Roderick on the Line

Ep. 166: "Hella NPR'd"


  this episode of Roderick on the line is [TS]

  brought to you by braintree you're [TS]

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  payments calm / supertrain [TS]

  cheap people keep putting the wheat pop [TS]

  hmm [TS]

  my bad habit to pop tap tempo a pump to [TS]

  pump em it's hard going to podcast boy i [TS]

  would have to ask the master that I'm [TS]

  afraid I don't know who you need this is [TS]

  that this is the first time in all the [TS]

  years that we have started our podcast [TS]

  without saying hello but but rather with [TS]

  some some strange bird noises they were [TS]

  on [TS]

  I don't know kind of tropical kind of [TS]

  domestic a little mix of the old world [TS]

  the New World Food you're giving me some [TS]

  good insight into how to have more than [TS]

  one podcast at a time [TS]

  yes and yes ahem not like I yes and [TS]

  there's so much to talk about and now i [TS]

  can't remember whether I talked about it [TS]

  on my other podcast already she's this [TS]

  is what I was worried about [TS]

  oh did I it I already talked to you [TS]

  about the time that I was them was that [TS]

  the other podcast yeah how do you feel [TS]

  about scrambling eggs [TS]

  oh it's in hate it when you take you [TS]

  take the egg in your right hand and you [TS]

  tapping on the edge of the bowl [TS]

  oh wait a minute hold on stop right [TS]

  there [TS]

  you-you-you crack that egg on a on the [TS]

  edge of the bowl Merlin you're gonna get [TS]

  all of the bacteria from the ball right [TS]

  in the egg dad cross-contamination you [TS]

  cross contamination [TS]

  I you know on the weigh-in today i was i [TS]

  was sitting here drinking I'm drinking [TS]

  my coffee and my in one of my beer [TS]

  steins and I realized that probably [TS]

  fifteen percent of everything I put in [TS]

  my body is coffee mold right I've got [TS]

  coffee mold and breathing coffee mold at [TS]

  all times [TS]

  and i'm drinking coffee mold from a [TS]

  variety of sources the primary sources [TS]

  I've never cleaned my coffee maker so [TS]

  full of coffee mold John that has a huge [TS]

  impact on the quality of your coffee you [TS]

  gotta clean your coffee maker and then [TS]

  and then I I by a horde of Boy i see i'm [TS]

  so used to lying since my my political [TS]

  days [TS]

  oh if you know it's gonna be a long road [TS]

  the ready truth that I can't even I [TS]

  can't even remember what's a line what's [TS]

  not but I've never bought this is gonna [TS]

  be a good one I've ever bought a pound [TS]

  of coffee of my life I just about i [TS]

  started talking like when i buy coffee [TS]

  as though I ever buy copy like you're [TS]

  like how Holbrook doing mark twain [TS]

  except you're doing yourself think it [TS]

  reads better if I say I by about how the [TS]

  coffee at a time by a pound so what [TS]

  happens to me is that someone gives me a [TS]

  pound of coffee that is how i get coffee [TS]

  people give me coffee and the reason [TS]

  people give me coffee is that coffee as [TS]

  you know on the west coast in particular [TS]

  is one of the primary schwag elements [TS]

  oh yeah right you go to a thing and [TS]

  they're putting together a gift bag or a [TS]

  gift basket and the first thing they do [TS]

  the first thing they put in a gift [TS]

  basket is a pound of coffee because [TS]

  there's a tremendous coffee surplus here [TS]

  there's so much freaking coffee and [TS]

  everybody is a coffee roaster a coffee [TS]

  grinder a copy importer and so they've [TS]

  just got warehouses full of coffee and [TS]

  everywhere I go somebody's putting a [TS]

  pound of gourmet coffee beans in my hand [TS]

  and so I bring it home and there was a [TS]

  what there's a while there where I had [TS]

  like 30 pounds of coffee in my freezer [TS]

  and then I then they're all the people [TS]

  that are like never freeze your coffee [TS]

  don't what are you talking about freeze [TS]

  your coffee it's gonna ruin that and I'm [TS]

  just like you know what I've got 30 [TS]

  pounds of copy [TS]

  I'm good I'm good way past the [TS]

  apocalypse right everybody of people are [TS]

  going to be knowing on each other Shin [TS]

  bones and I'm gonna be sitting on top of [TS]

  a giant pile of frozen coffee [TS]

  like that image so I'm confident in my [TS]

  choices but seems starving zombie-like [TS]

  creatures shuffling towards you and your [TS]

  butt's nice and cold [TS]

  nice and cold I get you a copy make [TS]

  frozen coffee makes a good ice pack to [TS]

  if you spring a sprained wrist or [TS]

  something I lifehack yeah but-but so [TS]

  lately I've had some cock I've had some [TS]

  coffee has been sitting out on the [TS]

  counter for a month and a half and from [TS]

  what I know about coffee mold which I [TS]

  have learned from reading magazine [TS]

  articles and and from hearing you make [TS]

  that sound [TS]

  whenever I talk about it and presumably [TS]

  what I've learned from dan Benjamin [TS]

  telling you about coffee mold because [TS]

  i'm sure that conversation happened I [TS]

  realize now that that coffee that's been [TS]

  sitting on my counter for a month and a [TS]

  half is probably fifty percent mold and [TS]

  I just make it and drink it and it [TS]

  tastes like mold like so many in the [TS]

  chain of custody from whatever coffee [TS]

  grows on 222 being expelled through you [TS]

  there the chain of custody is just [TS]

  riddled with problems there's all kinds [TS]

  of places for the introduction of [TS]

  different kinds of unsavory things you [TS]

  don't know you're not keeping you [TS]

  keeping a tight lock on that and this [TS]

  isn't even copy that's been through a [TS]

  civet but right so I just a man i'm [TS]

  thinking like then there's all the [TS]

  coffee cups i leave lying around both in [TS]

  the garden and in my office [TS]

  there's just gotta be so much coffee [TS]

  mold I if I had if I had some they live [TS]

  glasses but instead of seeing aliens [TS]

  among us it they could just see coffee [TS]

  mold of my heart of it might also be the [TS]

  nature of the stein I don't want to [TS]

  introduce new things here but you know [TS]

  the stein it's probably like a pottery [TS]

  kind of Stein right it's not like it's [TS]

  not like well uh plastic or something [TS]

  it's probably somewhat porous it's a [TS]

  pottery stone it's a pottery Stein so so [TS]

  there could be all kinds of you know [TS]

  invaginations that the mold could get [TS]

  into maybe start a family [TS]

  I well I mean there's there's coffee [TS]

  mold under my fingernails [TS]

  I'm not worried about it in the poor [TS]

  the surface of my bike my daughter will [TS]

  just start chewing we're at the movies [TS]

  yesterday starts chewing a fingernail [TS]

  and I'm like you [TS]

  you've been downtown for three hours and [TS]

  really want three hours of san francisco [TS]

  in your mouth [TS]

  well I've got worse than that i went to [TS]

  the i went to the ICU yesterday to visit [TS]

  a friend in intensive care [TS]

  I spent you know a few hours and twenty [TS]

  one person when he said I thought [TS]

  everything that like for a friend [TS]

  now you're actually going to see another [TS]

  present you it wasn't you I when I went [TS]

  to the ICU yesterday for a friend I [TS]

  would I went to the Insane Clown Posse [TS]

  it yesterday [TS]

  no III to visit a friend and I was in [TS]

  there and you know it was a very intense [TS]

  right you put on our you put on a rubber [TS]

  gown and gloves and a face mask and a [TS]

  face mask with like a shield my god I'm [TS]

  so sorry [TS]

  yeah yeah no it's not a nice place but [TS]

  then i was in there for I mean it's a [TS]

  wonderful place in the sense that if you [TS]

  are if you need the services that they [TS]

  provide that is where you want to be you [TS]

  would wrap much rather be there than [TS]

  sitting on top of a pile of frozen [TS]

  coffee beans yeah and then as I'm [TS]

  walking out of the ICU you know what and [TS]

  it's just like you take the stuff off [TS]

  and you deposited in a biohazard [TS]

  container and you walk through a [TS]

  pressurized aperture and all this stuff [TS]

  and then you and then i'm on my way to [TS]

  the parking garage and i'm just chillin [TS]

  on my fingernails know and I was like [TS]

  and I caught myself doing it like huh [TS]

  well welcome mersa to the otherwise [TS]

  completely toxic environment inside of [TS]

  me hope you can fight it out with the [TS]

  coffee mold you know and we'll see which [TS]

  wich toxin which neurotoxin is the is [TS]

  the one that survives but starting to [TS]

  start suddenly suddenly effect i can you [TS]

  deep on this John I gotta deal with this [TS]

  on another show but I started this [TS]

  weekend for I believe the possibly the [TS]

  fifth time I decided to read the first [TS]

  10 pages of Infinite Jest and this time [TS]

  I stick with it i know ya least 20 30 [TS]

  pages so yeah go go deep [TS]

  I think I can finish the chapter if I [TS]

  break it into pieces but you know in the [TS]

  beginning parties in the office you know [TS]

  talk about getting a scholarship and he [TS]

  has this flashback [TS]

  when he was a little kid and is how has [TS]

  a flashback of when he came [TS]

  he's like a toddler it comes out of the [TS]

  basement screaming something his mother [TS]

  can't hear what he's screaming because [TS]

  she's running a tiller in the yard and [TS]

  he's holding a just a giant piece of [TS]

  mold he broke off the part of the [TS]

  basement and has like orange and yellow [TS]

  spikes and soon as it starts screaming I [TS]

  ate this is a test that for some reason [TS]

  now is hitting the extra hard because [TS]

  that the predominant image of mold in my [TS]

  head for the last few days is a giant [TS]

  piece of basement mold like yellow [TS]

  stalagmites and so when you say coffee [TS]

  mold it could be something that could [TS]

  just be one of those like little booger [TS]

  looking droplets but but now but i'm [TS]

  thinking about eating basement mold [TS]

  that's a lot of a long book John did you [TS]

  ever read it [TS]

  no you know I i read gravity's rainbow [TS]

  know you know what you clocked out you [TS]

  have to read the other books yeah and [TS]

  that's exactly how I felt about it I in [TS]

  1992 I went into the bookstore hear that [TS]

  used to be where they destroyed the [TS]

  entire building to build a subway stop [TS]

  for the subway that still hasn't opened [TS]

  and and Denis Denis painful analogy [TS]

  district yeah thank you [TS]

  and it was the bookstore where everybody [TS]

  that worked there was a larper there [TS]

  were 50 cats there and it was owned by a [TS]

  woman who was a very nice woman but also [TS]

  had a she was not a nice woman [TS]

  let's be honest yeah cats bookstore [TS]

  dander I can see the signs on that is [TS]

  not adding up to a nice person but she [TS]

  had she was someone who kept a coterie [TS]

  of younger men working at her store that [TS]

  she was I think running through her [TS]

  function machine if you know what I'm [TS]

  saying oh very very much like a chain [TS]

  chain mail the culture I think I think [TS]

  chainmail figured highly there but I [TS]

  spent a lot of time in this bookstore [TS]

  and that's where I discovered Sinclair [TS]

  Lewis not it [TS]

  him personally but is you know that was [TS]

  when I first arrived in town and I [TS]

  didn't have any money i would go there [TS]

  and I'd buy that whatever that whatever [TS]

  the thickest book on the 99-cent rack [TS]

  was and lewis at Zenith was one of those [TS]

  and i became like that that's [TS]

  single-player Lewis fan but that's a [TS]

  different story no i said this week on [TS]

  your rainbow so I went in there one time [TS]

  and I was like a night then there was a [TS]

  note that the guy with the beard and the [TS]

  long hair who shaped kind of like a [TS]

  Hershey's kiss was behind the counter [TS]

  and I was like what's your favorite book [TS]

  man and he was like oh my favorite book [TS]

  uh it's a little bit better difficult [TS]

  the gravity's rainbow and I was like [TS]

  gravity's rainbow huh i have heard of it [TS]

  and i have been avoiding it like the [TS]

  plague and he was like oh dude dude what [TS]

  Terry another bow but my good sir [TS]

  and he went and like a dislodged himself [TS]

  from his perch and went and got me I [TS]

  think his personal copy or some special [TS]

  copy of gravity's wrinkle and brought it [TS]

  on he was like ooh la la [TS]

  here you are good luck Godspeed and I [TS]

  spent so long trying to read that [TS]

  freaking gravity's rainbow i read it i [TS]

  read that's that that's the book where i [TS]

  was reading it in four different places [TS]

  at one time i was reading it then i was [TS]

  reading i was i was reading back 50 [TS]

  pages that i was reading back a hundred [TS]

  and fifty pages and then i would had [TS]

  started over again [TS]

  also at the same time huh so so having [TS]

  done that when infinite just came out I [TS]

  was like I'm i will not be fooled again [TS]

  uh-huh i won't get fooled again same [TS]

  boss me that and so so but now I feel [TS]

  bad about it because it said it's held [TS]

  up you know here's the thing let's let [TS]

  me put my cards on the table as long as [TS]

  you're out of politics and being honest [TS]

  i might as well be honest to prom the [TS]

  gravity's rainbow [TS]

  no I have even crack the spine on crying [TS]

  of lot 49 00 that's a that's a [TS]

  delightful delightful read yeah I know I [TS]

  know I have a lot of these I have a lot [TS]

  of my post-college age i bought a lot [TS]

  more books on ever read but oh my god [TS]

  was epic epic fresh air so fresh air on [TS]

  Friday as you know on friday sometimes [TS]

  terry gross isn't there and so it was [TS]

  Dave Davies in for Terry Gross on fresh [TS]

  air which may not happen a lot of the [TS]

  time these days table steve davies of [TS]

  the kinks [TS]

  that's right he got punched in the face [TS]

  anybody hosts pressure no different dave [TS]

  davies de vc and they refer to him as I [TS]

  what do they call him like a contributor [TS]

  didn't refer to him as the like [TS]

  substitute host its pretty weak you are [TS]

  talking about fresh air as though it's a [TS]

  program i have ever heard [TS]

  ok so how is that how we're gonna do it [TS]

  but go ahead go ahead I'm listening [TS]

  what you've never heard of cat but the [TS]

  fan you're not more than that [TS]

  yeah i'm just very surprised you like [TS]

  someone first show you seem like someone [TS]

  who enjoyed music this is very [TS]

  surprising to me [TS]

  Davies is invert area gross locate uses [TS]

  point-of-sales can listen Dave Davies is [TS]

  in for Terry Gross and it's on the [TS]

  occasion of the release of his new film [TS]

  with the with the kid from facebook and [TS]

  the guy from freaks and geeks the [TS]

  facebook movie [TS]

  what were their it's a it's about a [TS]

  favor the famous week of interviews the [TS]

  last the end things called the end of [TS]

  the tour and it's jason segel yeah right [TS]

  I hear good things about this movie [TS]

  Yeah right right so it's kind of about [TS]

  that movie and it's kind of about you [TS]

  know dfw and so what they put together [TS]

  on this day when Davies was in for fresh [TS]

  air was an interview with David Foster [TS]

  Wallace from from 1996 to celebrate the [TS]

  release of the paperback of Infinite [TS]

  Jest there's a fantastic interview as [TS]

  always and then they talked to jason [TS]

  segel about forgetting sarah marshall [TS]

  which had just been released on DVD in [TS]

  2009 it's a pretty classic what what is [TS]

  the show about fresh air huh [TS]

  mhm not like but listen to it and you [TS]

  know I've read [TS]

  a lot of his short stuff I don't think [TS]

  I've ever never finished one of his [TS]

  novels but i love you know these essays [TS]

  my god but yeah I thought you know what [TS]

  I did wrong in January yeah i reread [TS]

  that supposedly fun thing I'll never do [TS]

  again right now works for the fourth [TS]

  time ready for your depth on the gang [TS]

  plank of a cruise ship and I remember [TS]

  you walking onto the cruise ship and CM [TS]

  in your eyes the fact that you had just [TS]

  read a supposedly fun thing I will never [TS]

  do again I did say I could see it in the [TS]

  way you carried yourself across the [TS]

  gangplank and I was like my friend free [TS]

  yourself from free yourself from mental [TS]

  slavery [TS]

  oh my god it was that anyway boy is that [TS]

  ever a fantastic si yes it is my god [TS]

  it's a me I mean like okay let's be [TS]

  white guys talk about mr. Wallace is a [TS]

  good writer but like his ability is [TS]

  elevated language but he's elevated [TS]

  without signing snooty and he's clever [TS]

  without signing snarky and the way that [TS]

  he observes and describes the situation [TS]

  the language he uses to describe even [TS]

  the most mundane situations it's just [TS]

  it's an other other delights total like [TS]

  math kandi I feel the words in my mouth [TS]

  when I'm reading it I i love it i [TS]

  thought you know everybody says this is [TS]

  like the best book in the last 25 years [TS]

  or whatever and like I i own two copies [TS]

  of it one of which is being used to hold [TS]

  a part of a bed right now [TS]

  yeah and-and-and I thought this time I [TS]

  tried to get out but I make it through [TS]

  but I'm trying [TS]

  well when you're done i'll let you all [TS]

  alone you up my complete copy of google [TS]

  Gulag Archipelago oh my goodness that's [TS]

  a long way huh yeah which is which is [TS]

  currently a I i'm pretty sure it's [TS]

  basically pretty sure it's like a large [TS]

  part of my living room furniture that's [TS]

  it that's a nice way to wind down at the [TS]

  end of the day is that just really [TS]

  really tuck into a multi-volume bit of [TS]

  sad [TS]

  yeah oh well and and you know i'm i'm [TS]

  halfway through 3 i'm halfway through [TS]

  mine comp bye-bye the Swede um it's a [TS]

  sweet it's a suite version of my comp [TS]

  did you not [TS]

  did you not get on board the the the my [TS]

  struggle train a couple of about a year [TS]

  ago might be my fresh air you're gonna [TS]

  have to [TS]

  give it to make some money but anytime [TS]

  so uh so this guy Carl Oh Carl over nows [TS]

  guard that's the fakest name I've ever [TS]

  heard in my life is literally named Carl [TS]

  Oh snows gonna scarred now's guard news [TS]

  guard is a is like a depressed Norwegian [TS]

  the guy of course I heard about this [TS]

  about our age and a like in the style of [TS]

  like depressed Norwegian he's sort of [TS]

  impossibly handsome in a having smoked [TS]

  two packs of cigarettes a day kind of [TS]

  way [TS]

  that's a wise catcher's mitt yeah [TS]

  exactly [TS]

  you know who looks like a catcher's mitt [TS]

  is kevin spacey I was watching that [TS]

  political program of his yes he talks [TS]

  directly into the camera [TS]

  uh-huh and once I realized that his face [TS]

  looked like a catcher's mitt [TS]

  I could not stop seeing it and I really [TS]

  kept feeling like it was distracting me [TS]

  from the programs and get that from him [TS]

  i think he looks like a thumb with a wig [TS]

  well now look at him as a catcher's mitt [TS]

  and imagine imagine like a knot and not [TS]

  even a baseball catcher's mitt like a [TS]

  softball catchers mitt just imagine a [TS]

  softball just going right in there just [TS]

  nestling in between his cheeks [TS]

  I think you'll see it anyway so I was in [TS]

  New York about a year ago and I was [TS]

  being I was being courted by a young [TS]

  book editor who is very smart and you [TS]

  harvest of writing a book he was [TS]

  courting me okay [TS]

  yes for the purpose of while he was [TS]

  courting me as a potential author for [TS]

  him a writer with Si and he's been very [TS]

  supportive of me and he's you know he [TS]

  likes the the things that I've written [TS]

  in these like you know let's write a [TS]

  book i am a book editor i work for a [TS]

  book publisher or I'm sorry not a [TS]

  publisher but like am what a black it's [TS]

  the equivalent of a manager they get [TS]

  your book published an agent an agent [TS]

  there you go that's the word and so [TS]

  we're walking around park slope brooklyn [TS]

  together and he's you know he's a young [TS]

  person but he's wearing big glasses so [TS]

  it kind of feels like I always imagined [TS]

  that my bed my book agent would look [TS]

  like Rob Reiner over and this one is is [TS]

  younger but he's got big glasses on so [TS]

  it feels very book editor e and we're [TS]

  just sort of wandering around park slope [TS]

  and we pass a bookstore he's like let's [TS]

  go into the bookstore and I'm like this [TS]

  perfect i'm in new york i'm walking [TS]

  around with my book agent we're gonna [TS]

  walk into a bookstore like lodi fucking [TS]

  da and we wander in and of course he [TS]

  immediately greets all the employees of [TS]

  the bookstore and there and they all [TS]

  loved him right there are they all know [TS]

  everything there they're all [TS]

  chit-chatting like oh have you heard [TS]

  from this author and they're talking [TS]

  books with each other all these young [TS]

  people working in books and I'm just [TS]

  feeling like this is so sophisticated i [TS]

  am i'm i'm here from the West [TS]

  this is the code that's the way i love [TS]

  to go to New York right you go to New [TS]

  York and you just you just get source [TS]

  whooshed into some cool new york thing [TS]

  or feels like of course that the the [TS]

  writer from Seattle is here [TS]

  traipsing around never written a goddamn [TS]

  thing but here I am and he says oh have [TS]

  you read [TS]

  have you read my struggle yet as though [TS]

  I were a writer who read all of the [TS]

  books that were coming out [TS]

  yeah must've felt like a test you know [TS]

  well but you know it's that time let's [TS]

  say I've been doing it for 25 years in [TS]

  music like all of your the new cat but [TS]

  and I would always be like oh do tell me [TS]

  more [TS]

  and then you know that's every time I go [TS]

  into a record store somebody puts five [TS]

  records in my hands but I don't want but [TS]

  so I'm standing there at the counter and [TS]

  I'm like oh my struggle how you mean my [TS]

  struggle that's a very familiar [TS]

  booktitle i think i remember reading a [TS]

  version of my struggle written by an [TS]

  author named Hitler and they're like no [TS]

  no it's a new epic novel written by this [TS]

  depressed Norwegian guy about your age [TS]

  who has just exhaustively chronicled his [TS]

  entire life with total honesty and I was [TS]

  like and I could just feel my stomach [TS]

  thinking like ah [TS]

  first of all that's my gig yeah and [TS]

  second of all why do I don't know and so [TS]

  pretty soon three huge volumes are put [TS]

  in my hands [TS]

  each one costs thirty-five dollars three [TS]

  hard bound books on now here's the test [TS]

  but em right i mean no i mean because I [TS]

  mean if you go um like it's already [TS]

  heavy [TS]

  yeah I'm telling a hundred dollars for [TS]

  books yeah but I was like sign me up i'm [TS]

  having a great day and so I walk out of [TS]

  there carrying a Manhattan phone book [TS]

  and I started to read them and I read [TS]

  the first 1i and I got about halfway [TS]

  through the second one and they really [TS]

  are that he really does talk about his [TS]

  life pretty much on a day-to-day basis [TS]

  like and then when I was seven [TS]

  i sat in the kitchen and waited for my [TS]

  cereal bowl to be filled by my mother [TS]

  who was emotionally absent x-pac was [TS]

  sounds like apartment without an editor [TS]

  it was really whoa [TS]

  and then and then scott simpson tweeted [TS]

  about it and I realized that oh we were [TS]

  all of us all of us depressed dads were [TS]

  reading at all at once and that and sort [TS]

  of Bounce me out of it for a minute I [TS]

  was like I can't so now it's sitting on [TS]

  my bed table [TS]

  I'm like there is karl karl neural or [TS]

  Carlo nice garden hose guard and then he [TS]

  you know he was doing a book tour and [TS]

  and it was one of those book tours that [TS]

  every kind of every middle-aged author [TS]

  dreams of where he's being swept around [TS]

  the world and [TS]

  people are genuine selecting I can hear [TS]

  in your voice can hear it so yeah and [TS]

  you know that be you a little bit [TS]

  well nothing was the entire time he was [TS]

  sort of disavowing that he liked this at [TS]

  all [TS]

  I'll of course you way you love being [TS]

  swept around i do like being swept [TS]

  around [TS]

  oh my god up so now now i understand it [TS]

  to be six books along i only have the [TS]

  first three [TS]

  oh my goodness it crackin so so so busy [TS]

  night and this shows the shows what up [TS]

  what up [TS]

  ignoramus Philistine I am but it isn't [TS]

  that thing where you kind of feel like [TS]

  you get the flavor after one or two it [TS]

  is not a thing that you even feel like [TS]

  it so this is the thing about gravity's [TS]

  rainbow to right where you read you are [TS]

  500 pages into a book and you have no [TS]

  idea what the flavor is yet right like [TS]

  year reading and you are reading and [TS]

  reading and reading and you don't know [TS]

  what's happening and you don't know you [TS]

  don't even know if you like it yet and [TS]

  you've invested 500 pages you've [TS]

  invested you know weeks of your life [TS]

  because it's not 500 easy pages and it's [TS]

  not that way Carl Mouse Guard is hard [TS]

  not gravity's rainbow like it's not [TS]

  difficult to read but it's but you're in [TS]

  there and you're like ooh I like this [TS]

  person do I like this world do I feel [TS]

  like this world even if i don't like it [TS]

  too i feel like it's important to I feel [TS]

  like I need to hate that I hate that [TS]

  healing light that feeling because I [TS]

  feel like I'm when that when i do that [TS]

  and battling this kind of peer pressure [TS]

  in my head whether it's real or not like [TS]

  this should be something right I get to [TS]

  be the guy who suggests this book to [TS]

  other people and then seemed surprised [TS]

  that they haven't read it and I feel [TS]

  that kind of pressure that I'm like [TS]

  eating my vegetables when i read a book [TS]

  like that I you know you know me I like [TS]

  to be punished and I like to suffer [TS]

  yeah and so it's really it's really when [TS]

  you thrive in a lot of ways [TS]

  yeah so I have done I have I have [TS]

  experienced a lot of culture that with [TS]

  that it was it was true suffering for me [TS]

  to endure [TS]

  but i but I understood that through [TS]

  suffering i was going to be delivered to [TS]

  another place that that the piece of [TS]

  culture that I was consuming was a ferry [TS]

  boat that was taking me from my the [TS]

  prior land the to this this dark new [TS]

  land [TS]

  you don't mean might not know what land [TS]

  that's right and I was not paying the [TS]

  ferryman until he got me to the other [TS]

  side [TS]

  mm don't fix a price that's right so I'm [TS]

  on the you know I'm on the book and I am [TS]

  in and I'm saying or I'm on the the [TS]

  piece of art and I'm saying you are [TS]

  punishing me you arcs but you may [TS]

  deliver me to a 22 candyland and a lot [TS]

  of the times you know the fact that [TS]

  fucking thing sinks and you have to swim [TS]

  back but but I the the jury's still out [TS]

  on this because because [TS]

  and I think this is the big the big [TS]

  quite that David Foster Wallace question [TS]

  the dave eggers question now the Carl [TS]

  now's hours guard Allison guard and the [TS]

  end its and it's a primary question of [TS]

  the work that i do and if you do which [TS]

  is at what point like all art is [TS]

  somewhat autobiographical we have [TS]

  stripped away a lot of the a lot of the [TS]

  artifice from it and and have arrived in [TS]

  a place now where autobiographical like [TS]

  with the autobiography with almost no [TS]

  additional work and only when you can be [TS]

  somebody who writes a memoir that's a [TS]

  thing on its own without it being about [TS]

  like my life and pro wrestling or [TS]

  something [TS]

  yeah right it's just like I'm just a [TS]

  charming Schmo and here's my [TS]

  autobiography people have been doing [TS]

  that for thousands of years but now it [TS]

  seems like that is that is well [TS]

  everybody is a autobiographer now [TS]

  because we're all were all documenting [TS]

  our own lives constantly [TS]

  and to what end and if you're if you're [TS]

  not adding something else to it which is [TS]

  either like a philosophical take well [TS]

  okay I get it [TS]

  yeah this has been an angle for you for [TS]

  a while in your in your in your your [TS]

  reflective romantic moments is like what [TS]

  are we producing yeah [TS]

  beyond this sort of ephemera yeah [TS]

  and-and-and with with dave eggers and [TS]

  and david foster wallace I mean that i [TS]

  read those guys at at obviously earlier [TS]

  in my life at a time when it seemed like [TS]

  what they were doing was magical because [TS]

  they were as you say like turning [TS]

  language the language itself was [TS]

  beautiful and then their life [TS]

  experiences or the way their minds [TS]

  worked for interesting and beautiful in [TS]

  a way and and and that was enough they [TS]

  didn't you know they didn't turn it into [TS]

  a novel about some other people it was [TS]

  it was a diary more or less but that [TS]

  that diary then little was elevated and [TS]

  and and now I feel like we're entering [TS]

  into a realm where the diary doesn't [TS]

  even have to be elevated it just has to [TS]

  be long or it has to be comprehensive [TS]

  and I don't know if that if that quite [TS]

  passes muster with me and I don't read a [TS]

  lot of this but i think i think i know [TS]

  what you mean i'm thinking about stuff [TS]

  that i had a class and mice third year [TS]

  of college [TS]

  it was really great but difficult which [TS]

  is called long poems and it was a you [TS]

  know a survey of long poems and had all [TS]

  the usual suspects in it you know and [TS]

  kind of doing like a and you know I had [TS]

  a close reading of things like the [TS]

  wasteland or things like William Carlos [TS]

  Williams is Patterson or leaves of grass [TS]

  you know by leaves of grass [TS]

  well still leaves the graphs is on the [TS]

  n.o Patterson is great the wasteland is [TS]

  a riot but like even leaves of grass but [TS]

  I have to just say like so going back to [TS]

  like what people are actually making I [TS]

  just gotta say man died [TS]

  feel like you clap out with a suspension [TS]

  engine but oh great [TS]

  gravity's rainbow like I never had that [TS]

  but also like Keats's Endymion reading [TS]

  this this is it's all couplets and it's [TS]

  just really really extreme that's an [TS]

  extremely long undersea adventure bike [TS]

  eats that involves lots of like you know [TS]

  tried in stuff and it was but I didn't [TS]

  really felt like i was eating my [TS]

  vegetables and it was it was not fun [TS]

  it was it's one of those things that [TS]

  like where you're like it wasn't even [TS]

  like I hate watch kind of thing whatever [TS]

  is keith is great but like you know I [TS]

  kinda like the other kind of stuff [TS]

  better [TS]

  these epic poems just feel like oh just [TS]

  like this grind and i have to say that [TS]

  you know even at the time now I get to [TS]

  do what I get to drop that I've read [TS]

  keeps Endymion look at me like i get i [TS]

  get through the white ribbon for that [TS]

  like I'm the guy who read that you know [TS]

  I don't know I just it's just some of [TS]

  this that's unkind but I don't want the [TS]

  key taters in the air the keeps fans to [TS]

  get on me you know they're out there [TS]

  right now I know but yeah i don't know i [TS]

  don't like I used to [TS]

  I don't know how you find the time to [TS]

  read you seem like a very occupied with [TS]

  lots of different things [TS]

  uh yeah yeah but I I do i do try to I I [TS]

  admire that [TS]

  that version that earlier version of a [TS]

  of of a fully-fledged adult who is who [TS]

  is up with the current reading over and [TS]

  I don't know if that fully-fledged adult [TS]

  is still if that's still a model you [TS]

  know obviously there are there are [TS]

  plenty of people plenty of adult people [TS]

  who are still living according to that [TS]

  but I don't know if we're minting any [TS]

  new people like that but then again i [TS]

  just described my young New York agent [TS]

  who who's still living in that world but [TS]

  it seems like that version of being a [TS]

  grown-up where you've got a you've got a [TS]

  you've got the the times literary [TS]

  supplement and you are you're you're [TS]

  working through it every every week I'm [TS]

  thinking about you think about it i'll [TS]

  go out [TS]

  Algonquin Round Table kind of situation [TS]

  we've got a bunch of people [TS]

  who are very competitive very smart very [TS]

  clever people who are doing a lot of [TS]

  writing and if you worked at the new [TS]

  yorker you were doing a lot of reading [TS]

  to and being the kind of person who was [TS]

  like extremely up-to-date on and an [TS]

  opinion about virtually everything that [TS]

  came out people just reading reading [TS]

  reading all the time it's what they did [TS]

  for a living you know people forget that [TS]

  writers also read like there's a lot of [TS]

  reading involved [TS]

  yep and and you know but the thing is [TS]

  like you look at that never looks like [TS]

  it's all look at their smoking wearing [TS]

  hats you know and and and talking about [TS]

  you know life and that's that's really [TS]

  fascinating but i don't know i mean how [TS]

  incredibly different is that from [TS]

  somebody like me [TS]

  well I don't not unless this is noble [TS]

  but like I love how great TV is right [TS]

  now and others there are if you look [TS]

  there are great movies and I feel I like [TS]

  being kind of up-to-date on what good TV [TS]

  shows are you know and that's the thing [TS]

  if you were if you were Dorothy Parker [TS]

  sitting in the lobby of a hotel ashing [TS]

  your cigarette in someone else's t you [TS]

  didn't have all that TV also felt like [TS]

  you had to know about and you didn't [TS]

  also you weren't reading like BuzzFeed [TS]

  right there's a lot to keep up on now [TS]

  yeah yeah there you go you got to go to [TS]

  click hold and see all the funny stuff [TS]

  that those guys are coming up with ah [TS]

  yeah yeah I don't know I'm just I'm just [TS]

  I can only speak for myself which is [TS]

  that like I've read a lot of stuff I [TS]

  think I've probably read more than a lot [TS]

  of people have read i had to read so [TS]

  much in college [TS]

  some of which was amazing i mean i'll [TS]

  read me some Absalom Absalom anyday the [TS]

  ambassador's you can keep it like that [TS]

  there was there's so many like very [TS]

  moby-dick not a fan like all the things [TS]

  that you have to read that we're [TS]

  extremely long and varied in their how [TS]

  great they were or how much you can even [TS]

  understand it but you had to because [TS]

  that was the process what you're going [TS]

  to get you get a voltaire occasionally [TS]

  and that's a lot of fun but there's just [TS]

  a whole bunch of stuff that I had to [TS]

  read but I have to admit I mean a lot of [TS]

  that was because I had to read it for [TS]

  class and also it made me feel a little [TS]

  fancy it made me feel a little bit fancy [TS]

  the kid from like Central Florida was [TS]

  reading the the great authors and some [TS]

  of it was really great and enjoyable [TS]

  some of it was very edifying but there's [TS]

  there's a part of me that was I kind of [TS]

  wanted to be snooty that was that was [TS]

  one big piece of it being able to talk [TS]

  about Alberto echo [TS]

  me feel smart mm and I I mean I they're [TS]

  still god there's so much i get from [TS]

  that stuff everyday all this all the [TS]

  great books but like I have to admit [TS]

  that the time i was doing it wasn't that [TS]

  noble I wasn't like I was trying to [TS]

  become a judge or something [TS]

  it was because I wanted I i liked [TS]

  feeling smart and want to feel smartest [TS]

  to read a lot of stuff that other people [TS]

  will not admit they don't understand [TS]

  mm so I'm i can't speak for other people [TS]

  but you know I think there will be these [TS]

  Oh current things that come along [TS]

  sometimes that everybody's supposed to [TS]

  you know it's almost like an emperor's [TS]

  new clothes kind of situation where [TS]

  you're expected to say well of course of [TS]

  course I mean how many times have I read [TS]

  Ulysses my goodness but you know that's [TS]

  work it'sit's I don't know I don't know [TS]

  I think illiteracy is changing [TS]

  yeah yeah well I always had the I always [TS]

  had a difficult relationship with the [TS]

  people who read for red in the way that [TS]

  you're describing revered to to read as [TS]

  a a big because because I I i was i was [TS]

  often in a situation where I would be [TS]

  sitting in a in a salon of some kind [TS]

  listening to people talk about books and [TS]

  realizing that they were talking about [TS]

  books as a kind of inner in the same [TS]

  with it that people talk about sports [TS]

  and they were smart in the same way me [TS]

  know when pitchfork was at its darkest [TS]

  timeline pitchfork in years but when [TS]

  they first start to become so annoying [TS]

  it was almost like you know so you can [TS]

  learn about these records in order to [TS]

  know what to roll your eyes about right [TS]

  right right well to learn about the [TS]

  records or to learn about the books as [TS]

  though knowing about them was its own [TS]

  thing [TS]

  who and for me it's all the the point of [TS]

  art is always that you have an emotional [TS]

  that it that is a door to an emotional [TS]

  state or an intellectual state that you [TS]

  didn't have prior access to and so to [TS]

  read a book and to not feel something is [TS]

  fine but that's the evidence you're [TS]

  looking for i read this thing and I did [TS]

  not feel something ok [TS]

  that tells me something right or or I [TS]

  did feel something and here's what I [TS]

  felt either negative or positive [TS]

  or something i can't describe and so [TS]

  forth and so on like your those those [TS]

  pieces of art are always portals to a [TS]

  better understanding of your emotions or [TS]

  your or your mind and and so and music [TS]

  and it and books and paintings and all [TS]

  of that and so listening to people talk [TS]

  about books as though they are [TS]

  commodities to you know and and what's [TS]

  in store or end this is the same about [TS]

  record collectors like that what's [TS]

  important about them is the date they [TS]

  were published the authors prior [TS]

  relationship with some other author the [TS]

  number of books that it's sold than the [TS]

  the way that that book fits into the [TS]

  cannon in terms of how its its [TS]

  relationship to its time or other books [TS]

  I mean all that is is also interesting [TS]

  but it's addenda and for a lot of people [TS]

  it's not identify a lot of people that [TS]

  is the primary interface interface with [TS]

  the literary world or the painting world [TS]

  now maybe that's why they say it's like [TS]

  sports were part of the joy of it is [TS]

  like the more complex it becomes like [TS]

  this is exciting because the more I know [TS]

  about this the more I want to know about [TS]

  this [TS]

  well and so and went so but what's what [TS]

  was frustrating for me is that I would [TS]

  sit in these situations where i would be [TS]

  with smart people who were who were and [TS]

  I've told you before right that when I [TS]

  was growing up in Anchorage out i had a [TS]

  Vespa and so I I i thought i was a mod [TS]

  and I i loved the clothes that the mods [TS]

  war and I have the only best but in [TS]

  Alaska so as far as I knew like I was [TS]

  the only mod in the whole state in the [TS]

  nineteen eighties the least I the only [TS]

  one that I knew and then when I moved [TS]

  down to Seattle and I met some real mods [TS]

  i was so excited I was like I'm a modern [TS]

  i found the mods i was young and I went [TS]

  to a mod party or two and and then I was [TS]

  so disappointed to discover that they [TS]

  were incredibly boring the mods were not [TS]

  smart even more interesting they were [TS]

  just fashion EP people that had chosen a [TS]

  weird [TS]

  fashion uh-huh but so you know to be [TS]

  around people and have the conversation [TS]

  be like have you read this book [TS]

  well yes i did i read that book because [TS]

  I earlier read this other book and then [TS]

  this book of course is the next book [TS]

  that you read [TS]

  oh well did you did you realize that the [TS]

  author of that book actually did you [TS]

  know had this other book [TS]

  oh yes I read that book did you read [TS]

  this book and and they were playing a [TS]

  game which was that the connector game [TS]

  right that you read a book and then you [TS]

  know you know that you know that that [TS]

  book is pointing to a different book in [TS]

  the in the way that people think about [TS]

  the literary culture [TS]

  uh-huh and so you are playing this this [TS]

  reference game where you're hopping from [TS]

  lily pad to lily pad and the end the [TS]

  other person is also playing that game [TS]

  with you and trying to get ahead of you [TS]

  and reference a book in advance of where [TS]

  you're going to be in this conversation [TS]

  and and you are here you're using books [TS]

  as sort of social chess pieces with one [TS]

  another and i would kind of sit in these [TS]

  conversations and and everyone so I'll [TS]

  lean in and say like oh that you know [TS]

  that book was really interesting it made [TS]

  me sort of question like my masculinity [TS]

  in a way and and the conversation will [TS]

  come to a screeching halt and everybody [TS]

  would kind of look at me and then they [TS]

  go back to talking about the next book [TS]

  and the and the publisher of that book [TS]

  and you know that they were not [TS]

  interested in talking about what the [TS]

  books did to them and that is what [TS]

  passes for intellectual conversation a [TS]

  lot of the time you're not you're not [TS]

  really exploring the work and in a lot [TS]

  of cases I wasn't sure that they had [TS]

  read them but that the but it but if [TS]

  we're making a little bit of the spills [TS]

  and talk about comic books where when [TS]

  you're talking about a comic book or a [TS]

  character or a story our community leads [TS]

  you to the next character or book or [TS]

  story arc and you right there is not a [TS]

  lot of times where you sit down and you [TS]

  know [TS]

  talk about how it makes you feel yeah [TS]

  and you and you and so much of that [TS]

  comic book talks like this artist this [TS]

  sinker this this you know where it fits [TS]

  into the cannon and never where it [TS]

  resides in your in your heart or if it [TS]

  even does and that's the thing like a [TS]

  couple people give me give me stuff all [TS]

  the time and I read it and it's the rare [TS]

  thing and it should be rare that you [TS]

  read something and go like oh fuck now i [TS]

  am forever changed by this like this got [TS]

  inside me [TS]

  um and for me unfortunately if a thing [TS]

  doesn't get inside me that I don't want [TS]

  to talk about it I don't care about [TS]

  where it fits in the can and I don't [TS]

  care who the you know I don't care that [TS]

  this is a this is a work in somebody [TS]

  else's work pile like I'm looking for [TS]

  the thing that that that nabs me and if [TS]

  it doesn't then I don't care about its [TS]

  relationship and that and that is that [TS]

  makes it hard for and that's part of the [TS]

  problem of me with fan fan boy that's [TS]

  how it that's why I can't be a fanboy [TS]

  exactly because how many great works are [TS]

  there not that many [TS]

  and if you're just a if you if you just [TS]

  want to talk about the things that [TS]

  connected with you it's going to be [TS]

  different for every person and you you [TS]

  don't have that like bonding over the [TS]

  Marvel Universe for instance like what [TS]

  about the Marvel Universe really grabs [TS]

  me there are several things but but but [TS]

  not enough that I want to spend a lot of [TS]

  time talking about all the stuff that [TS]

  doesn't know right and that's just you [TS]

  know that's hard about rock and roll to [TS]

  mean I listen to The Strokes yesterday I [TS]

  wanted to hear the strokes I hadn't [TS]

  heard the strokes in in 10 years and I [TS]

  was like I want to hear that i want to [TS]

  try and remember that feeling that I [TS]

  heard the first time I heard the strokes [TS]

  and felt like oh shit why didn't I think [TS]

  of that right there definitely one of [TS]

  those bands [TS]

  yeah why didn't I think of that it was [TS]

  right there was sitting there right all [TS]

  along [TS]

  and and nobody thought of it until they [TS]

  thought of it and how do you feel after [TS]

  was about 2000-2001 probably was when [TS]

  their record hit big how's it feel now [TS]

  2001 is when the record it big when I [TS]

  can't separate that from the fact that [TS]

  is when the first long winters record [TS]

  came out I can't separate from 911 [TS]

  because they had to pull that song new [TS]

  york city cops from the album the choke [TS]

  they chose to because i thought was in [TS]

  poor taste given what happened [TS]

  yeah since 2001 wow that's when I don't [TS]

  really 2001 first long winters record [TS]

  came or yeah first ones record was done [TS]

  it didn't come out until 2002 but it was [TS]

  we were done making it and then the [TS]

  strokes record came out and was like oh [TS]

  wow fuck right that sound [TS]

  dang dang dang dang dang dang dang dang [TS]

  I'm mad a plateau about you know it and [TS]

  and 5000 bands duplicated that but had [TS]

  it had a lot of energy and a lot of it [TS]

  had a lot of swagger but without to [TS]

  without too much obvious like you know [TS]

  that whatever that dumb song by the [TS]

  australian band that are you gonna be my [TS]

  girl [TS]

  Bobby dumped down internet and it was [TS]

  like that's it was easy swagger it felt [TS]

  natural and it was a minimalist is the [TS]

  wrong word but it wasn't it wasn't [TS]

  overdone it was a it was just pretty [TS]

  much just like straight-up rock and roll [TS]

  where it's another one things like like [TS]

  the faces the faces come along and [TS]

  you're like why you know what did people [TS]

  do this before it's like the Rolling [TS]

  Stones like more distilled and [TS]

  surprising right [TS]

  just answer Pixies or these fans to come [TS]

  along like oh man that's that's why [TS]

  didn't we do this before [TS]

  yeah yeah and I feel like when that [TS]

  first long winters record came out the [TS]

  reaction for people was like oh yes this [TS]

  i remember that all music guide review [TS]

  its own app everyone see you sounded [TS]

  like REM and I never understood that [TS]

  yeah that i personally sounded like [TS]

  michael stipe we at the big one that the [TS]

  band sounded like REM which I maybe I [TS]

  just think of REM is a different band [TS]

  and the one they're comparing it to but [TS]

  like [TS]

  I mean I can hear how something like [TS]

  what maybe cinnamon has some [TS]

  instrumentation that could be [TS]

  reminiscent of a like early mid nineties [TS]

  REM but also had this wasn't what people [TS]

  played on ya fuckin actually has a look [TS]

  I know they're there was a there was a [TS]

  review during that era that was like [TS]

  this band sounds like REM and they [TS]

  actually got Peter Buck to play on it [TS]

  that is a bridge too far [TS]

  yeah but like that's so that's so lame I [TS]

  mean I remember he had produced a [TS]

  feelings album i liked a lot in college [TS]

  and played guitar on one of the songs [TS]

  but it still sounded like the feelings [TS]

  that didn't sound like REM i mean yeah [TS]

  yeah you got a bad rap for a while as [TS]

  long as we're digging up old wounds you [TS]

  got a bad rap for a while for the whole [TS]

  i will people talk about this band [TS]

  because it has people from other bands [TS]

  in it that are more famous and it's like [TS]

  that it's missed the entire point of why [TS]

  you know especially this first couple of [TS]

  us have such a place in my heart that [TS]

  you asked it really just fucking good [TS]

  albums [TS]

  yeah but they don't sound like anybody I [TS]

  just don't get that they don't know that [TS]

  but a you know I I can't [TS]

  when I think about all the bands that [TS]

  came out all the bands of my friends all [TS]

  the bands that came out during that era [TS]

  that didn't get any attention that [TS]

  didn't that didn't move the needle at [TS]

  all [TS]

  I can't look back and you don't do that [TS]

  whole period i kept I kept really really [TS]

  i mean more than anything really wanting [TS]

  to be to be suddenly important in that [TS]

  way that sometimes I mean it kind of not [TS]

  sometimes every season there's a band [TS]

  that's suddenly important and you look [TS]

  at it you listen to the music and you go [TS]

  yeah i mean i hear what's cool about [TS]

  that that song but i'm not sure if I get [TS]

  why this band is suddenly important and [TS]

  that band is you know like I i I'm and i [TS]

  ended up meeting a and really liking the [TS]

  singer of clap your hands say yeah [TS]

  or foster the people or or mean the the [TS]

  number of bands that in the course of my [TS]

  own career in music were just the band [TS]

  of the moment and I met enough of those [TS]

  people and been friends with enough of [TS]

  them that very few of them have a Death [TS]

  Cab career where they're just kind of [TS]

  the band of the moments multiple times [TS]

  until they until they're a stadium band [TS]

  and you kind of go out how what how did [TS]

  that happen [TS]

  uh-huh like clap your hands say yeah and [TS]

  to stick it didn't it didn't keep [TS]

  happening for them but they definitely [TS]

  had a had a six-month period there where [TS]

  they were the they were the band that [TS]

  people were talking about [TS]

  yeah and and when you ask them about [TS]

  that experience they're like oh man I [TS]

  wish that hadn't happened i wish that we [TS]

  had had a chance to be more organic and [TS]

  take our time and it was really weird [TS]

  and it blew up and then it was then it [TS]

  went away and I think about that when I [TS]

  was putting out those first couple of [TS]

  Records and I just wanted to be the band [TS]

  of the moment so badly and and then I [TS]

  realized like I was lucky i was lucky to [TS]

  get the attention I got and clap your [TS]

  hands say yeah I was lucky to get the [TS]

  attention they got like you really only [TS]

  you really only get your shot at it and [TS]

  I had mine and there was so much snark [TS]

  in the air at the time and some of it [TS]

  landed on us but but what is our what is [TS]

  our medical metacritic rating I mean [TS]

  it's still above 60 you know like I [TS]

  think we were I think we were we were [TS]

  appraised pretty accurately in the in [TS]

  the long run you know really don't i [TS]

  mean huh i don't know i would i would [TS]

  love to have I mean Yankee Hotel Foxtrot [TS]

  came out right around the same time as [TS]

  the first long winters record and yankee [TS]

  hotel foxtrot had all that story about [TS]

  how they took it to the majors in the [TS]

  majors didn't want it and they got it [TS]

  back and put it out themselves and [TS]

  was a validation of of indy culture and [TS]

  validation of fuck the man even though [TS]

  they put it out themselves on another [TS]

  imprint of their major label and they [TS]

  made that film right where they didn't [TS]

  wear this but there's one there's a lot [TS]

  of stories also just the whole like how [TS]

  it is supposedly started with the idea [TS]

  of like hearing those weird radio [TS]

  broadcasts you know the curtains to seem [TS]

  to be to no one in particular there's [TS]

  all kinds of things NPR could write a [TS]

  story about with regard to that album it [TS]

  was hella NPR yep [TS]

  um and and it was indeed rocket NPR for [TS]

  sure everybody had a story and it was it [TS]

  was right at the peak moment of that of [TS]

  that notion that sort of Sean Marshall [TS]

  cat power bonnie prince billy idea of [TS]

  indie rock artists who doesn't want to [TS]

  be famous [TS]

  who's really tortured by their fame and [TS]

  tortured by their own complicated mental [TS]

  world and so and so they didn't want it [TS]

  man [TS]

  they didn't want it they were forced [TS]

  into it because their work was so [TS]

  amazing and you know and and sitting on [TS]

  the other side of it and saying like [TS]

  well bonnie prince billy may be living [TS]

  in a in a tree fort and we may not want [TS]

  it but he sure seems to pose for a lot [TS]

  of photo shoots like you how long it [TS]

  takes two to do a photoshoot for for a [TS]

  major feature and imagine many somebody [TS]

  is paying his publicist [TS]

  yeah it takes a whole day of standing [TS]

  around getting your picture taken to get [TS]

  that picture that's on the cover of mojo [TS]

  or whatever and and there's a different [TS]

  picture of him every time I open a [TS]

  magazine so he's doing a lot of those [TS]

  janeane garofalo on regarding any [TS]

  veteran a kaiser helmet like okay well [TS]

  you know if you uh you don't want to be [TS]

  photographed in a kind of helmet like [TS]

  stopped showing up at photo shoots with [TS]

  Kaiser helmet right like much you know [TS]

  if you if you quit being but is [TS]

  certainly way more complicated than that [TS]

  it's super complicated but it's yeah but [TS]

  Yankee Hotel Foxtrot aesthetically was [TS]

  exploring a lot of similar ground [TS]

  to the first long winters record right [TS]

  we were using americana styles but we [TS]

  were spending a lot of time with broken [TS]

  keyboards and weird little like Lila [TS]

  phones and stuff before before that [TS]

  became ubiquitous and they were Yankee [TS]

  Hotel Foxtrot has a lot of sort of sonic [TS]

  landscapes which was also what we were [TS]

  trying to do on the first long winters [TS]

  record and we were making those records [TS]

  are they were somewhat contemporaneous [TS]

  with one another like I like I i forget [TS]

  when yankee hotel foxtrot came out but [TS]

  it was all it was already after we had [TS]

  finished the first long winters record [TS]

  maybe they came out about the same time [TS]

  and the way that their record was [TS]

  discussed in the popular culture as [TS]

  though it was a you know a life-changing [TS]

  event for everybody and who and a real [TS]

  like new idea and send sitting with our [TS]

  record kind of there in my hand offering [TS]

  it up to the world and saying like this [TS]

  is a this was motivated by similar [TS]

  similar ideas and the saw and their [TS]

  songs here that are that are equivalent [TS]

  equivalently good and to have it sort of [TS]

  not not only like not be embraced at [TS]

  that same level obviously but but not [TS]

  discussed in that way even not the [TS]

  language used to describe our record was [TS]

  not the same and and and that was the [TS]

  that was the big my big my initial big [TS]

  resentment toward the decemberists was [TS]

  that so there-there record came out and [TS]

  people are like it is the literary it is [TS]

  this is the music that smart people will [TS]

  listen to have you heard these lyrics [TS]

  have you have you sat down with your [TS]

  pince-nez on and read these lyrics [TS]

  because this is where this is the future [TS]

  of smart people music and i was like i [TS]

  also have [TS]

  lyrics that that i would but i would [TS]

  love it if you would read them a couple [TS]

  of times everyone hello and you know in [TS]

  our our reviews were like you know indie [TS]

  rock stuff here here's a band making [TS]

  some indie rock music and and you know [TS]

  that there it is right and that's what [TS]

  we were doing but but I could never [TS]

  quite figure out how to get yourself in [TS]

  the lens of that of that culture sniper [TS]

  and and and and honestly everybody that [TS]

  makes stuff kind of wants to be there [TS]

  and then as soon as they are they don't [TS]

  want to be there and they disavow ever [TS]

  having wanted to be there because it [TS]

  happens but before you have time to [TS]

  really realize it's happening [TS]

  sometimes well that I may have told you [TS]

  about this before but in night early [TS]

  nineteen ninety-one i was sitting in a [TS]

  cafe in seattle and reading i think the [TS]

  rocket which was one of at the time [TS]

  Seattle had like four alternative [TS]

  newspapers and the rocket was the rock [TS]

  and roll one and it was a long interview [TS]

  with nirvana pre never mind during which [TS]

  kurt cobain kind of spent a lot of the [TS]

  interview saying like we're gonna be the [TS]

  biggest band in the world where the [TS]

  where our record is the best record [TS]

  anybody's ever made and we're gonna be [TS]

  huge and just really love like like [TS]

  lapping it up and loving it and and [TS]

  wanting wanting it you know and i [TS]

  remember reading it at the time also [TS]

  being a 21 year old who wanted to be a [TS]

  rock star and be like yeah man like [TS]

  that's the attitude that's that rock and [TS]

  roll attitude and and there was some [TS]

  irony in it for sure but he was also [TS]

  saying we've made the best rock and roll [TS]

  record you've ever heard and I can't [TS]

  wait for you to hear it and he was [TS]

  talking about nevermind but it hadn't [TS]

  come out yet and he was just like this [TS]

  is going to blow people's minds it's [TS]

  fucking killer and fast forward a year [TS]

  and reading the press where he was like [TS]

  this record didn't sound like we wanted [TS]

  to was too polished it was to wrong [TS]

  can roll with the major label hired an [TS]

  outside mixer and made it all slick [TS]

  that's not who we are and you know if [TS]

  the story had really changed and I [TS]

  imagine in his mind it was true what he [TS]

  was saying but and I've never been able [TS]

  to find that rocket interview and I [TS]

  never heard anything like that from him [TS]

  that I know of [TS]

  yeah it was really on that a scholar of [TS]

  Kurt Cobain died I'm much more familiar [TS]

  with the other kind of story [TS]

  yeah right the other story became my [TS]

  canon but the but that with the early [TS]

  early talk from him on that was like [TS]

  this is going to kick ass and because [TS]

  they were 21 and it made a killer rock [TS]

  record and they you know they had to [TS]

  know it right [TS]

  I and they were excited they were [TS]

  excited because you don't wear a kaiser [TS]

  helmet to a photo shoot unless you where [TS]

  you want your picture taken wearing a [TS]

  kaiser helmet and honestly you don't [TS]

  make a kick-ass rock record unless you [TS]

  want to make a kick you want to be a [TS]

  kick-ass rock band and you always gonna [TS]

  remember that there was no Nirvana [TS]

  before Nirvana that you know whatever [TS]

  happened in the two or three years after [TS]

  that you see as the you know there's a [TS]

  precedent with them but listen I mean it [TS]

  must have been seems like a really big [TS]

  deal because of all the bands that you [TS]

  could pick out of the lineup in 1990-91 [TS]

  they would not necessarily be the one [TS]

  you would pick two to be the ones to get [TS]

  a DC contract and get the biggest record [TS]

  in years right [TS]

  I mean and you tell me yeah no i don't i [TS]

  went to pick the fastbacks before that [TS]

  well or money i mean around Seattle like [TS]

  what was cool like money was cool and [TS]

  Nirvana was kind of seen as like [TS]

  Mudhoney wannabes because mommy had that [TS]

  like fuck you man at that was in their [TS]

  sound and in their attitude and if you [TS]

  look at money photo shoots from that era [TS]

  they didn't show up wearing a kaiser [TS]

  helmet they showed up covered in vomit [TS]

  and and so according to the standards of [TS]

  the time [TS]

  according to the language of the time [TS]

  they were way cooler and more authentic [TS]

  and and and their sound reflected that [TS]

  and there and the shit that they said I [TS]

  mean they were funny rai but also they [TS]

  were they were the [TS]

  were they were the [TS]

  come they were the punk-rock monkeys or [TS]

  the punk rock hard day's night where [TS]

  instead of saying like turn left at [TS]

  Greenland they would take the reporters [TS]

  microphone and and dunk it in a bucket [TS]

  of beer and say this interviews over [TS]

  fuck you and buy it by comparison [TS]

  Nirvana was polished and I mean more [TS]

  polished and more ambitious and you know [TS]

  they had that they there was that song [TS]

  that mean they were there were there [TS]

  were a couple of Nirvana lyrics that [TS]

  we're kind of cribbed out of mud honey [TS]

  lyrics enough that it was noticeable and [TS]

  the people remarked on it wow like i [TS]

  didn't i didn't Mudhoney already write [TS]

  that song i think they did but the [TS]

  Nirvana version of it was just a little [TS]

  bit more listenable so and also you know [TS]

  we think of kurt cobain is being very [TS]

  photogenic now but but that but they [TS]

  weren't very photogenic like that just [TS]

  the contrast between crisp who was 6 7 [TS]

  and curt who was 57 was it was weird [TS]

  looking right i mean they that they were [TS]

  only cute after after they had a little [TS]

  bit of style put on also Kurt Cobain had [TS]

  almost like almost like a like a Manson [TS]

  vibe sometimes you have right [TS]

  he looks really manic and bad skin and [TS]

  didn't know how do you know that whole [TS]

  period where he was dying his hair black [TS]

  and stuff just no thank you [TS]

  but after the fact you look back and and [TS]

  it all seems like it was it was faded to [TS]

  be when i got to seattle they were [TS]

  already up they were a big band because [TS]

  bleed should come out and they were one [TS]

  of the they were one of the big bands [TS]

  but they were playing at the ok hotel [TS]

  it's not like they were even playing the [TS]

  showbox they were they could sell 3 400 [TS]

  tickets [TS]

  and people its people weren't like [TS]

  snipping off a lock of his hair or [TS]

  anything [TS]

  yeah but then that record came out and [TS]

  boy it really connected and connected [TS]

  connected with the with everybody [TS]

  immediately [TS]

  uh-huh 25 years ago 24 years ago huh [TS]

  24 years ago this month right it came [TS]

  out in august-september right I think I [TS]

  i first started on mtv i think i dont [TS]

  even here on the I don't you know what I [TS]

  might have heard it on the college radio [TS]

  station but I I very specifically [TS]

  remember when the video because i was [TS]

  watching MTV a lot then and when the [TS]

  video came out and I taped it and like I [TS]

  was in its thrall i thought was the [TS]

  greatest songs ever heard [TS]

  yeah it was such a good song that even L [TS]

  Yankovic's version of it was something [TS]

  that I wanted to hear like a it would [TS]

  have somebody had so many good parts to [TS]

  it [TS]

  I mean you know I'm why i say this too [TS]

  much but there was so many hooks in that [TS]

  song but the hooks were there so [TS]

  sometimes so weird or just so satisfying [TS]

  I mean like you know just I mean the [TS]

  drums on that song alone or just like [TS]

  yeah to put them to put them to put them [TS]

  together [TS]

  I know and when you fairly recent [TS]

  addition to the band at that point yep [TS]

  yep it was outsider not even from the [TS]

  Northwest man the he's somebody's [TS]

  Virginia interviews over that [TS]

  yeah eh fuck you fuck your corporate [TS]

  rock magazines bad [TS]

  here we are here we are 25 years later [TS]

  and that's our legacy right it's not [TS]

  like not like oh yes the Freedom Riders [TS]

  haha yes the we we ended the war in [TS]

  Vietnam know it's like look your [TS]

  corporate rock magazines bad [TS]

  ya ready that's this episode of Roderick [TS]

  on the line is brought to you by [TS]

  braintree code for easy online payments [TS]

  to learn more now visit braintree [TS]

  payments calm / supertrain if you're a [TS]

  mobile app developer and I know many of [TS]

  you are please check out braintree [TS]

  braintree is the payment solution that [TS]

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  go to braintree payments dot-com / [TS]

  supertrain our thanks to braintree for [TS]

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  and for supporting Roderick on the lines [TS]

  that will be our epitaph press now sorry [TS]

  yeah i know it happens a lot a it [TS]

  happens a lot and what oh you know what [TS]

  the latest one for me was fun it was [TS]

  realizing that barack obama was elected [TS]

  president of the United States when he [TS]

  was 47 years old [TS]

  and at the time when he was 47 years old [TS]

  I i was what 3938 was I 331 you're that [TS]

  young i was 39 but able to say like oh [TS]

  right well 47 of course is like [TS]

  presidential age right [TS]

  it's not like he's getting elected [TS]

  president at 39 which is still a young [TS]

  it's a young man who 397 a lot of living [TS]

  did a lot of living really fell Merlin [TS]

  next month I will be 47 years old i will [TS]

  be 47 years old and I can't even make it [TS]

  through the primary of seattle city [TS]

  council election let alone get elected [TS]

  president of the united states didn't [TS]

  win the primary didn't win it huh was [TS]

  close wasn't even close [TS]

  who was not close pretty definitive not [TS]

  really a lot of opportunity to step in [TS]

  and say like I believe there were some [TS]

  voting irregularities I would I demand a [TS]

  recount who like none of that was that [TS]

  there was not an opportunity for that [TS]

  it's been a couple weeks now it's been a [TS]

  couple weeks [TS]

  just about just about a couple weeks [TS]

  tomorrow couple weeks yeah [TS]

  yep yep sort of still so processing it [TS]

  you know in the same the same way that [TS]

  they used to say that if you smoke pot [TS]

  it would you could still detected in [TS]

  your hair and your fingernails [TS]

  Oh several weeks after months after and [TS]

  if you smoke cigars you get high again [TS]

  my that one [TS]

  mm so how's your how's your hair doing [TS]

  is coming out uh the pot the elections [TS]

  and even you know analogy is anymore so [TS]

  I'm just cycling I'm just pushing it out [TS]

  through my pores I'm just I'm just I'm [TS]

  sure that that campaign is still going [TS]

  to be in my fingernails in my hair for a [TS]

  while but I've but the you know the part [TS]

  of it that would be detectable in my [TS]

  urine is maybe now starting to pass and [TS]

  I'm getting back on getting back on a [TS]

  regular amour amour normal even key [TS]

  Joel you sound a lot better I don't know [TS]

  what that's mean if it means anything [TS]

  but you do sound better [TS]

  yeah lets you so much bad yeah yeah if [TS]

  you want to wait a week I i we can also [TS]

  talk about Evel Knievel well yeah i do [TS]

  want to i want to share my whole [TS]

  experience with everybody and and I [TS]

  always knew that would take a little bit [TS]

  of processing time and i'm still I know [TS]

  I'm still processing it so why don't we [TS]

  talk about Evel Knievel and al-qaeda [TS]

  kidding and i will put a bookmark you [TS]

  know put a tad little-little attack in [TS]

  it uh-huh [TS]

  because I do want to know you wanted to [TS]

  discourse extensively on on the [TS]

  experience now that I am NOT under such [TS]

  intense scrutiny right because I feel [TS]

  like I owe that to everybody and also i [TS]

  would it will be interesting for me but [TS]

  but uh but I'm very very interested in [TS]

  Evel Knievel i don't know why i brought [TS]

  it up [TS]

  is that a is that a thing that is Evel [TS]

  Knievel back in the news you're talking [TS]

  about how you like you know people talk [TS]

  about books kinda jump from one thing to [TS]

  the next idea that sometimes i'm [TS]

  watching TV [TS]

  he is one reason why i frequently don't [TS]

  watch a whole movie yet you so you have [TS]

  one of those remote control dinguses [TS]

  that allows you to to jump around or are [TS]

  you talking about you actually you [TS]

  actually touch the mousepad no no no i [TS]

  mean i have a television I'm not an [TS]

  animal [TS]

  you know i watch things on the TV but [TS]

  yeah you watch things on the TV but they [TS]

  are coming from the internet they can [TS]

  they can but you also have cable [TS]

  no I'm a cord cutter so you cut the cord [TS]

  you have a do you have a disc for a dud [TS]

  a dirt I have a bluray / DVD player [TS]

  that's not currently plugged in but it's [TS]

  there if it's if it's needs to be called [TS]

  upon [TS]

  no I mean they like a rooftop uh I don't [TS]

  know we don't get we don't get any TV in [TS]

  the normal sense at our house which is [TS]

  what makes going to a hotel room so [TS]

  staggering for my family because my kids [TS]

  been brought up you know [TS]

  in a house that just doesn't have [TS]

  commercials it's so weird cause she [TS]

  loves them so much i think it's her [TS]

  favorite part of the show the [TS]

  commercials loves the commercials we [TS]

  talk about this like we'll be going out [TS]

  to eat because you know you can't go out [TS]

  to eat unless their televisions [TS]

  everywhere right and she'll just be rapt [TS]

  attention so just be staring at like the [TS]

  infomercial about golf [TS]

  there are much louder and much brighter [TS]

  than the normal show absolutely [TS]

  absolutely but now she's entirely in [TS]

  trance by this but it's it's strange [TS]

  because you know that means that she's [TS]

  growing up watching like reality shows [TS]

  like project runway where they do the [TS]

  whole big like cliffhanger and then they [TS]

  go to commercial and then come back and [TS]

  there's a cliffhanger music and they say [TS]

  what they just said right before they [TS]

  went to commercial [TS]

  it's like why did they say that twice as [TS]

  well because there's like two minutes of [TS]

  commercials that we didn't see right [TS]

  uh-huh [TS]

  no i don't know i was texting you last [TS]

  night was watching a movie by the Evel [TS]

  Knievel and now you just made me think [TS]

  of you because in the first few minutes [TS]

  they interviewed Matthew McConaughey and [TS]

  Guy Fieri and Uncle Bob Einstein on the [TS]

  first few minutes so you yeah you sent [TS]

  me on a little bit of a Bob Einstein [TS]

  trip last night where I i watched i [TS]

  watched his comedians in cars getting [TS]

  coffee [TS]

  all good did you enjoy that with the [TS]

  mercedes 300 SEL what the hell of a car [TS]

  beautiful car i was looking for one of [TS]

  those for a long time I thought that I [TS]

  would I thought that would be the car [TS]

  that i actually went and test drove some [TS]

  and a 300-horsepower engine in a car [TS]

  that sighs ah yeah 280 whole horsepower [TS]

  yeah I wasn't it was like the big [TS]

  Mercedes v8 they kind of just slammed [TS]

  into the regular size car and yeah [TS]

  they're they're amazing but you know [TS]

  they were amazing at the time the [TS]

  problem is now any like any like base [TS]

  model kia with a four-cylinder motor we [TS]

  have in automotive technology that has [TS]

  improved so much that you know through [TS]

  the through the alchemy of like torque [TS]

  and and revs [TS]

  and tuning they have basically achieved [TS]

  with these tiny little motors in these [TS]

  tiny little cars an ability to go way [TS]

  faster [TS]

  well it feels like the pickup is where [TS]

  it's changed it feels like every you [TS]

  know youyou we live through those years [TS]

  where pretty much every American car was [TS]

  not that super good somewhere nicer than [TS]

  others but it feels like any car [TS]

  American or internationally produced [TS]

  almost any car from the last even 10 [TS]

  years that i sat down and felt fine and [TS]

  had enough pick up to like be able to [TS]

  get onto the highway and it just didn't [TS]

  used to be that way [TS]

  yeah well I'm the fuel-injection what [TS]

  Scott about how they do that [TS]

  yeah it's all that kind of stuff it's [TS]

  physics it's again the cars don't have [TS]

  carburetors anymore they're all fuel [TS]

  injected and they all are geared us in a [TS]

  way where your first gear and your [TS]

  second gear are really torquay so they [TS]

  so you get all this off the line sort of [TS]

  jump like my my high school car was a 19 [TS]

  this is before i bought the Fiat might [TS]

  the first the first real car and I [TS]

  inherited from my dad [TS]

  it was a 1972 chrysler newport imperial [TS]

  and it was a coup pay the two door with [TS]

  a sort of opera window that had a and [TS]

  ahead of vinyl top and the color was [TS]

  like metallic copper metallic copper [TS]

  Kupe but but uh it when you think of a [TS]

  coupe like a like a two-door you think [TS]

  of it being a hot-rod car but this [TS]

  chrysler newport Imperial was 45 feet [TS]

  long and weigh like this up was in the [TS]

  style of the time right [TS]

  pre pre energy crisis [TS]

  oh my god what a boat it and that is [TS]

  exactly what we called it the boat [TS]

  that's a two-door yeah [TS]

  it's just the trouble such as 20 feet [TS]

  long but the trunk is 20 feet long and [TS]

  and the inside was a was like [TS]

  upholstered in exactly the fabric that [TS]

  you would you would have honor like a [TS]

  grandmother's couch use a 74 it was it [TS]

  was 74 Imperial you know an end and the [TS]

  largest island ltd yet but bigger and [TS]

  and and Chrysler right but I mean just [TS]

  in terms like I think if I like a LTR [TS]

  continental file from for is what it [TS]

  reminds me of it it looks like it's a [TS]

  nod to that but it's a little sporty-er [TS]

  and it's it's long in the front it's [TS]

  long in the back its long in the middle [TS]

  this impossibly my god it's ridiculous [TS]

  and so my Chrysler had a 440 like a very [TS]

  very big motor the displacement of the [TS]

  of the motor was pretty much as large as [TS]

  you could get there there are obviously [TS]

  we're bigger motors that Cadillac had [TS]

  like a 472 or something but but 440 was [TS]

  very very big engine and and yet the car [TS]

  was geared and designed to cruise on [TS]

  America's highways and from a stoplight [TS]

  if I would slam down the pedal it would [TS]

  immediately burn two gallons of gas but [TS]

  the car didn't like peel out it didn't [TS]

  it it sort of you know it it's its [TS]

  initial reaction to having the gas pedal [TS]

  slam down was sort of like oh god really [TS]

  ok [TS]

  [Music] [TS]

  like lurch forward and then hit its [TS]

  stride at about 65 miles an hour so if [TS]

  you know it weighed I'm 5,000 5,000 it [TS]

  wait and wait over it with over two tons [TS]

  yeah so it would it would at about six [TS]

  if you're doing a quarter-mile against [TS]

  somebody you know like any scirocco or [TS]

  any volkswagen golf could just school it [TS]

  in a quarter-mile but if you were doing [TS]

  a mile or you know or or but two miles [TS]

  straight away like forget about it this [TS]

  car could could go a hundred and forty [TS]

  miles an hour and and it just wanted to [TS]

  like the faster it went it just kind of [TS]

  would sit down on its haunches it just [TS]

  kind of got it would just get lower and [TS]

  darker like there was a gear it's [TS]

  switched gears at a hundred and ten [TS]

  there was another gear at a hundred and [TS]

  ten miles an hour it would go into a [TS]

  further like overdrive and you'd be [TS]

  going like it would down shift at a [TS]

  hundred and ten which means that it was [TS]

  meant to stay up there they designed it [TS]

  in such a way that it was like well a [TS]

  210 you're gonna want to have a cruising [TS]

  gear at that point right so that [TS]

  mentality and I mean and obviously it [TS]

  was just it was burning it a gallon gas [TS]

  every every minute but that mentality [TS]

  compared two cars now where none of [TS]

  these little cars can go a hundred miles [TS]

  an hour and if they and if you got one [TS]

  up 200 miles an hour you wouldn't want [TS]

  to stay there they check themselves [TS]

  apart but so that Mercedes that 300 it's [TS]

  it's a fast car and a very cool smooth [TS]

  running car but it's the same thing it's [TS]

  decided to go a hundred miles an hour [TS]

  all day long and kind of [TS]

  they're like a like a brick on ice [TS]

  I stepfather i'm pretty sure had the [TS]

  successor which is the chrysler new [TS]

  yorker brown [TS]

  oh that work for you are that's a i [TS]

  remember it was hard to close the doors [TS]

  and they were so it was electric windows [TS]

  which course maybe even heavier it was [TS]

  it was so impossibly heavy it was hard [TS]

  to close the doors because the doors [TS]

  themselves weighed so much [TS]

  yeah well I mean there's a lot of [TS]

  velocity once you got it moving you [TS]

  could like was a kid in that door [TS]

  yeah yeah we had we had a lot of fun in [TS]

  that car but unfortunately I was not it [TS]

  was a late bloomer [TS]

  so all of the greats like all of the [TS]

  wonderful sexcapades that I potentially [TS]

  could have had if I was a little bit [TS]

  more of a fast mover by the time by the [TS]

  time i was ready to to really make out [TS]

  with somebody in the in the on the [TS]

  comfortable couch in the backseat of [TS]

  that car the car was gone did I ever [TS]

  tell you what what happened to that car [TS]

  I got back to I got back to Anchorage [TS]

  after some trip and I was like where's [TS]

  the boat and my dad said oh I gave it to [TS]

  the city of Fort Yukon my dad at the [TS]

  time was was working as a the city of [TS]

  Fort Yukon had encountered some [TS]

  financial problems and was kind of going [TS]

  bankrupt and it was it was governed by a [TS]

  board by a kind of city council but it [TS]

  was it was also part of a native [TS]

  corporation and and so my dad went there [TS]

  to help them [TS]

  straighten out their town and kind of [TS]

  ended up for a time being a sort of [TS]

  unelected mayor chairman or you know [TS]

  like consigliere just an ad-hoc [TS]

  burgermeister yeah somebody to come up [TS]

  there and and and and my dad and my [TS]

  uncle both sort of help the city of for [TS]

  UConn [TS]

  over the course of several years figure [TS]

  out how to govern itself because they [TS]

  were alliances between families in the [TS]

  town then and there was a board that was [TS]

  sort of run by a guy and they had in the [TS]

  style of the time like there was the [TS]

  town but they also owned an airline the [TS]

  town-owned its own airline and they had [TS]

  and they were right on the river and it [TS]

  was a confusing place anyway we used to [TS]

  go up there quite a bit when my dad [TS]

  would have business there but I came [TS]

  home from some long trip and he said I [TS]

  gave your car to the city of for UConn [TS]

  and I said that was my car it still had [TS]

  my stuff in the trunk man did you open [TS]

  the trunk and empty it out and he was [TS]

  like oh no i didn't and i was like there [TS]

  was there was my stuff was in it like in [TS]

  the in the in the backseat my coat and a [TS]

  lot of things that seems really i mean [TS]

  there's like a package of oreos in the [TS]

  glove box that I was still working my [TS]

  way through and he was like well you [TS]

  know they for whatever reason I needed I [TS]

  I felt like it was sitting in my [TS]

  driveway and and they needed it and so [TS]

  it's now that it's now the car is now [TS]

  the city car mean there are other cars [TS]

  and for you come but this was now the [TS]

  city government car is a point that [TS]

  that's very generous but like what a [TS]

  cautionary tale I never want to do that [TS]

  to my kids car [TS]

  well and also in order to get it to for [TS]

  UConn he had to drive it up to the end [TS]

  of the road and put it on a barge and [TS]

  ship it down the Yukon River because [TS]

  there's no Road to the city of for UConn [TS]

  you can only get there by airplane or by [TS]

  barge and he barged it to for UConn and [TS]

  then of course the river froze and I you [TS]

  know I was arriving home in in december [TS]

  or something and it was like there's no [TS]

  getting you can't get the car if even [TS]

  even if you went up there and said give [TS]

  me my car back there wouldn't be any way [TS]

  to retrieve it has been setting a lot of [TS]

  work [TS]

  it was a big my dad you know he never [TS]

  did anything half-assed well that's not [TS]

  true he did everything FS but he never [TS]

  he did not give my car away half asked [TS]

  he gave my car away in the in the most [TS]

  fully asked way possible [TS]