Cortex 47: Picking Up the Breadcrumbs


00:00:00   we have a secret we have a secret that [TS]

00:00:02   we've kept from our listeners gray we do [TS]

00:00:04   it's not a big scandal I should be [TS]

00:00:07   should we'd make it out to be a scandal [TS]

00:00:09   no that's no that's no that's asking for [TS]

00:00:12   trouble okay no scam that's asking for [TS]

00:00:14   trouble no but we do have a secret the [TS]

00:00:17   last two episodes of cortex were [TS]

00:00:20   recorded back to bank mmm they were we [TS]

00:00:24   are optimizing we were trying to [TS]

00:00:25   optimize right trying to improve our [TS]

00:00:28   work clothes all about were clear [TS]

00:00:30   improvement on this show hmm so we [TS]

00:00:32   recorded two episodes back to back now [TS]

00:00:34   why did we do this you should be great I [TS]

00:00:36   feel like you are trying to blame this [TS]

00:00:38   all on me Mike I know I really looking [TS]

00:00:42   for your insight into why we would [TS]

00:00:45   undertake an experiment of this of this [TS]

00:00:47   nature let's just say this is part of [TS]

00:00:51   gray industries attempts at doing some [TS]

00:00:56   experiments in time reorganization over [TS]

00:00:59   2017 perhaps one could say redirecting [TS]

00:01:02   how time is spent in ways big and in [TS]

00:01:06   ways small so this this was a thing that [TS]

00:01:08   we decided to try and what I was very [TS]

00:01:11   curious to see is if anybody would [TS]

00:01:14   notice if there was any suspicion not [TS]

00:01:16   one person and he comes in the reddit [TS]

00:01:19   nothing and i have to say i was i was [TS]

00:01:22   pleased because to me listening to that [TS]

00:01:24   show the second show that we recorded [TS]

00:01:26   immediately after recording the first [TS]

00:01:28   one I just kept thinking oh it's so [TS]

00:01:31   obvious it's so obvious that this is [TS]

00:01:32   recorded immediately after we make no [TS]

00:01:34   reference to anything that's happened in [TS]

00:01:36   time there were a few sections in there [TS]

00:01:39   that I thought were a little weird we [TS]

00:01:41   didn't follow up at all on the previous [TS]

00:01:43   show and the previous show I think was a [TS]

00:01:45   show that kind of begged for some [TS]

00:01:47   follow-up like more than maybe any other [TS]

00:01:50   show that we have ever done I'm really [TS]

00:01:53   really begged for some kind of [TS]

00:01:56   acknowledgment of like kind words from [TS]

00:01:58   people but like no there was nothing [TS]

00:02:00   because we immediately recorded it after [TS]

00:02:03   the very first one and I have to say I [TS]

00:02:04   was pretty pleased that nobody nobody [TS]

00:02:07   caught us in the act of a double [TS]

00:02:09   recording now I'll say this all the [TS]

00:02:11   people that are gonna pop up in the [TS]

00:02:12   reddit thread and be [TS]

00:02:13   like oh I knew it I don't believe any of [TS]

00:02:15   you not wanna be ya now feller leave you [TS]

00:02:17   don't believe me cuz why didn't you say [TS]

00:02:19   it don't believe you okay III don't [TS]

00:02:21   believe it either it's one it's like a [TS]

00:02:22   cognitive bias that is occurring that [TS]

00:02:24   you're now going to remember that you [TS]

00:02:26   thought it was obviously recorded at the [TS]

00:02:28   same time but you didn't say anything [TS]

00:02:29   it's like if you change bit rates on [TS]

00:02:31   podcasts and people like oh I could [TS]

00:02:32   totally tell but they don't say anything [TS]

00:02:34   until after you've done it yeah I've [TS]

00:02:37   been in that situation yeah he you up [TS]

00:02:42   the bitrate no one complains no one [TS]

00:02:43   notices but if you tell them in advance [TS]

00:02:45   you'll hear howls of protest over there [TS]

00:02:48   download limits on their cellular plans [TS]

00:02:50   or whatever howdy yeah exactly how dare [TS]

00:02:55   you uh but yeah so I think it was an [TS]

00:02:58   interesting experiment the fact that [TS]

00:02:59   nobody noticed I think makes it [TS]

00:03:02   essentially a success yeah and I felt [TS]

00:03:05   that it came out well as well I think we [TS]

00:03:07   were above concerned that the episode [TS]

00:03:10   wouldn't be very good because obviously [TS]

00:03:12   it's like a mammoth recording session [TS]

00:03:14   mm-hmm but I was I was pleased with with [TS]

00:03:17   the output it did come out much better [TS]

00:03:20   than I expected and i also think we were [TS]

00:03:22   doing it under the worst of all possible [TS]

00:03:24   circumstances that we were recording a [TS]

00:03:26   relatively serious first episode and [TS]

00:03:29   then transitioning into a much more [TS]

00:03:30   normal second episode and i did really [TS]

00:03:33   feel in that second recording like I was [TS]

00:03:35   not quite on the ball and looking [TS]

00:03:38   looking back on it when i was doing one [TS]

00:03:41   of the pass-through edits on it i could [TS]

00:03:43   hear myself not explaining things as [TS]

00:03:46   well as i might imagine that a fresh me [TS]

00:03:48   would have explained those things but i [TS]

00:03:50   could be wrong about that because i'm [TS]

00:03:51   always amazed by when i listened back to [TS]

00:03:54   myself on a podcast how poorly i think [TS]

00:03:56   previous me explained the ideas in his [TS]

00:03:58   head this is a regular occurrence for [TS]

00:04:01   you you always feel like you never do a [TS]

00:04:03   good enough job but just pushes you to [TS]

00:04:05   be better and better every time you know [TS]

00:04:06   do you not have that Mike when you [TS]

00:04:08   listen back to the show you don't have [TS]

00:04:09   this experience of feeling like who is [TS]

00:04:11   this idiot trying to explain things [TS]

00:04:13   doesn't bother me okay but do you feel [TS]

00:04:15   it at all are you aware that you do a [TS]

00:04:17   poor job of explaining your idea I don't [TS]

00:04:20   have as many ideas to explain you know [TS]

00:04:23   so I don't really worry about it too [TS]

00:04:26   much it doesn't bother me it doesn't [TS]

00:04:27   bother me because I'm very aware of the [TS]

00:04:29   constraints that we're in I prepare as [TS]

00:04:31   much as I prepare but I know that every [TS]

00:04:33   now and then we're just gonna talk [TS]

00:04:34   instantaneously for a while not try not [TS]

00:04:36   to be too hot myself your perfectionist [TS]

00:04:38   this your problem I I disagree with that [TS]

00:04:41   I'm not a perfectionist I would just [TS]

00:04:43   prefer that I explain things much better [TS]

00:04:45   than I actually do I'm not a [TS]

00:04:47   perfectionist I just wish it was perfect [TS]

00:04:49   that's all I care about well I mean if [TS]

00:04:51   we're getting into wishing territory yes [TS]

00:04:53   of course if I have a if I have a bucket [TS]

00:04:55   full of wishes over here that I can use [TS]

00:04:57   then yes let's make things perfect but [TS]

00:05:00   actual perfection requires infinite [TS]

00:05:01   effort which I'm not willing to expend [TS]

00:05:03   but anyway put in putting all of that [TS]

00:05:06   aside I think even under non ideal [TS]

00:05:12   circumstances I think it came out pretty [TS]

00:05:14   well and so I would regard this [TS]

00:05:15   experiment as a win so we're not talking [TS]

00:05:18   about this purely so we can have like a [TS]

00:05:20   gotcha moment over the audience there is [TS]

00:05:22   a there's a solid reason for this which [TS]

00:05:24   is that it takes us a long time to [TS]

00:05:26   record these episodes we have currently [TS]

00:05:29   been on the phone for 90 minutes have we [TS]

00:05:35   yeah because it takes us a long time to [TS]

00:05:37   get ourselves ready to actually record [TS]

00:05:39   this is true by the time we have [TS]

00:05:41   completed our boot up sequence and [TS]

00:05:43   pre-flight check lists so if we record [TS]

00:05:48   two episodes back to back in theory it [TS]

00:05:51   is less time spent overall in recording [TS]

00:05:54   the episodes so that's kind of like the [TS]

00:05:56   idea of why are we doing this we're not [TS]

00:05:58   going to record every episode like this [TS]

00:05:59   but it's what the reason that we're [TS]

00:06:01   doing this is it gives us more [TS]

00:06:02   flexibility to put episodes out more [TS]

00:06:04   consistently especially as you are [TS]

00:06:07   looking at the way that you spend your [TS]

00:06:08   time more analytically and more closely [TS]

00:06:10   this year so it is a way for us to see [TS]

00:06:13   if like if we're under a time constraint [TS]

00:06:15   can we still get episodes out with [TS]

00:06:17   frequency in a way we could do that is [TS]

00:06:19   by banking them more often yeah that's [TS]

00:06:22   that's what we're looking at is there [TS]

00:06:25   are some points in the year where it's [TS]

00:06:27   going to be more difficult to record on [TS]

00:06:31   a bi-weekly schedule and so we wanted to [TS]

00:06:33   see if this was even possible to do or [TS]

00:06:37   if it turned out just to be too [TS]

00:06:38   exhausting to try to do two episodes [TS]

00:06:40   back to back and it's interesting to [TS]

00:06:42   think about this in terms of any other [TS]

00:06:44   kind of work late I am really aware that [TS]

00:06:47   any day that I'm recording a podcast is [TS]

00:06:51   a is a very different day in my mind [TS]

00:06:54   there's there's a meeting essentially [TS]

00:06:57   that's taking place later in the day and [TS]

00:06:59   so I'm always aware in the morning like [TS]

00:07:02   there's there's this sort of constraint [TS]

00:07:03   that whatever I'm doing it means to wrap [TS]

00:07:06   up by a certain time because there's [TS]

00:07:08   this meeting that's taking place that [TS]

00:07:09   that there needs to be recording for and [TS]

00:07:11   so that always kind of limits the [TS]

00:07:14   potential activities that can be done on [TS]

00:07:16   that day and then there are always [TS]

00:07:18   things like like you said we have this [TS]

00:07:20   whole process of getting ready to record [TS]

00:07:24   the podcast sort of chatting about stuff [TS]

00:07:27   ahead of time go running through the [TS]

00:07:29   show notes doing all of this other kinds [TS]

00:07:30   of things and so doing to it once is a [TS]

00:07:33   bit like any other batch processing of [TS]

00:07:36   work that occurs then that I feel like [TS]

00:07:39   like batch processing is maybe one of [TS]

00:07:44   the very first things about being [TS]

00:07:47   productive that I really learned a long [TS]

00:07:50   time ago and like the pre getting things [TS]

00:07:52   done world which is like do similar [TS]

00:07:54   tasks together at the same time don't [TS]

00:07:58   don't switch between lots of different [TS]

00:07:59   tasks do similar things together and so [TS]

00:08:03   this idea of recording two shows at once [TS]

00:08:04   feels like that and you get all of these [TS]

00:08:07   little savings of on a single day where [TS]

00:08:11   you have a meeting you get two shows [TS]

00:08:12   instead of one or like even just today [TS]

00:08:15   for some reason like my audio equipment [TS]

00:08:16   wasn't working quite right and have to [TS]

00:08:18   fuss with it for a little bit it's like [TS]

00:08:19   great one futzing with audio equipment [TS]

00:08:22   gets you two shows out the other end so [TS]

00:08:26   I think there's a big win in being able [TS]

00:08:28   to do something like this again because [TS]

00:08:32   it was very exhausting it's not a thing [TS]

00:08:33   that I plan to do every single time with [TS]

00:08:36   no but it is great to know that we have [TS]

00:08:38   it when we need it as an option yeah [TS]

00:08:41   that it's that it is there in lieu of a [TS]

00:08:44   time when there wouldn't be a show that [TS]

00:08:46   this is a thing that we can possibly do [TS]

00:08:48   when I was working in marketing [TS]

00:08:50   there was like an eye-opening moment for [TS]

00:08:52   me like went well and part of my job was [TS]

00:08:55   dealing with getting things printed [TS]

00:08:56   something getting things printed to [TS]

00:08:58   Center people Lou and the surprise for [TS]

00:09:00   me was in the fact that the amount of [TS]

00:09:04   things that you need printed didn't [TS]

00:09:06   change the cost equally right you could [TS]

00:09:10   have a hundred thousand things printed [TS]

00:09:11   and maybe that cost ten thousand pounds [TS]

00:09:13   but if you wanted two hundred thousand [TS]

00:09:14   it might be twelve thousand pounds right [TS]

00:09:16   right and it was always very confusing [TS]

00:09:17   to me it's like what there's more of [TS]

00:09:19   them and it's because I quickly found [TS]

00:09:20   out that so much of the cost is in [TS]

00:09:22   turning the machines on right right once [TS]

00:09:25   the machines are on and the plates are [TS]

00:09:28   printed for the likes of the things can [TS]

00:09:29   be stamped out or things can be inked [TS]

00:09:31   that's where a lot of the cost is going [TS]

00:09:33   so it is in the startup costs and [TS]

00:09:36   everything else from there is cheaper so [TS]

00:09:37   it's like a similar way for us it's like [TS]

00:09:39   by the time we get everything out the [TS]

00:09:41   way that is a big chunk of the time and [TS]

00:09:43   then the rest is just what ends up [TS]

00:09:44   getting put out but we only need to do [TS]

00:09:47   that once if we record two episodes so [TS]

00:09:49   that you know so that that was part of [TS]

00:09:50   like a realization for me which I've [TS]

00:09:52   kind of carried over into this work and [TS]

00:09:54   something that's important to me is that [TS]

00:09:56   there is there is an opportunity for the [TS]

00:09:58   for the show quality to decrease if we [TS]

00:10:00   do this right so there's a lot of work [TS]

00:10:03   that we're doing on the other end to [TS]

00:10:05   make it work you know and like there's [TS]

00:10:07   one thing that I've been thinking about [TS]

00:10:08   more like themed episodes and these [TS]

00:10:10   little standalone units that we can [TS]

00:10:12   release that will still be very [TS]

00:10:13   interesting but can live on their own a [TS]

00:10:15   little bit more than some other ever [TS]

00:10:17   episodes like we have done a couple of [TS]

00:10:19   episodes out of time now right like but [TS]

00:10:21   it was like an out of time and out of [TS]

00:10:23   time two out of time out time out they [TS]

00:10:24   were they were consciously made like [TS]

00:10:26   that and I'm kind of running some ideas [TS]

00:10:28   through my head that if we want to do [TS]

00:10:29   this a couple of times this year how can [TS]

00:10:32   those episodes be a little bit more [TS]

00:10:34   interesting and special than just a [TS]

00:10:35   regular episode so there is definitely [TS]

00:10:37   thought into it and really this is about [TS]

00:10:39   us ensuring that we can make sure it's [TS]

00:10:42   more often or at least not more often [TS]

00:10:44   but more often than we'd be able to do [TS]

00:10:45   if we didn't do this right yes really [TS]

00:10:49   they'll probably be less episodes this [TS]

00:10:51   year but if you didn't do it this way [TS]

00:10:52   there be even less so listeners [TS]

00:10:55   listeners to pull back the curtain just [TS]

00:10:58   a little bit here right this is this is [TS]

00:11:00   also part of a negotiation about how [TS]

00:11:02   many episodes are there go [TS]

00:11:04   to be over the course of the year where [TS]

00:11:06   I don't want no episodes and Grey's like [TS]

00:11:08   please please can we do some and I'm [TS]

00:11:11   like no and so that that's kind of how [TS]

00:11:13   it's been going you know yeah it is true [TS]

00:11:14   as you would imagine it's that's the way [TS]

00:11:16   it's going yeah I was I was attempting [TS]

00:11:18   to make the show bi-weekly in the sense [TS]

00:11:20   of twice a week but Mike was simply [TS]

00:11:22   unwilling to commit to that I'm like can [TS]

00:11:24   we do to a year right yeah that's so [TS]

00:11:27   we've had to come to some kind of [TS]

00:11:28   agreement between the two of us it's [TS]

00:11:29   been really tough has been really all we [TS]

00:11:33   got there you know yeah we had a bunch [TS]

00:11:36   of CEO to CEO conversations and we got [TS]

00:11:38   there like grown-ups today's episode of [TS]

00:11:42   cortex is brought to you by Casper hey [TS]

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00:12:59   that's why they can offer great prices [TS]

00:13:01   because they don't have to deal with all [TS]

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00:13:20   something like mattress online seems [TS]

00:13:22   like a peculiar thing based on how we've [TS]

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00:13:41   want you to feel comfortable in it spend [TS]

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00:13:55   visiting Casper calm / cortex and using [TS]

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00:14:01   thank you so much to Casper for their [TS]

00:14:03   support of this show many people have [TS]

00:14:07   asked me to share more about to doest we [TS]

00:14:10   made reference to it last time about me [TS]

00:14:13   moving to todoist as part of our burning [TS]

00:14:15   down the tasks before I get to that I [TS]

00:14:18   will ask you for for an update on your [TS]

00:14:20   task management situation is there a [TS]

00:14:23   task management although there is one [TS]

00:14:25   yet ya know I am I am a leaf on the wind [TS]

00:14:29   ah just taking life as it comes right [TS]

00:14:34   now huh yeah yeah oh it's actually no no [TS]

00:14:40   it's not nice oh well no system I don't [TS]

00:14:45   have a system wells a long time ago now [TS]

00:14:49   we spoke about this yeah i'm i am still [TS]

00:14:52   I'm still doing this thing where I'm a [TS]

00:14:55   bit playing around with and and just [TS]

00:14:58   being very informal and it's an [TS]

00:15:03   interesting thing because talking to [TS]

00:15:04   people in my life again everybody else [TS]

00:15:07   is coming from the perspective of oh [TS]

00:15:08   this is how this is how normal people [TS]

00:15:10   live that you just sort of know the [TS]

00:15:12   things that you need to do maybe you [TS]

00:15:14   write a few of them down but you don't [TS]

00:15:16   have a real system for keeping track of [TS]

00:15:18   absolutely everything that is watertight [TS]

00:15:20   under all circumstances and I I simply [TS]

00:15:24   don't understand how people can possibly [TS]

00:15:26   live like that because I'm trying to [TS]

00:15:28   figure out how to work [TS]

00:15:31   in the future which is just turning into [TS]

00:15:32   a much bigger project than I initially [TS]

00:15:34   expected but not having a current system [TS]

00:15:39   in place that is what I want it to be I [TS]

00:15:42   i find it somewhat somewhat [TS]

00:15:44   anxiety-inducing i am very aware of my [TS]

00:15:47   brain burning calories thinking about [TS]

00:15:51   stuff that i know it like this is the [TS]

00:15:54   whole thing that my previous system got [TS]

00:15:56   rid of is the like I don't have to worry [TS]

00:15:58   about anything because I just know where [TS]

00:16:00   everything is going to be and that that [TS]

00:16:02   is no longer the case so I'm aware that [TS]

00:16:04   my brain wants to be more anxious than [TS]

00:16:08   it normally than it normally would be [TS]

00:16:10   but I'm viewing this as an investment [TS]

00:16:14   that is worth making in trying to [TS]

00:16:15   refigure out what it is that I want to [TS]

00:16:17   do but so no I don't have a like Oh F [TS]

00:16:21   I've come down from the mountain with [TS]

00:16:22   some answers and and I may I may never [TS]

00:16:25   well do that i may just end up creating [TS]

00:16:27   some squirrely thing that is is just for [TS]

00:16:29   me the way i want it to work but i can [TS]

00:16:31   say it's been kind of interesting living [TS]

00:16:34   like a Normie i guess for the past few [TS]

00:16:37   months uh yeah it's been interesting [TS]

00:16:40   it's been an interesting thing not [TS]

00:16:42   completely no more though I mean you [TS]

00:16:43   didn't fire your assistant or anything [TS]

00:16:45   you know you're not a Normie gray [TS]

00:16:48   someone's picking up the bread crumbs [TS]

00:16:51   that you're dropping yes that is that is [TS]

00:16:54   definitely true that someone is picking [TS]

00:16:55   up the bread comes that I'm dropping and [TS]

00:16:57   related to that the one the one change [TS]

00:17:01   that I have made which I can report on [TS]

00:17:04   which it relates to this very section is [TS]

00:17:06   that I have moved from Wunderlist with [TS]

00:17:10   my assistant to todoist oh so I do have [TS]

00:17:14   some todoist experience in this [TS]

00:17:16   conversation but we have we have [TS]

00:17:19   switched our collaboration tool and I'll [TS]

00:17:23   just say for vastly better it's a big [TS]

00:17:26   it's a big improvement and so that is [TS]

00:17:28   that is one thing that has definitely [TS]

00:17:30   happened that is interesting so what are [TS]

00:17:32   your experiences with Steaua Smike so I [TS]

00:17:35   want to talk about a few a few aspects [TS]

00:17:36   of it so some of them are the things [TS]

00:17:38   that make to do a superior and some of [TS]

00:17:40   them the more tricky for me as a [TS]

00:17:44   previous OmniFocus user so the key [TS]

00:17:47   reason that I decided I wanted to make [TS]

00:17:49   this move which I have spoken about [TS]

00:17:50   spoke about it on the last episode is [TS]

00:17:52   the integrations but now I have more [TS]

00:17:53   time to play with them what makes [TS]

00:17:56   todoist interesting to me is that [TS]

00:17:58   todoist has a fundamental understanding [TS]

00:18:00   of the web there is an API there is a [TS]

00:18:04   web version of todoist and it is the [TS]

00:18:07   fact that it has this understanding of [TS]

00:18:10   kind of modern automation conventions [TS]

00:18:12   and stuff like that that is appealing to [TS]

00:18:14   me omnifocus is very shut off from the [TS]

00:18:18   rest of the world we spent a lot of time [TS]

00:18:20   talking about it in the past like how [TS]

00:18:22   excited we were when we could finally [TS]

00:18:23   have templates and that they could be [TS]

00:18:26   code for OmniFocus so we could do things [TS]

00:18:28   with it from other applications but it's [TS]

00:18:30   still on device everything is happening [TS]

00:18:33   on device and you have to ask OmniFocus [TS]

00:18:36   to do something or plug something into [TS]

00:18:37   it but to do 'used things can happen in [TS]

00:18:41   the background you can have tasks added [TS]

00:18:43   by services where you've never even [TS]

00:18:45   opened todoist only I have a workflow [TS]

00:18:49   which I'll put in the show notes which i [TS]

00:18:51   can run from anywhere on iOS i can add [TS]

00:18:53   links to it i can add i can at times i [TS]

00:18:55   can add notes and to do it is never [TS]

00:18:59   opened everything is just done in the [TS]

00:19:02   workflow app from wherever i want to do [TS]

00:19:03   it on the system and the task is added [TS]

00:19:06   in the background because it's added [TS]

00:19:07   wired to do is say P I hmm there are [TS]

00:19:10   other things that I have hooked up so [TS]

00:19:12   some web automation tools like zapier [TS]

00:19:14   and IFTTT they're able to add things so [TS]

00:19:18   I'm still digging around with zappia and [TS]

00:19:21   I want to spend more time talking about [TS]

00:19:22   this service specifically in the future [TS]

00:19:24   because it is like Charlie and the [TS]

00:19:30   Chocolate Factory this service is just [TS]

00:19:36   incredible like I've built some some [TS]

00:19:39   zaps as they call them which are doing [TS]

00:19:41   things that I've wanted for so long like [TS]

00:19:43   new we use fresh books for our invoicing [TS]

00:19:47   at relay FM and I now have the ability [TS]

00:19:50   in our in a slack channel to see every [TS]

00:19:54   time one of those people that we invoice [TS]

00:19:56   when the responses that we work of every [TS]

00:19:57   time they they log in [TS]

00:19:58   and do something in freshbooks [TS]

00:20:00   FreshBooks knows this we're now using [TS]

00:20:03   zappia that information is piped into [TS]

00:20:06   our slack so we're able to see every [TS]

00:20:09   time somebody logs in and looks at an [TS]

00:20:11   invoice without ever being in freshbooks [TS]

00:20:13   zapier is allowing that for us yeah [TS]

00:20:15   really allows you to connect a whole [TS]

00:20:17   bunch of stuff like if you ever used if [TS]

00:20:19   this then that and then you look at [TS]

00:20:21   zapier like I've been trying to slowly [TS]

00:20:25   transition all the stuff that i have in [TS]

00:20:27   if this then that to over to zapier [TS]

00:20:29   because it's so much more powerful and [TS]

00:20:30   when using zapier it makes you know as [TS]

00:20:34   apiaries is like like a constructor set [TS]

00:20:36   where you can build all kinds of things [TS]

00:20:38   and it makes if this then that look like [TS]

00:20:40   it's duplo yeah like what does those [TS]

00:20:42   lego blocks that are for real babies [TS]

00:20:44   like a gigantic Lego blocks that's what [TS]

00:20:47   it is okay that's what it feels like [TS]

00:20:49   you've got like the Lego stuff [TS]

00:20:50   mindstorms right like the stuff that you [TS]

00:20:52   can actually build robots with us [TS]

00:20:54   overruns a beer and then you've got your [TS]

00:20:57   little little fisher-price I have TTP [TS]

00:20:59   over there in the corner IFTTT is great [TS]

00:21:02   for for getting your feet wet with this [TS]

00:21:04   stuff but like the great thing about [TS]

00:21:05   zappia is like you can have one action [TS]

00:21:07   trigger things in multiple other web [TS]

00:21:10   services right there are multiple stages [TS]

00:21:12   you can build is really very powerful [TS]

00:21:15   yeah and what I also like is that you [TS]

00:21:16   can you can do the thing which I've [TS]

00:21:18   wanted if this and that to do for [TS]

00:21:20   forever which is have a some very basic [TS]

00:21:23   logic operators like if this occurs and [TS]

00:21:26   also these filtering conditions match [TS]

00:21:30   then do the thing I think that's you [TS]

00:21:33   know just even just the tiniest amount [TS]

00:21:35   of that makes it makes it so much more [TS]

00:21:37   powerful so I've got to recommend that [TS]

00:21:40   people try out say p ER and just as a [TS]

00:21:44   little as a little sidebar here i feel [TS]

00:21:46   like in my past couple months of [TS]

00:21:50   exploring with stuff really ever since i [TS]

00:21:53   started with using toggle and their api [TS]

00:21:57   for doing the time tracking i feel like [TS]

00:22:00   i've had my eyes open to this whole [TS]

00:22:03   world that i have been intentionally [TS]

00:22:05   avoiding yep me too buddy yeah which is [TS]

00:22:08   like this this whole world of web AP is [TS]

00:22:12   and I had a real moment of realizing I [TS]

00:22:16   need to learn a new skill here I [TS]

00:22:20   mentioned on two shows ago or whatever [TS]

00:22:22   was last show an amount of shows in the [TS]

00:22:24   past and amount of shows ago because of [TS]

00:22:26   because of the recording that I was that [TS]

00:22:28   I was playing around with Trello as as a [TS]

00:22:30   way to just visually move around work [TS]

00:22:33   and i'm really liking Trello like it's [TS]

00:22:35   it's an interesting way to just look at [TS]

00:22:36   some stuff and Trello is like zapier [TS]

00:22:39   like like slack like toggle like all [TS]

00:22:42   these things it has a Web API l yeah and [TS]

00:22:45   so I was playing around with the NS as [TS]

00:22:47   inevitably would happen anytime i'm [TS]

00:22:49   working with the tool eventually I [TS]

00:22:51   realize oh there are some things that I [TS]

00:22:53   would want to enter the same way all the [TS]

00:22:55   time if i was using this looks like here [TS]

00:22:57   we go like you're starting to build up [TS]

00:22:59   some kind of template right and i was [TS]

00:23:03   playing around and with workflow and [TS]

00:23:05   looking and seeing oh how can i get the [TS]

00:23:06   workflow app to automatically add a [TS]

00:23:09   bunch of cards to Trello if I want to [TS]

00:23:11   trigger a thing all right and I was [TS]

00:23:14   disappointed because in the workflow app [TS]

00:23:17   there's only a few options for what [TS]

00:23:20   kinds of information you can add to a [TS]

00:23:22   Trello card where it can go it's [TS]

00:23:24   relatively limited and it was this [TS]

00:23:26   moment it dawned on me I thought wait a [TS]

00:23:28   minute but what is the workflow app [TS]

00:23:30   doing it must be talking to some kind of [TS]

00:23:32   toggle API that exists out there on the [TS]

00:23:35   web and so I googled around and [TS]

00:23:37   eventually found it and I realized oh [TS]

00:23:38   okay Trello has an API where you can [TS]

00:23:42   affect everything about the cards like [TS]

00:23:45   literally everything is available there [TS]

00:23:47   and then I suddenly realized ah ok all [TS]

00:23:51   of these apps are doing the same thing [TS]

00:23:53   they're using web URLs and the public [TS]

00:23:57   API is to talk to each other and this is [TS]

00:24:00   a thing that I need to seriously sit [TS]

00:24:02   down and learn as a skill because if I [TS]

00:24:06   learn this skill then I'm not dependent [TS]

00:24:08   on the workflow app guys making a little [TS]

00:24:12   premade template that's easy for me to [TS]

00:24:14   use it's like no no I can just program [TS]

00:24:16   the thing directly to talk to the web [TS]

00:24:18   api's and I feel like that was the [TS]

00:24:20   moment I realize like this is what a lot [TS]

00:24:23   of [TS]

00:24:24   modern automation particularly on a [TS]

00:24:28   device like an iPad is going to look [TS]

00:24:31   like and I think that that was just a [TS]

00:24:33   real realization that I feel like I've [TS]

00:24:35   had in the past couple months like okay [TS]

00:24:38   this Web API world like this is way more [TS]

00:24:41   powerful than I ever gave it credit for [TS]

00:24:43   and I always used to be prioritizing [TS]

00:24:47   apps that could work on an airplane that [TS]

00:24:49   would work in offline mode where I [TS]

00:24:51   wouldn't have to connect to any kind of [TS]

00:24:52   web service but I think something has [TS]

00:24:55   shifted in my mind to finally really [TS]

00:24:58   understanding the value of these things [TS]

00:25:01   yep like if I am using a tool that has [TS]

00:25:06   an impact on my work my feeling now is [TS]

00:25:10   it has to have an API because I am fed [TS]

00:25:15   up of giving this data to a system which [TS]

00:25:19   keeps it mmm because there is no reason [TS]

00:25:23   for that to happen anymore I should be [TS]

00:25:25   able to tidy things together and I am [TS]

00:25:28   not close to what you're doing in the [TS]

00:25:31   level that which I'm doing this but I'm [TS]

00:25:34   getting interested and so that's and [TS]

00:25:36   I've started doing things where like [TS]

00:25:38   I've had a problem that I wanted to [TS]

00:25:40   solve and i am now like in the mindset [TS]

00:25:43   of like why don't I try and build a [TS]

00:25:45   thing hmm and I've been doing that with [TS]

00:25:47   some with some work flows like their [TS]

00:25:49   I've I've been able to build some [TS]

00:25:51   workflows now which I would have [TS]

00:25:54   previously just continued doing things [TS]

00:25:56   the same way and these services are [TS]

00:25:59   becoming more and more important for me [TS]

00:26:01   as I continue to do my work due to [TS]

00:26:02   optimize and with something we're gonna [TS]

00:26:04   talk about later on the show with hiring [TS]

00:26:06   an assistant is only going to become [TS]

00:26:08   more important because I will have [TS]

00:26:10   things now that will be entered by [TS]

00:26:12   somebody else into a system mmm right [TS]

00:26:15   and there could be a case where I'm like [TS]

00:26:17   why doesn't this stuff just come to me [TS]

00:26:19   instead of me going to get it and web [TS]

00:26:21   automation and web integrations will be [TS]

00:26:23   the API is will be what allows all that [TS]

00:26:25   stuff to be pulled together in an [TS]

00:26:27   interesting way so this is where I want [TS]

00:26:29   to go now like I have all of this data [TS]

00:26:31   that I give two systems I want these [TS]

00:26:32   systems to be able to talk to each other [TS]

00:26:34   if I want them to and I do I said what [TS]

00:26:36   you're doing here i think is [TS]

00:26:38   it's such a valuable skill to understand [TS]

00:26:42   like just it's not programming like [TS]

00:26:46   you're not a programmer here no way but [TS]

00:26:49   this this kind of thing where you you [TS]

00:26:53   learn and you realize how to make the [TS]

00:26:56   machine do something on its own or how [TS]

00:26:59   to make the different machines talk to [TS]

00:27:01   each other this this kind of very very [TS]

00:27:04   basic you know programming ultralight [TS]

00:27:08   kind of thing that an app like workflow [TS]

00:27:10   allows or something like JP er allows [TS]

00:27:14   you to do by visually rearranging [TS]

00:27:15   objects I think this is such an [TS]

00:27:18   incredibly valuable skill if you have [TS]

00:27:21   never messed around with one of these [TS]

00:27:23   kind of systems I think it's hugely [TS]

00:27:26   valuable to just just try and just play [TS]

00:27:29   around with a little bit just to get it [TS]

00:27:31   into your mind that there may be [TS]

00:27:34   something you're doing that with a [TS]

00:27:36   little bit of effort you can make [TS]

00:27:39   automatic or vastly vastly simpler and [TS]

00:27:43   once you get that hook in your brain you [TS]

00:27:46   can you can really improve a lot of the [TS]

00:27:48   way use you do things on computing [TS]

00:27:50   devices of all kinds but I just happen [TS]

00:27:53   to think like the workflow app in [TS]

00:27:54   particular is a great example of [TS]

00:27:56   visually rearranging stuff and there [TS]

00:27:59   seems to be a bunch more tools like like [TS]

00:28:02   zapier that are doing this kind of thing [TS]

00:28:03   of allowing you to visually rearrange [TS]

00:28:05   stuff even if you don't want to do the [TS]

00:28:08   thing that I'm trying to do which is [TS]

00:28:10   like dig into like how is this JSON [TS]

00:28:11   object structure like you don't need to [TS]

00:28:13   go that far just just knowing the basics [TS]

00:28:15   already makes a huge difference it is [TS]

00:28:18   these visual services that's helping me [TS]

00:28:19   understand it right like I've tweaked [TS]

00:28:22   things in some of my work flows which [TS]

00:28:25   are like real API stuff like I've messed [TS]

00:28:27   around in the code but it's because the [TS]

00:28:30   wrapper around it is helping me [TS]

00:28:32   understand the context of the thing yeah [TS]

00:28:34   so like I'm able to kind of work it out [TS]

00:28:36   in my brain with little knowledge was I [TS]

00:28:38   be like oh it's this step which is got [TS]

00:28:40   this code in it and this step isn't [TS]

00:28:42   working the way I want it to so let me [TS]

00:28:43   look at this and if this stuff written [TS]

00:28:45   well enough someone like me can can have [TS]

00:28:47   an idea of understanding it and also [TS]

00:28:49   playing with it and whilst we're in this [TS]

00:28:52   engine I've been thinking about this a [TS]

00:28:53   lot recently well like you spend hours [TS]

00:28:55   building this stuff right does it pay [TS]

00:28:58   off in the long run right this is a [TS]

00:29:00   question that I think a lot of people [TS]

00:29:01   have is like you've just spent four [TS]

00:29:03   hours building this workflow with trial [TS]

00:29:05   and error and all it's doing is saving [TS]

00:29:07   you 30 seconds every single time how [TS]

00:29:09   long is it going to take to for that to [TS]

00:29:11   pay off and the realization that I've [TS]

00:29:14   come to is it's not about the time it's [TS]

00:29:17   about the frustration yes yes it is [TS]

00:29:20   about me pressing one button to do a [TS]

00:29:22   thing rather than opening two apps and [TS]

00:29:25   then doing two things and type in this [TS]

00:29:27   thing in here and pressing send here [TS]

00:29:28   it's about pressing a button and just [TS]

00:29:30   having it done and it is the the [TS]

00:29:33   combination of the fun of building thing [TS]

00:29:36   and having the sense of accomplishment [TS]

00:29:38   of doing it and then every subsequent [TS]

00:29:40   time benefiting from that work that you [TS]

00:29:42   paid in and just making it feel like [TS]

00:29:45   your work is happening more smoothly it [TS]

00:29:47   doesn't matter to me if I'm saving time [TS]

00:29:49   that's not a thing it's about the [TS]

00:29:51   comfort of my work yeah there's also [TS]

00:29:54   another aspect to this which i think is [TS]

00:29:56   underappreciated but when you when you [TS]

00:29:59   automate something you end up making it [TS]

00:30:03   much easier to do that thing and so like [TS]

00:30:08   for example with the time tracking but [TS]

00:30:10   like the whole reason that I'm able to [TS]

00:30:12   do this seasonal experiment that I'm [TS]

00:30:14   doing of trying to track absolutely [TS]

00:30:16   everything is entirely because [TS]

00:30:18   automation allows the tracking to be as [TS]

00:30:23   simple as possible yep if I wasn't able [TS]

00:30:26   to use workflow from the notification [TS]

00:30:29   center from my watch to trigger the [TS]

00:30:31   toggle stuff if I was having to open the [TS]

00:30:34   toggle app or go to the toggle website [TS]

00:30:36   every time I wouldn't be doing this [TS]

00:30:37   wouldn't be doing exactly wouldn't what [TS]

00:30:38   exactly this would never had I'm still [TS]

00:30:40   using this for every task I do I'm still [TS]

00:30:43   finding it very useful like this feels [TS]

00:30:45   like just part of my work now but if I [TS]

00:30:47   had the friction of needing to open a [TS]

00:30:49   specific thing every time as opposed to [TS]

00:30:50   just like pulling down and pressing two [TS]

00:30:51   buttons it wouldn't be doing it yeah [TS]

00:30:55   it's that's one of the things that [TS]

00:30:57   automation gets you is it's a bit like I [TS]

00:31:00   forget the name of it but in a like in [TS]

00:31:02   economics when the price of a resource [TS]

00:31:05   dramatically [TS]

00:31:05   drops you end up using so much more of [TS]

00:31:08   it and it allows you to do more things [TS]

00:31:11   and it's not like oh the price of copper [TS]

00:31:13   is dropped like are you like yes we're [TS]

00:31:15   going to use more copper that's the [TS]

00:31:17   whole point right like we can now do [TS]

00:31:19   more things than we could do before [TS]

00:31:21   again it's funny you mentioned on the [TS]

00:31:24   watch like I'm so where there's a couple [TS]

00:31:26   of instances where being able to use the [TS]

00:31:28   workflow app from the watch in a couple [TS]

00:31:32   of situations means I'm able to very [TS]

00:31:34   easily track some time than I wouldn't [TS]

00:31:35   otherwise like in particular when I'm [TS]

00:31:37   reading at night like I'm reading the [TS]

00:31:40   book and my phone is charging in the [TS]

00:31:43   other room it's not in the same room [TS]

00:31:45   that I sleep and I can just very quickly [TS]

00:31:47   like press a button and then as i'm [TS]

00:31:49   going to bed just say like i'm done [TS]

00:31:51   reading stop the clock like the days [TS]

00:31:52   over and the little workflow app just [TS]

00:31:54   automatically does that thing whereas [TS]

00:31:57   otherwise I wouldn't be tracking my [TS]

00:31:59   reading time at night if it meant that I [TS]

00:32:00   had to get up and go use another device [TS]

00:32:03   that I don't want around me while I'm [TS]

00:32:04   reading at night like it's just it's [TS]

00:32:06   it's really great to be able to do that [TS]

00:32:08   kind of stuff like I wish I always kind [TS]

00:32:11   of feel like when people dismiss [TS]

00:32:13   automation it's it's been like I don't [TS]

00:32:16   think you understand what's actually [TS]

00:32:17   happening I think there's an idea in [TS]

00:32:19   your head of people spending hours and [TS]

00:32:22   hours automating some system for no [TS]

00:32:25   benefits but you're you're only looking [TS]

00:32:26   at the benefit in a very very narrow way [TS]

00:32:29   plus there's also just the skill of [TS]

00:32:31   learning how to do this kind of thing [TS]

00:32:34   and then being able to apply it to other [TS]

00:32:35   stuff I'm honestly considering this is [TS]

00:32:38   like a hobby mmm and one of my hobbies [TS]

00:32:40   now is tinkering of automation because I [TS]

00:32:43   find it fun I just guess I love the [TS]

00:32:46   feeling of like yes I did it like I did [TS]

00:32:48   it you know and that's that's that feels [TS]

00:32:50   good so going back to todoist right so [TS]

00:32:54   this this is like the biggest reason [TS]

00:32:56   that I made this move and there are a [TS]

00:32:57   couple of things and take advantage of [TS]

00:32:59   right now which I really like one of [TS]

00:33:01   them is having zapier or ifttt they can [TS]

00:33:04   both do this watch a google calendar and [TS]

00:33:07   add tasks based on events that trigger [TS]

00:33:09   so a practical application of this for [TS]

00:33:12   me is every time it sees a podcast [TS]

00:33:14   recording on my calendar it adds a task [TS]

00:33:17   to edit that show [TS]

00:33:18   hmm very simple right but it can do all [TS]

00:33:21   of that stuff for me and I think to [TS]

00:33:23   myself in the future of like the ways [TS]

00:33:25   that I could do this of like having this [TS]

00:33:27   stuff then going to toggle and like how [TS]

00:33:29   can all that work together and these all [TS]

00:33:31   these things can just trigger on their [TS]

00:33:32   own right so because I I still press [TS]

00:33:35   some buttons every time I sit down to [TS]

00:33:36   record I don't need to do that toggle [TS]

00:33:39   could just start at the same time right [TS]

00:33:41   because their calendar events I'm gonna [TS]

00:33:42   be here two o'clock right Friday or [TS]

00:33:45   whatever so toggle ways more just may as [TS]

00:33:47   well to start on its own it's like there [TS]

00:33:48   are little things that I know how I want [TS]

00:33:50   to build from them another one is an [TS]

00:33:52   integration which to do is build for [TS]

00:33:55   slack so I can be in slack and I can [TS]

00:33:58   type forward slash todoist and I can [TS]

00:34:00   just type in a task i can type in a due [TS]

00:34:02   date labels and projects and it just [TS]

00:34:04   gets added nobody sees it I just type it [TS]

00:34:07   i press enter it says yep the tasks in [TS]

00:34:09   there so this is like somebody's asking [TS]

00:34:10   me and slack to do something and I never [TS]

00:34:13   even leave slack oh so you can you don't [TS]

00:34:15   have to talk to the slack pot to do this [TS]

00:34:17   you can just like if you're in a general [TS]

00:34:18   chat room you can just do this yep oh [TS]

00:34:20   that's very interesting yep it's an [TS]

00:34:22   integration that to do is built so i can [TS]

00:34:25   be talking to stephen and he's like Oh [TS]

00:34:26   could you take a look at that invoice [TS]

00:34:28   for me later on and I could just type in [TS]

00:34:30   take a look at the invoice at two [TS]

00:34:31   o'clock and press ENTER and then just [TS]

00:34:33   added beautiful that's very nice [TS]

00:34:35   beautiful that's pretty nice so these [TS]

00:34:38   this is the main the biggest reason i [TS]

00:34:41   made this shift because as much as i [TS]

00:34:44   have loved using OmniFocus i think it's [TS]

00:34:47   very clear they're never gonna add this [TS]

00:34:48   but even if they're going to add it it's [TS]

00:34:51   gonna take longer for them to add this [TS]

00:34:52   then I'm willing to wait I'm at the [TS]

00:34:54   point now where I'm starting the value [TS]

00:34:57   this stuff a little bit more than losing [TS]

00:34:59   some of the features and there are [TS]

00:35:00   features not I'm losing there are things [TS]

00:35:01   that annoy me about to do is there are [TS]

00:35:03   things I wish it did better and there [TS]

00:35:05   are things that I wish it more like [TS]

00:35:06   OmniFocus which is kind of not fair but [TS]

00:35:09   I have those wishes and yeah that's [TS]

00:35:10   totally not fair because that's you know [TS]

00:35:13   that so like the things that annoy me [TS]

00:35:15   about it things I think aren't being [TS]

00:35:16   done right is one thing and then there [TS]

00:35:18   are just things i think they wish they [TS]

00:35:20   did more like OmniFocus which is like [TS]

00:35:21   you know that's not fair to wish I [TS]

00:35:23   humbly so one thing that I mrs. [TS]

00:35:26   OmniFocus is forecast view because it [TS]

00:35:28   became so important for me so it was [TS]

00:35:30   just his view in OmniFocus which gave me [TS]

00:35:31   a can [TS]

00:35:32   under and on the calendar days it showed [TS]

00:35:34   me how many tasks during each day and [TS]

00:35:35   that just gave me at a glance how busy [TS]

00:35:39   my week was mm-hmm to do is doesn't [TS]

00:35:41   really have this at all like they have a [TS]

00:35:43   next seven days which i'm using but all [TS]

00:35:46   it does is just shows a list of all of [TS]

00:35:48   the tasks for the next seven days you [TS]

00:35:49   get no counters choose a base on counter [TS]

00:35:52   right like I'd see like 7 12 on monday [TS]

00:35:54   nine times on Tuesday two tasks and went [TS]

00:35:57   de great i can move stuff to wednesday [TS]

00:35:58   because wednesday is not busy but now I [TS]

00:36:01   kind of just have to look at this list [TS]

00:36:02   and that's it doesn't really work for me [TS]

00:36:04   so well something to do is has which I [TS]

00:36:07   do kind of think is interesting and is [TS]

00:36:08   working for me more is when you got to [TS]

00:36:10   reschedule something it uses machine [TS]

00:36:12   learning to tell you when your busiest [TS]

00:36:14   that your least busy days will be so you [TS]

00:36:16   can move stuff too so it makes [TS]

00:36:17   recommendations and that's really cool [TS]

00:36:19   writes another thing about the data is [TS]

00:36:21   like it's it knows that like either by [TS]

00:36:23   trends or just by like what my average [TS]

00:36:25   task usage is a day like how many tasks [TS]

00:36:27   I'm check enough it can recommend days [TS]

00:36:30   in the future where I'm not so busy to [TS]

00:36:32   move stuff so I think that's really cool [TS]

00:36:33   yeah I think that's an interesting an [TS]

00:36:34   interesting example of again having the [TS]

00:36:38   dated done differently like the machine [TS]

00:36:40   can recommend things to you yeah in in [TS]

00:36:44   an open way and I've ever say like I was [TS]

00:36:47   curious when I saw that with to do us [TS]

00:36:49   now the way that i am using it which is [TS]

00:36:52   primarily as a communication tool [TS]

00:36:53   between my assistant i like that's [TS]

00:36:55   that's not really a practical thing but [TS]

00:36:57   i think it shows that an interesting [TS]

00:36:59   direction yeah we're how can this stuff [TS]

00:37:02   go like and I know that that's going to [TS]

00:37:05   get better for me over time the more [TS]

00:37:07   data i'm plugging into this the better [TS]

00:37:08   that suggestions gonna get right and it [TS]

00:37:11   so that's like a long game that I'm [TS]

00:37:12   playing with it but I do miss just not [TS]

00:37:15   just because my system had kind of been [TS]

00:37:17   built around this idea of looking at the [TS]

00:37:18   numbers mm-hmm but now now that I don't [TS]

00:37:21   have that like I'm starting to think to [TS]

00:37:24   myself like was this actually really a [TS]

00:37:27   good system mm-hmm I don't think it was [TS]

00:37:29   that thought that you're having right [TS]

00:37:31   there this is the this is exactly the [TS]

00:37:33   kind of thing that I'm trying to think [TS]

00:37:34   through with everything that I've done [TS]

00:37:35   is like there there are many tools that [TS]

00:37:38   i may have relied upon but if you step [TS]

00:37:41   away from them for a while you can view [TS]

00:37:42   it with more clarity and say [TS]

00:37:44   was this or was this not actually a [TS]

00:37:47   beneficial thing and I could see like [TS]

00:37:50   you always it's interesting is when we [TS]

00:37:52   would discuss using OmniFocus that you [TS]

00:37:55   always brought up the forecast tool as [TS]

00:37:57   such a primary thing for you whereas I [TS]

00:38:00   had a different feature which is my [TS]

00:38:02   primary thing but I never looked at that [TS]

00:38:05   forecast so that was one of the things [TS]

00:38:07   that to me just I filed under totally [TS]

00:38:10   useless let seeing that I have more or [TS]

00:38:12   fewer tasks represented as a single [TS]

00:38:15   number on a day like I just never found [TS]

00:38:17   that to be a useful tool to actually [TS]

00:38:19   guide any decision-making process at all [TS]

00:38:22   it's I mean simply because like tasks [TS]

00:38:24   are of vastly varying sizes yeah so [TS]

00:38:28   seven verses three verses 20 doesn't [TS]

00:38:31   actually convey the information that you [TS]

00:38:33   think it conveys so like yeah I'm just [TS]

00:38:36   realizing that those numbers they're not [TS]

00:38:38   that hopeful um I do wish i had the [TS]

00:38:41   forecast view just because it was a nice [TS]

00:38:43   way to see where there were maybe gaps [TS]

00:38:46   right so like days and there were less [TS]

00:38:48   busy but the idea that i live to it was [TS]

00:38:51   like plus seven tasks means super busy [TS]

00:38:53   day i don't think that that is as useful [TS]

00:38:54   as i thought it was right because we'll [TS]

00:38:57   come back to the to this in a moment but [TS]

00:38:59   to doest has quite some interesting [TS]

00:39:01   reporting features and let looking at my [TS]

00:39:03   last seven days every single day i was [TS]

00:39:06   doing i'm done over seven tasks so far [TS]

00:39:09   this week but previously that meant [TS]

00:39:10   super busy day to me so right i also [TS]

00:39:13   think that what i'm doing what to do [TS]

00:39:15   'used is I'm entering more tasks into [TS]

00:39:17   the system of OmniFocus I was [TS]

00:39:19   restricting the amount of tasks that I [TS]

00:39:20   would enter into the system because of [TS]

00:39:23   going over that number so now I'm adding [TS]

00:39:25   more stuff into the system which i think [TS]

00:39:28   is making me more productive as you [TS]

00:39:30   would assume because there are more [TS]

00:39:31   things that going in the more that goes [TS]

00:39:33   in the more that will get done or less [TS]

00:39:35   things that will get missed but now I'm [TS]

00:39:37   not in so much fear of like or can't [TS]

00:39:39   send it over seven so I think that's [TS]

00:39:42   been a is actually while I miss the [TS]

00:39:44   feature it has helped I think break a [TS]

00:39:47   bad habit what you're talking about here [TS]

00:39:49   like oh this arbitrary number of seven [TS]

00:39:52   this is I mentioned last time that I can [TS]

00:39:54   looking into scrum a little bit and I've [TS]

00:39:56   been playing around with some [TS]

00:39:57   ideas about how the system works for [TS]

00:39:58   organizing stuff and there's a couple of [TS]

00:40:02   things that I think are really valuable [TS]

00:40:03   in this and and one of them is is really [TS]

00:40:06   this this focus on trying to get an [TS]

00:40:10   estimate for how big your tasks actually [TS]

00:40:13   are and then trying to through measuring [TS]

00:40:17   your previous activities get a sense of [TS]

00:40:19   how much can I do in a day not based on [TS]

00:40:23   my feelings but based on previous data [TS]

00:40:26   and I think that that's a really [TS]

00:40:28   interesting idea and you can just see [TS]

00:40:32   how there are very many ways let like [TS]

00:40:34   this plus seven that you were running [TS]

00:40:36   into where you you can be getting a very [TS]

00:40:38   false sense of how much is on my plate [TS]

00:40:42   for the day and how much can I possibly [TS]

00:40:44   do so it's good I mean I mean I don't [TS]

00:40:46   know how to recommend to people because [TS]

00:40:48   obviously everybody systems different [TS]

00:40:49   but there is some real value in changing [TS]

00:40:53   things even if you plan to go back but [TS]

00:40:55   just as a way to help you reassess to [TS]

00:40:57   see if you've got any may be unhealthy [TS]

00:40:58   habits in your system mmm I do there was [TS]

00:41:01   a there was a problem in the system that [TS]

00:41:03   I didn't know was there this episode of [TS]

00:41:06   cortex is brought to you in part by [TS]

00:41:07   hover when you have a great idea for [TS]

00:41:09   your new startup or business or blog or [TS]

00:41:12   whatever you need to give it a great [TS]

00:41:15   domain name and finding that perfect [TS]

00:41:17   domain name is ridiculously easy with [TS]

00:41:20   hover when all you want to do is buy a [TS]

00:41:21   domain name or email address you [TS]

00:41:23   shouldn't have to opt out of page after [TS]

00:41:25   page of add-ons that you don't want and [TS]

00:41:27   you don't need that's why hover offers [TS]

00:41:30   only domains in email so you can focus [TS]

00:41:33   on getting a great domain name and [TS]

00:41:34   getting back to working on your idea [TS]

00:41:37   they believe you shouldn't have to pay [TS]

00:41:38   for things that should already be [TS]

00:41:40   included with your domain like who is [TS]

00:41:43   privacy which keeps all of your private [TS]

00:41:45   details safe on the internet many other [TS]

00:41:48   registrar's require that you pay for [TS]

00:41:50   such a service but not hover they think [TS]

00:41:52   that's just part of what buying a domain [TS]

00:41:55   name is however is where I always go to [TS]

00:41:58   register my domain names and it's where [TS]

00:42:00   you should too they're fantastic service [TS]

00:42:03   with a nice clean simple easy-to-use [TS]

00:42:07   website so to find that perfect domain [TS]

00:42:09   name for your idea goat [TS]

00:42:11   hover com / cortex and get ten percent [TS]

00:42:14   off your first purchase once again [TS]

00:42:16   that's hover com / cortex to find out [TS]

00:42:20   more and get ten percent off your first [TS]

00:42:22   purchase thank you so much to hover for [TS]

00:42:25   their support of this show and all a [TS]

00:42:27   real AFM relate it to this number thing [TS]

00:42:31   there is something that's frustrating to [TS]

00:42:32   me that the the badge that to do is [TS]

00:42:34   shows on the application on iOS is just [TS]

00:42:36   a straight how many tasks you have jus [TS]

00:42:38   for the day I've really want that to be [TS]

00:42:41   over to you honestly because it kind of [TS]

00:42:45   is just a weird thing to me to be like [TS]

00:42:46   just shows the number ten like that's [TS]

00:42:49   the total amount of tasks not like total [TS]

00:42:51   amount i'll sell overdue i'm getting [TS]

00:42:53   used to this because now this is kind of [TS]

00:42:55   just giving me a rundown of how many [TS]

00:42:56   things i have left for the day which is [TS]

00:42:59   so like it's I'm again it's like a [TS]

00:43:00   change of the system but I do still [TS]

00:43:02   think that that's weird not even to have [TS]

00:43:04   that setting of being able to say like [TS]

00:43:06   how many talks are overdue as to how [TS]

00:43:09   many tasks are just do for the day I do [TS]

00:43:11   you think it's a weird choice that [TS]

00:43:12   they've made to make that just ate you [TS]

00:43:14   can't adjust this this is what it is [TS]

00:43:15   here's okay so while we have been seeing [TS]

00:43:18   the praises of AP eyes and open data my [TS]

00:43:23   my biggest complaint with using a bunch [TS]

00:43:26   of these services like to do 'used slack [TS]

00:43:29   and Trello is that they never feel like [TS]

00:43:33   they're native citizens on the operating [TS]

00:43:35   system that you're using no because they [TS]

00:43:37   try and build applications that can work [TS]

00:43:39   across systems exactly that consistent [TS]

00:43:41   that shows itself in obvious ways and [TS]

00:43:44   not obvious ways like obvious ways for [TS]

00:43:46   like for example if I'm scrolling in [TS]

00:43:47   Trello it's clearly like a web page is [TS]

00:43:50   being rendered on the screen and the [TS]

00:43:53   framerate drops like hell if I'm [TS]

00:43:54   scrolling back forth in a way that a [TS]

00:43:56   native app never would because it's [TS]

00:43:58   doing something funny or like it's so [TS]

00:44:00   hard to pin down what it is but even [TS]

00:44:01   just the way in todoist when you're [TS]

00:44:04   completing tasks or adding things like [TS]

00:44:07   it just doesn't feel like iOS because it [TS]

00:44:10   because it isn't but it also shows up [TS]

00:44:13   and I think exactly what you're talking [TS]

00:44:15   about here where there are a surprising [TS]

00:44:17   lack of options very often when you're [TS]

00:44:21   using these kinds of apps when they are [TS]

00:44:23   apps to feel they should have [TS]

00:44:24   yeah and and this is this is a perfect [TS]

00:44:28   example of it feels like what you want [TS]

00:44:30   that app badge icon to represent it [TS]

00:44:33   feels like you should have a huge array [TS]

00:44:35   of selections in here but you don't and [TS]

00:44:38   I think that is a side effect of the [TS]

00:44:41   company I think smartly trying to build [TS]

00:44:45   an app that works universally across a [TS]

00:44:47   whole bunch of platforms and so to them [TS]

00:44:50   almost any time spent on customization [TS]

00:44:53   on a particular platform is almost [TS]

00:44:55   wasted time I'm aware like what I would [TS]

00:44:58   love is a way to have that badge show [TS]

00:45:01   the number of tasks that are currently [TS]

00:45:04   assigned to me in the system up again [TS]

00:45:07   this is because i'm using it in a very [TS]

00:45:08   different way you are as a collaboration [TS]

00:45:11   between two people and that's one of [TS]

00:45:13   these cases where's like I don't have a [TS]

00:45:15   good way for that that for the app to [TS]

00:45:19   communicate to me through a little icon [TS]

00:45:21   that oh my assistant needs me to get [TS]

00:45:24   back on something related to tax [TS]

00:45:26   documentation or whatever it is today [TS]

00:45:28   like it feels like that should be an [TS]

00:45:30   option but it isn't it's not in there [TS]

00:45:33   and I will just add since you missed the [TS]

00:45:36   forecasts from OmniFocus my biggest [TS]

00:45:40   missing feature that I have to say [TS]

00:45:41   omnifocus does so well and I don't see [TS]

00:45:45   any other to-do app at all handle this [TS]

00:45:47   is the concept of start dates and I feel [TS]

00:45:50   like start dates are so integrated into [TS]

00:45:53   my mind that I like I don't understand [TS]

00:45:57   how any of these apps work with like I'm [TS]

00:46:01   een here's all I'm asking for like this [TS]

00:46:02   let's let's say I wanted to add a task [TS]

00:46:04   let's do like the simplest task in the [TS]

00:46:06   world which is like buy flowers for [TS]

00:46:08   Mother's Day right let's say something [TS]

00:46:11   like this you know and it's do you know [TS]

00:46:14   the day before Mother's Day I don't want [TS]

00:46:17   to see that task as open and uncompleted [TS]

00:46:19   for the whole year running up to mothers [TS]

00:46:22   like I want to say set the start date a [TS]

00:46:24   week before Mother's Day like don't show [TS]

00:46:26   me this task until it actually starts [TS]

00:46:30   coming up right or if there's a thing [TS]

00:46:31   that I can only do later in the day but [TS]

00:46:34   I can't do now like set the start time [TS]

00:46:36   to be later in the day and [TS]

00:46:38   omnifocus like nails this with the [TS]

00:46:40   ability to only show you tasks that you [TS]

00:46:43   can do right now and no other [TS]

00:46:46   application seems to do this very well [TS]

00:46:48   and it is the one thing that is driving [TS]

00:46:50   me kind of crazy into doest is there's [TS]

00:46:52   always a bunch of stuff that looks like [TS]

00:46:54   it's open and available but very often [TS]

00:46:57   like I can't actually make any progress [TS]

00:46:58   on this until a later point in time and [TS]

00:47:01   I wish there was a way to hide it until [TS]

00:47:04   I actually can do something about it [TS]

00:47:07   yeah I've seen people complain about [TS]

00:47:10   with other systems as well Phyllis is [TS]

00:47:12   one of those things that I don't think a [TS]

00:47:13   lot of people are thinking about now [TS]

00:47:15   like it was maybe like a pot as part of [TS]

00:47:18   a system which people don't consider I [TS]

00:47:20   don't know why but it's like I never [TS]

00:47:22   even thought oh this is like it will [TS]

00:47:23   just come up when it comes up by due [TS]

00:47:24   date like even when you want to explain [TS]

00:47:26   it to me I'm just like it's just they're [TS]

00:47:28   just you just don't see it what do you [TS]

00:47:30   mean he just don't you but you do see it [TS]

00:47:31   like you see it in the system when [TS]

00:47:33   you're looking at like the list of open [TS]

00:47:34   tasks just don't look that like hey you [TS]

00:47:39   know like I know what you're seeing is [TS]

00:47:40   that you go to the project or whatever [TS]

00:47:42   but you don't need to be in the project [TS]

00:47:43   just just do what what's jus my notice [TS]

00:47:47   is there's a difference in the system [TS]

00:47:48   right but but I know I know this is like [TS]

00:47:51   yeah this is like a this is like a [TS]

00:47:52   philosophical distance and this is also [TS]

00:47:54   a case where I know that I am in the [TS]

00:47:56   minority because essentially no other [TS]

00:47:58   to-do app makes this no like it's like [TS]

00:48:02   I've never seen anybody do this [TS]

00:48:04   implementation as well the same was like [TS]

00:48:06   deferring yeah like I see people say [TS]

00:48:08   they want deferred eight so just like [TS]

00:48:09   just move the Jew day like what's wrong [TS]

00:48:11   with you that's this is in my mind it's [TS]

00:48:13   like just just move the date I do i do [TS]

00:48:16   think this is also a little bit of a a [TS]

00:48:18   holdover from a certain kind of getting [TS]

00:48:20   things done thinking which I still I'm [TS]

00:48:23   still maintaining that I really like [TS]

00:48:25   this which is a due date should be a [TS]

00:48:29   real hard due date are you like you [TS]

00:48:33   shouldn't be using due dates for I'd [TS]

00:48:35   like to do this thing on this day yeah [TS]

00:48:37   right that's that's the distinction here [TS]

00:48:39   and so a start date allows you to have a [TS]

00:48:42   distinction about like due dates are [TS]

00:48:45   really due dates right there they're not [TS]

00:48:48   these other kind of things but but I am [TS]

00:48:50   totally aware of like if I'm wanting to [TS]

00:48:52   use any other system I totally have to [TS]

00:48:54   hack my way around this like I did [TS]

00:48:56   mention before I still use to do to [TS]

00:48:58   track certain kinds of tasks like little [TS]

00:49:01   routine tasks and I just hack that whole [TS]

00:49:03   thing or it's like everything only shows [TS]

00:49:05   up in my system when it's overdue right [TS]

00:49:07   so sighs look just the due date means [TS]

00:49:09   nothing right it's just this is what I [TS]

00:49:11   want the thing to show up not when it's [TS]

00:49:13   actually do so I think I think that's [TS]

00:49:15   where this disagreement comes in is like [TS]

00:49:18   a philosophical conflict over what is [TS]

00:49:20   the meaning of the due date yeah I feel [TS]

00:49:22   like this is an old school thinking [TS]

00:49:24   rather as you mentioned because I feel [TS]

00:49:26   like everybody that I know that uses [TS]

00:49:27   those functions like differ and start [TS]

00:49:31   and stuff like that there's people that [TS]

00:49:32   that seem to have been doing this stuff [TS]

00:49:34   for longer yeah I I think that is the [TS]

00:49:37   case whereas it seems like most people [TS]

00:49:41   are much happier with using the due date [TS]

00:49:44   as a goal almost like oh this is the day [TS]

00:49:47   that I want to do the thing and it feels [TS]

00:49:49   like it might be like if you're at the [TS]

00:49:52   school of David Allen or not that that's [TS]

00:49:54   what I do think this is probably a [TS]

00:49:56   holdover from that but this is this is [TS]

00:49:58   one habit that I just I cannot let go [TS]

00:50:01   because I like it's like due dates [TS]

00:50:03   should mean something right likes it [TS]

00:50:05   like sometimes you get into an argument [TS]

00:50:06   with the person and they're using words [TS]

00:50:08   like in a really sloppy way and it's [TS]

00:50:10   like no words need to mean something [TS]

00:50:12   like if we're having a conversation and [TS]

00:50:14   words mean nothing like well I don't [TS]

00:50:16   even understand how we can have a [TS]

00:50:17   conversation and I feel that way about [TS]

00:50:19   due dates and system like the day due [TS]

00:50:21   date needs to mean something otherwise I [TS]

00:50:23   don't understand how to organize [TS]

00:50:25   anything okay grandpa I know I know [TS]

00:50:28   that's where I am you kids with your [TS]

00:50:30   with your due dates that mean nothing [TS]

00:50:33   and your words that can mean whatever [TS]

00:50:35   you want them to mean it's just like [TS]

00:50:36   okay whatever just gonna yell at you [TS]

00:50:39   from my porch that's what I'm gonna do [TS]

00:50:40   one of a problem of my switch to do is [TS]

00:50:44   is one hundred percent on me errors with [TS]

00:50:49   the manual data transfer okay human [TS]

00:50:53   error oh my god oh this is completely on [TS]

00:50:55   me so like I added some things [TS]

00:50:57   incorrectly so there was like some tasks [TS]

00:51:00   that I had to complete and they were [TS]

00:51:02   just like they were on the wrong [TS]

00:51:03   repeating cycle or something [TS]

00:51:05   and so now I live in fear of like what [TS]

00:51:09   else is wrong right something in here is [TS]

00:51:12   wrong and I don't know what it is and [TS]

00:51:15   I'll only know when it's too late you [TS]

00:51:18   know but there's nothing you can do [TS]

00:51:20   about that I just freaking wish there [TS]

00:51:22   was a system so i could move around [TS]

00:51:24   easily but no doesn't do like that ship [TS]

00:51:28   has sailed but i just wished that there [TS]

00:51:30   was something you know we spoke about [TS]

00:51:31   this last time like i just wished it was [TS]

00:51:33   like a system like Heather's calendars [TS]

00:51:35   or system how there is email right that [TS]

00:51:39   these things are just there and you can [TS]

00:51:43   move from app to app because they're [TS]

00:51:44   pulling from a database that everyone [TS]

00:51:46   can share you know like how r SS is you [TS]

00:51:49   know like I just wish there was a thing [TS]

00:51:51   like that for tasks but there isn't and [TS]

00:51:53   there never will be because it's too [TS]

00:51:54   late now there never will be and I think [TS]

00:51:56   the the three protocols that we have [TS]

00:51:59   like RSS email and HTML that are these [TS]

00:52:03   universal protocols that are used by [TS]

00:52:04   everybody I think all three of those are [TS]

00:52:07   are almost like a historical accident [TS]

00:52:09   that we even got them in the first place [TS]

00:52:11   I let not even long for this world [TS]

00:52:13   anymore lot of this stuff right yeah but [TS]

00:52:15   it'sit's they're really valuable because [TS]

00:52:18   of that but it's this is one of these [TS]

00:52:20   cases where I feel like you run the [TS]

00:52:21   simulation of the world over again and [TS]

00:52:23   we could end up in a world where there [TS]

00:52:25   aren't these common communication [TS]

00:52:28   protocols and I do think that when you [TS]

00:52:31   say they're not long for the world I [TS]

00:52:33   think on the user end in very many cases [TS]

00:52:35   they're not long for the world but [TS]

00:52:36   they're they're a kind of foundation [TS]

00:52:38   that will probably never go away and [TS]

00:52:40   they are super useful like HTML and be [TS]

00:52:44   able to do the this API stuff like this [TS]

00:52:46   is all dependent on the very notion of [TS]

00:52:48   loading and sending information to a web [TS]

00:52:50   page yeah great I'm so happy this is [TS]

00:52:52   here I said but the ones we have that's [TS]

00:52:55   as many as we're gonna have exactly [TS]

00:52:57   that's kind of I mean like the idea of [TS]

00:52:59   it is not long for this world in that [TS]

00:53:01   their war no one's gonna make another [TS]

00:53:02   one of these because this isn't how [TS]

00:53:04   companies get rich anymore its [TS]

00:53:06   proprietary exactly yeah I think we're [TS]

00:53:09   never going to end up with another one [TS]

00:53:11   of these like how you do if your [TS]

00:53:14   Evernote database over there buddy [TS]

00:53:15   doing good ya doing just great let me [TS]

00:53:20   tell you a story about how I wanted to [TS]

00:53:22   rearrange some tags on my iPhone and [TS]

00:53:26   every now and then like oh oh great all [TS]

00:53:29   the hierarchical information that I've [TS]

00:53:31   put together on my Mac with the tags Oh [TS]

00:53:34   none of that carries over to Evernote [TS]

00:53:35   great thanks thanks Evernote that's that [TS]

00:53:38   week this story for another time you're [TS]

00:53:40   gonna hate this but my suggestion to you [TS]

00:53:42   now is start over somewhere else and [TS]

00:53:46   like everything new you add to the [TS]

00:53:48   system goes in that place and everything [TS]

00:53:50   old is in the legacy app and then over [TS]

00:53:52   time you can let go ever know we can't [TS]

00:53:55   have we can't have this conversation now [TS]

00:53:57   like Mike you'd like you do not [TS]

00:53:58   understand you do not understand the [TS]

00:54:01   kind of legacy costs that I'm dealing [TS]

00:54:03   with here right this is this is just now [TS]

00:54:05   you've explained it to me I know I I [TS]

00:54:07   have an idea right like I can i can [TS]

00:54:09   understand but like it's not it's just [TS]

00:54:13   not gonna work for you man like it's [TS]

00:54:14   gonna die no no do you know what the gym [TS]

00:54:17   what the problem is the problem is [TS]

00:54:18   despite all of my frustrations it does [TS]

00:54:21   still work for me right like when i'm [TS]

00:54:23   trying to search for something this just [TS]

00:54:25   just just happened the other day like [TS]

00:54:26   i'm working on a video and i'm going to [TS]

00:54:29   do a quick search for a thing as like oh [TS]

00:54:31   great some notes I saved from like seven [TS]

00:54:34   years ago turned up as a thing that was [TS]

00:54:36   relevant to something that I'm doing now [TS]

00:54:38   so is it that's the problems problems [TS]

00:54:40   it's actually still useful to keep [TS]

00:54:42   working like there is still like a [TS]

00:54:44   system that can work right which is like [TS]

00:54:47   RSS like emails plain text you know [TS]

00:54:50   there are so many apps that build on [TS]

00:54:52   plain text man I know that you have [TS]

00:54:55   images right but you can also save [TS]

00:54:58   folders of images and it's it's sloppy [TS]

00:55:00   you know how many OCR bootleg [TS]

00:55:03   screenshots of God about that I have [TS]

00:55:05   right like I i have i have thousands of [TS]

00:55:10   ocr'd pages from books that i have found [TS]

00:55:13   interesting like it i cannot like that's [TS]

00:55:15   the problem anyway this is your fault [TS]

00:55:17   for bringing up Evernote I don't know [TS]

00:55:18   how it got down another Evercore tangent [TS]

00:55:21   here but what I was going to say [TS]

00:55:24   originally is that while something like [TS]

00:55:28   I [TS]

00:55:29   map for tasks will never exist with all [TS]

00:55:33   of these public API s and with your [TS]

00:55:35   growing skills and web automation there [TS]

00:55:39   is at least in theory the possibility [TS]

00:55:42   that a future Mike when moving from [TS]

00:55:45   todoist to some other program in the [TS]

00:55:49   future he'll be able to write something [TS]

00:55:53   that can at least do a basic transfer [TS]

00:55:55   right that can that can comb through the [TS]

00:55:57   database and then add tasks on the other [TS]

00:56:00   end to be double-checked I did look into [TS]

00:56:02   this a little bit like they're always to [TS]

00:56:05   move from OmniFocus todoist mmm but it [TS]

00:56:08   will still it still requires you to go [TS]

00:56:11   through and tweak some stuff because [TS]

00:56:12   they just don't talk to each other very [TS]

00:56:14   well like at all even if you take the [TS]

00:56:16   data out like the data OmniFocus gives [TS]

00:56:18   is not really comfortable for to doest [TS]

00:56:21   to accept so I still I know for my own [TS]

00:56:25   pups I still would have gone through [TS]

00:56:27   every task and made sure they were [TS]

00:56:28   correct oh yeah yeah again this is this [TS]

00:56:31   is not for now Mike I'm simply saying [TS]

00:56:32   like there's the possibility for future [TS]

00:56:35   Mike Mike four point oh yeah to API [TS]

00:56:37   enabled to do apps could have a much [TS]

00:56:41   easier transfer between them yeah then [TS]

00:56:44   one app that has an API and another app [TS]

00:56:46   that doesn't ah yes of course I see what [TS]

00:56:49   you mean it's not only focus was never [TS]

00:56:50   going to do any good but like yeah [TS]

00:56:52   future application like both [TS]

00:56:54   understanding the web right could yeah [TS]

00:56:57   you're totally right no one the very [TS]

00:57:00   best thing about to do list also houses [TS]

00:57:03   I think it's very worst floor so to do [TS]

00:57:08   its natural language entry is incredible [TS]

00:57:12   like I press control in and I just start [TS]

00:57:18   typing and then I press ENTER and the [TS]

00:57:20   task is done and it has the due date it [TS]

00:57:23   has the project it's all attached to it [TS]

00:57:25   I love it it's like how fantastical [TS]

00:57:27   change calendars to do is change task [TS]

00:57:30   entry because you just you type to it [TS]

00:57:33   you have to learn the language of the [TS]

00:57:35   application a little bit right leg [TS]

00:57:36   mm-hmm what is it that you need to do to [TS]

00:57:38   add something to a project what do you [TS]

00:57:40   need to do to add a label to it that [TS]

00:57:43   kind of [TS]

00:57:43   thing you know but it's brilliant but [TS]

00:57:46   where it falls down is the way that you [TS]

00:57:49   especially with repeating tasks like [TS]

00:57:53   there is a specific language they have a [TS]

00:57:55   website that will web page even in the [TS]

00:57:58   application you can get a link which [TS]

00:57:59   kind of tells you how do you say every [TS]

00:58:01   second Tuesday or how do you say every [TS]

00:58:04   first of the month right there are ways [TS]

00:58:08   in which you say this stuff into the [TS]

00:58:11   natural language and that's pretty [TS]

00:58:12   normal of this stuff right where there [TS]

00:58:14   is a language that it understands [TS]

00:58:16   because then it's going to get it right [TS]

00:58:17   and I totally understand that and you [TS]

00:58:19   have to learn the language to be able to [TS]

00:58:21   speak to it in that way it's like the [TS]

00:58:24   same with like the Amazon echo right you [TS]

00:58:26   speak to it in the ways that it [TS]

00:58:28   understands and then you are good right [TS]

00:58:30   right but the problem with to doest is [TS]

00:58:32   with all of the repeating tasks stuff [TS]

00:58:34   there's no UI yeah I've run into this as [TS]

00:58:37   well so you can't change a thing unless [TS]

00:58:39   you speak to it and that is crazy making [TS]

00:58:44   to me like i have spent like 20 minutes [TS]

00:58:47   trying to get a task to repeat in the [TS]

00:58:49   right way because i keep telling it in [TS]

00:58:51   the way that I think it should [TS]

00:58:52   understand but it's still getting it [TS]

00:58:55   wrong and I can't just click and then [TS]

00:58:58   just just press a button like I could do [TS]

00:59:00   in OmniFocus to get it to do that now [TS]

00:59:02   omnifocus I could set it that way but I [TS]

00:59:05   also couldn't speak to it right so [TS]

00:59:06   there's like a give-and-take with it and [TS]

00:59:07   everyone that I know that uses to do us [TS]

00:59:10   is also frustrated about this but over [TS]

00:59:12   time it becomes less of a problem as you [TS]

00:59:14   learn more and more how to talk to it [TS]

00:59:16   but they should also have the UI to be [TS]

00:59:20   like repeat every second Tuesday yeah [TS]

00:59:24   this this kind of stuff is really funny [TS]

00:59:26   because the natural language processing [TS]

00:59:27   is always oh it's fantastic when it [TS]

00:59:30   works but when it doesn't work suddenly [TS]

00:59:33   it's like you're in the 1970s talking to [TS]

00:59:36   the terminal right you just you need to [TS]

00:59:38   learn the magic incantations to say to [TS]

00:59:40   make up do the thing and it's [TS]

00:59:41   infuriating the problems lie and when [TS]

00:59:44   there isn't a defined language when it's [TS]

00:59:47   trying to infer your meaning right this [TS]

00:59:49   is why a lot of people i think get [TS]

00:59:51   frustrated it's eerie is that oh my god [TS]

00:59:53   Siri I think tries to take more broad in [TS]

00:59:57   put ya where the echo [TS]

00:59:57   put ya where the echo [TS]

01:00:00   you have to say things in a specific way [TS]

01:00:02   so once you learn those things is more [TS]

01:00:03   reliable so like I understand why it [TS]

01:00:06   needs the specific language because then [TS]

01:00:09   we're talking to each other in a way [TS]

01:00:10   that we understand it's like I'm talking [TS]

01:00:12   to you right now I'm not half of my [TS]

01:00:14   words aren't French right right I have [TS]

01:00:17   to speak to you in the language I know [TS]

01:00:19   you're going to understand I get that [TS]

01:00:21   but not having a you I fall back it's [TS]

01:00:24   just just stupid I think I can't [TS]

01:00:26   understand why you wouldn't have that [TS]

01:00:27   yeah it is frustrating again I've I'm [TS]

01:00:30   using it in a very different way but I [TS]

01:00:32   was aware of that really fast that the [TS]

01:00:35   lack of you I for certain aspects of the [TS]

01:00:37   task is frustrating and it it also seems [TS]

01:00:41   like you need this here so that I can [TS]

01:00:43   learn when the language typing works and [TS]

01:00:47   when it doesn't are so there can be a [TS]

01:00:48   little feedback loop but like what do [TS]

01:00:49   you think I said like how are you [TS]

01:00:52   populating all of these fields based on [TS]

01:00:54   what I'm typing into this box very very [TS]

01:00:56   weird I mentioned statistics to do is [TS]

01:01:01   has statistics which are kind of cool [TS]

01:01:04   kind of pointless at the same time the [TS]

01:01:08   pointless thing is something called [TS]

01:01:09   Karma you are points over time and then [TS]

01:01:12   you become like mega expert like I don't [TS]

01:01:15   really know why they have this system [TS]

01:01:17   doing why they have this system [TS]

01:01:18   ramification I know that's the reason [TS]

01:01:20   but it's like gamification is just like [TS]

01:01:23   machine learning right it's magic that [TS]

01:01:25   you sprinkle on to every product but [TS]

01:01:27   thing about it is is the gamification [TS]

01:01:29   does work because you know there's a [TS]

01:01:32   part of me and it's like oh like I've [TS]

01:01:34   just gone up a comma level like I am a [TS]

01:01:37   master now you know like I am currently [TS]

01:01:40   an expert to next is master than [TS]

01:01:42   Grandmaster and then enlightened you [TS]

01:01:45   know like it wasn't gonna get to the [TS]

01:01:46   enlightened phase and an only to work [TS]

01:01:48   anymore I think that's what that's what [TS]

01:01:49   it's telling me they give you a big [TS]

01:01:51   payout when you're done and then you've [TS]

01:01:53   won you've won the game of productivity [TS]

01:01:54   I think that's how it works but what I [TS]

01:01:57   do like is that the statistics that they [TS]

01:01:59   give you about like you can kind of tell [TS]

01:02:01   it how many tasks you want to complete [TS]

01:02:03   on an average day and then it has like a [TS]

01:02:05   baseline and you can see when you breach [TS]

01:02:06   over the baseline you get streaks going [TS]

01:02:08   and stuff like that which i think is [TS]

01:02:10   kind of interesting I can see how many [TS]

01:02:11   tasks are completed in the last seven [TS]

01:02:13   is an hour weekly basis the last four [TS]

01:02:15   weeks and like I like seeing that [TS]

01:02:17   because it's given me some trends but [TS]

01:02:19   i'm using project snail gray something [TS]

01:02:21   I've never done before but i'm using [TS]

01:02:24   project since but one of the reasons is [TS]

01:02:26   because it's easier for me to do this i [TS]

01:02:28   don't i can just type it in and it takes [TS]

01:02:30   like a second more for me to type in [TS]

01:02:32   like the pound sign and then cortex and [TS]

01:02:34   then is into a context project and I'm [TS]

01:02:37   finding this just to be useful mostly [TS]

01:02:39   for knowing where to find things so I [TS]

01:02:44   know I have a task in the future instead [TS]

01:02:46   of me searching for I hit the cortex one [TS]

01:02:48   I don't know it's going to be in there [TS]

01:02:49   and it's also interesting when I'm like [TS]

01:02:51   I can't I don't really feel like doing [TS]

01:02:53   this right now hey whats in my personal [TS]

01:02:54   stuff like was my personal tag there [TS]

01:02:56   easy things to do you know so that's [TS]

01:02:58   that it's interesting to me to kind of [TS]

01:03:00   put things in these buckets which is GTD [TS]

01:03:04   101 right using projects but I just [TS]

01:03:07   never done it before so i feel like i've [TS]

01:03:09   upgraded my system it's interesting to [TS]

01:03:11   me that anyone could have used OmniFocus [TS]

01:03:16   for as long as as you did without ever [TS]

01:03:18   really using projects it's it's so based [TS]

01:03:21   around the notion of there are projects [TS]

01:03:24   that it's almost inconceivable how you [TS]

01:03:27   would even be using it without without [TS]

01:03:28   projects as a fundamental part of the [TS]

01:03:31   part of things so it's funny to me that [TS]

01:03:34   todoist the application that seems like [TS]

01:03:37   a projects whatever maybe you have them [TS]

01:03:39   maybe you don't this is the one that has [TS]

01:03:42   has you now using projects more yeah it [TS]

01:03:46   is weird but is purely because of the [TS]

01:03:48   entry like I can get it in easier I [TS]

01:03:51   don't have to tap more stuff and spend [TS]

01:03:53   more time see it's just it's just like [TS]

01:03:55   automation right you've reduce the [TS]

01:03:57   friction to do something and then you [TS]

01:03:59   are more likely to take advantage of it [TS]

01:04:01   so yeah I am very pleased with todoist [TS]

01:04:03   overall it like with anything like I'm [TS]

01:04:06   critical of it because I really liked it [TS]

01:04:09   so I want it to be better mm-hmm if I [TS]

01:04:11   didn't have any complaints that's more [TS]

01:04:13   an issue I think right like I think I i [TS]

01:04:15   want to have complaints about the thing [TS]

01:04:17   because it means i'm pushing it means [TS]

01:04:18   i'm using it right lover than she's been [TS]

01:04:21   like yes fine whatever like I don't have [TS]

01:04:23   any feelings for it in that way but I [TS]

01:04:24   have feelings for this application [TS]

01:04:25   because I think it's very cool [TS]

01:04:27   a lot of the stuff that it does but it [TS]

01:04:29   has work to go but I am one hundred [TS]

01:04:31   percent sold I'm not moving back to [TS]

01:04:33   OmniFocus like this is my system I have [TS]

01:04:35   absolutely no desire to move back I am [TS]

01:04:39   completely sold on this because the [TS]

01:04:40   things this app does better know so much [TS]

01:04:44   better and the things that it doesn't do [TS]

01:04:46   as well and maybe not as bad as I [TS]

01:04:49   initially thought that they would be hmm [TS]

01:04:51   it's interesting it's an interesting [TS]

01:04:53   interesting verdict no more OmniFocus [TS]

01:04:56   for Mike no not as I said really I don't [TS]

01:05:01   know what it would take for me to move [TS]

01:05:03   back like I just don't think it's gonna [TS]

01:05:05   be on my horizon like OmniFocus is a [TS]

01:05:08   better iOS application than todoist [TS]

01:05:11   hands down that the apps are amazing [TS]

01:05:15   like on the Mac it's just a web app [TS]

01:05:18   little wrapper like it's even more like [TS]

01:05:21   funny than how it is on iOS where it's [TS]

01:05:24   it's still an iOS application as you say [TS]

01:05:26   but like it's it's not completely native [TS]

01:05:29   I doesn't feel it doesn't feel natives [TS]

01:05:31   there tryna unify this experience but on [TS]

01:05:33   the Mac it's just like this is just like [TS]

01:05:34   straight up like that but I just love [TS]

01:05:36   all of the bits around it all of the [TS]

01:05:39   stuff that makes the application work is [TS]

01:05:42   so interesting to me because there's so [TS]

01:05:44   many things happening in the background [TS]

01:05:46   I'm just really and kind of just smitten [TS]

01:05:49   about all of that honestly like I think [TS]

01:05:51   that it is a much better system for Mike [TS]

01:05:53   of 2017 than anything else is yeah it's [TS]

01:05:58   it's been very interesting just to play [TS]

01:06:00   around with this like I have a hard time [TS]

01:06:03   imagining using to do is to my primary [TS]

01:06:07   system but I've just been very [TS]

01:06:10   interested to play around with it and to [TS]

01:06:13   be using it as the communication device [TS]

01:06:15   between my assistant and I were we're [TS]

01:06:17   tracking what's going on is it just [TS]

01:06:20   because there's not enough tinkering [TS]

01:06:21   available it's a hard app to be [TS]

01:06:22   particular with its yet it's a difficult [TS]

01:06:25   app to be particular with they do have [TS]

01:06:29   filters which are these ways of pre [TS]

01:06:33   searching through a bunch of tasks which [TS]

01:06:34   are are comparable to OmniFocus but i [TS]

01:06:38   would say they are [TS]

01:06:40   much less powerful than I first thought [TS]

01:06:42   because there's some weird limitations [TS]

01:06:45   on combining certain kinds of queries [TS]

01:06:48   that that make it a little bit hard to [TS]

01:06:51   use but yeah it is it is difficult to be [TS]

01:06:57   particular with but I really do find [TS]

01:07:02   myself just just interesting and [TS]

01:07:05   thinking about this this whole concept [TS]

01:07:07   of apps that are really web services [TS]

01:07:12   with api's and it is also a thing in in [TS]

01:07:16   thinking about the future there there [TS]

01:07:21   may be some kind of thing that I could [TS]

01:07:24   do where you don't even really have to [TS]

01:07:27   interact with a nap so directly because [TS]

01:07:30   you're able to write little things that [TS]

01:07:32   interact with it indirectly in exactly [TS]

01:07:35   the way that you want to every time you [TS]

01:07:39   know III don't know I don't know where [TS]

01:07:41   I'm going to end up I don't predicts [TS]

01:07:43   that I'm going to go to to-do list as my [TS]

01:07:46   primary application in the future but I [TS]

01:07:49   do have to say as as this trial between [TS]

01:07:53   my assistant and I it has been very [TS]

01:07:56   successful and it's a really great tool [TS]

01:08:00   to be using between the two of us so I [TS]

01:08:02   think it definitely has a place in my [TS]

01:08:05   life going forward but perhaps not the [TS]

01:08:08   primary place right but who knows we'll [TS]

01:08:11   see like I web api is maybe one of those [TS]

01:08:14   features that over time just become so [TS]

01:08:17   increasingly valuable that it Dwarfs all [TS]

01:08:20   other considerations I've got to say [TS]

01:08:21   like if I was gonna put money on this [TS]

01:08:24   opal money that you end up in todoist [TS]

01:08:26   because if Web API is becoming that more [TS]

01:08:29   of an important tool for you you will [TS]

01:08:31   just get more and more annoyed that your [TS]

01:08:34   app that your that your GT application [TS]

01:08:36   your task manager you what I think of [TS]

01:08:39   for me and I think it's same for you the [TS]

01:08:40   center of all of my work mm-hmm has no [TS]

01:08:43   hooks and really from what I've seen the [TS]

01:08:47   doest is the one in this area so it [TS]

01:08:51   would it would surprise me you know like [TS]

01:08:53   you may [TS]

01:08:54   that building like a weird system that [TS]

01:08:56   uses these web api is to mock all of [TS]

01:09:00   these due dates and start dates stuff [TS]

01:09:03   for you for the rights of course like [TS]

01:09:05   that's exactly what I start thinking of [TS]

01:09:07   is like well but if you can i maybe [TS]

01:09:10   there's a way to automate that you could [TS]

01:09:12   and that might be an interesting way to [TS]

01:09:13   deal with that like you just you just [TS]

01:09:15   enter a task into somewhere and it will [TS]

01:09:17   appear in to do us at some point in the [TS]

01:09:20   future but I would be surprised honestly [TS]

01:09:24   like if in a year you're used to using [TS]

01:09:26   something else because if this [TS]

01:09:29   automation stuff is becoming as [TS]

01:09:30   important to you as I think it is it [TS]

01:09:34   would be it would be surprising for me [TS]

01:09:36   if you then just let your to-do app not [TS]

01:09:39   worry about that stuff yeah I don't know [TS]

01:09:43   I'm I'll be interested to find out what [TS]

01:09:46   future me does at least in the time that [TS]

01:09:48   I have spent so far I have consistently [TS]

01:09:51   noticed that I have conflicting needs [TS]

01:09:55   and requirements for high-level and [TS]

01:09:58   low-level looking at tasks there's [TS]

01:10:02   something there that I haven't quite [TS]

01:10:03   settled on that I don't quite have [TS]

01:10:05   requirements for yet there's something [TS]

01:10:07   brewing I don't know well we'll see [TS]

01:10:09   we'll see what happens but to do is [TS]

01:10:11   definitely has a place in my life we'll [TS]

01:10:15   just see how how primary it it becomes [TS]

01:10:18   or doesn't in the future thank you to [TS]

01:10:20   FreshBooks for supporting this week's [TS]

01:10:22   episode of cortex life as a freelancer [TS]

01:10:25   can be challenging but our friends over [TS]

01:10:27   at freshbooks believe the rewards are [TS]

01:10:29   worth it and they try and build tools [TS]

01:10:31   that make this challenging life easier [TS]

01:10:33   you know you could be racing to wrap up [TS]

01:10:36   free projects while also trying to [TS]

01:10:38   remember to track the time on them [TS]

01:10:39   because you're also working on building [TS]

01:10:41   out a new productivity system also [TS]

01:10:43   whilst trying to tackle that mountain of [TS]

01:10:45   paperwork and the working world is [TS]

01:10:48   different now the growth of the internet [TS]

01:10:49   means that there's more opportunities [TS]

01:10:51   for everyone to be self-employed that is [TS]

01:10:54   why FreshBooks was worked tirelessly on [TS]

01:10:56   an all new version of the cloud [TS]

01:10:58   accounting software that is tailored for [TS]

01:11:00   those of us that work online but and [TS]

01:11:02   also helps us deal with all of those [TS]

01:11:04   huge long lists of tasks that we have [TS]

01:11:07   day you'll be more productive and more [TS]

01:11:09   organized whilst also being paid quickly [TS]

01:11:12   FreshBooks customers get paid up to four [TS]

01:11:14   days faster on average and it's so [TS]

01:11:17   simple and so easy to get your invoices [TS]

01:11:19   sent out there you'll have online [TS]

01:11:20   payments set up in just a couple of [TS]

01:11:22   clicks and your invoices will be built [TS]

01:11:24   in their WYSIWYG interface you'll see [TS]

01:11:26   them exactly how your clients going to [TS]

01:11:28   see them too no more guessing games [TS]

01:11:30   involved in your invoices because we're [TS]

01:11:32   freshbooks you'll be able to see when [TS]

01:11:34   your client a senior invoice and you'll [TS]

01:11:36   have a full track of everything that's [TS]

01:11:38   been going up with it every time you log [TS]

01:11:40   into freshbooks you get notifications to [TS]

01:11:42   update you on what's change and what [TS]

01:11:43   needs your attention freshbooks has been [TS]

01:11:46   designed with the aerial question in [TS]

01:11:48   mind of how is my business doing no more [TS]

01:11:50   guessing games of what's odor over do [TS]

01:11:52   they let you know exactly and clearly [TS]

01:11:55   freshbooks is offering a 30-day trial of [TS]

01:11:58   unrestricted free use for listeners of [TS]

01:12:00   this show go to freshbooks calm / cortex [TS]

01:12:03   and in how you heard about a section [TS]

01:12:05   just type in the word cortex so they [TS]

01:12:07   know that you came to them from this [TS]

01:12:08   show thank you to freshbooks for their [TS]

01:12:10   support of this show and relay FM one of [TS]

01:12:14   the things that happened because of our [TS]

01:12:16   doubling up episodes was that between [TS]

01:12:19   those episodes and now we put up the [TS]

01:12:23   application to hire an administrative [TS]

01:12:26   assistant relay FM which is something we [TS]

01:12:27   been talking about for a while and I [TS]

01:12:29   wanted to talk about on the show but I [TS]

01:12:30   also wanted to get it done and I figured [TS]

01:12:32   maybe we'd keep the application open [TS]

01:12:34   until the show until we recorded a new [TS]

01:12:37   episode mm-hmm then we got over 100 [TS]

01:12:39   responses so we decided to shut it down [TS]

01:12:42   shut it down do you insisting to help [TS]

01:12:46   you get through all of those [TS]

01:12:47   applications oh I felt it um I did put [TS]

01:12:51   the I did put it in the show notes for [TS]

01:12:53   the last week's episode and I know that [TS]

01:12:55   a bunch of people found it because of [TS]

01:12:56   that because of the applications [TS]

01:12:58   increasing after the episode went out so [TS]

01:13:00   we did that but um I felt like a hunched [TS]

01:13:03   over a hundred applications was enough [TS]

01:13:05   that that seems like enough to get [TS]

01:13:09   started at the very least yeah and if it [TS]

01:13:11   isn't well we can just do it all over [TS]

01:13:13   again but we had the application up for [TS]

01:13:15   about a week also and again this is like [TS]

01:13:18   a refresher so awesome we'll be working [TS]

01:13:20   with [TS]

01:13:21   me primarily to help me with some of the [TS]

01:13:23   administrative that goes around the [TS]

01:13:25   business side of relay FM you know so [TS]

01:13:28   working with companies and helping me [TS]

01:13:30   like with booking in stuff into systems [TS]

01:13:32   and things like that so so kind of [TS]

01:13:34   helping me and assisting me so I can [TS]

01:13:36   focus on some other stuff we made a [TS]

01:13:38   really good decision when we probs [TS]

01:13:40   application to create a standalone email [TS]

01:13:42   address for this yeah that's probably a [TS]

01:13:44   good decision because then I assigned [TS]

01:13:46   him to the email address in a separate [TS]

01:13:48   application that wasn't my email app so [TS]

01:13:50   then I didn't have to see all these [TS]

01:13:52   emails coming in and that meant I could [TS]

01:13:54   just kind of go and read them in chunks [TS]

01:13:58   of time you know as opposed to like them [TS]

01:14:01   coming in constantly a hundred emails I [TS]

01:14:04   really would have felt that you know I [TS]

01:14:06   really would have felt that increase [TS]

01:14:08   over the weekend definitely things would [TS]

01:14:10   have gotten lost in my email inbox if if [TS]

01:14:12   they were coming in just through the [TS]

01:14:13   regular email addresses that we use so [TS]

01:14:16   that ended up being a good thing and [TS]

01:14:17   kind of maybe over like three or four [TS]

01:14:20   sessions went through all of them went [TS]

01:14:22   through all of the applications real [TS]

01:14:25   walls of text like that gets it's tough [TS]

01:14:28   because I feel like you kind of have to [TS]

01:14:31   pay attention right like you really have [TS]

01:14:34   to pay attention to all of them yeah [TS]

01:14:36   Aggie you are in a much more difficult [TS]

01:14:42   position here hiring the assistant that [TS]

01:14:45   I wasn't hiring the animator yeah [TS]

01:14:47   because with hiring the animator I'm [TS]

01:14:50   asking for a demonstration of your skill [TS]

01:14:53   mm-hmm I think with with any kind of job [TS]

01:14:56   hiring like that that's actually what [TS]

01:14:59   you want I was reading actually reading [TS]

01:15:02   some article about hiring where they're [TS]

01:15:03   proposing is this radical idea that if [TS]

01:15:05   if the job you're trying to hire for has [TS]

01:15:07   an actual skill I have the person do [TS]

01:15:09   some demonstration of the scale and it's [TS]

01:15:10   like yeah of course look if you do that [TS]

01:15:12   like that's that's what you want to do [TS]

01:15:14   like that's that makes things a thousand [TS]

01:15:16   times easier but I do not envy you in [TS]

01:15:20   this position because most jobs there is [TS]

01:15:25   no way that the person can really [TS]

01:15:27   demonstrate their skill in a meaningful [TS]

01:15:30   way ahead of time brother you can't have [TS]

01:15:33   this person [TS]

01:15:34   demonstrate their ability to be an [TS]

01:15:37   assistant for relay before they are the [TS]

01:15:39   assistant for relay there was one thing [TS]

01:15:41   but we did I won't say what it was but [TS]

01:15:44   there was a requirement in the [TS]

01:15:46   application that was not very over but [TS]

01:15:50   it was there and the people that didn't [TS]

01:15:52   do that thing loves a was good over them [TS]

01:15:55   yeah I mean that that's just a first [TS]

01:15:56   pass filter for that's hell no detail [TS]

01:15:59   noticing yeah we've all we've all done [TS]

01:16:02   things like that right where there's a [TS]

01:16:04   is this person paying attention yester [TS]

01:16:06   right and is it man that's gonna be kind [TS]

01:16:08   of important as time goes on right like [TS]

01:16:10   the person that is gonna be a cystic [TS]

01:16:13   name needs to listen to me like [TS]

01:16:15   otherwise this isn't gonna work so yeah [TS]

01:16:17   otherwise it's not going to work but so [TS]

01:16:19   I guess what I kind of want to know is [TS]

01:16:22   being in this difficult position not [TS]

01:16:25   being able to have a clear demonstration [TS]

01:16:27   of skill ahead of time how how were you [TS]

01:16:32   assessing these applications one good [TS]

01:16:36   thing was I read them all Stephen read [TS]

01:16:38   them all look so we amassed a group of [TS]

01:16:41   people mmm that we both like them we [TS]

01:16:44   were able to cross-reference them so [TS]

01:16:46   anyone that came up in both of us right [TS]

01:16:47   where that was a good application if [TS]

01:16:49   they didn't then me and him would maybe [TS]

01:16:50   argue that person right okay who would [TS]

01:16:53   go to interview so that was one good [TS]

01:16:54   part of it because there are some [TS]

01:16:56   candidates where I've put a lot more [TS]

01:16:57   full into them than others because I had [TS]

01:17:01   to argue it so that was an interesting [TS]

01:17:03   part of it as we were kind of discussing [TS]

01:17:04   who should go to the entry stage it was [TS]

01:17:08   just a lot of really hard and at some [TS]

01:17:12   point mind-numbing work because there is [TS]

01:17:16   a way to write a resume or CV that [TS]

01:17:21   pretty much everybody follows and [TS]

01:17:23   because it's the way these things should [TS]

01:17:25   be written as a lot of repetition an [TS]

01:17:30   awful lot of repetition mm-hmm and for [TS]

01:17:34   me the ones that really stuck out was [TS]

01:17:37   when somebody did something in the email [TS]

01:17:40   or in the cover letter to stoop that [TS]

01:17:45   that made them stand out [TS]

01:17:47   because there are also a lot of people [TS]

01:17:49   that were like you know I really love [TS]

01:17:50   the shows that you do and suffering is [TS]

01:17:51   what I like him so I don't know which is [TS]

01:17:53   nice because they're showing that they [TS]

01:17:54   understand it but that also became like [TS]

01:17:56   a thing that a lot of people were using [TS]

01:17:57   so there was just a few candidates that [TS]

01:18:00   what they wrote grabbed me and I can't [TS]

01:18:03   explain why mm-hmm but it was just like [TS]

01:18:06   I feel like I could work with this [TS]

01:18:08   person like there was just a feeling in [TS]

01:18:10   the way that they were expressing [TS]

01:18:11   themselves which was just something that [TS]

01:18:15   made sense now this isn't a weird notion [TS]

01:18:18   to me because I've done this before I've [TS]

01:18:20   hired people in the bank job so it's the [TS]

01:18:23   same kind of deal right the all resumes [TS]

01:18:26   look the same you know within a margin [TS]

01:18:29   but they all kind of sale of the same [TS]

01:18:31   kind of things mmm but it's the people [TS]

01:18:34   that kind of just they they display [TS]

01:18:36   something about themselves in the way [TS]

01:18:38   that they explain themselves for me the [TS]

01:18:41   explanation part is what's interesting [TS]

01:18:43   how somebody talks about themselves it's [TS]

01:18:46   so difficult right but like I wasn't [TS]

01:18:48   looking for someone who was to corporate [TS]

01:18:50   and I wasn't looking for someone who was [TS]

01:18:52   being zany for the sake of being zany [TS]

01:18:54   right but it's somewhere in the middle [TS]

01:18:56   look like I wanted that person to like [TS]

01:18:59   in prose give me an idea of their [TS]

01:19:03   personality and they were the ones that [TS]

01:19:06   kind of were able to jump through so [TS]

01:19:08   that was what made it interesting even [TS]

01:19:11   though it is hard work isn't the right [TS]

01:19:14   word but it's like intensive work which [TS]

01:19:17   is very repetitive you know so it was it [TS]

01:19:21   was a tough process but the people that [TS]

01:19:23   kind of spoke out to me especially with [TS]

01:19:26   the ones that were able to kind of shine [TS]

01:19:28   in some way in a way that cannot at all [TS]

01:19:31   be quantified but that's what makes it [TS]

01:19:34   interesting if you can quantify it then [TS]

01:19:37   it would be easy right everyone could do [TS]

01:19:39   it yeah i mean i would prefer that there [TS]

01:19:42   was some way to quantify it rightly like [TS]

01:19:44   like it's you know like it's World of [TS]

01:19:47   Warcraft and you're logging in you can [TS]

01:19:48   see oh there's this person rolled a 20 [TS]

01:19:50   in personal administration skills great [TS]

01:19:52   right that's that is actually what I [TS]

01:19:54   prefer but that's not the world that we [TS]

01:19:57   live in [TS]

01:19:57   so how are you going to filter down then [TS]

01:20:00   from the people that you have assessed [TS]

01:20:02   fit the role or interview so we have a [TS]

01:20:05   percentage of the applicants now that we [TS]

01:20:08   have worked in interviews for I want to [TS]

01:20:10   say how many there are I was gonna say [TS]

01:20:12   what percentage Mike I want to know a [TS]

01:20:13   percentage a presented of people but [TS]

01:20:18   what I will say is it's gonna take us [TS]

01:20:20   two and a half days to do this the [TS]

01:20:21   interviews how are you doing the full [TS]

01:20:23   who process that full how to hire [TS]

01:20:27   someone from the who book ammonia looks [TS]

01:20:30   like a player's gray yeah no I just want [TS]

01:20:33   to speak to all these people because the [TS]

01:20:36   next part of it is how do we communicate [TS]

01:20:38   so you're doing I presume like FaceTime [TS]

01:20:42   interviews that yes that's what's [TS]

01:20:44   occurring yeah it was an interesting [TS]

01:20:46   decision do we do audio or video hmm and [TS]

01:20:49   I've decided to do video primarily just [TS]

01:20:54   so I can get more of a feel for the [TS]

01:20:55   person although we will probably never [TS]

01:20:58   communicate visually right so me and [TS]

01:21:03   this person will most likely communicate [TS]

01:21:05   ninety-nine percent of the time for her [TS]

01:21:07   text mm-hmm but I wanna get a sense of [TS]

01:21:10   the person and I think the easiest way [TS]

01:21:13   to do that is to do this over video and [TS]

01:21:16   I think it also gives that person the [TS]

01:21:18   same from us is they get to get more of [TS]

01:21:21   a sense of us because they can see body [TS]

01:21:23   language they can see how we react to [TS]

01:21:25   things like it's just more expressive [TS]

01:21:27   and I think it's just a bit more of an [TS]

01:21:29   interesting way to do this as opposed to [TS]

01:21:31   like just exchanging e-mails back and [TS]

01:21:33   forth all having a phone call yeah it's [TS]

01:21:37   it's a more broadband way of [TS]

01:21:41   communicating than a narrow band way yep [TS]

01:21:44   there's less likelihood of things being [TS]

01:21:46   misunderstood i think and i also just in [TS]

01:21:50   case this is something we do end up [TS]

01:21:52   doing in the future I want to establish [TS]

01:21:54   this it's the first contact you know who [TS]

01:21:57   rather than like at some point [TS]

01:21:59   individual be like hey can we have a [TS]

01:22:01   video cooks it could be weird right like [TS]

01:22:02   if we already ever communicate but I [TS]

01:22:04   just want to start off like this is the [TS]

01:22:05   first contact that we've had and then we [TS]

01:22:07   move on forward from there I'm realizing [TS]

01:22:09   my assistant and I have [TS]

01:22:11   never done a video chat with each other [TS]

01:22:12   and it would be it would be strange I [TS]

01:22:14   probably noir that ever ever will never [TS]

01:22:17   was i don't see why i would want to do [TS]

01:22:19   it bong i I just want it to be this way [TS]

01:22:22   initially we're going to have a [TS]

01:22:23   three-person call we may as well do it [TS]

01:22:26   by video mm-hmm everyone gets to see the [TS]

01:22:28   nice blue wall behind me you know the [TS]

01:22:30   backdrop oh it's the thrice is gonna be [TS]

01:22:31   a mega office it's gonna be at mega [TS]

01:22:33   office you know it's a serious business [TS]

01:22:35   I don't know I don't know why it would [TS]

01:22:37   be any other place of course of course [TS]

01:22:39   it's been interesting trying to work out [TS]

01:22:41   the questions I mean are you gonna ask [TS]

01:22:43   like Google style brain Jesus how many [TS]

01:22:47   manhole covers are there in New York [TS]

01:22:49   City yeah it's like oh you have a bag of [TS]

01:22:51   grain and a fox and a duck on the shore [TS]

01:22:54   and you're trying to cross the river but [TS]

01:22:56   you can only take one thing at a time [TS]

01:22:57   what order do you do it is that what [TS]

01:22:59   you're gonna ask people yes just it's [TS]

01:23:00   just brain teasers I really want to [TS]

01:23:03   establish the idea that the Riddler [TS]

01:23:05   could be working with them at any moment [TS]

01:23:07   you know yeah right no it is purely I've [TS]

01:23:11   looked at like I've googled like [TS]

01:23:12   interview questions right just to give [TS]

01:23:15   like yet like an idea like what are the [TS]

01:23:17   standards because I think there are [TS]

01:23:18   reasons why people ask similar questions [TS]

01:23:21   so I've got some of those in there and [TS]

01:23:24   also just as a way to kind of like guide [TS]

01:23:26   my thinking cuz there's a definite [TS]

01:23:28   practice around this whether it works or [TS]

01:23:30   not people have done it for so long [TS]

01:23:32   there must be some benefit to it because [TS]

01:23:34   honestly like interviews all of this [TS]

01:23:37   stuff is so weird because you just get [TS]

01:23:39   these small slices of a person but then [TS]

01:23:41   you start working with them every day [TS]

01:23:43   mmm right and then you find out who they [TS]

01:23:45   are but I figure I may as well try and [TS]

01:23:48   follow at least some of the process that [TS]

01:23:50   I've done before that i knows worked [TS]

01:23:51   right which is resumes phone interview [TS]

01:23:56   right or resumes and a face-to-face [TS]

01:23:58   interview you know that kind of thing [TS]

01:24:00   and what I expect will happen is we'll [TS]

01:24:03   go through all of this and there will be [TS]

01:24:04   more than one person that sticks out and [TS]

01:24:06   then we'll baby do like a second like [TS]

01:24:09   phone call just to go through some other [TS]

01:24:10   little parts that may pop up because [TS]

01:24:11   what I also know is the questions I [TS]

01:24:14   asking interview one will be different [TS]

01:24:16   to the questions that I ask an interview [TS]

01:24:18   x-rite like a few interviews down the [TS]

01:24:21   line so there may be some like extra [TS]

01:24:23   crash [TS]

01:24:24   don't want to ask certain people to see [TS]

01:24:25   what they're like you know because it's [TS]

01:24:28   definitely going to be an evolving [TS]

01:24:29   process as it goes over those couple of [TS]

01:24:31   days like I do not expect the questions [TS]

01:24:33   to remain exactly the same because [TS]

01:24:35   someone will say something which will [TS]

01:24:36   spark a question which all that might [TS]

01:24:38   have been good to ask they have a person [TS]

01:24:39   you know mm-hmm but trying to work out [TS]

01:24:42   like how to understand if I can work [TS]

01:24:45   well with someone based upon some [TS]

01:24:46   questions that I'm thinking about in [TS]

01:24:47   advance is very difficult yeah I mean [TS]

01:24:51   this I've never done this kind of thing [TS]

01:24:55   but I imagine you must know that the [TS]

01:24:58   questions are a framework to get a sense [TS]

01:25:01   of how well you can work together right [TS]

01:25:04   is it that the answer is matter but they [TS]

01:25:08   matter maybe thirty percent yeah and [TS]

01:25:10   it's it's more the way the person is [TS]

01:25:12   explaining themselves I I'm imagining [TS]

01:25:15   that that's probably what it's like to [TS]

01:25:17   do to do these kinds of things it is the [TS]

01:25:21   quits it's like the resume the content [TS]

01:25:24   of the resume is not important to me [TS]

01:25:27   it's the way it's being presented to me [TS]

01:25:29   mmm i like how is this person describing [TS]

01:25:32   things so it's like all these questions [TS]

01:25:33   most of the answers they're not really [TS]

01:25:36   that important because most people will [TS]

01:25:38   answer these things the same because [TS]

01:25:40   they think they know what the answer [TS]

01:25:42   should be mmm but it's the way in which [TS]

01:25:44   the person explains what they're [TS]

01:25:45   explaining is why I'm interested in so [TS]

01:25:47   we'll see how I want to talk about when [TS]

01:25:49   I give people tips right this could be [TS]

01:25:50   out there grey listen no you know you [TS]

01:25:53   can't you can't give interview tips the [TS]

01:25:56   answer is number 62 that's what you need [TS]

01:25:59   to tell me that's the code yeah and as [TS]

01:26:02   as always with these things it's also a [TS]

01:26:04   matter of who is your competition as [TS]

01:26:07   well all right like that's that's what's [TS]

01:26:08   going on like on my on my job interviews [TS]

01:26:12   that was the thing that I was the most [TS]

01:26:14   obsessed with was finding out who the [TS]

01:26:16   other applicants were she create like a [TS]

01:26:18   virtual waiting room right you know like [TS]

01:26:20   you you go into a job interview and [TS]

01:26:22   everyone sitting there yeah like that [TS]

01:26:25   you know for this application they won't [TS]

01:26:27   they won't have that advantage but it's [TS]

01:26:28   like yeah I remember I remember one job [TS]

01:26:30   I was just like I was able to see who [TS]

01:26:32   the other applicants were I was like oh [TS]

01:26:34   I've owned this like I know I'm gonna [TS]

01:26:36   win this because the game is about [TS]

01:26:38   being better than these other people not [TS]

01:26:40   necessarily about being the best yeah I [TS]

01:26:42   fooled that once can get the job done [TS]

01:26:45   yeah see I did get the job yeah I know [TS]

01:26:49   how to play the game better than I do no [TS]

01:26:51   you're the you're the corporate master [TS]

01:26:53   here Mike so much of it is like I'm just [TS]

01:26:55   seeing what happens because I don't [TS]

01:26:57   really know what comes after these [TS]

01:26:58   interviews right what do we do next and [TS]

01:27:00   then houses all this start and then [TS]

01:27:02   how'd it miss me in this person start [TS]

01:27:04   working together and when do we start [TS]

01:27:05   working together and what are the hours [TS]

01:27:07   that we work to get it's all good it's [TS]

01:27:08   all so up in the air but now that we're [TS]

01:27:10   really seriously approaching this as [TS]

01:27:12   opposed to it just being this idea that [TS]

01:27:14   I've had it is interesting genuinely [TS]

01:27:17   exciting and quite a challenge yeah I [TS]

01:27:21   have to say I'm really glad that you've [TS]

01:27:22   started this like this is a thing that [TS]

01:27:24   we have had private conversations about [TS]

01:27:26   for a long time yeah horse like you need [TS]

01:27:29   to get someone to help you but error [TS]

01:27:31   there is a time at which you can do it [TS]

01:27:34   yeah and it's like the economics have to [TS]

01:27:36   make sense and also for me I needed the [TS]

01:27:38   moment of like I can't do this anymore [TS]

01:27:41   like this is too much if I don't get [TS]

01:27:46   someone to help me things won't work as [TS]

01:27:48   well right like that for me at least [TS]

01:27:49   that needed to happen I think that needs [TS]

01:27:51   to happen for everybody you know cuz [TS]

01:27:53   then you also get a clearer idea of what [TS]

01:27:55   you actually need someone to do yeah it [TS]

01:27:58   seems like nobody hires someone right at [TS]

01:28:01   the moment when it would be best to hire [TS]

01:28:02   that person right you hire a retroactive [TS]

01:28:05   exactly every every hiring that's ever [TS]

01:28:08   made is made at least six months later [TS]

01:28:10   than it should have been made yeah [TS]

01:28:12   that's that's I think that's just [TS]

01:28:14   natural that's a natural part of it and [TS]

01:28:17   I have it's like anybody who's listening [TS]

01:28:19   to us right now if you're even thinking [TS]

01:28:20   maybe I need to hire some was like yes [TS]

01:28:22   the answer is yes the answer is it's too [TS]

01:28:25   late for you so yeah no one no one no [TS]

01:28:29   one does it at the right time I think so [TS]

01:28:32   maybe gray actually I think very [TS]

01:28:34   strongly by the next time we talk I will [TS]

01:28:37   have higher than a system very exciting [TS]

01:28:40   good luck to the assistant if they [TS]

01:28:42   happen to be listening [TS]