Roderick on the Line

◼   ► this episode of Roderick on the line is [TS]

◼   ► sponsored by slack the messaging app for [TS]

◼   ► teams slack consolidates all your work [TS]

◼   ► communications into one place makes them [TS]

◼   ► instantly searchable and available on [TS]

◼   ► any device slack is free to use for as [TS]

◼   ► long as you want with as many users as [TS]

◼   ► you want start using slack today by [TS]

◼   ► visiting slack calm / supertrain [TS]

◼   ► [Music] [TS]

◼   ► beep-boop-beep-boop-beep more was going [TS]

◼   ► but I'll wallet [TS]

◼   ► it's going good at it's going great [TS]

◼   ► yeah how so good so good I was just uh I [TS]

◼   ► was just listening to some hold music [TS]

◼   ► and the whole music was maybe the best [TS]

◼   ► most appropriate hold music I'd ever [TS]

◼   ► heard in all the years [TS]

◼   ► what's that it was one lonely violin [TS]

◼   ► playing a kind of gypsy funeral music [TS]

◼   ► that's a very interesting choice you [TS]

◼   ► know and so often now you got to get on [TS]

◼   ► hold music and it's just like school or [TS]

◼   ► some terrible thing I never understood [TS]

◼   ► that and this was like just one violin [TS]

◼   ► just like 12 ya somethin mournful super [TS]

◼   ► mournful kva city is standing on the [TS]

◼   ► roof of his general just playing this [TS]

◼   ► scenario [TS]

◼   ► single by Lynn and I was just like this [TS]

◼   ► is the greatest and it was kind of hero [TS]

◼   ► was all scratchy old system was like why [TS]

◼   ► aren't all why isn't all hold music like [TS]

◼   ► this i just i seriously want this it's [TS]

◼   ► it is important with my mood [TS]

◼   ► yeah I mean I there's so much about [TS]

◼   ► holes under must be reasonably is the [TS]

◼   ► way that they do but like there's seems [TS]

◼   ► like there's these worst practices of [TS]

◼   ► things were like you know the the [TS]

◼   ► ultimately as the person who's on the [TS]

◼   ► phone [TS]

◼   ► ideally you want to speak as quickly as [TS]

◼   ► possible but if you can't speak as [TS]

◼   ► quickly as possible [TS]

◼   ► it's nice to be able to like do other [TS]

◼   ► stuff or you know so you know I the [TS]

◼   ► thing is what drives me crazy especially [TS]

◼   ► if you're on like without the comcast [TS]

◼   ► company is it breaks in here click and [TS]

◼   ► you'll go take a speaker wherever we go [TS]

◼   ► and get here click and then the music [TS]

◼   ► stops and they go into an ad [TS]

◼   ► yeah where you know so I mean I almost [TS]

◼   ► feel like I wish they would just have [TS]

◼   ► some kind of a tone or 70 [TS]

◼   ► the wrong approach but then also like [TS]

◼   ► you say systems are so shitty [TS]

◼   ► everything's all like jumping if it was [TS]

◼   ► good music it would sound like the worst [TS]

◼   ► am radio like inside of a fish tank [TS]

◼   ► right yeah and the the phone tree system [TS]

◼   ► that i just tried to navigate said you [TS]

◼   ► know for one press of for English press [TS]

◼   ► one side best one said for for the thing [TS]

◼   ► you're not interested in press one for [TS]

◼   ► the thing you're not interested in also [TS]

◼   ► press two for the thing you are [TS]

◼   ► interested in press three [TS]

◼   ► so I press three they said for the the [TS]

◼   ► permutation of the thing that you are [TS]

◼   ► interested in that you're not interested [TS]

◼   ► in press one for the permutation of the [TS]

◼   ► thing that you are interested in that [TS]

◼   ► you're not interested in press two for [TS]

◼   ► the permutation you are interested in [TS]

◼   ► press three and press three [TS]

◼   ► but it's like stuff you should have [TS]

◼   ► already been going to be there because [TS]

◼   ► you've already dismissed that [TS]

◼   ► yeah right and here we go and was so and [TS]

◼   ► I do that three or four times and then I [TS]

◼   ► get an A and finally the recorded [TS]

◼   ► message says for the thing for the exact [TS]

◼   ► reason that you are calling press one [TS]

◼   ► and I'm like here we go and i pressed [TS]

◼   ► one and it gave me a minute long [TS]

◼   ► recording of a voice telling me [TS]

◼   ► everything that I already knew and [TS]

◼   ► couldn't have been to this place in [TS]

◼   ► their phone tree without knowing right [TS]

◼   ► and then at the end of the phone miss at [TS]

◼   ► the end of that message there was no [TS]

◼   ► further option to progress to the next [TS]

◼   ► level so it was basically made it to an [TS]

◼   ► announcement [TS]

◼   ► it was the ultimate may I made it here [TS]

◼   ► to an announcement that is reading from [TS]

◼   ► a powerpoint demonstration of God and a [TS]

◼   ► powerpoint demonstration of how to how [TS]

◼   ► to have be the most basic and and then [TS]

◼   ► it was just like to repeat this press [TS]

◼   ► one to go back to the menu and so at [TS]

◼   ► that point all you can do is go operator [TS]

◼   ► operator operator 000 right and I [TS]

◼   ► normally do that with without even [TS]

◼   ► listening to the first thing but today I [TS]

◼   ► felt generous i was like i'm gonna [TS]

◼   ► follow this poetry although i'm going to [TS]

◼   ► go up into the highest branches of this [TS]

◼   ► tree where the view will be spectacular [TS]

◼   ► we're part of it i think about like when [TS]

◼   ► you're trying to write something long or [TS]

◼   ► when you're dealing with a big project [TS]

◼   ► I mean with me like for example trying [TS]

◼   ► to write that book a few years ago I was [TS]

◼   ► constantly torn between these two [TS]

◼   ► impulses there was the one impulse to [TS]

◼   ► just make make make new stuff which is I [TS]

◼   ► think the good impulse when you're [TS]

◼   ► drafting then there's the other impulse [TS]

◼   ► which is like yeah but you should also [TS]

◼   ► keep outlining and reviewing what you've [TS]

◼   ► done already not revising but like is [TS]

◼   ► this compulsion of like feeling like I [TS]

◼   ► have to make sure that this is going to [TS]

◼   ► make sense with what I've already done [TS]

◼   ► and I wonder if influential like that [TS]

◼   ► you take that model and spread across [TS]

◼   ► different business units and you have [TS]

◼   ► different people contributing different [TS]

◼   ► parts to the tree and there's not [TS]

◼   ► anybody who's project managing how [TS]

◼   ► sensible it is to hear something a given [TS]

◼   ► point and maybe it's not totally up to [TS]

◼   ► date you know what I mean yes I can see [TS]

◼   ► that really in a large even in a [TS]

◼   ► specially medium-sized corporation i [TS]

◼   ► would say we wouldn't have dedicated [TS]

◼   ► resources I can I could see that [TS]

◼   ► happening [TS]

◼   ► well I know it's like I think it's [TS]

◼   ► analogous to the way that we misuse the [TS]

◼   ► police in the sense that what if we have [TS]

◼   ► a problem in our town and you don't know [TS]

◼   ► how to solve it you send the police [TS]

◼   ► right even though the police are not [TS]

◼   ► problem solvers really they're not [TS]

◼   ► that's not the problem solving unit of [TS]

◼   ► the city have thought about that that's [TS]

◼   ► interesting that's interesting in like [TS]

◼   ► the police are really useful in certain [TS]

◼   ► ways but they are not the like we did [TS]

◼   ► they're not the psychology team to go [TS]

◼   ► out to figure out what somebody's why [TS]

◼   ► somebody's yelling right and in in [TS]

◼   ► business [TS]

◼   ► it seems like the engineers are the [TS]

◼   ► people that they send to solve a lot of [TS]

◼   ► problems right send the engineers and [TS]

◼   ► the engineers are you know they're [TS]

◼   ► they're like the police they're very [TS]

◼   ► good at at doing the thing that they do [TS]

◼   ► but they are you know they're not the [TS]

◼   ► ones that you send in to do just to [TS]

◼   ► check to see if a normal person can [TS]

◼   ► figure out your project if a normal [TS]

◼   ► person who isn't who has no inside [TS]

◼   ► knowledge is going to show up at the [TS]

◼   ► front door [TS]

◼   ► look for the doorbell yeah and you know [TS]

◼   ► in the engineers like well there isn't a [TS]

◼   ► doorbell clearly what you need to do at [TS]

◼   ► that point is to you know retina scan or [TS]

◼   ► whatever it's like the persons looking [TS]

◼   ► for the doorbell can't find it right and [TS]

◼   ► that you know and that disconnect where [TS]

◼   ► businesses don't you know and like every [TS]

◼   ► business [TS]

◼   ► should hire a squad of normals right [TS]

◼   ► there should be like team normal wear [TS]

◼   ► those people are constantly kept totally [TS]

◼   ► in the dark about your about the product [TS]

◼   ► your business makes everything and how [TS]

◼   ► it's made and how it's made and then but [TS]

◼   ► they are the like they are the final the [TS]

◼   ► final test and it's not like testers [TS]

◼   ► they actually belong to their they are [TS]

◼   ► they're part of your business and you [TS]

◼   ► just unleash your stuff on them write [TS]

◼   ► something a little bit [TS]

◼   ► unbuttons the wrong word but it's [TS]

◼   ► somebody who's there specifically to [TS]

◼   ► find what's broken about what you're [TS]

◼   ► doing [TS]

◼   ► I'm not just a tester but somebody in [TS]

◼   ► that case and I'm actually that someone [TS]

◼   ► like testing now that I hear those words [TS]

◼   ► but it's somebody's job it is to [TS]

◼   ► advocate for the the busy and confused [TS]

◼   ► person [TS]

◼   ► yeah right now if you're I guess what [TS]

◼   ► you have to do is you have to imagine [TS]

◼   ► and this is the thing that that happens [TS]

◼   ► so infrequently in the way that we [TS]

◼   ► design things it's like imagine the [TS]

◼   ► person not just your imagine the user [TS]

◼   ► right but like imagine a user who has no [TS]

◼   ► who doesn't even know they want to use [TS]

◼   ► your product who doesn't who you know [TS]

◼   ► imagine the user who's showing up there [TS]

◼   ► with like a crying baby whose doesn't [TS]

◼   ► exactly what i was thinking you know [TS]

◼   ► it's exact was just thinking of having [TS]

◼   ► to hold a crying baby and use the phone [TS]

◼   ► with one hand right when you totally [TS]

◼   ► self-absorbed position to take but those [TS]

◼   ► are the times I felt most acutely this [TS]

◼   ► was never designed to work in this [TS]

◼   ► situation and this is when I really [TS]

◼   ► needed to work right but here's the [TS]

◼   ► thing here's one you ready for this [TS]

◼   ► never have any device this happens with [TS]

◼   ► bluetooth speakers have lots of never [TS]

◼   ► have any device in the world that makes [TS]

◼   ► a noise when you turn it off like a car [TS]

◼   ► should not make a noise when it's locked [TS]

◼   ► that was a baby and it's just [TS]

◼   ► unnecessary have a bluetooth speaker my [TS]

◼   ► shower that makes a blue when you shut [TS]

◼   ► it off [TS]

◼   ► I was never aware of how many things [TS]

◼   ► make a noise when you turn them off [TS]

◼   ► until I had a kid I was trying to get to [TS]

◼   ► sleep you can get a use case you think [TS]

◼   ► they're saying goodbye is that is that [TS]

◼   ► what the the concept is like well the [TS]

◼   ► one they turn it off we should we should [TS]

◼   ► set to give them one last salutation [TS]

◼   ► right i think it's probably part of a [TS]

◼   ► certain kind of customer service [TS]

◼   ► experience where like you know it used [TS]

◼   ► to be that felt like a sign of status [TS]

◼   ► that your car made a bloop you know only [TS]

◼   ► douchebags and rich kids had those [TS]

◼   ► at one time and so once that became now [TS]

◼   ► you were kinda like when you're you know [TS]

◼   ► for doesn't matter whatever like you [TS]

◼   ► feel like you're a big shot up the ramp [TS]

◼   ► yeah i'll answer Maryland especially [TS]

◼   ► with speakers though I think it's a [TS]

◼   ► confluence of two annoying things which [TS]

◼   ► is on the one hand like this my [TS]

◼   ► bluetooth speaker in the shower [TS]

◼   ► it's just speaker on a suction cup is [TS]

◼   ► water resistant water proof nominally [TS]

◼   ► but it's very very cheap was like nine [TS]

◼   ► dollars and I and like what you couldn't [TS]

◼   ► do with good interface you need to cover [TS]

◼   ► you need to do some house so for example [TS]

◼   ► there's a light that blinks the entire [TS]

◼   ► time that's on which makes me a little [TS]

◼   ► bit crazy and then it makes a blue one [TS]

◼   ► blue please turn on what we turn off [TS]

◼   ► that's how lets you know right yeah I i [TS]

◼   ► was sort of side question yes speaker [TS]

◼   ► with a suction cup on it [TS]

◼   ► have you ever sitting in the bath [TS]

◼   ► suction-cupped the speaker to your self [TS]

◼   ► now you know when it's a great question [TS]

◼   ► if i were a little younger I think that [TS]

◼   ► would probably one of the first or [TS]

◼   ► second things like I did not like [TS]

◼   ► selection couple things to myself you [TS]

◼   ► know I'm gonna like turn it up and see [TS]

◼   ► like our fields all right it would be [TS]

◼   ► like yeah you really going to be a [TS]

◼   ► haptic right you really feel the music [TS]

◼   ► you feelin not happen but you feel the [TS]

◼   ► music in your head now like your [TS]

◼   ► your-your-your there in the shower [TS]

◼   ► let's see being kind of high-end trying [TS]

◼   ► that Alex suction cup the speaker to [TS]

◼   ► yourself and then you're like while [TS]

◼   ► you're waiting on hold pretty you know I [TS]

◼   ► can I I imagined that I would ultimately [TS]

◼   ► have to try that [TS]

◼   ► yeah you know the other thing is I I [TS]

◼   ► like what you said though about the [TS]

◼   ► police being like the engineers being [TS]

◼   ► like the police [TS]

◼   ► mmm i think there's there's a lot in [TS]

◼   ► common there but i think there's another [TS]

◼   ► two different poor impulses with the [TS]

◼   ► police maybe for me I kind of feel like [TS]

◼   ► they become my surrogate dad were like [TS]

◼   ► if I felt like I've done everything I [TS]

◼   ► can to ask control threaten and it still [TS]

◼   ► doesn't work out or I'm annoyed you know [TS]

◼   ► I tried to do this anymore but you end [TS]

◼   ► up calling the police today coming to [TS]

◼   ► take care of this thing like you you [TS]

◼   ► should you're gonna you go to the cold [TS]

◼   ► police you're making the noise [TS]

◼   ► yeah in with engineers i have a feeling [TS]

◼   ► the impulse is more practical of like [TS]

◼   ► well these nerves are going to have to [TS]

◼   ► be the ones who you know do this anyway [TS]

◼   ► let's just give it straight to them [TS]

◼   ► uh-oh [TS]

◼   ► you know and I'm nothing against you [TS]

◼   ► know engineering it's like it's it's [TS]

◼   ► such a misunderstood and difficult job [TS]

◼   ► but you know it's it's likely say you [TS]

◼   ► know don't don't put the guy who claims [TS]

◼   ► that cleans up after the elephants in [TS]

◼   ► charge of who's allowed to be in the [TS]

◼   ► parade because he's going to have a very [TS]

◼   ► specific point of view but I I feel like [TS]

◼   ► I feel like this there are there are [TS]

◼   ► products and there are things that we [TS]

◼   ► interact with that are that are purely [TS]

◼   ► for pleasure right that we you know like [TS]

◼   ► a guitar for instance you very seldom [TS]

◼   ► sit down pick up a guitar and go oh god [TS]

◼   ► I hate this guitar i just have to deal [TS]

◼   ► with it right now right and there are [TS]

◼   ► lots of things in our world [TS]

◼   ► oh yeah that are in that category just [TS]

◼   ► like I I just can't wait to get alone [TS]

◼   ► with this thing but most of the products [TS]

◼   ► that we are being sold now and most of [TS]

◼   ► the the way design works now the [TS]

◼   ► presumption of everybody a presumption [TS]

◼   ► of the people making the thing are like [TS]

◼   ► okay are you ready to sit down with your [TS]

◼   ► epson eps XP 400s and really get into [TS]

◼   ► this experience of working with this you [TS]

◼   ► know we're going to give you like a [TS]

◼   ► screen that has a sunset on it it's [TS]

◼   ► going to say hi to you right you're [TS]

◼   ► going it's going to give you my [TS]

◼   ► microwave microwave when it goes off it [TS]

◼   ► scrolls and leds enjoy your meal haha [TS]

◼   ► right and so insulting i don't want to [TS]

◼   ► been applying its greeting me and start [TS]

◼   ► your day I Antonio Berlin come back i'm [TS]

◼   ► talking to you you know and this this [TS]

◼   ► concept of like I mean ninety percent of [TS]

◼   ► the things that I interact within the [TS]

◼   ► day I but my met my attitude about it is [TS]

◼   ► I don't really want to be here [TS]

◼   ► interacting with you I just have to get [TS]

◼   ► through this process please can you just [TS]

◼   ► make it as simple as absolutely and so [TS]

◼   ► you walk up to the ATM and they're like [TS]

◼   ► hi would you like to hang out with me [TS]

◼   ► the ATM machine let's let's chat about [TS]

◼   ► you know it's just like up yours [TS]

◼   ► up yours bank up yours machine up yours [TS]

◼   ► programmer up yours everybody just give [TS]

◼   ► me the like basic and and that and that [TS]

◼   ► the idea that the the nicest thing that [TS]

◼   ► these people could do [TS]

◼   ► who are designing these things is [TS]

◼   ► designed it so that you so that is [TS]

◼   ► invisible and then it does not assert [TS]

◼   ► itself right because you are standing [TS]

◼   ► there not only with the crying baby but [TS]

◼   ► somewhere else to be [TS]

◼   ► you don't nobody goes to the ATM machine [TS]

◼   ► like I can't you know what later on [TS]

◼   ► today after i'm done with my work and I [TS]

◼   ► really need the money but I just enjoy [TS]

◼   ► the experience [TS]

◼   ► yeah i'm gonna change into something [TS]

◼   ► comfortable and just go down and fucking [TS]

◼   ► chat with me taking fucking language and [TS]

◼   ► just hang out man i'm gonna i'm gonna [TS]

◼   ► call up some phone trees pick a language [TS]

◼   ► maybe i'll pick it maybe i'll pick in [TS]

◼   ► the language that isn't mine and just [TS]

◼   ► listen to what it says in a different [TS]

◼   ► language and and I see that so I mean [TS]

◼   ► like every copier I've bought in the [TS]

◼   ► last however long you know which is a [TS]

◼   ► lot more copies than I ever should have [TS]

◼   ► had to Bonnie photocopiers photocopier [TS]

◼   ► zat Arras multifunction printers that's [TS]

◼   ► right there are also yes scanners and [TS]

◼   ► also you know can do a thousand other [TS]

◼   ► things and every one of them is just is [TS]

◼   ► just like at a loss leader pyramid [TS]

◼   ► scheme to sell overpriced cartridges [TS]

◼   ► right right that our thing that would [TS]

◼   ► work just like somebody was like what if [TS]

◼   ► we made ink out of bb's and each one of [TS]

◼   ► those babies cost a dollar [TS]

◼   ► like that's a for that is a visit that [TS]

◼   ► sounds like apples cloud right that [TS]

◼   ► sounds like a thing that we can just [TS]

◼   ► charge people it's just it's the [TS]

◼   ► ultimate it's the ultimate Remora the [TS]

◼   ► ultimate steal that Celia and so I you [TS]

◼   ► know how many printers are bought and i [TS]

◼   ► think half the printers i bought our [TS]

◼   ► because the their predecessor i threw [TS]

◼   ► out a window and every one of these are [TS]

◼   ► blind and then we've got it can can look [TS]

◼   ► at work with cloud-based printing which [TS]

◼   ► is really cool [TS]

◼   ► need some help but just even going in to [TS]

◼   ► enter the Wi-Fi password have a pretty [TS]

◼   ► good Wi-Fi password about you doing in [TS]

◼   ► and entering that using an up and down [TS]

◼   ► arrow to choose a letter capital no [TS]

◼   ► lower case number character [TS]

◼   ► I mean seriously and then of course does [TS]

◼   ► the whole likes high security thing [TS]

◼   ► where it doesn't you see what you've [TS]

◼   ► already typed in uh huh so it's one of [TS]

◼   ► those is one of those times where like [TS]

◼   ► again it's the reality is butting up [TS]

◼   ► against the best practices everybody [TS]

◼   ► should be using a better password but it [TS]

◼   ► doesn't take that many times of having [TS]

◼   ► to do that before you go you know I'm [TS]

◼   ► changing my netflix password to pencil [TS]

◼   ► every day well wait a minute what if [TS]

◼   ► somebody's looking over your shoulder [TS]

◼   ► when you put your password in your [TS]

◼   ► printer they can be off happening here [TS]

◼   ► is a choice of identity theft maybe [TS]

◼   ► print shit all day while you're at work [TS]

◼   ► you come home your whole house is full [TS]

◼   ► of like I did aliens and this scan this [TS]

◼   ► friends this episode of Roderick on the [TS]

◼   ► line is sponsored by slack the messaging [TS]

◼   ► app for teens i'm told that it sounds [TS]

◼   ► like I'm saying teens but this is the [TS]

◼   ► messaging app for teams although I have [TS]

◼   ► to imagine that teens are probably [TS]

◼   ► welcome as well in any case slack [TS]

◼   ► consolidates all your work [TS]

◼   ► communications into one place makes them [TS]

◼   ► instantly searchable and available on [TS]

◼   ► any device guys this is a very [TS]

◼   ► compelling new thought technology slack [TS]

◼   ► easily integrates with all the tools and [TS]

◼   ► services you already use all the great [TS]

◼   ► tools stuff like Google Drive and [TS]

◼   ► hangouts dropbox github stripe you name [TS]

◼   ► it [TS]

◼   ► so that means you have just this one [TS]

◼   ► beautiful place to go to keep up with [TS]

◼   ► everything that's happening on your team [TS]

◼   ► what's great is that slack also makes [TS]

◼   ► all your stuff searchable so every [TS]

◼   ► discussion every decision and document [TS]

◼   ► is archived index and available to a [TS]

◼   ► single search box [TS]

◼   ► no more digging through piles of old [TS]

◼   ► Braille Playboy's trying to find the [TS]

◼   ► Henderson report it's all just right [TS]

◼   ► there [TS]

◼   ► slack is used by over 500,000 people [TS]

◼   ► more than 60,000 teams every day that [TS]

◼   ► includes companies like the new york [TS]

◼   ► times perhaps you've heard of them [TS]

◼   ► ebay adobe and even the icecube neutrino [TS]

◼   ► Observatory who use slack all the way [TS]

◼   ► down at the South Pole [TS]

◼   ► that's the pole where the penguins live [TS]

◼   ► here's the really cool part black is [TS]

◼   ► free to use for as long as you want and [TS]

◼   ► with as many users as you want [TS]

◼   ► it's super easy to get started using [TS]

◼   ► select today by visiting slack dot-com / [TS]

◼   ► supertrain here's the crazy part when [TS]

◼   ► you sign up for your free account from [TS]

◼   ► that page you'll also get one hundred [TS]

◼   ► dollars in credit to use if you ever [TS]

◼   ► decide to upgrade to the mini fantastic [TS]

◼   ► features of slacks paid plans point is [TS]

◼   ► you need to get on this by signing up at [TS]

◼   ► slac dot-com / supertrain many thanks to [TS]

◼   ► slack the messaging app for teams for [TS]

◼   ► taking some of the pain out of staying [TS]

◼   ► connected and for their wonderful [TS]

◼   ► support of rather cuddle [TS]

◼   ► and screw you world uh it's it's so true [TS]

◼   ► you know it's funny I think about like [TS]

◼   ► the kind of jobs i can pass and refer to [TS]

◼   ► certain jobs I've had as someone in [TS]

◼   ► accurately but I felt like an [TS]

◼   ► information janitor where nobody notices [TS]

◼   ► what I do until the toilets backup [TS]

◼   ► you know the kind of job I've always [TS]

◼   ► been one of the one hand never wanted to [TS]

◼   ► have the kind of job where people only [TS]

◼   ► notice what you do when it doesn't go [TS]

◼   ► flawlessly that would be a terrible [TS]

◼   ► thing the other thing is I've never [TS]

◼   ► wanted to have one of those kinds of [TS]

◼   ► jobs where the success of the [TS]

◼   ► interaction is mostly based on how [TS]

◼   ► little they had to interact with you so [TS]

◼   ► you think about checking into a hotel [TS]

◼   ► late at night you think about you know [TS]

◼   ► obviously rental car because you know [TS]

◼   ► the rental cars like the worst because [TS]

◼   ► at that point you're like uh okay i'm [TS]

◼   ► finally done with all these flights and [TS]

◼   ► I'm not into the hotel yet now i gotta [TS]

◼   ► get a rental car and like every like [TS]

◼   ► picosecond that goes by that you're [TS]

◼   ► having to deal with that person and [TS]

◼   ► they're asking what the gps and in and [TS]

◼   ► dudn't know I just you know I mean it's [TS]

◼   ► like yeah that's the problem is though [TS]

◼   ► there with a device that's kind of what [TS]

◼   ► you really want you wanna be able to [TS]

◼   ► cover people's needs with an ATM but you [TS]

◼   ► know you don't want to turn into the I [TS]

◼   ► mean I again but we're going to guess [TS]

◼   ► what I'm saying is we're going to [TS]

◼   ► evaluate that interaction based on how [TS]

◼   ► little time it took its kind of how I [TS]

◼   ► feel about going out to eat I just want [TS]

◼   ► somebody is extremely efficient I don't [TS]

◼   ► want to talk about my day [TS]

◼   ► hi guys how y'all doing tonight how we [TS]

◼   ► deal and i'm skipping mind if I don't [TS]

◼   ► just settle in here to reminisce with [TS]

◼   ► you say lots of our appies via the great [TS]

◼   ► thing about the rental car business at [TS]

◼   ► airports is that you know they know that [TS]

◼   ► you're exhausted they know that you just [TS]

◼   ► want to get out of there and that's why [TS]

◼   ► they take that opportunity to upsell u14 [TS]

◼   ► time it's all that's the thing is their [TS]

◼   ► margins are so thin right down and it's [TS]

◼   ► gonna be all about all that other crap [TS]

◼   ► in the collision and explaining their [TS]

◼   ► the other just counting on you going [TS]

◼   ► like fine fine fine whatever whatever [TS]

◼   ► whatever like give it to me but what's [TS]

◼   ► amazing is that my interacting with my [TS]

◼   ► iphone as much as I do how much the [TS]

◼   ► business model of the internet right now [TS]

◼   ► is based on that same kind of coercion [TS]

◼   ► like oh are you really excited to watch [TS]

◼   ► this this little YouTube video well why [TS]

◼   ► don't we take 15 seconds and talk about [TS]

◼   ► your courage [TS]

◼   ► plans for the the best one is I I [TS]

◼   ► figured out like my latest attack which [TS]

◼   ► is akin to my hack of never upgrading my [TS]

◼   ► operating system huh [TS]

◼   ► my latest attack is i went in and i [TS]

◼   ► turned off cellular data uh in my iphone [TS]

◼   ► on all my games [TS]

◼   ► ok interesting that is a life hack I [TS]

◼   ► don't want my games interacting with the [TS]

◼   ► internet and what I discovered is I [TS]

◼   ► turned off cellular data for my games [TS]

◼   ► and that prohibits the games from [TS]

◼   ► downloading video advertisements which [TS]

◼   ► often are the thing that Jam my phone up [TS]

◼   ► the most absolutely but Apple has made [TS]

◼   ► sure that every time I turn on something [TS]

◼   ► that has cellular data disabled it pops [TS]

◼   ► up a screen that says cellular data is [TS]

◼   ► disabled for this and it won't let me do [TS]

◼   ► anything else right until I close that [TS]

◼   ► screen and so I never thought of that [TS]

◼   ► because the average the the revenue is [TS]

◼   ► going to come from advertising right so [TS]

◼   ► never thought of that [TS]

◼   ► so they are you know they're doing they [TS]

◼   ► they allow it but they make sure to [TS]

◼   ► punish you each time by saying like this [TS]

◼   ► thing that you know you've done where we [TS]

◼   ► want you to know that you've done it you [TS]

◼   ► think that's Apple i mean i think the [TS]

◼   ► Apple functionality of telling you you [TS]

◼   ► can't do something because you shut that [TS]

◼   ► off is a good idea [TS]

◼   ► reminding you that you're in airplane [TS]

◼   ► mode or something I mean for that I [TS]

◼   ► thought would look more to the [TS]

◼   ► developers who are putting ads in there [TS]

◼   ► is the way to sustain that I'm not sure [TS]

◼   ► because you know like sometimes I will [TS]

◼   ► make the mistake out i'll turn off [TS]

◼   ► location services in something because i [TS]

◼   ► don't want my photos tagged million [TS]

◼   ► shares location but then and i'm not [TS]

◼   ► even sure if that works that may just be [TS]

◼   ► a total like problem but i do what i can [TS]

◼   ► to not have my photos tagged [TS]

◼   ► particularly you know what I'm lying in [TS]

◼   ► bed at night sending naked texts out to [TS]

◼   ► friends in Europe when you break into [TS]

◼   ► the White House you know I don't want [TS]

◼   ► like that tagged exactly what up [TS]

◼   ► but then i'll click on the map program [TS]

◼   ► now why would I be doing that right if I [TS]

◼   ► didn't want right to know if I didn't [TS]

◼   ► want the map to like serve me here by [TS]

◼   ► knowing where i am and you know and the [TS]

◼   ► idea that at that point the thing pops [TS]

◼   ► up and says you need to you what you [TS]

◼   ► can't turn that on from here you need to [TS]

◼   ► now go back to your settings and enable [TS]

◼   ► location services and then come back [TS]

◼   ► here right and you're standing on a [TS]

◼   ► street corner and pouring down raining [TS]

◼   ► right exactly and then after exactly the [TS]

◼   ► scenario we're talking about and it's [TS]

◼   ► just like a the that somebody hasn't [TS]

◼   ► thought that through that if you click [TS]

◼   ► on map like let's just assume that [TS]

◼   ► location services and it is enabled like [TS]

◼   ► uh the night that the point zero one [TS]

◼   ► percent of the time that I go on into [TS]

◼   ► maps and just want to see like where's [TS]

◼   ► the 17th a tourism mole in Paris who you [TS]

◼   ► know i would like to see that on in my [TS]

◼   ► map program rather than googling it its [TS]

◼   ► that's negligible compared to the number [TS]

◼   ► of times when I'm in a hurry and I'm [TS]

◼   ► like oh where is that place you know I'm [TS]

◼   ► within to love using it really as a [TS]

◼   ► traditional atlas in that instance i'm [TS]

◼   ► using it look we're a thing is that [TS]

◼   ► regard to where you are right now [TS]

◼   ► I do that sometimes like chef the Faroe [TS]

◼   ► Islands I wonder how many natural water [TS]

◼   ► sources they're all in the parallel i [TS]

◼   ► wonder if i can see them from my map [TS]

◼   ► program it'll be able to be you know [TS]

◼   ► there's a lot of i mean i don't i don't [TS]

◼   ► flip through atlases anymore like I once [TS]

◼   ► did my whole life and so all i have is [TS]

◼   ► this little black box that comes to bed [TS]

◼   ► with me every night and I just get to [TS]

◼   ► flip through it it may require updating [TS]

◼   ► but there is in iOS 8 just for what it's [TS]

◼   ► worth Chancellor key so we let me if I [TS]

◼   ► don't see something out there is [TS]

◼   ► actually way to go on to privacy and [TS]

◼   ► then location services and it's kinda [TS]

◼   ► it's kinda cool [TS]

◼   ► you always have the ability to turn the [TS]

◼   ► location to never and then depending on [TS]

◼   ► the app usually your other choice is use [TS]

◼   ► location while i'm using it or use it [TS]

◼   ► all the time so that's kinda cool but [TS]

◼   ► that was just another is granularity to [TS]

◼   ► shutting it off if you want just never I [TS]

◼   ► mean I have most of mindset to never [TS]

◼   ► because I'm like you know why [TS]

◼   ► is this drawing program that my kid uses [TS]

◼   ► want that one of my location mnoi just [TS]

◼   ► to see how many you can do this with its [TS]

◼   ► kind of creepy always never those are my [TS]

◼   ► options [TS]

◼   ► well also while using so if you go in [TS]

◼   ► this case I got a chrome the browser and [TS]

◼   ► it says the location access never or [TS]

◼   ► just while using the app so that that's [TS]

◼   ► an upgrade because right now on when I [TS]

◼   ► go to privacy I just have always know [TS]

◼   ► while using the app hello some of them [TS]

◼   ► have that some of them do [TS]

◼   ► yeah so that should help a little bit [TS]

◼   ► thank you John siracusa for your [TS]

◼   ► constant yelling at merlin homicide [TS]

◼   ► I satisfied with your care and this in [TS]

◼   ► this instance you have forced Merlin to [TS]

◼   ► do a thing then and as you have Merlin [TS]

◼   ► has showed dinosaur John know but listen [TS]

◼   ► i want to i want to also commiserate [TS]

◼   ► because you know as I don't think it's [TS]

◼   ► transparently obvious to people what [TS]

◼   ► kinds of things you should flip on for [TS]

◼   ► wear and it does have an impact on your [TS]

◼   ► battery life and on your to some extent [TS]

◼   ► your privacy right well I'm like it look [TS]

◼   ► at any any service you sign up for the [TS]

◼   ► web [TS]

◼   ► the first thing i do when i set up for [TS]

◼   ► anything goes straight to the settings [TS]

◼   ► and straight to profile where I am [TS]

◼   ► increasingly not even surprised anymore [TS]

◼   ► when it's saying make everything public [TS]

◼   ► you know you just gotta go in there and [TS]

◼   ► go it was just you know you I don't [TS]

◼   ► really want my want all my information I [TS]

◼   ► don't wanna be accessible i don't want [TS]

◼   ► the email i'm saying is really is buyer [TS]

◼   ► beware at this point where you've got to [TS]

◼   ► go in and make sure that your ducks in a [TS]

◼   ► row with those things [TS]

◼   ► yeah yeah it is buyer beware well I'm [TS]

◼   ► the thing is you talk about battery life [TS]

◼   ► yeah my it's my psychic better little [TS]

◼   ► battery life [TS]

◼   ► that is always always always always [TS]

◼   ► agents it's always on three percent and [TS]

◼   ► I'm afraid that that that it's gonna [TS]

◼   ► shut off its I'm afraid that my battery [TS]

◼   ► life is gonna shut me down at fifteen [TS]

◼   ► percent which are used to do before i [TS]

◼   ► got the upgrade [TS]

◼   ► yeah and I don't want to you know [TS]

◼   ► actually lately I've had a surprising [TS]

◼   ► amount of energy and it's because I'm [TS]

◼   ► I'm undergoing a forced program of [TS]

◼   ► energy i can't wait to hear about this [TS]

◼   ► well you know what i mean i got it's [TS]

◼   ► just like okay you you have to show up [TS]

◼   ► yeah when you have stuff to do you just [TS]

◼   ► have to have you you find reservoirs of [TS]

◼   ► energy that that prior would have seemed [TS]

◼   ► inaccessible yeah i'm and and and it's [TS]

◼   ► always that feeling you know that [TS]

◼   ► feeling when you're like crusting a [TS]

◼   ► mountain range or above the tree line [TS]

◼   ► and you know over that Ridge there's a [TS]

◼   ► little lake and you just got to get [TS]

◼   ► there but you're really tired you have [TS]

◼   ► to find that energy to you know to push [TS]

◼   ► up / and then it's downhill to the [TS]

◼   ► little lake it helps to know there's [TS]

◼   ► something there though [TS]

◼   ► yeah right we're trying to use every [TS]

◼   ► part of the time Buffalo it helps a lot [TS]

◼   ► to know that that [TS]

◼   ► oh I just don't need to get through the [TS]

◼   ► rest of my life I need to get through [TS]

◼   ► this morning [TS]

◼   ► you know what I mean yeah right and that [TS]

◼   ► and so often the problem of living a [TS]

◼   ► life like mine was formerly that it was [TS]

◼   ► always a false horizon you know always a [TS]

◼   ► false summit like you're coming up the [TS]

◼   ► trail and you're like I can see light [TS]

◼   ► through the trees i'm at the summit and [TS]

◼   ► you get when you get to that use you [TS]

◼   ► crest that Ridge and you're like oh it's [TS]

◼   ► just a ridge i'm not at the summit like [TS]

◼   ► then you see watch the mountain go up [TS]

◼   ► and played apples tell me to go here on [TS]

◼   ► top of the windmill this isn't my are [TS]

◼   ► not having a meeting here I'm Chamber of [TS]

◼   ► Commerce is tapping their feet are so [TS]

◼   ► impressive to hear that was one of the [TS]

◼   ► things I was most kind of quietly [TS]

◼   ► concerned about was like what a huge [TS]

◼   ► adjustment [TS]

◼   ► I mean that's it sounds like i'm calling [TS]

◼   ► you lazy which is not what I mean to be [TS]

◼   ► saying which is that knowing that you [TS]

◼   ► are a night owl [TS]

◼   ► let's put it that way you you tell you [TS]

◼   ► in my experience given the options you [TS]

◼   ► tend to prefer to do a lot of your stuff [TS]

◼   ► at night [TS]

◼   ► yeah it's a lifestyle well it's [TS]

◼   ► interesting how it's [TS]

◼   ► just like when you change the job and [TS]

◼   ► you're doing something else and then [TS]

◼   ► that becomes the new thing that you're [TS]

◼   ► doing it was always hard for me to get [TS]

◼   ► up in the morning but now I have things [TS]

◼   ► to do so i'm getting up in the morning [TS]

◼   ► and then you settle into a thing where [TS]

◼   ► it's like oh it's no harder for me to [TS]

◼   ► get up in the morning then it is anybody [TS]

◼   ► else right [TS]

◼   ► it's just that the problem isn't getting [TS]

◼   ► up in the morning the problem is it's [TS]

◼   ► always hard to get up when the only [TS]

◼   ► thing motivating you to do your work is [TS]

◼   ► you all I know that that's talk about [TS]

◼   ► going up the ridge you get there and [TS]

◼   ► you're like his there's nothing here [TS]

◼   ► this is not what I I didn't do these [TS]

◼   ► 10,000 other things in order to be here [TS]

◼   ► and like you know the right is not there [TS]

◼   ► the the paintings not there whatever it [TS]

◼   ► is right [TS]

◼   ► yeah yeah I i totally agree the thing i [TS]

◼   ► feel like i am going through like my [TS]

◼   ► wife is working more she's changed jobs [TS]

◼   ► and is working a lot more just great and [TS]

◼   ► I'm very happy to and really enjoy my [TS]

◼   ► time with the kids so it is more like [TS]

◼   ► especially in the afternoons you know it [TS]

◼   ► is it's like I maybe like you I got used [TS]

◼   ► to having a certain number of [TS]

◼   ► constraints [TS]

◼   ► yeah but you know there would be a few [TS]

◼   ► constraints in the day I think for me [TS]

◼   ► work is challenging especially somebody [TS]

◼   ► who loves to sleep is to have the [TS]

◼   ► constraint of their stuff that needs to [TS]

◼   ► happen up to a certain point at night [TS]

◼   ► especially if you want to have a social [TS]

◼   ► life or whatever but you know even just [TS]

◼   ► like getting the the bath has to happen [TS]

◼   ► every night whether we feel like it or [TS]

◼   ► not like you know we can only tolerate [TS]

◼   ► the kitchen being dirty for so long you [TS]

◼   ► don't mean you want to be an animal so [TS]

◼   ► on the one hand there's the stuff that [TS]

◼   ► has to happen tonight and it is the [TS]

◼   ► stuff that really needs to happen at a [TS]

◼   ► certain point in the morning extremely [TS]

◼   ► what rare that my kid wakes up later [TS]

◼   ► than six so that problem is though then [TS]

◼   ► like the funeral saying you feel that in [TS]

◼   ► between and then you get look up on the [TS]

◼   ► complaining I'm really actually not i [TS]

◼   ► got I just invented a new phrase i call [TS]

◼   ► the grumble brag with which is when you [TS]

◼   ► are when you claim that you're not [TS]

◼   ► complaining about something while you're [TS]

◼   ► totally complaining about it haha but [TS]

◼   ► anyway when you get enough of those [TS]

◼   ► little waystations it's why it's so hard [TS]

◼   ► to have multiple jobs right yeah it [TS]

◼   ► becomes so much overhead and so much [TS]

◼   ► like stress about all the little [TS]

◼   ► checkpoint you have to get to in this [TS]

◼   ► little rally do you let me ask you a [TS]

◼   ► question because i was thinking about [TS]

◼   ► your book [TS]

◼   ► the other day just as i was driving down [TS]

◼   ► the street I was like Merlin's book [TS]

◼   ► yeah Merlin's book was a thing that I [TS]

◼   ► thought about a lot while you were [TS]

◼   ► making it and then you know thought [TS]

◼   ► about it a lot while you were not making [TS]

◼   ► his deciding not to make it and like do [TS]

◼   ► you ever fall prey to thinking about [TS]

◼   ► that [TS]

◼   ► what is probably quite a pile of writing [TS]

◼   ► that you did write and think like that's [TS]

◼   ► something I'm gonna repurpose for [TS]

◼   ► something or that's something I'm [TS]

◼   ► eventually gonna do something else with [TS]

◼   ► or guided every just happy just buried [TS]

◼   ► it to be honest it is in many ways [TS]

◼   ► incredibly painful in a number of ways [TS]

◼   ► it's still still it's difficult to talk [TS]

◼   ► about because on the one hand it's [TS]

◼   ► painful that this was something i was [TS]

◼   ► very not just passionate about but felt [TS]

◼   ► really uniquely capable of doing [TS]

◼   ► I had a lot of thoughts I had no there's [TS]

◼   ► no dearth of thoughts in my head about [TS]

◼   ► what to what to do and I had a lot to [TS]

◼   ► say I produced a lot of words i didn't [TS]

◼   ► love that many of the words and i'm [TS]

◼   ► actually going to settle this before but [TS]

◼   ► I'm going somewhere with this way the [TS]

◼   ► the part that makes it looks super [TS]

◼   ► painful though it was we get to get into [TS]

◼   ► the sunk cost fallacy stuff where I [TS]

◼   ► start thinking about what that did in my [TS]

◼   ► family for so long like for so long my [TS]

◼   ► wife was just unbelievably supportive [TS]

◼   ► and said yes to anything I ask for until [TS]

◼   ► I started to really like honestly abused [TS]

◼   ► it but like there were times like how [TS]

◼   ► long does it take me to learn i'm not [TS]

◼   ► going to write anything good and or [TS]

◼   ► substantial after seven o'clock at night [TS]

◼   ► and yes i would happen because i'm so [TS]

◼   ► stressed out about that i would happily [TS]

◼   ► leave her with all of the household [TS]

◼   ► duties while I go out and sit there and [TS]

◼   ► feel terrible about myself that's all [TS]

◼   ► that's that was all very difficult i [TS]

◼   ► still feel em failures too strong of war [TS]

◼   ► but i certainly feel like a success and [TS]

◼   ► how that whole thing went the other big [TS]

◼   ► part of this which you didn't ask about [TS]

◼   ► this but the other big part of this is [TS]

◼   ► just how much the landscape has changed [TS]

◼   ► which we've talked about this i mean is [TS]

◼   ► true for musicians but it's really true [TS]

◼   ► for all kinds of what will generally [TS]

◼   ► call content creators the evenin the [TS]

◼   ► last year that's changed let alone the [TS]

◼   ► last five years so I mean on the one [TS]

◼   ► hand i had a lot of stuff you know [TS]

◼   ► probably close to a hundred thousand [TS]

◼   ► words of words i started out with 40,000 [TS]

◼   ► just off [TS]

◼   ► website that need to be added a lot of [TS]

◼   ► words but I never really got it to be [TS]

◼   ► the thing i wanted and it's not even the [TS]

◼   ► thing as always feeling this pressure to [TS]

◼   ► make it a kind of about email even [TS]

◼   ► though it didn't have to be an email [TS]

◼   ► more and more that felt like such a [TS]

◼   ► millstone to me so it's not like i have [TS]

◼   ► that much I want to do with that the [TS]

◼   ► ideas in there are still very powerful [TS]

◼   ► and very lively to me just now that [TS]

◼   ► comes out in podcast the thing the thing [TS]

◼   ► though ultimately makes it something I'm [TS]

◼   ► not trying to repurpose or really [TS]

◼   ► explore I don't know I'm I would not [TS]

◼   ► rule out writing a book at some point [TS]

◼   ► but I writing anything right now is a [TS]

◼   ► really tough racket mean it's a very [TS]

◼   ► tough racket and i think that the [TS]

◼   ► industry has changed business has [TS]

◼   ► changed and i think the audience has [TS]

◼   ► changed so honestly the kinds of things [TS]

◼   ► that people will pay not that much money [TS]

◼   ► for our things I don't necessarily want [TS]

◼   ► to write I don't want to write listicles [TS]

◼   ► i don't i don't want to produce dozens [TS]

◼   ► of kindle books you know and it's not [TS]

◼   ► what it's really if this was true in [TS]

◼   ► 2009 but it's really true now that it [TS]

◼   ► and something Hodgins said when he was [TS]

◼   ► saying that this is a good idea to do [TS]

◼   ► and he was right [TS]

◼   ► is that you know this is how you get [TS]

◼   ► invited on the fresh air like this is [TS]

◼   ► how this is your jumping off point to a [TS]

◼   ► bigger thing right is like once you're [TS]

◼   ► an author it changes everything [TS]

◼   ► yeah but it wasn't even that I was [TS]

◼   ► looking for it was just being able to [TS]

◼   ► feel like the time and energy and stress [TS]

◼   ► that i had invested in that I wanted to [TS]

◼   ► turn into something really great and [TS]

◼   ► timeless maybe that was too much [TS]

◼   ► pressure to put on myself but it just [TS]

◼   ► became too much and now today like you [TS]

◼   ► know the whole inbox zero thing is like [TS]

◼   ► really just the whole concept is so [TS]

◼   ► annoying and then willful [TS]

◼   ► misunderstanding of what i was trying to [TS]

◼   ► say struggling to say yeah makes it a [TS]

◼   ► little bit dead in the water to me but [TS]

◼   ► honestly that the thing as I stand here [TS]

◼   ► today yes i still feel terrible about [TS]

◼   ► how that went for everybody involved but [TS]

◼   ► it is also a thing of like you know all [TS]

◼   ► things being equal if you're a reality [TS]

◼   ► TV star having somebody ghostwriter book [TS]

◼   ► is not a bad idea that somebody who [TS]

◼   ► wants to sweat every single word of [TS]

◼   ► something that will probably take nine [TS]

◼   ► months to a year to do I guess that's [TS]

◼   ► tough work for what you can expect in [TS]

◼   ► return today [TS]

◼   ► yeah yeah that setup is that I answered [TS]

◼   ► that fairly yeah you did [TS]

◼   ► i mean i-i think about it a lot in a [TS]

◼   ► different way now because I because I'm [TS]

◼   ► I've been reflecting on the last period [TS]

◼   ► of my life which is kind of you know [TS]

◼   ► it's the wisdom of retrospect you look [TS]

◼   ► back and say oh actually the last period [TS]

◼   ► of my life which seemed to go by and I [TS]

◼   ► blink actually was two distinct periods [TS]

◼   ► and it was filled with these two sort of [TS]

◼   ► different as you as you as you a portion [TS]

◼   ► your life into eras yeah by looking back [TS]

◼   ► and saying like which in my experience [TS]

◼   ► takes several years to realize what area [TS]

◼   ► that really was [TS]

◼   ► yeah right and at some of that is [TS]

◼   ► happening now and you know it a lot of [TS]

◼   ► the projects that i have pursued over [TS]

◼   ► the course of my whole adult life but in [TS]

◼   ► particular the last handful of years and [TS]

◼   ► they didn't come all the way to fruition [TS]

◼   ► I and that there was a period of sitting [TS]

◼   ► and being very excited about the about a [TS]

◼   ► television show i was thinking of making [TS]

◼   ► when I drove across America and went to [TS]

◼   ► went to little depressed cities and [TS]

◼   ► tried to identify it there arc from the [TS]

◼   ► time that they were founded through the [TS]

◼   ► time with cyber school and I totally see [TS]

◼   ► you doing that than I ever describe this [TS]

◼   ► to you I don't remember you describing [TS]

◼   ► this but that actually is like that [TS]

◼   ► sounds like forgive my saying that [TS]

◼   ► sounds like the work you were made for [TS]

◼   ► it really would be a really good at that [TS]

◼   ► I was super excited about you know you [TS]

◼   ► and and and he'd come in to put tipsy [TS]

◼   ► and you'd say like here's what here's [TS]

◼   ► what this land looked like when there [TS]

◼   ► was an Indian settlement here and here's [TS]

◼   ► why the here's why the settlers chose it [TS]

◼   ► because it was a great place to build a [TS]

◼   ► mill and here's what they milled and [TS]

◼   ► then there was a period of great [TS]

◼   ► prosperity when they figured out how to [TS]

◼   ► out to you know what this this was the [TS]

◼   ► place where they invented the tie tack [TS]

◼   ► and the tie tack blew up and everybody [TS]

◼   ► in the world needed one and this was tie [TS]

◼   ► tack central and I sack boom you know [TS]

◼   ► that's why they're all these beautiful [TS]

◼   ► uh beaux-arts mansions up on this one [TS]

◼   ► particular hill that they call founders [TS]

◼   ► hill and and then world war one came and [TS]

◼   ► you know and I could be telling this [TS]

◼   ► story in both at both video but also [TS]

◼   ► animation and and historical photographs [TS]

◼   ► and you know just kind of do this [TS]

◼   ► sweeping [TS]

◼   ► a rama of a place and then say then you [TS]

◼   ► know us manufacturing decline looks like [TS]

◼   ► cosmos but hyperlocal right right and I [TS]

◼   ► mean that sounds really silly but he's [TS]

◼   ► so great and look at second and Tyson no [TS]

◼   ► deGrasse Tyson alright they're both so [TS]

◼   ► great at taking these complex ideas and [TS]

◼   ► making it something that not only kind [TS]

◼   ► of kind of understand but you find [TS]

◼   ► incredibly interesting by being very [TS]

◼   ► specific but limited like you're not [TS]

◼   ► going to cover everything like in that [TS]

◼   ► your case you're not you're reading the [TS]

◼   ► encyclopedia for pickup see it's more [TS]

◼   ► like saying what you taught me that I'm [TS]

◼   ► so grateful for is like you can just [TS]

◼   ► look at the complexion of this land [TS]

◼   ► look at where this water is look at [TS]

◼   ► where that hill is look at how until [TS]

◼   ► they had promised ridiculous you [TS]

◼   ► couldn't live up on that part of the [TS]

◼   ► hill that you know yeah y-you're I think [TS]

◼   ► you're awfully good at that and and it's [TS]

◼   ► exciting because once you once you open [TS]

◼   ► your mind to that way of seeing you can [TS]

◼   ► look at your own town that way it [TS]

◼   ► doesn't you know you wouldn't need a TV [TS]

◼   ► show to do it you can like like you say [TS]

◼   ► there's a reason that somebody planted [TS]

◼   ► their their flag here and it's usually [TS]

◼   ► because that was where the water was and [TS]

◼   ► that was where the that's what was a [TS]

◼   ► defensible position and the city grew [TS]

◼   ► this way and that way you can tell where [TS]

◼   ► it is like that hope that whole mission [TS]

◼   ► i was on when I was on tour with Harvey [TS]

◼   ► danger where every time every town on [TS]

◼   ► the east coast and in the southeast in [TS]

◼   ► particular we pull in the bus would stop [TS]

◼   ► open up the door and the tour manager [TS]

◼   ► would say well you guys got four hours [TS]

◼   ► to kill until soundcheck and I would [TS]

◼   ► walk up the bus am going to find the [TS]

◼   ► Civil War graveyard gonna find the Civil [TS]

◼   ► War graveyard that is in every one of [TS]

◼   ► these towns and invariably where it was [TS]

◼   ► would have been the outskirts of town in [TS]

◼   ► 1870 without having to look it up on a [TS]

◼   ► city by City basis you can get a pretty [TS]

◼   ► good reckoning [TS]

◼   ► yeah you just know like okay I know I [TS]

◼   ► know that it's not on the outskirts of [TS]

◼   ► town now right because there's no [TS]

◼   ► there's no town back east that has grown [TS]

◼   ► none but it's but in a lot of cases it's [TS]

◼   ► kind of in the decaying inner ring and [TS]

◼   ► then you find the civil work graveyard [TS]

◼   ► know that you kind of can see then that [TS]

◼   ► everything built outside of it [TS]

◼   ► was built after 1870 and everything [TS]

◼   ► inside of it at least that was that [TS]

◼   ► those were the city limits and Sons like [TS]

◼   ► a little a little clue you can mostly [TS]

◼   ► count on you right and and and it's [TS]

◼   ► different in every place and you know [TS]

◼   ► and the the Yankee graveyards are very [TS]

◼   ► different than the southern ones and and [TS]

◼   ► it was just a kind of little game to [TS]

◼   ► play to pass the time that that got me [TS]

◼   ► out and walking but I learned a lot by [TS]

◼   ► just kind of seeking this this little [TS]

◼   ► depression in the ground anyway so that [TS]

◼   ► was a that was a television show that I [TS]

◼   ► that I really wanted to to make and got [TS]

◼   ► excited about and then I was like well [TS]

◼   ► of course we're going to buy a GMC RV to [TS]

◼   ► drive around the country and and I [TS]

◼   ► started talking to people and people in [TS]

◼   ► television and they were like well [TS]

◼   ► what's the hook [TS]

◼   ► I was like well but hook is that it's [TS]

◼   ► really a cool idea because we hook is [TS]

◼   ► usually I think it has that case like [TS]

◼   ► that because usually you're already [TS]

◼   ► really famous in some other way right [TS]

◼   ► now from TV or elsewhere you know I mean [TS]

◼   ► like Anthony Bourdain's that his name is [TS]

◼   ► a show like that that's like better than [TS]

◼   ► it should be because he's a very [TS]

◼   ► interesting guy would have gotten that [TS]

◼   ► show if you weren't already like a [TS]

◼   ► celebrity chef probably not and that's [TS]

◼   ► the thing people kept saying to me like [TS]

◼   ► well if you had written a book about the [TS]

◼   ► American town and I'm like right i mean [TS]

◼   ► this would kind of be the book i would [TS]

◼   ► write about the American town this video [TS]

◼   ► show and then people would like well i [TS]

◼   ► mean if you were like it if you were [TS]

◼   ► anthony kiedis I'm like well yeah I mean [TS]

◼   ► if I was anthony kiedis I'd be happy in [TS]

◼   ► a hot tub in vegas right i mean i [TS]

◼   ► wouldn't be doing this and he's a nice [TS]

◼   ► guy but it's all public images someone [TS]

◼   ► suffering only i love it too hey don't [TS]

◼   ► forget about him there but but no shirt [TS]

◼   ► now but then they were like well what if [TS]

◼   ► you know what if what if you got to that [TS]

◼   ► town and then you found the cool [TS]

◼   ► artisanal uh like mustard factory that [TS]

◼   ► the pic the mustache kids had built in [TS]

◼   ► the old abandoned hotel I was like yeah [TS]

◼   ► I'd be into that let's start sound like [TS]

◼   ► a different show though who different [TS]

◼   ► channel 2 100 now it's like if so then I [TS]

◼   ► started following that stream and I'm [TS]

◼   ► like what if I went to all the depressed [TS]

◼   ► towns in America and found them the [TS]

◼   ► artisanal must mustard factory that the [TS]

◼   ► mustache kids had built I was like [TS]

◼   ► that's an interesting show [TS]

◼   ► it's not quite at em right in my [TS]

◼   ► wheelhouse it's not yet i would i'm i'm [TS]

◼   ► happy to interact with those people and [TS]

◼   ► that would that would be a fun [TS]

◼   ► exploratory like but a lot of those [TS]

◼   ► towns don't have an artisanal must [TS]

◼   ► mustard factory a lot of those towns [TS]

◼   ► just have artisanal crank getting [TS]

◼   ► manufactured and you know like the town [TS]

◼   ► hasn't found its its footing yet and so [TS]

◼   ► that the idea can be evolving and [TS]

◼   ► eventually it just maybe this is [TS]

◼   ► somebody actually talk to somebody about [TS]

◼   ► I talk to a lot of people about it and [TS]

◼   ► and the and the and eventually it was [TS]

◼   ► like the consensus was the classic thing [TS]

◼   ► that that that my good friend christine [TS]

◼   ► connor said to me one time which is that [TS]

◼   ► people come all the time and say I don't [TS]

◼   ► watch TV but I've got a great idea for a [TS]

◼   ► television show right and she said the [TS]

◼   ► problem is that Pete the people who do [TS]

◼   ► watch TV do not want people who don't [TS]

◼   ► watch TV to make television for them and [TS]

◼   ► us she's the reason she's in the corner [TS]

◼   ► office that's really she's so smart [TS]

◼   ► right [TS]

◼   ► yeah and and so so what the program that [TS]

◼   ► I wanted to make was exactly the type of [TS]

◼   ► thing that would get me to watch TV but [TS]

◼   ► that's not what you know that that isn't [TS]

◼   ► half of the type of program that the [TS]

◼   ► executives approve and there was no [TS]

◼   ► component of my show where where there [TS]

◼   ► was no sex tape component no one got [TS]

◼   ► into a hair-pulling fight with anybody [TS]

◼   ► else there wasn't you know I never said [TS]

◼   ► BAM right and I didn't you know and I [TS]

◼   ► never added a like bacon seasoning [TS]

◼   ► vacancies and he's ready to it it [TS]

◼   ► wouldn't be expressly to make people cry [TS]

◼   ► which has a certain appeal [TS]

◼   ► not celebrity based strictly speaking [TS]

◼   ► it's not it's not emotionally [TS]

◼   ► base it's not about making you feel [TS]

◼   ► better or more competent but there's so [TS]

◼   ► many non fiction TV shows that are about [TS]

◼   ► making you feel like you're a chef even [TS]

◼   ► though you're mostly someone who watches [TS]

◼   ► TV and I think what it what it is is [TS]

◼   ► that PBS used to fund that kind of thing [TS]

◼   ► and doesn't as years ago [TS]

◼   ► yeah and there and all the things that [TS]

◼   ► came into the televisions fear that [TS]

◼   ► seemed like little PBS's like like the [TS]

◼   ► discovery channel and the National [TS]

◼   ► Geographic Channel and all these things [TS]

◼   ► you know the smithsonian channel where [TS]

◼   ► you're like oh my god it's a world of [TS]

◼   ► public television and then every one of [TS]

◼   ► those channels devolved away from like [TS]

◼   ► National Geographic is just about cute [TS]

◼   ► tiger babies decided but that should all [TS]

◼   ► be so telling to think about Bravo and [TS]

◼   ► ediscovery i'm not super familiar with [TS]

◼   ► National Geographic that was kind of [TS]

◼   ► after my time we take any of those [TS]

◼   ► things they all started out with the [TS]

◼   ► aspiration of being a i think i would [TS]

◼   ► suggest that but I mean with the [TS]

◼   ► aspiration of having sort of a [TS]

◼   ► high-minded calling like any had some [TS]

◼   ► really nerdy they would show opera on oh [TS]

◼   ► yeah [TS]

◼   ► Marisnick off right exactly it's the [TS]

◼   ► arts and entertainment and ditto ditto [TS]

◼   ► for bravo and you know there was a time [TS]

◼   ► before the advent of you know shark week [TS]

◼   ► when you could really see I don't know [TS]

◼   ► and I'm not gonna let grumbling what I'm [TS]

◼   ► saying is like once again let's just say [TS]

◼   ► that the market has changed i found [TS]

◼   ► something that was more palatable and [TS]

◼   ► profitable that guy that announcer for [TS]

◼   ► Bravo that's just like all the Bravo the [TS]

◼   ► top 10 greatest falls like I remember [TS]

◼   ► watching this channel where it was like [TS]

◼   ► masterpiece theater [TS]

◼   ► uh-huh and it now it's just like on [TS]

◼   ► bravo we're going to go into your closet [TS]

◼   ► and find all the dirtiest shit we can [TS]

◼   ► find our orders you like to cook [TS]

◼   ► shirtless on motorcycles but so so but [TS]

◼   ► but that the time i spent thinking about [TS]

◼   ► that television show and plotting it out [TS]

◼   ► and imagining it and Imagineering it [TS]

◼   ► let's be honest and the engineer and [TS]

◼   ► engine even and then really trying to [TS]

◼   ► think who the market was who I could who [TS]

◼   ► would how much it would cost to produce [TS]

◼   ► those episodes and whether or not i [TS]

◼   ► could sell fund those are internet fund [TS]

◼   ► them what if those episodes were only 15 [TS]

◼   ► minutes long but if they were 10 minutes [TS]

◼   ► long what if i sold them to museums [TS]

◼   ► right what if that was the thing that [TS]

◼   ► you when you walked into the PFC history [TS]

◼   ► museum that this video played and down [TS]

◼   ► and that was a thing that I could make a [TS]

◼   ► case to the national museum association [TS]

◼   ► that I would go around the country and [TS]

◼   ► do these these cool videos about these [TS]

◼   ► different places like a you know is [TS]

◼   ► churning all these different ideas and [TS]

◼   ► in the end none of that stuff got made [TS]

◼   ► and in a sense like not not yet [TS]

◼   ► it happened right but but I can't think [TS]

◼   ► of that as like a failure or a lot or [TS]

◼   ► lost time because I really worked on it [TS]

◼   ► and it didn't come to fruition but but i [TS]

◼   ► do think about the last five years of my [TS]

◼   ► life as this period where i was i was [TS]

◼   ► doing that a lot i was like what am I [TS]

◼   ► gonna use part of your like it's always [TS]

◼   ► when you work on your own or you do [TS]

◼   ► creative stuff an element of your job is [TS]

◼   ► always figuring out what to do next is [TS]

◼   ► to acknowledge work in general but I [TS]

◼   ► think when you are creative person and [TS]

◼   ► I'm not going to get creative because [TS]

◼   ► everyone should stop saying that when [TS]

◼   ► your creative person and you make stuff [TS]

◼   ► and your output is how you are evaluated [TS]

◼   ► huge part of what you do is thinking [TS]

◼   ► about what to do next and how but you [TS]

◼   ► don't really get points for that [TS]

◼   ► understandably right you don't you don't [TS]

◼   ► get credit for all the Opera you didn't [TS]

◼   ► write and and if I had when I first came [TS]

◼   ► up with this idea if I had quickly [TS]

◼   ► written a breezy book about the life and [TS]

◼   ► death of American cities and had like [TS]

◼   ► gotten that in the book pipeline and had [TS]

◼   ► gone around and done fresh air and and [TS]

◼   ► morning talk show circuit about like [TS]

◼   ► you've got her if if the book at had [TS]

◼   ► support right gotta read this book it's [TS]

◼   ► all about life and death American city [TS]

◼   ► that's where we're at right now and and [TS]

◼   ► you know these artisanal mustard [TS]

◼   ► factories aren't going to make [TS]

◼   ► themselves [TS]

◼   ► you know and then went because that's [TS]

◼   ► what David Rees effectively did he made [TS]

◼   ► that book about pencil sharpening that [TS]

◼   ► was very much his own personal private [TS]

◼   ► world his own personal private joke on [TS]

◼   ► himself and and world that he was [TS]

◼   ► exploring and then converted that into a [TS]

◼   ► television show and then he was in a new [TS]

◼   ► world of of struggle and strife he found [TS]

◼   ► a way I so interested in this actually [TS]

◼   ► he found a way tho to guess I would say [TS]

◼   ► take it and turn it he figured out a way [TS]

◼   ► to make it not obvious [TS]

◼   ► so on the one hand you okay all lost [TS]

◼   ► people people buy lots of books about [TS]

◼   ► sharpening pencils well not accurate [TS]

◼   ► like so he found a way to essentially I [TS]

◼   ► mean I've never even read the whole book [TS]

◼   ► but from watching the TV show my sense [TS]

◼   ► is what you're really getting to is that [TS]

◼   ► he has a very interesting approach to to [TS]

◼   ► thinking about life and experience and [TS]

◼   ► expertise and that applies to stuff that [TS]

◼   ► you might be taken for granted so it's [TS]

◼   ► not a show about sharpening pencils and [TS]

◼   ► it's it's it's it's kind of secretly a [TS]

◼   ► show about curiosity and science science [TS]

◼   ► science on some level but it's not it [TS]

◼   ► isn't like educational it doesn't feel [TS]

◼   ► like you're taking your medicine your [TS]

◼   ► menu and what makes it so intriguing is [TS]

◼   ► how how involved he is and how [TS]

◼   ► interested he is at least on screen in [TS]

◼   ► in exploring something that you think [TS]

◼   ► you really understand it doesn't come [TS]

◼   ► off turns out it doesn't feel like I [TS]

◼   ► said it doesn't feel like medicine [TS]

◼   ► that's that's his success there he did [TS]

◼   ► find a way to Vegas with help from [TS]

◼   ► people like Christine like figured a way [TS]

◼   ► to turn that [TS]

◼   ► yeah and the amazing thing about David [TS]

◼   ► and this is the great thing about Adam [TS]

◼   ► Savage and it's a thing that that that [TS]

◼   ► in a way i have in common with them is [TS]

◼   ► that both of those guys are still [TS]

◼   ► totally into an amazed by the things [TS]

◼   ► that the the things that they discover [TS]

◼   ► in a very childlike way [TS]

◼   ► yeah good examples I mean I go out I i [TS]

◼   ► spent a lot of time traveling with David [TS]

◼   ► and he is as cynical as the next guy [TS]

◼   ► about [TS]

◼   ► the world right but if you lift up a [TS]

◼   ► rock and there's a frog under it [TS]

◼   ► David is literally jumping for joy and [TS]

◼   ► cannot believe that there that he found [TS]

◼   ► a frog and we were in Ethiopia together [TS]

◼   ► and we've found this swimming hole out [TS]

◼   ► in the internet like a nature preserve [TS]

◼   ► and the local kids were climbing up this [TS]

◼   ► and probably tall tree and jumping into [TS]

◼   ► the swimming hole and David could not [TS]

◼   ► get his clothes off fast enough and I [TS]

◼   ► was standing there like and and jonathan [TS]

◼   ► coulton to and saying like uh uh David [TS]

◼   ► and he's already like well any claims of [TS]

◼   ► history and he gets up in it and he [TS]

◼   ► realizes how high it is and he's like oh [TS]

◼   ► but he's standing there in his underwear [TS]

◼   ► and there are you know 25 kids cheering [TS]

◼   ► him on and he's gotta make the jump and [TS]

◼   ► i'm on the shore like look man here's [TS]

◼   ► the you know there's one spot in this [TS]

◼   ► whole that I mean these kids are always [TS]

◼   ► 90 pounds and they can jump off that [TS]

◼   ► tree but there's one spot in the [TS]

◼   ► swimming hole that a 210 pound American [TS]

◼   ► guys going to land and not impale [TS]

◼   ► himself and it's right here [TS]

◼   ► do not go anywhere aim here and he jumps [TS]

◼   ► and he makes the landing and he pops up [TS]

◼   ► and it's just like it's the most [TS]

◼   ► beautiful thing you ever saw [TS]

◼   ► I am never in a million years do that [TS]

◼   ► for like 50 reasons [TS]

◼   ► well and the reason that you wouldn't do [TS]

◼   ► it is that two days later the Giardia [TS]

◼   ► that went up his nose and his but when [TS]

◼   ► he jumped in that pool caused him to be [TS]

◼   ► projectile vomiting and pooping [TS]

◼   ► everywhere now while we were you know [TS]

◼   ► like a staying in a single the locals [TS]

◼   ► for you were acclimated to it [TS]

◼   ► oh well you know or or they always have [TS]

◼   ► a low-level case of giardia but but um [TS]

◼   ► but David was not acclimated to it and [TS]

◼   ► we were then on a we were then on a navy [TS]

◼   ► base and trying to find some some cure [TS]

◼   ► because David couldn't couldn't walk 15 [TS]

◼   ► feet without needing to run to the [TS]

◼   ► downtown Miami and but that is the kind [TS]

◼   ► of you know that's the kind of actual [TS]

◼   ► like excitement about life and Adam [TS]

◼   ► Savage is the same thing I think way [TS]

◼   ► it's just like you just build a scale [TS]

◼   ► model of the of [TS]

◼   ► the hedge maze from the shining Why What [TS]

◼   ► Why Why What Why and it's just like what [TS]

◼   ► do you mean why have you seen it in [TS]

◼   ► appointee applied people who make an [TS]

◼   ► iphone app that says yoga people but [TS]

◼   ► then you look at him and like what's [TS]

◼   ► that they're dealing with the bushes [TS]

◼   ► like that what is that like what good is [TS]

◼   ► this he's like what good is it it look [TS]

◼   ► at it it's it it sells itself and it's [TS]

◼   ► like wow you mean you know like Leon [TS]

◼   ► Christian is on board one hundred [TS]

◼   ► percent but that like a normal person [TS]

◼   ► would have no would have no idea that [TS]

◼   ► that was made just than that everything [TS]

◼   ► he makes including his TV show is made [TS]

◼   ► just out of the spirit of like total [TS]

◼   ► love and total childlike excitement and [TS]

◼   ► I have that same quality about the [TS]

◼   ► things that i love and i think i think a [TS]

◼   ► lot of people have that quality about [TS]

◼   ► the things that they well and that you [TS]

◼   ► know and it's hard to sell its hard to [TS]

◼   ► sell that excitement about like tipsy [TS]

◼   ► have you ever looked at it in an atlas [TS]

◼   ► it's it do you know where the freshwater [TS]

◼   ► is never gonna make it to the first [TS]

◼   ► commercial break [TS]

◼   ► no except that these other nerds have [TS]

◼   ► managed you know like that and Adams had [TS]

◼   ► the advantage of like we're gonna blow [TS]

◼   ► shit up on an old airport [TS]

◼   ► yeah and whatever David's advantage was [TS]

◼   ► it was he just invented out of whole [TS]

◼   ► cloth right yeah and and part of that [TS]

◼   ► advantage was the pure in probability of [TS]

◼   ► a guy writing a book about pencils and [TS]

◼   ► but so I'm still you know i'm still [TS]

◼   ► turning that and you obviously have been [TS]

◼   ► trying to write my book about my walk [TS]

◼   ► across Europe for for 15 years now and [TS]

◼   ► the last in iteration of it i sent it [TS]

◼   ► off to a guy in New York City and it's a [TS]

◼   ► hundred plus thousand words too and he [TS]

◼   ► you know he was a fan of our program he [TS]

◼   ► was a he was a big big editor at a at a [TS]

◼   ► reputable legendary publishing house and [TS]

◼   ► he was like I'm totally into this i [TS]

◼   ► really think it's great but these [TS]

◼   ► hundred thousand words are really more [TS]

◼   ► like notes for a book no on the last [TS]

◼   ► thing you want to hear [TS]

◼   ► I was like notes for a book I was hoping [TS]

◼   ► you were going to say they just need a [TS]

◼   ► little bit of you know you just need to [TS]

◼   ► run government is covering a UPC code [TS]

◼   ► yeah i was i was getting ready to put [TS]

◼   ► the author photo know and that you know [TS]

◼   ► and that was just like right notes for a [TS]

◼   ► book and the and the world has changed [TS]

◼   ► so much in that 15 years there's so much [TS]

◼   ► of that writing is about is about how [TS]

◼   ► those places were in 1999 and they're [TS]

◼   ► not like that anymore and really to just [TS]

◼   ► different to be authentic in some ways [TS]

◼   ► you have to really rethink the entire [TS]

◼   ► approach [TS]

◼   ► yes because you've changed so much since [TS]

◼   ► then right and and i think the only way [TS]

◼   ► to do it now is that some at some point [TS]

◼   ► 10 years from now i go retrace my steps [TS]

◼   ► and then they then that whole book that [TS]

◼   ► i wrote were they they were notes for a [TS]

◼   ► book like here's a walk that I did when [TS]

◼   ► I was 30 and I never finished the book [TS]

◼   ► so when i was 16 i went and did it again [TS]

◼   ► this time on a bike that sounds like a [TS]

◼   ► documentary and on the bike and the bike [TS]

◼   ► is actually motorized it's called a [TS]

◼   ► motorcycle who and the motorcycle [TS]

◼   ► actually is a car and it's actually a [TS]

◼   ► plane and I flew over the I flew over [TS]

◼   ► the place that i walked in i wrote my [TS]

◼   ► reflections on that over a long weekend [TS]

◼   ► ha you got me [TS]

◼   ► don't forget no go I you can be really [TS]

◼   ► thinking about something now it is this [TS]

◼   ► as sounds kind of karma sucks and I [TS]

◼   ► don't mean it to be the way that you [TS]

◼   ► were describing you know talking about [TS]

◼   ► like trying to get you your concept for [TS]

◼   ► TV show on some of those places and then [TS]

◼   ► saying that you know people don't want [TS]

◼   ► to watch TV from people who don't watch [TS]

◼   ► TV [TS]

◼   ► yeah there's something in that is really [TS]

◼   ► painful and interesting to me because it [TS]

◼   ► leads to this larger point which is you [TS]

◼   ► know how little we each ultimately [TS]

◼   ► understand about the industries were not [TS]

◼   ► in right so you know you think you've [TS]

◼   ► read lots of books so you think of [TS]

◼   ► yourself as somebody who's who could be [TS]

◼   ► an author like a published author not [TS]

◼   ► just a writer but published some who [TS]

◼   ► sells their words for a living and [TS]

◼   ► periodically and again and again and [TS]

◼   ► again or you think of yourself as [TS]

◼   ► something like oh my god I've watched [TS]

◼   ► and read so much science fiction uh I [TS]

◼   ► could I could easily make a science [TS]

◼   ► fiction TV show and get it on netflix [TS]

◼   ► everybody's doing it nowadays but then [TS]

◼   ► once you actually meet people inside the [TS]

◼   ► industry it ends up you rely feel like [TS]

◼   ► you realize how a how little you really [TS]

◼   ► understand about that industry like we [TS]

◼   ► all have these gases and we've read [TS]

◼   ► things we've read books but in that case [TS]

◼   ► we're like you go like we haven't liked [TS]

◼   ► for Jon Jon's show hills and rivers [TS]

◼   ► where he goes around towards the great [TS]

◼   ► cities of American discusses their [TS]

◼   ► complexion like okay who do we think [TS]

◼   ► that is for and like who would watch [TS]

◼   ► that but also like who would advertise [TS]

◼   ► on that show right cause of the problem [TS]

◼   ► with the show like that i could see that [TS]

◼   ► being a huge disconnect that you know [TS]

◼   ► you want young people to watch it but [TS]

◼   ► it's probably like forward that would [TS]

◼   ► want to buy an ad on there or Buick or [TS]

◼   ► whatever anything make Buicks but I [TS]

◼   ► don't know I just think that's I think [TS]

◼   ► that's part of it is like it makes the [TS]

◼   ► can feel depressed it's too strong a [TS]

◼   ► word but can feel like it keeps you down [TS]

◼   ► because you start to feel like such a [TS]

◼   ► dumbass [TS]

◼   ► yeah he fundamentally don't understand [TS]

◼   ► this industry and then then finally that [TS]

◼   ► point like why do you imagine that there [TS]

◼   ► are there are by tens of thousands of [TS]

◼   ► people hundreds of thousands of people [TS]

◼   ► working all these images [TS]

◼   ► why don't they have TV shows they [TS]

◼   ► already understand how to make TV you [TS]

◼   ► like do you think you're actually that [TS]

◼   ► much better at making a movie than [TS]

◼   ► somebody who's been like an assistant [TS]

◼   ► director [TS]

◼   ► yeah and yet but they're yeoman they do [TS]

◼   ► their job [TS]

◼   ► it's just that we look at that go i can [TS]

◼   ► make the Avengers better or whatever [TS]

◼   ► it's like well you sure this was a lot [TS]

◼   ► of people working on that is take right [TS]

◼   ► well as anybody staffed up some of a big [TS]

◼   ► part of that it is the it's the classic [TS]

◼   ► thing and I'm and I'm seeing it now it [TS]

◼   ► in my foray into politics which is that [TS]

◼   ► I'm i am encountering the entrenched [TS]

◼   ► class and they are saying what makes [TS]

◼   ► exactly that [TS]

◼   ► what makes you think that you can do [TS]

◼   ► this better then those of us who are who [TS]

◼   ► have only been doing this and have been [TS]

◼   ► doing this for a long time and they're [TS]

◼   ► absolutely right in the sense that it in [TS]

◼   ► this same exact sense that you just [TS]

◼   ► described and the only hope the only [TS]

◼   ► hope is that routinely there are people [TS]

◼   ► from outside all these spirits who [TS]

◼   ► come in with a with a good idea and are [TS]

◼   ► able to master the vernacular put [TS]

◼   ► together that the right team of smart [TS]

◼   ► people to help her and actually do make [TS]

◼   ► something new from outside and it [TS]

◼   ► happens infrequently enough but it is [TS]

◼   ► that but when it does happen it's expect [TS]

◼   ► so exciting to us that we you know that [TS]

◼   ► we miss apply the lesson and think wow [TS]

◼   ► you know that again like I could I could [TS]

◼   ► make the Avengers better by sitting why [TS]

◼   ► can't I be Elon Musk right why can't I [TS]

◼   ► be yeah it kind of isn't that kind of [TS]

◼   ► over 2 [TS]

◼   ► over 2 [TS]

◼   ► what about it is and and and and partly [TS]

◼   ► you know partly it is this kits the [TS]

◼   ► question of how what role does expertise [TS]

◼   ► and experience play in various jobs and [TS]