4: A Decent Thing That Someone Would Like, with MG Siegler
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beautiful blues with java i'm going to
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wish you a Happy android first day
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yes very happy android first day i'm
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glad glad the timing of this this
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episode surround the betta almost
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perfectly it was a movement six months
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ago six months ago Eric Schmidt very
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smartly made a couple of predictions
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yeah LOL so there were actually i think
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there were three right he made he
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obviously made the one saying that by
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this state you know he thought that uh
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android-developers a would kind of be
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sorry developers in general be focusing
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on Android first instead of iOS he he
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made the prediction that Google
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television or there would be the vast
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majority of TV's on the market would be
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running some form of google TV and what
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was the third thing all the there would
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be some sort of killer tablet this was
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sort of a weird one because like I think
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was translated from some some foreign
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press thing but uh something about a
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killer tablet coming out around this
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time that might be the one that he's
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only somewhat often i think i think they
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will have something along those lines
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that their upcoming io conference but
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still still not quite six months a
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little bit more than sex once I am I
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think that the the TV one in particular
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was that not that there would be half
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the tvs and use would have google TV but
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half the tvs and stores in the US with
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right have something I haven't been the
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best buy this week i have not been the
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best buy but i'm guessing if i did and i
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kept a tally and I'm guessing it's a
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little under fifty percent yeah they may
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have gotten a big shipment in yesterday
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I was worried about two weeks ago I i
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don't recall seeing any butter
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I'm sure I'm sure he had some reason to
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suggest that that this was actually
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going to happen and i'm sure we'll hear
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more about it at Google i/o again
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the kids have been complaining about
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this show the talk shows usually that it
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is rambling and unfocused those are the
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adjectives that come up a lot from
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people who don't seem to like it i have
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i have a bad feeling that this
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particular episode maybe the word smug
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yeah that's a tough as they come up
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sometimes I my special guest this week
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i'm speaking to mg Siegler of Paris
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lemon fame and techcrunch in and various
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other endeavors and and I think you and
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I have a sort of shared reputation for
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4i i'm not sure how to describe it being
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poor poor sports right being you know
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not acknowledging androids winning ways
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many capacity I guess right all right
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and you know and I i think that you and
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I again this is so far this one of the
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talk show it's a lot of people who who
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I'm on the same page with but I think
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you you approach this the same way I do
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and you've done a lot of work with mike
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arrington who I have a funny
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relationship with but i do think though
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that one thing that the three of us
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agree on you mean you mike arrington is
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that you'd if you're writing about this
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stuff just call a spade a spade
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alright just lay it out there and I'm
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not gonna die i say to people I'm not
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going to sit here and bend over
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backwards to make somebody who's in
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second place seem like they're closer to
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first base first place than they really
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are just just because somebody thinks
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that's the way it should be
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yeah totally yeah i totally agree with
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that obviously and i think you know when
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we do get lumped into this this group
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that's some people feel is being unfair
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to guess the android camp it's you know
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it is just because that's the way we see
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it and I think for good reason and i
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think you know over time a lot of people
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have a have come over to this site as
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well but it's just got to be very
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those who see it a different way I guess
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and yeah i mean along those lines I
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remember what was the thing a few i
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guess it was a couple weeks ago where I
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think it was david poe grow some kind of
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review about some gadget I forget what
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it was i he might have been an android
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gadget maybe a windows phone thing I
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don't really remember what it was but
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someone I think it was a BuzzFeed i
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think it was Matt you can adjust yeah
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I'm apart 44 kinda you know make going
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out of his way to make it sound like you
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know this is a decent thing that that
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someone would like it's not clear that
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someone was that someone even exists in
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the real world but I those things are
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always pretty funny to me right as i
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call it grading on a curve
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yeah right it's this bending over
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backwards to make it seem as though it's
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it's more competitive than it really is
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because i had the bottom line was it was
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the the samsung galaxy player 4.2 I I'd
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i think i can do is write it was the
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ipod touch competitor right from Samsung
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and it does seem like finally five years
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later they've got a pretty good version
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of the ipod touch meaning in it like it
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like a high-end android phone without
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the phone but it was really really funny
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to read post take on well why would you
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buy this instead of the ipod touch and
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its really really hard you know that's a
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hard thing to come up with ya and I
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totally acknowledge that if you work at
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samsung or HTC any of these companies
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you're in the hole on this but it's it's
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like anything where if if you're behind
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it's not enough to catch up to who's in
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the lead you've got it put something out
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there that's that's in some ways ten
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yep totally agree thats that's like
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that's windows phone right now in a
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nutshell to you know it's great it's a
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good product but is it ten times better
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than than the iphone and you know
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certainly not with apps there's a what
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did they hit I think they did they hit a
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hundred thousand apps or something the
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other day but it's like you know that
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metric doesn't really matter that much
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anymore and I don't even know if they
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have a good percentage of the top apps
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on there it's just you know who who
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knows what those a hundred thousand apps
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or in it and if they matter to anyone
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but you know we'll see what uh what all
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this windows 8 stuff if that changes
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things at all from from an app
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developers perspective
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yeah I'm pretty bearish right now on on
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windows 8 in general i don't know i
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don't know how much you've talked about
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it and I've said some things here and
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there I think you and I are on the same
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page where I just don't understand it
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you know i like the metro stuff and i
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kinda just wish they were doing that I
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know why they're not I mean they have
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the legacy and they have all those users
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they can't just abandon straight up but
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i think it's going to kind of be a
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nightmare I've only used prototype stuff
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but i think it's going to be a nightmare
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trying to reconcile those two completely
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different things into some kind of
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seamless operating system
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yeah I i think the bottom line and I'm
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fascinated to see how it turns out
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and if anybody can make it work it is
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Microsoft because there's one of their
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things that they've done right
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institutionally for 30 years is they've
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done a great job at moving legacy
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platforms forward and and moving people
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with them so like their transition from
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that command line das PC era to the
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graphical computing era was it was ugly
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and it right involved a bunch of lurches
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but they did move the existing
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market-leading daus user base to windows
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yet slowly but surely over a couple of
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releases yep but I think in and doesn't
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matter big or small big meaning like
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Microsoft Windows you know the biggest
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platform in the history of computing or
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small something like well I've been
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thinking about this a lot is with
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panik's new version of coded for the mac
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is that where you start with something
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in a design forever effects it going
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forward and what I mean by that with
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koda is koda is designed its for anybody
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is no it's like a one window web
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development app you can edit HTML you
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can edit PHP and other scripting
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it as a whole bunch of stuff to make CSS
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editing easier it has documentation for
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all sorts of web development
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technologies like HTML CSS preview
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windows and remote connection stuff
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which panic specializes in because they
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make transmit this great ftps FTP File
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Transfer things interact but the main
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thing is that it's the main conceit of
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coda ever since it came out five years
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ago is that it all in one window vs more
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traditional apps like say bbedit or even
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textmate where it's sort of each text
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file is in a window and even in text me
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where that it's more little bit more tab
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oriented than bbedit it still is a
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different paradigm and I think it's
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harder for an app like BBM edit to to
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move towards something like a one window
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development and it would be hard for
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Panik to take kota and say well hey some
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people want stuff in a whole bunch of
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how can we add how can we make an update
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Dakota or you can have everything in a
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different window like you start with
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this design and you're kind of stuck
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with and what Apple is done and i think
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i think it to me it just clicks and it
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makes sense is that they said look
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there's a new way to do all this stuff
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so we're going to start with a new
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platform we're going to sell this thing
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this ipad that is like a computer it's
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like a laptop more or less but we're not
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going to run Mac os10 on it at all
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we're not going to use the name
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something look like it's going to be all
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started over from scratch and it's going
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to have all these restrictions and all
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these limitations that you're not used
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to but because we're starting over it
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doesn't feel like we're breaking
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anything it's all new ground yeah
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whereas with windows 8 I really feel
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like as they get closer and closer
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people are really running into this but
◼
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wait a minute you're going to break all
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of this stuff that I'm used to
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yeah and that and what's funny the most
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funny thing about that is that the way
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that they set it up you know what's this
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Steven Sinofsky the guys that you know
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in charge windows he keeps hurting these
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epically long post on the windows blogs
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but you know he set up whenever it was
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several months ago now that Windows 8 is
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but no compromises but i think it's like
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you can view it both ways either they're
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not compromising in that they're there
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including everything that everyone could
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ever want and is that in it in and of
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itself a compromise because they're not
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actually giving the best user experience
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they're just throwing kinda everything
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in there and hoping it all works
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together and you know so far the early
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reviews of the it was at the release
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►
candidate or whatever just that just
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came out have been you know they say
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good things in general but switching
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between those two different interfaces
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is very jarring and and it's going to
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confuse the hell out of people right and
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the out that I see is with winrt which
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is the goofily name right the armed
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yeah which isn't going to isn't going to
◼
►
start and we know what r T stands for is
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a real time with runtime what is it
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we know you know I don't know I think
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maybe run time but it's an awful name
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that really is yeah yeah but that's the
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one we're not going to have the legacy
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support they've got right maps in there
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like the built-in office apps which
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don't really look like metro they look a
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little bit more like traditional Windows
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but they really are supposedly touch
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oriented right and you can't install
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traditional windows looking apps on the
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getting so there won't be all this weird
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context switching yeah and that's that's
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great and I you know I know again I know
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why they couldn't do that overall just
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the sheer numbers that they be leaving
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behind and and and risk alienating
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completely but you know maybe maybe that
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version does better because it's uh it's
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kind of fresh and from the ground up but
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I don't know but then then it's like
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when you go to a store and you want to
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buy some kind of Windows machine do you
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buy the windows RT one with the armed
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ship to you by a similar-looking tablet
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device but has an intel chip and so it
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runs you know whatever the other flavor
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of Windows 8 is that's called it runs on
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the the old architecture
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it's like I don't know that seems like
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just a branding nightmare and a a
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consumer nightmare waiting to happen
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it really does to me because it seemed
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as if it it really doesn't seem
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confusing to me if it
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typical person just regular non nerve
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walks into an apple store that the
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difference between a mac and the ipad is
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very very different different names
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right different interface it it's all
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it's just a piece of glass this is super
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simple this is the thing I've heard
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about and here's the mac which is I
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understand even if you never use the mac
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surely you've used windows this is
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apple's thing that's like a regular pc
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with keyboard and windows and the mouse
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that you dragged around there's no
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confusion nobody's walking out with the
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wrong thing whereas I really really
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don't understand exactly what you said
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is if you go into a store and they have
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intel-based windows 8 tablets running
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the full version of Windows 8 and arm
◼
►
tablets that are running when Artie I
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really really don't understand how
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anybody except true nerds is going to
◼
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understand what what the heck the
◼
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differences in which one you might want
◼
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to buy right and so then Microsoft has
◼
►
to hope you know that they can open
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about a 10,000 more uh windows stores
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►
and they can have their own people
◼
►
explaining this or the reality of the
◼
►
situation is that everyone's going to
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walk into bestbuy or go on Amazon uh you
◼
►
know best buy will be people who hit you
◼
►
know does the the employees working on
◼
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Commission who have absolutely no idea
◼
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what the difference will be and you know
◼
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they just try and sell the most
◼
►
expensive one and then amazon you know
◼
►
you're left to fend for yourself and
◼
►
it's their guy I'm sure they're going to
◼
►
have you know the typical microsoft
◼
►
charts to show you know which is which
◼
►
feature doesn't have which version
◼
►
doesn't have this feature in which one
◼
►
doesn't this feature and it's just going
◼
►
to be heat such such a nightmare i do I
◼
►
you know it's just like God they should
◼
►
have just done windows RT the awful name
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►
and everything and just done the tablets
◼
►
that way and then had a more traditional
◼
►
version of windows and just kept it
◼
►
going and and you know hope and and see
◼
►
what happens that if people move more in
◼
►
the tablet space which is you know what
◼
►
of course is happening with Apple where
◼
►
they can have the two separate tracks
◼
►
and and there by natural selection kind
◼
►
of people are are choosing to go with
◼
►
the ipad more than they have with the
◼
►
with the mac and so they're just letting
◼
►
it play out in a natural
◼
►
way rather than trying to cram things
◼
►
together right so that you know Apple
◼
►
calls it back to the mac where they take
◼
►
these iOS ideas and right put them on
◼
►
the Mac you know and another example of
◼
►
what i said before about how where you
◼
►
start really affects what you can do in
◼
►
the future going forward I i still think
◼
►
that full screen mode on Mac os10 is
◼
►
weird and i just i use it sometimes but
◼
►
I don't use it nearly as much as I
◼
►
thought I would when they announced it
◼
►
and it's because yummy the whole system
◼
►
is designed on this idea that you're
◼
►
using these windows on one screen not
◼
►
full screen apps that
◼
►
yeah and i totally normal no way to
◼
►
square that circle smoothly i think it's
◼
►
you know I use it it seems to be good
◼
►
for certain things where you need a lot
◼
►
of screen real estate like I photos a
◼
►
good example of something that I like
◼
►
like to use it for and they do some
◼
►
interesting things that they don't play
◼
►
up enough because you know who the dual
◼
►
monitor situation isn't really i guess
◼
►
probably been a mainstream thing that
◼
►
you know they they actually do it
◼
►
smartly where you can do other things
◼
►
and even though it's a great out area or
◼
►
whatever you don't make it obvious that
◼
►
you can do it but you can kinda drag
◼
►
things over there and and work in that
◼
►
space as well when you have things full
◼
►
screen but other other apps don't do
◼
►
that at all and so it's just kind of
◼
►
like a wasted space into a monitor thing
◼
►
I think on the the bigger monitor in
◼
►
general like that you know the the full
◼
►
screen apps is often just overkill on a
◼
►
911 meant an 11-inch macbook air it
◼
►
could be nice just because that screen
◼
►
is small but yeah it's really hard that
◼
►
design problem as opposed to on the ipad
◼
►
where it just feels utterly natural it
◼
►
feels like it's just write that
◼
►
everything is full screen and I think
◼
►
you know on the other hand it would be
◼
►
really hard to add multi-application
◼
►
windows to the iPad because it has
◼
►
doesn't the whole thing it just wouldn't
◼
►
would feel weird and that's that's sort
◼
►
of interesting because it's actually i
◼
►
don't know if you've had a chance to
◼
►
play at all i assume not because they
◼
►
just started coming out with them but
◼
►
the new version of Chrome OS so they
◼
►
sent me one of the one of the new
◼
►
Chromebooks you know to try out right
◼
►
and the new version of Chrome OS is is
◼
►
pretty different from the previous
◼
►
iterations of it I assume you played
◼
►
with like some iteration yeah we better
◼
►
and so the new version is much more
◼
►
windows or answered then you know the
◼
►
old version was basically just pretty
◼
►
much a full screen browser at all times
◼
►
and it was you know if you could switch
◼
►
between windows but it would almost be
◼
►
like like now when i was ten when you
◼
►
switch when you're doing a full screen
◼
►
apps and it was kind of weird and now
◼
►
they're moving back to the window idea
◼
►
you can have a different there so
◼
►
browser windows but you can have
◼
►
different sizes open at the same time
◼
►
and kind of switch between them and it's
◼
►
it's fascinating that they are moving
◼
►
back to that thing and i get i know why
◼
►
they're doing it because they're trying
◼
►
to go after the the windows market
◼
►
itself and no one had any idea how to do
◼
►
this but uh I don't know if that will
◼
►
end up working for them or not I think
◼
►
it's a good idea to try it because no
◼
►
one was buying chrome OS as it stood so
◼
►
maybe this is a good idea for them to do
◼
►
it but they're going in the opposite way
◼
►
right you know in the bottom line for
◼
►
the mac users i think with this back to
◼
►
the mac thing is that it none of it's
◼
►
really broken their old habits where I
◼
►
got windows 8 really seems like it's
◼
►
going to break some habits 01 just
◼
►
notable example big big glaring
◼
►
fundamental difference between the mac
◼
►
and iOS is you just turn your machine on
◼
►
you've got nothing open you haven't used
◼
►
what do you see on the Mac you see a
◼
►
desktop where you can save files and put
◼
►
folders and just puts right there and
◼
►
that's where you know Mac users famously
◼
►
and I have messy desktops full of files
◼
►
and folders and shortcuts and you know
◼
►
whatever they're working on at the
◼
►
moment and on iOS it's this home screen
◼
►
you still have a background you have the
◼
►
desktop picture but it's that's where
◼
►
your apps are right and Apple added this
◼
►
back to the mac thing called launch pad
◼
►
in 10 7 which is sort of like the iOS
◼
►
launch screen for the mac you all you
◼
►
see your apps that should be in theory
◼
►
if they start over from scratch with the
◼
►
mac today that would be your desktop
◼
►
launchpad would be your desktop wouldn't
◼
►
be an app that you launch or mode you
◼
►
jump to it would just be that would be
◼
►
your desktop and I think it would be a
◼
►
lot easier for most users especially
◼
►
people just come into the mac for the
◼
►
first time but I don't you think they
◼
►
can do it because too many people say
◼
►
files to the desktop and if they
◼
►
couldn't save file to the desktop they
◼
►
yeah it totally great do you do you end
◼
►
up using launchpad a lot I you know I
◼
►
found it first that i didn't use it and
◼
►
now now I just use it because that's the
◼
►
way that mac app store apps kinda you
◼
►
know the easiest way to find them it's
◼
►
like they're the you know the latest
◼
►
happens is the one that's that's right
◼
►
do you use it I use it a little bit on
◼
►
my air which is my secondary machine and
◼
►
I don't have all the apps that i have
◼
►
installed yet and so it's a lot cleaner
◼
►
i only have like two screens of apps on
◼
►
the air right right on my main desktop
◼
►
Mac know because it's like I've got like
◼
►
40 pages of apps and it's there's no way
◼
►
to find anything and I really love and I
◼
►
use launch bar and it's I by the time I
◼
►
even think about opening launchpad
◼
►
I've already done the command space and
◼
►
type a few characters of the name of the
◼
►
yep it's interesting to that chrome OS
◼
►
that you know going back to that for a
◼
►
second they also copy that that as well
◼
►
they have like a launchpad like
◼
►
functionality now that's kind of one of
◼
►
the main features to launch their web
◼
►
apps instead of you know native apps but
◼
►
ah it's something they copied a little
◼
►
bit from windows and copied a little bit
◼
►
ah so it's it's certain music and the
◼
►
other thing I i'm sort of jumping around
◼
►
topics here but I want to go back to the
◼
►
I want to go back to this six-month
◼
►
prediction about app development on
◼
►
Android and that Eric Schmidt's
◼
►
prediction that which I think he meant
◼
►
that's the thing is that i think he
◼
►
yeah totally and your piece on
◼
►
techcrunch today celebrating android
◼
►
first day the six-month anniversary you
◼
►
you specifically mentioned his that the
◼
►
explanation for why he thought things
◼
►
were going to change in the next six
◼
►
months was ice cream sandwich right
◼
►
which i completely agree is by far and
◼
►
away the best version of Android ever
◼
►
it's it's a huge difference and I've
◼
►
said this before but it to me it's proof
◼
►
that Matias Duarte I think I'm saying
◼
►
his name right right is is very talented
◼
►
I i think that's the one where his his
◼
►
design sense is sort of been imposed on
◼
►
Android as a whole and if you use a
◼
►
phone it's it's coherent system wide
◼
►
it's it's very nice you had a good
◼
►
review of the the new Nexus that runs it
◼
►
right on and it i think it's a better
◼
►
system for developers have gotten rid of
◼
►
these soft buttons if you get a new
◼
►
phone so that you can have the whole
◼
►
screen on and so his body his argument
◼
►
was look ice cream sandwiches great
◼
►
we're gonna you know that's really
◼
►
what's going to drive people to to write
◼
►
for air android first and yet here's the
◼
►
it's seven months after ice cream
◼
►
sandwich came out and what's the
◼
►
percentage of android phones that are
◼
►
running scripts sandwich set 7.1 percent
◼
►
according to google themselves you know
◼
►
there they publish those numbers it's
◼
►
it's hilarious that you know it's just
◼
►
pathetic there's no other way to say it
◼
►
it's a it's so ridiculously seven whip
◼
►
7.1 percent of android users are using
◼
►
what you know everyone from eric schmidt
◼
►
on down considers to be the best version
◼
►
of Android and there's nothing anyone
◼
►
can do about it right and he said
◼
►
specifically at this event we made this
◼
►
prediction we're making fun of his quote
◼
►
was with the ice cream sandwich release
◼
►
our core objective as a company is to
◼
►
get all of the hardware vendors onto
◼
►
that platform and I honestly I and i
◼
►
don't mean this and i really don't mean
◼
►
it to be making fun of them
◼
►
I I I think it just shows how Android as
◼
►
a whole has sort of spun out of their
◼
►
yes as it as a concept it's it's become
◼
►
something that is obviously they're
◼
►
still driving that the development of
◼
►
the new releases but what how it's
◼
►
actually being used in the real world is
◼
►
has completely they've lost control of
◼
►
it right and you talked to people at
◼
►
Google I've had this discussion so many
◼
►
times in the past two to three years now
◼
►
where it's like they always and they you
◼
►
know they seem to legitimately believed
◼
►
that that's about to change and I don't
◼
►
know why they think that I mean that was
◼
►
part of the reason why you know I before
◼
►
the post you know making fun of the
◼
►
six-month claim you know I Provost six
◼
►
months ago pointing out june six you
◼
►
know as the day and just saying like you
◼
►
know we'll revisit it at that time and
◼
►
you know I just flat-out said like
◼
►
there's no way this is going to have
◼
►
and I laid out i think like five or six
◼
►
reasons why there was no way that that
◼
►
android development would actually
◼
►
surpassed iOS development and you know
◼
►
one of the reasons of of course and the
◼
►
thing that were you know talking about
◼
►
right now is that Google cannot get the
◼
►
OEMs and ore carriers to actually get in
◼
►
line with doing these the way that doing
◼
►
these updates the way that that Apple
◼
►
can with with their partners
◼
►
yeah i think and i think that there's a
◼
►
a it's like an institutional confidence
◼
►
and maybe it serves them well overall
◼
►
but that there's a sense of where Google
◼
►
we're doing cool stuff and so of course
◼
►
people are gonna get on board with what
◼
►
we want them to get on board with
◼
►
because of google yeah and then it's I i
◼
►
actually i think i wrote a post about a
◼
►
year ago or something that kind of like
◼
►
they were living in a dream world and of
◼
►
course that that put everyone on google
◼
►
side of things in a tizzy because you
◼
►
know pointing out not only that Android
◼
►
a with the carrier and OEM relationships
◼
►
isn't going as a as swimmingly as they
◼
►
had hope but also the google TV thing
◼
►
it's like they really thought that they
◼
►
were going to revolutionize the TV
◼
►
experience made you know they had all
◼
►
the executives that they needed to have
◼
►
I think was was atlanta two years ago at
◼
►
Google i/o I think they had like Howard
◼
►
Stringer up there and they had everyone
◼
►
and it was and it was you know sounding
◼
►
like it was going to be great and then
◼
►
everything just fell apart within like
◼
►
two months of that happening and is the
◼
►
same exact thing with the with google
◼
►
music which is probably the best well i
◼
►
would say Google Wallet might be the the
◼
►
biggest chaos situations they've ever
◼
►
had but google music is certainly one of
◼
►
them because it was two years ago almost
◼
►
exactly at i/o that they first announced
◼
►
you know what would look to be a full on
◼
►
itunes competitor of course they
◼
►
pre-announced it and no one knew for
◼
►
sure when it was going to come out and
◼
►
then hit took them several months of
◼
►
negotiating and it didn't actually
◼
►
launch until just about a year later and
◼
►
even today two years after they
◼
►
announced that they still don't have
◼
►
warner brothers on board
◼
►
I mean they still do not have one of the
◼
►
major labels on their big music service
◼
►
that was going to revolutionize you know
◼
►
music purchasing and how on earth do
◼
►
they not have at least twenty-five
◼
►
Warners you know arguably the
◼
►
it's important to have on board they
◼
►
don't have them on board and they know
◼
►
you just you know they just thought that
◼
►
they could get it you know would be
◼
►
super easy and two years later
◼
►
nothing and it's not going to happen
◼
►
right i think that the group and add
◼
►
some steps when it comes to dealing with
◼
►
the rest of the industry that they
◼
►
implement instead of thinking like a
◼
►
chess player and having this look if we
◼
►
do this then this then this this is
◼
►
you know and have this strategy that it
◼
►
with no gaps from here to there they
◼
►
have this we have the that famous South
◼
►
Park analogy where there's this step 2
◼
►
dot figure 3c is it alright let me let
◼
►
me hit the money button here and and do
◼
►
the first sponsor sure I want to thank
◼
►
brand new company it's a new app from a
◼
►
new company company is nice mohawk and
◼
►
they have a brand new app called Ida ITA
◼
►
think of it like it i think it's a Latin
◼
►
were plural for items a brand-new
◼
►
list-making app for the iphone and ipad
◼
►
and it's designed to make it fast and
◼
►
simple to collect and organize
◼
►
information i love the look at this app
◼
►
this app think of it as sort of almost
◼
►
like a field notes aesthetic like a
◼
►
brown paper with one of my favorite font
◼
►
future all over the place sort of the
◼
►
classic timeless fifties sixties look
◼
►
typographically looks like stationary
◼
►
beautiful ab and you just make lists
◼
►
it's not like a to-do system it's just
◼
►
less you make lists across items off
◼
►
couldn't be simpler and it syncs across
◼
►
iCloud so you can use it on more than
◼
►
one device and seamless sinking through
◼
►
iCloud universal app one app for both
◼
►
the iphone ipad and it's fully
◼
►
accessible using voiceover it is on sale
◼
►
right now for ninety-nine cents through
◼
►
june fifteenth one buck for the first
◼
►
list app that's actually better than a
◼
►
Ida ITA from nice mohawk great app you
◼
►
do when you find out that there's a cool
◼
►
app from 99 cents i just buy it
◼
►
yeah there's no question i mean who
◼
►
cares 99 dance where years into this
◼
►
whole app store thing where there's this
◼
►
whole discussion where indie developers
◼
►
had gone from selling at least on the
◼
►
mac it was very standard just you know
◼
►
indie developers the low-end was always
◼
►
I mean it seemed like nobody could
◼
►
really make a living selling software
◼
►
for less than 15 and most apps were
◼
►
usually started like 20 bucks you know
◼
►
1999 yeah and the whole 99-cent thing
◼
►
really had people thinking is anybody
◼
►
going to be able to make a living
◼
►
selling these apps and it's you know it
◼
►
seems like definitely some are I mean
◼
►
whether 99 senses the right price for
◼
►
199 and 299 but i'll tell you what for
◼
►
ninety-nine cents i just do it
◼
►
I just buy it um yeah i mean it's it's a
◼
►
no-brainer the only thing I actually
◼
►
think about now is that god I have so
◼
►
many apps and it's just going to get
◼
►
lost in the shuffle and you know will i
◼
►
buy it one night and then forget about
◼
►
it the next day and so a you know that's
◼
►
the only thing I think about it's not
◼
►
the the price thing it's almost just
◼
►
just you know a non equation because it
◼
►
is so cheap and so easy to download now
◼
►
I'm kind of interested to see how with
◼
►
you know some mountain lion presumably I
◼
►
i guess that they'll have the gold
◼
►
master version at WWDC next week
◼
►
you know we've both been trying it out
◼
►
for a bit the developer preview of it
◼
►
seems pretty solid to me i don't know if
◼
►
you've had any problems with it
◼
►
I the only thing I really noticed that
◼
►
kind of annoys me is the slow shutdown
◼
►
speed and that's like I don't really
◼
►
know what that's about I don't know if
◼
►
you've noticed that at all but uh
◼
►
there's and shut down
◼
►
ok so I you know I try and shut down i
◼
►
don't know why but I should tell them
◼
►
about what it once a night pretty much
◼
►
and then start anew in the in the
◼
►
morning but that's only thing I've
◼
►
noticed about it seems our salad but I'm
◼
►
sort of interested to see how the mac
◼
►
app store plays along with with mountain
◼
►
line now given the stuff that they're
◼
►
doing with with what's what's it called
◼
►
out of the Volt thing i'll file on and
◼
►
I'm sorry gatekeeper I know yeah you
◼
►
know how is that are people actually
◼
►
going to do the default setting for it
◼
►
right is going to be that people have to
◼
►
yeah certified by this app certification
◼
►
thing and are people actually going to
◼
►
get around to doing that our developers
◼
►
going to do that and if they do that is
◼
►
there more incentive now to sell their
◼
►
stuff as as a registered developer over
◼
►
the web versus the mac app store i don't
◼
►
know if it's the if it's apple playing
◼
►
against itself is you know trying to
◼
►
trying to push the mac app store a
◼
►
little bit less than making it easier
◼
►
for people to do the web or if it's a
◼
►
kind of vice versatile just exploded
◼
►
interest in in mac apps in general i
◼
►
wonder i do think and I believe this and
◼
►
you know this could be one of those
◼
►
things where I'm 23 years from now I'm
◼
►
shown to be wrong but I do believe that
◼
►
Apple sees that as long as there's a mac
◼
►
that you'll be able to install software
◼
►
from anywhere it will not be app store
◼
►
yep right which is a big fear for a lot
◼
►
of mac users is that there's gonna you
◼
►
know obviously not going to 10 8 but
◼
►
maybe ten nine or whatever
◼
►
sometimes a year from now two years now
◼
►
they're going to say hey there's a great
◼
►
new feature for security
◼
►
you can only install software from the
◼
►
mac app store I'm i don't think they're
◼
►
going to do that i really don't and I
◼
►
really think that gatekeeper is not a
◼
►
step towards that I think gatekeeper is
◼
►
a way of bringing some of the peace of
◼
►
mind of right the App Store to download
◼
►
it from anywhere apps right he's not
◼
►
yeah yeah go ahead well how how
◼
►
restrictive are they going to be as they
◼
►
really only going to because the thing
◼
►
is is that you get this developer
◼
►
certificate that signs your apps and
◼
►
apple can revoke so if you've used it
◼
►
for something that seemed to be malware
◼
►
people have got it apple can revoke that
◼
►
certificate remotely and then
◼
►
yep that all those apps just stopped
◼
►
working where they only going to what
◼
►
are they going to use that for they
◼
►
really are going to use it for things
◼
►
that everybody agrees our malware or
◼
►
like what about like this situation with
◼
►
the rogue amoeba airfoil touch
◼
►
yes it's interesting right right right
◼
►
so let me see if I can summarize this
◼
►
quickly but Rogan me by
◼
►
as this app for the iphone called
◼
►
airfoil speakers touch and you can use
◼
►
it to it's like a airplay remember
◼
►
fireplace without it and they added a
◼
►
new feature as I can night so you can
◼
►
play for you know music from airfoil on
◼
►
your Mac or PC to your to your iOS
◼
►
devices and it's great works works
◼
►
amazingly well they added a new feature
◼
►
in the latest version like six weeks ago
◼
►
that lets you set your iOS device as a
◼
►
destination for airplay from itunes so
◼
►
you can play music from itunes and have
◼
►
it sent there just looks just like when
◼
►
your apple TV shows up as a airplay
◼
►
destination right and the way there is
◼
►
no supported way to do that the way they
◼
►
did that is with this technique with you
◼
►
know I I think I don't even know how it
◼
►
works but any but there is no supported
◼
►
way to do it i think they have like a
◼
►
key that that came out of a an airport
◼
►
express or something like that the
◼
►
public key or something like that but
◼
►
it's not supported and once Apple
◼
►
figured out that the app got into the
◼
►
app store but then because that's the
◼
►
sort of obscure edge case that the
◼
►
reviewers aren't going to catch and
◼
►
they're not violating any of the actual
◼
►
rules of the app store in terms of
◼
►
private api all they're doing is using a
◼
►
non-public decryption key to be a air
◼
►
plate receiver and so apple took it out
◼
►
of the store until they took that
◼
►
feature out of the app and resubmitted
◼
►
it to the store so would they
◼
►
there's here so here's where i'm going
◼
►
with that what about if rogue amoeba
◼
►
ships a mac version that has the same
◼
►
feature right size not alter the store
◼
►
it's just sold through the through the
◼
►
web though right right so directly not
◼
►
through the mac app store right from the
◼
►
rogue amoeba website if it's signed by
◼
►
gatekeeper is that ok because it's not
◼
►
now where it's doing exactly what it was
◼
►
yeah I may not be happy i would hope
◼
►
that that what they would do in that
◼
►
situation is just reach out to the
◼
►
developer and you know try and talk to
◼
►
them back channel because it seems like
◼
►
it's a bit of you know it's going to be
◼
►
an edge case type situation where they
◼
►
can probably you know handle that they
◼
►
or to be able to handle that rather than
◼
►
just kill the app because that will
◼
►
cause an absolute shit storm if they do
◼
►
that you have a remotely kill a nap that
◼
►
was downloaded from the web
◼
►
you know that's kind of a a barrier i
◼
►
don't think they want to cross right i
◼
►
would think that they don't want to
◼
►
cross that because i really do think
◼
►
they want developers to get on board
◼
►
with this they want all the major Mac
◼
►
developers you know if you're going to
◼
►
keep selling stuff that's not my app app
◼
►
store only at least do this and I think
◼
►
that anything that they could do that
◼
►
would make developers wary of doing it i
◼
►
think those shy away from yeah yeah i
◼
►
think that the only use it for malware
◼
►
stuff and you know it's it's it's really
◼
►
genius because it kind of cuts mail
◼
►
where problems off you know right at the
◼
►
root of it rather than having to worry
◼
►
about it after the fact and so it's
◼
►
smart in that way I i still wonder and I
◼
►
and I think this is going to play out
◼
►
pretty interestingly in Mount line
◼
►
itself because you know they'll have for
◼
►
the first time all will be mac apps that
◼
►
can play nicely with iOS apps right so
◼
►
they'll have a lot of games that they're
◼
►
kinda that there will be coming out that
◼
►
will be able to do that that might my
◼
►
thought is and i'm pretty sure this is
◼
►
true maybe you know the answer sure that
◼
►
they have to be sold through the mac app
◼
►
store to be able to do that to be able
◼
►
to interplay with with iOS apps you know
◼
►
if that's if that's actually the case
◼
►
run the question by me again i'm not
◼
►
quite sure so they'll have you know like
◼
►
a game for example they had you know
◼
►
some sort of game that will right now of
◼
►
course you can play across iOS devices
◼
►
you can play with an iphone vs an ipad
◼
►
and some reason say and you know the end
◼
►
so they'll have it now where you can do
◼
►
it via the mac to you can play a game
◼
►
that's that syncs across the entire
◼
►
ecosystem but i think that those are
◼
►
only going to work if it's sold the mac
◼
►
app store i think there's things like
◼
►
Game Center that they're going to
◼
►
require you to use the mac app store for
◼
►
yeah I and I it there's nothing that
◼
►
would keep a developer from implementing
◼
►
their own peer to peer over the Wi-Fi
◼
►
thing that would let an ipad
◼
►
up communicate with a mac app you can do
◼
►
that today alright though that if you
◼
►
want to do it through apple's sister
◼
►
apples back and try to go through the I
◼
►
mean it's the same thing with iCloud for
◼
►
the only way you get to write to iCloud
◼
►
is if you go through the app store right
◼
►
and i think it's all about you know it's
◼
►
they're not going to they're never gonna
◼
►
see that control the start so that if
◼
►
anybody's writing it is abusing iCloud
◼
►
by writing way too much data exceeding
◼
►
any kind of you know limits are using it
◼
►
for file sharing or something ridiculous
◼
►
like that Apple can just yank the plug
◼
►
yet and this out let me ask you this
◼
►
this is this is something that developed
◼
►
that more than one developer is brought
◼
►
up you know in the past few months with
◼
►
me that when talking specifically about
◼
►
gatekeeper and i think you said
◼
►
something about this before but I'm
◼
►
interested in your take it some the idea
◼
►
that gatekeeper is sort of a test to see
◼
►
if they would if they can ever do non
◼
►
appstore apps on iOS devices so they
◼
►
would do the same thing where they they
◼
►
sign the developer and they have no
◼
►
unsigned developers since they're
◼
►
starting from scratch they would be with
◼
►
iOS but they would have a way that you
◼
►
could download via the web as long as
◼
►
they were a assigned developer and you
◼
►
would just lose excess of course to
◼
►
things like iCloud access and can game
◼
►
center and those type of Apple things
◼
►
but you would be allowed to download
◼
►
from the web do you think that's ever
◼
►
going to happen i don't and in fact John
◼
►
Walton I talked about it on last week's
◼
►
episode and i think it's it's possible
◼
►
and if they were going to do it would
◼
►
definitely be through gatekeeper like I
◼
►
think that in if they ever did it i
◼
►
don't think they would ever allow true
◼
►
unsigned side-loaded apps if they ever
◼
►
allowed sideload apps in iOS it would be
◼
►
through something exactly like
◼
►
gatekeeper where it's signed and they
◼
►
could still revoke it remotely actually
◼
►
have were sitting right here it's open a
◼
►
tab i haven't linked to it yet i have a
◼
►
blog post from a guy named zach weekend
◼
►
and he after listening to the show last
◼
►
week he said let me see if i can find it
◼
►
a good pull quote here that it's not
◼
►
about the money yes Apple makes a little
◼
►
bit of money from their thirty percent
◼
►
cut but they are also providing a
◼
►
service for that tree they host your
◼
►
yup I agree with that that is not just
◼
►
about the money i don't know i think
◼
►
they're on the Apple gets me abstracts
◼
►
it's nice and neutral to them it's icing
◼
►
on the cake right but the reason he
◼
►
finds it hard to believe that apple will
◼
►
ever open up the floodgates to third
◼
►
party at our third party non appstore
◼
►
amazon if Apple were to allow apps to be
◼
►
loaded from other sources nothing would
◼
►
prevent amazon from creating a rival
◼
►
store one that provides many of the same
◼
►
benefits and is even more
◼
►
developer-friendly uh yeah that's
◼
►
interesting that's really interesting
◼
►
actually because you look at the history
◼
►
of amazon while they are sort of trying
◼
►
to do this now with the with the android
◼
►
that's kind of their model in general
◼
►
where they just you know they figure out
◼
►
kind of the some weak point and just
◼
►
kind of go over the top and figure out a
◼
►
way to bully their their way into the
◼
►
system and kind of disrupted from the
◼
►
ground up and yeah that could
◼
►
potentially open some sort of box that
◼
►
that apple doesn't want to open if they
◼
►
were to do that I think that amazon have
◼
►
a harder time doing it from pure light
◼
►
quality perspective and maybe even you
◼
►
know kind of confusion on how to install
◼
►
things but yeah that's pretty
◼
►
I like that idea right I so I i would
◼
►
think my honest feeling is that they
◼
►
wouldn't do it unless they were forced
◼
►
to buy antitrust legislation
◼
►
yeah or however you want to put it
◼
►
government regulation right I then if
◼
►
they did that that's the route they
◼
►
would take yeah that's so not
◼
►
yeah interesting i wanted i forgot to
◼
►
mention one time wanted to give a
◼
►
shout-out to Ida about is that with this
◼
►
skeuomorphic sort of paper list thing
◼
►
they've done something i don't know if
◼
►
they had me in mind I don't know what
◼
►
they've done something that makes me
◼
►
just adore the app which is that like
◼
►
the whole user interface like i said is
◼
►
in future which I door but when you
◼
►
enter stuff it's not in and marker felt
◼
►
or chalkboard or any of those goofy
◼
►
silly childish handwriting fonts it's
◼
►
your input is helvetica it it's the I
◼
►
just wanted I can't believe i forgot to
◼
►
mention entering a sponsor read that
◼
►
it's the skeuomorphic paper type thing
◼
►
goofy silly handwriting fun which is why
◼
►
does Apple use those anyway like
◼
►
everyone just makes fun of them
◼
►
I you know what these are no I just
◼
►
remember the day I got my original
◼
►
iphone in 2007 I loved every single
◼
►
thing about it except that stupid font
◼
►
and notes app yes couldn't stop looking
◼
►
at it as I and I know they switched from
◼
►
marker fell to the one that has talking
◼
►
the name and i love the name the chalk
◼
►
name and I just can't help but think
◼
►
that it's somebody else that Apple who
◼
►
thinks of it like I do like nails on a
◼
►
chalkboard every time there's a pic also
◼
►
i also have a little another piece of
◼
►
correction from last week I have to get
◼
►
to is that last week's sponsor i
◼
►
pronouncing your name wrong
◼
►
pixelmator not pixel mentor and I I
◼
►
curse myself for this because i called
◼
►
it Pixelmator for years and then
◼
►
somebody somewhere told me that because
◼
►
the guys who make the aperture German
◼
►
that it's not called Pixelmator it's
◼
►
pixel mentor and I thought well you know
◼
►
I want to be worldly I'm debonair and it
◼
►
pronounce words in other languages so I
◼
►
didn't really think about it before we
◼
►
did the show and I did the sponsoring
◼
►
then i got like a hundred emails from
◼
►
people saying holy crap i've been saying
◼
►
Pixelmator like our automator for years
◼
►
I can't believe I'm wrong so I checked
◼
►
with the Pixelmator guys in there they
◼
►
said its Pixelmator like automator and I
◼
►
and I and I did the wrong thing i
◼
►
overthought it so that that's another
◼
►
piece of cleanup us we have a winner
◼
►
when you come guys soon you're coming
◼
►
out here for WI will be there I will be
◼
►
have you uh would what do you know what
◼
►
your general thoughts what's coming
◼
►
that's what I go we can spend the rest
◼
►
of the show and you know what I'll take
◼
►
an opportunity right now I have another
◼
►
I'll just make it right now maybe
◼
►
there's going to be a live episode of
◼
►
this show the talk show next week
◼
►
broadcast from WWDC gonna be on tuesday
◼
►
at five thirty and it's going to be free
◼
►
it's about a hundred and fifty tickets
◼
►
to give out so if you want to go if
◼
►
you're going to be in san francisco
◼
►
gonna be at WWDC it's going to be held a
◼
►
few blocks away from Moscow knee tuesday
◼
►
afternoon you can get tickets at
◼
►
talk-show dot eventbrite.com that's
◼
►
eventbrite is spelled bri te dot-com
◼
►
there's about a hundred fifty tickets I
◼
►
don't know how fast they're going to go
◼
►
i'm not going to announce on daring
◼
►
fireball the only way I'm gonna announce
◼
►
it is right here during this broadcast I
◼
►
special guest is going to be cable
◼
►
sasser of panic i don't know maybe
◼
►
there'll be other surprise guess I'm not
◼
►
sure probably about an hour show so nice
◼
►
the talk show at eventbrite.com hope you
◼
►
yeah i'll be a i'll be there on Tuesday
◼
►
Tuesday 530 so I figure we'll have lots
◼
►
of WBC news to talk about and talked
◼
►
about Panik software with with cable
◼
►
after so what to expect i don't know i
◼
►
guess they-- it seems like everybody
◼
►
realized it seems pretty obvious is
◼
►
going to new mac hardware right I'm not
◼
►
sure though how much time you know i
◼
►
like to think about where they put the
◼
►
emphasis in their key nuts because it's
◼
►
their very very carefully thought-out
◼
►
yep i wonder how much time they're going
◼
►
to spend talking about Mac hardware or
◼
►
will it just be I i can honestly see it
◼
►
it's not even really being mentioned i
◼
►
don't know i guess if they go retina
◼
►
display they're going to have to mention
◼
►
it because that's developer news and
◼
►
that's a real bragging point that they
◼
►
can jump on over the industry and they
◼
►
can say look first we brought the retina
◼
►
to the phone then we brought the retina
◼
►
to the ipad everybody loves it text is
◼
►
beautiful pictures look better now we're
◼
►
bringing it to the mac yep
◼
►
yeah I i think you know obviously
◼
►
everyone knows the trend over the years
◼
►
where because iOS is so huge compared to
◼
►
Mac development that this is the focus
◼
►
of WWDC now and it just so happens that
◼
►
the timing of all this this new mac
◼
►
hardware seems to be corresponding
◼
►
perfectly with wwc so you think that
◼
►
they got to say something about it there
◼
►
and the fact that they have you know the
◼
►
new OS 10 presumably close to being done
◼
►
they've always said is gonna come out
◼
►
this summer you know and and they like
◼
►
to of course launch those things with
◼
►
some new hardware so it still seems like
◼
►
though yeah i mean you all the banners
◼
►
you see that are up right now at at
◼
►
are pretty much a populated so it will
◼
►
be interesting to see how much time they
◼
►
devote to to the mac itself but I cannot
◼
►
wait to see what of retina display on a
◼
►
macbook and you know macbook pro or
◼
►
whatever it's going to be looks like I
◼
►
can't even really think about what it
◼
►
would look like because you know you you
◼
►
look at your screen right now I'm
◼
►
looking at a 27-inch imac screen and
◼
►
it's a beautiful screen and it's always
◼
►
been a beautiful screen and it's like
◼
►
how you know how much better is it going
◼
►
to be now with it with a Retina display
◼
►
and will it be the same situation that
◼
►
we had with the iphone and that with the
◼
►
ipad where you can look at one of the
◼
►
retina displays and then you look at the
◼
►
old one and while when you first look at
◼
►
one and look at the other you know too I
◼
►
think I still think to kind of the the
◼
►
common user they're like okay yeah it
◼
►
looks nicer but you don't really you
◼
►
don't really get into you look at one
◼
►
and then look at the other right away or
◼
►
try and switch back after a long time
◼
►
using it and it just looks awful and is
◼
►
that the way all macs are going to look
◼
►
yeah i think it's the same that whenever
◼
►
you buy a new computer and it's faster
◼
►
than your old one you notice the speed
◼
►
for a couple of seconds and it feels fun
◼
►
you know it kind of fades away and then
◼
►
if you go back to the old machine after
◼
►
a couple of days are like I can't
◼
►
believe i use this and that is the
◼
►
retina displays exact same way where and
◼
►
I remember it the naysayers about the
◼
►
ipad who are saying there's no way
◼
►
they're gonna you know they could do
◼
►
with the phone because it was only 960 x
◼
►
6 whatever 640 on but there's no way
◼
►
they're going to put the 2048 pixel
◼
►
display and this tiny little iPad it's
◼
►
that that's insane you're not going to
◼
►
do it nobody's gonna road is nobody's
◼
►
winning money it's a price nobody is out
◼
►
there did you know they argument was
◼
►
nobody's out there with the first ipad
◼
►
or the second one saying my god the
◼
►
pixels are too noticeable on this but
◼
►
the truth is once you've used the eye
◼
►
the retina display one they are they're
◼
►
yeah it's pretty bad to go back and and
◼
►
look at it now you can pack a i mean
◼
►
it's it's me it's even worse than it is
◼
►
on the on the iphone switch which is
◼
►
still pretty bad but just because the
◼
►
bigger screen and so it'll be even a
◼
►
bigger screen now you know presumably a
◼
►
15 inch or something like that with the
◼
►
with a mac book and it's like it got
◼
►
that's going to be really jarring to
◼
►
today and I know into mac people have
◼
►
said to me over the years because I i do
◼
►
i I obsess over typography
◼
►
it is absolutely one of my great
◼
►
passions and I've had this discussion
◼
►
with people about pixels is that you
◼
►
know that it's inevitable and and and
◼
►
they say well know most people don't
◼
►
care about this stuff like you do so why
◼
►
would they bother but it's the path that
◼
►
print talk right like if you look at
◼
►
really old books if you look at books
◼
►
that were printed you know like vintage
◼
►
books from about a hundred years ago or
◼
►
so that the printing quality was great i
◼
►
mean it you know typography had you know
◼
►
some of the great text faces of all time
◼
►
were well established already a hundred
◼
►
years ago and the typography is gorgeous
◼
►
but if you look at the quality of the
◼
►
printing it's it there's a lot of you
◼
►
know the ink spread a lot and the fonts
◼
►
were designed to accommodate that the
◼
►
great text faces of hundred years ago
◼
►
were designed with the idea that look
◼
►
it's gonna you know it's not going to be
◼
►
super crisp it's not the letters are
◼
►
going to be perfect you go to a
◼
►
bookstore now buy a print book that the
◼
►
the quality of the type in the book is
◼
►
it is like each letter is absolutely
◼
►
perfectly by a newsweek or time I mean
◼
►
they still print Newsweek right i think
◼
►
dan lyons you know he's he's big in
◼
►
there somebody's going to have
◼
►
somebody's wearing his legs right I the
◼
►
print quality is astounding
◼
►
it is absolutely astounding and its
◼
►
beginning maybe you don't notice that
◼
►
the you did people don't buy news we can
◼
►
think my god this thing is is very
◼
►
finely printed ah you may not know that
◼
►
you may not think it but you notice it
◼
►
and that's just like the way apple stuff
◼
►
is all the way you know where people
◼
►
don't buy normal people don't buy it
◼
►
the iphone and think about how nice this
◼
►
seems our between the steel antenna and
◼
►
the glass front and you may not think
◼
►
about it but you appreciate it right do
◼
►
you think do you think that they just to
◼
►
kind of one product with at first with
◼
►
the retina display for in terms of the
◼
►
Mack you know they do a macbook pro
◼
►
rather than the macbook air and and
◼
►
maybe or do they do you know do the
◼
►
release of cinema display one that can
◼
►
use that obviously they've met new mac
◼
►
pro's you'll need new cinema displays or
◼
►
or you can use the old ones but do they
◼
►
retina at first try I really don't know
◼
►
I I thought originally that they would
◼
►
do it one just to introducing and it
◼
►
seems like that's a little bit more of a
◼
►
napoli way to do it is just interactive
◼
►
but it seems like there but there's so
◼
►
many spots in the mac product matrix
◼
►
that are overdue for an update that it
◼
►
just feels to me like they're going to
◼
►
just do the whole line at once and say
◼
►
that they all they all get written that
◼
►
you get a Retina Display you get to it's
◼
►
going to be Oprah Winfrey up they're
◼
►
great cars God you think they'll do a
◼
►
27-inch imac and like cinema display on
◼
►
that would be pretty insane
◼
►
I don't know it seems it seems almost
◼
►
impossible but that's what I thought
◼
►
about the phone to when I first heard
◼
►
the rumors you know three years ago that
◼
►
they were going to double the pixel
◼
►
resolution on the iphone it just seemed
◼
►
yep I I mean it like there's more pixels
◼
►
i still have a 20 inch cinema display
◼
►
but even if you had like the old 23 into
◼
►
whatever you the ipad today's ipad has
◼
►
more pixels than oh that's crazy on
◼
►
yeah so I don't know I I you know I
◼
►
almost wonder in at it I don't even know
◼
►
if it's like a yield problem but maybe
◼
►
at this point you know with the pixels
◼
►
that small a couple of dead pixels you
◼
►
don't even notice i honestly don't know
◼
►
sure would be awesome if they did and I
◼
►
wonder you know obviously they'll try
◼
►
and they'll do something within os10
◼
►
mountain lion sooo kind of make older
◼
►
apps look fine on the new thing without
◼
►
being custom tailored for it but I I do
◼
►
excuse me what they'll end up looking
◼
►
like I think it's going to be like the
◼
►
iphone where they know they're going to
◼
►
stick out the ones that haven't been
◼
►
updated are going to stick out because
◼
►
that is the weird thing the weird thing
◼
►
about and I didn't think of it didn't
◼
►
make sense to me until I saw it but when
◼
►
you run non-retina apps on the iphone
◼
►
based shouldn't theory
◼
►
look the same as they did on an old 3gs
◼
►
with a non retina display but they don't
◼
►
it looks worse right because the pixels
◼
►
yeah there's a little for pixel square
◼
►
one pixel used to be but there's so much
◼
►
sharper that you see that whereas it was
◼
►
on the old non retina displays there was
◼
►
a fuzziness that sort of glossed over
◼
►
the the pixelation that you can notice
◼
►
whereas yep when you run them on the
◼
►
actual retina displays it it turns into
◼
►
sharp jagged pneus that stair-step you
◼
►
know like you're filling in graph paper
◼
►
right look and I you know I think that I
◼
►
think that's the motivation i think
◼
►
that's the one thing about apples
◼
►
success with this sort of athletics are
◼
►
a core value that across-the-board it
◼
►
just gets developers on board like your
◼
►
app looks like ass is is like a kick in
◼
►
the pants to developers to hurry up
◼
►
hurry up and fix it like no one wants to
◼
►
be that guy who people are saying i love
◼
►
your app but boy it looks like ass on my
◼
►
yeah I wonder I you know I think about
◼
►
like what are.what are 1080p movies
◼
►
gonna be like when you know most youtube
◼
►
things or 1080p now we have the option
◼
►
for at Vimeo videos and then of course
◼
►
the itunes content you know they can go
◼
►
with it so far beyond that but
◼
►
Hollywood's obviously not ready to do
◼
►
that they are they're filming like the
◼
►
filming the new Hobbit movie right with
◼
►
those red cams and that's going to be a
◼
►
uniform can I resolution right for can
◼
►
and so there are you know there are
◼
►
there will be options do that in the
◼
►
future but you know it's going to be an
◼
►
interesting transition is AI think video
◼
►
I think video gets by with it though
◼
►
because of the motion
◼
►
yeah is it right immersion kinda
◼
►
inherently blurs the stuff just like
◼
►
with you know when you watch an actual
◼
►
film projected that the you know the the
◼
►
frame to frame you don't see the frames
◼
►
and so right i think that covers it up i
◼
►
think a bigger question is what
◼
►
photography photographs are going to
◼
►
yep and you kind of see that on the ipad
◼
►
i think especially when you're on the
◼
►
web because most websites don't have
◼
►
retina photographs their photographs on
◼
►
the web and you really I'd I think you
◼
►
can really see like jpeg compression now
◼
►
that you couldn't see before with the
◼
►
exact same photograph on on a on another
◼
►
kind of non retina display
◼
►
yeah yeah it was you know I had my
◼
►
of course wasn't wasn't retina ready
◼
►
when it came out and I just look at that
◼
►
and cringe every single day and soho now
◼
►
it's a matter of just uploading a much
◼
►
larger image file but it looks finally
◼
►
looks fine red yeah let me I'm gonna
◼
►
just let me do the second sponsor and
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will run through I think for the rest of
◼
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the show will speak talk more about WWDC
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rumors but they're the second sponsor is
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excellent creations that spelled ex-ceo
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llen t excellent without the E in the
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excellent creations is a mobile app
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building mobile apps since 2007 and they
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they don't use cross-platform frameworks
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they write native code for whatever
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platform you're targeting are you
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attending WWDC excellent creations will
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be there handing out commemorate of
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that's a tag hash tag pound level up
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WWDC 2012 t-shirts so if you see anybody
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from excellent creations at WWDC in
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Moscow knee hit him up they'll give you
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a t-shirt and if you're in the market
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for a new job if you're not I iOS
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android mobile web developer excellent
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creations is hiring in denver colorado
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so if you need a nap talk to excellent
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creations they can make it for you if
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you're in the market for a new job as an
◼
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app developer talk to excellent
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they're great place to work thank you to
◼
►
them and look for Matt wdc so what else
◼
►
maps maps it seems like a done deal i
◼
►
mean that's the one that's that's leaked
◼
►
what what would you make of the of the
◼
►
google event yes it was me yesterday
◼
►
that happened kind of funny funny little
◼
►
event you know that uh that I don't know
◼
►
what they were really thinking you know
◼
►
if they were even trying to be a smart
◼
►
about the way that they kind of time the
◼
►
entire thing every tweet that is all
◼
►
about it you know I was gearing up to
◼
►
just sit down and watch it and then it's
◼
►
just like treat us like this is
◼
►
announcing anything all they're saying
◼
►
is you know kind of the history of
◼
►
google maps and and going into you know
◼
►
how great the product is and it's very
◼
►
clear that they threw this conference
◼
►
together at the last second just to
◼
►
preempt whatever Apple is going to
◼
►
announce at wwc one of the articles I
◼
►
read covering and i forget which side it
◼
►
was on but the first comment was perfect
◼
►
it was the first comment with somebody
◼
►
who's comment was google to apple all
◼
►
yeah you know which is it was so perfect
◼
►
because it's you know that's famously
◼
►
what try to people jerks try to stick in
◼
►
is the first comment on any article
◼
►
right it really was and and somebody
◼
►
else had the analogy is on Twitter and I
◼
►
wish I'd thought of it was that it
◼
►
really wreaked of that it was exactly
◼
►
like that 2010 CES keynote from steve
◼
►
ballmer whenever your slates and right
◼
►
right holding up their one year it was
◼
►
you know six weeks before the original
◼
►
iPad introduction and it was at a point
◼
►
where there is this fever pitch of hey
◼
►
apples really doing a tablet and there
◼
►
everybody knew it nobody knew what it
◼
►
was going to be but there's this idea
◼
►
that Apple has a tablet and it's coming
◼
►
soon in and Microsoft CES keynote was
◼
►
about slates and they tried to grasp the
◼
►
word in there and and Google got a
◼
►
chance to throw out the 3d word I you
◼
►
know even though you know they've had 3d
◼
►
elements of course for for a while but
◼
►
now they have some concern new you know
◼
►
I amazing 3d element coming soon my new
◼
►
nothing was actually released at this
◼
►
event because it wasn't ready right but
◼
►
coming soon they will have some sort of
◼
►
3d thing I thought I think was like
◼
►
quentin hardy for I think he wrote about
◼
►
in new york times maybe even like the
◼
►
bits blog there something like that but
◼
►
I'm you know because I was of course
◼
►
extremely skeptical and just wrote a
◼
►
post pretty much trashing that that
◼
►
whole conference is a giant waste of
◼
►
time and kinda showing a google has
◼
►
while they are you know undoubtedly the
◼
►
leader in maps they do have a
◼
►
vulnerability here that I think is is
◼
►
going to be fun sort of watch how it
◼
►
plays out but I thought we'd already had
◼
►
an interesting other view of it which is
◼
►
that they had to do this conference to
◼
►
preempt what the rest of the press will
◼
►
talk about at wwc which is that
◼
►
Wow Apple you know has an opportunity
◼
►
here to really hurt a google wear
◼
►
something that matters because you know
◼
►
mobile mobile Sookie maps are so key to
◼
►
mobile and there's all this data and you
◼
►
lose half the market all of a sudden and
◼
►
so Quinton hardees point was that you
◼
►
know this at least put some seed in the
◼
►
presses mind that well you know this
◼
►
what apple announced you know could be
◼
►
disruptive certainly but it's not nearly
◼
►
as good as what Google is done in and
◼
►
you know they've had seven years to work
◼
►
on this and they've been doing it all
◼
►
this time and they have all the experts
◼
►
in the space you know working on this
◼
►
problem so there's no way they can
◼
►
it was basically just a plant a seed of
◼
►
doubt in five days before WC about it i
◼
►
guess i just think it makes them look
◼
►
yes right there my tickets they're
◼
►
fighting down rather than fighting
◼
►
because they are a position of power
◼
►
I you know I i if it were me I would
◼
►
you know yeah and you know i might have
◼
►
you know fought as hard as i could have
◼
►
been negotiating table to convince Apple
◼
►
to stick with google maps in iOS if if I
◼
►
really thought that was in Google's
◼
►
interests but if they were clearly going
◼
►
to go their own way and not not renew
◼
►
the contract then just shut down
◼
►
silence and you know good luck and let's
◼
►
see what they do and let them do it
◼
►
because you know Jay arrow had a piece
◼
►
on business insider today and in typical
◼
►
business insider fashion it's sort of
◼
►
sensationalizing it why Apple is taking
◼
►
a tremendous risk with this time but
◼
►
the arrow and he has a good point the
◼
►
fundamental point though is that it is a
◼
►
risk because it has to be as good as
◼
►
google maps yet overall you know
◼
►
directions have to be as good and they
◼
►
can't in on and I I'm guessing that's
◼
►
why it's taking them so long with their
◼
►
a been working on this for a while
◼
►
they've been making these accusations
◼
►
accusations four years is that there's
◼
►
no other way to roll that out other than
◼
►
to do it all at once and have beautiful
◼
►
cartography that covers the world and
◼
►
accurate directions and driving and
◼
►
transit public right hands it you know
◼
►
and I know that the google walking
◼
►
directions of star still beta but you
◼
►
know that they pretty good i mean at
◼
►
least in the cities i've used them in I
◼
►
I mean I think they're just covering
◼
►
their ass if you know you can hit by a
◼
►
car or something like that
◼
►
right on but it just has to be as good
◼
►
and it's an area where Apple is it's not
◼
►
a historical struggling unproven yeah
◼
►
yeah and it's like it goes back to what
◼
►
we were talking about kind of the
◼
►
beginning where you know if if you're
◼
►
gonna come into a market that's kind of
◼
►
dominated by someone you have to do
◼
►
something that's that's really kind of
◼
►
you know not just not just as good but
◼
►
Apple resident necessarily have to do
◼
►
that here because they have control of
◼
►
this platform and so you know people
◼
►
will have no choice but rather to use it
◼
►
and as long as it's just as good
◼
►
that will be fine for people you know
◼
►
most people won't even you know most
◼
►
average consumers I think wouldn't even
◼
►
they'll notice a difference obviously if
◼
►
they look a little different but they
◼
►
wouldn't really care if it's a google
◼
►
map or if it's an apple maps as long as
◼
►
it functions just as well as it did so
◼
►
it doesn't have to be better here but it
◼
►
has to be as good and that's you know
◼
►
that's asking a lot and and no one knows
◼
►
if Apple's going to be able to pull it
◼
►
off or not they certainly think that the
◼
►
candidate seems like but who knows my
◼
►
big question and i have i forget if I
◼
►
ask this to john molitor adam lee circle
◼
►
around the show a week or two ago and I
◼
►
had it was multiple that would we
◼
►
couldn't figure it out is do you think
◼
►
they're gonna do a web version of the
◼
►
map yeah I actually i said this
◼
►
yesterday too kind of thinking out loud
◼
►
about it that's that's a really
◼
►
interesting question because it's on one
◼
►
hand it seems like if they're going to
◼
►
ask every developer to do this along
◼
►
with you know the standard maps app so
◼
►
in all the apps i'll have the you know
◼
►
they someone brought up the point you
◼
►
know that it's not like there is a
◼
►
Google Maps SDK part of the the iOS SDK
◼
►
is just the you know they've mapkit I
◼
►
think and and right now that uses google
◼
►
data and presumably they'll switch that
◼
►
out to use the Apple data so so all you
◼
►
know almost all developers you know
◼
►
probably will fall in line with that and
◼
►
if they do that then you know it's sort
◼
►
of like there's so many apps that have a
◼
►
web components to it like are they then
◼
►
going to have to switch over to using
◼
►
google maps on the web because they have
◼
►
no other choice or does Apple offer a
◼
►
web version of it i guess i would guess
◼
►
that apple doesn't have a web version of
◼
►
it though it doesn't seem like an
◼
►
apple-like thing to do but the other
◼
►
thing I was thinking about is what
◼
►
happens when you email somebody
◼
►
phone Yeah Yeah right like when you do
◼
►
it now it you can use the google map on
◼
►
the phone and say look here's where I'm
◼
►
yeah the directions in and there's like
◼
►
a little in action button email this and
◼
►
send them to the Google Maps website so
◼
►
i guess they just hope that you're using
◼
►
a mobile device or an iOS device and you
◼
►
either open it through your iPad or the
◼
►
iphone or maybe they have a picture or
◼
►
something including out it's a real
◼
►
mystery I don't expect them to a website
◼
►
but i wonder how they how you email
◼
►
directions to somebody if they don't
◼
►
it's also said it's interesting idea as
◼
►
well because you know on the web itself
◼
►
google is also in a bit of a vulnerable
◼
►
position there because for some reason
◼
►
which most people still don't really
◼
►
understand google raise their rates a
◼
►
few months ago for your google maps for
◼
►
like high-level customers so for example
◼
►
foursquare switched away from using
◼
►
google maps on their website they still
◼
►
use it in there in the mobile app
◼
►
because it's part of iOS SDK and it's
◼
►
free right but on the web they started
◼
►
jacking up the rates for like big
◼
►
customers and so all those guys moving
◼
►
over to things like open street maps and
◼
►
where they can kind of customize their
◼
►
own maps and so Google is actually
◼
►
vulnerable here and no one really again
◼
►
no one understands why they checked the
◼
►
traits that a lot of money for google
◼
►
and it just seems like a risk that
◼
►
they're taking for no apparent reason
◼
►
but so if Apple words to do web maps of
◼
►
some sort they could get a lot of the
◼
►
bigger developers potentially using them
◼
►
again I don't think it's gonna happen
◼
►
but it's something interesting to think
◼
►
it's always seemed in Google's priority
◼
►
was collecting data right right so I
◼
►
don't know why they're merging yeah
◼
►
right like why why motivate people that
◼
►
maybe look elsewhere and fit in
◼
►
foursquare is obviously a super high
◼
►
profile example why why give foursquare
◼
►
any reason to change it does seem
◼
►
curious to me and I mean unless it's far
◼
►
more expensive then then I think it is i
◼
►
mean it's it's definitely expensive but
◼
►
it'sit's such you know in the amount of
◼
►
money that they make that they would
◼
►
make from its is gonna be completely
◼
►
negligible to Google's bottom line and
◼
►
so right who cares just do it as a loss
◼
►
leader I mean it's such a valuable
◼
►
listen they're the leader in this and
◼
►
there you know i i've talked to
◼
►
foursquare but they don't know they
◼
►
don't really know why they decided to
◼
►
change it and and start jacking up these
◼
►
rights no one no one really knows and it
◼
►
just seems on googly it's not you know
◼
►
all the complaints that we you and I
◼
►
have about various aspects of google one
◼
►
is it one thing it i can't imagine ever
◼
►
saying before is that they seemed like
◼
►
they were too hungry for collecting
◼
►
money from people right dad never did it
◼
►
I can't think of any other example of
◼
►
that where they've done something where
◼
►
they seem to favor revenue per user /
◼
►
just getting as many people using their
◼
►
yeah so I don't know what do you think
◼
►
about you know so it sounds like we know
◼
►
seems like facebook as well it's going
◼
►
to be a part of this i know you're not a
◼
►
facebook user at all but now this is a
◼
►
you know this is this is the state.the
◼
►
of the ecosystem right now so many apps
◼
►
use facebook connect to be able to do it
◼
►
and it seems yet I i think if they could
◼
►
get facebook to agreed to terms that
◼
►
Apple considers appropriate privacy wise
◼
►
yep that it's done deal I'd i think so
◼
►
and I think I you know at one thing you
◼
►
have to remember too is that Apple
◼
►
really operates on a yearly schedule
◼
►
they really do things annually they
◼
►
don't roll out a lot of stuff other than
◼
►
bug fixes in you know in between and so
◼
►
a year ago is when they baked in the
◼
►
Twitter star if in the US and it was
◼
►
sort of you know I think it was half
◼
►
because they thought twitter is good and
◼
►
that would be useful for iOS and I think
◼
►
it was half a message to facebook of
◼
►
well we'll show you stop saying to them
◼
►
you know you don't agree to our Terms
◼
►
well these guys are you know they're
◼
►
nipping at your heels so you know one
◼
►
year later I wouldn't be surprised at
◼
►
all if you know I think as a negotiating
◼
►
tactic a one year head start of built-in
◼
►
social integration on iOS you know is
◼
►
enough to maybe get facebook to budge on
◼
►
the terms that they were offering which
◼
►
and that you know you i think you and i
◼
►
both have you know pretty high level and
◼
►
info on that it was you know more or
◼
►
less came down to their facebooks bottom
◼
►
line on the terms they wanted from Apple
◼
►
was Apple would not agree to not about
◼
►
money it was about privacy and private
◼
►
chef right so I i wouldn't be surprised
◼
►
at all I I think that's definitely
◼
►
happen i think it's i think it sticks
◼
►
out more now on iOS 5 that there's one
◼
►
and only one third party social
◼
►
integration you know that was like this
◼
►
this section in the settings apps that
◼
►
seems like it would naturally be suited
◼
►
through a couple of them and it's just
◼
►
one I Twitter and you know
◼
►
coincidentally tonight Facebook's like
◼
►
having this last-minute event looks like
◼
►
to launch what they're calling their app
◼
►
center which is which is fascinating
◼
►
because it's uh it's actually leaked out
◼
►
a little bit and it's gone live in their
◼
►
facebook app on their off facebook iOS
◼
►
app even it's basically on the side
◼
►
panel they knew how they have this new
◼
►
area that's called App Center where they
◼
►
basically have their own app store but
◼
►
it's not their app store it's really
◼
►
pointing to mobile apps at least on you
◼
►
know it's kind of I think the idea is to
◼
►
be platform-agnostic so it's on android
◼
►
2.2 android apps if it's on iOS points
◼
►
iOS apps that the web it can point to a
◼
►
web app but you know this this might
◼
►
come into play with kind of these
◼
►
negotiations as well because you know as
◼
►
we're seeing now Facebook is a pretty
◼
►
important driver for growth for a lot of
◼
►
these apps you know like we had all the
◼
►
video camera apps that were kind of
◼
►
exploding for awhile mainly because of
◼
►
the way that they were using facebook
◼
►
open graph and now you know one of the
◼
►
that's only going to get louder is about
◼
►
app discovery and apple but chomping you
◼
►
know there are supposedly trying to work
◼
►
on things with that but Facebook can do
◼
►
a pretty good job of it i think just
◼
►
given the social data that they have
◼
►
about what apps your friends are using
◼
►
and so maybe Apple maybe they do
◼
►
something a little bit more with that to
◼
►
to kind of make it as a new discovery
◼
►
layer for apps themselves because all it
◼
►
does is kick you into the app store it's
◼
►
just a new layer on top of it
◼
►
yeah I'd I definitely not an act that
◼
►
harkens all the way back to the original
◼
►
rumors that pain was designed with
◼
►
writing is playing over
◼
►
his right mind and I don't get these
◼
►
recommendations and and find out new
◼
►
music that people you know we're using
◼
►
based on your facebook friendships and
◼
►
yeah and so and that may have sunk that
◼
►
ship before it even started
◼
►
you know there are those lines one thing
◼
►
I've noticed i have noticed is recently
◼
►
and it's partly because I don't know if
◼
►
I notice it more because I don't even
◼
►
have a facebook account or if it's just
◼
►
my branding sensitivity but I've noticed
◼
►
more and more as i walk around the city
◼
►
when I see like billboards and
◼
►
advertisements like on the sides of
◼
►
buildings or wherever you can put ads
◼
►
like walking around I see an awful lot
◼
►
of brands that instead of putting their
◼
►
URL you know that it was put facebook
◼
►
yep dot slash their name yep I including
◼
►
one I forget who you didn't even print
◼
►
facebook they just printed the f just
◼
►
that Facebook f / their name
◼
►
yeah and I thought that was that blew me
◼
►
away and they didn't it wasn't next to
◼
►
their URL it was the this is where to go
◼
►
is facebook / brand name yeah i thought
◼
►
the same thing that's a I don't really
◼
►
know what that's all about facebook just
◼
►
as a killer kind of partnership team to
◼
►
be able to to get these guys to do it or
◼
►
if there's some sort of data that
◼
►
they're saying we're just kind of silly
◼
►
now to have your own website when what
◼
►
you really want is kind of data social
◼
►
data that facebook is able to offer up
◼
►
and help you kind of spread the word
◼
►
about messages and stuff right now that
◼
►
you can get them to follow you or like
◼
►
you and then have a ongoing relationship
◼
►
with them rather than one time they
◼
►
visit your site look right one page and
◼
►
whatever they remember they remember but
◼
►
i still think it's very very powerful is
◼
►
a powerful statement of Facebook's
◼
►
yeah you know while I have you here
◼
►
because now your new gig your job is
◼
►
really working as a you an angel
◼
►
investor or vc vc vc yeah just doing
◼
►
seed level investments of smaller kind
◼
►
of angel sighs investments in a way but
◼
►
yeah so I want you to explain to me the
◼
►
here's what I'd I don't understand why
◼
►
it's being called a disaster
◼
►
I don't understand it seems to me like
◼
►
it must it's gone down so that's not
◼
►
good but it seems to me like it was
◼
►
mostly at least on day one it was priced
◼
►
kind of right because this is my very
◼
►
very lame and I I this is so out outside
◼
►
my wheelhouse that maybe I'm just
◼
►
totally off base is that it was like
◼
►
what was it 30 $38 or 32 years that's
◼
►
the way over 38 somebody but it seemed
◼
►
to me like it if you were on the inside
◼
►
you got it you know if you there is one
◼
►
of the banks that was doing the IPO you
◼
►
you got it 38 bucks and if you jumped on
◼
►
it right when the bell rang if you can
◼
►
get your trade-in then you are getting
◼
►
it at the same price that seems fair to
◼
►
yep yeah its own people want people
◼
►
wanted to double that seems to me like
◼
►
you're saying that it's cooked in favor
◼
►
of the banks who got it at the price
◼
►
before it doubled yes that's it that's
◼
►
exactly right i mean my my take on it is
◼
►
is exactly pretty much what you said
◼
►
that this you know that the perception
◼
►
of it is not the reality the reality is
◼
►
that Facebook made as much money as
◼
►
possible as they could have off of an
◼
►
IPO and say you know say they had priced
◼
►
it at 15 or something and then you know
◼
►
it opened at 35 that would have been it
◼
►
wow you know everyone's like wow there's
◼
►
so much demand for that this these
◼
►
facebook shares whatever but Facebook
◼
►
would have made actually half the money
◼
►
because they would have only sold you
◼
►
know half and half as much half uh for
◼
►
what they could have uh basically and so
◼
►
Facebook came out very well from this
◼
►
and and you know I think that they're
◼
►
all looking at this right now and they
◼
►
just don't care i mean they had to go
◼
►
public it was kind of an annoying thing
◼
►
for them to do for a while you know they
◼
►
kind of rallied around rallied around at
◼
►
the end and they did raise you know it
◼
►
something like 16 billion dollars as a
◼
►
result of it but they did as well as
◼
►
it's a it's a loss really for you know
◼
►
the people who are looking to get a what
◼
►
typically happens at least with tech
◼
►
stocks you know where its there's a pop
◼
►
and so people want to get out and a 1
◼
►
get the 22 you know fifty percent
◼
►
whatever it's going to be pop and then
◼
►
sell quickly and they're pissed off
◼
►
because that didn't happen and instead
◼
►
you know they ended up losing money if
◼
►
you try to do that but it's a silly
◼
►
you're gonna buy facebook stock first of
◼
►
all you know there's a lot of talk right
◼
►
now that the financials aren't strong
◼
►
and and that there was some you know
◼
►
like insider knowledge about it that was
◼
►
only testing certain people and you know
◼
►
those things will get looked into and
◼
►
maybe there's something to that I don't
◼
►
it sounds like nothing that actually
◼
►
happened was illegal it was just kind of
◼
►
that's the way it works right now you
◼
►
know certain morgan stanley led the IPO
◼
►
and they let certain people know like
◼
►
what data they had but the reality of
◼
►
the situation is if you were going to
◼
►
you know you really should have known
◼
►
what you were buying to begin with it's
◼
►
not like any of this data is really
◼
►
secret or kind of hard to understand you
◼
►
just need to do a little bit of homework
◼
►
and if you're buying facebook stock you
◼
►
really should be buying it at the you
◼
►
know the IPO price and thinking it's a
◼
►
long-term bet not some sort of stock pop
◼
►
thing we're just in this we've been in
◼
►
this mentality of these these tech IPOs
◼
►
throughout the past however long you
◼
►
know decade now where these things
◼
►
initially pop and everyone is expecting
◼
►
the pop and so when it didn't pop people
◼
►
are wondering you know what does that
◼
►
mean is is is everything crashing is a
◼
►
you know is this the end of of tech
◼
►
itself but you know right now the stock
◼
►
and looking at $26 you know I i would
◼
►
bet in a year it will be you know
◼
►
somewhere around the IPO level maybe
◼
►
above it and that's just the way it's
◼
►
going to be and so you know Facebook
◼
►
grows into a more mature company and
◼
►
they start producing you know more
◼
►
substantial revenues that justify you
◼
►
know the pricing of it i think people in
◼
►
the tech press in general is just you
◼
►
know obviously they like to play up the
◼
►
story that it was a huge failure there
◼
►
were certain things that nasdaq really
◼
►
screwed up on and and that's certainly
◼
►
uh is is going to play out over the next
◼
►
several months when more companies start
◼
►
to IPO do they go with the new york
◼
►
stock exchange instead of nasdaq seems
◼
►
like that was part of the piling on
◼
►
nowhere that's not what that's not
◼
►
facebook's fault i mean i guess you can
◼
►
follow them for going with the nasdaq
◼
►
rather than going with the new york
◼
►
stock exchange but it but it's really a
◼
►
it's sort of like a piling on know where
◼
►
i saw that there's this sort of a and
◼
►
again i'm not really i don't use
◼
►
facebook but i actually really I'm kind
◼
►
of fascinated by the company and i am
◼
►
very interested in in Zuckerberg because
◼
►
I feel like he is one of those rare guys
◼
►
he's like a Bill Gates Steve Jobs rap
◼
►
once-in-a-lifetime sort of our
◼
►
once-in-a-generation unique individual
◼
►
yeah and if I were I didn't you know I
◼
►
don't have any money in facebook but if
◼
►
I did it wouldn't be because i like the
◼
►
product would be because i'd like to
◼
►
place a bet on him all right term and I
◼
►
still think I think that's exactly why
◼
►
amazon has such a high what's the what's
◼
►
the price to earnings yeah
◼
►
price-to-earnings right is people
◼
►
betting on Jeff Bezos yes which i think
◼
►
is a smart bat I would you know I don't
◼
►
have amazon stock either but I would you
◼
►
know I wouldn't mind having some amazigh
◼
►
certainly would think about it and if I
◼
►
did it would be betting on Jeff Bezos
◼
►
because I think he's very smart he's
◼
►
that type of guy and that's a good way
◼
►
to think about it because you look at
◼
►
Amazon's business and you see like the
◼
►
you know the prophets are following
◼
►
actually because of some of the hardware
◼
►
stuff they're kind of trying to do and
◼
►
and the margins aren't great at all but
◼
►
it's a total long-term bet they'll just
◼
►
be able to kinda outmaneuver everyone
◼
►
coming their way and facebook now you
◼
►
know kinda outmaneuver in the space that
◼
►
they're in and that will kind of be like
◼
►
we're just talking about the brands that
◼
►
are using it as their as a web page
◼
►
there now like a part of the fabric of
◼
►
the web that's kinda irreplaceable and
◼
►
some people don't agree with that of
◼
►
course and so but that's that would be
◼
►
the bet you're making I think you know
◼
►
you kind of hit upon it to the other the
◼
►
other kind of backlash element i guess
◼
►
the facebook IPO was the fact that
◼
►
they're the price-earnings ratios insane
◼
►
and their market cap you know was gonna
◼
►
be about a hundred billion and now it's
◼
►
closer like 60 billion or something like
◼
►
that and you think about that in
◼
►
relation to these other companies that
◼
►
are making you know like Apple and
◼
►
Google that are making the way way more
◼
►
more revenue and of course profit and
◼
►
Facebook's not that far away a hundred
◼
►
billion from google which is what it I
◼
►
think 200 billion and so like how can
◼
►
you possibly justify it just happens to
◼
►
be that you know Facebook had the
◼
►
biggest tech IPO of all time it was a
◼
►
there was a lot of pent-up demand for it
◼
►
and now that people you know have sensed
◼
►
that there's there's some way that they
◼
►
can spend this is a failure its kinda
◼
►
you know everyone likes to be the first
◼
►
to call you know the the the top of the
◼
►
market and now it's going down from here
◼
►
but it just doesn't seem like that's
◼
►
really what I got Diana
◼
►
glad to hear that from you because i had
◼
►
just had this sense that the press
◼
►
coverage was like the knives were ready
◼
►
to come out right did anything but shoot
◼
►
way up and then if they just piled on
◼
►
with the fact that there were technical
◼
►
problems on a stacks and that they just
◼
►
threw in and it just became this this
◼
►
very neat narrative that facebook's IPO
◼
►
is a disaster right and it means it was
◼
►
certainly not a disaster for them with
◼
►
right and then anything that could
◼
►
possibly fit into that basic story
◼
►
the facebook IPO disaster they would
◼
►
just throw in everything else gets gets
◼
►
tossed into that pile and I just I
◼
►
thought it was sort of a we were just
◼
►
waiting to jump on you think much like
◼
►
antennagate was for apple
◼
►
yes we do this right wait and we've been
◼
►
waiting for something like this and yeah
◼
►
we're gonna beat it until it's dead and
◼
►
the unfortunate side effect of some of
◼
►
this is that you know there are
◼
►
companies now we're going to be a little
◼
►
hesitant to go public and maybe that's
◼
►
right maybe you know maybe they should
◼
►
be hesitant more hesitant to go public
◼
►
you know you that you look at groupon
◼
►
and some of these other ones that are
◼
►
struggling you know but they're they're
◼
►
hesitant not for maybe the right reason
◼
►
you know they're hesitant because they
◼
►
don't want to get the same kind of press
◼
►
backlash you know that their Facebook
◼
►
out which is which is totally ridiculous
◼
►
and you know what there's not much
◼
►
really you can do about that but it's
◼
►
yeah here's the other thing that I see
◼
►
is big picture wise at the the Silicon
◼
►
yep is you know in that whole enemy of
◼
►
the enemy is my friend mindset is that
◼
►
google is to me the new microsoft we're
◼
►
the ones who are sticking her fingers
◼
►
and everybody else's pies
◼
►
yep and not making any friends and
◼
►
spoiling the friends that they had right
◼
►
because only I still it's so hard to
◼
►
think I mean that in terms of how far
◼
►
this industry can go in five years is
◼
►
that when he I phone was introduced
◼
►
there's Eric Schmidt invited up onstage
◼
►
back-slapping with Steve Jobs talking
◼
►
about what great almost sibling
◼
►
companies Google and Apple are apples
◼
►
doing their thing we're doing our thing
◼
►
it's totally separate where we love each
◼
►
other and we're so happy to have a
◼
►
couple of services on the iphone this is
◼
►
gonna be great and now look where they
◼
►
I the way I see it is google has really
◼
►
made enemies of everybody
◼
►
yeah and it just makes a lot more
◼
►
natural to see something like Facebook
◼
►
integration in iOS you know and and some
◼
►
significant keynote time monday devoted
◼
►
yeah i do i I along those lines I wonder
◼
►
if you know Apple back-channel was
◼
►
talking you know with facebook and kind
◼
►
of making sure that they get some sort
◼
►
of not exclusive partnership but kind of
◼
►
you know better access than facebook is
◼
►
willing to give to to something like
◼
►
Android and you know while Google and
◼
►
Facebook are at odds for other reasons
◼
►
and social and kind of different areas
◼
►
facebook is really they still have to
◼
►
play nice with android because so much
◼
►
of their businesses mobile and android
◼
►
is a large part of the mobile ecosystem
◼
►
and so they have to play nice with it
◼
►
but I do wonder if there's some sort of
◼
►
behind-the-scenes thing going on with it
◼
►
with Apple and Facebook where it's a
◼
►
little bit you know of an anti google
◼
►
tilt going on right now I just see that
◼
►
everybody's everybody's an enemy with
◼
►
google and that you know and it
◼
►
yeah and he is and it's one of those
◼
►
things like we talked about earlier
◼
►
where they just don't you know you talk
◼
►
to them and they don't have that they
◼
►
just don't seem to be aware of this even
◼
►
though like it's not like a big secret
◼
►
and anyone can see it you can talk to
◼
►
people who basically say it
◼
►
everyone is sort of if their not
◼
►
Google's enemy right now they feel like
◼
►
Google's going to move in their space
◼
►
because google just keeps doing that
◼
►
over and over and over again now you
◼
►
know the best relationship they have I
◼
►
guess is with Samsung because Samsung's
◼
►
the one company doing well off of
◼
►
Android but you know we'll see what
◼
►
happens with this motorola stuff you
◼
►
know that could go sideways as well you
◼
►
know and it does seem like they're
◼
►
oblivious about it I really attached to
◼
►
me as a difference for Microsoft was the
◼
►
enemy of everybody in the values and
◼
►
Microsoft seem very self aware of their
◼
►
role you know that they were you know
◼
►
making enemies of everybody and anybody
◼
►
was making a profit at Microsoft was
◼
►
deal that market right huh and they
◼
►
seemed very aware of that where Google
◼
►
does not google seems to think that
◼
►
they're still everybody's friend but
◼
►
everybody else kind of hates him
◼
►
yeah it's a very weird sense of
◼
►
entitlement like at a company level
◼
►
seems to be going on just on I just
◼
►
trying to wrap this up we've been we've
◼
►
been going for about an hour and
◼
►
happening any other WWDC predictions
◼
►
what you think about my idea of apple TV
◼
►
apps i've got nothing I have no inside
◼
►
dope on that nobody has wished me
◼
►
anything to me about that the only hint
◼
►
i have of that the only the only actual
◼
►
info is that I know that the new Apple
◼
►
TV has bluetooth for hardware right in
◼
►
and yet apples not using that your
◼
►
yep that's that's true and the new the
◼
►
latest iPhone has it as well right right
◼
►
okay so right yeah i don't know i
◼
►
haven't heard anything either about any
◼
►
kind of apple TV app stuff i mean it's
◼
►
gotta happen eventually of course and
◼
►
they already have some element of it you
◼
►
know that they have their own apps that
◼
►
they built for netflix and an MLB and
◼
►
the different ones you know that would
◼
►
be that would be a pretty awesome thing
◼
►
if they did that because everyone's been
◼
►
waiting for it and now the time it would
◼
►
be kind of interesting too because it's
◼
►
it's a you know right after the CES
◼
►
stuff where we had the kind of the game
◼
►
systems out there and you got 110 is
◼
►
doing now and Microsoft is kinda wait
◼
►
until next year to do their their new
◼
►
system sony and so there is kind of this
◼
►
this intro to the market right here and
◼
►
if and if Apple allows apps and you know
◼
►
presumably a lot of those would be games
◼
►
again that could be a fascinating a way
◼
►
I don't know if that if that will happen
◼
►
or not but yeah I mean they did just
◼
►
redesigned the interface right when did
◼
►
that come out like that was at the ipad
◼
►
event so yeah and the februari yep so
◼
►
and one thing I've noticed with that and
◼
►
it's gone to a more iOS home screen type
◼
►
thing read these little rectangles that
◼
►
look like apps been studying squares
◼
►
their little 69 rectangles upon and one
◼
►
thing I know about that is just like the
◼
►
original iphone where it was like an
◼
►
uneven number of icons that there
◼
►
because it yes yes there's only like one
◼
►
bottom row which gym bag for those other
◼
►
three spots to be filled in
◼
►
yeah which didn't necessarily imply
◼
►
third-party app right it could be an
◼
►
asshole or a good writer party right but
◼
►
I can't help but think that the apple TV
◼
►
is the same way where it's an uneven
◼
►
number of those rectangles where it just
◼
►
seems like it's almost like that blank
◼
►
spaces a dot dot dot it's like an
◼
►
ellipsis that's like more to come
◼
►
well I do think like when you you just
◼
►
look at the market itself and you see
◼
►
like you know Microsoft now there's this
◼
►
there's this big Microsoft's big push it
◼
►
in the press has been that that xbox is
◼
►
winning the battle for the living room
◼
►
right and so they're doing a you know
◼
►
they are doing all these partnerships
◼
►
with places like ESPN and so it seems
◼
►
natural that apple would also have some
◼
►
sort of ESPN you know watch now
◼
►
partnership thing with apple TV and so
◼
►
maybe maybe that's something that gets
◼
►
announced ahead of a rather than like a
◼
►
a platform for it right now but I also
◼
►
liked the idea and I think you put this
◼
►
forward since in a subtle way at least
◼
►
that if they do get a platform out there
◼
►
now and they get developers developing
◼
►
for it then if and when they do do you
◼
►
know their actual foray into the space
◼
►
in a more meaningful way they'll have
◼
►
apps they're ready to go and that's like
◼
►
you know they're seating their own
◼
►
victory right there right
◼
►
I can't help but think that if they do
◼
►
it there's got to be some kind of new
◼
►
hardware maybe not i I feel like this is
◼
►
the new Apple TV that does 1080p it only
◼
►
four months old so they can't just say
◼
►
that was obsolete but it's kinda like a
◼
►
remote or something that uses Bluetooth
◼
►
there's got to be better input than the
◼
►
the ir remote well those those those sk
◼
►
use it got leaked yesterday or something
◼
►
9to5 mac Adam like there were some
◼
►
interesting things in there right there
◼
►
were things that weren't known
◼
►
necessarily right there could be some
◼
►
kind of some sort of hardware thing
◼
►
that's totally off the radar that's like
◼
►
you know a cheap accessories so yeah
◼
►
maybe it is something like some kind of
◼
►
new remote control to specifically
◼
►
control apps in a in a different way and
◼
►
well you go ahead and go in what what do
◼
►
you think about you know that I think I
◼
►
think we can all assume we're not going
◼
►
to see new iphone hardware because you
◼
►
precedent has been set now for that in
◼
►
the fall but if you know as all
◼
►
indications seem to be lining up that
◼
►
there is going to be this new screen
◼
►
how do you think they're going to play
◼
►
that with with ios6 I think you've said
◼
►
before that they'll like do it in a way
◼
►
that's not obvious but they'll have
◼
►
something to kind of drop a hint that
◼
►
something will be changing about it how
◼
►
do you think they do that I either
◼
►
either not at all and just trust that
◼
►
when they do the announcement in
◼
►
september-october whenever the new phone
◼
►
comes out that they'll say look this
◼
►
phone is shipping next week and
◼
►
developers go to you know blah blah blah
◼
►
you know address and find out how to
◼
►
update your apps only have these guys
◼
►
here with us who we've brought in a
◼
►
month ago and they've updated their apps
◼
►
and you know right to talk about how
◼
►
they spent 15 minutes and and got their
◼
►
apt to do the new size or you know I got
◼
►
my conjecture was that they could do it
◼
►
in the context of made notifications
◼
►
right yeah like being flexible about
◼
►
making room for that doing it webos
◼
►
style like I know a lot of people hail
◼
►
the the multitasking interface of webos
◼
►
is like the but the card thing which I
◼
►
never really liked I I didn't like that
◼
►
I thought it was confusing the way that
◼
►
I was not a fan of that but I thought
◼
►
the best idea and webos was the way
◼
►
their notifications didn't cover contact
◼
►
content that they shrunk the content and
◼
►
yep i thought that was the best idea and
◼
►
I think it's silly having seen it the
◼
►
way that on iOS that they the banners
◼
►
cover-up content so I think they could
◼
►
do it that way they can get you to be
◼
►
flexible although it doesn't cover the
◼
►
horizontal case where when you're
◼
►
holding the phone sideways where I
◼
►
doesn't explain why you'd want to be
◼
►
flexible horizontally so I don't know
◼
►
that is a mystery to me
◼
►
I think bottom line is I totally believe
◼
►
Tim Cook's line at the de conférences
◼
►
last week that they're doubling down on
◼
►
I I don't think anything is I don't
◼
►
think things have ever been is tight at
◼
►
cupertino i've been following the
◼
►
company the only place that leaks is
◼
►
Asia it's the supply chain so all then
◼
►
there and I debt out a little bit
◼
►
outside apples control right so like
◼
►
and stuff like that that leak from
◼
►
manufacturing in China that's a little
◼
►
bit outside their control the stuff
◼
►
that's completely in their control the
◼
►
stuff that is actually happening in
◼
►
cupertino california it has never been
◼
►
more tight-lipped and and the best
◼
►
example of that is mountain-lion I mean
◼
►
mountain lion came out of the blue
◼
►
yeah i mean i remember talking to you on
◼
►
the phone yeah we're trying to guess
◼
►
what it would be right like a day or two
◼
►
before those briefings started in
◼
►
February i believe it was right
◼
►
I februari January whatever that was and
◼
►
you know number one there's the game of
◼
►
hey did you get the call you know yet i
◼
►
did I don't think I shoot right and then
◼
►
it's I get feel like then we can you
◼
►
know we still can't talk a lot but we
◼
►
can like times they give any idea what
◼
►
this is a pound and it's like we're both
◼
►
yeah i think the best guess was retina
◼
►
yeah right no max at the time exactly
◼
►
that was that was definitely my best
◼
►
guess and i think that was your best
◼
►
guests to around know you thats it's
◼
►
just a perfect and so I'm actually happy
◼
►
about this right in a way that I
◼
►
actually feel like I know less about
◼
►
what's going to be announced monday at
◼
►
WCC than I have in years and I couldn't
◼
►
be happier about it i'm gonna makes me
◼
►
just look forward to it
◼
►
yeah it makes it I'm it makes it really
◼
►
exciting that you know on the you're
◼
►
right that of course you know Apple
◼
►
can't do all that much to stop the the
◼
►
hardware stuff that kind of gets up from
◼
►
the third party suppliers over in Asia
◼
►
but like iOS like I feel like you know I
◼
►
heard a little bit about about Facebook
◼
►
heard a little bit about maps but that
◼
►
was the maps thing was only after
◼
►
someone else had heard something and so
◼
►
you could kind of you know put feelers
◼
►
out there for what's out there but i
◼
►
have no idea anything else you know you
◼
►
know that there's going to be other
◼
►
major changes and there's nothing really
◼
►
out there no one's talking about it and
◼
►
I kind of my gut feeling is that it's
◼
►
kind of going to be a big peanut that
◼
►
they've got a lot to announce and we
◼
►
just don't know what it is yet
◼
►
does it compare and contrast to last
◼
►
year where they actually put out a press
◼
►
release the week before where they said
◼
►
what they were going to cover
◼
►
yeah it was very unusual yeah they even
◼
►
in fact even like pretty much tip the
◼
►
beans on iCloud I don't think they not
◼
►
sure that they they minded but they said
◼
►
apples upcoming cloud-based did they do
◼
►
that do it you have any good reason for
◼
►
back at it like they did like say that
◼
►
they were going to iCloud there had been
◼
►
a lot of rumors about that I clouds
◼
►
coming but it's like why is it is it
◼
►
acceptable for me to say I was right
◼
►
is that gonna add is that self-serving I
◼
►
think I were right when they did it last
◼
►
year when I link to their PR and daring
◼
►
fireball my guess was and I think in
◼
►
hindsight it was exactly right
◼
►
was that it was specifically to set the
◼
►
stage for no hardware announcements
◼
►
ah right ok yeah right to make it clear
◼
►
to everybody we're gonna tell you what
◼
►
we're going to talk about just so that
◼
►
everybody will know we're not going to
◼
►
do a new phone because you have done
◼
►
this new phone in this vets the entire
◼
►
they uh they needed pretty either your
◼
►
yeah my guess is that jobs hated doing
◼
►
ah but i think he agreed that they had
◼
►
to CNU yeah because just imagine what
◼
►
the backlash would have been had it been
◼
►
set up that well we get a new iphone
◼
►
every year and wait a minute there's no
◼
►
new iphone this year and no one had any
◼
►
idea and that's the surprise that
◼
►
there's nothing and you know this is the
◼
►
downfall of Apple Apple slipping that
◼
►
you know like what's what's happening
◼
►
here because the one thing that that I i
◼
►
find myself losing track of sometimes
◼
►
and it's just a way to Center myself
◼
►
covering the company is to keep in mind
◼
►
that i get excited about cool new stuff
◼
►
that Apple does no matter what if it's I
◼
►
think it's cool it's new i get excited
◼
►
about I'm interested in it but there's a
◼
►
big difference between some of the stuff
◼
►
they do some of the other stuff which is
◼
►
is it something that they're selling or
◼
►
is it just something they're improving
◼
►
right so last year's thing was mostly it
◼
►
that's the thing is it was nothing that
◼
►
they were going to sell like iCloud is
◼
►
something they just gave to everybody
◼
►
right and so financially you know and
◼
►
that's it's after you know never forget
◼
►
that it's you know it's all about the
◼
►
money i feel like this year it's going
◼
►
to be about stuff that they're selling
◼
►
or at least a big part of it
◼
►
yeah and that's a I mean have they ever
◼
►
updated every single mac in their line
◼
►
at the exact same time
◼
►
no never and so that's a and there and
◼
►
the best part about that is that it
◼
►
probably still won't be the focal point
◼
►
of the keynote because iOS is
◼
►
you know so much bigger right yeah I
◼
►
definitely think I think it'll probably
◼
►
start out with the mac and then you know
◼
►
and congratulations you know whatever
◼
►
Mac you're using whatever one you like
◼
►
guess what there's a new Retina version
◼
►
of it i think so i think they're going
◼
►
to do and then now we're gonna start to
◼
►
the overview of mountain lion again you
◼
►
know they like to do ice those the 10
◼
►
things or whatever that uh that are that
◼
►
are new and dif right and then yeah then
◼
►
well I think that's a show I want to
◼
►
thank our sponsors again excellent
◼
►
creations that's X eell ENT creations
◼
►
excellent creation.com they have a
◼
►
special website WWDC 2012 dot excellent
◼
►
creations com check them out if you're
◼
►
looking for a mobile developer or
◼
►
looking for a new job as a mobile
◼
►
developer and Ida a great beautiful new
◼
►
list app for the iPhone and iPad you can
◼
►
find out more about that at nice mohawk
◼
►
dot-com happen to know that the
◼
►
developer of IDA has in fact a very nice
◼
►
it's true i wonder if that's you know I
◼
►
don't know if that's legal the Fiesta if
◼
►
you could require all of your employees
◼
►
to ever walk but that would be a good
◼
►
I do know that Ben Ben Lachman know the
◼
►
founder of the company does now he's
◼
►
kind of stuck with I have to ask him
◼
►
about that now that his name the company
◼
►
nice mohawk I wonder if he's kind of
◼
►
stuck with the haircut right 2060 still
◼
►
have the Mohawk even though there's no
◼
►
hair he has to get a hair hair implants
◼
►
to to keep the Mohawk going great right
◼
►
like it would have been in trouble for
◼
►
apple if they were somehow that you know
◼
►
named in 1978 after steve jobs then
◼
►
thick luscious head full of hair
◼
►
beautiful books with java