The Talk Show

32: Denied Permission for an Emergency Landing at Clavius


  well as it happens I'm on my way up to the moon [TS]

  are you by any chance going up you're basically yes as a matter of fact I am [TS]

  it is there any particular reason why you ask [TS]

  well I hope you don't think I'm too inquisitive but perhaps you can clear up [TS]

  the mystery about what's going on I'm sorry but I'm not sure I know what you [TS]

  mean [TS]

  well it's just for the past two weeks there have been some extremely odd [TS]

  things happening at Clearview clearly yes well for one thing whenever you [TS]

  phone the base all you get is recording which repeat the phone lines are [TS]

  temporarily out of order [TS]

  well I suppose they've been having a bit of trouble with some of the equipment [TS]

  yes well at first we thought that was the expertise has been going on for the [TS]

  past 10 days you mean you haven't been able to get any one of the base for 10 [TS]

  days that's right I see two days ago when a rocket buses was denied [TS]

  permission for an emergency landing at previous how did they manage to do that [TS]

  without any communication previous Control came on the air just long enough [TS]

  to transmit their refusal well that does sound very odd I'm afraid there's going [TS]

  to be a bit of a row about it [TS]

  denying them in permission to land was a direct violation of the IAS convention [TS]

  and yes well I hope the crew got back safely [TS]

  fortunately they did well I'm glad about that doctor at the region impressing you [TS]

  an appointment reticent to discuss may I ask you a straightforward question [TS]

  certainly quite frankly we have some very reliable intelligence reports that [TS]

  a quite serious epidemic has broken out at Clearview something apparently of an [TS]

  unknown origin is this in fact what has happened I'm sorry doctor smiles love [TS]

  but I'm really not at liberty to discuss this epidemic could you please bring to [TS]

  our based we should be given all the facts are just my life and not permitted [TS]

  to discuss this [TS]

  so I'm here in Chicago who are partners world headquarters with my good friend [TS]

  Jim Kudal jim welcome thank you [TS]

  last night we went to see a screening of 2001 a Space Odyssey the Music Box [TS]

  Theatre Music Box Theatre seventy millimeter print a couple years ago we [TS]

  were there there was a new a new printer this movie that came out and we thought [TS]

  we were going to go see it was a different folder sort of scratched up [TS]

  seventeen we were gonna go we went through the what are our dinner at Ohio [TS]

  State University because we had heard that they had the new print and as soon [TS]

  as it was sold out it was great to see it projected large but as soon as it [TS]

  started rolling there is a ticking artifact the left side channel of the [TS]

  audio in the first section of the film as soon as we heard that taking we knew [TS]

  that we were watching that same old print so if you go to see 2001 in [TS]

  seventy millimeter premium know you got the rape women the picture is absolutely [TS]

  gorgeous and there's no crazy audio thing on the list right and in addition [TS]

  to the fact that we didn't have any audio error last night there was a [TS]

  digital audio right thing was not the the analog audio decided that we were [TS]

  lucky enough to meet to chat with the projectionist last night during [TS]

  intermission how's that your mission in a film so called and he said that [TS]

  originally the seventy million prints were released with an optical audio [TS]

  track that ran alongside the picture and that after that they used a strip of MAG [TS]

  like magnetic tape that ran along picture but then now all that's a long [TS]

  time to pictures time code and its slaves basically a CD player which has [TS]

  all the digital audio life so [TS]

  but you know even though the audit was perfectly clear it is an old track and I [TS]

  believe that it's mono and I also know we also noticed that there's very little [TS]

  bottom and they're very little based on the track and I think that's probably [TS]

  true of most of the films of that era we're sort of spoiled now by you know [TS]

  transformers and everything else these chest-thumping subwoofer later exactly [TS]

  exactly although it did sound great and they did it again no bottom and it was [TS]

  no bueno had been based in addition to a truly truly magnificent picture quality [TS]

  and sounded great [TS]

  yeah it was you know I see my father took me to see 2001 I can't figure out [TS]

  exactly what it was but it was soon after came out I would put me about [TS]

  eight years old so little girl died but and I remember being enthralled and [TS]

  confused by the film but this was certainly the best representation of [TS]

  film I've ever seen and we were sitting in the second row and that was the right [TS]

  place to be for house family can I think the film film has been part of a seventy [TS]

  millimeter festival that they're running and I think every seat for every show [TS]

  sold out right away pretty cool so I don't think anybody who ever go see this [TS]

  movie you come out of it and you do exactly what I was saying I'm not gonna [TS]

  do we start talking about whether we were with my 12 year old line yesterday [TS]

  so we couldn't help his first question is what I actually like I really thought [TS]

  that Spencer had a truly fabulous interpretation of the last shot of the [TS]

  movie which is that it [TS]

  Superman floating over the earth and I know he was kinda half joking but I [TS]

  actually think that you know that to me is the basic gist of the story as I see [TS]

  it yes [TS]

  is that four million years ago whoever these whoever this is with behind the [TS]

  mindless used to model it turn our ape-like ancestors in the men that junk [TS]

  how do we turn from apes two men it was with their help and mom and that now [TS]

  four million years later through the same people's help Dave Bowman has [TS]

  become the first whatever's next after us going from humans to whichever is [TS]

  greater than humans day bowman's the first one is yes and I don't think [TS]

  Spencer is a person with that theory but that's the best I can make of either you [TS]

  know it the more I learn about the film and the more I see it the less I care [TS]

  about what the actual specific meaning of that last reel of film is you know it [TS]

  takes it so interesting me all the details in the middle section of the [TS]

  Jupiter discovery section all the details of everything takes forever and [TS]

  it's you see every little bit of everything and then we make a huge job [TS]

  you know obviously the most famous caught in cinema history between the [TS]

  bone in the spaceship and I jump and then you know jumped on that flits can [TS]

  acid-induced sort of color sex and it really is right there's these two [TS]

  fantastic believes in the movie there's the one where you did jump cut from four [TS]

  million years ago to 40 years in the future I mean I still think of it as the [TS]

  future you know it's eleven years after right but over the past 12 years now but [TS]

  then that last real is another jump like that where I mean who knows when or [TS]

  where you are but the other thing that really strike struck me last night I [TS]

  mean I again is super obvious but up until that last real up until you that [TS]

  this lips skin [TS]

  I I think of it like I always thought he was going through hyperspace or [TS]

  something that's where he's going to wherever the people who made the model [TS]

  are right but at that moment the movie shifts from two hours or so [TS]

  being extremely almost identically scientific like both in from the caveman [TS]

  stuff through the space stuff you know this sort of almost extraordinary [TS]

  precision and an attempt to do everything as realistically as possible [TS]

  to a final reel which every single second of it who knows if anybody's even [TS]

  realize it completely and there is an embodiment ad is it the wormhole fruit [TS]

  basis it you know [TS]

  centers other theory was when the very old man wakes up in the end he said it [TS]

  was all a dream [TS]

  sort of a conventional hollywood way to approach it if you have a chance to see [TS]

  this print and we understand that this will be the print that circulate [TS]

  circulating so I would certainly encourage you to have a chance to see it [TS]

  to see it it the first time I ever saw the film where things started to feel [TS]

  and I don't mean that like as an insult to the film obviously it's special [TS]

  effects and it's from 1968 but the you mentioned last night I think the same [TS]

  thing the 3d model stuff like of the discovery still holds up really well but [TS]

  some of the scenes are actually 2d photo realistic paintings or photographs that [TS]

  are moved across another 2d surface and the fidelity of the picture [TS]

  last night it was a little bit put the light of it looked flat yeah not bad [TS]

  glad so it sort of is sort of interesting to see a projected that such [TS]

  a different thing than to see even the DVD on your big screen flat screen at [TS]

  home whenever so and some of the stuff honestly I really don't think that it's [TS]

  just me being there Norma's fan of the movie special effects seemed still look [TS]

  as good as anything you ever gonna see because it looks absolutely real there's [TS]

  some shots where the camera is sort of stationary and space outer space and the [TS]

  discovery is passing over it and it it looks and only you can never be [TS]

  surpassed because it really looks like what it would look like if you put a [TS]

  seventy millimeter camera in outer space [TS]

  a real discovery and fluid over the camera and every fly by the camera of [TS]

  every space ship since 1968 owes its existence to that particular opening [TS]

  scene and a lot of the interiors opening scene of the discovery of the Jupiter [TS]

  sex in the interiors really hold up like just remarkably well just in terms of [TS]

  does that feel like it this could be a real pod bay station starship and it [TS]

  just feels absolutely we can actually focus wardrobe is sort of right back in [TS]

  style right now everything is like very contemporary yeah I do you know I guess [TS]

  we gotta get on them to to Barry Lyndon extremely I would be there would be a [TS]

  great pic cuz I that's another member I would just love to see it on the big [TS]

  screen of all of the other films I think that would be the one just talking about [TS]

  seeing a projected that would be the next protected [TS]

  I was at that Kubrick exhibit in Amsterdam and that just sort of [TS]

  interesting it's now in LA and I and it seemed as if they had this big space at [TS]

  the new film museum right on the water they're really rebuilding and it each [TS]

  the space was divided up by the movie so there was one section that was dr. [TS]

  Strangelove and it was another section of was 2001 and there was another [TS]

  section that was passed but that really cool thing was they were showing a [TS]

  projection of long sequences from the film on large screens in each of the [TS]

  sections but the sections of the exhibit were not separated from each other so [TS]

  while you were watching Alex in clockwork you could hear how the other [TS]

  side of the room and you could hear work in monthly talking to the russian Prime [TS]

  premier from strangelove it had it was like your head it was like the net [TS]

  effect of it was like maybe what it might have been to be like you because [TS]

  you had all these ideas floating around in your head and one time there's a [TS]

  great app for that exhibit two videos de VC nao yeah and it's got two photos I've [TS]

  never never seen anywhere before that impacts photos are in that episode even [TS]

  in the exhibit interests yes anybody out there is an interesting Kubrick and if [TS]

  you're not you're probably already stopped the podcast [TS]

  you gotta go to the Apple App Store just search for Kubrick and I think that's [TS]

  actually just the name of the app can you but it's it's like a great people [TS]

  get really coffee-table book is really there is another thing just a random [TS]

  thing that stuck out to me I said I mentioned this to you last night after [TS]

  the film but I'd never thought about it before but it really stuck out to me was [TS]

  in the caveman sequence in the pre-history sequence there's a scene [TS]

  where a cheetah is up on like a liberal little small cliff above the the tribe [TS]

  and pounces on the tax one of the tribes people [TS]

  and I don't know how they shot that because I realized it's and it wasn't [TS]

  all my stuff you know with cuts it was like 11 shot I believe I think you when [TS]

  it jumped a cut when the Tigers jumped and then the rest of it is just hold on [TS]

  a shot I got kind of a long shot of guy guy but he's never been fighting a [TS]

  cheetah and and everybody knows that there was it was people in suits doing [TS]

  so they have like a guy in a suit fighting against the front projector [TS]

  glass screen showing the go hard desert like and you know I noticed it seemed to [TS]

  but not do it didn't occur to me i guess im so immune to Hollywood special [TS]

  effects you know they just one of the Oscar nominated films as a boy the tiger [TS]

  in a boat for god sakes maybe it didn't occur to me that that can't actually [TS]

  attacking that guy but the thing that it could mean that Sheen is that the color [TS]

  correction was often its relative to the scenes before and after it and it made [TS]

  me so I can see this movie too many times but it made me think I bet I bet [TS]

  they only got that once like the only got the action they wanted once and [TS]

  maybe the lighting was incorrect but the fact was that they needed the action so [TS]

  they had to do what they could with the color correction to make it sort of fit [TS]

  with the scene that came before and after I i agree with that they were [TS]

  there is something off about the lady I love to see where the leopard turns into [TS]

  the camera and the front projection light is reflected in his eyes from you [TS]

  that's like which probably wouldn't happen in need to know in a way let's [TS]

  talk about one other thing is to see a lot of see that you've got a good big [TS]

  laughs in the movie always gets a big laugh when you see the movie it's the [TS]

  zero-gravity toilet instructions right on the pan-am shuttle yeah that's the [TS]

  way it would put it on ya that he's going to the spaces [TS]

  species and its like paragraphs and paragraphs of text and I believe it's [TS]

  all real texas not late lorem ipsum dolar and that comes up and he he would [TS]

  put looking at it he's like puzzled by it and I sort of think that that scene [TS]

  is like maybe only seen the film that actually doesn't fit that actually [TS]

  they're just as again because as you said he's been he's been flying around [TS]

  the galaxy for a long time he's been on the ship before I if I'm hard to believe [TS]

  he had had to go to the bathroom before right and secondly if everyone who ever [TS]

  flew on these ships used a zero-gravity toilet with they have to have like all [TS]

  of these instruction me it's clearly a joke for the contemporary audience [TS]

  watching the film which is really very little of that is that the stewardesses [TS]

  I think all mister discuss their not really played it to write a stewardess [TS]

  shoes which have some velcro on the bottom to keep her from to allow her to [TS]

  walk in zero gravity [TS]

  it's a grip shoes on the side and for me that and it looked cool its own sake of [TS]

  the gate is looking thing but to me that was another thing like thing for the [TS]

  audience because if everybody wore those shoes you wouldn't put groups you it [TS]

  doesn't stay tennis shoes I'm going to get my shoes you know it doesn't you [TS]

  know like so it was sort of a way to give out to scientific information was [TS]

  almost as though they they did like it was almost the equivalent of putting a [TS]

  graphic on-screen within our oh you know like a pop up ground that like labels it [TS]

  explains it or like you do in you know like some kind of folks will will [TS]

  explain [TS]

  Lake like your dick tracey comics Road withdraw like a little arrow to his [TS]

  watch and say to a wrist radio writer as well as proof of how smart we are about [TS]

  the future you know and I do kinda miss Panama now after seeing it again you [TS]

  know is there any more pain a merely they were gonna be the ones that made it [TS]

  to the major but they didn't yes we we don't really do that is still good right [TS]

  it was my belly and what it was but many interesting great time I do I so many [TS]

  scenes that I love but did the CNN help to me is one of my favorites so when we [TS]

  do what we did a reader here for the opening and there's something about the [TS]

  way that the guy who plays Haywood Lloyd I don't know I know he's never been [TS]

  anything but he's he's so deadpan in terms of obviously knows but he's not [TS]

  under plane is not overplaying it is just dont face about it and he's not you [TS]

  know he's not tight-lipped about it really seems like exactly the sort of [TS]

  guy who you want and the government to trust with the single greatest secret [TS]

  the government ever had [TS]

  yeah it really does seem like the perfect guy yeah and then he does the [TS]

  presentation later he doesn't really say anything to anyone right you know he's a [TS]

  perfect government trying to figure they still really the only guy who knows what [TS]

  the hell is going on even in the presentation yeah yeah right [TS]

  yeah he's just trying to keep them in line right sort of they get it's almost [TS]

  like just like a formality like it just just just good manners I'm not gonna not [TS]

  address you but I'm not going to tell you anything we need to address it right [TS]

  you have to keep up the charade epidemic but it's a beautiful kubrick in thing [TS]

  too is that you she said that the scene was myself in the Hilton and he end and [TS]

  the end of that scene that we just kind of went through is where he [TS]

  he accuses void of hiding the fact that they're just happened to mechanically [TS]

  base and then later he makes the presentation and he talked about what's [TS]

  going on the basis of the end of the presentation shows and that's why it's [TS]

  so important that we keep up the appearance of an epidemic and base so at [TS]

  the moment when we first saw Floyd we didn't know why he thought about this [TS]

  idea of an epidemic and later we find out what a cool caddy is because she's [TS]

  orchestrated this entire cover story it's good [TS]

  exposition Bay Cuba because we know as little as the people in this scene we [TS]

  are like the russians in the first scene and in the second thing of the [TS]

  presentation we are like the ignorant other officials from the garage area so [TS]

  it's nice we learn as characters in the film learn sort of like David hey we've [TS]

  got one over on us too and then there's the you pointed out that on the next [TS]

  shuttle the smaller one that goes from the space station to cuevas where [TS]

  they're wearing actually gotten on suits [TS]

  sandwiches and the guys I great presentation yeah you really fucked up [TS]

  the true but he didn't do anything unless for some authors beachy gave that [TS]

  we didn't see i dont well maybe but I don't think I think it was in reference [TS]

  to that presentation and I think he was just trying to be complementary to [TS]

  clearly you know to the highest-ranking guy that he's he's probably ever gonna [TS]

  encounters yeah but that guy you what was going on right now is one of the [TS]

  guys at Clearview so they clearly the two people who aren't a fan of the movie [TS]

  the well they certainly would have hit pause by now read the complaint and it's [TS]

  really is that the film is tedious its TV is deliberately that [TS]

  racial there's yeah there's there's extended sequences of people doing truly [TS]

  mundane things and the point of it it's almost like a deliberation on what the [TS]

  mundane aspects of the future going to be almost like a painstakingly detailed [TS]

  we've thought of every single thing we're gonna show it to you yeah and it [TS]

  in the pacing of it it doesn't always puts me in a certain mindset where it [TS]

  doesn't Jones me out yeah and and dads and moms breathing through the whole [TS]

  thing has sort of the Zen sort of a quantity quality too late when he opens [TS]

  please give you the explosive bolts to get back into the discovery when he [TS]

  opened that hand crank door it takes for ever like he just turned it in turns it [TS]

  in turns it and turned it and we're waiting we're waiting we're waiting in [TS]

  the tension is building and building a billion it's just beautiful the whole [TS]

  film as I mean the whole middle section at film is the most anti science fiction [TS]

  science fiction film ever made [TS]

  there's like in the time it took him to open that door in most science fiction [TS]

  films civilizations will have borne lived and died in the same time it took [TS]

  to open the door to new generations of weapons will be countered that weapons [TS]

  it would have been shown to 10 minutes ago exactly it is a movie but it's [TS]

  alright movie is now is a lot different than it was in 1968 and most of them [TS]

  over everything I would say one of the little ideas about it is that it's it's [TS]

  a g-rated movie and surely the only G-rated movies Stanley Kubrick ever made [TS]

  yeah which i think is a little weird because I just seems to me like a [TS]

  murderous robot may BPG already I mean 44 people get murdered yeah including [TS]

  Frank pool who'd I think kind of gives more [TS]

  nerd and one of the most terrifying ways imaginable I mean it's maybe even worse [TS]

  than drowning right just to be in a suit knowing that you've been cut you know he [TS]

  had a couple seconds there before he died revenue while going to die and I'm [TS]

  gonna float away into truly oblivion and of course the actual act expires on [TS]

  screen right [TS]

  spent their time can be spent his time shows every little detail of every [TS]

  little thing except for the most crucial moment and that really the film that [TS]

  happens offering frame and the murder of the three crew members who are [TS]

  hibernating hibernating is is something to yeah I did it was a murderers row but [TS]

  it would have been PG-thirteen but it's a dream it's a little difficult right [TS]

  and I do think that might be why they see it that way because how physical [TS]

  instantiation isn't a robot isn't that a humanoid types III PLO thing is really [TS]

  just a presence on the ship camera that you know he's a series of red cameras at [TS]

  a voice like you know if you want to think about it is almost like he's the [TS]

  ship right yeah it's like when we think of being killed by machines generally we [TS]

  made in the marching at us with lasers you know what I mean not turning off the [TS]

  power to our hibernation and that whole as that whole sequence after how kills [TS]

  Frank pool and his body is going out into oblivion [TS]

  what Dave Bowman does then is never explained he doesn't say anything cuz he [TS]

  did only person he would talk to would be how many clearing those against it [TS]

  seems realistic to me it seems you know but it's also seems like unlike most [TS]

  hollywood movies where he never does like a chick's ass fisted how and swears [TS]

  revenge and screams out of me and says well I'm gonna go get his body or [TS]

  something like that you know I'm not gonna let him I'm not gonna let him go [TS]

  like that i mean clearly news dad and doing a reason he went to get him as out [TS]

  of respect for his friend in yeah I wasn't like he thought he had any hope [TS]

  of saving his life he just you know he went out to retrieve his body and it's [TS]

  you know it's minutes long and I wonder how long that it seems is one of the [TS]

  things I would be surprised if somebody told me it was actually twenty minutes [TS]

  maybe 20 minutes before he gets down the steps gets into a tiny leaves until the [TS]

  time you blow through the explosive bolts to get back and that's a long and [TS]

  again glacial and quiet sort of a sequence you know like even when he [TS]

  blows the bowls didn't even hear the explosion attorneys like the middle east [TS]

  Scotland idea is based on your screen like there's no sound of the explosion [TS]

  killed me sound comes as he closed the door in Harrisburg to rush back into the [TS]

  airlock Justin choice they're right and that is one of them when I say it's like [TS]

  super scientific one of the ways that the film is when the camera is exterior [TS]

  space there is no doubt spaceships don't make any whooshing sound it's just pure [TS]

  silence and the sound some of the sounds in the movie was so loud in the theater [TS]

  the silence really pops the silence it's it's like you know a great visual in [TS]

  graphic design where r if you make truly great use of white space its striking [TS]

  but then the only time here burner upset would be to use the breathing of an [TS]

  astronaut [TS]

  and restorative it almost like audio audio wise put you in a first-person [TS]

  perspective yes yes the same way of a point of view camera that's exactly [TS]

  that's exactly it every time you the busy you are days like in a way you know [TS]

  what i mean you are so it almost makes my face feel hot like I can feel my own [TS]

  hot breath [TS]

  classes you know in clothes helmets are you is at how killed me and my body was [TS]

  floating out into the middle of nowhere between Jupiter and Mars would you get [TS]

  pot and come out my speed my body yes because I that moment I did not know [TS]

  that help me to remember how doesn't reveal that he had read his lips until [TS]

  after so I you get the feeling is suspicious beyond the fact just you just [TS]

  from the look on his face but yeah of course I could but of course but then [TS]

  when I got back and I couldn't get in and have to let you get away and I think [TS]

  Bowman at that point is angry I think he knows it tells fall but that he's only [TS]

  unsure whether it's how is malfunctioning [TS]

  forum 11 yeah right and so I think though and I you know and I think he's [TS]

  so in the state of shock because you know I mean I was used for his friend [TS]

  the only guys talked to him last year I don't know how long you been up there a [TS]

  long time [TS]

  month mission and it seems like they're pretty far along well is mostly almost [TS]

  there right because he sees the video transmission from Floyd when he's [TS]

  disconnecting half and that he says [TS]

  we're only gonna give you this message now that you're in reach [TS]

  so much like eighteen months in like 18 months he joined by just known as in [TS]

  Stata shopkeeper gets his helmet or you know whatever whether he completely [TS]

  forgot them and I think we're just made the assumption that I don't really need [TS]

  it cuz I'm not going out of the pod I'm just going to use the arms to get Frank [TS]

  how let me back in here just never even occurred to him that how ya that's [TS]

  actually the and then there's you know you go into that whole sequence of [TS]

  split-screen Cameron everything that goes into their now there's two ways [TS]

  this movie can go really one way is if you stay on the same path he wound up in [TS]

  the room at the way floors and Dave Bowman and the changing of time and [TS]

  place baby but if you make a little left hand turn right there you run right into [TS]

  the currents Malick's Tree of Life and then the move that movie takes over from [TS]

  there so that's the primordial ooze from which or something that you couldn't [TS]

  make science fiction will be held a double feature the coffee would be like [TS]

  six hours I could stand up everybody else [TS]

  Spencer I don't know what kind of state of mind by then do that too [TS]

  alright I was good let me do the first sponsored I want to thank Squarespace [TS]

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  in the ass [TS]

  as I mean in gym and I both know this setting up an online store and and made [TS]

  it really really easy so check them out the the URL is square / the [TS]

  talk-show square / the talk show that way don't know you're coming [TS]

  here from the show but check them out especially if you've got something even [TS]

  think about setting up an online store that's news to check out what they have [TS]

  to offer before you make a mistake and go somewhere else [TS]

  yeah I mean just brand new brand new and it's a whole suite of e-commerce [TS]

  features that are loaded into account so it looks cool overnight around a little [TS]

  bit they're sponsoring the deck to like other smart companies very smart [TS]

  companies let's talk about the deck so when I love we've been going since about [TS]

  2002 was kind of in its infancy and then really started getting going in 2009 so [TS]

  it kinda it really is a small text ads service as a sort of a proof of concept [TS]

  and originally just 39 and then after that I got through about it [TS]

  so I think 2009 was when we might have run a little at the end of 2008 to 2009 [TS]

  would have been the first year the deck here we are in 13 years or older I [TS]

  thought it was going to be sitting in my office I can say what I remember was it [TS]

  first launched with you and 37 signals and and tell them that is correct you [TS]

  are correct and you guys do boxing I think yes [TS]

  2006 and 2007 2008 2007 yes it really sort of calling sides of their enviable [TS]

  full-time and prior to that I ran into him time feels like it but prior to that [TS]

  I've been selling my own totally text ads same spot where the decades are down [TS]

  fireball rose more than just text and similar model were sort of like my RSS [TS]

  sponsorship still are where 2011 spot a week one sponsor me and you were buying [TS]

  those fights occasionally for Joel boxing and i dont think Ill just then so [TS]

  was just starting today so boxing is back then people actually needed this so [TS]

  that's how old we are displayed this but I think some people still do this is to [TS]

  better still not very many record to the old and I was gonna go when I wanted to [TS]

  take her in trouble time I needed somebody else to solve that I needed [TS]

  bigger better added you as I just emailed you to say hey thanks for all of [TS]

  the boxing things you sponsor here but I'm gonna go with so I'm gonna start [TS]

  looking for something else [TS]

  Brad yeah and you really hope that by John give you a week and then like we [TS]

  usually are you want to be in the day I was always convinced it would work and I [TS]

  believe it was at South by in 2006 where I got it was easy to talk to Jason [TS]

  freedom to because we shared an office [TS]

  Jason Newsted think imma do it and then I talked Jeffrey Feltman into it for us [TS]

  apart and then it ran with us three as the only place where they had appeared [TS]

  for a little bit for a while I believe you were MAC store [TS]

  and the UN do you know who it was really close he bails waxy toria and then it [TS]

  started then it then the group fairly quickly now it's going slowly but we [TS]

  wanted the event was relatively easy to do is difficult earned about getting new [TS]

  affiliates and now we're looking for exactly the right affiliate and when [TS]

  that you know that the ads work well for the audience and that is designed [TS]

  properly whatever but back then nobody was carrying it and when you put the ads [TS]

  on your site or Jason Kottke David or weeded there was some concern that our [TS]

  readers would see that is a betrayal which is kind of funny now doesn't it [TS]

  like to be so worried about that yeah and that is definitely true where was [TS]

  you know I've been doing during fireball for ten years we talked about it as a [TS]

  little bit over 10 years now but as a decade and then that that first half the [TS]

  2002 2003 2004 years nobody has your weblog nobody had any kind of ads and [TS]

  then Google Adsense thing but that was just text and it was all pay per click [TS]

  and and that was controversy I mean really was controversial people would [TS]

  just add like a single Google was like I don't know if completed version [TS]

  advertising at all and yeah we're more altruistic back in a young days I guess [TS]

  but at the same time there were always been other websites the scene at the new [TS]

  york times as the ones that were not personal but but somehow [TS]

  you know I don't call institutionalized yeah news sites had the worst ads I mean [TS]

  ads that are worse than the ones you see today I mean I think like about 10 level [TS]

  10 89 years ago [TS]

  advertising online was absolutely it at like the bottom right punch the monkey [TS]

  member that they would have these add that there's plenty of bad you know [TS]

  there now to go and maybe go see it / turned off I don't know I said maybe I [TS]

  shouldn't say that we do you think it should I mean the idea of the deck was [TS]

  just to go over the basics of the notice I'm sorry but the idea of the deck was [TS]

  we thought there is probably a better way to do display advertising that would [TS]

  provide benefits for all three people in the advertising equation and by the [TS]

  three people in the equation I mean the publisher the advertiser and the reader [TS]

  we feel we felt like we made the decade we can come up with the concept for [TS]

  delivering advertiser that would be beneficial to all three of those people [TS]

  that it would work because up until that point it was it wasn't it wasn't fair [TS]

  with for the advertiser was for the publisher was for the reader whatever so [TS]

  our content was if we put together a confederation of like-minded sites that [TS]

  we just played a single ad from an advertiser that was truly relevant to [TS]

  the readership that everybody could benefit and we've never said that if the [TS]

  head is in the deck we endorse it [TS]

  business but it's sort of an implied endorsement since we turn down as all [TS]

  the time since we're fairly local five and low tack and reserving a mini the [TS]

  debt is not any Brisbane programming thing and we're serving up these ads we [TS]

  have very low overhead on the network and so we deliver a lot of impressions [TS]

  for a relatively good cause so every a lot of people want to buy on the deck [TS]

  but we don't want [TS]

  the ad from people who want to add some people we have products and services [TS]

  that appeal to our audience in a real way not just in a sort of you know I am [TS]

  unconvinced that an algorithm can ever really choose relevance for advertising [TS]

  to a marketplace country maybe someday [TS]

  the other thing that's it's not really a direct concern to people who read sites [TS]

  that are on the deck people who read during fireballer cocky they don't need [TS]

  understand this and and it doesn't matter but the fact is the deck has [TS]

  never paid by the page view ever the fact that was part of the concept of [TS]

  this it better for everybody if we do it this way where you [TS]

  advertisers just paid the deck asset be in a run for the month and you know it's [TS]

  not that we don't give them traffic numbers tell them you know [TS]

  collectively we do this we tend to do this many page views a month or whatever [TS]

  but if we happen to do more we do a little last month it's not if it doesn't [TS]

  act right and that's the to me the biggest thing to me that's even bigger [TS]

  than the unobtrusive pneus of the actual physical format of the ad on page is [TS]

  that it takes away any sort of impetus to pump up your page views [TS]

  road is no reason and it so you don't see there's nobody I know about the deck [TS]

  or takes long articles embrace them into six pages right which is truly just it's [TS]

  just a scam I mean I don't even use that word lightly it's a scam to to get your [TS]

  pages up and [TS]

  that works against nobodies so the pain pay-per-view model that most of the rest [TS]

  of online advertising uses is bad for everybody because it's bad for the [TS]

  advertiser because they're getting these numbers that don't correlate to people [TS]

  they correlate to people clicking on web pages so when you go through and and the [TS]

  worst of it now this is the way to thats that sort of bottomed out the slideshow [TS]

  right here's twenty twenty ways that Apple could screw up the iWatch yeah [TS]

  you've got a click twenty times and it counts as twenty pages but that's no [TS]

  good for the advertiser right because each one of those advertisers let's do [TS]

  this for advertisers in the slide you they're all being charged the full price [TS]

  of the page you when it goes without saying that if I'm clicking through to [TS]

  20 pictures in nineteen twenty pages on one page what the more you know what's [TS]

  more valuable impression you know if if I'm involved in an article I'm reading [TS]

  it fireball I'm reading a post from peanuts with miss or a long thread on [TS]

  Metafilter involved in the ad is there if if I pick click through and she 480 [TS]

  get four more impressions but are those impressions equal to the same person no [TS]

  course it's even worse for the reader I mean nobody ever in history world said [TS]

  you know what I like to do as I like to click twenty times to see all 20 ideas [TS]

  you have about Kate Upton pictures I can handle rate and it's it's no good for [TS]

  the sites themselves because then they're busy themselves with trumped-up [TS]

  SEO headlines there you know who feels good about taking a nice long article [TS]

  that's really a good read and chopping it up in the bits where you know that [TS]

  each one of those times where you make asking readers to click the thing you [TS]

  know that half of them are going to just drop consumer gonna drop away it's [TS]

  almost heartbreaking to know that you if you've written something that really is [TS]

  good I get real nice 2000 word piece it's almost heartbreaking to think that [TS]

  two-thirds of the readers only go to the first seven hundred words just close the [TS]

  window so it doesn't work for anybody get it like entrenched and it's not just [TS]

  that it's the idea of displaying 5 ads on a page and counting them all as you [TS]

  don't count each of those are somehow for some reason you don't count each of [TS]

  those is the fifth of an impression because of all the pressure so I know [TS]

  maybe were over delivering but you know the dirty little secret of the doctors [TS]

  for the right advertiser works very well most of our advertisers Renu advertisers [TS]

  that have the service or a product that fits with sort of the mindset of the [TS]

  affiliates under the deck do very well so we don't have to change all the [TS]

  advertising on the web we just have to write the equivalent I N started to [TS]

  equate the ads in any one medium to another like how is a TV commercial like [TS]

  a magazine that it's hard to draw the comparison but to me the way that [TS]

  there's five ad on a page you know the washington post or something like that [TS]

  and they sell them all as separate page views to me it's like selling a [TS]

  full-page ad in the newspaper and magazine but putting five ads on the [TS]

  page right that's a good way to put it but you know what it is I often think I [TS]

  often they buying a slot on the deck which buys you one slot and that by you [TS]

  three percent of all the impressions across all the sites and services in the [TS]

  network for a calendar month that works out to somewhere between two and three [TS]

  million persons but buying that currently does not buying that is mozdok [TS]

  into buying a full-page in New York in a magazine is more like a magazine it has [TS]

  your buying a monthly thing [TS]

  you your ad is by itself that is not it is adjacent to content but it is not [TS]

  adjacent other air and it's very difficult to quantify the results that [TS]

  you get for it but if you buy the new yorker your sales go up you probably do [TS]

  the ad and you can track who sought in the new yorker will have the same thing [TS]

  with the deck so I think the decade's worth anything at all maybe it's more [TS]

  like a full-page magazine ad in a magazine that it is like a TV commercial [TS]

  or like a traditional Bay Area I just wish the decade like just take over all [TS]

  the pages and the affiliate a decade really big and blot on the continent [TS]

  think readers and advertisers and appreciate their yeah like usual of [TS]

  JavaScript to make the ad march over the page and you have to shoot it before and [TS]

  I'll go back to this spot and then a dialogue with his do you really want to [TS]

  leave the thing that I love those ladies join me this paper you don't know what [TS]

  the Cliq is you feel like you're in the spammers embrace already lake and just [TS]

  click no I don't want to leave your saying yes I appreciate your takeover ad [TS]

  but if you say I want to leave you think maybe they're smart enough to make that [TS]

  the defaulting send you to the Florida property page whatever the advertisers [TS]

  something more nefarious Netflix still does pop under ads I don't see them I [TS]

  don't know why maybe because I don't know what it's like a cat and mouse game [TS]

  I think between the browsers and the right and people who were trying to [TS]

  circumvent the anti pop up thing but every once and I still see him from [TS]

  Netflix and every time I see what I've been unhappy Netflix customer for years [TS]

  I still am but every time I see a popular from Netflix idea in my head [TS]

  that maybe I should unsubscribe from Netflix just because they're using some [TS]

  of the money did too popular which are the words right now working there were [TS]

  tears networking figures counterproductive [TS]

  I didn't know who I don't see no matter how do I have to admit that I used to do [TS]

  pretty good at that [TS]

  blocking right sure if you are like Squarespace and you have a product or [TS]

  service that could benefit by being in front of millions of creative [TS]

  intelligent curious and good-looking people you should go to the deck and [TS]

  give us a holler let me ask about another subject tell me about what you [TS]

  and I were both in New Zealand so tell me about that we were there we could go [TS]

  as a recording today Friday February 22nd a week ago we were together in [TS]

  serbia Chicago we were in Wellington New Zealand just about this time your [TS]

  presentation that's probably about right now though [TS]

  time different rights which is my blog right and there's this whole thing where [TS]

  the international dateline you cross over there there there in tomorrow [TS]

  already well it's like it now is that sort of like the end of 2001 daily [TS]

  though that our friend or mutual great friend Michael lob had a birthday and he [TS]

  he [TS]

  California the nine airplane from San Francisco I was on the plane with them [TS]

  we arrived in Wellington New Zealand on the 11 Michael's birthday can't so he [TS]

  got gypped out of a burglar who are maybe the positive maybe the count right [TS]

  now maybe he had to say it doesn't legally bound is being a girl [TS]

  let's talk about the great conference where did you where did you think I [TS]

  really was I went back I was there two years ago and it was such a long flight [TS]

  as soon as I came back I thought that was great but never again and then I [TS]

  think it's like the way that you know like child bearing where it hurts in in [TS]

  women say when they were going to do it again but then you feel like engineered [TS]

  to forget it's like the fights but if I remember it was such a great conference [TS]

  two years ago so I jumped at the chance to go back and I thought the same thing [TS]

  that it was man I would have loved to have been hearing and speaking just to [TS]

  see these [TS]

  do think it's the best cover diver I believe what I'm conferences and i'd [TS]

  never do that could never been to maybe only rivaled by 2007 2008 by before it [TS]

  turned into the monster that took over the world [TS]

  the thing it's a single track with a small exception it's a single check on [TS]

  to talk about 850 people there and everybody sees all the same talks in the [TS]

  middle of the day there half the people who are more developers go one way and [TS]

  having to learn more designers go the other way but by and large the [TS]

  singletrack conference and I have never been to a conference we're more of the [TS]

  speaker set and rooted for the other speakers for me that really sad [TS]

  interesting and well program conference it was that I wanted to see all the [TS]

  other speakers and not just cuz I knew some of them but because I didn't [TS]

  already know now that was sort of interesting and it's in a cool place [TS]

  well in terms of cool place it's a very cool place and it's nice it is a really [TS]

  nice treat every speaker but I think we're all from the Northern Hemisphere [TS]

  and they had [TS]

  me i'm suppose it depends on where you count Craig modest from being from a [TS]

  disease from san Francisco is one thing but even possible Tokyo yeah but it's [TS]

  really nice to go from mid February northern hemisphere to February South [TS]

  southern hemisphere I guess what is that that's the equivalent of August and and [TS]

  it's not real hot it was seventy everyday was like 70 and sunny and which [TS]

  apparently is not the case and will arrange quite a bit but we didn't see [TS]

  any of that sort of thing where they tell everybody it's windy and rainy all [TS]

  the time to keep people away they want to share these days maybe that I do [TS]

  think the singletrack nature of web stock I mean there's certainly a [TS]

  single-track conference but a lot of the other single track conferences that I go [TS]

  to or been to cart significantly smaller do the new one single 10 which is gone [TS]

  on two years in a row in October in Montreal is about a hundred think 22 [TS]

  years been the hundred and eight hundred and twenty-five people are so and c4 [TS]

  here in Chicago before that you know I was like a 2006 murder yeah those are [TS]

  real those are more focused on Apple developers developers but now clearly [TS]

  Mackinac Island School in there is some dirty this website but it was more of a [TS]

  general developer designer broaden your mind a little bit like for example Craig [TS]

  talked about what he called [TS]

  publishing the subcompact publishing talking about Marco little bit in the [TS]

  magazine but also sort of general trends it was more like that it was more like [TS]

  big idea and then let's break it down as opposed to this is how you clothes [TS]

  shopping cart israel's or whatever right and creating its Craig mobs talk is [TS]

  probably a perfect example of that where I feel like they did the name of the [TS]

  conference web stock implies its roots which was people making websites you [TS]

  know I think this was the seventh year that they ran three and I think a [TS]

  regionally was more specific about designing and building websites and now [TS]

  they've gotten away from that it i mean that certain part of it but I think [TS]

  Craig stalk exemplified why they're getting away from that because there's [TS]

  not that much of a difference and if you're going to do it online publication [TS]

  gonna need web stuff and AB stuff and I did a show of hands in my talks I was [TS]

  curious cuz I remember two years ago I did the same thing we know what are the [TS]

  people in the audience working on it was overwhelmingly websites web stuff and I [TS]

  asked how many people are working on apps and I'd say easily over half the [TS]

  hands well I mean those teams went up we're the ones we use it how many are [TS]

  working on both right as they were going to websites and mobile apps and like the [TS]

  whole everything up and it's you know I am I gonna get caught up in the emotion [TS]

  of and I did that but I think the dad think it speaks to the strength of the [TS]

  programming of the conference that Dave sort of adjusted instead of trying to [TS]

  replay what web stock was in 2007 and it's it's really sort of got their [TS]

  finger on the pulse of what are these people working on today even if it's not [TS]

  with the working on its what what issues but larger issues in design and [TS]

  development can we discuss that will benefit your work and the other thing [TS]

  they do is they have the first two days of the conference are workshops [TS]

  so you can go to a half-day workshop with Craig might for example about [TS]

  subcompact publishing and I think they actually with their iPhones published a [TS]

  book to Amazon in their happy so I mean there is practice I think the more [TS]

  practical sort of things like Karen McGrane stalks and wound up in workshops [TS]

  where people can really get their hands on this stuff and the more conceptual [TS]

  stuff wound up in the main presentation say so but I would encourage anybody who [TS]

  is interested in New Zealand to go to the next website yeah and it's it's one [TS]

  of those things where I guess no matter how a few civ our praise is of the [TS]

  conference anybody you know from North America even on the west coast we're [TS]

  already closer is still going to roll their eyes and then why not go away to [TS]

  New Zealand but if you've ever thought about going to New Zealanders or maybe [TS]

  in some kind of combined two week trip where you go to Australia to or [TS]

  something like that and workout schedule wise to do it with web stock in the [TS]

  middle that would be worth it really is it best is the best conference I know if [TS]

  that's going on and we'll see because it is beautiful Hall invitations are what's [TS]

  called the Wellington Town Hall which was from nineteen old and its big [TS]

  beautiful building the Beatles played there in the talking heads played there [TS]

  and all this other stuff happen then adds quite imposing stage for speaker [TS]

  but we had a big earthquake in Christchurch year-ago no two years you [TS]

  years ago they have made much [TS]

  stronger regulations about how buildings have to be supported so the Town Hall is [TS]

  because for two years while they reinforce it so I don't know what's [TS]

  going to happen it's hard to imagine that happening with all the beautiful [TS]

  building but I suppose it could happen anywhere just got my story on that the [TS]

  earthquake was that it happened so I certainly didn't support online 'cause [TS]

  right but if it happened like two or three hours after our plane took off [TS]

  from Auckland the 12 hour flight from Auckland SFO so we we we were in [TS]

  Auckland and there was no earthquake we've got an airplane two or three hours [TS]

  later when this truly horrifying earthquake again I don't think it's [TS]

  hyperbole devastated Christchurch animals major major world news and so [TS]

  like mine and Amy's family saw this thing major earthquake in New Zealand [TS]

  and they didn't know what city and all they did was we said we're going to New [TS]

  Zealand for Congress in 1800 block of Wellington they didn't know we were in [TS]

  Christchurch I so they all tried calling us and of course couldn't get a call [TS]

  because we were only two or three you know we had nine hours to go before we [TS]

  land in SFO and they just like when we landed in SFO or phone to turn our [TS]

  phones on it was like voicemail voicemail voicemail voicemail [TS]

  alright are you all right or your right and I my first thought was it's the way [TS]

  you always when you get bad news and he just instantly like blank and going to [TS]

  denial of us and they're like I was a different order quick and easy cuz I had [TS]

  just there was an earthquake you didn't occur to you that something like that [TS]

  could happen when you fly over the pacific especially being the other thing [TS]

  about that is remember when you fly from Auckland to tampering Cisco you pretty [TS]

  much arrived at the same time you left because he had a plan to actually [TS]

  there's no time you know right you leave there at three in the afternoon you get [TS]

  to San Francisco to about three in the afternoon it's almost like it's a free [TS]

  flops first even a week later he would have to put it right [TS]

  who have had two oh yes you could have had your birthday and then head your [TS]

  birthday right executive spent the whole time which is not anybody to have a [TS]

  great birthday I did the second sponsor a new sponsor and this is really i'd i'd [TS]

  say this not because those sponsors because I'm really impressed by what [TS]

  they built it ever picks ev er ki IX ever picks is a smart photo platform [TS]

  that helps you make sense of your growing photo collection they have no [TS]

  storage limit so you have all your photos anywhere everywhere [TS]

  organized automatically in the cloud really the bottom line long story short [TS]

  is that they're aiming to replace something like iPhoto or Lightroom as [TS]

  your canonical files 4444 photos and the problem that they're trying to solve is [TS]

  that day thing and I believe that the modern photographer is simply casual [TS]

  photographer is is overwhelmed by the number of photos that they take you know [TS]

  the take hundreds of month thousands in here and you end up with a digital [TS]

  cameras now for probably like 10 years we have libraries of 10 or more thousand [TS]

  files and nobody organizes and let's not pretend that you're going to get back [TS]

  from your vacation and that you have to take those 300 photos and put tags on [TS]

  all of them and name them all so they have done all this algorithmically it's [TS]

  really really smart stuff from a really smart team and they have a great iPhone [TS]

  Apple iPad app for navigating these libraries on the Mac you can still use [TS]

  something like iPhoto or Lightroom to suck the photos off your card and make [TS]

  color corrections and delete the ones that are no good [TS]

  eyes are closed but then it said of organizing them in their albums or [TS]

  anything like that just go through and iPhoto you tell over texts I am a client [TS]

  sort of like Dropbox it's just a simple little face with single runs in the [TS]

  background you get to pick which known file locations you know whether you just [TS]

  pick a folder or you pick your iPhoto library it upload them to your account [TS]

  in the cloud and everything else happens after that that happens really really [TS]

  impressive did by default it is groups everything by date in two events it's [TS]

  really really smart about detecting interesting parts of the photos so it [TS]

  puts them together in a collage on screen for you to pick from scroll [TS]

  through it shows you just great little thumbnails and it's very fast very [TS]

  beautiful you can try it for free the Ab Circle the software is free and you can [TS]

  do with 34 AV 30 day free trial just see how it works you like it you pay I think [TS]

  it's tickets $40 a month of forty dollars a year I'm sorry for $5 a month [TS]

  very reasonable unlimited stormed right and I again I was doubtful at the [TS]

  beginning and I wasn't quite sure what it was but it's not it's not a [TS]

  replacement for flickr is not Instagram it's not photo sharing its your personal [TS]

  library back in the cloud available on all of your devices all the time I'm [TS]

  using it I really couldn't be happier with them really impress I did that [TS]

  before we recorded the show I was showing jim was getting all maudlin and [TS]

  showing baby pictures of Jonas you're all the pictures I haven't seen in [TS]

  forever and it was just great so ever pics what you want to do [TS]

  do is go to ever picks dot com ev er VIX dot com and check it out thanks to them [TS]

  for sponsoring the show will take it up because I attend the other day that I [TS]

  hope that there's actually there is reincarnation because then I will be [TS]

  able to organize my digital photos I think it's a great promise I really do [TS]

  the premises you're never been organizing just given to us and we'll [TS]

  organize a long story short that's the just yet and it's it's I think they've [TS]

  got people even delete do you still believe photos that they that sow [TS]

  together like I think I was just like I do that shoot with my real camera I do [TS]

  so many pictures but I do I used to do I get to pass things first pass is go [TS]

  through like with website I took I don't know 300 pictures first passes just go [TS]

  through and pick out anything that's just all you know how to focus toward [TS]

  the lights way offers them somebody's eyes are closed and it was one right [TS]

  took place let's save for pictures that the same thing [TS]

  quick make it did snap decision which one is the good one and going and then [TS]

  the old way than what I used to do [TS]

  years ago and I still do every once in a while but I have to admit I just never [TS]

  get around to it must have been so then I would go through and really start [TS]

  thinking about which ones are good and giving up four star ranking to this one [TS]

  and five star to this one and stuff like that [TS]

  give him titles are putting me I don't get to do anything to lead I don't delay [TS]

  don't organized and it's not that I don't want to it's just too much is [TS]

  never seems like there's a great time when when you really want to take two [TS]

  hours ago through intense you know when you fall behind I got you know you're [TS]

  with the brothers will see Jason we met her I met you before he did [TS]

  the website said that an eight hour layover in singapore is a good time to [TS]

  organize for only over to be at the hanging out with Vijay Web Start made me [TS]

  feel great about my new zealand to philadelphia by way of Auckland and I [TS]

  went to LAX but there's no difference really been going through us have made [TS]

  me feel a lot better he was going home to Sweden he was flying instead of [TS]

  flying east use file West like New Zealand Australia to Singapore to god [TS]

  knows how to YouTube it was like one of the Indiana Jones trip you know . the [TS]

  plane and the map of the sepia tone map so where would you go back to website I [TS]

  would they think I mean I would be invited again but you know what I would [TS]

  like to do and we should get to talk to Mike Monteiro because he did it a little [TS]

  bit as I would like to go for longer go to web stock and then take a car on the [TS]

  South Island everybody said that like the place and that's where a lot of them [TS]

  there are some locations around Wellington from the Lord of the Rings [TS]

  but that's sort of like their cottage industry [TS]

  tourists Jenny how is is go there and see the Lord of the Rings sites and [TS]

  stuff like that and the studio is in the studio is in Wellington yeah I'll take a [TS]

  guess I'll so long that it's whether yeah but it is really a baby but he'll [TS]

  be surprised because they never have to guess at the pronunciation something [TS]

  like this would be kept everything so maybe he was wrong there some locations [TS]

  on the North Island with the one with Auckland and Wellington but the South [TS]

  Island is the one where it's apparently a little bit more [TS]

  a lot more see more there's a lot of population a lot more public ground is [TS]

  so I think that would be you know I think I would like to talk again I would [TS]

  also like to see more of ya so maybe we can work those two things together at [TS]

  something so what did you think of web stark most gratifying for most [TS]

  illuminating that's a good question or a bouncer really good drawing a blank on [TS]

  his name the guy who wrote the novel mister numbers low levels low Robinson [TS]

  there was a great talk gave a great talk on the way we put your by summarizing it [TS]

  the wrong way but part of it was about the way that we don't really understand [TS]

  any new medium until decades and in one of the ways he proved that was like [TS]

  going back to the turn of the last century and how when the movie's first [TS]

  became a thing people put like sarcastic quotes around the world movies that it [TS]

  was you know right [TS]

  movies with quotes around it and that that lasted for decades and even up [TS]

  through late twenties even though you know until like the nineteen thirties [TS]

  when people in newspapers wrote about movies they put the word in quotes like [TS]

  it was sort of not a real thing or form [TS]

  better passing fancy of some sort right he's talked to right around the corner [TS]

  and members of the quarters but when they first shown a movie for the first [TS]

  time somewhere in India or somewhere [TS]

  audience didn't know whether they should look at the screen or the light moving [TS]

  through the air like you know from the projection booth like they didn't know [TS]

  what was most interesting sort of which way to turn your chair was the best one [TS]

  for you I think that was very entertaining I soon have enjoyed Jason [TS]

  Katims talk about the stellar which I don't want it and I believe all the [TS]

  videos go up online right right or what it's about but it was a surprising it [TS]

  took it was a very typical talk about one guy building a web app that took an [TS]

  interesting and surprising turn is very human and emotional and also very [TS]

  important if so I like that and then I saw Kelly Anderson to talk about design [TS]

  of everyday life which really was grade some super interesting projects and a [TS]

  lot of really terrific work presented in a entertaining and intelligent way to [TS]

  get a chance to see her speak I would do that and I think those two maybe were [TS]

  unsurprisingly have the same taste as you but yet got keys was great and very [TS]

  personal and very Jason way yes it was it everyone in the room was surprised at [TS]

  one point in it let's put it that way right and I know he doesn't speak a lot [TS]

  size is probably a lot of people out there listening who certainly knows say [TS]

  probably daily but maybe don't know what he's like in person but he's I think he [TS]

  is a lot like what you think is quiet but he's thoughtful observant ran not a [TS]

  shower funny you know that doesn't mean it's not funny it just means it's quite [TS]

  funny lake and he is talk and the way he gave it was really in a way that I i [TS]

  cant do I don't know there's there's a there's a stage John Gruber that I don't [TS]

  think it's disingenuous on stage but I don't know I know that I'm not is [TS]

  broadly personalise and I really enjoyed that was great [TS]

  one of those wondering you said i i'd never I wasn't familiar with her work [TS]

  before I never met her before and now consider her hand blown away by the [TS]

  quality of our work and then Mike brought the house down my current era [TS]

  brought the house down he was the last speech on the last day and he talked [TS]

  about designers responsibility to their work and to that end to what's right and [TS]

  two aircraft and it was you know what you call that it was a brought the house [TS]

  down everybody grows every was it was it was it was powerful and positive and it [TS]

  was also a bit of a lecture so good with a good way and it was a boy was that the [TS]

  right audience for that talk right [TS]

  like in terms of actually him giving you know if you're doing it this way of [TS]

  doing it wrong and you should do it this way not just for yourself but really [TS]

  literally a minute for the world [TS]

  yeah and the people in the audience of the people who you know and you know [TS]

  what speakers we're allowed for a fact but he's demand over the lake in a [TS]

  speech like that which is a highly structured well-rehearsed right actually [TS]

  rigorous presentation he his profanity is powerful I will end in a good way so [TS]

  it's a great he's yeah he's his use of profanity is about as eloquent and go [TS]

  What is the title of his most famous speech online fuck you pay me he's also [TS]

  gonna get a list of this was called how designers destroyed the world right with [TS]

  titles is give it was a good way to end with a good way to end the show will [TS]

  probably thanks for having me on time listener first time caller as they say [TS]

  if you have a chance to see the new seventy million or print of 2001 travel [TS]

  all the way from Philadelphia Chicago if you have to it's worth you know what [TS]

  this means of course you know that they can schedule the 17th [TS]

  screening at this point until he probably will give you better able to [TS]

  bury linden we'll go back to Ohio say we could tell the story of account number [TS]

  at some point in the future thanks John [TS]