS]

  couple James away from getting the white [TS]

  robe which is the last thing I wanted to [TS]

  do in journey promote my daughter was [TS]

  playing it today and singing to do you [TS]

  know what a guy as they were going up [TS]

  the mountain and it was great it was you [TS]

  know do you see yourself playing [TS]

  brothers again [TS]

  uh no no no they're not going to play it [TS]

  that way back in and played it to get [TS]

  all the little side things and now i [TS]

  feel like i've experienced everything in [TS]

  that game so i don't think i need to do [TS]

  that i might read about the side things [TS]

  and if the side things sound interesting [TS]

  maybe i would go back but i think it's [TS]

  unlikely i'd actually rather play [TS]

  journey again but i mean i don't think [TS]

  i'll go back and play gone home again I [TS]

  think I got everything you know about [TS]

  that but you know yeah i won't i won't [TS]

  play gone home again i met i will [TS]

  probably have my son play through this [TS]

  when I think he's old enough to handle [TS]

  and appreciate it but I won't play [TS]

  through it again but interestingly i [TS]

  have played three co more than one time [TS]

  and not because I'm getting like you [TS]

  know I've done everything in that game a [TS]

  million times but just because it's kind [TS]

  of like watching a movie you've seen [TS]

  over and over again and like you've got [TS]

  home was just like a little bit better [TS]

  maybe that would be the experience many [TS]

  people do have that experience of like I [TS]

  just wanted I know exactly what's gonna [TS]

  happen this movie but i just want to [TS]

  watch it again because such a ride i [TS]

  play eco every couple of years over [TS]

  again just because i love the experience [TS]

  of playing the game even though I know [TS]

  everything that's going to happen i [TS]

  almost never play a narrative game again [TS]

  the second time I just it's in some ways [TS]

  it's so much so involving and so so much [TS]

  work to go through it that you know i [TS]

  just kind of find a kind of training and [TS]

  the idea of like starting over again is [TS]

  to me very very like oh god I don't [TS]

  think I can take that especially when I [TS]

  know where the plot goes even games were [TS]

  like mass effect where you can change [TS]

  the outcome I just effect mass effect [TS]

  it's a little bit longer and play well [TS]

  yeah I'm just saying I yeah a lot of [TS]

  those games i just have trouble going [TS]

  back to i mean the games that I play [TS]

  over and over again more games with like [TS]

  multiplayer stuff for you know it seems [TS]

  they're more like [TS]

  no sport games right perhaps but like [TS]

  you know prince of persia it's like all [TS]

  right I can try and like beat this right [TS]

  like it farther in this game than I have [TS]

  before what have you and i'm in the [TS]

  replay the replay camp for sure because [TS]

  i am in the midst of playing grim [TS]

  fandango for like the fifth time right [TS]

  now and just fantastic experience every [TS]

  single time that these two probably not [TS]

  so much [TS]

  you know I rarely have wanted to go back [TS]

  and reread are you there god it's me [TS]

  margaret either so yeah i reckin fourth [TS]

  grade nothing like 10 * well I do love [TS]

  that one [TS]

  if this had been more of in that vein I [TS]

  would probably have played twice already [TS]

  yeah i think the only games that I've [TS]

  replayed regularly the LucasArts [TS]

  adventure games like secret of monkey [TS]

  island group and grim fandango and [TS]

  things like that but yeah kind of like [TS]

  chase and I have enough games and [TS]

  haven't finished or haven't even got to [TS]

  start yet that you know multiplayer is [TS]

  really the only thing that gets me going [TS]

  back to it i still have to finish eco [TS]

  yeah you can start that over again it's [TS]

  only 10 hours it's not like this we shit [TS]

  shadow of the colossus to ego is the ego [TS]

  is the old version of journey like in [TS]

  terms of wow it's so short but it but [TS]

  now compared to the actual to our [TS]

  journey game I'll 10 hours that's like a [TS]

  full game shadow I i continue to think [TS]

  you'll never make it through but i wish [TS]

  i wish you luck [TS]

  it is long thanks thanks John it isn't [TS]

  it is not short and there is you will [TS]

  get frustrated and yeah which will be [TS]

  said but like it has a higher skill [TS]

  barrier than equals which is why i [TS]

  totally recommend equal to almost [TS]

  anybody and then shadow it's like with [TS]

  your gamer you should play but if you're [TS]

  not it's gonna burn you screw that huh [TS]

  you should let you should like the first [TS]

  the first level or 10 hours a boss [TS]

  fights will wear on the end [TS]

  yeah yeah that's yeah but will wear a [TS]

  non-gamer but the first one is worth [TS]

  experiencing and it's kind of a shame [TS]

  you can't hear myself and everyone at [TS]

  those that sounds like wearing on meat [TS]

  now I get sound too terrible to me at [TS]

  first i was like i love those you guys [TS]

  made the second game it's all boss [TS]

  fights I hate boss fights why would you [TS]

  ever and then I'd like okay I get it and [TS]

  it enjoyed it [TS]

  yeah it is its yeah alright I i [TS]

  recommend it [TS]

  hey before we go I want to ask everybody [TS]

  like we do with our book club we well I [TS]

  I ask you what are you reading but that [TS]

  would be very off topic for an episode [TS]

  developed video games so how about what [TS]

  are you playing Dan Morgan what are you [TS]

  playing you know I'm a standstill this [TS]

  Marco panelists Tony similar because the [TS]

  the beginning I just played or we're [TS]

  almost done with which we are playing [TS]

  multiplayer is a game called monaco [TS]

  which is super super fun and you should [TS]

  pick it up things on steam as well as [TS]

  experts like a multiplayer you know [TS]

  yeah I co-simulation you do like slots [TS]

  and baccarat less of that more of [TS]

  robbing things blind super fun game that [TS]

  like sort of follows a bunch of high [TS]

  strokes like you have different [TS]

  characters like a locksmith and the guy [TS]

  knocks people out and look out and [TS]

  they'll have special powers and the top [TS]

  down very stylized game but it's a lot [TS]

  of fun great multiplayer I mean one of [TS]

  the better multiplayer experiences I've [TS]

  had a really really long time and yeah I [TS]

  i highly recommend it it's not too long [TS]

  not super stylized to like that's the [TS]

  thing that yes even trying to figure out [TS]

  the total and that's that's interesting [TS]

  to it again we gamers if you played tons [TS]

  of games with people look like people [TS]

  like wow this does not look like games [TS]

  and once you figure it out it all has a [TS]

  language that kind of makes sense [TS]

  you see the matrix is like all that you [TS]

  stop seeing the big blocks you starting [TS]

  seeing people [TS]

  yeah that's cool i like it a lot Monica [TS]

  ok now we go to game i'm also playing it [TS]

  yeah Donny Tony Tony what else are you [TS]

  playing or anything [TS]

  um I've been playing Monica with gotta [TS]

  go that's great i just finished [TS]

  Assassin's Creed 3 which came out like a [TS]

  year ago but obviously I was just [TS]

  tearing through but it's an ok game i'm [TS]

  trying to clear through my [TS]

  embarrassingly large backlog so i can [TS]

  play the new Grand Theft Auto but i have [TS]

  two big backlog of my new games and I've [TS]

  been playing a bunch of games on my iPad [TS]

  recently the they came out with a new [TS]

  version of small world that is has [TS]

  multiplayer instead of just passing play [TS]

  and that's been playing that i have [TS]

  about seven or eight games a small world [TS]

  going at any time I don't know Sony what [TS]

  the hell [TS]

  smallworlds you know if there is a board [TS]

  game of that which I owned and play [TS]

  previously and the absolutely the iOS [TS]

  version of it is just great because it [TS]

  does the the score keeping for you and [TS]

  it you know it makes the rule [TS]

  ok simpler by enforcing them in a game [TS]

  state so you could as opposed to like [TS]

  setting up and playing small world would [TS]

  easily taken our this you can play a [TS]

  game and you know 15 minutes on or you [TS]

  know you play it one move a day over the [TS]

  course of multiple days so I'm playing a [TS]

  lot of that enjoy that [TS]

  that means all right Steve what are you [TS]

  playing can't believe it took you a year [TS]

  to get the assassins creed 3 tony you [TS]

  know I played all the other ones and I i [TS]

  started playing assassin's creed 3 and [TS]

  it did not grab me as much as the other [TS]

  ones there's some interesting stuff in [TS]

  there but it's a little bloated in terms [TS]

  of having all this stuff that you can do [TS]

  like you know you can be you know the [TS]

  famous assassin or you can spend a lot [TS]

  of time managing your like you know [TS]

  merchants there's a whole merchant [TS]

  minigame in here and I'm like why am I [TS]

  doing this but I need to do this to earn [TS]

  money so i can unlock the next thing and [TS]

  ya didn't grab me but you do get to cut [TS]

  out George Washington at the end so I [TS]

  like that [TS]

  well I just finished Ultima 5 that only [TS]

  took me 25 years [TS]

  yeah well I've never finished altima 4dr [TS]

  going to start with we're back in the [TS]

  day but I went to the Avatar i decided i [TS]

  have to finish all of them except [TS]

  perhaps for eight and 9i might not [TS]

  necessarily have to deal with us if they [TS]

  did not did not sound like they were [TS]

  true to the ultimate mythos or gameplay [TS]

  but at any rate finished altima five and [TS]

  right now since it's a the halloween [TS]

  season i finally got around to starting [TS]

  diablo 3 is whichever yeah it's Diablo [TS]

  slightly slightly dumped down from the [TS]

  previous feel like looking [TS]

  yeah whole lot of clicking hope you [TS]

  enjoy carpal tunnel and it looks nice [TS]

  that isolated monster is nice looking [TS]

  game although not as nice as i was [TS]

  expecting given well I mean it's still [TS]

  Diablo that's it that's true that's true [TS]

  so i'm having some fun with that at the [TS]

  same time I'm starting up another replay [TS]

  of Silent Hill 3 which is probably the [TS]

  scariest of of the Silent Hill games at [TS]

  least the ones that I've played which i [TS]

  highly recommend for anybody who really [TS]

  wants a good haunted town game not just [TS]

  a haunted house and yeah that's a good [TS]

  one [TS]

  probably fourth or fifth replay of that [TS]

  and it still scares the crap out of me [TS]

  every single time and as mentioned i'm [TS]

  also trucking through grim fandango [TS]

  again because you got team every once in [TS]

  awhile [TS]

  what is that a-what can you play that on [TS]

  right now [TS]

  that did they put that to modern systems [TS]

  now you gonna you got to do some dosbox [TS]

  foo i didn't even talk to have checked [TS]

  good old games to see if they've got a [TS]

  version of that but because a bunch of [TS]

  the classic LucasArts adventures they [TS]

  ported for some of them are even [TS]

  available for iOS like Secret of Monkey [TS]

  Island but not not all of them [TS]

  grim fandango is a great one it's [TS]

  fantastic probably the best adventure [TS]

  game i think all told you know story and [TS]

  puzzles and everything combined it's [TS]

  probably best that I've ever played and [TS]

  I played a lot i like that i think i [TS]

  like the little slightly wackier ones [TS]

  that like salmon max but Griffin it was [TS]

  a great game there's a lot of wackiness [TS]

  though in grim fandango probably more [TS]

  than I remember I remember [TS]

  yeah just having the guy who played not [TS]

  el guapo but his his sidekick who asks [TS]

  about the or who who says there's a [TS]

  plethora of pinatas without actually [TS]

  knowing what a plethora is as the main [TS]

  characters voice is is a huge boon is [TS]

  he's he's hilarious for anyone [TS]

  unfamiliar contango grim fandango is [TS]

  film noir meets Mexican Day of the Dead [TS]

  and you're basically a kind of a travel [TS]

  agent for the dead who get your affected [TS]

  your rewrite a murder mystery you know [TS]

  except it's an interesting murder [TS]

  mystery because everyone's dead [TS]

  I fantastic game if any of you have not [TS]

  played that i highly recommend you seek [TS]

  that out because it is literally other [TS]

  probably in my top three games ever [TS]

  yeah that's that's right didn't sell [TS]

  very well because it came out in 1998 at [TS]

  the same year that I starcraft and [TS]

  half-life game [TS]

  ok so Tim Schafer though you can't go [TS]

  wrong I'm Schaefer so if you're playing [TS]

  against even the video game draft yes we [TS]

  do some crazy like that video games are [TS]

  at early [TS]

  yeah you're sad and happy at the same [TS]

  time John circular what are you playing [TS]

  so I'm going through the HD remake of [TS]

  wind maker which is a game is the first [TS]

  of the game that I had my son play and [TS]

  he's played through it many many times i [TS]

  played through many many times I don't [TS]

  know if I would be interested in going [TS]

  through it again [TS]

  but they changed enough things that i [TS]

  mentioned the first of all looks looks [TS]

  really nice and it looks different than [TS]

  the original game not just because HD [TS]

  but because they change the graphics a [TS]

  little bit as well just a little bit and [TS]

  just it comes off differently but it [TS]

  does make me do it is appreciate how [TS]

  amazing the original games graphics [TS]

  cards i think now it's slightly less [TS]

  pure than it was but it's very pretty [TS]

  looking [TS]

  oh but I have complaints about this [TS]

  remake mostly having to do what you [TS]

  really get the control know you have [TS]

  time look nice [TS]

  I so wish I could play this game with [TS]

  the original controller because they be [TS]

  the gamepad and the pro controller both [TS]

  we have both of them we tried both of [TS]

  them either one of them comes close to [TS]

  the experience of playing the game with [TS]

  the original controller and the menu [TS]

  systems all god how many times I have to [TS]

  go to those menus like I guess it's nice [TS]

  to be using the touchpad all I can look [TS]

  at his touch or whatever but that I find [TS]

  that slower than the muscle memory of [TS]

  like going into the screen and picking [TS]

  an item and coming back out quickly [TS]

  continually frustrated but that's every [TS]

  time I had to to visit the the inventory [TS]

  stranger or deal with the control system [TS]

  it's frustrating but the game looks [TS]

  beautiful and they changed the game just [TS]

  enough to get rid of the super annoying [TS]

  things like we have a new sale that [TS]

  makes you go twice as fast and that [TS]

  makes that makes a lot of difference i [TS]

  was going to say I always felt like that [TS]

  game was padded with having a sale over [TS]

  here that's a light game I like the [TS]

  sailing and I I always thought they [TS]

  should have condensed into like in the [TS]

  middle of this game is one big massive [TS]

  sea journey that you feel a sense of [TS]

  accomplishment with after having [TS]

  completed but they didn't do that is [TS]

  that it's a bunch of series of small [TS]

  trips but I if you've never played the [TS]

  game I almost say that you should like [TS]

  get a gamecube or our game compatible we [TS]

  and play the original instead of the HD [TS]

  remake which I usually don't say about [TS]

  HD remakes but this year it does feel [TS]

  like a different game and it feels like [TS]

  a game made for people who played the [TS]

  first game was just fine i'm one of [TS]

  those people but that's the only [TS]

  reservation i would say is if you've [TS]

  never played the original game your i [TS]

  would say play the original games you [TS]

  have played the original game it's worth [TS]

  getting this to revisit it with a little [TS]

  twist [TS]

  where does that rank is as far as your [TS]

  favorite little games don't you think [TS]

  ah it if fluctuates because it and it is [TS]

  wrapped up a little bit of my sons and [TS]

  like the cars movie it's not my number [TS]

  one for sure at it's like fighting two [TS]

  and three maybe [TS]

  twilight princess keeps going up as i [TS]

  get older [TS]

  by the way that in the reference to HD [TS]

  remakes stay the hell away from the [TS]

  silent hill 2 and 3 HD ram not that you [TS]

  guys are going to rush out and buy him [TS]

  anything but wow did they do a [TS]

  screwed-up job on that poor yeah those [TS]

  are really like HD HD remix out there [TS]

  just like we got the game to run on a [TS]

  newer system basically and it turns out [TS]

  that they had I think some some early [TS]

  code before had fully been debugged but [TS]

  i think the biggest problem is that they [TS]

  that team silent when they made those [TS]

  games they really did some weird things [TS]

  with the hardware and I think that that [TS]

  one of the crucial components of the [TS]

  Silent Hill games is the fog [TS]

  man walked right into that one day they [TS]

  failed utterly to render the fog [TS]

  properly in these remakes and I think [TS]

  it's because they were doing something [TS]

  just really bizarre with the hardware to [TS]

  make it work properly and it was trying [TS]

  to make it work with the the playstation [TS]

  3 graphics hardware just was beyond the [TS]

  Ken of these Porter's I think they had a [TS]

  lot of budget to work with anyway but [TS]

  yeah I mean that the game is pretty much [TS]

  completely ruined too far more than [TS]

  three but yeah if you feel that you want [TS]

  to get into the Silent Hill universe [TS]

  stay the hell away from the thinking [TS]

  high-def remakes because it actually [TS]

  they actually have destroyed the game [TS]

  it amazes me that you love these old [TS]

  games so much it seems that such a low [TS]

  tolerance for like the gameplay tropes [TS]

  my god gone home with Judy Blume book in [TS]

  the skate like you're such a grumpy old [TS]

  man with the gameplay trailer so you go [TS]

  back to play these games and they have [TS]

  so many creepy things number of the [TS]

  control scheme to like the the gameplay [TS]

  mechanics limited limited by the [TS]

  technology of the time but you're [TS]

  totally tolerant of those but any new [TS]

  game that comes out not taking that crap [TS]

  from this game [TS]

  well I can appreciate them for for [TS]

  having played them when they were out so [TS]

  you know I can forgive a game that's 15 [TS]

  years old for playing like 15 year-old [TS]

  John you would never be critical of a [TS]

  movie where they went back and redid [TS]

  certain scenes and smooth you know [TS]

  improved graphics and stuff like that [TS]

  right now that's as i wrote I wrote a [TS]

  blog post about this why why do I hate [TS]

  the prequels and make this ball is [TS]

  different why don't the special editions [TS]

  and I'm don't hate remakes of video [TS]

  games and i wrote a whole blog post [TS]

  about it now if you're just joining us [TS]

  this is our for of hypercritical he's [TS]

  not so if you were to go to [TS]

  hypercritical taco and read my post [TS]

  about the winwaker remake you would [TS]

  learn all about it which we remake is [TS]

  that we can remember it for you [TS]

  wholesale that you got it i read that [TS]

  months but when the game was announced [TS]

  before the game actually came out and [TS]

  explains in detail why I think game [TS]

  remakes are more acceptable to me then [TS]

  going back and changing a movie [TS]

  alright the short answer is i can still [TS]

  play the original winwaker boom George [TS]

  Lucas Jason what are you playing right [TS]

  now [TS]

  dan I'm playing like some some [TS]

  battleship [TS]

  whenever quality stuff there maybe maybe [TS]

  words with friends stratego ya little [TS]

  minesweeper little solitaire some mario [TS]

  kart wii long little mancala go away [TS]

  thanks war [TS]

  yeah yeah so go fish you kids are [TS]

  playing journey that's good [TS]

  my kids are playing journey my family is [TS]

  playing playing small world out in the [TS]

  living room right now I saw it yeah [TS]

  happy to respond to Lauren on twitter [TS]

  about the yeah when you get the white [TS]

  robe Jason you have to at least go on [TS]

  one playthrough to help to help somebody [TS]

  as a white rose unit you have to fill [TS]

  that role it is obligated as you do that [TS]

  person entirely failed to appreciate [TS]

  that you have spent that long in the [TS]

  game and that's okay you can take your [TS]

  word get the white robe in like to game [TS]

  two to run through this is not right no [TS]

  you just have to go find a little lot of [TS]

  guys yeah yeah they glow [TS]

  yeah anyway I played these two games [TS]

  that we talked about and then and now [TS]

  and now we're done [TS]

  so I'd like to thank my panel for [TS]

  joining me on this adventure where I [TS]

  play video games which i almost never [TS]

  play and they play video games which [TS]

  they almost always seem to be playing [TS]

  smell have played it [TS]

  that's pretty much it i am a babe in the [TS]

  woods I represent the audience that's [TS]

  interested in video games but just [TS]

  doesn't know what to do or where to [TS]

  start [TS]

  that's me i have no idea what I'm doing [TS]

  is make it do worse than to start with [TS]

  the game like brothers [TS]

  yeah yeah absolutely alright so I'd like [TS]

  to thank my panelists for playing these [TS]

  games and for joining us tonight on the [TS]

  uncomfortable to steve lets a pleasure [TS]

  as always [TS]

  no the pleasure is all mine Jason it is [TS]

  actually I know back i know you're [TS]

  welcome Steve Johnson acusa thank you [TS]

  for being here [TS]

  I'm thinking about rerecording this [TS]

  podcast if i get a good ending [TS]

  yeah that's the one where Steve dies [TS]

  right [TS]

  it went wrong about our six for me i [TS]

  don't think i got a lot far back [TS]

  yeah Tony settle our thank you very much [TS]

  i'm still not clear how i get all the [TS]

  tivos for this [TS]

  yeah that's it you may pass through with [TS]

  only some of the trophies you may have [TS]

  to play this podcast again and a more'n [TS]

  thank you [TS]

  never again I mean good to be here a [TS]

  pleasure yourself [TS]

  what was that the ghost of dan more'n [TS]

  telling us know those ghostly sounds [TS]

  more like never again as much about sun [TS]

  cartoon basically and i'll be the father [TS]

  from brothers so I just crying [TS]

  intensively agreeing with Danny's dead [TS]

  and i could hear it boys [TS]

  let us remember this moment forever stop [TS]

  pressing the left trigger son you're [TS]

  making me cry [TS]

  ok and for all of us here at the [TS]

  uncomfortable thanks for joining us in [TS]

  our little conversation about video [TS]

  games we'll see you next time [TS]

  attention and comparable listeners if [TS]

  you stuck around this far in a couple of [TS]

  episodes we're gonna be discussing old [TS]

  movies again yes it's old movie club [TS]

  edition number two with Philip Michaels [TS]

  this time he's going to be showing his [TS]

  movies from 1952 there is a movie that [TS]

  didn't get nominated for an oscar for [TS]

  best picture [TS]

  singing in the rain classic a movie that [TS]

  did get nominated but didn't win [TS]

  high noon and then there's the winner to [TS]

  create a show on earth if you'd like to [TS]

  watch those movies in a couple of [TS]

  episodes you can hear us talking about [TS]

  from so stay tuned for that [TS]

  thanks for listening [TS]