337b: ...But Too Much
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the Intolerable episode 338 7777 buddy
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this is a bonus edition of the
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incomparable I like to have our episodes
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not be two and a half hours long and
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sometimes that means i cut things out of
◼
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episodes because you know me
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you've got time that you want to spend
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on other things and two-and-a-half hour
◼
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long podcast is too long i think in most
◼
►
cases but you know I don't want to judge
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some people love as much as they can get
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of anything we talked about and in this
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case we talk about black mirror that was
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what happened episode 337 and this is a
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sub episode to that because basically we
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talked for so long about every single
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black mirror episode that it wasn't
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gonna fit so instead what we did myself
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John siracusa David lure brian hamilton
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our conversation about black mirror the
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eight episodes that we didn't like as
◼
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much as the five that we loved is going
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to be put in this appendix episode so if
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you want to hear us talk about more
◼
►
episodes of black mirror here it is
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I will warn you if we haven't talked
◼
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about your favorite episode yet in the
◼
►
main show it means we didn't like it as
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much as the other five so be prepared if
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you're a big fan of white bear you're
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going to be disappointed with what we
◼
►
think of it but hey it's fun
◼
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everybody gets to have their own opinion
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thank you for listening to be
◼
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uncomfortable and enjoy the rest of
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black mirror the national anthem was
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episode 1 of series 1 a black mirror
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this famously is the episode that
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involves basically tech a day an
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anarchist blackmails the there
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the Prime Minister of England into
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having sex with a pig on us on live TV
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or he'll kill a princess and this got
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the news when it was reported last year
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that the prime minister of bread
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David Cameron was a in a secret society
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in college that apparently had an
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initiation ritual slightly related to
◼
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the plot of this purpose would but the
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idea here is that you know using using
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modern media techniques they escalate
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the pressure on the prime minister to do
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a egg to commit an unspeakable act in
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public and and shame himself and there's
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this question of like what can they do
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and will you will you give in to the
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demands of this terrorist or anarchist
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or will you not what people think very
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grimy episode made me feel gross
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watching it I if it was so sort of such
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a grim view of everything involved it
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just set the tone for the series and
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submit one of the things that maybe not
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come back to her for a long time was
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like yeah I see what they're doing there
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that's fine like this theme for me for a
◼
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lot of black mirror is I feel like
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everybody's seen it before or already
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know what they're gonna tell me and have
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learned this lesson and don't need to
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learn it again and it's not you know you
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mentioned in this lack earlier the like
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maybe you've seen too much sci-fi now I
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think it's like most adults who are even
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remotely enter the sort of you know this
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kind of genre fiction have seen these
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things before and the national anthem
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was like you've seen this before
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we'll make it a little bit more grimy
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and gross and and have it be ripped from
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the headlines and I was just not
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didn't watch it have too many problems
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with the premises ok David yeah I'm
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pretty much with john i saw it years and
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years ago and kinda went yeah okay you
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want to be read certainly but you need
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to be a better writer and then the whole
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David Cameron thinking about you go
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mmm he knows something but it's you know
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►
I've enjoyed charlie brooker before this
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has a comedian and a panel show host on
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BBC radio and he goes to an acid black
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show called so wrong it's right which is
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about horrible horrible stories so it
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made sense when it was like oh this is
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charlie brooker writing fiction but
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then-then isn't fiction
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yeah it's not as much friction as we
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thought I didn't I think this one is
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fine myself I i literally I have it in
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the eye I put them all in order and this
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is literally in the middle it is it
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isn't number 713 on my list and I have
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it as I i divided my black mirror
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episodes into three camps which is I
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I I appreciate it but I have some real
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problems with it and I hate it and this
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is this leads the i appreciated but I
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have some real problems that it's dark
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there parts of that I don't like but
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what I did like about it is that it
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takes its premise and and this is true
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for a lot of black mare episodes it
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takes its premise and it explores it
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I feel like it explores the
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ramifications of what this is to an
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extreme like every little bit of it and
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i actually like the way this one ends
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because it ends darkly but also with a
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an optimism about the public that it
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turns out is not present in almost any
◼
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other episode where Prime Minister goes
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through with this the the princess is
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released and we view you know down the
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road a little bit there's a flat they're
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sort of a time gap and that he is a he
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still prime minister and he's still
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popular but his wife despises him
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basically so that's that's a little dark
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twist but i thought wow they didn't you
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know show him like as a as a
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a drunk in an alleyway drinking out of a
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bottle and a paper bag like thick that
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it could have been darker and it turns
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out every other episode is pretty much
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darker than than that but but i did i
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did like that and and and what it says
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about like the political calculations
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and and being in public and and if
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somebody makes an outrageous demand your
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you're a public figure I just I mean
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that basic premise of what if this
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happened what would what would the
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result be and it moves through every
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step along the way I like that about it
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but it's not someone that I think I
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would want to revisit ever
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it's okay Brian you don't need to watch
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that 1i have so many opinions about that
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i'm not going to say anything because I
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have not watched it all right subtree I
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I just I don't know get outdated get uh
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yeah us in him so let's move on to the
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second episode of the first series which
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was called 15 million merits this is an
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episode about people this this is like
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the far future dystopia episode in a way
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which is there are people and all they
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do all day is like right exercise bikes
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in order to generate power and they get
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they get you know electronic currency
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that they can use to buy things and the
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only way out of this you know bicycling
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job of theirs is to become a contestant
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on a reality talent show
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so you know it's kind of a broad premise
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and we meet a we meet a nice young man
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named being who who is a who overhears a
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woman singing and thinks that she could
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try out for the reality singing show and
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cleanser his or gives her his his
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credits that he inherited and she wins
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on the show in a terrible way where they
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decide that they don't want her to be a
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singer they wanted to be a porn star and
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it's either that or back to the bicycle
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and so she accepts and then he is sort
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of destroyed by watching this happen
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saves up to be on the talent show
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himself decides to tell them all off
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threatens to kill himself
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and of course in the in the dark twist
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they appreciate his threatening to get
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killed himself while ranting about how
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unfair the world is and hire him to do
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that same thing every week on television
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►
that's a 15 million merits Brian would
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►
you think about this one
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you know honestly despite all the fat
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►
phobia ableism and terrible treatment of
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women i still have this episode you know
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the fact that the fat phobia is part of
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the satire though i would argue in this
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one I think that that is I think that I
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that's how I read that one is that that
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is that is not we're not supposed to be
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laughing at that that is part of the
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horrible world that they live in that
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there's like initially awful character
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that's in there yeah i agree but at the
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same time the fact that they're putting
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all the stuff into the show and the fact
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that it ends with this weird commentary
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about you know consumerism and the whole
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suicide thing what bothers me the most
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is that I don't think that was worth all
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the other terrible stuff that happened
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to me episode that ending and that
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character was not worth us having to
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watch the terrible things happen
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well David step back and look at any of
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it oh I i I've got like eight windows
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open here because i'm running a podcast
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►
I don't have time to chat sorry I'm back
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I'm back every no idea what you've said
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all right three minutes John so this
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this episode I had some hope for the
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show after like all going to come back
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to the show up the first terrible
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episode and like all right there's some
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interesting premise here I thought a
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little bit looked a little bit low
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budget like with the exercise bikes and
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little room there in heaven they had
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some interesting ideas but the problem
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was is it was like let's put a bunch of
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humans few of which have like our
◼
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current modern-day sensibilities in an
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absurdly awful situation that is
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unexplained and that they're that every
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every human in this people on the bikes
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the people sweeping up behind them the
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judges are on the the reality show the
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audience on the reality show the stars
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holiday show every single one of those
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people isn't in a miserable situation
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for unexplained reasons and I they move
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from one miserable situation for
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unexplained reasons to another measure
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and all the medical situations like oh
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you have to open your eyes and watch ads
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oh you the only way out of this grind of
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exercise bike is going to reality show
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oh you are a terrible person in the
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audience laughing at people and being
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cruel all your star of the show and
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you're you're alone and you have your
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glass shard in a little case and
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everything every one of those people
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why are they miserable who is making
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them miserable is this a misery of their
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own created like me there is no
◼
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explanation in their miserable in
◼
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different ways and it's like so the
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►
lesson is you're always going to be
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miserable in that no matter what because
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the writers are going to make every
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single facet of this new reality
◼
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miserable for reasons that you won't
◼
►
explain it was just the whole show felt
◼
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miserable despite the fact that I think
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they had concentrated on one or two
◼
►
aspects of it that you could you can
◼
►
have a dystopia but I want there to be
◼
►
some reason that SOB came to be other is
◼
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just that they felt like they were all
◼
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hemmed in by the writer so and then have
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the greatest one big thumbs down
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David yeah i'm i'm right there with you
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it's it was you you need something and
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and I hate watching things where it's
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literally the writers did this because
◼
►
the writers wanted to do it i have that
◼
►
problem with Sherlock two things happen
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►
because Moffitt and marketers want them
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to happen and this was very much the
◼
►
same way it's it's interesting to look
◼
►
at their there are a lot of interesting
◼
►
ideas but there's just no there's no
◼
►
hook to it there's no point so I this is
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►
this one is in my top half and toward
◼
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the bottom but it's in my top half
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I i like the little opinions I I yeah I
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like it for what it is which is I think
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that the world they yet why is that just
◼
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hope you you know again the matrix
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powering using people as batteries also
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doesn't make any sense i'm going to let
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it i'm going to make sense that
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machine's want to kill humans and make
◼
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sense there is a subjugated and as
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subjugate or but in this episode's just
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why are there coupons but why are there
◼
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people on exercise bikes at it because
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it's a method of control or something
◼
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like that but who's controlling them but
◼
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mr. but purely as purely again purely as
◼
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a as a metaphor i enjoyed the I the
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mechanics of earning the merits and of
◼
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being trying to be generous
◼
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I appreciate the fact that any belief we
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have that this that the work this world
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could be even remotely good or fair is
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ripped away with what happens to a be in
◼
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when she appears onstage I love as a max
◼
►
headroom fan from way back i love the
◼
►
the detail that you can not only can you
◼
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not turn off the TV but you must watch
◼
►
it and it will if you close your eyes it
◼
►
knows and it will let you until you open
◼
►
your eyes and look at what it's showing
◼
►
you which on max headroom make it
◼
►
through like a blanket over the TV they
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always were on but you could cover them
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and in this they know everything about
◼
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you i thought that was a really nice bit
◼
►
that will that will come to stick with
◼
►
me and you know as ridiculous as it is
◼
►
where he threatens to kill himself and
◼
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they and they applauded him and say you
◼
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can do that every week it and it is
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like I said was toward the bottom of my
◼
►
of my top app but I i did like the the
◼
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weird bittersweetness of him basically
◼
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living in a penthouse being able to look
◼
►
at big windows into the outside world
◼
►
and drink fresh orange juice as an
◼
►
example of just how bizarre and an
◼
►
unfair this whole society is and more
◼
►
importantly that his rebellion his act
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►
of rebellion is is completely co-opted
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►
and I I kind of enjoy opted by who
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►
nobody will ever see by the system
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►
manual about the system yet can't
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there's there's not even a hint of the
◼
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system install yy-you sorry it makes me
◼
►
angry because like that is but I don't
◼
►
think our that new but there's a lot of
◼
►
them in there you can make a good show
◼
►
about the have you have to watch ads
◼
►
right you could even make a good show
◼
►
about the reality show and about you can
◼
►
make a good show about the futility of
◼
►
rebellion but surrounding them you need
◼
►
you need a system and some antagonists
◼
►
and a power structure there's no power
◼
►
structure the power structure is writers
◼
►
everybody in the show at the back yeah
◼
►
yeah I mean there's no big brother
◼
►
there's no zig zag corporation there's
◼
►
there's just nothing opposing all of it
◼
►
Charlie Brooker is the ruler of the
◼
►
society let's move on to number three
◼
►
how about that the entire history of you
◼
►
1i have one more thing to say about this
◼
►
episode of Brian go for it
◼
►
contrary to all of that I believe that
◼
►
getting rid of any sort of Big Brother
◼
►
any overarching thing was the most
◼
►
interesting part of this episode to me
◼
►
as much as I hated the episode for all
◼
►
the other reasons including suicide
◼
►
which i completely forgot about earlier
◼
►
i really enjoyed the fact that it was up
◼
►
to me as the audience to populate
◼
►
everything else was happening above the
◼
►
people on the bikes and honestly I
◼
►
thought that they were living
◼
►
underground of our society today and
◼
►
that they were the ones powering some
◼
►
aspect of our society with their bikes
◼
►
which I thought was really interesting
◼
►
and if that's not the show at all that's
◼
►
just something that came to my mind as I
◼
►
was watching trying to make sense of all
◼
►
this which is again later that should
◼
►
not be put on me the audience but I
◼
►
still thought it was interesting that of
◼
►
all the things they chose to show and
◼
►
subject us to that was the one thing
◼
►
they got rid of but when your head Canon
◼
►
is more interesting than the thing
◼
►
you're watching that's a problem with
◼
►
the thing you're watching
◼
►
I don't entirely agree with that just
◼
►
because I don't think it always matters
◼
►
not everything has to flesh out the
◼
►
entire world above it I was ok with in I
◼
►
mean I i get that for some people to it
◼
►
has to be that way but it didn't bother
◼
►
me but it was just too much like i was
◼
►
saying like I i if we'd only seen the
◼
►
people on the bicycle or only senior it
◼
►
like it but they showed us every aspect
◼
►
of everything but there is no unseen
◼
►
part as far as where they showed up so
◼
►
much of the world that that's why i end
◼
►
up with like the big flat world where
◼
►
birds mr. Bowlen just the writers of the
◼
►
top pulling the strings whereas if they
◼
►
had showed less then you then you all
◼
►
you have left is headcanon I'm fine with
◼
►
that like when they're intentionally
◼
►
withholding and it's like we're just
◼
►
going to show you this aspect and you're
◼
►
not going to know what the Bob I just
◼
►
feel like they showed us too much right
◼
►
we don't need to know Big Brother we
◼
►
don't need any detailed big brother but
◼
►
we need to know that there is one
◼
►
yeah I suppose that's true but you mean
◼
►
the judges of the reality show don't run
◼
►
the let me my out because they're
◼
►
they're clearly this is horrible days
◼
►
rebellion idea they are also miserable
◼
►
which is a kind of a nice touch i
◼
►
alright the entire history of you is an
◼
►
episode in which people's everything
◼
►
people see is recorded and accessible so
◼
►
you have perfect memory and it can be
◼
►
played back to other people and the
◼
►
implications of that and i think this is
◼
►
a this is a another good example of
◼
►
taking a taking a premise and then ring
◼
►
a whole bunch of problematic
◼
►
interpersonal and social implications
◼
►
out of perfect replayable memory and it
◼
►
and it involves the dissolution of a
◼
►
marriage so what people what people
◼
►
David of of the first three in the first
◼
►
season this would be my favorite mine
◼
►
yeah well and see you know earlier in
◼
►
slack i said okay i don't know your list
◼
►
but I see the ratios i think i know
◼
►
which ones I think we like the same ones
◼
►
this this is just an interesting story
◼
►
well told and with it with a devastating
◼
►
payoff and it doesn't it doesn't overdo
◼
►
it doesn't belabor it just it's exactly
◼
►
right Dave sorry i was doing tom
◼
►
I think it's very well in terms of
◼
►
structuring the story and the characters
◼
►
and everything but the tech the tech was
◼
►
pretty cool but when it comes down to it
◼
►
this was a crappy person using tech
◼
►
crappily and you can make this story
◼
►
with twitter or text messages or
◼
►
anything right now and I don't know if
◼
►
what the show did again was worth the
◼
►
the emotional turmoil at the characters
◼
►
in the audience were put through because
◼
►
of the fact that the tech was so minimal
◼
►
well the world part but because this
◼
►
this is where the show works for me
◼
►
because the tech is important you know
◼
►
you need the tech for the story but the
◼
►
characters are what you're watching and
◼
►
and broker does not always care about
◼
►
the characters he is he's very into the
◼
►
tech in a lot of the shows and this is
◼
►
one where it's all it works for me
◼
►
and unlike some black mare episodes that
◼
►
this in this one the tech exists
◼
►
to bring out an implication of our
◼
►
social interactions and it actually
◼
►
reminded me a little bit of the
◼
►
invention of lying the regular basis
◼
►
movie which is the you know which is a
◼
►
it's got its own problems but the same
◼
►
idea is here because the entire history
◼
►
of you is about how there are if you can
◼
►
see everything that happened and
◼
►
remember everything that happened
◼
►
it's not necessarily a good thing in
◼
►
fact we lie and omit and miss remember
◼
►
and forget and it's one of the things
◼
►
that allows society and personal
◼
►
relationships to function and that if
◼
►
your idealistic and say no if everybody
◼
►
told the truth or if everything that you
◼
►
ever did could be checked that the world
◼
►
would be a better place and this is
◼
►
broker saying really what it and I
◼
►
appreciated that about it to that it
◼
►
that is that's what ultimately what it's
◼
►
about is what destroys this relationship
◼
►
is I mean yeah it's jealousy and there's
◼
►
some infidelity and all these other
◼
►
things mixed in there but ultimately
◼
►
it's about a lack of trust and the
◼
►
ability to prove or disprove everything
◼
►
in the world and you know I appreciate
◼
►
that about it like the first to have
◼
►
some really good satirical points and
◼
►
and really sharp things to say about the
◼
►
tech or about the politics or reality TV
◼
►
this one is actually a story about
◼
►
people yeah and it's it's something that
◼
►
we could live we can see ourselves going
◼
►
through the story John really isn't that
◼
►
so I am I really complained about that
◼
►
again everything the same except one
◼
►
piece of technology extended out
◼
►
ridiculously and the implications they
◼
►
would come from the existence of that
◼
►
technology totally ignored because if
◼
►
you could do that you could do so many
◼
►
other things but like now we just want
◼
►
to talk about this but i'm willing to
◼
►
mostly forgive that because i like David
◼
►
said this is episode about characters
◼
►
you could have this episode about slow
◼
►
dawning realization of infidelity you
◼
►
can have a sudden 1800 and it would
◼
►
still be good if done well right and the
◼
►
technology angle is what makes us a
◼
►
blackberry episodes like here is here
◼
►
here is that the black mirror twist on
◼
►
it is that at in the way you've seen the
◼
►
story told before with the ways that you
◼
►
can realize infidelity is happening here
◼
►
is a new way to both make a realization
◼
►
about it and obsess over both of which
◼
►
happened in the in regular life and have
◼
►
for millennia like all that stuff
◼
►
happens and when it happens always the
◼
►
people who are doing it are using the
◼
►
tools of the time this is showing us
◼
►
imagine if there was another tool and
◼
►
like Grayson said you know that the
◼
►
implications of being of having more
◼
►
information available this is not that
◼
►
big of an extension from you know
◼
►
Facebook stalking your ex or obsessing
◼
►
over text messages or looking at old
◼
►
pictures I mean just looking at old
◼
►
pictures with the thing that you
◼
►
couldn't do before photography because
◼
►
you're maybe you had an old painting but
◼
►
if you're rich but that's about it right
◼
►
so I you know I i would give this one a
◼
►
pass on the that the sci-fi trap of
◼
►
extending one technology leave
◼
►
everything else the same because I
◼
►
enjoyed watching it for the characters
◼
►
and the story and i think it passes the
◼
►
minimum bar for sci-fi ish anthology
◼
►
show it with a dim view of these
◼
►
particular characters and I also think
◼
►
like this one pulls back a little bit i
◼
►
mean it's I stuff like it's trying to
◼
►
say if we have this tech this is what's
◼
►
gonna happen to everybody and I don't
◼
►
like that but I'm willing to headcanon
◼
►
it back into a narrower story and say
◼
►
this is a story about these characters
◼
►
and it played out so definitely my
◼
►
favorite of the first season
◼
►
head-and-shoulders about who I'm okay
◼
►
I'm okay with it because i think the
◼
►
implication and this is actually the
◼
►
biggest problem i have with it is this
◼
►
is this is also about how this guy
◼
►
is awful I mean it exists driven to it
◼
►
but it's like the tech isn't the reason
◼
►
this happens he's the reason this
◼
►
yeah you feel like the show is blaming
◼
►
attack it's like now no not that I mean
◼
►
he would also be the facebook stalker
◼
►
like Matt this to this so many weekend
◼
►
1800 be waiting outside the tavern for
◼
►
you to leave he can let the fact that
◼
►
that an old boyfriend of his wife is our
◼
►
is there he could let it go entirely and
◼
►
he doesn't and that leads to a spiral
◼
►
that leads to disaster but a more
◼
►
confident emotionally balanced human
◼
►
being would let it go right and it's
◼
►
like the tekkit just enables the spiral
◼
►
but he's the reason why i should mention
◼
►
this is the only episode of black mirror
◼
►
that is not does not contain a charlie
◼
►
brooker writing credit at all it is just
◼
►
the Armstrongs episode so and you guys
◼
►
are really funny i like this the least
◼
►
of three of the first season but I still
◼
►
thought it was fine i think i thought it
◼
►
was fine i thought it was fine I i find
◼
►
i find the last half very difficult to
◼
►
watch and that's what pushed it down the
◼
►
the emotional abuse her know that
◼
►
happens as well as the violence as a man
◼
►
comes completely on board and does a
◼
►
sequence of just parentally awful things
◼
►
i find i found really really difficult
◼
►
to watch and again the expectations that
◼
►
black mirror sets for being a show about
◼
►
tech made the ending fall flat for me
◼
►
because there really wasn't much of that
◼
►
and as so often happens on the
◼
►
incomparable this discussion is really
◼
►
making me want to go back and re-watch
◼
►
it as a character drama with tech any
◼
►
and not a text story with some drama in
◼
►
it what stood out to me the most about
◼
►
this episode was when they're having sex
◼
►
while playing back memories of better
◼
►
sex and that was the one that really hit
◼
►
music oh ok thats that's where the shows
◼
►
going to go now okay and that turned me
◼
►
off from the rest of the show if i can
◼
►
remove that from my mind and re-watch it
◼
►
with this new lens of this is a better
◼
►
written drama that's not run by Charlie
◼
►
Booker i'll give it another shot once
◼
►
i'm a little bit more emotionally stable
◼
►
after the sponge hashtag premier to and
◼
►
and the and the amazing thing about that
◼
►
those you know how many times has that
◼
►
happened where you do start replaying in
◼
►
this can literally replay it for you in
◼
►
perfect detail and it adds forever and
◼
►
is yeah okay let's talk about white bear
◼
►
so in white bear a woman wakes up and
◼
►
doesn't remember who she is and goes
◼
►
outside and there are a bunch of people
◼
►
just standing around looking at their
◼
►
phones and watching and recording her
◼
►
and people try to kill her and she runs
◼
►
around and people try to kill her some
◼
►
more and she runs around and lady says
◼
►
we need to go to the transmitter because
◼
►
that will stop people trying to kill us
◼
►
and they take her there and it's
◼
►
revealed that the transmitter is
◼
►
actually the stage of a kind of reality
◼
►
TV said would be where they're uh
◼
►
they're doing a show about punishing
◼
►
murderers by having them feel the fear
◼
►
that their victims had and that she
◼
►
actually with her boyfriend or husband
◼
►
or whoever cat kidnapped a little girl
◼
►
and he killed her and so she now is
◼
►
sentenced to relive this day over and
◼
►
over again that's white bear i have
◼
►
opinions about this but I want to hear
◼
►
Ryan this had the potential to be my
◼
►
favorite black mirror episode because my
◼
►
history with the show was I watched 15
◼
►
million merits first stopped watching
◼
►
and then once everyone started talking
◼
►
about San junipero i decide to jump back
◼
►
in and started with white bear which was
◼
►
one that somebody recommended to me and
◼
►
it has potential to be my favorite
◼
►
because I really thought that the show
◼
►
needed some kind of intensity without
◼
►
emotional abuse and i'm really into
◼
►
horror movies i'm really into this kind
◼
►
of it seemed post-apocalyptic almost up
◼
►
through the very end and it was
◼
►
well-made well-acted well everything
◼
►
like we already said about the entire
◼
►
series but then the ending the ending
◼
►
just threw everything that I loved about
◼
►
that episode away and restored faith in
◼
►
the fact that blackberry is not a show
◼
►
for me there are some episodes a black
◼
►
mirror where the big reveal is that
◼
►
everybody that we've sort of been
◼
►
going for is terrible and they deserve
◼
►
everything that you've seen them get and
◼
►
you shouldn't feel bad for them and i
◼
►
find this kind of a frustrating and
◼
►
questionable decision but it's one that
◼
►
they keep making so i guess they think
◼
►
it's really great to do that so in this
◼
►
case you know this woman who seems like
◼
►
the victim is revealed to have been a an
◼
►
accomplice in the kidnapping and murder
◼
►
of a little girl and so we you know
◼
►
wherever we're witnessing her you know
◼
►
torture as justice essentially yeah John
◼
►
Charlie introduction so black mirror it
◼
►
is like a collection of things you
◼
►
shouldn't do I stories and so this isn't
◼
►
this episode is of the the genre where
◼
►
I'm going to make a story sci-fi story
◼
►
or any start really what happens live on
◼
►
syfy where I'm going to pretend the
◼
►
human nature has changed so radically
◼
►
that the entire world is entirely on
◼
►
board with the repeated incredibly cruel
◼
►
torture of this admitted you know killer
◼
►
our accomplice to murder or whatever and
◼
►
they're cheery about it and they bring
◼
►
their kids and isn't that super dark and
◼
►
terrible and it's like that's not what
◼
►
human beings are like I you like that is
◼
►
a ridiculous premise especially when its
◼
►
unsupported just be the surrounding
◼
►
hellscape you know Carrie pig's blood
◼
►
someone who turns out to be a murderer
◼
►
like all those people like it there
◼
►
there there and filming and they're so
◼
►
like there's not enough psychos in the
◼
►
world to fill those slots in that thing
◼
►
and the idea that it is a happy
◼
►
important part of a functioning Society
◼
►
yeah it only exists to further heighten
◼
►
the you know the the horror of like I
◼
►
can't imagine if I was in that situation
◼
►
and then as Jason said the final thing
◼
►
which i think is probably not a unique
◼
►
black mera twist a signature move of
◼
►
saying well guess what that person was
◼
►
terrible too so so you have fake people
◼
►
who act like humans would never act for
◼
►
inexplicable reasons and your heroes
◼
►
terrible to the end and was screaming
◼
►
yeah what if black mirror but even but
◼
►
uh yeah this is this is a dub almost I
◼
►
don't know its worst are tied for worst
◼
►
I i hated this I let me use the way
◼
►
I despise this episode for lots of
◼
►
um you know I despise this episode the
◼
►
ok the yeah i mean first off it it feels
◼
►
so artificial throughout I mean I get
◼
►
that it is kinetic there's a lot of
◼
►
action there's car chases and gunfire
◼
►
and people running in a showdown at a
◼
►
convenience store and all those things
◼
►
and it's super creepy because it's like
◼
►
as again post-apocalyptic is everybody's
◼
►
sort of had their mind taken over by
◼
►
this thing this beaming out that's
◼
►
making them be like zombies and watching
◼
►
or try to kill this lady that but i
◼
►
found it unpleasant to watch and I
◼
►
didn't really enjoy any but it seems
◼
►
sick it is brian i don't like horror
◼
►
movies so i can say no you i can see
◼
►
that right cuz I don't like horror
◼
►
movies is it just felt like that and
◼
►
perhaps a competent one so I disliked it
◼
►
already and then we get to the we get to
◼
►
the twist which one first off I felt was
◼
►
completely ridiculous and I and didn't
◼
►
help my opinion of it that now what we
◼
►
were actually watching is this
◼
►
ridiculous kind of reality show the only
◼
►
thing in this entire episode that i
◼
►
actually liked was over the end credits
◼
►
where it's like a production documentary
◼
►
of how they make the White Bear the
◼
►
trunk atrocity this is the White Bear
◼
►
reality show that that made me laugh
◼
►
because they're it's all of the
◼
►
trappings of a TV shows electronic press
◼
►
kit applied to this horrible thing and
◼
►
that made me that made me chuckle
◼
►
because that's not the only episode of
◼
►
black mirror where I felt like this
◼
►
little tidbit at the end should have
◼
►
been the whole episode because that
◼
►
would have been more cutting and instead
◼
►
you know instead this feels like like
◼
►
some movies that I've disliked over the
◼
►
years trying to have their cake and eat
◼
►
it too which is where really commenting
◼
►
on this by doing the exact same thing
◼
►
like now I don't think you get to do
◼
►
both of those things so yeah I hated and
◼
►
then was just so completely nullifies
◼
►
the rest of the show because the only
◼
►
thing of substance in the rest of the
◼
►
show is build up to a twist at once you
◼
►
know what it is that makes the rest of
◼
►
the episode you said this is all fake
◼
►
right it's all fake out so what you saw
◼
►
was a fake you you're seeing a show of a
◼
►
show that's fake there are really no
◼
►
steaks what you're seeing is this woman
◼
►
get terrified and you know did we really
◼
►
i mean the only reason I related to her
◼
►
is because she was in the opening scene
◼
►
and we followed the camera followed her
◼
►
but it's not like i emotionally
◼
►
connected with her and then was shocked
◼
►
when she was revealed to be a murderer
◼
►
that didn't really happen i'm just
◼
►
following her she runs right yeah if if
◼
►
that in sequence had been the whole show
◼
►
then you get to have a an hour of of
◼
►
sharp cutting satire about justice
◼
►
reality shows people's blood lust you
◼
►
instead you just have this little tiny
◼
►
snippet that you go well and you never
◼
►
want to see the rest of the episode
◼
►
again because what's the point good
◼
►
excuse for action sequences though which
◼
►
yeah yeah I'd like when it was started
◼
►
when and that's the other thing the
◼
►
episode was very easy to write the
◼
►
ending was very tricky if that had been
◼
►
the show it would have been trickier to
◼
►
write but it would've been so much
◼
►
better and wouldn't have been lazy
◼
►
yeah well I'm starting to realize about
◼
►
what I hate about black mirror is in
◼
►
white bear and 15 million merits
◼
►
especially the idea of public shaming
◼
►
and this kind of disbelief in the public
◼
►
to be any good and especially moments
◼
►
where the public is you know gasps
◼
►
lighted and convinced into believing
◼
►
something by a larger organization
◼
►
and we are put through the consequences
◼
►
of that by seeing characters that we've
◼
►
started to know and love put through
◼
►
terrible things not just you know being
◼
►
put through terrible things but in front
◼
►
of a crowd cheering them on doing like
◼
►
amplifying everything it's every single
◼
►
pantsless giving a speech dream you've
◼
►
had on TV multiple times which is weird
◼
►
although i will point out one out there
◼
►
is also an episode that i love that will
◼
►
get to a black mirror that seems to take
◼
►
the opposite tack which i find
◼
►
interesting that it isn't arguing with
◼
►
itself i don't know we'll get there
◼
►
next is the waldo moment which has been
◼
►
uh talked about a lot lately because I
◼
►
wonder why it is about a puppet the
◼
►
puppet nobody know but it is about a pre
◼
►
atv kind of cgi animated like live on
◼
►
the fly again a little like Max Headroom
◼
►
actually although not really he was kind
◼
►
of faked out but the idea of Max
◼
►
Headroom which is it's a comedian is
◼
►
working some equipment and creating this
◼
►
computer-generated bear who appears on
◼
►
TV and he runs four runs for a stands
◼
►
for a by-election for the UK Parliament
◼
►
is what happens and against the Tory and
◼
►
and labor candidates and the enters the
◼
►
debate and appears in a debate after
◼
►
harassing the the it's a safe seat for
◼
►
the Tories so here asses Tobias Menzies
◼
►
who I enjoy in lots of things and he's
◼
►
the inventory candidate and miss mr.
◼
►
Monroe and and in the end it becomes a
◼
►
viral sensation and Waldo the bear
◼
►
becomes more and more popular and
◼
►
meanwhile there's also a little side
◼
►
plot where the CIA comes to them and
◼
►
says this would be great to help us
◼
►
overthrow other countries that's just in
◼
►
no that's the that's the Walter moment i
◼
►
miss now mrs. now pay attention to me
◼
►
I've opinions yes yes mr. Monroe the
◼
►
fact that this episode is the one that
◼
►
is least talked about right now
◼
►
mmhmm yeah David I like bears
◼
►
I'm just you know I like bears
◼
►
uh-huh do you like waldo yeah yeah I
◼
►
like a better than Trump John this one
◼
►
on the suffers from a problem not
◼
►
related to sci-fi which is the studio 60
◼
►
on the Sunset Strip problem where did
◼
►
it's a show ostensibly about a comedy
◼
►
show but the comedy show is never funny
◼
►
so I see what this episode was going for
◼
►
but waldo was dumb and not convincing
◼
►
and so it undercuts I mean it's hard to
◼
►
do it i granted it's hard to do and so I
◼
►
think I kind of see what they were going
◼
►
for and in what they wanted to say i
◼
►
mean this this is this is not a trap but
◼
►
this is just what is doing that sort of
◼
►
moralizing like don't read on the public
◼
►
is and how they can easily be swayed but
◼
►
it's you know but it's sadly true but i
◼
►
think this was a not great execution of
◼
►
that ideas at waldos not that
◼
►
the satire could have been more cutting
◼
►
if it was like the angle the fact that
◼
►
he cg and virtual is a person behind him
◼
►
is not particularly interesting doesn't
◼
►
add much but it's like it's the
◼
►
obligatory sci-fi thing so I'd this this
◼
►
episode i really like it but I certainly
◼
►
didn't hate it so just kind of sits
◼
►
there i put in the middle and about the
◼
►
fact that but again it was the easiest
◼
►
way of doing this story and so it was
◼
►
like well alright now do something give
◼
►
me twist you can you pick anything
◼
►
Brian what i will say is that unlike
◼
►
john i did like the fact that there was
◼
►
a person behind Waldo in that his ark as
◼
►
somebody who created this character and
◼
►
then ending up somewhere where the
◼
►
character completely outgrew him and
◼
►
he's abandoned and drinking alone in the
◼
►
middle of some country that's
◼
►
unspecified I like that a lot
◼
►
even though all the political commentary
◼
►
was happening in the background again I
◼
►
think like me shines the best when the
◼
►
characters are front and center and
◼
►
everything else happening around them
◼
►
and I feel like this is the perfect
◼
►
relationship between Waldo and his
◼
►
creator but you could have the same
◼
►
story without the the puppet
◼
►
did like he creates the character but
◼
►
like plays himself which i think would
◼
►
be more accurate to politicians and
◼
►
eventually the character of gross him
◼
►
the problem is that he still trapped in
◼
►
the character because of the same person
◼
►
the fact that this was a CG thing that
◼
►
could be taken over by another person
◼
►
again is the sci-fi angle and like
◼
►
you've made this creation but it's not
◼
►
really you like I see where they're
◼
►
going with that but it like that there
◼
►
are better ways to tell the same story
◼
►
that's been told it's been told better
◼
►
and in other contexts the into twist in
◼
►
the wall darkness doesn't add to it for
◼
►
me I like the I like the fact that it's
◼
►
a virtual character and I mean they're
◼
►
trying to say something about sort of
◼
►
viral videos and we've got every in a
◼
►
late-night talk show host is trying to
◼
►
generate viral videos and here's a
◼
►
character who who kind of goes viral
◼
►
accidentally but it squandered and I
◼
►
have this in my it's this at the bottom
◼
►
of my kind of mid rank of sort of like
◼
►
you know it i like things about it but
◼
►
it could have been way better like I
◼
►
think the scene where this comedian who
◼
►
kinda hates this character and is really
◼
►
reluctant to push it and really
◼
►
reluctant to be he feels he doesn't want
◼
►
to talk about politics right he just
◼
►
wants to tell his jokes and he meets
◼
►
well he does more than meet the Labour
◼
►
candidate when Paris right and he meets
◼
►
her in a in a in a bar and they chat and
◼
►
they go back to his room so I I feel
◼
►
like that that their interaction was
◼
►
really interesting and the idea that she
◼
►
is running for a seat that she can't win
◼
►
and the dynamics of that in terms of
◼
►
politics at and that you know mr.
◼
►
Munro's got in the bag and that's what I
◼
►
really wish the episode had been about I
◼
►
really wish the episode had spent more
◼
►
time with that dynamic like what if you
◼
►
know could although win could Waldo
◼
►
sabotage mr. Munro's so that the Labour
◼
►
candidate who maybe you know if she had
◼
►
more beliefs which she doesn't and I
◼
►
think that's kind of the the cynical
◼
►
view of politics is probably accurate
◼
►
that dead charlie brooker has I just
◼
►
felt like I kinda wanted more of the
◼
►
political stuff i was really surprised
◼
►
point is there a thread about how it
◼
►
comes out that the voice of waldo has
◼
►
been romantically engaged with the
◼
►
Labour candidate and that maybe this is
◼
►
all just trying to sabotage Monroe I
◼
►
figured that would be a plotline never
◼
►
happens and in or is it threatened nor
◼
►
does anybody threaten it which just
◼
►
seemed kind of completely unrealistic to
◼
►
me on top of anything else so it's like
◼
►
and the CIA stuff is like from another
◼
►
movie it's like from a from an extremely
◼
►
hot rod kind of you know I don't know
◼
►
men in black kind of movie it's just
◼
►
completely out of left field so I feel
◼
►
like there was a really brilliant
◼
►
episode that might have been made using
◼
►
all of these component parts except for
◼
►
the CIA guy and then make it
◼
►
well it's like an episode of chopped
◼
►
about with TV show elements
◼
►
ok sure we move on we just gave a big
◼
►
net to the wall the moment
◼
►
so speaking of trying to kill people
◼
►
play test is next this is a an episode
◼
►
in which an American backpacker who
◼
►
travels around the world decides to sign
◼
►
up for an NDA of a new augmented reality
◼
►
game where they put an implant in your
◼
►
brain and you see things that aren't
◼
►
there and then he plays the game which
◼
►
is a way to do lots of jump-scares that
◼
►
are commented on but still are again we
◼
►
comment on the tropes but we still use
◼
►
the tropes and it goes horribly wrong or
◼
►
does it or it does or does it or it does
◼
►
this inferior was so much this this is
◼
►
one that could have been 22 minutes and
◼
►
done you just have to give the the title
◼
►
and a one-sentence promising like I've
◼
►
seen that before yeah yeah yeahs this
◼
►
this was I mean I this is where
◼
►
commander Riker keeps waking up in
◼
►
different reality right it is same place
◼
►
I think we've even seen it with video
◼
►
game yeah the whole idea I'm but it's a
◼
►
video game but but it goes too far like
◼
►
in the video game becomes real and you
◼
►
thought it was just a game but now there
◼
►
are actual steaks and it turns out you
◼
►
die and then the company on too far no
◼
►
one will be seated dying the game you
◼
►
die in real life no one will be saved
◼
►
during the 2-minute long whack-a-mole
◼
►
seen there is a welcome Elaine when when
◼
►
when his phone rang early on and I went
◼
►
that's an interesting detail that's
◼
►
check on mom not we asked them right and
◼
►
not a single show know when when it
◼
►
played out exactly the way I thought
◼
►
from that point on and and so my
◼
►
fifteen-year-old watch this with me and
◼
►
he said you guys are talking about this
◼
►
show are they all this stupid oh my god
◼
►
no they're not all dlc this is literally
◼
►
the morning so these are brand-new
◼
►
stupid this is the worst episode where I
◼
►
think this is it that I don't think it
◼
►
is here so I don't think this is the
◼
►
worst one because it promises a again
◼
►
it's got the technology would have
◼
►
amazing implications that are not
◼
►
reviewable whatever it this game company
◼
►
has a goal to make a game and you know
◼
►
this charismatic leader who wanted to do
◼
►
this thing and it's super dangerous and
◼
►
they are evil and evil company that is
◼
►
suffering people in to these tests on
◼
►
that are dangerous and cause them to die
◼
►
but you don't that it's not like and
◼
►
all humans like that now you like this
◼
►
company is like that right that's an
◼
►
evil corporation is the antagonist and
◼
►
the protagonist or whatever is a poor
◼
►
person gets sucked into it i think it is
◼
►
far less grimy and cynical and stupid
◼
►
and over reaching the other episodes it
◼
►
is straight down the middle
◼
►
exactly what it's going to be it never
◼
►
surprises you it is pretty boring and
◼
►
that's why i hate it i can't put it on
◼
►
the bottom is it doesn't make me like
◼
►
that angry and it's like well yeah I'd
◼
►
say it's lack of ambition is why i hate
◼
►
it i I think it's just garbage i think
◼
►
it I think it is everything that black
◼
►
mirror should be satirizing which is
◼
►
yes it's just kinda it's obvious and
◼
►
it's garbage and and you know I i
◼
►
thought this was in the bottom couple of
◼
►
episodes for me and then there's the
◼
►
final twist which i have now read in a
◼
►
couple different places was added
◼
►
because the director thought it would be
◼
►
cool to add yet another twist twist
◼
►
where he wakes up an extra time and it
◼
►
turns out that he's dying because his
◼
►
mom is calling and that was not
◼
►
originally in the script originally in
◼
►
the script is going to go through all
◼
►
the horror and then he was going to wake
◼
►
up and it turns out that was it and he
◼
►
was he was done with his test and
◼
►
they're like no no we can put in extra
◼
►
twist like well okay I kind of hated
◼
►
that too but um you know it was before
◼
►
it was like he goes back in his mom is a
◼
►
is the reason his mom's been calling is
◼
►
that she's got Alzheimer's basically and
◼
►
she's very confused and doesn't
◼
►
recognize him and he's been running away
◼
►
from this the whole time and you realize
◼
►
that you know I thought that was it
◼
►
ok ending and the other end try to do a
◼
►
little bit of character building for
◼
►
this character whose is death marking
◼
►
late great line starting late
◼
►
yeah and also black mare really likes
◼
►
this is the the sci-fi trope of that
◼
►
time is different for fast computers
◼
►
the sweet dreams things like seconds
◼
►
right and they did it they did it with
◼
►
that with the Christmas 12 and it's like
◼
►
I like that idea it's done inside for a
◼
►
lot and I think I like stories that are
◼
►
built around that but they just sprinkle
◼
►
it on is like some you know it's
◼
►
officially missing dash on top drilling
◼
►
I missed you know this this baloney
◼
►
sandwich an episode like I think
◼
►
and speaking of amazing stories like
◼
►
amazing stories had a lot of straight up
◼
►
the middle ones too but they were so
◼
►
sort of innocent like the ud and forgive
◼
►
their naiveté but this doesn't fit
◼
►
enjoying don't don't don't make me ruin
◼
►
your childhood by telling you how bad
◼
►
amazing stories family was right now I
◼
►
don't get right yeah but like it's not
◼
►
forgiven for being like a kid's show and
◼
►
this is like it was not a kids show and
◼
►
it is supposed to be a horror game and
◼
►
it's part of black mirror yeah yeah we
◼
►
need to serve in retaliation for real
◼
►
genius again 22 minutes
◼
►
you wouldn't notice it would be fine
◼
►
help at 50 well but at 54 you notice the
◼
►
12 twist at the end rewrite minutes we
◼
►
absolutely absolutely it would still be
◼
►
a bad episode but at 22 minutes you
◼
►
don't have that whole long protracted
◼
►
travel montage and the date
◼
►
yeah yeah and then I don't like the day
◼
►
I come on like tuesday better than
◼
►
anything in the actual plot
◼
►
yeah yeah yeah i forgot I was even in
◼
►
there was like a regular yeah just move
◼
►
well yeah you've got like that vaguely
◼
►
interesting idea that is done as simply
◼
►
and conventionally as possible
◼
►
where is if you have a story better game
◼
►
manufacturer trying to come up with a
◼
►
game that will literally scare you to
◼
►
death without killing you and then how
◼
►
do they do that how do they walk up to
◼
►
that edge there's an interesting idea
◼
►
this is not it no this is a you know
◼
►
slasher film basically yeah he really
◼
►
didn't go far enough with the
◼
►
personalized horror because all they do
◼
►
know in high school bully
◼
►
yeah oh you don't like what is well
◼
►
here's a giant spider
◼
►
yeah whatever whatever I mean they've
◼
►
made a literal horror movie I can't hate
◼
►
this episode but it is not that Graham
◼
►
fair enough it's good solid shut up and
◼
►
shut up and dance is an episode in which
◼
►
people are caught and compromising
◼
►
captions by by their devices being
◼
►
hacked so that they they can be recorded
◼
►
and their messages can be read and then
◼
►
they are told by a mysterious group that
◼
►
only communicates and text messages to
◼
►
do a various series of things that is a
◼
►
Rube Goldberg and sort of series of
◼
►
steps that lead to increasingly
◼
►
ridiculous situations that they are
◼
►
forced to comply with or everything
◼
►
that's going to ruin their lives will be
◼
►
revealed and I I gotta give it to black
◼
►
mirror you know black mirror is a show
◼
►
that tries to take a premise and run it
◼
►
to its fullest and it does that here i
◼
►
would argue that it perhaps runs it like
◼
►
it runs off the cliff with its premise
◼
►
and continues to run into the great yeah
◼
►
but yeah yeah it's like it for a while
◼
►
I'm like oh I'm kind of digging this and
◼
►
shut up and dance words like it is he
◼
►
gets a cake he's going to take a cake
◼
►
somewhere OB think that that guy isn't
◼
►
going to eat the cake
◼
►
they're gonna wear who's gonna get the
◼
►
cake what's going on with the cake and
◼
►
then it just it and then it wears out
◼
►
its welcome and becomes something that
◼
►
is just yeah unpleasant but you know
◼
►
where was going you'd seen enough black
◼
►
mare at this point i do the beauty and I
◼
►
be identifying with us here i get this
◼
►
job i saw that i was hoping against hope
◼
►
i'm watching this I'm like maybe they're
◼
►
not doing what I think now they're doing
◼
►
it i hope the twist is a twist on my
◼
►
twisted metal I want you know I was
◼
►
excited by that whole like what's gonna
◼
►
happen next and go here and do that but
◼
►
i cannot fend off the the sure knowledge
◼
►
having watched the season opens up this
◼
►
point of where this was going
◼
►
and it just it just went there and
◼
►
fizzled out to its and
◼
►
and the moral of the story is haha and
◼
►
and the whole time I'm watching it all I
◼
►
could think of was the blackmail sketch
◼
►
for Monty Python's Flying Circus and
◼
►
Michael Palin hosting a game show called
◼
►
blackmail which basically did this in
◼
►
about four and a half minutes it was
◼
►
much sharper and funnier did you I mean
◼
►
also he doesn't want to wear that for
◼
►
ruining Radiohead with child porn
◼
►
I you know not i'll get over it you can
◼
►
use you can use bad you know you can use
◼
►
music good music with bad stuff and I
◼
►
just the music will survive in the bad
◼
►
stuff will go away but but it is um yeah
◼
►
it out States welcome a lot and also for
◼
►
an insightful sort of social commentary
◼
►
and tech comment commentary thing I mean
◼
►
this episode is a little bit like guys
◼
►
guys did you know there are hackers and
◼
►
and and wait wait wait did you know
◼
►
there are text messages also trouble
◼
►
amazing there's also a troll face and we
◼
►
and also i don't know if anybody
◼
►
realized this but the they also get the
◼
►
GPS coordinates of everybody
◼
►
it's never that's never explain but yeah
◼
►
we have your computer but now we know
◼
►
where your phone is I don't think that
◼
►
actually makes any sense but ok uh what
◼
►
I'm saying is it it's tech satire is not
◼
►
particularly insightful other than that
◼
►
there are people out there on the
◼
►
internet who are jerks so fortune but
◼
►
even more i guess and much better
◼
►
organized unrealistically well-organized
◼
►
like the logistics of this are
◼
►
astronomical but the only thing about
◼
►
this and it's funny because there are
◼
►
two episodes that sort of address this
◼
►
at least that i think is interesting
◼
►
from a cultural standpoint is the idea
◼
►
as it turns out these people are all
◼
►
awful people and they've done terrible
◼
►
things our protagonist in this episode
◼
►
actually is the way they have on him is
◼
►
not that he was masturbating in front of
◼
►
its laptop it's that he's masturbating
◼
►
to child pornography in front of his
◼
►
laptop and uh you know I guess what it's
◼
►
trying to say is that the internet you
◼
►
know quill can destroy anyone and it and
◼
►
it can be bad people or good people but
◼
►
I mean it's a mess and not very good i
◼
►
think i'd also like to give a shoutout
◼
►
figuring out that twist five minutes in
◼
►
based on a single based on a single
◼
►
interaction with another person and I I
◼
►
completely missed that and I rewatched
◼
►
it and now that moment has a completely
◼
►
different meaning to me but kudos to
◼
►
John for actually figuring that out
◼
►
oh no Brian went down in the hole again
◼
►
Brian brain has his in your world but
◼
►
even more he went through them into the
◼
►
yeah wait did I do i Skype out yeah well
◼
►
you scrape by on your recording a song
◼
►
i'm sure all those will come through in
◼
►
the end that's all go together yet it is
◼
►
it brand in the mirror world now i'll
◼
►
send you coming on Blackie files again
◼
►
anyway uh I mean the upside down and
◼
►
making Jason to these bits on this a bit
◼
►
alright well i'm not alone
◼
►
enough said about shut up and dance I
◼
►
think who shut up and move on
◼
►
alright let's move on can we got two
◼
►
more we should get to them very quickly
◼
►
and they're very different episodes very
◼
►
quickly very quickly men against fire is
◼
►
an episode where I figured out the
◼
►
shocking plot twist a minute in and then
◼
►
watched as it delighted in doing its
◼
►
razzle-dazzle magic trick for about 40
◼
►
minutes when I knew every step it was
◼
►
going to take and I didn't
◼
►
this is in my lower tier of my bottom
◼
►
for but i didn't put it all the way at
◼
►
the bottom because I appreciate the
◼
►
story it's trying to tell even as I
◼
►
figured out i mean literally got the
◼
►
entire thing in the first minute and
◼
►
knew exactly how the entire episode was
◼
►
going to go i appreciated some of the
◼
►
little bits in it in terms of style and
◼
►
the very very end although it lifts
◼
►
kinda from white Christmas honestly is
◼
►
an interesting ? sort of twist but you
◼
►
know this is this is about army people
◼
►
who are trying to root out a an
◼
►
infestation of monsters that they call
◼
►
roaches and they have a heads-up display
◼
►
basically in their eyes that allows them
◼
►
to get information about tactical stuff
◼
►
and the shocker is that what's really
◼
►
happening is the heads-up display
◼
►
tactical stuff is making people look
◼
►
like monsters because they are whoever
◼
►
they are whatever their reason whether
◼
►
they're gypsies or Jews or whatever or
◼
►
you know you name it a left-handed just
◼
►
yeah they could be left-handed
◼
►
left-handers that they had to agree with
◼
►
the butter side down they had to see
◼
►
that they are all identified uh in these
◼
►
displays and made to look like and sound
◼
►
like monsters so that it's easier for
◼
►
soldiers to kill them and not not feel
◼
►
bad about killing other human beings and
◼
►
one character has his system hacked and
◼
►
discovers that there are shockingly haha
◼
►
they're actually really really people
◼
►
and all this extermination talk to talk
◼
►
about destroying the the awfulness that
◼
►
they spread is just talking about that
◼
►
come out and commit genocide and I again
◼
►
a perfectly reasonable thing to do you
◼
►
know where we're against genocide
◼
►
murdering innocent people great but this
◼
►
is the one John where I said maybe i've
◼
►
read too much science fiction but good
◼
►
Lord that it was easy like you don't
◼
►
have to read any science fiction to get
◼
►
this and in fact that undercuts the
◼
►
whole idea because human beings do this
◼
►
without that time knowing that this is
◼
►
this is less grim than the reality so
◼
►
yeah it's like a smile games are
◼
►
dehumanizing our soldiers what if we
◼
►
made the actual were like a video game
◼
►
where they where they we turned the
◼
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yeah but like we don't need video games
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►
like genocide is yeah i know it happens
◼
►
you don't even like they just people for
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►
people who look exactly like that like
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►
you don't even look different you don't
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►
have to basically be left-handed like
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►
yeah we don't it is that I do not say
◼
►
that this whole gotta run wishes episode
◼
►
was so try out a grand and the execution
◼
►
was just like the only thing I liked
◼
►
about it was the idea that after you
◼
►
know that the it's like what if we don't
◼
►
erase your memories you'll know all the
◼
►
bad things you did and it's like to
◼
►
choose whether you want to do that or
◼
►
not just but even that you saw coming
◼
►
once you saw him in the shrinks office
◼
►
after going through all the stuff and
◼
►
it's Ned I I'm not angry this one like
◼
►
am angered the other ones this one falls
◼
►
into the same categories play test for
◼
►
me because it's like I know exactly what
◼
►
you're doing this episode you do it it's
◼
►
done yeah yeah I mean GracePoint stop
◼
►
no go ahead at this point I stopped
◼
►
watching critically because i was so
◼
►
worn out from watching everything else
◼
►
so I just kinda like this episode wash
◼
►
over me and I didn't know the twist
◼
►
until the end when it was actually
◼
►
revealed and even then when the twist
◼
►
like hit me at the exact perfect moment
◼
►
to show intended it to
◼
►
I was still just as underwhelmed
◼
►
everything else because we end with
◼
►
black mirror screaming and consequences
◼
►
for characters and yeah fun and whatever
◼
►
we're 15 minutes points and I rolling
◼
►
twist if you didn't see it coming you'd
◼
►
still roll your eyes at like I mean it's
◼
►
just so like John said it's it's so try
◼
►
it under it undercuts the reality of the
◼
►
situation does saying in order for this
◼
►
to happen they need to look like
◼
►
monsters to you with some sci-fi deck
◼
►
don't need that all well although I i do
◼
►
like the fact that the idea here is that
◼
►
they're not doing it so that they will
◼
►
kill them they're doing it so that they
◼
►
don't get PTSD and are more effective
◼
►
soldiers so whether they don't feel bad
◼
►
about it but like this thing is like we
◼
►
can't find enough people who who will
◼
►
either just blindly follow orders or be
◼
►
actually hate these people and in
◼
►
reality you can people who blindly
◼
►
follow orders and are actually hit
◼
►
because that girl here take that
◼
►
yeah yeah I mean we in terms of figuring
◼
►
out the twist and in the first minute
◼
►
welcome to my no I felt like you really
◼
►
it was yeah i mean probably read about
◼
►
there's five seconds no it wasn't it was
◼
►
it pretty early on I knew where this was
◼
►
going to yeah I I but the thing with
◼
►
black mirrors the most hoping against I
◼
►
know right ok pricey was obvious
◼
►
maybe they'll change it and it's just us
◼
►
as you watch you slowly realize that it
◼
►
doesn't look at turning away
◼
►
no not gonna it's like nope they can
◼
►
avoid it now not there there's actually
◼
►
it sounds it's like I said they're a lot
◼
►
of the I mean almost every episode has
◼
►
something interesting about it there or
◼
►
occurred with an idea and and too often
◼
►
it just takes the most obvious direct
◼
►
way of doing it or the simplest way of
◼
►
telling the story and you know there
◼
►
could be interesting ways of doing this
◼
►
if this had been 22 minutes
◼
►
yeah it's still going to be lousy but
◼
►
it's over quickly and it doesn't give
◼
►
you time to think about headphones which
◼
►
is like the fifth season Twilight zones