Roderick on the Line

Ep. 62: "Cat Butt Was Real"


  hey John I Merlin has gone that's early [TS]

  mm you have a busy morning it's not even [TS]

  1030 yet [TS]

  mm-hmm I'm sorry we're starting earlier [TS]

  than usual which by which i mean we [TS]

  didn't delay it as much as usual [TS]

  yeah well I I feel like there's a little [TS]

  bit of mission creep and we're just [TS]

  getting earlier and earlier we're going [TS]

  to be recording this podcast at seven [TS]

  thirty in the morning [TS]

  mm I don't wanna hurt the evergreen long [TS]

  live nature of our programs i think [TS]

  it'll be helping people potentially for [TS]

  millennia [TS]

  yeah but first of all we always record [TS]

  at 10am on Wednesdays and less traveling [TS]

  with the the retinue but I think we need [TS]

  to officially move to 1035 that helped [TS]

  1035 you are you on the west coast right [TS]

  now come on the west coast so it feels [TS]

  like 7-10 35 on the west coast feels [TS]

  like seven it really goes I just reading [TS]

  the hunter s thompson used to wake up at [TS]

  3pm haha and then he did just so much [TS]

  cocaine up it was at to use your phrase [TS]

  that I picked up here I think he was [TS]

  gacked out on cocaine for a lot of the [TS]

  day [TS]

  yeah you know I have considered I've [TS]

  considered a lot of different speedy [TS]

  remedies to my to my problem of not [TS]

  wanting to wake up but all the they all [TS]

  contribute to my problem of not wanting [TS]

  to go to sleep [TS]

  halcyon he would have a house key on am [TS]

  mmm i wish i could find a healthy on [TS]

  this is a term I know you're not a [TS]

  technologist but i think this is a term [TS]

  you're familiar with time-shifting yeah [TS]

  i'm giving your 27 our natural day [TS]

  yeah you know this you know how there's [TS]

  some places like really squirrely places [TS]

  that don't observe the time child right [TS]

  yeah like little carries an Arizona or [TS]

  something but don't don't make the [TS]

  switch [TS]

  yeah it just seems to me that given the [TS]

  decisions that you made your life your [TS]

  career and your natural clock i dont see [TS]

  there is no reason that you couldn't [TS]

  move toward a 27 [TS]

  our day yeah mirana you get the kids [TS]

  stuff that stuff [TS]

  yeah I gotta go to the bank and stuff [TS]

  the the the thing that confuses me is is [TS]

  not the is not the the little time [TS]

  pockets in the world but there are you [TS]

  know I have a pretty good natural [TS]

  compass I I can always tell you where [TS]

  the where the you-know-what the cardinal [TS]

  directions are absolutely you're like [TS]

  you're like a bird of prey you've got [TS]

  like a non-magnetic your necklace or [TS]

  something yeah right but there are a [TS]

  couple of places in the world where that [TS]

  an inner inner compass is completely [TS]

  turned around buy something buy [TS]

  something in the ground [TS]

  hm the city of Budapest is like this it [TS]

  does not matter to me how I arrived in [TS]

  Budapest I I feel like it is like the [TS]

  city is rotated on the on the space-time [TS]

  but not like even like bring 90 degrees [TS]

  it might be rotated like 17 degrees like [TS]

  just enough to really screw up it's like [TS]

  70 degrees when it's right it's rotated [TS]

  70 degrees so so i don't thing is i have [TS]

  walked to Budapest [TS]

  mhm so you're moving mostly east at that [TS]

  point I was and so I knew with way [TS]

  slowing in here you're still going east [TS]

  for a lie [TS]

  did I knew and I want and I had been [TS]

  there before and experienced this [TS]

  problem of like wait a minute what no [TS]

  that's impossible [TS]

  that can't possibly be North I know it [TS]

  in my bones and then it's like no I'm [TS]

  afraid it is that is north and I'm so [TS]

  I'm i walked into this city and I'm [TS]

  thinking this will solve this problem [TS]

  for me this has been a problem for years [TS]

  yeah yeah we got a point of reference [TS]

  yeah now i'm walking in I have real i [TS]

  have europe at my back I'm gonna walk [TS]

  into the city and I swear to you I [TS]

  walked around the corner in it in a city [TS]

  street and all of a sudden it was like [TS]

  wobbly and I was upside down and [TS]

  backwards that list i mean that's like [TS]

  when Spiderman liz is spider spider [TS]

  senses [TS]

  really what it's like and I I'm the [TS]

  whole time the things i love the city [TS]

  the whole time I'm there I I enjoy it [TS]

  very much but there is something there's [TS]

  something there's it it's like a scene [TS]

  those images of Einstein Ian a fabric of [TS]

  space-time where you could be a [TS]

  non-euclidean city it's yeah it's like [TS]

  it there's a gravity sink there there's [TS]

  like a little it's like a it's like the [TS]

  whole on a putt-putt golf course and it [TS]

  is but there's also a twist and it's [TS]

  like it's like somebody it's not like [TS]

  somebody put dog poop in a bag and [TS]

  twisted it because Budapest is not you [TS]

  could not describe it as dog pooping a [TS]

  bang [TS]

  that is how i feel i feel like you don't [TS]

  mind just a bit i got i feel like that [TS]

  it isn't the city rhyme poop in that [TS]

  analogy the best is the bag again nobody [TS]

  blames the bag up there are no bad dogs [TS]

  but so so knowing that that exists [TS]

  knowing that that place is there and [TS]

  knowing that that most people don't [TS]

  experience it because most people don't [TS]

  have a very accurate inner compass and [TS]

  then it causes me to wonder about [TS]

  everything then it's like well if that [TS]

  if that can be true then what else can [TS]

  be true it's so much about this doesn't [TS]

  add up and I have to be honest I've my [TS]

  file card for Hungary is basically [TS]

  goulash and the Gabor sisters right and [TS]

  that's pretty much the extent of it [TS]

  balitaan oh that all not down with the [TS]

  phonetically like I have so many is [TS]

  already have so many questions for you I [TS]

  Allah that I don't want to get your way [TS]

  with this but I in the same census with [TS]

  the actually Peter Parker but but in [TS]

  that same sense you are made with an [TS]

  active mind and it seems to me that for [TS]

  the time you're enjoying this city there [TS]

  must be some small part of you that [TS]

  still wondering what the heck is going [TS]

  on and you think it might be the soil [TS]

  the pavement [TS]

  oh no it's something d it's something [TS]

  much deeper than that it's like a [TS]

  because I don't know what I I honestly [TS]

  don't know why my sense of the cardinal [TS]

  directions is so strong but it has saved [TS]

  my ass a million times and it doesn't [TS]

  seem to be that it's not like I get [TS]

  interference [TS]

  from microwaves well as far as you know [TS]

  as far as i know but it doesn't get the [TS]

  Sun do they get the Sun in hungry cuz my [TS]

  other centers of my sense of canning is [TS]

  is the opposite of years i mean i'm i'm [TS]

  lost on market street because there's a [TS]

  diagonal they have the Sun there but [TS]

  also you know one of the one of the good [TS]

  things about Budapest is that one side [TS]

  is a hill and one side is flat like [TS]

  theres a river that runs down the middle [TS]

  of it [TS]

  the river runs dude south through the [TS]

  town and one-sided is a big hill and one [TS]

  side is flat so you've got a [TS]

  geographical compass already in place [TS]

  yeah so there is there's an awful lot of [TS]

  letter there are a lot of physical [TS]

  features it's not like it's just a [TS]

  rambling a like a mess of a city it's [TS]

  incredibly ordered gridded say with life [TS]

  features they basically have a sudden [TS]

  basically have a sign on one side that [TS]

  says this is east this is east town and [TS]

  yet I can't get my head around it [TS]

  because it doesn't it doesn't square [TS]

  with how I because doesn't square with [TS]

  my emotional sense of what the [TS]

  directions are you go to somewhere like [TS]

  London or Boston have been the line i've [TS]

  been to London for like five hours but [TS]

  but yeah boss is a subtle myself most of [TS]

  it I i found a place that had it so good [TS]

  i don't smoke the day I found a place to [TS]

  have cigars and i went to a station [TS]

  yesterday i use the loo you see Bobby [TS]

  wasabi he had he had a torch and a lift [TS]

  and with or yeah well so shining glory [TS]

  listen I've been to London a lot of [TS]

  times you saw all the good stuff and [TS]

  that an Olympic Stadium doesn't sound [TS]

  like really much to look at but I mean [TS]

  now it's obviously for me do you get you [TS]

  have two problems here well I ever i [TS]

  cannot set aside genetics you can never [TS]

  I think you're unwise to set aside [TS]

  genetics but I was that the times the [TS]

  time when I had to acquaint myself with [TS]

  directions especially when I started [TS]

  driving with Florida where you know [TS]

  everywhere I've lived in Florida was [TS]

  oriented around in north-south artery [TS]

  you know what I mean like the US 19 US [TS]

  41 but there's always it and almost [TS]

  examine highways right they just go [TS]

  north and south florida is just too [TS]

  it's just a north-south dongle for he's [TS]

  just a dongle that's being I said dongle [TS]

  that's adorable huh [TS]

  it's a turkey waddle you know I don't [TS]

  like to quit the simpsons but but Homer [TS]

  everyone prefers to Florida as america's [TS]

  wang yeah but no I think that's part of [TS]

  it for me is I'm always trying to orient [TS]

  myself to like the large body of water [TS]

  is over there right to the West in my [TS]

  case and so I mean so for me seriously [TS]

  somewhere like San Francisco where you [TS]

  know as you know market street is is [TS]

  actually almost a perfect diagonal and [TS]

  then the streets that go around they're [TS]

  totally confusing some of the names [TS]

  change at market street there's [TS]

  intersections where there's like five [TS]

  roads coming together and i find that [TS]

  but you have no problem with that i mean [TS]

  we get anyway the times you've been here [TS]

  which i always enjoy we get in your van [TS]

  and you have one hundred percent [TS]

  confidence that you will get where [TS]

  you're going to take you take a step and [TS]

  you always know what the next step is [TS]

  well X and the thing about San Francisco [TS]

  is in that city was laid out by miners [TS]

  miners and trappers and i think i think [TS]

  what they did is they tied it tighter [TS]

  length of string to the belt loop of [TS]

  like 50 drunk guys and just send them [TS]

  all out from them from it's got this one [TS]

  currently go it will call you market but [TS]

  uh but but it in something in a city [TS]

  like San Francisco I kind of I don't [TS]

  know what it is I kind of just look up [TS]

  at the sky and nowhere is this is why I [TS]

  bring up the sign it was when i [TS]

  discovered the sign that my sense of [TS]

  direction got so much better because I'm [TS]

  good age were you when you discovered [TS]

  the Sun i think i discovered the sun at [TS]

  a point when I had to discover the son I [TS]

  never paid much attention to the Sun and [TS]

  then at some point i was informed that [TS]

  it generally speaking rises in the east [TS]

  and sets in the west and that the only [TS]

  two things that I have going for me in [TS]

  life literally our number one I almost [TS]

  never forget a face [TS]

  i I don't know anybody's name I have [TS]

  your written down here on a card but but [TS]

  that and i have an extraordinary sense [TS]

  of what time it [TS]

  usually down to no more than five [TS]

  minutes and you know that's not because [TS]

  the morning edition song came on [TS]

  it's like I I know what time it is and [TS]

  my wife will see what time is it and I [TS]

  will go 678 618 now i'm almost always so [TS]

  so let me tell you how that helps once I [TS]

  discovered the Sun i was able to know [TS]

  that because it is the morning and the [TS]

  sun's over there that's kind of it kind [TS]

  of eats it just seems to me that you [TS]

  would you would just see that you see [TS]

  your shadow like like a great roiling [TS]

  groundhog and you would know where I I [TS]

  don't wanna be labor this but this is a [TS]

  product this is the this is the problem [TS]

  with living on the earth one of the [TS]

  problems living in there like for [TS]

  instance if you're in Malibu California [TS]

  fly your you are conscious of the fact [TS]

  that the pacific ocean is it is to your [TS]

  West and America's to your East because [TS]

  you are on the pacific ocean right [TS]

  that's how we think of the world I could [TS]

  see it from my house but I Mallory days [TS]

  a year [TS]

  Malibu's in this weird little uh it's [TS]

  just weird little beard it's like it's [TS]

  like a little beard on california for [TS]

  his b crickets where we're not there was [TS]

  less Hollywood the ocean is no longer to [TS]

  the west of malibu the ocean is to the [TS]

  south of malibu malibu points south and [TS]

  east that's completely unacceptable [TS]

  so when you're in Malibu and the sun [TS]

  comes up you think oh my god the this [TS]

  the Sun is rising in the north or what I [TS]

  mean you cannot you cannot reckon with [TS]

  it because you eat your mind is so used [TS]

  to thinking of the Pacific Ocean always [TS]

  to the west always to the west right but [TS]

  really when you stand in Malibu and look [TS]

  out at the ocean you're looking south [TS]

  looking toward the Galapagos that's what [TS]

  I get the Turtles tortoises that's where [TS]

  that's where the tourists come from so [TS]

  it's so it's so this and this is that [TS]

  this is true portland oregon tui if you [TS]

  get accustomed to thinking that the [TS]

  river in portland oregon runs east-west [TS]

  and then you realize that runs [TS]

  north-south can't really screw up [TS]

  yeah why would you think that because [TS]

  because the first time you're in [TS]

  portland you get really baked yeah [TS]

  totally did [TS]

  yeah and now i'm given to believe that [TS]

  Portland is it's very flat no one's [TS]

  another city like Budapest there's Hills [TS]

  on one side and flat on the other hand a [TS]

  river in the middle locally-sourced me [TS]

  to the north to the north of Portland [TS]

  afternoon I know where this food trucks [TS]

  are like this food trucks [TS]

  yeah portland i just spent oh it's just [TS]

  been a week on the Oregon coast [TS]

  y-yeah I i went down to the oregon coast [TS]

  and rented a house what and i sat in the [TS]

  house and heard nothing about this [TS]

  well this is the thing I keep keep my [TS]

  keep my travels [TS]

  the thing about the thing about ok [TS]

  announcing to the world that you're on [TS]

  the Oregon coast is people can find you [TS]

  there they can they can they can explore [TS]

  your home so even i mean there are [TS]

  certain kinds of information that you [TS]

  are comfortable releasing retro actively [TS]

  but your movements your movements in in [TS]

  a contemporary sense need to be [TS]

  something that's a need-to-know basis [TS]

  that's right that's that and [TS]

  particularly when I'm going somewhere [TS]

  for to experience a kind of like lonely [TS]

  Beach solitude [TS]

  mm I don't want that interview no I [TS]

  don't want somebody like a DJ offer [TS]

  proof fuck time up 13 she wear trousers [TS]

  rolled I did but when walking I'm [TS]

  walking down the key to teach I didn't [TS]

  have each you know yet you encounter [TS]

  people who are you are out on the beach [TS]

  in the in the dawn light and sometimes [TS]

  they have to read dogs sometimes i black [TS]

  dog and then you want to meet those [TS]

  people on even footing beach footing you [TS]

  don't want to be out there and somebody [TS]

  with two red dogs goes super train em [TS]

  and that if I told people I was out [TS]

  there [TS]

  yeah butBut so I go to the oregon coast [TS]

  and my expectation is it's the middle of [TS]

  January it's going to be a constant [TS]

  like shitty was dark cold wind swept [TS]

  rainy week where I'm gonna sit in this [TS]

  little shingled house and I'm going to [TS]

  shiver and stoke the fire and have lots [TS]

  of deep thoughts and steam and I'm gonna [TS]

  steam and instead I get down there and [TS]

  it's the sunniest week on record and [TS]

  it's just beautiful every day [TS]

  Wow and I mean cold it's january but [TS]

  it's it's just beautiful sounds bracing [TS]

  it was it was great and you don't have [TS]

  so every day I go and I i start i say [TS]

  i'm going to take a quick walk on the [TS]

  beach and then I go and I walk for three [TS]

  and a half hours up and down the beach [TS]

  and I did not have as many deep thoughts [TS]

  but one of the one of the one of the [TS]

  takeaways was that the oregon coast for [TS]

  me is one of these places that I believe [TS]

  everyone in the world should everyone in [TS]

  the world it's not that everyone in the [TS]

  world should experience it but that [TS]

  everyone in the world should have access [TS]

  to it it's such a perfect place that I [TS]

  almost can't believe that that it isn't [TS]

  part of everyone's lands everyone's [TS]

  mental landscape because you know though [TS]

  the the state of Oregon the law there is [TS]

  that there is no private beach all [TS]

  beaches are public so you can walk from [TS]

  the top of Oregon to the bottom if you [TS]

  can forward the rivers and and the beach [TS]

  is just what at the beaches are really [TS]

  shallow so when the tide goes out you [TS]

  can walk out onto the mudflats seemingly [TS]

  forever [TS]

  I don't know it's just a it's just it's [TS]

  a it's a place that's always in my [TS]

  imagination and we used to go there is [TS]

  when I was a kid so [TS]

  so I just got back from there some a [TS]

  little dream a little like spaced out [TS]

  I'm him and it doesn't the things it [TS]

  doesn't like Portland somehow but the [TS]

  back in the old days portland and the [TS]

  oregon coast were kind of a symbiotic [TS]

  was like the people on the Oregon coast [TS]

  were largely from Portland and Portland [TS]

  was this little logging town and it just [TS]

  all felt like a kind of a weird I 11 but [TS]

  now portland is throbbing with this food [TS]

  truck energy and people with the you [TS]

  know with sink stoppers in their ears [TS]

  and and the oregon coast is still [TS]

  eternal it's it's just it doesn't feel [TS]

  like it's changed at all [TS]

  so the two things now the feels like [TS]

  there's a disconnect between Portland [TS]

  and that and the beach but you you [TS]

  stayed mostly close to the shingles [TS]

  yeah there's a little house that's [TS]

  that's basically in the sand dunes [TS]

  that's I mean you as a slingshot from [TS]

  the water and I camp out there and you [TS]

  are i mean in as much as you can say we [TS]

  can cut this out but as much as you can [TS]

  say you were you are ready for a [TS]

  sabbatical I guess a week ago all it [TS]

  took to just go away and and you're [TS]

  thinking this is going to be a place to [TS]

  get a change of scenery and you you put [TS]

  aside the worries of the day and and the [TS]

  deep thoughts can flow like the shallot [TS]

  I'd that was your thinking going into it [TS]

  yeah but I know that you're you know [TS]

  that you have a lot of feelings on these [TS]

  topics about like the deep thoughts and [TS]

  how they flow and I'm i'm beginning to [TS]

  end beginning to question whether there [TS]

  is any retreat that causes the deep [TS]

  thoughts to flow or whether the you know [TS]

  I Merlin I keep looking for the secret [TS]

  key that is going to unlock [TS]

  the to unlock my work and it's going to [TS]

  make me want to make the kinds of things [TS]

  that I think I should be making and this [TS]

  is a weird thing because I make things [TS]

  all the time but i have so i have i have [TS]

  a list of things i think i should be [TS]

  making right and I can't I couldn't be [TS]

  less interested in most of the time in [TS]

  making those things and so I keep [TS]

  thinking I'm gonna find this key it's [TS]

  going to unlock the box where the these [TS]

  things that I think I should be making [TS]

  our and they're going to pour out of me [TS]

  like they used to like when I was young [TS]

  and I didn't think I should be making [TS]

  those things I just did them and i'm [TS]

  gonna read I'm gonna find that again and [TS]

  so like I every time i go on tour every [TS]

  time I have a a an interesting moment or [TS]

  a fun night i come back and i sit down [TS]

  in my chair and I go I'm not I'm fired [TS]

  up [TS]

  I'm gonna do this stuff that i really [TS]

  think i ought to do and then you I just [TS]

  I just don't put kind of life drive [TS]

  trains out of me so I went to the oregon [TS]

  coast thinking I was gonna it's gonna [TS]

  talk to God in the form of the rhythm of [TS]

  his waves and you know i love the waves [TS]

  i stared out Adam maybe even talk to God [TS]

  a little bit but it'sit's that like I [TS]

  came back in and ported poured into [TS]

  anything actually well that's not true i [TS]

  wrote a long article about how punk-rock [TS]

  sucks but that's nobody wants that and [TS]

  that would come out anyway [TS]

  nobody's that would have everything is [TS]

  nobody's interested in it that's about [TS]

  what about hard to open jars something [TS]

  will be addressing hard to open jars i [TS]

  don't find any way hard candy so costly [TS]

  now I don't find the funds that I don't [TS]

  find the jars hard to open a hug I don't [TS]

  get invited 10 people by trousers that [TS]

  fit with what is that you have to be so [TS]

  laughs when I say box i don't mean punk [TS]

  rock music [TS]

  I mean I mean punk rock well now this [TS]

  heals a rift okay thank you [TS]

  ya know punk rock music you know my my [TS]

  contention about punk rock music is it's [TS]

  not a thing that they like it really [TS]

  never was a thing [TS]

  yeah good good punk rock music is just [TS]

  good rock music that's true and listen [TS]

  listen if you listen to the clash or the [TS]

  ramones or like any good band [TS]

  yeah if you listen you listen to what [TS]

  you know like axe or wire us into those [TS]

  bands you go these are just or talking [TS]

  heads you just listen it's like this is [TS]

  a fresh take [TS]

  following a bloated area bloated era [TS]

  bloated era that I happen to really like [TS]

  but it was there is certainly but [TS]

  they're on a continuum from the kinks [TS]

  well on a continuum from eddie cochran [TS]

  right so there is no punk rock [TS]

  ok it's just rock and the stuff that [TS]

  that that the best of the could [TS]

  legitimately called punk rock which is [TS]

  like self-conscious art music where it's [TS]

  like Yoko Ono screaming over some [TS]

  intentionally out-of-tune [TS]

  instrumentation and you know that's just [TS]

  that's that's neither pump more rockets [TS]

  just garbage so I'm pregnant [TS]

  punk rock music is just rock music punk [TS]

  rock as a philosophy is the thing that I [TS]

  think is bullshit [TS]

  even in 1976 when the garbage is piling [TS]

  up on the streets and there's no jobs no [TS]

  is a really good is a really good [TS]

  documentary on joy division i I've seen [TS]

  alex cox movie about you know seditious [TS]

  and stuff like that yeah you know it's a [TS]

  little you know ultimately how [TS]

  geographica nightmarish but but i saw [TS]

  this really cool documentary on joy [TS]

  division i thought was Michael [TS]

  Winterbottom maybe and heated the [TS]

  fiction film anyhow I real Warner bottom [TS]

  yet Michael Winterbottom from the water [TS]

  bottom brothers but now but but what I [TS]

  got from showing this kind of archival [TS]

  footage of what it was like to live in [TS]

  manchester in 1976 [TS]

  I mean it was so blighted and everybody [TS]

  was living in where they called council [TS]

  flats plastic just these awful the [TS]

  looks like something stolen we come up [TS]

  with a name and a bad night and there [TS]

  was a time when I don't know why this [TS]

  one really struck in my stuck in my mind [TS]

  but I guess there's a strike as you do [TS]

  in England and the garbage piled up on [TS]

  the streets for I guess weeks [TS]

  yeah and it was it was blighted it was [TS]

  really blighted in you know you listen [TS]

  to i don't know how i feel about the sex [TS]

  pistols I you know I think they're quite [TS]

  as good as people say they are but I [TS]

  mean no future in the future I mean it's [TS]

  just these are the best lump [TS]

  mm you think they're better than X yes [TS]

  okay but the thing is that better is [TS]

  that was the only goes an atom and [TS]

  animus alongside things like oh my god [TS]

  Genesis and queen this is the worst [TS]

  which I disagree with you don't think [TS]

  that was an animus but the the blight of [TS]

  northern England also produced black [TS]

  sabbath which is one of the great one of [TS]

  the great rock experiences a question [TS]

  the thing about punk rock philosophy the [TS]

  reason that I think it is bullshit and [TS]

  and I say that even acknowledging that [TS]

  punk rock as a like as a corner of youth [TS]

  culture was very important to people i [TS]

  have a lot of friends who claim that [TS]

  punk rock the culture saved their lives [TS]

  and it was the family that they didn't [TS]

  have and it was and it was a place where [TS]

  they were all there maybe they felt like [TS]

  they fit in for once [TS]

  well yeah and and I a man that thing is [TS]

  that you could people say that same [TS]

  thing about Scientology you know it's a [TS]

  place where your fashion questions your [TS]

  music questions your political questions [TS]

  and your social questions are all [TS]

  answered in one place [TS]

  oh its stock triangle and your it [TS]

  absolutely is nur 14 years old and so [TS]

  you walk into this you walk into this [TS]

  meeting hall and you're like oh my god I [TS]

  finally i'm home and i understand that [TS]

  that is that has a powerful emotional [TS]

  effect on people and even though a lot [TS]

  of these people now are 45 and 50 years [TS]

  old [TS]

  they cannot they cannot look at punk [TS]

  rock with it with a clear I but the [TS]

  reality is that punk rock as a [TS]

  philosophy as us as a social philosophy [TS]

  is it is intrinsically negative it is [TS]

  and tie reactionary and it is reaction [TS]

  exactly and then anyway fascist but but [TS]

  it does not have it is not pro anything [TS]

  it is anti-everything it lets you know [TS]

  what it is supposed to it never really [TS]

  stipulates what it's for [TS]

  it's like a fourteen-year-old boy island [TS]

  is what hates all he knows what hates [TS]

  and then and that has and that has four [TS]

  certainly you're in my generation that [TS]

  mentality we because punk rock was also [TS]

  cool because that was because you know [TS]

  that was where a lot of the that was the [TS]

  genesis point of a lot of the stuff that [TS]

  we liked and particularly and like I [TS]

  mean anytime you're you're in a sort of [TS]

  a mind-control posture if you can attach [TS]

  it to a good rock music you got half the [TS]

  people right there where they don't even [TS]

  have to think about what it's about [TS]

  that's why that's why christians are so [TS]

  interested in making rock music now you [TS]

  know it's a great way to get inside of [TS]

  people's heads and get them before [TS]

  they're really thinking critically so [TS]

  all through the eighties and nineties we [TS]

  has a generation internalised this punk [TS]

  rock critical eye which was which all it [TS]

  could say was that sucks that sucks that [TS]

  sucks that sucks it at it never espoused [TS]

  like its own concept of beauty and so I [TS]

  think personally I know what they did [TS]

  want really punk rock songs right there [TS]

  is anything when like when yr on yr [TS]

  things outdoor minor which is a gorgeous [TS]

  based on almost a ballad or or when you [TS]

  know I mean how different is [TS]

  you know something from london calling [TS]

  from almost every spring because I don't [TS]

  start things but from from like a [TS]

  restoring like proto power anthem almost [TS]

  well now Green Day is basically his pet [TS]

  is basically making music like ELO like [TS]

  the Buzzcocks with press releases its [TS]

  come all the way it's come full circle [TS]

  but but again leaving the music side and [TS]

  just talking about the talking about [TS]

  punk rock as us as a social phenomenon [TS]

  of fashion movement a way of criticizing [TS]

  culture which you know which it deeply [TS]

  profoundly is punk rock draws a line on [TS]

  everything is it punk or is it not in [TS]

  and you know and that's where that's [TS]

  where indie-rock got the concept that [TS]

  selling out was the ugliest thing you [TS]

  could do you know that whole business of [TS]

  can't like what with Johnny Rotten think [TS]

  of this decision [TS]

  exactly and death cab for cutie we're [TS]

  asking themselves that question what [TS]

  would Johnny Rotten think I mean through [TS]

  through the through of three different [TS]

  filters i mean they weren't actually [TS]

  thinking about trying rotten but but you [TS]

  know a sunny day real estate wouldn't do [TS]

  interviews right on their first record [TS]

  builders belen Sebastian wouldn't be [TS]

  photographed unless every single person [TS]

  like nine people in the band were all in [TS]

  the photo right and Eddie Vetter drove [TS]

  across America you know uninsulated ford [TS]

  van while his bandmates flew from show [TS]

  to show in their own private 747 keeping [TS]

  her because he was keeping it real [TS]

  via mike watt via John Iran be you know [TS]

  and so we all have been carrying this [TS]

  around in us everybody our generation [TS]

  and I think everybody from 30 to 50 this [TS]

  idea everything every time we make [TS]

  something we look at it and go punk or [TS]

  not [TS]

  Oh God not punk enough garbage can I'm [TS]

  comin around comin around okay so you [TS]

  know so anyway so ultimately I feel like [TS]

  what [TS]

  and the reason I'm saying this now is [TS]

  that I look at the look at the [TS]

  generation that is finally throwing this [TS]

  in the garbage which is this this newest [TS]

  generation 20 to 25 year-olds who are [TS]

  making stuff [TS]

  now and they you know I think they look [TS]

  at their cultural patrimony and they see [TS]

  a bunch of like whiny millionaires and [TS]

  they see the last the last vestiges of [TS]

  that kind of pitchfork II like a sellout [TS]

  is rights that this is hack the my kids [TS]

  that are 22 or like you know it just [TS]

  seems like that's how old people put the [TS]

  end up the end up starting if you [TS]

  allowed to happen yourself and it [TS]

  certainly happened to me is you end up [TS]

  starting whatever you call career with a [TS]

  certain amount of cultural baggage right [TS]

  about what the previous generation would [TS]

  think which is not so different from [TS]

  going to eatin right exactly absolutely [TS]

  and the the kids now I think are just [TS]

  like fuck it right and they they they [TS]

  take the they take a little bit of the [TS]

  sneer but none of the self criticism and [TS]

  they just want to dance and they're just [TS]

  being kids again and they seem like a [TS]

  much more [TS]

  oh my god and praise be to God that they [TS]

  are making culture much more [TS]

  lightheartedly and right you know you [TS]

  look at Lena denim or done Homer over [TS]

  that girl is that's making girls and and [TS]

  their this generation is there just as [TS]

  smart as we ever were but they are [TS]

  having a they're having a little bit [TS]

  more fun because they aren't when she is [TS]

  doing something more profound and more [TS]

  likely to endure in some ways yeah [TS]

  because they're not because they aren't [TS]

  self-censoring based on up like a [TS]

  fundamental principle that if you are [TS]

  not approaching the world with [TS]

  negativity then you are part of the ear [TS]

  part of the capitalists oh you know [TS]

  larki right you've got me you got me [TS]

  thinking about this and there's certain [TS]

  exhibit [TS]

  ok so I mean I personally never have [TS]

  thought the germs were all that great [TS]

  they kind of phoned it in think about [TS]

  what's enduring about like Agent Orange [TS]

  mm I mean that's so many armies now [TS]

  it'sit's that what is that that's that's [TS]

  like the the ventures with spit right [TS]

  right [TS]

  haha but here's what's interviewing [TS]

  wondering about it i mean we take away [TS]

  sure you i mean i think there's [TS]

  something to be taken away from the [TS]

  color stuff to think about this think [TS]

  about how much of of the enduring legacy [TS]

  that made bands like your previous bands [TS]

  you know it's you might have inspired [TS]

  you think about you know a lot of it [TS]

  some of it is cultural I mean you're [TS]

  never you're very unlikely in context to [TS]

  ever get weirder than screamin jay [TS]

  hawkins hawkins nobody's ever going to [TS]

  be that weird just given like what he [TS]

  was alongside in those days [TS]

  absolutely but think about this think [TS]

  about the the real and again I'm [TS]

  certainly guilty of the have geography [TS]

  here for every one of these but number [TS]

  one I don't think people really [TS]

  understand what independent music meant [TS]

  in the mid to late seventies because the [TS]

  Buzzcocks very few people have been as [TS]

  independent as the Buzzcocks they like [TS]

  practically press the records they made [TS]

  their own covers like they almost [TS]

  single-handedly invented independent [TS]

  music what is that [TS]

  well that ends up being a business [TS]

  decision because there was not there is [TS]

  not a forum or maybe a former for [TS]

  promoting them but there weren't that [TS]

  many people out there who are going to [TS]

  invest in them and they really did [TS]

  literally do it themselves like say what [TS]

  you will about the emek I it but the [TS]

  thing is we remember we remember discord [TS]

  for their like we won't play a show the [TS]

  cost more than seven dollars will ever [TS]

  again what they did was a business [TS]

  decision they created a sustainable [TS]

  business by being lean and by and by [TS]

  supporting artists that they really [TS]

  believed in and they all we all live in [TS]

  the in the aftermath of that like they [TS]

  created that and we met and that is why [TS]

  I don't that's why there's a bar sook [TS]

  that's where there's a bar soap that's [TS]

  absolutely smitten and the final and [TS]

  again this is going to be the most [TS]

  hydrographic I'm ready get can be wrong [TS]

  about this but you know I think this is [TS]

  in some ways extremely true which is the [TS]

  SST bands including especially people [TS]

  like black flag they worked really hard [TS]

  and only autos hard as Rollins makes it [TS]

  sound yeah I don't mean at the same time [TS]

  I mean I'd I only saw the Minutemen once [TS]

  and I saw the band after that a couple [TS]

  times but I mean I really believe that [TS]

  my quad is it is a pretty hard-working [TS]

  guy but the thing is they got in a van [TS]

  and they drove [TS]

  because of the community that they could [TS]

  develop they were able to blaze a trail [TS]

  that people are still driving their van [TS]

  down till this day but what game what is [TS]

  that it's business and its work all the [TS]

  enduring things in all this where people [TS]

  who actually decided to be dedicated to [TS]

  doing the work which is not nearly the [TS]

  same thing as starting out going like I [TS]

  want you know I want safety pins in my [TS]

  jacket or whatever ya want to work but [TS]

  and then that that's absolutely true and [TS]

  it is the it is the lack of ability to [TS]

  acknowledge that it is a business [TS]

  decision that all of those groups that [TS]

  you just mentioned I mean all of those [TS]

  innovations really you could write up an [TS]

  article for Fast Company about each one [TS]

  of those characters like a startup that [TS]

  works there let's start up the works but [TS]

  the but it like threaded through the [TS]

  philosophy of each one of those [TS]

  organizations was a rejection and denial [TS]

  that business was a was what they were [TS]

  doing this is at least not big business [TS]

  right [TS]

  they want they wanted to have enough to [TS]

  put gas in the van but that's the thing [TS]

  they were not proud of it and that if [TS]

  you read that Rollins book for he's [TS]

  talking about he's talking about being [TS]

  on tour [TS]

  there's this cognitive disconnect [TS]

  because on one page she's like so we got [TS]

  to chicago we sold out the metro and [TS]

  there was a line around the block man [TS]

  right i was riding in the back of a box [TS]

  truck from shows to show from chose to [TS]

  shows and I was peeing in a mason jar [TS]

  and and when you have sold out the metro [TS]

  or played the metro you realize that [TS]

  even if you're only charging five [TS]

  dollars ahead to sell out the metro is [TS]

  to have money you are earning money at [TS]

  this point it is a it is a bit of a big [TS]

  venue and you're in your posting your [TS]

  ego [TS]

  uh well you're boosting your ego but but [TS]

  more than that you have arrived at a [TS]

  place where you do not need to go from [TS]

  show to show in the back of a box truck [TS]

  so if you're doing it you are doing it [TS]

  you are doing it intentionally you know [TS]

  you are choosing it's like shoes and a [TS]

  heart chosen they've done this [TS]

  impossible thing of choosing to be in [TS]

  the proletariat yeah Rollins is either [TS]

  lying which I which partly I think is [TS]

  true or he is self mythologizing in the [TS]

  moment right he's waking up in the [TS]

  morning in the morning and there is a [TS]

  there is a tour manager or there's [TS]

  somebody standing there with an envelope [TS]

  full of cash and they are they are [TS]

  pretending it's not there and they're [TS]

  continuing to 2a you know to pee and [TS]

  jars and live at the end roll from show [TS]

  to show in a 50-gallon drum because [TS]

  because to get your own hotel room is [TS]

  bullshit you know and I got picked up at [TS]

  the airport one time by Bob Weston and [TS]

  big black yea big black and he picked me [TS]

  up at the airport in be big black van [TS]

  and it is afford band that is just [TS]

  exactly like you imagine the Minutemen [TS]

  toward in it is the van that the big [TS]

  black torrent and it's a 75 you know or [TS]

  78 read for bandwidth no paneling so [TS]

  it's just the you know it's just the [TS]

  sheet metal and there are no seats in [TS]

  the van there's like there's like a a a [TS]

  loveseat that somebody drags like [TS]

  sitting in steve albini guitar if it's [TS]

  like that it's like it's like a stakeout [TS]

  metallic and uncomfortable it's like [TS]

  sitting in a chair that you bet somebody [TS]

  made out of steve albini earwax and you [TS]

  know and and the thing has 350,000 miles [TS]

  on it and it's got backstage passes from [TS]

  Stowe's you know but but not like [TS]

  self-consciously but just like [TS]

  haphazardly stuck on the walls and he's [TS]

  like hey man sorry I could you know i [TS]

  had to get the truck running and here we [TS]

  go but we're all and and it was great it [TS]

  was super cool to be in this this BAM [TS]

  but you know Bob Weston was first [TS]

  engineer on in utero right right Bob [TS]

  Weston is a significant get points on [TS]

  that [TS]

  well he got paid for it right okay and [TS]

  he got a credit on honor but she got [TS]

  yeah [TS]

  and.and that and if you look at Bob [TS]

  Weston cv and i don't mean to throw him [TS]

  under the bus he's a wonderful man but [TS]

  he is you know part and parcel of of our [TS]

  entire culture up that that it that [TS]

  descends from punk rock which is that [TS]

  this and the thing is if there was a [TS]

  winking acknowledgement of like yeah I [TS]

  mean isn't this band great like I this [TS]

  is this is a piece of living history [TS]

  link is like he has no traffic Conestoga [TS]

  wagon but i think i can do is i suppose [TS]

  i could afford something a little more [TS]

  modern [TS]

  yeah if any of us for the last 25 years [TS]

  were able to still look to wink and say [TS]

  yeah i know i could be driving a better [TS]

  car but I drive this because i know it's [TS]

  cool it's a it's a it is part of history [TS]

  and its and I know that picking you up [TS]

  at the airport in this van is impressive [TS]

  to you and it's like it's like an A&R [TS]

  guy with yeah let's all sit here and [TS]

  like and just like just like give [TS]

  ourselves a little bit of of crotch [TS]

  pleasure [TS]

  let's just gently stroke ourselves [TS]

  knowing that we're in big black band and [TS]

  Mike watch shot near once but in fact [TS]

  but in fact for the last 25 years we had [TS]

  we have not let's be honest we if if you [TS]

  think that there has been that element [TS]

  of fun in our culture you are [TS]

  misremembering it because Bob Weston [TS]

  pick me up in that van with the pretense [TS]

  that that was his car and that was what [TS]

  he could afford and that was how you [TS]

  kept it you know and and and so and [TS]

  that's been true of everything we've [TS]

  done as a as a youth culture that's now [TS]

  moved into middle age where it's just [TS]

  like oh yeah sorry man I couldn't you [TS]

  know I would've been here earlier but i [TS]

  had to i was out getting frizzy and fit [TS]

  to poor people [TS]

  yeah i was working at the needle [TS]

  exchange and it's just like wait a [TS]

  fucking minute no you weren't and that [TS]

  at some one thing is when I look at the [TS]

  kids now i see they have taken all of [TS]

  that David they've adopted the fashion [TS]

  they've taken the taking the fun parts [TS]

  of that [TS]

  and it's why it that's why they they're [TS]

  a little bit incomprehensible to us [TS]

  because it's like with wait a minute why [TS]

  are you having fun [TS]

  you don't get to have fun you're making [TS]

  one is it's not so different from me [TS]

  being 46 in choosing to wear a shirt [TS]

  with a comic book character on it [TS]

  I i have i have the means i know we [TS]

  having fun [TS]

  oh yeah I am but it's partly nostalgic [TS]

  is partly something I feel like I'm is [TS]

  but you know you said something about to [TS]

  being being middle-aged and I think that [TS]

  can't be overlooked I mean you know when [TS]

  you're younger you sure have more energy [TS]

  can put up with more you were creating [TS]

  memories that you will someday be [TS]

  nostalgic about but you know think about [TS]

  how many of those bands again you know [TS]

  going back to a time when you let's say [TS]

  you start I can't think of a specific [TS]

  manner of the bus costs to come to my [TS]

  joy division comes to mind [TS]

  I mean a lot of that was you didn't have [TS]

  nobody came in right with the suitcase [TS]

  full of money but when you had the [TS]

  opportunity i mean joy division became [TS]

  new order and new order became huge and [TS]

  the thing is you might have gotten [TS]

  signed to mute or you might have gotten [TS]

  signed to i mean you know i am was an [TS]

  independent label for a pretty long time [TS]

  and you know and and thank God they put [TS]

  out the police you know what I mean they [TS]

  became a major on trying to say though [TS]

  is that when you do for lack of a better [TS]

  word grow up a little bit you might [TS]

  think about something like well you know [TS]

  what if I really care about what I'm [TS]

  making a I'm gonna need the means to do [TS]

  that for a living and not have to work [TS]

  at haagen dazs and then be when you no [TS]

  longer have to work at Hadassah and [TS]

  that's all just kind of put on you start [TS]

  to realize the extent to which you are a [TS]

  white kid who could drive around in a [TS]

  band and and draw a crowd this is an old [TS]

  argument but if you ask most African [TS]

  American people who are living in [TS]

  poverty they would love to have have [TS]

  even that freedom to get in a van and [TS]

  drive around a heartbeat but they can't [TS]

  they got stuff to do their work in a [TS]

  factory sorry sorry about punk rock here [TS]

  but that's really true you know a friend [TS]

  of mine always used to say you can't [TS]

  choose to join the proletariat because [TS]

  if you choose to do that [TS]

  you still implicitly have the net of [TS]

  being a white man who can walk anywhere [TS]

  and be the norm [TS]

  and and you know it but you're you are [TS]

  making the arguments that I feel like [TS]

  still from within this that the [TS]

  punk-rock mentality like we at with the [TS]

  idea that we even need to explain that [TS]

  we are that it's okay to enjoy success [TS]

  is we we we've been doing our whole [TS]

  lives so that we feel we feel like we've [TS]

  we forget that it is a technology and I [TS]

  feel like punk rock came punk rock came [TS]

  up not just in the blighted a like like [TS]

  shit scape of Manchester and to a lesser [TS]

  extent los angeles in the late seventies [TS]

  but also not to just always be hammering [TS]

  on this but in in the Cold War you know [TS]

  during a time when it seemed like it [TS]

  wasn't just that the rich people like [TS]

  they are now the rich people just seem [TS]

  like they're greedy they're stealing [TS]

  they are they're just sucking bone [TS]

  marrow and they're just lame [TS]

  there they are they're ugly their course [TS]

  but but but we forget that 35 years ago [TS]

  40 years ago those people also we [TS]

  perceive them i guess maybe mostly we [TS]

  perceive them as having their finger on [TS]

  the red button that was going to that [TS]

  was going to annihilate all of human [TS]

  like they were part they were part of we [TS]

  perceived and probably true that they [TS]

  were part of a system that elected the [TS]

  people who are keeping is really close [TS]

  to the football game opened right and so [TS]

  that paranoia i couldn't i could see and [TS]

  understand why why initially punk rock [TS]

  had this we're anti-everything mentality [TS]

  because to join that world at all to [TS]

  even to go so far as to like eat a [TS]

  hamburger at McDonalds you were [TS]

  contributing not just to a world where [TS]

  there were rich people who got to have [TS]

  swimming pools but you are contributing [TS]

  to a bankrupt a morally bankrupt world [TS]

  that was teetering on the edge of [TS]

  mutually assured destruction [TS]

  so there wasn't a way to participate [TS]

  where you were complicit and so punk [TS]

  rock was anti everything so you have you [TS]

  had to make something that was kind of [TS]

  ugly [TS]

  you had to know you were you eat it was [TS]

  the only moral choice but that has not [TS]

  been the case for 21 years [TS]

  yeah you know and so up so that and and [TS]

  the reality is looking back punk rock's [TS]

  response to the Cold War really when you [TS]

  broke it down when you really read the [TS]

  scenes was just a garbled mix of like [TS]

  like revolutionary marxism and I mean it [TS]

  was it was nothing new it was just it [TS]

  was just the dregs of a of a you know of [TS]

  a city college education like sandanista [TS]

  really do you know what the Sandinistas [TS]

  we're up to [TS]

  not a great record and it's and then [TS]

  they are and the Sandinistas sucked you [TS]

  know and to put to put to wave that flag [TS]

  was just was was to was to exhibit how [TS]

  little you knew and how how mute and [TS]

  impotent your response to it really was [TS]

  like punk rock did not smash the state [TS]

  it did not end the Cold War punk rock [TS]

  did not save us from from basically 12 [TS]

  years of Imperial Bush family punk rock [TS]

  did not do shit except you know and and [TS]

  when it when it turned into grunge when [TS]

  punk rock made that transition into [TS]

  grunge it continue to not do shit we did [TS]

  not even defeat ticketmaster like all we [TS]

  did all it did is what you're describing [TS]

  which is it started an alternate model [TS]

  for financing music and culture addy at [TS]

  the DIY right concept is the only [TS]

  positive product aside from the fact [TS]

  that some great music got made [TS]

  but philosophically DIY is the only [TS]

  thing that came up in weight and without [TS]

  we're going with that we're going and [TS]

  you know to whatever china but we really [TS]

  discovered was the maps are reliable and [TS]

  hey West Indies [TS]

  haha right and here are my intention [TS]

  unintended consequences that you start [TS]

  out with this this ethos and you know I [TS]

  don't say it's freaky things I wasn't [TS]

  there but I mean you start out with an [TS]

  easy thing you're young you know I mean [TS]

  are off from you really weren't [TS]

  I mean we were there what what did we [TS]

  get when we just wanted we join that [TS]

  culture 1980 yeah i mean i-i everything [TS]

  and this is this is you know another old [TS]

  man point but also everything so many of [TS]

  the things that we get to enjoy even [TS]

  started when i was there were filtered [TS]

  already you know two or three times [TS]

  through you know I let's put it this way [TS]

  I i would not have discovered a lot of [TS]

  that music without your community radio [TS]

  but also like independent record record [TS]

  stores and a lot of times it was pretty [TS]

  easy to go buy a copy of never mind the [TS]

  bollocks at you know record bar it but [TS]

  independent record stores were thing not [TS]

  because they were response to the [TS]

  corporate record world independent [TS]

  record stores were just a business model [TS]

  they were closed and it was a specialty [TS]

  stores like a comic shop [TS]

  yeah and that what we're discovering now [TS]

  what I'm seeing now is that DIY is [TS]

  finally divorced from the idea that it [TS]

  is against business and DIY is just now [TS]

  a business model and taking it away from [TS]

  this idea that DIY is against business [TS]

  you don't have young bands were like we [TS]

  don't do interviews we don't want your [TS]

  filthy lucre it's just the house say [TS]

  everything I've got sand facebook [TS]

  yeah that's right if you what do you [TS]

  know about good thanks what they had and [TS]

  it's like fuck fuck wait a minute [TS]

  it never was DIY was never a like an [TS]

  alternative to business it was just a [TS]

  form of business like if you put out a [TS]

  record is because you want people to [TS]

  hear it you want them to essentially to [TS]

  to buy it otherwise you would press [TS]

  those records in and giving them away [TS]

  but but you know here's the other thing [TS]

  is it I don't you tell me this is BS but [TS]

  on the punk rock is if nothing else [TS]

  extremely subconscious force excuse me [TS]

  extremely self-conscious [TS]

  you are yes you as we stipulated you're [TS]

  actively reacting to something else [TS]

  mostly in a negative way but I mean I'm [TS]

  never going on about people like to shop [TS]

  or whatever but like there's always been [TS]

  a self-consciousness and art but you can [TS]

  produce something of enduring value with [TS]

  that self-consciousness if you're--if [TS]

  Casso is reacting saison we came up with [TS]

  some pretty good stuff and figured out [TS]

  how to make a living out of it just [TS]

  you've got you've got to create more [TS]

  than just a poorly written manifesto [TS]

  right and and the thing is Picasso [TS]

  rejected the artists that come before [TS]

  him but and and poured a brilliant new [TS]

  he said with the abbot you look at this [TS]

  about it he didn't just go there but [TS]

  what he didn't do was say I no longer [TS]

  represented by a dealer in Paris my [TS]

  artwork should be free you know Picasso [TS]

  used the same dealers that is that is [TS]

  for animals proud to use the same [TS]

  dealers that is that the guys that came [TS]

  before him did it was punk rock was the [TS]

  first real thing that said we reject the [TS]

  we reject commerce because commerce has [TS]

  produced the bomb and or so or or the or [TS]

  the class system or its responsible for [TS]

  hunger or like any ill you can find you [TS]

  can strap on to this quote-unquote big [TS]

  system [TS]

  absolutely and if you if you if you [TS]

  collect eighties punk-rock azines like i [TS]

  do and read the screens in there there [TS]

  is no liberal cause that punk rock won't [TS]

  attach itself to read and i don't i [TS]

  don't mean liberal because punk-rock [TS]

  ultimately really extremely conservative [TS]

  was a libertarian philosophy like at [TS]

  Anarchy with the big a in a circle is [TS]

  just tea party [TS]

  hit you using it'sit's gun gun nuts in [TS]

  leather jacket basically you know it is [TS]

  it is leave me alone [TS]

  why should I have to do that right why [TS]

  should we do but did not as awesome me [TS]

  you're not the boss of me it is a bratty [TS]

  teen age philosophy that is you know now [TS]

  of course promulgated mostly by these [TS]

  people with PT Cruisers but that's what [TS]

  I'm you know secrets [TS]

  I'd I swear to you the people who were [TS]

  reading iron Rand in 1984 were all I [TS]

  mean either the drummer of rush or that [TS]

  this this like this subset this the but [TS]

  the kind of the place where ponytails [TS]

  and punk rock meet if it is thank you [TS]

  is it is anarchy / libertarianism right [TS]

  so anyway I I feel hopeful for the [TS]

  future but I really feel like we need to [TS]

  look back as a as a people and I'm talk [TS]

  about our generation in particular look [TS]

  back and say wait a minute this was [TS]

  bullshit the whole time we did not need [TS]

  or not maybe not the whole time but we [TS]

  inherited a thing that we did not [TS]

  understand we adopted we adopted this [TS]

  this mentality that for things to be [TS]

  good they had to prove they weren't shit [TS]

  and that you know that that money and [TS]

  business were intrinsically inherently [TS]

  immoral and it was and it was garbage [TS]

  and it handicapped but it also but you [TS]

  know how you're talking about people who [TS]

  would think you're weird best thing [TS]

  about how would with Johnny Rotten [TS]

  approve this you also as creative as you [TS]

  might have thought you were you had a [TS]

  clear progenitor progenitor that you [TS]

  wanted to please and that [TS]

  self-consciousness might lead you you [TS]

  know to to make this something with this [TS]

  certain drum beating do you recognize [TS]

  that that's actually a jumpy from noi or [TS]

  whatever you know that there's this [TS]

  there's this when you say like this is [TS]

  the would like doctrinal conservative [TS]

  thing I i look at [TS]

  somebody I don't know what's your [TS]

  feelings on Captain Beefheart i really [TS]

  like Captain Beefheart and I think the [TS]

  guys to be generous and he don't know [TS]

  he's certainly probably self-conscious [TS]

  in his way he was definitely insane he [TS]

  wouldn't wear headphones in the studio [TS]

  but to me that's something really really [TS]

  knew like what when that came out i mean [TS]

  the new york dolls were like rolling [TS]

  stones and dresses i should do this for [TS]

  a living I'm pretty good shows you are [TS]

  good at it but I mean again you you go [TS]

  back to something like screamin Jay [TS]

  Hawkins I don't know one thing him in [TS]

  particular but but like the kind of [TS]

  people who would really produce Charlie [TS]

  Parker or you know somebody who went out [TS]

  there and really I mean Charlie Parker [TS]

  was playing and and dizzy gillespie were [TS]

  playing in you know the contemporary [TS]

  like big bands the time during the day [TS]

  and like reinventing what we thought [TS]

  about music certainly with projectors [TS]

  but like their response was not to go [TS]

  screw you're just gonna play this just [TS]

  play this faster like the kind of [TS]

  rebooted the whole idea of jazz and a [TS]

  lot of guys they made something new that [TS]

  in its way we came to realize was [TS]

  beautiful it was at the time callaway [TS]

  called a Chinese music nor ping pong but [TS]

  but like we came to realize that you [TS]

  know that was something substantially [TS]

  new and we need to we need to be able to [TS]

  separate all of the amazing artwork that [TS]

  got made under the rubric of punk rock [TS]

  from the from what is the the kind of [TS]

  virus [TS]

  I'm not bored I'm bored I'm I I get what [TS]

  you're saying yes because it was your [TS]

  favorite punk rock then the sex pistols [TS]

  really yeah because that's that really [TS]

  is that that has antecedence in in like [TS]

  the kind of rock and roll that you [TS]

  really love in some ways the sex pistols [TS]

  are not really that different from ac/dc [TS]

  and a lot of ways the sex pistols and [TS]

  the romantics if you put blindfolds on [TS]

  like people from outer space if you if [TS]

  you blindfolded my pillows and played [TS]

  them the sex pistols in the romantics [TS]

  right people i think the pillows would [TS]

  say I don't know the guy from the [TS]

  romantics is kinda got a pretty cool [TS]

  little Lisp the Sex Pistols guys a [TS]

  little bit creamier but they're both [TS]

  they're both amazing i mean let's say [TS]

  let's say my favorite cool punk band [TS]

  because that because most people can't [TS]

  go [TS]

  their heads around the fact that the sex [TS]

  pistols are even are even a punk band [TS]

  anymore but I'm my favorite cool punk [TS]

  band is the bad brands and the Bad [TS]

  Brains in spite of the fact that their [TS]

  records don't sound good [TS]

  I got a pretty bad i think we got a [TS]

  really bad attitude that their records [TS]

  already hard to work the records don't [TS]

  really sound good like they're you put [TS]

  them on and you're like oh god I wish I [TS]

  could rerecord this even using the [TS]

  technology that the head of it wasn't [TS]

  that smart that's me and his crew to you [TS]

  I don't know how they let that spot guy [TS]

  anywhere near a favor and that is [TS]

  absolutely true blue skidoo' and I mean [TS]

  it's true a lot of those r.i.p listen to [TS]

  it now anyway not to go back if we could [TS]

  go back in time and rerecord those [TS]

  records the world would be a better [TS]

  place and that is one thing about that [TS]

  Sex Pistols record that it sounds it is [TS]

  solid gold sounding it sounds like a [TS]

  freaking abba record it's recorded so [TS]

  well and you you put that side to side [TS]

  with the Bad Brains record which was you [TS]

  know one of those was made by ric ocasek [TS]

  that's i'm selling their in a men's room [TS]

  yeah it sounds like it was recorded [TS]

  through one headphone speaker but those [TS]

  guys are putting together so much music [TS]

  out of out of like a grab bag of nuts [TS]

  and bowls and the and the overlay of [TS]

  like I mean what i don't like about the [TS]

  clashes that they are a white reggae [TS]

  band what I love about the Bad Brains is [TS]

  that they are fucking reggae band [TS]

  there's they are doing shit that nobody [TS]

  did that nobody has done before sense [TS]

  and it's not like any aspect of it was [TS]

  new but they put it together in a way [TS]

  that it still inspires me right and you [TS]

  know and I was not able I was never a [TS]

  Fugazi person i did not make that [TS]

  transition me neither [TS]

  I mean I i like that i like i like Minor [TS]

  Threat a lot and there are a couple [TS]

  Fugazi songs are familiar with that I i [TS]

  thought- that was really really good and [TS]

  I've seen I never saw them live but I've [TS]

  seen some of their videos of their live [TS]

  stuff and man they were some working men [TS]

  on CH and everything is I love those [TS]

  early Black Flag records love them early [TS]

  early early early Black Flag record [TS]

  everything before they weren't allowed [TS]

  to record anything [TS]

  you're talking about this continue [TS]

  talking like old-school 33 Rollins yeah [TS]

  and I used to go see all I mean I I had [TS]

  a I had a wonderful time in the [TS]

  punk-rock years suicidal tendencies [TS]

  loved it but by the time it turned into [TS]

  bad religion by the time you know by the [TS]

  time Circle Jerks turned into bad [TS]

  religion i didn't think that was my [TS]

  first punk rock show was when circle [TS]

  jerk that turned into bed religion I [TS]

  think that literally 1986 my first do is [TS]

  I went to circle jerk show i was totally [TS]

  terrified by the skanking and it was all [TS]

  like clothes cigarettes and you know and [TS]

  things people seen in magazines up mr. [TS]

  know it really is true you can you can [TS]

  seem like your guys like you talk about [TS]

  this guy's you walk around the sink [TS]

  stoppers acting like the real tough and [TS]

  they're in their dirty clothes but you [TS]

  know that's that's still a reaction to [TS]

  what you've seen other people do and in [TS]

  three years they will address in two [TS]

  years they won't dress like that anymore [TS]

  because they they are following a [TS]

  certain snaps on punk rock they are [TS]

  following a certain kind of fashion from [TS]


  any 32 1987 if I came out of a concert [TS]

  and I was not covered in blood [TS]

  I I felt like it was a shit was the shit [TS]

  one ng because no I mean it was it [TS]

  wasn't all my blood I mean it was it was [TS]

  you that he took the bitches act it [TS]

  wasn't that we were all taking each [TS]

  other out i mean i was just interesting [TS]

  but it was in a spirit of you know you [TS]

  have each other up and stuff yeah get in [TS]

  the middle and and and you did that [TS]

  would you do that shit out of you [TS]

  haha oh my god was so scared that I was [TS]

  up over by the bar [TS]

  oh my god I wanted and I thrived on it [TS]

  beat you know hit me hard hit me hard [TS]

  were allowed it was encouraged and and [TS]

  then if somebody fell you didn't pick [TS]

  them up and I mean one of the most [TS]

  traumatic experiences I ever had was at [TS]

  an all show a guy jumped up this you [TS]

  know staged over and it she just went [TS]

  into a hole my god said and he was he [TS]

  was out cold and you know the band [TS]

  stopped we all stopped we help this we [TS]

  got this guy into an ambulance and the [TS]

  show started up again like that so punk [TS]

  rock it was great but but but really [TS]

  that transition Circle Jerks into bad [TS]

  religion I stopped believing that there [TS]

  was a thing called punk rock anymore i [TS]

  just--can i mean i didn't i looked [TS]

  around and i was like what this is I [TS]

  don't even know what this is and really [TS]

  that was the last moment that it had any [TS]

  relevance because then it was all then [TS]

  the next generation was all punk rock [TS]

  through through punk rock through punk [TS]

  rock it was it was it was for I mean [TS]

  because of course being 21 is like being [TS]

  87 in punk rock years by the time it by [TS]

  the time we got to 1990 was like really [TS]

  we're taking our music from these guys [TS]

  from aberdeen washington now is that how [TS]

  far out we have to buy better names like [TS]

  the raincoats to find some monkeys that [TS]

  still have a little bit of life in them [TS]

  ok these were pulling these ding-dongs [TS]

  out of trees now and they're making and [TS]

  grudges well that's what we're gonna [TS]

  that's what we're going to call it [TS]

  grunge like we talked about notnot [TS]

  enduring oh yeah i've fallen so far this [TS]

  is not even this is just not this [TS]

  something else and you know i got into [TS]

  music because i was watching the grunge [TS]

  bands i came to Seattle and wanted to be [TS]

  in a band you know when I was playing I [TS]

  was playing jingle jangle REM tom petty [TS]

  Rock because to me it's stuff that was [TS]

  where it seemed like we were headed like [TS]

  that was where the good music was coming [TS]

  from and I show up in this town and [TS]

  they're all these swamp monsters they [TS]

  order a Jagermeister and get a record [TS]

  touch it and they're playing you know [TS]

  really what sounded to me at the time [TS]

  like retro music what about meeting I [TS]

  started with a meaningless genre like [TS]

  how can you put Mudhoney and the melvins [TS]

  and Nirvana and Pearl Jam in the same [TS]

  genre it just doesn't make a lick of [TS]

  sense [TS]

  well it's just the same as punk rock if [TS]

  it's good it's rock and roll if it's bad [TS]

  it's grunge and the and Camille and I [TS]

  didn't did we [TS]

  djed the sub pop 20-year anniversary [TS]

  party [TS]

  Wow several years ago and we have a [TS]

  collation out he's now the head of late [TS]

  he's at a level that's right a British [TS]

  label head but he and I were at this [TS]

  this bar Linda's and we had two [TS]

  turntables and we went to all of our [TS]

  friends and of course the bill owned a [TS]

  record store right he had some resources [TS]

  and I had some stuff and we collected [TS]

  all the like iconic grunge vinyl that we [TS]

  could find and then Anna and I don't [TS]

  mean like really any of the major label [TS]

  stuff but this was this was all the [TS]

  bands that were really making the scene [TS]

  89 threw 93 and we sat at linda's which [TS]

  did not at the time of a very good [TS]

  stereo system which was appropriate [TS]

  automatically aesthetically appropriate [TS]

  and we played this vinyl and we would [TS]

  you know one of us would pull a record [TS]

  out and the other one would go oh my god [TS]

  yes cat but yes they're awesome [TS]

  I never heard a cap but did you make [TS]

  that up oh that was real health proud [TS]

  dude hell trout get that shit on there [TS]

  and we would queue up this record and [TS]

  we'd be like this is going to blow [TS]

  people's minds that we have because the [TS]

  room was full of people that were there [TS]

  and they're waiting for green river yeah [TS]

  and feel like is sitting right in front [TS]

  of us you know he and fabric feel like [TS]

  even came with some records like we're [TS]

  everybody was so excited and then uq [TS]

  this shit up and here comes through the [TS]

  speakers and within and everybody goes [TS]

  yeah and then within a minute we're all [TS]

  looking at our fingernails because it's [TS]

  sucks like so that like it's terrible [TS]

  it's bad they recorded its badly played [TS]

  it's badly written most of that music [TS]

  was just bad and that's true of every [TS]

  music scene anywhere but but the the [TS]

  good pans the good grunge bands you have [TS]

  heard of there's no there was no secret [TS]

  stash of like oh yeah you've never heard [TS]

  of these guys but they're gonna they're [TS]

  gonna kill you you know i mean there are [TS]

  a couple there were a couple but but for [TS]

  the most part that stuff was just it was [TS]

  like it was like a pair of converse that [TS]

  were full of vomit [TS]

  ok did you ever read have you read any [TS]

  contemporary reviews of early Black [TS]

  Sabbath records there they are a riot [TS]

  for for so long I mean you know i'm not [TS]

  saying everything except it was was [TS]

  fantastic but i'm going to say that I'm [TS]

  gonna go right ahead and say it [TS]

  well at least the first six years first [TS]

  just six years yeah there's that 179 275 [TS]

  as well yeah there's that was that last [TS]

  Ozzy record that sounds like Sloan but [TS]

  um but you know how they're always quite [TS]

  a statement [TS]

  oh yeah it will this is this one song [TS]

  that basically takes a was set and as a [TS]

  you know the one I mean it's like AG [TS]

  ACDC longer you know the one I mean it's [TS]

  oh not the gas masks that one on the [TS]

  cover but it was last night he record is [TS]

  pretty he was pretty gone at that point [TS]

  but but it's funny cuz neck like today [TS]

  especially like I happen to really like [TS]

  the melvins and I think they're grazing [TS]

  their incredible ok alright cool I'm [TS]

  cool but but I that you know I and [TS]

  unlike you I'm given to believe i did [TS]

  not sit around and get super duper high [TS]

  list them i'm kinda regret that but like [TS]

  that's a honey pot like I guess this one [TS]

  of their hits but I mean like that song [TS]

  is a triumph [TS]

  it's so great but like you would never [TS]

  have had a Melvin this message is [TS]

  definitely I think one of those bands is [TS]

  what you're describing which is like [TS]

  it's cool to like The Melvins but they [TS]

  were really good and then I don't think [TS]

  they're ever would have been in Melvin's [TS]

  without a black sabbath not at all no [TS]

  chance I mean that may sound like [TS]

  patently obvious but it's fine if you go [TS]

  back to the time man [TS]

  no body especially like a sling [TS]

  criticisms but nobody like Black Sabbath [TS]

  they were like this is ridiculous [TS]

  it's the same way I make the joke about [TS]

  Mike Anthony which is you know a joke [TS]

  but like they're like this is this is [TS]

  there playing is asinine [TS]

  especially the bass and drum parts you [TS]

  know because the bass and drum parts to [TS]

  people who are used to hearing Ginger [TS]

  Baker like it was but it was no no don't [TS]

  don't don't don't [TS]

  yeah right yeah well picture I mean [TS]

  picture sabbah in 71 they were they were [TS]

  so weird and so dangerous was there a [TS]

  dumber looking I mean they looked like [TS]

  that if you saw them on if you saw Ozzy [TS]

  in a bar you would sit as far away from [TS]

  him as you could he was the deal was the [TS]

  big the archetypal dumb white northerner [TS]

  you know he just looks done it the [TS]

  fringe he's just looking at it just [TS]

  looks like the type of guys he looks [TS]

  like the type of guy that's gonna throw [TS]

  a pint glass over shortly he's like this [TS]

  is a guy has never made a good decision [TS]

  in his whole life his whole life Eric [TS]

  haircuts tattoos he has down the last he [TS]

  has ozzie tattooed on his knuckles [TS]

  finally probably isn't helping remember [TS]

  69 or whatever like right that was not a [TS]

  thing he did later that was that was his [TS]

  first statement to the world like raw [TS]

  ballsy see says right here [TS]

  Omaha Omaha like even in 1980 I fact [TS]

  there is exists far as I know there is [TS]

  exactly one video that I've seen of the [TS]

  crazy train in what looks like a [TS]

  cable-access studio and I guess he was [TS]

  pretty dried out mostly at this point is [TS]

  pretty tried out around but it is right [TS]

  that is lady by the Isley [TS]

  lady was fixing amount yeah but anyway [TS]

  and of course randy rhoads is from [TS]

  another planet but Ozzie even in 1980 he [TS]

  still looks like he has no idea what to [TS]

  do on stage it looks around and he walks [TS]

  around and he claps claps he looks [TS]

  nervous and request repeatedly that [TS]

  everyone go fucking crazy [TS]

  yeah stomps stomps is one foot and then [TS]

  walks over and then stomps his other [TS]

  foot maybe he looks like an autistic [TS]

  electrician he holds his hand up and [TS]

  then he remembers that that's the hand [TS]

  that he's holding the microphone haha [TS]

  he's like a rotten robbie singing i did [TS]

  i did i ever tell you she came to West [TS]

  High School yeah he tells a story and [TS]

  this is a clock this is a classically [TS]

  they went to the I he went to the other [TS]

  high school right the other school [TS]

  Randy Rhoads was in the band betrayed i [TS]

  was in my orange orange pants they were [TS]

  simulcasting from the vantage still so [TS]

  brokenhearted and that of course I've [TS]

  told you I told you my my my REM the DB [TS]

  story yeah that's terrible Jefferson [TS]

  like that point I Jefferson fuck stained [TS]

  with night ranger opening that's what i [TS]

  said fuck spain now that's an ox lots of [TS]

  punk-rock name haha Sabbath bloody [TS]

  Sabbath was a good record and I wish it [TS]

  had been produced different and real [TS]

  quick [TS]

  I don't have the drumsticks here but but [TS]

  you know what Allah especially in arcade [TS]

  to extend that need arises better but [TS]

  like actually I i'm not a giant Robert [TS]

  Chris calfan by any stretch even talk [TS]

  about self involved but his review of [TS]

  Zen arcade is is really funny says [TS]

  something like something like it's such [TS]

  a such activity here Bob blues guitar [TS]

  gathering dust between the amp and the [TS]

  speaker [TS]

  haha that's how i feel about every type [TS]

  of Sabbath bloody Sabbath and what could [TS]

  be a on the face of it a stupid or song [TS]

  a stupid or baseline it's like what is [TS]

  it like like e BB flat a something like [TS]

  it's something ridiculous like Bob blah [TS]

  blah but it's so good and then that [TS]

  breakdown [TS]

  sorry talk about music but the breakdown [TS]

  on that is like uh huh [TS]

  I love tennis that's probably my [TS]

  favorite black sabbath song the next [TS]

  record sabotage is where it starts to go [TS]

  off the rails and then after that it [TS]

  gets a little bit of what about having [TS]

  how you're always talking about this [TS]

  your family like heaven hell right i do [TS]

  I think heaven and hell I was a great [TS]

  food you and I almost argue about [TS]

  whether that's the best pound-for-pound [TS]

  Black Sabbath record which is probably [TS]

  not i no see there's that's on the list [TS]

  here [TS]

  the thing that reality is the best black [TS]

  sabbath record that's one sweet leaf [TS]

  yes but wow you know the first the first [TS]

  time Eric course and audition for the [TS]

  long winters name [TS]

  I've told this story where he shows up [TS]

  with a five-state he showed up with a it [TS]

  denotes a base and I said how did you [TS]

  learn the song so we'll have an acoustic [TS]

  guitar that's five strings on it and I [TS]

  said okay great that's and became knows [TS]

  this one with rose and he showed up and [TS]

  so I i we had a base there i had it's [TS]

  like a base bench and I gave him two I [TS]

  gave him two songs to learn and he [TS]

  played them flawlessly and I was like [TS]

  well great [TS]

  that was pretty cool why don't you go [TS]

  home learn the rest of the record come [TS]

  back in a week or two and we'll rehearse [TS]

  again he was like oh I mean I noted i [TS]

  learned other solutions and began how he [TS]

  had already learned i'm like when you [TS]

  learn the other songs you've only had [TS]

  the record for two days and he was like [TS]

  yeah and so that's Derek course [TS]

  information he proceeds to play the [TS]

  entire outer entire first long winters [TS]

  record flawless [TS]

  can I on the base and you know he's [TS]

  never played a pic didn't have a base [TS]

  when he learned and he learned on the [TS]

  guitar and I'm like okay kid that's [TS]

  pretty impressive [TS]

  having never played a base until you're [TS]

  on national TV [TS]

  you must have appreciated i did and i [TS]

  was like you know that's that's ok you [TS]

  know that'll do pig and then we started [TS]

  just like we're we're we're kind of we [TS]

  don't know what to do next we played all [TS]

  the songs a couple of times through and [TS]

  then we start I just I I think I'd i [TS]

  just picked out sweet leaf on the guitar [TS]

  and the band kind of picks up the the [TS]

  jam and and [TS]

  was they were simple enough chords that [TS]

  that a sports John Nelson and Chris [TS]

  camellia could manage to find something [TS]

  to do on their respective keyboard [TS]

  I'm we and you know and Michael [TS]

  Schilling are our former drummer was a [TS]

  big Sabbath fan so we start rocking out [TS]

  and courses just rocking the baseline of [TS]

  sweetly obviously not that hard but [TS]

  that's where you really shine Ringo [TS]

  Ringo is parts were not always crazy [TS]

  shine on the simple stuff [TS]

  yeah and so he and showing for mislikes [TS]

  apathy backbone and I'm like this kid is [TS]

  incredible i mean he he looks like [TS]

  somebody's dirty pile of laundry like it [TS]

  looks he looks like a free pile at the [TS]

  at the bottom of a dorm [TS]

  yeah but it looks like yeah this haircut [TS]

  looks like they came from the bars lost [TS]

  and found [TS]

  yeah but he is nailing this and we get [TS]

  to the end of it and I'm like wow dude [TS]

  you know kid you've got the job Sabbath [TS]

  fan you learned all the records here are [TS]

  you learned about the long winters [TS]

  record and you know any you know Sabbath [TS]

  your you've got the gig and he looks at [TS]

  me he goes Moses said and I said yeah [TS]

  sweetleaf we did the whole song like I [TS]

  saying it [TS]

  we did the whole time he was like oh [TS]

  yeah just displaying alone he just he [TS]

  just intuitive it's because really it is [TS]

  intuitive what they're going to do next [TS]

  but he didn't he what did not know that [TS]

  that's what we were playing he just [TS]

  played it I stares at the moment that I [TS]

  would always enjoy and i suspect i don't [TS]

  know i doubt you enjoyed as much as I [TS]

  did and matter because it wasn't just [TS]

  sound checks it was I get some no it [TS]

  wasn't the show's it was during [TS]

  soundcheck but sometimes completely [TS]

  apropos of nothing as you know Eric and [TS]

  nabeel would suddenly burst into like a [TS]

  perfect note-for-note spirit of heat [TS]

  yeah they would do it three shows [TS]

  something particularly in Europe [TS]

  sometimes when what I when going doing [TS]

  that when I would talk too long and I'd [TS]

  be like listen here's the problem with [TS]

  Denmark do you want to know the problem [TS]

  with Denmark i'm gonna break it down for [TS]

  you here at large [TS]

  it was like the spirit of radio and I'd [TS]

  be like alright alright [TS]

  ok now we're rush rush for a minute they [TS]

  would bring you out it was was not you [TS]

  know when you're younger you do you do [TS]

  silly things and laws by 1819 just have [TS]

  to just after high school and in my gap [TS]

  year and I I was hanging out with my [TS]

  ex-girlfriend and my pal and we stayed [TS]

  up all night just being stupid and [TS]

  probably taken vibrant and we were all [TS]

  at the same time with only got no you do [TS]

  we should try to clearwater beach for [TS]

  the sunrise and so we can see where this [TS]

  is going we literally got into his his [TS]

  car and drove you know 45 minutes to [TS]

  clear water and it was just gorgeous [TS]

  watching the Sun come up behind our [TS]

  backs because we have forgotten that we [TS]

  were on the west coast of florida up [TS]

  I don't know I die tomorrow I would 51 [TS]

  man-boy i could put down some fire [TS]

  before i discovered a federation took it [TS]

  to the next level [TS]

  yeah you know I discovered reading that [TS]

  Bob move that biography I knew I knew [TS]

  mostly secondhand in some cases [TS]

  firsthand about you know the stories [TS]

  about them but i always assumed that [TS]

  they were you know taking like whatever [TS]

  the dream I thought the I thought that [TS]

  they were taking I had always hear the [TS]

  day they took a lot of speed land speed [TS]

  record is called that for a reason not a [TS]

  great record but in my opinion but but [TS]

  you know I had always heard that [TS]

  especially bob was taken a lot of speed [TS]

  turns out turns out trucker speed he was [TS]

  popping ephedrine just like me boom punk [TS]

  i look at that you are punk rock oh my [TS]

  god I knew that all along but now that a [TS]

  doctor ticket it to another level [TS]

  yeah but you dr. feelgood got done [TS]

  little stands late watch me show you to [TS]

  review good could you do me like going [TS]

  to feel good when i talk about a shitty [TS]

  band something but then things got [TS]

  Simpson said around that guy playing a [TS]

  100 guitar riffs all in a row even like [TS]

  that and i loved it but he got [TS]

  the eighties any through in like 4 a-4 [TS]

  uh Motley Crue tunes in a row 10 or a [TS]

  couple of nights at least a couple in a [TS]

  row and then he came back to them later [TS]

  and it was like dude you're is that way [TS]

  she's that's what she chose to highlight [TS]

  you chose to do like four bars of a [TS]

  cream song and then you did like three [TS]

  formerly croissants yeah but if that was [TS]

  it that was you're a tease then I'm [TS]

  sorry [TS]

  and my crew is like the perfect thing of [TS]

  now I i should do this for a living I [TS]

  really should you should you should have [TS]

  you should have a podcast where somebody [TS]

  just names an album who and then just [TS]

  for that Stacy look we just try a couple [TS]

  guide 23 just shoot me want to see what [TS]

  I can do [TS]

  uh the guess who um no I Wow Stan you [TS]

  guess who that was that the baby and [TS]

  seen nothing yet [TS]

  uh well no that was so yeah I was [TS]

  bachmann from bachman-turner overdrive [TS]

  they stopped over driving [TS]

  yeah and we like Randy Randy Bachman he [TS]

  left the he left the guess who because [TS]

  he said they just wanted to party and [TS]

  they didn't want to work I was listening [TS]

  to American woman the other day which is [TS]

  a tune that is that has entered into the [TS]

  land of cliche [TS]

  so it seems like they're on the devil [TS]

  horns it's really it's yes absolutely [TS]

  but i was listening to it on a on one [TS]

  you know sometimes you you're listening [TS]

  to a tune on an unfamiliar stereo and [TS]

  you hear the mix differently and I heard [TS]

  two things really profoundly one for [TS]

  most of the track the band is really not [TS]

  in sync at all it's a it's that it's [TS]

  that era of like good enough it's very [TS]

  floppy a little bit but the river but [TS]

  like nobody's really tight with each [TS]

  other but those those drum breaks down [TS]

  and are now to pop down and nap you hear [TS]

  the room in those in the emptiness is [TS]

  arrested man shut the fuck up for a [TS]

  minute yeah and you hear you here like [TS]

  it the squeak of his of his kick pedal [TS]

  or whatever [TS]

  and-and-and I was suddenly drawn back [TS]

  into the tune because it was no longer a [TS]

  it was no longer like a cliché that [TS]

  made it unlistenable I was hearing the I [TS]

  was hearing the early seventies late [TS]

  sixties recording technology i was [TS]

  hearing these guys write this classic [TS]

  tune in there and you bring it into the [TS]

  studio like let's do this one and it was [TS]

  fun again like it was it was fun to hear [TS]

  it was like listening to those beetles [TS]

  mixes where you're like oh my god when [TS]

  you can hear the carpet Russell there [TS]

  was a it was it i mean if you can find [TS]

  something new and interesting to hear in [TS]

  American woman i will put in with you [TS]

  but it was there but I Steppenwolf I [TS]

  went through a heavy Steppenwolf [TS]

  phase-in in the it right about that time [TS]

  when I was trying to figure out maybe [TS]

  Jethro Tull's my band this I and there [TS]

  is that what you decide [TS]

  I decided no I for one day I was driving [TS]

  around super baked in my car with my [TS]

  friend Peter no sack and we were [TS]

  listening to Jethro Tull because Peter [TS]

  had this really like unusual music taste [TS]

  his favorite band was the talking heads [TS]

  but he also loved the doors and he would [TS]

  show up sometimes in like Jethro Tull [TS]

  what do you think about this and put it [TS]

  you know put the tape in and we drive [TS]

  around and I was a baked and I was like [TS]

  a throat all yes why have I not given [TS]

  these guys they're due [TS]

  Jethro Tull is my new band at last [TS]

  listen this business into this flu and [TS]

  then you know it lasted about a day and [TS]

  then the next day I heard that I was [TS]

  like oh bye guys just baked [TS]

  but I went through a Steppenwolf phase [TS]

  at that same time and actually saw [TS]

  Steppenwolf least their son john k and [TS]

  stepping johnk Steppenwolf right I saw [TS]

  them on their first reunion tour this [TS]

  would have been 86 probably they played [TS]

  they played a bar in Anchorage called [TS]

  the grand central station and we all [TS]

  went and it was cool and amazing when [TS]

  you think about it john kay was probably [TS]

  39 or something you know like 1986 it [TS]

  wasn't that far off [TS]

  he probably was 35 we were like this [TS]

  guy's really old he's coming out of [TS]

  retirement and and we listened to [TS]

  Steppenwolf all that summer and it was [TS]

  great [TS]

  drinking party music like psychedelic [TS]

  party music so I was Proust up a woman [TS]

  and that stuff actually if you was in a [TS]

  deep deep Steppenwolf Steppenwolf [TS]

  Steppenwolf i don't know i didn't know [TS]

  step of a deep cuts that you have the [TS]

  funds are very rarely if you sit down [TS]

  there you drive into the valley into the [TS]

  deep aor cuts [TS]

  yeah it's not like listening to be to [TS]

  the flipside of inner got a video where [TS]

  they have three or four songs and you're [TS]

  like okay it's like listening to you [TS]

  know i have like four copies of any [TS]

  gotta betta on vinyl [TS]

  I don't know how I don't I mean I know [TS]

  how I have one but I don't know how I [TS]

  have to excuse you occasionally throw it [TS]

  at the law [TS]

  I think it's because some at one point I [TS]

  wanted to have four turntables all four [TS]

  copies going at once just for copies of [TS]

  inner got to beat it all started like 30 [TS]

  seconds apart [TS]

  that sounds like a flaming lips [TS]

  experiment right we should do that we [TS]

  should do that in a parking garage in [TS]

  San Francisco [TS]

  I'm going to pick up my kid I got [TS]

  nothing [TS]

  god dammit i love music I know you do we [TS]

  should do with music podcast I mean we [TS]

  we filter it in like Hitler through [TS]

  Roderick on the line but you could do a [TS]

  music podcast that blew people's minds [TS]

  as long as you know it wasn't about [TS]

  guess who [TS]

  if I had named any banned from 1976 on [TS]

  you could have gone off like a rocket [TS]

  oh yeah I mean I i really like any band [TS]

  68 or any like you know what I i also [TS]

  like the idea I I don't love that word [TS]

  mean but she should always say like that [TS]

  but um I'm always liked the idea of [TS]

  trying to generate this like what it's [TS]

  like there was a fake wikipedia page 45 [TS]

  years about this fake war like I am sure [TS]

  about that wikipedia pages set for five [TS]

  years about a fake or no [TS]

  yeah I made it past the editors for five [TS]

  years but i always liked the idea of [TS]

  trying to generate like a new [TS]

  catchphrase that literally meant nothing [TS]

  my hell yeah I am my friend Marla in [TS]

  college was was trying to get us all to [TS]

  start using didn't tale isn't something [TS]

  that you would carry water in and and [TS]

  the the way using a minute that is so [TS]

  pale so pale that it's bucket and then I [TS]

  started really liking it and actually [TS]

  use it man that's that's a hundred [TS]

  percent bucket and I think we should do [TS]

  that with the guess who I think we [TS]

  should get people to to to really feel [TS]

  like now lets everyone to todd rundgren [TS]

  produce them right the guess who think [TS]

  so [TS]

  a lot but I i bet you're right no hmm [TS]

  he's got crazy hair nowadays run grip [TS]

  here you know XTC came around on skype [TS]

  setting that you know they were pissed [TS]

  as hell they felt they feel like they [TS]

  got Phil Spector by him to get let it be [TS]

  where like they had skylarking and it's [TS]

  a bunch of really good songs and then he [TS]

  did all that business he like was like [TS]

  ok these tracks and he went [TS]

  that business with kind of putting it [TS]

  all together into like a song cycle and [TS]

  on and departures was pissed when that [TS]

  record came out I loved it and [TS]

  apparently now they come around they [TS]

  really black sabbath their way into [TS]

  liking it now which I think it you know [TS]

  good on any Partridge do it on any part [TS]

  i'm super glad to hear it because I [TS]

  think that's a great record fantastic [TS]

  record [TS]

  yeah I like oranges and lemons too i [TS]

  like i like them I like them a panic [TS]

  attacks on stage and the stage fright [TS]

  I don't ever tell you about the time I [TS]

  saw him in a train station [TS]

  no um I was in my day I want to hear [TS]

  this [TS]

  um I was in the train station [TS]

  I think your picture 1976 opposing I [TS]

  didn't even sniffing blue pacific blue [TS]

  and eating automobile tires for three [TS]

  days I was not in a good place i was the [TS]

  Reading Festival and I was in bath [TS]

  england which is down the train line [TS]

  from reading is pulling out silly i was [TS]

  in i was in pok pok mark on meat pie and [TS]

  I had gone there because my my mother's [TS]

  maiden name is pretty and there's a town [TS]

  in the mendip hills of England called [TS]

  pretty and I hitchhiked there to see [TS]

  this little town which is really just [TS]

  like it's just a maypole and a bar and a [TS]

  church in a cemetery and send like [TS]

  10,000 sheet [TS]

  ok so i went to pretty and and is I you [TS]

  know I had a beer in the bar and i slept [TS]

  slept overnight in some guys Volkswagen [TS]

  in a in a car park and then the next day [TS]

  I was like I'm not hitchhiking back out [TS]

  of this place there's no one here took [TS]

  me all day to hitchhike down there [TS]

  so what did i do no no I got a guy a guy [TS]

  in a mini drove me back to bath and I [TS]

  was going to take the train to London [TS]

  but it was the Reading Festival and I [TS]

  didn't know about it at the time [TS]

  IM at the baths transportation I'm just [TS]

  there with a bunch of salary men like [TS]

  like the English guys with with the [TS]

  umbrellas and and a bowler hats waiting [TS]

  for the train and I looked down the [TS]

  train platform and there's andy [TS]

  partridge and it's just me a bunch of [TS]

  lumber shoots and then andy partridge [TS]

  and andy partridge isn't his eyes are [TS]

  darting around with the train platform [TS]

  is fidgeting and nervous and looking [TS]

  everywhere to see if anybody recognizes [TS]

  him and I'm behind like these guys in it [TS]

  in suits and I'm way down the platform [TS]

  and i'm watching him and he's looking [TS]

  around he's looking to the left is [TS]

  looking to the right look like he's [TS]

  think he's something that's something he [TS]

  doesn't want something he definitely [TS]

  doesn't want [TS]

  he's like he's like please nobody [TS]

  recognized me please nobody recognized [TS]

  me and he's looking but he can't stop [TS]

  looking around like if you just let me [TS]

  just saturday sat down invention and [TS]

  open a newspaper he would have been fine [TS]

  he looks like a nearsighted but I mean [TS]

  he's very easy to pick out of a crowd [TS]

  yeah he was killed was extremely [TS]

  conspicuous but nobody was recognizing [TS]

  him because it was just a bunch of [TS]

  normals and he's looking around looking [TS]

  around and I'm low i'm watching him and [TS]

  then he looks over and he sees me [TS]

  looking at him and he snaps front like [TS]

  like now he's staring across the [TS]

  opposite train platform pretending that [TS]

  he didn't just see me yeah and I'm [TS]

  looking at him now and he is like dr. [TS]

  Donna I I'm huh haha [TS]

  and then he looks over and i'm still [TS]

  looking at him and he turns and runs [TS]

  haha I giving any party's ever run well [TS]

  I mean like muscles it off the train [TS]

  platform and out of the station like the [TS]

  idea to him at the time 1986 the idea of [TS]

  him i guess this was 80 this woman later [TS]

  this was 88 the idea of sharing a train [TS]

  with somebody who had because I would [TS]

  have been in a different car when I was [TS]

  only Dale that was it just failed he and [TS]

  i think it looked to me at the time like [TS]

  he [TS]

  was experimenting with maybe i'll take [TS]

  the train and he got that far and was [TS]

  like nope can't do it and I don't know [TS]

  what I mean he must have gone and hailed [TS]

  a taxi or something it gets a [TS]

  agoraphobia [TS]

  yeah I think he's he's afraid of rabbits [TS]

  [Music] [TS]